Military Review

“The question now is whether there is Russia at all in the Arctic!”

60
The 11-th International Exhibition and Conference on the Development of Oil and Gas Resources of the Russian Arctic and the Continental Shelf of the CIS Countries (RAO / CIS Offshore) opened in St. Petersburg. We remind you that the deputy chairman of the Russian government, Dmitry Rogozin, recently said that if Russia does not enter the Arctic, others will do it. “The Arctic is great reserves, which, in the context of reduced access to energy, will increasingly attract great countries,” the deputy prime minister added. Especially for "AN" to the question "There is nowhere to retreat - is the Arctic behind us?" Answer ...


Anatoly Sitnov, Deputy Head of the Commission of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs for the Military-Industrial Complex, Former Chief of Armaments of the Armed Forces of Russia (1994-2000), Colonel-General of the Reserve:

“If in the Barents Sea they sold 175 thousand sq. kilometers along with Svalbard, then maybe they sold something else ... "

- In Soviet times, the Arctic was the main object of study. This concerned the movement of ice, and their melting, and undercurrents, but the continuation of the Eurasian and American platforms was mainly studied.

The question now is whether there is Russia at all in the Arctic! After all, they push us out just from everywhere. So from the point of view of state policy, Rogozin announces that he has long been announced. We have abandoned the Arctic, and now we are launching an offensive.

If you raise history When the Shtokman field began to be sold to the West, it turned out that the North had already been divided among themselves by the powerful. If anyone remembers, there was a meeting in which the United States, the Netherlands, Norway and England participated, who, without Russia's participation, determined what to do in the North Sea.

But the Eurasian platform of Russia is the main one in the fields in the north, and, of course, it’s simply impossible to give it to someone else’s order! And what should we do?

I recently passed MAKS-2013, and in order for us to have the right to call the North ours, we need Mig-31, Tu-160 and everything else - and without that nothing will happen.

But if we talk about mining in general, then it probably makes sense to think about whether there were any additional agreements that we do not know about. And if in the Barents Sea sold 175 thousand square meters. kilometers together with Svalbard, then maybe they sold something else. Although no one knows about this. Therefore, the statements of Rogozin that we should return to the Arctic are just nonsense! After all, we never left it.

And do not talk about the need to restore the Northern Sea Route, linking the Far East with the center. It is necessary to restore the presence in the north, to restore the radar field, airfields, etc. For conversations about the "pantry" that is there, already just crammed!

Maybe we are ready to give all this to America and China? No, I doubt that we can go for it! Today’s President Vladimir Vladimirovich, I think, will not allow this.

So do not “go back” anywhere. It is necessary to continue the work and development of the Arctic region of Russia.

Vladimir Rubanov, a member of the presidium of the Council on foreign and defense policy, the former head of the analytical department of the KGB of the USSR:

“If someone craves money, he will have money and nothing but money”

- Decisions should be made by politicians who think not in terms of the benefits of today, but in historical categories. But power is now with the holders of resources, and the security forces are forced to work according to the rules developed by these holders.

The dominance of the security forces in symbiosis with officials focused solely on serving their own profits, leads to the ousting of the creative apparatus from the state apparatus.

But a region like the Arctic cannot be approached only from the point of view of economic interests: they say, how much we invest, how much we get, etc.

If someone desires money, he will have money and nothing but money. This is roughly the current situation: there is money, there are no ideas, there are no people, and there is no creative resource.

Until the state has a creative idea, until the realization that creative people make up the salt of the earth wins, nothing will come of it. So far as the Arctic is concerned, it’s primarily about Russia's prestige ...

Leonid Ivashov, President of the Academy of Geopolitical Problems, Doctor of Historical Sciences, Colonel-General of the Reserve:

“If we don’t have military force there, they will take away everything”

- The Arctic is a huge accumulation of resources, so there will be a rather tough debate about the ownership of these hydrocarbon reserves. If we do not defend this region with the help of military force, then ships will simply come there first and take this territory under protection, then various “exploration” companies will appear, etc. And we will write to the UN ...

I think that in the near future there will be a powerful political and legal dispute with the use of economic levers and the possibility of some demonstration of the armed forces. Of course, the parties claiming these stocks simply overestimate the bar of their positions so that later in some kind of compromise agreement, they say, to get their share.

And, nevertheless, in the polar circle today we need to build a certain balance of power, perhaps involving China, which is in dire need of resources. And if we don’t have military force there, they will take everything away.

Gennady Schmal, President of the Union of Oil and Gas Industrialists of Russia:

“... both for own needs and for Europe”

- In the Barents Sea, we still have an 10% explored structure, and in other northern regions even less ... But only one Shtokman field has more than 3 trillion. cubic meters of gas, that is, you can easily extract 100 billion a year, and the field on the Yamal Peninsula shelf generally contains about 11 trillion. cubes.

