Military Review

Russia and Belarus: life-long unification ...

126
Last week, the 17 anniversary of the signing of the treaty marked the appearance of such a thing as the Community of Belarus and Russia. 2 April 1996 of this Community de jure began its work, which was aimed at the active integration of two sovereign states with the possible formation of a state in the future within common borders. Failures during the first Chechen campaign, economic troubles, the weakening of the position of Russian President Yeltsin, and at the same time - the young, enterprising, actively promoting integration of the President of Belarus Alexander Lukashenko contributed to the people separated by a contrived border once again find themselves in a single state, which could well give a significant impetus to the development of both the Russian Federation and the Republic of Belarus.


Russia and Belarus: life-long unification ...


A year later - in April 1997, a new treaty was signed in the Russian capital, which was the beginning of a long road of unification of the two states. From that moment on, Moscow and Minsk began to build in fact a new state, which was called the Union of Russia and Belarus. Outwardly, everything looked quite promising. People on both sides of the border saw that the authorities are ready to create a single territorial unit and are doing a lot to implement their plans. Allied governing bodies were created, rules for crossing the border were simplified significantly, negotiations were held on a possible transition to a single currency, the adoption of common state symbols and other attributes of a single state entity. It seemed, just now, and a single state will definitely appear on the world map. Such confidence among citizens of both Russia and Belarus manifested itself even in January of 2000, when a new document appeared on the strengthening of the integration processes that formed (at least on paper) the Union State.

However, further began to appear quite significant roughness. Each of the parties decided to start looking for special preferences for them to conclude an agreement on the creation of the Union State. Began to show backstage games, a certain side of which was poured into the press of Russia and Belarus. The reasons for pessimism among the citizens of the Union State of Belarus and Russia (CBR) were added after the statements of the top leaders in Minsk and Moscow.

First, a big energy dispute broke out. At the beginning of April 2002, the Russian and Belarusian sides signed an agreement on the supply by Gazprom of Russian gas to the territory of Belarus at the wholesale price, which at that time was slightly more than 30 dollars per 1 thousand cubic meters. In exchange, Moscow proposed Minsk to create a joint venture for the gas transportation industry, which was to appear on the basis of Beltransgaz. Shares were to be divided strictly equally.

Initially, both sides expressed their interest in reaching agreements, but some time later, Minsk received information that the Belarusian leadership was ready to make a deal with Russia if it (the Belarusian side) would have a controlling stake in the joint company - 51%. Suddenly, Belarusian experts also stated that the price of Beltransgaz was initially determined incorrectly, and after assessing it should be taken into account at the level of 5 billion dollars for full ownership of the Beltransgaz stake. Neither this amount, nor 49% of the shares of the joint gas transportation company Gazprom were satisfied, as was reported to the Belarusian leadership. To this, the Belarusian leadership responded with something like “you do not want what you want ...”, which has already led to a response demarche from Gazprom. The gas company decided to sell gas to Belarus not at wholesale prices, but at those prices that would have to “sensitize” the intractable Minsk. The price in the proposed document for signing was raised to the level of 50 dollars for 1000 cubes, which was not agreed by Alexander Lukashenko, accusing the Russian side of trying to put pressure on an independent Belarus. Documents that testified about new gas prices for Belarus, the official authorities of the latter for a long time did not want to sign, which put Belarus in a difficult economic situation.

In Russia, they began to accuse Lukashenko of double standards and abuse of interstate friendship, and in Belarus, in response to this, they began to accuse the Russian leadership and Gazprom of economic blackmail.

As a result, after lengthy negotiations and a series of mutual reproaches, the situation has shifted from a dead end, but the sediment, as they say, has remained. Already with more caution, the authorities of the two states began to talk about full-scale integration. This led to the fact that the Union State was increasingly acquiring a definitive paper status, without going on the path of real incarnation. Against this background, any idea of ​​mutual rapprochement between the two countries was perceived with enthusiasm, but often such ideas remained unfulfilled.

As an example, the idea of ​​introducing the single currency 1 January 2004 in the Union State can be cited. The first person to express such an idea in public was Alexander Lukashenko, who “thawed” somewhat after the gas conflict. But neither in 2004, nor today the single currency of Russia and Belarus did not appear. What is the main reason for such a long delay, which so far does not think to end? The reason is that Belarus was ready to accept the Russian ruble as its domestic currency, too, on the condition that one of the emission centers should be located in Minsk. However, the Russian authorities decided that this would somehow hit the Russian economy, saying that they would not give the go-ahead to open the Russian ruble emission center in the Belarusian capital. The official Minsk regarded this as an unfriendly gesture, and since then the talk about the introduction of the single currency of Russia and Belarus has been conducted in a somewhat sluggish form. Let us not forget that during the rise in the number of oddities of the Russian-Belarusian integration, Kazakhstan entered a similar process, however, the common currency in the Common Economic Space of the three states is also being spoken about only in the future time.

The current state of the integration mechanisms between Russia and Belarus is clearly not straightforward. On the one hand, Moscow and Minsk demonstrate political and economic goodwill, trade between countries grows, citizens of one country can find a job in another country within the framework of the Union State without special problems, but they do not leave the feeling that all integration will move for a very long time sleigh with ungreased runners. As they say, there is no such thing “with a breeze”, but I would like to speed up the process precisely to such indicators.

One of the parties takes the first step, but at the same time asks for some concessions from the second, the second side often does not go to such concessions, instead putting forward its proposals, which seem doubtful to the first party. And so - in a vicious circle ...

A negative thought comes to mind that the authorities of both countries are satisfied with the current state of affairs, and more active integration is presented only as a kind of utopian thought, the realization of which can be sought, but impossible to achieve. A sort of variant of communism, or something ...

This leads to the fact that the peoples of the two states are gradually, but they begin to realize that the real unification into single boundaries may not happen. At least, citizens are pushing for this.

This is evidenced by the results of a sociological survey that was recently conducted in various regions of Belarus. On the question of whether you want Belarus to unite with Russia “yes”, they answered 70% of respondents, although even 10 years ago this figure reached 82%.

Those figures decided to take advantage of people who call themselves oppositionists (both in Russia and Belarus), and in fact are ideological opponents of the unity of fraternal peoples, cultivating only one idea - the idea of ​​total separation in the post-Soviet space. So, these people decided to declare that the peoples of Russia and Belarus see the development of their states exclusively in sovereign forms. In other words, 70% of the Belarusians who said “yes” to the union, apparently, these gentlemen do not belong to the people ... In order to increase the effect of the “desire” to go their own way on the part of the Belarusians, the so-called Lithuanian Independent Institute decided to conduct its monitoring of the situation in Belarus -economic and political studies. Honestly, the very combination of the words “Lithuanian” and “independent” in the name of the institute makes us alert ... However, let us show ourselves the results of the research that this institute allegedly conducted in Belarus.

According to the institute's employees, they interviewed the Belarusians with 1513, asking the following question: if today a referendum was held in Belarus, then for uniting with whom you would vote (with Russia or the European Union). 28,1% of respondents allegedly spoke in favor of uniting Belarus with Russia, but 37,2% spoke for joining Belarus to the European Union, the rest were undecided to give an unequivocal answer, or generally against uniting Belarus with anyone. At the same time, the people who conducted the survey state that the error in the results of extrapolation to the entire population of Belarus is only 3%.

Evaluating such results, I would like to ask the authors of the survey and the persons who conducted it: in which, sorry, niche audience, was this kind of research conducted? Well, honestly, I can’t believe that there are more people in Belarus who want to integrate with the European Union than those who want to integrate with Russia.

By the way, such strange results of “sociological polls” should be paid close attention by the authorities in Moscow and Minsk. After all, the longer the pause in the movement of the two countries to meet a friend for real integration, the more people will want to drive a wide wedge between the nations, and arrange some long-lasting multi-round boxing match between survival ...
Author:
Photos used:
http://svpressa.ru
126 comments
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  1. FC SKIF
    FC SKIF April 11 2013 08: 40
    27
    Still, Lukashenko did well. He does a lot for his people. Look at the attitude of the Russian authorities (police, FMS, etc.) towards Ukrainians and Belarusians. Compare the dynamics of the prom. production of Ukraine and Belarus, the price of the same gas grew. All comparisons in favor of the former chairman of the state farm.
    1. vadimus
      vadimus April 11 2013 08: 58
      22
      I don’t understand these disengagement .. Anyway, amputation from a single whole .. When will we finally play enough and understand that we are one?
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets April 11 2013 09: 08
        17
        Quote: vadimus
        When will we finally play enough and realize that we are one?

