Illegals asked to understand and forgive

The migration issue in the Russian Federation over the past few years has become one of the most pressing issues for discussion. Moreover, not only and not so much representatives of the authorities, but the public of Russia and the migrants themselves are discussing this issue. Recently, in the framework of a discussion that has been going on for quite a long time, such a person as Muhammad Amin Majumder, who heads the Federation of Migrants of Russia, expressed his proposals regarding a positive solution to the migration problem in our country. Madjumder himself is an immigrant from Bangladesh, and therefore believes that he is well acquainted with the backstage life of immigrants in Russia, and is ready to put forward his ideas aimed at the development of migration policy in the country.

Mr. Majumder himself is confident that all the troubles of Russia in the migration field are not even in the number of migrants, but in the shadow side of using their labor. In this regard, he sees a solution to the problem as extremely simple: the state must take and amnesty several million illegal immigrants working in the territory of the Russian Federation. According to Muhammad Amin Majumder, it is the massive permission to work in Russia for those immigrants who today are forced to do this, hiding from the regulatory authorities, will significantly increase deductions to the state budget and solve problems with labor shortages in the country.

The opinion of Mr. Majumder certainly deserves attention. Especially its part, in which he indirectly hints at the existence of a situation in which the illegal labor migration market in Russia is beneficial not so much for the migrants themselves, as for various kinds of services. Those services whose professional activity consists in accounting (non-accounting), registration (non-registration) of immigrants who want to find a job in Russia or take a course. In other words, the president of the Federation of Migrants of the Russian Federation, indicates a possible way to stop those corruption manifestations that occur in government agencies working with the migration environment.

On the one hand, it is true that it is at least naive to believe that illegal migration in Russia is the machinations of migrants themselves, who want to be in the Russian Federation exclusively illegally. But Majumder’s proposal has a downside. He offers all those immigrants who are currently in Russia and carry out labor activities on an illegal basis, amnesty - that is, to abandon the legitimate claims against these gentlemen, in fact, violating the law. The amnesty for millions of illegal immigrants, an example against which Majumder considers the option of systematic amnesties in the United States of America, can be an indirect confirmation of Russia's readiness to “understand and forgive” both current illegal immigrants and those who, following the amnesty, will certainly pull to the Russian Federation.

The very essence of the proposed amnesty is twofold. The front side is to put a barrier to corrupt interests of some employees of the inspection services (the same FMS, for example) and businessmen, many of whom are used to actually using slave labor of illegal immigrants, at any time sending raids on their construction sites, underground workshops and farms. The flip side is a signal for all, without exception, who want to come to Russia: they say, we ourselves are not aware of how many migrants we need for complete economic happiness, but come all - perekantyutsya godok-another as an average illegal, gulping down the "hospitality" of business representatives , well, and then for all your experiences at the beginning, we will reward you with another amnesty ... You will work absolutely legally, and absolutely legally deduct money to the state budget.

I do not really want to make pessimistic forecasts in this regard, but under the circumstances, it is often the flip side of Mr. Majumder’s proposal that will most often appear. Maybe the president of the Federation of Migrants of Russia (FMR), and wants the best. Even with certainty, we can say that this is exactly what she wants ... But only if the state suddenly decides to take the idea of ​​the president of the FMR as a basis, then everything will turn out, most likely, not as better, but as always ...

After all, the problem with illegal immigrants and their hypothetical amnesty stumbles exactly on the corruption component. Recent examples suggest that there are certain structures in our country that managed to establish a serious business during illegal (specifically illegal) migration. After all, who is illegal? In fact, this is the most common slave ... His fate is in the hands of those who are willing to make money on this person. And as soon as an illegal immigrant is amnestied and transformed into a legally working immigrant, how can someone lose a feeder.

There are statistics according to which one economic worker (janitor, janitor) of structures under state control in such large cities of Russia as St. Petersburg and Moscow is allocated from 28 to 52 thousand rubles per month (for wages, inventory, repair of equipment, detergents, etc.). The janitors and cleaners themselves, the overwhelming number of whom are illegals, receive about 15 thousand rubles (at best) in their hands in the same cities. It turns out that on a single illegal immigrant a certain “uncle from the housing department” can earn from 14 to 37 thousand rubles a month! And maybe all 40-50 of thousands, if at the end of the month, comrades from the labor-control services suddenly descend on the desk. And if there are a million or a couple of millions of such illegal immigrants in a city, then it turns out that the shadow side of using their labor may well be estimated at several tens or even hundreds of billions of rubles ... The amount is enormous.

Proceeding from this, one can say that the very Russian-Russian lobby, promoting the idea of ​​“specific control” of illegal migration, will clearly be against amnesty. Depriving oneself with one’s own hands of an excellent feeder is a pipe! .. Even if the federal authorities carry out an amnesty for illegal immigrants to one degree or another, then it will be carried out by the hands of those who are suspected of frauds with the documents regulating the status of a migrant worker. It turns out that it will extinguish the fire with gasoline ... The result is seen in advance: in order to get rid of the status of illegal, you will need to put someone’s coveted envelope back at the right time at the right time. So it is practiced now. What, then, is innovation? ..

But, speaking about the interest in the presence of illegal migrant workers on the part of corrupt individuals, we must not forget that not every illegal alien himself will be ready to give up his dubious status. But what about slave labor? But what about the complete lack of social guarantees? It does not scare many. It does not frighten because it is impossible to legalize what they are doing in Russia for objective reasons. After all, not all the same millions of illegal immigrants sweep the streets or lay paving slabs. There are those who prefer to earn a living by activities that, to put it mildly, are not encouraged by Russian legislation. And if even this category of citizens gives the green light for living and “labor” in the Russian Federation, then our country will systematically slide to a situation that today manifests itself in a number of European countries. This situation is connected with the layering of one crime on another. Only in our version this whole puff pie will also be generously “decorated” with a corrupt “cream”.

In general, summing up, it is safe to say that the amnesty for illegal guest workers in Russia is an event that, if it has positive moments, then under current conditions it’s extremely difficult to get to the bottom of a negative husk for them. And if so, then the migration problem in the country should be solved by other methods. Although no matter what method you start with, anyway, the decision will rest on the blank wall of bureaucratic corruption, and finding this nut in our country is far more difficult than making it necessary to comply with the Russian laws of all guest workers combined.

PS
On the website of the FMS of Russia systematically appears information about the conduct of the so-called operational preventive measures under the general title "Illegal Migrant". For February, the department reports a large-scale audit in the Urals (in the Sverdlovsk region). In particular, it is reported that in just a week the audit has touched 200 employers who use the work of guest workers. During the events, mass violations were established, which led to sanctions. 17 foreigners were administratively expelled from the country outside the Russian Federation, 1 was deported, 643 work permits were canceled, the total amount of fines amounted to 970,6 thousand rubles, of which only 638,3 thousand were recovered.

It should be noted that administrative expulsion differs from deportation. Deportation and expulsion under administrative procedure are distinguished by the fact that deportation is a variant of protection measures that are exclusively applied to foreign citizens in cases provided for by Russian law in the interests of national security, public welfare, and health. Administrative expulsion is a measure of administrative punishment, it is applied exclusively by a court decision to foreign citizens and stateless persons for an administrative offense committed.

In addition, a criminal case was initiated under Art. 327 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation: “Forgery, production or sale of forged documents, state awards, stamps, seals, forms”.

Such raids by the FMS and preventive measures are carried out though regularly, but so far they do not lead to the normalization of the migration field in the country. The number of those who arrived in Russia, for example, from the republics of Central Asia, is sometimes ten times higher than the number of those who were administratively expelled or deported and those who left back voluntarily ...

Comments

[fenix57]

"The amnesty for millions of illegal immigrants, an example of which Majumder considers the option of systematic amnesties in the United States of America, may become an indirect confirmation of Russia's readiness to" understand and forgive "the current illegal immigrants ..." - but this Muhammad Amin Majumder who heads the Federation would not have gone migrants of Russia. The incumbent and refer to the US. Something new has appeared in the rules on the terms of compulsory registration and for the Russian Federation all this is at the level of concessions (from 7 days to 15), normal, yes. . Train to meet them (you can armored train). And all these exams in the knowledge of the Russian language, such ... I will not. Looked at them. Mlya GEYROPY IS LITTLE, ALREADY BEGIN TO CRY. Where is our most sanitary, he can

[Roman Skomorokhov]

How would that mean, to understand and forgive? To pretend that this is how it should be? That is, to open up the borders with the cry "stop by, lads!"?

A vicious circle, however. Millions work underground, live in piggy conditions (I watched the arrangement of Uzbeks in a shoe factory), crime grazes on this, bribery blooms in full bloom (I also watched "checks"). And then bang! - amnesty. So what? This will be issued in bulk, without figuring out who and what, permissions, are we waiting for the next?

But the whole problem is that the visitors themselves and their employers are not interested in the full design. Type you have to pay taxes. And such an approach suits everyone, and employers (fewer deductions, savings) and workers (more money on hand).

Summary: the amnesty will not work. And there’s nothing to look at in the USA, they are being expelled by thousands.

[GSH-18]

Quote: Banshee

But the whole problem is that the visitors themselves and their employers are not interested in the full design. Type you have to pay taxes. And such an approach suits everyone, and employers (fewer deductions, savings) and workers (more money on hand).

In general, for example, Tajiks themselves working in the Russian Federation are rare.
Any Tajik arriving comes under the command of a "brigadier" -zamlyak who is looking for work and arranging these gasterbayters, is engaged in "settling" the issues of the legality of his fellow tribesmen, and collects payments for their work. They may not receive anything at all, only food. They are told that money is being sent to their families. This really happens (but you yourself understand how and in what quantity). In short, you won't be able to figure out what needs to be done with all this "economy". It is better to ask the question: What are the bodies created to deal with these issues and why are they still getting paid?

[Vadivak]

Quote: Volodin Alexey

and one business worker under state control in large cities of Russia allocates from 28 to 52 thousand rubles a month; the janitors themselves are illegal, they receive about 15 thousand rubles (in the best case).

Here is the answer, forgive yourself first and continue to steal successfully

[nycsson]

Quote: Vadivak

Here is the answer, forgive yourself first and continue to steal successfully

This is the whole problem! It’s profitable for employers to hire migrants, they have to pay less! And the indigenous people suffer from this, experiencing competition!

An open letter from the head of the portal Superjob.ru, Alexei Zakharov, to the President of the Russian Federation

Dear Mr. President!

You set the task of creating 25 millions of “good and well-paid" jobs by 2020 year. This is a great challenge, and we, as employers, are both in favor of it.

But the real human resources policy is that by the year 2020 there will be additional 25 million jobs created for low-skilled migrants. This is in addition to the 10 — 15 millions of jobs that are already created for them.
As a result of state policy in the coming decades, the number of low-skilled migrants attracted from abroad will be more than half of the economically active population of the country.

Of course, we understand that a course has been taken on the innovative development of Russia. What is innovation? This is an increase in competitiveness through the application of advanced production management methods, cost reduction, etc. etc. In this sense, attracting a large number of low-paid and low-skilled labor force, which also works mostly outside the legal field on slave terms, is an unconditional innovation that allows organizations to reduce costs and become more competitive.

http://www.superjob.ru/info/announcement.html?id=111332

[sergey32]

Illegal migration is only one of the consequences of corruption in Russia. Until a leader like Lukashenko comes to power, unfortunately, there is no need to wait for improvements.

[Yoshkin Kot]

normal employers who really work migrants are not profitable, beneficial only to those who share the shah-maher

[GSH-18]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

normal employers who really work migrants are not profitable, beneficial only to those who share the shah-maher

Yes, good to fill here! 80% of the Olympic venues (mainly commissioning and beautification) in Sochi are being built by Russian construction organizations using exclusively guest workers! You mean they work at a loss ??!

