Military Review

Search works of the remains of Soviet soldiers in the area of ​​Myasnoy Bor

64
The other day, together with the employees of the Avtodor company, I went on a short trip to Novgorod land to look at how mine clearance work was carried out, as well as search and burial of the remains of soldiers who died during World War II, but not yet committed to earth. .


These places are associated with one of the most dramatic moments of the Great Patriotic War - the entourage of the 2 shock army and the attempt of the Soviet troops to get out of the deadly "bag" with a small neck at the Meat Bohr.

The tragic events began on January 7, 1942, when the Volkhov Front launched an offensive on the 150-kilometer lane. The Soviet forces were faced with a global task - the lifting of the blockade of Leningrad, the liberation of Novgorod and the destruction of all German troops east of Leningrad.

Thanks support aviation and artillery only managed to break through the German defenses of the 2nd shock army in the area of ​​Myasniy Bor on a narrow front line. The breakthrough is a narrow corridor, which by February 1942, at the cost of bloody battles, expanded to 12 kilometers. The army deepened 40 kilometers into the seized territory, forming a "bag". Further, the offensive stopped and it was not possible to expand it. Army formations went on the defensive. Lack of food and ammunition began to be felt ...

In the area of ​​the main losses of the 2 shock army, the construction of the seventh section of the Moscow-St. Petersburg expressway is planned, and the route will pass right through the epicenter of the fighting. In order to prevent the road from passing through the bones of the fallen, from 1 May 2013, work began on a thorough search for the ammunition left in the ground and the remains of the servicemen with their subsequent reburial. This is despite the fact that search expeditions (“Memory Watches”) in these parts have been going on since 1988.



1. German troops launched an offensive on March 15, and two days later the defense of the Soviet troops was broken. The ring of encirclement closed. But the bloody battles for the corridor did not stop - the Soviet fighters broke through the corridor width from 300 to 800 meters, but all attempts to keep him eventually failed. 31 May 1942, the "bag" was completely closed by a barrier of one and a half kilometers. The boiler turned out to be according to various estimates from 40 to 157 thousands of people. The inadequate supply of the army by land was completely stopped, and due to the lack of information, cargoes dropped from aircraft weapons and food often got to the Germans.

Because of the terrible famine, the soldiers ate not only the dead horses, but also the belts from the teams. At the height of human growth from all the trees were eaten bark. Cases of cannibalism were also recorded.

... the whole corridor was littered with corpses in several layers. Soviet Tanks they walked right along them and the caterpillars stuck in a continuous mess of human bodies. The bloody pieces were driven into the tracks, the cars skidded and the tankers cleared the tracks with pre-prepared iron hooks ...

The surviving fighters from the endless bodies of their dead comrades made a parapet to at least somehow hide in the sweep of territory. On the morning of June 25, 1942, the corridor was finally closed. After that, no one left the encirclement of Meat Bor.



2. At the beginning of 2013, Avtodor, the customer for the construction of a new road, held an open competition for the right to carry out exploration work in this area. The work is carried out by ITC Special Works together with the Novgorod search expedition Dolina.

The longest and most difficult is to search the area in search of mounted soldiers, mass graves, and especially sanitary burial grounds. Mounted soldiers lie shallow underground, see 10-15.



3. Sanitary burials were usually made in shell craters. There they dragged the dead and fell asleep.



4.



5. For the 2013 season of the year, 1273 explosive items were found on the territory of the future route and 254 soldiers were raised, including one German. So far, this is a stretch of 28 kilometers and 150 meters in width, where the future route will pass. Currently, work is underway to survey nearby territories.



6.



7. After the excavation of the mass grave, the number of bodies is determined by pairs of tibial bones, since they are best preserved in the ground.



8.



9. The excavation site of the mounted soldier. As it turned out later - the officer. The photo on the right shows a rifle, pieces of binoculars, fragments of the skull beneath it, below the boots in a backpack and a gas mask hose.



10. Star on a cap.



11. Cartridges are broken fingers.



12. Rifle.



13. You can often find preserved coins. These are 5 kopecks of 1930 of the year and 20 kopecks of 38 of the year.



14. Much less often come across medallions of fighters. Cases are especially rare when a soldier’s note is kept in medallions by which you can identify. For the 2013 year, only 254 fighters were identified from the 12 bodies found.



15. A few more things from the “Dolina” search expedition found.



16. Nurse tools.



17. German propaganda leaflets.



18.



19. In the village of Myasnoy Bor built a memorial and a chapel in memory of Soviet soldiers who died in the war.



20. Since 1988, more than 31 200 soldiers have been buried in the cemetery.



21.



