Military Review

The new German tank "Tiger V" (in the text of the "Bulletin of the tank industry" № 10 / 1944 g.)

131
The new German tank "Tiger V" (in the text of the "Bulletin of the tank industry" № 10 / 1944 g.)
German heavy tank Pz.Kpfw. VIB "Tiger-B" No. 502, captured on August 13, 1944 during the fighting on the Sandomierz bridgehead. On the barrel of a gun in memory of the commander of the 2nd tank battalion of the 53rd Guards tank Brigade Major A. G. Korobov, inscribed "Glory to Korobov."



In August, 1944 was captured on the right bank of the Vistula by new Red Tiger V tanks, manufactured by MAN.
According to the testimony of prisoners, the new German heavy tank "Tiger V" in the German army is called the "Royal Tiger". However, in the instructions for tank maintenance manuals found in captured tanks, the name “Royal Tiger” is not confirmed.

Tiger V tanks are available in two versions: commander and linear. The main difference between a commander tank and a line one is the installation of two radio stations in it, one in the tank control compartment (30WSA transmitter, MwEc receiver), the other in the tank tower (10 Wse transmitter, UkWe receiver) and three separate antennas enabling simultaneous two-way communication to receive and transmit over a distance from 2 to 50 km. The commander’s tank has 50 rounds of ammunition, the linear one has at least 70.

The Tigr-V tanks represent a further modernization of the main German tank TV Panther with the introduction of changes in the direction of increasing the booking and increasing the caliber of the main armament.

For comparison, the new heavy tanks with previously released below are comparative tactical and technical characteristics of heavy German tanks and self-propelled guns (see Table 1).

1 table. TTX heavy German tanks

Parameters

T-V1 "Tiger N"

"Tiger In"

"Tiger P" ("Ferdinand")

TV (-Panther ")

1. Tank weight, t

56

68

67-70

45

2. Crew

5

5

5-6

5

3. Dimensions by body (mm);

e) length

6220

7510

7000

6900

6) - // - with a gun, turn. astern

8360

9965

-

9170

c) - // - with a gun, turn forward

8420

10416

8180

9010

d) max width, according to wheel arches

3600

3750

3430

3430

e) stroke width on tracks:

640 mm

-

-

3320

-

660 mm

-

3270

-

3280

725 mm

3600

-

-

-

800 mm

-

3600

-

-

e) full height of the tank

2940

3075

3000

2910

g) clearance

front

380

492

500

430

behind

525

507

-

-

4. Armor protection (mm / hail):

a) top front sheet

100 / 8 °

150 / 50 °

210 / 32 °

85 / 55 °

6) lower front sheet

100 / 27 °

100 / 55 °

85 / 42 °

65 / 55 °

c) upper side sheet

82 / 0 °

80 / 25 °

85 / 0 °

45 / 30 °

d) bottom side sheet

62 / 0 °

80 / 0 °

85 / 0 °

45 / 0 °

d) feed sheet

82 / 8 °

80 / 30 °

85 / 0 °

45 / 50 °

e) hull roof

28

40

45

17

g) the forehead of the tower

100 / 0 °

1 IN / 10 °

200 / 20 °

100 / 10 °

h) the side of the tower

82 / 0 °

80 / 20 °

85 / 30 °

45 / 25 °

5. Armament

a) gun caliber

88 mm

88 mm

88 mm

75 mm

b) type KwK36r.

KwK 36

StuK 43

KwK 43

KwK 42

c) barrel length, cal

56

68,3

68,3

70

d) beg. BB speed, m / s

820

1000

1000

900

e) machine guns

2хМГ-34

2хМГ-42

-

2хМГ-34

e) mortar for LH

6

1 (swivel)

-

6

g) shot. to gun

86

50-70

38

80

h) sight

telescopes.,

her tel

blues

telescope,

breaking binocular

breaking monk

panorama

breaking. binoculars.

i) elevation angle

+ 15 °

+ -15 °

+ 15 °

+ 18 °

k) declination angle

-8 °

-In °

-7,5 °

-8 °

6. Engine

a) brand

MaybahN210

MaybahN1.-230

2хMebach HL-120

Maybach HL-230

b) compression ratio

7,5

6,8

6,5

7,5

c) max, power, hp

650

700

2x300

700

d) at rpm

3200

3200

3000

3200

e) explo. power, hp

600

e) specific. power, ps / t

10,7-11,6

10,3

9,1-9,6

14,4-15,5

7. Udl. pressure kg, cm3

1,02

1,02

1,13

0,84

8. Support rinks on board

12

Э

5

8

9. Speed ​​data (km / h)

a) max on the highway (rasch)

44

41,5

21

50,0

b) average peres.

15-20

55-20

9-12

15-18

10. Capacity of fuel tanks, l

510

360

1100

760

11. Fuel consumption per 1 km of track, l

a) on the highway

3,7

5

-

-

b) by the side road

5,5

7

6

5,95

12. Power reserve, km

a) lo highway

140

170

-

150

b) by the side road

90

120

180

120

13. Transmission:

a) location

front

front

the back

front

b) type of transmission

mechanical;

will occupy. from T-VIH;

electric;

mechanical longitudinal;

c) CAT

Eight ahead and 4 back

Eight forward and 4 back preselectoron control

Transmission from the engine to the drive wheel mechanical

Seven forward and one backward

d) estimated speeds at 3000 rpm

I transfer

2,84

2,54

-

II transfer

4,23

3,33

-

III transfer

6,2

5,62

-

IV transmission

9,2

8,33

-

V transfer

14,1

12,75

-

VI transmission

22,3

18,05

-

VII transfer

30,4

27,32

-

VIII transmission

45,4

41,5

-

e) turning mechanism

Special planetary

Planetary type T-VIH. Allows min. turning radius 2,08 m. Double steering control through hydraulic alignment and levers.

The rotation is carried out by creating a difference in torque of the traction motors. With sharp turns mechanically brakes acc. caterpillar

Planetary servohydraulic and mechanical driven control levers.



The device tank "Tiger"



A) General device tank

The overall layout of the tank "Tiger V" is the same as that of the tank "Tiger N" and "Panther". The engine with cooling systems, power and starting means is located aft of the tank.

The engine, cooling system (fans and radiators), air filters and fire-fighting equipment (carbon dioxide automatic fire extinguishers), heating means (thermosyphon heater) and starting means (inertial starter and direct-acting starter) are entirely borrowed from the Panther tank.

The transmission, main clutch, gearbox and control mechanism of the tank are located in front of the tank in the control compartment. Torque from the engine to the transmission is transmitted using a propeller shaft, located under the rotating floor of the tower along the tank.

To the left of the gearbox are the tank control mechanisms, control devices and the driver's seat. To the right of the gearbox there is a MG-42 machine gun with a telescopic sight, a radio station and a seat for the gunner-radio operator. In the center of the tank there is a turret with a rotating floor, on which seats are mounted, a turret hydraulic mechanism and a compressor.

The 88-mm KWK-43 cannon mounted in the turret is paired with an 7,92-mm MG-42 machine gun located on the right side of the cannon. On the left side of the gun along the tank there are fire control mechanisms (steering wheels for lifting and turning mechanisms, electric drive, current pulsator), monocular telescopic sight with varying light intensity, foot pedals to rotate the turret from the hydraulic drive and foot machine gun; behind the shooter is placed in the commander's turret tank commander.

Tank "Tigr-B" on the test. NIBT polygon


The tank commander has a retractable periscope - reconnaissance (length 1 m) for adjusting the fire and a foot control for turning the turret with the help of a hydraulic mechanism.

To the right of the gun is loader. He is a radio operator in the commander tank.

The chassis of the tank in its scheme is similar to the tanks "Tiger" and "Panther" with some changes in the design and location of the lower support rollers.

BOOKING TANK "TIGR-V"

number

Name

Thickness mm

The angle of inclination to the vertical is hail.

Diam exe on the outside. on top of

Diam excellent inside surface

2

Front lower

100

55

3.2

3.3

3

Airborne upper

80

25

3 6

3.7

4

Onboard

80

0

3.4

3,6

5

Aft

80

30

3.5

3.7

6

Roof

40

90

3.4

3.5

7

Bottom before.

40

90

3.S

3.6

8

Bottom bottom.

26

90

3.6

3.6

9

Frontal Tower

180

10

3.8

3.9

10

Airborne tower

80

20

3.85

3.05

1 1

Aft tower

80

10

3.9

3.3

12

Roof bash. before.

40

80

3.4

3.5

13

Roof bash. n

40

90

3.4

3.5

14

Roof bash. ass

40

85

3.4

3.5

IS

The wall of commands, bash.

90

22-69

3.5

3.6

16

Team roof, bash

22

90

3.3

3.4



Scheme of armored hull tank "Tigr-B"


B) The hull and tower of the tank

The hull is entirely borrowed from the Panther tank and is made of medium-hard steel armor (3,4 - 3,6 Brinell diameter ball print). The joints are made in a spike with austenite electrodes.

The front sheet of the tank is solid and has only a ball mount for a machine gun.

The inspection instruments of the driver and machine-gunner are periscopic and mounted in the roof of the tank. For the convenience of removing the transmission from the tank and the front part of the roof, there is a large secret hatch in which the driver and the radio operator are identical in design. The design of these hatches is the same as that of the Panther tank. The emergency hatch is located on the bottom in front of the shooter-radio operator seat.
The upper branch of the track and the vertical part of the hull are covered with a six-millimeter bulwark that serves as a fender liner at the same time.
The tank tower is welded from rolled armored steel. The diameter of the tower epaulet in the light - 1800 mm. The shape of the turret, unlike the generally accepted in German tank building (unbalanced type), is conical with a stern niche, similar to the turret of the T-34 tank of the 1941 release,

The gun in the tower is mounted through a hatch in the niche of the tower. The mask of the gun, unlike the generally accepted ones in German tank building, is spherical and is booked by a cast armor bell put on the barrel of the gun. The roof of the tower bends forward and backward.

A characteristic feature of the hull and turret is the absence of any kind of hatches and viewing slots in the front and side of the tank.
The commander's turret is similar to the turret of the Panther tank of the 1944 release, with the difference that its dimensions are significantly reduced.

The constructive modification of the commander towers of German tanks attracts attention. Starting with a rather complicated turret on a T-III tank, the Germans in 1944 came to a simplified cast turret with seven prismatic viewing devices. Simplification of the towers did not improve visibility, and is apparently the result of cheaper production. The visibility of the latest issue of German tanks has become worse.

The hull and tower of the tank are coated with special coating (paste) of the following composition:

Mineral part: barium sulphate 75,49%, silicon oxide 7,39%, iron oxide 6,76%, zinc oxide 6,62%, calcium oxide 1,28%,
The organic part: the waste of the pulp industry, the so-called sulfite-cellulose liquor, or the mass obtained when cooking wood with a solution of calcium desulfite. The main mass of the coating is organic matter.

The main purpose of the coating is to protect the body from magnetic ammunition (magnetic anti-tank grenades). The secondary purpose is a thermal insulation coating and a means of masking.

B) Armament

The tank’s armament consists of an 88-mm KWK-43 cannon, two MG-42 machine guns of an 7,92-mm caliber and a mortar mounted on the tank’s roof for throwing flue and fragmentation mines. A special shoulder strap is welded on the commander's turret, on which a special mobile bracket is mounted to install an anti-aircraft machine gun.

According to its ballistic properties, a gun is equivalent to a gun of a self-propelled gun - the “Ferdinand”.

The use of a unitary projectile increases the rate of fire and is a positive quality tank.

Unlike the Tigr and Panther tanks, the Tigr B tank is equipped with a monocular breaking sight with a variable aperture and field of view depending on the firing distance.

The sight has the following characteristics:

magnification - 2,5 and 5;

field of view - 25gr and 12,5gr;

exit pupil diameter - 6 mm and 3 mm;

removal of the exit pupil - 23 mm and 23 m.

The shot from the cannon is made with the help of an electric igniter, which receives energy from the battery, or an electric impulse device mounted on the tower chase in front of the shooter. To adjust the fire, the tank commander has a special retractable periscope reconnaissance with which you can monitor the tracer of the projectile, or its rupture, despite the dust cloud raised by the muzzle brake air when fired from a KWK-43 cannon.

The gun is balanced by a special balancing mechanism located in the turret on the right side of the gun. The bore after the shot is blown with compressed air, for which a special compressor is installed in the tower.

The disadvantage of the installation of weapons are great efforts on the handles of the lifting mechanism.

The tower is rotated by manual (mechanical) and special hydraulic drives. Rotation of the tower from the hydraulic drive is possible only with the engine running, the speed of rotation depends on the speed of the engine crankshaft.

