Military Review

The defense ministers of Kazakhstan and Turkey discussed military and military-technical cooperation.

142
The Minister of Defense of Kazakhstan, Adilbek Dzhaksybekov, held talks in September with Ankara’s negotiations with his Turkish counterpart Ismet Yılmaz, the press service of the Ministry of Defense of the Republic of Kazakhstan reported.


During the meeting, the sides discussed prospects for the development of bilateral cooperation in the military and military-technical fields, as well as in the field of military education.

"The Ministry of Defense of our country attaches great importance to the dynamic development of cooperation with the defense ministry and the Turkish Armed Forces. Your country is one of the most important partners of Kazakhstan. I am confident that the Kazakh-Turkish cooperation in the military sphere will continue to develop on the principles of reliable partnership and mutual benefit. "- noted Dzhaksybekov.

During the visit, the Minister of Defense of the Republic of Kazakhstan visited the company "ASELSAN" and "TAİ". With the leadership of ASELSAN, Jansbekov discussed the prospects for further development and the implementation of the Kazakhstan-Turkish defense industrial plant Kazakhstan Aselsan Engineering, which is scheduled to open at the end of the year in Astana. The project aims to manufacture riflescopes for small weapons, night vision devices and thermal imagers. Production of electronic printed circuit boards, software development, and manufacturing of optical lenses are envisaged.

With the leadership of TAİ, the Minister of Defense of the Republic of Kazakhstan discussed the Kazakh-Turkish cooperation in production aviation technicians. This company produces spare parts for modernized and light-winged flying vehicles, is engaged in the assembly of aircraft from the manufactured spare parts. The delegation got acquainted with the production of aircraft, UAVs and other aircraft manufactured by the company.

In Ankara, Adilbek Jansbekov familiarized himself with the production of armored combat vehicles at the FNSS plant. The Turkish side expressed interest in opening such an enterprise in Astana.
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  1. Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 4 October 2013 06: 51 New
    +2
    I wonder who owned the initiative for the meeting, Kazakhs or Turks? ...
    1. bask
      bask 4 October 2013 06: 58 New
      +6
      Quote: Valery Neon

      In Ankara, Adilbek Dzhansbekov got acquainted with the production of armored combat vehicles at the FNSS factory.

      The Turks have something to offer Kazakhstan. In the segment; light armored vehicles, MPAP.SAU.
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 4 October 2013 11: 31 New
        10
        Quote: bask
        Turks have something to offer Kazakhstan
        At Topvar, it has already been repeatedly discussed that the Russian military-industrial complex offers not very high-quality and uncompetitive products, and at obviously sky-high prices. Since the Russian Federation can’t buy abroad for many factors (mainly the prestige and lobby of manufacturers) ..
        Kazakhstan has no such problems. Accordingly, the RK can afford to choose the best equipment in the ratio of "price - quality".
        1. bask
          bask 4 October 2013 20: 38 New
          +4
          Quote: Alibekulu
          Kazakhstan, there are no such problems. Accordingly, the RK can afford to choose the best equipment in the ratio of "price - quality".

          And most importantly, modern, wheeled armored vehicles.
          BTR Pars 4/4, there are no Russian analogues.
          1. Semurg
            Semurg 4 October 2013 21: 32 New
            +6
            without a tower? without weapons? Or is it custom made?
            1. ayyildiz
              ayyildiz 4 October 2013 21: 48 New
              +3


              It seems that in Kazakhstan, OTOCAR is going to build an enterprise!
              1. Semurg
                Semurg 4 October 2013 22: 10 New
                +3
                it seems that we agreed with Ukraine on the account of armored personnel carriers, well, if we stir up turkey too well, especially if we have assembly, we have agreed on production with aselsan at a joint venture with us. If something doesn’t grow together with Ukraine on armored personnel carriers, it’s possible start co-production.
                1. ayyildiz
                  ayyildiz 4 October 2013 22: 27 New
                  +4
                  Otokar is a private corporation, but its range of armored vehicles is not bad! Better than FNSS!
                  1. bask
                    bask 5 October 2013 08: 28 New
                    +1
                    Quote: ayyildiz
                    Otokar is a private corporation, but its range of armored vehicles is not bad! Better than FNSS!

                    Otokar, this is the state .. Turkey.
                    And FSNN, this is a joint venture with BAE Systems (48%), among Turkish private owners 52%.
                    1. ayyildiz
                      ayyildiz 5 October 2013 15: 19 New
                      0
                      Otokar is a private company owned by Koch Holding as well as RMK, in Kazakhstan Ramstors used to belong to them too! You and I corresponded earlier on this topic!
            2. bask
              bask 5 October 2013 08: 25 New
              +2
              Quote: Semurg
              without a tower? without weapons? Or is it custom made?

              Exhibit sample. The combat module is installed, by order of the buyer.
      3. ayyildiz
        ayyildiz 4 October 2013 18: 24 New
        +3
        A practical example of close cooperation between the defense complexes of the two countries is the intention to create a joint venture with the Turkish Otokar corporation to produce wheeled armored vehicles in Kazakhstan!
    2. Kibalchish
      Kibalchish 4 October 2013 07: 08 New
      +4
      Yes, who would not belong to anything good is not here. The Turkish idea of ​​"great Turkestan" has not been canceled.
      1. Valery Neonov
        Valery Neonov 4 October 2013 07: 17 New
        0
        Don’t tell me ... because the Kazakhs in the TS are almost friends ... hi Or after they start blackmailing Russia, like Tajikistan for the base.
        1. Lindon
          Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 14 New
          +8
          The CU and SCO are open organizations.
          The more members teb the more all in the world.
          1. xetai9977
            4 October 2013 08: 27 New
            13
            Glad for the Kazakh brothers. They are developing industry, strengthening their own defense industry, and they have good relations with all of them.
        2. Kasym
          Kasym 4 October 2013 17: 06 New
          +9
          Good evening . The West has always tried to push Turkey into confrontation with Russia, drove a wedge between the Turkic peoples.
          Although I do not welcome the current government of Turkey, but I would like to see it more integrated into our space - here it can take a more worthy place than being a puppet of the West (I could not imagine that it will be in the EU on a par with, for example, Spain or France). It seems to me that it is better for Russia and Kazakhstan to have it as an ally than an adversary. The struggle for Turkey is just beginning - based on contacts between our (Russia and Kazakhstan on the one hand and Turkey with the other) authorities and Erdogan’s statement about the desire to join (or at least be an observer) in the SCO. It is interesting how events will develop further.
          1. Ascetic
            Ascetic 4 October 2013 22: 03 New
            +6
            Quote: Kasym
            . The West has always tried to push Turkey into confrontation with Russia, drove a wedge between the Turkic peoples.


            Despite the numerous Russian-Turkish wars, Turkey and Russia are more profitable to be allies than enemies. The Russian-Turkish strategic union would put an end to the hegemony of the West both in the Black Sea basin and in the Middle East. This was well understood in London and Paris and therefore sought by any means to provoke a clash of two empires. Today, the United States is trying to prevent rapprochement between Ankara and Moscow.
            In the era of the USSR, after the threat of war from Stalin, the Turks were forced to lie under the protection of NATO and American nuclear weapons. With the disappearance of the USSR, such a threat from Russia no longer exists, on the contrary, economic cooperation is growing from year to year. But Anglo-Saxons are still turning Turkey, although, as far as I know, the Turks themselves are more and more inclined towards anti-Americanism. If in 2008 69% of Turkish citizens wanted membership in the European Union, today 43% is affected by the fruitless stomping of Ankara at the doors of the European Union, and crimes of the American military in the Islamic world. the population opposes rapprochement with the United States, especially religious conservatives, nationalists and left-wing movements. But Turkey also has disagreements with Russia over the roof, so seisas should not be hoped for closer political integration. Syria alone is already a big stumbling block.
            1. ayyildiz
              ayyildiz 4 October 2013 22: 07 New
              +3
              Quote: Ascetic
              Turkey and Russia are more profitable to be allies than enemies.

              I completely agree with you! But only on mutually beneficial conditions!
              1. Ascetic
                Ascetic 4 October 2013 22: 44 New
                +5
                Quote: ayyildiz
                I completely agree with you! But only on mutually beneficial conditions!


                In general, if you really dream up, if you drive the Americans out of the Greater Caucasus and the Caspian Sea, then it’s quite possible to resolve issues only in the format of all neighboring countries in the regionStarting from the zero option (having forgotten the past and starting from what is between us now) and agreeing on mutually beneficial compromises without the participation of third countries, it is possible to solve the problem of NK, South Ossetia, Abkhazia, the division of the Caspian shelf, gas pipes and so on in this format. All neighbors are not easy, everyone has their own ambitions and historical grievances, but this is better than dancing to the tune Anglo-Saxon politics divide and rule. But alas, this is still fantasy.
                1. Kasym
                  Kasym 4 October 2013 22: 53 New
                  +7
                  Hello, Stanislav! As always good ! I agree with you completely!
                2. ayyildiz
                  ayyildiz 4 October 2013 22: 58 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Ascetic
                  . But alas, this is still fantasy.


                  I think it all starts with fantasy!
                  The world over the past 25 years has changed a lot and even change!
      2. Lindon
        Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 13 New
        +6
        Actually, Turkey considers the CU and SCO as an alternative to the EU.
        Khazin in general with both hands for Turkey’s accession to the CU.
        It is easier to communicate with Ankara through Astana.
    3. Lindon
      Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 11 New
      +3
      Constantly meet. Not as often as with Putin, of course.
    4. Semurg
      Semurg 4 October 2013 09: 25 New
      13
      never mind. the main thing is what agreements have been reached. in fact, Kazakhstan will receive the production of the things we need in our territory. We can sell it to Russians at domestic prices if they have interest.
      1. ayyildiz
        ayyildiz 4 October 2013 09: 39 New
        +7
        It seems that you already have a joint corporation with ASELSAN!
    5. The comment was deleted.
    6. ayyildiz
      ayyildiz 4 October 2013 18: 21 New
      +3
      In accordance with the intergovernmental agreement on cooperation in the field of military education from February 23 to 1993, successful cooperation continues in the field of training Kazakhstani personnel in Turkish military schools
  2. Captain Vrungel
    Captain Vrungel 4 October 2013 06: 52 New
    -4
    Well, how will Russia react to this? Or just Ukraine on its teeth, whose army is not only a burden for NATO, but also for itself. And so the star moves into the crescent. Something Georgia, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan reached for NATO Turkey. What is it for?
    1. Orel
      Orel 4 October 2013 07: 01 New
      +7
      Something Georgia, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan reached for NATO Turkey. What is it for?


      If there is an opportunity to gain access to military technology, then this is only a plus ... I think it is premature to look for some ins and outs here. Kazakhstan seeks to create its defense industry, modern and capable of providing the country. Apparently we don’t really help them in this (we don’t want competition), but someone uses it.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 4 October 2013 08: 58 New
        -2
        Quote: Orel
        Something Georgia, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan reached for NATO Turkey. What is it for?


        If there is an opportunity to gain access to military technology, then this is only a plus ... I think it is premature to look for some ins and outs here. Kazakhstan seeks to create its defense industry, modern and capable of providing the country. Apparently we don’t really help them in this (we don’t want competition), but someone uses it.

