NGAD is dead, we are waiting for NGAD-2!

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NGAD is dead, we are waiting for NGAD-2!

Just recently we were enthusiastically discussing the prospects of both the American sixth-generation fighter and its unmanned “faithful wingmen.” And although some believed that American technology was something perfect and infallible, no, it’s still “Zumwalt”!

And yes, we are not without sin either, we have more than enough of our own “No Analogues”, but to each his own, and for our “No Analogues” there will always be their “Zumwalt”. And this is quite normal, and therefore we will now consider the situation with the NGAD program and estimate what threat this poses to us.



So, news days: The US Air Force announces a competition for one of its most important future weapons, which was supposed to replace the F-22A Raptor.

"Originally conceived in the late 1980s, the F-22A remains highly capable, but the service believes a new aircraft with new technologies is needed to dominate current and future Russian and Chinese fighters."

Whatever fans of American technology say, yes, the F-22 has the highest combat capability in terms of warfare with balloons. Unfortunately, it has not been noted for anything more in the 20+ years it has been in service. Maybe, of course, I am wrong about something, correct me, but the Americans themselves write that the first use of the F-22 against an air target is February 2023. For a fighter, it is quite.

However, those who want to praise the Raptor can do so, but the US Air Force believes that it needs to be replaced.


And after much deliberation and debate, the Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) program, designed to create the world's first sixth-generation fighter, is back in development. And right from the start, for several reasons.

First, Air Force experts need to define exactly what the Air Force wants from an air superiority aircraft in the 2030s and beyond.

The second is to find out how it is possible (and whether it is possible at all) to implement such a thing weapon into reality.

"The NGAD reboot is an example of how the slow and complex development of modern combat aircraft is at odds with the breakneck pace of technological advances, which in turn threatens to strip even the newest aircraft of their most advanced features."

Well, that is, it is not the NGAD developers who are to blame, having mastered a certain number of billions of dollars, but technological progress, which has significantly outpaced the speed of aircraft design. That is, the lasers and blasters are already ready, but it has not been decided where to place the batteries for them in the fuselage. It happens.

Gen. Jim Slife, the Air Force's vice chief of staff, said the service is considering what it's really trying to do with the NGAD program in the first place, which raises two more questions:
- how the Air Force will achieve air superiority in a conflict;
- how to create a sixth-generation manned fighter.

“I mean, it’s not necessarily the same question,” Slife said earlier this month at a Defense News press conference in Arlington, Va.

Slife’s comments follow a July announcement by Air Force Secretary Frank Kendall that the service was suspending the NGAD program to review its data. Now, after years of development, the Air Force is embarking on a complete overhaul and shifting focus to take advantage of new technologies that have emerged since the aircraft was first conceived in the mid-2010s.

As part of that process, the Air Force consults with the program’s “lowballers” — or the major defense contractors that will compete for the contract to build NGAD — to determine the best way to move the program forward. The lowballers list includes not only aerospace companies that could build the airframe, such as Lockheed Martin and Boeing, but also engine makers General Electric and Pratt & Whitney.

The Air Force first began looking at replacing the F-22A in 2016, following the findings of its own study. That report concluded that the service should procure a Raptor replacement, known as Penetrating Counter Air (PCA), by 2030. PCA became NGAD in the late 2010s. Then, in 2020, former Air Force Assistant Secretary Will Roper stunned the world by announcing that a technology demonstrator aircraft had been developed, tested, and flown in just one year.

But the plane was never presented to the public.


However, information about NGAD has been slowly leaking out over the years. In 2020, Roper said the sixth-generation fighter would likely feature an AI co-pilot. Everyone laughed at the software version. drone R2D2, who accompanied Luke Skywalker's X-Wing fighter in the Star Wars films.


In 2022, Kendall testified to Congress that the jets would cost “hundreds of millions” each, a figure that was later refined to be around $250 million to $300 million for the next-generation jet. Then, in 2023, Kendall said the Air Force wanted a minimum of 200 NGAD fighters, along with 1000 wingmen. drones to accompany them in battle. A normal figure, we also wanted 1000 at one time tanks "Armata" and 200 Su-57 aircraft.

But reality can be somewhat more cruel than dreams.

“The key to understanding NGAD is that it will not be the next, better ‘fighter.’ Rather, NGAD will be a family of systems that together will be more effective at sustaining long-range warfighting in challenging environments,” explains Mark “Gonzo” Gunzinger, director of future concepts and capabilities assessment at the Mitchell Institute for Aerospace Studies in Arlington, Va. “This family of systems will be more resilient, more survivable than current-generation fighters.”

Well, Mr. Gunzinger also made a lot of big, bold noises about how the next-generation air superiority fighter will have a longer range, carry a larger payload, have more sophisticated sensors and information fusion systems, and have the versatile broadband stealth needed to maintain superiority over China's increasingly sophisticated air defense forces.

Each NGAD aircraft will be able to control one to five unmanned aircraft known as Joint Combat Aircraft (CCA) or “loyal wingmen.” Equipped with artificial intelligence and carrying sensors, jammers and missiles, each CCA drone will act as an airborne force multiplier, giving a manned fighter the ability to see further, shoot further, and hit more opponents—all without risking more human lives.

CCA will become part of the NGAD family of systems



Gunzinger: "The combat potential of CCAs goes beyond simply serving as loyal wingmen. Cheaper CCAs with some degree of autonomy could also be used to disrupt enemy air defenses, challenge enemy air defenses, and force enemy forces to respond in ways that reduce the risk to overall U.S. operations."

In general, it is exactly the same, which has no analogues in the world. Familiar. But at the same time, there are many details and nuances here. In order to unleash the full potential of joint combat aircraft, the Air Force must figure out how to best use the advantages that both unmanned and manned aircraft provide in combat. And this, excuse me, is not one year for the development, construction and testing of a full range of tests. A full range of full-fledged tests.

“CCA will complement fifth-generation manned combat aircraft, it will not replace the F-22, F-35, and NGAD – both manned and unmanned systems are necessary to achieve air superiority and create other effects needed to win in a peer conflict.”

In general, it’s quite logical, pragmatic, smells of multi-billion dollar contracts – in general, everyone is clearly happy with everything.

But as ambitious as those plans are, the Air Force wants to add even more capabilities to NGAD. Slife said there are new, emerging technologies that didn't exist when the Air Force set the NGAD requirements. That means there are new technologies that the Air Force now wants to put on the plane from the start. And it only takes about six years of work to get there. Not that many, actually; more ambitious projects have fallen through the cracks, it should be noted.

What is all this for?


In my opinion, this is a very reasonable question. After all, back in 2020, Will Roper, the Air Force's deputy director of acquisition and logistics, announced that the NGAD prototype had begun flight testing. And four years to where?

Although we don’t know how he flew…


But if you think ahead, the most obvious technology in the world of unclassified technology would be artificial intelligence, although that same remark by Roper about R2D2 suggests that the service was certainly jumping to conclusions. But artificial intelligence is something that already exists today, and although it mostly resides in the European Union, it is nevertheless entirely possible that it will appear on airplanes. Unfortunately, nothing else comes to mind.

Sure, you can fantasize about “We have these missiles, but we won’t tell you about them,” meaning there may well be some highly classified capabilities that weren’t ready in 2016, like onboard offensive and defensive lasers, new advances in stealth, and new sensors. And maybe they are ready already. Or maybe they aren’t.

The Air Force's decision illustrates an important problem with modern fighters: the rapid development of new technologies means that a jet that takes 15 to 20 years to develop may not be able to match key technologies developed after the aircraft's specifications have been finalized. And it's really hard to disagree, all story aviation is full of examples where a couple of breakthrough technologies made entire generations of aircraft that had just entered service obsolete.

The F-35 program began in 1995, but the first aircraft weren’t declared operational until 2015–2019. That long development period meant the jet needed technology upgrades almost immediately, including a processor upgrade, new internal cooling systems, a video datalink, and the ability to carry new weapons. The F-35’s newest upgrade, Tech Refresh 3, is rolling out to air forces around the world this year. And there’s no getting around it.

The NGAD program is also being restructured because of cost. Early versions of the F-35 cost more than $200 million per plane, and while the cost has dropped sharply as Lockheed Martin has built more of the jets, buyers have suffered severe price shock from both the plane and the cost of operating it. Even the world’s most expensive jet, at $300 million, will be a tough sell, especially given that the Air Force must also afford new T-7 Red Tail jet trainers and F-35 fighters in the coming years, while developing a stealthy aerial refueling tanker and funding both the new Sentinel ICBM and the B-21 Raider.


Overall, there are enough programs and directions, but ideally the Air Force should reduce costs by increasing the efficiency of development and production, otherwise it could end up in bankruptcy. Although here the Air Force may be forced to agree to a reduction in NGAD capabilities or postpone them for a later date.

Regardless, NGAD may be the most important conventional weapons program of the early 21st century. If the Air Force can get it right, a force of sixth-generation fighters backed by armed drones could be a powerful deterrent to America’s adversaries.

But first, before they can do any of that, the Air Force has to get NGAD right this time. And that's where it's very much in doubt. There are two real possibilities here, either NGAD has truly become so obsolete after 8 years of work on the program from day one and 4 years of flight testing that the project needs to be restarted, or...

Or four years of testing of the NGAD prototype showed its complete failure. This could well have happened.

So everyone can choose for themselves.
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  1. +4
    24 September 2024 05: 21
    NGAD is dead, we are waiting for NGAD-2!
    Can we order a memorial service now? request
    1. +4
      24 September 2024 06: 52
      Quote: Mouse
      Can we order a memorial service now?

      The simply insane pace of AI development seems to be shifting the focus from a manned system with UAV support to a fully unmanned system. And the experience of the SVO only complements this aspiration.
    2. +2
      24 September 2024 08: 02
      Quote: Mouse
      Can we order a memorial service now?
      Protestants don't have this - just a modest funeral... wink
  2. -1
    24 September 2024 06: 04
    To get a hold of the military budget... well, that's a dream, a dream and again a dream, of many.
    Although, sometimes a shot isn't a blank.
    In general, the theme is ETERNAL!!! soldier
  3. 0
    24 September 2024 06: 40
    a jet aircraft that takes 15-20 years to develop may not be able to accommodate key technologies developed after the aircraft's parameters are finalized
    How can an airframe become outdated in principle? But avionics and electronics can always be either replaced or modernized.
    1. 0
      24 September 2024 06: 52
      Quote: Dutchman Michel
      How can an airframe become outdated in principle? But avionics and electronics can always be either replaced or modernized.

      For example, they decided to throw out the pilot and finally make a fighter for overloads of 50 G
      1. +2
        24 September 2024 08: 45
        Quote: BlackMokona
        For example, they decided to throw out the pilot and finally make a fighter for overloads of 50 G
        If they throw out the pilot, then they will throw out the life support system along with some controls. And this will only be a plus for the hysteric. But in what kind of maneuvers can a load of 50G be applied, I can't even imagine
        1. 0
          24 September 2024 11: 38
          Dodging missiles (even missile defense, probably) is more than enough laughing
          Well, the combat turn radius at supersonic speed (let's say Mach 2) is impressive.
          The only weapon left is an electromagnetic catapult for canister shots - cheap and cheerful wassat
          1. 0
            24 September 2024 13: 51
            Quote: vadimtt
            Dodging missiles (even missile defense, probably) is more than enough
            If the missile has a proximity fuse, then you won't be able to dodge it.
      2. 0
        24 September 2024 16: 07
        fighter under 50 G overloads

        So, it is not because of a person that the overload is limited, but because of strength. The sports Su-26 has an operational normal overload of 12. The smaller the size, the simpler - the law of squares and cubes is on the side of small structures. The small R-60 missile has 40 in general. But it needs it - the speed is 2 times higher than the target speed. With the same radius of the target and the missile, the acceleration (and overload) is 4 times greater 10x4 = 40. Just enough for any aircraft with proportional guidance. And how are you going to make a wing that can lift 50 aircraft masses and at the same time maintain both landing and maximum speeds?
        1. +1
          24 September 2024 18: 15
          Quote: dauria
          So it is not because of the person that the overload is limited, but because of the strength.
          I know this wink wink
          1. 0
            24 September 2024 20: 46
            Yes, this is not an answer to you, but to BlackMokona
            How do you deal with these arrows? request
      3. 0
        30 September 2024 10: 17
        Alas! It will be too problematic for a fighter to develop an overload of 50g: Firstly, the airframe will have to be excessively strengthened, and this is extra weight that will eat up the flight characteristics, secondly (or maybe firstly!) - the bearings of normal turbojet engines are not designed for such loads. They simply will not withstand, or the entire design will have to be fundamentally changed - which will not be for the common good of the aircraft. Therefore, for a UAV fighter, close in size to a manned one, the maximum operational overload will never be higher than 20g, the maximum maximum is 25g, but this is already "beyond the limit"...
    2. 0
      24 September 2024 17: 45
      Quote: Dutchman Michel
      How can a glider become fundamentally obsolete?

      Easily. It's not for nothing that it was constantly redesigned in the Su-27/30/35 line
      Quote: Dutchman Michel
      here are avionics and electronics, you can always either replace or upgrade

      In a combat aircraft, everything is very "slicked up" and to shove in a new system that does not correspond in terms of weight/dimensions is quite a task
      1. 0
        30 September 2024 10: 22
        Therefore, when designing a new aircraft, its designers have long been sure to include reserve volumes - for those units that it may need for modifications in 10-15-20 years... But since, as electronics, computing technology and materials science progress, the mass and dimensions of new devices are reduced (as a rule), these reserve volumes are usually sufficient - including due to the fact that instead of old ones, with greater weight and volume, new ones are also installed, lighter and taking up less space...
  4. -6
    24 September 2024 07: 23
    Everything is simpler and more cynical, new budgets have already been assigned to whom and in which pocket, there is no way to break agreements. At the same time, new planes need to be sold to someone, and sold at a high price, they are very hungry. And a new input has been discovered, the equipment still needs to fight. And how American equipment fights, as the example of Abrams showed, they do not have time to reach the battlefield. But for how many decades the Americans considered the best tank in the world, it turned out to be undeserved. So the Americans are trying to put all these tasks in their heads. It turns out to be a new project Zumwalt, they can no longer do otherwise.
  5. -8
    24 September 2024 07: 27
    A typical budget cut. The money was allocated, mastered, the topic was closed and we open a new one, even more expensive and promising in cut. The cycle of money in nature. Why do we need a fighter against a country with nuclear weapons? This is the question no one asked the Pentagon.
    1. +3
      24 September 2024 11: 20
      I am taken aback when I see the complete lack of logic. Does the fact that a country has nuclear weapons preclude its participation in conventional conflicts? And even if this is so, does this mean that the Air Force should focus only on confrontation with the armed forces of nuclear powers?
    2. +1
      24 September 2024 18: 17
      Quote: Victor Sergeev
      Why do we need a fighter jet against a country with nuclear weapons? This is the question no one has asked the Pentagon.