22. But such transport is used here in the spring, when there is a lot of water in the forest.





Search work in Myasny Bor is the first large-scale project of this kind to be implemented during the preparation of the territories set aside for the construction of new roads.
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  1. Black
    Black 28 September 2013 09: 11
    21
    Igor Rasteryaev.
    George Ribbon.


    .....
    I drive through ominous places
    Where man is the main wealth of the bowels
    Where else from the war
    Soldiers lie three by one square meter
    There are steps everywhere, there are voices
    Wonderful lights in the swamps
    Shadows at night sing to you
    As if asking and wanting something:

    "Dig me out, brother, I'm Vershinin Sanya
    Fifth mortar regiment, I myself am from Ryazan
    You’ve seen a lot in movies about soldiers
    Right now, listen to mine, eh, it will be more interesting ”

    And they will start broadcasting
    In the language of groans
    Do you want to run away, but ahead
    They flicker between the trees again

    "Dig me up soon, I beg you again
    I am Sergey Morshannikov, a native of Pskov
    Give my address to my native side
    Eighteenth square, black funnel "

    And in the morning everything will roar, fly somewhere
    And trample on a machine gun in a bayonet with a mat
    And the trees are all upside down: roots grow up
    In this glorious battle crime scene.
    --------------------

    A wonderful corner, not a forest, but a fairy tale
    I stepped on a tubercle, looking, and this is a helmet
    I dug a little - and here's it: a bowler and a spoon
    And over this, everything is necessary - cloudberry berry
    Over the earth, the month of May is young and beautiful
    The train pulls up to the Apraksin station
    In the sky a caravan of geese, summer will be soon
    The girl in her braid straightens the tape ....
    1. Mitek
      Mitek 28 September 2013 09: 16
      13
      Thanks to these guys. And our ancestors have eternal memory. And our children must know and remember!
      1. gsg955
        gsg955 28 September 2013 10: 04
        12
        Very important and worthy work. All soldiers should be
        buried.
        1. APASUS
          APASUS 28 September 2013 14: 30
          +7
          Quote: gsg955
          Very important and worthy work. All soldiers must be buried.

          This work should be financed and managed by the Ministry of Defense through regional military registration and enlistment offices. But it often turns out that this is a personal initiative and the burial has not been carried out for years. The state self-removed itself at the time from the burial of its fallen soldiers, although it had no right!
          After all, this is our history, our memory and our future if you want ......... how to admonish young people if they see that our dead soldiers are not buried until now ?!
          1. GSE-PILIGRIM
            GSE-PILIGRIM 29 September 2013 14: 30
            0
            military registration and enlistment office in the subject of the rf alone in the regions departments manage yes finance no
            1. Serg 122
              Serg 122 29 September 2013 18: 29
              +2
              The military commissars will spend the sovereign's money on such nonsense ?! Yes, not in life! They will safely "master" them and nothing more
  2. Jarik56
    Jarik56 28 September 2013 09: 16
    +5
    Yes, it’s sad, but the Germans were better off with the burial, and with the preservation of the soldiers. Eternal memory to the fallen defenders of the Fatherland!
    1. smile
      smile 28 September 2013 13: 50
      +8
      Jarik56
      Regarding the preservation of soldiers, at the end of the war they had the same with it, as we did at the beginning. By the way, I read the SS man’s memoirs acting there. Ours also gave them heat, even there. According to him, by the end of the operation, about thirty people remained in his battalion. Saved. Oddly enough, the memoirist had a very high opinion of our soldiers.
      Please author, well, do not talk about that. what is unknown how much was surrounded there. Why increase the estimated number to 157 thousand? The entire personnel of the 2th Shock Army at the beginning of the operation was about 70 thousand. And it was precisely 40 thousand that got into the environment. All this has long been established and is known to everyone who wants to know about it.
      1. CTEPX
        CTEPX 28 September 2013 16: 36
        +2
        I was unpleasantly struck in the article by this insert
        ... the entire corridor was littered with corpses in several layers. Soviet tanks went right along them and the caterpillars stuck in a continuous mash of human bodies. Bloody pieces scored trucks, cars skidded and tankers cleaned the tracks with prefabricated iron hooks ...
        Of our Krasnoyarsk boys, who are preparing to serve in the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation in military sports clubs, they got into the region’s funded search engine projects - heels in 20 years.
        Talking with the heads of search engines in Kaliningrad "on occasion", without introducing himself, I was convinced of one ideological one - twenty "treasure hunters" plus heels of "advanced" ones working for foreigners.
        This is all because these guys from military sports clubs, so far none of those in power, are needed. It seems to everyone that this is an unnecessary initiative.
        1. smile
          smile 28 September 2013 18: 36
          +1
          CTEPX
          Unfortunately, the third generation of treasure hunters is already appearing in Kaliningrad, this is like an infection. We have almost no mass unidentified burials of Soviet soldiers. There are no remains of Soviet soldiers abandoned anywhere. But there are heaps of Germans, a lot of all sorts of values ​​buried by the Germans. Therefore, our search engines are infected with treasure hunting. Of course, the state should finance and organize them. But who to look for, Germans? There is practically no one else. But should the state finance the search for the Germans? By the way, one German token is a couple of thousand euros, if you sell to Germany ... this is our trouble ...
          And about the youth, well, my friend, who joined the Communist Party of the Russian Federation, tried to take up the upbringing of children from the Communist Party. We all helped, attracted schools, and we recruited the children, and we would organize the premises and there was an agreement on help from the school in Borisov-communists, all they had to do was say YES-where are they, they are very busy, they are not interested in youth policy, some delusion little things for the sake of form, for the report to the superiors, and that's it ... I had to send the children to the "Junior", created by the bad authorities and, at the very least, somehow coped with it. And to help him. Like this. No, we don’t care, if only the children received the correct upbringing, but I start to feel sick when I hear the cries of the communists that the government doesn’t take care of children ... but they themselves? And this despite the fact that I still consider the communists to be the only sane opposition and a possible alternative to Putin ... if Zyuga is removed ...
          1. CTEPX
            CTEPX 28 September 2013 18: 53
            +4
            Quote: smile
            My comrade, who joined the Communist Party of the Russian Federation, tried to start raising children from the Communist Party of the Russian Federation.

