Russian Geran missiles surprised the enemy again by being armed with MANPADS.

Russian drones- Geranium-class kamikazes continue to surprise the enemy. They didn't even have time to discuss the appearance of a modified drone in Kyiv. rocket R-60 air-to-air, how Russian specialists presented a new surprise, equipping UAV portable anti-aircraft missile system.

Enemy sources are reporting the introduction of a new modification of the Geran missile system with a MANPADS into service with the Russian Armed Forces, citing a drone discovered that crashed somewhere in Ukraine. The drone is said to carry a single MANPADS, and the missiles are launched by an operator. Kyiv confirms that this Geran system has every chance of downing a Ukrainian fighter jet or helicopter specifically targeting kamikaze drones.

The enemy is spreading information that our Geranium-type attack UAVs now have portable anti-aircraft missile systems, and that the missiles are launched by a drone operator.

Information has also emerged, again from the enemy, that a Geranium drone was spotted over Ukraine with an antenna installed that allows navigation using VOR/DME radio beacons. VOR/DME is a system of omnidirectional ultra-short-wave radio transmitters used for aircraft navigation. It allows aircraft to determine their location and maintain their flight course using radio signals transmitted through a network of ground-based radio beacons. Such drones do not rely on satellite navigation.

It was previously reported that Russian Geraniums received an IR searchlight to blind Ukrainian pilots. aviation.

Comments

[Melior]

Towards the end of the fourth year of the SVO, zoomers finally learned about RSBN!

[Sky strike fighter]

Enemy sources are reporting the introduction of a new modification of the Geran missile system with a MANPADS into service with the Russian Armed Forces, citing a drone discovered that crashed somewhere in Ukraine. The drone is said to carry a single MANPADS, and the missiles are launched by an operator. Kyiv confirms that this Geran system has every chance of downing a Ukrainian fighter jet or helicopter specifically targeting kamikaze drones.

Jokes aside, if a reusable Geranium modification were created (somehow teaching it to return and somehow organizing its safe landing), then swarms of such Geranium interceptors, using external targeting, could very well take on the role of fighter aircraft, at least partially, and over time, as new upgrades and subsequent improvements in capabilities occur, could even take on even more functionality. They could also easily intercept swarms of enemy drones.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

...somehow organizing her safe landing

The landing of the Tu-141 "Strizh" drone was carried out by parachute. The simplest method.

[Shurik70]

Attack UAVs, fighter UAVs and kamikaze UAVs are still different classes.
And it’s better to create specialized ones than to stick everything onto one universal type.
But it is worthwhile to accompany the Gerani with returning UAV fighters.
In World War II, fighters always provided cover for bombers.

[valek97]

We'd like to implement the idea of ​​mother patrol drones + reusable drones + two rows of aerostats in a north-south chain with a power cable from a generator down to the ground and an on-board radar. This would create a layered defense that could be partially defeated, but would be compensated for by a radial overlapping and intercepting system and an altitude that allows for long-range visibility. Make the aerostats capable of autonomously deviating +-200 meters and this wouldn't be a problem.

[Vitaly.17]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

Jokes aside, swarms of such Geranium interceptors, with the help of external target designation, could very well take on the role of fighter aircraft.

"They both can, but we won't rely on chance."
Unfortunately, experience shows that the Russian Defense Ministry's short- and long-range air defense capabilities are more than sufficient. However, the means for obtaining timely target information are extremely limited. The Russian Defense Ministry's "miraculously" inadequate military-technical policy has resulted in a shortage of AWACS aircraft, ground-based radars, and other electronic reconnaissance assets.

[Sky strike fighter]

"Miraculously," the inadequate military-technical policy of the Russian Ministry of Defense has led to a shortage of AWACS aircraft, ground-based radars, and other electronic reconnaissance equipment in the military.

Well, the experience of the Central Military District should prompt us to correct this situation. At least, I hope that's what will happen. Because what would we do in the 21st century without eyes? The experience of last year's Iran-Israel conflict clearly demonstrated the truth of the saying that whoever controls information controls the world.

[Vitaly.17]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

The experience of the SVO should encourage us to correct this situation.

He should, but he doesn't have to. Everything in our country depends on the human factor. It's tempting to believe that the next high-ranking official will come up with a clever idea, especially before elections. But the reality is grimmer than ever. These days, point your finger at any official, whether military or civilian, and you're 90% likely to find them a careerist, a corrupt official, a thief, or an agent of foreign influence.
Moreover, the best people of the country are now dying and suffering physical and psychological injuries in the SVO, for the majority of whom patriotism is not an empty phrase.

[Carib]

The developers incorporated most of the foreign components to improve performance and reduce weight and dimensions. Then came the sanctions, and the components were apparently specialized, but they purchased a few samples for testing. They tested it and it worked. And then came the sanctions. And they had to develop and manufacture the entire line themselves, without the developers or factories...

