Military Review

Power of persuasion. Russian squadron is already influencing US policy toward Syria

144
Power of persuasion. Russian squadron is already influencing US policy toward SyriaIt seems that the grouping of the Russian Navy in the Mediterranean is a real argument for political decisions taken by the United States with respect to Syria. Newspaper VIEW tried to figure out exactly what function Russian warships perform off the coast of Syria and how they look in comparison with the US fleet in this region.


Despite the easing of international tensions around the situation in Syria, the operational connection of the Russian Navy in the Mediterranean (Mediterranean squadron) continues to bear military service in the region. And even slowly increases the composition, although the build-up of forces goes at a slightly different pace - reduced. In general, the squadron gunpowder continues to keep dry.

Almost all the time while the US sauntered weapons around Syria after the advancement of completely contrived accusations of the use of chemical weapons, it seemed that you see some kind of farce. Or, rather, the behavior of a cowardly gopnik, who is afraid to enter into a fight, but cannot lose his dignity "before fraternization", and therefore he plays a scene like "hold me seven, and then six won't keep me, and I will tear them all away."

In the role of "barely holding" were the allies of the United States, who strenuously found ways to refuse to participate in this fun, and their own Congress, and even the enemy in this political situation, that is, Russia. Played its role of holding a cowardly bully from the fight and, probably, bashing and the Mediterranean squadron of the Navy. When the Americans with our help successfully found a loophole from the situation where they had driven themselves, it became clear that there would be no fight. And then a number of ships already planned to be sent to the squadron, allegedly according to a planned rotation, set different tasks. Stressing, however, that if the situation suddenly demands, they will be sent both and others.

In particular, the entry into military service in the Mediterranean to the squadron of the flagship of the Baltic Fleet, the destroyer of the 956 "Persistent" project, was canceled - he immediately found work at home, because the exercises "West-2013" begin at the same time, with which many more Russian exercises related to a single vision and legend. A pair of Black Sea "toothed kids": the rocket boat of the 12411 "Ivanovets" project and the small rocket ship of the 1234 "Shtil" project, which were also planned to be sent to the squadron, also stayed at home. Moreover, the representatives of the Navy referred to the difficulties of the transition of small ships in the autumn stormy weather, although before that the weather did not prevent them. It was probably planned to place them temporarily in Tartus, ensuring there was a constant presence there, which clearly made the port protected from possible attacks from the United States.

Until then, the Pacific flagship, guarded missile cruiser "Varyag" of the 1164 project, also redirected to the shores of Syria, has not yet been sent there. Although the program of his Pacific voyage is seriously reduced, the cruiser will still be sent to the "western Indian Ocean", where it will perform "various tasks." But if necessary, he can be quickly transferred to the shores of Syria and become part of the permanent compound of the Russian Navy. For now he, apparently, will look after the American ships in this region. And if specifically - for the AUG, led by the nuclear aircraft carrier "Harry Truman" in the Persian Gulf and the Arabian Sea. On the shock distance of their 16 PKR operational destination "Vulkan", I suppose. Obviously, the General Staff and the Main Headquarters of the Navy decided that at this stage a greater concentration of forces in the Syria region is not required, but it requires “supervision” of our American “probable partners number one”. Together with Varyag there are a tanker and an ocean rescue tug.

However, the "planned rotation" in the Mediterranean region was not canceled for the urgent (during the exacerbation) direction of the Black Sea flagship sent there, the guards missile cruiser "Moscow", and at the moment he is already leading a squadron. The large anti-submarine ship of the 1155 project “Admiral Panteleyev” from the Pacific Fleet transferred first to the squadron, and now has moved to the Red Sea - its task will also be tracking the AUG, led by the aircraft carrier Chester Nimitz. However, it is possible that “Varyag” could then change “Moscow” as the flagship of the grouping. "Moscow" for several months at sea and in need of entering the base for the prevention of machinery and mechanisms and the rest of the crew.

Also, the composition of the Mediterranean squadron now includes two patrol ships (or, as it is now fashionable to call, rocket frigates): the Baltic Fearless and the Black Sea Sharp-witted. If combatant in the Mediterranean squadron became familiar to Fearless, as was his fellow 11540 “Wise” project, then the last “singing frigate” of 61 “Sharp” project will celebrate the 45 anniversary next year. And although the ship was upgraded to a new project 01090, equipped with modern anti-ship missiles "Uranus" and a number of new systems - time takes its toll. Representatives of the Navy have already stated that if there are no extraordinary needs, in the future the “singing frigate” will act only in the Black Sea.

As for the large landing ships (BDKs), they as a part of the group already made up eight ships from all four fleets. A part of the BDK (two to four units) operate according to the shuttle scheme on the Novorossiysk – Tartus route, ensuring the supply of the main part of armaments, military equipment and ammunition to Syria, while the rest carry out military service as part of the squadron. Moreover, both of them, judging by the photographs and other information, are loaded to capacity. Only some carry weapons for the Syrian army, while others carry marines with equipment. Each BDK can carry either 1000 tons of cargo, or 20 tanks, or 50 pieces of equipment (Project 1171 Tapir, for example, Nikolay Filchenkov), or 500 tons of cargo, or 10 tanks, or 20 pieces of equipment (Project 775 and its modifications). In addition to equipment, they carry up to the battalion of marines (340-440 people). Included in the squadron is such an important ship as the SRZK (medium reconnaissance ship) Priazovye. He is SSV-201, a “communications vessel,” as it is more traditional than traditional for camouflage (everyone knows the real purpose of these ships), such ships are called in the Russian Navy. Built, like most of the USSR Navy's scouts, in Poland (then the USSR gave orders for such ships to the Allies, later equipping them) in 1987, this 3800-ton ship has neither powerful weapons nor high speed, but it is full of intelligence equipment. It includes a powerful complex of radio and radio intelligence (RIRTR), radar tools for working at different heights, sonar tools.

Six years ago, the "Priazovye" went through a deep modernization of radio equipment, as a result of which the appearance of the SRZK changed dramatically. In general, these scouts are upgrading almost constantly. In fact, the Priazovye SRZK is the eyes and ears of the squadron, ensuring the timely opening of the intentions and actions of the Americans, Turks, Israelis, conducting reconnaissance on the territory of Syria, including through the gangs radio networks.

Also, activities of the squadron provide about a dozen support vessels: three tankers, tugs and rescue floating workshop PM-138.

An important question that probably interests many: are there submarines in the compound? This question can be answered with certainty: yes, because even smaller groups of the Russian Navy on long hikes are often accompanied by the main striking power of our fleet — submarines. Even if they were quickly upgraded and repaired by our remarkable shipbuilders, or they are under repair for five years.

Although the official location of the submarine somewhere almost never confirmed, including in the composition of the Mediterranean connection. But with a few rare exceptions. One of them was the largest inter-fleet exercises off the coast of Syria at the beginning of the year, again “completely planned” coincided with another exacerbation of Western hysteria around Syria. Then in the squadron gathered nearly three dozen pennants, including two submarines, this was announced. Then, just as a solid demonstration of intentions and strength was carried out, when the marines and airborne troops landed from the BDK on the Syrian coast, covered by Russian and Syrian warships.

The submarines “surfaced” for the second time out of the darkness of secrecy, when a report on the official report on the formation of an operational connection of the Navy in the Mediterranean to Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu flashed on the screen a slide with a connection structure, which at that time consisted of four operational groups and 16 pennants, in t. h and submarine.

And the third time - recently, during the current exacerbation, when a message ran through the news agencies, where it was said in passing that the group could be reinforced by another nuclear submarine from the Northern Fleet. But the Americans, according to the information of some Western publications, believe that the Russians have three submarines in the region. One of them is the "assassin of aircraft carriers", a Project 949A submarine with an operational anti-ship missile "Granit", and also a pair of covering multipurpose submarines. True or not - it is difficult to say, as, indeed, about those who flicker in the news data on three American nuclear submarines in the region, including one of the Ohio class, out of the four ships that were converted from strategic missile carriers to carriers of the Tomahawk sea-launched cruise missiles (SLCMs). It is possible that all this information from both sides is a "leak" of data on contacts of their forces with submarines, but it is possible that it is erroneous or false. Fear has big eyes.

Near the Syrian coast is the Chinese detachment of ships, headed by the landing-helicopter ship-dock (DVKD) type 071. Such a ship carries several helicopters and up to a battalion of marines with equipment. Onboard the DVKD there is a battalion of marines with equipment and several helicopters. For Americans who are aware of the ever closer rapprochement of the Russian Federation and the People's Republic of China in the military and military-political plans and the unified position of the Eurasian great powers in Syria, this squad is another “nail in the chair”.

Many people ask themselves the question: what are the real goals of finding a large naval group near Syria? First of all, of course, this is a presence in an important region of the world, a flag demonstration and all that jazz. But this, of course, is not the point. In addition, the ships of our fleet are capable of providing reconnaissance, disclosing the actions and intentions of the opposing group and providing this information to Syrian friends. Not to mention the early warning of missile attacks for SAR air defense (as they did during recent launches in the Mediterranean Sea together with the SPRN radar in Armavir). Well, the target designation of the Syrian coastal SCRC "Rubezh", "Redoubt", the latest "Bastions" (a volley of which modern air defense is not even able to repel an aircraft carrier group), as well as aviation may well be provided. And you can’t show anything back.

