Military Review

US to help Ukraine get rid of rocket fuel

82
US to help Ukraine get rid of rocket fuel

Ukraine and the United States are preparing for May the opening of one of the key facilities for the solid rocket fuel (TRT) program for intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBM) RS-22 (SS-24 according to NATO classification) at the facilities of Pavlograd Chemical Plant (PCP, Dnipropetrovsk region) - plant for the disposal of solid waste TRT, as well as empty ICBM engine cases.


“According to the currently available information of the American side, which according to the agreement provides funding and construction of this plant, the opening of the object is scheduled for May. At present, its construction is almost completed: the American contractor is commissioning and commissioning, ”Leonid Shiman, the director of PCR, told Interfax news agency on Friday.

According to the agency’s interlocutor, according to the latest agreements with the US Department of Defense in 2010, the US side confirmed its readiness to increase its share of the program’s funding, as well as to ensure the supply of equipment for recycling solid waste TRT and empty ICBM engine cases in the spring of PCNH installation of hydraulic washout TRT. The commitments undertaken by the Ukrainian side were fulfilled.

In September, 2012, the United States launched the construction of a facility for utilization of solid waste TRT, as well as empty ICBM engine cases at PCP. The integrating contractor of the facility is the American URS.

According to some estimates, the cost of a plant for the disposal of solid waste TRT and empty ICBM engine housings is estimated at about $ 35 million.

According to L. Shiman, today, within the framework of the program at PCP, construction of six objects from 13 has been completed, and four more, including the USA under construction, are scheduled for commissioning on the 2013 year. With timely funding, the last three facilities can be commissioned in the first quarter of 2014.

According to the estimates of the director of PCE, the need for financing the program in 2013 was estimated at 368 million UAH.

The budget-2013 doesn’t provide for a separate financing of the program; it is planned to allocate a total of UAH 98,63 million to carry out work on government targeted programs and government orders in the field of space activities.

According to the SSAU, the actual government funding of the program in 2012 was 71,3%: of the budgeted 274,68 million UAH, 195,96 million UAH was financed.

The PCT-22 TRT is being disposed of at PCZ facilities within the framework of Ukraine’s international commitments on the reduction and elimination of strategic weapons, as well as the PC-22 ICBM elimination and reclamation programs of the PC-22 ICT. Within the framework of the program, by the end of 2013, it was planned to dispose of the existing 5 thousand tons of TRT PC-22 in Ukraine.

According to a government decree adopted in December 2012, the program implementation dates have been extended until the end of 2015.

In the 2011-2012, at the PCH 54 disposal of the most dangerous third-stage ICBMs in terms of storage time was ensured; in 2013, it is planned to dispose of the second-stage 18 MBRs.

The issue of enhancing program cooperation was discussed at the level of Heads of State Viktor Yanukovych and Barack Obama during the Washington Nuclear Summit in 2010.

At the same time, the parties agreed to export the existing reserves of highly enriched uranium from the territory of Ukraine in exchange for financial and technological compensation in the amount of more than $ 60 million.

In 2011, the American side also confirmed its commitments to commission a nuclear installation in Ukraine - the neutron source - on the basis of the Kharkov Physical and Technical Institute no later than April 2014.
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http://vpk-news.ru
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  1. Dwarfik
    Dwarfik 25 March 2013 13: 12
    +2
    Kind! Who would doubt that they would help, and they themselves would pay for everything ... long! This is called - running kozel in the garden.
    1. elmi
      elmi 25 March 2013 13: 16
      +5
      Once, like this, "good America" ​​helped to cut our ballistic missiles and close military factories
      1. Vadivak
        Vadivak 25 March 2013 13: 36
        +3
        Quote: elmi
        When something like this "kind America" ​​helped to cut our ballistic missiles


        The rockets were cut and left, and then the plant, I think that he will utilize all the rocket rubbish not only from Ukraine, but also the homeland of the Yankee benefactors, they’ve taken care of their ecology here and built a factory in Ukraine
        1. vitamin ky
          vitamin ky 25 March 2013 14: 59
          +4
          Quote: Vadivak
          Quote: elmi
          When something like this "kind America" ​​helped to cut our ballistic missiles


          The rockets were cut and left, and then the plant, I think that he will utilize all the rocket rubbish not only from Ukraine, but also the homeland of the Yankee benefactors, they’ve taken care of their ecology here and built a factory in Ukraine

          Well, how beautifully they told - in the period of independence (the very beginning) - "we will become the center of Europe", "we will feed everyone" - and how we fell for such bullshit - they were bred like children - now from the granary and health resort - into a cesspool and a sump for Europe May Sho May sad
        2. queen
          queen 25 March 2013 15: 54
          0
          Quote: Vadivak
          they’re taking care of their ecology here in Ukraine and built


          Talk about their independence, asking for help overseas. It’s sad that they sold so much (
        3. Botanologist
          Botanologist 25 March 2013 16: 49
          +2
          the Yankees take care of their ecology here in Ukraine and built a factory

          That absolutely is not agreed that the Yankees care about their ecology. I visited there, looked - there is only profit taking place, and do not care about ecology at all. Of course, modern technologies are being introduced, but some troubles, as in Europe, are not observed at all. What is shale gas production worth? wassat
          1. Arkan
            Arkan 25 March 2013 16: 55
            -1
            Quote: Botanologist
            That absolutely is not agreed that the Yankees care about their ecology.

            Once they had a mover about ecology, after their river caught fire ... wassat (Mississippi, if my memory serves me right). But they already forgot about it somehow. laughing
      2. Stiletto
        Stiletto 25 March 2013 13: 45
        +4
        These from what he likes will help to get rid. After this, as practice shows, there is only one problem: how to get rid of them themselves ?!
    2. Papakiko
      Papakiko 25 March 2013 13: 53
      +1
      Quote: Dwarfik
      running kozol

      At the same time, the parties agreed to export the existing reserves of highly enriched uranium from the territory of Ukraine in exchange for financial and technological compensation in the amount of more than $ 60 million.
      This "product" should have been exported to Russia in the 90s.
      And is Ukraine considered a non-nuclear power? belay
      1. Good man
        Good man 25 March 2013 14: 33
        +1
        Quote: Papakiko
        This "product" should have been exported to Russia in the 90s.

        This is a byproduct of the work of scientific reactors in Kiev and Crimea.
      2. nickname 1 and 2
        nickname 1 and 2 25 March 2013 16: 02
        0
        Solid rocket fuel (TRT) recycling of intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs) RS-22 (SS-24 according to NATO classification) - TRT solid waste disposal plant, as well as empty engine shells of ICBMs.

        Quote: Papakiko
        And is Ukraine considered a non-nuclear power?


        ?

        I remember we took nuclear weapons from Ukraine!
        1. Good man
          Good man 25 March 2013 16: 26
          0
          Quote: nick 1 and 2
          I remember we took nuclear weapons from Ukraine!

          Yeah, they left the waste from it.
    3. vitamin ky
      vitamin ky 25 March 2013 14: 53
      0
      once it turned out to deny the Americans in the Crimea (teachings) -performed one normal act -and immediately frightened -with such attempts -we don’t shine
    4. Good man
      Good man 25 March 2013 16: 24
      -2
      Quote: Dwarfik
      Kind! Who would doubt that they would help, and they themselves would pay for everything ... long! This is called - running kozel in the garden.

      This is fuel from ICBMs that were exported to the Russian Federation in the 90s. They would take it along with the missiles and we would not need to build factories for its disposal. And this is not a loan.
  2. ziqzaq
    ziqzaq 25 March 2013 13: 14
    -1
    Yeah, they like to help ..... at someone else's expense .. paskuda ....
    1. vilenich
      vilenich 25 March 2013 14: 03
      +1
      Quote: ziqzaq
      Yeah, they like to help ..... at someone else's expense .. paskuda ....

      So they are even more cunning, when the question was about liquidation, they promised the golden mountains, and when they broke everything, then they’ll use horseradish with oil for disposal. Which year they promise to build something in Pavlograd, they need it!
      I do not believe this article!
      1. Ascetic
        Ascetic 25 March 2013 19: 01
        +2
        Quote: vilenich
        So they are even more cunning, when the question was about liquidation, they promised the golden mountains, and when they broke everything, then they’ll use horseradish with oil for disposal. Which year they promise to build something in Pavlograd, they need it!
        I do not believe this article!


