Again about protecting fuel and energy complex facilities. Is it possible to secure oil refineries and oil depots?

83
Again about protecting fuel and energy complex facilities. Is it possible to secure oil refineries and oil depots?

Attacks have been and will be. The fuel and energy complex is the lifeblood of modern warfare. Without fuel, without lubricants, equipment turns into an ordinary stationary, and therefore, an easy target. Without gasoline or diesel fuel, even ordinary infantry will stop. Not only electricity at the front is generated by diesel or gasoline stations, but also ordinary heating of dugouts. Not to mention charging numerous devices and batteries.

I would not hesitate to call damage or at least damage to the refinery or storage base a factor capable of stopping the offensive and changing the balance of forces on the LBS. And this, under the current conditions, is probably one of the few options for solving the problem of the Russian offensive for Kyiv.



Is there a solution to the problem? Is it possible to develop a unified mechanism for protecting such facilities? This is what we should talk about today. Talk seriously, without idiotic proposals like installing shooters with hunting rifles around the perimeter of the plant or building a fence made of Pantsirs or other similar installations.

What is the main difficulty in protecting fuel and energy complex facilities?


It is worth starting from afar. From an elementary question that few people think about. From the area of ​​the facility! A modern oil refinery or storage base is practically a city of regional scale. Due to circumstances, I remember well the accident at the Omsk Oil Refinery that occurred in August last year.

Officially, the gas-air mixture exploded during repair work. But even today, the option of using the Ukrainian drone not discarded. This accident had too serious consequences. So, for information, the Omsk Oil Refinery is 21,3 million tons of refined oil and 5,1 million tons of produced motor gasoline (11,5% of the total production in the Russian Federation), according to data for 2023. A strange accident that put half of the plant's production out of action due to repairs...

Is it possible to hit a target at a great distance? Is it possible to program a drone so that it actually hits where it needs to? Let me ask you, when the Ukrainian Armed Forces attack populated areas in the Kursk region, do they really care where the drone hits? Any hit is already a success. That's how the Ukrainian Armed Forces operate today. Military or civilian - it doesn't matter to them. What matters is that it's Russian.

To better understand the problem, I will give an example of objects that every reader has seen. These are oil depots, of which there are about 500 in Russia. There are not so many large storage facilities, about 20. The rest are of medium or small category. The division of such storage facilities depends on the volume of product stored there. So:

Firstly, large oil depots where 50 thousand or more cubic meters of product are stored;

Secondly, medium-sized storage facilities. They store from 10 to 50 thousand cubic meters;

Thirdly, small oil depots with a storage capacity of less than 10 thousand cubic meters.

An average oil depot occupies an area of ​​about 153 thousand square meters. For comparison, the area of ​​a standard football field is 714 square meters. It is not difficult to calculate the length of the perimeter that needs to be protected. And given the danger of the stored product, the perimeter can easily be increased two or three times. A drone shot down over the territory of the facility will also cause serious damage. So, five hundred such facilities alone, without oil refineries, that need to be protected.

There is another problem that is quite difficult to solve. It is the country's territory. Russia is huge, which gives the enemy the opportunity to find ways around existing Defense and deliver the warhead to the intended target with virtually no counteraction from our systems, especially if in this case Ukrainians have the support of US aerospace intelligence.

Even after the first "distant" attack, I had the idea of ​​the possibility of striking from Russian territory. No one denies the presence of a fairly developed network of Ukrainian saboteurs on our territory. And it is difficult to deny it. FSB operatives work quite well and, fortunately for us, catch spies, saboteurs and other idiots recruited by the SBU and the GUR of Ukraine.

So, what methods of counteracting the SBU can we work out at the moment? First of all, this is a complete cover for all thermal power plant facilities. Is this possible today? Alas, no. We are not so rich in systems EW and air defense, so that we could seriously consider this option. Even if we remove such systems from the front line, it will not give anything. Except for weakening our positions there, at the front.

Another option is the work of our intelligence and counterintelligence to identify enemy agents in our agencies responsible for the security of fuel and energy facilities. And also the introduction of our people into Ukrainian structures that are planning raids... We simply do not have time for this option, and on the other side, they are also calculating this option.

There is one more option left. "Drive" the launchers and control points away from our facilities. Simply put, liberate the border regions of Ukraine and create a kind of no-fly zone there. The option is complicated, but quite feasible. But even this option does not provide a 100% guarantee of safety for factories and bases...

Let me remind you about the factories and storage facilities in Saudi Arabia. Despite very serious security measures, including even continuous patrolling of the perimeter of the facilities by Patriot air defense systems. And what is the result? The Houthis simply launch drones at low altitude, in the blind zone of the air defense system, and easily overcome the defense. True, the distances there are incomparable with ours.

Therefore, as it seems to me, today it is necessary to use all the opportunities that the army and the heads of enterprises have. There is an opportunity to use electronic warfare systems – we must use them. There is an opportunity to organize perimeter patrols with anti-drone weapons - Patrol. There is no point in hoping that we will find a way to protect ourselves from attacks any time soon.

Cornered cat


I think readers have noticed how much the intensity of Ukrainian drones' work on targets deep in Russia has increased. In total, our air defense fires 50-100 drones every night, and sometimes more. Experiencing a shortage of trained reserves, Kyiv quite logically remembered the "blood" for the army. Strikes are carried out persistently, until at least some success.

