Chief of the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces: the first regiment with S-500 Prometheus air defense missile systems is completing its formation

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Chief of the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces: the first regiment with S-500 Prometheus air defense missile systems is completing its formation

The Russian army continues to receive the most advanced weapons. Chief of the General Staff of the Russian Armed Forces, Deputy Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation Valery Gerasimov reported that the first regiment with anti-aircraft rocket The S-500 Prometheus air defense missile system is completing its development.

To enhance the capabilities of the Russian Federation's aerospace defense system, one Aerospace Forces unit has been formed. The formation of the first regiment equipped with the S-500 anti-aircraft missile system, capable of solving strategic missile defense tasks, is nearing completion

— Gerasimov said at a briefing for military attachés of foreign countries.



Naturally, it is not reported where exactly the missile defense regiment, which has received the latest S-500 air defense system, is deployed. Although this is not very important. The complex is distinguished by its high mobility and rapid deployment speed for combat missions. It can move independently on a wheeled chassis, or be quickly transferred on board military transport aircraft. This makes it possible to deliver Prometheus to any point in Russia in a short time and strengthen the missile defense there.

The new air defense missile systems developed by JSC Almaz-Antey Air Defense Concern are designed to detect and destroy the warheads of medium-range ballistic missiles, as well as intercontinental ballistic missiles at the final section of their trajectory. In addition, the Russian anti-aircraft system is capable of intercepting hypersonic cruise missiles at speeds exceeding Mach 5, and hitting other air targets, including aircraft equipped with airborne early warning systems (AEW). The S-500 is tasked with destroying low-orbit satellites, as well as space-based weapons launched from hypersonic aircraft.

Effective range of destruction of systems Defense/The S-500 missile defense system reaches 600 kilometers, the maximum interception altitude reaches 200 kilometers. The anti-aircraft missile system is capable of tracking up to 100 targets and hitting up to 10 of them using various types of missiles. The S-500 air defense system can use information received from missile attack warning stations (SPRN), operate both in a single air defense system, interacting with the S-400 and S-300 air defense systems, and autonomously. The Yenisei radar detector is significantly more powerful than the S-400 radar and is capable of detecting targets in near space at a range of up to two thousand kilometers.

The Russian military stated that in the future, the new generation of S-500 anti-aircraft missile systems will become the basis of a unified national air and missile defense system of the Russian Armed Forces. Earlier, on December 12 of this year, following a meeting of the Council of Heads of Government of the CIS, it was decided decision on the creation of a unified integrated air defense system for the Commonwealth countries.
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  1. -5
    18 December 2024 16: 30
    To be honest, I thought it had been in our troops for a long time; the S-500 was supposedly on the way 15 years ago.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. -3
        18 December 2024 19: 04
        Rather, there have been too many failures in the last few weeks, and they have sent Ryabkovs and Gerasimovs to the information front line so that all the people's indignation can fall on them. And all sorts of supreme and ministerial officials hardly show their faces about the failures, as if they are not involved.
    2. +9
      18 December 2024 19: 51
      Quote from alexoff
      S-500 was supposedly on the way 15 years ago

      You're confusing it with something else.
      1. -3
        18 December 2024 20: 24
        Probably with some other complex. At work I talked with a colleague who quit in the summer of 2010 about the somewhat delayed air defense complex, for which they still haven't finished the longest-range missile for 500 km, although the others are already ready. What were we talking about?
        https://lenta.ru/news/2010/07/13/s500/
        Let's see the year.
        I'm not even saying that according to the news, deliveries began in 2021...
        1. +4
          18 December 2024 20: 41
          Quote from alexoff
          https://lenta.ru/news/2010/07/13/s500/
          Let's see the year.

          There they talk about it being developed, and not about it being almost ready.
          Quote from alexoff
          I'm not even saying that according to the news, deliveries began in 2021...

          Most likely, they were previously scattered among different units, but now we are talking about a regiment completely re-equipped with 500s.
          1. -3
            18 December 2024 20: 46
            There they talk about it being developed, and not about it being almost ready.
            not in the process of twenty years of preparation, but already on the way everything was supposedly
            Most likely, they were previously scattered among different units, but now we are talking about a regiment completely re-equipped with 500s.
            It would be interesting to know what exactly the S-500 is outside the regiment? Here there is a separate launcher, in another area there is a separate radar, and they even took the command vehicle to Kamchatka...
            1. +3
              18 December 2024 21: 51
              Quote from alexoff
              not in the process of twenty years of preparation

              Developing new weapons is far from a quick process. The S-300 was developed since 1967, serial deliveries began in 1975, and the first regiment appeared in 1979.
              Quote from alexoff
              It would be interesting to know what exactly the S-500 is outside the regiment?

              A regiment does not consist of one set - there can be S-500 and S-400 in one regiment.
              1. -2
                18 December 2024 22: 22
                Quote: Dart2027
                The same S-300 was developed since 1967, serial deliveries began in 1975, and the first regiment appeared in 1979.

                The S-300 was made practically from scratch and in the form of various types, while the S-500 is already based on the more than remarkable S-300V4 and S-400. The Americans claim that the development began in 2001, but it is, unfortunately, unrealistic to dig up news from those years on the Internet.
                https://web.archive.org/web/20090917190204/http://www.missilethreat.com/missiledefensesystems/id.54%20/system_detail.asp
                Back in 2010, the Air Force commander was indignant that it was taking so long
                https://www.newsru.com/russia/26nov2009/vvs.html
                By the way, you can also notice that our military and industrialists knew about drones, but in 2022 they decided to pretend to be brooms, like, what kind of UAVs are these?
                Quote: Dart2027
                A regiment does not consist of one set - there can be S-500 and S-400 in one regiment.

