What could Heron's steamship have been like?

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What could Heron's steamship have been like?
"Heron's Steamboat" - illustration by Angus McBride


“…or unknown newly created fierce beasts, or breathing fiery breath, or spewing clouds of smoke…”



The Book of Wisdom of Solomon, 11:19


Alternative story The ancient world in artistic images and paintings. Today we will skip the artistic part of our story, but we will tell you, dear readers of VO, about two things at once: the possible appearance of Heron’s hypothetical “steamboat” and how, if you wish, to make its model.

Let's start with the fact that Heron's "turbine" was high-speed and could make up to 3500 revolutions per minute. In any case, this is what modern models of Heron's sphere, built according to his drawings, do. This means that paddle wheels cannot be installed on the axis of the sphere, which is also a branch pipe for feeding steam from the boiler. And if so, then the drawing by the famous English illustrator Angus McBride can hardly serve as a basis for a model of "Heron's steamboat", since it is too fantastic. This means that our task is to "reduce the fantasy", but "add realism". But is it possible to do this?

In principle, this is possible if... the ball rotating due to the reactive force is placed in the ship's hull not across, but along, and only on one branch pipe, which should also be the axis of its rotation. The axis itself should come out of the ball on the opposite side - and it is on it that you can install a bronze "worm" that engages with a large-diameter gear mounted on the shaft of the paddle wheels. The force transmitted by the ball will immediately increase sharply, so that with such a device, the steam turbine, in theory, could well rotate the paddle wheels. Although, of course, everything needs to be calculated here. But this is precisely what we will not do, but simply assume that this system will be operational.

The steam boiler and the hearth underneath it should be located inside the body. Ordinary firewood could serve as fuel, but it can be assumed that in this case, artificial air could be used to intensify combustion in the hearth. Since bellows for supplying air to smelting furnaces had long been used at that time, and besides, the burning firewood could also be doused with some kind of oil.

An aeolipile wheel positioned lengthwise would spray superheated steam over the entire deck. But if it were positioned transversely, its zone of influence would be relatively narrow, so that it would be quite possible to isolate the crew from it with shields made of metal, say, bronze sheets.

It is clear that the worm gear would only work to move the ship forward. In battle, therefore, ancient ships rammed each other. But how could one move back after ramming, having such an engine on board? To do this, it would be necessary to turn off the paddle wheel drive, without “turning off” the rotating ball itself. This can be done quite easily by making the steam supply pipe to the ball rotatable, and the shaft with the “worm” long enough and resting on some well-oiled support.

It would be enough to turn this shaft together with the ball to the left or to the right, as the teeth of our worm gear would disengage, after which the paddle wheels would immediately stop rotating. True, in this case, oars and rowers would have to be used for reversing, but they would be quite capable of developing the maximum possible rowing speed and quickly moving the "steamboat" away from the ship it had rammed, after that... rest again - and so on until the next ram. Well, and sailing in the usual mode could well be done under sails, which most often happened, while rowers were usually used in battle.

Of course, it would have been necessary to figure out how to control the shaft of the rotating ball, to move it and push it onto the gear on the shaft of the paddle wheels. But, I think, there would have been nothing particularly complicated in this for the mechanics of that time. After all, they made the "Antikythera mechanism", and the gears in it are much more delicate than those that could have been on "Heron's steamboat".

Well, now we will tell you how to make a model of this hypothetical “steamboat”, which can become both an excellent pastime, and as its result an equally interesting souvenir, and… a visual aid for the history classroom. The assembly model is produced “tank Leonardo da Vinci”, although in the form in which he drew it, it is also… completely inoperative.

Let's start with the fact that the basis for such a ship at that time could well have been a monera - a Roman warship with one row of oars, each of which was rowed by several people. The basis of the hull of such a ship is a semi-cylinder with added sides, which greatly simplifies the manufacture of the model.


The skeleton of the middle part of the ship

The part shown in our photo can be made from anything, including packing cardboard and cut strips of thick paper. The outside of the frame is pasted with two rows of coffee stirrer sticks using PVA glue. Then all internal fastenings except the end bulkheads are removed, after which the hull is pasted from the inside with strips of veneer 2 mm wide.


Plasticine extremity shapes

The ends of the bow and stern are easier to mold from plasticine, then freeze them in the refrigerator and, having greased them with oil, fill them with melted paraffin. In this way, we will get four forms into which we will need to press self-polymerizing clay (sold in the same Leonardo stores) and leave until it hardens completely. The finished ends are glued together, after which they are glued to the middle part of the hull.


The middle part of the body with the ends made of self-polymerizing clay. The inner lining of the body is clearly visible


And this is the hull sheathing with slats from the outside


It is best to paint the sheathed hull with "Wood Oil with Wax"

This coating allows you to get a very beautiful texture and rich color!


The steam boiler is half a wooden ball, painted bronze. The hearth is the same self-polymerizing clay…


And this is what our steam turbine will look like. The tanks, the pipes from which go to the furnace, can be intended for liquid oil


Our body is gradually acquiring details...


And this is... firewood! Thinly chopped branches!


Main deck


Paddle wheels and paddle wheel housings


The details of the battle towers, as well as the paddle wheels, are cut from 1 mm thick polystyrene on a CNC wall. However, they are not at all difficult to cut from thin cardboard, even greeting cards and tea boxes! On the finished towers, strips of veneer imitate bronze sheets…


The fully assembled hull of the ship before painting. Note the "bronze sheets" of the aeolipile fence and... the firewood stacked next to them.


Fully assembled and painted model with mast and sails installed


Top view. The stand is a piece of chipboard covered with strips of veneer. The decking is varnished. The railings and hull parts are acrylic paint in red and blue.


On the sail is the emblem - the Greek letter "gamma" with wings under the name of the ship - "Heronia"

The model stands themselves are cardboard cones cut out of egg cartons, filled with epoxy resin and painted to look like bronze. The oars are Chinese toothpicks. The railings are glued together from 2x2 mm slats. The beautiful curls on the bow bulwark are cut out of a polystyrene fan, just like the parts of the New Year's carriage, which was already mentioned here. It seems completely impossible to draw the eyes on the bow by hand. But they can be ordered from a printing house that makes iron-on stickers, and transferred into place using a soldering iron set to the lowest heat.

It is clear that if this were a real ship, it would be possible to find fault with it and find fault with it – and this is not so, and the other is not… so. But it should be considered precisely as an illustration of what we call a “flight of fantasy”, nothing more. Well, and for children, when they study Greek culture as part of a school textbook and get acquainted with Archimedes, it would not hurt at all to also see Heron’s aeolipile and even fantasize on the topic: “And what could his ship actually look like if it had been built?”
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  1. + 10
    April 27 2025 05: 20
    The disadvantages of such a turbine are visible at first glance: 1. a constant water supply is needed, the salt of which would quickly clog the insides of the ball. 2. The steam coming out of the nozzle will occupy a large area, therefore, it will be impossible to get close to the turbine. 3. Apparently, the efficiency of such a design is not very high and it is not clear whether the force of the steam will be able to turn the blades of the paddle wheel. 4. Bearings. This is the main thing. 5. The copper ball will not pierce for a long time under the influence of temperature. In a word, slaves are both cheaper and more reliable. wink
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. + 10
      April 27 2025 09: 07
      In a word, slaves are both cheaper and more reliable.


