Military Review

Gas for Manstein

29
Early in the morning, in the 4 hours of 30 minutes 13 in June 1942, the ambulance transport “Georgia” entered the South Bay of Sevastopol. When to Minna pier were only a few meters, transportation with clearly visible red crosses on board dived five German U-87. Two bombs hit the target - one in the engine room, the second - in the stern of transport. After 7 minutes there was a terrible explosion, and the 116 meter-long transport was literally torn in half. In 4 hours 55 minutes "Georgia" disappeared under water. Further Soviet historians put the bullet, after condemning another crime of the Nazis, the good, admiralty law prohibits flushing sanitary court.


Gas for Manstein


Raise to flood

But in 1948-1949 years both parts of "Georgia" were raised in the course of the Sevastopol bays removal of wrecks. Usually raised from the bottom of the sea trial or restored, or sent to the shipbreaking base - in 1949, the country as air was necessary scrap iron. But both parts of "Georgia" for some reason have not sent in Inkerman on butchering and towed in Cossack Bay and flooded there. Moreover, several divers and workers who participated in the ascent of "Georgia" were hospitalized. They appeared on the skin ulcers, characteristic of lesions with mustard gas.

In 1956 – 1959, a new ascent of both parts of “Georgia” was carried out, and this time they were towed and flooded away from the coast and at great depths. What is the deadly secret hiding the holds of sanitary vehicles?

Poison ship

To begin with, in the spring of 1942 the ships of the Black Sea fleet experienced a chronic shortage of anti-aircraft weapons, especially for protection against low-flying aircraft. But the ambulance transport “Georgia” had anti-aircraft weapons better than the Soviet destroyers of that time: five 45-mm cannons, two 12,7-mm DShK machine guns and six American Colt machine guns. The holds of the vehicle were loaded with shells to the eyeballs. But this is not so bad. Worst of all, among the high-explosive shells hundreds of chemical shells were laid out in even rows - caliber from 130 to 76 mm, as well as barrels of poisonous substance (OM), designed to equip aerial bombs. It was this cargo that was reburied twice along with the remains of "Georgia".

A rhetorical question arises: why in July 1942 of the year did you need to carry chemical ammunition to Sevastopol? Indeed, defenders of the city experienced an acute need in the high-explosive shells. Looking ahead, we note that because of the lack of shells and Sevastopol was commissioned. So why was there to carry himsnaryady which obviously can not be applied?

Nevertheless, it was just that - "Georgia" went to her last flight for the purpose of use of chemical weapon! Note that hundreds of tons of chemical ammunition - artillery shells, aerial bombs, various pouring aviation devices and so by the beginning of the war were stored in numerous adits of Sevastopol.

150-mm Germanic six-barreled chemical mortar, nicknamed by our soldiers "Vanyusha". By the spring of 1942, several battalions of such mortars were concentrated near Sevastopol

Brothers in Arms

The first chemical artillery for ship artillery arrived in Sevastopol back in 1916 year. Then the planned landing in the Bosporus, and Admiral Kolchak offered to throw Turkish coastal fortifications and infantry chemical shells. As a result, by February 1917 of the year in Sevastopol accumulated several hundred marine chemical shells of caliber from 102 to 305 mm.

After the war, both in Germany and in the USSR, the development of artillery and aviation weapons for ammunition was carried out in deep secrecy from its own population and Western countries: Germany signed the Geneva Protocol on the Prohibition of the Use of Chemical Weapons in the Summer of 1925, and the Soviet Union in December of 1927 . In 1926 year unfolded full-scale German-Soviet work on chemical weapons. The largest joint research center with a test site was established near the village of Shikhan in 130 km north of Saratov. The object received the secret designation "Tomka".