                Well, it's interesting to know what we're talking about. In general, according to the state defense order, they planned to make 2020 S-38 divisions by 500.
                In the coming decade, Russian armed forces will be provided with over 400 modern land and sea-based inter-continental ballistic missiles, 8 strategic ballistic missile submarines, about 20 multi-purpose submarines, over 50 surface warships, around 100 military spacecraft, over 600 modern aircraft including fifth generation fighter jets, more than 1,000 helicopters, 28 regimental kits of S-400 air defense systems, 38 battalion kits of Vityaz missile systems, 10 brigade kits of Iskander-M missile systems, over 2,300 modern tanks, about 2,000 self-propelled artillery systems and vehicles, and more than 17,000 military vehicles.
                More than 250 military units, including 30 air squadrons, are already using advanced military equipment. By 2020, the proportion of new armaments should rise to at least 70%. The systems remaining in service will also be significantly upgraded.

                http://archive.premier.gov.ru/eng/events/news/18185/
                I read it and went into a catatonic stupor...
                1. +2
                  18 December 2024 22: 35
                  Quote from alexoff
                  The S-300 was made practically from scratch

                  The bow and arrows were made from scratch. All technical innovations are created on the basis of what was done before.
                  Quote from alexoff
                  Back in 2010, the Air Force commander was indignant that it was taking so long

                  I believe this, but you can see for yourself that everything was far from finished.
                  Quote from alexoff
                  http://archive.premier.gov.ru/eng/events/news/18185/

                  I know about the missed deadlines, unfortunately, but...
                  1. -2
                    18 December 2024 22: 56
                    Quote: Dart2027
                    All technical innovations are created on the basis of what was done before.

                    In the USSR, air defense missile systems were created literally out of thin air, like a bow and arrow
                    Quote: Dart2027
                    I believe this, but you can see for yourself that everything was far from finished.

                    the news was saying that the S-400 was already reaching 400 km and all that was left was to teach it to fly at altitude, like the A-135/235
                    Quote: Dart2027
                    I know about the missed deadlines, unfortunately, but...

                    The indicated quantities are not a failure to meet deadlines, but the appetites of someone who turned the army into a cash cow with profits like those of Gazprom in a threatening period. If the S-500 turned out to be so complicated, then they bought five times fewer fully developed tanks and aircraft. It's like at work - you give someone a new project, and he doesn't succeed, and you think - maybe it's complicated and he's not to blame? You give him an old project - and the person can't do it either, it turns out that whatever he doesn't take on, he's doing it an order of magnitude worse than those who are younger and have almost no experience.
                    1. 0
                      18 December 2024 23: 00
                      Quote from alexoff
                      In the USSR, air defense missile systems were created literally out of thin air

                      Really? I didn't know he was that retarded.
                      Quote from alexoff
                      The news said that it was already

                      There were promises, but they were constantly postponed.
                      Quote from alexoff
                      then they bought five times fewer fully developed tanks and planes
                      YES, no, they purchased as planned, only with the 5th generation there were also delays in the deadlines.
                      1. -1
                        18 December 2024 23: 57
                        Really? I didn't know he was that retarded.
                        And what was the basis for the SAM system? What was the precursor?
                        There were promises, but they were constantly postponed.
                        classic, try to find where this hasn't happened, for the last 15 years promises have remained promises
                        YES no we purchased as planned
                        no, much less was purchased, the ground forces were ignored, USC failed in shipbuilding and only took money well, building a frigate hull for 4 years
                      2. 0
                        19 December 2024 19: 26
                        Quote from alexoff
                        What was the forerunner?

                        Before the S-300, there were the S-200.
                        Quote from alexoff
                        For the last 15 years, promises have remained promises

                        Nevertheless, albeit with serious delays, the work is progressing.
                        Quote from alexoff
                        no, much less was purchased, the ground forces were ignored

                        How much less?
                        Quote from alexoff
                        building a frigate hull for 4 years

                        The building is being built quickly, and problems begin with the equipment.
                      3. 0
                        19 December 2024 22: 08
                        Quote: Dart2027
                        Before the S-300, there were the S-200.

                        In what year did the USSR create its first air defense missile system and on what basis?
                        Quote: Dart2027
                        Nevertheless, albeit with serious delays, the work is progressing.

                        I wish the salaries of managers were paid with the same delays...
                        Quote: Dart2027
                        How much less?

                        I wrote - 4-6 times less
                        Quote: Dart2027
                        The building is being built quickly, and problems begin with the equipment.

