Military Review

"Monument to the torturer of Christians insults the entire Belarusian people": an open letter to Alexander Lukashenko

54
"Monument to the torturer of Christians insults the entire Belarusian people": an open letter to Alexander Lukashenko



Over the past years, the authorities of Belarus have made great efforts in promoting the Polish-Lithuanian heritage and presenting it as “Belarusian”. Throughout the country, at the expense of the republican and local budgets, the estates of representatives of the Polish-Lithuanian nobility are restored, monuments to them are established. One of those is the monument to Olgerd, the ruler of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, who is known for his conquests on Moscow and his ambiguous attitude to Orthodoxy. According to the plans of the Vitebsk city executive committee, the equestrian sculptural composition will be installed in the center of the city next to the Orthodox church by June 26 of 2013. Representatives of the Russian organizations of Belarus have repeatedly stated: the installation of the monument to Olgerdu is a demonstrative challenge not only to Russia, but also to the Orthodox Church. Nevertheless, the city and republican authorities intend to bring the work begun to the end, in connection with which representatives of the Belarusian public have addressed with an open letter to Alexander Lukashenko. The text of this letter was received by 13 in May to the editors of REGNUM and is published with preservation of orthography and punctuation of the original.




"An open letter to the President of the Republic of Belarus A.G. Lukashenko

Dear Alexander Grigorievich!

We appeal to you, as citizens of the Republic of Belarus, representatives of various public organizations. We are concerned about the plans to install a monument to the Lithuanian Prince Olgerd in the city of Vitebsk. Olgerd has no relation to the Belarusian people. He is the aggressor and apostate, as well as the invader, who constantly fought with all his neighbors, destroying cities and killing civilians. As a cruel villain of Russia, he is remembered in Russian stories. The evil horror left Olgerd in the history of Christianity. The Orthodox Church honors the memory (April 27) of the Lithuanian holy martyrs, subjected to a painful death on his orders.

In the light of these immutable facts, the question naturally arises: what motives the initiators of the monument are guided by, what goals are they pursuing? Has anyone thought that the installation of a monument to the villain of Russia and the torturer of Christians can be offensive to the citizens of the Republic of Belarus - not only Russians by nationality and not only Orthodox Christians? Moreover, the statue of Olgerd, as if in mockery, is going to be installed directly opposite the Orthodox Church of the Resurrection.



We believe that attempts to glorify such figures can only lead to a split of society, the spiritual and moral-political division of the people of Belarus. How to understand the words of the national anthem of the Republic of Belarus "We, Belarusians - Peace, ..." and the installation of a monument to the conqueror, who left a bloody mark in history, which became an example of unprincipled and aggression?

Residents of Vitebsk, public organizations of our city have repeatedly appealed to various authorities, including the Vitebsk Regional Executive Committee, the Administration of the President of the Republic of Belarus, in which they expressed their concern about the plans to install the monument to Olgerdu. However, all these appeals remained unanswered in substance. Nor was there any broad public discussion of the project for the installation of this monument.

In this situation, we appeal to you with hope for your informed decision, the wise word of the President of the Republic of Belarus, the guarantor of the unity of our people and our statehood, the guarantor of the rights of citizens of the Republic of Belarus. We proceed from the fact that your repeated statements about the brotherhood of Belarusians and Russians, about allied relations with the Russian Federation, your position of respect and support for Christian values ​​are completely sincere. We believe that the installation of monuments to figures, whose role in history is ambiguous and causes negative evaluations of a significant part of society, may be an example of a thoughtless step provoking a conflict. We believe that the majority of citizens of the Republic of Belarus think so. "