        I wonder what kind of military technology does Turkey have? scimitar probably from Syrian steel. laughing
        1. Zymran
          Zymran 4 October 2013 12: 35 New
          +7
          Quote: ed65b
          I wonder what kind of military technology does Turkey have? scimitar probably from Syrian steel. laughing


          Tank "Altai", for example, created jointly with the South Koreans. There was an article recently about their Black Panther tank.
          In the future, it would be nice to re-equip our entire army with the latest tanks.
          1. ed65b
            ed65b 5 October 2013 01: 02 New
            -3
            Quote: Zymran
            Quote: ed65b
            I wonder what kind of military technology does Turkey have? scimitar probably from Syrian steel. laughing


            Tank "Altai", for example, created jointly with the South Koreans. There was an article recently about their Black Panther tank.
            In the future, it would be nice to re-equip our entire army with the latest tanks.

            Oh .. Altai. Do you also have an army? Oh well.
        2. alone
          alone 4 October 2013 17: 13 New
          +4
          There is a wide range of military technologies ranging from small arms to tanks and the project of creating their own fighter. As they say, no one is moaning and everyone is developing. I think, on the contrary, the rapprochement between Azerbaijan, Kyrgyzstan and Turkey, I can push the creation and strengthening of the Slavic-Turkic Union. about the fears that all this could threaten Russia with a bluff. so far, everything is normal with our heads and we are not creating problems for ourselves out of the blue
          1. Essenger
            Essenger 4 October 2013 17: 19 New
            +3
            Quote: lonely
            creation and strengthening of the Slavic-Turkic union.


            Greetings

            There will be no union, Russian Turkophobia in blood and nothing will change in the near future.
            1. alone
              alone 4 October 2013 19: 39 New
              +2
              hi essenger. I therefore wrote the word "may", knowing that mistrust towards us Türks. and if you thought about it you would get a good union. It’s a pity that we don’t do it, they always look at us as unreliable)))) God ( Allah) them judge
      2. Semurg
        Semurg 4 October 2013 09: 35 New
        +9
        [

        If there is an opportunity to gain access to military technology, then this is only a plus ... I think it is premature to look for some ins and outs here. Kazakhstan seeks to create its defense industry, modern and capable of providing the country. Apparently we do not really help them in this (we do not want competition), but someone uses it. [/ Quote]
        I don’t understand the position of the Russians when they don’t want to open joint ventures. It’s clear when talking about piece or exclusive goods that is not on the market, and when talking about conventional weapons which are a dime a dozen in the market. Kazakhstan, if possible, wants to establish production at its own because the TS is easier to do, but if the Russians refuse or cannot, then with third countries. And why this causes such a negative among the Russians is not clear.
        1. ayyildiz
          ayyildiz 4 October 2013 09: 41 New
          +8
          Quote: Semurg
          . Kazakhstan seeks to create its defense industry, modern and capable of providing the country.


          A must, not just strive! hi
    2. StolzSS
      StolzSS 4 October 2013 07: 07 New
      -4
      Yes, it is clear why to the derban of their elites ...
      1. mirag2
        mirag2 4 October 2013 07: 17 New
        +1
        How will Russia react? It seems that it has already reacted-Surkov is returned. I don’t know why he has a good, unpredictable fantasy?
        He will be engaged in the post-Soviet space, I wonder what will come out ...
    3. xetai9977
      4 October 2013 08: 19 New
      +9
      Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan are Turkic states, and their good relations with Turkey are a natural process. If Turkey is a NATO member, this does not mean that Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan are also going there. We are not responsible for Georgia. To each his own.
  3. bomg.77
    bomg.77 4 October 2013 07: 18 New
    +1
    Kazakhstan, Turan wants to build with Turkey. Why did you join the vehicle?
    1. Lindon
      Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 08 New
      +4
      Putin did not call Turkey in the vehicle?
      Are there no plans for rapprochement with Turkey?
      1. bomg.77
        bomg.77 4 October 2013 08: 42 New
        +1
        Quote: Lindon
        Putin did not call Turkey in the vehicle?
        Are there no plans for rapprochement with Turkey?
        What kind of alliance and rapprochement can we talk about if Russia and Turkey are in different camps? For all Key positions, we are opposed.
        1. Lindon
          Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 54 New
          +6
          History shows that changing the camp is not a complicated matter.
          And allies or opponents - it depends on the point of view.
          Lenin and Stalin supported the creation of Ataturk, but when he headed for Europe, Stalin translated all the Turkic languages ​​of the USSR from Latin to Cyrillic. Although before that they planted the Latin alphabet.
          "Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said in a television interview that he asked Russian President Vladimir Putin to accept his country into the Shanghai Cooperation Organization."
          Turkey wants to become a regional leader and will not always be a servant of the West. So Turkey itself would not mind changing camps. Tired of sitting in the front desk of the EU.
          If it’s too much and the Customs Union will join the SCO.
          1. ayyildiz
            ayyildiz 4 October 2013 09: 24 New
            +5
            Quote: Lindon
            History shows that changing the camp is not a complicated matter.


            It is unlikely that Turkey will change the camp at this stage?
          2. bomg.77
            bomg.77 4 October 2013 10: 05 New
            0
            Quote: Lindon
            History shows that changing camp is not a matter of
            Just the same with respect to Turkey and Russia, this thesis is not suitable.
            Quote: Lindon
            Turkey wants to become a regional leader and will not always be a servant of the West. So Turkey itself would not mind changing camps. Tired of sitting in the front desk of the EU.
            It’s hard for the Turks to come to terms with the fact that after the Ottoman Empire they are forced to run errands in the USA and constantly knock on the doors of the EU (well, take me laughing ) this is understandable, but in my opinion the Turks themselves do not know what they want, Or pan-Turkism or (NATO and the EU) or (SCO and the CU).
        2. ayyildiz
          ayyildiz 4 October 2013 09: 23 New
          +6
          Quote: bomg.77
          What kind of alliance and rapprochement can we talk about if Russia and Turkey are in different camps?


          And with Germany are not different?
          1. bomg.77
            bomg.77 4 October 2013 10: 19 New
            0
            Germany is occupied and forced to do what the Anglo-Saxons say. Turkey has a more or less independent position on many issues, but it always turns out against Russia. hi
    2. Essenger
      Essenger 4 October 2013 09: 07 New
      +5
      Quote: bomg.77
      Kazakhstan, Turan wants to build with Turkey. Why did you join the vehicle?


      I also ask myself this question and I think it's time to get out of there.
      1. bomg.77
        bomg.77 4 October 2013 09: 24 New
        +3
        Quote: Essenger
        Quote: bomg.77
        Kazakhstan, Turan wants to build with Turkey. Why did you join the vehicle?


        I also ask myself this question and I think it's time to get out of there.
        Essenger, but in Turan what will you do? and why is Turan better than the customs union?
        1. Lindon
          Lindon 4 October 2013 09: 33 New
          +4
          And what is Turan?
          It is not a fact that the CU will be viable if Moscow invites the weak economies of Armenia, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan there.
          Why repeat the mistakes of others when Greece is pulling the EU into the hole before our eyes.
          Someone wants to lay a mine when creating a vehicle?
          1. bomg.77
            bomg.77 4 October 2013 10: 27 New
            +1
            Quote: Lindon
            And what is Turan?
            As far as I know, this is the dream of some Turkish politicians to unite the Turkic peoples in a single state.
            Quote: Lindon
            It is not a fact that the CU will be viable if Moscow invites the weak economies of Armenia, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan there.
            The vehicle already exists and in my opinion shows good results, but as for Turan, it’s not a fact that it will take place at all, but if it takes place then it will take many years. And weak countries are not forever!
            1. Lindon
              Lindon 4 October 2013 10: 48 New
              +3
              Dreaming is not harmful. Weak countries will always be. The USSR was also destroyed because the 4 economically wealthy republics had 11 subsidized ones.
              When within the framework of one country there is such a division, it is normally perceived, but not in the union of countries. Therefore, the EU is cracking at the seams - the PIGs are pulling down.
              If Russia, as a masochist, wants to boost the economy of Armenia, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan, then do not interfere with us. Do it outside the vehicle.
              1. Zymran
                Zymran 4 October 2013 12: 39 New
                +3
                Quote: Lindon
                If Russia, as a masochist, wants to boost the economy of Armenia, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan, then do not interfere with us. Do it outside the vehicle.


                And better, let them take Armenians, Kyrgyz and Tajiks, and they will leave us alone.
              2. Semurg
                Semurg 4 October 2013 13: 14 New
                +3
                Kyrgyzstan is important for Kazakhstan because it is a direct neighbor and it needs help from us, preferably by opening jobs there (tourism, energy, natural resources), although there is weak state administration and investment may be lost (though the rate of return on the investment is higher) it’s probably premature in the CU, but with time everything is possible (if the CU and CES will exist in the future). Armenia-Tajikistan I think is not important for us.
              3. bomg.77
                bomg.77 4 October 2013 18: 51 New
                0
                Quote: Lindon
                The USSR was also destroyed because the 4 economically wealthy republics had 11 subsidized ones.
                I think it is not necessary to say that the USSR was built on completely different principles than the EU. Those countries that were not subsidized entered the USSR as beggars like everyone else. All their prosperity is the merit of the USSR, and not of a single state. So Lyndon does not need about the rich and poor.
                1. Lindon
                  Lindon 4 October 2013 19: 17 New
                  +1
                  The USSR was voluntary on paper and it is far from the EU - these are two different eras. The republics were not poor - each country had its own economic model - no one received subsidies from the king.
                  The merit of Stalin was that he curtailed the NEP and closed foreign concessions. All resources were mobilized to create a new single economy. Stalin, as a Marxist, knew that the matter could not end with one imperialist war - that was what he was preparing.
                  And the fact that the 4 republics and the Pose of the collapse of the USSR are self-sufficient - it is visible even now - Look at the per capita GDP of the Russian Federation, KZ, Azerbaijan and all questions will disappear themselves.
                  1. bomg.77
                    bomg.77 4 October 2013 20: 26 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Lindon
                    The USSR was voluntary on paper and it is far from the EU - these are two different eras

                    I did not state the opposite.
                    Quote: Lindon
                    And the fact that the 4 republics and the cessation of the collapse of the USSR are self-sufficient - it is visible even now - Look at the GDP per capita of the Russian Federation, KZ, Azerbaijan and all questions will disappear themselves
                    Now yes, after oil and gas deposits were explored under the USSR. What the USSR did for all former republics was unattainable in the next 50-100 years. In the USSR, we flew in space, we defeated fascism, raised the BAM virgin soil, and so on, and now who is it pull without combining
            2. Yeraz
              Yeraz 4 October 2013 16: 37 New
              +1
              Quote: bomg.77
              As far as I know, this is the dream of some Turkish politicians to unite the Turkic peoples in a single state.

              you don’t fully know. This is not a dream of Turkish politicians, it is a dream of Turkic patriots who strive to live in a single state with a single national identity.
              So far, this is utopia. Because the national self-awareness should be the same, that was the state of Turan. But work is being done in this direction and this is being done by the most powerful states of the Turkic countries Turkey, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan. Kazakhstan in this slows down the Russian population inside but it’s getting smaller, and there are more Kazakhs and the national consciousness is becoming more. The key moment of Turan is a powerful cultural cooperation. Although Turkey, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan have made great strides in economic cooperation and everything is progressing only.
              1. RA77
                RA77 4 October 2013 17: 19 New
                0
                Quote: Yeraz
                it is a dream of Turkic patriots who strive to live in a single state-ve with a single national identity.

                And you, if I understand correctly, just one of these same Turkic patriots, right?
                1. Yeraz
                  Yeraz 5 October 2013 13: 21 New
                  +6
                  Quote: RA77
                  And you, if I understand correctly, just one of these same Turkic patriots, right?

