Military Review

The military-industrial complex of Ukraine - guns for fat

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The military-industrial complex of Ukraine - guns for fat

A paradoxical situation has developed in the defense industrial complex of Ukraine: with a high level of innovation and export potential, the industry is in a state of chronic crisis.


One of the main problems is poorly thought out and worse implementation of the defense reform. What measures should be taken to save the Ukrainian defense industry?

Reform: disappointing outcome

Over the next five years, the question of life and death for the majority of enterprises of the military-industrial complex (DIC) of Ukraine will be their ability to completely reorient themselves to export and find markets for their products abroad.

Moreover, this trend is caused not only and not so much by the chronic underfunding of the Ukrainian armed forces, which does not allow the implementation of modernization and rearmament programs in an appropriate amount. On March 25, 2012, the Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine approved the “Concept for the Reformation and Development of the Armed Forces of Ukraine until 2017”, according to which the reduction of the army and fleet twice (at present, the number of Ukrainian Armed Forces is 144 thousand people, by 2017 it will be 70 thousand).

In practical terms, the implementation of this reform will mean for the defense industry enterprises the largest decline in government defense orders in two decades. And this despite the fact that 12 of February of this year, Andrei Artyushenko, Director of the Department for Development and Procurement of Weapons and Military Equipment of the Ministry of Defense, noted: “The defense-industrial complex is loaded with military orders for only three to four percent of its capacity” ...

Despite the general problem situation in the industry, dozens of large enterprises of the Ukrainian “defense industry” not only maintained a stable mode of operation, but also managed to create significant potential for promising innovative developments. For example, in such areas as aircraft construction, armored vehicles, shipbuilding, radar and optoelectronic equipment, Ukrainian products are at the level of the best world analogues and are in steady demand in a number of countries. And at first glance, all the possibilities for increasing export volumes are open.

If it were not for one “but” ...

Back in 2010, the President of Ukraine set the task of modernizing and increasing the efficiency of the defense industry. As part of its directives, a large-scale reorganization of the military-industrial complex management structure was carried out: by decree of the Cabinet of Ministers No. 374 of 6 on April 2011 of the 125, existing defense enterprises became part of the state concern Ukroboronprom.

The intentions of the country's leadership were good, but in practice, instead of streamlining the situation in the industry, their implementation led to the acute problem of excessive administration, increased corruption and production stoppage at a number of previously stable enterprises.

As a result, the Secretary of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine, Andriy Klyuyev, was forced to state: “In 2010-2011, a number of tasks were set to increase the efficiency of the defense industry. Unfortunately, the effectiveness of their practical implementation is low. Problem issues are not resolved and continue to accumulate. ” Such were the disappointing results of the ambitious reforms of the military-industrial complex.

Chinese self-deception

The officials sitting in the chairs of the top managers of the state corporations of the military-industrial complex and in the offices of ministries sincerely considered themselves cool professionals and had no doubt that without much effort they could make a lot of money on export weapons. It seems that such high considerations were the basis for the ambitious program of military-technical cooperation between Ukraine and China. Figures were drawn such that it was breathtaking.

Recall that 16 in August 2010 of the year in the UNIAN news agency held a press conference of representatives of the Ministry of Industrial Policy of Ukraine under the following title: “Arms export to China will bring billions to Ukraine”. In particular, the meeting participants stated: “By 2013, the volume of exports of military products to China will reach the figure of 1,2 billion dollars.”

Such an encouraging start prompted the Cabinet of Ministers to join the process. On August 15, 2011, Mykola Azarov, during a meeting with the Chief of General Staff of the People’s Liberation Army of China, Colonel-General Chen Binde, said: "Ukraine is ready to intensify military cooperation, the exchange of military delegations, attachés, and expand the training of the Chinese military in higher educational institutions of the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine." At the same time, the Ukrainian prime minister identified the creation of heavy transport aircraft, large-tonnage ships, hovercraft as the promising areas of the military-technical cooperation, and construction tanks and air defense equipment. The government was tasked with developing a ten-year bilateral cooperation program.

23 August 2012, Dmitry Peregudov, General Director of Ukrspetsexport GC, presented a report on the group's financial and economic indicators for 2009-2011, which, in particular, contained information on the five-year plan for the upcoming work. According to this document, for 2012-2017. "Ukrspetsexport" has planned to export weapons and military equipment worth 5 billion. At the same time, 45% of products are supposed to be delivered to Asian countries, among which the main place belongs to China.

The above-mentioned nine-digit numbers of imaginary profits, it seems, just intoxicated some "specialists" in the arms trade. Any military expert knows that the Chinese prefer a “cunning approach” in armament procurement. Official Beijing has long been committed not to massive imports, but to pumping out advanced technologies and frankly pirated copying of innovative weapons and military equipment produced in Ukraine.

A simple example: the People's Republic of China signed a contract with the Sea company for the supply of an amphibious assault ship Zubr in the amount of only four units. It is clear why: the Chinese will simply copy these single items and then begin to produce them on their own. That is, the Ukrainian enterprise as a result will remain, as they say, "with the nose."

The same picture is observed in the rest of Ukrainian enterprises that succumbed to Chinese self-deception: the Chinese either bought small batches of products or demanded the transfer of production technology in full. It will take some three or four years - and the Ukrainian products copied to the People's Republic of China will be forced out from the foreign markets by the Ukrainian exporters.

Bet on Russia

One of the main causes of the crisis situation in the Ukrainian economy as a whole and in the defense industry was the gap between the unified production and technological chains between the enterprises of Ukraine and Russia.

It is known that for two decades of the newest Ukrainian stories in our country, not a single new factory or research institute has been established. The specific character of the defense industry complex of Ukraine is that it has a closed production cycle only for a small amount of military products.

Mainly Ukrainian enterprises act as suppliers of a very extensive range of the most important components and equipment items. In this sense, the defense industry of Ukraine in a natural, objective way complements the defense industry of Russia.

For example, Ukrainian enterprises produce radar and optoelectronic equipment for Russian MiG and Su fighters, engines for Mi and Ka type helicopters, and so on. Back in 2010, a conference was held in Kiev: “Ukraine’s defense industry - problems and prospects”, during which the head of research programs of the Center for Army Research, Conversion and Disarmament Sergey Zgurets stressed how seriously Ukrainian enterprises depend on the Russian market: “When we talk about relationships Ukraine and Russia in the segment of the military-industrial complex, then half of our arms exports go to Russia. ” In other words, the defense industry enterprises of Ukraine and Russia "have nowhere to go from each other." They need each other.

Even 3 December 2012, a group of experts from the public council of the Military-Industrial Commission of the Russian government developed the analytical report “Russia as an importer of armaments: challenges and opportunities”, which emphasized that creating a fully autonomous Russian defense industry is impossible.

Accordingly, the interest of the Russian side in relation to Ukraine is not in the desire to steal R & D on the cheap, as China does, but in long-term cooperation within the framework of integrated structures, which will provide Ukrainian enterprises with permanent and stable orders. It seems that this is the only real path to the revival of the Ukrainian "defense".

What can the OPK give to “small” Ukrainians

At the time of independence, around 750 of defense industry enterprises with a total staff of 1,5 million were located on the territory of Ukraine. 140 scientific, technical and industrial organizations participated in the fulfillment of defense orders.

In general, Ukraine accounted for about 30% of the entire defense industry of the Soviet Union. Of course, over the past twenty years, the production capacity of the Ukrainian defense-industrial complex has noticeably decreased. Nevertheless, the industry confidently maintains its leading position in terms of innovative development, production of high value-added products. And subject to the adoption of economically verified measures for its revival, it can significantly contribute to solving the array of accumulated social problems that are considered intractable.

First of all, we should mention such an objectively favorable factor as the general, long-term increase in the level of military allocations of most countries of the world and the volume of the international arms market. This trend allows us to count on the possibility of a significant increase in export operations of defense-industrial enterprises of Ukraine.

Let us say more: such a measure, such as combining the efforts of Russian and Ukrainian enterprises in the markets of a number of foreign countries, will allow a full-fledged breakthrough in the development of the industry. This will mean the creation of a significant number of new jobs, the growth of wages in defense enterprises, a significant increase in revenues from enterprises in the sector to social items of the state budget.

So, due to the revival of the "defense" can be successfully solved the huge problem of military retirees, which today is a shaped disaster for the Pension Fund.

In addition, in the defense industry there is a fairly large number of so-called "dual-use technologies", suitable for use in "civilian" sectors of the economy, as well as in medicine, prevention of emergency situations and man-made disasters. The use of such technologies can give a new impetus to the development of the economy as a whole and help bring the country out of a state of many years of economic stagnation.
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  1. Kars
    Kars 16 August 2013 09: 18 New
    +7
    What can I say --- Kharkov tank this year came to a small profit.


    Well, the article is rather mediocre.
    1. Kars
      Kars 16 August 2013 10: 12 New
      +1
      Sergey Gromov: Net profit of Ukroboronprom Group for the first half of the year grew by 520%


      In the first half of 2013, compared with the same period of 2012, the financial performance of the Concern enterprises noticeably improved. Net profit in the first half of the year amounted to 410 million hryvnia, compared with a loss of 97,6 million for the same period last year.

      This was announced by the Director General of the Ukroboronprom Group of Companies Sergey Gromov.
      According to S. Gromov, improvement of financial results is observed in all areas of the Concern’s activity. He emphasized that the largest growth in profitability was shown by shipbuilding enterprises, aircraft industry and special exporters.
      “The profit of shipbuilding and marine engineering enterprises increased from 35 million hryvnias in the first half of 2012 to 221 million in the corresponding period of 2013. The performance of aviation industry enterprises increased over the indicated period from 80 million to 143 million hryvnias. The profit of special exporters is from 44 million to 64 million hryvnias, ”says Sergey Gromov.
      According to him, even the deeply unprofitable enterprises of the Concern have demonstrated positive economic dynamics.
      “Manufacturers of radar equipment, air defense, missile and artillery weapons and communications over the year overcame the crisis and ended the study period with a total profit of 7,5 million hryvnias, in contrast to the losses of 62 million in the first half of 2012. Significantly reduced losses of enterprises of armored, automotive, engineering and special equipment. In the first half of 2012, their total loss amounted to 173 million hryvnias, and in the corresponding period of 2013 decreased to 17 million. The enterprises producing missiles and ammunition reduced losses for the study period from 22 million to 11 million hryvnias, ” - said Sergey Gromov.

      Sergey Gromov: The volume of production by enterprises of Ukroboronprom in the first half of the year increased by 31,1%

      General Director of the Ukroboronprom Group of Companies Sergey Gromov announced an increase in the volume of products manufactured and sold by the Concern enterprises.

      “The volume of manufactured products, works and services increased by 31,1% - from 4,5 billion hryvnias in the first half of 2012 to 5,9 billion in the corresponding period of the current year, primarily due to the doubling of production for export. The volume of sales increased by 55,3% from 4,5 billion hryvnias to 6,9 billion. Including for export - from 3 to 5,2 billion hryvnias, ”S. Gromov said.
      According to him, the largest increase in finished products of the Concern was provided by SE “Lugansk Aircraft Repair Plant” - 14,4 million, JSC “Fiolent Plant” - 24,4 million, GP NPKG “Zorya-Mashproekt” - 201,2 million hryvnias .
      In the first half of 2013, the Concern enterprises transferred UAH 1,3 billion to the budgets of all levels. The target indicator approved by the Concern for the year is 2,8 billion hryvnias.
      Sergey Gromov emphasized that a slight increase in indicators of work and services in the domestic market is due to insufficient budget financing of government orders.
      In his opinion, the effective activity of the defense industry enterprises is facilitated by their integration into the Concern. “Ukroboronprom is actually a vertically integrated structure. Earlier, the effectiveness of this format was proved in the field of non-ferrous and ferrous metallurgy, as well as the chemical industry, ”says S. Gromov.
      He noted that a positive trend was achieved in the worsening global environment.
      “Ukroboronprom is increasing its indicators, despite the decrease in the global arms and military equipment market by 0,5% in 2012, which occurred for the first time since 1988, according to studies by the Stockholm Peace Research Institute (SIPRI),” Sergei Gromov emphasized. Repost Reposted 0
      Tags: Ukraine, Ukroboronprom, Ukspeceksport
      1. Flooding
        Flooding 16 August 2013 11: 41 New
        +4
        Quote: Kars
        Net profit of Ukroboronprom Group for the first half-year increased by 520%

        Quote: Kars
        Net profit in the first half of the year amounted to 410 million hryvnia, compared with a loss of 97,6 million for the same period last year.

        Kars, I'm having trouble this morning with math.
        How is the figure of 520% ​​net profit growth? Did you take the second half of 2012?
        because when compared with the same period last year, profit growth is billions of times! This I understand, there is something to boast about.
        After all, as such, there was no net profit last year, it was negative.
        And then the simple laws of mathematics ...
  2. andru_007
    andru_007 16 August 2013 09: 38 New
    +4
    Quote: Kars
    What can I say --- Kharkov tank this year came to a small profit.

    For twenty-two years of independence, it’s p .. what a success what
    Good photo, as I understand it, Oplot ...
    1. Kars
      Kars 16 August 2013 10: 06 New
      +5
      Quote: andru_007
      For twenty-two years of independence, it’s p .. what a success

      Well, the Leningrad Tank Plant doesn’t boast of that anymore. And in such a period, for a tank plant, it really p ... what a success. The English tank factory closed, the French Leclerci haven't done for a long time.
      1. Zhenya
        Zhenya 16 August 2013 14: 48 New
        +1
        Everything is logical, Europe is increasingly abandoning tanks, there is a gradual decline in output.
    2. Lord of the Sith
      Lord of the Sith 16 August 2013 10: 18 New
      0
      In order to troll something, you must first study the issue, otherwise you may find yourself in a silly position!
  3. Ivan79
    Ivan79 16 August 2013 09: 52 New
    +6
    Effective managers - they are so ... Burn nada with a hot iron!
  4. makst83
    makst83 16 August 2013 10: 03 New
    10
    I will say the words of the beloved cartoon hero: "The military-industrial complex of Ukraine is a very strange thing, it seems to be there, but it still does not exist!")))
    1. Geisenberg
      Geisenberg 16 August 2013 11: 15 New
      0
      Quote: makst83
      I will say the words of the beloved cartoon hero: "The military-industrial complex of Ukraine is a very strange thing, it seems to be there, but it still does not exist!")))


      I’ll add from myself - and for free we do not need such patterns
  5. mazepa
    mazepa 16 August 2013 10: 06 New
    +1
    I agree about the managers.
    Regarding the article, it is not clear why the author is jumping from exporting goods to other countries to re-equipping the national army. Do not do like this. It would be better to describe either export or refitting. Although I can’t agree that the situation here is very bad. Their good news: In Crimea set a world record for raising a helicopter to the maximum flight altitude. The upgraded Mi-8MSB helicopter with TV3-117VMA-SBM1V 4E series engines rose to a height of 9150 meters and thereby blocked the ceiling of last year’s height, the press service of Motor Sich JSC reports.
  6. M. Peter
    M. Peter 16 August 2013 10: 33 New
    +9
    The defense industry of Ukraine, it is part of the defense industry of the USSR, just like our Russian defense industry, one BUT, Russia corrects the situation, trying to get rid of the country's dependence, which is trying to enter into an unfriendly bloc. In a few years, Russia will have its own defense industry complex, Ukraine will have separate factories generating revenue from the sale of unique units, in pieces, to third world countries, and the defense industry itself, as we now understand, is unlikely. Well, it’s just that you cannot survive without cooperation with Russia, and Russia is giving up Ukraine.
    1. mazepa
      mazepa 16 August 2013 11: 23 New
      -11
      In the same way, they talked about gas, but we purchased 22% less gas from you in 4 months of 2013. We buy cheaper from an unfriendly block, a block that is not friendly to us does not wage trade wars, as Russia is now. Ukraine is not Belarus. Old Man simply has no where to go, your pressure on Belarus is bearing fruit. Here are quotes and videos of Lukashenko.
      President of Belarus Alexander Lukashenko criticized the Customs Union and stated that "Russia has deceived Belarus." He stated this at a press conference in Minsk.

      The politician said that the Customs Union is not functioning, and Russia does not fulfill these promises when launching this project and "there is a team to Belarus not to let the Russian market."

      “This is a very difficult process. It seems that someone should have started this in order to demonstrate: “Look at how I work in this direction!” It was so often in our relations with the Russian Federation, ”said the President of Belarus.

      Meanwhile, Lukashenko believes that if the CU takes place according to classical principles that are accepted around the world, this will be good for Belarus: 170 million market, no barriers and barriers to trade.

      “We are not afraid that Russia will strangle us - a huge monster, we are not afraid that it will come to our market. But Russia should not impede our movement either to Kazakhstan or to the Russian market, ”says Lukashenko.

      He noted that while Russia is blocking the promotion of Belarusian goods on the Russian market.

      "Do you remember -" sugar war "," milk war ", etc. The main ideologist and trade representative in Russia is Onishchenko. He is the main expert in Moldovan wines, and in Georgian waters, and in our meat-milk-sugar. You know how these levers are turned on, ”concluded the President of Belarus. News dated August 14, 2013.

      1. Zopuhhh
        Zopuhhh 16 August 2013 12: 08 New
        10
        Industry is dying, and you don’t need gas either, they found something to rejoice ...
        1. Grot.sereda
          Grot.sereda 23 July 2014 21: 21 New
          0
          Gas is mainly needed by industry and the public. Factories are shutting down, but the population will get by.
      2. M. Peter
        M. Peter 16 August 2013 13: 03 New
        +7
        Quote: mazepa
        In the same way, they talked about gas, but we purchased 22% less gas from you in 4 months of 2013. We buy cheaper from an unfriendly block, a block that is not friendly to us does not wage trade wars, as Russia is now.

        This is the same as saying, they say I became more independent from the store, I began to buy 15% less ... wink Although this is most likely not an indicator of independence, rather than an indicator of decline.
      3. Zhenya
        Zhenya 16 August 2013 14: 51 New
        +7
        God damn you! Well done, that the enterprises came out for profit, well done, that everything is fine with you, tired of this booth. Russia is bad, hammer in and don’t think about it, even if you refuse gas, we have a place to sell it.
    2. Grot.sereda
      Grot.sereda 23 July 2014 21: 17 New
      0
      In Ukraine, experts from NATO and the USA have long been sleeping and sleeping for a long time. The military-industrial complex technologies, which they created during the USSR, were the most advanced, long-stolen goods, but what moved, shot and flew, disassembled to the last screw is sold for nothing. The leaders simply "kick out" the unwanted "new authorities. This is the scenario of the State Department. Russia has already passed this and shot at the White House from tanks. Is Ukraine worse than us? Beat your own so that strangers are afraid. Everything is repeated.
  7. sys-1985
    sys-1985 16 August 2013 11: 35 New
    +4
    The military-industrial complex in full will not be anymore, and why is it for Ukraine ?! The conditions for joining any unions are almost a complete rejection of the full-scale production of something. If only there was no war.
  8. Pacifist
    Pacifist 16 August 2013 11: 37 New
    15
    In order to link the military-industrial complex of Russia and the defense industry of Ukraine, Russia needs to be confident in a partner, and in the current situation, the Ukrainian leadership has made it possible to forget about cooperation. That is why the level of cooperation is decreasing and the share of import substitution programs is increasing. Mention of a helicopter engine development program in Russia says nothing? Without deliveries of products to Russia, it is not sad for the patriots of Ukraine, the Ukrainian defense industry will die very quickly. China will suck it to the shell and throw it away, while Europe’s products of the Ukrainian defense industry didn’t fall. These are the pies with kittens. And not Russia refuses Ukraine, but b ... I’m the position of the Ukrainian leadership has paid off, which is extremely sad for Ukraine and Russia. They made one geopolitical mistake, they swept the country. The Russian leadership made conclusions, but the Ukrainian leadership did not seem to have played enough ... only this is a game on the graves.
    1. Flooding
      Flooding 16 August 2013 12: 09 New
      +4
      Quote: Pacifist
      China will suck it to the shell and throw it away, while Europe’s products of the Ukrainian defense industry didn’t fall.

      It is so obvious that you are amazed at the naivete of some opponents.
      Of course, Ukraine will rely not on Europe, but on Africa, Southeast Asia, and they will try to lick on South America.
      But what can they offer when the T-72 storages are empty and the contracts for the supply of new equipment are not fulfilled? But everything goes to that.
      They will probably try to cooperate with other players in the market.
      As in particular, they are trying now with Poland.
    2. igor67
      igor67 16 August 2013 12: 45 New
      -1
      Quote: Pacifist
      In order to link the military-industrial complex of Russia and the defense industry of Ukraine, Russia needs to be confident in a partner, and in the current situation, the Ukrainian leadership has made it possible to forget about cooperation. That is why the level of cooperation is decreasing and the share of import substitution programs is increasing. Mention of a helicopter engine development program in Russia says nothing? Without deliveries of products to Russia, it is not sad for the patriots of Ukraine, the Ukrainian defense industry will die very quickly. China will suck it to the shell and throw it away, while Europe’s products of the Ukrainian defense industry didn’t fall. These are the pies with kittens. And not Russia refuses Ukraine, but b ... I’m the position of the Ukrainian leadership has paid off, which is extremely sad for Ukraine and Russia. They made one geopolitical mistake, they swept the country. The Russian leadership made conclusions, but the Ukrainian leadership did not seem to have played enough ... only this is a game on the graves.

      You are wrong, I worked for many years in the Soviet and then the Ukrainian military-industrial complex, and so after the collapse of the Union, when Kravchuk and Yeltsin signed a friendship agreement and there, our supplies went for repair kits, everything seems to be legal, only Russian enterprises received a directive there is nothing to sell or deliver from “Top” to Ukraine, so the big question is who threw whom, and what they signed there in Pushcha
      1. Pacifist
        Pacifist 16 August 2013 13: 12 New
        +5
        I will not argue, not because I can’t find the arguments, but because the topic is extremely painful. Belovezhskaya’s betrayal is a separate sore subject ... During the time of joint independence, so many have accumulated that you can list volumes, but since the beginning of 2000 there have been several attempts to begin mutual movement to meet each other ... and all failed with ... from my point of view actions Ukrainian authorities ... in general, a very painful impression of all this ...
        1. igor67
          igor67 16 August 2013 13: 22 New
          +2
          Quote: Pacifist
          I will not argue, not because I can’t find the arguments, but because the topic is extremely painful. Belovezhskaya’s betrayal is a separate sore subject ... During the time of joint independence, so many have accumulated that you can list volumes, but since the beginning of 2000 there have been several attempts to begin mutual movement to meet each other ... and all failed with ... from my point of view actions Ukrainian authorities ... in general, a very painful impression of all this ...

          Why again Ukraine? Remember Tymoshenko’s first term? Also, for the theft of gas and: something related to the Russian Ministry of Defense, I remember even Putin filed a lawsuit against him in Interpol, and then they all removed and forgot the miracle and again accepted the paradox in the Kremlin!
  9. sania0413
    sania0413 16 August 2013 12: 02 New
    10
    it seems to me, or the title and photo of the article can be offensive to someone?
    1. Flooding
      Flooding 16 August 2013 13: 05 New
      +2
      Quote: sania0413
      it seems to me, or the title and photo of the article can be offensive to someone?

      Honestly, at first I did not pay attention.
      Indeed, the picture is outrageous.
      1. Rider
        Rider 16 August 2013 13: 42 New
        +1
        Quote: Flood
        Indeed, the picture is outrageous.


        but in my opinion it’s extremely symbolic.
    2. mazepa
      mazepa 16 August 2013 15: 20 New
      -4
      I noticed. I just did not start writing about it. Americans are joking about vodka, bears and balalaikas about Russia, and our northern neighbor is apparently pouring his anger on the neighbors. He also didn’t answer because it’s stupid, Russia also sells its equipment, but how would they react with T90 with the Russian flag with vodka? Please do not associate. There are a lot of people in Ukraine who treat Russians just like Russians treat them.
      1. M. Peter
        M. Peter 16 August 2013 17: 32 New
        +3
        Quote: mazepa
        There are a lot of people in Ukraine who treat Russians just like Russians treat them.

        I'm afraid to shock you, but in Russia there are enough such people.
        For example, a neighbor drunk is unlikely to cause a bunch of positive reviews, usually the opposite. You know, he can be either Russian or not. Do not pay attention to this. You have a reassessment of the Ukrainian question on the part of Russians, and indeed Russia itself. As a rule, everyone here is parallel to us, only those who were somehow connected by family ties or something else are interested.
  10. smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 12: 25 New
    +3
    Peramoga of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex
    On October 10, 2009, the Ukrainian state-owned company Spetstekhnoexport signed a contract with the Sudanese Ministry of Defense (Military Industrial Corporation - MIC) through the mediation of the Sudanese company El Shaheed Ibrahim Shamseldeen Complex For Heavy Industries for the supply of a large batch of ground weapons, which included 110 main tanks T-72M1, 60 modernized T-55M tanks and 120 armored personnel carriers BTR-3E1. The tanks came from the presence of the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine with subsequent repairs, and the BTR-3E1 was supposed to be delivered to a new production enterprise, the Kiev Repair and Mechanical Plant. The BTR-3E1 should have been delivered with a standard set of individual spare parts, additional protection and a new cheapened Sturm-3MS combat module (the main differences are the absence of the Barrier anti-tank system and 30-mm grenade launcher, the location of the sighting system was changed). The total cost of armored vehicles sold under this contract in Sudan amounted to about 70 million euros., And an additional agreement to it provided for the supply of spare parts worth at least another 7 million euros. This was to be only the first part of the supply to Sudan from Ukraine of ground equipment and weapons under the so-called “big contract” worth several hundred million euros.
    During the 2010-2012 years, Ukraine, according to the data provided by it to the UN Register of Conventional Arms, delivered to the Sudan a total of 110 T-72М1 tanks (in fact, as you can judge, we mean the T-72A from the presence with the installation of mounted dynamic protection "Contact- 1 "), 60 tanks T-55М, 30 BMP-1, 10 BRDM-2, 41 self-propelled howitzer 2X1 caliber 122 mm, 30 combat vehicles MLRS BM-21" Grade X mmn Bronder’s XRNMND XRNMD’s in the version of the command post vehicle.