[Yoshkin Kot]

I want to say that you need to steal less

[GSH-18]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

I want to say that you need to steal less

It's right
So, a little more info about guest workers building Olympic facilities. They live in Adler in closed, fenced towns. Exit to the city is prohibited. Only accompanied by an accompanying person from the contractor, and if necessary, and not at will. These slaves behave culturally, the local population is not nervous. Accordingly, they physically cannot steal.
This is how it should be in the whole country.

[Georgs]

Duc, and who will organize these reservation labor camps? They must be built and maintained. In Sochi, they’re giving money for it now, and then? In what place the employers saw these camps, they themselves will say.

[GSH-18]

Quote: GeorGS

Duc, and who will organize these reservation labor camps? They must be built and maintained. In Sochi, they’re giving money for it now, and then? In what place the employers saw these camps, they themselves will say.

In most cases, these are typical 2,5m / 6m cabins built on each other over several floors. Cheap and cheerful. Then it is easily disassembled and transported to any place. This scheme of work and life of guest workers was included in the technical task of all tenders for participation in the construction of Olympic facilities. What prevents to apply this innovation throughout the Russian Federation ??

[Middle-brother]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

I want to say that you need to steal less

it’s advisable that it would do without it at all. And then the concept of less, more each has its own

[Yoshkin Kot]

among the Communists, everything is considered to be theft in general

[Grey74]

Well, Sochi is a completely different topic))) I suspect that by the year 15 everything will fall apart there))

[GSH-18]

Quote: Grey74

Well, Sochi is a completely different topic))) I suspect that by the year 15 everything will fall apart there))

Where did you get such amazing information? Did you yourself see what has been done in this city? With my own eyes?

[Georgs]

What has been done is not a question. The main thing is how it was done. Well, maybe it won't fall apart, then we are happy, "everyone believes in the best." But it can also sprinkle at once.

[GSH-18]

Quote: GeorGS

What has been done is not a question. The main thing is how it was done. Well, maybe it won't fall apart, then we are happy, "everyone believes in the best." But it can also sprinkle at once.

Objects of road infrastructure: bridges and tunnels, of which there are already countless in the city, are made at the HIGHEST level. You can rest assured that they will withstand 150-200 years if there are no strong earthquakes, or they do not explode. My friend is working in a not a small position in this area; I need not tell him tales.
How are things in the construction of buildings, I can’t say anything, there is no reliable information, only conflicting rumors ..

[Evrepid]

Where will these migrants go then? I would ask this question. Will stay in our country? or go back to your place? Vryatli will go back. And what shall we do with them?
What to do with the female contingent that has turned into prostitutes during their time?
Understand and forgive? Those. What would even more consider the population of the Russian Federation as prostitutes that you can have?

In general, there are more problems than solutions. Although the solution is always offered: "Cut the Gordeev knot! Namely, shoot the prostitutes, and collect all non-citizens and send them to the border ... Who was unlucky that the border was a sea ... This is their problem."

[Georgs]

Construction companies, of course, do not work at a loss. They are just in full chocolate. At a loss a) customers since migrant worker - non-qualifier. slave. the strength and quality of his work is low, and b) Russian citizens, from whom the slave was deprived. places.

[nycsson]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

normal employers who really work migrants are not profitable

Well yes! Then pay 30 thousand, and then 10! No difference!

[Yoshkin Kot]

quality terms, do not take into account? if the business is designed for a long time, and not to hit the jackpot and topple down, then the gasters are not profitable, and then it’s worth thinking that paying their salary, they will spend it in Russia and run into you through your sales

[nycsson]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

quality terms, do not take into account?

But are they really worse than ours? I doubt it very much! They live it!

[Yoshkin Kot]

worse at times, rare exceptions do not count, look at Moscow new buildings, in the province no one will accept such houses

[Evrepid]

with a normal payment, there will be workers! To hell migrants?
And the words: "Pay migrants a decent salary!" It's just extortion. do not need your own. but this is a must! :) Insanity.

[nycsson]

Quote: Evrepid

with a normal payment, there will be workers!

This is the essence of the matter! It’s okay to pay, and then at a minimum!

[Bismark]

Well, depending on what and where to look, I honestly have never seen a young Uzbek working as a surveyor, let alone an architect or foreman. I mainly work at our refinery. I practically did not observe migrants, welders, installers, locksmiths mostly ours and get from 30 to 60 are not always white but stable and on time, there are few young people, everyone wants to be managers, mega economists but really work few people want here and it turns out what we get.

[Grey74]

Beneficial to those who pay kickbacks! then nobody looks at quality!

[Z.A.M.]

nycsson

Quote: nycsson

Respected Mr. President!

Alexey, welcome. Yes, there was a respected ...
For a long time, for me - NOT respected... Migration, Gaster, WTO - one of the MANY treacherous acts ... of the "respected" ... And don't worry, all our aspirations ...
And about the migrant-Gaster ... already write FUN - all D O M O Y !!!!

[nycsson]

Quote: Z.A.M.

Alexey, welcome. Yes, there was a respected ...

And I welcome you Anton! And for me he was not respected! The letter says so!

Quote: Z.A.M.

The WTO is one of the MANY, treacherous acts ... "respected" ... And in fig to him, all our aspirations ...

I’m silent about the WTO! Ow ... chi, nothing more to say about them!

Quote: Z.A.M.

And about the migrant-Gaster ... already write FUN - all D OMO !!!!

They won’t send them home! Here is a lot of money!

[Normal]

Quote: Z.A.M.

For a long time, for me - NOT respected.

Quote: nycsson

And for me he was not respected!

Greetings and support.

Quote: Z.A.M.

And about the migrant-Gaster ... already write FUN - all D OM O

Now Kaathlons and other kawasmets will run in and it will begin; "stop whining", "you have to work", "Putin is to blame for everything"
And he is with us as usual in business. All of it is not there somewhere ...

[nycsson]

Quote: Normal

Greetings and support.

Mutually!

Quote: Normal

And he is with us as usual in business. All of it is not there somewhere ...

This is simple ignorance!

[valerei]

nycsson, I agree completely.
Dear Mr. President! With the Central Asian republics - a visa-free regime. Ride who and where can. You from Russia did not make a sovereign state, but, excuse me, a public toilet. Asians come, work, breed in our territory, and the Russian population is unable to do anything with this disgrace. They come here with their laws, habits, sores, their women give birth in our maternity hospitals at my expense, and I, a citizen of Russia, can not evict them to my home from my house. If the quantity goes into quality (as has already happened in France, England, Germany and where else?), Then only one thing remains: the flag in the hands of the nationalists: maybe they will put things in order in this matter. All that I wrote, of course, does not apply to Belarusians and Ukrainians. With them you can live and work together.
And the last thing: no one reads our comments and I just copied the address of "Mr. President" to start the conversation.

[Georgs]

Quote: valerei

nycsson, I agree completely.
Dear Mr. President! With the Central Asian republics - a visa-free regime. Ride who and where can. You from Russia did not make a sovereign state, but, excuse me, a public toilet. Asians come, work, breed in our territory, and the Russian population is unable to do anything with this disgrace. They come here with their laws, habits, sores, their women give birth in our maternity hospitals at my expense, and I, a citizen of Russia, can not evict them to my home from my house. If the quantity goes into quality (as has already happened in France, England, Germany and where else?), Then only one thing remains: the flag in the hands of the nationalists: maybe they will put things in order in this matter. All that I wrote, of course, does not apply to Belarusians and Ukrainians. With them you can live and work together.
And the last thing: no one reads our comments and I just copied the address of "Mr. President" to start the conversation.

Ah, valerei, a voice in the wilderness cries out! And what's the use of crying out in cries? Concrete actions are needed. From each, in his place, to the best of his ability.

valerei

[queen]

This is how the issue was decided in Japan. They pay more than their citizens a salary.

[Middle-brother]

Quote: regin

Arriving paycheck pay more than their citizen ..

specialists come to Japan, not helpers for everything ready

[Reddragon]

God will forgive (c)

[oper66]

The Criminal Code of the Russian Federation has Article 322 "illegal crossing of the state border - only it does not work because there is a small quotation mark there - in protected areas. You just need to revise the article and introduce criminal liability for illegal border crossing and illegal stay on the territory of the Russian Federation, regardless of goals - we kill several birds with one stone - after serving a couple of years, an illegal migrant (regardless of his citizenship, a Chinese Uzbek or a Pole) will work out unpaid taxes and duties and earn himself a department ticket, others will think whether it is worth going illegally to us. in the country and stop migration.In addition, to change the responsibility of employers, regardless of the form of organization from administrative to criminal and strict sanctions for years

[Romch]

Why align with America, it itself consists of 99% of immigrants, historically, let it replenish itself further with new ones, but we do not need such a bonus. Today we amnesty a million, tomorrow two more will not enter legally and ask for amnesty. And then we don’t know how to deal with Wahhabism and other manifestations of Islamism. If you let someone in our country, there are many Slavic brothers and there are many of their Russians abroad who want to return, but they are not allowed in, they must be returned.

[ia-ai00]

That's it! When you come to Moscow, it seems that you have arrived in an Asian country, sometimes Slavic people are almost 1: 5 in favor of Asian ones. Many of them already have Russian citizenship. But Russians cannot get this very citizenship for 10-15 years, even while living in Russia. A few years ago, a Russian relative's mother, a veteran of the Great Patriotic War in the Volgograd region, fell ill, broke her thigh neck, so her daughter from Kazakhstan was suing the Russian "justice" for 3 years in order to obtain a residence permit to care for a bed patient, otherwise every 3 months you have to cross the border back and forth, so as not to get a ban on entry to the territory of Russia! So the "dominance" by Asians is someone's lobby, so that it would be more difficult for the Russians to live on their land, this is a time bomb!

[GSH-18]

Quote: ia-ai00

So the "dominance" by Asians is someone's lobby, so that it would be more difficult for the Russians to live on their land, this is a time bomb!

This is the lobby of Russian organizations that should deal with this issue. So they regulate for the benefit of your pocket!

[Yoshkin Kot]

and where do you see the local day? they all work

[Uncle]

Quote: ia-ai00

So the "dominance" by Asians is someone's lobby, so that it would be more difficult for the Russians to live on their land, this is a time bomb!

I will support. We will survive any crisis or war, but mixing us with foreigners will poison the blood of the Russian nation.

[Yoshkin Kot]

on figs! independence so independence! it's time to close the border with countries outside the CU! send illegal immigrants home! they just dump our people’s salaries! and delay, for example, mechanization at a construction site, which reduces labor productivity and makes our economy less competitive! not to mention infection and crime !!!! Migrants! Home!!!!!!

[strannik595]

Illegals are invited to understand, forgive ........ and release back home ...... keyword forgot to add

[Mcsim]

At whose expense "back home"?

[Georgs]

So for ours, a clear stump!

[Mcsim]

(Judging by the flag) Europe will pay for the transfer of Asians from Russia to their homeland?

[albert]

For their own. If there is no money, to work out the contents and a ticket home. And more than a migrant who violated immigration laws should not be allowed back. He will come back and again to the camp only this time for ten years in Siberia. And then he stayed home.

[ughhh]

they need to chop off their legs before sending them home ... so as not to itch

[Georgs]

Power sales will not allow.

[Raphael_83]

As my brother says when broadcasting a TV show on ORT: "Understand, forgive ... and curse."

[Normal]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

send illegal immigrants home! they just dump our people’s salaries! and delay, for example, mechanization at a construction site, which reduces labor productivity and makes our economy less competitive! not to mention infection and crime !!!! Migrants! Home!!!!!!

I agree with every word, with one clarification; SHOULD NOT BE ANYTHING Illegal emigration. In any case, in such an amount that is a problem.