[ideo098]

It can't be returned; the flight mission must be one-way. But as for not completing the flight mission, that raises questions again, and there's no self-destruction, just as there never was. These are gifts straight from the sky for the Ukrainians.

[MrFox]

Well, you mentioned RSBN; the frequencies were redistributed long ago. Regarding DME, is the drone sending requests? I seriously doubt it.

[Lptsk]

RSBN is navigation. And the range is up to 200 km. I don't remember any more. And here you need a broadband channel, most likely, satellite communication has appeared.

RS. DME can, of course, but that's navigation, and there don't seem to be any problems with that. It's just unlikely that the beacons in Ukraine are working.

[al3x]

Surprise the enemy and take out their leadership and their closest entourage. The war might even end.

[Sky strike fighter]

The most promising area is the development of an inexpensive interceptor drone similar to the Gerani, but in a reusable version and preferably with a compact laser on board for intercepting targets.

[voyaka uh]

"preferably with a compact laser on board"///
---
Forget about it.
The laser requires a massive "battery".
Not for light drones.

[NakedMan]

We don't even have a ground-based air defense laser in our troops, but you want an airborne, inexpensive one. A shotgun or submachine gun is a more realistic option.

[Sky strike fighter]

Mobile ground-based air defense laser available.

A Russian combat laser system, as part of the Posok program, destroyed an FPV drone for the first time at a distance of 1 km, breaking its previous record of 700 m.

The design and development of these counter-drone systems, at least at the level of small startups, is still ongoing in our country, and this is a very important point.

The laser's power is known to be approximately 3 kW. While this isn't yet effective against large cruise missiles or heavy UAVs at ranges of 7-10 km, it is already capable of destroying kamikaze UAVs with Starlink terminals at ranges of 1-1,5 km, as well as damaging the optics of reconnaissance drones at much greater distances.

"War Chronicle"

https://t.me/swodki/550332

Over time, such a laser could be installed on the LPD-2000 turret instead of a firearm.

Russia has developed a new automated turret, the LPD-2000, for countering drones. The system is used as part of a mobile fire group, along with the Katran target designation system. The Katran target designation system combines several means of detecting and tracking aerial targets. It includes a radar, a laser designator, and an electro-optical system with automatic search and tracking of aerial targets.

https://dzen.ru/a/aVEbihD7VhuwKYdd

LPD-2000 turret

[torbas41]

In mass production, the simpler the more reliable; the guys in the SVO zone already have experience converting FPV drones into fighter drones.

[Hitriy Zhuk]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

but in a reusable modification and preferably with a compact laser on board to intercept targets.

And a compact reactor.

[Sky strike fighter]

As you know, the Burevestnik cruise missile system has a compact reactor. So, it's no longer science fiction. And by the way, the Burevestnik can patrol for days. Isn't that what you're proposing as a carrier for air-to-air missiles?

[Hitriy Zhuk]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

As you know, the Burevestnik cruise missile has a compact reactor. So, this isn't science fiction anymore.

Yes, but it is not generating.
And the laser needs kilowatts.

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

Is this what you are proposing as a carrier of air-to-air missiles?

It would be better to make a new Tu-95 out of it.
So that the crew (or drone) could spin for a month.

[kapitan92]

Quote: al3x

Surprise the enemy and take out their leadership and their closest entourage. The war might even end.

Henry Ford: "Isolate the 50 richest Jews and wars will stop."

These words were written almost 100 years ago, and how accurately they reflect the situation in today's Ukraine!

[al3x]

But no one, even within Ukraine, is trying to do this. But the proponents of "security guarantees" unanimously shout that it won't solve anything, that they'll replace it with others, and so on and so forth. Well, that means continuation is beneficial to everyone—that's the only way it can be interpreted.

[Dart2027]

Quote: al3x

But no one, even within Ukraine, is trying to do this. Meanwhile, the proponents of "security guarantees" unanimously shout that it won't solve anything, that they'll just replace it with others, and so on and so forth.

You are reading inattentively.

Quote: kapitan92

Henry Ford: "Isolate the 50 richest Jews, and wars will stop."

Zelensky and K are their ultimate lackeys.

[al3x]

Yes, yes, you need to take care of your greens, I know that.

[Dart2027]

Quote: al3x

You need to take care of your greens

The theory that he's more advantageous than a potential replacement is entirely plausible, but we're unlikely to know the truth. But in any case, eliminating him won't achieve anything. Israel eliminated a few Iranian generals, so what?

[nordscout]

kapitan92, the richest Jews are not in the Ukroreich, but in the USA, Britain, the Netherlands, Italy and Russia, it was G. Ford who was "broadcasting" about them... Apparently, something is wrong with the "isolation", since we have been fighting with the Ukroreich for more than 3 years now.

[kapitan92]

Quote from nordscout

kapitan92, the richest Jews are not in the Ukroreich, but in the USA, Britain, the Netherlands, Italy and Russia, it was G. Ford who was "broadcasting" about them... Apparently, something is wrong with the "isolation", since we have been fighting with the Ukroreich for more than 3 years now.