            And you can’t bring up children from the party)).
            What is the root difference between Stalin and Hitler?))
            Hitler had a "Hitler Youth" - a paramilitary formation. Stalin's pioneers and the Komsomol did not replace OSOAVIAKHIM)). Although, of course. he failed to CONTROL it. And it cost us in the inevitable war ... something.
            And there is NO other way for the military (Russian) empire, except to raise their children in a military-patriotic spirit)).
            And it is worth fighting for the LAW to educate the children of the Russian Empire in a military-patriotic spirit.
            The rest, compared with THIS - such a whim)).
            1. smile
              smile 28 September 2013 21: 35
              +1
              CTEPX
              Well, of course, you can’t. the guy just wanted the communists to participate in the upbringing of the younger generation precisely in a patriotic spirit, this is called youth policy ... :))) It turned out they did not need youth policy ...: (((
              I agree completely with the rest. Everyone would think so .... Sometimes I make my modest contribution. :)))
              1. dima_talib
                dima_talib 29 September 2013 01: 16
                +6
                Unfortunately, it’s bitter but true. I myself am a member of the Communist Party of Ukraine (Communist Party of Ukraine). I proposed something similar to my party members and leadership ...
                NOBODY needs it. Waving flags is a "mogem". And so, the pocket game "Simonenin". There are practically no young people in the CPU (as opposed to Svoboda).
                Sorry, a little off topic.
                Sick ...
                1. smile
                  smile 29 September 2013 13: 40
                  +1
                  dima_talib
                  So well, some tea will not be strangers ... everything is in the subject ... it’s a pity that it’s so sad ...
        2. smile
          smile 28 September 2013 21: 38
          0
          CTEPX
          Damn, I'm sorry, I think you minus a jerk ... I accidentally and will no longer ... :)))
        3. crazy_fencer
          crazy_fencer 29 September 2013 11: 58
          +3
          [quote = CTEPX] This insert has unpleasantly struck me in the article
          ... the entire corridor was littered with corpses in several layers. Soviet tanks went right along them and the caterpillars stuck in a continuous mash of human bodies. Bloody pieces scored trucks, cars skidded and tankers cleaned the tracks with prefabricated iron hooks ...

          And so it was, alas. When the first enthusiasts began to work in the area of ​​Myasny Bor, they discovered that in many places, especially in the area of ​​the Erica glade, the corpses lay in 6 (!!!) or even more layers. By the way, there is a slight inaccuracy in the article.

          "7. After the excavation of a mass burial, the number of bodies is determined by the pairs of tibia, since they are best preserved in the ground."

          It is determined not by the tibia, but by the femur. They really last longer, yet the largest bone in the body.
        4. Motors1991
          Motors1991 29 September 2013 18: 54
          -1
          Corpses in several rows, this is complete nonsense. There had to be the whole Soviet Union and it wasn’t enough yet. Of course it’s a disaster, but compared to Vyazma, Bialystok, Kiev, these are seeds, cynical of course, but those people did their duty and I owed them bow down
        5. UrraletZ
          UrraletZ 30 September 2013 08: 43
          -3
          The author of the article is a liberoid woodpecker. A wonderful theme with a "Jewish-Bolshevik" white-tape-liberal overtones. Better read the books by Alexei Ivakin "Desantura-1942" and "Blockade" there it is much more accessible and more reliable written without Goebbels' nonsense about the "bloody Stalinist regime".
    2. rodevaan
      rodevaan 30 September 2013 08: 29
      +1
      Quote: Jarik56
      Yes, it’s sad, but the Germans were better off with the burial, and with the preservation of the soldiers. Eternal memory to the fallen defenders of the Fatherland!