[Ghenxnumx]

I support fully and completely.
Maybe I don’t understand something, enlighten - how can a migrant, even the president of the Union of Migrants, put forward his ideas to the Government of the Russian Federation aimed at reducing the immunity of the Russian Federation from migration (and, of course, the welfare of his wallet) ??? And annoying that this topic is intensely exaggerated in all the media, tasted and sucked under all sauces.
Someone doubt that Majumder does not follow his interests?
I am firmly convinced of one thing - he definitely put on the interests of Russia from the highest minaret, issuing such pearls ...
In words, the organization’s activities are as follows:
"From the very beginning of its activity, the Federation of Migrants of Russia has taken a course towards constructive cooperation and interaction with all forces of society in Russia, which seek to normalize the migration process in the country.
The Federation conducts active educational work to counter the spread of extremism and terrorism, promote tolerance, religious tolerance among young people, promote confidence and harmony among peoples, consolidate civil institutions and authorities in regulating migration processes and maintaining security in Eurasian society.
One of the priority areas of the Federation is charity, protecting the rights of women, children and youth. The focus of the charity events of the FMR is on children from orphanages, poor families and children with disabilities in Moscow and Moscow Region.
Thus, the activities of the organization are developing strictly in accordance with the Charter of the organization, and is aimed at promoting the processes of "people's diplomacy", the protection of the rights and freedoms of migrants, the socio-cultural and legal adaptation of migrants in the Russian society, the protection and provision of conditions that guarantee the observance of the dignity of the individual stipulated by the Constitution of the Russian Federation. "
http://www.fmr.su/index.php?name=about
In fact, it strives for such a future.

[Middle-brother]

Quote: fenix57

Where is our most sanitary, he can

He can, but unfortunately he barks when the team came from above. But she is not, which leads to some thoughts ...

[AndreyAB]

But still, you need to understand, forgive and x .... th from Russia, tighten migrant policies, the borders in the end bring to proper condition, and if someone came to work, then strictly restrict freedom of movement, place of work and place of rest between they just run. The deadline is work — goodbye, and you can come to Russia only after 3-4 years — you can get a visa, then everything will get back to normal, so that work in Russia does not seem like a paradise for migrants, and illegal immigrants are sent to labor camps and let them go for grubs they’re plowing a time period determined by the court - after all, they came to work and shouldn’t understand it legally - the punishment is inevitable.

[Pula]

You need to start with the delivery routes, i.e. with border guards. And your brother-in-law ...?
And from whom they removed at least 200 thousand rubles. for every illegal, according to the law?
Deportation, expulsion ... "DIASPORA" is the driving force of illegal immigrants.
And we are terrorism! Illegals are the "muddy water" for the "crucians" of terror. So we returned to the beginning ...

[Trailer]

understand and forgive, and let go home. What do you think, if you legalize 10 millions of people at a time, which the employer needed only because of the ability to not pay taxes, would they be needed again by the same employer, who now also has to pay taxes from the once cheap labor force? It's easier to hire your own, since taxes are paid for him. And where will the freed part of migrants go? That's right, in crime. And we will have such a dashing time that mother does not grieve. A striking example is Germany. Where the indigenous population is getting smaller, churches are being sold under mosques, and on the streets they are trying to calmly distribute 40 of millions of Salafist religious literature.

[kostella85]

There is still one side of the issue - gastric people have a VERY strong influence on the salary of the local population.
Example: In 2009, the average cost of laying tile in the city of Kurgan was 480-520 r / sq. m, with a different influx of migrants (mainly Uzbeks), at the moment, the price for the same work remains unchanged, and this is for 5 years!
Due to this problem, many local builders go to Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug and Yamal-Nenets Autonomous Okrug to earn money. From what in the north in housing construction salaries also do not grow.
In my opinion, the question of becoming a guest worker should be decided for each specific region.

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

There is still one side of the issue - gastric people have a VERY strong influence on the salary of the local population.
Example: In 2009, the average cost of laying tile in the city of Kurgan was 480-520 r / sq. m, with a different influx of migrants (mainly Uzbeks), at the moment, the price for the same work remains unchanged, and this is for 5 years!
Due to this problem, many local builders go to Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug and Yamal-Nenets Autonomous Okrug to earn money. From what in the north in housing construction salaries also do not grow.
In my opinion, the question of becoming a guest worker should be decided for each specific region.

I will say so. Builders in our country doh ... ra! And the road to Krasnaya Polyana was built at 7 !!! times more expensive than the same length 6-lane autobahn! Pay a little at a construction site ?? Change your profession. Our shabashniki for trifling work break such prices, as if any private customer is a potential millionaire! It’s good that Tajiks are knocking you down. Will more adequately assess the value of your work. The advantages of fair competition!

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

The most lousy thing is that even the Baltic States bypassed us in the quality of construction objects. Vobschem judge for yourself

Lithuania

RF as they say without comments (prices for our footage are higher)

[img] http://prodamdolevoe.ru/images/NDC/objects/201209060518361706921303-img_1.J
PG? 6.576334760002085 [/ img]

[img] http://prodamdolevoe.ru/images/NDC/objects/20120905015443164729128-img_1.JP
G? 8.889628708055637 [/ img]

[img] http://prodamdolevoe.ru/images/NDC/objects/20120906053400141312117-img_1.JP
G? 9.151380038398749 [/ img]

And for this gamble our architects and builders want money, and so ...

[Grey74]

What is there to judge? the cost of 1 m2 about 10000 rubles. But when to add kickbacks and connection of communications there, together with all permissions. It turns out this box for a lot of money!

[Yoshkin Kot]

um, the cost price is 10 00 rubles m2 ??? not really cheaper than 20 in our Central European climatic zone does not work, unless of course the "American" boardwalk

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

What is there to judge? the cost of 1 m2 about 10000 rubles. But when to add kickbacks and connection of communications there, together with all permissions. It turns out this box for a lot of money!

And where do you want to live in a box or in a project higher. Yes, if such a district were built in my city, I would immediately take an apartment there and would not even look at the price, within reasonable limits, this can be overpaid for this.

[Ascetic]

Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov

Yes, if such a district were built in my city, I would immediately take an apartment there and would not even look at the price, within reasonable limits, this can be overpaid for this.

God forbid. I wouldn’t live there for free .. In the picture, the so-called Lithuanian version of passive houses Since 2010, the EU has been implementing a new directive on the energy performance of buildings. According to her, after December 31, 2020, all new buildings in the EU, and after December 31, 2018, are under the control of public authorities should be close to zero power consumption. Lithuania, as a member of the EU, also faces a transition to a new type of building.
The main idea of ​​a passive house is to reduce heat loss to such an extent that heating is not required. The house is heated by the heat of the people living in it with household appliances or alternative energy sources.
School picture

[Uncle]

Stanislav, heating is my topic, we have normal heat loss of 100W / m2, in Germany at best 50W / m2, and to build a building without any heat loss is fantastic, at least for now.

[Ascetic]

Quote: Alexey Prikazchikov

The most lousy thing is that even the Baltic States bypassed us in the quality of construction objects. Vobschem judge for yourself

And in terms of the quality of road construction, it has gone ahead by leaps and bounds (on video). Don't get fooled by these beautiful projects. It is impossible to live in them in our climatic conditions. In the suburbs, they have already "burned" on them .. The demand for them tends to zero .. even despite the democratic prices ... And this is gamna, which is below the entrance at a price of 5000 dollars. per square meter.
Here is such a prose of life .. it’s less and less bad for beautiful wunderfafli, especially on cardboard houses from the Baltic States with "economical euro materials"

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

And in terms of the quality of road construction, it has gone ahead by leaps and bounds (on video). Don't get fooled by these beautiful projects. It is impossible to live in them in our climatic conditions. In the suburbs, they have already "burned" on them .. The demand for them tends to zero .. even despite the democratic prices ... And this is gamna, which is below the entrance at a price of 5000 dollars. per square meter.
Here is such a prose of life .. it’s less and less bad for beautiful wunderfafli, especially on cardboard houses from the Baltic States with "economical euro materials"

Okay, here's the Finnish climate there like ours.

[Alexey Prikazchikov]

And now, friend, look how the Finns in our country are building, by the way, this economy housing

here is a photo of a complex of 66 houses (I pay special attention to details)

Here is just a separate complex is also an economy

[kostella85]

After that, I rewrite "any private trader to the customer" in the estimate and dismantle that xy .. I do not include that gastric stuck !!!
And about:

Quote: GSH-18

Our shabashniki for spitting work such prices breaking

I will tell you this: we pay a worker’s salary at the rate of 1500 (will you live for less?) rubles / day (and not 8 hours, like yours) + purchase / repair of a tool + workwear (especially winter) + agent percentage + ... + ... + ... + ......

So the question is: what amount of work does the team of builders need to complete so that our company stays afloat?

For your information: 1 day of "rent" of 1 Uzbek costs also 1500 rubles, of which this Uzbek gets from 400 to 1000 rubles, depending on qualifications!

[Larus]

The answer, as always, is afloat, namely, to moderate the appetites of the bosses, and to hand over those officials to whom you pay. Here you will find money for a real wage, and not to survive

[kostella85]

We are not talking here: to enter or not to enter! At ALL tenders for state. orders (municipal, regional, etc.) are won by the same companies, then this company draws up a new estimate based on its profit and smaller organizations or even just brigades are invited to work.
Such is the legislation, without joining "professional associations" (joining which costs a lot of money) will not be allowed to the competition!
So we must think, who is sitting in our Duma !!!!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

I will tell you this: we pay a worker’s salary at the rate of 1500 (will you live for less?) rubles / day (and not 8, like yours) + purchase / repair of a tool + workwear (especially winter) + agent percentage + ... +. .. + ... + ......

So the question is: what amount of work does the team of builders need to complete so that our company stays afloat?

For your information: 1 day of "rent" of 1 Uzbek costs also 1500 rubles, of which this Uzbek gets from 400 to 1000 rubles, depending on qualifications!

Read my post below. From real life. About repair by two Tajiks of our entrance. Moderate greed and live immediately becomes easier!

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

Read my post below. From real life.

And what are my words from?

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

And what are my words from? request

here is this post:
"This is not entirely true, and apparently not everywhere, as you say.
Specific example. Tired of waiting for the REU to deign to repair our entrance, which is in a deplorable state, we, having thrown ourselves off, hired 2 Tajiks, having previously bought the necessary building materials in the store. These guys, in 7 days, shamanized everything to the fullest, turning our entrance of a 5-storey building into candy! For this they took 10 thousand rubles for two !!
Estimate yourself how much Russian co-workers would demand from us for such work ??!
Is the conclusion clear? "

[Grey74]

Well, maybe you’re right, we did the same in our entrance, but it’s not very similar to candy. Yes, and they are paid not much less than the Russians.

[GSH-18]

Quote: Grey74

Well, maybe you’re right, we did the same in our entrance, but it’s not very similar to candy. Yes, and they are paid not much less than the Russians.

If everything is as you say, then all customers chose only domestic contractors. In fact, the opposite is true.

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

After that, I rewrite "any private trader to the customer" in the estimate and dismantle that xy .. I do not include that gastric stuck !!!

The usual cheat of our "super-professional" shabashniki Because of this, their work costs 5-7 times more expensive (apparently they beat off advertising costs )
As a customer, with equal quality of work, I will choose where it is cheaper. And so will any normal person. And do not comb here about the worthless quality of work of all guest workers. It is necessary to control the process. And even ours will overturn you worse than jamshuts!

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

The usual cheat of our "super-professional" shabashniki

Not super professional shabashnikov, but professional builders (professional, from the word profession) who studied at vocational schools, schools and instincts !!!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

Not super professional shabashnikov, but professional builders (professional, from the word profession) who studied at professional technical schools, schools and instincts !!