Dear sir, you have opened up "Europe" for me, I like you.
"Kill" 50 rich Jews and you will have "isolation", what does Khokhlomandia have to do with it?
We are not WARring with the Ukrainian Reich, we are conducting a SVO. Study the material or listen to Garant more often.

[Hitriy Zhuk]

Quote: kapitan92

the Jews

Was it then that Capital and the Americans found the scapegoats?

[Comrade Kim]

A picture says it all.

[avdkrd]

Quote: al3x

Surprise the enemy and take out their leadership and their closest entourage. The war might even end.

We'll be most surprised. If such an obvious solution has been blocked from the top for four years (in fact, longer), then why is enlightenment expected to dawn now? By all known laws of military art, the VPR is the priority target. The demagoguery about this being a military coup and not a war comes from the top, as does the narrative about the worthlessness of Zelya and his entourage.
Trump changed the rules of the game in four days and one relatively bloodless operation. I'm inclined to believe that the constant jabs at the American military, claiming it's coddled and its generals are only preoccupied with corruption and gender bias, are also a narrative created for our domestic consumption.
What Trump did is comparable to the seizure of Amin's palace. It's audacity, calculation, and the operation's support at every level.
When they say that the Americans have seized, you also have to know how to do that.
No, I don’t believe in sudden insight or even just a readiness to change something in the dynamics.

[al3x]

Even here on a forum that seems to be military-related, comments like this usually get downvoted. As soon as you write that their top brass needs to be taken out, bots (or half-baked soldiers) pounce, unanimously shouting, "That's fiii ...

[Boa kaa]

Quote: al3x

And the Americans are so cool in this regard, they immediately hit me in the heart.

I was bitterly disappointed by the operation to capture Maduro and his family: was there really no one to give the command to even use a MANPADS? The aircraft didn't take off, the S-300s weren't launched. The president's personal guard didn't even say a meow... After that, don't believe that a donkey loaded with a sack of gold can open the gates of any fortress. Comrade Xi was right to remove all the top generals. Perhaps this kind of thing should be done more often as a preventative measure. Especially where there's a whiff of gold and other undeserved benefits...
But they still don't want to deploy SMERSH to the frontline zone...

[cpls22]

Quote: BoA KAA

I was bitterly disappointed by the operation to capture Maduro and his family: was there really no one left to give the order to use at least a MANPADS? The president's personal security didn't even say a meow...

The head of the American Joint Chiefs of Staff stated that a shootout ensued during Maduro's arrest and an American helicopter was shot down:

All wounded American soldiers were evacuated and are in stable condition.

https://topwar.ru/275967-moschnye-gorelki-ne-ponadobilis-v-ssha-raskryvajut-detali-operacii-protiv-maduro.html

[Boa kaa]

Quote from cpls22

an American helicopter was shot down:
All wounded American soldiers were evacuated and are in stable condition.

Thanks for the info ...
Well, at least something, at least a "clump of wool." And this was probably done by the Cuban "volunteers."

[ideo098]

The American helicopter was reported damaged, not shot down. The same was true of Maduro's security detail; later, reports came that the Americans had shot almost all of them. Only the president's security detail resisted; all air defenses, even their man-portable air defense systems, were kept in place.

[Alexey Sommer]

Quote: Boa constrictor KAA

The operation to catch Maduro and his family left me bitterly disappointed: was there really not a single person who could give the command to use at least a MANPADS?

You are so naive, Chukchi youth.

[Alexey Sommer]

Please don't be offended. I'm simply surprised by your surprise.

[Dedok]

But they still don't want to deploy SMERSH to the frontline zone...

what is it?
And if they introduce it, what will be the consequences for those who introduced it?

[Boa kaa]

1. SMERSH - a structure called "death to spies" - counterintelligence, operating in the front line to identify and eliminate spies and saboteurs, as well as their accomplices from the local population (now called "waiters" - active)
2. "What are you hinting at, you royal face!?" (c)
Those who have entrenched themselves in government agencies are targeted not by SMERSH, but by the KGB, with its full complement of specialized units. Recently, Unit "K" was created, specializing in computer "geniuses"... and so on.
3. The hardest part is with the "waiters," the waverers, and the "creative intelligentsia"—they're "artists," that's how they see things! (The sad thing is that ophthalmologists (for them) are the authorities, they don't do a good job. Well, at least they could do some preventative work, for starters... You see, the air in the country would be cleaner...)

[Dedok]

I didn't write about that - I wrote about the fact that this structure can "reach out" to those who created it...
everything is mixed up...

[glock-17]

Trump showed the world that the US Army Special Forces are not eating their bread for nothing.

[fruc]

Russian Geraniums surprised again

It's a stupid habit to surprise someone. The photo shows the drone shot down over a field or crashed without hitting the enemy. Surprised, indeed.