                        The hull of a nuclear icebreaker is built quickly, when it comes to a military frigate, the hull is built for several years, and then it turns out that the money has disappeared somewhere and you have to take out a loan to complete the construction. And the money from it also disappears, and then the top managers of USC disappear somewhere and the company is given to VTB.
                      4. 0
                        19 December 2024 22: 43
                        Quote from alexoff
                        the first SAM and on what basis
                        Based on German missile technology. Nothing to say about the development timeframe of the S-300?
                        Quote from alexoff
                        The salaries of the managers were also paid with the same delays
                        And to all employees?
                        Quote from alexoff
                        4-6 times less
                        Will the source be?
                        Quote from alexoff
                        then the case takes several years to make
                        The fact that the hulls have been standing for years waiting for either the finalization of a new air defense system or the full production cycle of a domestic power plant is unknown to you.
            2. +1
              20 December 2024 09: 33
              These systems were first of all delivered to the Air Defense Academy and the training regiment to train specialists who would operate and maintain them; there was information about this as well.
    3. +4
      19 December 2024 08: 13
      Quote from alexoff
      To be honest, I thought it had been in our troops for a long time, the S-500 was around 15 years ago

      About 5-6 years ago Shoyga solemnly declared that the S-500 had successfully passed tests and was accepted into service. It turned out that, like many other things, he was LYING.
      Lying is not allowed.
      By the way, it was expected back then that the industry would hand over a regimental set of S-500 to the VKS every year; a total of 10 regimental sets were ordered. And I figured that we already had about five such regiments... A complete lie. Well, at least the first regiment was formed. It won't make a difference now, no matter where you put it. As of today, we only have a missile defense position area around Moscow and this regiment against ICBMs and IRBMs.
      Who to reward?
      1. 0
        20 December 2024 09: 35
        It's better to ask who to hold accountable and who to punish???
  2. +5
    18 December 2024 16: 34
    Up to 200 km. - the beginning of low Earth orbit (LEO). In terms of the possibility of getting enemy devices, this is very good news.
  3. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    2. +2
      18 December 2024 17: 41
      The idea of ​​a kinetic interception is idiotic in its very essence... It is extremely doubtful to hit a maneuvering hypersonic glider precisely... But it is quite possible to hit it with fragments. At such speeds, that might be enough.
      1. +3
        18 December 2024 18: 24
        Quote: paul3390
        Hitting a maneuvering hypersonic glider precisely is highly questionable...

        Especially if the speed of the SM-3 anti-missile is 14,5 Mach, and the speed of the glider is up to 27 Mach...
        But you and I have been convinced for hundreds of years that American shit is the most... smelly...
        1. 0
          18 December 2024 19: 27
          Quote: yuriy55
          Quote: paul3390
          Hitting a maneuvering hypersonic glider precisely is highly questionable...

          Especially if the speed of the SM-3 anti-missile is 14,5 Mach, and the speed of the glider is up to 27 Mach...
          But you and I have been convinced for hundreds of years that American shit is the most... smelly...

          So you're thinking again according to the WW2 patterns? Only in pursuit?
          No understanding of the lead?
          1. +1
            18 December 2024 19: 54
            Quote: SovAr238A
            So you're thinking again according to the WW2 patterns? Only in pursuit?
            No understanding of the lead?

            Do you have any idea what a "hypersonic maneuvering glider" is?
            What warning? What cowards, what money? This is not a ballistic trajectory and calculations are simply impossible!!! A priori!!!
            1. 0
              18 December 2024 20: 00
              Quote: yuriy55
              Quote: SovAr238A
              So you're thinking again according to the WW2 patterns? Only in pursuit?
              No understanding of the lead?

              Do you have any idea what a "hypersonic maneuvering glider" is?
              What warning? What cowards, what money? This is not a ballistic trajectory and calculations are simply impossible!!! A priori!!!


              Once again, I advise you to read about gliders.
              About their sizes, with which you can stand under the head fairing. The corresponding maximum load.
              About the principles of movement in near-Earth space at the boundaries of the lower layers of the atmosphere.
              about temperatures.
              about changing course at such speeds.

              And I'll give you one hint.
              Why is the angle of entry of any descent vehicle calculated with an accuracy of 1/100 of a degree and why is the speed of entry into the atmosphere calculated with an accuracy of 50 km/hour.
              And what will happen to the descent vehicle, if these indicators are violated...

              This is about some kind of super-maneuverability and unpredictability...
              study, and don't throw propaganda around.

              Physics, like mathematics, are two very heartless creatures!
              Poor students and dreamers are not tolerated at all.
              1. +1
                18 December 2024 20: 09
                Quote: SovAr238A
                Poor students and dreamers are not tolerated at all.

                Are you related to the creation of block 15U71 or U-71???
                Detailed tactical and technical characteristics have not been officially published.
                According to Russian President V. Putin, the hypersonic gliding winged warhead can break through even advanced missile defense systems by maneuvering in altitude and course. Its speed exceeds Mach 20 and it moves toward the target like a fireball, the surface temperature of which is 1600-2000 degrees Celsius. The combat equipment can be one block per UR-100N UTTKh missile and, according to statements, has a set of means for overcoming missile defense. The warhead is positioned as intercontinental range.

                https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Авангард_(ракетный_комплекс)
    3. +5
      18 December 2024 18: 01
      That is, buy from the US? The S-500 radar sees twice as far, the range of our SAM is three times greater than THAAD. What do you say about that?
      1. -7
        18 December 2024 19: 41
        Quote: hrych
        That is, buy from the US? The S-500 radar sees twice as far, the range of our SAM is three times greater than THAAD. What do you say about that?


