Military Review

Vladivostok in a high degree of readiness

163
The photograph on the web site www.shipspotting.com, taken by 8 September 2013, shows a very high degree of readiness of the landing helicopter ship Mistral in the dry building dock of the STX France shipyard in Saint Nazaire Vladivostok. The withdrawal of Vladivostok from the construction dock of the Saint-Nazaire shipyard is tentatively scheduled for October 15 on 2013.


Vladivostok in a high degree of readiness

The landing helicopter ship dock Vladivostok of the Mistral type under construction for the Russian Navy in the dry construction dock of the STX France shipyard. Saint-Nazaire, 08.09.2013 (c) Christian Plagué / www.shipspotting.com
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  1. elmi
    elmi 9 September 2013 13: 21
    22
    It looks beautiful. Soon another combat unit will replenish the fleet. It would be nice to have Yak-141 vertical take-off aircraft there, of course, after modernization and revival of the Yak-141. In addition to helicopters, aircraft would greatly expand the combat capabilities of the warship.
    1. little man
      little man 9 September 2013 13: 45
      20
      Yes, and drones do not interfere.
      1. Ruslan_F38
        Ruslan_F38 9 September 2013 13: 52
        34
        Quote: man
        to have Yak-141 type vertical take-off aircraft, of course, after the modernization and revival of the Yak-141


        This is an aircraft carrier succeed. But the construction timeline is impressive. If we were building at such a pace, then by 2020 we would not only have frigates in sufficient numbers, but also our own aircraft carriers with escort ships, but we only have to dream of such a situation. God forbid that they would finish building what they planned.
        1. aviator_IAS
          aviator_IAS 9 September 2013 14: 51
          +3
          Quote: Ruslan_F38
          But the construction timeline is impressive. If we built at such a pace


          So it was already half built with us (aft). Of course, this is far from half of the general work. Still a darkness of equipment and mechanisms to install. But St. Petersburg fodder feed quickly. Probably spied on the French something in the assembly technology. Or maybe they updated the shipyard’s production equipment? What else to explain this acceleration?
          1. Tersky
            Tersky 9 September 2013 16: 22
            +9
            Quote: aviator_IAS
            What else to explain this acceleration?

            Rogozin and the investigations of the military prosecutor's office in the military-industrial complex of Russia. Although I hate DAM, but here is his interview with the Swiss newspaper Neue Zurcher Zeitung: Russia is currently investigating 50 criminal cases on corruption offenses, Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev said, stressing that he considers it useful when such cases are captured by television cameras and discussed by civil society. When asked if this is a corruption scandal related to the former Defense Minister Anatoly Serdyukov, signaling a new wave of the fight against corruption, Medvedev noted that "in fact, there are much more corruption scandals."
            .
            Fully here -Http: //newsland.com/news/detail/id/1113305/ To broaden my horizons, I can still recommend-http: //www.newsru.com/world/29jan2013/tidefence.h

            tml
          2. Alexxeg73
            Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 08: 50
            +2
            And what is there to update then? It's just a metal structure. Filling with equipment is already in France. Otherwise, it makes no difference whether it is an icebreaker, a tanker, or a Mistral. Shipbuilding is the most conservative industry. This is exactly how Professor B.A. Tsarev, who led my graduation project, told me.
            1. desava
              desava 10 September 2013 09: 16
              +2
              Quote: Alexxeg73
              Shipbuilding is the most conservative industry.

              More than a controversial statement. The manufacture of durable hulls for submarines requires modern technology. Creation of GAS for them in general from "space" areas. Turbines are tougher than aviation ones according to the manufacturing requirements. Water treatment, power plant, operational safety, weapons, navigation ... Only the use of Archimedes' law can be called conservative.
              1. Alexxeg73
                Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 10: 28
                +2
                All that you have listed (except for the submarine buildings) is just the same equipment. And here we are talking about the construction of the building. And even submarine hulls - excuse 70s technology. Boat "Komsomolets" - remember? The one that sank. Dive depth record. Technology for 40 years. The famous "Losharik" project 10830 - development began back in the 70s. What modern technologies are we talking about? Titanium processing? Again, the 70s. The whole theory of building a ship's hull is based on empirical formulas that were deduced during the reign of Tsar Pea. I myself am a shipbuilding engineer, I designed a tanker. You know, it's hard to believe it, but to start designing it is enough to set the displacement. As for the Mistral, it is an analogue of a ro-ro vessel. Civilian technology. All the salt is in the filling.
                1. desava
                  desava 10 September 2013 11: 12
                  0
                  Quote: Alexxeg73
                  I myself am a shipbuilding engineer

                  It is an honor for me to communicate with a person working in this industry. Because, although I graduated from an institute with a similar specialty (construction and repair of submarines), I work in the field of civil energy.
                  Quote: Alexxeg73
                  The whole theory of building a ship’s hull is based on empirical formulas that were still derived under Tsar Gorokh.

                  The formulas are only designed. But the theory of construction is just developing. At the beginning of the 20th century, a keel was laid and a hull was already attached to it, later blocks of hulls and modules appeared (I may be mistaken in the wording), that is, sections saturated with equipment and ready to join. As for the PC submarine - of course, the design of the changes does not practically undergo, but the fact that the production of these same hulls (shipbuilding equipment, machine tools, access control and landing control systems, etc.) is dragging out is being modernized and improved. No wonder the diameter of a PC can still be made in Russia no more than 10m in diameter.
                  But does the hull shape of modern ships and ships not undergo changes? The same trimarans, catamarans, with a bulbous nasal tip (where half of the ship is a half tank)? The fact that technologies are not being introduced in our country and in the ship and ship industry is not an indicator of their absence. This is an indicator of the lack of motivation, finances and the capabilities of enterprises and managers.
                  1. Alexxeg73
                    Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 11: 49
                    0
                    Unfortunately, at the moment I am not in this industry either. Fate decreed ... But all this topic interests me vividly.
                    There is very little literature on trimarans and catamarans and their design is still in its infancy.
                    All development is now using CAD programs. Including specialized. Here in this technology develops. When the whole structure is developed in a virtual environment and the task for the manufacture of parts goes to automated lines. Welding technologies are also evolving, including again automated cutting and bending lines. And the assembly itself on the slipway is skilled workers and engineers, organization and clear schedules. And you go to the site in the vacancy of the same Baltic plant, where the feed was collected. For such salaries in St. Petersburg it is easier to work in a building materials store.
              2. Alexxeg73
                Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 10: 58
                +1
                Here is the skater. Looks like?
        2. ultra
          ultra 9 September 2013 22: 39
          0
          Quote: Ruslan_F38
          But the construction timeline is impressive.

          good
    2. Civil
      Civil 9 September 2013 14: 07
      +2
      I am personally interested in only 2 systems in this ship, this is the zenith of 9 and engines, everything else we have is also at a decent level, but what is heard about the upgraded Ka-29? Or again, how will the epic be with the struggles?
      1. Pilat2009
        Pilat2009 9 September 2013 16: 37
        0
        Quote: Civil
        it's zenith 9

        Do you really think that IT will be given to us? Even if they give it, then the decryption of the algorithms is unlikely to work before 2020. And there are still bookmarks to the heap
    3. Suhov
      Suhov 9 September 2013 14: 24
      +2
      Quote: elmi
      It looks beautiful. Soon, another combat unit will replenish the fleet.

      Quote: Ruslan_F38
      But the construction timeline is impressive.

      Serdyukov "scoundrel" tried ...
      wassat
      And in Syria, it (the landing helicopter dock "Vladivostok" of the Mistral type) would not be useful to us now, well ...
      wassat
      Anyway, the furniture maker's mission was very "profitable" and "honorable":
      - reduce the army at times
      (this alone contributed to the growth of his "popularity" in the army, and also formed a whole army of "grateful fans"),
      - demand military equipment of the proper level about the military-industrial complex (not just what the military-industrial complex can do, but what the army needs),
      - and that would be cheap,
      - .....
      wassat
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. Suhov
          Suhov 9 September 2013 14: 35
          0
          Quote: vaf
          Here are just who, Furnituremaker, "podvig" .. to fulfill this mission

          The Russian army had to be increased to the size of the PLA!
          wassat
          And that would all tremble!
          1. Suhov
            Suhov 9 September 2013 15: 04
            +3
            Quote: Sukhov
            And that would all tremble!

            Because hungry soldier with sapper shovel - highly scary soldier.
            wassat
            1. ATATA
              ATATA 9 September 2013 16: 51
              +7
              Quote: Sukhov
              The Russian army had to be increased to the size of the PLA!

              Quote: Sukhov
              Because a hungry soldier with a sapper blade is a very scary soldier ...

              And this hungry soldier will guard the government from a hungry people who will hardly feed a hungry soldier in an army the size of the PLA.
              ps
              Well, I think it was a joke on your part? hi
              1. Suhov
                Suhov 9 September 2013 17: 05
                +2
                Quote: ATATA
                Well, I think it was a joke on your part? hi

                Of course!
                hi
              2. Alexxeg73
                Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 08: 54
                0
                "PLA" - are you confused? If you wanted to emphasize the small size of the army, then this is definitely not the PLA. Because that's 2 people on active duty.
          2. demeen1
            demeen1 9 September 2013 19: 10
            +3
            To have an army of 2 million. huge costs are needed, but they are not. And for the soldiers to herd the sheep as a Moldavian fighter, it is better to be at home.9
    4. Sakhalininsk
      Sakhalininsk 9 September 2013 14: 27
      +4
      Quote: elmi
      It looks beautiful. Soon another combat unit will replenish the fleet. It would be nice to have Yak-141 vertical take-off aircraft there, of course, after modernization and revival of the Yak-141. In addition to helicopters, aircraft would greatly expand the combat capabilities of the warship.