Tereshchenko V.D. - participant of the Great Patriotic War, member of the presidium of the organization of veterans of the Vitebsk region;
Kovalev A.F. - participant of the Great Patriotic War, professor of the Vitebsk State University. PMMasherov;
Isakov V.P. - participant of the Great Patriotic War;
Zubanov V.G. - Chairman of the Board of Veterans "Aeroflot" Vitebsk;
Sereda N.N. - Member of the Council of Veterans of the Belarusian Public Organization of Veterans of ATS and VV, Lieutenant Colonel of Militia;
Tarasevich M.I. - Member of the public organization Union of Writers of Belarus;
Lebedko V.K. - Doctor of Pedagogical Sciences, Professor, member of the Union of Artists of the Republic of Belarus;
Kovalev A.A. - Doctor of Education, Professor.
Originator:
http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1657935.html
54 comments
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  1. shurup
    shurup 3 June 2013 06: 49 New
    +3
    Monuments to Lenin and Dzerzhinsky have been preserved in Belarus, but there is no monument to Peter the Great, which seems to be hinting.
    1. Nicholas C.
      Nicholas C. 3 June 2013 06: 53 New
      12
      Olgerd conducted several aggressive campaigns against Muscovite Russia, which were unsuccessful, but cost a lot of blood. These wars received the general name of Lithuanianism. It was the threat of Lithuanianism that forced Moscow to urgently build a stone Kremlin.
      1. Thunderbolt
        Thunderbolt 3 June 2013 07: 12 New
        +4
        Quote: shurup
        Monuments to Lenin and Dzerzhinsky have been preserved in Belarus, but there is no monument to Peter the Great, which seems to be hinting.
        Ah, well, no and no ... In my Russian city there is also no monument to Peter 1. Although there is a city and a millionaire, Tseretelli cannot afford it, but Lenin and Dzerzhinsky have one (and Vysotsky hi ))))))
        ,
        1. shurup
          shurup 3 June 2013 07: 55 New
          +3
          It will be weak. In Brussels there is a peeing boy, girl and, separately, a dog. Tourists tumble down to see.
          Your millionaire should also have a pre-revolutionary merchant-millionaire, but a philanthropist who deserves a monument, or other honorary citizens, but not local Luzhkovs.
        2. ivanovbg
          ivanovbg 3 June 2013 11: 02 New
          +4
          And here, in Bulgaria, there is the village of Tseretelevo, in honor of the prince.
          1. smile
            smile 3 June 2013 13: 41 New
            +2
            ivanovbg
            Oh, we would gladly have thrown off the whole country and sent to you the products of Comrade Tsereteli ... so you won’t take it, probably .. even for nothing ... :))))
        3. datur
          datur 3 June 2013 11: 09 New
          +3
          Ah, well, no and no ... In my Russian city there is also no monument to Peter 1. Although there is a city and a millionaire, Tseretelli cannot afford it, but Lenin and Dzerzhinsky are (and Vysotsky --- and we have- standing right in front of the Arms Plant !!! and there PETER THE GREAT is not depicted on a horse and a laurel wreath, as in St. Petersburg
          !!! And as a simple artisan, in an apron and with a sledgehammer in his hand !!!! good yes
      2. BDRM 667
        BDRM 667 3 June 2013 07: 34 New
        +8
        Quote: Nikolay S.
        Olgerd conducted several aggressive campaigns against Muscovite Russia, which were unsuccessful, but cost a lot of blood. These wars received the general name of Lithuanianism. It was the threat of Lithuanianism that forced Moscow to urgently build a stone Kremlin.

        The figure of Prince Algerd at the monument "Millennium of Russia" in the city of Veliky Novgorod ...
      3. shurup
        shurup 3 June 2013 07: 45 New
        +3
        Thanks to Lithuania, the Germans with Catholic missionaries did not reach Moscow. The Litvins wanted to milk the Moscow cow themselves.
        Dashing times were not related to modern Lithuania.
    2. avt
      avt 3 June 2013 10: 07 New
      +5
      Quote: shurup
      but there is no monument to Peter the Great, which, as it were, hints.

      Be the first to subscribe to the transfer of a monument to the work of Tsereteli! laughing Still need to write off part of the loans to the Old Man so that the monument is taken. laughing
      1. Mhpv
        Mhpv 3 June 2013 10: 55 New
        +4
        And I wanted to offer Peter the Great Columbus Tseritelevsky with a Thunder. recourse
        Did not have time. request
        I don’t know who will deliver hi
    3. Liasenski
      Liasenski 3 June 2013 11: 00 New
      +5
      This is a memorial complex in the village of Lesnaya, Slavgorod district, Mogilev region, the Republic of Belarus. The complex was laid down in the 1908 year in honor of the 200 anniversary of the victory of the Russian regiments under the command of Peter 1 over the Swedes on 28 on September 1708. Peter 1 called this battle the “MOTHER OF THE POLTAVA VICTORY”. The Poltava battle took place exactly nine months later. At the local cemetery there is an obelisk on the mass grave of the fallen in that battle.
    4. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 3 June 2013 18: 11 New
      0
      Monuments to Lenin and Dzerzhinsky preserved in Belarus, but there is no monument to Peter the Great, which, as it were, hints

      And for what merits to Russophobe the Westerner, an idiot drunkard and smoker No. 1 to erect monuments. For shaving beards, for violently imposing drunkenness, smoking, wearing scanty caftans and short pants? Because he reduced the population of Russia by 25% and clung to the reforms of Ivan the Terrible?
      1. shurup
        shurup 3 June 2013 23: 52 New
        0
        Wearing pants in ancient Rome was equated with barbarism. Next, write it yourself, but do not get carried away with the percentage of ... pants.
        I will personally answer for my smoking myself and not before I. Grozny, he ...
  2. fenix57
    fenix57 3 June 2013 07: 24 New
    +4
    The strange position of the Vitebsk city executive committee ... Let's hope that the shreds of the Vitebsk administration fly around the back streets! hi
    1. EDW
      EDW 3 June 2013 10: 29 New
      +4
      Our *** executive committees are still a swamp, you won’t get anything of them, only the dads are afraid of arrival. smile And if something, they will say something like "but we didn’t offer it, only such an opportunity was considered."