That is, there it is possible to produce such volumes of gas, which we lack both for our own needs and for the supply of Europe.
Originator:
http://argumenti.ru/live/2013/09/282989
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  1. Peaceful military
    Peaceful military 14 September 2013 06: 51
    14
    The Arctic is a key region for the strategic defense of Russia from the main geopolitical "partner" and a colossal economic development potential, at least in the form of the Northern Sea Route.
    One of the crimes of the liberals and the comprador nomenclature is the destruction of the Russian Arctic exploration.
    WHEN WILL THIS BACHANALY STOP ALREADY ?!
    1. a52333
      a52333 14 September 2013 07: 17
      11
      Come on, it’s straight to escalate the panic. No one else years 25 for production there will not undertake. We have an icebreaking fleet only. Extraction with modern technologies there is unprofitable. Of course, you need to put the columns, but you should not go down to hysteria at this second.
      1. not good
        not good 14 September 2013 11: 50
        +6
        China, by the way, is trying to build its icebreaking fleet, and recently drove its parachute along the Northern Sea Route, why would it.
        1. a52333
          a52333 14 September 2013 12: 33
          +4
          Let them try! Where are you trying to shade their place?
          1. not good
            not good 14 September 2013 20: 45
            +2
            Shade? -No, cross-yes.
          2. sub307
            sub307 15 September 2013 23: 05
            0
            And, how cool it would have been if you hadn’t decided to part with Alaska at one time.
        2. varov14
          varov14 14 September 2013 20: 53
          0
          The main thing is to quickly drown, so they did not have time to squeak.
        3. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich 15 September 2013 03: 56
          +1
          to the fact that it’s faster to Europe and we are not sickly paid for wiring.
        4. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 11: 36
          +4
          Quote: Negoro
          China, by the way, is trying to build its icebreaking fleet, and recently drove its parachute along the Northern Sea Route, why would it.

          In order to drive a ship along SevMorPuti, one must obtain permission from Russia.
          The presence of icebreakers in China ALMOST means nothing.
      2. Siberian German
        Siberian German 14 September 2013 15: 26
        -2
        but the problem is that they are developing these technologies and we don’t hear something
        1. a52333
          a52333 14 September 2013 21: 23
          +2
          Prirazlomnaya offshore ice-resistant stationary platform (MLSP) is an ice-resistant oil platform designed for the development of the Prirazlomnoye field in the Pechora Sea. Registered in the registry of ships of the port of Naryan-Mar [1]. The uniqueness of the platform is determined by the arctic conditions in which it has to work. Manufacturer Sevmash no one else does it yet.

          Negoro (1) Today, 20: 45 ↑ New
          Shade? -No, cross-yes. + To you. Similarly. I led the thought to that, there really is someone to claim, except in the Arctic countries is unrealistic.
          1. sso-xnumx
            sso-xnumx 14 September 2013 23: 21
            +3
            And where is the Pechora Sea?
            1. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 11: 49
              +4
              Quote: sso-250659
              And where is the Pechora Sea?


              East of Cape Kanin Nos.
          2. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 11: 48
            +9
            Quote: a52333
            The uniqueness of the platform is determined by the arctic conditions in which it has to work. Sevmash producer no one else does

            "Uniqueness" of the platform you say?
            1. Popularly nicknamed "putinka". In the last scheduled repairs in Murmansk, funds were allocated for it, like a grit, unmeasured. Bonuses received by contractors of all levels, on the occasion of the "early" completion of the renovation, is comparable to the annual budget of the provincial city.
            2. After the repair, the tower was towed to the Shtokman, where it started to work with a team of Sevmash workers on board - to correct and eliminate "flaws". "Posleremont" lasted about 2,5 months.
            3. The next platform ("Medvedevka" laughing ), who came to repair in Murmansk, did not have enough funds - all were selected.
            4. Remember the tragedy of towing the same platform in the Sea of ​​Okhotsk last year.

            Summary... EVERYTHING that is achieved by really hard work of hard workers and sailors is successfully "covered" by laziness, greed, incompetence, and most importantly - by the lack of jurisdiction of thieves in management structures
      3. Garrin
        Garrin 14 September 2013 17: 43
        +4
        Quote: a52333
        We have an icebreaking fleet only.

        Canada is building an icebreaker fleet. Moreover, the military.
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 11: 50
          +4
          Quote: Garrin
          Canada is building an icebreaker fleet. Moreover, the military.