      And there are no problems with repairs - you just change the entire unit and that's it.
    3. +2
      April 27 2025 13: 03
      The disadvantages of such a turbine are visible at first glance:

      The turbine rotates under the action of the reaction of the steam jet. Then, no rotations, transmissions or other sources of efficiency reduction are needed, attach a Laval nozzle to the boiler and go ahead.
      1. +3
        April 27 2025 14: 38
        Quote: Sensor
        The turbine rotates under the action of the reaction of the steam jet
        That's exactly what rotates. And for that, you need at least bearings!
        Quote: Sensor
        attach a Laval nozzle to the boiler
        At that time they didn't know what it was. laughing
        1. +2
          April 27 2025 15: 32
          That's exactly what's spinning.

          What I mean is that there is no need to make the boiler spin in order to create driving force.
          Moreover, the reaction force of the steam jet at the scale of the model is very small.
          If you don't want to get tied to history, then see
          https://modelist-konstruktor.com/v-mire-modelej/korabl-s-paroreaktivnym-dvigatelem
          The Laval nozzle appeared while thinking about how to make the boat float faster, heptyl and melange came to mind.
        2. +1
          April 28 2025 17: 54
          Well, why didn't they know? They knew! The prototype bearing was described in Aristotle's Mechanica (Latin: Mechanica). The first invention that can be safely called a prototype of a rolling bearing belongs to the ancient Greek engineer Diad and dates back to about 330 BC. It was the head of a siege tower for destroying fortress walls.
          The dyad mounted the ram on rollers that moved along grooves made in the base. The rollers were surrounded by a common basket, which was controlled by ropes thrown over fixed blocks. The ropes were attached to the ends of the basket.
  2. +6
    April 27 2025 05: 53
    Well, as for me, the reverse gear could have been made using not a direct worm gear, but through a gear block
    1. +5
      April 27 2025 05: 56
      Quote: faiver
      and through the gear block

      My brain wasn't strong enough here!
      1. +4
        April 27 2025 06: 03
        but this is taking into account modern knowledge, let's say if I were a time traveler I could have done it, but the question is in the materials - wooden gears are considered disposable, bronze? and how long will that firewood last?
      2. +3
        April 27 2025 08: 48
        Thank you Vyacheslav, I liked the article!
        The model is cool!!!
        Of course, it would be necessary to figure out how to control the shaft of the rotating ball, to move it and push it onto the gear on the shaft of the paddle wheels.

        Why not the Archimedes screw?
        1. +2
          April 27 2025 10: 13
          Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
          Why not the Archimedes screw?

          The wheels are prettier... And we need to think about the screw... And what length do you think it should be?
          1. +2
            April 27 2025 16: 30
            I would like to offer you, Caliber, to consider making another model of a hypothetical "steamboat" with a Heron sphere. Only a simpler design. Leave the Heron sphere and the drive the same, but without the worm gear. Only put it not on water wheels or on an Archimedes screw, but through a gear block, which would allow changing the direction of movement "back and forth" to an air propeller. Hypothetically, Heron himself, with his engineering knowledge, was quite capable of creating a similar design. And for you, as a modeler, it would be much easier to make.
            Sincerely.
            P.S. for example
            1. +3
              April 27 2025 20: 30
              Something like this, for example
              Fig. Hypothetical model model of a hypothetical "steamboat" with Heron's sphere and propeller
              1. +2
                April 27 2025 21: 55
                Quote: Richard
                Something like this, for example
                Fig. Hypothetical model model of a hypothetical "steamboat" with Heron's sphere and propeller

                Propellers were not in fashion back then. laughing. Only "hardcore", i.e. "Archimedes screw"! By the way, in this case, we can consider ships crawling out onto land (screws allow this) and conducting combat operations as tanks laughing!
                Regarding your picture, I suggest turning the propeller 180, it will blow directly into the sails. The efficiency is approximately the same laughing
                Best regards hi
            2. +1
              April 27 2025 21: 00
              Quote: Richard
              easier to make.

              Thank you, Richard. The idea is indeed interesting. But I will not do it. There are no less other interesting models and I want to make them too...
          2. +1
            April 27 2025 20: 24
            Quote: kalibr
            what length should it be?

            By the way, about the birds... the first screw steamers had a fairly long propeller... and as with many new products of their time, there is a legend that under some circumstances this long propeller broke off on one of the steamers and became quite short, and that's when the ship went faster... like, the ancestor of the propeller as we know it was born
        2. + 10
          April 27 2025 11: 21
          Because a normal deadwood could only be made in the 1840s.
          And by the way, the very first screws were actually "Archimedes' Screw", that is, an auger. And they came to a more or less modern form after a screw boat ran aground and lost most of this auger. After which the speed suddenly increased)
          1. +1
            April 27 2025 20: 58
            Quote: Senior Sailor
            lost most of this very auger. After which the speed suddenly increased)

            I read about this episode...
        3. +2
          April 27 2025 14: 49
          Quote: Kote pane Kohanka
          The model is cool!!!

          If only she would float!
          1. +1
            April 27 2025 20: 56
            Quote: Olgovich
            If only she would float!

            She would have floated, if she had been bigger and if her ends had not been made of clay. At one time I made a reconstruction of the ship "Alexandride" for the Czech (Czechoslovak) magazine "Modelář" - a kind of superdreadnought of the ancient world. The Czechs liked it and they published the material. But I could not make a model. I needed a figure of Atlanteans. In scale!!! And only now, 30 years later (if not more) I was able to order a figure of Atlanteans from an artist, make a Vixin model and now I am gradually casting them from bronzed epoxy. I can try to make this ship float. Interesting... But I don't know. It is easier to make stand-up ones.
      3. +2
        April 27 2025 19: 51
        Quote: kalibr
        Quote: faiver
        and through the gear block

        My brain wasn't strong enough here!

        Question...
        Extension alien History of the Ancient World Will be ??
        I mean the continuation of the story about Heron's steamer, because the whole point of the "steamboat" was combat use this "steamboat" against the fleet Rome - for the "beauty of history" you can even build a whole flotilla of "steamships", but what happened next?...
        Naval war with Rome, and what on land?... What naval battles with the Roman fleet?, what losses for Rome?, how will Rome respond to naval defeats? etc. etc.
        How will the history of the Ancient World turn out after the defeat of Rome? or Rome's agent will steal the plans for the steamship and Rome will build its own steamship fleet, and in a few years it will incinerate Alexandria as well Carthage?...
        There are a lot of questions, but once you step along the path of alien history, there is no turning back...
        With all my respect hi
        1. +2
          April 27 2025 20: 48
          Quote: cat Rusich
          I mean the continuation of the story about Heron's steamship, because the whole point of the "steamship" was the combat use of this "steamship" against the Roman fleet - for the "beauty of history" you can even build a whole flotilla of "steamships", but what happened next?...

          What follows will certainly be exactly what you are interested in! It is not my laziness or anything else... The thing is that it was customary to attach shields to the sides of warships in the Ancient World. In this case, these should be Roman shields of the legion defeated in Egypt. But... there are a lot of them and I ordered decals for them. While they are done, while they are on their way... When they arrive, I will decorate the ship finally, take especially high-quality photos... and then I will send it into battle.
          1. +2
            April 27 2025 21: 44
            Quote: kalibr

            What follows will certainly be exactly what you are interested in!
            Will there be a short story in the next series of alien history about the composition and structure of the Roman fleet, how the crew of warships was organized...
            Volumes of scientific research have been written about the land legions of Rome - about the fleet of Rome, readers of VO know that "it was", and what it was like Fleet of Rome - few can answer. And so I would like to learn the most basic information about the Roman fleet within the framework of alien history.
            hi
            1. 0
              April 29 2025 19: 59
              Quote: cat Rusich
              Will there be a short story in the next series of alien history about the composition and structure of the Roman fleet, how the crew of warships was organized...

