Military Review

Stalin and the wind of history

375
That is the trouble! When it happened
He has a frantic sickle
Passing on the field squall -
The sheaf fell behind the sheaf.
Stalin


The truth is a bitter medicine, unpleasant to the taste, but restoring health.
Balzac


Once, Stalin said that after his death, a lot of garbage would be put on his grave, but the wind stories dispel it. Everything happened just as the leader had foreseen. Less than a few years, N. Khrushchev (exactly at his request to increase the quota for execution, Stalin wrote: “Calm down, you fool”) began pouring dirt on the leader as one of the main “Stakhanovite terror” 1930s. Khrushchev was not the first in this regard: the systematic watering of Stalin (albeit interspersed with real criticism) was begun by Trotsky, well, the former Trotskyite Khrushchev, who did not come out of his mind, left only watering. Then Khrushchev was joined by the most zealous of the Sixties as "scavengers", and there is nothing to say about dissidents who "sang" against other people's voices "and" floated "on others' waves," they were part of Western anti-Soviet propaganda.

Perestroika marked a new stage in the defamation of Stalin. Here, however, not Stalin was the main target, but Soviet socialism, the Soviet system, Soviet history, and behind them Russian history as a whole. After all, one of the demons of perestroika declared that with perestroika they broke not only the Soviet Union, but the entire paradigm of a thousand-year Russian history. And the fact that Stalin was chosen as the main figure of breakdown once again testifies to the role of this man-phenomenon not only in Soviet, but also in Russian history - Stalinism, among other things, became an active and great-power form of Russian survival in the 20th century. in the conditions of an extremely hostile environment, aiming at the "final solution of the Russian question" - Hitler is not the only one in this regard, he simply - in a plebeian manner - shouted the loudest of all, repeating what the Anglo-Saxons had gathered.

("The USSR collapsed, the Soviet system was destroyed. It would seem that Soviet-style fools can calm down about Stalin and the USSR. But no, it’s bothering about them. True, the current de-Stalinisers are mostly farcical and odd, they look even small compared to the tuning rod. On the screens TVs grimace miserable social types such as the half-educated, bakery-fake publicist, the under-educated academician with snitches of a snitch, an alcoholic with a claim to the role of an international businessman and other meddling. Then you will remember Karel Chapek ("they come as and faceless masks "- about salamanders) and Nikolai Zabolotsky (" Everything is mixed up in the general dance, / And they fly to all ends / Hamadril and the British, / Witches, fleas, dead ... / Candidate of the past centuries, / Commander of new years, / Reason my! These freaks - / Only fiction and nonsense ").

Indeed, it’s not a delusion not to mention what the "carpet anti-Stalinists" serve as "arguments." These are either continuous, on the verge of hysterical emotions in the spirit of amateur club activity with shouts of "nightmare", "horror", "shame", very reminiscent of a jackal Tabaki from Kipling's "Mowgli" with his "Shame on the jungle!" - emotions without any facts and numbers. Or operating with fantastic numbers of victims of "Stalin's repressions": "tens and tens of millions" (why not hundreds?). If something is referred to, then Solzhenitsyn’s GULAG Archipelago. But Solzhenitsyn was a master of legend and the production of "linings". For example, he did not claim in the "Archipelago ..." for tsifirnuyu accuracy; moreover, it was expressed in the sense that this work has an impressionistic character, so to speak. Insured "Winds" - that's what the school means.

But over the last quarter of a century, on the basis of archival data (the archives are open), both our and Western (primarily American) researchers, most of whom are not at all noticed in sympathies with either Stalin or the USSR, or even Russia, have calculated the real number of repressed people. in 1922-53 (recall, by the way, that although the “Stalinist” era formally began in 1929, in fact, only with 1939 can we formally speak of Stalin’s full control over the party and the government, although there were some nuances here), and there are no "tens of millions" or even one "ten millions" there.

In recent years, well-documented works have appeared that show the real mechanism of the 1930-x repressions, which, like the mass ones, were unleashed by the “old guard” and “regional barons” like Khrushchev and Eiche in response to Stalin’s proposal on alternative elections. The leader could not break the resistance of the “old guards”, but a pinpoint (not massive!) Blow to their headquarters was dealt. I leave aside the fight against real conspiracies — the opposition of Stalin to the left globalists of the Comintern, like Trotsky, who believed that Stalin had betrayed the world revolution, etc. Thus, the real picture of the “repressions of 1930's” is much more complicated than Stalin’s detractors try to imagine; This is a multi-layered and multi-vector process of ending the civil war, in which the Stalin segment itself occupies far more than a small part.

Similarly, the second main block of Stalin’s charges fails - in the way the Great Patriotic War took shape in the first months: “missed”, “overslept”, “did not believe Sorge”, “believed Hitler”, “ran away from the Kremlin and for three days was in prostration " etc. All these lies have long been refuted by documents, the researchers are well aware of this - that Stalin didn’t oversleep anything, and that he never really believed Hitler, and that he didn’t believe Sorge correctly, or real guilt. Generals on the eve of June 22. This is not the place to sort out all these questions, but I cannot refrain from a single comment. Oh, how did the anti-Stalinists squirt over the TASS statement from 14 June 1941; the statement said that everything was fine in relations between the USSR and Germany, that the USSR continued to pursue a peace-loving course, etc. “Scavengers” interpret this as “Stalin’s stupidity and weakness”, as “currying favor with Hitler”. It does not occur to them that the addressee of the statement was not Hitler and the Third Reich, but Roosevelt and the USA. In April, 1941 of the United States Congress decided that in the event of a German attack on the USSR, the United States would help the USSR, and in the event of a Soviet attack on Germany, Germany.

The TASS statement recorded the complete absence of aggressive intentions of the USSR towards Germany and demonstrated this absence precisely to the United States, and not to Germany. Stalin was well aware that in the inevitable battle with the Reich his only real ally could be the United States, they would also keep the UK from slipping into the German-British anti-Soviet alliance. And, of course, it was impossible to prevent the careless movement, to which Hitler was pushing the Russians, to provoke the emergence of the North Atlantic (or rather, the world - with the participation of Japan and Turkey) of the anti-Soviet bloc. In this case, the Soviet Union (relative military potential on 1937 g. - 14%) would have to confront the USA (41,7%), Germany (14,4%), Great Britain (10,2% without imperial possessions), France (4,2%), Japan ( 3,5%), Italy (2,5%) plus jackals smaller. By the way, taking into account these figures and the fact of the decision of the US Congress, the entire falsity of the Rezun scheme and others like it about the alleged preparation by Stalin of an attack on Germany in particular and on Europe as a whole is obvious.

There is one purely psychological nuance in the accusations of the scientific and near-scientific brotherhood to Stalin. In everything, more precisely, in everything that is considered negative in Stalin’s rule (the positive is held along the line “against Stalin”) they blame one person as allegedly endowed with absolute power, and therefore omnipotent. But, first, Stalin managed to consolidate his power only by the end of the 1930s; before that - a struggle not for life, but for death, walking along the edge, constant readiness to respond to the joyful cry of the pack: "Akela missed." War is not the best time for sole decisions. Well, the period 1945-1953. - this is a time of constant undercover struggle of various nomenklatura groups with each other - and against Stalin. The post-war 8 anniversary is the story of a gradual obkladyvanie, surrounding the aging leader by the nomenclature (with the participation of certain forces and structures from abroad); Stalin's attempt to strike back at the XIX Congress of the CPSU (b) / CPSU (1952) and immediately after it ended in the death of the leader. Thus, in real, not "professorial" history, about which Goethe noted that it has no relation to the real spirit of the past, it is "... the spirit of the professors and their concepts, / which these gentlemen are out of place / For true antiquity they give out" Stalin was never the absolute ruler - he did not have the Ring of Absolute Power. This does not mean that he does not bear personal responsibility for mistakes, cruelty, etc., he bears - along with a cruel era, according to the laws and the nature of which he should be evaluated.

But it's not only that. The simple truth is this: the one who led the team, at least from 10 people, knows that absolute power is impossible - and the less possible it is, the more subordinates. Most of those who wrote and wrote about Stalin have never been guided by anyone or anything, i.e. in this sense, people are irresponsible. In addition to power, they often project their ambitions, fears, claims, desires, “swaying sleepy thoughts” (N. Zabolotsky) and, not least, the craving for denunciation (it's no secret that most of the Soviet era, Stalin and the KGB hate former informers, informers, because it is easier to hate the system and its leader than to despise one’s own meanness — repression, you know). Absolute power is the dream of the Soviet intelligentsia, which has found one of its reflections in The Master and Margarita; among other things, that is why the novel became cult for sovintelligentsia (and the “Notes of the Dead”, where a mirror was revealed to this layer, did not). To reduce the essence of the system to the identity of one person - this is something from social schizophrenia and from infantilism, not to mention professional insolvency.

It would be possible to point out a lot of other absurdities, mistakes and falsifications of “debris nanos” on Stalin’s grave, but what’s the point of delving into those poisoned with lies and hatred implicated in complexes and phobias and brains? It is more interesting to make out another thing: the reasons for hatred of Stalin, the fear of him of entire layers and groups in our country and abroad, fear and hatred that will not go into the past, but, on the contrary, sometimes seem to grow as they move away from the Stalin era. Who knows, maybe this is the main Military Secret of the Soviet era, which is not given to guess the burzhuinam and which hangs over them like a "Damocles sword"?

They often say: "Tell me who your friend is, and I will tell you who you are." In fact, a person is no less defined by friends, but by enemies: "Tell me who your enemy is, and I will tell you who you are." Let us reflect on Stalin through the prism of hatred towards him and fear of his enemies and their lackeys before him.

Attitude towards leaders: tsars, general secretaries, presidents, is an interesting thing because of its, at least outwardly, paradoxical nature. In Russian history there were three great rulers - Ivan the Terrible, Peter I and Joseph Stalin. The most brutal and destructive was the activity of the second: on its board, the decline in population was about 25% (the people of the city, ran up); at the time of Peter's death, the treasury was practically empty, the farm was ruined, and in a few years three ships remained from the fleet of Peter the Great. And this is a great modernizer? In people's memory, Peter remained the Antichrist - the only Russian tsar-antichrist, and this is very significant. But Ivan IV entered history as the Terrible, and his time in the XVII century. remembered as the last decades of peasant freedom. And they did not remember the oprichnina among the people with an almost unkind word - this is already the “merit” of liberal Romanov historians. Stalin, unlike Peter, left behind a great power, on the material foundation of which, including nuclear, we still live, and the Russian Federation is still considered a serious power (even if regional, but without Stalin’s foundation, Afghans and Libyans, no illusions are needed here).

Paradox, but of the three lords, Peter, despite the extreme personal cruelty and disastrous reign, we love power and a significant part of the intelligentsia. He did not get even a tenth of the criticism that liberal historiography and journalism brought down on the heads of Ivan the Terrible and Joseph Stalin. Grozny Tsar did not have a place on the monument "Millennium of Russia", and Peter - in the foreground. What did Peter do that, which did not do Ivan and Joseph? A very simple thing: allowed the top to steal on a particularly large scale, was liberal to the "pranks" of this particular layer. For this he is kind enough to the authorities (the portrait of Peter I in Chernomyrdin’s office is very symbolic) and reflecting her interests, tastes and preferences to a certain segment of historians and publicists. Ivan the Terrible and Stalin were tough and even cruel towards, above all, the top. "Cursed caste!" - these words were spoken by Stalin when he learned that the nomenclature evacuated to Kuibyshev was trying to organize separate schools for its children.

All his life in power, Stalin opposed the "accursed caste", not allowing it to turn into a class. He understood perfectly well how as this transformation “caste” would resist the construction of socialism - this is exactly what Stalin meant when he spoke about the growth of the class struggle as he advanced during the construction of socialism. As perestroika demonstrated, the leader turned out to be absolutely right: already in 1960-s a quasi-class shadow USSR-2 was formed, which, in alliance with the West, destroyed the USSR-1 with all its achievements. At the same time, real discontent of the population was caused by the USSR-2, i.e. deviations from the model, but the interested layers did a clever propaganda trick: they exposed the population of the USSR-2 with its flaws, growing inequality, artificially created deficits, etc. as the original design model of the USSR-1, which must be urgently "reformed."

In Soviet times, both during Stalin's life and after his death, the leader was hated mainly by two power groups (and, accordingly, the soviet intelligentsia groups associated with them). First, this is the part of the Soviet establishment that was charged to the world revolution and whose representatives considered Stalin a traitor to the cause of the world revolution or, at least, a deviator from it. We are talking about the left-globalists-Comintern, for whom Russia, the USSR was only a springboard for the world revolution. Naturally, they could not like either "socialism in one single country" (ie, the revival of the "empire" in the "red version"), or an appeal to the Russian national traditions, which they used to look down upon, or the abolition of 1936, the celebration of November 7 as the First Day of the World Revolution, neither the appearance of the term "Soviet patriotism" in the same 1936, nor much else. It is significant that already in the middle of the 1920-ies G. Zinoviev, the “third Grishka” of Russian history (those who would have numbered what kind of nonentity the fourth would be even if they knew the third), argued the need for the removal of Stalin from the post of General Secretary. "they dislike the Comintern," and one of the main critics of Stalin in 1930 was the high-ranking Comintern functionary O. Pyatnitsky.

The second group of Stalinheenavistavists can be called the “Soviet liberals”. What is a "liberal Soviet"? Of course, this is not a liberal in the classical sense, nor is it a liberal at all - even Nizhe-e-enko-nise-e-enko is not a liberal. The Soviet nomenklatura liberal is an interesting stamp: it is an official who sought to consume more than he was supposed to by the strict rules of the Soviet-nomenclature ranked hierarchical consumption system, and therefore ready to change power for material goods, which tends to go to the West more often and look through the shadows an economy with which it is increasingly merging in social ecstasy.

Today, this is called corruption, but this term is hardly applicable to the Soviet system: corruption is the use of the public sphere for private purposes and interests. The fact of the matter is, however, that in modernity there was no legally fixed distinction between these spheres, since there was no private sphere - “everything is collective, everything is mine”. Speech instead of corruption should go about undermining the system, which for the time being - until the time (until the middle of the 1970-s, when unaccounted oil dollars poured into the country) was quantitative. Thus, it is more correct to talk about the deformation of the system. It was these deformers who hated Stalin most of all, since the nomenklatura and near-nomenklatura thieves understood that with his or similar orders, retribution could not be avoided; Therefore, it was so feared that neostalinist A. would come to power. Shelepina, put on L. Brezhnev - and not lost. It was under the “hero of the Little Land” that the shadow USSR-2 increased (not the shadow economy, but the shadow USSR connected both with its shadow economy and with Western capital, its supranational structures, Western special services), but the shadow under Brezhnev knew its place , waiting for the time being, and from the middle of the 1970-ies, preparing for the jump, but under Gorbachev she took the place of the owner, destroying the front USSR-1. The real USSR at the beginning of the 1980-s was reminiscent of the galactic empire from the Azimov Academy ("Foundation") - a prosperous facade with corroded guts. Only the USSR, in contrast to the empire, did not have the mathematics of Selden with his plan - we had a "mathematician" - Gesheftmatik B. Berezovsky and that says it all. But back to stalinofobii. It quite clearly correlates with consumer attitudes, with attitudes towards consumption as the meaning of life. It is symbolic that one of the "carpet anti-Stalinists" stated on television: you can keep the national idea for yourself, but let me consume it. Can this type not hate Stalin and Stalinism? Can not. Stalinism is a historical work, setting on creativity as the goal and meaning of life, the USSR was a creative, highly spiritual project that even those who clearly do not sympathize with the Soviet Union recognize. The phrase said by former Minister of Education A. is indicative in this respect. Fursenko that the vice (sic!) Of the Soviet school was that she sought to educate the person-creator, while the task of the Eref school was to educate a qualified consumer.

The following is also symbolic. The same character who demanded for himself a “holiday of consumption” expressed himself in the sense that if the land east of the Urals could be mastered by the world government, then let it take them. Thus, the anti-Stalinist installation of consumption coincides with the globalist one — these are two sides of the same coin. So a line is drawn from anti-Stalinism to Smerdykovschina, i.e. to Russophobia. The social world of anti-Stalinists is a global “cattle yard” whose main goal is to ensure consumption under the direction and supervision of world government. Stalin three times tore the construction of such a world on Russian soil, for which the anti-Stalinists hate him. Everything is prosaic, the talk of freedom, democracy, "Soviet totalitarianism" of former Soviet careerists and snitches cannot deceive anyone.

Paradoxically, they turned out to be part of the left (conditionally: "Trotskyists", left globalists) and part of the right (conventionally: "Bukharinites"). In this regard, it becomes clear that the “Trotsky-Bukharin bloc” is not a violation of common sense, but dialectical logic, which Stalin, answering the question of how the left-right bloc is possible, put it this way: “Go left - come right. Go right - you will come to the left. Dialectics ".
The fear of the late Soviet nomenclature of Stalin is the fear of the "shadow USSR" of the original project, the parasite's fear of a healthy body, of retribution from its side, the fear of the people. After 1991, this fear has acquired a new, frank, not hidden, class dimension, which, as the de-Stalinization campaigns demonstrate from time to time, makes this fear panicky, deadly.

The question of the causes of hatred towards Stalin in the West is important. There are two aspects here - practical-political and metaphysical-historical. The practical-political aspect is simple: marrying Stalin, the enemies of Russia and the Russians question our victory in the Great Patriotic War / World War II, and, consequently, the right of the Russian Federation to be among the great powers, whose membership in the club is still largely determined by participation in anti-Hitler’s coalition and role in it.

Equating Stalin to Hitler, and the USSR to the Third Reich, coupled with talk that Stalin is guilty in unleashing a war like Hitler, and perhaps more, works in the same direction - hang on the USSR (and consequently on the Russian Federation) the guilt in unleashing a war, to impose a complex of historical guilt and inferiority. That is, with the practical-political aspect, everything is clear and simple.

More interesting, in my opinion, is the metaphysical and historical aspect of the problem of the causes of hatred of the western elite for Stalin. The fact is that Stalin thwarted three times the plans of this top-right-wing globalists to create a global peace under the auspices of something similar to the world government, the need of which was much talked by by the Warburg, the Rockefellers and their snoops from the intellectual servants. However, in fairness it must be said that the first to talk about the need for something like the world government in the XIX century. The Rothschilds, however, the Russian tsars Alexander I and Nicholas I, under their policies, undermined this opportunity. Hence, the Rothschilds' hatred for the Romanovs - as they say, at the end of the 19th century. one of the Rothschilds declared that peace with the Romanovs and their Russia is impossible for their family.

Stalin did more to crush the "shakes" of global "leaders" called "world government" than all the Russian tsars together, using the contradictions between the right-wing globalists themselves. With the sickle of the Red Empire, he threw three times the sheaves of globalization on the history field of the twentieth century.

For the first time, Stalin did it in the second half of 1920's, more precisely in 1927 – 1929, when his team, relying on the power of the Great System “Russia”, on the assistance of representatives of the intelligence agencies of the Russian empire and on the contradictions among the burzhuins, replaced the project “World revolution” by the project of the “red (socialist) empire”. Finintern, in his plans to create Venice the size of Europe or the world as a whole, had to deploy the “world war” project and lead Hitler to power, in every possible way strengthening a specific state - the Third Reich. As a result of the Anglo-American pumping, which sharply intensified in 1929, in the year of the expulsion of Trotsky from Russia (Stalin’s “farewell bow” to the “world revolution”), Hitler Inc. was able to fight by playing the role of an aggressor in a performance written for him. According to the "play", he was to smash the USSR, and then fall under the blow of the Anglo-Saxons.

However, history is a treacherous lady, everything turned out differently, and Stalin for the second time thwarted the plans of the globalists, defeating Hitler. He was helped by the struggle of Great Britain and the USA, which destroyed not only the Third Reich, but also the Third British Empire during the war (the Second ended with the deposition of the North American states).

For the third time, Stalin thwarted the plans of the globalists by the fact that the USSR was with him, not allowing the Marshall plan sticking around his neck, created a nuclear shield and sword and recovered not for 20, as Western experts predicted, but for 10 years, turning at the turn of 1940– 1950's superpower.

Stalin is a designer and general designer of a single geohistorical project that can be opposed to globalism — neo-imperial one. At the beginning of the twentieth century. the globalist (capitalist) project of the Anglo-Saxons - the British Empire and the United States - was faced with the fact of the existence of empires, which, by virtue of their existence, prevented the implementation of their project. The main of these four empires were two - German and Russian. They were set against each other, and then broken, using and reinforcing internal contradictions. World War I - the terminator of the Eurasian empires. For about a decade everything went as planned, but at the end of 1920's, the process went out of control: Stalin's team took over both the left and the right (for both, Russia was an appendage of the West, a bundle of brushwood in the bourgeois hearth) and even in 10 years, it built a red empire with a powerful military-industrial complex - it built it using global trends and global contradictions, which it set for itself. Stalin found the golden key to the secret door of the burzhuinov-globalists - the profit that one part of them could get by investing in the USSR by competing with the other part.

Stalin - the author and creator of the only successful anti-globalization project of the twentieth century. He clearly showed what could be opposed to globalists and how to deal with them. If we consider the year of the collapse of the globalist project in the USSR in its “world-revolutionary form” 1929 (the closure of the NEP, which closely linked the USSR to globalization - left-right dialectics), then it can be said that Stalin postponed the advent of globalization on 60 years - until Gorbachev’s final delivery on Malta 2 – 3 December 1989, everything and everything. It is clear that such a "World Game Home" will never be able to. Moreover, Stalin demonstrated the technology to combat them, making a bid to deploy his game and his economy, including an alternative world market and undermining the dollar's position. Here, the globalists should have exclaimed as one of the Russian poets of the 18th century: “Do you really love the old man?” Of course, it is impossible. They are such an "old man" as Uncle Joe or Old Joe, as the Anglo-Saxons called Stalin, you can not love - just hate. Considering the above, the analysis of Stalinism and the Soviet experience, the obligatory historical criticism of the first and second, the work on the mistakes is the most urgent task for us.

There is one more interesting twist of the anti-Stalinist campaigns in the West (and the fifth column is actively working in this direction) —the equation of Stalinism and Hitlerism, the practical-political aspect of which was discussed above. But there is an even more interesting aspect. I agree with those analysts who point out the similarity of the goal-setting of the current global elite and the Nazi elite: both proceed from the need for a radical reduction in the world's population, both are fans of order and neo-Orden structures of global governance; both are anti-Christian. The Third Reich was not an alternative to globalism; it was a means of global elites (quite benefiting from the implementation of the Third Reich project — primarily materially) and at the same time a brutal experiment to establish a new world order (after which a soft one could be implemented).

Stalinist neo-imperial anti-capitalism was an alternative to both Hitler and Anglo-Saxon "new order". That is why Stalinism is trying not only to equate with Hitlerism, but to present it even more rigid totalitarianism than this last one. Thus, first, the similarity of Hitler’s new order and the “new world order” of post-war Anglo-Saxon globalists camouflages; secondly, the only real alternative to (capitalist) globalism and stopping History in the spirit of the “3 D” program (deindustrialization, depopulation, derationalization of consciousness and behavior), which hundreds of “thought factories” are ordering, are being removed from the agenda. This alternative is neo-imperial on an anti-capitalist basis.

The stronger the resistance to globalism, the more actively the figure of Stalin and the historical experience of the USSR will be recalled, which, of course, cannot and should not be restored or repeated. Stalin made mistakes, sometimes quite annoying. Yes, it is the fault of a number of processes and phenomena - the wine that it shares with its time. But this is the fate of all statesmen. Are there not guilt among British and American politicians? Even as it is, and it doesn’t compare with the negative aspect of Stalin’s activities. Who ordered the nuclear bombardment of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, although there was no military need for this? Who ordered the bombing of Kampuchea, killing about a million people - in order to obscure this fact, Pol Pot was “added on” an extra million and a half victims and began shouting to the whole world about the atrocities of the Kampuchean communists. But about almost 1 million Hutus and Tutsis and about 2 million people in neighboring countries, carved out in the 1990s with the connivance of (at least) the world top, i.e. Western and African capitalists for some reason keep quiet. And only when it became necessary to use genocide in the center of Africa, these “dances for the glory of monsters” (as one of the best books about these events is called) as a means for striking 2 – 3 to dozens of representatives of the world elite, i.e. for internal clashes, the massacre was recalled later on by 18 years, and on August 17 on 2012, the corresponding lawsuit was filed with the chief prosecutor of the International Court of Justice. Examples can be multiplied, but the situation is clear without it.

... Once Stalin remarked: there is a logic of intentions and there is a logic of circumstances, and the logic of circumstances is stronger than the logic of intentions. There are intentions for some forces, layers to denigrate Stalin and the Soviet past, hiding in this blackness many negative and sometimes disastrous results of post-soviet, lack of talent of management, inability to historical creativity (what kind of creativity? This is a vice, and the task is to educate qualified consumers to stupid bathed in wretched consumption and did not think about anything).

But there are circumstances. These circumstances are the real life of the Russian Federation on the eve of a new round of privatization reforms; This circumstance of the budget for 2013 is a budget that sows doubts about the fact that the Russian Federation is a “welfare state”; These are the circumstances of the reduction of the cumulative part of the pension from 1% from salary to 2013% planned from 6 in January 2 (is this not the liquidation of the pension system?); these are the circumstances of the decline in the population of the Russian Federation and its slipping into the raw materials appendages of the West compared with not only the USSR, but even the Russian Empire; this and more. It is these circumstances that serve as the background and object of comparison with the Stalin era. The reforms that were carried out in the Russian Federation since 1992 were the best advertisement for Stalin and his era, the argument in their favor, and Stalin’s success was not accidental - despite the denounced by “scavengers” - in the “Name of Russia” competition. This success, based on the achievements of the Stalin era, both material and social, on the Great Style and the Big Strategy of the era, very much frightened many at the top. The competition showed that the leader was not mistaken: the Wind of History not only swept up the garbage from his grave, but also blew away the pygmies who were shitting on it. Contrary to denigration, the name of Stalin became “the name of Russia,” formally, not the first, but it took a long time to lead (and we understand everything).

Since the “Name of Russia” competition has passed, time has passed, but fears do not pass, new ones are added to them - before the revolution. Not so long ago, a high-ranking official, apparently persuading himself, said that Russia could not once again survive the turn to the left (mass nationalization, etc.). And then he warned those who, with their unwise policy, provoke such events: if the mood in society changes, then any attempt to influence it (apparently implied - to influence by force) will lead to very bad consequences: because if you influence, it will immediately revolution, that's all (this “that's all” is worth a lot). However, a few days later another high-ranking official bravo reassured his colleague: no one would allow the scenario of “color revolutions”, for example, “orange”.

I can not help but be distracted by the “lyrical digression”: the officials' confidence that they are the rulers of the historical element is touching. I will not forget how, in 1995, Mr. V. Chernomyrdin declared that Russia had exhausted the limit on revolution, believing that it could speak on behalf of Russian history. Not every statesman can afford this, well, let alone the hero of the era of timeliness all the more. How do you need to break away from reality, to blurt out such inadequate? O. Markeev said good about the ruling layer of 1990-s, comparing them with a flock of penguins, who settled on the tip of the iceberg and think that they control his movement, although they really do not know about the direction of the ocean currents, but also about their existence . However, is this typical only for 1990's?

