Military Review

British special forces want 7,62 mm

34
The British special unit SAS is updating its arsenal and pays special attention to the SCAR-H assault rifle.



In the SAS report, it is indicated that in clashes with the Taliban, the enemy often uses weapon chambered for caliber 7,62х39 mm and 7,62х54 mm, which, according to British experts, gives rebels an advantage in shootouts.

SAS insists that it is necessary to pursue a policy of "shooting to kill" and for this it is necessary to adopt the SCAR-H assault rifle for the cartridge of 7,62 NATO.

Former British commander, and now acting British parliamentarian Patrick Mercer told the Daily Mail, “The 7,62 mm cartridge is great, and the 5,56 mm cartridge cannot compare with it in stopping action and, in the opinion of the soldiers, has not justified itself in Iraq and Afghanistan. I hope that the British military will consider the issue of returning weapons to the infantry chambered for 7,62 mm. This will help save the lives of our soldiers and win battles. ”

The British Department of Defense spoke out in defense of the 5,56 mm cartridge, stating that this cartridge was widely used by the British military and showed its high efficiency, and for firing at long distances, troops can use machine guns and sniper rifles.

Another advantage of the currently used SA80 and C8 assault rifles (the Canadian version of the M16) is the 30 cartridge magazine as opposed to the SCAR-H magazine on 20 cartridges.

It is likely that the change associated with the replacement of small arms will affect only the special forces, and the bulk of the troops will still use the SA80 assault bullpup rifle chambered for 5,56 mm.

British special forces want 7,62 mm

The debate over the advantages and disadvantages of the 5,56 mm and 7,62 mm calibers has been going on for a long time. In particular, the United States took out a naphthalene and returned to service an M14 rifle chambered for 7,62 mm. The rifle has been upgraded and will be designated Mk.14. It is assumed that it will be used by special forces of the Navy and the US Army in Afghanistan.

Recall that the SCAR-H assault rifle is already used by US special forces operating in Afghanistan.
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34 comments
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  1. JonnyT
    JonnyT 28 March 2013 10: 55
    +6
    7,62 in the mountains is what you need!
    1. Arkan
      Arkan 28 March 2013 14: 34
      +3
      Quote: JonnyT
      7,62 in the mountains is what you need!

      In the forest too good .
      1. GHG
        GHG 28 March 2013 20: 38
        0
        Each cartridge has its own cartridge. 7.62 is good everywhere. Universal :-)
      2. GHG
        GHG 28 March 2013 20: 38
        0
        Each cartridge has its own cartridge. 7.62 is good everywhere. Universal :-)
  2. Mr. Truth
    Mr. Truth 28 March 2013 11: 01
    +3
    the militarized 6,5 Grendel with 123 granular (8 g) bullet will calmly replace both 7,62x51 and 5,56x45. Good cartridge.
  3. elmi
    elmi 28 March 2013 11: 10
    10
    We would also like to return to 7,62
  4. queen
    queen 28 March 2013 11: 31
    +9
    Mikhail Kalashnikov was against 5.45, we also need to return to 7.62
    1. PROXOR
      PROXOR 28 March 2013 11: 46
      +3
      Quote: elmi
      We would also like to return to 7,62

      Quote: regin
      Mikhail Kalashnikov was against 5.45, we also need to return to 7.62

      7,62 everyone likes, but there is one significant minus. It is poorly suited for automatic shooting. Due to its power, a huge recoil impulse is superimposed on the whole machine when firing a caliber 7,62 * 39. All the same, it is necessary to completely recycle the machine. Perhaps it makes sense to consider the possibility of building a machine gun on the basis of the Bull Pop system with a moving barrel. Maybe somehow it will reduce the return. Although, again, a large mass of moving parts will also negatively affect accuracy.
      1. Heccrbq
        Heccrbq 28 March 2013 22: 50
        0
        Your koment - amateur!
    2. Mr. Truth
      Mr. Truth 28 March 2013 23: 16
      0
      Quote: regin