      PS: Familiar, for the most part, although they say that they do not need a monument to a foreigner-conqueror in their hometown, only a few will be indignant. Here people are very inert - neither protests, nor orange or blue revolutions, nothing like this has a chance of success laughing .
      1. Egoza
        Egoza 3 June 2013 10: 44 New
        +8
        Quote: edw
        Families, for the most part, even though they say that they don’t need a monument to a stranger in their hometown,

        In fact, you need to look at least at Vika before judging ...
        "Around 1318 year Olgerd married the daughter of Vitebsk prince Maria Yaroslavna. He lived and reigned in the Sanctuary [8]. In 1341, together with his brother Keistut, he was invited by the Pskov people to protect the Pskov lands from the Livonian knights. He refused the offer to reign in Pskov, but left his son Andrei to the city. He owned the city of Krevo and the lands stretching to the Berezina River. After the death of his father-in-law, Yaroslav became the prince of Vitebsk.In the 1345 year, Keistut, by prior agreement with Olgerd, occupied Vilna and transferred the Vilnius lands to Olgerd. The brothers were allocated eunacy to Zaslavl, who was three days away from Vilna.Olgerd contributed to the development of construction in the city of Orthodox churches (the oldest church in Vilnius was St. Nicholas Church [9]; in the first half of the 1340's there was a monastery in the city where Gedimin’s sister lived [10]. The founding date of the Pyatnitsky church is 1345, and the Prechistensky church is 1346; Holy The Trinity Church was built after the meeting of the Orthodox with Olgerd [11] ..... Relations with the Chernigov princedom, Pskov, Smolensk, and Moscow are very different.
        http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9E%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%B3%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B4
        XXXX
        I believe that this letter was written by people who, out of ignorance, or intentionally play into the hands of those who want to pour mud on Lukashenko. Like "people write to him, but he doesn’t react"
        1. Nicholas C.
          Nicholas C. 3 June 2013 11: 16 New
          +3
          Quote: Egoza
          Olgerd contributed to the development of construction in the city of Orthodox churches

          There is such a moment. Starting from the very first Lithuanian prince Mindovg, historians seem to be unaware of the origin of the princes. Zhmudsky (Lithuanian in its present) origin is just one of the hypotheses. But their wives, it is well known, are Russian Orthodox among all. What is characteristic, Dovmont even became an Orthodox saint. There was a troubles on the joint Mindovg with the Order of the Destruction of the Yatvyag when the Pope crowned Mindovg with the king. But Mindovg only laughed at it. Even Jagiello managed to stay Orthodox before being catholicized. Therefore, the tradition of historians to call Lithuanian princes not pagan names, but pagan, raises questions.
        2. EDW
          EDW 3 June 2013 13: 05 New
          +1
          I read Vick, and not only ...
          And about Pskov they write differently. But in general:
          In 1363, Algerd defeated the Tatars army near the Blue Waters. He seized a number of Chernihiv-Seversky destinies, Kiev, Podolsk, Volyn lands, etc., subjugated the Principality of Smolensk to Lithuania. He also tried to extend his influence to Pskov and Novgorod, but did not achieve significant success. Olgerd’s attempt to conclude an anti-Moscow alliance with Khan Janibek in 1349 ended in failure. In 1368–72 he supported Tver against Moscow and made three unsuccessful campaigns against Moscow (1368, 1370, 1372) ... something like that.
          As for Maria Yaroslavovna, I haven’t digged information yet (I repent), but I immediately remembered the fate of Rogneda (and how marriages were often resolved in those and earlier times).

          I can say specifically about the situation that the very initiative veteran Tereshchenko Viktor Demyanovich from the village of Kopti, Vitebsk district, made a fuss with Olgerd. With his submission in the above-mentioned village, a whole memorial complex has been created, for which honor and praise are given. Intentionally, he would hardly begin to force a situation like "people write to him, but he does not react," rather because of thoughtlessness or ignorance.
      2. family
        family tree 3 June 2013 12: 02 New
        +3
        Families, for the most part, even though they say that they don’t need a monument to a foreigner-conqueror in their hometown,
        laughing The scoundrel won Maria Yaroslavna, and since the father-in-law of the children of the man did not leave the floor, after his death, Vitebsk also had to take over. Oh, insidious.
  3. individual
    individual 3 June 2013 07: 25 New
    +4
    Fair outrage of Belarusians about the opening of the monument to the hero alien people, alien faith and culture.
    This is like the opening by the Poles of a monument to I. Susanin or Kozma Minin on the Warsaw Palace Square.
    Father will figure it out with carriers of a foreign culture and will decide to preserve the Belarusian identity.
    Algerd let the Crusaders attend to them.
    1. family
      family tree 3 June 2013 11: 31 New
      +6
      Quote: individ
      Algerd let the Crusaders attend to them.

