The European drone hunter is ready. What about Russia?

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The European drone hunter is ready. What about Russia?

Munich-based Quantum Systems has unveiled its new single-engine UAV The Pulse P19 on the first day of ILA 2026. It is designed primarily for counter-drone operations and was developed specifically for this purpose, rather than being converted from a crop duster.

The model that was on display at the company's stand was armed with a radar, and the radar was not mounted externally in a container, but rather winged missiles and laser-guided munitions, but it was the unmanned interceptor drones that captured the imagination. Like, as the saying goes, destroys like, and there's a fair amount of common sense in that.



According to a company representative:

The aircraft will have a payload capacity of 2 tons and will be equipped with 12 such devices. We plan for the Pulse P19 to be optionally equipped with a crew and used for counter-drone swarms.

Having a radar capable of targeting both air and ground targets will increase the chances of detecting and destroying UAVs. Using the radar and an electro-optical/infrared turret, it will be possible to actively and passively detect and track long-range attack UAVs.

This would cost significantly less than launching $1,000,000 worth of air-to-air missiles. drones, which cost several times less.

Quantum Systems began its operations with the Vector unmanned aerial vehicle, which is used in Ukraine, where the company employs 500 people. It's unfortunate, of course, that so many employees are still unfamiliar with the Geranium or anything else in the modern Russian arsenal, but that's more of a political issue than a military one.


A reconnaissance drone powered by artificial intelligence, developed by the German manufacturer Quantum Systems, is being widely used in the war in Ukraine. With significant financial support from the German government, this drone is a vital tool for the Ukrainian armed forces in the areas of reconnaissance, surveillance, and real-time target acquisition.

All sensors, flight control systems, artificial intelligence, and actuators are seamlessly integrated into Quantum's proprietary Mosaic UXS avionics systems.

The platform, originally designed for counter-drone operations, will be equipped with a machine gun module, laser-guided munitions, and other new types of precision-guided munitions. All of this luxury will be guided by radar and an electro-optical/infrared guidance system.

Martin Baker has proposed the Mark 17 ejection seat for the manned version of the Pulse P19. Quantum plans to fly the aircraft in the summer of 2027.


Earlier that day, Airbus Helicopters and Quantum Systems signed a cooperation agreement under which the parties will jointly explore the integration of Quantum Systems' advanced C-UAS interceptors onto Airbus military helicopters, beginning with the multirole H145M. This strategic partnership is based on a shared commitment to strengthening Europe's defense ecosystem and providing armed forces with flexible, combat-ready solutions to counter modern asymmetric air threats.

Stéphane Thomé, Executive Vice President, Programmes, Airbus Helicopters, said:
"The H145M, with its advanced open system architecture and exceptional growth potential, is the ideal starting point for this joint initiative. Combining our extensive military helicopter portfolio with innovative unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) solutions aviation systems, we are strengthening Europe’s technological sovereignty and defence potential.”


Martin Karkur, Chief Revenue Officer at Quantum Systems, added:

As a pioneer in high-tech solutions for the unmanned era, we strive to help armed forces gain a decisive technological advantage in the fight against increasingly sophisticated aerial threats. Recent events demonstrate the need for unmanned systems to defend against drones.

So, Europe has become concerned about the demonstrated effectiveness of UAVs, and so concerned that it's begun investing heavily in their development. Some are wary, others are apprehensive. It's all normal, a completely expected reaction.

Of course, the model shown at the exhibition, as experience shows, is far from being an aircraft capable of performing combat missions. But it's either a path to an aircraft or a path to nowhere.

A very fair question immediately arises: what do we have?


In fact, if you look at the other side of the front, you'll see some reckless guys there have been chasing drones in Yak-18s, Yak-52s, and other archaic aircraft for a long time now. The pilot flies the plane, and the gunner fires at the drones with a semi-automatic shotgun or assault rifle.


It's not a bad idea: buckshot is very effective at disintegrating drones, the only problem is that you have to get within 50-60 meters to ensure a hit. Furthermore, there's a risk of the UAV's warhead detonating, which could cause serious damage to the aircraft. However, the opinion about who gets into the cockpits of these aircraft has already been expressed above. Overall, though, it's commendable; firing a shotgun from a training aircraft isn't something everyone can do.

So what do we have? Sadly, nothing at all. Drones continue to make daily visits to Russian refineries, and with considerable success. And this is no coincidence.

I read the opinions of “experts” that “the Ukrainians have made breaches in the Defense Russia" and that's why now their drones are flying in parade formation to Ufa and Naberezhnye Chelny and no one can do anything to them.


Let me disagree.

Every day, our Ministry of Defense publishes the number of drones destroyed. Some media outlets in that very city report how many UAVs were shot down en route to Moscow. But excuse me, these hundreds aren't shot down in Lyubertsy and Chekhov; they're shot down much further afield. In Belgorod, Kursk, Bryansk, Voronezh.

I'd simply suggest anyone writing such nonsense to live in one of these cities for a few days and appreciate the scale of what's happening. I won't go far: June 9th, from midnight to 6 a.m. – three alarms. All three, with full-blown special effects in the sky. Sirens wail, rockets rise and fall, and the people… And the people don't pay any attention to this wailing. Seriously, without bragging: no one is running anywhere, because there's nowhere to run, and there's no point.

Let me digress to something that's almost a joke: we got a new boss at the top of the management team at the Southeastern Railway. A very senior one, all the way from the northern capital. So, the boss was very surprised on the first night that the sirens were blaring, and the people were throwing wrenches at it. There, in Luga specifically, if the sirens start blaring, all the traffic lights turn red, work stops, and the people scatter to shelters. That's the way it works.

Well, if we do that here, it'll be a joke, and no one will get south on time. So, after a week of studying how our stations work, a high-ranking official decided that Luga is fine, but Voronezh is a no-no. So, the sirens wail, and the train conductors make up the trains.

In terms of losses, there haven't been any significant ones over the past four years. The worst damage, perhaps, was the burning of a sawmill and its materials last year. Otherwise, it's nothing. Yes, it's a shame when people are left homeless after a drone hits an apartment, but overall, there's no reason to complain.

Kursk is about the same. Belgorod is worse, much worse, but there story Another: the city was within range of everything from 120mm mortars to Highmars. They prevailed in numbers.

The whole point is that the Voronezh and Kursk regiments have been vying for the title of best in the Western Military District for years. And that says a lot. The crews really knew what they were doing, and now there can be no talk of professional suitability at all.


Or does anyone still think the other side is full of idiots and masturbators? No, they've actually learned to think and count there. And that's precisely why they started launching drones through the Baltics. Bypassing them. Or through the southern border, where air defense systems have never existed because they were completely unnecessary.

By "south," we mean the Orenburg-Orsk-Magnitogorsk-Chelyabinsk-Kurgan-Omsk arc. This isn't really the north, per se—it's the southern border. And from across this border, operating along the Nizhnekamsk-Naberezhnye Chelny-Sterlitamak-Ufa sector is quite simple. And there's no need to invent anything; all of the aforementioned cities are within 500 km of the potential launch point on the Kazakh side.

I don't even want to hear about Kazakhstan being in the CSTO, the EAEU, or even the Communist Party of the Soviet Union. Here, the issue isn't decided at the state level, but at the local level. And at the local level, almost anything can be resolved with money with the Kazakhs. Almost – because everything was decided with money in Ukraine. There, the people in uniform and in office are more shameless. But the Kazakhs haven't really gone very far either.

I'm among those who are convinced that the attacks on the Ural-Siberian oil refineries are coming from the south, not the west. Simply because it all seems quite logical on one hand, and completely illogical on the other. We shoot down 100, 200, 300 drones targeting Moscow, while at the same time, 5-6 manage to reach the Urals without a hitch.

Doubtful? No, not really.

There are only two options here. The first is to completely overload the air defenses in the east of the country, playing it safe—maybe something will slip through. The second is to bring the drone closer to the target and launch it without any problems. This doesn't apply to Crimea and the Krasnodar and Rostov regions, where the attack ranges are already minimal.

Is it difficult to transport a UAV? As Operation "Spiderweb" demonstrated, nothing is impossible. And perhaps trucks carrying dismantled "Lyuty" drones are still roaming the country.

Now about the air defenses, which are currently the subject of a barrage of criticism. Allegedly, all the radars have been destroyed, the air defenses are blinded and can't fire, so the drones do whatever they want.

Let's ask ourselves: was this air defense?

Let's look at the composition of the air defense forces of the Central Military District:
- 28th Anti-Aircraft Missile Brigade (Mirny, Kirov Region, 2 S-300V divisions and support units);
- 297th Guards Anti-Aircraft Missile Brigade, military unit 02030 (Leonidovka village, Penza region) (Buk-M2 air defense missile system);
- 76th Air Defense Division, military unit 34244 (Samara), subordination to the Aerospace Forces;
- 24th mobile anti-aircraft missile brigade, military unit 79222 (Divnogorsk, Abakan), subordination to the Aerospace Forces.

And that's all. It's clear that there are army air defense units within the motorized rifle and tank parts, but there are few of them, and their task, so to speak, is to protect their own.


Of course, the regions won't be left without air defense entirely, but here's a map showing the deployment of air defense units according to the list provided, taken from completely open sources. It suggests that all of the units listed can be considered a second-tier defense. And from the south, to Ufa, Chelyabinsk, Nizhnekamsk, and Naberezhnye Chelny—fly…


Let me repeat: the cities there won't be left completely without air defense; it's a question of numbers and training. And it's clear where the best units are.

And here the question truly arises: how to protect and with what. And something smarter is needed than deploying bank employees to repel drone attacks who knows what and when.

And now, today, the finger-pointing has begun at the West, where they've begun "urgently" preparing for a war with drones. They say they're already there, and we, as always, aren't ready.

Let's start with the fact that Europe is preparing for a Russian attack sometime around 2030 or a little later. This will happen by the time budgets are spent and the necessary equipment is created to most effectively repel anything coming from the east.

A perfectly reasonable approach. And they'll likely have a UAV fighter aircraft, barring anything untoward happening with the sixth-generation fighter.

Should we learn from this experience and rush to invent something based on the Yak-52? Definitely not.


This aircraft is completely unsuitable for mounting any effective search equipment. That is, it can be used in the Ukrainian style: visual detection, then small arms fire. From the cockpit. Last century, they tried to make the Yak-52B, a counterinsurgency aircraft, but to install two unguided rocket pods, they had to redesign the wing. They reinforced it, made it heavier, and so on.


There was the Yak-52B2 project. A lightweight drone interceptor. This modification was able to accommodate a 360-degree radar and an onboard computer. But the armament plan called for a 12-gauge semiautomatic carbine. In other words, the same variant as its neighbors, only with a radar.


But the Yak-52's top speed of 250-270 km/h doesn't make it a suitable hunter, limiting its use to very low-speed drones. Anything flying at 200 km/h or faster is beyond its reach. And there are plenty of things flying.

The Yak-152, a flying step up from the Yak-130, could have improved the situation, but alas, this aircraft is just as in dire straits as all other non-combat aircraft. We've paid enough attention to Rostec's plans for civilian aircraft to conclude that while there are plans, there are no aircraft, and none are expected.


Then there's the question of pilots who will board planes and begin targeting drones with their keen eyes as they sneak toward yet another oil refinery. This is a challenge, to put it mildly, because the training process itself is quite expensive. And for such flights, you don't need a recent flight school cadet with 120 minutes of flight time, but someone far more serious. We're not talking about swerving over an airfield, but about getting as close as possible to a flying bomb packed with explosives.