      - It’s all so, except that I personally don’t know German resources similar to our OBD and feat .... Well, plus that they didn’t take into account the losses of 45 years and how many tanks were ground by the Fritz in the 45th to speak only with a great deal of conventionality ... How many were the Wehrmacht, Volkssturm and other ragged men who were already in droves drove together to plug endless holes and breakthroughs of the Eastern Front.
      1. Stas57
        Stas57 30 September 2013 09: 13
        +1
        Everything is so, except that I personally do not know German resources similar to our HBS and feat ....

        the German "feat of the people" is certainly cool, but according to RK there is a site, as well as an analogue of the OBD-Volksbund
        1. rodevaan
          rodevaan 1 October 2013 06: 28
          0
          Quote: Stas57
          Everything is so, except that I personally do not know German resources similar to our HBS and feat ....

          the German "feat of the people" is certainly cool, but according to RK there is a site, as well as an analogue of the OBD-Volksbund


          - And how informative is the resource there? Something I could not go in there ...
          1. Stas57
            Stas57 1 October 2013 09: 51
            0
            - And how informative is the resource there?

            no less than 60% loss, more precisely, I won’t say, but there are facts of the absence of a full name, such is the specifics of the Volksbund.
  3. builder
    builder 28 September 2013 09: 25
    +7
    In 1996-1997, being a cadet, he took part in demining and search operations in those places. "Dolina" and schoolchildren from Krasnoyarsk also worked there.
  4. lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 28 September 2013 09: 46
    +7
    We have a small city, but also have their own search squad. By the way, now they are just on watch in the area of ​​Myasniy Bor.Borovichi search group "Star"
    1. CTEPX
      CTEPX 28 September 2013 16: 46
      +1
      Go to the squad’s website and see if it’s abandoned. After Baburin.
      And if possible, without righteous anger)). Help is better. Detachment.
  5. Sergey Medvedev
    Sergey Medvedev 28 September 2013 09: 51
    19
    Glory to the heroes! For some reason, there are no articles on this site to which our ancestors brought their enemies. How the Germans ate each other in the Stalingrad cauldron, and fortifications were stacked from frozen corpses. Like captured Italians made pizza from their comrades even in the NKVD camps, and the inhuman Stalinist wardens soaked these nonhumans on the spot as soon as they forced them into cannibalism. Historians tell us about the horrors of war on our side of the front line, and are silent about the horrors of war on that side of the front. As if they were not there. The picture is incomplete. These white spots should be removed.
    1. Letterksi
      Letterksi 28 September 2013 10: 21
      -7
      They intimidate with the horrors of war, so that they sit quietly and are afraid, afraid ... Like "You, of course, heroes, but ... you need to make sure that you can never fight again because of fear." Those who lie there, if they were alive, would probably spit contemptuously towards such hacks
      1. Stas57
        Stas57 28 September 2013 11: 33
        +6
        What a wondrous delirium, who is bullying? My grandfather ? My mother, my grandmother, who survived the hunger and horrors of the occupation, in whose arms three younger sisters and brothers died? Cohabited villages, murdered children, who intimidates, Dear? Who are the blockades? Belarusian villagers? Sailors Pacific, of whom 20 thousand lies with us Krivtsovo?
      2. lewerlin53rus
        lewerlin53rus 28 September 2013 11: 35
        +4
        Quote: LetterKsi
        Those who lay there, if they were alive, would probably spit contemptuously towards such scribblers

        I don’t think that those who lay there longed to fight. Even the Germans. To want to fight and be prepared to defend your homeland are two different things.
      3. novobranets
        novobranets 28 September 2013 16: 45
        +1
        They intimidate the horrors of war so that they quietly sit and fear, fear ..
        It seems to me, or are you misunderstood? Please express yourself more closely.
        1. Letterksi
          Letterksi 28 September 2013 18: 27
          +3
          Yes, perhaps they misunderstand. Probably not correctly expressed. Our people no longer imagine other ways of describing events, except about meat on tank tracks and cannibalism. Such a "genre" is intended to intimidate us and generate powerlessness in front of the enemy invasion and suppress the will to resist. So that everyone represents the war through the prism of fear. So that a person does not have the desire to pile on the enemy for the very least, but there is a desire to escape and hide
  6. mithridate
    mithridate 28 September 2013 10: 00
    +5
    well done guys! Engaged in a noble cause
  7. Lynx
    Lynx 28 September 2013 10: 13
    +7
    I read something about this search organization "Dolina" - and that the prosecutor's office was interested in them, opened a case, and that they were digging completely in the wrong place, and there were questions about the accuracy of the work. One friend of mine was from there, and therefore became interested. Mines and shells left unexploded items in the forest.
    And so, of course, this is a good and noble cause, but if there is no selfish motive in it. Either it was written about them like that, or something else, but I began to doubt ..
    1. lewerlin53rus
      lewerlin53rus 28 September 2013 14: 29
      +2
      The fact is that all kinds of black diggers often attach themselves to such organizations
      1. CTEPX
        CTEPX 28 September 2013 16: 51
        +2
        Quote: lewerlin53rus
        all sorts of black diggers often attach themselves to such organizations

