Military Review

From Ilyich to Ilyich. Essay based on comments on the site

72
The reason for writing the article was not so much the wise instruction of the president about preparing a textbook for schools for schools in Russia storieshow much vigorous the reaction of the public, including commentators site.


There is no dispute, the textbook is needed. But there are some very difficult questions that I would like to receive an answer in a possible discussion. Moreover, both the composition of the authors and the narration of the story will, by and large, be an indication of how Putin’s activities correspond to his speeches, and what Russia can receive as a result of his rule. (The article was written before the TV show, after which this question disappeared from many).

The first is, of course, the composition of the authors. For if among them are such “prominent figures of historical arts” as Svanidze and Pivovarov, then the maximum that our children will receive in schools is the feeling that the history of Russia began in 1991 year. And before that, a solid "darkness of ages." Well, of course, among the heroes of this new Russia, Gaidar, Chubais, Yavlinsky and their ilk will stand out first. Vlasov and Krasnov with Skins will be recorded in the martyrs. Dudaev with Maskhadov and Politkovskaya with Yushenkov will also go there. Well, Gorbachev and Yeltsin are the saviors of the Fatherland, do not go to your grandmother. However, the reaction of most normal people to these two historical "scumbags" is quite adequate. But the trouble is that in addition to them there is a mass of people who, stigmatizing their shame, at the same time give a similar assessment to certain historical events. And if these two work solely because of money, then the rest is much more difficult. One of the clearest examples is the question of the Cossacks and dispossession. Here, even with Judas Trotsky, it is difficult to be objective, but what about Stalin? We will write that he loved the Cossacks, and during the defense of Tsaritsyn he even cried when he gave instructions about the execution of military experts and the same Cossacks. And Podtelkov with his friends and Budyonny with Gorodovikov, in the suppressors of the Cossacks, we shall write down or in the revolutionary Cossack Kraskians. And how will we evaluate the activities of the Cossack atamans, who were going to separate themselves from Russia, as fighters for the Russian people, or as traitors who are no different from the current gay belolentochnikov. Not an easier question and with the surplus. Let me remind you that it was introduced not by the “bloody Bolsheviks”, but by the father Tsar Nicholas, and that she was introduced not from the desire to “eradicate the Russian people”, but because of the vital necessity in the warring country. It is no longer necessary, replaced by a tax in kind. Appeared Stalin, who heads the party and the state, to ensure industrialization, again introduced tough measures. How will we evaluate this period in the textbook? How is Russia's disaster or its achievement? I foresee comments in which, as before, it will be indicated that de mol masons and Jews perverted the Stalinist ideas, and he fought with them. Then you should probably indicate what was perverted, and what you fought for. After all, whatever one may say, Stalin, like his predecessors, and we will not be cunning followers, built socialism. That is, the formation that Lenin began to build, and which Khrushchev and Brezhnev continued to build. Now they talk a lot about building an empire for them. But this is only a form of existence of the state, and not an idea for the sake of which the state exists. If to be consistent, then under the “Trotskyite” Khrushchev and under the “stagnant” Brezhnev the state only strengthened. Someone has already forgotten, and someone did not find the time when there were two systems in the world, which in general were equal in their military and economic power. And, not the fact that our system for the most part of mankind was less attractive. By the way, it is not clear why "kukuruznik" (this is just clear) Nikita has recently been called a Trotskyite. In the initial period of the revolution, everyone (including Stalin) dreamed about the world revolution, and the fact that Nikita tried to expand the number of supporters of our country under the authorities, probably all the same to him.

A separate line in the series of rulers of this period is the figure of Lenin. What mark he deserves in the history of the country. It is possible and not to pay attention to the cries of individuals about the bloody tyrant (the same thing they say about Stalin), but it is amusing that in the evaluation question the most belolentochnye "liberals" speak word for word the same thing as terry fans of pre-revolutionary Russia. At the same time, both those and others continue to demand free education and medicine, decent wages and pensions. of what Lenin and his followers proclaimed as the main idea, and that well, we actually had a different social order. References to the fact that in America and Europe they received more, in my opinion, are untenable, because they began to receive, after the formation of a socialist state., As a result of repeated fights with power and the fear of the owners, without sharing a part, to lose everything. Now this fear is lost. And to expect that Roma, Tolyasik and Usmanov with Potanin realize and give the people the stolen money, it is not necessary. I note to myself that it is not embarrassing to any of the screaming people that until recently they enjoyed using free goods promoted by Lenin with pleasure, without being embarrassed by his tyranny. They talk a lot about double standards "over the hill". However, we have them no less. From the point of view of the Vladmiris and Suzdalians, both Nevsky and Donskoy, who used the Tatars in the struggle for power, by no means look like guardians for Orthodox Russia, and the people of Novgorod clearly should not have great reverence for Grozny. About Peter the Great, I really do not speak. We will write about them in the textbook, and at the same time, how will we interpret the capture of Kazan?

A science essay usually concludes. So I will be on science. Find old school dogorbachevskie textbooks and reread them. There, if they drove kings, then only the latter, they wrote about Stalin without fanfare, but without dirt, the achievements under Nikita were not ignored. It may be worth it for the secondary school to return to this form of presentation, and for inquisitive minds leave the opportunity to rummage through the Internet on their own and go to the library more often.
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  1. shitovmg
    shitovmg April 29 2013 06: 02 New
    10
    In my opinion, it is written with dignity, without bias.
    1. Nicholas C.
      Nicholas C. April 29 2013 07: 02 New
      +3
      Opinion as an opinion. MB, even fair. In a decent society, it is customary to sign opinions, rather than write anonymously. So authorship has appeared. The efficiency of DMB pleases.

      A single textbook is needed. It is worth considering his public rating choice. With the exception of the possibility that belolentochnye grantoedy voted repeatedly.
    2. Rink
      Rink April 29 2013 11: 20 New
      +1
      And in my opinion, this is a manifestation of the author of the article of weak character, a recognition of the inability to give his own assessment of the difficult periods of our history with the automatic transfer of his confusion to all others.

      No doubt, writing a single textbook is a complex and difficult issue. But why criticize him even before writing?!

      I will say this: the creation of a single textbook of history, which would stop the flow of dirty insinuations and distortions of even very recent events - not a lot, not a little, but recognition of the sovereignty of their country.

      Without such a single textbook, it is impossible to create a single state and own national ideology. Individual history textbooks for each region are an instrument for preparing the division of Russia into ever smaller pieces, including medieval principalities.

      The fact that such a single textbook is difficult to write does not mean that you need to give up and do nothing. We won’t write it ourselves - the State Department grant-eaters will sprinkle it without any doubts. They don’t save in the face of difficulties - it seems that they will be more aggressive than you.

      And the “patriots” of this kind and further, like Vasisualiy Lokhankin, will reassure themselves during the flogging with rods carried out by the next Hygienishvili: - “Maybe it should be so? Maybe this is the homespun truth?”
      1. kuga
        kuga April 29 2013 12: 38 New
        +1
        Izborsk club is also working on a common position on the history of Russia.

        The first results have been achieved - so far, of course, the compromise is rough, but the future skeleton is visible.

        ON THIS SIDE OF “RED” AND “WHITE”
        http://www.dynacon.ru/content/articles/1164/
      2. Nick
        Nick April 29 2013 18: 22 New
        +3
        Quote: Skating rink
        And in my opinion, this is a manifestation of the author of the article of weak character, a recognition of the inability to give his own assessment of the difficult periods of our history with the automatic transfer of his confusion to all others.