[NakedMan]

There was an article recently about a Ukrainian plane being shot down by a geranium. Does the photo show that they shot down a geranium? It's a fair trade, I suppose.

[wladimirjankov]

Russian Geran missiles surprised the enemy again by being armed with MANPADS.

Instead of "wow" and showcasing all the latest developments and UAV design, our designers should have installed a self-destruct device on it long ago. There's nothing complicated about it. Instead, we're giving our enemies nearly intact prototypes for study and "wow."

[asterisk200]

Self-destruction will add hassle at launch, but no one publishes statistics on self-destructions (in general)
Another interesting thing is that I'm seeing more and more videos of Geraniums in perfect condition; it looks like they're being carefully planted, not simply stifled. Is that possible?

[wladimirjankov]

Is it possible?

If control of a sophisticated Okhotnik UAV was intercepted while it was flying alongside a Su-35 and the latter's pilot was forced to shoot it down, then it's even more so with a Geranium controlled by an operator. In such cases, and not only, a self-detonation is necessary. And it won't add any "hassle at launch" if it's programmed into the UAV's controller and activated after launch.

[ideo098]

Ukrainians Of course, they could have seized control and imprisoned Geranka; they're not as stupid as many people think. Something needs to be done about this, a self-destruct mechanism needs to be created.

[Michael]

The Tu-160 has a reverse-fire anti-aircraft missile system. I think they're trying it on the Tu-95.
And on slow-flying Geraniums, you need to install MANPADS right in the back - try to catch up with a "flyer" and get it.

[Sky strike fighter]

Why set it forward/backward if, as the article states, the Geranium is controlled by an operator and, as a result, can not only evade interceptor drones, but most likely also turn 180 degrees to subsequently launch a missile mounted on the Geranium? Turn around and launch, like fighter jets.

[Michael]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

Turn around and launch like fighter jets.

Fighters are very fast and maneuverable, and they need to turn 360 degrees to launch a missile at the pursuer. And on a slow-flying platform, you can even equip a turret—one missile forward, one backward.

[Sky strike fighter]

To intercept a swarm of Geraniums, fighters will have to significantly reduce their speed; they won't be opening fire on the Geraniums at supersonic speeds, otherwise they will simply disappear. This is not to mention slower propeller-driven aircraft or helicopters, which reduce their speed before opening fire on the Geraniums and approach them as closely as possible, thereby becoming slow-moving targets.

[Michael]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

They slow down before opening fire on the Geraniums and approach them as closely as possible, thereby becoming slow-moving targets.

Therefore, we need to develop AI and create Robert Sheckley's "Guardian Bird".
I tried to attach the Terminator soundtrack, but it didn't work.

[Sky strike fighter]

Well, AI or operator control of such a drone via the same satellite, like Starlink. Drones should be inexpensive but multifunctional, like Geraniums, but it's highly desirable that they be reusable, so they're not just one-way trips. Reusable drones would be more cost-effective. And of course, the dream is to install a laser on a similar drone with a range of 1,5-2 km, which would guide the drone to its target using images from an onboard thermal imager.

[Michael]

Drones should be inexpensive but multifunctional, like Geraniums, but it's also highly desirable that they be reusable, so they're not just one-way trips. Reusable drones will be more cost-effective.

Terminator 1 and Terminator 2.

[NakedMan]

Fighters can instantly increase speed, and are far more maneuverable than geraniums. A MANPADS missile will catch up, but the drone itself is difficult to target, and such a maneuver would warn the pilot. It's better for the missile to fire unexpectedly in any direction.

[Radik Aytuganov]

The MANPADS, firmly attached to the geranium's body, still needs to lock on to a maneuverable target, which must be directly ahead. How do you envision this?

[Sky strike fighter]

Geranium can maneuver and turn. It can turn toward a target, having first locked onto it using a rotating mini-turret with a thermal imager or using external target designation coordinates received by Geranium's mini-PC, and then launch.

[Radik Aytuganov]

"having previously secured it with a rotating turret with a thermal imager"
I think you are asking too much of geranium.

[Sky strike fighter]

Geraniums already have thermal imaging cameras; a video from the Ukrainian side showed a thermal imaging camera on a downed Geranium. It just needs to be conveniently mounted on the Geranium so it can rotate using a mini-turret, capturing as much space as possible and thus finding a potential target. The device can be installed on the Geranium, which will receive external target designation, and with this, the Geranium will move to the desired square to search for a target using the thermal imaging turret and, once a target is locked on, open fire on it with short-range air-to-air missiles or MANPADS. Nothing out of the ordinary here. It's a perfectly viable option. Moreover, it's not a shame to lose such Geraniums deep in Ukrainian territory, unlike expensive fighters, which won't be sent behind front lines, unlike Geranium interceptors.

[D16]

And on the slow-flying Geraniums, MANPADS need to be installed right in the back.

Shooting through the propeller is problematic. And a hot engine won't make it any easier.

[Michael]

Quote: D16

Shooting through the propeller is problematic. And a hot engine won't make it any easier.

