Artificial Earthquake: Penetrating Seismic Nuclear Warheads for Oreshnik IRBM

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Artificial Earthquake: Penetrating Seismic Nuclear Warheads for Oreshnik IRBM

So, today we will return to the topic of ballistics missiles medium-range ballistic missile (MRBM) "Oreshnik" and let's talk about what worries many people - about nuclear warheads (NW) for this weapons.

Despite the fact that “here and now” the Oreshnik MRBM is more effectively used in a conventional (non-nuclear) version, which the author has already spoken about many times, the dynamics of military-political processes in the world do not really contribute to optimistic forecasts - it is possible that we will still have to take several steps up the “escalation ladder”, including the use of nuclear weapons (NW).



What role can the Oreshnik MRBM play here?

Earlier in the article "Passions for the "Nut"" We talked about the fact that Russia has more than enough nuclear weapons carriers, but the Oreshnik IRBM has several significant advantages over them.

NTDS


N-non-interceptability
The existing American anti-aircraft missile systems (SAM) of the Standard and Patriot type and anti-missile (ABM) systems of the THAAD type, potentially capable of intercepting hypersonic targets and some modifications of IRBMs, have never solved this problem in combat conditions.

During their tests, analogues of the ancient Soviet operational-tactical missile complex (OTRK) "Scud" or some analogues of MRBMs were used, while their launch points and flight trajectories were known in advance, and they themselves were usually "illuminated" by several radar stations (RLS) at once.


THAAD missile defense system and Scud OTRK

From real-life cases, it is known that on January 17, 2022, in the UAE, the THAAD missile defense system destroyed an IRBM launched by the Houthis at an oil facility near the al-Dhafra airbase.

Of course, if you listen to Ukrainian sources, then the Ukrainian anti-aircraft missile forces intercept Russian hypersonic missiles of the Kinzhal complex literally in batches, but from the Russian side there are usually no official confirmations or denials, and Ukraine itself cannot present any weighty arguments - usually at the site of the alleged strike, the remains of Ukrainian anti-aircraft guided missiles are found.

As for the Oreshnik MRBM, here, from the point of view of interception, everything is even more complicated - the flight trajectory of the warheads (WB) is most likely flat, the WBs themselves are controlled, it is possible that they carry out anti-aircraft maneuvers both in the middle section of the flight trajectory and in the final section, when the speed of approach to the target exceeds 11 Machs.

It is unlikely that anyone will be able to intercept the Oreshnik MRBM warheads in combat conditions, at least now and in the near future.

T-precision
Presumably, the accuracy of the Oreshnik MRBM warheads is significantly higher than that of intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs) or submarine-launched ballistic missiles (SLBMs). It can be assumed that the accuracy of the Oreshnik MRBM warheads is comparable to the accuracy of the Kinzhal hypersonic missiles, which is several meters.

Considering that the combat units are moving sequentially and have individual guidance, they can potentially all “arrive” at almost the same point.

D-range
This parameter is only significant in the context of the non-interceptability and accuracy parameters. In terms of range, cruise missiles (CM) of the Kh-101/Kh-102 type are comparable to the Oreshnik IRBM, but they can be easily intercepted by the enemy en route.


KR X-101 / X-102

Conventional ICBMs and SLBMs, when fired along a flat trajectory, will most likely have significantly lower accuracy - only the 15P771 Avangard complex can potentially surpass the Oreshnik in range, with comparable accuracy and non-interceptability.

But the cost of the Avangard complex, which is based on the 15Yu71 hypersonic glide guided warhead, is most likely significantly higher than that of the Oreshnik MRBM, although in general it is a big question to what extent the projects of the Oreshnik MRBM warheads and the Avangard complex glide hypersonic warheads are related to each other.

C-speed
Another parameter in which the Oreshnik MRBM is a leader, but, again, only in conjunction with range and accuracy.

The hypersonic missile of the Kinzhal complex also accelerates to 11 Machs, although its final speed when approaching the target is unknown, and the range is certainly shorter. The warheads of the ICBM and SLBM approach the target at a speed of 6-7 kilometers per second, but their accuracy is significantly lower than that of the Oreshnik BP MRBM. We have already discussed the Avangard complex above.


Entry of ICBM/SLBM warheads into the atmosphere

What gives us an advantage in the NTDS?

Regarding non-interceptability and range, everything is clear - the attacking munition must reach the target unharmed, and the greater the distance from which the target can be attacked, the safer it is for the carrier, and the less safe the enemy will feel.

As for accuracy and speed, these two parameters are critical for hitting buried targets, such as highly protected underground bunkers.

We recently talked about this in our materials "Knockin' on the Bottom": The Limits of Possibility for Bunker-Breaker Munitions и "Tremors of the Earth": Nuclear Bunker Busters.