You want to say that all "dzhamshuts" are stupid uncultured rams descended from the mountains ?? In order to repair the entrance several times cheaper and with the same quality, it is not necessary to graduate from construction institutes, enough experience. This was successfully proved, the guys who made repairs to us at the entrance proved in practice. If something we turn to HIM, and not to ours, who bend prices, fingers, and are clever, what paint is better to paint! I tell you, you should not consider everyone around you more stupid and go over your ears, it will just do you honor. People will look differently.
If you are a professional builder, respect. But here I was talking about something completely different.
I sincerely wish you further professional growth and mutual understanding with customers

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

and not ours, which bend prices, fingers, and clever, what paint is better to paint!

One "our" also did not be smart, in a closed room he painted a battery with nitro-enamel ......... it was then shown on TV ................. the end, alas, is obvious!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

Dean "our" was not clever either, in a closed room he painted a battery with nitro-enamel ......... it was then shown on TV ................. the end, alas, is obvious! crying

Let’s not now raise the issue of industrial accidents at construction sites! This is generally a topic for seven stamps for state media. It is understandable why So your example is not correct.

[kostella85]

I just meant that only on instincts you can’t get far with skills, there are a number of operations that seem to be elementary, for the performance of which it is NECESSARY KNOWLEDGE, and not industrial experience!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

I just meant that you won’t go far only on instinct skills, there are a number of operations that seem to be elementary, which require EXACTLY KNOWLEDGE, and not production experience!

No one argues. It is always better if the skills are backed up by knowledge. And the builder who knows, understands and applies in practice will always be better.
I meant that (in the best case), skilled migrant workers cost much less to the customer (for carrying out not difficult work) than our skilled construction workers. True, in the case of such a choice, phased control of the work is necessary.

[GSH-18]

Quote: Karavan

That's right, in crime. And we will have such a dashing time that mother does not grieve. A striking example is Germany. Where there are fewer indigenous people, churches are sold under mosques, and on the streets they seek to calmly distribute 40 million copies of Salafi religious literature.

It seems they are there on the eve of a grand schucher

[Straiser]

You can not carry out an amnesty! It will lead to an uncontrolled flow of emigrants to our country. Consequently, the crime rate will increase. And from this, clashes on ethnic grounds will also turn out, there are many examples. In my opinion, it is necessary to support those emigrants who legally want to work in the Russian Federation, it is easier to control them, and they pay taxes to the budget. And I should not send illegal immigrants outside the Russian Federation, I see no other way. Well and accordingly, it is more severe to punish the employers of those illegal immigrants

[Alexander Romanov]

Quote: straiser

And I should not send illegal immigrants outside the Russian Federation, I see no other way.

They are being deported all the time, there should be tougher border control. There will be a train filled with Tajiks to Moscow, they don’t have money, why everyone understands. Then passengers of this train are caught all over Russia and returned to their homeland. It turns out that the circuit is easier to create official points employment under a contract or whatever, but in Tajikistan and other republics, I think in many ways the issue of illegal immigrants will be removed. Others home without the right to re-enter.

[Yoshkin Kot]

Alexander, Putin seems to have promised a visa regime by the year 15, but he needs it yesterday! It was a deal clashed with the Azerbaijanis.
It was like this, I’m going home, I called and asked to buy bread, I stop at the store (near the market), I go in talking with the seller, and five Azerbaijanis just hang out in the hall and just yell stupidly, I tell them normally that they would say more quietly, what's here started! screams oh, well, I think there’s no need to quote the standard set of rudeness, many are in the know.
I propose to go out and go around the corner, pererasya, told friends, they said, in vain did not call, they would take the "guests" into the woods for a walk. and then loaded onto a commuter train to Kazan.
I personally think that in relation to such, there should be a policy of zero tolerance, a voice raised, a kick in the ass, go home
By the way, gentlemen, the modern migration and national policy in the country comes from the USSR with the fight against Russian chauvinism, and the "brotherhood" of peoples, at the expense of the Russian people, I remember the figure that every resident of the RSFSR subsidized "brothers" in the 80s, including children and pesioners for 200 full-weight Soviet rubles a year!

[Vadivak]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

five Azerbaijanis mumble and just yell stupidly,

That they can

[GSH-18]

Quote: Alexander Romanov

it’s easier to create employment centers under a contract or whatever, but in Tajikistan and other republics, I think the issue of illegal immigrants will be largely addressed. Others home without the right to re-enter.

Absolutely right! I support. ++++++++++++

[GSH-18]

Quote: straiser

You can not carry out an amnesty! It will lead to an uncontrolled flow of emigrants to our country.

I agree and support

[ed65b]

Taxes levy when transferring money. And employers are punished in the most severe way. There is a law that is not executed. In my opinion, no one has been punished. Corruption damn however.

[rpek32]

Mr. Muhammad Amin Majumder completely complete the turnaround

[Alexander Romanov]

Quote: rpek32

Mr. Muhammad Amin Majumder completely complete the turnaround

No, he earns a lot of money on minrants.

[Heccrbq]

Have you seen this interview with Muhammad admin Majuprupu ....... dick understand in general?

[Was mammoth]

Illegals, as part of the country's problems, are too beneficial to many in the government, law enforcement agencies, "businessmen" ... - therefore, we will all the time run into "invincible" corruption, that is, now there is a "fight" with "tops", and not with "roots". This problem can be closed relatively quickly if desired.

[Sirocco]

Not in the eyebrow, but in the eye said. Many businessmen say so you won’t work for this salary, we will hire Uzbeks and Tajiks, and they will hire. So in this matter, our business exchanges are the FIFTH column. By the way, in Germany there is exactly the same problem, only there, Romanians, Balts. And others from the EU.

[Yoshkin Kot]

I haven’t contacted anyone, they really have more losses, of course they work for free, but I have to redo the disgusting quality, in our city there is only one construction company that I use their work, at least I don’t know about others, and they have an eternal problem with quality and timing

[GSH-18]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

I haven’t contacted anyone, they really have more losses, of course they work for free, but I have to redo the disgusting quality, in our city there is only one construction company that I use their work, at least I don’t know about others, and they have an eternal problem with quality and timing

This is not entirely true and, apparently, not everywhere, as you say.
Specific example. Tired of waiting for the REU to deign to repair our entrance, which is in poor condition. We, the tenants having thrown themselves off, hired 2 Tajiks, having previously bought the necessary building materials in the store. These guys, in 7 days, shamanized everything to the fullest, turning our entrance of a 5-storey building into candy! For this they took 10 thousand rubles for two !!
Estimate yourself how much Russian co-workers would demand from us for such work ??!
The conclusion is clear.

[Yoshkin Kot]

let's see when it collapses

[GSH-18]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

let's see when it collapses

Three years have passed, the flight is normal. We took the normal materials ourselves in the store. Why should they fall off ??

[Yoshkin Kot]

lucky, and very much

[GSH-18]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

lucky, and very much

Perhaps .. When the choice of a future contractor took place, marketing research was conducted (so to speak) Two superintendents (ours) came, with a businesslike look and an intelligent face, they bought the price in full. On what communication with them ended. We talked with friends from other houses, we were advised by these residents (jamshuts) by the tenants themselves, and they gave us a phone number. They called, an hour later they arrived, without unnecessary show-offs, compiled a list of materials (final list!). On the same day we took everything. From 8 am they started. In a week, everything was ready. They even came to see us from other entrances. So that.
3 years have passed. Nowhere not only did not collapse, and did not even crack!
And for comparison, we go to the neighbor's entrance (to the neighbors), OUR "professionals" did repairs there (a month after ours). So that's where it all collapsed, cracked, you have to do it again. Probably they teach poorly at institutes

[kostella85]

It’s just interesting, but who do you work with, at least in what area?

[kostella85]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

let's see when it collapses

Then they will turn to normal builders, not Tajik shabashniki. Also these Tajiks will swear: "Oh, what assholes they are !!!!"

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

Then they will turn to normal builders, not Tajik shabashniki. Also these Tajiks will swear: "Oh, what assholes they are !!!!"

I'm not saying that all jamshuts make repairs or build better than ours, no, of course! Just if you approach the choice of a contractor wisely (to find out what and where and how he did it, and with what quality and cost), then the choice is often not in favor of domestic professional builders. Most of the construction work (such as repairing an apartment or entrance) does not require in-depth knowledge. These are mainly working skills.

[kostella85]

Does installing plastic windows require qualifications?
Does moving the bathroom, replanning, changing window doorways require qualifications?
Does wiring replacement (not just wiring) require knowledge?
I agree that when repairing a "simple" entrance, no special qualifications are needed, but there are also different entrances ...
Even some types of wallpaper without knowledge and appropriate equipment can not be glued. Here it is all about customer requests, good deshovy does not happen !!!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

Does installing plastic windows require qualifications?

This is done by working firms of the manufacturer of these plastic windows in 99% of cases. This is ONCE.

Quote: kostella85

Bathroom transfer

Plumbers are doing this. This is TWO.

Quote: kostella85

Wiring replacement

This is done by electricians. This is THREE.

Quote: kostella85

Even some types of wallpaper without knowledge and appropriate equipment can not be glued

It can be plasterers-molars. This is FOUR.
You brought the front of the full-scale repair work. With the use of labor of 4 construction specialties. And I mean the cosmetic repairs carried out by plasterers-molars, which are most of the guest workers. (also masons and concrete workers).

Quote: kostella85

good deshovoy does not happen !!!

Without a doubt. But not overly expensive. Feel the difference.

[Ermak]

Well, that's understandable ... everyone counts their money. Everyone wants cheaper. (Did you pay "by way"? Or drew up an agreement and listed taxes in the entire form?)))) So you acted as the "fifth column"). About the appetites of bosses and the introduction of money - it is less necessary to watch TV. Correctly you wrote above, it is difficult for builders to survive now, in the conditions of dumping of visitors. Their actual cost of living is lower. (I will not expand here, everyone understands what it is about) And then let's go to the visiting doctors and bakers and ... and you, dear, who is your profession? And what about only builders ?! Let all spheres be alternative! Cheaper after all! And then we ourselves will not work and earn. And let's go from here, scorched by the sun ...

[kostella85]

Ermak- Well done support !!!

[GSH-18]

Quote: Ermak

Well, that's understandable ... everyone counts their money. Everyone wants cheaper. (Did you pay "out of the blue"? Or made a contract and transferred taxes in the entire form?)))

Well you made fun, dear! We have form The REU was supposed to be repaired 10 years ago. Advise further in the barn to wait in shape? What country do you live in?

Quote: Ermak

You, dear, who is by profession? Why only to the builders ?! May all spheres with us be alternative! Cheaper after all! And then we will not work and earn. And let's go from here, Burning sun ...

In order for all spheres to become alternative, it is necessary that in addition to people who signed themselves up as builders, other professionals should come to us. And for some reason they do not go, but only "builders" go when we have the same "builders" nowhere to go. So ours are outraged that earlier prices could have been set, but now it is impossible - competition. They do not like it, they complain tearfully, there is nothing to feed the family when prices began to approach real
My answer: If you know how to work with your hands, work with them, not with your tongue, and you will earn money. After all, jamshuts in another country manage to earn money for themselves and for their families!

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

After all, jamshuts in another country manage to earn money for themselves and for their families!

In 2003, we traveled with a friend to Dushanbe, where they left 1000 rubles each in a restaurant (in a barbecue skewers it cost 15 rubles)! For residents of villages and small towns with this money you can live with your family for a month!
And about the entrance: your apartments, so you made repairs in your house, we do it every 5 years!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

And about the entrance: your apartments, so you made repairs in your house, we do it every 5 years!

Well, I wrote about this. We have an agreement with REO. They had to do the repair of the entrance, but did not. They put a bolt on all inquiries and letters. I had to solve this problem with an entrance on my own.

