Neither a mouse nor a frog: the domestic military-industrial complex has given birth to something incomprehensible

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Neither a mouse nor a frog: the domestic military-industrial complex has given birth to something incomprehensible

Recently, a Russian state corporation began testing the BT-3F floating armored personnel carrier, created on the basis of the outdated BMP-3. Many, having watched the "impressive" video of the demonstration of this "promising landing vehicle", asked the question that Morozko from the old fairy tale of the same name asked himself: what kind of a miracle-yudo is this?

This is how it is presented:



"The vehicle is designed to transport units of the Navy's coastal troops and units of the ground forces, and to provide fire support to dismounted troops in all conditions of their combat use. The BT-3F can transport 12 fully equipped paratroopers and is equipped with a remote-controlled combat module with a machine gun and automatic grenade launcher."

But is this machine capable of handling such tasks in practice?

"There is no sign that the experience of the SVO has been taken into account"


So, what is this promising machine?

Let's take a look at the presentation video that was published and received a lot of comments in the media. For example, here's what пишет "Russian newspaper":

"The vehicle can accommodate 12 paratroopers. They are in full combat gear, with weapons. The armored personnel carrier is still moving, and the soldiers are already getting out of the vehicle and taking up positions behind the BT-3F. In the video, you can see how the vehicle literally jumps into the pond and swims across it."


Jumping and swimming are all well and good, but the first thing I would like to draw attention to is the large sliding doors (which act as a landing hatch) behind the BT-3F. As some war correspondents joke, they are arranged at such a large angle that enemy FPV-drones It will be very difficult to miss them.

In order not to be unfounded, the author will cite the opinion of military expert Vladislav Shurygin, who wrote following:

"The combat vehicle in the video shows no sign that the experience of the SVO was taken into account in any way. The low track base is extremely vulnerable to detonation. The "cardboard" protection on top, in the form of thin steel doors that swing upwards towards the "drones", turns the troop compartment into a saucepan into which a grenade was thrown when a drone hits the open doors, and into a frying pan under a lid when the doors are closed, where the troops will fry, since a hit to the doors will almost certainly jam them tightly."

Indeed, in a real battle, the troops in this vehicle may find themselves, to put it mildly, in a difficult situation. One would like to ask: are the engineers really not familiar with the reality of combat operations in the SVO zone?

The second point I would like to draw attention to is how the troops exit the vehicle and cover themselves with its armor. It seems that those who filmed this video stayed in the 1990s and do not know modern combat tactics very well.

On unnecessary expenses


Many military experts and war correspondents ask the question: who prepared the technical specifications for this machine? After all, it is absolutely inadequate to the realities of the military conflict in Ukraine.

Svyatoslav Golikov, author of the Telegram channel “Philologist in Ambush,” considers it symptomatic that military design thinking continues to be limited to options for overcoming water obstacles and landing.

"It seems to me that it is not so surprising as it is symptomatic that in the fourth year of the war, having, it would seem, the experience of observing the practical implementation of the tactical and technical capabilities of the heavy American IFV, which is far from being the freshest in the conditions of modern combined arms combat, domestic military design thought persists in ignoring the need to provide higher anti-mine and armor protection for AFVs, continuing to rest on the options of overcoming water obstacles and landing. I strongly suspect that such persistence stems from technical assignments generated by the military thought of domestic military professionals, which is even more symptomatic,"

- notes he.

In his opinion, it is necessary to reduce unnecessary expenses and increase resources in more important areas. In particular, the area of ​​combat armored vehicles should be reduced, since in the current conditions it is simply a waste of money, and funds should be redirected to more practical things.

Of course, in the realities of modern combined arms combat, combat armored vehicles are necessary as a means of ensuring relatively rapid delivery of assault groups to the attacked positions in the conditions of an extended gray zone and direct fire support of assault operations. But the question is in the tactical and technical characteristics and the required quantities of such vehicles.

M2 Bradley, for example, demonstrates high resistance to external influences, be it kamikaze drone strikes or mine explosions, thus increasing the survivability of personnel even with significant damage. Why not just copy the same Bradley? The benefits from this would be much greater than from "not a mouse, not a frog, but an unknown animal" like the BT-3F.
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  1. + 22
    28 May 2025 04: 17
    The idea itself is not new and not bad, but there is a BTR-50, maybe it is worth modernizing it? The BTR-50 is made on the basis of the PT-76, and the weapons should be more powerful than the BT-3F, and the landing force of 20 people. Special vehicles are needed, of course, to overcome water obstacles, but not in large quantities. Moreover, as one of the commentators noted, today, based on the experience of the SVO, high-speed watercraft are needed (hovercraft, gliders). I completely agree with him. Today, our soldiers and Ukrainians are forced to use motorboats supplied by volunteers (where is the rear of the Ministry of Defense?). Basically, these vehicles are no longer new. We have already seen what this leads to - a group of our soldiers died because the boat motor did not start.
    1. + 15
      28 May 2025 07: 35
      It's so interesting to reinvent the BTR-50. Then we'll get to the BTR-152 laughing
      1. + 21
        28 May 2025 09: 11
        Why haven't we reached it yet? What do you think of armored vehicles: Typhoon, Buran, Akhmat, Spartak, Titan? They are the same BTR-152, only in a modern version.
        1. +2
          28 May 2025 10: 49
          Quote: fiberboard
          And what are armored vehicles in your opinion: Typhoon, Buran, Akhmat, Spartak, Titan? This is the same BTR-152, only in a modern version.

          Well, there's no need to compare it that way. The BTR-152 is basically a regular truck with an open body, only all iron.
      2. -5
        28 May 2025 10: 41
        The BTR 152 would have been much more effective than this coffin.
      3. + 25
        28 May 2025 11: 41
        Quote: Civil
        It's so interesting to reinvent the BTR-50. Then we'll get to the BTR-152 laughing

        Already. Armored car SBA-60-K2 "Bulat":
        1. +6
          29 May 2025 01: 00
          It's funny, but if the conscripts had been transported in BTR-152s during the attack on the Kursk region, there would have been far fewer losses from the Haimars cluster munitions.
          1. -6
            29 May 2025 03: 13
            It’s unlikely, because a Bradley-level IFV is needed against cluster Khimars, since 8mm tungsten balls can easily penetrate most Russian armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles.
            1. +6
              29 May 2025 03: 16
              Nevertheless, the balls penetrated simple flatbed trucks, not armor. If they had penetrated armored vehicles, they would have talked about it. But in fact, conscripts in unarmored trucks came under artillery fire. And it would have been better for them to sit in the BTR-152. It would have been really better for them...
            2. 0
              29 May 2025 18: 04
              The balls there are very small, 3-4 mm if I remember correctly. An 8 mm tungsten ball weighs 5 grams, and there in the warhead there are not 18k, but 182k. Drivers in armored cabins survived impacts, I armor the cabins according to class 3.
              1. -1
                3 June 2025 01: 13
                In my opinion, the Khimars warhead is 8 mm. 4 mm for 25-30-40 mm canister shells of the BMP. But I wrote it from memory, I saw the performance characteristics of the Khimars warhead somewhere. Maybe I confused it with another warhead, but I remember the figure of 8 mm associated with the balls from the warhead. Of course, 5 g per 180 thousand is almost a ton, which is certainly a lot. Thank you, I will check the information.
          2. 0
            2 June 2025 14: 41
            Quote: cast iron
            If the conscripts had been transported in the BTR-152 during the attack on the Kursk region, then there would have been losses from the cassette Haimars

            And the losses from drones are many times greater. Apparently, in your opinion, after being hit by a drone, it is more pleasant to lie in a cemetery. How do critics even imagine "taking into account the experience of the SVO" on heavy transporters? What do they lack on the APC to make it harder to hit with a drone? Barbecues? It's easy to screw on. Wrong angle of the hatch? What is "the right one"? There is no angle that would help. Make a strong negative, the drone will dive under the ledge and that's it. If you criticize, offer. Or shut up, critics have bred like maggots in shit, and the only benefit is the stench...
            In my opinion, the concept of an armored personnel carrier is currently irrelevant. Until there is a real weapon against drones, the production of any armored personnel carriers is a waste of strategic resources. A shell flew in - the armor of the armored personnel carrier protected from shrapnel. Then a drone flew in and killed everyone. What was the point of sweating?
            Light frame transporters, allowing to hide on the terrain and in any case reducing losses. Sights on machine guns, allowing to really capture a drone and shoot it down. Yes, computer! Yes, expensive! Yes, in the design bureau developing them it is impossible to attach a son, nephew, a big-paying blatnoy (a big-paying Ukrainian spy) as a GK! But without it there is no way! Damn it all...
            1. -1
              6 June 2025 00: 23
              Lightweight frame transporters that allow for cover in the area and in any case reduce losses.


              It would be better to put naked soldiers on donkeys and send them into battle. Same thing. I am always surprised by people who seriously talk about the need to deprive soldiers of armor protection. A drone can have a thermobaric charge, which will protect even an armored personnel carrier (APC) 80. But in a frame buggy, this thermobaric charge will tear apart a soldier's leg, arm, and other "unnecessary" parts of the body from your point of view. Moreover, the cumulative charge of the drone has a high explosive effect. And if in an open buggy all the high explosive effect will go to destroy the passengers of the buggy, then in a mobile armor a significant part of the high explosive effect will remain outside the armored box. How you all hate Russian soldiers. Sometimes it produces cardboard, landing submarines for them, and sometimes you want to put them on defenseless buggies or motorcycles.
              1. -1
                6 June 2025 12: 32
                So the Ukrainian Armed Forces and other enemies "maybe" will send a drone that won't kill a soldier? Where does this faith in the enemy's mercy come from?! No, he will send something that will kill! And yes, one or two people will get hit hard. BUT NOT FOR THE REST! ​​Because they will be protected by the bodies of the wounded, no matter how cynical it may sound, but the designer of military equipment is obliged to think exactly like that! And the rest will get a real chance to jump off and save themselves. But in an iron box, no one has the slightest chance, everyone will die. A cumulative charge without the slightest explosive effect kills everyone. There are no survivors. How much YOU hate Russian soldiers, it's simply amazing. Are you writing from Kyiv?
                1. 0
                  24 August 2025 13: 46
                  A cumulative charge kills everyone without the slightest explosive effect.

                  How is that possible? Especially considering the considerable internal volume of the APC.
                  1. -1
                    25 August 2025 09: 02
                    A cumulative shot is a stream of liquid, extremely hot lead, plus explosion gases - gaseous products released during the explosion of the charge. All this rushes around in the volume of the APC, reflecting off the walls, and the gases are simply very, very hot. Barotrauma and burning of the lungs, damage from droplets of lead flying at supersonic speed. Death.
                    1. 0
                      25 August 2025 10: 13
                      A cumulative shot is a stream of liquid, extremely hot lead, plus explosion gases - gaseous products released during the explosion of the charge. All this rushes around in the volume of the APC, reflecting off the walls, and the gases are simply very, very hot. Barotrauma and burning of the lungs, damage from droplets of lead flying at supersonic speed. Death.

                      There are no words!
                      Read Orlov's "Physics of Explosion".
                      1. 0
                        25 August 2025 12: 07
                        Thank you, I will definitely read it. My opinion is based on the material that we were once given at the military department.
                      2. 0
                        25 August 2025 12: 20
                        Not Orlov but Orlenko, but okay, I still had to go to Wikipedia to quickly digest the descriptions) I'll look at the formula part later. The question is that a cumulative charge that doesn't kill doesn't stop the vehicle. And the one that does stop kills the crew and the "cargo". The question is not about penetration as such, but about the destruction of enemy equipment and manpower. Yes, our major himself apparently didn't know the material. But the conclusion remains unchanged.
          3. -1
            5 June 2025 18: 53
            The conscripts were transported in regular KamAZ trucks with awnings. But with black military numbers.
      4. -1
        6 June 2025 00: 47
        They wanted to pay tribute to the legendary German "Hanomag". At least judging by the landing hatch.
    2. Ray
      +5
      28 May 2025 07: 44
      Yes, I saw that sad video. These were most likely not just soldiers. These were trained saboteurs or scouts. And because the engine didn't start and they weren't able to leave the hostile shore in time, they were shot from the shore like partridges and pelted with grenades.
    3. + 10
      28 May 2025 09: 10
      "BT-3F will operate between the islands on the Dnieper"
      No, it's "Special vehicles are needed, of course, to overcome water obstacles, but not in large quantities." And that's right!
      Here the "experienced" forget that each type of armored vehicle is needed for its own tasks. And it will never be possible to harness a heavy horse (Bradley, etc.) and a timid doe (BMD, BTR-3F) to the same cart.
      No one is suggesting arming motorized rifle units with light armored personnel carriers; these are special vehicles with light protection for special tasks (landings from large landing ships, crossing rivers), and not for cruising along the Dnieper as armored boats.
      So you can also make claims against a buggy or a motorcycle for why they are poorly protected. They say that speed can't always help, they say you can't run away from a bullet or shrapnel. wink
      Of course, the fact that the armored vehicle is of the light class does not mean that it should not use the well-known means of protection: screens, DZ, EW station, shotgun, anti-aircraft gun, layout, when leak-proof (secured like aircraft, from the time of the 2nd World War) fuel tanks separated by armored partitions. That is why GABTU exists - to make the industry meet all these requirements.
      1. +6
        28 May 2025 09: 21
        If you hang everything you wrote on this BT-3F, it will sink. I still think the BTR-50 is preferable.
        1. 0
          28 May 2025 09: 37
          Quote: fiberboard
          If we hang everything you wrote on this BT-3F, it will sink.

          That is unlikely. smile
          Much has been written, but this is not monolithic armor. In addition, screens can be used in the form of containers filled with a light filler, such as expanded clay. These will be both screens and floats to increase buoyancy.
          It's just that everyone needs to get involved, to delve into it, including the high-ranking officials. The way G.K. Zhukov delved into the improvement of the BTR-152 in his time. This model is still in service in some countries.
          1. -13
            28 May 2025 10: 24
            Everyone thinks that it will continue like this with drones. There will be no drones during a nuclear conflict. And a nuclear conflict is inevitable. If one person in the SVO lacks the courage, it does not mean that another will not use them. Here we will see who gives the wrong technical specifications. Bradley does not help the enemy much ... the Ukrainian Armed Forces are losing the theater of military operations as a whole. On the contrary, drones are needed for small and fast vehicles. Like buggies, Luaz, those same jeeps from the war, etc. There should be mass production and cheapness, more composites, etc.
            1. +5
              28 May 2025 11: 16
              Quote: hrych
              does not mean that the other will not apply.

              And how will the extreme vulnerability of the machine to enemy drones and mines help in case of nuclear weapons use? The hope that the enemy will not have such weapons is extremely illusory, IMHO.

              Quote: hrych
              Bradley doesn't help the enemy much

              The more protected Bradley can take more hits, saving more Ukrainian Nazis, which is bad. sad

              Quote: hrych
              Drones are needed to be small and fast vehicles

              By the way, this is exactly what the author of "Philologist in Ambush" writes about. That the money spent on developing this machine, which is irrelevant given the experience of the SVO, would be better spent on standardized and mass-produced army buggies, motorcycles, robotic platforms, etc. request
            2. +1
              28 May 2025 13: 31
              With drones it will continue for a long time, a very long time. But the problem is not in this platform, but in the equipment of electronic warfare and the capabilities of the machine gun DUBM. It is unlikely that the installed DUBM is able to effectively combat drones, but it should already be able to do this.
              1. +2
                28 May 2025 15: 54
                Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                With drones it will continue for a long time, a very long time. But the problem is not in this platform, but in the equipment of electronic warfare

                The Americans are already testing personal electronic warfare for infantrymen.
              2. -8
                28 May 2025 18: 30
                IMHO: a drone is good for positional or guerrilla (also considered positional) warfare, but in an active maneuver war they will be of much less use.
            3. The comment was deleted.
            4. -1
              29 May 2025 14: 16
              Quote: hrych
              There will be no drones during a nuclear conflict.