              Yes, it is planned. Now I am reading the relevant literature, and the artist is drawing pictures...
    2. +2
      April 27 2025 21: 06
      Quote: faiver
      Laval nozzle

      It is easier to use 180-degree rotating sleeves of a ball mounted on a turbine. The turbine is braked with pads (like the parking brake system once used on a car's cardan shaft). A couple of slaves turn the sleeves in the opposite direction with keys, release the brake and the turbine begins to rotate in the opposite direction. Saving engine losses in the transmission.
      1. +1
        April 29 2025 20: 00
        Quote: sergeyezhov
        A couple of slaves use keys to turn the sleeves in the opposite direction, release the brake and the turbine begins to rotate in the opposite direction.

        I also thought about doing this and maybe I will if the material ends up in a book.
    3. +1
      April 27 2025 21: 46
      Quote: faiver
      Well, as for me, the reverse gear could have been made using not a direct worm gear, but through a gear block

      The main question here, in my opinion, is how to ensure the clutch-disengagement of gears. Without stopping the main "turbine" at the moment of switching, it will smash to pieces, even wood, even bronze. Well, or "lick" sad
  3. +8
    April 27 2025 06: 05
    I respect people who can work not only with their heads, but also with their hands!
    Cool boat, I read the article with interest.
  4. +8
    April 27 2025 06: 56
    "Hieron wanted
    Make a new crown.
    He measured out the gold strictly.
    I took neither a little nor a lot,
    Just the right amount.
    I gave the jeweler an order.

    A month later, Hiero
    The jeweler brought the crown.
    Hieron took the crown,
    Looked around from all sides.
    Sparkles with pure gold...
    But anything can happen,
    And add silver
    You can get to gold cunningly,
    And even worse - copper
    (If you don't have a conscience)..."
    I remembered a poem about Archimedes)) and another Hieron
  5. +8
    April 27 2025 08: 15
    Good morning everybody! )))
    No, guys, as you wish, I didn’t understand the principle of operation, I need a drawing!
    Well, here is a ball, and water is boiling in it. Where does the steam go? I don't see it! Where is that which should rotate under its influence? Here in the drawing by Angus McBride everything is clear.
    Come on, explain!
    1. +7
      April 27 2025 08: 43
      Quote: depressant
      Good morning everybody! )))
      No, guys, as you wish, I didn’t understand the principle of operation, I need a drawing!
      Well, here is a ball, and water is boiling in it. Where does the steam go? I don't see it! Where is that which should rotate under its influence? Here in the drawing by Angus McBride everything is clear.
      Come on, explain!
      1. +4
        April 27 2025 08: 54
        Come on, explain!

        The ball is spinning? And the steam outlet pipes that rotate it? But won't they put out the fire under the ball?
        And the rod on which the gears are mounted is attached rigidly to the ball and rotates with it. The gears are coupled to a large toothed wheel. They rotate it. What a bore I am.
        And where does the transmission from the big wheel go? Or is it the paddle wheel?
        1. +7
          April 27 2025 09: 37
          Everything is clear. Boiler pipes transmission wheels water salt to taste love
        2. +2
          April 27 2025 10: 16
          Quote: depressant
          Where does the transmission from the big wheel go?

          The large gear is located on the paddle wheel shaft!
          1. +5
            April 27 2025 13: 17
            It was not necessary to use Heron's sphere, a cylinder is better and simpler. Moreover, rotation can occur both in the vertical and horizontal planes. I would also install a flywheel on the axis of rotation. This would stabilize the speed. However, all this is nothing more than belated wishes to the Author, who, in my opinion, made an excellent model of Heron's hypothetical "steamboat". In my opinion, here we should consider not the efficiency of such a steamboat, because the Author himself honestly writes:
            It is clear that if this were a real ship, it would be possible to find fault with it and find fault with it – and this is not so, and the other is not… so. But it should be considered precisely as an illustration of what we call a “flight of fantasy”, nothing more.

            and the very execution of this model of Heron's hypothetical "steamboat".
            Here the author deserves respect! I don't often praise Shpakovsky - but here there is no other way. The model is of high quality and has a high flight of fantasy!!!
            I will say more: my wife, a physics teacher and school principal before retirement, said that if she were still working, she would be very happy to buy this model of a hypothetical steamship with a Heronian sphere from Shpakovsky as a visual aid for the school physics classroom.
            1. +3
              April 27 2025 14: 54
              Quote: Richard
              better and simpler - cylinder
              In a sphere, the vapor pressure is distributed evenly over the entire surface.
              Quote: Richard
              visual aid for a school physics classroom
              Just instead of firewood, put a laboratory spirit lamp and the visual aid is ready!
              1. +4
                April 27 2025 14: 55
                Just instead of firewood, put a spirit lamp and the visual aid is ready!

                Great comment!!! good
                1. +2
                  April 27 2025 15: 09
                  Just instead of firewood, put a spirit lamp and the visual aid is ready!

                  The idea is good, Michel, but since this model does not have rotating mechanisms and the mechanisms themselves and the heron ball are made of flammable elements, it would be better to install a flickering LED under the boiler to simulate a fireplace.
            2. +2
              April 27 2025 20: 45
              Quote: Richard
              I will say more: my wife, a physics teacher and school principal before retirement, said that if she were still working, she would be very happy to buy this model of a hypothetical steamship with a Heronian sphere from Shpakovsky as a visual aid for the school physics classroom.

              Please convey my gratitude to your esteemed wife and tell her that this model will end up: A - either in our city museum of popular science, or... B - in the physics/history room of school number 6 in Penza. The children will definitely see it. I can't keep it at home...
              1. +2
                April 27 2025 21: 13
                Thank you. I will definitely pass it on.
                By the way, my wife's former colleagues are visiting us today. And the physics teacher has really "fallen for" your model. And he asks your permission to use your photos of this model in his lessons as a visual aid. He even threw together a sample poster. If you don't mind, of course? I kindly ask him to forgive me for the mistake in the initials - his daughter let him use the computer for a couple of minutes and he was in a hurry. If you give your permission, everything will be redone as it should be.
                1. +3
                  April 27 2025 21: 49
                  And the physics teacher just fell in love with your model.
                  When a physics teacher gets stuck on a model like this, he should be sent for re-certification of his qualifications.
                  Good evening, Dima!
                  1. +4
                    April 27 2025 22: 34
                    he should be sent for recertification

                    Good evening, Anton.
                    You're wrong. He's not a bad guy. Children love him. And it's one thing to simply tell about Heron's ball in class, and another to show visually how it could have been used at that time, even if purely hypothetically. This will be interesting for schoolchildren. Here I support both him and Caliber.
                    1. +2
                      April 27 2025 22: 44
                      another is to show clearly how it could have been applied at that time, albeit purely hypothetically.
                      In this case, history teachers must perform collective seppuku at the school assembly.
                      1. +2
                        April 27 2025 22: 50
                        If our NVP teacher was Japanese, I would definitely pass your advice on to him. And with great pleasure. laughing
                      2. +2
                        April 27 2025 22: 58
                        Although one of our Cossack songs has such a verse laughing
                        “…He took the saber, he took it, oh, he flared up
                        And he stabbed himself.
                        That's when my father believed, oh, he believed,
                        What is love in the world? (c)"
                        I'll have to tell the folklorists - let them do more than just sing and dance. A decree has come from St. Petersburg. Whether I want to or not, I have to do it. Yes
                      3. +2
                        April 27 2025 23: 19
                        Two questions arose:
                        1. Is the physics teacher a hereditary Cossack?
                        2. The decree came from St. Petersburg
                        There in your villages they still don’t know that St. Petersburg has been “not a decree” for more than a century? tongue
                      4. +2
                        April 28 2025 00: 13
                        Is the physics teacher a hereditary Cossack?