The Burglar


Accuracy and speed are important when using both conventional bunker-busting munitions and nuclear ones – the more accurately the warhead with a conventional or nuclear warhead (BC/NBC) is delivered, the more damage it will cause to the bunker, and the high speed of approach to the target potentially allows the Oreshnik IRBM to be “thrown” much deeper than the 60 meters accessible to bunker-busting aerial bombs – as long as the structure can withstand it.

In the material IRBM "Oreshnik": not nuclear, well maybe a little bit... we talked about the fact that the expected total mass of the Oreshnik MRBM warhead can vary in the range from 1,2 tons to 6 tons, depending on the range of use. In the latter case, the mass of the warhead is quite suitable for anti-bunker use even in the conventional version, while in the first case, the optimal solution will be a nuclear warhead.

Considering the accuracy and precision of the approach of the warheads of the Oreshnik MRBM, a “conveyor” scheme of application can be considered, when the first few inert warheads (clusters of tungsten rods) enter the ground, cause primary damage to it, crush layers of reinforced concrete protection, and behind them, as if on a “beaten path,” an BB enters, including a high-explosive or nuclear warhead.


The Oreshnik MRBM, even in the version with conventional bunker-busting warheads, can surpass the most powerful American bunker-busting aerial bomb GBU-57 MOP due to its greater depth and the use of the “conveyor” scheme.

In the above-mentioned material on nuclear bunker-busting munitions, we talked about the fact that during underground nuclear explosions at depths of about 100 meters or less, the main energy of the explosion tends to go where it is “thin”, that is, upwards.

Potentially, the Oreshnik MRBM can implement a "doublet" scheme, when two warheads with nuclear warheads, one after the other, are detonated almost simultaneously. In this case, the energy of the explosion of the second nuclear warhead, which is located above the first, will serve as a reflector for the explosion of the nuclear warhead buried as deep as possible.

That is, the second nuclear warhead would, as it were, seal off the energy of the nuclear explosion of the first nuclear warhead, directing it downwards as much as possible – toward the destruction of the enemy’s highly protected bunker.


Such synchronicity is difficult, if not impossible, to achieve for separately launched missiles, such as the hypersonic missiles of the Kinzhal complex, and is definitely impossible for bunker buster bombs.

The use of the Oreshnik MRBM with penetrating nuclear warheads may be appropriate not only for the destruction of highly protected buried objects, but also for the destruction of those objects located on the surface.

Clean nuclear weapons


There are many myths about pure nuclear weapons - that they are either being developed, or have already been developed, or even that they have already been used somewhere. In reality, only the first assumption can exist - that such developments are being carried out somewhere.

At the same time, as we have seen in the examples of peaceful underground nuclear explosions, considered in previous materials, in a number of cases the emissions of radioactive substances to the surface were minimal and amounted to single percent of the possible radiation contamination. Moreover, already a couple of kilometers from the point of the explosion, the radiation level often barely exceeded background values.

This is logical, because if the products of a nuclear explosion are sealed underground, then the contamination on the surface will be minimal, only a small amount of induced radiation from gamma rays and a stream of fast neutrons, if they can even penetrate the thickness of the soil above the explosion point.

Thus, by varying the depth of detonation of a nuclear warhead and the power of a nuclear explosion, we can obtain an almost pure nuclear explosion, only its “purity” will not be ensured by design solutions and the scheme of application.

The question arises: why do we need such a “clean” nuclear explosion if all its energy remains underground?

Why did the British engineer Barnes Wallace even invent penetrating ammunition before the start of World War II?

He invented them specifically to destroy highly protected objects located on the surface, since he assumed that local seismic vibrations from an underground explosion would have a much greater effect on them than a ground explosion of the same power, which is why those munitions were called “seismic”.


Barnes Wallace and his first seismic aerial bomb, Tallboy

It is possible that this does not work quite the same way with nuclear weapons - the greatest destruction is caused by an airborne nuclear explosion, but it also pollutes both the atmosphere and the surface the most.

If underground explosions with a power of about 100 kilotons at a depth of about 100 meters led to the formation of craters with a diameter of several hundred meters, then an explosion of lesser power, for example, several kilotons, at a depth of about 100 meters will not lead to the formation of a crater, but the resulting ground movements will lead to the destruction of above-ground buildings and structures in the affected area - in fact, we are talking about a local earthquake.

Thus, by varying the depth of detonation of a nuclear warhead and the power of a nuclear explosion, we can not only obtain a pure nuclear explosion, but also achieve the destruction of ground-based buildings and structures by creating an artificial earthquake.

What will be the affected area?

