Military Review

To the vile answer of Russia to the excusable prank of Ukraine

230
To the vile answer of Russia to the excusable prank of Ukraine... Here, not so long ago, one very significant thing happened, in fact, but for some reason a very unexpected event for the current Ukrainian authorities: they were surprised to learn that Russia, it turns out, is also a WTO member.


More than that.

As a member of this organization, the “entry” in which is still the subject of heated debate among the native Russian aspen, it turns out, has not only obligations towards the “civilized world” (to which, undoubtedly, “by birth” refers to second France "), but also certain rights prescribed in statutory documents.

And what really does not climb into any gate - can use them.

Moreover, sometimes even in a one-sided, as they say, order, without consulting anyone, including the “world community”, which, from the point of view of the modern Ukrainian authoritative mentality, has only to do what stand, so to speak, to guard the economic interests of the young Ukrainian democracy.

I explain.

Here, not so long ago, the state of the Russian Federation sent a notice to the World Trade Organization (we emphasize precisely “notice”) that the introduction of special duties on cars for cars that entered into force in March 2013 of the year is discriminatory for Russian manufacturers. And causes damage to Russian exports in the amount of 328 million US dollars, not counting 36 million dollars of taxes that are not received by the budget of the above-mentioned state.

Well, what can I say.

No, at first, Ukraine reacted quite calmly to this screencasting document: you never know who lost what, and where, and why it writes: these are the problems of the Moskal Indians who are not interested in sheriffs, as they say, simply by definition.

Delov something.

We will meet, talk, discuss, explain that “these hands have never been stolen”, we will offer to meet to talk again, and if we don’t agree, let them sue. No problem.

Everything has long been thought out and calculated, we have a sovereign right, so we use it sovereignly - the WTO, in the end, is a bureaucratic organization - until they figure it out until they send the necessary "notices": in short, or the donkey will die, or the padish. Turks too, for example, complain. They promise to impose special duties on the import of Ukrainian nuts, they have the right.

True, after the decision of the WTO Trade Council and the meeting of the special bilateral Turkish-Ukrainian commission on economic cooperation, which, undoubtedly, someday will take place sooner or later.

And the money is already - here they are, in the budget, dear. Moreover, even already spent. Excuse me…

... The answer of the “northern barbarians”, however, was for Kiev, frankly, somewhat unexpected. The Russians behaved like genuine savages, who did not know the rules of the hostel in the civilized world, did not invite anyone to any negotiations, but simply - within the framework of the same “WTO rules” in which, it turns out, such garbage is provided for, response measures. Namely, about the unilateral introduction of special duties for the import of Ukrainian coal on 54%, chocolate (ten eurocents per kilogram of finished products) and glass (15%, respectively), and without any preliminary discussion. Salo, chemistry and metal have so far, however, decided not to touch: fat is due to Ukraine’s lack of export opportunities (Polish and Belarusian themselves are used), and chemistry and metal are, apparently, purely humanitarian, for reasons.

Or - until the next time they decided to take care not to think that there was absolutely nothing to lose, or - something else.

But still, to put it mildly, it is unpleasant.

Moreover, as soon as Moscow these “uncivilized” and which, according to the Ukrainian Commissioner for European Integration Valery Pyatnitsky, will introduce the “pressure element” in the person of the above-mentioned special duties, you don’t want to join them as well. participants of the Customs Union, they have a common border.

And this, for a moment, is a third of Ukrainian exports, actually.

And - nothing can be done.

Although no, I lie, you can: as a civilized country, in contrast to wild Russia, a country, Ukraine has every right to appeal first to the WTO Trade Council, and then try to discuss this, such an unexpected, problem of tricky ass and thread bolt as part of a special Ukraine Russian Economic Cooperation Commission.

Something like that.
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230 comments
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  1. Refund_SSSR
    Refund_SSSR 18 July 2013 06: 52
    39 th
    I just don’t understand why the Russians, who want to spend their BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money, are required to pay GIANT duties for foreign cars? The very duties that were introduced as a temporary measure for a very short time ... Well, where is the cancellation?
    This is not a duty - this is direct theft from the pockets of citizens ... Rekit.
    Honestly, this policy of pushing pelvic tanks is already sickened ... Russia does not have a civil automobile industry. NO !!! And what it is is a miserable parody of a modern car.
    ___
    Well, according to the article - "for every cunning .. there is a bolt with a screw."
    But what is offended by a neighbor who did exactly the same as he did with his other neighbor, who is also a member of the WTO ... and not with one neighbor, but literally with each?
    The situation with duties and entry into the WTO is a shame for the Russian Federation.
    In your own eye, the log is not visible?
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 07: 49
      43
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      I just don’t understand why the Russians, who want to spend their BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money, are required to pay GIANT duties for foreign cars? The very duties that were introduced as a temporary measure for a very short time ... Well, where is the cancellation?

      Even if duties are now canceled, prices for used cars will not fall. The lower the price, the less profit. Everyone is accustomed to and commerce is not suckers, that would miss her.
      1. fzr1000
        fzr1000 18 July 2013 08: 27
        +7
        Profit still depends on the turnover of capital. So prices would fall. Just not the amount of duties, but somewhere around 20-25 percent.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 08: 36
          11
          Quote: fzr1000
          Profit still depends on the turnover of capital. So prices would fall

          I don’t know where you are from, but be in Vlada drive them to the green, most of them drag cars from Japan and not in dozens, but in pieces. At the same time, prices are that of large suppliers, that of small (piece) ones are the same. It makes no sense to reduce the price when the product is in demand. Plus the fact that now cars are sold at auctions, people work at rates. Who gave more, he bought hi
          1. Nicholas C.
            Nicholas C. 18 July 2013 08: 57
            32
            Russia formally, on much more favorable terms than Ukraine, joined the WTO. Yushchenko handed over Ukraine to the WTO so that the protective customs tariff there is lower than that of the European Union. Part of the industry in Ukraine rose only because of this. Based on this, Russia is acting. Bachil eyes that signed, now do it. Will it still be when the association with the EU is signed. Yushchenko with the WTO as paradise will be remembered.

            Glad to see Dima Lekuha here. (Although this is a reprint from another resource).
            1. APASUS
              APASUS 18 July 2013 11: 33
              14
              Quote: Nikolai S.
              Bachil eyes that signed, now do it. Will it still be when the association with the EU is signed. Yushchenko with the WTO as paradise will be remembered.

              It flashed here that the WTO accession agreement has 6000 pages,
              so I think not all parliamentarians even imagine what it is ........ about the fact that they read the entire treaty, I'm not talking!
            2. Protoucr
              Protoucr 18 July 2013 12: 33
              20 th
              Let's see what happens when you have a global gas price in the country soon
              1. Gecko
                Gecko 18 July 2013 13: 13
                12
                Well, in any case, they will be cheaper than yours, because There are no customs or transportation fees. Plus, there was a rumor that they wanted to freeze gas and electricity prices.
                1. PSih2097
                  PSih2097 18 July 2013 13: 37
                  -5
                  Plus, there was a rumor that they wanted to freeze gas and electricity prices.

                  the fact of the matter is that rumor will increase to NG, in the wake of excise taxes on gasoline.
              2. Semen Semyonitch
                Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 13: 57
                +1
                Quote: Protoucr
                Let's see what happens when you have a global gas price in the country soon

                ... but that's another story (Munchausen)
              3. lelikas
                lelikas 18 July 2013 14: 26
                +4
                Quote: Protoucr
                Let's see what happens when you have a global gas price in the country soon

                I do not think that it is very different, judging by the price of gasoline.
                1. Corneli
                  Corneli 18 July 2013 17: 32
                  -7
                  Quote: lelikas
                  Let's see what happens when you have a global gas price in the country soon

                  I do not think that it is very different, judging by the price of gasoline.

                  The gas price (world) and the gas price for enterprises and the public are 3 different things. Ukraine has a high price for the state (world), the price for enterprises mainly comes from it (because they have low profitability and competitiveness), but the price for the population is almost 3 times lower. The difference in price between incoming and for consumers (population, some enterprises) is paid from the state. the budget. So gas prices and gas prices for the population are not related. If in Russia they raise the domestic price of gas and at the same time there will be no state. subsidies then the rent will be higher than the Ukrainian order of magnitude, and industry does not seem enough ....
                  1. orek
                    orek 18 July 2013 19: 21
                    +5
                    Quote: Corneli
                    The gas price (world) and the gas price for enterprises and the public are 3 different things. Ukraine has a high price for the state (world), the price for enterprises mainly comes from it (because they have low profitability and competitiveness), but the price for the population is almost 3 times lower. The difference in price between incoming and for consumers (population, some enterprises) is paid from the state. the budget.

                    write beautifully. right. Just do not negotiate, and maybe not fully understand the topic. And EXACTLY: 1. go to the state website STATISTICS OF UKRAINE and see a.) The amount of gas produced in Ukraine; b) approximate gas consumption in the public sector; c) the amount of associated energy carriers and a lot of interesting digits. after that, GO for the cost of production in the country, taking into account delivery. After that, find on the Internet the owners of the entire chain PRODUCTION- DELIVERY TO THE CONSUMER, and after all the manipulations P ,,,,,,,,,,, and cry about the surcharges from the STATE BUDGET. something like that.!!
                    1. Corneli
                      Corneli 19 July 2013 15: 04
                      +1
                      Quote: orek
                      write beautifully. right. Just do not negotiate, and maybe not fully understand the topic.

                      I did not even think about any beauty and "negotiating" (I wrote to stop (if possible) a series of inadequate posts (srach with accusations) that do not carry any normal information (posts can be read above). did not consider it necessary (at this stage). And actually, where did you see MY crying? Read carefully the thread with comments on this topic, it describes the situation in Ukraine (current) and, presumably, what may be in Russia (allegedly in the future).
                      P.S. Who put the minuses and why ... I wonder) Tolya "zapadentsy" - everything is bad with us. Tol - "patriots of Russia" - like how could you think that we will be bad)
              4. ultra
                ultra 18 July 2013 14: 39
                +4
                Quote: Protoucr
                when you will have a global gas price in the country soon

                IMHO-Only when we run out of gas and we will import from behind the hill. hi
              5. Semen Semyonitch
                Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 14: 59
                +5
                Quote: Protoucr
                Let's see what happens when you have a global gas price in the country soon

                I can reassure you ... We don't even have gas anywhere ... All for you, yes, partners "...
              6. M. Peter
                M. Peter 18 July 2013 18: 52
                +2
                I’ll also look, we have never had his spawn. I mean, in our region it is not gasified. We manage with electricity, enough like that.
        2. Igor
          Igor 18 July 2013 08: 43
          11
          somehow you cunningly argue ... do you have such historical examples of falling prices ??
          I think prices will not notice the absence of duties.

          Imagine, prices all over the country fell at once, what will be your actions?
          You write a statement that you would be reduced ZP ??? Well, to maintain a balance in the economy?
          For example, I will shout "WOW !!!" and I'll run to buy better and more expensive things ..
          and I will by all means resist the decline of my RFP.

          But how do you plan to explain to entrepreneurs that they have earned too much? And what they really don’t want so much .. This is very not obvious to me ...
      2. Refund_SSSR
        Refund_SSSR 18 July 2013 09: 54
        +2
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        everyone is used to and commerce is not suckers, that would miss her.

        There is such a service as the Federal Antimonopoly Service, the existence of which is often nominative ... But nevertheless, this is a thieves' desk of dormoids and is called upon to control and resolve such price conspiracies ...
        Something like this ...
        But you can believe in the sanctity and sincerity of the aligarchic elite and believe that the main thing is to attract plants in the Russian Federation, and not to cut YOU wink
        1. Blackgrifon
          Blackgrifon 18 July 2013 10: 20
          +6
          Quote: We refund_SSSR
          There is such a service as the Federal Antimonopoly Service, the existence of which is often nominative ... But nevertheless, this is a thieves' desk of dormoids and is called upon to control and resolve such price conspiracies ...


          Her, comrade, FAS only works with small and medium business. Monopolies (oil industry workers), as a legal entity, judging by their behavior, do not perceive it.
          1. Refund_SSSR
            Refund_SSSR 18 July 2013 10: 49
            +2
            Quote: Blackgrifon
            judging by the behavior, do not perceive.

            So, therefore, the existence of this structure is purely nominal, and the essence is criminal due to the fact that large organizations sell into the smoke and frightens a trifle.
            1. Basileus
              Basileus 18 July 2013 14: 34
              +1
              Yeah. If you try, you can throw someone with so many complaints that he will get out of them for several months. But the prices of hydrogen sulfide are growing by leaps and bounds, and the FAS does not care - they are more interested in the clauses on the bidding procedures.
    2. Joker
      Joker 18 July 2013 08: 14
      31
      We have import duties not only because of the support of the pelvis, but primarily to open factories on the territory of the Russian Federation, the Japanese still resist, the Germans are slowly creeping over to us, the Americans have long been with us, and that's all. And I will tell you a lot of money in the piggy bank of the country, besides, they produce fords from AvtoVAZ, you need to invest money in it, to update production lines + new jobs. Now collect utilization collection, BUT it is generally small, about 20 TR on the car, with trucks sucks of course, there is a large collection, especially if used. from abroad to deliver. For example, Gaz will have a Mercedes to collect, and these are new technologies. The Chinese collected the iPhone and now they have released their phone, Huawei is called, a very decent machine, in my opinion, the thinnest smartphone in the world at the moment. I understood the WTO, it was necessary to attract foreigners to us, our cat wept for our technologies, so it will be possible to borrow them from foreigners. Von Gazelle Next, in my opinion a great car.
      1. Ustas
        Ustas 18 July 2013 09: 12
        +2
        Quote: Joker
        There is a Gazelle Next, in my opinion a great car.

        Here is one Gazelle from the entire line of small trucks and our manufacturers can offer. Even Koreans have more choices. A range of 1-3 tons of load capacity needs to be expanded.
        1. Joker
          Joker 18 July 2013 09: 21
          +8
          Here is one Gazelle from the entire line of small trucks and can be offered by our manufacturers.

          Well, what else do you want for 10 years of collapse, there would be no demand for the poor, European markets were already fed up with their own. Slowly we will build up.
        2. M. Peter
          M. Peter 18 July 2013 18: 56
          0
          Quote: Ustas
          Even Koreans have more choices.

          Are you about Hyundai? It seems to be also produced in Russia now.
      2. Refund_SSSR
        Refund_SSSR 18 July 2013 09: 46
        +5
        Quote: Joker
        primarily to open factories

        What stupidity ?! This is by no means the root cause.
        Then how to explain the cost of a foreign-made car EQUAL produced in RUSSIA by the value brought from abroad after payment of the duty ???
        This duty affects the cost of the final car for the USUALLY USER and is bred to it, to the very real grandmother, thereby pushing the pelvis to a completely free down in its price segment.
        This is nothing more than Rekit.
        And all good intentions are good for those who poke cons and confuse what it means to be a patriot and what it means to be a sucker wassat
        1. Rider
          Rider 18 July 2013 13: 54
          +3
          Quote: We refund_SSSR
          Then how to explain the cost of a foreign-made car EQUAL produced in RUSSIA by the value brought from abroad after payment of the duty ???


          and explain that if there were no duties, then there would be no factories.
          who would agree to make cars in Russia if they are more expensive than foreign 7
          here are their duties and equalize.
        2. Semen Semyonitch
          Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 14: 12
          +3
          There is a difference in the price of the machines assembled from us and "they" still have. It cannot be huge, because the assembly process is automated, and our workers will not, like the Chinese, grind rice in two shifts for a cup of rice. the cost of the Polo assembled in Kaluga and in Europe. The difference in a hundred thousand does not mean anything? But in general, the topic is a little different ... About Russia's protection of its interests and manufacturers ... hi
        3. Joker
          Joker 18 July 2013 14: 57
          +7
          This duty affects the cost of the final car for the USUALLY USER and is bred to it, to the very real grandmother, thereby pushing the pelvis to a completely free down in its price segment.

