Military Review

Noise-resistant American GPS will not be a problem for Russian “jammers”

122
The U.S. military said it had successfully tested a new noise-free satellite navigation system. Due to the use of new antennas, the designers were able to obtain a signal from the satellites of the GPS global positioning system even in the conditions of creating active interference with directional radiation. In particular, the resource naval-technology.com wrote about this. According to information from this source, a successful experiment was conducted on aviation US Navy base in Maryland using an UAV. This drone was equipped with special antennas and was in the laboratory, the walls of which were covered with special radio-absorbing materials.


The US Navy complex in Maryland, located on the Pataxen River, is used to conduct all sorts of radio engineering studies, as well as the training of air traffic controllers. Here is one of the largest runways on the entire east coast of the states, its length is more than 4-x kilometers.

In the course of the tests conducted on an experimental drone, new-type antennas were installed, after which the UAVs were installed in a specially prepared laboratory. To imitate interference, special radio transmitters were used, and the walls of the laboratory were previously covered with a special radio absorbing material. This laboratory allowed the researchers to simulate a sufficiently large number of various situations without the risk of losing UAVs and with minimal contribution from extraneous factors. The experiments confirmed the fact that through the use of special antennas, the effects of directional jammers can be neutralized. It is significant that the power and spectrum of interference that the antenna can withstand are not reported.

Noise-resistant American GPS will not be a problem for Russian “jammers”

Earlier, a number of English-language media wrote that a group of students from the United States, together with his teacher, had succeeded in faking GPS signals and knocking a civilian yacht in the Mediterranean off of its intended course. After that, one of the senators from the state of Texas expressed serious concern about the possibility of such an impact on warships, UAVs, or any civilian vehicles whose use is associated with an increased level of risk. Then the military simply ignored the policy, but work on the development of noise-free satellite navigation was started much earlier.

This is not unusual, as the satellite navigation system is very important today. As is often the case with almost all high-tech projects, the initiator of the creation and construction of a GPS (Global Positioning System) system was the military. The newest satellite network project for determining the coordinates of targets and objects in real time anywhere in the world has been called Navstar (Navigation system with timing and ranging), while the acronym GPS familiar today to every schoolboy appeared already later, when the system began to be applied not only in defense, but also for civilian purposes.

Today, GPS is much more actively used for civilian needs, this project has received good commercialization, and GPS receivers are being built into almost all modern devices today, perhaps not in irons. The key point in the development of GPS was the decision of the US President on 1 in May of 2000, when the so-called selective access was canceled - an error that was artificially introduced into satellite signals for inaccurate operation and positioning of ordinary civilian receivers. From this day, any amateur GPS-receiver could determine your coordinates with an accuracy of several meters (previously, this error was tens of meters).


The satellite grouping of the GPS global positioning system orbits around our planet in circular orbits with the same height and orbital period for all the launched satellites. Circular orbit with a height of about 20 200 km. is the orbit of the daily multiplicity with a period of 11 hours in 58 hours. Due to this, each satellite makes 2 full orbits around the planet in one stellar day - 23 hours 56 minutes. The satellite 24 in space ensures full system operation at any point on the earth’s surface, and they cannot always ensure a good position calculation and reliable reception. For this reason, in order to improve the accuracy and speed of positioning, as well as reserve for the occurrence of abnormal situations and failures, the total number of satellites is maintained in greater numbers, for example, in March 2010 was in orbit with the 31 satellite of this system.

However, according to Russian experts, the measures that the US military is taking to protect GPS signal receivers are insufficient and do not present any problems for modern Russian electronic countermeasures (REB). In particular, Oleg Antonov, the director of Aviaconversion, thinks so. According to him, Russian specialists have known about such developments for quite a long time, about 7 years ago, and even then, in our country, devices were developed that are able to suppress a new noise-tolerant system with a high degree of probability.

Oleg Antonov explained to journalists that it is most likely a matter of the well-known development of Lockheed, which is a combination of the main and additional six-section antennas around it. According to the calculations of a specialist, this device is able to reduce the interference power from a certain direction approximately 10-20 times. “At the same time, the power of interference signals of Russian modern REB facilities is a million times higher than the level of useful GPS signals, therefore, the conclusion about the effectiveness of using such noise-tolerant devices is obvious,” the Russian expert in the field of creating REB tools said.


Knowing the exact direction to the source of interference also plays a fairly important role in reducing the level of interference. However, when working with several sources of interference, the task is very difficult. In a personal conversation, a representative of the American company "Lockheed" told Antonov about the work on creating a special interference finder that would reduce the level of interference at all on the 10-15 decibel, despite the fact that the interference created by EW devices exceeds the level of GPS signals at the 60 decibel. On the question of what to do when working with several sources of interference, "they threw up their hands." As the director of the company, "miracles do not happen, this is advertising."

Significant reduction of interference efficiency can be achieved only with the help of a sharp increase in the power of signals emitted by satellites. But today it’s unrealistic to put this way into practice, the Russian expert noted. Today, Americans have begun to use new GPS signals based on outdated REP products. “But in Russia such interference transmitters are produced that are able to suppress any such signals,” Oleg Antonov noted.

Information sources:
-http: //rosinform.ru/2013/08/15/pomekhoustoychivaya-amerikanskaya-gps-ne-problema-dlya-russkikh-glushilok
-http: //lenta.ru/news/2013/08/12/gpsjamming
-http: //www.ixbt.com/car/gps/gps.html
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  1. Nayhas
    Nayhas 4 September 2013 08: 18
    +2
    a group of students from the United States, together with their teacher, managed to fake GPS signals and knock down a civilian yacht in the Mediterranean from the intended course

    The possibility of suppressing the civilian traffic police channel is of course a thing of the past, only the military do not work on it.
    In a personal conversation, a representative of the Lockheed American company told Antonov about the work on creating a special interference direction finder that would reduce the level of interference by only 10-15 decibels, while the interference caused by electronic warfare equipment exceeds the GPS signal level by 60 decibels. To the question of what should be done when working with several sources of interference at once, "they spread their hands." As the director of the company noted, "there are no miracles, this is advertising."

    Did Antonov believe that the American laid out the whole story for him? Somewhat naive ...
    While the examples of suppressing GPS signals used by the military are not known (reliable), they will probably appear soon or not. EW is very important, but all this should be in reasonable dimensions and prices so that it would be possible to saturate the units with them ...
    1. Genry
      Genry 4 September 2013 09: 36
      +3
      1. The most effective way to suppress GPS is to destroy satellites.
      2. You can distort the position of your companions.
      3. Simply rudely make noise on GPS frequencies from airborne or ground-based electronic warfare.
      This is all at the level of "special importance".
      1. roial
        roial 4 September 2013 09: 53
        -11 qualifying.
        The most effective way to suppress GPS is to destroy satellites.


        To do this, you need to have the appropriate technology and practice. Tell me, who, besides China and the USA, have been practicing the destruction of spacecraft recently?

        You can distort the position of your companions.


        How? Accelerate Radio Waves? If you mean fake signals, then if I’m not mistaken, the signals for the army go in encrypted form, and they must first be opened, and for this you need to bring the satellite to the right point, and so on. tp

        Just rudely make noise on GPS frequencies from airborne or ground-based electronic warfare.


        GPS frequencies are in the microwave range, therefore, the presence of a forest array between the jammer and the GPS receiver, of any buildings, and simply of terrain, negates all attempts to muffle the receiver, and the life of the air-based jammers will be very short (see for example)
        1. pinachet
          pinachet 4 September 2013 13: 45
          14
          our satellite destruction technology worked out in the 60s of the year.
          1. roial
            roial 4 September 2013 14: 19
            -4
            and when was the last time it was practiced? There, probably, who knew how to do this already in retirement and the equipment has long been written off, is there something new, and not 60's technology?
            1. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 15: 25
              +9
              Quote: roial
              and when was the last time it was practiced? There, probably, who knew how to do this already in retirement and the equipment has long been written off, is there something new, and not 60's technology?

              Breaking - not building. The technology for disrupting the operation of GPS signal transceivers is simple to disgrace.
            2. pinachet
              pinachet 4 September 2013 19: 43
              +1
              it is constantly being worked out. the principle of its operation is simple, the satellite starts and explodes where necessary, and a multi-kilometer loop of fragments sweeps away everything. so in real life you only need to control the satellite from the ground, and the tsup is constantly engaged in this.
              1. roial
                roial 4 September 2013 21: 42
                -2
                Well, as they say, neither to themselves nor to people, but how after such an explosion are you going to use your companions ???
            3. Mature naturalist
              Mature naturalist 4 September 2013 22: 56
              -1
              Quote: roial
              who knew how to do it already in retirement and the technology has long been written off, is there something new, and not the technology of the 60s?