        Only an unintelligent person doubts anything. And it is impossible to give an unambiguous assessment to all these historical figures. They are so mixed up with both good and bad ... God is their judge, and we will, by virtue of our beliefs, life experience, intellectual abilities, evaluate everything that has happened in different ways ....
      3. S_mirnov
        S_mirnov April 29 2013 21: 10 New
        +1
        "I will say this: the creation of a single textbook of history that would stop the flow of the dirtiest insinuations and distortions of even very recent events is not a lot, not a little, but the question of recognizing the sovereignty of your country."
        It depends on who this textbook will be compiled. If, under the editorship of people, reproaching their story and deliberately denigrating it
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAuCc06AaBU&feature=related
        - then this is a clear evil!
        if people seeking truth - then good
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oI-sEhX4ygQ&feature=related
        As for assessing the activity of specific historical characters, I use a rather simple principle - if the personality’s activity went to improve the life of the country's citizens (including future generations), then it means a positive character, if it led to a deterioration (including future generations), it means negative.
        Stalin left behind an industrialized country with population growth - that means a hero.
        Leaving the GDP behind Russia with a population decline and empty oil wells means a criminal.
        And this is so, for general development, in terms of history and the place of Russia in it.
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AnpOUM-XXw&feature=player_embedded#
        http://www.kramola.info/vesti/letopisi-proshlogo/kak-proizvodili-antichnost
        not everything is true there, but for that you have a head on your shoulders.
        1. yak69
          yak69 April 29 2013 21: 56 New
          +1
          Quote: S_mirnov
          It depends on who this textbook will be compiled. If, under the editorship of people, reproaching their story and deliberately denigrating it

          I would venture to express an opinion.
          So. Any historical event can be viewed from different points of view. And this has come to light recently. Some consider Lenin-Stalin to be bloody tyrants, others are geniuses who created a great country.
          In my opinion, it is possible to write a textbook ONLY AFTER WE DETERMINE WHERE WE ARE GOING AND WHAT WE WILL BUILD! Not like before. Well, not possible without it !! If we are building capitalism, then the USSR is an absolute evil and all our values ​​must be thrown away, because CAPITALISM is "Take everything from life! Here and now! Wealth at all costs! I, mine, mine!". Accordingly, Lenin-Stalin is tyrants and murderers of "freedom", "democracy" and "complete freedom of manifestation" (LGBT and Satanists).
          I was born and raised in the Soviet Union, I was raised in the spirit of the inviolability of the friendship of peoples, mutual assistance, personal responsibility for EVERYTHING happening in my country, first public interest, and then personal, etc. I lived in the USSR, now I live in the Russian Federation (don’t understand in which country with a bias to the west) and I can judge where and how a working person who creates national wealth lived and lives. Here, from here and my opinion:
          textbooks must be written objectively, but be sure to stand on a stable ideological basis! Remember how we were taught? First, the basis (ideology), and then the superstructure (economy). And then science and industry and education and military doctrine and all spiritual and moral values.
          In a word, we take Soviet textbooks and make a reasonable correction, without vulgarization and mud tubs. Mistakes and excesses are always with everyone! (as if the authorities are honest, objective, fair and chaste!). In addition, we open for study historical archives (within reasonable limits) and let independent enthusiasts work on documents.
    3. starshina78
      starshina78 April 29 2013 21: 57 New
      +1
      I agree ! Now, after the President’s words about writing a history textbook, "many are arguing:" And what should be this very history textbook? "I am of the opinion that it should cover the fact of a historical event, but without political context, that is, for example: the events of October 1917 for some in our country is the Great October Socialist Revolution, and for others it is the October Revolution. So in the textbook, it must be pointed out that revolution was complete in Petrograd (below is a footnote that before 1991, the USSR was considered a VOSR and there was a national holiday celebrated annually, it was a day off, and since 1991 it was abolished as a holiday, and there is an opinion that This is about October coup.) Let the student analyze the event himself, do not impose opinions on what is good and what is bad. And so on many controversial events in Russian history (the capture of Kazan by Ivan the Terrible, for example, is not interpreted in the history books of Tatarstan in other Russian textbooks). The most important thing to do is to write truthfully, not to keep silent about facts that for some reason do not like and do not suit anyone. And yet, I think, we need to talk more about the Great Patriotic War. You may not believe it, but I personally saw on television how the correspondents of Komsomolskaya Pravda interviewed our children about the war. It was painful to watch when a guy of 17 years old could not answer when the Second World War began, he could not name another
      one significant battle, the third generally stated that the Germans and I fought against the Americans, and there were many who were asked, and the answers were shocking. We become like Americans who confuse Chechnya and the Czech Republic. The survey was conducted at a metro station in Moscow. Here you have the younger generation.
  2. Andrew 121
    Andrew 121 April 29 2013 06: 02 New
    24
    Teach your children yourself. Teach your children to love the Motherland and hate enemies. No matter how they are taught by current historians, the child will always hear his father. Our history in these difficult times should go from father to son, then it will be true. Everything that has been passed by older generations should not be forgotten otherwise there will be no people .....
    1. domokl
      domokl April 29 2013 06: 09 New
      11
      Quote: Andrew 121
      Our story in these difficult times should go from father to son, then it will be true
      Are you sure that the father will tell his son a story? Will the father, a former Chechen fighter and father, a former special forces soldier share the same story in the same place?
      People see completely the same facts, but alas, this is not history, but personal perception ..
      1. bask
        bask April 29 2013 07: 15 New
        +3
        Quote: domokl
        Are you sure that the father will tell his son a story? Father, a former Chechen fighter and father, a former special forces soldier in the same place

        I agree domokl, the general story somehow does not work.
        I don’t know what to do. But to write a good textbook for the whole country is impossible today.
        TOO DISSOLVED, ethnically and religiously.
        How to explain to Tatar why Tsar Ivan the Terrible took Kazan, took Astrakhan.
        That they will write in textbooks about the Russian genocide in Chechnya in the 90s, after which the republic became multinational 99% mono-ethnic. And so on.
        1. Kaa
          Kaa April 29 2013 07: 53 New
          10
          Quote: bask
          How to explain to Tatar why Tsar Ivan the Terrible took Kazan, took Astrakhan.
          Yes, it’s easier to start with our site - how many ethnic groups are represented - so many opinions about this or that event. And if you string everything on an unbroken chain - first sub-ethnic groups that had a state-forming effect, then Novgorod-Kievan Rus, then principalities, then Moscow (Suzdal) Russia and territories temporarily falling away from it to its neighbors, then the Great Principality of Moscow, the Kingdom, then the Russian Empire, the USSR with its dualism — a world revolution and restoration under the new name of the Empire, a new collapse of the Empire, a new Time of Troubles and the beginning of a new restoration of the state? All events of an integration nature are a positive assessment, although some nationalities did not at one time understand their expediency, and disintegration is negative. Consider our external enemies, for 1000 years, no matter what system they are, they should be aware of this, and draw the parable of the broom and twigs through all the periods, so it’s a single picture and develops ...
    2. smel
      smel April 29 2013 06: 40 New
      +7
      I agree that children should be taught themselves. There is no hope for an adequate education. And history is such a science that can present the same facts with completely different and opposite interpretations. One smart politician (and essentially a scoundrel) said that in order to destroy a nation, only one generation should be made to forget history. This is what is happening now ... This is what the author of the article says ... Sadness is caused by the fact that the elite, which by virtue of its position is admitted to the hearts and minds of millions, is far from being the most patriotic part of society this time. And the second - in Moscow, which a priori makes the main political life, far from the best part of Russian society lives. So it becomes hard for fathers and mothers to fulfill their parental duty. But I’m sure that my country will overcome these difficulties. It is with the overcoming of such difficulties that its history is connected
    3. vilenich
      vilenich April 29 2013 08: 00 New
      +1
      Quote: Andrew 121
      Teach your children yourself

      No one removes the obligation of parents to teach their children! But a small digression into the theory of the issue suggests that you can not rely only on personal memory.
      Thus, we see that history and memory are two completely different things; when assimilated by the individual, they undergo specific mixing and generate specific conclusions. If historiography is focused on facts and on truth, develops sophisticated techniques for interpreting sources, then memory is always associated with a specific identity: a person recalls what is important to himself, which helps him cope with today's life. From this point of view, the distinction between our memory of “true” and “false” memories is also meaningful. Functionally, memory serves as an orientation in modern times - for example, it helps to make decisions based on experience. And if the borrowed memory tells the person the right decision, then in the functional respect, it is undoubtedly better than if the person made the wrong decision on the basis of the “right” memory.

      Memory in general is connected not so much with the past as with the present. Like all other memory systems, autobiographical memory is a functional system whose task is to help people cope with life in the present. Therefore, outrage at the fact that people often “incorrectly” remember something is based on a misunderstanding: it is incorrect to assume that history and memory are directly related to each other. While history seeks to establish the facts that have taken place and put forward verifiable statements about them, the memory is absolutely opportunistic: it takes what is useful to it and discards what seems to it superfluous or unpleasant.

