Military Review

Vladivostok docked

123
25 July 2013, aft of the Mistral-type landing craft Vladivostok under construction for the Russian Navy, which was built into the dry building dock of the STX France, was docked into Saint-Nazaire. It was docked to the bow of the ship built there. July 26 began work on the actual connection of both parts of the hull, which should be completed by the end of August.



The bow and stern parts of the landing helicopter ship dock "Vladivostok" of the Mistral type, being built for the Russian Navy, docked in the dry construction dock of the STX France shipyard. Saint-Nazaire, 25.07.2013



The process of docking the fore and aft part of the landing helicopter docking ship Vladivostok of the Mistral type under construction for the Russian Navy in the dry building dock of the STX France shipyard. Saint-Nazaire, 25.07.2013
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  1. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 28 July 2013 05: 33 New
    22
    Here they build a colossus .. Well done!
    1. Denin
      Denin 28 July 2013 05: 44 New
      +6
      Still, maybe cadets will be trained right at sea.
      1. Sasha1273
        Sasha1273 28 July 2013 06: 09 New
        18
        It would be a desire, and it would be possible to create such desks, museums, and patriotic centers from those written off. Over the hill this private patriots are doing. And in our country, private traders are rarely patriots, often the opposite.
        1. Refund_SSSR
          Refund_SSSR 28 July 2013 10: 33 New
          49
          I don’t know about you, but reading the comments of this news is ridiculous to me.
          Just literally 3-5 months ago, I was wildly bombarded for saying that these ships are needed and that they will come in very soon, but now the situation is exactly the exact opposite.
          What are all the same talkers live here. laughing Guys, aren't you dumb enough to change your minds like that?
          1. Dober
            Dober 28 July 2013 11: 55 New
            14
            Quote: We refund_SSSR
            What are all the same talkers live here. Guys, aren't you dumb enough to change your minds like that?

            Well done, Sergey! He took it so, in the course of the play, and * fell on all. Powerfully ...
            Incidentally, I, too, was not a supporter of the acquisition of "this miracle" for Russia AT THIS STAGE. If it depended on me, or on you ...
            And for two years he requested to explain to me the need for a Menstrual. Even two. And he proved, cited the opinions of admirals and shipbuilders, and pointed to links on this topic. Now I'm tired. Well, bought, and bought - do not give it to someone else. K.G. let it stand in the closet. Perhaps it will not decay ... They will find application. Maybe not in military operations, but for example for the "northern delivery", because for military operations by Russia with anyone else they are not only unnecessary, but even extremely dangerous.
            For example at the Pacific Fleet. Well, they gathered up fighters from all over the Far East. Plunged. Send with God's help. Where? And what to cover? Two BOD and three boats? Yes, an aircraft wing from one Amerian aircraft carrier in a couple of hours will turn this "floating shabby brick" into a mass grave (God forbid!).
            In 5-7 years, it would have been appropriate both in the Pacific Ocean and in the North Seas. As part of powerful fleets, equipped with suitable cover and strike ships.

            In the meantime ...
            Well, there is the Tsar Bell in Russia, there is the Tsar Cannon. Now there will be more "King Dinghy!
            Even two !!! ........
            1. avt
              avt 28 July 2013 12: 14 New
              -6
              Quote: Dober
              Well, there is the Tsar Bell in Russia, there is the Tsar Cannon. Now there will be also "King Boat!

              Botik GDP named after Serdyukov.
              1. Dober
                Dober 28 July 2013 12: 34 New
                +2
                Quote: avt
                Botik GDP named after Serdyukov.


                "In the sea of ​​blue, as in a pharmacy,
                Everything has an essence and weight -
                Ship like a man
                The name is desperately needed.
                You knowingly give a name
                I will tell you in advance:
                What do you call a yacht
                So she will swim!

                Let the youths still sailors
                Schooner flimsy in appearance -
                Call it "Albatross"
                And she is already flying.
                And you’ll call Serdyukov -
                Do not get away from trouble:
                This schooner and in the swamp
                Chokes on water.

                Call it Hercules -
                And command: Go! -
                And she is without an ice cutter
                Ice breaks at the Pole!
                ... Let the devils stir up our water,
                But we have our own moves!
                For the "trouble" trouble, believe me, -
                It's only half the trouble

                HOLIDAY, BROTHERS !!!
            2. grafrozow
              grafrozow 28 July 2013 13: 12 New
              +6
              Quote: Dober
              In the meantime ...
              Well, there is the Tsar Bell in Russia, there is the Tsar Cannon. Now there will be also "King Boat!
              Even two !!! ........

              Actually, there are already four plans. hi drinks
              1. self-propelled
                self-propelled 28 July 2013 19: 15 New
                0
                Quote: grafrozow
                Actually, there are already four plans


                where so much? wassat
            3. Rustam
              Rustam 28 July 2013 15: 45 New
              +6
              Dober Today, 11:55 ↑
              And for two years he requested to explain to me the need for a Menstrual. Even two. And he proved, cited the opinions of admirals and shipbuilders, and pointed to links on this topic. Now tired of


              Two years here? hmm, something I don’t remember you in hot battles on this issue
              if your registration is in 2013. Do not tell me under which nickname you were previously registered and what happened? If you were, of course.
            4. cdrt
              cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 04 New
              +1
              I propose to learn Korean or Spanish and ask the South Koreans and Peruvians why they need UDC. There, on the forums, the logging was probably a la Borodino too - which is better than the LST of 1942 or UDC and why UDC is not needed laughing
            5. yurii p
              yurii p 29 July 2013 12: 55 New
              0
              I’m afraid that you’re right, I don’t understand Russia wisely, I can’t measure arshin pockets, the theater of the absurd continues, the performance started in the 90s, only with other directors and actors.
          2. Master Taiga
            Master Taiga 28 July 2013 14: 08 New
            -7
            Yes, I, too, for the truth minus. But nothing, I train these animals slowly.
            And the fact that ships need to be built abroad has long been obvious. Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands.
            1. svp67
              svp67 28 July 2013 14: 11 New
              +5
              Quote: Taiga Master
              And the fact that ships need to be built abroad has long been obvious. Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands.

              Or maybe something else is obvious - it's time to put things in order at home ...
            2. grafrozow
              grafrozow 28 July 2013 14: 31 New
              +3
              Quote: Taiga Master
              And the fact that ships need to be built abroad has long been obvious. Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands.

              Are you talking about our workers from the shipyard? And who is building nuclear-powered icebreakers, France? Kulibins in Russia have not been extinct, it's all up to the customer. Someone has their own pocket more expensive than the sovereign.
              1. Master Taiga
                Master Taiga 28 July 2013 14: 36 New
                -5
                Nuclear-powered icebreakers were built in Finland.
                1. Lopatov
                  Lopatov 28 July 2013 14: 40 New
                  +5
                  Two out of ten. And only the body.
                2. svp67
                  svp67 28 July 2013 14: 40 New
                  10
                  Quote: Taiga Master
                  Nuclear-powered icebreakers were built in Finland.

                  To note
                  Almost all of these ships were built at the Admiralty Shipyards and the Baltic Shipyard in Leningrad. Two icebreakers - the river Vaigach and Taimyr - were built at the Wärtsilä shipyard in Finland and then transported to Leningrad for the installation of nuclear reactors. The lighter carrier Sevmorput was built at the Zeriv factory in Kerch.
                  Ocean icebreakers - "Lenin", "Arctic", "Siberia", "Yamal", "50 years of Victory" Soviet-built ...
                  1. Civil
                    Civil 28 July 2013 16: 10 New
                    +4
                    [quote] In October 2009, Atomflot’s general director Vyacheslav Ruksha stated that “Atomflot’s lighter carrier Sevmorput is without work, and if this situation continues in 2010, you will have to hand it over to the needles. And he could have served another 15 years. ”[6]
                    The official page of the Maritime Register contains the entry “Deleted from the register of ships from 02.08.2012/7/XNUMX” [XNUMX].
                    As of June 2013, work on decommissioning a lighter carrier was completed; in particular, the nuclear installation is stopped forever / quote]

                    for more than letting go of the needles of effective owners, there’s not enough mind, it’s for free ...
                    1. cdrt
                      cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 10 New
                      +1
                      for more than letting go of the needles of effective owners, there’s not enough mind, it’s for free

                      For free came - a fact. Moreover, to someone who apparently never understood how to earn money from the fact that it was profit.
                      Well, and a lighter carrier - can it simply be more expensive to contain than conventional lighter carriers with a traditional EU?

                      Still, the ship does not seem to be serial, many details are unique - but in fact, the transportation efficiency (taking into account all the costs) is hardly higher than ordinary ships.
                    2. grafrozow
                      grafrozow 28 July 2013 20: 52 New
                      +3
                      Quote: Civil
                      In October 2009, Atomflot’s general director Vyacheslav Ruksha stated that “Atomflot’s lighter carrier“ Sevmorput ”is without work, and if this situation continues in 2010, you will have to hand it over. And he could have served another 15 years ”

                      A lighter carrier was the best option for delivering goods to the North, because they could push the lighter in shallow water, but now the river ports are in ruin, there are no traffic volumes. The stations Uregoy, Korotchaevo, Nadym, Aksarka are liquidated. Small private owners remained, but they do not build the weather.
            3. Lopatov
              Lopatov 28 July 2013 14: 42 New
              +6
              Quote: Taiga Master
              Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands.

