Military Review

Nazarbayev, the destroyer of the USSR, will never become a creator

114

The allegations that he is the “main integrator” of the post-Soviet space is a myth


It's a shame to admit it, but it seems that the realities of the Russian-Kazakh relations are becoming more and more confident in the picture that is unpleasant for Moscow: Kazakhstan is objectively more necessary for Russia than vice versa. After all, Russia is the locomotive of this “idea of ​​the century” - the Eurasian Union. Astana, on the other hand, supports this idea, as the analysis of recent events, obviously unfriendly to Moscow, shows, rather declaratively.

Indeed, if one observes the actions of the Kazakh authorities, one can only be amazed how this can be combined with the status of an economic and political ally, how a country that is a member of the Customs Union with Russia and is a “co-founder” of the Eurasian Union can do this. Meanwhile, official Astana requires Moscow to “pack suitcases” at Baikonur, clearly does not oppose the prospects of a referendum on secession from the Customs Union, which local nationalists dream of, does not overwhelm those who want to significantly limit the circulation of the Russian language and, finally, does not rule out switching from Cyrillic to Latin . All such initiatives and plans for the future are declared almost completely without any reservations on the position of Russia. The authorities of the republic at every opportunity seek to emphasize its exceptional sovereignty.

Without exaggeration, the mass exodus of Russians from this country can be considered a true indicator of negative anti-Russian tendencies in Kazakhstan’s domestic policy. You can even safely use, if not too politically correct, but in this case, just the correct verb "run." That's right: as soon as Moscow had declared the program of resettlement of compatriots - it was here that all the most interesting began. An amazing (then - for some, now - for many) truth has opened: the Russians in Kazakhstan seemed to be waiting for this opportunity. Statements to the Russian authorities with requests for citizenship were an avalanche. You do not need to be a medium to unravel the main essence of such a mass mood. Of course, there is a longing for the Motherland, although the request is also served in no small numbers by those Russian Kazakhstanis who have lived their entire adult life outside of Russia. But it is getting harder and harder to become Russian in Kazakhstan - and not at all because of the gnawing grief over the sources. Everything is more prosaic. Astana does not get tired of reminding them: “You are strangers”.

Such, you see, the “Eurasian Union” is looming.

Meanwhile, the mass exodus of Russians from Kazakhstan is fraught with danger for the entire project of the Eurasian Union. Yes, Vladimir Putin and Nursultan Nazarbayev can meet and solemnly sign as many pacts as necessary for mutual integration, but only how will they work in this situation and what will their price be? “The very discussion of the usefulness or risks of the outcome of Russians and Russian-speakers from anywhere means that the Russian state fixes for itself the meaninglessness and the impossibility of building a new large state - the Eurasian Union,” Alexander Sobyanin, head of the strategic planning service of the Association for Border Cooperation, told the REX news agency. . Well, how can you argue?

Of course, in world politics there have always been a lot of theater and theatrical conventions, but Vladimir Putin, in his speeches and articles, repeatedly reminded us all that the Eurasian Union is a serious project to which serious resources are attracted. So is it not insulting to be so ridiculous to say goodbye to a great idea?

In a conversation with a KM.RU columnist, senior researcher at the Russian Institute for Strategic Studies, political scientist Azhdar Kurtov revealed the initial motives of the unfriendly policy of official Astana against the backdrop of a declared readiness for Eurasian integration:

- From the very beginning of voicing the idea of ​​building the Eurasian Union, I had serious doubts that some of our partners would sincerely support it. Why such doubts have the right to exist? Because the destroyers can not be creators, as I believe. Those people who destroyed the USSR at the end of the 80 and the beginning of the 90 of the last century, hardly changed their views. After all, the main merit they ascribe to themselves is the creation of nation states, that is, the destruction of the Soviet Union. So can a person who destroyed, suddenly “overhang”, reconsider his views and act in the opposite direction? Most likely, this is still slyness, even if these people declare their intentions.

In addition, from my point of view, we still do not quite correctly assess the causes of the collapse of the Soviet Union. The main reason is in the selfishness of national elites, in their desire to have full power. Power, I remind you, then, during the transition from a planned economy to a market economy (with unlimited power), they provided extremely wide opportunities for enrichment. That is, they sought not just the possession of power, but the possession of just such a power that would allow them to control the mechanism of property distribution, its privatization in their own interests, in the interests of their family, the clan. And there are plenty of examples, including in Kazakhstan. Yes, under the Soviet regime there were also the first secretaries of the Communist Party, but their relatives did not have such fabulous states as the relatives of Nazarbayev now possess. But why on earth? This all happened not because of their exceptional intellectual or business abilities, but because of their kindred closeness to the first person of the state, who determined the policy of his country.

Why, even then, at the first wave of independence, did the first big wave of Russians leaving Kazakhstan leave? Because such was the policy of the Kazakh authorities, who did not want to share their power with politicians belonging to another ethnic group, with Russians, Tatars, and Ukrainians. They wanted monopolies and passed relevant laws: for example, a law on language, knowledge of which was necessary for applicants for landmark posts in the system of state administration. And so they squeezed the Russian population out of their republic. I am already silent about the fact that at the beginning of the 90-ies, the Kazakh authorities blocked in a discriminatory way the associations of various Russian organizations, in particular, the Cossack organizations, stopped attempts to consolidate forces that defended the development of relations between Kazakhstan and Russia. But already then the myth of Nazarbayev as the “main integrator” in the post-Soviet space was launched. But only by further actions of Nursultan Abishevich this was not confirmed in any way.
Author:
Originator:
http://www.km.ru
114 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must to register.

I have an account? Sign in

  1. Hleb
    Hleb 12 May 2013 07: 09 New
    30
    After all, Russia is the locomotive of this “idea of ​​the century” - the Eurasian Union.

    But what about the fact that Nazarbayev is the recognized initiator of the Eurasian Union? Wasn't he in the 94th put forward the idea of ​​Eurasian integration?
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Alexander
      Alexander 12 May 2013 09: 37 New
      30
      1. Kazakhstan is the latest republic to secede from the USSR;
      2. Kazakhstan is the last state to leave the ruble zone (Of course. Such inflation was in those days).
      1. GELEZNII_KAPUT
        GELEZNII_KAPUT 12 May 2013 09: 53 New
        +8
        Yes, everything will be fine, of course, such things do not go painlessly, each of our three countries has its own strengths and weaknesses, everything will settle down with time, each will occupy its own niche!
      2. kuz363
        kuz363 10 July 2017 21: 15 New
        0
        By the way, Kazakhstan also requested in the ruble zone. But Russia, in the person of Shokhin, put forward tough conditions - to transfer to Russia all the gold reserves, only Russia could print rubles and so on. That is, to turn Kazakhstan into an ordinary republic of Russia.
    3. Nick
      Nick 12 May 2013 12: 54 New
      23
      Quote: Gleb
      But what about the fact that Nazarbayev is the recognized initiator of the Eurasian Union? Wasn't he in the 94th put forward the idea of ​​Eurasian integration?

      Nazarbayev is hardly a destroyer of the USSR. As far as I remember, it was he who advocated the preservation of the Union more persistently than all other republican leaders. The author is either "off topic" or disingenuous.
    4. Hleb
      Hleb 12 May 2013 20: 25 New
      0
      interesting moment. here both the customs union and the Victory and a few more points are touched.
      He who does not regret the collapse of the Soviet Union does not have a heart; he who wants to recreate it in its former form has no head
      1. Kolyan
        Kolyan 27 May 2013 12: 09 New
        0
        And so they won without Ukraine, since Ukraine was occupied!
    5. Reasonable, 2,3
      Reasonable, 2,3 13 May 2013 01: 08 New
      +3
      On Nazarbayev (no matter what he is), there is an information attack from the Pentagon. It is necessary to weigh. and immediately write comments.
    6. bnm bnmbm
      bnm bnmbm 18 July 2017 20: 26 New
      0
      Victor Martynyuk campaign agent Ukrainian, or something. But what about the three Slavic presidents without Nazarbayev, having destroyed the Union with their signatures. Fire him, urgently, moreover.
  2. vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 12 May 2013 07: 11 New
    52
    I was born and raised in Kazakhstan, and so during the collapse of the USSR, or rather immediately after, Nazarbayev many times officially approached Yeltsin to create a union, the Eurasian Union. And what is the answer? but nothing Yeltsin stubbornly did not notice these proposals, immediately closed the border, built border crossings. I remember we drove to Krasnoyarsk by car, on the Kazakh side there was a trailer and two border guards, most likely for the sake of formality, they asked where we were going and what we were carrying. On the Russian side there was already a terminal, armed guards 10 people, forced everyone to get out of the car arranged a check, we stood at this crossing for more than an hour. At the same time, Yeltsin persistently persuaded Ukraine, the feeling was that he was ready to kiss his ass, if only to return it. Surely when I sobered up after the Bialowieza agreements, I realized what I had done, it was a shame. That was the policy of Russia and Kazakhstan at that time. By the way, Kazakhstan last came out of the ruble zone, and rather did not go out, it was thrown out by Russia. Now, of course, you can be offended by Nazarbayev, but first you need to see who brought the relationship to such a point.
    1. Canep
      Canep 12 May 2013 07: 42 New
      28
      It is necessary to add here the immigration law of Russia according to which I had to live Russian for five years on the territory of Russia (for what? Without citizenship they won’t take normal work) then pass an exam in Russian (I don’t think there would be a problem). The program was shown on TV: the Russian family moved to Russia, his son was taken into the army in Chechnya, where he earned the star of the hero of Russia, came home, but they still do not give him citizenship. SHAME! They row into the army and do not give citizenship. It would be nice for Russia to think about its policy towards Kazakhstan, and indeed its citizens. Article minus - a one-sided view, Kazakhstan is not obliged to lick Russia's heels.
      1. Hleb
        Hleb 12 May 2013 08: 11 New
        +8
        and also add about the program of resettlement of oralmans. what will be the difference if I return to Kazakhstan to my homeland, where I was born. and the "monogol" who never lived there will return. yes now and they are already breaking them off (I recently observed a funny picture.
        they, at least initially, had legislative assistance in employment, exemption from military service in the manner prescribed by the legislation of the Republic of Kazakhstan, allocation of quotas for admission to secondary vocational and higher professional education organizations, provision of needy places in schools, kindergartens ... various benefits, provision housing, medical assistance, exemption from consular fees for issuing visas to enter the Republic, exemption from certain types of tax, travel and baggage to the place of residence, etc ...
        what will I get? nothing ...
        1. Delink
          Delink 12 May 2013 08: 23 New
          11
          And add 50000 tenge lifting for the Aralmans.
          1. Hleb
            Hleb 12 May 2013 08: 32 New
            +6
            )) at the beginning of the house they provided free of charge, now they paid the mortgage payment on them
        2. Canep
          Canep 12 May 2013 08: 27 New
          +8
          The Mongols often do not know either Kazakh or Russian, it is more likely that they will know Russian, in Mongolia he is taught in schools.
          1. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 06: 01 New
            +5
            All Mongolian oralmans speak the Kazakh language as their native language. Kazakhs in Mongolia live in its westernmost part, which is Kazakh autonomy within Mongolia and is usually governed by Kazakh governors. In Mongolia, the Mongols created all conditions for the Kazakhs to preserve their language and culture. The Kazakhs and Kazakhstan have no claims in this regard to the Mongols. There are frequent cases when the oralmans from Mongolia do not withstand nostalgia for Mongolia and come back. The Mongols are very good towards the Kazakhs, and the Kazakhs respect the Mongols. It is the Russians who can mock the “brotherly Mongolian people”, and for the Kazakhs, the Mongols are really culturally and historically related people, albeit of a different language group and a different religion. And indeed Mongolia in itself is our great Motherland. All our ancestors came from there. Someone a little earlier, some a little later. All artifacts in Mongolia until the 13-14th centuries are exclusively Turkic. The last Kazakh ancestors left there along with Genghis Khan.
            The Russian language in Mongolia sharply narrowed its "living space". Russia itself is to blame for this, which frankly sent Mongolia in three letters in the 90s, however Russia sent all its neighbors under Yeltsin, she had an affair with the West at that time. In addition, the Mongols, who knew most of their Russian language, sobered up by reading the comments of the Russians in any articles about Mongolia. In addition to stupid nationalism, bragging, ernistic phrases and insults, not a single Russian writes anything about Mongolia in the comments. The style is like a carbon copy: “Ahaha, Mongolia has launched a cameliferous cruiser! Uhaha the black-assed ones sent their pianist to Europe for a violin competition))) During rzhaka - the Mongol will see and get out of happiness for the first time at home” and all that. Two years ago, there was one article by a Mongolian journalist, written in brilliant Russian, where she wrote about the disappointment of the Mongols in modern Russians who have rolled into cave nationalism and illiteracy, and asked the Russians in their article to no longer mention Mongolia in Russian news in general. As if there is no longer Mongolia. Like, it’s better to consider that we do not exist than to practice toilet wit in your comments. In short, the Mongols reasonably decided to turn their backs on the Russian, who already has an ass for them. But the Kremlin recalls Mongolia only when it wants to cheaply pick up a thread on a deposit there. Doesn't roll already. The Mongols are already working with Japan, the USA, and Britain. It doesn’t come to mind to insult and insult them. Mongols cram English, not Russian. But the Russians never realize that their Internet stupidities will ensure that even the Bashkirs and Yakuts follow the Mongolian example. Not like the Central Asians or Caucasians. And then Russia will roll back to the borders of the Golden Ring. The Mongols in the most difficult time were loyal allies for the Red Army in 1941-1945. And they do not understand the squeals of some in the style of "Russia has only two allies - the army and navy!"
            1. DmitriRazumov
              DmitriRazumov 23 May 2013 13: 27 New
              +2
              Quote: Marek Rozny
              All artifacts in Mongolia until the 13-14th centuries are exclusively Turkic. The last Kazakh ancestors left there along with Genghis Khan.

              Please explain with what side the great Mughals became Turks.

              Quote: Marek Rozny
              Russia itself is to blame for this, which frankly sent Mongolia in three letters in the 90s, however Russia sent all its neighbors under Yeltsin, she had an affair with the West at that time.

              Here I agree, EBN was the main destroyer of the USSR and was wildly afraid of its revival, fearing to be responsible for its own crimes.

              Quote: Marek Rozny
              In addition to stupid nationalism, bragging, ernistic phrases and insults, not a single Russian writes anything about Mongolia in the comments.

              It seems to me that you attach too much importance to the Internet posts of some not quite educated people. State policy, thank God, is not based on the opinion of some not-so-literate users of the network. own complexes are implemented in a similar way.
              Quote: Marek Rozny
              The Mongols in the most difficult time were loyal allies for the Red Army in 1941-1945.

              No one denies this.

              Quote: Marek Rozny
              squeals of some in the style of "Russia has only two allies - the army and navy!".

              Judging by Nazarbayev’s statements in Turkey and the position of the Kazakh government on Baikonur and on Russian policy, this is not far from the truth.
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 14: 41 New
                +5
                Quote: DmitriRazumov
                Judging by Nazarbayev’s statements in Turkey and the position of the Kazakh government on Baikonur and on policy towards Russians ...

                1) Nazarbayev called Kazakhstan a tsarist colony. But did Soviet textbooks write differently in Soviet times? Those who taught the history of the Kazakh SSR should remember the wording - “the colonial policy of tsarism”, “exploitation of the Kazakh people”, etc. And this was written in the Soviet textbooks of the Ministry of Education! At the same time, Kazakhs do not detract from the merits of the Soviet government. Regarding specifically the Russian people, neither Kazakh textbooks nor politicians say anything bad. They talk about tsarist politics and the excesses of the first decades of Bolshevism. In Russia they talk about the Bolsheviks only in a positive way? Oh oh
                2) The position of Kazakhstan in relation to Baikonur is as simple as five kopecks - either Russia WORKS there, or if it intends to launch all launches from the Russian cosmodrome, let it give away UNUSED cosmodrome objects so that the Kazakhs themselves conduct their space activities. Until Russia announced that it was planning to transfer all the starts to the territory of Russia, Kazakhstan did not scratch its ears regarding participation in Baikonur activities. And now our task is to prevent the death of the city of Baikonur, in which the Kazakhstanis live, and not just the employees of the Russian Space Agency. Nobody expels Russia from Baikonur! On the contrary, the Kazakh government beats a panic in connection with the plans of Roscosmos to leave there. No need to turn everything around. Kazakhs will not watch how a unique object created by the efforts of the entire Soviet people is rusting.
                1. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 14: 45 New
                  +2
                  3) About the policy towards Russians - here on the website the Russians living in KZ themselves say - "there are no manifestations of nationalism in Kazakhstan!" Some Russians have discomfort associated with the fact that the Kazakh language is increasingly taking its place state language, they can scold corruption and officials who are most often Kazakhs, they can scold Kazakhs for traditional Kazakh vices (craving for idle rest, lack of punctuality, bragging, etc.), but such that someone infringes on the nat. or religion. sign - no such thing. Neither in state policy, nor in everyday life. Although it seems to someone nationalism that Leninogorsk was renamed Ridder (in honor of the German founder of the city) or that someone wanted to rename Pavlodar to Kereka (in honor of the Russian founder of the city of Koryakov). Yes, in Kazakhstan they wiped the communist names, replacing them with Kazakh ones. But how many objects were renamed in Russia over the past 20 years - Leningrad, Kalinin, Kuibyshev, etc.? And how many Finnish, Turkic, German names have been erased in Russia over the entire 20th century? Thousands! Yes, Shevchenko was renamed to Aktau, Tselinograd to Akmola / Astana, Panfilov to Zharkent, but the area where Shevchenko stands was always called Aktau Kazakhs, Zharkent was always Zharkent, and Tselinograd was called Akmola / Akmolinsk before Khrushchev. We even have the city of Dzhambul received the historical name Taraz. Wow, which Kazakh nationalists are merciless, they did not spare even their beloved poet. And in Astana, “Kazakh nationalists” renamed Abay Street into Kubrin Street in honor of the Russian pre-revolutionary activist Akmolinsk. And streets appeared in honor of Radostovets, Yanushkevich, Potanin, Gumilyov and many other Slavs who are related to Kazakhstan and whom the Kazakhs are proud of without exaggeration. Why should our streets bear the names of communist leaders and others who most often had nothing to do with our history? We have enough of our Russians to be perpetuated. Do monuments to Pushkin, Sholokhov and Lermontov are erected in Ukraine? And "Kazakh nationalists" in their cities regularly erect monuments to them instead of monuments to Lenin.
                  1. Marek Rozny
                    Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 14: 47 New
                    +2
                    quote = DmitriRazumov] Please explain how side the great Mughals became Türks. [/ quote]
                    To do this, you need to understand the tribal system of the Türks and the Mongols, then you will see that Genghis Khan on the koshma was raised not just by some “Mongols”, but by specific clans, which are an integral part of the Kazakh people, and not the Mongol or Tatar. All births that were in the 13th century are still alive and healthy. Wake up a drunken Kazakh or a Mongol at night, he will tell you a kind of story from the ages back. It will be interpreted or embellished in some places, but on the whole it’s absolutely accurate, when compared later with medieval chronicles (Mongolian, Turkic, Chinese, Arabic, Persian). There was not a single representative of the Khalkha-Mongolian clan during the raising of Temirshin (Temujin in Chinese transcription) on a white nightmare. All these genera are part of the modern Middle Zhuz of Kazakhs. And these pseudo-Khalkha-Mongols, for example, there are only Kazakh Naimans more than all the Mongols in Mongolia.
                    There were no Mongols in our steppes. In the Kazakh language, Tuev Hucha of Arabisms, Iranisms, and now words from Slavic, Germanic languages, but there is not a single Mongolism ... Yes, and in Russian, the Horde left exclusively Turkisms, not Mongolisms. The genus from which Genghis Khan originates is part of the Kazakhs, the genus of his mother is part of the Kazakhs. The Mongols do not have Genghisides, and the Kazakhs are a rather large part of society, even in modern realities (although they are not involved in politics). Not a single Mongolian clan — Hoshiuts, Torgauts, and other halkhs — participated in the Western campaigns. Only those genera that are the basis of modern Kazakhs are recorded - Naiman, Kerei, Jalayyr, Argyns, Kipchaks and others. In the mausoleum of Jochi Khan, all the rulers of the ulus clans left the imprints of their tamg seals. These are Kazakh tamgas, and not a single Mongolian one (each genus still has its own sign). Mongols in the 13th century lived in what is now China (Inner Mongolia). And today there are more of them than in Mongolia itself. And in the present "Mongolian" steppes lived the Türks. And all the artifacts that Soviet and Mongolian archaeologists unearthed there are exclusively Turkic, not Mongolian. Khalkha populated this land when the last Turkic clans (Naimans, Kereis, Jalayirs, Kiyats, etc.) came out from there. The word Mongol is not the self-name of the Khalkha. This is a national name that the Turks always gave to themselves during the periods of the construction of new empires. Literally and literally, this word “Mynkol” (sounds with the Kazakh sounds as “MNGOL”) in Kazakh means “Thousand troops” (“count” - “arm” in the military terminology of the Türks means “army”, for example, “count - Bosch "-" commander "," the one who controls the army ").
                    1. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 14: 48 New
                      +3
                      Quote: DmitriRazumov
                      It seems to me that you attach too much importance to the Internet posts of some not quite educated people.