It is also important to ensure the smooth operation of the “Syrian express” - regular flights of BDK with weapons. Moreover, we will supply weapons, as the head of state should understand, in any case, even in the case of a military operation. Americans will not be able to prevent us, it will mean war. That is, the Syrians will promptly make up for losses in technology, while the Americans during the long operation shine another Korea or Vietnam.

But the United States has neither intentions nor forces for any operations now, except for a one-time action or low-intensity strikes in a short period of time. They have little concentrated forces there, in the Mediterranean now there are only three destroyers of the type “Arly Burk” (there were five, but two took home) and one landing-helicopter ship-dock “San Antonio”. Moreover, he is not there because of Syria, but because of the fears of the United States that something might happen in Libya that requires the power support of the evacuation of the personnel. There is an aircraft carrier group in the Red Sea - an aircraft carrier, a cruiser and two destroyers, the other is the same - in the Persian Gulf and turned off from the game (even its aircraft do not have the ability to attack Syria: the airspace of Iraq and Jordan is closed to them). That is, the forces of the fleet are quite small, and they are divided. And against the available American forces, our group looks confident enough. Especially taking into account the submarine component and the arrival in the region of a missile cruiser capable of providing both zonal air defense with its C-300F air defense missile system and a shock function.

Americans have to take into account the fact that any missile launched in the direction of the squadron ships, can lead to war. And it will no longer be there who has many ships nearby. The leadership of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation has already hinted that “God forbid, a rocket will fall into our ship”, noting that in this case “the consequences for the ecology of the region can be dangerous.” Therefore, any flight paths of the SLCM will have to be built around. In addition, the ships of the squadron clearly defiantly conducted exercises in the period of aggravation of anti-submarine warfare and repelling attacks of cruise missiles.

The presence of a fleet in general, and with a developed amphibious component, is an important deterrent. Americans do not know exactly what actions will be taken by the group in response to various actions. For example, they also understand that the stated task for the squadron to “evacuate Russian citizens in the event of a catastrophic development of events” seems far-fetched. In Syria, there are no signs of the fact that the Syrian army is losing. On the contrary, even the limited strikes of the USA would not change what is already clear to everyone: the terrorist army recruited from all over the world is losing. The question is only when it will happen and how many more people will die and the houses will be destroyed.

And how to evacuate tens of thousands of people? Before the war, 140 lived in Syria with thousands of people with Russian passports: staff of various institutions, wives and children of Syrians, etc. Even if half or two-thirds left - the rest would be enough for a small country like South Ossetia (there were about as many citizens Russia at the time of the beginning of the conflict 2008 year). But the BDK can take only half a thousand people, well, maybe a little more. This is not a Costa Concordia cruise liner. And from it somewhere else you need to unload the troops and equipment. On the BDK can only take the embassy staff. But no one is going to evacuate him. In the USA, everybody understands this and is fully aware that the Russians can make an unexpected move when they try to strike at them - such as the legendary Pristina throw, only bigger. As a result of this move, the Americans would have an unpleasant choice: either to pretend that there was nothing, or to go to the aggravation. And the loss of face for the United States is now extremely dangerous - the economic situation is already bad. Therefore, in Washington, they so seized on a straw about Syria’s refusal of chemical weapons, graciously stretched by Moscow and Damascus.

There is one more factor. In the domestic media, it is often forgotten that at the moment the only country with a non-strategic (tactical) nuclear arsenal at sea is Russia. Not so long ago, the United States disposed of special warheads for the reconverted from nuclear to conventional "Tomahawks." The US Navy does not have other nuclear non-strategic charges. And in Russia, development in this area did not stop, and the production was not curtailed. Of course, a lot of obsolete charges were utilized, but the rest and recently produced will be enough for everyone. All this in the headquarters of the US Navy is taken into account and therefore they treat “these Russians” with caution.

In general, all this concentration of US forces looked frivolous, as if they were confronted not by Syria - a country with a powerful air defense and a strong enough army with combat experience, but some native leader who, by lack of thought and gluttony, ate an American evangelical preacher. There was neither a decent aviation forces to the theater, nor the forces of the fleet. The available stock of cruise missiles on ships in the Mediterranean (if you take into account typical ammunition for ships that left the base not for war, but for trivial patrols, all the more), as well as the number of carriers, is clearly not enough to create massive waves of cruise missiles. Those who wish can find themselves how many forces at one time were opposed to campaigns against the same Iraq, Yugoslavia, and not only for the war, but also for one-off actions, which were quite a few. That is, there was a banal bluff, but with what purposes it was made - this is a question not related to the objectives of this publication.

Therefore, the Americans agreed with the initiative of Moscow with relief - they didn’t smile at trying modern science ATS air defense systems, they present the capabilities of modern air defense systems much better than our home-grown «analysts’ depicting how easily and naturally Americans pogrom anti-aircraft weapons with which never have not met before and which are incomparable in any way with the old stuff with which they had to deal earlier.
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http://vz.ru/politics/2013/9/24/651799.html
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  1. The comment was deleted.
  2. Ivan79
    Ivan79 25 September 2013 07: 30 New
    19
    The article is definitely a plus. The Russian squadron saved not only Syria, but also the Americans from themselves. Paradoxical as it sounds.
    1. Aryan
      Aryan 25 September 2013 11: 03 New
      +8
      Let's hope for the best, Ivan79 !!!
    2. Tektor
      Tektor 25 September 2013 14: 42 New
      +2
      So far, the Russian squadron has not saved anyone: delayed. Amerzians sharpen their teeth ...
      And only one conclusion can be drawn from the article: no one will attack Syria from the sea with a high degree of probability, except perhaps out of curiosity (check missile defense), for example, with submarines ...
      That leaves Turkey, Jordan, Israel. With a low degree of probability - Lebanon, and with an uncertainty - Iraq, more precisely - the states. Remembering "Desert Storm", I would postal on Iraq and Jordan, because Israel should be "white and fluffy", and the Turks balked.
      1. 31231
        31231 25 September 2013 18: 45 New
        +1
        What is Iraq ?! They have oil pipelines through Syria. Are they sick to put their wallet at risk ?! Especially now, when Russia and China sided with small, but sovereign states.
        1. Tektor
          Tektor 26 September 2013 11: 22 New
          +1
          Which sheriff (states) cares about the opinion of the Indians (Iraqi)? Moreover, they have noticed fuss around the bases there. And the pipes can be quickly repaired. I would think about carefully mining the most dangerous areas. Moreover, all types of mines: anti-personnel, anti-tank, anti-helicopter and others. I would have thought of a system for the synchronous detonation of several landmines in the event of a single one. For example, when an anti-helicopter mine is triggered, several mines are simultaneously triggered, forming an "envelope", well, that is. if the anti-helicopter missile does not hit, then undermining the rest will lead to the defeat of everything within a certain area, which will guarantee damage to both the helicopter and the tomahawk ...
  3. Fox
    Fox 25 September 2013 07: 34 New
    18
    yes ... "a kind word and a pistol can always achieve more than just a kind word ..."
    1. Ulysses
      Ulysses 25 September 2013 13: 11 New
      +1
      For this, the Navy is intended. yes
  4. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 25 September 2013 07: 35 New
    +7
    Whoever says anything and the Fleet is a serious argument in any political situation! And although our Navy is still weak, they were serious if something happened ..
    1. Andrey57
      Andrey57 25 September 2013 10: 24 New
      19
      Why weak? laughing Shoigu, on the other hand, said in Russian that "if you accidentally hit our ships, there will be an ecological disaster." laughing Read, in plain text, rocks about tactical nuclear charges, and if they are available, as in that joke: - "... and if I have a rolling pin in my hands, then I don't give a fuck how you wear a cap!", That is, the number of ships it does not affect the speed of their flooding, the main thing is to honestly warn, and then let them guess whether the Russians are bluffing or they can seriously hit. And the very idea of ​​being able to get it on my own, I can't, and not only on the face, plunges the mattress makers into despondency - they would have bombed them with impunity, but they wouldn’t get them in the return line! laughing
      1. Quiet
        Quiet 25 September 2013 12: 00 New
        +2
        "if you accidentally get into our ships, it will be an ecological disaster"

        If the sea begins to boil there ....
  5. awg75
    awg75 25 September 2013 07: 37 New
    11
    It’s nice that the Russian Navy performs combat missions, but doesn’t stand at the berths as in the 90s! Keep it up!
  6. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF 25 September 2013 07: 39 New
    0
    Does everything dissolve? Something is hard to believe, because the US Army took a deposit from the Cathars to dismantle Syria. There is a choice: give it (which amers do not like to do) or fulfill an order.
    1. Nukem999
      Nukem999 25 September 2013 07: 44 New
      -13
      ...................
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 25 September 2013 08: 23 New
        +8
        This is your America, blackmail, warriors, support for terrorism. You probably voted for Baran Obama yourself.
        1. kostyan77708
          kostyan77708 25 September 2013 08: 48 New
          +1
          so they have people there, it seems like they don’t vote
          1. GDP
            GDP 25 September 2013 10: 12 New
            +9
            Why do Americans have a choice - Do you want to vote for Rothschild, do you want for Rockefeller - there is no third. Anyway, there is a choice - sort of choose what you want vodka or moonshine? I would like mineral water ... No, choose vodka or moonshine?
    2. igor36
      igor36 25 September 2013 08: 32 New
      +7
      Quote: FC Skif
      Does everything dissolve? Something is hard to believe, because the US Army took a deposit from the Cathars to dismantle Syria. There is a choice: give it (which amers do not like to do) or fulfill an order.