              "We've got enough nails" - not a quote, but close to the text
          2. postman
            postman 4 September 2013 23: 40
            0
            Quote: pinachet
            our satellite destruction technology worked out in the 60s of the year

            don't smack nonsense, she screeches
            60s, this is 1960-1970 ...
            1st satellite 1958
            Gagarin-1961
            etc.
            “Flight-1”, and 2 = it is a fiction, for TASS reporting, as in the rest of the “Cosmos-249” and “Cosmos-248” sparks, which had to be completed a month later with the help of “Cosmos-252”.

            That which we had on the database ("Cyclone", etc.) in the 80s (!!!!!) "operated" at altitudes from 250 to 1000 km, for the system based on the MIG31-rocket was not manufactured. ..
        2. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 15: 20
          +4
          Quote: roial
          GPS frequencies relate to the microwave range, therefore the presence of a forest massif between the jammer and the GPS receiver, any buildings, and just the folds of the terrain nullifies all attempts to muffle the receiver

          Well, who will be the "jammer" in the forest, hide under a tree stump? laughing
          The whole system of "protection" can and will consist of filtering the GPS signal. Just how to filter water from water?
          And in Mediterranean it will be much "cooler" than it was on the roadstead of Baltiysk, when all GPS receivers all over the district "fell" in the process of a watchdog check with a mechanism and turning weapons, carried out by a pair of our patrolmen.
          1. Rumata
            Rumata 4 September 2013 15: 26
            -2
            Quote: stalkerwalker
            all GPS receivers "fell".

            Can I clarify? All military receivers? Or civilians?
            1. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 15: 50
              13
              Quote: Rumata
              Or civilians?

              Civilians.
              To the indignant cry "I told you so!" I will explain again - the warriors have the same GPS receivers, only the setting is different - channels, etc. But the laws of physics apply equally to the military and civilians.
              1. roial
                roial 4 September 2013 21: 45
                -1
                If it would be so simple and possible, the MO would not spend money on deploying the GLONAS network and introducing GPS / Glonas receivers in the army
                1. stalkerwalker
                  stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 22: 33
                  +4
                  Quote: roial
                  If it would be so simple and possible, the MO would not spend money on deploying the GLONAS network and introducing GPS / Glonas receivers in the army

                  Each self-respecting power should have its own Satellite Navigation System, independent of other "partners".
                  The pioneers of this movement were the USA and the USSR - "Transit" and "Tsikada", respectively, whose primary task was to ensure the accuracy of the position of the SSBN.
                  Well, if, tomorrow is a war ... It is common for the army and navy to suffer certain losses in the name of victory, for which they were created.
                  1. stalkerwalker
                    stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 23: 43
                    +3
                    Quote: stalkerwalker
                    Well, if, tomorrow is a war ... It is common for the army and navy to suffer certain losses in the name of victory, for which they were created.

                    Who didn’t like it? Could be noted.
            2. Mature naturalist
              Mature naturalist 4 September 2013 22: 58
              0
              Quote: Rumata
              Quote: stalkerwalker
              all GPS receivers "fell".

              Can I clarify? All military receivers? Or civilians?

              Why are you interested in?
      2. postman
        postman 4 September 2013 22: 11
        +1
        1. Nonsense. The cost of destroying a satellite is from $ 130. And then if you get there.
        And there are 20 of them (satellites).
        2. To do this, at a minimum, you must have a group of YOUR satellites, and still it will not do anything: the satellites move + the area of ​​a sphere with a radius of 23 km is enormous.
        3. Bullshit like Antonov’s insinuations (I'd better sing a song :)): where is the satellite (20500km) and where is the vehicle (or la) electronic warfare?
        And where is the object instructing the signal.
        Remind me how signal intensity decreases from distance?
        Try to "make noise"
        "Voice of America", "Freedom" made a lot of noise?
        I could calmly listen.
        ???? What is such an OWL?
        Take an interest in what FAPSI works on
    2. neri73-r
      neri73-r 4 September 2013 14: 47
      +3
      There were cases, and more than once, the most famous one in the first Iraqi one, in the early 90s, was still used by the USSR Armed Forces, as I understood it was tested. Google about it in neta infa is.
    3. Max
      Max 4 September 2013 21: 56
      0
      While the examples of suppressing GPS signals used by the military are not known (reliable), they will probably appear soon or not. EW is very important, but all this should be in reasonable dimensions and prices so that it would be possible to saturate the units with them ...
      I think every radio engineer is able to assemble a GPS jammer.
      1. ICT
        ICT 4 September 2013 22: 12
        0
        Quote: Max
        I think every radio engineer is able to assemble a GPS jammer


        but I know that every other
        Quote: Max
        radio engineer
        can assemble a selector of its signal against a background of noise (here are spears that pierce all shields, but shields that do not pierce any spear .... an advertising inscription on an arms store in ancient China)
      2. postman
        postman 4 September 2013 23: 27
        +1
        Quote: Max
        I think every radio engineer is able to assemble a GPS jammer.

        Of course ... the Uzbek builder is the same: metal for example.
        but this is not the task: to put the jammer in order, la, and the roof of metal roof tiles above it.

        all of this is difficult, it’s simpler (if you have already determined the location of the object being wound up and reached it),
    4. postman
      postman 4 September 2013 22: 23
      0
      1. About the "military channel". What's the difference? It was a pure demonstration of the possibility.
      And there is no "military channel" for GPS. Otherwise, there would be no point in introducing a positioning error.
      1 n channel, 1 frequency (or rather, several of them: carrier, etc.)
      2. Either Antonov or the journalist sculpt the fuzz in the audience:
      - a drop in power, signal intensity from apt. Distances, masterpieces satellite (20500km) and where is the source of electronic warfare? Where is the object of attack?
      3. The false signal is easily filtered: the position of the satellite and its relative speed cannot be simulated.

      And what about "suppression authentically" ... The roof of a house, a car, a thunderstorm front, etc.
    5. poquello
      poquello 5 September 2013 01: 35
      +2
      Quote: Nayhas
      a group of students from the United States, together with their teacher, managed to fake GPS signals and knock down a civilian yacht in the Mediterranean from the intended course

      The possibility of suppressing the civilian traffic police channel is of course a thing of the past, only the military do not work on it.
      .
      While the examples of suppressing GPS signals used by the military are not known (reliable), they will probably appear soon or not.

      In ancient Chinese acupuncture medicine, there is a legend that from burning every first ten days of the lunar month every month a person will live 300 years, no one has confirmed, but he has not refuted either.
      Amers may have a tricky error correction protocol; ours has extensive experience in combating dissent with the help of jammers from the times of the USSR. IMHO noise immunity is directly proportional to braking.
  2. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 4 September 2013 08: 25
    +8
    Well, what’s the matter, immediately all this to Syria for testing. It’s interesting how the bandits' allies will sing when they stray from the course of the Kyrgyz Republic will fly onto their heads, and preferably back to the launchers. Less chatter, more work. What kind of idiots you have to be to put out a fire with kerosene (which the states do)!
    1. Veles25
      Veles25 4 September 2013 08: 44
      -17 qualifying.
      There are no analogues in the world again
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 4 September 2013 14: 38
        -1
        Quote: Veles25
        There are no analogues in the world again

        If no one knows about them, then probably an argument. This phrase is always used to write off a lot of money for useless development.
        1. poquello
          poquello 5 September 2013 01: 49
          +1
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Quote: Veles25
          There are no analogues in the world again

          If no one knows about them, then probably an argument. This phrase is always used to write off a lot of money for useless development.


          This phrase sometimes used to write off a lot of money for useless development.
      2. ultra
        ultra 4 September 2013 16: 13
        +9
        Quote: Veles25
        There are no analogues in the world again

        It depends on what! If the idiocy of the US leadership, then definitely not!
        1. Veles25
          Veles25 4 September 2013 16: 24
          -2
          LOL ..............
    2. KBPC50
      KBPC50 4 September 2013 09: 38
      +3
      Judging by the fact that they (the Yankees) are afraid to fly over Syria, such electronic warfare systems are already in service. And nonsense is all gps is not such a stable system. A pair of antediluvian magnetrons will suppress everything and everyone. And power will be required as a motor from one GAZ51. It is necessary to press at the receiving point, i.e. on Tomahawk. He (the tomahawk) will simply become an iron ax that cannot fly by itself, and swim too!
      1. Rumata
        Rumata 4 September 2013 14: 05
        -1
        Quote: KBPC50
        Judging by the fact that they (the Yankees) are afraid to fly over Syria, such electronic warfare systems are already in service. And nonsense is all gps is not such a stable system. A pair of antediluvian magnetrons will suppress everything and everyone. And power will be required as a motor from one GAZ51. It is necessary to press at the receiving point, i.e. on Tomahawk. He (the tomahawk) will simply become an iron ax that cannot fly by itself, and swim too!