Hydraulic drive control is not convenient enough, and its design is complicated and cumbersome.

In the stowed position, the gun is locked from the inside of the tank at the maximum elevation angle.

General views in the hull of the tank "Tiger-B".


The layout of the mechanisms of the tank "Tigr-V": 1 - engine "Maybach"; 2 - cooling fan; 3 - CAT; 4 - rotation mechanism; 5 - side clutches; 7 - the mechanism of rotation of the tower; 8 - shock absorbers for road wheels.

D) Transmission gearbox

The gearbox of the Tigr V tank is manufactured under the license of Maybach and is the same in design as on the Tigr N tank.
The box has 8 gears forward and one back, Transmission gearbox control is preselector. To shift the gears, it is enough to translate the preselector lever without turning off the main clutch. In the event of a hydraulic servo failure, the gearbox shift control, the main clutch disengagement and the gear shift can be mechanical.

Tank “Tigr-V” is on trial. NIBT polygon


The gearbox of the Tigr V tank is different in appearance and dimensions from the gearbox of the Tigr N tank. A feature of this box is the presence of a radiator that cools the oil. The radiator is placed in a special tank with water that does not have circulation. As a result, the gearbox overheats quickly, making it difficult to control the tank.

D) The rotation mechanism

The Tigr V tank has the same turning mechanism as the Tigr N tank.

The turning mechanism is planetary and provides the tank with good steering over almost any turning radius, but it has the disadvantage of all mechanisms with two degrees of freedom.

The rotation mechanism allows as many turning radii as there are gears in the gearbox.

With roll and various resistances on the tracks, the tank leads away.

The mechanism for design and production technology is complex. The steering mechanism control is servo-hydraulic, with redundant mechanical. Side disc brakes, the same as on Tiger N and Panther tanks.

Driving a Tiger B tank is possible both with the driver’s hatch closed and open. In the latter case, the driver’s seat rises, the servo steering wheel and the accelerator pedal also have a second upper position.

E) Chassis Tank

Suspension sneaker "Tiger B" - torsion bar, individual, on 9 rollers on the side, arranged in a checkerboard pattern (4 inside and 5 outside).
Torsions, in contrast to those previously used on German slippers, are single-type KV tanks. The front and rear rollers on each side have hydraulic shock absorbers located inside the tank. Large diameter track rollers, metal with internal damping, located directly at the wheel brace

The design of the roller of the tank "Tigr-V": 1 - bandage; 2-disk; 3- rubber ring; 4 - tapered inserts; 5 - hub.


The inner row of the roller has additional hubs, on which, apparently, it was supposed to mount the third row of rollers. The caterpillar is small-scale and consists of flat and ridge tracks, with holes for hooking.

Thus, the engagement pitch is equal to the pitch of two tracks of 150 mm each. Such a construction of the track led to a sharp reduction in the number of teeth on the drive wheel and, as a result, to their rapid failure.

Track width - 300 mm. For transportation by train. An additional track is used - 660 mm. The suspension of the tank relative to the track is located one-sidedly (pressed to the sides), as a result of which the tracks work as a console.

G) Additional equipment of the tank

The engine compartment of the tank is equipped with automatic fire extinguishers with a dosing device and thermal closures installed in flammable places. The cylinder with carbon dioxide and clockwork is located in the fighting compartment.

In addition to the carbon dioxide automatic fire extinguisher system, the 3 tetrachloride portable fire extinguisher is installed in the control room.
To facilitate starting in winter conditions, the engine is equipped with a thermostat and a thermosiphon heater, included in the overall engine cooling system. The thermosyphon heater is heated with a blowtorch.

Accumulators of special design are electrically heated for winter conditions; The batteries are heated and recharged on the parking lots of a portable 0,9 HP unit that is in the fighting compartment.

The body of the sneaker has a seal and is adapted to increase the ford overcome.

The device used earlier on the Tigr and Panther tanks for underwater driving on the Tigr I tank is absent.

Vulnerabilities of the Tigr-V tank


Vulnerabilities tank "Tiger"



The Tigr V tank, despite the reinforcement of armor and the sharp increase in weight associated with it, was generally as vulnerable as the Tigr and Panther tanks.

Its most vulnerable point is the undercarriage, which is affected by all types of tank and anti-tank artillery from all aimed fire.

The sides of the turret and the hull of the tank are affected by tank and anti-tank artillery of all calibers, a cumulative projectile from all allowable distances and all available calibers; piercing projectile calibers 45-, 57- and 76-mm from a distance 400 - 800 m; 57-75- and 85-mm armor-piercing projectiles from 700 - 1200 distance.

Larger calibers strike the sides and the stern of the tank from all distances of real fire.

The front part of the tank, the bottom sheet of the hull and the mask are hit by an armor-piercing projectile of 122- and 152-mm caliber from a distance of 1000 - 1500 m.
Machine-gun fire and fire PTR is very effective on the viewing devices, as they have large dimensions, are completely unprotected and difficult to replace after the defeat.

On the undercarriage and on the roof of the tank, mines and anti-tank grenades are effective and efficient.

The Tiger V tank appeared on the battlefield in the summer of 1944 at a difficult time for the Nazis, and they probably relied on the moral effect rather than on the outstanding fighting qualities of the tank.

The haste of the release of this tank on the battlefield is confirmed by the incomplete installation of a number of pipelines to increase the overcoming of fords, the presence on the machine of stickers made on ammonia paper, and the instruction found in the captured tank is typed and largely does not correspond to the tank.

The tank, due to the haste of release, has a large number of design flaws, the main ones being:
1. The onboard transmission is destroyed completely through 250-300 km. Mileage due to insufficient mechanical strength of the bearings.
2. The teeth of the rims of the drive wheels, due to the use of a double track with a single bobbin, wear out completely very quickly and are no longer suitable for further use through 250-300 km.
3. The guide ridges are wedged between the wheels of the support rollers, since the profile change between the disks of the rollers caused by the rubber deformation of the internal damping of the rollers is not taken into account.
4. Gearbox and steering mechanism overheat; hastily supplied tank with water to cool the gearbox oil in the absence of water circulation, does not justify its purpose.
5. The engine, due to the large weight of the tank, is overloaded and also has a tendency to overheat and seize the shaft, as a result of which a number of safety devices are inserted on the machine.

conclusions



The new German tank "Tigr V" is a further development of the tank "Panther" using the transmission of the tank "Tigr N" and weapons "Ferdinand."

The line-up of the tank and its mechanisms do not have anything new in comparison with the previously released tanks.

The general principal disadvantage of the Tigr V tank is its cumbersome size and, as a result, an excessively large weight, which in turn led to low maneuverability, poor tank maneuverability and unreliability in work.

Reservations and weapons of the tank is clearly not consistent with its weight. In the Tigr V tank, the Germans finally switched not only to the T-34 hull form, but also copied its turret, proving once again to the whole world the advantages of the T-34 classic tank hull.

In the tank "Tiger B" noteworthy:
A) carbon dioxide fire fighting automatic fire extinguishing system;
B) monocular breaking prismatic sight with a variable field of view;
B) battery electrical heating and a thermosiphon heater to facilitate engine start in winter conditions.
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  1. Kovrovsky
    Kovrovsky 6 June 2013 08: 46
    +2
    Dangerous adversary! It is good that the Germans had relatively few of them.
    1. Dima190579
      Dima190579 6 June 2013 09: 25
      +3
      For any modification of the T-34, the Nazis had to come up with a new tank. A shelf with drawings of it will be brought to iron there and the war is over.
      1. Bronis
        Bronis 6 June 2013 09: 54
        +5
        Yes, in general, the appearance of the T-34-85 and the "Royal Tiger" - events are parallel and somewhat natural. But this was not the answer to the modification of the 34. Both cars were put into production at the very beginning of 1944. And "Tiger II" took longer to develop, because was a new car, in general. But in some places on old units. Yes, and "ordinary" "Tigers" against 34-ok could act effectively - and for this they were created.
        But the T-34-85 is exactly the answer to the "Tigers" and "Panthers", which themselves were a qualitative answer to the T-34-76 (although earlier modifications of the T-IV with Ausf.F2 and then to Ausf.J).
        1. Vladimirets
          Vladimirets 6 June 2013 10: 32
          11
          The classic sample is not a biased and professionally written article. good
          1. Bronis
            Bronis 6 June 2013 10: 55
            +6
            Well, it was written not by journalists or historians, but by experts - contemporaries of events for purely practical needs (perhaps in a slightly adjusted form, but fairly objective, without tantrums or excessive infantilism). In essence, the main advantages and disadvantages of the design are given.
            Now they sometimes confuse the effectiveness of design and combat use. These are interconnected concepts, but not identical. And the politicization of modern assessments is sometimes higher than it was 70 years ago. So we get the war of publications and comments.
          2. Firstvanguard
            Firstvanguard 8 June 2013 20: 39
            +2
            Suspension sneaker "Tiger B"
            wassat laughing good neighing
        2. Uhe
          Uhe 6 June 2013 11: 04
          +4
          "Tiger" started doing earlier, back in the 39th, if I'm not mistaken. So Dima is right - the Germans came up with a new tank as an answer to ours, while ours needed to improve, since the groundwork for improvement in our tanks was originally laid. Even the IS, being a new tank, was a continuation of the KV line.

          The Germans lost the war not only on the battlefield, but also in the design bureaus, because the Soviet system was more efficient and far-sighted than the bourgeois-capitalist German. Ours turned out to be better futurists than the Germans :)

          In general, if you think about it, the Germans succeeded as long as they were able to assimilate the Slavs into themselves. As soon as they all assimilated and the flow of fresh blood stopped, the Germans immediately began to stagnate and now Germany is dying. That says a lot.
          1. Kars
            Kars 6 June 2013 11: 14
            +2
            Quote: Uhe
            "Tiger" started doing earlier, back in the 39th, if I'm not mistaken.

            Experienced work, no more.
            Quote: Uhe
            was more effective and visionary

            More massive, and about foresight - it's Fritz climbed into the wilds
            Quote: Uhe
            new tank in response to our

            The German answer was four with a cannon L48,
            Quote: Uhe
            Ours turned out to be better futurists than the Germans :)

            Not the Germans, the futurists were even more futuristic, only no one gave them to put everything into practice.
          2. Bronis
            Bronis 6 June 2013 12: 49
            +4
            Quote: Uhe
            39th, if not mistaken
            What they were going to do at that time (more precisely, starting from 1936-37) is a cross between the French B1 and German medium tanks. But in this form, the Wehrmacht did not need a heavy tank - Blitzkrieg and "infantry tank" are weakly compatible concepts, especially the Stugi appeared. And the project was going pretty badly. It has not yet become clear (after the failure of the Blitzkrieg and the meetings with Soviet tanks) what kind of heavy vehicle the Wehrmacht needs. And the developments were carried out in different directions - Porsche is a witness to this. laughing
            Well, as for futurism, the Germans gave our designers handicap ... sometimes, such a thing was born that even German industry could hardly or could not at all ... Futurism in war was not good, healthy realism was needed.
      2. Gahprom
        Gahprom 6 June 2013 11: 54
        +2
        Quote: Dima190579
        For any modification of the T-34, the Nazis had to come up with a new tank. A shelf with drawings of it will be brought to iron there and the war is over.

        what a ridiculous potreotic stupidity.
        for any modification 34ki long-barreled four was enough.
        1. Htuek
          Htuek 6 June 2013 22: 03
          0
          Is this what stupidity is that wrong? What was not enough just a long-barreled gun. Once made this monster.
          1. Bronis
            Bronis 6 June 2013 23: 19
            +1
            Quote: Htuek
            What was not enough just a long-barreled gun. Once made this monster

            Perhaps two things. The first quantitative superiority of Soviet tanks. The second one. Paranoia regarding the need for quality superiority, albeit to the detriment of manufacturability (on the understanding that the pace of production is difficult to increase). In general, an attempt to make a miracle weapon. Tiger-I until the end of 1943 was a rather difficult target. The anti-tank artillery of the Red Army was not ready for the appearance of this machine (the benefit of the mass use of tigers was limited by the number). But within 6-7 months. the situation began to change - the parts were saturated with the corresponding artillery. The Germans understood this. And the Germans wanted to regain their position, but failed ...
  2. Kars
    Kars 6 June 2013 09: 19
    +5
    _________________
    1. Kars
      Kars 6 June 2013 09: 20
      +3
      _______________________
      1. Kars
        Kars 6 June 2013 09: 21
        +2
        ________________
        1. Kars
          Kars 6 June 2013 09: 22
          +4
          ________________
          1. Kars
            Kars 6 June 2013 09: 22
            +4
            ________________
            1. Kars
              Kars 6 June 2013 09: 23
              +3
              ___________
          2. Kars
            Kars 6 June 2013 09: 24
            +2
            ________________
        2. Kars
          Kars 6 June 2013 09: 26
          +2
          The inscription on the trunk .. Slava Korobov ..
          1. Kars
            Kars 6 June 2013 09: 27
            +2
            ___________________
            1. Kars
              Kars 6 June 2013 09: 29
              +4
              ____________________
              1. Karlsonn
                Karlsonn 6 June 2013 14: 52
                +4
                Kars hi

                On photo:

                Shot in board Pz.Kpfw VI Ausf. B “Tiger II”, tactical number of 331, commander of 3 company Rolf von Westernhagen of 501 th battalion of heavy tanks, operating as part of the SS 1 th tank corps. Padded with battery SU-100 under the command of Captain Vasilyev (1952 th self-propelled artillery regiment). On board, you can see the number (93) of the Soviet trophy team. Hungary, Lake Balaton area.
                1. Kars
                  Kars 6 June 2013 15: 12
                  +2
                  drinks hi
                  ____________________
                  1. Kars
                    Kars 6 June 2013 15: 13
                    +4
                    ___________________
                    1. Karlsonn
                      Karlsonn 6 June 2013 16: 34
                      +1
                      I don’t confuse, the last photo, your work?
                      drinks
                      1. Kars
                        Kars 6 June 2013 17: 01
                        +3
                        My. I won’t do anything for him.
                      2. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 17: 11
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        My. I won’t do anything for him.