    In contrast to the sale of old equipment, the implementation of the contract for the supply of Sudan 120 BTR-3E1 of a new manufacture faced serious difficulties. At the end of 2010, the Kiev Repair and Mechanical Plant State Enterprise was able to send only the first two armored personnel carriers to Sudan, and in 2011 - only eight more BTR-3E1. Due to chronic breakdowns in the terms of the contract and the unsatisfactory quality of the ten cars already received, the Sudanese side in 2012 canceled the contract regarding the supply of BTR-3E1 and refused to receive 110 remaining units.
    Thus, the BTR-3 in Sudan repeated the fate of these machines in the UAE (the starting customer that financed its development), Myanmar, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan - when, after receiving small batches of BTR-3, customers refused to receive this equipment further.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/594362.html

    And here’s another “pride” of the Ukrainian VPK-BTR-4 ship with the next batch of which still hangs in the Indian Ocean, they say they are already heading to India, which is the largest scrap metal producer in the world. In the meantime, Ukraine is trading in stocks left over from the former USSR (T-72, BMP-1, BTR-70,2S1 Gvozdika, etc.), and Ukrainian “homemade products on their knees” regularly turn out to be defective. See how it will be a contract with Thailand for the supply of Oplot tanks is being fulfilled. Something like that. Sala Heroam! Death to the curds! Regards! hi
    1. Kars
      Kars 16 August 2013 12: 34 New
      +2
      Quote: smiths xnumx
      Paramoga "Ukrainian military-industrial complex

      Wow, last year's news))))

      But Thailand takes all the same BTR-3s, and the deliveries are regular. And what kind of background is it with Sudan, especially after the outbreak of the civil war, and problems with legal exports - you need to be disassembled.

      Quote: smiths xnumx
      PK-BTR-4 ship with the next batch of which is still hanging

      How not yet unloaded and not arrested for the auction? Well then.
      1. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 12: 56 New
        +3
        Wow, last year's news))))

        But Thailand takes all the same BTR-3s, and the deliveries are regular. And what kind of background is it with Sudan, especially after the outbreak of the civil war, and problems with legal exports - you need to be disassembled.
        The news is not of the first freshness, but the BTR-80A (BTR-3 is just the Ukrainian modification of the BTR-80) Sudan takes and actively uses them (2 contracts for 30 units each in 2000 and 2005)
        http://www.army-guide.com/rus/countrys.php?countryID=94
        During 2010-2012, Ukraine, according to the data provided by it to the UN Register of Conventional Arms, delivered to the Sudan a total of 110 T-72M1 tanks (in fact, as you can judge, we mean the T-72A from the presence of the “Contact- 1 "), 60 tanks T-55M, 30 BMP-1, 10 BRDM-2, 41 self-propelled howitzer 2C1 caliber 122 mm, 30 combat vehicles RSZO BM-21 Grad 122 mm caliber, as well as one upgraded armored personnel carrier BTR-70Di in the version of the command-staff machine and there were no problems with legal exports (recent deliveries already in 2012). But with the "non-fallow" BTR-3 problem. "Cursed Putin reached out"
        How not yet unloaded and not arrested for the auction? Well then.
        And what has already been unloaded and arrested? Do not share the link. Currently, SE PACIFICA hangs out on the roads of the port of Fujairah, UAE. Already 5 days. And before that, it really stuck in the Persian Gulf for several months. Here you can see:
        http://www.shipfinder.com/main/defaultwork?searchKey=SE%20PACIFICA&tp=1

        Here's a link to Jane's Defense Weekly:
        "Iraq has reportedly refused to take delivery of another consignment of Ukrainian BTR-4 armored personnel carriers (APCs) due to defects."

        http://www.janes.com/article/25704/iraq-btr-4-delivery-delayed
        .
        1. smiths xnumx
          smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 12: 56 New
          +4
          At the same time, by the way, an "amateur" counting tanks under the Cyprus contract of Russia does not enlighten about this:
          “I was an army receiver. Do not confuse with a factory receiver. I tested this piece of iron in conditions that may occur during operation. Index “E” means that the products are exported and not intended for the Ukrainian Armed Forces. For the Armed Forces of Ukraine, another version of this product is provided - BTR-4M. However, it still exists only in the drawings. Of the seven options (projects) - not one was approved.

          But back to the tests. Representatives of the Kharkov plant as they recognized my "mandatory program", so immediately twisted. Calls to Kiev began, after which some test cycles were simply removed.

          Yes, I forgot to say. On the BTR-4 there is generally no tactical and technical task (TTZ - regulatory and technical documents in the development and production system for military equipment that establish a set of requirements for the content, scope and timing of research or development work, - Ed.) . In other words, the country did not order such an APC. This is a personal initiative of comrades from Ukroboronprom, Ukrspetseksprot and the breeders themselves. Without TTZ and the corresponding resolution of the relevant committee (on defense) of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, this is a self-made gun.

          The second one. During the 20 days of the “lightweight” tests initiated by the plant, we identified 35 deficiencies in the machine’s body, 39 shortcomings in the combat module, five shortcomings in the power plant ...

          One such drawback in Soviet times would mean sending equipment for revision. And if there are two or more, then this is a blockage. Full. In short, the car is not just r ... but r ... but in a cube! I finally advised the guys from the factory to often go to the Internet or watch Al-Jazeera so as not to miss the moment when their cars would blaze en masse on the battlefields. And then he learned that all the armored personnel carriers bought by Iraq are constantly in storage, under canopies. The army categorically refuses to ride them. That’s all love. ”

          http://dumskaya.net/news/zastryavshie-posredi-persidskogo-zaliva-ukrainsk-028622
          /
          1. Kars
            Kars 16 August 2013 13: 05 New
            +2
            Quote: smiths xnumx
            I was an army receiver.

            Thanks, he laughed))) again from the Duma.))) There they should already be unloading and the OWNER personally negotiates with India)))
            Quote: smiths xnumx
            but the BTR-80A

            Quote: smiths xnumx
            2 contracts for 30 units each in 2000 and 2005)

            We look at the years - and think about it - it can be seen from the experience of operating 80A, the Sudanese decided not to take them anymore, and ordered BTR-3 from Ukraine. And then the war started and they were not up to new expensive toys.
            1. smiths xnumx
              smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 13: 29 New
              +4
              Thanks, he laughed))) again from the Duma.))) There they should already be unloading and the OWNER personally negotiates with India)))
              Consequently, Iraq did not accept armored personnel carriers. Well, we are waiting, from the next squeals from Tarasenko and Kotobred about the great "overpower" of Ukraine, which delivered the BTR-4 to India. By the way, Ukrspetsexport did not OFFICIALLY confirm, but did not refute, Duma’s information about the unwillingness of the Iraqi side to accept armored personnel carriers.
              We look at the years - and think about it - it can be seen from the experience of operating 80A, the Sudanese decided not to take them anymore, and ordered BTR-3 from Ukraine. And then the war started and they were not up to new expensive toys.

              We look. The cost of a batch of 30 BTR-80A-15 million dollars, i.e. the cost of an armored personnel carrier is 500 dollars
              http://www.army-guide.com/rus/countrys.php?countryID=94
              . Sudanese took the T-72, BMP-1, "Carnations", even the ancient T-55Ms and what’s most interesting, they found the money for them, and Ukraine’s sanctions didn’t prevent them from being put in a warring country, but they didn’t take the "newest" BTR-3E1 , so there may be a problem in the BTR-3 itself. Or maybe the problem is again in the position of Ukraine, which decided to supply weapons to both ours and yours and Sudan and its main opponent South Sudan (Faina and T-72). Now there is a similar situation with Azerbaijan, which was also "supposedly planning to buy" Oploty " and BTR-3, which was a lot of screams in ukrnet and even acquired 3 BTR-3E1
              http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C1%D2%D0-3
              , and eventually came to the T-90 and BTR-82A
              http://warfiles.ru/show-36695-sudan-v-2012-godu-annuliroval-kontrakt-na-postavku
              -ukrainskih-btr-3e1.html
              1. Kars
                Kars 16 August 2013 14: 59 New
                +1
                Quote: smiths xnumx
                Consequently, Iraq did not accept armored personnel carriers.

                Therefore - it does not prove anything. Especially poor quality.
                Quote: smiths xnumx
                We look. The cost of a batch of 30 BTR-80A-15 million dollars, i.e. the cost of an armored personnel carrier is 500 dollars

                In what year was it? And do not compare stuff with BTR-3
                Quote: smiths xnumx
                Sudanese took the T-72, BMP-1, "Carnations", even the ancient T-55M, and what’s most interesting was the money they found, and the sanctions of Ukraine didn’t prevent them from being put in a warring country
                You look at the dates, you can understand. When that went, and how quickly. B / y took immediately, as it was - and the BTR-3 must be made, and then the fighting began.

                Quote: smiths xnumx
                otoroya decided to deliver weapons to both ours and yours and to Sudan and its main adversary to South Sudan (Faina and T-72).

                By the way, you don’t know about the campaign.
                in Mombasa September 25, 2008 the ship was captured by Somali pirates
                How much before the war? How much before the formation of South Sudan?
                Quote: smiths xnumx
                and eventually came to the T-90 and BTR-82A

                How did it go? There is no mention in the link. Or did you dig a T-90 somewhere in Sudan?
                1. smiths xnumx
                  smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 15: 25 New
                  +3
                  Therefore - it does not prove anything. Especially poor quality.
                  What are you talking about, that the ship from March (loading armored personnel carriers in Odessa, google) through August just hangs out at sea and does not unload. Back in February 2013, the representative of the Iraqi Parliament’s Security and Defense Commission, Shivan Muhammad Taha, accused Ukraine of supplying low-quality BTR-4s to the Iraqi army and disrupting delivery dates for this contract.
                  “An investigation into the supply of arms to Iraq by Ukraine revealed corruption in the third part of the contract regarding the sale of 420 armored personnel carriers, of which only about 100 are currently delivered, despite the fact that several years have passed since the ratification of the contract,” he said. According to the deputy, in the course of the investigation it was established that all the armored personnel carriers delivered were “very old, corps rusty, cars unsuitable for use”.
                  http://sdelanounas.in.ua/blogs/38028/.
                  . Or that already at Jane's Defense Weekly he writes that Iraq does not accept Ukrainian armored personnel carriers because of their poor quality, I repeat specifically for you, encore:
                  "Iraq has reportedly refused to take delivery of another consignment of Ukrainian BTR-4 armored personnel carriers (APCs) due to defects."


                  http://www.janes.com/article/25704/iraq-btr-4-delivery-delayed
                  No need to pull the facts, and the best confirmation of your words will be a video with the unloading of the BTR-4 from a ship in Iraq.
                  1. smiths xnumx
                    smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 15: 43 New
                    +1
                    In what year was it? And do not compare stuff with BTR-3
                    Again, specifically for you encore, 2 contracts for 30 units each in 2000 and 2005
                    http://www.army-guide.com/rus/countrys.php?countryID=94
                    . What rubbish are you talking about. Stop raving. This “rubbish” in your opinion is bought half the world (Iraq, Venezuela, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Sudan, then google it yourself, the poor have no servants), it is traded by the same Ukraine, deliveries of the BTR-80 to Iraq, and the “newest” BTR- 3 (the same BTR-80, only with the Ukrainian module), practically no one needs it and the UAE (the starting customer that financed its development) also refused it, Myanmar, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Sudan. Thailand alone is still holding on. Or that Ukraine tore off the Iraqi contract, conducted on a non-alternative basis (without a tender, in gratitude for the participation of the Ukrainian brigade in the occupation of Iraq). It looks like you are repeating the story of "fools, Arabs and blacks."
                    You look at the dates, you can understand. When that went, and how quickly. B / y took immediately, as it was - and the BTR-3 must be made, and then the fighting began.

                    In Sudan, a civil war has been going on since its founding between Muslim Arabs from the North and Christian Negroes from the South, while African countries bordering South Sudan support the rebels. Learn the materiel. In January 2005, the parties agreed that South Sudan will enjoy autonomy for 6 years, after which the issue of independence of this territory will be put to a referendum, and oil revenues during this period are divided equally between the government and the rebels. and in 2011, after a referendum, South Sudan gained independence. So leave your tales to yourself.
                    How did it go? There is no mention in the link. Or did you dig a T-90 somewhere in Sudan?
                    Do not jump, of course, this is your favorite method of finding fault with words, especially when there are no arguments, where did I write about the T-90 in Sudan? I wrote about the next epic "ukroperemog" in Azerbaijan, where, as the "competent" Tarasenko and Kotobred shouted, they should have adopted the Oplot and BTR-3E, and as a result they took the T-90 and BTR-82A, here’s my phrase :
                    Now there is a similar situation with Azerbaijan, which was also "supposedly planning to buy" Oploty "and BTR-3, which was a lot of screams in Ukrnet and even acquired 3 BTR-3E1
                    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C1%D2%D0-3
                    , and eventually came to the T-90 and BTR-82A
                    1. Kars
                      Kars 16 August 2013 21: 59 New
                      +1
                      Quote: smiths xnumx
                      Where did I write about the T-90 in Sudan?

                      Quote: smiths xnumx
                      Now there is a similar situation with Azerbaijan, which was also "supposedly planning to buy" Oploty "and BTR-3, which was a lot of screams in Ukrnet and even acquired 3 BTR-3E1
                      http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C1%D2%D0-3
                      and eventually came to T-90 and BTR-82A

                      Quote: smiths xnumx
                      http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C1%D2%D0-3, а в итоге пришел к Т-90 и БТР-82А
                      http://warfiles.ru/show-36695-sudan-v-2012-godu-annuliroval-kontrakt-na-postavku



                      -ukrainskih-btr-3e1.html


                      So ring, they wrote the T-90 themselves

                      Quote: smiths xnumx
                      Again, specifically for you encore, 2 contracts for 30 units each in 2000 and 2005

                      And the contract for the BTR-3 was planned for 2012, which is not clear to you.

                      Quote: smiths xnumx
                      and in 2011, after a referendum, South Sudan gained independence. So keep your tales
                      So that's why they couldn’t deliver to South Sudan before that, well, you’re just like a storyteller as you come up with.

                      Quote: smiths xnumx
                      In January 2005, the parties agreed that South Sudan would enjoy autonomy for 6 years,

                      And there is a right to purchase weapons? Can you bring a contract agreement between UkspetsExport and SOUTH Sudan.?

                      Arab-Israeli war (1947-1949)
                      The first civil war in Sudan (1955-1972)
                      The Second Civil War in Sudan (1983-2005)
                      Border Conflict with Egypt (1995)
                      Darfur Conflict (since 2003)

                      1. smiths xnumx
                        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 10: 31 New
                        +2
                        So ring, they wrote the T-90 themselves
                        Kars are being treated, I repeat once again what I meant the T-90 in Azerbaijan, although if Sudan buys the T-90 I will only be glad. Although the ratio of sales of T-90 and Oplot (2500 versus 49) and T-72 and T-64 (a lot against ZERO) does not play.
                        So that's why they couldn’t deliver to South Sudan before that, well, you’re just like a storyteller as you come up with.

                        Ukraine supplied arms and military equipment to South Sudan, which were used in the confrontation between the Sudan People's Liberation Army and the South Sudan Liberation Army. According to the international human rights organization Amnesty International, it was deliveries of Ukrainian, as well as Chinese and Sudanese military equipment, weapons and ammunition that provoked an aggravation of the conflict in 2010-2011 in the state of Al Wahda.

                        According to the organization, Ukraine delivered the main battle tanks T-72 to South Sudan, which were used by the Sudan People's Liberation Army, in particular, to fire at civilians. Amnesty International was able to document the presence of five main battle tanks in the city of Mayom in the state of El Wahda, including three T-72M1 delivered to the country by Ukraine in 2009 through Kenya and Uganda. Amnesty International does not specify the total supply of Ukrainian equipment.

                        According to the Stockholm Peace Research Institute (SIPRI), in 2007-2009 Ukraine delivered 11 BM-21 Grad multiple launch rocket systems to South Sudan, as well as 77 T-72M1 main battle tanks. According to the UN Register of Conventional Arms Supplies, in 2007-2010, Ukraine supplied Kenya, Uganda, Chad and Congo with more than 58 thousand machine guns, heavy and light machine guns and pistols.
                        Calm down Kars, especially since your famous “woman of easy virtue” is “independent”: we will dance for your penny.
                        And there is a right to purchase weapons? Can you bring a contract agreement between UkspetsExport and SOUTH Sudan.?
                        Or maybe you still have the moon from heaven. read above and continue to carry the next nonsense.
                      2. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 10: 35 New
                        +1
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        I repeat again what T-90 meant

                        you never know what you mean, but you wrote about the T-90 in Sudan.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        According to the organization, Ukraine delivered the main battle tanks T-72 to South Sudan, which were used by the Sudan People's Liberation Army

                        )))))) aren’t they funny? They put the tanks in South Sudan and used Sudan. This is all black PR and failed to prove it.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        Or maybe you still have the moon from heaven. read above and continue to carry the next nonsense

                        Well, I read your next nonsense, but the fact that you can’t bring anything can be understood.

                        The information about Ukraine’s deliveries of tanks to the territory of South Sudan in 2007-2009, disseminated by the human rights organization Amnesty International, is based on outdated data.
                        This was stated by a source close to the state-owned company Ukrspetsexport, Interfax-Ukraine reports.
                        According to the source, the episode alleging the delivery of Ukrainian T-72 tanks under a contract with the Kenyan Ministry of Defense in 2008, which allegedly was delivered to South Sudan, received international publicity thanks to the exposure of the Wikileaks website in December 2010.
                        “Having gone through the stage of the“ information boom ”, the disclosures of Wikileaks themselves have become the subject of international judicial review, and now, we can say, they have“ expired statutes of limitations, ”the source said.
                        He also noted that the situation with the tank contract was commented by officials of Ukraine, including the management of the state company Ukrspetsexport at the stage of conclusion and implementation of the contract.
                        “The essence of these statements can be summarized: the accusations against Ukraine are unfounded and did not have an official evidence base,” the source emphasized.
                      3. smiths xnumx
                        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 11: 44 New
                        +1
                        you never know what you mean, but you wrote about the T-90 in Sudan.
                        Think what you want, however, the T-90 in Sudan, unfortunately not, do not lose hope that they will be there over time.
                        )))))) aren’t they funny? They put the tanks in South Sudan and used Sudan. This is all black PR and failed to prove it.
                        Kars, I get the impression that you are either lazy or stupid so much that you don’t know how to use Google. Especially for you:
                        Sudan People's Liberation Army. The Sudan Liberation People's Army is the ruling political movement in South Sudan, a former rebel group that fought first for autonomy and then for the independence of the southern Negro-Christian provinces of Sudan from the Arab-Islamic government. Founded in 1983 by John Garang. Since 2005, she has been observing a ceasefire, and the leader of the organization was ex officio Vice President of Sudan. It was supported by the governments of Ethiopia and Uganda. July 9, 2011 The Republic of South Sudan became an independent state. After gaining independence in 2011, the NEA will form the core of the armed forces of South Sudan.
                        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Народно-освободительная_армия_Судана
                        Black PR, why? Ukraine and Ukrspetsexport, so you won’t wash off a black dog.
                        Well, I read your next nonsense, but the fact that you can’t bring anything can be understood.
                        And what did you bring the source of OBS (one woman said)
                        This was stated by a source close to the state-owned company Ukrspetsexport, Interfax-Ukraine reports.
                        In short, no one can even call in any way. Where is the OFFICIAL rebuttal of Ukrspetsexport there is none, but there is no refutation of Dumskaya’s information about the disruption of the supply of armored personnel carriers to Iraq.
                        Well, also for you about "Faina"
                        Why does Kiev have such, to put it mildly, strange partners in the arms business, among which separatists prevail, fighting for independence by force? This question was answered in an interview with Pravda.Ru by UKRAINIAN political scientist Vladimir Skachko ... For the first time, arms relations between Ukraine and South Sudan were discussed in 2008, when Kiev lit up with a cargo of weapons on the Faina ship, captured in September of that year. Somali pirates. And although Kenya was the ship’s destination, everything said that it was a transit country, and the cargo was destined for South Sudan ... To these words, it should be added that they talked about the dark affairs of Ukraine in ... the Somali pirates mentioned above. Angered by the long delay in the ransom, they publicly announced that the cargo was by no means sent to Kenya, but to the “more northerly direction”, and they simply wanted to “collect taxes from illegal trade”.

                        True, after receiving the ransom and the release of Faina, they began to forget about the scandal. The tanks on board somehow slipped out of sight of journalists. But now they started talking about Ukrainian tanks again. And it is not at all excluded that the Faina was by no means the only ship loaded with weapons to the South Sudanese rebels.
                        Better learn the Kars materiel so as not to look like a complete idiot and recover from Tarasenko’s syndrome
                      4. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 12: 18 New
                        +1
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        Still T-90 in Sudan

                        Well, at least they learned something new.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        Sudan People's Liberation Army.

                        There is also the People's Liberation Army of SOUTH Sudan))))
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        And what did you bring the source of OBS (one woman said)
                        And you brought an even worse source - which did not provide any evidence. And to prove that it is not a camel)))

                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        In short, no one can call in any way. Where is the OFFICIAL rebuttal of Ukrspetsexport -
                        Are you sure that it is not there, and why refute what is not?

                        Yes, you clowns mate part nedaetsa.
                      5. smiths xnumx
                        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 14: 33 New
                        0
                        Well, at least they learned something new.
                        I did not plan to learn anything new from you. One indomitable nonsense ("Tarasenko syndrome") about the superiority of Ukrainian technical thought.
                        There is also the People's Liberation Army of SOUTH Sudan))))
                        And there is also your stupidity, evasion and unwillingness to admit, the obvious facts that practically no one in the world needs, and those who managed to vparit them (the same Iraq and Sudan) spit at the mere mention of them.
                        And you brought an even worse source - which did not provide any evidence. And to prove that it is not a camel)))
                        Well, what about Amnesty International and SIPRI, to a source close to the state-owned company Ukrspetsexport. "Haberdashery and Cardinal-Great Strength." Kars you at least understand that you are ridiculous and are nonsense.
                        Are you sure that it is not there, and why refute what is not?

                        Yes, you clowns mate part nedaetsa.
                        if it is, show or give a link. Keep making me laugh farther pea jester, I'll go for popcorn. Treat yourself with Tarasenko’s syndrome
                      6. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 21: 23 New
                        +1
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        I did not plan to learn anything new from you.

                        Well, what you planned does not interest anyone.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        ) spit at the mere mention of them.

                        But the fact is that your link turned out to be nonsense, where even they don’t know who is fighting.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        Well, where are Amnesty International and SIPRI

                        And who are they? Private organizations and nothing more. Moreover, no sanctions have been imposed on Ukraine.

                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        Keep making me laugh farther pea jester, I'll go for popcorn. Treat yourself with Tarasenko’s syndrome

                        Not better for valerian))) after all, already in the fifth or sixth news with the perseverance of the insane, post about delays with the Iraqi contract)))
                      7. smiths xnumx
                        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 23: 11 New
                        0
                        Well, what you planned does not interest anyone.
                        Clearly nothing more to say.
                        But the fact is that your link turned out to be nonsense, where even they don’t know who is fighting.
                        And your link then is complete nonsense with a slight touch of dibilism. A source close to the state-owned company Ukrspetsexport, Interfax-Ukraine reports. I'm straight from you under the table with laughter. Powerful frankly speaking source, just the same AUTHORITY.
                        And who are they? Private organizations and nothing more. Moreover, no sanctions have been imposed on Ukraine.
                        Well, they will be more authoritative than an unnamed source close to the state-owned company Ukrspetsexport, as reported by Interfax-Ukraine. Keep making me laugh further. Russia in 2011 delivered to the Sudan 23 MiG-29s and also no sanctions followed.
                        And who are they? Private organizations and nothing more. Moreover, no sanctions have been imposed on Ukraine.
                        No valerian whose I leave you, a tantrum in age. I still have everything in order with the nerves. And not in all, but in the second, concerning the Ukrainian military-industrial complex, the latest bullshit named Kars, I can remind you how you FIVE days with foam at the mouth proved to me that Russia did not fulfill the contract for the supply of T-80U to Cyprus, and when I proved the opposite to you with official documents, cowardly fled from the branch.
                      8. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 23: 20 New
                        +1
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        Clearly nothing more to say.

                        Is something clear to you? It's nonsense))) Well, at least they found out that the T-90 is not in Sudan.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        I'm straight from you under the table with laughter. Powerful frankly speaking source, just the same AUTHORITY.

                        A fact on the face - there is no sanction, and you can’t bring anything other than your beloved OBS. And officially to refute this))
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        . Russia in the 2011 year delivered the Sudan 23 MiG-29 and also no sanctions followed

                        )) Well, you and the clown)) Sudan, you would have delivered something to the South, or you would have proved that Ukraine delivered something. But you can see the aggravation - you do not distinguish between Sudan. like periods of military operations.
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        No valerian whose leave you
                        as you can see, you need it.

                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        hysterical age.

