So who has problems with the Su-57?

Meet another person who wants to walk on the wings of the Su-57, a certain Peter Suchiu from Michigan. During his twenty-year career in journalism, he has contributed to more than four dozen magazines, newspapers and websites. Today, my friend Peter found himself on the pages of The National Interest, which we respect, and he writes, they say, even for Forbes and Clearance Jobs. In general, it’s a sort of all-rounder.

While Forbes is a familiar face, Clearance Jobs is a career website that serves individuals with active federal security clearances and provides a secure forum for employers to hire cleared employees. It is also called the “Prime Secure Job Board” because the site exclusively serves candidates with a valid US government clearance.

Apparently, wealthy financiers and government agents are on vacation, so Peter decided to write about airplanes. Well, here everything is clear: either about the upcoming victory of the F-16 in the skies of Ukraine, or about the Su-57. The first topic is very optimistic, the second is just right.

So what is Peter Suchiu's main point?

“The Su-57 boasts stealth capabilities, advanced weapons and high maneuverability, but its stealth capabilities have been questioned compared to American counterparts such as the F-22 Raptor and F-35 Lightning II.

Meanwhile, the US is developing the Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) program, aimed at outperforming fifth-generation fighters with advanced artificial intelligence, unmanned systems and advanced technologies."

You know, I once made counter-arguments, but time has passed since then, and a lot has changed.

Okay, generally a rather respectful opinion, but about this written bag, with which all Americans are running around like mad, that is, about stealth, I would say a few words. In general, this is some kind of fetishism. Moreover, he is so stubborn. Well, everyone sees these “inconspicuous” ones: the French on Rafales, the Indians on Su-30MKI, the Germans on Typhoons. In short, everyone who needs it sees it. Those who don’t need it—that is, the Americans—don’t see it. Everything is laid out.

Our time is already in full force calling into question the stealth of the F-22 and F-35, and given that they have no other outstanding features (well, let’s say, except for completely castrated electronic warfare and the inability to look “sideways and backwards”), except for this the most inconspicuous, it’s time to think about this topic.

As for weapons, indeed, both we and the Americans have complete order with this. And if the Su-57’s stealthiness is just as bad as its American counterparts, then it’s really time to start racking your brains. After all, our fighter really has super-maneuverability, which American “irons” cannot see through a telescope. Whatever you say, UVT is a thing that we are much better at than the Americans.

So much has already been said on the topic of what is better, super-maneuverability or stealth, that I don’t even want to repeat myself. The only thing that can be said on this issue is that stealth is a rather ephemeral thing. The fact that the “invisible plane” is a myth was proven by the Serbs more than 30 years ago.

But all these plays on words “not at all”, “little”, “almost” are not noticeable - nothing more than an advertising slogan. Quite conventional. But maneuverability is a thing, as they say, “for centuries.”

New radars, optical systems, thermal imagers, and more sensitive seekers may appear. In general, there are many things that can reduce stealth to zero, that is, there are quite a lot of variables in this equation. But the ability to “break” the flight path and miss enemy missiles in an aerobatics maneuver is much more difficult to level out. The missile must fly much faster than its target, so it can maneuver, but not perfectly. Nobody can cancel physics.

As for the Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) project, the principle “When it flies, then we’ll talk” is evident here. It is more than strange to compare an aircraft that was produced, albeit in a small series, and something that is not yet even on paper.

“Despite Russian claims, the Su-57 may not meet true fifth-generation standards and is unlikely to easily evolve into a sixth-generation fighter.”

What are the “true fifth generation standards”? Stealth? Blindness and deafness for ¾ of a circle? Failure to integrate into modern battle management networks? Wildly expensive, beyond the bounds of reason? Yes, then the true standard of the fifth generation is the F-22 Raptor. Here you can also add complete incompetence for air combat, and everything is in perfect order.

In general, is this generation figure so important?

Yes, sure. It is very important for managers selling aircraft to other countries. The fifth generation, simply because of the number itself, must cost more than the fourth. But who said that the fifth generation should be more combat-ready?

Nobody. And here we can speculate.

I know one country that still has in service the first fourth-generation aircraft, developed in another country altogether. It has been standing since 1981. Almost with three modifications to date. The plane, as they say, has no frills: it’s gluttonous, it’s downright bad at maneuverability, and they didn’t even know what stealth meant when it was being developed.

In general, the plane turned out to be suitable for two things: catching up and killing. But in this he has almost no equal in the world. Everyone has already understood that we are talking about the MiG-31.

Yes, a very unique plane. But who can doubt that he is able to break the face of anyone detected by his radar? And now, when they began to install “Zaslon”, which can “look” at generally fantastic distances of 400 km, and with missiles with a range of 300 km...

This can be compared to the peregrine falcon. The duck is camouflaged and inconspicuous. But if the peregrine falcon’s eye notices her, food is served, as they say, fly to eat. She, so unnoticeable, has little chance of leaving.

In our case with airplanes, the situation is approximately the same. If Russian designers from the Research Institute of Instrument Engineering named after V.V. Tikhomirov give figures that the new Zaslon model, Zaslon-AM, “looks” at 400 km, I see no reason at all not to believe them.

“Zaslon” in the 80s “looked” at 200 km, and this was already creepy, and considering that its complex antenna had two completely independent X-band arrays with 1700 emitters and an L-band with 64 transmitters, combined into one plane, but what the followers of the creators of “Barrier” were able to do today is difficult to even imagine.

But it’s very nice to dream up.

Back in 1991, at the Le Bourget air show, ours were ready to lift the MiG-31 to detect the “stealth” F-117. The experts were so confident that the “invisibility” would be discovered by the “Barrier” that the Americans decided not to play with fire.

Today, when Zaslon-AM can confidently detect a target with an ESR of 20 sq. m., and this, in principle, is the EPR of fourth-generation aircraft, no matter ours, European, American, at a distance of up to 400 km, then “invisible aircraft” will be visible at a distance of 50-100 km if the estimated figures The EPRs of Western analysts are accurate.

And if they lied there, as usual, then at long distances. In general, if you look soberly and without marketing shouts, then the normal distance at which the F-22/F-35 can be detected will be somewhere in the region of 100-120 km. Yes, this is already a good range for an attack using the AIM-120, but nevertheless, this is a completely normal range for an attack with our missiles.

But it will be very difficult for them to escape if they miss. Speed ​​wall, sorry, not the same.

Here lies the answer why the F-22/F-35 never took part in operations where they could be “touched” by radar with your own eyes. The F-22 definitely failed; the Americans very carefully hid it from everyone who was interested in looking at the Raptor. With the F-35 it’s a little easier, there’s probably data from the Indians, and in Syria the Israeli F-35s “shone” like New Year’s toys.

The plane ceases to be “invisible” from the moment it is first seen. Then gradations begin, which are, in principle, optional. So there is currently only one real stealth aircraft in the world - the Raptor. Indeed, no one really saw it in combat, so about the F-22 you can tell any tales like an ESR of 0,00001 square meters. m. It’s still impossible to check, they are all laid up waiting to be written off. But this is the third question.

“Nevertheless, despite the fact that Russia continues to advertise this aircraft, Western aviation experts have suggested that the Su-57 is mostly hype, and that Moscow lacks the production capacity to even produce the aircraft in significant quantities. This is evidenced by the fact that the Su-57 first took to the air in January 2010, but entered service only in December 2020.”

Writing something like this in 2024 is ridiculous. Especially considering the fact that the F-35A made its first flight in 2006, and entered service with the US Air Force in 2016. That is, the same 10 years, but the USA has its own frame of reference, so for them 10 years is a normal period, but for Russia it is prohibitively long.

A system of double standards in action. A log for yourself, a branch for others

But now we will look a little to the side. Yes, it is difficult for an American to understand that in a country that is engaged in hostilities, there is somehow no time for experimenting with new technology, but there would be time to produce old and proven ones. Although the Su-34 and Su-35 cannot be called old technology. But in fact, they are more in demand than the Su-57, in my opinion.

However, what do our opponents generally accuse us of, so to speak? Just a different approach. The Su-57 is still in the rank of some kind of prototype, because yes, THAT engine is still not ready. Sometimes it happens. 14 years old and still not ready.

However, if you look at what we produce as new technology, there is a significant difference. The approach itself is different: we first make a small series, look at it, test it, polish it. Improved if necessary. Then - a series. And this has been the case since the times of the Soviet Union, and, I must say, the practice is just right.

Particularly useful in today's changing environment the warWho could have imagined five years ago that a battery-powered rattle would become a more effective way of destroying manpower and equipment than, say, an ATGM?

Let's look at our “successes” in the context of military operations from this angle.

"Armata". Concept? Concept. Yes, we went overboard with the hype, shouted very loudly about the topic of “not having”, in the end what? As a result, on the one hand, nothing, they released two dozen. Send to fight? So that such an expensive thing, stuffed with electronics, would die from the fact that a dozen drones will he arrive? If he had arrived, those on the other side would not have missed such an opportunity.

The same overkill, in my opinion, as the T-55/T-62. The truth is in the middle, the truth is that the T-72/T-90 is still the best that can be used in battle.

All other projects of the T-14 family were moved to about the same place. The reason is cost.

"Kurganets" ended up overboard for about the same reason. There is no doubt that this is a good project, but it requires thorough improvement precisely because it was developed under one set of conditions, but there are completely different ones.

"Terminator". The idea is complete, but again, it’s not that it didn’t work, but the composition of the opponents on the battlefield simply changed. Instead of infantry fighting vehicles/armored personnel carriers, ATGM crews, helicopters and other tanks They hit with drones, which are tens of times cheaper and have their own advantages over the same ATGMs. But as an anti-aircraft gun, “Terminator” is about nothing at all.

Su-57. Multirole air superiority fighter. Unobtrusive. Its use is also ambiguous. The fighter's first target is another enemy aircraft. In conditions when the enemy has a meager number of aircraft, and the ground is bristling with air defense systems, and even go and figure out whose “Buk” it is that “shines” you, it is not easy to determine, but there was a use. Yes, at the level of tests, but still.
What do all these types of weapons have in common? That's right, a limited edition release. Without spending (probably) huge amounts of money, we nevertheless developed and tested new equipment. Is the Armata not fit for battle tomorrow? It will stand, go to parades, and during this time something will change.

“Kurganets” turned out to be somewhat different from what was expected? Okay, there's some work to be done.

Su-57? He flies on an old engine, gaining information. Combat. Once the AL41F1 is completed, further evolution will follow.

Maximum efficiency at a relative minimum of costs.

Now let's look at the USA.

Three Zamvolts were built. $22,5 billion. Scrap.
13 littoral ships were built. 11 billion. Scrap.
Built 194°F-22 Raptor. $66,7 billion. They really want to scrap everything.

Here is a very easy and relaxed 100 billion dollars, the effectiveness of which is exactly at the level of “Armata”. But they made two dozen “Armat”, that is, the cost is simply incomparable.

But we're talking about airplanes.

What useful things have 20 Raptors done during their 194 years of service? One inflated bubble was knocked down.
What useful things did 8°F-1000 do in 35 years? Yes, it's richer there. Israeli F-35Is shot down as many as two drone.

Well, bombs and missiles were leaving somewhere from afar. But we do not consider the work of a fighter as a bomber at all.

12 Su-57s have between 2 and 8 victories, depending on the source. Having read the Ukrainians and the British, I am inclined to believe that 1 Su-27 and 2 MiG-29 are quite reliable, and the Ukrainian side admits these losses in air battles.

That is, in fact, 12 Su-57s shot down more than 1200 American aircraft. Three planes against a bubble and two drones - what more proof of effectiveness is needed?

To hell with them, with numbers! It is the fifth generation, not the fifth, not the sixth, not the eighth - there is an airplane, and it works like a combat aircraft. If we have. If it doesn’t work for them, there are so many stories...

What difference does it make that the F-22 is the “ideal” fifth generation, if it, not only fights, is not really able to fly? What's the use of the bells and whistles of the F-35 if it has a "around the pillar" range without drop tanks (stealth, where are you?), a tanker in the air or an aircraft carrier under its ass? Does the imperfect Su-57 fly three times further?

Well, then all that remains is to play with numbers. And the further they play, the more attention they pay to the “imperfection” and inconsistency of our aircraft with the conditions of the “fifth generation”, which, by the way, are not really formulated, the more convinced you become that the Su-57 is not only no worse, much better than American “ideals”. At least they are not afraid to use the Russian aircraft for its intended purpose.

Why compare the Su-57 with NGAD?

First, let's honor those whom this very program should correct in the eyes of the whole world. That is, Americans. Our hero Peter writes the following:

“First articulated back in 2014 by the DARPA Air Dominance Initiative, the US Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) program is designed to achieve air superiority, but NGAD should not be viewed as just one aircraft.

Last year at the POLITICO defense summit, Air Force Secretary Frank Kendall explained that NGAD's manned aircraft would control the unmanned fighter jets that accompany it. A variety of multi-role unmanned aerial vehicles, called Collaborative Combat Aircraft (CCA), can act as trusted wingmen while all aircraft can be networked together, enhancing situational awareness for both manned and unmanned aircraft.

Moreover, as Maya Carlin previously reported, there are likely five different technologies that will take priority in NGAD fighter design, including advanced weapon, stealth, digital design, motors and thermal management. While sixth-generation technology is not precisely defined, the features of the NGAD program are expected to exceed the capabilities of fifth-generation counterparts."

There, above, in the first quotation from Peter, it was just this: what about your Su-57, we will now have NGAD, and this is not what they say here!

In general, with this very creativity, Mr. Suciu simply admits that all these hundreds of F-22s and F-35s are bullshit that is good for nothing. And, by the way, this is indirectly confirmed by the fact that not a single country, except Israel, uses its F-35s in combat operations. Israel has nowhere to go, and the Jews bought these planes to fight. That's why they fight, and the rest of the world, which bought miracle planes, saves an expensive resource and sits on its fifth point.

But let's look at the NGAD program, which is being projected onto our Su-57.

In order for it to begin to represent something meaningful and possibly combat-ready, you just need to create:
- airplane;
— drones under the SSA program;
— software for the network that will connect these devices;
— communication and coordination systems;
— weapons.

As of today, the NGAD program has absolutely nothing on this list. So how can you even compare something that in 10 years and in 100 billion years will be something like this, claiming to be the sixth generation?

Unlike all these projects, which will not become projects tomorrow, the Su-57 not only flies, it also demonstrates combat effectiveness! Yes, on planes of a lower class, but what to do if Kyiv does not yet have others? Although something tells me that if the MiG-29 °F-16 had been in place, the result would have been exactly the same.

In general, it is not so important what this sixth generation will be like, in much the same way that the characteristics of the fifth are not important. Aircraft that can perform combat missions are important. It is not the numbers of generations that are at war; they, the numbers, give nothing at all except an increase in price. The aircraft of the second generation, modernized into the third, the Indian MiG-21, easily coped with the Pakistani F-16, which is the fourth.

I have said more than once that numbers don’t fight. Numbers justify defeats. And planes and pilots fight in their cockpits. The war is carried out by missiles guided by radar data.

I understand why Peter Suchiu changed forty editions. In order to write decently about airplanes, you need to be able to do more than just chew numbers. You also need to understand how the plane flies and fights. But the coach of government agents, unfortunately, does not have this. Therefore, the article looks more like a clownery.

But there is one more thing here: the more such articles appear in the United States, the more and more confident, to be honest, that they are being written for a reason. And our aircraft, although not produced in American quantities, is in fact no worse, but on the contrary, much better than American “stealth aircraft.” And they understand this perfectly. That’s why they try to give a damn when they draw these numbers of generations.

It seems that many in the United States still cannot understand that the war is not about numbers, it is about weapons. As for Russian weapons, you know, they have always been at the highest level.

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have. What the rest have is really their problem.

Comments

[StopTheUSA]

It would be logical if this Suchiu compared his NGAD with our Mig-41.
What they have, what we have, this is a very complex one, not even a project yet, but a concept with an eye to the distant future.
Everything is written there with a pitchfork in the water.
And the Su-57 is already a series, albeit a small one

[ramzay21]

The author is speaking from another dimension where the laws of physics do not work, where the only superpower so far whose economy is more than 10 times larger than ours is controlled by fools, but on which everything in the world depends. It's amazing!
No conclusions have been drawn over the two and a half years of the ongoing SVO. All the same mischievous sentiments.

[qQQQ]

Quote: ramzay21

The author is speaking from another dimension where the laws of physics do not work, where the only superpower so far whose economy is more than 10 times larger than ours is controlled by fools, but on which everything in the world depends.

I will support you. Counts the money of the country that prints it. Yes, if necessary, they will also print much more than 100 billion. And sooner or later, with such infusions, they will really get something unique. Well, we go into battle using what our grandfathers fought on, the main thing is it’s cheap.

[Electrical]

And sooner or later, with such infusions, they will really receive something unique.

Yes Yes. Of course. It’s just that they haven’t been able to do anything meaningful with their money since the days of b52 and the phantom. Still the flower doesn’t come out. Just cuts and money down the drain.

[Vasya_T.]

Well, why... And the F-14, and the F-15, and the F-16, and even the F-18 are quite good, working aircraft.
F-15, 16 and 18 will survive all sorts of F-35s.

[Glagol1]

Well, don’t overestimate the striped ones so much, Ramsay. There is an honest indicator of the economic power of countries - GDP at PPP. About “more than 10 times”. So, for the Russian Federation this figure is 5,5 trillion. dollars, and for the USA - 25 trillion. The difference is 4,5 times. Of course this is a lot, but not “more than 10 times”. This is the first one. But there is also a second thing: the striped country’s GDP includes inflated bubbles of stock exchange transactions and services. For example, a bank in New York orders an audit. It costs $10 million and is a service rendered. And a certain bank in Moscow will order the same thing, well, to check, for 500 thousand. The same picture is on the stock exchange. Our capitalization of Sberbank is 4 EBITDA, and that of American banks reaches 50. Why are you scared? Is Sber in a risk zone with low profitability?! It's simple. They, the striped ones, inflate themselves, inflate themselves, and wage war against us. So it turns out that Sberbank, which should cost at the very minimum 10 EBITDA, costs 4, and striped banks instead of, say, 20 - 50 or more. But income from trading on the stock exchange is also included in GDP. It's just all exaggerated. forgot 1929? There is also a third thing: this is the ratio of public debt to GDP. For us it is 20%, and for them it is 130%. What's the bauble? And the fact is that every year the striped ones will give more and more money just like that, for servicing the debt, and now it’s a trillion a year, and in a few years - one and a half. For now the dollar is saving them, but they are drowning it with their own hands. So things are not going well for the striped ones...

[ramzay21]

Well, don’t overestimate the striped ones so much, Ramsay. There is an honest indicator of the economic power of countries - GDP at PPP.

I try very hard to look at things realistically, so I can’t agree with you.
It is possible to calculate the economic power of countries only in nominal terms and in one currency, simply because calculating GDP in PPP is essentially multiplying our GDP by some figure and dividing their GDP by another figure. But can we buy for 20 dollars what they will sell for 100?

For example, a bank in New York orders an audit. It costs $10 million and is a service rendered.

Great example! Yes, their big four audits work all over the world, and until very recently, our banks also paid millions of dollars a year each for such an audit and paid not in some kind of PPP, but as much as they wanted. But the funny thing is that only part of this money went into calculating their GDP, part of it went into calculating our GDP. And they earned this money and did not print it.

What a picture on the stock exchange. Our capitalization of Sberbank is 4 EBITDA, and that of American banks reaches 50. Why are you scared? Is Sber in a risk zone with low profitability?! It's simple.

As a person who understands economics, I again disagree with you. On the stock exchange, no one forces anyone to buy anything; everyone decides for themselves what to buy and what to sell, and if their price is higher and ours is higher, then this is the price for today.
Why this happens is also an interesting question, for example, they are very worried that their rate on mortgage loans has increased significantly, right up to 7% from 2%, while our Central Bank rate is already 19%! And what kind of business can you do when the Central Bank rate is 19%? The answer is obvious. Only high-yield and therefore high-risk. That is why our market is assessed as high-risk.

There is also a third thing: this is the ratio of public debt to GDP. For us it is 20%, and for them it is 130%.

The calculation of our public debt does not include the debts of companies with state participation, but they greatly change this figure this time.
And if you do the math realistically, Americans pay less than 4% per year on ten-year securities, but how much do we pay?

[Andy_nsk]

As a person who understands economics, I again disagree with you. On the stock exchange, no one forces anyone to buy anything; everyone decides for themselves what to buy and what to sell, and if their price is higher and ours is higher, then this is the price for today.
Why this happens is also an interesting question, for example, they are very worried that their rate on mortgage loans has increased significantly, right up to 7% from 2%, while our Central Bank rate is already 19%!

As a person who understands economics, you should know that our Central Bank rate is 18%.

[Saxahorse]

Quote from Andy_nsk

As a person who understands economics, you should know that our Central Bank rate is 18%.

Apparently I didn't have time to track it. And so our Central Bank is already promising 20-22% in the fall. It's time to invest in production and give back to banks fivefold!

[Netl]

Quote: ramzay21

But can we buy for 20 dollars what they will sell for 100?

That’s right, exactly the same principle is embedded in the Big Mac index and a bunch of similar ones. You can buy exactly the same Big Mac in different countries for significantly different amounts of dollars. Which is a clear demonstration of the difference between the nominal value and the PPP value (measuring the economy in Big Macs and other comparable goods and services).

Quote: ramzay21

until very recently, our banks also paid millions of dollars a year each for such an audit

This is not an indicator of some kind of high-value check, but rather something like abuse of a monopoly financial position. Because, for listing on their exchanges, loans from their banks, etc. they demanded a report from their auditors. That is, it is not a question of the quality of the check, but simply an option for an imposed service that cannot be refused.

Quote: ramzay21

On the stock exchange, no one forces anyone to buy something; everyone decides for themselves.

Not really. Every year, the Federal Reserve issues trillions of dollars, formal and informal restrictions on withdrawals are in place, and a significant part of them ends up on the stock exchange. Therefore, the cost of a conventional American bank does not include its high-quality work, but the simple fact that the American investor has a lot of money and he is throwing it wherever he can.

Quote: ramzay21

The calculation of our public debt does not include the debts of companies with state participation

The calculation of their debt also does not include the debts of companies that can rely on state support (there were precedents). So comparable indicators are compared. And the level of real inflation must always be subtracted from current rates.

By the way, a very funny example of assessing the economy by PPP versus nominal was revealed during the production of shells. When the difference in the cost of a similar projectile was also hundreds of percent.

[Sumotori_380]

Different countries have different consumption patterns. That's why the Big Mac index doesn't help much.

[alexoff]

Quote: Glagol1

There is an honest indicator of the economic power of countries - GDP at PPP.

It’s good when all the necessary means of production are produced in your own country. Then this PPS will fit well into airplanes, ships and other high technologies. And when the main column of imports is means of production, then the PPP plays in the opposite direction - the population has little money and an excess amount of resources has to be spent for production

[IL-18]

It's not just striped animals that have ice. But, even though through wars, including civil ones, the USA nevertheless climbed back to the top of the world. Nowadays, comparisons are often made between the situation in the Northern Military District and the Finnish war. But, if you look closely, this is somewhere in the stage of the conflict on Lake Khasan. And that means there is time to do everything to avoid being drawn into a global war. Although, the process began in 2008. And during this time (16 years), no one, including the Russian Federation, left the dollar system. The finances of the world depend on the hegemon, who will both unleash and retract at his discretion. So you can charge $35 million for an F-200 with the prospect of selling it, and give it to someone for free, but force them to fight in their own interests. Or they can devalue $, either a little at a time, or immediately by several times or by orders of magnitude. And while our economy was growing, the Central Bank of the Russian Federation suddenly discovered “overheating” and raised the rate again, so that no one would be drawn to our economy, apparently. It seems that something is being done here to stabilize, but THERE the US Federal Reserve rate is being reduced in this situation.

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

The author is broadcasting from another dimension where the laws of physics do not work, where the only superpower so far whose economy is more than 10 times larger than ours

But how to calculate it, if at par, then it is so, but if according to PPP (and this is fairer, because domestic prices are also different). And if we exclude currency and stock exchange speculation and the service sector, leaving only the real sector, then the difference will be approximately 3 times. But our population is 2,5 times smaller. But they have a printing press, the military budget is even now almost 10 times larger (again at face value) + allies, satellites, military and political blocs, so Russia alone does not look very convincing against all this multitude. But if without the word “too” and together with allies and partners (in the correct understanding of this word), then it’s not so sad and hopeless. Although it is very, very worrying.
But we also need to look at the dynamics of processes. And the dynamics of these processes today are not at all in favor of the United States and Western countries. This is just objective reality and naked statistics.

Quote: ramzay21

No conclusions have been drawn over the two and a half years of the ongoing SVO. All the same mischievous sentiments.

I wouldn't be so categorical. Many conclusions have been drawn, many are being made. Purges are underway in the Moscow Region and these are definitely not cosmetic procedures - new arrests are made almost every day, 11 trillion rubles from the budget of the Moscow Region “disappeared” without any trace have been identified and become public (although for what period it is not named, but that’s 2,5 military budget of the pre-war Russian Federation. Putin canceled the “Budget Rule” from the IMF on February 25, 02.2022 - on the second day of the SVO. As a result, revenue (actually disposable) and budget revenues increased very significantly, so much so that it is enough without damage to the economy and the SVO. , and for internal development programs. Here it is necessary to correct the author’s figures (regarding the number of Su-57s in service). At the end of last year, there were 22 Su-57s in service this year (they were already at the end of last year). on stocks) 24 Su-57 by the end of this year. Next year, 30 units are expected, and this is the expected plateau - the design productivity of the new workshop exclusively for the Su-57. Production of other types (Su-35S\Su-35SM, Su- 30SM2, Su-34M) is also being increased and in the near future (by next year) it is expected to reach 24 - 30 units. each type per year - i.e. such is the performance of the ASZ. And you can’t accelerate here faster, because pilots for this aircraft must be trained, and aircraft technicians must be built, old abandoned ones must be restored, new regiments must be formed. So what if our Aerospace Forces receive 24-30 new heavy-class fighters every year? type (Su-57, Su-35S\SM, Su-30SM2 and Su-34M), then this will be quite good. With time .
And for lost time, 11 trillion rubles were stolen. and the failed rearmament of the Army and Navy, all those involved and responsible must bear the responsibility... I would like to see this. So it’s definitely too early for us to throw hats, and even more so bonnets, but the processes are not hopeless.
And we now have a “comprehensive ally” in the person of the nuclear power of the DPRK. They promise to sign such an agreement with Iran soon. I wouldn’t be surprised if something similar is signed with Venezuela...we are also building coalitions. And economic blocks.
But throwing hats is early, ugly and simply stupid.
Need to work .

