Bulgarian gun Р-М02

In the previous article it was possible to get acquainted with the Bulgarian pistol P-M01, which was, in fact, a cosmetic modernization of the Makarov pistol. This gun remained relevant for a long time, but the consumer, including the army and the police, demanded weapons under a more powerful ammunition, and the company Arsenal hastened to meet these requirements. With the beginning of the new century, the company began work on a new model of weapons, which was supposed to meet the needs of both the civilian market and become used by the army and police, and this gun was eventually developed. Let's try to meet him.

It was decided to make a new pistol under one of the main ammunition, which, although it is becoming obsolete, is slowly becoming less relevant, namely, 9x19. The designers decided to create a weapon that stood out against the general background, while it would be quite reliable and efficient, combined compactness, high working life and would be cheap to manufacture. It was possible to realize, unfortunately, far from all of our plans, although the result was quite nice, although I had some problems.

The appearance of the gun corresponds to all the latest modern trends of weapon fashion: a combination of plastic and metal, a seat for additional devices and so on and so forth. On the right and left sides, a fuse switch is located on the casing-shutter, which protrudes beyond the casing-shutter at the back, which allows you to remove and put the weapon on the fuse, without taking it away from the aiming line, although this slightly disturbs the trigger of the gun, but in any case This is all implemented reasonably and conveniently. On the plastic frame under the barrel there is a seat for a compact flashlight or laser designator. The slide delay control is located on the left side, it also serves as a lock for the housing cover, which does not allow the weapon to self-disassemble. The pistol grip has removable rear pads that allow you to adapt the weapon to the hand of the shooter of various sizes. Standard sights are mounted on the dovetail seats on the gate, which allows replacing them with more comfortable ones for the shooter, including with a fully adjustable one.

But much more interesting is the weapon automation system, which is built on the principle of gas braking of the bolt. Under the barrel of the weapon a gas piston is placed, into which, when fired, gunpowder gases get through the hole in the barrel bore and prevent the shutter-casing from moving backwards. After the bullet leaves the barrel, the powder gases reduce their pressure and the shutter-casing can easily start moving by throwing out the cartridge case and cocking the trigger while moving backwards and inserting the cartridge into the chamber when moving forward. The idea of ​​such an automation system is not new, there are other types of weapons that work on the same principle, but all of them have one common drawback - high demands on the powder charge. "Dirty" and poor-quality powder immediately makes itself felt in such weapons, adversely affecting the reliability and durability of the sample. So it’s not known what a gun you can’t charge, it feeds on exceptionally high-quality ammunition.

The weapon has a barrel with a polygonal cut length of 103,6 millimeters. The total length of the weapon is 180 millimeters. The weight of the P-M02 pistol is 760 grams, the capacity of the 15 magazine ammunition. Due to the fact that the weapon is very capricious for ammunition, the claimed resource of the 6000 pistol shots itself, the barrel of the weapon is able to withstand 10000 shots. I think that it is not necessary to say what information is present in the advertising of weapons, and what is not.

In general, the sample, in my opinion, turned out to be very interesting, but far from widespread, if only because of the fact that there are no quality cartridges everywhere. Dimensions and weight of the weapon allow you to wear it hidden without any inconvenience, even when it comes to daily wear. The accuracy of the weapon is quite high and with good preparation of the shooter can confidently use the weapon at distances up to 100 meters, although the effective range specified by the manufacturer is equal to 50 meters, but here is the question of the growth of the hands of each individual shooter.

Comments

[poizor]

Due to the fact that the weapon is very moody to the ammunition, the declared resource of the pistol itself is 6000 shots, but the barrel of the weapon is capable of withstanding 10000 shots.

Glock guarantee - 20 shots. draw your own conclusions.

[scrabler]

It seems to me that the resource of the pistol was underestimated. Simply, the bore locking system, according to Barnitzke’s principle, is a very capricious thing, sensitive to the quality of gunpowder, and therefore taken to a minimum so that there are no complaints. But why the resource with a polygonal rifle in 10 thousand shots is not clear.

[poizor]

Well, on the PM resource in general is 4, and here it is already 000.
about PMM they write that this resource also fell significantly after using more powerful cartridges.

[timeout]

Dear, show me a PM with a resource of 4000 shots, even after perestroika production ?! In the production of weapons in the USSR, the concept of a resource did not exist, but there was a rate of fire until 1970, it was indicated as 5000 shots, and after 2500. Only everyone knows the fact that the PM after the rate of fire on the contrary only rubbed the mechanism. The first issues that were made in Tula! under the numbers from 0010 to 0030 and the letters TM are still in technically sound condition with more than 150 thousand shots fired. This I consider an indicator for technology in the middle of the last century.