        Yeah, I remember when they were asked to install a hydraulic wash to liquidate the "Scalpel" (RS-22), so they rinsed their brains, but they did not give the installation, they had to use the burning method to work on a special stand. Moreover, in 2000. there was a contract for 24 million dollars. for the construction of a rocket fuel washout facility using Thiokol Propulsion technology. But then they got scared that the emulsion would be used to produce explosives "Era", which PCZ was going to supply to Ukrainian mining and processing enterprises and quarries. By that time, the explosive technologies of the American company Orica had already settled at the Poltava GOK, and an expansion was planned to the neighboring Dnipropetrovsk region. Therefore, in 2003. the project was closed. Now it means that when a pilot hydraulic washing unit was almost created in Pavlograd, they decided to return to the project. Well, at least they will bring the stove for burning the buildings themselves, or even the Ukrainian brothers will leave the buildings, they will say there is nowhere to burn and they will be right, because amerov's cunning is punishable.
        1. Kars
          Kars 25 March 2013 19: 11
          -1
          Strange Pavlograd and so does the entire range of explosives and without rocket fuel.
          On the elimination of strategic weapons, under the START-1 treaty of 31.07.1991/23.05.1992/22 and the Lisbon Protocol to it of XNUMX. for Ukraine’s obligations to eliminate the RS-XNUMX ICBMs
          STATE

          A comprehensive program for the phased reduction and elimination of the MBR ICBM RS-22 ", approved by the order of the President of Ukraine dated 02.12.1997.
          The program for the disposal of TRT MBR RS-22 ", approved by the Resolution of the Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine dated October 29.10.2000, 1684, No. 22.09.2004 (as amended by the Resolution of the Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine dated September 1262, XNUMX, No. XNUMX).
          The program for the disposal of ordinary types of ammunition unsuitable for further use and storage, approved by the Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine of 20.01.1995, No. 40-1
          Regional Comprehensive Program for the Transition of GOKs to Non-TNT, Environmentally Friendly Explosives, Development of Blasting in Ukraine (Cabinet of Ministers Decree No. 21858/45 of 27.01.1996/XNUMX/XNUMX)

          BULK EMULSION EXPLOSIVE SUBSTANCES (EMB) OF “ERA-T” BRAND FOR UNDERGROUND LOADING
          TU U24.6-14310112-046: 2007

          http://www.ric-phz.com.ua/index.php?pages=era-p
          1. Ascetic
            Ascetic 25 March 2013 20: 24
            +1
            Quote: Kars
            Strange Pavlograd and so does the entire range of explosives and without rocket fuel.


            As you know, in the late 90s of the last century, Ukraine, becoming a nuclear-free state, carried out the destruction of silo launchers of intercontinental ballistic missiles located on its territory, including the three-stage RS-22 ICBM (SS-24 Scalpel). It was decided to carry out the disposal of missiles at the premises of the manufacturer of rocket fuel for SS-24 - GP PHZ. After that, the missiles were delivered to Pavlograd for storage. In 2000, the US Congress allocated $ 24 million for the construction of a rocket fuel leaching facility using Thiokol Propulsion technology. However, then the American side began to insist on burning or undermining the steps, and in early 2003 announced the withdrawal from the project.
            However, the US withdrawal from the project did not fundamentally affect its development. Representatives of the PCP were able to convince Ukrainian officials of the inappropriateness of burning TRT and the possibility of making good money from processing it into peaceful explosives. The technologies developed during the work with TRT (production of emulsion explosives "Era", means of initiating explosions, blasting services, etc.) helped the plant to continue the construction of recycling facilities, the readiness of which is now estimated at 70-90%. And with the change of administration in the United States, there have also been changes to the utilization of TRT in Ukraine. In April of this year, Viktor Yanukovych and Barack Obama agreed to return the United States to Pavlograd. In the summer, experts from both countries discussed the volumes and ways of material and technical and financial assistance. And in September we agreed on their parameters.
            At the same time, the main burden on the utilization of TRT will still fall not on the USA, but on the budget of Ukraine. In August, the Cabinet of Ministers ordered to close last year's debt to PCP under the recycling program - UAH 50 million, and by the end of the year another 90 million UAH should be allocated. Next year, PCP expects to receive UAH 340 million from the treasury. In total, out of the total project cost of 2 billion, today less than UAH 800 million has been financed. But officials seem to have no other choice. The warranty period for the storage of rocket fuel expired in 1998-2001. And according to PCP, are currently being observed changes in the physical and chemical stability of TRT in 60% of the first stages, 85% of the second and 100% of the third stages of SS-24 Scalpel missiles, who are awaiting disposal in Pavlograd.
            It means that it became dangerous to destroy by burning, if you want to, you don't have to wash it, but burn the carbon fiber casings in a special furnace that the Americans should bring

            link
            1. Kars
              Kars 25 March 2013 20: 38
              0
              And? What did you want to say? Explosives are done.
              http://archive.nbuv.gov.ua/portal/natural/Nvngu/2009_8/StShvydko.pdf

              Specialists of PCP in 1999 in a feasibility study on the facility
              fuel acidification (OLT) justified the need
              44 million dollars. Since “PCP” is already hydrau-
              Lo and disposed of in explosives "Era" in four years
              up to 4 different stages of the RS-22 of the 163 engines
              lei, the contribution of the budget of Ukraine to OLT is already exceeding
              forces billion hryvnias, not including the cost of drilling
              imploding works.

              A few years ago, domestic rocket launchers
              together with the “Maurice Knutsen” celebrated graduation
              heptyl burning using American technology,
              developed by Thiokol Utah. In the middle
              90s Russia abandoned ready-made, past
              fire tests at the “Tiokol” range of installations
              (three installations: one had to be mounted-
              on in Zagorsk, and two on “Krasmash” in Krasnoyarsk).
              Ukrainian "patriots of the fatherland" picked up ready-made
              new technology of American destruction
              heptyl and, having mounted it in the center of the Dnieper
              Ropetrovsk, burned an indelible residue from 118
              Ket “RS-20” 300 kg each. In the territory
              UMZ. Russian experts, abandoning
              heptyl burning, ordered by the US Senate
              technology of processing heptyl into initial products
              you…

              National Space Agency of Ukraine
              By the Decree of the Cabinet of Ministers in 2006 introduced
              as part of its Pavlograd chemical plant 5
              government explosives distributed by
              Donetsk, Ivano-Frankivsk, Lugansk, Odessa
              regions and the Crimean peninsula. Almost all
              blasting in quarries is carried out using
              explosives manufactured by PCP which
              responsible for budgetary funds,
              add STRT and water washout in any of the compositions
              emulsion explosives "Era", produced
              PCP.
              1. Ascetic
                Ascetic 25 March 2013 21: 01
                +1
                Quote: Kars
                And? What did you want to say? Explosives are done.

                In 2003, the Americans refused to finance the project for the installation of hydraulic washing, so that the emulsion obtained would not be used in the production of explosives. This is one of the reasons for this failure, I described above, maybe the reason was different, because officially they referred to organizational and technical difficulties.
                And who-and- and whom did they mean, Comrade Zhukov?


                Speaking of heptyl, it’s a completely different story. It says TRT. The processing of heptyl into demytylamine is successfully carried out, for example, by the IRKUTSK AVIATION PRODUCTION ASSOCIATION,
                link
                So Tiokol is not needed when there is a more technologically advanced and safer way
                1. Kars
                  Kars 25 March 2013 21: 14
                  -1
                  Quote: Ascetic
                  not used in the manufacture of explosives

                  You want to say that since 2003 PCP does not produce ERA explosives?

                  и

                  I gave the link above
                  - Stop the "scientific" discussions about the competition -
                  between burning or exploding as
                  unacceptable in the densely populated territory of the UK
                  wounds.
                  - Stop budget financing and-
                  grudge "disposal" of residues of hydraulic erosion STRT
                  blasting water and blasting water for everyone
                  explosives and business entities on the territory
                  torii of Ukraine as a decision that did not pass public
                  discussion and no EIA in application
                  on explosive crushing of granite massifs



                  But I still did not understand what the Americans threw us at, and what other options we had.
                  except for the only fundamental mistake when they decided to take out only warheads, and not the entire missile.
                  1. Ascetic
                    Ascetic 25 March 2013 21: 35
                    +1
                    Quote: Kars
                    You want to say that since 2003 PCP does not produce ERA explosives?


                    Well, no yo-mo-yo, what does the ERA have to do with it? And they threw with the contract in 2003. on the installation of hydraulic washing. For they baked about their company Orika, who had settled in Ukraine, considering that as a result of using emulsion TRT, the production of explosives would increase sharply, which would compete with Orike. So then they spoke on Yuzhmash.

                    what other options we had.

                    Continue to blast or burn
                    Create your own hydraulic installation.
                    1. Kars
                      Kars 25 March 2013 21: 46
                      0
                      Quote: Ascetic
                      Well, no yo-mo-yo, what does the ERA have to do with it?

                      Quote: Ascetic
                      the emulsion obtained was not used in the manufacture of explosives

                      then what kind of explosives could they not do in Pavlagrad?
                      Quote: Ascetic
                      And they threw with the contract in 2003. for the installation of hydraulic washing

                      What did this mean? We paid them money, but they didn’t? They (the US government) promised financing and failed to provide?
                      Quote: Ascetic
                      pr-in BB that will compete with Orique.

                      How much did Orika sell explosives?
                      Quote: Ascetic
                      So then they spoke on Yuzhmash

                      And what about southeast mash? He didn’t make explosives.

                      Quote: Ascetic
                      Continue to blast or burn
                      Create your own hydraulic installation

                      Yes, but where does the Americans throw?
                      Quote: ziqzaq
                      Yeah, they like to help ..... at someone else's expense .. paskudy

                      so it’s absolutely incomprehensible what you remembered

                      Quote: Ascetic
                      Yeah, I remember when they were asked to install a hydraulic wash.

