Military Review

South Korean problems with Spike NLOS missiles

77
While the situation on the Korean Peninsula is heating up and countries are exchanging unfriendly statements, very interesting information begins to appear in the South Korean press. According to the largest newspaper "Chosun Ilbo", the South Korean army may have some problems in the event of an armed conflict. These problems will be associated with Israeli-made Spike missile systems.




First, a little stories. One of the places in the region of the Korean Peninsula where the least stable and peaceful situation is observed is the so-called. the northwestern islands are the Yonphendo archipelago and the island of Pannöndo. They are located a few kilometers off the coast of North Korea and are controlled by the South. Such an arrangement of the islands in combination with their affiliation has long been considered dangerous in political and military aspects. Understanding the danger of the situation, the DPRK military organized a coastal defense battery near the islands a long time ago. Long-range guns are located in well-protected positions within the coastal cliffs. These batteries showed their combat potential in November 2010, when, due to another deterioration in relations between the two Koreas, there was an artillery exchange of coastal defense and the garrison of Yonpyeongo Island. There were losses on both sides. However, soon an analysis of the actions of South Korean gunners armed with self-propelled guns K9, showed that their combat work was not effective enough.

After those events, the military command of South Korea initiated several studies, the purpose of which was to increase the combat capability of the troops on the north-western islands. First of all, the military came to the conclusion that the effectiveness of self-propelled artillery mounts firing uncontrollable shells was insufficient. Reliable coastal batteries required high precision weapon. An alternative to self-propelled guns could be air-to-ground missiles of the respective models, but their use is complicated by the fact that the South Korean air force F-15K and KF-16 fighter-bombers are based too far from the disputed territories and may simply not have time to react to the threat. As a result, the command took the best, as it seemed, the decision.

As a means for firing at coastal artillery of the enemy, the military of the Republic of Korea chose Israeli-made Spike NLOS missile systems. This complex was classified for the first few years, but is now offered for export. A universal missile can carry a combat unit of one of several types designed to eliminate various targets. The effective range of the complex Spike NLOS - 25 kilometers. In the middle of 2011, the South Korean forces ordered about 60 of such missiles and two launchers with a total value of 43 million US dollars from Israel. Almost all the complexes were planned to be located on the islands of Yonpyendo and Pannёndo.

South Korean problems with Spike NLOS missiles


According to the newspaper "Chosun Ilbo", already at the stage of selecting missiles, the military made one major miscalculation. They did not conduct their own tests in their own conditions, but fully trusted the fact that Spike was tested by the British military. Such an absentee “recommendation” was considered sufficient. However, the negative consequences of such a step are now being investigated.

First of all, some features of the Spike NLOS missile control system have been criticized by the largest South Korean newspaper. On one automobile or caterpillar (at the request of the customer) chassis four transport-launch containers with rockets and only one control system are standardly installed. The missile manufacturer, the Rafael concern, claims that the missile guidance can follow three methods: “shot and forget”, “shot, checked and sent” and “shot and brought to the target”. Not all conditions can completely entrust the guidance of missiles to automation, so the operator will have to not only search for the target and launch rockets. If the operator will have to independently “lead” each rocket, the rate of fire will not be high enough. For example, when firing from Yonphendo Island at coastal targets (a distance of the order of 12-15 kilometers) the rocket will reach the target only in 80-90 seconds. Thus, at the same time, only two guided missiles fired from two combat vehicles will be able to fly to targets on the coast, and the next such salvo will be possible only after some time. Finally, after all the ready-to-use ammunition is fired off, the calculations of both combat vehicles will begin reloading, which also takes time.

According to the newspaper “Joseon Ilbo” and the experts it has interviewed, such a rate of fire is unacceptable for fighting the North Korean coastal artillery. During the time that the missilemen from the islands can detect and hit the enemy, the DPRK gunners are able to accomplish their combat mission and, possibly, destroy the Spike NLOS combat vehicles. Thus, in the present conditions, the use of these missile systems to combat artillery looks dubious. For effective counteraction to coastal guns it is necessary to ensure an appropriate rate of fire.

Another problem of the Spike NLOS complexes was the incompatibility of the conditions of the Korean Peninsula. In the area of ​​the Yonpyeong and Pannöndo islands, fogs are often found and, because of this, it is difficult to direct missiles using only optical observation systems. According to some South Korean officer, who shared his thoughts with the newspaper, the fogs sharply reduce the combat effectiveness of missiles against artillery. It is worth noting that the scope of the Spike NLOS complex has a thermal imaging channel, but its effectiveness still remains a matter of controversy.

According to reports, last year the South Korean military department sent a list of complaints to Rafael concern. Since then, some work has been going on, but there has not yet been a noticeable shift. It is reported that test launches were carried out in the fall and winter, some of which proved to be successful. In March, Israeli specialists managed to make three successful launches in fog. Thus, the updated Spike NLOS complex is almost ready for delivery, but South Korea will probably not be in a hurry yet. Choson Ilbo cites the words of the representative of the Ministry of Defense of the Republic, according to which it is still too early to adopt a new modification and purchase. In the opinion of this military man, tests in Israel were made in desert conditions, which is significantly different from the realities of the area where new missiles are to be operated. Obviously, the South Korean military will insist on new tests on their territory, but this has not yet been officially confirmed.

As we see, at the same time with the aggravation of the situation on the Korean Peninsula, various negative trends are revealed that are directly related to the defense capability of the participants in a potential conflict. So far, it is impossible to say with certainty how dangerous in the real world situation existing problems with the Spike NLOS missile system can be. However, in the current situation, the most sensible step is to take measures that simply will not be the case to confirm or deny fears in practice.


On the materials of the sites:
http://rg.ru/
http://english.chosun.com/
http://rafael.co.il/
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  1. radio operator
    radio operator 25 March 2013 09: 19 New
    +7
    Weapons problems can arise from anyone.
    The main thing is that they arise, at the wrong time, not with you and your allies, but with the enemy.
    1. Yarbay
      Yarbay 25 March 2013 14: 06 New
      0
      Quote: radio operator

      Weapons problems can arise from anyone.
      The main thing is that they arise, at the wrong time, not with you and your allies, but with the enemy.

      In this case, clearly a custom article, and so you are right!
  2. qwert
    qwert 25 March 2013 09: 20 New
    +3
    60 of such missiles and two launchers with a total value of 43 million. Not bad. This is each rocket more expensive than the North Korean tank in 4 times.
    Spike's optical guidance system allows North Korea to use inflatable layouts. In the case of positional sluggish actions, you can just quietly ruin the southern neighbor.
    And about the fog. Well yes. In the Middle East, fogs occur once every 100 years. And their other weapons are tailored specifically for their region.
    1. Professor
      Professor 25 March 2013 09: 31 New
      -5
      Spike's optical guidance system allows North Korea to use inflatable layouts.