        More often the opposite)). All places are occupied by "black diggers")).
      2. novobranets
        novobranets 28 September 2013 17: 27
        +2
        Black diggers, it really is black. Having found a "fishing spot" they dig like bulldozers, scattering bones, some documents, personal photos and letters, and even medallions, which, in their opinion, are of no value. Robbers of the dead, marauders, that's who they are.
  8. creak
    creak 28 September 2013 10: 50
    +5
    What questions can the guys ask? You can only say thank you to them. The state, in fact, has withdrawn from this work ... Apparently our statesmen have forgotten the words of A.V. Suvorov: "The war is not over until the last soldier is buried" ... And the unexploded ordnance should be dealt with by sappers, who could have been allocated to help the search engines Ministry of Defense or Ministry of Emergencies.
    1. Day 11
      Day 11 28 September 2013 11: 04
      +7
      There may be BIG questions for the guys! I myself went (and I go if possible) to a cop. Why do you think for yourself. A REPRESENTATIVE is always with us and we don’t deal with them. -nit RGD-33 at the parking lot (bonfire) to dig up (I myself met with such a thing). And the memory of grandfathers needs to be respected! On that and our side were primarily people! Everyone had relatives
      1. creak
        creak 28 September 2013 11: 06
        +3
        So the state should not let this thing go by its own accord and confine itself to on-duty speeches from high tribunes ...
      2. Stas57
        Stas57 28 September 2013 11: 41
        +2
        We always have a policeman, an employee of the FSB and a machine of the Ministry of Emergencies, all GPs are just under the act and are immediately destroyed.
        But ...
        There were unpleasant moments - farmers go in bayonets when they see a cop
        1. Lynx
          Lynx 28 September 2013 15: 25
          0
          So you explain that you raise the fighters .. Or do they not like this either ?!
          1. Eugene
            Eugene 29 September 2013 11: 23
            +2
            Yes, farmers coughing on these explanations. The main thing is that their fields are even. Not everyone pits even after themselves. Well, greed. They found a type on my field, but they didn’t share it. Although I saw the opposite stories. .
          2. Stas57
            Stas57 29 September 2013 12: 42
            +1

            Lynx
            So you explain that you raise the fighters .. Or do they not like this either ?!

            they, as correctly noted do not care, or rather
            They can also be understood, just planted, there is a crowd with 10 people digging pits, digging holes, sometimes undermining on the spot.
            So far there have been no cases of an outright war, but I think shooting is not far off.

            crazy_fencer
            When I last visited those places (in the sense of Myasnaya Bor, Spasskaya Polist), no farmers smelled of it. True, that was five years ago. Really appeared?

            no, this is another area - Kursk
        2. crazy_fencer
          crazy_fencer 29 September 2013 12: 07
          0
          When I last visited those places (in the sense, Myasnoy Bor, Spasskaya Polist), there was no smell of farmers there. True, that was about five years ago. Really appeared? It was then that there, apart from roadside drunks, and "shoulder" one could rarely be found.
  9. Gur
    Gur 28 September 2013 11: 24
    +2
    Yes, the eternal memory of the soldiers, and our task is to instill in the children respect and awareness of the heroic deed of WWII soldiers.
  10. omsbon
    omsbon 28 September 2013 11: 26
    +2
    A terrible place - Myasnaya Bor!
    Every year new graves are added. Thanks to the search engines, they are doing the necessary and important thing!
  11. Ulysses
    Ulysses 28 September 2013 13: 08
    +3
    Eternal memory to the heroes.
    Fallen and Gum.
    To everyone who went through this hell.
  12. Landwarrior
    Landwarrior 28 September 2013 13: 47
    +1
    Right now, at least "screenings" can be put on MDs ... And those who started with probes generally walked, and when the first "minniks" appeared, it was generally like a song, although they took whatever they wanted. I was once in those parts on the watch of memory ...
  13. Lynx
    Lynx 28 September 2013 15: 31
    +3
    It is simply impossible to understand and realize how many people died in the Second World War ...