                        if you wrote your nickname correctly, I’m younger than you))
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        And not in all, but in the second, concerning the Ukrainian military-industrial complex, delirious nonsense

                        Five times already fasted)) and even in articles not directly related to the Ukrainian defense industry ..
                        Quote: smiths xnumx
                        you FIVE days with foam at the mouth proved to me that Russia did not fulfill the contract for the supply of T-80 to Cyprus,
                        And now it’s hard to see. It’s been delivered for a long time. But compared to your joke, when they themselves brought a link to a source in Uganda, but were not able to read it)))
                      9. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 23: 23 New
                        +1
                        I decided to see your comments --- YOU The clown even in the article about Sapspn was not too lazy to re-post about Sudan's refusal of the BTR-3)))) Well, you have to be so turned)))) you are very sick))))
                      10. smiths xnumx
                        smiths xnumx 18 August 2013 00: 45 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        I decided to see your comments --- YOU The clown even in the article about Sapspn was not too lazy to re-post about Sudan's refusal of the BTR-3)))) Well, you have to be so turned)))) you are very sick))))

                        "Peregrine Falcon", another enchanting wit "peremoga" "has no analogues in the world." I'm certainly not a doctor. but I can diagnose you: the Tarasenko virus. The virus is named after the first patient. It is treated if it does not go into a chronic form. There is also the “cat-dish” virus, a serious illness of the nervous system (sometimes called chronic trident’s syndrome), it causes a terrible allergy to goods manufactured in Russia, when the goods are made in Ukraine, the patient is ecstatic, does not behave adequately, often sings “She hasn’t died of Ukraine” , sometimes the patient has an exacerbation. Well, do not worry, the orderlies have already left. keep on hysterical hysteria. These your attempts are just ridiculous. I repeat once again today I have a Ukrainian clown named Kars.
                    2. smiths xnumx
                      smiths xnumx 18 August 2013 00: 25 New
                      +1
                      Is something clear to you? It's nonsense))) Well, at least they found out that the T-90 is not in Sudan.
                      I knew about the absence of the T-90 in Sudan without you. And never doubted their absence there.
                      A fact on the face - there is no sanction, and you can’t bring anything other than your beloved OBS. And officially to refute this))
                      how many times have I been called by an “expert” to teach you materiel so that you will not be poked with a muzzle, But you don’t obey. Have to repeat this moment:
                      Sudan-July 30, 2004 through the adoption of Resolution 1556 (2004); Until now, the arms embargo
                      Travel ban
                      Asset freeze

                      http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D1%E0%ED%EA%F6%E8%E8_%CE%CE%CD

                      )) Well, you and the clown)) Sudan, you would have delivered something to the South, or you would have proved that Ukraine delivered something. But you can see the aggravation - you do not distinguish between Sudan. like periods of military operations.
                      The clown is just you. There are sanctions, including and the supply of weapons, link above. It’s just that they are spit on by Russia and China and even Ukraine. So keep pulling the owl on the globe of Ukraine. I repeat to you, learn the materiel.
                      as you can see, you need it.
                      No, drink it yourself. Ask your doctors for help.
                      if you wrote your nickname correctly, I’m younger than you))
                      Moreover: such a young and already spoiled nerves. Do not save yourself in upholding the "achievements" of the military-industrial complex of Ukraine. Be treated. Secondly, I didn’t go with you, and I didn’t drink on the broodershaft, take the trouble to behave yourself politely by a young man.
                      Five times already fasted)) and even in articles not directly related to the Ukrainian defense industry ..
                      Link to the studio, not empty bullshit. Even on this site, the topic of failures in the supply of Ukrainian armored personnel carriers to Iraq was discussed twice. And in one of the discussions I did not even participate.
                    3. smiths xnumx
                      smiths xnumx 18 August 2013 00: 33 New
                      0
                      And now it’s hard to see. It’s been delivered for a long time. But compared to your joke, when they themselves brought a link to a source in Uganda, but were not able to read it)))
                      In my opinion, I admitted a mistake, unlike some clown "expert", who first FIVE days proved the opposite. and then pressed against the wall with OFFICIAL documents, he began to wag like a woman of easy virtue, and I am not me, Wikipedia is to blame and everything else, and then cowardly merged.
  • Kars
    Kars 16 August 2013 15: 44 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Iraq Sivan Muhammad Taha accused Ukraine of supplying low-quality BTR-4 to the Iraqi army and disrupting delivery dates for this contract

    And? Why did they armored personnel carriers were loaded onto the ship, and Iraq has not yet terminated the contract. Although it was easier to break it up in February, and to show marriage at the trial.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Or that already at Jane's Defense Weekly he writes that Iraq does not accept Ukrainian armored personnel carriers because of their poor quality, I repeat specifically for you, encore:

    And what else should he write? Maybe there is a photo of the marriage there?
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    No need to pull the facts, and the best confirmation of your words will be a video with the unloading of the BTR-4 from a ship in Iraq.

    And even this will prove nothing to you anyway, you will look for a corruption component.
    1. smiths xnumx
      smiths xnumx 16 August 2013 15: 50 New
      +2
      And? Why did they armored personnel carriers were loaded onto the ship, and Iraq has not yet terminated the contract. Although it was easier to break it up in February, and to show marriage at the trial.
      I cannot be responsible for Iraqi politicians. The contract was imposed on Iraq by the Americans, who paid for it. But the fact that Iraq is trying to get off of it is visible to the naked eye: performances by Iraqi officials, constant scandals, refusal to accept another party.
      And what else should he write? Maybe there is a photo of the marriage there?
      What else should he write? He, as an official, on the contrary, had to inform that the contract was being carried out normally, and was pleased with the quality of Ukrainian weapons. I didn’t see the marriage photo. maybe there is, but I think the warring Iraq does not refuse a good life to accept the BTR-4 party.
      And even this will prove nothing to you anyway, you will look for a corruption component.
      Personally, this will prove a lot to me and I'm not going to look for any components. I will rejoice from the bottom of my heart for the successes of Ukrainian gunsmiths, who have worthily refuted all sorts of "dirty insinuations." But I'm afraid this will not happen.
      1. Kars
        Kars 16 August 2013 21: 51 New
        +1
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        I can not answer for Iraqi politicians

        Then don't be sick.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        He, as an official, on the contrary, had to inform that the contract was being carried out normally, and was pleased with the quality of Ukrainian weapons.

        Why is it that if they want to get rid of the contract.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        but I think the warring Iraq does not refuse a good life to accept the BTR-4 party.

        Iraq is not at war, and there are all kinds of scrap metal preostostno.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Personally, it will prove a lot to me and I'm not going to look for any components

        will not prove.
      2. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 10: 22 New
        +3
        Then don't be sick.
        Tantrum and poparsa Kars fully satisfied.
        Why is it that if they want to get rid of the contract.
        Why do they need them? Moreover, they perfectly understood (like the United Arab Emirates, Myanmar, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Sudan, that Ukrainian homemade products on their knees are a complete turd.
        On July 23, 2013, the specialized inter-district court of Alma-Ata (Kazakhstan) sentenced Major General Almaz Asenov, former head of the main arms department of the Ministry of Defense of Kazakhstan, to 11 years of imprisonment under strict regime, confiscation of property, and deprivation of military rank for receiving a bribe of $ 200 from two employees of the Ukrainian state-owned Ukrspetsexport - the head of the First Regional Department, Alexander Shkolyarenko and his deputy, Alexander Khrulev. Shkolyarenko and Khrulev were sentenced to six years in strict regime and confiscation of property. The trial was closed. Ukrspetsexport and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine issued statements that they will seek the extradition of convicted company employees to their homeland.

        Iraq is not at war, and there are all kinds of scrap metal preostostno.
        C'mon, after the US occupation in 2003 (in which the Ukrainian brigade participated, for which Ukraine received a contract for the supply of armored personnel carriers) there is a sluggish civil war of all against everyone (Shiites and Kurds against Sunnis), and then the “comrades” from Syria began to climb. Learn the materiel and google again I mock at the poor servants no.
        will not prove.
        It is your opinion. I have already written at the top and will repeat again: Kars’s hysteria and pacifier are completely satisfied.
      3. Kars
        Kars 17 August 2013 10: 39 New
        +1
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Tantrum and poparsa Kars fully satisfied.

        It’s you who deceive yourself how much you feel sick about this but couldn’t say anything significantly.

        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Why do they need them?

        so why didn’t they tear it up in February? and there is still no information about the termination of the contract?
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Learn the materiel and google again I mock at the poor servants no.
        Well, yes, of course, a full-blown civil war))) and probably you still officially buy different types of weapons.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        It is your opinion. I have already written at the top and will repeat again: Kars’s hysteria and pacifier are completely satisfied.

        Naturally, and so it is clear that you are an impenetrable clown.
      4. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 11: 54 New
        0
        It’s you who deceive yourself how much you feel sick about this but couldn’t say anything significantly.
        And you yourself, that you proved once again trying to sew up the torn fart of Ukrspetsexport. continue to hysteria further, your Kars is completely satisfied with your tantrum.
        so why didn’t they tear it up in February? and there is still no information about the termination of the contract?
        I already answered you, I repeat, this is an internal matter of Iraq, nevertheless, a ship with an armored personnel carrier hangs at sea from March to August, so that its owner yelled about it.
        Well, yes, of course, a full-blown civil war))) and probably you still officially buy different types of weapons.
        Imagine just that, or Google was turned off for you, the poor have no servants, and different factions do not need to buy weapons, there are a lot of them left after Saddam.
        Naturally, and so it is clear that you are an impenetrable clown.
        Once again I repeat the hysteria and poparsa Kars fully satisfied. Continue hysteria further, hysterical.
      5. Kars
        Kars 17 August 2013 12: 15 New
        +1
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        And you yourself, that you proved once again trying to sew up the torn fart of Ukrspetsexport. continue to hysteria further, your Kars is completely satisfied with your tantrum.

        You have strange ideas about hysteria. In the last thread, people described the ways of trading Arabs very well.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        I already answered you, I repeat, this is an internal matter of Iraq, nevertheless, a ship with an armored personnel carrier hangs at sea from March to August, so that its owner yelled about it.

        If inwardly, what are you getting into it for? Trying to correct your wounded ego.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        and different factions do not need to buy weapons, and much remains after Saddam.
        Wow.a you said that 4 armored personnel carriers do not want to buy because of its use in .. constantly fighting Iraq ... and as such there are no military operations, the main thing is terrorist attacks, there are no front lines.

        Quote: smiths xnumx
        I repeat
        Yes, at least twenty times, once again they let you in)))
      6. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 12: 32 New
        0
        You have strange ideas about hysteria. In the last thread, people described the ways of trading Arabs very well.
        I was in Egypt, so I know how to trade Arabs, But here it seems, apart from Arabs, Azerbaijanis and Myamans, and even Sudanese. And all have similar trading methods. Something problems with the BTR-80 delivered by Iraq to Ukraine, no. At least I have not heard of them. And what else besides hysteria and lack of arguments can you justify your attempts to insult your opponent. Once I had the recklessness to offer you to conduct the polemic correctly, you refused. Now we have what we have.
        If inwardly, what are you getting into it for? Trying to correct your wounded ego.
        I climb, but simply stating the facts, voiced by the way UKRAINIAN portal. And you with foam at the mouth once again trying to refute the obvious facts that you are trying to correct your image or ego?
        Wow.a you said that 4 armored personnel carriers do not want to buy because of its use in .. constantly fighting Iraq ... and as such there are no military operations, the main thing is terrorist attacks, there are no front lines.
        . Even in warring Iraq, as well as warring Sudan, nobody needs rusty Ukrainian crafts on their knees. They buy old or modernized Soviet, Russian, American or new Uita, but for some reason Ukrainian is not. and about the front line, so in Afghanistan it wasn’t and never is, nevertheless, the war is going on there, and in Vietnam, except for the DMZ, there was no front line, so there was no war there. Continue pulling the owl on the globe.
        Yes, at least twenty times, once again they let you in)))
        I did not understand the meaning of what was said, apparently you do not speak Russian well. However, continue to make me laugh further. This is quite funny.
      7. Kars
        Kars 17 August 2013 21: 30 New
        +1
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        I was in Egypt, so I know how to trade Arabs

        Wow - what is the indicator of the logic of your statements. He was a private lycr in the Egyptian bazaar bargaining for souvenirs)))))
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Something there are no problems with the BTR-80 BTR-XNUMX delivered by Iraq

        And what can be the problems with this kapeshny scrap metal.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        And what else besides hysteria and lack of arguments can you justify your attempts to insult your opponent

        Dullness and donkey stubbornness .. an opponent .. who for the fifth time posts in various articles about the Iraq contract.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Are you with foam at your mouth once again trying to refute the obvious facts that you are trying to fix your image or ego?

        Your donkey is stubbornly killing me. There is an official statement from Ukrspetsexport, and the data from Dumskaya are rather contradictory.

        Quote: smiths xnumx
        They buy old or modernized soviet

        Cheap and IMMEDIATE. It is only such as you are unable to understand.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        and about the front line, so in Afghanistan it wasn’t and never is, nevertheless the war is going on there

        And majahideen buy armored personnel carriers?
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        American or new Uita

        And what new did Iraq buy from the Russian Federation? And I don’t know that the United States would supply Iraq with new armored vehicles. Even if it doesn’t prove anything, the United States could dictate terms.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        I did not understand the meaning of what was said,
        This is your constant state.
      8. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 22: 20 New
        0
        Wow - what is the indicator of the logic of your statements. He was a private lycr in the Egyptian bazaar bargaining for souvenirs)))))

        Well, of course, the mentality and ways of trading weapons and souvenirs is very different.
        And what can be the problems with this kapeshny scrap metal.
        Your first correct words on this thread. Indeed, the BTR-80 does not have problems, unlike Ukrainian armored relics, which are rejected by almost ALL potential buyers because they are unnecessary.
        Dullness and donkey stubbornness .. an opponent .. who for the fifth time posts in various articles about the Iraq contract.
        The stubbornness of an over-age hysteria trying to refute the facts of the epic failures of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex (Kazakhstan, the United Arab Emirates, Myanmar, Iraq, Sudan) while not finding arguments trying to insult his opponent.
        Cheap and IMMEDIATE. It is only such as you are unable to understand.
        All the more shooting, reliable and maintainable, and not complicated fakes, which constantly break and which do not shoot guns, like the BTR-4. By the way, the ship with the BTR-4 from Iraq arrived in Mumbai, India
        http://www.shipfinder.com/main/defaultwork?searchKey=SE%20PACIFICA&tp=1

        It seems that the shipowners got this dance, and they will deliberately run into the seizure of the cargo, so that after its sale from the auction they will seek compensation for losses. And finally free the ship for freight.
      9. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 22: 50 New
        +2
        Your donkey is stubbornly killing me. There is an official statement from Ukrspetsexport, and the data from Dumskaya are rather contradictory.
        and I am finished off by your impassable stupidity and stubborn desire to pull an owl on the globe, proving that Ukraine is doing well. you yourself read this statement of Ukrspetsexport. So read before you bring complete nonsense:
        The Ukrainian-Iraqi contract will go to regular mode.
        As for the correspondents of Ukraine, Ukraine has dzherelo in the holding company Ukrspetseksport, commenting on the information in the Ukrainian ZMI about the fact that they are on the other side of the country accept the BTR-4 party.

        "The Ukrainian-Ukrainian contract will be held under the regular regime. Oskilki bagato aspects in the contract є confidential, the company doesn’t comment on the information’, "said the agency’s correspondent.

        Vin takozh dodova, scho "Ukrspetseksport" ofііtsіyno povіdomit about the completion of the draft stage in the realizatsii contract.

        http://www.ukrinform.ua/ukr/news/ukrspetseksport_irakskiy_kontrakt_na_postavku_b

        tr_vikonue_tsya_v_shtatnomu_regimi_1850689.
        Well, where is the official statement here, it’s not even a representative of Ukrspetsexport, but a certain unnamed source in the company. Another source of OBS is one woman said. Another bullshit named Kars.

        Having handed over Ukrinform, a contract between Ukraine and Iraq for the transfer of supplies to Ukraine 450 units of BTR-4, in order to rob the factory named after Malisheva (metro Kharkiv). Recovering from 2010 rock, one hundred BTR-4 was delivered to Iraq.
        And majahideen buy armored personnel carriers?
        Do they need them?
        And what new did Iraq buy from the Russian Federation? And I don’t know that the United States would supply Iraq with new armored vehicles. Even if it doesn’t prove anything, the United States could dictate terms.
        Well, for example, offhand military helicopters Mi-28N and Mi-35, transport Mi-17, ZRAK "Shell C1". Serbia has Lasta 95 training aircraft and Zastava M21 assault rifles, USA ILAV Badger
        This is your constant state.
        No, this is your constant popoleal from the “peremogs” of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex, and such that you fall into constant tantrums from it. So, once again the hysteria of the "expert" Kars fully satisfied. Continue to hysteria further. Although there is a laugh at someone.
      10. Kars
        Kars 17 August 2013 23: 02 New
        +1
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        and I am finishing

        Maybe it’ll finish.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        proving that Ukraine is doing well.

        not as bad as you would like.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Another source of OBS - one woman said

        So this is your hobbyhorse. Duma is probably an epic official.
        And they don’t write about problems
        http://www.ukrspecexport.com/
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Do they need them?

        Buy or not?
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Well, for example, offhand Mi-28Н and Mi-35 combat helicopters, Mi-17 transport helicopters, ZRAK "Shell NXX"

        Bought? Or is it going to buy? Maybe they have already been delivered? It’s necessary there to see a ship next to it in drift))))
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        So, once again the hysteria of the "expert" Kars fully satisfied.

        I look how satisfied you are, repeat it like a mantra. You do not overdo it with auto-suggestion)))
      11. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 17 August 2013 23: 58 New
        0
        Maybe it’ll finish.
        Another hysteria. Do not wait. I’ll survive you.
        not as bad as you would like.
        But to make Ukraine feel bad, I just don’t want to. I have a bunch of maternal relatives there. Nevertheless, 5 million zarobitchans only in Russia talk a lot.
        So this is your hobbyhorse. Duma is probably an epic official.
        And they don’t write about problems
        http://www.ukrspecexport.com/
        Not yours, it’s you who have some sources close to Ukrspetsexport. Well, here's a link to Jane's Defense Weekly:
        "Iraq has reportedly refused to take delivery of another consignment of Ukrainian BTR-4 armored personnel carriers (APCs) due to defects."

        http://www.janes.com/article/25704/iraq-btr-4-delivery-delayed
        At the same time, follow your own link to the Ukrspetsexport website and find me an OFFICIAL rebuttal of the Dumskaya information there. Well, the best way is to show a photo or video from the unloading of the ship in Iraq.
        Buy or not?
        No, they simply don’t need them, since the Mujahideen are fighting with guerrilla methods with the complete domination of the enemy in the air, such common truths are such an “expert” as you really must know.
        Bought? Or is it going to buy? Maybe they have already been delivered? It’s necessary there to see a ship next to it in drift))))

        In the second half of 2012, the Russian Federation and Iraq signed a number of bilateral contracts in the field of military-technical cooperation totaling about $ 4,2 billion ... According to Ruslan Pukhov, director of the Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies (CAST), a contract for the sale of Baghdad Russian arms and military equipment primarily includes the supply of all-weather and all-day attack helicopters Mi-28NE “Night Hunter” and missile-cannon air defense systems “Pantsir-C1”.
        http://topwar.ru/19831-rossiya-i-irak-podpisali-kontrakty-o-voennom-sotrudniches
        tve-mezhdu-stranami.html
        So that the contract is signed, signed and I am sure it will be fulfilled.
        I look how satisfied you are, repeat it like a mantra. You do not overdo it with auto-suggestion)))

        Do not worry, it is better to drink a sedative, and you feel better. At least from boredom I won’t die tonight: the performance of the clown under the nickname Kars will not allow this to be done.
      12. Kars
        Kars 18 August 2013 00: 09 New
        +1
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Do not wait. I’ll survive you

        Do not neglect. With your tantrums and good looks on the Ukrainian military-industrial complex.
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        At the same time, follow your own link to the Ukrspetsexport website and find me an OFFICIAL rebuttal of the Dumskaya information there. Well, the best way is to show a photo or video from the unloading of the ship in Iraq.

        I will call you to AZLOM --- will you officially refute this to me?
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        No

        Then why are you sick?
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        . According to Ruslan
        Wow, according to)))

        Quote: smiths xnumx
        daily Mi-28NE “Night Hunter” helicopters and “Pantsir-S1” air defense missile and gun systems.

        So Iraq still hasn’t received them? Didn’t pay? Have you brought them?
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        Since the contract is signed, signed and I am sure it will be fulfilled.

        By the way on the BTR-4 contract was also concluded,)))
        Quote: smiths xnumx
        At least from boredom I won’t die tonight:

        Yes, it’s hard for you to come)) but you are being treated.
      13. smiths xnumx
        smiths xnumx 18 August 2013 01: 10 New
        -1
        Do not neglect. With your tantrums and good looks on the Ukrainian military-industrial complex.
        Do not worry so wait and see. The hysteria is just with you. Look, I’m even starting to look at direct insults and names.
        blacksmith 77
        go over but don't worry let you go.
        I will call you to AZLOM --- will you officially refute this to me?
        No, just give in the face.
        Then why are you sick?
        Do not vomit here just you, trying to cover up the torn fart of "Ukrspetseksport", hysteria every time when it is not possible for you. "Breathe deeper you're upset.
        Wow, according to)))
        But do you have something against the words of Ruslan Pukhov, director of the Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies (CAST), published on this site. Well, of course, unnamed sources related to Ukrspetsexport look much more serious.
        So Iraq still hasn’t received them? Didn’t pay? Have you brought them?
        Do not worry so. everything has its time. And receive, and pay and bring. Liyano, I have no doubt about that.
        By the way on the BTR-4 contract was also concluded,)))
        By whom? Americans, who rewarded in the same way their Ukrainian sixes, for participating in the occupation of Iraq.
        Yes, it’s hard for you to come)) but you are being treated.
        Breathe deeper you are excited. The doctors have already left. Hang on, help is coming.
  • Corneli
    Corneli 17 August 2013 23: 48 New
    -3
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    No, this is your constant popoleal from the “peremogs” of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex, and such that you fall into constant tantrums from it. So, once again the hysteria of the "expert" Kars fully satisfied. Continue to hysteria further. Although there is a laugh at someone.

    Are you seriously?):
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I already answered you, I repeat, this is an internal matter of Iraq, nevertheless, a ship with an armored personnel carrier hangs at sea from March to August, so that screamed its owner.
    Imagine just that, or you’ve been turned off Google, the poor have no servants, and different factions do not need to buy weapons, there are many left after Saddam.
    I repeat hysteria and popole Karsa is completely satisfied. Keep going hysteria further, hysterical.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And you yourself, that proved once again trying sew torn fart Ukrspetsexport. keep going hysteria next, your kars hysterical completely satisfied.

    It’s hard to say what’s wrong with the "hysteria" of Kars, but you and your repetitions have 10 pearls like: "poppoli", "the poor have no servants", I’m silent about serious problems about the variants of the word "hysteria" ... number and with respect to the opponent
  • Kars
    Kars 18 August 2013 00: 11 New
    +1
    Quote: Corneli
    . including with respect to the opponent

    I don’t need the respect of the clowns. The 77 blacksmith has already been dishonored several times, so it’s even nice. Although his perseverance and persistence with which he overwhelms the negative in Ukraine, it leads to mental disorder and an inferiority complex based on nationality.

    And his main fetish is pulling on a globe, it’s even scary to think about what he developed on the basis of.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 18 August 2013 11: 30 New
    0
    I deal with people as they deserve it. To the same Kars for whose honor you joined in this way, even during our first discussion on the T-64 disposal branch in Ukraine, I suggested Kars to conduct the polemic correctly and politely, but he refused.
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Let's not get personal and lead the discussion correctly.
    And let's move on?


    Therefore, I communicate with him the way he wanted it. and after this “expert” clown repeatedly caught in a lie and poked his face in the mud, having exhausted all his arguments, he began to hysteria and insult what he expected to receive in return. So what do you want me to be silent? Rudeness has no nationality.
  • Corneli
    Corneli 19 August 2013 15: 18 New
    -1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Therefore, I communicate with him the way he wanted it. and after this “expert” clown repeatedly caught in a lie and poked his face in the mud, having exhausted all his arguments, he began to hysteria and insult what he expected to receive in return. So what do you want me to be silent? Rudeness has no nationality.

    Your "polemic" is read by many people, including me. Where you "caught lying" there, I don’t know, I didn’t notice it in this article. But the banal, inadequate insults were a shaft. Do not want to read it? There seems to be an option. Do you want to argue with him about the "tantrums"? There are skype, mail, PM and more. Why should I read your rudeness?
    P.S. And I'm sorry, but your arguments are very controversial) Even about the same BMP 3. Have you seen him, traveled, touched your hands? Or read the criticism of the people who are interested and concluded that you are pleased?
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 17: 02 New
    0
    As for rudeness, I already explained who started to be rude first. I am on this site, discussing and discussing with many people, including and with SWEET_SIXTEEN, BigRiver, Karlsonn, Beck, and NEVER, I repeat to you, I have never admitted cases of rudeness to my opponent. And if a comrade who imagines himself to be an “expert” believes that he can insult me ​​with impunity, what answer he or you are going to hear.
    Secondly, you were mistaken, probably referring to the BTR-3, you didn’t see him, although you saw, studied and even had to ride the BTR-60PB, BTR-70, BTR-80. As for the criticism of how you put it “interested” people, the best way to confirm the fact of the sale is either a photograph or video or an official report to the UN. For you
    http://www.dsecu.gov.ua/control/uk/publish/article?art_id=47384&cat_id=47383.
    Link to the official report of Ukraine to the UN for 2012, of the significant ones there were only the well-known deliveries of the T-72 to Ethiopia, the BTR-4 to Iraq and the BTR-3 to Thailand, and the rest was small things. What does the stunning success of Ukrainian export and Ukrainian "tank building" show there? Not a single tank built in Ukraine appears in this report at all :-). Find there deliveries of BTR-3 to Sudan? And finally, someone Kars is trying to make me a hater of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex
    you turned your head at the envy of the military-industrial complex of Ukraine, with such perseverance, overpricing chernukha both where appropriate and where not appropriate.
    Read my post on the branch
    Polish company begins licensed production of Ukrainian armored personnel carrier “Dozor-B”
    . and find there "chernukha". I apologize to you for my rudeness, I have nothing to apologize to Kars for. I remain in my opinion that he is hysterical.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 17: 07 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The Polish company begins licensed production of the Ukrainian armored personnel carrier Dozor-B. and find there "chernukha

    Once I wrote, and then probably through force, banging my head against the table)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Read my post on the branch

    It’s better to read your comments in general - you’re a hater of Ukraine in general.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 17: 14 New
    +1
    http://www.aoss.org.ua/cgi-bin/index.pl?page=amat&id=814

    if anyone is interested in tank export of Ukraine
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 18: 14 New
    0
    Once I wrote, and then probably through force, banging my head against the table)))
    Kars, hysterical. hit yourself at the wall untill you die.
    It’s better to read your comments in general - you’re a hater of Ukraine in general.
    Well, of course, I'm really half Ukrainian (by mother), so I can be a hater of half myself. I just distinguish the official Ukrainian "state", with its mania, Russophobia and praise of the cat-dog Bandera and other Shlyukhevych, with the Ukrainian people, to whom my mother and partly me have the honor. And I really hope that soon Ukraine (at least East, South and Crimea) will be reunited with its older sister.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 15: 32 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    having exhausted all his arguments,

    Yes, of course, when you start to hysteria, I will crush you with arguments. But you can still see that you turned your head to the envy of the military-industrial complex of Ukraine, with such persistence, overcooked chernukha where it is appropriate, and where it is not appropriate.