        Everyone understands everything, but the real unification, IMHO, will happen only in the event of global and severe shocks of the world.
        1. Natalia
          Natalia April 11 2013 10: 31
          +7
          But all the same, everything is correct, the longer we wait, the sooner we will be convinced that we do not need unification. We must soon get off the handbrake at last, and rush to the meeting to create a single state.
          And I would start with a single currency.
          1. Patriot of Russia
            Patriot of Russia April 11 2013 19: 31
            +2
            I heard a very interesting version. Putin is simply afraid of losing the throne in cases of unification.
            who will get the most votes in choosing the president of the Union? everyone understands, you need a firm hand. the country is tired of corruption, theft, migrants, oligarchs, cops etc. I think dad would have coped with the task
            1. Alex Danilov
              Alex Danilov April 11 2013 22: 50
              +6
              You're not right. A state with militia and protection of civilians from bandits, murderers, etc. is better than a state without militia, but in chaos, lawlessness and banditry. It is necessary for civilians to not be afraid of anything, and simply work well, they made children and raised them and slept calmly at night. That's it. Everyone criticized that there are a lot of police in Belarus, but there is no crime. Our children can walk everywhere throughout the country at any time, and nothing explodes, thank God. That's I, as a father, want everything with my child, (or my parents, or my wife), so that he Obtain a good profession, and worked for the benefit of the country and had not been killed or maimed in some otmorozkom.Za it-thanks to Lukashenko.
          2. sq
            sq April 14 2013 13: 27
            0
            What about the example of the European Union?
        2. paunch
          paunch April 11 2013 10: 39
          -4
          Lukashenko is full today. any questions?
        3. INTER
          INTER April 11 2013 13: 28
          +1
          Quote: Vladimirets
          Everyone understands everything, but the real unification, IMHO, will happen only in the event of global and severe shocks of the world.

          True, more than once it happened!
      2. Nicholas C.
        Nicholas C. April 11 2013 09: 09
        12
        Belarus was already ready to accept the Russian ruble as its domestic currency as well, provided that one of the emission centers would be located in Minsk. However, the Russian authorities decided that it would somehow hit the Russian economy


        In 1992, when these new countries were formed, the state currency they had was the Russian ruble and each had its own emission center. Then they printed money as much as they could, and all rubles were brought to Russia. Remind me what inflation was? It is strange, is it not true that after this Russia does not want uncontrolled emission centers.

        A single state should be without delayed mines - internal borders - otherwise these mines will explode as in the case of the USSR, when Lukashenko will not be, but there will be a new spotted Judas.

        It is only necessary to realize that we are a single great divided people - Russians and Belarusians.
        1. Heccrbq
          Heccrbq April 11 2013 13: 33
          +1
          In 93 parliamentarians of Belarus came to our parliament with proposals on unification mechanisms, but there was a gangster seizure of power led by the EBN and everything remained in their places.
      3. Sirocco
        Sirocco April 11 2013 09: 12
        +9
        Quote: vadimus
        .When will we finally play enough and realize that we are one?

        Most likely this will happen when those in power, deputies, and our other chosen ones, begin to think of their country and people as their family. And do not worry about Its family, and its well-being. It turns out that they got to power and then, as in a joke, to the question of a peasant, what would he do if he were king? A man answered, I would say, so, would reign a hundred rubles and washed off. Just like in Russia now. Belalov is an example of this.
        1. evgenm55
          evgenm55 April 11 2013 10: 32
          +4
          Well, brother, if you wait for them and hope for them, then NEVER: The goals of us (the people) and them (gods and demigods) are different.
      4. Sirocco
        Sirocco April 11 2013 09: 18
        16
        You know, I just remembered the song of S. Rotaru. Actual it seems to me.
        I you he she!
        Together, a whole country
        Together - a friendly family!
        In the word "we" - one hundred thousand "I",
        Big-eyed, mischievous,
        Black, red and linen,
        Sad and funny -
        In cities and villages!
      5. treskoed
        treskoed April 11 2013 09: 40
        +2
        At the everyday level, we have long been united. No documents are needed when crossing the border, the rights of Russians and Belarusians are equal, there are no language barriers either, in Belarus there is a Russian language. And let politicians and businessmen agree, decide something, sign ....
        1. Natalia
          Natalia April 11 2013 10: 26
          +2
          However, quite significant roughnesses began to arise. Each of the parties decided to start looking for special preferences for itself from concluding an agreement on the creation of the Union State. Backstage games began to appear, a certain side of which spilled over into the press of Russia and Belarus.

          That is why the unification will happen when the idea of ​​creating a single whole outweighs the fear of trusting each other.
          1. Egoza
            Egoza April 11 2013 10: 39
            +3
            Quote: Natalia
            unification will occur when the idea of ​​creating a single whole outweighs the fear of trusting each other.

            The unification will take place when the GENERAL INTERNAL POLICY is developed! And the peoples will be told about it in detail. Then all fear will disappear. It's just that there are very different "courses" and attitudes towards the people in our countries. If Lukashenka does a lot for the people, then we do NOTHING in this regard. I do not presume to judge about Russia, you know better on the spot. fellow
            1. Andrey57
              Andrey57 April 11 2013 10: 59
              10
              Real unification will be only when the whole foreign world becomes one continuous "Cyprus", when our rich people understand that there is no alternate airfield behind the "hillock" and will not be, then they will cease to be temporary grabbers with a future abroad - this is on the one hand , and on the other hand, real unity will be when Russia pursues the same popular policy in all areas as in Belarus under the leadership of Batka, and as long as Aifonchik and Co rule, there will be no sense hi
              1. Alex Danilov
                Alex Danilov April 11 2013 21: 17
                0
                As for the fact that you need to keep your money in your own country, I completely agree. Only a patient will take money to other countries and invest in other countries, instead of developing his country. And other countries will simply take and take the money, like in Cyprus, or how the United States froze the accounts. Money should work for your country: for the army, military equipment, development and rearmament of the army, etc., so that the army can protect its country and peaceful people from aggression, up to the destruction of the enemy. On the people: higher education of youth, roads, me ditsinu, factories, hospitals, with
                1. Alex Danilov
                  Alex Danilov April 11 2013 21: 25
                  +2
                  kindergartens, the latest developments and the implementation of these developments in life, salaries to their people, workers. So that the people see and feel it. Then he (the people) will simply adore his homeland, and carry such a president in his arms.
        2. Alexander
          Alexander April 11 2013 10: 32
          +1
          But you don’t know if the people of Belarus have the opportunity to put forward a popular referendum?
          1. mch1950
            mch1950 April 11 2013 14: 28
            +1
            And most importantly, how such a referendum will end.
            1. Alexander
              Alexander April 11 2013 15: 16
              +1
              The main thing is that the referendum be legitimate, and the rest is the will of the people.
              1. mch1950
                mch1950 April 12 2013 17: 01
                0
                Nobody ever asked anything from the people and it seems they are not going to.
      6. sania0413
        sania0413 April 13 2013 16: 36
        0
        I think that when you realize that even though we are one, they are not the same. Belarusians are not Russians and not Poles. These are Belarusians. I think the same with Ukraine - they acknowledge that they are close to Russia, but do not identify with it. Unfortunately, many do not want to understand this.
    2. Civil
      Civil April 11 2013 11: 36
      +1
      Quote: FC Skiff
      Still, Lukashenko did well. He does a lot for his people. Look at the attitude of the Russian authorities (police, FMS, etc.) towards Ukrainians and Belarusians. Compare the dynamics of the prom. production of Ukraine and Belarus, the price of the same gas grew. All comparisons in favor of the former chairman of the state farm.


      The FMS and the police are no better for their Russians ...
  2. svp67
    svp67 April 11 2013 08: 46
    +7
    Quote: FC Skif
    Still, Lukashenko did well.




    I do not argue with you in assessing the business qualities of this STATE activist, but you will agree that it is easier to lead a mono-ethnic state of a relatively medium size and relatively small population than a country like Russia. Although Lukashenko is still GOOD.
    1. Andrey57
      Andrey57 April 11 2013 11: 02
      +6
      It makes no difference - if in Russia the same principles as in Belarus were put at the forefront, then the result would be exactly the same!
    2. botur
      botur April 11 2013 15: 30
      +1
      Quote: svp67
      it’s still easier to lead a mono-ethnic state of a relatively medium size and relatively small population,

      Yes, but do not forget about dependence on energy resources.
    3. I think so
      I think so April 11 2013 17: 44
      +2
      A bad dancer - "mono-national state" and "its size" interferes ... damn it ...
  3. Tatarus
    Tatarus April 11 2013 08: 52
    +6
    I would very much like to see a union with Belarus and Kazakhs during my lifetime. And then all the conversations are talking, but they are dancing. Interestingly. Everyone understands that together we are stronger both militarily and economically and politically. Only all who understand are divided into three categories
    1. Those who are for and who are trying to do everything for this. With a + sign
    2. Those who are against well and also try to do everything for this. With a sign -
    3. Those who are not interested and not interested. Which do nothing at all. With the sign 0

    As a result, the whole process of integration, but not the integration itself, more and more falls to the sign of infinity.
    1. Sirocco
      Sirocco April 11 2013 09: 14
      0
      While we are one we are invincible
    2. Sirocco
      Sirocco April 11 2013 09: 15
      20
      While we are one we are invincible. !!!
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny April 11 2013 10: 26
        17
        there isn’t enough Kazakh tank in the picture)))) we are not Slavs, of course, but for all these centuries the steppes were intertwined with the Eastern Slavs genetically, culturally, linguistically, psychologically - mother, do not worry.
        1. evgenm55
          evgenm55 April 11 2013 10: 35
          +4
          He did not want to offend - just probably forgot.
        2. sergey32
          sergey32 April 11 2013 11: 34
          +3
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          there isn’t enough Kazakh tank in the picture)))) we are not Slavs, of course, but for all these centuries the steppes were intertwined with the Eastern Slavs genetically, culturally, linguistically, psychologically - mother, do not worry.