      For the fact that in 1331 he tapped them on bread? For dad?
    2. smile
      smile 3 June 2013 14: 07 New
      0
      individual
      Nevertheless, with the Old Man, the absolutely idiotic and “unparalleled in the world” variety of nationalists is the “Litvinians” ... These ... I won’t say who ... believe that the Litvinians are ancient Belarusians (naturally antagonistic to the damned wild Muscovites. .lyam) -friends of ancient ukrov Indians taught Sanskrit .... :))))
      It has no analogues because there are no more nationalists in the world who are trying to abandon their history, language and national identity in general and to adhere to the absolutely alien and not very successful Lithuanian people.
      By the way, the Lithuanians support them, "culturally exchange" - like the allies against us, the bad ones ... and choke on a roar when they discuss these literally "Ivanes who do not remember kinship" ...
      Of course I’m hoping for a dad ... but so far he hasn’t hit a finger on this issue ...
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 3 June 2013 18: 56 New
        +2
        Materiel. Lithuanians have very little relation to Litvinians. A bit like an erzya to Russians.
  4. waisson
    waisson 3 June 2013 07: 49 New
    0
    I think the old man will make a fair decision
  5. kartalovkolya
    kartalovkolya 3 June 2013 08: 12 New
    +5
    again, the fighters against the flood do not give comment on the article. This is firstly: spitting in the face of the Orthodox Slavs, and secondly: the main goal is the authority of the Old Man. (and in which case they will write off the petty official for nonsense). And your gentlemen’s ears are “crap democrats” sticking out and you won’t hide them. As popular wisdom says: “Do not wash it like that!” Soon these people will propose to erect a monument to fascist cannibals in the place of Khatyn, holy for all Belarusians. and then finally enslave. Hold on to the brothers: They won’t pass!
  6. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 3 June 2013 08: 40 New
    +3
    what time! the Geyropa climbed here and there and then they are looking for local historical ala Bendera! but dad then and not in the know! Nicho sha, he will quickly restore historical justice! tuta you are not in Ukraine with Bendery busts!
  7. Avenger711
    Avenger711 3 June 2013 08: 41 New
    +3
    Well, how else? It is necessary to expose the notorious Grand Duchy of Lithuania and Russian some Belarusian. Although, with his conversion to Catholicism, one can say Slavic there, nothing remained. The Catholic is the enemy of Russia.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 3 June 2013 09: 00 New
      +2
      Quote: Avenger711
      It is necessary to expose the notorious Grand Duchy of Lithuania and Russian by a certain Belarusian.

      Whose is it? An unknown people who perished during ethnic cleansing under Alexei Mikhailovich?
      1. Avenger711
        Avenger711 3 June 2013 14: 34 New
        0
        Is the name unclear?
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 3 June 2013 18: 59 New
          0
          Cool. Do you like the name "Muscovy"? Or do you prefer the self-name "Russia"?
          Guys, there are already problems with Ukraine, would you like to try to remake the history of Belarus so that problems appear there too?
  8. regsSSSR
    regsSSSR 3 June 2013 08: 46 New
    +1
    by the way, it will be necessary in Poland or in Lithuania that there is such a thing to deliver to any leader especially historically hated by them laughing and look at the stormy reaction of these mas
  9. Asgard
    Asgard 3 June 2013 09: 03 New
    -1
    There was no such state of Lithuania ...
    Olgerd was a Russian prince ...
    Fought against planting ChristianityAt the same time, the entire adult Russian population was destroyed, Mamai and Batuy- "khans" fought with Christianity from Siberian Tartaria ...
    Those who understood were at war - WHAT IS EVIL !!!!bloody

    History (real)) Wait in the "pen". To draw conclusions without understanding the historical value of EXPERIENCE and to do ASSESSMENTS prematurely ...
    There were such PEOPLE in historical retrospectiveneed to save.
    There will be a library Ivan the Terrible, clever Tsar (sorry could not resist evaluating))) much will become clear ...,ALL ....