In real history, as N. Mandelstam rightly remarked, “the winner is the one who caught the general tendencies of history and managed to use them”, i.e. one who understands the direction of currents in the ocean. Stalin spoke about it in a different way: to saddle the laws of history, but the essence is the same. In other words, revolutions happen or do not happen, not by the wishes or spells of clerks and small proprietors, who are brought into power, but even very large figures. Revolutions are driven by other forces.

Further. If a revolution is possible in Russia, then in no way is orange - red. Moreover, this latter will be a reaction to something more terrible than a revolution. A revolution is something structured and developing within certain limits, it is an Order arising from Chaos. This Chaos itself is a reaction of a huge and outwardly amorphous, viscous mass to an alien aggressiveness towards it. Once K. Pobedonostsev noticed that Russia is a viscous country: neither the revolution nor the reaction do not end here (as if having overheard, the group "Nautilus-Pompilius sang:" In this country, viscous as dirt, / you can become fat you can be gone »). But the amorphousness and viscosity of these seem to be so from the West-centric point of view. In fact, the mass has a hard, hidden from the west-centered view frame. This is the Big System "Russia". Representatives of the authorities in Russia, as a rule, either understood this badly or did not understand it at all, the exception is Stalin. Yes, the mass itself in Russia / in Russia did not generate power pyramids, they were brought in from the outside - from the Horde, from the XVIII century. - from the West. “The rulers always introduced the idea of ​​a pyramid from the outside,” wrote O. Markeev, “fascinated by the order and splendor of the overseas capitals. Not they, but the mass itself decided whether to envelop it with life-giving mucus, feed it to the summit with life-giving juices or reject it, allowing it to live on its own, in order to suddenly and unexpectedly destroy it with one powerful impulse with the waking energy of the womb [...]

The chaos of troubled times, including the one we have been experiencing since the 1990s, is in many ways deceptive. Here is a look at the practice from a very far from scientific environment. The legendary killer Lesha the soldier / Alexei Sherstobitov in a serious book “Liquidator” writes about 1990's: “Slowly I began to understand the chaos surrounding me and paid attention to the harmony of his order - because it is chaos that creates great not only works, but also large-scale things from infrastructures to the universe. As such (chaotic. - A.F.) they seem to be due to a misunderstanding (by an observer. - A.F.) of the rationality of the order of things and the formulas by which they are created. Moreover, [...] even the possession of knowledge does not guarantee good luck in organizing the chaotic movement, and even having considered it in detail and seemingly understood everything, is unable to describe it. ” What can we say about not possessing knowledge and considering any reality, including Russian, through the prism of the Western order. It is clear that through such a prism any reality will be chaos - that is why almost all the reforms in Russia have been counterproductive, and the result has brought Stalin’s breakthrough.

A propos: Westernism today is a kind of social necrophilia. Striving as a model for imitation, to the orders of such a society, which is drowning in the pus of vice, is immobilized by social impotence and is not able to preserve neither racial, nor historical, nor religious identity, i.e. seized by the will to death, is nothing other than cultural-historical necrophilia, let us leave the dead to bury their dead. Those who call us to the “civilized world” want to lead us to the cemetery, or, at best, to the garbage of the “field of miracles” in the “land of fools”. Hitting this trash, and in the peripheral-third world version, was blocked by Stalin and his team in the 1930-s, and the inertia was enough until the 1980-s. Europe, about which one could speak Arthur Rambo’s words as a place: “... where is the baby / In the fragrant twilight before the flute is drained, / Involuntarily saddened and listening to silence, / In a hurry for the boat, like a moth of fragile” is long gone. Europe (and the West as a whole) today is more like a goblin reserve, only goblins are mostly non-native people themselves (although there are enough local goblins): Konradov's "heart of darkness" now beats in Europe - retribution for centuries of colonial plunder has come. But these are their problems - the problems of a “nobody’s house”; “Nobody's house” - one British journalist named the Great Britain since Thatcher since the Times, but the same can be said about the whole of Europe. "Nobody's House" - this is the ideal of globalists, which several times in the twentieth century. hooked Stalin: USSR was a common home.

Returning to the scheme of the pyramid and the masses, I note: only such a pyramid that meets the well-established forms of the collective unconscious and responds to them, is able to function normally in Russia, relying on an invisible frame. He understood this very well, moreover, Stalin felt. “Reforms are inevitable,” he wrote, “but in due time. And these should be organic reforms, [...] based on traditions with a gradual restoration of Orthodox self-consciousness (I wonder if these are the frantic Stalin detractors from the Russian Orthodox Church? - AF). Very soon, wars over territories will be replaced by “cold” wars — for resources and energy. We must be prepared for this. ”

This passage is worth a lot. Not only did the leader predict wars for resources that unfolded at the turn of the 20th – 21st centuries, he noted the need for reforms in the psychosphere, realizing that hostilities would shift over time and that reforms should be based on tradition (on the conscious and unconscious) , and not reject or break it. This is exactly what 1991 has been actively involved in by many of our media outlets, especially TV, however, without the success that it was counted on and often counterproductively, embittering the population, and, in fact, pushing for a “powerful impetus with the womb”. Of course, a significant part of moral guidelines and imperatives was destroyed during these 20 years - just like in 20 years preceding 1917. We see many manifestations of moral crisis, and, nevertheless, the task of destroying the Russian psychosphere, psychohistory is not solved by our opponent ( even computer shooters do not act on our children, like on western ones - due to differences in laughter culture). And it is not for nothing that officials fear the anti-liberal revolution “and everything”, the liberal “pyramid” (in both senses of the word) has remained alien, alien and hostile to the mass of the population, feeling itself infringed. As the group "Lyube" sang: "And for the fact that they have offended Russia, / Emelyan Pugachev will not forgive." The “lower world” always played a much larger role in Russian history than it was perceived and were ready to recognize the “bar” - terribly far from the people, the West-oriented authorities and professorial science. What can you advise these guys? Read carefully the Russian history and the works of Nobel laureate Ilya Prigogine about chaos, dissipative structures, self-organization and complexity. However, is it too late to “drink Borjomi”?

Not the revolution (especially on spirohetoznye belolentochnyh legs), we must not fear the new Stalin, but something more abruptly and terrible, known in Russian history under the name "Pugachev", i.e. mass reaction to an alien pyramid. One should not think that the times of the Pugachev region have passed - in the Big System “Russia” they will never pass, only the form can change. Pugachev and the “village of Plodomasovo” (N. Leskov) is the ever-present dimension of Russian life, so to speak, its parallel Lower World (Nav, Hel). It easily breaks into the Middle World, since the defensive lines of the latter in Russian life — the material substance, accumulated labor, property, and law — are historically weak. And today, they are repeatedly weakened by the unjust (to put it mildly, and if not softly, then the thieves', predatory) nature of property formation in 1990. And, who knows, will not the only one capable of taming the new breakthrough, the Chaos revolution and the new Stalin. Stalin was, along with Lenin, the Chaos tamer through the revolution, and then, independently, the tamer of the revolution (with globalization prevented) through the red empire of “anti-capitalism in one separate country” (by the way, N. noted delicately Mandelstam in the "Second Book"). And, how to know if the new authorities will not have to push-assemble-construct the power itself, of course, if the self-preservation instinct has not completely atrophied, struck by alien and alien information flows, thought forms, memes and conceptual viruses. In the work “Order from chaos” I. Prigogine and I. Stengers give the following example. The microscopic flat trematode worm, parasitizing in the liver of a sheep and self-reproducing there, does not get there on its own, but with an ant swallowed by a sheep, into which the trematode must first fall. However, even after this the likelihood that a sheep will swallow an infected ant is very small. The parasite, however, “solves” the problem in a simple, but inexplicable way for scientists, turning the small probability into the maximum. “It is possible to say with good reason,” the authors of The Order from Chaos write, “that the trematode“ takes possession ”of the body of its master. It penetrates the ant's brain and forces its prey to behave in a suicidal way: the enslaved ant instead of remaining on the ground climbs the stalk of the plant and, waiting at the very tip of the leaf, waits for a sheep. ” It is possible that the ant "seems" to be free in his behavior or even to "direct" by swaying the stalk (cf. penguins at the tip of the iceberg). In fact, he is a servant of trematode, who “put” into his brain a false and murderous for him “concept” of behavior that completely eliminates a sense of self-preservation. Put in place the “concept” of “controlled chaos” of “market reforms” and “human rights” - read S. Manna - and the "oil painting" will be clear. It is not by chance that in information wars, the first blow is delivered to the psychosphere of the ruling stratum, especially its protective and immune structures (ideology and special services) - in this regard, the story of the “Encyclopedia” in France of the 18th century. very instructive.

But back to taming Chaos, if it arises. To solve this problem, the new Stalin will have to throw the crowd, or as they used to say in Russia, to “give away by head” some, perhaps a significant part of the unjustly fattened ones, getting the most odious of them from anywhere - huch from abroad, huch from the devil's ass, huch from Kuyalnik and letting the rest "join our movement." How to know if the de-Stalinisers will not have to pray for the coming of Stalin, having heard the heavy tread of a black man, and not an Esenin one - from a mirror, in a cylinder and with a cane, and Lermontovsky - real, with damask in his hand. Such a "black man" - this is not "a delirium of intelligence services, the horror of emergency" (M. Voloshin), it will be more serious. He can bring with him a moment of truth to clarify the relationship between intentions and circumstances, the final solution to the question of their "negative dialectics." And it is necessary, paraphrasing A. Blok, to ask: "Stalin, give us a hand, / Help in a mute struggle."
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  1. Vladimirets
    Vladimirets 17 February 2013 10: 01
    -50
    Article set -. I am not a supporter of the indiscriminate stoning of Stalin, but frankly, the justification of all his actions looks unconvincing. Particularly surprised by the comparison with Peter I and Ivan the Terrible. Is it after Peter that there is nothing left? Well, you know ... Yes, Stalin left an industrial country with an atomic bomb and a powerful economy, but he accepted the Empire, and to say that the Russian Empire in 1917 looked like boyar Rus before Peter was somehow wrong. Stalin, like all outstanding personalities who influenced the course of world history, was an extraordinary man, certainly strong and charismatic, but not all of his actions deserve approval, which the author actually tries to achieve in his article.
    1. Dinver
      Dinver 17 February 2013 10: 06
      +40
      Joseph Vissarionovich was a strategist, like Peter the Great, they thought about future generations not sparing their contemporaries, and they both killed a lot of people, but they did this not out of their selfish interests but for the benefit of future generations!
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 17 February 2013 10: 19
        +25
        Quote: Dinver
        they thought about future generations not sparing their contemporaries, and they both killed many people, but they did this not out of their selfish interests, but for the benefit of future generations!

        Oh, in what, in what, and in selfish interests it’s difficult to blame them, in both trousers both ended their way.
        1. Komodo
          Komodo 17 February 2013 11: 04
          +28
          They say that Stalin only had a pair of well-worn boots and found a pair of uniforms after his death ... Just imagine for a moment what it is like to rule a country like Russia. I’ve been doing my business here for two years. I have already turned gray all over.
          1. Deniska999
            Deniska999 17 February 2013 12: 06
            +18
            And after death on the savings book there was no more than 900 rubles with that money.
            1. DYMITRY
              DYMITRY 17 February 2013 12: 55
              +44
              Quote: Deniska999
              And after death on the savings book there was no more than 900 rubles with that money.

              Huge fees for publishing his works in many countries of the world and in huge print runs, so Staldin transferred his name to the prize fund. I recall the Stalin Prize of the 1st degree was 100 rubles. 000,00nd degree 2 rubles. 50rd degree 000,00 rubles. And the Stalin Prize was awarded for the most extensive list of achievements. And Stalin paid all this from his own pocket. Not a penny came from the budget !!! With such expenses, where does the money for the second pair of trousers come from?
              1. Bekzat
                Bekzat 20 February 2013 10: 23
                0
                Greetings to all, for DyMitria, is that true? You can give a link, read.
            2. Gur
              Gur 18 February 2013 08: 57
              +4
              After the arrival of Khrushchev, when it was decided to take Stalin out of the mausoleum, he even took off a festive uniform with golden buttons, considered it a waste and buried in the usual.
        2. Alexander 1958
          Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 11: 49
          +13
          Quote: Vladimirets
          in one pants both ended their journey.

          This is true only for Stalin, but Peter 1 .. Did he give up property before entering the throne? winked
          Alexander 1958
          1. sams
            sams 17 February 2013 15: 27
            +4
            Comparing Stalin and Peter 1 is certainly not correct.
            An interesting short film about Peter.
            I do not agree with all the statements from this film, but in general it is true.
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 18: 20
              +10
              Quote: sams
              An interesting short film about Peter.

              It’s a very educational film, but do you think Peter's supporters will be impressed, there’s nothing to shake their foundation, the history textbook of high school
            2. speedy
              speedy 17 February 2013 23: 05
              +11
              I must upset, dear Sams - all the film's references to "Veles's book" and quotes from "her" are the authors' fantasies, in the original source this is not even close. I read the first two editions of 1993 and 1995. in the version of "vlesovitsy" (original font) with interlinear translation. There is no Atlantis, no war with China (as in the film). "Veles's book" in the original source, is the history of the Russian people, the history of the migrations of its ethnic core, including the Great Migration of Nations, the history of the conquest of India, the creation of the state of Iran, relations with the Goths, opposition to the Greeks in the Crimea and the northern Black Sea region. It was written in the middle of the 9th century by the Magi, but not Novgorod, but rather Kiev, for on one of the fragments of the board of this book there is the phrase "Rurik and Askold walk along the Dnieper in boats, call us to the war with the Khazars, but we will not give them our young men and their life are priceless "- these are the words of the southern Russian leaders of the Slavs demoralized by the Khazar defeat. The Magi themselves in this book say that this book was written to testify to their opponents - Greeks, preachers of Christianity - about the antiquity and glory of our kind ... Modern editions of this "book" are pure fakes, having nothing to do with the original source - a tool for recruiting neopagans and dividing patriotic Russian youth. We know who is doing this - Masonic roots - they dug, met ... Do not get caught in the "secret history", but if you are interested, work with primary sources. And about Stalin, I agree with the author on everything, except for the need for a new revolution from below - the GDP will rule everything "from above" by getting rid of its Trotsky and Bukharins, there will be a holiday of purification on our street, and although now "not the 37th", but this is for now, because it's already a pity.
              1. sleepy
                sleepy 18 February 2013 02: 54
                +14
                Quote: short-term
                "... VVP will settle everything" from above "by getting rid of its Trotsky and Bukharins, there will be a holiday of purification and
                although now "not the 37th", but this is so far, because it is already a Pity. "


                You need to start with something - time goes and goes ...
                Maybe a new finance minister is needed?
                Stalin had no problems with his finance minister, not that now ...
                Here is an example of how Comrade I. Stalin found himself Commissar of Finance.
                Arseny Zvereva.

                “Stalin had an amazing, just bestial nose for sensible personnel; very often he promoted people upstairs,
                not yet had time to clearly express themselves.
                Former worker of "Trekhgorki" and the commander of the cavalry platoon Zverev - from among them.
                In 1937, he worked only as a secretary of one of the district committees of Moscow.
                But he had a higher financial education and the experience of a professional financier.
                In the conditions of a wild lack of personnel (chairs were vacated almost daily) this turned out to be enough,
                so that Zverev became the first deputy people's commissar of finance of the USSR, and after 3 months already the people's commissar.
                Like all good accountants, he was very stubborn and unyielding. Zverev dared to argue even with Stalin.
                And here is an indicator of attitude; The leader not only let this go, but often agreed with his commissar ...

                ... War is not only won battles and battles.
                Without money, any, even the most heroic army is not able to move.
                (Few people know, for example, that the state generously paid its soldiers the perfect deeds.
                For a downed single-engine plane, the pilot was paid a thousand, for a twin-engine plane - two ... the tank was estimated at 500 rubles.) ...
                ... The undoubted merit of the Stalinist People's Commissar is that he managed to quickly transfer the economy
                on military rails and save, keep on the edge of the abyss the financial system ...

                ... Already from the middle of the war Zverev began to gradually restore the country's economy.
                Due to the regime of the most severe economy, he achieved a deficit-free budget for 1944 and 1945
                and completely refused emission ...
                ... Of all the warring countries, Russia was the first to restore its economy and improve the monetary system;
                and this is the undoubted merit of Minister Zverev ...
                ... Simultaneously with the reform, the authorities abolished the card system and rationing;
                although in England, for example, cards lasted until the early 1950s.
                At the insistence of Zverev, prices for basic goods and products were maintained at the ration level.
                (It’s another matter that they managed to raise them before.) As a result, the products began to drop in price sharply on collective farm markets ...
                ... Incidentally, the changes for the better did not end there.
                Every year and for some reason, on April 1 (this tradition will be broken only in 1991), the government lowered prices
                (Pavlov and Gorbachev, on the contrary, raised them).
                From 1947 to 1953, prices for beef decreased 2,4 times, for milk - 1,3 times, for butter - 2,3 times.
                The total weight of the food basket fell 1,75 times during this time; for nothing
                that no comparison was made with the one that Yeltsin would already establish in our time.
                I mean, the Stalinist basket was much more spacious ...
                ... Knowing all this, it’s very interesting to listen to liberal publicists telling horrors today.
                about the post-war economy. No, life in those days in abundance and satiety, of course, did not differ.
                The only question is what to compare ...
                ... The name Arseny Zvereva today is known only to a narrow circle of specialists;
                it never sounds among the creators of victory.
                This is unfair ... ".

                http://cccp-revivel.blogspot.ru/2013/01/o-stalinskom-narkome-arsenii-zvereve.htm

                l
                1. DYMITRY
                  DYMITRY 18 February 2013 08: 17
                  +1
                  Quote: sleepy
                  Due to the regime of the most severe economy, he achieved a deficit-free budget for 1944 and 1945
                  and completely refused emission ...

                  I’ll fix it a bit: the fiscal year 1945 ended with a budget surplus of 4,3%
      2. kush62
        kush62 17 February 2013 11: 24
        +4
        Dinver
        Joseph Vissarionovich was a strategist, like Peter the Great, they thought about future generations not sparing their contemporaries, and they both killed a lot of people, but they did this not out of their selfish interests but for the benefit of future generations!

        It’s always good to be kind at someone else’s expense. For example, Dinver, like many of us, wants our grandchildren and great-grandchildren to live well. So let's shoot him and his children, in the name of a bright life for future generations. This is approximately the argument of those who want to go to heaven. Let it be bad now, then (who will confirm?) It will be good. But is it not better now that it is good and then not bad. I am not speaking out against Stalin and Dinver personally. And against such excuses for any injustices. The article put a plus, written sensibly. Right or wrong, everyone has an opinion on this.
      3. shasherin_pavel
        shasherin_pavel 17 February 2013 12: 23
        +20
        dinver: When Stalin made a speech at 41 to the country, he noted that now we have no superiority either in people, or in territories, or in human resources, When he attacked near Moscow, he said: Take care of people, we have very few of them ... When Putin became president, his words: "We now have twice as many people as Stanin in 37." And then there were 2 million people. Have you noticed that we have millions in prisons? On the other hand, those who were shot in jail write and defended 3 doctoral dissertations, although now these doctoral dissertations are baked like mushrooms for money, but the thought that they, having committed a firing offense, continue to eat our bread and do not cough.
      4. ziqzaq
        ziqzaq 17 February 2013 12: 48
        +13
        Quote: Dinver

        Joseph Vissarionovich was a strategist, like Peter the Great, they thought about future generations not sparing their contemporaries, and they both killed a lot of people, but they did this not out of their selfish interests but for the benefit of future generations!

        That's it, they thought about the country, and now .... I hope that a new Joseph Vissarionovich will come and finally restore order
        1. baltika-18
          baltika-18 17 February 2013 15: 45
          +3
          Quote: ziqzaq
          I hope that a new Joseph Vissarionovich will come and finally restore order

          Author rights figure will be abruptly Stalin.
          1. sleepy
            sleepy 18 February 2013 03: 12
            +7
            Quote: Dinver
            "Joseph Vissarionovich was a strategist, like Peter the First, they thought about future generations,
            not sparing their contemporaries, both of them killed a lot of people, but they didn’t do it out of their selfish interests,
            but for the benefit of future generations! "
            .

            "Thought about future generations" is incompatible with "killed a lot of people."
            Another thing is that the people themselves, and not just the literary P. Korchagin did not spare yourself.
            About I. Stalin's strategic thinking:
            after the war, he was offered to shoot all those who were in German captivity.
            They say the war is over, and new women are giving birth. After all, among the former prisoners there were probably "zaslanets"
            and start a case, appoint an investigator, interview witnesses, raise archival documents,
            transporting 4 and a half million former prisoners across the country to confrontation is unprofitable for the budget.
            So they invited I. Stalin to shoot all the former Soviet prisoners of war, because Stalin did not respect the Germans, did not meet with bread and salt, he brought Hitler elected by the German people to suicide,
            and shoot his own him once to sign a leaflet and all ---- it’s business.
            Unfortunately, Stalin proposed another option, although it looked like this, that he spared compatriots.
            He proposed to send former prisoners of war under supervision, and SMERSH entrusted the work on the implemented agents,
            it was not up to them to beat out testimony with arms and legs, but to work with captured German sources and archives.
            Subsequently, many former prisoners of war returned without resentment,
            but many returned cops and thieves still do not hate Stalin.
      5. Alew
        Alew 22 February 2013 20: 45
        -1
        Here we are now enjoying these benefits and for whom so many Russians have been destroyed about the people. What doesn’t people history teach
      6. Corsair5912
        Corsair5912 23 February 2013 22: 18
        0
        Tsar Peter was a clinical idiot who crawled before the West and was not interested in any future generations.
        To destroy 25% of the population for the introduction of drunkenness, smoking, shaving beards, short pants and caftans, for the sake of building in the swamp of an unnecessary city, only an unintelligent person can
    2. Komodo
      Komodo 17 February 2013 10: 23
      +47
      Repression, repression - if you collect all those who have been convicted of corruption today, those who are waging an information war for Western money, those who are trying to crawl in the Caucasus (Bachabites, drug lords), those who, with their ... and frank traitors, thieves, criminals and all in one year to shoot. That's what turns thirty-seventh year.
      But how much easier it will become to breathe later. And now we just do not have enough eggs to do what Stalin did. Even just replanting or sending out is not enough strength.
      1. Atlon
        Atlon 17 February 2013 13: 06
        -2
        Quote: Komodo
        But how much easier it will become to breathe later.

        Will ... Just add here also everyone who stole "spikelets", and I think there will be 100% of the total population. Who stole bolts and nuts from the factory, slats from the sawmill, from the thread factory, etc. So it will be really easy to breathe! Only ... there is no one ...
        I am for harsh measures and for tightening the nuts. Just before demanding the 37th year, answer each to himself: "And you have nothing to send to the camps?"
        1. Komodo
          Komodo 17 February 2013 13: 15
          +7
          I think this is my opinion, the processes with spikelets and bolts, if any, were of a demonstrational nature. And then the press and the people passed it all by word of mouth, and such processes are designed for this. Not a bad method, by the way.
          1. wax
            wax 17 February 2013 15: 18
            +15
            Komodo
            You are right in many ways. Here I will tell you a "funny" case from my dktstvo. The scene is the town of Zhizdra, Kaluga region. After the war. On our street Bryanskaya there was (and still is) a bakery. So, one day a bakery worker quietly loaded two sacks of flour (which is clearly more than "three ears of wheat") on a cart, covered it with straw and drove down the street. He drove about half a street, and he was turned back, the bags were unloaded. He himself was taken away somewhere. At the end of the day, he returned home. He was immediately fired from the bakery, that's all. Because, as they said, "not all of them were at home" -
            But it was possible for 10 years and to curry favor with the authorities. So, those who were in the field, and formed the situation, somewhere turned out to be oloch, and somewhere normal people.
          2. SASCHAmIXEEW
            SASCHAmIXEEW 18 February 2013 20: 25
            +4
            I also think that this was not everywhere. I think that for intimidation, and then, in what year and who did it. In the organs before and there were more zhidosionists who could simply do this because of hatred of the Russians !!!
        2. vjatsergey
          vjatsergey 17 February 2013 14: 34
          +10
          and I’m ready to sit down for any trifle, but just let at least one thief who has stolen from a billion or more be in the cell with me
          1. Egoza
            Egoza 17 February 2013 18: 32
            +1
            Quote: vjatsergey
            but just let at least one thief steal from a billion or more in the cell with me

            Here is a bummer, sir! He will have "three-room apartments" with openwork lattice on the windows! laughing
            1. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 19: 02
              +2
              Unfortunately, one who has stolen a billion or more WILL NOT BE SITING IN THE CAMERA, even in three-room apartments with an openwork lattice!
              1. sleepy
                sleepy 18 February 2013 03: 22
                +3
                1926 Criminal Code of the RSFSR
                (as amended on March 1, 1957) (expired in connection with the adoption of the 1961 Penal Code)
                162. The secret theft of another's property (theft) entails:

                a) committed without the use of any technical means, for the first time and without collusion with other persons, -
                imprisonment or forced labor for up to three months;
                perfect under the same conditions, but due to need and unemployment,
                in order to meet the minimum needs of his or her family, -
                corrective labor for up to three months;

                b) committed repeatedly, or in relation to property,
                obviously necessary for the existence of the victim, -

                imprisonment for up to six months;

                c) committed using technical means or repeatedly, or by prior conspiracy
                with other persons, as well as, although without the specified conditions, committed at stations, marinas,
                steamboats in cars and hotels, -
                imprisonment for up to one year;

                d) committed by a private person from state and public warehouses, wagons, ships and other storage facilities
                or in the places of public use specified in the preceding paragraph, by applying technical means or by conspiracy with other persons, or repeatedly, as well as committed, even without these conditions, by a person who had special access to these warehouses or who protected them, or during a fire or flood or other public calamity -
                imprisonment for up to two years or forced labor for up to one year;

                e) committed from state and public warehouses and storage facilities by a person who had special access to or protected them, by using technical means or repeatedly, or in agreement with other persons,
                as well as any theft from the same warehouses and vaults, with especially large amounts of stolen goods, -
                imprisonment for up to five years;

                f) petty theft, regardless of its size, committed at an enterprise or institution - is punishable by imprisonment for a period of one year, if by its nature it does not entail a heavier punishment under the law. [Decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the RSFSR of August 16, 1940 ("News of the Soviets of Workers' Deputies of the USSR" No. 190 of August 17, 1940)].
                ______________
                See the Decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the USSR of January 10, 1955 "On criminal liability for petty embezzlement of state and public property"


                But now - I stole two loaves of need - to prison.
                Stole 200 million from the budget - to Spain.

                The history of the destruction of the region’s economy - maybe, remember? ..
                http://www.nabludatel.ru/new/2012/06/18/istoriya-unichtozheniya-ekonomiki-oblast
                i-mozhet-vspomnim /
                1. SASCHAmIXEEW
                  SASCHAmIXEEW 18 February 2013 20: 39
                  +2
                  If you compare this code and what was under Brezhnev, day and night, Stalin and his code are a teacher in a pioneer camp!
              2. DYMITRY
                DYMITRY 18 February 2013 08: 20
                +1
                Quote: Strategia
                Unfortunately, one who has stolen a billion or more WILL NOT BE SITING IN THE CAMERA, even in three-room apartments with an openwork lattice!