      Perhaps because people know that even in a large-scale nuclear missile war, conventional weapons are indispensable. Not everyone can be sure that nuclear weapons are such a sneeze-pow and that's the end of everything, let's go.
  6. -4
    24 September 2024 08: 00
    The Air Force first began replacing the F-22A in 2016, following the findings of its own study.

    If this car is going to be replaced with something new, then it means only one thing - this car is not such a supercar after all. F-22A, as American military analysts and Air Force leaders are trying to present it to us all...
    1. +1
      24 September 2024 08: 11
      Corrected
      Quote: Luminman
      If they are going to replace this machine with something new, then this means only one thing - this T-34 is not such a super machine as Soviet military analysts and tank commanders are trying to make it out to be...

      It's just that the F-22 has been in service for over 20 years, and any aircraft becomes obsolete as technology advances.
      1. -1
        24 September 2024 08: 20
        Quote: BlackMokona
        It's just that the F-22 has been in service for over 20 years, and any aircraft becomes obsolete as technology advances.

        Well, the F-16, which has undergone more than one upgrade, is still successfully crawls flies. It's old, of course, but it still breathes, and an old horse, as we know, won't spoil the furrow. So the Turks are going to buy it, even though it's old, and will be older than the F-22...

        Quote: BlackMokona
        It's just that the F-22 has been in service for over 20 years.

        This F-22 got into some kind of crooked formation... wink
        1. +1
          24 September 2024 08: 28
          Quote: Luminman
          So the Turks are going to buy it, even though it is old.

          So they have no choice. If they had the opportunity, they would buy F22/F35, but no one sells them...
          1. +3
            24 September 2024 08: 31
            Quote: Doccor18
            If there was an opportunity, we would buy F22/F35, but no one sells them...
            F22 is not exported, and no one sells F35 to them. I agree...
      2. +2
        24 September 2024 08: 31
        Quote: BlackMokona
        It's just that the F-22 has been in service for over 20 years.

        And the requirements for it were formed in the early 80s...
      3. 0
        30 September 2024 10: 24
        In its nearly 20 years in service, the F-22 has not become outdated at all.
    2. 0
      24 September 2024 14: 34
      Quote: Luminman
      then this means only one thing - this F-22A is not such a super machine

      Everything has a resource.
      The F22 is a great car, but it is physically aging, they don’t make new ones.
      There, according to the glider, the resource is probably running out.
      1. 0
        30 September 2024 10: 25
        The F-22 airframe's service life is calculated until 2045. Therefore, they will check it, ring it, do a gamma-ray flaw detection - and can extend the airframe's service life for another 10-15 years.
  7. +3
    24 September 2024 09: 12
    It is always difficult for the first. The task for NGAD developers now looks like "Go there, I don't know where, bring that, I don't know what." If a few years ago it was more or less clear what trends should be incorporated into a sixth-generation aircraft - in the fifth generation trends with improved characteristics and optional unmanned control, but in general it was at least clear that it should be a fighter, now, with the development of AI and UAVs, it has become unclear - will this be a fighter in the classical sense or a flying control center for "faithful wingmen" and will not itself participate directly in combat? What technologies should be developed for it? A powerful radar - or will each wingman have his own, quite powerful one, and the control center should not glow? Low-visibility control channels? Radio or laser, for example? Or do we need the ability to refuel wingmen in the air with fuel and ammunition? More questions than answers.
    1. 0
      30 September 2024 10: 28
      ...now, with the development of AI and UAVs, it has become unclear - will this be a fighter in the classical sense or a flying control center for "faithful wingmen" and will not itself participate directly in combat? What technologies should be developed for it?

      "Both, and you can do without bread!" You exaggerate the insolubility of the problem. "where to go". It's not all that catastrophic... smile
      1. 0
        30 September 2024 10: 40
        However, it is necessary to determine what technologies to develop for it. First of all, will it be manned or unmanned? If manned, will it be a combat strike vehicle or a control center for "faithful wingmen" and other third-party weapons? Will it rely on its own means of providing situational awareness or on external ones, such as UAVs?
        And there are many such questions, many of them depend on the forecasts for the development of UAVs for the next 30-50 years. And they are not at all obvious yet.
        1. 0
          30 September 2024 11: 46
          However, it is necessary to decide what technologies to develop for it. First of all, will it be manned or unmanned?

          It will most likely be "optionally manned" - either way, depending on the current mission. It needs to be used in a given place and time.
          If it is manned, will it be a combat strike vehicle or a control center for “faithful wingmen” and other third-party weapons?

          Drone control is a must-have option because people have been talking about it for 20 years and only the current development of computer technology allows us to implement sufficiently complex “brains” for drones.
          Will it rely on its own situational awareness capabilities or external ones, such as UAVs?

          And that (own excellent radar is definitely assumed) and - why not receive quality information from the drone's radar, if its level is sufficient for this? Without endangering the manned aircraft?
          Why do you always assume "either - or"? It won't be like that, it will only be "both - and".
          And there are many such questions, many of them depend on the forecasts for the development of UAVs for the next 30-50 years. And they are not at all obvious yet.

          No-no! The forecasts for the development of UAVs are just obvious! lol Forecasts for the development of manned aircraft are not clear! smile
          One thing is clear: With each passing year and decade there will be more and more drones in the air and fewer and fewer aircraft piloted by a living person.
          1. 0
            30 September 2024 12: 07
            It will most likely be "optionally manned" - either way, depending on the current mission. It needs to be used in a given place and time.

            Not "for sure". This approach underestimates the characteristics of the unmanned version. And if it is possible to make a purely unmanned version, it will have much higher characteristics than the manned one. The question is, will this be possible at least in the next thirty years?

            Drone control is a must-have option because people have been talking about it for 20 years and only the current development of computer technology allows us to implement sufficiently complex “brains” for drones.

            If current trends in UAV development continue, in about thirty years manned aircraft will not need to participate in combat directly at all - drones will conduct the combat, and the aircraft will carry out general control of the combat at a decent distance. And this will not be the same aircraft that is currently conducting combat. The same applies to situational awareness
            One thing is clear: with each passing year and decade there will be more and more drones in the air and fewer and fewer aircraft piloted by a living person.

            And in this connection the question arises - how will this affect the functions of manned aviation and, accordingly, the requirements for it. And there is no answer to this question yet.
  8. +3
    24 September 2024 09: 59
    Damn!
    Skomorokhov is a prolific author and Roman knows how to choose interesting topics and titles, there’s nothing to say.
    You see such an article, you rejoice while the author is not clear. You think: "now I will learn important and interesting and reliable information." Just not Roman, you think, because Roman does not understand at all what he writes about, so a feuilleton on a given topic.
    But you start reading, and from the very beginning you come across familiar cliches and phrases everywhere. Doubts creep in, you stop reading, start scrolling down the article to see the author, but even when scrolling, long before the end of the article, suspicions increase, Roman is an absolute champion in the length of his articles, they are sooooo long (it's clear that they pay for characters, not for knowledge)
    But not only are Roman's articles long, they are also completely untrue. Just like black and white.
    Thus, I conclude that Roman does not publish articles in order to tell us something, there is no truth in them, he publishes them and publishes them so long only with one goal - to make money from naive readers.
    But he doesn’t respect his readers because he doesn’t write the truth.
    1. 0
      24 September 2024 18: 28
      Quote: Alexey Sommer
      Thus, I conclude that Roman does not publish articles in order to tell us something, there is no truth in them, he publishes them and publishes them so long only with one goal - to make money from naive readers.

      Alexey, you are absolutely wrong. Roman is, consider him a full-time employee of VO, and he is simply forced to write on the topics that his manager assigns him. At the speed that the manager requires.
      His work is necessary and important because authors who are more or less knowledgeable about the topic they write about cannot write many articles. It's hard work, you know. And a site needs constant content updates to earn money from advertising.
      So it turns out that there can't be many good author articles, but a flow is needed. If there is no flow, advertising revenue will fall, there will be nothing to pay royalties with, good professional authors will leave and that's it, VO will end.
      Roman, by the way, knows very well that he is not an expert, and in many cases he understands the shortcomings of his articles - he simply does not have time to dig into the topics that are given to him, and no one asks about his interests. But thanks to him, you can occasionally read something good on VO, like what Sergey Linnik writes, for example.
      I understand your indignation, I myself once thought the same as you and got into a fight with Roman once, thinking that he was trying for the money. Well, then everything became clear
  9. -4
    24 September 2024 10: 43
    The Air Force wants at least 200 NGAD fighters along with 1000 wingman drones to accompany them in combat. That's a reasonable number, we also wanted 1000 Armata tanks and 200 Su-57 aircraft at one time.

    To be fair, it should be noted that the Armata and Su-57 are available, not many, but they are there.
    They have nothing but pictures and wish lists worth billions of dollars. request lol
    1. 0
      24 September 2024 11: 23
      There is a nuance: the SU-57, which we have in stock, but in small quantities, is an analogue of the 22nd, which they are going to withdraw
      1. -3
        24 September 2024 11: 28
        Quote from Sumotori_380
        There is a nuance: the SU-57, which we have in stock, but in small quantities, is an analogue of the 22nd, which they are going to withdraw

        Well, they can do whatever they want.
        But they don't have an equivalent replacement for him, Penguin (who is Fu 35th) is not capable of this.
        Getting rid of an airplane without replacing it, but only by developing something else, is not very smart. request
      2. +1
        24 September 2024 12: 20
        Quote from Sumotori_380
        The SU-57, which we have in stock, but in small quantities, is an analogue of the 22nd.

        Well, not exactly an analogue, especially in combat capabilities, but really of the same class. But if the F-22 looks like a stub against the background of the Su-57 - only for air combat and gaining air superiority with external target designation with rudimentary capabilities for working on ground and especially sea targets, then the composition of the on-board and portable weapons of the Su-57 is so wide, and the capabilities are varied, that hardly any of the modern aircraft is capable of equaling it in this.
        Well, and the price, where would we be without it?
        Quote from Sumotori_380
        but few

        It's really not enough, the series is just starting, but starting next year they promise 30 units per year. This year they promise 22 units.
        But we have as many as 3 4++ aircraft in the series - Su-35S\SM, Su-30SM2, Su-34M. They also promise to bring out and maintain their annual production rate at 30 aircraft per year of each type. So, starting next year, the troops will receive 5-4 new 100th and 120++ generation aircraft (bearing in mind the export of Su-35SE for Iran \ordered 70+ units\ and other customers).
        There is still no clarity about the fate of the MiG-35S - the first batch is to be delivered to the VKS by the end of this year (according to earlier statements), and there are at least two foreign customers for this aircraft. But the UAC management has not yet provided any clarity.
        And in December the Su-75 should take off for the first time, there is not much left. Perhaps it is for this that they are trying to pull the budget for the LFMI, but ... The Su-75 will have to undergo tests for at least another 5 years, treat childhood illnesses and fine-tune its onboard systems. The airframe is completely new, you can’t skimp on its fine-tuning. And all this time, while the Su-75 is learning to fly and preparing to become a star of world aviation, the MiG-35S should be produced for its own Aerospace Forces and allies. At the highest possible rate. Possibly with the transfer of assembly licenses to allies.
        1. 0
          24 September 2024 14: 41
          Quote: bayard
          MiG-35S should be produced

          The MiG-35S is of no use to anyone except the Mikoyan Design Bureau. No one, neither the Russian Ministry of Defense nor foreign customers.
          Its operating costs are the same as those of a heavy fighter, but its capabilities are the same as those of a light fighter.
          It is not needed, we just need to wait for the SU-75.
          1. -2
            24 September 2024 17: 45
            Quote: Alexey Sommer
            The MiG-35S is of no use to anyone except the Mikoyan Design Bureau. No one, neither the Russian Ministry of Defense nor foreign customers.

            This is NOT TRUE. Moreover, such heresy is completely unacceptable during a war. Our Aerospace Forces are too small, we need to double (at least), or better yet, triple the number of Aerospace Forces in the shortest possible time. And first of all, combat aircraft. The production of Su-57, Su-35S\SM, Su-30SM2 and Su-34M is being increased. But these are all HEAVY machines. As a result, our Su-34s almost always take off with a huge underload, carrying 4 FAB-500 with UMPK, two FAB-1500 or one FAB-3000 with UMPK. So, it would be much more rational to assign the FAB-250 and FAB-500 with UMPK to the MiG-35S LFMI, which has a higher speed and altitude than the Su-34, and therefore the bombs launched by it will fly further, and the combat load will be more rational and will be able to include the SD and MD RVV in case of an air battle, for which it is also much better prepared than the Su-34. The MiG-35S is a frontline LFMI, it can be operated from any airfields and strips, including highway sections and prepared dirt strips. Its engines have a service life of 4000 engine hours, like the Su-35S, and almost twice as long as the engines of the Su-30SM and Su-34 (2500 engine hours).
            Quote: Alexey Sommer
            It costs as much to operate as a heavy fighter.

            This is not true for the above-mentioned reason (engine resource), and because it is unpretentious to basing conditions. And it also burns less fuel. Its named/declared purchase price is approximately the same as the Su-30SM, but the MiG-35S has an AFAR radar, while the Su-30SM has a slotted PFAR. And this is in conditions when the Su-30SM is our most massive fighter due to exports and has long since recouped the cost of its own development. In the case of a normal series, the MiG-35 will also become cheaper. And most importantly, we have a plant with lines deployed and prepared for the production of these aircraft. Capable of producing 36 MiG-35S per year in peacetime. And in the conditions of a "threat period" and when working in 3 shifts, with the expansion of production? To neglect such potential is a crime.
            Russia has no problems with financing, but there are problems with trained personnel, production capacity and lost competencies. And there are no problems with launching serial production of the MiG-35S. We urgently need from 240 to 400 LFMI and for now only the MiG-35S can be that. In addition, the MiG-35S takes part in the SVO, despite the fact that there are only 6 of them in service.
          2. -2
            24 September 2024 18: 02
            Quote: Alexey Sommer
            capabilities as a lung.