Mortar fire.

[D16]

So, before launch, the geranium should fall under the enemy aircraft, lift the launch container with the missile, lock on to the target, and launch from the lower hemisphere in the tradition of "schrage muzik"?

[Michael]

Quote: D16

So, before launch, the geranium should fall under the enemy aircraft, lift the launch container with the missile, lock on to the target, and launch from the lower hemisphere in the tradition of "schrage muzik"?

Absolutely not, the Tu-160 does not need to fall under the enemy, since the "mortar" launch of the missile implies 90 degrees to its own horizon, regardless of up or down.

[D16]

How will the MANPADS seeker lock on to the target early and not lose it during a launch at 90 degrees to the horizon, and what will be the aerodynamics of the Geranium with a MANPADS on its launcher?

[Michael]

Quote: D16

How will the MANPADS seeker lock on to the target early and not lose it during a launch at 90 degrees to the horizon, and what will be the aerodynamics of the Geranium with a MANPADS on its launcher?

External targeting will most likely be required.
Very bad. You'll need an aerodynamic container, something like this.

[D16]

External targeting will most likely be required.

MANPADS don't work like that; for that kind of work you need other missiles and UAVs like the Okhotnik.

An aerodynamic container will be required.

A drone with such a container won't catch the flock. Shooting backwards would be pointless.

[D16]

In short, the development of a laser-guided S-70 missile is a logical step. A host of problems would be solved immediately. It would be possible to engage both aircraft and "hunter" pickup trucks without losing the UAV, by mounting the pods under the wing on small pylons for forward and backward firing.

[D16]

But the image you provided does raise some interesting questions. This, however, calls for a major upgrade of the Geranium and its launcher. The MANPADS could be mounted rearward-facing, outside the propeller's swept area, if it were mounted on a pair of narrow carbon fiber brackets attached to the wing spar and converging above the engine. The camera would also need to be mounted there. However, the MANPADS has poor forward detection of jet aircraft, and launching it from a pickup truck at full speed would require a Geranium launcher like this. A standard launcher wouldn't accommodate such a Geranium.

[Michael]

Quote: D16

Launch it from a pickup truck. A regular launcher like this won't fit.

For every ten strike "Geraniums," launch a couple of air defense "Geraniums." And then you can launch dummy missiles, or strike missiles disguised as air defense missiles.

[D16]

All that's left is a small matter. A laser seeker for the S-70, a laser rangefinder/target designator, and a power source for all this beauty. The fight against Geraniums will take on a whole new dimension.

[MrFox]

Don't destroy the dreams of village Kulibins

[D16]

What if they come up with something worthwhile? Theoretically, we could come up with a Geranium-style fighter-bomber, either without a warhead or with a light warhead, by mounting two MANPADS symmetrically on the wing, positioned beyond the propeller plane.

[MrFox]

Proposing requires engineering expertise. For example, what range should communication equipment have?

[D16]

They've adapted to mounting Starlink terminals like on boats. On the fuselage, in the middle. At least there were photos.

[MrFox]

Starlink won't work in Russia. It will work in Ukraine, but that's a foreign connection, with all the ensuing consequences.

I had something else in mind - the presence of radio modems on board and, as a guess, the use of mesh networks or repeaters.

[D16]

It works throughout Ukraine, regardless of the front lines. People are using it without any problems so far. They used mobile internet, but it's probably now turned off during air raids.

[NakedMan]

What's the range of a repeater that can be mounted on a drone? A repeater network extending from Russia deep into Ukraine probably wouldn't be that easy.

[MrFox]

There are reports that drones, or "waiters," located on rooftops, serve as repeaters. In specific operations, repeater drones simply hover over the operation site. Using radio modems, a few watts of power in the UHF range is sufficient to cover a range of several hundred kilometers, assuming no obstructions.

[snow mountain]

Quote: al3x

Surprise the enemy and take out their leadership and their closest entourage. The war might even end.

The whole point here is who will clap?

[rosomaha]

I have a question... why do we learn about such new products not from downed enemy UAVs (and en masse in one night), but from videos and photos of our own UAVs that have fallen or been shot down, and reports from pig-snouts. Accordingly, there is nothing to rejoice about... the new product is in the hands of the enemy, it hasn't proven itself yet... accordingly, the enemy can develop countermeasures before we start mass-producing the new product. While we are developing and scaling it up, they are doing the same in terms of countermeasures, so there is no revolutionary turning point with the massive, simultaneous (so that in one night 5 Mirages... 8 F16s and from 10 helicopters... and so that all the crews die) knocking out the most valuable elements of their air defense - the Shisnars and Mirages (+ the reputation of that...) and helicopters. And he himself will be able to use our innovations to develop similar systems for his long-range UAVs. So, there's little joy there!

[Dart2027]

Quote: rosomaha

We learn about such innovations not from downed enemy aircraft (and en masse in one night), but from videos and photos of our UAVs that have fallen or been shot down and from reports from pig-snouts

They don't have many of those pilots left. Besides, they try to stay away from the front lines, so even if they did kill someone, it's hard to figure out how.

