Military Review

MiG-29М / М2 and MiG-29К will become MiG-35?

68

The Serbian newspaper Politika 1 September 2013 of the year published an interview taken by the newspaper’s correspondent Miroslav Lazansky with the Director General of RSK MiG Sergey Korotkov at the MAKS-2013 air show. Although the interview is mainly of an advertising nature, it’s aimed at Serbia, it contains a number of interesting moments. First of all, it is worth noting the statements of S. Korotkov that RSK MiG decided to rename the MiG-35М / М29 (and, apparently, MiG-2К) aircraft to MiG-29, and that MiG-35 proposed for procurement for BB From Russia, it is essentially the same aircraft as the MiG-35М29.



Mr. Director, recently the Russian press wrote that the Russian Ministry of Defense canceled an order for MiG-35 aircraft, and you will not have a job.

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Is it possible to resolve the question of whether the MiG-29М2 is a different type in relation to the MiG-35. Or is it actually one plane? There is a lot of controversy over this.

MiG-29М2 and MiG-35 identical aircraft in weight, size, radar, engines, planned avionics and electronics, in suspended arms, in armsoutwardly. There is no difference there. True, we have a single version, which we called the MiG-29M, while the double version of the aircraft is designated as the MiG-29М2. In fact, the MiG-29М2 is an export version of the MiG-35 combat aircraft for the Russian Air Force. Here, let me tell you that at the MAKS-2013 cabin this year, we abandoned the name MiG-29М2 and adopted the name MiG-35. In order not to confuse more our customers, as well as our opponents. Thus, in the future there will be only the MiG-35, although it will vary depending on the equipment, depending on the wishes of the customer. For example, India is developing its electronics for this aircraft and we are installing it.

What country are you currently producing MiG-35 airplanes for?

And for Russia, and for India. India buys the deck version of the MiG-29K, which is equivalent to the deck version of the MiG-35. For example, the difference between the basic version of the MiG-29 and the MiG-29K, or the deck version of the MiG-35, is huge, even the tires on the wheels of the chassis are different.

How many targets of the MiG-35 can accompany simultaneously, and how many at the same time fire?

Accompany ten targets simultaneously and fire at four targets simultaneously.

The range of the radar "Beetle" on the MiG-35?

The maximum target detection range is 250 km, and the maximum range of an air-to-air missile is P-27 80 km. But we have a longer-range modern air-to-air missile.

Serbia is a potential buyer of the MiG-35. Did you talk about the possibility of giving us airplanes made for Syria, which you cannot supply right now due to a known situation?

We have a contract with Syria for the aircraft and Russian President Vladimir Putin said that the contracts should be respected. Syrian MiGs we will not sell to anyone.

But you do not deliver?

This is not for me. This is a question between us and Syria.

If Serbia decides to buy MiG-35, what will be the price of the aircraft?

We will give you airplanes at the same price as for Russian military aircraft.

That is, at the factory price?

Yes, both for Russia and for Serbia.

What are the proposals of outboard weapons for aircraft, equipment for intelligence and electronic warfare?

We have everything you want from this equipment in production, and everything is already integrated on the MiG-35 aircraft.

Medium and long-range air-to-air missiles?

All Russian-made air-to-air missiles can be integrated into MiG-35 aircraft for Serbia. We can even integrate Western-made rockets, if you want, the MiG-35 has a completely open architecture for all existing or only developed types of missiles.

Is there real-time two-way data transfer between planes and ground stations?

This possibility exists, and it is implemented in practice.

Who produces the wings and fuselage of the MiG-35?

Our company has a full cycle of aircraft production, from the design office, through the construction of aircraft, test methods, to the delivery and maintenance of aircraft. True, we buy engines, radar and generators from other companies, and then install them on airplanes. Earlier in the Soviet Union, the MiG company only designed the aircraft, and then it was produced according to the design documentation at other enterprises of the USSR. Now everything is different.

What percentage of composites used on the MiG-35?

About 16 percent, but there is a special coating, which on the MiG-35 aircraft greatly reduces the radio-location visibility, so that we can say that it is, in fact, an “invisible” aircraft, or an aircraft with low radar visibility. In view of this and other features, the Mig-35 is an 4-plus-plus generation aircraft. The advantage of the MiG-35 is also that it is designed to take off and land on bad airfields, and can use asphalt roads as a runway. In the double version, it is possible for the operator to choose targets and weapons that can be used; with the MiG-35, it is possible to quickly train a larger number of pilots. For your pilots who fly the MiG-29, retraining to the MiG-35 will not be an expensive or difficult or lengthy process.