    P | S I will say seditious thought, it is necessary to do so, so that they remember Hitler and what he tried to do, it is important for civilization (not for heroization))
    1. alexkross83
      alexkross83 3 June 2013 11: 33 New
      0
      Absolutely, right, and then our story was transcribed by this evil !!!! For some reason, it began with the baptism of Russia :-) :-) :-)
    2. smile
      smile 3 June 2013 14: 19 New
      0
      Asgard
      Alas, your untruth. These "Russian" princes all have Lithuanian names, which the Lithuanians still use ... another thing. that in the GDL by the 15-16th century the entire aristocracy (of Russian and Lithuanian origin) was completely polonized, lost its national identity, and in the majority began to consider itself Poles ...
      The Tatars did not fight Christianity, this is surprising, but they were quite tolerant .. but the Catholic comrades, primarily from Poland and their Orders, treated Orthodox schismatics even worse than the Saracens
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 3 June 2013 19: 00 New
        +2
        And how do you think, how Russian is the name Rurik?
  10. Lopatov
    Lopatov 3 June 2013 09: 05 New
    +4
    And why did “representatives of public organizations” decide that Belarusians are obliged to forget about their past?
    What is characteristic, among the signatories there is only one Belarusian, and a very interesting person: an ardent fighter with the Belarusian language in the local press.
    1. smile
      smile 3 June 2013 14: 26 New
      +1
      Lopatov
      The most doubtful is that Olgerd (Algirdas), a Lithuanian, was awarded a monument not because he managed his Russian subjects well, but because he actively and unsuccessfully competed with Russia ... that’s why I can understand those who were outraged .. .and you like it?
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 3 June 2013 19: 05 New
        +1
        Quote: smile
        Olgerd (Algirdas), Lithuanian

        That's all, the paragraph ... Materiel, materiel and again materiel.
        Even remaking someone’s story should be based on minimal knowledge. And not in the style of Belinsky with his "Country Moxel"
  11. smershspy
    smershspy 3 June 2013 09: 10 New
    +5
    Lord! It seems to me that again they are engaged in complete nonsense! Better to put a monument to the first giant Fedor Andreevich Makhnov (height 2 m. 85 cm.) Vitebsk district. It will be the right decision! I have the honor!
  12. family
    family tree 3 June 2013 09: 38 New
    +6
    Some kind of one-sided memory of "representatives of public organizations"
    1. cth; fyn
      cth; fyn 3 June 2013 10: 18 New
      -3
      the CIA bribed them. These felt their fingers everywhere and everywhere, it is extremely strange that a country with such a powerful statehood can praise its former enemies, all the more so since now there is nothing left of them.
  13. family
    family tree 3 June 2013 11: 03 New
    +2
    1. The annals of Bykhovets and Gustynskaya, The Velvet Book, say that Olgerd accepted Orthodoxy and the Orthodox name Alexander even before his marriage to Maria Yaroslavna, that is, before 1318
    2. The "Livonian Chronicles" by Herman Wartberg, on the contrary, claim that the funeral was performed according to the Lithuanian pagan rite: "At his funeral, in accordance with the Lithuanian superstition, a solemn procession was performed, with the burning of various things and 18 war horses." In the Moscow editions of the Life of the Vilnius Martyrs, it is written that at the insistence of the pagan Lithuanian court, Olgerd sentenced the three court Litvins, converted by Nestor to Christianity - Anthony, John and Eustathius, future saints.

    In favor of the first version there is undeniable evidence - he allowed to build several churches - two in Vitebsk and one in Vilna in the name of the holy martyr Paraskeva (Pyatnitskaya church), and most importantly, giving the name Andrei to his son would be, at least, surprising Do not be Orthodox. In favor of the second version, there is not a single concrete fact. It was beneficial for the Livonian Order to expose it as a pagan, and Moscow editions do not indicate what future saints were executed for.

    In any case, there is not a single concrete evidence of the persecution on his part of professing Orthodoxy. And, in fact, he was married to an Orthodox princess, lived at the Orthodox court, so I think that discussions about his religion can be left. And again it turns out that the enemies of our people have missed in choosing their hero. Not only is he friends with the Russians, he marries their girls, he also professes their religion, and he does not feel any disadvantage from it - this is not order.
    http://rumol.org/2013/03/13/nevygodnaya-istoriya-knyaz-olgerd/
  14. alexkross83
    alexkross83 3 June 2013 11: 40 New
    +2
    I believe that many who leave comments here need to study the past of their people! But not the story (from the Torah I), written to us by helpful chroniclers.
    1. family
      family tree 3 June 2013 12: 38 New
      +4
      Quote: alexkross83
      I believe that many who leave comments here need to study the past of their people!