[ramzay21]

But how do you calculate it, if at par, then that’s how it is, but if according to PPP (and this is fairer, because domestic prices are also different)

If you want to see the reality, then consider it at face value. If you want to go to the planet of Pink ponies, consider it in the teaching staff. Only the Chinese, who produce most of everything for them and for us, will not sell you for 20 dollars what they sell to them for 100, well, they will not sell it.

I wouldn't be so categorical. Many conclusions have been drawn, many are being made. Purges are underway in the Moscow Region and these are definitely not cosmetic procedures - new arrests are made almost every day, 11 trillion rubles from the budget of the Moscow Region “disappeared” without any trace have been identified and become public (although for what period it is not named, but that’s 2,5 military budget of the pre-war Russian Federation

Of course, there are good trends, but they are few and far between.
With plantings, it's all for show. Everyone who made criminal decisions remained in power, Shoigu, the entire General Staff, Manturov, Chemezov and others. And no one is looking for the 11 trillion stolen under Shoigu, everyone knows who has them, but they are all free, they imprisoned only minor ones for appearances, and that’s for now. We've already been through this.
Meanwhile, communications in the army on civilian Chinese unprotected analogue Bao Feng walkie-talkies, mass individual UAV companies, individual electronic warfare platoons and individual RTR platoons in the Moscow Region are not being created by anyone; they are only pushing the products of their UAV manufacturers instead of creating a system in which successful ones would be scaled products and solutions.

And we now have a “comprehensive ally” in the person of the nuclear power of the DPRK

Unfortunately, we have an oligarchic-feudal system, where most of our country belongs to foreign citizens and the leadership of our country dreams of an agreement and how to return everything back, and therefore, after some time, we will all see first an agreement and then reconciliation with the West and a break relations with the DPRK and Iran, with a transition to the camp of the enemies of these countries. Both North Korea and Iran understand this well.

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

If you want to go to the planet of Pink ponies, consider it in the teaching staff.

The IMF and the World Bank think so and all the pink ponies nest in their stables. But you must admit that a 4++ heavy fighter costs us 25 - 30+ million dollars. , and in the USA 100+ million dollars. The picture is the same with tanks, artillery systems, air defense systems, missile defense systems, etc., not to mention ammunition, the price of which differs by an order of magnitude. And in capital construction the picture is the same (at times), and in public transport, even in utility bills. One can argue with the figures of the assigned coefficients, they are assigned there without our knowledge, but the GDP in nominal terms... just look at the structure of the US GDP, what share of the GDP is occupied by stock market speculation, derivatives, services and entertainment. It makes more sense to compare the real sector of the economy, and best of all in units and kilograms.

Quote: ramzay21

the Chinese, who produce most of everything for them and for us, will not sell you for 20 dollars what they sell to them for 100

If you compare the Chinese and American real sectors, then such a ringing sadness will set in there... and the Chinese know how to calculate this.
BUT ! High technologies, aircraft manufacturing and the most powerful Air Force and Navy inherited from previous generations - this cannot be taken away and is not disputed by anyone. And even more so, the dominant and largely determining US dollar in world trade. But trends are important here. The US economy is simply no longer able to maintain its own infrastructure, its own Navy and Air Force at the required level - the number of combat-ready ships and aircraft has been declining for many years in a row. Look at their shipbuilding. On the state of their ship repair facilities, on the maintenance of the military aircraft fleet. They have a systemic crisis everywhere. And this crisis has reached such a level that no amount of money can fix it. They now spend up to 1,5 trillion a year just to service their own national debt! More than their entire vastly inflated military budget. Look at the problems they have with the development of a new ICBM, with the construction of the lead SSBN to replace the ancient Ohio.

Quote: ramzay21

With plantings, it's all for show.

I thought so too at first, but arrests continue. The General Staff has not yet been touched, which is no wonder - the country is at war, but the entire apparatus of the Ministry of Defense, all of Shoigu’s deputies have been arrested or, at best, fired. They are being careful, because during a war it is unacceptable to paralyze the Defense Ministry, just as an intra-elite rebellion is unacceptable. Remember Stalin’s purges, he also acted very carefully and step by step, but he managed to clean out the administrative apparatus of the Country and the Army before the start of the war, and now we have by no means Stalin’s people’s commissars, war and a completely different ideology... which is prohibited by the constitution.
About the fate of the 11 trillion stolen in the Moscow Region... let’s see, the fact that the figure has been announced is huge, and there are still many members of the “friendly gang of thieves and traitors to the Motherland” at large, and the children of the new elite have already grown up in their place.

Quote: ramzay21

Unfortunately, we have an oligarchic-feudal system

Exactly . For the sake of this, having destroyed the USSR, they failed from socialism into oligarchic feudalism, for the sake of decency, sticking the tag “capitalism” - for the sake of the untouchability of the “elites” and new owners. But today, for the sake of their own survival, they can play at some semblance of “socialism in the Chinese way.” This is very convenient for the redistribution of property and the removal of members of the former ruling “family” from power.
For greater resilience and mutual trust with our current allies. The form of power, ideology and economic model implemented in China may turn out to be very attractive for the renewed elite of the Russian Federation. This can reduce social tension, give some optimism to society and make the appearance of the “new Russia” more attractive.
If everything happens according to your understanding (continuation of atrocities and impunity of the “elites”), then I’m afraid a much more tragic option awaits us than the Republic of Ingushetia at the beginning of the last century. And the choice of path is now up to those who hold back.

[ramzay21]

The IMF and the World Bank think so and all the pink ponies nest in their stables.

The IMF and the World Bank only publish figures, including nominal GDP and GDP in PPP. And until 2014, all our leaders cited our place in the world as it should be in GDP par value, but everything changed in 2015. Oil and gas prices have fallen significantly, but in the kingdom of crooked mirrors the economy does not depend on the prices of raw materials! And how can we explain to people that we have fallen from 8th place to 15th place and our economy has become smaller than the economy of Australia, which has a population of 20 million?
So the scammers in power came up with the idea of ​​forgetting about the GDP nominal value and introduced GDP into the PPP for the scammer so that the inhabitants of the kingdom of Crooked Mirrors would not be upset, but would be proud. Moreover, effective managers led by a brilliant geostrategist, even in the conditions of oil prices returning above 60 dollars, are not able to bring us even to the top ten largest economies in the world! Alas, the rest of the dozen countries are growing differently from us, even despite the enormous help in the form of sanctions, when we are forced to develop industry and oligarchs to invest money with us. And if so, then GDP in PPP continues to rule and the lokhtorat continues to be proud that we are somewhere in first place in the kingdom of Crooked Mirrors.

But you must admit that a 4++ heavy fighter costs us 25 - 30+ million dollars. , and in the USA 100+ million dollars.

How much does the new Toyota Camry cost here and how much in the USA? And if the average American with a salary of 5 thousand dollars can buy it for five salaries, then how many salaries can the average Russian buy it for? So much for your inflated teaching staff.
And why can’t you buy a Mavic or a thermal imager in China several times cheaper than the Americans? After all, they should be in the teaching staff?
Why does our gasoline cost the same as in America, where there is also a transport tax, because in our PPP gasoline should be several times cheaper? Ask the gas station to sell you gasoline at PPS?
As for the fighters. Now generation 5 aircraft are much more important and the best F-35 fighter already costs less than 80 million apiece. How much does our Su-57 cost and how many of them are made?
And for example, shells are now riveted in Pakistan and are you sure that the Americans buy them at a higher price than ours?

Just look at the structure of the US GDP, what share of the GDP is occupied by stock market speculation, derivatives, and the service and entertainment sectors.

And what? For example, until recently our Sberbank paid several million dollars a year to an American auditing firm for an international audit. And that this is not a profit just because no one pays a Russian auditing company, even in Africa?

It makes more sense to compare the real sector of the economy, and best of all in units and kilograms.

Easily. For example, Americans produce more than 10 million American cars and a thousand passenger planes. How many Russian cars and passenger planes are produced per year?
And we haven’t yet considered heart valves, or bulldozers and excavators.

The US economy is simply no longer able to maintain its own infrastructure, its own Navy and Air Force at the required level - the number of combat-ready ships and aircraft has been declining for many years now

Where do you get this from? Their number of aircraft carriers is stable at 10, and the number of MAPLs and destroyers is growing every year! If our fleet, like theirs, was replenished every year with a destroyer of the level of Arleigh Burke and there were at least three such destroyers in the Black Sea Fleet, we would have won the Northern Military District long ago and our squadron in the Mediterranean would have been a real force and not the fleet of the Planet of pink ponies.

Look at their shipbuilding. On the state of their ship repair facilities

I look and...? They build an aircraft carrier faster than we do, a corvette, and a destroyer faster than we do. Misunderstandings 22160. Do you think that this is their problem in shipbuilding?

They have a systemic crisis everywhere. And this crisis has reached such a level that no amount of money can fix it.

In short, "America Kirdyk"? This bullshit was invented by Khrushchev and I’ve been hearing it since the 70s, only the kirdyk came to us just in 1991. Do you want to repeat it?

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

In short, "America Kirdyk"?

It is better to ask the Americans about this, and a considerable part of them already think so.

Quote: ramzay21

only the kirdyk came to us just in 1991. Do you want to repeat it?

And Katz suggests surrendering?
In fact, both in the economy and for hegemony (even if only economically) the United States now has China against it. And we are simply defending our living space.

Quote: ramzay21

And how can we explain to people that we have fallen from 8th place to 15th and our economy has become smaller than the economy of Australia, which has a population of 20 million?

Yes, everything is explained simply - the Central Bank has dropped the ruble exchange rate by 2 times, and the budget receives income mainly from taxes from oil and gas exports (about 50%). And so, in one fell swoop, the Russian Federation’s nominal GDP halved. Although in rubles it remained the same and even gradually grew. That's how it was explained. Questions about why they didn’t develop their production were not addressed to me, but to Yeltsin, who signed the capitulation, who handed over the entire financial system of the Russian Federation (99%) to England and the United States (shareholders of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation - “Bank of England 49,5% and the US Federal Reserve 49,5%, 1%, and XNUMX% from the first chairman of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation, Gerashchenko).

Quote: ramzay21

even with oil prices returning above $60, they are not able to bring us even into the top ten largest economies in the world!

What's the difference ? According to the IMF Fiscal Rule, everything above $40 per barrel went to the shareholders of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation in the so-called. "reserve funds" that are inaccessible to our government. This same Budget Rule was canceled by Putin’s decree on February 25.02.2022, XNUMX. Why do you think it was on this day? But now all revenue from our energy resources goes entirely to the budget of the Russian Federation and to the accounts of exporters. That is why there was a lot of money in the treasury. So much so that even with such a revenue part of the budget, when laying down the budget deficit for this year, we (counting by month) have a deficit that is either completely symbolic or the usual budget SURPLUS. And despite the war, sanctions and other joys of life.
So this is not “objective reasons” or the evil intent of the Kremlin, but the will of the true owners of the money that the Russian Federation has exactly such a ruble exchange rate. Well, in the current conditions, we have no need for a strengthening of the ruble. This course stimulates domestic production and optimizes export revenues.
Protective rate from Nabiulina?
This is very tough and extremely “patriotic” for the Central Bank, after such a patriotic demarche they asked for... the right to bear arms... and not just any pistol, but submachine guns!! Are they afraid of people's love?
Her .

[ramzay21]

It’s better to ask the Americans about this, and a considerable part of them already think so

It is on our TV that they spread this nonsense. Have you been to America yourself? Have you talked to the Americans yourself? Roll up and try to ask

And Katz suggests surrendering?
In fact, both in the economy and for hegemony (even if only economically) the United States now has China against it. And we are simply defending our living space.

I propose to change the oligarchic-feudal system and the brilliant geostratekh along with his effective managers for something more viable and working. And to live in the hope that the big guys from China and the USA will solve everything and help us and protect our lot has endured.

Yes, everything is explained simply - the Central Bank has dropped the ruble exchange rate by 2 times, and the budget receives income mainly from taxes from oil and gas exports (about 50%)

I'll tell you a terrible secret! The Central Bank is not able to hold back the collapsing market just as you are not able to hold back the coming of winter!
The ruble exchange rate fell because a huge imbalance in the trade balance arose and the flow of foreign currency from raw materials fell, but the demand for foreign currency remained the same. As you can see, everything is actually very simple.
[quoteAnd so, in one fell swoop, the Russian Federation’s nominal GDP halved. Although in rubles it remained the same and even grew slowly][/quote]
GDP fell by half simply because it fell by half. And the ruble fell because the cost of raw materials in the world fell by more than half and, as a result, they began to pay less for the same amount of goods and, therefore, GDP fell.

And so, in one fell swoop, the Russian Federation’s nominal GDP halved. Although in rubles it remained the same and even gradually grew

If the GDP of the USA or Germany is also calculated in rubles, then it turns out that their GDP has doubled in rubles, while ours has remained the same And this amazing mathematical discovery only confirms that there was no conspiracy by the Central Bank, but simply that GDP fell by half, with all the ensuing consequences. And GDP fell due to illiterate and criminal economic management.

Questions about why they didn’t develop their production were not addressed to me, but to Yeltsin, who signed the surrender,

Yeltsin has not ruled the country for 25 years How long can you hide behind this excuse? In 25 years, without expensive oil and gas, Stalin built a superpower with the second economy in the world and won the war against all of Europe, although he came to power in a destroyed, illiterate and hungry country.

which handed over the entire financial system of the Russian Federation (99%) to England and the United States (shareholders of the “Central Bank of the Russian Federation” - “Bank of England 49,5% and the US Federal Reserve System 49,5%, and 1% from the first chairman of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation Gerashchenko). Therefore, The shareholders of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation are spinning our finances the way they want, and if you don’t get rid of the stranglehold, it’s just a war.

Don't be offended, but forget this nonsense and never remember it again! Our Central Bank cannot belong to anyone other than the state. It is the regulatory body and the only first tier bank

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

Don't be offended, but forget this nonsense and never remember it again! Our Central Bank cannot belong to anyone other than the state. It is the regulatory body and the only first tier bank

Young man, me in the period 1991 - 1992. worked in one of the main structures of the Rothschilds in the USSR\then the Russian Federation (though he himself did not know for sure then, but Mikhail\Khodorkovsky\openly spoke about it not so long ago), at NTTM. So many processes then took place before my eyes, there is no need to argue with me and look funny. I then personally communicated and became acquainted with many future billionaires and oligarchs. And the fact that in the summer of 1992 the entire oil production industry of the Russian Federation did not collapse, was not bankrupt and bought up by “Western investors” is also my modest merit. So don't make faces and throw poop at the fan. The law on the Central Bank was adopted during the collapse of the USSR and it was then that the entire financial sector was transferred under the control of supranational bankers. That’s why such a collapse of the economy happened in 1992, and hyperinflation was rampant; CIA officers wrote the “Constitution of the Russian Federation” for Yeltsin. And there is no need to argue, you definitely weren’t there.

Quote: ramzay21

Have you been to America yourself? Have you talked to the Americans yourself?

Americans are different, I talked to some people, but mostly with people who come from us - communication is easier. And I hardly watch TV.

Quote: ramzay21

I propose to change the oligarchic-feudal system and the brilliant geostratekh along with his effective managers for something more viable and working.

Do you have any candidates?
Full team?
Will they really cope? Won't they get bogged down in theft and turn out to be traitors to the Motherland?
Or do you want to steer yourself?
I am not defending the current elite. I don’t want a new catastrophe for my Country and People, because the previous margin of safety no longer exists. For me, the best option is “Revolution from the top” - a controlled process of purification and rotation of the elites. . Now, by the way, the war is going on, and it is already purifying both Society and the Army, and even, little by little, the authorities.

Quote: ramzay21

GDP fell by half simply because it fell by half.

Lies and utter stupidity. There was no recession in the economy (production of goods and services). The Central Bank simply collapsed the ruble exchange rate, explaining this with standard nonsense. , budget revenues were approximately at the same level, and oil prices... What do you know about the “Fiscal Rule” from the IMF? We didn’t receive more than the price for oil that was set for us, everything that was higher was sterilized (bank expression) in the so-called. "reserve funds". So don’t listen to Nabiulina, this is just the governor of the IMF in the Russian Federation.

Quote: ramzay21

GDP fell due to illiterate and criminal economic management.

In a country under external financial control, this can always happen without a compelling economic reason.
And mind you, with the beginning of the Northern Military District, our management in the Moscow Region turned out to be incompetent, but the economic bloc turned out to be at its best. And in 2022 alone, the country earned an “extra”/above-plan $200 - 250 billion from energy exports alone. And to this day, not only has the economy not collapsed, but economic growth has also appeared, and budget revenues have grown astronomically. Despite all the efforts of Nabiulina to kill growth by increasing the Central Bank discount rate.
But until recently, the Defense Ministry was headed by the Knight of Malta with a retinue of embezzlers, spies and saboteurs.
Do you have someone instead? Platoshkina? And who will listen to him?

[ramzay21]

So many processes then took place before my eyes, there is no need to argue with me and look funny. I then personally communicated with many future billionaires and oligarchs and was acquainted

Oh then it’s a different matter! This is a powerful argument, I won't argue anymore I only listen to you The Central Bank has been captured and belongs to the Rothschilds and Gerashchenkos, right?

That is why such a collapse of the economy happened in 1992, and hyperinflation was fierce,

Amazing version Ordinary economists believe that the collapse of 92 occurred due to the uncontrolled printing of unsecured money since the late 80s and the collapse of oil and gas prices, multiplied by the rupture of complex production chains and the complete stop of the country’s financial system. But of course you know better

Americans are different, I talked to some people, but mostly with people who come from us - communication is easier.

This means you haven’t been to America and haven’t spoken to Americans But we're sure what they say
And I was there many times and spoke with ordinary Americans. Of course, they have problems, but they are not at all the same as ours, and that is why millions of our not very stupid people went there, and they can be found everywhere. But I don’t notice the crowds of Americans here.

Do you have any candidates?

Now such people are a threat to power and they are immediately imprisoned or physically eliminated.
No one knew Lenin in August 1917, but already in November the whole world recognized him!

Lies and utter stupidity. There was no decline in the economy (production of goods and services)

I explained to you how it all happened, I can’t do it any simpler, and you don’t hear anything

The Central Bank simply collapsed the ruble exchange rate, explaining this with standard nonsense. , budget revenues were approximately at the same level, and oil prices

Again. The Central Bank does not set the ruble exchange rate, just as the Hydrometeorological Center does not set the weather throughout the country, it is not able to do this. The ruble exchange rate is determined in the market by the supply and demand of the currency. The Central Bank can only CONTAIN exchange rate fluctuations by selling or buying currency from its reserves.
If the price of oil fell from 100 dollars in 2013 to 30 dollars in 2014, and we were producing 10 million barrels per day, then only this prevented 700 million dollars per day or 254 billion dollars per year from coming to the market! Plus about the same amount from gas! Where will the Central Bank get $500 billion a year for sale? All the reserves there were $500 billion. The Rothschilds and Gerashchenkos?

What do you know about the IMF's "Fiscal Rule"? We didn’t receive more than the price for oil that was set for us, everything that was higher was sterilized (bank expression) in the so-called. "reserve funds".

Did you understand what you wrote? Apparently you don’t understand what you’re writing about, but you have your own opinion and it’s funny. Don’t be offended, I don’t want to conduct an educational program, but read at least something about macroeconomics and the banking system, and you will understand what the Central Bank is doing and why reserves are needed, which were also in the USSR

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

I don’t argue anymore. I’m only listening to you. The Central Bank has been captured and belongs to the Rothschilds and Gerashchenko, right?

How funny is your concern about the incognito nature of world banking.

Quote: ramzay21

Ordinary economists believe that the collapse of 92 occurred due to the uncontrolled printing of unsecured money since the late 80s

And for whom was this money printed?
Not even since the late 80s, but let's say in 1991? In such volumes? And were they exported in cash as collateral for loans? What was prohibited by law? At a monstrously low rate? To whom were these hundreds of billions of printed Soviet rubles transferred?
Remember the minister who was involved in this?
Pavlova?
And his reform? Reform in his name?
And why did world banking need such an avalanche of Soviet cash? Exactly cash?
Do you remember what was written in small print at the bottom of Soviet banknotes? What are they provided with?
It was for this all and at the book price that they came/returned to Russia and other former republics of the USSR immediately after the Belovezhskaya Conspiracy, the coup and the “dissolution of the USSR”. That's when these cash Soviet rubles, received at a rubbish exchange rate, returned. And they immediately began to buy the most valuable assets - strategic enterprises, everything that is most valuable and interesting for world banking. Moreover, precisely at the book price of the Soviet period. Because it is written on the banknotes what they are backed by. And of course - GOLD. The same gold reserves that disappeared somewhere when Yeltsin came to power. And the party treasurers somehow began to throw themselves out of the windows together.
And they implemented all this through the structures and people deployed ahead of time. Mostly young people. - Komsomol leaders, so-called. "independent trade unions", national-religious communities. And it was a two-handed game - under the leadership of the party bosses (who were then immediately abandoned) and the KGB of the USSR, which was directly involved in this.
How else was liquidity unsecured by goods pumped up?
Through the unlimited issuance of loans to trusted commercial “cooperatives” and LLCs under often fictitious agreements and contracts.
This all exploded in 1992. Moreover, a simply monstrous mass of people who were not provided with any cash ruble supply entered the country. Several hundred billion in cash.
Not out of stupidity - by conspiracy, deliberately and consciously.

Quote: ramzay21

I have been there many times and spoke specifically to ordinary Americans.

That's noticeable .
And did you discover that the standard of living there is many times higher than in the Russian Federation? So in the colonies the standard of living is always lower than in the metropolis.

Quote: ramzay21

Where will the Central Bank get $500 billion a year for sale? All the reserves there were $500 billion.

Firstly, there is no need to go overboard with the amounts. Secondly, up to a third of this amount was stably sterilized in “reserve funds” and did not participate in circulation. Thirdly, we have a chronic surplus in foreign trade; we simply do not need as much foreign currency as we receive from foreign trade. Nothing terrible would have happened if our trade balance had leveled out, and the difference had been covered from reserves (after all, that’s what they are needed for). But the trick is that we do not have access to these reserves and can only get them through external investments and financing of international projects. . Therefore, there was only one way left for the government - to drop the ruble exchange rate and improve budget capacity. So in 2015, the collapse of the exchange rate was a concerted event. And then Russia had nothing to fight for its interests, and all its heavy weapons were located beyond the Urals. Therefore, the ruble exchange rate was halved, but they began to return troops to the European part of the country and accelerate the rearmament of strategic nuclear forces. The Knight of Malta stole and sabotaged a lot, but we rearmed the strategic nuclear forces. We will not be as rich as the United States for a very long time, unless they fall into the Civil War. But we will defend our place in the sun. Incl. and force of arms. And our weapons are good.
The IMF and World Bank switched to calculating GDP using PPP precisely because it is impossible to compare economies at face value. When the dollar cost 2015+ rubles before the beginning of 30. , a qualified specialist in the Russian Federation receiving 30 thousand was pleased and satisfied. Now he receives about 90 thousand. And it turns out that at face value for the population everything has become 3 times worse, but in reality the purchasing power of the salary of a qualified specialist has remained at approximately the same level. Except for imported goods, which are traded at face value + customs duty. And how can we calculate GDP at par? Especially considering that the purchasing power of the dollar has also seriously declined during this time? So it turned out that at face value the economy shrank by two or three times, and the country produced as many goods and services as it produced, and even increased it. So they believe in the World Bank that the real exchange rate of the ruble should be at the level of 30-35 rubles. for a dollar. That’s why the odds are set like this. If you want to argue about this, go to the IMF and the World Bank. One can only argue about the size of the coefficient.

Quote: ramzay21

I don’t want to conduct an educational program, but you should read at least something about macroeconomics and the banking system,

Young man, what can you know about Political Economy if “Economics” sticks out like a crowbar in your head? And manuals from the owners, who, according to you, are “not there”.

Quote: ramzay21

you read at least something about macroeconomics and the banking system, and you will understand what the Central Bank does and why reserves are needed,

Where you read, we wrote. Incl. about reserve funds.

[ramzay21]

All clear! This is a conspiracy!

Young man, what can you know about Political Economy if “Economics” sticks out like a crowbar in your head?

Special thanks for the young man! It's a compliment!
Glad you read Political Economy too! Especially for you. Macroeconomics is part of the science Economics and Economics is a book that was even sold in stalls in the early 90s.

And manuals from the owners, who, according to you, are “not there”.

Macroeconomics is a science and its laws worked even for the USSR and are working for the DPRK and Cuba. And manuals are instructions on what to do. These are slightly different things.

Where you read, we wrote. Incl. about reserve funds.

So you invented reserve funds?
Didn't you come up with the wheel and the locomotive by any chance?

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

So you invented reserve funds?