Try guess

The same system of classifying chemical weapons was adopted in the Wehrmacht and the Red Army. So, in the artillery himsnaryady all should have the same weight and ballistics with high-explosive and smoke shells. Therefore, in the shooting tables and other documents that were available in parts in peacetime, chemical shells did not appear anywhere. All Germanic chemical shells were painted in a dark protective color. On the projectiles with different chemical agents, colored annular bands were applied, as well as markings indicating the distinctive properties of the chemical agents, equipment, and a sample of the projectile. And guess what the inscription on the projectile means - FHGr Gelbring (howitzer grenade with a yellow ring) or FHGr Gruenring (howitzer grenade with a green ring).

Standards

The Germans had chemical equipment with a caliber from 75 mm to 150 mm, and in the Red Army - from 76 mm to 152 mm. They were divided into chemical, filled with liquid chemical agents, and fragmentation-chemical, filled with solid chemical agents. The latter provides an additional defeat the enemy shrapnel, like high-explosive shells.

The initial standard for calculating the number of chemical projectiles needed for bombardment of areas was as follows: one 76-mm chemical grenade per 40 m2 square or one 152-mm chemical projectile per 80 m2 square. Ballistic data 76-mm grenades chemical did not differ from conventional fragmentation grenade, and produced in their housings of conventional grenade.

Chemical bombs to German 100-mm light field howitzer arr. 16 18 and apparatus are similar to 75-mm projectiles. These shells are used in two versions, differing in the diameter of the ignition shells under a bursting charge

Enthusiasts

Interestingly, in the 1934 – 1936 years, the Ostechbureau and the Red Army ANII conducted “special secrecy work” on the theme of “Lafet”. So the shrapnel with poisonous elements was encrypted. In December 1934, the 76-mm poisonous shrapnel was tested with three shots. A crystalline poisonous substance was pressed into small 2-gram and 4-gram bullets. According to the commission, the shooting was successful.

In the prewar period, another 45 mm armor-piercing chemical shells were produced in the USSR. They were intended to poison the enemy personnel behind the armor tanks and pillboxes. The weight of the armor-piercing chemical projectile was 1,43 kg, the projectile contained 16 g of a poisonous substance placed in a chamber with a diameter of 24 mm. The initial velocity of the projectile was 760 m / s, that is, the ballistics of the shot with the same type of armor-piercing projectile UBR-240 were preserved.

Smelly "Katyusha"

It is curious that the appearance of rocket artillery in both the Wehrmacht and the Red Army was due to chemical projectiles. The fact is that the famous “Katyusha” was originally created for chemical munitions, and incendiary and high-explosive fragmentation shells were considered secondary. The first in the 1938 was the chemical practical shell PCX-132, and only then the high-explosive fragmentation missile M-13, which later received the RP-941 index.

At the end of the 30-s, the German engineer Nebel had designed the 15-cm missile and a six-barrel tubular installation, which the Germans called the six-barrel mortar. Mortar tests were initiated in the 1937 year. The system received the name «15-see smoke mortar type 'D'." In 1941, it was renamed 15 cm Nb.W 41 (Nebelwerfer), that is, 15-cm smoke mortar arr. 41. Naturally, the main purpose of the “smoke mortars” was not to install smoke screens, but to fire missiles filled with poisonous substances. Interestingly, the Soviet soldiers called 15 cm Nb.W 41 "Vanyushi", by analogy with the M-13, called "Katyusha".



Illiteracy

It should be noted that chemical weapons are effective only with their massive use. A typical example: at the beginning of the 1990-s, our historians discovered in the archives orders for the use of chemical equipment in the 1921 year against participants in the Antonovo uprising in Tambov. However, data on the losses of insurgents from chemical weapons was not found. Moreover, population surveys, conducted long before the restructuring, showed that the population in the year 1921 knew nothing about the application of the Communists agents. At the beginning of 80, I myself talked with an old woman, who boldly talked about battles with Antonovs, but had never heard of chemical shells. In fact, it was applied a few dozen 76-mm himsnaryadov that gave zero effect because of ignorance of our kraskomov.

Mass event

But in the Crimea, our command was preparing for the mass use of chemical weapons. I note that the first to use OM 11-Army General Manstein in April-May 1942 years on the Kerch Peninsula. Colonel-General F. Halder, in his diary of 13 June 1942, wrote: “General Oxner: Report on the participation of chemical troops in the battles for Kerch”.