                Hodor is sitting, and moreover on common grounds. And he stole a lot more than a billion.
                1. Strategia
                  Strategia 18 February 2013 16: 06
                  +2
                  He is not imprisoned for theft, but for greed: he did not share. Besides, he is also "political". By the way, the number of dollar billionaires has reached 131.
          2. SASCHAmIXEEW
            SASCHAmIXEEW 18 February 2013 20: 29
            0
            I will be happy to keep you company, but ..... you have to wait a long time !!!
      2. Zmey_2Garin
        Zmey_2Garin 17 February 2013 13: 52
        +5
        Komodo,
        I think exactly the same - the power in Russia now has "not strong eggs". Oh, what a pity that "all the steam goes to the whistle"!
        1. Atlon
          Atlon 17 February 2013 14: 02
          +7
          Quote: Zmey_2Garin
          I think in the same way - in power in Russia now "not strong eggs"

          And all around they are shouting that there is an authoritarian regime in Russia, and "bloody gebnya" in power ... However, it seems to me that this is not a question of eggs, it is a question of modern reality. and the lack (so far) of strength (physical) in modern Russia. we cannot arrange repressions now (although we really want to!), THERE WILL BE A GREAT REACTION. Both inside and outside.
      3. krisostomus
        krisostomus 17 February 2013 14: 54
        -18
        Why is it gentlemen, you breathe so "unevenly" in relation to homosexuals, well, almost through the commentary remember them?
        1. sergey32
          sergey32 17 February 2013 16: 41
          +9
          krisostomus,
          Yes, because these creatures have already captured Europe (geyropu), poisoned young Europeans with their views, and now they have set their sights on Russia. But here they break off bitterly, we will not allow it.
        2. Strategia
          Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 49
          +3
          Something you ask the question as if you are hoping to find a partner on this site.
        3. AlNikolaich
          AlNikolaich 17 February 2013 21: 44
          +9
          But for us, husbands and fathers it doesn’t work out differently. Well, we do not love them! and that’s it! More in the picture ...
          1. sleepy
            sleepy 18 February 2013 03: 33
            +10
            Well, we do not like these ...
          2. Gur
            Gur 18 February 2013 09: 35
            +5
            We don’t like it, but we tolerate it, the floor of Moscow (of course, not labor) is explicit and hidden puyury, the whole poppin beau monde with spoiled carvings, well, they don’t get it differently, everything is through the bed, and there you’ll be lucky. So citizens need to be activated, stigmatized, and especially zealous with a hot iron. Otherwise, they will break through.
        4. Cheloveck
          Cheloveck 17 February 2013 23: 41
          +2
          Quote: krisostomus
          Why is it gentlemen, you breathe so "unevenly" in relation to homosexuals, well, almost through the commentary remember them?

          Is this a painful question for you?
          Would you like to talk about it? laughing
          1. sleepy
            sleepy 18 February 2013 03: 31
            +1
            Quote: Cheloveck
            "Is this a painful question for you?
            Do you want to talk about it? "


            This is a painful question.
            The child comes from school, hugged at a break buddy on his shoulders - now do not otmazatsya from the label.
            Schoolgirls show off kissing during breaks - "We are lesbians!"
            And before, nobody paid attention to it,
            until Milon came ...
      4. Orik
        Orik 18 February 2013 00: 06
        0
        I agree with the list, only who will execute it ?!
      5. Combitor
        Combitor 18 February 2013 00: 24
        +6
        Komodo, .. if you collect all ... So it turns out the thirty-seventh year.
        I agree with you. Every day the news reports on new arrests of corrupt officials. Every day there are reports of terrorist attacks. Every day - reports of accidents that have occurred due to negligence. If you collect in a bunch of "heroes" of this news, add to them all sorts of "reformers" of our economy, industry, science, education, army, health care, social sphere, pensions according to Western instructions, thereby pushing our country far back, but putting in wagons, send them to explore the taiga, you get more "Stalinist" GULAG. So you will wonder, but with whom did you fight and who was imprisoned and shot at that time? Were they so innocent?

        Komodo, .. if you collect all ... So it turns out the thirty-seventh year.
        I agree with you. Every day the news reports on new arrests of corrupt officials. Every day there are reports of terrorist attacks. Every day - reports of accidents that have occurred due to negligence. If you collect in a bunch of "heroes" of this news, add to them all sorts of "reformers" of our economy, industry, science, education, army, health care, social sphere, pensions according to Western instructions, thereby pushing our country far back, but putting in wagons, send them to explore the taiga, you get more "Stalinist" GULAG. So you will wonder, but with whom did you fight and who was imprisoned and shot at that time? Were they so innocent?
        1. sleepy
          sleepy 18 February 2013 03: 36
          +1
          But who will plant them?
          Onet is a monument and Memorial in one!

          "ADC" Memorial ", St. Petersburg (Olga Abramenko)

          Public organization "Center for Human Rights", Dushanbe (Nodira Abdulloeva)

          Civic Assistance Committee, Moscow (Svetlana Gannushkina)

          International Federation for Human Rights (Suer Belassen)

          Bureau for Human Rights and Rule of Law, Dushanbe (Nargis Zokirova)

          Migrant Workers Union, Moscow (Renat Karimov)

          Association of Journalists "GenderMediaKavkaz", Tbilisi (Galina Petriashvili)

          Public Foundation “Nota Bene”, Dushanbe (Nigina Bakhrieva)
          1. sleepy
            sleepy 18 February 2013 05: 34
            +5
            Here are the "reformers" of our economy, industry, science,
            education, army, healthcare, social sphere,
            Pension according to Western regulations,
            pushing our country far back,
            and try not to put them in the cars, sending to master the taiga.
      6. Gur
        Gur 18 February 2013 09: 21
        +2
        I have already written again, it is wasteful to shoot, so much needs to be done in the country, if you cite Stalin as an example, then you need to do it in Stalin's way, you need to organize labor and rest camps, build roads and new canals, factories and factories. In addition, this will allow you to avoid erroneous decisions, like during executions. Likewise, if you shoot the country, you will lose a lot of human resources, and how many will not need to be expelled but will run away on their own, who have already had a roof and a table behind the hill? But there is still one problem, but how to return all this? If it is impossible, then we must work out what they stole. Planting is also not an option, we ourselves will feed. There is also a question, how can we avoid those mistakes that Stalin had, when bureaucrats tore their ass, zealously following the order, they dispersed so they asked to increase the quotas for execution, when some thread of the local villain thought they were god in such a situation, and the honesty of citizens ? would a neighbor want to have my apartment, car, place at work (underline as necessary) for this process? How many "innocent victims" will we have then? Well, I will immediately answer Atlon, yes, probably there is, well, here, as it were, to justify myself, "I'm not like that, life is like that" I mean, if a thief is considered safe and respected in the state (with a capital letter) who is now hiding behind the name "businessman", when even the state is under plausible actions rob their people, then what is left to me? When a working person gets pennies in comparison with office plankton, and life constantly throws up joy in the form of price increases, right down to cold water, what is left for us? And if we talk about the camps, then let's start with the head, at the bottom, I think the consciousness will wake up by itself.
    3. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 10: 51
      +20
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Is it after Peter that there is nothing left? Well you know ..

      Peter's reforms and wars had a negative economic effect. The population from 1700 to 1725 decreased from 18 to 16 million people. The introduction of serfdom with slave labor, threw the economy far back. While almost all countries of Western Europe were freed from the remnants of slavery, realizing that without it they are doomed, and Peter 1 on the contrary introduces slavery in Muscovy.
      The defeat of the Swedish army led to the weakening of Sweden and the loss of its influence on the countries of Europe, which led to their strengthening due to the victories of the Russian troops. Territorial acquisitions were disproportionate to the losses incurred - 2 million people. The lives of Russian people have become a bargaining chip in the political games of Western European politicians
      Peter 1 “cut a window” to Europe, or rather cut a window to Muscovy for European countries. Before Peter, the penetration of foreigners into the lands of Muscovy was very limited. The right to cross the border was received mainly by embassy people, some merchants and a very small number of travelers. Under Peter 1, crowds of adventurers and adventurers poured into Muscovy, craving to fill their empty pockets with the riches of Russian land. All of them were provided with tremendous benefits and advantages, in relation to the primordially Russian aristocracy, merchants and business people.
      To replenish the rapidly emptying treasury, Peter 1 introduces many taxes and the state vodka monopoly. Vodka was sold in state taverns, taverns and in pits (horse-changing stations). Peter began to impose drunkenness in Russia, at all levels of society. Vodka monopoly brought fabulous profits to the treasury, which was necessary for its purposes.
      All the “great activities” of Peter the Great led Muscovy, which under it became known as the Russian Empire, into a deplorable economic state. Victories over Sweden brought enormous disasters to the Russian people, or rather, part of it, moaning under the yoke of the Romanovs.
      “With other European nations it is possible to achieve the goal in humanistic ways, but with the Russians it is not so ... I do not deal with people, but with animals that I want to transform into people” - Peter 1 (by the way, it very much resembles the recent statement by Patriarch Kirill)
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 17 February 2013 11: 00
        +1
        Quote: alexandr00070
        Peter's reforms and wars had a negative economic effect.

        Quote: alexandr00070
        All the “great activities” of Peter the Great led Muscovy, which under it became known as the Russian Empire, into a deplorable economic state.

        Are you an effective manager? Under Peter, Russia received a navy, a modern army, and new territories.
        1. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 17 February 2013 11: 10
          +22
          Quote: Vladimirets
          Under Peter, Russia received a navy, a modern army, and new territories

          You have information from history books, a fleet (and according to you Oleg, a large army of thousands near Tsargrad transported rafts on the rafts or there were Varangians, but 3 ships remained from Peter's squadron built on the bones of the Russian people.
          Peter 1 returned from the “German lands” in 1699. Immediately after arrival, it changes the Russian calendar to Julian. Summer 7208 from S.M.Z.Kh. becomes 1700 year from R.Kh. Thus, the history of the Russian people, numbering many thousands of years, disappeared. There were conditions for the fabrication of history, which was rewritten by the "great Russian historiographers" Bayer, Miller, Shletser. After several generations, few people already remembered what happened before Peter the Great.

          The results of the war are mixed, but all authors note huge economic and demographic losses. As historians point out, the Northern War became a real ruin of Russia. By 1710, the population of Russia was reduced by 20%, and in the territories adjacent to theaters of war by 40%. Taxes increased 3,5 times. The peasants were turned into slaves, whose forced labor became the key to cheap production.

          1. Sweden did not cede territories attached to Russia, but sold it to Russia for a lot of money, which placed a heavy additional burden on the country.
          2. The Russian army fell into complete decline after the Northern War, and the fleet turned out to be of poor quality and quickly decayed after the death of Peter 1 (1725).
          3. Access to the sea did not contribute to the prosperity of Russia, but of Europe, which exported natural resources from Russia for a pittance, increasing its turnover by 10 times.

          Instead of a great maritime power, Russia became a great European power.

          Peter the Great - for Russia or Europe?
          1. Vladimirets
            Vladimirets 17 February 2013 11: 25
            -6
            Quote: alexandr00070
            Peter the Great - for Russia or Europe?

            Peter the first (an interesting pun) of our rulers who brought Russia to the world stage and began to reckon with it.
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 11: 41
              +22
              Quote: Vladimirets
              who brought Russia truly to the world stage and began to reckon with it.

              yeah, how strong is the history textbook (published with the money of Soros), you absolutely forgot that Russia for centuries, before Peter, held Europe and Asia in its fist, I won’t go deep into the times, that’s how Ivan the Terrible spoke to your Sweden : Second Epistle to the King of Sweden Johan III

              - You sent to us through captivity your letter filled with dog barking
              - You write your name in front of ours - it is indecent, for we brother is the Caesar of Rome and other great sovereigns, and it is impossible for you to be called his brother, for the Swedish land is honor below these states, as will be proved in front.
              - But you started an evil deed as soon as you sat down on the state, and our great ambassadors ..., with an insignificant and mocking order you ordered to rob and dishonor - they left them in their shirts! But these are great people.
              “You should have blamed your people for telling a lie, and our ambassadors have been tormented in vain because of your thoughtlessness.”
              “And despite your custom and the letter of protection, your ambassadors were dishonored and sent to prison, you won’t be amazed at this: you couldn’t but answer your unworthy act with our ambassadors, and even then we haven’t even been taken for our ambassadors: after all, our ambassadors - great people, and those are slaves, and you let them go, as captives, they were all intoxicated with poison, and when they arrived here, they died.
              “We wrote to you as it should be to write our autocratic power to your royal,” for it had never happened before that the great sovereigns of all Russia should communicate with the Swedish rulers.
              - This is the true truth, not a lie - that you are a man’s clan, not a state.
              - You yourself wrote that your kingdom stood out from the Kingdom of Denmark, and if you still send us a letter with a seal about how your father Gustav unscrupulously acted, capturing the kingdom, then it would be better, we have nothing to write about it: himself you recognized your lack of servitude!

              - The ruler of our army is God, and not man: as God gives, so will
              - And what did you write barking to us and then want to bark to answer our letter, so we, the great sovereigns, do not need to write anything to you barking, and writing barking is not appropriate for great sovereigns; we wrote to you, not barking, but the truth, and sometimes we wrote so extensively that if you don’t explain it, you won’t get an answer. And if you, taking a dog’s mouth, want to bark for fun - then your servile custom: it’s an honor for you, great sovereigns, to communicate with you –– dishonor, and barking to you to write –– even worse, and overflowing with you –– worse than that does not happen in this world, and if you want to transfuse, then you find yourself the same serf as you yourself are a serf, and with it you can transfuse. From now on, no matter how much you write barking, we will not give you any answer.

              Summer 7081 [1537 g], ​​January 6
              Website - http://www.hrono.ru
              1. wax
                wax 17 February 2013 15: 26
                +3
                And then Soros? Discover Stories: S.M. Solovyov, Klyuchevsky, Karamzin, Tatishchev, Kostomarov. Read Pushkin, finally. One can probably agree that the payment for progress was the largest (10% of the population, and that's not all) among all other rulers of Russia.
            2. sams
              sams 17 February 2013 16: 13
              +3
              The reforms of Peter I brought many problems to Russia. The greatest benefit from the reforms received the nobility. Moreover, thanks to Peter's policy in the XNUMXth century, for the first time in the entire existence of Russia, the nobility, in social, political and cultural relations, separated from their own people, turned into a closed estate, brought up in non-Russian traditions.

              In addition, Peter, providing, on the one hand, political support for the nobility, and on the other, solving the problem of greater independence of the state in economic terms, made the final enslavement of the peasantry. It happened in 1718-1724. during tax reform. Not only that, tax reform increased the tax burden of the population by 1,5–2 times, but also in order to control the receipt of taxes, a strict police control was established in the country — a passport system was introduced and a network of control over population movement was created. The person paying the tax turned out to be almost permanently attached to his place of residence and without special permission did not even have the right to move.

              Another problem posed by Peter and significantly affecting Russian history is the creation of a powerful bureaucratic system of governing the country, subordinated solely to the will of the tsar. The bureaucratic system, created on the basis of the principle of unconditional subordination of the younger to the elder, largely suppressed the initiative of people. Moreover, subordinate to the “king’s mania", such a system gave rise to a relationship when, according to one of his contemporaries Peter, Prince D.M. Golitsyna, not "the laws govern the persons, but the person the laws." In other words, it created the conditions for the complete arbitrariness of those in power.

              Favoritism, which literally defeated Russia in the XNUMXth century, also follows from such a political system. Already under Peter, omnipotent temporary workers plundered the country as they could. At the same A.D. Menshikov, with all his military and state achievements, there were no fewer or fewer sins, for he constantly confused the state and his own pockets, and his personal budget at one time exceeded the budget of the entire Russian state! The system of government that arose under Peter determined for many years the dominance of foreigners in the Russian bureaucratic apparatus.

              Finally, Peter I completely subordinated the Church to the state, turning it into one of the state institutions. The tsar also looked at the purely rationalist view of the Russian Orthodox Church itself. The main task was to completely subordinate the Church to the secular authority of the tsar and to seize the material values ​​of the Church, which are so necessary for securing numerous Peter’s undertakings. The destruction of the independence of the Church gave rise to many spiritual and social problems, which soon had tragic consequences in Russian history.
              1. alexandr00070
                alexandr00070 17 February 2013 18: 29
                +3
                Quote: sams
                The greatest benefit from the reforms received the nobility.

                Everything is correct, with the exception of one, the benefit was primarily gained by foreign nobles, Peter destroyed the boyars (BOYARY husband, husband with a fierce heart, i.e. brave smart, honest) and brought up the nobility according to the Western model and reptiles before him, and later on before all women - queens (there were no real men in the fatherland, Peter plagued all)
          2. opkozak
            opkozak 17 February 2013 12: 04
            0
            Peter 1 - carried out primarily the Europeanization of Russia. He, and not anyone else, turned the main cities of Muscovy into European cities. He lived specially for months in Poland, Germany, Holland and Belgium, studying local architecture and, as a result, inviting the best architects and sculptors. If not for him, only the churches would be the best buildings in Russia. (The illustration shows the monument to Peter the Great in Spa (Belgium).
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 12: 12
              +17
              Quote: opkozak
              Peter 1 - carried out primarily the Europeanization of Russia

              And if Russia needed it, it would be better if he lived in Russia and the rules, and not engaged in architecture,
              Peter 1 after returning from the "German lands" acted as a conqueror:

              - defeated Russian self-government - "zemstvo" and replaced it with the bureaucratic apparatus of foreigners;
              - turned the peasants into an estate - replacing the Russian title system with the European, although the "peasant" is a title above the king, about which there is more than one evidence;
              - transferred the peasants to the property of the nobles, which turned them into slaves (to whiten the image of Peter, this “event” falls on Ivan IV);
              - defeated the clergy (carriers of Russian culture) and destroyed Orthodoxy, bringing it closer to Catholicism, which inevitably gave rise to atheism;
              - canceled the natural measures (fathom, finger, elbow, tops) that were present in clothing, utensils and architecture, made them fixed, as in the West. This led to the destruction of ancient Russian architecture and art, to the disappearance of the beauty of life, since divine and vital proportions disappeared in their structure;
              - destroyed the ancient Russian calendar, rejuvenating our civilization for many thousands of years;
              - banned the cultivation of amaranth and eat amaranth bread, which was the main food of the Russian people, thereby destroying the longevity, which then still remained in Russia;
              - exterminated the archers as a caste, and dressed the Russian army first in the French, and then in the German form, although the Russian military uniform itself was a weapon. The people of the new regiments were called "amusing";
              - destroyed the Russian chronicles - ordered to take them to St. Petersburg and burn. Then he called on the German "professors" to write a completely different Russian story;
              - destroyed the Russian script, which consisted of 151 characters, and introduced 43 characters of the Cyril and Methodius script (change of the Initial Letter);
              But his main crime is the destruction of Russian education (image + sculpting), the essence of which was to create a person with three subtle bodies that he does not receive from birth, and if they are not formed, then consciousness will not have a connection with the consciousnesses of past lives (Image )
            2. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 13: 47
              +16
              Quote: opkozak
              turned the main cities of Muscovy into European cities

              At a fairly mature age (in the middle of my fifties), I first came to St. Petersburg. And so, standing in the midst of the magnificent splendor of the Peter and Paul Cathedral, I suddenly wondered if this splendor was worth the lives of those on whose bones this cathedral, like the whole of St. Petersburg (and the name is not ours) was built. Why are we always chasing "European standards" - architectural structures, jeans, cars, European-quality repairs. Where is our own value coordinate system? Thanks to alexandr00070 for his arguments (the language does not dare to call posts)!
            3. Cynic
              Cynic 17 February 2013 15: 16
              +16
              Quote: opkozak
              Peter 1 - carried out primarily the Europeanization of Russia.

              M-yes.
              As if to say it politely, in 1941 they also tried to Europeanize us, some as slaves, others as overseers!
              It’s just that they were strangers and the number didn’t pass, and then there was his king-father.
              Russia in direct battle has never yielded to anyone, but because of internal treason ...
          3. Uzoliv
            Uzoliv 17 February 2013 13: 26
            +1
            Oh, trouble, trouble, trouble in the quinoa garden ...
            About the fleet. Kaa recently proved to me here that Cossack planes are also a fleet. You remembered Oleg. At the time of entry, so to speak of Tsar Peter, did Russia have a regular navy? What was once, it may have been, but it is gone. And after Peter we have the CONTINUOUS development of the fleet, so for me Peter is the founder of the Russian fleet. The fact that there are few ships left - yes. But they continued to be built. Even such a negative character in our history as the Duke of Biron, during his regency launched a warship. And how many rules did he have - about two months?
            Peter created a pretty strong state structure, the proof of this is that with such weak rulers as: Ekaterina1, Anna Ioannovna, Anna Leopoldovna and Elizaveta Petrovna (you see, the ladies did not shine with either talent or intelligence), but Russia did not disappear, Russia continued to develop, successfully to fight - and you are talking about the decline of the army, where did you get this from?
            Now for the treasury. The treasury at the time of Peter's death is really empty. But the country's potential is huge. After Peter, Russia floods all of Europe with its iron (excellent quality by the way). And in those days, it's like ours - high technology. That’s our misfortune that serfdom at that time was economically beneficial for the state.
            Lomonosov is also a product of Petrine transformations, and Russian education in particular. In the Middle Ages, the Russian Orthodox Church made a terrible mistake (everyone tends to make mistakes), considering mathematics, geometry, astronomy, philosophy - the Hellenic heresy. From here to you and the influx of foreigners, their own specialists were not there.
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 14: 45
              +15
              Quote: Uzoliv
              That’s our misfortune that serfdom at that time was economically beneficial for the state.
              Lomonosov is also a product of Petrine transformations, and Russian education in particular. In the Middle Ages, the Russian Orthodox Church made a terrible mistake (everyone tends to make mistakes), considering mathematics, geometry, astronomy, philosophy - the Hellenic heresy. From here to you and the influx of foreigners, their own specialists were not there.

              It’s terrible to read such nonsense, serfdom is profitable, of course, thousands of their slaves to please Peter put their lives on the construction sites of St. Petersburg, for which one European city appeared in Russia, the rest remained Russian, Lomonosov arose contrary to, and not thanks to reforms, all what are you talking about invented by the Germans
              In 1724, by order of Peter the Great, the St. Petersburg Academy of Sciences was founded, in the image and likeness of Western European academies, but with one difference - Western European academies were autonomous, and St. Petersburg was dependent on the state. For 1 years, there were 120 academic historians at the historical department, of which only three were Russians, including MV Lomonosov. the rest are Germans who wrote the history of Russia, and some of them did not even know the Russian language! This fact is well known to professional historians, but is not advertised.
              1. Cynic
                Cynic 17 February 2013 15: 23
                +3
                Quote: alexandr00070
                but not advertised.

                We have a lot that is not advertised.
                And only one is advertised _ The Russian land went from Rurik, and the Russian state from Peter I!
              2. DYMITRY
                DYMITRY 17 February 2013 16: 00
                +7
                Quote: alexandr00070
                serfdom is profitable, of course, thousands of their slaves to please Peter put their lives on the construction sites of St. Petersburg, for which one European city appeared in Russia, the rest remained Russian

                Good day, Alexander!
                A huge plus for your posts. It would be very interesting to read a separate article on this topic. If I saw such an article on VO, I would be very grateful. Take it
                1. Strategia
                  Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 07
                  0
                  Join us!
                2. alexandr00070
                  alexandr00070 17 February 2013 18: 33
                  0
                  Quote: DYMITRY
                  It would be very interesting to read a separate article on this topic. If I saw such an article on VO, I would be very grateful. Take it

                  it’s fair to say that I’ve recently and don’t quite understand how this is done
              3. Uzoliv
                Uzoliv 17 February 2013 18: 13
                -1
                Dry theory is my friend, but the tree of life turns green ...
                Achinea say, prove that it was not economically viable. I am not talking about the moral side of the issue, I only stated a fact. Believe me, if serfdom would not be beneficial to the Russian state, and especially to the Russian elite, then the nobility. They would have canceled it a long time ago. This is the tragedy of our history.
                Now for the sciences. Low bow to you for admitting that the Academy of Sciences was founded by Peter. And the fact that the academicians were Germans, so no one hides, some are even proud of, for example, Leonard Euler. And Che weren't there? The damned nemchura didn't let you in? In order to become an academician, one must probably graduate from the university. And when did we have our first university, eh? How many years did it take to forge personnel? You reproach the academy for the lack of autonomy. So this is sedition. Yes, you are a respected liberal. Liberals are not liked here. All our interests should be subordinated to the state. Here's a quote from yesterday's article by Starikov: "We need to change the education system, prioritize unconditional adherence to state interests, and not only in the economy, but also in politics, education, art - in all vital spheres." And you will regret the lack of autonomy.
                You talk about Peter, a little strange. He is a man of his era, he sincerely considered himself the anointed of God, and all the rest of his slaves. As thought, so did. He could not have been otherwise; he was so raised and everyone around was raised in that spirit. This we can now argue: that serfdom is evil, that the people were killed during construction unnecessarily (although there is also a question - there are researchers who disagree with this), that Peter's reforms essentially led to a deep split in Russian society.
                Peter, with all due respect to him, would never have reached such conclusions, he simply did not know how to think in such categories.
                And as they say PS: I really love St. Petersburg and if it weren’t for me, it seems to me that Russia would not benefit from this. She might not have lost, but what she did not win is for sure.
                1. alexandr00070
                  alexandr00070 17 February 2013 20: 51
                  +2
                  Quote: Uzoliv
                  And the fact that the academics were Germans is no one hides, some even be proud of, for example, Leonard Euler. Why weren’t you?

                  Here it is the system of the German footprint in the history of Russia, that is, according to you before Peter in Russia people were running in loincloths and there was no history, but according to the old calendar, at the time the new one was introduced, Summer 7208 from S.M.Z.Kh. becomes 1700 year from R.Kh. , and thus disappeared the history of the Russian people, numbering many thousands of years. And how interesting people in Russia lived without an academy, how beautiful cities and fortresses were built using arshins and tops, and how they fought without academies is unclear ......
                  1. sleepy
                    sleepy 18 February 2013 03: 53
                    +2
                    Quote: Uzoliv
                    "... You talk about Peter, somewhat strange. He is a man of his era, he sincerely believed
                    Himself the anointed of God, and all the rest of his slaves. As thought, so did.
                    He could not do otherwise, he was brought up like that and everyone around was brought up in this spirit ... "


                    Peter was sincerely considered by many to be the AntiChrist, so Peter had a hand in
                    to get rid of them, leaving yourself slaves..
                    And who was he brought up abroad?
            2. Cynic
              Cynic 17 February 2013 15: 20
              0
              Quote: Uzoliv
              Peter created a pretty strong state structure

              By definition, was the design previously bad?
              So can enlighten us in its advantages?
              1. Uzoliv
                Uzoliv 17 February 2013 18: 49
                0
                Quote: Cynic
                By definition, was the design previously bad? So can enlighten us in its advantages?