    And I’m not starting to hysteria, but insults are just an attempt to reach out to such a stubborn individual who appropriately does not accept arguments that do not fit into his template.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    eksperd "-clown repeatedly caught in a lie and poked behind her face in the mud
    Once and not on a lie, all my links under the Cyprus contract confirmed my words. But even when you cited the link, you were unable to read it and NAGLO, several times argued that there wasn’t, even though everything was written in black and white in your link .
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 16: 35 New
    0
    Yes, of course, when you start to hysteria, I will crush you with arguments. But you can still see that you turned your head to the envy of the military-industrial complex of Ukraine, with such persistence, overcooked chernukha where it is appropriate, and where it is not appropriate.

    And I’m not starting to hysteria, but insults are just an attempt to reach out to such a stubborn individual who appropriately does not accept arguments that do not fit into his template.

    What are the arguments? Firstly, insults, especially on the Internet, are a sign of weakness and inability to prove their case by other methods. Secondly: what envy is what, to the military-industrial complex of Ukraine, since it is like honey in the famous Winnie the Pooh song, whether it is whether he is not there. Or do you call Ukraine’s arms trade, inherited from the USSR, "Ukrainian military-industrial complex"? And almost all of the "independent weapons." It turns out to be either defective or practically useless to anyone (Myanmar, UAE, Sudan, Azerbaijan)
    Once and not on a lie, all my links under the Cyprus contract confirmed my words. But even when you cited the link, you were unable to read it and NAGLO, several times argued that there wasn’t, even though everything was written in black and white in your link .
    What are your words?
    And BDK yearn for air in the holds.

    All are bad because there is no reference to the fulfillment of the contract. But the Russian-speaking one gives a more objective figure. And the completion of the delivery of tanks to Cyprus would not have gone unnoticed.

    The higher the place, the more prestigious and significant the supply of armored vehicles in our particular case. And what to do in Thailand, more dangerous neighbors. Therefore, they pay more attention to their army.

    He survived thanks to Tsar Boriska, a fellow countryman of UVZ.

    Apparently, all the same, it was not completed until 2012. And 2 years of fiber supply with the supply of used tanks

    Well, the last encore, already too lazy to look
    Political pressure. In Morocco, the T-90 lost to a Chinese tank with a Ukrainian engine.

    Continue to hysteria further, as there by the way with the sanctions of Sudan, have you found? The show must go on ...
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 16: 47 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    What are the arguments?

    Ordinary arguments.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Firstly, insults, especially on the Internet, are a sign of weakness and the inability to prove their case by other methods.

    Well, how can you prove something to a donkey? It’s your own taldychet. And if you want to consider something as signs, consider it.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And BDK yearn for air in the holds.
    Have you proved that they carry something?

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And the completion of the delivery of tanks to Cyprus would not have gone unnoticed.
    So you didn’t bring a link, there are links only to availability and that’s it.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The higher the place, the more prestigious and significant the supply of armored vehicles in our particular case. And what to do in Thailand, more dangerous neighbors. Therefore, they pay more attention to their army.

    Have you proved the opposite? And yes, it’s more respectable to deliver weapons to more developed countries than to the third world. And Thailand has many dangerous neighbors.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    He survived thanks to Tsar Boriska, fellow countryman of UVZ
    Which is also true, and I'm not the only one to say such a thing.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    political pressure. In Morocco, the T-90 lost to a Chinese tank with a Ukrainian engine.

    Lost
    Flag of Morocco.svg Morocco - 54 VT1A (MBT-2000), as of 2012 year. [6]
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Continue to hysteria further, as there by the way with the sanctions of Sudan, have you found?

    That you should have proved the application of sanctions to Ukraine for the supply of weapons to South Sudan


    In addition, Russian industry has been developing for a long time not only new models of military equipment, but also modernized versions of the old one. At the same time, other countries stepped up work to improve Soviet developments and began to compete with modern Russian technology.

    According to Makienko, "stagnation of the technical level of the T-90" while increasing its cost led to the fact that the Chinese VT1A managed to bypass the T-90C in the Moroccan tender for the supply of main battle tanks. In total, according to the results of the tender, the Ministry of Defense of Morocco purchased 150 VT1A tanks from China. The defeat of Russia in this competition can only be called annoying.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 17: 36 New
    0
    Ordinary arguments.

    I also answer you with ordinary arguments.
    Well, how can you prove something to a donkey? It’s your own taldychet. And if you want to consider something as signs, consider it.
    Therefore, I consider you an ordinary hysteria.
    Have you proved that they carry something?
    I repeat for you, I do not have sources at the General Staff of the Russian Federation, but here is a photo of the loading at the port of Novorossiysk BDK "Alexander Shabalin", which is just going to Syria,

    and here’s a photo of the BOD SF Severodvinsk, also in the port of Novorossiysk, which will accompany him.

    So you didn’t bring a link, there are links only to availability and that’s it.

    I repeat for you, encore, for the last time Link to the UN website
    www.un.org/disarmament/convarms/Register)

    document
    A / 67/212 / Add.2) dated January 30, 2013


    and to page number 7

    A / 67/212 / Add.2
    13-22169
    7
    Russian
    Федерация
    Authentic
    текст
    on
    Russian
    language
    Calendar
    year
    : 2011
    Provided by
    whether
    reference
    information
    :
    Yes
    date
    performances
    : 31
    May
    2012
    year
    National
    contact
    centers
    :
    Yes
    Export
    Abcde
    Notes
    Category
    (I – VII)
    The final
    (
    s
    )
    state
    (
    а
    )-
    importer
    (
    ы
    )
    Quantity
    of
    State
    Origin
    (
    if
    export
    -
    rum
    is
    other
    sovereign
    -
    GUSTs
    )
    In between
    -
    nye
    items
    (
    if
    those
    there are
    )
    Description
    facilities
    Comments
    к
    delivery
    I.
    Combat
    Tanks
    Venezuela
    Cyprus
    Uganda
    35
    14
    44


    http://www.un.org/ga/search/view_doc.asp?symbol=A/67/212/Add.2&referer=http://ww


    w.un.org/disarmament/convarms/Register/&Lang=R
    And how did these T-80Us get to Cyprus, fly by air? or came by water? I recall the report for 2011.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 17: 54 New
    0
    Have you proved the opposite? And yes, it’s more respectable to deliver weapons to more developed countries than to the third world. And Thailand has many dangerous neighbors.
    Well, what is India in your ranking
    http://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp.
    Well, I do not draw deep conclusions that in this rating India ranks fourth with T-90 and Thailand with Oplot 20. And in general, what does this rating have to do with the fact that Azerbaijan or Uganda purchased the T-90 from Russia and T-72 by Ethiopia in Ukraine. According to this rating, Thailand is higher than Ukraine (Thailand-20th place, Ukraine-22nd), or do you think the Ukrainian army is weaker than the Thai army? And finally. Excuse me, what are these dangerous neighbors in Thailand: Cambodia, which does not have its own combat aircraft, in which the civil war only recently ended, but there are border conflicts. but not more; Laos with a 30th army with 35 tanks (10 T-34-85, 10 PT-76, 15 T-55) and also without the Air Force (for comparison, Thailand has a 200th army); or Myanmar, in which the civil war does not stop from the moment of its formation and in which constant military coups.
    Moreover, the United States is in the first place in this rating, and there are definitely dangerous neighbors: Mexico is dreaming of capturing Texas and California, and Canada has deployed its fleet in the Big Lakes. Do not tell my slippers, they are so funny. Thailand simply thanks to the tourism business, for example, has more money, so he can afford such "goodies" as the Grippen, Oplot-M and even his own small aircraft carrier.
    Which is also true, and I'm not the only one to say such a thing.
    I also read a similar version from a certain Tarasenko in LJ. Now think about it. 13 years (XNUMX) have been ruled in St. Petersburg for Russia (Putin, Medvedev, now Putin again), well, not one of them has even made a timid attempt to reanimate the plant in Leningrad. Moreover, they are more or less "statesmen", and Yeltsin is a simple drunk who, by the will of fate, climbed to the throne, or do you think that this very high-ranking Russian alcoholic could think about the production of tanks? That's the whole answer to the "conspiracy theory"
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 18: 06 New
    +1
    Lost
    Flag of Morocco.svg Morocco - 54 VT1A (MBT-2000), as of 2012 year. [6]
    So what of this? I do not come up with a "conspiracy theory" and do not explain the defeat of the T-90 by political pressure, as you are trying to explain the defeat of the T-90 Stronghold in Azerbaijan.
    That you should have proved the application of sanctions to Ukraine for the supply of weapons to South Sudan
    And why should I justify this, remember your words:
    A fact on the face - there is no sanction, and you can’t bring anything other than your beloved OBS. And officially to refute this))

    I proved to you that sanctions have been imposed on Sudan
    Sudan-July 30, 2004 through the adoption of Resolution 1556 (2004); Until now, the arms embargo
    Travel ban
    Asset freeze

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D1%E0%ED%EA%F6%E8%E8_%CE%CE%CD

    There are sanctions, including and the supply of weapons, link above. It’s just that they are spit on by Russia and China and even Ukraine, and now Belarus, which supplies the Sudan with Su-24 and Su-25. As for the facts of Ukraine selling arms to South Sudan, all claims are to Amnesty International and the Stockholm Peace Research Institute (SIPRI).
    Ukraine supplied arms and military equipment to South Sudan, which were used in the confrontation between the Sudan People's Liberation Army and the South Sudan Liberation Army. According to the international human rights organization Amnesty International, it was deliveries of Ukrainian, as well as Chinese and Sudanese military equipment, weapons and ammunition that provoked an aggravation of the conflict in 2010-2011 in the state of Al Wahda.

    According to the organization, Ukraine delivered the main battle tanks T-72 to South Sudan, which were used by the Sudan People's Liberation Army, in particular, to fire at civilians. Amnesty International was able to document the presence of five main battle tanks in the city of Mayom in the state of El Wahda, including three T-72M1 delivered to the country by Ukraine in 2009 through Kenya and Uganda. Amnesty International does not specify the total supply of Ukrainian equipment.

    According to the Stockholm Peace Research Institute (SIPRI), in 2007-2009 Ukraine delivered 11 BM-21 Grad multiple launch rocket systems to South Sudan, as well as 77 T-72M1 main battle tanks. According to the UN Register of Conventional Arms Supplies, in 2007-2010, Ukraine supplied Kenya, Uganda, Chad and Congo with more than 58 thousand machine guns, heavy and light machine guns and pistols.

    Here you have a photo of the T-72 in South Sudan.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 18: 18 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, what is India in your ranking

    and you don’t want to remember what I wrote about India? That India had no choice since a tank factory specializing in T-72 was built in India during the USSR
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And in general, what is the relationship

    This happened in the process of a dispute, which developed quite peculiarly.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    According to this rating, Thailand is higher than Ukraine (Thailand-20-e, Ukraine-22-e), or do you think the Ukrainian army is weaker than the Thai army?

    I didn’t make this rating, if they think so, then they have a reason for this. For example, the population there is larger and they buy BTR-3 and Oplot.
    Therefore, in principle, I consider it not particularly biased.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I'm sorry what Thailand is like

    China, India, Indonesia, Malaysia, Vietnam - the politics in that region is very tense. Therefore, countries such as Thailand and Singapore spend a lot on their armed forces, while Thailand keeps a mini aircraft carrier thirsty.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Moreover, the United States is in the first place in this rating, so who exactly has dangerous neighbors

    the United States has neighbors; the vital interests of the United States have no borders.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    well, not one of them even made a timid attempt to reanimate the plant in Leningrad
    It’s too late to drink Borjomi when Lenengrad is pease --- de ban. And if this is your argument, then you are simply ridiculous.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    could this most senior Russian alcoholic think about tank production?
    That's just for this reason, and turned out T-90
    Quote: svp67
    I’m afraid that the true answer will not be as clear as the author is trying to prove. And if the first president of Russia had suddenly been a native of Siberia, the author would have now argued that T80 is much better than T64 and T72, which is much easier by the way
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 19: 47 New
    0
    and you don’t want to remember what I wrote about India? That India had no choice since a tank factory specializing in T-72 was built in India during the USSR
    I remember it perfectly, but it was not I who first started to refer to the rating
    http://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp.
    And affirm
    Have you proved the opposite? And yes, it’s more respectable to deliver weapons to more developed countries than to the third world. And Thailand has many dangerous neighbors
    . Well, India, in your ranking, is in fourth place, which means that Russia’s sale to India and the production there under a license of 2000 T-90 is much more PREMIUM than the sale of 49 Oplot by Ukraine to Thailand.
    China, India, Indonesia, Malaysia, Vietnam - the politics in that region is very tense. Therefore, countries such as Thailand and Singapore spend a lot on their armed forces, while Thailand keeps a mini aircraft carrier thirsty.
    Learn to read the map from Vietnam, India, Indonesia, China, in general there are no land borders with Thailand. The border with Malaysia is an impenetrable jungle. especially since Thailand and Malaysia and Indonesia are members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN).
    Here is a map for you

    Maybe you heard about the territorial conflicts of Thailand in general with anyone other than Cambodia, as I wrote above.
    I didn’t make this rating, if they think so, then they have a reason for this. For example, the population there is larger and they buy BTR-3 and Oplot.
    Therefore, in principle, I consider it not particularly biased.
    Not you make up, so why constantly refer to it?
    Can you compare the position of Uganda t Thailand
    http://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp. И Уганда не новая страна.
    And Taiwan has a smaller population than Ukraine and Thailand, about 23 million people and there is neither Oplot and BTR-3, and it is in the rating in 18 place.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 20: 13 New
    +1
    the United States has neighbors; the vital interests of the United States have no borders.
    Well, it's hard to argue. The interests of mattresses have no borders.
    It’s too late to drink Borjomi when Lenengrad is pease --- de ban. And if this is your argument, then you are simply ridiculous.
    No funnier than you, you have no arguments except the "conspiracy theory" and Yeltsin. Well, do not pull Russia into the 90s, 3 tank design bureaus, well, at least UVZ, due to foreign orders, kept afloat. There, the Soviet Union built as many as 3 (three) types of tanks, the mechanisms and parts of which were not interchangeable, 2 different types of ships on the same building (BOD pr.1155 and EM pr.956), etc. and the economy could not stand it. And in the 90s, bones crunched at the enterprises of the military-industrial complex around the world, in Ukraine KHKTM only kept afloat due to the Pakistani order. Well, Omsk did not have foreign orders, and did not buy its own army of tanks, so the factory closed, and the same thing happened with Peter. Although my opinion is, two or three design bureaus are needed to ensure normal UVZ competition in the development of tanks.
    That's just for this reason, and turned out T-90
    Well, I wanted my tank, so they called it, the last modification of the T-72-T-90 at that time. And I'm sure Yeltsin has nothing to do with him. For the whole of his second term, he only “worked with documents”, while the first one so far allowed his health to stupidly thump.
    Quote: svp67
    And who is svp67? And what does it have to do with domestic tank building? An ordinary member of the site who expressed his opinion.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 21: 43 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, it's hard to argue. The interests of mattresses have no borders.

    Something in the woods died.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, don’t pull Russia into the 90 3 tank KB,

    Is this your argument? Khilinky. It was necessary to leave Leningrad. And UVZ could, as before, drive the series for export.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, I wanted my tank, so they called it, the last modification of the T-72-T-90 at that time. And I'm sure Yeltsin has nothing to do with him
    No to the tank, but yes to the decisions on the tank - I already gave you a screenshot about the name.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And who is svp67? And what does it have to do with domestic tank building? Ordinary member of the site who expressed his opinion

    And who are you? SWP 67 even a tanker, in the subject understands and you're just a clown.
  • svp67
    svp67 19 August 2013 22: 13 New
    -1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And who is svp67?

    Quote: Kars
    swp xnumx though tanker


    “Who is Studebaker?”
    “Is this your relative Studebaker?” Is your dad Studebaker? ”About Bender repeat
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 22: 45 New
    +1
    Quote: svp67
    “Is this your relative Studebaker?” Is your dad Studebaker? ”About Bender

    will you refuse words?
    Quote: svp67
    I’m afraid that the true answer will not be as clear as the author is trying to prove. And if the first president of Russia had suddenly been a native of Siberia, the author would have now argued that T80 is much better than T64 and T72, which is much easier by the way

    otherwise they don’t believe you.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 22: 30 New
    0
    Something in the woods died.
    No comments. Another rambling raving gray gelding named Kars.
    Is this your argument? Khilinky. It was necessary to leave Leningrad. And UVZ could, as before, drive the series for export.
    Which one you have, besides the dubious conspiracy theory, you don’t have such and such.
    No to the tank, but yes to the decisions on the tank - I already gave you a screenshot about the name.
    Do you yourself believe that the drunk who had not served in the army for a single day had anything to do with deciding on tanks? Rave? He brought a screenshot, they just slipped a paper with the name to Borka, and said that this was the first RUSSIAN tank he waved without reading, I doubt that I was not drunk. He didn’t care at all at that time whether they would produce tanks or not. He had a "friend Bill, you see."
    And who are you? SWP 67 even a tanker, in the subject understands and you're just a clown.
    Who is the respected svp67, I do not know, I did not serve in one part with him. we weren’t supposed to be in the operative brigade of VV tanks: the “boxes” were beters, ZU-23, 2B11. Himself in the army served as an "expert" -hysteric. Keep coming up with the next nonsense and make me laugh further.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 22: 43 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    No comments

    In shock, the blacksmith agreed with me))) in the forest, probably a lot of things died.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Which one you have, besides the dubious conspiracy theory, you don’t have such and such.

    This can be said a fact, not a conspiracy theory. The most ordinary lobism and fraternity - without any background, threw off tank standing for 15 years.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Do you yourself believe that the drunk who had not served in the army for a single day had anything to do with deciding on tanks?

    And who if not the president?
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    He brought a screenshot, they just slipped a paper with the name to Borka, and said that this was the first RUSSIAN tank he waved without reading
    Because it was the countryman who slipped it, and if he waved without reading, it was he who was to blame.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Himself in the army served as an "expert" -hysteric.

    Yes, I had a little clown fantasy on the Genocide.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Keep coming up with the next nonsense and make me laugh further.

    That's just you nirazu refute my nonsense nesmogli. Although of course you can kichitsa Cyprus))) But compared with your Uganda)))
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 09: 49 New
    0
    In shock, the blacksmith agreed with me))) in the forest, probably a lot of things died.
    I haven’t called you by nicknames, not tea in kindergarten! And with the undeniable fact that the interests of mattresses have no borders, I’m not going to argue. Unlike some of the, ер, факты дов "",,,,,,,, сп сп ер сп некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых В некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых Unlike some of the некоторых "некоторых" "",,,,,,,,,,, некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых некоторых Unlike some of the "experts" who fit the facts into their own matrix, and are ready to blame the Russian government for lies if his opinion does not coincide with him.
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.

    This can be said a fact, not a conspiracy theory. The most ordinary lobism and fraternity - without any background, threw off tank standing for 15 years.
    Fact confirmed by KEM? Hysterical "expert", or another no less hysterical "expert" by the name of Tarasenko. About "fraternity" I already wrote above.
    In 2003, the Commander-in-Chief of the Ground Forces of the Russian Federation N.V. Kormiltsev called the T-72 the most effective example of armored military equipment in real combat conditions.

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2-72
    Another "fellow countryman", though born in Siberia, in Omsk, why didn’t he protect the T-80 ?. And it’s hard to blame him for lack of professionalism.
    And who if not the president?
    In addition to the president, there are a lot of other people who are much better versed in tanks (Minister of Defense, Chief of General Staff, Head of GBTU, etc. etc.)
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 09: 56 New
    +1
    Yes, I had a little clown fantasy on the Genocide.
    . Wow, I suppose in the “army” is “non-square”, a hysterical woman. Well, I’m not going to measure genitals with you, who served where, hysterical, I repeat not in kindergarten. November 19, even a holiday congratulations.
    That's just you nirazu refute my nonsense nesmogli. Although of course you can kichitsa Cyprus))) But compared with your Uganda)))
    The map then studied the bast shoe. I immediately gave a link to the same Wikipedia, only English and Spanish. And then he secured his success with official documents. Keep hysteria further, maybe it will. And as for Wikipedia, so in contrast to the hysterical "expert" I admitted my mistake, well, I found the data about the T-72 Uganda delivered by UKRAINE.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 11: 21 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Wow, I suppose in the "army"

    Naturally.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . Well, I’m not going to measure with you with child-bearing organs, who served where

    What are you? You’ve already started a clown late))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    He himself served in the army
    )))))) and then zadyuyu)) how it looks like you.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . I immediately gave a link to the same Wikipedia, only English and Spanish.

    Well, you're stupid))) they clearly told you
    Quote: Kars
    Of course Mogichi Cyprus Cyprus)))

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, I found data on T-72 Uganda delivered by UKRAINE.


    not everything was much funnier and showed your stupidity. You gave a link to Janes, said that there was NO. I asked you exactly no and where I read
    dy gave a link to the document)))
    and I easily found in YOUR document what you couldn’t read))
    but in my links in Cyprus everything confirmed my words))
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 12: 14 New
    0
    Naturally.
    Congratulations, I have
    a second cousin from Darnitsa served, he talked a lot about this circus.
    What are you? You’ve already started a clown late))
    Get out a tantrum. I asked you, you answered me, the more so the "Genocide" with a tank combines only a caterpillar mover.
    )))))) and then zadyuyu)) how it looks like you.
    The answer is above.
    Well, you're stupid))) they clearly told you
    Look at yourself "expert" great.
    Compared to you, I am an expert.
    Not a single evidence of hysteria, and no less hysterical conclusions.
    not everything was much funnier and showed your stupidity. You gave a link to Janes, said that there was NO. I asked you exactly no and where I read
    dy gave a link to the document)))
    and I easily found in YOUR document what you couldn’t read))

    but in my links in Cyprus everything confirmed my words))
    And what from this. Still squealing and hysteria.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.

    Teach materiel "eksperd"
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 11: 23 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I haven’t called you yet

    My nickname is easier to write, willow longer.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    In addition to the president, there are a lot of other people who are much better versed in tanks

    Well, yes, they showed it in the storming of the formidable, but the fact remains that the T-90 is a mistake and the result of the fraternity together with the fact that Borya did not go wild in the tanks.

    Quote: svp67
    I’m afraid that the true answer will not be as clear as the author is trying to prove. And if the first president of Russia had suddenly been a native of Siberia, the author would have now argued that T80 is much better than T64 and T72, which is much easier by the way

    And as we see more than one Tarasenko of such an opinion,
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 13: 09 New
    0
    My nickname is easier to write, willow longer.
    Come on, another rotten otmaz. But as you know, patients are not offended.
    Well, yes, they showed it in the storming of the formidable, but the fact remains that the T-90 is a mistake and the result of the fraternity together with the fact that Borya did not go wild in the tanks.
    This "mistake" has already managed to fight well, and in the same Chechnya.
    Combat application

    The first Chechen war - the T-90 turned out to be practically invulnerable to anti-tank weapons of Chechen fighters [75].
    The invasion of militants in Dagestan - one T-90 received seven hits from an RPG and remained in service [75].

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2-90. А по поводу новогоднего штурма Грозного и жопоголовых стратегов, во главе с Пьяным Борей не у одного меня чешутся руки с ними расчитаться за это. Но дохнут, же, сами (Ельцин, Грачев). Но мы уже полезли не туда.
    And as we see more than one Tarasenko of such an opinion,

    I already asked who the respected svp67 is, and what role it played in domestic tank building. I can also refer to Murakhovsky in assessing the merits of tanks. Iem more, I read your dialogue with svp67, this is an extravaganza:
    Quote: svp67
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And who is svp67?
    Quote: Kars
    swp xnumx though tanker
    “Who is Studebaker?”
    “Is this your relative Studebaker?” Is your dad Studebaker? ” About bender feel

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    will you refuse words?
    Quote: svp67
    I’m afraid that the true answer will not be as clear as the author is trying to prove. And if the first president of Russia had suddenly been a native of Siberia, the author would have now argued that T80 is much better than T64 and T72, which is much easier by the way
    otherwise they don’t believe you.

    in response to silence, well, the person does not want someone Kars hiding behind his name. That write ISCHO.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 13: 20 New
    +2
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    My nickname is easier to write, willow longer. Come on, another rotten otmaz. But as you know, patients are not offended.

    You also blind))
    smiths xnumx
    Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    This "mistake" has already managed to fight well, and in the same Chechnya.

    T-90 was in Chechnya, but there is no evidence that he fought. There is no evidence of his effectiveness.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    First Chechen war - T-90 turned out to be practically invulnerable to anti-tank weapons of Chechen fighters [75].
    This is a fairytale.
    There is only one mention in a museum of UVZ about a business trip for two weeks.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    But we have already climbed the wrong way

    as it’s not there, you were crucified that around EBN there was a mass of tank experts.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    in response to silence, well, the person does not want someone Kars hiding behind his name. That write ISCHO
    Maybe I didn’t notice. I’ll write a drug.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 14: 17 New
    +1
    You also blind))
    smiths xnumx
    Kars
    Took and copied or the mouse does not work.
    T-90 was in Chechnya, but there is no evidence that he fought. There is no evidence of his effectiveness.
    There is a link, do not believe refute or rewrite Wikipedia. Only many sources have to refute.
    This is a fairytale.
    There is only one mention in a museum of UVZ about a business trip for two weeks.
    See above. You have a fairy tale that does not fit into your matrix.
    as it’s not there, you were crucified that around EBN there was a mass of tank experts.
    If you believe that the Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation, the chief of the General Staff and the head of the GBTU are less versed in the tanks of a certain "expert", I am very sorry for you.
    Maybe I didn’t notice. I’ll write a drug.
    Write, "the office writes"
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 14: 20 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Took and copied or the mouse does not work.

    sometimes laziness - a blacksmith or a clown to write faster.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    There is a link, do not believe refute or rewrite Wikipedia. Only many sources have to refute.
    A link to an article from Independent Military Review does not even make any sense to refute, there is no other evidence.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    If you think that the Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation, the chief of the General Staff and the head of the GBTU are less versed in the tanks of a certain "expert", I am very sorry for you.