                  Of course good
                  1. RA77
                    RA77 5 October 2013 14: 25 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Yeraz
                    Of course

                    Yes, I felt)) That's what I see that you, that the rest of the Azerbaijanis (in this discussion Lonely, for example) each time you whisper to the Kazakhs with comments in your ear: You don’t need this TS. You are an independent country! No one decree to you, etc. etc. in the same vein. If only to get them away from Russia. And you yourself see them in your union. Turan, or what is it called? Cunningly, yes))
                    1. Essenger
                      Essenger 5 October 2013 14: 43 New
                      +3
                      Quote: RA77
                      that the rest of the Azerbaijanis (in this discussion Lonely, for example) every time you whisper to the Kazakhs with comments in your ear: You don’t need this TS. You are an independent country!

                      Well, again, the Azerbaijanis are “to blame” ?!)))
                      1. RA77
                        RA77 5 October 2013 15: 02 New
                        0
                        Quote: Essenger
                        Well, again, the Azerbaijanis are “to blame” ?!)))

                        Why are you to blame? Tricky! I wrote)) For good reason they are all this, for good reason;)) Do not listen to them at all, they will teach you bad things!)))
              2. Zymran
                Zymran 4 October 2013 17: 30 New
                +5
                Quote: Yeraz
                you don’t fully know. This is not a dream of Turkish politicians, it is a dream of Turkic patriots who strive to live in a single state with a single national identity.


                Well, I personally would not want to live in a single state, but the cultural, military and most important economic rapprochement of the Turkic countries is good. Most of all I would like to see the rapprochement of Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan.
                1. Essenger
                  Essenger 4 October 2013 17: 37 New
                  +3
                  Quote: Zymran
                  Well, I personally would not want to live in a single state


                  I am also against a single state, for consolidation in all areas. Especially in foreign policy and economics.

                  Quote: Zymran
                  Most of all I would like to see the rapprochement of Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan.

                  And what about the Kyrgyz?)))
                  1. Zymran
                    Zymran 4 October 2013 17: 39 New
                    +5
                    Quote: Essenger
                    And what about the Kyrgyz?)))


                    Winter will not be. laughing With the Kyrgyz, it seems like the relationship is pretty close, but with the Turkmen and Uzbeks there are very few any joint projects and other things.
                    1. ayyildiz
                      ayyildiz 4 October 2013 18: 04 New
                      +4
                      Quote: Zymran
                      but with the Turkmen and Uzbeks there are very few joint projects and other things.

                      This is also for their leadership, the time will come on joint more large projects!
                  2. ayyildiz
                    ayyildiz 4 October 2013 17: 53 New
                    +4
                    Quote: Essenger
                    I am also against a single state, for consolidation in all areas. Especially in foreign policy and economics


                    I completely agree and support you! hi
                2. Yeraz
                  Yeraz 5 October 2013 13: 24 New
                  +5
                  Quote: Zymran
                  Well, I personally would not want to live in a single state,

                  You say this on the basis of the current situation, and now I would not want to either, but when national thinking from the Turkic countries reaches the level where Kazakh and Uzbek will be perceived as a conditional Muscovite and Petersburger, then you will agree. But before that a long way to go in the national consciousness.
                  Quote: Zymran
                  but the cultural, military and most important economic rapprochement of the Turkic countries is good.

                  It is perfectly.
                  Quote: Zymran
                  Most of all I would like to see the rapprochement of Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan and Turkmenistan.

                  Of course, having common borders, this would be cool, but so far the Turkic Commonwealth is held on 3 pillars by Turkey, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan.
                  1. Zymran
                    Zymran 5 October 2013 13: 48 New
                    +5
                    Quote: Yeraz
                    but when national thinking from the Turkic countries reaches the level where Kazakh and Uzbek will be perceived as a conditional Muscovite and Petersburger, then you will agree. But before that, there is still a long way to go in the national consciousness.


                    I would also like the equal rights of all nationalities belonging to such a community. In the Ottoman Empire, the heyday was about the same, and the appointment to high government posts on the principle of meritocracy.

                    Quote: Yeraz
                    but for now, the Turkic community rests on 3 whales Turkey, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan.


                    Unfortunately for now, yes. But let's hope that the Turkmen and the Uzbeks will catch up.
              3. bomg.77
                bomg.77 4 October 2013 19: 28 New
                0
                Quote: Yeraz
                you don’t fully know. This is not a dream of Turkish politicians, it is a dream of Turkic patriots who seek to live in a single state
                Eraz, is Erdogan not one of these patriots? These patriots are represented in the parliament, therefore they are not just dreamer patriots, but politicians who influence Turkish politics.
                Quote: Yeraz
                While this is utopia.
                Israel, too, was a utopia, but for some 2500 years and everything turned out wassat
                Quote: Yeraz
                Turan is a powerful cultural collaboration.
                It is better to create a cultural and economic space than uniting into one big poorly governed state. Well, this is my opinion.
                1. ayyildiz
                  ayyildiz 4 October 2013 19: 37 New
                  +2
                  Eraz, is Erdogan not one of these patriots?

                  Honestly no! Not that party! Erdogan is more for a union of Muslim countries!
                  1. bomg.77
                    bomg.77 4 October 2013 20: 17 New
                    -1
                    Quote: ayyildiz
                    Honestly no! Not that party! Erdogan is more for a union of Muslim countries!
                    These are links of one chain. The Ottoman Empire 2 is also part of Turan.
            3. Kasym
              Kasym 4 October 2013 17: 40 New
              +5
              bomq.77. Hello. Most of the Turkic peoples live in the territory of the Russian Federation - Tatars, Bashkirs, Kalmyks, etc. .. Also, Turkey and Azerbaijan are separated by the Caspian Sea and Iran from other Turkic countries. Only Central Asia and Kazakhstan remain. But here, Uzbekistan is not written for any integration processes. Therefore, Tyran is only a fantasy.
              I also think that joining the CU of Kyrgyzstan, Armenia and Tajikistan is premature. They all need help, but we are not in a position to take everything upon ourselves now - let us prove to ourselves that we have chosen the right way - we will raise the well-being of our people and create a large number of highly paid slaves. places, and then give "load". And so, for now, we are sitting on the raw materials ourselves. Tomorrow, with another crisis, prices will go down to it, and what will we do ourselves? Today they will be promised, and tomorrow it’s not that help, we will not be able to fill our budgets. And how then we will look before the applicants - we promise help, but we can’t answer for the bazaar. No, that will not do . There is no need to rush in such matters. Our authorities promised us that with the Union y we will have a stronger and more developed economy, people's well-being will increase; Pust actually prove. We, in Kazakhstan, are accustomed to the fact that Nazarbayev is more or less responsible for his words - now now fools prove. He will prove, then we will think about neighbors - not greedy, we will share. hi
              1. Zymran
                Zymran 4 October 2013 17: 53 New
                +4
                Quote: Kasym
                There is no need to rush in such matters. Our authorities promised us that with the Union y we will have a stronger and more developed economy, people's well-being will increase


                Has the welfare of people greatly increased?

                Quote: Kasym
                We, in Kazakhstan, are used to the fact that Nazarbayev is more or less responsible for his words


                Did many of the promises come true?
                1. Kasym
                  Kasym 4 October 2013 20: 44 New
                  +5
                  I wrote about welfare below. I need time and for the sake of the future I am ready to tolerate.
                  About Nazarbayev. I am neutral with him, it’s hard for us to look at him objectively. But nonetheless .
                  -Nazarbayev. Corruption and "family" (especially their permissiveness), education and healthcare, culture and science.
                  + Nazarbayev.
                  1. Kazakhstan as a state hosted. The borders are defined, the relations with neighbors are friendly, the constitution and the army, the assembly of the peoples of Kazakhstan and good interethnic relations. There was no civil war or famine.
                  2. "First, the economy, and then politics." This is the main horse of Nazarbayev.
                  He promised to raise the building industry. In the USSR, the Kazakh SSR did not even make nails. And now the building industry is developing rapidly. The new capital is proof. Cement and brick plants. German Knayf, etc. etc..
                  He promised to collect cars. Done .
                  He promised to attract foreign investors. 80% of all investments in Central Asia go to Kazakhstan. The Council of Foreign Investors was created under his chairmanship, they meet once a year. Foreigners do not seem to be "impudent." Investments come, so the country is developing steadily. By the way, about stability, my Ukrainian guests spoke very often. "There are already more presidents than us; there is no stability, no investors can be lured. Rejoice that you alone have been all this time."
                  Kazakhstan is one of the few states in the world that has had economic growth since 1998. The economy has grown several times since (Kazakhstan’s GDP per person at the time of the collapse of the USSR was $ 600, and now $ 10. And there are major growth points - Kashagan goes to com. Mining, industrial and other economic programs.) . He promised to do it.
                  New enterprises and directions in the development of the economy have appeared. What was not during the USSR. Eletronica, for example, just showed by box that in Aktay they opened a plant - to collect gadgets. And LG has already moved from assembly to production (there is this infa on the Internet).
                  Previously, only chygyn melted. And now, pipes and fittings and automotive iron. Previously, only alumina was mined, but now aluminum is ready. Previously, there was not enough oil for yourself (if you know this), but now we are exporting. They used to depend on Uzbek gas and imported electricity. Now times are changing.
                  And these are all jobs. Its' his job . This cannot be denied.
                  He promised that according to the case of his son-in-law, he would investigate to the end. He did and then apologized to the people for him. I don’t remember that any incumbent president from the former USSR would give justice to his relatives.
                  Something like that. Sincerely hi
              2. MilaPhone
                MilaPhone 4 October 2013 19: 09 New
                +1
                Kasymu
                A good answer from a true Kazakh.
                As for the costs, I doubt that Kazakhstan will have to fork out something. Do you see the Customs Union is still more political consolidation. CSTO, TS, these organizations are called upon to preserve part of the communications of the former USSR, so to speak. To jointly reflect the military, political, and economic incentives that threaten our region globally.
                Kazakhstan is a clearly independent, established state, but please don’t be fooled by all sorts of Ottoman-Turanian ideas - they definitely will not help you in the confrontation with China.
                1. Essenger
                  Essenger 4 October 2013 20: 10 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Milafon
                  they definitely will not help you in the confrontation with China.


                  Why are we opposed to them? Or, as always, offer Russian "protection" from the Chinese?
                  1. MilaPhone
                    MilaPhone 4 October 2013 20: 24 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Essenger
                    Why are we opposed to them? Or, as always, offer Russian "protection" from the Chinese?

                    Why are you writing for the Kazakhs? You are not Kazakh!
                    1. Essenger
                      Essenger 4 October 2013 21: 09 New
                      +3
                      Quote: Milafon
                      Quote: Essenger
                      Why are we opposed to them? Or, as always, offer Russian "protection" from the Chinese?

                      Why are you writing for the Kazakhs? You are not Kazakh!


                      Who then do you think?
                      1. MilaPhone
                        MilaPhone 4 October 2013 21: 32 New
                        +2
                        Quote from Essenger:
                        Who then do you think?

                        Meskhetian Turk or Azerbaijani.
                      2. Essenger
                        Essenger 4 October 2013 21: 41 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Milafon
                        Quote from Essenger:
                        Who then do you think?

                        Meskhetian Turk or Azerbaijani.


                        I am an ethnic Kazakh, from the genus Altybas Alasha, the youngest zhuz.
                        For Russians, nationality is always important? By the way, are you Russian?
                        I have been here for more than a year and this is not the first time I have been asked about this. ..................
                      3. MilaPhone
                        MilaPhone 4 October 2013 21: 55 New
                        0
                        Quote: Essenger
                        I am an ethnic Kazakh, from the kind of Altybas Alasha, the youngest Zhuz. For Russians, is a person's nationality always important? By the way, are you Russian? I have been here for more than a year and this is not the first time I have been asked about this. Once I was called either a Jew or a Zionist.