Thus, the Soviet side quite objectively had the right to declare retaliatory measures. The massive use of chemical weapons near Sevastopol could lead to the complete defeat of Manstein’s army. Note that the Germans at Sevastopol had a huge advantage in battle Hinged (howitzers and mortars). And the defenders of the city had a significant superiority in long-range cannons (even without taking into account ship artillery). However, the mountainous terrain made guns with excellent ballistics impotent against German mortars hidden in the folds of the terrain. But chemical shells would easily have smoked the Germans out of their shelters. By the way, photos, newsreels and numerous memoirs show that our fighters did not part with gas masks until the last day of defense. But half-naked German soldiers near Sevastopol have no gas masks visible. Therefore, it is easy to assume the effect of the massive use of agents. However, the death of "Georgia" and attack the Germans out of Kharkov to Stalingrad forced the Soviet command to renounce the use of OM in the Crimea.

Papanintsy

Before the city was handed over during the 27 – 29 period of June 1942, chemical munitions were delivered at night from the Yukharina Beam storage facilities to Kazachya Bay, where they were loaded onto the Papaninets schooner, where they were then taken to the open sea near the bay, where they were dumped overboard. The discharge depth was not less than 50 m. At the same time, the mustard and lewisite, which the chemical bombs were refueled, were stored at that time in barrels of type L-100. Periodically, such barrels are found on the coast of Crimea today. "In the 80-e near the Cossack bay divers found the barrel type A-100 and drew to shore. An oily liquid smelling geranium was found in it. Laboratory analysis showed that in the barrel of domestic production is lewisite, a chemical agent. ” I would not wish such a find to anyone!
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  1. Greyfox
    Greyfox April 13 2013 09: 06 New
    +5
    And thank God that they did not apply! The Germans were leaders in such chemistry and it is still unknown how the chip would have laid down. Apparently, the saying "If you have a house made of glass, do not throw stones" kept both sides from using chemistry.
    1. svp67
      svp67 April 13 2013 13: 14 New
      +3
      Quote: Greyfox
      And thank God that they did not apply! The Germans were leaders in such chemistry and it is still unknown how the chip would have laid down. Apparently, the saying "If you have a house made of glass, do not throw stones" kept both sides from using chemistry.



      Nevertheless, this did not prevent the Germans from using BOV against our soldiers in Adzhimushka
    2. opkozak
      opkozak April 13 2013 23: 30 New
      +4
      The Germans widely used Cyclone B for poisoning prisoners of concentration camps. What is not a chemical war!
  2. Gazprom
    Gazprom April 13 2013 10: 12 New
    +2
    sensation, in a word ...

    It should be noted that chemical weapons are effective only with their massive use. A typical example: at the beginning of the 1990-s, our historians found in the archives orders on the use of chemical shells in the 1921 year against participants in the Antonov uprising in the Tambov region.
    "I'm not a boy to go to the archives!" © A.B.Shirokorad. ...
    1. svp67
      svp67 April 13 2013 13: 18 New
      +9
      Quote: Gazprom
      sensation, in a word ...

      It should be noted that chemical weapons are effective only with their massive use. A typical example: at the beginning of the 1990-s, our historians found in the archives orders on the use of chemical shells in the 1921 year against participants in the Antonov uprising in the Tambov region.
      "I'm not a boy to go to the archives!" © A.B.Shirokorad. ...