          Well, ka tell me a couple of cars that before joining the WTO were at a price equal to the basins and now they have risen sharply in price? I can't stand a single one, as there were Chevy Niva, but the Chinese cars are on par with ours, and they stayed, and the rest, as they were from 500 000 and higher, have remained. That then they have after every Restayl price creeps up. How much a Ford Focus used to cost and how much now, this is called inflation and dealers greed. At the moment, and before that, too, no one could compete with our cars for the price, so now it remains. Oh yeah, take a look at the Japanese and Americans, the Japanese are doing at home and the cost is higher than the Americans in a similar segment. Suppose Mitsubishi Lancer 10 Restayl, what is there at the maximum speed? Yes, nothing at all, compare with the Ford Focus 3 in the maximum speed, the price is cheaper and there are more times the Buns in the 10, and they break exactly the same. All that we produce is cheaper than imported goods, since there is no need to pay import tax, plus transportation costs, and about prices, you ask dealers with questions, they put the final price, and not the manufacturer.
          1. Papakiko
            Papakiko 18 July 2013 16: 22
            +2
            Quote: Joker
            and about prices it’s you to the dealers with questions, they set the final price, not the manufacturer.

            Everything would be so if it were not for the opposite.
            Gone are the days when the dealer lived on his own. Now the dealer works closely with the automaker to maximize profits. We do not consider this "official".
            Investments in zero back car dealerships return in 2-3 years. So what is the margin%?
            Renault Logan in Europe (Romanian assembly - Dacia Logan) costs from up to 300000 to 350000 rubles (7200-8300E).
            Renault Logan assembly AvtoFramos Moscow costs from 390000 to 530000 (9200-12600 Е).
            This I have given you a small example.
            You can still calculate the cost of tickets on a train-plane and it turns out that we overpay for everything in double compared to the Geyropeytsami.
            Quote: Joker
            Everything that we produce is cheaper than imported goods

            It’s been like this, but the mouse died, wow.
            1. fennekRUS
              fennekRUS 18 July 2013 18: 11
              0
              Papakiko .. Investments in zero-built car dealerships are returned in 2-3 years. So what is the margin%?
              And you sir, excuse me, for a week you want to recapture the costs? Or came into business for three years?
            2. M. Peter
              M. Peter 18 July 2013 19: 00
              0
              Quote: Papakiko
              those days when the dealer lived on his own were gone

              +1 I bought a car at a car dealership, a Chevrolet Orlando, Americans call every three months, they all ask how our local dealer serves me and my car, even if they are polite. wink
              1. Revolver
                Revolver 19 July 2013 00: 30
                +1
                Quote: M.Pyotr
                I bought a car at a car dealership, a Chevrolet Orlando, Americans call every three months, they all ask how our local dealer serves me and my car, even if they are polite.

                I bought a Chevrolet in 1996 from an American dealer and no one called me. Drive the service only to the dealer, otherwise the warranty is on, and it’s a whole day to kill, and the service is fie, change the oil and change the wheels. And after a couple of weeks after the warranty had to change the clutch. $ 1200 am
                Since then I have been buying only Europe, in particular the last 4 Volvo. good Arriving at the service - you have a choice or a substitute car (but you pay for the mileage) or are taken wherever you say and then when the car is ready pick up where you say (for free).
            3. Drosselmeyer
              Drosselmeyer 18 July 2013 23: 27
              +2
              Do not forget yet that over the hill many cars are sold in basic trim levels, which we consider to be luxury. For example, I bought a Ford Fiesta, so our empty base is more expensive than a luxury in Europe.
            4. Shoma-1970
              Shoma-1970 23 July 2013 00: 21
              0
              Of all I liked the word GEYROPEYTSY good
        4. 12061973
          12061973 18 July 2013 15: 07
          0
          Quote: We refund_SSSR
          This is nothing more than Rekit.

          racket is the price of vodka.
        5. FREGATENKAPITAN
          FREGATENKAPITAN 23 July 2013 07: 58
          0
          Well TAZ, not TAZ ..... and the best-selling car in the country ......... about the price? First explain to me pliz why bananas which driven overseas are cheaper than cucumbers that grow in any garden? Why is diesel fuel more expensive than gasoline, but it is practically oil driven through a sieve ??? ..... Much attention is given to AvtoVAZ by gentlemen ......... The collective farmer in life will not buy a foreign car (undoubtedly the best), even if equal price with Zhigulenok ... why? Yes, because it is being repaired with a hammer and some kind of mother ... and you don’t have to go to an expensive service station for 300 km ....................... Well and in conclusion, so that they wouldn’t think, in the garage I have two foreign cars ..... (I have the opportunity) ... but to listen to those who write, all Muscovites are spoiled ...
      3. seller trucks
        seller trucks 18 July 2013 10: 29
        +2
        Quote: Joker
        you need to invest money in this, to upgrade production lines + new jobs.


        (+) moreover, these are not speculative short investments, namely long-term ones. so ford
        Production capacity has increased 5 times and reached 125 000 vehicles per year. The staff is almost 3000 people; more than half of the employees who started their work at the plant in 2002, worked at the plant 10 years.


        http://ffclub.ru/topic/288835/


        Quote: Joker
        The Chinese won the collected iPhone and now they released their phone, they called Huawei, a very decent device, in my opinion at the moment the thinnest smartphone in the world



        from China a month ago Xiaomi MI2 I came for my daughter, I dream that my Asus would quickly die, order myself and my wife (galaxi). I read that it’s good, gentlemen, but not so much (on the Yandex market, wrote a comment) prices from 9 000 p. which is not even funny
      4. Lavr75
        Lavr75 18 July 2013 14: 10
        +3
        everything is clear and beautiful, but pl. Explain to me one simple thing, I bought a new Jeep Compass in the USA, in a store, it was delivered to me by ferry across the ocean, I cleared it in Russia and after all this it is cheaper than the same one produced in Russia, cool .Those. for some reason, it is in our production that he knows that, as a car produced in the country is more expensive than the same one brought.
        1. Semen Semyonitch
          Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 14: 33
          +2
          Quote: Lavr75
          everything is clear and beautiful, but pl. Explain to me one simple thing, I bought a new Jeep Compass in the USA, in a store, it was delivered to me by ferry across the ocean, I cleared it in Russia and after all this it is cheaper than the same one produced in Russia, cool .Those. for some reason, it is in our production that he knows that, as a car produced in the country is more expensive than the same one brought.

          This is where we collect the compass? Even if they were assembled, then from components that were not produced by us. Therefore, NORMAL practice is to protect our own car industry ... Read how it works for them, you will learn a lot of interesting things. To find fault with our AvtoVAZ has become a rule of "good taste", not only the lazy kicks. Yes, the quality is worse, but already incomparably better than the classics and nines or tens. Let's finish off the rest, and then we'll ride cheap Compasses and Cherokee. And the country will be called the 51st state of the United States ...
          1. Lavr75
            Lavr75 18 July 2013 14: 43
            0
            I beg your pardon, I flared up, you are right "Compass" is collected in the states, and when I (my brother) were exported from the USA, they returned a certain amount, for the export of a new car or something like that. But why is it so much more expensive in Russia. And why, if there is an opportunity to drive a good, comfortable, high-quality typewriter, should I buy a "pelvis".
            1. Joker
              Joker 18 July 2013 15: 03
              0
              I beg your pardon, I flared up, you are right "Compass" is collected in the states, and when I (my brother) were exported from the USA, they returned some amount, for the export of a new car or something like that. But why is it so much more expensive in Russia.

              You have returned the tax. And dealers pay him more, because they are legal entities. Plus, you drove your 1 and imagine the costs for driving 100 of such cars, plus salaries to sellers + for renting premises + profit, the result is known to you, that's why these fees are beneficial so that you don’t drive cars and collect money from us.
            2. Semen Semyonitch
              Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 15: 22
              -1
              Quote: Lavr75
              I beg your pardon, I flared up, you are right "Compass" is collected in the states, and when I (my brother) were exported from the USA, they returned a certain amount, for the export of a new car or something like that. But why is it so much more expensive in Russia. And why, if there is an opportunity to drive a good, comfortable, high-quality typewriter, should I buy a "pelvis".

              I understand your discontent. I, too, am not enthusiastic about the prices of automobile industry products (and much more). When we reach the level of development of the United States, then we will go for cheap ... And now we have what we have (I apologize for the pun) ...
          2. Semen Semyonitch
            Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 15: 30
            +2
            I wonder what the minus is? What is the point of view different from yours? So argue ... Or is it easier to push buttons? (cons by drum)
            1. Lavr75
              Lavr75 18 July 2013 15: 49
              +2
              I didn’t minus, honestly!
              1. Semen Semyonitch
                Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 15: 54
                0
                Quote: Lavr75
                I didn’t minus, honestly!

                Yes, I get it hi
          3. max102
            max102 25 July 2013 05: 30
            0
            Odd, gentlemen, everyone seems to be adults, and you believe in fairy tales, they are pushing their auto industry, because the deputies and the government have been paid to gentlemen, well then, there is no support for the aviation industry, there was an infa that the Sberbank buys 50 Boeing for Aeroflot, and one shot down costs how the work of all AvtoVAZ for six months (exaggerate, of course)
            Do we have at least some components for assembled foreign cars? Something I have not heard about, China yes, although not very high quality.
            Quote: Semyon Semyonich
            To find fault with our AvtoVAZ has become the rule of "good taste", only the lazy does not kick
            Why not kick him? even now, Japs, 90-06 years are bought, walked and another 10 years pass, but to give modest savings for a car "for a year" and even for the warranty period you will be milked up to 25% of the amount
        2. Setrac
          Setrac 18 July 2013 22: 59
          +1
          Quote: Lavr75
          Those. for some reason, it is laid in our production that, as a machine manufactured domestically, it costs more than the same one brought.

          Because the Chinese (and the Japanese) live in cardboard houses (the Japanese generally in pencil cases), because the Russian house should be a bit warmer, it should be warmed in the winter, the Russian should be dressed warmer (look - more expensive), eat more, because it’s cold, we even capital facilities at the plant will be more expensive due to all the same climatic conditions. In Russia, the production of consumer goods will always be more expensive than in countries with a more favorable climate.
          P.S. Among consumer goods, I include cars, household appliances and consumer electronics.
          And if you do not protect our production, then we will only have the raw materials sector, even processing will be abroad.
      5. es.d
        es.d 18 July 2013 17: 04
        0
        Quote: Joker
        We have import duties not only because of the support of TAZs, but primarily to open factories in the Russian Federation, the Japanese still resist, the Germans are slowly crawling to us, the Americans have long been with us, and that’s all.

        Hallelujah! Surely, someone said that. But this is one of the main conditions for foreign automakers to enter ANY market. Renault Nissan is no exception.
        Quote: Joker
        And I’ll tell you this serious money in the piggy bank of the country, in addition, AvtoVAZ produces Ford, you need to invest money in this, to upgrade production lines + new jobs.

        VAZ-2123, in the world of Shniva-GM. what Nissan is, Renault by the end of the year, Datsun will be.
        And car kits go to Ukraine, as I understand it, the tax increase does not apply.
        And yes, there is no Russian manufacturer, now we are the Netherlands. Hooray, comrades!
      6. fennekRUS
        fennekRUS 18 July 2013 18: 07
        +1
        Do you still believe that car prices are high due to duties? business, it is at all costs to tear off a maximum of money, at a minimum of costs. while the client pays ....
      7. FREGATENKAPITAN
        FREGATENKAPITAN 23 July 2013 07: 48
        0
        Excuse me what kind of Fords do they produce at AvtoVAZ ????? For 40 years I’ve heard the first time in Tolyatti? .............. Maybe you are talking about GM. So these are not the same Ford ... and in general a different story ....... At the VAZ, besides your own Nissan will produce, Dacia - (Lagus) and in the near future another two or three models Renault and Nissan will collect ...
    3. maxvet
      maxvet 18 July 2013 08: 14
      +5
      duties, among other things, forced foreign manufacturers to build their plants in Russia
      1. Vovka levka
        Vovka levka 18 July 2013 08: 34
        -3
        Quote: maxvet
        duties, among other things, forced foreign manufacturers to build their plants in Russia

        It seems everything is correct.
        But, what do these plants do? Only rough stuff. Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The basis in technology.
        1. Joker
          Joker 18 July 2013 09: 17
          +7
          But, what do these plants do? Only rough stuff. Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The basis in technology.

          Can you imagine how much a new factory costs to build a full cycle? They will slowly move production, now the crisis in Europe will be blown away and they will go to us, as if they are pretty, and if they smell the case in the US, they will not be able to get rid of their factories, China will already start to overload and the growth rates will slow down, and emerging market.
          1. afire
            afire 18 July 2013 09: 37
            +2
            The article in the series is all, we are the only Dartanyans. (About the word, for some reason this word falls under the abbreviation on the site, but it is not at all abusive).
            And all the fault of the haaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, and as a consequence laughing let them grimace further, the cam then shrinks, forcing the whole Ukrainian oligarchy to hysterically
            1. seller trucks
              seller trucks 18 July 2013 10: 38
              +7
              Quote: afire
              And all the fault of the haaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, and as a consequence


              in the USA it was called the "Soft Power" policy, everything is extremely civilized.
          2. seller trucks
            seller trucks 18 July 2013 10: 36
            +2
            and again about Europe:
            Ford's European losses became especially noticeable at the end of the 2012 of the year - a report for the fourth quarter of the period revealed losses of $ 732 million. A year earlier, European losses of the brand were $ 190 million.

            Amid the difficult situation faced by major players in the European market, Ford announced the closure of three plants in Europe by the 2014 year. The reduction will affect two enterprises in the UK and one in Belgium; in total, these plants account for 18% of Ford's production capacity in Europe.

            In a similar situation was the European branch of General Motors, Opel. The company decided to close its second largest plant in Germany. In addition, rumors circulate in a number of European media about the possible transfer of Opel to the French alliance Peugeot Citroen, which is also in an extremely difficult situation - the company closes a large plant near Paris and reduces thousands of workers.


            http://versii.com/news/271960/
          3. Vovka levka
            Vovka levka 18 July 2013 13: 20
            -4
            Quote: Joker
            But, what do these plants do? Only rough stuff. Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The basis in technology.

            Can you imagine how much a new factory costs to build a full cycle? They will slowly move production, now the crisis in Europe will be blown away and they will go to us, as if they are pretty, and if they smell the case in the US, they will not be able to get rid of their factories, China will already start to overload and the growth rates will slow down, and emerging market.

            As long as the fat loses weight, the skinny legs will stretch.
            1. Joker
              Joker 18 July 2013 15: 07
              +6
              As long as the fat loses weight, the skinny legs will stretch.

              There are no technologies, no money, there are not enough personnel to solve these problems in a year. Will be at the factories of Avtovaz BMW to collect, so our and copy the elements from there into your car. Here you have a Lada Kalina 2, already that is something in it.
              1. seller trucks
                seller trucks 18 July 2013 15: 15
                -4
                Quote: Joker
                Here you have Lada Kalina 2, there is already something in it.


                I would have driven designers at the VAZ with a filthy broom, geometry, as usual, clumsy, I don’t understand with fantasy quite famously?
                1. Locksmith
                  Locksmith 18 July 2013 16: 30
                  +4
                  Quote: seller trucks
                  I would have driven designers at the VAZ with a filthy broom, geometry, as usual, clumsy, I don’t understand with fantasy quite famously?

                  Once again, the chief designer, Vaza, is a German, a former Mercedes chief designer, and the design of our cars really likes Renault Nissan, they say only to tighten the quality, which they are doing now.
                  1. es.d
                    es.d 19 July 2013 18: 17
                    0
                    Quote: Locksmith
                    Once again, the chief designer, Vaza, is a German, a former Mercedes chief designer, and the design of our cars really likes Renault Nissan, they say only to tighten the quality, which they are doing now.

                    Sorry, insolent. Achievement list.
                    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%CC%E0%F2%F2%E8%ED,_%D1%F2%E8%E2
                    As for the quality (training) .. everything is as always: fat belts to France, Japan, silver-footed to Romania, Portugal. LQP, APW, etc. etc., kaizen forgot!
                    In my opinion, only the Japanese (in bulk) honestly work at the factory.
                2. Setrac
                  Setrac 18 July 2013 23: 04
                  +2
                  Quote: seller trucks
                  I would have driven designers at the VAZ with a filthy broom, geometry, as usual, clumsy, I don’t understand with fantasy quite famously?

                  Strange, you like the exact same geometry on a foreign car, you just don’t like everything Russian, and you hate Russians in general.
                  1. Corneli
                    Corneli 19 July 2013 14: 52
                    0
                    Quote: seller trucks

                    I would have driven designers at the VAZ with a filthy broom, geometry, as usual, clumsy, I don’t understand with fantasy quite famously?