For the oil and gas industry of the Russian Federation in conditions of hyperinflation in 1992, I. Implemented it through the analytical group (leader) of the “brainstorming” at the ministry (oil and gas). But this was within the framework of a comprehensive program. It was recommended by the minister and adopted by all oil companies in the country and Gazprom.

Quote: ramzay21

Economics is a book that was even sold in stalls in the early 90s.

I remember this book, large with a dust jacket. Stupid, crafty and very harmful. The impression is that it was written for clinical de-Bilov. Now this is the only economic discipline in the economy of the Russian Federation. Political economy is currently taught in only two universities in the country.

Quote: ramzay21

Glad you read Political Economy too!

Read fiction and manuals/instructions. I studied it, practiced it, and even participated a little in scientific work.

Quote: ramzay21

Did you invent reserve funds?

The ones you mean were invented by Fed shareholders long before the collapse of the Union. And they imposed them on all their satellite countries, which used dollars for international payments - to sterilize the excess/unsecured money supply in specially invented “reserve funds”. Soon after the decoupling from gold. The funds I proposed were for companies in the industry. Some other companies (from other industries) later implemented this for themselves.

Quote: ramzay21

manuals are instructions on what to do. These are slightly different things.

But you use them.

[ramzay21]

For the oil and gas industry of the Russian Federation in conditions of hyperinflation in 1992, I. Implemented a brainstorming session at the ministry (oil and gas) through the analytical group (head)

Wow you are so honored

Read fiction and manuals/instructions. I studied it, practiced it, and even participated a little in scientific work.

Judging by what you write, you leaned more on the yellow press, in which visits of aliens with conspiracy theories are printed

Now this is the only economic discipline in the economy of the Russian Federation. Political economy is currently taught in only two universities in the country.

Once again especially for you. Economics is a book and Economics is a science the same as Physics or Mathematics.
Political economy is one of the theories of the science of Economics in the Macroeconomics section. Simply studying Political Economy and not knowing what Economics is is like studying the Theory of Relativity and at the same time denying Physics You are an amazing political economist

The ones you mean were invented by Fed shareholders long before the collapse of the Union.

Reserve Funds existed long before the Fed and were called the Gold Reserve. If you studied economics you would know such a basic thing

And they imposed them on all their satellite countries, which used dollars for international payments - to sterilize the excess/unsecured money supply in specially invented “reserve funds”. Soon after the decoupling from gold.

Another elementary thing of economics that you are not familiar with!
If you studied economics, you would know the reason for the abolition of the gold standard

But you use them

You forgot to call me a sissy and an agent of the State Department Absolutely predictable actions. If there are no arguments in a dispute, then tsipso

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

You forgot to call me a sissy and an agent of the State Department

I don't know whose agent you are.
But you are defending an existing and already bankrupt economic model from which our country is now trying to crawl out (and the first attempts were in the fall of 2005). And you ignore the truisms of Political Economy and simply World History. You don’t look like an ordinary enthusiastic person, which means you act consciously, purposefully and are interested in the result to the detriment of our state. It is not for me to evaluate your efforts, but you have been demonstrating it very clearly for a long time. And such activities, as a rule, are not carried out for free.

Quote: ramzay21

If there are no arguments in a dispute, then tsipso

There are more than enough arguments, but you ignore them, so further dispute is meaningless and inappropriate.

Quote: ramzay21

Reserve Funds existed long before the Fed and were called the Gold Reserve.

There are different reserves, but you are again screaming about “conspiracy theories” (by the way, all the intelligence services in the world are doing just that) and pretending to be Dunno. They forgot to mention that there are also military, labor, material, sports, and grain reserves.
Your Chutzpah is appreciated.

[ramzay21]

forgot to mention that there are also military, labor, material, sports, and grain reserves

Labor reserves was a popular name for sports teams during the Soviet Union.
And gold and foreign currency reserves are a more advanced form of the Gold Reserve, which existed in all developed countries, even the ancient ones, and was intended to survive difficult times and was collected during well-fed times! And in normal families, money has long been put aside for a rainy day!
Only you don’t like such a simple explanation, you need a conspiracy

But you are defending an existing and already bankrupt economic model from which our country is now trying to crawl out (and the first attempts were in the fall of 2005).

You don’t look like an ordinary enthusiastic person, which means you act consciously, purposefully and are interested in the result to the detriment of our state

How do you combine these contradictory ideas in your head?
How can one be against the oligarchic-feudal system and at the same time support the one who runs this system and who protects the interests of the oligarchs and feudal lords?
I am against such a system and against such a leader. In my opinion, the best system for our country is the Chinese one, built on the basis of the Stalinist socialist system, only the oligarchs and feudal lords will not give up the loot just like that, and the leader who guards their interests will not take the loot from them either!

And you ignore the truisms of Political Economy and simply World History

But does Political Economy protect the oligarchic system and its leader and defender?
And Political Economy is an idea within the framework of the science of Economics, and not knowing Economics and its laws does not allow you to understand Political Economy as it should be understood.
And which of us is the enemy is a big question. You who support the current course of the country which is leading to the terrible past of feudalism or people like me who are against such a course.
I am writing this only because I see that your thoughts are still in the right direction, that you are still a patriot, but you have not yet come to the same conclusions as me

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

you need a conspiracy

It just so happens that I am personally acquainted with him (the conspiracy).

Quote: ramzay21

But you are defending an existing and already bankrupt economic model from which our country is now trying to crawl out (and the first attempts were in the fall of 2005).

Quote: ramzay21

How can one be against the oligarchic-feudal system and at the same time support the one who runs this system and who protects the interests of the oligarchs and feudal lords?

And again, you didn’t understand anything, and I even gave you the date. I'll try to decipher it. In the second half of 2005, some activities were carried out to prepare for the nationalization of the Financial System of the Russian Federation. A person responsible for this was appointed, purges began in the banking sector - commercial banks found to be transferring capital abroad were deprived of their licenses, the ultimate goal was the abolition of commercial banking, so that a few large state-owned (relatively industry-owned) remained to carry out financial activities. The head of this program was appointed by the president, a person close to him with very broad powers. And this person voiced the above goals publicly (which was a mistake). In the fall of 2005, the establishment of the Sharapov Economic Society took place, and it so happened that I also took part in voting for the establishment of this society. A representative from the President was also present there.
And about two weeks later he was killed. Indicatively, in the evening at the exit from the training room. The contractor is from Ukraine, the customer was recognized/appointed as one banker, whose commissioner had the day before deprived of the license of five of his banks. Then there was a raid from world banking and the program of nationalization of the financial sector had to be curtailed (from Russia they demanded complete nuclear disarmament and the transfer of all nuclear weapons to the control of the United States. McKay came with an ultimatum, just on the eve of the murder (a couple of weeks before, he left Moscow as if not in day of establishment of the Economic Society named after Sharapov.
Agreed then . The Russian Federation refused to nationalize the Financial system, but we were allowed to carry out pre-monetization of its economy from 4% to 40% of GDP (with a norm of 100%). This is why until 2014 there was such high growth of the Russian economy (about 7% per year). . At the same time, Western bankers guaranteed lending to our business at a low/normal interest rate, albeit in foreign currency.
Those. An attempt to jump off the needle of world banking was made in 2005 immediately after Russia paid off all its external debts. Immediately as soon as I paid.
Unlucky. They threatened us with a war for which we were unprepared.
And then there was that same “Munich speech”. And an article was published in Germany, “The Louse That Growled.” Remember?
Since then, the rearmament of the Army began. With all the problems and scandals, we have rearmed our strategic nuclear forces. Now a full-fledged Ground Army is being deployed, new formations are being formed. A new shipbuilding program for the Navy is being prepared (or already), two new shipyards are being built, and the task has been set to load all the stocks to the maximum. And strict control from thieves. The person responsible from the AP for this (for shipbuilding) is Patrushev. His son headed the Ministry of Industry and Trade, and the hoarse saboteur was relegated to a symbolic position. And oddly enough, there is enough money for all these programs. For all .
This is not a panegyric for the authorities, it is an explanation of what is really happening.
But power corrupts, and I know very well how any official or boss is taken into account immediately after appointment. On corruption and sabotage. And for external offerings by bringing everything stolen into their jurisdiction. They told us themselves.

Quote: ramzay21

In my opinion, the best system for our country is the Chinese one, built on the basis of the Stalinist socialist system,

How are you? Why exactly Chinese? In my opinion, the optimal economic model is precisely the Stalinist Economic System (and the Financial System too), as the most effective. She began to truly reveal her potential and qualities precisely in the post-war period. When small and partly medium-sized businesses are given to private (individual) and cooperative businesses, and all basic industries and strategic industries are in state (public) ownership. Under Stalin, the entire service sector and most of the consumer market were given over to cooperatives and private traders (individual entrepreneurs). As a result, the consumer market was filled with high-quality and varied goods, and the well-being of the People grew. And if you read his latest works on this topic (some are unfinished), then this is generally a treasure trove. It was precisely this model that allowed the USSR to twice emerge from bast shoes and devastation into the second economy of the World and lead half of this World, uniting it under the banner of the CMEA and the Countries of the Socialist Commonwealth. To have the highest rates of development in the world on a stable basis and to be so attractive that all countries and peoples liberating themselves from the colonial yoke sought to ally with us, and in the capitalist countries themselves there were quite powerful communist parties and movements. So strong that they had to be restrained from directly seizing power, because at that time it was untimely.
A successful, powerful state based on its entire People, with powerful social elevators and freedom of self-realization, with universal and the best Education in the World, universal and free Health Care and the most advanced Science. A country looking to the future, completely free in its decisions and impregnable militarily. This is the request of the Society today. But we definitely won’t survive a new revolution, especially in war conditions. The most rational is the so-called. "revolution from above". With a positive rotation of the elites and clearing them of traitors, saboteurs, spies and idlers.
And as for the first person... it is not eternal, but the “fucking” (according to Lukashenko) of the elites has already begun and seems to be gaining momentum. And the conditions of war/military threat are perfect for these processes.

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

How much does the new Toyota Camry cost here and how much in the USA?

But here protective duties work for the sake of launching our own automobile industry. There have been a lot of assembly plants, now they are setting up a full cycle. And the money for this comes directly from the tax/import duty on cars.

Quote: ramzay21

And why can’t you buy a Mavic or a thermal imager in China several times cheaper than the Americans?

Chinese Mavics are already inexpensive, but you need to set up your own production because the demand is huge.

Quote: ramzay21

Why does our gasoline cost the same as in America?

Because “The people are the second oil.” This is state policy. In Kazakhstan, for example, gasoline is several times cheaper, although it is transported there from our own refineries.

Quote: ramzay21

the best fighter F-35 already costs less than 80 million apiece.

A large and long series makes it so cheap.

Quote: ramzay21

How much does our Su-57 cost and how many of them are made?

According to the government contract and at the exchange rate at the time of its conclusion - 37 million dollars. Su-34 - about 28 million dollars. , Su-30SM about 30 million dollars. , Su-35S - about 35 million dollars. for the first episode.

Quote: ramzay21

how many of them are made?

This year 24 units will be delivered. , all of them have been on the stocks since last year.
Starting next year they promise 30 pieces. per year, this is the productivity of the new assembly shop.
Su-34M, Su-30SM2 and Su-35S\SM will be produced in 24-30 units each from this and next year. in year. Those. In total, 4++ and 5th generation heavy fighters will be delivered per year (from this year) at 100 - 120 units. Not bad in my opinion.
The MiG-35S has also been put into production and the first batches will go out this year, but it is possible that all of them will be exported.
They are going to fly the Su-75 into the sky by the end of this year - a year+ earlier than promised.

Quote: ramzay21

Until recently, our Sberbank paid several million dollars a year to an American auditing firm for an international audit.

They paid their owners and shareholders. look who is the shareholder of Sberbank and don’t forget who owns the joint stock company of the Central Bank of the Russian Federation.

Quote: ramzay21

Where do you get this from? Their number of aircraft carriers is stable at 10, and the number of MAPLs and destroyers is growing every year!

What if we compare not with us, but with China? After all, it is with China that the United States has a competition for leadership. We are simply protecting our living space. And China’s total VI of warships built per year is 4 times higher than that of the United States. And even more so - there are 20 times more civil courts than the United States. Everything can be learned by comparison.

[Silhouette]

Quote: bayard

But here protective duties work for the sake of launching our own automobile industry.

Protective tariffs have been in place since the Chinese rode bicycles, and the domestic auto industry has never taken off. I remember Kadannikov and Berezovsky introduced these same protective duties, but, unfortunately, they do not work. The domestic auto industry never existed. I don't mean UAZ and KAMAZ. I mean crossovers and other sedans.

[bayard]

Quote: Silhouette

The domestic auto industry never took off.

So I didn’t write that success is guaranteed, let’s see how it all ends this time. We have been fine with the screwdriver assembly for a long time, the quality is quite good, and the specialists are on site. The question now is with localization of the full cycle. And for this time it is necessary. In 2-3 years we'll see what comes of it.

[ramzay21]

So I didn’t write that success is guaranteed, let’s see how it all ends this time.

So this is understandable. The loaf will get older and continue to be produced. UAZ Patriot too. And we don’t have any more domestic cars! And under the current government it cannot be.

[Silhouette]

Quote: bayard

In 2-3 years we'll see what comes of it.

The same as always. NOTHING.

[ramzay21]

But here protective duties work for the sake of launching our own automobile industry. There have been a lot of assembly plants, now they are setting up a full cycle. And the money for this comes directly from the tax/import duty on cars.

When they started singing this song in 2008, we really still had an auto industry. But protective duties are not the development of the automobile industry, but fraud on an especially large scale, the occupation of a monopoly position in the market and the theft of state funds on an especially large scale by oligarchs like Deripaska and the top corrupt officials lured by him! Do you know that our budget does not receive anything from these schemes and has increased its dependence on imports? Over the 16 years of their activity, our budget has missed more than a hundred billion dollars (8 trillion rubles) of net income!

According to the government contract and at the exchange rate at the time of its conclusion - 37 million dollars.

This is State Secrets actually!

They are going to fly the Su-75 into the sky by the end of this year - a year+ earlier than promised.

Wood?

What if we compare not with us, but with China? After all, it is with China that the United States has a competition for leadership. We are simply protecting our living space.

What are you going to defend with? The hope that the big guys from China will protect us?

And China’s total VI of warships built per year is 4 times higher than that of the USA

And what? China does not have ten nuclear aircraft carriers or almost a century of experience in their competent use. China does not have nearly eight dozen destroyers of the level of the most advanced destroyer in the world, Arleigh Burke. China does not have dozens of bases in all corners of the world, there are not so many MAPLs of the level of Virginia, there is no such satellite constellation, there are no ASW aircraft like Poseidon in adequate quantities, there are not so many AWACS and RTR aircraft.
But China, unlike us, is moving in the right direction. We are moving backwards.

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

Do you know that our budget does not receive anything from these schemes and has increased its dependence on imports?

Embezzlement and corruption in “New Russia” were from the beginning as a state-forming principle for the elites. I don’t believe that the budget receives anything (especially now). But I won’t talk/write about the success of a new undertaking, we’ll wait and see.
And the fact that our complex and knowledge-intensive industrial production was prohibited from outside is best seen from the example of the domestic civil aviation industry. It was not the competition that they failed to withstand, but it was us who were eliminated as a competitor + they gained a good market in the Russian Federation.

Quote: ramzay21

According to the government contract and at the exchange rate at the time of its conclusion - 37 million dollars.

This is State Secrets actually!

This is all from open sources, it was announced on all channels and resources, it was discussed, compared and served as a clear demonstration of “how much cheaper our best aircraft in the world are than American ones.” This information was also on the government procurement website.

Quote: ramzay21

They are going to fly the Su-75 into the sky by the end of this year - a year+ earlier than promised.

Wood?

I don’t think so, I didn’t believe that they would raise it so quickly, but we don’t have long to wait, we’ll see soon.

Quote: ramzay21

What are you going to defend with?

Do you doubt the reality of our strategic nuclear forces?

Quote: ramzay21

The hope that the big guys from China will protect us?

These “uncles” in China are not so big and now they are on the contrary waiting for military support from us, because they expect to receive the coveted 1000 nuclear warheads on strategic carriers by the end of 2030. So they are the ones who are vitally dependent on us. But money is earned mainly in the USA and Europe. That is why there is such a spinning of the fifth point.

Quote: ramzay21

And what? China does not have ten nuclear aircraft carriers or almost a century of experience in their competent use.

Not yet, but they are learning and building. In addition, in addition to the aircraft carriers themselves, they are very actively building the so-called. UDC Type.75 (10 units ordered, half built), and just the other day we spotted from a satellite the Type 76 UDC under construction - larger and ... with an electromagnetic catapult in the front part of the deck. There is no information about this new product yet, but the catapult suggests that China may soon have its own VTOL aircraft, which they have been working on for a long time, a delay in the engine (a copy of our R-279V-300, which they bought from us from an exhibition back in the mid-90s -X) . Work on the engine is coming to an end; thrust is promised at afterburner of 18 kg.p. , the airframe will most likely be based on the J-500\31. It is likely that by 35 they will have such a VTOL aircraft.

Quote: ramzay21

China does not have nearly eight dozen destroyers of the level of the most advanced destroyer in the world, Arleigh Burke.

But they already have (continue to build) about three dozen Type 52D destroyers and at least a dozen Type 055 destroyers, of which they seem to have planned to build five hundred. 4 Type.055 are handed over per year.
And they are building a new frigate, Type.054B, which is already quite an ocean-class frigate with VI up to 7000 tons. And they have about two and a half dozen of the previous Type.054A. And they continue to build new and more advanced ships. By the way, they have electric propulsion (Type.052D, Type.055, Type.054B, all their aircraft carriers have electric propulsion and it seems like UDC Type.075 too. In the USA, such an (electric) transmission for large ships is still only available dream.
What's the use of electric propulsion?
The ship has excessive power supply and on any of these you can safely install a combat laser (they already have one) as a means of short-range air defense.

Quote: ramzay21

China does not have dozens of bases in all corners of the world

They have dozens of artificial islands with airfields, radar stations, air defense systems and bases for ships. And for now they are going to defend their rights in the adjacent waterways and the South China Sea, strait zones for the freedom of their navigation. This is what they are investing in. And they build the Fleet.

[Sumotori_380]

China is counting on the protection of our strategic nuclear forces??? Oh my God!!!

[bayard]

Quote from Sumotori_380

China is counting on the protection of our strategic nuclear forces??? Oh my God!!!

Why are we surprised? Do we know the composition of Chinese strategic nuclear forces? What is the number of nuclear weapons on their strategic carriers? I'll give you a hint - until recently there were only 200 pieces. (permitted from the United States since the signing of the previous “Trade Agreement”. Now another agreement is in force, and at the last congress of the CPC it was decided to increase the number of nuclear warheads on strategic carriers to 2030 by 1000. In addition, we protect China with our early warning stations and we even built one of these for them.
So until the early to mid-30s, China was critically dependent on our strategic nuclear forces. But they have already learned how to make decent ICBMs.

Quote from Sumotori_380

Lord !!!

Don't mention it in vanity, he will punish you.
China has no allies, no one trusts it, and against itself it has close-knit coalitions from the most developed countries of this world. He is interested in us until the early to mid-30s, and this must be realized.
Look what they fly during joint patrols of sea areas with us - on modernized Tu-16s! Their PLO and AWACS aircraft are based on our An-12. They still have a long enough journey ahead (15 years) without war to feel quite confident in front of the forces opposing them.
We insure them, they insure us. But this is for a while, while we are on the way (their wording).

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

China does not have dozens of bases in all corners of the world, there are not so many MAPLs of the level of Virginia,

China's MAPLs are so-so so far - in terms of noise and stealth. But they are working on it. But they have a fairly large number of non-surface submarines. And both with Stirling and with LIAB. And such non-nuclear submarines can already fight on equal terms with the US MASN in their BMZ, strait zones and in the waters of the South China Sea.

Quote: ramzay21

there is no such satellite constellation

China has a very decent satellite constellation, and they are not puzzled by their presence in all the world's waters. But the United States will be very difficult to assemble sufficient forces of its Navy to compete with the Chinese Navy. It’s already not easy.

Quote: ramzay21

there is no PLO aircraft like Poseidon in adequate quantities

But they have their own PLO aircraft based on our An-12, they have mastered the radar method of detecting submarines using a water hump, and they also have a lidar detector on these PLO aircraft, capable of detecting submarines at a depth of up to 300 m. And with them with the abundance of bases on the islands of the South China Sea, they can patrol very vast water areas.

Quote: ramzay21

there are not so many AWACS and RTR aircraft.

Likewise, the United States will not collect all its old E-3As there. But China has AWACS aircraft, and there are several dozen of them. Work is underway on a carrier-based AWACS aircraft for aircraft carriers and services on the islands. They have AWACS aircraft and they build them themselves. On the glider of a clone of our An-12.

Quote: ramzay21

China, unlike us, is moving in the right direction.

It is building its fleet, developing aircraft engine manufacturing, expanding strategic nuclear forces... And it is cooperating more and more closely with Russia in the military field - joint exercises, joint patrols. At the same time, our fleets and the armed forces in general complement each other very well. We have advanced submarines, strategic nuclear forces and strategic nuclear forces, but a weak and insufficient surface fleet. China, on the contrary, has a very large and already quite modern surface fleet, but relatively weak strategic nuclear forces and insufficiently advanced submarines. In addition, we protect them with our early warning radars and even built such a radar for them. A very interesting division of roles and directions. Individually, both we (weak surface fleet) and they (imperfect submarines, weak strategic nuclear forces) are flawed, but in the aggregate it turns out very well if the enemy is the same for both.
But both our and Chinese weaknesses must be overcome.
We are now building a huge Merchant Fleet, which needs to ensure freedom of navigation, which means being present in all shipping waters of our Merchant Fleet. Therefore, a sufficiently strong and numerous surface fleet is needed. Moreover, both our exporters and our military are equally interested in this. Consequently, such a fleet will be built and for this purpose two more new large shipyards are being built. Patrushev was appointed responsible for the construction of this Fleet; at a meeting on this topic, the GDP set the task of loading our shipyards to the maximum so that not a single slipway would be idle. So far these are just words and intentions, but USC has completely replaced the management and placed it under the management of VTB (funding is and will continue to be made through it). It was separately emphasized that the replacement of the leadership of the Moscow Region and USC and the purges there were in order to eliminate embezzlement, sabotage and unprofessionalism. For now these are words and intentions, let's see how things go. And there is enough money for the construction of the Fleet. And business is now also interested in this.

[bayard]

Quote: ramzay21

the number of MAPLs and destroyers is growing every year!

And the number of cruisers?
Why has the total number of pennants been steadily declining in recent years? And not because they don’t want to - they can’t. How to maintain the total number of destroyers and cruisers at least 60 units. what if we build only one new ship per year?

Quote: ramzay21

our squadron in the Mediterranean would be a real force and not the fleet of the Planet of Pink Ponies.

At the beginning of the Northern War, we had a very strong group assembled in the Mediterranean Sea: 3 missile cruisers, 3-4 frigates, two or three BODs, three diesel-electric submarines, a MAPL (maybe more than one) and a bunch of small missiles. But this did not help us win in 2022, because for this (as it unexpectedly turned out) we need the Ground Army, and not a hodgepodge of 100 thousand bayonets. If it weren’t for the hastily mobilized two corps of the Donbass republics (60 thousand), a complete disaster would have happened.
Now we have about 600 thousand bayonets in the Northern Military District zone alone. We are advancing slowly, but without the “Brusilov breakthroughs”.

Quote: ramzay21

They build an aircraft carrier faster than we build a corvette

But the Chinese are still building 4 times more.
But here we rent out 2,5 PLAs per year, while in the USA only 1,5, and even then with difficulty. In addition, we rent out 2 - 2,5 diesel-electric submarines/nuclear submarines per year.
We build about 40-50 ICBMs and SLBMs per year. and the overwhelming majority of ICBMs and SLBMs are very fresh or simply new, but how old are the American Minutemen? Sixth decade?

Quote: ramzay21

Do you think that this is their problem in shipbuilding?

That's what they think.

[alexoff]

Quote: bayard

11 trillion rubles from the budget of the Moscow Region have been identified and become public, having “disappeared” without any trace (although for what period it is not stated, but this is 2,5 times the military budget of the pre-war Russian Federation. .

This is from 2009. But then the military budget was much smaller. As far as I remember, after 2014 we spent about a trillion on the state defense order, so this can be said to be the majority of the state defense defense during the entire period of Shoigu’s leadership.

[bayard]

Quote from alexoff

This is from 2009.

It turns out that in 15 years. But the main expenses were already under Shoigu. I think that there will be many more questions for this “golden boy” and “prince of the blood”. It looks like the old “family” is being squeezed out of power. And they will actively degrease.

[easy]

I don’t know where you got these numbers from, but if this turns out to be true (albeit with some errors), then it will be a real balm for the soul. There is only one question: will our economy be able to cope with this? After all, in addition to airplanes, we also need tanks, artillery, missiles, shells, etc., and in large quantities. All this is not so simple, but it costs good money. I would like to, but doubts gnaw at me.

[bayard]

Quote: forester

There is only one question: will our economy be able to cope with this? After all, in addition to airplanes, we also need tanks, artillery, missiles, shells, etc., and in large quantities.

All this is actually produced at different factories. Last year, the Russian Armed Forces received just over 1500 new and modernized tanks. This year more is expected, perhaps about 2500 pieces. New workshops have been built at UVZ and Omsktransmash, capacities are being expanded, and a new modification of the T-80 is being prepared for production.

Quote: forester

All this is not so simple, but it costs good money.