                        and I have missed SU-122 from TAMIYA in a box crying all hands do not reach ...
                      3. Kars
                        Kars 6 June 2013 17: 14
                        +3
                        heard about Meng?

                        The TS-006 kit includes 26 sprues, makes 1303 parts, not including etched, cotton threads, and asphalt shoes, and etched 3 pieces, a total of 10 parts. In order to increase realism and interest in the model, we added a special umbrella for the armored mask, and two tank headsets in 1/35 scale.
                      4. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 17: 30
                        0
                        Quote: Kars
                        heard about Meng?
                        belay

                        nah what and how much does this miracle drag pull?

                        and you collected it? if so, how is it?
                      5. Kars
                        Kars 6 June 2013 17: 38
                        +2
                        dolar from 50-60

                        http://gurkhan.blogspot.com/2013/05/90-gur-khan-meng-models.html

                        not yet collected
                      6. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 17: 53
                        0
                        and how did you get it?
                      7. Kars
                        Kars 6 June 2013 17: 58
                        +2
                        Quote: Karlsonn
                        and how did you get it?


                        Did I say that I got it? I'm only waiting
                      8. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 18: 46
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        Did I say that I got it? I'm only waiting


                        these are all the limitations of Internet communication, I already thought that you are a happy owner sad .
                      9. Kars
                        Kars 6 June 2013 18: 53
                        +2
                        Quote: Karlsonn
                        I already thought that you are a happy owner

                        Not so much happiness is still far away. But the reviews about Meng are very good. In terms of the Turtle.
                        Also a sickly PT choice)))
                      10. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 12
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        But the reviews about Menga are very good. In terms of the Turtle. If all goes well.


                        biting my elbows in anticipation
  • ale-x
    ale-x 6 June 2013 11: 20
    0
    This was thrown after, under the tail, so to speak)))
  • Black Colonel
    Black Colonel 6 June 2013 09: 53
    +2
    Judging by the uniforms, the captured Americans are coming. The picture was taken, apparently, during the Wehrmacht operation in the Ardennes.
    1. Yemelya
      Yemelya 6 June 2013 19: 57
      +1
      Similar.
      The mechanic, apparently sensing the taste of victory, put on a black tank beret, remembering the times of the blitzkrieg.
  • svp67
    svp67 6 June 2013 18: 51
    +1
    Ibid.

    [Center]
  • ale-x
    ale-x 6 June 2013 09: 39
    +3
    The Germans did not have enough time to fine-tune this car. In a hurry. Soviet IS tanks were more dangerous and suitable for that time.
    1. ramsi
      ramsi 6 June 2013 10: 24
      +3
      in general, it is difficult to say: the IS ammunition load is about 30 shells, and the tiger has 70, the IS fire rate is about 17s / shot, and the tiger has 8; on ballistics, the KWK43 shell - quite confidently coped with the IS
      1. ale-x
        ale-x 6 June 2013 11: 25
        +3
        Maybe you are right about the gun, however, the running characteristics of the machine, maintainability, the cost of production / operation, the speed of training of crews and personnel are no less important .... There are a lot of factors. German tanks were high-tech, no doubt, but Soviet equipment and soldiers had and have much more advantages than disadvantages. The result is known to us.
        1. Bronis
          Bronis 6 June 2013 14: 17
          +2
          Unambiguously compare the machine is almost impossible. Feather. The relative small number of machines (even the IS-2 against the background of the T-34 and T-4 produced not so much) - they were rare and, as a rule, not in large quantities. Is-2 is a more versatile machine, thanks to the best high-explosive projectile action. The Royal Tiger is better as a fighter of its kind. Each side received the car it needed. In addition, the Royal Tiger in the middle of the 44th and the beginning of the 45th is a difference. After the loss of the industrial and raw material base, the quality of the machine also did not get better ... therefore, you can argue a lot, for a long time and without sane results.
  • 450096
    450096 6 June 2013 09: 42
    +2
    An interesting topic for me, and everything would be fine if it were not for the mass of purely grammatical errors. This fact is very annoying, and not only this article has sinned this recently.
    Dear authors, please do not let stupid mistakes spoil your work!
    1. Dmitriy69
      Dmitriy69 6 June 2013 09: 49
      +2
      Absolutely fair remark! Especially today is the Day of the Russian language.
  • Bigriver
    Bigriver 6 June 2013 10: 04
    10
    "The frontal part of the tank, the bottom plate of the hull and the mask are struck by an armor-piercing shell of 122- and 152-mm caliber from a distance of 1000 - 1500 m."

    And after five months she began to make her way at such a distance with the armor-piercing D-10S of the Su-100 self-propelled gun.
    Somehow he did not make any impression on our soldiers at the front. Unlike the first Tiger. Despite the greater weight and more powerful armor, it was noted that it "held" shells from tank and anti-tank guns much worse than the first model.
    Molybdenum ended in the Reich: ((And then these monsters drank all the gasoline laughing
    1. Vladimirets
      Vladimirets 6 June 2013 11: 42
      +1
      Quote: BigRiver
      Somehow he did not make any impression on our warriors at the front. Unlike the first Tiger.

      How much water has flowed between these events, a different situation, other armies ... what
    2. Gahprom
      Gahprom 6 June 2013 11: 58
      -5
      . Unlike the first Tiger

      who for six months didn’t scare anyone, and stood unnecessary to anyone, when they just figured it out
      1. Bigriver
        Bigriver 6 June 2013 13: 28
        +2
        Quote: Gahpro
        . Unlike the first Tiger

        who for six months didn’t scare anyone, and stood unnecessary to anyone, when they just figured it out

        Between "Mga-Autumn 42" and Stalingrad-December 42 "half a year will not be typed :))
        The Germans gained one tigrabtailung for the winter. It's just not clear whether he was part of Manstein's 6th TD in the "Winter Thunderstorm", or was he transferred to Rostov?
        But, the battalion was peculiar. Three companies, only one pure tiger.
        1. Gahprom
          Gahprom 6 June 2013 13: 38
          -2
          Between "Mga-Autumn 42" and Stalingrad-December 42 "half a year will not be typed :))

          no, I mean when he "got" and when he was noticed and "tested"
          and when tiger-fear began, a year and a half.
          1. Bigriver
            Bigriver 6 June 2013 14: 15
            +1
            Quote: Gahpro

            no, I mean when he "got" and when he was noticed and "tested"
            and when tiger-fear began, a year and a half.

            Well, they tested it right away, (it seems a month later) after it was taken near Mgoy.
            In the winter, decisions were made to strengthen the army’s PT capabilities.
            And there were few of them. Two faces of Kursk - no more than 150 tigers.
            Tiger fears also contributed to the strengthening of reservations Pz-III / IV.
            1. Gahprom
              Gahprom 6 June 2013 18: 56
              0
              as always, the unknowing sheep set a minus,
              Well, they tested it right away, (it seems a month later) after it was taken near Mgoy.

              they started testing only in the spring of 43, emnip March, and it appeared in August-September 42
              I agree with the rest
              1. Gahprom
                Gahprom 6 June 2013 19: 50
                -1
                already 3 illiterate people have gone

                Bigriver
                specified - in February the first tiger was fired,
              2. Bigriver
                Bigriver 7 June 2013 07: 31
                0
                Quote: Gahpro

                They started testing only in the spring of 43, March, and it appeared in August-September 42 ...

                Yes, I was wrong.
                The first appearance is near Mgoy. But then failed to capture.
                But it turned out to pull out the whole on the Volkhov Front only in January 43.
                Further, in February they tried.
                1. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 7 June 2013 11: 34
                  0
                  Quote: BigRiver
                  Yes, I was wrong.
                  The first appearance is near Mgoy. But then failed to capture.


                  belay

                  Quote: BigRiver
                  But it turned out to pull out the whole on the Volkhov Front only in January 43.


                  belay


                  Quote: Karlsonn
                  on the picture:

                  G.K. Zhukov, N.N. Voronov and K.E. Voroshilov visiting the first captured "Tiger" at the exhibition of trophy weapons in the Gorky Central Park and Museum in Moscow in the summer of 1943


                  Quote: Karlsonn
                  Pz.Kpfw. VI "Tiger" of the 502nd battalion of heavy tanks of the Wehrmacht (tactical tank number - "100"), captured by Soviet troops near Leningrad in the fall of 1942.


                  wink
                2. Gahprom
                  Gahprom 7 June 2013 14: 10
                  -1
                  Quote: BigRiver
                  Yes, I was wrong.
                  The first appearance is near Mgoy. But then failed to capture.
                  But it turned out to pull out the whole on the Volkhov Front only in January 43.
                  Further, in February - they tried

                  there is such an option
                  As a result of this battle (September 22), one engine stalled after the projectile hit, and the other three managed to reach the forward enemy, having received serious damage, and stopped there due to impassability and technical problems. Of the four tanks, three were evacuated, and one, with equipment removed by the Germans and blown up, was captured by Soviet troops.
                  According to other sources, there were six “Tigers” in the Leningrad direction on September 21, 1942 on the Mga-Sinyavino road, and one of them was presented on the open tank platform of the Lenin-Snegirevsky Military History Museum as of 2009
        2. Yemelya
          Yemelya 6 June 2013 20: 01
          0
          Quote: BigRiver
          It's just not clear whether he was part of Manstein's 6th TD in the "Winter Thunderstorm", or was he transferred to Rostov?

          Yuri Bondarev's "Hot Snow" mentions "Tigers". The book describes the reflection of the "Winter Thunderstorm". Not an argument, of course, but maybe based on facts.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 20: 19
            +4
            Quote: Emelya
            Y. Bondarev's "Hot Snow" mentions "Tigers"

            The Tigers were not there.
            A freshly manned unit (IV Division?) Arrived from France, which included PZ-4 with a long-barrel cannon.
            But before reaching the Myshkivka River, the Germans had to fight with parts of the 4 Cavalry Corps, which, closing the outer ring of the Stalingrad boiler, stumbled upon the Germans in the Kotelnikovo area.
            The situation was stalemate.
            While the 4 cavalry corps was gaining strength for the strike, the Germans gained reserves, surrounded and defeated the cavalry.
            But this time was enough to create a line of defense along the Myshkovka river.
          2. Karlsonn
            Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 23
            +2
            Quote: Emelya
            Yuri Bondarev's "Hot Snow" mentions "Tigers". The book describes the reflection of the "Winter Thunderstorm". Not an argument, of course, but maybe based on facts.


            on the picture:

            G.K. Zhukov, N.N. Voronov and K.E. Voroshilov examining the first captured "Tiger" at an exhibition of captured weapons in the Gorky Central Park of Culture and Leisure in Moscow in the summer of 1943 - Pz.Kpfw. VI "Tiger" of the 502nd battalion of heavy tanks of the Wehrmacht (tactical tank number - "100"), captured by Soviet troops near Leningrad in the fall of 1942 . Noteworthy is the unusual fastening of the equipment box on board the tower, which has never been seen later.