                        Something does not seem like you are a Kazakh. You comment more on articles about Turks and Azerbaijanis than about Kazakhs. I am Russian from the family of Svistoplyasovs, average. lol
                        No, you are clearly not a Jew.
                      4. Essenger
                        Essenger 4 October 2013 22: 09 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Milafon
                        Something does not seem like you are a Kazakh. You comment more on articles about Turks and Azerbaijanis than about Kazakhs


                        I want to comment on what article I want. This article, by the way, is about Kazakhs))) Maybe we can switch to Kazakh? Check)))

                        Quote: Milafon
                        I am Russian from the family of Svistoplyasovs, average.


                        Is this an attempt to troll the Kazakhs?)))
                    2. Yeraz
                      Yeraz 5 October 2013 14: 02 New
                      +4
                      Quote: Essenger
                      I am an ethnic Kazakh, from the genus Altybas Alasha, the youngest zhuz.

                      It’s just a matter of fact that earlier the Azerbaijanis always participated in the confrontation, while the other Turks stood aside, and now everything is changing and people don’t like it.
          2. Kasym
            Kasym 4 October 2013 21: 41 New
            +6
            Hello, hello. We help the Kyrgyz as well as you Belarusians. About this fact in Russia is poorly known - energy, washing and loans. And if they join the TS, then we will not get away from their workers ’Ryk, you will have to accept even more guest workers. This is as minimal. Consequently, there will be tougher competition in our labor markets. Have to create a slave for them. places. But where to create them: y us or in Kyrgyzstan itself? Therefore, I write that spending is inevitable.
            Mikhail, why do you think that if any Turkic union is created, it will be against Russia? Do not forget that among the peoples of the Russian Federation there are many Turkic-speaking people (their tribal lands are from the Volga and far east), and therefore such an alliance cannot, by definition, be directed against Russia. Quite the contrary — the USSR can be said to have been the Union between the Slavs and Turks (with the exception of the Turks and Kurds). But as I have already written, the union of the Turks is still mystic. And therefore, the Kazakhs have long been decided, since 1993.
            Michael, I do not consider China a threat. Stand in their place. Having unleashed wars with us or with you, they risk losing everything, incl. their statehood. They will lose access to our resources. They will lose their invested capital (China has invested 20 billion in Kazakhstan and 30 more recently signed documents. I think they invested even more in Russia). If they lose, of course. These are huge risks for them. They would have to keep their territory - Tibet, СyАР (yygy), south. There are practically no strategic allies except us. Y them with all neighbors territorial disputes. If they also begin to conflict with us, then it will not lead to anything good for them. They all understand this. We are their number one allies. By the way, according to the statements of the Chinese media, the most frequent meetings at the highest level in China are ... with Kazakhstan. Since taking office, Xi Jinping has been 2 officers. meetings and 1 unofficial. And this is for 4 months. his works . Which of these conclusions can be drawn for you.
            PS Recent agreements with China.
            1. We give an opportunity to gain an 8% stake in Kashagan (oil).
            2. They give us a loan (low. Percent. And "long") to gain our share in this field.
            3. Oil refinery.
            4. Petrochemical complex.
            5. Windmills and solar panels. Production.etc.
            In short, 30 billion .And they are also interested in opening a permanent committee on cross-border cooperation (there is similar between Kazakhstan and the Russian Federation), which, as I understand it, should contribute to the development of our villages. households .As stated that China is ready to buy production of our agricultural industry.
            Sincerely, Dayren. hi
        2. bomg.77
          bomg.77 4 October 2013 20: 00 New
          +2
          Quote: Kasym
          Hello. Most of the Turkic peoples live on the territory of the Russian Federation - Tatars, Bashkirs, Kalmyks, etc. .. Also, Turkey and Azerbaijan are separated by the Caspian Sea and Iran from other Turkic countries. Only Central Asia and Kazakhstan remain. But here, Uzbekistan is not written for any integration processes. Therefore, Tyran is only a fantasy.
          Hello Kasym. I know who they want to see in Turan, in addition to these nationalities, the Caucasian people Chechens and Dagestan Kabarda fall for them a separate idea of ​​pan-Islamism since they are not Türks. The creation of a tura does not provide for countries such as: Armenia, Georgia, United Iran (North is torn away) United Russia. Armenia as a bone in the throat of the Turks and Az-on and further advancement to the Caucasus.
          Quote: Kasym
          I also think that joining the CU of Kyrgyzstan, Armenia and Tajikistan is premature.
          Although they are poor, they are markets and logistics. With the entry into the CU, production may also be revived.
        3. Essenger
          Essenger 4 October 2013 20: 08 New
          +5
          Quote: Kasym
          Most of the Turkic peoples live in the territory of the Russian Federation - Tatars, Bashkirs, Kalmyks, etc.


          Kalmyks are not Turks
          1. Kasym
            Kasym 4 October 2013 21: 53 New
            +4
            I agree . But they are from jungar. And it was a people very close to us.
        4. Yeraz
          Yeraz 5 October 2013 14: 00 New
          +3
          Quote: Kasym
          hello. Most of the Turkic peoples live on the territory of the Russian Federation - Tatars, Bashkirs, Kalmyks, etc. .. Also, Turkey and Azerbaijan are separated by the Caspian Sea and Iran from other Turkic countries.

          This is not a problem. This is an example of Kazakhs and Azerbaijanis. The Caspian is not so large and logistics is very well developed between them. Baku has the largest civilian fleet in the Caspian, we can transport energy resources further and further by rail, and if you build a pipe everything is ok.
          Quote: Kasym
          They all need help, but we are not in a position to take everything upon ourselves now -

          So I am also against putting on poor countries. Because they will begin to blame each other. And most importantly, I say once more that unification should happen when we look at each other as representatives of one ethnic group !!! So far, the most progress in this Azerbaijanis and Turks would have achieved. But if there was political will, they would have achieved even more. Further, Kazakhs and Kyrgyz people could succeed in this. And so until there is a single national consciousness, and until then a single state will be created only in harm to Turan.
  4. Essenger
    Essenger 4 October 2013 10: 17 New
    +3
    Quote: bomg.77
    and why is Turan better than the customs union?


    plus for your question)

    You see, this is not about where it is better or worse. It's about benefits.
  • ayyildiz
    ayyildiz 4 October 2013 09: 26 New
    +4
    For more would be a joint military corporation!
  • Andrey KZ
    Andrey KZ 4 October 2013 09: 48 New
    +5
    Quote: bomg.77
    Kazakhstan, Turan wants to build with Turkey. Why did you join the vehicle?

    Think one-sidedly comrade.
    Sberbank of Russia JSC strengthens cooperation between the business of Kazakhstan and Turkey.

    Sberbank, in the framework of the Kazakh-Turkish business forum in Astana, presented the International Desk project - new offices for servicing international companies in Kazakhstan.

    “Why does Sberbank open an International Desk with a Turkish bias in Kazakhstan? Look, there are a thousand Russian and more than 1,7 thousand Turkish companies in Kazakhstan. Probably, the answer is already clear. We follow the client, we want to help the customers who work here,” - said the deputy chairman of the board for international business of Sberbank of Russia OJSC Sergey Gorkov.
    Answer the question for yourself, why does Sberbank of Russia serve Kazakh-Turkish cooperation?
    1. bomg.77
      bomg.77 4 October 2013 19: 39 New
      +2
      Quote: Andrew KZ
      Think one-sidedly comrade.
      I do not like footcloths to write and copy-paste, but I say what I think, excuse me. Thoughts are many, but I reprint them with difficulty. laughing
      Quote: Andrew KZ
      Answer the question for yourself, why does Sberbank of Russia serve Kazakh-Turkish cooperation?
      I can’t say anything about it because I’m not in the topic. Maybe just a business
      1. Andrey KZ
        Andrey KZ 4 October 2013 20: 09 New
        +3
        Quote: bomg.77
        I can’t say anything about it since it’s not a topic

        I’m kind of off topic, too, but given that the controlling stake in Sberbank of Russia belongs to the Central Bank of the Russian Federation, that is, the government of the Russian Federation, it can be assumed that Moscow is trying to somehow influence Ankara through Astana. But this is only my guesses.
        1. bomg.77
          bomg.77 4 October 2013 21: 29 New
          +1
          Maybe as you say, it's all dark. hi
  • Zymran
    Zymran 4 October 2013 12: 31 New
    +2
    It is unlikely that Kazakhstan is going to build Turan, but it’s not clear to me why it’s joined the Customs Union. I believe that in order to ensure Russia’s security, more precisely, the roofs for our “elites”.
    1. Kasym
      Kasym 4 October 2013 19: 10 New
      +5
      Zimran. Good evening. Kazakhstan itself proposed the creation of a vehicle and then the Union. "Kazakhstan is an integration engine in the former USSR" - V.V. Pytin.
      I actually long wanted to talk with those who are against the vehicle. Explain why? Due to price increases? Any other reasons?
      The increase in prices was associated with an increase in customs excise taxes - we had to align with the Russian ones (this is a fair and legal requirement of Russia to support Russian manufacturers - the same auto industry). But with the growth of trade, the GDP and welfare of Kazakhstanis should also increase. And here is the problem, i.e. it is not. But in two years all at once will not appear. Time is needed. We must now focus on the entire space of the vehicle. Now the conditions have changed. Our market (for Kazakhstan) increased by 10 !!! times. Now you can create industries that were previously unprofitable. Remember what Western economic gyry of various stripes said - tourism, energy, metals, grain, infrastructure and production only related to the extraction of the above raw materials. That’s all that we could develop (maybe I tried something).
      Now let's see what happens now. Toyota, which (I saw it on TV) in the person of the chairman of the board of the concern, at a meeting in Japan with Nazarbayev, smiled sweetly and did nothing on proposals 01 to open an assembly plant in the Republic of Kazakhstan. "I will do whatever you say for you. Market for others I’ll close all manufacturers. I’ll take care of myself. I’ll take care of myself. I’ll keep my body of iron (I kept my word) from our raw materials — it’s cheap to get maximum profit. Toyota did not go. And now, please, you yourself have come running. Recently, the first Peugeot collected. In the 14th Toyota will collect the first car. Nissan is ready. Kia and Hyundai, San Yang and Skoda, VAZ and ZAZ are already going. 300 cars by 000 will be assembled. RK will be able to eat such a quantity without a vehicle - hardly. Have you seen new greenhouses in rows on the Alma-Ata-Kapchagay highway? And in Shimkent, Taraz? Moreover, they sell expensively, I know from those who are engaged in this. "Now I’ll beat it back, another year and a half. And then I'll see if it’s possible to start competing with yzbeks - who knows? It turned out to be so awkward, but it’s kind of twisted out — TS helps, prices have risen." Y of Kazakhstan there are undeniable advantages to the Russian Federation and Belarus. We are a more southern country. Therefore, melons (how many cars I loaded with watermelons in the army and everything went north to Russia), onions, garlic, rice, cotton, high-gluten grain, sugar beets, meat can and should be grown with allowance for the whole TS, and not for 2020 mil Kazakhstan (and this is 17 times more). Here, please, you have a growth point that would not exist without a vehicle. And this is practically an increase for the whole agriculture, where almost half of the population of Kazakhstan lives. I want our shepherds to buy bays. And as before, when traveling to the city, relatives brought meat. Recently, I had guests from Kiev. "I love meat, but not so much!" Kazi for both cheeks weaved. Our shish kebab is not standing next to Kiev - they cook it on fruit trees, but that’s not it. Our saxail showed them - they understood why they didn’t kill him with an ax. Well, okay, this is retreat. Assembly of helicopters, locomotives and other rolling stock. Without a vehicle, all this will be idle and no one needs anything for nothing.
      For a huge country (ter. 9th place on the planet) with large natural resources and a small population, a large market is needed.
      And in general, analyze the actions of China before and after Kazakhstan's entry into the CU. Find out a lot of interesting things.
      I have a lot to add, incl. personal experience in trading with Russian companies. But this is on the next. times. hi
      Sincerely, Dayren.
      1. Zymran
        Zymran 4 October 2013 22: 14 New
        +3
        Quote: Kasym
        Toyota did not go. And now, please, you yourself have come running. Recently, the first Peugeot collected. In the 14th Toyota will collect the first car. Nissan is ready


        All this is good, and now the main question. Where is the growth of wealth for what money will people buy Toyota and Peugeot and even forgive the Lord Psany Yongs?
        Now I see only new Basins, and in some places Chinese cars. Occasionally come across Skoda.