[scrabler]

There is still a question of how to interpret the very concept of "resource". After all, you can talk about 10 thousand shots without changing the characteristics of the weapon or the barrel itself, or you can talk about 10 thousand as a shot after which the weapon in your hands crumbles. So everything is very controversial with the resources of weapons, they are rather written either for advertising, or so that there are no complaints about the manufacturer, they say, like this, the pistol is designed for so much, and I shot so much, here is a dump truck with shells The real resource for each pistol, even for one batch, is different and you can only recognize it when it ends, so these numbers are 10, 20 thousand so that it would take a place and measure well-known bodies with competitors, no more. Take any gun. One shoots his weapon without even jerking, and with the second it dangles in his hands, do not understand what. Who will last longer? So even the very resource depends on the shooter, not only on the device of the weapon, its quality and ammunition.

[timeout]

Cyril, you can measure anything. But I personally have PM 1968 on hand, from which I shot 4 rounds in 12000 years of ownership, and I am the 3 owner, despite the fact that it already has two export hallmarks on it, for some reason it’s not going to fall apart, it’s only change the return spring.

[scrabler]

What I'm talking about) And the tsiferki that the manufacturer gives, it is so

[poizor]

for the PM it is obvious that this is really "so". as for AK and SVD.
no need to talk about others on the harsh experience of the "quality" of a domestic manufacturer, which, even with pistols produced for more than half a century, drives out an open marriage ...

or articles and facts appeared on the Hansa when Glock and Co. did not stand up to what is written in the guarantee? But after all, many guns are armed and fired.

[timeout]

Dear, I myself sometimes visit Hansa. But to the personal opinions of other people, I put my own. Tell me who the Russian Federation has the opportunity to shoot, except for athletes and law enforcement officers? Short-stem owners who live outside of Russia, with technical problems, usually turn to the warranty service and do not describe it on Internet resources. I personally ... on the lengthy reasoning of people who can not for various reasons, not just shoot, but even hold the weapon in question. And I have such an opportunity, and the number of shooting pieces of iron is limited only by the size of my pocket.

[timeout]

By the way, the rate of fire was determined not by the manufacturer, but by GRAU.

[poizor]

Quote: scrabler

There is still a question of how to interpret the very concept of "resource". After all, you can talk about 10 thousand shots without changing the characteristics of the weapon or the barrel itself, or you can talk about 10 thousand as a shot after which the weapon in your hands crumbles.

Well, for Glock, it's kind of certain backlash in the trunk.

Quote: scrabler

The real resource for each pistol, even one batch, is different and you can recognize it only when it is over, so these 10, 20 thousand numbers are such that they would take a place and compete with known authorities, not more.

production quality is called.

Quote: scrabler

Take any gun. One shoots at him the weapon doesn’t even twitch, and at the second it hangs in his hands as if you don’t understand what. Whose weapon will last longer?

it will equally serve both; only weapons care and the use of different ammunition can affect.

[scrabler]

Do not tell me, the resource of the weapon depends on how you use the weapon. Moreover, there are separate models, or rather they were, in which the automatic system refused due to the fact that the rifleman was riding and was shaking along with his weapon. An example is certainly not correct, but the fact that a rigidly fixed pistol will have a greater resource than the one used by a person is a fact.

[poizor]

Quote: scrabler

Do not tell me, the resource of a weapon depends on how the weapon is used. Moreover, there are separate models, or rather, there were those in which the automation refused because the shooter rode on a cone and he was shaking along with his weapon.

Duc I do not mind - but these models did not go into series, or it was so long ago that it is called the 18th century.

Quote: scrabler

the fact that a rigidly fixed gun will have a greater resource than the one used by man is a fact.

How does it affect the trunk resource? and so what, and Glock where only and by whom only has not been used for decades, but there are no complaints about the resource ...

[scrabler]

I mean not the resource of the barrel, but the resource of the weapon as a whole. Misunderstood each other a little

[poizor]

Quote: scrabler

I do not mean the resource of the barrel, but the resource of the weapon as a whole.

so if the trunk resource of 20 is given as the main criterion, then everything else is built for it.
and "everything else" usually will survive more than one barrel.

[poizor]

Quote: Timeout

In the production of weapons in the USSR, the concept of a resource did not exist, but there was a norm that shot until 1970; it was indicated as 5000 shots, and after 2500.

this is the resource.