                      So whose score is that?
                      1. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 25 March 2013 22: 15
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        then what kind of explosives could they not do in Pavlagrad?


                        would you be able to use TRT for the production of explosives, which is economically more profitable, I clearly state?
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        PCP representatives were able to convince Ukrainian officials of the inappropriateness of burning TRT and opportunities to make good money at its processing into peaceful explosives. Technologies mastered during the work with TRT (production of emulsion explosives "Era", means of initiating explosions, subversive services, etc.) helped the plant to continue the construction of recycling facilities, the readiness of which is now estimated at 70-90%.


                        Quote: Kars
                        How much did Orika sell explosives?


                        Enough if you planned to expand

                        Quote: Kars
                        And what about southeast mash? He didn’t make explosives.


                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Pavlograd Mechanical Plant (PMZ), a branch of PO Southern Machine-Building Plant.

                        Quote: Kars
                        Yes, but where does the Americans throw?


                        In 2000 the contract was concluded in 2003, without explanation of the reasons, was torn up and the Americans have so far left this topic. (Veterans say that as soon as they fished out everything of value from Yuzhmash, recycling ceased to interest them right away) Is this not a kiddock?
                        Quote: Kars
                        So whose score is that?


                        And who needed to guess at once, They also promoted their installation of Tikola in Salda free of charge, the goal was to organize the disposal of heptyl merged with ICBMs as quickly as possible, not for the sake of the environment, the main thing with the BZHRK was that it was impossible to recover quickly. even cars were forced to cut and rocket shells explode.
                      2. Kars
                        Kars 25 March 2013 22: 29
                        -1
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        could not use TRT for the production of explosives, which is economically more profitable

                        Well, this is a moot point, you can take the washout unit into account. But it’s okay. It’s not a fact that explosives produced not from TRT will be more expensive than the American one brought in for three nine lands that have passed customs.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Do you specifically get something?

                        Comment did not force to write.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        The technologies mastered during the work with TRT (the production of emulsion explosives "Era", explosive initiation means, subversive services, etc.) helped the plant to continue the construction of recycling facilities, the readiness of which is now estimated at 70-90%

                        And where does the Americans? If the production is carried out.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Enough if you planned to expand

                        But the campaign was not expanded. And is there any connection between the firms.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        In 2000 signed a contract in 2003 without explanation, torn and the Americans so far left this topic

                        so what’s the kid’s money? Where? Why didn’t the court apply.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Veterans say that as soon as they fished out everything of value from Yuzhmash, recycling ceased to interest them right there

                        What could they value valuable under this contract?
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        The same with the BZHRK the main thing that could not be quickly restored. even cars were forced to cut and rocket shells explode.

                        Well, what do we have to do with it? Did we pay for the cutting? Or did we need rocket bodies?
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        And who needed to guess at once

                        I don’t need a question, the question is at whose expense. Ukraine doesn’t need ICBM missiles. And that's why only warheads were brought out to Russia, and not a complete missile for me. Personally, I would insist on this option, without any difference to export to Russia or the USA.
                      3. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 25 March 2013 22: 50
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        And where does the Americans? If the production is carried out.


                        Here I say where are the diamonds from? They always have nothing to do with it.
                        Quote: Kars
                        What could they value valuable under this contract?


                        Yes, not by contract .. They had contracted access to some technologies and what they didn’t have .. They also poked their nose .. And they went there as at home.
                        Quote: Kars
                        I don’t need a question, the question is at whose expense. Ukraine doesn’t need ICBM missiles. And that's why only warheads were brought out to Russia, and not a complete missile for me. Personally, I would insist on this option, without any difference to export to Russia or the USA.

                        But because the Americans did not allow it. In July 1991, START-1 was signed, and by November 1991, the collapse of the USSR had actually become irreversible. After the formal collapse of the USSR in December 1991, the production of new ICBMs at the PMZ was completely discontinued, missiles, deployed on the territory of Ukraine, were subject to withdrawal from combat duty and destruction in the framework of international treaties. (where the disposal sites were specified, and the missiles themselves became the property of Ukraine and it was easier and more necessary for the Americans to control ALL strategic factories and not only Russian ones) In 1993-1994, all ICBMs on the territory of Ukraine were removed from combat duty, and the BB removed from missiles were then were taken to Russia for disposal. In 1998-2001, the second stage was carried out - all 46 "Ukrainian" ICBMs 15Ж60 were removed from the silo OS. In 1999-2002, all ICBMs (including those that were never put on alert) were disassembled and sent for disposal. OS silos were detonated except for one serving for museum purposes.
                        Quote: Kars
                        Well, what do we have to do with it? Did we pay for the cutting? Or did we need rocket bodies?

                        In this case, the cars were cut in Bryansk, and the Americans don’t need the hulls, so they demand to destroy them
                        Quote: Kars
                        Personally, I would insist on such an option, and it does not matter to export to the Russian Federation or the United States.


                        They do not ask the vanquished, they do not insist, but humblely ask ..
                      4. Kars
                        Kars 25 March 2013 23: 11
                        0
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Here I say where are the diamonds from? They always have nothing to do with it.

                        So the reason is being removed to clamp down on the production of explosives.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Yes, not by contract

                        then I don’t understand what are the reasons to remember them.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        (where disposal sites are specified

                        and where was the place of disposal of missiles deployed on the territory of Ukraine.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Of Ukraine were removed from combat duty, and the BB removed from missiles were then taken out

                        So I say where it says that it was necessary to remove the BB and disconnect the product. And do not take it out completely.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        In this case, the cars were cut in Bryansk, and the Americans don’t need the hulls, so they demand to destroy them

                        Quote: Ascetic
                        and humblely ask

                        Yes?

                        And about
                        Quote: Kars
                        and not completely rockets for me is a big question.

                        most likely no one thought about it,
                      5. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 00: 33
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        and where was the place of disposal of missiles deployed on the territory of Ukraine.


                        On the moon, damn it laughing Kars is good this is already a flood .. don’t take an example with the maestro of this case Pupyrchaty ..
                      6. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 00: 47
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        So I say where it says that it was necessary to remove the BB and disconnect the product. And do not take it out completely.


                        In the Operating Instructions (IE REV). in the section Storage and transportation. The 12th GUMO of Russia is responsible for storage, for Ukraine has declared itself a non-nuclear power. Therefore, all BBs are exported to acc. storage bases in Russia.
                        Kars do better tanks, and then from similar .. questions I'm just in touch .. don’t disgrace
                      7. Kars
                        Kars 26 March 2013 01: 10
                        -1
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Kars do tanks better

                        Well, what I want. That's what I'm doing.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        On the moon, damn it

                        on the moon? strange.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        In the Operating Instructions (IE REV). in the section Storage and transportation. The 12th GUMO of Russia is responsible for storage

                        But the missiles were already Ukrainian.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Ukraine declared itself a non-nuclear power. Therefore, all BBs are exported to acc. storage bases in Russia

                        But why without carriers? We are not only not nuclear, but also have no right to own a balestic missile with a range of over 280 km.
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        I am just out of questions

                        It happens, but along with all this, it was the RF that won the most, taking the most valuable, and leaving thousands of tons of chemically hazardous substances in our territory. And we, in principle, should have been glad in the early nineties to every extra dollar we received. sympathizing with our disarmament
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        do not embarrass yourself

                        this is also my personal matter.
                      8. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 02: 15
                        +1
                        Quote: Kars
                        But the missiles were already Ukrainian.


                        The missiles were Soviet. Under START-1, the procedure for reduction and storage of BB of the parties was determined. The agreement was signed in 1991 .. The question of the continuity of obligations of the Soviet Union under START-1 was resolved in May 1992 by signing the protocol to the Treaty, which became known as Lisbon Protocol. According to protocol Russia became the successors of the status of the USSR Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine, which have committed themselves to implement strategic arms reductions under the START-1 Treaty. In addition, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine have undertaken to accede to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons as non-nuclear states, thereby Undertaking to either liquidate or transfer to Russia all nuclear charges that appeared on their territory. Subsequently, Russia entered into agreements with Kazakhstan and Belarus, in accordance with which they also transferred to Russia all carriers of nuclear weapons. Ukraine declared all carriers located on its territory its property and expressed its readiness to independently liquidate them in accordance with the procedures of START-1.

                        Quote: Kars
                        .But in the course of all this, it was the RF that won the most, taking the most valuable and leaving thousands of tons of chemically hazardous substances in our territory.


                        In Ukraine, they did not think so, leaving the rockets to themselves.
                        In relation to mobile missile systems, stricter elimination procedures are also provided than for mine missiles. In particular, To exclude a mobile rocket from the list, it is necessary to destroy not only the launcher, but also the rocket itself. For mine and sea-based missiles, the destruction of the missiles themselves is not required.
                        That is what they did in Pavlograd (they disposed of the Scalpel), and liquid ICBMs could not be cut, it was enough to drain the fuel.