Still, why was the MiG-35 called the 4-plus-plus generation?

There is no consensus in the world what to call the “fifth” generation of aircraft, therefore we call the MiG-35 generation “4-plus-plus”.

Western rival aircraft?

We fight and compete with Typhoon, Rafale, Gripen, we are superior to F-18. We are much cheaper than all of them. Of course, the price depends on the aircraft equipment.

How many countries in the world today use MiG type aircraft?

Our planes fly pilots 29 countries around the world. MiG-29 is used even by Americans to train their pilots. You know - for training in air combat, in "squadrons of aggressors".

Is there a possibility of cooperation in the repair of the MiG-29 for other countries in our aircraft repair plant Mom Stanojlovis in Batainitsa?

We were at this enterprise, you can become a regional center for repairing the MiG-29 not only for neighboring countries, but also for Algeria and other Arab countries that have this type of aircraft in service. Why take them to Russia if it can be done with you, and we have committed ourselves to repairing these aircraft in Batainitsa. We assume that Cuba will repair its MiG-29 from you. You know, it is not enough just to buy a modern aircraft, you need to support it.

If Serbia signs a contract for the purchase of MiG-35 aircraft today, how long will it take to deliver the first aircraft?

Aircraft are manufactured in working order, after signing the contract and prepayment will take from 18 months to two years before the delivery of the first aircraft. From a technological point of view, it is usually called two years, but for Serbia there is an opportunity to shorten this period.
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  1. VadimSt
    VadimSt 4 September 2013 20: 25 New
    +8
    The interview is more like intelligence!
    1. experienced
      experienced 4 September 2013 20: 54 New
      0
      Quote: VadimSt
      The interview is more like intelligence!

      I think that we should immediately release Migi under the "chip" MIG-100500MSUTVNKSVV let them be afraid laughing and again, any Serbian CIA agents would have to strain their brains
      Mr. Director, recently the Russian press wrote that the Russian Ministry of Defense canceled an order for MiG-35 aircraft, and you will not have a job.

      After this phrase, it was necessary to call the guards and workers and "fuck" the journalist wink Some kind of louse from a country that can never buy a MIG is swept away, and without consequences ... IMHO

      After posting a comment

      Threat Tomorrow I'll see who is minus wassat Serb? If not, drain the water wassat I will forgive Serba winked
    2. VasDA
      VasDA 5 September 2013 04: 16 New
      +1
      hi I recall a recent interview with one "uncle" and his answer: "Do you work in the media or the CIA? You ask me questions that should be asked by colleagues from other departments."
      Don't you think so? laughing
      1. Sergh
        Sergh 5 September 2013 06: 28 New
        +2
        Quote: seasoned
        Tomorrow I'll see who is minus

        Alex, put you a plus from me, do not be offended by them! We are always above them!
        News!
        We at Chkalde (Novosibirsk) have already started fresh purging of the 34th Sukhara. Another couple is preparing to take off, probably in a couple of weeks I will look in the sky. I have a Chkalovsky railway station from the balcony, one and a half kilometers away, dviglo buzzed all night now, plow in three shifts! Well done factory workers!
  2. svp67
    svp67 4 September 2013 20: 29 New
    +4
    MiG-29M2 and MiG-35 are the same aircraft
    Who will say this? And is there no juggling of facts ...
    1. Airman
      Airman 4 September 2013 20: 43 New
      0
      Quote: svp67
      MiG-29M2 and MiG-35 are the same aircraft
      Who will say this? And is there no juggling of facts ...

      Both are possible. But for some reason ours ordered the MiG-29, I don’t remember the exact index, and the MiG-35 was postponed to 2016.
      1. cdrt
        cdrt 4 September 2013 21: 00 New
        +4
        Both are possible. But for some reason, ours ordered a MiG-29, I don’t remember exactly the index, and the MiG-35 was postponed to 2016

        It was - expectations in RSK Mig contract for Mig-35. But!!! could not cope with the work on time. When sharing the budget, it was said - they didn’t manage, come tomorrow (in 2015). But on MiG-29 - let it be, we will order some.

        Action - changed the name Mig-29 to Mig-35

        Result - RSK Mig has a contract for Mig-35.