              Right In addition, your shipbuilding has been breathing for a long time. Hardly without Russian orders.
            4. Constantine
              Constantine 28 July 2013 15: 11 New
              +6
              Quote: Taiga Master
              Yes, I, too, for the truth minus. But nothing, I train these animals slowly.
              And the fact that ships need to be built abroad has long been obvious. Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands.


              Did he understand what he said? What kind of animals are you dressing with your West Brain here?

              Even here you did not deny yourself the pleasure of spitting on the faces of hard workers, and indeed of all citizens, with the words "Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands."

              It's time to learn how to follow the words until graduation. otherwise, with such corrals, you will be beaten at the university. Yes, and in high school, too. wink
              1. Blackgrifon
                Blackgrifon 28 July 2013 18: 26 New
                +3
                Quote: Constantine
                Quote: The owner of Taiga Yes, too, for the truth minus me. But nothing, I train these animals slowly. And the fact that ships need to be built abroad has long been obvious. Our know how to steal with their crooked little hands.


                Constantine! Fuck it - as they say - some people argue that you can live without a brain :)
                1. Constantine
                  Constantine 28 July 2013 18: 55 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Blackgrifon
                  Constantine! Fuck it - as they say - some people argue that you can live without a brain :)


                  He must bequeath himself to science))
          3. 11 black
            11 black 28 July 2013 22: 03 New
            +2
            Quote: We refund_SSSR
            I don’t know about you, but reading the comments of this news is ridiculous to me.
            Just literally 3-5 months ago, I was wildly bombarded for saying that these ships are needed and that they will come in very soon, but now the situation is exactly the exact opposite.
            What are all the same talkers live here. laughing Guys, aren't you dumb enough to change opinions like that?

            + you certainly - I also had the courage to blabber a month ago that the Mistrals would come in handy in Syria as a projection of power, in general, a wild minus from the patriots ury - and now I see they changed their minds at once laughing
        2. Master Taiga
          Master Taiga 28 July 2013 14: 12 New
          -3
          The fact that the private trader is not a patriot is to blame for the country itself, which spread rot of these private traders. Nigeria in the snow.
          1. grafrozow
            grafrozow 28 July 2013 14: 37 New
            +3
            Quote: Taiga Master
            The fact that the private trader is not a patriot is to blame for the country itself, which spread rot of these private traders. Nigeria in the snow.

            I heard a bell, but I don’t know where it is. SSZ, a shipbuilding factory, this is not a shoe repair shop and not Horns and Hooves. These are city-forming enterprises.
        3. Blackgrifon
          Blackgrifon 28 July 2013 18: 23 New
          +2
          Quote: Sasha1273
          private patriots are engaged. And in our country, private traders are rarely patriots, often the opposite.


          Not true - Do you know how many taxes and pension contributions a "private trader" has to do? Such museums are the prerogative of the state. Take the USA as an example - all of their battleship museums are state-owned.

          And about the news - good news - I have been waiting for these ships to replenish the Russian Navy for a long time. It is important, however, that the infrastructure for them be ready.
    2. xetai9977
      xetai9977 28 July 2013 09: 19 New
      23
      How fast. And where is their agreement, clarification, leapfrog, cut money ...? This is the way to work, not chatter.
      1. cdrt
        cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 12 New
        +1
        And where is their agreement, clarification, leapfrog, cut money ...?
        So you have to work, not chatter


        You are right, but ...
        This is not our method. laughing
    3. Sakhalininsk
      Sakhalininsk 28 July 2013 10: 05 New
      +7
      Quote: MIKHAN
      Here they build a colossus .. Well done!


      Unfortunately, the pace of construction of the ship is much higher than Russian. Let's hope that after 5 years, ships of the 1st rank will be built at the same pace at our shipyards.
      1. grafrozow
        grafrozow 28 July 2013 14: 42 New
        +2
        Quote: Sakhalininets
        Unfortunately, the pace of construction of the ship is much higher than Russian. Let's hope that after 5 years, ships of the 1st rank will be built at the same pace at our shipyards.

        Yes, then we will ask them to build us houses and sow grain for us. But what can they do, just what we’ll do ourselves?
      2. saturn.mmm
        saturn.mmm 29 July 2013 11: 08 New
        0
        Quote: Sakhalininets
        Unfortunately, the pace of construction of the ship is much higher than Russian.

        Only one fact, then, that the Baltic Shipyard launched the stern into the water and delivered to France almost to the launch of the French half, no one seemed to indicate it. The Russian plant did an excellent job. The conclusion is clear for me - in Russia, the problem is with the organization of production and not with production itself. Something needs to be changed at the level of forming orders and signing contracts.
        The news is wonderful and over time the ship will take its rightful place in the Russian Navy.
    4. Rustam
      Rustam 28 July 2013 10: 20 New
      +9
      Great news - once again, greetings to all measurers and feed experts.
      The pace of work is just excellent.

      In the first picture in the upper right corner, the nose of the second UDC Sevastopol is visible, pay attention to the second picture on the mast they are already starting to place radars


      The only joy is if you would have trained the future crew well and built infrastructure for them

      Here are good words on the situation with our UDC
      Poll # 27.07.2013/10/53 27.07.2013:XNUMX @ Barbarossa # XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX (aviabasa.ru)
      ★ ★ ★ ★ ★
      ☤☤☤
      Forget it, Barbie. At first they shouted that no one would build ships, he drank everything. Then they shouted that they would never build these ships.
      Now they are screaming that there will be no helicopters, and these ships will not be used.
      Do you think that when the military work begins with Vladivostok, they will have the courage or the honor to recognize themselves as alternatively gifted or lobbyists of domestic basins?
      Will not be enough. No courage, no honor.

      ps - nothing more to add

      also a discussion- http://bmpd.livejournal.com/576276.html#comments
      1. Rustam
        Rustam 28 July 2013 10: 28 New
        +2
        As for the docking, so far they have only let down - the process is long and complicated

        Here's a video

        Just failed. They promised to finish the docking at the end of summer.

        You’ve brought it, look at the add-on, it’s done technologically, the nose is raised, the stern is lowered, the field is smoothly aligned. If they are equalized, then the hump will move into the superstructure, but will not stand snugly when lowering.
      2. Alekseev
        Alekseev 28 July 2013 10: 51 New
        +1
        They shouted, screamed some kind of nonsense, you need to look at yourself, maybe you can scream even more! lol
        The specialists (and not the brehunts) had, and there are very well-grounded doubts, that it was precisely 2 UDCs (and not, say, a dozen frigates and a cruiser-helicopter carrier providing for the deployment of nuclear submarines) for exactly 1,5 billion euros at the moment all necessary to the Russian Navy.
        Not one did not doubt that the French would build them for such grandmas. And if you pay it is not 2, but 10. And ours would be built.
        Doubts were and are about the purpose of these ships.
        Why are they?
        Some people confuse these troop-landing troughs with a helicopter carrier, but this is deeply wrong.
        Real helicopter carriers are, for example, in Japan (such as the "Hyuug")
        And the Mistrals are weakly protected, they cannot walk as part of the destroyer and cruiser compound, the course is only 18 knots.
        They are for landing on the coast of the "banana republics."
        It is unlikely that when such a landing our fleet will land.
        And all the glorious Russian military sailors on the day of the Navy. Hooray!!! drinks
        1. Rustam
          Rustam 28 July 2013 11: 09 New
          10
          and you need to see yourself, maybe you scream even more


          I look you rude and you? I quoted another person’s link-true (the words squealed, maybe the person was mistaken)

          Why are they?


          Trough? I love this word - such a trough clowns with USC to build inconsistency, you probably missed the main discussions on this issue in 2 years - I advise you to fill your gap - strongly

          At the request of the listeners, I repeat my post to another colleague - why are these TORCHES needed


          Rustam  July 26, 2013 01:18 | Old problems with new ships

          funny .. déjà vu - that rascal of different "cyclists"

          Of course, where are we goofy Hamsters to you


          ps All fleets of the world - China, Japan, Spain, Holland, France, Ita
          liya, Korea, and even more so the United States -Have in their composition udk or build-and about protection, so these are questions for the USC, because we are building frigates and corvettes for 8 years with a displacement of 2-4 tons

          How many analogs of Mistral would we have built in 15 years?

          What is the UDC for? (In the photo of the UHD LHD-4 "Boxer" all the representatives of the typical Wasp air group are clearly visible - MV-22 convertiplanes, multi-purpose SH-60, heavy CH-53E and AV-8B aircraft.

          Then why the heck are we huge Eagles? And investing a huge dough for their repair and modernization ???? corvettes and hang out from the closet, no guys our fleet should develop and go in its development as the leading fleets of the world do (even at the first stage with a stranger help) and what to do, we don’t have time for buildup.