      Inflatable made of metal and with a thermal signature. wink

      And about the fog. Well yes. In the Middle East, fogs occur once every 100 years. And their other weapons are tailored specifically for their region.

      What are you talking about? Half a year there were fogs almost every day, last week there was such fog that the international airport was closed.
      1. Nazrug
        Nazrug 25 March 2013 10: 35 New
        +1
        And here is heat and optical guidance? It is not always possible to direct over heat, and even if the target does not produce heat, this does not mean that it is a model, but as far as I know, it’s unique and that the operator can direct the missile through the optical channel if the target is not in range , here it can be fooled.
      2. nnkfrschk
        nnkfrschk 25 March 2013 11: 06 New
        +3
        Inflatable made of metal and with a thermal signature
        - Actually, modern mock-ups have long imitated the thermal signature for a long time, in Russia such mock-ups began to be delivered to the troops - what prevents the Korean army from adopting the same?
        1. Professor
          Professor 25 March 2013 17: 24 New
          0
          in fact, modern mock-ups have long imitated the thermal signature for a long time, in Russia such mock-ups began to be delivered to the troops - what prevents the Korean army from adopting the same?

          I won’t laugh out loud.
          Have you seen the tank in the thermal imager? I have seen.
          It looks something like this.
          1. nnkfrschk
            nnkfrschk 27 March 2013 23: 33 New
            0
            I won’t laugh out loud

            Why did you decide that YOU are able to offend ME? To at least somehow offend me, you, for starters, must have a certain authority on this forum. However, judging from the comments of users addressed to you, there is only the authority of the forum troll, and the negative rating of 1900 clearly indicates the degree of "respect" among forum users to you.
            By the way, "in order" is written together.

            http://www.shakhty.su/world/news/2013/03/13/inflate/
            Pneumatic models of military equipment are a frame covered with an airtight shell. Each layout is equipped with thermal and radar simulators, a power unit and fans.


            And -
            Layout developers claim that they reproduce radiation in the radar range, thermal and near infrared, similar to night vision devices.


            Have you seen the tank in the thermal imager?
            - Have you seen the latest pneumatic model with a simulator of a thermal and radar signature in the signature thermal imager that it is so circling? And not from the nearest knoll - I have no doubt that anyone will distinguish the layout from the real equipment, but from the pilot’s cockpit, from the heights and speeds at which aircraft pilots prefer to work? No? I am sure this will be your answer.
            1. Professor
              Professor 27 March 2013 23: 59 New
              +3
              To at least somehow offend me, you, for starters, must have a certain authority on this forum.

              Dear, epaulets on this forum are easy to earn. It is necessary to shout loudly that Russia is the birthplace of elephants and the like, and you have marshal epaulets. However, these virtual shoulder straps have nothing to do with the level of intelligence or knowledge of the materiel. fellow


              You show this picture in the thermal spectrum, laugh together.

              Layout developers claim that they reproduce radiation in the radar range, thermal and near infrared, similar to night vision devices.

              And they (developers) classified a picture from the thermal imager? laughing

              So you didn’t see the tank in the thermal imager ... Have you seen the thermal imager itself? wink

              And not from the nearest knoll - I have no doubt that anyone will distinguish the layout from the real equipment, but from the pilot’s cockpit, from the heights and speeds at which aircraft pilots prefer to work? No? I am sure this will be your answer.

              You decided to answer for me yourself? Missiles of the very aircraft that their pilots prefer to work from those heights and speeds are very expensive not at all because of the number of precious metals on them. And in particular because of the time spent by developers of pattern recognition algorithms. In 1963 Vander Lugth first applied for this an optical correlator where all the "calculations" occur at the speed of light. Since then, this area of ​​science has gone far in advance. In short, fooling GOS missiles in the thermal spectrum is very problematic. And if the developers of the inflatable mock-ups could create a thermal signature of the tank, then they would simply become rich and we would observe this product in all modern conflicts. By the way, you are not aware of the experience of the combat use of these rubber products?
              1. Lopatov
                Lopatov 28 March 2013 00: 08 New
                +1
                Something you overclocked. GOS missiles are difficult to fool after capturing a target, yes. But they will not be able to distinguish the signature of the tank from the signature of the rubber product mounted on the GOS missiles.
                1. Professor
                  Professor 28 March 2013 00: 11 New
                  +1
                  The dispute will be pointless until we see a thermal image of this rubber product and learn about the experience of its combat use.

                  PS
                  A colleague who served in the reservists' office in the Golan Heights said that he watched through binoculars as the Syrian inflatable tanks swayed in the wind.
                  1. Lopatov
                    Lopatov 28 March 2013 00: 21 New
                    +1
                    And which one will spread it? In this case, it will be easy to find a common feature for rubber tanks, allowing them to be identified ..

                    Well, as for the military use, remember Kosovo. If you believe the reports of the pilots, they destroyed all the armored vehicles of the Serbs three times. The same picture with the Scuds in the first US-Iraqi. Both the Iraqis and the Serbs had very simple layouts.
                    1. Professor
                      Professor 28 March 2013 09: 07 New
                      -2
                      In the optical spectrum, they were not afraid to lay out a picture.
                      From the first Iraqi, and from Kosovo a lot of water flowed. By the way, NATO could actually destroy several times the armored vehicles. At the firing range, an empty tank has been shelled for years, and it is "almost like new."

                      Iraq ,, Libya - rubber products IMHO did not show themselves. sad
                      1. nnkfrschk
                        nnkfrschk 28 March 2013 11: 25 New
                        +1
                        In the optical spectrum, they were not afraid to lay out a picture.
                        - it's close. Have you seen this picture from ALTITUDE? The higher, the harder it is to distinguish a layout from a real tank.
                      2. Professor
                        Professor 28 March 2013 16: 03 New
                        +1
                        You probably misunderstood me, inflatable equipment has a place in the sun, but do not overestimate its capabilities.
                    2. nnkfrschk
                      nnkfrschk 28 March 2013 11: 27 New
                      +1
                      Professor. By the way, a question for you.

                      Above you wrote -
                      Dear, epaulets on this forum are easy to earn. We must shout loudly that Russia is the birthplace of elephants and the like
                      - How did you manage to raise your rating from -1900 to +45 FOR ONE NIGHT, shouting that Russia was the birthplace of elephants ??

                      I have the same question for the site moderators - is there obvious fraud with the rating, your actions?
                    3. Professor
                      Professor 28 March 2013 16: 05 New
                      0
                      How did you manage to raise your rating FOR ONE NIGHT from -1900 to +45, shouting that Russia was the birthplace of elephants ??