        And all the worries - interview + documentation reprint laughing laughing laughing laughing

        Watch my hands ... a bird will fly laughing

        Although ... let them catch up with Sukhoi in marketing skills - you look who of the customers is going to buy, really, after all, a lot has changed in the car
      2. aviator65
        aviator65 4 September 2013 22: 54 New
        +3
        I will answer a question with a question. MiG-21MF and MiG-21bis - these are the same aircraft?
        1. Alex 241
          Alex 241 4 September 2013 22: 57 New
          +1
          Of course not.
          1. aviator65
            aviator65 4 September 2013 23: 05 New
            +2
            Of course. Because these are variants of the same aircraft.
            1. Alex 241
              Alex 241 4 September 2013 23: 12 New
              +1
              Absolutely, I understand what you want to say, Alexei, for the sake of nomenclature they were not given the MiG-121 index, for example, they just entered a letter abbreviation, emphasizing that it is ideologically MiG-21. And in the Su models I’m already confused, with all this A wide range is a logical continuation of the Su-27.
              1. aviator65
                aviator65 5 September 2013 00: 22 New
                +1
                It would be more correct to say, not continuation, but development. Just the Su-27 (T-10) was originally created with great potential for improvement, as well as the MiG-29. A kind of optimal platform was found from the point of view of aerodynamics and technology, which could be adapted in the future to new requirements. And all this mess with the names is just for the sake of politics and commerce. Anyway, inside the design bureau all these products come under completely different ciphers that have nothing to do with their selling names. The logical continuation will be just the T-50. For the car is already fundamentally different, replacing the Su-27 family.
                1. Alex 241
                  Alex 241 5 September 2013 00: 32 New
                  +3
                  [/ img] [/ center]
                  Quote: aviator65
                  . And all this mess with the names is only for the sake of politics and
                  And it should be for the sake of the country's defense.
                  1. studentmati
                    studentmati 5 September 2013 00: 41 New
                    +2
                    Leapfrog with names has, in my opinion, a commercial component. Earlier, in an article about the T-50, I expressed my concern. I remember the classic cartoon of the 80s: "As you name the ship, so it will float! (Victory is .. trouble).
                    1. Alex 241
                      Alex 241 5 September 2013 00: 46 New
                      +2
                      Sasha, we talked about this issue a year ago.
                      1. studentmati
                        studentmati 5 September 2013 00: 53 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Alex 241
                        Sasha, we talked about this issue a year ago


                        And the "political" things are still there ... sad
                      2. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 5 September 2013 00: 55 New
                        +2
                        To whom cabbage soup is thicker, and to whom larger pearls.
                2. studentmati
                  studentmati 5 September 2013 00: 49 New
                  0
                  Quote: Alex 241
                  And it should be for the sake of the country's defense.


                  Why reinvent the wheel? There is a brand (in modern terms, a brand), there are certain production digital secret "troubles", the whole world has already got used to such a classification for 50 years? There is a "line" Mig, SU, Tu, Il, Yak, Ka, Mi, and of course M (formerly ME). Why follow the lead of "effective" managers? Our aircraft industry brands have mighty power, believe it!
                  1. aviator65
                    aviator65 5 September 2013 01: 20 New
                    +3
                    Why follow the lead of "effective" managers?
                    Who is the question to? These are the most effective ones who rule, and they have their own concepts of brands. Otherwise, why would we have a "superjet"? Previously, our design bureaus were led by General Designers, and now the heads of corporations. Do you feel the difference?
  3. experienced
    experienced 4 September 2013 20: 56 New
    +3
    Quote: svp67
    Who will say this? And is there no juggling of facts ...

    The more "confusion" the more profitable for us ... hi
  4. Odysseus
    Odysseus 4 September 2013 22: 48 New
    +4
    Quote: svp67
    MiG-29M2 and MiG-35 are the same aircraft. Who will say whether this is so? And is there no juggling of facts ...