      The creation of textbooks for training is a state affair and the whole question is how objectively and impartially this will be done. Here I agree with the author, although he is somewhat nostalgic for the Soviet textbooks, but maybe in some ways he was right, of course, and they have a great ideological component, but as for me, there is more truth than in modern publications.
  3. domokl
    domokl April 29 2013 06: 05 New
    +5
    I put the article plus simply because it is relevant today. But in my humble opinion, the author does not think at all about how to solve the problem, and most importantly, why it even appeared.
    The history textbook is now a dream. Alas, but the dream is still not marketable. Why? Yes, simply because Russia is at the turn of the epochs, in a mess ... There is no idea, there is no Future that would suit at least the majority (unless of course you take it seriously sayings like I want it to be good).
    Any history textbook is not only a dry statement of facts, but also a tool of ideology. And we do not have an ideology either.
    1. kuga
      kuga April 29 2013 12: 44 New
      +3
      Ideology is a system of conceptually formed views and ideas, expressing the interests of various social classes, groups, societies, in which people's attitudes to reality and to each other are recognized and evaluated ..


      By the way, I always wondered why they prescribed in the constitution that the state should not have ideology.
      After all, the lack of ideology is also an ideology, moreover, aggressive, not recognizing and destroying others.

      We are not blind, and we see what processes in the "West" are moving forward under this mantra "there is no ideology."
      1. AleksUkr
        AleksUkr April 29 2013 16: 29 New
        +1
        They did not prescribe an ideology, but they introduced it unobtrusively - LEARN HOW YOU CAN ...
        By the way, officials took it quite well. It turns out that there is no official ideology, but the country does exist. These are your deeds ...
  4. mogus
    mogus April 29 2013 06: 10 New
    +2
    I see no reason in writing conclusions about events in history from any authors. The story, then, is the story that these events occurred and everyone evaluates the influence of those events on their own. It's simple, the event and the date. History cannot be black or white; if there is light, then there will be a shadow.
    1. mogus
      mogus April 29 2013 07: 50 New
      +3
      Well, let's talk "for the cons" ...
      I positively accept the USSR, even though I am 30 years old. I understand the importance of Stalin in the rise of the country and victory in the Second World War. But explain to me why my grandfather (peace be upon him) the Great Patriotic War veteran didn’t love Stalin (the family father was repressed and subsequently shot. I’m still saddened by the recollections of the stories of my grandfather and his brothers and sisters. At that time, to remain without father is tantamount to death from starvation, and their 11 children ... in Siberia on permafrost, is that not in Europe)? Immediately after the war, my grandfather was sent to the construction battalion, where he raised the country for five years. After, until his retirement he worked on a timber truck. Grandmother, during the war I carried sleepers on myself. I have not heard bad things about the USSR from them.
      Some of the masters of Siberia were Cossacks. At one time, furs gave the lion's share to the treasury. The Cossack revolution is leaving already in Australia! Only now are returning ...
      An imprint of modernity, when from here 2/3 of the currency is in the treasury, and we are called subsidized ...
      So how to evaluate the story? Is everything absolutely right? -No. Is everything wrong? -No.
  5. Renat
    Renat April 29 2013 06: 14 New
    +4
    The question is really very complicated. After all, our past directly affects our future. Here one day can not do. Teaching children the devil knows who wrote the history books in the spirit of democratic values, we have almost lost an entire generation of young people. One must be objective. First of all, patriotic education of children from the first class. The rich history of the country should work for a brighter future. No Yankee can boast such a rich history as you and I, the citizens of Russia the Great, have.
    1. Soldier
      Soldier April 29 2013 07: 49 New
      +5
      Quote: Renat
      No Yankee can boast such a rich history as you and I, the citizens of Russia the Great, have.

      Yes, the story of the Americans is not rich, and there is more dirt than valor ... BUT! They classify any minor achievement as a great victory of the American people. And they are all right with patriotism. And although I personally don’t like it, , mattresses, but patriotic education, you can learn from them. Ask the American, what is the best country in the world? What will he answer? And what will our, mowers-majors-liberalists answer?
      1. Renat
        Renat April 29 2013 07: 54 New
        +3
        You ask amers who defeated Hitler? With foam at the mouth they will prove that it is they and not someone else. Or a young Japanese who dropped bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. He will answer anyone but not America. This is a story that is beneficial to them.
        1. Ghenxnumx
          Ghenxnumx April 29 2013 08: 33 New
          +1
          Quote: Renat
          You ask amers who defeated Hitler? With foam at the mouth they will prove that it is they and not someone else. Or a young Japanese who dropped bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. He will answer anyone but not America. This is a story that is beneficial to them.

          Watched - we know. Who has not seen - here it is clear: [media = http: //www.newstube.ru/media/amerikancy-ne-znayut-ob-uch
          astii-sssr-vo-vtoroj-mirovoj]
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov April 29 2013 08: 41 New
            +1
            Quote: Ghen75

            Watched - we know. Who has not seen - here it is clear:

            Something your link to the video did not pass [media = http: //www.newstube.ru/media/amerikancy-ne-znayut-ob-uchastii
            -sssr-vo-vtoroj-mirovoj] and I could not upload the video. It can only be laid out with YouTube request
  6. v53993
    v53993 April 29 2013 06: 18 New
    +1
    There is a historical memory of the people, and it is not possible to deceive the liberal historians.
    1. sergo0000
      sergo0000 April 29 2013 06: 35 New
      +1
      Quote: v53993
      There is a historical memory of the people, and it is not possible to deceive the liberal historians.

      Mikhail Zadornov

      Original mzadornov.livejournal.com 16.04.2013/10/35 XNUMX:XNUMX

      My team and I watched a video of the Dozhd TV channel in which a correspondent interviewed youth on the street. He asked questions with such a clear joke that it seemed unthinkable as if someone would believe that this was true. When in the final one of the respondents agreed that the duel of Bulgakov and Lermontov was unfair, because Lermontov fired a pistol, and Bulgakov from a Kalashnikov assault rifle, I did not believe that our youth knew so much ... nothing!

      We decided to check, came up with the most moronic questions, and our correspondent went to the center of Moscow. Here's what we learned: Lenin, whose real name was Medvedev, took the pseudonym Lenin because he was born in Leningrad. And Nikita Mikhalkov, who wrote the words for the anthem of Russia, did it better than his dad, who wrote the words for the anthem of the USSR. Not a single person (not a single !!!!) doubted that Nikita Mikhalkov was the author of the text for the anthem of Russia. Gogol wrote a trilogy, the first part of which was called “Mother”. He is the author of the novel Storm, in which the main character cheated on her husband, then had an abortion and threw herself under the train. According to respondents, this work cannot be excluded from the school curriculum, because schoolchildren need to learn from someone else's experience in order not to make such mistakes. Stanislavsky, Nemirovich and Danchenko founded the theater, and when he began to make a profit, Stanislavsky and Nemirovich “threw” Danchenko - these are bastards, they did wrong. In World War II, 50 thousand people died. Napoleon was cooler than Bonaparte. Zhukov for the victory over Napoleon in the battle on the Kursk Bulge 350 years ago received the rank of Field Marshal. Well, Bazarov drowned Mumu - a bastard!

      Here is a generation for you (not all!), But most of it, stained by pop music, Hollywood and the Russian reform of education - they don’t go to the theater, they don’t know history at all, they don’t read anything, who wrote some anthem - Nikita Mikhalkov or Fedor Bondarchuk - to them in FIG.

      The video we posted on YouTube. It was even sadder to read some comments - “Yes, and I don’t know that. What for?" "How will this help me in life?" "What kind of Pavlik Morozov and Zhukov - why the hell am I doing this?" And in the same vein.

      Many more accused us of interviewing 100 people, and then we made a cut of the 10 most stupid. I would be glad if that were so. But he looked at the source - yes, they were smart, developed and knowledgeable. About three out of thirty people.

      But this is surprising (someone made this observation in the comments), despite the complete ignorance of everything, oddly enough - in general, all the respondents had a rough idea of ​​who Rurik was and answered correctly: “The First Russian Prince”! Did I really get everyone like that with my historical essays and film? :) youtu.be/oMjT8fNrO8E

      Article and comments to it here http://trueinform.ru/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=13305
      video:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8zBji44Jfg&feature=player_embedded
      1. marsel1524
        marsel1524 April 29 2013 06: 46 New
        +1

        Doesn’t resemble anything? Can I try to conduct polls in other cities and towns?
        1. sergo0000
          sergo0000 April 29 2013 07: 22 New
          +1

          Doesn’t resemble anything? Can I try to conduct polls in other cities and towns?