There is not just a lot of money in the country now. And not only because 25.02.2022/40/700. Putin abolished the “Budget Rule”, after which all proceeds from energy exports went to the budget and exporters (before that, everything above 750 dollars per barrel of oil went to the so-called “reserve funds”, inaccessible to our government. After the arrest of our reserves, we All loan payments to Western banks in the Russian Federation were arrested (and this is about XNUMX-XNUMX billion dollars), and the assets of Western companies in the Russian Federation largely became the property of the Russian Federation or its citizens. Huge funds from offshore companies have returned to Russia and are now being sought for themselves. the place of application (for investment) and in general, the budget revenues of the Russian Federation have grown very much. So much so that despite the SVO and spending on this war, budget investments (direct) went into a number of development programs, therefore, despite the practically stopped passenger car production and all the sanctions. The Russian economy shows growth. During the war, there is not just enough money for defense orders - there is not enough capacity to satisfy all orders, hence the expansion of the capacities of defense enterprises.
Latest information from the head of the budget commission of the State Duma - despite the fact that this year's budget was drawn up with a deficit, budget revenues are already beginning to exceed expenses. Those. Instead of a (planned) deficit, we can get... the usual surplus at the end of the year. You know that over the 2,5 years of the Northern Military District, our reserves have not only not been wasted, but are constantly growing. There are not enough production capacities to carry out state defense orders and other programs. So there is just enough money. There is not enough capacity.

[Andrey Gladkikh]

In fact, I completely agree with you. I would just like to note that the size of the economy of a superpower is very relative. A very large part of it consists of services that do not produce anything material (for example, legal services). And also the so-called capitalization of companies and firms, which can “collapse” at one moment.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Andrey Gladkikh

I would just like to note that the size of the economy of a superpower is very relative. A very large part of it consists of services that do not produce anything material (for example, legal services). A

Turn on the TV and watch commercials. It seems that in Russia they produce nothing except grub and credit cards. Entirely advertisements of banks with some kind of cashbacks.

[donpablo]

In Ukraine, not “everything” is shown to you! Everyone advertises residential complexes and resorts and cruises. sooooo many cars are advertised, both cars and trucks.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: donpablo

sooooo many cars are advertised

This is a Chinese Moskvich, to which the wheels have been screwed - our production?

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

The difference between 80% of the service sector in the American economy and 68% in the Russian economy is not that fundamental. By the way, even in China it is 55%, and the share of services is growing from year to year, while industry is falling.

But even if we take industry, many indicators are terrifying. America produces 10610 thousand cars, and Russia 729 thousand. America produced 528 airliners last year (and this despite the fact that all recent years have been very bad for Boeing and the French are squeezing out the market), Russia made 38 in the best peaceful year, and now produces individually. Unfortunately, I couldn’t find anything about the machine tool industry - if the USA is not in the first positions in the world with its 5-6 percent of global production, then Russia is not included in any rating at all.

[donpablo]

are you an idiot or from Ukraine? what "superpower" why? real production was killed, the debt is 35 trillion 124 billion, the state budget deficit is more than 1,5 billion, corruption is off the charts, the Houthis are calling for the “hegemon”, the Hungarians are calling for the “hegemon”, and the Georgians are calling for the “hegemon”

[ammunition]

Quote: ramzay21

captivating moods.

Yes. And many have.
But here’s what I think... I believe that throwing hats is a way of protecting the psyche.
A simple way to avoid going crazy. IMHO, of course.-)))
***
As for the power of economies - That !! Su-57 and F-35 were developed at the same time.
Peers.
F - 35 produced more than 1000 units.
Su-57 produced (including prototypes) 15 units.
So... it turns out not 10 times, but 60 times, judging by the production of aircraft. Alas..

[ramzay21]

But here’s what I think... I believe that throwing hats is a way of protecting the psyche.
A simple way to avoid going crazy. IMHO, of course.-)))

Most likely you are right! Unfortunately! Most live in the Matrix!
And the only way to fix everything is to accept reality and start correcting it while it is still possible to fix something!

[bayard]

Quote: ammunition

As for the power of economies - That!! Su-57 and F-35 were developed at the same time.

The F-35 was developed and put into production earlier. In addition, their order book is full, they still have to sweat and sweat over deliveries. Our only anchor customer fell through, financing deteriorated and the Moscow Region was twisting its hands with orders and prices. But not only the Su-57 has been developed and is being built here. Our Su-35S was being developed simultaneously with the F-35, and they were launched into production at approximately the same time.

Quote: ammunition

Su-57 produced (including prototypes) 15 units.

No . At the end of last year, only 22 Su-57s were delivered to the troops (almost a regimental set). Now a new workshop built specifically for this purpose (Su-57) has been launched, in which 24 Su-57s have been assembled on stocks since last year, which should be delivered by the end of this year (the construction cycle from laying on the stocks to delivery to the customer today is about 1,5 .35 years, for the Su-30S and Su-1SM for comparison the construction cycle is 57 year). Before this (the launch of a new workshop), the Su-4 was assembled at a pilot production facility, where no more than 30 aircraft could be assembled at the same time. So the real mass production began with the launch of the new workshop and the first full-fledged batch will be this year. And starting next year, when the workshop is at full capacity, XNUMX boards will be delivered per year. All this is disgusting with delays in the normal launch of the series due to the exceptionally bestial attitude of the former leadership of the Moscow Region and rampant embezzlement. Now the money has gone to the military-industrial complex. Big money, prepayment and direct payments.

Quote: ammunition

it turns out not 10 times, but 60 times

Why do you count only the production of the Su-57 (while deliberately lying)?
In the Russian Federation, FOUR types of heavy fighters of generation 4+\++ and 5 are simultaneously produced: Su-30SM2, Su-34M, Su-35S\SM and Su-57. This year, about 100 of these aircraft will be delivered to the customer. In addition, the return to service from storage of MiG-31s, their overhaul and modernization to the level of the MiG-31BM continues. . So there is no need to be cunning and draw a shadow over the fence. We (Russia) do not compete with the US economy, but we ensure our own security.
And we will build civilian airliners in commercial quantities, we will certify our own components instead of imported ones, and production will begin. It is already underway - aircraft are being assembled to the level of installing the missing equipment, so as not to stand idle, both Superjets and MS-21. When production starts, the production of civilian airliners after reaching design capacity for MC-21 and Superjets alone will be at least 100 units. in year . Plus the Tu-214 for the production of which in Kazan there is a lot of space - up to 20 units. in year . The entire delay is related to the preparation of industrial cooperation. The windbag Manturov did a lot of harm with his hoarse promises, but he is no longer the head of the Ministry of Industry and Trade.
All this will be because there is no alternative and we will simply have to build the planes ourselves and at a high enough pace to replace the entire fleet of imported airliners. And then there will be exports.

And there is no need to make faces, and we will also have a completely our own automotive industry. Simply because we got all the assembly plants of Western and Japanese companies, and they should not be idle. And international cooperation in this matter will have to be gradually reduced to a minimum, as experience has taught. And the machine tool industry is being restored, and in its most complex segments - the need for its own industry and the lack of alternatives. And new shipyards are being built, because we need ships, large and many, and warships to ensure safe navigation for these ships. You will have to do everything yourself again. And this is good .
And let depression torment the Shemers and their Western partners, they already have something to suffer from.

[ammunition]

Why do you count only the production of the Su-57 (while deliberately lying)?

1) Article about Su-57.
2) I took the quantity and development time from Wiki. I have nowhere else to go. I didn’t write any deliberate lies.

[thekhohol]

> 2) I took the quantity and development time from Wiki
You have to be careful with the wiki. Even children at school already know that the Russian-language wiki is filled 99% from TsIPSO.

[Bledar]

All the same mischievous sentiments.

Skomorokhov is accused of throwing hats, he survived)

[Yaroslav Tekkel]

And he has been for a long time. I won't speculate about the reasons.

[Pioneer1984]

About 10 times accurate information?

[Timon2155]

Skomorokhov began to have too many emotions and mistakes (semantic and grammatical). Is this the same Roman who writes this?

[Glagol1]

That. Stylistics and unique iambic cannot be faked!

[Timon2155]

This means that he was also bitten by the cheer-dog: impartiality has sunk into oblivion))))

[Rome]

Everything is written there with a pitchfork in the water.
And the Su-57 is already a series, albeit a small one

If we take into account the US propaganda about delaying the release of the Su57 and add someone’s assumptions that the Su57, after an upgrade, will correspond to the 6th generation, then the conclusion is quite logical: that the Russians will begin to produce the Su57 when the USA has a 6th generation, that’s why they compare

[Hippo]

"It would be logical if this Suchiu compared his NGAD with our Mig-41."
Natural "phantom".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMrcba9bTuA

[StopTheUSA]

Well, since they tell us so much from the Czech Republic itself...

[Ross xnumx]

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have. What the rest have is really their problem.

And who is interested in the speculations and problems of some Suchiu?
We are more concerned not with numbers, but with deadlines... For starters, at least the timing of mass production of “Product 30”...
Then the fate of the long-suffering TAVKR "Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov" is very interesting.
Again, WHEN and where will he begin his combat journey...
Everything is clear about the Armata: an expensive tank will not stand up against a dozen cheap drones...
And when will we see a barrage of fire from the incomparable “Coalition”?
* * *
We have no problems. Problems arise for those who, for two and a half years, living in regions bordering (and not so much) with Ukraine, cannot consider their life safe, no matter how much it is stated on the screens...
There is also a minor problem with YouTube, which has nothing to do with either State Duma deputy Khinshtein or:

Article 29
1. Everyone is guaranteed freedom of thought and speech.
2. Propaganda or agitation that incite social, racial, national or religious hatred and enmity is not allowed. Propagation of social, racial, national, religious or linguistic superiority is prohibited.
3. No one can be forced to express or reject their opinions and beliefs.
4. Everyone has the right to freely seek, receive, transmit, produce and disseminate information by any lawful means. The list of information constituting a state secret is determined by federal law.
5. Guaranteed freedom of the media. Censorship is prohibited.

[Dart2027]

Quote: ROSS 42

And when will we see a barrage of fire from the incomparable “Coalition”?

Artillerymen of the Russian Army in the Northern Military District zone received the first samples of the latest Coalition-SV self-propelled artillery mounts. The Rostec state corporation announced this at the beginning of the year.
Tests of the howitzer were successfully completed in 2023. They confirmed all the stated characteristics. Now this self-propelled gun will be tested in battle.
https://rg.ru/2024/01/09/koaliciia-priniata-na-vooruzhenie-i-vyshla-na-peredovuiu.html

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Dart2027

Now this self-propelled gun will be tested in battle.

You understand that at least in hindsight we learn about the destruction of various Abrams, Leoparts, Patriots and other crap. The use of TOS, Hyacinth, Iskander, FAB and other equipment is demonstrated. But they never showed the result of the work of Coalition-SV.
And enough time has passed to reveal the results.

[Dart2027]

Quote: ROSS 42

But they never showed the result of the work of Coalition-SV.

Because any image gives a trace to determine the location, and for media reasons, the enemy will strive to destroy them with all his might. They also wrote about the tests of the Armata and Su-57 in the Northern Military District, and also without specifying where and when.

[Dart2027]

Quote: ROSS 42

at least in hindsight we will know

They write about the destruction of various equipment in a day or two, without delay, and not in a few months.

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Dart2027

They write about the destruction of various equipment in a day or two, without delay, and not in a few months.

And the fact of application is important to us!!! We can wait a couple of months.

[Dart2027]

Quote: ROSS 42

And the fact of application is important to us!!!

The fact of its use was written about in the newspapers. Well, they will show a video of the arrival of several shells, what will change? I seriously doubt that anyone will distinguish this from any MSTA.

[Rome]

Everyone was waiting for the Coalition, so that all sorts of Caesars and Panzer2000 would stop feeling impunity, due to the distance of fire.

[Dart2027]

Quote: Eroma

so that all sorts of Caesars and Panzer2000 would stop feeling impunity, due to the distance of fire

True, but it is in principle impossible to saturate the entire front with them in a short period, and Lancets became the main means of fighting artillery.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: ROSS 42

We can wait a couple of months.

This is of no use: there was already a media report (and even a TV report - an interview with the howitzer commander) that the Coalition won the counter-battery duel with the German Panzerhowitzer 2000.
You just need to look more carefully and listen to messages from the NWO zone.

[bayard]

Quote: ROSS 42

And the fact of application is important to us!!!

Follow the periodicals more closely and you will know that three “Coalition-SV” groups (three self-propelled guns in each) have been working (and continue) since at least 2023. on three sectors of the front as fire brigades for counter-battery combat against long-range self-propelled guns made by NATO. And very successfully. They literally worked their butts off, the guys were really exhausted, but a lot depends on the quality of aerial reconnaissance and target designation, without which high-quality counter-battery warfare is simply impossible. Now, with such reconnaissance, target designation has simply become an order of magnitude better, and we see the result in footage of the destruction of enemy self-propelled guns every day. And I heard the work of the group of self-propelled guns "Coalition-SV" in the Donetsk direction last year from the center of Donetsk, because the sound of their shots is seriously different from other guns. So these self-propelled guns underwent military testing and combat use on the fronts of the Northern Military District to the fullest extent under the highest combat tension. Now serial self-propelled guns "Coalition-SV" have begun to enter the troops.
Why did it take so long to put it into production?
Yes, because there is only one plant for their production (which was almost bankrupt on the eve of the Northern Military District) and at its facilities, from the first days of the Northern Military District, repairs and modernization of the Msta-S self-propelled guns took place. And then it was more important to saturate the troops with proven and mastered self-propelled guns. More important was the quantity to saturate the artillery units and make up for losses. Meanwhile, “Coalition-SV” was being polished and prepared for the series.
In addition, with the arrival of new modifications of the active-reactive high-precision "Krasnopol" in commercial quantities into the troops, the firing range of such ammunition for "Geocint" and "Msta" (any) increased to 40+ km. , which made our most numerous artillery systems equal in range to most NATO guns. And when reconnaissance and target designation UAVs appeared in sufficient quantities, and the work with “Krasnopol” with such target designation was mastered by the troops, everything got better with counter-battery warfare, but for the enemy things were getting worse and worse.
For those who mocked our new wheeled self-propelled gun "Malva", I will say that with the new "Krasnopol" it hits at about 42 km. , and it is with these ammunition that counter-battery warfare is carried out and high-priority targets are hit at such a range.
But what the troops are still missing is... FPV drones. The enemy has many times more of them, and this is precisely why they are very effectively holding back our advance this summer. The production of such drones needs to be increased urgently and manifold.

[alexoff]

Quote: Dart2027

Because any image gives a trace to determine the location, and for media reasons, the enemy will strive to destroy them with all his might.

Nonsense, the mallows showed and nothing. Coalitions can work in Red Fields 50 km from the front, so they could show how artillery destroys the transferred reserves of the Ukrainian Armed Forces near Kharkov. The coalition apparently ordered 6 pieces and is now saving it for a rainy day

[Dart2027]

Quote from alexoff

Nonsense, the mallows showed and nothing

Malva is the same MSTA, only in a wheeled version.

[alexoff]

Yes, I know. But according to you, nothing can be shown, otherwise they will find and destroy it. Even if the video was posted a month later. Blurring what cannot be shown is something journalists should be able to do.

[Dart2027]

Quote from alexoff

But according to you, nothing can be shown

They show something, but the Mallows in question are not such a promoted new product as the Coalition or Armata.

Quote from alexoff

Blurring what cannot be shown is something journalists should be able to do.

There are no newbies working there either.

[alexoff]

They show something, but the Mallows in question are not such a promoted new product as the Coalition or Armata.

and let’s say, on the official channel of the Ministry of Defense they show a video of Krasnopol suddenly flying through a checkpoint in front of a Kharkov armored tank. Everyone is ah... numb. What will the enemies do next?

There are no newbies working there either.

yeah, some important person gave them all the drawings long ago, just so that his accounts in Switzerland would not be noticed and they know much more than us. And everything is fine with satellite reconnaissance, but we transport armor on open platforms around the country. Therefore, why not work as a prosecutor, and not as a lawyer for the Moscow Region, and assume that they ruined all the new weapons?

[Dart2027]

Quote from alexoff

they show a video of Krasnopol suddenly flying through a checkpoint in front of a Kharkov armored tank

What's the point? How does this differ from what was announced about their participation? Showing them themselves is yes, but then information about geolocation will also appear.

Quote from alexoff

yeah, some important person gave them all the drawings long ago, just so that his accounts in Switzerland would not be noticed and they know much more than us

Will there be witnesses? How about the rest?

[alexoff]

Quote: Dart2027

What's the point? How does this differ from what was announced about their participation?

for example, to show voters that at least some analogue network still works in the northwestern district

Quote: Dart2027

but then information about geolocation will also appear.

geolocation at what point? A week ago? Will enemies start shooting into the past?

Quote: Dart2027

Will there be witnesses? How about the rest?

evidence of potential enemy agents among senior officials? Is there any doubt that if trillions of rubles of the military budget disappear, then such persons will not be developed there? I’m generally surprised that some deputy minister has not yet surfaced in Germany, where he would tell how he opposed and destroyed the army from the inside. Or can only Dvorkovich and Kasyanov be defectors?

[Dart2027]

Quote from alexoff

for example, to show voters that at least some analogue network still works in the northwestern district

Voters are already shown a lot of things.

Quote from alexoff

geolocation at what point? A week ago?

Firstly, we show more or less recent news, and not what happened in the past. Secondly, in a week other troops will be stationed there and will fly over them.

Quote from alexoff

Is there any doubt that if trillions of rubles of the military budget disappear, then such persons will not be developed there?

But for now they only catch people for theft.

[alexoff]

Voters are already shown a lot of things.

something that was shown at the parades of 2015-2020 is now almost never shown at the Northern Military District

Firstly, we show more or less recent news, and not what happened in the past.

what an owl pulling on a globe

Secondly, in a week other troops will be standing there and will fly over them

Well, don’t let them stand, fence off a circle with a radius of 30 meters

But for now they only catch people for theft.

They almost never get caught for theft, only for bribes. And the theft is orders of magnitude less than what was not among the troops. One and a half million sets of uniforms and three hundred concrete shelters for aircraft have disappeared somewhere, unidentified persons stole money for the repair of the airfield where the Su-57s are parked, but no one is looking for anyone. Yes, even those generals who organized formations under the attacks of the Khemars, not only did not go to trial - they were not even expelled from the army

[Dart2027]

Quote from alexoff

were shown at parades in 2015-2020, now they are almost never shown at North Military District

When they created the same Armata, no one could have imagined how much the conditions of the database would change. So it turned out that many things have simply become unreasonably expensive.

Quote from alexoff

what an owl pulling on a globe

These are the facts.

Quote from alexoff

fence a circle with a radius of 30 meters

That is, there is nothing to argue.

Quote from alexoff

They almost never get caught for theft, only for bribes.

You think these are different people.

[alexoff]

When they created the same Armata, no one could have imagined how much the conditions of the database would change.

on the armata there should be a kaz that also works as a machine gun at slow-flying targets. But our strategists looked into the future and decided not to produce it; with the money saved, they purchased one hundred modernized T-72s a year. Otherwise, we would have armata in a number comparable to the number of abrams in the Vsushniks.

So it turned out that many things have simply become unreasonably expensive.

Well, yes, coalition and derivation turned out to be unnecessary, that’s what our strategists thought Why do we need air blast shells to combat flying targets or long-range artillery?

These are the facts.

Is it prohibited by Russian law to show footage from a week ago?

That is, there is nothing to argue.

should I say something to the stupidest argument in history, that the enemies will figure everything out, and tomorrow our people with tents will stand there at a rest stop and sit and wait for him to arrive?

You think these are different people.

I believe that the stolen trillions are from whomever is needed, and this is just a demonstrative flogging of some who wandered off the coast

[Dart2027]

Quote from alexoff

But our strategists looked into the future and decided not to produce it; with the money saved, they purchased one hundred modernized T-72s a year. Otherwise, we would have armata in number comparable to the number of abrams in the Vsushniks.

Well, did the Abrams help them a lot? I doubt about a hundred, but having 10 tanks that are not ultra-modern, but capable of performing all combat missions is better than having a super tank, but only 1.

Quote from alexoff

Well, yes, coalition and derivation turned out to be unnecessary

They have already written to you about the Coalition’s presence there.
The newest ZAK-57 “Derivation-PVO” was spotted in the combat zone
https://dzen.ru/a/ZYrc-r_25nM2zk7f

Quote from alexoff

Is it prohibited by Russian law to show footage from a week ago?

Rather, they try to show current news, and not what happened six months ago.

Quote from alexoff

say something to the stupidest argument in history

That is, there is nothing.

Quote from alexoff

I believe that the stolen trillions are from someone

Who?

[AdAstra]

“Confirmed the characteristics” - “What else do you want a dog?” (C) no offense of course.

[D16]

And enough time has passed to reveal the results.

For serial Kaolition to work, you need to:
1. Build factories for the production of self-propelled gun components. The existing facilities are occupied in three shifts.
2. Build a factory for assembling self-propelled guns. The reasons are the same.
3. Build factories for the production of components for new ammunition. And the ammunition is new.
3. Build a plant to produce new ammunition.
4. Purchase, having previously produced, new equipment for these industries. I'm not even talking about the production of means of production.
5. Train a bunch of people to fight with the new self-propelled guns and conduct maintenance on them. maintenance and repair.
And all this during the most intense war since the Second World War.
It is possible that she simply will not have time for this war for objective reasons. And not only her.

[Artunis]

And taking into account the policy of the Central Bank, which actually prohibited investment in the economy, this task has become simply impossible at all.

[D16]

Targeted programs do not depend on the discount rate. So let's pass.

[Artunis]

But figs, you guessed it. Each complex technical product consists of thousands of components and materials that are manufactured by small private firms. And where do these companies and small businesses get working capital???? In banks at crazy interest rates? It's not even funny.

[DenVB]

Quote: Artunis

And where do these companies and small businesses get working capital???? In banks at crazy interest rates?

There is such a word - "capital".

[D16]

And where do these companies and small businesses get working capital???? In banks at crazy interest rates?

In the same place as the rest. The production of components for the Su-57 is as much a defense industry as the aircraft itself. Another thing is that in order to get involved in the action, companies will have to join a large holding like KRET or UAC, but this is quite reasonable.

[vkfriendly]

There are no results yet - they are there, but... as previously written, the state corporation Rostec has carried out a regrouping - it has removed Uraltransmash and a number of other manufacturers of artillery systems from the control of Uralvagonzavod and transferred it to Tekhmash, controlled by the private holding company Technodinamika. Some experts were skeptical about this decision, but Rostec assured that this would help meet the artillery needs of the special operation. As a result, the production time for the promising Coalition-SV self-propelled artillery mounts (SPG) was delayed.

[D16]

Maybe cheaper than Iskander, no matter how strange it sounds?

[papas-57]

“And there’s also a minor problem with YouTube.” The problem is very big, because... affects the interests of millions of users. And the pretext is far-fetched. If someone needs to find something forbidden, they will find it, even without YouTube.

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: papas-57

If someone needs to find something forbidden, they will find it, even without YouTube.

It's right. First they write and adopt the Constitution, and then they themselves violate the rights of citizens specified in it.
Still, they couldn’t eradicate it: “ban it!” and “don’t let me in!”
This is where the collapse of the USSR began, when the bans were lifted. People rushed to gnaw on the “forbidden fruits” and only then found out what kind of “good” it was...
* * *
A person compares information received from different sources, learns logic and knowledge of truth. One-sided propaganda is worse than lies.

[Retired from the digital age]

They come down on YouTube precisely for their one-sided propaganda. Only you consider blocking the Russian point of view as freedom of speech, and the American one as its suppression.

In particular, since 2020, YouTube has limited access to 207 Russian channels, with 83 of them blocked in the first half of 2024. According to Roskomnadzor, most of the blocked channels belong to Russian state media and domestic authors expressing support for government policies.

Among the blocked channels are Solovyov LIVE, Crimea 24, RT, RBC, NTV and Channel One channels, as well as regional VGTRK channels. In addition, YouTube has limited access to the pages of musicians, including Yaroslav Dronov (SHAMAN), Polina Gagarina, Oleg Gazmanov, Grigory Leps and Yulia Chicherina. The list also included Olympic champion Nikita Nagorny and the football clubs CSKA and Akhmat, as well as the Moscow Exchange channel.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Retiree of the digital age

In particular, since 2020, YouTube has limited access to 207 Russian channels, with 83 of them blocked in the first half of 2024. According to Roskomnadzor, most of the blocked channels belong to Russian state media and domestic authors expressing support for government policies.

That is, they block selectively, and we are all in one group.

[Retired from the digital age]

I see that you are not very familiar with IT technologies. Only YouTube can block an individual channel on YouTube.

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Retiree of the digital age

Only YouTube can block an individual channel on YouTube.

I know. This somehow cancels the fact

Quote: Mordvin 3

They block selectively, and we are all in one heap.

?
For me, we need to look for other solutions.

[Retired from the digital age]

Maybe you're right. But they don’t bother, they just block - that’s all.

[Ross xnumx]

In particular, since 2020, YouTube has limited access to 207 Russian channels, with 83 of them blocked in the first half of 2024. According to Roskomnadzor, most of the blocked channels belong to Russian state media and domestic authors, expressing support for government policy.

Between going to the store and cooking cabbage soup, I missed several messages.
Let's just say that in order to express support for something, you need to have it. Apparently I missed something in life or I was taught poorly in the Soviet school, but I still do not understand the state policy pursued by United Russia and its “members” and “circles”. And supporting the repeated lies, or empty promises, is throwing dust in the eyes.

Quote: Retiree of the digital age

The list also included Olympic champion Nikita Nagorny and the football clubs CSKA and Akhmat, as well as the Moscow Exchange channel.

Sorry, but supporting Russian football, whose achievements are very dubious, is a waste of time.

[alexoff]

Quote: Retiree of the digital age

In particular, since 2020, YouTube has limited access to 207 Russian channels, with 83 of them blocked in the first half of 2024. According to Roskomnadzor, most of the blocked channels belong to Russian state media and domestic authors expressing support for government policies.