    These are identical planes. But ... there are two Miga-35s smile
    One, with a Zhuk-M locator and an old wing, it is exported.
    The second one, with Beetle-A and a new wing, it is still in the plans.
    But in general, of course, due to the endless tightening of the Su-27M, Mig-29M programs and their advertising for deliveries abroad, there are so many of their modifications with different names that you can’t figure it out without a half-liter.
  • Brave
    Brave 4 September 2013 20: 38 New
    +2
    I wonder why at domestic prices? request
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 4 September 2013 20: 45 New
    +7
    M / M2 is renamed to 35 because M / M2 - two options
    the first is M2 MRSA, aka MiG-35 for a tender to Indians
    the essence of the usual MiG-29M with a two-meter cabin and new equipment
    the second M / M2 - based on the K / KUB glider (actually the same thing, only without a hook with all its stuffing) with ground equipment. He is a MiG-35 for the Russian Air Force
    The right step in applying the new index. Moreover, there is practically nothing left of the base MiG-29.
    MiG-29SMT - modernization of previously built machines, mainly for cab equipment, local use of radar absorbing coatings + overhead tanks. The glider, engines and RSL did not change, although the use of new equipment and MFIs in the cockpit greatly expanded the scope of the sighting system.
    MiG-29M / M2 / K and others are new, even the glider is completely different, not to mention the "stuffing".
    Yours! hi
    1. aviator65
      aviator65 5 September 2013 00: 49 New
      +3
      As I understand it, the main thing now in aircraft construction is to properly assign the index to the product. Otherwise, without it it can not be brought to the series. And I thought everything, and why aren't the latest modifications of the 29th adopted? Well now everything will be all right. Thank. Reassured.
      Yours! hi
  • Basileus
    Basileus 4 September 2013 20: 59 New
    +1
    It is a pity that nothing is heard about the version of PAK FA from MiG. I hope that we will not stop at the 5th generation heavy fighter, but will also make it lightweight. It is necessary to oppose the F-35 in the market.
    1. ziqzaq
      ziqzaq 4 September 2013 21: 15 New
      +2
      Quote: Basileus
      It’s a pity that nothing is heard about the version of PAK FA from MiG

      Yes, as a teapot in aviation, I would like to know the opinion of vaf or another professional about the MIG-35. Of course I can google myself, but I can hardly draw the conclusions (correct) myself, so if it’s not difficult, please enlighten me ........ Thank you in advance .....
      1. Botanologist
        Botanologist 4 September 2013 22: 42 New
        +2
        Quote: ziqzaq
        I would like to know the opinion of vaf or another professional about MIG-35


        I am not a professional in aviation, but I talked with VAF on the topic of MIG. The car is very necessary and good. Of course, there are questions about the radar - either the full one will go (Bug), or something cheaper to solder, but the plane is needed.
        Yes, and there is doubt about the advisability of transferring all military aviation exclusively to Sukikhs. Otherwise we'll finish the game - we'll definitely have to make the Yak-130 a front-line aircraft belay
        1. ziqzaq
          ziqzaq 4 September 2013 23: 23 New
          +1
          Quote: Botanologist
          I am not a professional in aviation, but I talked with VAF on the topic of MIG

          Thank you very much....
    2. aviator65
      aviator65 4 September 2013 23: 22 New
      +2
      Well, maybe we wouldn’t stop and even do it, but who will give us? And why do something to oppose the F-35 in the market? Does he already grab packs?
      1. Basileus
        Basileus 5 September 2013 07: 51 New
        0
        Even if they do not, they will. At least the program participants and at least to recoup the investment. And then there are those who will be forced. And the neighbors will want "the same, but cheaper." So they will look for what to oppose him.
        1. aviator65
          aviator65 5 September 2013 14: 27 New
          0
          Well, if you want to have hemorrhoids with this flying iron, you can wish good luck. And the neighbors, I think, if anything, the MiGami-29 will fight back. If, of course, you learn to fly properly. You just don't need to be impressed by computer toys like "OUR X2", "air kombat", etc. The reality is much more prosaic.
          1. Basileus
            Basileus 5 September 2013 14: 42 New
            0
            The reality is that the iron is offered as a 5th generation aircraft, and the MiG with perfect aerodynamics - 4. Marketing, his mother.