          Try winked Although I’m not sure that they know the story better in the hinterland. Well, and as an example, your video, which was shot in the USSR by the way, are such "little ones who are now sitting on forums and learning history again. And where is the USSR now !?"
          1. marsel1524
            marsel1524 April 29 2013 07: 53 New
            11
            I tried it :), distracted my students from practical work on site building. Who is Zhukov, Kutuzov and who took Kazan, everyone knows, about who threw Nemirovich or Danchenko :) they answered that it was one person, the director, and so on. Pushkin fired with Dantes, and Lermontov with Martynov, answered 8 out of 12 (half a class, the rest will be in the second lesson), they didn’t have guns :), Ostrovsky wrote "Thunderstorm" and so on. So, not everything is so bad, at least for us. MOBU secondary school №2 s. Kyrgyz-Miyaki of the Republic of Bashkortostan, I write a post at a break, so the learning process was not damaged :)
            1. vilenich
              vilenich April 29 2013 08: 29 New
              +5
              Quote: marsel1524
              MOBU secondary school №2 s. Kyrgyz-Miyaki Republic of Bashkortostan,

              It means honor and praise to your teaching staff or, as young people now say, respect and respect !!!
              1. sergo0000
                sergo0000 April 29 2013 08: 48 New
                +5
                Quote: vilenich
                Quote: marsel1524
                MOBU secondary school №2 s. Kyrgyz-Miyaki Republic of Bashkortostan,

                It means honor and praise to your teaching staff or, as young people now say, respect and respect !!!

                Join us! hi
                In big cities, the situation is different. In addition, there are also enough “liberal alternatives” who, for bribes coming from NGOs, also fight for the minds of our children and, as the youth say, what "Blow in the ears" all heresy.
      2. Denis
        Denis April 29 2013 07: 53 New
        +3
        There was some kind of broadcast where the wives of the stars (football players, etc.) answered in much the same way, except that they grimaced at the camera more. One lady didn’t believe in her kindness, she decided that they specifically want to expose them so stupid. I decided to check, and she teacher. After questions posed to the children, or rather their answers, she fell into a trance and the most frequently used phrase was "Horror, b ...!"
        Brought the teacher
      3. pensioner
        pensioner April 29 2013 09: 28 New
        +5
        Quote: sergo0000
        “Yes, and I don't know that. What for?" "How will this help me in life?" "What kind of Pavlik Morozov and Zhukov - why the hell am I doing this?"

        We are going with a driver (then he was 26 years old) on a long trip on an UAZ vehicle. Do not be silent. We are talking. It's about the war. I ask - "Who do you know Zhukov?" Answer: "There was such a leader in Ancient Rus." Okay, then I ask: “Where is Barnaul located?”. Answer: "I have not been there, so I don’t know." Then it became quite interesting to me. "Have you ever seen a map of Russia?" Answer: "Why?" After a long pause to the question “Who is Gagarin”, “It seems the astronaut”, and Moscow has the westernmost point of Russia. In good standing with the authorities. But the bosses generally need that in addition to the driver’s skills, would he know anything about Zhukov?
  7. valokordin
    valokordin April 29 2013 06: 24 New
    +3
    The article is modern and correct, I guarantee, with a GDP history book will be the same as it is supposed by the anticommunists Pivovarov, Svinadze, Ryzhiy, Yablinsky. It’s like a hymn to the music of Aleksandrov, and the words of the repainted Count S. Mikhalkov. and the Textbook is needed, however, the opposite point of view must be presented in it.
    1. domokl
      domokl April 29 2013 06: 33 New
      +4
      Quote: valokordin
      A textbook is needed, however, the opposite point of view must be presented in it.
      Remember the nursery rhyme - Baby son came to his father and asked the baby, What is good and what is bad?
      Imagine a mess in the head of an 10-11 summer child, if the textbook will present different points of view on the same event? We put the basic knowledge into the child’s head as the foundation for building a house.
      Once the teacher told us, the Russians came from the Slavs. We are now repeating this as a fact. However, you understand that this is not entirely so ....
      1. Day 11
        Day 11 April 29 2013 22: 20 New
        0
        Where can I go? I have a Tatar wife (a very beautiful woman).
    2. Lopatov
      Lopatov April 29 2013 08: 45 New
      0
      Textbooks should have information. And absolutely neutral ratings. Attempts to form a “correct point of view” in most cases lead to subconscious rejection, as evidenced by the many years of activity with the companion Savanidze.
      1. valokordin
        valokordin April 29 2013 09: 20 New
        +2
        Quote: Spade
        Textbooks should have information. And absolutely neutral ratings. Attempts to form a “correct point of view” in most cases lead to subconscious rejection, as evidenced by the many years of activity with the companion Savanidze.

        The textbook cannot be neutral. The most neutral textbook is the history of the USSR,
        1. Day 11
          Day 11 April 29 2013 09: 25 New
          0
          I wonder what the textbook “History of Russia 20-21 Century” would look like, say, written by Prokhanov? Probably also one-sided. It’s not easy. There is no truth in the world!
          1. kuga
            kuga April 29 2013 12: 56 New
            +1
            Prokhanov is trying at the Izborsk club. There are already results.
            For example, ON THE SIDE OF “RED” AND “WHITE”.

            Roughly, but the main thing is not given an assessment of history, but tools for the perception of historical facts.
        2. kuga
          kuga April 29 2013 12: 52 New
          +3
          I agree. The history textbook cannot be neutral.

          In my opinion, a history textbook should primarily provide tools and methods for the analysis and understanding of history, and not at all an assessment of history.
          And these methods and tools should be Russian, not foreign.
  8. fenix57
    fenix57 April 29 2013 06: 27 New
    +2
    Hello!
    Quote: domokl
    A history textbook is now a dream. Alas, but the dream is still not marketable. Why? Yes, simply because Russia is at the turn of the epochs, up and down ..

    History is now "played" by the one who orders it at the current historical period.

    Quote: domokl
    No idea no

    An idea is not needed here - objectivity in presentation and no more. hi
    1. domokl
      domokl April 29 2013 06: 42 New
      +4
      Quote: fenix57
      An idea is not needed here - objectivity in presentation and no more.
      Objectivity? The German spy works against the USSR-enemy ... Our intelligence is a hero. You can’t be the bearer of some idea and at the same time be completely objective. The mother of the criminal is always for his son .. Whatever he did ... And the mother of the victim is always against, for the same reasons.
      You take your own point of view as a criterion for evaluating .. And who said that it is correct?
      1. Denis
        Denis April 29 2013 07: 56 New
        0
        Quote: domokl
        You take your own point of view as a criterion for evaluating .. And who said that it is correct?
        So the author or authors of the textbook will also be based on their point of view
        1. domokl
          domokl April 29 2013 09: 31 New
          +1
          [quote = Denis] So the author or authors of the textbook will also be based on their point of view

          So you read my comments here .. I’m talking about this. As long as Russia does not work out a national idea that will unite it, there will be no textbook ...
        2. AleksUkr
          AleksUkr April 29 2013 17: 05 New
          +1
          - Jesus Christ said that thought is even more important than action. "In the created kingdom of God, thought is as real as action."

          From the article: !!! History textbook: truth or ideology ???
          A single textbook implies one look at the whole past of Russia, starting with Rurik and ending with Soviet and post-Soviet times. Moreover, Putin does not particularly hide the fact that it is not so much about history as about ideology. For example, he says: “If we are within the framework of a single state, we must cherish this and increase this power (that is, the power of a single state). But this must be done with modern, subtle, effective methods. ” This is what they say about ideology: subtly and effectively put certain ideas into people's heads.
          It is noteworthy that in this entire speech of Mr. Putin there is not a single word that the history textbook should contain historical truth, that there must be facts, they must be true and nothing important should be omitted. The lack of a presumption of truth is a characteristic feature of ideology, and it sits firmly in the heads of so many of our people, and not even necessarily connected with the authorities. Many times I heard: well, finally tell me what to believe in history? And you need to believe only the facts. Everyone will make estimates on the basis of their moral guidelines.