      Well, you can still bang the customer ....
      1. largus886
        largus886 25 September 2013 10: 41 New
        +1
        We have every right to strike at the nursery and the financial center of terrorism!
    3. Crocodile
      Crocodile 25 September 2013 09: 26 New
      +3
      Let them ask Russia, we can also help for nothing with the Qatari so that there will be no one to give the makings! repeat
      1. abrakadabre
        abrakadabre 25 September 2013 09: 56 New
        +2
        Come on. Let them get dirty. Once again. At the same time, other "allies of the great democracy" will ponder.
      2. Andrey57
        Andrey57 25 September 2013 10: 33 New
        +3
        So since the time of the Union we have a plan to launch an air and missile strike against the Saudis, it has recently flashed that it has been redesigned with new technology and can be completed without intermediate airfields and other laughing So on the spot, "we will help" Obamka close the loan, as Sarkozy did in Libya - "No creditor - no problem!" wassat
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak 25 September 2013 10: 43 New
          +3
          So present it in a ray, "we will help" Obamka close the loan

          For me, let him deal with his own loans.
        2. Sadikoff
          Sadikoff 25 September 2013 14: 52 New
          +1
          This is only after the states leave for the planned restructuring with publicity.
    4. olviko
      olviko 25 September 2013 10: 09 New
      +6
      "The us army took a deposit from the Cathars for the dismantling of Syria. There is a choice: to give it (which the amers don't like to do) or to fulfill the order."

      The democratic lads are now in fashion kidalovo, for example, Sarkozy took the money from Gaddafi, and soaked himself. Very practical. In principle, nothing prevents Amers from finding some kind of WMD in Qatar, there are enough tubes in the USA for everyone, and throwing this same Qatar into asphalt.
      1. ale-x
        ale-x 25 September 2013 11: 06 New
        +1
        Why "wet" Qatar? This is not "boyish")) Qatar must be convinced that it would be nice to return the money from amers, but with a penalty, and we will help you.
    5. Sadikoff
      Sadikoff 25 September 2013 14: 50 New
      0
      Everything has moved to the level of languages ​​- who will argue whom will surpass.
  7. alexng
    alexng 25 September 2013 07: 43 New
    15
    And the news line of the lie empire.
    Yesterday, during a regular meeting of the State Department, two armed bandits burst into the session hall. They apologized for being late and took their places. laughing
  8. a52333
    a52333 25 September 2013 07: 45 New
    +8
    Oh, this is not a success of the fleet, and not of diplomacy. I will say this: they were a serious argument in the SUSPENSION of the strike on Syria, reluctance to remove the stars from the chest, which they "hung" themselves.
    I rummaged here thoroughly, non-aggression occurred as a result of the separation of interests of US superelites.
    There would be unanimity there, they would strike through the heads of our fleet and without UN sanction. I will try to put my doubts and thoughts in the article by the weekend. The fools are now predictably naminus, well, and figs with him.
    1. Ihrek
      Ihrek 25 September 2013 08: 07 New
      10
      The separation of elites most likely plays a role, but the Russian squadron still played the most important role. Because they understood Russia would not be indifferent to watching tomahawks fly over our squadron and hit our closest ally in the region. Amers can only fight when the enemy is weaker than them at least 50 times. Finally, our fleet began to perform
      their real tasks. Otherwise, they will bite us, as it has been for the last 20 years. As the saying goes, the wolf is not afraid to go to the forest. Do you think they are not afraid? Russia does not twist yet the only country capable of destroying amers. They know about this no worse than us.
    2. Bigriver
      Bigriver 25 September 2013 08: 18 New
      +8
      Quote: a52333
      . non-aggression occurred as a result of the division of interests of superelites USA.
      It would be there unanimity, would strike through the heads of our fleet and without UN sanction ...

      Is the separation of elites a cosmic, miraculous process, independent of the current situation on earth? winked
      Obviously, it is due to some divine post-Protestant motives?
      Or maybe, nevertheless, the alignment of forces in the world, an assessment of the capabilities of the parties, at the cost of the issue? Here on earth?
      Isn't this alignment, the firm position of Russia and China in the UN, support for Assad and success in his fight against the Basmachis? Doesn't this include the tremendous work of our politicians and diplomats to attract the BRICS countries to the side "against aggression", the hard work of intelligence and analytic institutions, media institutions.
      Everything played a role in sharing the opinions of elites in Syria. And the fleet too. But, at the core, lies the firm and reasoned position of Russia.
      1. a52333
        a52333 25 September 2013 08: 54 New
        +1
        The separation of elites is a kind of cosmic, miraculous process,
        There is one REASON - you won’t be surprised - money.
        1. Bigriver
          Bigriver 25 September 2013 09: 16 New
          +5
          Quote: a52333
          ... There is one REASON - you won’t be surprised - money.

          Taking this factor into account gives us nothing.
          What, the money of the entire western elite was needed two years ago, and then suddenly half were not needed? smile
          It gives more understanding of the super-tasks of Western policy in the Middle East.
          But, the whole point is that this policy was built, not taking into account the possible stubborn defense of Russia and its mobilizing will.
          When the "factor of Russia" appeared, price of results The continuation of such a policy has changed a lot. It has changed to such an extent that the result, previously considered as desirable, has become more like a rout.
          And here, inside the elites, different opinions began to appear about the correctness of certain actions negative stop angry
          1. a52333
            a52333 25 September 2013 12: 18 New
            0
            The explanation is simple: Wall Street vs. VPK. The price tag is 500 million. For a start
            Each TLAM missile costs an estimated 1,41 million dollars, that is, a check will amount to 352,5 million dollars - only for military equipment. Then there are the costs associated with the warships and the personnel who manage them, which is necessary to support the operation, since the ships might otherwise not be deployed in the area.
    3. Papakiko
      Papakiko 25 September 2013 08: 20 New
      +1
      Quote: a52333
      as a result of the separation of interests of US superelites.

      That is, they are called the elites of the Morgans, Dupons, Knockfellers and so on. can no longer, exclusively superwafers will now be called?
      And where are the "interests" of the gayropean weird, the Persian monarchies, the Chinese?
      Quote: a52333
      I will try to put my doubts and thoughts in the article by the weekend.

      I will look forward to your conclusions. good hi
      1. a52333
        a52333 25 September 2013 08: 53 New
        0
        I will look forward to your conclusions
        You put it straight in the "broken birch" position. The topic is heavy and contradictory. The gayropean weirdos jumped aside together and decided to wait for the verdict. The Saudis took the side of the military-industrial complex (that is, for the essence), China lobbied for a ban.
    4. largus886
      largus886 25 September 2013 10: 06 New
      +2
      Amer in Pristina did not get into the airborne battalion, but here there were more forces, and now Russia is not the same as in the 90s!
    5. Fin
      Fin 25 September 2013 10: 29 New
      +3
      Quote: a52333
      I rummaged here thoroughly, non-aggression occurred as a result of the separation of interests of US superelites.

      IMHO. There are many factors that have affected the temporary retreat on the Syrian issue. This fleet grouping, which blocked the shelling sector, and the separation of elites, and military support for Assad. But the most important thing is the firm and decisive position of the Russian Federation at all levels, they even began to openly accuse the Yankees of lying, this has not been observed before. Even the Yankees hand-shaved and the UN refused to support them. And I did not want to look like an aggressor. In addition, they are afraid of Russians because they cannot calculate our actions.
      But this is just the beginning. They have a plan "B". First, they will try to take us out of the game, I think they will beat us financially, following the example of Cyprus. The first statements about the freezing of assets have already been heard. How soon we will see.
    6. Andrey57
      Andrey57 25 September 2013 10: 42 New
      +2
      Maybe you are right, but only in part, on the "Military Review" recently flashed infa that only Russia (from non-friends of mattress mats) has the technology of guaranteed "unfastening" GPS navigation, and not only this, but all the others NATO and mattresses for military purposes. And tomogavki without navigation systems self-destruct, even those in which the full route is embedded. So "over the heads" will be problematic. hi
    7. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 25 September 2013 11: 28 New
      +5
      Quote: a52333
      Oh, not fleet is success, and not diplomacy