                        He himself is either from Saratov or Voronezh. He came here on assignment in the late 80s. Now he is ours. His son and grandchildren are already local.
                        There in your villages they still don’t know that St. Petersburg has been “not a decree” for more than a century?

                        It's a decree for us. Yes You'll laugh, but that's what the locals call Pyatigorsk.
                      5. +3
                        April 28 2025 00: 19
                        You'll laugh, but that's what the locals call Pyatigorsk.
                        I won't. Because I've known for a quarter of a century that Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky is called "Piter" in the Far East.
                      6. +2
                        April 27 2025 23: 28
                        “…He took the saber, he took it, oh, he flared up
                        And he stabbed himself.
                        That's when my father believed, oh, he believed,
                        What is love in the world? (c)"

                        I sometimes think that the concept of "rhyme" was invented by Jews to harm the Cossacks. laughing
                      7. +2
                        April 28 2025 00: 18
                        You haven't heard Asian akyns yet. laughing
                      8. +2
                        April 28 2025 00: 30
                        I heard it was normal rap, with some color.
                      9. +2
                        April 27 2025 23: 01
                        I was clearly lucky with my NVP teacher. Especially since I had known him since I was six years old.
                  2. +4
                    April 28 2025 07: 22
                    Quote: 3x3zsave
                    When a physics teacher gets stuck on a model like this, he should be sent for re-certification of his qualifications.

                    Anton! You are wrong.
                2. +2
                  April 28 2025 07: 21
                  Good morning! Of course, you can. I'll be only too happy. Let him take it and use whatever he wants. If you were closer, I would sell him this ship for a purely symbolic price. But sending such a fragile thing by mail is simply impossible. Yes, it is durable, all on superglue. But not for our mail, alas.
    2. +5
      April 27 2025 09: 02
      Where does the steam go?
      Blow the whistle!
      Good morning, Lyudmila Yakovlevna!
      1. +3
        April 27 2025 09: 35
        Good morning

        Good morning Anton!
        It's good when the morning starts with you!
        Below I explain why wassat )))
    3. +6
      April 27 2025 09: 04
      Here in Angus McBride's drawing everything is clear.
      In McBride's drawing, two steamed carcasses are missing: the stoker and the helmsman.
      1. +4
        April 27 2025 09: 21
        two steamed carcasses

        I laughed so hard I fell off my chair!!
        .... for this you, Anton! good )))
        I haven't had this much fun in a long time and I'm still laughing with intermittent fits of laughter!
        And it all started out as seriously as possible)))
        And, can you imagine, they removed the Chmok's that you were entitled to! Well, wow!
        1. +6
          April 27 2025 09: 32
          Few people know.
          In fact, Heron invented the Finnish sauna. Central heating. Moonshine still. But it turned out as it turned out.
          1. +3
            April 27 2025 09: 44
            Moonshine still.
            I molded it,
            From aeolepil,
            And then what happened?
            I drank it away with the muses.
            1. +3
              April 27 2025 09: 59
              Steamboat with aeolepil
              Let's process it with a chisel -
              The device turned out
              A hundred times more beautiful
              drinks
              1. +2
                April 27 2025 10: 34
                The device turned out

                Mayakovsky!!!... No, take something better - Chukovsky and Marshak in one person!
                good wassat drinks ))))
                1. Fat
                  +2
                  April 27 2025 14: 57
                  "True, there is also Kolka Aseev - he can.
                  "His grip is mine!" (C) laughing
                  Welcome.
                  1. +1
                    April 27 2025 15: 15
                    Welcome.

                    Who is this?
                    I'm here! )))
                    I don't know about the rest. Apparently, they went to sculpt aeolepiles.
                    Andrey Borisovich, you wrote a poem about the triumph of the aeoles in modern life.
                    There's a hint here - a sauna and a moonshine still )))
                    Glory to Heron!
                    1. Fat
                      +2
                      April 27 2025 15: 18
                      Of course, you personally, Lyudmila Yakovlevna love
                      And all the participants in a fun discussion.
              2. +5
                April 27 2025 14: 44
                To the ship with the aeolepilus
                We bought a cruise with my sweetheart
                the guide strictly forbade it
                visit aeolepil
                But my darling was arrogant
                They say we have "full exclusive"
                I went there to have a look
                ....The whole household was scalded laughing
                1. +2
                  April 27 2025 15: 10
                  The whole household was scalded

                  Dmitry Vasilievich, you too have been counted! There is no counting the fiery poets!
                  good drinks wassat )))
                  Look at this aeolepilus,
                  He awakened the poet's gift in everyone!
                  And so from century to century
                  Aeo-splendid verse
                  A man writes...
                  All that's left is to wait for Sergei Vladimirovich with his sharply critical gaze, but here he is, not here. He's probably digging the garden )))
                  1. +5
                    April 28 2025 07: 49
                    My darling invited me
                    View the aeolepilus.
                    His car is good -
                    Let's be honest - I was surprised!
                    Oh my!
                    We are all cataphracts!
                    They put the kids to bed,
                    Well, they added some fuel to the fire.
                    He puffs, he spins,
                    He tries until the morning!
                    Eshkina Matryoshka -
                    I got burned a little!
                    My dear invited me again
                    View the aeolepilus.
                    I will tell Heron:
                    "Go to Acheron!" laughing
                    1. +3
                      April 28 2025 08: 28
                      "Go to Acheron!"


                      Vanechka, you have surpassed everyone!
                      good drinks hi )))
                      1. +4
                        April 28 2025 08: 34
                        Quote: depressant
                        "Go to Acheron!"


                        Vanechka, you have surpassed everyone!
                        good drinks hi )))

                        The muse bit me, but I haven't gotten vaccinated yet love
            2. +3
              April 27 2025 10: 32
              I molded it,
              From aeolepil

              A prolonged ovation, interrupted only by the groans of spectators who had fallen from their seats and the creaking of their bones as they tried to take their place, as well as the groans of those who had been bruised!
              Those who managed to keep their balance let out hysterical cries of "Bravo!!!"
              In short, a masterpiece of design thought! good drinks wassat ))))
              1. +3
                April 27 2025 15: 26
                In short, a masterpiece of design thought! wassat

                A completely unnecessary irony. For a model of how the hypothetical "steamboat" of Heron could look from the point of view of the Author, this is a very good execution. Moreover, making any model from scratch, even such a fantastic one, requires not only skilled hands but also a design mindset.
                1. +2
                  April 27 2025 15: 38
                  Completely unnecessary irony

                  I'm ashamed and crawl away into the shadows!
                  I'll go and cry over the ghost of the aeolepil, since I'm not allowed to touch it in reality crying )))
          2. +2
            April 27 2025 18: 50
            Quote: Tlauicol
            Alcohol mashine
            The moonshine still was invented by the Arabs...
            1. +1
              April 27 2025 18: 52
              Quote: Luminman
              Quote: Tlauicol
              Alcohol mashine
              The moonshine still was invented by the Arabs...

              I didn't say "invented"
              1. +2
                April 27 2025 18: 55
                Quote: Tlauicol
                I didn't say "invented"
                How should I understand this?
                Actually Heron invented Finnish sauna. Central heating. Moonshine still
                1. +2
                  April 27 2025 18: 58
                  Quote: Luminman
                  Quote: Tlauicol
                  I didn't say "invented"
                  How should I understand this?
                  Actually Heron invented Finnish sauna. Central heating. Moonshine still

                  Shovel
        2. +2
          April 27 2025 09: 48
          The day has barely begun,
          My life was not lived in vain!
          Not for fun,
          Only crawl for!
    4. +3
      April 27 2025 10: 14
      Quote: depressant
      There is a ball and water is boiling in it.