          Some opinions on the forums:
          -New project on the introduction of unanimity in Russia. The prophet was the never-existing Kozma Prutkov.
          -Never we will have not biased textbooks, not even a textbook of literature, let alone history — all the more ... Orwell also showed this beautifully in his novel 1984. The authorities (any) need an obedient people. History textbooks play an important role in this ... And who dares to create such a textbook? And if he decides, then who will allow? ...
          -History is the most deceitful science. Each mode interprets everything as it suits it.
          Whatever Putin says, a “reliable” textbook will not work anyway. He was the first to pervert many facts as he needed. This is the whole sadness ...
          - Mr. Putin’s desire for a “unified” ideology, as a means of uniting the country, can lead to exactly the opposite results. Only here, as bloodless as in the 91st, is unlikely to succeed in Russia. Too much money now at Putin and his friends from the lake cooperative. Without a second Civil, they will not give up these capitals.

          AND MORE IN THE SAME SPIRIT ....

          CONCLUSION:
          Russia to the bar of a normal state as to the moon crawl cancer ...
    2. Day 11
      Day 11 April 29 2013 09: 27 New
      0
      Objectivity can also be presented in different ways (with a bias on one or another action)
  9. borisjdin1957
    borisjdin1957 April 29 2013 06: 32 New
    +1
    from the Don.
    The article is written on time, thanks to the author!
    I am more inclined to the last paragraph of the article. It is necessary to state the facts, without speculation.
  10. Belogor
    Belogor April 29 2013 06: 33 New
    +2
    It is one thing to teach history, it is another thing to educate on the history of a citizen of his country. In general, every fact of history can be interpreted in any way, as anyone. To a greater extent depends on the teacher, but of course the textbook should also, somehow correspond to the task.
  11. Svobodny
    Svobodny April 29 2013 06: 41 New
    -1
    free education and medicine, decent salaries and pensions., i.e. of what Lenin proclaimed

    Ilyich also called:

    * "Pour acid on your heads and rob banks!" “I’m horrified, by golly with horror, I see that they have been talking about bombs for more than six months and haven’t done a single one! .. Let them immediately organize units from 3 to 10, up to 30, etc. person. Let them immediately arm themselves, as much as they can, some with a revolver, some with a knife, some with a rag with kerosene for arson ... "(Lenin V.I. Poln. Sobr. Soch. T.11. S. 336-337, 338, 340 , 343.)


    Here is another quote from him: “... Great Russians cannot“ defend the fatherland ”otherwise than wanting defeat in tsarism in any war”; “The slogan of“ peace ”is incorrect, the slogan should be the transformation of a national war into a civil war”; "The least evil would be the defeat of the tsarist monarchy and its troops."

    Lenin

    September-December 1914

    (Lenin V.I. Poln. Sobr. Soch. T. 26. S. 108-109, 6; Lenin collection. T. 2. P. 195)

    AND THERE IS ANOTHER: "Shoot anyone without asking!

    "Saratov, [to the authorized person of the People's Commissariat of Food] Paykes

    ... I advise you to appoint your bosses and shoot conspirators and hesitant, without asking anyone and not allowing idiotic red tape. ” (Lenin V.I. Poln. Sobr. Soch. T. 50.P. 165.)
    It should be noted that the Red Terror was declared on September 2, 1918, but in reality it was unleashed before the announcement, before the attempt on Lenin on August 30, 1918, and was not a response to the attempt.

    Read full here: Extremism in the works of Lenin

    In my opinion, every schoolchild should know that Lenin is the first enemy of the Russian people ... In our history there are evidence that no longer requires proof. Bolshevism is evil. It is a fact. Should our children know about this? - It is obvious that yes.
    1. explorer
      explorer April 29 2013 08: 40 New
      +1
      Quote: Svobodny
      Should our children know about this? - It is obvious that yes.

      Who argues about this - should, but with additions:
      - part of what is attributed to Lenin in the MSS, is the fruit of Trotsky's labor.
      - with comments, who gave money for the maintenance of the CPSU (b),
      - what would the preservation of the “democrats" -a la Kerensky in power in the 17th, etc., lead to?

      From the following:
      At one time I read one story about a swamp in one aul (?): It was a source of disease and infection, but on the other hand it provided a means of combating it: leeches.
      So Bolshevism - this is the same swamp - is all ambiguous. Like everything in history.
      And what else would be in place of Bolshevism, another question.
      1. Svobodny
        Svobodny April 29 2013 08: 52 New
        -2
        Quote: explorer
        what would the preservation of the "democrats" -a la Kerensky in power in the 17th, etc., lead to?

        And it’s scary to imagine what the traitors in power would lead Russia to.

        Bolshevism - this is the same swamp - everything is ambiguous

        With the swamp - I agree, this is a swamp. I do not agree with the ambiguity. Definitely everything is quite. The Bolsheviks destroyed historical Russia.
        1. kuga
          kuga April 29 2013 13: 07 New
          +5
          So the Bolsheviks staged February 1917? Yes Yes.

          The Bolsheviks gave Russia a new historical chance.
    2. kuga
      kuga April 29 2013 13: 06 New
      +2
      Another liberal govnovbros. something is taken out of context, something is simply invented, and most importantly, historical realities are not taken into account. Now they are sitting warm at the computer and do not understand what time it was then.


      Why is the ancient cathedral full of holes? - Because for a hundred years the obese pop here, hiccuping, took bribes and traded vodka.

      Why are they spoiling in kindly manor estates? “Because they raped and flogged the girls there: the wrong gentleman, so the neighbor.”

      Why are the centennial parks felled? “Because for a hundred years, under their spreading lindens and maples, the gentlemen showed their power: they poked a beggar in the nose with a beast, and a fool with education.

      It's like that.

      I know what I am saying. A horse will not go around. There is no way to keep silent about this; but all, however, are silent.

      A.A. Block 1918
      http://dugward.ru/library/blok/blok_int_i_rev.html
      1. Svobodny
        Svobodny April 29 2013 13: 15 New
        0
        kuga, you copied your comment from here http://oleg-egr.livejournal.com/109653.html?thread=2394965? Multiply them? wink
  12. roach
    roach April 29 2013 06: 50 New
    +3
    Quote: Renat
    No Yankee can boast such a rich history as you and I, the citizens of Russia the Great, have.


    ... at the same time the so-called the Yankees are a patriot of their country, and we ... "boast" of managing to pour shit on both our country and our rich history (to hell with Svanidze, but what did valokordin do wrong Sergey Mikhalkov?) and ... ourselves, in the end of the ends.
    1. Maximus
      Maximus April 29 2013 10: 35 New
      0
      True, I think that many “Yankees” know about Pearl Harbor, (based on their general knowledge of history), and they cannot connect our two words about the Battle of Stalingrad.
  13. fenix57
    fenix57 April 29 2013 06: 55 New
    +4
    Quote: domokl
    Objectivity? A German spy works against the USSR-enemy ... Our intelligence hero.

    Someone argued, I do not. But HISTORY OF RUSSIA in my SUBJECTIVE opinion is to be written from the point of view of real realities and political interests ...
    Russia - Sphinx.
    Rejoicing and mourning
    And bleeding black blood,
    She looks, strokes, looks at you,
    And with hatred, and with love! ..

    Alexander Alexandrovich Block
  14. ImPerts
    ImPerts April 29 2013 06: 56 New
    +6
    Truth is born in a dispute. But I am afraid that the "new historians" will not argue. They will be closed and the whole debate will be reduced to a howl with a simultaneous appeal to the "world democratic community." Accustomed to operate with emotions and artwork. As textbooks were created before. Below are excerpts:
    http://lib.babr.ru/?book=6858
    "Dzhugashvili (Stalin) Joseph Vissarionovich
    The economic problems of socialism in the USSR
    To the participants in the economic discussion

    Comments on Economic Issues Related to the November 1951 Discussion

    I got all documents on the economic discussion held in connection with the evaluation of the draft textbook of political economy. He received, inter alia, “Suggestions for improving the draft textbook of political economy”, “Suggestions for the elimination of errors and inaccuracies” in the draft, and “Information on controversial issues”.