[Ermak]

About "in form" of course, a joke, although if you are a guardian of the rule of law and a patriot, you could conclude a legal agreement with a legal company Prices began to approach real? ))) To be competitive in prices with visitors, local workers and their families must live as visitors, i.e. eat, sleep and .. in the same place. Do you wish them that ??? But in general, to live in our homeland, you need clothes and shoes for winter, summer, demi-season, high-calorie food, and not an ear of corn for lunch, or you will move the horses into the cold. The rent, where the heating line takes up the bold part of the bill. And to keep the newcomer’s family warm at home, it’s often enough to simply open the window. Etc. etc. ...
And before there was no competition between the builders. Do you read?
In your opinion, then we are giving away construction work to Gaster, are we going to do something else? Ndaa ... So, after all, we will give back something else too later ... The dashing trouble began ...

[kostella85]

In Kurgan, they (gastriks), mainly work on inexpensive cottages, and we’ll grow as helpers and laborers. True, they have their own company, and quite serious with special equipment, ............. E-STORY called

[Ermak]

It certainly is not a question: it will be cheaper with gastric. And the customer will pay less and the contractor will save on salary. Although they are trying to drive cunning and freebies, you do more control, you force them to redo it if that ... but the locals are left without earnings. It's like ... like joining the WTO! That will be cheap imported agricultural. products, other goods, well, let’s completely kill our own agricultural, some more production ... Is this good ???

[GSH-18]

Quote: Sirocco

So in this matter, our business exchanges are the FIFTH column. By the way, in Germany there is exactly the same problem, only there, Romanians, Balts. And others from the EU.

So, let's send our Tajiks to them! Romanians and the Balts immediately dumped home! It is necessary to send our illegal immigrants not to their homeland, but to the EU! From there they will definitely not return to us

[calculator]

US ALREADY: 90837 people
http://zavizu.org/obrashhenie/

[Dangerous]

And how under the Soviet regime Moscow and other large cities did without these guest workers? Almost all janitors / cooks / builders were of Slavic nationality

Moreover, while during the USSR, the level of education of these Uzbeks / Tajiks was even less (due to the fact that educational standards were valid throughout the country), now it’s an illiterate, stupid mass, without moral principles that spoil even more than they remove

[kostella85]

Quote: Dangerous

Almost all janitors / cooks / builders were of Slavic nationality

Even in the time of the Tsar, in Moscow there were a lot of janitors of Tatars and Bashkirs!

[predator.3]

Quote: kostella85

Even in the time of the Tsar, in Moscow there were a lot of janitors of Tatars and Bashkirs!

And now there are a lot of ours in Siberia and Moscow, if 300 people do not lie, only from Bashkiria they work in these parts, but they will have more in Siberia, and they’ll earn big money in Moscow, almost all arrived in a year on supported foreign cars (I mean fellow villagers).
And Gaster from the Near Abroad needs to cover the path to Russia! We need work, let them ask their presidents (Karimov, Rakhmon ...) let them build "developed capitalism", Russia, although a big country, but not a rubber one, we have a dime a dozen of our unemployed! It must be done, as in Japan, if the employer hires a non-Japanese, he must pay him twice as much as the Japanese!

[Yoshkin Kot]

so there is no talk of them, my people

[GSH-18]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

so there is no talk of them, my people

With what fright suddenly zapadentsi became our people for us? Monuments are ruining! Frank Russophobic behavior. Bender is a national hero.
As for the southern regions, I agree with you. But I want to say that we have enough of our unemployed. First you need to deal with them, and only then, all the flags to visit us!

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

But I want to say that we have enough of our unemployed. First you need to deal with them, and only then, all the flags to visit us!

So that's what Paul is talking about !!!!

[GSH-18]

Quote kostella85: So that's what Paul is talking about !!!
I am glad that we are unanimous in this.

[Yoshkin Kot]

um, it was about the Tatars and Bashkirs, however
ps I, in general, all who consider themselves Uroinets, for their own do not think

[ia-ai00]

So the Tatars and Bashkirs are Russians, not migrants!

[kostella85]

Yes, I'm not talking about Russians or migrants, I'm talking about:

Quote: Dangerous

Almost all janitors / cooks / builders were of Slavic nationality

[Raphael_83]

Yes, this term "Russians" is in the furnace - it simply freezes me out of it, as I hear / see. I have Tatar, Bashkir, and Russian (only a third) blood, but I consider myself completely and completely Russian, a native of a great (albeit really already in the past) country. And for me this is not so much a designation of nationality as a designation of belonging to Russian culture, language, traditions and history.
Although upon arrival in Moscow (periodically on business trips) I sometimes feel like the most natural migrant in some "non-Russian" country.

[Raphael_83]

Tatars and Bashkirs. Write correctly, I beg you. And then the eye hurts no worse than the plural in the words mens and childrens

[Yoshkin Kot]

limit, however, was just like that in Moscow without a residence permit it was not getting a job

[Garrin]

Quote: Yoshkin Cat

limit, however, was just like that in Moscow without a residence permit it was not getting a job

Dmitry, why is it so derogatory again? Yes, there were people, mainly with construction specialties, who rebuilt and build Moscow after the war, they were recruited within the limit. We lived in hostels, villages, etc. Back in 86m, in the current Butovo district, in the forest there was a village called "Vagonchiki", families lived there in carriages on rails, half a reserved seat carriage per family, everyone worked on the railway. Later on AZLK, ZIL, "Hammer and Sickle" began to import the Vietnamese ....
Normal, good people. Why are you so, Limit?

[Yoshkin Kot]

I don’t think the word limit is anything derogatory, by the way, I didn’t think I wondered that I would remember with regret the registration when the child could be let out for a walk in the yard, without any fear

[fern]

And under Soviet rule, these migrant workers were the Soviet people. And there was plenty of work in their republics

[Moritz]

Quote: Dangerous

And how under the Soviet regime Moscow and other large cities did without these guest workers? Almost all janitors / cooks / builders were of Slavic nationality

the most interesting thing is that builders from the RSFSR went to rebuild them Ashgabat and Tashkent after earthquakes, they did not observe their builders.

[UzRus]

The builders were, but not enough for such a grand restoration work. And after this, many builders who arrived in Tashkent remained.

[Georgs]

Quote: Dangerous

Moreover, while during the USSR, the level of education of these Uzbeks / Tajiks was even less (due to the fact that educational standards were valid throughout the country), now it’s an illiterate, stupid mass, without moral principles that spoil even more than they remove

Alas, alas, this is true. True bitter, like quinine.

[andrey122]

Let them simply blame and we will understand and forgive.

[UzRus]

And the dirt and garbage on the streets of cities instead of them for 5-10 thousand per month, who will clean?

[kostella85]

Intermediaries of all (both Russian and Uzbek) - on x .. th !!! In from then the salaries will be normal!

PS: By the word "Uzbek" I do not want to offend anyone, but I mean those representatives of national diasporas who profit from the difficult material situation of their people!

[UzRus]

church85, that's exactly what you need! First of all, there should be a priority for Russian citizens, and then for everyone else. You are definitely a plus! Or maybe it would be even better to determine the list of professions for which you can hire Gaster based on their level of education. And that’s it! And for all the rest, take only Russian citizens.

[Tatanka Yotanka]

Quote: UzRus

And the dirt and garbage on the streets of cities instead of them for 5-10 thousand per month, who will clean?

It seems you have not read the article

[UzRus]

Why, I read it. And the author did not discover America. Written in black and white - corruption of government agencies, which must monitor migration, and employers' benefit from the fact that it is better to use low-paid "slaves" - Gaster, than to pay their fellow citizens several times more. Did you miss anything? And I wrote my minus commentary not to pick someone up. In order for this mess to end, it is necessary to legislate a certain responsibility of the authorities and employers so that it is discordant. Can this be done quickly? Hardly. If there is a team "fas", then of course it will be fast. Drive out the cleaners without resolving the issue with a decent salary for their followers - who will clean the streets?

[Tatanka Yotanka]

Quote: UzRus

Who will clean the streets?

like this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSGQ41G1MXQ
not resolving the issue of a decent salary to their followers
there is no need to decide anything, there will be no migrants - they will be forced to recruit locals with a transparent salary, a social package and a salary many times higher, there are those who want to

[UzRus]

That's it - there is no need to decide anything, there will be no migrants. Keywords - there will be no migrants. And there are a lot of them. And quickly get rid of them will not work. Yes, most are without education. But there are also quite qualified specialists - builders, electricians, etc. Just for example: After class, my classmate left Tashkent for Moscow, got up, and decided to build a house in the Moscow Region. The Moldavians took the brigade (!) - in a month he kicked out nafig. Then he took fellow countrymen, three Uzbek construction workers from Bukhara - a master and 2 assistants. Built quickly and efficiently. Recommended to their friends, everyone is very satisfied. And there are many such examples. My Uzbek colleague’s son works under an electrician at St. Petersburg at a construction site, wiring, installing shields, etc. The employer is very satisfied. The guy does not drink, does not smoke, disciplined, studied at a Russian school.

[ultra]

Quote: UzRus

And quickly get rid of them will not work.

It is cheap labor of migrant workers that does not allow the economy to develop! IMHO getting rid of foreign workers stimulates the improvement of working conditions, the growth of productivity and, accordingly, wages! Well, definitely we need to introduce a visa regime!

[UzRus]

ultra, I will agree with you if it is written like this - getting rid of unskilled foreign workers

[ultra]

Quote: UzRus

getting rid of unskilled foreign workers

There are probably almost no qualified people there (in Central Asia), professional education has fallen below the baseboard, although there is demand, and even more so in Asia!

[Tatanka Yotanka]

Quote: UzRus

But there are also quite qualified specialists - builders, electricians, etc.

their main qualification is to take up any work wherever they take it, I don’t think that they finish some kind of construction training at home and therefore their qualification is determined by the experience they see, prompted, they will easily transform from shawarma cooks to electricians, from janitors to builders, to my opinion the satisfaction of your employer is more determined by the price of the employee

[UzRus]

I agree with you.

[Georgs]

UzRus,
Znachitsa, so. Who is against highly qualified professional personnel? Pros will be taken always and everywhere with great pleasure. The conversation is not about them, but about the wild, dirty, contagious biomass flooding our (OUR fucking!) Land.

[UzRus]

I noticed that the TVC broadcasted on 19.12.2010/XNUMX/XNUMX. 2010 years! And cho, all rushed to adopt the experience of the city near Moscow?

[Georgs]

Quote: Tatanka Yotanka

there are those who wish

Find - not the right word. They will run and stand in line.

[Georgs]

Quote: UzRus

And the dirt and garbage on the streets of cities instead of them for 5-10 thousand per month, who will clean?

But when there is no one to clean for 5-10 thousand, then everything will change. Slavic janitors will appear (and, by the way, the Tatars have always been excellent janitors according to contemporaries) with a normal salary and decent improvised modern equipment. Well, maybe for this some time, ankle-deep in g ... uh ... ko-kash-ke, I wanted to say, it will be necessary to go around. Until the managers have the necessary contact will not be connected. For them, our leaders, this always happens with a hefty delay.

[erix-xnumx]

All foreigners home. They are free citizens of their free states. So let them build their free and happy future, but in their own countries. And simultaneously with the deportation of illegal immigrants, it is necessary to tighten the responsibility for dishonest employers and officials. It is possible with their expulsion to those countries from where they most of all brought illegal immigrants to Russia.

[Xtra1l]

Majumder kick in the ass from Russia

[COBOK]

And no one asked the question: And this ... Muder, why did he come to Russia? In the column "purpose of arrival" is it "to head the federation of Russian migrants?" Have you come to study? Unlearned - home. Have you come to work? so work and don't get involved in politics. Something overly smart migrants pop up. How can you "understand and forgive" those who have not yet entered the country have ALREADY broken the law?
HOME, and in freight cars.

[pav-pon1972]

In the column "purpose of arrival" is it "to head the federation of Russian migrants?" Have you come to study?

Along the way, he already unlearned somewhere in London, Paris or in the States ...

