Military Review

Romanian troops in Moldova

239
Romanian troops in MoldovaMoldova has signed a military treaty with Romania. Now, in the event of a war with Transnistria, the Romanian army will openly enter there, and the Romanian gendarmes will crush any protests against the unification of the two countries in Chisinau, Balti or Gagauzia. The only way for Moscow to avoid slaughter is direct cooperation with Tiraspol.


27 June 2013, the Moldovan Parliament ratified the agreement on military cooperation with Romania. Reportedly, the main thing in the agreement that passed the first reading is the creation of a legal basis for the permanent presence of Romanian troops in the Republic of Moldova. Earlier, Chisinau and Bucharest signed a document stating that the Romanian gendarmerie can get access to the territory of Moldova in case of "riots".

Since Moldova considers Transnistria to be its part, any resistance of Tiraspol to the will of Chisinau, and any attempt by the Russian peacekeepers deployed in the Transdniestrian Moldavian Republic to stop the bloodshed, can be declared a “riot”. That is, the gendarmes from Romania will be called upon to help Chisinau with a forceful “solution of the Transnistrian issue”, and also to suppress the actions of opponents of the takeover of Moldova by Bucharest in Moldova itself (Balti, Gagauzia).

An armed invasion of Moldova from the Prut can go through the line of the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the line of the Ministry of Defense of Romania. The document implies: consultations, exchange of representatives, holding joint military exercises, exchange of personnel. Joint military infrastructures can be created. It gives the go-ahead to "the organization of joint command at the operational and territorial levels and the corresponding work of the general staffs." It provides for the “exchange of personnel during exercises”, “the use of the airspace of countries during joint exercises”, the exchange of documents, including “cartographic support”, etc.

This means in the event of a conflict on the Dniester, Romania can connect its air force to attack Transdnistria and the Russian group in Transdniestria, as well as with the help of its General Staff, which, of course, is more powerful than the General Staff of Moldova, to plan combat operations. It is clear that the Romanian military will take over command.

Finally, Romania is a member of NATO, which creates the prerequisites for entering into a possible new war on the Dniester of the forces of the North Atlantic Alliance.

Romanian piano in Moldavian bushes

The Romanian leadership and its junior partners in Chisinau have chosen the present days for this step not by chance. The situation in the zone of the Moldova-Transdniestrian conflict is now rapidly exacerbated. It may be several months before the final gap between Chisinau and Tiraspol.

The media reported: preparations for the signing in Vilnius of the treaties on Moldova’s accession to the trade zone with the EU and the Moldova-EU Association have been completed. Transnistria does not intend to join there. Initialing should take place in November-2013 in Vilnius at the Eastern Partnership Summit.

At the same time, Chisinau, along the Moldova-Transdniestrian border, is deploying 6 migration posts, which will fulfill the de facto function of the border. One of their tasks is to fine Transnistrians traveling in the Republic of Moldova, who do not have Moldovan citizenship. At the same time, Chisinau admits that this idea was thrown to him by the EU.

For its part, Transdniestrian President Yevgeny Shevchuk promised to “stop” reconnaissance flights over the territory of the republic. It is also reported that additional Transnistrian forces were brought into Bender, which caused protests from Chisinau.

Course - Odessa

It is obvious that Romania is preparing a takeover of Moldova with a new force. 27 June, the ruling "Coalition of pro-European government" in Chisinau adopted the Border Regime Treaty between the two countries - while the Moldova State Border Treaty has not yet been concluded. As is known, Romanian President Traian Basescu has repeatedly stated that he never recognizes the border "established by Stalin and Hitler." He believes that the Treaty of Paris 1947 of the year, which established the border between the USSR (which included the MSSR) and Romania along the Prut River, was imposed on Bucharest as a result of the Second World War.

And now the Romanians are creating the basis for a future takeover: in parallel with the military and police penetration into Moldova, they shy away from consolidating the state border with Moldova along Prut. It turns out that they may enter into a possible conflict in the former Soviet Moldavia, but they do not recognize the border. Most likely, in the future, Bucharest sees this border as the Romanian-Ukrainian border in the area of ​​Kuchurgan, which is not far from Odessa. However, the plans of the builders of "Great Romania" also include the annexation of part of the Odessa region and Bukovina.

In the meantime, as Moldovan parliamentarians themselves admit of the ruling checkpoint, Romania "refuses to even discuss the treaty on the state border." This is logical, since Bucharest sees Moldova and Transdniestria in its composition.

Bury the Helsinki Corpse

So, the European Union and Romania are initiating the aggravation of the situation on the Dniester. The EU is pushing Moldova towards repressions against Transnistrians who do not have Moldovan citizenship. Romania creates the basis for military intervention in the Moldova-Transdniestrian confrontation.

From the point of view of Brussels and Bucharest, these steps are taken on time. If agreements are signed in Vilnius, then political negotiations between the Republic of Moldova and Transdniestria will lose their meaning. In fact, what to talk about, if legally Moldova moves into the political and economic sphere of influence of the EU and Romania, while the Transnistrian Moldavian Republic is heading for Eurasian integration? For Tiraspol, links with Moscow and, if possible, Kiev are extremely important. And if Tiraspol, contrary to the wishes of Brussels and Bucharest, does not want to go "to Europe through Romania", it means that they believe in these capitals, it should be pressed.

In Transnistria, they are very alarmed: if Russia does not intervene decisively now, the unrecognized republic is waiting for a fate worse than South Ossetia (there is no common border between the Russian Federation and Transdniestria), and the Russian peacekeepers face the fate of the KSOR base near Georgians. Moldavian reconnaissance aircraft are already flying over Transnistria - believed to be in Tiraspol, with NATO reconnaissance aircraft on board. In the capital, Transnistrian Moldavian Republic regard these actions as clarifying targets for strikes and promise to “nip” flights.

Transnistrians hope that Moscow will finally stop looking at Chisinau on every occasion and start working directly with Transnistria.
Here they are also counting on the strengthening of the Russian military presence in the Transdniestrian Moldavian Republic, as well as on the earliest start of large-scale funding for the modernization and rearmament of Transnistrian security forces.

Transnistria also urgently needs to develop and implement a training program for the army, the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the KGB of the republic in Russia. If Ukraine somehow participates in this, this is even better, since the penetration of Romania into Moldova directly threatens the national interests of Kiev, they are convinced in Tiraspol. However, the Ukrainian theme requires a weighted separate conversation.

In a word, Transdniestria expects Russia to repeatedly strengthen direct ties in all directions. If Chisinau openly goes under the NATO military umbrella, they note here that there is no point in general adhering to the formalities left over from the dead more than 20 years ago by the Helsinki Accords.
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  1. experienced
    experienced 3 July 2013 15: 48 New
    79
    Пора России присоединять Приднестровье, располагать там военные базы и в случае входа румынских войск в Молдову раскатывать их по асфальту. Хватит миндальничать, всему есть предел. Чем больше мы закрываем глаза на "шалости" молдован и Украины с "перекрытием границ" Приднестровья, тем больше у них "зудит" от безнаказанности am
    It is necessary to demand from Ukraine clear conditions for military transit through its territory from Russia to Transnistria, to confront Moldova with the fact that the Romanians will get into you, we will consider the beginning of the database and occupation with all the ensuing consequences.
    1. Nevsky
      Nevsky 3 July 2013 15: 55 New
      +9
      True Romanians are coming, 1:50 laughing one of them is driving something at the communists.

      1. papss
        papss 3 July 2013 17: 45 New
        19
        No one here is driving the Communists ... I will briefly translate ... The dispute between Moldovan and Romanian ... Themes Antonescu freed Moldova, the Red Army occupied us ... Romanian Moldovans - you are an occupier, an invader. Negro - Moldavian - are you a communist? Moldovan, I am in my own land. At the end, Ryman shouts - all Russians ...
        So ... so that not all Moldovans want to see Romania here ...
        1. 89501358976
          89501358976 3 July 2013 18: 07 New
          11
          and black then what the hell do you need7 ??? am let him yell in africa !!!!
          1. Konstantm
            Konstantm 3 July 2013 19: 48 New
            10
            Quote: 89501358976
            and black then what the hell do you need7 ???

            It is said the same Romanian. Rather, the Afro-Romanian will be more tolerant.
            1. Aryan
              Aryan 3 July 2013 20: 01 New
              +8
              noble fellow this neger
              on the 9th of May I attached a ribbon to my leg
              his happiness that his policemen
            2. Very old
              Very old 3 July 2013 20: 51 New
              +2
              From tolerance already (Lord, save) ...
            3. avdkrd
              avdkrd 3 July 2013 22: 59 New
              +5
              not Afro, but Negro-Romanian)))
            4. DEfindER
              DEfindER 4 July 2013 10: 30 New
              +6
              Quote: KonstantM
              It is said the same Romanian. Rather, the Afro-Romanian will be more tolerant.

              For some reason, I immediately remembered this picture
            5. kirieeleyson
              kirieeleyson 5 July 2013 17: 20 New
              0
              Quote: KonstantM
              It is said the same Romanian.

              Да кто их разберет, как там в брате "да какая разница" ))
              Я конечно обалдел от "яркого поджарого Румына"
        2. Very old
          Very old 3 July 2013 20: 49 New
          +1
          And should we sniff in a rag? Alexey is right
      2. moldavan
        moldavan 3 July 2013 22: 24 New
        +4
        You yourself see how many and who wants to be with Romanians
    2. avt
      avt 3 July 2013 15: 58 New
      19
      Quote: seasoned
      It is time for Russia to annex Transnistria, to establish military bases there, and if Romanian troops enter Moldova, roll them on asphalt. Stop lingering, there’s a limit to everything.

      request How do you imagine this technically in the absence of a border with Transnistria? This is not Ossetia and Abkhazia, much depends on Ukraine here, and its leadership will spoil us out of the gas principle there.
      1. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 3 July 2013 16: 02 New
        11
        Quote: avt

        How do you imagine this technically in the absence of a border with Transnistria?

        And what can Ukraine do? Our transport workers will start to bring down, this is nonsense, plus in Gagauzia they want to separate from Chisinau. Many contra. What would Romania with its sixes get for hi
        1. Che
          Che 3 July 2013 18: 09 New
          +4
          Nonsense. I can’t imagine that the Romanians will become insolent enough to unleash a war. In my opinion, NATO will not even allow it.
          1. dustycat
            dustycat 3 July 2013 19: 31 New
            +4
            Let it be allowed.
            Moreover, they chopped off part of the shelf of the Black Sea near the ov.
            Another question is that Romania is still not Schengen for a reason.
            Separate it from the European Union - press a couple of buttons on the keyboard and euro transfers to Romania will stop. But the barriers on the border and so are.
            Of course, Romania is a NATO member, but the armament is not yet all NATO and the fact that NATO is highly used, so it’s not a pity to leave him there.

            The European Union has no great desire to wage a small victorious war that shines the next world.
            The whole question is how much determination of the current regime in Russia will be enough.
          2. Very old
            Very old 3 July 2013 20: 55 New
            +5
            Of course, it will not allow, but it will allow barking. FOR THAT she and the dog
          3. Blackgrifon
            Blackgrifon 4 July 2013 15: 41 New
            +2
            Quote: Che
            Nonsense. I can’t imagine that the Romanians will become insolent enough to unleash a war. In my opinion, NATO will not even allow it.


            And who in 2007 thought that it would blaze in South Ossetia so that the Georgians would attack the Russian peacekeepers and would really plan to attack the Russian soldiers?
        2. nycsson
          nycsson 3 July 2013 18: 11 New
          +7
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          And what can Ukraine do?

          Recently I watched an interview with Yushchenko: we took a direct course towards European integration! Do you catch a thought? laughing
        3. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 19: 16 New
          +1
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          And what can Ukraine do? Will start to bring down our transporters, this is nonsense

          Well, if the goal is only to overtake the transporters, then yes, but after the completion of the military phase, what shall we do?
          borzoi are offended and are unlikely to allow us to establish a message Dnieper, about Moldavians I will not even stutter.
          How will we support the economy of Transnistria ?!
          1. dustycat
            dustycat 3 July 2013 19: 34 New
            +7
            What to do what to do ...
            Think.
            Recognize Russia as an independent state of Eastern Ukraine or not.
            Europe will definitely not think for a long time recognizing the independent state of Western Ukraine.
            1. nycsson
              nycsson 3 July 2013 22: 43 New
              0
              Quote: dustycat
              Recognize Russia as an independent state of Eastern Ukraine or not.

              Do you offer Moldova and western Ukraine to surrender to Romania?
              1. Basileus
                Basileus 4 July 2013 15: 23 New
                0
                Here the Romanians would be happy)))
            2. sasha.28blaga
              sasha.28blaga 4 July 2013 08: 10 New
              0
              And Crimea yet !!!
        4. zennon
          zennon 3 July 2013 21: 29 New
          +2
          And what can Ukraine do? Will start to bring down our transporters, this is nonsense

          Any sovereign state has the right to regulate, as well as prohibit the transfer of goods / troops through its territory. I don’t know if you are aware, but ANY aircraft is obliged to obey the orders of the dispatchers. If there is an order to land, follow it! I understand what you want to say . The way out is to work out a consolidated policy with Ukraine, which means to conclude agreements.
          1. sasha.28blaga
            sasha.28blaga 4 July 2013 08: 16 New
            -1
            Dear Right, this is not an Obligation. Secondly, in order to ensure the right of the state to declare its rights, one Rada will not be enough.
        5. sasha.28blaga
          sasha.28blaga 4 July 2013 08: 08 New
          0
          That's right, and I also think so. Who are Ukraine if Russia is nobody for it. Shoot down our planes after one salvo from our side they have a thin gut (may the Slavs forgive me).
          1. kirieeleyson
            kirieeleyson 5 July 2013 17: 30 New
            0
            I can’t even imagine this for Ukraine to fly down our planes. It’s such a thing, to beat oneself for the sake of all kinds of gayropic scum. And how can something be decided, separated, attached, what kind of crap on our part is comrades?
            There will be Russians in Transnistria to wet - we will react harshly. Moldova will give green on this - there will be measures on it.
      2. experienced
        experienced 3 July 2013 16: 05 New
        30
        Quote: avt
        How do you imagine this technically in the absence of a border with Transnistria?

        Калининград в пример... Границы нет, но никто не оспаривает и "палки в колеса" не сует. Впрочем у России такие "колеса", что любые "палки" перемелем и не заметим. Просто нужен четкий "посыл" на уровне Президента:"Наше!!! Никому не лезть!" И думаю, даже этого будет достаточно hi
        1. avt
          avt 3 July 2013 16: 28 New
          +4
          Quote: seasoned
          Калининград в пример... Границы нет, но никто не оспаривает и "палки в колеса" не сует

          Well, let’s put an example that is not successful, this is not a self-determined unrecognized republic, but quite a territory of Russia inherited from the USSR. Well, where is Transnistria’s exit to the sea? Now, if at least technical support is provided? Gagauzia does not count, the situation there is somewhat different and the Turks will most likely fit into it.
          1. Very old
            Very old 3 July 2013 21: 03 New
            +1
            The Turks are long before the light bulb, they have other problems. To the tellers - a clear message: have you forgotten?
        2. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 19: 18 New
          +2
          complete blockade of TO is impossible; there is still a maritime communication
      3. Papakiko
        Papakiko 3 July 2013 16: 12 New
        +2
        Quote: avt
        This is not Ossetia and Abkhazia

        All true.
        One hope, the Black Sea Fleet is nearby.
        Видимо всёж на G8 пытались "разменять" Сирию на Преднестровье.
        1. nycsson
          nycsson 3 July 2013 22: 45 New
          0
          Quote: Papakiko
          Видимо всёж на G8 пытались "разменять" Сирию на Преднестровье.

          Radish horseradish is not sweeter!
      4. mch1950
        mch1950 3 July 2013 16: 29 New
        0
        But is the Kaliningrad region a myth?
      5. Airman
        Airman 3 July 2013 17: 49 New
        +2
        Quote: avt
        Quote: seasoned
        It is time for Russia to annex Transnistria, to establish military bases there, and if Romanian troops enter Moldova, roll them on asphalt. Stop lingering, there’s a limit to everything.

        request How do you imagine this technically in the absence of a border with Transnistria? This is not Ossetia and Abkhazia, much depends on Ukraine here, and its leadership will spoil us out of the gas principle there.

        The Kaliningrad region also does not have a land border with the Russian Federation.
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 19: 35 New
          +2
          Transnistria and the sea border does not have, in the event of a conflict, communication is really only through
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 21: 56 New
            0
            damn the administration, zadolbali in the word I wanted you, that doesn’t suit you, strain the IT specialists if the machine is moderating, then you made nonsense if the person forgive him a brain problem (based on the fact that it’s possible to deceive by changing the register it seems that IT specialists made a crap)
      6. Corneli
        Corneli 3 July 2013 18: 34 New
        +6
        Quote: avt
        here a lot depends on Ukraine, and its leadership from the gas principle will spoil us there

        Вы как в том злом анектоде: "Украина еще ниче плохого не сделала, но уже "нагадила" (ну или будет гадить)"
        Украине конфликты (любые), рядом нафиг не нужны - это факт. Но подвижки румынов с их Великой Романией нам не нужны тоже...Так что будем посмотреть, как оно дальше развиваться будет. А "гаденье" России, в этом вопросе, второстепенный фактор.
        1. Very old
          Very old 3 July 2013 21: 08 New
          +3
          OLEG, Romania has always been at someone's grab. Here from it one should expect the first dirty tricks, signaling, as in that joke
          1. Theophanes
            Theophanes 4 July 2013 15: 27 New
            +1
            I agree with you. Romania is in the wings. But if she decides to send troops ..... This is a prelude to 3 world!
        2. little man
          little man 4 July 2013 10: 05 New
          0
          "Так что будем посмотреть, как оно дальше..." Вот! В этом вся политика Украины.
          What is it called everyone knows.
      7. dustycat
        dustycat 3 July 2013 19: 21 New
        +1
        How how...
        What are the air defense of Ukraine? Randomly located radars. For orientation, they’ll go where to fly.
        Several Mi26 and IL76 will ensure the transfer of RPGs in sufficient quantities.
        And further - whether there are Romanian forces there, whether they are - does not have physical significance. This is Western Ukraine with UNA UNSO and to hang on the Romanians for a long time their hands itch. Well, tidy up the zemlyatse too.
        It will still be possible to equip Bessarabia and the Gagauzs with weapons.
        Просто так закинуть "по ошибке"...
        There are many options.
        Yugoslavia Europe seems like an easy walk.
        1. zennon
          zennon 3 July 2013 21: 40 New
          +1
          What are the air defense of Ukraine?

          And you remember October 4, 2001. I think they still had the S-200 ... By the way, the Kiev Economic Court did not plead guilty to the Ukrainian military in the case of the Tu-154 plane crash.
        2. serioga
          serioga 4 July 2013 08: 04 New
          0
          You are right, Bessarabia needs to be armed, for for Bessarabia the Romanians are like a bone in the throat with its politics, their agitators have been campaigning on the Besserabian people for 15 years among the Moldovan population but so far without result, in Bessarabia more than half of the population of Russians, Ukrainians, Bulgarians, Gagauzians and not it is impossible to take their opinions into account. And as for the sentiments, the local population is against Romania (in Izmail, Reni, Kilie, Vilkovo, more than 3000 people of the former paratroopers who fought in Yugoslavia are ready to take up arms in their hands against Romania, and even Lipovans living in Romania who deprived Ceausescu of their surnames giving them the Romanians, they will also support them, the Romanian state does not exist, just like the nation as a whole, there is only the Moldavian principality.
      8. Revolver
        Revolver 4 July 2013 00: 35 New
        0
        Quote: avt
        here a lot depends on Ukraine, and its leadership from the gas principle will spoil us there.

        So the fact of the matter is that Gazprom can close the pipe for emergency repairs wassat , and Yanukovych cannot but understand.
    3. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 3 July 2013 16: 00 New
      20
      Quote: seasoned
      It’s time for Russia to join Transnistria,

      Together with Kishenev soldier
      By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers request
      1. experienced
        experienced 3 July 2013 16: 07 New
        32
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers

        During the Second World War, these warriors went down in history as the most merciless looters. They took everything to the last rag from the population in the occupied territories.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 3 July 2013 16: 18 New
          10
          Quote: seasoned
          During the Second World War, these warriors went down in history as the most merciless looters.

          In general, Romania, at least with someone, when it was at war itself, I don’t remember something what
          1. experienced
            experienced 3 July 2013 16: 24 New
            10
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            In general, Romania, at least with someone, when it was at war itself, I don’t remember something

            It’s like they waged war with the Turks (although it may be partisan), there the count became famous, who was later turned into Dracula. request And so they all the time entered into blocs and coalitions, that in the 1st world, that in the second
            1. Alexander Romanov
              Alexander Romanov 3 July 2013 16: 35 New
              11
              Quote: seasoned
              It’s like they waged war with the Turks (the truth is maybe partisan)

              In short, there is nothing to remember Romania about glorious victories, but they were regularly raked.
              1. experienced
                experienced 3 July 2013 16: 37 New
                11
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                In short, there is nothing to remember Romania about glorious victories, but they were regularly raked.

                Well, yes, no matter who they allied with, they always raked and they and those for whom they fought. In general, well, their figs of such allies wink
                1. Very old
                  Very old 3 July 2013 21: 28 New
                  +1
                  Al, are there not much honor for them, what are we talking about?
              2. Garrin
                Garrin 3 July 2013 18: 52 New
                +3
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                In short, there is nothing to remember Romania about glorious victories, but they were regularly raked.

                Well yeah ... And Ducky? wassat
              3. nycsson
                nycsson 3 July 2013 22: 49 New
                +1
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                In short, there is nothing to remember Romania about glorious victories, but they were regularly raked.