Well, instead of creating new channels every day instead of the old ones, we decided that since this was blocked, then we are all leaving YouTube. You can just as easily say tomorrow that Ukrainians don’t greet us with flowers, we were offended and withdrew all our troops from Donbass and Crimea, how do you like that, Biden?

[Electrical]

In particular, since 2020, YouTube has limited access to 207 Russian channels, with 83 of them blocked in the first half of 2024.

That is, because of some 200 blocked channels, they decided to block millions of other Russian channels. Well, in Washington they were happy. All sorts of Khinshteins spoil Russia even more than the United States, doing their work for the State Department. I wonder if Khinshtein receives the same salary from them for this? Or is he an ideological Russophobe? And instead of blocking anti-Russian channels, he proposes blocking all Russian ones.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: ROSS 42

First they write and adopt the Constitution, and then they themselves violate the rights of citizens specified in it.

You are absolutely right: It’s high time to change the Eltsin Constitution!
And those declarations that are indicated in it are not observed by any state in the world. Why should the States be a “beacon of democracy”, and the censorship there is worse than fascist Germany! And they don’t have complexes like you...
As for “restrictions”, read the Laws of the Russian Federation adopted with the beginning of the Northern Military District in relation to the Armed Forces, etc. Would you like to compare the law on foreign agents of the USA and the Russian Federation?
That’s it: to whose mill are you grist, dear? Or have they forgotten that “the road to HELL is paved with good intentions” (c)

[DenVB]

Quote: Boa constrictor KAA

The States are the “beacon of democracy”, and the censorship there is worse than fascist Germany! And they don’t have complexes like you...

Curb your ardor. Assange was released from prison, but Navalny was not.

[Victor Leningradets]

These Navalnys are like Matroskin's shoe polish.
And where does Assange leave us?
As for the USA, we can firmly say that the wise policy of “glasnost”, with controlled “democracy” + robbery of the world through the dollar system = internal stability.
This has not yet been done to the Hegemon in the local theater of operations. And after that - a catastrophe worse than the collapse of the USSR.

[DenVB]

Quote: Victor Leningradets

These Navalnys are like Matroskin's shoe polish.
And where does Assange leave us?

I don’t know where Assange will take us. But it was announced that there is fascist censorship in the USA. Meanwhile, they do not have as many political prisoners as we do. Okay, everyone here hates Navalny. And Strelkov? And Udaltsov? How many “telegram people” were imprisoned for publishing compromising evidence on those close to the throne? How many people are fined hefty sums for reposting on social networks and similar “shaking of the regime”?

[Retired from the digital age]

A good selection of political prisoners in the USA is given here: https://cont.ws/@ra-victory21/2352014. You will have to count in your head, there are not enough fingers for this ((

[vkfriendly]

Come on, tell stories. No one has checked Guantanamo and other secret prisons throughout Europe and the world, where they allegedly have terrorists, but in reality they are just kidnapped citizens from the Middle East and it is not known why. And even more so, they don’t have such daredevils there who feed from the hand of another country and jump for a change of power, which we have in abundance. For some reason, we are embarrassed to create NGOs and influence the situation in the enemy’s camp through conscious citizens, but there are dozens of such citizens, and some will agree to change the regime with arms in hand.

[vkfriendly]

The problem can be solved - a small script from Github - goodbyedpi which prevents the provider from checking packets normally and blocking them.

[Olegi1]

If someone needs to find something forbidden, they will find it, even without YouTube.

I completely agree, plus. Personally, my use of YouTube is educational programs, mainly on history, if you need to see how to fix something, interviews with famous people. Based on my preferences, YouTube offers me something to watch. I don’t remember seeing anything “forbidden” on this list. I watch YouTube mainly on the way to and from work. There are a couple of areas along this path where any streaming service starts to freeze/slow down for a couple of minutes. Any, but YouTube!. What is the problem for our developers to make forward caching a couple of minutes longer in case they hit a “blind spot” - I don’t know, it can be solved by changing a couple of lines of code in the program. Well, or one constant, depends on the implementation.

[sdivt]

Quote: ROSS 42

4. Everyone has the right to freely seek, receive, transmit, produce and disseminate information by any legal means

Well, that’s just our case)
The author has produced and is now distributing the information.
Well, yes, this is a little untrue, but everything is strictly according to the constitution!
Produced, distributed.
And why are people dissatisfied...

[Andrey VOV]

Are you having problems with YouTube?

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Andrey VOV

Are you having problems with YouTube?

Imagine: neither watching the video nor downloading... It is interrupted several times or simply stops (downloading).

[Andrey VOV]

Ordinary schoolchildren have already solved this problem at once, I can tell you, right now Yandex, everything works, it shows..

[Ross xnumx]

Quote: Andrey VOV

Ordinary schoolchildren have already solved this problem once

Thank you. Unlike ordinary schoolchildren, this problem is not relevant for me: due to the hot weather, I prefer to ride a bike and swim whenever possible. A 20 km bike ride and a one and a half km swim on the lake removes any desire to study with a laptop.

[Andrey VOV]

5 minutes is not enough to put up a simple program and not complain about violating articles of the Constitution :))

[Vlad Gor]

Which one? Link please. YouTube is slow and takes an indecently long time to load.

[AdAstra]

Laws in the Russian Federation? No, we haven't heard.

[Dutchman Michel]

Quote: Roman Skomorokhov

Here you can also add complete incompetence for air combat

Will there ever be these same air battles? In recent wars, one can easily observe how the distance between objects opposing each other in the air increases more and more each time, and the classic fighter turns into some kind of carrier of cruise missiles and smart bombs

[Alex Starley]

In general, the concept of a theater of operations will change greatly. And the termination of the INF Treaty will further push for change. Firstly, long-range air defense missiles will no longer allow aircraft to approach the LBS line closer than 150-200 km. And air-launched cruise missiles will move to ground-based launchers within 3-5 years, and the range will increase beyond 500 km (also American prsm). So, what tasks will the plane perform? The KAB will not fail, missiles from the ground are more effective, there will be no enemy aircraft or they will be out of reach. All that remains is to detect ground targets at ranges of the same 150-200 km, but here it would be desirable to use the millimeter range in AFAR, but we do not have it in the Su-57.

[Wildcat]

In order to write decently about airplanes, you need to be able to do more than just chew numbers. You also need to understand how the plane flies and fights. //////That’s why the article looks more like a clownery.

Bravo!

Well, how can we not support the author?
Indeed, without knowledge and understanding it’s just a clownery it turns out: you need to at least learn to distinguish F117 from F15 , and only then... then write articles. I'm talking about Peter Suchiu, if anyone doesn't understand.

[AllX_VahhaB]

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have.

The problem with the Su-57 is their number!

[vargo]

You probably didn’t read the article just to write this...

[Alex 1970]

But it’s very nice to dream up. The quintessence of the article.

[air wolf]

Yesterday I spent half a day watching videos about the MiG-1,44, it’s a pity that it was killed to please the Su-47, these are completely two different aircraft, and it was very tragic for me to find out that the MiG-31M is an aircraft that surpassed everything in the world to please the USA project was destroyed, all that remains is to hope for the Su-57, I hope with the engine of the next stage it will take off to the required altitudes and speeds and in conjunction with the Okhotnik UAV, maybe it will do something

[URAL72]

You've watched fantastic videos. Nobody planned the MiG-1.44, like the Su-47, into series production. These are just experimental platforms. Especially the Su-47, where only the fuselage was new. The engine is from a MiG-31, the canopy and chassis are from a Su-27, and there is no radar at all. What choice are you talking about? Nobody chose anything, especially after the collapse of the USSR, there was no time for that, and we then had more weapons than we could support.

[Nikolaevich I]

I'm becoming clairvoyant! One had only to read the title of the article and thought that this was an article by Skomorokhov!

[belost79]

The article is missing the video sequence at the end, where caps are thrown into the sky and multiple HURRAYS!!!!!

[bambr731]

I know one country that still has in service the first fourth-generation aircraft, developed in another country altogether. It has been standing since 1981. Almost with three modifications to date. The plane, as they say, has no frills: it’s gluttonous, frankly lousy with maneuverability, and they didn’t even know what stealth meant when it was being developed.

The MiG-31 was created solely to catch up and kill (which it does very well). Its rank does not allow it any super-maneuverability - it is an interceptor aircraft

[slesarg1965]

Ground-based radars and aviation radars may not be very effective in the case of stealth, but they have not yet come up with anything from illumination from an external emitter; on the contrary, here stealth plays a negative role - a clear shadow is visible instead of illumination. This is the goal.

[Chief Officer Lom]

Yes. This only works if the plane flies between the radiation source and its receiver. Where in the sky will you hang the receiver? Or will you cover the orbit with a carpet of satellites with these receivers that are orders of magnitude denser than Starlink? Compared to this idea, a curtain of tethered barrage balloons is much more realistic.

[DenVB]

Quote: slesarg1965

They haven’t yet come up with anything from illumination from an external emitter; on the contrary, here stealth plays a negative role - in the light, instead of light, a clear shadow is visible.

Well thought out.

We draw a straight line from the receiving antenna to the enemy stealth aircraft, continue it further and place the transmitting antenna there (at some distance). And now, no matter how the plane maneuvers, we just need to move the transmitting antenna so that all three points remain on the same straight line. Then we will be able to continuously monitor the enemy by his “shadow” and even aim missiles at him.

All ingenious is simple!

[Ratmir_Ryazan]

Whatever you say, UVT is a thing that we are much better at than the Americans.

They simply don’t need UVT.

The experience of the SVO showed that super-maneuverability was not useful, speed - yes, but super-maneuverability with UVT was not useful at all.
All air battles took place at speed and the maneuver to evade enemy missiles was expressed not in aerial pirouettes, but in turning and avoiding the missile at maximum speed.

Regarding stealth, the point is not that such an aircraft cannot be seen at all, but from what distance it can be detected!!! Rafales and Indian Su-30s detected the F-35 during training battles at medium and short distances, but will they be able to do this at a long distance, will they be able to detect the F-35 before it launches an air-to-air missile at them with range of 100 km and more is a big question. And the main question is, will the AGSN missiles be able to capture the F-35 as effectively as a conventional aircraft?

The experience of the SVO is also indicative here, we don’t always detect and shoot down Ukrainian Su-24s with Scalps, but now imagine the same attack, only using the F-35 and missiles made using low-visibility technology. Whatever one may say, such an attack will be even more difficult to detect in advance and repel.

But there really are questions about our Su-57, the main thing is why, since this aircraft is so good and inconspicuous, we don’t use it in the air defense system to the fullest extent? Who takes care of it and why when we are losing thousands of our soldiers? Someone seems to be very worried that the Su-57 may turn out to be no better than the Su-35, despite the money spent on it, and they will have to answer for it. And so, while the Su-57, like the Armata, like the Kurganets, like the Boomerang, like the Coalition-SV, is used only in parades, you can continue to lie to the president to Chemezov that we have the most advanced weapon systems that have no analogues, and drive them to the front T-62, D-1, BTR-80, BMP-1 and give soldiers steel helmets from the 40s.

[Monster_Fat]

Well, the trend now is that...saw at the greatest possible distance and fired a missile at the target from as great a distance as possible. Moreover, the detection means installed on the aircraft itself no longer play a special role; its weapons receive remote instructions from other detection means - reconnaissance aircraft, UAVs, AWACS, space detection and control means. Moreover, modern missiles with active homing heads at the final stage have crazy distances to reach the target and are being developed with even greater flight ranges - up to 1000 km and more. So, there is no longer talk of any such “dog dumps” as was the case in Korea, Vietnam, etc. Something like this.

[PilotS37]

Quote: Monster_Fat

Well, the trend now is that...saw at the greatest possible distance and fired a missile at the target from as great a distance as possible.

This tendency has always been: to attack from the maximum possible distance until you are discovered and attacked in turn.
It’s just that at the beginning of the PVM, aviators fired at each other from ordinary Mausers. By the beginning of WWII, 20-mm cannons with a much longer range appeared, then missiles appeared, the launch range of which was increasing and increasing... The pilot can no longer see that far with his own eyes - he needs a radar...
But even at a distance of 200 km this is an “air battle”!

[andrey4578]

Regarding super-maneuverability and evasive maneuver. There is a video online of a competition between a horse and a racing car, you need to cover the distance and return to the start, the horse gets around due to its super-maneuverability. The last chance to drop a missile on a turn is not canceled, nor is a quick reaction to an ambush. Take-off and landing on the ground for super-maneuverability is available.

[andrey4578]

About this here https://youtu.be/0LqF7-YlJLM

[andrey4578]

I don’t know for sure, maybe it was taken down because of the turn. The rocket, of course, holds higher G-forces (it’s like you can’t escape), but at a certain distance (at point-blank range) (the turning radius and the difference in speed with a super-maneuverable machine - they will send it past if the pilot guesses this fraction of a second), the plane can escape.

[andrey4578]

It will most likely go away, if the turning radius is short, then the pilot (autopilot too)) has more time to make a decision, maybe up to a tenth of a second instead of a hundredth, maybe up to a second instead of a tenth - not an expert.

[PilotS37]

Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan

They simply don’t need UVT.

In fact, UVT is a very peculiar thing. Once upon a time (probably in a past life) I worked as an aerodynamicist at the Sukhoi Design Bureau, and on one “Topic” I studied the effectiveness of UVT. So, at low speeds it is very good, but as the speed increases, the efficiency of “ordinary” rudders remains the same (or even increases slightly), while that of the UVT begins to decrease and in the region of M=1 it becomes almost zero.
UVT is good on takeoff. UVT allows you to twist various “things” and somersaults at air shows, when the speed of aircraft, by definition, is not high. That's all, actually...
In addition, today Sukhoi aircraft have engines with round nozzles - they can be equipped with an all-angle UHT. But the °F-22 engine has a flat nozzle. There, the UVT can only operate in pitch and roll, but not in yaw! For "circus" maneuvers this is an important loss. They say Product 30 will also have a flat nozzle...

[Luminman]

studied the effectiveness of UVT. So, at low speeds it is very good, but as the speed increases, the efficiency of “ordinary” rudders remains the same, while that of the UVT begins to decrease and in the region of M=1 it becomes almost zero

I don’t quite understand, but how does the speed approach the number М and higher, may affect UVT? Can you chew it? I'm actually curious about this...

[PilotS37]

Quote: Luminman

studied the effectiveness of UVT. So, at low speeds it is very good, but as the speed increases, the efficiency of “ordinary” rudders remains the same, while that of the UVT begins to decrease and in the region of M=1 it becomes almost zero

I don’t quite understand, but how does the speed approach the number М and higher, may affect UVT? Can you chew it? I'm actually curious about this...

All aircraft aerodynamics are described in terms of dimensionless coefficients.
They take the lift force (Ya), divide it by the wing area, then divide it by the so-called “velocity pressure” (q = ro * v * v / 2), and get the dimensionless coefficient Cya. They work with him. With moments, the picture is similar, only there you still have to divide by the linear size, which is taken as the average aerodynamic chord of the wing (MAC).
The control forces from the rudders are also dimensionless.
At subsonic all these aerodynamic coefficients are practically constant; at transonic they begin to increase (but not much). In the region of M=1 there is a strong jump, and then a smooth decline begins.
Thus, as a first approximation, we can assume that up to M = 1, all aerodynamic characteristics of the aircraft are proportional to the square of the speed.
But with the thrust of a jet engine, things are different: it first (up to M = 0,4...0,5) decreases slightly, then begins to increase. In the region of M=1, it corresponds, plus or minus, to the thrust at M=0.
If we consider the engine nozzle as an aerodynamic control element, then its efficiency at M=1 will be approximately the same as at takeoff (M=0.1), and for conventional control surfaces there will be an increase of 100 times ((1 / 0,1)^2 ).
In fact, even with vigorous maneuvering at M = 0,5, UVT gives almost nothing.

[PilotS37]

This is, in short, but in detail, you need to write three thick books: “Aerodynamics of an Aircraft”, “Stability and Controllability of an Aircraft” and “Theory of Aircraft Engines”...

[solar]

Speed, turning radius and the overload that occurs when turning are related. The higher the speed and the smaller the turning radius, the greater the overload. At high speeds, it will not be possible to use super-maneuverability due to restrictions on overload - a maximum of 7-9 units, which neither the pilot nor the aircraft structure can withstand.

[Comet]

Quote from solar

At high speeds, it will not be possible to use super-maneuverability due to overload restrictions - a maximum of 7-9 units,

A highly maneuverable aircraft is capable of slowing down, conserving energy, quickly performing a maneuver using shock-absorbing technology, and picking up speed again. And without a shock-absorbing device, if you lose speed, you cannot quickly perform the maneuver; there will not be enough speed pressure. Therefore, the radius and time of performing a maneuver with a shock-absorbing device while saving energy will be less than without a shock-absorbing device.

[solar]

slow down while saving energy

it's like?

[Comet]

Quote from solar

it's like?

What how?

[solar]

How to slow down while saving energy?
uh ve square divided by 2 already cancelled?

[Comet]

Quote from solar

How to slow down while saving energy?
uh ve square divided by 2 already cancelled?

Gain altitude. It follows from the school course.

[solar]

and what if it gains altitude?

[Comet]

Quote from solar

and what if it gains altitude?

The speed will decrease, which will allow you to maneuver. And then pick up speed again due to the altitude.

[solar]

It can maneuver with the same overload without reducing speed and without the use of shock absorbers.
It’s a pointless exercise to artificially degrade performance by reducing speed, exposing the aircraft to enemy attack, only to create the need to use UVT.

[Comet]

Quote from solar

It can maneuver with the same overload without reducing speed and without the use of shock absorbers.

What I wrote was long ago established by Herbst and verified on the X-31.

[Sumotori_380]

And that’s why the ideas of the X-31 were not developed in its homeland?

[Comet]

Quote from Sumotori_380

And that’s why the ideas of the X-31 were not developed in its homeland?

How should the X-31 ideas be developed in its homeland?

[andrey4578]

You will probably agree that they work at subsonic speeds, at supersonic speeds they either catch up or run away, the work will be more productive with increased maneuverability. And the fact is that for any maneuver the speed must be reduced, a super-maneuverable one will in any case turn faster in any direction and will be less likely to loom in a dangerous direction.

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

So, at low speeds it is very good, but as the speed increases, the efficiency of “ordinary” rudders remains the same (or even increases slightly), while that of the UVT begins to decrease

We're talking about indicated speed, right? And with a decrease in speed, the effectiveness of “ordinary” rudders decreases, and the UVT increases.

Quote: PilotS37

UVT allows you to twist various “things” and somersaults at air shows, when the speed of aircraft, by definition, is not high. That's all, actually...

UVT allows you to switch from maneuvering while maintaining speed to maneuvering while maintaining energy, which reduces both the maneuver radius and the maneuver time. The nuance is that with increasing altitude, the available thrust of the engines decreases. As a result, the available overload of a steady turn becomes less than even the overload limit from the Flight Manual. Another point is that UVT allows you to not pay attention to its anti-spin properties when developing a glider.

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

Quote: PilotS37
So, at low speeds it is very good, but as the speed increases, the efficiency of “ordinary” rudders remains the same (or even increases slightly), while that of the UVT begins to decrease

We're talking about indicated speed, right? And with a decrease in speed, the effectiveness of “ordinary” rudders decreases, and the UVT increases.

If you carefully read my post and understand what we are talking about, you should understand that we are talking about true speed, and not about instrument speed. This is the first...
Secondly, I seem to have clearly stated that at low speeds UVT is very effective, so I don’t understand your passage about

As the speed drops, the efficiency of “ordinary” rudders decreases, while the efficiency of the rudders increases.

The reality is that the lower the speed, the more effective the UVT - as a control element - is. At v = 0 km/h (M = 0) there is simply no alternative to it. But already at M = 0,5, the UVT cannot play practically any role in the control of the aircraft.

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

If you carefully read my post and understand what we are talking about, you should understand that we are talking about true speed, and not about instrument speed. This is the first...

But doesn’t the efficiency of aerodynamic controls depend on the speed pressure?

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

But doesn’t the efficiency of aerodynamic controls depend on the speed pressure?

Of course, the effectiveness of aerodynamic controls depends on the speed pressure. Which is what I wrote about in my top post.
How is the velocity pressure in flight determined?
And what is “instrumented” speed?
As I remember (and this was almost 40 years ago), in flight it is and only the velocity pressure that is determined - using a sensor called “PVD”. Velocity pressure is the air density multiplied by the square true speed divided by half.
Since it is extremely difficult to estimate the density of air overboard in flight, a certain fictitious value is taken, on the basis of which - according to the airborne data - the "instrumented" speed is calculated - purely mathematically. Thus, “instrument” is the speed that the pilot sees on the instrument while sitting in the cockpit. She means nothing! So, "for reference"...
In addition (as I - again - remember) at trans- and supersonic sounds, the effect of air compressibility appears, which distorts the readings of the same PVD. Therefore, the “indicated” speed at such speeds differs even more from the true one: the pilot never knows exactly how fast he is flying!

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

And what is “instrumented” speed?

This is a function of the velocity head, expressed in units of velocity. This is a kind of approximation of the speed pressure. The pilot flies at the indicated speed.

Quote: PilotS37

In addition (as I - again - remember) at trans- and supersonic sounds, the effect of air compressibility appears, which distorts the readings of the same PVD.

The effect of compressibility is taken into account in the calculation.

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

Quote: PilotS37
UVT allows you to twist various “things” and somersaults at air shows, when the speed of aircraft, by definition, is not high. That's all, actually...

UVT allows you to switch from maneuvering while maintaining speed to maneuvering while maintaining energy, which reduces both the maneuver radius and the maneuver time. The nuance is that with increasing altitude, the available thrust of the engines decreases. As a result, the available overload of a steady turn becomes less than even the overload limit from the Flight Manual. Another point is that UVT allows you to not pay attention to its anti-spin properties when developing a glider.

The nuance, firstly, is that with increasing altitude, the efficiency of the rudders also decreases, since the moment from the steering wheel depends on the speed pressure q, and in it sits the air density “ro”, which decreases greatly with altitude (for the same reason - due to a drop in air density, the engine thrust also drops).
I quite deliberately left this effect “behind the scenes”, since here the speed characteristics of the engine are more important than the altitude characteristics.
The second nuance is that - as mentioned above - UVT is effective only at low speeds: conventionally up to M = 0,2. Yes, in such situations it will allow you to reduce the maneuver radius and fight the spin... But, at M = 0,5, the UVT is practically ineffective. What about pitch, what about roll, what about yaw...
You may know the RLE, but you don’t know “Aircraft Aerodynamics”.

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

But, at M = 0,5, UVT is practically ineffective. What about pitch, what about roll, what about yaw...

This is not true for rockets...

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

Quote: PilotS37
But, at M = 0,5, UVT is practically ineffective. What about pitch, what about roll, what about yaw...

This is not true for rockets...

You know better (probably, you are a rocket after all, and not Comet...)

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

You know better (probably, you are a rocket after all, not a Comet...)

For example, the Proton has no aerodynamic controls at all.

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

Quote: PilotS37

You know better (probably, you are a rocket after all, not a Comet...)

For example, the Proton has no aerodynamic controls at all.

And what does Proton have to do with it?.. We are talking about maneuverable aircraft, and you are dragging a hefty space a rocket and are trying to draw some conclusions based on its data... You should have brought a tank here!

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

And what does Proton have to do with it?..

You can also R-73, AIM-9X, Roland... You haven’t determined the effectiveness.

Quote: PilotS37

We're talking about maneuverable aircraft,

It will be different on every aircraft. Let's try to simplify. Let V be the speed of your hypothetical maneuverable aircraft, Ea(V) be the efficiency (in your understanding) of the aerodynamic controls of your hypothetical maneuverable aircraft, and Ey(V) be the efficiency of the AVT of your hypothetical maneuverable aircraft. E=Ey/Ea. Can you indicate the values ​​of E(V) in the speed range 50 m/s <= V <= 300 m/s in increments of 25 m/s?
Z.Y. What do you mean by efficiency?

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

Z.Y. What do you mean by efficiency?

You mix such things (warm with soft) that I don’t even know what to answer you...
You don’t need to be here, but somewhere else!

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

You mix such things (warm with soft) that I don’t even know what to answer you...

Well, I wrote what to count. What's the problem with the answer?

[PilotS37]

Quote: Comet

Well, I wrote what to count. What's the problem with the answer?

You first write some formulas “about efficiency”, and then me you ask: “What is efficiency?”... It’s somehow strange...

At a minimum, I understand that you are not an expert if you ask such questions. (But then why dive into some deep reasoning if you don’t know the basics?)

The main characteristic of the control element (hereinafter referred to as the OU) is the increase in control torque when this element is deflected by one additional degree. Let me emphasize once again that we are operating dimensionless aerodynamic coefficients, which are obtained by dividing the real physical forces and moments acting on the aircraft into a characteristic area, a characteristic shoulder (for moments) and a velocity pressure, where the square of the velocity “sits”.
The effectiveness of a governing body is its ability provide и keep the magnitude of the control torque at a certain, specified level.
Ensuring efficiency OS is achieved when designing an aircraft.
Maintaining efficiency - this is rather an internal feature of the op-amp: for example, the increase in control torque decreases with increasing angle of attack of the entire aircraft, as well as at large deflection angles of the op-amp itself. This is a consequence of the laws of aerodynamics, which are very difficult to fight. As a rule, they are simply taken into account by introducing restrictions on aircraft maneuvering.
When the op-amp loses the ability to produce the control torques required from it, we talk about loss of efficiency OU. For example, "the elevator loses its effectiveness when deflected by [conditional] 15 degrees".
In the case of a shock wave, the dimensionless increase in torque upon its deflection (to a first approximation) is inversely proportional to the square of the velocity. At M = 0,5 it is 25 times lower than at M = 0,1, and at M = 1,0 it is 100 times lower (in fact, not so much). If at M = 0,1 the increase in torque from the shock absorber is approximately comparable (or even greater) than from a “conventional” rudder (this is especially pronounced at high angles of attack, when “conventional” rudders lose their effectiveness), then at M = 0,5 0,3, it is already incomparably smaller, which is why they talk about the loss of efficiency of the shock absorber at such speeds (strictly speaking, even at M = 0,4..XNUMX the shock absorber is already “souring”).
... but at M = 0,0 the UVT is the only effective control element of the aircraft. But they don’t fly at such speeds...