This must be determined by calculation, varying the depth of detonation of the nuclear warhead and the power of the nuclear explosion, and for each target individually, taking into account the composition of the underlying soils.

It can be assumed that, as in the case of underground bunkers, the impact of a closed underground nuclear explosion (when the explosion products do not come to the surface) will cause even greater seismic vibrations, and therefore a larger diameter of the destruction zone than in the case where a funnel is formed with the explosion products coming to the surface.

Ukraine


So how deep can Oreshnik go into Ukraine?

There are a number of targets against which the Oreshnik IRBM with penetrating seismic nuclear warheads can be effectively used.

For example, these are Ukrainian underground gas storage facilities (UGS).


In the event of the use of the Oreshnik MRBM with penetrating nuclear warheads in the “clean” underground nuclear explosion variant, the seismic impact will destroy or damage both above-ground buildings, structures and equipment, as well as underground structures – vertical mine shafts and technological equipment located below ground level.

At the surface, radiation contamination of the area will be minimal, but it will not go anywhere from underground, so the restoration of the underground storage facility will have to be postponed for decades, if not centuries.

Another promising type of target is 750/330 kW high-voltage substations.

There are not that many of them left in Ukraine – about ten, of which nuclear warheads cannot be used only against those located at nuclear power plants (NPPs) or near them, but the rest can be dealt with without ceremony.

Due to seismic impact, all equipment located on the surface can be destroyed or damaged – generator transformers, autotransformers, general station control points, high-voltage adjacent power transmission lines (PTL) and other technological equipment.

Considering that their structures are largely made of metal, induced radiation may occur in them, which will make the object unrepairable for a long time, while the induced radiation will not spread beyond the attacked object.


Other objects may also be attacked – central railway hubs, large industrial enterprises, fuel and energy complex facilities, and much more.

In cases where there are populated areas near the objects intended for attack, it is possible to notify the population of the attack in advance, several weeks in advance, so that people can calmly evacuate - during this time, it is impossible in principle to evacuate the plant itself.

Of course, we are talking about Ukraine now, but we also mean Poland, the Baltic countries, and other countries of Eastern and Western Europe.

Conclusions


Donald Trump's coming to power does not mean that the war with Ukraine will end on terms acceptable to us; perhaps we will only see another round of escalation, and it is possible that we will not reach a direct military clash with NATO countries.

And what should we do then, burn our men in the crucible of war, replacing them with migrants from Central Asian countries?

This path will lead us to only one thing – the destruction of Russia as a state.


The only option left is to use nuclear weapons, but it is far from certain that it will be to our advantage. This could lead to a scenario where “we will go to heaven and they will all die,” but despite the optimism of the message, there are hardly many people who want to go to heaven right now.

The Oreshnik MRBM with warheads equipped with penetrating seismic nuclear warheads may prove to be the most effective weapon at the last level of escalation between Russia and Western countries, ensuring the guaranteed destruction of highly protected underground and above-ground facilities without significant radiation contamination of the area.
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  1. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. +7
        27 January 2025 06: 05
        And this is fundamentally wrong. The situation needs to be changed.
        1. +8
          27 January 2025 06: 52
          Quote from: FoBoss_VM
          The situation needs to change

          We hand out citizenship too easily. IOM membership probably has an effect here. I wouldn't be surprised if it's the same as with all the sanctions, WTO, IMF...
          1. +7
            27 January 2025 08: 41
            Too It's easy for us to hand out citizenship.

            You probably misspoke: cheap!
            1. 0
              8 March 2025 11: 10
              At the surface, radiation contamination of the area will be minimal, but it will not go anywhere from underground, so the restoration of the underground storage facility will have to be postponed for decades, if not centuries.

              Well, why should we poison the land that, based on historical claims, should be ours anyway? Everyone understands that the war in Ukraine will end VERY quickly if the West stops supplying Ukraine with weapons and ammunition. Well, we need to force the West to stop supplying. It is clear that it is not worth hitting France and Britain (which have nuclear weapons) (at least right away). But it is possible and necessary to hit other territories and important military and political infrastructure facilities located there. Yes, now we need to let the US, led by Trump, save face and break off relations with Europe themselves. There is progress in this direction, but we do not yet know where it will lead. But we should not poison our historical land, but rather hammer our true enemies - the European monarchies. So Oreshnik should be used against Brussels... let there be a "sealed zone" in place of the military bunkers, which is not worth going into for a couple of hundred years because of the radiation.
    2. +4
      27 January 2025 11: 16
      not work
      Only volunteers "die" easily, joyfully and effectively
      Migrants can only point machine guns at their officers
      if you don't give a machine gun, the convoy, food, and clothing will still cost more than the volunteers
      1. +3
        27 January 2025 12: 20
        Quote from: nepunamemuk
        not work
        Why? Simply, such people need to be diluted in other groups, without any possibility of even a mini-diaspora. And in Soviet times there were problems, when for every ten Russians in a unit there were a hundred Dagestanis or someone else. In addition, if you have to serve for citizenship, and serve not just anyhow, this will be a strong incentive.
        1. +2
          27 January 2025 13: 23
          late
          Two Tajiks shot eleven people at a firing range sad
          1. +3
            27 January 2025 14: 20
            Quote from: nepunamemuk
            eleven people were shot
            If you hang such people on poles, there will be fewer people willing to join. What kind of selection is there if such scumbags end up in the unit? Also, the Russians shot their own, it happened during hazing, in retaliation for bullying. It is unlikely that this particular case is a system.
            1. +1
              28 January 2025 17: 00
              Also, Russians shot their own, it happened during hazing, in revenge for bullying. It is unlikely that this particular case is a system.