            For the first time, Tiger I tanks went into battle on August 29 of 1942 of the year near the Mga station near Leningrad hi .
            1. Gahprom
              Gahprom 6 June 2013 20: 32
              -1
              captured by Soviet troops near Leningrad in the autumn of 1942.

              and fired in February, then the panic began in the offices ...
              1. Karlsonn
                Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 45
                0
                Quote: Gahpro
                and fired in February, then the panic began in the offices ..


                Nope, ours didn’t immediately understand what they were dealing with:

                ... For the first time, Tiger tanks took part in the battle on October 7, 1942. Here is what one of the officers who participated in the battle wrote about this:

                The battle took place south of Ladoga, on the territory very unfavorable for the use of "Tigers". Our actions were limited to swamps and marshes. At the very beginning, during loading in Fallingbostel, one tank was damaged due to breakdowns in the transmission, but we were able to deliver the tank to its destination. On the very first day upon arrival in Russia, we encountered two more cases of transmission failure. Only one tank remained in the ranks, which it was decided to use for patrolling the area. I will not talk more about the technical problems that we encountered, but will focus only on our two attacks.

                The first attack took place on September 16. At 17:00 we moved forward. We were opposed by enemy infantry and artillery. At this time I fired the first cannon shot. At that time, I considered (and still do) the Tiger as an excellent tank. On that day, I received only additional confirmation of my opinion, since the tank returned from the battle without being damaged. The enthusiasm of the soldiers wavered slightly due to the frequent mechanical breakdowns that began to haunt us again. One way or another, we went into the second attack with enthusiasm. However, this time, luck turned away from us. First of all, the terrain turned out to be impassable for us. Maneuvering between swamps and trees, we got several direct hits. As a result, the guns of the three "Tigers" were out of order. My tank also got hit - a shell hit from the left and pierced the cannon barrel. The second hit tore off the driver's hatch cover. The other two Tigers were similarly damaged. The fourth "Tiger" caught fire and was completely out of order. We noticed that the enemy's guns could never penetrate the armor of tanks. I hope that the next attack will be in more favorable terrain.
                1. Gahprom
                  Gahprom 7 June 2013 03: 22
                  +1
                  Nope, ours didn’t immediately understand what they were dealing with:

                  in February? in February already understood

                  “Several more months passed before the first“ Tiger ”was captured during the breakthrough of the blockade of Leningrad and was tested by shelling. However, soon after that, the Artillery Administration and the Armored Directorate began to hum like bee hives before a swarm fever ...
                  Many designers of domestic weapons recall that at the end of February 1943 an emergency meeting was held at the Headquarters, the reason for which was the use by the Germans on the Tikhvin Front of the heavy tank "Tiger" (the exact date of the meeting is unknown, but links to its transcripts are given in the correspondence of the NKTP of February 27 1943).
                  The meeting was attended by the People's Commissar of Armaments D. Ustinov with his deputies, the People's Commissar of the tank industry V. Malyshev with his deputies, the People's Commissar of ammunition B. Vannikov, the leadership of GAU and GBTU, a number of military specialists and leading workers of the defense industry. The message was made by the chief of artillery N. Voronov. He called the appearance on the Tikhvin front of the Tiger tanks sudden. The new German tanks made an amazing impression on him, he said. “We have no cannons capable of fighting these tanks,” were his closing words. Nobody could object to him. "
                  Svirin MH "Stalin's steel fist. The history of the Soviet tank 1943-1955"


                  but the four clowning clowns don't understand it
                  1. Karlsonn
                    Karlsonn 7 June 2013 11: 38
                    0
                    Gahprom hi

                    Greetings comrade.

                    Quote: Gahpro
                    Many designers of domestic weapons recall that at the end of February 1943 an emergency meeting was held at the Headquarters, the reason for which was the use by the Germans on the Tikhvin Front of the heavy tank "Tiger" (the exact date of the meeting is unknown, but links to its transcripts are given in the correspondence of the NKTP of February 27 1943).


                    Well, I didn’t understand it (network communication costs request ) I thought you were talking about February 1942, but now that you have explained, let me subscribe drinks .
  • Standard Oil
    Standard Oil 6 June 2013 10: 31
    +9
    As an old German proverb says, since the days of Frederick II: "It is too late to build the" King Tigers "when the Red Army is already in the territory of the Reich."
    As for me, it’s too big, too heavy and clumsy, too gluttonous shorter than stupid. It would be better to build more Hetzer or Stugs with these funds and can delay the fall of the Reich for a couple of minutes.
    1. stalkerwalker
      stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 19: 06
      +6
      Quote: Standard Oil
      With these funds, more Hetzer or Stugs were built and may delay the fall of the Reich by a couple of minutes.

      "Fast Heinz" used to say to the Fuehrer that it would be more efficient to produce more "fours" with a long-barreled 75-mm cannon. The Fuhrer thought differently from the words of the same Guderian.
  • Lech from ZATULINKI
    Lech from ZATULINKI 6 June 2013 10: 43
    +2
    The main weapon of this TIGER is a powerful gun capable of piercing the armor of our tanks at long range.
    According to the recollections of our veterans, such tigers were a very serious adversary and our tankers mostly used successful tactics of ambushes and traps against them.
    The lack of mobility of the TIGER on the battlefield and the speed of movement of the T-34 made it possible to withstand these tigers in battle.
    1. Bigriver
      Bigriver 6 June 2013 11: 47
      +9
      Quote: Lech from ZATULINKI
      .
      The lack of mobility of the TIGER on the battlefield and the speed of movement of the T-34 made it possible to withstand these tigers in battle.

      IMHO, the main drawback of the 2nd Tiger is the discrepancy between the concept of the object and the task set for it.
      Tiger-2 was created as a means of reinforcing RGCs. It was not a linear tank of tank divisions and was part of the separate heavy tank battalions attached to the troops. And what might be the gain in the second half of the war? Only plug holes. And in order to shut them up, operational and strategic mobility, a short reaction time, the ability to make long marches, and choose travel routes are needed. And with this, the 2nd Tiger was all very bad.
      And head-on with our tanks - this is very, very rare. Most of the recollections of this adversary are connected with the German counter-offensive near Balaton. This is where their career began, and there it ended.
      Because the "song of our tank troops" began :)) In the winter of 1945, our breakthroughs developed twice as fast as Guderian and Gepner moved in 41st in Russia.
    2. Gahprom
      Gahprom 6 June 2013 11: 57
      -2
      The lack of mobility of the TIGER on the battlefield and the speed of movement of the T-34 made it possible to withstand these tigers in battle

      and how, sorry? the average speed in the battles of World War II is 10-30 km, emnip,
      at the same time, they drove at maximum speed so that it was unrealistic to shoot - "heaven to earth", they made a "short" shot for the shot, where the tiger could catch 34ku
      that’s all the advantage
      1. family tree
        family tree 6 June 2013 20: 36
        +4
        Quote: Gahpro
        and how, sorry?
        Stupidly did not have time to breakthrough. The Germans themselves complained.
        1. Gahprom
          Gahprom 6 June 2013 20: 50
          0
          Quote: perepilka
          Stupidly did not have time to breakthrough

          I remind
          allowed to resist these tigers in battle
          in battle, and not, for example, in a front-line operation, yes there, they might not have time.
          1. family tree
            family tree 6 June 2013 21: 13
            +1
            Quote: Gahpro
            allowed to confront these tigers in battle

            Well, like Oskin on August 13, 1944. just don’t say that it’s unfair, the CTs, too, mostly from the ambush, filled frags.
            1. Gahprom
              Gahprom 6 June 2013 21: 27
              0
              Well, like Oskin on August 13, 1944. just don’t say that it’s unfair, the CTs, too, mostly from the ambush, filled frags.

              WOTovets, and where does it come from, we are discussing the mobility and T-34, once again
              The lack of mobility of the TIGER on the battlefield and the speed of movement of the T-34 made it possible to withstand these tigers in battle
              1. family tree
                family tree 6 June 2013 23: 57
                +1
                Entered, a purely tank duel in the open field laughing No, thirty-four, of course, went to the tigers, but not less than three, but preferably five for one. But this is when there was no other way out, or the commander is not smart. Not for that it was made.
                1. family tree
                  family tree 7 June 2013 00: 04
                  +1
                  Although there was a case http://spbtur.blogserver.ru/?p=109 just due to mobility.
  • ale-x
    ale-x 6 June 2013 11: 19
    +2
    So it turns out that this is not a tank, but a bunker. From the article it is clear that 350 km of run and the Tiger needs repair, and serious.
    1. Gahprom
      Gahprom 6 June 2013 13: 18
      -1
      Well, we also have 100km marches, not all 34kas reached, T35 or KV2 in general,
      1. Bigriver
        Bigriver 6 June 2013 13: 36
        +4
        Quote: Gahpro
        Well, we also have 100km marches, not all 34ki reached, ..

        By the middle of the war they were already running quite well.
        5 Guards TA ran at night to Prokhorovka, Che, that, about 300 km.
        The loss of equipment on the march is less than 5%.
        By the winter of the 44-45th, the TA could have run 500 km in one operation, and couldn’t lose it for technical reasons.
        1. Gahprom
          Gahprom 6 June 2013 18: 58
          0
          Quote: BigRiver
          By the middle of the war they were already running quite well.
          5 Guards TA ran at night to Prokhorovka, Che, that, about 300 km.
          The loss of equipment on the march is less than 5%.
          By the winter of the 44-45th, the TA could have run 500 km in one operation, and couldn’t lose it for technical reasons.

          Well, CT would run to the 46-47th year,
          But how did 34ki run in 42? I’m silent about 41
          1. family tree
            family tree 6 June 2013 20: 47
            +1
            Quote: Gahpro
            Well, CT ran would by the age of 46-47

            Maybe wouldbut didn’t run, but the T-54 in the 45th already ran, and in the 47th the T-55.
            1. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 6 June 2013 22: 31
              +1
              Quote: perepilka
              Maybe it would, but he didn’t run, but the T-54 already ran in 45


              T-54 ran in 1945 mainly on the training ground bully if my memory serves me well, the 54 was adopted in the spring of the 1946, and serious production was established only in the 1948.
              1. family tree
                family tree 7 June 2013 00: 17
                +1
                Made in January 45th, in service with the 46th, from July 45th a new hodovka and gusli with tarsus, and not with ridges, so I ran, unlike would
            2. Gahprom
              Gahprom 6 June 2013 22: 40
              -1
              Maybe it would, but he didn’t run, but the T-54 already ran in the 45th, and in the 47th the T-55.

              it’s clear what’s going on

              well, one famous panther ran 600 km without major repairs,
              1944 year
              1. family tree
                family tree 7 June 2013 00: 32
                +1
                Quote: Gahpro
                well, one famous panther ran 600 km

                Panthers, unlike the Tigers, also served after the war, but this is not about them.
        2. rexby63
          rexby63 6 June 2013 19: 16
          0
          5 Guards TA ran at night to Prokhorovka, Che-that, about 300 km


          No, they walked all day July 7th. And so from 00.00 7.07.43 to 23.00. 09.07.43/350/XNUMX covered almost XNUMX km. March losses:
          29 tk - 6%
          18 tk - 44%
          5 guards ZMK - 29,5%
          But these are very, very good indicators.
  • The comment was deleted.
  • Taoist
    Taoist 6 June 2013 13: 21
    +6
    In general, it is very interesting to compare our and their "design school" ... The difference is fundamental. The Germans tried to make the design as perfect as possible from the point of view of performance characteristics - which ultimately led to a constant decrease in manufacturability, over-complexity of the design and, as a consequence, a decrease in reliability. Ours worked in almost the opposite direction. Any machine in the process of operation and production was simplified as much as possible (sometimes even to the detriment of formal performance characteristics) but was brought to the maximum production / price / efficiency ratio. By the way, the German approach also had the disadvantage that only a well-trained crew could operate such "wunderwales". That in the conditions of war turned into another problem. In the same 34ku it was possible to plant a mechanic drive "from a plow" ...
    1. Mairos
      Mairos 7 June 2013 12: 58
      0
      "Our school", and often in general, we had and still have one big drawback - minimal concern for a person and his life. Hence, often, huge losses and massive heroism, which sometimes could be dispensed with. Suffice it to recall all these endless "timing" of actions during the holidays. The most recent example is the New Year's storming of Grozny in the first Chechen company.
      To be honest, I am offended. Even now, when the demography is complete, from some chiefs you can hear something like "what's the difference, a battalion is more or a battalion is less."
      About the disgusting ergonomics of our equipment and the "convenience" of field equipment (in the recent and distant past) I am generally silent. Let the fans of footcloths minus)))
      1. Taoist
        Taoist 7 June 2013 13: 22
        0
        Well, partly (just partly) you are right. But this is not a question of the "design school" as such - rather, a question of the general attitude towards the "individual personality". And about the "convenience of inconvenience ..." Well, for example, a standard German infantryman looked of course more beautiful than our "vani" - but his "beauty" was adapted to our realities much worse. Try to run in PS both in winter and in summer ... With equipment, too, not everything is so simple. So it's not worth generalizing in principle. Everywhere has its pros and cons. I myself, as a staff member, had the pleasure to experience many things on my own skin - therefore, I have long weaned myself from categorical judgments.
  • pinecone
    pinecone 6 June 2013 13: 50
    +2
    The Reich ended molybdenum.