Quote: Timeout

It is only a well-known fact that in PM, after a norm, it is the other way round, only the mechanism was rubbed.

that's the quality! you don't even need to use a file and a hammer - you just need to shoot 5000 (or 2500) cartridges for the pistol to "get used"! stunned!

Quote: Timeout

One of the numbers from 0010 to 0030 and the letters TM are still in technically sound condition with more than 150 thousand shots fired. This I consider an indicator for technology in the middle of the last century.

What's the problem? replaced the worn trunk at Glock after 20, at PM after 000 - and shoot further.
only on the Glock it will be the 8th barrel, and on the PM 30 (or 60?). no, of course you can shoot with the old barrel - just think the bullets will fly "in that direction", and not at the target.
so we think where the technology is ...

[timeout]

If you find at least one PM with a replaced table or which needs to be modified with a file ... Operational shooting this concept is not a guarantee of the manufacturer, but the number of shots after which the weapon must undergo maintenance in the weapons workshop, which even in Soviet times was not done as unnecessary. It’s not worth idealizing Glock, it was enough to see these devices and with broken frames, blown trunks or shrunken springs in the first thousand shots.

[poizor]

Quote: Timeout

If you find at least one PM with a replaced table or which needs to be modified with a file

it's not me talking about the shot at 150 ...

Quote: Timeout

Operational shooting this concept is not a guarantee of the manufacturer, but the number of shots after which the weapon must undergo maintenance in the weapons workshop, which even in Soviet times was not done as unnecessary.

so what resource does the PM have?

Quote: Timeout

It’s not worth idealizing Glock, it was enough to see these devices and with broken frames, blown trunks or shrunken springs in the first thousand shots.

1. what did you do with the frame than broke it?
2. what kind of cartridges were they shoved into the pistol, that the barrel was inflated? I saw such hands that shoved there "special" home-made, and then swore that "she came herself!"
3. see item 2.

yuzal wildly killed pm, the barrel is almost smooth, itself all white in nicks, in the trunk of a rust shell rust, in general, IMHO he shot more than 50 k shots clearly. Threat in an object the size of an elephant’s ass with great difficulty hit 1 time out of 8 with 25 m

Glock and Co. will have the same problems.

[timeout]

1. what did you do with the frame than broke it?

The frame was cracked and just burst. For 2 years I saw three such trunks.

2. what kind of cartridges were they shoved into the pistol, that the barrel was inflated? I saw such hands that shoved there "special" home-made, and then swore that "she came herself!"

No, the technology for relieving internal stresses after forging the barrel was simply violated, and the metal remained too ductile, when firing with a half-shell or with practical bullets, I did not observe bloating, only when shooting FMJ.

How does it affect the trunk resource? and so what, and Glock where only and by whom only has not been used for decades, but there are no complaints about the resource ...

Tell me where Glock was used? And in what army units?

so what resource does the PM have?

It turns out that PM has a physical resource even higher than that declared by Glock. At least I don’t know a single Glock which during operation did not break anything.

[poizor]

Quote: Timeout

Tell me where Glock was used? And in what army units?

Glock was and is being used by the police. Well, all sorts of fans to shoot.

Quote: Timeout

It turns out that PM has a physical resource even higher than that declared by Glock. At least I don’t know a single Glock which during operation did not break anything.

which PM? how many PM shoot you as much as the Glocks you have ever dealt with?
By the way, what about firing accuracy? with ammunition used?
It would be interesting, of course, to remove PM and Glock by 20 and compare the results ... dreams

[timeout]

For your information, the PM, with all its plainness, performs its functions 100%. A normal shooter calmly puts a bullet at 25 meters in a circle with a diameter of 6 cm. Read the posts carefully! The reliability of the PM before the first breakdown or delay is higher than that of the praised Glock, again this is not only my statement, but the opinion of many people who dealt with this gun. If we are again talking about reliability. Take Glock from any shooting gallery and look at his condition, and then compare with the PM who shot the same. You talk about what you have not seen in life and are trying to argue. And my experience already allows us to make comparisons, since, unlike you, I have been the owner of the short-barrel for almost 12 years, and I shot from pistols of almost all famous brands with more than one thousand rounds of ammunition.

[VictorRO]

I can say the following about Glock - I heard only one case of glock breakdown over the past 12 years in Moldova, and we have enough of them in private individuals (we have been allowed to wear a cop since the age of 94). Clone PMa - the so-called Baikal 442 (6 rifling) broke a lot, although initially the quality of Baikals can not be compared with PM. Unfortunately in Russia, weapons for civilian purposes are not made very well, and therefore the price is several times lower than the same Glock. I have 19 already the 3rd year and there are no problems. Prior to this, I had ChZ and Walter. Glock is Kalashnikov in pistols. Shooted cleaned and do not care - for some reason it does not redden like all other types. PM lived its golden age with dignity and it is time to retire. Times change and you need another weapon with different characteristics.