        How did this help those two dozen S-300 and S-400 (which supposedly can be seen and destroyed from 300 and 400 km away) destroyed by the Ukrainians?
        The same ATAKMS, GMLRS, StormShadow missiles?
        1. +1
          18 December 2024 21: 53
          Quote: SovAr238A
          those two dozen S-300 and S-400

          Why did they destroy so much?
        2. +4
          19 December 2024 01: 35
          Quote: SovAr238A
          How did this help those two dozen S-300 and S-400

          Show proof of your chutzpah, Bandera-curious one? And show the phenomenal results of THAAD's work?
        3. +1
          19 December 2024 08: 33
          Quote: SovAr238A
          How did this help those two dozen S-300 and S-400

          Yes, write more, MORE!! laughing Why should we feel sorry for their (our) air defense systems?
          And although one or two divisions were really hit, they were simply overloaded, and one or two missiles out of ten+ got through. And how many vehicles are in the air defense division?
          And how many air defense systems of the Ukrainian Armed Forces have been destroyed over the last couple of months?
          War is not without losses, but nowhere and never do they lie as brazenly as during it.
        4. 0
          20 December 2024 09: 43
          You can come up with anything, especially if you refer to the data of Ukrainian propaganda, if you listen to them, they have already practically destroyed all of our Aerospace Forces, Air Defense, tanks and BMPs, and shot down almost everything that flies from us in their direction, you are apparently one of the adherents of this Ukrainian propaganda.
  4. +3
    18 December 2024 16: 44
    The S400 and S500 systems need to have short-range SAMs in their arsenal for self-defense against anti-aircraft missiles, drones, and aircraft that have snuck up close... Pantsir can't always be nearby for cover, and a third line of defense wouldn't hurt. SAMs for use from the same launchers as large and medium missiles, only instead of 3 large one, 1-3 small ones... we had such developments... I don't know if they were in production
    1. +3
      18 December 2024 16: 51
      And what if you attach a missile from an S-400 to the "Pantsir" and suddenly there's a B-52 and it has nothing to reach it with and there's no S-400 nearby))) are you kidding?
      1. 0
        18 December 2024 19: 36
        Have you seen the video of the BP cash desks of the S300/400 positional areas being covered? And the B52 is not suitable for such a range
      2. -2
        18 December 2024 19: 42
        Quote: Lemon
        And what if you attach a missile from an S-400 to the "Pantsir" and suddenly there's a B-52 and it has nothing to reach it with and there's no S-400 nearby))) are you kidding?

        Actually, this is not a joke, but one of the branches of air defense development.
        When instead of one container with one long-range missile, 4 containers with medium and short-range missiles are installed.
        And the air defense missile system is already becoming universal.
    2. 0
      20 December 2024 09: 47
      To achieve this, it is necessary to produce much more and upgrade to the latest versions of the TOR, BUK, PANTSIR SM, and S-350 air defense systems, which operate at medium and short ranges.
  5. IGU
    -5
    18 December 2024 16: 45
    Gerasimov just burst into statements today.
  6. 0
    18 December 2024 16: 47
    V.V. Zhirinovsky also spoke about the S500 and S700, which should be supplied to the troops.
  7. 0
    18 December 2024 17: 06
    In addition, the Russian anti-aircraft system is capable of intercepting hypersonic cruise missiles at speeds exceeding Mach 5

    And there is such information:
    The anti-aircraft complex is also tasked with destroying hypersonic cruise missiles, aircraft and UAVs, both conventional high-altitude and hypersonic missiles with a speed of 5 M and higher; destroying low-orbit satellites and space weapons launched from hypersonic aircraft, attack hypersonic UAVs and orbital platforms.
    With a planned SAM range of 600 km, it will be able to detect and simultaneously hit up to 10 ballistic supersonic targets, flying at speeds of up to 7 km/s (21.021 Mach), and also to destroy the warheads of hypersonic cruise missiles.
    1. +5
      18 December 2024 17: 20
      They showed footage of the S-500 tests, the missile takes off very quickly. Impressive.
    2. 0
      19 December 2024 00: 17
      I don't understand something else: ...and also space weapons launched from hypersonic aircraft... What is this even about? Who has such aircraft?
  8. +4
    18 December 2024 17: 20
    Maybe it's off topic, but our air defense is fighting hard today. There were just 4 explosions, cars - it's like they went crazy. The only valuable thing in our city is the oil refinery. For what strategic interests it was built near the border posts - that's unknown. hi
  9. -2
    18 December 2024 17: 35
    Gerasimov is being actively promoted today, it’s obvious that someone needs to clean up his tarnished image, although it’s useless!!!
    1. -1
      18 December 2024 18: 11
      "Gerasimov is being actively promoted today, it's obvious that someone needs to clean up his tarnished image, although it's useless!!!"
      ...
      Why promote him? He doesn't have an elected position? And it's too early to become a deputy.
      1. 0
        19 December 2024 08: 38
        Quote: Crane
        Why promote him? He doesn't have an elected position? And it's too early to become a deputy.

        Maybe before resignation? Do they let you speak out before retirement?
  10. +1
    18 December 2024 17: 38
    Quote: Sankara
    Up to 200 km. - the beginning of low Earth orbit (LEO). In terms of the possibility of getting enemy devices, this is very good news.