      The Red Army used chemical munitions from the "royal" reserves. And there were most of the shells equipped, not with BOVs, but with irritating agents such as chloropicrin. These are now used to disperse demonstrations.
  3. redwolf_13
    redwolf_13 April 13 2013 11: 57 New
    -4
    Where does it come from!! The stench is terrible !!! Again, the terrible rusky tried to fill the magnificent civilization with mustard gas, chlorine and it is not clear what. ADMINISTRATION Deputy let here THIS G ,, BUT. If someone else broke through the brain connected to the Foyan. My screen has nothing to do with it. If the attackers have an attack of incontinence, let G ,, M rush elsewhere
    1. redwolf_13
      redwolf_13 April 13 2013 15: 36 New
      0
      You put a minus JUSTIFY.
  4. Volkhov
    Volkhov April 13 2013 12: 24 New
    -11
    At the beginning of the article, they were mistaken for a month - in July the city was German.
    The accuracy of the German reconnaissance work is interesting - they knew that where they bombed in the city - it was good that the ship sank, and could even poison the whole district.
    During the war, Soviet chemical weapons served as a counterweight to the German atomic one - Sevastopol was defeated by nuclear shells, and after the second use on the Kursk Bulge there was an ultimatum on the chemical response and the use of nuclear weapons was limited to testing.
    1. Leisure
      Leisure April 13 2013 14: 18 New
      +5
      What nuclear weapons, what kind of alternative story?
      1. Volkhov
        Volkhov April 13 2013 14: 25 New
        -4
        The official story is completely false, specially made so that the population is blind and well managed ...
        Therefore, an alternative factual is gradually being created, which gives some kind of review and opportunity for movement.
        1. poligraf
          poligraf April 13 2013 21: 51 New
          +8
          Mr. Volkhov. You made a mistake on the site.
          You are here
          http://alternathistory.org.ua/
        2. Corsair
          Corsair April 14 2013 22: 27 New
          +3
          Quote: Volkhov
          Therefore, an alternative factual is gradually being created, which gives some kind of review and opportunity for movement.
          To the Yellow House laughing
        3. bezumnyiPIT
          bezumnyiPIT 11 May 2013 14: 26 New
          0
          gradually created? by whom? you? and the ass will not crack the strain?
    2. bezumnyiPIT
      bezumnyiPIT 11 May 2013 14: 24 New
      0
      SHIELD? Do you have two or three according to the history of the fatherland?
    3. Alex
      Alex 2 September 2013 09: 17 New
      +3
      Quote: Volkhov
      During the war, Soviet chemical weapons served as a counterweight to the German atomic one - Sevastopol was defeated by nuclear shells, and after the second use on the Kursk Bulge there was an ultimatum on the chemical response and the use of nuclear weapons was limited to testing.


      Is this nonsense in the last stage or just the evening before the evening was a success in full?
    4. Bigfoot_Sev
      Bigfoot_Sev 26 December 2013 15: 40 New
      0
      Quote: Volkhov
      At the beginning of the article, they were mistaken for a month - in July the city was German.
      The accuracy of the German reconnaissance work is interesting - they knew that where they bombed in the city - it was good that the ship sank, and could even poison the whole district.
      During the war, Soviet chemical weapons served as a counterweight to the German atomic one - Sevastopol was defeated by nuclear shells, and after the second use on the Kursk Bulge there was an ultimatum on the chemical response and the use of nuclear weapons was limited to testing.


  5. svp67
    svp67 April 13 2013 14: 20 New
    +3
    Quote: Volkhov
    During the war, Soviet chemical weapons served as a counterweight to the German atomic one - Sevastopol was defeated by nuclear shells, and after the second use on the Kursk Bulge there was an ultimatum on the chemical response and the use of nuclear weapons was limited to testing.