                What's the difference? They are in NATO, and this is not the last trump card!
            2. kartalovkolya
              kartalovkolya 3 July 2013 16: 37 New
              +8
              By the way, my friend: during World War I, the question arose of what to do with Romania. If an Alliance needs Defense, 1 divisions are needed, and if enemies clearly drink it, 13 divisions are needed. So who needs such allies to tear down their navel!
            3. Very old
              Very old 3 July 2013 21: 26 New
              0
              In any, from dummies you’ll only wait in the back (the folder was correct, I didn’t say in vain)
            4. stroporez
              stroporez 5 July 2013 11: 48 New
              0
              князь Владислав --- очень даже "путевый" воин был......токо вот не румын он.............хотя и строил Бухарест.
          2. rolik
            rolik 3 July 2013 17: 02 New
            12
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            In general, Romania, at least with someone, when it was at war itself, I don’t remember something

            With Ostap Suleiman Bert Maria Bender Bay, in the Golden Calf.
            - Troianu Romagna Mare! Ostap said to the approaching officer. And as it seemed to Ostap, the officer smiled at him in the dark ..... but what happened next everyone remembers. It was a glorious battle of the brave Romanian border guards with the evil Russian savage (although it was hard to call Russian Ostap). ))))
          3. Tersky
            Tersky 3 July 2013 18: 23 New
            +8
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            In general, Romania, even with someone

            It became most interesting winked , пришлось слазить в "Вику". repeat .Romania originated as vassal state of the ottoman empire in 1859 as a result of the unification of two principalities - Moldova and Wallachia. , (now it’s clear where the legs grow from, wink laughing ) Another historical area of ​​the modern Romanian state - Transylvania - was then part of Austria-Hungary. During the First World War, Romania initially maintained neutrality, then entered 28 on August 1916 of the year on the Entente side under the influence of the victories of the Russian army. Romania declared war on Austria-Hungary, but its army was quickly defeated. Romania was saved from liquidation by the Russian Empire, which allocated an army to support it, thereby expanding the Eastern Front to the Black Sea.

            As a result of the war, Romania acquired Transylvania, and reunited Bessarabia, which was part of Russia. In the 1917 year, - the Council of the Territory, the Council of the Country) - the state authority in Bessarabia (formerly part of the Principality of Moldova) proclaimed the Republic of Moldova, from 27 of March 1918 of the year - the Moldavian Democratic Republic and recognized the accession of Bessarabia to Romania. During World War II, Romania was an ally of Nazi Germany. Romanian troops participated in the war against the USSR. Two new provinces were created from the Soviet territories occupied by Romania: Bessarabia, which included the right-bank part of the Moldavian SSR, the Izmail region and the Chernivtsi regions of the Ukrainian SSR, and Transnistria, which included the left-bank part of the MSSR and parts of the Odessa, Nikolaev and Vinnitsa regions of the Ukrainian SSR.

            In August 1944, King Mihai I, united with the anti-fascist opposition, ordered the arrest of Antonescu and the pro-German generals and declared war on Germany. After that, Soviet troops were introduced into Bucharest, and the allied Romanian army, together with the Soviet, fought against the Nazi coalition on the territory of Hungary, and then in Austria.
            1. Very old
              Very old 3 July 2013 21: 33 New
              +3
              Vityunya, without going to WIKI - she went there. Well, not worth our attention
            2. 225chay
              225chay 4 July 2013 09: 46 New
              0
              Quote: Tersky
              In August 1944, King Mihai I, united with the anti-fascist opposition, ordered the arrest of Antonescu and the pro-German generals and declared war on Germany. After that, Soviet troops were introduced into Bucharest, and the allied Romanian army, together with the Soviet, fought against the Nazi coalition on the territory of Hungary, and then in Austria.

              Короче всегда куда "ветерок дует"
          4. Very old
            Very old 3 July 2013 21: 23 New
            0
            In convoys. Duty wagons must be loaded
          5. nelson
            nelson 3 July 2013 21: 45 New
            +1
            In our childhood there was Commissar Miklovan, who extinguished all enemies to the right and left. But this is a movie, but I don’t remember.
            1. Yashka Gorobets
              Yashka Gorobets 3 July 2013 23: 43 New
              +1
              Miklovan was in the Russian translation, and in the original it was Moldavan, taking into account the fact that his friend Mihai Roman (Romanian, that is, in Russian), the picture was still looming. In one of the series, the Moldovan commissioner complained that several million fellow citizens are in the occupation, and in the courtyard of the film was the 40th year. So the Romanians even then sharpened knives.
          6. Ivan.
            Ivan. 4 July 2013 00: 58 New
            0
            Quote: Alexander Romanov
            Quote: seasoned
            During the Second World War, these warriors went down in history as the most merciless looters.

            In general, Romania, at least with someone, when it was at war itself, I don’t remember something what

            I can’t remember except Moldova.
            About fraud

            For more than 40 years, Stefan III with rare courage and, in fact, alone, resisted the onslaught of the Turkish colossus. The resources of Moldova and the Ottoman Empire were not comparable, but Stefan won 34 of 36 battles with the Turks. Not having achieved the unification of Christians against the Turks, Stephen, on his deathbed, bequeathed his son to obey Porta, but on honorable terms ...

            These are known facts. And the falsification consists in intrusive statements: while he allegedly did not order to be friends with the Russians, explaining that they were worse than the Turks ... And other nonsense, sometimes with reference to some wall inscriptions in Putna, where the great ruler was buried. It is well known who Stefan III considered worse than the Turks.
            Romanian of course
            In 1538, the Turkish army invaded Moldova, led by Sultan Suleiman himself, from the east the Crimean Tatars surged in, and from the north the Poles. First, Peter Raresh defeated the Ottomans at the Battle of Khotyn. But the Turkish army captured Suceava, and the metropolitan boyars hastened to express their loyalty to the Sultan. The Turks seated Stefan Lacusta on the Moldovan throne, Petr Rares fled the country. It was from this time that Moldova finally fell under the control of the Turks. The Sultan subjugated the areas between Prut and the Dniester, and Bujak, which the Turks took, as usual, in alliance with the Walls (Muntians or Romanians), gave to the Crimean Tatars
        2. Manager
          Manager 3 July 2013 16: 30 New
          +2
          Quote: seasoned
          During the Second World War, these warriors went down in history as the most merciless looters. They took everything to the last rag from the population in the occupied territories.


          So they had a role model! Here is an example. Guess who and with whom here?
          1. Pimply
            Pimply 4 July 2013 13: 13 New
            0
            1941 year, Besarabia. German paratroopers and Romanian officers are studying the map of hostilities.
        3. mch1950
          mch1950 3 July 2013 16: 30 New
          +2
          And they fought on the side of Hitler.
          1. S-200
            S-200 3 July 2013 17: 41 New
            13
            were starting fight for Hitler, and finished for Stalin! soldier
            who even awarded them King Mihai - the Order of Victory!
            так что,если и в этот раз по-крепче "звездюлей" выпишем, то запросто штыки на НАТО повернут...
            Только пусть сперва "21" вазелином смажут, а уж потом дырки на кителях под наши медали сверлят ! laughing
            1. cherkas.oe
              cherkas.oe 3 July 2013 18: 36 New
              +7
              Quote: S-200
              Только пусть сперва "21" вазелином смажут, а уж потом дырки на кителях под наши медали сверлят ! laughing

              Удивляюсь Вам коллега ,как ненавязчиво и элегантно Вы создали сокральную связь между нашими медалями,"21"и вазелином.Вертуоз!!!! fellow
              1. S-200
                S-200 3 July 2013 20: 17 New
                +5
                this "сакральную связь",colleague, Joseph Vissarionovich at one time with all of Europe did ... lol
                not because of that and tease them - Gayropoy ? what
                and I just brought History lesson . repeat
                1. cherkas.oe
                  cherkas.oe 4 July 2013 14: 40 New
                  +1
                  Quote: S-200
                  and I just brought - a history lesson

                  Thank you! drinks A colleague in our history.
                  1. S-200
                    S-200 4 July 2013 15: 29 New
                    +1
                    hi THANK YOU - our grandfathers !
                    1. cherkas.oe
                      cherkas.oe 5 July 2013 00: 20 New
                      0
                      Quote: S-200
                      hi THANK YOU - our grandfathers !

                      I, and Father from cover to cover (19 holes in the body) was there. July 4, the 21st year, as it is in this world. Now we are sitting, remembering relatives.
            2. Simon
              Simon 3 July 2013 20: 57 New
              +5
              Military prostitute. Who is stronger and for whom victory is on the side of those becomes. The Warsaw Pact was gone, behind the back of NATO. And now, like a dog, begins to bark and snap back because of the owner.
        4. seller trucks
          seller trucks 3 July 2013 16: 45 New
          +4
          In June 1941, the Hungarians fought against the USSR an army of 380 thousand people. The infantrymen in the Hungarian army were called Honved, the cavalrymen were called Hussars. In addition to the cavalry, the Hungarians had strong mechanized units, good artillery, and in their military spirit they were significantly superior to Italians and Romanians. The Hungarian army also fought in Ukraine, and in the summer of 1942, they stormed Voronezh. During the winter counterattack of the 1943 of the year, the 3-I Hungarian army was completely defeated by the Red Army. About 70 of thousands of Hungarian soldiers and officers were killed, about 30 of thousands of military personnel were captured.


          http://www.tyurma.com/plennaya-evropa

          and there

          After the war, the Main Directorate for Prisoners of War and Internment of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the USSR (GUPVI) drew up a certificate in which it analyzed the national composition of the enemy troops captured by the Red Army. The picture was very characteristic. The Germans were captured 2 389 560 people, Hungarians - 513 767, Romanian - 187 370, Austrians - 156 682, Czechs and Slovaks - 69 977, Poles - 60 280, Italians - 48 957, French - 23 136, Yugoslavs - 21 822. Moldovans - 14 129, Dutch - 4 729, Finns - 2377, Belgians - 2 010, Luxembourgers - 1652, Danes - 457, Spaniards - 452, Norwegians - 101 people.


          well, they paid for their sins, and Voronezh is a nightmare for them
        5. Very old
          Very old 3 July 2013 21: 14 New
          0
          Alyoshka, don’t be angry with branzulets, they’ll bite off your slippers
        6. 225chay
          225chay 4 July 2013 09: 40 New
          +1
          Quote: seasoned
          During the Second World War, these warriors went down in history as the most merciless looters. They took everything to the last rag from the population in the occupied territories.

          Right The old people said when the Nazis entered the Caucasus, the first Romanians and Hungarians came in, they were exclusively engaged in robbery and violence. Nemchura even had to exponentially shoot before the population after complaints about them one too zealous roman
      2. Geokingxnumx
        Geokingxnumx 3 July 2013 16: 26 New
        -3
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers

        they have good special forces))
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 3 July 2013 16: 33 New
          +4
          Quote: GEOKING95
          they have good special forces))

          Yes Yes
        2. Manager
          Manager 3 July 2013 16: 44 New
          +3
          Quote: GEOKING95
          they have good special forces))


          Yeah))
          http://video.yandex.ru/#search?text=%D1%80%D1%83%D0%BC%D1%8B%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%BA%D
          0%B8%D0%B9%20%D1%81%D0%BF%D0%B5%D1%86%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%B7&where=all&filmId=4vu4YYU
          3UXI
          1. Geokingxnumx
            Geokingxnumx 3 July 2013 17: 52 New
            -3
            Quote: Manager
            Yeah))
            http://video.yandex.ru/#search?text=%D1%80%D1%83%D0%BC%D1%8B%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%BA%D

            0%B8%D0%B9%20%D1%81%D0%BF%D0%B5%D1%86%D0%BD%D0%B0%D0%B7&where=all&filmId=4vu4YYU

            3UXI

            always pierce
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gabOzuSi7Ig
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkoBx5BelTs
        3. Chicot 1
          Chicot 1 3 July 2013 16: 44 New
          +9
          Quote: GEOKING95
          they have good special forces))

          Да, может быть... А случаем, грузинские "ренджеры" не у них учились?.. Наверное, еще и на "отлично" закончили...
          1. Geokingxnumx
            Geokingxnumx 3 July 2013 17: 55 New
            -7
            Quote: Chicot 1
            Да, может быть... А случаем, грузинские "ренджеры" не у них учились?.. Наверное, еще и на "отлично" закончили...

            Ha ha ha
            and what does this have to do?
            we had two elite specialists 90
            Alpha and Omega
            Alpha, of course, was trained in the USSR (In Russia)
            and Omega (American). gray guys! Shevardnadze destroyed them!

            right now one was left Vashlisjvari
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 19: 45 New
              0
              minus you not for what they wrote, but for how
              1. Geokingxnumx
                Geokingxnumx 3 July 2013 21: 34 New
                +2
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                minus you not for what they wrote, but for how

                It’s good that you answered why I set the minus) and here some just put it and do not answer)))

                and the question is what, how?
                1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 21: 53 New
                  +3
                  when they speak with an accent it’s understandable, but when they’re not writing very
                  1. Geokingxnumx
                    Geokingxnumx 4 July 2013 09: 46 New
                    +1
                    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                    when they speak with an accent it’s understandable, but when they’re not writing very

                    Well I'm sorry I'm studying)
            2. Alexander Romanov
              Alexander Romanov 4 July 2013 04: 39 New
              +2
              Quote: GEOKING95
              we had two elite specialists 90
              Alpha and Omega

              Already funny
              Quote: GEOKING95
              Vaslisjvari

              Wow, this is it, this is yours laughing
              1. Geokingxnumx
                Geokingxnumx 4 July 2013 09: 50 New
                0
                Quote: Alexander Romanov
                Already funny

                and why? :))
                don't want don't believe

                Oh yes we can’t fight, and Georgians are not warriors, etc.
        4. Phantom Revolution
          Phantom Revolution 3 July 2013 21: 54 New
          +1
          Quote: GEOKING95
          they have good special forces))

          You won’t be fed up with special forces, I won’t diminish their merits, fools do not serve in special forces, but they are not strong.
          1. Geokingxnumx
            Geokingxnumx 4 July 2013 09: 49 New
            0
            Quote: Phantom Revolution
            You won’t be fed up with special forces, I won’t diminish their merits, fools do not serve in special forces, but they are not strong.

            I did not say that they are the best or excellent or strong.
            1. Phantom Revolution
              Phantom Revolution 4 July 2013 11: 13 New
              0
              Quote: GEOKING95
              I did not say that they are the best or excellent or strong.

              Да я понял, потому и решил поставить плюс. Просто к тому не важно какой спецназ, основной силой являются "обычные" бойцы. Если вторые подведут, первые при самом лучшем раскладе не смогут противостоять регулярной армии, в том же 08.08.08 основную работу делали бойцы 58 армии, специфические задачи решали спец. силы. p.s. В миротворцы набирают тоже не мальчишек для битья, хотя и миротворцы тоже ограничены и без основной силы не способны долго вести оборону. Но нападение на них, будет означать нападение на РФ и результатом станет отсоединение Приднестровья уже юридически. Как бы румыны не хотели, но НАТО не даст и даже не будет развязывать третью мировую из-за них.
        5. 225chay
          225chay 4 July 2013 09: 56 New
          0
          Quote: GEOKING95
          they have good special forces))

          у румын хорошие "медвежатники", специалисты по грабежам и взломам сейфов. Их сейчас целая румынская "армия" в гейропе
      3. Manager
        Manager 3 July 2013 16: 28 New
        +2
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        never seen brave romanian soldiers

        Here's an example
        1. sumcream56
          sumcream56 3 July 2013 17: 17 New
          -6
          What kind of Romanians are these? This is the Germans!
          1. Manager
            Manager 3 July 2013 17: 21 New
            +6
            Quote: sumcream56
            What kind of Romanians are these? This is the Germans!

            This is a Romanian SS
      4. rolik
        rolik 3 July 2013 16: 58 New
        +5
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers

        У них в свое время была " голубая дивизия")))))
        1. Trapperxnumx
          Trapperxnumx 3 July 2013 17: 10 New
          +5
          Quote: rolik
          У них в свое время была " голубая дивизия")))))

          Isn't Spain really?
          1. S-200
            S-200 3 July 2013 17: 57 New
            +3
            Spanish Phalanx Division
      5. Tersky
        Tersky 3 July 2013 18: 17 New
        +1
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        By the way, and that in Romania there is an army,

        Sasha, hello Alex! Dummies have an army, fully transferred to a contract basis. There is the Air Force- (main MiG combat aircraft - 21 99 pcs. + Avioane Craiova SA IAR-99C Şoim,
        Avioane Craiova SA IAR-99 Standart, respectively 12 and 9 pcs.) 87 helicopters for various purposes, Navy -4 frigates, 4 corvettes, 3 patrol boats, 3 torpedo boats and even 877 project submarines (inherited from the USSR). Tanks - 569 pcs. T-55, Romanian version of the T-55. 1977 g. 226 pcs., Upgraded TR-580. 1986 g., 249 pcs., And the upgraded TR-85. 1999 g. 59 pcs.
        1. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 4 July 2013 04: 41 New
          +2
          Quote: Tersky
          Dummies have an army,

          Twist, it's a bunch of scrap metal laughing
      6. Sashkessss
        Sashkessss 3 July 2013 18: 35 New
        +2
        The brave Romanian soldiers are not visible during the day - they sleep in the caves until night, after which they fly out to drink human blood. The rest are miserable semblances of soldiers
      7. Mister X
        Mister X 3 July 2013 19: 06 New
        11
        Quote: Alexander Romanov
        By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen a brave Romanian soldier


        On November 19 on November 1942, Operation Uranus began.
        And already on November 24, the Soviet troops of the Southwestern Front defeated those encircled in the region of Raspopinskaya
        Romanian troops and took 30 thousand prisoners and a lot of equipment.
        The brave Romanian warriors did not fight long.
        Paulus was thrown at the very beginning of the Battle of Stalingrad.
        In addition to the 2's of the Romanian armies, the 1 Italian army also surrendered.
        Needless to say: Field Marshal was unlucky with the Allies.
        Romanians, by the way, want to erect monuments to their victims in the Crimea and near Stalingrad.
        They are motivated by the fact that the Italians were allowed to do this and the monuments were erected.

        On the territory of Moldova, older people still remember the “Romanian liberators” and “dear relatives”:
        there was not a single cellar, closet or pan in which the Romanian soldiers did not stick their noses.
        They took away everything that they saw and did not stand on ceremony.
        The Germans also took, but first asked.
        Even my grandmother memorized this phrase:
        - Uterus! Is there a trigger? Come on!

        At the end of the 90's, Romania already hosted the Moldovan military for joint exercises.
        Our employee, it seems, served in the DSB and he was honored to go to Romania to exchange experiences.
        Romanian officer drove Moldovan fighters into a ditch with water and acted like an American sergeant
        from the Hollywood training camp: ordered to dive and hold his breath.
        And those who came up earlier than others hit with a boot in the face.
        He hit one guy very well: he lost consciousness and went to the bottom.
        His closest comrades dived, raised to the surface and pushed him ashore.
        Then the whole group got out of the moat and the boys together hung the mantle to the Romanian officer,
        and then they threw him into the same ditch with water.


        So in Romania there is an army.
        And Romanian soldiers are not that cowardly: they are calculating.
        He who is weaker is kicked.
        Those who are stronger are allied with that.
        There is a possibility - looting.
        1. nelson
          nelson 3 July 2013 21: 53 New
          +2
          And already on November 24, the Soviet troops of the Southwestern Front defeated those encircled in the region of Raspopinskaya
          romanian troops
          And how symbolically the name of the settlement sounds.
        2. Alexander Romanov
          Alexander Romanov 4 July 2013 04: 45 New
          +2
          Quote: Mister X
          Romanians, by the way, want to erect monuments to their victims in the Crimea and near Stalingrad.

          And they don’t want anything else
          Вот так искажают историю,сначала ставят памятники,хрен знает где,хрен знает кому,хрен знает зачем. Потом проидет лет 300 и некоторые "историки" будут говорить,что там была битва,а Румыны на Волге защищали свою родину.
      8. Simon
        Simon 3 July 2013 20: 28 New
        0
        Near Stalingrad, many such brave Romanian soldiers lie. It is time to recall this to the Romanians. They forgot how our soldiers beat them in the face or the strong became behind NATO. am
      9. zennon
        zennon 3 July 2013 23: 22 New
        +1
        By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers

        And it was and is now. By the way, in the Second World War, the Romanian army was the only one in Europe in which ... corporal punishment was preserved! request
      10. serioga
        serioga 4 July 2013 08: 13 New
        0
        I knew one such Romanian soldier who had served under Stalin and his military career ended 40 minutes after the first battle near Odessa when the sailor took his weapon and kicked his ass, which led to a fracture of the pelvic bones so he was captured, and he didn’t the only such warrior remaining after serving in Bessarabia
    4. krasin
      krasin 3 July 2013 16: 44 New
      +1
      The Moldavians are a broken piece. Their appetites, just give! For Transnistria they will definitely climb.
      We are waiting for an adequate response from Putin, so this cannot be left to chance.
      So here are the Moldovans and what have we done so bad to them? ZAS ...- Tsy!
      1. dustycat
        dustycat 3 July 2013 19: 46 New
        0
        They did not join the European Union.
        Although Romania did not accept Schengen ...
    5. nycsson
      nycsson 3 July 2013 18: 01 New
      0
      Quote: seasoned
      It is time for Russia to annex Transnistria, to establish military bases there, and if Romanian troops enter Moldova, roll them on asphalt. Stop lingering, there’s a limit to everything.

      Have you forgotten about Ukraine?
      1. Orik
        Orik 3 July 2013 19: 44 New
        +3
        Of course, how to attach the PMR without Ukraine. smile
    6. Interface
      Interface 3 July 2013 18: 11 New
      +1
      Well, comrades, put the Iskanders?
    7. Airman
      Airman 3 July 2013 18: 13 New
      +5
      Quote: seasoned
      Пора России присоединять Приднестровье, располагать там военные базы и в случае входа румынских войск в Молдову раскатывать их по асфальту. Хватит миндальничать, всему есть предел. Чем больше мы закрываем глаза на "шалости" молдован и Украины с "перекрытием границ" Приднестровья, тем больше у них "зудит" от безнаказанности am
      It is necessary to demand from Ukraine clear conditions for military transit through its territory from Russia to Transnistria, to confront Moldova with the fact that the Romanians will get into you, we will consider the beginning of the database and occupation with all the ensuing consequences.


      All this is our opinion, protect Transnistria. But our powers that be pretend that there is no problem, they are more important cooperation with Tanzania. And if something begins in Transnistria, God forbid, no one but volunteers from Russia will come to the rescue. Judging by Snowden, the mattresses barked, and political asylum was denied. Belenko was not returned.
      1. experienced
        experienced 3 July 2013 18: 26 New
        +7
        Quote: Povshnik
        All this is our opinion, protect Transnistria. But our powers that be pretend that there is no problem, they are more important cooperation with Tanzania.