No, if the state starts paying for flight training at, say, DOSAAF... Then the situation might change. In five or six years. But it's doubtful that by then there will be enough aircraft to form light interceptor squadrons.

So, there are no planes and none expected anytime soon, nor are there any pilots for them. Is everything lost?

Not quite.

Oddly enough, there is a counter-UAV weapon that can replace the light aircraft we don't have. These are helicopters.

The helicopter in the Air Defense Forces is already a fully formed archaic device, practically useless due to its catastrophic vulnerability. This has long been clear and understood, but we still have plenty of helicopters, and we have the pilots to fly them.


This idea was confirmed by the penultimate raid. We have a few helicopters based here and there. And they often participate in repelling attacks. Naturally, on the outskirts of the city or over the reservoir. Just in case, as they say.

The last time, a pair of rotary-wing aircraft were flying something over the industrial zone. They didn't hang around for long, about three minutes. Then they flew back to base, passing right over our sector. And in the industrial zone, fire sirens started wailing, as always, according to our reports: drone debris had set a barn on fire.

In short: unlike a light training aircraft, a combat helicopter has a radar (well, many do), a radar, a laser rangefinder, and so on. In other words, the machine is almost fully equipped and can take down anything from a Geranium-type drone to a cruise missile.

Of course, in this version, the YakB-12,7 machine gun would look much better on the Mi-28N instead of the GSh-23, as the Mi-24 has a four-barreled, large-caliber machine gun. After all, a 30mm round is too much for a drone, and the ammunition is too few. A cannon is a bit more complex and expensive.

Faster targets can easily be dealt with using the Ataka-V; the missile has proven itself in all its glory, and it can be used to confuse not only tanks, and the fact that it is radio-controlled is simply wonderful.

Besides, our helicopters can easily carry the Strelets missile system. And these are the Igla-V missiles, a wonderful weapon, capable of shooting down anything from an airplane to a cruise missile.

It turns out that we don't have an aircraft capable of effectively hunting drones, and the existing Yak-130 trainer is perfectly suited for attacking medium-speed targets, such as cruise missiles and UAVs with turbojet engines, which neither a Yak-52 aircraft nor a helicopter can catch.


There's also no faith that Russia can create such an aircraft from scratch and launch it into production. The shameful story of the An-2 replacement is a good example. And the "revival" of domestic passenger aviation—well, that's just the final nail in the coffin of faith in our aviation industry.

Of course, it's necessary to keep an eye on what's happening in the world. Naturally, we need to be aware of the activities of those who are preparing to go to war with us in the near future. Yes, it's difficult to say how serious all these preparations are, but it's worth noting that Europe could easily cause a lot of unpleasantness, because we are adults and understand that all this "Made in Ukraine" stuff is actually Made in the EU. And we shouldn't forget the great generosity of Great Britain.

So drones will continue to fly eastward, just as they have been. And we must seriously utilize all realistic possibilities for repelling such attacks, rather than constructing empty plans. It's clear that a well-designed plan can secure subsidies; the only question is how much of the project will be a Pantsir, and how much an Armata.

They can build whatever they want in Europe; their war isn't going to start anytime soon. But ours clearly won't end anytime soon, so we need to take a more down-to-earth approach. And the proposal isn't entirely without common sense. If a helicopter has no business being on the front lines, then its place is in the rear. Of course, an anti-tank helicopter as an air defense system is a real challenge, but what can we do?


In our city, they've also started selling gasoline at 20-liter tank caps. Whether you like it or not, looking at the footage of burning refineries, you start to think: something needs to be done.
116 comments
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  1. +3
    16 June 2026 05: 26
    "Will you like it or not, you start thinking, looking at the footage of burning oil refineries. Something has to be done." A fire broke out at an oil depot in the Krasnodar region after a Ukrainian drone strike. Emergency services are currently working to extinguish the fire.
    1. +1
      16 June 2026 10: 39
      Like stocking up on gasoline?
      1. +1
        18 June 2026 08: 22
        ,
        Quote: 220-volt
        Like stocking up on gasoline?

        Switch to electric cars, they can probably be charged by wind turbines and solar panels laughing

        A global UAV detection and tracking system should probably be created across the country. All cell towers should be equipped with audio and optical sensors capable of monitoring sound and visually detecting UAVs. Working together as a unified system, it would be possible to both determine entry routes and promptly issue aircraft control orders.
        After all, there is aviation along the entire border, but judging by everything, there is no timely target designation for it.
  2. +3
    16 June 2026 05: 29
    The sirens are wailing, the rockets are taking off and falling, and the people… The people aren't paying any attention to this wailing anymore. Seriously, no boasting: no one's running anywhere, because there's nowhere to run, and there's no point.

    Well, yes...the apotheosis of everything that is happening. request
    When will Baikals finally start flying all over Russia?
    1. +2
      16 June 2026 08: 10
      UTS-800, as an option...
      1. +5
        16 June 2026 12: 59
        Recently, on a slow but not banned video hosting site (which, incidentally, sometimes works even without special software, especially if the provider has sent a speed limit notification), there was a NY Times report about an An-28 crew working against drones. The only modifications it has are a single M134 machine gun mounted near the left side exit, and that's it. No radar, no guided missiles, nothing. Just a rapid-fire 7,62mm belt-fed machine gun and the gunner's steady hands. But, oddly enough, that's all it takes. All target information is transmitted through the Delta system, which directs the crew to the desired point, and from there, the "free hunt" begins. The crew itself—unthinkable by our standards—is entirely volunteer, consisting of former retirees (the chief pilot, for example), fathers of many children, and other men exempt from conscription. The result is a very simplified version of a gunship, the flight hour of which will definitely be cheaper than the same characteristics of any possible helicopter.
      2. +1
        16 June 2026 14: 26
        Yes, but it needs to be unmanned. Because enemy drones are evolving and will soon be carrying air defense missiles themselves.
        This unmanned version of the aircraft is needed so that we don’t start losing pilots.
        1. +1
          17 June 2026 23: 59
          They've been carrying missiles for a long time, and they started carrying them before our geraniums. We lost a helicopter over Millerovo a couple of months ago. Our enemies are very resourceful and strong, don't underestimate them.
        2. 0
          18 June 2026 08: 30
          While UAVs fly on propeller engines, and slowly, as all kinds of propeller-driven fighters grow, UAVs will switch to jet engines, and all propeller-driven defense will instantly become obsolete.
          And another option is that the missiles you mentioned, or the BALAs themselves, thanks to their cheap optics and onboard AI, will attack the planes and helicopters that are attacking them.
          In the long term, it is of course necessary to increase the effectiveness of combat aviation or create loitering fighter drones.
    2. +2
      16 June 2026 20: 45
      When will Baikals finally start flying all over Russia?

      When will they start jailing those who successfully utilized the allocated funds, but that's all? There are still no planes.
  3. + 12
    16 June 2026 05: 31
    To begin hunting drones, you first need to detect them, and I think the very first step is to look at an AWACS system, whether it's on an aircraft, a hot air balloon, or an airship. Radar installed on even the most basic and inexpensive aircraft simply won't detect a low-flying drone. It might be able to shoot it down, of course, but it's unlikely to detect it. In short, the main thing is to detect it, and detect it as far away as possible. There are plenty of weapons for this, from aircraft to ground-based systems, to shoot it down.
    1. +2
      16 June 2026 07: 01
      Quote: Xenon
      and as for shooting it down, there are plenty of weapons for this, from aircraft to ground systems

      Are you sure?
      1. +1
        16 June 2026 07: 52
        Quote: lithium17
        Are you sure?
        And you?
        1. -1
          16 June 2026 09: 23
          And I know the real state of affairs...
          1. 0
            16 June 2026 10: 39
            And I know the real state of affairs...
            Then the cards are in your hands! What's the real state of affairs there?
            1. -2
              16 June 2026 11: 59
              This is terrible! Talk to the volunteers and the guys who managed to get home on vacation. Find out about the mobilization plan from the authorities... Go to the gas station; by the way, many have switched to cash! Go to the store.
              1. +2
                16 June 2026 16: 24
                Well, it's obvious that things are truly dire. But what needs to be done? Yes, here on this site, most of the people are just talking nonsense; the real decisions are made elsewhere, but at least we can chat and fantasize. What else can we do?
                By the way, I doubt anyone will share the mobilization plan. It's a closely guarded secret for now.
  4. + 23
    16 June 2026 05: 54
    As the saying goes: it's not that there are no planes, but that there's no Stalin. But seriously, there's no accountability across the entire vertical of power for wrongdoing, or rather, inaction. Putin, who built this notorious vertical based on personal loyalty, forgets to demand loyalty, first and foremost, to the state, from his accomplices. With the economy developing since the "holy" 90s, internal statehood and personal accountability within all branches of government have been completely neglected, as evidenced by the billionaire judges, governors, and their deputies. Below them come millionaire police officers, prosecutors, and so on—the list is endless. And the funniest thing will be that in September, United Russia will win the elections again, despite the fact that almost every thieves belong to this party.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  5. +6
    16 June 2026 05: 59
    Sorry, but writing that light aviation is useless, knowing that the enemy is confidently intercepting a significant portion of our UAVs with this very same aviation—well, that's just so-so...
    But the observation about the small sky being completely blocked for Russia is spot on. They've ruined the small sky in Russia.
  6. +1
    16 June 2026 06: 04
    The article is in pieces and not even read by the author - sentences stick out chaotically in all directions.
    It feels like it was cobbled together from two articles by different authors.
  7. + 10
    16 June 2026 06: 07
    Quote: igorra
    And the funniest thing will happen in September: United Russia will win the elections again, despite the fact that the thieves are all members of this party.
    It was funny in 1996, when there was absolutely no work in the country, the ruble was depreciating every day, the army was delaying ration payments for an entire year, the alcoholic Yeltsin slept through a state visit to Ireland, and even drunkenly urinated on the tire of a government plane in New York and conducted a German orchestra with drunken abandon. And the funniest thing was when this lousy alcoholic "won" a second election and became president for a second time. And not a single country in the democratized West noticed any violations in these "elections."
    1. +5
      16 June 2026 06: 28
      What's the point of these memories? In your opinion, everything's fine now. Or do you have no opinion, and the TV does all the thinking for you?
      1. +7
        16 June 2026 08: 10
        In your opinion, everything is fine now.
        It only gets worse. wink
        1. +2
          16 June 2026 15: 02
          How can things get better when the heirs of that same alcoholic Borka are at the helm? Or has the government's course changed? Or has it stopped stealing and smuggling money abroad?
  8. +3
    16 June 2026 06: 11
    Maybe we should revive the aviation of the WWII era?
    1. +7
      16 June 2026 07: 13
      It's necessary. But there's no one. The expertise is lost. Otherwise, the La-7 would be an excellent drone hunter.
      1. 0
        16 June 2026 10: 27
        The La-7 has percale skin and won't last long. The post-war all-metal La-11 is better - it's a modification with increased range and flight duration.
        1. mz
          0
          16 June 2026 11: 30
          Quote: Melior

          The La-7 has percale upholstery, it won't last long,


          The La-7 has birch veneer skin. It's still stronger than percale when properly treated.
          1. 0
            16 June 2026 11: 39
            Not all: ailerons and tail unit - percale.
      2. 0
        16 June 2026 12: 58
        Yes, most likely, the L-29 would be perfectly capable of catching drones. But you have to think about it, do something, what if it doesn't work out and they land it? Better to do nothing, maybe it'll go away!
        1. +1
          16 June 2026 16: 43
          Do we even have any left? I think both the L29 and L39 were written off and scrapped long ago.
          1. -1
            16 June 2026 17: 19
            Officially, no, but perhaps they didn't manage to cut everything up. Of course, no one will restore them, just as no one will build a similar MiG-21-level plane using a single Yak-130 engine. At most, they could hold a presentation and steal all the money.
            1. 0
              16 June 2026 18: 20
              If I'm not mistaken, we had an aerobatic team performing on L-3s, but as for their safety... My father served at the BVVAUL airfield, there were tons of those L-3s there, cadets trained on them, and there were at least 150 MIG-21s of various modifications, many of them with unused service life... After the school was disbanded, all this stuff was successfully disposed of.
              1. -1
                16 June 2026 18: 30
                It's usually like this here—if you're in the European part, everything's scrap, but in Siberia, maybe there's some left over. Those bastards are actually stuffing L29 engines into their Flamingos, as they say. They find some work somewhere, after all.
              2. 0
                17 June 2026 14: 13
                In Slavgorod they wanted to make a storage base on the 21st and 23rd, but... crying
            2. -5
              16 June 2026 21: 12
              Are you sure you're from Moscow State University? They're already rolling out the Su-75, and you suddenly need a MiG-21.
              Why use one engine from the Yak-130 if two aren't enough? They're developing a new SM-100 for it?
              I don’t see any logic in your statements.
              1. -1
                16 June 2026 22: 00
                Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                They're already rolling out the Su-75, and you suddenly need the MiG-21.