                Have mercy, did I write this. For its time, the orders were not bad. But everything flows and everything changes. And even if there had not been Peter, then someone else would have been engaged in reforming the state machine. It’s just ripe. Here is a small example: the Siberian order deals with judicial, military, financial, commercial, mining and other issues. That is, it overlaps the competencies of other orders, well, this is not the order. Reforms with Peter, without Peter - were inevitable.
                1. Cynic
                  Cynic 17 February 2013 20: 50
                  +1
                  Have mercy, what a reform of the state machine!
                  It seems that the conversation was about creating it anew according to European standards!
            3. sams
              sams 17 February 2013 16: 36
              +1
              How the fleet of Peter I decayed and what it cost Russia can be read here:
              http://ttolk.ru/?p=11932
        2. Mikhail3
          Mikhail3 17 February 2013 11: 42
          +18
          I am an engineer. Immediately before the accession of Peter, Russia sold to Europe from one and a half to two thousand cannon barrels annually. By modern standards, it is a superbly built industrial power with a powerful military-industrial complex. After his accession - not a trunk. After a while (when, as a result of the "victory of reforms", suddenly a little bit of money appeared, and this was not always the case) Russia began to buy cannon barrels. That is, the kirdyk of the military-industrial complex, the collapse of finance ...
          The navy in the Baltic is cool ... A small detail - what the pineapple was it for us, along with a stupid window? Carrying goods there was hellishly difficult ... Territory? Every Russian tsar easily conquered them ... just putting so many people is indescribable. However...
          Do you know how many fighting techniques the fighter of the "regiments of the new order", so praised by the apologists of Peter, mastered? Do not know. Historians of the region do not like this knowledge ... well, know. Two. TWO !! Curse this bastard forever and ever, amen ...
          1. Cynic
            Cynic 17 February 2013 15: 28
            -3
            Quote: Mikhail3
            Immediately before the accession of Peter, Russia sold to Europe from one and a half to two thousand cannon trunks annually

            Bloody gebni misinformation! Until Peter I, Russia did not have its own cannons and had no experience of cannon fighting!
            Reliability of information?
            Everyone knows that!
            There in the cinema they showed how merchants brought the first guns to the tsar to the show!
            1. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 12
              +7
              "Under John III, a cannon hut was set up in Moscow; since then, artillery business began to develop rapidly. Under Ivan the Terrible, the defense of the" towns "was entrusted mainly to artillery; from 1522, the field army always maneuvered with artillery." Brockhaus and Efron Dictionary.
            2. donchepano
              donchepano 17 February 2013 20: 15
              +3
              Quote: Cynic
              showed in the cinema .....



              Here ... In the movie ... Who creates the movie?
              And in general, we have a solid movie from 1991 to the present ... with Kremlin artists.

              By the way, I support the request of Dimitri to Alex 00070))) I, FOR!
              1. Cynic
                Cynic 17 February 2013 20: 36
                +1
                Quote: donchepano
                Here ... In the movie ... Who creates the movie?

                Tyk documentary !!! wink
                1. Egoza
                  Egoza 17 February 2013 21: 32
                  +2
                  Quote: Cynic
                  Tyk documentary !!!

                  Oh, don't tell me, dear! I still remember how in one Kiev military school they laughed when one of their colonels was invited to "act in films." And he was very much like Khrushchev! In short, they removed the film, the film was aged and it turned out to be a wonderful "documentary film" of how Khrushchev walks along the banks of the Dnieper and thinks how to liberate Kiev!
                  1. Cynic
                    Cynic 18 February 2013 07: 23
                    +2
                    Quote: Egoza
                    the film was aged and it turned out to be a wonderful "documentary"

                    M-y-ya.
                    Quote: Cynic
                    yk documentary !!!

                    Oh-ho-ho-noses.
                    Peter I
                    1672 - 1725)
                    Cinema
                    It was invented at the end of the XNUMXth century and became extremely popular in the XNUMXth century.
                    drinks
              2. basil_OK
                basil_OK 21 August 2013 23: 51
                0
                and before - too ("of all the arts for us the most important is cinema"): take at least G. Mitich - a typical Indian lol
          2. Prophetic
            Prophetic 17 February 2013 16: 01
            +6
            And you could not write more nonsense? What 2 thousands of trunks a year ?! Where?! Who?! Although you are an engineer, this does not mean that you can not know your story! When will we learn to CHECK the information we read? Let it be known to you that Russia, like all of Europe, BUYED iron ore in Sweden. Even during Hitler's time, 3 / 4 of all iron ore of the Third Reich is Swedish. Due to its high percentage. And you thought why Petr1 was forced to pour bells on guns? Yes, because Karl 12 immediately cut off supplies of iron and ore to Russia during the war. That is why Peter was forced to urgently build steel mills, organize the first in Russia geological ministry for the search for minerals.
            what the pineapple was he to us, along with a stupid window?
            And the fact that the Swedish fleet has BLOCKED trade with Russia on the sea (read cheap), the way.
            Carrying goods there was hellishly difficult ...
            Young man, what are you grinding !? Yes, the ancient path from the Varangians to the Greeks, the main trade artery of Russia, passed along this path!
            that's just putting so many people - it's indescribable
            And how many people? During the Battle of Poltava, Russian casualties were 1345 killed. So what? Just don’t get on about 2 million. It was born the same as a mess about 6 million "dead" Jews. Here they were, and now they are gone. Of course, they died. To just leave, run away - no, not my God!
            Quote: Mikhail3
            Do you know how many fighting techniques the fighter of the "regiments of the new order" mastered,
            And there is no boom boom. 1. Sagittarius fired from heavy squeaks, which were mounted on slings and gunpowder was poured onto a shelf. “The new shelves have switched to much lighter and faster flintlock guns.” 2. Learn to use modern linear tactics. 3. We learned to conduct intelligence on an ongoing basis, and not from case to case. 4. The percentage of 5 firearms increased significantly. The artillery of Ivan the Terrible is a huge clumsy cannon firing with stone cores, all of which are non-standard calibers. To move, 12-18 horses were required. We switched to a much more mobile artillery of standard calibers. Nuclei from one gun (lo and behold!) Began to be suitable for another! 6. Created from scratch a fleet of the European level. We learned not only how to control warships, but also how to defeat the Swedes at sea. 7. Created industry, including the military. And all this in a war! The production of gunpowder, guns has grown significantly! 8.Do you know that up to Peter there were very few professional workers! Whoever didn’t shove these plants !. What quality can we talk about under such conditions? It was under Peter that workers began to be trained in the profession and paid for their work. 9. They created military and naval schools. Just during the rout near Narva, ALL the high command posts were occupied by foreigners, and it was AFTER Peter's reforms near Poltava that RUSSIAN commanders appeared, and not vice versa! etc etc
            The strongest European army — the Swedish — ceased to exist. Russia has become a powerful military and commercial power.
            1. GP
              GP 17 February 2013 17: 35
              +1
              And 150 years ago from today:
              Quote: Prophetic
              1. Fighters fired from heavy guns.. - New regiments switched to much lighter and faster-firing self-loading shotguns. 2. Learn to use modern tactics. 3. Learned to lead comprehensive intelligence, and not just on an ongoing basis and from case to case. 4. Significantly increased the percentage of firearms 5. Artillery R P - these are huge clumsy cannons firing nuclei, and well, at least standard calibers. To move, a horse was needed (!). We switched to a much more mobile artillery of standard calibers. Shell from one gun (lo and behold!) began to be suitable for another! 6. Created fleet world class. Learned not only to control warships, but also to win all on the sea. 7.Created the best industry, and military as well. And all this in a war! The production of gunpowder, guns has grown significantly! 8.Do you know up to USSR / RF there were very few professional workers! Whoever didn’t shove these plants !. What quality can we talk about under such conditions?

              laughing
            2. Mikhail3
              Mikhail3 17 February 2013 18: 32
              -2
              Peter, the vile, really bought. I didn’t believe that we had our own. And she, you know, was ... The Swedish fleet really blocked the trade. Only trade was weak ... railways, you see, did not exist then. And on the rivers not very much to dung on the Baltic ... it cost a myriad of Russian people to the rank of angels ... "From the Varangians to the Greeks" ... the goods were not collected from the "Varangians", because there was nothing. Slowly, by land, by carts ... the goods, slowly concentrating in our cities, were delivered to Russia.
              As for the affairs of the military ... no, very rzhachno. Of course, while Peter did not shave the Sivolap bears, we were eating bread soup. And as I shaved, so they began as cultural ones - to screw up the consort consort.
              1. dmitrich
                dmitrich 18 February 2013 03: 43
                0
                you fool my friend.
            3. Gur
              Gur 18 February 2013 10: 49
              +1
              I'm just out, one is healthy, and the rest are delusional or misdirected. Guys Russia, Russia as an original state is not and was not on a separate planet, and willingly not willingly had intercourse with other states, under the kings of any dynasty and any time of reign there were "advisers" foreigners, from the Varangians to Byzantium, it's another matter how strong they are could influence the affairs of Russia, everywhere under different tsars it was different. But the fact that for construction and ore business, foreigners were always invited, under Ivan 5 (I apologize if I was wrong in the figure) an Italian was invited to build churches in Moscow, who taught ours in the production of lime and cement (well, probably not exactly cement, but cement mortar) he also, at the request of the king, made the first furnaces for melting metal, Russia bought metal from the Chukhonts who had trade relations with the Scandinavians. So Russians have not yet traveled to the Urals. As for Peter 1, for me he was and is a great person. Yes, maybe not everything, like everyone else, was right, especially I did not like the huge dominance of foreigners, in particular in science, they strongly pinched our history and the treasury too. But there were also those who accepted Russia as their own. Did Peter have a choice? I don’t know I didn’t live at that time. But it was necessary to push the sleeping bear apart. I don’t know how the sleepy patriarchal Russia would have ended, I think not with anything good. Here they write about the clergy, as the guarantor of spirituality and Russianness, but was it not a brake? did it not call everything advanced heresy? The church has always resisted change and education. And then the question arises, is this our faith in general? And why was she inoculated with us? Here you can ask a lot of questions and agree to the point of absurdity. Gentlemen, comrades, do not judge the deeds of those whom you cannot reach, judge your deeds and those of your contemporaries. Try to change what you think is necessary (unless, of course, the guts are not thin) and not say that someone is to blame for everything, and that the whole history of Russia was written by the Germans, where did you get the truth then?
              1. SASCHAmIXEEW
                SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 09: 40
                0
                And 7000 years before Peter, RUSSIA jumped from branch to branch, and did not destroy chronicles from monasteries? In 1700, Russia was like a hell out of a snuffbox !! Prior to this, there were no birch bark letters, and Russia, as it were, was not .... And the word Gardarik is a country of cities, then the Russians themselves came up with it !! Then the question is where on the European to Peter's maps the word Gardarik is present ?? Have you heard of the Acroim?
              2. Lomov
                Lomov 25 February 2013 00: 41
                -1
                Yeah, with common sense is not a lot here ....
        3. tupolev-95
          tupolev-95 17 February 2013 12: 17
          +1
          Do not forget the German dominance in power, do not forget the temporary workers and what happened after the death of Peter.
          1. stalkerwalker
            stalkerwalker 17 February 2013 17: 46
            +7
            And today's grefs, boos, chubais and others like them today?
            1. SASCHAmIXEEW
              SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 09: 53
              +1
              Today the liquidationist dominance, and how we tolerate this !! In the Second World War, the Germans were given a turn because they began to create lawlessness! But the liquidationists grunt us now, and instead of us RUSSIA will be emigrated by emigrants !! The Zionist plan of globalization is being carried out by mendels, Chubais, grefs, kudrins, they are Fed officials, it is not for nothing that they learned to betray their homeland abroad !!! Drive and judge for the betrayal of the motherland !!!
        4. baltika-18
          baltika-18 17 February 2013 15: 51
          +4
          Quote: Vladimirets
          Are you an effective manager? Under Peter, Russia received a navy, a modern army, and new territories.

          The Romanov dynasty, unfortunately, out of the 304 years of its reign, the first half of this period broke what came before them, and only since the time of Catherine the Great, and since the second half of the 2th century it began to create something.
      2. shasherin_pavel
        shasherin_pavel 17 February 2013 12: 37
        +9
        About serfdom: When Lazarev's ship entered the port of Anguilla for repairs, our sailors complained about the whips in the fleet. The British sailors asked to show their backs, only one of the sailors was able to show a back that had been streaked with a whip. The English sailors laughed and showed their backs, they all had whips, and some had a tortoiseshell pattern, this is when the scabs from constant flogging turn into shells. Our serf sailors crossed themselves and said: God save us from such freedom. In England in those days, even a child was sent to hard labor for a stolen piece of bread. Read foreign literature. At the same time, our agricultural land use was always risky agriculture, because the harvest season ends with cold weather, and in Europe, especially in the southern part, two crops were harvested. Honor those writers of Russia before the revolutionary: "pieceiness" was the norm for the peasants. This is when hungry families went from house to house not for Christ's sake, but silently entered the house and stood at the threshold. The owner could remain silent if he himself had nothing to eat, but most of them broke off a piece of bread and served it, everything was done in silence, so as not to humiliate people from his community, and then everyone knew that he could go for a piece from the next harvest. "For Christ's sake" and "kusochestvo" were different in nature the existence of peasants throughout Russia.
        1. sams
          sams 17 February 2013 16: 39
          +4
          Testimonies of contemporaries, representatives of the common people:

          Winch, confessor of Prince A.D. Menshikova: “Peter is the Antichrist. He did not spare his son, beat him and the prince did not just die. It is known that de sovereign killed him ... "

          Monk, former captain Levin: “The last times have come ... Now we have not the king, but the antichrist - makes us monks eat meat and live with wives ...”.

          Peasant Startsev: “What kind of king is this, he is de antichrist, and not a king, the kingdom has left his kingdom and the nobleman and Germans and he lives all in the German settlement, on Wednesday and heels he eats meat. Do not wait for de Antichrist again, he is the Antichrist. ”

          Popular opinion: “There is no Tsar Peter Tsar Pyotr Alekseevich and Tsar Tsarevich in Moscow, they are plagued, the boyars and the Germans have plagued, the Antichrist reigns in his place”.

          The deacon of the Chudov Monastery, Jonah Kirilovets, spoke of the replaced Peter: “The Emperor was not the tsar and not the tsarist generation, but the German ... When the Empress Tsarevna Natalya Kirillovna had her daughter’s son and then the Emperor, Tsar Alexei Mikhailovich, was angry with her ... and when de she slept an hour to give birth to her daughter, and then, the sovereign, fearing him, the sovereign, took in exchange from the German settlement a baby man’s floor, from the Lefortovo Palace ... ”

          The opinion of some serfs: “The sovereign de was not of a royal tribe, of a German breed, but the great sovereign was concealed by the Germans from their mothers, in small years, and instead of the evo they replaced the new. The Germans are cunning, they’re letting the face go. ”

          A certain peasant: “The Tsar has released all his land, they have remained only in soul and body ... There is no Tsar in Moscow. Seven years in captivity, and Nemchin sits in the kingdom. Here are de thousands with four archers chopped. If he was de sovereign, would he have begun to desolate his land. ”
          1. Alekseev
            Alekseev 17 February 2013 17: 53
            +4
            The article, it seems, is about Stalin, but they "grabbed" about Peter.
            Everyone knows: how much money was in the treasury, how much was decreasing (or, by turnover, the population’s profit), how the fleet became impoverished and how many ships were left, how the army fell (or flourished). It can be seen that people are interested ...
            A simple "peasant" cannot immediately understand, everything is very confusing, and the historical "bison" are very contradictory in their assessments.
            It seems to me that, without further ado, we must proceed from the consequences of the activities of both Peter and Stalin.
            For example, could a declining army successfully beat the Prussians in the Seven Years War?
            It was the kingdom of Moscow, became the Empire. And there is the opinion of researchers that both the budget and the population, despite the losses from the wars, have not decreased, but increased. request
            Well, under Stalin it was the same "something, and very significant."
            And the repressions, of course, were the same.
            The most complicated historical processes simplify to the level of good-bad.
            One cannot approach the assessment of the events of the 18th century, and indeed of the beginning of the 20th, from the point of view of the humanist of the 21st century.
            This approach resembles narcissistic chatter.
            He, the asshole, knows how it really was. wassat
            And you, fools, have read a lot of textbooks, you have finished schools, but you don’t know the whole truth!
          2. alexandr00070
            alexandr00070 17 February 2013 21: 07
            +2
            Quote: sams
            “Peter is the antichrist.


            and also the opinion of Tolstoy L.N. (1828-1910) - Russian writer, thinker. About Peter 1 - “There was a rabid beast. The great bastard, the pious robber, the murderer ... Forget about it, and not erect monuments. ”

            Voloshin M.A. (1877-1932) - Russian poet, translator. He called Peter "the first Bolshevik."

            Solonevich I.L. (1891-1953) - Russian historian, publicist. Extremely negatively assessed the personality of Peter and his reforms. Accused Peter of cruelty, tyranny and cowardice; in the gap between the ruling elite and the people.

            Burkovsky A.M. - Russian writer, historian. Following the Old Believers, he calls Peter 1 “the anti-christ king”, “the possessed sadist” and the “bloody monster”. According to Burkovsky, everything attributed to Peter was known long before him. Before the reforms of Peter the Great, Russia was much more developed and free than after.
            1. Alekseev
              Alekseev 17 February 2013 21: 26
              0
              Thank you for clarifying who Tolstoy L.N. is. (1828-1910) smile
              1. alexandr00070
                alexandr00070 17 February 2013 21: 39
                0
                Quote: Alekseev
                Who is Tolstoy L.N. (1828-1910)


                well, actually Lev Tolstoy (August 28 (September 9) 1828, Yasnaya Polyana, Tula province, Russian Empire - November 7 (20), 1910, Astapovo station, Ryazan province, Russian Empire), the count is one of the most widely known Russian writers and thinkers, revered by many as one of the greatest writers of the world. [2] Member of the defense of Sevastopol. Enlightener, publicist, religious thinker, whose authoritative opinion caused the emergence of a new religious and moral movement - Tolstoyism. Corresponding member of the Imperial Academy of Sciences (1873), honorary academician in the category of fine literature (1900)
            2. Gur
              Gur 18 February 2013 11: 00
              0
              But how, it’s only here that is possible with us, Leo Tolstoy is also not without a flaw in my opinion. And what is this Solonevich I.L. at one time did not say the same to Stalin? Or can this only be said dead? Old Believers? PS, and they as sectarians did not fool people? Osprey in churches did not arrange self-immolation? They didn’t rave about what? Crap shorter ..
      3. Lomov
        Lomov 25 February 2013 00: 16
        -1

        How long do you think you could keep the border locked? Until now, untouched tribes are found in the jungle. The trouble is that in contact with civilization, they quickly die ....
    4. avt
      avt 17 February 2013 10: 53
      +14
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Article set -. I am not a supporter of the indiscriminate stoning of Stalin, but frankly, the justification of all his actions looks unconvincing. Particularly surprised by the comparison with Peter I and Ivan the Terrible. Is it after Peter that there is nothing left? Well, you know ... Yes, Stalin left an industrial country with an atomic bomb and a powerful economy, but he accepted the Empire, and to say that the Russian Empire in 1917 looked like boyar Rus before Peter was somehow wrong. Stalin, like all outstanding personalities who influenced the course of world history, was an extraordinary man, certainly strong and charismatic, but not all of his actions deserve approval, which the author actually tries to achieve in his article.

      I disagree with you. It is not a matter of justification, justifying as well as settling personal scores with the deceased is stupid and completely stupid. The article attempts to analyze, good or bad, a debatable question. Well, talking about Stalin's legacy of the Russian empire after the Civil, which actually destroyed this empire in the literal and figurative sense, is too much. Here the figures of what was and what was left by 1924 speak for themselves. And the Petrine era is also not unambiguous, and if you leave emotions and count - the picture is very similar. Although Petya's starting positions were more favorable. I repeat, a serious meticulous analysis is needed. But any attempt to carry it out causes wild resistance, a terrible howl with the accusation of all mortal sins with the stigma of "Stalinist". Agree, it evokes a certain direction of thought. Why are they all of a sudden? , well, at least for an intellectual approach yesand not for a set of stamps.
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 17 February 2013 11: 06
        -5
        Quote: avt
        The article attempts to analyze, good or bad, a debatable question.

        So I wrote about what, in my opinion, this analysis is one-sided.

        Quote: avt
        Well, to talk about Stalin’s legacy of the Russian Empire after the Civil Empire, which actually destroyed this empire in the literal and figurative sense, is too much

        What are you talking about? I wrote that RI 1917. was higher in development than pre-Petrine Russia, is it not?
        Quote: avt
        Although Petya's starting positions were more favorable

        This is what they are more preferential?
        1. avt
          avt 17 February 2013 11: 24
          +6
          Quote: Vladimirets
          What are you talking about? I wrote that RI 1917. was higher in development than pre-Petrine Russia, is it not?

          Well, who was Stalin in 1917? And the level of development of the empire after 1917 with the transfer of the Imperialist to the Civil was reduced to almost zero. So, on the one hand, it turns out that there is complete disruption with the population that went through the fratricidal war with all the moral and material costs inherent in this war, and the state inherited by Peter with a small, albeit rather dangerous for him family mess, arranged by his grandfather Misha, father Alexei, brother Fedor and sister Sophia. Even the associates of Peter spoke of Sophia’s rule as a reasonably rational one. No, there were different starting positions, very different.
          1. Vladimirets
            Vladimirets 17 February 2013 11: 37
            -2
            Quote: avt
            inherited by Peter with a small, albeit rather dangerous for him family mess, arranged by his grandfather Misha, father Alexei, brother Fedor and sister Sophia.

            A little trouble? Well, well, the Streltsy rebellion with subsequent reprisal is, of course, a little mess. There were no open speeches against Stalin at all.
            1. avt
              avt 17 February 2013 11: 50
              +4
              Quote: Vladimirets
              A little trouble? Well, well, the Streltsy rebellion with subsequent reprisal is, of course, a little mess. There were no open speeches against Stalin at all.

              When Petya was really in danger and hiding from his sister in the Lavra, there were no military clashes, not only large-scale, but also small ones. To beat Petya quietly did not work, and Sophia in exchange for life and position comrades quietly merged. Well, the petty rebellion in the absence of Peter was almost overwhelmingly suppressed by Romodanovsky and the subsequent demonstrative executions of the archers did not draw the scale of the civil war, even the later Cossack Bulavinsky riot. His father from Razin was in immeasurably greater danger. Then yes, the real threat to Romanov was.
      2. Kaa
        Kaa 17 February 2013 12: 41
        +21
        Quote: avt
        Well, to talk about Stalin’s legacy of the Russian Empire after the Civil Empire, which actually destroyed this empire in the literal and figurative sense, is too much

        Well, not Stalin destroyed it, he rebuilt it according to Marx. And who destroyed?
        "Cash cow - Russia - Stalin pulled out of the ticks of the West After the February revolution in our country, B'nai-Brit assembled a large team headed by Trotsky, put them on a steamer and, having supplied them with a large sum, sent them to Russia: "Power is lying on the ground there, it must be picked up. And concentrated in the hands of American protégés." US President Woodrow Wilson himself gave Trotsky an American passport, accompanied by a visa to enter Russia and a British transit visa. The Americans were in a hurry to send Lev Davidovich's group, because they had information from their ambassadors from Europe: Germany was preparing a Bolshevik landing in Russia, led by Lenin. So the enemies Lenin and Trotsky ended up at the same time in one place, with one task, but aimed at different results. Trotsky could boldly speak about himself in the words of Peter Verkhovensky from Dostoyev's Demons: "I am a swindler, not a socialist." Lenin entered into an alliance with him, because behind the back of the "Judas" there was a lot of American money.Unlike the Russian Bolsheviks, Trotsky invested in the concept of “world revolution” to create the United States of the World - in the current terminology of the All-Planet Oligarchy, where our country was given the place of a supplier of resources and slave power.The fashion to behave like in a seized territory and defiantly show off in front of a poor country - also from there. NEP with its estimates in our country was lucky. For decades we walked under the banner of Lenin, and the NEP should have been extolled as a brilliant invention of the leader. Then the Kremlin talked about a market panacea, and the NEP turned up on the arm as a positive example. In addition, there was a good reason to commemorate Stalin's memory for his reluctance to give people economic freedom. Now it does not matter that, according to some Bolsheviks, it was not the iron Marxist Lenin himself who came up with this policy - it was recommended to him by the bankers circling around Trotsky. It could have a good effect, but NEPmans “brought enterprises to malicious bankruptcy” in order to buy them for bribes to officials at bargain prices.: “The products of the socialist sector, as a rule, did not go directly to consumers, but fell into the hands of NEPmans who sold it with a margin of several hundred percent. As a result of such speculation and the expansion of the black market, the undermining of nationalized sectors of the economy, large private capital appeared in the country. The workers were no longer able to pay the high rent for the good apartments to which they were relocated after the revolution, and gradually returned to the slums. ”At about the same time, Trotsky's supporters Kamenev and Zinoviev pushed the idea of“ open borders ”. Socialism, they argued, is international in nature and involves the elimination of borders, at least between major industrial countries. With uncontrolled movement of capital through a system of commercial banks and other attributes. Trotsky all the time insisted on luring foreigners into Russia: civilization, money. Even he undertook to lead the Main Concession Committee. At the request of the concessionaires, they were allocated millions of hectares of forest and the best mineral deposits for deforestation. 123 companies from the USA, England, Germany, France settled in Russia. By 1928, concessionaires accounted for 0,75 percent of all capital investments in industrial development. But they extracted lead for export, 62 percent, manganese - 40, gold - 35, copper - 12 percent. Russia understood that it, yesterday’s advanced empire, was torn to pieces, leading to destruction.
        1. Kaa
          Kaa 17 February 2013 12: 43
          +19
          Kaa,
          Quote: Kaa
          Kaa
          Trotsky’s demagogy with the company of tomorrow’s prosperity under the authority of the World Government, when superimposed on reality, looked like a cynical mockery. The authorities completely compromised the NEP and the dominance of foreigners with the manners of the executioners dealt a tangible blow to the Leninist party. They fled from it: ideological - because of disagreement with the policies of the Central Committee, opportunists - because of the opportunity to get out in another place.Stalin said: "Let careerists flee from the party, in their place call those who support the country." On the same principles, he organized the so-called "Leninist" draft in the RCP (B.). The party’s number grew as a widow, its composition became different: the Communists from the regions prevailed, more closely tied to the interests of Russia. It was no longer the Leninist party, but the Stalinist, and they tried to strangle our state immediately with blockades. They banned firms from buying furs, gold, and minerals from the Soviet Union. Even for the supply of timber, this super-liquid product, an embargo was imposed. And the country needed a currency for industrialization. The West agreed to take only wheat from us, hoping to cause a food crisis. And later, the West intensely incited Hitler to the USSR. Such is the face of the "civilized" world, under which they always want to lay us down.Bnay Brit envoys in Russia are masters of demagogy and then infected the party with demagogy. Stalin could get them out of power only using demagoguery. In his speeches, he constantly relied on the postulates of Marxism, on the authority of Lenin. Without becoming personal, he spoke of a clear discrepancy between the doctrines of the cases. This disarmed the opponents and impressed the audience.. Then they will begin to blame Stalin as if he had departed from Leninist principles. This is not true. The basic principle of Lenin, Trotsky and the whole team is terror. Koba did not back away from him. Only those terror was directed against the Russian nation, and Stalin gave it an international character, directing the tip of the ax primarily against the instigators of anti-Russian terror themselves. Therefore, the descendants of these instigators - direct and ideological, hate Stalin so much. Corrupt officials with parasite speculators went through the stage. Their descendants also have a rattle at the mention of Koba.http: //webcache.googleusercontent.com/search? q = cache: http: //www.pravnabat.r
          u / story / sovremennye-demokraty-prodolzhateli-dela-trotskogo
          1. Ascetic
            Ascetic 17 February 2013 14: 48
            +10
            Kaa,

            All rightKaa... Therefore, modern globalists and liberals, the ministers of the cult of the Golden Calf and their henchmen in Russia, the compradors and the "fifth column" still hate Stalin so much more than anyone else. So far, he is the only one in history who was able to inflict a crushing blow and defeat on them, and this is not forgotten even at the genetic level.