                    Quote: Setrac
                    Strange, you like the exact same geometry on a foreign car, you just don’t like everything Russian, and you hate Russians in general.

                    Quote: Locksmith
                    Once again, the chief designer, Vaza, is a German, a former Mercedes chief designer, and the design of our cars really likes Renault Nissan, they say only to tighten the quality, which they are doing now.

                    Setrak, where did you see the "Russians" there?) Maybe a person doesn't like Germans?)))
              2. Locksmith
                Locksmith 18 July 2013 16: 27
                +1
                Quote: Joker
                so ours and copy the elements from there to your car. Here you have Lada Kalina 2, already something is in it.

                You will not please, the main designer is Vase-mister who painted mercy.
              3. SerAll
                SerAll 18 July 2013 17: 59
                -1
                I hasten to disappoint, there is only design! everything else .... the seats are from the old model, "smells" like in the Chinese .... even the plugs for the screws that hold the door trim are not .... and these are the most expensive configurations! oh, yes, I did not find a place for the disc ... In short, there is a small shift .... but even the difference in attitude towards the buyer in the cabin is disgusting! while "feeling" all the managers went about their business ... no one came up ....
                1. rolik
                  rolik 18 July 2013 21: 59
                  0
                  Quote: SerAll
                  There are no plugs for the screws that hold the door trim.

                  Internal door trim has long been placed on "clips". Even on Niva 90s of release. And even earlier. I would very much like to look at the pepelats, which has door trim on self-tapping screws or screws. And Kalina and Grants of the latest editions are pretty well equipped for their class. I can't say about the quality, but if on the last Kalina and Grant the mileage to the first MOT is now equal to 15000 km. then the quality should be at the level. Recently I watched the presentation of the Yo-mobile. I expected to see something better than this crookedly molded basin, and with a price of over 400 rubles. And the promised super capacitors were never installed in it ((((((
                  1. SerAll
                    SerAll 19 July 2013 00: 36
                    0
                    Quote: rolik
                    has long been put on "clips".

                    I know, but the bolts are bare there, it catches your eye!
                    go to the salon and see! tomorrow I can nafotkat
          4. Semen Semyonitch
            Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 14: 46
            0
            Quote: Joker
            But, what do these plants do? Only rough stuff. Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The basis in technology.

            Can you imagine how much a new factory costs to build a full cycle? They will slowly move production, now the crisis in Europe will be blown away and they will go to us, as if they are pretty, and if they smell the case in the US, they will not be able to get rid of their factories, China will already start to overload and the growth rates will slow down, and emerging market.

            Not really ... So, everywhere there is a crisis, but we have a rise, you say? Well, Tikurilla, damn it, gives)))
            1. igor.borov775
              igor.borov775 19 July 2013 07: 32
              0
              It’s ridiculous to talk about China. A state program has been launched there to tighten the standard for products. Over the past five years, many car factories will disappear and they will not withstand the new strict standards. They are actively adopting the experience of the car factory that they have acquired in Sweden, and the Swedes have always been proud of their quality, there’s no need to drag China here, There is also a lot to do, But it seems to me that this strategy of the new Government of the country will achieve their goal, We won’t do it there quickly, but do it, We still see very serious intentions, It remains for us to HOPE that it will be
          5. Locksmith
            Locksmith 18 July 2013 16: 22
            +1
            Quote: Joker
            Can you imagine how much a new plant costs to build a full cycle?

            So now no one is doing this, they create a car for a ready-made, or components designed for the main "cart" - the factories are mainly assembly, well, they stamp, welding, this is already a lot, and in techno-towns there are factories of companies cooperating with the main industries, the main thing for them volume, which is why these factories were not built in Russia, now the volumes have appeared and like mushrooms after the rain the necessary production has grown - after merging with Renault, AvtoVAZ is actively sorting its suppliers, Renault-Nissan took our grant as a base for their new car and will sell it under their Maorcas around the world, they liked our car and they are actively improving it, and the entire pool of suppliers has been shaken up for the sake of improving quality.
          6. Papakiko
            Papakiko 18 July 2013 17: 22
            -2
            Quote: Joker
            China is already beginning to oversaturated and growth is slowing down

            You are clearly a victim of the media.
            Quote: Joker
            and we have a growing market

            Yes, obviously, you are reasoning like a celestial.
            Quote: Joker
            Can you imagine how much a new plant costs to build a full cycle?

            Not a factory, but factories for all companies.
            All in all it is necessary to remind the cost of the VAZ and FIAT transaction.
            Quote: Joker
            They will move production on the sly, now the crisis in Europe will hit us and how nice they will go to us

            Purely for an example: Clarks shoes have been sewn everywhere for 20 years, but not in England. And in England there are only designers, technologists, engineering and, of course, capital.
            And what, Angles go bisque or in torn?
            Do not go and will not go.
            Why should a monkey get off a palm tree with bananas?
          7. igor.borov775
            igor.borov775 19 July 2013 06: 56
            0
            Hi, blessed are those who believe, It’s not so easy to write here that they’re not in a hurry to bring something advanced, but there’s no problem getting a new one, Nobody will rush to raise us who we need, We need our own less developed economy to start, Our fathers are rulers all the time they talk about it
        2. maxvet
          maxvet 18 July 2013 09: 49
          +6
          Yes, even rough things, but our workers, taxes to us, electric energy and others. Ours, otherwise there would have been Chinese
          1. Semen Semyonitch
            Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 14: 55
            0
            Quote: maxvet
            Yes, even rough things, but our workers, taxes to us, electric energy and others. Ours, otherwise there would have been Chinese

            ... Not rough things ... There are rough floors (we will leave the right to this term with a left-handed vovka). There is a degree of localization of production. It reaches 50%. So we will survive when we will collect high-tech products ...
          2. Vovka levka
            Vovka levka 18 July 2013 15: 43
            -2
            Quote: maxvet
            Yes, even rough things, but our workers, taxes to us, electric energy and others. Ours, otherwise there would have been Chinese

            Yes it's true. But it is necessary to strive for more and at the same time not to lift one’s nose.
        3. Turner
          Turner 18 July 2013 11: 29
          0
          Something for you, Vovka.
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 12: 15
            +5
            Quote: Turner
            Turner

            Ivan Fedorovich, why do you have a female avatar?
            1. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker 18 July 2013 16: 41
              +4
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              Ivan Fedorovich, why do you have a female avatar?

              Hahhhhhhhh a question ... laughing
          2. Vovka levka
            Vovka levka 18 July 2013 19: 22
            0
            Quote: Turner
            Something for you, Vovka.

            Honestly, something like a light bulb.
            These shoulder straps are like medals on Brezhnev’s chest. Whatever the child was amusing, the main thing would not be crying.
        4. Locksmith
          Locksmith 18 July 2013 16: 14
          +1
          Quote: Vovka Levka
          But, what do these plants do? Only rough stuff. Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The basis in technology.

          Not quite so, for example, AvtoVAZ is now making "Largus" - this is Renault MSV, the body is stamped - welded - painted in place, glass-plastic - local, local wiring, ABS electronics - local, Renault is building an engine plant in Togliatti, that is, after three -Four years localization will be 100%, the same with other factories, but slowly but practically everyone begins to build their "court" factories in Russia.
          1. Akim
            Akim 18 July 2013 18: 16
            0
            Quote: Locksmith
            Not quite so, for example, AvtoVAZ is now making "Largus"

            Have you seen him on the streets? Simply, the Dacia MKV is a good car and well worth the money. It is well accepted in Ukraine, especially the 7-seater, so "Largus" is not supplied here. Yes, and "Duster" we have appeared several years earlier.
          2. Vovka levka
            Vovka levka 18 July 2013 19: 24
            0
            Quote: Locksmith
            Quote: Vovka Levka
            But, what do these plants do? Only rough stuff. Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The basis in technology.

            Not quite so, for example, AvtoVAZ is now making "Largus" - this is Renault MSV, the body is stamped - welded - painted in place, glass-plastic - local, local wiring, ABS electronics - local, Renault is building an engine plant in Togliatti, that is, after three -Four years localization will be 100%, the same with other factories, but slowly but practically everyone begins to build their "court" factories in Russia.

            And who is against?
        5. es.d
          es.d 18 July 2013 17: 09
          -1
          Quote: Vovka Levka
          Technological things do not, it is the engine, gearbox, electronics - it all starts. The foundation is in technology.

          It’s not yours, if VAZ is the territory of the Russian Federation, then they do it.
    4. Powder donut
      Powder donut 18 July 2013 09: 58
      +7
      As I understand you, I look at the American Ford Mustangs and really want to do it myself ... (at us the price is shamelessly raised by this voracious miracle of the American automobile industry) But also, strangely enough, I wish that our jobs would not be lost. And I hope that our car industry will release something interesting.
    5. experienced
      experienced 18 July 2013 10: 00
      12
      The author has an idea like a red thread how good it is that Russia has joined the WTO and now we have "leverage" on Ukraine. However, with the WTO, Russia "got into a mess" and there are more minuses from it than profits, and I think the main "berries" are still ahead. Russia even without the WTO has so many "whips" that it can bring Ukraine to bankruptcy. Just recently, DAM canceled quotas for the purchase of pipes from Ukraine, before that Ukraine had been given out so much loans under state guarantees that if you now demand payments on time, the budget of Ukraine bursts like a bubble, yesterday it was infa that Naftogaz was asking to roll over a loan of $ 2 billion. these chocolates, sugar, cheeses and Onishchenko can much better than any WTO "slow down" at the borders ...
      And it seems to me that it is necessary to leave the WTO and the sooner the better, there will be nothing good for our agricultural and industry, and raw materials will be bought from us anyway. hi
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 18 July 2013 10: 18
        +6
        Quote: seasoned
        And from the WTO, as it seems to me, I need to leave, and the sooner the better,


        Entrance to the WTO is worth the ruble. And the solution is not two, and not ten, but much more expensive ...
        1. little man
          little man 18 July 2013 16: 24
          -1
          Not true. Formally, it costs nothing. If you mean fines, then this is a separate conversation and everything is very complicated there. A bunch of mixed opinions.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 18 July 2013 17: 06
            +3
            Quote: man
            Not true. Formally, it costs nothing.

            Formally, and entry is free ...
      2. Rider
        Rider 18 July 2013 13: 58
        +1
        Quote: seasoned
        However, with the WTO, Russia "got into a mess" and there are more minuses from it than profits, and I think the main "berries" are still ahead.


        but you can’t argue with that

        alas.
    6. Blackgrifon
      Blackgrifon 18 July 2013 10: 18
      +2
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      I just don’t understand why the Russians, who want to spend their BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money, are required to pay GIANT duties for foreign cars? The very duties that were introduced as a temporary measure for a very short time ... Well, where is the cancellation? This is not a duty - this is direct theft from the pockets of citizens ... Rekit. Here honestly, this policy of pressing TAZs has already gotten sick ... RF civil automobile industry. NO !!! And what it is is a miserable parody of a modern car.


      This is a tricky measure to protect the domestic auto industry. For two decades, Lada has not been able to produce anything normal and at the same time competitive, and the prices for their cars are like for an almost new foreign car.
      Another thing is that the auto industry holds a lot of enterprises, including from other industries. Accordingly, its complete collapse will be very, very painful.
      1. xan
        xan 18 July 2013 12: 10
        +4
        Quote: Blackgrifon
        This is a tricky measure to protect the domestic auto industry. For two decades, Lada has not been able to produce anything normal and at the same time competitive, and the prices for their cars are like for an almost new foreign car.

        your untruth
        this tricky measure to ensure that foreign cars are produced here, and not just imported from abroad
        1. Akim
          Akim 18 July 2013 12: 26
          -1
          Quote: xan
          this tricky measure so that foreign cars are produced here

          Do not be offended, but do not want to buy a St. Petersburg Hyundai Accent or KIA Rio, preferring Korean for the same money
          1. Semen Semyonitch
            Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 15: 39
            0
            Quote: Akim
            Quote: xan
            this tricky measure so that foreign cars are produced here

            Do not be offended, but do not want to buy a St. Petersburg Hyundai Accent or KIA Rio, preferring Korean for the same money

            Are there any facts? About the same price? I would really appreciate it ... hi
            1. Akim
              Akim 18 July 2013 16: 03
              -4
              Quote: Semyon Semyonich
              Are there any facts? About the same price

              They go into a car dealership and ask - Korean or St. Petersburg. And the facts ... The price list on the Ukrainian site Hyundai.
          2. M. Peter
            M. Peter 18 July 2013 19: 12
            +1
            Quote: Akim
            Do not be offended, but do not want to buy a St. Petersburg Hyundai Accent or KIA Rio, preferring Korean for the same money

            Yes, there is no difference, but those who want to live stereotypes. And in smotrish, cities began to fill up with new "foreign cars" that are being made here.
            Look, the Japanese were appreciated, they say the engine was a millionaire, the fact of the matter is that WHERE it was, now the Camryuha from St. Petersburg is no worse than the Japanese.
            1. Akim
              Akim 18 July 2013 19: 36
              0
              Quote: M.Pyotr
              Yes, there is no difference, and those who wish to live by stereotypes.


              These are not stereotypes. Don't take a Chinese car, that's a stereotype. At first, only St. Petersburg Solaris / Accents went to Ukraine. But since half a year, the Korean ones have already started. And people prefer to take them. Probably the same word of mouth worked. Of course, they also take St. Petersburg. But if there is a choice, they prefer the "southerner".
    7. Mikhail3
      Mikhail3 18 July 2013 11: 28
      +8
      Do you want a salary? And it is you, and not the Germans? This is the only and unique reason for the introduction of duties, and by all countries of the world. Otherwise, your salary will be given to those whose output will be the cheapest. Since we need to spend the most on heating, to maintain a considerable army, we can then release ... nothing. If we remove the duties, then we need to leave somewhere 30 million people to attend to the extraction of resources, let the rest die of hunger. Think a little bit ...
      1. max702
        max702 18 July 2013 17: 41
        -1
        And if you look carefully at just the work in this direction and it is exactly 30 million (Medicine, education, pensions. Support for motherhood. Mortgage. Loans with gangster interest, etc., etc.) .. no more. to extract and protect oil and gas is enough and okay .. Dubai is an example of this. How many local people are there, and how many gaster workers work for them? That's what the authorities dream of .. a lot of extra people, they and social programs and jobs, etc. .. but not enough for everyone. they’re cutting unnecessary ones. And the fact that they themselves are then west and will not be thrown.
    8. roma2
      roma2 18 July 2013 14: 56
      -3
      If I’m not mistaken, then the special duty is in response to the introduction by Russia of a recycling fee for Ukrainian cars. And where does the coal duty on chocolate and glass ??? The author simply adjusts the facts to his speculation.
    9. Pilat2009
      Pilat2009 18 July 2013 17: 46
      +2
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      This is not a duty - this is direct theft from the pockets of citizens ... Wrecking

      You, as a free person, can buy any car. Dig up only money or take a loan. But no one forcibly forces you to take a basin. Someone also rides on the Oka
    10. Ascetic
      Ascetic 18 July 2013 19: 47
      +3
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      Honestly, this policy of pushing pelvic tanks is already sickened ... Russia does not have a civil automobile industry. NO !!! And what it is is a miserable parody of a modern car.


      Ascetic RU June 21, 2013 10:32 | To a sketch on a helicopter carrier. Why are Russian media always ready to believe that “Russians are disgraced”
      Quote: Vladimirets
      This is historically the case, we love to scold ourselves, but we hate it when others scold us.

      This did not happen by itself. It is the result of the centuries-old policy of the Russian pro-Western elite and intelligentsia, brainwashing so that we disbelieve ourselves and our own country, and in our place today there are enough hungry people who can replace our whole country. And even “thank you” will not say that they vacated this place. The only question is: are we all together what will we do in such a situation? Who will we need? This national pragmatic interest or position, which the same pro-Western elite and the shaking hands of the intelligentsia brand as the patriotism of the outcasts, is no less evident.
      Of course, you can blame the Lada and compare with Mercedes, which means to sign the complete insolvency of the domestic auto industry and eliminate it as unnecessary, why, after all, globalization, let others make cars and planes, and we will buy all this for resources. But the Chinese will never even think of scolding their cars even if they are inferior to the Lada for example and developing their auto industry.
      Therefore, when scolding you, remember that in this way you are completely deprived of the sense of self-preservation of the nation, and your work, no matter what area you work in, will soon become useless to such an attitude, and you yourself will be supplanted by more united and strong competitors.
    11. rolik
      rolik 18 July 2013 21: 49
      +1
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      Honestly, this policy of pushing the basins already is sick of it ...