              There was a case in the SA. We read such orders based on the investigation materials of the military prosecutor's office. Not all greenhorns could stand the bullying of their grandfathers. For some, especially the psychos, it was unbearable. As a result, fights, and in rare cases executions on guard duty, when AKMs with live ammunition were in hand.
  2. +11
    27 January 2025 04: 30
    There are a number of targets against which the Oreshnik IRBM with penetrating seismic nuclear warheads can be effectively used.

    For example, these are Ukrainian underground gas storage facilities (UGS).
    In the event of the use of the Oreshnik MRBM with penetrating nuclear warheads in the “clean” underground nuclear explosion variant, the seismic impact will destroy or damage both above-ground buildings, structures and equipment, as well as underground structures – vertical mine shafts and technological equipment located below ground level.

    There is no process equipment below ground level at the UGS, a pipe cemented on the outside goes there, all the equipment is located on the surface and can be easily destroyed by a regular high-explosive device of sufficient power, ensuring the necessary accuracy. There is also no need to blow up the pipe at depth, because if it is damaged even close to the surface (ideally, the gas from the pipe should break through to the surface - it will certainly catch fire - and this is a total disaster), it can no longer be repaired. A new well will have to be drilled and cased, which is quite solvable.
    1. 0
      27 January 2025 15: 42
      Hi all! hi The article is wonderful! Respect to the author!
      Have you heard? Have you heard? They're building a city underground,
      They say so, in case of a nuclear war!

      This is from Vysotsky's song "Rumors". I believe in our Victory! And the enemies won't hide underground no matter how hard they try. It's easier to get to hell am am!
  3. +9
    27 January 2025 04: 53
    This requires desire, but the authorities don't have it. Only drawing.
    1. +8
      27 January 2025 06: 55
      How then to win if there is no desire, perhaps the "grenades" (power) here are not of the right system...
  4. +15
    27 January 2025 05: 09
    Wow, so many targets at once, both nuclear and non-nuclear, and the whole world in pieces, and in general everything is great and wonderful. In fact, there was only one launch of the hazelnut tree, they wanted to emphasize the red line, they emphasized it for exactly one day, and the missiles flew in our direction again. More than one month has passed since the last launch, at least some prehistoric point of U was launched, it doesn’t matter where, at least in the direction of the enemy, and here we are talking about a whole hazelnut tree. And that with warnings, SMS mailings, letters, faxes, and other information joys, eh, if only in a war the soldiers of both sides were armed with water pistols, where on a hot sunny day, they would all cheerfully shoot each other with water, run to recharge, and at the end of the day all together discuss the battle, drink beer, and laugh merrily, then yes, it would be “the best job in the world”, but war is not going that way at all, people kill there, fiercely, and without the slightest pity. And the more painful and large blows there are, the faster the wars end.......
    1. +10
      27 January 2025 06: 07
      By the way, there was so much pathos... laughing How many times after that did the storm of scalps and atakams fly in to Belgorod, Kursk and Bryansk regions? Probably about ten, if not more... The West is not afraid of the Russian leadership
  5. +7
    27 January 2025 05: 46
    There are certain oddities with the Oreshnik MRBM.
    The Russian President stated that the missile had been developed for several years and that he personally supported its development. As is known, IRBMs were not developed in Russia; it was believed that the Iskander and Kinzhal would be sufficient. Wikipedia: development years 2023-2024.
    Who is the developer?
    When was the test conducted? That is, they tested it in Ukraine right away?
    Who is the manufacturer? On November 28, 2024, Putin announced that Oreshnik had been put into serial production by Russian factories.
    Missile designation?
    Photo of the PGRK?
    In which military unit or formation was the Oreshnik put into service (the media writes about ICBMs, where they are put into service)?
    For example, see the Vanguard (missile system) wiki:
    "Avangard" is a Russian missile system (15P771) equipped with a guided warhead (15U71 or Yu-71). The basis of the system is a hypersonic guided warhead launched to the target using an intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) UR-100N UTTKh/RS-28.
    Years of operation 2019 — present
    First flight December 26, 2018
    When was it produced 2018 - present
    In service with the Strategic Missile Forces
    Designer of OKB-52
    Manufacturer Votkinsk plant
    1. +1
      27 January 2025 06: 29
      Quote: smart fellow
      Designer of OKB-52
      Manufacturer Votkinsk plant