            1. sleepy
              sleepy 18 February 2013 04: 13
              +4
              It seems that now the NEP is repeating when the rich get richer ...

              "... Our domestic specialists are so adept at bankrupt enterprises that" a mosquito will not undermine the nose. "
              For the bought up debts in the amount of 100 thousand rubles, they stopped the enterprises, planted their leader, and the process started - stone on stone did not remain on the old foundations. The slogan “take and get rich” was embodied specifically. They cut the last cows on the collective farms and got drunk on the money they earned to hell with their eyes. But this insatiable machine still works. Arbitration courts on a regular basis by their decisions declare bankruptcy, complaining about workload. Moreover, arbitration managers are appointed from among bankruptcy specialists who often live in Moscow and N-Novgorod.
              Formally, everything is according to the law, but essentially a real robbery.

              According to A.Proskurin, in Russia as a result of the introduction of capitalism, entire industries have been destroyed.
              Machine tool construction, for example, provides with its products 2-3 percent of the 1990 level.
              As a result of the bankruptcy of the motorcycle industry, Russia currently produces about 2–3 thousand motorcycles a year, while previously they produced up to 800 thousand units.
              Excavator production remained at the level of 2 thousand against 25 thousand in 1990.
              Completely destroyed the production of Russian televisions, providing in the past
              full cycle of manufacturing and assembly of parts. We can cite Belarus as a positive example,
              where similar capacities have been preserved and are still in operation ... "
              http://www.nabludatel.ru/new/2012/06/18/istoriya-unichtozheniya-ekonomiki-oblast
              i-mozhet-vspomnim /
          2. SASCHAmIXEEW
            SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 10: 24
            0
            Bravo!!! Everything is exactly so !! Stalin God sent RUSSIA !! God would give a second Stalin, otherwise we’ll perish with these liquidationists in power .....
        2. avt
          avt 17 February 2013 14: 11
          +3
          Quote: Kaa
          Well, not Stalin destroyed it; he rebuilt it according to Marx. And who destroyed?

          And I will not argue. It’s just that we had a dispute about something else with Vladimirets. And if you highlight the post-war attitude of Stalin to the Marshall plan, to attempts even then to bind the Country to the federal reserve system, then you look someone will start to search for and analyze the facts. And this is good.
          1. Kaa
            Kaa 17 February 2013 14: 44
            +7
            Quote: avt
            post-war attitude of Stalin to the Marshall plan

            Let's go in order. "The ideological rationale for American claims to world control was as old as the world. It was necessary to find an antagonist and present him as the culprit of world tension, and present his own diktat as forced or benevolent patronage. The main leverage is economic, aid was provided free of charge and in large volumes. Acheson-Clifford-Marshall prepared a document corresponding to the tasks set rather quickly - by May 23, 1947. This was the basis of the Marshall Plan. The report of the policy planning group provided for the economic recovery of West Germany. But in order to help the enemy of yesterday did not cause resistance from the public of the United States, it was necessary to provide assistance to other West European countries, which were supposed to put forward a program of their own economic recovery and development (providing the USA with a full report on the current state of its economy). America undertook to finance the entire "enterprise." On June 5, 1947, speaking at Harvard University, Secretary of State J. Marshall outlined the picture of the impending collapse of Europe and announced the "plan for the salvation of Europe", a plan with the help of which The United States wanted to take control of European development. Documents of that time clarify the picture. They leave no doubt that the inclusion of the USSR and Eastern European countries in the assistance program was unthinkable for the United States. Secretary of State Marshall asked Kennan and Bohlen if the USSR would accept the invitation to join the American plan. Both believed that Moscow would not do that. “It was a finely designed game - because the American congress would not support the assistance program if the Soviet Union was one of the recipients - but Marshall excitedly invited - with the consent of the President of Moscow, too.” British Foreign Minister Bevin quickly organized a conference of recipients of assistance on “ Marshall’s plan. ” The USSR, Poland, Czechoslovakia and Romania expressed their interests in the plan. What was the reaction of the Soviet Union? Molotov shortly after the landmark speech of Secretary of State Marshall at Harvard University (June 5, 1947) sent a note to the Central Committee of the All-Union Communist Party of Bolsheviks with a proposal to join the American plan. The Soviet Union, trying to maintain at least a minimal chance of preventing a split in Europe, nevertheless sent a high-ranking delegation to Paris in June 1947 to a trilateral conference, together with the British and French, to discuss the “Marshall Plan”. Molotov, led by a large delegation, arrived in Paris to meet and discuss with Bevin and Bidot. On July 2, Forrestal wrote in his diary: “I am deeply concerned about the next six months. I look at Paris and think that the program was designed to prevent the Russians from participating in it. ” Agentura (Guy Burgess) informed Stalin that the eastern zone of occupation in Germany, unlike the three western, would never receive American economic assistance. Historians today agree that the US Congress, if the USSR joined the "Marshall Plan", would have made this help purely decorative. The Soviet side proposed changing the procedure for providing assistance: each country would submit lists of the goods it needed, and the United States would act on the basis of bilateral agreements with recipient countries. This offer was rejected..Stalin denied the two demands of the Americans: the unification of European resources, in which Soviet funds would be used to boost Western European industry; Opening accounts of where American money will go. July 2, 1947, Stalin ordered Molotov, already discussing the specifics of the plan, to leave the French capital. http://www.erlib.com/
            1. Kaa
              Kaa 17 February 2013 14: 58
              +6
              Quote: Kaa
              Kaa

              .Also everything else, the connection of the USSR to financing under the Marshall Plan threatened with inevitable territorial losses. In June 1944, in Moscow, a meeting was held between Eric Johnston and American Ambassador Averell Harriman with Stalin and Molotov. The Americans proposed investing $ 10 billion in the Crimean economy, as well as creating a republic there where Jews from all over the world could move. It was also a question of Mikhoels as a possible leader of this republic.. Stalin insisted that investments should be directed not only to Crimea, but also to other areas of the USSR that suffered as a result of the war, and, in turn, proposed the figure of Kaganovich as the leader of the republic.
              Until June 1945, the Crimean Project seemed to remain in force and could in future become a key condition for the spread of the Marshall Plan to the USSR. The idea of ​​creating a Jewish republic in Crimea with the support of the United States received wider circulation among Soviet Jews. The Americans, in particular Harriman, continued to persistently find out: how far are the Soviets ready to go in political concessions in exchange for help within the framework of the USSR’s participation in the implementation of the “Marshall Plan”? Is the "Crimean project" for Moscow still a practical program? What benefits can be obtained by promising loans to Russia?
              «Purely confidential.
              US Department of Commerce
              A. Garrimanu
              Dear Averell!
              The President approves your plans. He added the following to them. The coexistence on the territory of Crimea of ​​the base of the Soviet Black Sea Fleet and the Jewish Republic, open for free entry of Jews from around the world, seems inconsistent, fraught with unpredictable consequences. This from the very beginning raised his doubts about the reality of the “Crimean project”. Crimea should become a demilitarized zone. Let Stalin know that he must be prepared to relocate the fleet from Sevastopol to Odessa and the Black Sea coast of the Caucasus. Then we will believe that the Crimean Jewish Republic is a reality, not a propaganda myth. J. Marshall »

              It was about creating a Jewish Socialist Soviet Republic with the possibility of secession from the USSR
              , The USSR began to actively support the creation of the state of Israel in part of Palestine. Soon they began to implement the project of creating the state of Israel - many Jewish refugees from all over the world rushed to Palestine (in 1945–46 their number reached 600 thousand people) .. “Since Stalin was determined to give his state to the Jews, it would be foolish to resist the United States!” - concluded US President Harry Truman and instructed the "anti-Semitic" State Department to support the "Stalin initiative" in the UN .. In November 1947, it adopted resolution No. 181 (2) on the creation of two independent states in Palestine: Jewish and Arab, immediately after British withdrawal (May 14, 1948)
              1. Kaa
                Kaa 17 February 2013 15: 45
                +9
                Quote: Kaa
                Kaa
                "Now let me say a few words about Brayton Woods."
                "If the Lord created the earth in six days, then the creators of the financial world managed in three weeks: from July 1 to 22, 1944. During this period, in the resort town of Bretton Woods in the US state of New Hampshire, an international conference was held with the complex title "Reforming the traditional system of gold standards of national currencies" .. The conference resulted in the signing of an agreement that went down in history under the name of Bretton Woods. The official goal was to proclaim the creation of a global financial system that would get rid of economic "nationalism" and "egoism" and lead to a stable work of mankind for the common good. In fact, the goal was completely different. . Money from the air, wealth from nothing, without labor. . Great Britain and the USA actively directed events in the direction they needed. . According to its results, the dollar was to become the world reserve currency. This problem was solved by the Second World War and tens of millions of deaths .. This is the only way European and other countries agreed to create in each of them a small copy of the US Federal Reserve System, a central bank independent of the government. Why did the USSR even take part in it? There was trade for the future structure of the world, and to refuse to participate in conferences would be foolish. In addition, the United States and England could commit any feint, up to a separate peace with Germany, in order to prevent Russians from entering Europe. The Soviet Union was an equal partner of the anti-Hitler coalition, Stalin intended to maintain a similar position for the post-war period. I think that he intended to share with Anglo-Saxons the sphere of influence not only in Europe and Asia, but also in the economy. The ruble zone is the dollar and pound zone. The power of gold is on the side of the bankers. The strength of the weapon, too: the United States has an atomic bomb, the Soviet Union, it will appear only in 1949 .. But the Anglo-Saxons were seriously planning to deliver a nuclear strike against Russia-the USSR in the event of Stalin’s disagreement to “surrender” their financial independence. The logic that the States promoted at this conference seemed flawless. Since the main gold reserves and the main working industry are now concentrated in the USA, only they can ensure the gold content of their currency. This meant that the post-war economy must be built on the basis of the dollar. It was proposed to save not yellow metal, but American and, in very small quantities, British currency. What did this lead to? To the fact that all other money of the world at once turned into secondary. Each country pledged to provide a one-time exchange of the entire volume of its national currency for dollars. This is where the system for linking the volume of rubles to the volume of dollars, from which the Central Bank of Russia works today, comes from. The fact that the States themselves will not need to do anything to print this “new gold” for themselves is left out of the picture. In 1944, a controlling stake in the global economy belonged to the USA, Great Britain and their partners, which was immediately reflected in Bretton Woods. Quotas were distributed in such a way that the Anglo-Saxons could always guarantee themselves any solution. The US quota in the charter was registered as 2750 (million SDRs), the UK - 1300. The USSR received only 1200, and France, for example, only 450. In December 1945, Stalin had the courage not to ratify the Bretton Woods Accords. not because "he didn’t like the capitalists" or "was a dictator", but simply because it was unprofitable for his power, the Anglo-Saxons were very worried .. Confrontation sets in - that same cold war. The West begins, and not the Soviet Union at all. The fight ensues because Stalin refused to surrender Russia's state sovereignty. Yeltsin and Gorbachev will hand him over for a couple.
                l
                1. Egoza
                  Egoza 17 February 2013 18: 40
                  +4
                  Dear Kaa! +++++++++ Yes, here are the rules do not order to vote so part for the same person! recourse
        3. wax
          wax 17 February 2013 15: 30
          -2
          Kaa, according to Lenin, you are fundamentally wrong.
          1. Kaa
            Kaa 17 February 2013 15: 50
            +6
            Quote: Wax
            according to Lenin, you are fundamentally wrong.

            1) Only he who does nothing is not mistaken.
            2) How many people - so many opinions.
            3) I have never claimed to have "possession of the ultimate truth."
            4) Please argue your vision of my "fundamental mistake" hi
        4. baltika-18
          baltika-18 17 February 2013 15: 57
          +7
          Quote: Kaa
          Trotsky all the time insisted on luring foreigners into Russia: civilization, money.

          Wise Kaa is your plus. The same thing is happening now. From here we conclude that the current guardians of Russia are no different from Trotsky.
          1. Kaa
            Kaa 17 February 2013 16: 07
            +5
            Quote: baltika-18
            Russia's current guardians are no different from Trotsky.
            I won’t tell about everyone, but many still yes
            “Socialism, they argued, is international in nature and presupposes the elimination of borders, at least between the main industrial countries. With the uncontrolled movement of capital through the system of commercial banks and other attributes. Do you see no similarities with how it all began under Gorbachev-Yeltsin? First, the economic reforms of the 88th - the transfer of state resources into the pockets of private traders, which allowed dealers to acquire large capital. Then the boundless liberalization of the foreign economic and banking sectors. And then the distribution of property to “their own”, that is, privatization in Yeltsin and Putin style with the unhindered transfer of assets from our country. The Bnay Brit team, of course, did not stutter about privatization. But the logic of her actions led to this. But the transformation of the Trotskyists from Communists into capitalists would have occurred instantly. So it happened with many party bureaucrats of the 90s. An amazing thing flew by for almost three quarters of a century, and Bnay Brit’s recipes did not change. The state supply system of enterprises, like in Gorbachev-Yeltsin times, collapsed before our eyes - raw materials and materials left through cooperatives and private firms. The scale, of course, was still not the same - the country did not go through industrialization. But still. For example, the government sent a large number of saws purchased in England to the Sibkraysoyuz for timber companies, but they did not reach the lumberjacks - they were sent back to Moscow through the private company Bakanov, Lisitsyn, Vagin and Kazakov, where they were sold at markets ...
            Gold from the Irkutsk province, Oirot and other regions ceased to go to the plants for processing - it was actively bought from miners by currency traders.
            NEP authorized the private production and sale of alcohol. Up to ten percent of peasant farms switched to super profitable business. Up to 100 million pounds of bread were transferred to the production of alcoholic potions per year. Russia was immersed in a drunken state. Casinos opened in Moscow, prostitutes roamed in packs. In restaurants, Nepmans walked with officials. Corruption began to gain momentum. The courts heard the same cases: bribes, bribes, bribes. Without a bribe, it was impossible to rent land, a factory, or a store. This phenomenon has especially spread in Leningrad, the current supplier of leading Russian cadres. The number of administrative and supervisory institutions increased there to 3115, in which 171 thousand officials accumulated. Even the workers in the city were fewer. The officials wanted to live better than others - they did not hesitate to extort the population. Did someone catch them? Of course. True, investigators and judges of Leningrad also loved bribes - they let go of those caught. In 1924, only one visiting session of the Supreme Court of the RSFSR examined 42 criminal cases of responsible forensic investigators in the city on the Neva. All were convicted, 17 people were sentenced to death. The permissiveness of speculators and swindlers caused toothache among the people. Opposition to power politics grew stronger. Http: //webcache.googleusercontent.com/search? Q = cache: http: //www.pra

            vnabat
            .ru / story / sovremennye-demokraty-prodolzhateli-dela-trotskogo
            1. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 29
              +2
              Quote: Kaa
              An amazing thing, it flew for almost three quarters of a century, and the recipes of Bnai Brit have not changed.

              Even more surprisingly, our manic tendency to step on the rake also did not change ... which, apparently, determines the invariability of Bnai Brit's recipes.
          2. Ascetic
            Ascetic 17 February 2013 17: 59
            +7
            Quote: baltika-18
            Wise Kaa is your plus. The same thing is happening now. From here we conclude that the current guardians of Russia are no different from Trotsky.


            Very well trained people work in the fifth column. They are very well able to tune the audience to the thoughts that they need. They regularly go to trainings abroad; they do not hide this. And what thoughts will train foreign trainers to inspire? Of course, not aimed at strengthening the statehood of Russia. Russia still has a nuclear baton and therefore war with it is only possible informational. What is now in full swing. The Internet is another battlefield and, judging by the statements of users, the fifth column wins here.
            A lot of such disruptive media products were made by re-educated local residents. They are already convinced that undermining statehood is their own thought, that they are an intelligentsia that independently makes decisions and themselves, without any thirty pieces of silver, work against their country. Free, just like that, destroy statehood. They think that their thoughts are advanced, that they understand the situation, and most certainly, these thoughts are not flooded in their heads from abroad, but are born of their mind after a deep analysis of the situation. Just as those who broke the Iron Curtain in the Soviet Union once thought. They are smart people, educated, great specialists. They consider themselves intelligentsia for good reason. But they are naive, suggestible and stupid in everyday life, such everyday fools, like those who destroyed the USSR. I am familiar with such a family of ordinary intellectuals who defended democracy at the "White House" for 20 years, and today, 20 years later, they wear white ribbons, because like 20 years ago, as they say, they want to live not by lies and they have AJP, this is not the diagnosis, as they think, is an active life position, which has taught them nothing for 20 years.

        5. SASCHAmIXEEW
          SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 10: 15
          -1
          One today, and the authorities are the same, so we need a second Stalin with the repressions of the liquidationists who are in power !!!!
    5. Kyrgyz
      Kyrgyz 17 February 2013 11: 00
      +10
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Particularly surprised by the comparison with Peter I and Ivan the Terrible.

      Merits of Stalin no less if not more
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Well, you know ... Yes, Stalin left an industrial country with an atomic bomb and a powerful economy, but he accepted the Empire, and to say that the Russian Empire in 1917 looked like boyar Rus before Peter was somehow wrong.

      Stalin led the country in the late 20s nominally, really in the 30s, and from that country that was at 17m, then only memories remained
      It can also be said that Putin led the country after the USSR, slyly missing 92-99
      1. Vladimirets
        Vladimirets 17 February 2013 11: 22
        0
        Quote: Kyrgyz
        Merits of Stalin no less if not more

        I wouldn’t deny it anywhere, no? How amazing is the ability of people to grab the right words out of context.
      2. sniper
        sniper 17 February 2013 16: 37
        +8
        Quote: Kyrgyz
        Stalin led the country in the late 20s nominally, really in the 30s, and from that country that was at 17m, then only memories remained

        I am a bad historian, and I don’t really believe in the quality of archives, I think that every ruler, having come to power, removed from the archives what could compromise him, but this is not about that ... I completely agree that completeness Stalin did not have power in the 20s, but he did not have it even until his death, although he managed to get a "controlling stake" in the late 30s ... I'm just trying to think logically. Take Khrushchev, he was Stalin's associate ???? No, of course not, but he held a very significant post and why is he around him, first of all, in the army, the police, the NKVD, will put people loyal to Stalin? It would be silly, he promotes his supporters, the purges begin, and what do we see? They are not cleaning at the same time trying to cause discontent among the people ... And this happens almost everywhere ... There was a difficult time and there were not so many supporters in Stalin, there was no unity in the party and there could not be ... So any Stalin initiative ran into a frank sabotage is at the highest level ... Therefore, I believe that blaming Stalin for all the victims is fundamentally wrong, most of the blood is in the hands of the opponents of Stalin, and not on him ...
    6. Oleg14774
      Oleg14774 17 February 2013 11: 20
      +9
      Empire "empire" strife! So Russia, which Putin "accepted", could also be called an empire conditionally (why not, why not call it). But you can call anything anything you want, only this will not correspond to the fact.
      Read about that time in Martins Ludo's book "A Different View of Stalin". The Belgian cannot be accused of "love" for Russia, and even more so for Stalin. But as we have recently noticed, there are also thinking people in the West. And if there are those who think, why do we believe Western propaganda about Stalin spread through "" our "" (even in double quotes) media!
    7. Alexander 1958
      Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 11: 43
      +2
      Good afternoon!
      Arguing
      Quote: Vladimirets
      but frankly, the justification of all his actions looks unconvincing

      you probably missed this paragraph in an article by Fursov
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Stalin made mistakes, sometimes very annoying. Yes, it is the fault of a whole series of processes and phenomena - the fault that he shares with his time.

      Alexander 1958
    8. Vadivak
      Vadivak 17 February 2013 11: 56
      +12
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Is it after Peter that there is nothing left? Well you know ..


      It remains, of course, that the German woman was a formidable prostitute who became empress, an empty treasury, foreigners and masons in power, a ruined patriarchal Orthodox church (restored only under Stalin), taxes on smoke and fords, but a lot of anything remained, but that’s not the main thing

      Previously, the throne passed in a direct male descending line, but according to the manifesto on February 5, 1722, the autocrat was given the right to appoint a successor for himself at his own request
      Autocracy has rarely punished itself so severely as in the person of Peter this law on February 5, ”wrote Klyuchevsky. Peter I did not have time to appoint an heir: the throne was given “to chance and became his toy” - it was not the law that determined who should sit on the throne, but the guard, which at that time was the “dominant force”.

      Peter signed the death sentence of the Russian monarchy, since the time of Catherine 2 Russians were no longer on the throne. Therefore, the Germans scoffed and strengthened serfdom, sold the Russian man as cattle at a time when the metro was launched in London
      1. Prophetic
        Prophetic 17 February 2013 16: 31
        0
        Catherine was not a convoy prostitute, but this is not important. The main thing is not who, but WHAT she was. Stalin, for example, was the son of a shoemaker, but that did not stop him from creating a red empire.
        Taxes? In Europe, taxes were no less. Empty treasury? Treasury is a bargain. Yes, in many countries the state of the treasury was NEGATIVE, because lived in debt to the Jews. It’s not necessary to go far for examples even now.
        Quote: Vadivak
        strengthened serfdom sold Russian people as cattle at a time when the metro was launched in London
        In the US, slavery was abolished even later, so what? Did it bother them much?
        Political change is a consequence of the economy, and not vice versa. Not for nothing that Nekrasov wrote about the abolition of serfdom, that a great chain broke, and struck one end on the gentleman, the other on the peasant. The apple must ripen, and the green can be poisoned. Alexander 2 also wanted to cancel it, but he thought better of it, because his own elite would have nailed for that.
        1. Strategia
          Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 54
          +5
          Quote: Prophetic
          In the US, slavery was canceled even later

          So there is the slavery of blacks, and not their fellow believers!
    9. Deniska999
      Deniska999 17 February 2013 12: 06
      +12
      As V. M Molotov said: The enemies of Stalin are the enemies of Russia.
    10. shasherin_pavel
      shasherin_pavel 17 February 2013 12: 15
      +12
      In boyar Russia, Peter had companions, when many counts and princes shaved their chins and wore European dresses. one should not think that Peter was the complete opposite of the surrounding society in Russia. At the same time, we must not forget that Grozdny left Russia after his rule with thousands of guns, but they were scattered throughout the territory of Russia, each city had its own fusions and cannons, So Peter accepted the country already prepared for imperial formation. Stalin took her with a plow, see the photos of that time. (it should be noted that the plow was not a symbol of poverty, but the correct agricultural tool for agriculture, the plow was used for sowing barley, and barley was never planted for plowing). After Peter, many ships fell apart with the connivance of the new ruling elite, because Peter was building a fleet in a hurry, and the technology for preparing wood for building ships did not correspond to the experience of England or Holland. Disruption of wood processing for ships required a lot of effort from the crew and the cost of financing the fleet. And Stalin was not allowed to complete the construction of battleships of the Soviet Union type with 406 mm guns. Stalin "took over the empire" which lost the Kuriles, drowned its fleet in the Tsushima Strait, lost half of Sakhalin, lost the Principality of Finland, about which the Swedes said: “We lost a wild tribe, and it returned to the Grand Duchy of Finland, and a proud lion." the empire lost Poland, Western Ukraine and Western Belarus, as well as the entire Baltic region. With a lost fleet in the Black Sea, and a rusty one in the Baltic, a complete lack of such in the North and Pacific. Continue on! or not?
      1. alexandr00070
        alexandr00070 17 February 2013 12: 25
        +3
        Quote: shasherin_pavel
        At the same time, one should not forget that Grozdny left thousands of guns after his reign, but they were scattered throughout Russia, each city had its fusee and guns, so Peter accepted the country already prepared for imperial formation.