        You're not right. Last spring, Rogozin, as a government official made a series of statements during his visit to Chisinau, thesis looked like this:
        - Russia against the interference of other countries in the affairs of Moldova;
        - The Russian peacekeepers will not leave Transnistria and will be provided with everything necessary to carry out their functions.
        - He announced his intention to discuss in Chisinau the question of creating a Russian consulate in Transnistria

        Quote: Povshnik
        And if something begins in Transnistria, God forbid, no one but volunteers from Russia will come to the rescue.

        Georgians also thought so ... The result is known to everyone, a bear can be teased for a long time, but if he rushed into a fight, then stopping him would be more expensive winked
        Quote: Povshnik
        Judging by Snowden, the mattresses barked, and political asylum was denied. Belenko was not returned.

        Идет большая дипломатическая и политическая игра. Козыри на стороне России. Сноудена никто США не выдает, а потому хватит уже посыпать голову пеплом и кричать "усе пропало,шеф". Пока ВВП с больших трибун "хлестает по щекам" американцам, мне особенно понравился его пассаж про то, что Сноуден - правозащитник... Услышав, ржал громко в голос. laughing
        Regarding Belenko: he died in 1997 as a result of a car accident, what do you need for his remains of the corpse to be returned to Russia? belay
        1. Apologet.Ru
          Apologet.Ru 3 July 2013 20: 59 New
          +5
          About Belenko -
          "Автоавария произошла на идеально прямом отрезке федеральной трассы Лос-Анджелес – Сан-Франциско. Ни перекрёстков, ни примыкающих дорог тут на многие километры не было. Поэтому разбитая в лепёшку автомашина не могла не озадачить американских дорожных полицейских. Возможно, гораздо меньше они бы удивились, если б узнали, чей труп пришлось извлекать из-под обломков.
          The name of the Soviet fighter pilot Viktor Belenko thundered to the whole world in 1976 year. Then he managed to escape to Japan on the latest MiG-25 of the time. At first, Moscow did not believe in betrayal. But then, after the President of the United States personally awarded Belenko American citizenship, they began to search for the former pilot around the world. But by that time he already bore a different name, had a different family, and was engaged in a different business.
          В 1997 году бывшего лётчика удалось разыскать обычному японскому журналисту. В почти 20-часовом интервью предатель случайно обмолвился, что за два года до этого по делам бизнеса побывал в... Москве. А спустя какое-то время после знаменательного интервью случилось роковое ДТП".
          An interesting denouement of history, is not it ...
          1. 225chay
            225chay 4 July 2013 10: 10 New
            0
            Quote: Apologet.Ru
            the US president personally awarded Belenko with American citizenship,

            So Snowden would not hurt us to reward
          2. kotdavin4i
            kotdavin4i 5 July 2013 14: 05 New
            0
            Quote: Apologet.Ru
            А спустя какое-то время после знаменательного интервью случилось роковое ДТП".

            - Не все так просто "По мнению некоторых российских источников в 1997 году при загадочных обстоятельствах погиб в автокатастрофе. В 2000 дал интервью американскому корреспонденту на авиашоу в шт. Висконсин, США, в котором, в частности, сказал:
            [В США] я встретился с космонавтом Игорем Волком. Он сказал: «Ты же вроде бы умер!», — я ответил: «Не так быстро. КГБ распространил слухи о моей смерти, чтобы отбить охоту у других»."
    8. nokki
      nokki 3 July 2013 18: 40 New
      +7
      That's right, experienced! Clearly lacking a firm hand: princely, tsarist, Stalinist, presidential ... Anything! Tired of all these diplomatic little games and reverences when the West, and the East, flouted all conceivable and unimaginable norms and laws, when the UN turned into a fiction, when, finally, the RUSSIANS and our BROTHERS are suffering (and threatened!) In the spirit of other nationalities.

      Diplomacy will no longer help. Here we need a good blow to the jaw of the overwhelmed mu.d.ch.y.y. Or will we again throw our people (albeit living in other republics) at the mercy of the zombies? ..
    9. Alexander Petrovich
      Alexander Petrovich 3 July 2013 19: 12 New
      +7
      what guys, unfortunately, they’re capturing it, consider that they have already captured our country. I recently had a fight with an old friend, a cadet of an officer’s school, and for this reason they quarreled, forever, I called the Russians with an obscene word, just like a man in a clip. You would know how painful it is in your heart to see how Moldova is being merged.
    10. moldavan
      moldavan 3 July 2013 19: 31 New
      10
      Moldova will never be with Romania, with a strong Russia. Yes, and the people with Russia, each grandfather or father almost fought in the Great Patriotic War, it is sometimes offensive when you give us to the Romanians or call us
      1. nelson
        nelson 3 July 2013 22: 00 New
        0
        So don’t give up!
        1. moldavan
          moldavan 3 July 2013 22: 22 New
          +4
          we won’t surrender but without RUSSIA we are nobody,
    11. Apologet.Ru
      Apologet.Ru 3 July 2013 20: 46 New
      +1
      27 June 2013, the Moldovan Parliament ratified the agreement on military cooperation with Romania. Reportedly, the main thing in the agreement that passed the first reading is the creation of a legal basis for the permanent presence of Romanian troops in the Republic of Moldova. Earlier, Chisinau and Bucharest signed a document stating that the Romanian gendarmerie can get access to the territory of Moldova in case of "riots".

      hi Honestly, having learned about this sad fact, I, to put it mildly, fucked up belay , извините, коллеги, меня за мой французский и "почувствовал в воздухе запах гари". Ой, не зря мамалыжники засуетились, как бы автор статьи провидцем не оказался. Для «новой России» решение вопроса с Приднестровьем будет являться экзаменом на «совершеннолетие» и на право осуществлять свои имперские амбиции. Хотя, по-моему, не всё так печально, т.к. в новейшей истории существует прецедент – Косово. Другой вопрос, дадут ли его реализовать в случае с Приднестровьем, т.к. «По мнению правительств США и некоторых государств ЕС], ситуация в Косово является уникальной и признание его независимости не должно быть прецедентным для иных самопровозглашённых образований. В качестве обоснования уникальности Косово госсекретарь США Кондолиза Райс назвала комбинацию следующих факторов: общий контекст распада Югославии, этнические чистки и преступления в отношении гражданского населения Косово и длительный период нахождения края под управлением администрации ООН»…
    12. phantom359
      phantom359 3 July 2013 22: 35 New
      +1
      Quote: seasoned
      Пора России присоединять Приднестровье, располагать там военные базы и в случае входа румынских войск в Молдову раскатывать их по асфальту. Хватит миндальничать, всему есть предел. Чем больше мы закрываем глаза на "шалости" молдован и Украины с "перекрытием границ" Приднестровья, тем больше у них "зудит" от безнаказанности am
      It is necessary to demand from Ukraine clear conditions for military transit through its territory from Russia to Transnistria, to confront Moldova with the fact that the Romanians will get into you, we will consider the beginning of the database and occupation with all the ensuing consequences.

      Yes something like that.
    13. krasin
      krasin 3 July 2013 23: 38 New
      0
      The Council of Non-Governmental Organizations of the Transnistrian Moldavian Republic (Moldova) having split from Moldova sent an appeal to the UN with a request to consider the issue of official recognition of this de facto independent state. The appeal is also addressed to the presidents of Russia and Ukraine. Apparently, Transnistria decided to take such a step with the tacit blessing of Moscow.

      Here is the answer.
    14. luka095
      luka095 4 July 2013 00: 11 New
      +2
      If Romania took such a step, it means that it received approval in NATO. Romanians themselves would hardly have done it. If so, then Europe has decided to launch a trial balloon and look at Russia's reaction ...
      And the reaction, in order to avoid many negative consequences, should be tough.
      Ball on the side of the Kremlin ...
    15. Semen Semyonitch
      Semen Semyonitch 4 July 2013 04: 18 New
      0
      experienced RU Yesterday, 15:48
      It is time for Russia to join Transnistria ...
      Our politicians will not take such a step. Putin and Snowden do not know how to behave, but then the step is more serious. Either it’s not the time to cast a vote, either ours and yours ...
    16. Black Colonel
      Black Colonel 4 July 2013 09: 47 New
      +2
      Покойный генерал Лебедь в своё время заявил:"Если Румыния не уведёт свои войска от границы, то через 5 дней мои танки будут у Бухареста". В ту же ночь над Бухарестом кружили неопознанные самолёты. На следующий день Румыния отвела свои войска от границы с Молдавией.
      One must act in this way and not ask permission from either Brussels or Washington.
  2. Ragnarek
    Ragnarek 3 July 2013 15: 51 New
    +9
    from the Romanians of the war as from GA a bullet. they would have signed the Arabs
    1. Gecko
      Gecko 3 July 2013 15: 54 New
      +9
      Of the Romanians, according to the experience of the Second World War, only punitive.
  3. GovernmentFSO
    GovernmentFSO 3 July 2013 15: 54 New
    0
    Romania is not a strong country, so calm down comrades!
  4. Nevsky
    Nevsky 3 July 2013 16: 03 New
    +5
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Quote: seasoned
    It’s time for Russia to join Transnistria,

    Together with Kishenev soldier
    By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers request


    Alexander, I didn’t see Romanian either, but he saw how the Yankees train Polish, maybe an American Negro also teaches Romanians to fight in the European climate and forest zone:

    Poles are taught to fight blacks:

    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 3 July 2013 16: 19 New
      14
      Quote: Nevsky

      Poles are taught to fight blacks:

      By the way, Georgians were also taught to fight blacks laughing
      1. Simon
        Simon 3 July 2013 21: 04 New
        0
        Yes, where is the Georgian pride that its blacks are taught to fight. laughing
    2. 89501358976
      89501358976 3 July 2013 18: 20 New
      +1
      THE GERMAN ARMY I THINK THERE WERE NOT THAT THAT !!! AT ITS TIME CONSIDERED THE BEST ARMY OF THE WORLD yes
    3. m262
      m262 3 July 2013 21: 53 New
      +1
      Прошу прощения, смотри ш на этих "Доблесных жолнеров" : прекрасно экипированные бараны. Если- бы не холост ые патроны друг друга по убивали бы, гранатометчик вообще жжет!!!
      "У вас несчастные случаи на стройке были?- Будут!"
    4. ammunition
      ammunition 3 July 2013 22: 01 New
      +2
      laughing

      Cool video. (+).
      Такая фиговина , 30-ть лет назад называлась в армии - " зарница" .. пренебрежительно.. То есть - типа по деЦЦки. Патроны холостые. wassat
      -----
      As I remember now -
      They threw out a sabotage group .. 16 man .. and we caught them with the whole company. And of. the intermediary counted all sorts of losses there bully
      The landing party lasted two and a half hours .. until they were found and pressed to the river.
      " зарница" - одно слово. Несерьёзно это.
    5. Pimply
      Pimply 4 July 2013 13: 22 New
      +1
      And what does the instructor race have to do with it?
  5. ed65b
    ed65b 3 July 2013 16: 08 New
    +4
    Article bullshit. Romanians in the direction of Russia can not even fart. And what kind of fighters we saw in the Great Patriotic War. And even more so, Europe with their problems does not give a damn about Moldova with their problems. And NATO is all in the smut and then Romanians.
    Minus.
    1. wasjasibirjac
      wasjasibirjac 3 July 2013 17: 27 New
      +3
      Quote: ed65b
      Article bullshit. Romanians in the direction of Russia can not even fart.

      in the 90s, when the war took place in Transnistria, the local Romanian marshal shouted very loudly that the brave Romanian army is able to roll out the 2 40th armies in a couple of days,
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 3 July 2013 18: 21 New
        +2
        Probably saliva choked and died or not died of courage laughing
    2. teodorh
      teodorh 3 July 2013 18: 34 New
      +2
      Quote: ed65b
      Romanians in the direction of Russia can not even fart.


      Dwarf countries like Qatar are not just farting, but spitting your side. Beat your ambassadors. And you are talking about such a serious country as Romania. Besescu in 2008 said that if the Russian Federation tries to do in Moldova what it did in Georgia, Romania will be forced to intervene. This is not some expert, but the president of the country.
      1. ed65b
        ed65b 3 July 2013 19: 05 New
        +5
        So what? Will this help them? Or should we be scared? And you need to take a tie from Sahak for hire. Do not tell the public about the threats of Romania.
        1. teodorh
          teodorh 3 July 2013 19: 50 New
          -9
          Saakashvili has the right to eat a tie, his own tie. Like some he doesn’t steal the ring.
          1. experienced
            experienced 3 July 2013 19: 55 New
            +3
            Quote: teodorh
            Saakashvili has the right to eat a tie, his own tie. Like some he doesn’t steal the ring.

            Yes, even if he eats his cowards after escaping from a Russian attack aircraft, we do not mind. But provocation with a ring, this is rather a minus to our system, it is necessary, as in most countries, gifts, the value of which exceeds a certain amount, to give to the state hi
            Странно, что "терпила" так долго молчал о "краже".
          2. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 20: 02 New
            +1
            Well, with a ring, they generally froze stupidity
      2. dustycat
        dustycat 3 July 2013 19: 52 New
        +2
        One Mikhas also said that just stick around.
        Now they send him ties.
      3. Apologet.Ru
        Apologet.Ru 3 July 2013 20: 53 New
        +1
        It’s not a matter of the president of all Romanians, but whose physiognomy looks out because of his s.adnitsa ...
      4. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 22: 12 New
        +1
        Quote: teodorh
        about such a serious country like Romania

        Are you serious, am I talking about a serious country? !!!!
        1. teodorh
          teodorh 3 July 2013 22: 24 New
          0
          Well, if you read, then in addition to Russia and the United States there are no subjects of world politics, all of them are objects in your opinion.

          An intelligent person, I am forced to end our discussion today. We continue after.
    3. bord731
      bord731 4 July 2013 23: 21 New
      0
      Статье поставил минус. А автору статьи нужно внимательней вникать в получаемую информацию , и не вводить в заблуждение уважаемых посетителей этого сайта. Вот выписка из заседания парламента : " 15:10. Как сообщили во фракции ПКРМ, на момент выхода коммунистов из зала, там было всего 47 других депутатов. таким образом закон о договоре военного сотрудничесва с Румынией принят быть не мог." Вот ссылка -http://www.puls.md/ru/content/zasedanie-parlamenta-ot-27-iyunya-2013
  6. VDV 80-82
    VDV 80-82 3 July 2013 16: 10 New
    +4
    Romanians, though, but not enough to shoot at a Russian military base! otherwise, the retaliation will be cruel ... and NATO will spit on the Romanians ... yeah, right now they’ll go to fight for the gypsies with Russia ... the author is simply escalating!
    1. adg76
      adg76 3 July 2013 16: 29 New
      +9
      A normal person can vryatli find logic in the actions of NATO. Therefore, the option of an attack (you cannot say otherwise) on Moldova and Transnistria of Romania, with the subsequent presentation of territorial claims to Ukraine, is quite real. Syria is an example. Speeches by Western leaders that government forces are destroying unarmed civilians, is not the hypocrisy the top? And arrogant, with smiles, in the camera of journalists
      1. S-200
        S-200 3 July 2013 18: 13 New
        +1
        За Приднестровье Россия молдаванам с румынами по "самое не балуй" вставит БЕЗ ОГЛЯДКИ на НАТО и "старшего брата" ! Приднестровье "де-факто" - Russian enclave!
        There ALL are citizens of Russia!
      2. dustycat
        dustycat 3 July 2013 19: 54 New
        +1
        As soon as they make territorial claims, only the Euro will remain from the European Union.
        Moreover, in the amount that will be in the form of cash in the pockets of those living in Romania.
        Romania is not in Schengen. Barriers and checkpoints of the European Union are working.
    2. Urcom
      Urcom 3 July 2013 16: 34 New
      +6
      I don’t think that the Romanians are ready to do something with their gypsy armed forces against the PMR and our peacekeepers without the approval of NATA and the EU, and these gentlemen, along the way, decided to raise the degree of the situation in the Gypsy-PMR-Moldova triangle in revenge for our position on Syria and for shame with Snowden.
    3. Andrey Skokovsky
      Andrey Skokovsky 3 July 2013 18: 06 New
      +5
      Quote: VDV 80-82
      Romanians, though, but not enough to shoot at a Russian military base! otherwise, the retaliation will be cruel ... and NATO will spit on the Romanians ... yeah, right now they’ll go to fight for the gypsies with Russia ... the author is simply escalating!


      about Romanians, you are probably right, the problem is that the Romanian government expresses not only its national interests but also the interests of the US State Department and NATO
      and for that, actions need only legitimate reasons, so in the event of a conflict we can well find out that in Romania there are several divisions of the original Romanian blacks or the native Romanian Arabs

      the impression that we do not have enough people to keep all directions, and Moldova somehow remained unattended, I really hope that this is not so .......
      1. Zopuhhh
        Zopuhhh 4 July 2013 15: 36 New
        0
        Nuclear weapons have not been canceled ... In a couple of directions of nuclear weapons, the rest to keep - otherwise nothing.
    4. Yazov
      Yazov 3 July 2013 18: 35 New
      +1
      I completely agree. But there was an example with Georgia. There are exceptions in life.
    5. 225chay
      225chay 4 July 2013 10: 18 New
      -1
      Quote: VDV 80-82
      Gypsies will go to war with Russia.

      gypsies - immigrants from India
      Romanians - Romanesque group
  7. Yeraz
    Yeraz 3 July 2013 16: 20 New
    +1
    yes bullshit is all. everyone has a few passports in their hands and calmly travel on both sides. Well, the fact that an agreement was signed so it was supposed to happen for a long time is one people, which is surprising. and the PMR under the cap of the Russian Federation. everyone is happy .
  8. adg76
    adg76 3 July 2013 16: 22 New
    10
    Если Румыния начнет ОККУПАЦИЮ Молдавии, то просто следует найти лиц с молдавским гражданством, которые попросят о военной помощи Россию. Юридические аспекты здесь не уместны. Есть право сильного. Украине популярно и закулисно объяснить, что если не дать по рукам Румынии, то следующей будет в очереди на оккупацию Украина. И ей следует не просто пропустить Российские войска, но и оказать всестороннюю поддержку по восстановлению независимости Молдовы от оккупационных войск Румынии. Ответ должен быть ЖЕСТКИМ и МОЛНИЕНОСНЫМ, без оглядки на "Европейскую Демократию". То, что руководство Украины пребывает в нирване и не понимает, что начинается очередной передел мира, говорит о близорукости и его преступном бездействии
    1. Apologet.Ru
      Apologet.Ru 3 July 2013 20: 54 New
      +1
      Why wait, she ALREADY started!
  9. Starover_Z
    Starover_Z 3 July 2013 16: 24 New
    +6
    Quote: gecko
    Of the Romanians, according to the experience of the Second World War, only punitive.

    And this is not honey! In the Second World War, they were just atrocities much worse than the Germans!
    Quote: GovernmentFSO
    Romania is not a strong country, so calm down comrades!

    Звиздец! В 1992 году собирали "партизан" и гнали воевать против Приднестровья, а сейчас если опять начнётся заваруха и вступят румыны,
    it will be abruptly 08.08.08! In the first Transnistrian war, up to a thousand people were killed, and now it can be much worse.
    Moreover, Romania is already a member of NATO!
    1. Zopuhhh
      Zopuhhh 4 July 2013 15: 46 New
      0
      In 1992, this all happened with the obvious connivance of the Russian leadership, this time this should not be ...
  10. falcon
    falcon 3 July 2013 16: 27 New
    +6
    The Romanian army is historically strong and militant. Its highly mobile compounds are especially dangerous -
    cavalry manned exclusively on a professional basis from persons of gypsy nationality
  11. misham
    misham 3 July 2013 16: 29 New
    +1
    The article is provocative. Nobody is going to fight with anyone. Moldavians just take a show off. It would be nice to read the text of that treaty in Russian.
    Romania in NATO, hardly anyone wants to get involved in a war with Russia for the sake of great Romania. Ukraine, too, can be a bit involved, reinforced fur. put forward the brigade. Neighbors after all.
    Another thing is that the problem of Transnistria must be solved. In addition to the territorial problem, the PMR is a source of smuggling (from alcohol to Asian migrants) near the EU border.
    Let Moldovans boost their economies (it is unlikely soon), provide a high standard of living for their population, with guarantees to national minorities, as in the EU, PMR can integrate into Moldova.
    1. Akim
      Akim 3 July 2013 17: 13 New
      0
      Quote: misham
      It would be nice to read the text of that treaty in Russian.

      Key provisions signed in April:
      The main provisions of the Treaty relate to arms control, training of military personnel, improvement of legislation in the field of national defense, as well as scientific research in the use of airspace.

      I agree - the provocateur wrote an article, but the moderators thoughtlessly reprint. There is no secret item. as in the Molotov-Ribentrop Pact.
    2. gray
      gray 3 July 2013 19: 17 New
      0
      Ukraine, too, can be a bit involved, reinforced fur. put forward the brigade. [/ quote]
      Which is interesting?
      1. sasin2008
        sasin2008 3 July 2013 20: 26 New
        +1
        Ukraine, if it wants, can level Romania and Moldova, for the time being we can afford it!
  12. omsbon
    omsbon 3 July 2013 16: 31 New
    10
    The descendants of Roman legionnaires (any Romanian gypsy by blood from Julius Caesar) are very brave and warlike, though before the unarmed. The Romanian army gained even greater fame, like thieves and looters!
    1. pensioner
      pensioner 3 July 2013 18: 02 New
      +3
      Quote: omsbon
      Descendants of Roman legionnaires (any Romanian gypsy he is by blood from Julius Caesar)

      !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ++++++++++++++++++++++
      Thank!! Laughing for a long time!
      1. omsbon
        omsbon 3 July 2013 18: 10 New
        +2
        Quote: retired
        Thank!! Laughing for a long time!