      The water boils not in the ball, but in the boiler underneath it. Steam goes into the ball and comes out of the L-shaped pipes.
      1. +2
        April 27 2025 10: 25
        Steam goes into the ball

        Vyacheslav Olegovich, how does steam get into the ball if the ball is rotating?)))
        1. +2
          April 27 2025 10: 31
          Quote: depressant
          Steam goes into the ball

          Vyacheslav Olegovich, how does steam get into the ball if the ball is rotating?)))

          The L-shaped posts on which it is fixed (I have one of these!) are pipes with seals. Steam from the boiler goes through them into the ball!
          1. +1
            April 27 2025 10: 38
            Through them, steam from the boiler goes into the ball!

            Well, it finally got through!
            Please forgive me and don't hurt me! love ))))
            1. +1
              April 27 2025 10: 39
              Quote: depressant
              Well, it finally got through!

              Oh, come on, Lyudmila Yakovlevna. For what? It doesn't always happen, you'll figure it out right away. It's a familiar story...
          2. +1
            April 27 2025 21: 40
            these are pipes with seals
            I was wondering what they propose to make the seals from?
            1. +2
              April 28 2025 07: 25
              Quote: 3x3zsave
              seals?

              Mountain flax + graphite
  6. The comment was deleted.
  7. + 12
    April 27 2025 09: 04
    At school, I had fun with various technical crafts. One of them was a steam boat - Dreadnought (why bother with trifles!). A tank of about 150-200 ml was soldered from a tin can. A curved tube was soldered to the tank, the lower end of which came out below the waterline of a piece of board representing a model of Dreadnought. The tank was installed on some kind of brazier to prevent water from flooding it and the wind from blowing it away. Water was poured into the tank, and a tablet of dry fuel was placed under it. When the water boiled, the steam from the tube reacted with the surrounding water and created a reactive force. I would not say that it was a speedboat, but the Dreadnought was quite good at moving around the pond. An interesting point. When the water boiled away, a vacuum was created in the tank and it sucked in water itself. The design was absolutely indifferent to salt and other turbidity dissolved in the water. When I had already finished school, my younger brother found the Dreadnought. Naturally, he went to test it in the same pond. By this time, the tank was almost rusty, and when the Dreadnought came out onto the gray pond, the tank exploded spectacularly. It was the heroic death of the Dreadnought, to the delight of the boys gawking at this spectacle.
    This design is much simpler than Heron's. It could have been implemented at that time without problems. Only two unclear issues: scalability and efficiency.
    1. +3
      April 27 2025 09: 31
      This design is much simpler than Heron's.

      Great, Victor! good drinks )))
      This is clear to me!
      And before my eyes were the scalded carcasses of the stoker and the helmsman!
      Anton set the trend for the whole day wassat )))
    2. +4
      April 27 2025 10: 19
      Quote: Old electrician
      An interesting point: When the water boiled away, a vacuum was created in the tank and it sucked the water into itself.

      I had the same boat, only with a refrigerator coil. "Starting water" was poured in with a spritzer. And then the coil itself sucked in portions of water and evaporated them.
      1. +8
        April 27 2025 10: 31
        I had the same boat, only with a refrigerator coil. "Starting water" was poured in with a spritzer. And then the coil itself sucked in portions of water and evaporated them.

        The correct name is "steam-pulse" propulsion.
        On YouTube you can find it by name - "pop-pop boat"
        Somewhere I came across calculations on the use of such a propulsion system on real ships.
  8. +2
    April 27 2025 10: 14
    This means that our task is to “reduce fantasy” but “add realism.”
    A good problem, it's just a pity that the author was unable to solve it, but merely replaced other people's fantastic ideas with his own

    Although, of course, everything needs to be calculated here. But we will not do this, but simply assume that this system will be operational.
    I also recommend that the author assume that coal and fresh water will periodically fall from the sky during the voyage.
    But it is even better to immediately assume that this engine will work with an automatically renewable amount of steam (arising by magic) and will not require the supply of heat - this will significantly simplify the construction of an imaginary steamship.
    1. 0
      April 27 2025 10: 33
      Quote: Lewww
      coal and fresh water

      All this can be stored, right? And the fuel is not coal, but firewood. And this engine does not work constantly, but only during a naval battle. You need to read the article more carefully.
      1. +3
        April 27 2025 10: 39
        All this can be stored, right?
        Why stock up on anything in an alternate universe where its own alternate laws apply? laughing
        And in our universe, this engine will have an efficiency of about 1% and the power it develops will only be enough to overcome the friction in its own bearings.
        And you make him turn the gears laughing

        I look forward to your next article where you will describe your own design scheme of a perpetual motion machine.
        However, apparently in your alternative universe the force of water resistance = 0, and there is no friction in the gears
        1. -1
          April 27 2025 10: 42
          Quote: Lewww

          I look forward to your next article where you will describe your own design scheme of a perpetual motion machine.

          Your humor is dumb, DUMBLER. But you will get an article about Leonardo da Vinci's tank. And there will be his device, which is absolutely NOT FUNCTIONABLE. And yet everyone admires his genius. And the genius did not see an elementary thing in the design of his "tank". And yet. He also made the gears turn... But he can, right?
          1. +4
            April 27 2025 10: 50
            Your sense of humor is stupid, STUPID.
            Well, it is what it is. But I am constantly working on it. laughing
            But he can, right?
            Well, yes, he can - he deserves it.
            What are you personally famous for, what scientific and technical invention can you boast of?
            1. 0
              April 27 2025 11: 02
              Quote: Lewww
              What are you personally famous for, what scientific and technical invention can you boast of?

              See the Internet. It would take too long to list them here...and a lot has already been written about them over the last ten years...
            2. +5
              April 27 2025 11: 18
              What are you personally famous for, what scientific and technical invention can you boast of?

              The author's real working one is a soap dish used as a "brush driver" body.
              The rest are either projects or "cargo cult". The author has a complete rejection of even primary technical calculations, and from this - a complete misunderstanding of the essence of technical invention. Although the fantasy works very well, we must give it credit.
              1. +3
                April 27 2025 16: 18
                The author has a complete rejection of even primary technical calculations.
                I beg you - why do you need technical calculations when composing fairy tales? laughing
              2. +3
                April 27 2025 20: 37
                Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
                Of the author's actual working ones

                I once presented here my author's certificates for industrial designs and a diploma for developing a visual aid for schools and universities... but that was a long time ago...
          2. +3
            April 27 2025 11: 24
            And yet everyone admires his genius.

            Leonardo's genius is admired because he was able to actually come up with new concepts for many things. And the fact that he was unable to embody "in metal" is not his fault, but his misfortune. Well, there were no necessary technologies then - they were not mature enough.
            Now all technologies are available and the fact that the author does not know how to use them is not his problem, but his fault. After all, it is possible to make elementary calculations at the level of draft design.
            Leonardo tried, but Shpakovsky didn’t.
            1. +5
              April 27 2025 16: 54
              Leonardo tried, but Shpakovsky didn’t.

              Different tasks. Leonardo invented something new, and Vyacheslav Olegovich popularizes the old. For example, I heard about Heron's turbine. And now I know how it works and what modern technologies are based on Heron's ideas.
            2. +2
              April 27 2025 20: 11
              Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
              and Shpakovsky - no.