      Why make a disgusting aircraft carrier out of a good UDC? Many vertical boxes on this platform can not be delivered anyway, and those that hypothetically can be shoved will devour all useful space.
      Aircraft should be at least on a ship similar in impact capabilities to Kuzey, then this is a real cover.
      1. elmi
        elmi 9 September 2013 15: 13
        +2
        I don’t argue that it’s a good thing to have a full-fledged aircraft carrier, but they don’t build it ... I am with both hands for the construction of aircraft carriers, but either for lack of money, or there is no determination, but they only say and promise to build, and time passes ... Everything but I think that for the first time it is possible to have hybrids of a helicopter carrier with an aircraft carrier, the design can be changed in terms of capacity. Here was an article that, if you wish, you can rebuild transport for aircraft carriers in a short time. power. Having such hybrids of avia there’s already something! The alignment of forces can be substantially changed in our favor in different regions of the planet, but it’s better than having only the 1 aircraft carrier and empty promises to build in plenty.
    5. White
      White 9 September 2013 15: 36
      +5
      In addition to helicopters, it would be nice to have Yak-141 vertical take-off aircraft


      Even if you imagine that Yak will be upgraded and brought up, there is still a question - is the Mistral deck suitable for landing / take-off. Will it not be trite to burn out under the engine jet (there’s a fan in the F-35 instead of lift engines and there are questions)
      1. elmi
        elmi 9 September 2013 18: 50
        +1
        Quote: White
        Even if you imagine that Yak will be upgraded and brought up, there is still a question - is the Mistral deck suitable for landing / take-off. Will it not be trite to burn out under the engine jet (there’s a fan in the F-35 instead of lift engines and there are questions)

        Well, I think our designers will bring to mind the take-off deck, our scientists do not take ingenuity and knowledge.
    6. honest jew
      honest jew 9 September 2013 18: 52
      +2
      Ah yes well done French !!! Such a work of art created !!!
    7. Alekseev
      Alekseev 9 September 2013 19: 51
      0
      Quote: elmi
      In addition to helicopters, it would be nice to have Yak-141 vertical take-off aircraft

      It is good to... yes
      But it will not work to have them there ... No.
      Because the project is not provided, however.
      Yes, and the Yak-141 could not be made consistent with the requirements of the fleet. request
      And it would be nice to build an aircraft carrier like the Japanese "Hyuga" instead of the Mistrals for the same money.
    8. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 10 September 2013 06: 36
      +1
      let me not share your optimism, because this defenseless pelvis, like an aircraft carrier, requires considerable covering forces, this time, and secondly how to apply it and where? in the north, he is not a tenant, in the Baltic and the Black Sea, what the hell is he? and even more so in the Far East ... this is a floating shed! one hit, and there is no shed or helicopters. for that money from him who just didn’t have it ... now everyone understands this but the contract is already in force, and the penalty is even more expensive if you refuse ....
      1. evil hamster
        evil hamster 10 September 2013 15: 51
        0
        Sorry of course, but you’re talking nonsense. Any landing ship is a defenseless pelvis one hit and there is no BDK or Marines. And what to abandon landing ships for this reason? For example, IL 76 is absolutely defenseless in front of a fighter, but it doesn’t bother anyone! Naturally, the Mistral should be escorted and defended like any landing ship, military transport plane or convoy of trucks - but this is normal, nothing else has been invented.
        1. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich 11 September 2013 06: 36
          +1
          well ... and where to attach this masterpiece? what tasks and where it will perform (ferry functions do not count))) sound the doctrine smile
  2. bars280
    bars280 9 September 2013 13: 22
    0
    And if there will be whatever the bookmark, our specialists will be able to identify and eliminate it ??? And it will be an unexpected surprise.
  3. Ragnarek
    Ragnarek 9 September 2013 13: 25
    +5
    Quote: bars280
    And if there will be whatever the bookmark, our specialists will be able to identify and eliminate it ??? And it will be an unexpected surprise.

    I doubt it. it is not accepted. who will then order the construction of ships at this shipyard? and for sure the ship will be inspected "whoever needs it"
    1. Per se.
      Per se. 9 September 2013 13: 57
      +5
      Quote: Ragnarek
      then who will order the construction of ships at this shipyard?
      After that, it will not matter who will think what if a war breaks out. At one time, when it was time to divide the Italian fleet, after the end of World War II, the Soviet Union claimed a new battleship of the "Littorio" type, but thanks to the lottery organized by the "allies" we got the "Giulio Cesare" by lot, which became "Novorossiysk". On the night of October 29, 1955, a battleship, standing on a battleship barrel at the base, was rocked by an explosion from the starboard side in the bow, equivalent to 1000-1200 kg of TNT. There were several versions, from the official one - the old German bottom mine, to the diversion of combat swimmers. By the way, powerful explosives could be put into the welded nose of the battleship even before its transfer, and then only activated. And that, although the same Italians were suspected, they were not caught - not a thief. Here it is better to watch a hundred times, than drooling now, then pay with the blood of our sailors.
      1. zadorin1974
        zadorin1974 9 September 2013 14: 59
        0
        Well, at the expense of "Novorossiysk", after all, no one doubts - the sabotage of combat swimmers plus the slovenliness of the guardhouse - but at the expense of bookmarks - well, we are not suckers in the 1st department either or what? here they will be driven over to us and will install weapons and equipment - and it will last another 20-30 years HOW IT IS ACCEPTED BY US - A Pity !!!!!!!!!
        1. Pilat2009
          Pilat2009 9 September 2013 16: 40
          +3
          Quote: zadorin1974
          Well, we also do not suckers in the 1st department, or what?

          I wonder how they will decrypt the software part?
          1. zadorin1974
            zadorin1974 9 September 2013 22: 36
            +1
            Well, maybe I’m also for a cadet — not so smart — but in my service and in life I met davolno smart people — well, MASKVICHAM may have come to you somehow request
            1. zadorin1974
              zadorin1974 9 September 2013 23: 14
              0
              My friends (well, I’m not lucky - on Tuesdays our village didn’t go to school request ) they somehow work from our collective farm with the monogies of other koopyratiiyivs and solve their problems without having to go out for a beer. We are RUSSIAN (in your opinion) Our business at the stall ???? was somehow hurt.
            2. Pilat2009
              Pilat2009 11 September 2013 21: 26
              0
              Quote: zadorin1974
              maybe the chel somehow went wrong

              Sorry if I offended. Greetings from Yekaterinburg
          2. Mature naturalist
            Mature naturalist 9 September 2013 23: 36
            +2
            Quote: Pilat2009
            I wonder how they will decrypt the software part?

            There is such a thing: "disassemble".
            Any software can be unwound.
            1. El13
              El13 10 September 2013 15: 15
              +2
              Any one can be unwound, the question is, how many person-years will it take? Plus microcircuits, you will open everything either through one or X-rayed wassat, and then "unwind" them again?
  4. igls
    igls 9 September 2013 13: 27
    16
    This is how people quickly build ships, not like in Russia, they drag out deadlines with money, and then they bring them to mind for years.
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 9 September 2013 13: 45
      11
      Quote: igls
      That's how people build ships fast

      The pace is really impressive, I don’t want to remember about mine crying
    2. shpuntik
      shpuntik 9 September 2013 15: 44
      +5
      Corporal
      igls RU Today, 13:27 PM
      This is how people quickly build ships, not like in Russia, they drag out deadlines with money, and then they bring them to mind for years.

      We know how to build, there is a problem with saturation. We made a half of the building on the "Balts", sent it, emnp. I put a bottle, that this is another "fornicator", as with "Bulava" and "SSJet", we will suffer with it, it will not work. Only loot will fly abroad, with a whistle. Moreover, there will be no 4 pieces. I think so.
      1. VAF
        VAF 9 September 2013 15: 47
        +2
        Quote: shpuntik
        I put a bottle, that this is another "fornicator", as with "Bulava" and "SSJet", we will suffer with it, it will not work. Only loot will fly abroad, with a whistle. Moreover, there will be no 4 pieces. I think so.


        +! good drinks
        1. shpuntik
          shpuntik 9 September 2013 15: 57
          +4
          vaf (1) RU Today, 15:47 ↑ New
          VAF hi drinks I was already tortured to cut the truth, my posts about GDP were deleted a long time ago, the rating was 7000, for the activity of the "minus", now I will be more careful :-) This photo started:

          Maybe this harms the site? They can probably cover the site. what
          1. VAF
            VAF 9 September 2013 16: 04
            +1
            Quote: shpuntik
            I was already tortured to cut the truth, my posts about GDP were deleted a long time ago, the rating was 7000, for the activity of the "minus", now I will be more careful :-) This photo started:


            Novel fellow drinks I am already in the "know" of events !, but you are still .. "lucky" .. and me Mr. Smirov [b] 300 [/ b at a time ... and you say 000 lol

            And you say .. "criticism" ... LOW! wassat Immediately .. KIRDYK am
            1. shpuntik
              shpuntik 9 September 2013 16: 32
              +2
              [b] vaf (1) RU Today, 16:04 PM ↑ New
              Novel fellow drinks I'm already in the "know" of events! But you are still .. "lucky" .. and me Mr. Smironov [b] 300. [/ B]

              300 thousand is weighty. If a ruble for a little thing - Lada Samara :-)
              1. VAF
                VAF 9 September 2013 16: 41
                +4
                Quote: shpuntik
                300 thousand is weighty. If a ruble for a little thing - Lada Samara :-)


                What are you modestly .. in our salon it already costs 460 tons. True, in my opinion, Priora ... but Djilik, China .. really cheaper, and it cannot be compared with this ..... "product of autotaza" wassat

                And I have Mr. Smirnov here this photo .. "removed from the run", but the post was in style " fellow "..... request



                Apparently you're right ... someone starts the site .. "don't like" there was a lot of criticism and little fellow
    3. APASUS
      APASUS 9 September 2013 20: 43
      0
      Quote: igls
      This is how people quickly build ships, not like in Russia, they drag out deadlines with money, and then they bring them to mind for years.