          In all Western countries, icebreakers - a military-laden fleet operate under the flag of the Navy of their countries.
      4. a52333
        a52333 14 September 2013 22: 36
        +2
        Yes, by the way about the columns, I remembered that they had been standing for a long time wink Russian polar explorers are celebrating their triumph: from now on, members of the Arctic-2007 expedition have a well-deserved right to call themselves the conquerors of the Arctic depths. On Thursday, the researchers made a unique dive to the bottom of the Arctic Ocean near the North Pole in the Mir-1 and Mir-2 bathyscaphes and successfully returned to the surface. With them aboard the research vessel "Akademik Fedorov" they raised soil samples, the analysis of which can expand the territory of our country to the northernmost point of the planet.
    2. Reasonable, 2,3
      Reasonable, 2,3 14 September 2013 08: 33
      +1
      Stop the panic! We have everything there!. Another thing, they want to take away. Here are all the questions for Mr. Putin and Co.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 14 September 2013 09: 34
        +4
        I fully support the a52333, the most powerful icebreaker fleet, only we have the more nuclear one, there aren’t any more, the laying of new atomic icebreakers of ice class vessels. definitely we are ahead of everyone. With such a length of the coastline, any movement without our knowledge and permission can lead to grave consequences for the intruder. Well, as an example, the Yakuts with Evenks will embark on the path of piracy laughing
        1. a52333
          a52333 14 September 2013 21: 42
          +2
          AHA, and floating nuclear power plants:
          Floating nuclear power plant (floating nuclear power plant, FNPP) is a Russian project for the creation of small mobile floating nuclear power plants developed by the Federal Atomic Energy Agency of Russia, the Baltiysky Zavod OJSC, the Malaya Energetika OJSC and other organizations.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 11: 52
            +4
            Quote: a52333
            AHA, and floating nuclear power plants:

            On the occasion of the permanent mess at SevMashPredpriyatie, and at "Zvezdochka" as well, the project is under the cloth.
            And Tolyan-Red on which oil will be smeared?
    3. Gari
      14 September 2013 12: 52
      +2
      Quote: Peaceful military
      The Arctic is a key region for the strategic defense of Russia from the main geopolitical "partner" and a colossal economic development potential, at least in the form of the Northern Sea Route.

      The largest hydrocarbon deposits have been discovered in coastal and international waters. According to available estimates, their reserves in the north of the Yamal Peninsula, the Gydan Peninsula, in the Gulf of Ob and Taz, and on the shelf of the Kara Sea amount to seven billion tons.
      All rough diamond reserves are concentrated in the Russian Arctic, including 29% in the Aikhal region of Yakutia and 21% in the Arkhangelsk region.

      From Hamburg (Germany) to Yokohama (Japan) along the Northern Sea Route - 12 thousand km, and through the Suez Canal - 20,5 thousand km.
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 11: 54
        +5
        Quote: Gari
        All rough diamond reserves are concentrated in the Russian Arctic, including 29% in the Aikhal region of Yakutia and 21% in the Arkhangelsk region.

        "SeveroAlmaz" does not pay "a penny" to the treasury of the Arkhangelsk region.
        The city is gradually turning into a "ghost".
      2. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 12: 25
        +5
        Quote: Gari
        From Hamburg (Germany) to Yokohama (Japan) along the Northern Sea Route - 12 thousand km, and through the Suez Canal - 20,5 thousand km.


        Navigation on SevMorPuti begins in late June, and continues until the end of October.
        Support is required for a powerful icebreaking flotilla. So the commercial side is a big question.
        Ships sailing along the SevMorPuti must correspond to the ice class not lower than 1, and such were in a scanty number, and now they are rare.
        "Walking" on merchant ships in ice, even under icebreaker escort, is a whole science. You can already count such professionals on one hand.
        1. Gari
          15 September 2013 15: 51
          0
          Quote: stalkerwalker
          Navigation on SevMorPuti begins in late June, and continues until the end of October.

          “The Northern Sea Route is the national transport artery of Russia,” said Artur Chilingarov, President of the State Polar Academy, Hero of the Soviet Union and the Russian Federation, during a visit to Chukotka. “The State Duma is preparing to consider a bill defining the status and basic principles of using this most important transport artery. that this initiative is actively supported by both the President and the Prime Minister of the Russian Federation, who understand the importance of the Arctic for Russia.

          Today, the revival of the Northern Sea Route has begun: last year, a tanker with a cargo of gas condensate to China passed this route. The piloting of another tanker with a large displacement is planned for this navigation. It is also planned to restore the polar stations providing hydrographic and navigation support. At the end of November, we created the North Pole 38 drifting station, which is located about 1000 km northeast of Pevek. The Ministry of Emergencies takes an active position on this issue, which involves the construction of centers in the northern ports, including Pevek and Provideniya, to provide necessary assistance in the event of ice problems during the transportation of goods along the Northern Sea Route.