Creating a fuel deficit in the troops, as I wrote above, is one of the ways to stop the offensive. Ukraine has no other ways. A cat, driven into a corner, uses all means to get out. Even the nuclear threat does not stop them. Remember January 29, when one of the UAVs targeted a nuclear facility, the Smolensk Nuclear Power Plant, in the Smolensk region.

Naturally, understanding that the probability of a successful operation by a single drone is almost zero, the enemy has now switched to massive attacks. It accumulates drones and then launches them in a "flock". The tactics are not new, and we have used them quite successfully. And given the vulnerability of the targets, it is quite effective. Even the debris of downed drones can cause serious fires at facilities.

There is no need to expect the attacks to stop. Zelensky understands perfectly well that for him, war is life. If there is no war, there will be no former president. Therefore, the attacks will become more and more massive. More and more "incomprehensible" from a military point of view.

Today, many are surprised by how punitive forces behave in the Kursk region. They kill, rape, rob... But try to connect such behavior "on the ground" with the blows missiles and drones on peaceful villages and cities. Dropping mines and grenades on evacuated civilians and other "eccentricities" of the Ukrainian Armed Forces. What thoughts came to your mind, dear readers? What fate did you mentally predict for the punishers?

Don't be surprised, but your thoughts, only realized in concrete actions, are the goal of all these atrocities. Kyiv needs to provoke Russia to a disproportionate response, to a blow that can be promoted as genocide of Ukrainians. And thus get a pretext for continuing military actions.

I have already written about the desires of the different parties to the conflict. I think it is worth repeating. We need peace. A lasting and long-term peace, without the possibility of being violated by the other side. The US needs to leave Ukraine with the least possible image losses, while the war must continue in order to continue exporting American weapons. Last year alone, the American defense industry increased its profits by almost a third!

Europe also needs a war. President Biden, no matter how much shit is thrown at him in the US today, has done his job. He has destroyed most of Europe's economy, disarmed European armies, and destroyed long-standing ties between the EU and Russia. Biden has essentially made Europeans slaves of Americans. The peoples of Europe are beginning to understand this. And to prevent this understanding from turning into riots, to ensure that the political elite retains power, a war is needed.

I won't even write about Kyiv and Zelensky's government. Just turn on the TV or computer and listen to the experts on any talk show.

I will finish with one important reminder for the particularly... stupid. It is very difficult for some to understand the fact that the war is not only being waged at the front, the war is being waged everywhere. Including deep in the rear. Social networks are full of messages about some military facilities in the center of Russia, in Siberia, in the Far East. And not just messages, but also photo and video materials.

Well, people don't understand that in this way they are helping enemy intelligence. Intelligence gets 80% of its secret information from open sources. From those very popular channels that strive to become the most read. Soldiers and war correspondents on LBS have already realized that they cannot be filmed against the background of recognizable objects, now it's the turn of civilians. By the way, soon, perhaps, they will introduce a ban on such filming and even fines...

And finally. For dessert. According to some sources, in the last days of January, the enemy used a new type of drones for the first time. Zelensky spoke about them a month ago. Drones-cruise missiles. I mean that you can't underestimate the enemy.
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  1. -3
    4 February 2025 04: 53
    Zelensky understands perfectly well that for him war is life. If there is no war, there will be no former president.
    Hence the conclusion: remove Zelensky - end the war!
    1. +11
      4 February 2025 10: 32
      Grandma promised not to touch the green. Because, primary sexual characteristics, to make a male decision, are not visible, grandfather has long ago become a bvbushka.
      1. -3
        4 February 2025 19: 22
        For the winners of the Special Olympics, the war in Donbass was started not by an expired product, but by a pastry chef.
        The power there has already changed once, so what?
        We'll kill the clown - it will be Syrsky. Or someone else even more different. And yes, the risk of liquidation by a Russian missile will not stop their desire to become the next contender for the Kiev throne.
        1. +3
          5 February 2025 06: 52
          If you persistently start chopping off the heads of the hydra, over time the hydra will run out of biomaterial from which a new head can grow.
        2. 0
          6 February 2025 02: 44
          The war in Donbass was started not by an expired person, but by a confectioner.
          It seems like the pastor has already started
          the risk of being eliminated by a Russian missile will not stop their desire to become the next contender for the Kyiv throne.
          However, being sent from the throne to the cemetery on a rocket will definitely change something in the brains of the candidates. But their long and carefree life, on the contrary, will only excite them
    2. BAI
      +3
      4 February 2025 10: 38
      remove Zelensky - end the war!

      Another one will come. We need to remove the puppeteers, not the puppet.
      1. +8
        4 February 2025 11: 05
        Quote: BAI
        The puppeteers need to be removed

        We don't dare cut the strings, and we're afraid to hiss at the puppeteer! request
        1. AAK
          +4
          4 February 2025 12: 05
          With normal, and not "jacket-and-nepotism" preparation for the SVO and with the presence of political will, this operation could have been completed in about a year and a half (without going into Western Banderland - it definitely needs to be foisted off on the Poles, Romanians, Hungarians and Slovaks), but there is no preparation, no will...
          1. +6
            4 February 2025 13: 48
            Quote: AAK
            there's just no preparation, no will...
            We calculated the same as the Crimea option. The saber campaign and Crimea is ours
    3. +1
      4 February 2025 19: 03
      Hence the conclusion: remove Zelensky - end the war!