                      this was enough for the Mongols to turn away. And in my opinion, here every Kazakh already aloud wrote about his disappointment in Russian Russia, because every day on this website alone dozens of insulting posts fall under the address of the Kazakhs and Kazakhstan, which simply fall under the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan. At the end of the 80s, Solzhenitsyn’s only book, “How do we equip Russia,” inspired the Russians with the idea that Kazakhstan illegally owns its lands and is still hacking. In the 90s, the Russian media within the framework of the platform for populist statements during the elections formed the image of Kazakhstan, in which "they cut the Russians out." Which is still often duplicated by some on the Internet.
                      Today, a huge role is played by ... comments by nameless users who create "public opinion". If I, in your opinion, exaggerate the importance of Internet comments, then what about the Pentagon, which allocates billions of dollars to conduct information warfare on the Russian-speaking Internet in the person of “commentators”. They don’t even hide it!
                    2. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 14: 49 New
                      +1
                      Quote: DmitriRazumov
                      It seems to me that you attach too much importance to the Internet posts of some not quite educated people.

                      this was enough for the Mongols to turn away. And in my opinion, here every Kazakh already aloud wrote about his disappointment in Russian Russia, because every day on this website alone dozens of insulting posts fall under the address of the Kazakhs and Kazakhstan, which simply fall under the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan. At the end of the 80s, Solzhenitsyn’s only book, “How do we equip Russia,” inspired the Russians with the idea that Kazakhstan illegally owns its lands and is still hacking. In the 90s, the Russian media within the framework of the platform for populist statements during the elections formed the image of Kazakhstan, in which "they cut the Russians out." Which is still often duplicated by some on the Internet.
                      Today, a huge role is played by ... comments by nameless users who create "public opinion". If I, in your opinion, exaggerate the importance of Internet comments, then what about the Pentagon, which allocates billions of dollars to conduct information warfare on the Russian-speaking Internet in the person of “commentators”. They don’t even hide it!
                    3. DmitriRazumov
                      DmitriRazumov 23 May 2013 22: 18 New
                      0
                      Quote: Marek Rozny
                      To do this, you need to understand the tribal system of the Türks and the Mongols, then you will see that Genghis Khan on the koshma was raised not just by some “Mongols”, but specific clans, which are an integral part of the Kazakh people, and not the Mongol or Tatar ...

                      “If you try to understand the essence of the reasons that push Chinese and Kazakhstani historians to such maneuvers in the process of repelling the seemingly indisputable ancestor from the Mongols, they are extremely clear. Kazakhstan, as a young state, during the years of independence has not filled an ideological niche with anything. Therefore, the figure of Genghis Khan is extremely important, because it can be "laid" in the foundation of the idea of ​​Eurasianism. "

                      Without going into details of the origin of the Turks and Mongols, Kotor. can be found on the Internet pages:
                      According to Nazarbayev and scholars, Kazakhs are Türks.
                      Mongols are not Turks.
                      Consequently, the Kazakhs are neither Mongols nor Genghisides.
                      By your own logic, you can consider, for example, Russian descendants of the Mongols and Genghisides, because the Mongols and numerous Turkic tribes raided Russia, assimilated in Russia, many Tatars (Turks) served the Russian princes, and some of them even became Russian tsars (Boris Godunov, Grand Duke of Tver Semion Bekbulatovich, etc.).
                      In my opinion, the Kazakhs do not need to look for a dubious relationship with the brutal barbarian who. famous only for organizing hordes of young steppe inhabitants in numerous swift and absolutely ruthless armies. The "Empire" created by him did not exist even 200 years, without leaving any inheritance: neither writing, nor original culture.
                      Kazakhs have something to be proud of without Genghis Khan. For example, achievements in economic development, feats during the Second World War, in contrast to the same Crimean Tatars or Chechens, they were not traitors to their homeland and fought on all fronts, showing exceptional courage and heroism.
                      1. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 13: 52 New
                        +4
                        One can, of course, argue about the origin of Genghis Khan himself, spears among scholars and Internet commentators on the part of adherents of the “Mongolian” and “Turkic” versions break hundreds daily. However, regarding the ethnic composition of the army and the state apparatus of Genghis Khan, there are no particular mysteries - 80-90% of the Turks are of specific clans, most of which are now the basis of the Kazakh nation. What should I do if my family voluntarily joined Genghis Khan (having withdrawn from submission to the Khorezmshah) in 1210 (before the start of the war with Khorezmshah Muhammad). Around the same time (a little later), my mother’s clan joined Redbeard. The Turkic clans of the steppe inhabitants willingly and without coercion poured into the army of the then little-known Genghis Khan, who was raised on a koshma by representatives of four clans - Naiman, Kerey, Kiyat, Merkit. All these clans are now Kazakhs, and not Mongols, Tatars or Uzbeks. Moreover, Naiman is generally the largest clan among the Kazakhs (kiyats and merkits merged with other Kazakh clans, and the Kerei is still one of the largest clans among the Kazakhs).
                        Good or bad Genghis Khan - it does not matter for us. it наш. Bad or Good Horde - it doesn't matter, it's is our the state. Stalin did a lot of good and a lot of bad things, and the USSR was both good and bad for its citizens, but that’s all is our. And to renounce one’s own story is pointless. Moreover, unlike the USSR in the Horde, our ancestors generally played a major role in government and in the army.
                        And Genghisides are generally massively preserved only among the Kazakhs. Neither Kalmyks, Buryats, nor Mongols have them. In isolated cases, some Turkic peoples have them, and among the Kazakhs, Genghisides (direct, along the male line) still have a significant mass of people. Even in the Russian army, the Chingizid officers who served were Kazakhs - the intelligence officer Chokan Valikhanov (Shokan Ualihanov), General Gubaidulla Zhangirov, civil administration officials, etc.
                        How will the Kazakh perceive the “Mongol invaders” if he himself is the direct descendant of these “Mongol wars”? In Soviet times, they tried to convince us that the ancestors of the Kazakhs allegedly fought against the "invaders", but there was a discrepancy in the Kazakhs' head - "how is it? Fought with ourselves?" Yes, some cities on the territory of Kazakhstan resisted Genghis Khan, but keep in mind that these were garrisons subordinate to Khorezmshah Muhammad, who swore allegiance to the Shah, and by and large the leaders of these garrisons themselves provoked a military conflict between Genghis Khan and Muhammad (head of Otrar Kaiyr Khan, events 1218-1219 year). The red-bearded only addressed Muhammad with a proposal for an equal military-political alliance, since the main population of both rulers consisted of the same Turkic steppes, which Genghis Khan rested on, proving to Muhammad that by uniting, they would be able to rule the whole world. Genghis Khan, neither before nor after, as an equal, as an ally, has ever addressed any other ruler - for ethnic reasons.
                        This is a big topic of discussion, but we can’t refuse Genghis Khan and the Horde.
                        By the way, for the fact that the Argyns (my kind; the second largest in number among the Kazakhs) were among the first to voluntarily go to Genghis, the Argyns had the right to marry the Genghisides. And they got the best lands in the new territories (including the part of the Crimean lands where Argynsky Beylik was then located; the head of the Argyns there, Tugai Bey, was a military ally of Bogdan Khmelnitsky against the Poles).
                        The "Tatar-Mongolian" horde was neither Tatar (I mean Kazan), nor Mongol. This Horde (Ulug Ulus, more precisely) was created by the ancestors of the Kazakhs, Bashkirs, Nogais, Karakalpaks, Siberian Tatars (whose clan composition is 100% identical to the clan composition of the Kazakhs of the Middle Zhuz).

                        What the Horde left or left behind is a separate big topic.
                2. DmitriRazumov
                  DmitriRazumov 23 May 2013 19: 33 New
                  -2
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  Nazarbayev called Kazakhstan a tsarist colony. But did Soviet textbooks write differently in Soviet times? Who taught the history of the Kazakh SSR should remember the wording - "the colonial policy of tsarism", "exploitation of the Kazakh people", etc.

                  Nazarbayev: “After the last Kazakh khan was killed in 1861, we were a colony of the Russian kingdom, then the Soviet Union. For 150 years, the Kazakhs almost lost their national traditions, customs, language, religion. With the help of the Almighty, in 1991 we proclaimed our independence. Your ancestors, leaving their historical homeland, from the Turkic Kaganate, took the name of the Turkic people with them ”(http://inform.kz/rus/article/2502148: Kazinform, 12.10.2012/19.55/XNUMX. XNUMX)
                  Generally interesting, consider this pearl with t.z. allied relations of the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan on the CSTO (military-political union) and the CU (economic union). One of the closest allies of the Russian Federation travels to the country - a member of NATO (the military bloc, which takes at least an unfriendly position with respect to the Russian Federation, and a maximum aggressive) and blames Russia there. It’s approximately as if Putin went to China and declared there that the Kazakhs are descendants of the Turkic tribes Kotor. often behaved unfriendly towards Russia-Russia, robbed and killed, led civilians into slavery, etc. Therefore, it would be necessary now for the Russian Federation and China to strengthen cooperation, recalling the old friendly ties between China and Russia, China and the USSR.
                  If this is a political maneuver, then some kind of painfully clumsy.
                  1. Marek Rozny
                    Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 14: 20 New
                    +2
                    And why do Kazakhs not have the right to recall their own history? We were a colony of the Russian Empire. Partial colony in the Soviet Union (not in all respects, but still). The Kazakh language and culture were in the pen, there was no education in the Kazakh language (only school and only partially). Rituals were banned (even which were not religious). In industrial terms, Kazakhstan was an exclusively raw materials appendage of the Soviet economy. The standard of living in the Kazakh SSR among the 15 republics was one of the lowest.
                    What is wrong in his speech Nazarbayev? The Kazakhs are still experiencing the consequences of a commodity economy and total Russification, and they will definitely experience a couple of decades.
                    But! The Kazakhs, remembering this, do not at all turn the events of the past into a "stick in the wheel" in our relations. And even more so, we do not blame the Russian people or Russia, namely the tsarist and Bolshevik authorities. It is in Russia that they like to confuse these concepts, and in Kazakhstan these are different concepts - the “Russian people” and “Soviet power”. In the end, Russia is also not silent about the repressions of the 30s, about the famine in the Volga region, about the soulless politics of tsarism, about the excesses of Soviet power in the initial decades. So why do Kazakhs not have the right to talk about it? Moreover, no one throws a stone at the Russian people.

                    By the way, in Russia, historical steppes are already exhibited in a filthy light. Kazakhs are not particularly indignant, although they understand that we are talking about our direct ancestors. Well, they don’t get into the details of conversations between Slavic presidents either. Embrace of Russia with the Bulgarians or Serbs in our country is not called a betrayal in the direction of Kazakhstan. And in Russia, straightforward tantrum happens when the Turks talk about their kinship.
                    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 25 May 2013 15: 11 New
                      -7
                      Quote: Marek Rozny
                      The Kazakh language and culture were in the pen, there was no education in the Kazakh language (only school and only partially)

                      I wonder why it is so impudent and shameless to lie? !!!
                      1. Yarbay
                        Yarbay 25 May 2013 15: 16 New
                        +6
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        I wonder why it is so impudent and shameless to lie? !!!

                        Vladimir, who enrolled in higher education institutions in the republics in groups in their native language?
                        Those who knew that they couldn’t go anywhere further than their village and the ceiling on which moet was counted was agran on the collective farm !!
                        Let's be honest, a person who did not study in Russian had no prospects !!
                      2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 May 2013 15: 43 New
                        +1
                        my opponent said that there was NO education in the Kazakh language, that the culture was in the pen, I argue that this is a blatant FALSE.
                      3. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 17: 47 New
                        +1
                        Vladimir, tired of his foolishness. By 1991, the Soviet government did not bother to create a single faculty in the Kazakh language (except for some faculties of ZhenPI (women's pedagogical institute), where teachers were trained for aul schools). The number of secondary schools was constantly decreasing (despite the non-percentage increase in the number of Kazakhs). You, a “refugee”, should know that before Gorbachev’s perestroika, there was only ONE school with the Kazakh language of instruction in the one and a half million Alma-Ata. The second Kazakh school appeared in the late 80s just before the collapse of the USSR.
                        In many “Russian” schools there was a banal shortage of teachers of the Kazakh language, in connection with which the number of lessons was either less than the curriculum or not taught at all (and in the villages because of the lack of teachers foreign languages ​​were not taught, although in the certificate they then set everyone "five").
                        The history of Kazakhstan consisted of a thin book the size of a notebook from which the student could learn little about the history of his own republic. In the textbook of the history of the USSR, in general, the history of Kazakhstan and Central Asia, 2-3 pages were allotted, and then they mostly described the horrors of the tsarist regime and nishtyaks from the Soviet government and the Russian people in particular.
                        No national holidays were allowed. Even Nauryz (a non-religious holiday) was even banned. Although the Russians celebrated Maslenitsa at the same time, they did not hesitate to show it on the central television in the program “Play, accordion”.
                        It was problematic to buy children's books in the Kazakh language (and indeed literature in the Kazakh language). An exception is the works of "ideologically" correct authors of the Writers' Union of Kazakhstan. Finding Jules Verne in Kazakh was a futile exercise. And even Kazakh fairy tales you could find most often in Russian.
                        The specialized vocabulary of the Kazakh language did not develop at all.
                      4. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 17: 49 New
                        +4
                        The whole Kazakh culture was reduced to aitys on the theme of the harvest and one dance "Kamazhay". Something similar to pop music appeared only in the 70s in the person of Dos Mukasan. It was a fresh wind for the Kazakhs! And until 1991, in addition to them and Rymbaeva, practically no one was allowed to enter the normal stage (Dnishev, Tulegenova and Baglanova were opera singers, moreover, Baglanova and Tulegenova generally began their activity in the 40-50s and were of little interest to young people).
                        In most cities of the Kazakh SSR there were no Kazakh theaters, but Russian theaters were everywhere. 99% of the streets were named in Russian or in honor of Russian + foreign communists. Moreover, in many cities there was not at least one “Kazakh” street. For example, in Rudny (Kostanay region), the first streets with Kazakh names appeared in the 2000s.
                        In a word, Vova, to speak about the fact that Kazakh SSR had education in the Kazakh language, the Kazakh culture "flourished" only by a person who has no idea about it. And it was just like you that spread all Kazakhs in the bud, calling it all “nationalism”, and therefore all Russian officials from the Kazakh SSR draped in 1991, because there was a snout in the lint and those who had blood on their hands (especially for "1986 "). By the way, in our 86th year, you also hid behind the BTRs against Kazakhs? Wow, how much hatred you have for Kazakhs for soiled pants in December of that year)))) You have a long track record of "fighting Kazakh nationalism";) And therefore NO ONE Kazakh on the site can’t say anything good about you. If you couldn’t even get respect from the Kazakhs here, then how did the Kazakhs contemptuously look at you when you got there?
                      5. The comment was deleted.
                      6. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 18: 32 New
                        +2
                        Eka, you thought over Vovochka))))
                        1) There were separate groups. But: a) not at all faculties and not at all universities; b) a separate group and a faculty are not the same thing; c) the bulk of the textbooks were ... in Russian. The fact that in the 70s they introduced separate "Kazakh" groups is a formality for a tick. We taught them in Russian, because Kazakh literary specialized was not actually. You, refugees, all this time expose this fact as the “inferiority” of the Kazakh language)))) Like, the Kazakhs do not have a scientific technical language, and now you are trying to prove that this is not so))))))) Logic is zero, conscience too.
                        2) I lived in Orenburg - a stone's throw from Kazakhstan, if you have problems with geography. Secondly, unlike the "refugees" who abandoned their parents in Kazakhstan, we spent several months in Kazakhstan with our relatives, the benefit of our relatives lives in all regions of Kazakhstan. Thirdly, unlike you, I am deeply engaged in the history of my native country, therefore, in addition to my personal opinion, I can rely on evidence and documents, and not get sick like you about “secret documents”.
                        3) About books - my parents and I tried to buy ANY book for our age in Kazakh. But you are unlikely in your life trying to buy a book in the Kazakh language - so do not tryndi. And don’t worry - today there are much more children's books in Kazakh than in Soviet times.
                        4)
                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        fill up unfinished