          The revival of heavy traffic along the Arctic route is also facilitated by climatic changes in recent years. Observations show that Arctic ice cover is generally declining. Previously, the Northern Sea Route was impossible to go in one navigation, now it is not a problem. It was also previously impossible for a vessel with an ice belt, but not belonging to the class of icebreakers, to reach the point of the North Pole. Now there are such cases. All indications are that climate mitigation is underway. And you need to watch them. In turn, the observation network provides for the organization of polar stations, which previously were more than a hundred in the Arctic. If we restore at least 40, then this will be enough to create reliable scientific and operational support for navigation along the Northern Sea Route. ”
  2. Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 14 September 2013 07: 11
    +6
    hi Russia should not concede the Arctic with its hydrocarbon reserves to anyone.
    Judging by the latest actions, she (Russia) is not going to do this. I mean the actions of the Northern Fleet Squadron, led by the Peter the Great, a heavy nuclear missile cruiser, which took part in a campaign along the Arctic route, defending Russia's status as a leading Arctic power. good soldier
    1. Hleb
      Hleb 14 September 2013 07: 27
      +7
      Judging by recent actions, she (Russia) is not going to do this
      are you here on the forum to such a conclusion?

      The Ministry of Defense told about brigades to protect the interests of the Russian Federation in the Arctic
      http://topwar.ru/18817-v-minoborony-rasskazali-o-brigadah-dlya-zaschity-intereso



      v-rf-v-arktike.html

      The Russian Ministry of Defense has taken up the creation of Arctic brigades. Arctic troops will be created by 2015
      http://topwar.ru/11809-ministerstvo-oborony-rossii-vzyalos-za-sozdanie-arktiches



      kih-brigad.html

      The beginning of the revival of the Russian icebreaking fleet laid
      http://topwar.ru/20879-nachalo-vozrozhdeniyu-rossiyskogo-ledokolnogo-flota-poloz



      heno.html

      The construction of nuclear icebreakers LC-60 given the green light
      http://topwar.ru/32334-stroitelstvu-atomnyh-ledokolov-lk-60-dan-zelenyy-svet.htm
      l

      With the new technology for the Arctic brigades, the Commander-in-Chief of the Land Forces of the Russian Federation got acquainted in the Arctic
      http://topwar.ru/25449-s-novoy-tehnikoy-dlya-arkticheskih-brigad-glavnokomanduyu



      schiy-suhoputnymi-voyskami-rf-oznakomilsya-v-zapolyare.html

      Russian submarine fleet in the Arctic will be increased
      http://topwar.ru/8482-rossiyskiy-podvodnyy-flot-v-arktike-budet-uvelichen.html
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 14 September 2013 07: 34
        +6
        Quote: Gleb
        are you here on the forum to such a conclusion?

        Constantly such nonsense, at first they will read ten articles on this topic, which say what is being done for development and people shout correctly. Then an article is similar and the same ones say, well, we’ll shove the Arctic. There is no logic.
        1. TRex
          TRex 14 September 2013 19: 00
          +2
          We cherish - we do not cherish ... I do not know. I’ll report the exact figure: in the 80 of the last century, the population of the New Earth amounted to 10 thousand, today barely two thousand are typed. So draw conclusions.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 12: 30
            +4
            Quote: TRex
            So draw conclusions.

            The people "vote with their feet."
            In the same 80 and 90, up to 1,5 million cubic meters of saw-timber were exported from Igarka by ships of all north-western companies.
            Today Igarka is a ghost town. Vessels - sold or scrapped (due to age), or "there". What is left cannot be called a fleet. Or ashamed.
      2. Rif
        Rif 14 September 2013 19: 14
        0
        "The Ministry of Defense has resumed Russia's permanent military presence in the Arctic" - http://topwar.ru/33344-minoborony-vozobnovilo-postoyannoe-voennoe-prisutstvie-ro
        ssii-v-arktike.html
  3. serge-68-68
    serge-68-68 14 September 2013 07: 59
    +1
    The fact that the USSR was engaged in Arctic research did not make it Soviet. International laws apply to this territory. And they did it right that 10 years ago they were preoccupied with substantiating Russia's right to a piece of the Arctic as a continuation of Russian land. However, it appears that no conclusive evidence has been obtained.
    And I think that it was not today's Russia that "lost the Arctic", and it was not "lost" either. She simply was not "picked up" on time, when no one needed the whole XX century. And when they remembered about gas, etc. - it was already late. But if they would have picked it up in time, according to the principle of the Kuril ridge, then now they could respond with a clever air to the claims (like the Japanese): "Guys, we understand everything, but we can't give it back - people won't understand ... Maybe in a hundred years ? "
    1. wax
      wax 14 September 2013 12: 53
      +2
      In fact, Stalin "picked up" not only the Arctic (along the meridians from the extreme land-sea borders in the west and east), but ALL of Antarctica. The necessary diplomatic steps, backed by the might of the Soviet armed forces, were taken in a timely manner and with an eye to the future.
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 15 September 2013 12: 44
        +4
        Quote: Wax
        In fact, Stalin "picked up" not only the Arctic (along the meridians from the extreme land-sea borders in the west and east), but ALL of Antarctica. The necessary diplomatic steps, backed by the might of the Soviet armed forces, were taken in a timely manner and with an eye to the future.