                      I repeat once again. I have real epaulettes and I don’t give a damn about virtual ones. Therefore, I do not follow this process at all.
              2. nnkfrschk
                nnkfrschk 28 March 2013 11: 22 New
                +1
                Well, I prefer to believe the words of development experts about the similarity of the thermal signature, and not the words of an unknown commentator.

                Dear, epaulets on this forum are easier to earn
                - but to earn disrespect, such as yours, you must VERY hard work. You tried.

                And they (developers) classified a picture from the thermal imager?
                - It is unlikely that the site simply did not have a thermal imager and an inflatable layout at hand to take a picture. Why keep something secret, because the signature of the tank’s layout is practically the same as the signature of the present. first sentence of my post.


                So you didn’t see the tank in the thermal imager
                - What do I have to do with it? The developers saw him in the thermal imager. Him and the inflatable layout. See the first sentence of my post.

                fooling gos missiles in the thermal spectrum is very problematic.
                - This is hardly such a big problem. Moreover, the permeability of the atmosphere for infrared rays is not absolute, and from a height there will always be some fuzziness. After the GOS captured the target - yes, it is unrealistic to shoot down the capture, but to deceive is without problems. This task was successfully solved by the Russian defense industry. See the first sentence of my post.
                And by the way - in the UK they also adopted mock-ups of tanks - from the 1990s. They probably did not know about your existence and your doubt about the effectiveness of these models, otherwise for sure - I ALMOST) I am sure - they would not accept them! )))

                Syrian inflatable tanks sway the barrel in the wind
                - yes, I think that for all inflatable models, and not only models, something sways in the wind laughing
                1. Professor
                  Professor 28 March 2013 16: 21 New
                  +1
                  Well, I prefer to believe the words of development experts about the similarity of the thermal signature, and not the words of an unknown commentator.

                  Your right, the more I will tell you a secret, I’m not a real professor, although I have several degrees.
                  wink

                  - but to earn disrespect, such as yours, you must VERY hard work. You tried.

                  I can’t stand the spirit of the patriots of any country, be it Russia, Kazakhstan or Israel. About Natsik I think no need to explain. I will always express my point of view even when it is not in the mainstream.

                  The developers saw him in the thermal imager. Him and the inflatable layout.

                  However, the director general of the Russian Balloon enterprise, Viktor Talanov, did not provide the goods. Looks bad at them with marketing.

                  After the GOS captured the target - yes, it is unrealistic to shoot down the capture, but to deceive is without problems. This task was successfully solved by the Russian defense industry.

                  Yah?

                  And by the way - in the UK they also adopted mock-ups of tanks - from the 1990s. They probably did not know about your existence and your doubt about the effectiveness of these models, otherwise for sure - I ALMOST) I am sure - they would not accept them!

                  Which of the potential opponents of Great Britain had thermal imagers in the 1990s, even if Russia purchased thermal imaging arrays in NATO? But in the visible optical spectrum, rubber products are even nothing at all.

                  yes, I think, for all inflatable models, and not only models, something sways in the wind

                  Yeah, a barrel with an amplitude of a meter. lol

                  PS
                  I wanted to show you a picture of the F-16 at a distance of 90 km !!!, but the site is buggy and I can not find my previous comment. sad
                  Fatal error: Call to a member function getCountry () on a non-object in /var/www/wwwadmin/data/www/topwar.ru/engine/classes/comments.class.php on line 208
                  1. nnkfrschk
                    nnkfrschk 28 March 2013 23: 01 New
                    0
                    I cannot stand the patriots of any country, be it Russia, Kazakhstan or Israel.
                    - I noticed. And they can’t stand people like you, which is proved by your previously deeply negative, now scribbled, obviously, either by some third parties or the administration (since you say that it’s not you) rating))) You, most importantly, write more on Syrian topics , and then something has not been seen there for a long time)))
                    Only here is the misfortune - these "cheers-patriots", or rather - those who consider themselves to be such - on the site are hundreds of times more than yours. And anyway, what do you care about PATRIOTS of a foreign country?

                    Looks bad at them with marketing
                    - but it’s good with customers, since their products are in demand and ALREADY delivered to the Russian army. A good product with a regular customer does not need marketing or advertising.

                    Yah?
                    - well yes.

                    Which of the potential opponents of Great Britain had thermal imagers in the 1990s, even if Russia purchased thermal imaging arrays in NATO?
                    - Well, you want to say that the inflatable mock-ups are hopelessly outdated and do not even imitate the thermal signature like Russian ???

                    Yeah, a barrel with an amplitude of a meter
                    - Yes, let yourself swing, you something? yours is obviously shorter, it just doesn’t swing))) Yes, and one fuy is not visible from the plane, this trunk is swinging or, as journalist Ankhar Kochneva says, “drives a sting”)))
                  2. Professor
                    Professor 29 March 2013 10: 21 New
                    -1
                    Only here is the misfortune - these "cheers-patriots", or rather - those who consider themselves to be such - on the site are hundreds of times more than yours. And anyway, what do you care about PATRIOTS of a foreign country?

                    More? Yes, even a million, the amount there rarely goes into quality. Not patriots - I sincerely respect those, but cheer patriots whose stupidity knows no boundaries, either physical or territorial.

                    but it’s good with customers, since their products are in demand and ALREADY delivered to the Russian army

                    Well, right in line, the buyers are lined up. wink Who else bought it?

                    Well, what do you want to say that inflatable mock-ups are hopelessly outdated in small-shavens and do not even imitate a thermal signature like Russian ones ???

                    Both of them work only in the visible spectrum and do not imitate the thermal signature. The reverse has not yet been proven, and you can say anything without proof.

                    yes let yourself swing, you something?

                    This indicates the effectiveness of a rubber product if a simple fighter with binoculars can with 100% probability distinguish the layout from the original. hi
                  3. nnkfrschk
                    nnkfrschk 30 March 2013 00: 58 New
                    0
                    This indicates the effectiveness of a rubber product if a simple fighter with binoculars can with 100% probability distinguish the layout from the original.
                    - don't be funny. Inflatable layouts are not designed to deceive infantry. They are designed to inflate pilots - so that they launch an expensive rocket with a cheap toy)

                    both of them work only in the visible spectrum and do not imitate the thermal signature
                    - you are wrong, Russian mock-ups imitate a thermal signature - as the sources say, and until you prove the opposite - say, with a snapshot of the inflatable layout in question, I prefer not to trust you, an unknown commentator, but to sources mentioning this development.

                    More? Yes, even a million, the amount there rarely goes into quality.
                    - and it depends on what is considered quality. In addition - and the number is important, democracy, xl and ... You, for example, when you vote, because you don’t shine with your crusts, and your person’s voice with epaulets and degrees is equal to the voice of any Israeli homosexual, drunk or prostitute. And it is the votes of that very majority that decide the election results, regardless of their "quality".