                By the time they're rolled out, by the time they're built, by the time the pilots are trained, the enemies will already have Terminators on jump packs cutting through them
                Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                Why use one engine from a Yak-130?

                To make a simple single-engine aircraft for local missions, not for maneuverable combat. In fact, a Global Hawk equivalent could have been developed using this engine long ago, but they decided to make an Altius with two diesel engines and propellers, and everything was stolen and destroyed.
                Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                if two are not enough for him

                What does he lack? Flight training on real fighter jets with high acceleration? The Yak-130 has a thrust-to-weight ratio of over 0.5, so he could cobble together a new MiG-17-level drone, fly drones, and launch a couple of FABs.
                Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                They are developing a new SM-100 for it

                Great, if they did put it into production - the extra half ton of power wouldn't hurt!
                Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                I don’t see any logic in your statements.

                Logic: they could have made a drone catcher a long time ago, an unmanned aircraft flying behind our lines and shooting down enemy drones with something cheap. They once showed off the Grom jet drone; if Kronstadt hadn't gone bankrupt and if someone had been there to finish it, they could have done it a long time ago. But there's no one, and the Ministry of Defense doesn't need it for free; it's just a matter of time and doesn't want to scrap old anti-aircraft missiles in Ukraine.
      3. +1
        17 June 2026 14: 10
        "And a deer (helicopter) is better!" Helicopters are widely used as drone interceptors (according to a well-known blogger), and even manage to take down a couple dozen in a single sortie.
        1. 0
          17 June 2026 15: 32
          No better. Out of hopelessness.
          1. 0
            19 June 2026 13: 43
            What's the alternative? Even considering the shortages, an interceptor helicopter, in my opinion, is quite suitable!
            1. 0
              19 June 2026 14: 31
              It's carrying a lot of unnecessary stuff. A light fighter with a couple of machine guns, a radar, and an OLS would have been better.
  9. +9
    16 June 2026 06: 15
    And the “revival” of domestic passenger aviation – well, this is simply the final nail in the coffin of faith in our aviation industry.

    What aviation industry? In our country, it's easier to make money reselling...tax laws allow speculation and don't stimulate production.
    1. +4
      16 June 2026 07: 10
      Quote: Konnick
      What aviation industry?

      Honestly, we're perfectly capable of creating a similar drone fighter. If we plan to maintain the air defense system for another five years, then we can start now. And train the right personnel. "Komsomolets on a plane" should be in the spirit of our times. Only, of course, not "Komsomolets," but... I don't even know who...
      1. +4
        16 June 2026 07: 13
        not "Komsomolets", but...

        UNDP member!
        1. 0
          17 June 2026 10: 53
          The Yundros won't even intercept drones. They'd rather march with flags and shout "for Russia" at rallies, quietly siphoning off money. We've already had "Nashi" (Ours). The movement's commissars were jailed, while others, out of hatred for their homeland, fled to unfriendly countries for permanent residence. And the movement's leader, Vasily Yakimenko, gives scandalous interviews and regrets nothing; he should be in the Arctic Circle, or better yet, building a road to Kamchatka.
      2. +3
        16 June 2026 07: 45
        Quote: Puncher
        Quote: Konnick
        What aviation industry?

        Honestly, we're perfectly capable of creating a similar drone fighter. If we plan to maintain the air defense system for another five years, then we can start now. And train the right personnel. "Komsomolets on a plane" should be in the spirit of our times. Only, of course, not "Komsomolets," but... I don't even know who...

        The existing government structures are unwilling to manage the economy by creating state-owned unitary enterprises. They can only privatize the remaining state-owned enterprises, which included the aircraft factories...so there's no point in expecting a revival of production of the An-2, Su-26, Yak-52, and others. We started the SVO with Soviet weapons, and it looks like we'll end it with the same.
      3. 0
        17 June 2026 14: 15
        There are also "pence" ready to "shake off the old days"!
  10. +4
    16 June 2026 06: 17
    The European drone hunter is ready. What about Russia?

    Well, we haven't even started yet. Everyone's in a rush, rushing, and they've already finished it in six months to a year.

    We have a very high level of monopolization or oligopolization of any market. A dinosaur is generally big and powerful, but by the time the signal reaches the brain and back... they can bite off its tail.
  11. + 11
    16 June 2026 06: 58
    To counter drones, we need a SYSTEM, not just individual airplanes and helicopters! Even if they're sophisticated and fully equipped, it means we need to build a structure from scratch that has everything we need and deploys it within large regiment-brigade units, each with hundreds of aircraft and support and control bases, not just a dozen. Essentially, we need to build everything from scratch: airplanes, control and detection systems, training units. And with people like Rogozin and Chubais in the mix, all we have left is the slogan: "Work, brothers!"
  12. +5
    16 June 2026 07: 21
    I agree that you shouldn't rely on the Yak-52 (!)...on many counts! As for the Yak-52B, the redesign (strengthening) of the wing didn't really help solve the problems! Test results showed that the Yak-52B shoots poorly and has become worse at flying! These are the main reasons why the Yak-52B was never completed! By the way, they tried to do the same with the Yak-152! But then the fact that the Yak-152 "died" decided! Some time ago, aviation schools were offered the SR-10 aircraft (by the way, the AR-10 drone was also based on this aircraft!), but the Ministry of Defense wrinkled its face and wrinkled its "buns", saying, "We don't need that airplane! We have the Yak-130 and the Czechs! We have enough of this!" True, later, they decided to get a turboprop UTS-800! I can't say how things are with the UTS-800 lately (I haven't kept track!), but it looks like the SR-10 will have to be forgotten forever! Too bad! The SR-10 would have made a good UAV fighter! And the AR-10 drone would have been "something"! But for now, all we can do is rely on the UTS-800! Create a "3-in-1" out of it! 1. A UAV; 2. A "Yastrebok" UAV; 3. Maybe even a UAV itself!
  13. -1
    16 June 2026 07: 43
    And that's precisely why they started launching drones through the Baltics. Bypassing them. Or through the southern border, where air defense systems have never existed because they were completely unnecessary.

    They're stretching their air defenses. The air defenses are currently concentrated practically along the front line (well, Moscow has its own). The Ukrainians are trying to stretch their air defenses in different directions and thereby reduce the concentration near the front line.
  14. +2
    16 June 2026 08: 01
    Should we rely on manned aircraft? Not only is it difficult to find enough of these aircraft, but finding enough pilots is no less challenging! But there are plenty of people in the country willing to play "airplanes" with a joystick in hand! And at the same time, wear a uniform and feel like soldiers! And there are a "relatively" sufficient number of relatively inexpensive UAVs, such as the Gerber, which have been successfully perfected to an acceptable level! They are already equipped with video cameras (thermal imagers), online controls, and can even be equipped with automatic shotguns and even machine guns! Landing by parachute or on wheels is possible, and a "peasant self-defense" can be created!
    1. 0
      16 June 2026 14: 50
      Yes, yes. They're already recruiting for the training centers. I'm signing contracts. And if you don't master the technique or don't get a bird, your next steps are spelled out in the contract. The need for people at the LBS hasn't gone away.
  15. +1
    16 June 2026 08: 07
    The helicopter in the Air Defense Forces is already a fully formed archaism, a machine practically useless due to its catastrophic vulnerability.
    The same was said about the main battle tank. But the Mi-28N and Ka-52M have their own radars and radars and can easily catch up with the drones. So it's too early to write off the helicopters for combat use. Here's a real-life example: when drones flew through Estonian airspace to a Russian port during the PMF, who flew the drone intercept over the Gulf of Finland? Those were our own attack helicopters.
    1. +1
      16 June 2026 11: 11
      Quote: dragon772
      The same was said about the main battle tank. But the Mi-28N and Ka-52M have their own radars and radars and can easily catch up with the drones. So it's too early to write off the helicopters from combat use.

      This is exactly what the article talks about.
      ...we still have a lot of helicopters, and we also have pilots for them.

      In short: unlike a light training aircraft, a combat helicopter has a radar (well, many do), a radar, a laser rangefinder, and so on. In other words, the machine is almost fully equipped and can take down anything from a Geranium-type drone to a cruise missile.
  16. +3
    16 June 2026 09: 27
    There are no technical or technological barriers to the rapid development of aerial drone destroyers.
    The problem, apparently, is personnel. Those tasked with "regulating financial flows" are incapable of organizing anything else, and don't want to.
  17. +4
    16 June 2026 09: 34
    but that is more of a political question than a military one

    More likely sexopathological, there are too many 3,14doras in the Kremlin.
    1. +3
      16 June 2026 09: 40
      Quite a few cell towers have already been built; if they are equipped with radar, this will greatly simplify the task of detecting drones.
      1. +1
        16 June 2026 17: 30
        Quote: agond
        Quite a few cell towers have already been built; if they are equipped with radar, this will greatly simplify the task of detecting drones.

        And it will simplify the task of targeting anti-radar missiles at mobile network base stations! And it seems you don't know the meaning of the term "French radar"! That's where (as well as the Russian "analogue") they tried to use mobile phone network base stations! At first, there were encouraging reports, but then, somehow, "everything went quiet"!
      2. +1
        16 June 2026 22: 20
        It is not radars that need to be installed on towers, but microphones, and all of this needs to be combined into a system.
  18. +3
    16 June 2026 09: 43
    The question here is more about how to combat the consequences than the causes! Should we start targeting the bridges and tunnels supplying these causes? Otherwise, we'll soon be so completely buried we won't be able to go outside.
  19. 0
    16 June 2026 10: 16
    Quote: agond
    Quite a few cell towers have already been built; if they are equipped with radar, this will greatly simplify the task of detecting drones.

    There are plenty of them in large population centers, but outside of them, there are plenty of dead zones, and they'll be used for flying. And where would they get so many radars, and how would they pay for it? Are you personally willing to pay for even one radar near your home?
  20. 0
    16 June 2026 11: 27
    It's easier to deploy barrage balloons around cities. They'd be equipped with radar, AI-based electronic warfare, and weapons.
  21. 0
    16 June 2026 11: 51
    Quote: Mangel Alys
    It's easier to deploy barrage balloons around cities. They'd be equipped with radar, AI-based electronic warfare, and weapons.