[Comet]

Quote: PilotS37

The effectiveness of a control element is its ability to provide and maintain the value of the control torque at a certain, specified level.

Clear.

Quote: PilotS37

In the case of a shock wave, the dimensionless increase in torque upon its deflection (to a first approximation) is inversely proportional to the square of the velocity.

But here we are talking about the increase in a dimensionless quantity, while in determining efficiency we were talking about the quantity itself.
But I understand you. Thank you. You are looking at the effectiveness of the governing body, not the effectiveness of the aviation complex. Pilots from Kubinka once said that with UVT the radius and time of maneuvers were reduced. This coincides with the results of Herbst's research. This, naturally, increases the combat effectiveness of the aviation complex. Another point is that in a number of Roland air defense systems, control in the pitch and yaw channels is carried out only by the UVT.

[Strelkin]

First you write some formulas “about efficiency”, and then you ask me: “What is efficiency?”... It’s somehow strange...

If we compare two fighters according to efficiency, then only one comparison is appropriate here: according to combat effectiveness. That is: how many times out of 10 (out of 20, out of 50, etc.) will plane N win/lose to plane Q in a duel situation, with complete equality of initial conditions and without any external support, using only your avionics and your weapons.
For example: under the supervision of those organizing this check, two aircraft equipped with full sets of telemetry, transmitting to the command post all information from the board, including all data on flight parameters, radar readings, electro-optical systems and other means of detecting and conducting air combat, diverge at the same distance relative to the control point (indicated by GPS coordinates, for example), 400-500 kilometers, beyond the detection range of the enemy, their radars, at the command of the judges, simultaneously begin to converge to this point.
Next they must find each other and “destroy” each other. The central computer at the control point, where all information from everyone converges, in real time, within a fraction of a second, it calculates and determines who shot down whom first - he is the winner in the duel.
And so - 10 times, 20 times, as many as the organizers deem necessary.
This is the only way to test the real combat effectiveness of any fighter - in a duel with an opponent, under equal initial conditions and without any external support. And then the statistical results are processed and “who is xy?” is revealed.
Any fighter against any other.
Rafal vs F-16 block 70/72.
Eurofighter vs F-15EX.
F-35 vs Su-35S.
F-22 vs Su-57...

[steelmaker]

When we have a multiple numerical advantage in aircraft in the Northern Military District and no air supremacy, it is stupid to praise our aircraft. And you can always justify mediocrity. Everyone has their own truth. I find the article inappropriate now.

[Vladimir-TTT]

The article is a clear “order”. Like, everything is fine with us, there are no cuts, new equipment is being produced in the required quantities and is at war, and in general, everything is fine, a wonderful marquise.
This is only the third year of the NWO, and if they don’t reach an agreement peacefully, it’s even difficult to imagine how long it will continue. If you look at the pace of offensives and counter-attacks, it will take a very long time, longer than what is already going on.

[Luminman]

When we have a multiple numerical advantage in aircraft in the Northern Military District and no air supremacy, it is stupid to praise our aircraft

The point here is not at all in the number of aircraft available to the warring sides, but in the fact that today air defense systems are one step or half a step ahead and defeat aircraft...

[steelmaker]

"today air defense systems are one step or half a step ahead.."
Or maybe it’s just that they don’t fight these air defense systems like they fight airplanes. Or do you want to say that these air defense systems are invisible? Or maybe it’s just that the current commanders only have enough education to “trade the Motherland”? Already in the third year, can you figure out something how to destroy this air defense?

[Vladimir-TTT]

That's right. And bridges across the Dnieper cannot be destroyed, and railway transportation and many other “oddities” cannot be stopped.
Only markers and constant surprise:
- How? Have we been deceived again? Are we our own, bourgeois?

[Luminman]

Already in the third year, can you figure out something how to destroy this air defense?

Do you know the way?

[steelmaker]

"Do you know the method?.."
It’s not like he’s stupid, but you can’t call him smart.
That you're not interested in anything at all? Don't know how to use the Internet?
“Nevertheless, the methods of combating air defense systems have long been known and are prescribed in textbooks. These are high-quality work of satellite and electronic reconnaissance, the use of AWACS (long-range radar detection) aircraft, information from agents and the local population.
It is most effective to use combined strike tactics, when missiles are first launched to expose the locations of air defense systems and radars. The enemy is simply forced to shoot at them and use up a significant part of the ammunition. Missiles are already flying behind them, which will work directly on the elements of the air defense system."
This is me, the first thing I found to broaden your horizons.

[Luminman]

Quote: steel maker

It’s not like he’s stupid, but you can’t call him smart

I can't exactly call you smart. This is what I mean:

Quote: steel maker

Don't know how to use the Internet?

[Comet]

Quote: steel maker

when missiles are first launched to reveal the locations of air defense systems and radars. The enemy is simply forced to shoot at them and use up a significant part of the ammunition.

But the enemy does not do what he is “simply forced to do.” And then what?

[Private Rifleman]

Breaking through air defense systems has always been a dangerous undertaking and always involved losses, it’s just that now Russia cannot afford the same losses as, for example, the Americans in Vietnam, due to the small number of flight personnel and the long time it takes to replenish it and the insufficient number of aircraft; Ukraine’s air defense could be destroyed but at the cost of hundreds of other aircraft and the cost of the lives of dozens of pilots, they simply don’t agree to this because it will take decades to simply make up for losses at current production rates

[Alex Starley]

Yes, in the current situation, the theater of operations has moved to the plane of “war with rebels,” which is further aggravated among Ukrainians by the “stubborn behavior of an offended teenager,” i.e. All their equipment is dispersed in some abandoned cowsheds, pigsties, garages, etc. 1-3 units each, including personnel. And the air defense stupidly doesn’t turn on, it’s just waiting to give a shit, to catch our flyer and again sneak around somewhere in disguise, brag to the foreign media and post it in the cart, i.e. it does not perform functions as object or military air defense. So, if our stealth miracle “breaks through” the air defense, it won’t do anything significant, it just runs the risk of being shot down, and if it’s suddenly given target designation for a barn where two Abrams are hidden, that’s what the Iskander-M is for, why risk the pilot? .

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Alex Starley

And the air defense stupidly doesn’t turn on, it’s just waiting to give a shit, to catch our flyer and again sneak around somewhere in disguise, brag to the foreign media and post it in the cart, i.e. it does not perform functions as object or military air defense.

In fact, this has been a standard air defense tactic since Vietnam: sit on the equivalent, monitor targets on the VICO and wait for the control command from the command post. Going on air only after receiving an order to destroy the target. Any broadcast is an unmasking of the position, after which the position must be changed. Because the RTR does not sleep, the coordinates and type of source are determined quickly and then wait for arrival. Previously, they were afraid of suppression groups with PRR, long-range RS and OTR. Now UAVs have been added to them.

[R_S_F_S_R_]

Yes, yes, yes, that’s why they introduced double-barreled guns into air defense. Noncha are burning in packs of Patriots, S-300s, Shilkas, Pantsyri, etc., including brave men with arrows, needles and other stingers.

[Chief Officer Lom]

This is because the air defense of the outskirts uses radar illumination from AWACS aircraft and NATO UAVs that hover beyond its borders, and which in a “fair” battle would have been shot down a long time ago, but we are “no good.” Although it should have been stated long ago that radar irradiation of our aircraft in a combat zone is aggression, regardless of any borders.

[Zufei]

And, by the way, this is indirectly confirmed by the fact that not a single country, except Israel, uses its F-35s in combat operations. Israel has nowhere to go, and the Jews bought these planes to fight. That's why they fight, and the rest of the world, which bought miracle planes, saves an expensive resource and sits on its fifth point.

[Buskan]

Quote: ROSS 42

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have. What the rest have is really their problem.

And who is interested in the speculations and problems of some Suchiu?
We are more concerned not with numbers, but with deadlines... For starters, at least the timing of mass production of “Product 30”...
Then the fate of the long-suffering TAVKR "Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov" is very interesting.
Again, WHEN and where will he begin his combat journey...
Everything is clear about the Armata: an expensive tank will not stand up against a dozen cheap drones...
And when will we see a barrage of fire from the incomparable “Coalition”?
* * *
We have no problems. Problems arise for those who, for two and a half years, living in regions bordering (and not so much) with Ukraine, cannot consider their life safe, no matter how much it is stated on the screens...
There is also a minor problem with YouTube, which has nothing to do with either State Duma deputy Khinshtein or:

Article 29
1. Everyone is guaranteed freedom of thought and speech.
2. Propaganda or agitation that incite social, racial, national or religious hatred and enmity is not allowed. Propagation of social, racial, national, religious or linguistic superiority is prohibited.
3. No one can be forced to express or reject their opinions and beliefs.
4. Everyone has the right to freely seek, receive, transmit, produce and disseminate information by any lawful means. The list of information constituting a state secret is determined by federal law.
5. Guaranteed freedom of the media. Censorship is prohibited.

Hello. Our constitution has long been wiped out (I won’t name names on this one).
All for friends, law for enemies.

[Ezekiel 25-17]

The profession of a journalist is akin to another ancient profession, to be sold for money: it’s not me, it’s Jack London, through the mouth of his hero, Elam Harnish.

[olegff68]

The article is some kind of wild collection of jingoistic clichés and cliches. Literally every paragraph is a lie and nonsense. Nonsense about maneuverability, nonsense about the uselessness of low EPR.....nonsense on top of delirium, driving nonsense on. I had already begun to dream that “you can make mistakes, you can’t lie” and the time for jingoistic frenzy has passed, but no - everything is in place.
And - the main advantage of the F-35 over the Su-57 is that the first is mass-produced, in modern robotic factories, at a pace that we have not yet merged, at a pace that will make it possible to compensate for losses in conflicts even at very high intensity.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: olegff68

the main advantage of the F-35 over the Su-57 is that the former is mass-produced,

What you write so correctly about is the advantage of the AMERICAN aviation industry!!! not the F-35.
And in order to understand what is better and for solving what problems, you need to compare the performance characteristics of machines and wearable weapons. But for this, in addition to ambition, you also need to use your brain a little... Which is not observed in this case. Sorry.

[olegff68]

What is the "aviation industry"? Are you broadcasting to us from the USSR? When the jingoistic patriots here were telling us about the prohibitive cost of the F-35 project, they somehow “forgot” to mention that the allocated funds went to the construction of NEW mega-technological factories for the production of the F-35, where the developed THREE DIFFERENT aircraft with maximum unification are assembled - F-35A, F-35B and F-35C.
And the ability to make up for losses is one of the key characteristics of military equipment (the T-34 will confirm).
And yes - for the same F-35A, everything is fine with combat characteristics - maximum overload 9G, all-angle passive detection system, radar with directional electronic warfare function, etc. and so on.
And yes - only a stupid person allows himself to laugh at the enemy and underestimate his capabilities.

[Electrical]

And yes - the same F-35A, everything is fine with combat characteristics - maximum overload 9G, all-angle passive detection system,

Where is 9zh? Only in advertising brochures. There is a maximum of 7, but in reality no more than 6.5. Well, all-perspectivity, and even passive, is nonsense beyond fantasy, existing only in the heads of a sect of adherents of the great American Empire.

[olegff68]

My dear, I am taking OFFICIAL data, but your arguments about “embellishment”, they are precisely from the minds of the adherents of “has no analogue”. Max overload F-35A - 9G, F-35B - 7G, F-35C - 7,5G. For comparison, the “vertical” Yak-38 has a maximum overload of 6G.
And I quote:

AN/AAQ-37 is an electro-optical system (EOS) with a distributed aperture system (DAS), consisting of 6 IR sensors located on the fuselage with a viewing range of 360 degrees. The system allows you to: ............ Launch an air-to-air missile at a target flying behind the aircraft.

[Deon59]

Well, the F 22 didn’t shoot down anyone, but the Su 57 shot down a couple, which is good. And now the question is who will dare to shell US territory and kill US civilians. And what will happen to those who do this? And whose citizens around the world are caught and imprisoned in US prisons. . The Su 57 flies, but in no way protects Belgorod from missiles. And Sevastopol cannot protect the Black Sea Fleet. And who has problems with invisibility with electronic warfare or with electronic warfare there are no analogues.

[mad-max78]

A gorgeous photo of a crashed plane, no words characterize the author of the article better than this photo, he writes above that the Serbs did not know that this plane was invisible and here in the photo the author of the article shows us a man in an arafatka headdress, just think of such a Palestinian Serb))).
Roman Skoromokhov wrote this article as he actually always does it according to the following principle, the topic of today’s essay is this, here are pictures on this topic and this is all we need to write an article and begins to actually write an essay on this topic, namely to compose, to look for some kind of objectivity in the articles of this author is a completely useless and pointless exercise. The photo in this article of a Palestinian Serb in an arafat jacket without any words proves that I am right about this wonderful author, he will write any article faster than anyone can read it, amazing productivity, it’s just a shame it’s meaningless.

[Vladimir-TTT]

Yes, Roman is no longer the same... Either they scared him or they bought him. He became a jingoistic patriot.
I observe an interesting dependence (this is not here - on one of the forums in the politics section) - the further away from the war, the cooler the jingoism.
On that forum, the most patriotic patriot lives in the USA..

[Good Evil]

Quote from: mad-max78

The photo in this article of a Palestinian Serb in an arafat jacket without any words proves that I am right about this wonderful author, he will write any article faster than anyone can read it, amazing productivity, it’s just a shame it’s meaningless.

Moreover, with his poor knowledge of the school physics course, when he writes on technical topics - it’s a disgrace!
It’s a disaster if the cake maker starts sewing boots... (I.A. Krylov)

[Svetlana]

Quote: olegff68

And - the main advantage of the F-35 over the Su-57 is that the first is mass-produced, in modern robotic factories, at a pace that we have not yet merged, at a pace that will make it possible to compensate for losses in conflicts even at very high intensity.

In order to increase the efficiency and mass production of jet engines (RE) while simultaneously reducing the cost, I propose the following ejector two-circuit turbo-prop-fan thruster with an air compressor drive from a 2nd circuit propfan through a step-up planetary gearbox. In a two-circuit turbo-prop-fan air-breathing engine, the turbocharger drive is made from the ring gear of the planetary gearbox. The 2nd circuit fan blades are rigidly mounted on the ring gear of the planetary gearbox. The carrier with the planetary gears of the planetary gearbox is braked, and the sun gear of the planetary gearbox drives the 5-stage air compressor into rotation. The first 4 stages of the compressor are a 4-stage axial compressor, the 5th stage is a centrifugal compressor. The angular speed of rotation of the compressor shaft is 3..4 times higher than the angular speed of rotation of the secondary circuit fan blades and is directed in the opposite direction.
By eliminating the need for a gas turbine, the cost of a jet engine is reduced. The low cost of manufacturing the proposed RD allows it to be used in the mass production of unmanned aerial vehicles as an engine. To provide the on-board electronics with additional electrical energy, the proposed RD can use an MHD generator located in the nozzle part of the RD.
When the taxiway is started, the electric motor (built into the nose cone of the air compressor shaft) spins the compressor. Using a compressed compressor, air is supplied together with atomized kerosene into the annular combustion chamber, and the mixture is ignited. The resulting stream of hot exhaust gases is passed from the combustion chamber through the nozzle apparatus and used to eject air from the channel of the 2nd circuit of the RD.
Due to the decrease (compared to atmospheric) pressure in the cavity of the annular channel of the 2nd circuit, atmospheric air is sucked into the cavity of the 2nd circuit channel through the blades of the 2nd circuit propfan. Air passing between the propeller fan blades causes them to rotate together with the ring gear of the planetary gearbox. Next, through planetary gears, mounted with the possibility of rotation on axles mounted on a stationary braked carrier, rotation is transmitted to the sun gear, rigidly connected to the air compressor shaft. The fan blades of the 2nd circuit (made by 3-D printing on a printer) have a saber shape, which allows you to redirect part of the air flow to the compressor and increase the pressure at the compressor inlet.
Due to the twist (around the axis) of the exhaust gas flow of the 1st circuit when they exit the annular nozzle into the ejector mixing chamber, the efficiency and degree of air ejection from the cavity of the 2nd circuit increases.

[Dozorny severa]

It is not clear why the gases emanating from the combustor should be cooled? The efficiency should decrease as a result.

[Luminman]

Air passing between the propeller fan blades causes them to rotate together with the ring gear of the planetary gearbox

These blades of your 2nd circuit propfan can to some extent be called a turbine, only turned upside down and receiving an impulse not from the hot gases from the combustion chamber, but from the air. They, the propeller fan blades of the 2nd circuit, if I understand correctly, are the mover of the compressor and everything that sits on the common shaft. How could such a design be cheaper?

[Maks1995]

Too pretentious and lacking in substance.
and SU57, F35, F22 were not discussed only by the lazy.

But problems have always been, are and will be. Then the dollar fell - flights became more expensive.
The hangars weren’t built, but the typhoon/UAV arrived.
Then powerful new engines spoil the strip coverage more, etc.

[Tima62]

[Quote] one Peter Suchiu from Michigan. During his twenty-year career in journalism, he has contributed to more than four dozen magazines, newspapers and websites. Today, my friend Peter found himself on the pages of The National Interest, which we respect, and he writes, they say, even for Forbes and Clearance Jobs. In general, it’s a sort of all-rounder./ Quote]
Our Roman is an even greater all-rounder. Yesterday about railways, today about airplanes, tomorrow about a submarine.
Are you upset that someone named Peter Suchiu is taking away his bread?

[JD1979]

After all, our fighter really has super-maneuverability, which American “irons” cannot see through a telescope. Whatever you say, UVT is a thing that we are much better at than the Americans.

Oh yes))) how can you not jerk off to your fetish))) Amers have stealth, we have circus acrobatics. True, the author, like other fetishists, never answers several questions))):
1. At what distance does the battle begin?
2. At what speeds do we see this very maneuverability at entertainment events?
3. How much do these acrobatic stunts with turns on the spot affect changes in the flight trajectory of a rocket located at a distance of kilometers, tens of kilometers?

[Meaning of life]

The buffoon continues to buffoon. It's because of people like him that everyone laughs at us. He himself needs to be put in the cockpit of a Su-57 and sent to Syria to repel Israeli attacks. Or at least at the Northern Military District, let him show how to shoot down the dill antediluvian F-16s.

[Alex Starley]

Well, in general, there are a lot of questions about garlic for the SU-57, everything is too secret, although they write about the prospect for export. And where are the advertising brochures? Here are the Indians in 2018. refused to continue the joint project for the 5th generation, voicing that the avionics did not live up to those of their competitors. A question about radar and optical detectors, which, by all accounts, are clearly inferior to those in the f-35. I don’t know what the life-giving radar Belka is doing there, but there is nothing concrete, unlike the f-35, where everything is described in more or less detail.

[Dozorny severa]

I read the article and was moved, even the photo of Putin on the wall gave me peace...
The CIA has already put the article on the table of the Committee of Chiefs of Staff and they are all changing diapers.

[AdAstra]

Ahahahahaha "" "

[Dozorny severa]

Quote: Alex Starley

Well, in general, there are a lot of questions about garlic for the SU-57, everything is too secret, although they write about the prospect for export. And where are the advertising brochures? Here are the Indians in 2018. refused to continue the joint project for the 5th generation, voicing that the avionics did not live up to those of their competitors. A question about radar and optical detectors, which, by all accounts, are clearly inferior to those in the f-35. I don’t know what the life-giving radar Belka is doing there, but there is nothing concrete, unlike the f-35, where everything is described in more or less detail.

The Indian Su-27,30 avionics were made in Israel.
The reason is different - India supplies a lot of goods and services to the United States, and they demanded counter purchases, in Washington they do not express concerns, but immediately hit the sanctions in the face with their fist.

[Hexenmeister]

India does not have the Su-27, but only the Su-30MKI, and the main combat radar system on it is ours, and if there is anything Israeli, it is all secondary in relation to the radar.

[storm]

Until Russia puts into service at least ten Su-57 regiments, the Americans will have time to scrap the already obsolete Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD)...

[Pavel57]

The article is a mess. Planes, tanks, armored personnel carriers - everything was mixed up.

Another gem - the rocket must fly much faster than its target, so it can maneuver, but not perfectly. Nobody can cancel physics.


The requirement for the rocket was to have an overload 2 times greater than the target. This follows from the laws of guidance. We can say that this is also physics.

[Strelkin]

The requirement for the rocket was to have an overload 2 times greater than the target. This follows from the laws of guidance. We can say that this is also physics.

Why only 2 times more? Fighters (almost all world ones) have a maximum operational overload 9g, according to the physiological limitations of the pilot, but for rockets it is much greater:
AIM-120C7/D — 40g
AIM-132 ———- 50g
AIM-9X ———-- 60g
Python-5 ———-- 70g
A-Darter ——— 100g

[AdAstra]

Well, why not, we “walk” through their Penguin, they through our SU. In my opinion, everything is logical.

[R_S_F_S_R_]

I'm a buffoon, write better about the ruins of the Moscow MiG and about the ruins of Phasatron, which made radar for MiGs, which were formed just a few years ago. Moreover, they demolished it there even when the Dwarf on Louboutins had already gone to war, with someone else’s feet.

The MiG-31 caught up with him there and killed him.
The MiG was killed a long time ago, damn. And you will no longer restore it - neither people, nor industry, nor related industries, nor science. It's fucking over.

Otherwise, he is throwing out Tsarist logic here, is proud of the achievements of the people’s power half a century ago, attributing Soviet achievements to the anti-people Pupkin regime, as in the 80s “everyone was afraid of us.”

Write your justifying bullshit why, under Putin, no new MiGs, Tupolevs, Ilyushins, Berievs, Kamovs, Milyas, Myasishchevs appeared and why Sukhoi, is in a coma, has been flying for 15 years on single copies of the “fifth generation” with Soviet engines from the fourth generations. After all, the little bastard has been hanging on an oar in the galley for 25 years. During this time, the Soviets changed 2 generations, developing and building up, and not degrading and ruining.

Bore me and tell me how Pupkin’s government lobbied for Boeing and Airbus here in the 124s. How much money was spent on the programs for the “revival of domestic aviation”. Why did they stop making the An-90, which was XNUMX% made from Russian components, during the navel? What, the subcontractors were also knocked down with their research institutes and NGOs?
So write about it. I'm not even talking about the new models that came in a flood under the Soviets, but today even the old ones cannot REPEAT on the once well-established production.

[Hexenmeister]

The modern Phazotron, as an administrative setting, by and large goes there, and the developer of the Zaslon for the Mig-31 is alive and thriving, well, how much longer can these tales about the Phazotron-developer be repeated?

[R_S_F_S_R_]

What does it mean for him to go there? Is there a surplus of high-tech and scientific personnel in the country? H. with him, maybe not high-tech anymore, with such a shitty regime, but simply high-tech production.

Again, radars should be modernized, new models should be released, and not hang around continuously for 40 years, based on thoughts from 60 years ago. And this is done not by a turner behind a vice, but in an “administrative building.”
This is the Barrier, which belongs in the trash heap for a long time. But in the absence of 15 years since ROFAR was announced, the Putinoids praise Zaslon. And they will praise for another 80 years.

Again, radar is not only for aviation! This includes art, civilian sensors, and x. understand what else. At least medicine.

Phasatron, that very “administrative building”.
Well, yes, that’s where they want to go, haha, we are finally a raw materials superpower (according to Pupkin), the raw materials sector needs to be developed - pipes, saws, nets and barrels, and let the cattle go into business - sell Chinese underpants to each other.
https://dzen.ru/a/ZfRww1LCT0mFC1fG

And this is the MiG, where the Tsarebozhniks have already made the MiG-41, to replace the MiG-31, which flies into space at Mach 7:
https://dzen.ru/video/watch/62f8d789290c116eaf6d447c?clid=562&rid=164511394.1142.1720518390087.10899

channels on Zena with a killed wetland - shaft. The 2020 program has been implemented, the 25 million high-tech jobs proclaimed by Pupkin no longer exist in the country.

[Hexenmeister]

Before you talk about Phazotron-NIIR, at least understand its “achievements” in terms of aviation radars, and do not confuse them with the achievements of the Soviet NPO Phazotron! But we don’t have these achievements, we’ve been shouting about the afar radar for light MiGs for decades, and where is it? The export of this option was lost, apparently due to its “outstanding” characteristics; we made SIX for ourselves!!! Mig-35, and they have a radar with a mechanically driven antenna, apparently this is an afar miracle for that kind of money and with such characteristics it’s not even needed for advertising purposes! All other radars of our modern fighters are not their development! I think that you cannot even name these developers, but you are so worried about the “administrative layer with scientific personnel.” And it’s better for you not to talk about radar, even a quick glance at your messages shows that you are a complete zero in radar, but all sorts of thinking patterns that you stick out are through the roof!

[R_S_F_S_R_]

Yes, the achievements are known, they ended with the Beetle. But Mig's achievements ended even earlier, like other "labels". And Zaslon finally stopped developing under the Soviets.

That’s where I started, that there hasn’t been anything for a long time, not even old, not to mention development.

Moreover, these same people, but under a different government, could progress, develop, science and discoveries. And with the navel, these same people can’t do anything but ruins. That they even completely dropped out of the world scientific citation.