      Can I ask a question? And what kind of car do you drive yourself?
    12. Setrac
      Setrac 18 July 2013 22: 46
      +1
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      I just don’t understand why the Russians, who want to spend their BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money, are required to pay GIANT duties for foreign cars?

      You will earn your BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money on Mars, or on the extreme in Antarctica, in Russia you earn with the help of the state, because you live in this state and use the resources of this state.
    13. NOBODY EXCEPT US
      NOBODY EXCEPT US 19 July 2013 00: 23
      -1
      See how many minuses the Puintsy instructed, it’s a pity that I can’t put a lot of pluses, and about duties on foreign cars, let's say ..... no matter how old it is, it’s still better than new VAZ troughs .... many years of experience confirm .. ...
    14. nycsson
      nycsson 19 July 2013 00: 30
      0
      The video is dedicated to all supporters of Russia's accession to the WTO !!! fool fool fool
      1. Kurap
        Kurap 23 July 2013 13: 15
        0
        after watching anger and fear for myself and my children. I have a very good attitude towards the government in the person of VV Putin, I don’t understand how he allowed Russia to enter the WTO, I really want to believe that the Russian ministers bought by the West misled him and he will save the country in some tricky way us from this trap. I hope that some services are browsing this site and they will hear me there.
    15. dustycat
      dustycat 20 July 2013 11: 54
      0
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      I just don’t understand why the Russians, who want to spend their BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money, are required to pay GIANT duties for foreign cars?

      Patience.
      The European Union has already lifted a boil over these duties.
      Ours also ran into what they fought.
      1. Setrac
        Setrac 20 July 2013 15: 00
        +1
        Quote: dustycat
        Patience.
        The European Union has already lifted a boil over these duties.
        Ours also ran into what they fought.

        Duties were imposed before joining the WTO, so that the EU breaks down.
    16. Фокус
      Фокус 23 July 2013 17: 17
      0
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      Honestly, this policy of pushing pelvic tanks is already sickened ... Russia does not have a civil automobile industry. NO !!! And what it is is a miserable parody of a modern car.

      This is the main problem of our car industry, of course there are a lot of problems, but they are being solved, and only thanks to these duties and agreements on "localization" there is hope that we will not ruin this VERY IMPORTANT industry, we can break everything quickly, but "we already have elbows bitten "
    17. Nick
      Nick 23 July 2013 20: 40
      0
      Quote: We refund_SSSR
      I just don’t understand why the Russians, who want to spend their BLOOD and HONESTLY earned money, are required to pay GIANT duties for foreign cars? The very duties that were introduced as a temporary measure for a very short time ... Well, where is the cancellation?
      This is not a duty - this is direct theft from the pockets of citizens ..

      And it would be necessary to abolish all taxes, and tomorrow pensions, and after tomorrow the state "Russia" will disappear from the political map of the world ...
      Yes, it is unpleasant to pay duties and taxes, but it is necessary. But it is only necessary to ask the "servants of the people" so that the incoming funds bring the maximum benefit to all citizens, and not just to these very "servants" ...
  2. arkady149
    arkady149 18 July 2013 06: 55
    +2
    Crippled Russian exports? And our auto industry is not snickering? Make good cars or compete in price, you’re used to drive a bulldozer, and then climb out due to duties and overpayments from our pocket.
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 07: 50
      11
      Quote: arkady149
      And our auto industry is not snickering?

      We have a car industry ????? Oh yes, the factories of Nissan, Toyota, Mazda, Ford, BMW and others laughing
      1. arkady149
        arkady149 18 July 2013 08: 17
        +9
        AvtoVAZ products (a car factory — something like an MPH) are truly our products, domestic products with a claim to be called a car. Ownership experience (1 time in 2106 and 2 times in 2193, now Opel) shows what our people can do, but will not, as long as there is an opportunity to leave at the expense of duties, subsidies and other crap, we don’t want to compete honestly, and I'm not talking about hard workers and management engineers are slandering.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 08: 37
          0
          Quote: arkady149
          AvtoVAZ products

          It is the product, not the car. Designer - in a set of bolts, nuts, wheels laughing
          1. ytqnhfk
            ytqnhfk 18 July 2013 08: 47
            +5
            Maybe the product but it’s already become much better; time is on; everything is changing; only stereotypes are not changing; and what are the classes of cars being compared with? It’s time to stop confusing it all over with a small car of everyday availability!
            1. Refund_SSSR
              Refund_SSSR 18 July 2013 10: 05
              -1
              Let's take Koreans and even the Chinese ... the cost of NEW cars without duties is equal to or even lower in favor of not the Russian Federation, but the quality and reliability of a foreigner, even such as the Koreans and Chinese, is higher!
              It's a shame!
              1. Blackgrifon
                Blackgrifon 18 July 2013 10: 25
                +4
                Quote: We refund_SSSR
                and the quality and reliability of foreigners, even, such as Koreans and Chinese, is higher! It's a shame!


                And what do you want if even quality falls on the defense industry - the technologist’s salary is lower than that of a seller in McDuck. When at the beginning of the two thousandth AvtoVAZ was given a multi-million dollar loan or a grant from the state, they lowered it for prizes at a time (the scandal in the media was a couple of months).
              2. 1c-inform-city
                1c-inform-city 18 July 2013 11: 11
                +3
                As for the Chinese, you obviously bent over. And by the way, the Chinese do not have their own cars either. The welded trunk does not make Cherry QQ even Matiz of the Uzbek assembly. Changing the appearance due to cosmetics does not make the car better (verified many times)
              3. ultra
                ultra 18 July 2013 14: 45
                +1
                Quote: We refund_SSSR
                the reliability of foreigners, even, such as Koreans and Chinese, is higher!

                Maybe the Chinese are delivering something special to you on Sakhalin!
              4. Locksmith
                Locksmith 18 July 2013 16: 34
                +2
                Quote: We refund_SSSR
                and the quality and reliability of foreigners, even such as Koreans and Chinese, is higher!

                The magazine "Za Rulem" investigated this issue, with the Chinese for more than a year, for some reason they do not want to live normally in our country, they are starting to crumble. wink , and yes indeed, it’s quite outwardly attractive to ourselves — in our city we bought Chinese minibuses, green ones, beautiful, and nothing inside, two years = there are no routes, the pancake rotted and broke, and the clumsy grooves are like tanks ride and ride ... laughing
                1. rolik
                  rolik 18 July 2013 22: 21
                  +1
                  Quote: Locksmith
                  two years = there are no routes on the routes, everything is rotted and broken, and clumsy grooves like tanks go and go ...

                  From friends at the enterprise bought Chinese trucks, like KAMAZ. They worked for a year, now for three years they have been standing motionless and dispossessed. Broke so fast that did not have time to buy zap))))
              5. M. Peter
                M. Peter 18 July 2013 19: 19
                0
                Quote: We refund_SSSR
                Let's take Koreans and even the Chinese ... the cost of NEW cars without duties is equal to or even lower in favor of not the Russian Federation, but the quality and reliability of a foreigner, even such as the Koreans and Chinese, is higher! This is a shame!

                I bought a Niva-Chevrolet in 2011, my tongue just doesn’t turn to add the word Chevrolet to the word NIVA. It's more all the same Niva than a Chevrolet, just an icon ...
                So, for two years in bumps and wilds of Siberia, on a speedometer under 60 thousand km, there was no breakdown, then a maintenance took place. That's really expensive, the first after the break-in cost me 5 kilo rubles, oil and filter change. But there are no complaints about the supposedly worthless quality. Given that I had (have) a workhorse, built a house, I drove a board and cement on it.
              6. rolik
                rolik 18 July 2013 22: 18
                0
                Quote: We refund_SSSR
                Let's take Koreans and even Chinese

                Koreans have prices not as low as before. Look at the price lists. And the Chinese ... no, I'm sorry, I do not want to breathe formaldehyde during the trip, and so the environment is not very good.
                1. es.d
                  es.d 19 July 2013 17: 54
                  +1
                  Quote: rolik
                  Quote: We refund_SSSR
                  Let's take Koreans and even Chinese

                  Koreans have prices not as low as before. Look at the price lists. And the Chinese ... no, I'm sorry, I do not want to breathe formaldehyde during the trip, and so the environment is not very good.


                  They pay for entry to the market. Then, take their own. These are axioms.
              7. ytqnhfk
                ytqnhfk 19 July 2013 00: 57
                -1
                And the Koreans at a price like our VAZ? What brand is it? Hyundai or Kia? The prices at them aspire to besides even a small car at such price that it is terrible to approach!
            2. Corsair
              Corsair 18 July 2013 12: 35
              0
              Quote: ytqnhfk
              Maybe the product but it’s already become much better; time is on; everything is changing; only stereotypes are not changing; and what are the classes of cars being compared with? It’s time to stop confusing it all over with a small car of everyday availability!

              Link claiming to be true:
              http://www.sdelanounas.ru/blogs/33754/
          2. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 09: 58
            +1
            They are building up cons in me, I see a club of AvtoTAZ fans sitting on a site wassat
            1. seller trucks
              seller trucks 18 July 2013 11: 04
              0
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              It is the product, not the car. Designer - in a set of bolts, nuts, wheels


              and nevertheless, Avtovaz has a car that has blown up worldwide recognition, and I want to note that after the birth of this car a new class appeared - a crossover, Lada 2121 "Niva", already 30 years in the cage

              Over three decades of the 1,8 million produced Nivs, over 100 thousand were exported to more than 500 countries of the world. Annually, about 15 thousand Nivs were exported to Latin America, Africa, the Middle East, Eastern and Western Europe, and including Germany, France, Italy, England, Spain, Benelux countries and Greece. In these countries, as well as in Japan, despite the fact that the SUV is no longer delivered to the Land of the Rising Sun, to this day there are clubs for Niva lovers. There are "Niva" in Australia and Canada.


              http://www.nivapower.ru/world
              1. experienced
                experienced 18 July 2013 11: 07
                +3
                Quote: seller trucks
                and nevertheless, Avtovaz has a car that has blown up worldwide recognition, and I want to note that after the birth of this car a new class appeared - a crossover, Lada 2121 "Niva", already 30 years in the cage

                No longer, there is now a Chevrolet NIVA, which does not shine with reliability and differs very much from the Niva in price ...
                The Niva brand is no longer Russian hi
                1. seller trucks
                  seller trucks 18 July 2013 11: 25
                  0
                  Quote: seasoned
                  No longer, there is now a Chevrolet NIVA, which does not shine with reliability and differs very much from the Niva in price ...
                  The Niva brand is no longer Russian


                  I'm not writing about the Chevy Niva, but about the Lada 2121 (for TCP), we are talking about different cars
                  1. experienced
                    experienced 18 July 2013 11: 45
                    +2
                    Quote: seller trucks
                    I'm not writing about the Chevy Niva, but about the Lada 2121 (for TCP), we are talking about different cars

                    Once again I bring your comment
                    and nevertheless, at AvtoVAZ there is a car that has stoked worldwide recognition, and I want to note that after the birth of this car a new class appeared - a crossover, Lada 2121 Niva, already 30 years in a clip

                    Now your
                    Quote: seasoned
                    Brand name Nyva not Russian anymore

                    And now for the information from Wiki
                    VAZ-2121 "Niva" - a Soviet and Russian off-road passenger car - a small class SUV with a supporting body and permanent all-wheel drive.

                    Serially produced from April 5, 1977 to the present (since 2006 - under the brand Lada 4x4[2]).


                    And all this is due to the fact that the Niva brand was bought out by Chevrolet and now stands after their name. I just pointed it out hi
                    1. seller trucks
                      seller trucks 18 July 2013 12: 17
                      0
                      Quote: seasoned
                      And all this is due to the fact that the Niva brand was bought out by Chevrolet and now stands after their name. I just pointed it out



                      seasoned, I don’t understand in any way, why are you arranging these distortions? what's the difference what they write in the PTS "Lada" or "Niva", for ordinary people, however, for the manager in a car dealership, when mentioning "Niva" everything is extremely clear VAZ 2121, and to whom it belongs there, about the birds
                2. M. Peter
                  M. Peter 18 July 2013 19: 23
                  0
                  Quote: seasoned
                  No longer, there is now a Chevrolet NIVA, which does not shine with reliability and differs very much from the Niva in price

                  I do not agree. At one time I chose between the old Niva and the Chevrolet, the difference was 40 thousand rubles, between the three-door and the normal interior. And the quality, I described above. My impressions of Niva good
              2. Corsair
                Corsair 18 July 2013 12: 24
                +2
                Quote: seller trucks
                and nevertheless, Avtovaz has a car that has blown up worldwide recognition, and I want to note that after the birth of this car a new class appeared - a crossover, Lada 2121 "Niva", already 30 years in the cage

                A car revolutionary in its ideas and indicators, which could become a real nightmare for global automakers, be our manufacturer quick in updating the model range and .... improving the quality of components and, as a result, assembly request
                By the way, the release of VAZ 2121 has already "passed" the 2 millionth milestone.
                http://www.sdelanounas.ru/blogs/30257/
              3. rolik
                rolik 18 July 2013 22: 27
                0
                Quote: seller trucks
                , Lada 2121 "Niva", already 30 years in the cage

                I have a second Niva car)))) I’ve got better dirt in the forest, it’s better not, it performs its tasks at 5+, it never failed. You just need to know right away that this is a car for driving on every shise with the appropriate comfort (or rather, without it), that's all.
            2. xan
              xan 18 July 2013 12: 18
              -2
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              They are building up cons in me, I see a club of AvtoTAZ fans sitting on the site, sorry AvtoVAZ wassat

              Are you doing something competitive with your hands, Dartanyan, or are you hanging around for days?
              If the VAZ is sold, then it is needed.
              1. experienced
                experienced 18 July 2013 12: 32
                +2
                Quote: xan
                Are you doing something competitive with your hands, Dartanyan, or are you hanging around for days?

                Bugaga, is he on your maintenance? You do not care what he earns and where he "hangs around" and for how long? That's how the grumblings were who cared about everything, and they stayed, work yourself, provide for your family, and do not look at what others are doing am
                If the VAZ is sold, then it is needed.

                I do not need it, but I am worried about the constant billions in "injections" from the budget into this underproduction
                1. seller trucks
                  seller trucks 18 July 2013 13: 36
                  +1
                  Quote: seasoned
                  I do not need it, but I am worried about the constant billions in "injections" from the budget into this underproduction


                  no longer, the Russian side owns a blocking block of shares, everything else belongs to Renault-Nissan, now they are releasing Nissan-Almera on the VAZ, which is essentially Reno-Logan in a different iron, the beet lifter control was too lazy to transfer to the doors, like most French people have between seats
                2. xan
                  xan 18 July 2013 13: 40
                  -2
                  Quote: seasoned
                  Bugaga, is he on your maintenance? You do not care what he earns and where he "hangs around" and for how long?

                  you apparently also do not produce anything competitive, manager, master language
                  Quote: seasoned
                  I do not need it, but I am worried about the constant billions in "injections" from the budget into this underproduction

                  the giraffe has already answered your question here, VAZ is in a competitive environment, and people have been given the choice of cars.
                  Quote: Akim
                  There is simply no choice. If they offer me two new cars at the same price, I will not buy a VAZ.

                  don’t buy, are they forcing you? As for the choice, we have a choice in Russia, you know the market
                  Quote: seasoned
                  That's how the grumps that were all the matter were, and remained,

                  And I got sick of those who can only sell and wag their tongues.
                  1. Akim
                    Akim 18 July 2013 14: 04
                    +1
                    Quote: xan
                    don’t buy, are they forcing you? As for the choice, we have a choice in Russia, you know the market

                    I am critical of both the Russian and Ukrainian auto industry. To Ukrainian, even a lot more. There really is nothing proud of one shame. In Ukraine, ZAZ is a very big competitor in prices. Chinese jelly and a little vaz. And who in Russia in the price range competes with VAZ? Yes, no one.
                    1. xan
                      xan 18 July 2013 14: 59
                      +1
                      Quote: Akim
                      And who in Russia in the price range competes with VAZ? Yes, no one.