        You are welcome. Laughter prolongs life.
        Live long!
  13. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 3 July 2013 16: 32 New
    +3
    In general, my friends’s little article is clearly custom-made, to probe the reaction and pat the nerves. It’s not the thing to compete with us, but they forgot how we all and all of them fought together for ages. And as for the Romanian army, it still didn’t came to the end of the Second World War. But they have one advantage: they run very fast.
  14. armandos
    armandos 3 July 2013 16: 33 New
    +5
    There is definitely a problem and sooner or later it will be necessary to show will at the level of the president. Romanians have long wanted to gobble up Moldova, they have long considered RM a priori their territory, which in general is not so far from the truth. I would be on Putin’s place, defiantly equipping the Russian base with new weapons, moreover, so that through the entire channel they could see how the weapons arrive at the base. I think this is enough for the hotheads to calm down. Problems will be with Ukraine, it will bargain to the last, but I think this is also solved. Recently, I notice that everything around (meaning around the borders with Russia) began to slowly greyhound. It looks like a scene from Mowgli when a bunch of red dogs attacked the Ball. The will and determination of the country's leadership is needed!
  15. dmitrich
    dmitrich 3 July 2013 16: 35 New
    +3
    the gypsies in a noisy crowd went on the offensive.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  16. DmitryMSK
    DmitryMSK 3 July 2013 16: 36 New
    +1
    Moldovans I watch more and more greyhounds every day am

    It would be necessary to find leverage on the presumptuous molds of Moldova and cool the ardor. A Romanian to send to .ope
  17. shamil
    shamil 3 July 2013 16: 42 New
    +3
    let Vova go to Transnistria on a friendly visit and all-all die out
    1. Gipmol
      Gipmol 3 July 2013 20: 34 New
      +5
      Не "вова" а ВОВА!!!
  18. slaventi
    slaventi 3 July 2013 16: 43 New
    +4
    Romanians know how to fight or not, it’s not so important. They will use them in view of their ethnic proximity with the Moldovans, it’s also beneficial for them, they will expand the territory. The West is in a hurry to swallow another piece of the empire, and it may be choking. Transnistria is like a bone in its throat. Russia needs to hurry, take measures to prevent the Ossetian scenario of 2008 of the year, and establish economic, political and military ties with Transnistria.
  19. Navy7981
    Navy7981 3 July 2013 16: 54 New
    +8
    Alas, Moldovans show their complete inconsistency as an ethnic group and as a state. One must be in the delirium of a fever-inflamed mind, in order to think that after unification they will mean something for a dominant ethnic group. Moreover, the Romanians, the people are very cruel, and the political system supported by Europoids will be a supporter of simple and clear decisions, for example, a small genocide disguised naturally as democratic assistance in relation to those who disagree with the fact that now the main Romanians.

    Regarding the Romanian army, I agree. She is strong and fighting with her is not easy, but there is one thing but! No matter how well prepared their army is, this is an army of victories. Defeat and loss will cause cruelty at first, then everyone does not want to fight. You can recall the events of the Great War. While they were moving forward, and our army was rapidly retreating, the Romanians were on top. They were normally on the defensive and advanced, but as soon as a turning point was noticed and the number of casualties increased, then problems began and the difference with the Germans was immediately visible to the soldiers. Nevertheless, if one assumes a collision, it is necessary to prepare very seriously and in no case not to expect that the enemy will be weak.
  20. kind
    kind 3 July 2013 16: 58 New
    +8
    Now, in the event of a war with Transnistria, the Romanian army will openly enter

    In 1992, they also entered, but illegally, as advisers. Then the first ones fled, because Cossacks announced that they would not be taken prisoner, but immediately destroyed.
    1. sasin2008
      sasin2008 3 July 2013 20: 30 New
      +2
      There was a matter, Our affairs got along there, by the way, both Russians and Ukrainians ...
  21. papss
    papss 3 July 2013 17: 06 New
    +9
    Of course the article is serious ... and characterizes a fait accompli. Although, Romania did not prevent anything from being drawn into the Transnistrian conflict in the early 90s. Now they legally make it legal. Just that
    1. Moldova, Moldavians are not Georgians ... and the PMR, not Ossetia. There is no gorge to block and cut off aid. Ukraine ... Cossacks ... all at once ... The mood in Russia and the Eurasian Union and joining it is very strong in the country itself. There is a government clique - which is against, with minimal support from the population. A lot of Russian-speaking people. In a word underground. To the government that unleashed the past conflict, it cost the authorities ...
    2. To start a war, there must be a capable center of power. He is not there. This is not the government of Georgia since 08.08.2008 with a strong presidential authority and the Parliament with full support. The president is weak. A coalition of parties rules, gaining 10-12% in the people
    3. The country has its own Frond in the person of the second Transnistria, called Gagauzia. He also advocates for secession ... for 2015, a referendum on secession from Moldova has been scheduled ...
    4. NATO will not allow its member, Romania, without agreement, to start a war with Transnistria with it. And Russia is not the same as it was even in 2008, the United States and NATO understand this ...
  22. Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 3 July 2013 17: 12 New
    +5
    Russian people in Transnistria must be sure: Russia will protect its compatriots by any means. Let the Romanians unite with the Moldavians. But do not touch the Russian people from Transnistria. They also wanted to pacify South Ossetia. Did not work out.
  23. sumcream56
    sumcream56 3 July 2013 17: 13 New
    -8
    Lord comrades! The Romanian army after August 1944 turned bayonets against Hitler. And they fought well in Hungary, participated in the Balaton operation and in the liberation of Yugoslavia. By May 1945, almost the entire Romanian Air Force fleet had been knocked out. By the way, the Romanians took Odessa and Sevastopol. Moreover, over Odessa in 1941, a Romanian pilot rammed a Soviet plane.
    In general, I don’t understand the logic of the Transnistrians. They lived in the Moldavian SSR, but why are the Romanians worse? Orthodox, quite civilian people. The language for learning is very easy. By the way, this is not such a backward country. Back in 1941, she built fighter jets. And now Renault Logan of the Romanian assembly is sold in Russia.
    1. Akim
      Akim 3 July 2013 17: 27 New
      +1
      Quote: sumcream56
      Moreover, over Odessa in 1941, a Romanian pilot rammed a Soviet plane.

      I would show you a photo - but not in Neta, but in the Odessa Museum there. It was forbidden for 50 years: a Soviet soldier knocked down a Romanian street sign, and civilians stood below. And the woman is in French boots. By the way, in Odessa the card system for issuing products appeared on April 12, 1944.
      It is right that Odessa was freed from the invaders, but only one chernukha should not be allowed.
    2. Navy7981
      Navy7981 3 July 2013 17: 33 New
      +2
      Romanians participated in the occupation of Ukraine and Crimea as part of the Wehrmacht.
    3. gray
      gray 3 July 2013 19: 20 New
      +2
      Romanian assembly and French brains ... no need to talk about the awesome achievements in industry.
  24. knn54
    knn54 3 July 2013 17: 18 New
    +9
    A bit of history: on January 28, 1918, Romanian troops entered Bessarabia.
    During the Khotinsky uprising of 1919, during the uprising and its suppression, more than 11 thousand inhabitants of Bessarabia were killed, 22 villages were destroyed by artillery fire. A significant part of the surviving rebels joined the brigade of G.I. Kotovsky.
    Gas attacks against people during the Tatarbunar uprising in 1924. THEN on the side of the rebels came the Communist Party of Romania.
    “Maybe if I were no longer a revolutionary, I would become him, returning from this tragic chaos of southern Europe.” Henri Barbus.
    I don’t think that Romanians have changed during this time.
    Today, about 170 of thousands of Russian citizens and 100 of thousands of citizens of Ukraine live in Transnistria. This is the territory of the Russian Orthodox Church.
    Ukraine and the Russian Federation need to act as the ONE front to protect their citizens.
    PS June 28 marks 73 years since the day when, in accordance with the demand of the USSR, Romania withdrew its troops and administration from Bessarabia!
    1. gray
      gray 3 July 2013 19: 22 New
      +4
      The Ukrainian people in the majority - yes, but as for the Ukrainian authorities ... something gnaws at me, it hurts a lot in the mouth of NATO and the EU
    2. Gipmol
      Gipmol 3 July 2013 20: 45 New
      0
      This is despite the fact that in Transnistria we have 516 thousand. of the population in 2011, of which about 35-40% in Russia are earned
  25. teodorh
    teodorh 3 July 2013 17: 26 New
    -24
    Long live Greater Romania.

    It has long been necessary to crush these separatists.

    Regarding the looting of the Romanian troops, in this Russian warriors can give them a master class.
    1. Navy7981
      Navy7981 3 July 2013 17: 51 New
      +1
      Качественные переспективки "Не секрет, что я не намерен упускать из рук то, что приобрёл. Транснистрия станет румынской территорией, мы её сделаем румынской и выселим оттуда всех иноплеменных. Во имя осуществления этой цели я готов вынести на своих плечах все тяжести… " Антонеску
    2. gray
      gray 3 July 2013 19: 23 New
      +1
      to hell with you, and not great Romania ... All the greats have long been assigned
    3. LENINGRADE
      LENINGRADE 3 July 2013 19: 48 New
      +2
      No, I don’t like Kirkorov, he’s some kind of sweetman, in a word, Romanian !!!!
      1. teodorh
        teodorh 3 July 2013 19: 52 New
        0
        Kirkorov Bulgarian actually
        1. Karabin
          Karabin 3 July 2013 21: 36 New
          +3
          Quote: teodorh
          Kirkorov Bulgarian actually

          What a difference! (C)
    4. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 22: 12 New
      0
      all the same, how old are you? !!!
      Quote: teodorh
      Long live Greater Romania.

      It has long been necessary to crush these separatists.

      Regarding the looting of the Romanian troops, in this Russian warriors can give them a master class.
  26. MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 3 July 2013 17: 29 New
    +4
    Let only poke around (I hope they did not forget Stalingrad ..)
    1. dmitrich
      dmitrich 3 July 2013 17: 56 New
      +4
      they were gouged near Voronezh.
  27. Jarserge
    Jarserge 3 July 2013 17: 31 New
    +7
    Молдаванам неплохо бы было знать свою историю.Им так хочется побыть гражданами "второго сорта" Только вот нет рядом ни СССР и тов.Сталин давно лежит возле кремлёвской стены, выручать будет некому коль сами сунут голову в капкан.Всё уже было в истории, только если читать агитки нынешних сторонников румынизации то правды не узнаешь.Исчезнут молдаване с лица земли как мамонты останутся только румыны.
    1. teodorh
      teodorh 3 July 2013 17: 38 New
      -10
      Quote: Jarserge
      Им так хочется побыть гражданами "второго сорта"

      Как будто при СССР они были гражданами "первого сорта"
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. Egoza
          Egoza 3 July 2013 21: 08 New
          +5
          Quote: teodorh
          Yes, my ancestors lost the national liberation against you.


          sorry, when was that? What years. (Without any jokes, it’s interesting, but I didn’t find it on the Internet).
          Quote: teodorh
          Genocide was committed against the Kazakhs.

          Если Вы как в Украине имеете в виду "голодомор", то - извините. Голод был везде, (как и в Европе и США)Или Вы тоже считаете, что морили голодом именно казахов, а рядом живущих русских, украинцев и т.д. усиленно откармливали?

          Quote: teodorh
          500 nuclear test was performed above and below ground. Why on the Kazakh land?

          So after all, these lands were the least populated! Because there they did. Can you give examples of those affected by these tests?
          1. teodorh
            teodorh 3 July 2013 21: 26 New
            -5
            Quote: Egoza
            sorry, when was that?


            The national liberation struggle did not stop until 1986. More than 300 revolts were committed. The longest and largest was under the leadership of the last khan of the Kazakhs Kenesery Kasymuly in the middle of the 19th century. But unfortunately she failed.

            Quote: Egoza
            You also think that it was the Kazakhs who starved them, and the Russians, Ukrainians, etc. living nearby. hard fed?


            Well look at the official data. Doesn’t it seem strange to you that from 1926 to 1939 Kazakhs decreased by 1 million, Ukrainians by 3 million, while the Russians increased by 22 million.

            Now I am answering your question, but the Kazakhs and Ukrainians were starved, and the rest were fed.

            Quote: Egoza
            So after all, these lands were the least populated! Because there they did. Can you give examples of those affected by these tests?


            You are either a cynic or an ignoramus.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 22: 03 New
              +3
              Quote: teodorh
              The national liberation struggle did not stop until 1986

              1 how old are you
              2 where did you study history
              Quote: teodorh
              1926 - until 1939 Kazakhs decreased by 1 million

              how many of this million migrated to China and Mongolia? !!!!
              Quote: teodorh
              Now I answer your question, yes, Kazakhs and Ukrainians starved, and the rest were fed

              and after that you ask why you are considered a moron? !!!
              sorry and who to consider you? !!!
              Quote: teodorh
              You are either a cynic or an ignoramus.

              keep silent about ignorance
              1. teodorh
                teodorh 3 July 2013 22: 19 New
                0
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                where did you study history


                Certainly not from Russian sources.

                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                how many of this million migrated to China and Mongolia


                Kazakhs migrated there after the first famine in the early 1920s.
          2. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 3 July 2013 22: 34 New
            -3
            Quote: Egoza
            So after all, these lands were the least populated! Because there they did. Can you give examples of those affected by these tests?

            нифига се "наименее заселенные земли"! это обжитые земли двух самых больших казахских родов - аргынов и найманов! полигон в 20 тысяч квадратных километров! это как вся Молдавия практически. а площадь пострадавших земель - 300 тысяч квадратных километров! За пределы полигона вышли радиоактивные облака 55 воздушных и наземных взрывов и газовая фракция 169 подземных испытаний. Именно эти 224 взрыва обусловили радиационное загрязнение всей восточной части территории Казахстана. Суммарное количество взорванных килотонн - 2500 Хиросим!
            1 people were recognized as victims of nuclear tests, but only 323 people received certificates confirming the right of victims. Really - or it's just your ignorance of the subject, or cynicism. Comparing with Novaya Zemlya, where there were no civilians at all and where fewer bombs were detonated, is generally incorrect. And this is not the only place where nuclear charges exploded in the KZ. In western Kazakhstan, in the Caspian littoral, giant pits were dug by the nuclear explosion method in the 60s.
            1. Lopatov
              Lopatov 3 July 2013 22: 37 New
              0
              And with the Orenburg region can be compared?
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 3 July 2013 22: 45 New
                +1
                I myself am a native of the Orenburg region. It is absolutely incorrect to compare the explosion of one single bomb at the Totsky training ground with 500 explosions of more powerful charges in Semipalatinsk.

                "...Сколько людей умерли от последствий взрыва в окружающих Тоцкий полигон оренбургских деревнях — неизвестно, однако жителям деревень Богдановка и Фёдоровка, которые находились в 12-15 км от эпицентра взрыва, было предложено временно эвакуироваться за 50 км от места проведения учения. Что же касается долгосрочных последствий, то «Средний прирост смертности в области от злокачественных новообразований (в 1970 г. — 103,6, в 1991 г — 173 на 100000 жителей), равный примерно 3,5 % в год, соответствует средним показателям в Российской Федерации и в других европейских государствах»..."
                1. Lopatov
                  Lopatov 3 July 2013 23: 21 New
                  +1
                  Do you know that 48 industrial nuclear explosions were carried out in the European part of the RSFSR, and 32 in the Asian part? What rockets with nuclear warheads fired at Kapyar? Moreover, the explosions were high-altitude aerial.
                  1. Marek Rozny
                    Marek Rozny 3 July 2013 23: 51 New
                    0
                    Quote: Spade
                    Do you know that 48 industrial nuclear explosions were carried out in the European part of the RSFSR, and 32 in the Asian part?

                    1 Peaceful nuclear explosions by region
                    1.1 Arkhangelsk region (600 km from Arkhangelsk and the Nenets Autonomous Okrug) - 4 explosions
                    1.2 Astrakhan region (underground explosions) - 15 explosions
                    1.3 Bashkortostan - 7 explosions
                    1.4 Irkutsk region - 2
                    1.5 Kemerovo region - 1
                    1.6 Murmansk region - 1
                    1.7 Ivanovo Region - 1
                    1.8 Kalmykia - 1
                    1.9 Komi - 3
                    1.10 Krasnoyarsk Territory - 6
                    1.11 Orenburg Region - 4
                    1.12 Perm Region - 12
                    1.13 Stavropol Territory - 1
                    1.14 Tyumen region - 1
                    1.15 Yakutia - 11
                    1.16 Kazakh SSR - 73
                    1.17 Uzbek SSR - 2
                    1.18 Ukrainian SSR - 2
                    1.19 Turkmen SSR - 1
                    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D1%8F%D0%B4%D

                    0%B5%D1%80%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%B2%D0%B7%D1%80%D1%8B%D0%B2%D1%8B_%D0%B2_%D0%A1%

                    D0%A1%D0%A1%D0%A0
                    Clearly? Especially if you calculate the total power of the explosions and compare them with military training grounds in the KZ. And even more so, if we compare the number of affected people.

                    And about how many explosions were carried out in the Kazakh SSR in Kap.Yare I already wrote.
                    1. Lopatov
                      Lopatov 4 July 2013 00: 01 New
                      +1
                      Wikipedia is cool. But your data is not true. Once again, 80 industrial explosions in the RSFSR, 15 Kazakhstan, 2 Ukraine, 2 Uzbekistan, 1 Turkmenistan. Everything else is figures taken from the ceiling.
                      1. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 00: 55 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Spade
                        Wikipedia is cool. But your data is not true. Once again, 80 industrial explosions in the RSFSR, 15 Kazakhstan, 2 Ukraine, 2 Uzbekistan, 1 Turkmenistan. Everything else is figures taken from the ceiling.

                        Shovels, well, what the hell did you run into? Is it unpleasant to be wrong? Understand.
                        Цифра "15", относящаяся к Казахстану - это не общее количество взрывов, а количество пром.проектов In Kazakhstan!
                        Kazakh SSR:
                        1) "Azgir". 17 explosions (22 nuclear charges). Galit site 180 km north of Astrakhan, Guryev region, 1966-1979 0,01-150 ctw
                        2) “Batolit-2”. 320 km south-west of Aktyubinsk, Aktobe region, October 3, 1987, 8,5 kt, depth 1002 m. Seismic sounding.
                        3) "Lapis lazuli". The tract Murzhik, Semipalatinsk test site, December 7, 1974, 4,7 kt, depth 75 m. Moving part of the hillside for the construction of the dam.
                        4) “Lira”. 6 explosions to create cavities for underground gas storages at the Karachaganak gas condensate field in the West Kazakhstan region.
                        5) “Sai Utes” (unofficial name “Mangyshlak”). 3 explosions. 100-150 km southeast of the village. Sai Utes, Mangyshlak region, 1969-1970, 30-80 ct. To create a failed funnel.
                        6) "Meridian-1". 110 km east of Arkalyk, Tselinograd region, August 28, 1973, 6,3 ct. Seismic sounding.
                        7) "Meridian-2". 230 km southeast of Dzhezkazgan, Shymkent region, September 19, 1973, 6,3 ct. Seismic sounding.
                        8) "Meridian-3." 90 km southwest of Turkestan, Chimkent region, August 19, 1973, 6,3 kt. Seismic sounding.
                        9) "Region-3". 250 km southwest of Uralsk, Ural region, August 20, 1972, 6,6 ct. Seismic sounding.
                        10) "Region-5". 160 km southeast of the city of Kustanay, Kustanai region, November 24, 1972, 6,6 ct. Seismic sounding.
                        11) “Sary-Uzen” (aka “Well 1003”). Semipalatinsk test site, October 14, 1965, 1,1 ct. Excavation, calibration to create a funnel for the reservoir.
                        12) “Telkem-1”. Semipalatinsk test site, October 21, 1968, power 2 x 0,24 ct. Calibration soil discharge to create a funnel for the reservoir.
                        13) “Telkem-2”. Semipalatinsk test site, November 12, 1968, power 3 x 0,24 ct. Excavation gauge for trenching
                        14) "Chagan". Semipalatinsk test site, January 15, 1965, capacity 140 kt. The explosion in well 1004 created an artificial body of water that was filled with water from a specially created reservoir at Chagan. To create a reservoir, a stone and earthen dam with a concrete spillway was built. The first (and most powerful of all) industrial nuclear explosion.
                        15) "adit". 36 explosions at the Semipalatinsk test site, 1964-1984, the power of 0,01-150 ct.
                        Total: 73 nuclear peaceful explosions in the territory of the Kazakh SSR.

                        А в Ваши данные вкралась ошибка. 15 - это не количество взрывов, а количество "пром.проектов" (не знаю, как лучше это назвать).
                        И обратите внимание, на области РСФСР, где проводились эти мирные взрывы. Подавляющее большинство - земля тюркских и финно-угорских народов. Это, безусловно, Россия, но далеко не "русские земли", включая Астрахань, Оренбуржье или Сибирь. Не хочу начинать холивар, но земли нац.меньшинств России и "русские земли" - это не одно и тоже. Это звучит "красиво" - blew up in the European part of the RSFSR, Arkhangelsk region. Ага, город Котлас, возле которого взрывали - земля финно-угорцев, я уж молчу про земли ненцев - формально это тоже подпадает в статистику "европейская часть РСФСР". И т.д.
                      2. Lopatov
                        Lopatov 4 July 2013 01: 18 New
                        0
                        Tell me. What industrial nuclear explosions could be carried out at the Semipalatinsk test site? It seems that this error crept into your data.

                        We are talking about nuclear explosions with purely utilitarian tasks. As, for example, the last Soviet industrial nuclear explosion: September 06.09.88, 8,5 Arkhangelsk Region, RSFSR, power XNUMX KT. Conducted for seismic probing with the task of finding minerals.

                        I have a list of all 715 nuclear explosions in the USSR. With the date, place, type and task of the explosion. Are you ready to mind me at this level? It is unlikely that this is not on Wikipedia. So accept my numbers with 80 industrial explosions outside the ranges on the territory of the RSFSR for confidence.

                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        Yeah, the city of Kotlas, near which they blew up - the land of the Finno-Ugric

                        Turn to like-minded, Ukrainian Natsik. They will explain to you that Russian and Finno-Ugric peoples are one and the same.
                      3. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 01: 43 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Spade
                        What industrial nuclear explosions could be carried out at the Semipalatinsk test site?

                        Peaceful, peaceful nuclear explosions. This is any explosion for non-military purposes. Not all peaceful bombings were industrial. But all industrial explosions are considered to be peaceful.
                        Military bombings - counted separately.