                    And the question about two thousand rating units for one night remains open. I think it’s worth contacting the site’s administration, let’s look at the logs - from which IPs, and from which accounts the pluses were put to your old posts ... This is a very, very interesting question - there is fraud with your rating, and besides your words that you are not involved in this , as far as I know, there is no evidence of your non-participation in this, but there are plenty of motives - an inferiority complex, as for the “consultant” group - and there’s a deep minus, and not far from the first skull, wow, mess ... And here - what a coincidence is interesting, shortly after my post about your rating - a kind fairy arrives and raises HIS to you))) And this - I spoke with the guys - not the first time. This happened before ... And I think this should be stopped.
                  4. Professor
                    Professor 30 March 2013 10: 05 New
                    +1
                    And the question about two thousand rating units for one night remains open.

                    Forgive you how many years that you are interested in the rating on the forum and epaulettes on the avatar? wink I repeat as a last resort, I have my own real epaulettes and I don't care about virtual stars and skulls.

                    don't be funny. Inflatable layouts are not designed to deceive infantry. They are designed to inflate pilots - so that they launch an expensive rocket with a cheap toy)

                    Where, when, in which conflict did these rubber products demonstrate their effectiveness? Answer: nowhere, never, in any!

                    In addition - and the amount is important, democracy, x and l ..

                    You please do not confuse the polling station with the arrangement of minuses and pluses on the forum. At least everyone votes there and only once! Democracy...

                    I prefer not to believe you, an obscure commentator, but to sources mentioning this development.

                    Your right to take the word of others without seeing the materiel. hi So then you read: The declared characteristics were not confirmed. sad

                    Here is the materiel for the staff. So it is seen on Elop from a distance 92 km, 24000 feet high, 466 knots.



  • Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 25 March 2013 11: 25 New
    +3
    Made of metallized plastic and with a thermal signature, yes. Already imitate the thermal picture with the help of cheap heaters ...
    The habit of waving with the unarmed is very relaxing. Cool stuff for shelling the enemy with a light rifle and foolishly armed cars. They also have tanks that the enemy will never learn to use.
    Alas, the North Koreans are hungry, but skillful and courageous. It won’t work out like that ...
    1. BruderV
      BruderV 25 March 2013 11: 49 New
      -3
      Quote: Mikhail3
      Alas, the North Koreans are hungry, but skillful and courageous. It won’t work out like that ...

      So hungry and skillful that they see better than a thermal imager at night, shoot farther than snipers without optics, fight without communication with the command and generally with weapons of the 60s? Harsh! Only I had something deja vu played out. Something like that in 2003 already heard seems about Stalingrad near Baghdad.
      1. nakaz
        nakaz 25 March 2013 12: 30 New
        +1
        But they are ready to put all the people but to win, but it is worth a lot.
        1. BruderV
          BruderV 25 March 2013 13: 05 New
          -2
          Quote: nakaz
          But they are ready to put all the people

          Who are they? A leader with a fragile mind and teenage ambitions? The people themselves may well run to surrender, not even for trinkets and iPhones, but stupidly for food. In Iraq, too, there was a fanatical republican guard, and ordinary soldiers and officers in the majority have passed more than one war and had good combat experience. But what ended everyone remembers. And where did the readiness to put all the people go?
      2. Mikhail3
        Mikhail3 25 March 2013 13: 11 New
        +3
        He attributed his stupid words to me and so won! Well done ... How North Koreans are fighting - Google to help. It’s unlike the Arabs. To inhale rubbish under the guise of a weapon to the South Koreans - this operation did not become more ethical based on your chatter ...
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 25 March 2013 13: 22 New
          +4
          Quote: Mikhail3
          How North Koreans are fighting - Google to help.

          And what will Great Google say? What if not for the Chinese troops, then North Korea would not exist now?


          Quote: Mikhail3
          Inhaling rubbish under the guise of weapons to South Koreans

          And why did you decide that Spike NLOS is rubbish? Believe articles dictated by Americans?
          1. fzr1000
            fzr1000 25 March 2013 17: 14 New
            +1
            If not for America, South Korea would not have existed. Compare- China and the USA. There is still the USSR, though modestly on the sidelines.
            1. Lopatov
              Lopatov 25 March 2013 20: 17 New
              +3
              What do you think, why the north climbed so greyhound south? The South Korean armed forces were police forces; economically, the South was as poor as a church mouse. Now this is by no means the case.
        2. BruderV
          BruderV 25 March 2013 13: 29 New
          -2
          Quote: Mikhail3
          How North Koreans are fighting - Google to help. It’s unlike the Arabs

          Well, let there be not Arabs, but the Japanese in the 45th. No matter how hungry and not cunning, but could not oppose anything superior superior firepower, superior numbers of equipment and better weapons. Or are the Koreans even more severe? Such Chingizid monols who came out of the desert and bent half the world. Oddly enough, for the homeland one must kill and kill a lot, and not die, only in this way victory is won. Is there something in the north that can reliably and kill a lot of southerners? The nucleus of the bomb will tell you right away that it will not fly - at the start it will be shot down.
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 26 March 2013 00: 05 New
            +1
            Quote: BruderV
            but could not oppose anything superior firepower, superiority in numbers
            - perhaps this is true, but:

            Quote: BruderV
            better weapons
            - very doubtful. The Yapes had good weapons, and Zero aircraft were among the best examples of the Second World War. The cruiser Yamamoto ... There are many to list.
            Without the atomic bomb and the help of the USSR, which had defeated the Kwantung Army, the amers would have long fumbled with yapes, and it’s not at all the fact that they would have won.
            1. Lopatov
              Lopatov 26 March 2013 01: 17 New
              +1
              Quote: aksakal
              The Yapes had good weapons, and Zero aircraft were among the best examples of the Second World War. The cruiser Yamamoto ... There are many to list.