              Are these the ones that won't be on fiber optics? Or will UAV operators die out along the entire BS line during a nuclear attack?
              1. -2
                29 May 2025 15: 54
                All electronics will die, both from the EMP of just one high-altitude explosion over a territory comparable to Poland, and locally. Neutron weapons are especially good at destroying electronics, you can't protect yourself from neutrons with layers of armor, etc. They pass them. Operators, if they remain, will only have Kalashnikovs, RPGs, and guns with mortars. Here, there is absolute all-terrain capability, protection of personnel from all damaging factors of a nuclear explosion by light armor. Bulletproof and anti-fragmentation protection from accidentally surviving natives, which is a last resort. Also, the best means of demining, as well as nuclear weapons, an air burst, as environmentally friendly, but all pressure-action ammunition, with electronic fuses, etc. detonate immediately in a decent area of ​​the armor group breakthrough. And the blow must be delivered to the cradle of Banderaism, a march through Belarus and Western Ukraine to Transnistria and Odessa, clearing the way for yourself with the indicated means, since it is a pity to expose Russian-speaking areas to contamination. It is not forbidden to shit on the Poles, Romanians, etc. along the way, taking into account the wind rose. Although an air explosion simply gives a tiny contamination, and a high-altitude one does not at all, it is exoatmospheric and neutron charges, while neutrons are active, very strongly affect personnel in shelters, but this is a very short time. Neutrons will quickly find a shelter for themselves and sow corn wassat It will be tastier and will knock out pests and weeds. If, of course, you don't know all this, first of all the basics of nuclear physics, then of course, it's scary. The Greens were created for this purpose, to fool people's heads when we surpassed the West in nuclear weapons. So, some C-grade students start to slow down, chew snot and talk nonsense about a brotherly nation. In an air explosion, when the plasma ball does not touch the ground and does not contaminate the soil, raising it in the form of a radioactive cloud, but only a few dozen kilograms of fissionable matter evenly scatters for tens of kilometers in different directions. That's all. But what damage to the enemy. And if you finally deign to read about the BMP-3. Yes, even here
                https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/БМП-3
                From the very beginning, you understand the technical requirements of the Ministry of Defense and its counterparts based on it, as well as why they are being created. BMP-3 is a Soviet and Russian combat armored tracked vehicle designed to transport personnel to the front line, increasing their mobility, armament and protection on the battlefield. in conditions of the use of nuclear weapons and joint actions with tanks in battle.
                1. -1
                  30 May 2025 16: 08
                  Quote: hrych
                  neutrons cannot be protected by layers of armor, etc.

                  Armor, of course, is a poor protector. But ordinary water vapor is quite good. At one time, it was precisely for this reason that the decision was made to develop neutron weapons primarily for extra-atmospheric interceptions (ABM). And water-saturated ground is an even better defense. So the effectiveness of neutron weapons is highly questionable, and in practice, even the radius of a reliable defeat will be unclear. They usually write about a radius of 1,5 km, but fog or rain rises and that's a bummer sad

                  Quote: hrych
                  detonate all pressure-acting ammunition,

                  Most modern fuses have a combined action. But even those that are pressure-type are designed for a strictly defined pressure range. Which will not be observed in most of the affected area. Accordingly, most of the mines already placed will be dangerous for poorly protected equipment, plus the enemy, of course, will additionally mine remotely.

                  Quote: hrych
                  protection on the battlefield in conditions of the use of nuclear weapons and joint actions with tanks

                  Tanks have a whole range of radiation protection systems. And the crew's chances of survival are seriously increased if used correctly. But the BMP-3 does not. sad Only thin armor, which will be immediately penetrated by penetrating radiation.
                  1. -1
                    31 May 2025 23: 34
                    Neutron weapons, let's say, of the first generation, slightly disappointed the West. But not because of the weak effect of neutrons, but on the contrary, other damaging factors are too strong. And to kill people, but not to destroy buildings, was the idea. This is at the first stage. In the exoatmospheric interception, stupidly, a chain reaction in the warhead of fissile material, without reaching critical mass. This is relevant and also relevant when striking mines, etc. Which have a degree of protection from other damaging factors, but not from neutrons. And just when the accuracy increased, or rather, the deviation decreased, the effectiveness of such ammunition increased. However, it is electronics that die perfectly. We do not need to kill a person, we need to damage a micro-drop, even a nano-drop of silicon, germanium, etc. in microcircuits. Regarding the BMP-3, its task is not to get hit, but to quickly come to the place after the strike, where the induced radiation from the same neutrons is absent. Yes, the terrain is radioactive, bridges and roads are damaged, hence the all-terrain and cross-country capability. The resistance of an enemy hit by a nuclear strike is, well, questionable, although it has the main caliber firepower of a tank, a rapid-fire cannon and machine guns. So, in order to increase the number of attack aircraft, they reduced the firepower and increased the horsepower without losing all-terrain capability. The concept is not new. But from radioactive dust, just a capsule of light armor isolates the crew. While maintaining bulletproof resistance. Since a slightly fried enemy should lose the ability to artillery and perhaps even die with a machine gun, but it is dangerous. Regarding mines. If a tank runs over an anti-personnel mine, it will explode. If an infantryman steps on an anti-tank mine, it will not work. But in a nuclear strike, everything within a certain radius will work. About the new, remote mining, of course, it is funny. The enemy was subjected to a nuclear strike, so the BMP-3's task is to be the first to capture an important object. And most importantly, why should you argue and prove the opposite? Once again, I repeat, during a nuclear war there will be no drones. There will be no satellites and there will be no proper communication, etc. The electronics will die completely, the mechanics partially.
                    1. -1
                      2 June 2025 16: 44
                      Quote: hrych
                      when the accuracy increased, or rather, the deviation decreased, the effectiveness of such ammunition increased

                      Yes, the accuracy has increased, the efficiency has increased in terms of neutron radiation. And in general, a radius of approximately one and a half kilometers is more than enough to destroy the electronics of a missile silo. But this does not solve the problem of hydrogen in the ground and atmosphere. A UAV crew with a large supply of drones with live microcircuits can easily survive in a damp dugout. Unless the explosion occurred directly above them.

                      Quote: hrych
                      Regarding the BMP-3, its task is not to get hit, but to quickly return to the scene after the attack.

                      Just one unfinished UAV crew can wipe out a huge number of BMP-3 and similar vehicles. When these BMPs were designed, there were no such threats. But such equipment is extremely vulnerable against drones. request

                      Quote: hrych
                      If a tank runs over an anti-personnel mine, it will explode.

                      No. Modern pressure fuses have not only a lower pressure level, but also an upper one. Specifically in case of an explosion under a car, not under a tank. In addition, the fuses are also duplicated by some kind of magnetic field sensor. So, a huge number of mines will not explode simply from a shock war. And then the same surviving drones remotely deliver new mines.

                      Quote: hrych
                      During a nuclear war there will be no drones. There will be no satellites and no proper communications, etc. Electronics will die completely

                      There is some substitution of concepts here. What kind of war are we talking about? If it is about limited use of tactical nuclear weapons, plus the aforementioned neutrons, then - no. There will be a sufficient number of surviving electronics. If we are talking about mass use of strategic nuclear weapons (and there the power of explosions will be orders of magnitude greater by about 5!), then EMP will hit everything else. Then not so many will survive. But in this case the big question is - what is such a war for?

                      Quote: hrych
                      why do you need to argue and prove the opposite

                      I think you are wrong in your assessments of the use of nuclear weapons. And under no scenario will the use of the BMP-3 now be justified. These concepts from the 70s are outdated sad
                      1. -1
                        2 June 2025 18: 44
                        No one will make a deep mine for drone operators wassat But, in addition to the neutron flux, the EMP penetrates deep, along with cables, wires, fittings, etc. They need to be sealed, like in a capsule. And here the destruction zone is the size of Britain, Poland, Ukraine. And the BMP-3, having fallen under the EMP, will continue to work, of course, having lost its electronics, but will remain on the move, with guns and machine guns.
                      2. -1
                        3 June 2025 10: 50
                        Quote: hrych
                        EMI goes deep

                        But this depth depends on the power of the EMP, which is proportional to the power of the explosion. And it falls proportionally to the cube of the distance from the epicenter.
                        To summarize the above, we need many explosions of strategic thermonuclear supplies at a relatively short distance from the objects to be hit. Then the goal of destroying electronics will be achieved. But let's return to the question of what type of nuclear war are you writing about?

                        Quote: hrych
                        And the BMP-3, having been hit by an EMP, will continue to operate.

                        If you are writing about the mass use of strategic nuclear weapons (and these are not small, clean neutrons) even in a limited area, then there will be plenty of radioactive dust, so much so that it is comparable to the eruption of a super-volcano. BMP crews will last a couple of days if they move on the surface. In addition, the surface itself will start to emit radiation very soon. There is no point in such actions. Therefore, the only point in producing BMP-3 now is the refusal to reconfigure production lines in combat conditions. Like we are making old, bad machines, but we are doing it. sad
                      3. -1
                        3 June 2025 11: 17
                        About 90 percent of strategic warheads will use airborne nuclear explosions not out of humanism, but because of the greater effectiveness of damaging factors, where the main one is the shock wave. Here, radiation is absolutely insignificant, the soil is not contaminated, and the soot from fires of only large cities, in comparison with volcanoes, is simply a pittance. Another thing is Poseidon with an artificial tsunami and special contamination of the territory with radioactive cobalt. This is further from our borders. But the war is not over, someone must capture wells, bridges and dams, or rather, what is left of them, and the enemy must be finished off. Tactical weapons, rather for the post-apocalypse or against a non-nuclear aggressor, like Ukraine. BMP-3, T-72, etc. must reach the English Channel, the South China Sea, etc. All this is spelled out in the plans of the General Staff one way or another. No one ends history with a nuclear apocalypse. The war will only begin after that.
                      4. -1
                        3 June 2025 16: 05
                        Quote: hrych
                        they will use an airborne nuclear explosion not out of humanitarianism

                        What does humanism have to do with it? It is precisely those damaging factors that work against electronics that require a close detonation from the target. Otherwise, free neutrons will be extinguished by hydrogen atoms in the atmosphere and soil, and the EMP will weaken to low levels that are no longer dangerous for shielded equipment. Damage to the enemy on the surface will be inflicted, but in underground shelters, there will be enough of the same drones.

                        But if you bring thermonuclear fusion to the surface and extinguish the electronics in underground shelters, you get a full set of joys of a nuclear apocalypse, including dust and other things. And you can only capture a nuclear desert there.

                        And there are no good options here. Strategic nuclear weapons were invented for deterrence, not practical use. And tactical ones will not completely shut down electronics. In the 70s, armored vehicles were invented specifically to meet the requirements of passage after a strike with tactical nuclear weapons, but then there were no drones that were so dangerous for armored vehicles. Now the then concepts of infantry fighting vehicles are useless. request
                      5. -1
                        4 June 2025 19: 16
                        Quote: Netl
                        Today, the IFV concepts of that time are useless.

                        Once again, neutron weapons kill people a little further than the blast wave, about a kilometer or two further in radius from the epicenter. Therefore, it was a disappointment for those who wanted to save industrial facilities, buildings, etc. I.e. the radius of DESTRUCTION OF PEOPLE. Do not confuse the death of a person and a nanodrop of a rare earth element in a microcircuit. The radius of destruction of microcircuits is significant. Secondly, we do not even need to destroy the microcircuit by damaging it, it is enough to achieve a failure in the electronics so that this whole mess becomes unusable, and this happens at a huge distance from the epicenter of a conventional charge a la Hiroshima. Back then, there was no real electronics, only wired telephone, teletype and vacuum tube radio stations. All communication with Hiroshima and Nagasaki disappeared, including areas not heavily damaged by the explosion, they could not transmit information. This is a fact. It is also an indisputable fact that during the liquidation of the Chernobyl accident, it was light, armored vehicles that became the main ones for protecting the liquidators in the immediate radius from the reactor. That is, practice shows that the BMP-3 with maximum firepower of a heavy tank with full all-terrain capability (maybe I should send you some Pantoners wassat ) in central and eastern Europe, where there are many rivers, swamps, backwaters, as well as moving to the West, you need to cross huge rivers like the Dnieper, Dniester, Danube, etc. Realize and live with this. And electronics will not be destroyed by Putin, but by a solar geostorm similar to 1859, which happens once every 200 years, plus or minus, and for which the elites on the planet are preparing in full swing. It is you, the narrow-minded, who are taught to use electronic money, store information in electronic files and use technology that will not move without electronics.
                      6. 0
                        24 August 2025 14: 13
                        If you are writing about the mass use of strategic nuclear weapons (and these are not small, clean neutrons) even in a limited area, then there will be plenty of radioactive dust
                  2. 0
                    24 August 2025 14: 06
                    But ordinary water vapor is quite good.

                    The content of water vapor in the atmosphere is about 0%.
                2. -1
                  15 June 2025 00: 15
                  All electronics will die
                  Not all of them. Unlike you and me, designers solved the problem of induced electromagnetic pulses in military technology back in the 60s of the last century. Believe me, or better yet, double-check with reference literature, all of our human nuclear explosions in the air and even in space are far from what the solar wind brings us during solar flares. One small prominence is equal in energy to several thousand atomic bombs, but satellites somehow cope. Some cannot withstand such a load, it happens. Just imagine the conditions where they work. It can be very hot there.

                  Neutron weapons are especially good at destroying electronics; you can’t protect yourself from neutrons with layers of armor, etc.
                  The opposite principle works in protection from neutron flux than in protection from hard gamma. The lighter the material, the better the protection. That's why BrB2 is at your service. Or ordinary water, which slows down neutrons quite well. A 6-meter layer of water will protect you from the reactor's neutron flux. That's why, if something happens, dive deeper and hold your breath longer.

                  Also, the best means of demining, also nuclear weapons, air blast, as environmentally friendly, but all pressure-action ammunition detonates
                  A very expensive demining agent, although very effective. However, it is not environmentally friendly at all.

                  If, of course, you don’t know all this, first of all the basics of nuclear physics, then of course it’s scary
                  Otherwise, they would have started thinking about activating an air suspension of ordinary table salt over the enemy’s camp using an induced neutron flow (a source based on amercium or curium).
                  1. -1
                    15 June 2025 02: 27
                    Really? Microchips in the 60s? Double check? The buried, unfortunate, shielded cable burned out during testing, so-and-so. A prominence? Really? Satellites are protected by our magnetosphere, several Van Allen belts hold charged particles of the solar wind, and there have been no disasters like the superstorm of 1859 to date. Water from neutrons? You are not in a submarine, but in a dugout, in a toilet, in a vehicle, and a neutron charge will catch you unexpectedly.
                    Quote from barbos
                    What exactly do you think would prevent drones from being used in the event of a nuclear conflict?
                    The presence of microchips in drones, the presence of radio transmitting devices in drones and the presence of electronic detectors in drones, in particular - electro-optical, i.e. cameras. As well as the presence of a monitor, a radio transmitting device and microchips in the operator. All this will definitely die from an EMP. Check out the 1999 report of the US Committee on Homeland Security. "THREAT OF ELECTROMAGNETIC PULSE TO U.S. MILITARY AND CIVIL INFRASTRUCTURE". Washington, D.C.: US House of Representatives | 106th US Congress. This report was in connection with the appearance in the DPRK of nuclear weapons and a missile, which was then capable of reaching the center of the United States, but not the East Coast. This explosion in the center of the United States hit the East Coast precisely with an EMP. "Big heads" were invited there and I will quote for general development, so that you do not talk nonsense:
                    But neither the Strategic Air Command nor the Joint Chiefs of Staff nor the Defense Communications Agency during the Cold War believed that the civilian telephone or telegraph or any other infrastructure would survive a nuclear attack to any degree. They thought it would be destroyed completely and permanently, and that was well documented, Mr. Chairman, in the Post-Nuclear Attack Survival and Recovery Studies (PONAST) of the 1970s. There's nothing left of it. It was completely incinerated, and the claims by AT&T or anyone else that it's in much better shape today are, frankly, bullshit.
                    ... Dr. Wood, could you tell us how many (companions) will survive?
                    Dr. WOOD: That would depend, sir, on where the explosion occurred and the overall yield of the explosion. The satellites would be quickly disabled by the gamma radiation, the so-called electromagnetic pulse, generated by the system, and other satellites, which were not necessarily in view at the time of the explosion, would be disabled within hours or weeks by what is known as saturation of the Van Allen radiation belts surrounding the Earth by beta decay products of the fission products produced by the explosion.
                    1. 0
                      21 June 2025 22: 46
                      Really? Microchips in the 60s? Double check?
                      In your personal opinion, electronics was and is built only on microcircuits? Let's play? You find at least one microcircuit in the R-123 radio station, which is far from the 60s or even the 70s, and you drop it on my foot. If you don't find it, I drop this tube contraption on your foot.

                      The buried, unfortunate, shielded cable burned during testing, so-and-so. A prominence? Really?
                      In the 80s, a powerful solar flare knocked out the energy system in Canada. A prominence, though. Even Kuzkina's mother can't compare to it in terms of energy. You can double-check.

                      Water from neutrons? You are not in a submarine, but in a dugout, in a toilet, in a vehicle, and a neutron charge will catch you unexpectedly.
                      Remind me, how many meters is the free range of neutrons? And so that we don't embarrass ourselves next time, a neutron has no charge. It is a neutral particle, that's why it is even called that - a neutron.