    Valuable remark. By that time, the situation with alloying metals in Germany was catastrophic, which led to a sharp decrease in the quality of armored steel. The exception was the regular supply of significant volumes of chrome ore from Turkey, but they also ceased after the entry of Soviet troops into Bulgaria in September 1944.
    1. Bigriver
      Bigriver 6 June 2013 14: 05
      +3
      Quote: pinecone
      ... The exception was regular deliveries of significant volumes chrome ore from Turkey, but they also stopped after the entry of Soviet troops into Bulgaria in September 1944.

      There was also a seam with nickel. Lost Ukraine and Finland. The latter is also the autumn of the 44th.
  • misterwulf
    misterwulf 6 June 2013 13: 51
    +1
    If they thought to continue to fight with t-34-kami, then we had to stop at the Panthers, and not bother with a new wunderwaffle.
    1. svp67
      svp67 6 June 2013 14: 09
      +2
      Quote: misterwulf
      If they thought to continue to fight with t-34-kami, then we had to stop at the Panthers, and not bother with a new wunderwaffle.

      For this purpose, the Pz4 would be better, and better the "Hetzer" and the cannon at the level and quantity are much higher ...
    2. M. Peter
      M. Peter 6 June 2013 14: 17
      +2
      Then 4 would have come, by the way, the most efficient Reich tank. Against the background of these famous tanks, the T4 is somehow forgotten, and this workhorse, pushed by the creators themselves. Well, in principle, we also benefit, we spent on tigers.
      1. ramsi
        ramsi 6 June 2013 14: 33
        0
        Pz4, even shielded, was inferior in all respects to t34-85. And the panther had potential
        1. svp67
          svp67 6 June 2013 14: 45
          +1
          Quote: ramsi
          Pz4, even shielded, was inferior in all respects to t34-85. And the panther had potential

          Bravely, but ...
          - there were studies on the installation of a "Panther" gun on the Pz4, and it even spoiled the skins of the ISam ...
          - in the case of the Pz4, it had the main trump card in that situation - the possibility of releasing this tank in a "mass" order to "satiate the appetite" of the troops ...
          1. ramsi
            ramsi 6 June 2013 15: 04
            +3
            the Pz4 truck is an already modified Pz3, 26t with a 300l.s petrol. - then, probably, there was nowhere to go, therefore they threw
            1. Kars
              Kars 6 June 2013 15: 10
              +3
              Quote: ramsi
              the Pz4 trolley is the already modified Pz3,

              Actually, this is a false statement.
              Quote: ramsi
              Alchet, probably already had nowhere, so they left

              It was where, but the name let us down - if it were called Jaguar, everything could have turned out differently
              1. Karlsonn
                Karlsonn 6 June 2013 16: 45
                0
                Quote: Kars
                Actually, this is a false statement.
                yes


                Quote: Kars
                It was where, but the name let us down - if it were called Jaguar, everything could have turned out differently


                We have the answer to each of your questions: We have a machine gun, but you don’t have one!

                on the picture:

                The Soviet tank T-44-122 and the German tank PzKpfw V "Panther" in comparative tests. Photo from the archive of the Kharkov Design Bureau of Mechanical Engineering named after A.A. Morozova.
                1. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 6 June 2013 16: 50
                  +1
                  Here is another photo, quite rare:

                  soldier
                  1. svp67
                    svp67 6 June 2013 18: 17
                    +1
                    Quote: Karlsonn
                    Here is another photo, quite rare:
                    The "poor" T44 already had the transmission working in "tension", but from this "monster" it generally poured, so shooting only from the spot ...
                    1. Karlsonn
                      Karlsonn 6 June 2013 18: 48
                      0
                      Quote: svp67
                      The "poor" T44 already had the transmission working in "tension", but from this "monster" it generally poured, so shooting only from the spot ...


                      So what? as a result we raped T-54 soldier
                      1. Yemelya
                        Yemelya 6 June 2013 20: 05
                        0
                        Quote: Karlsonn
                        So what? as a result we raped T-54


                        With a different transmission.
                      2. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 27
                        0
                        Quote: Emelya
                        With a different transmission.


                        going will overcome the road wink
                      3. rexby63
                        rexby63 6 June 2013 21: 02
                        0
                        With another transmission


                        I doubt
                      4. svp67
                        svp67 6 June 2013 21: 09
                        +2
                        Quote: rexby63
                        I doubt


                        What is there to doubt
                        Almost without changes, the engine-transmission compartment scheme worked out at the T-44 was used, but the B-54 diesel engine with increased torque and planetary, two-stage rotation mechanisms - Recall that in tanks with on-board friction, mechanical drivers during turns had to repeatedly slow down the track or slip the friction clutch, overheating the disks. And on the T-54, putting the lever in the first fixed position, it was possible to turn the car around with a constant radius of about 9 m, in the second - to brake the track, and in the intermediate - to smoothly drive the tank. We add that the planetary mechanism made it possible to overcome suddenly appearing obstacles and sections of heavy soil without shifting gears - by putting the lever in the first position, the driver mechanic increased the torque on the drive wheels by 1,42 times. Although the T-54 was heavier than its predecessor, it was distinguished by better traction and dynamic characteristics, which was achieved after a serious alteration of the chassis. For example, the caterpillar was made small, with pin gear and developed lugs, track rollers reinforced. To counter angular oscillations for the first time in the country, the first and last nodes of the torsion suspension were installed paddle hydraulic shock absorbers
                        .

                        Of course, the T54 transmission was not invented with "0", but several changes were made that turned out to be decisive in terms of improving performance and reliability ...
                      5. Karlsonn
                        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 22: 33
                        0
                        Quote: rexby63
                        I doubt


                        in what? belay
                      6. rexby63
                        rexby63 7 June 2013 22: 05
                        0
                        I didn’t drive tanks, but I have tractor driver’s crusts. And in the old days, all high school students in the sowing season were obliged to practice. The thing is this: two tractors - DT-54 and DT 75, at the first coupling, at the second planetarium, I personally did not feel the difference. Therefore, I doubt if I would compare all this directly with military equipment, then I would not doubt
                2. svp67
                  svp67 6 June 2013 20: 31
                  +3
                  Quote: Karlsonn
                  So what? as a result we raped T-54
                  For its time, a very revolutionary and advanced machine ... Which completely overshadowed the T44. But even if "44" appeared in 44, then alas, it would not have brought much benefit, since the stage of "childhood diseases" had not yet passed, although the T34 had a huge bunch of shortcomings, but by the period 44-45 it had not estimated qualities - high reliability and excellent maintainability, which allowed the Red Army during this period to carry out deep operations that could not be carried out without tanks ...
                3. Karlsonn
                  Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 47
                  0
                  Quote: svp67
                  But even if "44" appeared in 44, then alas, it would not have brought much benefit, since the stage of "childhood diseases" had not yet passed, although the T34 had a huge bunch of shortcomings, but by the period 44-45 it had not qualities


                  totally agree drinks
      2. ramsi
        ramsi 6 June 2013 18: 07
        +2
        about the Pz4 box - you are right, this is different, but about the fact that there was room to "grow" ... Yes, the Germans tried to shove the panther cannon into the Pz4, but abandoned it due to the overweight of the front rollers. A similar story is with our T34s - they did not strengthen the VLD of thirty-fours for the same reason, although it was even requested. And only when they managed to turn the engine across, move the turret back - and only then strengthen the VLD, making it like a panther. In fact, it was already a different tank - t44.
        By the way, I don’t understand what you have in the picture - in appearance, an ordinary screened four
        1. Kars
          Kars 6 June 2013 18: 14
          +2
          Quote: ramsi
          By the way, I don’t understand what you have in the picture - in appearance, an ordinary screened four

          She is the most.
          Quote: ramsi
          well, the Germans tried to stick a panther cannon in Pz4

          The wedge light on 7,5 cm KwK 42 did not fail. It was possible to shorten up to 55-60 calibers.
        2. stalkerwalker
          stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 19: 19
          +4
          Quote: ramsi
          put the panther’s cannon in Pz4, but threw it because of the drag of the front rollers

          If you look at the cross-sectional drawing of the Panther turret, you can see that the counterpart of the cannon ALMOST reaches the rear of the turret. That led to certain problems for the loader, and the three tankers in the Panther turret were more than cramped.
          No wonder the Germans preferred Tiger in this regard, as the successor to the Pz-3, in terms of comfort and convenience.
      3. stalkerwalker
        stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 19: 13
        +4
        Quote: Kars
        It was where, but the name let us down - if it were called Jaguar, everything could have turned out differently

        The statistics of the defeats of Soviet armored vehicles shows that the largest percentage of Panzervaffen hits was shown by the Pz-4 with the long-barreled 75-mm gun.
        The legends about "Tigers" -snipers are rooted in poor identification: at a distance of over 1 km, only a very experienced eye could distinguish between "four" and "Tiger".
        1. Kars
          Kars 6 June 2013 19: 32
          +3
          Quote: stalkerwalker

          The statistics of the defeats of Soviet armored vehicles shows that the largest percentage of Panzervaffen hits was shown by the Pz-4 with the long-barreled 75-mm gun.

          Only vryatli these statistics can distinguish who was armed with 75 mm gun fired shells. PAK-40, Shtug, Hetzer, Panther, Four.
          Quote: stalkerwalker
          The legends of "Tigers" snipers have their roots in poor identification:

          legends they are legends
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 19: 55
            +3
            Quote: Kars
            Only vryatli these statistics can distinguish who was armed with 75 mm gun fired shells. PAK-40, Shtug, Hetzer, Panther, Four.

            Statistics were given by the command in the combat report.
            I don’t remember the part number.
            The conversation was only about the hits / knockouts of our tanks by the German.
            1. Kars
              Kars 6 June 2013 21: 52
              +3
              Quote: stalkerwalker
              Statistics were given by the command in the combat report.

              It is also not easy for them to determine, they consider it mainly following the tracks on the armor.
    3. Bigriver
      Bigriver 6 June 2013 15: 13
      +1
      Quote: ramsi
      the Pz4 truck is the already modified Pz3 ...

      There was no cart on the Pz-III. There were torsos, as on the IS-2.
      1. svp67
        svp67 6 June 2013 16: 48
        +1
        Quote: BigRiver
        There was no cart on the Pz-III. There were torsos, as on the IS-2.
        Well, actually, we still used it on HF ...
      2. family tree
        family tree 6 June 2013 20: 56
        +2
        Quote: BigRiver
        There was no cart on the Pz-III. There were torsos, as on the IS-2.
        Yah?
        1. Bigriver
          Bigriver 7 June 2013 07: 35
          0
          Quote: perepilka
          Yah?

          In what year the production of "troika" to mod. D inclusive and how many were physically made?
          Go further Vicki, you will learn a lot of new things. In particular, you will learn that already in the 40th year, the "troika" sold by the USSR was on torsion bars.
          1. family tree
            family tree 7 June 2013 08: 25
            +2
            Quote: BigRiver
            In what year the production of "troika" to mod. D

            B-12pcs, S-15pcs, D-50pcs A-10pcs, Christie's pendant, not trolleys. With 38g they switched to torsion bars. The name Pz-3 was approved in 36. Thus, 2 years with trolleys and 5 years with torsion bars.
            1. Bigriver
              Bigriver 7 June 2013 15: 06
              0
              Quote: perepilka
              ... Thus, 2 years with trolleys and 5 years with torsion bars.