    In reality, it’s most likely more, maybe even 5, no one will make the real characteristics public.
  11. +1
    18 December 2024 17: 43
    Quote: White45
    THAAD SM-3 no need to fantasize, everything has already been thought up

    Maybe you should also offer to buy it or ask for a license for HAAD SM-3? Let those scum beg for it, but we have our own!
  12. 0
    18 December 2024 19: 37
    It can be assumed that this regiment is deployed somewhere near Moscow, although there are already "more than enough" there. I came across an OSINT site about air defense, so I can't vouch for the accuracy.
    1. 0
      18 December 2024 19: 38
      P.S. Red - S 400, yellow - S 300, but there may be variations, so the types of SAMs may differ.
    2. 0
      19 December 2024 08: 43
      Quote: TermNachTER
      It can be assumed that this regiment is deployed somewhere near Moscow, although there are already “more than enough” there.

      There is already a missile defense position area there. I would cover the bases of our Northern Fleet with the first regiment.
      Another thing is outrageous - Shoyga reported on the adoption of the weapon 5-6 years ago, and it was promised that the industry would issue a regimental set per year. If that were the case, we would have up to five such regiments deployed now. And how good Kartonny was at lying... But he was not at this meeting, although he supposedly had to be, given his rank as Secretary of the Security Council.
      1. 0
        19 December 2024 09: 37
        It is possible that the funding was spent on other needs. The SVO is still going on.
        1. -1
          19 December 2024 10: 23
          Judging by the timing of that cheerful report, a couple of such regiments should have already been deployed by the beginning of the SVO. And who is curtailing the production of air defense/missile defense systems with the beginning of a war/SVO that could spill over into a World War at any moment?
          Shoyga simply passed off the beginning or the first successful test as the readiness of the complex for serial production and putting it into service. And then during the tests, sides and jambs appeared, which had to be corrected, finished, redone. He always and in everything LIED, painting fairy-tale pictures with propaganda. Just the reports on the delivery dates of the frigates of project 22350\22350.1 are worth something, according to them, today 6-7 such frigates were supposed to be in service, plus "Nakhimov" and "Kuznetsov" no later than this year in service. According to the cheerful reports of LAST (!!) year. But in reality, everything turned out to be not simple, but very simple - the budget for the construction of these (and not only these) ships was stolen, then a ton of loans were taken out for these same ships and they also stole it, everything was transferred to an offshore account and happily disappeared into the unknown. This is Shoyga all over - all in Armatas, Kurganets and "modular ships" of Project 22160 and 20386.
          1. -1
            19 December 2024 11: 13
            I'm not saying that they're winding down, but that they could have "slowed down" a bit and directed the finances to what was needed at "0". The budget isn't bottomless, and they stole so much that it was a nightmare.
            1. 0
              19 December 2024 11: 24
              In the SVO, the main expenditure is on short- and medium-range SAMs... in principle, they could, but our budget for 2022 and 2023 is so full of money that, despite the SVO and increased expenditure, they were able to replenish reserve funds... They have a rubber piggy bank.
              You do understand the importance of such air defense systems, don't you? This is a fairly reliable cover for our naval bases from Trident-2 SLBMs, cover for our main industrial areas, and during the SVO this can grow into something much bigger... You don't joke around with such programs, it's not like saving on matches. It would be time to slow down some civilian projects here.
              Quote: TermNachTER
              They stole so much it was a shame.

              Wow ! .
              1. 0
                19 December 2024 11: 27
                It is clear that short and medium ranges work mainly. But the very fact of the presence of the S-400 in the Dzhankoy area is troubling the Banderoluftwaffe from Odessa to Krasnoyarsk and Dneprozhidovsk.
                1. 0
                  19 December 2024 11: 36
                  Quote: TermNachTER
                  the very fact of the presence of the S-400 in the Dzhankoy region is troubling the Banderoluftwaffe from Odessa to Krasnoyarsk and Dneprozhidovsk.