            Also no. Combat load is 6500 kg versus 8000 kg for heavy ones. Normal - 3250 kg (half of the maximum), which is enough to take 4 FAB-500 with UMPK + RVV for air combat and/or Kh-31 (PRLR).
            Is this not enough?
            It can carry the Kh-35 and Kh-69 and basically the entire range of modern ASP. Its radar sees even further than the Su-30SM radar (280 km for a large target), despite the fact that the area of ​​the canvas is significantly smaller than that of the heavy Su-30SM.
            What else do you need for war?
            Quote: Alexey Sommer
            You just have to wait for the SU-75.

            According to the most optimistic forecasts, the Su-75 will be ready for series production no earlier than in 5 years. The airframe is completely new and all the flaws and shortcomings still need to be identified and corrected during testing. Haste in such a matter can be very expensive. Including in reputation.
            And the allies need to be armed right now. Urgently! The world smells of war. The Iranian and North Korean air forces need to be urgently rearmed with modern aircraft. Iran alone needs at least 70 LFMIs, which could become MiG-35S, in addition to 150+ Su-35SE. They can/should be sold a license to assemble them from our machine kits. The North Koreans also need up to 100 of these aircraft. There are others in need, who are in dire need right now.
            And the Su-75 needs to be made properly so that it really becomes the king of the sky and a bestseller for many years. And the VKS needs from 600 to 1000 of these LFMIs. But this aircraft is for the next decade.
        2. -1
          30 September 2024 10: 42
          But if the F-22 looks like a stub next to the Su-57

          Who said that??
          - only for air combat and air superiority

          But this is not enough: to organize air supremacy in the theater of military operations, having shot down and dispersed all enemy fighters "to zero"?! lol IS THIS NOT ENOUGH??
          with external target designation

          But this is a ridiculous lie: The F-22 has been providing tactical situational awareness to large AWACS for many years! HE IS THE SOURCE OF EXTERNAL TARGET DESIGNATION FOR EVERYONE ELSE IN THE TEAMER'S DISTRICT!
          with rudimentary capabilities for working on land and especially sea targets

          Again, absurdity: the F-22 is the main strike force for destroying the enemy's most advanced air defense and missile defense systems - after ballistic missiles and cruise missiles. Only after it will come the F-35, and after them - all 4th generation fighters...
          The composition of the on-board and portable weapons of the Su-57 is so wide, and its capabilities are so varied, that hardly any modern aircraft can match it in this regard.

          In the theater of military operations, the Su-57 is worth nothing not only against the F-22, but also against the F-35. AT ALL.
          1. 0
            30 September 2024 17: 27
            Eh, Strelkin-Belkin-Pogorelkin, they apparently pay well. lol
            Then why do they so stubbornly want to write off your protégé (F-22)? Since he is so "irresistible"?
            Simply a good, but very expensive aircraft with limited capabilities - small BC, no onboard radar panels, which is why its radar field of view is very limited, no onboard computer, old onboard computer... Against the latest stealth fighter with a circular radar, a luxurious onboard computer, the latest avionics and 8-10 (depending on the type) missiles in the internal compartments.
            Again :
            - 4 missiles against 8-10 missiles,
            - one radar canvas against SIX canvases of an all-aspect radar complex,
            - absence of OLS and presence of excellent OLS with a target detection range of up to 70-75 km.
            - the aircraft is in serial production and its production is expanding, as opposed to being written off due to its high cost, complexity and unsuitability for modernization.
            - an aircraft that during its long career has not shot down a single aerial target except for a hot air balloon, against an aircraft that is actually fighting, has shot down enemy aircraft and hit targets on the ground (mainly air defense missile systems) to its credit.
            Yes, you are Strelkin, with your shoulder strap in a puddle the color of your flag.
            But he could have simply written that: “the plane is not bad, it’s just the first of its kind, and it’s quite suitable for air combat at medium ranges, and even at long ranges, if we consider a range of 100-150 km as such, it has an undeniable advantage/strong point - stealth, but otherwise it’s outdated... if it had avionics from the F-35, it would have shaken off its old ways, but... it’s impossible and impractical,” and he would have been honest.
            1. 0
              30 September 2024 19: 21
              Eh, Strelkin-Belkin-Pogorelkin, apparently they pay well. lol

              Only "on a voluntary basis"!
              Then why do they so stubbornly want to write off your protégé (F-22)? Since he is so "irresistible"?

              "Don't wait!" They will be decommissioned by 2045, when it will be replaced by NGAD.
              Simply a good, but very expensive aircraft with limited capabilities - small BC, no onboard radar panels, which is why its radar field of view is very limited, no onboard computer, old onboard computer... Against the latest stealth fighter with a circular radar, a luxurious onboard computer, the latest avionics and 8-10 (depending on the type) missiles in the internal compartments.

              All this nonsense (which is not found on any modern fighter in developed countries) greatly increases visibility. There is no trace of it on the F-35! laughing
              Again :
              - 4 missiles versus 8-10 missiles

              8 ARVV in F-22, eight! 6 AIM-120D long range (180 km) plus 2 AIM-9X short (30 km). 6+2=8. Generally speaking, children know this...
              - one radar canvas against SIX canvases of an all-aspect radar complex,
              - absence of OLS and presence of excellent OLS with a target detection range of up to 70-75 km.
              - the aircraft is in serial production and its production is expanding, as opposed to being written off due to its high cost, complexity and unsuitability for modernization.

              The creators did not consider it necessary to stick this on a fighter for gaining air superiority, which already beats everyone with astronomical scores.
              - an aircraft that during its long career has not shot down a single air target except
              balloon, against an aircraft that actually fights, has shot down enemy aircraft and hit targets on the ground (mainly air defense missile systems) to its credit.

              Are we really talking about the Su-57?! wink So, in a duel with the Su-22, the F-57 will emerge victorious 10 times out of 10, 20 times out of 20, 50 times out of 50! They are simply incomparable.
              Yes, you are Strelkin, with your shoulder strap in a puddle the color of your flag.

              Do you have some problem with colors, are you color blind or something? Take a look at my post today in this thread, 30.09 8:18, wouldn't you mind?
              https://topwar.ru/249981-razmyshlenija-o-vsemoguschestve-f-22-raptor-v-svete-poslednih-reshenij-vvs-ssha.html
              I can't retell my biography five times a day... There will be fewer questions about "the color of my flag"... lol
              But he could have simply written that: "the plane is not bad, it's just the first of its kind, and it's quite suitable for air combat at medium ranges, and even at long ranges, if we consider a range of 100-150 km as such, it has an undeniable advantage/strong point - low visibility, but otherwise it's outdated... if it had avionics from the F-35, it would have shaken off the old days, but... it's impossible and impractical"

              The F-22 is the best fighter in the world at the moment, with no equal. And it is also capable of defeating its "little brother" the F-35 in a duel, despite the fact that the latter has better avionics. But the F-22's APG-77 radar has 2200 receiving and transmitting modules and it can see a target with an RCS of 1 m at 225 km in normal mode and at 193 km in stealth mode, while the F-35's APG-81 radar can see the same target only at 160 km, and its PPM antenna has only 1676 pieces. True, they are going to install a new antenna in the next series, with a PPM made of gallium nitride instead of gallium arsenide, then the power can increase by 60%...
              ...and would be honest.

              I am always honest, that's my credo... winked
              1. 0
                1 October 2024 00: 04
                Quote: Strelkin
                But the F-22's APG-77 radar has 2200 receiving and transmitting modules and it can see a target with an RCS of 1 m at 225 km in normal mode and at 193 km in stealth mode.

                I read about this radar back in 1988 (or at the end of 1987) in the weekly intelligence bulletin "Aviation-Rocket Technology" or in the monthly magazine "Technical Information", both DSP, but it is no longer important. So the radar is not new, but then it was still being tested, and perhaps it was only being developed. In addition, the PPM is on gallium arsenide (limitations on temperature resistance and output power. Now this is no longer fashionable and all AFAR radars are trying to make PPM based on gallium nitride.
                What I mean is that the F-22 has a radar developed in the late 80s - early 90s. The Belka has a much newer radar, and although you can't find exact data now, they say that the detection range of a target with an RCS of 3 square meters is 400 km. In addition, over the last 20 years (at least) they have worked hard to increase sensitivity, noise immunity and computer analysis of the response signal in order to increase the ability to detect low-visibility targets. That is, detection capabilities depend not only on the power of the probing signal, the sensitivity of the receiving devices, noise immunity and wavelength, but also on the quality of the analysis of the received signal. What I mean is that we are comparing the mutual detection capabilities of the Su-57 and F-22.
                And the fact that he won against someone there... there the most modern opponent of our aircraft was the Su-30MKI with its huge EPR and the export version of the "Bars".
                And please explain what you meant by the term "stealth mode" for radar? Reduced radiation power? But you understand that any radiation source is recorded by RTR and a warning system with at least a vector to such a source? I am interested in this as a radar specialist.
                And one more thing - you constantly call the F-22 a kind of "AWACS" in the enemy camp... How do you imagine this in practice, if it has a fixed canvas with a viewing sector of 100 - 120 degrees maximum? The Su-57 has a 360 degree view, it can, but it will also give itself away with radiation.
                1. 0
                  1 October 2024 06: 34
                  And please explain what you meant by the term "stealth mode" for the radar?

                  LPI - Low Probability of Intercept:
                  https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/f-22-avionics.htm#google_vignette
                  The Low Probability of Intercept (LPI) capability of the radar defeats conventional RWR / ESM systems. The AN / APG-77 radar is capable of performing an active radar search on RWR / ESM equipped fighter aircraft without the target knowing he is being illuminated. Unlike conventional radars which emit high energy pulses in a narrow frequency band, the AN / APG-77 emits low energy pulses over a wide frequency band using a technique called spread spectrum transmission. When multiple echoes are returned, the radar's signal processor combines the signals. The amount of energy reflected back to the target is about the same as a conventional radar, but because each LPI pulse has considerably less amount of energy and may not fit normal modulation patterns, the target would have a difficult time detecting the F-22.

                  The radar's low probability of intercept (LPI) capability outperforms conventional ELINT/SELINT systems. The AN/APG-77 radar is capable of performing active radar searches against ELINT/SELINT-equipped fighters without the target knowing it is being illuminated. Unlike conventional radars, which emit high-energy pulses over a narrow band of frequencies, the AN/APG-77 emits low-energy pulses over a wide band of frequencies using a technique called spread spectrum transmission. When multiple echoes return, the radar's signal processor combines the signals. The amount of energy reflected back to the target is about the same as a conventional radar, but because each LPI pulse has significantly less energy and may not match conventional modulation patterns, the F-22 will be difficult for targets to detect.

                  And one more thing - you constantly call the F-22 a kind of "AWACS" in the enemy camp... How do you imagine this in practice, if it has a fixed canvas with a viewing sector of 100 - 120 degrees maximum?

                  Can you imagine what a huge sector this is, 120 degrees? At a range of about 400 kilometers, from an altitude of about 20 kilometers? Secondly: the plane is not nailed to one place - it will turn to the right by 60 degrees, turn to the left by 60 degrees - and it will see everything and everyone, including those flying close to the ground. And it will transmit all the pictures, all the videos from its radar in real time to the large AWACS, and there is a team of 20 people, they control all the planes in the theater of operations. The Americans believe that this is more than enough, they tested it in dozens of large exercises, the result is excellent.
                  Here is a 2008 article:
                  https://nvo.ng.ru/concepts/2008-02-29/5_pentagon.html
                  1. 0
                    1 October 2024 12: 56
                    Quote: Strelkin
                    Since each LPI pulse has a significantly lower amount of energy and may not follow normal modulation patterns, the F-22 will be difficult for targets to detect.

                    This will only work for old SAR systems and radiation sensors, it is enough to use wideband receivers and antennas, and it will not be possible to disguise yourself as a remote radar. Especially when there are samples of the radar signature of such a BRLS. SAR always sees further than the radar of any aircraft. The main thing is to use the right equipment. And since such a radar has existed for a long time, the means of its direction finding have long been created. Such a thing could/may work only as a factor of novelty ... but it is not new for a long time.
                    Quote: Strelkin
                    will turn to the right by 60 degrees, will turn to the left by 60 degrees - and will see everything and everyone

                    That is, expanding the field of view by maneuvering. The Irbis on the Su-35S and Su-30SM2 uses a turn of the antenna web to solve such problems, which provides a field of view in a sector of 240-270 degrees without any maneuvering. And although the Irbis is a PFAR, it is very powerful. As for the Belka, it has a circular view without any turn of the web or maneuvering, and also uses a broadband signal of "increased stealth" or "stealth mode" in your opinion, with a detection range of 3 km for targets with an EPR of 400 sq.m.
                    And more about the AWACS aircraft, the A-50U has characteristics in terms of detection range and the number of targets tracked at least at the level of a modernized AWACS, i.e. about 650 km, it is capable of guiding/correcting the target designation of SAMs and RVV BD fighters without the participation of a ground radar and a fighter, such missiles cannot be evaded by diving to the ground. And the A-100, which is undergoing testing, has a detection range of high-altitude (more than 10 m) targets up to 000 km. In our case, there is one problem - there are still few such AWACS aircraft, but the rate of their production is increasing and has already exceeded the rate of the SVO by 850-4 times. So, with approximate qualitative parity and the unconditional superiority of our side in air defense means (and their quality), we essentially now have one task - a quantitative increase in what we lack. And for a conflict of a higher level than the current one, we have completely modernized and updated strategic nuclear forces, as well as nuclear deterrence means of the continental, operational-tactical and tactical levels. In sufficient quantity and excellent quality.
                    1. 0
                      1 October 2024 13: 15
                      This will only work for old RTR systems and radiation sensors, it is enough to use wideband receivers and antennas, and it will not be possible to disguise yourself as a remote radar.

                      Of the latest Russian aircraft SPO, I know only the L-150. And, apparently, it does not recognize the operation of the radar with AFAR in LPI mode.
                      Especially when there are samples of the radar signature of such an BRLS.

                      The F-22 and F-35 radars (as well as all other Western AESA radars) form any signals.
                      RTR always sees further than any aircraft radar. The main thing is to use the right equipment.

                      "Golden words"! Does the Pentagon know this? wink
                      That is, expanding the field of view by maneuvering.

                      So.
                      In the Irbis on the Su-35S and Su-30SM2, to solve such problems, the antenna web is rotated, which provides visibility in a sector of 240 - 270 degrees without any maneuvering.