    For all these materials, as well as for the draft textbook, I consider it necessary to make the following comments.
    ...
    10
    WAYS TO IMPROVE THE DRAFT TEXTBOOK FOR POLITICAL ECONOMY

    During the discussion, some comrades too zealously “delivered” the draft textbook, scolded its authors for errors and omissions, argued that the draft failed. This is unfair. Of course, errors and omissions are in the textbook - they are almost always in a big deal. But be that as it may, the vast majority of participants in the discussion nevertheless recognized that the draft textbook can serve as the basis for the future textbook and needs only some amendments and additions. Indeed, one only has to compare the draft textbook with the available textbooks of political economy in order to conclude that the draft textbook is a whole head taller than existing textbooks. The great merit of the authors of the draft textbook is that.

    I think that to improve the draft textbook, a small commission should be appointed including not only the authors of the textbook and not only supporters of the majority of the participants in the discussion, but also opponents of the majority, ardent critics of the draft textbook.
    It would be nice to include also experienced statisticians in the commission to check the numbers and introduce new statistical materials into the draft, as well as an experienced lawyer to verify the accuracy of the wording.
    The members of the commission should be temporarily freed from any other work, providing them fully in material terms, so that they could completely devote themselves to work on the textbook.
    In addition, an editorial commission should be appointed, say, of three people for the final edition of the textbook. It is also necessary in order to achieve unity of style, which, unfortunately, is not in the draft textbook.
    The deadline for submitting a finished textbook to the Central Committee is 1 year.

    J. Stalin
    1952, 1 February. ”

    About literate legal wording very much. This is very lacking in regulatory documents. angry
    1. vilenich
      vilenich April 29 2013 10: 47 New
      +1
      Quote: ImPerts
      But I am afraid that the "new historians" will not argue. They will be closed and the whole debate will be reduced to howling with an appeal to the “world democratic community”.

      You know, this is reminiscent of one saying (unfortunately by an unknown author):
      The Promethean case is in the reliable hands of the Herostrats.
  15. Temer
    Temer April 29 2013 06: 59 New
    0
    Everything is correct. The history textbook should state the facts dryly. But it was bad or good, it's up to the readers to judge.
    1. djon3volta
      djon3volta April 29 2013 07: 23 New
      +5
      so you can just return the Soviet textbook and do not change anything, add another 10-15 pages 1991-2011 and that's it. what was the point of renaming the POLICE to the POLICE? why not the GENDARMERY then?
      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov April 29 2013 08: 48 New
        +3
        Because the gendarmerie has a different function.
      2. Maximus
        Maximus April 29 2013 10: 31 New
        +1
        In the Soviet textbook, some facts, how to say it, are “a little distorted,” and there are generally “white spots” for example the First World War, we know more from the history of the Greco-Persian wars than many important events and facts of our own history.
  16. krpmlws
    krpmlws April 29 2013 07: 07 New
    +4
    Firstly, there is no signature for the article. Who is the author, with whom to polemic? Well, probably someone from the site’s editorial office. Perplexity causes uncertainty, uncertainty, and reeling of the author. Although he draws conclusions in the right direction, but a lot of questions liberal questions. In general, what are we talking about? A history textbook for our children. It is necessary to decide on the concept of the textbook. All these ooh yes the author’s ahs are senseless and harmful. What do we want from the textbook? For the children to be brought up in the right direction: in the spirit of patriotism, love to the homeland, while they studied the true information on the history of Russia and the world. What about the negative aspects of the history of Russia? There is no sense in hiding them, since the effect may be the opposite when the person independently encounters this information. At the same time, negative aspects must be metered, In general terms. How to assess the personalities of Russian statesmen? According to the results of their work: to become Russia strong, then appropriate assessments should be followed and vice versa. Do not ignore the negative facts in history in this plan (the destruction of the Russian Empire, the USSR) and adequate assessments of the personalities involved (both patriots and villains). This is important, reasons must be shown, lessons learned and ways to prevent the recurrence of tragic events in the future. The child should receive a system at the lessons of history coordinates, in which a citizen of a great country clearly saw his place, received a sense of national dignity and self-sufficiency, without a sense of national inferiority and envy of other nations.
    1. Normal
      Normal April 29 2013 07: 43 New
      +4
      Quote: krpmlws
      Firstly, there is no signature under the article. Who is the author, with whom to polemic? Well, well, probably someone from the site

      Go to the DMB profile, read the comments. The author is a long-standing and well-known visitor to the site.
      Quote: krpmlws
      The child should receive a coordinate system in the lessons of history, in which he clearly saw his place as a citizen of a great country, received a sense of national dignity and self-sufficiency, without a sense of national inferiority and envy of other nations.

      I agree with you.
  17. Bigriver
    Bigriver April 29 2013 07: 10 New
    +5
    "... they wrote about Stalin without fanfare, but also without dirt, achievements under Nikita were not hushed up. Maybe it’s worthwhile for secondary school to return to this form of presentation, but for inquiring minds, we’ll leave the opportunity to rummage through the Internet on our own and visit libraries more often."

    I consider such a detached work - a worthless tool for anything. Moreover, I consider this approach "surrender" of our Russian and Soviet history to our geopolitical opponents. Surrender to them.
    The child needs a holistic view of the past "from ancient times to the present day."
    A solid foundation, a meaningful look at your story is needed.
    One cannot do without interpretations, conclusions, ideology.
    1. sergo0000
      sergo0000 April 29 2013 09: 40 New
      +3
      Quote: BigRiver
      One cannot do without interpretations, conclusions, ideology.

      That's for sure! +
      With the same success, the student can google. A textbook for children, which means that he must also have an educational function.
  18. Temer
    Temer April 29 2013 07: 21 New
    +3
    Quote: BigRiver
    One cannot do without interpretations, conclusions, ideology.


    most importantly, liberals with tolerasts should not be allowed to develop ideologies.
  19. Denis
    Denis April 29 2013 07: 35 New
    +2
    Well, Gorbachev and Yeltsin are the saviors of the Fatherland, so don’t go to your grandmother. However, the reaction of most normal people to these two historical “scumbags” is quite adequate
    These are those who remember. The children did not find this mess, so different figures decided to whiten themselves even in the textbook
  20. Bort radist
    Bort radist April 29 2013 07: 40 New
    +2
    A story without an assessment of events is a "tear-off calendar", dates and holidays. Writing the perfect textbook is IMPOSSIBLE without evaluating events. The history of the people should not depend on the textbook, the textbook is not the LAW. A lot depends on the attitude of the people to their history. The significance of many events has been understood through centuries. Tyrants become - saviors, "saviors" - Judas.
  21. Svobodny
    Svobodny April 29 2013 07: 48 New
    0
    Quote: BigRiver
    The child needs a holistic view of the past "from ancient times to the present day"


    I completely agree with you. Finally, it is necessary to call white white, black black, and holy holy. As long as we ourselves, within present-day Russia, we will rush about in the assessments of HOLY PRINCE Alexander Nevsky, for example, calling him either a traitor to Russia or a prudent henchman of the Horde (point of view, ponimash), forgetting about the main thing - about his HOLINESS, which we have the right to reason about the fact that somewhere in Esengovia they perverted our common history, humiliated the role of the Russian people in the Victory over fascism, and rewrote history.

    That is why a single textbook is REQUIRED. Only for its writing you need to attract PROFESSIONALS, and most importantly - carriers of traditional Russian spirituality.
  22. Normal
    Normal April 29 2013 07: 56 New
    +3
    The history of the country for the younger generation should be glorious, great and heroic. Only in this case is it possible to instill patriotism and love for the Fatherland in children. Thoughtful digging in history, evaluating various actions and statements of historical figures in isolation from the historical situation and conditions, criticism and debunking will not lead to anything good. It is enough to recall the chernukha of the late 80s, the beginning of the 90s to understand this.
    But whether the current government will succeed in creating such a textbook. Is the government interested in objective and comprehensive coverage of history? I have big doubts. Too often, GDP says one thing, and its appointees and associates do the exact opposite.
  23. Old warrant officer
    Old warrant officer April 29 2013 08: 29 New
    +4
    History as a textbook has always been and will be biased. She wrote and will write for the sake of momentary rulers and customers. Only a person living in a given period can judge a particular period of history more or less biased. And the farther inland, the more discrepancies and inaccuracies, bias and bias! Unfortunately, it is impossible to win! A more or less truthful history textbook can be compiled provided that experts from a wide variety of political and public views are involved in this work, and even then it is unlikely to please everyone. As an alternative, only specific facts, events and documents can be considered, leaving the students themselves an opportunity to try to independently evaluate these or other historical events. But personally, I still think that a new textbook will whitewash some and blacken others, as they say in Odessa - whoever dines with a girl dances her!
  24. Bigriver
    Bigriver April 29 2013 08: 35 New
    +4
    I joked here how the new textbook sees GDP.