        Rave...
      2. Veles25
        Veles25 4 September 2013 16: 26
        -7
        your crazy stories
      3. postman
        postman 4 September 2013 23: 24
        -1
        Quote: KBPC50
        A pair of antediluvian magnetrons will suppress everything and everyone. And power will be required as a motor from one GAZ51. It is necessary to press at the receiving point, i.e. on Tomahawk.

        Vampor to school, to class 7 my for a start ... Fortunately, September 1 recently "hit" ... you still have time
  3. roial
    roial 4 September 2013 08: 33
    -1
    Judging by the complexes that are in service, there is currently no way to suppress GPS signals.
    “At the same time, the power of interference signals of modern Russian electronic warfare equipment is a million times higher than the level of useful GPS signals

    What are these funds and where were they in conflict with Georgia ??
    1. Veles25
      Veles25 4 September 2013 08: 42
      -12 qualifying.
      according to Russian experts.


      here's how ..
    2. KBPC50
      KBPC50 4 September 2013 09: 40
      +3
      Means were. But the Yankees used a systemic change of coordinates i.e. 1km to the left and 1 further or closer, and so they planted a Polish government plane. Everything is just ridiculously.
      1. Papakiko
        Papakiko 4 September 2013 12: 51
        +3
        Quote: KBPC50
        so they handed over the Polish government plane

        Course-glide path beacons for which the hell are created and shy?

    3. Egor.nic
      Egor.nic 4 September 2013 14: 53
      +9
      You're not right. It is possible to suppress any communication and broadcasting system. It's all about the approach and implementation method. On any tricky nut, a tricky bolt will always be created.
      But, as a matter of fact, in the 90s they already knew how to jam the frequency hopping and ShPS systems. Suppress the usual broadcast system, there are also methods.
  4. slavik_gross
    slavik_gross 4 September 2013 08: 41
    +4
    I hope all this is in Syria ?! And we will see everything in action ...
    1. AVV
      AVV 4 September 2013 09: 30
      +5
      I would like to hope that these developments of electronic warfare of the Russian and Belarusian production are already in place !!!
    2. Oberst_71
      Oberst_71 5 September 2013 08: 26
      0
      nichrome is not there.
  5. pensioner
    pensioner 4 September 2013 08: 54
    +4
    “At the same time, the power of interference signals of modern Russian electronic warfare equipment is a million times higher than the level of useful GPS signals, so the conclusion about the effectiveness of using such noise-immunity devices is obvious”,

    Amers urgently need to install Tetris receivers in their ZhPS. After all, a soldier must do something if the FPS does not work ...
    1. a52333
      a52333 4 September 2013 09: 05
      +5
      They won’t have no time for Tetris, they don’t go on paper cards, they will get lost in their garden.
      1. KBPC50
        KBPC50 4 September 2013 09: 42
        +4
        That's right, not up to Tetris !!! The cards are forgotten. Get lost in Syria.
        1. Bort radist
          Bort radist 4 September 2013 17: 23
          +3
          Quote: KBPC50
          The cards are forgotten. Get lost in Syria.

          They raised us at night, on alarm! The commander with the navigator comes running up, the commander shows "Start" and asks the navigator - "Did you take the cards?" He answers - "Yes". It turned out he took the playing ones, and those wassat . Good take off and hang up!
  6. HAM
    HAM 4 September 2013 09: 22
    +8
    Do you remember how much screaming there was when the “free radio lovers” (radio hooligans from the Saratov region) drowned out the communication channels of the British Air Force? So you can and should press.
    1. KBPC50
      KBPC50 4 September 2013 09: 47
      +4
      Suppress !!! 100%
      1. Bort radist
        Bort radist 4 September 2013 17: 27
        0
        "It is significant that the power and spectrum of interference that the antenna can withstand are not reported." Keywords. Their invisible, invisible to their radar with a decimeter range.
    2. Rumata
      Rumata 4 September 2013 14: 09
      -6
      Quote: HAM
      Do you remember how much screaming there was when "lovers of free radio" (radio hooligans from the Saratov region) drowned out the communication channels of the British Air Force? So you can and should

      I haven’t heard this story, but what does the communication channels and GPS have to do with it? It’s like writing "Do you remember how our synchronized swimmers took almost all the gold at the Olympics ?? Now Brazil has no chances for the World Cup!" The tomato is red, and the tractor door opens
      1. Egor.nic
        Egor.nic 4 September 2013 14: 55
        +3
        Did you understand what you said? Tea is not in the circus ....
      2. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 15: 27
        +8
        Quote: Rumata
        I have not heard this story, but where does the communication channels and GPS?

        Teach materiel - there is such a section in physics as the theory of propagation of radio waves. Everything is spelled out there ...
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 16: 37
          +4
          Quote: stalkerwalker
          Teach materiel - there is such a section in physics as the theory of propagation of radio waves. Everything is spelled out there ...

          You would, comrade, first look into the textbook, and then poke the minus ... laughing
          1. Rumata
            Rumata 4 September 2013 17: 01
            -2
            Quote: stalkerwalker
            You would, comrade, first look into the textbook, and then poke the minus ...

            If this is for me, then I did not give you a minus., But judging by your comments in this topic, read the textbook, but somehow everything just comes out for you. On my knee, I can bungle a "jammer" for a radio a meter away from me, probably I will drown out the GPS without any problems, the same thing!
            1. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 17: 22
              +8
              Quote: Rumata
              On my knee, I can bungle a "jammer" for a radio a meter away from me, probably I will drown out the GPS without any problems, the same thing!

              And you try - and test not far from the nearest military base. You will learn about the reaction personally. laughing
      3. The comment was deleted.
  7. 77bor1973
    77bor1973 4 September 2013 09: 49
    +2
    At one time in Iraq, most of the axes did not reach the target.
  8. Kubatai
    Kubatai 4 September 2013 10: 19
    +1
    A carriage of nails - and there is no orbital grouping. True, no one laughing
    1. rlanry
      rlanry 4 September 2013 11: 51
      +3
      Do you know in what orbit the GPS satellites work? 24 thousand km. What are you going to throw nails there?
      1. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 4 September 2013 14: 44
        +1
        Quote: rlanry
        What are you going to throw nails there?

        Few decommissioned missiles? I would buy a box of screws for this topic in gratitude to the pendos.
        1. rlanry
          rlanry 4 September 2013 15: 48
          -1
          Quote: Ingvar 72
          Quote: rlanry
          What are you going to throw nails there?

          Few decommissioned missiles? I would buy a box of screws for this topic in gratitude to the pendos.

          Existing missiles do not fly to such a range, that’s the whole point.
          1. fzr1000
            fzr1000 4 September 2013 17: 15
            11
            Those. GPS satellites were there as a result of a miracle or a UFO?
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. The comment was deleted.
          4. spravochnik
            spravochnik 4 September 2013 21: 33
            0
            And what did they throw them there? From a slingshot or what? A box of nails on any lighter companion will be.
          5. bif
            bif 4 September 2013 22: 55
            0
            Dear, do not talk about a topic about which you did not even bother to just look at the Internet.
            1. Contact with a satellite is not a prerequisite for interception, there is enough reason to believe that the USSR developed plans to detonate a 1-10 megaton nuclear warhead in a certain "square", which "blinded" the satellite like a mine to death. True, there was a great risk of damaging our own.
            2. ".. August 18, 1983, the statement of the head of our state sounded, and the complex fell silent. I emphasize, he fell silent, and did not" die. "He was still on alert, and Soviet specialists stopped any tests in space ..." "Anatoly Dokuchaev." FIRE AMONG THE STARS "I recommend reading, all of a sudden your BLIND SKEPSIS will see through.
            1. postman
              postman 5 September 2013 00: 58
              +1
              Quote: bif
              1-10 megaton ball in a certain "square