                        Well now what else is not clear? Why didn’t Ukraine act like Kazakhs with Belarusians? They say Kuchma so decided (a native of Yuzhmash) apparently there was interest. And so HZ ..
                      9. Kars
                        Kars 26 March 2013 02: 52
                        0
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Missiles were soviet

                        Quote: Ascetic
                        . Ukraine declared all carriers located on its territory its property

                        But the Belarusian and Kazakh were not their property?
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        expressed readiness to independently liquidate them in accordance with the procedures of START-1
                        it would be interesting to see where it is written
                        Quote: Ascetic
                        Well now what else is not clear?

                        If it’s true that they themselves decided to leave, then a dumb young man, besides what all the same, the USA achieved something at someone else’s expense if the missiles were disposed of anyway .. And why such a surge of negativity when the USA helped us in this.


                        Quote: Ascetic
                        They say Kuchma so decided (a native of Yuzhmash) apparently there was interest.

                        In principle, it is plausible if you consider the rockets as a means of putting satellites into orbit. Then it’s a normal idea, but it’s clear that something has gone wrong.
                      10. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 09: 20
                        +1
                        quote = Kars] And the Belarusian and Kazakh were not their property? [/ Quote]

                        See Lisbon Protocol v.1

                        link
                        .Protocol records connection of Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine to the START treaty and at the same time requires them to join the nuclear non-proliferation treaty.
                        [quote = Kars] it would be interesting to see where it is written [/ quote]
                        Strategic nuclear forces of the USSR and Russia
                        link

                        Particular activity in this matter is demonstrated by Ukraine, which in April in
                        unilaterally announced the establishment of its administrative
                        control (jurisdiction) over strategic forces on its territory. Already
                        nationalized parts of long-range aviation in Uzen. It can be assumed that in
                        In the coming months, attempts will be made to swear and part of the Strategic Missile Forces,
                        located in Ukraine. Violation of the Alma-Ata agreements was the refusal of Ukraine from its
                        obligations to destroy all nuclear weapons by the end of 1994
                        of the year. Now we are talking about a 7-year period, and it is due
                        a number of requirements that make it doubtful that Ukraine
                        really wants to become a nuclear-free state. Lisbon Protocol
                        signed in May, does not guarantee a solution to this issue. Anyway,
                        Ukraine, like other former Soviet republics, is in no hurry to sign
                        Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. And in what capacity are they
                        may sign the Treaty if they do not recognize nuclear warheads,
                        located on their territory, the property of Russia?
                        A ban on ICBMs with an RGH IN can solve this problem, since all missiles on
                        the territories of Ukraine and Kazakhstan belong to this category. It is unlikely that these
                        states will be able to keep the ICBMs with the RGH IN if the United States abandons them and
                        Russia. In any case, this factor played in the achievement of the Washington
                        arrangements are no less important than traditional strategic
                        considerations.
                        link
                        The aviation group, consisting of TB Tu-160 and Tu-95MS, was half abroad: in Kazakhstan - 40 Tu-95MS, which were returned to Russia, and in Ukraine - 12 Tu-160 and 24 Tu-95MS (as well as 59 non-strategic long-range bombers Tu-22M). Ukraine declared all these planes its property and proceeded to destroy them for American money. Russia bought 8 Tu-160 and 3 Tu-95MS, as well as 500 cruise missiles to them as part of paying off Ukrainian debts for Russian gas, for which Ukraine was charged $ 275 million in debt. The remaining bombers in Ukraine have mostly been destroyed, including one Tu-160, one Tu-95MS, as well as 56 Tu-22 and Kh-22 cruise missiles to them, and 3 Tu-22 and 7 Kh-22 missiles (without military equipment) left as museum exhibits.
                        link
                        Nuclear fungus of Ukraine.
                        link

                        US and Ukrainian defense ministers sign agreement on financing the elimination of strategic weapons near SS-19 ICBM launchers
                      11. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 09: 40
                        +1
                        Here everything is explained simply. In Ukraine there are 176 ICBMs with MIRVs, of which 130 ICBMs with MIRVs of the UR-100N type and 46 ICBMs with MIRVs of the RT-23 UTTKh stationary base (1240 warheads), in Kazakhstan - 104 ICBMs with MIRVs of the R-36M type (1040 warheads), in Belarus - 54 ICBMs with the Topol monoblock (54 warheads). Belarus returned all the Topol mobile ground-based missile systems (PGRK) based on its territory. OSov missiles did not make sense without silos. The Kazakhs decided to abandon the missiles and return them to Russia, because they did not have production facilities on their territory. In Ukraine, practically all the production of ICBMs of the USSR remained, there was no need to build anything new. and since the Americans paid for the disposal, it was cheaper and easier for them to do this at the existing facilities.
                        But all the plants for the production and disposal of nuclear weapons were in Russia. It turns out that the hulls and engines were mainly made in Ukraine and the BB in Russia.

                        First the official Ukrainian document relating to nuclear weapons was the Declaration on State Sovereignty of Ukraine, adopted by its Supreme Council on July 16, 1990... 355 people voted for it, and only 4 were against it. It declared the intention to become a neutral state and adhere to three "non-nuclear principles": not to preserve, not to produce or acquire nuclear weapons.
                        Then the APU Statement of October 24, 1991 was adopted
                        As the "legal successor" of the former USSR, Ukraine expressed its readiness to abide by the START-1 Treaty and enter into negotiations with the Russian Federation, Belarus and Kazakhstan on the destruction of weapons falling under it. Problems related to the destruction of other nuclear systems were proposed to be discussed within the framework of "international mechanisms". Finally the question was raised about the right of Ukraine to control the non-use of nuclear weapons located on its territory, and that it was she who would ensure its "physical security." In other words, it was about establishing at least partial Ukrainian control over nuclear weapons until they are destroyed.
                        Next
                      12. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 09: 47
                        +1
                        The liquidation of the USSR was strictly determined by the preservation of nuclear weapons under a single centralized control. And therefore, the Ukrainian leadership was forced to make a number of serious concessions and agree with the scheme for solving nuclear problems outlined in documents adopted by the CIS in December 1991-February 1992. Its essence is as follows:
                        See: Agreement on joint measures for nuclear weapons, "Commonwealth. Information Bulletin of the Councils of Heads of State and Government of the CIS". Issue 1. Minsk, 1992, p.13-14; Strategic Forces Agreement... "Commonwealth". Issue 1, pp.25-26; Strategic Forces Status Agreement. "Commonwealth". Issue 2, p.50-53.