                      All of this will definitely die from EMP
                      To do this, you need to be near the epicenter of the explosion. I'll try to explain it to you, since you skipped physics classes. The structure of our world is such that the energy of an electromagnetic pulse decreases in quadratic dependence on the distance. I'll translate from technical to layman's terms. If you are 100 meters from the epicenter of a nuclear weapon explosion, the energy of the EMP will decrease by 10 thousand times (but this will not save you for a completely different reason), if you are a kilometer from the epicenter, the energy of the EMP will drop by a million times (this will also be of little use to you), but if you are 10 km from the epicenter, the energy of the EMP will drop by 100 million times. And this is the case when you are in an open area in direct line of sight. If there are obstacles, the picture changes. Do you have the ability to bomb every 20 km with a nuclear weapon in a square-nest manner?
                      1. -1
                        21 June 2025 23: 05
                        Semiconductors die completely. Diodes and transistors. Rod lamps are the most stable. The Earth is protected by Van Allen belts, to a certain extent. These are giant formations around the Earth. And a thermonuclear explosion inside these structures and close (relatively) to the affected object and this, yes, is a small model of the Sun. EMP, just during high-altitude explosions, affects huge areas, comparable to the territory of the USA with one charge. But within a radius of 1500-2000 km they completely destroy electronics. Why do the elites of the West, having received a leap in progress during the development of electronics, advocate for limiting nuclear weapons? These types of progress are incompatible.
                      2. 0
                        22 June 2025 00: 42
                        1 So you won’t show the microcircuits in R-123?
                        2 Semiconductors do not die. Penetrating radiation destroys the potential barrier (the basis of the semiconductor pn junction). The radiation is gone and the barrier returns to its place. There is pure quantum mechanics there.
                        3 Lamps can be ordinary (diodes, triodes, tetrodes, pentodes) and special ones for the microwave range (klystrons, magnetrons, TWTs), there are no rod ones.
                        4 The Earth is protected by the atmosphere and magnetic field. The Van Allen belts, also known as radiation belts, are famous for having very high radiation (https://elementy.ru/nauchno-populyarnaya_biblioteka/434793/Radiatsionnye_poyasa_Zemli_otkrytie_i_pervye_issledovaniya)
                        5 Small model of the Sun is a Tokomak thermonuclear reactor
                        6 Last year there were more headline articles about EMP weapons, how they will burn all drones. It turned out that everything is easily treated with ordinary physics. Look at the Ostragradsky-Gauss theorem at your leisure.
                        7 There are solutions that do not react to EMI. There are no conductive elements on which electricity will be induced.
                      3. -1
                        22 June 2025 01: 19
                        Aren't you tired of arguing? Argue with the US Congress speakers, I'm just referring to them. I didn't invent this. There is a sharp voltage surge in the electronic circuit and a breakdown of the semiconductors. So, if a buried, shielded cable burns out, not to mention a lousy electronic circuit, what can you argue about at all. The model of processes on the Sun is the thermonuclear fusion of Helium from Hydrogen, which occurs when a thermonuclear charge is initiated, and even more so, the model of solar flares. And TOKAMAK is just an attempt to control thermonuclear fusion in a magnetic field. We don't really know what's inside the Sun, but gravity obviously matters, and the huge, even colossal, gravity that stars have.
                      4. -1
                        29 June 2025 20: 18
                        Aren't you tired of arguing? Argue with the US Congressional speakers, I only refer to them.
                        Tell this to those who were protected from drones by your electromagnetic pulse from the explosion of TNW in space. Give the addresses of cemeteries so that at the tombstones they can tell about what a powerful explosion of TNW in space and that all drones are immediately screwed?

                        There is a sharp voltage surge in the electronic circuit and breakdown of the semiconductors
                        Learn physics.

                        The Sun is a thermonuclear fusion of Helium from Hydrogen, which occurs during the initiation of a thermonuclear charge and, moreover, a model of solar flares.
                        What exactly did they want to say by this? The sun was turned on by the explosion of a nuclear weapon?
                      5. -1
                        29 June 2025 20: 43
                        Once again, I quoted the report of US scientists to Congress. Are you going to teach them physics? If you don't understand it yourself, why are you trying to judge? Listen to the professors, not to your own backwardness.
                        Quote from barbos
                        What exactly did they want to say by this? The sun was turned on by the explosion of a nuclear weapon?

                        I wanted to say that you don't understand the topic at all and continue to talk nonsense. TOKAMAK does not have the main indicator for the existence of stars - gigantic gravity. Do you know what gravity is? TNW is the abbreviation for tactical nuclear weapons adopted in Russia. And yes, a thermonuclear explosion of a device created by people, processes on the Sun and the explosion of a supernova are certainly similar events, but of different scales. I've heard of a supernova.
                        Quote from barbos
                        There is a sharp voltage surge in the electronic circuit and breakdown of the semiconductors
                        Learn physics.

                        You take an article
                        https://tr-page.yandex.ru/translate?lang=en-ru&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FNuclear_electromagnetic_pulse
                        And you read
                        A nuclear electromagnetic pulse (NEP or NEMP) is a burst of electromagnetic radiation caused by a nuclear explosion. The resulting rapidly changing electric and magnetic fields can interact with electrical and electronic systems, causing destructive currents and voltage surges.
                        A geomagnetic storm-like E3 pulse from Test 184 caused power surge in a long underground power line, which led to a fire at a power plant in the city of Karaganda.

                        You can argue with the Wikipedia editors, but they have links to the data. If you want, they are available.
                        In short, don't write to me anymore. I'm just wasting my time with you. And study physics yourself before you advise others.
                      6. -1
                        29 June 2025 20: 58
                        Once again, I quoted the report of US scientists to Congress.
                        Tell them about it on the front end, which is covered with optics like a web. Tell them about the uselessness of drones and about the congressional report.

                        Do you know what gravity is?
                        According to RT (theory of relativity) or QM (quantum mechanics)?

                        A geomagnetic storm-like E3 pulse from Test 184 caused a power surge in a long underground power line
                        How long do you think the conductors are in modern microcircuits? How many meters do you think the conductor length is between elements in a modern microcircuit made according to 15 nm technology standards? Can you calculate how many volts will be induced in a conductor 100 nm (nanometers) long?
                      7. -1
                        29 June 2025 21: 00
                        I haven't read it, sorry. Good luck.
                      8. -1
                        29 June 2025 21: 08
                        I haven't read it, sorry. Good luck.
                        Nothing new, though. Stay healthy!
                      9. 0
                        24 August 2025 14: 23
                        Semiconductors die completely

                        I was told about radiation tests of one converter. It failed because the fluoroplastic insulation fell off the wires. When the wires were separated so that they wouldn't short-circuit, it worked in the best possible way. Germanium is very afraid of radiation, silicon is not.
                      10. 0
                        15 September 2025 01: 13
                        The breakdown occurs due to a voltage surge, here silicon or germanium, they are the death of the circuit. In space, radiation is very high and electronics are subject to increased requirements, and you always see protection in the form of gold foil. But if the device gets hit by a pulse of solar origin, then it is finished. The study of deep space is mainly further from the Sun, Mars is one and a half times further than Earth, Ceres in the asteroid belt is almost three times further, and Jupiter is five times further, etc. But there it is cold and the atmosphere does not warm up well on Mars. The study of Venus and especially Mercury is problematic due to the influence of the Sun. Venus is 0,7 Earth distances, and Mercury is on average 0,4. That is, the Earth is too close and only its magnetosphere with radiation belts protects people. Let's say that an electronic civilization is thanks to this, but only within a century. Although the brain and nervous system work on microcurrents, this bioelectronics is resistant to EMP to a certain extent. And thermonuclear weapons are just a tiny solar model, but outside the planetary defense. Why does the world's Backstage dislike nuclear weapons so much, because the NMP became possible thanks to digital, global systems, but they are EMP-unstable.
            5. -1
              14 June 2025 23: 50
              There will be no drones during a nuclear conflict. And a nuclear conflict is inevitable.
              What exactly do you think would prevent drones from being used in a nuclear conflict? What kind of factors could these be? If you are sure that drone electronics will fail at the slightest increase in radiation levels, I have to disappoint you. It is not yet known who will switch off first: the drone operator from radiation sickness, or the drone electronics, which can be easily wrapped in leaded cardboard or copper foil. Most drones have a small processor, you won’t need much.
        2. -3
          29 May 2025 01: 03
          I still think that you should be the one to be put in the BTR-50 and sent into the attack. So that you can test all the "conveniences" of this steel tracked semi-submarine on your own skin.
          1. +4
            29 May 2025 05: 02
            Me for sure! I've already fought in the BMP-2. Only I write that it is a means of landing and forming water obstacles. This BT-3F or BTR-50 is not needed for anything more. And today a drone leaves a pile of iron even from an Abrams. There are no invincible machines.
            1. -2
              29 May 2025 05: 16
              Quote: fiberboard
              And today a drone leaves a pile of iron even from an Abrams. There are no invincible machines.

              The question is not whether the vehicle is invulnerable, but whether 27 people will leave it or not.
            2. +2
              29 May 2025 08: 40
              Me for sure!


              I got it that you like to suffer a little. :) The BTR-50 is an inconvenient machine for a person. It is extremely inconvenient to get into it. It is extremely inconvenient to get out of it. It is difficult and inconvenient to transport cargo on it. At the very least, it needs to be moored, since there are no sides. Plus, the cargo will interfere with the already inconvenient dismounting. If you only need the dismounting and dismounting of marines, and nothing more, then screw wheels to the boat and be done with it.
      2. +6
        28 May 2025 13: 01
        Here, the "experienced" forget that each type of armored vehicle is needed for its own tasks.

        It is, of course, great that we are so successful in solving infrequently occurring problems, but what about the most common, widespread problems? Is anyone going to solve them? Maybe then we should start actively developing and publicly discussing the design of medals for the capture of Slavyansk and Kramatorsk and orders for the storming of Kyiv and Lvov? Well, what, the country is rich to deal with non-urgent issues! fool
      3. -2
        28 May 2025 20: 57
        Why shouldn't this APC be included in motorized rifle units? Besides everything else, it is also a tracked tractor. In the absence of serial production of the MTLB, it is quite suitable for its partial replacement.
        1. -1
          29 May 2025 03: 55
          MuromThe diesel locomotive is now "capital"
          motorized vehicles (MTLBu) from storage bases
          even to a better state than
          they were at the time of their
          release from the S.S.R. era :-)))
      4. -1
        2 June 2025 14: 51
        Quote: Alekseev
        So, you can also make claims against a buggy or a motorcycle for why they are poorly protected.

        Wow, Ivanovich! And the guys didn't know... Are you serious about all this?! Amazing. So the intelligence and saboteurs urgently needed a mass grave?! Because no, NO preparation will save those who were found in this thing and fired at with something heavy. Even if they fired a grenade launcher, the Javelin is completely finished without any options. And even if they only shoot with machine guns, what future does the exposed intelligence have?
        And motorcycles, mind you, allow you to quickly dismount. They give a person a serious chance to take cover in the area, to show preparation. And not to sit like sprats in a can, waiting to be baked, having only prayer as a means of counteraction. So motorcycles are fundamentally better protected than this crap...
    4. + 13
      28 May 2025 11: 38
      Quote: fiberboard
      The idea itself is not new and not bad, but there is the BTR-50, maybe it is worth modernizing it? The BTR-50 is made on the basis of the PT-76, and the armament should be more powerful than the BT-3F, and the landing force is 20 people.

      He-he-he... so the BT-3F is, in a way, a reincarnation of the BTR-50: an amphibious APC based on an infantry fighting vehicle, which was based on a light amphibious tank.
      Quote: fiberboard
      Special vehicles are needed, of course, to overcome water obstacles, but not in large quantities.

      Initially, the BT-3F is a niche vehicle for the Navy. For the army, it can be useful primarily as a tracked lightly armored chassis with a large internal volume. Chassis for mortars and ATGMs, command and control vehicles, communications, medevacs, etc.
      1. 0
        28 May 2025 16: 00
        It seems that the mortar module did not work out. The 2B27B combat module from the Drok self-propelled artillery unit in 82 mm caliber has vertical guidance angles of 45-85 degrees. That is, without the ability to fire direct fire. And, most likely, it has no chance of being used as a launcher for small-sized missiles through the barrel. In my humble opinion, this is a design failure.
        There are already ready-made advanced models for 120 mm in the form of SAO Lotus, Phlox and Gorets.
        1. The comment was deleted.
          1. -1
            1 June 2025 22: 38
            I wonder who gave you upvotes for an obviously stupid comment?
      2. -2
        29 May 2025 04: 07
        Medical evacuees without a full-fledged
        rear entrance/exit?!
        Tanunakh... Who needs such "happiness"??? :-(((
        It is impossible to get a normal universal one
        lightly armored amphibious chassis
        TANK without its preliminary complete
        re-arrangement!!!!!
    5. 0
      29 May 2025 00: 58
      God, how you all hate Russian soldiers. The BTR-50 is an even bigger scumbag than the BT-3F. At least they made the mixing more convenient in this aluminum tracked boat. Have you ever seen people jumping on the BTR-50 to get in or out of it? It's a natural climbing wall. Whoever made it clearly had problems with his head and signs of sadism towards the military.
      1. -1
        29 May 2025 04: 57
        And in this lightly armored and poorly armed wonder waffe there will be no "mixing" when it arrives there? It is only a landing craft, for landing or formation. It is not good for anything more. And what does hatred for Russian soldiers have to do with it, if I myself was a Russian soldier for twenty years? Can you suggest something different and sensible, then everyone present here is only for it!
        1. -1
          29 May 2025 08: 32
          And what does hatred towards Russian soldiers have to do with it, if I myself was a Russian soldier for twenty years?


          Even though you are a sadomasochist, because you like the BTR-50 and for some reason you decided that normal people like jumping around a 1.5 meter high steel climbing wall in bulletproof vests.
          There are two options. Either make a normal dessert vehicle for people with a ramp. Or leave the wretchedness in the form of the BTR-3F. And let the BTR-50 stand in a museum and amaze with its design cretinism.
          1. -1
            29 May 2025 09: 39
            Quote: cast iron
            make a normal dessert machine

            What, excuse me, should I do? belay
            1. 0
              29 May 2025 10: 16
              What, excuse me, should I do?


              Dessert machine :) The phone thinks it's smarter than a human and inserts words as it sees fit. The word "landing" for marines was meant.
              1. -1
                10 June 2025 03: 34
                Dessert is translated from a foreign language as "beach". That is, it means a car in which you can drive out of the water onto the beach and eat desserts with dessert spoons.
          2. -1
            29 May 2025 12: 13
            Well, you design a normal "dessert" car for people with a ramp.
  2. +8
    28 May 2025 04: 24
    All these doubts are due to lack of spirituality and forgetting of values.

    Regarding the SUBJECT - ok, they left the BMP3 chassis. Ok, let it float, parachute and fly.
    The level of protection should already be higher than that of the BMP2.
    Well, what's stopping them from making a normal ramp for the landing force? The hull has to be redesigned anyway? And why not move the tanks out of the habitable space?
    1. + 10
      28 May 2025 06: 02
      Quote: Wildcat
      Ok, let it float,

      The recipe for the newest armored personnel carrier from Rostec is to take cardboard aluminum armor, put fuel tanks in the front, cram people in tightly behind them without a partition, make doors in the roof and above the engine so that it is impossible to quickly climb out and drag in a wounded person – done!
      The BT-3F will cruise between the islands on the Dnieper, shooting at the bastards with its standard weapons, and the Banderites will hide in the coastal vegetation and howl helplessly. A joke. A sad joke. They will launch FPV drones and then post them on Telegram with mocking comments. Very low anti-mine protection, inconvenient landing/disembarkation of troops due to the location of the engine, and already quite weak armor.
      1. +5
        28 May 2025 08: 27
        I didn't even want to butt into the comments, but... okay, the author refers to comments in the media that have no relation or competence to the topic. Second, usually military equipment is ordered with specific requirements. WHAT THE DESIGNERS CREATED. AND THERE SHOULD BE NO CLAIMS ABOUT THEM, WHAT YOU ORDERED IS WHAT YOU GET. And finally, third, in the modern world where kickbacks and lobbying rule, you can get even more amazing things. I wouldn't be surprised if we can soon discuss toilet paper specially designed for submarines and buy it at Pyaterochka.
        1. + 13
          28 May 2025 10: 53
          What you wrote is happening, but exactly the opposite. First, Rostec "gives birth" to this "miracle-yudo" and then begins to push it through the relevant structures of the Ministry of Defense, with the goal of accepting it into service.
          1. 0
            28 May 2025 14: 40
            Quote: Pioneer1984
            What you wrote is happening, but exactly the opposite. First, Rostec "gives birth" to this "miracle-yudo" and then begins to push it through the relevant structures of the Ministry of Defense, with the goal of accepting it into service.

            Well, I won't argue here, although to give birth to something like that you also need to feel like Napoleon and have a specific piston in your ass to push, well, for example, in the Duma you need to buy a third part
        2. 0
          29 May 2025 03: 19
          Quote: NIKNN
          Secondly, military equipment is usually ordered with specific requirements. WHICH IS WHAT THE DESIGNERS CREATED. AND THERE SHOULD NOT BE ANY CLAIMS AGAINST THEM.