              1. it is necessary to undermine not in a square, but in a cube, but rather in a 4-dimensional coordinate grid (+ time)
              try to get into a moving point on the surface of a sphere with a radius of 25000 + 3300 km ....
              2. there were no "megatons"
              OPERATION “K”
              1,2,3 from 1,2 kT to 300 kT at altitudes from 150 to 300 km, an attempt to destroy the DS-A1 (open name “Cosmos-11”) is unsuccessful, the R-9 rocket fell 20 meters from the launch pad

              In total, nine explosions were carried out: the Americans blew up five nuclear charges, the Soviet Union - four charges.
              The Americans, undermined the W-49 with a capacity of 1,4 MT at an altitude of about 400 kilometers, the carrier rocket “Tor” with serial number 195:
              "The Soviet satellite Kosmos-5, being 1200 kilometers below the explosion horizon, recorded an instantaneous increase in the intensity of gamma radiation by several orders of magnitude, followed by a decrease by two orders of magnitude in 100 seconds. After the explosion, a vast and powerful radiation belt arose in the Earth's magnetosphere. at least three satellites that entered it were damaged due to the rapid degradation of solar batteries.The presence of this belt had to be taken into account when planning flights of the manned spacecraft Vostok-3 and Vostok-4 in August 1962 and Mercury- 8 ”in October of the same year. The effects of the pollution of the magnetosphere have been visible for several years."
              Quote: bif
              that as a mine to death "blinded"

              not a minimum and not any "death"
              Quote: bif
              I emphasize, I fell silent, not "died." He was still on alert


              Nonsense, complete. No where, or what is not (even on conservation), so dirty "alert":
              Agreement on the Principles of Activities of States for the Exploration and Use of Outer Space, including the Moon and Other Celestial Bodies / dated January 27, 1967

              Treaty Banning Testing Nuclear Weapons in the Atmosphere, Outer Space and Underwater (Moscow Treaty) August 5, 1963

              ABM Treaty May 26, 1972

              everything is there and the database and disposal and control and storage ...
              Yes, and does not live as many PSO
              1. SASCHAmIXEEW
                SASCHAmIXEEW 5 September 2013 11: 13
                0
                And what, are all these contracts being fulfilled? It's unlikely ... Amer put everything on ... with the device!
  9. Tourist Breakfast
    Tourist Breakfast 4 September 2013 10: 59
    -6
    Antonov on the work on creating a special interference direction finder, which would reduce the level of interference by only 10-15 decibels, despite the fact that the interference caused by electronic warfare means exceeds the level of GPS signals by 60 decibels.


    This "electronic warfare agent" is just some kind of Death Star! Curious how long it will live on the battlefield.
    1. Professor
      Professor 4 September 2013 15: 31
      -5
      Quote: Tourist's Breakfast
      means of electronic warfare "just some kind of Death Star! I wonder how long it will live on the battlefield.

      And you ask another question: where did it manifest itself and whom has it helped lately?
      1. Veles25
        Veles25 4 September 2013 16: 30
        -7
        people create their own tales
        1. Kir
          Kir 4 September 2013 19: 35
          0
          What really forgotten the need to lock the ward number 6 must inform the orderlies. By the way, the place where you live is a fairy tale, but rather a lie produces like a crazy printer so ....
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. spravochnik
        spravochnik 4 September 2013 21: 46
        0
        Iran, for example, an American UAV plant.
      4. ruslan207
        ruslan207 4 September 2013 23: 16
        0
        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%91%D0%9A%D0%9E_%C2%AB%D0%A2%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B8%D
        1%81%D0%BC%D0%B0%D0%BD%C2%BB
      5. ruslan207
        ruslan207 5 September 2013 07: 29
        +1
        Professor Iran, for example, planted an American drone with the help of a reb. Here is a fresh example for you
        1. Professor
          Professor 5 September 2013 09: 45
          0
          Quote: ruslan207
          Professor Iran, for example, planted an American drone with the help of a reb. Here is a fresh example for you

          I read fairy tales of 1000 and read one night only before bedtime and then not myself.
          1. ruslan207
            ruslan207 6 September 2013 07: 42
            0
            It is your right to believe or not to believe. I personally believe.
    2. beard999
      beard999 4 September 2013 16: 47
      +3
      Quote: Tourist's Breakfast
      curious how long it will live on the battlefield

      And what are you going to take them to the "battlefield"? A gain of 60 dB is achieved in very compact PP devices (for example only: http://niiekran.ru/prod_ppoi.php). If we talk specifically about the suppression of the SNA, then here the equipment is quite small-sized http://img15.nnm.me/6/5/8/8/f/4cb398862a1da3656d7f207b654.jpg
      http://www.qsl.net/n/n9zia/wireless/pics/gpsjam-7.jpg . В том числе и при использования АПФАР, для повышения эффективности ПП http://www.protek-vrn.ru/production/reb/apfar.html . Тем более, что для защиты территории или ТВД, таких передатчиков и антенных систем, можно разместить десятки и сотни.
      1. Tourist Breakfast
        Tourist Breakfast 5 September 2013 00: 49
        -1
        And what are you going to take them to the "battlefield"?

        "Harm", for example.

        60dB gain achieved in very compact PP devices

        Here it is rather not a matter of gain, but of output power, as such. The signal power, as is known, decreases in proportion to the square of the distance.
        So estimate at what distance from the GPS receiver the interference will actually be 60 decibels higher than the signal, in the case of a compact interference source.

        Moreover, to protect the territory or theater, such transmitters and antenna systems, you can place dozens and hundreds.


        Except that.
  10. rlanry
    rlanry 4 September 2013 11: 45
    +6
    The GPS signal is not a priori adapted to high protection against interference. It is vulnerable due to the very principle of signal construction and the method of determining coordinates based on it.
    What has now been achieved in terms of noise immunity is nothing more than shallow tricks that do not fundamentally change the situation and are able to cope only with small local noise.
    To radically improve the situation, you need to completely change the satellite constellation to a new one, with a higher signal level and its other look. But only who will do it - it's crazy expenses ...
    1. Rumata
      Rumata 4 September 2013 14: 13
      -6
      Quote: rlanry
      The GPS signal is not a priori adapted to high protection against interference. It is vulnerable due to the very principle of signal construction and the method of determining coordinates based on it.

      Radio waves are also not a priori adapted to protection from interference, and they are also vulnerable. But in reality, it’s not so simple, and if you take military use of both radio and GPS, completely drowning them out is very difficult. And if they did this with the radio, then it hasn’t worked out with GPS yet, and I don’t mean civil GPS. If your navigator is in the car, it’s easy to fool it doesn’t mean that it’s just as easy with tamahawks ...
      1. Egor.nic
        Egor.nic 4 September 2013 15: 08
        +1
        Do not expect ....
        "Tamaghawk", as a means of radio reception, in the first place, will be inflicted maximum damage when setting smart interference. Much will not reach, but some will return to the launch point. Accurate and ultra-precise weapons are good in the war between the Martians and the Papuans. And firing a smart cannon at smart sparrows is a circus.
        1. Rumata
          Rumata 4 September 2013 15: 21
          +1
          Quote: Egor.nic
          "Tamaghawk", as a means of radio reception, in the first place, will be inflicted maximum damage when setting smart interference. Much will not reach, but some will return to the launch point. Accurate and ultra-precise weapons are good in the war between the Martians and the Papuans. And firing a smart cannon at smart sparrows is a circus.

          The pro will return to the launch point, just super. I am glad that on this site there are people who are at least a little versed in the things about which they reason. And yes it was sarcasm, write it is still very important for us to know your opinion on all issues !!
        2. Veles25
          Veles25 4 September 2013 16: 32
          -7
          another wise guy
  11. saag
    saag 4 September 2013 11: 49
    +1
    or switch to pulsar orientation :-)
  12. Lopatov
    Lopatov 4 September 2013 13: 14
    +6
    And what, in fact, will this jamming of ZhPS give?
    For example, we have a Very Important Object that needs to be protected. We put JPS jammers, jamming the signal within a radius of 5 km. Potential partners shoot at the "OVO" with their unparalleled world Excalibur. The range is, for example, 10 km. Will jamming ZhPS help? No. The projectile has an inertial guidance system with correction based on global positioning data. By the time it enters the jamming zone, the projectile has already “worked out” the main errors of aiming the gun and the inertia system will be enough for it to confidently hit the target.

    So maybe it’s not worth the hassle?
    1. Professor
      Professor 4 September 2013 15: 29
      +6
      Quote: Spade
      And what, in fact, will this jamming of ZhPS give?