      Do not wish. Not only that, they are also trying to judge, acts committed in the Middle Ages, from the point of view of modern politics and geography, not realizing that from the modern point of view the whole history of the modern world is easily described by the articles of the criminal code, and any past figure can be summed up, or tower laughing
  15. Valery-SPB
    Valery-SPB 3 June 2013 12: 37 New
    +2
    I support the position of all those who rightly pointed out the historical illiteracy of the signatories. And Prince Dovmont left the Litvins in Pskov. So what? What are the Polish-Lithuanian forces? In Lithuania, there was an autochthonous population of zhmud and aukshtayts, and the Russian princes ruled, who freely passed from one state formation to another, which were the Grand Duchy of Moscow (Russian) and the Grand Duchy of Russia, Lithuania and Zhemait (Samogit), also Russian. And his Grand Duke Jagello became the king of Poland by personal unity. His regiments and regiments of the Grand Duchy of Russia and Lithuania fought in 1410 between Grunwald and Tanneberg, and the entire ramming blow of the Teutonic cavalry was stopped by three Smolensk regiments (not from the principality of Moscow, alas) under the command of Semyon Linguven Olgerdovich!
    1. smile
      smile 3 June 2013 14: 36 New
      +1
      Valery-SPB
      You wrote almost everything correctly, except for one important point ... why did you decide. that the autochthonous population of the Lithuanian ON part was ruled by Russian princes?
      Then explain why they bore exclusively Lithuanian names, which the Lithuanians still use (well, until they got married with ours or were not polonized)?
      Example:
      Olgerd-Algirdas
      Vytautas-Vytautas
      Mindovg-Mindaugas
      Keistut-Keistutis-Kastitis (for zhamytay)
      ...Well. etc. Russians didn’t and still don’t call children .... Do not downplay the role of Lithuanians.
      1. Valery-SPB
        Valery-SPB 3 June 2013 19: 56 New
        +2
        I answer smile (2).
        But Shvarn Danilovich (in the baptism of John) is the prince of Kholmsky, Galitsky, the Grand Duke of Lithuania. The son of Prince Daniil of Galicia and Anna Smolenskaya, from the Galician branch of the Rurikovich clan. And this! (1): Karl, Ingeld, Farlaf, Ruar, Truan, Lidulfost ... Here (2): Ivor, Vuefast, Sheikhvern ... Here is Yavtyag, a contender for the Lithuanian name. And here! Ancestors of the Arabs? If anyone wants: Adulb, Alvad, Aldan. The lists are significant. These are two treaties of the Russian princes Oleg and Igor with Byzantium, with a list of Russian PERSONAL (!) Names who came with the princes of Rusich. Well, how is it not room for imagination?
        Palemon (Roman), according to legend, was the ancestor of the dynasty of Lithuanian princes. He has three sons: Bork, Kunos and Spera. Bork founded Yurbork, Kunos - the city of Kunas (Kaunas?). Spera also settled outside Zemaitiya (?) In the territory of future Lithuania (?). Only Kunos left offspring: Kernus, who founded the Lithuanian-Zavileysk Principality, and Gimbut, in Zemaitiya. Gimbutu was succeeded by the son of Montivil. His son, Skyrmont, was sent by his father outside Zemaitiya. Having crossed the rivers Vily and Neman, he founded the city of Novogrudok, which became the center of the Novogrudok principality.
        One of the branches of the village in the Principality of Polotsk, the eldest branch established itself in Navahrudak.
        Novogrudok is a city in the Grodno region of Belarus, in the past it is one of the main political and cultural centers of Black Russia. It was a large settlement in the lands of the Krivichy, which fell under the control of the Old Russian state at the end of the X century. The old Russian name is Novgorod.
        Reliable information about the Lithuanian princes appeared in the XIII century. Prince Mindovg, who became the founder of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, is mentioned. It is assumed that the genus died away at the end of the XIII or the beginning of the XIV century, although there was a hypothesis about the origin of the Gediminovich dynasty from Palemon.
        Descendants of the Lithuanian prince Gediminas: Velsky, Volyn Voronoi-Volynsky, Gurkovichi, Zaslavsky (from them the branch of the Mstislavsky), Zheslavsky, Zbarazhsky (from them - Vishnevetsky, Porytsky or Poretsky and Voronetsky, Kuretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Vorontsky, Vorontsky, Koretsky, Vorontsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Vorontsky, Vorontsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Koretsky, Vorontsky, Nesvitsky (from them Predelnitsky) Olelkovichi (from them Kiev, Pinsk — one branch, Slutsky), Patrikeev (from them Bulgakov (from which, in turn, the Golitsins, Kurakins), as well as the Khovansky and Schenyatev), Pinsk (two branches ); Polubensky (from them the Derechinsky); Sangushkovichi (from them the Lubartovich-Sangushko-Kovelsky, Sangushko-Koshirsky, Trubchevsky (from them Trubetskoy), Chartorysky or Chartoryzhsky, Chartorysky and, finally ... Jagellons (royal dynasty).
  16. Dawn
    Dawn 3 June 2013 12: 48 New
    0
    Who does not want to work in the present, he creeps into the past.
  17. family
    family tree 3 June 2013 13: 01 New
    +2
    Grunwald Reference
    - Allied forces totaled 91 regiments, of which 51 were Polish and 40 were of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania. In the Polish "banners" 7 were from the Russian regions of the kingdom, and in the Lithuanian army of 40 "banners" 36 were Russians. The most combat-ready were Smolensk regiments. The Polish historian of the 47th century, Jan Dlugosh, wrote: “The“ banners ”were called by the names of the Lithuanian lands, namely: Trokskaya, Vilenskaya, Grodno, Kovenskaya, Lida, Mednitskaya, Smolenskaya, Polotskaya, Vitebsk, Kiev, Pinsk, Novgorod, Brest, Volkovyskaya, Drogichinskaya, Melnitskaya, Kremenetskaya, Starodubskaya. " Russians made up XNUMX percent of the allied forces. The army of the Order opposed them - the army of knights, the troops of the vassal princes and the so-called guests or hunters - from various countries of Western Europe.