        It is absolutely true that the Arctic borders of the USSR were recognized by all countries, and the Northern Sea Route until the 1991 of the year was the internal route of the USSR.
        Judah Benya Reltsyn began to launch all kinds of trash into the Russian Arctic, so that the devils would fry and freeze the villain.
  4. individual
    individual 14 September 2013 08: 47
    11
    Quote:
    "That is, it is possible to extract such volumes of gas there, which we do not have enough for our own needs, and to ensure Europe ".

    This is the problem of those in power - money at all costs.
    When solving the issue of Arctic reserves, even the authors write not about the need for internal energy supplies, but about providing Europe.
    Even if Europe itself is concerned about its problems, they have no gas and electricity infrastructure in either the village or the city. What can you say about Russia.
    The result of cutting coupons from the sale of energy is visible in offshore, where the capital of our nouveau riche settles.
    And the Russian hinterland heats its apartments on the model of the 18-19th century.
    For our "financial" upstarts there is no homeland, there is only a price of $.
    Therefore, DAM without hesitation sold a piece of the shelf of Norway without discussion in parliament and among the people.
    These are the dealers who rule Russia, the dealers of imperialist capital.
  5. pahom54
    pahom54 14 September 2013 09: 14
    +2
    The fact that someone is dividing the Arctic behind our (Russian) backs is, of course, regrettable ... However, this whole division has not yet taken the form of some kind of international legislation, and it is not too late for Russia to "stake out" its territory. And she does this - brigades are being created for combat operations in the Far North, the passage of a detachment of combat ships with icebreakers, the planned modernization and construction of new Tu-160s, the construction of new nuclear submarines designed for operations in an ice situation - is this not an indicator that Russia will not give up so easily?
    I do not think that Norway-Holland, as well as England-USA, are ready, can and willing to fight for the Arctic economic zone with the use of armed forces (for now, at least), and if Russia hurries up and intensifies its defense and economic forces, then and these "desires" will think a hundred times about whether it is worth getting into this showdown. Even geographically, the Arctic borders on Russia, but not on England and the United States, and they have no way to get in here.
    And if you officially stake out your territories in the Arctic, then various "international" exploration parties have no place there.
    1. zanoza
      zanoza 14 September 2013 10: 12
      +4
      Quote: pahom54
      And she does this - brigades are being created for fighting in the Far North, the passage of the BATTLE ships with icebreakers, the planned modernization and construction of new Tu-160s, the construction of new nuclear submarines designed for operations in ice conditions - is this not an indication that Russia its so easy not to give up?

      There were brigades, there were divisions in the Far North, and practically all the northern archipelagos were "populated" by the military (air defense), and nuclear submarines have repeatedly surfaced at the North Pole. It was ... but just ... in the 90s and 00s, we didn't see threats, you know, in that region.
      Now they "woke up" and decided to revive everything or almost everything, BUT it will be expensive to recreate the lost infrastructure on a new basis (even there they were able to hand over everything for scrap and take away), maintain and provide. "Only by plane (helicopter) can you fly ...", only by steamer (they were also allowed to use metal) you can bring EVERYTHING ...And do it!
      I will specify. The USA has Alaska and, accordingly, access to the Arctic. We have a common sea border with them, neighbors - however ...
      1. wax
        wax 14 September 2013 12: 58
        -3
        This is where the Mistrals come in the future.
        1. rsnv
          rsnv 14 September 2013 15: 15
          +4
          Mistrals will not work, they will freeze there immediately.
          1. densh
            densh 14 September 2013 21: 13
            +3
            These won't freeze
  6. Michael_59
    Michael_59 14 September 2013 09: 19
    0
    Yeltsin's gang on trial!

    Until everyone sells.
  7. individual
    individual 14 September 2013 09: 30
    0
    In the Arctic, contradictions between countries are exposed:
    "The power of diplomacy, against the power of arms."
    Who will win?
  8. chunga-changa
    chunga-changa 14 September 2013 09: 48
    +3
    There are territorial waters -12 miles. There is an exclusive economic zone of 200 miles. There are international waters. To the Arctic Ocean, this also applies. Another thing is that international waters are almost constantly covered with ice, but when the ice comes down shipping will be carried out on a common basis.
    Here the question of expanding our exclusive economic zone over 200 miles, there are loopholes, they are trying. Delimitation of fishing zones at the junction of 200 miles with zones of other states (Norway). The most important thing is the establishment of sovereignty over the Wrangel Islands, Novosibirsk and Franz Josef Land. We have a base on Novaya Zemlya, there are no questions. And it will be like China, they declared the islands controversial, sailed, built a city, everything, the rest bite their elbows. The F-I land is of strategic importance, most of the trajectories of ballistic missiles pass over it. And yet, states with access to the Arctic Ocean intend to share water among themselves, but so far they cannot agree, America is not happy with the size of its zone. States that do not have a way out against such a division object, they also want to.
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 14 September 2013 21: 41
      +2
      Quote: chunga-changa
      Another thing is that international waters are almost constantly covered with ice, but when the ice comes down shipping will be carried out on a common basis.
      ... states with access to the Arctic Ocean intend to share water among themselves, but so far they cannot agree, America is not happy with the size of its zone. States that do not have a way out against such a division object, they also want to.