        You are confusing something (John IV Vasilievich (Grozny) August 25, 1530 - March 18, 1584 - First Tsar of All Russia -------- Peter I Alekseevich (The Great) June 9, 1672 - February 8, 1725 --- First All-Russian Emperor) between them 140 years of difference, several kings, troubled times, etc. And also Ivan, Rurikovich, and Peter Romanov, so who is to whom, that is left unclear
    11. Basilevs
      Basilevs 17 February 2013 13: 22
      +4
      I don’t want to go into my favorite books, here’s only one episode. At school, in the distant Soviet era, I knew from textbooks and films that Peter 1 created the Russian fleet, etc. ... But already in adulthood I could not recall the actions recorded in the history of this fleet AFTER Peter. Apparently, he quietly decayed, having no use. And how much work, blood and lives did he cost ??
    12. Urrry
      Urrry 17 February 2013 13: 32
      0
      "but he accepted the Empire" ... in my history books, between the flourishing Empire and the coming to power of Stalin, there is a period of an unsuccessful and costly war, revolution, chaos, destruction of the state apparatus and administration, devastation, darkening of mind ... but that one Peter the Great really came to power against a completely different background :)
    13. Zmey_2Garin
      Zmey_2Garin 17 February 2013 13: 43
      +3
      Vladimirets,
      In my opinion, you have not read the article very carefully. The author clearly and unambiguously said that not all of Stalin's actions and decisions deserve approval. Stalin is a man, albeit of a huge scale, and he had mistakes, even more, ERRORS. But, if you compare, the pros still outweigh. I agree with the author that the fact that we are now (up to now!) "Gnawing at" the Soviet "groundwork" is a huge merit of Stalin, who managed to give such an acceleration to a huge country!
    14. Avenger711
      Avenger711 17 February 2013 13: 53
      0
      He took the ruins of an empire. Which even before the WWI didn’t somehow pull the empire. The exam did not pass the war.
    15. Steering wheel
      Steering wheel 17 February 2013 15: 05
      +3
      The Haaretz newspaper reported that 5 SSA fighters were injured in clashes with the Syrian army near the northern border of Israel. It is noted that they were taken to the hospital in Safed.
      In addition to the supply of weapons and food to terrorists in Syria, the Zioni offspring is already openly treating them in their territory - and this is what they themselves show
    16. Cynic
      Cynic 17 February 2013 15: 05
      +3
      Quote: Vladimirets
      Particularly surprised by the comparison

      And the appearance of comparisons of Gorbi with Peter I, did not surprise you at one time? But in terms of the scale of their impact on Russia they are very, very comparable.
      Both that and this Russia were remade in a western way.
      I will not say anything, such as opening my eyes to the obvious, just by historical sources, find out under which Russian tsar the Russian zemlya has grown the most and how it was called.
      As said
      They need great shocks, we need Great Russia!
    17. starshina78
      starshina78 17 February 2013 19: 08
      +4
      What kind of empire did Stalin accept? Russian? Nothing remained of it as a result of two revolutions and a civil war - that's one thing. Second, Stalin (correctly written by the author of the article) only in the thirties became the head of the country after the 17th Congress of the All-Union Communist Party "B" in 1934. It was then that the country's revival began, its transformation into an industrial, powerful state began. The construction of new factories began, the missing technologies were bought for the rise and development of new industries, and many other things. And this is the merit of Stalin. He put forward the slogan "Let's turn the country into an industrial giant! "And the people supported him. From there appeared their heroes - the Stakhanovites. Remember the film" Time Forward! ". I would also like to say about the lies spread by the figures from Memorial and the like. Allegedly, Stalin was in prostration after the outbreak of the war. Although the entries in the log of Stalin's reception of visitors from June 0.00:220 to June 25 indicate that that he practically did not sleep, but carried on intensive work.After Stalin's death, everyone wanted to slander him, but this dancer tried most of all (Khrushchev almost always danced at all buffets, Stalin laughed at him about this). Speech at the 20th Congress in 1956 Khrushchev took revenge on Stalin, so Stalin is a great man!
    18. Galan
      Galan 17 February 2013 20: 41
      +2
      The article does not justify Stalin in all his actions, but speaks of the need for an assessment taking into account his time and real conditions. The fight against the "old guard." How to fight her if she had ten years of experience in underground struggle, terrorist acts in tsarist Russia. The civil war washed away the last remnants of humanism from it (though it is strange to talk about the humanism of these old revolutionaries).
      The struggle was not comic in the country and the methods were applied quite adequate to that time.
    19. Ross
      Ross 18 February 2013 10: 12
      +1
      Vladimirets,
      Peter hated everything Russian, and Stalin carefully raised it! Peter doesn’t fit Stalin in soles. Read the author that left one and the other after the people.
    20. SASCHAmIXEEW
      SASCHAmIXEEW 18 February 2013 18: 20
      +1
      Everyone is mistaken, but Stalin is right globally, and from Peter to Stalin RUSSIA was built different for another 200 years, but everyone was thinking about RUSSIA, and what is Mendel and Putin thinking about when passing laws against RUSSIA !!?
    21. ia-ai00
      ia-ai00 April 27 2013 07: 53
      0
      Well, of course, Stalin
      he accepted the Empire
      ... but which
      - after the First World War, revolution and civil war ?! Hungry, ruined, illiterate! And just as Peter himself, for fun, he killed and mutilated people, built Petersburg on the bones ... - read classics about Peter!
    22. saha6052
      saha6052 13 August 2013 16: 59
      0
      One senses: even a strong author is too tough for the task: to wash the black cat to white - Neither Grozny nor Peter buried Russia - then there were no developed communications and total "class" ideologies to which one could subscribe to a part of the country's passionary layer and start a game of falling ( suicide).
    23. saha6052
      saha6052 13 August 2013 17: 15
      0
      And it is strange that such an author does not explain the concept of a "quota" - for execution, this is also Khrushchev invented or carried out the instructions of Pahan, who confused the New World with a meat-plant. In the memoirs of one general I remember the remarks: Semyon! - wash (it was in the bathhouse) calmly - you see yourself - they don't take Fools (it was going to war, why would the gigantic people need Eyes?) If he also had Eyes - what the hell is war?
      1. Cynic
        Cynic 13 August 2013 18: 09
        0
        Quote: saha6052
        Khrushchev also invented this or carried out the installation of Pakhan

        Ask who the author of the resolution is Khrushchev’s paper _ Smother!
  2. 111a29
    111a29 17 February 2013 10: 09
    +18
    To author +
    "Stalin did not remain in the past, he disappeared in the future"
  3. enot555
    enot555 17 February 2013 10: 12
    +15
    Here is such a leader now that the unfinished geyropa and degenerated PIN should be taken to cry with hot tears and shaking in horror !!! am am am
    further existence and survival in a world where everyone wants to grab a piece from Russia is possible only with a person like I.V. STALIN ---
    GLORY OF THE SOVIET EMPIRE !!!
  4. plebs
    plebs 17 February 2013 10: 16
    +24
    If JV Stalin had destroyed millions, lost tens of millions in the war, millions were in prison, after the war there would have been such a demographic hole that the USSR would not have crawled out of. Nobody in the world needs a strong Russia, which is why all kinds of liars Mlechina and Svanidze and his comrades thrive here. If JV Stalin had television, we would live in a different, I think, fairer world.
    1. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 10: 59
      +11
      Quote: plebs
      such a demographic pit from which the USSR would not crawl out

      The number of Russians (Great Russians, Little Russians and Belarusians) during Stalin's rule increased, according to censuses, on average by 1,3-1,5 million per year.
      1926 g. - 113,7 mln. (146,6 mln. - the total population of the USSR)
      1939 g. - 133 million (170,6 million)
      1959 g. - 159,3 million (208,8 million)
      For comparison: during the reign of Yeltsin, the number of Russians in Russia decreased by 6,8 mln. People, during the reign of Putin - by 6,4 mln.
      1. Komodo
        Komodo 17 February 2013 11: 08
        +1
        This is considering the second world war. Get fucked up. We are getting smaller. Fuck it.
      2. djon3volta
        djon3volta 17 February 2013 11: 08
        -1
        Quote: alexandr00070
        For comparison: during the reign of Yeltsin, the number of Russians in Russia decreased by 6,8 mln. People, during the reign of Putin - by 6,4 mln.

        under Stalin, it was impossible to leave for permanent residence in another country.
        do not understand at all, where do you take these millions of numbers about the population decline under Putin? "when there is no news, I make it up" M. Twain. wassat
        1. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 17 February 2013 11: 17
          +1
          Quote: djon3volta
          under Stalin, it was impossible to leave for permanent residence in another country.

          People flee the country not from a good life, but the data here http://stalinism.ru/stalin-i-sovremennost/sssr-pri-staline-tolko-faktyi.html
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 17 February 2013 11: 27
            +10
            Quote: alexandr00070
            People flee the country not from a good life,

            And who runs away from what’s old, and more runs away from those who try to escape from criminal liability. In Russia, many parameters are many times better than in the west. The Hollywood picture no longer works.
          2. djon3volta
            djon3volta 17 February 2013 11: 35
            -1
            Quote: alexandr00070
            People fleeing a country not from a good life

            a direct question - under Stalin, could a simple man leave the USSR? and under Khrushchev, Brezhnev, Gorbachev?
            another question, under Yeltsin and Putin, people weren’t born in Russia? didn’t come to permanent residence in Russia? just died, went and went, went away, right? why don’t you bring the population’s profit in figures? For comparison, you were too lazy to pull out the picture which ones are convenient for you, do you like to show that everything is bad in Russia? well, according to your post, this is not visible with the naked eye. if you loved Russia, you wouldn’t compare it with such pictures.
            as opposed to this.
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 11: 48
              +10
              Quote: djon3volta
              , under Yeltsin and Putin, people were not born in Russia


              We are discussing an article about Stalin, not your love for Putin, and by the way, love for Putin is not expressed in love for Putin, do not confuse
              1. baltika-18
                baltika-18 17 February 2013 16: 01
                +2
                Quote: alexandr00070
                We are discussing an article about Stalin, not your love for Putin, and by the way, love for Putin is not expressed in love for Putin, do not confuse

                Well done, Sasha. He answered well. Keep it up. drinks
            2. vovan1949
              vovan1949 17 February 2013 17: 06
              +2
              I lived under Stalin, and under Brezhnev, and under Khrushchev. Neither I, nor my parents, friends, acquaintances, thought to go abroad. What for?
              On the second question. Yes, people were born under Putin and under Yeltsin. But less was born than it was decreasing and dying. And so for 20 years.
              But your picture doesn’t mean anything.
        2. Komodo
          Komodo 17 February 2013 11: 36
          +6
          Departure from the country was regarded as a betrayal, given that the Union opposed the whole West.
        3. Kaa
          Kaa 17 February 2013 11: 46
          +13
          Quote: djon3volta
          under Stalin, it was impossible to leave for permanent residence in another country.

          Dear, I can’t agree with you here. There was one period when decent people went to Israel to order ... to Israel ....
          "In November 1947 g. It adopted resolution No. 181 (2) on the establishment of two independent states in Palestine: Jewish and Arab, immediately after the withdrawal of British troops (May 14, 1948). It was important for Stalin to consolidate, in defiance of the British, diplomatic success and, if possible, annex the future Jewish state in Palestine to the newly created world camp of socialism. For this, a government was prepared in the USSR "for the Jews of Palestine." Solomon Lozovsky, a member of the Central Committee of the All-Union Communist Party of Bolsheviks, a former deputy people's commissar for foreign affairs, and the director of the Sovinformburo should become the prime minister of the new state. Twice Hero of the Soviet Union tanker David Dragunsky was approved as Minister of Defense, Grigory Gilman, senior intelligence officer of the USSR Navy, became the naval minister. But in the end, a government was created from the international Jewish Agency, headed by its chairman Ben-Gurion (a native of Russia); and the "Stalinist government" dismissed, ready to fly to Palestine. It is not known for certain how many Soviet troops left for Palestine before and during the War of Independence. According to Israeli sources, 200 thousand used legal or illegal channels. Soviet Jews. Of these, “several thousand” are military personnel. In any case, the main language of "interethnic communication" in the Israeli army was Russian. He occupied the second (after the Polish) place in all of Palestine. Secretly sent to Israel and Soviet officers. Great opportunities appeared in the Soviet intelligence. According to State Security General Pavel Sudoplatov, "the use of Soviet intelligence officers in combat and sabotage operations against the British in Israel was already begun in 1946." They recruited agents among the Jews leaving for Palestine (mainly from Poland). As a rule, these were Poles, as well as Soviet citizens who, taking advantage of family ties, and in some places forged documents (including nationality), traveled through Poland and Romania to Palestine. Israeli special forces were created from scratch. The best officers of the NKVD-MGB took direct part in the creation and training of the commandos (the “Stalin Falcons” from the Berkut detachment, 101st reconnaissance school and the “C” Directorate of General Sudoplatov) who had operational and sabotage experience: Otroshchenko, Korotkov, Vertiporoh and dozens of others. In addition to them, two generals from the infantry and aviation, the vice admiral of the Navy, five colonels and eight lieutenant colonels, and, of course, junior officers for immediate field work, were urgently sent to Israel. Among the "younger" were mostly former soldiers and officers with the corresponding "fifth column" in the questionnaire, who expressed a desire to repatriate to their historical homeland. As a result, Captain Halperin (born in Vitebsk in 1912) became the founder and first leader of Mossad intelligence, created the Shin Bet public security and counterintelligence service. The history of Israel and its special services “honorary pensioner and faithful heir to Beria,” the second man after Ben-Gurion, entered under the name Iser Harel. Smersha officer Livanov founded and led the foreign intelligence of Nativa Bar. He took the Jewish name Nehimiya Levanon, under which he entered the history of Israeli intelligence.
          1. Egoza
            Egoza 17 February 2013 19: 28
            +1
            Quote: Kaa
            to create an entire state for permanent residence, on the order of DECENT people went ... to Israel ....

            So I.V. Stalin conceived Israel as the outpost of the USSR! Because there are so many military experts there, the best officers of the NKVD_MGB!
        4. Alexander 1958
          Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 12: 11
          +5
          Good afternoon!
          The latest data for 2012. The population of Ukraine is 45 million 500 000 people for 1991 52 million with a tail. It takes-we get about 7 million minutes. At the end of the 80s in Ukraine there was still a weak population growth. You can see the data on Russia's demographic losses yourself.
          Alexander 1958
          1. morpex
            morpex 17 February 2013 15: 12
            -5
            Alexander 1958,
            Latest data for 2012 year. Population of Ukraine 45 mln 500 000 people for 1991 year 52 mln with a tail. It takes-we get minutes 7 million. At the end of the 80's in Ukraine there was still a weak population growth.
            I dare to console you. Again, well, negotiate everything to the end! This population has not gone anywhere. Officially, 6, 5 of a million Ukrainians went to work and for permanent residence over the hill. And how many illegal immigrants? So, put it on and there will be the same figure in 52 million.
            1. Misantrop
              Misantrop 17 February 2013 16: 10
              +3
              Quote: morpex
              Officially, 6 million Ukrainians went to work and for permanent residence over the hill. And how many illegal immigrants?
              That's only 45 million is obtained just taking into account those who left. If you counted by actual availability at the time of the census, the numbers would have been generally slaughter
              1. Kaa
                Kaa 17 February 2013 17: 42
                +3
                Quote: Misantrop
                That's only 45 million is obtained just taking into account those who left.

                "6500000 employees currently work outside Ukraine. This is 14,4% of the total population of the country (the representative office of the International Organization for Migration) in Ukraine.
                Of the 6,5 million migrants, 67% are men, 33% are women. More often than Ukrainian, Russia, Germany, the USA, Israel, the Czech Republic, Hungary and Poland choose for labor migration. According to IOM, 54% of Ukrainian migrants work in the construction sector, 17% - in the field of home care, 9% each in the agricultural sector and trade, another 6% - in industry and 5% are engaged in other types of work. The largest number of citizens leave the Transcarpathian and Chernivtsi regions, the smallest - from Kiev, Odessa, Zhytomyr , Kirovograd, Poltava, Dnipropetrovsk. The main factor affecting the migration behavior of residents of different regions is the economic situation. For example, in the Donetsk region, the average per capita income is $ 683, in Bukovina, the average income is $ 352. Regarding the level of education of Ukrainian labor migrants, then, according to IOM, 59% have complete secondary education, 17% have basic or incomplete education higher education, 14% - higher education, However, regardless of the level of education, almost all Ukrainian labor migrants work in jobs that do not require high qualifications .. http://kosiv.info/rada/kosivs/tidings/4560-6-5 - 2011 data.
                During 2012, remittances to Ukraine decreased significantly. This was reported by the National Bank of Ukraine on its official website. So, $ 4,29 billion was transferred from Ukraine to Ukraine from abroad. This is the lowest figure for the last three years. If in 2010 the volume of funds brought to the state through a variety of payment systems amounted to $ 5860000000 billion, then in 2011 this figure reached as much as $ 7,02 billion. During this time, only $ 0,73 billion was withdrawn from Ukraine. Earlier, experts have repeatedly expressed the opinion that one of the main sources of foreign exchange to Ukraine is domestic workers who work for a long time outside the homeland, but transfer the money earned to relatives home.
                http://tsn.ua/groshi/groshovi-perekazi-v-ukrayinu-skorotilisya-ledve-ne-vdvichi-
                282437.html
                A related question arises. who then votes in Western Ukraine?
                "" The Ministry of Internal Affairs published the information received from the State Border Service about the citizens of Ukraine who went abroad. According to this information, it was established that the total number of entries with the numbers of passport documents of citizens who left the borders of Ukraine and did not return to Ukraine as of 19.08.2007. 3 is 323 million 524473 thousand citizens. Today, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the General Prosecutor's Office of Ukraine and the Central Election Commission have at their disposal the names of persons who did not return to Ukraine. According to these data, the largest number of citizens who left Ukraine , observed in the Lviv region - 255085 persons, Transcarpathian region - 202343 persons, Ivano-Frankivsk region - 175650 persons, Ternopil region - 16 persons.At the same time, according to the head of the Lviv regional state administration, as of August 2007, 400 changes were made for more than 20 thousand voters who increased the number of voters in about blast by almost 19 percent of the total. This happens despite the fact that, as indicated above, according to the Ministry of Internal Affairs, as of August 2007, 524, more than 463 thousand residents of the Lviv region, who have the right to vote in the elections, went abroad! .http: //pr.dn.ua/articles/art_XNUMX.html
            2. Alexander 1958
              Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 18: 12
              +3
              For
              morpex
              Good afternoon!
              I am not an expert in statistics, but as far as I know, those people who went to work remain citizens of Ukraine and are taken into account when calculating the population of Ukraine. Not long ago I read an article about the census in Latvia, so they introduced a special column "Latvian citizens absent for more than a year" ..!
              I would also like Ukraine to not die out, but the facts are stubborn .. In Dneprodzerzhinsk in the 80s, we had 295 thousand inhabitants, now less than 250 thousand. I think the statistics in Ukraine are no better.
              Are you looking at life through the eyes of Yanukovych? Well, he’s the president, he’s supposed to ex officio say that everything is fine with us .. But to you, why wishful thinking?
              Alexander 1958
        5. shasherin_pavel
          shasherin_pavel 17 February 2013 12: 54
          +2
          But what about all these homies that showed up in Europe after the "redrawing". Who told you that no one went abroad? Read the memoirs of Tupolev, the general designer of long-range bombers in Europe, but even in Brezhnev's times it was impossible to imagine this! It was they who later became all restricted to travel abroad, and under Stalin, many plant directors and designers visited Europe, and generals.
        6. Zmey_2Garin
          Zmey_2Garin 17 February 2013 14: 40
          +9
          And you so want to "for permanent residence in another country"?
          Welcome to me, to the Republic of Lithuania! I think you will like it: work for a miniscule pay \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ 'rectle, pay 60-65% of income per quarter payment, and the rest is purely for grub. And in order to earn more or less - regularly go on business trips for 40-45 months. This is provided that you have a profession in demand on the labor market.
          1. morpex
            morpex 17 February 2013 15: 14
            -6
            Zmey_2Garin,

            Do you think it is easier in Ukraine and Russia? I dare to assure you, even worse than yours ... much ...
            1. Komodo
              Komodo 17 February 2013 15: 20
              0
              In Russia, it is normal, here is another problem, many strive to do nothing at all, the eternal "dream of a Russian person about a freebie" works, and those who want to work live normally, moreover, they DO NOT ENOUGH HANDS !!!
              I have an uncle sovkovskoy hardening recently flew to Thailand. Generally movie
              Imagine a Soviet intelligentsia in Thailand. I still can’t laugh at his impressions))) ...
        7. vovan1949
          vovan1949 17 February 2013 16: 57
          +2
          @@ under Stalin it was impossible to leave for permanent residence in other countries ""

          Yes ... This is very true for millions of people. ???
      3. Alexander Romanov
        Alexander Romanov 17 February 2013 11: 26
        +3
        Quote: alexandr00070
        For comparison: during the reign of Yeltsin, the number of Russians in Russia decreased by 6,8 mln. People, during the reign of Putin - by 6,4 mln.

        What to compare times, before the family was the meaning of life, and now for many, a career, the birth of children has faded into the background. Not Putin, not Stalin will not force women to give birth.
        1. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 17 February 2013 11: 51
          +7
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          Not Putin, not Stalin will not force women to give birth.


          But Stalin can also motivate him in spite of the war and devastation.
          1. Alexander Romanov
            Alexander Romanov 17 February 2013 12: 16
            +12
            Quote: alexandr00070
            Stalin dealt with this despite the war and devastation

            And then Stalin, he did not give birth, but women. The meaning of life for people was different, the people themselves were different and the value was one-family! Now loot and career.
            1. Tsoi is alive
              Tsoi is alive 17 February 2013 12: 29
              +1
              Quote: Alexander Romanov
              Now loot and career.

              I’m looking at the flag, Alexander, you are back in Russia! drinks
              With what I congratulate you! wink
            2. wax
              wax 17 February 2013 15: 48
              +2
              Motivated. And very effective - financially and morally.
              1. loisop
                loisop 17 February 2013 22: 49
                +2
                And then there is such a film: "Once upon a time twenty years later"
        2. Strategia
          Strategia 17 February 2013 14: 10
          +7
          Quote: Alexander Romanov
          the meaning of life, and now for many, a career,

          Not a career, but a "golden calf" in the form of American green "cabbage" (toilet paper) and other "democratic values" in the form of mansions, yachts, etc. The worst thing is that the absolute majority is waged in a competition in personal enrichment.
        3. wax
          wax 17 February 2013 15: 36
          -1
          The hitch, however, is that times themselves are the work of human hands.
      4. Oleg14774
        Oleg14774 17 February 2013 11: 43
        0
        Failure under Putin is the consequences of the 90s.
        You read, Alexander, the old literature. The growth has gone!
        1. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 17 February 2013 12: 01
          +7
          Quote: Oleg147741
          The growth has gone!

          and no one says anything against anything, this year for the first time in 20 years we exceeded mortality by several people, and under Stalin
          1939 g. - 133 million (170,6 million)
          1959 g. - 159,3 million (208,8 million)
          20 years and 38 million in plus and add losses in the war
          1. Strategia
            Strategia 17 February 2013 14: 12
            +3
            Quote: alexandr00070
            for the first time in 20 years exceeded mortality

            Is it fertility or migration? And what is the percentage of growth of the "titular nation"?
          2. Oleg14774
            Oleg14774 17 February 2013 17: 07
            0
            Under Stalin (came to power in 1924 until 1939), Putin has only 15 years of age 13. Only two more years, if from 1959. then 35 years old. so Alexander, with respect to you, but there is still time!
      5. Avenger711
        Avenger711 17 February 2013 14: 18
        0
        And where does Putin ??
      6. morpex
        morpex 17 February 2013 15: 04
        -7
        alexandr00070,
        The number of Russians (Great Russians, Little Russians and Belarusians) during Stalin's rule increased, according to censuses, on average by 1,3-1,5 million per year.

        The number was growing not only due to fertility. When did the USSR enter the war? That's right, on 17 of September 1939 of the year. And it is precisely due to the occupation of the Baltic States, Western Ukraine and others (you need to add Karelia here) that number has grown. So, to say the least, tell the whole truth.
        1. Avenger711
          Avenger711 17 February 2013 15: 29
          +3
          And the occupation answer for the lie?
          1. morpex
            morpex 17 February 2013 17: 25
            -1
            Avenger711,
            And the occupation answer for the lie?
            Well, why do you perceive everything with anger? For the native people of that moment in a foreign country, we were invaders. It’s true! Well, imagine if we lose the war and we would live under the Germans now, what would we call them now? And then they were also invaders. Any soldier, of any army, stepping into the territory of another country is an invader if he remains there forever or for a long time.
            1. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 17: 28
              0
              Quote: Strategia
              first learn the meaning of occupation
            2. Kaa
              Kaa 17 February 2013 17: 51
              +8
              Quote: morpex
              For the indigenous people at that time in a foreign country, we were invaders

              Here they are, "poor victims of the occupation"
              1. morpex
                morpex 17 February 2013 18: 53
                -4
                Kaa, from them, "poor victims of the occupation"
                Respect Kaa.And what about other pictures on the theme of the victims of the occupation? For example, the corpses of those shot in Katyn?
                1. GP
                  GP 17 February 2013 19: 04
                  +3
                  Quote: morpex

                  Kaa, from oni, "poor victims of the occupation"
                  Respect Kaa.And what about other pictures on the theme of the victims of the occupation? For example, the corpses of those shot in Katyn?


                  The shooting of Polish officers, whose hands are up to the elbows in Russian blood, from robberies in Little and White Russia to concentration camps! Ay-yay, "poor victims of the occupation"; all the more it has not been reliably established whose hands this is the work of the NKVD or the Gestapo, the probability of Hitler's "service" to Stalin is high. With the Poles, Hitler, as well as with the Jews, did not stand on ceremony.
                2. Avenger711
                  Avenger711 17 February 2013 19: 41
                  +2
                  For Katyn to the Germans. And then the facts indicate this.
                3. Kaa
                  Kaa 17 February 2013 21: 58
                  +3
                  Quote: morpex
                  the corpses of those shot in Katyn?

                  I am wildly sorry, for God's sake, don’t consider me rude, but this vesch from the "Soldier's Tales" section is now believed:
                  1) Part (significant) of the Poles.
                  2) The heirs of the late Dr. Goebbels.
                  3) Liberals of the "white tape spill"
                  4) Victims of the process called "PROPAGANDA"
                  I don’t even want to discuss this topic, they will accuse and be banned for flood or trollism.
                  katyn.editboard.com ›stalin.su› book.php? action = header & id = 17 proza.ru ›2012/10/05/691 dm-dobrov.ru› history / katyn / katyn-5.html .... and more ... many thousands of times on this topic in the net. Thanks to Yakovlev, Gorbaty, EBN and their "guarantors", I wonder if they took it in zlotys, or in "evergreens"?
                  1. morpex
                    morpex 17 February 2013 23: 12
                    -1
                    Quote: Kaa
                    I am wildly sorry, for God's sake, don’t consider me rude, but this vesch from the "Soldier's Tales" section is now believed:

                    Kaa. But what then is it?
                    The investigation of the Chief Military Prosecutor’s Office of Russia, which ended in 2004, confirmed the death sentence of 14 542 by Polish prisoners of war on charges of state crimes by the NKVD Troika and reliably established the death of 1803 people and 22 of them.

                    The topic of the Katyn execution for a long time complicated the Polish-Russian relations. In 2010, Russian President Dmitry A. Medvedev noted: “The Katyn tragedy is a consequence of the crime of I. Stalin and a number of his minions. The position of the Russian state on this issue has long been formulated and remains unchanged. "

                    On November 26 on November 2010, the State Duma of Russia adopted a statement “On the Katyn tragedy and its victims,” which acknowledges that the mass shooting of Polish citizens in Katyn was carried out according to the direct instructions of Stalin and other Soviet leaders and is a crime of the Stalin regime.
                    1. Deniska999
                      Deniska999 18 February 2013 15: 20
                      +2
                      Come on, Medvedev can say anything, much less about Stalin. He supported de-Stalinization.
                      1. SASCHAmIXEEW
                        SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 12: 39
                        +1
                        Medvedev-Mendel is a protege of the Zionist top oligarchs, for whom Stalin is the enemy No. 1! He didn’t give them in the 30s to grumble RUSSIA !!! Here someone wrote, genetic hatred, I 100% agree with this, for the Zionists there is a strong, independent RUSSIA bone in the throat, and Stalin made it like that !!!
                    2. alexandr00070
                      alexandr00070 2 March 2013 01: 02
                      +1
                      Quote: morpex
                      The investigation of the Chief Military Prosecutor’s Office of Russia, which ended in 2004, confirmed the death sentence of 14 542 by Polish prisoners of war on charges of state crimes by the NKVD Troika and reliably established the death of 1803 people and 22 of them.

                      with 12,11 minutes about the real facts about Katyn
                  2. alexandr00070
                    alexandr00070 2 March 2013 01: 23
                    +1
                    Quote: Kaa
                    I am wildly sorry, for God's sake, don’t consider me rude, but this vesch from the "Soldier's Tales" section is now believed:

                    1. Kaa
                      Kaa 2 March 2013 03: 18
                      0
                      Quote: alexandr00070
                      alexandr00070

                      ++++ for all videos. The 60th anniversary of Stalin’s death is approaching, there will probably be articles on this topic, maybe put them again in the discussion? hi
                4. alexandr00070
                  alexandr00070 17 February 2013 22: 10
                  +5
                  Quote: morpex
                  For example, the corpses of those shot in Katyn?