    And in more detail, this is about the "German nuclear weapons". Where and how was it used, and how did it happen that we did not notice?
    1. Volkhov
      Volkhov April 13 2013 15: 55 New
      -5
      They were used for the first time in Sevastopol (5 special grenades 813 mm cal.) Along Mount Champagne (buried), in warehouses in Sev. bay (buried), baht. 35 (low above ground). Perhaps by 35 baht. there were 2 shots, another 1 by the CP Black Sea Fleet.
      Power about 10 kT. Uranium explosives. More details in articles, other comments.
      "We" did not notice, because we did not sit at the NP, like Manstein. During the evacuation, only about 300 senior officers were taken out, who tried to keep secrets, like skin. For the most part, the 100 remaining in the city and at Cape Khersones died, not everyone could see from the dugouts, few knew about nuclear energy.
      But the leadership started the atomic program in July 42 - it is officially believed that Senior Lieutenant Flerov sent a letter to Stalin about the disappearance of work on uranium from the press, in reality, the Dora gun was fired at command posts, and the authorities did not like that.
      1. bezumnyiPIT
        bezumnyiPIT 11 May 2013 14: 28 New
        0
        And the Germans managed to rebuild Sevastopol in two years, so that ours did not notice traces of the use of nuclear weapons wassat
      2. Captain45
        Captain45 24 May 2013 16: 51 New
        0
        Quote: Volkhov
        They were used for the first time in Sevastopol (5 special grenades 813 mm cal.) Along Mount Champagne (buried), in warehouses in Sev. bay (buried), baht. 35 (low above ground). Perhaps by 35 baht. there were 2 shots, another 1 by the CP Black Sea Fleet.
        Capacities of the order of 10 kT. Uranium explosives.

        WELL THIS, this ... this is a rupture of the brain, both head and spinal, immediately together under the influence of nuclear weapons.
      3. Alex
        Alex 2 September 2013 09: 20 New
        +2
        Quote: Volkhov
        They were used for the first time in Sevastopol (5 special grenades 813 mm cal.) Along Mount Champagne (buried), in warehouses in Sev. bay (buried), baht. 35 (low above ground). Perhaps by 35 baht. there were 2 shots, another 1 by the CP Black Sea Fleet.
        Capacities of the order of 10 kT. Uranium explosives.

        And the case seems to be serious. Even minus the sin.
  6. redwolf_13
    redwolf_13 April 13 2013 15: 16 New
    +5
    Article or great stupidity or provocation
    Transport "Georgia" had a displacement of 6050 tons, a length of 115,85 m, a width of 15,5 m; draft 5,8 m; side height 7,84 m. As the main mechanisms, two diesel engines of 1950 hp were used, which worked on two four-blade propellers and ensured a full speed of at least 13,1 knots. A diesel stock of 286 tons provided a cruising range of 6540 miles (at full speed). The last passage of this ship from Novorossiysk to Sevastopol ended in tragedy. In addition to 708 people, 526 tons of ammunition were loaded into the holds of this vessel. "At the transition from Novorossiysk to Sevastopol convoy ... was discovered at 12 o'clock on June 12, 1942 by enemy air reconnaissance ... On the evening of the same day, the convoy was attacked by bombers and torpedo bombers. From 20 hours 30 minutes to 21 hours 35 minutes, 45 bombs and 150 torpedoes were dropped on a convoy located 8 miles south of Cape Ayia. "Georgia" managed to evade all torpedoes and most bombs. Only two “land mines” exploded in the water at a distance of 8-10 meters from the stern of the vehicle, and the third was 50 meters from the port side. Shock jammed the steering wheel in the "right on board" position, the right diesel engine stopped, the seams of the aft clearance cover parted ... the transport was slowly flooded with water. "The crew struggled to save their ship with the last effort: within half an hour they managed to start the right diesel engine and put the steering wheel in the diametrical plane (zero position). But the available drainage facilities were not enough, and the trim on the stern slowly increased, as the water flooded the tunnels of the propeller shafts and entered the engine room through the bulkhead. By 22 o’clock the water flooded holds N5 and N4. Speed ​​decreased as the shafts rotated in the water. By 3 o’clock (night) on June 13, 1942, the water flooded the tiller compartment, and its level reached the aft mooring deck and part of the windows went into the water. Speed ​​dropped to 7 knots. Minesweepers alternately towed "Georgia" slowly making their way to the base. Only at 4 a convoy passed booms (Sevastopol Bay) and when turning into the South Bay, the port tug SP-30 came to the aid of “Georgia”. It seemed that the transport could be saved. But when approaching the mine pier at 4 hours 48 minutes, five enemy aircraft attacked Georgia from a low-level flight. The morning light illuminated the semi-flooded Georgia, and the fresh wind quickly carried the smoke through. Two bombs hit the engine room and the N4 stern hold with ammunition. The plane dropping the bombs was shot down, but at 4 hours 55 minutes the ammunition in the stern holds was detonated. With a huge explosion, the Georgian corps was torn in half. The aft part of the hull with a length of about 40 meters quickly sank with a crane to the starboard side, and eight minutes later the bow of the long-suffering transport disappeared under the water. Only odnoka smoke, burning solarium and some pieces fell off on the water. Almost all died, only a few heavily shell-shocked sailors managed to pick up port boats from the water. Four more bombs exploding in the water dropped a second plane.
  7. redwolf_13
    redwolf_13 April 13 2013 15: 32 New
    +6
    If you believe this "scribbler" then in the adits and shelters of Sevastopol were already chemical BP. But the stupid command sent another transport with chemistry. Why lead even if there is already a lot.
    Sailors and Red Army men in bags from gas masks carried products. And the gas mask does not protect against mustard gas; Looks like a poorly studied "borosopisets" at the lessons of the NVP.
    Yes, here's another question "Georgia" sank torn in half, that is, part or all of the Chemical BP fell into the water. After the occupation of Sevastopol, the Germans of Romania and Italians cleaned the fairway and port and that they did not find anything. And where did the chemistry from the cellars go? ITS that the Red Navy "drank" ??? Yes, if at least one shell or barrel hit the Germans or their allies, a howl would stand on the whole ball about wild Russian bloodthirsty commissars.
    Pure water ordering article
    1. Volkhov
      Volkhov April 13 2013 19: 50 New
      0
      Chem. there were ammunition, this is not a violation of the treaties, and now there is, their capture was nothing special - the application is another matter.
      A gas mask partially protects against everything, a full chemical suit was then a rarity, just thick clothes hold a drop.
      The Germans hardly needed to get a foreign mustard - they had their own gases. And the article is many years old.
    2. Alex
      Alex 2 September 2013 09: 25 New
      +2
      Yes, if at least one shell or barrel hit the Germans or their allies, a howl would stand on the whole ball about wild Russian bloodthirsty commissars.