          About Chen for products, some shout that the Mistrals are expensive?

          here is a good post

          dmitreach  July 22, 2013 17:14 ↑ ↓

          Error number times:
          You should not compare the cost of the domestic product for FRANCE with the price tag for ANOTHER state (in this case, Russia).
          Assigned to nuber to:
          1,2 billion Euros (rounded, the civir is different, but not fundamental) - a lot of money. What can I buy on them:
          More than 60 wooden lard for the modernization of Nakhimov. (digital figure is not final, according to tradition - can be increased)
          Premier League Alexander Nevsky - 23 lard (almost like one Mistral)
          Nuclear submarine Severodvinsk (head) almost half a hundred lard (further, serial, almost a dozen times cheaper ...)
          You can launch a firecracker 14 times - Proton-M (with 56 GLONAS satellites). The last launch cost 4,4 lard.
          Or, like three pieces of Express-AM4, in August last year (it became space debris at a cost of 20 billion rubles. - Almost like one Mistral)
          Approximately 2 frigates project 1135.6 (Which for the Indians pasted. There were two contracts for three models.)
          Leasing the Nerpa-Chakra somewhere ... 650 bucks lyamov for 10 years of active use.
          The cost of the Atomic Icebreaker, with a capacity of 60 megawatts (Project 22220) is almost 40 lard.
          You can try to buy 1800 BA Lynx.
          Prices are certainly not for children ... But!
          with this money how many warships could be built
          Which ones? Type DK Dugong (Denis Davydov)? Or 1135.6?
          What to measure Mistral? (in boas, monkeys or in parrots)
          1. Alekseev
            Alekseev 28 July 2013 16: 58 New
            -2
            Quote: Rustam
            I look you rude and you?

            From smart to smart! wink And how do you like?
        2. Rustam
          Rustam 28 July 2013 11: 22 New
          10
          And ours would be built.


          Yes, ours would have been built in 15 years

          The specialists (and not the brehunts) had, and there are very well-grounded doubts, that it was precisely 2 UDCs (and not, say, a dozen frigates and a cruiser-helicopter carrier providing for the deployment of nuclear submarines) for exactly 1,5 billion euros at the moment all necessary to the Russian Navy.


          All the same, the fairy tales that clowns with USC rubbed at people once made themselves felt

          about a dozen frigates - I’ll tell

          1-value contract with training, logistics and a guarantee of 1,2 billion euros

          2 dozen frigates? The cost of a long-term construction called frigate 22350 Admiral Gorshkov is 450 million Baku, and this is not the final figure (we will soon celebrate the 9th anniversary of its construction)
          where is a dozen frigates for 1,2 billion euros?

          Yes, regarding the value, the cost of the latest French frigate FREMM (in the photo and video) is 450-480 million euros, our guys are not far away, they just forgot about the terms and quality - well, we have a normal budget, we’ll master the loot as it should
          1. PLO
            PLO 28 July 2013 12: 52 New
            +1
            about the domestic basins, you said it well ..
            right on the right day.
          2. Rustam
            Rustam 28 July 2013 16: 55 New
            +7
            olp Today, 12:52 ↑
            about the domestic basins, you said it well ..


            I spoke and reprinted the text of another person (maybe he’s wrong and boiling) it’s about our UDC, some gentlemen call Taz, Koryt, Bath, Pasudina even Suitcase, probably from anger and it inspires me, I’m 100% sure that buying such ships is a leap forward, both to the culture of construction and the operation of such vessels -160 people of the team - that’s yes, that’s the equipment

            France is the key that will give us both technology and knowledge
            at the prices of products I spoke above and I speak repeatedly

            I recall the words of gentlemen from the USC and gentlemen from the same Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation (Minister Ivanov, the head of the Moscow armament) about our frigates 22350 - by the end of 2020, have 10 units in the composition - well, well

            total

            -It is completely understandable and it is recognized at the highest level that the military development program is completely failed, USC is unable to fulfill it

            -that is why we need new technologies, new equipment, a new vision - and France should help us in this, if we continue to cooperate

            - at the price for the long-term construction 22350 I spoke above, and the price of the latest FREMM frigates is small, the difference is to the production culture and timing (won the bz broke his ass and was able to pass the stern, we can only help under tight control, but with the help of French or German technologies)

            but I know many already think they are in favor of ordering ships there, following the example of UDC 2 there 6

            PS here's a demonstration video - the construction of a FREMM frigate for the Navy of MOROCCO Mohammed VI the price of the entire contract is 470 million euros (logistics, training, guarantee) the sufferer Gorshkov costs $ 450 million
            FREMM was laid in the arsenal in Loriana at the end of 2008 and launched on September 14, 2011 -6000 tons, the ship will be delivered to the Moroccan side by the end of 2013 and will become the largest combat unit of the Navy of Morocco

            The video is very revealing - look at the culture of production everything is technologically built at the highest level and compare with the workshops of the same CB - I hope we will soon too (hope dies last) and we will also learn how to do it efficiently, quickly and on time (and not we will blame allies and the Lord God)

            And most importantly, deal with the miracle managers and directors of our USC
            1. PLO
              PLO 28 July 2013 17: 31 New
              0
              I spoke and reprinted the text of another person

              You have subscribed to this text, moreover, this is not the first time ..
              ps - nothing more to add


              you can talk further about quoting, but rushing at such quotes and demanding correct communication from the person you are talking to is at least short-sighted, but about the boiling point, these weak excuses could not help it, maybe those who call Mistral are also boiling with a trough, but you don’t understand them ..

              then the purchase of such ships is a leap forward, both to the culture of construction and operation of such ships

              here I even partially disagree with you.
              the purchase of these ships does not help us in any way to modernize the shipyards.

              - at the price for the long-term construction 22350 I spoke above, and the price of the latest FREMM frigates is not big difference-

              small?
              almost 30-40 percent cheaper is this the difference is small?

              BZ won’t torn his ass and was able to pass stern, we can only help under tight control, but with the help of French technology or German

              The BZ didn’t pass stern; the BZ passed an empty box, which on the STX will already be saturated with French-made equipment.

              The video is very indicative - look at the culture of production, everything is technologically built at the highest level and compare with the workshops of the same CB

              I still can’t understand where do you get that buying Mistral will help modernize the Federation Council to the level of the French? the contract does not affect it at all. as it was before the Mistral, so it will be after.


              And most importantly, deal with the miracle managers and directors of our USC

              First of all, we need to deal with the miracle of the generals in the Moscow Region.
              if they don’t know what they need, no shipyards for it
              1. Rustam
                Rustam 28 July 2013 18: 00 New
                +2
                I still can’t understand where do you get that buying Mistral will help modernize the Federation Council to the level of the French?


                I said compare the level and equipment of the shipyard in Brest and NE.
                It will help, if we still decide to build another 2 you want, you don’t want to modernize the shipyard (most likely the BZ) and customize it to French standards
                did you like the video? is it impressive is it true? when it will be like this with me I will be a happy person

                First of all, we need to deal with the miracle of the generals in the Moscow Region.


                You correctly noticed that, because at one time we made one monopolist who failed everything and everyone (notice Serdyukov at that time and there wasn’t any mention at all), the miracle of managers from USC who told us tales about delivering 2020ti by 10 is also unforgettable frigates 22350 and 20 corvees 22380-85
                1. PLO
                  PLO 28 July 2013 18: 12 New
                  0
                  I said compare the level and equipment of the shipyard in Brest and NE.
                  It will help, if we still decide to build another 2 you want, you don’t want to modernize the shipyard (most likely the BZ) and customize it to French standards

                  no one will upgrade the shipyard, there is no money, and for this we need a lot of money
                  will build as well as the stern of the mistral.
                  only if the state helps.

                  You correctly noticed this, because at one time we made one monopolist who failed everything and everything (notice Serdyukov at that time and there was no mention

                  and who made it? SF itself chtoli? or did someone in the MO have huge grandmothers from this?


                  we also remember the miracle of managers with USC who told us tales about the delivery by 2020 of 10 frigates 22350 and 20 corvees 22380-8

                  these miracle manager will tell you about 100 ships a year ..
                  that's just what kind of demand from them if the ship laying plan and the terms of their construction MO determines.
                  1. Rustam
                    Rustam 28 July 2013 18: 35 New
                    +2
                    and who made it? SF itself chtoli? or did someone in the MO have huge grandmothers from this?


                    I always talked about this, and when SV received orders (which were unable to fulfill), who then distributed the orders with us, Mr. Moscow and the company strangled a more technological BZ
            2. cdrt
              cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 45 New
              +1
              Yes, there is much more order in the shipyards.
              Yes, France is much more technologically advanced than production (actually not only shipbuilding).
              Yes, they create the same electronics, but we are catching up.
              Yes, the Mistrals we ourselves would not have created for 20-30 years. and it’s not only shipbuilders, designers and component engineers. These yes, skillfully frustrate any new project. Remembering the story of Ivan Tarava, Khalzan - in order to order a good UDC, you need to have practical experience in using something like that.
              Otherwise, the customer’s mind will give birth to monsters in the form of a UDC-Helicopter carrier of a carrier-carrier of the Kyrgyz Republic, a gunboat ...


              But since after all, the war is not directly on the verge (well, except for those with whom it is about to begin), the economic effect of building the fleet is much more important: the revival of technological chains, jobs, salaries, and consumption based on them.
              See the experience of overcoming the Great Depression of the United States of the Year since 1936.

              And therefore - they did everything right - they bought it, later they will build it themselves under control. You look at the time and master the modern doctrine of amphibious assault forces.

              Well, with Gorshkov they’ll bring it. 5 years and bring. Then the series will be launched. And in general, this is probably correct.
              1. Rustam
                Rustam 28 July 2013 20: 35 New
                +1
                c
                drt Today, 19:45 ↑
                Yes, there is much more order in the shipyards.