    The head of state voiced the idea: the new educational literature should be "built in the framework of a single concept, within the framework of a single logic of continuous Russian history, the interconnection of all its stages, respect for all pages of our past ". Vladimir Putin explained: Russia is a multinational country, and the contribution that our many peoples have made to its development is still fully appreciated. "It is necessary to show with concrete examples that the fate of Russia was created by the unity of different peoples, traditions and cultures. I add that the textbooks for the school should be written in good Russian and not have internal contradictions and double interpretations."

    It turns out that in the framework of the Eurasian concept will be.
    If so, we will not find liberals and universal people in the authors' collective.
    1. baltika-18
      baltika-18 April 29 2013 08: 59 New
      +3
      Quote: BigRiver
      I will add that the textbooks for the school should be written in good Russian and not have internal contradictions and double interpretations. "

      Quote: BigRiver
      It turns out that in the framework of the Eurasian concept will be.
      If so, we will not find liberals and universal people in the authors' collective.

      And it seems to me that it is just the general people that we will receive.
      Let’s see .... What’s the story? Literature and Russian language textbooks have been written by universal people.
      That's where the nightmare is.
      And history ... History is part of ideology, the same event can be interpreted differently. We do not have ideology ....
      How will it be? A simple statement of a set of facts. Where did Putin first mention the new history textbook?
      In the Jewish Museum of Tolerance. Symbolically, however .....
      1. Bigriver
        Bigriver April 29 2013 09: 09 New
        +2
        Quote: baltika-18

        And it seems to me that it is just the general people that we will receive.
        We'll see....

        Let's see, of course.
        But Chesslov, I do not see the logic of the first statement. Given the stated goal - EAC.
        The ideological basis of such a future union is the Eurasian concept of Alexander Dugin. Universal human beings and liberals (as “Westerners”) are in strict contrast with this idea.
      2. Normal
        Normal April 29 2013 09: 37 New
        +1
        Quote: baltika-18
        In the Jewish Museum of Tolerance. Symbolically, however .....
        That's it! Greetings, Nikolay.
        Typically, the result of an activity will be directly opposite to the stated objectives:
        Quote: baltika-18
        just universal man and get.

        Russians will be completely removed from history and some “Russians” will be left alone and everything in the spirit
        Quote: BigRiver
        EAC.
  25. Asgard
    Asgard April 29 2013 09: 01 New
    +6
    History books should educate from citizens - patriots ...
    Moreover, in our history there is something to be proud of, there are Real Heroes, glorious deeds, and leadership in all positions. No need to invent anything, We must not forget .... our great past. And It was just that ...
    1. AleksUkr
      AleksUkr April 29 2013 17: 15 New
      +1
      There is something to be proud of. In this I completely agree with you.
      BUT REALITIES ABSOLUTELY OTHER:
      After all, we have not only life, but also school textbooks on concepts: first - Joseph Vissarionovich, later - the Central Committee of the CPSU, nowadays - Vladimir Vladimirovich and his "United Russia". And it’s time for us to break out of this vicious circle - no way. We continue to march along the old rake. Yes, and we plan to distribute them to schoolchildren again.
      George Jans.
  26. Day 11
    Day 11 April 29 2013 09: 14 New
    +2
    The article is really relevant. If the bastard Svinidze puts his hand in writing a textbook, write is gone. Somewhere I still have a Soviet history textbook (I need to dig in the country), I think 5-7 grades. Let my daughter study history on it ( naturally after my censorship).
    1. Maximus
      Maximus April 29 2013 10: 25 New
      0
      And why, for example, do you specifically apply your censorship in the Soviet textbook?
      1. Day 11
        Day 11 April 29 2013 10: 35 New
        0
        Party-Our Steering !!!
        1. Maximus
          Maximus April 29 2013 10: 53 New
          0
          "We don’t need the sun; we need a party;
          1. Uzoliv
            Uzoliv April 29 2013 11: 22 New
            0
            Spring has come, summer will come - thanks to the party for this! belay
          2. Day 11
            Day 11 April 29 2013 12: 13 New
            0
            If a woman is beautiful and hot in bed,
            This is a personal merit of Leonid Ilyich!
            1. IRBIS
              IRBIS April 29 2013 18: 51 New
              +1
              I’ll add my own “five cents”:
              Today is a holiday for the guys -
              Jubilant Pioneer!
              Today I came to visit us
              Lavrenty Palych Beria!
              1. Day 11
                Day 11 April 29 2013 22: 41 New
                0
                What did you want to say by this? We should be delighted? Or maybe the other way around, be upset! If you wanted to humiliate Lavrenty Pavlovich with something, I won’t be with you
    2. Black
      Black April 29 2013 14: 37 New
      0
      Quote: Den 11
      Somewhere I still had a Soviet history textbook (I need to dig in the country), in my opinion, grade 5-7. Let my daughter study history on it (naturally after my censorship).

      Have you read modern Danilin Kosulina? The Soviet side is not just not standing, and not even lying.
      1. Day 11
        Day 11 April 29 2013 17: 10 New
        0
        I'll see, be sure to leaf through. Thank you!
  27. Tartary
    Tartary April 29 2013 10: 05 New
    +5
    Quote: Den 11
    The article is really relevant. If the bastard Svinidze puts his hand to the textbook, write it is gone.

    Svanidze must be driven from television screens by a filthy broom!
    Gozman is generally worth anilizing - here is a ghoul so a ghoul ...
    Yesterday, Solovyov said that one, that the other drove such nonsense, that I just want to ask: - What kind of grass do true (!) Liberals smoke? Judging by the situation, they prevent it with wormwood ...

    Quote: Den 11
    Somewhere I still had a Soviet history textbook (I need to dig in the country), in my opinion, grade 5-7. Let my daughter study history on it (naturally after my censorship).

    So I think that our “historians” would have hidden their desire to leave their mark in History in the form of textbooks to hell, but would have taken Soviet textbooks (at least until the 5th grade) and reprinted for our beloved ( !) children ...
    And then I read from a small task in a textbook on the Russian language for the 3rd grade and I directly understand that it was not Russians who wrote them, but semi-literate neoliberals who translated them from foreign countries.
    Literature is finally a separate topic — no matter the verse, the young "classic" of the poetic genre - I feel really sick, the right word ...
    Ugh ...
    That's because it was not our foundations that the enemies laid in the textbooks for our children, children do not understand the morality of parents born in the USSR.
  28. Maximus
    Maximus April 29 2013 10: 23 New
    0
    It is impossible to become like amers, and write one-sidedly, or even rewrite history, but it is hardly possible to please the “red” and “white”.
  29. Black
    Black April 29 2013 10: 33 New
    +1
    My strong conviction is that "it will turn out as always" again.
    Patriots will not be allowed to write.
    And in general, until the country becomes stable, when we understand what we are, where we are going, what we are striving for, what we are building, then maybe such a textbook will be possible.
    In the meantime, I’m sure we will get another stumbling block of opinions and assessments.
  30. zav
    zav April 29 2013 10: 33 New
    +5
    "Do you know why the national idea is hidden from the people?
    Because a state that has one and a half dozen major nations and nationalities and a hundred more small ones has big problems with writing a national idea. It is known that the Russian people, the state-forming people of Russia, are a nation of peasants, artisans and warriors, and this peculiarity should be reflected in its national idea. And although other peoples with similar lifestyles live next to the Russians, they pray to another god, and therefore their nacidea should look somewhat different. Among the southern peoples grazing cattle in alpine meadows, it is completely the third, and the northern peoples, hunting animals on the arctic coast, may be able to live in a completely unprotected state. The state cannot limit itself in writing ideas to general universal phrases, since each nation will tend to think that this is not such an honor, and the idea will remain a piece of paper, not a guide to action. That is, the idea will not ignite. Writing national characteristics and priorities of all nations separately is also not the best way out, since no one will guarantee that ideas from neighboring paragraphs of a document do not conflict with each other, and that a contradiction on paper does not translate into a standoff on the street. And the document itself, which should fit in several lines, will turn into a chubby and boring volume and will lose the right to be called in a concise and vivid manner, a lofty goal and source of inspiration that has a profound effect on the actions of the masses. "
  31. Vtel
    Vtel April 29 2013 14: 06 New
    +2
    The beginning of the article is not bad about figures trying to rewrite history according to their near vision, they see a great attraction to laurels. But then ...