    We have as many of these balloons as there is shoe polish in a shoe polish factory, nowhere to put them :), and radars are sold in every kiosk - take them and hang them up 😁
  22. 0
    16 June 2026 11: 52
    And now, today, the finger-pointing has begun at the West, where they've begun "urgently" preparing for a war with drones. They say they're already there, and we, as always, aren't ready.

    The issue of using the Ya-52/152 to combat drones has been raised on the pages of the Military Aviation for a long time.
    But they don't hear us. request sad
    Should we learn from this experience and rush to invent something based on the Yak-52? Definitely not.

    When there's nothing left, you need something to tide you over until that needed and SPECIAL thing appears. And that, again, means TIME, MONEY, and DAMAGE to the country, and the loss of our people. sad
  23. +2
    16 June 2026 12: 39
    They have the technology to build such a machine, but our high-performance fighters can't get much further than the old Yak-18. Compared to a combat helicopter, the cost of such a plane, its maintenance, and flight hours would be simply ridiculous, which is probably why they laugh at it.
  24. -2
    16 June 2026 12: 49
    I wonder if it's possible to revive production of some WWII-era fighter aircraft? Surely the companies have the blueprints and process charts in their archives...
    For some reason, everyone thinks drones are a temporary phenomenon, and this war is the last one, so no one is even trying to design anything new. And even if they did, the Lightning design from World War II would, in my humble opinion, be the most suitable for combating drones. It has a radar in the nose, machine guns in the wings, and highly developed wing mechanics—slats, spoilers, three-slotted flaps, and anti-spin corners. This will allow the aircraft to quickly reach its target, and then deploy the slats and flaps, significantly increasing maneuverability and reducing speed for better aiming. This configuration will allow operations both day and night. The aircraft will still be heavy compared to drones, so a gunner with a machine gun can be placed in the back in case the pilot misses and the aircraft overflies the drone.
    1. +1
      17 June 2026 17: 45
      Quote: whowhy
      I wonder if it's possible to revive production of some WWII-era fighter aircraft? Surely the companies have the blueprints and process charts in their archives...


      No. That's not realistic. Firstly, not all the blueprints have survived. Secondly, the technology hasn't been preserved for sure, since even the La-7 was a "hybrid" wood-metal construction. And this is a machine from the final period.
      But that's not the main point. Piston aircraft engines haven't been produced in Russia for many, many years. The main problem with Yak-152 production is finding a replacement for the RED A03 diesel engine, which, although developed by our designers, was put into production in Germany to speed up its entry into service. The Germans took control of it, and to keep an eye on it, they even imprisoned the engine's chief designer. Partners...

      Quote: whowhy
      And if they were to do so, then, in my humble opinion, the Lightning's World War II-era design would be most suitable for combating drones. Radar in the nose, machine guns in the wings, and highly developed wing mechanics—slats, spoilers, three-slotted flaps, and anti-spin corners.


      Perhaps, but we've lost our piston-engine aircraft design school. No one can build an airplane in six months; Yakovlev, for example, no longer exists as an independent design firm. Lavochkin is busy with space exploration, Tupolev has been struggling with the PAK DA for an unfathomable amount of time, and Ilyushin is struggling to produce a small military transport aircraft. Who will do it? MAI students?
      But the main thing is, what engine?

      Quote: whowhy
      The plane will still be a bit heavy compared to drones, so you might want to put a gunner with a machine gun in the back, in case the pilot misses and the plane flies past the drone.


      Why an airplane? Kamov has the Ka-226, a modular helicopter. It can carry up to a ton and seat up to seven people. It can reach speeds of up to 200 km/h. The forward cockpit is clear, so you can install a Ka-52 radar—it's ready, you just need to stow it—in the cargo compartment for the radar operator and the weapons system operator, and a pair of 12.7mm machine guns on the sides. If needed, there's also a radar system included in the Ka-52's avionics suite. The helicopter is ready, designed, the avionics are there, designed, nothing needs to be built from scratch. Even the armament is there and tested—the USPU-24, with a four-barreled YakB-12,7mm heavy machine gun.
      The problem is the motor. But it already exists – the VK-650V. It needs to be made.
  25. +2
    16 June 2026 12: 53
    Drive out the generals with a dirty broom
  26. 0
    16 June 2026 13: 30
    In 2009, Airborne Forces Commander Lieutenant General V. Shamanov recalled how uncomfortable he felt in Abkhazia in 2008, when a Hermes drone, purchased by the Georgians from Israel, hovered over the group of Russian troops that he led that had been brought in there.
    "We tried shooting it down with an Igla MANPADS, but it was difficult to target the missile due to the object's weak radiation. We tried firing at the UAV with the BMP-2 cannon, but it couldn't reach the target at an altitude of 1,500 feet. We're currently working on this, looking for other means of countering UAVs.
    One of the discoveries has already been made, although it seems unexpected. Discussions are underway with industry regarding the production of small aircraft such as motorized hang gliders, which could be used to combat potential enemy UAVs…

    In 2016, Izvestia reported that the Federal Service of National Guard Troops (FSNG) had begun testing the Poisk-06 MSN trike, equipped with a thermal imaging camera and night vision equipment. For strike missions, the engine-powered trike is equipped with a four-barrel, rapid-fire aircraft machine gun, and hardpoints on the cockpit can carry bombs weighing up to 200 kg.

    "The main feature of the delta glider is that it's practically inaudible during flight, and at night and in poor weather conditions, it's visually invisible against the sky. Takeoff and landing, even if the Poisk is carrying cargo or weapons, require only a few meters of unprepared, level ground," explained a representative of the FSVNG command.

    Equipped with a ten-meter wing, the Poisk-06 MSN can reach speeds of up to 125 km/h and climb to altitudes of up to 4 meters. The weight of the trike with fuel is approximately 285 kg, and the takeoff weight is over 500 kg. The Poisk can fly in challenging weather conditions, particularly with a headwind of 12 m/s and a crosswind of 6 m/s.
  27. +2
    16 June 2026 13: 30
    Our problem is that our country's leadership is woefully inferior to our enemies in terms of decision-making speed. While Europe and Ukraine take one or two tentative steps to resolve the problem, Russia's military-political leadership takes five or six, or even switches to "pretend nothing's happening and wait for it to resolve itself" mode. And I think the reason for this is physiological, or, more simply, human aging. People over 70 are simply not capable of leading a country engaged in a full-scale war.
    1. +2
      17 June 2026 17: 59
      Quote: Idle_piston
      Our problem is that the country's leadership is catastrophically inferior to our enemies in terms of the speed of decision-making.


      No, our problem is that the industry built by the USSR was designed for a completely different socioeconomic system. And no leadership can overturn the laws of economics. Let me remind you, just in case, that no European country can provide itself with combat aircraft on its own. At the very least, they can, with a little help and a fair amount of controversy, build fighter-bombers.

      Quote: Idle_piston
      Well, people over 70 are not capable of leading a country when it is waging a full-scale war.

      Churchill was 71 years old in 1945, Roosevelt was 63 (and he was seriously ill), Stalin was 67. Not boys at all, not boys at all.
  28. 0
    16 June 2026 14: 14
    The helicopter in the Air Defense Forces is already a fully formed archaic device, practically useless due to its catastrophic vulnerability. This has long been clear and understood, but we still have plenty of helicopters, and we have the pilots to fly them.

    The author should have provided some support for this thesis. For example, on June 27, 2019, a major contract was signed for the serial production and delivery of 98 of the latest Mi-28NM attack helicopters to the Russian Aerospace Forces by the end of 2027. This means that the number of Mi-28NM helicopters currently in service with the Russian Aerospace Forces can be estimated at no less than 50-60 units.

    Perhaps the author could point to at least one instance where an Mi-28NM was shot down by an enemy to support his thesis about the "catastrophic vulnerability" of modern combat helicopters?
  29. +1
    16 June 2026 15: 05
    Drones should be fought with drones. Like the American MQ-9 Reaper or the Russian Orion, armed with cheap missiles (similar to the APKWS II missile) or FPV drones. Unfortunately, this takes time, and time is short.
    1. 0
      16 June 2026 15: 56
      They won't be able to handle it. We need something bigger and with people on board.
      1. 0
        16 June 2026 16: 54
        General Atomics Aeronautical Systems announced a flight test of the MQ-9A Reaper reconnaissance and attack UAV with the APKWS II integrated into its onboard weapons system. The updated "bird" is claimed to be capable of effectively hunting long-range drones similar to the Russian Geranium, Iranian Shahed, and Ukrainian Lyut.
        APKWS II is a laser guidance kit that turns a conventional 70mm unguided rocket into a guided air-to-air weapon.// they'll handle it.
        1. +3
          16 June 2026 17: 48
          They might be able to chase individual drones, but it's unlikely they'll be able to in a massive attack. Your Reapers and Hunters aren't particularly maneuverable aircraft, unlike classic airplanes and helicopters. As for laser guidance for aerial targets, it's also not a very reliable system. The 70mm caliber is too large for drones, and if it misses at low altitude, it poses a danger to ground targets as well. Especially since there was a tragic example in history...
          Back in the 1950s, Americans widely used WWII fighters converted into drones for anti-aircraft training. Hellcats were especially frequently converted. One day, one of these drones stopped responding to commands and flew toward a nearby town. Although it was flying quite steadily, it could have crashed and caused damage if its fuel supply ran low. Two interceptors were dispatched to intercept the stray drone. Ironically, they were armed with 70mm unguided rockets, but they had no cannons. The interceptors fired about 200 rockets at the errant Hellcat, hitting it only a couple of times. The drone continued flying until it ran out of fuel. It crashed on a farm, causing a fire. Unguided rockets, missing their target, wreaked havoc on the ground, burning several cars, starting fires and destroying rural homes and other buildings, and damaging crops. Several fires broke out on the ground, which took two days to extinguish, requiring 200 firefighters. Fortunately, no one was injured, and the rockets narrowly missed an explosives factory. The damage was colossal... This epic story is widely known as the "Battle of Palmdale." Search...
          I'm not sure I've captured all the details accurately, but the gist is clear.
          Sound familiar?
          1. 0
            17 June 2026 09: 38
            Quote: futurohunter
            These Reapers and Hunters of yours are not particularly maneuverable aircraft, unlike classic airplanes and helicopters.
            The MQ-9 Reaper has a maximum speed of 400 km/h (250 mph). Cruising speed is 250 km/h (155 mph). It's not a jet, but it can stay in the air for 24 hours, conduct radar reconnaissance, and then attack a UAV if it detects one. Could a fighter jet do that? I highly doubt it. And don't forget the cost per flight hour. UAVs are much cheaper.
            Quote: futurohunter
            The 70mm is too large a caliber for drones, and if it misses at low altitude, it also poses a danger to ground targets.
            SAM missiles are larger than 70mm, and they miss just as much. Air-to-air missiles are also larger than 70mm, and they miss, too; not all of them hit their target.
            As for the 50s, they used conventional air-to-ground missiles, but they had a different fuse, so if they missed, they'd fly down and then explode. APKWS II is a redesign of that missile.
            1. 0
              17 June 2026 09: 45
              There's also a jet version of the Reaper, albeit with a different name. However, a jet consumes much more fuel and has a shorter flight time. A light aircraft, like the one featured in this article, costs a comparable amount per hour to fly the Reaper. Another issue is that, physically, humans can't stay in the air for very long.