                I’m talking about this and about the order and culture of production. The video above about the construction of Fremm shows how we fell behind

                ps- the photo that revolts me (clickable) March 2013 inside the under construction project called Admiral Gorshkov (project 22350) food block -We look at the floor and see a bunch of bull-calves-you have to kill for it

                Forum Balancer
            3. saturn.mmm
              saturn.mmm 29 July 2013 11: 48 New
              +1
              Maybe we just have a lame production organization.
              And about technological backwardness and inability to build ships, I want to give an example from the times of the USSR
              January 6, 1987 July 1988 September 4, 1989
              These are the years of the construction of the nuclear submarine pr.941 Shark, as you know the displacement of 48000 tons and the ship is more complicated than the Mistral. But the fact that in cooperation with the French is much positive is 100%, to emphasize their experience, in any case, will be beneficial to domestic shipbuilding .
              1. Rustam
                Rustam 29 July 2013 13: 26 New
                +1
                I want to give an example from the times of the USSR


                Do not compare the Secular control and organization of the current scammers and molesters (that with the defense industry that with the USC)
                1. saturn.mmm
                  saturn.mmm 29 July 2013 16: 13 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Rustam
                  Do not compare the Secular control and organization of the current scammers and molesters (that with the defense industry that with the USC)

                  Here I am talking about the same thing, under normal conditions, for example, the Baltic Shipyard, worked decently, as far as I know, the French had no complaints. And economic amnesty is brewing in Russia, so we will study for a long time with the French. All the brave, no one is afraid of anything, that you can’t buy for money, you can buy for big money and this is the norm.
        3. Mikado
          Mikado 28 July 2013 14: 25 New
          -1
          Quote: Alekseev
          And the Mistrals are weakly protected


          Ours made significant changes to the design, stuffed it with various miracle weapons, so as not to be defenseless, this was said and written.
          1. PLO
            PLO 28 July 2013 15: 00 New
            +2
            Ours made significant changes to the design, stuffed it with various miracle weapons, so as not to be defenseless, this was said and written.

            do not repeat nonsense after others.
            there is no miracle of weapons on the Mistral (not to mention the fact that installing it would be a huge stupidity)

            of weapons they will have exactly two AK-630 AUs and two Bib launchers.
            for such a ship, this is not just a miser, it is less than nothing.
            1. Mikado
              Mikado 28 July 2013 16: 29 New
              -1
              Quote: olp
              of weapons they will have exactly two AK-630 AUs and two Bib launchers.



              ))) I don’t know what to even answer you)) You probably think our sailors are big fools, since you think that this is all the weapons that they plan to place on this ship) Then they and Petruccio will take off all the missiles and leave two anti-aircraft guns))) us the concept of building ships is a little different than in the west, we love to install manyoooooo different and good weapons on our ships (especially more and especially aircraft carriers). And you say that our weapons on the Mistral put even less than the French put on their own)) Here's a tentative list of weapons for the ship

              weaponry
              Radar weapons: 2 navigation radars DRBN-38A Decca Bridgemaster E250, radar target detection MRR3D-NG

              Tactical strike weapons: Caliber Supersonic cruise missiles

              Artillery: AK-630

              Anti-aircraft artillery: 2 × 30 mm Breda-Mauser gun mounts,
              4 × 12,7 mm Browning machine gun; "3M47" Bending

              Missile weapons: 2 × 2 - launchers SAM Simbad

              All these Simbads and Browninges are likely to be replaced with something nice, but I don’t doubt that there will be cruise missiles on the ship
              1. PLO
                PLO 28 July 2013 16: 53 New
                +1
                ))) I do not know what to even answer you))

                you know. sometimes it’s better to be silent than to speak. that was exactly the case.

                Wikipedia copy-paste is certainly tricky, but somewhat stupid.
                if only because you don’t know what is behind all these names.
                and the right to include the word in the list of weapons 12.7 machine guns, I would be ashamed of you.

                2x2 Symbad is a complete analogue of our 2x2 Bending.
                2x30mm Delusions change to 2x30mm AK-630 (not even Duets)

                but about supersonic missiles Caliber forget about a nightmare.
                they will not be on the Mistral, and most importantly they are not needed there.


                All these Simbads and Browninges are likely to be replaced with something nice, but I don’t doubt that there will be cruise missiles on the ship

                your doubts are of course a strong argument)
                only all photos of our Mistral refute this
                1. Mikado
                  Mikado 28 July 2013 20: 58 New
                  +1
                  Quote: olp
                  you know. sometimes it’s better to be silent than to speak. that was exactly the case.


                  I agree, this is exactly your case)

                  Quote: olp
                  Wikipedia copy-paste is certainly tricky, but somewhat stupid


                  perhaps you probably spend a lot of time there, you know where everything is written. I’m not here, all my info from the site defense.ru))



                  Quote: olp
                  but about supersonic missiles Caliber forget about a nightmare.
                  they will not be on the Mistral, and most importantly they are not needed there.


                  powerful, and most importantly irrefutable)

                  Quote: olp
                  only all photos of our Mistral refute this


                  Of course, of course, they confirm only that they will install two AKs and two SAMs, no more)))

                  In general, in fact, do you yourself believe that they will put there only a pair of AKs and a pair of air defense systems? Or, do you even absolutely know this?)
                  1. PLO
                    PLO 28 July 2013 21: 23 New
                    0
                    I agree, this is exactly your case)

                    it's funny to hear it from a person who doesn't know what he is saying

                    powerful, and most importantly irrefutable)

                    exactly)
                    Of course, of course, they confirm only that they will install two AKs and two SAMs, no more)))
                    In general, in fact, do you yourself believe that they will put there only a pair of AKs and a pair of air defense systems? Or, do you even absolutely know this?)

                    I do not need to believe, I know
                    and now poke your finger where UKKS will be located? lol


                    or here you can search here
                    official project image of the Russian Mistral)
                    1. Mikado
                      Mikado 28 July 2013 22: 20 New
                      +1
                      )))) Hooooospodya
                      And where is the RCC or UKKS located here?



                      http://icdn.lenta.ru/images/2013/07/25/15/20130725154428500/pic_4c5ab064f4248e32
                      ac2f04f9ca853f48.jpg

                      Well, of course, after reading the documentation you can say where) It is the same with Mistral, that the RCC that the UKKS can be located where the designer’s heart desires, is there a lot of space, or do you think they should have a big deal about themselves?))
                      1. PLO
                        PLO 29 July 2013 03: 19 New
                        0
                        hmm, they gave it out .. I’ll tell you a secret on the corvette 20380 no UKKS lol

                        By the way, UKKS can’t be located anywhere, and at least at the construction stage, the groundwork for it would be clearly visible.

                        give a hint look for something like that)
              2. Blackgrifon
                Blackgrifon 28 July 2013 18: 32 New
                +1
                Quote: Mikado
                that there will be cruise missiles on the ship, I have no doubt


                I do not agree - UDC is not designed for such weapons. Yes, and he does not need it.
                1. Mikado
                  Mikado 28 July 2013 21: 00 New
                  0
                  Admiral Vysotsky, at one time, thought differently, like a number of other admirals and designers, stuffing a bunch of missiles onto our cruiser aircraft.
              3. cdrt
                cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 57 New
                0
                but that there will be cruise missiles on the ship, I have no doubt

                a dream of some kind.
                why on the landing platform, landing marines from 30-40 km from the coast of the Kyrgyz Republic? Why then not put 20 Granites? On AB set.

                And it’s nothing that after this the ship will become a bad UDC (with 8 helicopters and 300 landing personnel), but the KR will be as much as 20 more (though on the ship, with a speed of 18 knots and built by civil standards, but that's okay) ...
                1. Mikado
                  Mikado 28 July 2013 21: 04 New
                  0
                  Quote: cdrt
                  And nothing that after that the ship will become a bad UDC


                  these questions should be asked to our designers, who loved to shove rockets on aircraft-carrying ships to their intended purpose. The concept is different (it was and, as I understand it, it remains), their UDC is covered by a crowd of ships, our UDC is covering itself.
            2. cdrt
              cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 53 New
              0
              Mistral is a landing ship. UDC. The rest of the UDC can be thought of as more armed (although the fact wink - a little stronger, most have an analogue of the Dagger).
              1. donavi49
                donavi49 28 July 2013 20: 05 New
                +4
                If.
                Juan Carlos I (the one Australia chose) has 4 12,7mm Browning anti-piracy turrets.
                Kenber (model for Australia) - 4 guns Rafael Typhoon 25 mm and 4 anti-browning turrets 12,7mm.
                LST Osumi - 2x12,7mm Branding and 2 Phalanx CIWS.
                Dokdo (the one that Ykspert believes is better) is 2 × Goalkeeper CIWS and 1 × RIM-116 Rolling Airframe Missile.
                LHA America (this is no longer the UDC, but essentially an aircraft carrier for the 45k + IMS) - 2 × RIM-116 Rolling Airframe Missile, 32 air defense missile systems ESSM, Phalanx CIWS and anti-piracy Browning 12,7 turrets.
                1. cdrt
                  cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 28 New
                  0
                  ADMS 32 ESSM missiles

                  I actually ESSM and Sea Sparrow analog dagger and called wink
        4. cdrt
          cdrt 28 July 2013 19: 30 New
          +1
          Good, inexpensive UDC ...

          About banana republics delivers. laughing
          Of course, we do not need UDC. Well, of course, the Russian Navy is needed, only hardcore, only TDK, to land not under direct fire from tanks is not our method.