              Is this a significant fact in the context of discussing the modernization of the Pz-IV?
              What does he give you, and what do you want to prove? That the dumb men were stupid and it was necessary to make tanks on the springs, so what would that allow you to create a prodigy?
              What is the point?
  • Gahprom
    Gahprom 6 June 2013 19: 01
    -1
    Quote: ramsi
    Pz4, even shielded, was inferior in all respects to t34-85. And the panther had potential

    more than bold
    1. ramsi
      ramsi 7 June 2013 12: 12
      0
      and in what was inferior? Sight? .. By the year 44, the quality of the sights is already close to the pre-war in terms of glass quality. And from the point of view of ease of use - well, this is very amateurish. Ammunition? .. well, this is clearly not critical. What else is there - a walkie-talkie? ..
  • Volkhov
    Volkhov 6 June 2013 14: 08
    -6
    In this Tiger, the main thing is barium-based anti-atomic coating - readiness for an atomic war, which was canceled only by the negotiations of the autumn of 44, the rest of the Wehrmacht’s technique is a surrogate designed to take time to evacuate the elite.
    The Germans captured many fortifications with real bunkers in working order - the Sudeten Czechs, Maginot of the French, Belgian, Polish, Molotov and Stalin lines ... but in the defense of Germany, mainly ersatz, field fortification was used. Dot weapon sets were taken out and still cover bases in different parts of the world - another war was not pulled and victory was declared. Now they want to fight yet, only they are embarrassed to say with whom.
    1. smile
      smile 6 June 2013 16: 32
      +4
      Volkhov
      And since when did the tsimmerit coating applied against magnetic anti-tank mines (which, by the way, the coalition did not have) become anti-nuclear? Explain, please.
      And yet, you intrigued me terribly - can you elaborate on the Nazi bases, which are still hiding with the help of exported sets of Maginot lines and Czechs with all kinds of Belgians? Well, please!
      1. Karlsonn
        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 17: 02
        +3
        smile hi

        Well, why did you frighten the comrade, in the evening I wanted to arrange a KVN with beer on the topic: Wehrmacht anti-nuclear tanks, the second life of Czechoslovak, French, Belgian, Polish and Soviet pillboxes - INTIGATIONS, INVESTIGATIONS, SENSATIONS !!! and now - not fate crying

        1. smile
          smile 7 June 2013 15: 12
          +1
          Karlsonn
          :)))))
          I repent ... I sprinkle ashes on my head .... ruined such a fun .... :)))
      2. Volkhov
        Volkhov 6 June 2013 20: 28
        0
        Quote: smile
        can be more

        Get on a boat and row from Koenigsberg north to the Gulf of Bothnia to Lulea, then walk to the mountains and enjoy.
        1. smile
          smile 7 June 2013 15: 17
          +1
          Volkhov
          Please clarify: is it you who, sending me in a boat to the Gulf of Bothnia, want to kill me, or is it humor? If it’s humor, then you start to like me - for example, I haven’t sent anyone to the Gulf of Bothnia yet (can I take advantage of it?) .... and if not ... send someone on foot to the mountains to find something there, without specifying landmarks ... have you seen the mountains?
          1. Volkhov
            Volkhov 8 June 2013 02: 11
            0
            Swim, go north, they will find you earlier than you notice - take humor with you.
    2. Karlsonn
      Karlsonn 6 June 2013 17: 27
      +2
      Quote: Volkhov
      The main thing in this Tiger is barium-based anti-atomic coating - readiness for atomic warfare


      the tank’s anti-nuclear defense is not a barium-based coating, but:
      - a filter-ventilation installation providing sealing of the reserved armored compartment and supply of purified air to the crew;
      - charge pumps creating excessive pressure in the tank;
      - Armor components that protect against neutron radiation;
      - an X-ray counter that instantly registers the gamma-ray flux and issues an executive signal to the pyrocartridge circuit of the sealing devices to ensure the sealing of the hull and tower, and the blackout of the main power circuits and engine shutdown;
      - anti-radiation synthetic materials that slow down and absorb neutrons, with which the armor is supplemented from the inside.


      Quote: Volkhov
      but in the defense of Germany, ersatz, field fortification, was mainly used.


      Yeah, ersatz-field fortification laughing

      on the picture:

      The 210-mm cannon (21 cm Kanone 39) of the Marcouf coastal battery, also known as the Crisbecq, captured by units of the 39th Infantry Regiment of the 9th American Infantry Division in Normandy.
      1. Karlsonn
        Karlsonn 6 June 2013 17: 32
        +1
        another photo of ersatz field fortification wink

        on the picture:

        U.S. troops are examining a German 210-mm cannon of special power 39 / 41 concern Skoda (21 cm Kanone 39 / 41 Skoda) in one of the two battery bins Chrisbek (Crisbecq).
        Battery bunkers were located on the east coast of the Cotentin Peninsula, near the hamlet of Saint-Marcouf. Battery guns fired at landing ships near the Utah Beach landing site. The battery commander was Lieutenant Walter Ohmsen.
        The bunker was captured by units of the 39th Infantry Regiment of the 9th American Infantry Division.
        1. Volkhov
          Volkhov 6 June 2013 20: 34
          -1
          This is improvisation - a gun in the window. These bunkers have ball installations, towers, thickened trunks.
          The 21 cm cannon was coastal, there were few of them and in this case they only covered it partially from the bombing.
          1. Karlsonn
            Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 49
            0
            Quote: Volkhov
            This is improvisation - a gun in the window.


            I have no words.
            1. stalkerwalker
              stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 21: 52
              +5
              Quote: Karlsonn
              I have no words.

              But fun laughing
            2. Kars
              Kars 6 June 2013 21: 55
              +3
              __________
              I’m thinking of mixing the artillery of the Atlantic Wall with the rest of the Third Reich fortifications (even though there are a lot of typical fortifications, both stationary and pre-fabricated)
              1. Kars
                Kars 6 June 2013 21: 58
                +2
                ______________________
                1. Kars
                  Kars 6 June 2013 22: 01
                  +2
                  _____________________-
                  1. Kars
                    Kars 6 June 2013 22: 03
                    +2
                    _____________________
              2. Karlsonn
                Karlsonn 6 June 2013 22: 40
                +1
                Quote: Kars
                Though I think to mix the artillery of the Atlantic Wall with the rest of the fortifications of the Third Reich (


                I agree, but to declare that the Germans had only ersatz-field fortification - bust.
      2. Volkhov
        Volkhov 6 June 2013 20: 40
        -3
        Quote: Karlsonn
        the tank’s anti-nuclear defense is not a barium-based coating, but:

        Why the protection against radiation by barium is bad - is still used.
        And the sensors are not so needed - after all, bombs are only their own, they will ring before the explosion. Driving through a burnt wasteland, it is precisely the coating that needs to be replaced.
        1. Karlsonn
          Karlsonn 6 June 2013 22: 38
          +2
          Quote: Volkhov
          And the sensors are not so needed - after all, bombs are only their own, they will ring before the explosion.



          Quote: Volkhov
          Driving through a burnt wasteland, it is precisely the coating that needs to be replaced.


          hug and cry !!! Comrade, you contradict yourself! no sensors needed !?
          need a coating ?! and how will she create excess pressure? how will air filter?

          tyredets crying
        2. Alex
          Alex 16 September 2013 14: 05
          +2
          Quote: Volkhov
          Why is barium radiation protection bad?

          The point is not the quality of protection with barium or something else - the point is that you blasted out obvious nonsense, and now you are trying to make excuses. It is better to ask a question: and on what devil did the namts have to create anti-radiation protection, if they dreamed of atomic weapons only in sweet dreams? Just don’t talk about the "atomic bomb of the Nazis," "the German groundwork in the American atomic program," "exported brains and materials," and other nonsense in this style.
    3. Alex
      Alex 16 September 2013 13: 52
      +2
      Quote: Volkhov
      In this Tiger, the main thing is barium-based anti-atomic coating - readiness for an atomic war, which was canceled only by the negotiations of the autumn of 44, the rest of the Wehrmacht’s technique is a surrogate designed to take time to evacuate the elite.
      The Germans captured many fortifications with real bunkers in working order - the Sudeten Czechs, Maginot of the French, Belgian, Polish, Molotov and Stalin lines ... but in the defense of Germany, mainly ersatz, field fortification was used. Dot weapon sets were taken out and still cover bases in different parts of the world - another war was not pulled and victory was declared. Now they want to fight yet, only they are embarrassed to say with whom.


      Please share the grass that you smoked before ... request

      And pillboxes of all lines - so they were just oriented against Germany, and not against France and Czechoslovakia.
  • svp67
    svp67 6 June 2013 14: 27
    +1
    The new German tank "Tigr V" is a further development of the tank "Panther" using the transmission of the tank "Tigr N" and weapons "Ferdinand."
    Not quite a correct statement. Here it was necessary to say - The shape of the "Tiger B" body is a logical development of the ideas laid down in "Panther". And in general, I believe that this tank would have more prospects if it had the size and shape of the "Panther", armor, gun and transmission of the "Tiger A", then it would be a stronger and more dangerous enemy for us and our allies, and the place of the main the tank was supposed to take Pz4 ...
    1. Yemelya
      Yemelya 6 June 2013 23: 10
      0
      Quote: svp67
      and the place of the main tank was to take Pz4 ...

      In 1945, the Pz IV against the background of the T-44, "Pershing" and "Centurion" would have looked somehow not very solid.
  • vomag
    vomag 6 June 2013 15: 07
    +2
    the author cheats with fluffs messed up on the "tiger2" Ausf.B was installed the 88mm KwK43 L / 71 cannon and not

    StuK 43
    1. Yemelya
      Yemelya 6 June 2013 20: 09
      0
      Quote: vomag
      the author cheats with fluffs messed up on the "tiger2" Ausf.B was installed the 88mm KwK43 L / 71 cannon and not

      StuK 43


      And with the tracks too. 300 instead of 800.
      1. family tree
        family tree 6 June 2013 21: 02
        +1
        And with the capacity of the fuel tank is not clear.
  • Sasha 19871987
    Sasha 19871987 6 June 2013 15: 53
    0
    thanks to the author, I tried
  • Kovrovsky
    Kovrovsky 6 June 2013 16: 00
    +1
    Quote: M.Pyotr
    Then 4 would have come, by the way, the most efficient Reich tank. Against the background of these famous tanks, the T4 is somehow forgotten, and this workhorse, pushed by the creators themselves. Well, in principle, we also benefit, we spent on tigers.

    Why is it retracted? The T4s fired the entire Second World War, Germany’s most massive tank.
  • Svyatoslav72
    Svyatoslav72 6 June 2013 16: 32
    -1
    Tiger II (Royal) and Panther were very unfortunate options. In addition to insufficient quality armor, they were too capricious (chassis and mechanisms), excessive sizes and poor mobility, difficulty in operation, and slowness. Such a miracle of creation could only be invented by people far from the needs of armored forces, far from fighting. The German tankers themselves are better related to the Tiger I (H), and the tank troops needed the T-4 (the working battle horse of the German Tank Forces) of deep modernization.
    If the Panther also "showed its teeth" due to its 75mm rapid-fire cannon and rather ricochet frontal armor (with the G turret), then the Tiger II required heroic efforts of the crew, and an initially favorable situation on the battlefield.
    1. Bigriver
      Bigriver 6 June 2013 17: 12
      0
      Quote: Svyatoslav72
      ...and tank troops needed a T-4(working warhorse of the German Tank Forces) deep modernization.
      If the Panther also "showed its teeth" because of its 75mm rapid-fire cannon and enough ricocheted frontal booking(with model G tower) ...

      They didn’t need the tank troops so urgently in T-4. They (Panzerwaffe) completely changed their mission in the Wehrmacht in the second half of the war, turning from a means of developing the operation into a mobile PT reserve.
      In the realities of this time period, the PT agent from Pz-IV is, to put it mildly, worthless.
      The reserve of modernization has been completely exhausted. On modifications H and J, the chassis was already very overloaded. Which greatly affected the combat readiness.
      As for inclined booking ...
      Ricochet is fair for very sharp meeting angles and for pointed head-mounted caliber armor-piercing. Dumbheads normalize to armor.
      1. Kars
        Kars 6 June 2013 17: 19
        +2
        Quote: BigRiver
        In the realities of this time period, the PT agent from Pz-IV is, to put it mildly, worthless.


        this is a controversial statement. Vryatli PAK 40 was much better.
        Quote: BigRiver
        On modifications H and J, the chassis was already very overloaded. Which greatly affected the combat readiness.

        What was particularly overloaded there? The fact that Jake began to simplify everything wherever possible was due to reasons that have little relation to tank builders.
        1. Karlsonn
          Karlsonn 6 June 2013 18: 03
          +1
          Quote: Kars
          Vryatli PAK 40 was much better.