                      I know. But the "stupid" Anglo-Saxons, Frogs, Pasta-lovers and other liberal rabble categorically refused to go down this path!! "Well, you're so dumb!" laughing
                      And although the Irbis is a PFAR, it is very powerful.

                      No more powerful than the F-22 radar.
                      As for the "Belka", it has a 3-degree view without any canvas rotation or maneuvering, and also uses a broadband signal of "increased stealth" or "stealth mode" as you call it, with a detection range of targets with an EPR of 400 square meters of XNUMX km.

                      Here's more detail from this point! There is a main centimeter-range antenna, there are two side antennas smaller in the centimeter range, there are two antennas in the half-wings, a range of 15-30 cm, there seems to be no antenna in the tail - how is coverage in a 360-degree sector ensured?? Here in the picture I don't even see decimeter antennas in the half-wings - have they really abandoned them?!
                      1. 0
                        1 October 2024 13: 19
                        And more about the AWACS aircraft, the A-50U has characteristics in terms of detection range and the number of targets tracked at least at the level of the modernized AWACS, i.e. about 650 km.

                        No, of course not. LESS.
                        So, with approximate qualitative parity and the unconditional superiority of our side in air defense systems (and their quality)

                        There is no "quality parity" even close. And where did you get this superiority in resources?? Where does this "hatred" come from?! SOURCE?? (Except Roman Skomorokhov, of course.)
                      2. 0
                        1 October 2024 19: 25
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        No, of course not. LESS.

                        We are not talking about the detection range of a fighter, but of a target such as a bomber, an air force aircraft, an AWACS aircraft, a military transport aircraft, etc. The modernized AWACS demonstrates approximately the same range for such targets.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And where did you get your superiority in resources?

                        We are talking about ground-based air defense and its means. And the fact that we have quantitative and qualitative superiority in this is not disputed by the Western expert community.
                        With the support of ground-based air defense, the VKS fighter aircraft will be able to withstand a numerically superior enemy. Moreover, if such a confrontation occurs, the first thing that will be destroyed will be all airfields, arsenals, command centers, missile defense and air defense facilities. Moreover, by means that modern NATO air defense/missile defense is not capable of intercepting. And this is also our qualitative advantage. No one will allow "conventional" dancing with NATO.
                      3. 0
                        1 October 2024 19: 45
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        No, of course not. LESS.

                        We are not talking about the detection range of a fighter, but of a target such as a bomber, an air force aircraft, an AWACS aircraft, a military transport aircraft, etc. The modernized AWACS demonstrates approximately the same range for such targets.

                        Stop-stop-stop! It is obvious that at this point you are seriously misunderstanding: the characteristic of the capabilities of a radar is the range of its detection of a target with a specific EPR, today in the USA the standard for a target with EPR=1 m². Not something gigantic, with an RCS of hundreds of square meters. And this is given in reference books, in open information. And here the modernized AWACS and the Russian A-50, even with "U", even the A-100 "didn't even come close."

                        The A-50:
                        The radar "Vega-M" is designed by MNIIP, Moscow, and produced by NPO Vega. The "Vega-M" can track up to 150 targets simultaneously within 230 kilometres. Large targets, like surface ships, can be tracked at a distance of 400 kilometres.

                        A-50:
                        The Vega-M radar was developed by MNIIP, Moscow, and is manufactured by NPO Vega. The Vega-M can simultaneously track up to 150 targets within a radius of 230 kilometers. Large targets, such as surface ships, can be tracked at a distance of up to 400 kilometers.
                        .......................
                        "Small targets within a radius of 230 km" - targets with an RCS of 5 m² (I came across this once).
                        The modernized AWACS (from memory) takes a target with an RCS of 1 m² at a range of 415 km.
                        Believe it or not, check it out, the network is in front of you.
                      4. -1
                        1 October 2024 19: 50
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And where did you get your superiority in resources?

                        We are talking about ground-based air defense and its means. And the fact that we have quantitative and qualitative superiority in this is not disputed by the Western expert community.

                        Not just "disputed" - that's nonsense.
                        With the support of ground-based air defense, the VKS fighter aircraft will be able to withstand a numerically superior enemy.

                        She can't. And it would be a great blessing if she never had to do that.
                        Moreover, if such a confrontation occurs, the first thing that will be destroyed will be all airfields, arsenals, command centers, missile defense and air defense facilities. Moreover, by means that modern NATO air defense/missile defense is not capable of intercepting.

                        ?? In these two and a half years, Russian military power has already destroyed this in Ukraine?! "Practice on cats" before going to war with NATO??
                        And this is also our qualitative advantage. No one will allow "conventional" dancing with NATO.

                        Really, a thermonuclear warhead aimed at Washington right away?! wassat laughing Without fear of retribution?!
                        "I do not believe!" (with K.S. Stanislavsky)
                      5. 0
                        1 October 2024 22: 51
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "I do not believe!"

                        It's your right. It will be too late to be convinced.
                        You are now being bombed by those about whom they also said that "they wouldn't dare". And if you force them, then the YABCh won't spare them either (and they have some).
                        Quote: Strelkin

                        ?? In these two and a half years, Russian military power has already destroyed this in Ukraine?!

                        Several times already. The fact that it is being replenished is something else - it is grinding up the funds of NATO and Co. Everything that was from the Warsaw people and obtained from users of Soviet weapons was collected/bought up for the Ukrainian Armed Forces. And yet it is dying.
                        At the same time, only conventional warheads are used against the Ukrainian Armed Forces; with NATO, everything will be simpler and faster. Therefore, the time and means of delivery will be required an order of magnitude+ less. For everything that is available.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Without fear of retribution?!

                        If NATO does ask, not a second of regret.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Not just "disputed" - that's nonsense.

                        Your shorts are nonsense. Our air defense systems are the best. Israel has recently acquired some pretty good systems, but right now they are being depleted and riddled with holes by the "third world country". Maybe you could tell us how unnecessary and weak the Israeli air defense/missile defense system turned out to be, how useless it is in repelling air and missile strikes? Think about what you are saying, at least at the moment when you can only rely on air defense.
                      6. 0
                        2 October 2024 05: 00
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Without fear of retribution?!

                        If NATO does ask, not a second of regret.

                        That is: I don’t feel sorry for Russia at all, “what will happen to it later”?!
                        Like little children ...
                      7. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 00
                        Strelkin, you were bombed today, and in a very spectacular and demonstrative manner. Will you respond?
                        And when your special services and your Air Force destroy the objects and leaders of your enemies, what are you guided by?
                        Now we are guided only by the principles of expediency and our own safety.
                        Did you start bombing Lebanon because Hezbollah threatened you with its missile potential? Did you kill diplomats and IRGC leaders because you thought it was appropriate for the country's security?
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Like little children ...

                        It’s not funny for yourself?
                        What we will do will be the "response". But such that no additional effort is required.
                        So, Strelkin, will Israel respond to a night attack on its territory?
                        So why be surprised that we will strike in response to a strike by English, French and/or American missiles on our territory? We are within our rights, just as Iran was within its rights last night, and just as Israel is now within its rights to respond.
                        Is Netanyahu preparing something terrible there?
                        Armageddon?
                        Are you talking about a nuclear strike there?
                        But why?
                        After all, Israel itself only needs 15-20 nuclear warheads, and Iran probably already has them.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Like little children ...

                        Can't wait to go to heaven, or whatever the classic says?
                      8. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 15
                        Strelkin, you were bombed today, and in a very spectacular and demonstrative manner. Will you respond?

                        Required! But I am not Netanyahu and I cannot say - when and how.
                        And when your special services and your Air Force destroy the objects and leaders of your enemies, what are you guided by?

                        Common sense and the commandments of the Torah (you know it as the "Old Testament"): "Kill the one who wants to kill you first!"
                        Now we are guided only by the principles of expediency and our own safety.

                        Which of the leaders of enemy states were killed?!
                        Did you start bombing Lebanon because Hezbollah threatened you with its missile potential?

                        No, because Hezbollah has been shelling Israel for almost a year! am It's just that it's only now that her turn has come.
                        Did they kill diplomats and IRGC leaders because they thought it was necessary for the security of the country?

                        Because Iran HAS BEEN STATING ITS DESIRE TO DESTROY ISRAEL FOR MANY YEARS, and its proxies - Hamas, Hezbollah and others have been persistently trying to do this all these years - with Iranian weapons, with Iranian money...
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Like little children ...

                        It’s not funny for yourself?

                        Not a drop!
                        What we will do will be the "response". But such that no additional effort is required.

                        Dreaming is not bad!
                        So, Strelkin, will Israel respond to a night attack on its territory?

                        IMHO: Yes, of course, of course.
                        So why be surprised that we will strike in response to a strike by English, French and/or American missiles on our territory?

                        THEY HAVE BEEN STRIKING FOR A LONG TIME AT THE TERRITORIES THAT ARE OFFICIALLY DECLARED AS RUSSIAN BY RUSSIA! CRIMEA, DONBASS, ETC., ETC. And not a peep in response!
                        We are within our rights, just as Iran was within its rights this night.

                        And why the hell did "Iran have the right" all of a sudden? am
                        and how Israel now has the right to respond.

                        Naturally! To a blow from a country that has nothing to do with us at all! And declares "our destruction"!
                        Is Netanyahu preparing something terrible there?
                        Armageddon?

                        Not yet. Only with conventional weapons.
                        Are you talking about a nuclear strike there?

                        I haven't heard it YET, and they won't talk about it.
                        But why?
                        After all, Israel itself only needs 15-20 nuclear warheads, and Iran probably already has them.

                        Let him apply it. Then he will get - a word of six letters, the second "i"? That's right - FIASCO! laughing
                      9. 0
                        2 October 2024 08: 39
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Let him apply it. Then he will get - a six-letter word

                        And if he uses it and the missiles pass through as easily as they did last night? Will you have the same fun?
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And why the hell did "Iran have the right" all of a sudden?

                        Because you attacked his territory and his diplomatic mission. He has the right to attack, just as you now have the right.
                        And yet - if the missiles pass through just as easily, but they have slightly different warheads, will you have the same fun? I don't really, I have two friends living there.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        THEY HAVE BEEN STRIKING FOR A LONG TIME AT THE TERRITORIES THAT ARE OFFICIALLY DECLARED AS RUSSIAN BY RUSSIA! CRIMEA, DONBASS, AND ETC.

                        Hezbollah also hit you for a year before you were able to do so.
                        So we are not dealing with a small backward state, but with a powerful military-political bloc. The gift should be big and given to everyone at once, so as not to offend.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Dreaming is not bad!

                        Well, you dream about it too
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        FIASCO!

                        And what will happen in the fuss with Iran, only Ahura Mazda knows. Maybe a FIASCO, maybe some other beast.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Iran has been declaring its desire to destroy Israel for many years

                        As far as I have heard the speeches of their leaders, they have been denying these accusations for the last few years. They claim that they do not want to destroy. What they want is unclear, but they say that something else.
                        But the British want it.
                        Precisely to destroy the state of Israel. And by the way, they do not hide this.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "Kill the one who wants to kill you first!"

                        You see, according to the commandments, how simple everything is, but you resist the "will of God". And you dissuade us from fulfilling your "will of God". Somehow illogical, don't you think?
                        They want to defeat our country and kill us all, our enemies have been telling us this for the third year, we are now going to kill them all, because this is the “will of your God”, as well as our will and decision - everything is according to the commandments written by someone, but in this part we definitely agree.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Which of the leaders of enemy states were killed?!

                        Come on, how can you kill the prankster Biden, the dunce Scholz or the unfunny clown, and leave the others? The Queen herself died on the island. We are for universal happiness - global. Otherwise, some kind of hooliganism will result. Let's bring Kamala to power and then fellow .
                      10. 0
                        2 October 2024 08: 50
                        And what if he uses it and the missiles pass through as easily as they did last night?

                        Well, you were lied to again: who told you that "THEY got through easily?!"
                        Will you have as much fun?

                        I will have a lot of fun when our missiles and bombs hit their targets in Iran. The villains will get their comeuppance.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And why the hell did "Iran have the right" all of a sudden?

                        Because you attacked his territory and his diplomatic mission.

                        What, what?! After he's been messing with us for 20 years through Hezbollah?! Don't you find it funny? You claim that the nasty Englishwoman is doing you a disservice by handing over missiles to Ukraine and allowing it to strike targets on Russian territory! So Iran, handing over missiles to Hezbollah, is the same "nasty Englishwoman"!
                        Or do you have two measures??
                        He has the right to strike, just as you now have the right to strike.

                        Enough of these nonsense stories: Iran has been screaming for years that it wants to wipe Israel off the face of the earth!
                        And yet - if the missiles pass through just as easily

                        Stop talking this nonsense and presenting your wishes as reality? There never was and never will be any "easy pass".
                        but they will have slightly different combat units, will you have the same fun?

                        In this case, Israel will undoubtedly suffer, but the power of the ayatollahs in Iran will be destroyed absolutely definitely. Absolutely definitely.
                        I don't really like it, I have two friends living there.

                        So talk to your comrades, tell them how many of your comrades here are dreaming of someone destroying Israel! Will you make them happy?
                      11. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 04
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        THEY HAVE BEEN STRIKING FOR A LONG TIME AT THE TERRITORIES THAT ARE OFFICIALLY DECLARED AS RUSSIAN BY RUSSIA! CRIMEA, DONBASS, AND ETC.

                        Hezbollah also hit you for a year before you were able to do so.

                        But we were busy with Gaza! It is impossible to destroy all the gangs in the area at once, there just aren't enough hands...
                        So we are not dealing with a small backward state, but with a powerful military-political bloc. The gift should be big and given to everyone at once, so as not to offend.

                        You will NEVER hit this "big military-political bloc". Because then you will get a second word of six letters, the second "i"...
                        And after the dust settles, 3/4 of Russia's territory will be taken over by China. And this does not make me happy at all, but rather deeply saddens me - for Chinese boots to tramp through my native Kemerovo... Because of your stupidity...
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Iran has been declaring its desire to destroy Israel for many years

                        As far as I have heard the speeches of their leaders, they have been denying these accusations for the last few years. They claim that they do not want to destroy. What they want is unclear, but they say that something else.

                        Are you really trying to kill me with your sense of humor today? Who will believe this "military trick" of theirs? THEY BELIEVE ACTIONS. And their actions are the same: fight for the destruction of Israel. No other.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "Kill the one who wants to kill you first!"