      That's it. Not to mention the fact that then the entire front would be drowned in clouds of such OM, that the entire PMV would seem like a light stink in the garbage.
  8. Fibrizio
    Fibrizio April 13 2013 19: 11 New
    +3
    I liked the photo with the "special" German rocket mortar for firing precisely with gas shells. Well, no, the truth is, the article doesn’t refer to anything, but it affirms such things as "why rocket mortars were developed."
    And if such shells were used, then I think it would be known, than not compromising? In Nuremberg, this would have been remembered.
    For example, the fact that the British during the capture of France by Hitler used bullets doom doom I heard from several places. And about it never.
  9. SIT
    SIT April 13 2013 20: 53 New
    +5
    Bombs stitch the deck of a civilian ship like paper. So they rushed in the holds. Georgia was torn in half. It turns out that there was a detonation of a fairly large number of some ammunition. How did not a single chemical shell detonate? How could barrels of lewisite survive in such an explosion? At the bottom of Cape Chersonesos and now are shells of various calibers, but they all that I saw have traces of rifling on the rims. These were unexploded when fired, and there was no information anywhere about shooting chemical shells.
    1. svp67
      svp67 April 14 2013 17: 13 New
      +1
      Quote: SIT
      Bombs stitch the deck of a civilian ship like paper. So they rushed in the holds