      When the ice comes down in the Arctic, no one will say for sure, but certainly not earlier than through 2-3 for thousands of years or through 2-3 million years. There is time to prepare for defense.
      Let the states want, even until the blue face, there is nothing to do without icebreakers in the Arctic, and only Russia has them, no country in the world can do icebreakers, and they can’t afford most countries, just like oil offshore platforms and drilling rigs and a drill for drilling the bottom at great depths.
      1. chunga-changa
        chunga-changa 15 September 2013 00: 28
        +1
        For example, right now, Peter with icebreakers near the Novosibirsk Islands, and near the north of the Earth F.I. our hydrographic expedition without icebreakers, look at the map, where to go even further. America has icebreakers, but not atomic ones, but they take 2 meters of ice. We ordered icebreakers in Finland, are able to build? China intends to build its icebreakers. The rest do not need them yet, but I’ll surely need them — they will build it.
        1. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 15 September 2013 12: 00
          +2
          Quote: chunga-changa
          For example, right now, Peter with icebreakers near the Novosibirsk Islands, and near the north of the Earth F.I. our hydrographic expedition without icebreakers, look at the map, where to go even further. America has icebreakers, but not atomic ones, but they take 2 meters of ice. We ordered icebreakers in Finland, are able to build? China intends to build its icebreakers. The rest do not need them yet, but I’ll surely need them — they will build it.

          The navigation period along the Northern Sea Route is 2-4 of the month in different sections (from June-July to September-October) so it is not surprising that the ships are now reaching the Western Federal District and the Novosibirsk Islands.
          The thickness of the ice in the Arctic exceeds 2-2.5 m, new icebreakers in Russia will have an ice penetration of 3.5 m.
          Ice conditions change according to cyclical climate changes with the duration of the cycles 11-15, 30-45, 100-300 years, depending on solar activity. There were periods when the Pomors reached Chukotka during the summer, and it happened that they could not reach Grumant (Svalbard) because of the ice.
          So for foreigners, the Arctic has many surprises.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 13: 06
            +5
            Quote: Corsair5912
            The thickness of the ice in the Arctic exceeds 2-2.5 m, new icebreakers in Russia will have an ice penetration of 3.5 m.
            Ice conditions change according to cyclical climate changes with the duration of the cycles 11-15, 30-45, 100-300 years, depending on solar activity. There were periods when the Pomors reached Chukotka during the summer, and it happened that they could not reach Grumant (Svalbard) because of the ice.

            ++++!
      2. strannik595
        strannik595 15 September 2013 12: 00
        +1
        no country in the world can do icebreakers
        When the ice goes down in the Arctic, no one will say for sure, but certainly not earlier than through 2-3 for thousands of years or through 2-3 million years
        ......... The ship is a legend, was built in England in the 1917 year, in the 2017 year the Krasin will celebrate its centenary. It was he who in 1928 participated in the operation to rescue the expedition of Umberto Nobile to the North Pole on the airship "Italy" .....build icebreakers not we first started (The world's first Arctic icebreaker was Ermak, built at the Armstrong Whitworth shipyard (1898 year — operated by the Baltic Fleet until 1964 year). Svyatogor was built in 1917 year (it bears Krasin name from 1927 year) and we are not the only ones who can build them ....... so we don’t have very much time
        1. Misantrop
          Misantrop 15 September 2013 12: 12
          +1
          Quote: strannik595
          we were not the first to build icebreakers and we are not the only ones who can build them
          We open Wiki (not to rummage far) and read:
          Ship for the Russian fleet on the improved project of the Makarov "Ermak", under building number 904, was laid in early 1916 on the stocks of the English company WG Armstrong, Whitworth & Co. Ltd. in Newcastle, launched on August 3 of the same year, was being completed at Middlesboro.
          Please note that you did not "come to the salon and bought a finished product", but ORDERED according to YOUR project. And the specific manufacturer is not too important, in this case he acts as an employee request
          1. strannik595
            strannik595 15 September 2013 12: 28
            0
            why not built at home? not every employee will make an Arctic icebreaker, this is not a shovel to do, do you agree?
            1. Misantrop
              Misantrop 15 September 2013 12: 53
              +1
              Quote: strannik595
              why not built at home?
              And then what were all the shipyards in Russia busy with? In 1916, that year, a few years after Tsushima ...
        2. Corsair5912
          Corsair5912 15 September 2013 12: 31
          +2
          Quote: strannik595
          no country in the world can do icebreakers
          When the ice goes down in the Arctic, no one will say for sure, but certainly not earlier than through 2-3 for thousands of years or through 2-3 million years
          ......... The ship is a legend, was built in England in the 1917 year, in the 2017 year the Krasin will celebrate its centenary. It was he who in 1928 participated in the operation to rescue the expedition of Umberto Nobile to the North Pole on the airship "Italy" .....build icebreakers not we first started (The world's first Arctic icebreaker was Ermak, built at the Armstrong Whitworth shipyard (1898 year — operated by the Baltic Fleet until 1964 year). Svyatogor was built in 1917 year (it bears Krasin name from 1927 year) and we are not the only ones who can build them ....... so we don’t have very much time