      Well, there will be Zaluzhny, which is even worse. Yes, and Budanov is no sugar.
      Hence the conclusion: Ukraine must be finished! And as quickly as possible, not by slowly squeezing toothpaste out of a tube. There are not enough weapons and fighters, but there is Kuzkina mother - that means we use nuclear weapons on special objects and on individual cities. Of course, the population must be warned in advance.
      1. +1
        4 February 2025 19: 37
        Quote: Alexey Lantukh
        Of course, the population needs to be warned in advance.

        And we also need to start burning oil refineries in the countries that sponsored Nazism. No one will provide us with the necessary amounts of fuel and lubricants, and Zelensky will be forced to do so from all over Europe.
        We are at war, but in Europe they live and chew gingerbread.
        The firm conviction that Brzezinski's words about Russia's "elite" were right has not disappeared...
        In fact, we have been confronted with the fact of the gradual destruction of the structures of the Russian economy. We are only watching the clumsy movements of various officials and continue to guess when this circus with horses will end. It is impossible to explain anything with sound logic and judgments of a sober mind. We can only guess who this Russian bourgeoisie works for, but the situation of ordinary citizens of the country is not getting any better, and the number of citizens themselves is decreasing every year. Soon the question will be posed differently: will they destroy us or will we destroy them?
      2. 0
        5 February 2025 20: 49
        Yes, there is everything in abundance except one thing - the strategy of VICTORY. The government, measuring the greatness of the country exclusively by "increasing trade turnover" with expensive partners, has created for itself a practically insoluble problem. The forces that today participate in the SVO under the terms of a contract with the Ministry of Defense are not enough for victory, and the state of the economy does not allow attracting forces in quantities sufficient to achieve victory under the same conditions.
        1. -1
          5 February 2025 22: 27
          The forces that are currently participating in the SVO under the terms of a contract with the Ministry of Defense are not sufficient for victory, and the state of the economy does not allow for the involvement of forces in quantities sufficient to achieve victory under the same conditions.

          That's it! The shortage of weapons and military equipment is clear to all armchair experts, not to mention the specialists of the Ministry of Defense. I would also add the shortage of qualified military personnel at all levels, which leads to the tactics of squeezing out, rather than strategic encirclement, which would change the parity of the opposing forces in our favor. Imagine if the May offensive with sufficient forces on Vovchansk along the Seversky Donets, and then on Kupyansk ended with the encirclement and liquidation of this cauldron, then this would have created a significant advantage in our favor and the Armed Forces of Ukraine would not have time for Kursk. But such strategic operations are not carried out. Why? Well, who knows? We do not know all our shortcomings. Only some.
          1. 0
            6 February 2025 07: 20
            So maybe it’s not so much a matter of shortcomings, but rather that we simply don’t know the true goals of the SVO?
    4. Qas
      0
      6 February 2025 00: 54
      Nonsense. Little depends on Zelinsky in this card game.
      We will gain nothing from his liquidation, he should have been removed immediately, and not given guarantees of personal immunity. And now we need to cut a path to Odessa.
  2. +13
    4 February 2025 05: 54
    War is also necessary for Europe.
    For all the bourgeoisie, war is needed. These are such old women... And people? Oh, God bless them, the women will give birth, and if not, they will bring in... they will exchange... What was the USSR bad, with bad national policy and the countries of the socialist camp, there were no wars within the USSR, Azerbaijan did not fight with Armenia, Georgians with Abkhazians and Ossetians, the Ukrainian SSR with the RSFSR...
    1. -2
      4 February 2025 06: 31
      The SVO has shown that with the modern development of drones, the fuel and energy complex of any state must have its own air defense system, constantly on combat duty.
      More small oil depots are needed. Tanks (oil product tanks) should be placed as far apart as possible. It is better to bury them in the ground. Oil refineries should be equipped with 30 mm metal cutters with their own radars, like on Chinese warships.
      If modern Russia had the KGB and SVR from the USSR, then our agents, with the help of drones and various hired European groups, could arrange such an Allahu Akbar for the European fuel and energy complex that the Europeans would have to fill their cars with donkey urine.
      The EU fuel and energy complex is not protected from drone attacks at all. There is a large Chechen diaspora in Europe. Perhaps Ramazan Kadyrov is capable of organizing drone fireworks for the European fuel and energy complex.
      1. -1
        4 February 2025 06: 34
        Trump's Not Peace Plan
        Russia is the only country in the world capable of destroying the United States.
        Author Fedorov. Maybe we will destroy the USA and there will be no problems with the fuel and energy complex. smile
        1. -1
          4 February 2025 06: 47
          Quote: parusnik
          Trump's Not Peace Plan
          Russia is the only country in the world capable of destroying the United States.
          Author Fedorov. Maybe we will destroy the USA and there will be no problems with the fuel and energy complex. smile

          The development of modern drones allows us to introduce a new concept - drone terrorism. The genie is already out of the bottle. The milk has been milked, and it cannot be put back into the cow. The fuel and energy complex will have to work under the threat of constant drone attacks. And this will happen all over the world.
        2. +5
          4 February 2025 07: 43
          Quote: parusnik
          Maybe we can destroy the USA and there won’t be any problems with the fuel and energy complex.