                        You see, according to the commandments, how simple everything is, but you resist the "will of God". And you dissuade us from fulfilling your "will of God". Somehow illogical, don't you think?
                        They want to defeat our country and kill us all, our enemies have been telling us this for the third year, we are now going to kill them all, because this is the “will of your God”, as well as our will and decision - everything is according to the commandments written by someone, but in this part we definitely agree.

                        When this SVO ends, when a normal government is formed in Russia, then insight and enlightenment will begin - “the scales will fall from the eyes” and Tens of millions of Russian citizens will learn that no one has ever threatened it, no one has ever attacked it, no one has ever wanted to destroy it. What a great surprise that will be!
                        Let's bring Kamala to power and then...

                        Well, well... If anyone brings her to power, it will be China...
                      12. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 42
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        You were lied to: who told you that "THEY passed easily?!"

                        I just saw it. The strike was quite massive, you hardly had enough long-range SAMs in the launchers to repel such missiles. Besides, some people claim that your missile defense systems were hit, although that may be just fantasy. After all, no one will send nuclear warheads in the first echelon if there aren't too many of them. They will be sent in the second, when the air defense/missile defense is depleted. And judging by this night, they will pass easily if the same number of missiles are used in the salvo.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        I will be very happy when our missiles and beans hit their targets in Iran. The villains will get their comeuppance.

                        Well, you see how much fun you have in store for you. And you still denied us the right to have such fun. We also love to punish sponsors of terrorism, destroy pirate islands and wet-clean continents.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        is doing a disservice by handing over missiles to Ukraine and allowing it to strike targets on Russian territory! So Iran, handing over missiles to Hezbollah, is the same "disgusting Englishwoman"!
                        Or do you have two measures??

                        Ahura Mazda forbid - there is only one measure and the right to revenge is sacred. We will take revenge.
                      13. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 45
                        Well, why keep on "pouring from empty to empty"? The not-so-distant future will dot the "i's". Or the "yo's"... lol
                      14. 0
                        2 October 2024 17: 43
                        And so it is with you, from empty to empty. lol So why weren't Scholz and the English king killed? lol Biden was pitied. laughing
                        In the USA and even England, no matter who rules the states (nominally), nothing changes. We need to solve the Question, and not play with the Narodnaya Volya and Mercader.
                      15. 0
                        2 October 2024 17: 47
                        Then why weren't Scholz and the English king killed?

                        WHAT FOR?!
                        lol Biden was pitied. laughing

                        And why this one? He's barely alive...
                        There the government is collegial and the death of the president or king has no effect on anything.
                        In the USA and even England, no matter who rules the states (nominally), nothing changes.

                        What am I talking about?!
                        We need to solve the Question, and not play with the Narodnaya Volya and Mercader.

                        WHAT is the question and HOW to solve it??
                      16. 0
                        2 October 2024 19: 09
                        You have your questions, we have ours. Everyone understands and solves their questions in their own way.
                        According to the laws of time.
                      17. 0
                        1 October 2024 22: 36
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        A-50:
                        The Vega-M radar was developed by MNIIP, Moscow, and is manufactured by NPO Vega. The Vega-M can simultaneously track up to 150 targets within a radius of 230 kilometers. Large targets, such as surface ships, can be tracked at a distance of up to 400 kilometers.

                        Strelkin! Strelkin!! What A-50?? The A-50 began to enter service with the USSR Air Force in the 80s, my classmates served on them, they have long since retired. They (A-50) have not been in service for a long time - they have all been or are being upgraded to the A-50U, which takes a target with an RCS of 1 m2 at a range of about 450 km. And a target with an RCS of 10 m2 or more at a range of up to 650 km.
                        The A-100 can capture a target with an RCS of 1 m2 at a range of 600–650 km.
                        A target with an RCS of over 10 m2 at a range of up to 850 km, but for this the target must be at an altitude of at least 12-15 km, and the AWACS aircraft at an altitude of 10 m.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        The modernized AWACS (from memory) takes a target with an RCS of 1 m² at a range of 415 km.

                        That's why I write that in terms of detection range, the A-50U is at least equivalent to the modernized AWACS. And the new A-100 is very significantly superior to it.
                        Why does he need such power and sensitivity?
                        So for "stealth" - to see better. And cruise missiles in WWI to see from afar.
                        But the original A-50 was weaker than the first versions of AWACS.
                        And why are you still stirring up trouble and cheating? This is not good, even for a relocatee who is a repatriate.
                      18. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 51
                        The A-100 can capture a target with an RCS of 1 m2 at a range of 600–650 km.

                        This isn't even fantasy. This is
                        "the ravings of a grey mare on a moonlit night"
                        . Only the most powerful radars of the Aegis system with a capacity of 58 megawatt!! wassat laughing
                        For example (I have already given it):
                        https://mostlymissiledefense.com/2012/08/03/ballistic-missile-defense-the-aegis-spy-1-radar-august-3-2012/

                        detection range

                        The only public numerical figure on Aegis detection range against a specific target (that I have seen) is that the SPY-1D “can track golf ball-sized targets at ranges in excess of 165 kilometers.” A golf ball-size (1.68 inches diameter) sphere corresponds to radar cross section of about 0.0025 m² at 3.3 GHz. This statement was made in the context of the soon-to-be deployed SPY-1D(V) radar to detect mortar and artillery shell and small-caliber rockets against a clutter background, so presumably it applies to the D(V) version. Scaling to a radar cross section more typical of a ballistic missile warhead (0.03 m² at 3.3 GHz) gives a range of at least 310 km.

                        The only public figure I've seen for Aegis's detection range on a specific target is that the SPY-1D "can track golf ball-sized targets at ranges greater than 165 miles." A golf ball-sized sphere (4.27 centimeters in diameter) corresponds to a radar cross section of about 0,0025 square meters at 3,3 GHz. This claim was made in the context of the SPY-1D(V)'s imminent deployment to detect mortar, artillery, and small-caliber rockets against jamming, so it presumably refers to the D(V) version. Scaling to a radar cross section more typical of a ballistic missile warhead (0,03 square meters at 3,3 GHz) yields a range of at least 310 miles.
                        ...........................................
                        This is this terrible, horrible radar, weighing many tens of tons is capable of seeing a target with an RCS of 1 m² at a range of ~738 km - 745 km. The A-100 aircraft radar cannot do anything like that...
                        Why are you so lazy before declaring something, just click once in any search engine?! It takes a couple of seconds! And don't "talk nonsense" to the masses...
                        https://www.belvpo.com/%D0%BF%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BC%D1%8C%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B0-%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BE%D0%B3%D0%BE-%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BE%D0%BB%D0%B5%D1%82%D0%B0-%D0%B4%D1%80%D0%BB%D0%BE%D0%B8%D1%83-%D0%B0-100-%D0%BF/#:~:text=%D0%90%2D100%20%D0%BF%D0%BE%D0%BB%D1%83%D1%87%D0%B8%D0%BB%20%D0%BF%D0%B5%D1%80%D1%81%D0%BF%D0%B5%D0%BA%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9%20%D0%B2%D1%8B%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%8D%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B5%D1%82%D0%B8%D1%87%D0%B5%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9,%D0%BA%D0%BC%2C%200%2C01%20%D0%BA%D0%B2.
                        The A-100 received a promising high-energy radar complex based on a phased antenna array of the S-band with a capacity of up to 300 simultaneously tracked targets. The detection range for targets with an effective reflective surface of 0,1 sq. m is 200 km, 3 sq. m is 550 km, 0,01 sq. m is 110 km.
                      19. 0
                        2 October 2024 06: 46
                        The A-100 is currently undergoing testing and so far only the declared and estimated characteristics are known. I referred to the former, you to the latter. But even according to the parameters you provided, the A-100 is noticeably superior to the modernized AWACS. And the A-50U is approximately equal to it. In our case, the number of such aircraft is important.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        This terrible horrible radar, weighing many tens of tons, is capable of seeing a target with an RCS of 1 m² at a range of ~738 km - 745 km. The A-100 aircraft radar cannot do anything like that...

                        Well, how can an AWACS aircraft compete with the AEGIS? But the S-500 SAM radar produces approximately the same parameters, but it is noticeably lighter. Although perhaps you were talking about the weight of all four canvases.
                      20. 0
                        2 October 2024 06: 57
                        The A-100 is currently undergoing testing and so far only the declared and estimated characteristics are known. I referred to the former, you to the latter. But even according to the parameters you provided, the A-100 is noticeably superior to the modernized AWACS.

                        The detection range for targets with an effective reflective surface of 0,1 sq. m is 200 km, 3 sq. m is 550 km, 0,01 sq. m is 110 km.

                        This means that it should detect a target with an RCS of 1 sq. m at a range of 550:√√3 = 418 km. The modernized AWACS sees the same target at 415 km. BUT! There is a nuance: in the USA the probability of detection for all radars/on-board radars is accepted 0.86, and in Russia 0.5. lol
                      21. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 52
                        No need for these antics, different figures were named, and the complex is being tested. There is no need to stretch an owl onto the globe of Israel. For us now it is more important to increase the number of these aircraft. And their characteristics fully correspond to both the customer's requirements and the level of the opponent.
                        Did you find it funny last night?? That your air defense/missile defense missed so many targets? The "probability of detection" thing is complete nonsense. Or is it just your nerves?
                      22. 0
                        2 October 2024 08: 16
                        Did you find it funny last night??

                        I wasn't scared. Moreover: I am glad that Ayatollah Khamenei decided to launch this missile strike on Israel - he has finally "untied the hands" of our leadership.
                        Why did your air defense/missile defense miss so many targets?

                        Oversaturation of missile defense. This is natural.
                        The "probability of detection" thing is complete nonsense.

                        This is not "nonsense". This is another "medical fact" that you simply do not know.
                        Or is it just your nerves?

                        I am absolutely calm. Completely. I repeat: I am glad that the Ayatollah foolishly decided to take this step. This is already the second missile attack on Israel from Iran, the first was in April.
                      23. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 18
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        I am glad that the Ayatollah foolishly decided to take this step.

                        I'm glad that you're happy, now you'll have something to do.
                      24. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 22
                        Nobody doubts it! There is a lot of work to do...
                      25. 0
                        1 October 2024 16: 36
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        , there seems to be no antenna in the tail - how is coverage in a 360 degree sector ensured??

                        Under the tail fairing, the same canvas as the side-view canvas. This arrangement of the radar canvases has been talked about and written about since the very moment the appearance of the T-50 became known. The rear-view radar canvas (rear hemisphere) on the experimental Su-34 was similarly placed; I don’t know whether they are installed on serial Su-34s.
                        I don’t know who drew and published your picture. They could have simplified and made cheaper the design and composition of the BRLK, of course, or they could have simply not focused on it.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "stupid" Anglo-Saxons, frogs, macaroni and other liberal rabble categorically refused to go down this path!! "Well, you're stu-pi-p!"

                        They are simply small and poor, they build light fighters in limited series, the USA will not allow wide export - they stretch their limbs according to their clothes, they do not overcomplicate the designs. Although I read that on their promising aircraft (where France is with Germany, and England with Italy) they still want to make an AFAR canvas with the ability to turn. It's just that when the "Irbis" appeared it was too late for them to rush around, but on the next ones they want exactly this kind of canvas turn.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "Well, you're so dumb!"

                        We just saw an interesting solution to expand the viewing area and wanted the same one for ourselves.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And although the Irbis is a PFAR, it is very powerful.

                        No more powerful than the F-22 radar.

                        At least equivalent in detection range. But the Su-35SM is already equipped with the "Belka".
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Does the Pentagon know this?

                        Everyone knows this.
                        Eh Belkin-Strelkin, traitor to the Motherland. But with what aplomb.
                      26. 0
                        1 October 2024 17: 00
                        Eh Belkin-Strelkin, traitor to the Motherland. But with what aplomb.

                        I'm just trying to tell the ultra-patriotic ignoramuses and laymen that "Kyiv can be taken in three days" with their ideas about truth — it doesn't work. It only works out "Avdiivka in two years".
                        If you continue to "puff out your cheeks" and talk nonsense about the military aviation, it will get much worse.
                      27. 0
                        1 October 2024 20: 12
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "take Kyiv in three days"

                        This slogan was spread by Anglo-Saxon propaganda. There was not a single official statement/promise about such terms.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        It only turns out "Avdiivka in two years".

                        It was not possible to force Kyiv to peace in the spring of 2022, the strategy changed - a war of attrition and the deployment of a Large Army. Which is what is happening.
                        As a result, everything is increasing and increasing for us, and for used and 50+ - decreasing and decreasing. In my opinion, the dynamics are not bad.
                        While the former is in agony, and NATO+ is exhausting its resources (both weapons, financial, industrial, emotional), the Russian Federation is increasing the number of its armed forces, arsenals, completing the rearmament of its strategic nuclear forces, restarting the economy, resolving issues of import substitution, building new alliances and coalitions.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "puff out your cheeks" and about military aviation

                        We are talking about specific models, which are only forming the first regiments. In order to feel confident, the VKS needs to at least double the number of combat aircraft, and in order to equalize potentials with reliance on ground-based air defense and hypersonic strike systems, it needs to be tripled. Therefore, the production of combat aircraft is increasing, air regiments are being rearmed and new ones are being formed/restored.
                        So no one is striving for high rates of SVO; it now plays a slightly different role.
                        By the end of this year, we will have about 44 Su-57s in service. By the end of next year, 70-76 units. This qualitatively strengthens the Aerospace Forces, so what's the rush? After all, the number of Su-35S\SM, Su-30SM2, Su-34M and even MiG-31s ​​from modernization annually replenish the ranks of the Aerospace Forces by 20-30 machines of each type (with the MiG-31, I think, more modestly, but the industry produced 10 of them from modernization, and one year even 20 units per year). We have good dynamics.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        it will still be much worse.

                        It will be. But we are preparing for it.
                        We are not "puffing out our cheeks", but are rearming the strategic nuclear forces, developing and deploying a fleet of IRBMs and other types of RBMs, increasing the range of SRBMs to 1000 km, so that there is enough for everyone in need. We are introducing new and modernized submarines into service.
                        But to disperse about the "invincible and terrible Raptor", which our Su-35S intercepted in Syria with the help of OLS, going on its tail and approaching at a distance "close", which the vaunted lizard noticed only when "close" ... these are they - the CHEEKS.
                        They may even burst from the strain.
                      28. -1
                        1 October 2024 20: 22
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "take Kyiv in three days"

                        This slogan was spread by Anglo-Saxon propaganda. There was not a single official statement/promise about such terms.