            In addition, funding and experimental work did not bother anyone.
            1. aviator65
              aviator65 5 September 2013 14: 49 New
              0
              Until now, we have made offers on the market not on the basis of "we have the same, but cheaper", but "here's another one, much better and cheaper." And it worked.
              1. Basileus
                Basileus 5 September 2013 15: 00 New
                0
                Yah? In any case, marketing in the market decides a lot, and you should not forget about it. And the design work and the diversity of the MiG line will not hurt.
                1. aviator65
                  aviator65 5 September 2013 16: 14 New
                  0
                  Of course they won't. Only the MiG is not a VAZ. We need a government order from the government and the Defense Ministry with specific tactical and technical requirements, backed up by appropriate funding. And it just does not exist. Lead the development on an initiative basis? What shishi? All the profit from what is produced goes to the UAC and ROSOBORONEXPORT. Now they decide who to develop what. Until the beginning of the 90s, the Mikoyan Design Bureau was developing in several directions. I will list a few.
                  Edition "9-12" and its modifications (MiG-29).
                  Ed. "01", "95", "07" - MiG-31 and its modifications.
                  Ed. "512" - a promising interceptor, replacement of the MiG-31,
                  Ed. "1-44" - fighter under the IFI program,
                  Ed. "301" - hypersound.
                  Even the MiG-110 was developed - a light transport aircraft.
                  What of all this turned out to be in demand today? Dali created the MiG-AT, but considered less promising compared to the Yak-130. Collaboration with Italians played a role. The Mikoyanites have enough breakthrough developments that could be used now parallel to the theme of the 5th generation. But it turns out they are not needed. Why, when there is a Sukhoi firm that can do everything that flies.
                  1. Basileus
                    Basileus 5 September 2013 16: 55 New
                    0
                    So I say, with appropriate funding. It's just stupid to kill competition. There, in tank construction, VNII-100 and Omsk have already been killed, now Armata is given birth heavily and for a long time. Competition will not hinder dry competition, and it’s time for the state to learn the lessons.
                    1. aviator65
                      aviator65 5 September 2013 17: 08 New
                      0
                      Eh. Say it to the one who kills. As they say, for mutual understanding! drinks
  • AIR-ZNAK
    AIR-ZNAK 4 September 2013 21: 01 New
    +1
    Some article is confused. What is not clear to what. Confused questions and answers. Everything is muddy.
  • Des10
    Des10 4 September 2013 21: 05 New
    +2
    "Although the interview is mainly for promotional purposes, .."
    Normal, calm interview. +
  • denson06
    denson06 4 September 2013 21: 35 New
    +3
    A plane will be good .. a bit with avionics, if I am not mistaken, it remains to finalize ..
    Good luck to you and your colleagues, Mr. Korotkov. The aircraft is needed by the Russian Air Force in the first place!
  • aviator65
    aviator65 4 September 2013 22: 22 New
    +6
    "I smashed all the brains into pieces, I braided all the convolutions!"
    Ah yes Korotkov! good Ay yes su ...! I mean, if you work with managers from a Sukhov company, you will learn not that. Poor, long-suffering MiG-29, poor OKB (RSK) them. A.I. Mikoyan! This is what you have to go to in order to stay afloat and not be completely sunk by Pogasyan's office. Modifications of the same wonderful MiG-29 aircraft have to be passed off as different aircraft. Can anyone remember how many modifications of the MiG-21 were produced? But at the same time, it never occurred to anyone to call him the MiG-23 or -25. These were already, indeed, fundamentally different machines, which, by the way, also had modifications. And now, you see, they were afraid to get confused. What's the confusion then? In the series so far only MiG-29SM (ed. 9-13), yes -29K (ed. 9-31) have finally been pushed through. And if the 9-31 design is indeed significantly redesigned for deck use (in the same volume as the Su-33 relative to the Su-27), then all other options were created with the aim of further improving the performance characteristics of the basic version (ed. 9-12). But in fact, the plane is the same. At one time, A. N. Tupolev, in order to push his new bomber into the series, presented it as a modification of the previous machine. This is how the Tu-22M appeared. Now, in order to please the buyer and offer him something new, it is enough to assign a new index of the next modification, albeit very wonderful, but already exchanged its third dozen fighter. The Sukhovites, of course, have done better here. But they are still lagging behind VAZ in this. How many modifications of the VAZ2101 "koppeyka" have been offered by those for more than three decades under the guise of another "new" car? This is marketing!
  • Peaceful military
    Peaceful military 5 September 2013 00: 30 New
    +2
    Alas.
    They refused to build such a necessary and long-awaited MIG-35 for the Russian Air Force. What then to talk about. angry
    1. aviator65
      aviator65 5 September 2013 00: 34 New
      +2
      In my opinion, just no one refuses to build. They don’t want to take it!
      1. Peaceful military
        Peaceful military 5 September 2013 00: 39 New
        +1
        Alexei, maybe you accidentally missed it, but it happened just the other day when you refused to finance the construction, in my opinion 36 MIG-35 for the Russian Air Force ... hi
        1. Alex 241
          Alex 241 5 September 2013 00: 45 New
          +2
          Andrey scan articles from August 23.
          The supply program commissioned by the Russian Air Force 37 advanced MiG-35 multi-role fighters has been postponed until 2016, flightglobal.com reports on August 21. Initially, deliveries were scheduled to begin this year. Deputy Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Yuri Borisov accused the industry of "not being ready to fulfill the contract."

