Loser of the day: fifty years of “Tornado”

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Loser of the day: fifty years of “Tornado”


Panavia Tornado, aka MRA-75, aka Panavia 200. The fruit of the joint work of the British Aircraft Corporation (Great Britain), Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm (Germany), and Aeritalia (Italy).



These three whales formed the consortium Panavia Aircraft GmbH in 1971, shares in which belonged to British Aircraft Corporation (42,5%), Messerschmitt-Bölkow-Blohm (42,5%), Aeritalia (15%).

Two modifications were developed: the Tornado IDS fighter-bomber and the Tornado ADV interceptor. Aircraft have come a long way, but the ADV interceptor ended its career in 2010, but the IDS fighter continues to serve to this day, reaching its anniversary.


This plane can and should be considered a symbol of the revival of European aviation design school and industry, truly in Western Europe they were able to overcome everything: complete decline after the war, the financial crisis of the sixties, dependence on the United States. And a truly excellent third-generation combat aircraft was created, which also became the first European aircraft with a variable-sweep wing and the world's first production aircraft with a fly-by-wire control system (EDCS).

History work on the aircraft project was difficult and long, and as a result, only three countries remained from the European consortium of 8 countries, which began implementing the project, which was called MRCA-75 (Multi Role Combat Aircraft - multi-role combat aircraft of 1975).


The plane really turned out to be “universal” (“Panavia” - “General Aviation” from Greek): in addition to the announced concerns, the following took part in the development:
- Turbo Union (Rolls-Royce, Fiat, MTU) created the engines;
- Mauser created guns;
- Avionika worked on avionics.

Interestingly, the creator countries saw the role of the aircraft differently: in the British Royal Air Force, the MRCA-75 was supposed to replace the Vulcan and Canberra bombers, without being embarrassed at all by the fact that the Vulcan was a very strategic bomber, which, according to plans, was supposed to strike, including on the territory of the USSR.

In the German Luftwaffe, the new aircraft was supposed to replace the frankly unsuccessful F-104G as both a fighter and an attack aircraft capable of operating against naval targets in the Baltic.


The Italian Air Force in MRCA-75 also saw a hunter for Soviet ships in the Mediterranean Sea instead of the Starfighter.

As a result, after lengthy discussions and agreements, the main tasks of MRCA-75 were determined:
- strikes on enemy airfields;
- striking at troop concentration areas, headquarters and communications;
- direct all-weather and round-the-clock support for ground troops on the battlefield;
- strikes against surface sea targets;
- conducting aerial reconnaissance.

Well, plus everything, the plane had to be able to maneuver in combat. Of course, with Soviet fighters, which in itself was a difficult task, especially considering the low altitude of the aircraft. In essence, the result was a multi-role strike bomber-attack aircraft. Still, as a fighter it was fodder for the Soviet Su and MiG.

Initially, Germany and Great Britain wanted to adopt a two-seat aircraft (Panavia-200), while the Italians were happy with a single-seat aircraft (Panavia-100). As a result, the parties agreed on a two-seater model for reasons of economy.

On August 14, 1974, the first aircraft took off. In September 1974, the new fighter-bomber was named "Tornado". In 1980, the British Air Force received the first Tornado aircraft, and a year later these aircraft began to enter service with the Italian and German Air Forces.


Germany purchased 359 aircraft.
The Luftwaffe received:
- 157 fighter-bombers;
- 55 combat training aircraft with dual control;
- 35 aircraft EW "Tornado" ECR.
The Bundesmarine received 100 fighter-bombers and 12 dual-control aircraft for its aviation.

Italy purchased 100 fighter-bombers, 12 of them with dual controls.

The UK received a total of 229 aircraft, of which 51 were dual-control). In addition, in 1984, some British aircraft were modified to carry the British WE177B nuclear bomb or the American B61 nuclear bomb. This modification was designated Tornado GR.1.

"Tornado" entered service and... almost instantly became outdated. Despite the fact that the work was carried out quite quickly in the second part, by the nineties the aircraft was openly in need of improvements. And when preparations began for the war with Iraq, they took on the “Tornado” more than specifically.

A special radio-absorbing coating was applied to the front parts of the air intakes, wings and tail, which, however, turned out to be ineffective and even moreover, there were cases of tearing off and getting into the air intakes. As a result, after the war the coating was removed from all aircraft.

But more useful things have been added:
- encrypted communication equipment;
- special cockpit lighting, allowing the pilot to use night vision goggles;
- satellite navigation unit;
- new PTBs with a capacity increased to 2250 liters;
- hanging container (2 pcs.) with laser-thermal imaging sighting system TIALD.

The armament was supplemented by American Paveway II guided bombs, rockets AIM-9 "Sidewinder" and experimental anti-radar missiles ALARM, which in fact underwent field tests in Iraq.


Over time, the range of weapons that the Torando could carry increased. In the 90s, the Tornado was armed with the Sea Eagle anti-ship missiles, the Germans armed themselves with the Kormoran and Kormoran-2 anti-ship missiles, the Italians mastered the AGM-65D Maverick, AGM-88 HARM, Kormoran anti-ship missiles, AIM-9L and GBU-16 bombs. Plus, the Italians got the Tomson-TRT CDLP container laser target designation system.

As a result, after all the modifications, the result was an aircraft that was quite good in terms of performance characteristics and very sophisticated in terms of armament. Good export options loomed, but... alas, the price of the Tornado turned out to be very high. Yes, today, after the “successes” in this field of the F-22 and F-35, the “measly” 30 million dollars from the Tornado look ridiculous, but in the 90s it was a lot of money, and those who want to update their aircraft fleet - ended very quickly.