[NakedMan]

Apparently, there are no plans for mass production yet. Someone is probably cobbling together something from cheap components, and the main effect won't be a surprise breakthrough, but rather to scare enemy aircraft, making them less likely to shoot down our drones.
They installed MANPADS on their boats, so we probably won't reveal any particularly secret decisions.

[Alexandra]

Damn, when are we going to defeat our enemy?

[Alexandra]

Caracas was built in 24 hours, and we've been putting our guys to death for 4 years... And we're proud ((( I've seen our guys without legs, mines, etc. Would America allow that, damn it? (((

[Nikolaevich I]

Well, there you have it... the method is "turning around" in my opinion! As soon as the first reports appeared about installing the R-60M on the Geran, I immediately said that this method is not very good! Of course, it's better than nothing, but installing missiles based on MANPADS on the Geraniums would be more practical! For example, the Igla-V helicopter-based SAMs! But there were some idiots at the Military Academy who gave me "minuses"! I assumed that things would get to the Igla soon, and I was right! And finally, I will say (it's a song!): NATO is developing special small-sized air-launched anti-missiles (interceptor missiles) against SAMs and SAMs! In Russia, the situation is neither good nor bad; but the Russian Ministry of Defense will still have to deal with this, sooner or later (preferably sooner!)! So, these anti-missiles are "perfect" for self-defense on the Geraniums! I also predict it's time to install small quadcopters ("Dukats") on the Geraniums to combat mobile air defense groups! Although "Dusts" (aircraft-type drones) would also be good for this! Even earlier, I proposed arming the Geraniums with "Dusts" and "Dukats" to counter SAM radars!

[rocket757]

Having drones that can destroy enemy air targets is logical. Drones can fly over enemy territory, and enemy air forces will be on their heels... creating fighter drones is a logical solution.

[Moneron]

The enemy isn't surprised by anything...technically, they're ahead. But readers of the Military Review are surprised by the flamboyant titles of some articles..."...scared...surprised..." For four years, we've been unable to frighten or surprise them until our victory.

[cuzmin.mihail2013]

There are simply no words! I read the comments and, yeah, my imagination is boundless. The only thing simpler would probably be to turn an Su-57 into a UAV... It would just be a bit expensive. The beauty of UAVs is that they're cheap, unmanned, and designed for single-use!

[Comrade Beria]

Enemy monitoring channels are reporting the takeoff of strategic bombers. Monday morning will be a bit loud.

[AC130 Gunship]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

Enemy sources are reporting the introduction of a new modification of the Geran missile system with a MANPADS into service with the Russian Armed Forces, citing a drone discovered that crashed somewhere in Ukraine. The drone is said to carry a single MANPADS, and the missiles are launched by an operator. Kyiv confirms that this Geran system has every chance of downing a Ukrainian fighter jet or helicopter specifically targeting kamikaze drones.

Jokes aside, if a reusable Geranium modification were created (somehow teaching it to return and somehow organizing its safe landing), then swarms of such Geranium interceptors, using external targeting, could very well take on the role of fighter aircraft, at least partially, and over time, as new upgrades and subsequent improvements in capabilities occur, could even take on even more functionality. They could also easily intercept swarms of enemy drones.

First, we need to ask Iran (the developer) about this.
And secondly, the cost increases. The whole point is the low price of a disposable product.

[Sky strike fighter]

First, we need to ask Iran (the developer) about this.

No need. Iran developed Shaheds. And we have Geranis.

And secondly, the cost increases. The whole point is the low price of a disposable product.

The trick is that while maintaining a low price, the reusable Geranium will actually be even cheaper due to its multiple, rather than single, use. Yes, the engine's lifespan will have to be extended, which may be a bit more expensive, but the multiple uses will pay for it. It's one thing to use a UAV once, but quite another to use it dozens or hundreds of times. It will replace dozens or hundreds of similar disposable UAVs, which translates into savings and benefits.

[Rusfaner]

I wonder why there's no self-destruct on Geraniums? Logically, there should be.
Or is logic not the issue here?

[landromat]

Hmm, MANPADS are good but expensive. For that kind of money, you could try making an anti-aircraft version of the Geranium, lightening the warhead to the level of a MANPADS, perhaps a second engine, rocket boosters, or a boosted main engine to increase the speed to 300-400 km/h against helicopters and Yak-52s. With TV and heat sensors all around, such a Geranium would pretend to be a normal victim when a helicopter or Yak-52 approaches, suddenly picking up speed, turning around, and the guys are coming.

[AC130 Gunship]

Quote: Sky Strike fighter

First, we need to ask Iran (the developer) about this.

No need. Iran developed Shaheds. And we have Geranis.

And secondly, the cost increases. The whole point is the low price of a disposable product.