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        tinker

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        sheep aul

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        udot

                        Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                        moron

                        wow, how nature got out of you)))) as required to prove)))
                      7. Vasilenko Vladimir
                        Vasilenko Vladimir 25 May 2013 19: 17 New
                        -5
                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        1) There were separate groups. But: a) not at all faculties and not at all universities; b) a separate group and a faculty are not the same thing;

                        Marek, you really are a ram, there could be a physics department in KazGU, chemical, biological, not Kazakh or Russian and these faculties had groups teaching in Kazakh and Russian, you can highlight my epithets in your address, you can minus it, but you really .
                        you forget that it’s not at the party meeting or political information, you are carrying out a blizzard without even understanding what you’re talking about, then you are comparing average real estate prices with real ones, then you are talking about some Kazakh faculties.
                        you didn’t have enough culture, so all your national dance costumes were developed and invented in Soviet times, call me at least one Kazakh composer of the 19th century, at least one writer with an international name
                      8. The comment was deleted.
                      9. The comment was deleted.
                      10. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 26 May 2013 08: 12 New
                        +2
                        1) Faculties can be of different directions, but should have been Kazakh. These are not Kazakh groups that should have been (of which there actually weren’t any), but faculties and universities. You all understand, you just don’t want to recognize elementary things. And recognize that EDUCATION IN KAZAKH LANGUAGE WASN’T.
                        2) I have never sat at a party meeting. And I’m not even going to join NurOtan. Calm down, Vovochka.
                        3) About real estate - you sat in a puddle, but again raise this topic. Although I understand that this is an attempt to move away from the topic of education and culture in the Kazakh SSR))))
                        4) Thank you for the Kazakh clothes, and before the Soviet regime we went naked)))))))))) Or, probably, in Russian folk clothes) And about the dances - yes, you're right. Kazakhs did not dance much. We are not Uyghurs, we love to sing and fight, and dancing is not ours. Instead of our culture and customs, they slipped us dances uncharacteristic of our nation.
                        5) You do not understand Kazakh culture so much that you don’t know a single composer? Well, you generally ... Kurmangazy, Abay, Zhayau Musa, Dauletkerei, Asan Kaygy, etc. They wrote music for Kazakh instruments, and not for piano. But Bach and Mozart did not write music for kobyz, dombra and zhetygen. Each nation has its own tools.
                        And about writers with an international name - I don’t know your native Ukrainian writers with an international name))) Gogol doesn’t count, they don’t know him abroad (he was personally convinced more than once), and he wrote not in Ukrainian) Ah, yes ... you're like "Russian"))) Sorry, I completely forgot that you refused your Ukrainian roots.
                        6) You can continue to swear at me, I only have a smile from your scolding))) If a smart person insulted me, I would really worry, and so ... What to take from a "professional fighter against Kazakh nationalism" since 1986 ?))) Just help what medical laughing
          2. Alibekulu
            Alibekulu 25 May 2013 15: 24 New
            +5
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            I wonder why it is so impudent and shameless to lie? !!!

            From the book of Kheifets M. R. Selected: in 3 vol.
            T. 2: Journey from Dubrovlag to Ermak, 1979-1987. - 227 sec. : 6 l. silt
            Head Why Ermak?
            According to legend, the city is based on the place where the famous conqueror of Siberia, ataman Yermak, drowned in the Irtysh river when trying to escape from the enemies surrounding him. The Russians believe that he was pulled to the bottom by chain mail with silver eagles on his shoulders, donated by Yermak Ivan the Terrible. The Kazakh legend that I first heard in the city was this: Ermak raped a local girl and was sleeping, stabbed to death by the avenger - her father. But both of them agree that Yermak died somewhere here, and the Voskresenskaya marina arose, after the revolution renamed the district center Kaganovich, and under Khrushchev - the city of Yermak.
            Then I remember I was struck that mainly Slavs live in it, and Kazakhs - and throughout Kazakhstan too - are a minority, and not too large (in my years - about a third of the population of the republic). It was impossible not to notice: all the bosses on whom my fate depended are not Kazakhs: head of the city party committee Malyshkin, head of the district committee - Sychuk. How did this happen?
            Subsequently, he found out that when the republic was founded (in the 20 and 30 years, the process of its creation lasted in several stages), the Kazakhs made up the majority of the population. A lot of them died out during the era of famine associated with collectivization (a certain analogue of the Ukrainian "famine"), but even by the beginning of the war (1941), the Kazakhs still accounted for half the population of the republic. Where did today's “Twelve Languages” come from, pushing the Kazakhs to second roles?
            Perhaps these are the descendants of the exiles? What scale was reached by the power of zechovy streams that the percentage of local Muslim, that is, traditionally large families, fell in the republic 2-3 times (in different years)! I had more than a million people in Kazakhstan with the so-called “settlers” in Kazakhstan ... And how many residents left the former Steplag (Solzhenitsyn was serving his sentence and exile in Kazakhstan, too. However, for the sake of objectivity I will add: before him - Dostoevsky).
            Is it fair to call the Kazakh Republic Exile-Kazakh ?..

            PSURL: http://www.sakharov-center.ru/asfcd/auth/auth_pages508d-2.html?Key=16345&page=10

            9
          3. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 25 May 2013 15: 45 New
            -3
            in elderberry garden
            you will also argue about the lack of national culture and art, the lack of education in Kazakh? !!!
        3. Duisenbay Bankankulov
          Duisenbay Bankankulov 14 May 2017 19: 09 New
          0
          Vladimir can you remember 1986, when the hunchback appointed Kolbin to the post of first secretary of the CPSU of Kazakhstan, or is this also a myth ???
  3. DmitriRazumov
    DmitriRazumov 23 May 2013 19: 45 New
    -5
    Quote: Marek Rozny
    Kazakhstan’s position with regard to Baikonur is as simple as five kopecks - either Russia WORKS there, or if it intends to launch all the launches from the Russian cosmodrome, let it give back the UNUSED

    Too simple, to say the least. There is such a good proverb: "Simplicity is worse than theft." It should be recalled that Kazakhstan unilaterally privatized Baikonur in 1991, despite the persuasion of the Russian leadership and the command of the air forces. After that, the property of military units was subjected to predatory looting by the local population. At the request of the RK, the Russian Federation leased the spaceport for 50 years, and the aerospace forces continued to work at the spaceport, saving the property and equipment they needed. remained after privatization. If it weren’t for the Russian Federation, then the picture could have been like in Ukraine, where Kravchuk declared an independent space power and privatized 3 NPCs and a training ground in Yevpatoriya. Through the short. time, the equipment turned into scrap metal, and military units who took the oath to Ukraine were dismissed.
    In December 2012, Astana’s launch plan from Baikonur outraged the Russian side. So, the number of starts of the Proton launch vehicle agreed by Kazakhstan was reduced from 14 to 12, there were other restrictions. The Russian Federation responded by announcing the possibility of terminating cooperation on all joint space projects. “Russia considers this decision as the desire of the Kazakh side to circumvent the terms of the Baikonur complex lease, namely the obligation“ not to directly or indirectly prevent the tenant from using the Baikonur complex for its intended purpose ”, follows from the document.
    “In this situation, Russia will be forced to reconsider its position on the advisability of continuing bilateral cooperation on joint projects, including the Dnepr program, the Baiterek joint project, taking into account plans for its transfer to the Zenit launch vehicle and a number of others” - says the text of the note.
    In Roskosmos dissatisfied with the actions of Kazakhstan. “The limitation in 2013 of the number of launches of spacecraft by Proton-M rockets will not allow fulfilling contractual obligations under five commercial programs, which in turn will lead to the termination of international contracts and the need to return customers up to $ 500 million,” the department explained.
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 14: 46 New
      +4
      1)
      Quote: DmitriRazumov
      Kazakhstan unilaterally privatized Baikonur in 1991

      Sorry, but BAM Russia "has not unilaterally privatized"? What is left on whose territory, then each country and passed into ownership.
      2) The property was not plundered by the local population, which did not have access to the property of military units, but by the officers and ensigns themselves, who then moved to Russia. Read the memoirs of those who served in those years at Baikonur (as well as at other sites, for example, Darial-U). There it is colorfully described how the servicemen of the Russian army robbed absolutely everything that reached out to hands. And this is written by Russian officers themselves. If something the local population could snatch during this chaos, then it’s only a trifle and only with the permission of the local Russian military command (most often the usual barter of those years is a shepherd to a military vodaru, officers to a shepherd of OZK or a color).
      3) The rental of Baikonur was not needed ONLY by Kazakhstan. You might think then, Russia could safely do without this spaceport. Both parties urgently needed such a format of relations. Kazakhs themselves then would not have pulled Baikonur, because there was no money, no specialists, and Russia without Baikonur would simply cease to be a space power. And if Kazakhstan would not have lost anything from the death of Baikonur (then there were not even ordinary Kazakh residents there), then for Russia the loss of Baikonur would be a disaster on a national scale. So there is no need to be afraid of the Ukrainian example. FIG would be able to Russia in the 90s to build a new spaceport. In the meantime, it would have built, the space industry would have been ruined for sure.
      4) The Kazakhs only in December 2012 showed their leverage over Roscosmos, when it became finally clear that Roscosmos was going to dump from Baikonur (at the same time, essno, renting an unused Baikonur for 50 years). It was necessary to somehow sober up Russian space officials who aimed at the “dog in the manger” policy. Indeed, it was not in December 2012 that Russia began to build a new cosmodrome, and not in December 2012, Russia decided to transfer almost all launches from the new cosmodrome. Kazakhstan’s actions are a response to Russia's actions. What good is Kazakhstan from dead Baikonur (both the spaceport and the city, which is already inhabited by Kazakhstanis)?
      5) Regarding the scarecrow statement about the “revision” of cooperation on the launch vehicle, the Kazakhs are already tired of demanding that Roskosmos fulfill its obligations. The rocket had to fly in space for a long time, the money was paid to Roscosmos in full, as was agreed in the contract ten years ago. But still no money, no rockets. And here we are still scared that they will stop "cooperation"! Absolutely all space projects with Russia turned out to be fraud and scam. The Accounts Committee of Kazakhstan is forced to admit that all the money of the Kazakhs went into the void, without bringing any benefit to the Kazakhs. And at the same time, Kazakhstan did not make hysteria, but suggested that only Russians take a more responsible approach to the following joint projects.
  • kuz363
    kuz363 10 July 2017 21: 22 New
    0
    “All Mongolian oralmans speak Kazakh as their native language.” What is meant by this? If they are just spoken, they know it. But can they read and write correctly in Kazakh? Very doubtful. I worked for an oil company and periodically we had production certifications. So I can say that many local Kazakhs, especially in rural areas, could not read and write in Kazakh, although they knew the everyday language. How to consider whether they were literate or not?
  • Aliko
    Aliko 10 May 2017 20: 36 New
    +1
    These are Kazakhs, not Mongols, Oralmans know Kazakh better than some Kazakhs in Kazakhstan, according to the Bayan Ulgian aimak of Mongolia, only Kazakhs
  • Alibekulu
    Alibekulu 12 May 2013 14: 47 New
    +7
    Quote: Gleb
    and to the homeland where I was born. and the "monogol" who never lived there will return.

    As for the program of resettlement of compatriots ("oralmans") to Kazakhstan - this is absolutely the right idea. The only problem is its execution. I think you would be delighted if a similar program was in the Russian Federation. So don’t ..
    Try looking at the return program from a different perspective.
    Imagine, simulate such a situation: “You and your younger brother and sister were in an orphanage. When you left the orphanage, you could find a good well-paid job, buy an apartment, start a normal family ..
    So, you would leave your little brother and sister in the orphanage, knowing what kind of order there .. and how they live there .. what Or would they, like a normal, responsible big brother, take them to him ??! request
    The answer, I think, is unambiguous ..
    So Kazakhstan is doing what any normal state should do. good
    1. Hleb
      Hleb 12 May 2013 15: 18 New
      +1
      So don’t ..
      what? I can speak any language. It’s possible not to conspire. There would be a program in Russia, but I would not mind.
      I’m Russian going and the ethnic Kazakh reception is different. Let there be brothers, but then there’s no need to talk about equality. There’s selection on a national basis. Kazakhstan doesn’t need people! Kazakhs are needed. To these oralmans from Mongolia, for example, local treat like natural mongols
      where are the Kazakhs and Russian brothers forever, but somewhere not? What kind of Mongol is a brother, and the Russian who lived in the same country as the Kazakh is not?
      1. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 12 May 2013 15: 51 New
        +2
        The logic is reinforced concrete good
        Now the Russians are moving from Kazakhstan to the Russian Federation. In Russia, a resettlement program has been adopted so I shout that:
        selection on a national basis.
        ??
        And at the expense of a national sign - they gave apartments, and now there is financial assistance - to returnees, who, due to historical reasons, ended up abroad.
        Russian living in the same country as Kazakh?

        I, a Kazakh, have lived my entire conscious life in Kazastan - I have not given and have not given anyone an apartment. I would not refuse. But, it never occurred to me to blame anyone for this ...
        1. Hleb
          Hleb 12 May 2013 16: 04 New
          -1
          was that the answer?
          repeat again? selection is on the basis of a national sign. Russian will come to Russia and a person of a different nationality will arrive — there will be no difference, as in Kazakhstan.
          and about what suits you, that the local population does not have water and villages, and the oralmans are building modern villages, so you can continue to remain silent. And now they are given. The truth was made to pay for them. Earlier there was a halava.
          1. Alibekulu
            Alibekulu 12 May 2013 17: 04 New
            +3
            Quote: Gleb
            repeat again? selection is on the basis of a national sign. Russian will come to Russia and a person of a different nationality will arrive — there will be no difference, as in Kazakhstan.

            You tell this to Tajiks, Uzbeks and Kyrgyz ... otherwise they don’t know about it ..
            By the way, you don’t know anyone in Rasea who calls them “chocks” and “chukmeks” ?! repeat
            the local population has no water in villages and apartments

            Auls ?! Do you have water and apartments in all villages ??
            Our issue of water supply is being systematically solved .. apartments in the village (at least in our village it makes no sense, they will leave and will leave ..)
            and the oralmans are building modern villages, so you can continue to be silent.
            Why be silent ?! I will brag about this, including to the scattered people .. I am glad for them (compatriots) and proud that our state is doing this and has the opportunity to do so ..
            What I can agree with you is that the mechanism for helping them is not well developed .. Often they, in connection with this, form dependent moods, which is not gut .. negative
            In this, I fully agree with you good
            And on the situation with the Oralmans, you do not see the full picture .. accordingly, you are not drawing the very correct conclusions ..
            Later, if interested, I’ll try to explain .. Now the Internet is stupid crying
            Although in the example with the orphanage, I’m practically on my fingers - I explained everything ...
            1. Hleb
              Hleb 12 May 2013 21: 19 New
              -2
              You tell this to Tajiks, Uzbeks and Kyrgyz ... otherwise they don’t know about it
              give examples when a Tajik or an Uzbek who has arrived and lives legally is infringed on something?
              By the way, you don’t know anyone in Rasea who calls them “chocks” and “chukmeks” ?!
              I know. \\\\\\\ and in the same way they are called in Kakhakhstan.
              Our issue with water supply is systematically resolved
              I don’t need to hang out. I travel regularly and know the situation. No one needs a village. Tell someone who knows about Kazakhstan on the map.
              Do you have water and apartments in all villages ??
              what state are we talking about? don't change your shoes. there are topics about Russia and there we all talk about problems
              Why be silent ?! I will brag about it, including to the scattered
              don't need these scornful
              scattered
              in the eyes and I can call a mambet.
              but about the pride that local people who are hunchbacked for the country and don’t have enough housing or even water, unlike the visiting “Mongols,” I won’t say anything. I would say to my eyes. Here they don’t understand
              1. Alibekulu
                Alibekulu 13 May 2013 08: 12 New
                +1
                scattered
                Quote: Gleb
                in the eyes and I can call a mambet.


                "Scatter my you scatter
                From the Volga to the Yenisei
                "

                Lyrics for Lyube

                Write to Rastorguev ... take heart ...