          Then BMPT under the Kazakh flag should be added, just in time it will be.
          1. sibircat
            sibircat April 11 2013 12: 26
            +2
            BMPT at the uralvagozavod (in Russia) do, and the fire control system for it at the Vavilov MMZ (in Belarus). And then the Kazakhs?
            1. sergey32
              sergey32 April 11 2013 15: 11
              +2
              Because only they have BMPT in the troops.
              1. sibircat
                sibircat April 11 2013 15: 31
                +4
                I know what they have, I saw the delivery contract myself.
                The car is not bad, it’s strange that we don’t supply our troops.
                1. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny April 11 2013 17: 55
                  +3
                  What? Not a bad idea about BMPT)))) They do it, of course, in Russia, but only Kazakhs drive them (so far). Yes, and perhaps soon we will create a joint venture with the Russians in KZ, so that on our territory part of the T-72 will be turned into Terminators. We don't need the T-90 base, but we have a lot of T-72s. The Ukrainians recently helped us to establish a plant for the repair of armored vehicles in Semipalatinsk, it would be great to arrange a workshop with the Russians for stamping BMPT shek with the Russians, than to drive hundreds of tanks for modernization to Russia (plus the usual modernization of tanks is required). It seems that Uralvagonzavod is not against this, especially since the Russian Ministry of Defense does not yet have a demand for Terminator services. Not to be lost to clever Russian ideas? Moreover, the Russians, in addition to money, also receive a strengthening of the ally's army, the final link to Russian supplies and the unification of heavy armored vehicles (and then the Italians, Turks, Israelis are already offering their options), and in addition, Russia may get some groundwork, with which the Turks are divided in terms of the modernization of armored vehicles.
                  1. iliq
                    iliq April 11 2013 18: 16
                    0
                    BMPT in the form that now - no one needs. neither the Russian Federation nor the Kazakhs. Kazakhs just have a little money for such toys.
                    1. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny April 11 2013 19: 16
                      0
                      What do you mean is not needed? Just as we need. Machine norms. TTX will gradually improve. Chassis we need from the T-72. With electronics / optics - if anything can be agreed with the Turks, if the Russian analogue is much inferior. The machine itself is necessary. Therefore, we purchase. The first samples were rolled back. Now we want to have them en masse along with conventional tanks.
                      1. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 19: 29
                        0
                        that means - is not needed. you read some specialized forums, such as Courage 2004 - there is no place for this craft in combined arms combat. there is no place for her in the structures of motorized riflemen or tankers;)

                        I generally keep quiet about the "security" of the weapons of this craft.
                      2. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny April 11 2013 19: 47
                        +2
                        Why do I need a forum to read people who can only theoretically represent the pros and cons of BMPT? I felt this car myself, but it’s easier for me to learn about its usefulness / uselessness from the military themselves who drive it at the training grounds, since I communicate with the military several times a month, including the heads of the armament center.
                        there are cons. like every thing. there is nothing perfect. but more pluses than minuses. this is enough for us. and errors will be corrected a hundred more times. Kazakhs voiced their comments and wishes to the Russians.
                        we buy Pinocchio, although they also have some complaints about their range. but while the troops let them learn on what is, tactical actions are being worked out, and the performance characteristics of the plants will be improved in parallel.
                        in a tank battle with the Abrams, this technique is not needed. and for urban battles, in the mountain forests of the border territory - this technique is just right for the aid of both tankmen and foot soldiers.
                      3. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 20: 05
                        0
                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        Why do I need a forum to read people who can only theoretically represent the pros and cons of BMPT?

                        well, these people are not only theoretically familiar with BT;)

                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        It’s easier for me to learn about its usefulness / uselessness from the military themselves, who drive her at the training grounds, since I communicate with the military several times a month, including the chiefs of the armament center apparatus.

                        so ask where BMPT place in combined arms combat;) and tell - tell me.

                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        we buy Pinocchio, although they also have some complaints about their range.

                        what is what!?

                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        but while the troops let them learn on what is, tactical actions are being worked out, and the performance characteristics of the plants will be improved in parallel.

                        Is this what the military told or who?

                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        for urban battles, in the mountain forests of the border territory - this technique is just right for the aid of both tankmen and foot soldiers.

                        ahhh, I can't! Why are these "stupid" tankers with infantry disowning crafts? I will not say anything about the RF Ministry of Defense!
                2. M. Peter
                  M. Peter April 12 2013 05: 54
                  +2
                  Kazakhs just. The Russian army simply has no tasks for this machine, while the Kazakhs have plenty. The southern borders are just troubled, there are all sorts of gangs of formation, drug trafficking, do not fight in tanks?
    3. Alex Danilov
      Alex Danilov April 11 2013 21: 04
      +3
      Yes, not enough. But we know our allies and friends. Greetings to the Kazakhs from Belarus!
  4. Artmark
    Artmark April 11 2013 12: 17
    +4
    Strength in unity !!!! Glory to the USSR !!! soldier
  5. Alex Danilov
    Alex Danilov April 11 2013 21: 03
    +3
    Guys and our presidents, bark faster to unite. Do you really not see how NATO, the US, the EU want to embarrass us and simply destroy, or crush us. Read my comments on YouTube. Starting with "what Russia scared NATO and everyone else there. They are simply afraid that we will revive the USSR 2: 0 !!! It will be much more powerful both militarily and economically, an alliance, an alliance. Ordinary people will live - just fine, ride in a union and travel abroad. We will be the worst, The most beautiful and most peaceful! The golden age will come. Presidents, let's decide it quickly, don't you see how the enemies are afraid and are doing everything to prevent this from happening?
  • sergo0000
    sergo0000 April 11 2013 09: 09
    +4
    After all, the longer the pause in the movement of the two countries towards each other for real integration, the more there will be those who want to drive a wide wedge between the nations, and arrange a long multi-round boxing match from the unification process - to survive ...
    You can’t say more precisely +++
  • Nesvet Nezar
    Nesvet Nezar April 11 2013 09: 10
    +4
    Only the accession of Belarus as one subject of the federation to the Russian Federation or as several entities. Not any unions. And the federal-national structure of the Russian Federation must be abandoned. Federation is bad and not strong.
    1. Jurkovs
      Jurkovs April 11 2013 10: 23
      +1
      The federation should not be ethnic, but regional, provincial, land.
      1. evgenm55
        evgenm55 April 11 2013 10: 42
        +7
        I think the same way. I completely agree. In pre-revolutionary Russia, not everything was bad. Smart, bright, patriotic people lived. There was no Georgia, there was a Tiflis province, there was no Ukraine, there were Kiev, Kharkov, etc. provinces. How many troubles the country could have avoided. With all due respect to the Bolsheviks, I can’t understand why Lenin V.I. went on dividing the country on a national-territorial basis? After all, he was a smart man. STALIN, by the way, was aware of the danger of such a division, especially in the national regions. It is a pity he did not have time to fix it.
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny April 11 2013 18: 37
          -2
          but how lovely it was in the Horde! No Russians, but only Dmitry Donskoy ulus, ulus of other vassal princes, Crimean yurt, Siberian yurt, Juchi ulus, Khulagu ulus, Dzhagatay ulus, Ugedey ulus, Nogai yurt, etc. What country has passed! Torn the country to the joy of the West!
          It's good that the Moscow ulus with blood and then restored the Horde. True, by 1917 the policy of the ruling dynasty had exhausted itself, for which it was thrown off nafig and after the usual massacre of everyone with everyone, a native of the Simbirsk yurt, Zholdas Lenin and a native of Gurdjistan, Zholdas Yusup Stalin again recreated the Horde in its former borders. In 1991, their dynasty fizzled out, the people kicked them out too. Again they had a little scandal, shot and began to repair the Horde again. And fuli? Ulug Ulus is eternal. Back in the 6th century, the kagans of the Türkic Kaganate engraved words on the stones about the "Eternal State", which stretches from the Far East to the Black Sea;)
          In a word, Evgenm55, why soar? Our state is eternal. Just reformatted from time to time in accordance with the new era wink











          1. faser
            faser April 11 2013 19: 47
            -3
            You still forgot about the Hun Empire. we are all stuck together from the same test, just differently called from climatic and religious factors
  • Pushkin
    Pushkin April 11 2013 09: 31
    +4
    Not for that, the Union was torn, so that we now begin to unite
    As for the common currency - IMHO Lukashenko does not go for it, because the Central Bank of Russia is like an independent office
  • LaGlobal
    LaGlobal April 11 2013 09: 35
    +7
    Give the union of the two states! Give restoration of the former greatness of the Great Country!
    Ukraine, please do not hesitate and do not delay this process! We need you - and we to you.
  • rennim
    rennim April 11 2013 09: 38
    12
    Old Man Lukashenko as president of a united Russia and Belarus. He will definitely not liberalize and flirt as our current rulers will not. A tough and consistent politician. And the people will not let officials be torn off as sticky. He will not scare officials and thieves too. Yes, and he will not let the budget be stolen.
    1. Onotollah
      Onotollah April 11 2013 10: 29
      +2
      Quote: rennim
      in the presidency of a united Russia and Belarus.