          “We postponed the purchase of the MiG-2016 until 35 and will purchase 16 MiG-29SMT fighters. The Ministry of Finance is not against such a decision, ”he said on August 20. A few days earlier, the Kommersant newspaper reported that the acquisition of the MiG-35 in the amount of $ 1,1 billion was postponed. “The MiG Corporation will need three years to bring the MiG-35 design to the necessary conditions and prepare its serial production. We will continue the purchase of the MiG-29SMT to support the aviation industry, ”an anonymous source from the Ministry of Defense told the newspaper.

          The military department was planning to sign a contract with MiG RAC on the MiG-35 in June, but the head of the corporation, Sergey Korotkov, told the Russian media at the time that the contract had not been signed.

          The Russian Air Force is already equipped with 28 MiG-29SMT fighters, which Algeria abandoned in 2007. These aircraft were equipped with new equipment to meet Russian requirements.

          While there are no comments from the Air Force, but it is unlikely that they were pleased with such news. The MiG-29SMT is a further development of the old MiG-29A model and it uses the innovations that should have been applied to the MiG-29M, in particular, additional fuel tanks, the Zhuk-ME multifunction radar, advanced avionics and upgraded RD-33 engines ¸ but without traction vector control.

          The main differences between the MiG-35 and the MiG-29SMT are the Zhuk-AE active phased array (AFAR) radar, the OLS-35 optoelectronic system, and thrust vector controlled engines.
          1. Peaceful military
            Peaceful military 5 September 2013 00: 49 New
            +2
            Well, who will say that? Evil is not enough ... angry
        2. Peaceful military
          Peaceful military 5 September 2013 00: 46 New
          +2
          PS There was still an absurd argument that, they say, production capacities do not allow the simultaneous implementation of the export program and the program for the construction of new aircraft for its air forces ...
          1. Alex 241
            Alex 241 5 September 2013 00: 48 New
            +2
            Here is the news from September 3: The Serbian newspaper "Politics" on September 1, 2013 published an interview taken by the newspaper's correspondent Miroslav Lazansky with the general director of JSC "RSK" MiG "Sergei Korotkov at the MAKS-2013 airshow. Although the interview is mainly for advertising purposes the promotion of the MiG-35 aircraft to Serbia, it contains a number of interesting moments. First of all, it is worth noting the statements of S. Korotkov that RSK "MIG" has decided to rename the MiG-29M / M2 aircraft (and, apparently, the MiG-29K) in MiG-35, and that the MiG-35, proposed for procurement for the Russian Air Force, is essentially the same aircraft as the MiG-29M2.


            Mr. Director, recently the Russian press wrote that the Russian Ministry of Defense canceled an order for MiG-35 aircraft, and you will not have a job.