                The word "Scattered"invented, if I’m not mistaken, Yeltsin BN Yes, if that’s the 1st President of Russia (not some mambet ..)
                Quote: Gleb
                in the eyes and I can call a mambet.
                This is all of you - it costs nothing to offend a person of a different nationality .. at the same time, you are sincerely outraged that I use an idiom that is widely used in modern Russian ...
                By the way, you as a person living in Kazakhstan should know that Kazakhstan and Kazakhs are written a little differently .. Kazakhstan and Kazakhstan.. Some of the Kazakhs were indignant about this request What can about the stress in the word will breed discussions ??
                On other issues, unsubscribe later, now is not enough time ..
        2. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 16: 39 New
          -1
          Quote: Alibekulu
          Now the Russians are moving from Kazakhstan to the Russian Federation. In Russia, a resettlement program has been adopted so I shout that: selection is on a national basis.
        3. V. Ushakov
          V. Ushakov 13 May 2013 05: 04 New
          0
          Do not give an apartment? Do not worry - you will soon receive - an apartment or even the house of an internally displaced person, whom you yourself will drive out. On a national basis ... This is how the distribution of posts in modern Kazakhstan. This is not a state where career growth is "under the nationality" - a banal eastern satrapy or - a khanate. And the Russians are fleeing from there because of the lack of prospects of business and administrative growth and - because of the very possible physical repressions on the part of both individual "citizens" and the khanate as such. Clear as a day. They will leave, you will recruit the Turks and the Chinese, who will eat you up over time, if, again, Russia does not stop.
      2. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 05: 34 New
        +1
        Quote: Gleb
        where are the Kazakhs and Russian brothers forever, but somewhere not? What kind of Mongol is a brother, and the Russian who lived in the same country as the Kazakh is not?

        you, my friend, what are you worried about? that the Kazakhs did not want to pay mother aid to the Russian, who draped out of KZ in the 90s, and at the same time Kazakhstan and the Kazakhs (most often), whined in Russia about how they “infringed” him here, demanded status from the Russian government "forced migrant", and now this same Vasya Pupkin is knocking on the door of the consulate of Kazakhstan and shaking rights on equal conditions for moving to Kazakhstan along with a Kazakh who turned out to be outside of Kazakhstan of his own free will ??? You either put on your underpants or remove the cross. Either there was no need to get out of here, or return without showing off and demanding a red carpet at the station.
        And they don’t give out huts to local Kazakhstanis, which are Russian, that Kazakhs. Do not expose the situation that Kazakhs in the KZ are given gingerbread cookies, and Russians are given a shish with butter.
  • Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 05: 26 New
    0
    Germany is pulling the Germans, Israel is the Jews, Kazakhstan is collecting Kazakhs (every fourth Kazakh lives outside of Kazakhstan - as historically happened - mainly in Russia, Mongolia, China and Uzbekistan, plus Iran, Turkey, Kyrgyzstan).
    In the 90s, Russians were dribbling from Kazakhstan. They didn’t leave, they didn’t emigrate, but they were draping themselves around, causing panic and hysteria over themselves and those who remained: "There will be f_pa and massacre!" As a result, the Russian diaspora in Kazakhstan has strengthened financially and has already distinguished itself by its contribution to the construction of independent Kazakhstan as athletes, scientists, businessmen, politicians, etc., and the "refugees" did not give Russia anything. Not a single high-profile surname in any field of activity. At all. Here, willy-nilly, you will start to think - either this useless “foam” was blown away from Kazakhstan, leaving only the best Russians in the KZ, or the border between our countries is magical and paralyzes all the energy from the crossing person laughing
    However, for those who want to return to KZ for permanent residence, there is a pleasant thing - they do not need to have financial confirmation for each family member, as it is supposed to by "left" immigrants. A person who is not an ethnic Kazakh, who was not born in the territory of the KZ, did not live here - must have 10 thousand dollars for each member of the family in the bank account. Former Kazakhstanis can obtain Kazakh citizenship without these barriers. True, many still do not receive citizenship if it turns out that they foolishly took shape in Russia in the 90s as "refugees" or "forced migrants." Russians merge this information to the Kazakhs, and ours prescribe a “stop” to these “refugees” twice. Although you can get a residence permit. About 20 thousand people move from Russia to Kazakhstan annually for permanent residence (according to Russia). The vast majority are ex-Kazakhstanis. Plus, tens of thousands receive a residence permit, remaining formally citizens of Russia and not going to change their citizenship just in case.

    Z.Y. The mentioned support mechanism for oralmans is temporarily "turned off". The country needs to digest the oralmans who arrived over these 20 years (a little less than a million people).
  • Hleb
    Hleb 12 May 2013 07: 54 New
    +4
    forced everyone to get out of the car arranged a check, we stood at this passage for more than an hour
    You have not stood for a long time and what bothers you in this? Believe me, I know how many drugs are transported across the border and how many Asians (Uzbeks, Tajiks, Kyrgyzs) cross the border, in transit through Kazakhstan.
    1. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 12 May 2013 11: 02 New
      +6
      You somehow did not read the comment very carefully, I wrote that it was in 92-93. The union has just collapsed. and then no one was driving anywhere, and drugs are still being transported in tons, but for some reason, at the border, they are forced to dump all of the bags of ordinary passengers. In fairness, Kazakh border guards are now more amused by this.
      1. Hleb
        Hleb 12 May 2013 12: 32 New
        +4
        I don’t understand what changes the year? Do you not like that border control was carried out and is ongoing to ensure the country's security? Is there a constitution, there is a border policy, and if there was a post and border guards fulfilled their duties, this does not mean that they should not check you. it or not. I generally doubt that you could be inspected at 93, and even more so at 92 at some post
        By the way, they don’t force everyone to dump it. More than that. They don’t even need to present things for inspection for no reason.
        1. vladsolo56
          vladsolo56 12 May 2013 14: 39 New
          0
          My wife went there a month ago, my mother arrived three days ago, so they check and how. My wife was forced to dump the whole bag. But as I already wrote it was the Kazakh border guards. I never write what I don't know
          1. Hleb
            Hleb 12 May 2013 15: 10 New
            +2
            Well, I don’t know, maybe the regime depends on a specific post. Where there are already drug detection systems that do not require a shmona. But I noticed that after the adoption of the customs agreement they stopped shuffling without a trace. A visual inspection, drug dogs. A couple of weeks ago I went, so in general, except for passport and visa checks, there was nothing. even dogs. but I won’t be surprised if there are such cases somewhere
      2. Beck
        Beck 12 May 2013 13: 07 New
        18
        UNCLEAR???

        Officials do not see refrigerations. The Kremlin and Astana are committed to building the EurAsEC. But similar articles about Kazakhstan periodically appear on the site. What someone really wants to completely separate the historical neighbors? What does someone really want the relationship between Russia and Kazakhstan to be like that of Russia with Ukraine? What does someone really want to pull the barbed wire along the entire border, and in the future to build a concrete wall? What does someone really want the Eurases not to take place?

        Of course, no one will die and we will live separately, looking at each other with binoculars, through a neutral strip. HERE WHO DOES IT NEED? The main tone of the Russian press is benevolent to relations between Russia and Kazakhstan.

        And here on the site, judging by the articles posted, they want to push both of them. And it turns out in some part. And they don’t think that living in good neighborliness is better. And do not think about their compatriots left out. If only to weld a weld.

        Well, well, go on. Bad business is not tricky. Sow a grain of rejection seeds, and seedlings of thistles of INTERNATIONAL discord, so they will rise without leaving violent growth.
      3. Beck
        Beck 12 May 2013 13: 54 New
        +5
        Quote: vladsolo56
        You somehow didn’t read the comment very carefully, I wrote that it was in 92-93


        I will tell my former fellow countryman not a joke, but a bike, which also happened in the mid 90s in Kazakhstan. Then, even in the Kazakh army, they were taken in the Soviet way, all without exception.

        Was at a party. Opposite sat three women Slavic. We had a conversation.
        One said that they were planning to move to their historical homeland, to Russia. Another clasped her hands.
        - Klava you are a fool or something. Here you move. Your Sanka is 17 years old, so he will be taken to the army there and sent to Chechnya. You won’t get any tears. And here, here, it’s good. He took the money to the draft board and walk Sanya on all four sides.

        I almost fell off my chair from laughter. Women then looked at me for a long time with resentment.
        1. Hleb
          Hleb 12 May 2013 15: 55 New
          +6
          By the way: the team of Astana Arlans boxers in the common people “Wolves” from Kazakhstan won the WSB-elite world cup among club teams. They defeated the Ukrainians. Moreover, the Olympic champions A. Usik and two-time Olympic champion V. Lomachenko were among the Ukrainians
      4. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 06: 08 New
        0
        come on you roll a barrel on our border guards. our frankly speaking on the drum that there is imported into Russia. they try to keep tight control only in a southerly direction.
        and a shmon on the Russian side is only fine with a very suspicious person, or who started to vomit first. and it’s not a secret to anyone that Russians can easily behave deliberately defiantly, showing that he is a “white man”, and the Kazakh border guard or customs officer “mambet, yesterday grazing sheep”. even here on the website every day these phrases appear. let alone the flow of thousands of Russians at the border. there will always be one such boob.
        you need to monitor your language and behavior, then the customs officer will not even look at you.
  • andrejwz
    andrejwz 12 May 2013 09: 48 New
    +6
    Quote: vladsolo56
    Now, of course, you can be offended by Nazarbayev, but first you need to see who brought the relationship to such a point.

    Yes, the creation of the Union is not a quick and easy thing. There are a lot of reasons and a lot of reasons for old insults on both sides. The theme seems to me: "Everything is lost! Everything is lost!" pumped artificially. Throw an article, a program, a rumor - and let them bite - you look, and society is not ready for integration, but, to hell with them, not a union. Article "minus" - in terms of new information "0". It turns out to maintain the appropriate degree?
    1. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 12 May 2013 11: 05 New
      11
      When Nazarbayev proposed the Union, everything would be much simpler, there would be a single economic, ruble, and territorial space. All that was required was to sign an agreement. Now, of course, a new generation of political “elite” has grown up both there and there, and now, in fact, they’re essentially a Union.
      I also remembered that Yeltsin was the first to pass a law to trade with the CIS countries at world prices, it was not just a blow, it was a vile and provocative blow.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 14: 03 New
    0
    Quote: vladsolo56
    Surely when I sobered up after the Bialowieza agreements, I realized what I had done, I was ashamed

    smiled
    Quote: vladsolo56
    By the way, Kazakhstan last came out of the ruble zone, and probably didn’t come out; Russia threw it away

    it is true that at that moment Kazakhstani money was already printed (you need to prepare the design of banknotes, agree with the appropriate printing house in England where you will not be put to print the next day)
    Quote: vladsolo56
    I remember we drove to Krasnoyarsk by car, on the Kazakh side there was a trailer and two border guards, most likely for the sake of formality, they asked where we were going and what we were carrying. On the Russian side there was already a terminal, armed border guards people 10

    Have you tried to drive back? very interesting this business is communication with the Kazakh customs
    1. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 12 May 2013 14: 41 New
      0
      And we went, in a couple of weeks, and you know nothing new happened during that time.
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 14: 50 New
        -5
        so I went and the difference at the customs in Domodedovo and Alma-Ata, I also saw more than once
    2. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 12 May 2013 15: 18 New
      +6
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      it is true that at that moment Kazakhstani money was already printed (you need to prepare the design of banknotes, agree with the appropriate printing house in England where you will not be put to print the next day)

      If this is so, but perhaps it was so, then BRAVO Nazarbayev .. BRAVO good
      I foresaw everything, I took everything into account, a few steps forward, and considering the most negative scenario .. Just like a real chess grandmaster bully
      I wish everyone to have such foresight and insight - especially the leadership of our countries !!!! hi
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 16: 41 New
        -6
        again, NO ONE will prepare this just in case, from here morality was planned in advance and statements about what were squeezed out were made to the public
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 12 May 2013 17: 15 New
          +4
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          again, NO ONE will prepare this just in case

          Nda fool ..with Yeltsin, after all his tricks negative you must always be prepared for anything ...
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          from here morality everything was planned in advance

          After drunk EBN and the company collapsed the USSR ... Nazarbayev must have formed MORAL - plan everything in advance .. even the most fantastic and hypothetical scenarios .. am
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 14: 03 New
    -1
    Quote: vladsolo56
    Surely when I sobered up after the Bialowieza agreements, I realized what I had done, I was ashamed

    smiled
    Quote: vladsolo56
    By the way, Kazakhstan last came out of the ruble zone, and probably didn’t come out; Russia threw it away

    it is true that at that moment Kazakhstani money was already printed (you need to prepare the design of banknotes, agree with the appropriate printing house in England where you will not be put to print the next day)
    Quote: vladsolo56
    I remember we drove to Krasnoyarsk by car, on the Kazakh side there was a trailer and two border guards, most likely for the sake of formality, they asked where we were going and what we were carrying. On the Russian side there was already a terminal, armed border guards people 10

    Have you tried to drive back? very interesting this business is communication with the Kazakh customs
    1. Beck
      Beck 12 May 2013 14: 58 New
      +7
      Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
      it is true that at that moment Kazakhstani money was already printed (you need to prepare the design of banknotes, agree with the appropriate printing house in England where you will not be put to print the next day)


      Do not lie.

      When Moscow, led by Gaidar, threw Kazakhstan out of the ruble zone, there were no designs of the Kazakh currency. Depreciated rubles went to echelons to Kazakhstan. Then, for the first time, the people of Kazakhstan went through an account of money (worthless salaries) for thousands and tens of thousands.

      In order not to drown in this stream of paper, tenge printing was urgently ordered in London. And London printed these tenge on loan, since Kazakhstan did not have any currency to pay for the order.

      Do not lie.
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 16: 27 New
        0




        as well as banknotes of 20, 50, 100, as well as small tiinks and this is all “not of any designs”

        DO NOT do the development overnight and put it into circulation. You can hardly imagine what it is.
        1. Beck
          Beck 12 May 2013 18: 25 New
          +6
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
          DO NOT do the development overnight and put it into circulation. You can hardly imagine what it is.


          Do not juggle to justify your lies. When choked with wooden rubles, then urgent and designed the design of notes for printing them in London. AFTER that we were thrown out of the ruble zone. Not BEFORE you claim.
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 19: 37 New
            -3
            Quote: Beck
            Do not distort your excuses

            there are two opinions one of my three is not right
            you and your comrades-in-arms are already getting ridiculous, at first you disprove my statements with the lack of design and the haste with which the first tenge was issued, as always after I gave documentary evidence of my point of view, you start to be rude and insult.
            you your "associates" are not interested.

            ps from the fact that you say halva a hundred times in your mouth it will not become sweeter, you can continue to claim that everything is wonderful and wonderful in the Republic of Kazakhstan, but neither national, nor social, nor economic problems will disappear from this
            1. Beck
              Beck 12 May 2013 21: 29 New
              +1
              Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
              there are two opinions one of my three is not right


              There are two opinions. Yours and mine, but their interpretation is a matter of purely everyone.

              Here is what you say you gave as an example banknotes. So I talk about them. Only you say that the design was done in advance, even before Kazakhstan was thrown out of the ruble zone. And that provokes people. Like, look, the Kazakhs planned to leave the zone themselves and kept the design in the stash. And I say that you are lying. There was no Prepared Design. Nobody knew that they would throw us out. Gaidar did it all of a sudden. And as the paper of Soviet rubles filled us up, only then the URGENT design was made and an order was made to print them.
              NOBODY knew or suspected that we were thrown out of the ruble zone.
              1. Alexander
                Alexander 12 May 2013 21: 51 New
                +1
                Maybe I'm naive, but I want to ask. Do you want to return to the ruble zone?
                1. Beck
                  Beck 13 May 2013 09: 27 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Alexander
                  Maybe I'm naive, but I want to ask. Do you want to return to the ruble zone?


                  It seems even before Kazakhstan was thrown out of the ruble zone. Nazarbayev offered Yeltsin to make a common currency - Altyn. That in Russian and Kazakh languages ​​has its meaning.

                  If we build a strong EurAsEC, a common currency will be necessary and inevitable.
              2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 22: 58 New
                -3
                Quote: Beck
                Like, look, the Kazakhs planned to leave the zone themselves and kept the design in the stash. And I say that you are lying. There was no Prepared Design

                sorry for being rude, you are generally friends with the brain, you roughly imagine the timing of such work, develop, coordinate, think over protection, etc. you remind me of those sheep from mine images that gave 15 months to develop 4 textbooks.
                urgently beck can only crawl out and then if diarrhea.
                unlike you, I am somewhat versed in printing
                1. Beck
                  Beck 13 May 2013 09: 42 New
                  +6
                  Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                  sorry for being rude, you are generally friends with the brain, you roughly imagine the timing of such work, develop, coordinate, think over protection, etc.


                  And why are you nervous, it breaks into hysteria that there are no arguments, and those that are beyond any criticism.

                  That's because they created these designs in a hurry, and then later replaced these designs, without hurry, with others. But protection, as there are world standards for this protection, did not have to invent anything new. Protecting it all the currencies of the developed world is about the same.

                  And the company in London was provided only with artistic design, and they did the defense and printing themselves, since they are a specialized company. And we do not have specialists in protection now.

                  And who argues about the presence of idiots in officials who are ready for 4 months to write a new version of “Warriors and Peace”.

                  And the last one. I see you getting nervous, the screech slips, probably the tick begins. So health will be shaken. From all I wish you to take soothing, listen to melodic, measured music, relax in silence. In order to subsequently write comments without hysteria.

                  Ours to you, with a brush.
                  1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                    Vasilenko Vladimir 13 May 2013 09: 49 New
                    -3
                    you don’t need arguments, they don’t do art design in 5 minutes on their knees, it doesn’t matter who developed the protection (it should be woven into the design of the bill in general) all the time, like printing, delivery and distribution across the territory of the Republic of Kazakhstan.

                    I say again, you can stand in an ostrich pose for as long as you like, nothing will change from this, I won’t work at factories, and parties today that are firmly in nationalist positions will not be struck by internationalism
                    1. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 17: 12 New
                      +2
                      Vova, do not mix cutlets and flies into one. First, they threw us out of the ruble zone (although until the last moment Moscow had given hope for this), and then ours had to rush to enter our own money in an emergency. Then, when the Central Bank of Russia issued money with the inscription "Russia", when the financial system was finally torn between us. In Kazakhstan, by November 1993, they used rubles, but SOVIET, not Russian, which in fact and legally were foreign money and they cost twice as much as Soviet rubles. Che you turned durkee, forgot what and how it was in 1993? I forgot that in the morning, at lunch and in the evening, food prices rose because the money supply grew daily due to Soviet banknotes from Russia and other republics? Balabol you and a liar.

                      Factories work for us. Take it easy. There were more Kazakhstani goods than under the Soviet regime. We have launched an industrialization program, although you are useless to talk about it. You have blinders before your eyes and between the lines it says: "Kazakhstan should come, because I left, but without me all these millions of Kazakhs are nothing!"
                      And the paradox is that the more "golden-armed" balabol left, the better the people of Kazakhstan began to live. Even the streets got less dirt. But the more “Russian-speaking” people like you entered Russia, the worse the situation there is nationally and garbage in the streets. It’s not the Tajiks who’ll balamute water, but throats like you, “sufferers” for the Russian nation, “fighters” for the idea of ​​taking away a broom from an Uzbek janitor ... If anyone in Kazakhstan starts saying that Kazakhs deserve to be janitors and that Kazakhs should occupy this niche, displacing migrant workers - he will be considered an enemy of the nation or just a moron. You in Russia drive in Russians the idea that Russians should push foreigners (although almost all of them cannot boast of 100% “Russianness”) even at the cost of degrading the professional qualities of Russians in Russia. You are frank enemies of the Russian people! What else do you call your desire to give Russian a broom? The Russian patriot thinks about how to raise the Russians in the professional plan, and the “foam from Kazakhstan” (pseudo-pseudo-pseudo-Russian pseudo-refugees) encourages Russians to go down to the level of laborers ... Since you are unlikely to be paid by the Zionists, the State Department or the Martians, I believe that your fellow friends are yelling about it simply because of some mental disability. Pull the Russian people up rather than down.