    It is entirely possible that they are a priori tankmen? Cannot be from the Air Force? And so on? And the error with the T-90 is obvious.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Write, "the office writes"
    Already written. Let's wait.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 21: 40 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I remember it perfectly, but it was not I who first started to refer to the rating

    And how do you like the rating?
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, India, in your ranking, is in fourth place, which means that Russia’s sale to India and production there under the 2000 T-90 license is much more MUCH MORE PREMIUM than the sale of 49 Oplotov by Ukraine to Thailand

    Had there been a T-90 plant built from scratch in India in the Russian Federation, and this is the legacy of the USSR, and it would have got to India without a tender.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Learn to read the map near Vietnam, India, Indonesia, China, in general there are no land borders with Thailand.
    You are observant. Only the World Ocean provides coherence of positions. Various alliances are also possible.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Thailand and Malaysia and Indonesia are members of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN).

    Well, yes, China and the Russian Federation are included in the SCO)) and therefore they do not keep troops on their borders with each other.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Not you make up, so why constantly refer to it?
    Are you referring only to what YOU make up yourself?))) I don’t have either logic or intelligence))) This is an unrated rating, and it is at least for some indicators

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And Taiwan has a smaller population than Ukraine and Thailand, about 23 million people and there is neither Oplot and BTR-3, and it is in the rating in 18 place.

    and what? do you want to argue by the methodology for calculating the rating? Forward to the site - there are taken into account more than 60 different factors.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 22: 07 New
    0
    And how do you like the rating?
    Why do I “like” him. Nevertheless, to compare the Armed Forces of the states by a certain rating is as strange as women. Someone likes blondes, someone brunettes, someone redheads. Someone bbw, someone slender.
    Had there been a T-90 plant built from scratch in India in the Russian Federation, and this is the legacy of the USSR, and it would have got to India without a tender.
    Well, let's start with the fact that the main rival of the T-90 in India was and is the "Arjun", however, the T-90 is the main tank of the Indian army. Or can you tell me on the basis of which tender the T-80UD was delivered to Pakistan ?.
    You are observant. Only the World Ocean provides coherence of positions. Various alliances are also possible.
    Well, for this you do not need to buy tanks, but to buy planes and warships. I doubt very much that China, which cannot land amphibious assault forces in Taiwan, will take and plan to land in Thailand. Or Vietnam, so he doesn’t have enough DC to land more battalions at the same time. India, Indonesia, Malaysia are generally funny. Do they need it?
    Well, yes, China and the Russian Federation are included in the SCO)) and therefore they do not keep troops on their borders with each other.
    And they conduct joint exercises. Only this year already twice. We are holding troops on the border with Ukraine, and it is a member of the CIS. And on the Caspian, in general, we have the largest fleet of the KSF, and there are only friendly states :, Turkmenistan, Iran.
    Are you referring only to what YOU make up yourself?))) I don’t have either logic or intelligence))) This is an unrated rating, and it is at least for some indicators
    No, I refer to a lot of data, see links, I prefer official ones, like a report to the UN, or rather verified ones.
    and what? do you want to argue by the methodology for calculating the rating? Forward to the site - there are taken into account more than 60 different factors.
    I won’t even think about it.laughingEnough for me is the fact that Russia is in second place, India is from T-90 to 4th, Iran is from T-72 to 16th, and Thailand with Oplot is in 20th and Ukraine is 22nd. tongue
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 22: 19 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Nevertheless, it is as strange to compare the Armed Forces of the states by a certain rating, as well as women.

    Well, it seems you don’t have any logic at all. Compare specific indicators with external sensations. Go back to the rating and read carefully what is considered there.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, let's start with the fact that the main rival of the T-90 in India was and is “Arjun”

    He would be and would be if he was ready for mass production by the time of the first contract on the T-90
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Or can you tell me on the basis of which tender T-80UD was delivered to Pakistan?
    There were other difficulties, but nevertheless the USSR did not build tank plants there on preferential terms, and there were no Soviet tanks in Pakistan's armaments.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, for this you do not need to buy tanks, but to buy planes and warships.

    Well, everyone buys there.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    We are holding troops on the border with Ukraine, and she is a member of the CH

    Then why was there a mention of international unification? In 1941 between the USSR and Germany there were also pacts and an exchange of technologies - and everyone remembers how it ended.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Um, I refer to a lot of data, see links, I prefer official ones, like a report to the UN, or rather verified
    Then the meaning of your utterance?

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Not you make up, so why constantly refer to it?

    logic failure again? at least why the question mark is your next logical failure.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I won’t even think about it. It’s enough for me that Russia is in second place, India is with T-90 at 4, Iran is from T-72 at 16, and Thailand with Oplot is at 20, and Ukraine is 22-m

    I’m quite happy with the 22 position of Ukraine. And by the way, the rating there does not depend on tanks. And it would be nice to see some people involved exclude nuclear weapons.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 11: 22 New
    +1
    Well, it seems you don’t have any logic at all. Compare specific indicators with external sensations. Go back to the rating and read carefully what is considered there.
    I already wrote that about my attitude to the ratings. The DPRK has nuclear weapons, a million-strong army and its own production of the main types of weapons, and it is in 28th place, while Thailand and Ukraine do not have nuclear weapons, and they are higher, what objectivity can be there.
    There were other difficulties, but nevertheless the USSR did not build tank plants there on preferential terms, and there were no Soviet tanks in Pakistan's armaments.
    It was precisely in the arsenal of Pakistan that, and still is, the Chinese copy of the T-54A-T-59. And the USSR simply could not build anything in Pakistan because Pakistan was an enemy and supported Afghan dushmans.
    Well, everyone buys there.
    And they’re doing it right. Si vis pacem, para bellum (Russian: “if you want peace, prepare for war”).
    Then why was there a mention of international unification? In 1941 between the USSR and Germany there were also pacts and an exchange of technologies - and everyone remembers how it ended.
    Now is not the 1941 year, and Thailand and the ASEAN member states do not have any territorial conflicts.
    Then the meaning of your utterance?
    The meaning of my statement, you must answer for your words or at least reinforce them with a link, and not with your own conclusions.
    logic failure again? at least why the question mark is your next logical failure.
    What is it expressed in? To the point that you first say one thing and then refer to another?
    I’m quite happy with the 22 position of Ukraine. And by the way, the rating there does not depend on tanks. And it would be nice to see some people involved exclude nuclear weapons.
    Me too. For example, Russia is in second place, thanks to the USSR, Ukraine would be even lower. Won the DPRK with nuclear weapons generally moved to 28th place.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 11: 31 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I already wrote that about my attitude to the ratings. The DPRK has nuclear weapons, a million-strong army and its own production of the main types of weapons and it is in the 28 place, while Thailand and Ukraine have no nuclear weapons, and they are higher, what objectivity can there be

    Don’t continue to stupid))) There are 65 indicators, including availability and access to oil, resources, etc. And nuclear weapons of S. Korea and more are fiction. Maybe there are a couple of charges, but there are no carriers, (old crafts based on Skud consider we will not) and it is not a fact that it will fit into the dimensions.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    full-time in the arsenal of Pakistan consisted and yes and now there is a Chinese copy of the T-54A-T-59

    Chinese
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . And to build something in Pakistan, the USSR is simply not mine
    All the more .. honor .. that Ukraine sold there the T-80, and not the 17 modification of the T-72 on which the Indians ride.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Now is not the 1941 year, and Thailand and the ASEAN member states do not have any territorial conflicts.
    But what are you, and then what is everyone arming at such a pace? Especially in that region.


    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The meaning of my statement, you must answer for your words or at least reinforce them with a link, and not with your own conclusions.
    Well, you still have to fall into the logical hole? I just brought the link and didn’t even make any special conclusions of my own - everything is intelligibly written in the Rating.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    What is it expressed in? To the point that you first say one thing and then refer to another?

    Reread and you’ll understand everything, your logic is absent like a tokay, but only convulsive-hysterical attempts are twisted.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Me too. Russia, for example, is in second place, thanks to the USSR, Ukraine would be even lower
    failure of logic again. I’m glad that at least you understand who you need to say thank you to. And by the way, Ukraine voluntarily refused the fourth nuclear arsenal in the world, unlike Korean fakes.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 14: 01 New
    +1
    Don’t continue to stupid))) There are 65 indicators, including availability and access to oil, resources, etc. And nuclear weapons of S. Korea and more are fiction. Maybe there are a couple of charges, but there are no carriers, (old crafts based on Skud consider we will not) and it is not a fact that it will fit into the dimensions.
    Well, Americans, South Koreans and Japanese do not think so
    On February 10, 2005, the DPRK first openly announced the creation of nuclear weapons in the country [1]. October 9, 2006 was the first nuclear explosion [2]. In April 2012, the DPRK constitution was amended on the country's nuclear status [3]. On December 12, 2012, the DPRK entered the club of space powers, launching an artificial Earth satellite into orbit.
    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%E0%EA%E5%F2%ED%EE-%FF%E4%E5%F0%ED%E0%FF_%EF%F0%
    EE%E3%F0%E0%EC%EC%E0_%CA%CD%C4%D0

    At the same time, do not enlighten what weapons for its armed forces Thailand, in contrast to the DPRK, which almost completely satisfies its weapons needs (except for the air force), produces independently.
    Chinese
    Chinese copy of the T-54A.
    But what are you, and then what is everyone arming at such a pace? Especially in that region.
    Si vis pacem, para bellum (rus. "If you want peace - prepare for war"). Moreover, Thailand is distinguished by its distortions in the field of arms purchases. they have won, the only aircraft carrier, without an air group, is used as a royal yacht and tourist route.
    Well, you still have to fall into the logical hole? I just brought the link and didn’t even make any special conclusions of my own - everything is intelligibly written in the Rating.
    I didn’t drink with the Brudershaft and you didn’t switch to it. You have already done your conclusions everywhere, such that logic nervously smokes on the sidelines.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 14: 08 New
    +1
    Reread and you’ll understand everything, your logic is absent like a tokay, but only convulsive-hysterical attempts are twisted.
    Exactly especially in the matter with Cyprus
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.

    Keep turning around further.
    failure of logic again. I’m glad that at least you understand who you need to say thank you to. And by the way, Ukraine voluntarily refused the fourth nuclear arsenal in the world, unlike Korean fakes.
    What joy. Thanks, by the way, to mattresses.
    As a result of the collapse of the USSR, the number of nuclear powers increased, since at the time of the signing of the Bialowieza Accords, Soviet nuclear weapons were deployed in four union republics: Russia, Ukraine, Belarus and Kazakhstan.

    The joint diplomatic efforts of Russia and the United States of America led to the fact that Ukraine, Belarus and Kazakhstan renounced the status of nuclear powers, and transferred to Russia all the military atomic potential that appeared on their territory.
    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%D0%B0%D1%81%D0%BF%D0%B0%D0%B4_%D0%A1%D0%A1%D
    0%A1%D0%A0#.D0.91.D0.B5.D0.B7.D1.8A.D1.8F.D0.B4.D0.B5.D1.80.D0.BD.D1.8B.D0.B9_.D
    1.81.D1.82.D0.B0.D1.82.D1.83.D1.81_.D0.A3.D0.BA.D1.80.D0.B0.D0.B8.D0.BD.D1.8B.2C
    _.D0.91.D0.B5.D0.BB.D0.BE.D1.80.D1.83.D1.81.D1.81.D0.B8.D0.B8_.D0.B8_.D0.9A.D0.B
    0.D0.B7.D0.B0.D1.85.D1.81.D1.82.D0.B0.D0.BD.D0.B0
    So, Kazakhstan, Belarus and South Africa also voluntarily abandoned nuclear weapons. "God doesn’t give horns (Svidomo) to a cow, otherwise they would sell it all over the world.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 14: 16 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Exactly especially in the matter with Cyprus

    And what about Cyprus? It is possible. Moreover, such a delay.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    What joy. Thanks, by the way, to mattresses.

    And not only mattresses - there are still some countries that have participated and are guarantors of our security.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    "God doesn’t give horns (Svidomo) to a cow, otherwise they would sell it all over the world

    As I am in another thread, I replied to a similar YOUR statement--
    I wanted to say something? that you (the Russian Federation) are not a vigorous cow))) And at the same time you also managed to Belarus, with Kazakhstan to insult the clown.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 14: 45 New
    +1
    And what about Cyprus? It is possible. Moreover, such a delay.
    keep believing further. Sources talk about backward. It reminds me of a well-known Ukrainian proverb: "Our shouting lies all the time."
    And not only mattresses - there are still some countries that have participated and are guarantors of our security.
    You represent this country, Russia, what kind of threat does it pose to the security of Ukraine?
    As I am in another thread, I replied to a similar YOUR statement--
    I wanted to say something? that you (the Russian Federation) are not a vigorous cow))) And at the same time you also managed to Belarus, with Kazakhstan to insult the clown.
    Well here, no comment at all. Pure tantrum. And how did I offend Belarus with Kazakhstan? Keep laughing further.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 14: 50 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    keep believing on

    And what to believe is a fact - the supply of tanks from the presence of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for so long.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    "Our shouting lies all the way."

    And to translate? It does not make sense in Ukrainian.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    You represent this country, Russia, what kind of threat does it pose to the security of Ukraine?
    I wrote about threats from the Russian Federation? although who should not be trusted with whom and the Russian Federation, it is easier for mattresses to keep their word - they are far from us.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, there are no comments at all. Pure tantrum. And how did I offend Belarus with Kazakhstan? Keep laughing further

    Yes, of course. Again, we went to the unconscious. Although you are not friends with logic, you have little understanding of what to write
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    So, Kazakhstan, Belarus and South Africa also voluntarily abandoned nuclear weapons. "God doesn’t give horns (Svidomo) to a cow, otherwise they would sell it all over the world.

    By the way, South Africa was also insulted. The postscript (Svidomo) does not mean anything. You put these countries on the same line. And who said that South Africa or Belarus are not Svidomo-only in their own language, they are sovereign countries that follow their own national interests. But you don’t understand.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 15: 11 New
    +1
    And what to believe is a fact - the supply of tanks from the presence of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for so long.
    How could they have done so.
    And to translate? It does not make sense in Ukrainian.
    Do not seem dumber than you really are, you understand everything.
    I wrote about threats from the Russian Federation? although who should not be trusted with whom and the Russian Federation, it is easier for mattresses to keep their word - they are far from us.
    And why should the Russian Federation trust Ukraine?
    Yes, of course. Again, we went to the unconscious. Although you are not friends with logic, you have little understanding of what to write
    This is your purely personal opinion. Keep hysteria, the doctor has already left.
    By the way, South Africa was also insulted. The postscript (Svidomo) does not mean anything. You put these countries on the same line. And who said that South Africa or Belarus are not Svidomo-only in their own language, they are sovereign countries that follow their own national interests. But you don’t understand.
    Of course, countries voluntarily renounced nuclear weapons.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 15: 51 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    How could they have done so.

    They smashed something for a long time.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Don't seem dumber than you really are, you all understood

    Once again I repeat you wrote nonsense.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And why should the Russian Federation trust Ukraine?

    It should not. But we just didn’t have any guarantees in the Russian Federation.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    This is your purely personal opinion.

    This confirms that you lousy and not even trying to justify.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Of course, countries voluntarily renounced nuclear weapons.
    Yes, and it was them that you insulted.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 17: 10 New
    0
    They smashed something for a long time.
    Nevertheless, the contract was completed in full and on time. There are no official complaints from Cyprus. What other questions?
    Once again I repeat you wrote nonsense.
    I don’t write in literary Ukrainian, where do my mother and grandmother (Sumy region) come from, speak Russian language from Google specifically for you:
    Vsrashshsy shout our bere

    This confirms that you lousy and not even trying to justify.
    And I’m not going to. Sick Kars keep raving. Show Must Go On ...
    Yes, and it was them that you insulted.
    Wow. Recognition of the fact of a voluntary refusal from nuclear weapons is already an insult to the country. Just something on this thread, I do not see either Belarusians, or Kazakhs, and even more so the Yuarovites. There is only one hysterical representative of "non-self". Sue me.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 17: 19 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Nevertheless

    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And I’m not going to.

    Who would doubt
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    only something on this branch I neither Belarusians, nor Kazakhs, nor even more so the Yuarovites.
    This is good for you. And the fact that you insulted them is clear.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 17: 51 New
    0
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90
    Where are the claims of Cyprus? No, but no, and no trial. At the same time, where was the T-90 offered to Cyprus? And even if they suggested, what of this? He who pays orders music. Cyprus pays, he orders. I wanted the T-80U to receive the T-80U, I would like the T-90 to receive the T-90. everything else is your sick nonsense.
    Who would doubt
    In what. in your mental health? I definitely didn’t doubt that he was completely upset and that you got the Tarasenko virus. The virus is named after the first patient. It is treated if it does not go into a chronic form. There is also the “cat-dish” virus, a serious illness of the nervous system (sometimes called chronic trident’s syndrome), it causes a terrible allergy to goods manufactured in Russia, when the goods are made in Ukraine, the patient is ecstatic, does not behave adequately, often sings “She hasn’t died of Ukraine” , sometimes the patient has an exacerbation. Do not worry so let you go.
    This is good for you. And the fact that you insulted them is clear.
    I have already answered, I do not see a single complaint from BELARUSIANS, nor from KAZAKH, nor from SOUTH AFRICAN. I see only one complaint from the turned on the whole head of Kars.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 18: 00 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Where are the claims of Cyprus?

    Quote: Kars
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Cyprus pays, he orders. Wanted T-80Y got T-80Y, would like T-90 would get T-90. everything else is your sick nonsense.
    Something for their money Cyprus received music for a long time, and T-90 did not want to.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    your infection with the Tarasenko virus

    It’s strange, but what does it have to do with it? Then you have Khlopotov’s virus for the whole ass, what do you think.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    causes a terrible allergy to goods manufactured in Russia, falls into the sight of goods made in Ukraine

    This is an indicator of your psychosis on the basis of envy of Ukraine, as well as many of your comments both locally and not. Your favorite occupation is to re-write muck about Ukraine))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I have already answered, I do not see a single complaint from BELARUSIANS, nor from KAZAKH, nor from SOUTH AFRICAN.
    Well, there are few such selfless people to read, and even more so to disassemble your incoherent flood.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 18: 21 New
    0
    Something for their money Cyprus received music for a long time, and T-90 did not want to.
    Where are the claims of Cyprus? Link to them? And not the opinion of the wretched “expert” under the nickname Kars. According to the documents of the contract, the fulfillment was completed in full and on time, about which an OFFICIAL report of Russia to the UN was submitted.
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.


    Answer us soon through the dopa chief doctor.
    Sincerely. Date, signature ... Answer us, and
    then
    If you do not respond, we will write in "Sportloto".
    Write Kars, write.
    It’s strange, but what does it have to do with it? Then you have Khlopotov’s virus for the whole ass, what do you think.
    Well, find me where I refer to Khlopotov. You are just the first to refer to him.
    This is an indicator of your psychosis on the basis of envy of Ukraine, as well as many of your comments both locally and not. Your favorite occupation is to re-write muck about Ukraine))
    I already wrote again, I am half Ukrainian (by mother), I have a bunch of relatives in Ukraine, my wife is half Ukrainian (by father). And how can I hate parts of myself. I distinguish I simply distinguish the official Ukrainian "state", with its mania, Russophobia and praise of the cat-dog Bandera and other Shlyukhevychs, with the Ukrainian people, to whom my mother and partly me have the honor. And I really hope that soon Ukraine (at least East, South and Crimea) will reunite with its older sister.
    Well, there are few such selfless people to read, and even more so to disassemble your incoherent flood.
    C'mon, you are the only one with a grenade on the tank, you’re “selfless” ours, look around, orderlies with a straitjacket are not stealing. I haven’t laughed like that for a long time. He named one svp67, and even that one recoiled from you as from a plague. Along the way, you already got everyone here.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 18: 27 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Where are the claims of Cyprus?

    Quote: Kars
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Write Kars, write.

    Surely, it’s necessary to stop your nonsense.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, find me where I refer to Khlopotov.
    Where am I at Tarasenko?

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I already wrote again, I am half Ukrainian (by mother), I have a bunch of relatives in Ukraine, my wife is half Ukrainian (by father)

    This does not cancel your psychosis, but probably even enhances it.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I really hope that soon Ukraine (at least East, South and Crimea) will reunite with its older sister

    Wow, we divide into younger-senior)) then you will be segregated, you will be able to teach mind-to-mind as elders)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I haven’t laughed like that for a long time. He called one svp67, and even that one recoiled from you as from a plague

    Not yet evening.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    you already got everyone here on the move.
    Who else?
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 10: 08 New
    0
    Surely, it’s necessary to stop your nonsense.
    All epic drain is protected. That is, the answer to my question will not follow:
    Where are the claims of Cyprus? Link to them? And not the opinion of the wretched “expert” under the nickname Kars. According to the documents, the contract was completed in full and on time, as presented by the OFFICIAL report of Russia to the UN.

    Continue to believe in your "conspiracy theory", issued by an inflamed brain and carry another nonsense.
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.

    How many times have I turned to you with a request to call me to you, but by the way to continue to pay attention to such a rude stupid as YOU I'm already tired.
    Where am I at Tarasenko?
    And here I referred to him.
    This does not cancel your psychosis, but probably even enhances it.
    Continue to hysteria and carry on nonsense further. However, I really consider the "independent Ukrainian state" a cheap vulgar operetta, led by clinical thieves, fools and beggars. "Rada itself is not glad that it is Rada" Well, something like this:
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 10: 28 New
    0
    Wow, we divide into younger-senior)) then you will be segregated, you will be able to teach mind-to-mind as elders)))
    There are no people like you, along with Tarasenko and Kotobred in the same ward of a psychiatric hospital. give a set of soldiers and plastic tanks and howl to your health after a sedative injection. And we’ll return the “Zapadents” to the Poles, they will vividly remember the “Volyn massacre”, and will again in Lviv, as before 1939, on all decent places there are signs: “PEOPLE WITH DOGS AND UKRAINIANS RESPONSE”.
    Not yet evening.
    “Midnight is approaching, but Herman (svp67) is still gone. He never came to stand up in a frantic, hysterical“ expert ”, As I don’t see on the branch of offended Belarusians, Kazakhs, South Africans, and I don’t see Ukrainians, except for one hysterical, sick on the whole head of “expert.” So, continue to merge further, the next drain is protected.
    Who else?
    Well, for example, Vladimir under the nickname smile, on a branch
    Cooperation with Vietnam. Money and politics

    Yesterday, 14: 55 ↑

    smiths xnumx
    Bliiiin, I'm sorry !!!! The fact is that Kars, in my opinion, is the only person. who blacklisted me (by the way, he didn’t understand why, because if I argued with him, then, unlike some, he really didn’t get on me :)))). Well, imagine, I see a series of your comments, one by one ... the comments do not indicate to whom they are addressed ..... so I read them and reread them ... it seems that you are addressing Ryabov specifically Kirill ...
    Now everything is clear. My attitude to Kars is similar to yours.
    Well, you know my opinion about yourself - a vulgar hysterical stupid clown mowing under the "expert". I will not say anything about the opinions of the participants of MG 42 and ATATA. I did not participate in the discussion on this thread. However, on this thread, someone regularly gives me pluses, and you have minuses. Who are you unknown? Please write PM, I want to thank you and at least in the virtual shake hands.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 11: 13 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    em like you with

    Well, say hello to Napoleon - what kind of blacksmith is making plans)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    "Midnight is approaching, but Herman (svp67) is still gone. He never came to stand up in a frantic, hysterical" expert "

    Taki came)))) read below the clown)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Now everything is clear. My attitude to Kars is similar to yours

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    MG 42 and ATATA
    So you have a lot of such clowns. Ataty was completely frostbitten, I didn’t even argue with him, I sent him immediately to the emergency situations, MG42 was a neo-Nazi with a nickname from Hitler’s Spit. You yourself admitted Ukrainophobia, but it's funny with you.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 11: 54 New
    0
    Well, say hello to Napoleon - what kind of blacksmith is making plans)))
    No hello, the sick Kars will convey him from the ward with Tarasenko and Kotobud, after another enchanting victory over the “damned moskalyami”.
    Taki came)))) read below the clown)))
    He got a man after all. Well, what did he say.
    What can I tell you? The fact that in our Sverdlovsk region in honor of the celebration of "Tanker’s Day" the governor used to hold celebrations, which invited both designers and operators, that is, us sinners ... And there, after the feast, there were opportunities for direct communication. You know, there are a lot of interesting things to learn, so to speak first-hand. Including about "who and where, and most importantly HOW to solve" issues, especially in the championship issue. And honestly, not all of the above is "accessible, to understanding." For example, why Leningraders were not “allowed” to modify the T80 with the 2B2 diesel engine? At least as an experiment, in order not to create a more perfect competitor to the “born T90”. And for this, "undercover methods" were undertaken. Since the tank that we know today as the T90 should not have been like that ... It pleases another - the situation is changing, in terms of the T90, and for the better ...
    Almost the same as me, that they slipped the document to the most senior Russian alcoholic, and he waved it without reading. About intrigues in between KB. I did not deny this either. Or is it different in Ukraine? Thanks of course to the respected svp67 for the information.
    So you have a lot of such clowns. Ataty was completely frostbitten, I didn’t even argue with him, I sent him immediately to the emergency situations, MG42 was a neo-Nazi with a nickname from Hitler’s Spit. You yourself admitted Ukrainophobia, but it's funny with you.
    And I look at you alone, with a grenade at the tank, until the orderlies came. I read the statements of both MG 42 and ATATA and did not see anything funny or even more fascist. Especially as I understood MG 42 from the CPU in general. Their opinion of you is no better. Well, what about Ukrainophobia at the wrong gate. However, it’s funny to you too. Keep making me laugh further my funny clown ...
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 12: 30 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    No hello will convey to him

    Do not bring down from the ball head to the healthy.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    He got a man after all. Well, what did he say.
    What did the clown eat? And snotted further. And he confirmed what I said, and not you a clown.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Almost the same as me
    No, to put it mildly, you were mixed up with hav, and you are smiling. As I said T-90 is not the best solution.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I also read the statements of both MG 42 and ATATA and did not see anything funny or even more fascist

    Yes, you would lie justified, but not.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 13: 44 New
    0
    Do not bring down from the ball head to the healthy.
    So I have no currency with my healthy on your sick.
    What did the clown eat? And snotted further. And he confirmed what I said, and not you a clown.
    Especially for the patient Kars, I quote:
    Kuznetsov 1977 RU August 19, 2013 22:30 | MIC of Ukraine - guns for the sake of fat
    Do you yourself believe that the drunk who had not served in the army for a single day had anything to do with deciding on tanks? Rave? He brought a screenshot, they just slipped a paper with the name to Borka, and said that this was the first RUSSIAN tank he waved without reading, I doubt that I was not drunk. He didn’t care at all at that time whether they would produce tanks or not. He had a "friend Bill, you see."