            You, as a journalist, see that the newspaper Kommersant wrote this on the first page. The very next day, the same newspaper denied the same information also on the first page. The Russian Ministry of Defense is only interested in when the first MiG-35 enters the army. And this is not all, interest in our aircraft is growing, over the past years we have worked for foreign customers, and now the Russian Ministry of Defense has decided to purchase a number of MiG-29SMT aircraft, we have signed two contracts for the decked version of the MiG-29K aircraft. Our aviation will receive 37 MiG-35 aircraft, all documentation for this has been handed over to the Russian Ministry of Defense, and we expect that the first aircraft will go into operation with Russian military aviation in 2015.
            1. Peaceful military
              Peaceful military 5 September 2013 00: 57 New
              +2
              Sash! Here is one continuous blah blah blah. As in the movie "Aladdin's Magic Lamp": "to say about a dream that this is not a dream, but about not a dream to say that this is a dream."
              Yes, and we have already been accustomed to the fact that as soon as negative news arrives regarding improvement in the armed forces, then with all refutations and other bleating, this negativity necessarily occurs.
              Those. burned, repeatedly in milk and now blow into cold water.
              So there is "two in one bottle".
              1. Alex 241
                Alex 241 5 September 2013 01: 01 New
                +2
                Andrei, you voiced this, I read the news and the brains jammed completely. I don’t understand the damn thing, I skid like a Kirovets in a swamp!
              2. aviator65
                aviator65 5 September 2013 01: 04 New
                +2
                Yes, they did not agree on the price! The Ministry of Finance decides how much fighter aircraft to buy for the Air Force.
            2. studentmati
              studentmati 5 September 2013 01: 03 New
              +1
              From the point of view of the manufacturer, you can always present the goods sold under the name that the buyer wants to hear. The main thing is to feel the psychology of the buyer. If you want a cabin heater - hold it; if you want off-road tires on the Su-27 - we’ll do it; if you want a shade in the right lamp - no problem ...
              1. Peaceful military
                Peaceful military 5 September 2013 01: 09 New
                +2
                In short, guys, as AI Raikin exclaimed: "They are fooling our brother, oh they are fooling!"
                1. studentmati
                  studentmati 5 September 2013 01: 15 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Peaceful military
                  In short, guys, as AI Raikin exclaimed: "They are fooling our brother, oh they are fooling!"


                  Politics is nothing personal. Our inveterate "partners" do not believe that Russia is still "in business", so they are too shy to take or not take? Behavior sorry ....., nothing more to say.
        3. aviator65
          aviator65 5 September 2013 01: 06 New
          +3
          So I say they don’t want to take it.
          1. studentmati
            studentmati 5 September 2013 01: 21 New
            +1
            Quote: aviator65
            So I say they don’t want to take it.


            One thing remains, to prove quality in action! By the way there is a very close opportunity in time ...
            1. Peaceful military
              Peaceful military 5 September 2013 01: 26 New
              +1
              By the way, there is a very close opportunity in time.

              I just read the news that widespread use of the latest modifications of the SU-2013SM27 and MIG-3SMT was announced at the upcoming West 29 exercises, but not a word about the MIG-29M2, which is the MIG-35.
              1. studentmati
                studentmati 5 September 2013 01: 31 New
                +1
                Quote: Peaceful military
                but not words about the MIG-29M2, which is the MIG-35.


                They will pass the teachings, we will find out ... The modifications are, by definition, extreme, if you don’t tell me, but as for the name, the essence is not important!
              2. Odysseus
                Odysseus 5 September 2013 02: 03 New
                +3
                Quote: Peaceful military
                I just read the news that widespread use of the latest modifications of the SU-2013SM27 and MIG-3SMT was announced at the upcoming West 29 exercises, but not a word about the MIG-29M2, which is the MIG-35.

                It's simple. The Su-27SM3, MiG-29SMT are in the army, but MiG-29M2 is not. Therefore, not a word.
            2. aviator65
              aviator65 5 September 2013 01: 29 New
              +2
              What to prove to ours? They are either not given money for purchases, or, as in the old days; "There is an opinion ... Migi should not be taken." I'm talking about the military.
              1. studentmati
                studentmati 5 September 2013 01: 42 New
                0
                Quote: aviator65
                either, as in the old days; "There is an opinion ... Migi should not be taken." I'm talking about the military.


                Times are different, but Migi does not take. And why?
                1. Odysseus
                  Odysseus 5 September 2013 02: 10 New
                  +3
                  Quote: studentmati
                  Times are different, but Migi does not take. And why?

                  Those MiG-35s that they don’t take with Zhuk-M because they are supposedly expensive, but those that aren’t with Zhuk-A so far, so they made a move and will take SMTs from old export stocks.
                  In addition, now the main profit is, therefore, export is always expensive for us, and Lukhovitsy is not the Banner of Labor.
                  1. studentmati
                    studentmati 5 September 2013 02: 20 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Odyssey
                    In addition, now the main profit is, therefore, export is always expensive for us, and Lukhovitsy is not the Banner of Labor.


                    Profit is the foundation of the economy.

                    I recalled the analogy, the overwhelming majority (all) of the Soviet Moskvich cars were equipped with the M412E engine. The letter "E" stood for "Export". On the conveyor, all engines were marked "E". Consequently, all engines that entered the domestic market were rejected by the state acceptance. It may be funny today, but "Muscovites" were exported and very successfully ...