                        С фига ли я националист? С дубу рухнули? То, что я говорю о ядерных испытаниях и "перегибах" большевиков - я якобы русофоб? Успокойтесь. Запарили мерить казахов своими мерками. Если сами лично подвержены болезни "мы - великий народ, подаривший всем папуасам ништяки", то не думайте, что казахи якобы тоже делят народы на "великих" и "не очень". У казаха, что евреи, что русские, что немцы, что негры не вызывают никаких отрицательных эмоций. Мы можем быть националистами только по отношению к китайцам. 2500 лет воюем. К ним легко у казаха разогреть ненависть. А к русским у нас ненависти, страха или презрения нет ни грамма. Откуда тут взяться национализму? Чудные вы люди.
                      4. RA77
                        RA77 4 July 2013 02: 44 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        Успокойтесь. Запарили мерить казахов своими мерками. Если сами лично подвержены болезни "мы - великий народ, подаривший всем папуасам ништяки", то не думайте, что казахи якобы тоже делят народы на "великих" и "не очень".

                        А почему вы считаете, что это не так? Русские - это действительно великий народ, подаривший не то что "попуасам", а всему миру множество достижений и проч. "ништяков". Вровень с остальными не поставишь, это как минимум. А говоря о вас, казахах, в сравнении с русскими, скажите, какие ваши достижения в науке и технике? Может есть хоть один обладатель нобеля - казах? Что, кроме "9 из 10 пуль были отлиты из казахского свинца", (на заводах построенных СССР (sic!)), вы можете дать миру? Уран? Опять же, тень СССР и русских. А вот след русских людей сейчас можно найти в чем угодно. Начиная от американской системы малозаметности "стелс" и заканчивая такими простыми и полезными вещами, как спортивная гиря, которые я оч. люблю тягать))
                      5. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 03: 10 New
                        -1
                        Quote: RA77
                        And why do you think this is not so?

                        For one simple reason. Today one people generates something, tomorrow another. My ancestors wrote and science appeared much earlier than the Russian ancestors. The contribution of the ancestors of the Kazakhs (Uzbeks, Karakalpaks and other Turkestans) to world science was disproportionately more significant in the 8-12 centuries than the contribution of the ancestors of the Russians at that time. Kazakhs are not only nomads, but also residents of cities from ancient centuries. There were no cities in the steppe. They were not needed there. And South Kazakhstan has been urbanized since ancient times. Our own written language appeared in the 5th century. And the scientists of Turkestan (traditionally belonging to the Muslim scientific world, which also includes scientists of Arab and Persian origin) were once the only scientific base in the world, while Europe burned each other at the stake, and China and India were concerned about the problem of survival. .
                        Russian science actually appeared only two centuries ago. I do not argue, the Russian world gave the world a large number of scientists and inventions. This is normal. The day before yesterday - we, yesterday - you, today - the Japanese, tomorrow - the Chinese. Therefore, there are no great or simple nations. Once Tajiks were engaged in higher mathematics at a time when pre-Christian fornication was still in Russia. Today, Tajiks work as unskilled laborers, while Russians receive Nobel Prizes. Which of you is greater - Tajiks or Russians? They are all the same. Tomorrow the situation may change again. 100 years ago, the Japanese were considered undisciplined and utterly lazy. 50 years ago, no one would have thought that the Japanese would give the world the lion's share of scientific discoveries. And 20 years ago we laughed at the Chinese.
                      6. demon ada
                        demon ada 4 July 2013 07: 36 New
                        0
                        somehow it does not fit
                        Kazakhs got genocide
                        destroyed as a nation
                        killed by nuclear bombs
                        and they shook off the state.
                        or I don’t understand, or there was some kind of irregular genocide.
                      7. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 12: 17 New
                        +1
                        Quote: demon ada
                        somehow it does not fit
                        Kazakhs got genocide
                        destroyed as a nation
                        killed by nuclear bombs
                        and they shook off the state.
                        or I don’t understand, or there was some kind of irregular genocide.

                        "сс-овцы расстреливали советских жителей, вешали, сжигали, а гляди-ка до сих пор живут себе вполне люди во всяких белоруссиях. наверное, сс-овцы были добрыми людьми. наговаривают на них, не было ничего плохого со стороны фашистов, если Беларусь до сих пор существует и молоко экспортирует"... у Вас такая логика... Бл_дь, я уже затр_хлся со всеми вами. Вы как дети малые. Вам столько лечит по ушам ездили о "необыкновенном величии русского народа", что когда вам любой простой пример, свидетельствующий о "некрасивых поступках" приводят, у вас мозги отключаются и начинается "ааааааа, они нас не любят, неблагодарные! мы же ВЕЛИКИЕ, почему они нас не любят? мы же даже разрешили им нашу попу поцеловать, а они все равно не прониклись ВЕЛИЧИЕМ! они нас ненавидят, падлыыы"
                        Трезветь пора. Никто не обсирает советскую власть, как это делают сами русские в России. Но стоит казаху что-то сказать на эту тему - начинается истерика "да как они посмели! прочь руки от дела Ленина-Сталина! они же в юртах жили и кизяком зад подтирали! они должны терпеливо переносить тему голода, расстрелов, уничтожения их культуры и ядерных взрывов! подумаешь бОльшая часть казахов сдохла, зато мы для русских переселенцев хрущевки в Казахстане построили. Разве это не чудесно?"
                    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 09: 10 New
                      -2
                      Quote: Marek Rozny
                      My ancestors wrote and science appeared much earlier than the Russian ancestors. The contribution of the ancestors of the Kazakhs (Uzbeks, Karakalpaks and other Turkestans) to world science was in the 8-12 centuries

                      in numbers and dates please
                    3. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 12: 36 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                      in numbers and dates please

                      And you just lived in KZ? This is the material of the Soviet school textbook on the history of the Kazakh SSR. Do you even know anything about Kazakhstan? How sick of these types of me. How did you live here if you don’t know about Kazakhstan.
                      Thanks again to you for leaving Kazakhstan. Ты ни украинцем не смог остаться, ни казахом не смог стать, да и русский из тебя не очень получился. В Казахстане много русских. На многих можно знак качества ставить. Тебя я никак не могу ассоциировать с этими русскими. Ты же безграмотный! Человек, живущий в Казахстане и не знающий ее историю - безграмотен. На кой ляд ты умничаешь про КЗ, если ты как "пробка" во всех вопросах, связанных с Казахстаном? Не знаешь даже школьного курса истории КЗ - не выеживайся тогда.
                    4. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 13: 13 New
                      0
                      Quote: Marek Rozny
                      You could not stay a Ukrainian

                      I have never been Ukrainian I RUSSIAN

                      you, as always, left the answer to a direct question, spread your thoughts across the screen

                      You clearly said that the writing of the ancestors of the Kazakhs appeared earlier than the Slavs - please provide dates
                    5. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 16: 59 New
                      -1
                      Вовочка-анекдот, если ты прогуливал уроки по истории Казахстана, то так уж и быть, подскажу нужную страницу. Набери в гугле "древнетюркская письменность", она же "орхоно-енисейская руническая письменность". Уже в середине первого тысячелетия это была распространенная по всей степи письменность. Каменных памятников этой письменности - тысячи. После 8 века тюрки переходят на бумажную письменность (после того, как после разгрома китайцев в Таласской битве, тюрки завладели секретом изготовления бумаги) - использовались различные алфавиты, но в итоге самым распространенным стал алфавитом стал на основе арабицы (под влиянием ислама). А использовалась еще согдийское письмо, уйгурское. То, что ты не в курсе о тюркских алфавитах и не в курсе о тюркской науке средневековья, еще не обозначает, что этого не было. Это говорит лишь о том, что у тебя кособокое образование и ограниченный кругозор. Ну, и просто кипит гнев от того, что у нас письменность появилась раньше, чем у славян laughing Sorry, the Turks did not wait for the Russians to bring the Bulgarian Cyrillic alphabet to us in the 20th century)))
                    6. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 17: 29 New
                      -1
                      Marek tires your rudeness
                      You clearly and distinctly said that the writing of the ancestors of the Kazakhs appeared earlier than among the Slavs, please give information about one and the other writing without showing off.
                      your ability to spread your thoughts is well known, try to get along without it
                    7. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 00: 41 New
                      +1
                      в гугле забанили, Вова? ты, казахстанец полулиповый, в советское время в музее по истории хоть раз был? неуж-то не видел там предметы с древнетюркской письменностью? да и как ты в КазССР в школе учился, если эта тема еще в СОВЕТСКОМ учебнике по истории Казахстана раскрывалась? Я поражаюсь с тебя, Вова. Ты же двоечник явный. Я думал, у тебя в школе только по русскому и казахскому языкам были неудовлетворительные оценки, так еще явно и по истории у тя не "пятерка" стояла))))
                      А судя по тому, что тебя вечно обижали "казахские националисты", а ты не мог им дать сдачи, то предположу, что и по физкультуре у тебя "троячок" в аттестате))))
                      Короче, как тебе обычно говорили в школе: "Василенко, садись, двойка!" laughing Stomp into the library or google - open your mind there and read about Turkic writing. Maybe the brain will increase. Well, or arrogance will decrease. And then come again to tell why you are supposedly higher than the Kazakhs)))) Once again I will dunk you in a puddle.
                    8. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 09: 31 New
                      0
                      that is, there will be no answer?
        2. RA77
          RA77 4 July 2013 16: 52 New
          +2
          Marek Rozny Oh yes, of course. In your opinion there are no great ones. All are great!)) Or nobody is great)) To equalize everyone, to divide everything equally, first of all they want those who have nothing, who are nothing at the moment;)
          And of course, if you have nothing in the foreseeable future, you will go into the muddy waters of ancient times, trying to stick to their achievements. While there and now, it is sometimes difficult to understand who had whose blood and what they actually invented. And of course, you do not take into account the scale of inventions, aligning everything with one comb. Writing, albeit a fundamental thing, but which is relatively simple and which was invented by many separately from each other, stands next to what you are awarded prizes for. Well done, dance.
        3. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 17: 30 New
          +2
          Да, казахи считают, что нет великий народов, правильных религий или еще чего такого. Мы - не идеальные, но этими болезнями степняки не страдают. И мы действительно изумляемся, когда какой-то обычный гомо сапиенс (причем не всегда лучший представитель своей нации) начинает ездить по ушам, о том, что его нация - великая, а остальные - в подметки не годились. У казахов одна реакция - дать п_зды, чтобы больше не болтал ерунды. А потом появляются "беженцы" из Казахстана, жалующиеся на то, что в Казахстане его националисты притесняли )))) За языком следить надо и не строить из себя пупа земли. У русских много национальных достоинств, много великих людей, но и говна предостаточно. У казахов - то же самое. Только у нас нет нац.идеи, что мы - "самые-самые, а остальное - ". Это нацизм называется, если Вы не в курсе. Гитлер тоже самое проповедовал, если помните.
          У нас тоже есть пацанва, которая думает, что "казахи - самая великая нация, а остальные - курят в сторонке", но только казахское общество так сконструировано, что подобные юношеские макималистские мысли быстро проходят и человек начинает думать в соответствии с казахским менталитетом: "нет великих или невеликих народов".
          Another thing is that there are national habits, national traits - some are prone to trade, others to war, others to diplomacy, etc. Everyone has both cons and pros.
          Про какие "чужие достижения" Вы там намекаете? Тюркскую письменность использовали славяне, монголы или китайцы? Говорите откровенно, русских великодержавников тут не банят))) Развеселите пассажем, что тюркская руника - чья угодно письменность, но только не тюркская)))
          And do not expose me as an idiot who compares ancient achievements and modern ones. I spoke only about comparing ancient achievements between our peoples. Then the Turks had science and writing. For Russians, even at the turn of the millennium, this was not even in its infancy. And I don’t need to sculpt that at least in the 10th century Russians had scientists. We had. Their names were even given in Soviet textbooks, though in a chaotic form. Al-Farabi, Al-Khwarizmi, Al-Biruni, Mahmoud Kashgari, Yusuf Balasaguni and others had an influence on the science of that time much more than all European scientists of the same period))))) And I don’t mention Tajiks whose contribution into world science is also significant and undeniable. And the personalities mentioned are the direct ancestors of the Kazakhs, Karakalpaks, Uzbeks, and not the Persians, Arabs, Russians and Chinese.
          Yes, now, Kazakhstan is far from a leader in science. But we don’t sit idle. They have already begun to invest in science, there are cautious optimism. Orientation to science is the # 1 task in Kazakhstan. All commodity companies by law now pay an additional tax on the development of new technologies. And they began to lure scientists from all over the world to Astana so that staff would work and train us. The state also finances private innovators. Without a pump, we just do it. Nobody says that there are only fools in Russia, Russian science made a serious contribution in the 18th, and especially in the 19-20 centuries to world science. God forbid that in the 21st century Russia remains a significant scientific power. I will only be glad. I just don’t understand when in Russia they think that Russia ALWAYS was supposedly a leading scientific power, and the CIS neighbors were ALWAYS backward in science. This shows only the shortcomings of horizons and human history.
        4. RA77
          RA77 4 July 2013 21: 11 New
          0
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          And do not expose me as an idiot who compares ancient achievements and modern ones. I spoke only about comparing ancient achievements between our peoples. Then the Turks had science and writing. For Russians, even at the turn of the millennium, this was not even in its infancy. And I don’t need to sculpt that at least in the 10th century Russians had scientists. We had. Their names were even given in Soviet textbooks, though in a chaotic form. Al-Farabi, Al-Khwarizmi, Al-Biruni, Mahmoud Kashgari, Yusuf Balasaguni and others had an influence on the science of that time much more than all European scientists of the same period))))) And I don’t mention Tajiks whose contribution into world science is also significant and undeniable. And the personalities mentioned are the direct ancestors of the Kazakhs, Karakalpaks, Uzbeks, and not the Persians, Arabs, Russians and Chinese.

          To illustrate what you are saying, I will give such an analogy. You boast that in kindergarten, first and maybe in the second grade of school, you were, if not an excellent student, then a strong drummer. True, then they called you differently (not a Cossack / hee), but we will close our eyes to this. Also, you boast that your classmate, if he was not a double, then from two to three, for example. However, by the end of your studies at school and later at the institute, this classmate of yours was already an excellent student, and you did not show yourself anymore. By the end of the school, we moved to the deuce, but you were not accepted to the institute at all. So in this whole story you have absolutely nothing to show off, because you still understood something when it came to elementary things, but you were unable to understand more complex and complex material. AT this example you are a lump sum, absolutely incapable of understanding something more complex than 2 + 2. You also boast, essentially contrasting your achievements with those of your classmate, which is stupid. That's about what you look like.

          Yes, and then why Tajiks here? Strictly speaking, I asked what Kazakhs can boast of. Those. since you began to be called Kazakhs. However, I agree to attach to you and all those listed by you. It is clear that you have no one else to mention. The Kazakhs themselves did not achieve anything in science and technology.
        5. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 01: 19 New
          +1
          1) you have problems with logic. which school, which institute? do you think the development process of all nations is over? who is at what level in 2013, then everything will remain forever? we are all still in school in the first grade, that are Russians, that are Kazakhs, that are Japanese, that are blacks. И слово "нИдоумок" оставь себе на память. And it’s better, in your terms, stay after class in the classroom and write this word on the board 100 times without errors.

          2) "Казак" - это наш обычный объединяющий этноним. Тюрки состоят из родов (практически одни и те же рода у всех тюрков-степняков) и каждый раз этноним менялся в зависимости от политического объединения. Были "казак", до этого "мынкол", до этого "турк" и т.д. Кто подчинялся Едыге - тот назывался "ногай", а захотел "ногай" уйти от Едыге и откочевать к султанам Жанибеку и Керею, то автоматически становился "казак". Не понравилось ему под Жанибеком, уходил к Абулхайиру и получал новый этноним "озбек". Но при этом население всех степных государств было одинаковым по родовому составу (и сейчас также). Завтра мы можем назвать себя "еуразиялык" ("евразиец") вместо "казак", но это не означает, что мы с неба упали и наших предков не существовало. Этноним - у нас политическое имя, и оно постоянно меняется. А родовое имя казахи сохраняют более бережливо. Я - аргын. И даже когда я стану "еуразиялык"-ом, я все равно останусь аргыном. И мои дети через тысячу лет, называя себя землянами будут знать, что они аргыны.
          У нас другой подход к самоидентификации. Не меряйте степняков своими европейскими лекалами. Не вписываемся мы в ваши шаблоны. И то, что до 15 века мои предки не называли себя "казак", а называли себя "монгол" не означает, что моего народа не было. Это ты не знаешь, как твоего прадеда сто лет назад звали, а я своих предков на десяток столетий знаю. Так что прежде чем умничать о предках, лучше подумай, кто своих предков лучше знает, ты или казах?

          About Tajiks, I wrote that I don’t even mention themand even types like you generally get rid of resentment that even Tajiks had great scientists in the 10th century, and Russian ancestors in the 10th century - hmm ... there were completely different concerns)))

          Перечисленные мною древние наши ученые заложили основы многих наук. К примеру, Аль-Бируни ввел понятие "алгебра", написал труд о шарообразности Земли и о том, что Земля вращается вокруг Солнца (за 500 лет до того, как европейцы сожгли бедолагу Джордано Бруно), а труды Аль-Хорезми настолько часто переписывались в средневековой Европе, что даже его имя превратилось в научное слово "алгоритм"))))) Более подробно о влиянии тюркских ученых мне лень тебе писать. Все равно не поймешь и будешь только какашками кидаться. Что у тебя есть, то и кидай. Все равно промажешь laughing
        6. RA77
          RA77 5 July 2013 04: 31 New
          -1
          I see you are already starting to twitch. Not worth it.
          Yes, you're right, I made a mistake in the word. Which you grabbed onto. What else remains for you?) You will not say anything new, you will grind what you have already said.
          And an example to illustrate is not required to cover the entirety of the picture. Sometimes enough discussed section.
          And with the logic, everything is fine with me;)

          And you shouldn’t mention Tajiks at all. Because it is not related to the topic. What I wrote to you about. Recalling that it is only about the Kazakhs. And you are mistaken about my reaction to their achievements in the distant past. I'm neither cold nor hot from this.

          And the rest ... It wasn’t worth chewing for so long what part of the body you have to be this ancient scientist and go into the details of their discoveries. I already wrote earlier that let their merits be considered yours. After all, it is already clear that over the past centuries, the Kazakhs have achieved nothing in the field under discussion, and the opening of these Pts. ancient years have a completely different level of difficulty. Perhaps you should give them their due, but putting them on the same line with what is happening now is stupid.
          In general, it is interesting that even access to the institutes of the USSR did not give birth to any great scientist among you Kazakhs. Fact.
        7. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 13: 23 New
          0
          Я дергаться начал? Если я дернусь, ты лежать будешь ))) За языком просто следи и сглотни своего "недоумка", гастарбайтер чешский.

          Касательно казахской науки в 20 веке - то казахи занимались не электроникой или военными разработками, а аграрной наукой, а также горно-металлургической наукой. По этим направлениям, Казахстан и в советское время был на ведущих позициях, и сейчас на мировом уровне достойно выглядит. Изобретения - это не только телевизор или караоке, но и новый способ выщелачивания руды или выведение улучшенных пород мясного скота. Теперь иди и убейся-ап-стену, "знаток науки" )))
        8. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 14: 05 New
          -2
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          If I jerk, you'll lie

          apparently the arguments are over laughing
        9. RA77
          RA77 5 July 2013 21: 37 New
          0
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          Did I start to twitch?


          Ты, ты. Не делай вид, как будто это не так. На "ты" скатился и смайлами сыпать стал. Плюс смысл того, что ты написал. Видно, что тебя зацепили мои слова. Но главное тебе нечего сказать по теме, кроме как пережевывать уже сказанное.

          Quote: Marek Rozny
          Если я дернусь, ты лежать будешь ))) За языком просто следи и сглотни своего "недоумка", гастарбайтер чешски


          Are you sure about that, fucking doc?
          In the text I am specially for sheep like you stressedthat my word is valid only within the framework of this example! But you didn’t notice this because of the squint of eyes. And the fact that in the framework of the example I have given is really so, you can understand by re-reading that example again and finally turning on logic, dumbass.

          А по сабжу, ты просто не хочешь признать, что казахи в науке никто и звать вас никак. За все время, что вы зоветесь казахами, вы ничего не достиги в науке и технике. Что тут еще обсуждать? И так все ясно. Гордишься тем, что твои Оочень далекие "предки" слово "алгебра" ввели))) Русские к 88 году "Буран" построили, который вышел на орбиту и затем в автоматическом режиме сел на аэродром. И это во времена, когда память компов шла на Kb. О производительности я вообще молчу. Амеры вот только научились делать подобное, при современных то компах.
          I'm generally sure that your ancient ancestors would have disowned such you. The only thing you can really do is work as middle managers.
  28. Kazbek
    Kazbek 5 July 2013 11: 21 New
    0
    Quote: RA77
    А почему вы считаете, что это не так? Русские - это действительно великий народ, подаривший не то что "попуасам", а всему миру множество достижений и проч. "ништяков". Вровень с остальными не поставишь, это как минимум. А говоря о вас, казахах, в сравнении с русскими, скажите, какие ваши достижения в науке и технике? Может есть хоть один обладатель нобеля - казах? Что, кроме "9 из 10 пуль были отлиты из казахского свинца", (на заводах построенных СССР (sic!)), вы можете дать миру? Уран? Опять же, тень СССР и русских. А вот след русских людей сейчас можно найти в чем угодно. Начиная от американской системы малозаметности "стелс" и заканчивая такими простыми и полезными вещами, как спортивная гиря, которые я оч. люблю тягать))

    You are a wise guy, that you are proud of the old merits of the USSR, what did you do after the collapse of the USSR? The country has been dragged and proud, you cannot launch rockets already - everyone is falling. Well, and how far have you gone from us? I don’t see something that you would live better than us. We would have raised the country without you after the collapse, although you said that we would all have khan without you and will live in yurts again. If you are so smart and we are so stupid that you don’t live like Arab sheikhs and Venus do not fly. And show me the Nobel laureate after the collapse of the USSR, only Russian and not Jewish and living in Russia.
  29. Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 11: 53 New
    -3
    Quote: Kazbek
    We without you after the collapse of the country raised

    this topic has been sucked up many times

    на примере легкой промышленности особого "поднятия" не наблюдается в СХ тоже, в Алма-Ате уже яблоки из Китая продают, да бесспорно банков Швейцария позавидует, правда основное их занятие отмывка грязных денег, но это мелочи
  30. Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 14: 25 New
    +2
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    this topic has been sucked up many times

    And how much you don’t suck, you won’t get to the bottom, Vasya. Because you initially have no such task. Your ultimate goal of dialogue is to insult the Kazakhs, expose them as ungrateful, nationalists and parasites. And any of your pseudo-conclusions in any case will lead to the above conclusions.
    It is useless for you to explain and prove something. I absolutely clearly imagine how the Kazakhs spoke to you in Kazakhstan. It doesn’t reach you, why not a single Kazakh on the site treats you with respect? And why do Kazakhs also unanimously despise all kinds of smokes, ya-ya and other subjects similar to you?
    Ты можешь ткнуть пальцев в какого-то казаха в реальной жизни или здесь на сайте и сказать: "Вот этот казах меня уважает"?
    Rhetorical question. Especially considering that even yours real Russian acquaintances from Kazakhstan no longer want to communicate with you ... laughing
  31. Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 14: 31 New
    -1
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Your ultimate goal of dialogue is to insult the Kazakhs, expose them as ungrateful, nationalists and parasites

    can you give at least one example when I insulted Kazakhs (neither you personally, not quite an adequate person) but Kazakhs ?!
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    It doesn’t reach you, why not a single Kazakh on the site treats you with respect?

    firstly, there are not many Kazakhs; secondly, they cannot represent the opinion of all Kazakhs
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Ты можешь ткнуть пальцев в какого-то казаха в реальной жизни или здесь на сайте и сказать: "Вот этот казах меня уважает"?

    you know poking fingers at people is not very polite, (this is not important for you) but nevertheless there are plenty of such Kazakhs
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Especially considering that even your real Russian acquaintances from Kazakhstan no longer want to communicate with you ...