[Mareman Vasilich]

Woke up, morons. Amnesty, forgive ....................... Thu, ur

[Owl]

It is not a question to accept migrants from Belarus or from eastern Ukraine, but the majority of migrants will be "Tajik-Uzbeks" who do not know the Russian language well, who live by their own laws, in their diasporas, their number already inspires legitimate fears, the number of illegal acts is growing (rape , murders, robberies, drug dealing), their arrival and their illegal use in production is sanctioned by the corrupt local leadership.

[ultra]

[quote = Eagle owl] Accepting migrants from Belarus or eastern Ukraine is not a question, [/ qThe main goals of the developed State program are to stimulate and organize the process of voluntary resettlement of compatriots to Russia, to compensate for the natural population decline in the country as a whole and in its individual regions due to attracting immigrants for permanent residence in the Russian Federation.

You can read more about the program on the website of the Federal Migration Service

[Raphael_83]

Quote: Eagle Owl

the number of illegal acts is growing

Regarding unlawful acts:
- Our central office of the republican branch is located not far from the Central Market, Ufa. So there is a parking lot of minibuses, the carriers of which are entirely Central Asians (transport mafia, Mlyn); and these same figures, not hiding foolishness (diverse), were trading in full view of the cops; I had never seen something in three and a half years of work with this office, so that they would at least detain someone;
- at the same time I go to work past the republican drug control, where they periodically harbor me as witnesses - and not a single person from the warm southern regions flashed in the documents or among the detainees. Illegal actions, you say? For me it’s already quite legalized

[Letnab]

But what is there to suffer? not enough money to expel gastrik? so let this money be earned, cars and railroads are manually poured along the Far East from BAM to the Bering Strait ... and they will earn money on the road, and there will be a lot to go home ...

[Georgs]

Quote: Letnab

not enough money to expel gastrik?

We have not enough money for everything except for the income of money bags. The question is fundamentally wrong. Unsystematic. Do not send. For their money. It is unreasonable, stupid to, sorry, sow. It is necessary to create conditions under which they themselves would strive to leave as soon as possible. And the same highly qualified personnel must be attracted, lured. Well, that’s how they usually do.

[bombowoz]

Yes, I don’t understand why to go here to build. Is there really nothing to do at home !? Why doesn’t the local kurbashi create the conditions for business, but on the condition that the locals work! Seek help in other countries, open roads for investment. In addition to heroin, there are many other things.

[kostella85]

Because there, they ate the last x ...... without salt, and the families are big - you need to feed them !!!

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

Because there, they ate the last x ...... without salt, and the families are big - you need to feed them !!!

It used to be big-in Soviet times. Now, at best, 1-2 children. I had a chance to talk with the Tajiks, who were building a summer house for my neighbors ...

[kostella85]

Ulukbek (Uzbek by nationality) worked for me, he is 23 years old, 4 children are the eldest of whom 9 !!!!!! years, the wife when she gave birth was 11 years old !!!
1-2 children in urban or simply more educated people !!!

[UzRus]

Now it’s a lot to have children. In Tashkent, there are usually 2 children in a family (I have at least).

[kostella85]

This "giant" is from somewhere near Fergana

[UzRus]

Ah, well then it’s clear!

[GSH-18]

Quote: Bombowoz

In addition to heroin, there are many other things.

Only these things do not fall into dust on profitability with the gerik!
You don’t start selling any junk in the train if you have the opportunity to trade in real estate!

[pinecone]

Legalians, illegal immigrants ... What actually difference. We do not need them for the spirit. They have their own very independent states, so they would graze there their beloved rams and other horned animals. But personally, I am not at all opposed to the arrival of representatives of the Caucasian race, as was the case with the German colonists in the Russian Empire. And this muddy Bengal Muder really need you ***** to build outside the Russian Federation.

[Larus]

Bravo !!! Instead of developing internal migration for citizens of the Russian Federation and thus leaving money in the country, incomprehensible members offer us to legalize all illegal immigrants in the country, whom no one undertakes to calculate.
And soon we will draw a new story that will tell how in Russia all the peoples did this very story ......
There is nowhere to slide further.

[Pelican]

The United States annually deportes 400 thousand illegal migrants from the country. RF 30 thousand The volume of entry of illegal immigrants is comparable.

[Averias]

This is what I especially liked, a quote from the article: "Majumder himself is an immigrant from Bangladesh, and therefore he believes that he is well acquainted with the backstage of the life of immigrants in Russia."
This is certainly strong, I would say it will be stronger than Faust (Goethe). Looks like there in Bangladesh, they are only busy thinking hard on the question of how to solve the problem of migrants in Russia. It is then of course, who else but Bangladesh think about it. They are practically close, and suddenly "guests" from Asia will go to them en masse, and they are in "all weapons". A couple of million migrants will come to them, and they clap them - and amnestied, beauty. And the fact that they will all have nothing to eat, it does not matter, we will tolerate. In cramped conditions, but not offended, as they say.
And where only these "Majumders" come from, he himself never worked, he never ate beach packets. Itself to see normally "coupons" on these migrants cuts.

[Tartary]

Putin promised to introduce visas in 2015 - he will ..
If the CIS presidents do not make the right decisions on joining the EurAsEC ...
In the meantime, the essence and the matter, they will stir up the old song - let it go with the container in w ... p, and expel it at the expense of the budget, at our expense - taxpayers ...
So shta, at least discuss here to pain in the joints of the hands ...

[Manager]

What for? I nervously scratch my forehead!
After all, those who are now in the territory of the Russian Federation are more than enough. At the same time, you can and even need to take into account that the maximum that they are capable of is to be janitors. This is the only thing that they do is not bad. And the rest?
Consider?
They’re not builders, they don’t smell like a higher education, they won’t correct our gene pool, but rather spoil it, there are more and more criminals with every visitor.

No guys. I am totally against it!

And by the way, recently entered the UFMS squads. The question is why? After all, then it turns out that one contradicts the other. Oh, how it reminds tolerant Europe.

[kostella85]

Quote: Manager

to be janitors. This is the only thing that they do is not bad. And the rest? Consider? Builders they are not what

In the summer, they ventured to hire (through a company, officially) 3 Uzbeks to dismantle the annex and clean the bricks !!!! This is some kind of scribe, they almost killed each other there, there are no safety concerns at all, as well as no other way (except pilaf). True, one who served in the ranks of the SA in the Sverdlovsk Region was sharply different in intelligence (for the better)!

[Averias]

In the appendage, to your comment. Not only are they uneducated, they are also cunning. A friend brought to his country house, several Uzbeks with the task of digging a hole (3x3m), left food, gave the elder a little money in the form of an advance payment (so that they would not worry). He gave the order how to do the work, to call, he will take them back. After 2 hours, they called, they say - the owner, the pit was dug up. He arrived, measured (for him for this purpose the timber was, in fact, along the length of the timber and dug a hole), everything is normal. Although inexplicable doubts tormented him, as if it was not a 3 meter deep hole, and they did the work too quickly. Well, once the work is done, I gave the remaining amount and took it to the city. And then the father-in-law, arriving at the cottage, found a chip, the Uzbeks sawed off a piece of timber and the hole turned out to be 2m50cm. And the coolest thing is that my friend, he is a riot police, but well done, he showed a sense of humor. Say he’s a sucker - you don’t buzz on others. And although at first, I wanted to tear to shreds.

[Z.A.M.]

Averias

Quote: Averias

Not only are they uneducated, they are also cunning.

Yes, if only that ...
Note, even 5 years ago, when they were shown on TV - face into the ground, "... do not smoke Russian ...", only that snot was not allowed.
Now look at the reports with them, they will see the camera and: "Who is this? !!!", and they also strive to knock it out or in the face of a non-tolerant correspondent.
ABOUT N A G L E L I !!! Which is not surprising! ALL - OUT!

[kostella85]

Now Averias d appendage, to your comment. about their super hard work and total sobriety. My colleagues and I sat in the office celebrating my birthday, naturally, I also drank gastric drinks a bottle of vodka for three, so that AFTER WORK they would drink for my health. After our departure, alcohol remained. He settled these Gastriks in the next room, and so the doors to the offices never closed. On Monday, having come to work, the alkagol was not in the office, and these hardworking slept peacefully. As it turned out later my booze was not enough for them, these non-drinkers found out where they sell alcohol and swollen all weekend .........

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

As it turned out later my booze was not enough for them, these non-drinkers found out where they sell alcohol and swollen all weekend ......... laughing

Yeah .. They love to have a drink, they all know. My friends (they have their own grocery store) scored long Then part of the money was given, part of the work, even there they built

[Tartary]

Quote: kostella85

In the summer, they ventured to hire (through a company, officially) 3 Uzbeks to dismantle the annex and clean the bricks !!!!

And somehow I once took two young ...
They did the job, paid off honestly, fed them fatherly, but modestly at lunch ...
After work, I dragged on a conversation about the friendship of peoples and key points of religion - like nothing ...
And at the exit from the car, one, so it is in a low voice: - nothing, they say, soon you will find out about "Allah Akbar" - and on the move ...
In the beginning, I didn’t even ate what happened, and then I regretted it very much - they had to give them not quite fatherly ...

So nah from the beach of all these "friends"! Let's better be friends with them at a distance. Yes, and "Saiga" is time to lay under the sofa ...

[Manager]

Quote: Tartary

And at the exit from the car, one, so it is in a low voice: - nothing, they say, soon you will find out about "Allah Akbar" - and on the move ...

What did you want? What would they all love us? We are in their eyes that not a family is so aligarch. Apartment car. And they have nothing except a pair of shirts and beds in Aul. It’s clear that a hungry well-fed man is not a friend. Therefore, I do not believe their friendly smiles categorically.

[IRBIS]

But let the employers who hire illegal immigrants pay for their deportation to their historical homeland for their light. Plus, to such dealers to apply increased future attention from the oversight bodies. Well, the visa regime - by itself. And urgently, because the abundance of someone else’s gene pool on the streets of our cities is already becoming alarming.

[Mareman Vasilich]

Migrant workers, like other areas of activity in the country, are just a tool for plundering the country. In the country, all values ​​are transferred to money. No conscience, no homeland, no flag. The problem is not in migrant workers, but in their purpose and those who are behind it.

Quote: UzRus

And the dirt and garbage on the streets of cities instead of them for 5-10 thousand per month, who will clean?

For reference.
Who did this before, in a normal country, the USSR? And why for 5-10 TR? If their employer hadn’t paid, they would have paid a better deal.
So, are you cunning?

[UzRus]

Incorrect comparison with the USSR. In the USSR, everyone was provided with work and the question was not where to go to work. Work was the sea - factories, factories, collective farms, etc. Why for 5000-10000? On NTV they showed Gaster, who in Moscow worked on street cleaning for that kind of money. And no one is disingenuous, adopt legislation that the employer will mainly hire Russian citizens and pay them a decent salary. It can be done?

[Mareman Vasilich]

You have read inattentively.

[UzRus]

Where did I read inattentively?

[pinecone]

Without a doubt, the fundamental reason for the mass migration of Asians is the fact that they are brought here intentionally as part of a replacement program developed by the international pederastical community, that is, the destruction of the indigenous (White) population. historical Russia.
Foul Muder is just one of the tools of the anti-Russian forces.

[kostella85]

To account:

Quote: pinecone

that they are deliberately brought here

I don’t know, but that's what they are fleeing from hopeless poverty - that's for sure !!!

[Sasha 19871987]

honestly, then I am against the presence of these same immigrants ... I tried to decorate myself, but under their pressure of cheapness I had to move to another area, although I really liked the finish ... for what is the point? Why pay Russian 5 thousand, when you can pay two Uzbeks a thousand and they will do the same work, clumsily, wretchedly, but they will ...

[kostella85]

Quote: sasha 19871987

Why pay Russian 5 thousand, when you can pay two thousand Uzbeks a thousand and they will do the same work, clumsily, wretchedly, but they will

About that and speech !!!!

[UzRus]

Why pay Russian 5 thousand, when you can pay two Uzbeks a thousand and they will do the same work, clumsily, wretchedly, but they will ... - Sasha, and now tell me who is profitable?