              This is Heron - no. Although he could have... He was a great mathematician, not like me.
          3. +5
            April 27 2025 12: 59
            And there will be his device, which is absolutely NOT WORKABLE. And yet everyone admires his genius.
            His engineering proposals are admired by people who have no critical thinking at all. He was a genius artist. But everything else (except the tank - also the parachute) is completely inoperative. Just drawings for nothing to do. Leonardo was hyped up in the 19th century, when a great universal scientist of antiquity was needed to unify Italy, so a genius artist was appointed to this position.
            1. +5
              April 27 2025 14: 07
              And everything else (except the tank - also the parachute) is completely inoperative. Just drawings for nothing to do.

              Well, well. Draw conceptually new things for fun. It won't work - the human brain of the overwhelming majority is incapable of this in principle. And attempts to implement such diverse ideas on an authentic technological level are generally possible only for geniuses.
              And Leonardo has fully functional designs for the technological level of his era. So, of course, he was an extraordinary engineer for his era. So, he is a genius - deservedly so. But he was ahead of his time, and at that time witches were still burned at the stake and people believed in a flat earth.
              1. +3
                April 27 2025 17: 11
                And Leonardo has fully functional designs for the technological level of his era.
                And from this point on, more details, please.
                1. 0
                  April 27 2025 17: 26
                  And from this point on, more details, please.

                  Come on. Don't know how to google? Learn - it's useful.
                  A simple image query returns a whole bunch of absolutely functional designs - and we're not talking about things that were unconventional for those times - parachutes and helicopters. It's clear - first you need to learn how to read blueprints.
                  1. +1
                    April 27 2025 17: 30
                    So I have to look for this evidence myself, because my opponent is too lazy? And most likely, there is nothing to present. laughing
                    1. +1
                      April 27 2025 17: 34
                      So I have to look for this evidence myself, because my opponent is too lazy? And most likely, there is nothing to present.

                      Ignorance of such obvious facts speaks of the futility of any evidence. It is not necessary to prove that water is wet in fact. The Dunning-Kruger law confirms this.
                      Is it hard to just type into Google "Leonardo da Vinci drawings"?
                    2. +2
                      April 27 2025 17: 38
                      And everything else (except the tank - also the parachute) is completely inoperative.

                      You put forward this postulate - now prove it
                      So I have to look for this evidence myself, because my opponent is too lazy? And most likely, there is nothing to present.
                    3. +1
                      April 27 2025 17: 59
                      For those who don't know how to google.
                      Here is the very first picture for the request "Leonardo da Vinci's drawings" - drawings of easel crossbows - everything is fully functional.
                      1. +2
                        April 27 2025 18: 20
                        What's surprising about that? He suggested increasing the crossbow by 20 times. (Naturally, no one started doing such nonsense) So it had been known for almost 2000 years.
                      2. +1
                        April 27 2025 18: 27
                        And was this in demand by anyone?
                      3. +2
                        April 27 2025 18: 38
                        And was this in demand by anyone?

                        Do you recognize the quadcopter? Leonardo's concept. Yes, it was impossible to make it at that technological level. Or rather, it was possible, but it wouldn't fly. But now it worked. That's the genius.
                      4. +3
                        April 27 2025 18: 56
                        In his, Leonardo's, time it was possible to invent the open-hearth furnace, the steam hammer, the breech-loading rifle with a paper cartridge, the telescope, porcelain production, pasteurization, and, finally, the smallpox vaccination.
                        He didn't invent anything useful.
                      5. +3
                        April 27 2025 20: 14
                        Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
                        everything is fully functional

                        Such diagrams were included in books before him...
            2. +2
              April 27 2025 20: 12
              Quote: Aviator_
              So the brilliant artist was appointed to this position.

              Here I completely agree with you!
          4. +2
            April 27 2025 16: 49
            But you will get an article about Leonardo da Vinci's tank. And there will be his device, which is absolutely NOT WORKABLE.

            You are wrong. The Americans had a series of films about the reconstruction of Leonardo's projects. They made a tank, invited bodybuilders to turn the handles and drove it a bit and shot. So, they confirmed its functionality. True, it couldn't turn and didn't drive for long - its strength ran out, but it worked!!!!
            1. +2
              April 27 2025 18: 07
              Here I found it - the Da Vinci Apparatus series - in episode 1 they make a tank -
              [media = https: //vk.com/video-143460619_456241728]
            2. +5
              April 27 2025 19: 03
              The benefits of such a tank are no more than those of Heron's steamship. The Taborites are crying patstal
            3. +4
              April 27 2025 20: 33
              Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
              So, the functionality has been confirmed.

              Look at HIS diagram. According to it, the wheels will spin in opposite directions.
      2. +3
        April 27 2025 16: 51
        And the fuel is not coal, but wood

        This is much worse - the calorific value of coal is several times higher than that of firewood, so you need to take more firewood than coal.
        1. +2
          April 27 2025 20: 16
          Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
          so you need to take more firewood than coal.

          I know that. But in Ancient Egypt (and Rome) they didn't heat with coal, hard coal. They used only firewood and charcoal.
    2. +4
      April 27 2025 10: 39
      But it is even better to immediately assume that this engine will work with an automatically renewable amount of steam (arising by magic) and will not require the supply of heat - this will significantly simplify the construction of an imaginary steamship.

      That's right - "if you're going to dream, then dream."
      But in reality, either the size of the boiler will exceed the size of the vessel, or it will sink under the weight of the firewood - a turbine is a very uneconomical thing, especially one like this.
      With the design given by the author, this "ship" will not even move from its place - the steam will quickly run out.
      1. +5
        April 27 2025 11: 08
        With the design given by the author, this "ship" will not even move from its place - the steam will quickly run out.
        in the author's alternative universe it will shift, in it the force of water resistance = 0 laughing
      2. The comment was deleted.
  9. +4
    April 27 2025 10: 52
    IMHO. The ancients were not fools.
    Water and windmills were already known. The Romans certainly did.

    So how to effectively use steam - they would have guessed for sure. Sails, kilns, etc. - everything is before our eyes. The finds show that they knew how to make complex things.
    And not just a ball with valves.
    1. +5
      April 27 2025 12: 06
      The ancients were not fools.

      A favorite slogan of the chronologists.
      Fools or not, but all fantasies can only come true if there are appropriate technologies. And the ancients didn't have them - technologies. Otherwise, only a "cargo cult" helps.
      1. +2
        April 27 2025 18: 39
        Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
        all fantasies can be realized only with the appropriate technologies. But the ancients did not have them - technologies
        Rather, sufficient knowledge has not yet been accumulated. And it is this knowledge that gives birth to technologies...
        1. +4
          April 27 2025 18: 43
          Rather, sufficient knowledge has not yet been accumulated. And it gives birth to technologies...

          Well, it's like the birthright of the chicken and the egg. A lot of knowledge has also been born from technologies. As an example, the technology of Damascus has been known for a very long time, and scientific knowledge on it is 100-150 years old.
          1. +3
            April 27 2025 18: 47
            Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
            A lot of knowledge was born from technology too
            Agreed. As in the case of the above Laval nozzle и jet propulsion, the idea of ​​which was born in people's minds long before Laval and Newton provided a theoretical basis for them...
      2. +1
        April 27 2025 20: 31
        Quote: Ivan Ivanych Ivanov
        But the ancients didn’t have these technologies.

        In the tomb of Pharaoh Djoser, many broken and whole vessels with a narrow neck made of alabaster were found. There is an image on the walls of how such vessels are drilled manually. And it is clear how the neck is drilled. But how did they drill the body of the jug through a narrow neck? We do not have such technology. But the Egyptians did!
      3. +2
        April 27 2025 20: 44
        There was no powerful knowledge, yes.
        But that a cylindrical tank is more technologically advanced in production than a round one - they would probably have figured out. (Ancient samovars, saucepans, teapots, basins, potbelly stoves are usually cylindrical, not round). And it would have been possible to assemble 1-2 items for display, for fun.