    ну этот вообще уже из области каких-то досужих рассуждений и бредовых идей вашего воспаленного мозга, или вы можете привести конкретные примеры, тогда "приз в студию"
  32. RA77
    RA77 5 July 2013 22: 09 New
    0
    Quote: Kazbek
    You are a wise guy, that you are proud of the old merits of the USSR, what did you do after the collapse of the USSR?

    For a start:
    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/ПАК_ФА
    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Авиационная_вакуумная_бомба_повышенной_мощности

    Quote: Kazbek
    Well, how far have you gone from us?

    In terms of science and technology - far. Mainly because you don’t have anything meaningful here.

    Quote: Kazbek
    Without you, after the collapse of the country, we raised the country, although you said that without you all will be khan and will live in yurts again.

    You did not raise nichrome. You leave only on natural resources, which, by a lucky coincidence, were abundant on your land. Otherwise, they would be like kigriz. Those. lived from revolution to revolution.

    Quote: Kazbek
    And show me the Nobel laureate after the collapse of the USSR, only Russian and not Jewish and living in Russia.

    And what do you clarify so, huh?))) Have you remembered about Game and Novoselov? You know, yes, what the Nobel laureates were in Russia after the collapse of the USSR))) And what would you know, a Kalmyk may be Russian! ;)
    Zhores Alferov (2000)
  33. Alibekulu
    Alibekulu 7 July 2013 23: 15 New
    +2
    Quote: RA77
    Zhores Alferov (2000)

    Жорес Алфёров получил "Нобелевку" за научные открытия сделанные в СССР... Из интервью Жореса Ивановича:-"..в моем случае это середина 70-х годов.." Т.е. получил её за "былые" заслуги, советского времени..
    In terms of science and technology - far.
    Только вот "Протоны" всё падают и падают.. repeat
    You travel only on natural resources
    Hmm .. Whose cow mumbled .. Why are you leaving yourself?
    Otherwise, they would be like kigrizes
    They would be like Ukrainians-Ukrainians ..
    And what would you know, a Kalmyk may be Russian! ;)
    Ага, ну да, прям как в том анекдоте: "Да, как в Москве - так чукча (чукмек, чернож-й, чукмек..), а как пурга - так люди".
  34. Lopatov
    Lopatov 4 July 2013 13: 08 New
    -1
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Если сами лично подвержены болезни "мы - великий народ, подаривший всем папуасам ништяки"

    But I'm not really Russian. Of the representatives of the people who made themselves. And who didn’t drag by the ass from the primitive communal system, the Russians, like you. Tell them thank you that you are not at the same level of development as the Mongols. Who receive an apartment in a nine-story building, collect a yurt in the courtyard.
    And you are a clear Russophobe, from the outside it is perfectly visible. Dissatisfied with the fact that they brought you into people. The Moor did the deed; the Moor is worth deflecting. In order to increase self-esteem
  35. Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 13: 44 New
    +2
    Quote: Spade
    But I'm not really Russian. Of the representatives of the people who made themselves. And who didn’t drag by the ass from the primitive communal system, the Russians, like you. Tell them thank you that you are not at the same level of development as the Mongols. Who receive an apartment in a nine-story building, collect a yurt in the courtyard.

    Yes, it makes no difference to me who you had in your ancestors. You, apparently, like Vasilenko, are embarrassed by your national roots, and therefore behave like a neophyte, proving to others that he is allegedly more Russian than the Russians themselves.
    A hint about the primitive communal system - about your ethnic group? )))) EPT, another civilizer was found with a bare dupe. Pre-revolutionary Russian scholars of Turkestan Potanin and Kharuzin wrote that the steppes stood at a higher cultural level than the Russian settlers. Not to mention that the Kazakhs were trite richer than the Cossacks and immigrants.
    And here is a quote from 19th century scientific papers:

    "(Иртышскіе) казаки настолько поддались вліянію окружающихъ ихъ киргизовъ, что почти все казачье населеніе говоритъ по-киргизски и нередко предпочитаетъ этотъ языкъ родному; для многихъ это колыбельный языкъ, такъ какъ няньки часто выбираются изъ киргизокъ. Киргизскія привычки простираются и на одежду и пищу казаковъ. Какъ и киргизъ, иртышскій казакъ любитъ носить широкіе плисовы шаровары, халатъ изъ бухарской парчи или саранджи и лисью шапку (борькъ); онъ любитъ киргизскія національныя блюда, въ томъ числе и конину... Кроме того, многіе предразсудки, понятія и убежденія казакъ заимствовалъ отъ киргизовъ: онъ, какъ и этотъ последній, считаетъ стыднымъ сесть на коня безъ нагайки, надеть холщевые шаровары и т. п.
    In order to wage a successful struggle, the Russian must have studied with the Kyrgyz, and since the cultural level of the settled soldiers was not high, he should be attracted by the more luxurious clothes of the Kyrgyz people from Bukhara, both weapons and horse-drawn decorations; Kyrgyz-stepnyak, being for the new settler the ideal of a rider, was supposed to subjugate the Russian element and influence his customs, manners, worldview and language. ... The Okirgizenie of Russians is explained mainly by the low cultural level of the last ...
    (Алексей Николаевич Харузин, "К вопросу об ассимиляционной способности русского народа", 1894 год).
  36. Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 14: 13 New
    -2
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    You, apparently, like Vasilenko, are embarrassed by their national roots,

    I'm sorry, Marek, but you’re really my father’s lynch my ancestors from the Cossacks on the maternal from the Russian and Polish nobility, I consider myself Russian, you invented something for yourself there and performed, but at the same time you don’t even have the courage to call yourself
  37. Lopatov
    Lopatov 5 July 2013 23: 50 New
    -2
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Yes, it makes no difference to me who you had in your ancestors. You, apparently, like Vasilenko, are embarrassed by your national roots, and therefore behave like a neophyte, proving to others that he is allegedly more Russian than the Russians themselves.

    It is possible that more Russian than many who consider themselves Russian. I’m a Belarusian.

    Quote: Marek Rozny
    A hint about the primitive communal system - about your ethnic group? ))))

    No, obviously not about mine.

    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Pre-revolutionary Russian scholars of Turkestan Potanin and Kharuzin wrote that the steppes stood at a higher cultural level than the Russian immigrants.

    You have problems with the Russian language. In your quote there is nothing about a higher cultural level of the steppes than the immigrants.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 23: 55 New
    0
    the truth must be borne in mind that when tested at the Totsky training ground, the military was driven out
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 00: 59 New
      0
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      the truth must be borne in mind that when tested at the Totsky training ground, the military was driven out

      "...к операции привлекли целых 45 тыс. солдат, организация была намного строже: контроль радиации до прохождения войск через заражённую зону (по опасной зоне не ходили даже разведчики, местность размечали флажками, отстреливаемыми из дозиметрического танка), ОЗК и последующая дезактивация".
      The soldiers were not running in shorts there. And not at the epicenter.
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 01: 04 New
        0
        well, so no one was forcing anyone to run around the training ground, another question is that many, as always, put everything at stake, who is radiation, what kind of radiation do we not see means no, if not, everything normally grazes the sheep.
        or someone forcibly drove someone into the zones of infection and exclusion ?!

        p / s / based on your phrase about ozk and decontamination, I can say one thing about you as Suleimenov about radiation, you don’t even have the slightest idea, but about the epicenter, you can say that about the atomic explosion and its consequences
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 01: 27 New
          -1
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          well, so no one was forcing anyone to run around the training ground, another question is that many, as always, put everything at stake, who is radiation, what kind of radiation do we not see means no, if not, everything normally grazes the sheep.
          or someone forcibly drove someone into the zones of infection and exclusion ?!

          Владимир, ну че ты опять дурочку включил? Когда-нибудь местным разъясняли про опасность? И уже тем более рассказывали ли общественности, когда ядерные облака гуляли по Карагандинской, Павлодарской и другим областям? Пришлось бы переселять миллионы людей и ставить крест на сотнях стратегических предприятиях Центрального, Северного и Восточного Казахстана. Власти молчали. Панику пресекали. Даже про аварию на Чернобыле молчали, пока Западная Европа шум не подняла. А тут ты делаешь вид, что якобы казахским аулам разъясняли, чем им грозит проживание на зараженных территориях. Да и не было никакой "зоны отчуждения" на деле. Это гигантская территория, и она не обнесена ни забором, ни знаками. Только там, где сами военные объекты стоят.

          I will not say anything about the passage addressed to me and Suleimenova. Kazakhs will forever be grateful to Suleimenov, and the contemptuous attitude of the Kazakhs (even here on the forum) towards your person - you yourself know. You don’t stand Olzhas’s nail either. So no matter how hard you try, you won’t be able to stain him with shit. Just sweat and, God forbid, you will get cold. And your health is not as good as you told me.
        2. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 11: 21 New
          -1
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          Vladimir, why did you turn on the fool again? Ever been explained to the locals about the danger? And even more so, did they tell the public when nuclear clouds walked in Karaganda, Pavlodar and other areas?

          you turn on the fool, provided that you didn’t live in the Kazakh SSR, that you didn’t know how and to whom, but you have already said so many nonsense on this thread that you are amazed at starting with the OZK as a means of protection against radiation and ending with the monolithic character of the Kazakh nation throughout history
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          And your health is not so good, as you said

          Is it the manner of the political leaders to invent and lie ?!
        3. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 12: 52 New
          +2
          1) Vasilenko, do you have a memory problem? I personally have repeatedly told you about when and how many times I was and lived in Kazakhstan. The fact that I was born in Orenburg (this is right on the border with the KZ) does not mean that I was not in the KZ. Both of my parents are natives of Kazakhstan - the Tselinograd and Dzhambul regions. My grandmothers lived there. My relatives are scattered throughout the KZ, whom we visited every year several times at all Kazakh events.
          Yes, I know the history and culture of Kazakhstan unimaginably better than you. This is my story, my culture. And for you, Kazakhstan was a break-in place. You are a guest worker. Sred_at you wanted for everything related to KZ. From you is a source of information on KZ, as from a cow pomegranate tortilla.
          Although I'm afraid you will forget this information again in half an hour. And again, for the hundredth time, you will ask one and the same thing again.

          Про здоровье ты и сам жаловался, оборот "здоровье уже не позволяет" из твоих уст я помню. Можешь перекопать свои сообщения, если запамятовал. Твои проблемы.

          Vova, I wrote that the soldiers were in the UPC. This is better than without OZK. The soldiers did not have any other work clothes at that time. Soldiers did not run in the most infected areas of the training ground, but only where the radiation level was relatively low. Hare fooling around.
        4. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 13: 16 New
          -1
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          Vasilenko, do you have a memory problem? I personally have repeatedly told you about when and how many times I was and lived in Kazakhstan. The fact that I was born in Orenburg (this is right on the border with the KZ) does not mean that I was not in the KZ.

          everything is in order with my memory, you wrote repeatedly that you lived with your father in the GDR, he served in the same place and studied at school
        5. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 16: 49 New
          +1
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          everything is in order with my memory, you wrote repeatedly that you lived with your father in the GDR, he served in the same place and studied at school

          Damn, Vova, you never cease to amaze me every day. Neither I nor my father have ever been to the GDR. And I never wrote such statements. Search through the archive of my messages.
          You ... have a bite or something.
        6. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 17: 22 New
          0
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          Do you ... have a bite or something

          that you boor it doesn’t surprise me anymore, I could have made a mistake and I won’t rest and prove something, although it was postponed in my opinion along with the fact that your father was a political officer.
          so still where and when did they finish school ?!
        7. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 22: 35 New
          +4
          Vasilenko, you started to be rude to me in December. So what a hello, such an answer. And with a fig, will I play politeness with a man who is an outspoken chauvinist and an ordinary liar?
          As for the school - it will be necessary, I will tell you myself. But not at your request. Don’t give you any answer - you will fashion a thread. And if you blurt out something offensive about my father, I’ll get it out of the ground. And then I feel that your language is not the first time itching, not only addressed to me, but also to say it. I warned you, Vova. Watch your language. Put a barrel on me - I don’t care. If you touch your father, the conversation will cease to be virtual.
          Ну, так что ты там мне про ГДР хотел залечить? Запускай свой сериал фантазий, какая сегодня серия от "БеженецТВ"? )))
        8. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 12: 09 New
          0
          And with a fig, will I play politeness with a person who is an outspoken chauvinist and an ordinary liar?
          zadolbal, or shut up, or bring at least one of my chauvinistic statement
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          And you’ll blurt out something offensive about my father - I’ll get it out of the ground

          firstly, you don’t need to threaten, secondly, I didn’t say a word about your father, apparently, as always, there are no arguments, by the way I don’t need to look underground, I write on my own behalf and I don’t hide my address

          p / s / I still didn’t understand that you got hooked on your father? !!!
          Yes, and about the language I advise you to do the same
        9. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 14: 06 New
          -1
          wahahaha)))))))))))

          - You are a boor, a chauvinist and a liar!
          “I'm not a chauvinist!”


          laughing
        10. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 5 July 2013 14: 18 New
          -2
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          You are a boor, a chauvinist and a liar! - I'm not a chauvinist!

          had a good laugh? calmed down?
          can you think adequately now?
          Well, either give me at least one example of my chauvinism, at least one, or shut up.

          it seems that the Kazakh Natsik has the word shovik a kind of fetish, none of you know the meaning of this word, but every Russian who has the audacity to criticize the political or economic situation in the Republic of Kazakhstan immediately becomes a shovik
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 13: 19 New
    0
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Vova, I wrote that the soldiers were in the UPC. This is better than without OZK.

    you wrote that they were not in shorts but in the OZK from the point of view of the damaging factor of radiation, this is monstrous, the only difference is that they could wash away the settled dust, the whole dose that they picked up at the time of the exercises with them and remained.

    you do not know what radiation is, but at the same time you undertake to talk about its consequences
  • Egoza
    Egoza 3 July 2013 22: 51 New
    +2
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    it's just your ignorance of the subject,

    Thanks for the specific answer. Really didn’t know. it was just that the test site was always mentioned (even if it was very large), but I thought - since the test site, especially for such explosions, means an uninhabited place.
  • Gecko
    Gecko 3 July 2013 21: 16 New
    +5
    from 1926 to 1939 - Written claims against the great Georgian (the father of all nations) and a handful of Jews in power.

    Ты еще один садомазохист-одиночка который решил на Русском патриотическом сайте доказать что все Русские "нехорошие люди"?
    1. teodorh
      teodorh 3 July 2013 21: 44 New
      -2
      Quote: gecko
      from 1926 to 1939 - Written claims against the great Georgian (the father of all nations) and a handful of Jews in power.


      When it comes to positive aspects in the USSR, whether it be a victory in WWII, space exploration, it is the merit of the Russians.

      When it comes to negativity? The Georgians, the Jews and the commies are to blame?

      Where did you write that the Russians are bad? good or bad, good or evil can be people, not entire nations. Prominent figures of the Russian people have made a huge contribution to the development of world civilization. Your attempts to accuse me of Russophobia are groundless.
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 3 July 2013 22: 49 New
      -1
      Quote: gecko
      from 1926 to 1939 - Written claims against the great Georgian (the father of all nations) and a handful of Jews in power.

      ahhhh, well, as usual ... all that was good in KZ was Russian. everything bad is from the Bolsheviks, Jews and Georgians. very comfortable position. win-win.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 21: 49 New
    +6
    Quote: teodorh
    We were allowed to create our autonomy by the very last, although in terms of numbers, Kazakhs were the fourth largest empire after the Slavs

    eeeee mnnnn do not even know what to say
    Quote: teodorh
    Why not somewhere near Ryazan or Pskov? And yes, we are in your opinion chocks and Papuans, people from the third grade.

    you know, I can’t stand it when a thread begins that the USE victim yells about the fact that the RSFSR fed Central Asia, but you are the same victim of a new education, you don’t understand what you are writing about, and it seems even what you are writing, stupidity drives stupidity and stupidity
    1. teodorh
      teodorh 3 July 2013 21: 56 New
      -1
      I don’t get used to it when my views are not identical to the views of the cheers-patriots of whom 90-95 percent here, I automatically become dull or stupid =)
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 21: 57 New
        +1
        Quote: teodorh
        I don’t get used to it when my views are not identical to the views of the cheers-patriots of whom 90-95 percent here, I automatically become dull or stupid =)

        or maybe you just don’t need to write stupid things ?!
        1. teodorh
          teodorh 3 July 2013 22: 07 New
          0
          my question is why during the ussr a nuclear testing ground was created on our territory, and not some other territory? it was a question and you answer me about stupidity.
          1. Misantrop
            Misantrop 3 July 2013 22: 11 New
            +3
            Quote: teodorh
            why during the ussr a nuclear testing ground was created on our territory, and not some other territory?

            Have you ever heard of the New Earth?
            1. Marek Rozny
              Marek Rozny 3 July 2013 22: 39 New
              -3
              Quote: Misantrop
              Have you ever heard of the New Earth?

              And how many civilians were affected by the nuclear explosions in Novaya Zemlya? Answer: 0 people.
              For example: in Kazakhstan, more than 1 million people are officially recognized as victims of nuclear explosions!
              1. Misantrop
                Misantrop 3 July 2013 22: 46 New
                +9
                Quote: Marek Rozny
                in Kazakhstan more than 1 million people are officially recognized as victims of nuclear explosions!

                Still, such an occasion for benefits. It's like during the reign of Yushchenko, he rushed with gigantic figures about the Holodomor. If you believe its numbers, then all Ukrainians died, and some - not even once laughing
                1. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 3 July 2013 22: 59 New
                  +1
                  Misanthrope, this is not funny. We still have physical birthdays. And not only in areas adjacent to the strategic nuclear zone, but also in the west of the KZ.

                  "Журналисты “Уральской недели“ побывали в Бокейординском районе в семьях детей, пострадавших от воздействия испытательного полигона Капустин Яр.

                  The peak of pathology among children occurred in the 90s, but, having traveled several villages of the district, we made sure that sick children continue to be born here ...
                  Alizhan, 10 months, Central Hospital, Saykhyn District Center. The diagnosis is Down syndrome. A child has a congenital pathology - the fingers are joined together.
                  Ainara, 5 years old, the village of Khan Orda. Wearing six month old baby clothes. From birth, the girl has disrupted the growth process of the body, because of which the girls practically do not grow the humerus and femur. According to parents in mental development is not inferior to peers.
                  Islay, 12 years old, the village of Khan Orda. Suffering from autism. Every day he spends in the company of his father and dolls. Islay hardly speaks, and when she saw the camera aimed at her, she burst into tears.
                  Gulmira, 23 years old, the village of Khan Orda. Outwardly, the girl looks like a teenager, and in terms of mental development she remained at the level of a nursing infant.
                  At home, Gulmira is tied to a bed, and recently even wrapped with wire, because she learned to untie the rope.
                  - Tears the wallpaper, sometimes even windows can break. “Nobody knows us, although we live in the house of eight people,” her mother says, “My voice only sometimes recognizes, and then when I feed her.” When she wants to eat, she begins to bang her head against the wall.
                  Asylbek, 24 years old, the village of Khan Orda. The diagnosis is a growth pathology, in other words - a dwarf.
                  Serik, 22 years old, Muratsay village. Has no eyes from birth, a pronounced mental and physical developmental delay.
                  He does not give an account of his actions and therefore most of the time he is tied to the bed. The only thing he reacts positively to is music, which he is ready to listen to all the time.
                  Danagul, 7 years old, Muratsay village. Doctors diagnosed her mental retardation and cleft lip.
                  Asylkhan, 22 years old, Agen branch. He is far behind peers in mental development, but overtakes them in physical ...
                  The Kapustin Yar training ground was created in 1947. Then more than 60 thousand people were forcibly evicted from these places. Today, the population in the Bokeyordinsky district barely exceeds 16 thousand people.
                  По открытым данным, начиная с 1950-х, на полигоне Капустин Яр было проведено как минимум 11 наземных ядерных взрывов, суммарная мощность которых составляет примерно 65 атомных бомб, сброшенных на Хиросиму. "
                  http://thenews.kz/2013/05/22/1385718.html
                  In general, the Kazakhs, to their nausea, have seen enough of the photographs of people who were born disabled after nuclear tests.
                2. Misantrop
                  Misantrop 3 July 2013 23: 14 New
                  +6
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  We still have physical birthdays. And not only in areas adjacent to the strategic nuclear zone, but also in the west of the KZ.