                      Z.Y. There are no nationalist political parties in Kazakhstan, balabol.
                    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
                      Vasilenko Vladimir 23 May 2013 18: 33 New
                      -3
                      Quote: Marek Rozny
                      Factories work for us. Take it easy. There are more Kazakhstan goods than during the Soviet era

                      Marik of your stupidity is not even surprised, we are not at the congress of Nurotan calm down.
                      can you list the large factories of light industry
                    3. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 18: 13 New
                      +1
                      You have already been repeatedly answered regarding specific plants. uselessly. after a short time you start asking again. search in google.

                      Z.Y. Legprom, by the way, was practically absent in Kazakhstan in Soviet times.
                    4. The comment was deleted.
  • treskoed
    treskoed 12 May 2013 07: 17 New
    +9
    The integration process is not a Russification process. Kazakhs have their own mentality, language, and customs. There are and will be disputes of economic entities. Disagreements on certain international issues are also acceptable. Someone likes something, someone doesn’t, but there is a union and we are together!
    1. V. Ushakov
      V. Ushakov 12 May 2013 07: 31 New
      -8
      Yes. The “bye” union is there and we are “bye” together. What will happen after - we do not know. And - if we pack our bags from Baikonur, then let them pack their bags from the twelve regions that were illegally transferred to Kazakhstan - Nikita. If such a crap continues, it is necessary to tighten pressure on this post-Soviet satrapy or - annex it by military means.
      1. Hleb
        Hleb 12 May 2013 07: 44 New
        +5
        those twelve regions that were illegally transferred to Kazakhstan - Nikita

        tell us about these dark pages of history
      2. Canep
        Canep 12 May 2013 07: 46 New
        +8
        Read the story, and also take an interest in what language the name BARNAUL, Altai is.
        1. Canep
          Canep 12 May 2013 08: 31 New
          0
          And Omsk got its name from the Om River. From Wikipedia:
          The name "Om" according to one version comes from the Turkic word om - "quiet" [4]. The local name of the river in Baraba and Irtysh is the diminutive Omka. [5]

          And ASTRAKHAN perhaps got its name from Aster Khan.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. The comment was deleted.
          2. Hleb
            Hleb 12 May 2013 08: 51 New
            +4
            yeah and Tomsk yes? come on Astrakhan, Orenburg, Beshtau, Saratov, Kazan, will we analyze the name of Khabarov?
          3. nemec55
            nemec55 12 May 2013 09: 06 New
            -1
            OMSK Special-Place-Links-Katarshnikov
            1. 101
              101 12 May 2013 13: 41 New
              +7
              So it began. They put shit on us, and let’s throw the Minus article as vicious, damn it. Or maybe they check us for lice?
      3. Nick
        Nick 12 May 2013 13: 01 New
        +3
        Quote: V. Ushakov
        Yes. The “bye” union is there and we are “bye” together. What will happen after - we do not know.

        Yes, everything does not last forever under the moon ... And according to astrophysicists, the moon is not forever ...
    2. Circle
      Circle 12 May 2013 10: 12 New
      11
      It was really difficult to draw the border in the 20th century, because for several centuries Russians and Kazakhs lived side by side. It was different in history, but in the end, in that historical period everything was so mixed up and grown togetherthat it was very difficult to understand. Each side has its own arguments. But how to cut what has long penetrated in both directions? But the main thing is different. That the peoples of both countries have long lived in peace and are used to trust each other. And used to not trust others, the same Chinese together. The little article is simply called upon to try to bite this centuries-old alliance that existed between ordinary people without any papers and contracts. And this attempt itself is quite awkward and ridiculous. The State Department is preparing them badly, badly.
  • Hleb
    Hleb 12 May 2013 07: 29 New
    +6
    clearly does not oppose the prospects of a referendum on withdrawal from the Customs Union

    It’s just ordinary people of Kazakhstan who talk about the minuses of the customs union. Because prices jumped sharply. For the same cars, housing for discontent. Earlier, people from the border regions of Russia specially went to Kazakhstan for things and products. Today, there is practically no difference in price. bind simple people it is with the customs union
    1. ia-ai00
      ia-ai00 12 May 2013 13: 22 New
      -5
      You might think that if Kazakhstan leaves the Customs Union, then prices will “jump” ...
  • Rezun
    Rezun 12 May 2013 07: 30 New
    +2
    Unable to find the source, why?
    1. 101
      101 12 May 2013 13: 55 New
      +4
      Quote: Rezun
      Unable to find the source, why?

      Victor Martynyuk political observer of the Internet portal in Moscow Kakaga horseradish not understand Provocation guys
  • smsk
    smsk 12 May 2013 07: 43 New
    -3
    Quote: V. Ushakov
    Yes. The “bye” union is there and we are “bye” together. What will happen after - we do not know. And - if we pack our bags from Baikonur, then let them pack their bags from the twelve regions that were illegally transferred to Kazakhstan - Nikita. If such a crap continues, it is necessary to tighten pressure on this post-Soviet satrapy or - annex it by military means.


    First you put things in order in your Russian regions, and then climb into another country, do you have so little of your land, or are these imperial ways? We’ll give the Kuriles to the Japanese, and we’ll take away eastern Kazakhstan, well, well
    1. V. Ushakov
      V. Ushakov 12 May 2013 08: 54 New
      -4
      For some reason, you arrange such orders in yourselves that the Russians have nothing to do there because of the complete lack of prospects and because of the danger of living among you. However, you - for some reason, run to us, where "there is no order." We would sit at home, but restore order, and not arrange order. Otherwise, we will sweep the torn broom, the time will come.
      1. ziqzaq
        ziqzaq 12 May 2013 12: 57 New
        10
        Quote: V. Ushakov
        However, you - for some reason, run to us, where "there is no order."

        Nobody is running anywhere. Although rather the opposite, we have enough Russians at work who have come specifically to work. And mostly elderly people leave for Belarus. The article is provocative ....
        1. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 14: 06 New
          -2
          Quote: ziqzaq
          And mostly elderly people leave for Belarus

          and in numbers can your statement be voiced?
          1. mr.rafael-r
            mr.rafael-r 13 May 2013 14: 34 New
            -1
            Vladimir, what are the numbers, what are YOU. This is not a khan’s business. wink .
      2. kuz363
        kuz363 10 July 2017 21: 49 New
        0
        Listen, sweeper! Can you tear the navel? Digest first Crimea, Transnistria, Syria, Donbass, Abkhazia, South. Ossetia And it would be nice to restore order in Russia itself, before meddling on the side. If you think that the Russians in Kazakhstan will meet the liberators with bread and salt, as in the Crimea (although, apparently, they already repent), then you are greatly mistaken.
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 11: 28 New
      +2
      SMSK, that’s why the most often included Russian nationalists, judging by the names, are not really Russian?))) Ushakov is a Turkic surname, Vasilenko is Ukrainian, etc. The author of the article is also with a non-Russian surname (Russified Ukrainian, apparently). The complex of neophytes. I would also understand when the Ivanovs would wave a saber of nationalism, but usually Zhirinovsky, Potkin and other "Russian-speaking" people are engaged in this gesheft.
      I didn’t see the ardent Natsik with the surname “Petrov” or “Sidorov” ... With the owners of these surnames - I have only wonderful associations, from classmates to business partners.
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 23 May 2013 13: 03 New
        -5
        went to x ...
        I don’t like the surname, don’t read it, I’m already sickened, I have never presented a single evidence of my vysers, but a Pontus like a padishah.
        it's you Russian-speaking ba no matter how Kazakh or crest, and I'm Russian
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 13: 26 New
          +3
          every ton of evidence leads you to every point, but your jitters and hysteria begin every time))))) drink a sedative, Little Johnny)))) and even so these "Kazakh nationalists" have broken your mind))))) all Russians in Kazakhstan is different, but all the "refugees" - like a carbon copy - neither know how to write in Russian, nor think, nor argue, nor tell. And, as it turned out over these 20 years, they still do not know how to work. It seems that this is the whole snag, why they were left out of work in Kazakhstan.
        2. kuz363
          kuz363 10 July 2017 21: 53 New
          0
          You are a terry crest. And over to the Russians.
  • nemec55
    nemec55 12 May 2013 07: 45 New
    10
    I also don’t understand what to do with the Kazakhs’s stigma in the gun. We need to work with people and the country and not loot and shout And just shout (the country's leadership) that Russia is the most work so that in any country of the former Soviet Union and abroad, the inhabitants of Russia respected us and will talk about the fact that we are a great country, and it’s embarrassing to look into the eyes of embezzlers with thieves by embezzlers.
    1. nemec55
      nemec55 12 May 2013 07: 47 New
      +6
      But Nazarbayev has nothing to us or does not owe you, he works for the good of his country.
    2. The comment was deleted.
  • Rezun
    Rezun 12 May 2013 07: 48 New
    +4
    I found the author, looked. Reluctance to say nothing ...
  • pinecone
    pinecone 12 May 2013 07: 50 New
    -1
    Sliced ​​chunk. They are Turks and will be guided by Turkey. No wonder Nazarbay was erected a bronze monument in Ankara. With his departure, the pro-Turkish mood will intensify even more. It is unfortunate that after 1917. the Bolsheviks handed over to them the South Siberian, Caspian and Uual lands. Uralsk, Guryev, Pavlodar, Petropavlovsk, Semipalatinsk, Ust-Kamenogorsk ... Russian cities, towns and Cossack villages ... We need to gather our strength and defend what is left, or it will be too late.
    Thanks to the author for a concise and sober assessment of the situation.
    1. RUS
      RUS 12 May 2013 11: 31 New
      -8
      We will return, we will return everything, the beginning was laid-Abkhazia and South Ossetia (they are de facto independent de facto our "protectorate"), then Crimea, the North of Kazakhstan, eastern Ukraine.
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 17: 43 New
        +3
        Quote: pinecone
        They are Turks and will be guided by Turkey.

        And why not to Yakutia and Tatarstan itself? Tatars and Yakuts are closer to us than the Turks. We’ll eat one horsemeat. If the Kazakh “chunk” falls off, then it will pull other Turkic “chunks” along with it. Turn on your head. Ask the Tatar that he would prefer to live in the same state as Kazakhs or Russians, maybe there will be less aplomb.
        Quote: pinecone
        No wonder Nazarbay in Ankara erected a bronze monument.

        In this case, Nazarbayev apparently also targets Moldova, Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan and Armenia, where the local people also erected monuments to him. And to what Russian politicians did the neighbors erect a monument during their lifetime? Do not want to think?
        Quote: pinecone
        With his departure, pro-Turkish sentiments will increase even more.
        Wipe your finger, tie something out of it to suck.
        Quote: pinecone
        after 1917 the Bolsheviks handed over to them the South Siberian, Caspian and Uual lands. Uralsk, Guryev, Pavlodar, Petropavlovsk, Semipalatinsk, Ust-Kamenogorsk ... Russian cities, towns and Cossack villages ...

        If you don’t know the history of Russia, where are you going to talk about the history of Kazakhstan? The fact that tsarism built military bases on the territory of Kazakhstan does not mean that it is "primordially Russian land." And as self-education, take the census of the population of the Russian Empire in the above-mentioned areas and see if there were at least somewhere Russian migrants in the majority. As for the cities, they were filled with Russian people not under Tsar Gorokh or even under Lenin, but only a few decades ago during the war (evacuated) and post-war "Komsomol construction sites" and virgin lands.

        Quote: RUS
        We will return, we will return everything, the beginning was laid-Abkhazia and South Ossetia (they are de facto independent de facto our "protectorate"), then Crimea, the North of Kazakhstan, eastern Ukraine.

        You will swallow steppe dust to swallow. In the Kazakh steppe tons of bones are such attachments. This is not Georgia and Poland for you. On the territory of Kazakhstan, not a single invader came out victorious. Come to northern Kazakhstan to “conquer me”, I can drop the address in PM. Then you will go to the surgeon under the "protectorate" ...
    2. Duisenbay Bankankulov
      Duisenbay Bankankulov 14 May 2017 19: 33 New
      0
      Well, you're right, you need 5 regions of Kazakhstan, which were transferred to the RSFSR after the transfer of Crimea to Ukraine. Can you recall a year ???
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 15 May 2017 13: 06 New
        0
        eu, then forgive me and return all of Kazakhstan to Russia as an autonomous republic
  • vjatsergey
    vjatsergey 12 May 2013 07: 52 New
    +4
    As soon as we leave Baikonur, there will immediately be others - the USA or China.
    1. nemec55
      nemec55 12 May 2013 08: 09 New
      +3
      And how would you like. Damn, this person works for his country. Here, in my opinion, he realized that 20 years after the collapse of the USSR, the Russian authorities did nothing to improve relations. I lived in the KZ until the 95th and now I live 5 km from the border and I’m often there.
      1. Hleb
        Hleb 12 May 2013 08: 28 New
        +1
        and the United States and Kittai will benefit Kazakhstan? it is thanks to the United States that Musabaev and Aubakirov flew into space, right? that we had a single country and a period in history doesn’t mean much. and Kazakhstan should be indebted to Russia for a long time to come. from this it is impossible to put an equal sign between us and the Americans with the Chinese
        (Do you live by chance in the Isilkul region?)
        1. nemec55
          nemec55 12 May 2013 09: 00 New
          +3
          Kazakhstan should, I don’t argue, but it doesn’t owe us the state identity should also be veteran apartments and a 5% mortgage and roads, an honest court, a salary, rural work, land for peasants.
          In Odessa region
        2. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 17: 50 New
          +3
          Russia or the Soviet government sent Musabaev and Aubakirov into space?
          Russia or Soviet power ruined the Aral Sea and left us the poisoned land of nuclear testing grounds?
          Did Russia or the Soviet government kill half of the Kazakhs in 1932-1933, taking all their livestock as part of "collectivization"?
          By 1937, did Russia or the Soviet government shoot the entire intellectual elite of the Kazakh nation?
          And so on.

          Many Russians deliberately juggle with concepts, substituting definitions where necessary. Where are the advantages of the Soviet power, it is attributed to the "Russian people", and where are the jambs of the Soviet power, the Russian kagbe has nothing to do with it ... Do you want to cling to the achievements of the Soviet power? Then answer for her mistakes and mistakes.
  • knn54
    knn54 12 May 2013 08: 07 New
    11
    Destroyer of the USSR Nazarbayev will never become a creator.
    So that's who the Union destroyed. And we EBN AND MSG (Kravchuk, Shushkevich) are spread rot, it turns out badly.
    Not tired of the extreme look?
    V. Ushakov: ... of the twelve regions that were illegally transferred to Kazakhstan ...
    15 volosts of the Omsk district and Akmola, Atbasar, Kokchetav and Petropavlovsk districts of the Omsk province in 1921 were transferred to Kazakhstan (the Kyrgyz Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic). Kalinin, not Nikita.
    1. AleksUkr
      AleksUkr 12 May 2013 13: 19 New
      +5
      The President of Kazakhstan, N. Nazarbayev, was not present at the meeting in Viskuly, although on December 8 he was supposed to arrive in the forest, where he was expected until the evening and even postponed the signing of the Agreement. Nazarbayev really flew from Kazakhstan, but not to Minsk, but to Moscow. Official sources report that it was only a refueling of the aircraft, but so far this side remains the most mysterious in the history of those days: according to one version, Marshal Shaposhnikov prevented Nazarbayev from flying out, and the president of Kazakhstan was taken directly to the Kremlin to speak with Gorbachev ... In an interview for Komsomolskaya Pravda in the same 1991. the president of Kazakhstan said: “I still wouldn’t have my signature under the document, and if I had been there, at least I would have tried to convince the participants of the Minsk meeting to nevertheless hold consultations with all potential members of the Commonwealth of Independent States and only after that take some that decision. ” It remains unclear whether this decision was made by Nazarbayev on his own, or whether a conversation with Gorbachev took place.
      1. Beck
        Beck 12 May 2013 14: 39 New
        +1
        Quote: AleksUkr
        Marshal Shaposhnikov prevented Nazarbayev from flying out, and the president of Kazakhstan was taken to the Kremlin directly from the plane to speak with Gorbachev ...


        I have another version.

        From 1979 to 1984, Nazarbayev was secretary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Kazakhstan, not to be confused with the first secretary. In 80 years, Gorbachev was a member of the Politburo of the Central Committee.KPSS and he oversaw Kazakhstan. And in 1984, he nominated Nazarbayev to the post of Chairman of the Council of Ministers of the Kaz.SSR. And in 1989, it was Gorbachev who ousted Kunaev and promoted Nazarbayev to the post of the First Ceretron of the Communist Party of Kazakhstan.

        At the last XXI111 Congress of the CPSU in 1990 (July 2–13), when Gorbachev’s power was weakened, he might not even be re-elected to the General Secretary, Nazarbayev was one of his most active supporters.