                        Ukraine and Belarus pledged to join the NPT as nuclear-free states;
                        by July 1, 1992, tactical nuclear weapons should be exported to the Russian Federation and deployed there, at the central factory bases for dismantling under joint control;
                        until the complete elimination of nuclear weapons in the territories of Ukraine and Belarus, a decision on their use will be made by the President of the Russian Federation in agreement with the leaders of Ukraine, Belarus and Kazakhstan;
                        common control over the nuclear weapons of the former USSR is maintained and a joint command of the Strategic Forces is created;
                        until complete destruction, nuclear weapons deployed in Ukraine are under the control of the joint command of the Strategic Forces;
                        strategic nuclear weapons stationed in Ukraine should be destroyed by the end of 1994;
                        The strategic forces (primarily the nuclear deterrent forces) function as an "independent strategic formation." They are directly controlled by the commander of the Strategic Forces, who is subordinate to the commander-in-chief of the CIS Joint Armed Forces and the Council of Heads of State;
                        - movable property of the Strategic Forces (including nuclear weapons and their carriers) "is in their possession and use."
                        The then agreed approach allowed Ukraine to achieve two other goals: to prevent the establishment of the Russian monopoly on nuclear weapons, to keep it under collective control with the participation of Ukraine, and to reassure Western leaders who were worried about the prospect of several new nuclear states appearing on the territory of the former USSR.
                        However, the formation of a single centralized mechanism for managing the Strategic Forces was frozen in the spring of 1992. On the one hand, this was due to the actions of the Russian leadership, which ignored a number of agreements reached. On the other, it was the result of a serious review of Ukraine’s nuclear policy.
                        Next
                      13. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 10: 00
                        +1
                        March 12, 1992 L. Kravchuk announced the suspension of the export of tactical nuclear weapons to Russia. He substantiated this decision by the fact that there is no evidence that the ammunition being removed is actually unmounted, and not simply added to the Russian arsenal. He also demanded that the dismantling of nuclear weapons be carried out under international control, and suggested that a plant for the elimination of nuclear munitions be built with Western help in Ukraine.
                        The next step in this direction was taken on April 5, 1992, when President L. Kravchuk signed decree No. 209, according to which the 43rd missile and 46th air armies were included in the armed forces of Ukraine
                        Finally, on April 9, 1992, the Supreme Council of Ukraine adopted a resolution "On additional measures to ensure the nuclear-free status of Ukraine"
                        These actions of Kiev met with stiff opposition from both Moscow and the leading Western powers, primarily the United States. In Washington, in particular, they clearly understood that if Ukraine came too close to possessing nuclear weapons, this would make the START-1 Treaty and START-2 Treaty knowingly impossible.
                        As a result of the decisive demarches of Moscow and Washington, the Ukrainian leadership made serious concessions. On April 16, 1992, a Russian-Ukrainian agreement was signed on tactical nuclear weapons, as well as a protocol on the timing of the elimination of warheads and control mechanisms. The Russian Federation agreed that Ukrainian observers should be present at enterprises where de-stocking of warheads is being carried out. However, Ukraine refused (although then this requirement reappeared) from the idea of ​​an international, i.e. with the participation of Western experts, monitoring this process. The withdrawal of tactical warheads was resumed. In early May 1992, the last such ammunition left Ukrainian territory. On the same days, President L. Kravchuk, while in Washington, confirmed Ukraine’s intention to gain a nuclear-free status in the future.
                        Then there was the Lisbon Protocol. In May 1992. which was already mentioned above. Now about the property defined by document on the status of the Strategic Forces
                        It said that "the movable property of the Strategic Forces (ie, nuclear weapons) is in their possession and use." However, such forces were never created as a kind of independent legal entity. The reason for this is the actions of both Ukraine and Russia, which announced in the spring and summer of 1992 their claims to their own control over nuclear weapons. The named agreement was not submitted for ratification and actually lost force.
                      14. Ascetic
                        Ascetic 26 March 2013 10: 09
                        +1
                        On July 2, 1993, the Supreme Soviet of Ukraine adopted by an overwhelming majority of votes a document prepared by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs entitled "Main Directions of Ukraine's Foreign Policy". It, in particular, said: "Having become due to historical circumstances the owner of nuclear weapons inherited from the former USSR, Ukraine never authorizes its use. "16. The words" becoming the owner of ... nuclear weapons "were included by lawmakers in the original text, which only said that Ukraine would never authorize the use of nuclear weapons.
                        At the end of 1992, about six months after the signing of the Lisbon Protocol, the START I Treaty and its protocols were submitted to the Supreme Council for ratification. A special working deputy group was created there, headed by a staunch supporter of nuclear weapons, Minister of the Environment Y. Kostenko. In March and April 1, the Supreme Soviet held open and closed hearings on nuclear issues, during which the arguments and positions of the parties were formed and refined. In particular, in April 1993, 1993 Ukrainian deputies signed a statement in which they demanded to recognize Ukraine as a nuclear state, and stressed that without "confirmation of the status of Ukraine as the owner of nuclear weapons located on the territory of Ukraine, the Supreme Council of Ukraine cannot proceed to final consideration "contract162. At the beginning of June 19, the issue was discussed at a parliamentary meeting, where no decisions were made and further work was postponed until autumn. In the course of these hearings and discussions, four main conditions were formulated, without which Ukraine is not going to ratify the START-1993 Treaty.
                        First. Ukraine should receive security guarantees. This should be a multilateral instrument of a binding legal nature, signed by all five nuclear powers. It should clearly state the rejection of territorial claims against Ukraine and economic pressure on it, as well as the obligation to protect in the event of aggression.
                        Second. Ukraine claims compensation for all fissile materials.
                        The third. The United States should provide Ukraine with financial assistance in the amount of about $ 1,5 billion to cover the costs of nuclear disarmament.
                        Fourth. The destruction of nuclear warheads should take place under appropriate control. Moreover, the elimination of warheads and carriers must be considered in a single complex. Otherwise, Ukraine may be faced with the need to independently, without outside support, deal with the elimination of carriers, including ICBMs equipped with extremely toxic fuel - heptyl. It is alleged that in Ukraine there are neither technologies for burning it, nor storage tanks.
                        In the summer of 1993 in political and government circles of Ukraine, the idea that 46 SS-24 solid-fuel rockets should be preserved has become widespread. This position was also supported by Prime Minister L. Kuchma. Formally, it did not contradict START-1, but it is not consistent with Article XNUMX of the Lisbon Protocol, which states accession to the NPT.
                        Russian-Ukrainian talks on nuclear weapons began in January 1993 and culminated in September 1993 with the signing in Massandra during a summit meeting of a number of documents.
                        Despite the position of a significant part of the Ukrainian parliament, the delegation of Kiev agreed that nuclear warheads should not only be serviced by Russian specialists, but also dismantled at Russian plants. m. Kyiv’s demand that the President of Ukraine be provided with a subscriber console of the Strategic Forces combat control system, which allows him to prevent their unauthorized use, also remained unsatisfied.
  • Ascetic
    Ascetic 25 March 2013 20: 40
    +1
    In 1991, when the USSR and the USA entered into START-2, the Scalpels (like some liquid missiles, in particular the SS-18, known as the Satan) were among the strategic weapons to be eliminated. 15ZH60, from which the nuclear warheads were removed, was sent to the place where they were previously manufactured - at the Pavlograd Mechanical Plant (PMZ), a branch of the Southern Machine-Building Plant Production Association. There they were disassembled into the first, second and third stages, engine nozzles and other components were separated. AND solid fuel charges were transferred for storage to another enterprise - Pavlograd Chemical Plant (PCP), where TRT was once produced.
    Of the fifty rockets 15ZH60, which were on combat duty in Ukraine, 150 sections were obtained (50 first, as many second and third stages). And in each - solid rocket fuel (50 tons - in the first, 36 - in the second and 13 tons - in the third stages). To the 150 steps were added five more that remained in Pavlograd from the time when, for technical reasons, the components of the missiles in one of the military units in the north of the USSR were replaced. In this way, the total mass of TRT at the chemical plant reached 5050 tons.
    When the question of eliminating the Scalpel missiles remaining from the Strategic Missile Forces of the former USSR was decided in independent Ukraine, the United States promised Ukraine, proclaiming a nuclear-free status, support for the disposal of TRT. And at first, the Americans allocated funds for these purposes, thanks to which A pilot plant began to operate at PCP. With its help, the technology of rocket fuel hydraulic washing was worked out - much safer from an environmental point of view than burning TRT, which is unacceptable in Ukraine, - the country is densely populated and actually has no small areas (unlike, say, Russia).
    It was assumed that after testing the TPT hydraulic washout technology, the pilot plant will be replaced by an industrial one with much greater productivity. By the way, TRT, washed out of the buildings using this technology, is not destroyed, as some media sometimes write erroneously. It must be disposed of to good use - to become a raw material for the production of industrial explosives.
    Rocket fuel cannot be stored indefinitely. This problem was discussed at the Ukrainian-American negotiations at various levels. The result was the construction of an industrial installation in Pavlograd, which made it possible to deploy the utilization of rocket fuel reserves with funding from both sides - Ukraine and the United States.
    The productivity of the industrial installation, which began work at the Pavlogradsky Chemical Plant, is 2000 tons per year. With this in mind, we plan to utilize the local stocks of solid rocket fuel during 2011, 2012 and 2013.

    From an interview with the chairman of the State Committee of Ukraine, Yuri ALEKSEEV. in 2011

    Storage facility for solid rocket fuel at PCP
  • MrFYGY
    MrFYGY 25 March 2013 13: 14
    0
    "At the same time, the parties reached an agreement on the export of existing reserves of highly enriched uranium from the territory of Ukraine in exchange for financial and technological compensation in the amount of more than $ 60 million."

    This is a big blow to our export of nuclear fuel.
    1. Arkan
      Arkan 25 March 2013 13: 20
      0
      Quote: MrFYGY
      This is a big blow to our export of nuclear fuel.

      Ukrainian weapons-grade uranium donated by Yanukovych Obama was exported to Russia.
  • Vladimirets
    Vladimirets 25 March 2013 13: 16
    0
    "At the same time, the parties reached an agreement on the export of existing reserves of highly enriched uranium from the territory of Ukraine in exchange for financial and technological compensation in the amount of more than $ 60 million."

    And I read and think: what kind of attraction is unprecedented generosity? Everything became clear here.
  • Vanek
    Vanek 25 March 2013 13: 30
    +2
    Damn, let Aguzarov go there. She will drink it for free wassat
    1. ziqzaq
      ziqzaq 25 March 2013 17: 51
      +1
      Quote: Vanek

      Damn, let Aguzarov go there. She will drink it for free

      Vanek, juicyly said ... Thank you ....
    2. morpex
      morpex 25 March 2013 19: 34
      +2
      Quote: Vanek
      Damn, let Aguzarov go there. She will drink it for free

      It’s ridiculous of course. But the problem is that there is HEPTIL fused with missiles in the storage facilities. It does not decompose in nature. We do not have the technologies for its processing. After Ukrina became nuclear-free, everyone did not give a damn about it. But the problem still remained. What will be better? Let here amers and let them at least do something in this direction? Or to sit and wait until all this will crash?. So I live nearby. Someone’s scary brothers .....
      1. Ascetic
        Ascetic 25 March 2013 20: 47
        +2
        Quote: morpex
        . But the problem is that there is HEPTIL fused with missiles in the storage facilities. In nature, it does not decompose. We do not have technologies for its processing.