                        ALL THE HOSTS OF THE CENTRAL RUSSIAN TV CHANNELS. Solovyov and Simonyan — Anglo-Saxons?! They couldn't have said anything like that without the knowledge and orders "from above", "they wouldn't have the heart to do it". ONLY WITH THE KNOWLEDGE.
                      29. 0
                        1 October 2024 20: 25
                        By the end of this year, we will have about 44 Su-57s in service. By the end of next year, 70-76 units. This qualitatively strengthens the Aerospace Forces, so what's the rush? After all, the number of Su-35S\SM, Su-30SM2, Su-34M and even MiG-31s ​​from modernization annually replenish the ranks of the Aerospace Forces by 20-30 machines of each type (with the MiG-31, I think, more modestly, but the industry produced 10 of them from modernization, and one year even 20 units per year). We have good dynamics.

                        And when (in your opinion) Russia in this situation will be ready for a full-scale conventional war with NATO? wink
                      30. 0
                        1 October 2024 22: 02
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And when (in your opinion) will Russia, in this situation, be ready for a full-scale conventional war with NATO?

                        War with NATO will ONLY be total and nuclear. This has been in the doctrine of the Russian Federation since its very foundation. That is why the Ground Forces, Aerospace Forces and Navy were so neglected, but the Strategic Nuclear Forces were constantly receiving new missiles and nuclear warheads of the new generation, early warning systems and all the necessary supplies and equipment, and were very well financed. It was precisely for a conventional war that the Russian Armed Forces were not prepared to the proper extent.
                        Only a total thermonuclear war with maximum damage to the enemy. Because even our human resources are incomparable.
                      31. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 31
                        War with NATO will ONLY be total and nuclear. This has been in the Russian Federation doctrine since its very foundation.

                        There was nothing like that in the Russian Federation doctrine. It said: "IN THE CASE OF AN ATTACK EVEN BY NON-NUCLEAR MEANS, WHEN THERE IS A THREAT TO THE EXISTENCE OF RUSSIA."
                        This is why the Ground Forces, Aerospace Forces and Navy were so neglected.

                        No, They were so neglected because everything there had been stolen.
                        Only a total thermonuclear war with maximum damage to the enemy. Because even our human resources are incomparable.

                        And when, in your opinion, should it begin?? The goals of the SVO on the "demilitarization and denazification of Ukraine" have failed, not been achieved. When will you, Colonel General bayard Are you planning to start a "total thermonuclear war with maximum damage to the enemy"?! wink laughing
                        However, the Kremlin does not agree with you... lol
                      32. 0
                        2 October 2024 06: 21
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        When you, Colonel General Bayard, are going to start a "total thermonuclear war

                        It’s not entirely clear what kind of “howl” and who I’m “bending”, but it’s not up to me to make the decision, I’m not even a marshal. laughing
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        The Kremlin does not agree with you...

                        Why? Quite often I agree.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        The goals of the SVO on the "demilitarization and denazification of Ukraine" have failed and are not achieved.

                        So the SVO is not finished, the goals are consistently achieved, denazification continues. In less than 3 years of the SVO, 7 newest SSNs have entered service, including 3 SSBNs "Borey-A", several SSNs have returned to service after modernization. The number of the RF Armed Forces is growing, and without any mobilizations, in the SVO zone we have had numerical parity with the Armed Forces of Ukraine (our group and the Armed Forces of Ukraine) since the beginning of this year, the military-industrial complex is picking up speed, ammunition production is breaking records and not only replenishing the expenditure, but also allowing to replenish arsenals, missiles are not running out, UAV production is growing, and next year it will grow by another 5 times. Where are we rushing?
                        And we can squash the entire collective West with one strong-willed decision - there are ENOUGH means for this. So if they continue to insist - our hand will not tremble.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        No, they were so neglected because everything there had been stolen.

                        So you stole it. lol And they relocated. winked
                        And it was not about mobilization reserves and arsenals, but about the fact that the number of the Ground Forces of the RF Armed Forces at the beginning of the Central Military District was "as much as" 270 thousand "bayonets and feathers", because this is together with the rear, staff, clerks, dog handlers... A terrible army. For the whole of the Endless.
                        And now the Air Force has more than a million. And the number of Airborne Forces has grown significantly. And the number of Marine Corps of the Navy. And the Russian National Guard has doubled. And even something like Border Troops has appeared.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There was nothing like this in the Russian Federation doctrine.

                        The Doctrine contained what they considered necessary. And the attitude was that no one would dare to attack a nuclear superpower. And if NATO dared, then the war would only be nuclear. Therefore, the other branches of the armed forces were neglected and represented symbolically (for our scale). Money was again saved. And now look how it is - a Big Army is needed, and the Navy turned out to be necessary, and the Air Force (as part of the Aerospace Forces) has to be built up. Now the conversation will only be from a position of Strength. Otherwise, the perverts no longer understand.
                        And we have something to say.
                      33. 0
                        2 October 2024 06: 29
                        And we have something to say.

                        May you all be healthy! smile
                        And, of course, no one will dare to attack a nuclear power - except for the reckless Ukrainians... lol Who weren't even afraid of tactical nuclear weapons, not to mention those cowardly Naglo-Saxons! wassat
                        ...................
                        By the way: There is no need to put a space after words before punctuation marks. Punctuation marks are placed IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE WORD.
                      34. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 36
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        No one will dare to attack a nuclear power - except for the reckless Ukrainians...

                        Well, there is a reckless government on strings and pre-trained/educated thugs on payroll. But the people were quite peaceful, they got carried away.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        not like those cowardly impudent Saxons!

                        These are also frostbitten, and there is only one way to calm a mad dog. But they could live...
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There is no need to put a space after words before punctuation marks.

                        It's already a habit.
                      35. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 39
                        It's already a habit.

                        So give it up. So a literate (in all respects) person?
                        Nobody writes like that...
                      36. 0
                        1 October 2024 20: 28
                        But to disperse about the "invincible and terrible Raptor", which our Su-35S intercepted in Syria with the help of OLS, going on its tail and approaching at a distance "close", which the vaunted lizard noticed only when "close" ... these are they - the CHEEKS.
                        They may even burst from the strain.

                        I repeat: The F-22 fleet is capable of destroying all Russian fighters in a single battle - without any losses on its side. (although it is clear that no one will put up a "wall to wall")...
                      37. 0
                        1 October 2024 22: 07
                        And the Russian Armed Forces need only a few low- or medium-power nuclear warheads to destroy the entire F-22 fleet - according to the number of airfields where they are based. And it will be exactly as I said, and not as you came up with.
                        The US currently has about one hundred and fifty Raptors in service (left), soon (in a few years) we will have the same number of Su-57s, then we will be able to go head to head. But this will not help the Raptors.
                      38. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 35
                        And the Russian Armed Forces need only a few low- or medium-power nuclear warheads to destroy the entire F-22 fleet - according to the number of airfields where they are based. And it will be exactly as I said, and not as you came up with.

                        There are 10 F-22 squadrons stationed in ten locations around the world.
                        The US currently has about one hundred and fifty Raptors in service (remaining)

                        Actually, 186.
                        soon (in a few years) we will have the same number of Su-57s, then we will be able to go wall to wall. But this will not help the Raptors.

                        How many times do I have to repeat it: in a duel, the Su-57 loses to the F-22 with a "dry" score, no matter how many battles there are. It simply can't do anything against it. ZERO. According to the initial performance characteristics.
                      39. 0
                        2 October 2024 06: 28
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There are 10 F-22 squadrons stationed in ten locations around the world.

                        Well, 10 YBP, what's the big deal? lol
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Actually, 186.

                        An outdated figure, a hurricane recently broke them, the roof of a large hangar fell on them. There were about 20 units to be written off. Well, and in general, there are currently 30 to 50% of those not ready for combat. Especially if in a few years.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        How many times do I have to repeat it: in a duel, the Su-57 loses to the F-22 with a "dry" score, no matter how many battles there are. It simply can't do anything against it. ZERO. According to the initial performance characteristics.

                        This is simply a LIE of a relocate in the status of a repatriate. You are simply biased and prejudiced. However, practice will show if it comes to that.
                      40. 0
                        2 October 2024 06: 31
                        No, sir, that's an opinion. Specialist against opinion amateur...
                        You have to trust the experts! wink
                      41. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 37
                        I trust only proven specialists. And facts.
                      42. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 45
                        I trust only proven specialists.

                        to domestic propagandists?
                        And the facts.

                        But you don’t believe the facts from 20 years of exercises, including international ones, with the participation of the F-22... lol
                      43. 0
                        1 October 2024 21: 55
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        ALL THE HOSTS OF THE CENTRAL RUSSIAN TV CHANNELS. Solovyov and Simonyan are Anglo-Saxons?!

                        Just don't lie. The only thing they said was to voice the statements of the WESTERN press about "three days to take Kyiv". Lying like that is some kind of... BOTTOM.
                      44. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 24
                        I saw these statements by Simonyan, Solovyov, and Father Lukashenko - None of them ever said, "I am referring to Western media data." And these videos are shown on the Internet day and night, one click - and you can listen to them for two hours... You are lying in a strange way, because all this can be checked in two or three seconds by anyone who wants to...
                      45. 0
                        2 October 2024 05: 14
                        I remember what they talked about and wrote about back then - they were sucking on the forecasts of "Western experts". Some of the regular talkers may have thrown their hats, but most were more reserved and realistic in terms of timeframes. But even those who were spouting off-the-cuff nonsense - were spouting off-the-cuff nonsense. Not a single official or on behalf of such an official has ever claimed anything like that.
                        Although the operation was conceived precisely as a rapid coercion of Kyiv to peace on our terms - cessation of shelling of LPR and DPR cities, recognition of the independence of the Donbass republics and non-aligned neutral status. Excellent conditions, but the clown was ordered to kill his country in a hopeless war.
                        Therefore, the strategy of the Russian Federation has changed. With such a massive involvement of NATO in the conflict, the optimal mode and sequence of actions have been chosen.
                        Resolve the issue on the battlefield?
                        We will decide. But at the pace and mode that we choose ourselves.
                        War of attrition??
                        We will deplete not only the Ukrainian Armed Forces, but also all NATO arsenals and budgets.
                        Have you formed a coalition against us?
                        We will create our own coalition, but then don’t be offended.
                        Are you (USA, England, etc.) arming the Ukrainian Armed Forces?
                        We will arm your enemies and see who will pay the price.
                        Are you officially preparing for nuclear war?
                        We are removing all restrictions on the use of nuclear weapons - complete freedom of choice of targets, time and scale of use.
                        Escalation?
                        Solely for the purposes of de-escalation and for your own safety.
                        START?
                        No one (us!) needs him anymore, only the interests of our own safety.
                        Who first if anything?
                        Of course, in England, and totally and finally.
                      46. 0
                        2 October 2024 05: 25
                        I think that in the next year (maximum - one and a half) all this will end to everyone's satisfaction. Without a thermonuclear strike on London, Washington and Moscow.
                        DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT AS A RESULT OF SUCH BLOWS ONLY BEIJING WILL BE A WINNER, BUT NOT MOSCOW OR WASHINGTON? winked
                        And then historians will analyze "CAUSES AND EFFECTS" for many hundreds of years...
                      47. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 24
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        I think that in the next year (maximum - one and a half) all this will end to everyone's satisfaction. Without a thermonuclear strike on London, Washington and Moscow.

                        If Harris wins in the US, the escalation will continue. And England will finish off Israel - it (the City) is in the way with its existence. A turn for the better (de-escalation and reaching some kind of agreement) is only possible if Trump comes to power. But who will allow him to come to power?
                        Although Trump would be a salvation for Israel too - he is a supporter of preserving your state.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT AS A RESULT OF SUCH BLOWS ONLY BEIJING WILL BE A WINNER, BUT NOT MOSCOW OR WASHINGTON?

                        It's too bad that the US doesn't understand this (there's simply no one there now). London is playing its game with the frenzy of a maniac. Do you think the Kremlin was so eager for an alliance with China? But London and its proxies in the US administration did everything to set Russia against the US, to force it to get closer to China and thus strengthen China - against the US.
                        Why did London start all this?
                        The degeneration of the elites and the phantom pains of the former empire... whose foreign minister is black, the recent prime minister is Indian, the mayor is Pakistani, and the police beat up locals to protect the atrocities of Arabs and other foreigners. A state in the phase of self-destruction, which is dragging the rest of the world down with it.
                        Want to join?
                      48. 0
                        2 October 2024 07: 37
                        Well, here we go again, "the Englishwoman is messing up"! lol How old is this slogan, 100? 150? 200? lol And you are still worried about the poor Naglo-Saxons, how they might genetically degenerate due to the dominance of Indo-Pakistanis! laughing
                        Okay, thanks, you made me laugh - you can't take this in large doses... And it's all off-topic. If you have anything about aviation - I'm always happy to tell you everything I know. That you don't believe it and demand verification in the next war... Maybe better not? wink winked WHAT IF I'M RIGHT AND NOT YOU? What if the F-22 really is superior in combat effectiveness to the Su-35 and Su-57 by not one and a half to two times (according to Andrey from Chelyabinsk), and 150-200 times, as I claim? wink AND WHAT WILL HAPPEN THEN?? what Horror-horror!! crying
                      49. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 13
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Well, here we go again, "the Englishwoman is messing up"!

                        Well, why an Englishwoman right away?? There's some kind of... king there now... Maybe he's shitting, but I don't know - in the chamber pot, or running all the way to the toilet. request
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And you are still worried about the poor Naglo-Saxons, how they might genetically degenerate due to the dominance of Indo-Pakistanis!

                        On the contrary!! I am incredibly happy about this! They now have their own - quiet domestic happiness... No, well, a black man at the head of the British Foreign Office, that's just fellow awesome. They still need to bring a pygmy from Africa and appoint him as Minister of Finance. Yes
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        You don't believe in this and demand verification in the next war... Maybe it's better not to?

                        We must! We definitely must!!
                        Otherwise the truth cannot be obtained. angry
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        WHAT IF I'M RIGHT AND NOT YOU??

                        So we'll check. Yes Experiment is the basis of the scientific approach, and we are for a purely scientific approach.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        AND WHAT WILL HAPPEN THEN??

                        HAPPINESS ! fellow
                        Universal and inevitable HAPPINESS!! Yes
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Horror-horror!!