      Yes, we are still far from the Western pace. Here I read an article recently that Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering, Ltd (DSME) shipyards are building a supertanker in a year! True, our joint project with them muddied up in Vladivostok. But Koreans don’t give bribes there either .. ....... problems, problems
  5. smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 9 September 2013 13: 29
    24
    The French, as promised, are likely to hand over their part of the work within a year. And you KA-52K - at least one alive saw? Maybe he was at MAX this year? And how many KA-29s (they were supposed to put in Vladivostok) how many modernized this year? But after a month the French take him out of the construction dock.
    Ka-29 - only upgrade;
    Ka-52K - the first prototype is being manufactured at Progress.
    Another Ka-32, which the Ministry of Defense ordered in return for the Ka-27PS, can also be registered on it.
    There are no pilots and ground specialists for helicopters either. In a high degree of readiness - Vladivostok - will be when it is included in the KTOF, with a crew, after the actual successful delivery of all tasks according to KBPNK, with an air group on board. From whom to form an air group, with pilots allowed to fly from the deck of "Vladivostok"? Yours faithfully! hi
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 9 September 2013 13: 43
      +2
      Quote: Kuznetsov 1977
      And you KA-52K - at least one alive saw?

      They fly in Arseniev, but I don’t know whether it is K or not request
      1. 31231
        31231 9 September 2013 16: 46
        0
        I liked Arseniev. And the people there are probably the most good-natured of whom I have seen in the Far East.
    2. little man
      little man 9 September 2013 14: 02
      +2
      In the meantime, there are no turntables to load a container with Clubs on it. laughing
      1. VAF
        VAF 9 September 2013 14: 06
        +7
        Quote: man
        In the meantime, there are no turntables to load a container with Clubs on it.


        Che is trifling about .... let's just install with "Yars" wassat
      2. waisson
        waisson 9 September 2013 19: 31
        +1
        it’s not better to go to St. Petersburg as sometimes between Kenik and let him work, but I’m afraid he’s a ferry and stay until the helicopter group arrives
        1. Andrey Yuryevich
          Andrey Yuryevich 10 September 2013 11: 23
          +1
          here's a really sensible thought ... even with a stop, catch flounder ... laughing
    3. VAF
      VAF 9 September 2013 14: 05
      19
      Quote: Kuznetsov 1977
      . From whom to form an air group, with pilots allowed to fly from the deck of "Vladivostok"?


      Dear Mr. Kuznetsov, let me ask you what stock fellow over or for a second they took off the "rose-colored glasses", and then it turns out ... "the horse ... did not roll around" bully

      What about yours fellow -posts ... we have so much. yes half as much, etc.? wassat

      And about fellow new submarines that are without missiles? And about the Su-35, which does not have new weapons, and even something else? And about the T-50, which is almost in the army? well, etc. etc.
      Therefore, I bet you the first time +! For honesty and ... courage, because still here, on the site, the truth is not very welcome. here more and more fellow and glory to Putin fellow which instead of Stepashin appoints T. Golikov belay
      We are going the right way ..... "tovorsizchi"! wassat
      Where is the new position for Taburetkin wassat ?
      1. Bronis
        Bronis 9 September 2013 14: 23
        +3
        Quote: vaf
        which instead of Stepashin appoints T. Golikov

        Nominally ... Could Elvira Sahibzadovna Nabiulina ... Sahib - gentleman, then - everything is clear ... cat - back view ... wassat
        And Serdyukov is a doctor of economic sciences. It seems like I wanted to teach at SPbU (seriously) and get the rank of adviser at the head of the FCS ... but I didn’t ask, in the end ... I see him on the labor exchange wassat
        1. VAF
          VAF 9 September 2013 14: 33
          +2
          Quote: Bronis
          Nominally ... Could Elvira Sahibzadovna Nabiulina ... Sahib - gentleman, then - everything is clear ... cat - back view ...


          Greetings! drinks well, here, as in the song .... "it's not evening yet. it's not evening yet" or as they have ".. everything will be for them .. good"! wassat

          Here, if they are in the holder .. then already in the holder, even the shells and then ... do not throw away, but attach ... well, how not to say Glory .... wassat !!!
          1. Bronis
            Bronis 9 September 2013 14: 54
            +9
            Unfortunately, it turns out, what it turns out ... However, somehow Mother Russia has experienced all this for centuries. If I could answer in one word what is happening in Russia, I would have to say: they are stealing (Karamzin said, if I am not mistaken). It's just that it is necessary to admit it "at the top" and turn off "unnecessary" populism, which sets the teeth on edge (but not forgetting about competent propaganda instead of Siberian Cranes). And then it is not Russia that works, but this (Yudashkin, by the way, well done - he guessed it) ...
      2. baltika-18
        baltika-18 9 September 2013 14: 38
        +7
        Quote: vaf
        here more and glory to Putin who appoints T. Golikova instead of Stepashin

        For some reason, he’s not surprised. His wife is Khristenko. Putin’s comrade-in-arms since 1999.
        She will converge where it is necessary, where it will not converge, as the boss will say. And there will be no honesty. "Madame Arbidol" she is "Madame Arbidol". Greetings to the faithful putints.
        1. VAF
          VAF 9 September 2013 14: 50
          +2
          Quote: baltika-18
          Wife Khristenko


          This is the most important thing, and everything else ... they are all .. "associates"! +! wassat
          1. Tersky
            Tersky 9 September 2013 14: 59
            +5
            Quote: vaf
            This is the most important thing, and everything else ... they are all .. "associates"!

            Sergey hello! In the explanatory dictionary of Efremova, the derivative of the word companion is "He who, together with someone, participated in a war, battle, etc.; comrade in arms." Khristenko charging ...
            1. VAF
              VAF 9 September 2013 15: 19
              +2
              Quote: Tersky
              Khristenko loading ...


              + + + + drinks laughing laughing laughing or maybe ... offering or .. lol
              1. Tersky
                Tersky 9 September 2013 16: 33
                +3
                Quote: vaf
                or maybe ... offering or ..

                not... No. usually serving from among the regional .. wink
      3. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 9 September 2013 16: 25
        15
        Dear Sergei, it’s absolutely in vain that you signed me up as a pro-Putin. On the contrary, I always really assessed the situation, especially with regard to the fleet ... And as for our beloved minister "Stool", you know, I would gladly enroll in the NKVD, shoot the reptile, and then check out. Well, in confirmation of the sincerity of their intentions:

        Yours! hi
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Cristall
          Cristall 9 September 2013 17: 06
          +2
          awesome movie.
          1. VAF
            VAF 9 September 2013 17: 25
            +1
            Quote: Cristall
            awesome movie.


            Just awesome +! good
            1. Tersky
              Tersky 9 September 2013 17: 37
              +2
              Quote: vaf
              Just awesome +!

              Sergey, are you talking about the video ... laughing don't get fooled wassat laughing laughing
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. The comment was deleted.
        3. atalef
          atalef 9 September 2013 17: 33
          -1
          Auction roller. Class (+)
        4. gagarinneon
          gagarinneon 10 September 2013 11: 16
          0
          the video is mortal, our liberals, communists and democrats need to turn it in the Duma DAILY, and the eight themselves will run to SUSHYa ...........
        5. Politician
          Politician 10 September 2013 13: 40
          +1
          The song is cool! But the idea is go-no. Everything is much closer than we think. If you want to find the culprit, look in the mirror. People! When we get power and the opportunity to find someone else, the majority is ready to do it for a penny. We must not blame the authorities, we must begin with ourselves! When we for the most part become Humans, everything around will be transformed. It’s a pity, at this time I don’t live, not you my friend.
    4. Russ69
      Russ69 9 September 2013 15: 44
      0
      Quote: Kuznetsov 1977
      The French, as promised, are likely to hand over their part of the work within a year. And you KA-52K - at least one alive saw? M

      "Vladivostok, we will be completing it for another year, if not longer. You look and the ship will be prepared, you still need to test it on it.
      1. VAF
        VAF 9 September 2013 15: 51
        +1
        Quote: Russ69
        You look and they’ll prepare a boat, you still need to test it.


        By "shipbuilder" as I understand it, you mean the MiG-29K / KUB or the Su-33M?

        And how "sideways" can they be "tested" on this barge? belay After all, they seem to be not "verticals" as far as I know lol
        1. Russ69
          Russ69 9 September 2013 15: 56
          +4
          Quote: vaf
          By "shipbuilder" as I understand it, you mean the MiG-29K / KUB or the Su-33M?

          And how "sideways" can they be "tested" on this barge? After all, they seem to be not "verticals" as far as I know

          And where does it ... smile The conversation seems to be about the deck version of the Ka-52 ...
          1. VAF
            VAF 9 September 2013 15: 59
            +2
            Quote: Russ69
            The conversation seems to be about the deck version of the Ka-52 ...