    Guys, why weren’t the fighters raised in Soviet times? Why did they need so much time to lie down so that they could begin to be searched and reburied? And only I hear about individuals and organizations that are engaged in the search .. Where is the state?
    The state, by the way, tightened the law on search ...
    1. Stas57
      Stas57 29 September 2013 12: 51
      +2
      Quote: Lynx
      Guys, why weren’t the fighters raised in Soviet times? Why did they need so much time to lie down so that they could begin to be searched and reburied? And only I hear about individuals and organizations that are engaged in the search .. Where is the state?
      The state, by the way, tightened the law on search ...

      I'll tell you.
      In Brezhnev's times, in my opinion, it was necessary not to put concrete steles, or 50-meter bayonets, not to remove the lake area, but to dig, dig until it turns blue, let it be classified, but let everything lie in the graves, and not in the fields, since the state could and the MO is useful to attract, but who needed it, they poked the same "Alesh" in the villages according to the order, for the next anniversary, and under them no one. There were such cases, and then the villages changed the plates, with each other.
      As a result, they raise the fighter in flight, and he seems to be lying in the village in the "brotherhood". And also not an isolated case, or they raise him, but he is from a neighboring village (at 43, as he was released, a short check and for replenishment), so he is neither in TsAMO, nor in the Book of Memory, anywhere, only a bowler hat signed from a person remained.
      that's why I don't like all these "symbols of our common victory", all these movies about unreal events, myths about the war, though it lies there in the fields, and more than one generation will dig
      1. Eugene
        Eugene 29 September 2013 21: 46
        0
        Come on!
        They were digging normally during the Soviet era. Memories of memory. Someone doesn’t know, let’s keep quiet. It’s simply unmeasured! I remember how we were fed in collective farm canteens, how they were provided with transport. There is nothing to murmur about the Union! He did his job!
        1. Stas57
          Stas57 30 September 2013 09: 31
          +1
          Come on!
          They were digging normally in Soviet times. Memories of memory. Someone doesn’t know, let’s keep quiet. It’s just unmeasured! I remember how we were fed in collective farm canteens, as they were provided with transport.


          ololo.
          If they were digging normally, now there would be nothing to dig.
          45 to 85years 40 !! years, participants, witnesses are alive, a huge mechanism of the state has been working, during this time no more than 50 people have been dug in our area, and then, by and large, they accidentally hooked a tractor or dug a trench.
          All the masters of the search movement I know began at the turn of the 80-90 with zero, in general, before them no one had ever done this, so seriously, with us along the Kursk Bulge.

          There is nothing to purr about the Union! He did his job!

          what did he do? poked concrete monuments, with empty graves and type all is well? What the union could do and what it did is a huge difference.
          Therefore, both then and now, enthusiasts rather than the state are engaged in really large-scale search.
  14. novobranets
    novobranets 28 September 2013 16: 38
    +5
    Quote: Lynx
    Where is the state?