                  И все это ТОЛЬКО от воздействия ЯО, ни от чего больше? В Крыму взрывов ЯО не было пока. Вот только количество отклонений весьма велико с каждым годом все увеличивается. Зато вот Хиросиму и Нагасаки не отселяли. Тех, кто выжил. И суперкрутых мер по дезактивации тоже никто не проводил, просто не знали тогда, что и как делать, да и зачем это нужно. И что, там одни мутанты ползают? А на Украине и в Белоруссии, куда "Чернобыльские подарки" высыпались, процентный уровень отклонений не слишком отличается от других регионов. Про комбинат "Маяк" и его прилегающую территорию доводилось читать? Уж там и вовсе запредельные значения облучающих факторов, "Капустин яр" отдыхает. Вот только населению там почему-то не торопятся статус "радиационно-пострадавших" давать...
                3. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 01: 14 New
                  -1
                  Misanthrope, I do not want to seem like a nationalist, but the Kazakhs are proud that they are a very healthy and strong nation. In our country, Islam still influences some habits, and the tradition of knowing the ancestors up to the 7th generation, so as to prevent incest, is still valid. and we are never born hilyaki. And nutritional features play a role. Horse meat - the most healthy and medicinal meat - is still an essential part of the diet of modern Kazakhs. And koumiss is used regularly. Plus shubat and other sour-milk drinks. This is not a panacea, but the nation, as a result, is generally healthy and resilient.
                  U.rody are born solely for environmental reasons, primarily in areas infected with nuclear explosions. A smaller part is the consequences of the work of harmful enterprises (especially in Altai).

                  Чернобыльская катастрофа не была "запланирована" в отличие от военных ядерных испытаниях в Казахстане. И сравнение с Хиросимой я уже сделал. В одном Семипалатинске 2500 "Хиросим" случилось. How can one compare the first American bombs with what was blown up in Kazakhstan until the end of the 80s ???
                4. Misantrop
                  Misantrop 4 July 2013 10: 29 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  Kazakhs are proud that they are a very healthy and strong nation.

                  ... and therefore they consider themselves entitled to indicate to the nuclear scientist, who worked all his life at a nuclear plant until retirement, how exactly radiation affects living organisms? belay Radiation, no doubt, has contributed, BUT its main effect is that radiation reduces the margin of resistance to mutations. But for the mutations themselves, say thanks to your cotton growers and the thousands of tons of fertilizer that they poured into the fields. Therefore, the peak occurred precisely in those years that you are writing about, by the time of explosions, the power of warheads and the half-life of isotopes, this peak has nothing to do with it. request Moreover, a military explosion differs from a research one VERY much. And its power is just one of a whole list of parameters. Certainly not the most important for determining the long-term consequences of it
                5. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 13: 03 New
                  0
                  Moreover, there are Uzbek cotton growers or someone else, when mutants are born in the territories affected by radiation. In other regions of the KZ - there are no such massive cases. Thousands of people with birth defects live in Semsk, and it turns out the Uzbeks are to blame ... Well, kanesha. Radiation is garbage, here cotton growers pesticides are terrible weapons ... They drove off in Paktaaral, travailed in East Kazakhstan and in Uralsk.
                  You have Chernobyl. What is the city abandoned? Do not be afraid, live there. Cotton growers are far from you. You will not become a mutant, health will not be thinned. Welkam that Chernobyl.
                6. Vasilenko Vladimir
                  Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 13: 29 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  And here the Uzbek cotton growers

                  despite the fact that you don’t know the subject of the dispute, the chemicals used to grow cotton are no less dangerous
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  other regions of the KZ - there are no such massive cases

                  can you give statistics ?!
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  Radiation is garbage, here cotton growers pesticides are terrible weapons ...

                  you forgive by education who?
                  from the conversation it’s already clear that you don’t know anything about radiation or pesticides
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  Welkam Tu Chernobyl

                  Marik, well, do not disgrace, well, bullshit
                7. Misantrop
                  Misantrop 4 July 2013 15: 24 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  And here the Uzbek cotton growers

                  Despite the fact that this chemistry is a powerful mutagen.
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  In other regions of the KZ - there are no such massive cases.

                  I will not argue. This is what I wrote above:
                  Quote: Misantrop
                  radiation reduces the margin of resistance to mutations.

                  Or is it too difficult to tie together two different sentences? Still try, I specifically removed everything superfluous from the post so as not to distract wink
                8. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 18: 06 New
                  +2
                  Misanthrope, I still do not understand Where is the connection between pesticides used in Uzbekistan and genetic abnormalities among residents of East and West Kazakhstan? There is a gigantic distance between them. Moreover, in the territory of the mentioned Kazakh regions, agriculture mainly consists of cattle breeding, and chemical soil treatment is not applied there.
                  Ладно от Василенко я никогда не услышу здравого ответа, он человек "обиженный" на казахов. Вас я искренне уважаю и вообще не хочу идти на конфликт с Вами, даже если не согласен в каких вопросах. Просто объясните - связь между узбекскими химикатами и Восточным Казахстаном?
                9. Misantrop
                  Misantrop 4 July 2013 22: 32 New
                  0
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  in the territory of the mentioned Kazakh regions, agriculture mainly consists of cattle breeding, and chemical soil treatment is not applied there.
                  Тут две причины, основная из которых - ветровой перенос всей этой дряни вместе с пылью. Лесных массивов (больших) нет, серьезных горных массивов, меняющих расклад ветров - тоже. Вот и таскает на гигантские расстояния. Основной-то массив - степной. Что уж говорить, если часть жимикатов, судя по спектральному анализу, рассыпаемых в Молдавии, в результате в Крым попадала. Вроде бы и море, и горы имеются, но тем не менее... А второе - употребление продуктов питания (основной их массы) более-менее местного производства (т.е. с теми же разносимыми ветром химикатами). НО если в остальных регионах за счет хорошего иммунитета это не давало ТАКИХ зримых результатов, то в районах, близких к полигону, это было явно заметно. В них-то иммунитет населения источниками ИИ ослаблен был, вот и сказалось... А в 90-е как раз и перестали сыпать химию, не до нее стало из-за "перестройки". Вот и пошло постепенно на спад, насыпано-то до хрена было. Взрывы-то на полигоне к тому времени уже давно прекратились, наземные и воздушные - вообще хрен знает когда. Практически все взрывы после самых первых были подземного типа, no surface emission at all. Так что на экологию эти взрывы вообще НИКАК не влияли. Мне по долгу службы пришлось довольно плотно этими вопросами заниматься. Да и прожил 10 лет на Кольском полуострове. А тот и без всяких баз ВМФ "светится", как новогодняя елка. Коренные породы, базальты и граниты дают natural background in 15 micro-roentgen ... request

                  Why did the Japanese, even those living in nuclear-bombed cities, not have a large number of mutations. They have a significant part of the diet of seafood. And in those until recently, there were not many harmful chemicals and isotopes. This is now, when after the accident at Fukushima, almost half of the fish caught off the coast of Japan gives isotopic exposure, a surge in mutations can soon be expected ...
                10. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 00: 18 New
                  +2
                  Quote: Misantrop
                  wind transfer of all this rubbish along with dust. There are no (large) forests, serious mountain ranges changing the alignment of winds - either. That drags to gigantic distances. The main array is the steppe.

                  look at the physical map of Kazakhstan. Between the Uzbek Pakhtaaral and Semipalatinsk, in fact, there is a natural barrier.

                  Quote: Misantrop
                  And the second is the use of food products (the bulk of them) of more or less local production (i.e. with the same chemicals carried by the wind).

                  Kazakhstan food very high quality. And the meat (horsemeat and lamb) of East Kazakhstan is generally the best in all of Kazakhstan. Fruits and vegetables (traditionally imported from southern Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and now China) northerners / easterners do not consume very much. Yes, and the SES is not asleep. Pesticidal products are caught regularly. But all the same, vegetables / fruits in this region are not eaten in moderation. They are Kazakhs, they would have more meat and tea. According to statistics of the still hungry 90s, a Kazakhstani eats meat a month, how much Japanese eats in a year. And this despite the fact that the lion's share of the eaten meat eludes official statistics. And flour products in Kazakhstan are of the highest quality. So even here I have doubts about your theory about the connection of pesticides with diseases of residents of poisoned regions.
                  Что тут гадать - главная причина - это влияние радиации. В любой момент у местных жителей (даже у здоровых родителей) там может родиться ребенок с серьезными дефектами. Наверняка есть влияние "грязных" заводов расположенных неподалеку (Усть-Каменогорск). Тут я могу согласиться. И тем не менее, первопричина повышенной врожденной инвалидности - ядерные полигоны. А все остальное - усугубляющие факторы.
                11. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 5 July 2013 00: 20 New
                  0
                  Кроме того, не надо говорить, что якобы люди от балды записались в "жертвы". И обратите внимание, что это правительство Казахстана платит деньги пострадавшим от действий полигона, а не Россия, представители которой тут галдят "мы вам диснейленды построили". За такие "диснейленды" почему-то приходится Казахстану до сих пор расплачиваться деньгами. И если бы Казахстан путал бы "русский народ" с "советской властью", то мы бы потребовали от России возместить эти затраты. Однако поскольку казахи не путают эти понятия, то и не предъявляют никаких требований к Москве. Виновник - ныне не существующая "советская власть/руководство СССР". Так что претензий мы предъявлять никому не можем. И благодарности за достижения бывшего строя - объявлять некому. К сожалению, многие русские этого не понимают. А точнее, понимают только удобную для них формулировку: "Все хорошее в СССР - от этнических русских, все плохое в СССР - от евреев, Сталина и КПСС". А потом этим русским приходится записывать казахов поголовно в националистов, поскольку степняки категорически отказываются соглашаться с такой иезуитской логикой.
                  Мы же не поляки, украинцы или литовцы, чтобы просить от соседей благодарности, покаяния или еще чего-нить. Туранцы более прагматичны. Обратите внимание, это не только казахи не требуют от Москвы "компенсаций и извинений за прошлое", но и узбеки, киргизы, туркмены. А кто обычно просит такое от Москвы? Исключительно европейские этносы СНГ и Восточной Европы. Куда деваться, это европейский менталитет - считать себя обиженным, а соседей - неблагодарными. Вон уже даже Германия вообразила, что Россия должна извиниться за свое прошлое. Турции, Венгрии или Монголии и в голову не придет просить от соседней страны покаяния или наоборот извиняться за что-то, случившееся в прошлом. Было и было. После драки кулаками не машут и претензий не предъявляют. А германские и славянские народы всю душу друг другу изведут, ощущая себя "униженными и оскорбленными". А потом устраивают сами себе "большую кровь", когда доведут себя до истерики. Я не прав? По-моему, это очевидная разница в мышлении наших культур. Хотя от русских казахи ожидают увидеть более трезвое отношение к прошлому, чем это принято на Западе.
                  В н-ный раз говорю, не просите благодарности от нас, и тогда не будете слышать ответные претензии. А по своей инициативе степняк претензий предъявлять не будет. "Беженцы" Казахстана этого не поняли. Потому они везде и видели националистов. Нормальные русские, которые не требуют "благодарности" от казахов, не встречают "казахских националистов". Что тут непонятного?
    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 14: 35 New
      0
      Quote: Marek Rozny
      but the Kazakhs are proud that they are a very healthy and strong nation. In our country, Islam still influences some habits, and the tradition of knowing ancestors up to the 7th tribe in order to prevent

      you already decide whether they’re healthy or are born, Islam was dragged to something, Kazakhs had tuberculosis almost everywhere, I’m talking about good health of the nation
    3. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 17: 52 New
      0
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      you already decide whether they’re healthy or are born, Islam was dragged to something, Kazakhs had tuberculosis almost everywhere, I’m talking about good health of the nation

      Vova, stop pouring guano. Kazakhs are a healthy nation for a number of reasons. This is nutrition, and Islam (which significantly affects the spread of addictions), and the prevention of incestuous marriages, etc. When a person neglects Kazakh cuisine (horse meat, koumiss, shubat), drinks vodka in liters - then yes, the question of the health of this Kazakh is understandable . But in general, Kazakhs drink alcohol moderately (and many do not drink strictly), horse meat on the table by the Kazakh - constantly. And Kazakhs go in for sports much more often than Russians in Russia.
      Ну, а распространение туберкулеза - это "спасибо" советской власти. До революции казахи понятия не имели о туберкулезе, т.к. в рационе у степняков есть кумыс - единственное природное лекарство от этой болезни. Туберкулез в казахской степи возник после того, как советская власть отобрала весь скот у казахов. Так что лучше закрой эту тему сам, а то получишь еще один баттхерт. Туберкулез - "подарок" советской власти 20-30 годов.
      And do not think that before the Russians, the Kazakhs did not have medicine. In this we (and in veterinary medicine) succeeded more than the Russians in our time. All their diseases and cattle diseases were cured by themselves. Kazakhs smirked at the Russian veterinarians who received a European education when they came to the Steppe.
      Ну, а повсеместное внедрение больниц - это заслуга советской власти. Я лишь напомню, что основная масса русского народа получила образование и бесплатную медицину в то же время, что и казахи. То, что князья и купцы России пользовались лучшими мед.средствами того времени (причем, западноевропейскими) - не означало, что русский народ сам пользовался достижениями мед.науки. Спасибо (в этом вопросе) советской власти. И "спасибо" советской власти за туберкулез. Не отнимали бы большевики у казахов скот (лошадей в первую очередь), не было бы у нас этой печальной страницы в истории.
    4. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 4 July 2013 18: 03 New
      -1
      Quote: Marek Rozny
      Before the revolution, Kazakhs had no idea about tuberculosis

      Well, why are you writing something you don’t know about?
      Valikhanov died of tuberculosis, Kazakhs did not know such a disease, she herself came to the steppe and settled
    5. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 18: 22 New
      +1
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      Valikhanov died of tuberculosis, Kazakhs did not know such a disease, she herself came to the steppe and settled

      don't get smart. Valikhanov fell ill with tuberculosis away from his native places when he was on a mission in China. In St. Petersburg, the disease worsened, and he returned to Kazakhstan as a deeply sick man before his death.
  • papss
    papss 3 July 2013 23: 19 New
    +5
    You write these large texts ... it’s certainly bitter to read ... although it’s someone else’s pain ... but believe me, it’s hard to read ... But it’s even harder to understand what you are striving for ... The specific perpetrators are people who are already gone ... you are not happy ... you need other explanations ... Namely, conviction of the Russian people, ненависть к которому легко читаемая между ваших строк...Именно...все вы хотите как раз повесить на невиновных...кстати тоже ныне не живущих людей...на их сыновей и внуков. И чтоб славяне начали каяться в том что это было...Ведь вы этого добиваетесь. Этого не будет! Нам каятся не в чем. Вот вы до костей не терпим к русскому...таких много из бывших "покоренных", а ведь СССР, действительно хоть и был русско-образующим государством, управлялся в разные годы людьми далеко не русскими...Ну это для вас не ответ. Вас очень угнетала власть, а веры в то что от руководства все исходит вы не поддерживаете.Тоже очень хорошая позиция. Не правда ли? Так легко можно валить все на русских...
  • Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 00: 19 New
    -1
    But how did I get tired of explaining. Kazakhs have no complaints against the Russian people! We have no special gratitude to the Russians, nor complaints! Some Russians have a problem with self-identification! I’ve written dozens of times (and besides me, other Kazakhs with one voice) - Russian and Soviet power are not the same thing! either you then accept claims for the excesses and mistakes of the Soviet regime, or do not expose yourself as donors, sponsors, educators, advocates. You really don’t understand what exactly annoys Kazakhs and others? It is annoying when some Russians try to make themselves benefactors and at the same time try to abstract from all the black pages of history.
    Quote: papss
    We repent of nothing.

    So there’s nothing to thank you for! That's the problem. The decisions were made by the Soviet government - she and the blasphemy, and she was honored by us. What about the Russians? When a Kazakh scolds the Soviet regime, you perceive that he allegedly curses ethnic Russians. And the Kazakh is not talking about the Russian ethnic group, but about the Soviet government! Did the Russian people decide to build mining plants or landfills in Kazakhstan? Of course not. Soviet authority. Did the Russian people decide to treat the Kazakhs or to Russify them? Of course not. These are the decisions of the Soviet government. Enough Kazakhs record in Russophobia. This is idiocy. Kazakhs, including me, do not have any negative feelings for Russian or other peoples of the USSR. The Russian people are an instrument of Soviet power, the same as Kazakhs, Ukrainians, Georgians, Chechens, Moldavians.
    Другое дело, что советская власть по существу состояла из этнических славян (я не про годы революции), и многие решения были продиктованы этническими соображениями. Советская власть вела открыто политику обрусевания всех народов СССР. Конечная цель советской власти в нац.политике - создание "советского человека" на базе русского языка и русской культуры. Вам это кажется нормальным, а мне - нет. Василенко уехал из КЗ, посчитав ниже собственного достоинства знать казахский язык и казахскую культуру. Это для него - проявление национализма. А почему насильственная русификация казахов - это не проявление национализма? Что за двойные стандарты? Казахи уважают русскую культуру и неплохо ее знают. Но мы не собираемся превращаться в "монголоидных русских" и отрекаться от собственного языка и культуры, к чему вела нас советская власть. У нас есть чем гордиться в собственной культуре и мы не считаем ее хуже русской, немецкой или арабской. Когда казахи говорят об этом, Вы это воспринимаете в штыки, записывая казахов в каких-то русофобов. Казахи в подавляющей массе - вообще далеки от идей национализма и нетерпимости! Это абсолютно противоречит казахскому менталитету.
  • papss
    papss 4 July 2013 00: 47 New
    +3
    Yes, how did I get sick of explaining
    you don’t get nervous, you write here to be listened to and read ...
    Enough Kazakhs record in Russophobia
    , I asked you not to speak on behalf of all Kazakhs, and while talking with you, I am in every way distancing myself from the general thoughts of all Kazakhs, unlike you I personally tell you that you are a Russophobe... and you move your ideas from all Kazakhs
    Soviet power essentially consisted of ethnic Slavs (I'm not talking about the years of the revolution), and many decisions were dictated by ethnic considerations.
    what are you saying ...? What else do you agree on? Soviet power cannot consist of an ethnos (read what an ethnos is) ... it's all too early to say the feudal form of government - it consisted of ethnic Germans ... And the main persecution of Kazakhstan ... between 1924-1953. also implemented by the Slavic ethnic group?
    The vast majority of Kazakhs are far from the ideas of nationalism and intolerance! This is absolutely contrary to the Kazakh mentality.
    you really are not asking for it ...
  • Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 4 July 2013 04: 11 New
    -2
    Объясняю про казахов и их особенности. Казахи - монолитная нация. Голова у казахов устроена с одинаковым мировосприятием. И казах с казахом никогда не будут враждовать. "Казах с казахом не воюет" - кредо нашей нации. Любой казах может сказать, что он думает, как большинство казахов. Даже если встретятся два казаха с разными точками зрения, в нужный момент они будут думать в одном направлении. В этом смысле мы отличаемся от русских, которые скорее развяжут братоубийственную войну прежде чем согласятся с оппонентом. Казахи предпочтут компромисс с единокровником. "Все казахи - друг другу родственники" - второе кредо казахов. И поскольку unity для казахов выше личной точки зрения, и поскольку казахи предпочтут согласиться с казахом-оппонентом вместо того, чтобы дубасить его по голове (особенно когда рядом есть неказах), то в большинстве случаев, всякий казах может считать, что он говорит от имени всех казахов. Спор между казахами всегда имеет черту, после которой казахи будут иметь общую точку зрения, или перестанут, как минимум спорить. Менталитет такой. Поэтому казахи - сплоченная нация. Поднять на дыбы или общее дело всех казахов (киргизов, монголов, башкир) - легкая задача. У нас нет поговорок типа "моя юрта с краю". Все всегда заодно.