          I insist - “Faustpatron”, here is the choice of the masters! wassat

          what although no, I take my words back, cooler than the mountains (and, accordingly, cooler than the German four) of course - “Pupchen” fellow !

          on the picture:

          German easel 88-mm anti-tank grenade launchers "Pupchen" (Raketenwerfer 43 "Puppchen"), captured by the Red Army in one of the cities of Pomerania. 1-th Belorussian Front.
          1. Kars
            Kars 6 June 2013 18: 09
            +4
            The choice of professionals))))
            1. svp67
              svp67 6 June 2013 18: 11
              +2
              Quote: Kars
              Professionals Choice


              1. Kars
                Kars 6 June 2013 18: 55
                +3
                Hetzer is not from the poor. And the fact that Czechoslovakia was not particularly bombed.
                1. svp67
                  svp67 6 June 2013 20: 15
                  +1
                  Quote: Kars
                  Hetzer is not from the poor.

                  As well as our T60 and T70, but they also helped us survive, but Hetzer was more serious, although of course they were far from Yagdpanther ...
            2. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 6 June 2013 18: 54
              +2
              Quote: Kars
              The choice of professionals))))


              peaceful Soviet tractor will go too wink
              1. Kars
                Kars 6 June 2013 19: 05
                +3
                This is not an Anglo-American tractor.
                If the Soviet take ...
                1. stalkerwalker
                  stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 19: 58
                  +4
                  Quote: Kars
                  This is not an Anglo-American tractor.

                  What are you guys doing photoshopping on the go ...?
                  Impressive ...
                  laughing
                  1. Karlsonn
                    Karlsonn 6 June 2013 20: 32
                    +1
                    Quote: stalkerwalker
                    What are you guys doing photoshopping on the go ...?
                    Impressive ...


                    without Photoshop, a tank (aka a Soviet military tractor) - NI-1
                    1. svp67
                      svp67 6 June 2013 20: 37
                      +1
                      I really like the "regular" IS6
                    2. svp67
                      svp67 6 June 2013 20: 41
                      0
                      Well, from the Soviet "freaks" project A44
                      1. Taoist
                        Taoist 7 June 2013 13: 29
                        0
                        Probably the most promising of all the pre-war ones. A real forerunner of the "main tank" especially in the version with 107mm. It is a pity, of course, that the war broke off the designers in this regard.
                    3. stalkerwalker
                      stalkerwalker 6 June 2013 21: 21
                      +3
                      Quote: Karlsonn
                      without Photoshop, a tank (aka a Soviet military tractor) - NI-1

                      And then ...
                      The legend of the defense of Odessa - the tank "To Fear" laughing
        2. Bigriver
          Bigriver 7 June 2013 07: 39
          0
          Quote: Kars

          this is a controversial statement. Vryatli PAK 40 was much better.
          What was especially overloaded there?

          Well, the Germans themselves thought so :))) And then, it is necessary to consider the PT-capabilities not of tank guns and tanks, but of formations on the materiel of the "four".
          The congestion of the chassis, according to the Germans themselves, in particular Guderian, limited the mobility of formations on the ground.
          But, and this is only one nuance.
          No time: ((Hurry ...
          1. Kars
            Kars 7 June 2013 09: 07
            +2
            Quote: BigRiver
            Well, the Germans themselves thought so :)))

            They thought so only on the JagdPz IV / 70 (V) self-propelled guns with an armored cannon from a panther, in the cockpit and not in the tower. On the linear four of the latest modifications, something about overload is not heard.
            Quote: BigRiver
            And then, it is necessary to consider the PT-capabilities not of tank guns and tanks, but of formations on the materiel of the "four".

            Really? Isn’t it too complicated? Since the moment that tanks do not fight tanks (ideally) and the presence of anti-tank artillery?


            Pz.IV Ausf.H
            Tanks of modification N received 80-mm frontal armor, the antenna of the radio station was moved to the rear of the hull, 5-mm side screens appeared on the hull and turret, which protected against cumulative (or, as we called them, armor-burning) shells, the design of the drive wheels changed . Some tanks had non-rubber support rollers. On the Ausf.H, a Zahnradfabrik ZF SSG77 gearbox was installed, similar to that used in the Pz.lll tank. The MG 34 anti-aircraft machine gun, Fliegerbeschussgerat41 or 42, was mounted on the commander’s turret. On the machines of the latest releases, the aft leaf of the hull became vertical (it was previously inclined 30 ° to the vertical). Up to 18 mm increased armor protection of the tower roof. Finally, all the outer surfaces of the tank were coated with zimmerite. This version of Pz.IV became the most massive: from April 1943 to May 1944, the factory workshops of three manufacturing companies - Krupp-Gruson AG in Magdeburg, Vogtiandische Maschinenfabrik AG (VOMAG) in Plausen and Nibelungenwerke in S. Valentin - left 3960 combat vehicles. At the same time, 121 tanks were converted into self-propelled and assault guns.

            According to other sources, 3935 chassis were made, 3774 of which were used to build tanks. Based on 30 chassis, 30 StuG IV assault guns and 130 Brummbar self-propelled guns were fired.



            Of the foregoing, of course, it does not follow that the Pz.IV was an ideal tank. Let's say he had insufficient engine power and a rather stiff and out-of-date suspension, which negatively affected his maneuverability. To some extent, the latter was helped by the lowest L / B-1,43 ratio among all medium tanks.

            The equipment of the Pz.lV (as well as other tanks) with anti-cumulative screens cannot be attributed to the coup of German designers. Cumulative ammunition was rarely used in droves, and the screens increased the dimensions of the vehicle, making it difficult to move in narrow aisles, blocked most surveillance devices, and made it difficult for the crew to land and disembark. However, an even more senseless and rather expensive event was the coating of tanks with zimmerite.

            Here are just forgetting something about the congestion of the chassis. And ahead of - specific power is not it.
            1. Bigriver
              Bigriver 7 June 2013 15: 24
              0
              Quote: Kars

              They thought so only on the JagdPz IV / 70 (V) self-propelled guns with an armored cannon from a panther, in the wheelhouse and not the tower.On the linear four of the latest modifications, something about overload is not heard.

              Really?not too hard? starting from the moment that the tanks do not fight tanks (ideally) and the presence of anti-tank artillery?

              And where does the general "fad" come from to switch from linear "fours" to Panthers?
              Guderian lobbied the case. It was bought by the Soviets? :))
              True to him, no one objected to this issue. Why would this be? AND?
              You are not familiar with Manstein's memoirs? There are remarkable fragments that speak about the capabilities of the "quadruple" materiel just before the "Kharkov-43 spring".

              On the second ...
              Of course, everything is very complicated :( But, let's lose the situation? Having the introductory ones that we know.
              The end of 44 - the beginning of the 45th.
              TA is introduced into the breakthrough at the front of 8-12 km.
              It includes TWA-THREE TC (1 MK?) + 2 CCI + 2-4 medium-heavy SAP, and possibly SABr. These are only tanks and self-propelled guns. Can we imagine the density?
              This "locomotive" operates on a suppressed tactical defense and then 2-3 tactical defense lines. What is there? Let's say one TD is quickly thrown into the flank on the Pz-IV materiel.
              What is the fate of this TD, incapable of knocking out a critical amount of materiel, and most importantly - ISy and ISU?
              Most likely, she - TD Wehrmacht, will die or refuse to advance, without coming into contact with the flank of the army.

              It seems that near Fastov, in the late autumn of the 43rd there was a phrase by Katukov.
              From memory, not verbatim: "Fuck .., spent the whole day on this 23rd TD": (((
      2. svp67
        svp67 6 June 2013 18: 09
        +2
        Quote: BigRiver
        In the realities of this time period, the PT agent from Pz-IV is, to put it mildly, worthless.

        Oh well ... Isa could have been a difficult nut for him, but everything else was good ... Sights - the highest level, the gun - at the level, distribution of duties - excellent, visibility from the tank and commanding controllability - well above average, communications - great ... So it's a good military machine.
        1. Karlsonn
          Karlsonn 6 June 2013 18: 55
          +1
          Quote: svp67
          Oh well ... Also, Is could be a difficult nut for him, and everything else at a time ...


          I also think that the comrade got excited with such an assessment of the four drinks
          1. Bigriver
            Bigriver 7 June 2013 15: 38
            0
            Quote: Karlsonn

            I also think that the comrade got excited with such an assessment of the four drinks

            I did not assess the "four" as a tank. I spoke about the low prospects of the Wehrmacht mobile formations equipped with this materiel in the second half of the war.
            Fight and complete the combat mission of the UNION.
            From tank divisions entirely on "fours" - a very bad mobile PT reserve and a means of stopping a breakthrough.
      3. Svyatoslav72
        Svyatoslav72 6 June 2013 20: 18
        -1
        Quote: BigRiver

        They didn’t need the tank troops so urgently in T-4. They (Panzerwaffe) completely changed their mission in the Wehrmacht in the second half of the war, turning from a means of developing the operation into a mobile PT reserve.
        In the realities of this time period, the PT agent from Pz-IV is, to put it mildly, worthless.
        The reserve of modernization has been completely exhausted. On modifications H and J, the chassis was already very overloaded. Which greatly affected the combat readiness.
        As for inclined booking ...
        Ricochet is fair for very sharp meeting angles and for pointed head-mounted caliber armor-piercing. Dumbheads normalize to armor.

        Yes! there were so many tanks that were used captured in France (this is to the fact that they did not need).
        The mission was changed from a lack of Tanks, and a human resource, especially after the Kursk Bulge. Yet again! what is shitty what is not, based on the amount of funds used in this place. Any tank was created as a PT, and this established destination began to dominate from the beginning of the 40s (not in all countries).
        The reserve was exhausted due to a shortage of necessary materials, and you will not go far on substitutions. About overload in the course, again, the deficit dictates the rules, and model J has already gone for the worse and on the path of maximum simplification.
        About rebounds and inclinations, you should not rely on new ammunition, but for the old I advise you to look at materials on the tactics of using Panthers and to combat them, you will find a lot of interesting things.
        PS I respect your erudition, but I didn’t sculpt a hunchback and didn’t speculate, all this was indicated by the participants in the events.
        1. Bigriver
          Bigriver 7 June 2013 15: 51
          0
          Quote: Svyatoslav72
          .
          Mission was changed from lack of tanks, and human resources, especially after the Kursk.
          About rebounds and inclinations, don't rely on new ammunition, but for the old I advise you to look at materials on the tactics of using Panthers and on combating them, you will find a lot of interesting things.

          The Panzerwaffe's mission did not change due to a lack of tanks, but due to the fact that the Red Army broke their strategic backbone and did not allow them to "walk through Russia". And the stake was placed on ONE campaign, which was supposed to end, the edge, in October 41st. They did not plan anything further.
          But, they began to wash themselves with blood here from the very border.

          The second ...
          Do you think I am deliberately confusing you when I talk about "normalization"? :))
          Let's look at the caliber armor-piercing to the ZIS-3 and F-34:
          Shot 53-UBR-354A (Dull-headed with a ballistic tip tracer).
          Shot 53-UBR-354B (Dull-headed with a ballistic tip with tracer localizers).
          1. Svyatoslav72
            Svyatoslav72 7 June 2013 16: 24
            -1
            Tovarisch! do you have a bad history or are you sick with "hurray-patriotism"? Most likely both. AND! for shells, so it is necessary to observe the conditions and not neglect ballistics and armor penetration. Do not forget that projectiles under the influence of overload have the properties of self-destruction or loss of lethality. So the angularity (angle of inclination) + thickness + material strength forms the armor resistance that not every special projectile can overcome.
            PS Do not sweat my brains for nothing, I'm already a Master in the battle with nonsense.)))
            1. Bigriver
              Bigriver 7 June 2013 18: 00
              -1
              Quote: Svyatoslav72
              Tovarisch! do you have a bad history or are you sick with "hurray-patriotism"? Most likely both. AND! for shells, so it is necessary to observe the conditions and not neglect ballistics and armor penetration.
              PS Do not sweat my brains for nothing, I'm already a Master in the battle with nonsense.)))