      It is believed that the unification of states will occur in 2016. Thus, Vladimir Putin can run for president of the newly formed state and extend his presidential powers. I do not think this is bad, it's just a plausible option. Lukashenko is likely to have the role of prime minister or head of the presidential administration. I don’t know what position Nazarbayev will take.
      Everything is purely IMHO.
      1. evgenm55
        evgenm55 April 11 2013 10: 47
        +3
        Then Putin is in the whole united state of Serdyukov, Chubais, etc. start otmazyvat.Here thieves of Belarus will be delighted ...
    2. Egoza
      Egoza April 11 2013 10: 34
      +7
      Quote: rennim
      Old Man Lukashenko as president of a united Russia and Belarus. He will definitely not liberalize and flirt as our current rulers will not. A tough and consistent politician. And the people will not let officials be torn off as sticky. He will not scare officials and thieves too. Yes, and he will not let the budget be stolen.

      Well, that's why the union does not happen! Everyone understands that father has every chance to become a president in a completely democratic way, but do oligarchs need it? fellow
  • sanyabasik
    sanyabasik April 11 2013 09: 47
    +2
    Quote: Sirocco
    it will happen when those in power, deputies, and our other chosen ones, begin to think of their country and people as their family.

    i.e. NEVER ... sad
  • fenix57
    fenix57 April 11 2013 09: 53
    +2
    The survey conducted Lithuanian Independent Institute for Social, Economic and Political Studies- comrades, dear, and what result did we want to get from this "independent" who "feeds" (for sure) from the EU ..
    Here is the information, please regret, as they say:The Independent Institute for Social, Economic and Political Research (abbreviated as IISEPS, Belarusian. “Independent of social and economic and political studies”) is the oldest non-governmental research center in Belarus, created in February 1992 by a group of scientists, journalists, politicians and businessmen. Currently registered as a public institution in the Republic of Lithuania. Funded by foreign and international organizations.see Wikipedia.
    Comments are superfluous ...
  • aleks71
    aleks71 April 11 2013 09: 53
    +5
    According to the national mentality, we are one nation at the same time .. At the state level, we are unlikely to become one state .. there are no reasons ... well, at least a few .. what is the Russian ruble? Is it the national currency of Russia? Judging by that Russia can’t print it on its own, it’s not national .. To unite means to take on the whole liberal shushara that drives Russia every year farther and farther nowhere. Yes, and economic models are too different .. Plus, the loss of sovereignty of power , but does Sana need this? While he is the boss at home and does a lot for Belarus, I wouldn’t say that .. I myself am a Belarusian, I live in St. Petersburg, I go to my mother systematically, to visit, I don’t know how I am traveling in Belarus, I have a lump in my throat, you look around and you can see that this land has a HOST .. What about the Russian land (with all due respect) can not be said.
    There is no owner here, there is a consumer of Russian land, only for now, and after me it doesn’t matter .. So, the union is still a dream at the state level, and why is it? There are no borders, they are economically integrated, people are native, that on the one hand, on the other hand .. So I think ..
  • Seaman
    Seaman April 11 2013 10: 11
    0
    Anyway, we will be together, life will force. We can’t be apart. And it’s time for Ukraine to stop rushing around.
  • 101
    101 April 11 2013 10: 11
    +4
    Belarusians should not enter into one state with us only if their dad will be the head. And that will save if there is no order. Let us beware of ... plunge. Where are we calling that?
  • Seaman
    Seaman April 11 2013 10: 13
    +7
    Anyway, we will be together, life will force. We can’t be apart. And it’s time for Ukraine to stop rushing around.
  • Jurkovs
    Jurkovs April 11 2013 10: 19
    +3
    “The reason is that Belarus was already ready to accept the Russian ruble as its internal currency, provided that one of the emission centers would have to be in Minsk. However, the Russian authorities decided that this would somehow hit the Russian economy , announced that they would not give the go-ahead for the opening of a center for the emission of the Russian ruble in the Belarusian capital. " I remind the author that after the collapse of the Soviet Union, all the former republics suddenly arrogated to themselves the right of emission centers (there was no currency of their own), inflated the ruble assets of their banks, and pulled off ruble liquidity. In Russia, there was not enough cash in circulation and many regions began to introduce their regional currencies in the form of coupons, obligations, and so on. The Central Bank of Russia was forced to cover the inflated ruble assets of the former republics with real money and hyperinflation reached three-digit levels. Russia literally demanded that the republics introduce their own currencies and in every possible way helped this over the years. Only a person who has forgotten this story will agree to the existence of two or more emission centers in the country. There is no need to make Belarus white and fluffy, many there wanted to be sybaric at the expense of Russia.
    1. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 April 11 2013 10: 37
      0
      At the time of the collapse of the USSR, I lived in Kazakhstan, so there was no bloating of ruble assets, there was always not enough money, banks could not give out cash for wages on time. I do not know in which separated republics assets were inflated, but apparently this is some kind of myth.
      1. Jurkovs
        Jurkovs April 11 2013 16: 59
        +2
        So after the collapse, the Central Bank determined the ruble weight only for Russia, and EVERYONE used it. Because rubles in circulation was not enough. Industry survived offsets. If you don’t know, I’m explaining, several directors gathered, watched who owed whom and for what, drew up a balance, drew up a paper and submitted it to the bank, which wrote off the debts of enterprises to each other. Salaries and pensions were paid in installments on a weekly basis. At the same time, there was money on the account, but the bank could not give out, since he did not have this cash. Then coupons were introduced, under the guarantee of the administration, coupons were collected in bakeries, and then these stores were built into the offset chains. I myself did this, so I know it thoroughly, apparently in Kazakhstan it was better to live for rubles.
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny April 11 2013 19: 10
          +5
          Kazakhstan and Russia initially agreed that there would be a single currency. However, in 1993, Yeltsin decided to replay everything, and introduced the Russian ruble, and specifically for Russia. All the promises of a single ruble zone turned out to be a banal fiction on the part of Russia. In Kazakhstan, by November 1993, there was just a kapets about the money supply - all Soviet rubles from all the former republics were imported by carriages, redeeming local goods. Inflation has been abysmal. And if in Russia Soviet banknotes and Russian rubles were one to one, then “across the river” in Kazakhstan, one Russian ruble was exchanged for two Soviet rubles.
          In Kazakhstan, there was no problem with cash, but with their value. Imagine all the cash banknotes of the USSR have accumulated in one republic with a population of 16 million people! Until recently, we believed the promises of the Kremlin about a single ruble zone. But it turned out that Yeltsin was simply delaying the time before entering Russian rubles. Only in November 1993, the Kazakhs announced the introduction of their own currency, which, incidentally, was printed by the bourgeois on credit. Up to this point, cash in the hands of the population was candy wrappers, with which you could wipe your ass and heat the stoves. The depreciation went on before our eyes. In the morning, meat costs 2500 Soviet rubles, in the afternoon 2800, in the evening 3000 rubles. The next day, growth continued. In November 1993, Soviet banknotes began to change into rubles, but inflation was stopped only in the second half of the 90s.
  • vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 April 11 2013 10: 26
    10
    Why is the rapprochement (political) so slow that it is not even noticeable? The answer is simple because political systems are different. In Russia, the unbridled criminal market economy, in Belarus, a civilized market with state monopoly enterprises. Our country is ruled by oligarchs, in Belarus let a dictatorship, but aimed at improving the life of the whole society. Our oligarchs have been drooling for a long time in Belarusian enterprises; they really want to take their hands on them. And most likely not in order to continue to work, but in order to bankrupt them. Indeed, the Russian economy is 90% speculative, why release something, when it’s easier to buy over the hill at a low price, to sell houses at a higher price. Everyone benefits both entrepreneurs and officials, customs officers. Everyone except the people. So that's about it. I personally think that if states are united, then only Lukashenko should be the president, otherwise nothing good will come of it.
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 10: 33
    11
    By the way, the death penalty has not been abolished in Belarus. He shot the terrorists who blew up the metro, and Old Man wanted to spit on the opinion of the West. But in a democratic Russia, child killers do not receive a tower, and it is not a fact that in a few years they will not be released.
    But Belarusians do not want to unite, because they see what they have done with production and agriculture in Russia. Because they want to eat their sausage from meat, and butter from milk, and not from shit.
    1. djon3volta
      djon3volta April 11 2013 19: 29
      -6
      Quote: sibircat
      But Belarusians do not want to unite, because they see what they have done with production and agriculture in Russia.