          Apparently Peru, South Korea - everyone also wants to land on the shores of the banana republics (especially South Korea). wink
          And the United States, when they built the Taraws and planned to land in Kamchatka with their participation, apparently considered the USSR a banana republic. repeat

          These "mantras" of "serious specialists" in the 1941 Feodosian landing force were always taken. I want to say - dear, WWII ended soon as 70 years ago. People created helicopters and much related to this. laughing

          Doubt further, but, preferably, to yourself, the caravan has already passed by ... laughing
          I don’t think I will be a prophet, but when a couple of weeks ago Rogozin went to France and talked about co-production there, oh I think they seriously discussed the second pair of ships, which will be joint production
    5. Turik
      Turik 28 July 2013 15: 57 New
      +2
      I do not argue that the ship is good, necessary, with the aircraft carriers we yourself know - tight.

      But to be honest, I’m just ashamed of our country. I am ashamed of our shipbuilders, the leadership and, of course, officials, for whom I drank the national dough - a sacred thing. After all, we can do such ships ourselves, all that is needed is 2-3 normal universities, a couple of executions and 2-5 billion dollars to start with. Then it all pays off.

      For example, Iranians, Thailand, Latin America are now ready to buy such ships and no one. To drive our officials into Bosch that all this will bring them much more money than banal kickbacks.
      1. Mikado
        Mikado 28 July 2013 16: 31 New
        +1
        Quote: Turik
        To drive our officials into Bosch that all this will bring them much more money than banal kickbacks.


        Drive a nail into their head, there are still some exhortations to do.
      2. cdrt
        cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 02 New
        0
        Thailand, Latin America are now ready to buy such ships and no one

        Well .... Thailand already bought AB (well, for what money was enough, I bought one wink ) in Spain.
        Peru - she herself laid down the UDC a few days ago.

        The USSR-RF has never been a leader in the construction of aircraft carriers.
        40-50 years behind really. Why is it that someone will buy UDC from us, for which we ourselves, even in the heyday of the USSR, could not even articulate the requirements articulate?
    6. Siberian German
      Siberian German 29 July 2013 07: 38 New
      0
      but I like that they are building quickly - and somehow they don’t hear scandals they drank coca .... And here. what desperately I don’t like - where are the messages about the construction of new piers for Vladik - where he will be standing - if the raid is a disposable toy quickly develop motor resources
  2. andrei332809
    andrei332809 28 July 2013 06: 13 New
    20
    Happy Russian Navy Day !!!
  3. Zabvo
    Zabvo 28 July 2013 06: 19 New
    +4
    The pace is impressive, it would be just as fast for our shipyards only for our Navy. And then it turns out weird how in cooperation or for a foreign customer they build without leaving the schedules ... request
    1. Alexey Prikazchikov
      Alexey Prikazchikov 28 July 2013 07: 34 New
      +4
      After Mistral, there may be such temps. In any case, our mountain-shipbuilders will not succeed in building on the old one, they simply will not understand.
  4. waisson
    waisson 28 July 2013 06: 21 New
    +8
    the docking is timed to the day of the Navy. With the Navy HOLIDAY !!!!! who served in the navy
  5. buzuke
    buzuke 28 July 2013 06: 22 New
    +6
    the closer to completion, the less talk about the need to purchase the Mistral
    1. Zabvo
      Zabvo 28 July 2013 06: 26 New
      +5
      Quote: buzuke
      the closer to completion, the less talk about the need to purchase the Mistral
      I agree, it has always been like this with us. At first we say no, but as soon as we build it turns out to be necessary. Paradox... wink
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 28 July 2013 10: 13 New
        +4
        Yeah. At first we are indignant, and then we will reconcile.

        It's like buying a concrete mixer for a woodworking workshop. Questions firstwhat for","we have no business with concrete","damn, what a concrete mixer, when the circular incense breathes".

        Then the people calm down: "oh well, why jerk, anyway paid for it","what if someday come in handy""a good stand will come out, and the lights on the ceiling, if you stand on it, it’s quite convenient to change"
        1. svp67
          svp67 28 July 2013 10: 15 New
          +1
          Quote: Spade
          "what if someday come in handy"
          Or maybe our shipbuilders will "take up the mind" and again "learn" how to make ships quickly and efficiently ...
          1. Lopatov
            Lopatov 28 July 2013 10: 21 New
            +3
            Is it like "training on cats"? If they lock up, then do not mind?
          2. cdrt
            cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 06 New
            0
            Or maybe our shipbuilders will "take up the mind" and again "learn" how to make ships quickly and efficiently ...

            Programmers say - quickly, efficiently, inexpensively. Only two characteristics are possible at a time. laughing
            Our shipbuilders seem to have only one:
            - either qualitatively, but expensive and long (pr.885)
            - either quickly, but expensively and poorly (20380) as an example repeat
    2. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 28 July 2013 06: 32 New
      +3
      Of course, I did not ship, but I have a question, with such dimensions, the docking is strictly in the middle, how firm is such a connection, I understand that this barge will avoid stormy seas, but anything can happen if such a connection can withstand a normal storm.
      Many are happy with this super expensive barge, but I honestly would have been more happy with a normal cruiser, and even more pleased with an amphibious landing craft.
      1. bddrus
        bddrus 28 July 2013 06: 37 New
        +1
        I also did not ship, but it seems to me the remaining blocks are connected in the same way as they will connect the two halves.
        "normal cruiser"?
        1. vladsolo56
          vladsolo56 28 July 2013 08: 04 New
          +1
          however, there are cases when ships of this size just fall apart strictly in the middle, here is a recent case when a container ship fell apart in half. And this is not an isolated case.
          1. Kavtorang
            Kavtorang 28 July 2013 09: 39 New
            +5
            There is another technological process: a curtain sectional assembly. Take a look at how supertankers, container carriers and RO-RO are being built in Singapore and the UK.
            Everything is fine here: docking of two block-section sets. I don’t see any problems.
            1. grafrozow
              grafrozow 28 July 2013 13: 34 New
              +1
              Quote: Kavtorang
              There is another technological process: a curtain sectional assembly. Take a look at how supertankers, container carriers and RO-RO are being built in Singapore and the UK.

              Yes, even as the Americans built the “Liberty” The latter was written off from us somewhere in the 80s.
          2. MichaelVl
            MichaelVl 28 July 2013 11: 20 New
            +1
            vladsolo56,
            Have you ever thought that the reason for such "collapse" that you are talking about may be improper operation with overload or uneven and improper placement of goods?
            1. grafrozow
              grafrozow 28 July 2013 13: 36 New
              +1
              Quote: MichaelVl
              Have you ever thought that the reason for such "collapse" that you are talking about may be improper operation with overload or uneven and improper placement of goods?

              There are also killer waves.
      2. dustycat
        dustycat 28 July 2013 09: 45 New
        +2
        Quote: vladsolo56
        Of course, I did not ship, but I have a question, with such dimensions, the docking is strictly in the middle, how firm is such a connection, I understand that this barge will avoid stormy seas, but anything can happen if such a connection can withstand a normal storm.

        The most critical seas in terms of wave load are the Arctic Ocean.
        It was not for nothing that ships built for the southern seas fell apart.
        But the ship connected to the Second World War from two ships - there quite calmly served to be written off as needles.
        By the way, the original ships had riveted hulls - they had no problems connected by electric welding.
      3. dustycat
        dustycat 28 July 2013 09: 47 New
        +1
        Quote: vladsolo56

        Many are happy with this super expensive barge, but I honestly would have been more happy with a normal cruiser, and even more pleased with an amphibious landing craft.

        Landing ekranoplan - not the most successful use of ekranoplanes.
        More effective in this design are missile carriers and anti-submarines.
        SVPs are more suitable for the role of paratroopers.
      4. grafrozow
        grafrozow 28 July 2013 13: 29 New
        0
        Quote: vladsolo56
        Many are happy with this super expensive barge, but I honestly would have been more happy with a normal cruiser, and even more pleased with an amphibious landing craft.

        See also why Australia rejected the Mistral. Our order saved the shipyard in Saint-Nazaire from bankruptcy. Who benefits from this?
    3. AVV
      AVV 28 July 2013 08: 40 New
      0
      They’ll build a couple, break in in our conditions, then they will decide whether a second pair is needed or not !!! And no more, the money paid !!!
    4. cdrt
      cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 03 New
      +1
      the closer to completion, the less talk about the need to buy a mistral

      This is exactly what Putin once said: a dog barks, a caravan goes wink
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 28 July 2013 20: 45 New
        -1
        Quote: cdrt
        This is exactly what Putin once said: a dog barks, a caravan goes

        And what difference does it make where he holds the path ... The main thing is to go. And all for disagreeing with the general line appointed by the dogs barked.
  6. Apologet insane
    Apologet insane 28 July 2013 07: 33 New
    -11
    I wonder when the French will start to do rockets or tanks to us?
    1. omsbon
      omsbon 28 July 2013 10: 04 New
      +7
      Quote: Apologet Insane
      , when will the French start rockets or tanks?

      As you will see the Russian tricolor above the Eiffel Tower, you know, they will start soon!
    2. Master Taiga
      Master Taiga 28 July 2013 14: 32 New
      -1
      Given the degree of degradation, ours and dishes will soon be forgotten how to do.
    3. cdrt
      cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 10 New
      +1
      I wonder when the French will start to do rockets or tanks to us?