            Then, I'm sorry drinks in the wrong place .. "twisted", recourse but it seemed that you mean to use the barge under a full-fledged aircraft carrier wassat
            Then +! drinks
            1. Russ69
              Russ69 9 September 2013 16: 15
              +1
              Quote: vaf
              Then, forgive me for the wrong place .. "twisted"

              It happens that everyone is not sinless ... smile
              1. The comment was deleted.
                1. Russ69
                  Russ69 9 September 2013 17: 03
                  +2
                  Quote: vaf
                  Out of curiosity. As they say. Nothing personal

                  I seem to be +, and you ... ".. in the face"

                  Yes, I have nothing against you, I just do not like some comments at the level of a liberal hamster (do not consider it an insult). No offense, I also put the pluses to you. This is normal, everyone present at the forum cannot agree on one opinion on each issue ... Otherwise, it would be boring ... drinks
                  So I compensate for the direct question ...
                  1. VAF
                    VAF 9 September 2013 17: 34
                    0
                    Quote: Russ69
                    I just don’t like some comments at the level of a liberal hamster (do not consider it an insult)


                    Here's something, but I didn't notice "this" recourse

                    Quote: Russ69
                    This is normal, everyone present at the forum cannot agree on one opinion on each issue ... Otherwise, it would be boring ...


                    I agree to all 100% drinks

                    Quote: Russ69
                    for a direct question ...


                    So taught, so brought up soldier
                    1. Russ69
                      Russ69 9 September 2013 17: 50
                      +1
                      Quote: vaf
                      Here's something, but I didn't notice "this"

                      Yes, I said that you would not perceive my expression "liberal hamster" as an insult to you ... smile
                      VAF, such a question, as not bad knowledgeable in aviation. How long can the Ka-52K tests take, if by the end of the year, as promised, they would do it.
                      1. VAF
                        VAF 9 September 2013 18: 14
                        +1
                        Quote: Russ69
                        How long can the Ka-52K tests take, if by the end of the year, as promised, they would do it.


                        It depends on what they mean by tests, because a ship differs from a land one only by folding blades (changes in the steering column), and avionics are a little different.
                        Those. LCI will practically or should be fast, but flights from the deck, and in different conditions, and then also weapons ... here it can stretch ... for a long period!
                      2. Russ69
                        Russ69 9 September 2013 18: 25
                        +1
                        Quote: vaf
                        Those. LCI will practically or should be fast, but flights from the deck, but in different conditions, and then also weapons ...

                        So, in principle, is it possible, after paintwork, to continue testing the rest and simultaneously launch the series?
                      3. VAF
                        VAF 9 September 2013 18: 48
                        +2
                        Quote: Russ69
                        is it possible, after paintwork, to continue testing the rest and simultaneously launch the series?


                        We, in principle, do this, after the end of the flight design, they assign the letter "0" (this means that you can launch a batch or series), and then only as joint (stages A and B) and military ... bring to mind and make changes (very rarely, that in the design, although it happens, for example, a narrowed "ass..opa" on the Su-24M and aerodynamic ridges).
                        But basically it concerns avionics, PRNK, SUV, and BKO, well, there may be some improvements on the joint-stock company.
                      4. Russ69
                        Russ69 9 September 2013 18: 55
                        +1
                        Well, that means, if you wish, in three years, the Vladivostok can be equipped with an air group.
                      5. VAF
                        VAF 9 September 2013 19: 03
                        0
                        Quote: Russ69
                        means if desired


                        Unfortunately, there is only one wish here. recourse
                        It depends on what the Ka-52K will "wear". How long has the Simple Ka-52 in service and ...... ATGM only promise by 2015 and then ... "Whirlwind-1M".
                        The Su-35 when it went into the series and ... the SUV tests and the AB itself will end only at the end of 2015.

                        And here everything is practically from scratch necessary .. so I think for more than 3 years ... much more.
  • gunnerminer
    gunnerminer 9 September 2013 16: 18
    +2
    There are no pilots and ground specialists for helicopters either. In a high degree of readiness - Vladivostok - will be when it is included in the KTOF, with a crew, after the actual successful delivery of all tasks according to KBPNK, with an air group on board. From whom to form an air group, with pilots allowed to fly from the deck of "Vladivostok"? Yours faithfully!


    Yes exactly.
  • shpuntik
    shpuntik 9 September 2013 16: 25
    +7
    Kuznetsov 1977 (2) RU Today, 13:29
    And you KA-52K - at least one alive saw?

    Not only are there no helicopters, but also their own internal combustion engines. "Vyartsila" will stand. This means that, and auxiliary mechanisms will be from the "Champs Elysees", most likely fittings, electrics, wiring. As a result: we have only a "box", a body. Something like this was done with the Norwegian rescue tugs: they ordered a hull from us, then they drove from Vyborg or St. Petersburg to Finland for completion. As a result, the lion's share of the added value remains there, and our equipment manufacturers die. The only thing we do ourselves is saturation of the submarine, it is difficult to change here, there is little space, everything has been perfected over the years.
    And, on tankers, 70-thousanders "Lavrov", "Ulyanov" all foreign equipment was installed. Fitted under foreign Lloyd's Register and Veritas. Our Register of the USSR, which was respected on a par with Lloyd's, "floated away" into oblivion. request It would be revived ... But apparently, Medved doesn’t have Wi-Fi, wassat not before.
  • gispanec
    gispanec 9 September 2013 13: 30
    0
    what weapons will it stand on? ... except for turntables naturally))
    1. Bronis
      Bronis 9 September 2013 14: 33
      +1
      In theory, apart from the self-defense air defense system (Calm or Polyment, in the "pictures" it seems that there was also Flexible) and the AK-630 there should be nothing. Some generals and "Onyxes" wanted to see it ... but this is not from a good life, probably
      1. Russ69
        Russ69 9 September 2013 17: 38
        +1
        Quote: Bronis
        and the AK-630 should not be anything.

        It will also be like 2 or 3 pieces. Somewhere in a similar topic laid out the layout of weapons. As the French believe, the seats under the AK, apparently did.
        1. Bronis
          Bronis 9 September 2013 17: 57
          +1
          Well, yes, SAM + AK-630. I wrote about this
          1. Russ69
            Russ69 9 September 2013 18: 06
            0
            Quote: Bronis
            Well, yes, SAM + AK-630. I wrote about this

            So the phrase is not understood .... smile
  • bars280
    bars280 9 September 2013 13: 33
    0
    Quote: Ragnarek
    Quote: bars280
    And if there will be whatever the bookmark, our specialists will be able to identify and eliminate it ??? And it will be an unexpected surprise.

    I doubt it. it is not accepted. who will then order the construction of ships at this shipyard? and for sure the ship will be inspected "whoever needs it"

    Well, that bookmark may sleep until a certain time, and we are far from friends for the French. By the way, the French seem to have done similar things in Yugoslavia 1999. I don’t remember that, but they sold something to the Yugoslavs. And then at hour x it stopped working.
    1. Yuriwhite
      Yuriwhite 9 September 2013 13: 43
      +2
      In general, it was not the Yugoslavs, but the Iraqis who bought the air defense systems from the French wink
    2. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 9 September 2013 16: 51
      +1
      Quote: bars280
      And then at hour x it stopped working.

      So they and in the Volklands half of the precision munitions were not blown up
  • serge-68-68
    serge-68-68 9 September 2013 13: 43
    +4
    People build ships: laid in February 2012, launched in September 2013, will be commissioned in 2014. Without noise, dust, crying about a lack of funds, labor and production capacities.
    1. zart_arn
      zart_arn 9 September 2013 13: 56
      +3
      Means for the construction of ships swells more than enough, and so do we. Just look out the window and look at cars worth more than 100 non-rubles, estimate the cost of housing and think about where the money comes from.
    2. Manager
      Manager 9 September 2013 13: 58
      +1
      Quote: serge-68-68
      People build ships: laid in February 2012, launched in September 2013, will be commissioned in 2014. Without noise, dust, crying about a lack of funds, labor and production capacities.


      It is called turnkey and with trained personnel.
    3. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 9 September 2013 16: 53
      +1
      Quote: serge-68-68
      crying for lack of funds

      And why should they cry - everything is paid in half
  • WIN969
    WIN969 9 September 2013 13: 44
    +2
    It is strange that we will accept in our navy a ship that is being built by a NATO member for us, I hope that at least the electronics of the ship will be ours and we have installed it.
    1. creak
      creak 9 September 2013 15: 12
      +5
      And this is nothing that the best leader of the Black Sea Fleet "Tashkent" before the war was designed and built in Italy, ruled by Mussolini, and the Germans gave us the almost finished cruiser "Luttsov", which we called "Petropavlovsk". And that our fleet suffered from this, rather the opposite ... Well, about
      "Varyag" needless to say, it was also built in Philadelphia ... If its own industry is not yet able to provide the required number of modern ships, then they need to be ordered, including abroad. As the great pragmatist Deng Xiaoping once said: "It doesn't matter what color the cat is, as long as it catches mice."
      1. Per se.
        Per se. 9 September 2013 18: 02
        +2
        Quote: ranger
        and the Germans handed over to us an almost finished cruiser "Luttsov", which we called "Petropavlovsk". And that our fleet suffered from this, rather the opposite ...
        The Germans warmed us well with the cruiser, here just from the category "our fleet suffered from this." Finally, now is not the time of Benito Mussolini, and, moreover, not the time of the Russian-Japanese war, now it is dangerous even for those in power to go to a foreign clinic, they can make "firmware" for the human brain, what can we say about electronics, even an electrician. Our fleet and shipbuilding were ruined not without the influence of the CIA and the US State Department, it is naive to believe that they do not track or edit the construction of ships in a NATO member country, refusing to lobby their interests and sabotage our military construction. In any case, you need to be very careful about this topic, maybe it doesn't matter "what color the cat is", but who will catch the mice from whom is another question.
      2. Pilat2009
        Pilat2009 10 September 2013 13: 15
        0
        Quote: ranger
        And it’s nothing that the best leader of the Black Sea Fleet "Tashkent" before the war was designed and built in Italy, ruled by Mussolini