          Before building an icebreaker, it must be designed, and this is far from accessible to every shipbuilding company. Moreover, the main equipment is installed according to the projects and under the guidance of the customer.
          1. strannik595
            strannik595 15 September 2013 13: 09
            0
            I agree with your arguments ...... I'm not a shipbuilder, but somewhere very deeply there is a doubt that the atomic icebreaker is more difficult to design and build than an atomic aircraft carrier with catapults
            1. AlNikolaich
              AlNikolaich 15 September 2013 14: 10
              +2
              Quote: strannik595
              I agree with your arguments ...... I'm not a shipbuilder, but somewhere very deeply there is a doubt that the atomic icebreaker is more difficult to design and build than an atomic aircraft carrier with catapults

              Apparently not harder ... But there is a nuance! An icebreaker is an engineering of a completely different level than an aircraft carrier. One strength calculation of the case is worth it! Plus the power plant, superactive screws, cooling system. Protection against violent vibrations and shock. In short, aerobatics based on many years of experience in construction and operation. Not everyone is given, in short ...
              1. strannik595
                strannik595 15 September 2013 16: 35
                0
                I agree with you that the American and British shipbuilders are so stupid, despite all of their Silicon Valley resources, that they are never given the opportunity to make a strength calculation of the hull ....... only research institutes in Moscow and St. Petersburg are capable of this. .... vivat Russia, we still have a couple of millennia to protect our Arctic from western predators drinks
  9. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 14 September 2013 12: 06
    +1
    Yes, Siberia is a huge pantry of minerals. But these resources are being spent today at a tremendous pace. What's next? How will our descendants live? It seems that the current ruling and economic elites in Russia do not think about it. Why are the huge volumes of extracted gas and oil in no way affecting the development of high-tech industries?
    The exercises of the Northern Fleet ships in the Arctic conducted in September indicate that Russia pays great attention to the Arctic region. Many countries (even those far from the Arctic) pay attention to the huge energy reserves of this region. So, Russia should not miss the initiative in the development of the Arctic shelf.
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 14 September 2013 21: 53
      +1
      Quote: Ivanovich47
      Yes, Siberia is a huge pantry of minerals.

      The usual misconception of the profane.
      There are no storerooms in Siberia, most of the deposits are either not explored, that is, there is no data on the technological properties of p.i. and the conditions of their occurrence, or referred to off-balance sheet, that is, their development will not bring anything but losses. Many mines with commercial reserves are abandoned and their "resources" are not being consumed at any rate. (According to geological terminology, resources are supposed minerals, the existence of which has not been proven)
      What is being worked out has been explored and mastered in the USSR at the expense of the state budget with loan repayment periods of 25-50 years. Not a single bank in the world on such terms gives a loan of tens of billions of rubles, euros or dollars for exploration and development of deposits.
      So after 15-20 years there will be nothing to mine in Siberia.
      A big polar fox will come to the "pantry".
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 12: 34
        +5
        Quote: Corsair5912
        A big polar fox will come to the "pantry".