Only real men from the Saudi dynasty were able to buy the Tornado for their Air Force, and the Saudi Air Force acquired 90 aircraft for itself, including 14 with dual controls and 6 reconnaissance modifications.


By the beginning of the new millennium, the Tornado was among the so-called “strong old men”, that is, outdated aircraft that required major modernization. However, the members of the triumvirate could not agree among themselves and, as a result, it was not possible to organize joint work on modernizing the Tornado. The British chose to remove the Tornado from service; the Germans and Italians began working separately on their own modernizations.

The crucible for Tornado was the war with Iraq. The aircraft was actively used by participants from all three owner countries. During the fighting, the Tornado dropped 950 adjustable Paveway II bombs and 4250 conventional free-fall bombs of 450 and 900 kg, fired 123 ALARM anti-radar missiles at enemy radars, and used 100 sets of JP233 bomb clusters. Losses amounted to 11 vehicles, with eight crew members killed and seven captured.

Many experts agreed that the use of Tornado in real combat was not very effective. It is very strange that such a complex aircraft, packed with equipment, suddenly turned out to be of little use for combat use.

The reason for this was the discrepancy between the formation of attack and defense complexes (despite the fact that the combat survivability complex was very weak) and the conditions in which the aircraft was used.

The use of the Tornado practically as an attack aircraft, striking airfields and command centers from a low altitude, entailed considerable losses. During tests for use in the European theater of operations (naturally, against Soviet troops), the main method of using the Tornado was to fly at low and ultra-low altitudes to attack enemy troops. However, during planning, the effect of enemy counteraction was incorrectly calculated. And in Iraq, it turned out that the modes in which the Tornados reached the target were very advantageous for the numerous Iraqi small-caliber anti-aircraft artillery.


And for the Tornado it would be more advantageous to strike from long distances, away from the close range zone. Defense enemy using high-precision weapon long range. But the Tornados worked point-blank, which resulted in losses and damage to almost all aircraft involved in the operation.

Performance characteristics of the Tornado GR.Mk.1 modification
Wingspan, m - 13,92
Length, m - 16,72
Height, m ​​- 5,95
Wing area, m2 - 31,00
Weight, kg
- empty - 14
- normal takeoff - 20 410
- maximum takeoff - 27

Fuel kg
- in internal tanks – 5
- in PTB 4 x 1 l or 500 x 2 + 1500 x 2 l

Engine: 2 x TRDDF Turbo-Union RB.199-34R Mk.101 x 4 180 kgf

Maximum speed km / h
- at altitude – 2 (338M)
- near the ground - 1 480
Cruising speed, km/h – 1 (010M)
Ferry range, km – 3
Combat radius, km – 1
Practical ceiling, m – 15 240
Crew, people - 2
Armament:
Two 27 mm Mauser BK27 cannons with 180 rounds of ammunition per gun
Combat load - 9000 kg on 7 suspension units:
- 3 nuclear bombs WE.177;
- 2 AIM-9B/L Sidewinder air-to-air missiles;
- 7 anti-radar missiles ALARM;
- 4 Sea Eagle anti-ship missiles;
Up to 3 bombs of different types:
- GBU-15 with optical guidance;
- Paveway with laser guidance;
- 454 kg, 340 kg, 227 kg, 113 kg conventional bombs;
- BL775 cluster bombs;
- napalm tanks and special hanging containers.


Today, the German Air Force is one of the last operators of the Tornado, along with Italy and Saudi Arabia. Less well known is the fact that the German Navy was the first German operator to get its hands on the Tornado. But the last “sea” Tornados were decommissioned in 2005, after which the German Navy completely abandoned the use of high-speed aircraft. But there were times when Tornados flew side by side with Soviet and Russian Su-27s over the waters of the Baltic...

Another interesting feature of the Tornado was the ability to refuel aircraft in the air. In the German and Italian Air Forces, the Tornado could be equipped with a Sargent Fletcher refueling capsule with a capacity of 1400 liters, which was located under the fuselage, using which it was possible to significantly increase the already good range of the Tornado or refuel any other aircraft that had the appropriate equipment .


The British also equipped several of their aircraft to perform the refueling role before the Gulf Operation in 1991, but were in no hurry to use the aircraft.

Well, the cherry on the cake: “Tornado” could well end up serving in the US Air Force!

The idea that the US Air Force would buy a European-designed and manufactured combat aircraft now seems almost unthinkable, but in fact the relevant service of the Air Force has more than once considered the possibility of purchasing a Tornado.

The Tornado version of the IDS was considered as a potential candidate for the creation of an advanced tactical fighter (ETF), but it turned out that the candidate remained a candidate, and its place in the Air Force was taken by the F-15E Strike Eagle, which was precisely created to perform such tasks.

Another potential export operator for Tornado is Japan. There, the Japan Air Self-Defense Force (JASDF) had been looking for a successor to its Mitsubishi F-80 attack aircraft, which primarily carried the load of an anti-ship defense aircraft, since the mid-1s.

It also didn’t work out, the Japanese went a little too far with their wishes: according to the JASDF, the Japanese Air Force’s Tornado was supposed to fly further, which required lengthening the fuselage, or that the development would take a longer fuselage of the Tornado ADV interceptor, and leave the capabilities from the IDS Tornado and partly from the ECR model.


Manufacturers were able to build this. But upon presentation, the Japanese military refused the aircraft and preferred to modify the Mitsubishi F-2 to their requirements.

In general, the world abandoned Tornado. And even with numerous upgrades, today's Tornado IDS is quickly heading toward retirement. The situation might have been different if partner countries had gone ahead with plans to create an improved version known as Tornado 2000.

Plans for the Tornado 2000 were formulated shortly after the 1991 Gulf War, in which the basic Tornado IDS flew a large number of combat missions, with successful results but also painful losses.