      Franks us tanks ???
      - Slightly in Tula with my samovar ... laughing

      Although ... tank building in the USSR began, by the way, with a copy of the French tank laughing
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 28 July 2013 20: 46 New
        +1
        But is the situation in our tank building something fundamentally different from the situation in shipbuilding?
  7. Strashila
    Strashila 28 July 2013 07: 58 New
    -1
    I looked at the photo ... compared the sizes, the question arose and why such things in French technology that our shipbuilders could not do ... for which the loot was dumped ... for show-offs, like they bought a maid in French.
    1. Edward72
      Edward72 28 July 2013 08: 31 New
      -1
      Serdyukov and Co. had their own interests
    2. biglow
      biglow 28 July 2013 09: 20 New
      +4
      Quote: Strashila
      I looked at the photo ... compared the sizes, the question arose and why such things in French technology that our shipbuilders could not do ... for which the loot was dumped ... for show-offs, like they bought a maid in French.

      the French and the rest of the world didn’t pass on the technology of block manufacturing of cases. We don’t have such technology, because it appeared only in the 90s, when we had so many difficult times
      1. dustycat
        dustycat 28 July 2013 09: 41 New
        0
        Quote: biglow

        the French and the rest of the world didn’t pass on the technology of block manufacturing of cases. We don’t have such technology, because it appeared only in the 90s, when we had so many difficult times

        Take it easy with such statements.
        Large-block shipbuilding was begun in the USSR.
        Almost half of the surface fleet of the USSR before the war was built using this technology.
        In the 1990s and 2000s, almost all of our shipyards capable of building such were sawn into chermet.
        The purely conclusion of the dough for the hill is to restore our shipyards capable of this cost half the cost of this project (if kickbacks and cuts are not included there).
        1. Dober
          Dober 28 July 2013 12: 19 New
          -1
          Quote: dustycat
          In the 1990s and 2000s, almost all of our shipyards capable of building such were sawn into chermet.

          That's all. I see no other reason.
          It is not clear why Russia will not place orders at the German and Finnish shipyards. After all, all the same, they are almost empty. The year before last was in Helsinki. Huge Docks are empty. Probably the same situation in Turku and Rauma, where the largest cruise ships were built.
          Although the corps for the Russian destroyers could be assembled, they would be armed at home.
          It would be possible to agree with the bourgeoisie by installments. You can pay hydrocarbons With those money now - * oops ...
          1. donavi49
            donavi49 28 July 2013 18: 09 New
            +5
            Already do it. For example, the handsome Vitus Bering was made at the Vyborg Shipyard, and then equipped at Arctech Helsinki Shipyard Oy (STX Finland - STX Corporation, at the shipyards of which Mistral is actually being built). Baltzavod’s icebreakers will be built in a similar way.
          2. cdrt
            cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 13 New
            +1
            Although the corps for the Russian destroyers could be assembled, they would be armed at home.

            So there are problems with the construction of hulls, it seems like our shipyards do not have?
            But systems, weapons - this is a problem.
        2. biglow
          biglow 28 July 2013 13: 03 New
          +4
          Quote: dustycat
          Quote: biglow

          the French and the rest of the world didn’t pass on the technology of block manufacturing of cases. We don’t have such technology, because it appeared only in the 90s, when we had so many difficult times

          Take it easy with such statements.
          Large-block shipbuilding was begun in the USSR.
          Almost half of the surface fleet of the USSR before the war was built using this technology.
          In the 1990s and 2000s, almost all of our shipyards capable of building such were sawn into chermet.
          The purely conclusion of the dough for the hill is to restore our shipyards capable of this cost half the cost of this project (if kickbacks and cuts are not included there).

          let's be realistic, now such a ship and for such a time in Russia can not be built for any money. And ships for the fleet are needed yesterday. Therefore, we must take everything that is and have time to build our own
      2. Coward
        Coward 28 July 2013 10: 26 New
        +5
        Batma Ave. 1288 in Nikolaev built on such technology. And "riveted" 113 ships from 1974 to the end of the 90s
      3. Sochi
        Sochi 28 July 2013 12: 49 New
        +2
        If I am not mistaken, then in this way amers in the second world built transports of the Liberty type, and in large numbers.
    3. Denin
      Denin 28 July 2013 09: 33 New
      +5
      Ours buy technology along with the Mistrals, I heard that our shipbuilders had a different ship construction technology, they built it completely in monolith, it was affected by cost and complexity, and the French have a block construction technology, and ours also want to master it. It is unlikely that the French sold us only the technology; I had to buy Mistral in the appendage.
      I think they said here
      http://www.echo.msk.ru/programs/arsenal/
      24 June 2013, 22: 10
      Arsenal
      Subject: A new stage in the domestic military and civil shipbuilding
    4. bddrus
      bddrus 29 July 2013 11: 12 New
      0
      our shipbuilders - which ones? let the frigates with corvettes start building normally, then the destroyers. Estimate how many years we would wait for something like this from development to delivery.
  8. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 28 July 2013 08: 14 New
    +5
    Quote: vladsolo56
    however, there are cases when ships of this size just fall apart strictly in the middle, here is a recent case when a container ship fell apart in half. And this is not an isolated case.

    Tipun to your tongue .. God forbid !!
  9. CLUTCH
    CLUTCH BAGS 28 July 2013 09: 13 New
    +2
    And anyway, congratulations on the holiday !!!
  10. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 28 July 2013 09: 42 New
    +2
    Quote: buzuke
    the closer to completion, the less talk about the need to purchase the Mistral

    Not certainly in that way. Rather, about a suitcase without a handle - and uncomfortable to drag and throw away a pity.
  11. alone
    alone 28 July 2013 10: 13 New
    -2
    Mizirali this cut dough. you yourself can build no worse
    1. svp67
      svp67 28 July 2013 10: 18 New
      +6
      Quote: lonely
      Mizirali this cut dough. you yourself can build no worse
      Something in the light of the latest news, you begin to doubt it - the French shipbuilders, compared to ours, look preferable. And they are doing everything on time and all the details and sections they fit together, and most importantly quickly ... It seems ours needs to learn not so much "what to build, but how to build ...".
      1. Blackgrifon
        Blackgrifon 28 July 2013 18: 43 New
        +1
        Quote: svp67
        and most importantly quickly ... It seems ours needs to learn not so much "what to build, but how to build ...".


        There is one good example - in the second half of the twentieth century, the British tank design bureau so "got" their native leadership with "ideas" (on the principle that if we think of a basin on the tracks, they will buy it anyway) that the government announced a competition for a new tank for the army and allowed the Americans and the French to attack him (though they shouldn't have won it). As a result, the English design bureaus woke up and began to work as expected.

        It's me that m. an example of HOW and at what speed it is NECESSARY to build ships will make the USC work faster and better.
  12. Grigorich 1962
    Grigorich 1962 28 July 2013 10: 31 New
    +6
    but I liked that it’s so clean on the pier ... nothing superfluous ....... in Sevamash we’ll break a horse’s foot ... what where ... where .... we probably decide to confuse the likely enemy
    1. Blackgrifon
      Blackgrifon 28 July 2013 18: 45 New
      +2
      It's all about the organization of labor. Yes, and in the motivation of workers. What do you want if a technologist in the defense industry gets less than a seller at McDonalds? And this despite the fact that in all developed countries, the military-industrial complex is the engine of the economy.


  13. alone
    alone 28 July 2013 10: 59 New
    +3
    foreigners value order at their enterprises. Everything is arranged in their shelves. this is their quality mark.
    1. Dober
      Dober 28 July 2013 12: 22 New
      0
      Quote: lonely
      foreigners value order at their enterprises. Everything is arranged in their shelves. this is their quality mark.

      We read yesterday's article about Naglia.
  14. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 28 July 2013 11: 46 New
    +2
    Quote: svp67
    It seems ours needs to learn not so much "what to build, but how to build ...".

    Golden words, "Yuri Venediktovich" (c.)
    It brought me, just now, the fate of the Zvezda Shipyard (Bolshoi Kamen) - oh, and sadness is there!
    But, the theme was voiced that they are going to do military acceptance from scratch. He adhered to his candidacy and this is what it turns out: only former officers of the Navy who have not reached the age limit, well knowing the organization of ship repair and shipbuilding.
    Well, let's see recourse
  15. Asan Ata
    Asan Ata 28 July 2013 11: 52 New
    +2
    Seven feet under the keel!
  16. RMRS
    RMRS 28 July 2013 12: 06 New
    +4
    Well, why did you attack our shipbuilders so much? You didn’t build anything especially for 15 years and then immediately release everything for you in 3 years (This happens only in a fairy tale. So many personnel were spent, so many were stolen, destroyed. The technologies are old, the equipment is the same (What do we want? Although they lowered the stern on time (it means they can do it on time when necessary). Shipbuilding needs to be re-equipped, staff must be trained and order put in place in the manual. Then, not only will the stern be lowered on time, but all orders. It’s just a shipyard whose directors are business executives (Krasnoe Sormovo, Z Yelenodolsky, Diamond, Vyborg, Sredne-Nevsky), and there are some where there are only “managers.” So compare “managers” and “business executives.” USC is good, but this pyramid has cut the state money. They’re not afraid of the consequences, they’ll cry "It’s all bad, but we work, they forgive them everything. Shipbuilding needs 2-3% loans, not 20% each, enriching so-so-tired bankers. Because on the defense industry, you can easily raise money for business (I’m writing not out of self-interest), but it’s hard for them to get up, USC is crushing. I really liked at the salon in St. Petersburg that there were a lot of private companies that jumped out of their skin to get their part of the pie and, most importantly, they will produce everything on time. But alas, the state corporation did it so that there was “control” and “stable growth”, but it will not happen. This is sad.
    With the Feast of all those involved in the Navy, let the state and the managers do not grind your tongue for good, but put into operation weapons that can protect the homeland.
  17. Watchman
    Watchman 28 July 2013 12: 10 New
    +3
    It would be more pleasant for me to read about the commissioning of Severodvinsk or even the laying of the destroyer of a new project on holiday, but the Mistral is also nothing.
  18. Sochi
    Sochi 28 July 2013 12: 52 New
    +3
    Happy Morimena !!! A fair wind and seven feet under the keel !!!
  19. homosum20
    homosum20 28 July 2013 14: 25 New
    0
    There is a lot of water in the dry dock.
    Apparently, this is a FRENCH dry dock.
    1. grafrozow
      grafrozow 28 July 2013 15: 44 New
      +2
      Quote: homosum20
      There is a lot of water in the dry dock.
      Apparently, this is a FRENCH dry dock.