    Советская власть (я про управленцев) состояла практически из одних славян и обрусевших. Что тут дальше-то спорить? Инородцев были единицы. А мусульман (по происхождению) вообще практически не было. Много знаете казахов, татар, башкир, якутов, калмыков, таджиков и прочих в парт.номенклатуре высшего звена? Неуж-то все тупые были до такой степени, что советское образование не могло вытащить азиатцев из болота отсталости? Давай не будем валять дурака. Вся власть в СССР находилась в руках этнических славян, в первую очередь русских. Были евреи сначала, но их еще при Сталине жестко "загасили".
    Я мог бы понять Вас, если бы говорили что-то вроде: "мы, русские, построили Байконур, правда мы же и казахов в 32-33 годах умертвили шибко, это вина нашего народа" - тогда бы я увидел и стремление нести ответственность. А так - вижу только бегство от ответственности и желание присвоить те заслуги, которые этому народу не принадлежат, а принадлежат Кремлю.
    З.Ы. Считаете меня русофобом и националистом?))) Да ради бога, тут и админы так думают, они тоже люди, и тоже обижаются, когда казахи не врубаются, за что мы должны быть "благодарными" русским и почему же в таком случае русские "не виноваты" в катастрофах, случавшихся с казахским этносом в период нахождения в составе России/СССР. Очень простая и удобная позиция у некоторых русских в этом вопросе.
    We do not consider Russians to be responsible neither for achievements, nor for crimes and mistakes of the Soviet government. It is only in your head that the Kazakhs have any claims to the Russian people))))
  • papss
    papss 5 July 2013 23: 25 New
    -1
    I apologize for not answering you right away ... well, it's too late ... than never. I see that you are progressing, unfortunately not for the better, as an interlocutor you are not interesting to me, you are interesting to me as a sick person (this is not an insult, only for health) ... well, I will not torment, in order
    Казахи - монолитная нация. Голова у казахов устроена с одинаковым мировосприятием. И казах с казахом никогда не будут враждовать. "Казах с казахом не воюет" - кредо нашей нации.
    , you have already fallen from the monolith of the nation ... since your president shows the exact opposite to you, saying that he fell ... I think to upset yourself with a lie, so you ...
    "Все казахи - друг другу родственники" - второе кредо казахов. И поскольку единство для казахов выше личной точки зрения, и поскольку казахи предпочтут согласиться с казахом-оппонентом вместо того, чтобы дубасить его по голове (особенно когда рядом есть неказах), то в большинстве случаев, всякий казах может считать, что он говорит от имени всех казахов.
    , this is your method to take and allow yourself to speak from all Kazakhs ... Do you want a parallel? I’ll bring you ... in a madhouse, patients, too, using a sick creed proclaim themselves Napoleon on behalf of all Frenchmen ... By the way, the word creed - use correctly, creed, ideology proper, and a look at these or other things ... I gave you your creed to you Yesterday - you are Russophobe to the bone marrow ...
    Still, I can tell you. reading what you write, I come to the conclusion ... that the nationalist ... in terms of the letter, you even the folklore of the nation, turn against the nation itself ... original ...
    У нас нет поговорок типа "моя юрта с краю". Все всегда заодно.
    и хотя то что вы перефразировали украинскую поговорка, я не советовал бы вам судить о народах по ним...Для ликбеза, дам ещё "или волю добыть или дома не бывать"...и вообще, у вас нация казах - не имеет отрицательных моментов, перечислять я не буду...утомлюсь...именно по этому, вы идейно уже фюрер...и заметьте пишу вам...и ничего не говорю о русских восславляя их...
  • papss
    papss 5 July 2013 23: 26 New
    0
    Using the example of the Soviet government ... you showed that, to put it mildly, you are floating in the history and concept of its terms ...
    Soviet power (I'm talking about managers) consisted almost of the Slavs and Russified.
    Soviet power is the power of workers and peasants ... I understand what you were talking about when writing managers ... and I’m not fooling with you, but there were educated and competent people from the more literate central Russia in the administration.
    Was it really all stupid to such an extent that the Soviet education could not get the Asians out of the swamp of backwardness?
    yes, mind you wrote so ... And you should have known. You probably take the backlog in the formation of pre-revolutionary Russia and the first five-year plans of Soviet power as a fairy tale. And the war delayed this process. The Soviet Union, literally until the 80s, it eliminated illiteracy ... And when it was liquidated, people from the local community became managers ... And you can’t argue ... I’ll tell you with confidence that from the mid-60s, the Communist Party of the Kazakh SSR consisted of mainly Kazakhs
    then I would see the desire to bear responsibility.
    , well, you are bent ... I wrote above about your negative progress ... You are not the Lord God, to repent and be responsible before you ... Moreover, as a person blinded only by hatred ... you often break down, say tales reinforced by a smart word ...
    Do you consider me Russophobe and nationalist?
    Yes ... I just don’t think you really are both. Do you know why? I will say the most important thing ... I thought you understood me yesterday ...the fact that you want the truth and repentance of the entire Russian people (maybe by the way, it should be), from one, two arguers with you on this resource gives you both a Russophobe and a nationalistAnd imagine that you would be endowed with the power of Hitler, Stalin ... and at least Nazarbayev? That was? I'm scared to think ...
  • Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 14 July 2013 12: 08 New
    -2
    Quote: papss
    I see that you are progressing, unfortunately not for the better, as an interlocutor you are not interesting to me, you are interesting to me as a sick person

    Это тебе надо лечиться, раз не понимаешь смысла того, что тебе говорят. Налепил ты х.ерню вместо ответа, сам сочинил ерунду, сам ее доказываешь, сам с этим споришь, сам сидишь рукоблудствуешь перед монитором. Ты, хр.енов "врач", лучше о своем здоровье побеспокойся. А у конеедов проблем со здоровьем и генетикой нету.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 23: 49 New
    +1
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Suffering from autism

    Is this also related to radiation? without any tricks, there is a medical report on a causal relationship.
    the topic is extremely sensitive, and when you consider that 98% of people involved in it do not know how gamma radiation differs from beta or alpha, they confuse bombs with charges, then I'm sorry
  • Lopatov
    Lopatov 3 July 2013 22: 14 New
    +2
    А где ещё есть места достаточно близкие от Урала и при этом достаточно засушливые, чтобы при испытаниях не произошло заражения грунтовых вод и достаточно удалённые от "вероятных друзей"?

    By the way, the tests were carried out not only in Kazakhstan. Novaya Zemlya, Totsky training ground.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 3 July 2013 22: 18 New
    +1
    Quote: teodorh
    my question is why during the ussr a nuclear testing ground was created on our territory

    Well, judging by the question, the question of your not-so-cleverness becomes clear, not only did you teach history, it’s not clear, but you also skipped geography
    and as for the test of nuclear weapons, let it be known that they were conducted not only in the Kazakh SSR
  • Cat
    Cat 3 July 2013 17: 44 New
    +7
    Quote: Jarserge
    . Moldavians will disappear from the face of the earth as mammoths will remain only Romanians.


    The old Chukchi dies ...
    He called his eldest son to himself, said to him:
    - A son! Save the fire! Fire is heat, this is food, this is life! Got it
    - Got it, father.
    Calls the middle son:
    - And you, son, take care of the water! Because without water, as they say, neither tuda nor syuda.
    “Good, father.”
    Summon the Chukchi Junior:
    - And you, son, take care of the Moldovans.
    - Well, but ... why should I take care of them ???
    - Because when the last Moldavian disappears, we Chukchi will turn out to be the most stupid people on Earth ...
  • Egoza
    Egoza 3 July 2013 20: 58 New
    +1
    Quote: Jarserge
    It would be nice for Moldavians to know their story.

    Yes, there would have been one Kotovsky with a brigade.
  • pensioner
    pensioner 3 July 2013 17: 49 New
    +1
    Quote: avt
    How do you imagine this technically in the absence of a border with Transnistria?

    This is all technically solved. We already have one enclave. It will be 2. If Russia joins Transnistria, there will immediately be technical solutions for how it will manage it. And Ukraine, no matter how anyone is interested in good relations with Russia. Although everything is wonderful for her now (as I understood for myself over the past week), quarreling with Russia is like death to her. Well, or a serious illness ...
  • pensioner
    pensioner 3 July 2013 17: 56 New
    0
    But the fact that Moldova and Romania signed a similar agreement ... Who said that Moldovans love Putin? Who chose those who sign such agreements? So: don't ...
  • papss
    papss 3 July 2013 17: 57 New
    +4
    [quote = Manager] [quote = sumcream56] What are these Romanians? This is the Germans! [/ Quote]
    Это Румынский СС[/quot[quote=teodorh][quote=Jarserge]Им так хочется побыть гражданами "второго сорта"[/quote]
    Как будто при СССР они были гражданами "первого сорта"[/quote]
    I would be silent ... everyone worked in posts and directors ... no one made them second grade ... according to their education ... Well, as a keepsake, the names of all the leaders of the MSSR ... But under the new government, you are you won’t be like half the Romanians in the government, as there is no Moldovan leader Chisinau ...
  • Prometheus
    Prometheus 3 July 2013 17: 59 New
    +3
    It is necessary to turn Romania into Wallachia. Annex the Moldavian region and Bukovina to Russia, and give Transylvania to the Magyars.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 3 July 2013 18: 06 New
    +2
    Romania I think it’s not worth it to discuss it on such a site .. (they will get the full poke and NATO will not help)
  • Ivanovich47
    Ivanovich47 3 July 2013 18: 10 New
    +6
    Quote: Today, about 170 of thousands of Russian citizens and 100 of thousands of citizens of Ukraine live in Transnistria. This is the territory of the Russian Orthodox Church.
    We must not abandon our compatriots in trouble. For moral support, the song: We are Russians.
  • piotr534
    piotr534 3 July 2013 18: 21 New
    0
    Если молдоване от "большого" ума решаться наступить на грузинские грабли, результат будет схожим. Наши миротворцы будут обязаны защищать сторону подвергшуюся нападению. НАТО за молдован не впишется,даже при участии румын,нет правовой основы. Мне кажется ЕС уже смирился со статусом Приднестровья,но под давлением Румынии даёт им возможность по куражиться на последок,что бы потрепать нервы России,вдруг обломятся какие нибудь преференции.
  • sumcream56
    sumcream56 3 July 2013 18: 23 New
    -9
    It is best to return to the borders of 1939. Transnistria -Ukraine. A piece of Odessa region - Moldova with Romania. As for the ram over Odessa, the Romanian of the Soviet bomber, what kind of chernukha is it? This is evidence that not all Romanians are cowardly gypsies. And the participation of the Romanian armies in the war against Germany since August 1944 is also a dirty trick? By the way, even before this, a division named after Todor Vladimirirescu was formed from captured Romanians, who fought on the side of the USSR.
    1. papss
      papss 3 July 2013 18: 38 New
      0
      And the participation of the Romanian armies in the war against Germany since August 1944 is also a dirty thing?
      Anyone who says chernukha ... is not informed ...
      At the end of 1944-1945, the Romanian ground forces very actively fought as part of the Soviet fronts. In addition to the already mentioned Bucharest-Arad operation and the Debrecen operation, the Romanian armies participated in the Budapest operation, in the Western Carpathian operation, in the Prague operation. The total losses of the Romanian troops after August 1944 amounted to 129 people, of which 316 people died, died from wounds and disappeared, 37 were wounded and sick. [208]

      http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Википедия Румыния во ВТОРОЙ Мировой войне.
  • sky17176
    sky17176 3 July 2013 18: 25 New
    +2
    Well, the West showed its face. What successes in the negotiation process can be discussed if the Moldovans are practically preparing for the force option, and the whole world is talking about the need to change the Russian peacekeepers. If Russia leaves Transnistria, there will be a 1992 variant with larger negative aspects. Then the Moldavians will unite with the Romanians and take away Odessa, and what will happen next.
    So where is European security, is it not obvious that this treaty is directed against Transnistria and Ukraine.
  • sumcream56
    sumcream56 3 July 2013 18: 36 New
    -2
    I’ll clarify so as not to be unfounded. Allaces.ru ›cgi-bin / s2.cgi / rom / publ / 01.dat
    Romanian aviation in World War II
    © M.Zhirokhov, 2004-03-30
    The author is grateful to Alexander Stratulat (Chisinau, Moldova) for the assistance provided.
    "Так, младший лейтенант авиатор Василе Клару из 2-ой Истребительной Флотилии, в воздушном поединке с шестью самолетами противника, израсходовав все боеприпасы, таранил своим IAR-80 истребитель противника. Подвиг летчика был по достоинству оценен - посмертно он был награжден самой высокой наградой румынской армии - Военным Орденом "Михай Витязу".Над территорией Чехословакии румынские летчики воевали 144 дня.
    In total, until the end of the war (on May 12, 1945), the 1st Corps accounted for 8542 sorties and the destruction of 101 enemy aircraft (along with anti-aircraft gunners). Losses amounted to 176 aircraft shot down by fighters, air defense and crashed in numerous accidents in the conditions of bad weather in winter - spring of 1945.
    Конкретные данные есть только по участию "хеншелей", по остальным - данные отрывочные. Так вот, за пять месяцев боевых действий, с 19 декабря 1944 г. по 11 мая 1945 г. летчики 41-й штурмовой эскадрильи ("хеншели") выполнили 422 самолето-вылета, налетав 370 часов и сбросив 130 тонн бомб. В результате действий эскадрильи было рассеяно 66 колонн войск противника, уничтожено 185 автомобилей и 66 конных повозок, на железнодорожных станциях пилоты "Хеншелей разбили" 13 поездов, среди прочего уничтоженного имущества врага - артиллерийские орудия, минометы, пулеметы. Потери эскадрильи составили восемь штурмовиков HS-129B. Летчики "штук" только в Словакии совершили 107 боевых вылетов, налетав 374 часов. Они сбросили 210 тонн бомб на 37 железнодорожных станций и 36 позиций противника. В уничтоженные были записаны 3 танка, 61 грузовик и 6 зенитных батарей.
    During the entire war, the Romanian Air Force lost 4172 people, of whom 2977 were fighting for Germany (972 dead, 1167 wounded and 838 missing) and 1195 fighting against Germany (356, 371 and 468, respectively). However, the war ended a bit later for the Romanian aviators . On May 11, the Romanians performed strikes against parts of the Russian Liberation Army of General Vlasov. The Vlasovites had nothing to lose, and they desperately resisted in the forests near Hungarian Broad. On the evening of May 11, 1945, airplanes (several bombers under cover of four Bf-109Gs) returned from the last combat mission of the Romanian Air Force in World War II.
    The end of the war the Royal Romanian Air Force met even in worse condition than June 22, 1941. In fact, the aviators were left alone with their problems amid the complete cessation of the supply of spare parts for aircraft. The future was foggy ..
    Кстати по уставу НАТО, нападение на любого члена НАТО означает немедленное вступление в войну всего блока." А вот Украина никакую помощь Приднестровью не окажет, не надейтесь. Эта страна еще худшая политическая проститутка,чем Румыния.По мнению многих авторов, румынская оккупация Одессы в сравнении с немецкой в других городах была "сказкой".
    1. Day 11
      Day 11 3 July 2013 19: 01 New
      -2
      I found a video on Romanian women-pilots in World War II on the Eastern Front.
    2. piotr534
      piotr534 4 July 2013 00: 45 New
      0
      By the way, according to the NATO charter, an attack on any member of NATO means the immediate entry into the war of the entire bloc.
      In this case, no one is going to attack Romania, but some power units or even Romanian troops on the territory of Moldova or Transnistria hypothetically entered into an armed confrontation with Russian peacekeepers, this is a completely different song that has nothing to do with the NATO charter. And finally, Russian peacekeepers in Transnistria have a UN mandate and their direct task is to prevent a clash between the warring parties and protect civilians. hi
  • papss
    papss 3 July 2013 18: 52 New
    +3
    according to the NATO charter, an attack on any member of NATO means the immediate entry into the war of the entire bloc
    , I forgot to add, I need the approval of NATO, so that it enters Transnistria ...there are not small fools and not small foolsto get into this ... Well, about Ukraine and its prostitution, this is true until its interests are affected ... Ukrainian Slavs will die ... the situation is changing dramatically ... Yes, and yet ... to whom Ukraine doesn’t understand the appetite of Romania ... swallows Prenistria ... wants Odessa and Chernivtsi ... so do not calm yourself ...
    1. sumcream56
      sumcream56 4 July 2013 10: 59 New
      -2
      As for the population of Northern Bukovina, the Chernivtsi region, by the way, is the birthplace of Sofia Rotaru, 45% of the population are Romanians. Here would be to make an exchange-Northern Bukovina first entered the USSR in 1940. And Transnistria, unlike Bessarabia, has never been a part of Wallachia and Moldova. By the way, Moldova has never been a special nation. Bessarabians are part of the Romanian nation. As for Transnistria. Legally, even Russia considers it to be Moldavian territory. Given the correlation between the population and the desire of Moldovans to wash toilets in Europe, two-thirds in a referendum will vote for unification with Romania, unless the Romanians want it, and Ukraine has already lost Romania to the Snake Island in an international court. Yanukovych will raise his country against NATO? Isn't that funny for you? Well, the orange ones, if they return to power, they will generally lick everything from NATO.
      1. papss
        papss 4 July 2013 12: 51 New
        0
        By the way, Moldova has never been a special nation
        what do you smoke? But what about the Principality of Moldova? With his story? The thing is that it has not been around for a long time ... and that it just served as the creature that united Wallachia with Romania ... only this does not allow us to say that Moldova was not ... Meaning do not undermine ... showing that there was no Moldovans ... you cross out the history of the Principality of Moldavia ... starting to study the issue from the history of Romanians. Bessarabians? Original ... like cabbage rolls ...
        Для "умных" - http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B4%D0%B0%D0%B2%D1%81%D0%BA%D0
        %BE%D0%B5_%D0%BA%D0%BD%D1%8F%D0%B6%D0%B5%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B2%D0%BE
        As for Transnistria. Legally, even Russia considers it to be Moldavian territory
        and whoever argues, yes, Moldavian ... no, Romanian ... Here you entered the legal side ... then 45% of the Romanian population (who themselves, over the past 5 years, are becoming citizens of Romania accelerated, like Moldovans, became Romanians), in your opinion, gives them the right to chop off a piece from Ukraine ... or make an exchange ... just ask 55% of the remaining Western Ukrainians ... they will answer you ... You probably haven’t been there, but I'm frequent there guest ... and knowledge in history, that Romania, that you do not have Moldova ...
        Given the ratio of population to the desire of Moldova to wash toilets in Europe
        , you do not decide for Moldovans, you simply do not have such a right .. where are you washing yourself?
        Ukraine has already lost the Snake Island in Romania to an international court
        lost ... a big word. The dispute was long ... since the days of the USSR. And there are such things that need to be thrown off ... they are not worth it. Only now, in such lush heads like yours, let the thought creep in that everything is so simple. What are you all the time NATO, NATO ... what kind of NATO, do not cover the aspirations of the Romanian clique to chop off lands and the aspirations of NATO ... There are of course those eagles too ... But they are friends with the head ... and get the fire - you will personally extinguish the Romanian lives. ..and how with the island it’s not a ride with everyone ...
  • Constantine
    Constantine 3 July 2013 19: 14 New
    +4
    Moldovan, apparently, did not have any national pride at all, since they are ready to lay down tiles and tiles in European apartments and erase their own country. It’s just not conceivable and I don’t have words to rate this act briefly.

    On the other hand. In the case of Transnistria. If they are handed over to Moldova, then this may turn us away from those who look at Russia as a savior, and there are more, I dare say, more. In other words, all work to strengthen the country's image and positions in the foreign policy arena will be in vain because Russia will look like a paper tiger, which is not acceptable.

    At the same time, I believe that our management, having more extensive information, will make the right decisions, as it does with respect to ATS, for example.
  • surveyor
    surveyor 3 July 2013 19: 19 New
    0
    Interesting article.
    War will not be they are not really id *** you. soldier
  • ed65b
    ed65b 3 July 2013 19: 21 New
    +1
    Manstein’s discussions on the order of the Romanian army complement
    cretinize the memories of an officer of the Wehrmacht, commander of a sapper battalion
    Major G. Waelz. In his book “The Soldiers Who Are Betrayed,” dedicated to
    the battles for Stalingrad, he described the foundations in the Romanian company: the company commander
    “He gives out the food. He has his own special system here. First of all,
    the officers' bowler hats — meat and beans, almost without liquid. Then
    non-commissioned officers. They catch the remains of the thick from the boiler. And all that
    stays - warm tasteless water goes ordinary. That’s the rule ... Instead of-
    the beating that gets the food ... The soldier will still get his portion of the beatings - not-
    it is important whether he is wounded or sick, frostbite or even exposed
    amputations. It is clear to me that the fighting spirit of soldiers does not rise from this, only
    hatred of officers is pouring ... Romanian peasant guys have no
    chickpeas of rest, they are busy from morning to night. They not only have to serve and
    to please their company and platoon commanders, but to get the most for them
    conceivable things to create coziness in officer dugouts. Moreover,
    entire platoons are engaged in a matter which ordinary death cannot think of.
    ny ... Today, 40 soldiers are busy building a special stable for
    mitzey captain racehorse mare Mademoiselle. It is more spacious and warmer than in
    any shelter for soldiers ... "

    It is interesting to have a change or everything is the same.
  • True
    True 3 July 2013 19: 42 New
    -1
    Between Moldova and the Black Sea there is a small isthmus of Ukraine. If you fit the ships of the Black Sea Fleet, then it is quite possible to naughty rockets in Moldova wink
    1. Igoriok222
      Igoriok222 3 July 2013 23: 58 New
      +3
      Is it okay that about 500000 Russians live in Moldova? And what did ordinary Moldovans do to you? You can exterminate power, but common people are not to blame. You are too cool on statements!
  • KG_patriot_last
    KG_patriot_last 3 July 2013 19: 51 New
    +3
    The whole world is divided on the contrary and new countries appear, and Moldovans voluntarily refuse their country ... I think the Kurds and Uyghurs are a little bit a ** e from the actions of this nation ...
    1. individual
      individual 3 July 2013 21: 09 New
      +2
      ... And everyone wants to be great: either a great caliphate, then a great neighbourhood horn, now a great gypsy camp. am
      1. KG_patriot_last
        KG_patriot_last 3 July 2013 22: 37 New
        0
        Yes, the greatest Romanian country will in any case be a regional power only. But the Arab caliphate should not be underestimated. The fact is that this is a supranational project of the Arabs, theoretically even France can turn out to be an enclave ... So in this regard, you need to keep your eyes open ...
  • GEO
    GEO 3 July 2013 19: 55 New
    0
    Quote: Alexander Romanov
    Quote: seasoned
    It’s time for Russia to join Transnistria,

    Together with Kishenev soldier
    By the way, and that there is an army in Romania, I have never seen brave Romanian soldiers request

    А ты спроси у своих дедов, они тебе про них расскажут как они "воевали" в 43-м под Сталинградом laughing
    from a Romanian soldier, like from th ... a bullet.
    Let them step on the Georgian rake ...
  • MIKHAN
    MIKHAN 3 July 2013 19: 56 New
    +1
    Quote: True
    Between Moldova and the Black Sea there is a small isthmus of Ukraine. If you fit the ships of the Black Sea Fleet, then it is quite possible to naughty rockets in Moldova

    Двух пьяных прапорщиков в двух танках достаточно ...с аудиосистемами с песней " Вставай Страна огромная вставай на смертный бой..!!" Паника обеспечена ..(шутка конечно и все же ....))))
  • ObnaPur
    ObnaPur 3 July 2013 19: 59 New
    +1
    But what, the Romanian army is the most combat-ready, invincible, and does it have any victories to boast of?
  • GEO
    GEO 3 July 2013 20: 00 New
    0
    словосочетание "румынская армия" вызывает у меня когнитивный диссонанс...
  • Darth Revan
    Darth Revan 3 July 2013 20: 03 New
    +1
    I do not think this is possible. Russian bear - he is a harsh beast.
  • GEO
    GEO 3 July 2013 20: 18 New
    +4
    Quote: sumcream56
    It is best to return to the borders of 1939. Transnistria -Ukraine. A piece of Odessa region - Moldova with Romania. As for the ram over Odessa, the Romanian of the Soviet bomber, what kind of chernukha is it? This is evidence that not all Romanians are cowardly gypsies. And the participation of the Romanian armies in the war against Germany since August 1944 is also a dirty trick? By the way, even before this, a division named after Todor Vladimirirescu was formed from captured Romanians, who fought on the side of the USSR.

    and you are not fucked up, a gray-winged eagle, scattered Russian lands ???