It was planned that the Torando-2000 would enter service at the turn of the century and would be further optimized to overcome modern air defense systems at low altitudes. Distinctive features of the new design will be a longer fuselage that can accommodate a larger fuel supply and more modern avionics.

To better overcome enemy air defenses, the forward fuselage had to undergo a fair amount of reconstruction to reduce the cross-section of the radar and change the design of the air intakes. Instead of carrying additional fuel in bulky drop tanks with considerable radar reflection, a semi-conformal fuel package would be installed under the fuselage. Compared to the base Torando, the range of the new aircraft was planned to increase by 25 percent.

With more advanced projects on the horizon, including the Joint Strike Fighter program, which the British soon became involved in, plans to create an optimized strike version of the Tornado were abandoned. So the F-35 shot down the Tornado 2000 on takeoff.

Failed radar killer


One of the most intriguing episodes in the history of Tornado service to the British Crown is the decision to modify a batch of Tornado F3 interceptors for a defense suppression mission. Informally called the "Tornado" EF3, this version was armed with the same ALARM anti-radar missiles that were provided to some British aircraft. fleet "Tornado" GR1.


Unlike the Tornado ECR, for example, the Tornado GR1 and GR4 had very limited capabilities to detect and localize enemy emitters autonomously. On the other hand, the F3 Tornado had a much more powerful Radar Homing and Warning System (RHAWS) with antennas on the tail and wings. These antennas provided a much more accurate emitter location system (ELS).

The EF3 Tornado was quickly developed and ready for deployment to the Middle East in 2003 for the US invasion of Iraq. Considering the improved capabilities that the EF3 Tornado offered, it is somewhat surprising that the decision was made not to send the aircraft to the Persian Gulf, and the program was canceled shortly thereafter.

The second takeoff never happened, and now the Tornado, which entered service in 1979 (the UK finally phased out the aircraft in 2019), is now essentially living out its last days. Yes, on August 14, 2024, Tornado celebrated 50 years since its first flight. But the lack of a full-fledged modernization plan brought to naught the career of this, in principle, very good aircraft.


For comparison, our Su-27 made its first flight a little later, in 1981, was put into service in 1985, and is still in service. But - having 12 modifications. And moreover, the latest evolutions of the aircraft in the form of the Su-34 and Su-35 are generally accepted masterpieces, which are very dangerous opponents for both those in the sky and those on the ground.

Development, that is, its complete absence due to the fact that “there was no agreement among the comrades,” put an end to a rather good aircraft. And now, half a century after its first flight, the Tornado is living out its days in the air forces of Germany, Italy and Saudi Arabia, awaiting replacement by more modern machines.
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  1. -2
    19 August 2024 04: 29
    Seven nannies have a child without an eye. And the performance characteristics are very good. The Su-34, with the same combat load, has a take-off weight one and a half times greater.
    1. +5
      19 August 2024 06: 30
      Engines have never been the strong point of our aviation
    2. +3
      19 August 2024 09: 43
      Actually, the platypus has BN Max. not 8 tons at all.
    3. +25
      19 August 2024 09: 59
      Another nonsense of the political scientist Roma in terms of conclusions and conclusions.
      Loser of the day: fifty years of “Tornado”
      Airplane with CDS, with color monitors, with helmet-mounted display, ...
      What then are Su-24 and Su-24M?
      A shed with pointer instruments, with rockers and mechanical rods, with weak, uneconomical engines and a small combat load and combat radius... It barely takes off with two 1500 tanks and 4 OFAB-250 SHN, and that's only 4 tons? Of which there are about 250 pieces in the advanced VKS?
      Well, at least a little objectivity!!!
      1. +6
        19 August 2024 14: 21
        Quote: Vitov
        Another nonsense of the political scientist Roma in terms of conclusions and conclusions.