                        Well, you are climbing on the horn for HAPPINESS? You are ready to bomb peaceful Iranians. What if they get upset? Of course, they don't have nuclear weapons, but they assure that if necessary, they will definitely use them.
                        But you're not afraid, are you?
                        What kind of "horror-horror" is this?
                        This is HAPPINESS!
                        Here we are - for universal and unconditional HAPPINESS.
                        It (HAPPINESS) is so pleasant to bring to the enlightened West - as a tribute for all its good deeds.
                      50. 0
                        2 October 2024 09: 21
                        Once again: in the event of a nuclear missile war between Russia and the United States, Russia will become China's prey, with all its contents, and the United States will fall into insignificance and turn into a vassal of China.
                        Based on this, it is quite clear that Neither the Kremlin nor Washington are so crazy as to start seriously fighting among themselves to please China.
                        Couch dreamers, watching the mushroom clouds of thermonuclear explosions over US cities in their lukewarm erotic dreams, can dream as much as they want, as they say, "until Lent"... lol
                      51. 0
                        2 October 2024 17: 12
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        In the event of a nuclear missile war between Russia and the United States, Russia will become China's prey, with all its contents, and the United States will fall into insignificance and turn into a vassal of China.

                        Is this how they will transform?
                        Why aren't they afraid?
                        USA?
                        Maybe because they know that it doesn’t take much to get China out of the game?
                        And we know it.
                        And China knows it.
                        Therefore, if it comes to an exchange, China will certainly be taken out of the game.
                        And no one will turn into anyone else.
                        Of course there will be post-apocalyptic chaos, but the side that has retained a decent portion of its potential by that time will be able to restore order. We will retain it simply because we will hardly need our strategic nuclear missile potential to guarantee the destruction of Europe and North America. It will remain for us as insurance and to maintain future order.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There are no such madmen in Washington as to start seriously fighting among themselves to please China.

                        It's strange, no matter how I look, I only see these lol ... exactly like these.
                        So don't talk about China, this fable is as old as the world. China knows about its vulnerability, and those who need to know it know it too.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        watching mushroom clouds of thermonuclear explosions over US cities,

                        There won't be any mushrooms. More likely, they will be a little later and as insurance/pre-shooting phenomena. The problem needs to be solved, not complicated.
                      52. 0
                        2 October 2024 17: 25
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        In the event of a nuclear missile war between Russia and the United States, Russia will become China's prey, with all its contents, and the United States will fall into insignificance and turn into a vassal of China.

                        Is this how they will transform?

                        Of course.
                        Why aren't they afraid?
                        USA?

                        How can they not be afraid?! They are very afraid.
                        Maybe because they know that it doesn’t take much to get China out of the game?
                        And we know it.
                        And China knows it.
                        Therefore, if it comes to an exchange, China will certainly be taken out of the game.

                        And who said what will happen? Shoigu, or Gerasimov?! lol
                        And no one will turn into anyone else.

                        That is: a blow to Washington - and a simultaneous blow to Beijing?! Does Comrade Xi know about this plan?? wassat Has Patrushev already told him about this?!
                        Of course there will be post-apocalyptic chaos, but the side that has retained a decent portion of its potential by that time will be able to restore order.

                        New York is at the latitude of Batumi. In the US, on average, it is significantly warmer than in Russia and the chances of a significant part of the population to survive there are much greater than in Russia. And the population there is TWICE as large.
                        We will preserve it simply because we will hardly need our strategic nuclear missile potential to guarantee the destruction of Europe and North America.

                        ?? WHAT will you need??
                        It will remain with us for insurance and to maintain future order.

                        Shoigu said? Or Konashenov?
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There are no such madmen in Washington as to start seriously fighting among themselves to please China.

                        It's strange, no matter how I look, I only see these lol... exactly like these.

                        This is an illusion.
                        So don't talk about China, this fable is as old as the world. China knows about its vulnerability, and those who need to know it know it too.

                        What makes him so terribly vulnerable? Especially since he's not going to attack anyone, he'll be in the role "a clever monkey sitting on a hill and watching a fight between two tigers in a valley."
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        watching mushroom clouds of thermonuclear explosions over US cities,

                        There won't be any mushrooms. More likely, they will be a little later and as insurance/pre-shooting phenomena. The problem needs to be solved, not complicated.

                        I don't get it?! So "the whole world will crumble to dust"? That means "MUSHROOMS".
                        Or have you discovered a new type of weapon - torsion fields?? laughing
                      53. 0
                        2 October 2024 18: 54
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        And who said what will happen? Shoigu, or Gerasimov?!

                        No.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        ?? WHAT will you need??

                        What is available, but is not an ICBM.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        That is: a blow to Washington - and a simultaneous blow to Beijing?!

                        No, the US will take care of Beijing, it's their headache, not ours. It won't be a "sly monkey on a tree/hill". They understand, they are preparing.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        I don't get it?! So "the whole world will crumble to dust"? That means "MUSHROOMS".

                        The main thing is not the mushrooms, the main thing is the solution to the problem.
                        And the issue is quite solvable.
                        You are solving your own problems, aren't you?
                        And we decide.
                      54. 0
                        2 October 2024 19: 39
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        I don't get it?! So "the whole world will crumble to dust"? That means "MUSHROOMS".

                        The main thing is not the mushrooms, the main thing is the solution to the problem.
                        And the issue is quite solvable.
                        You are solving your own problems, aren't you?
                        And we decide.

                        Intrigued. wink But I don’t believe in miracles and in wonder-waffles either.
                      55. 0
                        2 October 2024 19: 44
                        Remember how the classic said:
                        Whatever the Rake teaches
                        But the heart believes in Miracles... lol
                        In fact, everything is real.
                        By the way, there will be no new START and our hands are completely free.
                      56. 0
                        2 October 2024 22: 09
                        Yeah, right... "No restrictions"... lol
              2. 0
                1 October 2024 01: 21
                Quote: Strelkin
                8 air-to-air missiles in an F-22, eight! 6 long-range AIM-120D (180 km) plus 2 short-range AIM-9X (30 km). 6+2=8.

                And how did it manage to fit so much? Can you confirm this with a photo or a layout diagram? I've only read about 4+2 missiles when loaded to the maximum, we're not talking about pylons. While the Su-57 can carry 6 R-93Ms + two "Vipers" (RVV SD), or 8 + 2 if only RVV SD. Even the most die-hard US Air Force patriot won't argue that the Su-57 has much larger weapons bays. Just as we're the only ones with RVV BDs that can fit in the internal bays.
                And the F-22 has a very sensitive anti-aircraft missile coating - it easily cracks, and when going supersonic, it can fly off in whole pieces. This is because any damage to such a coating makes the aircraft less visible, and the speed limitation to 1M limits its maneuvering, high-speed dash when approaching or breaking away when leaving under attack. The F-35 has such a coating, but it has other disadvantages - low maximum speed, a round hot nozzle, a large, far-visible torch, especially in afterburner. The OLS will say thank you.

                Quote: Strelkin
                So, in a duel with the Su-22, the F-57 will emerge victorious 10 times out of 10, 20 times out of 20, 50 times out of 50! They are simply incomparable.

                He will be very lucky if the result of such fights can be reduced to 1 to 1. But there are serious prerequisites that he will not succeed. I understand that you are a patriot of this aircraft, but in this case your arguments and self-confidence are simply ridiculous.
                Quote: Strelkin
                All this nonsense (which is not present on any modern fighter in developed countries) greatly increases visibility. On the F-35 it is not even a trace!

                Until recently, these "developed countries" did not have a helmet-mounted target designator for the RVV MD for close combat... and now for some reason they have appeared... Why? If the USSR had them back in the 80s?
                So the absence of "all this nonsense" on fighters of "developed countries" is only to our advantage. This gives us an undeniable qualitative advantage.
                Quote: Strelkin
                I can't retell my biography five times a day...

                Is there something terrible about her? Shameful? Or are you so proud of her?
                So far, from everything I've read from you, all that's visible is the bias and PR of an aircraft developed in the 90s. With a radar developed in the late 80s - early 90s.
                1. 0
                  1 October 2024 06: 56
                  How did it fit so much?

                  So much could fit into its prototype, the YF-22, in 1990! 34 years ago.
                  Can you confirm this with a photo or a layout diagram?

                  There are a million of them!
                  I've only read about 4+2 missiles when loaded to max.

                  This simply cannot be. Any search engine, whether in Russian or English, will instantly give you all the data!
                  , we're not talking about pylons.

                  It goes without saying that we are not talking. We can hang another 8 (eight) AIM-120Ds there!
                  The F-22 also has a very sensitive anti-radiation coating - cracks form easily.

                  This is true, therefore they are constantly seriously checked before each flight and this results in additional operating costs.
                  and the speed limit of 1M limits it in maneuvering, high-speed dash when approaching or breaking away when escaping from an attack

                  ?? You were lied to, THERE IS NO SUCH LIMIT FOR HIM.
                  And when going supersonic, nothing “flies off in pieces”, that’s nonsense... lol
                  He will be very lucky if the result of such fights can be reduced to 1 to 1. But there are serious prerequisites that he will not succeed. I understand that you are a patriot of this aircraft, but in this case your arguments and self-confidence are simply ridiculous.

                  I didn't come up with this, it's the result of HUNDREDS of exercises in the US and DOZENS of MAJOR international exercises involving the F-22.
                  Until recently, these "developed countries" did not have a helmet-mounted target designator for the RVV MD for close combat...

                  You're out of the loop again: he was still on the deck-based Phantom, from the Vietnam War era...
                  Why? If the USSR had them back in the 80s?

                  They appeared in the West a long time ago. They simply didn't think it necessary to equip the F-22 pilot with this, it kills everyone from afar.
                  This gives us an undeniable quality advantage.

                  This is how it seems to you.
                  Quote: Strelkin
                  I can't retell my biography five times a day...

                  Is there something terrible about her? Shameful? Or are you so proud of her?

                  I'm proud of her! smile I gave you a link - take a look, read it, look at the photos of the documents...
                  So far, from everything I've read from you, all that's visible is the bias and PR of an aircraft developed in the 90s. With a radar developed in the late 80s - early 90s.

                  My "commitment" stems from 60 years of studying modern aviation during this time, 26 calendar years of which were professional, during service in the air forces of the USSR/Russia... lol
                  1. 0
                    1 October 2024 15: 46
                    Quote: Strelkin
                    This is the result of HUNDREDS of exercises in the US and DOZENS of MAJOR international exercises involving the F-22.

                    And who did the brave F-22s fight against during these exercises?
                    Exclusively with the 4th generation?
                    And from ours?
                    Su-30MKI and their incarnations?
                    While we are talking about dueling situations with the Su-57 - an aircraft of course of the 5th generation, with a more advanced IRLC, longer-range missiles (1,5-2 times), much better maneuvering capabilities (if suddenly it comes to close combat), with an OLS seeing up to 70-75 km. in the infrared range, with the latest radiation warning system designed to detect and determine the coordinates/vector to the radiation source of a broadband complex combined signal... What is the calculation and what is the source of such boundless confidence?
                    Quote: Strelkin
                    You're not in the know again: he was still on the deck of the Phantom.

                    And how successful? Experiments don't count. Since the early 80s, we've had such target designators on our helmets - standard equipment.
                    Quote: Strelkin
                    They appeared in the West a long time ago.

                    Yeah, having tumbled around in training battles with the Warsaw export MiG-29s. And having seen what an advantage this gives in close combat.
                    Quote: Strelkin
                    My "commitment" stems from 60 years of studying modern aviation during this time, 26 calendar years of which were professional, during service in the air forces of the USSR/Russia...

                    Relocated to the "historical homeland"?
                    The bias is obvious and does not add credibility to your opinion. The Su-57 was created specifically to fight and outperform the Raptor. The radar has an undeniable advantage both in the detection range of low-visibility targets and in the all-round view (360 degrees), and also in the ability to covertly conduct long-range reconnaissance with a wideband AESA "DM" radar canvas in the leading edges of the wings. In such a range, the target is better visible at long distances, and the range itself is not typical for fighter radars and can easily be mistaken for a signal from a remote ground-based radar, or for a telecommunications signal. This is where the possibility of true covert detection at a long distance lies. And having a BB RVV with a range of 300+ km. ... well, you get the idea.
                    Reliance on the AWACS aircraft?
                    But the A-50U is in no way inferior to the modernized AWACS, not at all. But the A-100 is seriously superior. If the former is capable of seeing a large target at a distance of up to 650 km, then the A-100 will see the same target (if it is high-altitude) at a distance of 850 km. AWACS cannot do this. And we already have a second A-100 entering testing and the tests are going well. In the meantime, the rate of production of the A-50U (now also from scratch) has increased 4-6 times compared to the pre-war rate. So we are replenishing. And under equal conditions, the "Raptor" will have little chance. They will be ... but this will most likely depend on the quality of the pilot and luck, without which you can't get anywhere in combat.
                    1. 0
                      1 October 2024 16: 53
                      And who did the brave F-22s fight against during these exercises?
                      Exclusively with the 4th generation?

                      Of course. There was nothing else: F-15, F-16, F-18, Rafale, Eurofighter, Gripen. All the best 4th generation aircraft in the world.
                      And from ours?
                      Su-30MKI and their incarnations?

                      I don't remember seeing anything about "F-22 vs. Su-30MKI". But what's the point if F-22 has fought F-15C and F-15E dozens of times? They are roughly the same "cut" and size as Su-30MKI. And the radars are similar in characteristics.
                      While we are talking about dueling situations with the Su-57 - an aircraft of the 5th generation, of course

                      An aircraft with a frontal RCS of 0.1 m² (at best!) cannot be considered a 5th generation aircraft.
                      That is why the Hindus disowned him.
                      ...with a more advanced IRLC, longer-range missiles (1,5-2 times longer), much better maneuverability (if it suddenly comes to close combat), with an OLS that can see up to 70-75 km in the infrared range, with the latest radiation warning system designed to detect and determine the coordinates/vector to the radiation source of a broadband complex combined signal...

                      Why did the Indians give up on it, having invested more than 280 million dollars in its R&D?? No one will return their money.
                      What is the calculation and what is the source of such boundless confidence?

                      Because the Indians, who were told all the nuances of its performance characteristics, rejected it.. After they were told all the nuances of its performance characteristics. Instead, they started buying Rafales, then setting up production of Rafales...
                      Quote: Strelkin
                      You're not in the know again: he was still on the deck of the Phantom.

                      And how successful? Experiments don't count. Since the early 80s, we've had such target designators on our helmets - standard equipment.

                      More than successfully.
                      Quote: Strelkin
                      My "commitment" stems from 60 years of studying modern aviation during this time, 26 calendar years of which were professional, during service in the air forces of the USSR/Russia...