        The little arctic fox is already there .... recourse
    2. MstislavHrabr
      MstislavHrabr 15 September 2013 16: 02
      +1
      Mineral extraction in the Arctic is allowed only to companies registered and paying taxes in the Arctic regions ... For every cubic meter of gas produced in the Arctic, give a penny for the improvement of the Arctic coast and islands!
  10. Denis
    Denis 14 September 2013 12: 07
    0
    so that we have the right to call the North our own, we need the Mig-31, Tu-160 and everything else - and without this, there will be nothing.
    They, fortunately, exist. If necessary, you can still release it, although with the MiG-31 it seems to be more difficult
    Only need an icebreaker fleet and nuclear submarines, they would not have been killed
    Gennady Schmal, President of the Union of Oil and Gas Industrialists of Russia:
    "... and for their own needs, to ensure Europe >>
    And for the highlighted need to hang, these ... are happy to sell everything
  11. mithridate
    mithridate 14 September 2013 13: 12
    +2
    the Arctic must be fought with all available means, and not sold with Svalbard
    1. goats denis
      goats denis 14 September 2013 20: 30
      +1
      It’s interesting, but the son of Matvienko will also fight, or only get money by selling quilted jackets, kirzachi, or tail-dresses to the army and navy
  12. major071
    major071 14 September 2013 13: 28
    +6
    You read such articles and become frenzied: how much our shit-democrats and liberalists have managed to do for 20 years! But they live like Christ’s bungle. The main thing is to fill your pocket, and after me at least a flood.
  13. repytw
    repytw 14 September 2013 14: 18
    +4
    My friend lives on Dikson, so with the union there lived 12000 people, now about 600, five-story buildings are empty and so along this coast of the Northern Sea Route. In order for the Arctic to remain ours, it is necessary to develop it economically, so that people live there again, for this it is necessary to have another national project, at least send criminals to settlements there.
    1. MstislavHrabr
      MstislavHrabr 15 September 2013 16: 12
      0
      A camp for the temporary settlement of illegal migrants ... Let them live until they learn the Russian language.
  14. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 14 September 2013 21: 30
    +4
    If we take up the history of the Shtokman field when they started selling it to the West, then it turned out that the North had already been divided among themselves by the powers that be. If anyone remembers, there was a meeting in which the USA, the Netherlands, Norway and England participated, which determined without Russia what to do in the North Sea.

    It would be nice for the author to study geography and talk with at least one oil geologist who worked in the Arctic, then he probably would not have started to write all kinds of nonsense. No one will push us out of the Arctic, the arms are short, there is 2 navigation there month after year, and even then only with icebreakers that no country has except Russia.
    And Russia does not adjoin the North Sea sideways, for what reason the United States, the Netherlands, Norway and England should invite Russia.
  15. NOBODY EXCEPT US
    NOBODY EXCEPT US 14 September 2013 23: 50
    +1
    With geography, many here have very little to say about the North Sea, and Svalbard has been the territory of Norway since the time of the Russian Empire and earlier, we are talking about changing the sea border between Norway and Russia, as a result of which Russia lost a fair amount of land for fishing and mining , and you don’t have to blame everything on DAMA there and the GDP warmed up well in tandem or many people lost their memory .......
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 15 September 2013 12: 37
      +4
      Quote: NOBODY BUT US
      Russia has lost a fair amount of land for fisheries and mining, and you don’t have to blame everything on DAM and the GDP has warmed up well in tandem or many have lost their memory .......

      Have you seen what Russian fishermen are doing in the waters of Grumant-Spitsbergen? Remember the story of the trawler "Electron"?
      Norwegians could not allow such barbaric fishing. Today, ships of the Russian and Norwegian Navy patrol there.
  16. slaventi
    slaventi 15 September 2013 03: 40
    0
    The Ministry of Defense has resumed a permanent Russian military presence in the Arctic by organizing a cruise of a detachment of warships of the Northern Fleet to the Arctic regions of the Northern Sea Route. First Deputy Defense Minister Arkady Bakhin told reporters on Saturday after the conference call held under the leadership of the head of the department Sergei Shoigu about the arrival of the detachment to the western coast of Kotelny Island. He said that Temp airfield will be restored and improved on the Novosibirsk Islands will be able to receive aircraft An-72 and An-74.
    Come back!
  17. Evgeniy667b
    Evgeniy667b 15 September 2013 04: 51
    +1
    Quote:
    Until the state has a creative idea, until the realization that creative people make up the salt of the earth wins, nothing will come of it. So far as the Arctic is concerned, it’s primarily about Russia's prestige ...
    Has anyone seen how Valiant Gazprom is developing the shelf in the Yamal region? Temporary workers are natural, just to choose what they want, and after them, a lifeless desert. All fucked up ...
  18. Backfire
    Backfire 15 September 2013 18: 33
    -1
    Maybe we are ready to give all this to America and China? No, I doubt that we can do this!

    Rzhunimogu.
    "Who are "we? One stick, two strings, I am the master of the whole country ?!

    They are your "elite". They are interested in the next 20 years and the "fit" of their children into the world elite. All. No more.
    Even that "revival" - attempts to do at least something in the field of armaments - is just a desire to take the "proper" place in the world elite. When seated at the table, "yours" are given more and more distant seats. They were worried that soon they might not invite at all. And you are vparivayut these maneuvers under the motto "for Russia."
  19. Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. 16 September 2013 07: 14
    0
    Quote: Backfire
    They were worried that soon they might not invite at all. And you are vparivayut these maneuvers under the motto "for Russia."

    When they are not invited, then they will definitely have to do all the maneuvers under the motto "for Russia." Maybe for the best.