                      I dont know. I myself have been driving AUDI A5 for 6 years. The first car VAZ 99, no negative emotions.
                      The state did not abandon the VAZ, and Renault-Nisan sucked it in, let them now have a headache. The state is definitely a plus, and for the creation of the domestic foreign auto industry too. But whiners have a choice, but they also prefer to mock. It remains only to rejoice that they do not make decisions
                    2. rolik
                      rolik 18 July 2013 22: 30
                      0
                      Quote: Akim
                      And who in Russia in the price range competes with VAZ?

                      In theory, the ё-mobile was supposed to compete. But, it seems to me, there will not be much demand for this bathtub.
                3. es.d
                  es.d 18 July 2013 20: 13
                  0
                  Quote: seasoned
                  I do not need it, but I am worried about the constant billions in "injections" from the budget into this underproduction

                  For-dol-ba-li!
                  1.VAZ belonged to the state (Russian Technologies),
                  2. The state, indeed, gave Russian Technologies money,
                  3.Attention! mr. Chemezov gave VAZ a LOAN, which VAZ pays, guess who. Moreover, calculations were announced that only due to taxes and other payments the amount of the loan is blocked for 3-5 years (subject to the work of VAZ).
                  4. Money, by successful managers appointed by the aforementioned Mr., successfully successful (how many gobbled up; Mr. Artyakov is the song about the main thing, but he is not alone), the loan is hanging at VAZ.
                  The Samara region, which was the 3-4th place in Russia in economic development (Moscow, St. Petersburg, Novosib.), Is, of course, also subsidized by VAZ. So to lower the factory that worked in the worst of times - you need talent. Muscovites have it!
                  5. Operation "Ends in water". We rent a candle factory to Lohu Gon.

                  Don’t hate people, if the quality only worries the hard worker, this will not be enough for a long time ... We earn less than 5 years ago. Social, sports, medicine in the negative ... crisis, s. Specialists are running. But, cheers, the Romanians, Spaniards, French, Japanese came in large numbers ... they’ll teach us how to play us.

                  Well, yes, nothing, the special forces brigade has already been stationed here - we will not talk.

                  PS Sorry, I'm tired of listening to the retelling of KVNovsky pederach. People who do not have the slightest knowledge not only about the Plant, but also engineering, express concern about the state of Democracy and Freedom of Speech at the VAZ.

                  http://lurkmore.to/%D0%90%D0%B2%D1%82%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%B7
                  I recommend to get acquainted, evil, but for people not in the topic - to start.
              2. Akim
                Akim 18 July 2013 12: 53
                +1
                Quote: xan
                If the VAZ is sold, then it is needed.

                There is simply no choice. If they offer me two new cars at the same price, I will not buy a VAZ.
                1. seller trucks
                  seller trucks 18 July 2013 13: 22
                  +1
                  Quote: Akim
                  There is simply no choice.


                  I beg you, there is always a choice. for example, a second-hand option, if you are not too lazy and can travel, you can keep within the same money as the new VAZ, I once bought a "nephew" 2-tap for a price commensurate with the new "Kalina", and in Ukraine VAZ is still in the top three sales leaders, or rather # 2

                  http://auto.bigmir.net/autonews/autoworld/1530886-Prodazhi-avto-v-Ukraine--rejti
                  ng-po-modeljam-za-2012-god
                  1. Akim
                    Akim 18 July 2013 13: 32
                    0
                    Quote: seller trucks

                    I beg you, there is always a choice. e.g. used option

                    You can't buy a used one on credit. And as for the rating. Have you looked at which cars? Sevens and nines ("Samara" is not your 15th but VAZ 21093 with a MeMZ engine or 99th with 1,5).
                    Anyway bullshit and Sens too. And if you compare Kalina and Lanos, I’d better take the second one (although I really don’t really want to take it).
                    1. seller trucks
                      seller trucks 18 July 2013 13: 44
                      +1
                      Quote: Akim
                      you can’t buy a used loan.


                      Well, this is debatable, I took it for consumer needs, more expensive, but I don’t have to pay for CASCO.

                      Quote: Akim
                      Sevens and nines ("Samara" is not your 15th but VAZ 21093 with a MeMZ engine or 99th with 1,5).


                      it doesn’t matter, even with a pedal drive, if there is an OTTS, forward and with a song, but I don’t argue bullshit personally, but not everyone is as smart as you buy.


                      Quote: Akim
                      And if you compare Kalina and Lanos, I’d better take the second one (although I really don’t really want to take it).


                      you'd better compare with "chance" laughing
                      1. Akim
                        Akim 18 July 2013 14: 13
                        0
                        SenS 1.3 is much cheaper than Kalina. Sens 1,4 with the MeMZ engine I call everyone - do not buy. It's not just FU, but FU-FU-FU.
                        PS We have a Lanos with a Melitopol engine (1,3 1,4) called SenS. With the Korean (1,4 automatic transmission 101 hp, 1,5 86 hp and the Chinese 1,5 109 hp) called Lanos. Everything goes to you under the name "Chance".
                      2. seller trucks
                        seller trucks 18 July 2013 14: 54
                        0
                        Quote: Akim
                        SenS 1.3 is much cheaper than Kalina.


                        these are classmates, only the beet lifters have been removed from the "chance" and there is no power steering laughing and, accordingly, nightmare engines.
                      3. Akim
                        Akim 18 July 2013 15: 19
                        0
                        At "Chance" we will call it that, there are front windows. Power steering (EUR) is not needed there. the car is soft and easy to steer. There is also a condenser (but it barely pulls at 1,3). The engine ran off (1,3) 250 units - I did not know any problems. Here is a Tavrian box really G .... I changed it after 100 thousand. C Kalina is much better. But the Korean box will blow up Kalinovskaya. Chance does not yet have an adjustable steering column. Overall, I would prefer Chance 1,5 (109 horses) among these options. In general, these two machines must be removed from the conveyor.
                2. rolik
                  rolik 18 July 2013 22: 33
                  0
                  Quote: Akim
                  And if you compare Kalina and Lanos, I'd rather take the second

                  In Lanos, in winter, ears fall off from the cold, checked.
                  1. Akim
                    Akim 19 July 2013 00: 23
                    0
                    Quote: rolik
                    In Lanos, in winter, ears fall off from the cold, checked.

                    Tell me by whom? Maybe for minus 25 I will not say. But minus 15-20 the stove works perfectly. Verified personally.
        2. es.d
          es.d 19 July 2013 18: 42
          -1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          They are building up cons in me, I see a club of AvtoTAZ fans sitting on the site, sorry AvtoVAZ wassat

          Simply, people, on it "damned", work.
          For YOU, on purpose, YOU know that VAZ is a Defense Enterprise.
          At least it was like that ... Until we were sold ...
          IZHMash-VAZ "daughter", in the current terminology (for information).
          1. FREGATENKAPITAN
            FREGATENKAPITAN 23 July 2013 08: 04
            0
            I hasten to disappoint you .. VAZ was never a defense enterprise ...... Unless you assume that there was a time when they tried to adapt a classic NIVA to the Army .... didn’t go ... And still, not any defense .... .... In Togliatti since 70 ..... you can say VAZ as flaky I know
      2. domokl
        domokl 18 July 2013 10: 00
        +2
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        It is the product, not the car

        laughing Sasha, ride a Honda. And the machine is decent and there are no problems. Only change the oil, but the tires
        1. Blackgrifon
          Blackgrifon 18 July 2013 10: 26
          +2
          Quote: domokl
          And the machine is decent and no problems. Only change the oil, but rubber


          Comrade And what are you only promoting Honda? :) Skoda and Kia, too, nothing :)
          1. rolik
            rolik 18 July 2013 22: 35
            0
            Quote: Blackgrifon
            Comrade And what are you only promoting Honda? :) Skoda and Kia, too, nothing :)

            I’m paving on the asphalt on Fols and am very happy about this fact, but on dirt and gullies on the Niva .... and also very happy about this fact)))))
        2. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 11: 20
          +3
          Quote: domokl
          ride a honda

          I still have Toyota, there are no problems either, and most importantly, I do not need to drive a yellow spare car from Khabarovsk to Cheta, well, just in case laughing
          1. experienced
            experienced 18 July 2013 11: 29
            +4
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            I still have Toyota, there are no problems either, and most importantly, I do not need to drive a yellow spare car from Khabarovsk to Cheta, well, just in case

            But in your Toyota there is no such additional option as Sasha Gray, and in the yellow typewriter I saw such an option wassat
            1. Alexander Romanov
              Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 12: 21
              +3
              Quote: seasoned
              But in your Toyota there is no such additional option as Sasha Gray, and in the yellow typewriter I saw such an option

              Yes, yellow cars generally attract the strange attention of foreign cars laughing Photoshop American news, but cool
            2. NOBODY EXCEPT US
              NOBODY EXCEPT US 19 July 2013 00: 31
              +2
              And who is Sasha Gray?
              1. Lopatov
                Lopatov 19 July 2013 00: 34
                +1
                Who is she. This is where such places are located, where they do not know her?
          2. domokl
            domokl 18 July 2013 13: 13
            +2
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            the most important thing is you don’t need to drive the yellow spare car from Khabarovsk to Cheta, well, just in case laughing

            drinks good good You are not a patriot .. Just like Medvedev lol Or your wife won't let you go too laughing
      3. Blackgrifon
        Blackgrifon 18 July 2013 10: 23
        +2
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        It is the product, not the car. Designer - in a set of bolts, nuts, wheels


        I heard somewhere that in Europe our cars are called "Lego for adults" :)
    2. d1m1drol
      d1m1drol 18 July 2013 08: 57
      21
      I will not engage in controversy over the quality of VAZ cars, to each his own. Who is able to buy foreign cars, and who is not able to take Lada. I take Lada, and I will take Lada. Because my parents worked at this plant, and almost all my relatives! And no. The plant didn’t snoop on your money, because about 700-800 thousand people are fed from the plant. And if you close it, then in your city the visitors from Togliatti will be added, because here it will be impossible to survive. And by the way, in 2012, the plant made a profit. This is a question about subsidies. And also, thanks to the snickering plant, I practically do not pay for the children's ass. The plant pays its taxes. And crying forever about the fact that foreign cars are expensive ... no money? Admit it to yourself and buy a car within your means. Duties are needed on foreign cars. These are taxes to the treasury. On which aircraft and tanks are built including. So do not talk about the Volga Automobile Plant .. I can tell a lot.
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 09: 56
        +2
        Quote: d1m1drol
        . Who is able to buy foreign cars, and who is not able to take Lad

        Yes it is.
        Quote: d1m1drol
        I take Lada, and I will take Lada.

        That everything is so bad and you have no prospects for improving the financial situation. I sincerely sympathize recourse
        Quote: d1m1drol
        . So do not talk about the Volga Automobile Plant .. I can tell a lot.

        I have one question for you, when will you start producing cars?
        1. Refund_SSSR
          Refund_SSSR 18 July 2013 10: 08
          -1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          I have one question for you, when will you start producing cars?

          I join the question! good
        2. Blackgrifon
          Blackgrifon 18 July 2013 10: 29
          +4
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          That everything is so bad and you have no prospects for improving the financial situation. I sincerely sympathize


          My friend took a new 14. After a month, the cooling flowed. Liquid - he drove the car 4 times to the service station to the official dealer - they did it for him, but still flowed. A friend spat on everything and at the first opportunity took a supported Opel.
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 11: 23
            -2
            Quote: Blackgrifon
            My friend took a new 14. After a month, the cooling flowed. Liquid -

            Well, what do you answer .... Lada-quality .. somewhere there winked
            1. Pilat2009
              Pilat2009 18 July 2013 19: 54
              +1
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              Lada-quality .. somewhere there

              The folks of the Kaluga assembly got oil flowing.
              If you read on the Internet, then each model has its own sores
              1. NOBODY EXCEPT US
                NOBODY EXCEPT US 19 July 2013 00: 36
                -4
                My advice to you is not to take even a Ferrari if it is Kaluga or some sort of Russian assembly, take an old European or a pure Japanese ....
          2. Curculum
            Curculum 18 July 2013 11: 26
            +6
            Quote: Blackgrifon
            My friend took a new 14. After a month, the cooling flowed. Liquid - he drove the car 4 times to the service station to the official dealer - they did it for him, but still flowed.

            Similar stories can be heard about any car, there can be exceptions only about brands like "Bentley" or "Bugatti" - "but this is a completely different story." wink
            1. Corsair
              Corsair 18 July 2013 12: 44
              +1
              Quote: Kurkul
              Similar stories can be heard about any car, there can be exceptions only about brands like "Bentley" or "Bugatti" - "but this is a completely different story."

              "Drive" these brands into REAL road conditions of Russia and "high-tech garage" service - and from these cars you will not find not only "bolts" but also "buckets" lolNo matter how super quality the car might be, "kill" it in our directions, "like two fingers on the asphalt" ...
              1. Curculum
                Curculum 18 July 2013 13: 13
                +1
                Quote: Corsair
                "Drive" these brands into the REAL road conditions of Russia and the "high-tech garage" service - and from these cars, not only "bolts" but also "buckets" you will not find

                I don’t know for the "Bugatti" in operation, but on the "Veyron" model I had a chance to ride the track in the Nürburgring, the impressions were stunning, but: a very stiff suspension and discomfort in the cabin, a clean "stool".
                But regarding "Bentley" - you are mistaken, I own a "Continental GT" for a year and a half, hit 25 thousand km, from breakdowns: nothing, not even the bulbs are intact, I visited the dealer only 2 times - for scheduled maintenance.
                At the same time, I agree with you: you can "kill" anything, even in any direction, because much and the main thing depends on the gasket between the steering wheel and the seat.
            2. rolik
              rolik 18 July 2013 22: 38
              +1
              Quote: Kurkul
              , there can be exceptions only for brands like "Bentley"

              English cars have never been particularly reliable. Land Vedov has an eternal problem with the box.
          3. d1m1drol
            d1m1drol 18 July 2013 12: 25
            +3
            Hands on the service station master need to tear off simply. When the ass instead of the locksmith’s head at the service station is a misfortune, sadness. I got a chill. liquid, I took apart the car myself, replaced the radiator of the stove and returned everything as it was. Although the warranty service is here .. the staff decides everything) My father took a used Mercedes from me ... took a used one and sold it ... bought a Prior and does not buzz ..
          4. ultra
            ultra 18 July 2013 14: 55
            +4
            Quote: Blackgrifon
            My friend took a new 14. After a month, the cooling flowed. Liquid - he drove the car 4 times to the service station to XNUMX

            A friend took a new X-Trail, after 7 thousand km the engine knocked! And what? The neighbor's XC-90 just fucked it out of the service did not climb out, and sold it! Another Audi "allroad", the same story! My first car was nine , "half a collective farm" I transported on it, did not disappoint!
          5. Setrac
            Setrac 19 July 2013 00: 11
            +2
            Quote: Blackgrifon
            My friend took a new 14. After a month, the cooling flowed. Liquid - he drove the car 4 times to the service station to the official dealer - they did it for him, but still flowed. A friend spat on everything and at the first opportunity took a supported Opel.

            Why did the friend flow confess? Or is he not qualified enough to understand? Overheated? Started in the winter and did not warm up, began to gas? Or maybe just out of luck, got married?
            1. es.d
              es.d 19 July 2013 16: 43
              +1
              Quote: Setrac
              Quote: Blackgrifon
              My friend took a new 14. After a month, the cooling flowed. Liquid - he drove the car 4 times to the service station to the official dealer - they did it for him, but still flowed. A friend spat on everything and at the first opportunity took a supported Opel.

              Why did the friend flow confess? Or is he not qualified enough to understand? Overheated? Started in the winter and did not warm up, began to gas? Or maybe just out of luck, got married?

              In-in! The same vodyatli from "for a ruble", we managed (on the test track!) To burn the clutch at the viburnum. And the other day the Frenchman broke the bumper against the wall (he was not killed).
        3. experienced
          experienced 18 July 2013 11: 27
          +3
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          I have one question for you, when will you start producing cars?