      No. not because of this at all. look at Ukraine, what's better there than in Russia, and that's why ukry don't want to join the vehicle? Ukrainians and Belarusians look to the west more than to the east. because they are also brainwashed there through the Internet and TV, they say Russia bad, and the west is good. Especially Ukrainian TV in this regard "works well".
      if we take Russia as a whole, we don’t need to join someone, we are self-sufficient, and small states are constantly looking for protection.
      1. Alex Danilov
        Alex Danilov April 11 2013 21: 47
        +4
        It’s not true. We want to be with Russia. Russia - allies are just as necessary and necessary as air. Otherwise, you, Russia, will be completely surrounded by NATO and the United States, and they will crush us and then - they will chase you (((. You that you don’t see or are blind ?? the USA is actively taking over the world, from minerals to people. It builds its military bases. And this is so that their dollar (candy wrapper) does not collapse, that is, you can always use military power .God, presidents, you don’t see that the United States wants to crush Russia's allies, and then take on Russia - finally dividing, destroying it? In general, you need to restore the USSR 2: 0 !!! It will be a much more powerful union both militarily and economically, an alliance than the old USSR. And what? People in the USSR 70-80 years-lived-excellent ( I myself am from the 80s and I found the USSR): medicine-qualified and free, education-free, many apartments, cars bought already-ordinary hard workers, we rode around the union wherever we wanted-and went there, man I was sure of tomorrow. And how many children were sure and gave birth. Crimes weren’t, well, there were some fights and that’s all. Girls and boys then weren’t whether they didn’t smoke. We were afraid of other countries and didn’t call names. They bought our USSR-ruble for a few dollars.
        In general, guys, the sooner we understand-what-in-unity-our strength, and the faster we restore the USSR 2-0, it’s only much more powerful both militarily and economically, the more the USSR will be, the better it will be for us- believe me, stopudov. We will be the most terrible, the most beautiful and the most peaceful !! The best! Let’s be faster there, there will be no atom of Russia, and we will sit under the Yankees ((.
  • avt
    avt April 11 2013 10: 38
    +3
    Quote: Jurkovs
    The reason is that Belarus was already ready to accept the Russian ruble as its domestic currency as well, on the condition that one of the emission centers should be located in Minsk.

    Yes, this is one of the reasons, the second and perhaps the main one, there is no way to the Kremlin for the national elites, neither from the black nor from the front door. And I already liked to steer, even a small state. Hence, such misunderstandings arise in the form of a union state not formalized by any normative legal document and the complete absence of any supranational structures for making a MANDATORY decision. CSTO is also not so fun and glorious. The Constitution of Belarus directly prohibits the use of the army outside the state. Well, then who will grieve for the sovereignty of the CSTO members? That's right, Vanek is Russian. That is why, according to the figurative expression of the same dad, from time to time from the Kremlin from St. Petersburg, they also give credit carrots and gas prices sane. But Lukashenka is still a fine fellow, he beats his interest, but stupidly not riots like the Ukrainians holding power. A kind of soft belbashi laughing , it was not in vain that he translated and published Rukhnamu. Here and recently, the GDP was written to him as a bonus for another gas string. Ukram for edification.
    1. paunch
      paunch April 11 2013 10: 43
      +4
      should steer one (one, one).
      There are no states with 2 emission centers.
    2. Alex Danilov
      Alex Danilov April 11 2013 22: 12
      +4
      As for the CSTO, you’re wrong, if there is only external aggression against Russia, Belarus, as a state, it may not become possible within 3 days until the Russian teddy bear swells and thinks what to do, whether Belarusians help or like in Libya- we don’t really want to wait, which, by the way, I wouldn’t really like to. CSTO is security, understand, not an attack. In the event of an attack, Belarus will not, we just put our heads together while you sniff, damn it, but this I don’t want the script. I want it so that you — the Russians — respond quickly, promptly and immediately, and come to help us until Belarus destroys everything. Don’t worry, no one will pass through us, we will die, but will not pass, it will be easier for us to apply, the battles will be fierce.
  • niklev65
    niklev65 April 11 2013 10: 39
    +3
    The article repeats several times: Gazprom, Gazprom ... Who is he, this Gazprom, to put obstacles in? Let him get gas (his direct duty) and don’t go where the dog ... doesn’t stick! And Russia (great, white and small) will still be united, and then the whole world will understand who is the boss in the house (that's why they bother us with all their might).
  • honest jew
    honest jew April 11 2013 10: 48
    11
    Lukashenko is a normal man! I would not refuse to drink with him a normal environmentally friendly Belarusian vodka, under Belarusian pickles cucumber and a slice of fragrant Belarusian bread !!!!
    1. Jurkovs
      Jurkovs April 11 2013 17: 07
      +2
      But Lukashenka will not be able to annex Russia to Belarus, and the longer he will resist, the harder it will be to unite, mainly for Belarus. Today he is good, and tomorrow descendants can even admit as a traitor when the time for unification will be lost and the enemy will be on the verge.
    2. I think so
      I think so April 11 2013 18: 22
      +1
      Lukashenko does not drink ... And he served in the border troops ...
      1. GOGY
        GOGY April 12 2013 13: 18
        +1
        Actually, the border troops were subordinate to the KGB, under the Soviet regime for sure
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 10: 48
    +5
    10 thousand dollars today is too high a salary for an official. This opinion was expressed by Alexander Lukashenko at a press conference on Tuesday. "The Lord is with you, do not talk about this amount. I do not even think of such figures. Our minister today. Receives less than two thousand."
    http://finance.tut.by/news330422.html
  • Kazbek
    Kazbek April 11 2013 10: 49
    10
    Russians, Belarusians, Ukrainians are genetically one people, so it’s time for you to unite and not share.
  • Egoza
    Egoza April 11 2013 11: 05
    +7
    In the spring of 1996, in a conversation with a Russian entrepreneur, Vanga said: "Russia is the progenitor of the Slavic powers. Those that separated from it will return to it in a new capacity. Russia will not deviate from the path of reforms that, in the end, will make the country strong and mighty. "
    The Soviet system, in which Vanga lived half of her life, did not weigh her down, although she grew up in poverty, and lost her sight due to the poverty of her relatives. One day she had a conversation with a famous Bulgarian journalist, to whom she said: "Socialism will return in a new form. There will be a Soviet Union again, but a new one. There will be cooperative farms. And Bulgaria will overcome difficulties. Bulgaria will move forward only with Russia - she is our mother. Russia was and will be a great power ... Write about Marx and Lenin, young people should know them. Why are you ashamed of them. "
    Sidorov V.M. "Lyudmila and Vangelia".
    S ... S ... S ... S ... S ... S ... S ... S ... S ...
    I really hope that Vanga’s words come true!
    1. Sergey_K
      Sergey_K April 11 2013 13: 33
      -3
      When the Slavs won their place under the sun, Russia did not smell. What are you raving about with Wang? Unification will happen when the storm in the glass calms down, the offense of the Russians and other peoples will pass. While this is not noticeable, even in this forum.
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 11: 05
    +1
    I recommend to see, for those who have not seen the videos, although they were shot 2 years ago, they have not lost relevance:
    Enchanting Belarus
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOsqUjn7rtE
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLi47llFrMY
  • Vtel
    Vtel April 11 2013 11: 08
    +1
    They would have united long ago, but they don’t give permission from the Washington Regional Committee. What they pull there, I don’t understand!
  • Thunderbolt
    Thunderbolt April 11 2013 11: 09
    16
    Two countries --- one people. I don’t want to say anything else.
  • honest jew
    honest jew April 11 2013 11: 14
    +8
    Zhirik Krasava !!!
  • Algor73
    Algor73 April 11 2013 11: 18
    +4
    That's a very difficult question. But the difficulty is that in the Union State someone must be senior. It is clear that he is not a representative of Belarus. But Lukashenko does not want to give in, and there are good reasons for this - he put things in order in the country and keeps all profitable and strategic enterprises in the public sector to the maximum. The people want reunion, there is no top. This also applies to Ukraine. There are no prospects for Ukraine (and Belarus) joining the EU. One must still seek understanding in the East. Well, we don’t have a European mentality, we won’t work, live and relax in a European way. What is normal for us is a catastrophe for a European and vice versa. Sooner or later, Ukraine, Russia and Belarus will all the same be together, whether Europeans and our leaders want this or not, but this has developed and is taking shape historically.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 11: 19
    +1
    it’s good to talk about Lukashenko from stories from the television ...
    but in fact - Lukashenko was blown away for five years already, the economy is in the pope ... the city-forming enterprises are sold to Russian "business" - the Mogilev refinery, Grodno Azot, etc.
    many have probably heard here about "clapping their hands" - yeah, the very thing for which people who are disliked for a long time are imprisoned.
    and those who traveled across the Belarusian-Polish / Lithuanian border by car will tell about diesel locomotives (yeah, "contrabass", living on the smuggling of Belarusian diesel fuel, cigarettes and alcohol, and pushing Polish sausages with diapers back), due to which normal people traveling to vacation must be defended at the border sometimes for more than a day ...
    and inflation of 300% in 2011? during the night, the dollar became out of 300o rubles 10000 ...
    or can someone tell us how private production blooms and smells in Belarus? how do they comprehensively help, develop, create conditions? What private plants were built? I don’t know about such ...