      Alexey, hello! I agree. This is the result of the firm position of the President of the Russian Federation, who managed to pull up allies, organize foreign policy propaganda, and find levers of financial influence on a part of the "disinterested" American elite. Political and economic interaction with the PRC played a decisive role here. They pressed, but for our preferential supplies of energy resources and electricity. energy, military-technical cooperation, etc.
      2's, of course, money! If the amers get into the Syrian adventure, then, given the position of the Russian Federation, they will receive 2-th Vietnam. Then what will happen to the APR? Even America cannot afford such expenses. This is the path to the abyss.
      B-3-them, mn public opinion is not on the side of the United States. Europe does not want to fight, tear to NATO. The situation is delicate: get involved, you can lose face. Again Mujahideen. They openly hate the states. Putin acted wisely, giving Obama the opportunity to get out of tsuzwang, retaining his face. But not one good deed will go unpunished. In response, we will probably get financial and economic problems, a boycott of the Olympiad under the pretext of protecting gays, the division of Ukraine, drug trafficking in the Slovak Republic, etc.
      Correctly said Z. Brzezinski (vrazhina!) The world is a large chessboard. Today we must be grateful that we have a grand master who is worthy of opposing the backstage, defending the national interests of Russia.
      1. Starina_hank
        Starina_hank 25 September 2013 18: 06 New
        0
        An idiotic question: will we survive the second Vietnam or the hell with it?
      2. a52333
        a52333 25 September 2013 23: 26 New
        0
        Hello to you, Alexander. hi There the full anus is brewing. I’ve gotten into trouble with this monster! Tangle of contradictions! The sour thing is the Leuchweiss Cave, as Bender would say. In two words, the military-industrial complex and intelligence pulled up from Wall Street. Rzhach!
  9. Nayhas
    Nayhas 25 September 2013 07: 54 New
    -17
    Pathos-patriotic nonsense. Do not disgrace, funny to read ...
    PS: for a snack for leavened patriots, if the RKR Varyag was going to "look after" Harry Truman, how would he know where he is?
    1. Nukem999
      Nukem999 25 September 2013 08: 13 New
      -16
      people began to post their own fantasies on the site
      1. AlexAl
        AlexAl 25 September 2013 11: 39 New
        +1
        What to look for them! They let white swans and bears into a great air swimming and that’s it. And then, as usual, the mattresses themselves are met with open arms and themselves accompany them towards the AUG. If a bear or a swan flew over the AUG, then the entire composition of the AUG increased to a salary, as for military operations. A long time ago the article was with a description of how they met.
    2. Wedmak
      Wedmak 25 September 2013 09: 30 New
      +4
      if RKR Varyag was going to "look after" Harry Truman, how would he know where he is?

      What about recently launched spy satellites? The square of the AUG location can be easily identified. And then you just have to appear over the Varyagu skyline, the whole AUG will turn sour and will follow Varyag more (the devil knows these Russians !!) than to make plans for an attack on Syria.
      1. Andrey57
        Andrey57 25 September 2013 10: 52 New
        +8
        You are a little mistaken - "Varyag", like "Moscow", it is enough to be within 500 km, and there is nothing for it to scatter to the horizon line, the missiles are not small - they will fly in flocks by themselves hi
        1. Wedmak
          Wedmak 25 September 2013 11: 05 New
          +2
          I know. But it is unlikely that the Varangian alone will clash with the AUG. It’s up to the Americans to get his nerves up, and this is best done in full view.
    3. IRBIS
      IRBIS 25 September 2013 10: 00 New
      12
      Quote: Nayhas
      PS: for a snack for leavened patriots, if the RKR Varyag was going to "look after" Harry Truman, how would he know where he is?

      Sorry, but you came to us from the past, from very distant ones, perhaps? They learned how to "find" the necessary ships in the world's oceans without leaving the office as early as fifty years ago. In general, you missed the most interesting thing in life.
      1. AlexAl
        AlexAl 25 September 2013 11: 43 New
        0
        Just people thinks that AUG goes to the bottom and hides. And in general, amers have all the stealth technology.
        1. Nick888
          Nick888 25 September 2013 13: 52 New
          +1
          Maybe he comes up with the movie "The Avengers", where the aircraft carrier flies)
    4. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 25 September 2013 11: 45 New
      +7
      Quote: Nayhas
      if RKR Varyag was going to "look after" Harry Truman, how would he know where he is?

      Eugene, I will not reveal a big secret, but on the ship (RKR, for example) there are RTR means that with a certain (sufficient for RCC) accuracy can determine the ship's location by operating RES. The rise of aviation is associated with a sharp surge in REI.
      Secondly, no one says that in case of aggravation of the situation, our SSC will not hang out on the side of the AVU, giving out its place with an accuracy of 1 kbt., As well as other EDCs.
      Thirdly, do not forget about space. Liana must earn in 2013 year in full. I think this will be enough to organize a full-fledged volley of anti-ship missiles.
      And last (but not least), no one can be sure that one of our plRKs does not graze this fat target. I am sure that it is so. But submariners have always loved silence and secrecy.
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 20: 59 New
        0
        Liana should earn in 2013 in full.




        About 2013 and the beginning of Liana’s work, they rang loudly for a long time and there, before being adopted as if they were a donkey to the moon. Without Liana, aviation reconnaissance, AWACS planes, the Russian ship’s grouping is without eyes and ears. The presence of the Azov RZK only partially compensates for the lack of intelligence .
  10. azlok
    azlok 25 September 2013 08: 16 New
    +3
    BDK Pacific Fleet Peresvet, BDK Pacific Fleet Admiral Nevelskoy, BDK BF Alexander Shabalin and tugboat Fotiy Krylov in Novorossiysk, September 20.
    1. Nukem999
      Nukem999 25 September 2013 08: 23 New
      -24
      old rusty ship
      1. vvvvv
        vvvvv 25 September 2013 09: 04 New
        11
        It doesn't matter. The main thing is that the zaketas on it were *** e ... It was a special humiliation for American aircraft carriers to be sunk by a "rusty ship". This is a special thrill.
        1. Nukem999
          Nukem999 25 September 2013 09: 08 New
          -13
          buzz rusty
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 25 September 2013 09: 45 New
            +9
            Quote: Nukem999
            buzz rusty

            I don’t like it, your fleet doesn’t like it either, until heartburn laughing
            1. Nukem999
              Nukem999 25 September 2013 10: 03 New
              -11
              like a paper boat
              1. Proud.
                Proud. 25 September 2013 10: 47 New
                +7
                Quote: Nukem999
                like a paper boat

                In an article dated September 23: Tin board of the destroyer Porter after collision with a tanker in the Strait of Hormuz, 2012.
              2. Asgard
                Asgard 25 September 2013 14: 08 New
                +3
                I don’t put a minus, but I follow the comments
                Quote: Nukem999
                like a paper boat

                And I conclude, you're a masochite))))

                I also often get minus from the cheers-patriots and the God-chosen nation, but even so I try to write in essence what I know for sure ....
                Are you dima, apparently you know a little (I read your comments in the profile)), but you are making a cool video (respect))) a "person" not lost to society, so read, gain wisdom (not even knowledge)) wisdom from the collective mind on this site ....
                Read carefully, it is advisable to read Fedor Mikhailovich Dostoevsky in breaks from the Internet (this is such a Russian classic writer)))

                Words, in the correct sequence, observing "silence" (punctuation marks))) will organize your brain correctly, it will "vibrate differently and you will start talking (and wait, snarl))))
                with people.
                Do not want to read Dostoevsky Petkevich))) there, too, everything is written correctly, according to certain rules (the same will be the result)))
                Well, the comments hung up the "old man", as usual after a visit - the mood improved))
                Times of course are difficult, but reading comrades, I understand.
                Erupt)))
          2. largus886
            largus886 25 September 2013 10: 36 New
            +5
            Foolish flag change do not disgrace the Soviet!
          3. Proud.
            Proud. 25 September 2013 10: 40 New
            +3
            Quote: Nukem999
            buzz rusty

            Do you use a crocodile?
            1. IRBIS
              IRBIS 25 September 2013 14: 15 New
              +4
              Quote: Be proud.
              Quote: Nukem999
              buzz rusty

              Do you use a crocodile?

              Most likely his parents were pounding. And not only with a "crocodile" ... Only then my mother forgot to have an abortion ...
              1. Corsair
                Corsair 25 September 2013 14: 46 New
                +3
                Quote: IRBIS
                Most likely his parents were pounding. And not only with a "crocodile" ... Only then my mother forgot to have an abortion ...

                His dad gave birth ... wassat
                1. Bort radist
                  Bort radist 25 September 2013 19: 47 New
                  0
                  Quote: Corsair
                  His dad gave birth ..

                  "I'm not daddy,
                  I'm not my mother
                  I grew up on the street
                  the chicken took me away "
                  Childhood song.
          4. Akhtuba73
            Akhtuba73 25 September 2013 10: 49 New
            +3
            Quote: Nukem999
            buzz rusty

            Right That's just a rusty and rough high you can do a lot. Must it hurt to sit after that?
      2. UVB
        UVB 25 September 2013 09: 22 New
        +8
        But it fully copes with the functions assigned to it.
      3. Wedmak
        Wedmak 25 September 2013 09: 30 New
        +5
        Look at your pelvis ....
      4. Ihrek
        Ihrek 25 September 2013 10: 47 New
        0
        this "rusty" business can do that will not seem a little.
      5. AlexAl
        AlexAl 25 September 2013 11: 47 New
        +3
        And also with an old, rusty tank and an old rusty Kalash, an old rusty sapper shovel, and many more old and rusty. Only amers are so fashionable that the color and look of the old rusty spoils and demoralizes the whole mood to liquid bricks.
      6. lewerlin53rus
        lewerlin53rus 25 September 2013 12: 27 New
        +5
        Quote: Nukem999
        old rusty ship