      Absolutely agree. Today, almost all systems are duplicated by inertia.
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 4 September 2013 15: 44
        +7
        Rather, on the contrary, global positioning is not the main source of obtaining location data, but serves only for correction
        1. Professor
          Professor 4 September 2013 16: 10
          0
          Not always, the latest high-precision bombs (more precisely, kits for the conversion of ordinary bombs) are equipped with purely GPS guidance. Therefore, no one bothers to carry out accurate bombing.
      2. yanus
        yanus 4 September 2013 16: 53
        +3
        Quote: Professor
        Absolutely agree. Today, almost all systems are duplicated by inertia.

        What makes them not just expensive, but very expensive
        1. Professor
          Professor 4 September 2013 17: 07
          -1
          Quote: yanus
          What makes them not just expensive, but very expensive

          Yah? Sound pliz cost of the standard module of inertial guidance?




          1. yanus
            yanus 4 September 2013 17: 30
            +3
            Quote: Professor
            Quote: yanus
            What makes them not just expensive, but very expensive

            Yah? Sound pliz cost of the standard module of inertial guidance?

            Well, you little bit yourself MIL-STD .. MIL-STD ..
            And then they rolled down to civilian chips, with civilian characteristics. Fi ..
            1. Professor
              Professor 4 September 2013 17: 43
              -3
              Quote: yanus
              Professor

              You have a typo in my nickname I hope?

              And so, argue that they are expensive so bring the price to the studio. Waiting for.
              1. yanus
                yanus 4 September 2013 18: 12
                +3
                Quote: Professor
                And so, argue that they are expensive so bring the price to the studio. Waiting for.


                Northrop Grumman has been selected by the Eurofighter consortium and general contractor Alenia Aermacchi as the supplier of inertial navigation systems for multipurpose combat aircraft Eurofighter Typhoon of the third tranche.
                Northrop Grumman Italia will provide the Eurofighter consortium with an inertial navigation system with fiber optic gyroscopes and GPS global positioning systems for Typhoon fighters from all participating countries.
                The new contract is estimated at 30 million euros ....

                Third tranche - 108 aircraft
                30 million / 108 ~ 270 thousand euros.
                You can also divide it into two, if you think that the "inertsilka" is inexpensive like GPS. Still, 135 thousand euros is somehow not cheap ...
                1. Professor
                  Professor 4 September 2013 18: 53
                  0
                  Quote: yanus
                  inertial navigation systems for multipurpose combat aircraft

                  For airplanes ...
                  The new contract is valued at 30 million euros and builds on Northrop Grumman's extensive experience with the Eurofighter program spanning more than 20 years as a supplier for all three tranches of the program. Northrop Grumman Italia has delivered a total of more than 400 inertial navigation systems for Tranches 1 and 2 of the Eurofighter.

                  Northrop Grumman to Supply Inertial Navigation System for Eurofighter Typhoon Tranche 3
                  total 30 lemons per 400 !!! air systems = 75 thousand including GPS receiver with directional antennas. Not at all expensive.

                  Based on high-accuracy fiber-optic gyro technology, Northrop Grumman's inertial navigation system and complementary GPS receiver incorporate state-of-the-art features, such as selective availability / anti-spoofing module architecture and an anti-jam antenna system.

                  Northrop Grumman to Supply Inertial Navigation System for Eurofighter Typhoon Tranche 3
            2. poquello
              poquello 5 September 2013 02: 41
              +1
              It's a craving for spectacular delivery
    2. yanus
      yanus 4 September 2013 16: 59
      +4
      Quote: Spade
      And what, in fact, will this jamming of ZhPS give?

      If you suppress GPS, then automatic determination and sending of data on the coordinates of the unit to the ACCS will become impossible. Do you think "bending" the ACCS is not enough?

      Quote: Spade
      Range, for example, 10 km. JPS suppression will help? No. The projectile has an inertial guidance system with correction according to global positioning data.

      And the fact that the circular deviation of projectiles directed on a "pure" inertial and projectiles on GPS differs by an order of magnitude, or even two, is this a trifle? ))

      Quote: Spade
      By the time it enters the jamming zone, the projectile has already “worked through” the main errors

      GPS works just in the final section, because it has higher accuracy.

      Would you be engaged in self-education or something ...
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 4 September 2013 17: 49
        +2
        Quote: yanus
        And the fact that the circular deviation of projectiles directed on a "pure" inertial and projectiles on GPS differs by an order of magnitude, or even two, is this a trifle? ))

        Do you think that jamming of the LPS signal is possible along the entire flight path of the projectile? You did not forget that it is controllable, and not adjustable?
        1. yanus
          yanus 4 September 2013 18: 26
          +1
          Quote: Spade
          Do you think that jamming of the LPS signal is possible along the entire flight path of the projectile?

          40 km for not the most ideal GPS receiver? Why not..
          Quote: Spade
          You did not forget that it is controllable, and not adjustable?

          Could you develop your thought? Well, right away, not asil)
  13. saag
    saag 4 September 2013 14: 13
    +7
    Quote: Spade
    And what, in fact, will this jamming of ZhPS give?
    For example, we have a Very Important Object that needs to be protected. We put JPS jammers, jamming the signal within a radius of 5 km. Potential partners shoot at the "OVO" with their unparalleled world Excalibur. The range is, for example, 10 km. Will jamming ZhPS help? No. The projectile has an inertial guidance system with correction based on global positioning data. By the time it enters the jamming zone, the projectile has already “worked out” the main errors of aiming the gun and the inertia system will be enough for it to confidently hit the target.

    So maybe it’s not worth the hassle?

    Yes, the escalibur flies itself along a ballistic trajectory, it doesn’t need to bypass the radar zones, but it needs to fly, and it will fly, it needs to turn, and then the zone of uncertain reception, well, relying on the inertial system, turns, but it’s not checked correctly maybe a little inaccuracy with the distance grows into a big discrepancy, in fact, half a kilometer from the target, this is already a bonus
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 4 September 2013 15: 46
      0
      A much more sophisticated inertial guidance system can be installed on a cruise missile. Because she does not have such strict restrictions on acceleration and size.
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 16: 10
        +3
        Quote: Spade
        A much more sophisticated inertial guidance system can be installed on a cruise missile.


        With the initial error of the positioning medium of the medium, the magnitude of this error will increase as you move away from it. The map of the area included in the flight program will not particularly help on the initial flight path - water, water, water all around. When approaching the shore, it will still be necessary to compare your place with the planned one.
        Well, finally.
        1. KR - this is not a torpedo, twisting circles in search of a programmed target.
        2. The problem with positioning ships at sea is the problem.
        1. Professor
          Professor 4 September 2013 16: 14
          0
          Quote: stalkerwalker
          The map of the area included in the flight program will not particularly help on the initial flight path - water, water, water all around.

          Inertial that water, that sand. The error is not high even with inertia.

          Quote: stalkerwalker
          KR - this is not a torpedo, twisting circles in search of a programmed target.

          The Kyrgyz Republic gave, and many others do just that — they circle and impinge on the goal.

          Quote: stalkerwalker
          The problem with positioning ships at sea is the problem.

          In the days of Columbus it was like that. Today, there are no problems.

          PS
          Cruise missile navigation methods
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 16: 25
            +4
            Quote: Professor
            PS
            Cruise missile navigation methods

            I understand the motives for your concern: we are here, and you are there.
            Therefore, if the inertial is "screwed up", check the functionality of the Iron Dome ".
            1. Professor
              Professor 4 September 2013 16: 29
              -1
              Quote: stalkerwalker
              I understand the motives for your concern: we are here, and you are there.

              I’m not worried, but discussing the materiel. There is no GPS on the LCD.
          2. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 16: 29
            +3
            Quote: Professor
            KR - this is not a torpedo, twisting circles in search of a programmed target.
            KR ... that’s how they work - they circle and look for a goal.

            Well, only if this CD is suspended from a balloon, and sings "I am a cloud-cloud-cloud, I am not a bear at all ..".
            1. Professor
              Professor 4 September 2013 16: 44
              -1
              Quote: stalkerwalker
              Well, only if this CD is suspended from a balloon, and sings "I am a cloud-cloud-cloud, I am not a bear at all ..".