    and ordinary Belarusians don’t see any development plans, stagnation and degradation are visible to the naked eye ... Lukashenko has neither political will, nor economic resources, nor people to develop the Republic of Belarus ... and Belarusians won’t go to any kind of union with Russia - you look at the Russian Federation from the side, and ask yourself what you will choose - the Russian Federation or the EU?

    ps Well, about "patriotism" and "united people" - you first sort it out in the Russian Federation, show that patriots and a single people - maybe then others will start looking in your direction.
    1. sibircat
      sibircat April 11 2013 11: 28
      +2
      "Many probably here have heard about" clapping their hands "- yeah, the very thing for which people who are disliked for a long time are imprisoned."
      Names put in the studio!
    2. avt
      avt April 11 2013 12: 05
      +3
      Quote: iliq
      those who traveled across the Belarusian-Polish / Lithuanian border by car will tell about diesel locomotives (yeah, "contrabass", living on the smuggling of Belarusian diesel fuel, cigarettes and alcohol, and back Polish sausage with diapers), because of which normal people go on vacation sometimes it is necessary to defend at the border for more than a day ...

      Well, the border Poles on both sides have always been doing this. request As well as in Kaliningrad, buy and sell is always easier than doing something with your hands. Maybe they drag the Polish sausage, but in Moscow, for example, dairy and meat products from Belarus are always in priority. And the fact that industrial development plans can only be tied to a single market of the customs union, so the last fuck will be convinced of this after Ukraine's association with Eorosoyuz. An exception will naturally be an intellectual, always splashing saliva and wanting to clean up something in an enlightened Europe that is free from totalitarianism. Well, at the expense of Lukashenka's lack of will laughing request but whoever did not have and will not, is forever in the opposition of intellectuals, it is a lot of chatting, but to rest on their chatter, not to mention giving life, no. And he has an economic resource, they regularly throw it up, the main thing is that he would behave appropriately and the resource would be laughing
    3. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 April 11 2013 14: 32
      +3
      Nonsense, do not equate all Belarusians with speculators of the mouchers.
    4. Alex Danilov
      Alex Danilov April 11 2013 23: 54
      +3
      Quote: iliq
      it’s good to talk about Lukashenko from stories from the television ...
      but in fact - Lukashenko was blown away for five years already, the economy is in the pope ... the city-forming enterprises are sold to Russian "business" - the Mogilev refinery, Grodno Azot, etc.
      many have probably heard here about "clapping their hands" - yeah, the very thing for which people who are disliked for a long time are imprisoned.
      and those who traveled across the Belarusian-Polish / Lithuanian border by car will tell about diesel locomotives (yeah, "contrabass", living on the smuggling of Belarusian diesel fuel, cigarettes and alcohol, and pushing Polish sausages with diapers back), due to which normal people traveling to vacation must be defended at the border sometimes for more than a day ...
      and inflation of 300% in 2011? during the night, the dollar became out of 300o rubles 10000 ...
      or can someone tell us how private production blooms and smells in Belarus? how do they comprehensively help, develop, create conditions? What private plants were built? I don’t know about such ...

      and ordinary Belarusians don’t see any development plans, stagnation and degradation are visible to the naked eye ... Lukashenko has neither political will, nor economic resources, nor people to develop the Republic of Belarus ... and Belarusians won’t go to any kind of union with Russia - you look at the Russian Federation from the side, and ask yourself what you will choose - the Russian Federation or the EU?

      ps Well, about "patriotism" and "united people" - you first sort it out in the Russian Federation, show that patriots and a single people - maybe then others will start looking in your direction.

      You don’t need to speak for Belarusians. Or did some Lithuanian or Pole decide to put him under Belarusians?
      As for inflation, the EU is in the ass, it’s agreeing on a loan with Russia. And as for sausage — complete nonsense and lies — Belorussian sausage — natural — like everything else. People in Belarus work, get married, make children, buy, build housing-and-just-live. The only thing I want is for a bigger salary and an apartment, a house, you could quickly build, buy.
      Private owners, we do not need, factories must belong to the state and work, for the country, oligarchs, we do not need.
      As for "clapping his hands" - looked at them, pull the country into chaos, devastation and lawlessness, we do not need such.
      Belarusians are not what they want to unite with the Russian Federation, they want the USSR in general 2: 0 !!!
  • niklev65
    niklev65 April 11 2013 11: 28
    +1
    Eh! If only Putin and Lukashenko could figure out “for three.” Yanukovych will be the third? Be-me ... everything is clear with you! Nazarbayev will be the third? The same song. Isn't it possible to dilute our company with female society (what is this for drunkenness, if there are no women ...)? Angela ... !!! It would be a bomb! The next day, 33 applications were received in the Customs Union, 31 in the Eurasian EU, 27 in the SCO, 20 in the CIS, etc.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 11: 29
    -2
    Quote: Algor73
    But Lukashenko does not want to give in, and there are good reasons for this - he put things in order in the country and keeps all profitable and strategic enterprises in the public sector to the maximum.

    lies. the public sector is being sold for a sweet soul - Minsk MTZ, MAZ, Grodno Azot. for the simple reason that the bottom of their "profitability" comes at the expense of cheap Russian hydrocarbons. there even a diesel fuel with gasoline began to be carried through customs as a "solvent" ...

    Quote: Algor73
    People want a reunion

    with whom? with the RF? have you seen yourself in the mirror? the people absolutely do not want the "Russian way" - the plundering and destruction of the remnants of the Soviet heritage.

    Quote: Algor73
    There are no prospects for Ukraine (and Belarus) joining the EU.

    with Lukashenko - no. but he did not have long. who comes after him is an open question ...

    Quote: Algor73
    What is normal for us is a catastrophe for a European and vice versa.

    I wonder how do tens of millions of Soviet people who have left the post-Soviet space to cope with this?

    Quote: Algor73
    Well, we don’t have a European mentality, we won’t work

    Well, yes, who wants to work? if you can steal?

    Quote: Algor73
    Sooner or later, Ukraine, Russia and Belarus will all the same be together, whether Europeans and our leaders want this or not, but this has developed and is taking shape historically.

    I'm afraid that neither you nor I will see this ...
    1. Corsair5912
      Corsair5912 April 11 2013 11: 56
      +4
      Bullshit, the economy of Belarus is quite efficient, no one is selling the public sector, recently a 90-ton BelAZ was put into production, there is a Russian order.
      The people of Belarus undoubtedly want to unite with Russia, no one has stolen and destroyed anything anywhere.
      Everyone who got into the EU after the dismemberment of the USSR is already in such debts that it is easier for them to hang themselves, the EU is a Jewish idiot for suckers. For Belarus, this is unacceptable in any scenario.
      The cheril bath fell, what millions of Soviet people went abroad, only Jews and Germans left, and there were not even 1% of them in the USSR.
      The overwhelming majority of Soviet people in their entire lives didn’t steal a penny, they only stole traders, but criminals.
    2. vladsolo56
      vladsolo56 April 11 2013 14: 33
      -3
      Who pays you for such nonsense?
      1. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 April 11 2013 15: 50
        +4
        This is for you, the Russophobes Judotrolls are paid for nonsense, but I do not need to shout.
        I have friends and relatives in Belarus, they live there, and they are normal working people, and not hired lackeys of Telavivs and Washington.
        1. vladsolo56
          vladsolo56 April 11 2013 19: 36
          +2
          Corsair Well, you at least look who is commenting laughing the same is written for ilig. So you shouldn’t be so indignant at me.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 11: 39
    -1
    Quote: sibircat
    Names put in the studio!

    http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1419704.html
    http://www.regnum.ru/news/1418767.html
    http://n1.by/news/2011/06/22/122865.html
  • PistonizaToR
    PistonizaToR April 11 2013 11: 44
    0
    Vanga was blinded not from the fact that she ate and lived poorly, but from the fact that her lightning had blown so ...
  • Goldkonstantin
    Goldkonstantin April 11 2013 11: 46
    +4
    The time has not come! We will unite again again - the people are one. Lukashenko is really well done - he suffers everything that is poured on him both in the West and with us (unfortunately) in Russia. Everything will return and Russia, and Ukraine, and Belarus, and Kazakhstan - we will live in one state! Patience, comrades!
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 11: 48
    +1
    Quote: iliq
    Quote: sibircat
    Names put in the studio!

    http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1419704.html
    http://www.regnum.ru/news/1418767.html
    http://n1.by/news/2011/06/22/122865.html

    And where are the names of those who are "imprisoned for a long time"?
    Rewritten, released ... You yourself are not funny?
    Do you know about the swamp business in Russia? This is where the little duckies are planted and sitting.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 11: 55
    -1
    Quote: sibircat
    Rewritten, released ... You yourself are not funny?

    no, I'm not funny. there were not paid oppositionists, but ordinary citizens - who organized themselves and expressed their dissatisfaction with the regime absolutely peacefully and without disturbing anyone.
    and this is not the only case ... here is such a "prosperous Balorus!"