        She doesn’t even know how to troll. Goof, go to the port and look at any ship that has come from a distant crossing. Any, even new, will be rusty. Sea water does its job. And on the old account, look at the years of construction of many Amerov vessels.
        1. vvvvv
          vvvvv 25 September 2013 13: 34 New
          +4
          And his task is not even to troll, but simply to "spoil the air" (did not write in a shorter word) ... The trolls have common sense and logic resting, but here they simply died altogether. Soviet and Russian technology has always been reliable in operation, even if it does not always look impressive. Not the conditions for pido **** to be all sorts of little things. Kalashnikov also looks simple, but foreign analogues cannot be compared with unpretentiousness and reliability. Or is it like running into a Russian bumpkin with a fist the size of an Amer, but not in a tuxedo and lacquered boots ... No one will judge the outcome of a fist fight by the degree of shine of boots ?! laughing
      7. PiP
        PiP 25 September 2013 14: 19 New
        0
        Quote: Nukem999
        old rusty ship

        A rusty double-barreled gun is buried in the "vegetable garden". Do you doubt that you can kill from it? Stop carrying the blizzard.
        1. Arabist
          Arabist 25 September 2013 14: 33 New
          0
          You can kill with an envelope. In general, about Syria, I think there was a complex of factors. Yes, it’s not over yet. But the positive dynamics are evident.
  11. andr1966a
    andr1966a 25 September 2013 08: 21 New
    0
    Quote: Jamal
    The separation of elites most likely plays a role, but the Russian squadron still played the most important role. Because they understood Russia would not be indifferent to watching tomahawks fly over our squadron and hit our closest ally in the region. Amers can only fight when the enemy is weaker than them at least 50 times. Finally, our fleet began to perform
    their real tasks. Otherwise, they will bite us, as it has been for the last 20 years. As the saying goes, the wolf is not afraid to go to the forest. Do you think they are not afraid? Russia does not twist yet the only country capable of destroying amers. They know about this no worse than us.
    1. andr1966a
      andr1966a 25 September 2013 08: 49 New
      +5
      The Russian squadron may have played a role, but I don’t think it was strong. In the Soviet Union, what power was there, and we weren’t very afraid, there were skirmishes and confrontations. There were wars, and one should not underestimate the enemy, the mattresses have excellent armament, good equipment, and most importantly they have combat experience (there isn’t only the spirit of victory) .And we’ve got military officers fired and heroes planted (Budanov, Kvachkov, etc.)
      1. Quiet
        Quiet 25 September 2013 10: 37 New
        +1
        Maybe the Russian squadron played a role, but I don’t think so much. In the Soviet Union, what power was there, and they weren’t very afraid

        So, after all, the American economy was not such a bloated bubble, about to burst ...
  12. rugor
    rugor 25 September 2013 08: 46 New
    +5
    The squadron is certainly good, but the most important role for the one who decides to use this squadron. Now the West understands that if something happens and the GDP does not flinch - this is the main strength of Russia.
  13. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 25 September 2013 08: 50 New
    +8
    I remember even before the peak of the Syrian crisis, some comrades were crap on our Navy and were starving .. (as it is again now) like rusted tin cans that they can against the US armada ... They could not get scared!
    1. Wedmak
      Wedmak 25 September 2013 09: 32 New
      +1
      Could not afraid because!

      Well, in vain did they warn our people about the consequences for the region’s ecology ... It was obviously not about packs of anti-ship missiles.
      1. Deniska
        Deniska 25 September 2013 10: 57 New
        +4
        Yes, the environment may suffer due to the reactor of the aircraft carrier wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat wassat
  14. v.lyamkin
    v.lyamkin 25 September 2013 08: 51 New
    0
    One thing is bad, Obama again began to cock something. Either his wife scolded, or else what happened.
    1. Corsair
      Corsair 25 September 2013 21: 20 New
      0
      Quote: v.lyamkin
      One thing is bad, Obama again began to cock something. Either his wife scolded, or else what happened.

      Ish, how he laughed ...
  15. Asan Ata
    Asan Ata 25 September 2013 08: 57 New
    +6
    An attempt by Nukem999 to warm up the conversation failed))). Let's better dream about the post-imperialist world. drinks
    1. KG_patriot_last
      KG_patriot_last 25 September 2013 11: 16 New
      +1
      Of course, it would be better not to let the USSR flag be worn - it would immediately be clear who is who ... There are 15 republics, they are only allowed to do this ... Moreover, as a second flag and not the main one ... In general, it is advisable not to hide behind Soviet flag to all overseas ...
  16. vvvvv
    vvvvv 25 September 2013 09: 02 New
    +1
    Well, Che, Assad would have been brought to Tartus without even hiding it, and let the p.i.nd.s.d.sy risk darting a blow at our base ... Probably, they sniffed this matter and realized that Assad extinguished :) There is no sense in bombing ...
  17. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 25 September 2013 09: 29 New
    +2
    Now it’s up to Assad to clean up and clean up again .. He doesn’t have much time .. Russia has helped and is helping! I hope the Syrians will not forget this (we were bluffing on the brink of war and our nerves were stronger)
    1. Setrac
      Setrac 25 September 2013 15: 26 New
      +1
      Quote: MIKHAN
      we were bluffing on the brink of war and our nerves were stronger

      If we were bluffing, the war would take place, in such matters they are not bluffing.
  18. vlad.svargin
    vlad.svargin 25 September 2013 09: 45 New
    0
    To support our diplomacy, the fleet in the Mediterranean is a very weighty argument:

    Therefore, the Americans agreed with the initiative of Moscow with relief - they didn’t smile at the modern air defense systems of the SAR,
  19. Russ69
    Russ69 25 September 2013 10: 06 New
    +2
    It’s silly to argue about the steepness of a fleet in the Mediterranean. The group itself plays its part in politics in any way. And the United States raises additional questions about whether the fleet will intervene or not in the event of a strike and how much it will intervene. For politicians, this is an additional annoying factor in any case when making a decision. Let not the main, but important.
  20. Dimy4
    Dimy4 25 September 2013 10: 16 New
    +2
    Association with the gopnik right to the point!
  21. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 25 September 2013 10: 30 New
    +1
    I hope that after the Syrian crisis everyone understands the importance of a powerful Navy in Russia .. Peter 1 is clearly forgotten ..
  22. Quiet
    Quiet 25 September 2013 10: 48 New
    0
    Quote: MIKHAN
    I remember even before the peak of the Syrian crisis, some comrades were crap on our Navy and were starving .. (as it is again now) like rusted tin cans that they can against the US armada ... They could not get scared!


    It's not about rusty ships, but about the crew, the strength of his spirit !!!! The American crews apparently have problems with this ...
  23. Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. 25 September 2013 10: 56 New
    0
    Quote: UVB
    But it fully copes with the functions assigned to it.

    The purpose of our fleet, in this case, is to show the firmness of Russia in relation to Syria (regardless of its condition). In the event of a mess, the local theater will fade into the background. The conflict can go on as an adult, and ours was not in vain taking care of the environment.
  24. Grigorich 1962
    Grigorich 1962 25 September 2013 10: 59 New
    +1
    A good article ... voluminous and to the point ..... thanks to the author .... mood today raised in full
  25. Samy
    Samy 25 September 2013 11: 13 New
    +1
    It seems that both sides do not really know what to do ... All the same, the forces of our fleet there are very weak, but the Americans do not force events, although they could.
    1. 123dv
      123dv 25 September 2013 12: 13 New
      +1
      The fact is that they are perfectly able to calculate options for probable scenarios. And, presumably, none of the possible scenarios of them currently suits.
      Delay is just right for everyone.
      The reason is quite decent.
      We continue to sharpen the knife ....
  26. andruha70
    andruha70 25 September 2013 11: 13 New
    +2
    It seems that the grouping of the Russian Navy in the Mediterranean is a real argument for the political decisions made by the United States regarding Syria.
    so this is not the point ... even if there will be only one longboat with a Russian peasant ... holding a balalaika in one hand and hugging a bear with the other ... laughing and the fact that for some time, the leadership of the country showed a big and fat cookie to the West ... like, come on ... it's our cow ... and we milk it ... wink these western devils do not understand otherwise ...
    1. andruha70
      andruha70 25 September 2013 11: 44 New
      0
      I understand, minus I drove a supporter of Western ideology? come on, arguments to the studio tongue
  27. Goldmitro
    Goldmitro 25 September 2013 11: 17 New
    +2
    <<< The Mediterranean Squadron of the Navy also played its part in keeping the cowardly bully from fighting and, probably, spanking. >>>
    If we compare today's events in Syria with a similar situation in Yugoslavia, when Russia during the reign of Apohm Yeltsin, the only thing it could dare to was to send its own reconnaissance ship to monitor the actions of NATO that bombed Yugoslavia and then received a humiliatingly harsh warning from the US Secretary of Defense not to interfere and not interfere with what is happening, then today's Russian Mediterranean squadron, demonstrating Russia's determination to intervene and cool the ardor of overly inflamed globalizers, already accustomed to implementing their plans with the help of Tomahawks, undoubtedly testifies to the immeasurably increased power of Russia and determination to defend its interests, which can no longer be ignored by the United States, NATO and their allies!
  28. Ihrek
    Ihrek 25 September 2013 11: 25 New
    +3
    In the event of a fleet collision, we have few chances, but we will knock out amers teeth and perhaps even break our hands. This thought alone cools them. And we have nowhere to retreat (no matter how it sounds) - Russia is behind.
    1. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 25 September 2013 12: 21 New
      +5
      Quote: Jamal
      In the event of a fleet collision

      The question will be about 3 MV.
      Quote: Jamal
      We have few chances, but we will knock out amers teeth and perhaps we’ll break our hands.

      our air force grouping in the Wed sea is like an iceberg: everyone can see only its surface part. And what the underwater one is, none of the adversaries knows, therefore "This thought alone cools them."