    No, to put it mildly, you were mixed up with hav, and you are smiling. As I said T-90 is not the best solution.

    In 2003, the Commander-in-Chief of the Ground Forces of the Russian Federation N.V. Kormiltsev called the T-72 the most effective example of armored military equipment in real combat conditions.

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2-72

    Another "fellow countryman", though born in Siberia, in Omsk, why didn’t he protect the T-80 ?. And it’s hard to blame him for lack of professionalism. And as you know, the T-90 is a logical continuation of the T-72, so I eksperd mixed you with shit yesterday,
    Kuznetsov 1977 RU Yesterday, 09:49 | MIC of Ukraine - guns for the sake of fat

    Keep hysteria further.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 13: 47 New
    0
    Yes, you would lie justified, but not.
    "Expert" breathe deeply you are excited. I look out there, I already forgot how to write correctly from hysteria. Well, don’t worry, and you will be cured! Look only before the time, do not break the monitor on the computer, otherwise I’ll spit it out of indignation.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 13: 48 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, do not worry and you will be treated!

    in this phrase, the letter And mrgo says. That's just how you can promise something if you have not been identified.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 14: 19 New
    0
    in this phrase, the letter And mrgo says. That's just how you can promise something if you have not been identified.
    And I have never been sick, and therefore do not pounce insults at a person who has a different point of view from mine.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 14: 22 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And I never got sick

    It’s not necessary to deny the obvious. But you are healed, try it can feel better.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 15: 12 New
    0
    It’s not necessary to deny the obvious. But you are healed, try it can feel better.
    Patient under the nickname Kars do not apply your diagnosis to strangers. Your disease, thank God, is not transmitted through the monitor.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 15: 16 New
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    But you heal, try it may feel better.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 15: 51 New
    0
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: Kars
    But you heal, try it may feel better.

    Write ISCHO, it looks like your orderly has a vacation and you got to the Internet.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 19: 35 New
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    But you heal, try it may feel better.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 13: 51 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    So I’m not a currency with my healthy on your sick

    Yes, just a hysterical turn.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    No, to put it mildly, you were mixed up with hav, and you are smiling. As I said T-90 is not the best solution.
    this is true truth.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    In 2003, the Commander-in-Chief of the Ground Forces of the Russian Federation N.V. Kormiltsev named the T-72

    And what else can I say? Did he have any choice? And where does the T-72 to the T-90 clown?
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    as you know, the T-90 is a logical continuation of the T-72, so with the shit I mixed you "expert" yesterday,
    Well, you and the clown)))

    wipe off again
    Quote: svp67
    I’m afraid that the true answer will not be as clear as the author is trying to prove. And if the first president of Russia had suddenly been a native of Siberia, the author would have now argued that T80 is much better than T64 and T72, which is much easier by the way
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 14: 30 New
    0
    Yes, just a hysterical turn.
    If you were sick, I would not be so sure.
    And what else can I say? Did he have any choice? And where does the T-72 to the T-90 clown?
    The patient, and who proved to me with foam at the mouth what day in a row that the T-90 and T-72 are the same thing and even gave a screenshot.

    And his choice in 2003 was the T-80, and also the T-64 with the T-62.
    Well, you and the clown)))
    wipe off again
    Of course, I understand that the respected svp67 authoritative comrade, but the commander in chief of the ground forces of the Russian Federation N.V. Kormiltsev is somehow more authoritative for me.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 11: 09 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    That is, the answer to my question will not follow

    here is the answer
    Quote: Kars
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    How many times have I turned to you with a request to call me to you, but by the way to continue to pay attention to such a rude stupid as YOU I'm already tired.

    And you didn’t work for you.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    independent Ukrainian state "cheap vulgar operetta, led by clinical thieves, fools and beggars.
    So I’m talking about this - you have psychosis on the basis of Ukraine, and most likely out of envy, as many said without the Russian Federation, we will die of starvation and crawl back up ourselves, and for 20 we’ll not die for years, and without oil and gas.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 12: 27 New
    0
    here is the answer
    Quote: Kars
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90
    That is, with denial of contract performance in general:
    Cyprus is yes, 96 years old, and until now the contact has not been fulfilled, which says a lot.
    we have already moved on to the deadlines. You undoubtedly progress to a better patient. Now about the "long", where are the official claims of Cyprus? And even if the T-90 was offered to Cyprus, which I personally do not doubt very much, it is up to the customer to choose which tank. Cyprus chose the T-80U, especially since they already had 41 T-80Us, which facilitates the training of crews and the supply of spare parts.
    And you didn’t work for you.
    Continue in the same vein as a hysterical woman, you might be banned, and we lose the "pleasure" of reading your incoherent nonsense. Although to be honest. I’m even a little upset. It will be a pity to lose such a funny clown.
    So I’m talking about this - you have psychosis on the basis of Ukraine, and most likely out of envy, as many said without the Russian Federation, we will die of starvation and crawl back up ourselves, and for 20 we’ll not die for years, and without oil and gas.
    The next drain is protected. I have a lot of relatives in Ukraine, my mother communicates with them on Skype every week. They come to visit us, we used to sit at a glass of tea with lard. And the company where I work has a lot of Ukrainian “zarobitchans”, so that I have information. There is nothing good in Ukraine. Personally, my opinion, which by the way my mother really does not like, has long been necessary to get rid of the illusions of a "Slavic brotherhood" and crush this "under-state" (for Georgia in 2008, for the UNA-UNSO militants in Chechnya, for outright Russophobia in politics, etc.) .d.) like a stinky bug. however, this is already happening. As the hero of the film "Brother-2" said: "You will answer me for Sevastopol!"
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 12: 34 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    That is, with denial of contract performance in general:

    keep tupit you clown plums do not protect.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . Now about the "long", where are the official claims of Cyprus?

    Quote: Kars
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90


    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Keep up the good work hysterical, maybe banned
    please

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . I have a lot of relatives in Ukraine

    So that's why there’s even more psychosis. Envy parses, you run the articles about Chernukha about Ukraine,
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    the hero of the movie "Brother-2" said: "You will answer me for Sevastopol!"
    In the most real Ukrainophobe.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 13: 55 New
    0
    keep tupit you clown plums do not protect.

    Start over:
    Cyprus is yes, 96 years old, and until now the contact has not been fulfilled, which says a lot.

    Now let's continue:
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.
    The hysteria of the "expert" Kars is fully satisfied. Keep merging on.
    please
    Why the hell do I need you, hysterical.
    So that's why there’s even more psychosis. Envy parses, you run the articles about Chernukha about Ukraine,
    You can’t slander that. which in itself is black, as a sub-project "state of Ukraine." So I don’t have any envy, I go to Ukraine to see my relatives, drink wine, talk with them, eat bacon, communicate normally with normal Ukrainians, I have no problems. Well, the truth is such individuals like you, but this is a clinic, it is not treated.
    In the most real Ukrainophobe.
    "Blessed is he who believes." See answer above.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 13: 58 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Start over:

    Forget about Cyprus.

    Quote: Kars
    Long. And on time it doesn’t look like. And the claim, what can I say. Cyprus did not want T-90


    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Why the hell do I need you, hysterical.
    The fact that you write comments proves the opposite homosexual hysterical))

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    You can’t slander that. which is black in itself

    But you will put a lot of effort into posting the Chernukha, if I didn’t know that you are a psycho turned in Ukraine, I would think that you are paid for it.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Blessed is he who believes. "See answer above.

    You are the real Ukrainophobe. This is undeniable.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 15: 19 New
    0
    Forget about Cyprus.
    All enchanting drain in the subject of the contract with Cyprus is counted.
    The fact that you write comments proves the opposite homosexual hysterical))
    Wow, what a lively self-confident cockerel, how many of you have scribbled them, and I will answer you, as you noticed calmly, without any extra emotions.
    But you will put a lot of effort into posting the Chernukha, if I didn’t know that you are a psycho turned in Ukraine, I would think that you are paid for it.
    I’m just stating the facts, enchanting “overcame” the Ukrainian military-industrial complex, and you are mad because you can’t refute them and they don’t fit into your mournful matrix.
    You are the real Ukrainophobe. This is undeniable.
    Today, of course, I will inform your mother, grandmother and wife, as well as relatives (Kiev, Sumy, Sumy) and all Ukrainians I know about this “discovery” of you. Have a good laugh together.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 14: 12 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, Americans, South Koreans and Japanese do not think so

    Some found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    at the same time, do not enlighten what weapons for its armed forces Thailand, in contrast to the DPRK, which almost completely satisfies its weapons needs (except for the air force), produces independently.

    Thailand, unlike Korea, is not starving, and it can afford to buy weapons.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Chinese copy of the T-54A.

    Chinese, not T-72 manufacturing plant

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Si vis pacem, para bellum (rus. "If you want peace - prepare for war").

    Plus, the situation in the region is very unstable, and the strangest alliances are possible. At the same time, conflicts are possible with Cambodia, Laos and Vietnam - which, to hell, China can support.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    used as a royal yacht and tourist route.

    Monarchy understand.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I didn’t drink with the Brudershaft and you didn’t switch to it.

    Cho so arguments ended? Or attentiveness appeared, I already called you a groove of twenty on, and you only got a bit ashamed of the clown.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    that logic nervously smokes on the sidelines.
    It’s not for you to judge the clown about logic, you are completely unfamiliar with her.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 15: 47 New
    -1
    Some found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq)))
    In Iraq, they found WMD-bacteriological. Moreover, Iraq had previously actively used chemical weapons in the war with Iran, and in 1988 in the war against the Kurds.
    Thailand, unlike Korea, is not starving, and it can afford to buy weapons.
    First, the DPRK imposed international sanctions, including arms embargo. Secondly, rumors of the current famine in the DPRK are greatly exaggerated. Third, over 6 million people live in Thailand below the poverty line. This is 9,5% of the total number of Thais. Carriers of the AIDS virus or patients - 570 thousand
    Chinese, not T-72 manufacturing plant
    Well? China generally built a tank factory in Pakistan (Al-Khalid) The reasons why the USSR and Russia do not supply weapons to Pakistan, I have repeatedly explained above, there is no need to repeat.
    Plus, the situation in the region is very unstable, and the strangest alliances are possible. At the same time, conflicts are possible with Cambodia, Laos and Vietnam - which, to hell, China can support.
    Another nonsense of a gray gelding named Kars. What conflicts with whom? With Cambodia, which does not have its own combat aircraft, in which the civil war has just recently ended, there are border conflicts, but no more; Laos with a 30th army with 35 tanks (10 T-34-85, 10 PT-76, 15 T-55) and also without the Air Force (for comparison, Thailand has a 200th army); or Myanmar, in which the civil war does not stop from the moment of its formation and in which constant military coups. I especially liked the thesis about the alliance of Cambodia with Vietnam, which had occupied it for 10 years (1978-1989). Or about the alliance of Vietnam with China, this is generally a song. Learn the map and equipment. Moreover, Vietnam has no land border with Thailand at all, and while the Thai fleet is at sea, it covers a Vietnamese sheep like a bull.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 15: 53 New
    -1
    Monarchy understand.
    Come on, just something I didn’t hear that the Queen of Great Britain used an aircraft carrier instead of a yacht, or about a Belgian or Dutch or Danish or Norwegian or Swedish king. True, all of these and aircraft carriers do not, however, they do not use warships as pleasure yachts.
    Cho so arguments ended? Or attentiveness appeared, I already called you a groove of twenty on, and you only got a bit ashamed of the clown.

    It’s not for you to judge the clown about logic, you are completely unfamiliar with her.
    Well, this is a matter of psychiatry. It looks like they went to the psychiatric hospital, or the sick Kars just escaped. Read Putin’s answer on a nearby branch. Well, and especially for you- PSHEL IS HISTORY !!!.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 16: 34 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Come on, just something I didn’t hear the Queen of Great Britain use an aircraft carrier instead of a yacht

    Well, you never know what you did not hear.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well this is a matter of psychiatry

    Yes, it's time for you to go to a psychiatrist.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    read Putin’s answer on a nearby branch.

    Personally Putin, to me personally? Send him from me to Croatia)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    u and especially for you- PSHEL WON HISTORY !!!.

    Well, why are you talking about yourself in the third person? Write to me, it’s interesting and fun.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 11: 08 New
    0
    Well, you never know what you did not hear.
    that is, there will be no answer. Let’s write it down: the next drain of the gray gelding named Kars
    Yes, it's time for you to go to a psychiatrist.
    After you, women and patients with disabilities, I usually skip ahead.
    Personally Putin, to me personally? Send him from me to Croatia)))
    Well, my friend, I see you have already begun to delusions of grandeur; look this way to the chamber with Napoleon, Alexander the Great and Hitler nearby.
    Well, why are you talking about yourself in the third person? Write to me, it’s interesting and fun.
    No, it’s just about YOU. However, I even began to like this circus with horses, or rather with a gray gelding named Kars
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 11: 49 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    that is, there will be no answer. Let’s write it down: the next drain of the gray gelding named Kar

    Something you lately like a parrot about the drain))) is hard to see. And the fact that you have a small horizons and you do not perceive the printed information is already clear.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    After you, women and patients with disabilities, I usually skip ahead.
    Since I will not let you go forward after such a thing, all the more so, everything progresses for you.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, my friend, I look at you already megalomania has begun

    It’s strange why I have it, you write that the answer for me is from Putin, and I ask again)) well, not a clown))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Roch I even began to like this circus with horses, more precisely with a gray gelding named Kars
    Then why are you hysterical and whimpering? Being a man - oh I forgot you latent fagot))
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 15: 58 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    In Iraq, they found WMD-bacteriological.

    And is there a link?
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Moreover, Iraq previously actively used chemical weapons in the war with Iran, and in 1988 in the war against the Kurds.

    Applied. But the reason for the war was a little different content.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    First, the DPRK imposed international sanctions, including arms embargo.

    You undertook to prove my case for me))))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . Secondly, rumors of the current famine in the DPRK are greatly exaggerated
    This conclusion is that you made Kim Jong In))))
    Also say that S. Korea refused food ___ type u have everything.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Third, more than 6 million people live in Thailand below the poverty line. This is 9,5% of the total number of Thais. Carriers of the AIDS virus or patients - 570 thousand

    So what? Can you also say that speedoids, if necessary, cannot be used as cannon fodder))))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well? China generally built a tank factory in Pakistan (Al-Khalid)

    And they build tanks with Ukrainian diesel engines.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The reasons for which the USSR and Russia do not supply weapons to Pakistan, I have repeatedly explained above, there is no need to repeat.
    You cannot explain something in principle, while your explanation will not change the fact of the construction of a plant in India,

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Another nonsense of a gray gelding named Kars.

    Well, nonsense for you, and in that regina there is a very tense military-political situation.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Moreover, Vietnam does not have a land border with Thailand at all, and while the Thai fleet is at sea, it covers a Vietnamese sheep like a bull.

    They wrote themselves - get ready for war, to have an advantage over neighbors is the guarantor of peace, here Thailand is arming itself. But you are so stupid that you do not understand it.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 16: 25 New
    -1
    And is there a link?

    Of course there is.
    500 chemical munitions were found in various parts of Iraq. Most of them have been found since March 2003, when the coalition forces launched a military operation in Iraq, according to a report by US intelligence agencies provided to the US government. The report was circulated by GOP members from the Republican Party. A statement was prepared in early April of this year, but intelligence information remained classified until yesterday ...
    ... During the fighting in the warehouses in various parts of Iraq, artillery shells filled with poisonous gases were discovered

    http://www.rbc.ua/rus/top/society/v_irake_nashli_oruzhie_massovogo_porazheniya__
    1150970603
    Reference to a Ukrainian source, in order to avoid accusations of bias.
    You undertook to prove my case for me))))
    . I don’t even think so. What is your point?
    So what? Can you also say that speedoids, if necessary, cannot be used as cannon fodder))))
    Trasvestites can also be used. And women make excellent snipers, but for some reason they are not called up to the army everywhere (except Israel).
    And they build tanks with Ukrainian diesel engines.
    Even with French, even Angolan, even from Papua New Guinea, it makes no difference to me.
    You cannot explain something in principle, while your explanation will not change the fact of the construction of a plant in India,
    Keep raving on. The USSR built a tank plant in India perfectly, now the T-90s are assembled there. Hindus are happy, Russia also supplying assembly kits for assembly. What's wrong?
    Well, nonsense for you, and in that regina there is a very tense military-political situation.
    Between whom and by whom? Between Vietnam and China, yes, there has been centuries-old enmity since the time of emperors. There is little tension between Cambodia and Thailand, but the Cambodians really understand their strength (the absence of the Air Force and Navy), so they do not rock the boat. And Indonesia and Malaysia have enough struggle with the Islamists. Moreover, Indonesia would have kept its own, in 1997, East Timor captured by it became independent, and now there is a problem with western Papua, where the Papuans are guerrilla.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 16: 30 New
    -1
    They wrote themselves - get ready for war, to have an advantage over neighbors is the guarantor of peace, here Thailand is arming itself. But you are so stupid that you do not understand it.
    And who says that it’s bad that Thailand is arming itself is his own business, especially if there is money, his neighbors also buy weapons, including and in Russia. Everything else is a question for your psychiatrist. See Putin’s answer on a nearby branch.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 17: 20 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    who says bad

    Therefore, you leaked the topic, it is typical for you to go in some direction, and then otmazvatsa.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 18: 00 New
    -1
    Therefore, you leaked the topic, it is typical for you to go in some direction, and then otmazvatsa.
    Drop dead, however, count as you want, as you know, they are not offended by the sick.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 18: 09 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    figuratively, however, count as you want, as you know, they are not offended by patients.

    So I'm not offended by you. Don’t worry.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 16: 32 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    500 chemical munitions found in different parts of Iraq. Most of them have been found since March 2003.

    Wow, wow. Now the invasion of Iraq has become legitimate, and why did the British experts end their lives))
    That's just you about bacteriological tales told.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I don’t even think so. What is your point?

    About a low place S. more likely in the rating of the sun.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Trasvestites can also be used. And women make excellent snipers, but for some reason they are not called up to the army everywhere (except Israel)

    Really? Do you know that women serve in the armed forces of many countries? Or do you need snipers? And it makes no difference to me whether or not a machine is transvestite in hand and forward.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The USSR built a tank plant in India perfectly, now the T-90 is assembled there.

    That is why the T-90 is assembled there. In India, in principle, there was no alternative.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Hindus are satisfied
    Not really, but they have nowhere to go.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Between whom and by whom?
    Yes, you can say between everyone, but you can’t understand this with your level of mental development.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 16: 55 New
    -1
    Wow, wow. Now the invasion of Iraq has become legitimate, and why did the British experts end their lives))
    That's just you about bacteriological tales told.

    Soldiers of the Dutch contingent in Iraq, stationed in the southeastern province of Al-Mutanna, found ten artillery shells that, according to the military, can be equipped with biological charges.

    http://www.gazeta.ru/2003/10/18/last101817.shtml

    So what they found, of course, not everything they wanted, but they did. For what purpose the British scientists committed suicide, you can ask them in the next world. Well, at the same time, what did 1650 Ukrainian troops do in Iraq (since August 2003; the main contingent was withdrawn in December 2005, the remainder in December 2008), of which 18 or more than 42 wounded were killed?
    About a low place S. more likely in the rating of the sun.
    So I am surprised. The DPRK has nuclear weapons, the army of millions has its own fairly well-developed arms production, and in all, at 28, it is lower than some of Thailand and Ukraine.
    Really? Do you know that women serve in the armed forces of many countries? Or do you need snipers? And it makes no difference to me whether or not a machine is transvestite in hand and forward.
    In the course, in the USA and fagots serve and what? But the official appeal is only in two countries (Israel and the DPRK). By the way, and you yourself have looked after your place with transvestites or fagots, personally, I would prefer with women, especially Ukrainian.
    That is why the T-90 is assembled there. In India, in principle, there was no alternative.
    The alternative is ALWAYS. Indians Mig-29 did not want to buy and smoked Rafal, did not want Mi-28 and Apache, etc. Just the T-90 Indians, like his predecessor T-72, are completely satisfied, that's why they constantly increase his purchases:
    In 2008, Indian Defense Minister D. Singh called the T-90 “the second deterrent after nuclear weapons” [57] in a conflict with Pakistan, which threatened to spill over into a large-scale nuclear war.
    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2-90
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 16: 58 New
    -1
    Yes, you can say between everyone, but you can’t understand this with your level of mental development.

    Continue to rave further, may let go. For the rest, see Putin’s answer on a nearby branch.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 17: 27 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    continue to rave on, maybe let go. For the rest, see Putin’s answer on a nearby branch.
    Personally to me? Putin))) Well, you're a clown.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 18: 03 New
    -1
    I repeat SPECIALLY for those who are in the tank, deaf, wretched and blind, as well as PERSONAL for Kars with the words of our president V.V. Putin
    This is a sign of weakness when opponents become rude, Putin said. Who calls names, that’s what they call
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 18: 08 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    in the words of our president V.V. Putin

    He is your president, let him give you brains (unless of course they are) and powder.
    And with stubborn donkeys and clowns it makes no sense to talk differently. They neither write logic, nor knowledge, sheer nonsense, they can’t even read their own links, but they are distinguished by excessive self-confidence.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 10: 31 New
    -1
    Again, the answer according to Putin is especially for hysterical "experts" with brains undermined by the protection of the "achievements" of the "Ukrainian military-industrial complex":
    This is a sign of weakness when opponents become rude, Putin said. Who calls names, that’s what they call
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 11: 13 New
    +1
    Quote: Kars
    He is your president, let him give you brains (unless of course they are) and powder.
    And with stubborn donkeys and clowns it makes no sense to talk differently. They neither write logic, nor knowledge, sheer nonsense, they can’t even read their own links, but they are distinguished by excessive self-confidence.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 17: 27 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    which, according to the military, can be equipped with biological charges.

    As many as ten sleepwalkers))) according to))) go walk the clown))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    . Well, at the same time, what did 1650 Ukrainian troops do in Iraq (since August 2003; the main contingent was withdrawn in December 2005, the remainder in December 2008), of which 18 and more than 42 wounded died?

    Nobody pulled them by force, all the contractors who passed competitive selection did what they did - they made money, got combat experience, and improved the country's image.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    So I am surprised. The DPRK has nuclear weapons, the army of millions has its own fairly well-developed arms production, and in all, at 28, it is lower than some of Thailand and Ukraine.
    Do not be lazy and look carefully - at least to whom I say - a clown who sees figs in his own links. And the fact that you are dumb is already clear.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    In the course, in the USA and fagots serve and what?
    Let them serve.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    By the way, and you yourself where you looked after your place with transvestites or fagots, I personally would prefer with women, especially Ukrainian.

    Nothing shines for you except fagots, but I personally am not going to join the army anymore.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    There is ALWAYS an alternative
    In tank matters, India would have been too expensive an alternative.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Just the Indians T-90, like his predecessor T-72, is completely satisfied, that's why they constantly increase his purchases:

    if they were completely satisfied, they would not torment Arjun and Arjun 2.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    2008 Indian Defense Minister D. Singh called the T-90 “the second deterrent after nuclear weapons”
    Well, at least not the first, and probably the Indian Air Force was offended by this))
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 10: 50 New
    -1
    As many as ten sleepwalkers))) according to))) go walk the clown))

    The next drain is protected.
    Nobody pulled them by force, all the contractors who passed competitive selection did what they did - they made money, got combat experience, and improved the country's image.
    The only pity is that the Iraqi partisans killed only 18 Ukrainian occupiers, it was necessary much more. However, these woeful warriors in Iraq became famous only for looting and cowardice. Here are the recollections of one of them:
    ... The next case was not so catastrophic in terms of the number of victims, but no less vile ... Despite the fact that all the personnel of the convoy, led by Walker (commander of the second platoon, usually the convoy commander) demanded immediate assistance to the allies , he acted like the last to ... To begin with, he tried to contact the headquarters for five minutes. Apparently, he hoped that the headquarters would not give permission for intervention. The Poles, seeing that such a mess, fit in, and the score in the battle goes for seconds, they rushed to the aid of their own. There is no connection, as usual, according to the law of meanness, but when he nevertheless phoned, the headquarters gave "go-ahead" to his great chagrin. Then he said:


    - According to the x-th your "good". You are there, and I am here. And I have to answer ...


    The battle ended without ours. The Poles lost two killed and two more wounded. Got to the local Arabs, who fell under the gap of a land mine. When ours passed through this place, they saw how the bodies of the dead were loaded onto cars. Following our Poles showed the middle finger. With this gesture in Babylon our convoys met for a long time. Returning to base, Walker sobbed like a child ...