      You need to talk less
    2. -7
      27 January 2025 06: 59
      The missile is smaller, easier to hide. Perhaps new workshops, factories with buried exits. Perhaps ours, using tracking systems, calculate the windows between the flights of radio-location satellites of spies, or have learned to counteract using anti-radar emitters on the same frequency from closely located places and in cloudy weather.
      1. 0
        27 January 2025 07: 53
        Everything falls into place if we put together the information in the media. A train carrying presumably 5 or 4 Pukguksong-2 (US designation: KN15) mounts with an estimated range of 1200-3000 km, first shown in 2017, was spotted in Russia (the train also carried about fifty Koksan self-propelled howitzers). In the summer of 2024, North Korea reported the successful launch of a missile with a multiple warhead designed to penetrate the missile defenses of the United States and South Korea. The KCNA report claimed that “individual warheads [were] accurately targeted at three specified coordinates,” and radar stations verified the effectiveness of the “decoy separated from the missile.”
    3. +3
      27 January 2025 10: 27
      "Who is the developer?
      When was the test conducted?"///
      ---
      Oreshnik is a Rubezh MRBM.
      Look for material about Rubezh.
      1. 0
        27 January 2025 11: 33
        bryahnya)) we firmly and strictly adhere to the INF Treaty, which is now inoperative, so all the talk about the border is not serious) they pulled up the Almaz station and dropped a pallet of bricks from it, and when they entered the atmosphere, they caused a local bada-boom
  6. +2
    27 January 2025 06: 19
    It would be nice to fantasize about the next goals for "Oreshnik" - the construction (or construction) of enterprises for the repair and restoration of foreign military equipment... Although, although suddenly there are foreign specialists there, and it's a pity about the equipment somehow...
  7. 0
    27 January 2025 06: 55
    Donald Trump's coming to power does not mean that the war with Ukraine will end on terms acceptable to us

    The war that the West is waging through Ukraine cannot a priori end in any other way than the complete and unconditional capitulation of both the Kyiv and European Nazi communities, because there will be no conditions acceptable to Russia in the negotiations.
    And what should we do then, burn our men in the crucible of war, replacing them with migrants from Central Asian countries?

    This is the most pressing question and there are not many answers to it.
    By the way, we learned from DAM that last year there were 450 volunteers, and other sources reported that 000 of our compatriots were fighting in Ukraine... I don’t want to make incorrect assumptions, but this is alarming...
    * * *
    If the mass European hysteria continues, we will have to give a verified and thoughtful response in any case. And it should already be ready, because we don’t want to end up in June 80, 22 in the year of the 1941th anniversary of the Great Victory...
    1. +2
      27 January 2025 08: 45
      By the way, we learned from DAM that last year there were 450 volunteers, and other sources reported that 000 of our compatriots were fighting in Ukraine... I don’t want to make incorrect assumptions, but this is alarming...

      so this is the law of life: if something is lost somewhere, then something else must gain...
    2. +6
      27 January 2025 09: 04
      Quote: yuriy55
      The war that the West is waging through Ukraine cannot a priori end differently
      If we talk about a shameful deal, if not capitulation, then a war of attrition, this is what will lead to, only increasing the wealth of Russian billionaires, who have long ceased to be our "elite". If we talk specifically about Russia's victory, then here, rather, we must talk about the complete and unconditional capitulation of capitalism itself in Russia, the return of people's power and socialism.
      1. +2
        27 January 2025 09: 05
        Quote: Per se.
        If we are talking specifically about Russia’s victory, then here, rather, we should talk about the complete and unconditional capitulation of capitalism itself in Russia, the return of people’s power and socialism.

        Yes, such a victory is worth a lot...
      2. 0
        27 January 2025 11: 23
        complete and unconditional capitulation of capitalism itself in Russia, the return of people's power and socialism

        how many of "our own" will have to be intercepted...
        1. +1
          27 January 2025 12: 05
          Quote from: nepunamemuk
          how many "of our own"
          Not only the West has shown its true face in "democracy", but also all the inverted renegades have shown themselves, what to speak about the arrogant oligarchs, they have not been shy for a long time. Suitcase, train station, London... All of them either have connections with crime, or corruption, other violations of the law. There are, one must think, those who have acquired wealth relatively honestly, this is a separate topic, although they say that you can't acquire stone palaces by honest labor. We must draw conclusions about the good for the country, but it is unlikely that this good is in what is happening to this "elite" now.
          1. +2
            27 January 2025 13: 10
            Suitcase, train station, London...