                  Well, Sumerian falcons do not fly so high - the interception range at a distance of 380 km. This is for targets at an altitude of at least 10 km. But in August 2022, I personally observed a high-altitude interception of a ballistic target from the Odessa region from the Saki beach. This was about a week after that famous attack on the Saki airfield with missiles, when the planes were hit.
                  1. 0
                    19 December 2024 13: 57
                    It's about 100 km to Kherson and Nikolaev, so they can easily get there even for 2 km.
                    1. 0
                      19 December 2024 14: 21
                      Recently, target designation and guidance of the S-400 SAMs from the Su-35S have been established, and at a range of almost 400 km. And regardless of the target's altitude.
                      1. 0
                        19 December 2024 15: 22
                        A completely logical step. The radar would also need to be more powerful to "illuminate" further away.
                      2. 0
                        19 December 2024 15: 45
                        So, the "Irbis" has a range of up to 400 km against a large target, how can it possibly go further, even SAMs don't fly further? The "Belka" (Su-57) has about the same range, but it has an AESA.
                        In addition, the A-50U can also guide long-range SAMs and has demonstrated this more than once... But the guys got carried away, lost their vigilance, and lost two A-50Us in a few days. From a Patriot ambush.
                      3. +1
                        19 December 2024 16: 47
                        I'm just saying, "I'd really like it" to reach further. Regarding the A-50, I have some doubts. Foreign experts really like to show off satellite photos, from the recent ones, our ships in Tartus. Why are there no photos: here is the airfield in Ivanovo, from such and such a date, there are 11 aircraft. But here is a photo, from such and such a date, two aircraft are missing. The A-50 is not a matchbox, you can't hide it in your pocket.
                      4. 0
                        20 December 2024 01: 57
                        There is no doubt that two A-50Us were indeed lost, and practically at the maximum distance from the LBS. It's just that no one expected that the "Patriot" would be dragged so close to the front line, because it was risky. But that's exactly what they risked then, using air situation data and target designation from NATO AWACS aircraft, or aircraft/complexes ("Kolchuga", for example) to detect and track AWACS aircraft. Then they turned on their own radar on command, detection, capture, launch, shutdown and "legs-my-legs". Our A-50Us did not fly closer than 200 km to the LBS, but ... that was enough for them (the range of the SAM is 250 km). It's a shame about the crews.
                        And the loss of the actual aircraft was compensated for quickly - within a few months, the industry delivered two freshly modernized A-50Us. And during this year, two more. Now the VKS receives two such aircraft per year. Plus, two A-100s are already undergoing flight tests. They say that successfully.
                      5. 0
                        20 December 2024 09: 27
                        The firing range of the Patriot is 180 km. A-50 was hanging at a distance of 200 km. Even if they pulled it out to "0" it was still not enough. How could AWACS provide information if it was hanging over Romania? And I repeat - what prevented you from posting a photo from a satellite to confirm your words? Here are 11 sides, and here are 9 - they have the ability
                        inspect almost all airfields during the day, several times. No one presented anything. Ivanovo is not such a big city that people would not find out about the loss of two planes and the death of more than 20 people.
                      6. 0
                        20 December 2024 10: 01
                        You don't trust the information about the downed A-50Us?? After all, even videos from the crash sites were posted online, already in the dark, when it was unclear to those filming what had fallen there. Fighter-Bomber and Voevoda immediately confirmed this information, and the Ministry of Defense did not deny it, although they refused to comment.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        The firing range of the Patriot is 180 km.

                        And yet 250 on a large, low-maneuverability target. And from approximately this distance, i.e. at the limit of the range, our AWACS aircraft were hit. And precisely because of this range of destruction and also because many thought that the Ukrainian Armed Forces had transferred only old modifications with SAMs up to 80 km, many did not believe in the "Patriot" and considered other options. From friendly fire to the use of a restored S-200. Or even an F-35 or F-22 from the zone of its own invisibility for the A-50U radar.
                        But everything turned out to be prosaic - the "Patriot" was equipped with new SAMs with a range of up to 250 km, and ambushes were set up with its help by an English crew, or a German crew, but under the control of English curators, who set up ambushes from the border area of ​​the Bryansk region (remember two aircraft \Su-35S and Su-34\ and two EW\REP helicopters shot down there in a few minutes?), and from the Kharkov region, and from the Kherson region, when two A-50Us were shot down.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        Ivanovo is not such a big city that people would not know about the loss of two planes and the death of more than 20 people.

                        And did you ask the Ivanovo people? Now, and especially then, they really didn't like to admit and show losses. In principle, it's right not to help the enemy propaganda.
                        At one time, several of my classmates served on the A-50. They served as they were assigned to graduates. But they retired about 5 years before the SVO.
                      7. 0
                        20 December 2024 10: 39
                        I don't see 100% evidence. Photos from the crash site - what can you understand there? Except that something big fell and burned. What it was, why it fell - is unknown. With all due respect to the fighterbomber and the governor, I read their channels in TG regularly, also not 100% sources, as they themselves say. I won't be surprised if it ever turns out that the FSB was working "in the dark".
                        The S-200 air defense missile systems were removed from service back in the 10s, and I seriously doubt that there is anything left there after 20 years.
                        I have not heard about the Patriot SAM with a range of 250 km. They have also moved to 180 km not so long ago, and until recently the range was 100.
                        If there were rumors (gossip) etc. in Ivanovo, they would appear on the Internet. Nowadays, with modern methods of disseminating information, "you can't hide an awl in a sack." I haven't heard anything like that.
                      8. 0
                        20 December 2024 11: 16
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        I haven't heard about the Patriot SAM with a range of 250 km. They also moved to 180 km not so long ago,

                        I think that this is the same missile, it's just that the range of SAM systems for different types of targets is usually different. Sometimes this is specifically indicated in the data tables. So, the Pantsir-M SAM system has a maximum range of 40 km for hitting large, non-maneuverable targets, but it's 32 km for a fighter. I think it's the same here. The A-50U is a very large, slow, and poorly maneuverable target, so the missile doesn't waste energy when guiding itself to a maneuvering target and flies to its maximum range. Like the S-200 SAM that shot down the Russian Tu-154 flying from Israel over the World Cup. The range there was generally 320 or 340 km, but the target was simple, large, non-maneuverable, and the SAM's energy was quite sufficient.
                        The assertion that it was, after all, a Patriot appeared seriously later than the first wave of discussions, apparently determined by the collected debris and striking elements.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        The S-200 air defense missile systems were removed from service back in the 10s, and I seriously doubt that there is anything left there after 20 years.