          It is unlikely that these requirements are at the request of the frontline fighters. And what does it mean "created"? This tractor has been without any changes since the 80s, like all the armored vehicles of the Russian Federation for the last 30 years. No one is trying to create anything, it costs money, and they do what they can, calling it "new developments".
      2. -1
        29 May 2025 08: 42
        You can always say that the frontal location of the fuel tanks increases the armor protection of the front several times :)
        1. 0
          29 May 2025 16: 14
          What do you mean by the frontal armour? Yes, fuel for the cumulative jet can be regarded as protection for the crew, but what can you say if you are, for example, a platoon commander (this is how the use of the BMP was calculated. The sons of the battalion commanders who were burning in this fire were burning in this fire. And don't believe the fairy tales because the fuel tanks were in the doors, many guys died and that's why they were removed from the end. And not quite. When we learn to love ourselves, then perhaps the conversation will be different.
          1. 0
            29 May 2025 22: 47
            Yes, fuel for the cumulative jet can be considered as protection for the crew.


            Well, if you consider the detonation of fuel from the cumulative charge as protection for the crew.... Well, then there are no questions for you at all. Yes.

            And don't believe the fairy tales because the fuel tanks were in the windows and many boys died.


            The BMP-2 has the main tank in the middle of the troop compartment... what a great idea! The troops sit on the fuel tank, and their doors are filled with diesel fuel. Reliable as a Swiss watch! There is a much better arrangement of the tanks. Like the M113 - at the rear on the sides of the ramp as an extension of the sides.
            1. 0
              29 May 2025 23: 53
              Well, if you consider the detonation of fuel from the cumulative charge as protection
              And hello to you too. The fuel tank in the BMP is considered protection against the cumulative jet
              and the wider the barrier, the better the APFSDS will pierce through the BMP and even penetrate two more BMPs
              1. 0
                29 May 2025 23: 57
                And the fuel in the tanks does not ignite, it needs access to oxygen. Yes, the BMPs are burning, but it’s 50/50 and yes, there are casualties.
            2. -1
              10 June 2025 03: 50
              If the exit is at the back, then it is logical to place the tanks at the front. Diesel fuel cannot detonate. Even a diesel-air mixture has a hard time contributing to the behind-the-armor effect [of an armor-piercing solid projectile with explosives, but cumulative jets do not belong to them].
              The BMP-2 has its main tank in the middle of the troop compartment...

              The BMP-1 is identical. There, as a sofa back, there is a fuel tank made of thick (well, 3 mm) aluminum. And closer to the exit, there are a couple of heavy lead-acid batteries. And in the T-34, the fuel tanks are smeared in a thin layer along the sides (and it is not considered patriotic to be outraged by this).
              1. -1
                10 June 2025 08: 33
                If the exit is at the back, then it is logical to place the tanks in the front.


                Statistics from past wars show that the forehead is hit most often. And if there are tanks, they will explode more often. In my opinion, the tanks are best made in the M113. Or place them in the floor.
                1. -1
                  11 June 2025 05: 13
                  There is no explosive in the fuel tanks, there is nothing to explode (only burn). Or the incoming ammunition is so powerful that it will tear apart not only the tank, but the entire armored vehicle. In the correct layouts, they try to place the tanks in places protected by the thickest armor.
                  1. -1
                    11 June 2025 08: 56
                    There is no explosive in the fuel tanks, there is nothing to explode (only burn).


                    The HEAT shell hits the BMP-3 from the front, pierces the armor and the fuel tank, initiating combustion. Burning diesel fuel spills over the driver, two machine gunners, and the floor. Everyone is burning. Everyone is having fun. Fantastic machine! We must take it!
                    1. -1
                      14 June 2025 01: 02
                      The burning diesel fuel will fly in the same direction as the pieces of metal from the walls of the fuel tank and the tail section of the cumulative jet. The probability of death from fire is low.
      3. P
        -1
        30 May 2025 00: 10
        The rear engine layout, as far as I remember, is needed for weight distribution because of the turret. The turret is gone, but the engine will remain where it was. Because a new car is expensive, takes a long time and there are no guarantees of return on investment
        1. -1
          31 May 2025 12: 44
          Is it because of the turret? And in the BTR-60/70/80, because of the under-turret? And in the BMP-1/2, why didn't the turret prevent the engine from being installed in the front?
          1. -1
            10 June 2025 03: 53
            Because they balanced the batteries and fuel in the rear doors and the back of the sofa.
        2. -1
          10 June 2025 09: 01
          The rear placement of the internal combustion engine is solely due to the fact that some idiot came up with the idea of ​​turning an experimental floating tank into an infantry fighting vehicle...
      4. 0
        24 August 2025 14: 32
        we put fuel tanks in front, and behind them, without a partition, we pack people tightly

        Back in 1998 I saw an experimental BMP-3 with a soft fuel tank in an isolated armored compartment.
        Why it didn't work is not a question for the designers.
  3. +2
    28 May 2025 04: 34
    Military design thinking continues to focus on options for overcoming water obstacles and landing.

    The most unpleasant thing is that even with the ability to swim, it is possible to provide decent protection and ergonomics. I see the unpleasant thing in the fact that those who set the task and the performance characteristics for designing this little box do not know this...

    And a vehicle for airborne landing is needed. However, if there is a choice of either or, and not both, I will choose a protected vehicle.
    1. +7
      28 May 2025 21: 24
      The stubborn desire to have an infantry fighting vehicle (BMD) for airborne landings is simply astounding. Is it really that hard to understand that with the development of air defense, and especially MANPADS, the time for mass landings has passed, just as the time for combat elephants, chariots, and other similar models has passed... The results and experience of the Air Defense Forces clearly indicate this. No, they continue to invent and pull out of their fingers unrealistic hypothetical tasks and situations for airborne equipment
      1. +1
        29 May 2025 03: 06
        Quote from: spyder100
        The stubborn desire to have an infantry fighting vehicle (BMD) for airborne landings is simply astounding. Is it really that hard to understand that with the development of air defense, and especially MANPADS, the time for mass landings is gone, just like the time for combat elephants, chariots, and other similar models.

        It amazes people who are not aware of the urgent need to transfer reserves.

        Quote from: spyder100
        The results and experience of the SVO clearly indicate this. No, they continue to invent and suck out of their fingers unrealistic hypothetical tasks and situations for airborne equipment
        This was especially noticeable when they frantically stuffed the “heavily protected” BMP-26-1 into the Mi-2 in order to plug the front that had collapsed in 22.

        Urgent transfer of troops to YOUR rear in a THREATENED direction may be needed at any moment. There may be no airfields nearby, and if there are, they may be under attack. Unloading by parachute is MUCH faster than landing. The landing force NEEDS equipment, and any armor is better than none.
        The simplest things, if you don’t imagine that troops are only landed in the rear of a strong enemy.
        1. P
          -2
          30 May 2025 00: 15
          And how many times has this worked in reality? What if the threat of a breakthrough in the future increases precisely because the existing technology is not capable of fighting the enemy at the required level now?
          1. 0
            30 May 2025 03: 28
            Quote: Pandemic
            And how many times has this worked in reality? What if the threat of a breakthrough in the future increases precisely because the existing technology is not capable of fighting the enemy at the required level now?


            In 22 there were plenty of tanks, and nothing had been heard about FPV drones yet, but the collapse happened.
            Well, it's obvious that loaves of bread and pickups are better than armored cars... No, armor protects the crew better than tin and glass, with or without barbecues.



            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            This was especially noticeable when they frantically stuffed the “heavily protected” BMP-26-1 into the Mi-2 in order to plug the front that had collapsed in 22.
        2. -1
          31 May 2025 06: 35
          Where, when and how many times in combat conditions did paratroopers land in modern conflicts? And yes, the mentioned equipment with Mi-26 was landed by the landing method, by the way, if you do not see the difference between air-transportable and air-droppable equipment.
          1. 0
            1 June 2025 16: 45
            Quote from: spyder100
            Where, when and how many times have paratroopers landed in combat conditions in modern conflicts?

            Modern, how modern is that?
            https://dargot.livejournal.com/377247.html

            Quote from: spyder100
            And yes, the mentioned equipment from the Mi-26 was landed using the landing method, by the way, if you don’t see the difference between air-transportable and air-droppable equipment.
            And to what distance did they transfer? And how many pieces and in what time did they transfer? Considering that there are about a hundred Mi for ALL of Russia and the range with maximum load is less than 500 km.
            And how much does the Mi-26 unload, considering that it is a very big target for the OTRK?
            By the way, do you understand that airborne equipment is unloaded instantly, unlike air-transportable equipment?

            And yes, BMP-1-2-3 have some kind of super protection compared to BMD-1-2-3-4?
    2. -1
      29 May 2025 03: 23
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      The most unpleasant thing is that even with the ability to swim, you can ensure decent protection and ergonomics.

      The only serious floating and well-protected APC in the world is the Singaporean Terrex 2. And it is clear from the vehicle that in order to provide buoyancy and decent armor, the vehicle requires an impressive volume.
      1. -1
        29 May 2025 04: 09
        Quote: karabas-barabas
        The only serious floating and well-protected armored personnel carrier in the world is the Singaporean Terrex 2.
        Apart from increased seaworthiness, there is nothing special about this APC. And seaworthiness can be increased by adding floats. However, such seaworthiness is not really needed for rivers.
        1. -2
          29 May 2025 16: 31
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          Apart from increased seaworthiness, there is nothing special about this armored personnel carrier.

          The highest protection of all floating armored vehicles. Singapore puts the level of protection of its armored vehicles in first place, if you look at individual examples, the BMP Hunter, or the Singaporean Leo2. And if you look at the Terrex, its volumes are still striking, most likely spaced composite armor, with good resistance to cumulative threats.
          1. -1
            30 May 2025 03: 24
            Quote: karabas-barabas
            The highest level of security of all floating BBT.

            No, the AAV-7 with the EAAK add-on protection kit provides at least no worse performance.
            https://doczz.net/doc/1815036/armor-shield-p?ysclid=mba24unqzo501244747

            Quote: karabas-barabas
            And if you look at Terrex, its volumes are still striking, most likely the spaced composite armor, with good resistance against cumulative threats.
            Nothing like that is written about Terex, but yes, floats can perform the function of spaced armor.
  4. +8
    28 May 2025 04: 47
    The BT-3F floating armored personnel carrier could have worked as having no analogues in the world 20 years ago. But today it is a "marriage at work". am
    1. +1
      28 May 2025 05: 27
      Absolutely right! For some reason it is not obvious to engineers and military acceptance
    2. +7
      28 May 2025 06: 48
      Quote: zxc15682
      But today is a "marriage at work"
      This is not a defect in work, this is capitalism, picked up from the garbage heap of history. Who is left in our design bureaus, what happened to the optimized industry? Nothing fundamentally new, it is not very possible to create under the bourgeoisie, we are going with Soviet developments, Soviet stash. Thank you, the Soviet margin of safety remained, the Soviet design school, and, the BT-3F is not a defect in work, but first of all a machine for our MP. The same "Bradley" was accepted into service in 1981, it is a machine of a different class, comparing it with the BT-3F, at the very least, is not correct.
      1. +7
        28 May 2025 07: 27
        Quote: Per se.
        Thank you, there is still a Soviet margin of safety left, soviet design school,

        Alas, there is nothing left of the Soviet design school! The old-timers have already died out naturally (or are no longer able to work), and the chicks of the Unified State Exam and fee-paying faculties have nothing to do with it. Those rare exceptions that are truly smart and talented, for some reason, are leaving for abroad. It's sad...
        1. +5
          28 May 2025 14: 03
          Quote: Good evil
          Those rare exceptions who are truly smart and talented, for some reason, end up abroad.

          Because their talented developments will find application there, will go into production, and they will have something to be proud of. Plus a decent standard of living. In our country, their developments will be shown at an exhibition at best. And a beggarly existence with wandering around rented apartments. This is the fate that the State of Effective Managers has prepared for them. And don't tell me about salaries of 300 thousand, they exist only in the fantasies of state propaganda, Rosstat and the fables of relevant ministers in the office of the Chief Liberal Manager on camera, intended for cattle (that's the only way they perceive us).
          1. -1
            28 May 2025 20: 31
            Quote: AlexSam
            Because their talented developments will find application there, will go into production, and they will have something to be proud of. Plus a decent standard of living.

            That's what I wrote about...
      2. P
        0
        30 May 2025 00: 16
        in the design bureau there are blind old women and students with waxed skis
    3. +4
      28 May 2025 13: 06
      So maybe the drawings were drawn in 1993, then someone found the folder, blew off the dust and the one that has no analogues in the world is ready
    4. +2
      28 May 2025 14: 19
      The BT-3F floating armored personnel carrier could have been considered unique in the world 20 years ago.
      Why 20 years ago? It is still the same, having no analogues in the world. Because no one in the world needs it.
  5. The comment was deleted.
  6. +5
    28 May 2025 05: 57
    The author gets only a plus, he is one of the few who admits that there are problems and is not embarrassed to voice it. I am just afraid that he will get into trouble for this. And they will also call him a cypsoshnik. I hope they don't remove the article as has already happened.
  7. -4
    28 May 2025 06: 14
    Where did this nonsense about the invulnerability of Bradley or the Swedish CV-90 come from? They burn like candles....
    There is a normal element of training military personnel - studying the vulnerable spots of tanks and other armored vehicles of the enemy.... where officers were engaged in training their soldiers - there the enemy tanks are burning, where everything was left to chance, as if the contract soldiers would figure it out themselves - there foreign models of armored vehicles are "difficult to destroy"...
    Oh well! To hell with us... Visually, it's a BTR-50! With a BMP-3 chassis...
    During the Soviet era, this BTR-50 was replaced in MP units by the BTR-60...
    Is this idiocy? But it seems like before entering a military college young people undergo a medical examination, it seems like complete idiots shouldn't be in the Army...
    So, it is still some kind of infection that is spreading in the military-industrial complex.... Only they call THIS - the development of funding, and nothing else....
    The height of "effective management" would be to take the concept of armored vehicles from the 50s, stick it on a chassis from the 80s, come up with a name in the 20s and pass it off as an innovation and a flight of engineering thought...
    And in anticipation of the upcoming expansion of MP units and formations, we might even adopt...
    THIS is how we will win...
    But the MP doesn’t have the required quantities of DK (either MDK or BDK)!
    First, we need to decide WHAT we need the MP for? And then - WHAT types of weapons will these soldiers and officers need...
    If we need the Marine Corps to fight in the Kursk region, they need tanks; if they need to cross the Dnieper, they need armored personnel carriers and infantry fighting vehicles; if they need to solve problems somewhere in the Kuril Islands, they need air-cushioned landing craft with such a speed and maneuvering capabilities that they will at least make it difficult to defeat them...
    Well, and IF our marines move for Okiyan))) - they need other "boats")))
    We need to stop this BESTIALITY! Another time is coming...
    1. + 11
      28 May 2025 10: 56
      It’s not about invulnerability, but about an order of magnitude greater survivability, in comparison with the domestic armored fighting vehicles you listed.
      1. 0
        30 May 2025 06: 06
        Okay, let's put it this way - IN WHAT is this notorious great vitality of yours expressed???
        I PERSONALLY had to be hit twice, as part of a crew, in a BRM-1K, by a hit by an AT mine and a Javelin...
        Shell-shocked, wounded, but we all remained alive and were able to retreat...
        None of the cars caught fire, the fire alarm went off (of course, THEN they were burned, but that was later...)
        Bradley, having run over TM-62, will continue moving?
        Bradley, hit by ATGM, will either Metis or Fagot retain the ability to fire?
        WHAT is Bradley's survivability???
        This vehicle is the same age as our BMP-2, so the BMP-XNUMX has its advantages...
        By the way, both the Dvoika and the BTR-82, which were hit by cluster munitions, also did not catch fire, and if the BTR was sent for repairs (transmission damage), then the Dvoika continued to fight, albeit without communications in the left troop compartment)))
        WHAT is the survivability???
        1. 0
          30 May 2025 12: 15
          Read what the enemy writes, and not those who are broadcasting in the marathon, but those who had the chance to fight in both the BMP-2 and the Bradley.
          1. 0
            30 May 2025 12: 39
            Listen)), I'm telling you what I experienced myself, you're asking me to read stupid stuff)))
            Is there any common sense in this?
            I didn't have the chance to burn either Bradley or the Swedes myself, I was THERE when they were burning)))
            And read...what?)))
            How did we beat the Russians at Kursk?))) but now we don't know how to defend ourselves at Sumy...)))
            Try to take a critical approach to your recommendations...)))
            1. -1
              30 May 2025 12: 49
              Judging by your post, you have problems with critical thinking. Although, observing how we conduct military operations, it becomes obvious that this is a systemic problem of our army and navy.
          2. -1
            30 May 2025 12: 53
            Here's what I can recommend to you...
            Deal with Troika and Bradley's armor.
            Understand the weight difference - 10 tons is not two kg...
            Find out the years of Bradley's design, the number of units produced, who adopted it for service)))
            AND FOR ME - the height of the Bradley is -3 m! This is CRITICALLY important when shooting from the RPG-7!
            A shot from a PG-7VR smashes Bradley into pieces!)))
            This is it - I tried it!))))
            1. -1
              30 May 2025 13: 05
              Why should I figure it out and their armor? I know that the 30 mm BMP-3 gun won't be able to hit the Bradley in the frontal projection, even with the BOPs, which it doesn't have. But the Bradley Bushmaster with its BOPs from 1000 m will penetrate the three in the frontal projection.
    2. +8
      28 May 2025 11: 43
      Quote: Koschei - from the Wilderness
      Visually, it's a BTR-50! With a BMP-3 chassis...