        Plant them. Thieves' Melitopol software for the production of filling equipment "Melitopolprodmash" of the Ministry of Engineering for the light and food industries and household appliances of the USSR ..
        The plant has been engaged in the production of 1974G11, 426G11 units since 427. The enterprise has manufactured and delivered more than 150 units of the above equipment to the Plesetsk and Baikonur space ranges and to the bases of strategic missiles practically throughout the USSR.
        Currently - the company "UKRHIMPROMMASH", which is one of the divisions of the holding "MELITOPOLPRODMASH." She is involved as lead contractor for the production of rocket fuel utilization units in the complex international program Cyclone-4 with the Yuzhnoye Design Bureau.
        1. morpex
          morpex 25 March 2013 21: 09
          +1
          Quote: Ascetic
          It is involved as the main contractor for the production of installations for the disposal of rocket fuel in the complex international program Cyclone-4 with the Yuzhnoye design bureau.

          Oh Ascetic .. All this is so. Yes, things are still there ... How many years have passed, and the problem of disposal has not moved off the ground ....
          1. Ascetic
            Ascetic 25 March 2013 21: 40
            +2
            Quote: morpex
            Oh Ascetic .. All this is so. Yes, things are still there ... How many years have passed, and the problem of disposal has not moved off the ground ...


            And because it is cheaper to quietly pour or burn than to allocate money and painstakingly work. For it is an expensive pleasure There are no other reasons

            Today in Ukraine it is still impossible to solve
            the issue of utilization of heptyl liquid rocket fuel,
            which is
            extremely dangerous to human health, due to the significant cost
            of these works, - the Minister for Issues noted at a press conference on Thursday
            emergency situations and to protect the population from the consequences of the Chernobyl
            disaster Valery KALCHENKO. According to him, this also applies to the problem.
            destruction of ammunition whose shelf life has expired and chemical
            weapons remaining in Ukraine since World War II.
            V. KALCHENKO noted that to eliminate the consequences of all emergency
            situations in Ukraine, including landslides in Dnepropetrovsk and problem solving
            gas lines "you need about 1 thousand budgets of Ukraine". The Minister
            emphasized that today the responsibility for the storage of liquid rocket
            ministries and departments carry fuel, chemical weapons and ammunition
            - owners of the marked substances.

            That's the whole story there is no money, but there’s something to buy locks in Europe,
            Everything is familiar .. They do not plan to live in Ukraine, and they are ALIENS ..
            1. morpex
              morpex 25 March 2013 22: 54
              -1
              Quote: Ascetic
              "about 1 budgets of Ukraine are needed."

              Here, in my opinion, the minister went too far ... Learning from Asirov? The other day, he said that 500 billion hryvnias should be donated for repairing roads in Ukraine, while independent experts considered that there would be enough 13. Or do they immediately take their pocket into account?
  • nakaz
    nakaz 25 March 2013 13: 36
    +1
    Keywords -
    At the same time, the parties agreed to export the existing reserves of highly enriched uranium from the territory of Ukraine in exchange for financial and technological compensation in the amount of more than $ 60 million.
    It is now clear why the United States has such a panic. Soon, nuclear fuel could run out at their nuclear power plants.
  • JonnyT
    JonnyT 25 March 2013 13: 39
    0
    Well, who would doubt ..... ruin loosen they will always help
  • Ragnarek
    Ragnarek 25 March 2013 13: 43
    +1
    usa will always help. here, offer them to cut our yao, so they will come running naked with a jigsaw wink
  • Ruslan_F38
    Ruslan_F38 25 March 2013 13: 51
    0
    It’s interesting, but you can’t destroy them about the USA?)) Ukraine upsets me of course, they have completely lost their national identity.
    1. vitamin ky
      vitamin ky 25 March 2013 14: 46
      +1
      not only upset you, you read such news - and ashamed of the country - after all, we can’t do anything ourselves - although no - one thing is great with us - "the seat is not even on two chairs, but on four" - offensive crying
  • Warrawar
    Warrawar 25 March 2013 13: 51
    +3
    The long-awaited "investments" have come to Ukraine!
  • lewerlin53rus
    lewerlin53rus 25 March 2013 14: 00
    +4
    US to help Ukraine get rid of rocket fuel

    And at the same time from industry, agriculture, the army, etc.
    1. vitamin ky
      vitamin ky 25 March 2013 14: 49
      +2
      Quote: lewerlin53rus
      US to help Ukraine get rid of rocket fuel

      And at the same time from industry, agriculture, the army, etc.


      heh -that we have not had for a long time-although your train of thought is correct and understandable
    2. medwed1976
      medwed1976 25 March 2013 14: 56
      0
      and most importantly from sovereignty ... or have already helped
      1. vitamin ky
        vitamin ky 25 March 2013 15: 09
        +2
        our country itself is to blame for the situation - with other Rome we know how the attempt to get along with everyone at once and flirt with several partners at once ends (either tripper or unwanted pregnancy smile ), which by the way we now have)
        By the way, there is: the name, the coat of arms <anthem <and the state border - does not guarantee statehood and sovereignty - so it flatters doubts and only - so we don't need helpers - we ourselves are destroying what we had and do not make efforts that we have something has become negative
  • afire
    afire 25 March 2013 14: 28
    +2
    We lost Ukraine guys, if their top is not demolished - we will be incredible pancakes in the Crimea. where do ukrainians look? - there is a gooey experience of Russia - the same scenario .... why are they killing themselves?
    1. Arkan
      Arkan 25 March 2013 15: 22
      +1
      Quote: afire
      We lost Ukraine guys, if their top is not demolished - we will be incredible pancakes in the Crimea. where do ukrainians look? - there is a gooey experience of Russia - the same scenario .... why are they killing themselves?

      Everything is somewhat more complicated ... do not forget that the initiators of the collapse of the USSR were in Moscow and not in Kiev, some of them are still in power in Russia and they are most often shouting about the "betrayal of Ukraine" now ... Actually, this is one of the reasons why that half of the Ukrainians who have not taken part in the elections for the last twenty years (since they initially did not want the collapse of the USSR) do not trust today's Russia as well as the West.
      1. Cheloveck
        Cheloveck 25 March 2013 18: 51
        +2
        Quote: Arkan
        Everything is somewhat more complicated ... do not forget that the initiators of the collapse of the USSR were in Moscow and not in Kiev

        And Kravchuk, it seems like not at work?
        1. Arkan
          Arkan 25 March 2013 19: 34
          +1
          Quote: Cheloveck
          And Kravchuk, it seems like not at work?

          Perhaps, and "in business" only without looking back at Moscow, he would not dare to utter a word.
  • pinecone
    pinecone 25 March 2013 15: 14
    0
    Quote: elmi
    Once, like this, "good America" ​​helped to cut our ballistic missiles and close military factories

    Under the guise of the already thoroughly forgotten term "conversion". And they also had "denationalization". You can't say it right away, but the country was denationalized to smithereens.
  • homosum20
    homosum20 25 March 2013 15: 19
    -3
    Let us drive - we will help. All the same, ho.ly (ho, I beg the truth not to be offended) pido ... s.
    1. vitamin ky
      vitamin ky 25 March 2013 15: 31
      +2
      my dear — you would filter the bazaar — you violate the rules of the site and human decency — to express yourself in this way — to insult a bunch of people — whom you don’t even know — it's mean and low
      1. homosum20
        homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 12
        -9
        And about "you" - you hammer the arrow, and I will score your "you" in your throat.
        1. homosum20
          homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 42
          -3
          Scite, brothers Ukrainians? You have to answer for the bazaar. Or filter it.
          1. Manager
            Manager 25 March 2013 16: 47
            +3
            Quote: homosum20

            Scite, brothers Ukrainians? You have to answer for the bazaar. Or filter it.


            Oh you are a clown. I'm Russian, but you really make me angry. The hero is sitting at the monitor and men are pouring mud on the men.
            A normal man will never measure letters on a site and score arrows in view of the futility of this venture.
        2. Skavron
          Skavron 25 March 2013 21: 16
          0
          Quote: homosum20
          And about "you" - you hammer the arrow, and I will score your "you" in your throat.

          Ukraine
          Donetsk region.
          Konstaninovka
          st. Minsk 265
          Come hammer it in the throat
          or do you always merge and become disgraced?
          come on ... wait. Or do you still come from the train to come?
          1. morpex
            morpex 25 March 2013 21: 33
            +1
            Quote: Skavron
            come on ... wait. Or do you still come from the train to come?

            Let's throw off and buy a ticket for him! How are you?
            1. Skavron
              Skavron 25 March 2013 22: 31
              0
              no, we are oh-oh-so-so-poor ... still buy him a ticket)))
    2. Fastblast
      Fastblast 25 March 2013 15: 40
      +4
      Inadequate?
      What does all Ukrainians have to do with it?
      1. homosum20
        homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 15
        -6
        Excuse me, where did you see the word "everything"? I say ro your government, which expresses the interests of ALL Ukrainians. You are not satisfied with my statements, or the actions of YOUR government? All questions to your government from you - on Khreshchatyk. And I'm in Russia.
    3. Kars
      Kars 25 March 2013 15: 45
      0
      Quote: homosum20
      Let us drive - we will help

      Really? Give, with great pleasure.
      Why were you silent before?
      People that live in the vicinity of those depots, even your last words will not be offended.
      1. homosum20
        homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 44
        -1
        So get it! Why minus ?. Ah, can you not? is this your government and who chose him? Chose - answer. Why should others be responsible for your FUCK..you?
        1. Kars
          Kars 25 March 2013 17: 10
          +1
          Quote: homosum20
          So carry

          And who are you? Or to your country house personally? And do you agree with customs? On the transport of chemically hazardous substances?
          Quote: homosum20
          is this your government

          It seems you do not understand what you are talking about.
          Quote: homosum20
          Why should others be responsible for your FUCK..you?