        According to the descriptions, individual products that work on water and wind were made quite successfully
    2. +3
      April 27 2025 13: 52
      Economy + oak heads = 100500 great ideas screwed up. And ancient times are no exception.
      The same comrade Kulibin lived not at all in ancient times and already witnessed the Iron Age and metalworking, however, his proposals for self-propelled carriages or chain ferries that pull themselves against the current were sent to the forest time after time, because up to a certain moment a donkey + a dude were much more attractive to the ancient (and not so) bourgeois. It's not that they didn't like all these bright ideas and they were all obscurantists - but they definitely didn't want to pay for a long creative search in the dark that precedes a stable result.
      One can see quite a logical thing in this, if one thinks from the point of view of "game theory". It was later, when the bourgeoisie began to turn over large capitals, that they could afford the innovation race - but before that moment science itself firstly appeared, and secondly the scientific approach was born, calculations of strengths and capacities, instead of these endless experiments "by eye".

      Here the story with the "first Russian tank" is very indicative, I mean, of course, the ever-memorable "Tsar Tank", which happened in the 20th century, by the way. When calculations existed, there was already physics and materials science and wagons of scientists. But in fact, they built a huge piece of crap, absolutely unsuitable for real combat. In this regard, I would say that the ancients were really "The ancients were not fools" - they would not have gotten involved in such nonsense, preferring stability.
      1. +2
        April 27 2025 17: 07
        in fact, they built a huge piece of crap that is absolutely unsuitable for real combat

        I remember that the Germans built the same monstrous "thing")))
        And how right you are!
        Who was the first to attempt to enter outer space? Icarus!
        A dream and a constructive idea are always ahead of time. And if it weren't for this, we would be flying into space.
  10. +5
    April 27 2025 11: 39
    Ancient ships actually rammed each other.
    It is often written about, but ramming a wooden ship is a bad idea. Even on an armoured ship it is better not to do it.
  11. +3
    April 27 2025 12: 42
    It is clear that if this were a real ship, it would be possible to find fault with it and find fault with it – and this is not so, and the other is not… so. But it should be considered precisely as an illustration of what we call a “flight of fantasy”, nothing more. Well, and for children, when they study Greek culture as part of a school textbook and get acquainted with Archimedes, it would not hurt at all to also see Heron’s aeolipile and even fantasize on the topic: “And what could his ship actually look like if it had been built?”
    That's how, with the help of beautiful models, they sell children all sorts of fantasies about antiquity, Archimedes and Herones. And then from these children, who have accepted the author's fantasies as reality, new generations of dreamers grow up.
    1. +1
      April 27 2025 20: 25
      Quote: Seal
      new generations of dreamers are growing up.

      Exactly! V.I. Lenin considered fantasy to be a quality of the greatest value, but he was by no means!
  12. +3
    April 27 2025 12: 45
    Quote: Max1995
    IMHO. The ancients were not fools.
    The information that the ancients did not have was very extensive.
    Mark Twain
  13. +2
    April 27 2025 13: 20
    Whatever the child amuses himself with, as long as he doesn't shoot up...
  14. +5
    April 27 2025 13: 36
    Once again I am thrilled by your models, Vyacheslav! Beautiful! And the article is interesting.
    As for the idea itself - the efficiency of such a propulsion system would be low because it would not provide for high steam pressure due to design features and due to the materials chosen and the methods of their processing available in that era. Also, the hydrodynamic resistance of the ships of that time left much to be desired and this, given the rather low power available to the Heron sphere with realistic dimensions of its execution, would hardly have given such a vessel a speed worth noting, a competitive advantage relative to a sail + rowers would hardly have taken place at all because your model would still have a sail and rowers and this machine and wheels and as a result, the hydrodynamic resistance would be even worse than that of a conventional ship, despite the fact that the load would be greater and as a result, the profit from the machine with all its shortcomings would be even less.

    I also have a lot of skepticism about paddle wheels, they somehow didn't catch on in military affairs and, as far as I know, weren't used en masse (but here I won't claim that there weren't any attempts) because the efficiency of a paddle wheel is such - very much energy is wasted and in empty directions, and improving this design at the level of materials available at that time would hardly have given something stable and repairable quickly. Most likely they would have abandoned it at the very beginning. If we were to think about a propeller - I would probably be inclined to derivatives of the Archimedes screw because it is much more compact, it is possible to organize high rotation speeds, it is not so vulnerable in combat conditions, etc.
    But one way or another, such a vessel would have to be really huge and very expensive, and the ability of an engine of such a design to effectively pull it makes me quite skeptical.
  15. +6
    April 27 2025 17: 17
    Two main achievements of Vyacheslav Olegovich’s article.
    1. Once again I was amazed by his skill in making models.
    2. I was forced to turn to the technical creativity of Heron of Alexandria and fell into a state of shock!
    I quote:
    He studied geometry, mechanics, hydrostatics, optics. He wrote monumental works, naturally relying on the knowledge of his predecessors (Archimedes, Euclid): "Metrics", "Pneumatics", "Automatopoetics", "Mechanics", "Catoptrics" (the science of mirrors), "On Automata", "Bellopoetics" (the structure of military throwing machines), etc.

    He was the first to invent automatic doors, an automatic puppet theater, a vending machine, a steam turbine, automatic scenery, a device for measuring the length of roads (an odometer). He was the first programmer - he invented a programmable device (a shaft with pins with a rope wound around it).

    Many of his works were irretrievably lost due to a fire in the Alexandria Library, but those that have come down to us have been preserved thanks to Arabic manuscripts.

    What people they were!
  16. +3
    April 27 2025 20: 24
    [quote=depressant]What people they were!
    The first is nice! The second was precisely the goal. Through interest in the beautiful and original - to learning and comprehending the new, by the way, raising dreamers is also a very important task. Someone named V.I. Lenin considered fantasy to be a quality of the greatest value.
  17. +1
    April 27 2025 20: 39
    Quote: kalibr
    Exactly! V.I. Lenin considered fantasy to be a quality of the greatest value, but he was by no means!
    Are you talking about this?
    Here is an illustration for you. Then about the fact that when I spoke about the most important thing, Preobrazhensky and Osinsky proved it, and Larin proved it especially. Look what he did. He accused me and joked and laughed very cheerfully.

    He does this magnificently, this is his strong point. If this strong point of Comrade Larin were not connected with the fact that he has to apply it to state work, Comrade Larin would be of a thousand times greater use to the republic, because he is a very capable person and has a great imagination. This ability is extremely valuable. It is in vain that they think that only a poet needs it. This is a stupid prejudice! It is needed even in mathematics, even the discovery of differential and integral calculus would have been impossible without imagination. Imagination is a quality of the greatest value, but Comrade Larin has a small excess of it. For example, I would say that if Larin’s entire reserve of imagination were divided equally among the entire number of members of the RCP, then it would turn out very well. (Laughter, applause.) But until we can carry out this operation, until then state, economic, planning, and business affairs cannot be entrusted to Larin; it would have been the same as in the old Supreme Council of the National Economy, when Rykov had not yet recovered, but worked and signed "Yu. Larin" on behalf of the entire Supreme Council of the National Economy; it was bad not because Comrade Larin showed only his worst qualities, but on the contrary, his best abilities, because no one doubts his devotion and knowledge of the matter, and yet the matter was set up incorrectly!