              Besides missiles, there are also machine guns. They are much cheaper to use, and more rounds can be fired than missiles.

              As for the 50s, they used conventional air-to-ground missiles; they had a different fuse, and if they missed, they would fly down and explode.
              That's not true. If you were to delve into the history, you'd learn that Starfire interceptors were armed with anti-aircraft missiles. They were intended for use against large groups of bombers, which is why they chose to carry a large number of unguided missiles.
              And the drones fly at a low altitude, and the probability of the missile falling to the ground if it misses is also very high, almost 100%.
              1. 0
                17 June 2026 11: 14
                Quote: futurohunter
                There is also a jet version of the Reaper, although with a different name.
                RQ-4A Global Hawk: Range of approximately 5500 km with a 24-hour endurance. Maximum flight time is 36 hours. Maximum speed is 837 km/h. Expensive, so it is primarily used for reconnaissance.
                And so, in my opinion, they are the future. Especially if they have artificial intelligence. It will be able to independently search for and attack targets 24 hours a day.
                Unfortunately, we don't have that.
                Quote: futurohunter
                In addition to missiles, there is also machine gun armament.
                To be honest, I don't really believe in machine guns. I remember a Zvezda report about the Pantsir. And how they tried to shoot down a flying target with its cannons. Well, a trained crew (with the developers of this system) couldn't shoot it down, and this wasn't even a combat situation. The report frankly stated that these cannons are mainly used against saboteurs. Sure, you could attach them to an aircraft, but then you'd have to fly very close to it, and that's dangerous for the aircraft itself. It's easier to launch a missile from 7-8 kilometers away.
                Quote: futurohunter
                This is not true. If you were to look into the history in detail,

                I asked. They used an unguided Mk 4 FFAR ("Mighty Mouse") missile with deployed fins. The APKWS II, however, is quite guided.
                1. +2
                  17 June 2026 11: 35
                  I wrote that your Reaper has a number of disadvantages compared to manned platforms, and can itself become an easy victim of those same drones.

                  even if it's artificial intelligence
                  Which can be wrong, not see goals at all, or invent them where there aren't any. It happens. You apparently don't work with neural networks...

                  I don't really believe in machine guns
                  As far as I understand, you think of a drone as some kind of flying "spherical horse in a vacuum." But they're actually very different. From ones that fit in the palm of your hand to a Global Hawk the size of a passenger airliner. Each type of drone has its own unique weapon. Those semi-homemade model aircraft flying over our cities are best taken down with a machine gun, preferably from a flying platform. It'll also easily deal with a large multicopter like Baba Yaga. Incidentally, a Reaper will also poke holes in it if it's mounted on an interceptor.

                  You know little more than nothing about the Pantsir. It was developed at a time when drones weren't such a threat. And small FPV systems didn't exist back then. Its primary targets are aircraft, helicopters, and cruise missiles flying at low altitudes. And here, it's incredibly effective. Its cannons were designed for close-in engagements. In the long-range zone, the Pantsir uses missiles; if targets appear closer, or the missiles miss, the cannons are activated.

                  These guns are mainly used against saboteurs
                  Since World War II, small-caliber anti-aircraft automatic cannons have been used very effectively against ground targets. For example, the Shilka and the Tunguska (the ancestor of the Pantsir) successfully picked off Chechen militants.

                  And APKWS II is very manageable.
                  So what, it can't miss, fall to the ground, and explode?
                  1. 0
                    17 June 2026 12: 33
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    I wrote that your Reaper has a number of disadvantages compared to manned platforms.
                    All technology has its advantages and disadvantages. I've pointed out its positive qualities: 24-hour flight/patrol endurance, reconnaissance, and target engagement. Are you saying the An-2 with machine guns would be better? Well, I don't know.
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    You apparently don't work with neural networks...
                    It works. Sometimes there are glitches. But for some reason our opponents are implementing it. Probably out of stupidity.
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    These semi-home-made model airplanes that fly around our cities are best taken down with a machine gun, preferably from a flying platform.
                    I wonder if planes and helicopters today have machine guns and cannons? They do. So what? Does that solve the problem?
                    I don't object to the fact that, in the absence of advanced technology, you could equip an AN-2 with machine guns and shoot them down. You could also equip a hot air balloon with machine guns, or dig up World War I planes with machine guns. But I still don't think they have a future.
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    You know little more than nothing about the Pantsir. It was developed at a time when drones weren't such a threat. And small FPV systems didn't exist back then. Its primary targets are aircraft, helicopters, and cruise missiles flying at low altitudes. And here it's incredibly effective.
                    Of course, the Pantsir isn't against the FPV, I know that. The Pantsir was developed as a Tunguska-like missile, not for ground forces, but for point air defense. As for its mega-effectiveness, you know, I don't believe the marketing brochures. Shooting down planes, helicopters, and missiles with a dual-caliber missile, in my opinion, is no easy task. Especially since these targets are maneuverable, while its missile doesn't maneuver at all in its terminal phase. That's why the Pantsir was never adopted by the ground forces, and they use the Tor missile, which maneuvers throughout its entire flight, even under high G-forces. The only advantage of the Pantsir is the missile's cost—it's cheaper and faster to produce. Moreover, the Pantsir was developed after the 1991 Iraq war, where those very same aircraft-type reconnaissance drones were actively used. It's suited for such purposes, not aircraft.
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    The Pantsir uses missiles; if targets appear closer, or the missiles miss, the cannons are activated.
                    I don't know what's going on there. But in the plot, the trained crew couldn't shoot down a single target with their cannons.
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    The Shilkas and the same Tunguskas (the ancestor of the Pantsir) successfully shot at Chechen militants.
                    I don't argue, but what does air defense have to do with it?
                    Quote: futurohunter
                    So what, it can't miss, fall to the ground, and explode?

                    And where do the other missiles that miss fly, in your opinion? From the same Pantsir. Aren't they flying downwards?
                    1. +1
                      17 June 2026 15: 08
                      Are you saying that the AN-2 with machine guns will be better?
                      You've attributed your fantasies to me. Your Reaper will itself become a target for those same drones and their missiles. And I was writing about a simple manned aircraft with sensors and weapons. Incidentally, nothing prevents it from working in tandem with drones. Furthermore, these drones can patrol for hours, and their pilots will rotate.

                      But for some reason our opponents are implementing it. Probably out of stupidity.
                      First of all, "business and nothing personal."

                      Don't planes and helicopters have machine guns and cannons these days? Yes, they do. So what? Does that solve the problem?
                      I personally witnessed an Mi-35 shoot down a drone with its onboard cannon. Any other questions?

                      The Pantsir was created as an analogue of the Tunguska, but not for ground forces, but for air defense systems.
                      Not so. Both the Shilka and the Tunguska, and especially the Pantsir, were designed to escort military convoys on the move. And they fire on the move, without stopping or deploying outriggers. And the Pantsir-S was designed on wheels, so it could quickly move alongside convoys on highways.

                      The rocket doesn't maneuver at all in the final phase.
                      Where does this come from? The Pantsir has a radio-command missile. After the fuel burns out, ANY missile gradually loses maneuverability, and when it reaches the end of its flight, it becomes immobile. If it doesn't find a target, its self-destruct mechanism is activated.

                      use "Thor"
                      The Thor is a slightly different system. And at close range, it can't fight back... Unfortunately, I had the chance to speak with the widow of an officer who served on the Thor...

                      The only advantage of the Pantsir is the cost of the missile.
                      Well, actually, different types of systems complement and reinforce each other. You know, the old Osa and even Strela-10 missiles are still in use at the front... And the Strela-10 missile is really cheap...

                      The plot involves shooting down a prepared crew with cannons
                      Anyone can miss

                      What does air defense have to do with it?
                      You yourself said something about saboteurs.

                      where do you think they fly... Isn't it down?
                      In theory, any missile that misses its target should receive a self-destruct command. Certainly after a certain flight time. But when firing at a target at low altitude, there's a chance the missile will fall to the ground before the self-destruct mechanism is activated. And this probability is much higher if the missile is launched from a "flying" launch pad rather than a ground-based one. By the way, I don't know about the self-destruct mechanism on your "semi-guided" missile.
                      1. -1
                        17 June 2026 17: 25
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Your Reaper will become a target for those same drones and their missiles. And I was writing about a simple manned aircraft with sensors and weapons.
                        And your plane won't be able to do the same? //The Ukrainian F-16 fighter was shot down by a Geranium drone// especially since it would have to fly closer to it to fire machine guns.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Incidentally, nothing prevents it from working in tandem with drones. Furthermore, these drones can patrol for hours, with their pilots rotating.
                        Why bother if they can do it themselves? General Atomics Aeronautical Systems, Inc. (GA-ASI), the manufacturer of the MQ-9, confirmed today that it recently flight-tested a U.S. Air Force MQ-9A armed with the APKWS at the Nevada Test and Training Range (NTTR). GA-ASI refers to the missile simply as APKWS. The FALCO missile features a modified laser-guided guidance and control system and a proximity fuze that is ideal for engaging small airborne targets. “We recognize the importance of a system like APKWS for the MQ-9 as a counter-attack capability against single-target attack drones,” said GA-ASI President David R. Alexander. “APKWS has the potential to increase the number of weapons the MQ-9A can carry and also enable the use of new, less expensive weapons.”

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        First of all, "business and nothing personal."
                        You think implementing AI in drone business is nonsense. I don't think so. I think you've heard of the Hornet drone. This is just the beginning.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        I personally witnessed an Mi-35 shoot down a drone with its onboard cannon. Any other questions?
                        And what is that supposed to mean? And how many cases have there been of missiles being shot down? Or helicopter attacks and whirlwinds?

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Not so. Both the Shilka and the Tunguska, and especially the Pantsir, were designed to accompany military columns on the move.
                        That's not true. Have you ever wondered why the Tor and Tunguska are tracked, while the Armored Carrier is on wheels? They have different purposes.
                        //The Ground Forces Command has refused to accept the Pantsir-S1 anti-aircraft missile and gun system (ZRPK) into service. Testing of the system showed that it does not meet stated requirements. A source in the Ground Forces Command told Izvestia this.
                        "The latest field trials at the Ashuluk training ground showed that the technical and combat characteristics of the Pantsir-S1 air defense missile and gun system do not meet the requirements of the Ground Forces. Therefore, the decision was made not to purchase these systems," he said.
                        The issue of deliveries of the “Shell” to the Ground Forces was discussed for several years, comparative tests of these systems and the Tor-M2 air defense systems of the Almaz-Antey air defense concern were carried out. As a representative of the Russian military-industrial complex told Izvestia, all the tests were not very successful for the Shell.
                        "The missile is incapable of engaging maneuverable targets; the system itself is bulky and immobile, which is crucial for motorized rifle units; there are questions about the electronic base," an officer familiar with the situation told Izvestia. He also noted that in modern warfare, such short-range systems are powerless against combat aircraft that attack outside the coverage area of ​​air defense systems, while man-portable air defense systems and small arms are much more effective against enemy helicopters.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Where does this come from? The Pantsir has a radio-command missile. After the fuel burns out, ANY missile gradually loses maneuverability, and when it reaches the end of its flight, it becomes immobile. If it doesn't find a target, its self-destruct mechanism is activated.