        Then there was peace, friendship and chewing gum. Stalin bought a lot of useful things from stupid capitalists - those mothers would sell their mother for 10% of the profit. Yes, and one ship did not play any role. And then nobody had a clue about bookmarks.
    2. T80UM1
      T80UM1 9 September 2013 15: 14
      +4
      It was like that before Tsushima, but the lovers of the main buyer had the most expensive diamonds. What thieves didn’t get used to, it’s important for them to earn money on luxury and yachts, and the fact that simple sailors will not care for them.
  • vagabo
    vagabo 9 September 2013 13: 53
    +1
    About bookmarks. Not to Iraqis and not to Yugoslavs.
    During the Falklands Conflict, the Argentine Air Force was armed with Exocet missiles (translated as flying fish). At the beginning of the war, they sank or damaged several English ships. London rushed to Paris. After that, the Argentine missiles, when launched, strangely stopped finding targets.
  • mitya24
    mitya24 9 September 2013 14: 11
    +1
    The experience of the last unsuccessful launches of satellites shows that even without the "stubs" of the enemy, there is not enough of a domestic production.
  • tilovaykrisa
    tilovaykrisa 9 September 2013 14: 13
    +1
    Explain to the amateur what is the use of this type of ship, what tasks can he solve in relation to the Russian Federation?
    1. VAF
      VAF 9 September 2013 14: 22
      +2
      Quote: tilovaykrisa
      Explain to the amateur what the use of this type of ship is.


      Allow me, as the same amateur in the Navy, well, until the real naval "pulled up" to stick with their opinion!

      No application ... no, just ... scarecrow, that's just not clear for whom ... there is nothing for him, nothing at all, starting from the place of basing (or how Kuzya will be ... on the eternal .. bank ") but helicopters, crews, etc.
      There are no guard ships for him, so he can only command tugboats (of which there are a lot in the warrants of our fleet ..or our ships can’t even go to sea without a tugboat request ) or Grachyonka type boats, diving and assault boats. wassat +! lol
      1. MilaPhone
        MilaPhone 9 September 2013 14: 31
        0
        Quote: tilovaykrisa
        Explain to the amateur what is the use of this type of ship, what tasks can he solve in relation to the Russian Federation?

        The main thing is that he is Universal.
        For example, it would be very useful for us now in Syria. But now we don’t have it, unfortunately.
        1. VAF
          VAF 9 September 2013 14: 36
          +2
          Quote: Milafon
          For example, it would be very useful for us now in Syria.


          Let me curiosity, purely as an amateur, but what could this barge come in handy for you in Syria (I’m writing specifically for you, because we don’t need it there for hell ... unless you command the BDK)?
          1. Suhov
            Suhov 9 September 2013 15: 01
            +5
            Quote: vaf
            Quote: Milafon
            For example, it would be very useful for us now in Syria.

            Let me curiosity, purely as an amateur, but what could this barge come in handy for you in Syria (I’m writing specifically for you, because we don’t need it there for hell ... unless you command the BDK)?


            Mistral disinfectant is used for disinfection of surfaces and cleaning
            wassat

            How our "Mistral" differs from the "Barge":
            - manages the actions of various branches of the forces of naval groups (surface ships, submarines, naval aviation), and possibly the actions of interspecific groups in naval and oceanic theaters of operations.
            Already this is enough.
            Of course, you can use flags, fire smoke and Morse code for control, but now this is no longer relevant.
            - Russian DVKD will be equipped with cruise missiles with an increased firing range, the latest air defense and missile defense systems,
            - The ultra-long-range Vampir NG infrared search and tracking system provides passive round-the-clock panoramic surveillance of surface conditions, automatic detection, tracking and reporting of various types of threats, from anti-ship missiles with a fixed flight path over water to attacking fast ships.
            The system has two modes of operation: "ocean" mode for long-range observation in the open sea, "coastal" mode for coastal waters,
            - ...
            1. VAF
              VAF 9 September 2013 15: 25
              0
              Quote: Sukhov
              How our "Mistral" differs from the "Barge":
              - controls the actions of various branches of the forces of naval groups (surface ships, submarines, naval aviation)


              From now on and in more detail wink (about surface ships and submarines, or maybe all the same tugboats and auxiliary vessels .. bring them much more)
              But here on Naval Aviation .. that's for sure .. to me wassat

              Well, you comrade Sukhov, dear ... "hit"! wassat Come on ... I'm really waiting ... by "control" lol maritime aviation lol
              1. Suhov
                Suhov 9 September 2013 17: 04
                +1
                Quote: vaf
                Well, you are comrade Sukhov, dear ... "hit"!
                Come on ... really waiting ... for "management" of naval aviation


                Dear comrade Vaf!
                hi

                Here is the link:
                http://army-news.ru/2012/02/mistrali-osnastyat-udarnym-vooruzheniem/

                Here are the contents of the link:
                The Russian General Staff confirmed this information ...
                DVKD of our Navy should Not only manage actions various kinds of forces of naval groups (surface ships, submarines, naval aviation) or even by the actions of interspecific groupings at sea and ocean theaters of operations, not only deliver and land ashore marine armored vehicles with the help of helicopters and landing and landing equipment, but must themselves have sufficient fire and strike power to be full-fledged self-defense multi-functional warships as part of these groups. Therefore, the Russian DVKD will be equipped with cruise missiles with an increased firing range, the latest air defense and missile defense systems. ”


                So all claims are against the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation.
                hi


                General Staff - "hit"!
                wassat
                And I will modestly step aside and wait.
                yes
                While you, dear Vaf, will weigh the lyuley to the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation!
                wassat

                hi
                1. Bronis
                  Bronis 9 September 2013 17: 23
                  +2
                  Quote: Sukhov
                  Here are the contents of the link:
                  The Russian General Staff confirmed this information ...
                  The DVKD of our Navy must not only manage the actions of various branches of the forces of naval groups (surface ships, submarines, naval aviation) or even the actions of interspecific groups at sea and ocean theaters of war,

                  Allow the cue of another amateur.
                  In principle, what the Ministry of Defense declares is correct. Always need a control ship. Only this is fraught with a number of difficulties.
                  1. You need your own BIUS. He should stand not only on Mistral, but on all ships of the group. Further more - if the grouping is interspecific, then they should have. And if only they will command by radio and issue target designations - there is no point in a new "manager".
                  2. We need security ships (who to control).
                  3. (but actually 1) You need to understand how to use all this and where.
                  As for the strike weapons. The UDC is not a destroyer after all. It has its own niche. The more "Onyxes" - the worse the landing properties. Yes, and they will have to be placed on the upper decks, which in a large number obviously does not improve seaworthiness - he did not count on this.
                  The desire to make a "super-ship" is great due to the shortage of ship personnel. Many draw analogies with Soviet aircraft-carrying cruisers, they say they also had large anti-ship missiles. Yes, there were, but with their rather modest (in anti-ship capabilities) air groups, it could not be otherwise.
                  And the General Staff should weigh the "lyuly". It seems that we probably do not have a coherent concept for the development of the Armed Forces. It is not drawn. And it doesn't look like a "cunning" plan either.
                  1. Suhov
                    Suhov 9 September 2013 17: 28
                    +1
                    Quote: Bronis
                    Allow the cue of another amateur.

                    You're right. But with what it is necessary to begin, all the same ...
                    1. Bronis
                      Bronis 9 September 2013 17: 39
                      +2
                      Quote: Sukhov
                      You're right. But with what it is necessary to begin, all the same ...

                      I won’t be clever - I don’t know, and I can only assume, if we talk about concepts and tactics of application.
                      But it seems that our main problem is not this, but the "cart ahead of the donkey." And this problem is much broader than the Mistrals, and most importantly - more systemic. Too often these or those posts are occupied by people who are not versed in "their" question. Paradoxically, we have developed a "caste of managers". They always and everywhere only rule. Today - in medicine, tomorrow - in nuclear energy. Here is Serdyukov - an example. Bad / Good is not important. Will not pull. Previously, there was a system of professional growth in the direction. Now it is crumbling.
                      It is clear that today's personnel problem came from the concept of personal devotion. But now she has clearly degenerated ...
                      There are no simple and quick solutions.
                2. VAF
                  VAF 9 September 2013 17: 44
                  +1
                  Quote: Sukhov
                  General Staff - "hit"!


                  You are absolutely right ... as from December 11, 1994 ... they "got stuck", and they still can't get out .... 08.08.08. confirmation of this!

                  "Successful" "reforming" and its consequences do not need to hopefully list? wassat

                  So excuse me, but links to articles and "calculations" of our Top Commanders and Commanders-in-Chief ... this is only theory and "justification" of what continues to be "done".

                  This is not to reproach you, this is my opinion, but maybe the General Staff did not know that we don’t have MRA at all, we have enough to count distant anti-submarine fingers on one hand, well, IL-38 = x, maybe the other hand will be needed (in that already fifty dollars, and to hell with them), but I’m sorry, I forgot .. I’ve adopted the new An-140 for the Navy Aviation ... that’s what the strength is and what will be controlled wassat

                  Well, about all the enlarged and the newest ... God forbid, of course .. but with such "leaders" ... not in this life! soldier
      2. sashka
        sashka 9 September 2013 14: 44
        +2
        Next is a post about an attack on a Chinese ship. I don’t own a photoshop. If you add containers to the mistral, there will be almost one to one ..
        1. VAF
          VAF 9 September 2013 15: 16
          0
          Quote: Sasha
          If you add containers to the mistral, there will be almost one to one ..


          Hi Sasha! I agree here .. for the transportation of containers it can and will go, but only how to load them onto the deck .. or all the same in the hold?