          Ours is left to us from the USSR.
          1. Arkan
            Arkan 25 March 2013 17: 26
            -1
            Kars, I welcome you! There is such a term "chronophage" in everyday life, Internet trolls are one of their varieties. And there have always been enough provocateurs on the network (and they do not always belong to the nation on whose behalf they speak) smile Do not waste your time on them.
            1. Kars
              Kars 25 March 2013 17: 57
              +2
              Quote: Arkan
              Internet trolls - one

              Well, it’s inappropriately to generalize the trolls. You can look at my profile.

              and so the campaign type catches up with what it is about. He thinks that there are nishtyaks to divide there without him, and why the tanks are painted in such a strange color, and people go around in chemical protection suits and he’s not familiar

              Name of harmful
              substances
              1st stage 2nd stage 3rd stage
              Blowout
              from all of us
              163-x
              SKD, kg
              Al2O3 19975,7 11512,5 5622,8 2023970,0
              HCl 6855,8 1351,3 678,5 486680,0
              CO 9121,7 5290,9 1849,8 887300,0
              NOx (in terms of NO2) 1808,0 3974,4 3532,8 504828,8
              Dioxins and cyclic
              heteroaromatic substances
              458,4 238,3 84,4 42640,0
              Sooty polycyclic substances 781,6 453,4 158,6 76040,0
              Total 39001,2 22820,8 11926,9 4021441
              .
              1. Arkan
                Arkan 25 March 2013 18: 29
                -1
                Quote: Kars
                Well inappropriately generalize trolls

                Psychology is a fairly accurate science. smile
                Quote: Kars
                and so the campaign type catches up with what I mean

                Even if he knew he would behave in the same way. At least it kills your time, at the very least it causes negative emotions (this is actually the goal). I picked up a couple of everyday examples (to make it clearer about what I mean).
                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgw_2NIGVgc
                http://www.myfilofax.ru/chonofag/
                http://subscribe.ru/group/zvyozdnyij-put/2652888/
            2. homosum20
              homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 35
              0
              Not about the provocateurs. It's about those who live in one country, and the bazaar after another. Are you happy with everything there? Well, do not meddle on our sites. Who called you here?
          2. homosum20
            homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 33
            0
            Come on to the country! What is in the way? That piz .. you are more than you can. Well shut up!
          3. homosum20
            homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 34
            0
            And you-this is not the USSR? Maybe the children are not yours?
      2. homosum20
        homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 32
        0
        So come on! Without piz..zh. And then, as always, in Ukrainian - they squandered - and we are not lucky.
    4. homosum20
      homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 11
      -2
      never loved the truth. Even during the Soviet Union, they claimed to feed the Russians. Who can they feed? They can only suck and put cons. I turn to the Russians - am I wrong? They do not put minuses to me - they put minuses to you. And when (if) they enter NATO, we will wash ourselves with blood. not yatskoy. His. They will hide behind the Americans. Are you (or are we Russians afraid to offend anyone? Therefore we go in shit ourselves).
      1. Manager
        Manager 25 March 2013 16: 52
        +3
        Quote: homosum20
        They do not put minuses to me - they put minuses to you.

        Oh, where did that bring you.
        Don’t you, dear friend, let’s answer for yourself. I would not want us to be perceived by all of us as an Internet of zats.

        PS> here everyone probably has his own opinion about Ukraine. And it's mostly not the best. But to stoop to the point that would throw mud at fellow Slavs on the Internet, almost no one stoops.
        Remain human, and do not become like homosum20 personalities. I am not talking about hypocrisy, but I am calling for restraint. For the word is not a sparrow.
        1. homosum20
          homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 37
          0
          I will answer for myself. Come on - place, time - I will answer. I would also not want to be confused with you.
  • lechatormosis
    lechatormosis 25 March 2013 15: 34
    0
    RUSSIA this GOLFOU has already passed it seems UKRAINE will have to BEND UNDER THE MATTRESSES.
    1. homosum20
      homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 19
      -3
      Most cannot imagine how long. And frankly, no one knows how this will end. When a brother goes to his brother, this is armageddon.
      But who is with the sword to us, well, and so on ......
      1. homosum20
        homosum20 25 March 2013 16: 38
        -2
        As far as I understood from the discussion, the site commentators like the appeal "you". I judge by points. I want to deepen the question: maybe the appeal "pido..s" - like it even more?
        Next - h.hlyats .. I have already lured the point of view on Russian issues. I want to remind you that Ukraine has been seeking accession to the European Union and NATO for several years, which are promoters of the US strategy on the European continent. This is an objective fact. THOSE. The state of UKRAINE, as a potential (and aspiring to this) member of NATO, is our ENEMY. Russians may snot about fraternity, but they don’t perceive bullets and shells of these categories. In particular, Ukrainians killed our guys in Georgia. Of course, they forgot about this because of the Khokh. We must not forget. At least for the sake of the dead.
        I perceive the point of view of any household on this site as the point of view of the enemy. Who does not agree - object. Just do not need snot about historical roots. Kalashnikov assault rifle historical roots do not care.
        And now I'll see what awaits us. Snot and the end of Russia. Or they will know their place.
        Why your points - this is the last thing that interests me.
        1. homosum20
          homosum20 25 March 2013 17: 08
          -4
          In general, h.h.ly remind me of the Jews. (Vadim h.kh.ly is not hoch.ly, you yourself understand, and there is no reason to ban it for that) They crucified Christ, because they wanted to eat fat, and to spoil the truth. (especially the Pharisees in the temple). Now the moral descendants of these are shouting about the Holocaust. (And note - both of them).
          What besides contempt and distrust can such people cause?
          1. homosum20
            homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 26
            0
            I am not addressing to am, but to Russian. We constantly talk about our own uniqueness, about the defenselessness of our culture in front of all sorts of strangers. Well, where are you, supporters of Russian identity. TOTAL FOREIGN JOB, such as marines, squawrons, etc. it pours - do you agree? I do not care about these toy cons. Do you not understand that it was Kuchma in the first place that initiated the collapse of the USSR? Now they, like the Georgians, are climbing into our market for nothing, undermining it by dumping, and also show off. I am Russian. I hate traitors. traitors (who was on the Maidan? A mistake? You have to pay for the mistakes.) Us Russians, like a fag ... owls, once again have smug ki. I do not agree with this. I have not been and I will not. And you, if you agree, you deserve it.
            To the administrators, you didn’t just remove the flags. Politics is shit. You are a politician.
            1. homosum20
              homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 50
              0
              Only smart people understand (and you, it seemed to me, are not fools) - you can fool a small number of people for a long time .... (I’ll throw the middle out - you don’t know yourself) .... but you cannot constantly fool everyone. We have been deceived for too long for Vaschinta feints to pass. People need to know who they are talking to. Apparently, you are not interested. You are again for an international vinaigrette in which there is not unity, but there is visibility (your default figure). Only, if you are smart people, you must understand - the one who wants to drink, he wants to drink, and not. And this is immediately noticeable in emphasis.
        2. morpex
          morpex 25 March 2013 20: 52
          +3
          Quote: homosum20
          The state of UKRAINE, as a potential (and aspiring to this) member of NATO, is our ENEMY.

          According to all data, Russia on cooperation is much more closely tied to NATO than Ukraine. Here you and the Mistrals and Iveks and transshipment bases in your territory. So that whose cow would moo ...
          Quote: homosum20
          In particular, Ukrainians killed our guys in Georgia.

          Show me the facts, photos of these freaks their last names.
          Quote: homosum20
          I perceive the point of view of any household on this site as the point of view of the enemy. Who does not agree - object

          In my opinion, you have enough of your enemies in Russia. At least you figured it out. And you pay tribute to Kadyrov and his gang under the guise of development assistance, and then you sit and spray your saliva ...

          Quote: homosum20
          And now I'll see what awaits us. Snot and the end of Russia.