    What is the state now? A handful of people are preoccupied with their well-being, they do not give a damn about the dead and the living, only people like from the film who have not sold their conscience, enthusiasts who at their own expense (almost always) do a good deed, worthily burying the remains of our ancestors who died fulfilling their debt. Myasnaya Bor is only one episode, and how many more fields and forests are seeded with the bones of soldiers. Near Voronezh, consider in the center of the country, in the forests, not so far from the city there are clearings where both ours and Germans lie mixed. This is known to the shtetl rulers, but I have not heard that any steps have been taken to correct this shame, I can’t choose another word for the memory of the victims.
  15. PValery53
    PValery53 28 September 2013 17: 40
    0
    "Officials do not have shame ..." - To "educate" officials, they must be immersed in the "slurry of today's realities."
  16. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 28 September 2013 17: 48
    +1
    Lord What a terrible war it was. Only our fathers and grandfathers could, falling in their thousands in their own land, break the ridge of the German beast. How little we pay attention to them. Our enthusiastic search engines are doing a great job. It is time for our state to take care of the memory of its saviors!
  17. serge-68-68
    serge-68-68 28 September 2013 18: 14
    +4
    The day before yesterday in Velizh they finished raising a nurse in the spring of 1942. 98 soldiers. 1 locket. The burial place is three meters from the road, partially - under the foundation left from the hut. Today 333 soldiers are buried.
    1. Eugene
      Eugene 29 September 2013 11: 31
      +1
      98 eight fighters, one medallion. God forbid, empty. So in Crimea. "Nurse" for 236 people. More precisely, two, next to. Several medallions, medal "For Courage. medallion, filled, not fact. They raised two soldiers, with medallions. Readable. "Zaporizhzhya region ..", and then the names of villages, districts, streets, which are all renamed. Scrolled a map of the region, sent a request to the regional military commissariat.
  18. uzer 13
    uzer 13 28 September 2013 20: 23
    +2
    All the dead cannot be raised, except for Myasniy Bor, there are other similar places, in the area of ​​the same swamps. About the 2th shock army, I can say that after it entered that swamp and could not make its way to Leningrad, it was in The soldiers had neither food nor ammunition, there was no air support at all, while German planes bombed them continuously. After the army commander was replaced and the corridor was again punched in the area of ​​Myasniy Bor, about 4 km wide, 2 shock army it was possible to save and withdraw from the encirclement, but instead it was ordered to strike at Luban with all forces, followed by access to the Krasny Bor area and the opportunity to connect with the troops of the Tikhvin Front. It was not possible to break through the enemy’s defense, it was well prepared. The German units even managed to time to build a narrow gauge railway that ran parallel to the main railway. The remains of the hungry dystrophics died, fulfilling an absurd order and having no chance to win. After that there were still repeated attempts to break through in the districts of some railways. stations that were unsuccessful, and in the spring a spontaneous retreat of the surviving soldiers began through the corridor in the swamp near Myasniy Bor, which was only 200-300 meters wide, which was shot from machine guns on both sides. It was possible to crawl through this section only at night, thanks to the river The leaf did not have to be crossed, because it was littered with corpses.
    Thus several thousand people were saved. The order to retreat from July 25, 1942 apparently appeared nevertheless, but nobody seemed to know about him. Everyone who could move tried to get out of the swamp on their own and exit to the railway. built by fighters of 2 UA in the north-west direction, several wagons were left in the wounded, because there was no way to help them. Such is the harsh truth of war. Here is a quote from military documents:
    July 1942/6, p. 305, 313 /. At the beginning of July 1942, in the units of the 2nd shock army that had left the encirclement, there were only 10 898 people in seven divisions, six brigades and one battalion, i.e. two full-blooded divisions.
    Glory to the fallen soldiers! 2 The Shock Army perished through no fault of their own.

    In the photo, the soldiers of the German army ride on their Stern narrow gauge railway.
  19. I am
    I am 28 September 2013 21: 44
    0
    The war is not over until the last soldier who fell on it is buried !!!! So the guys are doing an important thing. More to such.
    1. Roman1970
      Roman1970 11 October 2013 12: 22
      0
      Quote: I am
      The war is not over until the last soldier who fell on it is buried !!!! So the guys are doing an important thing. More to such.

      I completely agree with you!
  20. aszzz888
    aszzz888 29 September 2013 09: 21
    0
    This is where our golden youth, and not the ones who spend and drink parental money in taverns.
    Thank you for such a rough but grateful and necessary work!
  21. vladimir VR
    vladimir VR 29 September 2013 11: 50
    0
    Credible memory to all the fallen!
  22. major071
    major071 29 September 2013 13: 10
    +5
    Only the country that remembers its fallen soldiers is strong.
  23. ROA
    ROA 29 September 2013 16: 36
    -2
    Hmm, our military has always laid soldiers on life, for women still give birth.
    1. Eugene
      Eugene 29 September 2013 21: 53
      +1
      He understood what he said, or quoted?
  24. freedom2013
    freedom2013 29 September 2013 18: 24
    0
    Until 2010, near the Air Force (novoselitsy), there was a training for the Air Force and provided assistance to search engines using equipment (entirely swamps) and people. Now they have been transferred to Stavropol and it is not known who will continue to help from the Moscow Region. And there to dig and dig, he was present at 2 reburials.
  25. rodevaan
    rodevaan 30 September 2013 09: 30
    +1
    Quote: Sergei Medvedev
    Glory to the heroes! For some reason, there are no articles on this site to which our ancestors brought their enemies. How the Germans ate each other in the Stalingrad cauldron, and fortifications were stacked from frozen corpses. Like captured Italians made pizza from their comrades even in the NKVD camps, and the inhuman Stalinist wardens soaked these nonhumans on the spot as soon as they forced them into cannibalism. Historians tell us about the horrors of war on our side of the front line, and are silent about the horrors of war on that side of the front. As if they were not there. The picture is incomplete. These white spots should be removed.