        Totally agree with you.
        1. +3
          20 August 2024 18: 56
          Roma was carried away in the wrong direction. Tornado is a serious enough machine as a fighter-bomber. And in the Gulf it showed good survivability. But as an interceptor it is weak. When our fifteen was replaced by 27, they were issued over the Hans on Tornado harshly and with perversion. And Tornado was killed not by the EFs but by the Jewish fighter.
      2. 0
        21 August 2024 10: 47
        Objectively, the Su-24M is quite a decent aircraft. The radius is small, but there is no need to drive it across three seas. If he is with Hephaestus and is a good pilot, it will not seem like much.
    4. +10
      19 August 2024 10: 17
      We have a tiny number of Su-34s. Before the SVO, there were only 120 of them - that's 4 full regiments. When 7 years ago I said that we needed at least 500 Su-34s - they laughed at me and banned me... 500 Su-34s are only 6 divisions. In the USSR, only the 14th Air Army, which was based in the Western part, had that many Su-24s... 120 of these attack aircraft for the entire country and the SVO? NOT FUNNY!
      1. +1
        21 August 2024 10: 52
        The time will come - and there will be even fewer of them. With the development of aviation and air defense, new models will become more and more expensive, more complex and more efficient. 120 Su-34 is not a lot, but there are also about 50 Su-24M/M2, as well as Su-35, Su-30... And as for 500 Su-34s, everyone wouldn’t mind, but these are just dreams... 250 that would be cool. In general, NAPO can physically produce 16-18 units per year.
        1. +1
          21 August 2024 11: 27
          Here are overview figures for aircraft availability and delivery rates in recent years:
          https://aviation21.ru/sostav-boevoj-aviacii-vks-rossii-na-2023-god/
          A little more than a dozen Su-24Ms are equipped with Hephaestus... And the modification of the Su-24M2 is just a cut of the dough...
    5. +1
      19 August 2024 11: 53
      The combat load must always be looked at specifically. You never know what they wrote there, how many kg the plane can lift. First, with what fuel reserve. And then each unit (usually in pairs) can carry a certain load. There is also strength, etc. Even if the strength allows, and there is nothing of such mass to hang there, then oh. For example, a pair of high-velocity missiles with a transition beam is one thing, some kind of bomb is another, and another bomb can no longer be hung. Something can only be hung on both sides, something only in one copy.
  2. +17
    19 August 2024 04: 33
    Incredibly beautiful plane!
    While still a student, I read one of those books that were not sold in stores about the aviation of that time. "Tornado" was rated as the most advanced Western aircraft. In its size and weight, it had the best characteristics and capabilities.
    But then the war came in Iraq and that was it. It turned out that the desire to squeeze everything that was possible out of the plane backfired. Very dense layout of everything. The interior of the aircraft was used up to 1 cubic meter. mm. Any fragment or bullet brought something out of standing. Due to the density of the systems, repairs in the field were extremely difficult or impossible. The plane began to fly a lot, and all the numerous equipment began to fail. Repair, again, see above.
    American planes are large, made more freely and not so versatile, turned out to be much better. And the best European plane turned out to be a wooden Jaguar. There was nothing to be denied about him.
    Something like that.
    1. -6
      19 August 2024 06: 38
      It wasn't the plane that was bad. It was the Russian air defense technology that was good. The scales of truth always have two bowls.
      Oddly enough, even in the days of missile air defense, the main damage was done by firearms of various calibers. Their cheapness and quantity made them effective.
      Just like today on earth in Ukraine. The main defeat, the overwhelming majority of it, comes from artillery. She remains the queen of the fields..
      1. +1
        19 August 2024 11: 49
        For some reason, with the same air defense, the remaining aircraft performed their tasks normally. There was no need to drag them from the only hole to the factory.
        And "Tornado" distinguished itself.
        1. 0
          19 August 2024 11: 52
          High efficiency, due to complexity, results in low maintainability.
          For example, the famous Tiger tank.
          A stone ax is the least likely to break. But for some reason they refused it.))
          Thank you.
          1. 0
            19 August 2024 11: 59
            So the Tornado was not effective. The pilots were tired of going back without completing their combat mission. 4-5 flies out, 1 or 2 come back. I don’t remember the exact ratio, but something like that. And the Jaguar flies and flies. And what to choose? Bucket of bolts or super-duper? And the F-16 flies. And F-15.
            1. +1
              19 August 2024 12: 19
              Dear Maximum, you are going against progress.
              Each new model of military equipment is more effective than the previous one, but more complex in design and maintenance.
              Requires a higher level of operator qualification in case of non-standard situations.
              At the same time, standard operations are automated as much as possible.
              For example, loading in our tank. Search, destruction of targets of our latest models of air defense missile systems Pantsir, S400, everything is automated.
              But there is always the possibility of manual control. There is no such thing as 100% reliability.
              1. +2
                19 August 2024 13: 10
                What do I have to do with it? I am always for all progress. But "Tornado" was clearly unsuccessful in terms of its intended purpose - war. At least in Iraq. With all her problems. I didn't come up with anything. I just read all sorts of materials on the use of aviation in that war. It was a long time ago. Americans are Americans, but the most effective aircraft among Europeans was the Jaguar. But there were no good words for “Tornado”. He was removed from there until the operation was completed. He killed everyone.
                Why did I remember this so much? Yes, because I remember that book from my early youth. I don't remember the name. For specialists in the USSR to pay tribute to foreign cars, this has never happened in wide circles. But the book was for universities. I remember that they also paid tribute to the good optimization in all parameters for air combat, especially aerodynamics, of the F-15. These two aircraft stood out in particular. Otherwise, everything is the same. Everything was assessed correctly, what and why. Believe me. It was written, if memory serves, by someone from Moscow Aviation Institute. This happened in the years 88-90. The book is earlier.
                And then there was Desert Storm. Trali-vali. And later there were a flood of articles on everything. The West won. They boasted wildly. They translated everything for us with pleasure. Nevertheless, it became possible to publish. And there were articles. Both in “Wings of the Motherland” and in “Equipment and Weapons”. That's all. Hello! “Tornado”, praised by theorists, turned out to be bullshit. Just bullshit. Although, as an airplane, it is beautiful. I’m almost sure that they brought everything to fruition for the variable-sweep design. And everything else too. The best variable sweep aircraft. Only no one needs it anymore. But it could only fly from European airfields and in Europe, as well as perform normal routine peacetime tasks. That's all. After all, all that the Tornado needed was to be a flying platform for the weapons that had to be carried for the mission. And he couldn't handle it. Due to low reliability and extremely difficult repairs in airfield conditions.
                Because of these small sizes, I personally look at the Eurofighter with the same squint. Something is not right about this beautiful plane. I understand: the Su-27, F-15, -16, -18 family, even the MiG-29. But Europeans, they are somehow different. Everyone wants to put a pint into a gallon.
                1. 0
                  19 August 2024 13: 22
                  Maximus, I respect pathation lovers like you. Nice to read. Everything is on topic.
                  1. -1
                    19 August 2024 13: 31
                    Thank you! drinks drinks
                    But I'm still not a fan. Professional, but a little wrong. Not in the unit to fly and all that. In part to do. The rest is of interest.
                    1. 0
                      19 August 2024 13: 38
                      Often, amateurs understand issues better than professionals if they love what they do. ) I will read your posts.
    2. +3
      19 August 2024 06: 40
      I absolutely agree - a very beautiful plane! but even the assembled model of the Tornado was three times more expensive than the slightly humpbacked Jaguar.
      1. +4
        19 August 2024 11: 11
        I didn’t have enough photos of the tornado with the mining system, it’s a cool container there
        1. +2
          19 August 2024 13: 13
          Eh, there was a photo in Foreign Military Review, where a “Tornado” with German crosses sprinkles these mines from a container. The bourgeoisie knew how to advertise their equipment.
          1. +2
            19 August 2024 13: 40
            In "Aviation and Cosmonautics", too, it seems
            1. +1
              19 August 2024 13: 50
              I somehow didn’t read it. You can't re-read everything. That's why I saw it myself at ZVO. Maybe it was at AiK. Why not? There is such a long flat box under the fuselage.
              1. +1
                19 August 2024 14: 46
                Looks like an airplane on a caterpillar
        2. +1
          23 August 2024 03: 26
          Roman, welcome!
          Here is this photo, as well as several articles about “Tornado” published on VO in 2017.
          https://topwar.ru/106584-sovmestnye-poslevoennye-evropeyskie-proekty-boevyh-samoletov-chast-4.html