                      Relocated to the "historical homeland"?

                      Repatriate, that's what it's called.
                      The bias is obvious and does not add credibility to your opinion.

                      I am talking about something that I have been thoughtfully studying for many years. You can't force anyone to believe you by the ears... If you don't want to, don't believe it!
                      The Su-57 was created specifically to combat and outperform the Raptor.

                      Su-57 to "Raptor" - "like a drunk man crawling 7000 kilometers to Beijing on all fours." That's why everyone in the world needed the Raptor, but no one needed the Su-57. WHERE IS THE QUEUE FOR HIM?? WHERE IS IT?!
                      The radar complex has an undeniable advantage both in the detection range of low-visibility targets and in the all-round view (360 degrees), and also in the possibility of covert long-range reconnaissance with a wide-band AFAR "DM" radar canvas in the leading edges of the wings. In such a range, the target is better visible at long distances, and the range itself is not typical for fighter radar complexes and can easily be mistaken for a signal from a remote ground-based radar, or for a telecommunications signal. This is where the possibility of true covert detection at a long distance lies. And having a RVV BD with a range of 300+ km. ... well, you get the idea.

                      Once again: WHERE IS THE QUEUE FOR HIM?? WHERE IS IT?! WHY IS IT NOT THERE??
                      Reliance on the AWACS aircraft?

                      Who? The F-22 is the eyes of AWACS today. Today, AWACS itself cannot get close to the thick of the battle - it would be shot down in no time, so it uses information that the F-22 provides it with.
                      But the A-50U is in no way inferior to the modernized AWACS.

                      Not true.
                      But the A-100 is seriously superior.

                      Completely untrue.
                      And under equal conditions, the Raptor will have little chance.

                      There will never be a level playing field. And in the West today no one takes seriously Russian aircraft, Russian electronics, Russian radars, Russian missiles. The main competitor of the USA is China and its aviation and its missile technology. NOT RUSSIAN...
                      1. 0
                        1 October 2024 21: 40
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There will never be a level playing field.

                        What if it happens?
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Nobody takes Russian aircraft, Russian electronics, Russian radars, Russian missiles seriously today.

                        This would be very beneficial for us, but it is not so.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        The main competitor of the USA is China and its aviation and its missile technology. NOT RUSSIAN...

                        This is in a geopolitical sense, not in a technical sense. In technical terms, the Chinese Air Force is not on par with the VKS, although they are trying. Especially in engines.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There was nothing else: F-15, F-16, F-18, Rafale, Eurofighter, Gripen.

                        That is, never with an equal opponent. lol There is little honor in such victories if there is already a stronger opponent.
                        Well, at least with another Raptor or, at worst, with an F-35. lol After all, during the training of combat with aircraft of the previous generation, something appropriate was selected for the role.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        An aircraft with a frontal RCS of 0.1 m² (at best!) cannot be considered a 5th generation aircraft.

                        Many years have passed since then, we have a new coating, and the fabulous data about the Raptor's EPR have been dispelled. Especially if it has a rusty, cracked or damaged coating.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Why did the Indians give it the boot after investing over $280 million in its R&D?

                        And how much SHOULD they have invested? They missed several payments and were counting on getting the plane for free. In addition, they asked for a two-seater fighter and immediately, we suggested that we first develop a single-seater and only then work on a twin-seater.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        The Indians, who were told all the nuances of its performance characteristics, rejected it.

                        With the same coating.
                        And you seriously think that 0,1 m2 is not the fifth generation? Seriously? And what about the F-35 with its 0,1-0,3 m2? lol Especially considering the Su-57's "DM" search radar? Well, really, there's no point in stooping so low.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        Instead, they started buying Rafales, then setting up their own production of Rafales...

                        Did they fix it? Or did they trick the Indians, catching them on the hook of corruption? The Rafale is just a technical analogue of the MiG-35 with elements of the avionics from the Su-57. Not one iota "stealth".
                        The Indians simply dream of becoming the "world's factory" instead of China, so they maneuver... And they bite their elbows until they bleed, that they have abandoned the Su-57, they dream of returning. Because they simply have nothing to put up against the new Chinese aircraft. lol Well, it's not a Rafale. laughing
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        WHERE IS THE QUEUE FOR HIM?? WHERE IS IT?!

                        In general, it exists, but until our own VKS are saturated, there can be no talk of export. But there are definitely customers for it. But they won't advertise themselves, why would they want trouble from the US and Co.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "Raptor" was needed by everyone in the world,

                        Who else operates the Raptor? laughing Who bought it?
                        And why COULDN'T they do this?
                        And for some reason the US bought a very limited series for itself? After all, they wanted to buy about 1000 units? So what is the secret of such a commercial failure of this aircraft?
                        Why is the US so afraid to demonstrate its TRUE capabilities. At least to its closest allies - Israel, for example?
                        Not a single plane has been sold, the development has not paid for itself, and the question of removing them from service and writing them off is constantly being raised... Why? This does not happen with successful machines.
                        The US has always overstated the characteristics of its aircraft, sometimes VERY much. It is enough to remember the F-111.
                        Aren't you ashamed to promote such a commercially UNSUCCESSFUL aircraft, which in 20 years you have not managed to sell to a SINGLE buyer?

                        You are being bombed now, I sympathize.
                      2. 0
                        2 October 2024 03: 36
                        This is in a geopolitical sense, not in a technical sense. In technical terms, the Chinese Air Force is not on par with the VKS, although they are trying to.

                        The Chinese Air Force has long since surpassed the Russian Aerospace Forces in all respects.
                        Especially in engines.

                        Today — this is more than a controversial issue, especially considering that the WS-15 production plant has been operating for two years now. It's time to get rid of the decades-old stereotypes.
                      3. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 05
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        There was nothing else: F-15, F-16, F-18, Rafale, Eurofighter, Gripen.

                        That is, never with an equal opponent. lol Such victories are of little honor if there is already a stronger opponent.

                        ?? So when the Raptor appeared in US combat squadrons in 2005, where in the world could they find a "stronger enemy" for it?? Back then, there simply weren't any... (By the way: they don't exist now either, NGAD hasn't been created yet...)
                        Well, at least with another Raptor...

                        Surely there were such funny fights... But there should be a draw in long-range combat (or someone will be lucky), and in dogfight - pure art of an individual pilot, like in the First World, in the Second World or in local wars of the 5s-50s.
                        or with F-35 at worst . lol

                        It appeared 10 years later. And its radar is weaker (225 km target with 1 sq.m. EPR for F-22 versus 160 km for F-35). F-35 is weaker as an air fighter, it was designed and created mainly as a strike aircraft.
                        After all, during the training of combat with aircraft of the previous generation, something appropriate was selected for the role.

                        So at that time there was nothing “appropriate” yet.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        An aircraft with a frontal RCS of 0.1 m² (at best!) cannot be considered a 5th generation aircraft.

                        Many years have passed since then, and we have a new coating.

                        Indians lined up for him again?! NO?? WHY??
                        ...and the fabulous data about the Raptor's EPR was dispelled.

                        Only in the ignorant heads of "aviation enthusiasts" are they considered "fabulous". The rest of the world does not consider them "fabulous" - the Europeans, who are struggling, the South Koreans, the Japanese, even the Turks! lol They all believe that stealth is extremely important in modern warfare.
                        Especially if it has a rusty, cracked or damaged coating.

                        Those aircraft that remain in service and are not relegated to the training category - their coating is regularly renewed, although this costs serious money. Well, what can you do: you have to pay for everything...
                        And do you seriously think that 0,1m2 is not the fifth generation? Seriously?

                        There wasn't even one "lying around"! (Ask the Indians?) According to the CIA, the J-20 has a frontal RCS of ~0.01 m² and the Americans classified it as a stealth aircraft. This means that the stealth limit is the aircraft's frontal RCS of ~0.01 m² and below..
                        What about the F-35 with its 0,1-0,3 m2 then? lol

                        The F-35 also has 0.0001 m², and according to one American aviation general, it is EVEN LOWER! Believe it or not...
                        Especially considering the Su-57's "DM" search radar? Well, really, there's no point in stooping so low.

                        Do not me tell these funny tales, there are a hundred people here who will take them in with delight - alas, they are laymen... They do not know what they are saying... THEY ARE NOT GUILTY, THEY ARE VICTIMS OF PROPAGANDA.
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        WHERE IS THE QUEUE FOR HIM?? WHERE IS IT?!

                        In general, it exists, but until our own VKS are saturated, there can be no talk of export. But there are definitely customers for it. But they won't advertise themselves, why would they want trouble from the US and Co.

                        Another sweet fairy tale. While the Indians wanted to buy PAK FA - the entire aviation world knew about it, when the Indians refused to buy it, because its parameters did not meet expectations - the entire aviation world also found out about it. And then suddenly "secrecy"! Only in your imagination.
                      4. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 20
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        "Raptor" was needed by everyone in the world,

                        Who else is an operator of the Raptor? laughing Who bought it?
                        And why COULDN'T they do this?

                        The whole world knows this too: the US Congress has banned its sale abroad to prevent leaks of top secret technologies. Australia, Japan, Israel - "on their knees begged" to sell it. But the most vile Nagla-Saxons categorically refused...
                        And for some reason the US bought a very limited series for itself? After all, they wanted to buy about 1000 units?

                        They wanted to buy 750 while the USSR was alive. But it died in agony and the new enemy China had not yet gained strength, they considered it possible to cut it to 187 units. They miscalculated by about half, then "teared their hair out", but it was too late...
                        Why is the US so afraid to demonstrate its TRUE capabilities. At least to its closest allies - Israel, for example?

                        ?? I don't get it?! FOR ALMOST 20 YEARS THEY HAVE BEEN DEMONSTRATING AND DEMONSTRATING, IN A BUNCH OF JOINT INTERNATIONAL EXERCISES. (You're saying something strange.)
                        ...the question of decommissioning and writing them off is constantly raised... Why? This does not happen with successful machines

                        There is no "constant talk of write-offs" Several years ago, there was talk in the US Congress and Senate committees, who were horrified by the pace of progress of the Chinese stealth program, about resuming production of approximately the same number of F-22s, but Lockheed Martin said it would cost an extra $50 billion and the issue faded. Now it's NGAD's turn.
                        The US has always overstated the characteristics of its aircraft, sometimes VERY much. It is enough to remember the F-111.

                        Are you talking nonsense again?? And what was "overstated" there? The plane proved itself to be excellent during the Vietnam War, better than all others! Look, the Australians had an F-111 that served for over 40 years...
                        Aren't you ashamed to promote such a commercially UNSUCCESSFUL aircraft, which in 20 years you have not managed to sell to a SINGLE buyer?

                        Well, stop talking nonsense, The entire aviation world knows about the US Congress ban on selling F-22s abroad, but you don't know! So ignorance is not an argument.
                        You are being bombed now, I sympathize.

                        We have been bombed for 76 years, we are used to it. We bomb too, and so much that they are sending chips flying...
                      5. 0
                        2 October 2024 04: 51
                        Quote: Strelkin
                        that the WS-15 production plant has been operating for two years now.

                        This is just a Soviet-Russian R-279V-300 engine, not brought up to design parameters, which the Chinese have been working on since the mid-to-late 90s, having bought it straight from an exhibition - a demonstration model, which was intended for the Yak-201.
                        For the sake of at least somewhat acceptable service life, they reduced its maximum thrust and now it produces something around 16 - 000 kgf instead of the designed 16 kgf.
                        While we are successfully testing the R-579V-300, which has already exceeded the design thrust in afterburner during bench tests, producing 24 kgf instead of 000 kgf.
                        And the Lyulkovites have indeed worn out their "Product-30", although the engines launched into production have a slightly lower thrust than the design - again for the sake of service life. And serial Su-57s with "second stage" engines are already on the stocks.
                        The Chinese had an AFAR radar before our Belka, but it is difficult to evaluate its merits, because the Chinese are keeping it secret, and we are few who are skilled in reading hieroglyphs in technical texts.
                        But overall, their "Dragon" is nowhere near the Su-57. But with new engines, it will really become faster. And they have no analogues to the RVV BD, although overall the missiles are already quite good. They are great, they try and have no shortage of resources. And it is good that the US is preparing to confront China. We are not against it.
  10. e_4
    +2
    24 September 2024 12: 03
    Personally, my opinion is that it is better to stop a project with little prospects sooner than to continue to bury funds in it simply because it is a pity to spend them. Yes, NGAD may have been a rip-off, but continuing dead-end work would have been a much more "rip-off" activity.
    1. 0
      30 September 2024 10: 50
      There can't be a "low-promise project" - there can be delays, hitches, temporary problems with financing - but the project itself is simply doomed to further development, it can't be otherwise. In the process of its development there can be design errors that will be corrected...
      But the project itself can neither be stopped nor cancelled... winked
  11. 0
    24 September 2024 14: 59
    Quote: BlackMokona
    under overloads of 50 G
    But do materials exist in reality that can withstand such overloads without falling apart? I don't mean shock overloads, but long-term and systematic ones.
    1. 0
      24 September 2024 18: 33
      Quote: Sergey Zilinsky
      But do materials actually exist that can withstand such overloads without falling apart?

      Well, for SAMs such overloads are not the limit
  12. 0
    25 September 2024 16: 46
    For what? For profit. The US military-industrial complex is not dying for this. 400% profit… and capital is not afraid of self-destruction.
  13. 0
    25 September 2024 20: 01
    I admit "information fog" regarding the NGAD program, in order to send Russia, China, and even "comrades in arms" in NATO - on the wrong path or "relax" the military-scientific thought of these countries... Russia, or rather, the USSR, has already been through this... And the last "flight with undressing" (financial) was during the times of passions over the "Star Wars" program of R. Reagan, to which the USSR was quite "excited"... Those who are supposed to monitor "overseas" scientific and technical thought, probably learned lessons from R. Reagan's "Star Wars" and made the appropriate conclusions regarding the NGAD program... As they say in Odessa: "We'll wait..." The Mojave Aviation Center (USA) knows how to keep secrets, even from Roman Skomorokhov....
    1. 0
      30 September 2024 10: 45
      I admit "information fog" regarding the NGAD program, in order to send Russia, China, and even "comrades in arms" in NATO - on the wrong path or "weaken" the military-scientific thought of these countries...

      And how will China "relax"? Its intelligence knows very well that work on NGAD is continuing and no one is going to stop it. Accordingly, they will "push hard".