        Based on the foregoing, it can be assumed that Nazarbayev was not going to fly further into the forest. He flew and flew precisely to Moscow, to Gorbachev, with an explanation of the current situation.
        1. Duisenbay Bankankulov
          Duisenbay Bankankulov 14 May 2017 19: 53 New
          0
          Beck, one small amendment made in 1986 to Kolbin, was appointed the first secretary of the Central Committee of the CPSU of Kazakhstan, so the youth went to the Zheltoksan Square in December ...
          1. Vasilenko Vladimir
            Vasilenko Vladimir 15 May 2017 13: 07 New
            0
            Quote: Duisenbay Sbankulov
            First Secretary of the Central Committee of the CPSU of Kazakhstan

            for starters, you’ll have to figure out what to write about, but Kolbin has never been appointed first secretary of the CPSU Central Committee
            1. Duisenbay Bankankulov
              Duisenbay Bankankulov 16 May 2017 05: 13 New
              0
              Vladimir: It was the hunchback who appointed Kolbin, it was with him that the first color revolution in the USSR was. Google to help ....
              1. Vasilenko Vladimir
                Vasilenko Vladimir 16 May 2017 10: 05 New
                0
                for starters, you will learn to distinguish the CPSU from the CCP, and after that you will send me somewhere hi
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 11: 55 New
      +1
      Quote: knn54
      15 volosts of the Omsk district and Akmola, Atbasar, Kokchetav and Petropavlovsk districts of the Omsk province in 1921 were transferred to Kazakhstan (the Kyrgyz Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic). Kalinin, not Nikita.

      but nothing that this is the land on which the Kazakhs and their ancestors lived their entire history, when the Russians still lived in Kievan Rus? Take the census in Tsarist times and see how many Russians lived there until 1900 - with a gulkin nose. Yes, and those - the military (soldiers and visiting Cossacks), the officials of the tsarist administration (paramilitary) and in some places the schismatics who had fled from Nikon’s reforms at one time. Only in the 90s of the 19th century did mass Russian colonists-Stolypinites appear.
      By the way, any Kazakh will not only say that the districts mentioned are exactly Kazakh, he will also say what kind of Kazakhs live there - Argyns. My subgenus Argyn-Karauyl lived in the Zerendinsky volost of the Kokchetav district. There were no Russians at all. This was the most gorgeous place in the entire Omsk province! And still this place is the best in the Akmola region, and Omsk will confirm this. And at the beginning of the 20th century, my family was expelled from there, having taken the land for immigrants from Russia and Ukraine, and my family was driven out to the most uncomfortable part of the region, where it still lives. Since the beginning of the 20th century, there have been only Russian villages in Zerenda. And now you expose them as indigenous Russian lands. Well, there were no Russians here. There are many Russians now (and let them live), but the Omsk province and others have never been the original Russian lands. All this land is in Kazakh mounds, and Russian cemeteries appeared only at the end of the 19th century.
      And they didn’t mention that not only Omsk was transferred to Russia in the 20th century, but also Orenburg with the region? This is absolutely Kazakh (and Tatar-Bashkir in the north of the region) territory. Kazakhs living in Russia do not move en masse to Kazakhstan because they live on their historical land. They are not diasporas, they are indigenous inhabitants Orenburg, Astrakhan, Volgograd, Omsk, Kurgan regions and Altai Territory. These regions received the "Russian look" a hundred years ago, and in a number of places even less. The colonization of Kazakh Astrakhan, for example, began only in the 18th century, and even then it was populated not by Russians, but by Germans. All Russianness of Astrakhan was expressed in the presence of Russian troops (Cossacks, for example) and Russian merchants who arrived (represented by the Kazan Tatars). There were no Russian peasants here, until Stolypin decided to throw yesterday's serfs into Siberia and Kazakhstan.
    3. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 11: 57 New
      -1
      Quote: knn54
      15 volosts of the Omsk district and Akmola, Atbasar, Kokchetav and Petropavlovsk districts of the Omsk province in 1921 were transferred to Kazakhstan (the Kyrgyz Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic). Kalinin, not Nikita.

      but nothing that this is the land on which the Kazakhs and their ancestors lived their entire history, when the Russians still lived in Kievan Rus? Take the census in Tsarist times and see how many Russians lived there until 1900 - with a gulkin nose. Yes, and those - the military (soldiers and visiting Cossacks), the officials of the tsarist administration (paramilitary) and in some places the schismatics who had fled from Nikon’s reforms at one time. Only in the 90s of the 19th century did mass Russian colonists-Stolypinites appear.
      By the way, any Kazakh will not only say that the districts mentioned are exactly Kazakh, he will also say what kind of Kazakhs live there - Argyns. My subgenus Argyn-Karauyl lived in the Zerendinsky volost of the Kokchetav district. There were no Russians at all. This was the most gorgeous place in the entire Omsk province! And still this place is the best in the Akmola region, and Omsk will confirm this. And at the beginning of the 20th century, my family was expelled from there, having taken the land for immigrants from Russia and Ukraine, and my family was driven out to the most uncomfortable part of the region, where it still lives. Since the beginning of the 20th century, there have been only Russian villages in Zerenda. And now you expose them as indigenous Russian lands. Well, there were no Russians here. There are many Russians now (and let them live), but the Omsk province and others have never been the original Russian lands. All this land is in Kazakh mounds, and Russian cemeteries appeared only at the end of the 19th century.
      And they didn’t mention that not only Omsk was transferred to Russia in the 20th century, but also Orenburg with the region? This is absolutely Kazakh (and Tatar-Bashkir in the north of the region) territory. Kazakhs living in Russia do not move en masse to Kazakhstan because they live on their historical land. They are not diasporas, they are indigenous inhabitants Orenburg, Astrakhan, Volgograd, Omsk, Kurgan regions and Altai Territory. These regions received the "Russian look" a hundred years ago, and in a number of places even less. The colonization of Kazakh Astrakhan, for example, began only in the 18th century, and even then it was populated not by Russians, but by Germans. All Russianness of Astrakhan was expressed in the presence of Russian troops (Cossacks, for example) and Russian merchants who arrived (represented by the Kazan Tatars). There were no Russian peasants here, until Stolypin decided to throw yesterday's serfs into Siberia and Kazakhstan.
  • heavytank
    heavytank 12 May 2013 08: 35 New
    10
    Posted by Victor Martynyuk! if you want to write some sort of political conclusions from the beginning, you must be able to analyze what happened in the whole country and in the world order. Without sufficient knowledge, a good article is unlikely to be obtained. As for Nazarbayev, there is and always has been between the leaders of Russia, there will be a warm attitude. so it should be. After the collapse of the USSR, Kazakhstan and Russia, Belarus remained faithful to each other as allies. Read the story from the beginning, then write a normal article.
    1. Duisenbay Bankankulov
      Duisenbay Bankankulov 14 May 2017 19: 56 New
      0
      Why would he know the story ??? After all, the custom article is immediately visible, the paints are thick, and the goal is one provocation ...
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 15 May 2017 13: 08 New
        0
        Quote: Duisenbay Sbankulov
        Why would he know the story ???

        tell yourself this first secretary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Kazakhstan
  • arkgrz
    arkgrz 12 May 2013 08: 44 New
    +5
    in our army, of all Asians, Kazakhs were the most adequate .. you could always find a common language .. and they all knew Russian, unlike chocks .. but still I think you need to live in your own countries .. work wherever you want .. and then home though. and inspired by this article, we also need to give firm confidence to the Tajiks of the Kyrgyz and so on. ..that they will have to leave Russia .. this is not their homeland. and so work for now.
    1. QWERTY
      QWERTY 12 May 2013 14: 02 New
      -3
      They used to know the Russian language. I have parents in Dzhambul, I visit there periodically. You go on the bus - not a single Slavic face. They go from villages to the city to live - and they don’t know Russian at all. I was still studying at school in 1999, there were classmates such. In general, why take a steam bath, all non-Kazakhs will dump them from there - and slowly the country will return to yurts. The truth is beautiful, the sea comes from oil and gas.
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 18: 21 New
        +5
        as is characteristic of the "refugees" from Kazakhstan: to Russia themselves, the elderly on the neck of the Kazakhs. you, yutsuken, do not be afraid, we will feed your parents. already accustomed to such "refugees". not in Russian it is not in Kazakh. you still cannot feed yourself in Russia, and even take responsibility for the elderly - the heavily "freedom-loving" patriots of Russia ...
  • aszzz888
    aszzz888 12 May 2013 08: 46 New
    +7
    [i] [/ i] But only with further actions of Nursultan Abishevich this was not confirmed in any way. [i] [

    It’s somehow smeared, without facts. What "next steps" when, in relation to whom?
    Raw article, and smacks of it ...
  • stranik72
    stranik72 12 May 2013 08: 52 New
    11
    The article is so-so, well, first of all, Nazarbayev was for preserving the USSR unequivocally, this is a fact and he is not in doubt, he was not even invited to a Belovezhsky conspiracy because of this. Secondly, Nazarbayev began talking about integration immediately after the "dissolution" of the USSR. Well, what about the creator, what he has been doing in Kazakhstan and has already done during this time, we have never dreamed of in Russia. Concerning the attitude towards Russians, there is ambiguous, there are only local leaders in any business, in principle, Kazakhstan is not very promising for the Russian self-realization, as is Tatarstan.
    1. Hleb
      Hleb 12 May 2013 08: 57 New
      +4
      he says now that Kazakhstan was occupied by Russia, right? and is for the Kazakhs a man who brought them independence. And what Russia did not dream of? What did he do?
      1. nemec55
        nemec55 12 May 2013 09: 23 New
        +2
        Dear Gleb, you probably all the same understand that this is a PR move, perhaps the cunning Kazakh needs from the Turks and Russia and is blackmailing this. I think it’s normal, but there will be Amer bases there or Ritya et still grandma with a pitchfork in the coffee grounds.
        1. Hleb
          Hleb 12 May 2013 09: 37 New
          +2
          I also wrote here on this statement, but you must admit that such statements in the person of the president are unacceptable to Russia (not to anyone). This seems more like a lie.
          but in general, if it were not for the collapse of the union, then in life would not have thrown such beauty


          1. nemec55
            nemec55 12 May 2013 09: 45 New
            +3
            Yes, the photos are cool balm for the soul. We in the Kyzyltu district are not the same beauty.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. Hleb
              Hleb 12 May 2013 10: 00 New
              +3
              but Ishim you don’t have? but there is probably such a landscape wink

              Oh saw. You have enough ponds!
              1. nemec55
                nemec55 12 May 2013 10: 23 New
                +2
                We have 7 ponds around the state farm Bidayikskom carp from 2 to 15 kg in childhood he caught 7 kg a little heart did not go. He honestly did not see such a landscape But in Russia it is full
              2. Beck
                Beck 13 May 2013 15: 38 New
                +2
                Quote: Gleb
                but there is probably such a landscape


                Is that a hint of drugs? Is she hemp? Such a thick hint, even in the pants does not fit. Take more green flies on the dunghill and give it with a hint that only in Kazakhstan there is dung and flies.

                I will give a little explanation so that people know that not all thick hints are true. Since, to some extent, my work was related to the fight against drug addiction.

                Hemp - Cánnabis. You will find botanical data in encyclopedias. Hemp in Russia was mainly used to produce fiber going to hemp, paper, tissue and to obtain hemp seed oil. Russian, European hemp does not have a narcotic effect. And hemp is essentially a weed, it grows by itself in any places without care. It’s worth it just to get her out of the site of great labor. And in Kazakhstan, throughout the territory, wild hemp is spread, without narcotic action, with the exception of one place. And it grows where ordinary grass does not grow.

                Only Indian and Manchu types of hemp have a narcotic effect. They were originally introduced into the Criminal Code.

                In the mid-30s, nonsense struck the heads of the leadership of the USSR. A decree on the comprehensive development of hemp breeding was issued, and its cultivation in household plots was encouraged. Since hemp is weed by nature and needs to be taken care of, it was decided to plant large areas of hemp in the Chui Valley of Kazakhstan. And planted in rows. Two rows of women especially, one row of men. In anticipation of hempseed oil, such shanty sheds were built in the valley of oil-producing factories. Crops were good, oil of excellent quality. But in five to ten years, the natural happened. Either Russian hemp was reborn from crossing with local hemp, or else that. But Chui hemp began to possess a narcotic property. During the war, there was no time for hemp. And after the war, hemp crops in the Chuy valley stopped, because it became a drug.

                Then for decades they tried to destroy it, but everything was useless. Even in the 80 years, if you look closely, it was clear that obscure rows go into the distance. Addicts learned about the new narcotic Klondike from the beginning of the 60s and drove there in gangs. They used Chuy valley for decades. Then, in the Criminal Code, Chuiskaya was added to Indian and Manchu cannabis. The fight against drug addicts, before perestroika, was conducted after the sleeves, as the official ideology claimed that there was no drug addiction in the USSR.

                Attempts by drug addicts to sow Chuya hemp in other places were unsuccessful. Since such crops were given a drug crop only in the first year, two. Then hemp is reborn and becomes non-narcotic. Therefore, continuing to take risks, messengers go to the "promised" land of drug addiction.
                1. Hleb
                  Hleb 13 May 2013 15: 48 New
                  -3
                  Such a thick hint, even in the pants does not fit. Take more green flies on the dunghill and give it with a hint that only in Kazakhstan there is dung and flies.
                  don’t drive in. do you write chtoli yourself in a log? there were no hints. there was humor and normal communication with normal people. did you attend a lecture. do you think that anyone knows?
                  my work was connected with the fight against drug addiction.
                  By the way, I probably should know when and where the largest consignment of anasha of the history of Kazakhstan was seized?
                  1. Beck
                    Beck 13 May 2013 19: 34 New
                    +6
                    Quote: Gleb
                    don’t drive in. do you write chtoli yourself in a log? there were no hints. there was humor and normal communication with normal people. did you attend a lecture. do you think that anyone knows?


                    So your humor did not understand. Here is the specifics of communication on the site, and for a week what article with a bias atu Kazakhstan. And about Chuya hemp, it is precisely few who know how it became a drug.
          2. Andrey KZ
            Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 10: 47 New
            +9
            Well, here we are, picking mushrooms!
            1. Andrey KZ
              Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 10: 58 New
              +5
              We love the mountains and respect fishing!
              1. Andrey KZ
                Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 11: 01 New
                +5
                Here we are in the mountains
      2. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 12: 15 New
        +3
        Quote: Gleb
        he now says that Kazakhstan was occupied by Russia, right?

        do not misinterpret. Nazarbayev mentioned that in tsarist times we were a colony of Russia. What is he wrong if even in Soviet times, tsarist politics was called colonial and exploitative in our textbooks? And until 1917, tsarism actively used the concepts of "colony", "colonists", "natives", speaking of Turkestan. Rewrite all pre-revolutionary materials on Turkestan and Soviet textbooks, then the phrase about "colonial policy" will not be an eyesore.

        Nazarbayev really gave us real independence. Not that fact, I mean that the USSR was ruined by the leaders of the Slavic republics, but that Nazarbayev was able to build a normal state in which people calmly work and live. We do not arrange civil wars, we do not go abroad for a piece of bread, we have confidence in tomorrow and the further development of the republic. Simply put, the state took place. And this despite the fact that the difficulties were an order of magnitude greater than that of the neighbors - starting with the fact that the titular nation was not the overwhelming majority, that there was no processing industry, that there were no officers for the armed forces, there was no treasury, and so on. We are here all the collapse, collapse and internecine war. Che hide something? Russian newspapers of the early 90s openly wrote that Kazakhstan is not viable and generally about to Kazakhs and others crawl on their knees ... Do not remember the newspapers? Yes, even our Russian-speaking Kazakhstani media wrote such rubbish that they wanted to get into a noose, only the Giller’s “Caravan” alone was worth what, which every Friday told the country that “we are good.”
    2. Canep
      Canep 12 May 2013 09: 20 New
      +8
      In order to have prospects in the civil service, you need to know the Kazakh, the Russians are really tense here. Although the last two ministers for emergency are not Kazakhs. But in fact, to have prospects for the state. service can be a Papuan, but you need to be in the edging at the top.
      1. Egoza
        Egoza 12 May 2013 10: 50 New
        11
        Quote: Canep
        In order to have prospects in the civil service, you need to know the Kazakh, the Russians are really tense here.

        This is actually correct. You live with the people, you work in the civil service, you need to know the language of the people. This is respect for the people, for the country where you live, and facilitates communication with the population. And most importantly, it closes its mouth to all those who claim that "the Russians are arrogant, they don’t even want to learn the language, put themselves above the Kazakhs ..." the invaders, in a word.
        Nazarbayeva has always respected and this article looks strange. However, one must judge by deeds, not by words. Sometimes they say one thing in politics, but do it their own way. So time will tell.
        1. vladsolo56
          vladsolo56 12 May 2013 12: 24 New
          +3
          As for the language, I can say. I don’t know how it is now, but when my son was in school they taught the Kazakh language from the first grade, so even the children from Kazakh families, where he is constantly spoken, did not really know it. There were no teachers, and the program was so-so. In Ust-Kamenogorsk, where we lived, the number of Kazakhs was no more than 10%. Because everywhere in communication was Russian. So how many do not teach, if there is no daily communication, there will be no sense. And it is not the fault of the Russians that they do not know the state language. By the way, in different regions of Kazakhstan, the language was not exactly the same. And modern Kazakh, this is not the one they spoke many years ago.
        2. Vasilenko Vladimir
          Vasilenko Vladimir 13 May 2013 10: 09 New
          -4
          Kazakhs in the Kazakh SSR accounted for 18% as you come up with what language they will speak in such a republic
          1. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 12: 22 New
            +5
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            Kazakhs in the Kazakh SSR accounted for 18% as you come up with what language they will speak in such a republic

            Is this your census year data, Little Johnny? already lifted up his endless lies and distortion.
            1. Vasilenko Vladimir
              Vasilenko Vladimir 23 May 2013 13: 05 New
              -5
              I have these data from the Central Control Commission, they have never been officially announced, since they questioned the expediency of the republic itself

              not only drink tea with the generals
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 13: 36 New
                +2
                Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
                I have these data from the Central Control Commission, officially they have never been announced

                this is called frank pzdzh.
                if such staggering numbers existed, then the Kazakhs would definitely use them for propaganda purposes under various sauces. but there is no such figure and never has been, even after the famine of the 30s. not a single notorious Kazakh nationalist speculating on the topic of "Russian occupation" has thought of lying to such numbers. so once again you fell for balabolstvo. I won’t be surprised that in childhood you were beaten in the yard by Kazakh boys. that's why you have hatred for the Kazakhs.
                where you snooze there are psychologists? how much their services cost, write to me, maybe I will pay you. and you will benefit, and the Kazakhs will no longer have to fend off your writings.
          2. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 12: 23 New
            +1
            Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
            Kazakhs in the Kazakh SSR accounted for 18% as you come up with what language they will speak in such a republic

            Is this your census year data, Little Johnny? already lifted up his endless lies and distortion.
      2. kuz363
        kuz363 10 July 2017 22: 04 New
        0
        Actually, this is the way it should be in civilized countries. For example, in Belgium, in order to obtain citizenship, even having the birth certificate there, you need to know one of the official languages ​​- Flemish, French, German. So if you want to be the boss in Kazakhstan, learn Kazakh. Nothing wrong
    3. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 12 May 2013 20: 24 New
      -4
      Quote: stranik72
      because of this, he was not invited to a Bialowieza conspiracy

      that's really funny
  • Tom230
    Tom230 12 May 2013 09: 04 New
    16
    The article is complete nonsense. In vain even read. Only spoiled my mood in the morning. I will not even discuss this topic.
  • Andrey KZ
    Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 09: 18 New
    21
    It is alarming that recently there have been many articles with a negative connotation regarding Kazakhstan. Public opinion is being formed that is favorable to someone. We have to admit that Mrs. Clinton, who is Hilary, keeps her promise. One thing is good if the “liberal” media and “experts” barked , then we are on the right path, comrades. It can not but rejoice almost complete unanimity of visitors to the site. Greetings to all! hi
  • Circle
    Circle 12 May 2013 09: 24 New
    17
    The article is a provocation on emotions. And a dirty provocation. Ask what Nazarbayev did during these August days and in the near future in 1991.