          Imagine. How many used "yaposhek2" can be loaded? drinks
    2. PSih2097
      PSih2097 9 September 2013 14: 28
      +3
      Quote: tilovaykrisa
      Explain to the amateur what is the use of this type of ship, what tasks can he solve in relation to the Russian Federation?

      Universal landing ships of the Mistral type - a class of universal landing helicopter carrier landing ships, capable of performing four different tasks at once: to land military units on land, receive helicopters, be the center of command and a floating hospital. Although, as VAF correctly said, there are no ships for an escort warrant for him yet (well, don't let him out with corvettes) ...
      1. MilaPhone
        MilaPhone 9 September 2013 15: 03
        +4
        Quote: PSih2097
        Let me curiosity, purely as an amateur, but what could this barge come in handy for you in Syria (I’m writing specifically for you, because we don’t need it there for hell ... unless you command the BDK)?


        Maybe you don’t need it personally, but I remind you that the only foreign Russian naval base is located in Syrian Tartus. And we are present there.
        In the Mediterranean Sea the guard ship “Undaunted” of the Baltic Fleet, the large landing ships “Shabalin”, “Admiral Nevelskoy”, “Novocherkassk” and “Peresvet” are already on duty. The group will also include the Moscow Black Sea Fleet missile cruiser and the Varyag missile cruiser Pacific Pacific Fleet.
        These landing ships are outdated and worn out.
        For example, during an exercise in January this year in the Mediterranean Sea near the large landing craft "Saratov" (launched in 1966 !!!) a diesel generator went out of order.
        I think the above listed our group, "Mistrals" armed with our attack helicopters and marines, would only strengthen.
        1. VAF
          VAF 9 September 2013 15: 33
          0
          Quote: Milafon
          but let me remind you that the only foreign Russian naval base is located in Syrian Tartus. And we are present there.


          Let me remind you how the real naval ones explained to me that there is no naval base in Tartus !!!!
          There is a PMTO. Your comparison is similar to comparing DARM with Aviazavod!

          Now ... we don't have a naval attack helicopter NO !!!! There is a ground attack Mi-28 and, for now, a "semi-impact" Ka-52.

          Or are you going to "drop" the landing of Marines on enemy ships, ie. air boarding wassat

          Therefore, the answer to your post .. "would be useful" not only intelligible, but not even a simple answer request
          1. Russ69
            Russ69 9 September 2013 17: 14
            +2
            Quote: vaf
            Let me remind you how the real naval ones explained to me that there is no naval base in Tartus !!!!
            There is a PMTO. Your comparison is similar to comparing DARM with Aviazavod!

            About the base I agree. Even before the war in Syria, there was a report about this base. whose personnel, several midshipmen, a barge and several cars, welded to the pier, since Soviet times.
            1. VAF
              VAF 9 September 2013 18: 56
              +3
              Quote: Russ69
              About the base I agree.


              And what about helicopters? On the Ka-52, there is not even a Vortex yet ... only projections and promises that it will be done ... but ... because with the Whirlwind you will not trample .... this is again some kind of boarding ... we need something more serious ..type anti-ship missiles ... or torpedoes, and this is a new PrNK .. in general, still work and work in this direction, but here .. already .. Syria is going to "fight"!

              Dreaming about the power and revival of the power of the Russian Navy is certainly good ... but just dreaming. and ..Syria then .. today ... here it is and that .... everything that is combat-ready is there or on the way, and God forbid .. that the Amers would have enough reason ... to "turn back" and ours .. .. excerpts! soldier
              1. Russ69
                Russ69 9 September 2013 19: 12
                +3
                Quote: vaf
                What about helicopters, aren’t they? On the Ka-52, there’s not even a Whirlwind

                He, though somehow complete, albeit with grief in half ...
                Well base, a long time ago, legal name and no more.
                Quote: vaf
                and then .. already .. Syria are going to "fight"!

                Yes, I myself received the cons, because I said seriously no one is going to fight for direct Syria. For stupid now, nifiga we are not ready ... To help, but we must.
                At least in political terms, it turns out until they bomb ... Yes, and they have already begun to set conditions under which there will be no bombing. Lavrov said he was ready to support ...
        2. densh
          densh 9 September 2013 20: 55
          -1
          Do not you think that the list of ships is perplexing? It seems that it was formed on the principle of, Schaub Bulo. Why do so many BDK-extras?
      2. Pilat2009
        Pilat2009 9 September 2013 18: 55
        +1
        Quote: PSih2097
        four different tasks at once:

        How can it be a floating hospital at the same time as transporting troops? His displacement is not rubber, especially if you still weld missiles. Is it even more interesting how much he can land at a time? One battalion will be swept away in one fell swoop
  • mmmakm
    mmmakm 9 September 2013 14: 23
    +1
    Again about polymers. Half was built in Russia. And then burst out, oh how quickly they build, oh how they are doing well. And where do such things come from, forgive me, sinful god, ki.
    1. Russ69
      Russ69 9 September 2013 15: 48
      +1
      Quote: mmmakm
      Again about polymers. Half was built in Russia. And then burst out, oh how quickly they build, oh how they are doing well. And where do they come from, forgive me God

      Now the fashion is like that, it’s said that in Russia everything is not so trendy
      1. VAF
        VAF 9 September 2013 16: 09
        +1
        Quote: Russ69
        Now the fashion is like that, it’s said that in Russia everything is not so trendy


        Why and what does fashion have to do with it request You say. so and together we will fellow
        And then while a serious "problem" and a real one, except for rusty large landing ships, and the remains of more or less combat-ready UNITS, but from all fleets, request we can’t collect anything recourse and even the tugs are there .. here only .. can’t hold out .. because there is nothing ... and you are FASHION request
        1. Russ69
          Russ69 9 September 2013 17: 27
          +4
          Quote: vaf
          Why and what does the mod have to say? so and together we will
          And then while a serious "problem" and a real one, except for rusty large landing ships, and the remains of more or less combat-ready UNITS, but from all fleets,

          Duc, no one says that our fleet is ahead of the whole planet. Another annoying thing is that even an attempt to do something is perceived exclusively as drank some dough (although this is also present, to be honest). Or something like that; "but nothing will fly," "but nothing will float." Well, if it does float or flies, it is still not so.
          The fleet is a pleasure that is extremely expensive and in order to bring it into a less suitable condition, it will take not 1 or 2 years.
          As for these "Mistrals", then of course to hear the opinion of the Moremans hottso, since they are on the forum. And more than one opinion is desirable.
          Personally, for me, I still don’t understand why we need them right now, but nevertheless I’m not special about it and honestly haven’t heard anything intelligible.
          1. Bronis
            Bronis 9 September 2013 18: 16
            0
            Quote: Russ69
            Duc, no one says that our fleet is ahead of the rest. Another annoying is that even an attempt to do something is perceived solely as a dough drank (although it is present, it is a sin to conceal).

            The reality is that any sound idea is surrounded by corruption schemes.
            An example is "Rural School Optimization". You need to save money. We are closing the school, buying a school bus, and taking the children 45 km away. to another school. But in practice it turned out to be more expensive. The cost of the bus + driver + fuel and lubricants + repair + roads. And buses in 3-5 years - a full sieve, a new one is needed. And the money is gone. The target program has ended ... And those people have already "raked" it.
            Or online home education for blind and visually impaired children. It's a good idea, but the supplier to Russia is essentially one. The kit costs 350-400 rubles. per person (with analogues in 50 thousand). Why would the visually impaired need an electron microscope? And what about the Lego programmable robot?
            And what about electronic government services? Rostelecom is fabulously wealthy, and the system, de facto, does not work (with the exception of several federal departments, and even that is not thank God) and will not mean the architecture of the building ... Not a single army ...
            1. Russ69
              Russ69 9 September 2013 19: 36
              +1
              Quote: Bronis
              The reality is that any sound idea is surrounded by corruption schemes.

              Not without it...
              Adopt a law so that it is not for the investigation to prove that the official stole, and the official would prove that all good was acquired by honest and not feasible labor.
              In Singapore at the time, it worked ....
              You look at us, at least somehow it helped.
              1. Bronis
                Bronis 9 September 2013 19: 55
                0
                Quote: Russ69
                Adopt a law so that it is not for the investigation to prove that the official stole, and the official would prove that all good was acquired by honest and not feasible labor.

                That is the presumption of innocence in criminal proceedings. But the civil burden of proof is just on the defendant.
                We, unfortunately (or fortunately) are not Singapore. If the presumption of guilt is introduced in the criminal process, this will have to be done for all categories of cases. And it will only get worse - it will hit us. And those who can - will pay off. I assure you that Russia is not the worst legal system. The problem is in the performers. And here it is not very important which law was adopted
              2. Pilat2009
                Pilat2009 9 September 2013 21: 10
                0
                Quote: Russ69
                not the investigation proved that the official stole, and the official would have argued that all good was acquired honestly

                So for this, the income declaration was conceived, looked at the end of the year and asked: Where did the firewood come from? Another thing is that no one really asks, apparently they didn’t
          2. VAF
            VAF 9 September 2013 19: 12
            +3
            Quote: Russ69
            that even an attempt to do something


            So and such a question was not asked .. what for to do "something" when it is necessary to do the NECESSARY?
            Is it now instead of barges 4-6 modern destroyers descended .. is it bad?
            As for it will fly .. and how can it (Mace) fly if you make a sea Mace from the land Poplar and the most "terrible" was done by DRYERS.
            It’s the same as to put AlexTV in the Su-24th, and me in the T-90 ... will it be laughing?
            I didn’t want it at all, but okay ... I was recently at Obnosov ..... I was at the factory .... they can’t start production ... they can’t ... is that like ????
            Everything is there — money, machines, allies awaiting ...... but people ...... are already gone.
            That's why, when you see all this from the inside ... you know how insulting .. to look at all this "grease", "lordship", "swagger", "arrogance & q
            uot;, "nepotism", etc.
            Okay .. I’ve finished everything, and then .. again it will carry ... on the bumps! soldier
            1. Russ69
              Russ69 9 September 2013 19: 28
              +1
              Quote: vaf
              So and such a question was not asked .. what for to do "something" when it is necessary to do the NECESSARY?