          https://topwar.ru/106618-sovmestnye-poslevoennye-evropeyskie-proekty-boevyh-samoletov-chast-5.html

          https://topwar.ru/106638-sovmestnye-poslevoennye-evropeyskie-proekty-boevyh-samoletov-chast-6.html
          1. +1
            26 August 2024 13: 12
            Thank you very much, hi but I never found it
        3. 0
          26 August 2024 09: 25
          https://youtube.com/shorts/bbye16D9m1w?si=MtRf-p7dcgdkeWZj
          I came across a video. Translation - akhtung. But the picture is here.
  3. +6
    19 August 2024 04: 37
    Large scale production, long service life, foreign deliveries, and good modernization potential do not allow the Tornado to be called a failure.
    At the same time, the USSR, which spared no expense on defense, created two aircraft of the same class: the Su-24 fighter-bomber and the Su-25 attack aircraft, essentially alternatives to the universal Tornado. Today, our new Su-30, 35 have returned to the theme of universality.
    1. -4
      19 August 2024 04: 44
      To paraphrase what was said about tanks: the best aircraft for service in peacetime.
      1. +2
        19 August 2024 05: 00
        Military science operates with numbers and statistics. And not ideological arguments, or even successful jokes.
        1. -3
          19 August 2024 05: 38
          So..., “military science” determined the place of this plane - at home at the airfield.
          How many such systems are there? It’s beautiful and excellent, but you can’t fight on it. It is broken by the war.
          1. 0
            19 August 2024 06: 52
            The outcome, the goal of any battle, is to destroy, capture the enemy, or abandon one’s positions.
            During the Great Patriotic War, the highest mortality rate was among pilots. Most Heroes of the USSR were pilots. Most often posthumously.
            And only then came the soldiers of the infantry units. Exceptions don't count.
            There are only a few pilots who fought throughout the war.
          2. 0
            19 August 2024 07: 10
            I want to develop your idea. Europe, since the days of the “European Market”, has strived to create something pan-European - ships, tanks, planes, but at some stage, everyone scattered into their own sandboxes. They made a common tank - it didn’t work out, they made a common plane - the French “jumped to the side”, it turned out to be a “tornado” and a “typhoon”, they made a common ship “Horizon” - the Germans and the British set sail)))
            1. 0
              19 August 2024 11: 17
              Doing it together is much cheaper, but better quality.
              Only thanks to globalization are goods, cars and airplanes of the highest quality produced.
              Many, many countries make components for them.
              Compare AVTOVAZ cars and similar models of this class in other countries, and you will have your answer.
              1. -1
                19 August 2024 11: 56
                Yeah, but for some reason in Europe at the end of the last century they didn’t understand this.
  4. +3
    19 August 2024 05: 50
    When the Tornado appeared, it was advertised as a super-duper progressive aircraft with a fly-by-wire control system. Before him, the classic was the system of mechanical rods from the pilot's handle to the booster system and rudders. Naturally, they didn’t even try to make a digital control system, like on modern aircraft.
    It quickly became clear that the analog control system, when flying close to high-voltage power lines, experiences interference and the control system stops working. It was a long time ago, I don’t remember the details, but it seems like there were even disasters. Therefore, Tornado had a unique flight limitation, the only one in world aviation. It was prohibited from flying near power lines. I have not seen any information that this restriction has been lifted.
    1. +1
      19 August 2024 06: 06
      !! A very appropriate comment for your nickname! drinks I didn't know about this. Fun fact.
    2. +2
      19 August 2024 06: 11
      It was prohibited from flying near power lines.
      Miracles! I've never heard of this either!
    3. +3
      19 August 2024 07: 01
      The magnetic field strength decreases with the square of the distance from the source. The metal fuselage shields the systems from external influences.
      The power of the aircraft's actuators is high, and therefore requires 27? Voltage voltage.
      The plane is filled with instruments with strong electric fields of different frequencies.
      I will express doubts about the version about the power lines.
      1. 0
        19 August 2024 07: 54
        EM compatibility on an aircraft is a mysterious thing. There may be the strangest options
        1. +1
          19 August 2024 08: 08
          At what frequencies reflections, interference, resonance of waves will occur, nobody knows. The length of waves is small, centimeters. Even a small shift of the source of waves in space can change the whole picture.
      2. +3
        19 August 2024 08: 45
        The plane is filled with instruments with strong electric fields of different frequencies.
        I will express my doubts about the version about the power lines...