      And the BMP-3 is a former light amphibious tank. So the spiral of history has completed its turn - and we again got an APC based on an amphibious tank. smile
    3. -8
      28 May 2025 12: 00
      I agree. I'm tired of this worship of "made in not Russia"! What a role model Bradley has found for me! What a tin can, which is not at all difficult to hit with conventional weapons.
      And one more thing. All this is generated by the capitalist-managerial environment. And if the Supreme wants good and the future of Russia, it is necessary to finish all these joint-stock companies. And only state structures at 100%. And bring back the red directors. Then there will be sense. And the experience, and the SVO, and Syria, and the Caucasian wars will be taken into account. And embodied in metal.
      And an oligarch, whether private or state-owned, is still an enemy! And must be exterminated as a class.
    4. -8
      28 May 2025 16: 09
      Yes, it was the CIPSO that threw it in, and ours picked it up...
      The Bradley's body is the same aluminum as the BMP-3, even thinner...
      More advanced screens, including those made of ceramics, and a very modern and sophisticated automatic fire extinguishing system...
      And so the Abrams burn, of course the Bradleys will burn...
      And if you read the comments of the "experts", then the Abrams is crap that can be destroyed with a KPVT, and the Bradley is a super-survivable technology that nothing can take down and we need to copy it...
      Although any critically thinking person should understand that this cannot be, because it can never be... But the "experts" do not know how to do it correctly, that is why they write all sorts of nonsense...
      At the same time, we must be realistic and admit that modern weapons have significantly surpassed armor and increasing armor is a dead-end branch. What can be done:
      1. Transition to unmanned systems.
      2. The widespread use of electronic warfare systems on equipment, with the ability for electronic warfare specialists to set frequencies by choosing from the most reasonably possible set of frequencies.
      3. Use of all kinds of masking systems.
      4. Use of shelters for equipment in parking areas.
      5. Deployment of specially trained and equipped fighters to combat firewood on the march (2-3 fighters on the roof with shotguns and anti-drone guns).
      6. Use effective tactical techniques (drive different routes, drive at dusk when drones are least effective, etc.).
      7. Allocation of forces and resources at all levels, from the company to the strategic level, for the targeted fight against enemy UAV crews. (Naturally, at the strategic level, they will not destroy the FVP operators, but factories, concentration sites, and pilots of large birds).
      8. Development and implementation in the troops of other means of combating drones (microwave, laser, perhaps they will come up with something else).
      But it’s not interesting to write about this - they might ask some question to which the “experts” don’t know the answer.
      That's why they write, let's copy the Bradley BMP...
      And given that reverse engineering alone will take several years, and production will start when all the Bradleys are handed over to the museum...
      And we need to produce the equipment that a plant can produce in large quantities today. Because it is not the wonder weapon that wins that does not exist, but the army that has a standard supply of weapons and equipment...
      And that is why they took the SVT out of production (which was very advanced, the FN Fal, which is still in service today, is nothing more than an SVT, redesigned to accept a magazine and NATO cartridge, and the rest is tuning) and put the 50-year-old Mosin into production, took the ZIS-41 out of production in 2, and so on and so forth...
      1. P
        -1
        30 May 2025 00: 23
        1 the body kit is there and the chassis doesn't fly out and buzz in place without moving 2 the ramp 3 boarding in a single-volume troop compartment where you CAN stuff a wounded person 4 the troop doesn't have to try to kill the crew in advance for jammed hinges and locks and there is no need to allocate a separate fighter trained in Shaolin so that he can open and close the doors
      2. 0
        24 August 2025 15: 44
        5. Deployment of specially trained and equipped fighters to combat firewood on the march (2-3 fighters on the roof with shotguns and anti-drone guns).

        A human being cannot cope with this task. Only automation.
    5. P
      -1
      30 May 2025 00: 19
      from comparing the number of carrots needed to stop/ignite specific samples. Comparison on good samples is very much not in favor of the BMP series (1-2 are very bad, 3 are better)
  8. -6
    28 May 2025 06: 22
    The M2 Bradley, for example, demonstrates high resistance to external influences,

    Is everything so wonderful with this "Bradley"? Who is promoting this device, which even the Americans themselves used to ridicule? Why compare the BMP and the APC, created for different tasks, with different combat weights?
    If we talk about an unknown animal, so that it was impossible not to remember about the development in the USA of the same expeditionary, floating IFV, or the old workhorse for their Marines, the AAV-7... They pecked and pecked at the "uselessness" of the Airborne Forces, now it has come to the equipment of our Marines. The BT-3F was created primarily for landing, it is adapted for swimming in conditions of fluctuations in the water surface up to three points. The machine can leave the landing ships at a distance of 40-60 km from the shore and any combat module suitable in weight can be installed on it. In the photo, the American ones, "neither a mouse nor a frog." Anything not compared with them would be closer to the topic.
    1. +8
      28 May 2025 06: 53
      After all, capitalists can make a ramp!!! am
    2. Ray
      + 10
      28 May 2025 08: 00
      These American "neither mouse nor frog" were developed in peacetime. In the "pre-Drone" age, when combat vehicles were hit from the front or in profile. And this shows that the Americans had vehicles for all tasks. Including Bradley for land warfare.
      And this Bradley is being promoted primarily by those who have seen and encountered this Bradley in real life. From my region, from each village, 7-8 people are fighting in the SVO, many have already won their own ((( so I have already heard about Bradley, and not from the media. This is a real combat vehicle, many times more resistant to threats from above than our infantry fighting vehicles.
      As for this miracle-monster, the hero of the story, this invention was invented in the 4th year of the war, as the author of the article correctly pointed out, when humanity already knows that combat vehicles are mainly destroyed from above by drones or even javelins. And large areas are remotely mined by throwing mines from MLRS in a short time, creating threats from below as well. And to develop an IFV completely ignoring these facts, well, I don’t know what to call it.
      1. +8
        28 May 2025 09: 30
        Quote from Ray
        As for this miracle-monster, the hero of the plot, this invention was invented in the 4th year of the war.
        This "miracle-yudo" was primarily intended for the Marines, for landing operations, and not for the SVO. By the way, the fourth year of the SVO is a "merit" of a different kind, and our BMP-3 or the same BT-3F are not to blame for this. Our men are being laid down in frontal assaults, with absurd self-restraint and simultaneous trading with the enemy. Here, even the "Maus" will not help, if someone would feel calmer in such a mastodon. Both "Bradleys" and "Abrams" burn, there is no indestructible equipment, and any unit can become a "mass grave", especially clumsy and large ones. The fact that the LBS is dominated by drones, positional dead ends, this is also due to "wise" tactics and political will. When there are dozens of operators for one tank, zeroed in on areas and established places, that's one thing, when there are hundreds of tanks for one operator in a breakthrough or envelopment, that will be a completely different war, but for this, the SVO must become a war, and not an operation in which masochists send in frontal attacks, without envelopments and breakthroughs, with a limited contingent.
        So think about what the priorities should be when creating new divisions, new equipment, the very nature of combat operations. And, don't retell the nonsense about the miraculous "Bradley", fakes have been produced more than once, an outright provocation. If men in iron-clad "loaves" almost go on the attack, this is again not the fault of the BMP-3 or the BT-3F created for the Marines. All questions to our capitalism, and to those who have everything in the West and with the West, who let go of the thugs from the "Azov" and the same Kherson surrendered.
        1. +3
          28 May 2025 11: 37
          Quote: Per se.
          BMP-3 or the same BT-3F, are not to blame for this

          The problem is also that our army does not have a sufficiently protected vehicle that could withstand several drone hits, a mine, but save the lives of the landing force when delivering assault forces to positions.

          Quote: Per se.
          when there are a hundred tanks per operator in a breakthrough or envelopment

          This is impossible. Drones cost pennies, they are made in garages en masse. And whole regiments of operators are already being trained. The future is precisely drone wars.

          Quote: Per se.
          BMP-3 or BT-3F created for marines. All questions to our capitalism

          These are more questions for military planning. The prospects of drones have been known for a long time. And here either increase the protection like Bradley and above, or increase mobility (buggy, motorcycles, etc.), and in the BT-3F neither one nor the other sad
          1. +3
            28 May 2025 12: 29
            Quote: Netl
            The problem is also that our army does not have a sufficiently protected vehicle that could withstand several drone hits, a mine, but save the lives of the landing force when delivering assault forces to positions.

            Are you saying that the Bradley is exactly that kind of vehicle? But, the article is about a watercraft for the Marines, we are not presenting the American AAV-7 in the NVO?
            The impossibility of a tank breakthrough bypassing all the "drone carriers" that will remain in their familiar dugouts? Unfortunately, under the current situation, this is indeed impossible.
            That there are questions about military planning, yes, and not only that, the Banderites prepared for war with Russia for eight years, but what did our generals and politicians do? Here is a comment on the topic of the SVO. Why do we need divisions and armies?
            "What are generals and the General Staff for if the actions of small assault groups are at the head and in three years of the Central Military District there has not been a single military operation at the level of a combined arms army.
            Instead of including UAV companies in the organizational structure of all regiments and brigades, the Lompassniks are creating unmanned troops with an unclear structure and even more unclear interaction with units located on the LBS...
            We are repeating the mistakes of 22 when, in order to receive artillery support, it was necessary to get approval from almost the army commander, and after a few hours or days, the artillery was plowing up empty "squares", mercilessly spending ammunition.
            " (assault
            (Dmitry Kurochkin)).
            Therefore, I repeat, the issue here is not the BT-3F, a machine created for other tasks. Here is where the same "Kurganets-25" is, and how it would have shown itself in the SVO, another topic, again to our leadership, how and for what they were preparing for 8 years, recognizing the Bandera government, but not recognizing Donbass...
            1. +4
              28 May 2025 14: 12
              Quote: Per se.
              Are you saying that the Bradley is exactly that kind of machine? But, the article is about a water beetle for the Marines,

              You yourself wrote about the BMP-3, I quoted it without changes. And the Bradley, of course, has a lot of shortcomings, but it is still better protected. And without a doubt, our designers could have made even better protection, if not for the strange, hopelessly outdated requirement for buoyancy for the BMP.

              There are also huge questions about the feasibility of a floating armored personnel carrier for the Marines. It does not provide speed, protection, or stealth. The same drones fly over water just as well. sad

              Quote: Per se.
              Why do we need divisions and armies?

              For better interaction between troops within units.
              Your criticism is largely fair. But here one can ask the question, wouldn't the interaction be even more complicated if there were no structure of the said units. Even the Ukrainian Nazis, having had their fill of brigade-level amateurism, are moving on to a corps structure. sad

              Quote: Per se.
              create unmanned troops with an unclear structure

              It is not so obvious here. Because now, in order to simply strike with an FPV drone, a whole working system is needed: reconnaissance, a repeater, a strike, confirmation (possibly its own electronic warfare and reconnaissance) and support for all of this. And the number and nomenclature of unmanned systems is constantly growing, which is why separate units are being created. request

              Quote: Per se.
              how and what they prepared for over 8 years, recognizing the Bandera government

              We hoped to come to an agreement. Yes Even the SVO was planned not as a real military operation, but as a measure to ensure the success of the Istanbul negotiations. request
              1. -1
                30 May 2025 02: 15
                They hoped to reach an agreement. Yes Even the SVO was planned not as a real military operation, but as a measure to ensure the success of the Istanbul negotiations. request
                It's hard to negotiate when the enemy probably sees money from the state defense order coming into foreign accounts, sees that hangars for airplanes are not being built, sees how the children of important people, including those from the Ministry of Defense, hang out in Florida and Nice. We are the only ones who are not told anything, or maybe the Pentagon received reports from some Krivoruchko or Zolotov about the real state of our army and security forces, and maybe even with the execution of orders - they fired a hundred smart commanders, promoted two hundred kleptomaniacs and tyrants.
      2. -2
        28 May 2025 15: 50
        Ray (Rinat), I have heard about Bradley, and not from the media. It is a real combat vehicle, many times more resistant to threats from above than our infantry fighting vehicles.
        Rinat, what with what compare? 15-19 ton vehicle and 30-33 ton vehicle? do you understand the difference? what does it consist of? Where did it come from and why?
        1. Ray
          -1
          29 May 2025 12: 12
          That's the point, the front today requires these 30-ton machines, not products for the Marine Corps, which are far removed from the modern realities of war.
      3. -4
        28 May 2025 16: 25
        Are you the daughter of an officer from the village?
        Javelins have damaged much less vehicles than Korzhts, Stugns, Faggots and other classic anti-tank missiles. Conventional RPGs from different countries have destroyed more vehicles than Javelins.
        The drone practically does not attack from above - it hits the weak part, trying first of all in the engine compartment. In tanks it can also be in the turret ring, in vehicles in the driver's seat...
        1. Ray
          -2
          29 May 2025 11: 54
          Let's not insult, "lieutenant". Do you have many relatives at the front?
        2. Ray
          -2
          29 May 2025 12: 11
          And if we are on topic, then why does the Marine Corps need this BM today? In the SVO, the Marine Corps is used in some other way, rather than strictly on the land-based bridgehead as regular motorized riflemen?
          Are there plans to storm Odessa from the sea? These machines can't even cross the Dnieper in modern conditions, not to mention using them in the Black Sea given the current state of the Black Sea Fleet, because firstly, they still have to get to the Dnieper (except for the area near Kherson), and secondly, drones will also be flying there from the air, to which this BM-ZF, or whatever this miracle Yudo is called, is very likely vulnerable. What do you think about this, father-in-law Shoigu?
  9. +6
    28 May 2025 06: 40
    This car has been known for a long time. What are you surprised about?
    The concept has changed, yes. But in our heads there is still chaos.
  10. + 14
    28 May 2025 06: 45
    For three years now I have a strong feeling that the best thing in the country is military parades...
  11. +1
    28 May 2025 07: 15
    All this fuss comes from desperation.
    There are no clear technical requirements, no competition (I'm not talking about the competition of who will bring more money to the right places), there is no competition in the end. It's like our auto industry, a private plant produces the same products for decades, does not lift a finger to localize production, but at the same time demands subsidies for its miserable quality.
    Only in the military industry it is even worse, in fact they may not modernize at all, they will buy anyway.
    As they say, you can do something even without doing something.
    If I were the Minister of Defense, I would take a closer look at the Belarusian volat; if I were to pay money, then at least for relatively modern technology, and not for the cyberpunk that the military industry offers us.
  12. +2
    28 May 2025 07: 40
    Add.
    I would just like to see the technical specifications for this miracle and who compiled them.
    The corporation that owns the plant doesn't care about the soldiers who fight there.
    Profit at any cost.
    The only way to fix the situation is to have a development contract with strict requirements for both parties. And the fear of criminal liability.
    1. +1
      28 May 2025 08: 00
      It's like in our production. An order comes from above that a "kaising" is needed for the shop. The engineering and technical workers convey this idea to the workers that a "kaising" is needed. And the workers do the same thing, but "through the ass with a tambourine", and then the project is drawn up and safety technology is invented. (Something like that, well, you get the idea.) wassat The bosses get bonuses, the workers get double for working on weekends. Photo reports and awards are made.
  13. +4
    28 May 2025 07: 54
    as has already been written - let's figure out what it is needed for? If the task is to create a SEA-FORCEABLE landing vehicle, then in principle it is not implied that it will take someone out of the battlefield, that it will drive through minefields. Its main task is to travel on the water surface (hello, ensuring buoyancy due to the mass and tightness of the hull) for some kilometers, drive onto the shore and travel as much as it can, land people and basically that's it. Its task does not include a powerful gun (there is nowhere to place it, a high center of gravity is incompatible with seaworthiness) and heavy armor (there will be no buoyancy). An outstanding example of a landing armored vehicle was made by the Japanese in the form of the "ka-mi" 80 years ago, the rest is an attempt to suck nonsense out of a finger. Maybe you don't need to demand the strength of a hammer from a microscope?