    Quote: sibircat
    Do you know about the swamp business in Russia? This is where the little duckies are planted and sitting.

    and what is proud of here? many here do not understand, because of which simple, ordinary people do not want any kind of union with the Russian Federation, under any circumstances!
    and with the departure of Lukashenko (and maybe even with him) the Belarusians and the customs union will send nafig - nothing but the cost of food and goods he brought to the Belarusians ...
    1. sibircat
      sibircat April 11 2013 12: 01
      +8
      Personally, I do not care about political unification. I live and work in Russia, my daughter is studying at BSU in Minsk.
      I don’t feel the borders, it’s easier to make money in Russia, and it’s better to live in Belarus.
      Here is my answer to you.
  • elmi
    elmi April 11 2013 11: 59
    +6
    It seems to me that Lukashenko will agree to complete unification into one state, provided that he remains the president i.e. new Russia led by Lukashenko. For the sake of unification, you can go for it.
  • redwar6
    redwar6 April 11 2013 12: 01
    +2
    Do you know who does not want unification?) On A begins, well, you understand, on A ends, and she is in the alliance, by the way the alliance also does not want :)
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 12: 10
    +2
    Quote: elmi
    It seems to me that Lukashenko will agree to complete unification into one state, provided that he remains the president i.e. new Russia led by Lukashenko. For the sake of unification, you can go for it.

    And 160 of Russian billionaires standing up applaud you :)
    1. elmi
      elmi April 11 2013 13: 07
      +7
      Quote: sibircat
      Quote: elmi
      It seems to me that Lukashenko will agree to complete unification into one state, provided that he remains the president i.e. new Russia led by Lukashenko. For the sake of unification, you can go for it.

      And 160 of Russian billionaires standing up applaud you :)

      But the number of billionaires will become more secure and the difference between rich and poor will not be so big
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 10
    0
    I have a question for those who believe in unification:
    What benefits will the affiliated countries receive in comparison with the present moment?
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 16
    -3
    Quote: avt
    Well, the border Poles on both sides have always been doing this.

    yeah, they were so involved that 10% of diesel fuel in Poland (according to Polish data) is smuggling.

    Quote: avt
    And the fact that industrial development plans can only be tied to a single market of the customs union, so the last dibil will be convinced of this after the association of Ukraine with the Eorosouz

    I have not heard anything intelligible ... foggy discussions on the topic of whether there is life on Mars ...

    Quote: avt
    in Moscow, for example, dairy and meat products from Belarus will always be in priority.

    how was it with the "milk war"? Why did Lukashenka not want to "sell" to Russian "capitalists" for a cheap price?

    Quote: avt
    And he has an economic resource, they regularly throw it up, the main thing is that he would behave appropriately and the resource would be

    cool - you just wrote that Lukashenko has no economic or strong-willed resource ...
    1. avt
      avt April 11 2013 15: 21
      +2
      Quote: iliq
      I have not heard anything intelligible ... foggy discussions on the topic of whether there is life on Mars ...

      Well, since a true intellectual will hear nothing but his own opinion, here I am powerless laughing Here even the Baltic states is not an example, here it will only reach through the ass.
      Quote: iliq
      yeah, they were so busy that 10% of diesel fuel in Poland

      Well, what am I wrong in? Fortsa is everywhere Fortsa and with any structure. And what the Old Man sells is his thieves' happiness, the St. Petersburg rule doesn’t put a rule, he sends a share, this is the resource. Ukry with gas is insolent - you get two streams.
      Quote: iliq
      cool - you just wrote that Lukashenko has no economic or strong-willed resource ...

      An eccentric person, there would be no will - he would fly out of the presidents like a cork from a bottle, and without an economic resource he would not sit for half a year. So, before you rummage around rallies, read the Rukhnama if you cannot master Marx's Capital. Yes, about ,, milk wars ", so everything is simple here - dad really dumped at prices and ours howled, well, since the market is large, they dragged all and sundry, so they took out almost everything from your market. But now they seem to be more or less equal in prices. Although our Milk Union is still twitching at the mention of Belarusian milk.
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 12: 25
    0
    Then BMPT under the Kazakh flag should be added, just in time it will be. [/ Quote]
    BMPT at the uralvagozavod (in Russia) do, and the fire control system for it at the Vavilov MMZ (in Belarus). And then the Kazakhs?
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 26
    -2
    Quote: Corsair5912
    Bullshit, the economy of Belarus is fully operational, no one is selling the public sector,

    for example, Grodno Nitrogen ...

    MAZ
    http://www.rbcdaily.ru/industry/562949979044825

    Oil refinery Naftan
    http://news.vitebsk.cc/2013/03/25/npz-naftan-prodayut-rossiyanam/

    Why sell (and give away state profits) if everything is so good?


    Quote: Corsair5912
    The people of Belarus undoubtedly want to unite with Russia, no one has stolen and destroyed anything anywhere.

    is it in the Russian Federation, right? turn on the TV, look chtol somehow;)

    Quote: Corsair5912
    what kind of millions of Soviet people went abroad, only Jews and Germans left, and they and 1% were not in the USSR.

    google in hand - there are numbers.

    Quote: Corsair5912
    The overwhelming majority of Soviet people in their entire lives didn’t steal a penny, they only stole traders, but criminals.

    and how did these "Soviet people" become who they are now?
    Didn't they at every feast toast "so that we had everything, and we didn't get anything for it!"?
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 29
    0
    Quote: sibircat
    fire control system for him at the Vavilov MMZ (in Belarus).

    from french components ...
  • COBOK
    COBOK April 11 2013 12: 35
    11
    I will express my opinion, and then scold, kick, etc., but justified.
    I believe that unification with Belarus, now, with the state of Russia that exists, will simply destroy Belarus and turn it from a normal state into a poor subject of the Russian Federation.
    Our privatizers, led by a plushy, will ruin any economy (that's why I have long suggested sending him to Usania, let it shit there), look, everything that is privatized, under the control of "effective managers" does not work, and "BATKA" has managed to keep the state. ownership of most of the enterprises and they work (although, for 20 years or so, as we are assured that without capitalism everything will die, only we cannot assure you). Russia is a member of the WTO ... (clarification required?)
    Lukashenka will become "one of ..." and will not be able to resist the flow of liberal go-on that will pour from Russia, NGOs, left-wing activists, etc., I directly envy the Belarusians, how they live without it. The level of disintegration of the public administration system that Russia has reached is unattainable under Lukashenko (and this is good). Introduce tough censorship, without it people simply suffocate in the slops. By the way, moreover, it is not unimportant - the question of the death penalty (there can be no two opinions here - we take the example of our brothers-neighbors).

    So, if Alexander G. is in no hurry to create a single state, I understand him perfectly. I believe that Russia should reach the level of Belarus, and not vice versa, we must restore order in our country (yes, finally nationalize oil, gas, energy companies, the military-industrial complex and the Central Bank), give Pendal an iPhone (I just got it, well, there can be no prime minister - as a minister, a person whom he doesn’t make a penny of a country - they hate the way, let them fear, but do not despise) and his team, EXIT WTO and indeed need to work on yourself ...

    Almost advertising (VO forgive them paid wink ) - the company "Wargaming" - the creator of the "world of tanks", games that conquered a huge number of people around the world and, for comparison, a LADY asking to create a Russian analogue of some toy (under Belarusian "totalitarianism" (three times HA), the process of creation goes on yourself).
    1. sibircat
      sibircat April 11 2013 13: 22
      +1
      Hugo Chavez nationalized resources, and died of unknown cancer. And as they suggest it is not by chance.
      1. COBOK
        COBOK April 11 2013 13: 53
        +2
        And what for us the FSB? They must defend their own when he begins to send "privatizers" and hang liberals (I have a dreamy mood, jr ..). In extreme cases, the KGB can be asked to help. I think, Old Man will not refuse the brotherly people. wink
      2. itkul
        itkul April 11 2013 18: 41
        -2
        Quote: sibircat
        Hugo Chavez nationalized resources, and died of unknown cancer. And as they suggest it is not by chance.