        Along any power line there is an exclusion line where any economic activity is prohibited. However, summer cottages in this zone and close to it are not at all uncommon. Russia is a country of invincible creativity. Therefore, cunning summer residents in this area lay two wires parallel to the power line and connect a 220 V refrigerator to them. It works flawlessly, the length of the wires is selected experimentally. This is an illustration of the extent of electromagnetic interference. They don't write about this in textbooks. Now about the ESDU. Such a system is unthinkable without feedback. For this purpose, there are sensors on both the joystick and the steering surface. If these sensors are consistent, then the difference between their signals is zero. If the sensors are mismatched, the ESDU turns the rudders until they agree with the joystick and reset the signal. This is a classic of automatic control systems. Signals from the sensors are sent to a comparator - a device for comparing signals. To ensure control accuracy, the comparator includes an electronic amplifier. Those. We are not talking about the 36 V AC of the aircraft on-board network, from which the ESDU operates, but about hundredths of a volt of the mismatch signal. From the cockpit to the steering wheels is 10-15 m. It is enough that the electromagnetic interference in these wires amounts to a fraction of a volt, and the steering wheels will be adjusted to a position independent of the joystick. A mouthful of earth is then guaranteed. Tornado showed by its example that shielding wires does not guarantee protection from interference. In digital ESDS there may also be interference, but the communication principle is different.
        1. +3
          19 August 2024 11: 43
          The respected Old Electrician is telling fantastic, unscientific things.
          To create voltage, a potential difference is needed.
          On power lines this is usually 110-220 kilovolts.
          There are requirements for the refrigerator to operate: a strict limit - 240-190 volts.
          The current strength in starting mode is several amperes.
          And will this work? Don't be ridiculous.
          At best, you will light a small incandescent lamp 2 V, 5 A. Yes, it will light.

          It's even funnier about sensors on the plane's streamlined surfaces. And what about static electricity, lightning strikes, icing, rain, radar operation...
          1. 0
            19 August 2024 13: 40
            To create voltage, a potential difference is needed. On power lines this is usually 110-220 kilovolts. For the refrigerator to operate there are requirements: a hard limit - 240-190 volts...
            – you will be surprised, but there is such a magical thing called a step-down transformer. Apply 220 volts to the primary winding and remove, for example, 5 volts from the secondary winding. You know how in the children's joke:
            And my dad works as a step-down transformer! Receives 380 and buzzes at 220!