        Quote: Kasym
        300 000 machines will be assembled for 2020. RK will be able to eat such a quantity without a vehicle - hardly.


        Fuck us so many cars. Do you think they can be delivered to Russia? Personally, I doubt very much.

        Quote: Kasym
        Assembly of helicopters, locomotives and other rolling stock. Without a vehicle, all this will be idle and no one needs anything for nothing.


        Locomotives in the Russian Federation still do not miss. But they are bought by the Baltic states, Tajikistan and Mongolia. Our vodka is also not allowed in the Russian Federation. The only thing that we successfully trade in is bearings, and Rakhatov sweets.

        And why do we need a vehicle when there is a WTO into which we will soon enter? We will open it, if it’s so important for you not the 170 millionth market, but the whole world.

        In short, the growth of people's well-being is falling sharply, and prices are rising. Well, let's wait a couple more years, but I'm sure it will get worse.
        1. Kasym
          Kasym 4 October 2013 23: 40 New
          +5
          Zimran, thanks for the answer. I agree with you regarding the current situation. Improving the welfare and solvency of the people directly depends on the country's GDP. Kashagan will double oil exports. An industrial program, an agricultural development program (which should be developed by the government before the end of the year) should add to the budget. That is, I'm talking about real points of growth. Yes, not immediately, but the direction is absolutely right. Let us recall the Kazakhstan-2030 program for becoming one of the 50 developed economies of the world. The task was completed this year. Nazarbayev kept his word, and the terms, as you can see, are 16 years earlier than planned. Now they’re preparing a new one, now we are talking about the 30 most developed economies in the world. But can a poor state, with a poor population, swindle at such a thing? Not . China, in connection with the crisis in the West and the country's large gold and foreign exchange reserves, began to sharply increase the solvency of its population, thereby increasing domestic consumption. Our time will come too - gold and foreign exchange reserves are approaching 100 billion, while there is still not enough industrial potential, developed infrastructure. The crisis has not yet passed, so ours do not risk raising social financing. programs. By the way, much more money is spent on social media in Russia than us. So, there is a potential and opportunity for our economy.
          I know what problems there are with Russians - you write everything correctly. The same goes for medicines. They require their certification, and it is terribly expensive. Now this issue is being discussed between governments. These are the same "costs". Ours are also tough negotiators. We’ll agree, this is a normal process - they don’t go anywhere, otherwise ours will begin to shut off oxygen somewhere. In the end, Pytin and Nazarbayev will decide everything in one meeting. I read that over there Chimkent agreed with Moscow on the supply of villages. products. This is such a klondike for our dehkans, if you approach with your head.
          Unfortunately, the WTO does not open markets - no one is waiting for you in Europe, we should have been able to enter Russia faster than Russia. There is only a place for strong economies.
          According to my estimates, around 2015-2016, substantial growth will begin. Pah-pah, of course. But stability is necessary not only for us, but also in the region. drinks
  • Papania
    Papania 4 October 2013 07: 32 New
    -6
    We saw the Kazakhs in this Turan ... They beckoned with plague and they led. Turks would not move without a kick. On the other hand, the Turks need to tie the top to themselves ...
  • fklj
    fklj 4 October 2013 07: 32 New
    -7
    What can I say. Reliable allies in Russia. Political prostitution rules.
    1. Lindon
      Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 10 New
      +2
      I understand that the tender for C-300 has failed.
      It’s not good to envy when others do better.
    2. hommer
      hommer 4 October 2013 08: 41 New
      10
      Quote: fklj
      Reliable allies in Russia. Political prostitution rules


      Do not hysteria, please.
      Kazakhstan is an ally for Russia, but not a vassal.
      Kazakhstan will always have its own interests, it is important that this does not harm Russia. What threat do you see in the production of optical sights, thermal imagers, spare parts for aircraft, etc.? Offer Kazakhstan production according to your technologies, it will be more profitable and better - definitely the questions will be removed.
      And cooperation with Russia in the military and military-technical sphere is several orders of magnitude higher than the volume of cooperation with any other country.
      No need to think in outdated categories.
      This is well understood in the Russian leadership. If you thought like you, then there would definitely be only two allies.
      1. fklj
        fklj 4 October 2013 08: 53 New
        -8
        Kazakhstan is an ally for Russia, but not a vassal.

        Yes you. These are millions of Russians, in Kazakhstan, vassals. And the Kazakh leadership has its own interests and no one doubts this.

        What threat do you see in the production of optical sights, thermal imagers, spare parts for aircraft, etc.?

        It is not a matter of producing optical sights, but of the "East Bazaar" policy of Nazarbayev and the reliability of Kazakhstan as Russia's strategic ally.
        1. Lindon
          Lindon 4 October 2013 09: 01 New
          +6
          Nazarbayev’s East-Bazaar policy is better than the corrupt policy of Gorbachev, Yeltsin and Medevedev.
          Nazarbayev was the last to leave the USSR and proposed a vehicle. Only the victim of EG who does not know the history of the last 22 years can blame his "insecurity".
        2. hommer
          hommer 4 October 2013 09: 01 New
          +7
          Quote: fklj
          Yes you. These are millions of Russians in Kazakhstan, vassals


          Google the number of Russians, Ukrainians, Belarusians in the civil service in the Republic of Kazakhstan. With many of these "vassals," I would willingly switch places. But I do not pull in performance, education, business qualities. And they pull - and work in critical positions.
          I don’t even want to answer the provocation.
          Either a troll or a clinic.
          Into a black list.
          1. RA77
            RA77 4 October 2013 16: 50 New
            -1
            Quote: hommer
            Google the number of Russians, Ukrainians, Belarusians in the civil service in the Republic of Kazakhstan. With many of these "vassals," I would willingly switch places. But I do not pull in performance, education, business qualities. And they pull - and work in critical positions.

            Googling is an option, of course. But I'm interested in it, but what do the Russians themselves from Kazakhstan keep quiet on this subject? Let them speak for themselves. How many are there in the civil service or not at all. And then all the Kazakhs are responsible for them.
            Anyone let him answer, but besides Т80UM1 and a person with the nickname Andrey KZ. The first Korean, as far as I know, but there is no faith in the second.
            1. Andrey KZ
              Andrey KZ 4 October 2013 19: 55 New
              +3
              Quote: RA77
              Anyone let him answer, but besides Т80UM1 and a person with the nickname Andrey KZ. The first Korean, as far as I know, but there is no faith in the second.
              So what? Please explain yourself.
              1. RA77
                RA77 4 October 2013 21: 44 New
                -4
                Andrey KZ,
                Yes, I do not believe that you are the one you impersonate. Here local Kazakhs sometimes about Russians in Kazakhstan and about Russians in general somehow somehow boorishly and very unpleasant things burn up. But this surprisingly does not hurt you. It hurts me, but you are not. Okay, you say Ukrainian. Otmazyvatsya, well done. However, they say about the Ukrainians, I’m sure you would not say anything against. You do not look like either Russian or Ukrainian. But even if I am mistaken, you still too much Kazakhs assent in everything. Therefore, I do not think that your opinion is worth believing.
        3. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 4 October 2013 09: 32 New
          +5
          Quote: fklj
          And the Kazakh leadership has its own interests and no one doubts this.

          Except you, nobody, that’s true, that’s true laughing
        4. T80UM1
          T80UM1 4 October 2013 09: 33 New
          +5
          if you don’t want to write to anyone about Nazarbayev’s policies, it’s better to study Medvedev’s policies when he surrendered Libya or merges the economy now. Millions of Russians will be much better if the production will be opened on which they will receive work, unlike simple promises from the historical Motherland ...
      2. ayyildiz
        ayyildiz 4 October 2013 09: 28 New
        +9
        Quote: hommer
        Kazakhstan is an ally for Russia, but not a vassal.


        Not who forget that Kazakhstan is an independent state!
    3. Essenger
      Essenger 4 October 2013 09: 08 New
      +5
      Quote: fklj
      Reliable allies in Russia.


      Which country, such allies

      Quote: fklj
      Political prostitution rules.

      Well, no one gave you any guarantees
    4. T80UM1
      T80UM1 4 October 2013 09: 30 New
      12
      Something begins to remind:

      When Russia communicates with Turkey, this is the development of bilateral relations, when Kazakhstan communicates with Turkey, it weaves an anti-Russian conspiracy ...
      1. Essenger
        Essenger 4 October 2013 10: 19 New
        +6
        Quote: T80UM1
        Something begins to remind:

        When Russia communicates with Turkey, this is the development of bilateral relations, when Kazakhstan communicates with Turkey, it weaves an anti-Russian conspiracy ...


        Recently, you surprise me) Plus you
        1. MilaPhone
          MilaPhone 4 October 2013 12: 32 New
          +1
          There is a wise saying:
          Where the foot of the Turk stepped, the grass does not grow.
          How are you there without grass, then you will be Kazakh brothers ????
          1. Semurg
            Semurg 4 October 2013 13: 01 New
            +5
            Quote: Milafon
            There is a wise saying:
            Where the foot of the Turk stepped, the grass does not grow.
            How are you there without grass, then you will be Kazakh brothers ????

            they also say where the Ukrainian passed fat disappears, and you are pulling Ukraine hard in the vehicle. how are you there without fat risk staying Russian brothers laughing
            1. MilaPhone
              MilaPhone 4 October 2013 15: 07 New
              +1
              Well, what can you do if now they are prettier than bacon.
              Instead of fat, we will buy kurdyuk from Turkmenistan.
              1. ayyildiz
                ayyildiz 4 October 2013 17: 43 New
                +1
                Does Turkmenistan cooperate less with Turkey?
          2. ayyildiz
            ayyildiz 4 October 2013 17: 41 New
            0
            Quote: Milafon
            There is a wise saying:
            Where the foot of the Turk stepped, the grass does not grow.


            And where the Armenian foot entered, intrigue and envy!
            1. MilaPhone
              MilaPhone 4 October 2013 18: 23 New
              +1
              Quote: ayyildiz
              And where the Armenian foot entered, intrigue and envy!

              And what about the Armenians here? request
              1. alone
                alone 4 October 2013 19: 47 New
                +1
                besides that, that proverb about the Turk, after which the grass grows on, the Armenians always scatter hi Well, knowing your relationship, you can only guess what you're driving at))
              2. ayyildiz
                ayyildiz 4 October 2013 19: 51 New
                +1
                Quote: Milafon
                And what about the Armenians here?

                And besides that from their name you write!
          3. alone
            alone 4 October 2013 19: 45 New
            +2
            and the Kazakhs are the same Türks. and what do you think, why does grass grow there?
            1. MilaPhone
              MilaPhone 4 October 2013 19: 58 New
              +1
              Quote: lonely
              Kazakhs are the same Türks. And why do you think grass grows there?