        Are you implying that the same fate awaits Lukashenka when he wants to privatize what Russia has invested in Belarus
    2. Heccrbq
      Heccrbq April 11 2013 13: 36
      0
      Huge plus for your post !!!
    3. Alex Danilov
      Alex Danilov April 13 2013 00: 26
      0
      Brother, everything will be. Putin has authority. Much he has returned to the state, will return everything else. Those who row, will remove from power, with the confiscation of the loot in favor of the state and people.
      We, our countries will restore the USSR 2: 0. Much more powerful both militarily and economically, much better than the old USSR. Ordinary people will live fine, we will travel abroad and ride around the union. In the near future. We are simply angry that we ruined such a powerful country. And at the same time, we’ll stop paying a few rubles for a dollar, we’ll do our own currency. And it will be like this: our 1 ruble = 1 dollar. Tired of paying our crazy money for some kind of candy dollar.
      Yes, after the restoration of the USSR 2: 0 - this is our union, the alliance will already drag everything from outer space to the Earth and master it. As if someone did not want to ruin Russia, it would not work and the USSR 2: 0 - we will restore! they still have goosebumps when they think that the USSR will recover and are furious that they cannot break up Russia.
      No need to be afraid of Bear, he is kind, but respect and do not offend, so as not to wake the Bear.
  • fenix57
    fenix57 April 11 2013 12: 39
    +1
    Quote: Seaman
    And it’s time for Ukraine to stop rushing around

    And the Ukrainian leadership has already made a decision judging by "..... On April 8, the President of Ukraine V. Yanukovych signed the law of Ukraine "On Ratification of the Agreement between Ukraine and the European Union on Amendments to the Agreement between Ukraine and the European Union on the Facilitation of Visa Processing". A step towards the EU has been taken. see http: //glavnoe.ua/news/n133160 hi
  • sibircat
    sibircat April 11 2013 12: 39
    +1
    Quote: iliq
    Quote: sibircat
    fire control system for him at the Vavilov MMZ (in Belarus).

    from french components ...

    I assembled the frame-99 myself. Of the French components there are only cameras (television and thermal). If neither Russia nor Belarus does it better, you can buy from SAZHEM as pieces.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 44
    0
    Quote: sibircat
    I collected frame-99 myself. Of the French components, there are only cameras (television and thermal).

    and without this camera there is no SLA. or rather there is - the year before last generation.

    Quote: sibircat
    If neither Russia nor Belarus does it better, you can buy from SAZHEM as pieces.

    in order to do this, you need a lot of specialists, money and time - at least to catch up ...
    1. sibircat
      sibircat April 11 2013 12: 47
      +1
      An order is needed for 300-500 items and an advance payment. There are specialists with brains in "Pelenga", and cameras in Vologda began to be made under a French license.
      1. iliq
        iliq April 11 2013 13: 20
        0
        cameras is one thing, but without the French matrix (which no one in their right mind licenses) - there isn’t it ...
        1. sibircat
          sibircat April 11 2013 13: 26
          +2
          A year and a half later, the Chinese will do no worse than the French matrix, they do not spare money for industrial espionage.
          1. iliq
            iliq April 11 2013 13: 35
            0
            it is only a dream. maybe the French will do the matrix for them - but no one will transfer the technology to the Chinese. and copy high-tech products (I'm not talking about development) - succeeds with a lag in a generation or two.
            1. sibircat
              sibircat April 11 2013 14: 02
              +2
              Forty years ago, they laughed at the Chinese that they cook steel in the courtyard of the house, 40 years ago they said that space technology from the USSR was slammed. Judging by the pace of their development is no longer funny.
              1. iliq
                iliq April 11 2013 14: 13
                0
                So I do not dispute the success of China.
                Yes, they are catching up with developed countries, but in the high-tech sphere this requires a lot of money, specialists and time.
                perhaps in 10-15 years they will reach the current Sagem level, but by then the products of the next or even higher generation will be there.
                1. sibircat
                  sibircat April 11 2013 14: 23
                  +1
                  My opinion: Belarus and not only it does not need to chase someone or invent something from scratch. It is necessary to develop those industries where there is great theoretical and practical experience. To do and improve what works best.
                  1. iliq
                    iliq April 11 2013 14: 33
                    0
                    unfortunately this will not work ... take a look at the experience of the USSR - better and cheaper foreign goods "forced" the "honest Soviet man" to destroy his country ...
                    1. sibircat
                      sibircat April 11 2013 14: 51
                      +3
                      More than one dissertation will be written about the collapse of the USSR; far from everything is so simple there. Why is Cuba the best medicine in the world? This is recognized even by the states.
                      And in general, they will earn more money on this, if "friends" do not help them destroy medicine.
                      1. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 15: 11
                        -1
                        the best medicine and poverty ...

                        if desired, they can destroy medicine as well, but apparently they don’t want to.
                      2. sibircat
                        sibircat April 11 2013 15: 27
                        +4
                        Poverty? It's funny Nobody dies of hunger, and every second psychiatrist, as in the states, does not need them. As for me, a beautiful life according to the Western model, I already ate in Russia before burping.
                        How many years can you earn an apartment?
                        How much from the family budget will you give back on a loan, pay for housing, for food? Somehow I got fed up with cheap bananas, but I can’t find the real fat.
                      3. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 20: 25
                        -1
                        Poverty? It's funny Nobody dies of hunger, and every second psychiatrist, as in the states, does not need them.

                        well, man doesn’t live by bread alone. and one should not forget about natural conditions. I also do not mind living all year in a plywood house at an average temperature of +15 overboard. but no - you have to pay for a real house, and for heating in winter. plus matching winter clothes ...
                        I do not mind leaving every year 6 euros for heating alone ... but you can’t deceive nature.

                        How many years can you earn an apartment?

                        I think for 10-15 years. this is if you put off 1/3 s / pl.

                        Somehow I got fed up with cheap bananas, but I can’t find the real fat.

                        so I can’t eat tomatoes every day;)
                        but with fat there are no problems - good is more expensive than consumer goods.
                      4. sibircat
                        sibircat April 11 2013 20: 34
                        0
                        [quote = iliq] [quote]
                        I think for 10-15 years. this is if you put off 1/3 s / pl.

                        And will you live these 10-15 years on the street?
                      5. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 20: 49
                        0
                        why? I wrote for how much I (with my family) can realistically save up for an apartment.
                        at the same time, I didn’t write whether I would live in it on credit or rent a house. with rental housing - it will certainly be longer.
                      6. sibircat
                        sibircat April 11 2013 21: 05
                        +1
                        It’s just that at the enterprises of Minsk, about which I wrote above, young specialists up to 90 received apartments after 5-7 years of work. It was received, not bought.
                        About me: I changed 12 rented apartments before buying my own.
                      7. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 21: 13
                        0
                        in Belarus it was different - large enterprises had the opportunity to build for their own. smaller ones - there were already problems. Well, and accordingly, it depended on Rye - the outback or the capital;)

                        Yes, and live in a hostel 5-7 years old, often with children - there is little happiness. and an apartment, although they received it, but it was not the property of those living.
                        at the moment in my hometown they are building entire microdistricts - with soft loans, etc.
                        but this (construction boom and flight from the village) is only a matter of time, they will soon run back to the village :)
                      8. sibircat
                        sibircat April 11 2013 21: 37
                        +1
                        Today there was a live broadcast on Channel 5. Open studio. "Russian Business"
                        http://www.5-tv.ru/programs/broadcast/507576/
                        An example was given: St. Petersburg, a family takes a mortgage for 20 years, takes the cheapest kopeck piece, provided that they have 1 million rubles for a down payment. Mortgage payment is 32 thousand per month. The average salary 31 TR in the city. Let's say 2nd work-62 tr
                        62-32 = 30; 30-5 (utilities) = 25; 25/3 (1 BABY) = 8 thousand per person. This is not enough even for food.
                        Conclusion: even having put on a collar for 20 years, the average family will not pull out a mortgage!
                      9. iliq
                        iliq April 11 2013 22: 22
                        0
                        takes the cheapest kopeck piece

                        is it how much does it cost?

                        Conclusion: even having put on a collar for 20 years, the average family will not pull out a mortgage!

                        I hasten to assure you - in Europe it is about the same. but with the difference that the market for rental housing is developed - but on average they give half the salary for an apartment.
                        and for the average salary, taking a loan you can buy an apartment for 10-15 years (I estimate 400-500 euros per month and the cost of an apartment is 40-80 thousand euros)
                        but nevertheless the majority, in Germany, live in rented housing - this is the norm.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 46
    -2
    Quote: COBOK
    "BATKA" managed to keep the state. ownership of most of the enterprises and they work (although, for 20 years or so, as we are assured that without capitalism everything will die out, only we cannot assure you)

    and the miracle-Old Man without a free Russian hydrocarbon is already selling "most of the working", I gave links.
    1. COBOK
      COBOK April 11 2013 12: 55
      +3
      And with us and with "free hydrocarbon" with "effective managers" (this expression enrages) most of the enterprises are falling apart out of the blue, these are the ones that actually produced the necessary products.
  • iliq
    iliq April 11 2013 12: 56
    +1
    Quote: COBOK
    And with us and with "free hydrocarbon" with "effective managers" (this expression enrages) most of the enterprises are falling apart out of the blue, these are the ones that actually produced the necessary products.

    question:
    Do Belarusians want the same?
    1. sibircat
      sibircat April 11 2013 13: 03
      +1
      As the Russian Belarus I answer: I personally do not want hi
    2. COBOK
      COBOK April 11 2013 13: 03
      0
      Purely hypothetically: state ownership of the extractive industry, military-industrial complex and central bank, plus the absence of wild liberals in the government?
    3. COBOK
      COBOK April 11 2013 13: 08
      +1
      I spoke about that - too early. Only with you our views differ on the problems that arise in the matter of unification.