    https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%B0-%D0%9C%D0%B8
    1. 0
      28 May 2025 10: 01
      kamakama (Andrzej Kaminski), respected, but humanity has long ago invented anti-landing mines for detonation both in the water, as soon as the landing craft leaves the ship and goes to the shore, and in the littoral. And drones from above will attack the marines' armored personnel carriers both on the water and as their transport begins to get to the shore...
      1. +1
        28 May 2025 15: 56
        Your suggestions? Mines are treated by increasing the armor. This entails an increase in weight, a decrease in seaworthiness, payload and a decrease in coastal passability, and most importantly - maneuverability and speed. How to treat drones? You can't stick in an air defense system like a gun armor, it remains speed and maneuverability. But this is impossible with armor

        In fact, this is a classic task for shipbuilders, completed 120-150 years ago - armament, speed, armor - choose any 2 and forget about the third
        1. +1
          28 May 2025 16: 43
          kamakama (Andrzej Kaminski), I have not seen any projects, not even in models, but in beautiful computer presentations, of something like "Pantsir" for marines to combat aerial drones or with electronic warfare systems against drones. If you know, please share... The classic task that you recalled has been solved for more than 100 years in the Russian Navy - they went under water...
          1. -1
            29 May 2025 01: 30
            So I didn't understand - in what way do you propose to solve your own task? If you criticize - suggest
          2. -1
            29 May 2025 01: 49
            If the words "under water" are a submarine landing, then that's something.
            1) People can be pushed out through pressure chambers. Where to put heavy weapons and how?
            2) Mines are not going anywhere. In principle, above- and underwater drones have either already been invented or this does not present any difficulties
            3) Underwater vehicles are much worse in maneuverability and speed than surface vehicles. Armament and armor are generally not so good.
            1. -1
              29 May 2025 10: 46
              kamakama (Andrzej Kaminski), respected sir, your first task was armament, not landing from submarines. They removed the armament underwater, made the submarine fleet nuclear, got the opportunity to remind the enemy from the North Pole: "Don't be naughty!". It is possible to keep Washington in sight from the Commander Islands or from the beaches of Rio de Janeiro with the Bulava, which for some reason you consider a "not so great" armament. And please compare the speed and range of the Gremyashchy and the Knyaz Oleg, they entered the active composition of the Pacific Fleet with a difference of 1,5 years.
              1. -1
                30 May 2025 20: 50
                I didn't understand anything from your train of thought, only that something is wrong. So I'm asking - what is the correct way? "Bulava" on the beaches of Odessa? Or Kherson? It seems the topic is about seaborne assault vehicles. Instead of a warhead, we'll stuff a squad of marines into the "Bulava"?
          3. -1
            30 May 2025 02: 30
            My suggestion is for the Marines to land on the shore by helicopters - the enemy has little time to prepare, and mines can be flown past. No one is stopping them from landing right away with a crowd of drone operators and Rabman. The only question is - what next? Planning for more than a battalion is already some kind of unrealistic mental task for headquarters, their maximum is to take Sudzha - an urban-type settlement with 5 thousand residents and an area of ​​4 square kilometers. And then they land on the shore, and then what, where to fight? recourse
            So our guys landed on Zmeiny, what mission did they perform there and what weapons did they have? They were just sitting there to irritate the hell out of them, so that they would drag all sorts of weapons and shoot at a tiny patch of land, and our guys were heroically fighting back. They weren't sinking any enemy vessels from the island - they weren't delivering any missile systems there. And what were they doing there, what was the plan? Just sitting there, apparently, like - bite me! But probably the entire fleet headquarters gathered ten deadbeats and thought about it for months, and they were even paid salaries for it...
  14. +6
    28 May 2025 08: 01
    two weeks ago, there was already news about "this miracle"...
    it has no anti-mine protection, no protection against 14,5mm calibers and higher - no, landing and landing of troops "over the head"...
    There is nothing to say other than Rostec's budget development
  15. +3
    28 May 2025 08: 02
    "It's hot." You should at least try to figure out what it is and where it's from. The development of this tracked armored personnel carrier was paid for by Indonesia, where swimming is the main requirement. In our country, it will replace the old floating wheeled armored personnel carriers at most, and even that's not a fact.
  16. +1
    28 May 2025 08: 04
    For some reason it seems to me that this stubbornness in the unwillingness to recognize someone else's successful experience has purely selfish goals, and all the managers there don't give a damn about the lives of our soldiers, Russia, as the successor to the USSR, has its own weapons school, which is a brand and which is being pushed into international markets, although with each passing year it is less and less successful, if we copy Bradley, this will mean recognizing the victory of the Western military school, and then the Indians, Algerians, Iraqis, Indonesians and others will think hard about whether it is worth buying weapons from Russia if Russia itself has admitted that it is so-so...
  17. +3
    28 May 2025 08: 25
    Four years... In 41, the Soviet army had a good, but still very crude T-34. In 1944, the IS-2 entered service. There is literally a gap between them. Progress is obvious. Now, after four years of war... They have learned to hang additional protection on T-90 tanks, launched a simplified version of the BMP-30, developed, as I understand it, initially for export. I have not seen any more serious upgrades to armored vehicles.
    1. +8
      28 May 2025 11: 49
      Quote: Griboedoff
      Four years... In 41, the Soviet army had a good, but still very crude T-34. In 1944, the IS-2 entered service. There is literally a gap between them. Progress is obvious.

      In 41, the Soviet army had a T-34, although not bad, but still very crude. In 45, the Soviet army had the same T-34 with 45 mm hull armor, but with a new gun in a new turret, which overloaded the front rollers. That's progress.
      And the IS-2 is a tank of high-quality reinforcement. In the best case, a regiment per hull. And yes, a regiment of that time, with 21 vehicles.
    2. -1
      28 May 2025 16: 08
      Griboyedov Four years... I haven't seen any more serious upgrades to armored vehicles.
      I think it is exclusively and only Due to new air threats, the role of armored vehicles has diminished in relation to its.
      as soon as the armored vehicle electronic warfare system in various quick-change frequency suppression configurations is put into production, inexpensive kinetic suppression solutions are developed (let's say, a cheaper KAZ - we don't need to shoot down a missile/shell, but just hook a propeller blade.) - then "new products" can come out - after all technology has become very expensive - more than a certain amount, it is impossible to make.
      There are 8 billion people in the world. That's the grin
  18. + 11
    28 May 2025 08: 28
    For the sake of objectivity, I'll throw in my two cents.
    The article, with the expert's opinion added, described the "upper flaps" in great detail, how stupid, inconvenient and dangerous they were. But I was confused by the second photo in the article, where the lower flaps for the landing party exit were clearly visible. The photo is of low quality, so I dug around on the Internet. I think that "my" photo shows everything perfectly. By the way, the author of the article, without specifying any other characteristics of this ashcan, simply got fixated on these "upper flaps". The rest of the text is just emotions without facts, the level of "thoughtful analysis" is kindergarten.
    1. +5
      28 May 2025 08: 34
      Well, and another point. The Bradley, to which the author of the article "nods", is a machine of an initially different class and purpose:
      The Bradley is an infantry fighting vehicle designed to transport and support infantry, as well as to provide fire support to destroy enemy armored vehicles.
      BT-3F - designed to increase the mobility and protection of marine and ground forces units.
      Hence the difference in protection, weapons, etc.
      But to what extent the BT-3F meets the task - I would like to hear from real experts.
    2. -1
      28 May 2025 09: 04
      The fighter is about to break his ankle.
    3. -4
      28 May 2025 16: 48
      Moreover, there is an additional hatch on the doors themselves and two more on the roof. That is, the thesis that you can’t get out of the car is at least questionable.
    4. 0
      24 August 2025 16: 02
      I think everything is clearly visible in "my" photo.

      However, what prevented them from being made to fold down, and with a folding step on each one?
  19. +9
    28 May 2025 08: 32
    An interesting nuance - the BTR vehicle, a competitor to the M113, but everyone compares it to the Bradley IFV. And why? Because no one doubts that this thing will have to be used for assault operations. Perhaps the root of the problem is in the improper use of technology, and not in the fact that the industry can't?
    The same heavy IFV can be made in a repair plant with minimal material investments, but there are none. Why? No one ordered it. The customer should be vilified, not the manufacturer. The customer does not adapt the combat regulations and technical assignments to the requirements of modern combat, not the engineers
    1. 0
      28 May 2025 16: 47
      Well, everything is simple here, the BMP-3 combat module requires complex electronics, which it is impossible to increase production and/or purchase.
      As a result, the sighting system and the fire control system are a restraining factor in increasing production... The way out of the situation is quite logical. For what there are enough guns, we assemble with a gun, for what there are no guns, we rivet without guns... In terms of money, too, because the gun and electronics are the most expensive, the automatic loader is also not cheap... I think the cost savings are 2 times...
  20. +4
    28 May 2025 09: 03
    How much is in the Bradley mega-roof? A mighty 6 millimeters?
    1. -1
      28 May 2025 16: 39
      There is aluminum, so it is more, but the essence is the same... I think one and a half centimeters maximum...
      1. +3
        28 May 2025 17: 18
        Quote: Kolin
        How much is in the Bradley mega-roof? A mighty 6 millimeters?
        Quote: George Sviridov
        There is aluminum, so it is more, but the essence is the same... I think one and a half centimeters maximum...

        The basic version has steel armor (6-26 mm)
        If you think logically, then the roof has these 6 mm. It’s not like this minimum is on the side.
        1. -1
          28 May 2025 19: 12
          I probably agree, although it is doubtful that it is like this everywhere, 6 mm is not enough to provide rigidity... Perhaps 6 mm is partially on top and perhaps on the stern...
  21. -2
    28 May 2025 09: 06
    If this "monster" had been created, say, 5 years ago, it would have been understandable. The release of this "monster" today is nothing more than sabotage. It will end up on parade with the T-14 and other prototypes that will never reach the front line.
    1. +2
      28 May 2025 16: 43
      Why is that... Unlike the Armata, the BMP-3 and the vehicles based on it are mass-produced products developed by industry...
      Moreover, there is exactly the same vehicle but based on the BMD-4, the Rakushka armored personnel carrier, which is being purchased for the Airborne Forces...
      It is not clear why these machines should not be purchased...
      And considering that the president has set the task of deploying the Marine Corps brigade into a division... I think the order will be substantial.
    2. 0
      24 August 2025 16: 05
      If this “monster” had been created, say, 5 years ago, this would be understandable.

      Isn't this APC 20 years old?
  22. +2
    28 May 2025 09: 24
    Judging by the critics' comments, they didn't read the text. "This machine" was created for marine landings. Well, your "Bradley" won't float to the shore on the waves. But a floating machine is needed. Hundreds of simply drowned paratroopers in 1945 during the landing on the Kuril Islands will tell you this. When the majority of the "meat landing" died not from shells, mines, bullets, but from sea water. There were no means of delivery, ships could not come close - the result is sad. Yes, we won, but how many hundreds would be alive if they had such equipment.
    The problem is different. They throw such equipment into assaults. MTLBs, not to mention civilian vehicles, are not designed for assaults, but there have been cases of attacks from our side on MTLBs, etc.
    All kinds of equipment are needed, both floating and heavily armored, for different tasks.
    1. +5
      28 May 2025 12: 09
      Quote: Mekey Iptyshev
      But a floating vehicle is needed. Hundreds of paratroopers who simply drowned in 1945 during the landing on the Kuril Islands will tell you this. When the majority of the "meat landing" died not from shells, mines, bullets, but from sea water. There were no means of delivery, ships could not come close - the result is sad.

      On the Kuril Islands, the problem was not in the means of delivery, but in planning the operation without taking into account the hydrography. The base had means of delivery - the same boats. But for some reason, the headquarters decided that the ships with the landing force would be able to approach the shore at depths where landing the infantry over the side and then under their own power in chest-deep water was possible. But in reality, it suddenly turned out that the landing area was strewn with rocks on the bottom, and it was impossible to approach the shore, so the infantry had to be landed at depths of about 2 m.
      That operation was a collection of screw-ups. Starting with the fact that the Japanese were woken up by artillery preparation long before the landing. Then the infantry was disembarked overboard at a depth of 2 m. Then the landing force went deep into the island, not bothering to capture the Japanese anti-aircraft batteries that were shelling the landing zone from the flanks (they sank about a dozen landing craft). The air cover for the landing force was such that Japanese aircraft repeatedly attacked the landing ships. Well, and the finish - the assault on Japanese pillboxes by bare infantry and the repulse of a tank attack with practically no anti-tank weapons (grenades and anti-tank rifles). Well, the headquarters did not bother to plan the landing of artillery along with the first wave.
      And the fighters had to plug the holes in the plan with their bodies - literally:
      And what about the maneuver to envelop the landing force from Malaya Vysota? It didn't work. The direct participants in this attack are still standing in their places, some in a visible place, some stuck in a stream. Their opponents were marines, along with several anti-tank riflemen. The group was commanded by technician-lieutenant A. M. Vodynin, who died after throwing himself under a tank with a bundle of grenades. His example was followed by sergeant S. I. Ryndin. Another tank was destroyed by Petty Officer P.V. Babich and Senior Seaman M.V. Vlasenko; both were considered dead for some time.

      ...when the paratroopers went to storm Height 171, they came under fire from a two-embrasure bunker. Vilkov and sailor Pyotr Ilyichev crawled up to the bunker and threw grenades at it. When the paratroopers went on the attack again, the machine guns started working again, and then Vilkov and Ilyichev covered the embrasures of the enemy bunker with their bodies.
    2. 0
      28 May 2025 16: 14
      If you are threatened by a fire today and a flood tomorrow, it is better to get a fire extinguisher, not a boat. No one argues that a boat is better in a flood, but the priority now is in the fire extinguisher, i.e. what is needed for the SVO
    3. 0
      28 May 2025 17: 22
      "This machine" is created for marine landings." - where and who to land. And for landing there are landing ships on an air cushion. Everything is simple there.
      And the people here are indignant for one reason, because they understand perfectly well that this creation will not so much “sail the seas” as be used as a transport for assault groups far from any water.
  23. +3
    28 May 2025 09: 44
    The vehicle was developed long before the start of the SVO. It had a relatively successful export contract from Indonesia. The inherent problems with the rear engine (which interferes with landing troops) were known even then. Most likely, a mass order for this vehicle from our Armed Forces cannot be expected.
  24. +5
    28 May 2025 10: 17
    In fact, the technical specifications for this vehicle were prepared by Indonesia, for which this vehicle was rushed together under a contract for the BMP-3, which the Customer wanted to supplement with a similar armored personnel carrier, of course, an amphibious one.
    Since then, they have been trying to place this machine somewhere else, so far without much success. By the way, in my opinion, for the conditions of the same Indonesia or the Philippines, the machine is what is needed. Well, and for low-intensity combat operations - it will also do.
    1. -1
      28 May 2025 16: 51
      The vehicle was not placed due to a lack of understanding that mortarmen, machine gunners and grenade launchers also need something to drive. But the Airborne Forces understood this immediately after receiving the BMD, and acquired the BTRD and BTR-MDM.
      1. -2
        28 May 2025 19: 16
        Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
        But the Airborne Forces understood this immediately after receiving the BMD, and acquired the BTRD and BTR-MDM.

        I have already brought the airborne battalion's special forces on the BMD-4M and BTR-MDM, but apparently it was "not a good idea".
        If the Airborne Forces were really concerned with transporting soldiers, then:
        1. Would increase the number of BTR-MDM in a battalion from 1 to 4 to 1 to 2
        2. We thought about changing the composition of the battalion's equipment: assigning the BMD-4M the role of fire support, i.e. a light tank, and the troops would be transported on the BMD-4M but with an unmanned DUBM, for example, the BM-30-D "Spitsa", and the BTR-MDM for control, logistics and other tasks in the near rear.
  25. 0
    28 May 2025 10: 21
    I wonder what options the critics can offer?
    I don't like the ramp, it seems to be stuck, the rear swing doors are also not cool, the side ones don't roll...
    We haven't tried the ones that open downwards at the bottom yet.
    Don't take criticism to the point of absurdity.
    If you criticize, make suggestions!
    1. +3
      28 May 2025 13: 00
      A teleportarium is urgently needed to land terminators in the rear of the heretics.
  26. +6
    28 May 2025 11: 37
    In all the time that I have been reading articles on VO, such a mediocre, illiterate article has never been published here.
    Theoretical calculations about the military vehicle were collected from people who consider themselves experts and presented as the ultimate truth. You should listen to the opinion of the front-line soldiers who operated the BMP-3 (and the BT-3F was created on its basis). And then, based on them, you would draw conclusions, assume what shortcomings the BMP-3 BTR could have inherited, and which ones were corrected, instead of writing nonsense, at the level of gossip.
    The BT-3F will be purchased for the Marines to replace the BTR-80, which is currently their main transport. The armor thickness of the BTR-80 is from 5 to 9 mm, which was once considered sufficient to protect the transported infantry from small fragments and small arms fire. I do not have any data on the armor of the BT-3F, but since it was made on the basis of the BMP-3, here is the data on it
    .... The BMP-3 received spaced armor, built on the basis of aluminum parts from the ABT-102 alloy and BT-70Sh armor steel. The upper frontal and zygomatic parts of the body are made of aluminum and have a thickness of 18 and 60 mm, respectively. The medium frontal part, which has a slight forward slope, includes 10 mm steel, 70 mm air gap, 12 mm steel and 60 mm aluminum sheets. The lower part has a similar design, but dispenses with the inner steel sheet. The boards are assembled from sheets ABT-102 with a thickness of 15 and 43 mm. The roof, stern and bottom are 15, 13 and 10 mm thick, respectively. The forehead of the tower received protection in the form of 16 mm steel, 70 mm air and 50 mm aluminum. An additional protection of the frontal projection is a wave-reflecting shield made of armored steel of small thickness.
    The BMP-3's spaced and homogeneous armor provides all-round protection against large-caliber small arms. The frontal projection can withstand fire from a 30-mm cannon at a range of 200 m. ....