              You can not list everything. But it is imperative to add “at the beginning of the war.” By the end of the war, the Americans were technically superior to the Japanese.
              1. ultra
                ultra 26 March 2013 13: 53 New
                0
                Quote: Spade
                add "at the beginning of the war" Towards the end of the war, the Americans technically superior the Japanese by head.
                good
            2. Pimply
              Pimply 26 March 2013 13: 21 New
              -1
              Have you noticed where the Americans were at the time of the atomic bomb drop? And how did you grind the Japanese? This was not the 41st and not the 42nd. The Americans by that time were an order of magnitude superior to the Japanese.
            3. vitya29111973
              vitya29111973 26 March 2013 16: 07 New
              0
              There were planes, there were just no pilots, and so was the whole class.
        3. ultra
          ultra 26 March 2013 13: 51 New
          0
          Quote: Mikhail3
          Inhaling rubbish under the guise of weapons to South Koreans

          Well, it's you in vain! We must pay tribute to the Israeli weapons at the level! hi
      3. aksakal
        aksakal 25 March 2013 23: 59 New
        +4
        Quote: BruderV
        Something like that in 2003 already heard seems about Stalingrad near Baghdad.
        - Are you talking about Fallujah? Actually, this is a historical fact, and it’s indisputable. The Amer did not take this city by ground storm, despite the lack of thermal imagers, optics and communications from the Faluj people. On one courage and the legendary Kalash, that is called. By the way, according to the chronicles, during the storming of Fallujah, the amers themselves there with pleasure mocked at the enemy from the same Kalash, they took their rifle to shoot from the grenade launcher. But we are assured that this kind of recognition of this machine gun by the Amer soldiers is supposedly a legend. And you look at those chronicles - see for yourself.
        Amerians, having taken pains to storm the city, simply razed it to the ground with the help of heavy aircraft, and, according to some statements, unconventional bombs were used.
        North Koreans are not so technically sucky. Who told you that they have no optics? I agree with the thermal imagers that they are probably bad, although no one has yet canceled contraband, but with ordinary sniper optics - something you North Koreans think is completely sucks. Do guys generally produce long-range missiles, have they moved further than the Iranians, moreover, tangibly, and they will not be able to produce conventional optics? laughing laughing They and kalashi under rather complicated auger magazines with 300 rounds are modifying lightly, here you are drawing problems for them with optics laughing laughing
        Brooder 5 is the fifth brother, so I get it? The first is a genius, the second is smart, the third is so-so, the fourth is stupid, and the fifth is completely ... You all understood laughing laughing laughing Moreover - in principle laughing Joke, I like to joke, do not be offended. Sometimes think with your head, and so they will not joke laughing Do not believe the liberoid media, they will draw you not that laughing
        1. BruderV
          BruderV 26 March 2013 00: 55 New
          -2
          Quote: aksakal
          Who told you that they have no optics?

          I’m not saying that it is not there, it is in the quantity and quality that we had during World War II. Here in the photo are the model parts of the exercises. Kakbe on the 47th Kalash in principle does not provide for mounting a dovetail for optics. There, the soldiers don’t even have bulletproof vests and steel helmets like the SSh, which they don’t even hold a pistol bullet, and you dream about optics. The country on all counts lives in the early 60s
          http://www.catsmob.com/photo/1053-severnaya-koreya-segodnya-68-foto.html
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 26 March 2013 02: 06 New
            +3
            Far from all points, you exaggerate. There are breakthroughs. Do not forget, Yu. Korea sells weapons to all and sundry. Even Russia was noted by the T-80s and the joint development-refinement of the S-300, later renamed "Antei". I am silent about SABJ.
            Sanctions imposed on North Koreans. But even so, it wasn’t on all counts in the 60s. And the fact that on many points after all in the 60s does not at all make the DPRK a weak adversary. Do not forget that even in the first Chechen feds ran [right] [/ right] in the same US helmets and heavy lead armor plates, and this is actually the second half of the 90s!
            Only in the second Chechen feds began to look quite modern, and the current pictures are completely pleasing - titanium helmets, good body armor .... But something you are not in that steppe at all. They are not fighting helmets with body armor, people are fighting! For this, no one can say for sure how Koreans are more fighting than Arabs, only a real war will show. I think that the North Koreans will be able to level out their fighting spirit with the substantial technical and economic superiority of the southerners, however, only at the first stages of hostilities. And then - a harsh prose of life, who is economically stronger or has managed to transfer the economy to war rails more successfully, he will be on horseback
            1. ultra
              ultra 26 March 2013 13: 57 New
              0
              Quote: aksakal
              I think the North Koreans will be able to level their fighting spirit
              Yes, numerical superiority, with more or less equal equipment! hi
  • BruderV
    BruderV 25 March 2013 10: 57 New
    0
    Quote: qwert
    This is each rocket more expensive than a North Korean tank 4 times.

    These are partial prejudices. One rocket costs 145 thousand dollars, the rest is the cost of PU and its maintenance. Do Koreans from the north make tanks worth 30 thousand dollars? From what of bamboo stalks and rice shoots?
    1. Nayhas
      Nayhas 25 March 2013 11: 07 New
      0
      Koreans indicate the cost of 300 thousand dollars ...
    2. aksakal
      aksakal 26 March 2013 01: 50 New
      +1
      Quote: BruderV
      Quote: qwert
      This is each rocket more expensive than a North Korean tank 4 times.

      These are partial prejudices. One rocket costs 145 thousand dollars, the rest is the cost of PU and its maintenance. Do Koreans from the north make tanks worth 30 thousand dollars? From what of bamboo stalks and rice shoots?

      What are you saying! -))))) To the Peruvians, a much smaller strictly anti-tank rocket Spike was vaporized for 250 tons of greens for each, but here the Koreans were much larger and more versatile missiles with a greater range of 145 tons were introduced -)))) however, they are inconsistent -))) )))
  • BruderV
    BruderV 25 March 2013 11: 56 New
    0
    Quote: qwert
    In the Middle East, fogs occur once every 100 years.

    And how many times a year sandstorms with zero visibility can you tell?
    1. Professor
      Professor 25 March 2013 17: 28 New
      0
      And how many times a year sandstorms with zero visibility can you tell?

      I will prompt. About 50 times a year. Therefore, they (sandstorms) in Arabic are called "hamsin", which translates as 50.
  • Pimply
    Pimply 25 March 2013 15: 42 New
    -3
    Have you been to the Middle East? Lived at least a couple of months? 8)))
  • aksakal
    aksakal 25 March 2013 22: 36 New
    0
    Quote: qwert
    60 of such missiles and two launchers with a total value of 43 million. Not bad. This is each rocket more expensive than the North Korean tank in 4 times.
    Spike's optical guidance system allows North Korea to use inflatable layouts. In the case of positional sluggish actions, you can just quietly ruin the southern neighbor.
    And about the fog. Well yes. In the Middle East, fogs occur once every 100 years. And their other weapons are tailored specifically for their region.

    Merkava is no exception, also under a stony-hilly (here you don’t need mountains, in Israel there are no mountains, so formally geographically))) the terrain, mud and swamps and forests are no longer Merkava’s sphere. It is clear that for their region, both Merkava and Spike are cool weapons, but for other regions they need to be seriously modified. But then the price -))))). Jews and in an unfinished form bend for their weapons, as if they are made of pure gold -))))) by the way, ATGM Spike 250 tons per racket even turns out more expensive than for such an amount of gold. But does he surpass the same Cornet? Which costs 3 times cheaper-)))) even if superior - is it three times as much in price?
    Then, here is this niche of universal missiles with a range of up to 25 km and warheads up to 10-15 kg - is it so important? With high-precision shells such as Kitolov-2, excalibur and others, this niche does not close? After all, they are cheaper, and the underweight in a warhead of a single projectile can be closed with a volley of a couple of shells, but such durable targets are usually a little ... Correct me if I'm wrong
  • Professor
    Professor 25 March 2013 09: 27 New
    -9
    According to the newspaper “Joseon Ilbo” and the experts it has interviewed, such a rate of fire is unacceptable for fighting the North Korean coastal artillery. During the time that the missilemen from the islands can detect and hit the enemy, the DPRK gunners are able to accomplish their combat mission and, possibly, destroy the Spike NLOS combat vehicles. Thus, in the present conditions, the use of these missile systems to combat artillery looks dubious. For effective counteraction to coastal guns it is necessary to ensure an appropriate rate of fire.