      Quote: Jamal
      And we have nowhere to retreat (no matter how it sounds) - Russia is behind.

      A sober idea, but the situation is not as tragic as near Moscow in 41. Yes, with the loss of Syria (God forbid!), Our position on the pipe in Europe will drastically change, incomes will fall, etc. But Iran will still remain the last bastion. Then there will probably be no margin of safety apart from our own resources. So that this does not happen and you need to resist today, "like the last time!" IMHO.
    2. andruha70
      andruha70 25 September 2013 15: 45 New
      0
      In the event of a fleet collision, we have few chances, but we will knock out amers teeth and perhaps even break our hands.
      and not only hands ... wink as my late grandfather said, there are few of us ... but we are in vests ... am
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 37 New
        0
        as my late grandfather said, there are few of us ... but we are in vests ...




        In 1905, before the Tsushima battle in Russia, the same mood was inflated. They threatened to throw their hats at the Japanese.
        1. Arabist
          Arabist 25 September 2013 17: 41 New
          0
          You might think then, Japs, we never won.
          1. gunnerminer
            gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 45 New
            +1
            You might think then, Japs, we never won.




            The U.S. Navy inflicted defeat on the Japanese fleet. The Japanese fleet defeated the Tsushima battle. Then there was soup with a cat, I apologize for the pun.
            1. Arabist
              Arabist 25 September 2013 17: 51 New
              0
              Fleet, yes, but on land we.
              1. gunnerminer
                gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 56 New
                -1
                Fleet, yes, but on land we.




                Port Arthur, Half of Sakhalin Island, the islands of the Kuril ridge of the SA and Navy were able to recapture after the defeat of the main forces of the Japanese fleet and aircraft by the Americans in 1945.
                1. Arabist
                  Arabist 25 September 2013 17: 58 New
                  0
                  Oh really? Or maybe because we then smashed Germany and could not participate? And Hassan and Halkin-Gol?
                  1. gunnerminer
                    gunnerminer 25 September 2013 18: 03 New
                    0
                    Oh really? Or maybe because we then smashed Germany and could not participate? And Hassan and Halkin-Gol?



                    The topic of the article is about an amusing Russian ship grouping, incomprehensible. Judging by the composition, purpose. Do you for some reason write about the defeat of Germany and so on?
                    1. Arabist
                      Arabist 25 September 2013 18: 06 New
                      0
                      What does it not suit you? Are we going to fight?
                      1. gunnerminer
                        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 18: 10 New
                        0
                        Is she not happy with you? Are we going to fight?





                        Judging by the composition of the Russian group, the Government of the Russian Federation was not going to fight. The Pacific Marines were tormented to no avail, making it impossible even to do normal physical exercises without going ashore. They sleep in six-tier bunks. Without air conditioning.
                      2. Arabist
                        Arabist 25 September 2013 18: 19 New
                        +1
                        And why not 100 tier? I really didn’t think that sleeping without split is such a torment.
                      3. gunnerminer
                        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 18: 58 New
                        0
                        And why not 100 tier? I really didn’t think that sleeping without split is such a torment.




                        The way to sleep in this way adversely affects the fighting qualities of the landing party, especially if the paratroopers are not able to do normal morning exercises, not to mention physical training, march throws and other things. The DBCs are designed to transport troops, but not for long-term deployment If there is no hospital vessel in the grouping, which is also intended for recreation and preventive and therapeutic measures of military personnel.
                2. Setrac
                  Setrac 25 September 2013 19: 12 New
                  0
                  Quote: gunnerminer
                  The topic of the article is about an amusing Russian ship grouping, incomprehensible. Judging by the composition, purpose. Do you for some reason write about the defeat of Germany and so on?

                  You remembered Japan belay
                  1. gunnerminer
                    gunnerminer 25 September 2013 19: 19 New
                    0
                    You remembered Japan



                    Comments were reminded, the situation before the Battle of Tsushima, there were a lot of hat-expressing expressions.
                    yours came from vrmen Tsushima. In high school this period of the history of the Russian Federation was taught. Moreover, in Russia there are about 200 thousand deviators from military conscription. And this is in peacetime. Young people don’t want to serve not on a contract basis, not on conscription, or alternatively. Plus to all the creation of a funny Mediterranean squadron for internal use. The excitement around the group is inflated with the aim of agitation, to distract the population from prohibitive corruption in the military-industrial complex, the failures of the last three state weapons programs, especially the Navy, the failures in the manning of the RF Armed Forces, from reducing the number of naval personnel, especially submarines of all classes.
    3. andruha70
      andruha70 25 September 2013 18: 57 New
      +1
      In 1905, before the Tsushima battle in Russia, the same mood was inflated. They threatened to throw their hats at the Japanese.
      I don’t know what was swelling there before the Tsushima battle, however ... my grandfather survived ... the Nazis broke ... he gave birth to a father ... and he gave me ... tongue and about Japan ... why did you remember Tsushima exactly? what next? and today? maybe it’s worth it to unravel and look globally? where is that japan? where is half of Sakhalin and the Kuril ridge? no tongue and thanks to whom? thanks to our grandfathers. I’ll tell you a commonplace thing — to lose one battle — it doesn’t mean to lose a battle ... soldier
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 19: 03 New
        -2
        I don’t know what swelled there before the Tsushima battle



        Comments were reminded, the situation before the Battle of Tsushima, there were a lot of hat-expressing expressions.
        yours came from vrmen Tsushima. In high school this period of the history of the Russian Federation was taught. Moreover, in Russia there are about 200 thousand deviators from military conscription. And this is in peacetime. Young people don’t want to serve not on a contract basis, not on conscription, or alternatively. Plus to all the creation of a fun Mediterranean squadron, for domestic use.
  • gunnerminer
    gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 40 New
    -2
    In the event of a fleet collision, we have few chances, but we will knock out amers teeth and perhaps even break our hands.



    What fleets are you rallying about? In the Mediterranean Sea, the RF Ministry of Defense was able to collect everything that it can sail. The composition of this group does not even correspond to the operational connection. It’s good if they maneuver without accidents and incidents.
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 25 September 2013 11: 36 New
    +4
    Of course, when the ships of the Russian Navy were at the piers, the Americans felt at ease in the vastness of the world's oceans. It is quite a different matter when a squadron of Russian ships arrives in a region engulfed in military confrontation. Here you will not "spoil"! Undoubtedly, the Russian fleet in the Mediterranean is a powerful deterrent for the unbelievable Yankees. Everyone understands that the Russian fleet did not come to the shores of Syria for "rest". And it's time for our sailors to learn how to fight, seeing potential opponents through binoculars.
    1. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 36 New
      0
      Undoubtedly, the Russian fleet in the Mediterranean is a powerful deterrent




      The fleet consists of several operational formations. The Russian naval grouping in the Mediterranean Sea consists of several ships, hardly corresponds to the operational formations.
  • stpv1
    stpv1 25 September 2013 12: 03 New
    +1
    I read in a previous article that smart without RCC, is it really true
    1. Corsair
      Corsair 25 September 2013 12: 59 New
      +1
      Quote: stpv1
      I read in a previous article that smart without RCC, is it really true

      Yes, that article was puzzling, puzzled. But, unfortunately, I can’t find the information ... request
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 33 New
        0
        Yes, that article was puzzling, puzzled. But, unfortunately, I can’t find the information ...





        You are right. SKR Shrewd and TFR Undaunted go with empty launch containers for RCC.
  • HAM
    HAM 25 September 2013 12: 57 New
    +1
    "Tomahawk", "Tomahawk" -BOOMERANG!
  • trenkkvaz
    trenkkvaz 25 September 2013 12: 59 New
    -5
    The Americans would have been laughing so hard at this article. smile
    For them, that our fleet is there, that it is not there. It does not weather.
    At the highest level, it was stated that Russia would not fight over Syria!
    Accordingly, the presence of our fleet off the coast of Syria is pointless from a military point of view. He would be an observer of the war, no more.
    1. Proud.
      Proud. 25 September 2013 13: 48 New
      0
      Quote: trenkkvaz
      Russia will not fight over Syria!

      Correctly stated. Nobody wants a hot phase of the conflict (direct intervention). Even the amers. And the war is already on. A war of geopolitical interests, and Russia is participating in this war.
      Quote: trenkkvaz
      the presence of our fleet off the coast of Syria is pointless from a military point of view

      The fleet is meaningful.
      Quote: trenkkvaz
      He would be an observer of the war, no more.

      Do you have a reliable source?
    2. Odysseus
      Odysseus 25 September 2013 15: 44 New
      +1
      Quote: trenkkvaz
      Accordingly, the presence of our fleet off the coast of Syria is pointless from a military point of view. He would be an observer of the war, no more.

      Let’s say, the grouping of ships performs the tasks of escorting the BDK, reconnaissance and representative.
      He really cannot and does not intend to do military tasks.
      But she still benefits.
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 18: 17 New
        -2
        He really cannot and does not intend to do military tasks.
        But she still benefits.




        What can be the benefit of the presence of a ship group consisting of thirty and forty-year-old ships maneuvering at the cost of the heroic efforts of the crews! At the same time, everyone knows about the inability to carry out any tasks. This is an agitation in the style of the 70s for domestic consumption.
        1. Odysseus
          Odysseus 26 September 2013 00: 22 New
          0
          Quote: gunnerminer
          At the same time, everyone knows about the inability to perform any tasks. This is a campaign in the style of the 70s for domestic consumption.