    And the fact that the Zhmudins name Lithuania was stolen in a quiet way does not make them Litvins at all, but the Lithuanians tongue
    1. smile
      smile 3 June 2013 14: 53 New
      +1
      family tree
      It’s strange, it turns out ... they stole the name Lithuania from the Russians, they stole the names ... they stole everything so that the stolen Russians stole everything comrades-in-arms from them, completely forgot .... wonders, don’t you find it?
      And Zhmudins still exist - zhamayts. In Lithuania, they like to tell jokes about them - for them it’s the standard of rude, greedy and stupid boor ... though they don’t tell the zhamaytam - they are also very pugnacious ... :)))))
      You should not read books like Bushkov's “Russia, which was not there,” which actively (and unreasonably) pushes a little thought about the ancient Belarusian Litvinians.
      We simply called the Litvinians all who were subjects of the ON. The Lithuanians created this state, and initially the entire elite was ethnically quite homogeneous. Well, it’s like now everyone who calls their Russians abroad Russian.
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 3 June 2013 19: 09 New
        0
        Well, definitely a follower of Belinsky.
      2. family
        family tree 3 June 2013 19: 33 New
        +2
        Quote: smile
        It’s strange for you ... they stole the name Lithuania from the Russians,

        He put it wrong, say they privatized the history of the GDL, and pulled it on themselves. The name Litvin has several definitions, from the smallest, zemait, to the inhabitants of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, and indeed, it is not a nationality. Francis Skorin, in one university he enrolled as Litvin, in the other as Ruthenian. Kosciuszko claimed that he was Litvin and a Pole by nationality.
        ps I sit and think what ..., I, the Arkhangelsk Pomors (which some who have become impoverished with a little intelligence, also consider nationality) harness themselves to the prince of Vitebsk, although he left a beautiful mark on the history of Belarus what
  18. Opera
    Opera 3 June 2013 13: 09 New
    +5
    Quote: Dawn
    Who does not want to work in the present, he creeps into the past

    Who does not know the past has no future!
  19. Corsair5912
    Corsair5912 3 June 2013 18: 26 New
    0
    Olgerd is clearly an enemy of the Russian people (Belarusians and Ukrainians were Russian at that time).
    The Polish-Lithuanian occupation, which became possible due to the princely civil strife, is the reason for the modern disunity of the Russian people.
    The cruel invader, who was the mortal enemy of our great-grandfathers, remains our enemy, even if he died long ago.
    To erect a monument to the enemy means to betray their grandfathers and great-grandfathers.
    "And forever and ever
    A coward, a traitor - we always despise
    The enemy is the enemy, and war is still war,
    And the dungeon is cramped, and freedom is one -
    And we always trust in her.

    Time has not erased these understandings,
    You just need to raise the upper layer -
    And steaming blood from my throat
    Feelings of eternity gush on us. "
    V. Vysotsky Ballad about time
    http://music.yandex.ru/#!/track/366676/album/37164
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 3 June 2013 19: 10 New
      0
      Quote: Corsair5912
      Polish-Lithuanian occupation, made possible by princely feuds

      Another "historian". And the Poles are generally from which side?
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 3 June 2013 21: 15 New
        0
        Quote: Spade

        Another "historian". And the Poles are generally from which side?