    In the article of the Joseon Ilbo newspaper, not a word is written about this. request


    They are talking about plans to purchase 60 missiles and two launchers for a total of $ 52 million. It is further reported that the Koreans personally experienced a dozen Tamuz at three occasions, the last time in January of this year. Most ended in failure. In March of this year, all three tests were successful and the Koreans want to deploy Tamuz in Korea next month. It is alleged that the tests took place in a desert area, not Korean conditions.

    PS
    Yesterday, in response to the shelling of the Israeli patrol by Tamuz, a firing point in Syria was successfully hit.

    PPS
    In 2006, the Maglan division produced more than 600 Tammuz. Here is one of them.
    [media = http: //www.youtube.com/watch? v = pXw9SqnXqZQ]
  • spirit
    spirit 25 March 2013 09: 30 New
    +1
    With an expensive spike, beat on the rocks !!! Yes, the northerners will ruin them after a couple of days of conflict laughing
    1. BruderV
      BruderV 25 March 2013 11: 41 New
      -4
      Quote: spirit
      With an expensive spike, beat on the rocks !!! Yes, the northerners will ruin them after a couple of days of conflict

      Why? You buy a Hyundai Solaris, a Samsung TV, some other smartphone and you are not alone and everything will pay off. And what the northerners will compensate for the loss of personnel from precision weapons and with what means rearmament is not clear. To legitimize cannibalism in the country?
      1. aksakal
        aksakal 26 March 2013 00: 10 New
        +1
        Quote: BruderV
        Hyundai Solaris, Samsung TV, some other smartphone
        - are they fighting this? Yeah, you made fun ... Look at the inhabitants of the same area, about which the famous hit is now booming - it's true there. Residents of this area actually do nothing, stagger around during the day in search of the latest fashion, hang out in clubs in the evening, and pervert in sex at night laughing Eloi typical laughing With such a lot you can’t win, if at all laughing And the North Koreans look like Morlocks.
        1. BruderV
          BruderV 26 March 2013 01: 11 New
          +2
          Quote: aksakal
          are they fighting this? Yeah you made fun

          Is everything all right with the Russian language? I am in terms of understanding it. Or is it a trololo? Here it was a matter of the fact that the South Caucasus has overwhelmed the world markets with its equipment and it can afford to buy expensive weapons, it has money for it, they don’t need to carry on the tractor launcher.
          Quote: aksakal
          Residents of this area actually do nothing, stagger around during the day in search of the latest fashion, hang out in clubs in the evening, and pervert in sex at night. Eloi typical.

          Everywhere there are enough sons of rich daddies; in the DPRK, I assure you too, there is a nomenclature that feels itself masters of life. If you judge peoples by the clips you see, I can congratulate you on a broad outlook. And this is how stereotypes of Votka, Myedved, Perestroika, etc. In our country, if a chanson-thug is popular, does the whole country sit in the zone and use the mobile to spin it?
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 26 March 2013 02: 28 New
            +2
            Quote: BruderV
            Quote: aksakal
            are they fighting this? Yeah you made fun

            Is everything all right with the Russian language? I am in terms of understanding it. Or is it a trololo? Here it was a matter of the fact that the South Caucasus has overwhelmed the world markets with its equipment and it can afford to buy expensive weapons, it has money for it, they don’t need to carry on the tractor launcher.

            Everywhere there are enough sons of rich daddies; in the DPRK, I assure you too, there is a nomenclature that feels itself masters of life. If you judge peoples by the clips you see, I can congratulate you on a broad outlook. And this is how stereotypes of Votka, Myedved, Perestroika, etc. In our country, if a chanson-thug is popular, does the whole country sit in the zone and use the mobile to spin it?

            - thanks to wealth? Maybe the lack of sanctions still allows South Korea to buy what it needs and not even what it needs (SABJ) -)))))))) to be clever, that’s all. Wealth is the third thing, they will impose sanctions on you - your wealth will not help and will disappear altogether, like a haze of fog.
            There is a nomenclature in the DPRK, but in such ridiculous amounts .... The rest of the population is in full combat readiness, while the Yukoreytsa have only military specialists, the rest relax on the subject of military training. He was especially interested in this area, they live there, and there’s a bit too much of these loafers for little Yukorea -))))) Asy military are at first better than not so skillfully, but the militarily prepared military force, but in the neighboring read the thread with Wasserman about the lack of expert aces, maybe then a thread will reach you, and a propaganda movie can be laid out from any country - and there it will still look spectacular -)))))
        2. Lopatov
          Lopatov 26 March 2013 01: 22 New
          +3
          And that is why the UK has such a rapidly growing economy? "Typical Eloi" pulled their country from the deepest pit. They were much poorer than the North Koreans.
          I was in Japan. If you watch movies and clips, they only do that they relax. And in real life they plow like slaves in galleys.
          1. Pimply
            Pimply 26 March 2013 13: 31 New
            -1
            A fracture in the South Caucasus occurred somewhere in the early 70's.
        3. BruderV
          BruderV 26 March 2013 01: 47 New
          0
          Quote: aksakal
          With such a lot you can’t win, if at all

          Not for propaganda. Just everyone sees what he wants to see
        4. Pimply
          Pimply 26 March 2013 13: 30 New
          -2
          Firstly, the DPRK has a very strict class system of Songbuns. Absolutely official.
          Secondly, there are several separate elite estates.
  • Backbone
    Backbone 25 March 2013 10: 33 New
    +1
    Against 10-20 artillery mounts, this system will be ineffective in any way. And if (rather yes, than no) the territory is shot by northerners, then southerners can not oppose anything. Moreover, it is noted that North Korean installations are reliably protected. In general, are there any ways to defend against artillery shells? Well, there is a type of "Arena" or what other dynamic protection?
    1. Nayhas
      Nayhas 25 March 2013 11: 06 New
      -1
      SK are eyeing the Iron Dome, but its effectiveness against conventional shells is somehow doubtful, although they may want to use DPRK against missiles. But again, the total volley that can provide the DPRK with BM-21 to intercept will not be realistic.
      1. beard999
        beard999 25 March 2013 17: 56 New
        +4
        Quote: Nayhas
        SK are eyeing the Iron Dome