              Quote: lonely
              besides that, that proverb about the Turk, after which the grass grows, the Armenians always scatter well, knowing your kindred relationship, you can only guess what you are driving at))

              I specifically meant the TURKS.
              Bulgarian proverb. Can you translate the Arabic as an example, also Muslims, but ...
              "Rather, the chicken will fly, than the Turks learn to love."

              Kurdish proverb:
              Bad life is that neighborhood with a Turk.
              1. ayyildiz
                ayyildiz 4 October 2013 20: 13 New
                +3
                Quote: Milafon
                I specifically meant the TURKS.


                Yes, Turkey is generally a desert! But for some reason, in agricultural products one of the first in Europe!

                Quote: Milafon
                Kurdish proverb:

                Again, for some reason, theirs high-level Kurds prefer neighbors of the Turks!
              2. Essenger
                Essenger 4 October 2013 20: 18 New
                +4
                Quote: Milafon
                I specifically meant the TURKS.

                not Turks, but Turks will be more correct in the future.

                but at the expense of proverbs, everyone has such about everyone.
                even among the Kazakhs there are proverbs about Russians, and negative ones.
    5. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 4 October 2013 16: 39 New
      +6
      Quote: fklj
      What can I say. Reliable allies in Russia. Political prostitution rules.
      Try to look at the situation with cooperation with Turkey from a different angle. I already wrote that Turkey would be delighted with full-scale military cooperation with Kazakhstan. But, just Kazakhstan, does not make closer contacts with Turkey, so as not to annoy the Russian Federation, as it understands that you will begin another hysteria ...
      Ak-Orda is not ready to move closer to Turkey to the detriment of its relations with Moscow.
      But in turn, she will not give up family ties with the Turkic country, for the sake of Russia ..
      By the way, for good reason, the latest products of the Turkish defense industry are called "Altai", "Tulpar" .. This, I think, is a direct appeal to the common Turkic roots ...
      1. alone
        alone 4 October 2013 21: 43 New
        +6
        Quote: Alibekulu
        By the way, for good reason, the latest products of the Turkish defense industry are called "Altai", "Tulpar" .. This, I think, is a direct appeal to the common Turkic roots ...


        I won’t say anything about “tulpar,” but the name of the tank has nothing to do with the Altai Territory.

        ALTAY is a promising third-generation Turkish main battle tank. The name of the tank was given in honor of the Turkish general Fakhrettin Altai, he commanded the cavalry corps during the military operations of 1919-1923 in the struggle for the independence of Turkey.
  • mirag2
    mirag2 4 October 2013 07: 33 New
    +6
    They will produce sights. We also don’t have modern ones. How did the story end with our attempt to export from America thermal imagers and new sights?
    They burned them that year, right? And then?
    For the lack of modern thermal imaging sights, it is very disappointing ...
    Although the Jews were going to sell their collimators to us, they always only sell the most rubbish.
    1. Lindon
      Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 33 New
      +8
      We must adopt the good that is in the west.
      Thermal imagers, sights, electronics - all these are the weak points of the Soviet military-industrial complex.
      Joint production on the territory of the Customs Union is a good help for borrowing and creating your own.
    2. Semurg
      Semurg 4 October 2013 09: 21 New
      11
      mirage 2. it is very bad that there are so few balanced comments like yours on the Russian side, basically some kind of nonsense about betrayal, etc. Reading their comments discomfort appears and you start to think if they live in the past (where there was a single state) if they have complexes that they are exceptional and others are second-rate. I think they started building an alliance early so that the Russians would rethink and have their imperial illnesses and then the whole thing about the alliance will be zero or even minus.
      1. Zymran
        Zymran 4 October 2013 13: 25 New
        +4
        There is no sense.
  • Lindon
    Lindon 4 October 2013 08: 23 New
    +7
    Kazakhstan cooperated with Israel - google Nise, Aibat, Semser.
    Attempts are constantly being made to modernize the weapons left over from the USSR.
    Such an inexpensive upgrade is obtained when modern electronics are installed on good art, rocket and mortar systems.
    1. T80UM1
      T80UM1 4 October 2013 09: 35 New
      +4
      And here the dough and criminality drank, Some people even sat down for the samser at the Kamaz base ... They just adopted the most complete, the base bends from the shots.
      1. Lindon
        Lindon 4 October 2013 09: 41 New
        +6
        I like Nise. In Russia, they go to the same thing only on their own - how many years will it take? I will not say, but Kazakhstan already has it and it’s good.
        There are always problems - the main thing is to be able to solve them optimally.
        I can’t say that there was no positive.
        1. Semurg
          Semurg 4 October 2013 10: 22 New
          +7
          They drank some of the money, but the main thing was the result (we need to think about the negative experience), we didn’t do such things in Kazakhstan now, but the rest will come with experience. And we would still not have these modernized types of weapons to procure.
  • individual
    individual 4 October 2013 08: 56 New
    +2
    For some reason, the author of the publication did not ask the Minister of Defense of Turkey: "How does the Turkish government sponsor bandits in Syria?"
    For this reason alone, it should not be a handshake for the CSTO defense ministers. Or, behind Moscow’s defending Syria, you can do everything while maintaining interests alien to us?
    1. Lindon
      Lindon 4 October 2013 09: 06 New
      +5
      Kazakhstan is still investing in Georgia. They are also not handshake.
      And Abkhazia with Ossetia does not recognize when.
      And in general, Kazakhstan has its own view on international politics.
      If offended, let Shoigu not handle with Dzhaksybekov.
  • ed65b
    ed65b 4 October 2013 09: 02 New
    +2
    right right, build a factory. You see the Turks fool their heads and the Jews will throw that secret thread. Here we all find out. fellow
  • Essenger
    Essenger 4 October 2013 09: 10 New
    +4
    Naturally, this news cannot but please me
  • MRomanovich
    MRomanovich 4 October 2013 12: 25 New
    -4
    It's a shame for the Kazakhs, as they spit on our friendship with their deed. Turkey is a member of NATO and whatever the "high" meetings would not talk about the lack of confrontation, but in fact NATO is a hostile organization towards us, all members of which, including Turkey, openly ruin Russia at every opportunity.
    1. Andrey KZ
      Andrey KZ 4 October 2013 12: 44 New
      +4
      Quote: MRomanovich
      their action they spit on our friendship
      And where did you see the “spit on friendship” here?
      With the leadership of "ASELSAN" Dzhansbekov discussed the prospects for further development and the implementation of the Kazakh-Turkish defense industry plant "Kazakhstan Aselsan Engineering", the opening of which is scheduled for the end of the year in Astana. The project aims to produce optical sights for small arms, night vision devices and thermal imagers. Provides for the production of electronic printed circuit boards, software development, manufacturing of optical lenses.
      People work, try to open production in their country, get access to technology. What is wrong?
  • Tan4ik
    Tan4ik 4 October 2013 12: 29 New
    -2
    Of course not bad. And many people living in Kazakhstan think that we are of the type of "friends", although we ourselves are evicting our people from Kazakhstan, but go to work with us! So not fair friends.
    1. Zymran
      Zymran 4 October 2013 12: 32 New
      +5
      Kazakhs do not go to work with you, do not confuse us with Kyrgyz, Tajiks and Uzbeks.
      1. Essenger
        Essenger 4 October 2013 12: 45 New
        +6
        Quote: Zymran
        Kazakhs do not go to work for you,


        Already going (after the start of work of the vehicle
        1. Zymran
          Zymran 4 October 2013 12: 46 New
          +4
          Are you talking about a recent article that he saw someone somewhere at the airport?
          1. Essenger
            Essenger 4 October 2013 14: 40 New
            +3
            Quote: Zymran
            Are you talking about a recent article that he saw someone somewhere at the airport?


            Zymran, I personally saw two who were going to work in Russia, it seems to Novorossiysk.
            1. Zymran
              Zymran 4 October 2013 15: 27 New
              +2
              Unskilled labor or specialists?
              1. Essenger
                Essenger 4 October 2013 16: 58 New
                +2
                Quote: Zymran
                Unskilled labor or specialists?


                to construction
      2. Semurg
        Semurg 4 October 2013 12: 52 New
        +6
        Well, someone is who works in Russia, so we also have people with Russian passports who work in Kazakhstan. The truth is not in those massive quantities like our neighbors.
    2. Andrey KZ
      Andrey KZ 4 October 2013 12: 49 New
      +5
      Quote: Tan4ik
      Of course not bad. And many people living in Kazakhstan think that we are of the type of "friends", although we ourselves are evicting our people from Kazakhstan, but go to work with us! So not fair friends.

      We are not "type" -we are FRIENDS. And no one "ours" is not evicted, already tired of writing about it.
      1. Tan4ik
        Tan4ik 4 October 2013 12: 54 New
        -2
        Yes you evict
      2. Semurg
        Semurg 4 October 2013 12: 55 New
        +4
        Quote: Andrew KZ
        Quote: Tan4ik
        Of course not bad. And many people living in Kazakhstan think that we are of the type of "friends", although we ourselves are evicting our people from Kazakhstan, but go to work with us! So not fair friends.

        We are not "type" -we are FRIENDS. And no one "ours" is not evicted, already tired of writing about it.

        He forgot to add in the north is still not so, but in the south it is very bad. laughing
        1. Tan4ik
          Tan4ik 4 October 2013 13: 17 New
          0
          Funny kapets is simple.
          1. Andrey KZ
            Andrey KZ 4 October 2013 13: 46 New
            +3
            Boris, Sagat laughs because this phrase
            it’s not so in the north, but in the south
            It’s become a classic on the Internet. They have talked about this so much that it remains only to laugh. But the truth is, no one drove anyone, did not drive and will not drive.
    3. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 4 October 2013 16: 11 New
      +4
      Quote: Tan4ik
      , although you yourself are evicting ours from Kazakhstan, but come to work for us! So not fair friends.
      Tanchik, but here in more detail please ..
      Where, when and how ??! I would evict some of your shoviks in the Russian Federation, if there was an opportunity .. Here T80UM1 и GUR They also wrote about this, but they didn’t answer me a request (requirement) to give specific facts .. no
      So all hope is for you, tanker ..
      Here is one of your ia-ai00 everything is still not being "evicted" from Kazakhstan .. recourse
      1. T80UM1
        T80UM1 4 October 2013 17: 22 New
        +1
        Remind me where and when I said that someone is being evicted ???
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 4 October 2013 23: 28 New
          +4
          Quote: T80UM1
          Remind me where and when I said that someone is being evicted ???
          ..
          Quote: T80UM1
          12 July 2013 10: 30 ↑ my acquaintance Kazakh said that even one Russian word about Kazakhs will say bad, I have friends in the prosecutor's office who will quickly deport him to his historical homeland ...
          ..
          Quote: GUR
          12 July 2013 11: 37 ↑ And are those guests who raised the country good and, in cases of displeasure, deported to their historical homeland? homeland.
          ..
          Quote: Alibekulu
          13 July 2013 12: 42 ↑ Gur and T80, give specific examples, where, when and which Russian was deported for a bad word about the Kazakhs ??
          1. T80UM1
            T80UM1 5 October 2013 07: 20 New
            0
            Hello! They arrived ... I just wrote about what some Kazakhs say and how they relate to the national minorities ... Or do you think this is a fact of the department itself ??? So in this case, when someone talks about the poor attitude in the KZ of some representatives of the title to the national minorities, I can’t but agree ...
            1. Alibekulu
              Alibekulu 5 October 2013 08: 19 New
              +1
              Quote: T80UM1
              Hello, come ..
              Hey.
              Quote: T80UM1
              here I can not agree
              Yeah current ..
              Quote: IRBIS
              Wolf law in Kazakhstan. Because, as selective, it applies only to "non-Kazakhs"
              ..
              Quote: Lakkuchu
              In a state governed by law, justice cannot be on the side of indigenous or non-indigenous; it should only be on the side of the law. All citizens of the country, regardless of nationality, should be equal before the law. From your own words it turns out that in Kazakhstan there is an infringement of rights on a national basis
              ..
              Quote: piter-tank
              I read your next post and realized that there is no justice in Kazakhstan in principle. The principles of the Lynch Court dominate.
              1. T80UM1
                T80UM1 7 October 2013 06: 41 New
                +1
                Comment on the incident when the zamakima kicked the stewardess (Russian) for responding in Kazakh with errors ???