      Do not say nonsense, dear. They pump out water. Do not confuse the drydock with the floating dock. Ships of such sizes are laid on the slipways, and brought to mind in drydocks.
    2. cdrt
      cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 18 New
      0
      There is a lot of water in the dry dock.
      Apparently, this is a FRENCH dry dock.

      Everyone knows that ships are teleported to / from the dry dock.
      And sloppy Frenchmen just got water laughing
  20. homosum20
    homosum20 28 July 2013 14: 46 New
    -2
    I did not understand the minus. And what, for a dry dock it is not enough there?
  21. Zhenya
    Zhenya 28 July 2013 15: 16 New
    +1
    A healthy ship ... surprised by the size.
    1. grafrozow
      grafrozow 28 July 2013 17: 40 New
      +1
      Quote: Marrying
      A healthy ship ... surprised by the size.

      Do not offend the Navy, the ship is in the merchant fleet, in the Navy ship. drinks Happy Navy Day !!!
      1. Coward
        Coward 28 July 2013 19: 24 New
        0
        Well, why? There are support vessels in the Navy.
        1. grafrozow
          grafrozow 28 July 2013 20: 36 New
          0
          Quote: Coward
          Well, why? There are support vessels in the Navy.

          Yes there is, but it’s not correct to compare them with warships. It’s like comparing civilian plumbing with a soldier, because both are in one part, only one works and the other serves. hi
        2. grafrozow
          grafrozow 28 July 2013 20: 37 New
          0
          Quote: Coward
          Well, why? There are support vessels in the Navy.

          Yes there is, but it’s not correct to compare them with warships. It’s like comparing civilian plumbing with a soldier, because both are in one part, only one works and the other serves. hi
          1. Coward
            Coward 29 July 2013 05: 35 New
            0
            Is a floating hospital a "hospital ship" or a "hospital ship"?
            It flies the flag of auxiliary vessels of the Russian Navy.
      2. The comment was deleted.
  22. Pashhenko Nikolay
    Pashhenko Nikolay 28 July 2013 15: 22 New
    +3
    Quote: Dober
    For example at the Pacific Fleet. Well, they gathered up fighters from all over the Far East. Plunged. Send with God's help. Where? And what to cover? Two BOD and three boats?

    Well, as we recall, a war with Georgia unexpectedly arose and paratroopers landed from the BDK on the shore, and the cruiser Moscow escorted them successfully. And it seems, why did we need the BDK in the Black Sea?
    1. PLO
      PLO 28 July 2013 15: 35 New
      +1
      Well, as we recall, a war with Georgia suddenly arose and paratroopers landed from the BDK on the beach

      about suddenly you are very mistaken.

      and the cruiser Moscow escorted them successfully covered.

      the cruiser Moscow all the time stood on the roadstead of Sevastopol and did not directly cover the BDK.

      2 BDK covered only 1 MRK and 1 IPC.

      Well, nothing, but now these 1 IPCs and 1 RTOs will cover the whole Mistral and provide him with reliable protection
  23. Zhenya
    Zhenya 28 July 2013 15: 40 New
    +2
    Quote: olp
    Well, as we recall, a war with Georgia suddenly arose and paratroopers landed from the BDK on the beach

    about suddenly you are very mistaken.

    and the cruiser Moscow escorted them successfully covered.

    the cruiser Moscow all the time stood on the roadstead of Sevastopol and did not directly cover the BDK.

    2 BDK covered only 1 MRK and 1 IPC.

    Well, nothing, but now these 1 IPCs and 1 RTOs will cover the whole Mistral and provide him with reliable protection

    Well, what do you ulcerate then? This ship will sail to Vladivostok, where does the Black Sea and its cover?
    1. PLO
      PLO 28 July 2013 16: 10 New
      +1
      Well, what do you ulcerate then? This ship will sail to Vladivostok, where does the Black Sea and its cover?

      many sincerely believe that the Mistrals were necessary in 888.

      This the ship will sail away to Vladivostok

      notice not i said that
      1. Zhenya
        Zhenya 28 July 2013 17: 27 New
        0
        Well, I’m not a fan of just this ship and I don’t know if it makes sense at all.
        1. grafrozow
          grafrozow 28 July 2013 17: 46 New
          +1
          tongue
          Quote: Marrying
          Well, I’m not a fan of just this ship and I don’t know if it makes sense at all.

          Eugene, they put a vessel in the hospital under the patients, they use it in the tyulkin fleet, "Mistral" is a ship. am
  24. Rumata
    Rumata 28 July 2013 15: 51 New
    +3
    I’m an ignoramus in everything connected with the fleet, I don’t know whether such a ship is needed or not needed, I can only tell local specialists what it looks like

    By the way, make it clear. Is the construction of a lumpy part on Russian wharfs not a kind of accumulation of experience in the construction of such ships? In addition, the very fact that the nose is waiting in France makes us not relax the rolls and settle on time, which is also very important against the background of many "long-term construction projects"
    1. PLO
      PLO 28 July 2013 16: 31 New
      +2
      By the way, make it clear. Is the construction of a lumpy part on Russian wharfs not a kind of accumulation of experience in the construction of such ships? In addition, the very fact that the nose is waiting in France makes us not relax the rolls and settle on time, which is also very important against the background of many "long-term construction projects"

      a certain moment about “makes you not relax the rolls and settle on time” certainly has a place to be.

      But the reasons for long-term construction are too numerous.
      The construction of the hulls themselves has long been no longer a problem (the construction of the 11356s of the same stern of Mistral is a confirmation of this), ships are turning into long-term construction for many other reasons.
      The shipyard can build and assemble the hull arbitrarily quickly, but if there is nothing to saturate it, i.e. equipment and subsystems are not delivered on time, it will still turn into a long-term construction.

      Therefore, the construction of the Mistral is not indicative, because we only need to build a part of the bare building (which we already did normally), and all the rest of the equipment will be supplied by France, moreover, this equipment has already been worked out and there are no problems with its production.
      So the statement that they say we will buy the Mistrals and ourselves will learn how to build ships like him is extremely short-sighted. As soon as we try to build it on our own, we will immediately encounter the fact that a huge number of enterprises involved in the construction of this ship will begin to disrupt the deadlines.
      at the same time, we do not have to wait for any modernization of the production of our shipyards, they built the same stern of the Mistral in exactly the same way as all the rest of our ships.
      IMHO, it would be better if money instead of these Mistrals would be invested in the same modernization of shipyard production by purchasing a new machine park, modernizing workshops, building new crane equipment, etc.
      This would give hundreds of times great benefits to our shipbuilding industry.
      1. donavi49
        donavi49 28 July 2013 18: 00 New
        +2
        Well, they do it anyway. In practice, the amount of funds allocated for the re-equipment of production (and this is a separate article) simply cannot be mastered locally. For example, Sevmash last year mastered less than 30% of the allocated funds.
        1. PLO
          PLO 28 July 2013 18: 26 New
          0
          Well, they do it anyway. In practice, the amount of funds allocated for the re-equipment of production (and this is a separate article) simply cannot be mastered locally. For example, Sevmash last year mastered less than 30% of the allocated funds.

          and this is the second bottom of the problem .. and its solution is far from obvious.
          that's just the purchase of the Mistrals will not contribute to this in any way
          1. cdrt
            cdrt 28 July 2013 20: 23 New
            0
            that's just the purchase of the Mistrals will not contribute to this in any way

            Will contribute.
            The race for the leader will not allow you to sit exactly on your ass and moan / stupidly cut government funds.
            I think the experience with Mistral will be continued in some form (fairly precise, but visual).
            You look at the threat of competition and problems "magically" to be solved in the USC faster at times will start
      2. grafrozow
        grafrozow 28 July 2013 18: 09 New
        +2
        Quote: olp
        So the statement that they say we will buy the Mistrals and ourselves will learn how to build ships like him is extremely short-sighted. As soon as we try to build it on our own, we will immediately encounter the fact that a huge number of enterprises involved in the construction of this ship will begin to disrupt the deadlines.
        at the same time, we don’t have to wait for any modernization of the production of our shipyards,

        Quote: olp
        it would be better if money instead of these Mistrals would be invested in the same modernization of shipyard production, through the purchase of a new machine park, the modernization of workshops, the construction of new crane equipment, etc.
        This would give hundreds of times great benefits to our shipbuilding industry.