            Why is that?
            handcuffs, confiscation, Magadan. am
            1. +1
              27 January 2025 14: 22
              Quote from: nepunamemuk
              handcuffs, confiscation, Magadan.
              That's also an option, but I think they'll escape sooner, with personal planes, yachts, and informants.
  8. 0
    27 January 2025 07: 31
    Why does the author write SKAD at the beginning of the article? Isn't that the NATO designation for the Elbrus missile system? I see many people have taken a liking to the bourgeois name
    1. +2
      27 January 2025 07: 52
      Quote: Vadim S
      Why does the author write SKAD at the beginning of the article? Isn't that the NATO designation for the Elbrus missile system?
      Elbrus - is a complex that includes the missile itself, as well as the communications system, guidance and transport on which it is located. Scud - the NATO name of our R-17 missile, but in some third world countries where we supplied these missiles, they underwent minor modernization and were no longer exact clones of the R-17. For example, Saddam Hussein had these missiles modernized by some West German company...
  9. +2
    27 January 2025 09: 15
    >"here and now" the Oreshnik MRBM is more effectively used in a conventional (non-nuclear) version
    not true
  10. +10
    27 January 2025 09: 22
    Fantasies and dreamers...
    Previously, we fantasized about Peresvet, Burevestnik, Poseidon, 3000 Armat...
    And now about Oreshnik
    Fu
  11. 0
    27 January 2025 11: 16
    we can also talk about combat tripods and then vimanas with parabrahma needles are on the way)) our enemies probably read our sites in case they manage to scare someone)))
  12. +1
    27 January 2025 11: 24
    A small clarification. An airborne nuclear explosion is not the "dirtiest". It only produces fission fragments. The dirtiest is a ground-based one, in addition to fission fragments, tons of radioactive dust are produced there, raised into the air by the explosion.
  13. The comment was deleted.
  14. 0
    27 January 2025 18: 22
    Andrey. Good day. Overall, the article is good, but most of the conclusions made in it are far from reality. The first thing that caught my eye was the speed of the ICBM warheads approaching the earth's surface - 6-7 km/s. This is far from true. Formally, the earth's atmosphere ends at an altitude of 900 km. But in reality, it ends at the Karman Line, i.e. at an altitude of 100 km. What is higher is practically a vacuum, even the Mach number cannot be measured, due to the lack of any density of the medium in which the speed of sound propagation can be measured. On the approach to this very Karman line, BB ICBMs with a launch range of 9 - 600 km have a speed of 12 -800 km / s, they enter the dense layers of the atmosphere at a fairly acute angle to the earth's surface (horizon) of 7,2 - 7,6 degrees, before they collide with the earth's surface they need to cover a distance of 18-23 km or even (by eye) more, when approaching the earth's surface BBs have a speed of no more than 750 km / s. Now, as for equipping the "Oreshnik" with something similar to the "Avangard". The "Oreshnik" has a throw-in weight of 800 kg (warhead from the "Yars"). The UR-3N UTTKh can fit only one "Avangard", the "Sarmat" only two. Maneuvering in the atmosphere is an expensive pleasure and eats up a lot of throw-in weight. In general, I have big doubts about the usefulness of such a device. Example - let's compare two options of combat equipment of the Sarmat ICBM - the first - 1250 unguided BBs with individual targeting of medium power class (100 kt) and the second option - two guided warheads "Avangard". The first option, the Americans will need at least 20 GBI anti-missiles to shoot down all the BBs, for combat equipment with "Avangards" - up to 500 anti-missiles, although the homing head of the anti-missile will have to be modified, but these modifications are a pittance both in time and money.
    1. +2
      28 January 2025 00: 19
      Quote from sergeyketonov
      Overall the article is good, but most of the conclusions made in it are far from reality.