                Then comment on the incident with the family of Chechen Mamakhanovs in the lakeside when, without trial, 4 people were killed in ethnic clashes

                Comment on the conflict at the Tengiz field with the Turkish workers

                And comment on the killing by the oralmans of a law enforcement representative in shanyrak

                I don’t argue that our society is more tolerant than in Russia, but you still don’t have to turn a blind eye to the behavior of some citizens ... Yes, I forgot to add in the first case, the zakamak was not even punished, and his boss took his side ... And what offended you those answers ???
                1. Alibekulu
                  Alibekulu 7 October 2013 10: 06 New
                  +1
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  Comment on the incident when the zamakima kicked the stewardess (Russian) for responding in Kazakh with errors ???
                  What is there to comment. For good, he needs a good knock on the head ..
                  There is a law, relevant articles under which he should be punished ..
                  Also for other cases cited by you ??!
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  And what were you offended at those answers ???
                  Why it is necessary to be guided by emotions: "offended", "loves - does not love" and so on.
                  I do not "climate", when in one or another kamenty everything is brought to nationality. I’m not going to justify our judicial system, and the Kazakhs (ours have their own bziki). In my opinion, yes, our court is largely corrupt and unfair. But this is a feature of all post-Soviet countries. I think in the Russian Federation, Ukraine, and others. A completely similar situation. But in the examples you give, the emphasis is on the Kazakhs.
                  The Kazakhs themselves have said this more than once, that a simple, non-paid Kazakh is in the same conditions as a simple Russian, Korean, and others.
                  If you give examples where you directly point to the Kazakhs, answer me the question, did the son of the head of “Kazzinc” be punished to bring down a child to death ??! And who was he by nationality ...
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  but you shouldn’t turn a blind eye to the behavior of some citizens ..
                  I said what is it worth ?! I myself had more than once troubled situations with the Kazakhs. But to emphasize that it is because they are Kazakhs, it somehow did not occur to me. I myself can cite a lot of examples when, like the Kazakhs, but also the "Russians" evaded deserved punishment ..
                  In general, it is often much easier for me to deal with Russians than with Kazakhs ..
                  P.S. As for the "fucking". One Korean woman, answering my question about difficulties in relations with other nationalities, chuckled: “Let someone in the Kyzyl-Horde touch the Korean boy .. Instantly, the Koreans are grouped and go to a showdown. So it’s not enough. ” She herself currently lives in Kokshetau (Kokchetav), but originally from Kyzyl - the Horde.
                  Something like that..
                  1. T80UM1
                    T80UM1 7 October 2013 11: 48 New
                    0
                    There are simply moments when the court really is on the side of the strong (the case of the kazzinc and other cases, for example, the head of the kazinvest bank ...), but in the case of the flight attendant, there is a blatant case of harassment on the basis of language and from a government official, moreover, the authorities themselves justify this - unacceptable.

                    PS When the courts do not work, and the government does not protect rights and freedoms, citizens decide that they must protect their rights and dignity ...

                    justice in Kazakhstan is not in principle. Lynch Court Principles Prevail

                    that is, lynching ... and all the cases described above by me, stem precisely from the impunity and permissiveness of individuals or individuals of nationalities ...
                2. Zymran
                  Zymran 7 October 2013 12: 13 New
                  +2
                  Quote: T80UM1
                  Comment on the incident when the zamakima kicked the stewardess (Russian) for responding in Kazakh with errors ???


                  Taki he is a former zakakim and. But it seems that Skat’s leadership decided to put the brakes on the case.

                  Quote: T80UM1
                  Then comment on the incident with the family of Chechen Mamakhanovs in the lakeside when, without trial, 4 people were killed in ethnic clashes


                  The rioters were punished and received real prison sentences.

                  Quote: T80UM1
                  And comment on the killing by the oralmans of a law enforcement representative in shanyrak


                  In the same way, they were punished; by the way, the policeman was a Kazakh.
          2. Semurg
            Semurg 5 October 2013 08: 21 New
            +5
            Alibek. I am moving you really collect "pearls of the friends of Kazakhstan" I thought you were joking when you wrote this. Yes, a thorough approach to the matter is felt, probably your job as a teacher leaves its mark. I’m far from this maximum I can pooskospalit and argue with different types of "glamorous", probably also the work of a taxi driver leaves its mark on everything to do in a run-circle there is no systematic approach. but it’s probably good that we are different.
            1. Alibekulu
              Alibekulu 7 October 2013 10: 17 New
              +2
              Hello. I think everything is much more prosaic .. I'm just a bore ... recourse
      2. RA77
        RA77 4 October 2013 17: 47 New
        0
        Quote: Alibekulu
        Tanchik, but here in more detail please ..
        Where, when and how ??!

        Alibek, you are an adult, right? What facts do you expect, evidence? You’ll wait forever. Nobody will ever provide them to you. It’s just that one way or another, conditions are created that people without words understand everything and are forced to leave. In the end, all those who tell stories about how they were forced to move from your country cannot lie! For example, I tend to trust them more than you. I do not particularly follow the news from the KZ, but I didn’t see anything here of Russian Kazakhstanis who would directly say that there are no obvious or hidden processes for squeezing out Russians from the country.
      3. Tan4ik
        Tan4ik 4 October 2013 19: 13 New
        0
        Hope you say. Okay. There are a lot of examples of how our people are evicted from the territories of Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan and so on. Regions Number (people) Share of Kazakhs in Russia% Share of us. region% mountains us. % rural us. % avg. age (years)
        Астраханская область 149 415 23,1 16,3 33,2 66,8 30,1
        Оренбургская область 120 262 18,5 6,0 21,8 78,2 29,2
        Омская область 78 303 12,1 4,1 47,7 52,3 28,5
        Саратовская область 76 007 11,7 3,1 21,35 78,65 30,9
        Волгоградская область 46 223 7,1 1,8 21,08 78,92 29,6
        Chelyabinsk Region 35 297 5,4
        Tyumen region 19 146 2,9 0,6
        Samara Region 15 602 2,4 0,5
        Moscow and Moscow region 12 900 2.0
        Республика Алтай 12 524 1,9 6,2 8,1 91,8 25,7
        Kurgan region 11 939 1,8 1,3
        Novosibirsk Region 10 705 1,6 0,4
        Altai Territory 7979 1,2
        Republic of Kalmykia 4948 0,8
        Sverdlovsk Region 4403 0,7
        Republic of Bashkortostan 4092 0,6
        Rostov Region 3021 0,5
        St. Petersburg 3349 0,4
        Krasnoyarsk Territory 2521 0,4
        Republic of Sakha (Yakutia) 1525 0,2
        Tomsk Region 1215 0,2
        Всего 653962 100,00 0,45 32,5 67,5 30,2



        This is for the year 2010 Kazakhs entered Russia. Between 1990 and 1997, 1,2 million Russians left Kazakhstan, representing almost 14 percent of the population, of which more than 90 percent went to Russia. Copy-paste from Wikipedia. While I haven’t found normal statistics, I’m looking for and will prove to you my point of view.
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 4 October 2013 23: 41 New
          +4
          Quote: Tan4ik
          There are a lot of examples of how our people are evicted from Kazakhstan
          Concrete fact cite ..
          Quote: Tan4ik
          This is for the 2010 year of Kazakhs who have entered Russia
          Why this "stream of consciousness" ???
          Quote: Tan4ik
          During the period from 1990 to 1997, 1,2 million Russians left Kazakhstan
          During the same period, even more Russians left the Russian Federation. Also Kazakhs ?? belay
  • xetai9977
    4 October 2013 13: 27 New
    +2
    Quote: Milafon
    Where the foot of the Turk stepped, the grass does not grow.

    The lifeless landscape of Turkey
    1. MilaPhone
      MilaPhone 4 October 2013 15: 13 New
      0
      Quote: xetai9977
      The lifeless landscape of Turkey

      Красиво.
      Tell me where exactly this is in Turkey and I will see if the original, indigenous population remains there.
      1. Lindon
        Lindon 4 October 2013 15: 19 New
        +2
        And who is the original, indigenous population? Accidentally not Russian?
        What do Russian tourists know about the history of the population of Turkey?
        1. MilaPhone
          MilaPhone 4 October 2013 15: 38 New
          -1
          Quote: Lindon
          And who is the original, indigenous population? Accidentally not Russians? What do Russian tourists know about the history of the population of Turkey?

          I don’t know for tourists, but just Russians know enough. If this is the Mediterranean coast of Turkey, then the indigenous people were Orthodox and one hundred pounds of it, now nifiga does not live there.
          1. ayyildiz
            ayyildiz 4 October 2013 17: 46 New
            +1
            Quote: Milafon
            If this is the Mediterranean coast of Turkey, then the indigenous people were Orthodox and a hundred pounds of it, now nifiga does not live there.

            Orthodoxy when a comrade appeared? Orthodoxy is a people or faith?
            1. MilaPhone
              MilaPhone 4 October 2013 18: 21 New
              0
              Quote: ayyildiz
              Orthodoxy when a comrade appeared? Orthodoxy is a people or faith?

              Ask the Greeks.
              1. ayyildiz
                ayyildiz 4 October 2013 18: 44 New
                +1
                You claim that Orthodoxy is a people and not faith! And I ask you?
                Do you initially ask where the Greeks are in the Slavic states?
                1. MilaPhone
                  MilaPhone 4 October 2013 18: 52 New
                  +2
                  Definitely, this faith is professed by 220 million people. Some of them are Greeks who are the autochromic population of the Mediterranean coast of modern Turkey. Exhaustively?
                  1. ayyildiz
                    ayyildiz 4 October 2013 19: 03 New
                    +3
                    Quote: Milafon
                    Mediterranean coast of modern day Turkey

                    Not only in Turkey but also in Bulgaria, the former Yugoslavia, Crimea, and where are they?
                    1. MilaPhone
                      MilaPhone 4 October 2013 19: 13 New
                      +3
                      They are in the grave.
                      Have a conscience !!!
                      It’s you Turks who survived from them !!!
                      1. ayyildiz
                        ayyildiz 4 October 2013 19: 27 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Milafon
                        They are in the grave.
                        Have a conscience !!!
                        It's you Turks who survived from there


                        Teach history comrade, the Slavs arrived in the Balkans earlier than the Turks!

                        Yes, we are bad Turks, but why then 300.000 Armenians 100.000 illegal immigrants from them live in Turkey? And how many Turks live in Armenia?
                      2. MilaPhone
                        MilaPhone 4 October 2013 20: 06 New
                        +2
                        Quote: ayyildiz
                        Yes, we are bad Turks, but why then 300.000 Armenians 100.000 illegal immigrants from them live in Turkey? And how many Turks live in Armenia?

                        Where are the others? Armenians, Greeks, Assyrians?
                        And how do I know why they live there, what do you think is the House Book.
                        Why do you live in Russia? Are you promoting Turan?
                      3. ayyildiz
                        ayyildiz 4 October 2013 20: 17 New
                        +2
                        Everything is written above! Citizens eat from all peoples in Turkey! And in Armenia?
                        Where are the Turks who used to live there?