          HER ... wink
          We are our own, bourgeois. It's not possible. lol
          By the way, how is the clause on SVO spelled out in the contracts between the refinery and the insurers?
      2. -1
        4 February 2025 08: 31
        Quote: Bearded
        The SVO has shown that with the modern development of drones, the fuel and energy complex of any state must have its own air defense system, constantly on combat duty.


        Saudi Arabia has already decided that you are right. But the Houthis disagreed with them and periodically blow up oil depots with their drones
      3. +3
        4 February 2025 10: 17
        What has been proven is that wars should be short, victorious, and take place in distant territories. If you give your enemy time to adjust their strategy and develop new products, no air defense will save you.
      4. -2
        4 February 2025 15: 02
        Quote: Bearded
        If modern Russia had КГБ

        Who squandered the entire state - which was dragged in pieces in different directions? Such a KGB is not needed for nothing....
    2. +1
      4 February 2025 19: 42
      Quote: parusnik
      For all the bourgeoisie, war is needed.

      But not on its own territory. If Putin had launched several conventional strikes on countries supplying weapons to Ukraine, no one in Europe would have provoked Russia to continue the execution using anything...
      Well, let them kill each other as much as they want...
      1. +3
        4 February 2025 21: 18
        Do you understand that everyone profits from the SVO? Those who supply weapons to Ukraine and those countries that supply military products to Russia? And especially the intermediaries? The bourgeoisie of all countries has one principle, nothing personal, only profit? Haven't you noticed that somehow countries that are not part of NATO, but of BRICS, do not particularly oppose Ukraine and the countries that support it? They supported Russia, for the sake of decency, and that's enough, once. Did the African countries calm down when it became clear that they would not go hungry, despite the SVO? Name at least one country that actively supports Russia? Does it declare sanctions or at least constantly repeat about the danger that Ukrainian Nazism poses? I mean that all countries, more or less involved in the conflict, have their own business.... If I had struck... yeah, almost in my own... where do we get medicine and much more from, and we give them gas... other raw materials, look, trade turnover with countries that supply weapons to Ukraine has not decreased. Therefore, the SVO will not end in the near future, all the ghouls-bourgeois are doing well, including ours. And if you think that our beloved president does not have any property there, you are deeply mistaken. I will note that there, it is not only Germany, France, England, Spain, there are other, seemingly inconspicuous countries, with good assets and where they keep secrets. Yes, I really love Vladimir Vladimirovich... and sometimes, in the winter, he walks around without a hat... God forbid, he catches a cold.
    3. +1
      5 February 2025 13: 51
      I completely agree, more or less normal.
  3. -2
    4 February 2025 06: 39
    The territory is huge, but it is used extremely stupidly, well, I personally do not understand why strategically important objects, military-industrial complex objects, and large industrial enterprises are located in the zone of probable shelling, and the reach of enemy strikes, okay, objects built in the USSR, the borders were different, but in the Russian Federation, well, and that's if they were able to build them.
  4. -3
    4 February 2025 06: 53
    The author is right. All forces must be drawn into this fight. And no one should go alone. But for some reason we have forgotten about large owners. A country is strong where the participation of billionaires in the affairs of the country is clearly visible. And there is simply nothing to be proud of in the fact that there are many rich people in the country. It is their participation that helps countries build multi-million cities and ensure the defense of the country. Since we have moved on to this, we must all be together.
  5. +5
    4 February 2025 07: 15
    This will continue for a long time, while half the country is at war, and the other half pretends that nothing is happening
    1. +5
      4 February 2025 09: 54
      Quote: Idle_piston
      This will continue for a long time, while half the country is at war, and the other half pretends that nothing is happening

      So what do you suggest?
  6. -2
    4 February 2025 07: 34
    It is possible to organize perimeter patrols with anti-drone weapons - patrol.


    What can I say ...
    This is not about refineries or even oil depots. Too late! The drone lost control and fell on the site anyway. Maybe on a vacant lot, if you're lucky, but most likely it will hit a tank, column, heat exchanger, or product pipeline, which are located everywhere there. Fire, explosion, destruction of equipment (facility), loss of shift.

    If space reconnaissance is unable to detect UAVs, there should be continuous patrolling of the border by AWACS with subsequent interception by air defense, helicopters, etc. If AWACS is not enough, then there is no way to save the factories except by eliminating the source of the UAVs.
    1. -5
      4 February 2025 08: 35
      Quote from Eugene Zaboy
      The drone lost control and still fell onto the site.

      Yes, a fire may even start. But it fell in the wrong place. You understand perfectly well that it is one thing to hit the most complex units that take a long time to restore, and another thing to burn down a secondary facility that will not affect production output.
      1. -2
        4 February 2025 09: 06
        It is surprising why the oil tanks are so close to each other and why they are not underground, is this required by the regulations? And also if drones in the plural attack objects hundreds of kilometers away, fly low for hours and no one sees them?
        1. +1
          4 February 2025 09: 47
          Reinforced concrete tanks (RCTs) were built in the USSR, at least they are still present at Transneft facilities (I participated in major repairs), the paradox is that they are CHEAP!!! Cheaper than vertical steel tanks (RVS) assembled sheet by sheet!!! How can you steal them then???
      2. +2
        4 February 2025 09: 33
        Quote: domokl
        Yes, a fire may even start. But it fell in the wrong place. You understand perfectly well that it is one thing to hit the most complex units that take a long time to restore, and another thing to burn down a secondary facility that will not affect production output.