          In Togliatti, Renault is now riveting that Duster. SUV (4x4) for the poor, for the money can take its own niche. A new one costs about half a lemon. Maybe it will go on sales, though I don’t know how the profit is divided between VAZ and Renault.
          But the author of the comment has a question: why should buyers of VAZs pay for your kindergarten? Socialism is gone, and VAZ still lays money on social programs in the cost of cars
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 12: 24
            0
            Quote: seasoned
            In Togliatti, Renault is now riveting,

            Russian Automotive Industry request
          2. Raven1972
            Raven1972 18 July 2013 12: 24
            +3
            Quote: seasoned
            and VAZ still lays in the cost of cars money for social programs

            But others do not? And by the way, why not? We have a Volvo plant, so there the social network is even cooler, right up to dental prosthetics at the expense of the enterprise, do they take money from the air for this? Also included in the price of cars ... hi And they don’t see anything wrong with that ...
          3. d1m1drol
            d1m1drol 18 July 2013 12: 28
            +4
            I think it's still a question of responsibility for the city ... Socialism is gone .. a sad fact. And I believe that education, including preschool, should be free. AvtoVAZ buyers will not pay, they will pay all of the taxes .. including me.
            1. Raven1972
              Raven1972 18 July 2013 12: 49
              +2
              Quote: d1m1drol
              I think this is still a question of responsibility for the city ..

              Not only this is the NORMAL approach of the NORMAL producer to those who directly bring him profit only ...
          4. es.d
            es.d 18 July 2013 17: 40
            0
            Quote: seasoned
            In Togliatti, Renault is now riveting that Duster. SUV (4x4) for the poor, for the money can take its own niche. A new one costs about half a lemon. Maybe it will go on sales, though I don’t know how the profit is divided between VAZ and Renault.
            But the author of the comment has a question: why should buyers of VAZs pay for your kindergarten? Socialism is gone, and VAZ still lays money on social programs in the cost of cars

            Where did you get such news about the VAZ, sorry, suck it from the Comedy Club?
            Nissan pays for the assembly of Nissan Almera, sells itself.
          5. ultra
            ultra 19 July 2013 10: 46
            +1
            Maybe this is news for you, but the Renault-Nissan group is actually the owners of VAZ.
          6. rolik
            rolik 19 July 2013 12: 12
            +1
            Quote: seasoned
            In Togliatti, Renault is now riveting that Duster

            Renault that Duster riveted in Moscow at Avtoframrosa (we can say that this is a former Moskvich).
        4. d1m1drol
          d1m1drol 18 July 2013 12: 20
          +3
          To begin with, the term machine is quite suitable for AvtoVAZ products.
          Quote: d1m1drol
          I take Lada, and I will take Lada.
          That everything is so bad and you have no prospects for improving the financial situation. I sincerely sympathize with recourse

          There are prospects. And my financial situation is quite normal. I just do not make a welfare attribute out of a car. For me, this is a vehicle and nothing more. Moreover, if you remove the stereotypes about the quality of cars, then everything is not that bad. The car is lucky, the conder is working, the EUR is working, what else is needed from the car except the brand? It's just that many people are looking for an excuse to prick their homeland, and they find it. I don’t let out cars, I build TPPs in the regions of our country .. so I don’t need to personalize AvtoVAZ questions for me personally, there are a lot of top managers who will answer all your questions)
          1. Curculum
            Curculum 18 July 2013 13: 31
            -1
            Quote: d1m1drol
            For me, this is a vehicle and nothing more.

            A moot point, because the result of movement depends on many components, starting with the very need for movement and ending with comfort and speed. But here - who is to what end, to whom and the scooter - a means of transportation (although, in fact, it is).
        5. xan
          xan 18 July 2013 12: 26
          +2
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          That everything is so bad and you have no prospects for improving the financial situation. I sincerely sympathize with recourse

          You start to look frowning
          what's your business?
    3. es.d
      es.d 18 July 2013 17: 13
      0
      Quote: arkady149
      2 times 2193

      belay
  3. Semen Semyonitch
    Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 15: 53
    +2
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Quote: arkady149
    And our auto industry is not snickering?

    We have a car industry ????? Oh yes, the factories of Nissan, Toyota, Mazda, Ford, BMW and others laughing

    For the time being, there is no need to joke ... But the fact that we are not able to compete with leading automakers is primarily the state of the entire industry. If we now have complete .op with space, this does not mean that it is not .. .
  • Alexey Prikazchikov
    Alexey Prikazchikov 18 July 2013 08: 39
    +3
    Crippled Russian exports? And our auto industry is not snickering? Make good cars or compete in price, you’re used to drive a bulldozer, and then climb out due to duties and overpayments from our pocket.


    I can say the same about Izh Mash and our other defenders. Only vazovtsy and kamazovites are at least kind of fluttering and trying to do something there. And these suckers, as always.
    1. xan
      xan 18 July 2013 12: 32
      +7
      Visitors to the VAZ
      Does someone make you buy a VAZ? Buy other cars. And the VAZ is for sale, so someone needs it. Fees were introduced not to save the VAZ, but to ensure that foreigners place production in Russia. Now VAZ is in a competitive environment. Stop whining!
      1. Akim
        Akim 18 July 2013 13: 00
        0
        Quote: xan
        Fees were introduced not to save the VAZ, but to ensure that foreigners place production in Russia

        If the car cost 15 pieces, and suddenly began to cost 16, they will take it anyway. And if it cost 8, and then it began to cost 9 they won’t take it (and this is VAZ’s competitors).
        1. xan
          xan 18 July 2013 13: 48
          +1
          Quote: Akim
          If the car cost 15 pieces, and suddenly began to cost 16, they will take it anyway. And if it cost 8, and then it began to cost 9 they won’t take it (and this is VAZ’s competitors).

          Let used or new lower class.
          Now the choice is great.
          but in general you wrote nonsense
          1. Akim
            Akim 18 July 2013 14: 18
            0
            and I wrote about one class "B". Or has the new Aveo become cheaper?
  • pinecone
    pinecone 18 July 2013 06: 56
    +2
    What a messy article. "Second France", a sly ass, a threaded bolt ... You can't figure it out without half a liter.
    1. Aeneas
      Aeneas 18 July 2013 07: 21
      -7
      a standard set of "hahlosrach" stamps about Ukraine. Nuu isho about lard, where can we go without it repeat
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 07: 51
        +8
        Quote: Aeneas
        a standard set of "hahlosrach" stamps about Ukraine.

        And the identity, but how do Ukrainian counter-measures discuss retaliatory measures? Do not say that they don’t discuss, even as they discuss and the fray are not frail wink
        1. Aeneas
          Aeneas 18 July 2013 20: 16
          0
          so this resource claims to be adequate. But thanks to such an article, and comments, it is degrading into the Polit Polit section on Udava.
      2. Semen Semyonitch
        Semen Semyonitch 18 July 2013 16: 08
        +2
        Quote: Aeneas
        a standard set of "hahlosrach" stamps about Ukraine. Nuu isho about lard, where can we go without it repeat

        What has it got to do with "osrach"? No one is in love with anyone. Why do you react so painfully? Listen to you, so any article containing "negative" in relation to Ukraine is aimed at inflating "osrach" ... How about a dead man -or nothing, or only good ...
    2. little man
      little man 18 July 2013 17: 04
      -1
      Yes, and annoyed through the word epithets Russian sculpt:
      "Mokal..skim Indians", "northern barbarians", "uncivilized", "genuine savages."
      He would not go to the goat crack this scribbler

      By the way, why in the article the word mosk .. was allowed, but in the commentary tret?
  • domokl
    domokl 18 July 2013 06: 56
    17
    laughing Indeed, the problem is the ass of the cunning and the screw. Does the Ukrainian leadership still not understand that it is impossible to put pressure on Russia? Do you want to cooperate, stop cheating
    1. I am a Russian
      I am a Russian 18 July 2013 08: 25
      +9
      Quote: domokl
      stop cheating


      unlikely to be able to. Accustomed to a freebie ... hard to return to the real world
      1. ytqnhfk
        ytqnhfk 18 July 2013 08: 59
        +1
        That's it we don’t want to do anything; we just want to receive money, so no one will give! freebie attempts (gas transit and not only reworking old weapons and trying to put them out) doesn’t work out well, and requests for loans under any conditions (selling industry to push to RUSSIA, etc.)
        1. Mhpv
          Mhpv 18 July 2013 09: 57
          +5
          Quote: ytqnhfk
          freebie attempts (gas transit and not only alteration of old weapons and an attempt to vaporize them)

          The auto industry of Ukraine is the same something of a Chinese-style freebie. All of their last Zazes are former Daewoo and then Shvrolet Lanos now Chevrolet Aveo, VAZ Bogdan, etc. with nameplates ZAZ. laughing
          Ukraine is an indifferent country which means: "Bachili eyes, shoplifting - now uzhte, I want to povilazte." This is a market and no one here will sell for nothing, and even more so to buy just because to save someone's economy flying into the abyss is not obliged.
          And what is there to yell about pressure from the market, everyone can and Russia can’t, no, it’s nice that you in 90 could spit to the tune of the West towards Russia, and now when it has grown stronger you are yelling that they offend you.
          Go to any market in any country and shake rights and see the result, the same thing on a national scale.
          There are two fools on the market - one is selling, the other is buying. But there is a fundamental difference between them. The one who sells will receive the money. And the one who buys will part with the money.
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 11: 27
            +4
            Quote: mhpv

            Car industry of Ukraine

            I never thought that the Cossack would look better Lada laughing
            1. Mhpv
              Mhpv 18 July 2013 11: 37
              +1
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              I never thought that the Cossack would look better than a Lada laughing

              Well, that’s right, while we have Prokhorov the E-mobile is being invented by ZAZ by using ready-made technologies.
              I think Nissan Renault will shake up our VAZ lineup soon, there is already a beginning.
              1. Alexander Romanov
                Alexander Romanov 18 July 2013 12: 25
                0
                Quote: mhpv

                Well, so right while we have Prokhorov E-mobile invents

                By the way, and on the roads of Russia, has anyone seen this E **** Mobile?
                1. Mhpv
                  Mhpv 18 July 2013 12: 33
                  +4
                  Quote: Alexander Romanov
                  By the way, and on the roads of Russia, has anyone seen this E **** Mobile?

                  Here it is an environmentally friendly E *** mobile under the control of Prokhorov. laughing
                2. NOBODY EXCEPT US
                  NOBODY EXCEPT US 19 July 2013 00: 40
                  0
                  We had a presentation in Vladimir, not a bad thing, but the series is far ...
            2. zmey_gadukin
              zmey_gadukin 18 July 2013 12: 59
              0
              Swept the other day. Extremely playful and comfortable. Do not compare with the Lanus ...
          2. Curculum
            Curculum 18 July 2013 11: 31
            0
            Quote: mhpv
            There are two fools on the market - one is selling, the other is buying. But there is a fundamental difference between them. The one who sells will receive the money. And the one who buys will part with the money.

            Therefore, there is a third one who is smart (at least someone should be him, the world is not all fools), called an intermediary - he only receives money by pushing the foreheads of two fools, so you understand?
            1. Mhpv
              Mhpv 18 July 2013 11: 42
              0
              Quote: Kurkul
              intermediary - only receives money, pushing the foreheads of two fools, so you understand?

              The mediator is a helminth, the role of which is the WTO and the European Union. hi
              1. Curculum
                Curculum 18 July 2013 13: 19
                0
                Quote: mhpv
                The mediator is a helminth

                Have you ever thought that, for example, an auto-transport company is also an intermediary between a manufacturer and a consumer? So, in your opinion, the driver of the truck is a worm and a parasite?
                1. Mhpv
                  Mhpv 18 July 2013 14: 02
                  0
                  The company itself is a helminth, not a driver.
                  In this case, the driver and the car are means for making a profit. Take the large trading companies from them with their ATP, and not the transport companies that need to pay part of the profit or include it in the price of the goods additionally.
                  1. Curculum
                    Curculum 18 July 2013 15: 04
                    0
                    Quote: mhpv
                    The company itself is a helminth, not a driver. In this case, a driver and a car are means for making a profit. Take large trading companies from them with their ATP, and not transport companies that need to pay part of the profit or include it in the price of the goods .

                    It turns out messy, excuse me: the driver and the car are means, although the means is only a car, nevertheless, they "both" do not produce anything! Tell me the product they produce, please. The driver only serves the means by which he delivers the goods. And the type of property ownership is absolutely the third question.
                    Another example: once there were MTSs that had agricultural machinery for processing fields - are they also "helminths"? What about bus / trolleybus / tram fleets?
                    And take a hairdresser: he just cuts off your hair, where is the availability of the goods he produces? Or is your hairstyle a product? But, in this case, it can be sold - isn't it stupid?
  • freedmen
    freedmen 18 July 2013 07: 13
    -1
    The article is seedy, both morally and politically. I don’t even want to discuss such articles.
    And about Ukraine, I will say only one thing!
    I respect and love this country and people. 50% of the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug is the population from Ukraine. It is not for nothing that our district is called Tatar-Yat. But those who order such "prose" as enta clearly want a further split of the "family" ties between our peoples.
    The very personality of the writer already causes one conclusion - the nationalist, whose ancestors only did what they destroyed, like Bendera. Ugh, already disgusting.
    And then, the canvases of Ukraine in every possible way wish to warm up at the expense of their neighbors, and not only at the expense of Ukraine. By the way, it has always been, is and will be. Well, they have such a mentality !!! This mentality is manifested even between home neighbors. And that's it.
    1. domokl
      domokl 18 July 2013 07: 22
      +4
      Emotionally, but not understandable. What are you advocating? For the unity of peoples? So who is against? For the political views of the author? And why? For the truth? And what is written incorrectly?
      Indeed, the author wrote an article ala lubok. But it is readable. And the facts are stated correctly. Without distortion.
      And you just have it present.
      Quote: freedmen
      I respect and love this country and people

      this is your first statement and
      Quote: freedmen
      , canvases of Ukraine in every possible way wish to warm up at the expense of neighbors
      second, so what do you want to say?
      1. freedmen
        freedmen 18 July 2013 10: 03
        +3
        The answer is very simple:
        the entire elite of power, that in Russia, in Ukraine, live in business, and they are not up to the people.
        the games of these "masters" destroy relations between our peoples.
        and instead of writing these articles, you just need to meet each other, which is essentially integration (albeit of a different kind).
        Moreover, almost all power in Kiev is Americanized, and these articles, as an argument of my statement, prove the above circumstance. Moreover, this is not the first log thrown towards Russia.
        That's all this and disgusting!
        and such articles only heat up the situation, and are most likely written by order.
    2. Ustas
      Ustas 18 July 2013 09: 17
      +1
      Quote: freedmen
      50% of the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug is the population from Ukraine.

      So they have long been Russian. And by and large, we are one people.
      1. freedmen
        freedmen 18 July 2013 10: 08
        +2
        we are Russian for zapadentsev, and for eastern Ukraine, we are the same relatives as their neighbors on the porch.
        In general, the Anglo-Saxons play the main violin at the national political level in Ukraine. A recent example of all entogo is the political situation in Crimea, where even the Crimean Tatars strive to obtain independence.
        Oh, all this r .... not casual, including this article.
  • Aeneas
    Aeneas 18 July 2013 07: 19
    +2
    "Oh, what am I to blame?" - "Shut up! I'm tired of listening, Leisure for me to sort out your guilt, puppy! You are to blame for the fact that I want to eat" .... Russia introduced protective duties on import cars almost a year ago through levying the so-called recycling fee. After this procedure, Ukrainian car manufacturers (ZAZ, KRAZ) finally lost the Russian market. The Ukrainian government, represented by Comrade Azarov (a pure Russian and a native of Kaluga) hoped that this measure (utilization fee) would bypass Ukraine, because in just a few months (just a year ago) Russia, Ukraine and other CIS countries signed the "Agreement on the CIS Free Trade Zone "in St. Petersburg and cars were not included in the list of trade restrictions. But the Kremlin made it clear that they changed their minds, and "everything will be like this." winked And now, almost a year later, Ukraine introduces a similar recycling fee .... And it began: a threaded bolt, cunning opa, haakhlys betrayed Russia, etc. Well, to the heap, DAM announces the "final end" of trade between Russia and Ukraine. Mdaa, and practically at the same time announces the revival of the An-124 production. What kind of production is there now? recourse
    1. Avenger711
      Avenger711 18 July 2013 08: 08
      +4
      That's right, no An-124s that are already idle in the Air Force. And in general, before the trial of the Ukrainian separatists, not a single detail from Ukraine for Russian weapons.
    2. avt
      avt 18 July 2013 10: 01
      0
      Quote: Aeneas
      And so it began: a threaded bolt, a cunning opa, haahlys betrayed Russia, etc. Well, to the heap, DAM announces the "final end" of trade between Russia and Ukraine. Mdaa, and practically at the same time announces the revival of the An-124 production. What kind of production is there now?