          With an approach like yours, a clown is definitely the end ...
          1. Skavron
            Skavron 25 March 2013 22: 36
            -1
            Marine, let’s better not throw off a ticket, but throw off a bottle ... otherwise I can’t re-read the tantrums of homosum20 soberly ... it really vomits like that hamster))))
            1. homosum20
              homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 16
              0
              Crest, this is a Russian site. You on the site Bendery show off, wise guy. And here no one is waiting for you. We are Russians.
          2. homosum20
            homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 15
            +1
            morpex (sorry, I was at the operation, it was not up to you), you either, or skillfully pretend to be. The destruction of Russia as a state was and is the goal of NATO and the United States. Are you writing for hamsters? Or do not understand the obvious things? NATO is an enemy of Russia. It is unlikely that this hypothesis will have opponents. Is NATO an enemy of Ukraine? Whose nonsense is this? Rather, yours.
            If you haven’t read the confession of yours on the Internet, you haven’t watched on TV - you are a narrow-minded and uninteresting person. Watch the programs of that time. I don’t have time to prove to the demagogues that it was broadcast throughout Russia. You killed the Russian guys. You () are enemies.
            As for Kadyrov, don’t sweat it. Yanukovych’s gang is no better to pay. Only Kadyrov with Dzhigits do not go home and to the office and don’t have me in the ass - and Yanukovych has you like that.
            And about my end, still suck.
  • Geisenberg
    Geisenberg 25 March 2013 16: 02
    -3
    That's right, dispose of it, otherwise don't let the Russian boron take it back ... it would be necessary to throw off some other little plant, and make a dump of toxic waste out of a low-lying one.
    1. homosum20
      homosum20 April 2 2013 19: 17
      +1
      Yes, waste is more toxic than you do not.
  • 120352
    120352 25 March 2013 16: 04
    0
    The United States will help get rid of not only rocket fuel, but in general everything, including the budget of Ukraine. And we will have to pull it out of the mud again!
  • Kolyan 2
    Kolyan 2 25 March 2013 16: 36
    +2
    US to help Ukraine get rid of rocket fuel

    This they can do. They’ll get rid of oil, gas. But the fuel, it is necessary to invest money. it means not just for thanks, but it will be more substantial. Do not lose Ukraine.
  • WWW.budanov
    WWW.budanov 25 March 2013 17: 06
    -2
    Quote: Dwarfik
    Kind! Who would doubt that they would help, and they themselves would pay for everything ... long! This is called - running kozel in the garden.

    And besides this (free of charge) the next "Chernobyl" will be prepared ...
  • i-gor63
    i-gor63 25 March 2013 17: 48
    -3
    They would save everything. And from people too. Free cheese is known to be in a mousetrap.
    1. Ruslan67
      Ruslan67 25 March 2013 18: 12
      +3
      Quote: i-gor63
      Free cheese is known to be in a mousetrap.

      And then lately it has risen in price laughing
  • Mails
    Mails 25 March 2013 18: 40
    -1
    Of course, amers will help cut and recycle ...
    And Russia in times of conflict will help, as always, protect unarmed friendly people in the event of any conflict ...
    These are called hopes, when one hopes on the other and on the neck of the paws will overwhelm a case of a difficult situation ...
    The leadership of Ukraine understands everything perfectly ... just this fact will help enrich their pocket ... And the Russian Ivanushka take the rap in case of something serious himself .... And while the Ukrainian government proudly says - "Every man for himself" - and then, as they say late ... "Russia help! Beat the sypostat."
  • Vital 33
    Vital 33 25 March 2013 19: 24
    +1
    Hmm, insanity grows stronger ... and the winter that lingered, to see someone demolished the last crumbs of reason ...
    No, well, let this fuel lie to itself, it can explode, or spill over the rivers ... from people, someday be strangled, be careful with hatred, brains will burst.
  • morpex
    morpex 25 March 2013 20: 25
    0
    Quote: homosum20
    So get it! Why minus ?. Ah, can you not? is this your government and who chose him? Chose - answer. Why should others be responsible for your FUCK..you?

    So we would be happy! But you don’t need this heptyl either. As you don’t have zero recycling technology. Do you have a little toxic waste? Do you even understand what substance it is?
    1. Vital 33
      Vital 33 25 March 2013 20: 30
      -2
      Yes there is no use ... a person has some kind of personal vendetta for Ukrainians))).
  • O_RUS
    O_RUS 25 March 2013 22: 25
    -1
    Quote: morpex
    What will be better? Let here amers and let them at least do something in this direction?


    ... and this is not once again, under a plausible pretext, to let the amers come closer to Russia ... pressure ... as an option? The militants in Chechnya were armed ... got away with it, gas is being stolen ... now amers to Russia
    1. Skavron
      Skavron 25 March 2013 22: 40
      +1
      Quote: O_RUS
      Militants in Chechnya armed ...

      but what weapon is interesting?
      I didn’t notice something m-16 ... everything is mostly AK ...

      Quote: O_RUS
      let amers get closer to Russia

      They are ALREADY in Russia ... so here you will be among the Ukrainians.

      Quote: O_RUS
      gas steals ...

      Where? By whom? Facts please ...
      1. morpex
        morpex 26 March 2013 00: 46
        -1
        Quote: O_RUS
        Quote: morpex
        What will be better? Let here amers and let them at least do something in this direction?


        ... and this is not once again, under a plausible pretext, to let the amers come closer to Russia ... pressure ... as an option? The militants in Chechnya were armed ... got away with it, gas is being stolen ... now amers to Russia

        I will answer with the words of another
        Quote: Vital 33
        Hmm, insanity grows stronger ... and the winter that lingered, to see someone demolished the last crumbs of reason ...
  • morpex
    morpex 25 March 2013 23: 13
    0
    Quote: Skavron
    Marine, let’s better not throw off a ticket, but throw off a bottle ... otherwise I can’t re-read the tantrums of homosum20 soberly ... it really vomits like that hamster))))

    Good thought ... I’ll definitely throw off in your area. Now thanks to this banderlog I know your address ... drinks
    1. Skavron
      Skavron 26 March 2013 01: 12
      0
      Well, in a personal email ... I will be glad of course) drinks
  • O_RUS
    O_RUS 26 March 2013 02: 18
    0
    Quote: morpex
    I will answer with the words of another


    well ... it’s always been like that
  • O_RUS
    O_RUS 26 March 2013 11: 36
    -3
    Quote: Skavron
    but what weapon is interesting?
    I didn’t notice something m-16 ... everything is mostly AK ...

    Quote: Skavron
    Where? By whom? Facts please ...


    .... answer you, convince, explain the obvious ... - waste of time

    ... for you are a slave

    Try to achieve harmony with yourself and the world. Good luck to you.
    1. Skavron
      Skavron 26 March 2013 13: 04
      +1
      Quote: O_RUS
      ... answer you, convince, explain the obvious ... - a waste of time

      Oga, it’s easier for you to say this than to bring FACTS !!!
      For they are not, and you are just a liar and a provocateur.
      And for my harmony do not worry) I am always friends with my inner world ... the profession obliges
  • O_RUS
    O_RUS 26 March 2013 11: 52
    -1
    Quote: homosum20
    never loved the truth. Even during the Soviet Union, they claimed to feed the Russians. Who can they feed? They can only suck and put cons. I turn to the Russians - am I wrong? They do not put minuses to me - they put minuses to you. And when (if) they enter NATO, we will wash ourselves with blood. not yatskoy. His. They will hide behind the Americans. Are you (or are we Russians afraid to offend anyone? Therefore we go in shit ourselves).


    I am Ukrainian ... I have been living in Russia for more than a year, but I agree with you in many ways. In part, the double standard among ordinary fellow tribesmen (Ukrainians) was a plus for the move. The main and decisive one was sent to further training ... now I go to my hometown (to Ukraine) to teach - Unfortunately, only living in Russia I manage to maintain my knowledge up to the mark.

    You don’t swear, but we Ukrainians minus everything that we don’t like, even if it’s true. The history is full of examples that such a position (figuratively speaking) brings positive results
    Good luck to you!
    1. morpex
      morpex 26 March 2013 12: 45
      0
      Quote: O_RUS
      I am Ukrainian ... I have been living in Russia for more than a year, but I agree with you in many ways.

      Well then, everything falls into place. In principle, I suspected that you were a renegade.
    2. Skavron
      Skavron 26 March 2013 13: 05
      0
      Quote: O_RUS
      Yes, we Ukrainians minus everything that we don’t like, even if it's true

      well, so far there is not much truth from you
  • darksoul
    darksoul 26 March 2013 21: 08
    +1
    Helpers hu .... you
  • Hauptmann emil
    Hauptmann emil 26 March 2013 21: 51
    +1
    And why the photo shows the cars of the fire train? belay
  • O_RUS
    O_RUS 28 March 2013 23: 32
    +1
    Quote: morpex
    In principle, I suspected that you were a renegade.


    calling me a renegade you perceive Russia as an enemy for a renegade is a person who has changed his beliefs, transferred to the camp of opponents; traitor, apostate.

    Etc. fool it’s good that you are just a forum fighter ... people with this view of studying in Russia - BRAKES for the development of Ukraine
  • O_RUS
    O_RUS 29 March 2013 21: 15
    +1
    Quote: Skavron
    Oga, it’s easier for you to say this than to bring FACTS !!!
    For they are not, and you are just a liar and a provocateur.
    And for my harmony do not worry) I am always friends with my inner world ... the profession obliges


    facts? You will deny the obvious. And the example is negative - gas theft

    Harmony and presence of professional deformation? - do not present yourself as a clown (like trying to become a person, but express yourself as ....) At least try to leave a "hat" (I mean professional deformation) at work.