              I had a lead that they do, but slowly ...
              As for it will fly .. and how can it (Mace) fly if you make a sea Mace from the land Poplar and the most "terrible" was done by DRYERS.

              What now ..., they’ll finish it on anyone. The last time I flew quite normally and the double volley was successful. Here again questions to production are likely.
              Quote: vaf
              Everything is there — money, machines, allies awaiting ...... but people ...... are already gone.
              That's why, when you see all this from the inside ... you know how insulting .. to look at all this "grease", "lordship", "swagger", "arrogance & q

              Here I agree ...
              1. The comment was deleted.
            2. Suhov
              Suhov 9 September 2013 19: 48
              0
              Quote: vaf
              Everything is there, money, machines, allies waiting ...and people ...... are already gone.

              Indeed, the Ravshans and Jamshuts in this matter, as assistants, are not very ... No.
  • rudolff
    rudolff 9 September 2013 14: 31
    +7
    I have an unpleasant feeling that after the signing of the ship handover deed, its retrofitting with Russian equipment will take no less time than its construction. Delivery of all coursework problems and inclusion in the first line, the prospect of a not too near future. And if it is still labeled "in trial operation", then no one will be in a hurry with a full-fledged wing. It's good if at first at least heels of the turntables are temporarily assigned.
    1. VAF
      VAF 9 September 2013 14: 40
      +1
      Quote: rudolff
      that after the signing of the act of transfer of the ship, its retrofitting with Russian equipment will take no less time than its construction


      Rudolff, hello, dear!
      Well, you flattered it, about .... no less time to equip. According to the most "modest" estimates, if there is nothing extraordinary. And it will certainly be .. or we are not .. we wassat so here are the deadlines for bringing this barge into combat ready state, I think so ... by the year 20-25 ... not earlier ... we can argue ... if it turns out that there is nothing on it at all ... except Waves, with Sharp crying
      1. rudolff
        rudolff 9 September 2013 16: 27
        +1
        Hello, Sergey. I just tried to express myself delicately. But in fact, you have correctly named the numbers. Full combat readiness should be expected by the twentieth year. Previously unlikely. If only without turntables.
      2. Russ69
        Russ69 9 September 2013 17: 32
        0
        Quote: vaf
        so here are the deadlines for bringing this barge into combat ready state, I think so ... by the year 20-25 ... not earlier ... we can argue ... if it turns out that there is nothing on it at all ... except Waves, with

        Probably too long, but 3-4 years for sure. while the turntables are stamping, while the equipment is being installed (and the trouble is complete with suppliers) By 2018, it may and will go into operation as a full-weight ship.
        1. Alexxeg73
          Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 11: 12
          0
          Everything will be fine! Cruises to friendly countries with visits will not hurt to do!
  • sven27
    sven27 9 September 2013 14: 40
    0
    The pace of construction is encouraging, maybe we still have something to order from them to add the agility of our USC.
    1. sub307
      sub307 9 September 2013 14: 48
      +1
      Well, in what way will orders "there they have" add the quickness "here with us"?
      1. sven27
        sven27 9 September 2013 14: 58
        +1
        Gentlemen from USC, taking advantage of the lack of domestic competitors, increase the terms and cost of contracts, and then they have a real competitor who does the work at a fixed price and on time. If USC does not want to lose the contract, you need to hurry ... I think everything is simple.
  • sergant89
    sergant89 9 September 2013 14: 59
    0
    [quote = Ruslan_F38] This is already an aircraft carrier succeed. But the construction timeline is impressive. If we were building at such a pace, then by the 2020 year we had not only frigates in sufficient numbers, but also our own aircraft carriers with escort ships, but we only have to dream of such a situation. God forbid that they would finish building what they planned. [/ Quote]
    [quote = igls] This is how people quickly build ships, not like in Russia, they drag out deadlines with money, and then bring them to mind for years [/ quote
    And there’s nothing to add, maybe it was better to buy technology and construction time
  • Maks-80
    Maks-80 9 September 2013 15: 02
    +2
    Can we order a couple of other new types of ships at their shipyards? The construction timeline is really impressive compared to ours. Well, at least before the revolution, Russia built ships in England and in France.
  • Druid
    Druid 9 September 2013 15: 11
    +1
    Quote: vaf
    Well, you flattered it, about .... no less time to equip. According to the most "modest" estimates, if there is nothing extraordinary. And it will certainly be .. or we are not .. we wassat

    Will start to rust request , then they will sell to the Chinese as a floating casino hi
    1. VAF
      VAF 9 September 2013 15: 36
      0
      Quote: Druid
      then they will be sold to the Chinese as a floating casino


      I believe in it ..... everything repeats !! +! drinks
  • VohaAhov
    VohaAhov 9 September 2013 15: 28
    +6
    Stalin was a wise man. When buying warships for the USSR abroad, he said: "When buying from us it becomes two more ships than from the imperialists. Plus one in our fleet. Minus one in theirs." Maybe I did not quote word for word, but conveyed the meaning.
  • Strashila
    Strashila 9 September 2013 15: 29
    +1
    Everything is of course wonderful ... but there is a question ... what kind of super shipbuilding technologies were the bells and whistles of the Moscow region about, like we don’t have and don’t have such an opportunity to build, the storage current could ... if half the ship was built on the move Russian shipyard ... ???
    1. Alexxeg73
      Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 11: 19
      0
      That's the pepper, there are no special "technologies" in the construction of the case. When they talk about technology, they mean propulsion, electronics. And the "box" itself is civil construction technologies. Nothing new. And the secret of speed is simple: uninterrupted supply of parts and various "bending" from shipbuilding shops to the slipway, competent organization of work, skilled workers and engineers. And you go to the website of any of our shipyards or shipyards - some are "required" ...
    2. Alexxeg73
      Alexxeg73 10 September 2013 11: 36
      0
      I won’t even reveal military secrets if I tell you the salaries at the Baltic factory where the BDK feed was built: ship inspector - 28 thousand, dock operator - 13,5 thousand, electrician - 22 thousand, rigger - 23 thousand. Engineering: power engineer 35 thousand., Mechanic 29 thousand., Constructor - 30 thousand, builder of ships - 30-40 thousand.
  • bubla5
    bubla5 9 September 2013 15: 46
    +3
    But the construction timeline is impressive. If we built at such a pace
    In our country, one generation develops a country and multiplies its power, and then another, led by several masses, destroys everything
  • ATATA
    ATATA 9 September 2013 16: 56
    0
    The main thing is that we would not have been equipped with it until 2030, otherwise the money would be for the French.
    But my heart feels that it will be so.
    Where is Stalin?
  • mr.Bear
    mr.Bear 9 September 2013 17: 05
    0
    But the construction timeline is impressive. If we built at such a pace


    Our bureaucracy takes 50% of the time ...

    And about the purpose of this ship, I see it only as support for the landing. Well, reconnaissance / rescue operations.
    1. densh
      densh 9 September 2013 21: 08
      -1
      Especially reconnaissance — on a dark night, at low speed, invisible to the radars ,, Mistral ,, hangs off the enemy coast. The enemy does not know what to think. lol
  • Sirs
    Sirs 9 September 2013 17: 52
    0
    As I understand it, we need ship design technology with a large unification of elements.
  • nikcris
    nikcris 9 September 2013 18: 17
    +2
    Quote: elmi
    It looks beautiful. Soon another combat unit will replenish the fleet. It would be nice to have Yak-141 vertical take-off aircraft there, of course, after modernization and revival of the Yak-141. In addition to helicopters, aircraft would greatly expand the combat capabilities of the warship.

    There is no Yak-141. And there is no factory. Dismantled into bricks. Only the pedestal with the Yak-38 remained.
    1. desava
      desava 9 September 2013 19: 08
      0
      Quote: nikcris
      In addition to helicopters, it would be nice to have Yak-141 vertical take-off aircraft

      I don't understand why they stuck to a hypothetical Yak-141 with also hypothetical characteristics? If I’m thinking about the placement of aircraft on board the Mistrals, it comes to my mind (also, of course, “hypothetically”) the S-47 “Berkut.” According to Wikipedia, the takeoff / run length is 90m.
  • nikcris
    nikcris 9 September 2013 18: 25
    -2
    Quote: VohaAhov
    Stalin was a wise man. When buying warships for the USSR abroad, he said: "When buying from us it becomes two more ships than from the imperialists. Plus one in our fleet. Minus one in theirs." Maybe I did not quote word for word, but conveyed the meaning.

    He was wise, no doubt. But he was too clever with the fleet - not one of our victims, unfortunately, matches the enemy’s counterparts. I would say more - ALL the dead ships do not match even one !!! (Syk !!!)
    PS Marinesko does not drag - he drowned a passenger liner.
    1. densh
      densh 9 September 2013 21: 16
      0
      Marinesko drowned military transport. And if this causes you indignation, then remember the Tallinn crossing.
  • nikcris
    nikcris 9 September 2013 19: 11
    0
    Quote: elmi
    I don’t argue that it’s a good thing to have a full-fledged aircraft carrier, but they don’t build it ... I am with both hands for the construction of aircraft carriers, but either for lack of money, or there is no determination, but they only say and promise to build, and time passes ... Everything but I think that for the first time it is possible to have hybrids of a helicopter carrier with an aircraft carrier, the design can be changed in terms of capacity. Here was an article that, if you wish, you can rebuild transport for aircraft carriers in a short time. power. Having such hybrids of avia there’s already something! The alignment of forces can be substantially changed in our favor in different regions of the planet, but it’s better than having only the 1 aircraft carrier and empty promises to build in plenty.