      Sergey, welcome! hi
      I agree with the article's assessment. But, as is tradition, with your and the author's permission (?), a couple of remarks on the subject:
      1. At the beginning of the article the author writes about SCUDs (R-17) that shot down PATRIOTS on the BV. And it is not surprising, because hitting a "flying pillar" with an RCS of 15 sq. m is not at all the same as hitting a "carrot" (with an RCS of 0,5 sq. m). But even then, they hit the "tanks", not the BZO missiles! Therefore, the falling remains, soaring, hit the target.
      2. ORESHNIK breeds the blocks to apogee! literally 10-15 seconds after the "hyperstart". R-ta has a solid propellant rocket engine on a mixed high-energy fuel. And then you need to intercept 6 BB + n TLC! And here 2x2 PRR will not do, as you think.
      3. About accuracy. It depends on the control system, which, I believe, traditionally consists of IN+GLONASS/NAVSTAR+OLS... Therefore, when GPS (GLONASS) is suppressed... one can only dream of accuracy. And the 10 m SQWO will go into oblivion, but ICBMs/SLBMs have such an option as "astrocorrection" (they fly "close to the stars, with an apogee of 1300 km! And not 120 -- like BSRD). Therefore, if they fit into 90/250 m, then it will be nice, because this, in principle, is comparable to the "hole" that the SBP will dig during the explosion.
      4. About the throw weight. It's time to stop repeating the nonsense about 6000 kg that will be loaded onto the MRBM! The equipment is most likely standard from the YaRS, well, maybe they'll tweak it from the R-29PMU... That's why 6 carrots flew to Donetsk...
      5. About 2 SBPs one after the other in "one pocket". Well, this has been tested for a long time: they don't shoot at protected/buried objects like that. The Yankees have long ago come to the conclusion that 1 SBP from 2 DIFFERENT ICBMs should be used to work on the silo. And these are 2 different Trident IIs, and not the same "cart" with carrots.
      6. The explosions will not "support" each other. These are not solid bodies, but PLASMA! They will extinguish each other's energy, but will not amplify it. There will be no "support"...
      7. Europe and nuclear strikes against it. S. Karaganov believes that we will have to use nuclear weapons to bring the Euro-public to its senses. It is hard to disagree with him, since we will not be able to overcome the entire united NATO military-industrial complex with conventional weapons when it gets on a war footing. The question of the US place in this showdown remains open. And also the position of the PRC. But there is no doubt that our leadership should stop chewing salt.
      IMHO.
      1. +1
        28 January 2025 15: 00
        Sanya! Hello! Sorry I didn't answer right away, I read it on my phone late yesterday evening, but I can only write from my computer, and setting it up is a whole lot of work, lowering it from above, connecting a bunch of wires. Glad to see you, don't disappear for so long again. What can I think? Okay, he was young - he went on another hike or met a crazy, beautiful babe, went on a bender, that's understandable, no questions. But now, what can I think? Several weeks - silence. At least once every three days throw a couple of lines on the forum, so that it is clear - alive and well!!!
        Okay, good to see you!!!
  15. 0
    27 January 2025 19: 16
    AI draws beautiful and, importantly, symmetrical holes.
  16. 0
    27 January 2025 21: 22
    What again? Calm down with him, with the "hazelnut". There is no information in open sources. Neither the throwing mass, nor the accuracy, nor the type of warhead are clear. Nothing is clear at all. There is only a murky video from a camera, on which nothing is clearly visible. You can fantasize all you want.
  17. 0
    28 January 2025 02: 50
    "Here and now" the Oreshnik MRBM is more effectively used in a conventional (non-nuclear) version...

    No, not more effective, not more efficient, but the only acceptable one. But expensive.
    It would be better to make a second stage for Iskander + a light warhead, 100 kilograms of explosives, highly accurate, with radar guidance and an optical head at the same time.
    and a PLANT needs to be built, a second Votkinsk. Let the oligarchs chip in for the construction.
  18. 0
    28 January 2025 13: 14
    There must be an order from the Supreme Commander-in-Chief.

    But does Vladimir Vladimirovich have the political will to inflict a strategic defeat on the Ukrainian Wehrmacht and its NATO masters?
  19. 0
    28 January 2025 18: 25
    The non-nuclear version of the Oreshnik is an unreasonably expensive weapon. The radius of destruction is small, so the damage inflicted on the enemy may be cheaper than the cost of the spent missile. Except in exceptional cases, when it is necessary to hit a squirrel in the eye so as not to spoil the skin.
  20. +2
    28 January 2025 18: 32
    Nuclear weapons may prove to be much more humane than conventional weapons. Years of bloody assaults destroy hundreds of thousands and millions of lives. On the other hand, a well-organized single nuclear strike can end a war in a few minutes. And the number of victims will be an order of magnitude less than in a sluggish, multi-year "conventional" war.
  21. +1
    29 January 2025 17: 05
    Here we go again...

    The Oreshnik MRBM is more effective to use in a conventional (non-nuclear) version, which the author has already spoken about many times before,

    An IRBM will never be truly effective in a conventional version. Especially with the use of several warheads.
    Experience with the use of Oreshnik has shown that it is not a wonder weapon at all.