      Mikhail Kalashnikov was against 5.45, we also need to return to 7.62

      With all due respect to Mikhail Timofeevich, 5,45 has much more advantages. It is definitely better than 7,62 M43 everywhere, in external, internal and terminal ballistics. Better than a 5,45 cartridge with a 7n10m bullet there is no gross cartridge, neither in 5,56x45 caliber nor in 7,62x39.
      The militarization of the grendel will be a breakthrough. He is known to work well only with trunks longer than 24 inches. If you manage to disperse the 8 gram bullet from the machine at 800 m / s, then we can talk about a real breakthrough.
    3. Mr. Truth
      Mr. Truth 28 March 2013 23: 16
      0
      Quote: regin

      Mikhail Kalashnikov was against 5.45, we also need to return to 7.62

      With all due respect to Mikhail Timofeevich, 5,45 has much more advantages. It is definitely better than 7,62 M43 everywhere, in external, internal and terminal ballistics. Better than a 5,45 cartridge with a 7n10m bullet there is no gross cartridge, neither in 5,56x45 caliber nor in 7,62x39.
      The militarization of the grendel will be a breakthrough. He is known to work well only with trunks longer than 24 inches. If you manage to disperse the 8 gram bullet from the machine at 800 m / s, then we can talk about a real breakthrough.
    4. Mr. Truth
      Mr. Truth 28 March 2013 23: 17
      0
      Quote: regin
      Mikhail Kalashnikov was against 5.45, we also need to return to 7.62


      With all due respect to Mikhail Timofeevich, 5,45 has much more advantages. It is definitely better than 7,62 M43 everywhere, in external, internal and terminal ballistics. Better than a 5,45 cartridge with a 7n10m bullet there is no gross cartridge, neither in 5,56x45 caliber nor in 7,62x39.
      The militarization of the grendel will be a breakthrough. He is known to work well only with trunks longer than 24 inches. If you manage to disperse the 8 gram bullet from the machine at 800 m / s, then we can talk about a real breakthrough
  5. angolaforever
    angolaforever 28 March 2013 11: 54
    +7
    It's time to pay attention to 7,62. And we especially on the new AK with balanced automation. Such a thing and even under 7,62 will be the best assault rifle in the world in all respects.
  6. erased
    erased 28 March 2013 11: 55
    +5
    M-14 has long been upgraded to M-21.
    With AK, contrary to the instruction, one must beat with runaway single, and not bursts. They are only for group targets at a distance of up to 200 or for single targets at a distance of up to 50. The correct use of weapons is the key to success in battle.
    And the problem with the large dispersion of the AK is explained by the mediocre quality of domestic ammunition. Even foreign experts spoke of this. Their accuracy of battle AK caliber 7, 62 is quite satisfied.
    The 6,5 x 38 cartridge of an American company may be good, but as long as it comes to it, a lot of water will leak. And blood.
    1. PROXOR
      PROXOR 28 March 2013 12: 52
      0
      Quote: erased
      M-14 has long been upgraded to M-21. With AK, contrary to the instructions, you must beat with runaway single, and not bursts. They are only for group targets at a distance of up to 200 or for single targets at a distance of up to 50. The correct use of weapons is the key to success in a battle. And the problem with large dispersion of AK is explained by the mediocre quality of domestic ammunition. Even foreign experts spoke of this. Their accuracy of the AK 7, 62 caliber battle was quite satisfactory. The 6,5 x 38 cartridge of the American company may be good, but as long as it comes to it, a lot of water will leak. And blood.