    Here explain to me, onshore fuel oil (s), why the hell are Russian aircraft carriers?
    Do we have remote areas requiring cover?
    Are we going to fight with New Zealand?
    Is everything all right in our house and the chickens are not biting money?
    1. desava
      desava 9 September 2013 19: 17
      +1
      The fleet for our country (in the context of a superpower) is a diplomatic weapon of foreign policy. This time. This is a non-nuclear weapon of retaliation for any potential enemy, anywhere in the world. These are two. This is a non-nuclear strike weapon. These are three. Russia is (whether she wants it or not) in the heavy weight category and it is necessary to maintain fit accordingly.
    2. Per se.
      Per se. 9 September 2013 23: 02
      0
      Quote: nikcris
      Here explain to me, onshore fuel oil (s), why the hell are Russian aircraft carriers?
      For the same reason why Russia needs aviation. There will be no need for aviation, there will be no need for aircraft carriers and, in general, all airfields. An aircraft carrier is only a mobile naval airfield for aircraft, which, in turn, are a type of weaponry, like missiles or torpedoes, is the evolution of military technology, the progress of war at sea, and not a tribute to fashion or someone's whim. And, yes, we have remote territories that require cover, these are both the areas where our strategic boats are deployed and the zones of national interests that existed before the "Cuban missile crisis" and will remain after a long time.
  • VadimSt
    VadimSt 9 September 2013 19: 19
    +3
    Quote: Pilat2009
    I wonder how they will decrypt the software part?

    You probably don't know that there is a significant difference between programming and cryptography. Any program consists of source code that is written in one of the well-known programming languages. In the absence of source code, it can always be subject to the reverse process - disassembly. Encryption, in the program code, can only be applied to text messages, such as - "Let's go nafik", everything else is stable, predictable and subject to professional analysis.
    Look, if Microsoft could protect their programs from hacking by craftsmen, I'm not talking about professionals. Simply, without the source code of the program, it will become impossible to adapt the system to your own needs and armament, so I think everything was agreed in advance, because otherwise, there was no need to purchase it.
  • nikcris
    nikcris 9 September 2013 19: 29
    0
    Quote: desava
    The fleet for our country (in the context of a superpower) is a diplomatic weapon of foreign policy. This time. This is a non-nuclear weapon of retaliation for any potential enemy, anywhere in the world. This is a non-nuclear strike weapon. Russia is (whether she wants it or not) in the heavy weight category and it is necessary to maintain fit accordingly.

    What have aircraft carriers to do with it?
    Was the weight category as stated? But then Hitler zababahala TWO "POCKET" battleships, which kept the entire scapa flow in his pocket for several years. More precisely one - Tirpitz.
    Germany did not have any aircraft carriers. Britain had. The only thing that comes to mind of their achievements is the wedge of the Bismarck's rudders, when the latter has already exceeded the task.
    PS Do not like about overfulfillment? Minus and google - in fact another similar case in recent history has a place to be.
    1. desava
      desava 9 September 2013 19: 37
      +3
      Quote: nikcris
      TWO "POCKET" battleships that kept the entire scapa flow in their pockets for several years. More precisely one - Tirpitz.

      Pocket battleships are Admiral Scheer, Admiral Graf Spee, and Lutzov (Deutschland). Their displacement is up to 16000 tons. The Bismarck and Tirpitz are much larger ships. But this amendment is not important.
      You yourself have just named the reason for the importance of an aircraft carrier - moral impact - not the last quality. Only in World War II were battleships the main striking force at first, and then gradually their role was played by aircraft carriers - the weapons of powerful powers that can afford expensive and powerful toys (like battleships at one time).
    2. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 11 September 2013 21: 34
      0
      Quote: nikcris
      The only thing that comes to mind of their achievements is the wedge of the Bismarck's rudders,

      Considering that this great achievement flew there. Have you forgotten about Taranto?
  • nikcris
    nikcris 9 September 2013 19: 45
    -1
    Quote: desava
    Quote: nikcris
    TWO "POCKET" battleships that kept the entire scapa flow in their pockets for several years. More precisely one - Tirpitz.

    Pocket battleships are Admiral Scheer, Admiral Graf Spee, and Lutzov (Deutschland). Their displacement is up to 16000 tons. The Bismarck and Tirpitz are much larger ships. But this amendment is not important.
    You yourself have just named the reason for the importance of an aircraft carrier - moral impact - not the last quality. Only in World War II were battleships the main striking force at first, and then gradually their role was played by aircraft carriers - the weapons of powerful powers that can afford expensive and powerful toys (like battleships at one time).

    YES!!! I made a mistake with my pockets, I repent.
  • arnulla
    arnulla 9 September 2013 21: 25
    0
    When will we start building at such a time?
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 9 September 2013 21: 32
    +3
    In the last iteration, i.e. in the form in which it is being built, they rushed to the other extreme, leaving it without weapons at all: two Ak-630s and two bends are nothing for such a ship, although they just asked for it around the perimeter of the 4-D ZRAK Broadsword, and RBU would not interfere, and if the current composition of the fleet has no one to cover it, so it will be an ordinary truck for a long time. Now we have three cruisers "in various points of the World Ocean", two BODs, one TFR and ten BDKs, so that amphibious assault ships sailing alone on the Okyan seas are now the norm for the Russian Navy. UKSK would definitely not hurt the domestic Mistrals, especially given the announced plans to use them as anti-submarine helicopter carriers. Yours faithfully! hi
  • ksan
    ksan 9 September 2013 21: 32
    -2
    It seems that I did not go to the "military site" but to Bolotnaya Square smile "Everything is lost, everything is lost", "everything was stolen", "ships are not built", "there are no weapons, only tugs are floating" laughing The United States has about 40 bases and points of repair and supply of the Navy around the world, therefore, tugboats do not "hang out" after ships, but stand on them. And we build ships as much as there is enough money. And the Soviet fleet was always weaker than the American one, but it resisted always worthy. Take even the Indo-Pakistani conflict, even the Arab-Israeli wars. Do you know why? Then there were fewer whiners, and more soldiers and patriots hi
  • nikcris
    nikcris 9 September 2013 22: 57
    0
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    In the last iteration, i.e. in the form in which it is being built, they rushed to the other extreme, leaving it without weapons at all: two Ak-630s and two bends are nothing for such a ship, although they just asked for it around the perimeter of the 4-D ZRAK Broadsword, and RBU would not interfere, and if the current composition of the fleet has no one to cover it, so it will be an ordinary truck for a long time. Now we have three cruisers "in various points of the World Ocean", two BODs, one TFR and ten BDKs, so that amphibious assault ships sailing alone on the Okyan seas are now the norm for the Russian Navy. UKSK would definitely not hurt the domestic Mistrals, especially given the announced plans to use them as anti-submarine helicopter carriers. Yours faithfully! hi

    I don’t understand anything. Have you praised or scolded? If the first, then a helicopter with a torpedo is a drop dead when the input is a penny.
    If the latter, then a helicopter with a torpedo is a dolce-money tool for searching for sunken whales.
  • fedor
    fedor 10 September 2013 10: 12
    0
    Quote: Andrey Yurievich
    Andrey Yuryevich

    I gave the navy a little less than 50 years, commanded many ships, formations, served at headquarters of several levels, lived for more than 14 years in the seas and oceans, solving combat missions on command bridges, and solved combat tasks in combat contact at sea and on land, on this basis I have repeatedly stated and continue to assert that this ship does not meet the requirements for solving the tasks of our Navy, I have listed the reasons many times, I will not repeat myself. The contract to build this ship is a political deal. This ship can only be operated in southern latitudes and only in peacetime, provided that a basing system and all types of support (combat, special-technical, logistic) are created for it, which will require costs several times higher than the cost of the ship itself. In a threatened period and in wartime, the Navy will not have enough forces to support its combat support, it will be destroyed in the first hour of the start of the DB. The ship will go into operation no earlier than in three or four years, a year for more saturation and armament, six months for factory and state. tests, two years for trial operation, six months for the restoration of the resource after testing and trial operation. And this is only if everything goes "without a hitch," which never happens ... God grant that I was wrong.
    1. Andrey Yuryevich
      Andrey Yuryevich 10 September 2013 11: 16
      +1
      if you are this to me, so I said the same thing hi
  • mithridate
    mithridate 10 September 2013 10: 55
    0
    French by French, but it’s better to build military equipment yourself
  • zveroboy61
    zveroboy61 10 September 2013 11: 40
    0
    I agree, prepare your gun yourself. I read a lot about equipment, but I just can’t understand why we need this fuel truck.
  • malikszh
    malikszh 10 September 2013 12: 45
    0
    Well Frenchmen quickly build well done
  • Egor.nic
    Egor.nic 10 September 2013 13: 22
    0
    Useless trough, and what money was paid to the contractor, and how much more would be required to adapt it to our armament and military equipment. And spare parts and repair kits ...
    Yes, I recall the old saying - the more oaks in the army, the stronger our defense.
  • Pilat2009
    Pilat2009 11 September 2013 21: 28
    0
    Quote: Pilat2009
    Quote: zadorin1974
    maybe the chel somehow went wrong

    Sorry if I offended. But my post is very neutral. Greetings from Yekaterinburg