                  What about ................ As a result of the war launched by Poland against Soviet Russia, the Polish army captured more than 150 thousand Red Army soldiers. In total, together with political prisoners and interned civilians, more than 200 thousand Red Army men, civilians, White Guards, fighters of anti-Bolshevik and nationalist (Ukrainian and Belarusian) groups were in Polish captivity and concentration camps.
                  the total number of Red Army soldiers killed in Polish camps is 18-20 thousand people. However, documents and materials from the collection "Red Army Men in Polish Captivity ..." make it possible to assert that the mortality rate of Red Army soldiers in Polish camps was much higher. G.V. Chicherin's note indicates the figure of 60 thousand Red Army soldiers who died. The Russian historian N.S. Raisky agrees with this number. And according to the calculations of the military historian M. V. Filimoshin, the number of those killed and died in Polish captivity of the Red Army is 82 people (Filimoshin. Voenno-istoricheskiy zhurnal, No. 500. 2).
                  In retaliation "for 92 privates and 7 officers who were brutally murdered by the 3rd Soviet cavalry corps", soldiers of the 49th infantry regiment of the 5th Polish army shot 200 captured Cossacks from machine guns.
                  1. krisostomus
                    krisostomus 18 February 2013 07: 43
                    -5
                    Not true. Poland did not oppose Soviet Russia and did not enter the territory of the RSFSR; it opposed the Bolsheviks who tried to establish Soviet power on Ukraine and Belarus, which had proclaimed themselves sovereign, at the request of the latter.
                5. alexandr00070
                  alexandr00070 2 March 2013 01: 42
                  +1
                  Quote: morpex
                  For example, the corpses of those shot in Katyn?


                  at 25 minutes
            3. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 21: 28
              +3
              Quote: morpex
              For the indigenous people at that time in a foreign country, we were invaders.

              As a result of the war, Ingria (Izhora), Karelia, Estonia, Livonia (Livonia) and the southern part of Finland (before Vyborg) were annexed to Russia, and St. Petersburg was founded. Russian influence was firmly established in Courland. However, according to the Nishtad Treaty, these territories were not ceded, but were sold by Sweden to Russia for huge sums of money - 2 million thalers (efimks), which placed a heavy additional burden on the country.
              The initiator of the war with Sweden was August II (King of Poland), his desire to take Livonia from Sweden, for the help he promised to return to Russia, the lands of Ingermanladia and Karelia, formerly belonging to it. Previously owned by her, Russia, and your statement about the occupation of countries only 20 years old living independently, this is the territory of Russia
              1. krisostomus
                krisostomus 18 February 2013 07: 48
                -2
                That is, you do not recognize the principles of international law? And in your practice, use the one that suits you more
        2. Strategia
          Strategia 17 February 2013 15: 56
          +3
          Well, if the whole truth, then again
          Quote: alexandr00070
          1926 g. - 113,7 mln. (146,6 mln. - the total population of the USSR)
          1939 g. - 133 million (170,6 million)

          Firstly, the Baltic states became part of the USSR only in 1940 (i.e., before the All-Union population census).
          Secondly, as a result of the Polish campaign of the Red Army, the territory with a population of only about 13 million people came under the control of the USSR, where not only Russians lived there.
          As for the term "occupation", you are more careful - first, study the meaning of the concept "occupation".
          1. morpex
            morpex 17 February 2013 17: 34
            0
            Strategia,
            As for the term "occupation", you are more careful - first, study the meaning of the concept "occupation".
            Occupation (from lat. Occupatio - “capture, occupation”) in the general case - the occupation by the armed forces of the state (the occupying army and navy) of the territory not belonging to it, not accompanied by the acquisition of sovereignty over it, usually temporary. The occupation should be distinguished from annexation, the act of the state joining all or part of a foreign territory unilaterally. The occupation in all cases is carried out using military force and has several types:
            occupation at war, military, enemy occupation
            post-war occupation pursuant to peace agreements
            peaceful (non-war) occupation (non-belligerent [9]), peacetime occupation
            1. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 17: 49
              0
              Quote: morpex
              the occupation by the armed forces of the state (the occupying army and navy) of territory not belonging to it, not accompanied by the acquisition of sovereignty over it, usually temporary

              Do you feel the difference?
              1. morpex
                morpex 17 February 2013 18: 11
                0
                StrategiaDo you feel the difference?

                I yes. And you?
                1. Strategia
                  Strategia 17 February 2013 19: 14
                  0
                  Quote: morpex
                  the occupation by the armed forces of the state (the occupying army and navy) of territory not belonging to it, not accompanied by the acquisition of sovereignty over itusually temporary.

                  Now you understand?
                  1. morpex
                    morpex 17 February 2013 19: 55
                    0
                    Quote: Strategia
                    Now you understand?

                    Quote: Strategia
                    usually temporary.

                    Are we still in the Baltic? As the definition of occupation, just to the point. Temporarily.....
                    1. Strategia
                      Strategia 17 February 2013 20: 00
                      0
                      Please read the whole phrase and delve into its meaning!
            2. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 17 February 2013 21: 33
              +2
              Quote: morpex
              in the general case, the occupation by the armed forces of a state (the occupying army and navy) of territory that does not belong to it,

              oh I repeat ............ The initiator of the war with Sweden was August II (the king of Poland), his desire to take Livonia from Sweden, for the help he promised to return to Russia, the lands of Ingermanladia and Karelia, formerly belonging to it.
              As a result of the war, Ingria (Izhora), Karelia, Estonia, Livonia (Livonia) and the southern part of Finland (before Vyborg) were annexed to Russia, and St. Petersburg was founded. Russian influence was firmly established in Courland. However, according to the Nishtad Treaty, these territories were not ceded, but were sold by Sweden to Russia for huge money - 2 million thalers (efimk), which placed a heavy additional burden on the country
              not going far into history, we bought these lands, and gave them away after the revolution for free and again took them back in 1940, because the Baltic States did not return money for the territory --- so where did the occupation come from?
        3. Cynic
          Cynic 17 February 2013 17: 43
          +1
          Quote: morpex
          And it was due to the occupation of the Baltic States, Western Ukraine and others (here it is necessary to add Karelia too) that number increased

          Your knowledge about the mechanism of accession to Russia of torn territories is simply amazing!
          By the way, many were struck by why, after the war, CCCP did not grow another republic!
          1. Avenger711
            Avenger711 17 February 2013 19: 47
            0
            No, we are better off separately from the Psheks and Finns, they are just under the heel.
    2. arnulla
      arnulla 17 February 2013 15: 23
      +4
      You have a mistake - mlechins and Svanidze should be written that way, with a small letter ...
  5. fenix57
    fenix57 17 February 2013 10: 17
    +26
    FOR ALL GOOD DON'T BEThere is much to say about Stalin, but I’m just sure that during the social survey of the population (in all regions, and not in Moscow and the Moscow region), the overwhelming majority of those polled are for the Stalinist order of things. Tired of ENDLESSNESS, IMPUNITY officials. Just needed ORDER. All these liberodemohemocrats in the geyropu hi
  6. Renat
    Renat 17 February 2013 10: 31
    +12
    Article +. If we compare Stalin with Peter and Ivan, then of course everyone is sure that the aponents of the leader look like true patriots, creators and defenders of the faith and the Fatherland. But we see them through the depths of centuries. As you know, time heals. Pyotr Alekseevich also ruined many souls in his time, but very few people remember this now. Not to mention Johann the Terrible. History has preserved only their conquests. It is still unknown where we would be now without the father of all nations. And throwing mud at Stalin was not only fashionable, but also distracted from the daily problems of rampant crime, corruption and general chaos. During his reign, no one could feel like Christ in the bosom. Including those who today consider themselves "masters of life" and do, frankly, whatever they please. Confident in their absolute impunity. It's my opinion. Maybe I'm wrong about something, but still ... Time will certainly put everything in its place.
    1. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 11: 24
      +5
      Quote: Renat
      Not to mention Johann the Terrible.

      John IV Vasilievich (1530-1584), nicknamed Ivan the Terrible - the first king of all Russia. The nickname "Terrible" is often presented in a distorted form - terrible, translated from English "terrible" or "scary". In Russian, “Terrible” means - with a thunderstorm for the wicked and with mercy for the good, so the king should rule. Grandfather also called Grandfather John IV - Ivan III.

      Under Ivan IV the Terrible, Russia became a gigantic world power, the unification of lands, the strengthening of public administration and the army took place. For Western Europe, such a gigantic and strong country, besides that professing the Orthodox faith, was terrible, therefore it was considered advisable to form a negative image of this country. [Andrey Vassoevich]
  7. djon3volta
    djon3volta 17 February 2013 10: 33
    +7
    the same thing happens around Putin, which happened around Stalin. read at least half of what is written, and put Putin instead of Stalin.
    with Putin coming to power, the country, although slowly, is moving forward, the standard of living will increase, people will not go hungry, there will be no global wars, the law will be respected at the very least. Yes, the problems remain - corruption, moronity, nepotism, but the West has been solving these problems for centuries! but we want everything at once, it doesn’t happen. Putin needs help! what is the opposition calling for rebellion! and what's next? typhoid and hunger?
    1. DeerIvanovich
      DeerIvanovich 17 February 2013 11: 37
      +2
      correctly noticed, the story is back to square one, but with new faces, I hope, and with more optimal solutions for an adequate asymmetric answer to the question!
    2. Xab
      Xab 17 February 2013 11: 56
      +2
      You think correctly. It's a shame that not all the right conclusions are drawn. It seems to be not stupid people on this site, but for some reason many people do not see anything beyond their nose. Vladimir Putin takes all this into account, all the mistakes of the former leaders and goes in the right direction. I am sure that if V.V. Putin somewhere to back down, his fate is the same as Gaddafi expects and knowing this, he is strengthening his position in every way. Our people should pray for Putin. And if everyone understood him and everyone supported him, he would have done everything long ago for what they reproach him for (there aren’t enough eggs). Health to him and success in everything ...
      1. Komodo
        Komodo 17 February 2013 12: 14
        +5
        GDP of people from the Soviet intelligentsia. He is well aware of history, an intellectual and intelligent person. Year of the Dragon. Dragon in eastern astrology is a sign of the winners. If only evil spirits would not let them go astray. Not redirected vector. Health to him and success in everything ...
      2. Karabin
        Karabin 17 February 2013 22: 35
        0
        Quote: XAB
        Vladimir Putin takes all this into account, all the mistakes of the former leaders and goes in the right direction.

        Accession to the WTO, i.e. to a globalist organization controlled by world capital - is this the right way?
      3. ozs
        ozs 18 February 2013 00: 17
        0
        You are not overheated by chance?
        For what it is necessary, he prays to our government, for Serdyukov, Fursenkov, Golikov, Chubais.
    3. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 14: 22
      +2
      Quote: djon3volta
      what the opposition is calling for riot!

      Who is calling for rebellion ?! Call for the legality of action - from fair elections to punishment of embezzlers and crooks! And for some reason, the authorities are starting to redo laws to protect criminals. In truth, he who has ears, let him hear, he who has eyes, let him see!
      1. alexandr00070
        alexandr00070 17 February 2013 14: 50
        +4
        Quote: Strategia
        Call for legality - from fair elections


        And how to prove that the elections were fair, any opposition is initially determined not to believe
        1. Strategia
          Strategia 17 February 2013 15: 59
          +1
          There is no need to prove anything - it is enough to ensure normal public control at polling stations.
          1. Egoza
            Egoza 17 February 2013 18: 53
            +4
            Quote: Strategia
            it is enough to ensure normal public control at polling stations.

            Alas! NOT enough! I was convinced personally! laughing
            1. Strategia
              Strategia 17 February 2013 19: 06
              0
              It means that they did not sufficiently ensure control at ALL STAGES of voting.
              1. Egoza
                Egoza 17 February 2013 21: 39
                +1
                Quote: Strategia
                AT ALL STAGES of voting

                At all stages of the delivery of ballots to the CEC! Here only close people work!
                1. Strategia
                  Strategia 17 February 2013 23: 58
                  0
                  Certified copies of the minutes (stamp and signature of the chairman of the PEC) are entitled to require each member of the PEC. Accordingly, the integrity of the elections can be controlled by these copies of the protocols. Documents of TECs are also not closed. Another thing is that even the chairpersons of PECs fled with the ballots without signing the protocols in the presence of the PEC members, and even more so without issuing copies of the protocols.
                  1. Komodo
                    Komodo 18 February 2013 00: 11
                    -1
                    The 2012 election is fair or not fair, that’s not the trick,
                    and the fact that out of 5 candidates initially,
                    any normal person, not immersed in the upsets
                    pre-election race, and most of them choose one.
                    From 1. Kremlin buffoon
                    2.Communist
                    3. The deputy of something there.
                    4.Oligarch
                    5. Popularly beloved prime minister.
                    Who will a normal person choose?
                    Everything is thought out in advance, and honest dishonest ones
                    And it's good that they think in advance.
                    1. Strategia
                      Strategia 18 February 2013 00: 21
                      0
                      Quote: Komodo
                      and honest dishonest no matter

                      What to talk about with you after these words ?!
                      1. Komodo
                        Komodo 18 February 2013 00: 53
                        +2
                        Moreover, I even think that elections in the country do NOT need to be held at all.
                        Because the bulk of people watch what TV brings to them. Which, however, rarely watches BECAUSE - PUSHES! And what does television carry? What channels did the fifth column not creep into, you know?
                        They don’t even know. And it seems to me that very soon few people will believe the media at all. Yes, and they will stop watching soon.
                        Further: To entrust the leadership of the country to the person whom they choose in some elections, to expose the country to the game of Russian roulette, this is the top of sloppiness. When the leader in the management system changes, IN ANY MANAGEMENT SYSTEM, the structure, goals, composition, plans changes IMMEDIATELY
                        virtually everything starts from scratch. Vector change. It is impossible to plan and develop long-term projects. Have you ever had a director change? So this is the same thing. Only globally.
            2. sleepy
              sleepy 18 February 2013 04: 17
              +2
              The nomination of Mrs. V. Matvienko in St. Petersburg for a deputy position.
              There was public control - what's the point?
    4. baltika-18
      baltika-18 17 February 2013 16: 15
      +1
      Quote: djon3volta
      the same thing happens around Putin, which happened around Stalin. read at least half of what is written, and put Putin instead of Stalin.

      Putin before Stalin, as before China, cancer. And if you carry out associations, then Putin is associated with Trotsky. In Soviet times, the proverb went "write ... shh, like Trotsky", now about the same.
    5. Karabin
      Karabin 17 February 2013 22: 46
      -2
      Quote: djon3volta
      the same thing is happening around Putin, which happened around Stalin.

      Yeah. Around Stalin's metallurgical, engineering and chemical giants. Around Putin's oil and gas pipelines and pipelines over the hill.
    6. SASCHAmIXEEW
      SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 13: 00
      0
      And who is in opposition, pigs detached from the feeder !!! Which RUSSIA broadcast on the drum + with the money of the State Department, I would have been more strict with them, but God does not give horns to a vigorous cow !!
  8. zennon
    zennon 17 February 2013 10: 39
    0
    The article is interesting, it has been analyzed a lot, there are interesting conclusions. But there are also things with which I disagree. For example, the derogatory and contemptuous assessment of Hitler. Don't like the personality? I am not delighted either. But I have to admit that he was a man of exceptional will, the best organizer and one of the best orators in history. To cement such a country with such a people, culture, history on his ideas is beyond the power of "plebeians and screamers". Five women made eight suicide attempts because of him, and three succeeded ...
    Not bad for "nothing"!
    1. Renat
      Renat 17 February 2013 10: 45
      0
      Hitler alone is certainly not an easy person. Good speaker organizer. But his coming to power was largely helped by the then economic situation in Germany.
      1. zennon
        zennon 17 February 2013 11: 18
        0
        Of course! As to the adventurer Lenin. wink
        1. SASCHAmIXEEW
          SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 13: 15
          0
          And both helped the liquid-Zionist moneybags and all with one goal to break RUSSIA, just like now !!
      2. Oleg14774
        Oleg14774 17 February 2013 11: 28
        +8
        Hitler was "brought" to power by those who brought Lenin to power in order to split Russia, Those who removed Stalin, Beria, installed Khrushchev (pri ... ka), installed Brezhnev, under whom they were quietly nurtured and placed in responsible and important posts Gorbachevs, Yeltsins, Gaidars, Chubais, etc. And then we were told that the USSR was exhausted and this is natural. It is natural that we pass .... whether our country! Relaxed and got the most out of it!
        And the rise of Germany is due to the work of a very competent apparatus of economists and organizers, who were set up to take away the same so that supposedly Germany would occupy the whole of Europe. This was done so that Germany alone would not physically (resource) pull out the war with the USSR.
        I’m thinking about something else, what if Hitler had thrown his "owners" and really united with Stalin. The union of Russia and Germany is a nightmare for the Anglo-Saxons, which is why they play our two nations against each other all the time.
        And so they would go to rest in the California region to relax, and to whom to go fishing, then to the Alaskan Territory for example.
        1. Komodo
          Komodo 17 February 2013 11: 40
          -3
          Who are these owners wondering ??. Which brought Hitler to power, Khrushchev, Lenin, Gorbachev, Brezhnev, let's better write and vote for them. What to talk with the Sixes ??? ADDRESSES, NAMES, STUDIO !!!!!!
        2. Renat
          Renat 17 February 2013 11: 58
          +1
          The fool was Hitler that flooded the Union. Unite it with Stalin no matter what the world is like now. I am sure that at least it is not worse than what we are observing now.
        3. Black
          Black 17 February 2013 17: 22
          0
          well, maybe to a resort in California, but it was possible - to hand number 147741 and to Auschwitz. fool
        4. Avenger711
          Avenger711 17 February 2013 19: 50
          +2
          Did someone bring Lenin with a bunch of scumbags? Learn stories and do not write nonsense. The interim government itself has done things.
        5. loisop
          loisop 17 February 2013 22: 59
          +1
          The union of Germany and Russia - yes, this is Bismarck bequeathed to his followers. But they didn’t listen. However, it is not Hitlerite Germany, not at all. Hitler had only one vector - the war with the USSR. Development and did not smell.
        6. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 20 February 2013 15: 36
          0
          Quote: Oleg147741
          Those who removed Stalin, Beria, put Khrushchev (at ... ka), set Brezhnev, in which Gorbachev, Yeltsin, Gaidar, Chubais, etc. it is natural. It is logical that we pass .... whether our country!
      3. DeerIvanovich
        DeerIvanovich 17 February 2013 11: 39
        +2
        Well, actually coming to power that Hitler, that Lenin, that the sharp rise of Japan before the Russo-Japanese war, this series can be continued for a long time - the same money served. I won’t even write whose thinking people know this.
        1. Komodo
          Komodo 17 February 2013 11: 52
          -3
          Belief in this is based on the principle that religion was born in all civilizations. If something happened inexplicably, then someone needs it.
          Let's build totems and we will pray on these unknowns)). There will be more benefit.)))
          But seriously - Stop looking for the extreme.
          We do everything with our own hands and brains !!!
          1. DeerIvanovich
            DeerIvanovich 17 February 2013 12: 50
            -2
            But in the case there is something to say, or only know how to shake the air?
            1. Komodo
              Komodo 17 February 2013 13: 44
              0
              Essentially the fact that someone invisibly rules the earth civilization:
              Conspiracy theories are born at the speed of doomsday theories. If one assumes the possibility of such a control, then questions immediately arise about the effectiveness of such a control. If what is happening now in the world is a scenario and everything is going according to some plan, then this is a complete mess. Please tell me the main goals of this community.
              The growth of African states is it according to plan? Is the rise of China according to plan?
              Is the war in Syria and its apparent failure a plan? Eurocrisis is poplana?
              Is the US crisis planned?
              1. Kaa
                Kaa 17 February 2013 16: 35
                +3
                Quote: Komodo

                Essentially the fact that someone invisibly rules the earth civilization:

                If you are talking about that, then ...... hi
                1. Komodo
                  Komodo 17 February 2013 16: 47
                  0
                  From the very birth of mankind, it always fights, gets sick, believes in the end of the world, creates revolutions.
                  And always behind this is the world government, "golden billion", "Masonic lodges" and other crap ??.
                  KAA answer, I believe you.
                  1. Kaa
                    Kaa 17 February 2013 22: 29
                    +5
                    Quote: Komodo
                    KAA answer, I believe you

                    What is the difference between religion and science, because one and the other are different spheres of KNOWLEDGE? There is only one difference - science requires the EVIDENCE of some postulate, and religion - only faith.
                    Quote: Komodo

                    From the very birth of mankind, it always fights, gets sick, believes in the end of the world, creates revolutions.
                    And always behind this is the world government, "golden billion", "Masonic lodges" and other crap ??

                    If there is indisputable evidence, then this is a scientific truth, if not, then sectarianism from the category of UFOlogy, conspiracy theories, Freemasonry, etc. "The truth is somewhere out there ..."
                    1. Tsoi is alive
                      Tsoi is alive 17 February 2013 22: 43
                      +1
                      Kaa.
                      Kaa is not getting into your argument, a purely correct picture. wink
                      1. Tsoi is alive
                        Tsoi is alive 17 February 2013 23: 08
                        0
                        Tsoi is alive,
                        By the way, guys from Ukraine threw this picture! drinks
                    2. Komodo
                      Komodo 17 February 2013 23: 14
                      -2
                      Sextants, for sure. They just redo the story, actively introducing there, a kind of world government, then they fuck us with brains. And they don’t give particular arguments. An example of a story alteration:

                      http://lll22021918.livejournal.com/25744.html

                      - about how General Vlasov became Stalin's Secret Agent.
              2. Prophetic
                Prophetic 17 February 2013 17: 09
                +4
                Conspiracy theory is when 11 of September is declared the result of an international terrorist organization. It is not known where it came from. And when EVERY YEAR, the powerful worlds of this gather together for a fight, this is not a conspiracy, but a medical fact. Not everything they can do? And this is the result of the fact that within this elite there are contradictions. N.r., between the Rockefellers and the Rothschilds. And it inspires ...
    2. Masterzserg
      Masterzserg 17 February 2013 12: 00
      +6
      Hitler is definitely a massive character. But fellow citizens were destroyed, he dragged the country into a world war, again, mediocrely destroying fellow citizens and people of other countries, civilians, and as a result, the land of Germany burned, suffered and was divided. Judging by the results of its final actions, the results, then they are comparable to the actions of Gorbachev and Yeltsin. Nothing, quite an adequate definition.
      1. zennon
        zennon 17 February 2013 20: 45
        -1
        You already decide about Hitler: insignificance or large-scale character?
        1. Masterzserg
          Masterzserg 18 February 2013 10: 42
          0
          You will re-read my post more carefully, and everything will become clear, but if you just troll, then leave the site, and if you do not understand this combination, then read a couple of books, maybe your brains will develop) See, the advice from me is for you for all cases of life. lol
  9. muzhik
    muzhik 17 February 2013 10: 40
    +4
    Expected and objective! Author plus!
  10. taseka
    taseka 17 February 2013 10: 54
    +18
    "Stalin said that after his death a lot of rubbish would be put on his grave, but the wind of history will scatter him." - stirs them up, from the Rothschilds to the Liberasts, from a strong hand - which Russia - the Soviet Union put, respect yourself !!!
    1. morpex
      morpex 17 February 2013 15: 26
      -15
      We are Russian people strange. Not one ruler in Russian history has destroyed as many of our own people as Stalin, but we idolize him and sing praises. Well, imagine for a moment, some neostalin will return. Are you sure that tomorrow you, your son, grandson you will not rot tomorrow in the Kolyma in the name of some lofty goals and ideals? Do you personally want your children and grandchildren to have such a fate? I am sure that no ... So, first think carefully about what you are calling for. And how it can all end .. With good intentions the road to hell is paved ....
      1. Misantrop
        Misantrop 17 February 2013 15: 34
        +14
        Quote: morpex
        Not a single ruler in Russian history has exterminated how many of his own people like Stalin

        Maybe enough already someone else's nonsense to post? Verbatim, moreover.
        Quote: morpex
        Are you sure that tomorrow you, your son, grandson will not rot in Kolyma tomorrow in the name of some lofty goals and ideals?

        But are you sure that one of your relatives will not die tomorrow simply because someone from the dumbfounded majors will simply be too lazy to press the brake of his cool insured car? And he won’t have ANYTHING for that. But then it is YOU who will be locked up in prison if you try to outrage it. Under Stalin, to get to the camp, at least, a formulated charge was needed. Moreover, if now the share of acquittals is a negligible percentage, then with it it was several times higher

        Fayngold the Younger, who tore the young girl to pieces with his car in the center of Simferopol, has not been convicted until now (although several years have already passed). And in the case he is now passing witness. Despite the fact that at the time of the accident was in the car one.
        1. morpex
          morpex 17 February 2013 17: 49
          -2
          Misantrop,
          Yes, I agree with you about the aforementioned about the majors, and indeed about those in power at all! Well, we are now talking about Stalin. Why is he here? Maybe you and I are to blame for the fact that we have such lawlessness? And don't you think, dear, that you don't need to resurrect Stalin, but do something yourself? then they got used to the fact that a strong ruler would come, put everyone in prison, shoot, and order would be. Will not come. We ourselves need to take it and direct it .... In Lenin's writings there is such a phrase: ".... it is better to destroy a thousand innocent than to miss one guilty one ...". By the way, the works of Lenin, Stalin loved to quote. I ask you again, do you want such power?
          1. Misantrop
            Misantrop 17 February 2013 18: 37
            +8
            Quote: morpex
            Once again I ask you, do you want such power?

            I’ll answer again - I want to. And now I’ll try to explain why. Almost ANY power differs one by one the only featured: it establishes a law for all or for the crowd below, making government officials unpunished and impunity. All other differences are secondary. Under Stalin no the provision was not a guarantee against punishment for breaking the law. By the way, a fair amount of the repressed fell into ITU for false denunciation, i.e. for attempting to settle scores with an opponent using punitive bodies of the state. Among them is the notorious Vavilov. This case was examined in detail by my acquaintances at SevInfo, there was even a special topic about it.
            Well, because of our age, position, etc. we can either help in the formation of such power, or interfere in every possible way (so that they do not interfere with stealing). The attitude of this government towards us will depend on this. And it will be established sooner or later, because the regime of rule of unpunished thieves will not last forever, there will not be enough resources for plunder for a long time (this despite the fact that external forces will not interfere). Most likely, the stealing "elite" will be swept away by more successful neighbors, but then they will begin to establish their own order. Under which there will be no place for us in this territory. That's the whole alignment ...
            1. morpex
              morpex 17 February 2013 19: 32
              0
              Quote: Misantrop
              At which we already have no place in this territory. That's the whole layout ...

              But I agree with that. I think the same way about this. I think. Time to throw stones and time to collect them.
              1. sleepy
                sleepy 18 February 2013 04: 29
                +2
                Quote: morpex
                "I ask you again, do you want such power?"


                What kind of power are we talking about?
                About power in Kushchevka? Does anyone want such power?
                When it is dangerous to walk the streets at any time to underage girls.