The trick is that while maintaining a low price, the reusable Geranium will actually be even cheaper due to its multiple, rather than single, use. Yes, the engine's lifespan will have to be extended, which may be a bit more expensive, but the multiple uses will pay for it. It's one thing to use a UAV once, but quite another to use it dozens or hundreds of times. It will replace dozens or hundreds of similar disposable UAVs, which translates into savings and benefits.

China also calls its Tu-16s by a different name. But everyone understands that they are still Tu-16s. They just have new engines, updated avionics, and new missiles.

And where are you going to get a long-lasting engine for the Shahed? There isn't one.

[AC130 Gunship]

Quote: Rusfaner

I wonder why there's no self-destruct on Geraniums? Logically, there should be.
Or is logic not the issue here?

Question for Tehran

[Svetlana]

Quote: D16

Shooting through the propeller is problematic.

A Geranium can be used with a pulsejet engine (PuJT). For example, with this PuJT (it has no propeller). The figures depict the three operating phases of a diesel pulsejet engine with a coaxial combustion chamber arrangement, air compression in the main pulse combustion chamber (MCC1) using two coaxial gas pistons consisting of exhaust gases pushed into MC1 by pulse combustion of a small amount of fuel in auxiliary pulse combustion chambers MC2 and MC3. MC1 has two coaxial exhaust pipes: the first exhaust pipe (PEP) and the second exhaust pipe (SEP), located coaxially around the PCP.
R1 is the radius of the first exhaust pipe (FEP) exiting the main combustion chamber No. 1 (MCC1).
R2 is the outer radius of the second exhaust pipe (SEP) exiting the main combustion chamber No. 1 (MCC1) coaxially with the first exhaust pipe.
R2 is approximately equal to R1 multiplied by the square root of 2, so that the cross-sectional areas of the exhaust pipes of the PVT and VVT are approximately equal.
The VVT is coaxially located around the PVT.
The first end of the PVT is connected to the pulse combustion chamber No. 1 (PC1).
The second end of the PVT is connected to the pulse combustion chamber No. 2 (KS2).
The first end of the VVT is connected to the pulse combustion chamber No. 1 (KS1).
The second end of the VVT ​​is connected to the pulse combustion chamber No. 3 (KS3).
KS3 is coaxially located around KS2.
The KS3 ends with a nozzle, which is also a coaxial aerodynamic valve through which the combustion chambers are blown with fresh air in the reverse direction.
KS2 ends with a straight resonant exhaust pipe, exiting coaxially from the aerodynamic valve into the ejector mixing chamber.
The volume of the resonant exhaust pipe exiting the combustion chamber KS2 is greater than or equal to the sum of the following volumes: the volume of the exhaust pipe exiting the combustion chamber KS3, plus the volume of the combustion chamber KS3, plus the volume of the second exhaust pipe (SEP) exiting KS1 and entering KS3, plus the volume of the first exhaust pipe (FEP) exiting the combustion chamber KS1 and entering the combustion chamber KS2, plus the volume of the combustion chamber KS1 plus the volume of the combustion chamber KS2. This is necessary to ensure complete purging of the above-mentioned total volume after the formation of a vacuum in the resonant exhaust pipe exiting the combustion chamber KS2.
R2 also coincides with the radius of the end of the combustion chamber KS1.
In KS1, at least one fuel injector is installed at the base (at the left end) of KS1.
Inside KS2 and KS3, in the area of their maximum cross-section (approximately in the middle of their axial length), fuel injectors are installed, supplied with fuel through fuel tubes from common pulse valves or even from one common pulse fuel valve installed in the casing of the ejector nozzle, which is also the casing of the diesel thruster jet engine.
In the area behind the end of the exhaust nozzle of the KS3, fuel injectors are installed for the direct-flow mode of operation of the diesel thruster jet engine.
Auxiliary pulse combustion chambers KS2 and KS3 are welded to the outlet openings of the exhaust pipes of the PVT and VVT.
The coaxial diesel thruster jet operates as follows.
Fuel is injected and atomized into the air-filled KS2 and KS3 by pulse fuel injectors. The atomized fuel is then ignited and/or detonated in KS2 and KS3 by high-voltage and/or plasma discharges from spark plugs. Detonation shock wave fronts from KS2 and KS3 penetrate KS1 through the high-voltage fuel injection system (HVDI) and high-voltage fuel injection system (HVDI), compressing the air within. At the moment of maximum air compression in KS1, the pulse fuel injector atomizes the fuel.
To increase the service life of KS2 and KS3, a non-detonation ignition and combustion mode of the fuel injected and atomized over a pre-calculated time interval in KS2 and KS3 is also possible. The fuel injection duration by the injectors in KS2 and KS3 is chosen to be moderate, such that the same combustion product pressure of 10–50 atmospheres is created in KS2 and KS3 during the injection and pulsed combustion periods. Combustion products from KS1 and KS2 exit in two opposite directions: into the ejector nozzle volume on the exhaust and (in the opposite direction) through the PVT and VVT, they penetrate KS1 and compress the air in it to the combustion product pressure in KS2 and KS3 (i.e., up to 10–50 atmospheres). Just like in the detonation mode of a ramjet engine, at the moment of maximum air compression in KS1, fuel is injected and atomized into it by a pulse fuel injector.