    Source: http://novosti-n.mk.ua/ukraine_article/read/852.html

    received combat experience, improved the country's image

    There are many more memories.
    Four Ukrainian troops were expelled from Iraq. As the Rosbalt correspondent was informed in the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine, such a decision was made due to numerous violations of the charter. In particular, we are talking about the "low moral and psychological qualities" of the soldiers of the 81st tactical group of the Ukrainian Armed Forces in Iraq. Or rather, about the banal abuse of alcohol and sexual licentiousness.
    http://www.rosbalt.ru/2005/09/16/226656.html?#1752

    Well, what can we say which country is such and combat experience (cowardice) and image (looting) Haha. Write the clown ISCHO ...
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 11: 00 New
    -1
    Do not be lazy and look carefully - at least to whom I say - a clown who sees figs in his own links. And the fact that you are dumb is already clear.
    Everything is clear, again there are no arguments. The next drain is protected. You're not tired of draining the clown yet.
    Let them serve.
    Let them serve correctly, we must at the same time transfer this beneficial experience to the Ukrainian “army”, especially since a “gay parade” has already been held in Kiev.
    Nothing shines for you except fagots, but I personally am not going to join the army anymore.
    To us, in the army of Russia, homosexuals are OFFICIALLY not called upon. Or drain again?
    In tank matters, India would have been too expensive an alternative.

    Not more expensive than SSBN "Arikhant", multipurpose fighters, which they have been building for the last 30 years and their own aircraft carrier.
    if they were completely satisfied, they would not torment Arjun and Arjun 2.
    Indians torment a lot of things. See the list above.
    Well, at least not the first, and probably the Indian Air Force was offended by this))
    Everything is clear again, there are no arguments, continue to merge further. Listen Kars, it’s not interesting to talk to you anymore. Drain by drain. Would you at least have prepared for the next solo performance. Come on pull up "expert" make me laugh yet ...
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 11: 22 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Everything is clear, again there are no arguments. The next drain is protected. You're not tired of draining the clown yet.

    What is the argument? That you brought Jens and at the same time proved it without reading it)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Let them serve correctly, we must at the same time transfer this beneficial experience to the Ukrainian "army", especially since the "gay parade" in Kiev has already been held
    Are you also a latent fagot? That you are so interested in homosuxealism, you follow the game parades)) I didn’t even know about this in Kiev))) fagot and Ukrainophobe - you’re getting wider and wider.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    more expensive than SSBN "Arikhant", multipurpose fighters, which they have been building for the last 30 years and their own aircraft carrier

    Again, the rule of logic rule)) may not be more expensive, but then some of the money transferred would not be enough))) or the rate of income would slow down - but to whom I will explain the hidden homosexual without intelligence and logic.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Indians torment a lot of things. See the list above.
    They want to get away from unreliable exporters that they didn’t deploy their own helicopter program as the Apaches bought it.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Listen Kars, it’s not interesting to talk to you anymore. Drain after drain
    Of course, for you it’s a plum, sticking your faces into your messy poke.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 12: 41 New
    -1
    What is the argument? That you brought Jens and at the same time proved it without reading it)))

    The list of your plums is already so big:
    contract with Cyprus
    Iraq, Sudan, ignorance of the Asia-Pacific region (I simply didn’t even bother to look at the map).
    What your constant tantrums testify to.
    Are you also a latent fagot? That you are so interested in homosuxealism, you follow the game parades)) I didn’t even know about this in Kiev))) fagot and Ukrainophobe - you’re getting wider and wider.
    Sick, I'm watching you about sore, about the ass. Do not worry, the orderly will inject you a sedative. And to find out about the gay pride parades of Kiev, it’s enough to read Ukrainian forums and watch the news.
    Again, the rule of logic rule)) may not be more expensive, but then some of the money transferred would not be enough))) or the rate of income would slow down - but to whom I will explain the hidden homosexual without intelligence and logic.
    Oh pedrilka I see you perked up hearing your native words- "homosexuality". In short, for the fagot from Zaporozhye I explain that the Indians want to be a self-sufficient state, that's why they build SSBNs, combat aircraft, tanks, and other wunderwaffles, they have money for this. Here are just a little experience.
    They want to get away from unreliable exporters that they didn’t deploy their own helicopter program as the Apaches bought it.

    Hindus, therefore, produce their Chetak and Chitah helicopters under a French license and Dhruv of their own design, and also develop their own HAL LCH combat helicopter. Only experience is not enough.
    HAL LCH - Indian attack helicopter developed by HAL, designed for high-altitude applications.
    The development of the helicopter was launched in 2006. The first flight took place in March 2010. It is developed by the Indian national company HAL since 2006. Some of the technologies used in it have already been tested on another Indian helicopter - Dhruv. LCH certification will be completed according to the plans of the company by 2012-2013, and the delivery of the first aircraft to the Indian Air Force is expected in 2014-2015.

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_LCH
    So the cockerel, I repeat, teach you the materiel again!
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 12: 44 New
    0
    Of course, for you it’s a plum, sticking your faces into your messy poke.

    Who is poking. Are you? So you didn’t answer one question, you didn’t answer so clearly. Only continuous tantrums and stupid insults as in the Kindergarten.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 12: 49 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Who is poking. Are you?

    I, many times poked you hysterical latent homosexual. And the picture shows that you often say that)))
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 13: 57 New
    -1
    Where in your wet dreams or during your next rambling ravings. Stray further. "Halva, halva, halva, no matter how you say it, your mouth will still not be sweeter"
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 13: 59 New
    +1
    C'mon, do not waste your time, do not get distracted from tracking gay parades.))
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 12: 46 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The list of your plums is already so big:
    contract with Cyprus
    Iraq, Sudan, ignorance of the Asia-Pacific region (I simply didn’t even bother to look at the map).
    What your constant tantrums testify to.

    In addition to the controversial Cyprus, you were everywhere in flight, with such failures of logic and knowledge that it is possible that you graduated from school.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    to learn about gay pride parades in Kiev, it’s enough to read Ukrainian forums

    C'mon, it’s clear that you are closely watching homosexuals by your comrades))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    People want to be a self-sufficient state, and therefore they build SSBNs, combat aircraft, tanks, and other wunderwaffles, money and
    another jump from a topic that shows that the klokn has falsified himself mentioning the cost of the war projects of India in the context of the uncontested acceptance of the T-90

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    HAL LCH

    Here, a fagot knocked me out - in helicopters I’m not very. But this is more likely an exception to the rule.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 14: 02 New
    0
    In addition to the controversial Cyprus, you were everywhere in flight, with such failures of logic and knowledge that it is possible that you graduated from school.
    Go learn the globe of Ukraine. Some dangerous neighbors of Thailand, China and Vietnam and the Paracel Islands are worth a lot.
    C'mon, it’s clear that you are closely watching homosexuals by your comrades))
    Yes, I have long been watching on this site one funny fagot under the nickname Kars.
    another jump from a topic that shows that the klokn has falsified himself mentioning the cost of the war projects of India in the context of the uncontested acceptance of the T-90
    Come on! Made laugh.
    Here, a fagot knocked me out - in helicopters I’m not very. But this is more likely an exception to the rule.
    Don’t worry so much about a cockerel, your lover will come soon, he will calm you down. In the meantime, better train the materiel.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 14: 07 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Go learn the globe of Ukraine. Some dangerous neighbors of Thailand, China and Vietnam and the Paracel Islands are worth a lot.

    Well, you are unfamiliar with geopolitics, so you only have a globe that you like to pull on (though I’m not an owl along the way)))

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    and I have long been watching on this site one funny fagot under the nickname Kars.

    Well, I admitted it, only now I’m loosening you up, I’m not homosexual like you - but I don’t dance your ass, stick it there whatever you want.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Come on! Made laugh.
    The fact that India did not have an alternative to the T-90? Laugh.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    In the meantime, better train up the materiel.
    Helicopters are not interesting to me.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 11: 16 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Another drain protected

    What else can I take from you)) you have neither the mind nor the logic. We found as many 10 shells)) I suppose there are still expired
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    However, these woeful warriors in Iraq became famous only for looting and cowardice.
    It’s not bad either. You want to live be able to go around.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, what can we say which country is such and combat experience (cowardice) and image (looting) Haha. Write a clown ISCHO
    Well, you can always find negative, it pleases that when you were looking for it, you had to suffer. And to write - of course I will still write that you would continue to have hysteria.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 12: 50 New
    -1
    What else can I take from you)) you have neither the mind nor the logic. We found as many 10 shells)) I suppose there are still expired
    Found, and chemical already 500. So continue to merge further.
    It’s not bad either. You want to live be able to go around.

    Similarly, "Sala Heroam! Hero sala!" or "Sala to Heroes, death to cottage cheese!". But seriously, on the topic you seem to have nothing to say. That is, you agree with the looting and cowardice of the Ukrainian “army” in Iraq.
    Well, you can always find negative, it pleases that when you were looking for it, you had to suffer. And to write - of course I will still write that you would continue to have hysteria.
    Write ISCHO ... The only pity is the time that a fool breaks out on you from communicating with normal people.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 12: 56 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    they’ve gone, and the chemical ones are already 500. So keep merging further.

    It's not funny. But of course you will justify US aggression against Iraq for 10 shells with Biologists and 500 with chemical ones. Then why are you Ukrainian. Contingent call aggressors))) well, you homosexual clone crazy and logic.


    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Similarly, "Sala Heroam! Hero sala!" or "Sala to Heroes, death to cottage cheese!

    And more fat, and not like your toilets in Georgia, pi ..did)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    That is, you agree with the looting and cowardice of the Ukrainian “army” in Iraq.
    I don’t give a damn about him.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Write ISCO ..

    I will write.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The only pity is the time that comes off
    yes unlike))
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 14: 16 New
    -1
    It's not funny. But of course you will justify US aggression against Iraq for 10 shells with Biologists and 500 with chemical ones. Then why are you Ukrainian. Contingent call aggressors))) well, you homosexual clone crazy and logic.
    I do not justify the aggression of Iraq. You asked me if you found a chemical or bacteriological weapon in Iraq? I answered you and gave links. But Ukradina sent her occupying contingent to Iraq, 18 occupiers from which returned “with a load of 200”, and 42 “with a load of 300”. From greater losses he was saved by cowardice and looting, well, they didn’t have time for military operations, and if they took place somewhere, the "ukro-warriors" cowardly hid, which they themselves honestly write in their memoirs.
    And more fat, and not like your toilets in Georgia, pi ..did)))
    Wow, we’ll write that in Georgia, with minimal losses in 5 days, we dispersed an army prepared according to NATO standards, armed with and Ukraine (that it was not her embargo on arms deliveries to Georgia) and with the Ural defense calculations, some of which were brought in a zinc wrap mattress "Dallas". Well, about the toilet, you seem to have moved from homosexual, to another favorite of his "anal-fecal" topic. however they are interconnected. By the way, do not enlighten that p ... and (in your expression) Ukrainians in Iraq, maybe there were toilet bowls.
    I don’t give a damn about him.
    Especially 18 dead and 42 disabled people, they are especially normal. The lads did not take away the smell of tobacco. Earth they rest in peace! Still, their Slavs.
    I will write.

    Write-write, I’m your scribble tonight, I want to show my medical neighbor, let him diagnose you.
    yes unlike))
    Just like you perceive leaving or blacklisting as your victory. Do I need it? Yes, and you laugh too much fun. there is something to laugh at ... You don’t even need to go to the circus.
  • Kars
    Kars 21 August 2013 14: 29 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Once I do not condone the aggression of Iraq. You asked me if you found a chemical or bacteriological weapon in Iraq? I answered you and gave links.


    The fact that they found it is funny, but you are not able to understand it. The mind is not enough.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    cancer occupation contingent, 18 of the occupiers from which returned "200 cargo", and 42 "300 cargo".
    Maybe then they will send it to Syria, it would be nice. In Mali, it’s also interesting.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    and with air defense calculations, some of which I brought in a zinc wrap mattress "Dallas

    And you certainly have evidence)) even though your lies are already expected.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Well, about the toilet, you seem to have moved from homosexual, to another one of his "anal-fecal

    Why mine? I didn’t know about this until you talked about your fetishes right now)) And the fact that they stole the san faynes cannot be taken from yours in Georgia.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Especially 18 dead and 42 disabled people, they are especially normal.

    Dies more on the roads. And they are volunteers.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Write-write, I’m your scribble tonight, I want to show my medical neighbor, let him diagnose you.

    Well, why are you so disguised as you would say, I will show .. to my attending physician ..
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    rsto people like you perceive leaving or blacklisting as your victories

    Well, for starters, you don’t know how to read as usual. I put them on the black list,
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And I need it
    and what do you need a homo clown for? apart from the distribution of chernukha about the military-industrial complex of Ukraine? By the way, why is it still not present on the article about Motor Sich? didn’t you get anything black?
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 14: 54 New
    -1
    The fact that they found it is funny, but you are not able to understand it. The mind is not enough.
    Maybe then they will send it to Syria, it would be nice. In Mali, it’s also interesting.
    Aren't you the “military” in the forefront going! Write ISCHO rambo room.
    And you certainly have evidence)) even though your lies are already expected.
    See the film by Arkady Mamontov, "Friend or Foe" is called. everything is clearly described there.
    The attack on Tskhinvali was carried out by 270 Ukrainian military, 10-15 of them were killed ... According to accurate data, 20 Americans were killed during the fighting, who were gathered in the combat zone, loaded into an American ship in plastic black bags, and 10 -15 killed Ukrainians (there is no exact figure). The ship unloaded containers with the corpses of Ukrainians at one of the Ukrainian ports at night, and departed for Naples, from where the Americans were sent to the United States.

    http://archive.censor.net.ua/go/offer/ResourceID/112269.html

    I have enough intelligence, unlike some self-appointed "experts", and I would be surprised if they had not been found, they didn’t climb for that. Well, and how does this affect the fact of the deployment of the Ukrainian occupation forces to Iraq. That Nenko fell under the mattress covers, won France and Germany did not lay down troops did not give.
    Why mine? I didn’t know about this until you talked about your fetishes right now)) And the fact that they stole the san faynes cannot be taken from yours in Georgia.
    Yours, you first started her. And as for the toilets in Georgia: "What is your evidence?" Another attempt by Georgians to whitewash their image and the fact of defeat.
    Dies more on the roads. And they are volunteers.
    Hey, you tell their mothers, families and friends about this, just quietly, and run away quickly, otherwise you will be caught and you know how they taunt them for such words.
    Well, why are you so disguised as you would say, I will show .. to my attending physician ..
    Write ISCHO ... You're just funny.
    Well, for starters, you don’t know how to read as usual. I put them on the black list,
    Congratulations on your “well-deserved victory," but my black list is empty, even you moron is not there.
    and what do you need a homo clown for? apart from the distribution of chernukha about the military-industrial complex of Ukraine? By the way, why is it still not present on the article about Motor Sich? didn’t you get anything black?
    At the moment I am joking over a certain funny cock under the nickname Kars, telling about his unconventional sexual orientation. And they don’t lay out normal topics about Ukraine, because I’m answering you a worried nerd the next day, and there’s no time even to communicate with normal people on the site.
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 18: 23 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Therefore, I consider you an ordinary hysterical

    Your personal problems. In this case, YOU are trying so hard to refute me)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    and here’s a photo of the BOD SF Severodvinsk, also in the port of Novorossiysk, which will accompany him.

    So what? Did you prove that he doesn’t carry air? The fact that they go there here is a well-known fact.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    www.un.org/disarmament/convarms/Register)

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    and to page number 7
    But the fact that the contract was successfully completed is not referenced. And it’s not even the fact that something went and was not announced. But by the way, it’s not very important - it’s still T-80
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 21: 04 New
    0
    Your personal problems. In this case, YOU are trying so hard to refute me)))
    I can say the same about you.
    So what? Did you prove that he doesn’t carry air? The fact that they go there here is a well-known fact.
    That is, they just go back and forth, especially under the guise of warships. Well, here is another photo that they carry

    S-300PMU2 "Favorite". In the camouflage of the Syrian desert "? With a radar 96L6E" color of sand "RZS S-400" Triumph "? Photographed June 23, 2013. Shooting time 18-05. On the stage near Novorossiysk.
    But the fact that the contract was successfully completed is not referenced. And it’s not even the fact that something went and was not announced. But by the way, it’s not very important - it’s still T-80
    Come on. At first you claimed this
    Cyprus is yes, 96 years old, and until now the contact has not been fulfilled, which says a lot.
    . Then they gave a link to the Russian Wikipedia, which indicated that Cyprus had 2012 T-68Us for 80, and when I indicated that according to the English and Spanish Wikipedias, 82, that the Russian was more worthy of trust. Well, according to the Russian Wikipedia, in 2009 a contract was signed for the delivery of another 41 T-80Us, 27 were delivered in 2010, 14 remain, the data on their delivery is given in the registry for 2011 provided by Russia to the UN, 41 are obtained. There are questions ? Here is the link for you:
    Russia submitted to the UN Register a report for 2011 on the supply of conventional weapons. Below is material on the categories of “battle tanks” and “armored combat vehicles”.

    In the “battle tanks” category, 35 MBTs were declared to be delivered to Venezuela, 14 to Cyprus and 44 to Uganda.

    Thus, Russia completed the delivery of 41 T-80U / UK tanks to Cyprus, the contract for the purchase of which cost $ 156 million for the National Guard was concluded with the Ministry of Defense of Cyprus in 2009. Of these, according to the report, in 2010 27 MBT were delivered. The remaining 14 cars, most likely, were transferred at the beginning of 2011.
    http://vpk.name news/86119_rossiya_predstavila_v_registr_oon_otchet_po_post

    avkam_obyichnyih_vooruzhenii_za_2011_god.html
    . And where does the T-80?
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 21: 34 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I can say the same about you.

    This is also your problem.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    3 June 2013. Shooting time is 18-05. on the stage near Novorossiysk.

    Here in Syria, show him then we'll talk, and show that they drove before THIS. In 2012 year.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Any questions? Here is a link for you
    Why is it taking so long? Does UVZ put sticks in wheels? Cyprus and T-80 surfaced with us about lobbying for UVZ deliveries to the foreign market of other tanks except the T-72 / 90 in light of the re-melting of the Russian T-62 and T-64

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    apparently, were transferred at the beginning of the 2011 year.

    And the words .. Apparently .. very inspire confidence.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 19 August 2013 22: 50 New
    -1
    This is also your problem.
    No, this is already your problem.
    Here in Syria, show him then we'll talk, and show that they drove before THIS. In 2012 year.
    I don’t have any sources either in the GRU or in the General Staff, and what they drove is that the Basmachis see and feel in their own skin, and the Israelis, I hope, will soon feel it.
    Why is it taking so long? Does UVZ put sticks in wheels? Cyprus and T-80 surfaced with us about lobbying for UVZ deliveries to the foreign market of other tanks except the T-72 / 90 in light of the re-melting of the Russian T-62 and T-64
    The contract was concluded for 2 (TWO) years from 2009 to 2011. and he was executed on time. There were no claims from Cyprus. Tanks in Cyprus, which is confirmed by the 2011 report on the supply of conventional weapons provided by Russia to the UN Register. The last T-62s were withdrawn from service in 2011, having managed to fight in the first and second Chechen companies and in Georgia in 2008. 2500 T-62s were in storage for 2012, of which 900 should be disposed of this year. And I can say about the T-64 that they were not used in any military company (Chechnya, Georgia), such a good tank can be seen.
    And the words .. Apparently .. very inspire confidence.
    Well, they were transferred later, nevertheless they were transferred, about which there are OFFICIAL documents confirming the fact of transfer. Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
  • Kars
    Kars 19 August 2013 22: 58 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    No, this is already your problem.

    It's not a problem for me.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I don’t have any sources either in the GRU or in the General Staff, and what they brought was that the Basmachis see and feel in their own skin, and the Israelis, I hope, will soon feel it.

    Again, a stupid failure in logic. If the militants see this, then they take it off, grab it as trophies and everyone will know about it. But there were no reports from Syria. Unless the used Kalashkovs and cartridges carry it - even in Syria this good that shoe polish.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The contract was concluded for 2 (TWO) years from 2009 to 2011. and he was executed on time. There were no claims from Cyprus.

    The one who exposes the RF claim. And used T-80 for two years - less than fifty))))))))))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    The last T-62s were withdrawn from service in the 2011 year, having managed to fight in the first and second Chechen companies and in Georgia in the 2008 year. 2500 T-62 was in storage for 2012 year, of which 900 should be disposed of this year. And I can say about the T-64 that they were not used in any military company (Chechnya, Georgia), such a good tank can be seen.
    Why did you write this? You were asked about this? You were not asked - But you were told that at least these 900 utilized T-62s did not get into Syria, and moreover they were not sold to third countries, bringing profit to the treasury of the Russian Federation.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?

    It is not excluded.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 09: 21 New
    +1
    It's not a problem for me.
    Moreover, I do not pay attention to insects like you trying to spoil the wicked thing.
    Again, a stupid failure in logic. If the militants see this, then they take it off, grab it as trophies and everyone will know about it. But there were no reports from Syria. Unless the used Kalashkovs and cartridges carry it - even in Syria this good that shoe polish.
    I explain to those who are in the tank that the Syrian tanks are still fighting the great merit of Russia. At the same time, tell us from which ceiling you took such information:
    Unless the used Kalashkovs and cartridges carry - even in Syria this good that shoe polish.
    . Another nonsense, in an attempt to make excuses ?.
    The one who exposes the RF claim. And used T-80 for two years - less than fifty))))))))))
    Taki da Algeria put up and refused to accept the MiG-29SMT and received in exchange for the Su-30MKA, and that, and nothing, some sat down, some lost their comfortable chairs. MiG-29SMT with French avionics entered service with the Russian Air Force. Everyone is happy. By the way, how are we supplying BTR-4 to Iraq? Something I do not see them in service with the ZSU.
    Why did you write this? You were asked about this? You were not asked - But you were told that at least these 900 utilized T-62s did not get into Syria, and moreover they were not sold to third countries, bringing profit to the treasury of the Russian Federation.
    Moreover, the worn-out T-62s, which have exhausted their resources, are not needed by anyone in the world, and Russia is preserving its reputation as a reliable partner and will not sell the inheritance of the former USSR at dumping prices, like "non-stop" ones. Therefore, Russia is trying to sell the T-90 and T-72 produced at UVZ, hoping to subsequently receive a contract for their modernization, rather than tanks, the last of which was released, already back in 1975 (like the T-62) At the same time, explain and Syria asked for the delivery of her T-62? So they have about 1000, especially since the main burden of the fighting by the Syrian army is carried by the T-72. Or again just like that, fart in a puddle?
    It is not excluded.
    "And Baba Yaga is against!" Well, what can I say, only one is healed.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 11: 16 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Moreover, I do not pay attention

    According to your hysteria, you can see.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    I explain to those who are in the tank that the Syrian tanks are still fighting the great merit of Russia.

    Yes, rather the USSR, and Chinese spare parts.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    At the same time, tell us from which ceiling you took such information:

    What information? It was you who were crucified that the BDK was taking SOMETHING to Syria)) and then you turned out to be in the GRU no contacts.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Another nonsense, in an attempt to make excuses ?.
    What is the excuse for?

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Taki da Algeria put up and refused to accept the MiG-29СМТ and received in exchange for the Su-30МКА
    These are rarities, exceptions to the rules can be said. Yes, Cyprus just didn’t need to get the T-80 instead of T-90, as the UVZ lobby calculated.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Moreover, the worn-out T-62, which have exhausted their resources, do not need anyone in the world

    In Afghanistan, T-62 are still fighting. In Syria, they are still fighting. And the state of deterioration is very debatable, many T-62 tanks were in storage. So again, the failure of your logic)))
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Therefore, Russia is trying to sell T-90 and T-72 produced at UVZ

    And the Syrians are already lacking in armored vehicles. And this is exactly what UVZ is trying to do, which would only take it, and the money in the state budget of the Russian Federation is ten.
    And deliveries of T-62 will not do any harm to the image of the Russian Federation - used tanks they are used tanks.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    They have them so about 1000

    Bylo, it was - 2 years ago.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    the fierce fighting of the Syrian army are carried by the T-72

    Yes, of course, everything that can ride is at war there.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 11: 41 New
    0
    According to your hysteria, you can see.
    Continue to hysteria and be called "expert" you ours, can let go.
    What information? It was you who were crucified that the BDK was taking SOMETHING to Syria)) and then you turned out to be in the GRU no contacts.
    And I still say that the BDK is bringing SOMETHING to Syria, which I cannot specifically name. But no one empty ships, but under the guard will not drive. Does he know extra money?
    These are rarities, exceptions to the rules can be said. Yes, Cyprus just didn’t need to get the T-80 instead of T-90, as the UVZ lobby calculated.
    Rarity, not rarity, but this is a fact, instead of the MiG-29, Algeria received the Su-30. Keep your next delusional conclusions about the T-90 and the "UVZ lobby". Who pays, in this particular case, Cyprus, he orders the music. Already corny, vulgar and uninteresting.
    In Afghanistan, T-62 are still fighting. In Syria, they are still fighting. And the state of deterioration is very controversial, many T-62 tanks were in storage. So again, the failure of your logic)))
    What is the failure of logic? That Russia is getting rid of obsolete tanks left over from the USSR, replacing them with more modern models. So in warehouses, so and "Maxims" and PPSh and PPS and even steam locomotives are available. And what from this? Moreover, Ukraine is doing the same. and somewhere still T-34-85 drive and even fight.
    And the Syrians are already lacking in armored vehicles. And this is exactly what UVZ is trying to do, which would only take it, and the money in the state budget of the Russian Federation is ten.
    And deliveries of T-62 will not do any harm to the image of the Russian Federation - used tanks they are used tanks.
    About the lack of technology in Syria have you been informed from the Syrian General Staff? Another inference. However, the Syrians OFFICIALLY did not turn to Russia for supplies of tanks. Turn to see.
    Bylo, it was - 2 years ago.
    Given the fact that the Basmachi have only a few tanks, and even those captured from the government forces, there are still enough tanks there. So far, the loss of about 400 T-72 out of 1100 has been confirmed, and the total losses of BTTs were about 1000 units.
    Yes, of course, everything that can ride is at war there.
    It was also used in Chechnya, all kinds of exotic types PT-76, D-44, M-30 and ZPU-4, nevertheless, the "super-duper modern" T-64 tank did not reach it. In war they always use everything at hand.
  • Kars
    Kars 20 August 2013 11: 52 New
    +1
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Continue to hysteria and be called "expert" you ours, can let go.

    Well, I’m far from your tantrum.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    And I still say that the BDK is bringing SOMETHING to Syria, which I cannot specifically name.