                    Mig is also a good car, ask the pilots and operators (I say without irony)?
                    1. aviator65
                      aviator65 5 September 2013 14: 01 New
                      +1
                      The Moskvich was a good car. In skillful hands good For export, it went partly to third world countries, and mainly to the social camp. And it was actually a domestic market within the CMEA. As for the MiG, so far no one has heard that this is a bad car. And it doesn’t matter which one.
                      Senior comrades at Mikoyan Design Bureau told me something. When the Iranian-Iraqi war was going on, our specialists from the OKB worked in one of the Iraqi air units. Someone asked the Iraqi pilots what is better to fly: on the fly or on the mirage? The answer was: "It's better on mirages. There is comfort, air conditioning is good." Then they asked: "And to fight?" In response: "And to fight - only on the MiG."
  • Peaceful military
    Peaceful military 5 September 2013 02: 38 New
    +1
    Deviate from the topic, sorry.
    Profit is the foundation of the economy.

    By no means, dear Alexander, not at all. The economy is much more complicated than the commodity-money-commodity formula, etc. = profit ... Moreover, the economy of the state.
    We are already about 30 years old, driven by the nose with this Darwinist postulate about profit, as the basis of the economy. AND? What are the results? Then, as in the best decade of reagonomics, the Soviet, planned model of organizing the state economy was taken as the basis and the results were impressive. A. Wasserman has a wonderful work on this. hi
    1. studentmati
      studentmati 5 September 2013 02: 43 New
      +1
      Quote: Peaceful military
      We are already about 30 years old, driven by the nose with this Darwinist postulate about profit, as the basis of the economy. AND?


      And why has aircraft construction gone to naught in 22 years of the "progressive" economy?
      1. aviator65
        aviator65 5 September 2013 12: 01 New
        +3
        Aircraft construction, like astronautics, and fundamental science cannot develop depending on profit. This is a strategic industry, one of the components of the country's defense capability. Our aircraft industry came to naught when it was drawn into market relations. First, Gorbachev's forced conversion, and then finished off with Gaidar's reforms. Some of the then "reformers" stated literally that we did not need it at all! Like, if you need something, we will buy it abroad. R. A. Belyakov, the last General Designer of the OKB im. Mikoyan suffered a heart attack and died shortly after his visit to Boris N. Yeltsin, trying to prove the need to preserve his team and the importance of the work he was doing. But the "father of Russian democracy" never really got into it. And you say why?
      2. Peaceful military
        Peaceful military 5 September 2013 12: 26 New
        0
        And why has aircraft construction gone to naught in 22 years of the "progressive" economy?

        That's why it came to be that aircraft manufacturing, like everything else, drove into the Procrustean bed of the Darwinist economic paradigm from profit. Here is the result.
        hi
  • aviator65
    aviator65 5 September 2013 13: 20 New
    +3
    Quote: Odyssey
    In addition, now the main profit is, therefore, export is always expensive for us, and Lukhovitsy is not the Banner of Labor

    Here! How many factories produced the MiG-29 before the early 90s? Two: the main production - "Znamya Truda" in Moscow, sparks - "Sokol" in Nizhny Novgorod. Plus a finishing base - Lukhovitsy. And now all production has been concentrated on a development base, quickly adapting it for industrial assembly. And after that they also say that the production capacity does not allow it. And how many factories have the Sukhovites left? Count: Komsomolsk, Irkutsk, Novosibirsk, Omsk. And these factories cannot be compared with Lukhovitsy. Well, at least they haven't touched the Falcon yet, otherwise they would have remained without the MiG-31.
  • Odysseus
    Odysseus 6 September 2013 08: 27 New
    0
    Quote: aviator65
    Count: Omsk

    Probably you mean Ulan-Ude? In Omsk there was Flight and engine building.
    Quote: aviator65
    And how many plants were left to the Sukhovites?

    It’s not that they were left. They simply survived by exporting to the 90s. Although by and large only Irkutsk is in order.
    Quote: aviator65
    It's good at least they haven't touched the Falcon yet, otherwise they would have remained without the MiG-31.

    The falcon is half-dead. On the whole, I agree with you. You definitely wrote, "Our aircraft industry came to naught when it was dragged into market relations."
    1. aviator65
      aviator65 6 September 2013 11: 52 New
      0
      I really want to hope that the Falcon will not suffer the fate of the Banner of Labor, which simply survived from Khodynka due to its prestigious location.