            The difference in voltage is regulated by the ratio of the length of the primary winding wire to the length of the secondary winding wire. To ensure that the transformer is of acceptable size, the windings are wound in the form of coils. In this case, the primary winding is the power line wire, and the secondary winding is the wire stretched across the summer cottage. There is no need to roll them into a tube. Since there is no iron in this transformer, such transformers are called air transformers. A very popular thing in radio engineering. In this case, this overhead current transformer reduces, for example, 330 kV, to 220 V. There is nothing supernatural about this, except for a creative way to steal electricity.
            About the sensors on the streamlined surfaces of the aircraft is even funnier. But what about static electricity, lightning, icing, rain, radar operation...
            – you will be even more surprised, but the entire plane is covered with sensors for various purposes, belonging to all kinds of aircraft systems. ESDU is only one of them. Moreover, all of them (sensors) are recessed into the surface of the wing and fuselage. None of them are on the streamlined surfaces of the aircraft. At the same time, it should be added that there are no rules without exceptions. Therefore, air pressure sensors are located directly in the air flow. If, God forbid, for example, they are all knocked out by lightning, then a small polar fox comes to the plane right in flight. I forgot what it's called. After this, what remains of the plane is what is popularly called a “pit.”
            All I can say in conclusion is that with such ideas you are clearly not destined to be an aircraft designer.
    4. +3
      19 August 2024 18: 55
      I live in an area closed to civilian flights (only a military training area).
      During the COLD WAR, I often saw simulated air battles between Smerchs or Smerchs > F16/18.
      The Tornado (at least for Italy) was an excellent aircraft (perhaps even better than the F15) and did well in mountainous terrain, with valleys, mountains and narrow gorges.
      They appeared out of nowhere (from behind a mountain top or from a riverbed) and had impressive acceleration to pursue their target.
      It was really cool to watch those fights.
      However, in the desert, the Tornado was an Iron, and it was easily identified by anti-aircraft fire.
      But in its environment (the topography of Italy) it was practically unnoticeable due to its ability to fly calmly at an altitude of 15 to 30 meters.
      PS My area is full of high voltage lines.
  5. +2
    19 August 2024 06: 19
    It’s interesting, but at the same time our MiG-29 was undergoing final tests. And if we talk about generations, then the MiG-29 still belonged to the fourth generation, and the Tornado to the third
    1. +3
      19 August 2024 06: 36
      Yes, I always treated "generations" as some kind of absurdity. And this division into 20 years of late creation of Tornado and MiG-29 appeared... And what is the F-15? It was created earlier than MiG-29, and a little later than MiG-23. So now we have to "pervert" 4+++ and five with a minus.
      1. +1
        19 August 2024 06: 38
        Yes, I always treated “generations” as some kind of absurdity
        I think so too. Generations are just some reference points for weapons; it is more convenient to navigate by them and imagine the capabilities of the machine. At least theoretical possibilities
        1. -3
          19 August 2024 09: 46
          The first generation is aircraft with piston engines.
          The second generation is aircraft with turbojet engines.
          The third generation is supersonic aircraft.
          Starting from the fourth generation, the very meaning of the word “generation” was lost and became an advertising slogan, which could mean anything. For example. The American bomber Northrop B-2 Spirit has a maximum speed of 1010 km/h (M=0,95). Tell the Americans that this is a second generation aircraft (jet, subsonic) and you will insult them to the very depths of the vulnerable American soul.
          1. 0
            23 August 2024 00: 20
            You are mistaken. Generations are only applicable to jet machines.
            0 generation - “piston” aerodynamics with jet engines (MiG-9, F-80),
            1st generation - vehicles with already “reactive” aerodynamics (swept wings, etc.), but with cannon armament (MiG-15, Saber).
            2nd generation - based on missile weapons and supersonic aerodynamics to break through enemy air defenses (MiG-21, F-104),
            3rd generation - multi-mode aircraft, adapted to break through enemy air defenses at ultra-low altitudes (MiG-23, F-14).
            4th generation - universal aircraft with fire-and-forget homing weapons (MiG-29, F-15).
            5th generation - stealth aircraft with supersonic cruising and long-range weapons used before the aircraft is detected by enemy radars (Su-57, F-22).
            6th generation - aircraft with autonomous control (i.e., not requiring not only a crew, but also an operator on the ground), otherwise corresponding to the 5th generation.
            1. -1
              5 September 2024 15: 54
              Generations are just words invented by journalists for the sake of beauty and nothing more.
              Those who know - they don't give a damn about these generations.
              Now generations have begun to give birth in both fighters and tanks.
              As if anything depends on these generations.
              Cretinism is growing.
              1. 0
                11 September 2024 12: 33
                It was the military who came up with these generations. Because for them, differences in generations play a significant role (they change the tactics of use and countermeasures).
      2. +1
        19 August 2024 07: 15
        I agree with you. A modern aircraft is an extremely complex mechanism. Simplified assessments like plus and minus were invented for stupid people.
    2. 0
      19 August 2024 10: 37
      Aha
      on the Mig-29 there are hydraulics, and on the Tornado there is an ECM....
      Are hydraulics more modern???
      1. 0
        19 August 2024 11: 01
        on the Mig-29 there are hydraulics, and on the Tornado there is an ECM....
        Are hydraulics more modern???
        Hydraulics is the working agent that controls the engine. The command is given by the ECM. On MiGs it was called
        "Unit for automatic regulation and control of engines"
        1. 0
          19 August 2024 11: 15
          And what does the engine have to do with it???
          I'm talking about the working surfaces that the pilot "steers" - the Mig-29 had hydraulics, with all the tanks, pipes, cylinders and boosters. From the aircraft control stick and pedals to the control devices there is a direct connection through the hydraulic system.
          But the Tornado has an ECM - without direct communication, everything is through contacts and wires with electric motors.
          1. 0
            19 August 2024 11: 24
            And Tornado has an ECM - no direct connection
            The main force, for example for extending flaps or landing gear, is hydraulics. The ECM is just a think tank
  6. +8
    19 August 2024 06: 33
    In the early 90s, our "fish trawler", then "Leonid Galchenko", took fish from Scottish fishermen - like mackerel, 150 tons daily and froze it. What I mean is that we were moored near the town of Ullapool. And in the bay and around there was an aerobatic zone of some English Air Force base. The English flew beautifully on the Tornado, even below our deck. Once, one day, they could not think of anything better than to enter our ship in pairs and go down into the gorge with a slide, once they entered - the ship was shaking, the second time the same thing again. The third time, a mechanic - adjuster jumps out of the cabin shouting: From Russian literature, only English flyers. And the flights stopped. From the night there was a ruckus in the sky and at sea. By morning we were already in the general plan in the English news. The last pair Tornado lost control and both crashed into a mountain. I advised the adjuster to draw a star on each of the two "Baaders" (fish cutting machines). Russian swear words are so strong that they can drop them from the sky. Black humor, I felt sorry for the pilots. They flew beautifully, as in the photo for the article, part of the photo, I think England (Scotland).
    1. +5
      19 August 2024 06: 45
      Yes, it was an interesting coincidence. But in reality, the old aviation rule worked: After the phrase "look what I can do" prepare a wake.
      1. +7
        19 August 2024 10: 45
        After the phrase "look what I can do"

        A little wrong, 70% of traumatology patients end up after the phrase
        - Look how I can do it
        The remaining 30%, after the phrase
        - Look how it should be done
        laughing
    2. +3
      19 August 2024 07: 21
      The training area for the combat use of aircraft was in a seaport, a seaside town, in a mountainous coastal area, rocking the ship at extremely low altitudes?
      Dear sea wolf, I don’t believe it. ) This doesn’t happen.
      1. -1
        19 August 2024 07: 28
        Just look at the map first so as not to believe it. The village of Ullapool is a resort town in Scotland that receives a sea ferry once a day. I don’t want to fly to the bay.
        1. +4
          19 August 2024 07: 48
          And I believe in the village, that you have traveled all over the world, seen different countries, experienced really dangerous situations more than once and you have something to tell, I also believe.
          But there are general laws for conducting planned combat training.
          The main thing is safety.
          Primarily civilian objects. The noise level is prohibitive, interfering with people's normal lives. Threat of falling, aircraft collision, detachment of suspended loads.
          The operation of a radar, radio station, etc. blocks home and special communications. This angers the residents.
          The training area must have a variety of objective control means. Etc.
          1. +4
            19 August 2024 10: 43
            Quote: Stardock
            But there are general laws for conducting planned combat training.
            The main thing is safety.
            Primarily civilian objects.

            In theory - yes. But in practice... remember how the Marine Prowler demolished the cable car in Cavalese - he just decided during a training flight on the MV on the permitted route go to WWI.
            Not bad, but a training route for low-altitude flights, laid through a ski resort with cable cars.
            1. +2
              19 August 2024 11: 19
              It is obvious that the pilot violated the route assignment, the flight plan, and deviated from the route.
              I wanted to see the girls.)
              1. +3
                19 August 2024 13: 02
                Quote: Stardock
                It is obvious that the pilot violated the route assignment, the flight plan, and deviated from the route.