              Masters tend to contact the Cosmos, not the opponent :)))
              I correctly, intuitively understood that your speech is addressed to me?
              Why is there so little fact and so much expression in your speech?
              Tell us, "fighter with nonsense" about the struggle of "stupid" with "inclined" :))
              Or "anti-hurray-patriotic weight in the head" does not allow you?
          2. The comment was deleted.
  • rexby63
    rexby63 6 June 2013 18: 52
    +1
    Thank you for the article. Briefly and succinctly. Great advantage
  • ilya63
    ilya63 6 June 2013 22: 17
    -1
    set a minus for Mr. Sych’s complete nonsense; I don’t know what colonel he is, I’ll explain why:
    1.the T-VI tiger was already a sufficient argument for fighting any armored vehicles during the war — it had sufficient reservation — it didn’t penetrate our forehead with artillery, but up to 500-700 m, the 88 mm fast-firing gun hit our tanks it’s guaranteed from 2000m-1500m, and there’s nothing to talk about the tanks of the so-called allies (M. Vitman taught them what was what) had excellent Zeiss optics, infrared vision devices and an optical range finder (there were cases of the destruction of our aircraft, especially gun attack aircraft then the anti-aircraft gun), it was quite maneuverable, the power-to-mass ratio (specific power) was 12,3-12,5 hp / t., in the article 10,7-11,6 I can pass inaccuracy in all respects ( divide 700hp, by 57t, engine Maybach HL-210-P45, in the article P-30-650hp, put on the first samples and subsequently replaced by p-45), the chess suspension allowed firing on the go and t .p., just a tiger I-heavy tank and can not be compared with the t-34 of any modifications, for 1 tiger pla 3-4 34-100 mm average T-122, and only a caliber of 2 mm and higher than 122 mm carried the tiger from one shot of the IS-800 with a 34 mm gun, another thing is that the tiger was difficult to manufacture (and expensive), operation (transportation by transport cranes, shoe change in combat-XNUMXmm, not every bridge withstood such a mass) and repair (naturally) and they were released much less than the t-XNUMX.
    2. the most dangerous enemy was the panther, after curing its childhood ailments. Our artillery did not penetrate the large angles of inclination of the frontal armor, its high maneuverability, rate of fire, high accuracy of hit and great armor penetration, excellent visibility, etc., made this tank a dangerous enemy especially since panthers always acted from ambush or together with tigers 1, but the difficulty in production caused a low level of production of these tanks (which is also good for us).
    3. Tiger2-was a continuation of the concept of development of the panther, and not the further modernization of the panther as stated in the article, this is a completely different song.
    This animal couldn’t penetrate our forehead by our means, if only in the commander’s turret or in the ball mount of the machine gun (after replacing the Henschel’s tower with a machine gun removed), it itself had an 88mm gun (KwK43L71 71 caliber long) in the article the whole gun is written in TTX, had a speed of 44-45 km per hour (28-35 in the field), but the complexity of production, the Germans’s loss of material bases for metal mining and alloying additives, led to poor quality of the armored steel produced (there are pictures where cracks go along the hull and tower of the cars), finally they were released only 489 pieces, at the end of the war they could not have any value.
    The enemy whom our grandfathers and fathers defeated must not be underestimated and belittled (strong warriors are Hans), thereby we belittle the heroism of our people.
    hello Polkoniku Sychu (go teach the goldfinch materiel)
    1. Karlsonn
      Karlsonn 6 June 2013 22: 44
      0
      Quote: ilya63
      hello Polkoniku Sychu (go teach the goldfinch materiel)


      I'm afraid he will not answer you anymore, we learn to read carefully! article title:

      The new German tank "Tiger V" (in the text of the "Bulletin of the tank industry" № 10 / 1944 g.)
    2. Gahprom
      Gahprom 6 June 2013 22: 53
      0
      Quote: ilya63
      hello Polkoniku Sychu (go teach the goldfinch materiel)


      did you see the tank in your eyes?

      In some sections of L. N. Kartsev's memoirs, published in our magazine in Nos. 5,7 / 2002, Major General AM Sych was mentioned. Today we have the opportunity to tell you about this wonderful person who has done a lot for the development of domestic tank building. Leonid Nikolayevich Kartsev is already familiar to the readers of the Technics and Armament magazine from the series of articles "Memoirs of the Chief Designer". Colonel Guly Grigory Anisimovich was the head of a department in the UPZ, the head of which was Alexander Maksimovich Sych for 12 years.

      Outside the work environment, we met only in December 1992 on vacation at the Arkhangelskoye sanatorium. On December 21, I asked Alexander Maksimovich to tell his biography. He granted my request. After the conversation, I briefly wrote down its content, which I now present.

      AM Sych was born on November 20, 1908 in a working class family in the mine settlement No. 16 of Donetsk Region. In 1924 he graduated from the Mining College. Until 1929, he worked as a turner in mining workshops.

      In 1929, at the expense of a thousand, he was sent to training courses at the university.

      In 1930 he entered the military-industrial faculty of the Automobile and Tractor Institute, in 1932 it became part of the newly organized Academy of Mechanization and Motorization of the Red Army, which he graduated with honors in 1934, with the rank of engineer of mechanized troops, and was appointed to serve in tank division of the scientific and technical management of mechanization and motorization of the Red Army.

      In control, he was a leading engineer in medium and heavy tanks: T-35, T-28, T-29, BT and T-26. Following the results of the war in Spain in 1936, AM Sych developed technical specifications for tanks, including the BT-20 tank, the design of which formed the basis for the development of the T-34 tank.

      In May 1938, Alexander Maksimovich was repressed and accused of participating in the military anti-Soviet conspiracy of Commander II Rank Fedko. He was held in Butyrka and Lefortovo prisons. In June 1939 he was released from custody due to insufficient evidence, restored to the party and army.

      For further service, AM Sych was sent to a tank test site, to the position of senior engineer. There he served for more than 9 years, occupying successively the following positions: the head of the testing department, the assistant to the chief of the testing ground, the first deputy for science and testing. In December 1939, he was sent for one month to war with Finland.

      During the Great Patriotic War, Alexander Maksimovich repeatedly went to provide technical assistance in the development of new tanks: the Western, Stalingrad, Voronezh, 1st Ukrainian fronts. In March 1945, with a group of officers, he was sent to the Far Eastern and Transbaikal districts to prepare personnel for a future war with Japan. Upon arrival from the Far East, he participated in the development and testing of new tanks: T-44, T-54, IS-1, IS-2, IS-3.

      In 1946, AM Sych led the preparation of armored vehicles for testing in the first atomic explosion. Along with this, by decision of the head of testing the first atomic bomb, academician I.V. Kurchatov, a special group was created that was tasked with: on two specially equipped T-54 tanks, immediately after the tests, drive into the epicenter of the explosion, measure the contamination of the air and the earth's surface at a depth of 10 cm. AM Sych was the group leader and driver of the first tank.
    3. Gahprom
      Gahprom 6 June 2013 22: 56
      +1
      I will continue
      Alexander Maksimovich told me how they were dressed in white clothes, how academics Kurchatov and Keldysh warned of the possibility of mortal danger, and reported that participants in this operation had already been presented with awards for their orders, and that he was awarded the title of Hero of the Soviet Union.

      Tanks drove to the epicenter 10 minutes after the explosion. All those envisaged by the program of work were implemented. All received awards, except for AM Sych, who was refused by the Ministry of Internal Affairs, as being under investigation.

      Alexander Maksimovich at the training ground knew tanks best of all, could drive and knew how to fire from them. Having a good memory and a natural gift from the narrator, he was the only one to report to statesmen of the highest rank at tank shows.

      During World War II, samples of armored vehicles from around the world were collected at the training ground. AM Sych reported on them M.I. Kalinin, K.E. Voroshilov, A.I. Mikoyan, G.K. Zhukov, K.K. Rokossovsky, commander of the fronts and armies, representatives of industry, among whom were V.Ya. Malyshev, J.Ya. Kotin, A.A. Morozov, I.Ya. Trashutin.

      In September 1948, the demonstration of the armored vehicles created after the war took place to the Minister of Defense N.A. Bulganin. Everyone liked the report of AM Sych, and the minister proposed to the commander of the SI armored forces. Bogdanov to appoint him to the general post in GBTU.

      Alexander Maksimovich was introduced to the post of head of the tank department. The appointment was delayed for a long time, since the apparatus of the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the Central Committee of the CPSU prevented this. Bulganin found out about this and signed the order of appointment without their visa. As general, AM Sych spent four years with the rank of colonel and became a general only in 1953, after the death of Stalin.

      During the life of Stalin, the Ministry of Internal Affairs began to conduct an investigation related to some problems in heavy tanks. AM Sych also appeared in the case. After the arrest of Beria, this investigation ceased.

      During our conversation, Alexander Maksimovich, smiling, said: "Beria saved me from death twice: the first - when he became the people's commissar of internal affairs, and the second - when he was left from the Ministry of Internal Affairs." He was rehabilitated only in 1957.

      Occupying the position of head of the Production and Orders Department until 1962, AM Sych thoroughly studied the production capabilities of tank factories, knew many employees of enterprises, design bureaus and defense ministries. Factory directors have always tried to fulfill his every request. For example, plants were reluctant to take orders from the Office of Repair and Supply for the manufacture of spare parts for tanks. Seeing this, Alexander Maksimovich took over the supply department. Spare parts began to be delivered in the necessary nomenclature and the right quantities.

      In 1962, at the suggestion of the head of the Personnel Department of the Central Committee of the CPSU Savinkin, AM Sych was appointed deputy head of the GBTU, his functions expanded. But even in this position, he continued to bet on the Uralvagonzavod and intensify the fight against the T-64 tank, considering it unpromising in all respects. In this fight, he began to help the new head of GBTU, Lieutenant General N.P. Belyanchev.

      And in the autumn of 1966 a reprisal took place. AM Owl was sent to Belarus to check storage depots, opened his safe, took an unclassified notebook for recordings there and declared them secret. Alexander Maksimovich was dismissed from the army due to the inconsistency of his post.

      After arriving from a business trip, he demanded an examination of the contents of the notebook, but he was told that they had burned it ...

      To get rid of N.P. Belyanchev, canceled his position. P.P. Poluboyarov.


      That's the kind of person you are a pig , called carduelis
      and spit on Ban, complain, you already showed everyone what you are for people character
  • Yemelya
    Yemelya 6 June 2013 22: 55
    0
    The constructive modification of the commander towers of German tanks attracts attention. Starting with a rather complicated turret on a T-III tank, the Germans in 1944 came to a simplified cast turret with seven prismatic viewing devices. Simplification of the towers did not improve visibility, and is apparently the result of cheaper production. The visibility of the latest issue of German tanks has become worse.


    I think that a considerable role in changing the design of the turrets was played by the fact that they had to match the armor of the turret’s armor and withstand the blows of increasingly powerful shells.
    O. Karius, it seems, wrote that the high turrets of the "Tigers" of the first releases ("trash cans") were blown off by shells (together with the commanders, of course). The turrets of the late "Tigers", similar in design to the Panther ones, were more successful in this regard.
    1. Kars
      Kars 7 June 2013 11: 52
      +1
      Quote: Emelya
      O. Karius seems to have written that the tall turrets of the "Tigers"

      By the way, what did they write about the best heavy tank of World War II? Did Carius stick to your opinion that this is a CT?
  • Genady1976
    Genady1976 7 June 2013 00: 10
    0
    whole bunch of tigers
  • pinecone
    pinecone 7 June 2013 07: 27
    0
    According to the German tank general Manteuffel, the best tank of World War II was the IS-2.
    1. Karlsonn
      Karlsonn 7 June 2013 11: 49
      0
      According to the German tank general Manteuffel, the best tank of World War II was the IS-2.

      I go horse , ugh "Star"! bully
  • Svyatoslav72
    Svyatoslav72 7 June 2013 19: 11
    -1
    Quote: BigRiver

    Masters tend to contact the Cosmos, not the opponent :)))
    I correctly, intuitively understood that your speech is addressed to me?
    Why is there so little fact and so much expression in your speech?
    Tell us, "fighter with nonsense" about the struggle of "stupid" with "inclined" :))
    Or "anti-hurray-patriotic weight in the head" does not allow you?

    Oddly enough, your intuition did not disappoint you. There is a lot of FUCKtazha, your wonderful picture is also affected by the BALLISTICS on which you were supposed to put. I understood perfectly well that there is a desire to "kick the humpback" on cognitive topics from WOT, and to turn the arrows in a different direction.
    PS My Patriotism does not allow me to "close my eyes" to the obvious, repeat elementary stupidity, and support the harmful. Good luck.
  • misterwulf
    misterwulf 8 June 2013 20: 14
    0
    By the way, all the statistics of tank battles show that our "main" tank and anti-tank artillery T-6 hit many times more than T-5 (Panther). Only the IS was successfully fighting the Panther.
  • Alex
    Alex 16 September 2013 14: 43
    +2
    Thanks to the author for finding and publishing this article. The documents of those years are great and informative, and even if they contain errors and inaccuracies, they are also history. Big "+". And the discussion was informative. Thanks everyone hi
  • Vasily199
    Vasily199 17 June 2019 09: 55
    +1
    Quote: Dima190579
    For any modification of the T-34, the Nazis had to come up with a new tank. A shelf with drawings of it will be brought to iron there and the war is over.

    Brad wasn t 34 for a tiger rival!