              In fact, this is called barazhivayuschim ammunition. Materiel pancake. Punch along Delilah.
              Delilah High Precision Cruise Missile
              1. stalkerwalker
                stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 16: 51
                +4
                Quote: Professor
                Delilah High Precision Cruise Missile

                Delilah, to be exact.
                About barrage - it will work if there are no modern air defense / missile defense systems.
                And finally.
                Quote: Professor
                The problem with positioning ships at sea is the problem.
                In the days of Columbus it was like that. Today, there are no problems.

                Today all navigation systems of both warships and civilian ships are "sharpened" for GPS / GLONASS positioning.
                "Basics of navigation and navigation".
                1. Professor
                  Professor 4 September 2013 17: 04
                  -1
                  Quote: stalkerwalker
                  Delilah, to be exact.

                  Will you teach me Hebrew? wink דלילה - it is Delilah.

                  Quote: stalkerwalker
                  About barrage - it will work if there are no modern air defense / missile defense systems.

                  Just these funds they are called to knock out.

                  Quote: stalkerwalker
                  Today all navigation systems of both warships and civilian ships are "sharpened" for GPS / GLONASS positioning.

                  Everything?
                  1. stalkerwalker
                    stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 17: 20
                    +3
                    Quote: Professor
                    Will you teach me Hebrew? דלילה - it is Delilah.

                    Professor, how can I - will I teach you something?

                    Quote: Professor
                    About barrage - it will work if there are no modern air defense / missile defense systems.
                    Just these funds they are called to knock out.

                    Who will give them? Or is it an invisible "stealth"?

                    Quote: Professor
                    Everything?

                    All. If you have a GPS on your car, what are the sailors to do? Have you tried to tune a satellite TV antenna "by eye"? Astrolabes and sextans are a thing of the past. And how long.
                    1. Professor
                      Professor 4 September 2013 17: 48
                      -2
                      Quote: stalkerwalker
                      Professor, how can I - will I teach you something?

                      Come on, I still have to study and study. But in this case, I'm right for 100%.

                      Quote: stalkerwalker
                      Who will give them? Or is it an invisible "stealth"?

                      The first barrage will be brought down, but they will not leave the second.

                      Quote: stalkerwalker
                      Astrolabes and sextans are a thing of the past. And how long.

                      So I'm ancient. When I served in the Navy we didn’t have any GPS.
                      1. stalkerwalker
                        stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 17: 52
                        +3
                        Quote: Professor
                        Come on, I still have to study and study. But in this case, I'm right for 100%.

                        In a lot of knowledge - a lot of sadness ...
                  2. The comment was deleted.
                    1. Professor
                      Professor 4 September 2013 23: 15
                      -1
                      Quote: Mature Naturalist
                      So you have no vowels in Hebrew.

                      and you will teach me Hebrew? wink How, then, is "shalom" or "amen" pronounced in Hebrew? laughing
                2. The comment was deleted.
                3. Pimply
                  Pimply 4 September 2013 18: 21
                  0
                  Quote: stalkerwalker
                  Delilah, to be exact.
                  Especially for you, since you are being knocked out in front of a professional, this is a name with vowels in Hebrew. So that there is no doubt. It is Delilah that is read. דְּלִילָה
                  1. stalkerwalker
                    stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 18: 30
                    +4
                    Quote: Pimply
                    Quote: stalkerwalker
                    Delilah, to be exact. Especially for you, since you are being knocked out in front of a professional, this is a name with vowels in Hebrew. So that there is no doubt. It is Delilah that is read. דְּלִילָה

                    Thank you !!!
                    Well, Pskap, we are not trained in Hebrew literacy. laughing
                    And I read it in English transcription. F. Mercury has such a song "Delilah".
                    Do you have a rotational method? Or did you decide to intercede for the zem? So I'm not scary Karabas-Barabas.
                    1. Pimply
                      Pimply 5 September 2013 00: 30
                      -3
                      Quote: stalkerwalker
                      Well, Pskap, we are not trained in Hebrew literacy.

                      Have you ... fox? Bravo. They said something smarter from this? No.
                      Quote: stalkerwalker
                      And I read it in English transcription. F. Mercury has such a song "Delilah".

                      Who cares. Prof. you clearly and correctly pointed out that you are not quite right. You started to rock out and clown around. Has it become easier? Exhale, beaver, exhale.
                      1. stalkerwalker
                        stalkerwalker 5 September 2013 00: 45
                        +5
                        Quote: Pimply
                        Has it become easier? Exhale, beaver, exhale.

                        Zinc for the geyser, Jewish Chris!
                        The professor does not require shitty lawyers, for which he respect and respect.
        2. Lopatov
          Lopatov 4 September 2013 17: 51
          0
          You went even further, decided that jamming of the signal along the entire trajectory of a cruise missile is possible?
      2. yanus
        yanus 4 September 2013 17: 01
        +1
        Quote: Spade
        A much more sophisticated inertial guidance system can be installed on a cruise missile. Because she does not have such strict restrictions on acceleration and size.

        Can you name the standard deviation of the "inertial"? )))
        Or do you have all the CDs with a nuclear warhead?
      3. beard999
        beard999 4 September 2013 17: 11
        +1
        Quote: Spade
        A much more sophisticated inertial guidance system can be installed on a cruise missile.

        This is the mantra that “can be set,” repeated the past few years. Like, “you can” in the Kyrgyz Republic and the UAV. There is only one question - why have the Americans, so far, not put the “more advanced inertial guidance system” in place of the SNA? In service, they have no UAVs, not KR, using exclusively ANNs.
        And, in my opinion, to date, statements that the SNA is possible to replace the ANN look like a big hatred.
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 17: 29
          +4
          Quote: beard999
          And, in my opinion, to date, statements that the SNA is possible to replace the ANN look like a big hatred.

          Otherwise, ammunition would be delivered on screw vehicles with location determination by the method of "polling the local population" - very economically and effectively in the fight against "terrorists" riding camels, and military bases in Bedouin tents.
        2. Lopatov
          Lopatov 4 September 2013 18: 30
          0
          I apologize, why should they completely abandon the ZhPS? Just because they can drown it? In theory.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 18: 38
            +3
            Quote: Spade
            I apologize, why should they completely abandon the ZhPS? Just because they can drown it? In theory.

            No one will refuse ...
            Such an opportunity - to stick the control module, launched - and forgot.
          2. beard999
            beard999 4 September 2013 20: 51
            0
            Quote: Spade
            why should they completely abandon ZhPS? Just because they can drown it? In theory.

            Well, firstly, not “theoretically”, but practically. It would only, “theoretically”, the Americans did not bathe with an increase in the “security” of GPS. Yes, and electronic warfare systems that carry out the suppression of the SNA, do not exist "theoretically." For example, domestic “Diabazol” or “Depth”. And secondly, and this is the main thing, if it were possible to replace the SNA with a “more advanced inertial guidance system”, this would give absolute autonomy and almost absolute security of the WTO from any missile defense. Just a dream! That's just in practice, nothing like this happens. Everything is only at the level of boltology on the Internet, and nothing more.
            1. Lopatov
              Lopatov 4 September 2013 20: 58
              0
              The first versions of "Excaliburs", which worked only on the ZHPS, often lost satellites without any jamming, and after that they flew anywhere - the system could no longer "select" deviations. And it is with this that the introduction of inertial guidance with correction is connected.
              But don't forget that these shells are by no means the best at the moment. German-Italian "Volcanoes" in addition to this system are optionally equipped with a semi-active laser or passive IR seeker.
              1. beard999
                beard999 4 September 2013 22: 21
                0
                Quote: Spade
                The first versions of "Excaliburs", which worked only on the ZHPS, often lost satellites without any jamming, and after that they flew anywhere - the system could no longer "select" deviations.

                The implementation of the embedded accuracy characteristics in the Excalibur UAS depends primarily on the stability of communication with at least three GPS satellites simultaneously. If this is not done, then no ANN will help to implement the declared КVO M982. But it doesn’t even matter. All Excalibur materials that I met, including and from Raytheon itself, it has always been argued that the M982’s HF was originally ANN + GPS. Which is actually not surprising. This is a completely normal configuration of the American WTO’s CH, starting with the JDAM kits in the mid-90s. But modern WTO systems equipped exclusively with ANNs are not known to me. They don’t do that. SNA is always present. In my opinion, the conclusion is quite clear - the most modern and sophisticated ANN is not able to replace the SNS.
                Quote: Spade
                German-Italian "Volcanoes" in addition to this system are optionally equipped with a semi-active laser or passive IR seeker

                GOS data significantly increases the cost of Volcano. And mainly, they are used for the possibility of defeating UAS mobile targets, which is not possible in guidance systems with only ANN + SNA. Well, it is natural to reduce the CVO: “The CVO should not exceed 20 m with the normal functioning of the SRNS and ANN. It is planned to use a laser homing head to reduce the CVO to 5 m. " http://pentagonus.ru/publ/artillerijskie_boepripasy_povyshennoj_tochnosti_istori
                ja_sostojanie_razvitie_ch2_2012 / 6-1-0-2255. It is obvious that the Volcano still enters the target area before turning on the GOS with the help of the SNA. From GPS there is no escape. So its jamming is quite relevant.
  14. Professor
    Professor 4 September 2013 15: 22
    +1
    Noise-resistant American GPS will not be a problem for Russian “jammers”

    I don’t know how it is about the future, but they could not drown out the current GPS.