      Not a fact, the bombs could pierce the ship through and explode already under the hulls, as a result of a dynamic impact, the hull also broke ...
      1. Andrey77
        Andrey77 April 16 2013 13: 27 New
        0
        Both versions are correct. Explosion in the hold or explosion under the bottom. An explosion on the upper deck does not cause such damage.
  10. ImPerts
    ImPerts April 14 2013 17: 10 New
    +4
    The article is nonsense.
    This is about the author:
    http://history.milportal.ru/arxiv/voenno-istoricheskij-zhurnal-2009-g/voenno-ist
    oricheskij-zhurnal-3-2009-g /
    “In the Military History Journal No. 10 for 2007, two articles were published under the heading“ ”Unknown Wars” by historian Alexander Shirokorad. ”I fully share the opinion of the authors of Lieutenant Colonel A.V. Lobanov and captain 1ran E.G. Machikin about A. B. Shirokorada 1, but I can’t agree that in the titles of the articles A.B.Shirokorad is called a historian. So, the article by A.V. Lobanov is entitled: “Pseudoscientific study of military operations in the Northern Black Sea Region” by 2, and E.G. Machikina - “Chronicle diluted with jokes with numerous errors and inaccuracies. ”3. A historian cannot engage in pseudoscience and anecdotes. The creations of AB Shirokorad are nothing but falsification of history.”
    or
    "Gavril" against torpedo bombers
    What happens when cynical amateurs write about the war "
    http://www.aviaport.ru/digest/2007/04/11/119097.html
    The book of Alexander Shirokorad “Torpedo bombers in battle. They were called suicide bombers.” In it, the author tries to impress readers that the leadership of the country, the Armed Forces and the Navy were universally mediocre, the merits of crews of torpedo bombers were inflated, medals, orders and titles of Soviet Heroes They received the Union undeservedly. In the preface, Mr. Shirokorad writes with irony about Gavril - the character known from the book "The Golden Calf." The most piquant is that the author of "Torpedo bombers in battle", of course, does not classify himself. Out of false modesty? I didn’t have to fight, but during the service I met with dozens of pilots and navigators - participants of the war. Most of them did not survive to this day and can’t fend for themselves, which gives me the right to speak out in defense of their honor, dignity and combat merit! "
    Here is just about pseudo-historians. 5 parts.
    "How and why historians lie"
    http://www.km.ru/news/kak-i-pochemu-vrut-istoriki-ch-1
  11. i.xxx-1971
    i.xxx-1971 April 14 2013 22: 31 New
    0
    Rave. Sevastopol surrendered commanders: Oktyabrsky and Petrov with their licking, cowardly fled. In the Great Patriotic War, the parties did not use chemical weapons. If I may say so, there was a kind of "gentlemanly" agreement.
    1. Andrey77
      Andrey77 April 16 2013 13: 31 New
      0
      There is some truth in your words. To 5 (!!!) aircraft attacked a civilian ship ... So the target was "Georgia". And this means that the Germans somehow knew about the cargo on board.
  12. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. April 21 2013 16: 47 New
    +1
    Quote: i.xxx-1971
    Rave. Sevastopol surrendered commanders: Oktyabrsky and Petrov with their licking, cowardly fled. In the Great Patriotic War, the parties did not use chemical weapons. If I may say so, there was a kind of "gentlemanly" agreement.

    Brad.
    The fall of Sevastopol is a national tragedy.
    The main reason is a mediocre defeat on the Kerch Peninsula, where everything was prepared for the offensive, the liberation of Crimea and the deblockade of Sevastopol. there was also the main supply directed to the Crimea.

    And in Sevastopol, there was already not enough troops to repulse the next assault, and enough artillery had only 2-2,5 ammunition (it took at least 6). Neither Oktyabrsky nor Petrov are guilty of these troubles.
    Their only fault was that they were evacuated, and the Primorsky Army of the regiment defense unit of the main Black Sea Fleet died, almost all died, because only about 30-35 thousand people were captured.
    And, again, the main feature of the tragedy is that in Sevastopol the best soldiers of the Red Army and the Workers 'and Peasants' Red Fleet were killed and captured.
    so blame the leadership in the Caucasus and the Kerch Peninsula.
  13. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. April 21 2013 16: 50 New
    0
    Quote: Andrey77
    There is some truth in your words. To 5 (!!!) aircraft attacked a civilian ship ... So the target was "Georgia". And this means that the Germans somehow knew about the cargo on board.