    And I say that they take air. And the whole war is proof of this. Where modern weapons from the Russian Federation, even new DZ blocks for Syrian tanks are not visible. Like there are not many among the trophies. And on the fake about the presence of C-300, even Assad caught.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Who pays, in this particular case, Cyprus, he orders the music. Already corny, gone and uninteresting

    Well, well, they ordered music for three years, a couple of dozen used tanks could not get.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    That Russia is getting rid of obsolete tanks left over from the USSR, replacing them with more modern models
    This is not even a failure of logic, but stupid jumping))) Moreover, the deliverance of Russia from old tanks, to your words that nobody needs T-62 and is not operational.

    Quote: smiths xnumx
    About the lack of technology in Syria have you been informed from the Syrian General Staff?

    this can be seen with a naked eye, and confirmation that the war is still going on.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    However, the Syrians OFFICIALLY did not turn to Russia for supplies of tanks. Turn to see

    Well of course. You have already been approached for C-300, and have already boasted of availability.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Given the fact that the Basmachi tanks have a few units, and even those captured from government troops,

    Yes, not just a few units but dozens.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    So far, the loss of about 400 T-72 from 1100 has been confirmed, and the total losses of BTTs were about 1000 units.

    This data is at least a year old, and spare parts that the Russian Federation sent arrested Fina.
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    It was also used in Chechnya, all kinds of exotic types PT-76, D-44, M-30 and ZPU-4, nevertheless the “super-duper modern” T-64 tank did not reach it. In war, always use everything at hand

    Well, the T-64 wasn’t very close at hand.
  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 20 August 2013 12: 53 New
    0
    Well, I’m far from your tantrum.
    Where can I get to the annoying insect, nicknamed "eksperd", which runs after me like a dog with a tin on its tail, on all branches, so that I once again dunked its face into his own "thoughts".
    And I say that they carry air. And the whole proof is the war. Where modern weapons from the Russian Federation, even new DZ blocks for Syrian tanks are not visible. Like there are not many among the trophies. And on the fake about the presence of the S-300 even Assad caught
    . "Blessed is he who believes." Go on.
    Quote: Kars
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    Will you blame the government of the Russian Federation for providing a false report to the UN?
    It is not excluded.

    Well, well, they ordered music for three years, a couple of dozen used tanks could not get.
    Not three, but two (2009-2011), once again I remind the report dated 2011.
    This is not even a failure of logic, but stupid jumping))) Moreover, the deliverance of Russia from old tanks, to your words that nobody needs T-62 and is not operational.
    Would find a buyer to sell. Rossi these old T-62 and T-64, as unnecessary trash are not needed. T-64, so no one needs it at all.
    this can be seen with a naked eye, and confirmation that the war is still going on.
    Well, of course, an eye-diamond. The war continues not because the legitimate government of Syria does not have enough tanks, but because someone (the USA, Great Britain, S. Arabia, Qatar, etc.) is carefully fomenting it by sending weapons and armed fanatics to the Basmachis.
    Well of course. You have already been approached for C-300, and have already boasted of availability.
    They have not yet requested tanks. For the rest, wait and see. There are at least 3 more BDKs who have gone to Syria. They will find out with what.
    Yes, not just a few units but dozens.
    Anyway, a little, much less than the government troops.
    This data is at least a year old, and spare parts that the Russian Federation sent arrested Fina.
    No, they’re just the latest data from your favorite Tarasenko
    http://andrei-bt.livejournal.com/233448.html

    Well, the T-64 wasn’t very close at hand.
    Come on, as many as 2 (TWO THOUSAND THREE FIFTY), according to Wikipedia
    Russia:
    Ground forces of Russia - 2000 T-64A and T-64B (BV) in storage, as of 2012 [14]. After the development of the resource, they are gradually withdrawn from service and disposed of [15]
    Coastal troops of the Russian Navy - 350 T-64, as of 2012

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2-64
  • Mestny
    Mestny 16 August 2013 12: 36 New
    +3
    Quote: Kars

    Well, the Leningrad Tank Plant does not boast of this

    LenIngradsky. Lenin.
    There are many different plants in Russia. And there is something to brag about.
    1. Kars
      Kars 16 August 2013 13: 07 New
      +1
      Quote: Mestny
      There are many different plants in Russia. And there is something to brag about.

      Tank? There were three — but the great, huge, successful, etc., and the RF of the RF gave two praises, and one was able to produce about half a ton of tanks for the RF army in 20 years, will you compare it with the USSR? Or admit that the USSR defense industry was too huge , and could not be fully preserved after the collapse of the USSR and the end of the Cold War.
      1. Rider
        Rider 16 August 2013 14: 01 New
        +9
        Quote: Kars
        two were favored, and one was able to release about 20 years for the Russian army half carcasses of tanks


        and also exported more than one and a half thousand pieces, and pulled the modernization 72x.

        and your efforts to beat over half carcass tankof broken up on reinforced concrete monolith 10 (in words) - TEN OPPOSITIONS for the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

        since you’re going to take it, then do it correctly.
        1. Kars
          Kars 16 August 2013 14: 51 New
          +1
          Quote: Rider
          and also for export more than one and a half thousand pieces

          And how much oil and gas was exported? And so?
          Quote: Rider
          your attempts to hitchhike over half carcasses of a tank tank are broken on a reinforced concrete monolith 10 (in words) - TEN OPPOSITIONS for the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

          Well, you compared the peaceful, non-aligned Ukraine. And the great Russia, the geopolitical pole and the leading player in world politics
          Quote: Rider
          since you’re going to take it, then do it correctly.

          So start with yourself, maybe we will blame Ukraine for not having 5th generation fighters?
          1. Rider
            Rider 16 August 2013 15: 32 New
            +5
            Quote: Kars
            And how much oil and gas was exported? And so?


            and the fact that your calculations are extremely (so to say) one-sided.

            since you started to count (or give an example), then do it correctly.
            and not juggling.
            and then according to your own patterns, you can say that TOTAL 10 NEW tanks were put into the arsenal of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

            and for 5 generations, that's right.
            lope there NEW aircraft delivered to the glorious Air Force of Ukraine?
            1. Kars
              Kars 16 August 2013 15: 39 New
              +1
              Quote: Rider
              and the fact that your calculations are extremely (so to say) one-sided.

              But is it nothing that the countries are fundamentally different? And if for Ukraine 10 new tanks is a LOT, and, in principle, more than, up to 500 for the Russian Federation is extremely small.
              Quote: Rider
              and for 5 generations, that's right.
              lope there NEW aircraft delivered to the glorious Air Force of Ukraine?

              and why?
              1. Rider
                Rider 16 August 2013 16: 22 New
                +4
                Quote: Kars
                But nothing that the countries are fundamentally different?


                that's exactly what is different.
                therefore, build phrases CORRECTLY.
                But how to calculate according to YOUR method, I have already shown.

                Quote: Kars
                and why?


                and really - why.
                1. Kars
                  Kars 16 August 2013 16: 39 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Rider
                  therefore, build phrases CORRECTLY.

                  Quote: Kars
                  The Russian Federation has been favored by two, and one in 20 years has been able to produce about half the tanks for the Russian army, you will compare it with the USSR

                  what’s not correct? The Russian Federation considers itself the heir to the USSR - and a great power, with a pole of power.
                  Quote: Rider
                  and really - why.

                  Romanians fly on MiG-21 - they are trying to buy 20 F-12 b / y for the 16th year
                  1. Rider
                    Rider 16 August 2013 17: 30 New
                    +6
                    KAAAAARRSSSS!
                    you just make me happy!

                    and so on your first ... uh pearl.

                    The Russian Federation considers itself the heir to the USSR - and a great power by the pole of power.

                    really believes, and the Air Force is pulling up the fleet.
                    and swung at Armata.
                    and radar introduces one after another.
                    and owns the VETO right in the UN Security Council.
                    but Nenko recently positioned herself as a second France.
                    I understand that this dream is over, since you began to equate yourself with Romania?

                    with which I congratulate you.

                    and by the way, proud of the fact that they buy BU equipment, it's like beee ...

                    (I’m just curious, but nafihaa, Romanians fighters, they recently sawed a rare armored train (the pride of the nation))?

                    here you have recently been offered to dispose of surplus tanks.
                    1. Kars
                      Kars 16 August 2013 20: 39 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Rider
                      really believes, and the Air Force is pulling up the fleet.
                      and swung at Armata

                      So these are THEIR problems. But this does not change the facts that I described.
                      Quote: Rider
                      Nenko recently positioned herself as a second France.
                      I understand that this dream is over, since you began to equate yourself with Romania?

                      Ukraine and France have common borders? And territorial disputes? Did not know. Can I compare with the USA?
                      Quote: Rider
                      and by the way, it’s proud that they buy BU equipment, it’s like beee
                      And here pride. This is a given. Ukraine does not need more. Can we build an aircraft carrier so that you would not be ashamed of us?

                      Quote: Rider
                      here you have recently been offered to dispose of surplus tanks
                      Well, while this is not confirmed, there are more tanks in Ukraine than in France, for sure.
                      1. Rider
                        Rider 16 August 2013 22: 06 New
                        +4
                        Quote: Kars
                        But this does not change the facts that I described.


                        it cancels your naughtyness, and not all of the above.
                        Quote: Kars
                        Ukraine and France have common borders? And territorial disputes? Did not know. Can I compare with the USA?

                        Yes, at least you compare with Australia.
                        it was simply stated that Ukraine = France (second)
                        where does the border and territorial disputes, but I do not understand.
                        and now you give Romania as an example.
                        Well, maybe she’s your equal now.

                        and on tanks - we’ll survive.
                      2. Kars
                        Kars 16 August 2013 22: 25 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Rider
                        it cancels your naughtyness, and not all of the above.

                        Discussion does not cancel. T-90 made for the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation about 500 and not the best configuration.
                        Quote: Rider
                        it was simply stated that Ukraine = France (second)

                        And therefore, the armed forces need to be compared with her, and not a fierce opponent)))) you have wild logic.
                        Quote: Rider
                        where does the border and territorial disputes, but I do not understand.
                        This is natural, but you have to fuss, but they don’t give you. Therefore, you pretend that you do not understand, although it is quite possible that you have too good an opinion of yourself.

                        Quote: Rider
                        and now you give Romania as an example.
                        For starters, I personally didn’t bring France anywhere. And specify Ukraine = France in everything?

                        Quote: Rider
                        and on tanks - we’ll live
                        Why so hesitant?
                        Quote: Rider
                        Romania.
                        Well, maybe she’s your equal now.

                        http://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp
                      3. Rider
                        Rider 16 August 2013 23: 14 New
                        +5
                        Quote: Kars
                        Discussion does not cancel. T-90 made for the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation about 500 and not the best configuration.

                        I don’t know what configuration OPLOT is being delivered to your army, but since you decided to reduce everything to measuring the length of the nth unit, it turns out that Russia is cooler than Ukraine exactly 50 times
                        Quote: Kars
                        And therefore, the armed forces need to be compared with her, and not a fierce opponent)))) you have wild logic.

                        with which opponents!? what logic!?
                        Yes, finally think about what you say!
                        I said that initially Ukrainian figures positioned Ukraine as the second France.
                        and you cited Romania as an example, which caused my sarcasm about the devaluation of values.
                        where are you there "incredible enemy" I saw I have no idea.
                        Quote: Kars
                        For starters, I personally did not bring France anywhere. And specify Ukraine = France in everything?

                        I’m trying to explain it to you.
                        YOU - YES, DO NOT LEAD.
                        but YOUR politicians have announced this loudly and often enough.
                        Quote: Kars
                        Why so hesitant?

                        But how should it be?
                        I do not see reasons for optimism (from the point of view of Ukraine)
                        Quote: Kars
                        http://www.globalfirepower.com/countries-listing.asp

                        then why cite Romania as an example?
                        and judging by this table, Vietnam Australia and Saudi Arabia (which are lower in Ukraine’s military power) DO NOT buy used aircraft.
                        you already vibrate examples CORRECT
                      4. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 09: 50 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Rider
                        I don’t know what configuration OPLOT is being delivered to your army, but since you decided to reduce everything to measuring the length of the nth unit, it turns out that Russia is cooler than Ukraine exactly 50 times

                        You bring strange comparisons. And what is the nth aggregate?
                        And there is no particular argument. Russia is militarily cooler - nuclear weapons cannot be taken from her.
                        Quote: Rider
                        with which opponents!? what logic!?
                        Yes, finally think about what you say!

                        Watch yourself
                        Quote: Rider
                        I said that initially Ukrainian figures positioned Ukraine as the second France.
                        Where was it positioned? In this article? And before or after my mention of Romania.

                        Quote: Rider
                        and you cited Romania as an example, which caused my sarcasm about the devaluation of values.

                        You probably need to be cured, bring something to yourself there.
                        Quote: Rider
                        where are you there "incredible enemy" I saw I have no idea.

                        Yes, it's hard for you to live like that.
                        Quote: Rider
                        I’m trying to explain it to you.
                        YOU - YES, DO NOT LEAD.
                        but YOUR politicians have announced this loudly and often enough.

                        So you turn to them. And did they bring France militarily? That's just all your aspirations will be crossed out by the presence of nuclear weapons in the arsenal of France.
                        Quote: Rider
                        then why cite Romania as an example?
                        and judging by this table, Vietnam Australia and Saudi Arabia (which are lower in Ukraine’s military power) DO NOT buy used aircraft.
                        you already vibrate examples CORRECT

                        are they all not far from Ukraine? And what is the difference to you Used or not used?
                      5. Rider
                        Rider 17 August 2013 12: 19 New
                        +4
                        Quote: Kars
                        And there is no particular argument. Russia is militarily cooler - nuclear weapons cannot be taken from her.


                        and everything else too.
                        Quote: Kars
                        Watch yourself

                        a strange statement, you have disagreements with logic, but I am to blame.
                        Quote: Kars
                        You probably need to be cured, bring something to yourself there.

                        Yes, it's hard for you to live like that.

                        apparently this is a tantrum.
                        Quote: Kars
                        So you turn to them. And they brought France militarily?

                        they stated that Ukraine = Faction 2
                        and the fact that you suddenly decided to cite Romania as an example does not cross out my, but rather yours (or rather, Ukraine as a state) aspirations.
                        with which I congratulate you
                        Quote: Kars
                        are they all not far from Ukraine? And what is the difference to you Used or not used?

                        judging by the table YOU give - YES.
                        and there’s no difference, welcome to the club of the 3rd world countries.

                        all the best.
                      6. Kars
                        Kars 17 August 2013 21: 37 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Rider
                        and everything else too.

                        Not really.
                        Quote: Rider
                        a strange statement, you have disagreements with logic, but I am to blame.

                        you just do not have any logic and it is you who are to blame for this.
                        Quote: Rider
                        apparently this is a tantrum

                        It’s hard with the stubborn community. And use the advice for free.
                        Quote: Rider
                        they stated that Ukraine = Faction 2

                        Who THEY? When? In what Context?
                        Quote: Rider
                        but the fact that you suddenly decided to cite Romania as an example

                        How is it? I’ve never brought France anywhere, and Romania I ALWAYS bring as a probable adversary with whom Ukraine has a common border.
                        Quote: Rider
                        judging by the table YOU give - YES.
                        Vietnam and Saudi Arabia are located near Ukraine)))) Well, you said so.

                        Quote: Rider
                        and there’s no difference, welcome to the club of 3 countries
                        Are you aware that the United States bought used ships for its Navy?

                        Quote: Rider
                        all the best.

                        This is not your first departure.)))
  • desiscia
    desiscia 16 August 2013 14: 10 New
    -4
    Guns for the sake of sala, I would use the clever man with fat like that in the face. For ensign. am
    1. mazepa
      mazepa 16 August 2013 15: 22 New
      +2
      It depends on the fat. I wouldn’t be in such a hurry. THAT may be more useful than fat. What could be tastier than potatoes with cracklings.
    2. Rjn
      Rjn 16 August 2013 16: 01 New
      +7
      And the fact that Amer wrote this flag is nothing, have you lost it and that’s all? But what about: the master has allowed to joke.
      1. desiscia
        desiscia 16 August 2013 17: 40 New
        +1
        And Amer is five years out of Ukraine. Well, yes, the bourgeois muzzle easily got off, I would evo into a barrel z ha ... m. and according to Khreshchatyk.
  • sergey158-29
    sergey158-29 16 August 2013 22: 36 New
    0
    Of course, "sitting" on an oil-gas pipe, every Russian can afford to tell the "little brothers" what he (the elder brother) is cool with the expansion! angry

    Therefore, I propose to conduct a test for coolness, namely, full-fledged proving ground (fortunately, a proving ground has already been built) tests of the OPLOT and T-90MS ++ tanks with the adoption of the winner in service with both countries !! hi

    This will be cool !!! Oh yes, now they will tell me about the super-duper-secret in the letter A ...
  • Misantrop
    Misantrop 16 August 2013 23: 27 New
    +2
    Quote: sergey158-29
    Of course, "sitting" on an oil-gas pipe, every Russian can afford to tell the "little brothers" what he (the elder brother) is cool with the expansion!
    Even 30 years ago, I personally heard just such conversations. One detail - Ukrainians spoke about their steepness, it was they who mostly worked there on a rotational basis. Accordingly, they made good money, and the deposits were common. Then Ukraine and Belarus refused them, SAMI. Like from many other things, preferring to set aside your own independent piece of the country and not wanting to “feed the parasites-holodrants”. Hydrocarbon prices were ridiculous, work was hard, shift conditions were even harder. Well, who is the doctor now, when did the conjuncture change?
    1. sergey158-29
      sergey158-29 16 August 2013 23: 46 New
      -1
      Yes, for heaven’s sake, we don’t feel sorry ... You just don’t say to the Russian people that they have abandoned oil and gas - their PEOPLE'S PURPOSE! Yes, and here the situation has not changed, but the PRICE!
      Here about something else. What, writers write here, we (the Russian Federation) have so many tanks, planes, etc. And you (postings) 10 pieces ...
      Here they (the writers) write that for us 10 pieces are many, but for you it’s a drop in the bucket, that's all ...
      And about tank tests at your new training ground it would be at least INTERESTING!
      No offense. drinks
      1. Misantrop
        Misantrop 17 August 2013 09: 53 New
        0
        Quote: sergey158-29
        Yes, for heaven’s sake, we don’t feel sorry ... You just don’t say to the Russian people that they have abandoned oil and gas - their PEOPLE'S PURPOSE!
        But I feel sorry. Not for themselves, for them. At that time, I was in the autonomous region, providing the country's external security. Without me, this scam was scrolled ...
  • Yuri Y.
    Yuri Y. 16 August 2013 23: 55 New
    +3
    In the context of Ukraine’s current policy, she doesn’t really need a military industrial complex, for 70 army there is a lot of equipment and is not needed (if only for the external market, i.e. for fat). In Russia, out of habit, they will move away from external dependence, which they do if possible (they will either start building a spaceport or design a simulator for naval aviation). You watch some factory come to life, they also want to eat here. All the same, we will try to be as independent as possible in politics and, as a result, in the production of weapons for ourselves. Ukraine did not want to be independent with us, it will be independent of the EU. Maybe the next, for this, a used batch of F-16 will have to be bought, or, years later, a tank for the parade should be taken from the Baltic states. We do not want to be independent from the USA, we want not to depend on them.
  • RoTTor
    RoTTor 17 August 2013 00: 12 New
    +7
    The military-industrial complex of Ukraine was an integral part of the military-industrial complex of the USSR, important, but not autonomous, due to the natural division of labor.
    Maybe even a healthy liver is autonomous from the body?

    The best factories and NGOs of the military-industrial complex were destroyed thanks to idiocy and boundless greed for the profit of small-town “bricklayers”.

    The legendary Kiev "Arsenal" robbed of production facilities under ... courts.

    The shipyard “Leninsky Forge”, which built the best missile boats, having got to the chocolate magnate Poroshenko, has long been ... all shipbuilding.

    On the territory of "Gidropribor" there are shopping and snack centers.
    Many factories were demolished - for the construction of commercial housing.

    And so - to infinity.

    The scientific base of the military-industrial complex has been destroyed.

    And to the West, the remnants of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex will not be allowed into the cannon shot - there are enough of them there, why do they need competitors with a muddy political orientation

    The only market - Russia, the CIS and the CSTO is lost for the same reason - no one will buy
    weapons from a country from which it is not known what to expect tomorrow.
    1. Armata
      Armata 20 August 2013 18: 50 New
      0
      And what did they do with the Nikolaev shipyards! Almost nothing remained of them, and after all, more than 20 years ago they built an atomic aircraft carrier!
  • Cristall
    Cristall 17 August 2013 17: 06 New
    -2
    Kars is one against all. Hercules versus Hydra.
    Respect for this person. Special respect for the photo of the Bastion. Beautiful infection. Happy for Kharkov. It’s a pity the media do not do much to popularize the industry (including turbine engines and space), I certainly understand that hellish cuisine is more profitable to discuss, but sometimes the Ukrainians themselves are not aware of their own successes. And failures are carefully savored and discussed.
    The title of the article is derogatory.
    With such success, you can write articles "Oil for the sake of fat", engine pipes and stuff "for the sake of fat"
    Unhealthy surge in unhealthy "news" about Ukraine.
    1. Hudo
      Hudo 18 August 2013 00: 20 New
      +4
      Quote: Cristall
      Kars is one against all. Hercules versus Hydra.


      Do not exaggerate! Phrase: "Kars - against common sense", which more accurately describes the essence of what is happening.
  • Oleg Kharkov
    Oleg Kharkov 18 August 2013 01: 44 New
    -1
    Custom article that does not reflect the essence of what is happening. Another attempt to pit the fraternal peoples (in spite of the efforts of Russian politicians, and indeed Ukrainian, too, which is really a sin). And what is most sad - these attempts are being understood by the masses, and the banner of the blackening of Ukraine is picked up with a bang. Well, come on, we’ll be meaner. am.
  • Silkway0026
    Silkway0026 19 August 2013 22: 03 New
    +2
    for what is providence punishing this country? .. for what? perhaps for prostitution, the trouble of most buffer states
  • svp67
    svp67 21 August 2013 10: 11 New
    +2
    Quote: smiths xnumx
    silence in response
    What can I tell you? The fact that in our Sverdlovsk region in honor of the celebration of "Tanker’s Day" the governor used to hold celebrations, which invited both designers and operators, that is, us sinners ... And there, after the feast, there were opportunities for direct communication. You know, there are a lot of interesting things to learn, so to speak first-hand. Including about "who and where, and most importantly HOW to solve" issues, especially in the championship issue. And honestly, not all of the above is "accessible, to understanding." For example, why Leningraders were not “allowed” to modify the T80 with the 2B2 diesel engine? At least as an experiment, in order not to create a more perfect competitor to the “born T90”. And for this, "undercover methods" were undertaken. Since the tank that we know today as the T90 should not have been like that ... It pleases another - the situation is changing, in terms of the T90, and for the better ...
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  • smiths xnumx
    smiths xnumx 21 August 2013 20: 42 New
    -1
    I? I do not call - I say that it would be nice, and it is quite possible what will happen.
    Come on, come on, write a petition to the UN. In Syrian land there is a lot of space, and you will find 2 meters.
    Answer us soon through the dopa chief doctor.
    Sincerely. Date, signature ... Answer us, and
    then
    If you do not respond, we will write in "Sportloto"

    Are you stupid again? Volunteers will come there, and even with a competition for a place. They still won’t take me without a bribe. They’ll send an art regiment to them.
    .................. and when it comes to things, then into the bushes. And so if you want to go of course, only it’s not “Counter Strike”, they won’t give you a spare life. Let's look at your cold grave. And it’ll be more fun when you scratch and beg for NATO’s pension and your "under-state" with asphalt stumps in Zaporozhye. As they say, the logical ending. For without climbing the dog will not perish.
    http://www.segodnya.ua/world/v-hruzii-udivljajutcja-zachem-roccijckie-voennye-vo


    rujut-unitazy-i-taburetki.html
    Although of course you say that there were only angels and slivers did not feed)))
    And that you are referring so finely to just the former Minister Givi Targamadze, you’d better immediately refer to the tie-eater Sukashvili:
    As a result of the fighting in the Tskhinvali region, the Russian 58th Army lost 1789 soldiers, 105 tanks, 81 combat vehicles, 45 armored personnel carriers, 10 Grad devices and 5 Tornado devices.

    Such data leads the agency "MediaNews".

    According to him, these figures reflect the losses of only the 58 army. The losses of the Pskov and Novorossiisk airborne divisions remain unknown, since these data are especially classified by the FSB of Russia.

    The figures concerning the losses of South Ossetia are also given: "8 percent of the armed forces of the criminal regime of Eduard Kokoity has been destroyed," the message says. Of the 500 militants of the most combat-ready detachment of South Ossetia, the Tskhinvali OMON, only five people survived.
    1. Kars
      Kars 21 August 2013 21: 00 New
      +1
      Quote: smiths xnumx
      Come on, come on, write a petition to the UN. There is a lot of place in Syrian land, and you will find 2 meters

      I do not prefer Egypt and Greece, in Syria for me there is nothing interesting.
      Quote: smiths xnumx
      Come on, go-go, although people like you can only bark from the gateway, and when it comes to things, then into the bushes

      Yes, I won’t go; there are people who need it more than me, and they will be lined up in line.
      Quote: smiths xnumx
      it’s not for you, Counter Strike,

      never played.
      Quote: smiths xnumx
      that you are referring so finely to just the former minister Givi Targamadze, you’d better just link to the tie-eater Sukashvili
      Well, of course it is necessary that Putin personally voiced this)))
      And by the way, I saw by the way, look look.

      Quote: smiths xnumx
      As a result of battles in the Tskhinvali region, the Russian 58 army lost 1789 soldiers

      What can I say? As usual, Russia showed poor readiness, of course they didn’t lose so much, but the official ones were simply orgromic for such a short period of time. There would be more militant peoples like Georgians, Angolans, Somalis in place of Georgians.
  • Endrew
    Endrew 1 November 2013 21: 15 New
    0
    And why did they draw fat on the ensign? they wanted to fuck, oh, these Mosk * it!))
  • Endrew
    Endrew 1 November 2013 21: 18 New
    0
    Then on the ensign of Russia it will be appropriate to draw a bottle of vodka))