    I believe that the last name Larin can be easily replaced with the nickname Kolibr.
    Here is an illustration. Look at what he did. He accused me and joked and laughed very cheerfully. He does it magnificently, this is his strong point. If this strong point of Comrade Kalibr were not connected with the fact that he has to apply it to his work, Comrade Kalibr would be a thousand times more useful, because he is a very capable person and has a great imagination. This ability is extremely valuable. It is in vain that they think that only a poet needs it. This is a stupid prejudice! Even in mathematics it is needed, even the discovery of differential and integral calculus would have been impossible without imagination. Imagination is a quality of the greatest value, but Comrade Kalibr has a small surplus of it. For example, I would say that if Kalibr’s entire stock of imagination were divided equally among the entire number of VO authors who consider themselves historians, then it would turn out very well. (Laughter, applause.)
    hi
  18. +2
    April 27 2025 21: 00
    Quote: depressant
    Many of his works were irretrievably lost due to a fire in the Alexandria Library, but those that have come down to us have been preserved thanks to Arabic manuscripts.
    And how did these "works" migrate into Arabic manuscripts, if according to historians, when Amr ibn al-As conquered Alexandria, a Christian theologian named John Philoponus showed him the library, and Amr ibn al-As wrote a letter to the Caliph Umar asking what to do with it now? The Caliph is said to have replied: "If these books do not contradict the Koran, they are of no use to us, and if they do, they are harmful to us." Amr ibn al-As eventually gave the library's manuscripts to the Alexandrian baths to heat the furnaces, but it was only six months later that the last manuscript was burned - such was the enormous number of books the library contained.
    However, according to other data from the same historians (or maybe from others, but still historians) the Alexandria library was destroyed long before the arrival of the Arab Muslims in Egypt, and they cite the works of such "authoritative historians" as Al-Baladuri, Ibn al-Athir and Ibn Khaldun. Thus, the "works" "Futuh al-Buldan" (author al-Baladuri), "Tarikh al-Yakubi", "Tarikh Abi Hanifa" and others contain some details of the conquest of Alexandria, but the Alexandria library is not mentioned in them in a word. Why? Because it no longer existed by the time the Arabs came to Egypt. The Hellenic heresy was burned by Christian fanatics, and Hypatia of Alexandria, a Neoplatonic philosopher of late antiquity, mathematician, astronomer and mechanic, daughter of the astronomer and mathematician Theon of Alexandria, wife of the Neoplatonist Isidore, was torn to pieces by these fanatics with shells.
  19. +2
    April 28 2025 00: 42
    Wow! Thanks for the creative implementation)) I'll add: Heron could have thought of using direct jet thrust. It would have been of little use, though. But it would have been beautiful! And he could have even thought of a propeller. Or a drive for oars from his devil machine
  20. 0
    April 28 2025 18: 28
    Book (ancient roman navy) The Roman Navy Ships, Men Warfare 380 BC AD 475 by Michael Paul Pitassi https://dropmefiles.com/bHTvv The link will expire in 6 days.
    Information for those who really want to read, but have big problems with English. Google translation technology has improved significantly, below is an unedited fragment of the translation of the first paragraph of the introduction of The Roman Navy
    THE ROMAN NAVY, or more accurately the naval forces of the Roman state, often occupies only a couple of paragraphs in many accounts of the Roman war effort. In fact, for over 800 years it was an integral part of the Roman state’s military forces and became the world’s first “superpower” navy. It was the instrument by which Rome achieved dominance over the Western Mediterranean, which allowed it to expand into the lands around it and establish its empire; it was the navy that allowed the Romans to intervene in and ultimately dominate the Eastern Mediterranean and the lands of the Middle East. It was a naval campaign and a naval battle that established and secured the power of Rome’s first emperor; it was the dominance of the navy that allowed the empire’s commerce and economy to grow and prosper, free from the scourge of piracy and on a scale not seen until the twentieth century. Finally, it was the loss of that dominance that was the single most important factor in the collapse and end of the Western Roman Empire. Cicero's dictum that "The master of the sea must necessarily be the master of the empire" (M. Tullius Cicero, 106–43 BC, Epistolae ad Atticus 10.8.4, existimat enim qui mare teneat eum necesse [esse] rerum potiri) has been borne out in every pan-European war since. At its peak, during the Punic Wars, the navy accounted for a third of the entire Roman military effort, and during the empire it averaged just over a tenth.
  21. 0
    April 29 2025 20: 10
    Quote: kalibr
    In the tomb of Pharaoh Djoser they found many broken and whole ones narrow-necked vessels made of alabaster. There is an image on the walls of how such vessels are drilled manually. And it is clear how the neck is drilled. But how was the body of the jug drilled through a narrow neck? We don't have such technology. And the Egyptians did!
    Again from the series "just to blurt out something". What, have you never done small repair work around the house with your own hands? Well then, before you start smashing the keys, you should at least read a little first about what kind of beast this "alabaster" is, if you've never encountered it before. lol
    Here's how and what kind of crafts are made from alabaster now
    https://rutube.ru/video/91f8a0317595997e877d9f10708000dc/?r=wd
    And here is shown how a cylinder vase is made from alabaster these days.
    https://rutube.ru/video/ba54cc0e6d41f256a91ed8c12038add0/?r=wd
    In the same way, there are now no problems casting a jug from alabaster. hi
    Fantasy is a quality of the greatest value, but Comrade Caliber has a small surplus of it. For example, I would say that if the entire stock of Caliber's fantasy were divided equally among the entire number of VO authors who consider themselves historians, then it would turn out very well. (Laughter, applause.)
    laughing laughing laughing
  22. +1
    April 30 2025 10: 49
    Quote: Seal
    And here is shown how a cylinder vase is made from alabaster these days.
    Well, you can still make a cylinder vase, it will last for some time if you don’t drop it often. But what’s the point of making an alabaster jug ​​or other vessel with a narrow neck? After all, alabaster is just a subspecies of gypsum, a type of natural stone with the addition of minerals, a semi-aqueous composition of CaSO4•0,5H2O. The narrow spout (narrow neck) will break off after the first fall of the jug (vessel). What’s the point?
  23. 0
    April 30 2025 18: 02
    Quote: Minrep
    Well, you can still make a cylinder vase, it will last for some time if you don’t drop it often. But what’s the point of making an alabaster jug ​​or other vessel with a narrow neck? After all, alabaster is just a subspecies of gypsum, a type of natural stone with the addition of minerals, a semi-aqueous composition of CaSO4•0,5H2O. The narrow spout (narrow neck) will break off after the first fall of the jug (vessel). What’s the point?
    Is this a question for me? What does it have to do with me? This is Vyacheslav Shpakovsky (Caliber) who fantasized about a vessel with a narrow neck made of alabaster, the manufacturing technology of which is supposedly lost. hi
  24. 0
    19 October 2025 20: 06
    Shpakovsky is an "engineer"!! My God... I couldn't even expect that))
    No, a ship with Heron's turbine couldn't have been like that. It couldn't have been anything at all. The construction of a full-scale turbine in Greece during Heron's time couldn't have been done in principle. Just as the Antikythera Mechanism couldn't have existed there, which is, of course, a low-grade fraud, and for precisely the same reason.
    Greek technology couldn't reach the required heights with the dactyl—that is, the finger—as its smallest unit of measurement. This was the maximum precision the Greeks achieved in everything they made. So, any seal, for example, or any bearing, was manufactured so that the minimum tolerance, whether the finger was larger or smaller, was somewhere between 5 and 8 cm. Can you imagine how a turbine shaft would wobble in such bearings?
    3500 rpm? At that speed, even at a third of it (and the massive shaft and impeller couldn't be stabilized at low speeds—that's the nature of steam turbines—either the speed is high or the impeller is frozen) the entire structure would have been blown to pieces, along with the ship and crew.
    A steam engine, quite massive, could have existed there. A turbine? No way. Hmm. Shpakovsky is just as much of an "engineer" as he is a "gunsmith." Horrible...