      Someone I did not understand request There is no EBN and no one to watch so that every official thinks about Ukraine in the morning. For a long time Kuchma wrote a book that Ukraine is not Russia. It turns out that only business remained and nothing personal. request Your leaders do not want to negotiate within the framework of the Customs Union - they do not order independence, well, they received it with the appropriate information support. Well, with regards to the An-124, yes it doesn’t say anything DAM, listen less. Only army vehicles will actually be upgraded. You can’t count on new ones, there are no merchants for 100 cars, and the Moscow Region will not pull so much, and it’s not necessary, they will stand idle, but eventually they will sell part of it.
      1. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 18 July 2013 10: 22
        +4
        Quote: avt
        Kuchma wrote for a long time that Ukraine is not Russia

        Yes, it was a pearl ...
        Ordered ...
        What is now blaming the mirror? what
  • taseka
    taseka 18 July 2013 07: 53
    0
    What they wanted, they got it! This gangbanged WTO will still show itself where we will be oh how painful and unprofitable !!! Only oligarchs who win this WTO for themselves and shove it, and above all the oil and gas lobby, win!
  • Igarr
    Igarr 18 July 2013 07: 54
    +4
    Someone as always scolding.
    Someone as always needs to throw firewood into the fire. Just. Even without a goal, that’s good.
    Because they haven’t thrown it for a long time.
    The usual situation of trade misunderstandings is presented almost as a genetic predisposition ... and so that there would be no mistakes .. necessarily fat.
    There is no way to say - in ... cooperation slowly went, we will start building aircraft. No, instead, let's talk about "cans" - because the volume is not weak.
    It's sick to read.
    What does this have to do with Military Review ?
    1. zmey_gadukin
      zmey_gadukin 18 July 2013 11: 53
      +1
      Igarr ... plus you!
  • Igor
    Igor 18 July 2013 07: 59
    +5
    The relations between our countries are rather complicated and the source of problems can be in a completely different place. It’s hard for me to say where is the same Rubicon, the border that separates friendly weird and hostile. The participation of Ukraine in NATO maneuvers and the chilling of American soldiers is, for me, a direct hostile action that outweighs the brotherhood of all Slavs. and if Ukraine has enough money to accommodate NATO soldiers, then I would think how to make sure that this does not happen again.

    I wish all forum users (and Ukrainians too) a successful solution to their economic problems, at least at the level of their families. drinks
    1. I am a Russian
      I am a Russian 18 July 2013 08: 42
      +2
      Quote: Igor
      I wish all forum users (and Ukrainians too) a successful solution to their economic problems, at least at the level of their families. drinks


      not only at the expense of a neighbor, but on mutually beneficial cooperation
      1. freedmen
        freedmen 18 July 2013 10: 12
        +1
        I agree!
        even living in a single house, you need to negotiate and seek compromises, not flaws.
        until the 17th, the Slavic peoples had a single rule, one law of the life of neighbors:
        if my neighbor lives well, then I will live well.
        that's what needs to be revived!
  • KazaK Bo
    KazaK Bo 18 July 2013 08: 07
    12
    The worst thing in this story is the feuds between neighbors, whose economies were still a single whole. We started with the question "Who feeds whom?" at the dawn of the parade of sovereignties to the present day. You can blame each other for self-centeredness or great power ... but the reason is still different. In the weakness of our economies. For a large, developed economy, more than $ 300 million dollars is a lot of money, but ... And for us - already KARAUL! When will our politicians understand that they are waiting for us in Europe only as markets for their goods, but not as producers of goods, competitors for European producers? How many more bumps need to be filled to understand that our vector of development is EASTERN DIRECTIONS. Yes, there, too, we are not very welcome with open arms, but there, if you strain a little, we will be COMPETITIVE! And in terms of the quality of goods ... their nomenclature ... opportunities for cooperation and expansion of production, etc.
    Worse than stepping on a rake more than once. This is masochism! But it is clear to our politicians that such a state corresponds to their ambitions and really likes it.
    1. freedmen
      freedmen 18 July 2013 10: 15
      0
      it is useless to talk about the understanding of our "powers", they live by their own business and play off peoples at the behest of London-Washington
      1. washi
        washi 18 July 2013 16: 33
        0
        Friedman. I agree that your bleed
    2. Dmitry 2246
      Dmitry 2246 18 July 2013 10: 40
      +4
      Quote: KazaK Bo
      When will our politicians understand that Europe is waiting for us only as markets for their goods, but not as producers of goods, competitors for a European manufacturer.

      I agree with you for this Ukraine was invited to join the customs union.
      Having been refused, we close our market gradually and methodically competently.
      Refusing economic integration, Ukraine frees up space for other countries in Finland, Kazakhstan, Belarus, etc.
      There are no emotions here.
      Trade relations are usually strengthened by the military, so the number of orders for Ukraine is reduced.
  • Imperial
    Imperial 18 July 2013 08: 10
    0
    Article to the wrong address, just someone needs a srach, why? life is boring? So then write about the gas "wars", the site is military laughing
  • treskoed
    treskoed 18 July 2013 08: 29
    +1
    Somehow it’s not pleasant to jail with Ukraine .... Moreover, such a small thing ... How to rob a child ...
    1. Alexey Prikazchikov
      Alexey Prikazchikov 18 July 2013 08: 44
      +3
      How to rob a child ...


      Rather, in the ass to blow zasr ... antsu.
    2. washi
      washi 18 July 2013 16: 31
      -1
      a small dog is always a puppy, but crap already on an adult
  • leon-iv
    leon-iv 18 July 2013 09: 05
    -2
    her rotten sketch, does not roll!
  • xzWhiteWolf
    xzWhiteWolf 18 July 2013 09: 08
    -3
    Article wild trolling))
    And so it’s all right, you want to put a pig in a friend, be prepared to step on your own in ***.
  • stalkerwalker
    stalkerwalker 18 July 2013 09: 21
    12
    Well, since the article is from another resource, from the same comments:

    1. Ukraine. Grandson asks grandfather
    - I’m absent, but did you expect me to live like that?
    - Nі onuchok. Earlier, we lived better, then we swore moskali and came up with an idea for us.


    2. Ah, the Ukrainian night is dark and every year it gets darker and darker, but there’s nothing to hide anymore ....
  • My address
    My address 18 July 2013 09: 25
    +4
    In the middle of the 90-x talked with colleagues from Ukraine. They thanked Russia for almost free gas and even then declared that it was primarily the new owners who did not care about the brotherhood of nations. And I, the foolish one, said that no, we would still remain close economically, culturally, with defense and kindred.
  • treskoed
    treskoed 18 July 2013 09: 27
    +1
    Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
    How to rob a child ...


    Rather, in the ass to blow zasr ... antsu.

    Of course, and loving, parentally ....
  • Constantine
    Constantine 18 July 2013 09: 34
    +9
    I read the article. The author could write more tactfully. A lot of water in the form of unnecessary words that leave an unpleasant sediment. With regard to trade relations with "Square", then everything here clearly and unambiguously made Glazyev understand some time ago.



    It is time for Ukraine to understand that no one is going to play with it anymore. The position when, for the sake of the interests of a handful of oligarchs, "independent" by insidious intent, short-sightedness, or simply due to the stupidity of the management corps, substitutes its brothers - will not work. Now the situation, including the geopolitical one, is not that one could lie under the enemy and be friends with Russia. It's time to decide on whose side Ukraine is and to make the appropriate decisions. Adequate, not impulsive or deliberate.
    1. Protoucr
      Protoucr 18 July 2013 14: 06
      -3
      Ukraine will not be in nanoTS. This is already a hysteria in the Kremlin.
      “We have nothing to offer you.”
  • pa_nik
    pa_nik 18 July 2013 09: 45
    -2
    Something is not very happy with such "brave" news about the victory on the "WTO front". belay "You'd better find a helmet!" (C) "Gentlemen of Fortune"
  • Valery Neonov
    Valery Neonov 18 July 2013 10: 09
    0
    Quote: We refund_SSSR
    The very duties that were introduced as a temporary measure for a very short time ...

    There is nothing more permanent than temporarily introduced! hi
    And according to the article, what about it ...:
    Who is not with us is against us .... winked
  • Zoryana Mriya
    Zoryana Mriya 18 July 2013 10: 15
    -5
    And why is it not written about how Russia introduced duties on the protection of its VAZ a year ago ???? And this, by the way, directly affected the Ukrainian automotive industry! This means that Russia can protect its producers, but Ukraine cannot? it turns out like this: "How could Ukraine in general encroach on the Vyalikuyu Hegemony of Big Brother with its little hands !!!" It must be slapped on its hands, so that it does not want to eat, but goes hungry! "
    Yes, the article is pitiful, for this five points, but the author clearly does not like Ukraine. I think in Kiev they’re not fools, although the author apparently knows better.
    1. washi
      washi 18 July 2013 16: 27
      +3
      Russia introduced duties on cars not a year or even two ago, but much earlier. Moreover, it increased the duty gradually.
      I think in Kiev are not fools
      I hope but doubt
    2. ultra
      ultra 19 July 2013 11: 13
      +1
      Quote: Zoryana Mriya
      to protect his VAZ a year ago

      You are terribly far from the people, not of VAZ, but of all car manufacturers with factories in Russia!
  • Opera
    Opera 18 July 2013 10: 16
    -4
    Quote: KazaK Bo
    Yes, there, too, they are not really waiting for us with open arms,

    Well, yes ... Tired of calling - hands drop!
  • shpuntik
    shpuntik 18 July 2013 10: 17
    +3
    An article in the style of Nikolai Vasilyevich Gogol, offensive to Ukrainians, but true. But the Ukrainians do not need to be offended, the wedge between our Slavic peoples cannot be driven in by anyone; speech in the article about the manual.
    It seems that soon Janek, the second time they will put laughing.
  • Middle-brother
    Middle-brother 18 July 2013 10: 20
    +1
    Entered the game - play by the rules. But in fact - so she failed this game (WTO) and the owners of the casino, who came up with the game and the rules am
  • Sevastopol
    Sevastopol 18 July 2013 10: 52
    +4
    With politicians in Ukraine can only speak from a position of strength. Moreover, no matter what those colors. Yanukovych with his example proved (to both Ukraine and Russia) corruption, selfishness and betrayal, even a seemingly pro-Russian political flow called the party of regions. He has gathered in the EU. Yeah. Only now instead of the EU, this country is now a pinzdets.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • sop.ov
    sop.ov 18 July 2013 11: 31
    +3
    The article is another govnosrach. The author does not specify that duties were increased only for passenger cars with engine displacement from 1,1 to 2,2 l. and affected the most sought after market segment. All talk about protecting the domestic producer is the verbal fornication of the government, as the main reason is the budget hole, which they are trying to patch at the expense of the average Ukrainian. At the same time, those in power and local manufacturers do not explain why the Chinese Forza or Skoda (given the benefits for them) of local assembly are more expensive than imported ones. Most likely they don’t know, because they don’t ride on them, but they ride on those who don’t fall under this increase.
    1. Akim
      Akim 18 July 2013 12: 34
      0
      Quote: sop.ov
      All talk about protecting the domestic producer is the verbal fornication of the government, as the main reason is the budget hole, which they are trying to patch at the expense of the average Ukrainian

      I do not agree. ZAZ has a large lobby in the government.
      1. Protoucr
        Protoucr 18 July 2013 13: 44
        -3
        It is necessary to introduce duties on KAMAZ.
  • andru_007
    andru_007 18 July 2013 11: 51
    +1
    Quote: KazaK Bo
    The worst thing in this story is the feuds of neighbors

    I would even say a feud in the same family ...
  • Conepatus
    Conepatus 18 July 2013 12: 03
    0
    Quote: APASUS
    Quote: Nikolai S.
    Bachil eyes that signed, now do it. Will it still be when the association with the EU is signed. Yushchenko with the WTO as paradise will be remembered.

    It flashed here that the WTO accession agreement has 6000 pages,
    so I think not all parliamentarians even imagine what it is ........ about the fact that they read the entire treaty, I'm not talking!

    Even if you read it, it’s little use. Here you need a legal and economic education, but where does it come from the cattle who have seized power? Although the trade wars between the two countries are in vain. Only the relations between us will suffer, that the "true crap" only hand.
  • sop.ov
    sop.ov 18 July 2013 12: 22
    +1
    Quote: Conepatus
    Although trade wars between the two countries are in vain. Only the relations between us will suffer, which "true crap" only plays into the hands.

    That is yes. All the fuss resembles the clarification of the relationship of alcoholic neighbors - equally that families are not sweet, but they themselves have fun with broken faces. wassat
  • Akim
    Akim 18 July 2013 12: 45
    +2
    A normal economic process has taken place. Russia has defended its car market from Ukrainian cars. That is what the Ukrainian government has gone on about with the leadership of auto enterprises is bad. I absolutely did not press ZAZ. It is a pity for the people who work there, because because of the greed of the bourgeoisie they do not produce cars. It is necessary to remove these Views, Forza, Lvanosy / Chances from the assembly line and return the cars of class A, A +. That their price was 4-5 pieces of greenery, as if it is more expensive for the same money to buy a normal foreign car of the early 2000s .. When there was "Tavria", "Slavuta" plant produced a quarter of a million cars. And now 40 thousand are not enough.
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 18 July 2013 12: 53
      +5
      Quote: Akim
      A normal economic process has occurred.

      Right.
      Such events in the world can be counted hundreds, especially with goods from China.
      It is sad that everything is tied to the relationship between Russians and Ukrainians, as such. But not a single mere mortal, from the above, will have any gain or loss. They will live, as before ...
      1. Akim
        Akim 18 July 2013 13: 13
        +1
        Under Chuchma, "Tavria" cost 15 thousand hryvnia ($ 3 thousand). And coupled with a low interest rate for domestic cars - snapped up like hot cakes. The increase in sales started - the price began to rise. First 17 thousand then 21 thousand. But that was bearable. When the price went up to 25 thousand (5 pieces of dead presidents) - the car came kaput. And now too. I do not want to buy a domestic FU for 8-12 thousand raccoons. I don’t have extra money to support a national producer!
        1. Drosselmeyer
          Drosselmeyer 18 July 2013 23: 34
          +1
          What national? ZAZ are terrible Frankensteins from the bodies of previous models with Chinese engines, or even just Chinese. It's been a long time since nothing. "Lanos" was a good car, but it is morally and structurally outdated ten years ago, and prices are low ...
          1. Akim
            Akim 19 July 2013 00: 26
            0
            The manufacturer is national. And the fact that garbage is released is another question.
  • Opera
    Opera 18 July 2013 12: 47
    +3
    Brotherhood implies a blood, cultural basis! The basis of common moral values ​​and common goals! This is a historical basis! The basis of a common past with the bitterness of defeat and great victories! These are the graves of our great ancestors who did not divide themselves into older and younger! These are their great deeds worthy of which we must be!
    There is no room for money-grubbing in the fraternity! There is no place to sit with one seat on two completely different chairs! Brotherhood cannot be remembered when profitable! It is either there or not! Brotherhood is sincerity and mutual assistance, and not a trick hidden under national shirts! Cunning from the evil, cunning in politics from him!
    1. washi
      washi 18 July 2013 16: 21
      +4
      There is no room for money-grubbing in the fraternity! There is no place to sit with one seat on two completely different chairs! Brotherhood cannot be remembered when profitable! It is either there or not! Brotherhood is sincerity and mutual assistance, and not a trick hidden under national shirts! Cunning from the evil, cunning in politics from him!
      I agree with both hands.
      But Okraina is now a separate, sovereign state, moreover, spoiling for the lungs. Therefore, this territory should be treated like a state, including all legal sanctions for violations of international obligations
  • Protoucr
    Protoucr 18 July 2013 13: 46
    -5
    The policy of the Russian Federation reminds terror and trolling of an international scale.