      I agree that the quality of ammunition in our country was not always very good, but not so much. All the same, accuracy is primarily affected by the movement of the machine after the shot, namely, the recoil force of the machine. Having achieved a significant reduction in recoil or stability of the machine, you can increase the accuracy.
  7. Rustiger
    Rustiger 28 March 2013 12: 08
    +3
    UNIVERSAL AMMUNITION.
  8. AlNikolaich
    AlNikolaich 28 March 2013 12: 59
    0
    It has long been assumed that the return of 7,62 will take place. Our specialty has been using AKMS for a long time in hot spots. The meaning is clear! the advantage of the 5,45 in a lower momentum, and a larger wearable stock of ammunition. Minus weak stopping effect, frantic ricochet, weak armor penetration. The Ministry of Internal Affairs generally respects 991, under the patron 9x39. Not without purpose all this. According to the employees who returned from the special business trip, the adobe shed only shoots 7,62x51, 9x39 and more! The rest do not break! So then we will look further!
  9. Bosk
    Bosk 28 March 2013 13: 24
    +1
    In fact, the advantage of 7.62 in mountainous and wooded wounds has been known for a long time, and the tactics of the actions of spirits from medium and long distances speaks for itself ...
  10. Hemi cuda
    Hemi cuda 28 March 2013 13: 36
    +2
    It is a pity no one came up with a cartridge of 2 or 3 mm would be a store for 100 toothpicks, normal cartridges are from 6,5 mm and more everything else is from the evil one.
  11. Suhov
    Suhov 28 March 2013 14: 35
    +5
    SAS insists it is necessary to pursue a policy of "shooting to kill"

    And the words are clever, and the speech is folding, but the meaning does not understand ...
    What policy, other than "shoot to kill", can you pursue with an assault rifle?
    If we assume that the SAS is thus trying to identify the concern for the right to life of citizens of a foreign country (whom they call rebels for some reason), then first let them try to answer the questions: what are they doing there and who called them there?
  12. Olegovi4
    Olegovi4 28 March 2013 15: 25
    0
    which according to British experts gives the rebels an advantage in the shootings.
    here it is choooo.Therefore, apparently they are in Iraq too .... and in Afghanistan. It’s like in a movie - yes, the grenades he has in the wrong system.
  13. Olegovi4
    Olegovi4 28 March 2013 15: 25
    +1
    which according to British experts gives the rebels an advantage in the shootings.
    here it is choooo.Therefore, apparently they are in Iraq too .... and in Afghanistan. It’s like in a movie - yes, the grenades he has in the wrong system.
  14. Olegovi4
    Olegovi4 28 March 2013 15: 26
    +1
    which according to British experts gives the rebels an advantage in the shootings.
    here it is choooo.Therefore, apparently they are in Iraq too .... and in Afghanistan. It’s like in a movie - yes, the grenades in it are in the wrong system.
  15. Olegovi4
    Olegovi4 28 March 2013 15: 26
    +2
    advantages of the mujahideen
    here it is choooo. Therefore, apparently, they are in Iraq too .... and in Afghanistan. It’s like in a movie - yes, the grenades in it are in the wrong system.
  16. Suhov
    Suhov 28 March 2013 15: 31
    +4
    Taliban ... no one told them that weapons under the 7,62 mm cartridge cannot be used, because it is inefficient. And they themselves do not know how to read ...
    Wild people !!!
    wassat
  17. Suhov
    Suhov 28 March 2013 15: 31
    0
    The Taliban, no one told them that weapons under the 7,62 mm cartridge cannot be used, because it is inefficient. And they themselves do not know how to read ...
    Wild people !!!
    wassat
  18. hrych
    hrych 28 March 2013 17: 21
    +4
    In fact, the caliber of 7,62x39 was adopted taking into account the experience of two world wars.
  19. hrych
    hrych 28 March 2013 17: 21
    +2
    In fact, the caliber of 7,62x39 was adopted taking into account the experience of two world wars.
  20. Alexey Prikazchikov
    Alexey Prikazchikov 28 March 2013 17: 57
    +1
    The British special forces want 7,62 mm, and we want a skar and its analogue Mk.14.
    1. PROXOR
      PROXOR 28 March 2013 18: 20
      +4
      Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
      and we want skar and its analogue Mk.14.