    To sing his praises and attribute miracles to him is to live by the principle “you don’t need to deceive me, I’m happy to be deceived myself.”
    For the money that it costs to produce the Oreshnik, you can build about 100-120 Calibers.
    There is not a single target that could be destroyed by Hazel that could not, in turn, be dispersed many times over by a hundred KR.
    Or do you just not know what you are writing about?

    The BBs are controlled, and it is possible that they carry out anti-aircraft maneuvers both in the middle section of the flight path and in the final section, when the speed of approach to the target exceeds Mach 11.

    Remember. Well, at least once, turn on your mind and remember.
    No Combat Ballistic Block has the ability to maneuver in the atmosphere!
    In principle, he can't.
    It has a design like this.
    And the task is this.
    Even during the process of entering the atmosphere, it is given a rotational motion to stabilize the direction of movement. So that it goes exactly to the "center of the funnel". Always.
    Never will the speed of movement in the lower layers of the atmosphere of the Warheads of Ballistic Missiles be more than 5M, Never. In reality 3-4M.
    11M is almost the first cosmic velocity.
    For what incomprehensible reason do you tie the speed of cosmic movement to the terminal speed?
    Or do you just not know what you are writing about?

    It is unlikely that anyone will be able to intercept the Oreshnik MRBM warheads in combat conditions, at least now and in the near future.

    Any missile defense system that is designed to intercept ICBM warheads will also intercept MRBM warheads. And it doesn't matter what it's called: Oreshnik, Trident, Sarmat, Jericho, Peacekeeper, Midgetman, Minuteman, Bulava or M51 or Dongfeng with Pershing...
    Just because there is no difference between them in principle! for PRO

    Considering that the combat units are moving sequentially and have individual guidance, they can potentially all “arrive” at almost the same point.

    It won't happen. They don't shoot at one point. Both for technical reasons (there are difficulties in guiding the bus, taking into account its movement and constant retargeting to place the BBs at one point and "mutual cancellation", when the detonation of the previous one interferes with the flight and the detonation of the one following it), and for tactical reasons (such as overlapping one target with different BBs from different ICBMs.

    a “conveyor” application scheme can be considered, where the first few inert warheads (clusters of tungsten rods) enter the ground,

    This is not even science fiction. It is fantasy, based on technical illiteracy.

    I highly recommend reading "Underground Explosion" on Wikipedia.
    There you will see both the required speed of entry into the ground and the maximum penetration capacity into the ground.
    And the effect of depth and power.
    And you will stop spouting absolutely illiterate things.
    Everything has already been thought of before you.
    And I think before you were born.
    Because in fact I see just a graduate based on the Unified State Exam.
    They didn't teach like that in Soviet times.
  22. 0
    30 January 2025 23: 59
    the speed of approach to the target exceeds Mach 11.
    ...
    It can be assumed that the accuracy of the Oreshnik BRSM is... equal to a few meters.


    It's impossible.
    No homing head (without which accuracy in units of meters is unattainable) will work at a speed of 11 Mach in the atmosphere.
    Because the plasma surrounding the BB at such a speed is opaque in any range.
    1. +1
      1 February 2025 14: 29
      Quote: Veselov-Poselkin
      It's impossible.
      No homing head (without which accuracy in units of meters is unattainable) will work at a speed of 11 Mach in the atmosphere.
      Because the plasma surrounding the BB at such a speed is opaque in any range.

      The magnetic field lines of an electromagnet located inside a hypersonic controlled warhead (HCW) can exit through the plasma surrounding the hypersonic warhead, beyond the oblique jump of the shock wave attached to the HCW head.
      Extraordinary microwave waves can be used to communicate with the UBB.
      See Alexander Alekseevich Vedenov, problem book on plasma physics
      Problem 6.8 Is it possible to introduce a beam of extraordinary microwave waves (wavelength 8 mm), intended for electron-cyclotron heating of electrons, into T-10 tokamaks from the outside of the toroid?

      In recent years, Alexander Alekseevich Vedenov has been working in the field of artificial intelligence and neural networks.
  23. +1
    27 February 2025 12: 52
    With such a government in Russia, instead of Ukraine, they will set conditions for us. They are already doing so. What Oreshniki, what nuclear weapons, only a trench, a machine gun and grenades. No matter who you listen to among our fighters, all they have seen is a machine gun, grenades and the death of their comrades in droves. If our government were as bold as our assaults, not a single one of them would open its mouth. But who will they destroy, their own potential business partners in Europe? And who will they sell gas to then? Oh, they kill and rape, well, that's such a trifle. The elections will be over, new leaders will come and everything will be forgotten, but for now there are a machine gun, a trench and grenades. And our women and children must be taken from the occupied regions, otherwise they will rape and shoot us. That's what business partners are like.