          Well, firstly, not everything is known - you can track it by comments smile
          Secondly: in the 70s, agitation was much closer to reality.
          But on the merits of the matter ... The ships accompany the BDK, and are engaged in reconnaissance to the best of their ability. There is nothing more that the Russian Federation can do now. Such is the real state of the fleet in the conditions of capitalist Russia.
          1. gunnerminer
            gunnerminer 26 September 2013 00: 29 New
            0
            Well, firstly, not everything is known - you can track it by comments



            Those who are supposed to know are aware of the combat readiness of the Russian naval group. Not all of the comments reflect the commentator’s real opinion. I remember the agitators of the 70s. They carried tons of them to Arabic in Syria and Egypt. And they didn’t get directions from political agencies and military councils even try to distribute them among Arab-speaking military personnel. In addition, contacts with foreign military personnel were forbidden. The USSR Armed Forces officer was obliged to inform the officer of the Special Department of the KGB serving the unit or compound no later than 24 hours about unauthorized and deliberate contact with a foreigner. agitation. The NATO military was even stricter.
      2. Simon
        Simon 25 September 2013 20: 33 New
        0
        Yes, sometimes one presence is enough to stop the war. In addition, our fleet saved Obama from shame as a peacemaker who unleashed a war. Kaba did not have to return the Nobel Prize to him, who received as a peacemaker. hi
        1. gunnerminer
          gunnerminer 25 September 2013 20: 39 New
          0
          Yes, sometimes one presence is enough to stop the war. In addition, our fleet saved Obama from shame as a peacemaker who unleashed a war. Kaba did not have to return the Nobel Prize to him, who received as a peacemaker.

          The Syrian campaign is not over. The fighting in Syrian territory has not stopped and does not stop even for a minute. Even after the arrival of Russian old ships in the eastern Mediterranean. Major events take place on the Syrian territory. Even if the Russian military-political leadership brings everything that can stay afloat, this will not stop the opposition.
    3. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 32 New
      -1
      At the highest level, it was stated that Russia would not fight over Syria!
      Accordingly, the presence of our fleet off the coast of Syria is pointless from a military point of view. He would be an observer of the war, no more.




      There is nothing to wage war on the Mediterranean Sea and in Syria. The results of the so-called surprise exercises of the Eastern Military District are especially convincing in this regard.
  • Maks-80
    Maks-80 25 September 2013 13: 12 New
    0
    Article plus! drinks
  • Ihrek
    Ihrek 25 September 2013 13: 21 New
    0
    The fleet must be revived.
  • andr1966a
    andr1966a 25 September 2013 13: 42 New
    +1
    Quote: Quiet
    So, after all, the American economy was not such a bloated bubble, about to burst ..

    Let's face it, well, America’s economy will not burst in the near future, no matter how much we would not like it. The whole world is tied to the dollar, and they will print more. And it’s not beneficial for anyone that America’s economy (even us) collapses, so will pull. In my opinion, Obama did not dare to strike for many reasons; diplomacy, Lavrov smart; our alliance with rapidly developing China; the information war, this time we won; the betrayal of England; in Russia, NATO transshipment bases that can be covered up; our fleet and much other
  • Kapdva
    Kapdva 25 September 2013 13: 53 New
    +1
    We went on these "old, rusty ships, wherever you go and stick your nose in!"
  • Navigator2013
    Navigator2013 25 September 2013 13: 56 New
    +3
    Great article! Clearly structured arguments.
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 25 September 2013 15: 03 New
    0
    In short, maybe the Russian fleet can make a rustle and cover it with breasts in vests (if that)! This is only the beginning I'm sure !!

    I’d also like to add .. I’m sure that even our small ships (escorts), sailing past Amer hulks, showed them (indecent signs ... secretly from the captain naturally)))) laughing
  • Gur
    Gur 25 September 2013 15: 24 New
    0
    In the Syrian scenario, I was surprised by Britain and other Sykuns and another analogy with Serbia when Milosovic started to bomb Yeltsin said if you bomb I will call you and express my dissatisfaction, then I would be ashamed for a bit of the underground I was ashamed of my country, but how things were happening now everyone saw and they heard. Believe me, the most important thing in the crisis was political will, but you also need to take into account that this will would have been worthless if it weren’t for the army and navy. And judging by the flights of the BDK of Russia, oh, I’m unaware of anyone who would go into Syria with a sword.
  • Gur
    Gur 25 September 2013 15: 26 New
    -1
    Yes, I forgot I still think if we had not given Serbia back then (though we couldn’t), most likely the inconsequential events in Iraq of Libya, Afghanistan, Syria, the adversary then liked it came to taste.
  • chushoj
    chushoj 25 September 2013 15: 57 New
    0
    The article about the surface fleet is patriotic. The diplomatic victory is clear, which has provided many opportunities, including time for a significant redeployment of Syrian troops. A blow will be delivered to Syria, and the blow will be from different directions. "Sales" of American used and testing of Russian diagnostics is a small part.
  • HAM
    HAM 25 September 2013 16: 31 New
    0
    Somehow the Americans came to the Crimea "for wool", and left "shorn", and only the patrolmen (punched the sides, broke the weapons) were "sheared". Look in YU TUBE, an entertaining video, old, rusty, gouged "cool" and new ones. no shooting, only "bulk".
  • gunnerminer
    gunnerminer 25 September 2013 17: 28 New
    0
    What can a funny ship group, which is based on BDKs that have served all their terms, do? What can the TFR Undaunted and TFR Tasty, with empty containers for Uranus missiles do? With anti-submarine calculations that do not have the skills to search for and destroy enemy submarines. combat exercise to search for and destroy a submarine. in view of the complete lack of support forces for such an exercise. The only submarine B-871 877 of the Alrosa project on the KChF cannot dive and travels with maximum average speeds, and only accompanied by a tugboat. The same goes for TFR Undaunted .RKR Moscow, a ship that has served all its terms and is unable to use the S-300f complex due to the technical condition of the latter (even from aft course angles). It has no air cover grouping, without eyes and ears. The OSNAZ groups of reconnaissance ships were equipped with specialists from all fleets , senior intelligence officers were appointed to the post of commanders of the OCHNAZ groups fleets and the Navy. The command and the headquarters of the grouping have no experience in commanding and operational management, the staff of the officers of the headquarters operators is finally formed just the other day. There are no universal supply ships, a hospital ship, there is no modern floating workshop (thirty-year PM-138 does not count).
    1. poquello
      poquello 26 September 2013 02: 09 New
      +1
      Quote: gunnerminer
      What can a funny ship group, which is based on BDKs that have served all their terms, do? What can the TFR Undaunted and TFR Tasty, with empty containers for Uranus missiles do? With anti-submarine calculations that do not have the skills to search for and destroy enemy submarines. combat exercise to search for and destroy a submarine. in view of the complete lack of support forces for such an exercise. The only submarine B-871 877 of the Alrosa project on the KChF cannot dive and travels with maximum average speeds, and only accompanied by a tugboat. The same goes for TFR Undaunted .RKR Moscow, a ship that has served all its terms and is unable to use the S-300f complex due to the technical condition of the latter (even from aft course angles). It has no air cover grouping, without eyes and ears. The OSNAZ groups of reconnaissance ships were equipped with specialists from all fleets , senior intelligence officers were appointed to the post of commanders of the OCHNAZ groups fleets and the Navy. The command and the headquarters of the grouping have no experience in commanding and operational management, the staff of the officers of the headquarters operators is finally formed just the other day. There are no universal supply ships, a hospital ship, there is no modern floating workshop (thirty-year PM-138 does not count).

      Volcanoes have left us to eat, here’s another for guzzle and hezbola vodka as a guarantee, now we cannot sail away. Koki dive overboard with hunger with knives, all around the fish they cut and bit.
  • Stepnogorets
    Stepnogorets 25 September 2013 18: 53 New
    0
    Quote: gunnerminer
    What can a funny ship group, which is based on BDKs that have served all their terms, do? What can the TFR Undaunted and TFR Tasty, with empty containers for Uranus missiles do? With anti-submarine calculations that do not have the skills to search for and destroy enemy submarines. combat exercise to search for and destroy a submarine. in view of the complete lack of support forces for such an exercise. The only submarine B-871 877 of the Alrosa project on the KChF cannot dive and travels with maximum average speeds, and only accompanied by a tugboat. The same goes for TFR Undaunted .RKR Moscow, a ship that has served all its terms and is unable to use the S-300f complex due to the technical condition of the latter (even from aft course angles). It has no air cover grouping, without eyes and ears. The OSNAZ groups of reconnaissance ships were equipped with specialists from all fleets , senior intelligence officers were appointed to the post of commanders of the OCHNAZ groups fleets and the Navy. The command and the headquarters of the grouping have no experience in commanding and operational management, the staff of the officers of the headquarters operators is finally formed just the other day. There are no universal supply ships, a hospital ship, there is no modern floating workshop (thirty-year PM-138 does not count).

    Murat! You indecently know a lot!
    1. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 25 September 2013 19: 11 New
      0
      Murat! You indecently know a lot!