Well, Pupkin got bad people, what can you do?
Oh, he suffered with us, poor thing, I can’t save him, because we were very lucky with him, but he wasn’t with us.
Here is Sidzipin, a good little people who fell into the lottery - hard-working, savvy, multiplying. But Pupkin got a bad deal, and even these dashing nineties, when everything at least still worked, and these mines from Lenin and the Polovtsians.

Hence the conclusion:
Since this hand-assed little people, incapable of anything, consisting entirely of drunks, stupid people and thieves, doesn’t want to do anything himself, then why is it necessary to demolish all this, otherwise they will break their heads in the ruins.
Pupkin is already tired of placing all these suicides in heaven, through Gundyaev, by the grace of God.

PS
Where is the logical error here? I don't understand.
Or is everything right?
Isn’t it really good that they defeated Phasatron with his hand-assed hands, who understands radar according to Wikipedia?
There, the subcontractors with all sorts of related research institutes have long ago begged for Molotov cocktails because they are worthless. And so the Uzbeks brought in by the regime will carry out compacting buildings in their place, at least something good in this life.

[Hexenmeister]

And Zaslon finally stopped developing under the Soviets

That is, what were the changes in Zaslon already in “our” time and what did they lead to? You don’t know! What were the concepts for constructing Zaslon, and what is their fundamental difference from other radars, you don’t even know.

After all, it’s really good that they defeated Phasatron with the hand-assed people

OK good. The only problem is that you apparently don’t know that the very one who was destroyed is an association of enterprises that (the enterprises) remained as they were, but suddenly there was no more room for the “managing” elite.
Py.Sy. I’m not interested in your thoughts about the people and other personalities, I didn’t write about this in my messages, so please don’t write this nonsense when you respond to my messages.

[R_S_F_S_R_]

Yes, everyone knows these improvements - the little ones of the Chinese and American periphery.

And the fact that the guardsman of the Pupkin Guard who defeated Phasatron and None was in the chair is an excellent indicator and a sure sign of further ruins.

PS
Your protective reasoning and ridiculous defense of ruinization don’t interest me either.

[cytadell]

New radars, optical systems, thermal imagers, and more sensitive seekers may appear. In general, there are many things that can reduce stealth to zero, that is, there are quite a lot of variables in this equation. But the ability to “break” the flight path and miss enemy missiles in an aerobatics maneuver is much more difficult to level out. The missile must fly much faster than its target, so it can maneuver, but not perfectly. No one can cancel physics

The author of the article is absolutely right in his reasoning regarding the stealth technology and the criteria for matching the generations of these same aircraft. In the context of the article and the specifically cited passage above, it is possible to formulate some universal criterion for the aircraft of the future. Call it the 6th generation criterion if you want. So the maneuverability and speed of the “bird” should be such that it would be impossible to shoot it down with any one or two air defense or air-to-air missiles. Moreover, maneuverability must be supported by the absence of a pilot in principle, by the presence of AI, which takes over all the computational processes of controlling this maneuverability. In addition to this, the machine should be more compact than the SU-57 and lighter (at a glance, 1.5-2.5 times), it should carry electronic warfare and jamming systems, heat traps and some other features. Well, that's about it.
The equation is agility versus speed.

[PilotS37]

Roman has outdone himself!
1. He now writes Fahrenheit (°F) instead of the F symbol for American fighters. Bravo! Cool gag!
2. Speaking about the visible-invisible °F-22 (in the radio range), he posts a photo of a visually visible object. Where is the logic?
3. Speaking about the Serbs who shot down °F-117 (there was laughter in the aviation world back then! (although in general war is always a tragedy)), Roman posts a photo... of some Tuaregs dancing on the wreckage of °F-15 .
Our Roman got carried away! I got completely carried away...

[Frettaskyrandi]

Speaking about the Serbs who shot down °F-117 (there was laughter in the aviation world back then! (although in general war is always a tragedy)), Roman posts a photo... of some Tuaregs dancing on the wreckage of °F-15.
Our Roman got carried away! I got completely carried away...

These are not Tuaregs, these are Libyans crawling around an American F-2011E Eagle that crashed for technical reasons in March 15.

[PilotS37]

Quote from Frettaskyrandi

These are not Tuaregs, these are Libyans crawling around an American F-2011E Eagle that crashed for technical reasons in March 15.

The word "Tuareg" was used as a symbol here. By the way, 19 Tuaregs live in Libya.

[fiv]

I find out who the author is when, after reading ten paragraphs about nothing, my eyes itch and my brain begins to itch (or the place where it is found in people in general). The ability to string words together must be supported by extensive knowledge of the subject and analytical talent. Then you will get useful and interesting materials. In general, we all have room to grow. Having just decided where.

[jaroff]

An airplane is a weapon that you need to know how to use. Like any weapon or tool. For this there is such a science as “Air Force Tactics”. Knowing the capabilities of your equipment (nomenclature, quantity, range of weapons and the number of weapons for each type, performance characteristics of each type, etc.), using intelligence data on a specific theater of operations, the use of aviation is planned, and only then the combat effectiveness is assessed. It’s simply impossible to evaluate as in the article and unprofessional

[Luminman]

For this there is such a science as "Air Force Tactics"

I wonder if anything has changed in this discipline today after the collapse of the USSR?

[Frettaskyrandi]

one Peter Suchiu

You can, of course, joke about “Peter’s friend,” but “a certain Peter Suciu” is the owner of one of the most authoritative news sites on military-technical and military-political topics, which is referenced by the world’s leading publications and the author is up to his level in about the same way as to Alpha Centauri.

[solar]

In short, everyone who needs it sees it.

Why see them? They are not wearing an invisible hat. If you come close or fly up, they will be visible. If you can fly up, of course.

After all, our fighter really has super-maneuverability, which American “irons” cannot see through a telescope. Whatever you say, UVT is a thing that we are much better at than the Americans.

The author, apparently, is not aware that the F-22 is equipped with UVT.

But the ability to “break” the flight path, miss enemy missiles on the side in an aerobatics maneuver

Aerobatics is a new word in aviation :))
The possibility of anti-missile maneuver depends on the overload capacity. Modern missiles reach 50-60 units. Airplanes really have 7, maximum 9 - neither the structure nor the pilot can withstand more.

target with EPR 20 sq. m., and this, in principle, is the EPR of fourth generation aircraft

The F-18 has an EPR of 1 m2, the Eurofighter has 0,5 m2.
And the whole article is in this style...

[PilotS37]

Quote from solar

Airplanes really have 7, maximum 9 - neither the structure nor the pilot can withstand more.

The design can withstand even more: there is somewhere around 11...12g

[solar]

+9-9,5g is the standard maximum limit in the performance characteristics of fighters. Taking into account the suspended weapons, the real value is no more than 7-7,5.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote from solar

The author, apparently, is not aware that the F-22 is equipped with UVT.

Yes and no - there the nozzle moves only in one plane

Quote from solar

Airplanes really have 7, maximum 9 - neither the structure nor the pilot can withstand more.

More, there are restrictions on the pilot

Quote from solar

The F-18 has an EPR of 1 m2, the Eurofighter has 0,5 m2.

The F-18 EMNIP is 1,2 m, and the Eurofighter is about the same, but this does not take into account the suspensions, and from a certain (nose) angle.
Ours, by the way, someone boasted that in the nose projection of the Su-34 the EPR is at the level of the cruise missile.

[solar]

Yes and no

And yes. The Americans selected those components of the UVT that are applicable in real combat.

The F-18 EMNIP is 1,2 m, and the Eurofighter is about the same, but this does not take into account the suspensions, and from a certain (nose) angle.

Not 20 anyway.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote from solar

And yes. The Americans selected those components of the UVT that are applicable in real combat.

And no - maneuver in the horizontal plane is undoubtedly important.

Quote from solar

Not 20 anyway.

Well, I don’t even know where Roman got it from. 3-5 m2 was for the 4th generation, now, of course, even less

[solar]

And no - maneuver in the horizontal plane is undoubtedly important.

They proceeded from the possibility of real use in combat conditions. The fact that flat nozzles with 2D deflection improve aircraft performance was established back in the 70s of the last century on the F-15V. In the 80-90s they also tested round 3D nozzles.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote from solar

They proceeded from the possibility of real use in combat conditions.

In which the all-angle nozzle obviously has an advantage

[solar]

acceleration equals turning radius times speed squared. Therefore, if you double the speed, to real air combat speeds, the overloads will increase four times and the overload restrictions simply will not give you the opportunity to realize the capabilities of the UHT at real combat speeds. And so - yes, UVT has an advantage in a certain speed range.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote from solar

Therefore, if you double the speed, to real air combat speeds, the overloads will quadruple

Who can argue, but this does not depend on the direction and applies to both 2D and all angles

[solar]

UVT has capabilities that can be used in real conditions - for example, reducing take-off mileage. So they use them.

[Strelkin]

The Americans decided that there was no need for it, but the problems with cost and resources were increasing sharply.

[Sumotori_380]

Rather, it is a compromise caused by the nozzle design

[Strelkin]

Ours, by the way, someone boasted that in the nose projection of the Su-34 the EPR is at the level of the cruise missile.

You need to immediately ask this delusional man: AT THE EXPENSE OF WHAT??

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

You need to immediately ask this delusional man: AT THE EXPENSE OF WHAT??

Yes, indeed, only Americans can use stealth technologies:)))))

[Strelkin]

Where is the all-duralumin Su-34 — and where are the stealths? What is stealth about this anyway?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

all-duralumin Su-34

You are simply a new word in aviation. Solid duralumin, wow:)))))) From a solid piece of duralumin:))))))

Quote: Strelkin

What's stealthy about this anyway?

I don't know, they don't report it. The Eurofighter doesn't seem to have stealth either, but the EPR in the front (not officially disclosed) is stated by experts at the level of 1 m2

[Strelkin]

You are simply a new word in aviation. Solid duralumin, wow:)))))) From a solid piece of duralumin:))))))

And as you may have guessed, we are talking about casing. And the Su-34 has the same all-dural alloy, just like the F-22 and F-35, which are almost all-carbide (carbon fiber reinforced plastics). That is why the EPR of these two materials differs so strikingly, even without additional RPM (radio absorbing materials) coating.

I don't know, they don't report it. The Eurofighter doesn't seem to have stealth either, but the EPR in the front (not officially disclosed) is stated by experts at the level of 1 m2

Yes, as they report, you just have to be lazy and take a look at Google — What the hell is this thing made of?!

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

almost entirely crab

Oh, the fighting crabs have already gone into battle...

Quote: Strelkin

Yes, as they report,

Well, please provide the Eurofighter EPR data with a link to the official source.

[Strelkin]

almost entirely crab

The only thing left to do is to get involved with the typos...

Well, please provide the Eurofighter EPR data with a link to the official source.

There are no official sources in the open press about this theme. All unofficial. The most objective value for the Eurofighter seems to me to be the frontal EPR (without suspension) of 0.3-0.5 m².

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

There are no official sources in the open press on this topic. All are unofficial.

Exactly. But you, not knowing the official data, continue to assert the superiority of American technology...

[Strelkin]

But you don’t know them either! But you continue to assert the superiority of Russian technology... Could you justify this somehow??

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

But you don’t know them either!

I understand that due to a number of technologies the Su-34's RCS could have been significantly reduced relative to the RCS of 4th generation aircraft. Whether this was done or not - I do not know. Therefore, I admit the POSSIBILITY that this was done. Technically, it is possible.
You do not allow for such a possibility.

[Strelkin]

I understand that due to a number of technologies, the EPR of the Su-34 could be significantly reduced relative to the EPR of 4th generation aircraft.

If the fuselage is made of duralumin, the EPR will be exactly the same as that of the Su-27, Su-30 and Su-35.

Whether this was done or not, I don’t know.

There was no, because no one bothered with it at all. If you think something was done, give me a link?

So I admit the POSSIBILITY that this was done. Technically it is possible.

Of course it is possible if you provide a link that instead of duralumin it has a carbon fiber skin, and in addition it is covered with layers of RPM? And if not, then no.

You do not allow for such a possibility.

For starters, IF WE COULD, we would have made the Su-57 a stealth aircraft, and not the product that even the Indians "turned up their noses at" - It was precisely because of their unsatisfactory low visibility. Indians preferred to buy "Rafali"...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

If the fuselage is made of duralumin, the EPR will be exactly the same as that of the Su-27, Su-30 and Su-35.

Comrade teacher, I report. The EPR is affected
Radar installed in the nose of the aircraft (yes, the fairing is radio-transparent)
Configuration of the skin, angles of reflection of radio waves
Fuselage covering
The material from which the fuselage is made and the methods of its fastening
And much more, including lantern design, etc.

Quote: Strelkin

For starters, IF WE COULD, we would have made the Su-57 a stealth aircraft, and not the product that even the Indians "turned up their noses at" - precisely because of its low visibility that did not satisfy them. The Indians preferred to buy the Rafale...

That means you don't know anything about our Indian contracts.

[Strelkin]

Comrade teacher, I report. The EPR is affected
Radar installed in the nose of the aircraft (yes, the fairing is radio-transparent)
Configuration of the skin, angles of reflection of radio waves
Fuselage covering
The material from which the fuselage is made and the methods of its fastening
And much more, including lantern design, etc.

Right. And what is there in this regard on the Su-34?? Besides your dreams?

That means you don't know anything about our Indian contracts.

We are not talking about "in general". We are talking about the fact that the Indians put a "big Indian bolt" on the supposed contract for the PAK FA. Which did not turn out to be stealth and never became one. And yes, they are successfully producing the Su-30MKI under license, supplementing its avionics with an Israeli electronic warfare station ("second freshness") and some other French avionics...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

Correct. And what is so special about the Su-34 in this regard?

Who knows. Maybe it's complicated, maybe not. I'm not you, to make categorical judgments without information:)))))

Quote: Strelkin

We are not talking about "in general". We are talking about the fact that the Indians put a "big Indian bolt" on the proposed PAK FA contract.

We are saying that you are completely unaware of the Indian contracts, you don’t even know that the Rafale and PAK FA could not intersect in principle, since the Indians considered them to be aircraft of different classes and tasks.
You don't know that the Su-57 is a heavy fighter, and the MRCA tender was announced to replace their light "brothers", which is why not a single heavy fighter participated in the tender.

[Strelkin]

We are saying that you are completely unaware of the Indian contracts, you don’t even know that the Rafale and PAK FA could not intersect in principle, since the Indians considered them to be aircraft of different classes and tasks.
You don't know that the Su-57 is a heavy fighter, and the MRCA tender was announced to replace their light "brothers", which is why not a single heavy fighter participated in the tender.

Oh! And why the "heavy fighter" Su-57 (so "heavy" that I couldn't find anywhere - and what is the maximum load it can lift?!) versus the "light" Rafale, which takes "only" 9.5 tonnes (!!), why did the Indians abandon this "heavy" fighter?! And they already have one heavy Su-30MKI. And why is the Su-57 not in a hurry to be launched into large-scale production by the native Ministry of Defense?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

Oh! And why the "heavy fighter" Su-57 (so "heavy" that I couldn't find it anywhere - and what is the maximum load it can lift?!) versus the "light" Rafale, which takes "only" 9.5 tons (!!),

Because you need to take your medications on time. Then you won't have the illusion that fighters are divided into light/heavy by the weight of the weapons they carry.

Quote: Strelkin

Why did the Indians abandon this "heavy" fighter?

Quote: Strelkin

And why is the Su-57 not in a hurry to be launched into large-scale production by the native Ministry of Defense?

You didn't answer the question: from what sources did you get the information that India is buying Rafali instead of FGFA?:))))))))))

[Strelkin]

...it will not seem that fighters are divided into light/heavy according to the mass of the weapons they carry.

How, how are they divided?? Shed some light on the truth - why didn't these fucking Indians take the Su-57, - but for some reason grabbed the Rafale? By what criteria are modern fighters of the Su-57 class and the Rafale class divided? What is the fundamental difference??

You didn't answer the question: from what sources did you get the information that India is buying Rafali instead of FGFA? :)

- Well! Well! From reality: FGFA was rejected, rejected, renounced - and Rafale was seized, purchased, serial production was being established and in considerable quantities...
Of course, you have an original interpretation of the events?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

How, how do they share?? Shed some light on the truth - why didn't these fucking Indians take the Su-57, but for some reason grabbed the Rafale?

Go study the material already, don't disgrace yourself. The Indians abandoned the FGFA not in favor of the Rafales, but in favor of their own developments HAL AMCA
Rafale competed with the MiG-35 and other Eurofighters.

Quote: Strelkin

- Well! Well! From reality: FGFA was rejected, rejected, renounced - and Rafale was seized, purchased, serial production was being established and in considerable quantities...

Instead of 126 aircraft for 20 billion euros, India bought only 36 for 9 billion.

[Strelkin]

Go study the material already, don't disgrace yourself. The Indians abandoned the FGFA not in favor of the Rafales, but in favor of their own developments HAL AMCA

Stop lying and making the public laugh? The HAL AMCA program was launched only in 2010, when it became clear that nothing good had come of the PAK FA. Only then did the Indians scratch their heads and realize that they needed to try to make their own 5th generation aircraft:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL_AMCA

Rafale competed with the MiG-35 and other Eurofighters.

Here comes the farce again: what kind of competitor is the MiG-35 to the Eurofighter?! How many regiments does Russia have with the MiG-35? How many?!

Instead of 126 aircraft for 20 billion euros, India bought only 36 for 9 billion.

Aha Plus, expand production of Rafales in India!
https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/rafales-make-in-india-plans-get-shot-in-the-arm-101719896115568.html
Plus the naval Rafale:
https://www.dassault-aviation.com/en/group/press/press-kits/india-selects-the-navy-rafale/

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

Stop lying and making the public laugh? The HAL AMCA program was only launched in 2010, when it became clear that nothing good had come of the PAK FA

Mmm. Not only did you blurt out some obvious stupidity, but you also persist in it.
Okay, let's figure out point by point who is lying here.
So - first there was the MRCA tender for 126 new fighters to replace the MiG-21, 27. At the same time, this tender was initially supposed to be the only one - they wanted to buy Mirage 2000s. And it was in 2021 But the tender dragged on.
Then the program for the creation of a new 5th generation fighter FGFA was opened. It happened in 2007. That is, your statement that the Indians were looking for a replacement for the FGFA is nonsense, Siv Cable - when they started this tender, the FGFA program did not exist at all.
Next. The Indians' tender was a mixed success, and only in 2012, having considered the F/A-18, F-16, Gripen, Rafale, MiG-35 and Eurasian Fighter, they announced the winner. It turned out to be the Rafale. Reading lips TWO THOUSAND TWELVE.
And the Indians left the FGFA program in 2018 city
That is, at the time the winner of the tender was determined, the FGFA program was alive and well, and it was destined to reach a dead end only after 5 years (the proposal to terminate it was made in 2017).
Conclusion - Your statement

Quote: Strelkin

IF THEY COULD, they would have made the Su-57 a stealth aircraft, and not the product that even the Indians "turned up their noses at" - precisely because of its low visibility that did not satisfy them. The Indians preferred to buy the Rafale...

It is a lie from the first to the last word.

Quote: Strelkin

Aha! Plus, start production of Rafales in India!
https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/rafales-make-in-india-plans-get-shot-in-the-arm-101719896115568.html

Did you read the link yourself?

Dassault Aviation SA is in the process of acquiring land near Jewar international airport for a maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) facility for India's Mirage 2000 and Rafale fighters

Dassault Aviation SA in the process of acquiring land near Jewar International Airport for maintenance, repair and overhaul (MRO) of Indian Mirage 2000 and Rafale fighters
And then - thoughts from "unnamed sources" that MAYBE it will be possible to assemble Rafales at this plant
You know, I could waste my time on a mistaken person. But you are deliberately telling a lie.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

So - first there was the MRCA tender for 126 new fighters to replace the MiG-21, 27. At the same time, this tender was initially supposed to be the only one - they wanted to buy Mirage 2000. And it was in 2021

In 2001 of course

[Strelkin]

So why did the Indians abandon the PAK FA? God (or the hell with it, with the Rafale). You claim - because you decided to make your own 5th generation aircraft (in 2010!). And then you write that they left the PAK FA program in 2018.
So why did the Hindus LEAVE it?? This was our main, original question...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

God (or to hell with him, with Rafal).

Oh, well, yes, we'll hush up your lie for the sake of clarity and continue asking questions. Well, well.

Quote: Strelkin

So why did the Indians abandon the PAK FA?

Who told you that they refused?:)))))))) Do you think that the Indians bought the Rafale differently?
At first they wanted the Mirage 2000 on a non-alternative basis. All the conditions of the competition were written for it. Then they changed their minds and left the French with nothing. They turned to the Americans, and the Super Hornet became their new "favorite wife". And then they changed their minds again and returned to Dassault, but they stopped producing the 2007s in 2000. In the end, they bought the Rafale.
As for the PAK FA, the Indians say they are ready to return to the idea of ​​buying it after it receives full functionality (I think we are talking about the 2nd stage engines) and enters the troops in this form. So this story is incredibly far from its end.

[Strelkin]

Oh, well, yes, we'll hush up your lie for the sake of clarity and continue asking questions. Well, well.

Are you kidding me? Look at the title of the topic? Initially, you claimed that purely Russian avionics are the most powerful in the world. That the Su-57 is almost the F-22, only a little better! Then I said: "Why did the Indians "bolt" on the almost best aircraft in the world and started buying the Rafale?!" And then it began: "This is a plane of the wrong system! The wrong size! From a completely different competition!"
Who cares?!
1. If the Indians were sure that they would receive a 5th generation aircraft from Russia, would they start building their own 5th generation aircraft? Which, judging by their pace, will be in about ten years? NO, never.
2. Having the Su-30MKI, its well-established production on the conveyor belt and its own Tejas, would the Indians rush to acquire the Rafale? NO.

As for the PAK FA, the Indians say they are ready to return to the idea of ​​buying it after it receives full functionality (I think we are talking about the 2nd stage engines) and enters the troops in this form. So this story is incredibly far from its end.

Well, this is complete nonsense: if we put F-57 engines on the Su-22 now, will it become a 5th generation aircraft? OF COURSE NOT.
...........................................
I repeat the question: WHY DID THE INDIANS REFUSE THE SU-57?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

Are you kidding? Look at the title of the topic? Initially, you claimed that purely Russian avionics are the most powerful in the world.

As usual, you hear not what your opponent says, but what you want to hear.

Quote: Strelkin

Then I said: "Why did the Indians "screw over" the almost best airplane in the world and start buying the Rafale?!" And then it started: "This is an airplane of the wrong system! The wrong size! From a completely different competition!"

What was that?:))) Am I talking to Dolly the fish?
Read one more time

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

So - first there was the MRCA tender for 126 new fighters to replace the MiG-21, 27. At the same time, this tender was initially supposed to be the only one - they wanted to buy Mirage 2000. And it was in 2001. But the tender dragged on.
Then the program for creating a new 5th generation fighter FGFA was opened. This happened in 2007. That is, your statement that the Indians were looking for a replacement for the FGFA is nonsense, Sea Cable - when they started this tender, the FGFA program did not exist at all.
Next. The Indians' tender was a mixed success, and only in 2012, having considered the F/A-18, F-16, Gripen, Rafale, MiG-35 and Eurasian Fighter, they announced the winner. It turned out to be the Rafale. Reading lips TWO THOUSAND TWELVE.
And the Indians left the FGFA program in 2018.
That is, at the time the winner of the tender was determined, the FGFA program was alive and well, and it was destined to reach a dead end only after 5 years (the proposal to terminate it was made in 2017).

We understand that Rafale and PAK FA are NOT connected to each other in ANY WAY.
Try to learn this and not forget it through the comment.

Quote: Strelkin

1. If the Indians were sure that they would receive a 5th generation aircraft from Russia, would they start building their own 5th generation aircraft? Which, judging by their pace, will be in about ten years? NO, never.

Only a person unfamiliar with India can make such a stupid statement.

Quote: Strelkin

2. Having the Su-30MKI, its well-established production on the conveyor belt and its own Tejas, would the Indians rush to acquire the Rafale? NO.

This is even more stupid, which shows that you don’t know anything about Tejas.
Hint: the Indians were counting on the Tejas, on the fact that it could replace part of their light aircraft fleet. But they were afraid to put all their eggs in one basket, so they wanted to have a foreign fighter that would be localized like the Su-30.

Quote: Strelkin

Well, this is complete nonsense: if we put F-57 engines on the Su-22 now, will it become a 5th generation aircraft? OF COURSE NOT.

Of course. Even with the first stage engines it is quite a 1th generation.

Quote: Strelkin

I repeat the question: WHY DID THE INDIANS REFUSE THE SU-57?

Dear Dolly Fish, Read the syllables

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

Who told you that they refused?

[Strelkin]

We understand that Rafale and PAK FA are NOT connected to each other in ANY WAY.

I explained HOW they are connected. But in your alternative Universe this connection is not traced, there are different laws...
1. If the Indians were sure that they would receive a 5th generation aircraft from Russia, would they start building their own 5th generation aircraft? Which, judging by their pace, will be in about ten years? NO, never.

Only a person unfamiliar with India can make such a stupid statement.

[Strelkin]

Only a person unfamiliar with India can make such a stupid statement.

Has the Maharaja already given you a white elephant for your special services?!

This is even more stupid, which shows that you don’t know anything about Tejas.
Hint: the Indians were counting on the Tejas, on the fact that it could replace part of their light aircraft fleet. But they were afraid to put all their eggs in one basket, so they wanted to have a foreign fighter that would be localized like the Su-30.

And did the summoned spirit of Indira Gandhi tell you this?!

Quote: Strelkin
Well, this is complete nonsense: if we put F-57 engines on the Su-22 now, will it become a 5th generation aircraft? OF COURSE NOT.

Of course. Even with the first stage engines it is quite a 1th generation.