[kostella85]

Dofiga is beneficial for everyone, but not profitable - for the robots and small IPshnik!

[UzRus]

Here with those who benefit, maybe and need to start "educational work"? Demand creates supply, right? If there is no demand, there will be no supply. Everything is very simple!

[kostella85]

Quote: UzRus

Those who benefit from it may and need to start "educational work"

Alexander, this is big business, I don't give a damn to him! I will also quote a proverb: "the fish rots from the head." if the GDP does not want to fight this infection (corruption), then who needs it from the bureaucrats, everyone has their own interests. Own business! Nobody comes to himself nya eggs !!!!!

[UzRus]

So I wrote above - there will be a command "Fas!" from GDP and everything will be in chocolate.

[fenix57]

Quote: Alexander Romanov

They are being deported all the time, tighter border controls should be

Pass persons (and transport cp-tv) crossing the state. The border for entry into and exit from the Russian Federation is carried out in accordance with the legislation of the Russian Federation and intergovernmental agreements.

[DeMBel]

Good day to everyone who reads and thinks about what they read and draw conclusions.
The article is interesting and unconvincing, I write as a person who has worked in the FMS system for 11 years and is just in this direction. The whole trouble is, this is my point of view that Russia wants to become good for everyone, and all these problems with migrants are solved only in one way - this is a visa entry, and then only those who are needed come to Russia, and not the entire village and village etc.
Best regards

[pav-pon1972]

I think we need to start with our bureaucrats ... Up to huge fines, dismissals and a prohibition to engage in managerial activities for 5 years ... Money to municipal, state bodies, and all kinds of public companies controlled by the state are allocated for the positions of workers, cleaners and etc. huge. And bureaucrats master them wisely, and they need to beat them on the hands. Will arrange as expected. You can't get into commercial organizations here. as they want to pay, so they will. And the superfluous will leave themselves, or the FMS authorities will help them. And there is no need to take the American experience ... In no case.

[UzRus]

I think we should start here with our bureaucrats ... Up to enormous fines, dismissal and a ban on engaging in leadership activities for 5 years ... - An excellent decision, and consolidate it by law. You are a plus!

[FunkschNNX]

The visa regime and often expel violators of labor laws, with a fine, of course, also per employee and 1000 times more per employer.

[JonnyT]

this uncle wants a lot ... cookie him !!!

[calculator]

The saddest thing about all this is that WHAT WE DO NOT ASK, WE SAY.

[Hey]

Gosterbayters are such a club for uncooperative rulers, in the pocket of the current government. While there is an accumulation of forces. Once on day-X, it will be time to rebuild the empire and annex territories. An offer will be made (like the "Godfather"), which cannot be refused, to join a single state. Well, for the intractable, there will be a public flogging in the form of a mass dispatch to the homeland of representatives of this nation from among the illegal immigrants. To clarify the correct course in international politics.

[Apollo]

Vladimir Putin, if he wants, will immediately block the flow of immigration but cannot do this for the following reasons:

1. Mostly the stream comes from neighboring CIS countries.
2. Does not want to spoil relations with the leaders of the CIS countries.
3. To some extent, trying to compensate for the lack of labor.
4.Support Economy, Political and Social stability in neighboring countries.


I think that as long as there are no economic reforms in some CIS countries, there will be a flow of legal and illegal immigration. Among other things, illegal immigration is to some extent beneficial to law enforcement agencies. In my opinion, their material interest is unequivocal.

[GSH-18]

Quote: Apollon

I think that as long as there are no economic reforms in some CIS countries, there will be a flow of legal and illegal immigration. Among other things, illegal immigration is to some extent beneficial to law enforcement agencies. In my opinion, their material interest is unequivocal.

In addition to the above, cheap foreign labor really (though not regrettable) allows you to carry out the planned amount of work on allocated (scarce) budget funds in the regions. If you attract Russian contractors with Russian workers, then the estimate will increase at times — often there is simply no such money in local budgets.
The issue of migration of foreign labor arises because of the connivance of the supervisory authorities. Russian guest workers are now needed. But like everything else in the state, they require control and regulation (especially recently).

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

allocated (scarce) budget funds in the regions. If you attract Russian contractors with Russian workers, then the estimate will increase at times — often there is simply no such money in local budgets.

Pavel, the estimate is considered based on the project, there is at least a Tajik at least a restorotor from the Louvre, it makes no difference - the gene. the contractor also pays! And he (the general contractor) also saves not only on salaries, but also on materials !!

As for the estimates. Estimates are inflated for extra. the work is NOT considered in the project, the decision is made by the CUSTOMER (UKS municipality, etc.), that is, by the OFFICIAL !!!!!!
This was clearly seen when Kozak’s GDP was built in Sochi, where the customer (vice president of the Olympic Committee) and the contractor were one person - Belalov !!!

So who should have been fired: a thoughtful Belalov or a dead Kozak (chairman of the OK) ????

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

Pavel, the estimate is considered based on the project, there is at least a Tajik at least a restorotor from the Louvre, it makes no difference - the gene. the contractor also pays! And he (the general contractor) also saves not only on salaries, but also on materials !!

This scheme dominates our construction industry.

Quote: kostella85

As for the estimates. Estimates are inflated for extra. the work is NOT considered in the project, the decision is made by the CUSTOMER (UKS municipality, etc.), that is, by the OFFICIAL !!!!!!

I absolutely agree with you. That's exactly how the cost of the Adler-Krasnaya Polyana highway increased at 7 !! time!
When I wrote the previous post, I meant Tendering for construction and maintenance (the 94th law has not been canceled). Naturally, it will be cheaper for the contractor who pays the workers less. It doesn’t work with ours, but with gastriks, with a bang.

[kostella85]

Quote: GSH-18

Holding tenders for construction and maintenance (nobody canceled the 94th law). Naturally, it will be cheaper for the contractor who pays the workers less.

You, Paul, may be right here, but not quite. I can’t say anything about this road, I don’t know, but, for example, about a huge perinotal center by our standards, I know well ....... The "now deceased" firm MOSSIB won the tender there, not having in its staff not a single builder and not a single unit of special equipment ...................... It was completed by the entire region, even the GDP came, set up for "heroic" work: laughing: Maybe this is the same situation with the road ...................

[GSH-18]

Quote: kostella85

This was clearly seen when Kozak’s GDP was built in Sochi, where the customer (vice president of the Olympic Committee) and the contractor were one person - Belalov !!!

So who should have been fired: a thoughtful Belalov or a dead Kozak (chairman of the OK) ????

The answer is in the question. Both tries .. from the beach!

[kostella85]

I disagree, in Russia God loves a trinity !!! so they still have someone missing ..........

[Renat]

Why don't we touch grandmas everywhere? Take a look at France. Tolerance. All Africa and Asia are welcome. And what came of it? Pogroms of entire neighborhoods, burning cars, riots, etc. You try to go to the Central Asian country and take a walk in the evening. It’s better not to do this. A European face means blame. I know for myself.

[UzRus]

You specifically about what Central Asian country are you talking about?

[calculator]

For example, at night Kulyab

[UzRus]

Calculator, I asked about the country, and you answered about the city. Well, Kulyab, yes, that place is still ... It "thundered" during the civil war ... No, here you can easily walk around Tashkent at any time of the day. You only need to have documents with you.

[calculator]

I’ve been there for 3 years 2002-2005 ... walked Photo by the way on the avatar -10 Pogz 117 detachment of the Moscow

[UzRus]

Yes guys, you got there, border guards, in Tajikistan ...

[Straiser]

The French themselves are not happy with their tolerance now. That and look, a new "Kosovo" will appear on the map of Europe

[Sleptsoff]

The country was turned into trash

[vik71]

Somehow I talked to Gaster from the east. To the question: As you guys in Is Russia living? answered: harasho brother. We talk further, I say: And what if for example am i to you? Suppose in the market to sell Kursk apples? The answer exceeded all expectations: You can’t do it, brother, you can make money there .....
This is the answer of a simple resident. I'm in touch.

[Octavian avgust]

Well, you’re talking to the uneducated, they grazed sheep just yesterday, at best!

[Strashila]

Illegal migration ... forgive these tomorrow all the inhabitants, that small residue that will be there. Yes, in fact, Russia already contains these republics at the expense of subsidies there ... to their rulers. The separation ... given the crimes committed ... 5 years of colony settlements ... only then deportation for life ... along with their families, the families of their families ... and so on. And then there’s no application for raising agriculture ... here’s a free labor force ... use for the good of the fatherland. And officials condoning illegal immigrants with confiscated property, and members of their families, families of their families ... there in cowsheds and in the fields.

[Octavian avgust]

Muhammad Amin Majumder

You don’t need to listen to a person with that name right away. He is not Russian. The problem is not even in migrants, but in Russian genetic core of the nation. The Russians themselves are degrading, especially young people, and how can something great be built with such material? I am against migration in general, if qualified specialists were traveling then yes, and since there are enough of their lackeys who can take the streets of revenge, if only they would pay enough!

[baltika-18]

Quote: Octavian avgust

and so there are enough of their lackeys who can take the streets of revenge, if only they would pay enough!

It would be interesting to find out whom do you rank among the slaves? Since there are slaves, then there must be a “bar.” Who belongs to them? And in what category?

[calculator]

On February 18 and 19, police barriers appeared on the Uzbek-Kazakh border near Tashkent, where young people “supposedly traveling to work in Russia” were “turned back”.

On the way to the checkpoint (checkpoint) "Gisht-kuprik" on the Uzbek-Kazakh border, portable metal barriers and half a dozen policemen appeared.

Law enforcement officers were allowed only women and children, old people and citizens with Kazakh passports, Tashkent human rights activist Vladimir Khusainov, who appeared at the border, said.

All young men who tried to enter Kazakhstan were denied border crossing, as a result of which a large crowd formed near the police fences.

“You look young, that means you are going abroad to earn money, and this is now prohibited,” one of the policemen told the 50-year-old Khusainov.

When the human rights activist tried to "pump up his rights", the police promised "for disputes with representatives of the authorities" to put him in prison for 15 days.

Khusainov complained to the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Uzbekistan on the helpline, and he was asked to come to the Ministry of Internal Affairs to see a document prohibiting young men from traveling abroad.

In the Tashkent region’s internal affairs department, the human rights activist was told by telephone hotline that he should present a document-telegram from relatives in Kazakhstan if traveling on personal matters.

Most of the experts associate innovations on the border with Kazakhstan, which created problems for citizens of Uzbekistan suspected of “guest workers”, with a recent statement at a meeting of the Cabinet of Ministers of President Islam Karimov.

The head of state, known for his addiction to Russian television, showed a rare awareness of the fate of an Uzbek man who worked as a janitor in a Moscow courtyard.

Bahrom Khurramov, 35, in January became the hero of many Russian media outlets following an incident with a teenager teasing and mocking him who reportedly broke his jaw.

Karimov about the history of Khurramov said: “What could this man not earn at home as much as a janitor in Moscow?”, And for some reason he accused the Minister of Internal Affairs Bakhodyr Matlyubov.

“Perhaps, attempts to suppress the departure of migrant workers were the answer of the Ministry of Internal Affairs to the president - they say, look at what bad consequences the police may interfere in the market migration process,” human rights activists suggest.

[UzRus]

This we are in the know. Karimov spoke at the end of January at a meeting on the results of work in 2012. Did you take fergana.ru? We have prohibited this site, only through a proxy you can go.

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Assault news

[UzRus]

A reference can not be?

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http://www.shturmnovosti.com/

[vik71]

Octavian avgust,
So to me what a difference who will crack me there, a grammatical Wahhabi or poorly educated shepherd.