                        Why do you live in Russia?

                        None of your business !

                        Are you promoting Turan?

                        I am more for economic ties, including with Russia!

                        But on mutually beneficial terms!
      2. Lindon
        Lindon 4 October 2013 19: 34 New
        0
        The Greeks conquered and came to Asia Minor since the time of Troy, Macedonian, etc. Read Herodotus. Campaigns against the Persians - Macedonian in Asia Minor.
        1. MilaPhone
          MilaPhone 4 October 2013 20: 19 New
          0
          Quote: Lindon
          The Greeks conquered and came to Asia Minor since the time of Troy, Macedonian, etc. Read Herodotus. Campaigns against the Persians - Macedonian in Asia Minor.

          Will you try to convince me now that the Greeks in this region are bloody conquerors and the Turks came as liberators?
          1. Apollo
            Apollo 4 October 2013 20: 23 New
            +6
            Quote: ayyildiz
            Everything is written above! Citizens eat from all peoples in Turkey! And in Armenia?
            Where are the Turks who used to live there?

            Quote: Lindon
            The Greeks conquered and came to Asia Minor since the time of Troy, Macedonian, etc. Read Herodotus

            Quote: Milafon
            You’ll try to convince me now that the Greeks in this region are bloody conquerors,


            I remind the topic The defense ministers of Kazakhstan and Turkey discussed military and military-technical cooperation. not the history of the above ethnic groups.
            1. MilaPhone
              MilaPhone 4 October 2013 20: 35 New
              +1
              Thank you for reminding me. And then I wrote about the grass and everything suddenly changed all around, malfunctioning. Someone fell on the shuganki Armenians remembered.
              And most importantly, I wanted to say that:
              Kazakhs do not believe the Turks.
              Russians always carried Kazakhs only civilization, intelligence. They didn’t harm, but helped to recreate the national and most importantly state self-awareness
              1. Essenger
                Essenger 4 October 2013 21: 18 New
                +4
                Quote: Milafon
                Kazakhs do not believe the Turks.


                Turks are our brothers, when, how and in what way we will communicate, cooperate, etc. we will decide exactly without your prompting.
    2. ed65b
      ed65b 5 October 2013 01: 08 New
      0
      Quote: Lindon
      And who is the original, indigenous population? Accidentally not Russian?
      What do Russian tourists know about the history of the population of Turkey?

      But the Kazakhs know everything. Are you not playing Santa Barbara there ???
  • Dmitriy85
    Dmitriy85 4 October 2013 15: 16 New
    +8
    They must buy howitzers from them T-155 Firtina. And ours is completely out of date.
    1. ayyildiz
      ayyildiz 4 October 2013 17: 32 New
      +4
      Quote: Dmitriy85
      They have to buy howitzers from the T-155 Firtina.

      My opinion is to jointly produce!
      1. Dmitriy85
        Dmitriy85 4 October 2013 22: 08 New
        +5
        Interestingly, does the Korean side need permission for the joint production of Firtina howitzers? The howitzer seems to be Korean, but Turkey produces under license.
        1. Zymran
          Zymran 4 October 2013 22: 16 New
          +8
          I need it, I think. In general, the Turks have close cooperation with the Koreans on the military side. Tanchik "Altai" is also based on Korean developments created.
        2. ayyildiz
          ayyildiz 4 October 2013 22: 24 New
          +4
          Quote: Dmitriy85
          Interestingly, does the Korean side need permission for the joint production of Firtina howitzers?

          No, it’s not necessary! Korean is taken as a basis, but not its pure copy!
          1. xetai9977
            5 October 2013 14: 04 New
            +3
            Ours bought 36 Fyrtyn self-propelled guns, and no Korean permits were needed!
            1. Zymran
              Zymran 5 October 2013 14: 29 New
              +5
              It's not about purchasing, but about joint production.
  • Kazbek
    Kazbek 4 October 2013 18: 34 New
    +9
    Kazakhstan is not obliged to ask anyone to cooperate with anyone.
    1. alone
      alone 4 October 2013 19: 51 New
      +7
      I support. countries should cooperate with mutual benefit, taking into account mutual interests. while some look at others from high, such cooperation does not last for a long time !!
  • Semurg
    Semurg 4 October 2013 23: 01 New
    11
    I read. On the topic of two views, one you are traitors - the other is fine. My understanding of this problem is to Kazakhstan to pull any production in the military or in the civilian sphere, if anyone doesn’t like it outside of our borders this is their problem. The second topic raised by the TS here is someone against someone and both sides have pretty good arguments and arguments. My opinion is to live in the TS 3-4 years and then knock out the debit loan to think what to do next, but for now all the movements on EEP, etc., to suspend. The third topic of persecution of Russians who think that they are being abused left or sitting on their suitcases, who think that this is not being adapted to the new reality of independent Kazakhstan. My attitude to this is ambivalent on the one hand, I feel sorry for people leaving to change their way of life, with another I understand that this is better both for them and for those who remain. The fourth topic is that Andrei KZ and Essenger are not who they say they are, here the "conspiracy theory" blossoms and smells. laughing My understanding is why a person should take a steam bath sitting on the site and impersonating another, for what? or believe that this site has an influence on the adoption of any decisions?
    1. RA77
      RA77 5 October 2013 11: 22 New
      +1
      Quote: Semurg
      The fourth theme is that Andrei KZ and Essenger are not who they say they are, here the "conspiracy theory" blossoms and smells. My understanding is why a person should take a steam bath sitting on the site and impersonating another, for what? or believe that this site has an influence on the adoption of any decisions?

      This site 100% affects the attitude of Kazakhs to Russians and vice versa. And not only those who are registered, but also those who simply read individual articles and most importantly comments to them. Almost all Kazakh users registered here came to the opinion that the vehicle is buzzing, and the Russians are almost brothers! However, over time, in both cases, the opinion has changed almost polar. Not at all, but at most, as I can judge.
      Regarding the "conspiracy theory," you have gone too far. On many Internet resources, among other things, users specifically create additional users to the main users, for various purposes. This can be said already a common thing. Either they are designed to add the necessary comments / articles, or, as in this case, purely to create the desired view of others by definition. topic. Take a look, all Kazakh users, without exception, say that everything is fine in Kazakhstan, everything is fine. There is no harassment of anyone. Some Russian users from Kazakhstan (and these are clearly real Russians, not virtuals), however, write that there are still some kind of oppression or hidden squeezing them out of the country. At the same time, there are practically no Russian users from Kazakhstan who would support the Kazakhs. Therefore, it would be in the interests of the latter to have at least one such. Andryukha has a nickname like "Yes, I'm Russian from Kazakhstan." Here. But these are only assumptions, of course. There are no evidence yet. Lazy to look))
      1. Andrey KZ
        Andrey KZ 5 October 2013 15: 21 New
        +4
        Quote: RA77
        RA77
        Hello, although you don’t believe me, I’ll try to answer. Can you give examples where Kazakhs insult ALL THE RUSSIAN PEOPLE? Yes, they put individual "comrades" in their place, but at the same time, they repeat once again that they respect the Russian people , have Russian friends and relatives. At the same time, you yourself were present in that discussion where one “Russian” (the language doesn’t dare to call him Russian) suggested that we have no one to choose the president from, we, all 17 millions of sheep are here. Agree that this statement provoked a fair response. I have the reaction of Kazakhstanis, including mine. Regarding civil servants, the Slavs in the civil service also have about the same ratio as among the common population, that is, if we have about 10% in the south of the Slavs, then in the civil service where it’s the same, maybe a little less, you see, it would be strange if it were the other way round. In general, I don’t understand this desire for a civil service. The salary of an average civil servant at the level of a skilled, say, excavator, is about 100-150 thousand tenge, which is to be torn ? Cut the budget? So for this now they are planting bundles (when all ayut?). Regarding the Russian language, we have 6 radio stations in Chimkent, of which only 2 are Kazakh-speaking. Well, Kazakh, in my opinion, we need to know, we live in Kazakhstan. As for the persecution, they were not unique. So why have many Russians left Kazakhstan? Let's look at Chimkent of the 90's, be they not okay. Enterprises got up, EVERYTHING! At best, they get some kind of unnecessary salary. There is no electricity for weeks! And this is a regional center! I thought worse it cannot be, no matter how wrong, they turn off the gas to everyone, schools, hospitals, the whole city. Overnight, the apartments turned into cold and dark concrete boxes, people in the apartments put potbelly stoves, cooked in the courtyards at the stake. Chimkent is located in the valley, and from which side do not enter, there is a point from where the whole city is in full view. I rode moonless at night in Chimkent, I ascend to this point, and before me instead of a sea of ​​light, boundless darkness and a veil of smoke from fires and bourgeois reveals illuminated by a deathly pale starlight above a seemingly dead city. This was perhaps the only case when the stars did not tuned my soul in a philosophical or romantic way, and they sounded the alarm in it. To admit, I had no faith that Kazakhstan would get out of this hole. There was hope, but there was no Faith. Here in these troubled, hopeless times the Russians went from Kazakhstan, hoping for a better life. You may not believe me, Your right, you are a doubting person, and therefore a thinking person. Here is food for thought for you.
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 5 October 2013 16: 30 New
          +5
          Quote: Andrew KZ
          Here is food for thought
          Hi Andrey hi (Sorry for the familiarity ... yes
          Not so RA77 and wrong. Kazakhs Andrei have long perceived as their .. yes At the same time, both Kazakhs and Russians are categorically against assimilation. We are for the fact that the Kazakh would remain Kazakh, and Russian Russian. But at the same time there should be elementary mutual respect ..
          I will express my opinion. Kazakhs in the issue of "genocide", "oppression" are more objective than Russians, as in Russia and Kazakhstan.
          Since Kazakhs are usually bilingual, they can consider problematic issues in Kazakhstan (and Russia) from different angles. Those. I, as a person who knows the Russian language, considers himself in his self-identification as a Soviet person.
          Even after many years, until now we are Kazakhs in the civilizational, cultural, educational and mental field of the former Union.
          On the other hand, we Kazakhs, brought up and raised in our own, rather peculiar environment, can consider, for example, the processes of the decline of the Russian population from our point of view, which is fundamentally different from the "canonical" version ("expelled", "expelled", "took away children's toys "...)
          Add to this, we do not have a restrained (flawed) imperial consciousness that blinds our eyes, as it would seem adequate to the Russians.
          All of the above gives the Kazakhs a more complete, holistic and objective picture of what is happening in Kazakhstan ..
          P.S. And Andrey, by virtue of the fact that he can look from the position of a simple Kazakh
          he can understand and accept the Kazakh point of view (-u-u-u- "renegade" am ..)
          1. Andrey KZ
            Andrey KZ 6 October 2013 08: 36 New
            +2
            Quote: Alibekulu
            Hi, Andrey (Sorry for the familiarity ...

            Hi! Everything is fine, it’s easier for me.
        2. RA77
          RA77 5 October 2013 19: 23 New
          +1
          I will answer everything
        3. RA77
          RA77 5 October 2013 21: 51 New
          +1
          Andrey KZ,
          No, I will disappoint. Today is such a great day and I do not want to plunge into all these nats again. Topics. We will assume that I could not answer you. (especially regarding prooflink on Kazakh statements about Russians)
          No wonder you wrote all this. I read everything. Maybe I’ll answer later if we cross somewhere in the discussion, but not today. I apologize.
          1. Andrey KZ
            Andrey KZ 6 October 2013 08: 31 New
            +2
            No problem hi It was nice to talk.
  • Zymran
    Zymran 6 October 2013 15: 21 New
    +4
    By the way, be that as it may, and Kazakhstan will soon enter the WTO.