    The main and consistent initiator of the Customs Union was suddenly a destroyer. The USSR was destroyed by Yeltsin, Kravchuk and Shushkevich with anti-state connivance Gorbachev. With the violation of all conceivable and inconceivable legal and human laws, including the conduct (for some reason by Gorbachev) of the results of an all-union referendum in the spring of 1991 with the only question: should the USSR be preserved. A large country responded positively.

    And therefore, the first president of the USSR ex officio had to take all measures to fulfill the will of the people. And do not go on about the three swollen senility. That's who the "destroyers of the USSR". And Russia, as one of the coolest republics of the Union, is simply must It was in favor of its preservation and strengthening, and not of decay. Yeltsin is due personal disagreement with Gorbachev put the future of the state at stake in the game. What all came of this to the delight of the "progressive West" we all now not only see. But survived "all the charms" of collective betrayal. So do not deceive the youth and themselves.

    All people have their own shortcomings, including Nazarbayev. However, one does not need to ascribe to a person what he did not do. Moreover - turn upside down and hang tags. Bold minus the article.
    1. avt
      avt 12 May 2013 09: 52 New
      +3
      Quote: Circle
      The article is a provocation on emotions. And a dirty provocation. Ask what Nazarbayev did during these August days and in the near future in 1991.

      The fact that the article is pro-American and provocative agrees completely, with clean water, or rather dirty, propaganda. So, it is slightly tinted for analytics. It seems that the consciousness of people is loosened, the consciousness is prepared for certain actions, even the vehicle is like a bone in the throat, not to mention greater integration, but propaganda lays on fertile soil, the problem is painful and it will not be much to aggravate its work.
      Quote: ymNIK1970
      We will see the result in 2014.

      It is possible. But the date must be taken as a semantic code, as the name of the stock, but the meaning is correct good
  • ymNIK1970
    ymNIK1970 12 May 2013 09: 30 New
    +2
    The article is correct. Pure Bandera. We will see the result in 2014.
    1. Semurg
      Semurg 12 May 2013 10: 42 New
      11
      Quote: ymNIK1970
      The article is correct. Pure Bandera. We will see the result in 2014.

      We were waiting for 12g and the end of the world, did not come. We are waiting for 14 g and the end of the world, it will not come. I’m tired of waiting for either the end of the world or the bright future. I think the union will be built, I hope it will bring more pluses than minuses. Well, at least on this branch did not fall for provocative article (a.kurtov often flashes with a negative about Kazakhstan and Nazarbayev, probably some personal insults?
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 13: 19 New
        +5
        Azhdar Kurtov is a well-known Russian political scientist who from the beginning of the 90s began to predict the collapse and aggravation of interethnic relations in Kazakhstan. Since the forecast does not come true, it simply pushes back the date of the hour “X” every year. If Kurtov says anything good about Kazakhstan, the sky will fall to the ground in surprise.
    2. smile
      smile 12 May 2013 13: 37 New
      0
      ymNIK1970
      Not true. Comparing with Bandera is simply unreasonable and completely unreasonable ... and 14 years old ... I'm afraid to wait to understand what we will have to take much longer ...
  • kind
    kind 12 May 2013 10: 14 New
    +7
    Quote: knn54
    Destroyer of the USSR Nazarbayev will never become a creator.
    So that's who the Union destroyed. And we EBN AND MSG (Kravchuk, Shushkevich) are spread rot, it turns out badly.
    Not tired of the extreme look?
    V. Ushakov: ... of the twelve regions that were illegally transferred to Kazakhstan ...
    15 volosts of the Omsk district and Akmola, Atbasar, Kokchetav and Petropavlovsk districts of the Omsk province in 1921 were transferred to Kazakhstan (the Kyrgyz Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic). Kalinin, not Nikita.

    Let us recall the illegal seizure of the lands of the Siberian Khanate by Yermak.
    1. avt
      avt 12 May 2013 10: 58 New
      +3
      Quote: Good
      Let us recall the illegal seizure of the lands of the Siberian Khanate by Yermak.

      request But he did not capture anything. Kuchum, having heard about an unsuccessful company in Livonia, refused to collect and send tribute to Moscow, sending a corresponding message to Van, for some reason called by the historians of Grozny, although such a nickname was given to Ivan IIIm. Well, since there were no free troops, the tsar, for great privileges in trade, instructed the Stroganovs to sort out the issue. They then gathered PMCs from the Cossacks under the leadership of Ermak to restore constitutional order. This confirms the rather calm behavior of the local population in relation to the Cossacks. Well, then the king sent the regular parts.
  • smsk
    smsk 12 May 2013 10: 52 New
    11
    V. Ushakov

    The whole problem is not in the banana republics, as you cannot understand. The whole point is the weakness of Russia itself. You yourself in Russia have been betrayed by your rulers, not to mention Russians abroad. Russia does not affect anything in the world, cannot declare in full voice about its interests. What prevents you from kicking all the gaster back?
    I sincerely wish Russia to be strong in this world, so that all countries respect and fear it, so that no Qatari bastard could even think with impunity to poke the Russian ambassador face on the asphalt. Then there will be respect (fear) for Russians in the world.
    1. avt
      avt 12 May 2013 11: 25 New
      +3
      Quote: smsk
      What prevents you from kicking all the gaster back?

      Only Marxism interferes. laughing For it is said that there is no such crime that the capitalist will not commit with 300% profit. request Confirmation is the latest prohibition of GDP for Gaster to work as sellers and cashiers - only having Russian citizenship. For the year, almost 90% of Gaster’s online campaigns, request business - nothing personal. No sick leave, labor unions, vacations, well, etc. In general, there is no Labor Code and a minimum of white salary with the corresponding tax deductions.
    2. nemec55
      nemec55 12 May 2013 19: 22 New
      +3
      VOOOOOOOOT golden words. You are a huge plus.
  • Grishka100watt
    Grishka100watt 12 May 2013 11: 15 New
    11
    This article is a provocation.
  • RUS
    RUS 12 May 2013 11: 25 New
    +6
    As long as our government does not listen, respect and protect the interests of Russians in Russia, we can not talk about other countries. This is to ask what else is better for the Russian in Grozny or Alma-Ata, Makhachkala or Bishkek, Nalchik or Dushanbe, and in the south of Stavropol what is better?
    1. V. Ushakov
      V. Ushakov 12 May 2013 13: 20 New
      -4
      Yes, nowhere is better. None of the above locations. How to separate - at once became a complete scum. And the further, the more this abomination will increase. It can only be held back by Russia's military reinforcement - by a couple of orders of magnitude. Then they will quiet down: it is no good to make noise when the strong one is nearby.
    2. nemec55
      nemec55 12 May 2013 19: 30 New
      +2
      It won’t be, the divide is not up to the citizens
  • dc120mm
    dc120mm 12 May 2013 11: 48 New
    -3
    Very interesting stats, carefully read.
  • Barvetum
    Barvetum 12 May 2013 13: 37 New
    +6
    from the very beginning of the article I realized that the article is complete nonsense. Where did you come up with this? What is the way out of the customs union? What is the eradication of Russians? What are you talking about? Even if we take the southern regions (where I come from), there are Russians there, but I don’t say anything about the northern regions, there the ratio of Kazakhs and Russians is about 60-70 at 40-30. And I am glad, for readers, that they did not fall for this provocation, and keep in mind that before you write such articles, study the history.
  • Galinanp
    Galinanp 12 May 2013 13: 49 New
    +7
    The article is clearly from a series of State Department orders. The Clintons some time ago voiced the attitude of the Anglo-Saxons towards the integration of Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan and other republics of the USSR in the future, that they (the Anglo-Saxons) would not allow this. The media in the entire post-Soviet space in their hands, various corrupt political scientists, experts, etc. So such stuffing should be treated as an element of information warfare.
  • Semyon Albertovich
    Semyon Albertovich 12 May 2013 14: 55 New
    -7
    The main thing is as if Nazarbayev did not outwit himself.
  • aviamed90
    aviamed90 12 May 2013 15: 10 New
    +2
    The article is somehow awkward. Neither this nor that.
    Never been to Kazakhstan. The only thing that is familiar is the Russian exodus from the country. There really is a problem with that. Faced this by accident.

    I had a good friend from there (we studied together at a military academy). I must say that the Kazakhs at that time (1996-1999) studied at our military academies for gold. They studied in Russian groups, had access to the whole secret, but naturally did not go to dresses and parades. All this (the educational process, everyday life) was controlled by the military attache of the embassy. Well, then, at one fine moment, my friend says - and why, they say, let's join our army! I was stunned! I’m Russian, and I have Russian citizenship. And he skillfully explains to me that this is not prohibited by the laws of the Russian Federation and is possible under the CIS treaties. Broke for a long time. He promised the "colonel", an apartment, a decent denyuzhku.
    And then he nevertheless admitted to me - there are not enough qualified officers for technical and staff posts, especially pilots. And this happens not only in the army, but also in all sectors of the economy, in schools, etc. The reason is simple - the Russians are leaving in droves. He modestly kept silent about the reasons for the departure of the Russians. And it’s not difficult to guess for yourself.
    And the task of recruiting came from the embassy.
    First, it turns out that the Russians pointed to the door, and then began to lure, when there was no one to work.
    1. Ram chandra
      Ram chandra 13 May 2013 13: 56 New
      +1
      Well, that’s why we love Russians.
  • d.gksueyjd
    d.gksueyjd 12 May 2013 18: 54 New
    10
    The article is untrue - the Kazakh SSR was the last to leave the USSR, and this is the fault of three alcoholics, by name: Yeltsin, Kravchuk, Shushkevich! By the way, Yeltsin was awarded the highest Russian order for this!
  • mr.rafael-r
    mr.rafael-r 12 May 2013 20: 32 New
    -2
    For those who have left KZ (such as I), there is nothing new in the article, and unfortunately this is true. In the republic there is even a word used by the government itself - MULTI-VECTORITY: on the one hand, we are with the Russian Federation, and on the other with the Islamic world, but we listen to the United States and work with China))). And there is oppression, only everything is cleverly done - no one cuts or kicks anyone, they just create conditions when they give up.
    And I will answer the gentlemen of the KZ patriots right away to work further for the benefit of no desire, three generations of ancestors built and developed and turned out to be invaders.
    Kazakh Fascism in KZ is growing. Go to sites like Azatyk.
    1. Andrey KZ
      Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 20: 51 New
      10
      Mr. Rafael, the “azattyk” is something like “swamp” in Russia and no one listens to them in Russia. Well, you never need to lower your hands, this is not our way, not Russian!
    2. Alibekulu
      Alibekulu 12 May 2013 20: 52 New
      +8
      Quote: mr.rafael-r
      For those who left KZ (such as I), there is nothing new in the article, and unfortunately this is true.
      True, not all ..
      MULTI-VECTORITY: on the one hand, we are with the Russian Federation, and on the other, with the Islamic world, but we listen to the United States and work with China)))
      And why can’t we cooperate with the Islamic world, the USA and China ?? But the Russian Federation does not cooperate ?! repeat Listen, we don’t tell you "..with whom not to sleep, and with whom to be friends .."
      . And there is oppression, only everything is cleverly done - no one cuts or kicks anyone, they just create conditions when they give up.
      Hmm, Kazakhs need to solve all your problems for you request - put food in your mouth, put to bed .. dance for the mood ?!
      And I will answer the gentlemen of the KZ patriots immediately to work further for the benefit there is no desire
      It’s like, did you plow for the good of Kazakhstan, and not for yourself and your family ?? repeat There is no desire do not work, just do not say that you worked only for the good of Kazakhstan - you are our benefactor
      Kazakh Fascism in the KZ
      Tell where in Russia fascism is growing ?? And not on sites, but on the streets of Russian cities ..
      1. Andrey KZ
        Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 20: 59 New
        +5
        Quote: mr.rafael-r
        no one cuts or kicks anyone
        Alibek, progress is as if on the face. hi
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 12 May 2013 23: 30 New
          +9
          Andrey in this progress thanks first of all it is necessary to tell you drinks , as well as Sergei, Eugene, Cyril and other Russian Kazakhstanis ..
          Earlier, in the VO forums on topics related to Kazakhstan, our "former" ones usually spoke and they created and are creating a "public opinion" in Russia, about the fact that we almost live eating Russians .. And, to be honest, it hurt that that none of our Russian fellow citizens will express their objective, “unblocked” opinion about the interethnic and interethnic situation, as they say firsthand .. and not about the speculations spread by our “former” .. (Although, of course, they have their own , often the "bitter" truth) .. In our "nicks" with the Russians, the facts we cite Odes were not taken into account because, objectively, they (our arguments and facts) in their eyes are subjective .. And you know Andrew is very hurt sad I thought ... well, really, out of a large number of Russian Kazakhstanis, there will not be at least one who speaks with a different opinion, different from these - in frankly "black tones" .. (Caravan - Eugene .. I took it for the Kazakh wink)
          And in the discussion of the topic “Is it necessary to restrain the process of Russian exodus from Central Asian countries: opinions” it was very surprising and encouraging that our Russian fellow citizens were found and not a little .. And they were able to consolidate a rebuff to the so-called “defenders of the humiliated and oppressed Russians” ..
          And for this, all of you Kazakhs to us from all of us to “VO” (I hope ours will not be angry with me for exceeding authority) lol :

          Ylken RAKHMET OTANDASTAR hi
        2. mr.rafael-r
          mr.rafael-r 13 May 2013 13: 37 New
          -1
          Andrey You are an idealist. My name and surname and patronymic are not Russian at all. And it so happened that people of non-Russian nationality said a lot of friendly words to me a lot of "good" words about Russians and Russia. And this is not to be noticed by some Natsiks, but by sight of ordinary people. An example of this is the son of Alibek.
          Quote: Alibekulu
          . And there is oppression, only everything is cleverly done - no one cuts or kicks anyone, they just create conditions when they give up. Hmm, Kazakhs, that you need to solve all your problems for you - put food in your mouth, put to bed .. dance for the mood ?!
          And I will answer the gentlemen of the KZ patriots right away to work further for the good there is no desire. Is that the type you plowed for the good of Kazakhstan, and not for yourself and your family ?? There is no desire do not work, just do not say that you worked only for the good of Kazakhstan - you are our benefactor


          You see how hurt it is for the living. And he himself knows that I'm right wink And about the taxes that I (like everything else) paid probably were not the state treasury.
          Alibek’s son, tell me what happened to the Azerbaijanis from NovoUzensk (Zhana Ozen) - some of them were cut out and left. How many Russians are left in Chimkent? Kustonay, Karaganda, Petropavlovsk, Pavlodar, Ust-Kaman are not Kazakh for another 50%, but this is not for long.


          Andrew, God forbid, that I was wrong. But after 5-7 years, you will remember this conversation. I am sure that you will remember in the Russian Federation.
      2. mr.rafael-r
        mr.rafael-r 13 May 2013 13: 58 New
        -2
        The flag is good, and most importantly correct. Learn Chinese, it will be useful to you. Benefactor and hard worker. laughing
        SU you probably did not find.
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 13 May 2013 16: 17 New
          +4
          Quote: mr.rafael-r
          The flag is good, and most importantly correct.

          What no longer to get to the bottom ?? Just what about the color of the flag ?! laughing
          You still get to Winnie the Pooh on my profile picture fellow
          Learn Chinese, it will come in handy
          Any foreign language will come in handy, be it Chinese or English ... I would be very happy if I knew Chinese ..
          Benefactor and hard worker.
          Interesting, and where did I call myself that? request I did not position myself as a benefactor or a hard worker .. Actually, it was you who flaunted that:
          there is no desire to work further for the benefit, three generations of ancestors built and developed ...
    3. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 23 May 2013 13: 02 New
      +3
      Radio Azattyk is Radio Liberty (just under the Kazakh name, but look at the icon carefully if you don’t know the translation of the word). To pass off this American resource as the opinion of the Kazakhs is like calling Brzezinski the mouthpiece of the Kremlin.
      On the Azattyk website, not one of my comments has ever passed moderation. And I’m sure that all the comments there are employees of the Freedom-Azattyk website themselves and write. Amer is not just grandmothers pay them. By the way, this is the only resource where adherents of radical Islam choke. Wahhabis and the American media in Kazakhstan are tied with strong friendly ties.

      In general, frankly, I doubt that Kazakhstan was of any use to you. Zaletny you. Just a guest worker. And you didn’t work for free. Have you been paid extra? Write a complaint. Calculated? What are the claims against Kazakhstan-employer?

      Here, in Andrew, the owner and the citizen are felt. It doesn’t matter if he is Russian or Korean. He is a full-fledged part of this country with all rights and obligations. And you lived as a guest worker and having left, you remained just a guest worker. I do not feel any regret from your departure. The more such alarmists, provocateurs, chauvinists (although, of course, you all imagine yourself to be the first "internationalists") and outright idlers leave, the better for Kazakhstanis of all nationalities. How many “Russian-speaking” people left Kazakhstan for Russia? A half million like? At least someone gave something to a new homeland? Give one last name at least. Any Kazakh will name a bunch of Russian Kazakhstanis that he is proud of. But does anyone know at least one surname of an ex-Kazakhstani who left after 1991, whom Russia or Kazakhstan would be proud of (or even just know)? Who have we “lost”? Take offense, do not be offended, but I have a low opinion of all our "refugees." For 20 years, none of them achieved anything in Russia. And this is in the absence of "Kazakh oppressors and oppressors"! What are you doing here, comrades, then in Kazakhstan you have done something good besides producing saliva? Trite losers who did not realize themselves in Kazakhstan and blamed the Kazakhs and signs on the streets for this. And now, even in Russia, they were predictably losers, and without exception. The usual gray mass at best, unable to give birth to any outstanding representative for Russia. Who's guilty? "Kazakh nationalists", of course ... It’s how they drove you into the KZ that you still cannot straighten your shoulders in Russia.