    From the factory, the BT-3F is equipped with additional protection consisting of add-on armor along the sides and grilles (approximately 4 tons)
    The APC is well balanced, and the troops are in the center of the vehicle (the most comfortable place), which is not at all unnecessary during a long march (those who have previously ridden in the BMP-1-2 in the troop compartment will especially appreciate it)
    YouTube is full of videos of drones flying into car doors. The fact that the doors are vertical doesn't bother them at all. So, doors that are angled as a disadvantage compared to those that are vertical is far-fetched.
    1. +1
      28 May 2025 11: 47
      Another photo. The seats for the troops are fixed to the sides and have footrests (to protect the troops in case of an explosion)
      1. -1
        29 May 2025 13: 15
        Quote: Bad_gr
        Another photo. The seats for the troops are fixed to the sides and have footrests (to protect the troops in case of an explosion)

        And, apparently, this is not all that is required for mine protection. It is also clear that the floor of the troop compartment is raised. Most likely, this is one of the reasons why a cabin was made above the troop compartment. If you simply remove the turret with the triplet from the BMP-3 and replace it with a DUMB, you can get an IFV/APC for 2-3 crew members and 10-13 paratroopers.
    2. +2
      28 May 2025 13: 23
      So before that they demanded to remove the 100mm cannon. There is no cannon here, but criticism is necessary. And criticism of the hinged doors came into play.
    3. +3
      28 May 2025 14: 22
      Well, the expert is not a simple one, but a TELEGRAM BLOGGER himself! And in Telegram there are only experts, they do not lie, but they save up for Zikrs themselves :))) Actually, the entire level of experts is to compare an armored personnel carrier with an infantry fighting vehicle.

      It's sad that such articles appear on VO.
    4. -4
      28 May 2025 17: 38
      "BT-3F will be purchased for the Marines, to replace the BTR-80, which is now their main transport." - compared to this miracle - a wheeled APC will be more reliable. In addition, the Marines have both BMP and BMD and everything else, including tanks.
      And the main thing is that the main vessel of the Marines is the hovercraft. Therefore, they don't really need such floating "somethings".
      1. 0
        29 May 2025 10: 20
        Quote: Ivan F
        "BT-3F will be purchased for the Marines, to replace the BTR-80, which is now their main transport." - compared to this miracle, a wheeled APC will be more reliable.

        Yeah... especially when landing.
        The problem with the BTR-80 when used by the Marines is that the vehicle has a low buoyancy reserve and is not suitable for swimming even in relatively light waves. Plus, the driver-mechanic needs to be highly qualified: the ability to control the vehicle afloat, taking into account the waves, wind direction and currents.
        © Murakhovsky.
        And the wheeled vehicles are not so good at maneuverability in the coastal zone. I remember that in the Pacific Fleet, during one of the exercises, when landing on an unfamiliar shore, the BTR-80 had problems getting onto the beach and moving along it.
        Quote: Ivan F
        And most importantly, the main vessel of the Marines is the hovercraft.

        The main vessel of the seafarers is the large landing craft. There are practically no hovercraft left with the ability to land equipment.
        And a large landing ship is a landing of equipment in the water. Landing on the shore looks beautiful, of course, but in reality it turns the ship into a stationary target, which even mortars will not miss.
        1. -1
          29 May 2025 19: 50
          "Plus, a highly qualified driver-mechanic is required: the ability to control the vehicle afloat, taking into account the waves, wind direction and currents" - of course, because this is not required on an infantry fighting vehicle. "It" floats on its own and does not sink. Here you are right. laughing

          "There are practically no airborne landing craft left." - that's what we need to make, not troughs that won't reach any shore, even in the smallest conflict. There's no point in even talking about war.

          "And a large landing ship is a landing of equipment in the water. Landing on the shore looks beautiful, of course, but in reality it turns the ship into a stationary target, which even mortars will not miss." - and from a large landing ship they will apparently jump out on the move and it will not become a target. laughing
          1. +1
            30 May 2025 12: 11
            Quote: Ivan F
            "Plus, a highly qualified driver-mechanic is required: the ability to control the vehicle afloat, taking into account the waves, wind direction and currents" - of course, because this is not required on an infantry fighting vehicle.

            The BT-3F is more seaworthy than the BTR-82 and is more forgiving of the driver's mistakes.
            Quote: Ivan F
            "There are practically no hovercraft left with the ability to land equipment." - that's what needs to be made, not troughs that won't reach any shore, even in the smallest conflict.

            Oh-ho-ho... The SVP will not reach the shore in any minor conflict. Remember the misadventures of the MDK-93 in Abkhazia, when it was unable to reach the shore, driven away by fire from only the small anti-aircraft guns and rifles. One hit from a 23-mm shell - and they almost lost the turbine.
        2. -1
          29 May 2025 19: 59
          "And a landing craft is a landing of equipment in water. Landing on the shore looks beautiful, of course, but in reality it turns the ship into a stationary target, which even mortars will not miss." - landing in water, ONLY THEN! when the trough cannot approach the shore, unlike the hovercraft. And not because it looks so cool. laughing
    5. -2
      29 May 2025 04: 22
      Personally, I hoped that it was like this
      a dense anachronism, as
      "course machine guns" is over
      back in the early Paleolithic?! :-)))
      Well, at least with the end of WW2...
      But no ...
      The burp of the 30s has arrived
      even until the 21st century...
      1. -1
        29 May 2025 10: 30
        Quote: Sharikov Polygraph Polygraphovich
        Personally, I hoped that it was like this
        a deep anachronism, how did "course machine guns" end in the early Paleolithic?! :-)))
        Well, at least with the end of WW2... But no... The burp of the 30s has even reached the 21st century...
        These machine guns are each controlled by their own shooter.
        1. 0
          29 May 2025 13: 24
          With such a guidance sector,
          you could say that these machine guns
          are NOT controlled by anyone at all :-(((
          Compared to them, so are the coursework
          "kugelblende" 85 years ago
          look like the pinnacle of technology...
          And places for both of these appeared
          UNDER-"machine gunners" because
          that it was necessary to go somewhere
          shove in 2 more motorized riflemen, stupidly
          NOT fitting into the miserable type
          "landing" compartment, glued on
          lopsided between combat
          department and logistics of the former
          floating tank (Object 685).
          After all, in normal infantry fighting vehicles there,
          in the nose, in place of the would-be "machine gunners",
          The MTO and mechanic are located to the left of it.
          But the BMP-3 is NOT even close to being an "infantry fighting vehicle"!!!
          It remained clean and floating.
          a tank that was being developed to replace the PT-76,
          since the mid-70s with a 5-year-old
          break in development...
          1. 0
            29 May 2025 14: 26
            Quote: Sharikov Polygraph Poligrafovich
            And places for both of these appeared
            UNDER-"machine gunners" because
            that it was necessary to go somewhere
            shove in 2 more motorized riflemen, stupidly
            NOT fitting into the miserable type
            "landing" squad,

            From the experience of those who fought in the BMP-3: these two motorized riflemen sit either in front behind the machine guns or in the general compartment, depending on the tasks assigned to this unit.
            1. -1
              29 May 2025 18: 21
              Yes, there in the (supposedly) "landing" department in general
              no one has been driving for a long time!!!
              Today, BPM-3s are used exclusively in the role
              ERSATZ-"Sturmgeschütz" at your direct disposal
              platoon commander, but NOT as an infantry fighting vehicle.
              And even then, only after the top has been rigged up
              huge homemade "barbecues"...
              Why "ersatz"?!
              Yes, because it is a full-fledged "StuG"
              even 80...85 years ago it was quite
              adequate (for its time)
              armor protection to walk with the infantry
              in frontal attacks, what is this very thing for?
              "StuG" was originally created.
              But the luminous tin can
              (BMP-3) is not suitable for any attacks now
              can't walk...
              Just from somewhere behind my back
              infantry to shoot from closed
              positions...
              And if we attack, then only on the first
              and immediately for the last time :-(((
              It's like some kind of deja vu,
              times of 1944...1945: in the Wehrmacht -
              "StuG.40", and in the same role we have -
              cardboard "Naked Ferdinand"
              (SU-76M), with a ratio of losses
              somewhere around ~1:10 in favor of the "Sturmgeschütz" :-(((
              P.S.
              And also: the 300th, which is still somehow walking,
              today he can't get into the BMP-3 himself anymore,
              but they fit into the BMP-1 / BMP-2 quite well
              even walking 300s on their own...
          2. 0
            24 August 2025 16: 15
            and MTO of the former
            floating tank (Object 685).

            The 685 and 688 have completely different MTOs.
    6. -1
      29 May 2025 08: 47
      What would you say to the front-line soldiers who used the BMP-3?


      The opinion of the front-line soldiers who were blown to bits in a BMP-3 when they ran over a PT mine can be ignored? And the opinion of the front-line soldiers who couldn't get out of the burning BMP-3 because of its inconvenient layout can also be ignored? Will the women give birth to new ones?
      1. -1
        30 May 2025 07: 44
        Quote: cast iron
        The opinion of the front-line soldiers who were blown to pieces in a BMP-3 when they ran over a PT mine can be ignored? And the opinion of the front-line soldiers who were unable to get out of the burning BMP-3 due to its inconvenient layout can also be ignored?
        Demagogue. Why don't you mention those who died, although they were covered by tank armor? And those who died in civilian transport, for whom the armor of an armored personnel carrier would have been enough to stay alive?
  27. +2
    28 May 2025 13: 17
    Quote: CruorVult
    A teleportarium is urgently needed to land terminators in the rear of the heretics.

    if they want to, they'll still find fault: the teleport window is the wrong size/color, with the wrong sound/at the wrong distance. And if you think about it - the armored car in question doesn't have a toilet/shower/jacuzzi. There isn't even a regular bidet, which is completely outrageous ;)
    1. +1
      28 May 2025 16: 55
      And if you think about it, the armored car in question doesn't have a toilet/shower/jacuzzi.
      toilet to take a crap in a BMP-3 - yes. a large contaminated area with a depressurized hull (to go out for natural needs) - no way through - the interior of the vehicle must be hermetically sealed, otherwise it will not be possible to deactivate upon arrival at the location. this is comfort class. this is only offered to long-range aviation pilots and astronauts.
      1. -1
        29 May 2025 08: 51
        All the guys, you convinced me! I need increased armor protection for the push in the form of a bench! :)
    2. +4
      28 May 2025 17: 33
      Quote: Tarasios
      there is no toilet in the armored car in question.....
      There is a toilet, but it is not for everyday use, and only when there are no other options (it is located under one of the landing seats)
      1. -4
        29 May 2025 03: 01
        Better right after the nuclear one
        explosion quickly jump out on
        street and get there instantly
        TO DIE from the extreme
        radiation, than a week or two later
        slowly die and disintegrate
        into pieces from radiation sickness... :-(((
        In a real nuclear war
        will become everyone's greatest happiness
        It is NOT possible to survive at the very beginning!!!
      2. The comment was deleted.
  28. -1
    28 May 2025 13: 21
    This is a vehicle for Indonesia, the second echelon after the BMP-3F, which they also purchased, but here the number of passengers transported is double on the same base.
    This is not a combat vehicle.
    The businessmen are unhappy.
    And also swimming at a speed of 10 km/h, the laughing slippers suggest.
  29. 0
    28 May 2025 14: 54
    It's strange that the author asks what it is.
    This is an adaptation of the "shell" for the Marines...
    Our people are strange...
    You say the BMP-3 is cool, a powerful gun capable of firing from closed positions, and if you adjust it from a drone, that's really cool...
    They answer. Why the hell does infantry need a tank - the main thing for them is to travel, and there is little space there and if the ammunition (well, first of all, the propellant powder charges) detonate, then the entire crew is minus, so they say when they transport infantry, they don't use a cannon and don't load ammunition...
    They removed the cannon well, removed the explosive ammo, and made more space for the landing force.
    Now they ask - what the hell is this...
    Well, in essence it is a more modern M113...
    And this is not something that was just invented, it was invented for the Airborne Forces a long time ago, made on the basis of the BMD-4 BTR Rakushka. They even riveted some of them and put them into the troops...
    And now this is an adaptation based on the BMP-3f for the marines...
    Considering that the equipment on the front line rarely works, it is generally a useful thing.
    And I will also assume that the BMP-3 combat module, with a laser rangefinder, a heat gun, a cannon, is the bottleneck preventing the increase in production volumes of military equipment... So they decided that as many combat modules as they supply, so many BMD-4/BMP-3 will be made, and in the remaining time they will build RAKs and such APCs... In a war situation, when any equipment is needed and it is better to drive poorly than to walk well, this decision is correct.
    Well, let's see what happened Ukrainians They drive normally on the M113, so ours will drive no worse on this one. And it is better protected and more maneuverable.
    1. -1
      29 May 2025 03: 15
      Yes, the infantry in the lumune can
      the BMP-3 bank has been around for a long time in principle
      Nobody carries!!!
      And if you use it only in the role
      direct weapons
      support of the company, and here too the old one
      Saveyskaya "Nona-S" a hundred times
      cooler and more efficient!!!
      At 120-mm "Nona" and OFS
      more powerful, and the barrel rises
      in mortar style, and regular
      120mm regimental mines
      mortars from all over the world
      they fit perfectly, and all sorts
      typeO "armor protection" everything
      is also absent in fact,
      what's there, what's there :-(((
  30. +1
    28 May 2025 15: 11
    Of course, I have heard a lot of different things, there is a lot to discuss, but the ideas have a right to exist, such as turning paratroopers into airmobile forces, replacing the requirement for equipment to be airdropped with vehicle transportation, and by simplifying and making equipment heavier, increasing its protection.
    But to issue non-floating equipment to the MARINES, that's something new...
    Okay, it's okay to say that the Marines are not needed... This is debatable, but here's the question: let's issue the Marines non-floating equipment, I've never heard of that before...
    1. VlK
      -1
      28 May 2025 16: 21
      Why don't the Marines simply land equipment from ships using specially designed and constructed means - some self-propelled pontoons, self-propelled landing barges and boats? Then there won't be any need for amphibians, and it will be possible to get by with ordinary standard unified ground vehicles.
      Meretskov recalled that during the liberation of Norway, amphibians collected from all over the front sank even when forcing a fjord; local Norwegian fishermen participated in rescuing the crews. They did not prove themselves to be a very reliable means of crossing.
      1. +3
        29 May 2025 10: 31
        Quote: VlK
        Why don't the Marines simply land equipment from ships using specially designed and constructed means - some kind of self-propelled pontoons, self-propelled landing barges and boats?

        Because for this we need these very ships and boats. And also a complete restructuring of the concept of seaborne assault, which has remained unchanged since the 50s of the last century: slowly crawling to the shore, large landing craft boxes vomit out of their wombs floating equipment that is also slowly crawling on the water. And all these large and slow-moving targets are joyfully welcomed from the shore by the surviving PDO.
        Quote: VlK
        Meretskov recalled that during the liberation of Norway, amphibians collected from all over the front sank even when forcing a fjord.

        This is because the weather has to be taken into account and the equipment and crews have to be prepared for operations at sea. Overseas, the same DUKW even crossed the English Channel.
        1. VlK
          -1
          29 May 2025 10: 51
          So it's time to restructure, the question has come to a head, especially in light of the deployment of brigades in the MP division? Moreover, there is probably still some time reserve, while the entire MP is busy in land areas not in its profile.
          1. +1
            29 May 2025 15: 32
            Quote: VlK
            So it's time to restructure, the question has become urgent, especially in light of the deployment of brigades in the MP division?