The fuel-air mixture in KS1 is ignited by the temperature of compressed air and/or an electric plasma spark plug. The resulting exhaust gases are then passed through the exhaust pipes (PVT and VVT) into the auxiliary combustion chambers (KS2 and KS3) and then into the resonance tube and ejector nozzle. Due to the inertia of the exhaust gas flow, a vacuum is created in the resonance exhaust pipe, KS2, PVT, KS1, VVT, KS3, and the coaxial aerodynamic valve (nozzle) of KS3. The pressure becomes lower than atmospheric pressure, and fresh air from the air intake enters these areas of vacuum.
The main combustion chamber KS1 is filled with fresh air through the auxiliary combustion chamber KS3, and then in reverse through the second coaxial exhaust pipe VVT. Fresh air enters KS1 through VVT since the pressure in KS1 is less than atmospheric pressure in this phase of the diesel PUJT operation.
Then fresh air enters from KS1 through the PVT into KS2 and partially cools the walls of KS2.
To limit the combustion chamber wall temperature and ensure complete combustion, the combustion chambers of air-breathing jet engines typically burn a lean fuel-air mixture. Due to the non-stoichiometric fuel/air ratio, the exhaust gases contain oxygen. Measuring the O2 content in the exhaust allows one to monitor the performance of the thrusterjet.
The pulse fuel injectors in the auxiliary combustion chambers KS2 and KS3 are positioned approximately midway along their length. After fresh air purging and partial cooling of the combustion chamber walls, atomized fuel is injected into KS2 and KS3 by the pulse fuel injectors. The fuel-air mixture is ignited and/or detonated (detonated) by a pulsed high-voltage discharge from the spark plugs in the auxiliary combustion chambers KS2 and KS3. The fronts of detonation shock waves and/or combustion waves with increased pressure in KS2 and KS3 begin to propagate in both directions (to the right and left) from the plane of the injectors in KS2 and KS3. The increased pressure front moving from KS2 and KS3 toward KS1 compresses the air in KS1.
During combustion of the fuel-air mixture in the auxiliary combustion chambers, approximately half of the exhaust gases from the auxiliary combustion chambers exit through the exhaust nozzles of auxiliary combustion chambers #2 and #3 into the atmosphere, while the other half of the exhaust gases from the auxiliary combustion chambers return to the main combustion chamber and compress the fresh air entering the main combustion chamber (MCC1). Gas pistons (detonation wave fronts) moving through the exhaust pipes of the primary combustion chamber (PCB) and the secondary combustion chamber (VCB) simultaneously enter MCC1. The air compression ratio in MCC1 can reach values ​​of 10-50 times. At the end of the air compression phase, fuel is injected into MCC1 by a pulse injector and ignited. The injected fuel ignites in MCC1 due to an increase in the temperature of the compressed air in MCC1 due to its adiabatic and/or shock compression. The cycle then repeats.
The duration of the pulsed fuel injection into the combustion chambers, the intervals between fuel injection pulses, and the distribution of commands to open the electromagnetic valves for fuel injection into the pulse fuel injectors are controlled by a microprocessor-based electronic control unit (ECU), guided by analog signals from the pressure sensors in the compressor station. The fuel system of the diesel thrusterjet is a common rail system, with the fuel tank pressurized with compressed nitrogen to a pressure of 15 ... 100 bar. Electronically controlled electrohydraulic injectors with electromagnetic (electromagnetic valve) or piezoelectric (piezoelectric valve) drive of the control valves inject fuel under high pressure into compressor stations #1, 2, and 3. The pulse electromagnetic valves for feeding fuel to pulse fuel injectors KS2 and KS3 are common for KS2 and KS3. This achieves virtually simultaneity of the pulsed fuel supply to KS2 and KS3. Minor non-simultaneity is due to the different lengths of the fuel lines from the fuel solenoid valves to the injectors installed in KS1 and KS2. The solenoids of the fuel injector opening solenoid valves are powered by an onboard lithium-ion battery and/or an onboard thermoelectric generator installed in the ejected air flow under the ejector thrust enhancer casing, with the hot side on the outer surface of the exhaust pipe of the military-industrial complex (MIC) and/or from an onboard Hall-type MHD generator with air-cooled magnets mounted on heat insulators on the outer surface of the coaxial exhaust pipe of KS2 and/or KS3, creating a transverse magnetic field in the exhaust pipe channel. The aforementioned MHD generator is capable of producing alternating electric current due to the fact that the plasma movement in the exhaust pipe channel of the military-industrial complex is reverse (back and forth).

[mixa7591]

This is complete nonsense; the author has no idea what shooting with a PZPK is.