    EW troops lose GPS fight
    Russian jamming stations could not prevent the "Americans" from destroying the training facility
    1. ultra
      ultra 4 September 2013 16: 19
      +2
      Dear Oleg, perhaps it was, only 0% faith in this article!
      1. Professor
        Professor 4 September 2013 16: 39
        0
        Quote: ultra
        Dear Oleg, perhaps it was, only 0% faith in this article!

        Nevertheless, GPS guidance in recent conflicts has shown its best.
        1. ultra
          ultra 4 September 2013 17: 05
          +2
          I can’t argue with that! However, I have no information that any electronic systems for countering GPS-guided ammunition were used.
  15. Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 4 September 2013 16: 28
    +3
    The task is not to jam the positioning signal. It means that the mechanism following this signal loses its orientation. Therefore, the question is not so much in the power of the interference, but in its parameters and, so to speak, "setting". An encrypted signal, you say? wink Oh well...
  16. ICT
    ICT 4 September 2013 17: 51
    0
    I’ll try to summarize the disputes (I repeat)

    Electronic warfare is electronic warfare, namely warfare, and not a panacea, if everything was so simple, then battleships with large guns would go to the seas and windows and would be pulled at each other by large-caliber blanks, and not a cruiser with miracle rockets
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 18: 03
      +4
      Quote: TIT
      Electronic warfare is electronic warfare, namely warfare, and not a panacea, if everything was so simple, then battleships with large guns would go to the seas and windows and would be pulled at each other by large-caliber blanks, and not a cruiser with miracle rockets

      Who knows...
      In the event of a global conflict, the entire space group can be turned into "space debris" by detonating 4 YaZs at the maximum attainable altitude, in anti-polar orbits above the equator and poles.
      And that's it ... "... Take your overcoat, let's go home ...". Communication - only MF / HF (if the equipment was not affected by EMP). Positioning - by luminaries, or by triangulation marks (if the optics are not clouded).
      1. ICT
        ICT 4 September 2013 18: 15
        +1
        Quote: stalkerwalker
        4's ID at maximum reachable height,
        , but we can’t do with two, or better without them stop . this is another topic and truly only a theory,
        Quote: stalkerwalker
        Communication - only PV / HF
        , messenger drivers, smoke signals, well, and there we will restore experience, that is, we’ll make a knee lol
        1. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 18: 45
          +3
          Quote: TIT
          , messenger drivers, smoke signals, well, and there we will restore experience, that is, we’ll make a knee

          I like drums more - panimash music ... laughing
  17. e-froloff
    e-froloff 4 September 2013 17: 56
    0
    I’m sure! 70% of the information that they give out is a bluff! They have it! They make a fool of their people with decisions! Why will they not fool the whole world with praise of their super weapons ???
    1. SASCHAmIXEEW
      SASCHAmIXEEW 5 September 2013 11: 42
      0
      They make a fool of it ... How tired of all this! All this riffraff from North America is just cowards and ponte! V45g only they had YaB, so what? All plans are how to destroy us, to this day ... Just a jerk, who does all this! There are no other words for these nonhumans !!!
  18. yanus
    yanus 4 September 2013 19: 28
    0
    Quote: Professor

    The new contract is valued at 30 million euros and builds on Northrop Grumman's extensive experience with the Eurofighter program spanning more than 20 years as a supplier for all three tranches of the program. Northrop Grumman Italia has delivered a total of more than 400 inertial navigation systems for Tranches 1 and 2 of the Eurofighter.

    total 30 lemons per 400 !!! air systems = 75 thousand including GPS receiver with directional antennas. Not at all expensive.

    has delivered - elapsed time. 400 sets were already delivered.
    And 30 million - new a contract for about a hundred aircraft of the third tranche.
    1. Professor
      Professor 4 September 2013 21: 54
      0
      Still a bad example, we are talking about an inertial with the most advanced GPS. To find out from this example how much the inertial costs is not possible. You have a link to the price of the inertial.
  19. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 4 September 2013 20: 07
    0
    Satellite navigation systems (SNS) GLONASS (Russia) and GPS (USA) use noise-like signals to generate and transmit navigation information. The amplitude of these signals is at the level of the "white noise" of outer space. It is necessary to take into account the powerful interference environment created by industrial installations, thunderstorms, etc. SNS receivers with this kind of interference have learned to deal with high probability. In the USSR in the 80s of the last century, research was carried out effects of intentional interference to the work of the SNA receivers. The results were depressing. The noise immunity of satellite navigation systems was very low. If you keep in mind that the power of interference transmitters can reach tens of kW or more, the reliability of the SNA will be very low.
    1. Andreas
      Andreas 4 September 2013 20: 31
      +1
      The SNA receiver, equipped with an integrated timer and three antennas with radiation patterns located in mutually perpendicular directions, can automatically detect the location of noise-like signal sources (including electronic warfare equipment).

      If the sources do not coincide with the orbital position of the GPS or GLONNAS satellites at a given time, noise-like signals will be ignored.
  20. saag
    saag 4 September 2013 21: 25
    +2
    Quote: Andreas
    If the sources do not coincide with the orbital position of the GPS or GLONNAS satellites at a given time, noise-like signals will be ignored.

    And if the noise-like signal goes at the GPS frequency? Will the receiver ignore this same frequency?
    1. Professor
      Professor 4 September 2013 21: 57
      0
      Quote: saag
      And if the noise-like signal goes at the GPS frequency? Will the receiver ignore this same frequency?

      if the interference source is between the satellite and the GPS receiver then the electronic warfare has a chance ...
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 22: 52
        +3
        Quote: Professor
        if the interference source is between the satellite and the GPS receiver then the electronic warfare has a chance ...

        The design of any antenna is based on the receiving circuit, which is excited in case of coincidence with the tuned frequency. The problem lies in the plane of sensitivity of this circuit (read antennas) - which signal will prevail, one's own-correct, or someone else's-false. The frequency of 1,5-1,6 GHz, at which the satellites operate, is, so to speak, "gentle", the issue of satellite selectivity is closed by the criterion for selecting satellites in height above the horizon.
        And further.
        It has already been noted that if there are too many "consumers" of the signal coming from one satellite at a certain site, there are interruptions in obtaining coordinates.
        1. Professor
          Professor 4 September 2013 23: 04
          +1
          Quote: stalkerwalker
          And further.

          The problems with noise immunity and “repeated image” turned out to be the most difficult to solve. They led to the introduction of the technology of so-called “smart” antennas, usually based on “digital beam forming” in software. The idea behind this technology is simple, but as usual difficult in detail. A conventional GPS antenna receives signals from the entire upper hemisphere above the rocket, thus including GPS satellites, as well as enemy interference. A so-called controlled-pattern antenna (Controlled Reception Pattern Antenna, CRPA) using software synthesizes narrow beams aimed at the intended location of GPS satellites, resulting in an antenna that is blind in all other directions. The most advanced designs of antennas of this type produce so-called "zeros" in the antenna pattern aimed at sources of interference to further suppress their influence.

          directional antenna
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 4 September 2013 23: 41
            +3
            Quote: Professor
            Problems with noise immunity and "ghosting" proved to be the most difficult to solve. They led to the introduction of so-called "smart" antenna technology, usually based on "digital beamforming" in software.

            Nobody argues that everything is so simple, I think that the developers of electronic warfare equipment are familiar with this trick. But such "high algebras" are difficult for me to understand.
            And you deservedly bear the nickname "Professor". laughing
            1. Professor
              Professor 5 September 2013 09: 43
              0
              Quote: stalkerwalker
              Nobody argues that everything is so simple, I think that the developers of electronic warfare equipment are familiar with this trick. But such "high algebras" are difficult for me to understand.