        And this is how you get up, if you snout to the north, then from the left.
        “On August 14, 1385, in the town of Krevo, Lithuanian prince Jagiello and 11-year-old Queen of Poland Jadwig entered into a dynastic marriage. He laid the foundation for the military-political bloc of both countries, and in March 1386, Jagiello under the name of Vladislav I received the Polish crown. According to the Union of Krevo The Grand Duchy of Lithuania committed itself to Catholicism, to transfer its treasury to Poland, to pay 200 thousand florins to Wilhelm of Austria for abandoning Jadwiga (they were previously engaged), to permanently annex Lithuanian, Ukrainian and Belarusian lands to Poland. "
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 3 June 2013 21: 40 New
          0
          And what, it was necessary to negotiate with the Golden Horde, to which the Moscow Principality belonged?

          The country was weakened by civil war and wars with aggressive neighbors - the Order, the Mongol-Tatars, Poland and the Principality of Moscow. And so they chose the least of evils. Moscow under the leadership of the Horde was more dangerous.

          By the way, Ukraine was conquered from the Horde as a present to Poland solely because they could not have kept it themselves. Crimean Khanate created too big problems
        2. Valery-SPB
          Valery-SPB 3 June 2013 22: 17 New
          0
          The Russian prince Jagello, at the conclusion of marriage and the accession to the throne of Poland, concluded a personal union, not a state one! Legally means - without the union of two states. And he was the second. Vladislav II.
        3. family
          family tree 3 June 2013 23: 53 New
          +1
          Quote: Corsair5912
          "On August 14, 1385, in the town of Krevo, Lithuanian prince Jagiello and 11-year-old Queen of Poland Jadwig entered into a dynastic marriage.

          Wow, damn it! Jagiello seduced the youngster for the sake of the Polish crown, and they signed Olgerd’s rivals, and at the same time they were immediately an enemy of the people and a traitor, that is, a traitor to the motherland! Ale, there seems to be another article there, a pure criminal, never a politician. Paragraph, NKVD taxis wassat
    2. family
      family tree 3 June 2013 19: 56 New
      +4
      Quote: Corsair5912
      Olgerd is clearly an enemy of the Russian people (Belarusians and Ukrainians were Russian at that time).

      belay . ON were Russians, Moscow Russians, Tver Russians, Novgorod Russians, and everyone enthusiastically muttered each other, in the competition for the challenge cup of the collector of Russian lands, that is, who will be in charge. The Novgorodians were a little smaller, they preferred to trade. The ON and Moscow reached the final, Moscow took the cup for a long time. Called internal disassembly.
      1. Valery-SPB
        Valery-SPB 3 June 2013 20: 47 New
        0
        Well done perepilka! And I still remember the words that converted to Catholicism, Prince Jeremiah Wisniewiecki, who led the Polish-Lithuanian troops to suppress the uprising of Bohdan Khmelnitsky: "For I am a prince and Russian governor!"
      2. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 3 June 2013 21: 21 New
        0
        Quote: perepilka

        belay . ON were Russians, Moscow Russians, Tver Russians, Novgorod Russians, and everyone enthusiastically muttered each other, in the competition for the challenge cup of the collector of Russian lands, that is, who will be in charge. The Novgorodians were a little smaller, they preferred to trade. The ON and Moscow reached the final, Moscow took the cup for a long time. Called internal disassembly.

        You do not know history well, it was not the people who fought, only princely squads of several hundred, rarely thousands of people, fought. The reasons were different, but the main one appeared after baptism, not all cities adopted Christianity and Russia was divided into 250 principalities. Christianity in Russia was finally confirmed with the help of the Tatars only in the 15th century.
  20. Valery-SPB
    Valery-SPB 3 June 2013 22: 07 New
    +2
    [quote = Corsair5912] [quote = perepilka]
    You do not know history well, it was not the people who fought, only princely squads of several hundred, rarely thousands of people, fought. The reasons were different, but the main one appeared after baptism, not all cities adopted Christianity and Russia was divided into 250 principalities. Finally, Christianity in Russia was confirmed with the help of the Tatars only in the 15th century. [/ Quote].
    And the princes collected the militia from the army (plowmen). The plowman in rati - for heroic death, infantry without armor, without military training, assembled so that the attacking horse squad bogged down and lost control.
    Oh yes! People still paid taxes to the prince. The cost of one village is a compound bow, the cost of another is forged, from the same place, a horse trained in military wisdom, and not a village blacksmith did a sword, but, with folk money.
    Oh, I forgot! Our princes from Ladoga and Novgorod went, and Pskov is nearby. And there the guys are not simple, free, we dabbled in our ears, but everyone in the "armored gilt", they say, even Stekolnu was robbed. To this he was noxious, either they would invite the princes, then they would be expelled. Tired of the life of such a prince Mstislav Udaloy.
    “You are evil,” he says. “I’ll leave you.” And what do you think? He left, left the miserable people, left without power. Leaving said: "I'm going to Russia!" There he was ... in the city of Galich!