    Yes, at that time, if the Germans found our boat in the sea, then they attacked it with squadrons.
    That was their advantage in the air. From memory, about 1 to 15.
  14. Sergey S.
    Sergey S. April 21 2013 17: 05 New
    0
    Quote: i.xxx-1971
    Rave. Sevastopol surrendered commanders: Oktyabrsky and Petrov with their licking, cowardly fled. In the Great Patriotic War, the parties did not use chemical weapons. If I may say so, there was a kind of "gentlemanly" agreement.

    Brad.
    The fall of Sevastopol was predetermined by the defeat of our strike group on the Kerch Peninsula.
    There. and not to Sevastopol for several months, the main deliveries of ammunition were made.
    The Kerch group of 2 armies was supposed to delocate Sevastopol and liberate the Crimea ...
    The fault of Oktyabrsky and Petrov is that they remained alive, and did not share the fate of the units of the Primorsky Army and the coastal defense of the Main Base.

    So blame the leadership in the Caucasus and the Kerch Peninsula.
  15. Navigator2013
    Navigator2013 April 29 2013 00: 13 New
    -2
    At the height of World War II, on December 2, 1943, the Italian port of Bari was bombed by the German Junkers JU-88, during which 17 Allied cargo ships were sunk, 6 more damaged. Among the sunken ships was the American military transport John Harvey (displacement of 7200 tons, 134,6 x 17,4 x 8,43 m, armament 1 x 102 mm gun mount !!!)
    Liberty type with a cargo of 60 tons of mustard shells belonging to the American army. As a result, the crew completely died, according to official figures, due to the spread of mustard gas, a number of military personnel and the local population were poisoned, including fatal ones. Yesi there was a "gentlemen's agreement", why did the Americans transport ammunition from the OM in advance? German intelligence worked just as clearly as in Sevastopol ...
  16. Captain45
    Captain45 24 May 2013 16: 47 New
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    And I read about something completely different in the memoirs of the chief of staff of the 4 (Yalta) partisan region Ilya Vergasov that the Georgia medical transport was sunk in October 1941 of the year almost on the roads of Yalta, he saw the death of the ship from the edge of the Yalta at the same time almost the entire headquarters of the Yalta partisan region. The question is who is lying, Ilya Vergasov in his "Yalta notebooks" or A. Shirokorad in this article. The reason is the discrepancy in the dates of the ship's death. Vergasov described this episode, from memory as follows: "Finally "Georgia" came out, Find on the ship the wounded evacuated from the hospitals of Yalta, Simeiza flew, one salvation hung fog, but the south is south, only transport went into the sea, the clouds burst and the bright southern sun splashed. Twenty minutes later we heard the familiar howl of German dive-bombers. Four fell out of the clouds " Junkers. "They dived, reptiles, like in exercises, literally five minutes later the transport broke in half and went into the water. There was nothing left, just the gray sea." Yes, and there were a lot of questions about chemical weapons, chemical weapons in the USSR, a lot of things done Germans, the USSR provided them with a training ground, but and they themselves did not pick their nose, learned a lot, but in the Crimea, but in such numbers, it is doubtful.
  17. Captain45
    Captain45 24 May 2013 17: 02 New
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    I apologize, comrades, in the heat of emotion, I did not immediately understand that “Georgia” is not “Armenia”, a damn pun, although they don’t joke about this topic. Vergasov spoke about the death of “Armenia”. I apologize for the ships of the same type, and the names, although I see the difference between Georgians and Armenians.
  18. Captain45
    Captain45 24 May 2013 17: 02 New
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    I apologize, comrades, in the heat of emotion, I did not immediately understand that “Georgia” is not “Armenia”, a damn pun, although they don’t joke about this topic. Vergasov spoke about the death of “Armenia”. I apologize for the ships of the same type, and the names, although I see the difference between Georgians and Armenians.
  19. silberwolf88
    silberwolf88 7 May 2014 14: 22 New
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    About how many wonderful discoveries we have ... preparing an unbiased study of history.
    Everything was ... BUT for everything ... even the use of chemical weapons ... there were reasons.