                        The missile's dual-caliber design (the booster stage is jettisoned, sharply reducing the missile's caliber, reducing drag losses) then propels the sustainer stage forward by inertia. Because the 57E6E sustainer stage lacks its own engine, the missile will have low power output at its maximum range of 18-20 km. During testing, to successfully engage a target at a range of 20 km, the target's speed had to be no more than 80 m/s. 80 m/s = 288 km/h. And I don't know if it can hit an aircraft.
                        But Pantsir is very suitable against counter-UAVs.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        And the Strela-10 missile is really cheap...
                        Is this a cheap 9M37 anti-aircraft missile with a homing head? I don't know.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Anyone can miss
                        Of course, it can, especially for the story about the Pantsir during exercises. But for some reason, they didn't miss with the missiles. Why is that?

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        But when firing at a target at low altitude, there's a risk the missile will fall to the ground before the self-destruct mechanism is activated. This risk is much higher if the missile is launched from a flying launch pad rather than a ground-based one.
                        Why? They're currently introducing the "Gvozd" missile for the Pantsir. It has a maximum range of 7 km. So, it might work, but the others won't. Well, I don't know.
                        Especially with machine guns. Where in the city would hundreds of bullets from planes fly? Whose heads would they hit? And what's better: one missile or hundreds of bullets?

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        By the way, I don’t know what’s going on with the self-destructor in your “semi-controlled” one.

                        I'm not that level of bird. But I think everything is fine.
                      2. 0
                        17 June 2026 18: 45
                        and your plane won't be able to do it?
                        Anything is possible. But the pilots will react faster than the operators of your Reaper, not to mention its "brains." As for the "Ukrainian F-16 fighter"—it's well known how "prepared" their pilots are...
                        To fire a machine gun, he needs to fly closer to it
                        And a drone doesn't need one? What's the difference? By the way, missiles also have a limited range—the smaller the missile, the closer it flies... And the Reaper also has a limited payload capacity.
                        Why bother if they can do it themselves?
                        Counter question: why is the concept of an unmanned wingman being developed now, in many countries at once, including ours?
                        The introduction of AI into UAV business is nonsense.
                        What I meant was that the AI ​​push, just like the electric car push, is primarily about business, and practical application comes second. Application is secondary. The main thing now is money. And the thoughtless implementation of AI will cause a lot of trouble... well, they're already crying.
                        Hornet UAV. This is just the beginning.
                        This isn't even the beginning... But methods for deceiving and driving this AI of yours crazy are also already evolving. It's a double-edged sword.
                        How many times have they been shot down by a missile? Or by helicopters, by attack or by a whirlwind?
                        So what? Missiles can't shoot down everything, and not always. "Attack and Whirlwind" aren't missiles, are they?
                        Have you ever wondered why the Tor and Tunguska are on tracks, while the Panzer is on wheels?
                        For the same reason that truck-mounted guns were invented. The Tor and Tunguska were designed to accompany tank columns attacking off-road. It just turned out that with a well-developed road network, it's faster to travel on wheels. And so, they often go into battle "on wheels." Or, at least, to the battlefield. Isn't it obvious?
                        Продолжение следует ...
                      3. 0
                        17 June 2026 18: 46
                        short-range systems are powerless against combat aircraft that attack without entering the systems' coverage area
                        Once again: there's a lot flying over the battlefield these days. And the Pantsir is practically the last line of defense. Not quite the last—there are also MANPADS and small arms.
                        And for some reason, you're not taking into account that Pantsirs (and others) can be hidden and ambushed by air defense systems. And they'll open fire when those same helicopters or attack aircraft approach. Believe it or not, unguided rockets and free-fall bombs haven't gone anywhere. And they don't fly far.
                        The Tunguska was actually designed for a different war and different purposes. But for lack of anything better... Incidentally, even the ancient Stela-10 is still in use on the front lines...
                        The rocket, thanks to its dual-caliber design, reduces aerodynamic drag losses.
                        Your knowledge is amazing laughing The drag will remain virtually unchanged. But the weight will be significantly reduced by jettisoning the now-unnecessary mass. And the lighter rocket flies further. This isn't called a dual-caliber design, but a multi-stage design. It's used on many rockets. At a minimum, many rockets have a booster, which provides the initial momentum for the rocket and is then jettisoned.
                        Moreover, almost all missiles have a passive trajectory phase, when the engine's fuel has already burned out and the missile flies by inertia. And the passive phase is much longer than the active phase... Where do air-to-air missiles like the Kh-37 get those tens and hundreds of kilometers? Because of the long passive phase. The missile gains altitude, then dives toward the target in passive mode (as an option). Incidentally, a missile is also a UAV. laughing
                        And any missile in the passive phase loses speed and energy, and along with them, the ability to maneuver.
                        Is the 9M37 anti-aircraft missile with a homing head cheap?
                        Can an ancient, almost vacuum-tube rocket really be expensive?
                        The Nail missile is being introduced into the armored vehicle. It has a range of 7 km.
                        The "standard" Pantsir missile is simply too powerful for drones. A weaker missile would suffice. And the range could be reduced. But such a missile is smaller and lighter, allowing more of them to be carried on a vehicle. And it would be cheaper to produce.
                        And what is better, one rocket or hundreds of bullets?
                        You're a strange man. Apparently, you've never seen or heard an explosion near you. Otherwise, you wouldn't be reasoning like that. What's worse: when pieces of metal simply fall to the ground, or when the "fallen" metal explodes?
                      4. 0
                        18 June 2026 13: 31
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        But the pilots will react faster than the operators of your Reaper, not to mention its "brains".
                        Of course, he's risking his life, and a drone pilot is just a drone. But that's for now.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        And a drone doesn't need one? What's the difference? By the way, missiles also have a limited range—the smaller the missile, the closer it flies... And the Reaper also has a limited payload capacity.

                        The difference is that missiles have a range of 7 km, and a machine gun has a range of 2 km at most, and that's still a lot.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        And the Reaper also has a limited carrying capacity.
                        That's why they developed a cheap, lightweight missile, which the Raptor can also carry, about 8 of them. It can also patrol 24 hours a day, conduct reconnaissance, and, if necessary, attack slow-moving targets like UAVs. Why do you need an airplane? Unless you have a UAV. Then yes. An airship with Peter the Great-era cannons and grapeshot would also come in handy.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Counter question: why is the concept of an unmanned wingman being developed now, in many countries at once, including ours?
                        for conducting air combat and suppressing air defenses, but certainly not for shooting down low-maneuverability targets such as UAVs.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        and your plane won't be able to do it?
                        Anything is possible. But the pilots will react faster than the operators of your Reaper, not to mention its "brains." As for the "Ukrainian F-16 fighter"—it's well known how "prepared" their pilots are...
                        To fire a machine gun, he needs to fly closer to it
                        And a drone doesn't need one? What's the difference? By the way, missiles also have a limited range—the smaller the missile, the closer it flies... And the Reaper also has a limited payload capacity.
                        Why bother if they can do it themselves?
                        Counter question: why is the concept of an unmanned wingman being developed now, in many countries at once, including ours?
                        The introduction of AI into UAV business is nonsense.
                        What I meant was that the AI ​​push, just like the electric car push, is primarily about business, and practical application comes second. Application is secondary. The main thing now is money. And the thoughtless implementation of AI will cause a lot of trouble... well, they're already crying.
                        Hornet UAV. This is just the beginning.
                        This isn't even the beginning... But methods for deceiving and driving this AI of yours crazy are also already evolving. It's a double-edged sword.
                        How many times have they been shot down by a missile? Or by helicopters, by attack or by a whirlwind?
                        So what? Missiles can't shoot down everything, and not always. "Attack and Whirlwind" aren't missiles, are they?
                        Have you ever wondered why the Tor and Tunguska are on tracks, while the Panzer is on wheels?
                        For the same reason that truck-mounted guns were invented. The Tor and Tunguska were designed to accompany tank columns attacking off-road. It just turned out that with a well-developed road network, it's faster to travel on wheels. And so, they often go into battle "on wheels." Or, at least, to the battlefield. Isn't it obvious?
                        Продолжение следует ...
                        Who's complaining? You think we don't need AI.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        But methods of deceiving and driving this AI of yours crazy are also already being developed.
                        That's when cars are painted like zebra crossings. Is that what you're talking about?

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        So what? Missiles can't shoot down everything, and not always. "Attack and Whirlwind" aren't missiles, are they?
                        And what about machine guns? Why isn't the Vortex a missile? I told you they shoot down helicopters with them. I don't get the point.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Well, or to the battlefield. Isn't it clear?
                        The Tor is tracked, and the Pantsir is also tracked, but for some reason it wasn't adopted by the ground forces. Why? I told you earlier. It's currently in service with the Aerospace Forces for facility defense. Perfect for drones.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        And this is not called a bicaliber but a multi-stage scheme.
                        Well, I don’t know what you call it, but everywhere in the literature about Pantsir it’s different //The missile is made according to a bi-caliber scheme with a detachable starting engine with a diameter of 170 mm, a command guidance system with an air-dynamic steering drive, IR and radio direction finding of the target// this is according to TOR //SAM 9M331 is solid-fuel, single-stage, made
                        aerodynamically designed "duck" with radio command
                        guidance method. The high-explosive fragmentation warhead includes
                        fragments of high-density alloy.// And what is the passive section of a single-stage rocket?
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Moreover, almost all rockets have a passive trajectory phase, when the engine's fuel has burned out and the rocket flies by inertia. And the passive phase is much longer than the active phase…
                        You're simply comparing different types of missiles. The TOR's active phase is 8-10 seconds, while the Pantsir's is 2 seconds. The former flies only in passive mode during the terminal phase, controlled by rudders, while the Pantsir flies almost the entire 17-18 km trajectory. You see the difference.
                        And this is not my knowledge // "Evaluation of the characteristics of the Pantsir-S1 air defense missile and gun system at one of the open scientific and technical conferences of the Russian Ministry of Defense and the Russian Academy of Missile and Artillery Sciences. The authors of the report are V.V. Belotserkovsky, candidate of military sciences, associate professor (VPVO VVS) and I.A. Razin (VA VPVO VS).1) The actual results of firing tests showed a low capability of the system to fire at targets maneuvering and flying with a course parameter of more than 2-3 km
                        2) the possibility of firing at targets flying at speeds greater than 400 m / s has not been confirmed, although a speed equal to 1000 m / s is given in the technical characteristics of the complex
                        3) the maximum firing range of 20 km is provided for aerial targets flying at a speed of no more than 80 m / s (on the E-95 target), since the available overloads of SAMs at this range do not exceed 5 units.
                        4) the main disadvantage of a bicaliber missile ***** is the lack of an engine in the march stage of the SAM, as a result of which, within the declared damage range, the rocket will move with negative acceleration of the order of 50-30 m / s 2, which leads to the appearance of such non-linearities in the input signal missile control loop, which lead to an increase in errors of its guidance on actively maneuvering target
                        But I repeat once again, it is very good that we have this complex; it is just right for fighting slow-moving, non-maneuvering targets.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Can an ancient, almost vacuum-tube rocket really be expensive?
                        Yes maybe.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        It’s just that the “standard” Pantsir missile is too powerful for the same drones.
                        No, not for that, but because the complex has a dead zone that the guns were supposed to cover, but they are ineffective, so a small missile is needed, but they also increase the ammunition load.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        What's worse: when pieces of metal simply fall to the ground, or when the "fallen" metal also explodes?
                        Why did you choose something explosive? But hundreds of bullets hitting people's heads is a very dangerous thing. You know, even if it hits you at the end of its life, it'll be a real pain. They're also falling downwards, aren't they?
                      5. 0
                        18 June 2026 16: 49
                        The difference is that the missiles
                        Even a long burst from a machine gun is cheaper than any missile, and a drone can be easily destroyed with even a short burst. Even your Reaper. Again, it all depends on what you're shooting at. A missile is better against your Reaper, while bullets are better against the botched weapons launched by the Waiters. The same applies to small drones—a missile simply won't be able to target them, and the damage from its explosion can be greater than the drone's own charge.