      Tskh! Thank you, Dear. It’s impossible to know a lot.
  • Stavr
    Stavr 25 September 2013 19: 41 New
    +2
    Quote: gunnerminer
    What can a funny ship group, which is based on BDKs that have served all their terms, do? What can the TFR Undaunted and TFR Tasty, with empty containers for Uranus missiles do? With anti-submarine calculations that do not have the skills to search for and destroy enemy submarines. combat exercise to search for and destroy a submarine. in view of the complete lack of support forces for such an exercise. The only submarine B-871 877 of the Alrosa project on the KChF cannot dive and travels with maximum average speeds, and only accompanied by a tugboat. The same goes for TFR Undaunted .RKR Moscow, a ship that has served all its terms and is unable to use the S-300f complex due to the technical condition of the latter (even from aft course angles). It has no air cover grouping, without eyes and ears. The OSNAZ groups of reconnaissance ships were equipped with specialists from all fleets , senior intelligence officers were appointed to the post of commanders of the OCHNAZ groups fleets and the Navy. The command and the headquarters of the grouping have no experience in commanding and operational management, the staff of the officers of the headquarters operators is finally formed just the other day. There are no universal supply ships, a hospital ship, there is no modern floating workshop (thirty-year PM-138 does not count).


    This is exactly what the Germans thought when they approached the Brest Fortress, ..... what could this handful of Russians do then they thought !! .... how we all ended up remember !! It’s not necessary to measure everything only with the amount of equipment and its condition (this is important, I don’t argue), the main thing is that courage and courage do not leave, it will be necessary, planes will be shot down from the slingshot))
    1. 31231
      31231 25 September 2013 19: 54 New
      0
      The person is not seen from the Russians. And he does not know what "The need for invention is cunning!" And as for the Russian need for any Western capitalist popabol.
      1. gunnerminer
        gunnerminer 25 September 2013 20: 02 New
        -1
        The person is not seen from the Russians. And he does not know what "The need for invention is cunning!" And as for the Russian need for any Western capitalist popabol.




        A very interesting remark. It’s very suitable for internal mass propaganda material. The Russian Defense Ministers, the former Minister of Finance Kudrin would appreciate your opinion. Judging by the lack of integrated supply ships in the Mediterranean group, the Russian Navy Command will think similarly.
    2. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 25 September 2013 19: 57 New
      -2
      This is exactly what the Germans thought when they approached the Brest Fortress, ..... what could this handful of Russians do then they thought !! .... how we all ended up remember !! It’s not necessary to measure everything only with the amount of equipment and its condition (this is important, I don’t argue), the main thing is that courage and courage do not leave, it will be necessary, planes will be shot down from the slingshot))




      Read it again, slowly and attentively. The age of ships and vessels is more than extreme. About training crews of Special Operations Command Risky and Special Purpose Operations Command Undaunted, about training groups of Special Forces crews of reconnaissance ships. Untrained crew using new equipment can break numbers causing an accident and breakdown. a submarine of project 685 -Komsomolets- on April 9, 1989, and a planck 949A of the project -Kursk-.
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 25 September 2013 21: 58 New
        +2
        Quote: gunnerminer
        Plark 949A of the project -Kursk-

        Here is a bastard, what cynicism, to blame the death of the Kursk on the unprofessionalism of the sailors. What a brazen attempt to slander the heroes. Your disrespectful traitor has no place on a Russian patriotic site.
        1. gunnerminer
          gunnerminer 25 September 2013 22: 14 New
          -2
          Here is a bastard, what cynicism, to blame the death of the Kursk on the unprofessionalism of the sailors. What a brazen attempt to slander the heroes. Your disrespectful traitor has no place on a Russian patriotic site.




          Why so much aggression? Read carefully the investigation materials of the accident-Kursk- there is enough information about the level of crew training-Kursk-. Give examples of heroism of the crew-Kursk-, with a brief description of the feat. Everyone knows about the self-control of the group commander Kaptan-Lieutenant Kolesnikov.
      2. 31231
        31231 25 September 2013 22: 07 New
        0
        Dear, when I served in our battalion only on commander’s BRMKs, Behakhs and armored personnel carriers the radios worked. I thought this was a scribe.
        But then, when I came into production and worked in Russia, I can confidently say "The Russian man will survive this and eliminate it!" Because, although we are careless, we are not lacking in talent and applied experience.
        1. gunnerminer
          gunnerminer 25 September 2013 22: 21 New
          0
          But then, when I came into production and worked in Russia, I can confidently say "The Russian man will survive this and eliminate it!" Because, although we are careless, we are not lacking in talent and applied experience.




          Does anyone dare to say the opposite? The Russian peasant is constantly lucky with all the authorities and regimes with command and leaders. There is such a song, “The Island of Bad Luck” from the 1968 comedy film “The Diamond Arm”, shot by director A. Gaidai. In that song, the text on this subject. Perhaps you have never seen this movie.
  • Strong
    Strong 25 September 2013 20: 10 New
    0
    Quote: gunnerminer
    What can a funny ship grouping do, the basis of which is the BDK that has served all terms?


    BDK can carry weapons. Only a wild romantic will risk looking at them, which at best will not stay in place later.

    You do not count on a full sea battle? Why is it needed by all of us living on Earth?
    1. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 25 September 2013 20: 26 New
      +1
      BDK can carry weapons. Only a wild romantic will risk looking at them, which at best will not stay in place later.

      You do not count on a full sea battle? Why is it needed by all of us living on Earth?



      This is not about using the BDK for transporting any goods. The need to find a fun group of Russian ships in the Mediterranean is discussed. The situation in Syria and the eastern part of the Mediterranean Sea can change in a matter of hours. Ships of any fleet, any country should be in the appointed degree combat readiness around the clock. And do not rely on chance or that the enemy will be scared of their presence alone. Fighting can begin at any time, regardless of the wishes of network commentators. The same doubts were in preparation for the Iraqi and especially Libyan campaigns.
      1. chushoj
        chushoj 25 September 2013 20: 54 New
        0
        Some strange psychology has developed among modern people who, without exception, virtually all occupy the post of chief accountant in the Ministry of Defense. Counts the mass of missiles against the mass of air defense. You can not do it this way.
  • Strong
    Strong 25 September 2013 20: 14 New
    +1
    It's fun to read the comments about "God forbid what kind of rocket will fly towards the ship's order !! 111"

    Like Tomahawks fly to ships and can be used against ships. And let the anti-ship missiles - again, where such courageous will you find on both sides of the barricades? :)
  • coserg 2012
    coserg 2012 25 September 2013 21: 27 New
    0
    Normal article. The main thing, after so many years, the fleet set in motion north, east, south. Men will gain experience, and there the new equipment will arrive in time.
  • NEXUS
    NEXUS 25 September 2013 23: 27 New
    +4
    good night gentlemen and comrades ... the article is interesting, as well as the comments on it ... but in my opinion, one of the deepest points was missed in everything said above ... I think that the Russian squadron off the coast of Syria is not a one-time measure .. . recall the 5 squadron of the times of the USSR ... in that region it served on a regular basis ... the conflict in Syria gave Russia first its presence by several ships, and now the grouping has slightly increased ... the feeling is that Russia is returning the lost in 90 's influence in the region, and does it very successfully ... Yu, no, I am convinced that the formed squadron will no longer leave those places, but will only be strengthened by new ships and submarines ... I think this is a revival of the 5 squadron, gentlemen!
    1. gunnerminer
      gunnerminer 26 September 2013 00: 09 New
      0
      one deep point has been missed ... I think that the Russian squadron off the coast of Syria is not a one-time measure ... remember the 5 squadron from the times of the USSR ... in that region it served on an ongoing basis ... conflict



      What to return? Pay attention to the composition of the squadron and the age of the ships. Each year, the naval composition of the Russian Navy is reduced, the motor resources of the main and auxiliary resources of the ships are reduced. This group is at sea with virtually no support. Without aviation support, without full rear support (no universal ships supply, there are no hospital courts), without bases, without intelligence. The limited capabilities of the RZK-Priazovye are not enough for the entire group.
      1. poquello
        poquello 26 September 2013 02: 31 New
        +1
        Quote: gunnerminer
        The limited capabilities of the RZK-Priazovye are not enough for the entire group.


        From bad luck, no one is talking about the Sea of ​​Azov to argue with you.
        1. gunnerminer
          gunnerminer 26 September 2013 12: 30 New
          0
          From bad luck, no one is talking about the Sea of ​​Azov to argue with you.





          They want to argue, they want not to argue. This is a blog, not a discussion at a party meeting. There are arguments that argue, there are no arguments, they just shout.
          1. poquello
            poquello 26 September 2013 22: 22 New
            +1
            Quote: gunnerminer

            They want to argue, they want not to argue. This is a blog, not a discussion at a party meeting. There are arguments that argue, there are no arguments, they just shout.


            Such arguments as yours I quoted above.
  • shalk
    shalk 27 September 2013 00: 11 New
    0
    Quote: Postman
    Quote: krasin
    4 sighting tomahawks were also shot down, and one F-22 was also shot down.
    "Where did the firewood come from"?
    Quote: krasin
    to recall the facts of losses in Iraq and they were not very small there - 600 aircraft and 400 pieces of armored vehicles from the NATO coalition were lost.
    ??? cool
    all involved
    1700 units of armored vehicles
    1100 helicopters
    420 deck and 540 land group aircraft total 960


    And these figures, of course, directly from the Pentagon. As children, ...