            The deployment of Marine brigades in divisions has little to do with the amphibious assault. This is an attempt by the Navy to recreate the infantry component of the coastal troops under the guise of "marines".
            Because the 11th, 14th and 22nd coastal defense corps, previously subordinated to the fleet, were taken away from it after the start of the SVO and reassigned to the "boots". The first two corps were used to form the ground forces of the LVO, and the 18th OA was formed on the basis of the third.
    2. +3
      28 May 2025 17: 02
      But to give it to the MARINES non-floating equipment, this is something new...
      tank battalions were removed from the staff. They were almost always there
  31. +2
    28 May 2025 15: 44
    Gentlemen who write that the vehicle was developed in the third year of the war. This vehicle was already exported to Indonesia in 2019 and is in service with the Marine Corps there. This vehicle was developed in the 90s-00s and completed by 2015. They just decided to try to push it into the Russian army once again.
    1. 0
      29 May 2025 13: 37
      This is already the second attempt with the BT-3F. The first attempt to offer the Ministry of Defense a BT-3F in a configuration similar to the vehicles supplied to the Indonesian Marine Corps ended with the remark that the armament was weak (we will leave the question of why strong armament is needed on an APC to the conscience of the generals). As a result, a new version of the BT-2023F was presented at Army-3, where instead of a machine gun DUBM, a launcher with 2 Kornet ATGMs was installed, the protection was reinforced with screens and grilles, as VO wrote: https://topwar.ru/223755-nejasno-sohranilas-li-plavuchest-v-zapadnoj-presse-ocenili-bronetransporter-bt-3f-s-protivotankovymi-raketami.html
  32. 0
    28 May 2025 16: 12
    One just wants to ask: are engineers really not familiar with the reality of combat operations in the SVO zone?

    Maybe these "engineers" should be sent to SVO to gain experience? And creative ideas? what
    1. -3
      29 May 2025 03: 31
      The engineers sculpted only what
      the comrade generals ordered them,
      decades in the making
      to the war before last!!! :-(((
  33. +1
    28 May 2025 16: 26
    Quote: Little Bear
    If this "monster" had been created, say, 5 years ago, it would have been understandable. The release of this "monster" today is nothing more than sabotage. It will end up on parade with the T-14 and other prototypes that will never reach the front line.

    So it was created 9 years ago - in 2016.
    1. -4
      29 May 2025 02: 49
      God grant that "THIS"
      never got anywhere
      what a real war!!! :-(((
    2. -4
      29 May 2025 03: 47
      Complete analogue of BMP-3 and BT-3F
      Today there are already almost
      in every Russian IRP :-)))
      Only, unlike the BMP-3,
      its analogue in IRP is real
      healthy and quite tasty :-)))
      And the lumunia is also leaving
      many times less...
  34. 0
    28 May 2025 16: 59
    Copy this nonsense already!!!! They're messing around with their swimming again like a cat with a mouse
    1. -1
      28 May 2025 17: 16
      In order to copy or produce something, industry is needed. Our armored defense enterprises have not been able to launch a single project created in the Russian Federation in series production. It is good that the equipment for the BMP-80, BMP-3 and T-72 is available, so we produce them with minimal modernization.
  35. +1
    28 May 2025 17: 09
    Now a crowd of ultra-patriots will come running, shouting: “How dare you praise Bradley?”
  36. -1
    28 May 2025 17: 14
    Well, what can I say, apparently KMZ does not have the equipment to mass-produce at least the BMP-3 with the engine layout in the forehead (Manul or Dragoon)... Because this shithole cannot be explained by anything else
    1. -3
      31 May 2025 15: 45
      Mil pardon!?
      And BMP-1 and BMP-2 were produced
      in Kurgan, or on Mars??? :-)))
      1. 0
        1 June 2025 17: 17
        Mil pardon!?
        And BMP-1 and BMP-2 let out

        There is an answer in your question...
        In the USSR, Buran was also produced with sharks and eagles, but in the Russian Federation, their production is not visible.
        1. The comment was deleted.
          1. -1
            4 June 2025 18: 54
            So, mass-produce something not from the USSR, where our dear friend is the T-14, Boomerang, Kurganets, Koalitsiya and a couple dozen other new projects? The truth is that Russian factories can mass-produce only modifications of the T-72, BTR-80 and BMP-3 (and even then without major changes to the layout)... And even now, if they give the Defense Ministry industry the task of producing something new, the industry simply won't be able to adapt to it. Why, in 30 years you've had entire industries multiplied by zero - electronics, optics, engine building and so on
            This is what holy capitalism does, which the damned Soviet Union planted a mine for, of course. Because your parents gave birth to you, and they could have bought products #2 and there would have been one less liberal ruining the country.
            1. The comment was deleted.
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. 0
              24 August 2025 16: 28
              and they could have bought product no. 2

              No. 2 in pharmacy slang is the amount in the package. Aspirin No. 10.
  37. -1
    28 May 2025 19: 14
    It's true: "The sleep of reason produces monsters."
  38. -1
    28 May 2025 21: 54
    Quote: George Sviridov
    Of course, I have heard a lot of different things, there is a lot to discuss, but the ideas have a right to exist, such as turning paratroopers into airmobile forces, replacing the requirement for equipment to be airdropped with vehicle transportation, and by simplifying and making equipment heavier, increasing its protection.
    But to issue non-floating equipment to the MARINES, that's something new...
    Okay, it's okay to say that the Marines are not needed... This is debatable, but here's the question: let's issue the Marines non-floating equipment, I've never heard of that before...


    Why do they need floating equipment if they can just take and land equipment from a fast assault flat-bottomed boat? Or does religion forbid it? Or is there no money for it? (And there is money for a vehicle that is obviously worse than a combination of a self-propelled flat-bottomed boat + a standard land vehicle, and may even be more expensive)
    1. -1
      30 May 2025 02: 29
      The flat-bottomed vehicle is larger, it is much easier to hit, it itself takes up more space in the landing ship (if it is in it of course or we only plan landings for short distances (relatively) in general this is an extra chain in this regard. In the same US KMP there is a special vehicle AAV7 which is a slightly floating armored personnel carrier, the same vehicle is in service with the Japanese Marines, China also has floating armored personnel carriers. Assault flat-bottomed vehicles are also needed, but for the transfer of tanks, for example, artillery, and infantry, you just need a floating armored personnel carrier to transport more than that.
  39. -2
    28 May 2025 23: 23
    Typical analogue, no, natural sabotage...
    1. +1
      29 May 2025 02: 08
      It is not possible to carry troops inside such a vehicle, that is true. But in general the article and the barking of the commentators resemble unfair competition. This vehicle should not be compared to a tank. It is better to compare it with other floating equipment.
      1. The comment was deleted.
  40. -1
    29 May 2025 00: 21
    Unlike pseudo-robots-not-tankets, this one at least won't get stuck in the mud and will go along a broken track. But, looking at how soldiers drive APCs, they should have made a flat platform without armor or sides at all.
    1. -3
      29 May 2025 02: 45
      All this has already been done a long time ago.
      in the form of a regular on-board "shishiga" :-)))
  41. The comment was deleted.
    1. +1
      30 May 2025 02: 30
      Shouldn't the Marines' armored personnel carriers float? Should Marines go into landing operations by swimming or in rubber boats?
      1. -2
        30 May 2025 04: 07
        Yes, there will NEVER be another one in history
        no sea landings, so colorful
        filmed in the cinema under the S.S.S.R.
        "Counter Move" !!!!!
        Today, all this looks like this:
        science fiction and never
        will NOT come true anymore...
        Any huge landing trough,
        which will lose momentum for several
        tens of minutes after opening
        bow gates and ramps, will become
        a stupidly motionless target, into which
        it will be hard to miss from the shore
        even from a regimental 120 mm mortar :-(((
        P.S.
        Yes, and no parachute landings
        in world history, never again
        It will NOT happen...
        So, all the cinematic beauty
        mass ejection from "In the Zone"
        "special attention" also forever
        will remain in military history
        in the form of an unattainable dream...
        Not a single landing craft and not a single
        one Il-76 today under no circumstances
        conditions will NOT reach the point
        landing!!!
        The first and the last, more or less
        successful mass parachute
        The landing took place in 1940.
        at Goering's false-schirmjägers
        in Crete!!!
        And even then, the losses amounted to
        about 30%, although still
        Crete was successfully taken
        very small deutsch
        by forces...
        But the artist Addy himself eventually
        said that there are no such perEmOH
        he doesn't need more even for free :-)))
        1. 0
          30 May 2025 16: 39
          That's exactly why all first-tier countries have in their armed forces both marines capable of sea and airborne assaults. They're probably stupid.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. 0
              31 May 2025 13: 51
              If we couldn’t implement it due to the weakness of the fleet, it doesn’t mean that others won’t be able to either.
              1. The comment was deleted.
        2. 0
          24 August 2025 16: 32
          The first and the last, more or less
          successful mass parachute
          The landing took place in 1940.

          And all the allied parachute landings in 1944 were unsuccessful?
  42. -1
    29 May 2025 05: 42
    why invent something new if you can just slap on something good and old for the same old stuff laughing Kurganets Shmurganets A Pt Our Everything
  43. -1
    29 May 2025 08: 30
    Are engineers really not familiar with the reality of combat operations in the SVO zone?

    And when did initiative cease to be punishable? And it is unlikely that any adult engineer would go to work for food.
    No, these are games with budgets, for completely different guys.
  44. -1
    29 May 2025 13: 57
    Question for experts: why was the armored cabin built above the troop compartment on the BT-3F?
    If you simply remove the turret with the under-turret basket from the BMP-3, then 11-15 people can comfortably fit inside the hull.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. -1
      31 May 2025 00: 25
      15 - that's if you stack them all
      straight on the floor "jack" and without chairs??? :-)))
    3. 0
      5 November 2025 12: 46
      Obviously, it’s for more comfortable placement of the landing force, so that it would be possible to enter/leave the landing glass simply by bending the head, and not on the belly
  45. P
    0
    29 May 2025 23: 57
    In order for a new machine to appear for new requirements, there needs to be someone to invent it. This is a school, a team of sufficient numbers and competences, contractors supplying equipment. We throw out personnel immediately, the proud title of "KMZ designer" for many decades was equal to a scourge with an income of two cheap push-button phones per month. The design tool of designers is a partially stolen compass (the introduction of which gave the green light to a stable drain of personnel in ASCON), you can simply forget about new units and assemblies. Therefore, there will be this little humpbacked horse
    1. 0
      30 May 2025 18: 07
      I agree with you, colleague! 150% With one clarification - not KOMPAS, but ACAD, but of course, "cracked" at the state level!!!
    2. 0
      24 August 2025 16: 36
      Designer's Design Tool - Partially Stolen Compass

      Somehow, the drawing board didn’t bother the designer before.
      1. P
        0
        24 August 2025 16: 39
        and it doesn't interfere now, but only if the designer is an immortal from the era before last
  46. +1
    30 May 2025 01: 18
    I don't get it, am I the author? I understand that everything is bad, but what exactly? This is a naval vehicle, you can't hang tank armor on it, and you can't install a cannon from the "Coalition" on it. Judging by the reviews, the basic vehicle is very mobile and maneuverable. The vehicle is designed primarily for the transfer of manpower from the ship to the shore by swimming. Accordingly, from the bottom side, the vehicle must be streamlined, lower the tracks lower, it will not be able to swim at all.
    Here, from the remote module, it is required to take into account the experience of the air defense system, it must fully automatically protect the vehicle from drones. Yes, drones have caused a stir, but I think in the near future, active protection means will appear for which fighting them will not be a problem. Moreover, it is possible that the armored personnel carrier and infantry fighting vehicle will be assigned protection from drones, units already upon exiting the vehicle, within a radius of 50-100 meters.
    1. -1
      6 June 2025 01: 05
      This is a naval vehicle, and no matter how much you want to, you can’t put tank armor on it or a cannon from the “Coalition”.


      So in 41 they made ships with 300 mm armor, but it is impossible to make an armored vehicle? A very controversial statement. It is possible to make a floating tank with powerful armor. It will just be quite large in volume.
      1. -1
        14 June 2025 10: 15
        Can you tell me how many thousand tons the ships with 300mm armor weighed? If you have a boat, try to put at least 10mm armor on it.
  47. 0
    30 May 2025 18: 01
    [quote][engineers are not familiar with reality/quote]
    Absolutely not familiar!!! The coordination and approval of the technical specifications (product specifications) lasts for years (!!!). Even replacing the "Soviet" screwdriver in the maintenance kit with any NORMAL one, but, let's say, Belarusian, causes hysteria among the representatives of the Ministry of Defense when the product is handed over. Help, in short!!!
  48. +1
    31 May 2025 07: 59
    The problem is not in creating something (the "Armata" tank, the Su-57, the coalition and many other things). This is secondary. The main thing is to create a stable scheme for enriching a group of people by prior agreement at the expense of the state budget. The creation of something as a result is a side effect, so to speak!!!
    1. -1
      4 June 2025 12: 02
      You can't win a war with a liberal system. "SMERSH" shot saboteurs on the spot.
  49. -1
    2 June 2025 14: 06
    What is there to think about, gaijins? The Japanese have long known the answer - the future is in "mecha". That's what we need to focus on!!
    1. 0
      5 November 2025 12: 49
      What mecha?! All mecha is based on a production base, and in Russia, that's impossible due to the lack of one. They can make a tank hull in Russia, but assembling a modern tank is impossible—they don't have the microchips.
  50. -1
    4 June 2025 11: 59
    There are trophies. Is it really necessary to reinvent the wheel? In today's reality, protection from drones is important.
    1. 0
      5 November 2025 12: 50
      For drone protection, you have to go to the Chinese. Our guys won't be able to handle such a thing, since lithographs won't deliver before 27. And without lithographs, there are no radars, cameras, or neuromorphic processors.
  51. 0
    4 June 2025 12: 57
    Why didn't they make the BTR-3F like this? There's more room for everything and the displacement and the exit is easier. What were they thinking when they made what they have now?
  52. 0
    5 June 2025 18: 55
    Has a parachute platform been developed for this? Well, so that from the sky to the ground - and into battle!
  53. -1
    5 June 2025 20: 56
    Kurganets 25 nervously smokes on the sidelines, the money is gone!
  54. -1
    6 June 2025 19: 19
    I am genuinely surprised by articles like this.
    The APC was made according to the army's technical requirements. Here it is. Most likely, it was ready in the 90s, but it was not accepted into service. Then they suddenly gave money and started demanding new products. Here is a ready-made new product taken off the shelf and issued.
    Let me remind you how recently they laughed at the "garbage container with cameras" from 404... and this was a healthy attempt by the enemy to make a heavy armored personnel carrier.
    On the same BMP3 cart there is a front-wheel drive Manul...it is in no hurry to scale it up and it is quite possible to make an APC on its basis. The second approach is to make it on the basis of a tank chassis.
  55. -1
    6 June 2025 21: 45
    I believe that the Russian Ministry of Defense will conduct tests before accepting this thing into service... or refusing to accept it. Or maybe they won't be interested in it at all. In any case, there will be tests and they will show everything, namely tests, and not the empty chatter on this page, including the chatter of the author of the article. If the characteristics are of interest, they can offer the manufacturers to rearrange the doors, for example. In this case, it is convenient to shoot drones with shotguns through such doors, but there are also enough disadvantages - the drone must first be detected and shot, otherwise there will be a tragedy.)
  56. -1
    9 July 2025 14: 07
    I believe that the developer was inspired by the Swedish SV90, far from the worst product. THE BEST COMBAT BOT AT THE MODERN STAGE. We must give credit to the developers. There are at least 2 imitators even in our Penates. You can laugh and write whatever you want, you have to try.
  57. 0
    20 August 2025 17: 17
    I don't get it. What kind of water obstacles are our engineers planning to overcome in the waterless Ukrainian steppe? What kind of airborne landing did commander Gerasimov plan? Why do Russian armored vehicles have to be light, thin-walled, uncomfortable, and unprotected? What kind of idiot sets such technical requirements?
    1. 0
      5 November 2025 12: 51
      Indeed, there are no water barriers... But in fact, any stream becomes a front line=(
  58. 0
    5 November 2025 12: 43
    The author's ability to write a question and an answer in one sentence, even with a question, is amazing.
    The BTR-3F is the Russian "Bradley"
    What is the phenomenon of Bradley's direness - there is nothing to burn in him!
    The engine is mounted on the starboard side, with the driver sitting on the left. The fuel tank is located under the troop compartment, making it difficult to access. The Bradley has virtually no ammunition—its 20mm rounds don't burn or detonate, no matter how they detonate, but they need to actually burn. The explosion of one or two rounds doesn't destroy the entire vehicle and doesn't reach the driver, who sits in a sort of sick capsule.
    Thus, this BTR-3F is the answer to the Bradley.
    Whoever says the protection is worse—so who are you trying to defend yourself against?! The Bradley's aluminum armor can't even withstand a 30mm autocannon with standard Russian armor-piercing rounds. No IFV can withstand an ATGM or a 120mm HEAT round, let alone a crowbar with 400+mm of penetration through armor steel. So, the Namer's adherents can go to hell—it's better to protect it with "bushes" against drones than to lug around 30 tons of useless extra armor. 14.5mm armor is still good.