With a frontal EPR that does not stretch 0.1 m²?? No, of course not. And he wasn't even lying nearby.

Quote: Strelkin
I repeat the question: WHY DID THE INDIANS REFUSE THE SU-57?

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
Who told you that they refused?

Hindus ...
https://naked-science.ru/article/tech/eto-ne-pyatoe-pokolenie-indiya

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

I explained HOW they are related.

And I explained to you on the dates what nonsense you wrote.

[Strelkin]

You constantly avoid the main questions!
Who told you that the Su-57 is a 5th generation aircraft? (Besides Pogosyan?)
What score will it end with? 100 battles between F-15EX and F-35?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: Strelkin

You constantly avoid the main questions!

I constantly answer them. Alas, you are unable to understand my answers, because they do not fit into the narrow logical chain that you have left yourself.

Quote: Strelkin

Who told you that the Su-57 is a 5th generation aircraft? (Besides Pogosyan?)

So you and Pogosyan are through the roof:)))))

Quote: Strelkin

What would be the score of 100 battles between the F-15EX and the F-35?

You're boring me. Do you even read what people write to you?

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

Well, if my memory serves me right, we estimated the probability of the F-35 winning at around 0,2 against the Su-35, so I would think the EX would be at around the same level.

[Strelkin]

Quote: Strelkin

Who told you that the Su-57 is a 5th generation aircraft?

I constantly answer them. Alas, you are unable to understand my answers, because they do not fit into the narrow logical chain that you have left yourself.

Try answering again?

Quote: Strelkin
What would be the score of 100 battles between the F-15EX and the F-35?

You are bothering me.

Amazing answer! Laconic and specific! The audience applauds!

[ximkim]

The SU-57 can be sent to a museum.
By the standards of the development of the world aircraft industry, this is the limit of the capabilities of the Sukhoi Design Bureau. The Russian military-industrial complex is not capable of more.

[K-50]

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have. What the rest have is really their problem.

Well, for the rest, it’s really a problem that we have the Su-57, but they don’t have anything like it.

[Svetlana]

Quote: Luminman

How could such a design be cheaper?

Air compressor parts are not required to be heat-resistant, unlike gas turbine parts (blades). Therefore, an air compressor can be manufactured in a cheap way - printed on a 3D printer, for example using powder metallurgy from titanium powder. Unfortunately, it is still difficult to produce monocrystalline heat-resistant gas turbine blades using the 3D powder printing method. And the heat-resistant metals used to make turbine blades (chrome, molybdenum, niobium, tantalum, etc.) are much more expensive than titanium. Therefore, such a design will be cheaper than designs with gas turbines.

[Svetlana]

Quote: Dozorny severa

It is not clear why the gases emanating from the combustor should be cooled? The efficiency should decrease as a result.

The gases emanating from the CS, heated to high temperatures, have already passed through the nozzle channel with the magnetic field of the MHD generator and have partially given up their energy to the on-board MHD generator, which increases the efficiency. The gases emanating from the CS are usually cooled in the stealth structures of aircraft to reduce visibility in the infrared range.

[Russian Patriot]

There is no doubt that the Su-57 is a wonderful aircraft.
The only question is the speed of production. 12 pieces is very little. There is no point in denying this fact.

[Strelkin]

There is no doubt that the Su-57 is a wonderful aircraft.

Huge doubts arose among the Hindus - so they categorically refused it.

The only question is the speed of production. 12 pieces is very little. There is no point in denying this fact.

Huge doubts that “the Su-57 is a wonderful aircraft” arose among the Russian Defense Ministry and the command of the Russian Air Force, that's why the Su-57 was never put into large production.
NATO command and the Chinese command have no doubts about the combat capabilities of the Su-57.

[RondelR]

Complete nonsense. F22 flies with a Lunenberg lens. Of course, India's Su-30 and Rafale see it. Low visibility is much more important than maneuverability; it reduces the detection and capture radius of missile seekers. I didn’t read further, there’s no point in reading fairy tales.

[Strelkin]

During exercises, not to mention combat situations, the Luneberg lens blocks are, of course, removed. For example, those F-22s that are causing terror in Syria and over the Persian Gulf fly there without these blocks. This block can be removed/installed in a minute - four bolts to unscrew/screw...

[Illanatol]

Quote: qqqq

I will support you. Counts the money of the country that prints it. Yes, if necessary, they will also print much more than 100 billion. And sooner or later, with such infusions, they will really get something unique.

Money does not automatically turn into a finished product. Generous funding doesn't solve everything.
Find a dozen graphomaniacs and pay each 10 million bucks. Will you end up with an opus comparable to War and Peace? Is not a fact.

[Illanatol]

Quote from solar

And yes. The Americans selected those components of the UVT that are applicable in real combat.

Nonsense. They didn't take anything. They were able to develop (not from scratch) a deflectable thrust vector in the vertical plane - and they used it.
Well, of course, there’s no need for super-maneuverability horizontally, yeah!

[solar]

The Americans developed UHT with both flat nozzles and round all-angle nozzles back in the 70-80s of the last century, used on the F15-F-15B and F-15 STOL/MTD (Short Takeoff and Landing/Maneuver Technology Demonstrator).

In 1975, the Langley Research Center began conducting sponsored programs to study two-dimensional thrust vectoring nozzles; [6]: 44 government and industry studies of non-axisymmetric two-dimensional (2D) nozzles in the early 1970s identified significant benefits for XNUMXD thrust vectoring nozzle concepts.

After testing, they abandoned all-angle ones, leaving only 2D with flat nozzles.

[Sumotori_380]

Has it really been stolen from us again???

[Illanatol]

Quote: RussianPatriot

There is no doubt that the Su-57 is a wonderful aircraft.
The only question is the speed of production. 12 pieces is very little.

It is possible that he also has his own “childhood illnesses”, which are revealed during the operation of a small series. Plus, using real combat experience will allow you to make some changes.

This is better than launching a crude and very expensive aircraft into large-scale production.

[Illanatol]

Quote: RondelR

Low visibility is much more important than maneuverability; it reduces the detection and capture radius of missile seekers.

But if a modern missile has captured a target, it is unlikely that it will be possible to escape without high maneuverability.
The seeker is not only in the radio range, but also in the infrared. But it is unlikely that it will be possible to camouflage the aircraft from thermal seekers - not only does the engine shine strongly, but the airframe itself heats up (especially at supersonic speed).

[solar]

The overload capacity of a rocket is higher than that of an airplane. To avoid a missile, you need a lucky coincidence of circumstances. With a double launch, it is much more difficult to escape.

[Devil13]

Author, a few points.
F-35s were shining over Syria, yes.
Syria also has air defense.
And where are the downed ones? But they are not there.

Further. Russia DOES NOT HAVE AWACS. That's it, 10 planes, which the Ukrainians are also reducing in number - it's not even funny.
Any operation of the US Air Force and not only is provided by:
- AWACS 400km+
- RER, electronic warfare f-18G
- large UAVs with tsu capability
And other delights of life.
Where is all this in the Russian Aerospace Forces? What is the time lag between detecting a target on the ground or in the air and striking?
Considering that the Su-35 is being raised to intercept..... From the airfields!
And 34 for strikes too.
That is, the “duty link” in the air has not been done, we do not have the possibility of a timely (within 2-10 minutes) air strike!
Jews have been saying hello since the 1970s, well.
Like any other countries, since the time of any operation where the enemy’s air defense and air force were destroyed and suppressed in a few days.

So no need to la-la, uh-huh.
A combination of f-35 and drlo still looks better than “only su-57”.

Well, speaking of stealth. It does not make the plane INVISIBLE.
It REDUCES THE DETECTION DISTANCE. What you write about in the end (i.e. you understand what you’re talking about, but continue to push bullshit)

+ Our own developed radar detection systems
- The distance at which you will be detected
+ The distance at which your missiles will hit the target
= Window of opportunity and possibility of action in this operational interval.
So far from your own conclusions in the article:
The F-35 will approach undetected at 120 km, perfectly seeing ours.
Will launch a missile with a range of 180 km, from which ours can no longer escape
And he leaves, turning around.

10 out of 10. From YOUR SAME article, Karl!

[Electrical]

The F-35 will approach undetected at 120 km, perfectly seeing ours.

I wonder how he will “see perfectly”? Or will an AWACS aircraft fly next to it, which will glow for hundreds of kilometers in a circle like a Christmas tree? And no one will notice it, because it is “not according to the rules”?

[Strelkin]

Devil13
(Nikolai)
The F-35 will approach undetected at 120 km, perfectly seeing our people.

I wonder how he will “see perfectly”?

Using LPI mode - Low Probability of Intercept - low probability of interception.

[Ruslan]

I don’t know about the actual performance characteristics, but how beautiful the Su-57 is. I really can't get enough of it :-)

[andrey4578]

No matter what they write there. This car is apparently not inferior to anything good we have, it can work without compromising aerodynamics and other combat characteristics, such as increased stealth (ammunition in the back), for this reason it can already be called a new generation. And so, a generation is a generation of people, let someone write about those who have not yet been born, it’s their business.

[Sumotori_380]

Does it have a dump body or a flatbed?

[Lucy]

Author Roman Skomorokhov

[donpablo]

a few days ago, in the US media, there was an article “The command of the US Air Force canceled the competition for the “6th generation”. They are sooo asking Congress to write off all F22s, Congress so far agrees to write off only the first generation F22, and the military is begging to write off all F22s - unsuitable for in combat operations they are very expensive to maintain and for some reason they are sooooo expensive to store” the F35 was supposed to replace the F 35, but there are so many problems. that the military accepted it into service, with the wording “limitedly suitable.” Under wild pressure from the US government, otherwise the partners in the F35 project, tired of waiting for the plane, threatened to withdraw from the project, withdraw their contribution, who needs a plane that the army does not accept for service country of origin. but the promise of “Loha Martin” to fix all the numerous mistakes remained promises. According to last year's report of the commission of auditors, "the F 25 has about 900 malfunctions. 9 are critical to the life of the pilot"

[andrey4578]

I hope you don't mind criticism. The fact is that the pluses confirm a clear and already voiced idea, the minuses are about what?

[Mister who]

Stealth does not play a special role, the main thing is speed (maneuverability is not needed), I think it is inferior to Su in speed and was conceived as a bomber, as a fighter it is inferior to the old modification of Su.

[Dozorny severa]

Quote from Frettaskyrandi

Speaking about the Serbs who shot down °F-117 (there was laughter in the aviation world back then! (although in general war is always a tragedy)), Roman posts a photo... of some Tuaregs dancing on the wreckage of °F-15.
Our Roman got carried away! I got completely carried away...

These are not Tuaregs, these are Libyans crawling around an American F-2011E Eagle that crashed for technical reasons in March 15.

Yeah, that’s right, Tuaregs are forbidden to show their faces...

[Mister who]

*the correction is inferior to the moment, set the high-altitude moment against the Su-57 who will win. The instant is both high-speed and high-altitude, with the same radar and missile equipment 100%

[Mister who]

The Su-57 is subsonic, this is confusing in the first place and in general! The bomber class, whatever one may say, is not a fighter.

[Meaning of life]

Actually, it's supersonic.

[Mister who]

I’ll disappoint you, it’s actually subsonic, its classification is a bomber

[Meaning of life]

Maximum speed: Mach 2 (2,135 km/h; 1,327 mph) at high altitude
Supercruise: Mach 1.3 (1,400 km/h; 870 mph) supercruise at high altitude

[BSD Fan]

You author don’t understand anything! The SU-57 flies on old and insufficient jet fuel with a corresponding price! And the F-22/35 fly on the purest democrakerosene costing 100 thousand dollars per gallon! That's when the SU-57 switches to such democratic kerosene and will be able to leave a contrail in the colors of LGBTQ+-*/ then it will be able to compete on equal terms!

[Colleague]

An excellent, devastating response article to the publication in the privileged US media, with calculations and figures. Bravo!

[1 z1]

It will stand, go to parades, and during this time something will change.

Maximum efficiency at a relative minimum of costs.

The author has a very interesting vision of the economic effect.

[S.Z.]

We need to understand why we need the SU-57.

Obviously, there are no fools to fight with NATO (just as NATO is also not foolish enough to fight with us), and after the NWO we will also receive a fair inoculation against local “small victorious wars”, since even with the most favorable outcome, we will have to rake and rake away the consequences of this action .

Therefore, we need an airplane first of all in order to trade it. Therefore, articles about our advanced technology should be perceived as trade advertising and anti-advertising, that is, commercial promotions.

[anclevalico]

Show me the mass-produced Su-57, in its final modification and commercial quantities. It will immediately become clear whether we have problems with him or not. IMHO, we now have big problems with aviation in general. And not only.

[Mister who]

Because it’s like an Armata, very expensive and a bomber, apparently it was cut to destroy fortifications in conventional war games, or for the post-apocalypse (i.e. WW3) when the main areas are destroyed, additional destruction is carried out precisely by bomber aircraft, then what survived, it is achieved by them, not aerial shooting as in tank troops, but the removal of production or critical infrastructure, then it fits in, because after nuclear weapons, aviation will finish off according to the doctrine! Additional exploration of what survived and removal.

[Illanatol]

Quote from solar

The overload capacity of a rocket is higher than that of an airplane.

What matters is not the permissible angular overloads, but the turning radius. With an overload of 5 g, it is quite possible to escape from a rocket with 50 g. The size of the overload also depends on the speed, let me remind you.
It’s difficult even for a rocket with gas-dynamic rudders to replicate Pugachev’s Cobra.

[Comet]

Quote: Illanatol

What matters is not the permissible angular overloads, but the turning radius.

Angular speed of turn.

[Mister who]

If the scattering of shrapnel over the affected radius is greater than your angular turn due to inertia, then no maneuverability will help you, only afterburner and altitude. Strike and escape from the affected area due to speed. This is exactly how the enemy sets the task, and you will do somersaults from the missiles)) resembles the dance of a squid in a frying pan. Why was Fast and Furious invented?

[Sumotori_380]

I doubt that dynamic braking from supersonic speeds works. That is, first the aircraft leaving the missile defense system needs to be thrown up to 0,3-0,4 M, and then figure

[Sumotori_380]

Of the entire assortment of figures using UVT, only information about the value of the bell came across in the public domain - supposedly it allows, by reducing the speed to zero, to disrupt the addition of a pulse-Doppler radar

[Mister who]

The radius of the shrapnel will cover all your somersaults! You can set the detonation before the target reaches it, so it will be a sure thing for the duck.

[Illanatol]

Quote from solar

After testing, they abandoned all-angle ones, leaving only 2D with flat nozzles.

That’s why they refused because they couldn’t bring them to mind, to an acceptable level of manufacturability.
We chose what was simpler and what we could actually put into production.

[Illanatol]

Quote: Mister Who

The Su-57 is subsonic, this is confusing in the first place and in general!

Not "Mr. Who", but "Mr. Inadequate"!

The SU-57 even has a cruising speed of 1800 km/h. That is, it can fly for a long time at supersonic speed, without afterburner.

And the F-35’s cruising speed is just subsonic, like that of 4th generation fighters.

[Mister who]

You can instantly compare it with an interceptor, you found something to compare it with, it made you laugh)))

[Mister who]

Mig-31 3000 km/h, well, who will win? If the same radar and missiles, Su will crap, he is a bomber for positions and an apocalypse post, not for air combat, and he will most likely beat him in altitude. Glory to the Union!

[Sumotori_380]

1,5 M at the cruising speed of the 57th is not 1800, but 200-300 kilometers less

[Simfy]

1000 units in service f35 - when we, even theoretically, will have 1000 units in service. SU-57? Even 20 pcs. per year, in 50 years, when 6-7 generation vehicles will be in service.

[Vovan]

Whatever you say, UVT is a thing that we are much better at than the Americans.

Is it really so difficult to write in Russian, or is written Russian a language that the author does not know well?

[RMT]

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have.
Happy is he who believes...

[Vladimir-TTT]

Quote: RMT

So who has problems with the Su-57? We do not have.

Due to lack of availability.
No plane - no problem.
Not that at all - no, for reports, awards and bonuses - it is there.
And as for “on the warpath” - he’s not there.
What can't be said about the much-maligned F-35?

Those who wish can try to remember the entire military history.
Not a single wunderwaffe brought victory to any country - if it was not mass-produced in the required quantity.

[Dozorny severa]

Quote: Illanatol

Find a dozen graphomaniacs and pay each 10 million bucks. Will you end up with an opus comparable to War and Peace? Is not a fact.

They will hire two dozen journalists for this - and who will write laudatory reviews - and that’s the end of it...

[Rockerman]

This is all good, a lot of text and pictures. I’m wondering if “everyone who needs to see them sees them,” how to explain the murder of the Hamas leader in Tehran, for a second - the capital of Iran, an aircraft missile, the carrier and launcher of which, none of the systems Iran has, including Russian ones, didn't you catch it? Although, judging by the range of the supposed missile (there was a review-article on the topvar on the missile), it was launched from Iranian territory.

[Illanatol]

Quote: Dozorny severa

They will hire two dozen journalists for this - and who will write laudatory reviews - and that’s the end of it...

It won't work. Masterpieces are masterpieces because they stand the test of time.
Shakespeare's Hamlet has not yet been forgotten. Try to remember, offhand, the “Oscar-winning” films of 20 years ago. Weak?

[Illanatol]

Quote: Simfy

1000 units in service f35 - when we, even theoretically, will have 1000 units in service. SU-57? Even 20 pcs. per year, in 50 years, when 6-7 generation vehicles will be in service.

We don't need 1000 Su-57s.
I estimate the need for our Air Force at 250-300 SU-57 (as a continuation of the Su-27 traditions) and 400 cheaper and smaller 5th generation fighters, as a continuation of the MiG-29 line.

[Desperado]

The release of the Su-75 would be appropriate if there is a sufficient fleet of 4++ generation fighter aircraft. But the number of aircraft against the background of the potential enemy’s aircraft fleet is simply minimal. Figures from Wiki https://clck.ru/3CMP8z
Judging by the data, it is necessary to replace the fleet of Su-27 and Mig-29. Those. In the first few days, the goal is to replace old types, maximizing the fleet of modern equipment. Instead of 200 Su-57s for the same money, you can produce 400-450 Su-35S, the production of which has long been mastered and is easier to increase.

[Mister who]

Why do you think it wasn’t the Armata tank that was launched into production? There will also be price-quantity-efficiency! In terms of price-quantity-efficiency, few could compete with the Union, but if you try to do it cheaper, it won’t work.

[Petrov-Alexander_1Sergeevich]

Master of the title, as I read it, immediately scroll to the author’s name and yes, it was him

[lazy]

57 were built a little, but 35 was a lot, the Americans themselves have not produced 22 for a long time, in contrast to 15, 16, 18. just as they said in one advertisement, “if everything is the same, why pay more,” and if both 15 and 35 perform their tasks on decent level, then why a massively more expensive aircraft? the technologies have worked out, they are slowly riveting, something will appear that 35 cannot cope with, they will increase the output of 57,

[Mobik]

Oh, okay, again the old song about the main thing “this stealth of yours is bullshit.” What about the capture of stealth aircraft by missiles with AGSN and PPGSN. It is not enough for the radar to see it; the missile must also capture it.

[AC130 Gunship]

Well, when the author, comparing 5th generation aircraft (which conventionally includes the Su57), dragged in here the Mig31 developed in the late 70s of the last century, you don’t have to read any further.
Another multi-station operator, “versed” in airplanes, submarines, tanks, and contraceptive products

[guest]

Su-57. Multirole air superiority fighter. Unobtrusive.

But in the Northwestern Military District zone they haven’t noticed him for a long time.

[Mister who]

In addition to the above, information somehow flashed about its operating speed, apparently when throwing 800 km/h, and the main thing that catches your eye is the glider; the high-speed ones have a completely different glider. The next generation fighter will have no fins in the form of an arrowhead and will most likely be powered by jet (rocket) thrust during afterburner; I think the shooting is not carried out in afterburner, at operating speed.

[Strelkin]

Next-Gen Fighter Jet Will Have No Arrowhead-Shaped Feathers

And how will it stay in the air?

and most likely on jet (rocket) thrust with afterburner

And where will he get fuel for this?!

[Mister who]

As a hybrid car, aviation fuel, after working on the target - going beyond the radius of destruction, switching to jet thrust. If robotization, then have you already seen the cartoon with Sarmat, does it remind you of anything?

[Pavel57]

Quote: Strelkin

The requirement for the rocket was to have an overload 2 times greater than the target. This follows from the laws of guidance. We can say that this is also physics.

Why only 2 times more? Fighters (almost all world ones) have a maximum operational overload 9g, according to the physiological limitations of the pilot, but for rockets it is much greater:
AIM-120C7/D — 40g
AIM-132 ———- 50g
AIM-9X ———-- 60g
Python-5 ———-- 70g
A-Darter ——— 100g

From the point of view of guidance according to the law of proportional navigation, the excess of the interceptor missile overload over the target overload is 2 times. If the target is an aircraft, then 9x2 = 18.
If the target is a missile with 30G, then the available overload of the interceptor missile is 60G.
The figures you cited most likely apply to situations when the target is a missile. But for most aircraft missiles, such large values ​​of available overloads are achieved with the help of gas-dynamic rudders, and they are active only when the cruise engine is running. After the cruise engine stops running, due to aerodynamics alone, the interceptor missile loses speed greatly due to large overloads with all the ensuing consequences of reducing the possibility of hitting the target.

[Strelkin]

The figures you cited most likely apply to situations where the target is a missile.

The overload numbers that I have given are the maximum. available rocket overloads. This is the overload that a rocket is generally capable of creating - at its maximum speed and at low altitude (maximum air density).

But for most aircraft missiles, such high values ​​of available overloads are achieved with the help of gas-dynamic rudders, and they are active only when the cruise engine is running.

Someone has cruelly misled you: None of the five rockets I listed above have gas-dynamic rudders. Obviously, due to lack of need, they create all the overloads with aerodynamic rudders and their aerodynamic surfaces; in the AIM-132, such a surface is mainly the missile body.

After the main engine stops working, the interceptor missile loses speed due to high overloads due to aerodynamics alone.

After the engine stops working in the cruise mode, the rocket does not “lose speed from high overloads”, because in this section of the trajectory it (as a rule) does not experience any “high overloads”, it while there is no need to maneuver much, the target is still far away.

with all the ensuing consequences of reducing the chances of hitting the target.

The missile loses speed due to air resistance, even if it does not maneuver at all, and, accordingly, its available overload decreases. Therefore, according to all passport data, the far and upper limits of the kill zone of SAMs and air-to-air missiles are taken to be such that the missile is still capable of performing a one-time overload of 5g. Hence the ranges of these air-to-air missiles (at an altitude of 11 km, on a collision course, the speed of the interceptor and target is 0.9M):
AIM-120C7/D — 180 km
AIM-132 ———- 25+ km
AIM-9X ———-- 35+ km
Python-5 ———-- 20+ km
A-Darter ———- 22+ km

[Pavel57]

The rocket does not need maximum overload throughout the entire flight.
Only when practicing the initial miss in close air combat and practicing a miss due to the target maneuvering before the flyby. When guiding in other areas, the excess of the required missile overload over the target is maximum with a coefficient of 2.

And, apparently, you are not aware-
"The AIM-9X missile, built according to a normal aerodynamic scheme, is equipped with titanium cruciform wings and movable tail surfaces integrated with a block of gas-dynamic rudders."

It was created as a response to the R-73, which had gas-dynamic rudders. Aerodynamics in close combat were no longer sufficient, despite the maximum values ​​of available overload, which you operate with.

[Strelkin]

And, apparently, you are not aware-
"The AIM-9X missile, built according to a normal aerodynamic scheme, is equipped with titanium cruciform wings and movable tail surfaces integrated with a block of gas-dynamic rudders."

You are right, I just forgot this feature of this rocket.

It was created as a response to the R-73, which had gas-dynamic rudders. Aerodynamics were no longer sufficient in close combat.

True, in close combat, while the missile does not have time to accelerate, and the mutual angular movements of the aircraft are very large, gas-dynamic control makes sense.

...despite the maximum values ​​of available overload that you operate with.

In order for a missile to be able to create maximum overloads, it needs high speed and low altitude (high air density). But since in a close maneuverable air battle the opposite can easily happen: significant altitude and relatively low speeds, yes, gas-dynamic rudders make sense. Yes, and the A-Darter also has a controlled thrust vector...

[Mister who]

Don't forget, in a real war, shooting down planes is a secondary and final story, the main thing is to cause irreparable damage to objects on the ground, that's all. A jet-powered plane, maybe one way, to take out what survived, for this you need speed and altitude, there will be no shooting in the sky))) that's the last century. By the time the fighters reach the target, the target itself will no longer exist))) a war from 30 minutes to a couple of hours and that's it, bye, bye, why do you need planes? To take out the survivors.

[Strelkin]

Don't forget, in a real war, shooting down planes is a secondary and final story, the main thing is to cause irreparable damage to objects on the ground, that's all.

Made me smile! From ear to ear! "And the peasants don't know!" — Neither Washington, nor Beijing, nor the Kremlin know! Why didn't you tell them all the "correct answer"?! Hiroshima and Nagasaki were bombed almost 80 years ago, one year short, why aren't nuclear wars raging on planet Earth??

A jet-powered plane, maybe one way, to take out what survived, for this you need speed and altitude, there will be no shooting in the sky))) that's the last century.

See above.

By the time the fighters reach the target, the target itself will no longer exist)))

See above.

war from 30 minutes to a couple of hours and that's it, bye, bye, what are planes for? To carry out the survivors.

See above.

[Mister who]

Have you heard about carbon rods falling from space, there is only inertia that causes Kawabanga! The rod just falls from a height.

[Strelkin]

I love good science fiction and I don't like fantasy at all...

[Hyperstein]

Armata is the best! Remember that tank? Well, the Yankees don't know how to make airplanes and they never will!