        This is more Israeli Wishlist than the real intentions of the South Caucasus. The same thing was previously attributed to India, until the official refusal of the Indians appeared http://www.rg.ru/printable/2013/02/11/kupol-anons.html.
        "Iron Dome" is a system effective exclusively in Israel - to intercept Hamas homemade products. As for the volleys of regular RS MLRS, the Israeli air defense system is not an assistant. Just for an example. As you know, the Iron Dome battery has three launchers with 60 missiles. In order to absolutely guarantee to break through the Iron Dome battery and hit the intended target, 3 BM Grad MLRS are enough. Two BM will make a volley at the location of the battery (80 RS). Even with the interception of 100% of the RS (although this is naturally fantastic), 20 RS will cover the air defense system battery in any case. The third BM (40 RS) can already be worked out without interference on the target. Intercept the salvo of the third BM, the air defense system will simply have nothing ...
        Thus, the MLRS, created more than 50 years ago, is quite relevant in the fight against the latest Israeli air defense systems.
        And that would be completely understandable. Israel used 50 batteries (6 missiles) to block the Gaza Strip (territory with a front length of less than 12 km and a depth of 5-300 km). And as they wrote in the media, it would be nice for more efficiency to have 1-2 more batteries (at the same time, note that Hamas residents did not have full-time BMRS MLRS “Grad”). For comparison, the border between Korea is about 240 km. BM MLRS in the DPRK - more than 2500 units.
        Yossi Drucker, Rafael's Iron Dome project manager, claimed the cost of one missile was $ 100. The cost of one Iron Dome air defense system (battery), according to various media estimates, was $ 50 to $ 200 million. Compare this with the cost of BM-21 and RS to it.
        And why the heck is Iron Dome for such money and with such efficiency?
        1. Professor
          Professor 25 March 2013 18: 07 New
          0
          For a long time something you have not been seen ... hi
          Compare this with the cost of the BM-21 and RS to it.

          Compare the cost of a cartridge and body armor.
          And fuck Law Firm Iron Dome»Body armor, for such money and with such efficiency? wink Rhetorical question - do not answer.
        2. Pimply
          Pimply 26 March 2013 13: 34 New
          0
          Do you have some idea why SK needs an LCD? No? Because they have Seoul in the zone of direct destruction of missile systems and artillery. And now the main potential deal is the exchange of 4 South Korean ships for a dozen domes.
    2. Lopatov
      Lopatov 25 March 2013 12: 51 New
      +3
      Absolutely effective. They will knock out these little balls long before they can cause tangible harm.
      1. Professor
        Professor 25 March 2013 17: 31 New
        0
        Absolutely effective. They will knock out these little balls long before they can cause tangible harm.

        good

        In general, are there any ways to defend against artillery shells?

        I suppose you are interested in active defense, not bunkers? The Americans successfully laser shot down shells and naval anti-aircraft installations.
        1. Lopatov
          Lopatov 25 March 2013 20: 19 New
          0
          Actually, I'm talking about North Korean wunderwaffes. They will be kicked out.
  • Nayhas
    Nayhas 25 March 2013 11: 09 New
    0
    Well, finally, Spike-NLOS needs to be used in conjunction with UAVs, how is the SK going to carry out guidance without preliminary reconnaissance of the target?
  • ed65b
    ed65b 25 March 2013 11: 52 New
    +3
    Jews lit Korean suckers. Right now, and they will sell them a cap and drushlag. laughing
  • Lopatov
    Lopatov 25 March 2013 12: 47 New
    +2
    I haven’t read such a game for a long time. It seems that the Americans paid for this newspaper, because the Israelis are crossing the road for the second time.
    1. opkozak
      opkozak 25 March 2013 14: 31 New
      +4
      Of course, the Koreans were bred. Against the enemy’s batteries and in the rocks, it’s good to fight, for example with thermobaric charges - the ammunition stock of guns - detonates. The blast wave fights off from opposite cliffs and causes an extensive concussion of the internal organs of the artillerymen (minced meat is popular). Ours used it shelling from "Pinocchio" Mujahideen. And you don’t have to hit hard enough accuracy of 20-50 m. Read the previous articles on topvar. We have a 9M55S rocket for the Smerch MLRS.


      If you beware of all kinds of Hague conventions (imagine the Koreans are going to sue), then there’s another thing - a 300-mm 9M55K1 missile with self-aiming warheads. Number of warheads, pcs 5. Weight of explosive explosives, kg 4,5
      Armor penetration at an angle of 30 ° from normal
      to armor from a distance of 100 m. 70 mm
      homogeneous armor. Firing Range, km:
      - maximum 70 km, minimum -20 km. Tactics - launched a UAV. He took the target. Sharnul first. Retargeted. The heat has gone.

      1. Lopatov
        Lopatov 25 March 2013 14: 39 New
        0
        Cool. And what is the flying time of planes with such bombs? I am afraid that during this time the North Korean artillerymen will already fulfill their task, and the use of such weapons will become an act of revenge, and not a military necessity.

        According to the MLRS, the Tornado rockets are not much cheaper than the Spikes, in addition, they require expensive reconnaissance equipment.
        1. bazilio
          bazilio 25 March 2013 15: 53 New
          0
          Quote: Spade
          Against the enemy’s batteries and in the rocks, it’s good to fight, for example with thermobaric charges - the ammunition stock of guns - detonates.

          Yes, I agree, but the ODAB has a limitation associated with the principle of work. The effect of volume detonation is achieved by spraying an aerosol suspension of explosives. In strong winds, during precipitation, the effectiveness of the ODAB decreases almost to a minimum. In the described conditions, coastal cliffs, and therefore windy weather or fogs, are not the most suitable conditions for ODAB. Again, this is an aircraft ammunition, and therefore this is either the weapon to strike first, or the weapon of retaliation.
          Quote: Spade
          We have a 9M55S rocket for the Smerch MLRS.

          Yes, Tornado is a unique vehicle, but according to passport data, the minimum firing range is 20 km, and in the case under discussion, the distance to the target is 12-15 km.