      And what does VCA or Vintorez not suit you? The first chambered for 7,62 * 54 the second chambered for 9 * 39. Or do you think MK.14 and its modernization MK. 21 pounding mostly bursts. Even striped from M16 and M4 shoot solo. And our guys mostly shoot single. Otherwise, you won’t get ammo. For automatic fire, RPKs, PCs, cookies and other types of light and heavy machine guns are good. ESPECIALLY CORD. wink This is generally worth the hassle: obstruction, brick wall or metal sheet up to 15mm.
      1. Arkan
        Arkan 28 March 2013 19: 39
        +3
        Quote: PROXOR
        And our guys mostly shoot single. Otherwise, you won’t get ammo.

        Single fire is far from always effective, combined-arms combat is very different from special operations (artillery and aviation work, opponents actively use smoke and other camouflage means .... combat at distances exceeding sighting range or in the forest) - very often units have to focus fire on indicated by the senior reference point, achieving the maximum possible density of fire per square meter per second. In battle, it is better not to save as much as possible. smile
        1. PROXOR
          PROXOR 29 March 2013 09: 18
          0
          Quote: Arkan
          Single fire is far from always effective, combined-arms combat is very different from special operations (artillery and aviation work, opponents actively use smoke and other camouflage means .... combat at distances exceeding sighting range or in the forest) - very often units have to focus fire on indicated by the senior reference point, achieving the maximum possible density of fire per square meter per second. In battle, it is better not to save as much as possible.

          For this, a manual or easel machine gun is provided. The same Pecheneg with a cartridge of 7,62 * 54 is a very dangerous beast.
      2. Alexey Prikazchikov
        Alexey Prikazchikov 29 March 2013 05: 55
        +1
        Svu deshovaya alteration with no quality. It is more likely that the shooter himself will crash than the enemy. Screw cutter is a special weapon. Skar is a modular system. There you and a light machine gun and a light sniper rifle and carbine are much more. About the build quality and lightweight polymer case just do not say anything. Mk 14 is a perfectly balanced and well-thought-out weapon and sue to it ... to blow like to the moon.
        1. PROXOR
          PROXOR 29 March 2013 09: 16
          0
          Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
          Svu deshovaya alteration with no quality. It is more likely that the shooter himself will crash than the enemy. Screw cutter is a special weapon. Skar is a modular system. There you and a light machine gun and a light sniper rifle and carbine are much more. About the build quality and lightweight polymer case just do not say anything. Mk 14 is a perfectly balanced and well-thought-out weapon and sue to it ... to blow like to the moon.

          Feedback on IEDs is based on personal experience? You just so categorically declare.
          1. Alexey Prikazchikov
            Alexey Prikazchikov 29 March 2013 19: 07
            0
            Almost personal experience ...
  21. Mr. Truth
    Mr. Truth 28 March 2013 23: 18
    0
    Then the worn-out record "7,62 versus 5,45" and "MT versus"
    With all due respect to Mikhail Timofeevich, 5,45 has much more advantages. It is definitely better than 7,62 M43 everywhere, in external, internal and terminal ballistics. Better than a 5,45 cartridge with a 7n10m bullet there is no gross cartridge, neither in 5,56x45 caliber nor in 7,62x39.
    But the militarization of the grendel will be a breakthrough. He is known to work well only with trunks longer than 24 inches. If you manage to disperse the 8 gram bullet from the machine at 800 m / s, then we can talk about a real breakthrough.
  22. MRomanovich
    MRomanovich 29 March 2013 09: 25
    +1
    Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov
    The British special forces want 7,62 mm, and we want a skar and its analogue Mk.14.

    who said that we want a skar, we have enough of our achievements both old and new without him. and we don’t need an analogue of m14. Yes, the M14 is beautiful in a new look - a bunch of rails, holes and all kinds of sticking things out, it’s a blaster, not a rifle, but from this and from performance it does not become an object of desire, we definitely do not dream of it.