                        Why do you need an airplane?
                        It's all good together. The final decision still needs to be made by the people, otherwise your ripper will cause trouble—it's happened before. And it's easier to see from the air.

                        And also an airship
                        Incidentally, they're currently experiencing a resurgence. They can fly to great heights, carry a ton of sensors to detect targets, serve as relay stations, and can hover in the sky practically indefinitely. But it's best to arm them with either machine guns or interceptor drones. Launching a missile from an airship is dangerous for it.

                        The Thor is tracked, and the Pantsir is also tracked, but for some reason it wasn't adopted into service.
                        There's also a wheeled Thor. The first tracked Pantsir is essentially the same as the Tunguska—there was no point in duplicating the armament. But a wheeled vehicle is more suited to the realities of modern warfare—I've already explained why.

                        everywhere in the literature about the Shell
                        The developers simply wanted to come up with their own name. This "second gauge," in fact, doesn't affect anything. And in terms of its operating principle, it's a two-stage system.

                        TOR active region
                        Once again, the systems were designed for different purposes, and, in fact, they work together. However, neither one nor the other can fend off an FPV drone that suddenly appears from behind the bushes.

                        yes maybe
                        Hmm. Ever heard of asset depreciation? The value of an item declines over time until it reaches a meager residual value. And a product that's been discontinued and simply taken from warehouses is essentially worthless. Try selling that Strela on the global arms market—it'll fetch, at most, the price of a cheap car, because it's so old.

                        Why did you take that explosive?
                        What, blanks? You've been reading about Patriots and Teds. Well, they hit with kinetic energy, but they often miss. But most missiles fired at airborne targets don't hit them, but instead have a proximity fuse and explode nearby. A study was even conducted once, which found that detonating at a certain distance from an airborne target was much more effective than direct contact. Moreover, the proximity fuse ensured that the target would be destroyed even if the missile missed by a small amount. Therefore, today, almost all airborne missiles carry an explosive payload.

                        Hundreds of bullets on people's heads is a very dangerous thing.
                        Why "straight at the heads"? Unless you're firing from above directly at a group of people, the likelihood of hitting them is extremely low. But when firing over a populated area, there are tons of objects below. Even a 100-gram blast from an explosive will cause significant damage. But bullets weighing less than 100 grams will, at most, break glass or scratch walls and roofs. And they'll most likely fall at the end of their projectile, at low velocity, unless they're firing downwards—which is unlikely. You could talk about tracer or armor-piercing incendiary bullets. But tracers will burn out, and there's no point in using armor-piercing incendiary rounds on drones. In any case, a charge weighing 100 grams or more will cause orders of magnitude more damage than even a long burst from a heavy machine gun.
                      6. 0
                        18 June 2026 16: 55
                        Add.
                        You think we don't need AI?
                        Don't consider AI a panacea. Fanaticism, in any field, is generally harmful. AI has its place. It is a human assistant, not a replacement. The final decision should be made by a human. For example, giving targeting instructions to the AI ​​or choosing from the options offered by the AI.
                        That's when cars are painted like zebra crossings. Is that what you're talking about?
                        You tend to overstate things and ignore important details. For example, where does the AI ​​get its information? Let's say from the camera. But it also has its own characteristics, such as a specific refresh rate, dynamic range, and so on. It's possible to create camouflage that blurs the object being observed on the camera, blind the camera with a laser beam, generate a false image on it, create a moiré pattern that makes it impossible to distinguish an object, and so on.
                      7. 0
                        18 June 2026 17: 40
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Even a long burst from a machine gun is cheaper than any missile, and a drone can be easily destroyed even with a short burst.

                        You still have to hit it. They're mostly hit with missiles (or drones). Although planes, helicopters, and even armored vehicles are armed with machine guns and cannons. Why is that?
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Everything is good as a whole.
                        So the complex provides both reconnaissance and destruction within 24 hours.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        A tracked Panzer is essentially the same as a Tunguska—there was no point in duplicating the armament. A wheeled vehicle, however, is more suited to the realities of modern warfare—I've already explained why.
                        And I pointed out to you that it wasn't accepted into service with the ground forces, and I explained the reason. It's only in service with the Aerospace Forces. That's why the tracked version isn't produced. And it's not a matter of duplication. The Tunguska isn't produced at all right now; it's only being repaired. Only the Tor is produced.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        The developers simply wanted to come up with their own name. This "second gauge," in fact, doesn't affect anything. And in terms of its operating principle, it's a two-stage system.
                        You said there was no such name at all. laughing I have described all the influence to you.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Once again, the complexes were created for different purposes.
                        I agree, but for some reason you wrote to me about something else.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Hmm. Ever heard of asset depreciation? The value of an item declines over time until it reaches a meager residual value. And what about an item that's no longer in production?
                        Why do you think the ammunition used in the system has been discontinued? The missile's fuel and lubricants will be more expensive.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Therefore, now almost all missiles operating "by air" carry an explosive charge
                        I know. You were the one writing about explosions, I didn't write anything like that. So the question is: why would they explode when they hit the ground if they have a proximity fuse?
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        Why "straight to the heads"? Unless you're shooting from above directly at a group of people, the likelihood of hitting them is extremely low.
                        And who's going to watch from the plane to see if there's anyone below? They'll go all out and fire hundreds of bullets at unprotected people. That's better. I don't know.
                        Quote: futurohunter
                        The final decision must be made by a human. For example, giving targeting instructions to the AI ​​or choosing from options suggested by the AI.
                        Sooner or later, they'll decide to let AI make decisions on its own. It's more efficient and faster. That's why AI was invented.

                        Quote: futurohunter
                        But it also has its own peculiarities.

                        But the man has no special needs. Maybe he slept poorly or his wife got on his nerves.
                        P.S. If you think the future lies with the Yak-52 and its Maxim missiles, go ahead. I'll stick to my guns, however, that the future of counter-UAV warfare (like the Shahed) lies with Raptor-type drones armed with missiles or FPV drones.
                      8. 0
                        19 June 2026 00: 32
                        You still have to hit it. They mostly hit it with missiles.
                        Machine guns and cannons also hit. Watch the video – there are plenty of them. Again, it depends on the drone's size. Not every drone can be targeted with a missile. You can fire a cannon or machine gun at anything, although, obviously, they won't fire at a small drone.
                        Tunguska is not produced at all now.
                        Obsolete. The Carapace is its further development.
                        I have described all the influence to you.
                        Where? The absurd idea that aerodynamics are improving?
                        Why did you decide that the ammunition from the complex that is in service has been discontinued?
                        But why bother? There are more modern and more effective vehicles. The missile stockpiles were produced during peacetime. When they run out, the launcher will be dismantled from the Motolyga, and the Motolyga will still be useful. The Osa-AKM will also be removed when the missiles for it run out. But it's unclear what to do with the chassis.
                        Why will they explode when they fall to the ground if they have a proximity fuse?
                        There's also a contact device. The self-destruct device might not have time to detonate due to the low altitude of the weapon. And even if it does detonate, there's a high probability of an explosion near the ground, with an accompanying shock wave and flying shrapnel.
                        And who will be watching from the plane to see if there is anyone below or not?
                        Shooting from above is much worse than shooting from below, or at roughly the same altitude. And sensors are also less effective against the ground than against the sky.
                        hundreds of bullets will fly at unprotected people
                        Once again, these bullets will most likely hit cars and ground structures. A missile on the ground, however, doesn't cause much harm. I've given you an example. But you'll have to try to find an example of random damage from a burst of fire at the end of a round.
                        will come to the decision that AI will make decisions on its own
                        It already does, and there's already considerable regret about it. The military hasn't yet crossed the line where authorization to use weapons is given by humans. Or rather, some have already crossed it, but they're no longer human.
                        This is why AI appeared
                        Not for this, but for solving complex and non-standard problems.
                        he slept poorly or his wife was on edge
                        This is why teams, crews, procedures, checklists, etc. are created.
                        Yak-52 with Maxims on board
                        You'll have a hard time finding a Maxim, except in museums, and with sawn-down barrels. And you'll have to pry a Yak-52 from private owners or buy it, especially in pretty bad shape. You might also recommend a Vilga-35 or a Blanik. laughing It's easier to find a Diamond-42—they're new and we've bought a lot of them. And the Diamond is available as a light counterinsurgency aircraft. The Maxim is too heavy for the Yak. There are plenty of other weapons available now. You could even use the YaKB machine gun from the Mi-24. And we need fundamentally different aircraft. In fact, we practically don't have any aircraft for conversion into drone interceptors. We can't even buy them from the Chinese—they don't produce them. The only options are to buy parallel imports from Switzerland, Austria, Canada, or the US. Brazil, at worst, fortunately, is in BRICS. Theoretically, we could equip Ansats or Eurocopters with Bo-105 turrets—thankfully, we have plenty of these helicopters—but their flight hours are already quite expensive.
  30. +1
    16 June 2026 15: 30
    A helicopter with an onboard radar (and a gunner on board) to cover important targets is the most sensible idea, in my humble opinion. After all, they've already tested something to protect against unmanned aerial vehicles.
    Perhaps something will come from the oil workers, since they have been allowed to defend themselves for money.
  31. 0
    16 June 2026 15: 33
    Quote: AlexanderA
    Perhaps the author could point to at least one instance where an Mi-28NM was shot down by an enemy to support his thesis about the "catastrophic vulnerability" of modern combat helicopters?