    - Sergey, I completely agree with you! But the topic of how they beat enemies today, alas, is a taboo. Crawling on all fours in front of zapadoidami - that's what is now possible, which means that idiotic chatter about "thrown corpses" is now relevant. In the early 90s, when we had propaganda diarrhea from the west about the fact that supposedly a Russian Soviet soldier did not know how to fight, but only filled up the corpses of his enemies, and the Germans were supposedly frozen by the winter, but the wind blew, and ours all believed in this Russophobic propaganda nonsense, because it was fashionable to believe that the true truth, of course, in the west. The same thing is observed now. I just can't understand why our losses are always relished in all their glory - "100500" million were put in Rzhev, "200500" billions near Moscow, take any Russian film of modern production - it's sickening to watch, one thing about how a crowd of our soldiers is being driven to the fascist machine guns, mortars. Only about this and speech, only this and savor. As if they are deliberately hammering the brain that they fought just like that.
    It seems that the Russian / Soviet victorious soldier is deliberately turning our modern pro-Western ideologues into a kind of dumb, uncontrollable mass that was driven to slaughter. That's what is disgusting and that's what infuriates.

    If you constantly hammer on the head with blatant lies 100 times, then on the 101st they will begin to believe that this is true. And so it goes. Moreover, both our enemies in the West (for obvious reasons) and their own Svanidzi-Rezunov trolls here in Russia are engaged in this outright muck, (probably because of idiocy and complete ignorance of the issue).

    Okay, Westoids, everything is clear there, the Soviet soldier horn beat these horrible non-humans, so they all scribble their vile libel on us. But I don’t understand why our own offspring is doing the same thing? Why is it completely ignored the only circumstance that the Soviet people defeated the pan-European (!) Enemy not by quantity, but by a higher fighting and moral spirit, modern weapons not inferior to the enemy, their ingenuity, enthusiasm, patriotism, operational thinking of their military leaders, innovation and technical training their workers, designers, inventors. They cannot understand that without all the baggage that I listed and did not list, a victory over a well-equipped and equally numerous enemy would have been unthinkable! - No, but - they threw it in billions and entered Berlin in corpses. And our unicellular barranes with puppy enthusiasm and pig squeal repeat this stupid Russophobic tale invented in the west.
  26. rodevaan
    rodevaan 30 September 2013 09: 30
    +4
    Losses. Only the lazy did not relish our losses in the war (I speak with contempt). How they "savor" in modern Russia - perhaps even in the West they no longer savor ... Take Rzhev, Moscow, Leningrad, Stalingrad, and any major battle - it's the same everywhere. Everything about us - and everything in black light. Everything. Yes, war is war, there was everything in war. And the fact that they attacked in full growth also happened, and that the losses were great - it also happened. But could it have been otherwise in that operational situation? And have they fought like that everywhere? But of course you don't need to think about it! The modern rassian is imprisoned for something else: everyone in the West says - a little million, let's write three! Why feel sorry for them, "uncivilized scoops". This is our current attitude, imposed from the West, towards our ancestors, towards the grandfathers who defended our freedom and our country.

    And with all this - not a word about what the enemy had. And how many fascist bastards were put. This topic seems to be a strict taboo for modern democratic historians. Not a word. Nowhere. Try to find at least 1 report on how many fascist subhumans were flogged near Rzhev? Fuck with 2 you will find, I tried - but apart from extremely general phrases, I did not find anything. Rzhev, it really was the cornerstone of the Eastern Front, there were the most terrible battles in the whole war, a huge number of troops were involved, and the Nazis filled holes there with everything they could fill. But you will not find anywhere about Rzhev's losses of the enemy. Only Grossman sat through his teeth in his book about "huge" and "terrible", but by a miracle the survivor, the only one of his entire company Fritz, wrote in his memoirs that he had never seen such hell and mess anywhere else when a full company arrived at the beginning of the day, by the end, only a few maddened fascists remained of it. What was going on there - on the other side, we can only guess. And so everywhere.

    And for some reason, our degroot do not understand that war is not something that is shown in idiotic, stuffed with West-like anti-Russian propaganda films - these are the hardships that all soldiers and all armies go through. Fritsev was also not spared for the sake of the operational situation, they were also sent to slaughter, to our machine guns and guns in Sevastopol, Kursk, and Stalingrad, they were also put in batches and mowed with shrapnel, only this can be said by a poor little kintz for black popcorn , and not 30-year-old semicircular pseudo-historians, but veterans and letters from soldiers from the front. That's where the more or less true information.

    But now it’s still fashionable to show frank diarrhea about how a dumb herd of Red Army soldiers was being driven unarmed to fascist dugouts. And nothing else interests.

    Why am I writing this? Because I don’t want to accept this vile propaganda pro-Western diarrhea with which our great fathers and grandfathers are watered. Because it’s disgusting that we treat our ancestors like that. What is it that of the great victorious soldier, of the great and iron generation of REAL PEOPLE, who crushed all this common gayropstansky rabble of bandits and murderers, who rebuilt and turned a devastated country into a great and world Power, who survived a complete disgrace and the collapse of the 90s, - do the faceless and stupid gray mass of some dumbrock-dumbass who didn’t know how to fight, but crushed enemies with a thoughtless mass.