              Everything is much simpler. Imagine that I'm watching through binoculars ... You have a 1 watt laser pointer. So, in order to blind me you need to be between me and the observed object (GPS satellite and receiver on the CR, UAV, etc.). Otherwise, you will shine in the back of my head ... fellow

              To drown out CAPA, the jammer must be placed on airplanes and / or balloons. Today no one can do this; there is no money. Therefore, all the talk about jammers for UAVs at 50, 120 km is a simple idle talk. So the developers of electronic warfare nervously smoking on the sidelines.

              I support almost every word Andreas.
              1. stalkerwalker
                stalkerwalker 5 September 2013 11: 08
                +3
                Quote: Professor
                I support almost every word Andreas.

                No comment ...
                The last argument laughing .
                Calculated on paper, but forgot about the ravines ...
                Everything is easy in discussions, in theory.
                To control the velocity vector, location, and altitude of the flight of the spacecraft, you will need the services of 4 satellites at the same time, even each other being replaced, as you fly over the spacecraft trajectory.
                Practice shows that at times it is not without problems to achieve normal visibility of 2-3 SNS satellites even in "peaceful life".

                Then I take my leave.
                hi
      2. Andreas
        Andreas 4 September 2013 23: 41
        +2
        This task (combining in space on one line three points - a cruise missile, electronic warfare equipment and a GPS satellite) is practically not feasible, since:
        - the rocket and satellite move along their trajectories, so the electronic warfare vehicle must be able to track the missile in flight, quickly go to the desired area, calculate and then maintain some complex intermediate trajectory so that it stays in line with the rocket and the satellite all the time;
        - the speed of movement of the electronic warfare must not be less than the flight speed of the rocket - about 800 km / h, i.e. electronic warfare must be installed on a jet;
        - for positioning, it is necessary to have at least three satellites in direct visibility, the current GPS space group provides the visibility of four or more satellites, therefore, electronic warfare systems for jamming a single missile will require more than one, and they must strictly coordinate their movements between themselves;
        - two or more jamming objects, for example, two missiles or a missile and a false target, can simultaneously be in the effective range of EW means, so the amount of EW means doubles, triples, etc.

        As a result, the task of physically shielding GSM satellites with numerous electronic warfare devices installed on board aircraft does not have a technical solution for every purpose that falls within their area of ​​responsibility.
    2. Andreas
      Andreas 4 September 2013 22: 05
      0
      Three directional antennas allow you to determine the spatial position of the radiation sources and tune away from those of them whose position does not coincide with the orbits of the GPS / GLONNAS satellites, regardless of the radiation frequency.
  21. vanderhaas
    vanderhaas 5 September 2013 03: 50
    0
    Quote: Andreas
    Three directional antennas allow you to determine the spatial position of the radiation sources and tune away from those of them whose position does not coincide with the orbits of the GPS / GLONNAS satellites, regardless of the radiation frequency.

    Generally speaking, GPS translators are in geostationary orbits and triangulation is carried out using at least three signals. And the task of the receiver is just to determine its location, and not to estimate its movement relative to the GPS translators "known" in this area of ​​the planet's surface. So the task is not jamming, but signal substitution (the connection is not two-way, but one-way, after all, it is a receiver, not a receiver-transmitter). Here you can't do with antennas.
    If people in real time, RTP hacks ....
    1. Professor
      Professor 5 September 2013 09: 47
      +1
      Quote: vanderhaas
      In fact, GPS translators are in geostationary orbits

      no. not at all geostationary.
    2. Andreas
      Andreas 5 September 2013 12: 07
      +1
      At the time of launch, the coordinates of the launch point, the start time and the trajectories of the GPS satellites are entered into the inertial guidance system (ISN) of the cruise missile. During the flight of the rocket, the ISN continuously monitors the change in coordinates and counts the progress of time using the built-in timer.

      Therefore, by the time you start listening to GPS satellite signals (for example, when approaching a target), the rocket computer will be able to determine with great accuracy the segments of space in which at that moment three, four or more GPS satellites are located.

      It is in the direction of these segments that the radiation patterns of the controlled receiving antenna of the CRPA type will be formed.

      In this case, the electronic warfare means must be in time to detect the missile’s approach to the target in time, fly into the air, reach the missile’s screening point from each of the GPS satellites, and in this position accompany the missile until it passes the target.

      For comparison, a rocket takes less than one second to determine coordinates using GPS satellites, electronic warfare equipment will take more than ten seconds to complete the indicated anti-signal maneuver.

      There is also a proven way to determine the coordinates at the end of the flight by comparing the actual radar / thermal image of the terrain with a sample previously stored in the rocket’s memory.

      In the case of a missile strike at sea / in a desert with moving sand / in an area with deep snow cover (with an absent or inconsistent terrain), the target is easier to recognize with the help of the radar / thermal signature guidance system (a sample of which is also stored in memory from different angles rockets), since the underlying surface (water, sand, snow) differs sharply in contrast to the target itself.

      Therefore, a missile equipped with a combined guidance system (GPS + GPS + GPS) is invulnerable to electronic warfare.
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 5 September 2013 12: 10
        +3
        Quote: Andreas
        Therefore, a missile equipped with a combined guidance system (GPS + GPS + GPS) is invulnerable to electronic warfare.

        Convinced ... laughing
      2. Ev58
        Ev58 5 September 2013 14: 14
        0
        Undoubtedly, for the WTO, where cartography plays an important role, any EW means are losing their relevance. In order not to create illusions, it should be noted that such means, as a rule, are equipped with radiation-resistant equipment and have the necessary constructive and technological solutions to ensure resistance to combat means that generate EMP or an increased level of SJR and function under conditions of high-intensity electromagnetic fields. We are not talking about "ballistics" at all. And the Americans can be understood: they are "obsessed" with GPS, unless they pray to him.
  22. Rash
    Rash 5 September 2013 07: 06
    0
    Friends! Throw the flame! Nobody has yet repealed the law of nuts and bolts.
  23. saag
    saag 5 September 2013 07: 58
    0
    Quote: Andreas
    therefore, the electronic warfare vehicle must be able to track the missile in flight, quickly go to the desired area, calculate and then maintain some complex intermediate trajectory in order to stay in line with the missile and the satellite all the time;

    It may just be to hang the UAV at the required height in the right areas and with a directional antenna to cover this same area, giving out kilowatts of power to the antenna, if a tenth comes to the surface, then this is very enough
  24. viruskvartirus
    viruskvartirus 5 September 2013 13: 00
    +1
    The best jammer for GPS is the remaining space debris from the satellite and broken-down ground stations. Here's how to do it quickly and efficiently and you should think first.
  25. Ev58
    Ev58 5 September 2013 13: 52
    0
    "The professor, of course, is a burdock, but the equipment is with him, with him!" - as the classic of Soviet cinema says.
  26. Vldmr
    Vldmr 14 September 2013 21: 16
    0
    A very interesting guess comes to mind. The orbits of GLONASS satellites are about 19100 km, and NAVSTAR 20200 km. If we assume that our system was put into operation later and our military men ate for good reason, they could make a simple feature, such as relaying the GPS signal to our satellite with some non-zero delay. The situation is this: our satellite receives a GPS signal from the nearest NAVSTAR satellite (it’s quite possible, our orbit is lower and the radiation pattern of the NAVSTAR satellite should be wide enough so that the signal reaches the entire surface of the globe, plus side lobes can be caught at such a small distance between the satellites radiation from the NAVSTAR satellite antenna) and the received signal is either processed according to a special algorithm with errors, or simply relayed with a certain delay, which will not allow it to be used for accurate determination of coordinates (by the way, in this case, signal encryption will not help, since it will completely identical). Not knowing exactly the algorithm of the receivers for selecting a signal, I can’t say whether I can deceive the GPS receiver with approximately the same levels of true or false signal. I dare to suggest that a more powerful signal will be chosen sooner. Then the question is the energy potential of the transmitting path, in the antenna bottom. Honestly, I did not understand the information on the distribution of the power density of the radio navigation field of the emitted signals by the GLONASS and GPS systems, but it seems that there are no fundamental barriers for such jamming. Well, the Americans, respectively, may have prepared a similar kaku for us :))). Let’s think that ours nevertheless provided the opportunity to do such muck. It is clear that such a solution will complicate the satellite, it will require additional power to relay the interfering signal, so as not to disrupt its navigation functions. All dances with a tambourine around the receiving antennas controlled by the NAM will not help here. Of course, you need to look at the orbits of the satellites, there will probably be time intervals when the satellites are far apart, and such a scheme will not work.