        Something reminiscent of the situation with our football, we bought the legionnaires, we pay them awesome money, but there is no money for our youth schools. How to grow our talents? Imagine the biathlon championship of Russia for the team of the Sverdlovsk region. favors Wagner Love or Kaka. This is not funny, bitter. How, with the slogan of our government, will we support a domestic producer? How much will the Mistral content cost us? After all, they will also have to buy spare parts, and if they do not want to sell them? No matter how it turns out, the input is a penny, and the output is the ruble.
        1. donavi49
          donavi49 28 July 2013 18: 32 New
          +4
          Which part? Engines, so there fraternal Vyatsila are from Finland, we have half of the auxiliary and 3 / 4 of the rest of the fleet on them. Electronics - well, it’s more complicated here, on the other hand, we have no analogues either to go with the level of 90's, or with a foreign one. Lifting, various mechanisms, chillers, etc., etc. are interchangeable and the French themselves buy a lot.

          Example - F-14 in Iran is flying today, the states have blocked their spare parts for how many years? Similarly, with the frigates of the Iranian Navy, which was still purchased by the Shah, most of the chassis. Well, this is not to go deep.
  25. Kibalchish
    Kibalchish 28 July 2013 16: 26 New
    +2
    Quote: Rumata
    I’m an ignoramus in everything connected with the fleet, I don’t know whether such a ship is needed or not needed, I can only tell local specialists what it looks like

    By the way, make it clear. Is the construction of a lumpy part on Russian wharfs not a kind of accumulation of experience in the construction of such ships? In addition, the very fact that the nose is waiting in France makes us not relax the rolls and settle on time, which is also very important against the background of many "long-term construction projects"

    Yes, that's exactly what the calculation is for. Over the 20 years, many specialists have lost and much needs to be created from scratch. By the way, the feed of this miracle was made in Russia. So learn slowly.
  26. Kibalchish
    Kibalchish 28 July 2013 16: 33 New
    -2
    In addition, our already practiced landing on the "Mistral"
    1. grafrozow
      grafrozow 29 July 2013 00: 48 New
      0
      Quote: Kibalchish
      In addition, our already practiced landing on the "Mistral"

      Yes, but they didn’t fit in the elevator.
  27. Kibalchish
    Kibalchish 28 July 2013 16: 43 New
    -2
    Quote: Marrying
    Quote: olp
    Well, as we recall, a war with Georgia suddenly arose and paratroopers landed from the BDK on the beach

    about suddenly you are very mistaken.

    and the cruiser Moscow escorted them successfully covered.

    the cruiser Moscow all the time stood on the roadstead of Sevastopol and did not directly cover the BDK.

    2 BDK covered only 1 MRK and 1 IPC.

    Well, nothing, but now these 1 IPCs and 1 RTOs will cover the whole Mistral and provide him with reliable protection

    Well, what do you ulcerate then? Given the ship will sail away to Vladivostok, where does the Black Sea and its cover?

    The ship will leave
  28. Vorchun
    Vorchun 28 July 2013 17: 06 New
    +2
    Quote: Dober
    Quote: avt
    Botik GDP named after Serdyukov.



    And you’ll call Serdyukov -
    Do not get away from trouble:
    This schooner and in the swamp
    Swallows water


    Well, today is different

    This schooner and in the swamp
    slip the steering wheel without soaking
  29. shoroh
    shoroh 28 July 2013 18: 29 New
    0
    It’s stupid to scold the ship, knowing exactly what kind of equipment it will be there. It’s one thing if the purely paratrooper, with the complete absence of shock weapons. Another thing is if there will be powerful air defense and cruise missiles with long-range helicopters. Such a colossus can accommodate a lot of weapons. In addition, the speed is 18 knots, by whom is it measured? I don’t think that all performance characteristics of military equipment will be so easy to talk on the Internet, rather the opposite. Imagine that he has a speed of 30 knots, and the corresponding weapons, and SUDDENLY barges have become formidable attack ships. In fact, if there is money, let them order ships abroad too, for the capacities of domestic shipyards are greatly undermined after the collapse of the Union. Any opportunity to build a high-quality and modern warship for Russia must be used! Russia has always been a strong fleet, so many glorious victories, it remains for the small - to implement plans.
  30. malikszh
    malikszh 28 July 2013 19: 16 New
    +1
    This ship must be deployed in the Mediterranean Sea and Russia will not need to rent a base to save a lot of money.
  31. Vlad_Mir
    Vlad_Mir 28 July 2013 19: 34 New
    +3
    It will be a great modern ship. In addition, Russian shipbuilders will be able to get an interesting experience!
  32. kotvov
    kotvov 28 July 2013 21: 12 New
    +1
    I’m not a strategist, but can someone explain why IT is possible for the country. Maybe we will start capturing the colonies. About technologies: France, as I heard, refused to supply electronic equipment. We think we ourselves will be able to supply anyone we want. What will he do in Vladivostok? Questions questions.
  33. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 28 July 2013 21: 30 New
    0
    Quote: grafrozow
    See also why Australia abandoned the Mistral.

    Australia refused, specifically, the Mistrals during a tender in which the United States, Spain, France and South Korea participated.
    And they chose a version of the Spanish “Juan Carlos-I” modified for the customer’s requirements. And the requirements there were quite specific - they first of all needed a platform for the F-35 STVOL, landing operations - according to the residual principle. Accordingly, the Adelaide and Canberra will still be light aircraft carriers, not UDC.
    IMHO.
  34. Roman_999
    Roman_999 28 July 2013 21: 41 New
    0
    Why isn’t they building in Russia? Why don’t they take over the experience if they are not building here? France, the country of NATO, damn it, I don’t understand what kind of splicing it is, I can immediately go into the gums to run off .... or turn around more comfortably I don’t know what is more popular there in Europe ...
    1. Kavtorang
      Kavtorang 28 July 2013 22: 06 New
      0
      Quote: Roman_999
      Why isn’t they building in Russia? Why don’t they take over the experience if they are not building here? France NATO country damn

      No dough wink , but seriously, there is neither political will, nor a clear naval doctrine. What is is toilet paper. What to do with these UDC? I already gave an example - the commander of the BV, having an introduction to the presence of Mistral, for the transfer of the MP brigade to Sakhalin, demanded a preventive strike by nuclear weapons against all naval and anti-aircraft forces of one island state. Otherwise, they’ll drown both the ships and the Marine Corps - the "bottleneck", to hell.
      France was not a member of NATO from 1966 to 2009 and passed a very interesting and distinctive path of military-technical development.
      1. PLO
        PLO 28 July 2013 22: 13 New
        0
        MP brigades on Sakhalin

        uh?
        and railway ways will not be faster? what
  35. ed1968
    ed1968 28 July 2013 22: 00 New
    0
    first consider ready. excellently managed
  36. Kavtorang
    Kavtorang 28 July 2013 22: 20 New
    +1
    Quote: olp
    won't it be faster by rail?

    Ferry to Vanino? Not an option, the exercises are not even considered - to be disabled in the first salvo. On the other side of the map are also far from absolute cretins
    And then, extreme exercises showed that the readiness of any LLC and OJSC to work according to mobilization plans is close to zero
    1. Rustam
      Rustam 29 July 2013 00: 12 New
      +2


      (Wick "What is the destroyer of the Chinese, the Russian - scrap)

      Until we get rid of such directors and managers, we will lament that theirs is better there - Mr. Rogozin, it’s time to put things in order in the military-industrial complex, which you supervise (although they talk about the situation in the late 90s), I think little has changed, by 80 % of factories and enterprises, such managers and management remained here

      We’ll also return once again how did this company go bankrupt SV received so many orders? Naturally they are unable to fulfill them on time and efficiently (hi to the former Minister Ivanov and the company) notice Serdyukov there wasn’t there yet
      1. PLO
        PLO 29 July 2013 01: 21 New
        0
        For reference, Pugachev (just that crook about whom this interesting story was) belonged to both the Severnaya Verf and the Baltic Shipyard until 2012, after which OSK took control of them through their bankruptcy.

        I wonder if you really think that the BZ is now on its way to a brighter future through the construction of the Mistral stern, and the Federation Council is still brazenly profiting from lobbied orders?
  37. The comment was deleted.
    1. Kavtorang
      Kavtorang 28 July 2013 23: 55 New
      0
      Thanks for the video - did not see.
      Well, what can I say -Rois in the fart - hooray
      by mom herself, don’t worry and okay. Maybe the eyes of someone will open (so as not to yell about "our having no analogues in the world")
      The reliability of the video on the Far Eastern Shipyard / Shipyard - I confirm
  38. grafrozow
    grafrozow 29 July 2013 01: 09 New
    0
    Interestingly, the contract for the supply of Mistral from the Russian side was signed by Deputy Prime Minister Sechin I.I. by education, philologist, novelist, teacher of Portuguese and French. At present, he is president of Rosneft. A man with an interesting biography, looked at Wikipedia.
  39. donavi49
    donavi49 29 July 2013 10: 54 New
    +3
    Aligned stern and bow, current status for yesterday.