[kay040976]

Here the guys tried to write about all the changes in the PM, and you can accordingly compare what goes wrong and analyze for what reason (http://guns.allzip.org/topic/81/87214.html). There are a lot of things about the Glock on the site too ... Makarov’s pistol is not to blame, a hundred became Makarych, Baikal, IZhom, etc. .... He is a good gun in itself.
PM lived, PM alive, PM will live ...
PS the truth is only with his old cartridge

[timeout]

it's not me talking about the shot at 150 ...

I don’t talk about this, go to Tula, KBP Museum. And you will see such numbers only with an accuracy of one.

[timeout]

locking the barrel channel according to the Barnitzke principle is a very moody thing

In vain so about Barnitsk ... Enough pistols that work on this principle such as HK 7-13, Steyr GB18 trunks are even very reliable. It all depends not on the principle, but on its implementation.

[scrabler]

This is not the case of the barrel locking system, the system itself is certainly excellent, many thanks to the designer for it. Here the fact is that not all cartridges will flawlessly eat, cartridges in which the powder in half with mud will not go. Rather go go, but for how long - the question.

[timeout]

I have a friend, a policeman in Bonn. He has 2 pistols, time sheet and personal HK P7-13. The personal barrel is fed only by Russian-made cartridges, Barnaul. The quality of our gunpowders is probably not worth repeating. Shot already in the region of 8 thousand, and for all the time only 4 delays. 1 due to the fault of the store, the rest due to the dead spring of the ejector. He did not own GB18 for long, and even because of the very poor smuggled ammunition from Brazil, there were no delays.

[scrabler]

Damn, that's lucky people And why such a strict savings on ammunition? By the way, it would be interesting to find out by the difference in price from different manufacturers, say, the same 9х19. Well, so to speak, in order to compare how much domestic cartridges are cheaper than foreign ones outside the post-Soviet space.

[timeout]

Pack of 50 9x19 FMJ Barnaul costs 12 euros in Germany. In Asuncion, a pack of the same costs 50000 guarani (about 15 bucks). Real Brazilian SHS are around 20 bucks per pack.

[avt]

An interesting design, but in my opinion not practical. You can say not working, a combat model - SUV.

[scrabler]

But no matter how it was, I would take it if possible))) An interesting locking system, accuracy, if you can talk about it for a short-barrel, let it be necessary to mess with it, but that’s only more interesting As a civilian model fit

[avt]

Quote: scrabler

and I would take it if possible))) An interesting locking system,

For the collection - why not, but as a working tool. I doubt it.

[Alew]

In my opinion, this is another attempt to use a gun to slow down with powder gases. Even the first Grach used a similar system after clogging the automatic slowdown, he shot another 1000 times and broke after that Grach designers returned to the short stroke of the barrel and got a normal pistol. From these pistols with pistons with rollers interest PSA pistol (Berdysh) A free bolt with a polyurethane damper interchangeable shafts can use 9X18 9X19 PM TT Beautiful pistol some springs to twist under the question of a reserving

[Ch0sen1]

None of the gas braking pistols were widely used due to their increased sensitivity to contamination. The system is interesting as a civilian, sporting weapon, but hardly in combat conditions.

[kay040976]

Yes comrades. Well, people created another illiquid. Well, they want to throw money for development. Let be! Do not take a proverb about a rake. Do not interfere with the concept of military and civilian weapons. For combat and more claims, performance characteristics and requirements are different.
I’m glad for a comrade who managed to shoot a lot of ammunition from all over the world, but what is the argument about. The simplest test, immersion in water, pull and shoot ... Guess what will happen to such a gun? This is a drawback of the locking scheme! A disease of all these pistols.
Two advantages - a fixed barrel, from which accuracy is higher, a small number of parts of the locking mechanism. There are more disadvantages. Even if IT (the pistol) fails at least once at the right moment, but what kind of gun is it needed then ?! Such a device is not for protecting people, but rather for a turn, for terrorists they are developing so that they would not fire a shot at the right time.
Such a thing not only in the barrel and box will have to be cleaned but everywhere, but with complete disassembly (at least without a frame), and after each interruption of shooting (at high humidity, or low temperatures), because regardless of the cartridge, the deposited particles of burnt gunpowder inevitably collect everything on themselves.