    I'm not the author, but I don't think he was talking about attack helicopters. For target defense, we need some kind of upgraded version like the Mi-8.
    1. +1
      16 June 2026 21: 20
      You'll be exhausted from retrofitting the Mi-8. But attack helicopters already have everything they need, including radars and lightweight air-to-air missiles.
  32. 0
    16 June 2026 15: 55
    Sleeper cells launching drones have been busted in the regions multiple times. It's not even about the Kazakhs. Our border in the south is so porous that you could probably smuggle a nuclear bomb through it, not to mention drone parts.
    Now, what to shoot down drones with? We have plenty of Mi-24/35s; they're already chasing drones. But they're not the only ones we can use. We have a fairly large fleet of a wide variety of civilian helicopters, both domestic and imported. Anything larger than a Robinson won't mount anything on it. But Ansats are perfectly capable of carrying a machine gun turret. The Mi-8, however, is too expensive to fly for such missions. Only during massive attacks, when it can pick off the bad guys in droves.
    For some reason, no one remembers the sizable fleet of Diamond-42s, once purchased for basic training of civil aviation pilots. Yet they can carry both radar and weapons.
    In general, Roman is right – we need to revive DOSAAF. And along with it, the small aviation necessary for our country's vast territories. For some reason, Canada, which is much smaller, has a small aviation fleet that is orders of magnitude larger than ours, despite our much larger territory. And the aircraft they use, like the Pilatus, are quite successful in fighting guerrillas in the jungle. We don't need Baikals; we need even smaller planes. Incidentally, we don't have any "aerotractors" either, and they could quite successfully fight the flying vermin.
  33. 0
    16 June 2026 17: 43
    German technology is clearly excessive compared to the drones currently in use and is clearly designed for the future. Today, however, ranting about the shortcomings of the Yak-52 is frankly stupid. Do something, idiots!
    .
    Drawbacks, such as the lack of an airborne radar, are easily mitigated by ground interaction. A ground-based radar will cost ten times less than an airborne one, and it can be deployed to the areas under cover more quickly. Instead of waiting for the perfect fighter, do what you can!
    1. 0
      16 June 2026 21: 20
      A comedian? Yes, in the 70s, fighters were guided from the ground. It's a real challenge, and even a modern fighter like the MiG-23 with its radar was poorly executed. Guiding a Yak, which has a speed close to that of a UAV, is next to impossible. Ground-based radar is more expensive than airborne radar (you also need a machine and a crew of 2-3), and the range of UAVs is only 5-10 kilometers, which a UAV would cover in a few minutes. Do you want to blanket the entire territory with radars? What's the money for that? It's easier to install radars on airships and build a cheap fighter in the style of biplanes from the 30s.
  34. +3
    16 June 2026 18: 20
    Yet another confirmation of the "economics of war." The entire world was preparing to deploy and intercept the Überwaffe, but the current SVO demonstrates that the same effect can be achieved with "garage-grade" weapons. These weapons are so inexpensive that they can be used without counting. And they inflict severe damage on enemy infrastructure.
    In my humble opinion, massing small-caliber anti-aircraft guns against such a war is possible, but firing a heavy machine gun upward requires self-destruction of missed shells, lest they fall from the sky onto civilians and troops and kill no one. This immediately leaves only the ZU23 variants. "Our people" can't produce them in sufficient quantities because our production hasn't shifted to a wartime standard, and missed deadlines are reassigned to other work. And even monstrous waste isn't always punished.
    We're also in dire straits with piston and turboprop aircraft. There's no production, and even R&D on civilian aircraft is in deep... crisis. And having blueprints for something like the La5/Yak9 won't help at all, because production technology has advanced, and redesigning the Yak52 for new wings/fuselage also requires skill.
    Simple solutions would have been available if "our people" had thought about it in 2014, but alas, even since 2021, greed has overshadowed long-term planning. And even now, "our people" are more concerned with profit than victory.
    Conclusion: Massive air defense/small-area anti-aircraft defense is impossible due to management errors and the need to put a large number of people under arms. The revival of piston-engine and turboprop aircraft requires more time than we have. We've been forced into a time crunch. And the problem isn't just the military-industrial complex's reluctance to accept this, but also the population shortage, thanks to previous mistakes. The decisions that remain are either bad or very bad, and no one wants to make them...
    1. 0
      18 June 2026 20: 09
      Yes, we have everything... It’s unclear why we don’t use it... The entire “front-line aviation” is out of work.
  35. +1
    16 June 2026 20: 49
    The aircraft described above have their engines located ahead of the cockpit, making it difficult to install a radar. Pusher-propeller aircraft are needed, meaning the engine and propeller are located behind the cockpit.
    1. 0
      18 June 2026 20: 18
      We need machines with a pusher propeller...
      I know one like this - SU-25 laughing It seems he has some kind of radar... The only thing I'm not sure about is the patrol duration. As for sending them out to intercept, that's fine...
      1. 0
        19 June 2026 09: 05
        What matters is the stall speed of an airplane compared to the speed of a drone.
  36. 0
    16 June 2026 21: 13
    We need to produce something like the I-153—lightweight, cheap, but with a more powerful engine, a pair of heavy machine guns, a 23mm cannon mounted through the propeller shaft, and a wing-mounted detection system. Speed ​​350, super maneuverability, plywood, suitable for a low-level pilot, no airfield required.
  37. 0
    16 June 2026 22: 36
    Yes, it turns out there are tons of options for combating UAVs of all kinds, take your pick. But unfortunately, there aren't any who would choose the most effective and widespread ones yet. It feels like the entire world is learning how to shoot down our drones, while air defense, as a separate branch of the Russian Armed Forces, hasn't yet recovered. Maybe it would be easier to corral all the experts into shady places, provide them with housing and food at the highest level, surround them with barbed wire, and not let them out into the world until they create something new, beyond the legacy of the Soviet era. Maybe we'll see aircraft and engines and everything else, fighters for everything, and even based on new physical principles. Well, maybe we could at least stick a bunch of Pantsir missiles around Russia's perimeter, or revolving-type cylinders for MANPADS. I can't believe that after five years of war, the entire country couldn't be shut down, like Moscow on Victory Day! It's a shame for the country!
  38. 0
    17 June 2026 01: 46
    I read the entire discussion thread.
    I'd like to share my thoughts on this topic. I'm not an air defense specialist or an aviator.
    1. Everyone probably already knows what the best air defense is – our tanks on their airfields. The point is clear: we need to destroy the source of the threat. Sad, gloomy, impossible!!
    But Unfortunately, we are not like that.And even in the fifth year of the Central Military District, you still hear the line "we haven't even started yet." We need to hit the enemy's infrastructure. At the very least, if we can't quickly take control of the territory.
    2. The UAV is small, very small; it doesn't show up in typical radar frequency ranges. Sure, you could go to the millimeter range, where UAV detection is very good, but the range would be laughable. UAVs can only be detected using a comprehensive approach—radar, radar, and sound reconnaissance and detection. Only a combination of these systems will allow UAV detection with a high degree of certainty. And again, a system of such devices is needed. It's clear you'll need enough radars for the entire country, but something like this is not feasible. Faroe-Icelandic border Sound and optical (IR and UV) sensors are probably possible. Purely passive sensors, on every pole. Expensive? Yes. But quite feasible. If Siluanov is spending money (200 rubles) on buying foreign currency, maybe it would be better spent on national security rather than on shredded paper?
    3. A UAV interceptor—let's be honest—is needed. It would be useful. Chasing helicopters is expensive, and it also drains valuable equipment. It's easier to build an aircraft that can chase UAVs, which fly at speeds of 150 to 400 km/h. At such low speeds, a biplane can only fly confidently and have good maneuverability (the I-153 or another option, but it requires the ability to fly at "low" speeds of less than 200 km/h). Unfortunately, there aren't any such aircraft, not even in draft form in the design bureau. We don't have any small aircraft.
    But what if we create a concept for the aircraft—"trainer aircraft, combat trainer aircraft, combat aircraft"—all on a single platform? And there shouldn't be any strict requirements for pilots.
    It's as if thoughts like these are swarming.
    1. 0
      18 June 2026 20: 16
      Everyone probably already knows what the best air defense is - our tanks at their airfields.
      By and large, a drone doesn't need an airfield - just choose a flat section of road and go!
      The UAV is small, very small.
      We need specialists here. I've heard about over-the-horizon radars that say they can see a shadow ball thousands of kilometers away... So I think not all is lost.
      ...We don't have any small aircraft...
      So for now we need to use what we have and what hasn't been used.
      1. 0
        20 June 2026 01: 26
        Quote: tehnix
        By and large, a drone doesn't need an airfield - just choose a flat section of road and go!

        Well, you didn't understand the point of "our tanks on their airfields." What's important here is that our Armed Forces will control the territory and no one will be able to take off from there.
        Quote: tehnix
        We need specialists here. I've heard about over-the-horizon radars that say they can see a shadow ball thousands of kilometers away... So I think not all is lost.

        The newspapers wrote about a tennis ball after the latest radar system was commissioned, and the commander boasted that they could spot a tennis ball over Europe. But they could spot it, but it turns out they couldn't provide targeting information, that is, the precise coordinates of the ball. That's why millimeter-wave radars are needed to combat UAVs (they're roughly the same ones used in our Khrizantema antitank missiles and the UAVs' Hellfire).

        Quote: tehnix
        So for now we need to use what we have and what hasn't been used.

        What do we have? Can you clarify? It's not entirely clear what you're suggesting we use.
        1. 0
          20 June 2026 08: 52
          What's important here is that our Armed Forces will control the territory and no one will be able to take off from there.
          ...ah, well, if we take over all of X-land... then yeah, they'll have major problems with takeoff! But, well, all that's left is just the simple matter of capturing...
          Millimeter-wave radars are needed to combat UAVs.
          That's what I'm saying: we need specialists. I'm not one of them, so it's hard for me to judge.
          What do we have?
          DOSAAF airplanes, some living agricultural aviation, a Su-25, helicopters, maybe not much...
  39. 0
    17 June 2026 09: 20
    Quote: Nikolaevich I
    And it will simplify the task of directing the PRR to the base stations of mobile networks!

    The range of anti-aircraft missiles is very limited, it is 100-300 km, they may simply not reach the cell tower and then hit the radar antenna on the tower, which is much more difficult than destroying an air defense missile and gun system on the ground.
  40. 0
    17 June 2026 12: 52
    The number of drones with a range of 1000+ km is growing and will continue to grow, regardless of the development of the Strategic Defense Forces until a peace treaty is signed. The 404th isn't buying them; they're free, and production facilities in the EU are being built and expanding.
    Even if they remain with internal combustion engines and the same speeds, the number of helicopters will not be enough...even taking into account the Mi8 with two containers with GSh-2-23.
    We need an aircraft similar to the Tucano with a turboprop engine (mass), suspended containers with radar and with an OLS.
    The concept was conceived a long time ago; Russia's territory is vast, and there aren't enough air defense systems for such cheap drones.
  41. 0
    18 June 2026 02: 37
    We need to hit European refineries, that's what needs to be done. Destroy the oil depots, completely cut off their power. Before it's too late.
  42. 0
    18 June 2026 20: 06
    It turns out that we don't have an aircraft capable of effectively hunting drones, and the existing Yak-130 trainer is perfectly suited for attacking medium-speed targets, such as cruise missiles and UAVs with turbojet engines, which neither a Yak-52 aircraft nor a helicopter can catch.

    As I understand it, we have a dime a dozen Su-25s. Modernized ones, in storage, etc. They're of no use on the front lines right now anyway, but it can chase missiles, has radars, and payload capacity, and even has some protection against drones with air-to-air missiles.
    He will even release a flock of fighters against a swarm of drones.
  43. 0
    22 June 2026 10: 16
    It's sad, but where is the science? The Soviet education system allowed the country to develop nuclear weapons and missiles during the most difficult post-war years. This saved the country from a nuclear war with the US and its allies. The Russian education system is incapable of creating defensive electronic warfare systems against drones. These drones are, figuratively speaking, cheap and improvised. The costs of developing nuclear weapons and drones are simply incomparable. Where is the science? Only science, not a soldier with a rifle and a cart from the Civil War, can nullify this entire drone component, which, due to its cheapness and ease of manufacture, is plaguing our country.
    1. 0
      9 July 2026 01: 44
      Науку в СССР кормила вся страна!!! Бюджет был один для всех, не было олигархов с яхтами, не было у алюминиевых заводов и ГЭЦ владельцев-частников. Поэтому инаука развивалсь ибо понимало руковдство что без науки будет трындец.
      А ща , в 90е раздербанили страну под видом приватизации и усё. Урвал заводик алюминевый - и ниче ему ненадо окромя чтоб завод работал, нафига буржуину наука???
      Да не нужна, так же производство- мы за границей всё купим.
      и... всё затухло.
      Вот интересно , заводы и фабрики приватизировали , а потм их раздербанили и нету теперь производсства.
  44. 0
    24 June 2026 16: 21
    Why are you interested in advanced Russian air defense developments?
  45. 0
    10 July 2026 02: 11
    А не пора ли тотально шмонать все грузовики? И зачем второй члеен экипажа для охоты за беспилотниками? Есть 2 варианта возродить поршневые истребители времен ВОВ или установить соответствуещее огнестрелы для стрельбы через винт (применять синхронизаторы) или стрелять чрез ось винта если установлен редуктор, а так же установка пушек и пулеметов в консоли крыла!