        To make it clear what we are talking about, I am providing a photo.
        In each tube, in the attached photo, an oil product moves under significant pressure and high temperature. The valve seals are leaking, the flanges are digging, there are traces of oil products and gas contamination everywhere. Below, under the columns, there are pumping stations, where everything also leaks and is necessarily gassed. The pumps operate on water vapor, so they do not explode. Even the kettle, in the control room, is located in a strictly designated place with powerful forced ventilation and a gas analyzer. All the tools are copper-plated to eliminate sparks during work. The nails on the shoes are also copper. Is it possible to allow an outbreak in such a place? You have to go there to understand what we are talking about.
        1. 0
          4 February 2025 09: 43
          With respect, Colleague!!! hi
    2. -1
      4 February 2025 10: 51
      The experience of this war showed that AWACS aircraft cannot operate safely near an unsuppressed long-range air defense system.
      1. -1
        4 February 2025 15: 14
        Quote: overland
        The experience of this war showed that AWACS aircraft cannot operate safely near an unsuppressed long-range air defense system.


        Do AWACS aircraft need to approach the Ukrainian border to detect drones crossing it? The task is to intercept UAVs over Russian territory before striking significant objects, and not to intercept UAVs over Ukrainian territory.
  7. +5
    4 February 2025 09: 52
    The author is another chatterbox, we read: "Europe also needs a war. President Biden, no matter how much shit is poured on him in the US today, has done his job. He has destroyed most of Europe's economy...".
    Staver, no one believes this nonsense about the economy being destroyed in Europe anymore - the oil bases are burning not in Europe but in Ukraine and the Russian Federation.
    All this Solovyov-Zakharovsky nonsense has already gotten on everyone's nerves.
    It feels like the chief propagandists have gone crazy.
  8. -3
    4 February 2025 10: 02
    Protection of fuel and energy complex facilities (as well as any other) is a process that requires investment in technology, personnel training and integration of all security levels. This includes: Organization of Physical Protection; Cybersecurity; Monitoring and Forecasting; Organizational Measures; Technical Measures; Environmental and Social Measures; Insurance and Risk Management; International experience and close cooperation on this issue. Then the required results will be achieved.
  9. BAI
    -5
    4 February 2025 10: 42
    All oil depots and factories from Soviet times. They were designed for nuclear war conditions. This is more powerful than drones.
    The problem is that all the equipment is imported, there is no replacement. Therefore, damage, even minor, is difficult or impossible to repair
    1. +4
      4 February 2025 11: 10
      This is a distillation column from the Omsk Oil Refinery. It was built in the Soviet Union. Could you explain how this structure would withstand a nuclear explosion?
      1. BAI
        -2
        4 February 2025 11: 18
        Why ask stupid questions? No one can survive a nuclear explosion. Especially a direct hit. After that, that's it, the end. There was an emergency reserve that allowed us to quickly restore everything. But now we can't restore it. That's what I wrote about.
        And there were strategic fuel reserves that allowed us to survive the repair period.

        It is now that oil refineries have found themselves within the city limits or in close proximity to cities and may come under attack. But when they were built, it was not intended to use nuclear weapons directly for the plant; they were supposed to keep the shock wave from the nuclear weapons at some distance.
  10. -2
    4 February 2025 11: 44
    What is the main specificity of the oil refinery defeat?
    The fact is that with the slightest puncture of a pipe or tank, a fueled source of combustion is formed, which contributes to its further spread and increase.
    If we try to make self-sealing coatings on these objects, the results of drone hits will not be so catastrophic, and can be quickly restored. I see something like a layer of liquid armor on pipes and tanks as a solution to the problem.
    1. 0
      4 February 2025 15: 41
      I see something like a layer of liquid armor

      Are you from the future?
      We haven't invented liquid armor yet.
      1. 0
        4 February 2025 15: 47
        Quote: nickname7

        We haven't invented liquid armor yet.

        https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%96%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%8F_%D0%B1%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD%D1%8F
        and here's another one from us:
        https://vsluh.net/2068-zhidkost-protiv-puli-student-stomatolog-pridumal-revoljucionnyj-bronezhilet.html
      2. +2
        4 February 2025 15: 49
        Or you could look for something else based on the principle of the combustion products of such a coating increasing in volume. Like - it started to burn, and swelled up into non-flammable foam, sealing the hole.
  11. +1
    4 February 2025 11: 59
    The area of ​​a standard football field is 714 square meters.