[Larus]

In one program, some ml. Lieutenant of the police froze that the Russian nation as such is not there, it was washed away by the Tatar-Mongols although everyone knows for a tribute they came, and then a couple of people, although there is an alternative version that the yoke as such was not .....
Well, in short, and then this jr. Lieutenant of the police said that we need to learn history, if so, as he betrayed the Tatar-Mongol and eroded our nation, then tries. we need such cops and dumb me such a story

[Krasnoyarsk]

Let dear migrants use three funny letters, no legalization, but only close the borders and check all who have received citizenship since 2000, in case of violations, take citizenship away and expel them from the country.

[knn54]

... in the shadow side of the use of their labor.
Two active accomplices of terrorists involved in the recruitment and sending of people abroad to gangs were detained in the suburbs. It is known that both citizens of Uzbekistan.
A resident of the Moscow Region Tatyana Kudryavtseva went mushrooming into the forest. And there, a guest worker from Uzbekistan attacked her with a very distinct intention to rape. But the woman was not taken aback and killed him with a knife. A criminal case was instituted against her under Article 105, Part 1 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation (“Murder”). “It follows from the factual circumstances,” explained the structures of the Investigative Committee of the Russian Federation, “that the Uzbek government wanted to rape her, that is, to harm her health, and not take her life.” And she, you see, took the life of the rapist. It turns out that the woman had to surrender? So that the whole of Russia should not resist if it is raped?
They are here precisely for the reason, for the most part, that they are not spending anything. Nothing at all. The employer organizes to eat, sleep, and for the money earned they return with a kilogram of Afghan heroin in the stomach. As illegal immigrants, they have no responsibility, and hence the feeling of impunity.
And about the compensation of labor. For Peter and the region they need a maximum of 300000, and they are 15 times more.

And if (God forbid) war. These "guests" will rob and rape our families and the corrupt cops will release them. While we are going to fight ... This happened in Libya, almost all migrant workers took the side of the rebels.
PS The Western Roman Empire fell from the barbarians, of whom there were immeasurable, even some emperors, and the Eastern (Byzantium) kept this issue under control. And it lasted another 1000 years!

[fzr1000]

SKR - impotent .. s.

[Navy7981]

I don’t know who is thinking what, but I get the feeling that they want to replace us. There is no other understanding.

[Ramses_IV]

Here's WHAT THE FUCK IN US IN THE COUNTRY LACK OF WORKING HANDS ???? This is complete nonsense, which is used to justify this black stream. Those. it was always enough - and now again - and not enough.
Here, I came across an interesting article: http://www.kramola.info/vesti/metody-genocida/cveti-rodnoj-uzbekistan-no-tolko-b




ez-menja
Now they are planting tomatoes that the website is somehow far-right, but .... it seems to be true. Perhaps, I’ll go to myself to issue a permit for the trunk - otherwise it will be too late.

[rubber_duck]

Quote: Ramses_IV

Perhaps, I’ll go to myself to issue a permit for the trunk - otherwise it will be too late.

And so late. That is, pointless. If it’s not too late, Kalash will be given out anyway, and if it’s too late, then your rifle is not worth the hassle.

[Straiser]

Read books in the Nation series. For example: Xenophobe, Outcast, terrorist.

[figvamforever]

Quote: Banshee

But the whole problem is that the visitors themselves and their employers are not interested in the full design.

The whole problem is that the population is ready to join the self-defense units from migrants.
Does anyone want a war?

[BAT]

First of all, it is necessary to carry out inspections and cleanings in all departments of the FMS, and only then decide what to do with illegal immigrants.
But in general, in my opinion, we need to drive them all back to our Uzbekistans. Tajikistan and Kyrgyzstan. Somehow we can get by without gasters. Otherwise, their presidents have become too loose. Especially lately the Tajik idiot. It's time to put it in its place.

[nic]

Below is an article about Kosovo and six years of independence, very symbolic.

[nycsson]

ALL AS ONE, STAND UP FOR THE DEFENSE OF OUR HOMELAND!

The Rus must awaken from their mental sleep and begin to defend themselves from the insidious and vile enemy who is coldly and systematically destroying their Motherland. None of the strangers will protect us. The fate of Rus' and our destiny are only in our hands...

"Victory depends on the valor of the legions." Gaius Julius Caesar.


It should be recalled that after the artificial collapse of the USSR-Russia in August 1991 and the shooting of Parliament in October 1993, Russia lives in the period of the “New World Order” of the Anglo-Saxon-Jewish core represented by the US cluster - the global financial mafia. Therefore, the tone of the foreign and domestic policy of our Fatherland, to our deep misfortune, is set from the Washington Regional Committee. And now in Russia the question of the succession of power over Russia has again arisen.
What is really happening in Russia? What forces are fighting for power over Russia in order to continue to steal resources and destroy the people? The answers to these questions are already on the surface today, and they can be seen with your own eyes. First of all, these are the clan interests of the groups behind V. Putin and the “liberals.” From materials of Russian and foreign media it is known that V. Putin personifies the clan of “siloviki-oligarchs”, and Kudrin, Nemtsov, Kasyanov, Prokhorov, Navalny, etc. – the “liberal oligarchs” of the old and new batch.

http://warfiles.ru/show-24590-vsem-kak-odin-vstat-na-zaschitu-nashey-rodiny.html

[i-gor63]

I studied under the Union in the Moscow region, and I don’t remember street cleaners of such nationalities on the streets of Moscow, and they built their own houses (I know for sure). We also went and helped (Tashkent, Spitak). Do you think there were more people? It's just beneficial for you. The time will come, some hope to escape abroad, the rest agree to live on reservations. It won't be better. Greater Kosovo. Now they are powerless and you are smiling at them. Then there are a bunch of mosques, “who are you?”
Then - "Goodbye!" Only the visa regime will save us. And there is nothing to be afraid of, that if you turn away, they will sell out to someone. They are already corrupt. Such people love a strong brother, but are disdainful of a weak one. Kerimov staged a demarche and squeezed out the Uzbeks. Let them serve the Americans and go overseas. Look, the Americans will let a lot of them in. And you legalize, legalize. I wonder how long you can last like this.

[vpaster]

In our bodies, each organ has a precisely established location and emits a certain frequency of energy (proven by scientists); a change in the location of any organ in the body can cause the death of the entire organism. Also, the body of Christ (spiritual structure) consists of different members (nations). (1 Corinthians 12:12) “For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of one body, although many, are one body, so is Christ.” Just as each member of the body has a clearly established order of location in the body, therefore each people and tribe must live on the part of the earth strictly allotted to it by God. The spirit of the part of the land on which a tribe or people lives corresponds to a certain spirit (energy) of the development of the KIND. The authority of God clearly and precisely established the boundaries of residence for each people on the part of the land allotted to them; accordingly, the people are given the gifts and callings necessary for cultivating the “vineyard.” God gave each nation its own “vineyard” (a state with all the natural resources on this part of the earth) and each nation will give an account for the cultivation of its “vineyard.” Chinese in China, Indians in India, Pakistanis in Pakistan, blacks in Africa, Cameroonians in Cameroon, Somalis in Somalia, redskins in America, Brazilians in Brazil, Argentines in Argentina, whiteskins in Europe, Frenchmen in France, Italians in Italy, etc. . Only the Slavs were given by God most of the land in Europe and Asia (whoever is given more will be asked for more), and if it were not for the Lord, the Slavs would live in the Kyiv volost alone. There are clear historical examples for this, when the Persians, Greeks or Romans conquered vast territories of foreign states, but in the end, where are they? They sat down in the place where the Lord had appointed

[Geisenberg]

I propose to actually understand and forgive them, but deport them. Behind the gate - to your homeland, with a clear conscience.

[Boer]

That’s right, the visa regime is absolutely 100%, and don’t let in those who have in any way caused harm to the Russian Federation and its citizens, there are plenty of them. Make emigration services work normally, they must control them completely (place of residence, work, movement around RF, etc.) and finally create a labor exchange for emigrants (it will be easier to control). The most important thing is to harshly punish employers for hiring unaccounted labor, otherwise it turns out they swooped in, grabbed the workers and so on, and everyone “drained the water” but you need to ask directly those who supervise a construction site or other facility and a FINE! specific penalty up to angle.answer. so that it would be more profitable to hire legal workers than labor force. And in general, there are many different methods and tools to solve such problems, but who will solve them? Those who care about smoking and other nonsense, they generally live in their own parallel, wow, bastards .Something like this.

[Alikovo]

they need to be expelled from Russia

[walter_rus]

There is another possible solution to the problem (economic). Allow all migrants to work, but let his employer pay to the state budget for each foreigner, maybe half a million a year (the figure is quite realistic, based on the average salary). Then it will be more profitable for employers to increase the salaries of Russians than to attract foreigners. And if you need a unique specialist from abroad, then you won’t mind paying that amount for him; it will pay off handsomely. And the efficiency of the supervisory authorities will increase - they are good at collecting money - not like just chasing after illegal immigrants without any benefit :))) I hope that then the problem will be much reduced.

[dmb]

I will also make my contribution. Which of the keyboard spankers work as a janitor? We obviously won’t see a forest of hands. Remember how zealously the residents of the house whose yard he was cleaning stood up for the janitor who broke the boy’s jaw, and how angrily he was denounced by those who did not live in that yard. Of course, this can be explained by Moscow humanism, but it seems to me that everything is simpler, they were afraid of drowning in garbage. Of course, migrants are taking away some professions from us. But the majority work where locals do not want to work for one reason or another. In my opinion, only a draconian measure can significantly change the situation. The presence of an illegal migrant should entail mandatory and unalternative liquidation of the enterprise with confiscation of equipment. For government agencies, unconditional dismissal of the head with deprivation of the right to hold government positions. positions for 5 years. These laws can be adopted within a month. If anyone needs it, we can get it within a week. And of course, justified quotas for the required quantity, border control, etc.

[dmb]

I don't really care about the cons. But it was probably put there by the owner of the stall. For obvious reasons, he cannot explain it, and my proposals do not suit him for one simple reason. In words, he is against illegal migration and even allows himself to mutter, “Russia is for Russians.” But this is when it comes to competitors’ stalls. But by not paying extra to the illegal Uzbek immigrant working for him, he increases his profit. And business is business.

[Yoshkin Kot]

for 20 thousand a month? there are those, a woman washes my mother’s entrance, she gets 2 a month, she has five of them, the janitor also gets 000 a month

[rubber_duck]

Let me guess... Are you a Muscovite? Or a Leningrader?

[homosum20]

God will forgive, but the migration service has no such right.

[ko88]

I had the opportunity to talk a lot with immigrants, with Tajiks, Uzbeks and Kyrgyz, the overwhelming majority of them were young people, I’ll say this; very good people, I don’t have anything bad, but something needs to be done, that is, introduce control over those entering, as they say in common people, tighten the screws, do everything like people do and not through the ass as we always do. And Russia has also turned into a gateway, and for this reason the West is afraid to cancel visas with us because millions of guest workers will flood Europe.

[Suvorov000]

This is all done simply by Comrade. Stalin was already making a five-year plan program at the expense of the free labor of prisoners, all these wretched freeloaders and their sympathizers to the camps and to the new White Sea canals with a song

[ko88]

you stupid looser

[Suvorov000]

And you, dear sir, are a corrupt soul, your ancestors mined the land with blood, and now you are ready to sell it for a white toilet and four-ply toilet paper

[ko88]

Suvorov000, you know, my dear fellow, how many innocent souls Comrade Stalin ruined, how many talented military men of all ranks, some were thrown into the forest, some were expendable, when hungry peasants received 10 years in camps for a handful of grain, and thousands of broken families. So, according to your judgment, all these people are freeloaders, wretched, along with their families??

[svv65]

What kind of labor shortage are we talking about here? Go to Avito and see by the views how many people are looking for work. It is necessary to tighten migration legislation, raise the cost of a work permit many times over, introduce criminal liability for working without a permit, and then the problem will be solved on its own. Russia does not need guest workers, especially in times of economic crisis. We would like to provide our own people with work.