                        They were put into storage, and the SAMs were used quite actively as strike missiles. The probability that they could restore the SPC was not zero in principle, I myself expressed such a version, believing that the "Patriot" would not reach at such a distance. But it turned out to be a "Patriot" after all.
                        But if the official media are silent about this, then that's what they were ordered to do. They were also ordered to remain silent about the Indonesian Boeing, although my comrades and I personally interviewed witnesses of that shootdown and the picture is quite clear to me... but first they closed all the information, and then, by order of the highest authority, they started spreading nonsense about the Sumerian "Buka-M1" missile. Precisely nonsense, because I, as an officer of the air defense combat control (in the past), confirm this. And I remember very well the marks in the Boeing's skin from the R-60M RVV (with a groove from its tail on the wing and a VERY characteristic hole in the entrance to the left cheekbone of the cockpit... And also holes from 30 mm shells in the skin - this was already a Su-25 (taking off from the Dnepropetrovsk airport) finishing off the falling Boeing - a witness told me. But at altitude it was shot down by a Su-27 taking off from near Kharkov, she also saw it.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        "murder will out"

                        But you can chatter, silence, fool, intimidate.
                        When my friend asked his friend (then the commander of the Air Defense Forces) about the Malaysian Boeing, he immediately stopped him with a gesture - "Forbidden topic". And not another word. And they served together for about ten years.
                        I learned everything I needed to know about those downed A-50Us, and I discussed everything that needed to be discussed.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        How could AWACS provide information,

                        AWACS - this is about other cases, in the same Bryansk region. And for target designation of the Patriot's guidance radar for a short switch-on, it is enough to work ... the ground-based Kolchuga complex. This is a passive ELINT complex that gives out coordinates of emitting targets. The A-50U for the Kolchuga shines like a beacon in the night, so without giving itself away at a convenient moment for interception, at an acceptable distance, the Patriot's radar switched on and the plane was shot down with two missiles (to be sure). With the second, approximately the same thing happened. Moreover, in the first case, at first they seriously sinned on friendly fire from their own anti-aircraft gunners. But the second left no doubt.
                        And regarding "where are the holes in the ranks", I wrote to you - last year two brand new A-50Us returned to service, the second one under the Christmas tree. So the ranks were quickly replenished and there were no losses in the ranks.
                      9. 0
                        20 December 2024 13: 22
                        Such a "leap" in range - 30%. Excuse me, where from? Yes, I can believe that due to the flight profile and lack of maneuvering, you can add km. 15-20, but not 70. The new modification had a range of 250 km. and got the "carcass" at 280 - I believe, it is possible. They were put into storage))) do you understand what this is? This means that everything that can be taken out on a "Gazelle" will be taken out and sold. There is nothing left there for 20 years. Even the Strela 2/2 M MANPADS were stolen and sold - and this, excuse me, is a special inventory, it is not lying around in a warehouse.
                        And what is secret or unclear about the Malaysian Boeing - everything is clear as day))) the dispatcher from the Dnepropetrovsk control center who directed it has gone missing.
                        What does "Kolchuga" have to do with it? Any RTR station can give a bearing on a radar of the same power as the A-50. There is no doubt that it was tracked. What is questionable is what got it.
                        Intimidated, bullied?))) They transfer information and money to Ukraine, and here there are only rumors (gossip) in a small town.
                        Do you think that mattress makers are not able to distinguish a used side from a new one? I think they would have said that instead of two knocked down ones, two new ones were brought in. But they didn't say anything.
                      10. 0
                        20 December 2024 13: 23
                        P.S. skip - "new modification with - 200".
                      11. 0
                        20 December 2024 15: 34
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        I think they would have said that they brought in two new ones instead of the two that were shot down. But they didn't say anything.

                        I think they kept quiet so as not to reveal that it was their or the British crew that controlled that "Patriot", you can't train a Sumerian to operate such equipment at once - it's very complicated and everything is in English. After all, they were transferring the SAM system "for the protection of Ukrainian cities".
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        Such a "jump" in range is 30%. Excuse me, where from?

                        Yes, it all comes from the same place - if the target is large and does not maneuver, then the SAM flies towards it without maneuvering. Its active/accelerating section of the trajectory is not that great, and then it flies by inertia and is controlled by rudders, sometimes gas in the transverse thrust block. Any turn is a loss of energy, a loss of speed, and therefore the range at which the SAM can hit the target. When the S-200 SAM flew at the Tu-154, it was beyond its rated range, but since the target was simply ideal and reflected the illumination signal well, the missile had enough energy. This is how the official record for the range of practical target destruction by this complex was set... But how many people died there.
                        By the way, the matter is rather murky, initially the S-300 was supposed to fire, a no-fly zone was cut out for it, and at the last moment the SAM was changed. I know this from a secret agent of that S-300 division.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        And what is secret or unclear about the Malaysian Boeing? Everything is clear there.

                        It is forbidden to even mention those two planes (Su-27 and Su-25) that were near the Boeing and fired at it. It is forbidden AT ALL. Despite the fact that almost the commander-in-chief of the Air Defense reported on these fighters with a demonstration of the wiring of these targets, with side numbers, call signs of the pilots ... Everything was ordered to be forgotten and now the New Reality is "a Buk was shooting !!". There really was a Buk in that zone, the American agent who was hanging around with it (the head of the operation) is known, in what hotel he lived ... even that Buk itself in an ambush (in that very place) was discovered during reconnaissance behind enemy lines by my late comrade ... and it was his voice in that intercept that the SBU demonstrated in the connotation that it was a "Russian Buk". So I am still in the subject of this mess, but when it happened I was not there (in Donbass).
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        What does "Kolchuga" have to do with it? Any RTR station can give a bearing on a radar of such power,