    714 sq. m is approximately 32 by 22,5 m.
    The area of ​​a football field, according to FIFA recommendations (length - 105 meters, width - 68 meters), is 7140 square meters
    1. 0
      4 February 2025 17: 39
      These authors love to measure everything in football... The average oil depot occupies an area of ​​about 153 thousand square meters. For comparison, the area of ​​a standard football field is 714 square meters. It is not difficult to calculate the length of the perimeter that must be guarded.
      For most ordinary people, the area of ​​a football field is an abstract concept.
      And 153000 square meters is an area of ​​400×400 meters, approximately.
      As a driver and a pedestrian, this is a more understandable value for me.
  12. -1
    4 February 2025 12: 10
    Mobile fire groups and stationary posts will help reduce damage from raids to a minimum. Mobilize 30-40 thousand people to the air defense and go.
  13. +2
    4 February 2025 12: 25
    1. If it is impossible to organize air defense, then the solution is dispersal, camouflage and fortification.
    Transition to many small installations with simplified equipment of our own production.
    Strengthening the installation is also quite possible. In the first place, protective walls for individual valuable installations, equipment and tanks. This was already done in Germany during World War II and it turned out quite well. The Allies dropped several hundred thousand tons of bombs on the synthetic fuel factories and not only were they unable to destroy them, but they were unable to completely stop production. At the same time, the German fuel industry was not created for survivability from air attacks and the Germans began its restructuring only by the end of 1944. By the summer of 1945, it could move on to new, well-protected installations.
    2. The thesis about the very large size and impossibility of protecting the factories is also very controversial. Protection from ballistic missiles with nuclear charges cannot be compared with protection from slow, fragile drones flying at low altitude. It is quite possible to organize continuous patrols in the air or at least duty on the sites near these factories with light training aircraft or light helicopters with MANPADS, machine guns or anti-tank missiles.
    1. -1
      5 February 2025 07: 07
      Sound granometric and radar reconnaissance, doesn't it mean anything to you?
  14. 0
    4 February 2025 12: 47
    If there is no way to counter drones, then we need to hit the drone manufacturers, Oreshniki, no factories, no drones. Oreshniki, the Yellowstone volcano, there will be no problems in the world at all. smile
  15. +3
    4 February 2025 12: 51
    Today, many are surprised by how punitive forces behave in the Kursk region. They kill, rape, rob...<.........> What thoughts have come to your mind, dear readers?

    Well, it's not complicated. Just two thoughts.
    1. Who the f... allowed this?!
    2. Who the f... will answer this?!
  16. +1
    4 February 2025 13: 25
    Are the aerostat barriers in WWII already forgotten? And the aircraft drone, slow-moving, large, I don't see a fundamental problem in shooting down each one with a heavy kamikaze copter. Yes, it will cost several million, though.
    1. -2
      5 February 2025 07: 05
      Who needs this? Everything is bourgeois, the bourgeoisie will hang themselves for a penny, it's easier for them to get insurance, and there is only one political will in Russia - to hold on to power!
  17. 0
    4 February 2025 15: 38
    It turns out there are too many bases, at least sooner or later most of them will be put out of action, the number of active bases must be reduced, the fuel must be drained and mothballed. And the remaining active bases must be strengthened in defense.
  18. 0
    4 February 2025 16: 56
    For Mr. Staver, as a reminder (from the theory of war), that the war for independence and sovereignty of any country is waged at the front, THIS war, and when it "moves" to the deep rear - it means that it is no longer a war for sovereignty and independence, but a "deal" between the state and the belligerent side and the enemy's agents sitting in the "deep rear", on different "floors" of power, management, provision of THIS war... And, Mr. Staver, in any war, the rear is calmer than the fighting army, and the deep rear is CONFIDENCE in future victory... Moreover, in today's Russia, the "supervising" and guiding "bodies" of our rear exceeds all conceivable and inconceivable limits, which presupposes, there, iron discipline and state control... And if, THEN, no, there is no need to invent various "social excuses" and banal pretexts, IT MEANS, in the active work of the "fifth "column" and the bureaucracy that has joined it, of all stripes and colors... The tightening of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation and PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY OF THE OFFICIALITY, of all levels, on the "ground", may change the situation in the near and far "rear" of Russia... Although it is difficult to talk about a victorious war in a country that is fighting with its own kind, "managing" to supply them (the enemies in the war) with energy resources, nuclear fuel, "rare earth", chemicals. fertilizers, allowing them to transfer their "hard-earned" (currency) there, "releasing" "carriers" of "state secrets" from the country, abolishing ideology in the country at the legislative level... The attempt to continue to prove to the "crazy" world its "whiteness and fluffiness" has already "cost" Russia thousands of dead and maimed, destroyed objects and entire territories, destroyed lives, destinies and hopes.... Maybe the time has already come to think about the ordinary Russian man, "from the provinces", making "ends meet" from the galloping rise in prices for food, housing and communal services, public transport, medicines and medical services, education and culture (now not about Moscow and not about the Russian aligarchate)... Mr. Staver, write about the "essence" of the issue, and not about the inventions of "dreamers" from high offices and their entourage... The country lives in the paradigm of the present war with the West, and not in the "local" SVO, where everything and everyone should be "sharpened" for a true victory, and not for a "fixed deal" to please the Rublev "celestials" and their entourage.....
    1. +1
      5 February 2025 07: 02
      Yes, sir, you are a communist!
      In Russia there was, is and will be an ideology and this ideology is personal enrichment
      the people have two classes, the bourgeoisie class and the proletariat class
      The Russian-Ukrainian war, a war for the redistribution of spheres of influence between Western transatlantic corporations and Russian imperialism
      and as for caring about the common people, that's a shot in the air!
      1. -1
        5 February 2025 09: 30
        Dmitri Troshev, Russia is still holding on to the remnants of communist ideology.... That's how it is...
  19. 0
    4 February 2025 17: 14
    As I understand it, we will fight with white gloves?
  20. +1
    4 February 2025 18: 29
    The entire top of the Bandelogs should have been removed from the very beginning of the war, and not bowed and bowed in goodwill.
    1. -1
      4 February 2025 19: 06
      If Zelensky is gone, Zaluzhny will be there, which is even worse. And Budanov is no picnic either.
      Hence the conclusion: Ukraine must be finished! And as quickly as possible, not by slowly squeezing toothpaste out of a tube. There are not enough weapons and fighters, but there is Kuzkina mother - that means we use nuclear weapons on special objects and on individual cities. Of course, the population must be warned in advance.
  21. 0
    4 February 2025 19: 20
    A cat cornered uses all means to escape. Even the nuclear danger does not stop them. Remember January 29, when one of the UAVs targeted a nuclear facility, the Smolensk Nuclear Power Plant, in the Smolensk Region.