    The question is not easier with the surplus. Let me remind you that it was not the "bloody Bolsheviks" who introduced it, but the priest Tsar Nikolai, and that it was introduced not out of a desire to "eradicate the Russian people", but because of the vital necessity in a warring country.

    but here's a hint - Only bread was part of the tsarist layout, and almost all food was part of the Soviet one. First, in the young Soviet state, bread and grain were selected. Then, from 1919 - potatoes, meat, and by the end of 1920 - almost all agricultural products. Food was seized at the advice of the peasants almost for free. Under the tsar, bread was bought from peasants for real money, and not for devalued pieces of paper, and transportation to the station was paid, as a stimulating measure at the suggestion of Rittich, at the expense of the Ministry of Agriculture. The Tsarist unfolding was voluntary (!) - this is perhaps the most significant difference. And there is not a single factual confirmation of the existence of food detachments, food armies and the use of troops to extort bread under the tsar. That is, there is a big difference in goals, volumes and results.

    After all, whatever one may say, Stalin, like his predecessors, and we will not dissemble followers, built socialism. That is, the formation that Lenin began to build, and which Khrushchev and Brezhnev continued to build.

    Indeed, if not to dissemble, then both Lenin and Khrushchev are just an instrument of the kosher International - building a subordinate raw-material state, obedient to their ideology, especially a comrade from an armored car and a successor to their ideas, a corn-nerd, and Stalin did not fit into their "performance" although of course he had excesses too. Therefore, it is better to put them together in a line - a completely different perspective and goals.

    By the way, it is not clear why "kukuruznik" (this is just clear) Nikita has recently been called a Trotskyite.

    A classic example of Trotskyism can be the speech of N. S. Khrushchev at the XX Congress of the CPSU in 1956. He adopted the main thesis of L. D. Trotsky that I. V. Stalin, relying on bureaucracy and striving for power, deformed socialism in the USSR and that the fight against Stalin is a return to "Leninist democratic socialism." To the ideological heritage of L. D. Trotsky.
  32. Oleg1986
    Oleg1986 April 29 2013 15: 16 New
    +1
    Only mentally unhealthy people can glorify the bald man who drowned the country in blood with Trotsky. About "terry fans of pre-revolutionary Russia" - and the author, like that clown, is all in white. That is, in red.
    People are trying to find a common language, points of unity, and this dmb sees nobody but the scum 3 of the international, point blank. They don’t even touch his mummy from Red Square - let the descendants not accepted by the Russian land lie there for edification. But all the same, itching at someone to screw the "illich lamp."
  33. Day 11
    Day 11 April 29 2013 15: 29 New
    0
    Yes, it’s time to throw this Form into the pit! He doesn’t bring much money, it’s time to dump history!
  34. knn54
    knn54 April 29 2013 16: 40 New
    +1
    Such as Svanidze and Pivovarov will not cross out pro-Western and Russophobic interpretations of our historical past from the school curriculum.
    The textbook should be such that everyone who reads it could be proud that it is RUSSIAN.
    PS About the famous Soviet party leader Anastas Mikoyan with his unique political vitality they said: "from Ilyich to Ilyich without a heart attack and paralysis." What will they write about him, about Serdyukov, Chubais ...
    1. Denis
      Denis April 29 2013 17: 10 New
      0
      Quote: knn54
      About the famous Soviet party leader Anastas Mikoyan
      About him, I think that there’s not much bad going on. He was rather a business executive than a politician. He started the production of ice cream and not only him. An example is not very successful, compared with these thieves, a real child
      Again, this is my opinion
    2. Day 11
      Day 11 April 29 2013 17: 20 New
      0
      Here, some people on YOUR (Ukrainian) "http://korrespondent.net/site say that" we have already fought each other once (moreover, they give convincing evidence), you can and more. "Is this how to write in the textbook?
  35. SlavaP
    SlavaP April 29 2013 18: 52 New
    +1
    It seems to me that History cannot be objective in nature. You can try to create a single history textbook based on the principle of “basis and superstructure”. The basis is a single thought that goes through the whole book - "Great Great One Indivisible." A powerful modern state with a rich history, a great people and definitely a great future. On this Basis, erect a Superstructure from pure historical facts, presented briefly and impartially. Thus, if a child learns the basic idea from Basis, then it will be 90% of success. And the add-on - everyone can interpret them differently and there is nothing terrible about it. Someone will perceive the facts this way, and someone else, and this is inevitable.
    As an example: “Encyclopedia for children, Volume5 History of Russia and its closest neighbors” Publishing House “Avanta” 2004year UDC087.5: 94 (47) (031) somehow came to me somehow. I always open it with interest and without a shudder - in my opinion it was a good attempt to realize Russian history, you can take it as a basis.
  36. Skuto
    Skuto April 29 2013 19: 33 New
    0
    It is necessary to write about any event, about any historical person from the position of stating the minuses and pluses .... and already the student himself, if interested, will decide for himself how to relate to this. In addition, one must make a mandatory discount on the realities of the time when historical events and personalities took place or lived.
  37. Nikolay-
    Nikolay- April 29 2013 19: 43 New
    0
    The main criterion for assessing historical events is appropriate to determine the benefit for the state. Not a chimera of “human rights,” but an increase in territory, an increase in production, a life expectancy of a population, etc. And it doesn’t matter if specific historical figures succeed in some ways, but in some places are not wealthy. Life is not black and white. So let the whole range of shades be reflected, and for students it will become a priority in assessing historical figures the benefit for the fatherland.
  38. dmb
    April 29 2013 19: 45 New
    +6
    I am grateful for the feedback. On the one hand, it would be possible to envy those people for whom everything is clear, who have no doubts, and therefore they categorically determined the author to be weak-character in person, and who do not want to give a firm assessment. I dare to assure them that the author is able to give estimates and, having spawn, did not hesitate along with the party’s general line or of any President there. The article is not about my attitude to certain events in our history, but about their possible presentation in the textbook for our children and grandchildren. I proposed a variant of the Soviet textbook, as the most objective of their possible. My critics offer nothing but general wishes for “continuity of communication”, “Holiness” and quotes from Putin, in which the specifics are even less. I propose to give dissent concrete examples of what they disagree with in Soviet textbooks. They obviously will not dispute positive moments from the royal heritage, I will turn to negative ones. Ivan the Terrible canceled the possibility of the transition of peasants from the boyar to the boyar. Peter the Great tightened serfdom. Under Catherine, the uprising of Pugachev (the Cossack among other things) was brutally suppressed. The result of the reign of Nicholas I was the international isolation of Russia and the shamefully lost Crimean War. I am silent about the second number, because the result of his reign was a revolution that was not perceived by critics of the Soviet system. Which of the above, according to critics, did not correspond to the truth and should not exist in the Soviet textbook? At the same time, I note that about each of the rulers, except for Nikolaev, there were ten times more positive things in the same textbook. And Nikolai, they really deserve it. Now let's talk about the Soviet era. I already wrote about this in an article. Do you propose adding Lenin’s cruelty to the textbook? Yes, probably it is. Only objectively, with an attempt to objectively find out the causes of this cruelty, not becoming like the notorious Svanidze, but at the same time give an objective assessment of his ideas and their implementation. I emphasize the objective. For me, one phenomenon is still incomprehensible. Most of the critics present on the site, apparently, weren’t at a conscious age under Lenin, but also under Gorbachev. According to the poem, they learned all their knowledge about him exclusively from modern sources, or from the losers of Lenin’s opponents, whose impartiality is hardly believed. As for the modern ones, they are all too often “liberalists and white painters.” As the "pseudo-patriots" believe their writings, I can’t imagine.