    - Russians, with terror, you only sow response actions to yourself, of which Ukraine actually has more than the Russian Federation.
    1. I am a Russian
      I am a Russian 18 July 2013 16: 15
      +3
      Quote: Protoucr
      RF policy


      What is Ukrainian freebie ended (ends)? Sprayed with demoniac saliva!
      Engage in business for the benefit of the family, your country, and do not look for freebies on the side to slam the neighbor.
      1. Conepatus
        Conepatus 18 July 2013 16: 53
        0
        Well, let's say. And then what? After all, we will not bend, but we will ruin the relationship.
    2. M. Peter
      M. Peter 18 July 2013 19: 51
      +1
      And what if our Kremlin returns everything in the next month as it was, Ukraine will not want to enter the EU?
      Or maybe everything will be the other way around, that is, when extending such a policy of the Russian Federation, relatives from Ukraine will not let me in on the threshold of their apartment?
      Do you yourself believe in what you write? winked
  • EGORKA
    EGORKA 18 July 2013 14: 15
    +5
    Quote: Protoucr
    The policy of the Russian Federation reminds terror and trolling of an international scale.

    - Russians, with terror, you only sow response actions to yourself, of which Ukraine actually has more than the Russian Federation.

    Find the word terror in the explanatory dictionary .... otherwise you’ve been engaged in trumpet terrorism for 20 years now that is independent of yours)) And the words from the fable come back to your threats:
    Krylov's fable
    elephant and pug

    Through the streets of the Elephant they drove,
    As you can see for show -
    It is known that Elephants in wonder with us -
    There were crowds of onlookers behind the Elephant.
    From nowhere, meet Moska them.
    Seeing the Elephant, well, to him to rush,
    And bark, and scream, and tear,
    Well, and climbs into a fight with him.
    "Neighbor, stop being ashamed, -
    She mongrel says - do you want to mess with Elephant?
    Look, you're wheezing, and he goes to himself.
    Forward
    And I don’t notice your barking at all. "
    "Eh, eh! - Pug answers her, -
    That's what gives me the spirit,
    That I, absolutely without a fight,
    I can get into big bully.
    Let the dogs say:
    "Ay, pug! Know she is strong,
    What barks at the Elephant! "
    1. I am a Russian
      I am a Russian 18 July 2013 16: 05
      +3
      Quote: EGORKA

      Through the streets of the Elephant they drove,
      As you can see for show -
      It is known that Elephants in wonder with us -


      Well done Egor! good
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 18 July 2013 14: 32
    +4
    Sound pragmatism should prevail in the economy of any country. Russia joined the WTO for a very long time. For a long time Russia, in the process of negotiations on joining this organization, defended its interests and favorable conditions of this joining. Ukraine, on the other hand, entered very quickly and without any problems. Perhaps today the problems of such a "quick" entry are affecting. Trade wars do not paint anyone. They only confirm the existence of crisis phenomena in bilateral economic relations. What prevents both Russians and Ukrainians from coming together, discussing the ONLINE situation and taking mutually beneficial measures. But this is not there. We bomb each other with a percentage of duties and think that this is how we solve our problems. Absurd stupidity! Need to communicate!
  • The comment was deleted.
  • gorgo
    gorgo 18 July 2013 14: 58
    0
    Quote: freedmen
    The article is seedy, both morally and politically. I don’t even want to discuss such articles.
    And about Ukraine, I will say only one thing!
    I respect and love this country and people. 50% of the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug is the population from Ukraine. It is not for nothing that our district is called Tatar-Yat. But those who order such "prose" as enta clearly want a further split of the "family" ties between our peoples.
    The very personality of the writer already causes one conclusion - the nationalist, whose ancestors only did what they destroyed, like Bendera. Ugh, already disgusting.
    And then, the canvases of Ukraine in every possible way wish to warm up at the expense of their neighbors, and not only at the expense of Ukraine. By the way, it has always been, is and will be. Well, they have such a mentality !!! This mentality is manifested even between home neighbors. And that's it.


    I totally agree. It is surprising and frightening that in such articles the main characters are precisely "Russians and Ukrainians". Which is not only fundamentally wrong, because it is necessary to talk about the "authorities of Ukraine and the Russian Federation", and not at all about the peoples, but - what is worse - subconsciously continues to drum into heads that there are Russians and there are Ukrainians. But this, tovarischi, is nonsense! We are all Russians! And what all sorts of bastards are doing up there is our pain and misfortune, not our fault (although to some extent, it is our fault).
    But articles like that are clearly crappy. Very similar in style to the creations of our Svidomo journalists. Only those on the mov write. Here to move this opus to mov - well, one to one! Really disgusting to read!
    1. Ivanovich47
      Ivanovich47 18 July 2013 20: 07
      0
      I agree with you, colleague. You will agree that Russia and Ukraine are farther and farther apart. There is no delirium, even at the level of peoples there is alienation. I know what I'm saying. A few days ago I came from Ukraine.
      1. psv910
        psv910 18 July 2013 21: 32
        +3
        Quote: Ivanovich47
        I agree with you, colleague. You will agree that Russia and Ukraine are farther and farther apart. There is no delirium, even at the level of peoples there is alienation. I know what I'm saying. A few days ago I came from Ukraine.

        How many people, so many opinions. There is no alienation.
        I also arrived from Ukraine on July 11, the reception was the most cordial everywhere.
        The article is harmful. You can’t measure everything with money.
      2. I am a Russian
        I am a Russian 19 July 2013 22: 46
        0
        Quote: Ivanovich47
        I know what I'm saying. A few days ago I came from Ukraine.


        In even how! It turns out that I am not the only one who travels to Ukraine. During these six months I spent two and a half months in Kiev. I went to work, and then in the spring ... a call-voice from the tube "Do you accept guests?" Sergei arrived, served together, a native of Kiev. He stayed with me, took a walk, visited the "sleeping" areas ...
        ... We went to Kiev together.
        After another walk through the night streets of Kiev, Sergei tells me: “Even with all your chocks, you feel more comfortable in Russia. I never thought that in Ukraine they would raise their hand against veterans. On those thanks to whom we live. "
  • Scoun
    Scoun 18 July 2013 15: 08
    +1
    Author Dmitry Lekukh

    Write more, easy to read, affordable. hi
  • EGORKA
    EGORKA 18 July 2013 15: 44
    +3
    Even though we are all Russians by blood, we’ve got it in our heads. We came up with the idea of ​​separating us, if the Austro-Hungarian empire was not mistaken, then the division continued under the USSR into fraternal peoples, why don’t I understand, and after the collapse of the Soviets, consider this division, a generation has grown up believing that we are not the same and only some remember and consider us as one people, this generation will die and that’s all ... No matter how Russia tries to prevent this for our common good, but so far it doesn’t work out, it’s the worst thing that the West is with us and we They made their mistakes with their people. Therefore, it seems to me that at the level of our countries and economies it is necessary to remove fraternal approaches, they do not work and bring only insults hindering development, we live in a capitalist world and it is better to use a balanced and pragmatic approach with which Russia, and it was precisely balanced and reasonable that we always tried to settle our affairs with Ukraine, in many ways going to a meeting. Ukraine was the first to use pragmatism in our relations, this is when I chose rnity, and now entering into association with the EU, and when Russia began to apply a more pragmatic position towards Ukraine, then reproaches began, they press, they crush, etc. As they say, when you sow, you shake. And fraternal approaches can be applied in other lawsuits, if there is a desire.
    1. Warrawar
      Warrawar 18 July 2013 19: 11
      0
      Quote: EGORKA
      May we and all Russians be by blood

      Our blood is just completely different.
  • sop.ov
    sop.ov 18 July 2013 15: 51
    0
    Quote: Akim
    I do not agree. ZAZ has a large lobby in the government.

    yes, but the money from the duty will go to the treasury. I doubt that in the short term, while there is fuss with duties, ZAZ’s position in the market will greatly strengthen
  • Sirjey
    Sirjey 18 July 2013 16: 19
    +1
    Quote: gecko
    Well, in any case, they will be cheaper than yours, because There are no customs or transportation fees. Plus, there was a rumor that they wanted to freeze gas and electricity prices.


    As a little competent person in matters of gas price pricing, I will refute the rumor:
    For 2014-2016, an average increase in gas prices for industrial consumers is planned at 5% per year, but for the population 2014–10%, 2015–9%, 2016–8%. As we see, the population is again traditionally richer than industry, but gradually there is a softening (at least not at 15% per year), so alas, there’s no need to talk about freezing (
  • Tolik.Skiff.
    Tolik.Skiff. 18 July 2013 16: 33
    +2
    The island "Serpentine", together with the gas reserves, was moved to quiet time and without any duties, and even "there was no noise of waves." Give it to Russia at least for rent, but no ... As in the joke "we won't eat sho, I'll bite" .. Immediately after the collapse of the USSR, I was driving from Kerch to Simviropol in a bus, so an elderly old man, all the way, shouted to the whole bus "sho we Muscovites need here" ... The fact that I was from the Kuban, he did not care, like everyone else! !! Conclusion: Since then I haven’t gotten to Ukraine anymore ... I support all Russia's actions at the expense of Ukraine and even consider them very weak ... Only for one Ukrainian strategic plane shot down in Georgia ... if it was American ???
    1. UFO
      UFO 18 July 2013 17: 20
      0
      = Tolik.Skiff.-Everything is correct, only it is possible without errors, so as not to cause ridicule of the "more advanced". wink
  • Conepatus
    Conepatus 18 July 2013 17: 52
    +1
    Guys, all this is of course relevant, but the Far East has become depopulated (read a freebie for China). You can practice literature and insulting Ukrainians as much as you like, but this will not solve the problem. It seems to me (although I do not pretend to be absolute) that both countries (after all, it’s a sin to hide) from the WTO and the creation of a system (based on the same TS) that allows the economy to develop regardless of the crisis of the Westerners will be more effective than being measured by squeaks
    1. UFO
      UFO 18 July 2013 18: 20
      0
      Well so, what was the matter? Who will start? request
    2. Sour
      Sour 18 July 2013 23: 12
      +2
      Not so depopulated the Far East, as it seems stupid Svidomo. Especially those who have never been further than Kiev in the east.
      And don't lie about the dominance of the Chinese in Russia. This dominance is only a figment of the imagination of "Svidomo" freaks. This is their favorite topic. I live in Russia, but I see the Chinese only on TV, the last time I saw live was when I was in Hamburg three years ago. I strongly doubt that there are more Chinese in Nizhny Novgorod or Kazan than in your Kiev.
  • EGORKA
    EGORKA 18 July 2013 18: 29
    +4
    Quote: Conepatus
    Guys, all this is of course relevant, but the Far East has become depopulated (read a freebie for China). You can practice literature and insulting Ukrainians as much as you like, but this will not solve the problem. It seems to me (although I do not pretend to be absolute) that both countries (after all, it’s a sin to hide) from the WTO and the creation of a system (based on the same TS) that allows the economy to develop regardless of the crisis of the Westerners will be more effective than being measured by squeaks


    Is Russia really against joint development for our common good ?! For several years now Russia has been calling for this, but the Ukrainian authorities are still deaf, they go to the EU and carry their independence there. In response, Russia has to change something in its economic policy, to cut something, as is now seen. than Russia went to meet Ukraine in the hope of future closer cooperation, all this can stop as we see and approach this more pragmatically, just to the Far East, which you mentioned, more money can go. Russia leads an independent policy and the fewer the weak points we have, the better it is to the fact that the EU is also a political organization, Ukraine only enters into association with them and has already put forward a bunch of demands, and if in the future Ukraine its European bosses will order to somehow blackmail Russia economically and Ukraine will not can refuse, then what? That is why Russia will have to minimize the risks and note that all this will be legal, within the framework of the same WTO, I think Russia has drawn conclusions from the problems with the "gas pipe" and the constant blackmail of "Naftogaz", we do not want to anymore. for a pipe, and a few years ago I would have agreed to a joint venture, the money that Gazprom spent on roundabout maneuvers could have been spent on investments in Ukraine. But, but, but ...
    1. Sour
      Sour 18 July 2013 23: 47
      +2
      In this case, do not forget one obvious thing -
      Russia is doing well without Ukraine and will cost further.
      Next, let's see how Ukraine will manage without Russia.
      And from this we will draw the obvious conclusion - is the conversation on equal terms justified?
      And who needs it?
      Or is there still a self-sufficient state (on the one hand), and it is not clear what with the capital in Kiev (on the other hand)?
  • sashka
    sashka 18 July 2013 20: 10
    -1
    Article class. And the conclusions are also Class. Neither add nor add. I applaud standing !!!
  • Naval
    Naval 18 July 2013 20: 19
    +5
    Gone are the 90s, when Ukraine lived according to the principle of "pokirlev calf two queens sse", they took both from the West and from Russia, as in that joke: "I told my wife, I went to my mistress, and I said to my mistress, I went to my wife, and I will climb in a hut and work, work .. "But after the" orange "masks flew off, and everyone saw the animal grin of nationalism. Now questions are being resolved pragmatically, if you are not with us, then against us. Therefore, there is nothing to be offended by tricks and screws, as one of the postulates of the free market says: "walk around the bazaar, maybe you will find cheaper"
  • individual
    individual 18 July 2013 20: 57
    +1
    I agree with the author.
    But troubles with Ukraine did not begin today. Even when he was V. Chernomyrdin The ambassador of Russia to Ukraine from independent politicians sounded:
    "And what did Viktor Stepanovich do for the good of Ukraine?"
    Chernomyrdin's biting answer: "In Russia they care about the state, in Ukraine they care about the hut!" He blew up the nationalists with his innocence.
    Although the Russian ambassador to Ukraine, Mikhail Zurabov, said that his predecessor in this post, Viktor Chernomyrdin, considered Ukraine a part of his life.
  • stranik72
    stranik72 18 July 2013 21: 04
    0
    sadly, but I was even more saddened by the news that we had already begun to kill our own people, our border guards "distinguished themselves" on the Sea of ​​Azov, so against the background of this event, everything else is pranks of the bourgeoisie, which have practically nothing to do with the common people of both countries.
  • tilovaykrisa
    tilovaykrisa 18 July 2013 21: 17
    0
    I have dual citizenship and live 60 to 40 in both the Russian Federation and Ukraine, this will not change anything, this article is more likely to pit us, stupid and empty, two oligarchs (cosmopolitan) had a fight. Russia should concern itself with the problem of Crimea, since Ukraine is letting it drift away, and there are more Russians than in the Baltic, and the Tatar underground is gaining strength. The option of Kosovo-Yugoslavia is just around the corner, and these monetary losses will be many times greater than some duties of which we objectively do not even notice.
    1. Akim
      Akim 18 July 2013 22: 07
      -3
      Quote: tilovaykrisa
      I have dual citizenship and live 60 to 40 in both the Russian Federation and Ukraine,

      Do you know that you are breaking the law?
      1. tilovaykrisa
        tilovaykrisa 18 July 2013 23: 41
        +1
        which one? god? For example, I gave the oath to the state of the USSR, so for whom am I now a traitor to the Motherland?
        1. Sour
          Sour 19 July 2013 00: 00
          +1
          I took the oath to both the Union and Russia. And I do not see anything criminal in it. Glory to the Lord God that Ukraine did not take the oath.
          "But there are more Russians than in the Baltic states," is this where - "there" ???
          Is it not in "Svidomo" ???
          Ukraine is full of Russian speakers, but there are not so many Russians. Percent fractions, and nothing more.
          1. tilovaykrisa
            tilovaykrisa 19 July 2013 22: 02
            +1
            Crimeans tell it.
        2. Akim
          Akim 19 July 2013 00: 30
          0
          Quote: tilovaykrisa
          For example, I gave the oath to the state of the USSR

          Calm down you with the oath. Nobody will put you under arms and are not going to. And the law. Dual citizenship is prohibited in Ukraine, but this is not criminally punishable.
  • EGORKA
    EGORKA 18 July 2013 22: 32
    -1
    Quote: stranik72
    sadly, but I was even more saddened by the news that we had already begun to kill our own people, our border guards "distinguished themselves" on the Sea of ​​Azov, so against the background of this event, everything else is pranks of the bourgeoisie, which have practically nothing to do with the common people of both countries.

    This is an accident, in that area there are many Ukrainian poachers who are not averse to catching fish in our waters, when they contacted them and tried to inspect them, they tried to leave, all this led to a tragedy. Therefore, write garbage about the fact that "we started to kill its "not worth it, they saved one, but would like to kill, then they would drown everyone and no one would know.