          Quote: opkozak
          300-mm 9M55K1 missile with self-aiming warheads. Number of warheads, pcs 5. Weight of explosive explosives, kg 4,5

          So also anti-tank ammunition. "Suitable for use in open areas, in the steppe and desert, it is almost impossible to use in the forest, it is difficult to use in the city. Designed to defeat the top groups of armored vehicles and tanks."
        2. opkozak
          opkozak 25 March 2013 16: 04 New
          +3
          They say that dogs eat cheap meat. It is necessary to use different damaging means.
          Speaking of weapons of volumetric explosion (WWII) found a cool article.
          http://nnm.ru/blogs/smprofi/oruzhie_budushego_boepripasy_obemnogo_vzryva/
          Where is it written. NOT “WUNDERWAFFE” But, despite its high combat effectiveness, WWII have a number of significant drawbacks. For example, they have only one damaging factor - a shock wave.
          They do not and do not possess cumulative and fragmentation effects.
          The blasting effect — the ability to destroy an obstacle — is quite low in thermobaric ammunition. Even well-sealed field fortifications can be a pretty good defense against a DOM explosion.
          Modern hermetically sealed armored vehicles and tanks can also safely withstand such an explosion, even in its epicenter. That is why BOV has to be supplied with a small cumulative charge.
          At medium altitudes, where there is little free oxygen, the phenomenon of a volume explosion is difficult, and at altitudes greater, where there is even less oxygen, it is impossible at all (which practically excludes the air defense sphere). In case of heavy rain or strong wind, the cloud either dissipates strongly or does not form at all.
          This led to the fact that, for example, in Afghanistan, the targets for the ODAB had to be chosen only in the valleys - in the discharged and oxygen-poor air of the high mountains, they lost their strength. In order to at least partially compensate for these shortcomings, the military often had to trick, using a kind of “cocktail” - a combination of ODAB with smoke bombs, whose thick smoke did not allow the aerosol to disperse.
          For anti-battery fight. But with smart use.
          1. aksakal
            aksakal 26 March 2013 00: 19 New
            0
            Quote: opkozak
            This led to the fact that, for example, in Afghanistan, targets for the ODAB had to be chosen only in the valleys - in the discharged and oxygen-poor air of the high mountains, they lost strength.
            - and they say, a ruse for inventions of cunning laughing A small can of highly compressed oxygen will not add much mass to the bomb, but use in the mountains would already be possible. Moreover, to add a spray can partially be possible by reducing the main explosive - compressed oxygen also explodes very well by itself, especially if the oilseed is a little nearby laughing No, ours in Afghanistan were clearly not starving, since this invention was not enough
    2. Professor
      Professor 25 March 2013 17: 34 New
      0
      I haven’t read such a game for a long time. It seems that the Americans paid for this newspaper, because the Israelis are crossing the road for the second time.

      IMHO local is an article, Korean. I believe that her legs are growing from the Korean military-industrial complex. Koreans are always opposed to everything foreign, where patriotism comes to not healthy forms.
      1. bazilio
        bazilio 25 March 2013 18: 10 New
        +2
        It seems to me that art is the best solution for the tasks described in the article for the UK. Beach complex
        A wide selection of ammunition, hits 20 km. At the same time, it can also work on ships with speeds up to 100 knots (Wikipedia data), with a detection and fire control system + the ability to fire in automatic mode + mobile, it will be possible to escape from retaliation
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 26 March 2013 13: 35 New
          0
          He is not able to protect large areas. And the Koreans need to protect Seoul
  • smprofi
    smprofi 25 March 2013 19: 36 New
    +3
    Well, this is how they fulfill the task in North Korea









    1. bazilio
      bazilio 25 March 2013 19: 48 New
      +1
      They work beautifully. The question arises: what can the South Caucasus counterpose to this? If you peel not at the coastal battery, but at distant objects, then Tornado. Well, the fleet in the form of shock high-speed ships, patrolling the area and able to instantly respond to such a volley.
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 25 March 2013 19: 59 New
        +1
        Aviation SC aviation is an order of magnitude stronger.
        1. smprofi
          smprofi 25 March 2013 21: 31 New
          +1
          Well, there gringos from the Nippon Islands and aircraft carriers will help. it is clear
    2. Lopatov
      Lopatov 25 March 2013 20: 51 New
      +1
      Interestingly, they put them for beauty, or this is the standard placement of tools and installations.
    3. BruderV
      BruderV 25 March 2013 21: 04 New
      +2
      God forbid these dashing carts will start to peel
      1. BruderV
        BruderV 25 March 2013 21: 32 New
        0
        And when these guys with PPSh and tarry attack go here certainly the end of world imperialism. Photo of this year.
  • BruderV
    BruderV 25 March 2013 20: 32 New
    0
    By the way here on Friday wrote about North Korean drones here they are Stalin's falcons. ETOGES need V-2 resurrected, but on the Zile. Divine.
    1. Windbreak
      Windbreak 25 March 2013 23: 56 New
      0
      Copy-alteration of the American target drone MQM-107 Streaker (first flight in 1974) Toli Iran helped, felts from South Korea accidentally flew
  • воронов
    воронов 26 March 2013 00: 26 New
    +1
    If the hook is between the Koreans, then I think the Southerners will not find it a little, they don’t have much hope for Yap, they don’t have a fighting samurai spirit, and they don’t have any special opportunities, the hope is only for Amers, and the Chinese will crush the Northerners, there’s more than one million army volunteers "will come up and most likely the Vietnamese will share their Bodalov experience with the amers, and ours will remember 1951-1953g.
    1. Lopatov
      Lopatov 26 March 2013 01: 24 New
      0
      The Chinese will not climb. For them, SK is like a suitcase without a handle that has long had time to get bored.
      1. Cheloveck
        Cheloveck 26 March 2013 03: 15 New
        0
        Quote: Spade
        The Chinese will not climb. For them, SK is like a suitcase without a handle that has long had time to get bored.

        How to climb!
        They need to develop combat experience, but they must verify their developments in real conditions.
        And here is such a chance ...
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 26 March 2013 13: 39 New
          -1
          Not at a split in which you can lose half the economy
  • Martar
    Martar 26 March 2013 12: 17 New
    -1
    Israel clearly unleashed South Korea at $ 43 million)))
    These are Israeli missiles, and besides, the British said that everything is good, it’s necessary to take shit, even without testing under operating conditions. But it does not fly in fogs, and developers do not need to finish it under fogs, to spend money on what Israel does not need. Now the South Caucasus does not even get to the bottom of Israel, they will kill all the targets in the desert and they will be told that they are fools themselves, because they had to watch what you take before taking.
  • Gavrn
    Gavrn 27 March 2013 18: 48 New
    +2
    An article about how the army of the UK bought a sniper rifle, and the journalist wants a machine gun :)
    1. aksakal
      aksakal 28 March 2013 01: 52 New
      +1
      Quote: GAVRN
      An article about how the army of the UK bought a sniper rifle, and the journalist wants a machine gun :)

      More precisely, a machine gun that puts a burst on the target with sniper accuracy. So even the "Pecheneg" does not suffer from this-))))).
      In general, they try to put shoes on each other, Jews get better shoes laughing Experience, however, with centuries
  • Zen
    Zen 30 March 2013 02: 57 New
    +1
    If Koreans cling to each other, then a big war can begin.