    The stopping nuclear danger is the strike of TNW. And the blowing up of a nuclear power plant on Russian territory is a nuclear danger for the residents of Russia.
    * * *
    All these refineries are designed as a certain number of tanks for storing the finished product of processing. Maybe it's time to start designing refineries that have protection from the same drones... They started installing shelters for aviation, otherwise they stood in rows - hit them as much as you want...
    It is not money that needs to be made, but modern production, protected from various collisions.
    1. -1
      6 February 2025 02: 55
      Maybe it's time to start designing refineries that have protection against the same drones...

      In general, our refineries are not very ours in terms of equipment, which is expensive. New refineries are not being built. As for protection, TG wrote how some comrades developed protective gratings or something like that, but the firefighters said that in case of fire it could interfere, it is not allowed, where are your certificates and regulations? And the insurers said that there is no such thing in the documents. And therefore it is better to let it burn than to explain anything to the comrades who are inspecting
    2. 0
      12 February 2025 01: 27
      Quote: yuriy55
      All these refineries are designed as a certain number of tanks for storing the finished product of processing. Maybe it's time to start designing refineries that have protection from the same drones...


      An oil refinery is a solid container from start to finish. An oil refinery consists of pipes, columns, reserves and other equipment, all of which are filled with oil or oil products. Pipes with oil come into the oil refinery and pipes with oil products leave.
  22. +1
    4 February 2025 19: 28
    Oh, what nonsense the author wrote, especially in the area of ​​secrecy. The other side knows absolutely everything, and the coordinates of production facilities, suppliers, the mode of shipments and deliveries, and much more, including mobile phones, personal data of key employees of enterprises. That's why the tale of secrecy is Bredov's! It is impossible to protect objects of such a scale, especially considering the Ukrainian diaspora in the country with all the sympathizers, an FPV will fly to the right place and a fire is guaranteed. How can this be avoided considering its range of 15 km or more? No way! At one time, after the Great Patriotic War, there was an unspoken agreement at the level of the special services not to engage in terrorism at the level of the special services on each other's territory, because it is IMPOSSIBLE to protect yourself from this when the special services of another state are doing it! So what to do? There is actually only one way out - to respond with similar actions on the territory of the special services of this state, and there is no other way! England, USA, Germany, Poland, Czech Republic, Romania, France, here is a minimum list of targets... If the billionth B-2 at the US base burns from a FPV missile or an English destroyer from the same thing while loading ammunition at the base, then they will start thinking, but otherwise it's just hot air...
    1. 0
      4 February 2025 20: 56
      max702! Everything is possible... If only there was desire and personal responsibility... But at the present time, in Russia, this is very, very modest... Personal responsibility is brought up by a DIRECTED IDEOLOGY or very strict laws in the country... And with desires, now, it's generally "a disaster"... A generation of "builders of capitalism" has grown up (with rare exceptions), who have completely different "desires" and especially, in the direction of such a concept as "my Country"..... In short, no desire, no responsibility, in the overwhelming majority....
  23. +2
    5 February 2025 03: 17
    Aren't you tired of thinking for the authorities? "We can"...
    Yes, their goal is to bring Russia into a socio-economic crisis, there is no production, and now there will be no fuel, electricity is getting more expensive - where the hell are they spending it? And yes, the infrastructure is deteriorating...
    I wouldn't be surprised if these drones are launched from Russian territory, and we won't see any air defense
  24. -1
    5 February 2025 06: 33
    protection of objects from UAVs, a set of measures;-
    - white noise jammers (all-frequency radio signals)
    - UAV surveillance video and noise detectors
    - UAV all-weather interceptors
    and tie everything to AI
  25. +1
    5 February 2025 08: 42
    It's time to send the ships and boats of the Red Banner Caspian Flotilla to the Volga River to protect the Zavolzhye facilities and hydroelectric power plants. Let them go to the lower reaches and help shoot down drones and detect them. And when the ice melts, they will go higher up the reservoirs.
    They can’t just stand at bases and participate in parades all the time; it’s time to cover the skies.
  26. 0
    5 February 2025 09: 45
    The attacks on oil refineries in the European part of the Russian Federation continue, however, there is no fuel shortage... At least there are no such reports!
    1. 0
      5 February 2025 18: 18
      Impacts do not make weather, they do not go beyond the limits of normal accidents. Any reliable protection system is hundreds of times more expensive than damage from impacts, impacts are a PR stunt and the author is promoting this PR.
  27. -2
    5 February 2025 13: 22
    To win we need OVERWHELMING superiority!
    In technology, tactics, strategy in PEOPLE!!
    We need a new, but meaningful MOBILIZATION!!
    Delay is criminal!
  28. DO
    +2
    5 February 2025 13: 38
    Again about protecting fuel and energy complex facilities. Is it possible to secure oil refineries and oil depots?