      If any Russian made a real contribution to the development of Soviet or modern Kazakhstan, then hell will give up what his hands and the hands of his fathers touched. A normal person will not give up what was paid for with sweat and blood. And if someone wants to “push” him and take something personal, then he will clench his hands and put the “oppressor” in its place. If I come to your house and say: “Get out of here, this is my apartment now”, you’ll be indignant and beat me with beat, because it’s your apartment. In the same way, a normal Russian Kazakhstani will send the one who tries to “infringe” him. And he will be right. And the Kazakhs will fully support him. And let the prokhendei from the number of “infringed ones” fail anywhere, there’s nothing for us to spoil the gene pool with plain blood. I would prefer my children to marry a strong adequate bold working Russian than a weak, weak-willed whiners from among my nationality.
  • Alibekulu
    Alibekulu 12 May 2013 21: 11 New
    +7
    The Russians will leave Kazakhstan and this is an objective reality .. And, this makes me a little sad. sad Himself grew up in a multilingual and multi-ethnic environment (mainly Russian) .. And in the future it will shrink like shagreen skin .. And there are a lot of both objective and biased factors ..
    There is Kazakh nationalism, but there is also Russian nationalism .. And it will always be so. And no need to raise a tantrum about this .. In each country they (nationalists) are and usually they are a minority ..
    And moreover, as a rule, they are marginalized .. and seek to compensate for their personal failures in nationalism ..
    The death of the Russian population occurs for many reasons, and nationalism on this scale is far from in the first place ..
    1. Andrey KZ
      Andrey KZ 12 May 2013 21: 26 New
      +5
      Alibek, where does such pessimism come from? Do you know something that I don’t know? I don’t give a damn about Natsik, I don’t notice them and most of them don’t notice, they will degenerate like a weak link.
      1. Egoza
        Egoza 12 May 2013 22: 07 New
        +9
        Quote: Andrew KZ
        I don’t notice them, I don’t notice them and most of them don’t notice, they will degenerate as a weak link.

        do not expect! Ukraine is an example of this! Natsik need to pay attention and crush right away! Until they have grown!
      2. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 13 May 2013 20: 48 New
        +6
        Quote: Andrew KZ
        Alibek, where such pessimism comes from

        Andrey, yes there is a reason ..
        In 2011, exactly during the events in Jean-Ozen, there was an extremely unpleasant situation in Kostanay ..
        I was not in Kazakhstan then, I was in Kazan .. And, upon arrival, my brother told me .. so I bought it for that and sell it .. maybe all the rumors and lies .. I’ll tell you in a slightly hyperbolic syllable ..
        In general, at that time, the infamous events in Jean-Ozen, in Kostanay, the bus burned out (or did not burn out) .. Burned out, but oh well, where it doesn’t happen - interesting to continue ..
        Rumors began to circulate around the city at the speed of lightning that the Kazakh Natsik had done it and that the Kazakhs would begin to slaughter the Russians ... That night many could not sleep, they were waiting for them to be slaughtered ..
        You know, it would be funny if it weren’t so sad ..
        I, of course, understand everything, but it was extremely unpleasant that our Russians really thought that the Kazakhs would organize pogroms .. It hurts most of all what they thought about us ..
        It seems that we live together in one country, we go to each other's houses, we watch football together - we drink beer, but they think of us like that ..
        When I found out about this, I asked my friend about this situation .. And also my own, how to call her .. mentors, or something (she is to me, like a second mother ..) ..
        Well, they hesitated, did not know what to say ...
        But, by their reaction and their eyes, it was clear that then they really believed in IT .. stop
        Something like that..
        P.S. Hmm, I'm a pessimist in life, but life ..
        Life makes you be optimistic good
    2. mr.rafael-r
      mr.rafael-r 13 May 2013 14: 15 New
      -3
      Quote: Alibekulu
      The death of the Russian population occurs for many reasons, and nationalism on this scale is far from in the first place ..

      Yah. repeat In the books on the new history of Kazakhstan there are no words about the colonization of KZ by Russians? And the right to apply in Russian to state bodies is not taken away? And the cities built for the most part are not renamed Russian? Not only that, in the State Institution and other things without Kazakh knowledge they no longer take it, so gentlemen of the parliament (majors winked ) a couple of times they suggested introducing a compulsory knowledge item for kazyaz and LLP. If this is not nationalism, then what is it.
      1. Alibekulu
        Alibekulu 13 May 2013 17: 40 New
        +4
        Quote: mr.rafael-r
        In the books on the new history of Kazakhstan there are no words about the colonization of KZ by Russians?

        Do not confuse negative wise guy ... I won’t say offhand, but in my opinion it talks about the colonial policy of the Russian empire ..
        Do not like "words about colonization .. In books on the new history of Kazakhstan .."
        Well good Now i am you I will give words about colonization from Russian books and from the lips of Russian historians. For example, the famous researcher of Siberia - Yadrintsev Nikolay Mikhailovich will come down ?! repeat (I note not Kazakh! request ) The author of the sensational book in its time, with an interesting title for you "Siberia as a colony".. True, the sonorous name ??!
        Read at your leisure before you make a complaint .. Here on the "IN", they usually write like this: "Learn the materiel mr.rafael-r - learn materiel mr.rafael-r .

        http://elib.tomsk.ru/elib/data/2010/2010-0020/00006.png
        P.S. I advise sometimes .. although I would like to pick up books from time to time .. very useful smile
        1. Alibekulu
          Alibekulu 13 May 2013 18: 03 New
          +1
          Here is another photo of the contents of the chapters of the book .. True interesting names wink : "V. Colonization of Siberia and modern resettlement.", "Siberia as a product of colonization", "Periods of official colonization, industrial, commercial and agricultural colonization", "Setting the colonization and places chosen by the people", "The role of Siberia in the future colonization .. .
          More opinions of Russian or Russian historians about colonization needed ?? lol

          1. Lopatov
            Lopatov 13 May 2013 18: 10 New
            -6
            Have you read the book itself? It would be better for you to delete these posts. In order not to give arguments to opponents in a dispute.
            1. Alibekulu
              Alibekulu 13 May 2013 20: 10 New
              +3
              Quote: Spade
              It would be better for you to delete these posts.

              Here's what’s interesting to me .. why don’t you write them and offer them ??
              In the end, my comments are just answers to the attacks of my opponents.
              That is, if they did not write, then I would be silent .. If they delete theirs, then I also agree to do it without problems .. Only, there is a moment of technical character .. how to actually delete ?!
              In order not to give arguments to opponents in a dispute.

              So damn, do you think they will stop ?!
              1. Lopatov
                Lopatov 13 May 2013 20: 55 New
                -3
                They will not stop. Read what the author means by "colonization", otherwise you just looked at the cover and the content. They will not leave stone upon stone from your argument.
                1. Alibekulu
                  Alibekulu 13 May 2013 21: 37 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Spade
                  They will not stop.

                  Well, but why are you so worried about me? ..
                  I repeat, why don’t they write to them ?!
                  Quote: Spade
                  They will not leave stone upon stone from your argument.

                  Well, okay .. they won’t leave, they won’t leave ...
                  1. Lopatov
                    Lopatov 13 May 2013 21: 42 New
                    0
                    Quote: Alibekulu
                    I repeat, why don’t they write to them ?!

                    About what? The fact that "colonization" in Russian meant all development of territories while protecting the rights of the local population? This is so everyone knows. Including you. But you need to justify Nazyrbaev’s statements.
                    1. Alibekulu
                      Alibekulu 13 May 2013 22: 40 New
                      +6
                      Quote: Spade
                      About what? The fact that "colonization" in Russian meant all development of territories while protecting the rights of the local population?

                      Nda sad And you will turn out of these ... "Big White Gaspadin" mean ..
                      This is so everyone knows. Including you.

                      You are right, I and the other Kazakhs know, but they know about the negative side of this process .. And if you are really interested, look at the profile Marek Rozny.. everything in his comments is well-reasoned and thorough, with links and so on. etc. not like mine negative the attitude of the Kazakhs on all problematic issues is given .. Read, it will be interesting to you .. True, it often brings it, but this is the cost of a hot and honest disposition .. Interestingly, it has not been on the site for a long time .. request By the way, if he was, I would not have climbed into this controversy at all .. Not that level recourse
                      Quote: Spade
                      But you need to justify Nazyrbaev’s statements
                      What a fright I, and we Kazakhs should justify it fool We generally agree with him!?! If you really need a detailed comment - contact Becku.. I think, AGAI, everything will explain to you in detail and in detail yes Much better than me .. So contact ..
                      1. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 12: 45 New
                        +5
                        Hello! No, they didn’t ban) It’s just a forum forum, but you also need to earn money, it wasn’t up to the site)
                        And as for the "level", I do not at all consider that your level is lower than mine, your head is cooking normally, and there are more than enough healthy thoughts. Yes, and other Kazakhstanis here are rampant, who are able to adequately and informedly respond.
                        It is especially pleasing that most of our Russian Kazakhstanis react sensibly to such articles and the fabrications of some "refugees."
                      2. Alibekulu
                        Alibekulu 25 May 2013 15: 11 New
                        +7
                        Greetings .. Very glad. We always read your comments with interest. Very informative and informative ..
                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        Kazakhstanis here are a shaft who are able to adequately and informedly respond.
                        Hmm, even somehow takes pride in ours .. As a rule, they write competently and competently express their opinion ..
                        happy that most of our Russian Kazakhstanis react sensibly
                        I join .. hi
                      3. Yarbay
                        Yarbay 25 May 2013 15: 21 New
                        +4
                        Quote: Alibekulu
                        Greetings .. Very glad. We always read your comments with interest. Very informative and informative ..

                        I support !!!!!!!!!!
                      4. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 25 May 2013 16: 42 New
                        0
                        Rahmet. By the way, a little off topic, but in an article on the Kengerlin cavalry, I asked about who the rulers were from among the Azerbaijanis? Apparently there simply no one has yet seen. An interesting principle is the election of power. If everything is clear with us - from the Chingizid Sultans in the elections by influential people from the people, then how did you manage this matter? After all, Azerbaijanis have a unique situation - a mixture of Turkic realities and local Caucasian. Plus, contact with the Turks and Persians, who had their own control mechanisms.
  • lecturer
    lecturer 13 May 2013 11: 07 New
    +5
    I am proud for US, for RUSSIAN!
    For the fact that they do not hide "their" mistakes, i.e. "government" or "Yeltsin" - and, accept them as theirs!
    YES, read, and almost no one attributed to "someone"!
    Here is the RUSSIAN SPIRIT, here it smells of Russia !!!
    P / S Well, but the article (?) ... so, the hostile voice is everywhere !!! They are paid for "it."
  • Ram chandra
    Ram chandra 13 May 2013 14: 02 New
    +9
    Custom-made article is nonsense. Pleased komenty. Everything is good. Russians in Kazakhstan / Kazakhstan the road is open. If you are smart, strong, brave, and indeed - you are welcome! No need to divide people according to nationality - you need to divide people according to their abilities. And the Kazakhs need to strive to be smarter, stronger - well, you understand. And not to drive away those who are smarter, more capable of them - and this, as I see it, is the main problem of the Nazis. They just realize that weaker.
  • serpentine fist
    serpentine fist 13 May 2013 20: 31 New
    +6
    Nurek got to you too !!! and it pleases, it means you did everything right, although all the laurels of the integrator now go to Putin.
  • Alibekulu
    Alibekulu 15 May 2013 11: 55 New
    +4
    Summarizing ..
    Quote: Spade
    But you need to justify Nazyrbaev’s statements
    And why, you yourself perfectly answered your own question ..
    Quote: Spade
    "colonization" in Russian meant all development of the territories while protecting the rights of the local population?
    those. according to your quote (which I quoted above), Nazarbayev’s speech must be understood in Lopatov’s way: “After the last Kazakh khan was killed in 1861, every development of the territories while protecting the rights of the local population Russian Empire, then the Soviet Union. "
  • Nomad
    Nomad 27 May 2013 11: 32 New
    +3
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    it’s you who steamed it; it’s filled in unfinished, at each faculty there was a group in which the instruction was in the Kazakh language, you weren’t in the Kazakh Soviet Socialist Republic, therefore, sit quietly and don’t stand out for culture, he didn’t know you didn’t know what was and what wasn’t. aul

    Well, finally, Vasilenko ceased to pretend to be an intellectual and showed everyone his true cattle essence. Not a single fact, only a piglet screeching, insulting and inventing a sick consciousness.
  • Nomad
    Nomad 27 May 2013 11: 41 New
    +2
    Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir
    my opponent stated that there was NO education in the Kazakh language, that the culture was in the pen, I argue that this is a blatant FALSE

    Oops! Vasilenko, it turns out, is also a specialist in Kazakh culture!
  • Nomad
    Nomad 27 May 2013 11: 46 New
    +3
    Quote: Alibekulu
    Andrey in this progress thanks first of all it is necessary to tell you, as well as Sergey, Eugene, Cyril and other Russian Kazakhstanis ..

    Join us!
  • Nomad
    Nomad 27 May 2013 11: 53 New
    +2
    "you zaparit it will fill in the unfinished, at each faculty there was a group in which the instruction was in the Kazakh language, you weren’t in the Kazakh SSR, therefore, sit quietly and don’t stand out culture, he didn’t know you don’t know what was and what wasn’t.
    sheep aul "
    Well, finally, Vasilenko stopped building himself as an intellectual and showed everyone his true bydlyasche essence. Not a single fact, only a piglet screeching, insulting and inventing a sick fashizoid consciousness. By the way, his profile picture is suitable, I’ll now call him Rabid Dog Vasilenko. )))
  • Xenial
    Xenial 21 June 2013 15: 21 New
    0
    The title, of course, is loud, but, like most of the information in the article, empty speculation.

    My Almaty family is almost in the fourth generation. But over the past years, from all sides it has been hinted that you are not in your place, not in your land. There are fewer and fewer Russians in high positions. If there are a sufficient number of Russian children in state schools, then in elite they can already be counted on the fingers.

    The fact that the fewer Russians, the better, is sometimes quite well seen.
  • osoboye_mneniye
    osoboye_mneniye 5 May 2017 18: 00 New
    0
    terrible article. All in a bunch. And in the end, without any reason, Nazarbayev was accused of all problems.
    About the outcome of the Russians, the question was turned upside down. The Russians began to be oppressed, but not because the authorities wanted it, but because the Kazakhs shoved their eagles to the helm everywhere. In any state, the helm should have a titular nation. There was an excess in Kazakhstan with this, but no more than in other post-Soviet states.
    Moreover, Kazakhstan is, along with Belarus, the only state where wars and coups were avoided.
    Apparently this gnaws at the “partners”, since such articles appear.
  • Vasilenko Vladimir
    Vasilenko Vladimir 15 May 2017 13: 05 New
    0
    Duisenbay Bankankulov,
    Vladimir can you remember 1986, when the hunchback appointed Kolbin to the post of first secretary of the CPSU of Kazakhstan, or is this also a myth ???

    what is this for?
    By the way, the question immediately is what was the concern of non-party Kazakhs before?
    1. Duisenbay Bankankulov
      Duisenbay Bankankulov 16 May 2017 05: 25 New
      0
      Vladimir, in the history of Kazakhstan during the reign of the Communists there were such persons as Golovoschekin and Mirzoyan, well, plus kolbin. Well, you had to learn a little history at school so as not to ask stupid questions ....
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 16 May 2017 10: 07 New
        0
        clear knowledge of zero Pontus per 100
        you can answer the question what relation do the non-party have to the party "inter-party" ?!
        further, what does the Goloshchekin have to do with it, and what does it have to do with colbin? !!!
        minus you for not knowing completely
  • kuz363
    kuz363 10 July 2017 21: 10 New
    +1
    Complete nonsense of the author and complete speculation.
    The locomotive of the Eurasian Union was just Nazarbayev. And remember which republic was the last to leave the USSR in 1991. That's right, Kazakhstan.
    There is no mass exodus of Russians now. Yes, in the 90s a lot of people left, but not only Russians, but also Germans, Turks, Ukrainians .... They mainly went to their historical homelands. After all, many employees of defense enterprises had apartments reserved, and in order not to lose them due to the collapse of the USSR, they had to return. And in recent years, the annual outflow is in the range of 30-35 thousand. Most of course in Russia, often due to continued studies of children or support from parents. As for the Cossacks, their activities were promptly suppressed in Uralsk. Otherwise, it would have happened like in Chechnya. But Cossack emissaries from Russia came to them for leadership and each state should worry about its security.
  • 1536
    1536 22 July 2017 10: 47 New
    +1
    First of all, it is necessary for the Russian leadership to revise its foreign and domestic policy, and not to blame it on its sane. So far, no real actions have been taken beyond declarative statements. Moreover, some ugly monster with a non-Russian surname is running around the country, shouting about some kind of corruption, and that look will bring crowds of people dissatisfied with everything and everyone to the streets of the cities, start a “revolution”. This follows from the analysis of the media. Moreover, foreign media support this. The last straw will probably be the "disclosure" of corrupt officials at a cheese factory that is of "poor quality" compared to foreign counterparts, and taxi drivers don’t eat it, complain ...
    And how do you order the same Kazakhs to all this? Nobody knows what will happen tomorrow? What will happen in 2018, and in 2024? Nobody knows. The Americans are so insolent that they are ready to abduct Russian citizens directly from the Lubyanka metro station in the Moscow metro. And so on.
    That's all sane neighbors and think it is better to maintain close ties with the Americans or the Chinese than with people whose right hand does not know what the left hand is doing, who, in addition to everything else, are completely defenseless, or are playing a double game. An unenviable prospect. And all because of some kind of stupid little picture on TV screens, understatement in life, lack of development plans, goals, prospects, betting on the wrong people. That is, simply, because of a small mind, as it turns out in practice.
  • Vladimir K
    Vladimir K 26 August 2017 09: 09 New
    0
    Who needs this Eurasian Union is a consequence not of the imperative of the time, but of the political situation. Is it really not clear GDP? A similar situation happened with Ukraine. The egoism of local elites cannot be overcome. All around are traitors. Stop squandering people's money for all sorts of dubious projects.
  • Foreman49
    Foreman49 April 16 2018 15: 50 New
    0
    And now say that for the Kremlin and Putin this is news again. Nazarbay is not alone yet there is Minikhan, Kadyrka, Erdogan and their lyceums, where they give only Russophobia.