                The fact of the matter is that the plane was on its route. But the crew did not familiarize themselves with the new maps and flight altitude restrictions - these documents were found unopened in the cockpit.
                That is, the violation was only in height - twice (1000 feet instead of 2000).
                And the flight route went through the ski resort.
                1. +1
                  19 August 2024 13: 25
                  The horizontal echelon in aviation is 100-200 meters.
                  Wrong, 1000 meters?
                  It's like driving in oncoming traffic. Trifle)))
                  1. +4
                    19 August 2024 15: 29
                    Quote: Stardock
                    Horizontal level in aviation is 100-200 meters.
                    Wrong, 1000 meters?

                    Wrong by 1000 feet - 300 meters.
                    Moreover, in the old docks the lower limit was exactly 1000 feet. It was raised to 2000 feet, EMNIP, a year before the disaster. But who reads the instructions...

                    In general, laying out a route for a training flight at low altitudes through a ski resort is some kind of avant-gardeism. This is not some kind of remake: the routes existed in Cavalese for a long time, and in 1976 the largest cable car accident in history was recorded there (42 dead).
              2. +2
                19 August 2024 13: 59
                In 1971, a Tu-104 crashed in Irkutsk. To practice landing approaches in difficult weather conditions, this Tu-104 had a curtain that could be used to close the cockpit windshield from the inside. When landing, the left pilot said to the right pilot: “Look how I can do it!” and closed this curtain. I wanted to show how cool he would be to launch the “Carcass” into a blind landing. Needless to say, such experiments with passengers on board are strictly prohibited.
                No one has used this curtain for 100 years. Therefore, at the last moment, when it was necessary to switch to visual control, it got stuck. The landing really turned out to be blind. The plane hit the concrete with all its might and broke apart. Fortunately, some of the passengers survived. The aces in the cockpit also survived.
      2. UAT
        -1
        19 August 2024 19: 29
        Dear Stardock, starting from the fact that the height cannot possibly be low, and ending with the heights rocking the ship - you have done something beyond childish. How can this be translated into normal Russian?
        1. +2
          19 August 2024 21: 11
          Dear Wat, if I understood your question correctly, I wanted to say that in the port at anchorage, aircraft cannot fly at extremely low altitudes. Of course, these zones are prohibited for training flights.
          Even an airplane flying at subsonic speed carries a shock wave ahead of itself, a compaction zone, which of course affects nearby objects within 0-50 meters.
          We even had a project for a supersonic aircraft flying at an altitude of 60 meters and actually killing all living things.
          The lungs of people and experimental animals were torn.
          1. UAT
            0
            19 August 2024 21: 16
            Respected Stardock Sorry I didn't realize it right away. Here is a quote from your comment that caught my attention.
            The training area for the combat use of aircraft was in a seaport, a seaside town, in a mountainous coastal area, rocking the ship at extremely low altitudes?
            1. +1
              19 August 2024 22: 18
              Dear UAT, I'm sorry, I really didn't express myself clearly. And I confused you.))
              I wanted to say that flights in the port area cannot be so low that they even rock the ship. It's impossible.
              This distance is 10-20 meters. Nobody will do that.
              Moreover, next to a foreign Soviet ship. Then the USSR was respected. .
              1. UAT
                +1
                20 August 2024 11: 01
                Respected Stardock Thank you, I understand. I suppose no one should have done that. But not everything in this life is done according to the rules and common sense. It's a pity.
    3. +4
      19 August 2024 08: 55
      In the 1s, there was only one air crash involving two Panavia Tornado GR14 aircraft - on August 1991, 464 in Yorkshire, when aircraft with tail numbers ZA545 and ZAXNUMX collided.
  7. +1
    19 August 2024 07: 45
    Due to the low thrust-to-weight ratio and the ridiculous ceiling for a fighter (15 m), this aircraft did not have a serious capability for maneuvering and close combat. This also includes not very large operational overload...
    1. +1
      19 August 2024 08: 29
      Perhaps the operational overload was reduced due to the folding wing. The MiG-23 constantly had cracks in the center section. Here they simply introduced restrictions into electronics.
      Dead end scheme, what can you do?
  8. +2
    19 August 2024 10: 05
    the latest evolutions of the aircraft represented by the Su-34 and Su-35

    Roman, what do you think “evolution” is, especially in relation to an airplane?
    Translate into Russian, please.
  9. +3
    19 August 2024 10: 40
    In the first picture I immediately noticed that something was wrong))
    1. 0
      19 August 2024 10: 51
      I searched for the fox longer than for the MiG-29 / laughing
      1. 0
        19 August 2024 11: 29
        In the first picture I immediately noticed that something was wrong))

        All that. This is the last of the 24 MiG-29s that the German Air Force received from the GDR. They were in service with the Taktisches Luftwaffengeschwader 73 “Steinhoff”.
  10. 0
    19 August 2024 12: 05
    Beautiful plane. It somewhat resembles an old Mercedes in the back of a w124 coupe)
  11. Des
    0
    21 August 2024 09: 53
    From the author’s (note!)) article on VO: “During the hostilities, Tornado dropped 950 adjustable Paveway II bombs and 4250 conventional free-falling bombs of 450 and 900 kg, fired 123 ALARM anti-radar missiles at enemy radars, and used 100 sets JP233 bomb clusters The losses amounted to 11 vehicles, with eight crew members killed and seven captured."
    a little further:
    ... "And for the Tornado it would be more profitable to strike from long distances, far from the enemy’s close air defense zone, using long-range precision weapons. But the Tornado worked point-blank, which resulted in losses and damage to almost everyone involved in aircraft operations."
    Well, thanks for the analysis of the combat situation).