    It follows from the text of the article that it is impossible. At the same time, the majority of the text of the article is devoted to the justification of the fact that strikes on the oil refineries can win the war.
    According to the author, only idiots use a firearm to defend against drones.
    Standard air defense systems like Pantsirs, as well as electronic warfare, are supposedly too expensive to use for oil refineries.
    There is not a word about FPV drones as a means of destroying long-range drones.
    Nothing was said about using aviation to combat long-range drones either.
    There is also nothing about means of detecting long-range drones.
    Nothing about protective nets.

    In short, it’s not an article, but a meaningless set of contradictory, dubious statements.
    It seems that military technology is definitely not the esteemed author's strong point.
  29. -1
    5 February 2025 13: 49
    By the way, soon they might introduce a ban on such filming and even fines...
    If self-recruited people, knowing that a term awaits them, still run for 10 to set fire to cabinets on the railway, then will someone really be stopped by a fine for posting a photo of an object? Only a term and not a small one, and even then it is not a fact that this will stop, they will find someone anyway - like in
    In Ancient Greece, a citizen of the polis living in isolation from public life, not participating in the general meeting of citizens of the polis and other forms of state and public democratic governance

    Or, as is permitted, a person suffering from a severe form of mental retardation (oligophrenia). Who will do this...
  30. -1
    5 February 2025 18: 12
    For comparison, the area of ​​a standard football field is 714 square meters.

    A standard football field is approximately 100 meters x 60 meters or 6 square meters.
    714 sq. meters is 100 meters x 7,15 meters?
  31. 0
    5 February 2025 18: 28
    The price of protecting oil depots is higher than the cost of a quick victory. Invest in communications and drones, combat robots.
    .
    I will sell the idea of ​​a combat robot-machine gun for a low price. Cheaper than the cost of a contract for a platoon of motorized riflemen.
  32. 0
    5 February 2025 21: 55
    It is possible, if you saturate the units in the SVO with air defense systems so much that they would shoot down 99% of drones flying over their heads. This is not fpv, I think the TOR M2 would cope with them perfectly.
  33. 0
    7 February 2025 19: 54
    A modern oil refinery or storage base is practically a city of regional scale. Due to circumstances, I remember well the accident at the Omsk Oil Refinery that occurred in August last year.

    True. Around any city there are dominant heights and lowlands. Everything else is a question of combination. If only there was something to combine.
    Quote: Vlad2012
    This is not fpv, I think TOR M2 would cope with them perfectly.

    Unfortunately, front-line SAM systems are not always suitable for protecting objects. The dominant heights are often overgrown with forest. An object SAM system must be able to hunt both from a forest road and from behind low industrial buildings.
  34. 0
    8 February 2025 01: 12
    In all regions, the authorities will still have to form territorial defense regiments and brigades, no matter how they try to slow down and delay this process.
    One of the main tasks
    territorial defense units should be responsible for protecting strategic facilities
    from drone attacks.
    The first step is to set up in the regions
    acoustic sensor networks,
    especially around strategic
    nuclear power plant facilities, oil refineries,
    electrical substations,
    gas transportation infrastructure,
    chemical and defense enterprises.
    The second step is the formation of air defense units in the territorial defense structure armed with MANPADS, ZU-23, machine gun mounts on anti-aircraft mounts, and rifles with special ammunition.
    Owners of oil refineries, chemical plants, and other important strategic facilities must be required to create air defense facilities based on the GIBKA air defense missile system, machine guns, and automatic cannons...

    enterprises.
    Step
  35. 0
    8 February 2025 19: 25
    Of course it is possible to protect, here someone has come up with something new, everything has already been written a long time ago what and how, who needs to do in a given situation, there is one but, only then effective managers will have to share their revenue and profit, in this situation of protecting fuel and energy complex facilities we see simply banal greed of the heads of fuel and energy complex companies, remember how long the law was passed on private security companies allowing them to organize anti-drone teams at facilities, there is still no sense in this at most enterprises in the country. It is necessary to order the country's leadership to force these managers to invest in protective measures, of course, in unison with the Ministry of Defense, the Ministry of Emergency Situations, the FSB - everything for the front, everything for victory, but as it is, they are corporate leaders, they will do nothing, it is easier for them to present claims to the state for burned reservoirs and destroyed oil depots. A magic kick is needed.
  36. 0
    9 February 2025 13: 08
    There is only one way to stop the Nazi scum: strike at them in accordance with the Russian Federation doctrine.