                        That's the thing, that for a short activation of an air defense missile system from an ambush, it is not a bearing that is needed, but precise target coordinates, preferably with characteristics (speed, altitude, direction of movement), so that the activation is really short, because such a target can be fired at by a SAM without additional correction, because the SAM has an AGSN and, having reached the rendezvous point, it will already aim itself. It is very dangerous to give away your location, being SO close to the LBS.
                        And it is also desirable to know the entire air situation - are there any other targets in the area of ​​the upcoming shooting, do they pose a danger to the air defense system in the event of detection of its radiation. Kolchuga can give away all this without revealing itself at all. And it was a huge omission and even a crime to allow/allow the removal of all available Kolchugas from our (Donetsk) Rubin plant in the summer of 2014. angry There was some kind of conspiracy there and our people were told not to interfere. I even suspect who ordered it.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        There is no doubt that he was being tracked. What is questionable is what got him.

                        I'm telling you, the official version is "Patriot", but the Ministry of Defense is not commenting. And that's right.
                        It is easy to determine this - by the striking elements.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        Do you think that mattress makers are not able to distinguish a used side from a new one?

                        It is not profitable for them to pedal this topic, so that there is no escalation between us. That is why we do not comment or make statements - we have been walking on the edge for three years, you have to understand.
                      12. 0
                        20 December 2024 16: 06
                        When they were sinking the "Moskva" they weren't shy. And now they've suddenly become so shy?
                        Yes, I can't disagree with you that the shooting from Cape Chauda is a murky matter. But I still doubt the increase in the range of the same SAM, first from 100 to 180, and then immediately to 250 km. And that the A-50 radar didn't track the SAM and didn't transmit a message that they were under attack?
                        The Su-25 was Bandera's - why keep it a secret? And regarding the "Buk", even the "National Geographic" had a film where they described the warhead explosion in detail and even measured and compared the sizes of the holes in the glider.
                        They are already shooting at Russia with anything. What is there to keep secret? On the contrary, after all the failures of the "Patriot" - excellent advertising. The guaranteed range of destruction is 250 km. - the Russians can confirm.
                      13. 0
                        20 December 2024 16: 44
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        , after all the failures of the "Patriot" - excellent advertising. Guaranteed range of destruction is 250 km. - the Russians can confirm.

                        There were no failures back then and "Patriot" had a benefit performance. Especially this nomadic one, which the English led. And the Sumerian and even English publics were chattering about the record range of destruction. The Americans were silent. The Americans are the main sponsors, but the moderators of this war are definitely the English.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        increase in the range of the same SAM, first from 100 to 180, and then immediately to 250 km. - I still doubt it.

                        Firstly, the missile is not the same at all, although it fits into the same container. Secondly, look at the S-300, it has exactly the same increase in range in the latest modification - 250 km.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        And that the A-50 radar did not track the SAMs and did not transmit a message that they were under attack?

                        I think he reported it and even tried to evade it. I don't know about the first one, but the second one definitely managed to seriously descend (tried to dive below the radio horizon), but the missile with the AGSN didn't care. Moreover, there were two missiles and one of them self-destructed or fell for the trap, but the second one got it. This is from the analysis of the words of eyewitnesses who were the first to get to the wreckage. And they didn't even know what kind of plane was shot down.
                        Quote: TermNachTER
                        even on National Geographic there was a film where they described in detail the explosion of the warhead and even the size of the holes

                        We had several such films, even with animation, where the role of each aircraft was described, and this fully corresponded to the testimony of eyewitnesses and footage of wreckage with traces of damage. They tried to catch up with the role of the Buk, supposedly only it. So the pass was given to b\u25band NATO, so that they would admit that it was the Sumerians who shot it down by mistake in the heat of battle. Then our anti-aircraft gunners shot down exactly two Sumerian Su-25s and only that Su-XNUMX remained in the air, which later distinguished itself so much.
                      14. 0
                        20 December 2024 17: 49
                        Regarding the S-300, which shoots at 250 km. - I have some doubts. You have to understand that even the newest version, which is PMU 2, still shoots at 200 km. The S-250 of the new SAM shoots at 400 km, which no longer fits in the S-300 TPK. Alas, miracles do not happen, it is impossible to pour a liter into a 0,7 bottle. I posted enemy OSINT maps here, so their S-300 has a range of 200 km. I think the stupidest people drew them.
                        Otherwise, I stand by my opinion, although I don’t force it on anyone.
  13. -1
    18 December 2024 23: 41
    And how offensive it is when such a complex is destroyed by drones for 50 thousand rubles
    1. 0
      19 December 2024 11: 14
      It is impossible to destroy the entire SAM system with one or two. They are spread over a fairly large area.
      1. 0
        19 December 2024 12: 45
        I'm speaking figuratively. It's clear that it won't work, it's clear that this is a complex, and a launcher, and a command post, and an antenna, etc. ... But the meaning is clear. The S500 should be part of a layered system that excludes such possibilities. The price of loss is too high.
  14. 0
    19 December 2024 17: 41
    Quote: Serg 122
    I don't understand something else: ...and also space weapons launched from hypersonic aircraft... What is this even about? Who has such aircraft?

    Most likely, it is a preemptive action, for example against the development of the American X-37B line.
  15. 0
    20 December 2024 08: 20
    Colleagues, enlighten a layman, what military schools of air defense profile still remain in Russia. I think there used to be a school in Engels.