                Under socialism, everyone would be imprisoned, and not released on bail.
                Does anyone want to have power like the killers?
                Then everything is clear, and many furtively spoke not for the protocol,
                if they killed one adult or a child every day, no one would have noticed.
            2. sleepy
              sleepy 18 February 2013 05: 39
              +2
              Quote: Misantrop
              "... Under which there will be no place for us in this territory.
              That's the whole alignment ... "


              140 million are the population of our country, of which 80% are still Russians.
              Over 8 years, the number of Russians has decreased by 4.8 million.
              Today, 20 million migrants live in Russia,
              14 million people enter Russia every year,
              1,7 million work permits
              about a million get patents,
              3-5 million are dissolved somewhere in the country.
              Every seventh resident is an immigrant.
              Every fourth migrant out of a million examined has infectious diseases, sexually transmitted infections, HIV, syphilis, hepatitis, cases of typhoid and an outbreak of tuberculosis have been reported.

              At the same time, a third of jobs in Moscow are occupied by Migrants,
              more than 60% of them work in the service sector.
              In kindergartens of the capital, 1% of children do not speak Russian and do not understand Russian, for 3% of capital's schoolchildren, Russian is not their native language.
              United Russia and Gadzhimet Safaraliev put forward a plan to import another 50-70 million immigrants for stability.

              ksu-trubetskaya.livejournal.com/40719.html
        2. morpex
          morpex 17 February 2013 18: 30
          -2
          Quote: Misantrop
          Can
          Maybe enough already someone else's nonsense to post? Verbatim, moreover.

          You know, I'm glad for you! Obviously, your ancestors were lucky in those bad times. Unfortunately, neither my grandfathers nor my grandfather were lucky to have grandfathers and their many relatives. Who decays starving in the homeland, who in the settlements who along the way do not know where .... And our family didn’t have politicians, liberals, majors, etc. Yes, and where did they come from ordinary peasants. You may be right on a global scale. But understand me, a little man who just wants to tell you that not everything it was so much fun as you draw. So that I am not telling you all this at all. I do not obessudte.Dlya Stalin - tiran.Minusuvat, please, as much as you ugodno.No to insult me ​​and mine, believe me, no innocent ancestors is not necessary.
          However, God will judge you .....
          1. alexandr00070
            alexandr00070 17 February 2013 23: 02
            +2
            Quote: morpex
            For me, Stalin is a tyrant

            "... These and similar numerous examples with sufficient clarity testify to how carelessly, frivolously, and lightly some local Party organizations and local authorities treat such an important issue as the issue of freedom of religious belief. These organizations and authorities apparently do not understand that by their rude, tactless actions against believers, who represent the vast majority of the population, they inflict incalculable harm to the Soviet regime ... <...>
            Based on the foregoing, the Central Committee decides:
            1) prohibit the closure of churches, prayer rooms ... for reasons of non-fulfillment of administrative orders for registration, and where such closure took place - cancel immediately;
            2) to prohibit the liquidation of prayer rooms, buildings, etc. by voting at meetings with the participation of unbelievers or outsiders to the group of believers that has concluded a contract for a room or building;
            3) to forbid the liquidation of prayer rooms, buildings, etc. for non-payment of taxes, since such liquidation was not allowed in strict accordance with the NKYU instruction of 1918 P. II;
            4) prohibit arrests of a "religious nature", since they are not connected with the brightly counter-revolutionary actions of "church ministers" and believers;
            5) when leasing premises to religious societies and determining rates, strictly observe the resolution of the All-Russian Central Executive Committee dated 29 / III-23; <...>
            7) lay the responsibility for enforcing this directive on the secretaries of the province committees, regional committees, regional bureau, national central committees and regional committees personally.
            Secretary of the Central Committee I. Stalin. "
            1. Komodo
              Komodo 17 February 2013 23: 29
              0
              I read on how Stalin in 1943 at the most critical moment, dramatically changed his attitude towards Christianity after the events described here:

              http://www.tropinka.orthodoxy.ru/ikonosta/bogorodi/kazanska.htm

              Kazan Icon of the Mother of God
              in the history of World War II

              I don’t know the truth or not. To each according to the degree of faith.
              1. alexandr00070
                alexandr00070 17 February 2013 23: 40
                +2
                Quote: Komodo
                dramatically changed attitudes towards Christianity

                do not forget that Stalin graduated with honors from the theological seminary.
                “Between 1920 and 1930, 150 churches were completely destroyed in Moscow and in the surrounding areas. 300 ... converted into factory shops, clubs, dormitories, prisons, isolation wards and colonies for adolescents and street children. Plans for architectural buildings include the demolition of more than 500 remaining churches and churches. Based on the foregoing, the Central Committee considers it impossible to design buildings due to the destruction of temples and churches, which should be considered architectural monuments of ancient Russian architecture. The organs of Soviet power and the workers 'and peasants' police of the OGPU are obliged to apply measures (up to disciplinary and party responsibility) to protect the monuments of ancient Russian architecture. ”
                On November 11, 1939, under the chairmanship of Stalin at a meeting of the Politburo of the Central Committee, the following decision was made:
                "1. To recognize the practice of the NKVD of the USSR in terms of the arrests of ministers of the Russian Orthodox Church and the persecution of believers as inappropriate.
                2. The instruction of comrade Ulyanov (Lenin) of May 1, 1919 No. 13666-2 "On the fight against priests and religion", addressed to before. Cheka to comrade Dzerzhinsky, and all relevant instructions of the Cheka-OGPU-NKVD regarding the persecution of the ministers of the Russian Orthodox Church and Orthodox believers - cancel.
                3. The NKVD of the USSR to conduct an audit of convicted citizens related to worship. "Release from custody and replace with convicts not related to deprivation of liberty for the indicated reasons, if the activities of these citizens did not harm the Soviet regime."
                1. Komodo
                  Komodo 17 February 2013 23: 51
                  -1
                  But in 1943 it happened, according to the Russian Orthodox Church, of course, a turning point after which the mass construction of chapel temples began. According to the Russian Orthodox Church
                  1. alexandr00070
                    alexandr00070 18 February 2013 00: 38
                    +1
                    Quote: Komodo
                    But in 1943 it happened, according to the Russian Orthodox Church, of course, a turning point after which the mass construction of chapel temples began. According to the Russian Orthodox Church

                    THERE WAS SO When the Great Patriotic War began, on June 22, 1941 the head of the Orthodox Church in Russia, Metropolitan of Moscow and Kolomensky Sergius, in an address to “Shepherds and Pasoms of the Orthodox Church of Christ” blessed “all Orthodox to defend the sacred borders of our Motherland”. He recalled: “By the means of selflessness, there were innumerable thousands of our soldiers, who laid down their lives for their Homeland and faith at all times of the invasion of enemies in our Homeland. They were dying, not thinking of glory, they only thought that the Motherland needed a sacrifice on their part, and humbly sacrificed ... their very life. " Throughout the war, in churches during worship, people prayed for the victory of Russian soldiers. The Russian Orthodox Church spiritually sanctified the struggle against the enemy, raised money for the fund to help the front, and transferred large values ​​to the fund of the state.
                    WHAT TO DO 1943 Metropolitans Sergius, Alexy and Nikolai were received by Stalin on September 4, 1943. He supported their proposals on the better functioning of the Russian Orthodox Church and, in particular, on the opening of religious educational institutions. On September 5, 1943, Pravda reported this: “Metropolitan Sergiy informed the Chairman of the Council of People's Commissars that in the leading circles of the Orthodox Church there is an intention to convene a Council of Bishops in the near future to elect the Patriarch of Moscow and All Russia and to establish the Holy Synod under the Patriarch. Head of Government Comrade I.V. Stalin was sympathetic to these proposals and stated that there would be no obstacles to this from the government. ” Stalin praised the patriotic role of the church in the war and considered it necessary to encourage its activities.
                    BUT THERE WAS AND SO Unfortunately, some Orthodox priests both in the USSR and especially abroad perceived the German invasion as liberation from the Bolsheviks. Already in June 1941, Metropolitan Anastasius repeatedly asked Berlin for help in reviving the old Orthodox traditions in occupied Soviet lands. And in Paris, Metropolitan of the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad (ROCA) Seraphim Lukyanov prayed to the Almighty “to bless the great leader of the German people, who raised his sword against the enemies of God himself ... May the Masonic star, sickle and hammer disappear from the face of the earth."
                    The Russian Orthodox Church Abroad, with a number of its priests, served Hitler. They did not consider General Vlasov a traitor. According to the ROCOR synod, "in the Russian diaspora, of which the surviving members of the Russian Liberation Army (ROA) also became a part, General Vlasov was and remains a kind of symbol of resistance to godless Bolshevism in the name of the revival of historical Russia."
                    1. Komodo
                      Komodo 18 February 2013 01: 09
                      +1
                      And here's another ::

                      "If everything that has been determined is not fulfilled, Russia will perish."

                      “Churches, monasteries, theological academies and seminaries should be opened throughout the country. The priests must be returned from the fronts and prisons, they must begin to serve. The Mother of God and will carry her in a procession of the cross around the city, then not a single enemy will set foot on his holy land. This is the chosen city. Before the Kazan icon you need to perform a prayer service in Moscow; then it should be in Stalingrad, which cannot be surrendered to the enemy. The Kazan icon must go with troops to the borders of Russia. When the war is over, Metropolitan Elijah must come to Russia and tell about how she was saved. "
          2. loisop
            loisop 17 February 2013 23: 06
            +3
            Quote: morpex
            But to insult me ​​and mine, believe me, innocent ancestors do not need to


            And you try, request from the archives the case of your, well, absolutely innocent relatives. I guarantee you will learn a lot of interesting things.

            By the way, even nowadays 95% of prisoners in the zones are innocent and imprisoned "for nothing." Well, in their words, of course.
          3. Misantrop
            Misantrop 17 February 2013 23: 22
            +3
            Quote: morpex
            not everything was so fun as you draw

            Have I portrayed at least one rainbow picture here? Revolution, civil, red terror after the departure of whites (I live on the street named after Bel Kun - a vampire from the Baltic, who fills the Crimea with blood). Then - a grave recovery, another war, Tatar punishers, battles for liberation, post-war reconstruction and more ... I just listed here what my direct relatives were direct witnesses to, and I had the opportunity to ask them myself, not from books and newspapers. It was almost never easy. Joyfully - yes, it happened. And the great-grandfather got to camp before the war. Then they still released, not without it.

            But minus you? And for what, for thoughts? A strange occupation, that's what I do not like to do. In any millstone you cannot imagine getting into the millstones of the state machine. But it’s Stalin who is to blame for this, despite the fact that just the Khrushchev-led apparatus (it was he who did this in Ukraine) who grind their lives is still IMHO not fair
            1. Tsoi is alive
              Tsoi is alive 17 February 2013 23: 29
              +1
              Misantrop,
              What kind of fighter are you? wink
              Sorry, I'm just pinning you! wink
              Brother, stop fighting .......

          4. Avenger711
            Avenger711 18 February 2013 02: 23
            0
            Do you know where the most innocent babies are? In prison.
        3. SASCHAmIXEEW
          SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 13: 31
          0
          Are there really not a single man in Simferopol?
      2. vovan1949
        vovan1949 17 February 2013 17: 50
        +8
        Firstly, all the rulers of the world destroyed their own people.
        Secondly, where did you get the idea that Stalin was destroying his own people? (just don't talk about the "milen of the innocent murdered" - this myth has long been debunked).
        And thirdly, if "some neostalin returns" I am sure that I, my son and my grandson will not "rot in Kolyma", by the way, Kolyma is my homeland, since we do not steal, we do not take bribes, we live honestly earned labor. And let the Kolyma be populated by the owners of yachts and Bentleys, three-story cottages and sepermarkets, commercial intelligentsia, etc. In general, a dozen - one and a half million of these reptiles should develop the northeastern regions of Russia, until the Chinese mastered them.
        1. sleepy
          sleepy 18 February 2013 04: 38
          +1
          From the Internet.

          "... All of the above and many other abominations, which can be replenished indefinitely, have presented Russia with the newfound capitalism, democracy and liberal values, which are tirelessly praised on television and in the press.
          With even greater indefatigability, life under socialism is being poured there.
          But for me and, I am sure, for millions of my fellow citizens, socialism was and remains the personification of a society of general prosperity, equality and fraternity, when a person was a friend and comrade, in other words, there was the exact opposite of what he faced in the new Russia, in which he is forced to live by the laws of the jungle,
          where the fittest survives, and in relation to people also the meanest and most arrogant ...
          ... The author of economic reforms, Gaidar, having heard about the death of people from hunger, calmly remarked that the extinction of the people
          during the transformations, it’s quite a natural phenomenon, and later, when the people began to leave for the next world
          one million a year, with satisfaction stated that it was not so long to wait until the last wimps die out,
          referring to old people and people not fit for business.
          The author of the impudent fraud with Chubais vouchers confirmed this with his question:
          “If we can’t feed, do we need so many people?” ...
          ... It is important for me that it was socialism that gave these and many other benefits to the people,
          and capitalism, under the pressure of the working people, was forced to adopt and introduce some of them,
          for example, an eight-hour working day, paid leave and pensions.
          The length of the working day, two days off per week and annual holidays were legalized in the USSR
          in accordance with labor regulations developed by scientific institutes,
          taking into account the physiological characteristics of a person. There are no such institutions in any capitalist country,
          just as in the current liberal-democratic Russia, there is no day to be found with fire ...
          http://www.vedamost.info/2012/11/blog-post_7544.html
          1. sleepy
            sleepy 18 February 2013 04: 39
            0
            "...... What annoys me most about the democrats is that they consciously identify socialism and its social values ​​with the repressions that took place at that difficult time and are largely explainable.
            Accusing Stalin as their main enemy of all sins, the Democrats inextricably accuse him
            and slop all the Soviet past.
            I understand this as a tricky and scumsy move to prevent a thorough discussion about comparing the socialist social system, the aim of which was to increase the standard of living in every way
            the population through the provision of many benefits to it (this includes the free health care, medicine, education, housing, almost free housing services, public transport, kindergartens, pioneer camps,
            holiday homes, etc. etc.)
            with an anti-popular system of capitalism aimed at the unthinkable enrichment of a group of elected people,
            owning the main share of income from previously owned by all the people of natural wealth.
            Under socialism, it was out of the question that the money from these incomes was spent on buying expensive castles, villas, foreign football and other clubs, moon sites for bl ..., to blame, lovers.
            Under socialism, all revenues from the sale of natural resources went to the needs of the state and people.
            Due to this, the state was able to provide the population with the above
            social benefits ...
            ... Recently, I heard how Putin, speaking of measures taken to radically improve something in the country, exclaimed with pathos: “You just think about this figure: 65 billion rubles! Just think about it! ”
            I was not too lazy and thought about it. And he received about two billion dollars, which is only one sixth of the funds given to them by Putin, Abramovich for what he bought back in the early nineties,
            by the way, with Soros’s money, for only a hundred million dollars.
            And there are over a hundred such Abramovichs in the country, and today their wealth is over three hundred billion dollars, or one hundred and fifty times sixty-five billion rubles, which stunned Putin so much.
            But for some reason he does not want to take into account this money, which essentially belongs to the people, and even often
            refers to their lack ... "
            http://www.vedamost.info/2012/11/blog-post_7544.html
            1. Tsoi is alive
              Tsoi is alive 18 February 2013 04: 44
              0
              Quote: sleepy
              .Which most of all revolts me in democrats,

              And how revolts me ....
              1. sleepy
                sleepy 18 February 2013 05: 45
                +4
                Tsoi is alive

                There is no need to be surprised - you have oil - democracy is coming to you! "
                1. Tsoi is alive
                  Tsoi is alive 18 February 2013 05: 56
                  0
                  Quote: sleepy
                  There is no need to be surprised - you have oil - democracy is coming to you! "

                  Then the Pont can turn around ... like such an embarrassment ... wink
      3. Alexander 1958
        Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 18: 39
        +1
        We are already dying without Kolyma.
        In general, it seems to me that if you send a dozen, another thousand from Ukraine to Kolyma, then everything will go well with us. And life will become better and we will live longer ..
        Alexander 1958
        1. The cat
          The cat 17 February 2013 18: 56
          +1
          Quote: Alexander 1958
          In general, it seems to me that if you send a dozen, another thousand from Ukraine to Kolyma, then everything will go well with us. And life will become better and we will live longer ..

          Will you go
          1. Alexander 1958
            Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 20: 05
            +1
            There is no particular desire, but if you know that it will not be in vain ...
        2. George
          George 17 February 2013 21: 34
          +2
          Hello everyone !
          I apologize for the intrusion, but at first ours will go to Kolyma, and yours will take the second flight.
          1. Alexander 1958
            Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 23: 23
            +3
            For Georges
            No, well, what kind of discrimination is it for Our oligarchs? smile Or do you think ours stole less? So our Akhmetov is cooler than any Russian oligarch! And in general, as in words so Russia + Ukraine = drinks , and how to attach our oligarchs in Kolyma, so secondarily? Not brotherly it!
            Alexander 1958
            1. George
              George 18 February 2013 01: 56
              +2
              Hello, Alexander .
              So be it drinks
              We will arrange for them to conquer the Kolyma jointly. Only after all, everything there should be properly prepared for the arrival of the oligarch brothers. And ours will begin. So no offense. Everyone will be there.
              1. GP
                GP 18 February 2013 02: 17
                +1
                George
                The beginning of the path of Abramovich. Are you sure with the demotivator to the former governor of Kamchatka laughing ? More likely the end of the road hi
                1. sniper
                  sniper 18 February 2013 02: 19
                  +2
                  Quote: GP
                  More likely the end of the road

                  This is the New Way of the old oligarch !!! wassat
                  1. George
                    George 18 February 2013 02: 37
                    +1
                    Verbal truth Nicholas hi
                    1. sniper
                      sniper 18 February 2013 02: 39
                      0
                      GeorgeThank you, Yuri, I try! drinks
              2. Alexander 1958
                Alexander 1958 18 February 2013 17: 04
                0
                For Georges
                drinks
                Alexander 1958
            2. SASCHAmIXEEW
              SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 14: 10
              0
              In fact, they are liquid-Zionist, and by and large they have a relationship with Little Russia and RUSSIA as much as !! And in Kalym there is enough space for everyone !!
      4. SASCHAmIXEEW
        SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 13: 26
        0
        Marine, I was with the owner, for 4,5 I did not meet a single innocent !!! There is no punishment without fault !!!
  11. Normal
    Normal 17 February 2013 10: 54
    +12
    I have a complicated attitude towards Stalin. By and large, it’s not for me to evaluate a figure of this magnitude.
    And the article is a huge plus. With all its disadvantages in particular, in a general sense, the article is deep, correct.
  12. VadimSt
    VadimSt 17 February 2013 11: 15
    +14
    +++ There are several reasons.
    1. Stop sprinkling ashes on yourself. The British Empire, over the course of several centuries, has emerged on almost all continents; many historical events associated with it are worthy of an international tribunal, and without statute of limitations. But I don’t remember that the British systematically “pinched” themselves, cursed their kings, recognized the colonization and destruction of hundreds of thousands of people as a mistake, apologized, made compensation for colonization, ruin, infringement of freedoms, etc.
    2. In recent decades, many are accustomed to "pulling" and "savoring" from our history, only the worst. Who benefits from this? These issues are practically considered in the article, and although taking into account that period, they are still relevant today.
    3. No one, for the entire period of mankind, can name an absolutely positive leader - perhaps, the current ones are American presidents - in American cinema. The leader appears when he knows that to achieve the goal it is necessary not only to create, but also to clean the "stables". Much more harm to his image, the guardsmen from the authorities. They then, and hayut the leader, for many years - until the emergence of a new one, capable of clearing the "stables".
    1. shasherin_pavel
      shasherin_pavel 17 February 2013 13: 15
      +4
      The British Empire lost everything during the Second World War, but in it, no one ever raised a hand against the property of the government elite, and it is they who rule the show in the press of blasphemy or lies. Why should she (Britain) sprinkle ashes on her head, if the museums of England keep all the national wealth of Asia plundered during the colonization. And the rich, as they were, remained. In just one phrase from Stalin that by 58 the country was ready to cancel monetary transactions throughout the country. For such words, any "covetous man" is ready to bury him for two kilomeirs deep into the Earth. How can they rise above the people if the money is canceled? How Stalin wanted to do this I can’t even imagine ... maybe he foresaw the possibility of moneyless transactions through terminals? But where does such a base come from in the absence of even a good connection? All Stalin's fault is before the moneybags in the encroachment on their property and equal division, because Stali forbade members of the government to have dachas of more than 4 rooms, how can he forgive him, and what if someone decides to take up such an initiative against them now ?!
    2. Zmey_2Garin
      Zmey_2Garin 17 February 2013 15: 02
      0
      VadimSt,
      I agree with you 200%. About leaders - in particular.
    3. krisostomus
      krisostomus 17 February 2013 16: 06
      -3
      It was also not very clear to me what the author wanted to say. The author is trying to justify Stalin by attracting African Tutsi and atomic bombing, and God knows what else.
      But, firstly, does Stalin need justification? Who and how would not relate to him - he absolutely indisputably went down in history as an outstanding personality on a global scale and in the most direct way influencing the world order.
      The author's arguments that the death of people is inevitable in the name of the "bright future" of their subsequent generations are somehow not very convincing. Well, then maybe today's criticism of the situation in the country is absolutely groundless and the "reforms of Yeltsin with Gaidar" are also in the name of "a bright future." And as far as I remember after Gaidar's death, it didn’t hurt his savings book either, at least according to his capabilities and in comparison with other “reformers” of a lower rank.
      Secondly, it is clear that Stalin did not have a very sweet time among the "loyal Leninists" and "leaders of the world proetariat" with their intrigues and undercover struggle, as well as the fact that until a certain time he was not free
      in their decisions. But then the question arises - what kind of society was built in the USSR if each generation of "leaders of the vanguard of the working class degenerated" and turned into a "special" class of "red boyars"?
      Was there really no other way of building a "bright future" how to regularly shoot and sit down the "old leaders" according to the principle "they cut the forest - chips fly"?
      1. Strategia
        Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 32
        +1
        Quote: krisostomus
        And as far as I remember after Gaidar's death, it didn’t hurt his passbook either,

        Have you been a member of the welfare assessment committee of the late Egor Gaidar ?!
  13. DeerIvanovich
    DeerIvanovich 17 February 2013 11: 25
    +9
    on the topic being described, the author made fairly general judgments fairly objectively and I completely agree with him. The corrupt elite only remembers and exalts their rulers. Those rulers for whom the corrupted elite as well as for the common people like a bone in the throat, and who have done a lot for the country, uniting and saving it with the same elite blasphemes, and remembers and honors the people.
    This is how it was necessary to manage, being almost surrounded by a single corrupt elite to successfully deal with it for decades.
    Do not forget that Stalin studied at a theological seminary, about Orthodoxy and the traditions affected by the author of the article.
  14. Oleg14774
    Oleg14774 17 February 2013 11: 30
    0
    In general, we are not ordinary people!
  15. sergo0000
    sergo0000 17 February 2013 11: 33
    +24
    Great article! I read relishing syllable and word! smile fellow
    He shared in social networks. We would have had more such heralds of historical truth in Russia with such a manner of writing and style. Every person feels something like this in the country, but it’s worth it to convey to the people who are big! good Another time will come when the liberals themselves will seek protection from the Stalinists. I believe. And there will be no place left on this planet where they could hide themselves and bury their capitals.
    In general, not an article, but a song!
    1. baltika-18
      baltika-18 17 February 2013 16: 07
      +2
      Quote: sergo0000
      Great article! I read relishing syllable and word!

      I’ll support you, Master. drinks
  16. Ragnarek
    Ragnarek 17 February 2013 11: 36
    +7
    one cannot judge that era by today's standards. Stalin, like everyone else, made mistakes, but in the end he created a powerful state that could survive in the war with the entire European Union.
    1. Alekseir162
      Alekseir162 17 February 2013 11: 55
      +7
      All true is not mistaken only the one who does nothing. I think any ruler can find a bunch of mistakes (so to speak, his skeleton in the closet), but to judge the time of the reign of a politician is not necessary for individual errors during his reign. And according to the final result in a historical perspective. Comrade Stalin is out of competition here.
  17. Masterzserg
    Masterzserg 17 February 2013 11: 49
    +11
    Stalin left behind a strong power, having accepted it after the disaster, he himself was able to overcome the catastrophe and lead the country into leaders. Yes, at a huge price, and I would not want to live in that difficult era, but to deny Stalin's tremendous achievements is at least a sign of dementia.
  18. Malysh
    Malysh 17 February 2013 11: 50
    +6
    And under Stalin, they also reduced prices. The main repressions occurred in 34-35g. and screaming all about the 37th. because he started pushing the ram at that time
    1. loisop
      loisop 17 February 2013 23: 16
      +3
      Quote: MALYSH
      screaming all about the 37th. because he began to crush the Jew at that time


      Not certainly in that way. at 37 they pressed cool creacles at that time: the Mechins, Svanidze, Latins, and so on.
      And the aforementioned comrades (who are not comrades to us at all, we are in the same field with them .. uh ... hmm ..) the great masters let a terrible stink even without cause. And then its own skin. Clearly, the stench rose to heaven.

      // Well, the fact that among them there were (in percentage terms) a lot of "rams" .. Well, it is the same today.
  19. Renat
    Renat 17 February 2013 12: 10
    +2
    Of course, the murders of repression cannot be justified, especially if they are not justified. But do not forget that any power, even the kindest and most democratic, is a dictate. Why are the repressions of the 30s still relishing. Currently, it’s not just repression, but full-scale genocide against entire nations and countries that are objectionable. It’s just called all democracy.
  20. Xab
    Xab 17 February 2013 12: 11
    +1
    Very true article. It would be great if everyone made the right conclusions from this article and supported our president who is trying in every possible way to bring the country into world leaders for one while fighting against corruption and the West by the Anglo-Saxons who are not averse to digesting Russia., But they lack teeth. Do not confuse the 40s with the present. before all thieves did not have the opportunity to hide the loot in Swiss banks. Otherwise VV would have hung them for a long time ... And remember, never forget - you won’t always be good for everyone.
  21. Cpa
    Cpa 17 February 2013 12: 13
    +7
    The article is very consistent and multifaceted. It is immediately obvious that the author deeply and long understands the essence of what is happening. One of the best articles on this site. Write more, please! hi
    On my own, I want to add that a draw is the best model of the liberals. But as long as they have someone to hide behind, who will they run to, if the West goes into decline or becomes the house of fundamentalists? Everything goes to that, the founders of Western culture are merging Europe and America, as the Egyptian and Greek civilizations were merged. A nobody’s house is a sweet utopia of globalists for demshiza, globalists in the house themselves have long been seen as the main ones!
  22. anchonsha
    anchonsha 17 February 2013 12: 25
    +6
    An interesting article, something new about Stalin for young people, there is something to think about, and most importantly - do not wake the beast among the people. And also thoughts about the best for the people - where is it located, in what social formation is it the best to find? The history of socialism has shown that the material prevails over the ideological, in connection with which consumerism prevailed in the formation of the bourgeois layer of the intelligentsia, which means that sacrifices are needed to stop this. Another thought is that the people themselves subconsciously, deeply choose those who brought the country, the people good, good, despite the fact that during this there was tyranny. It was Stalin who attributed these people.
    1. krisostomus
      krisostomus 17 February 2013 19: 33
      -1
      You have made a very "deep" conclusion. Will you determine the degree of "bourgeoisization"? That is, in your opinion, "ideal socialism" is when you have been given a pair of underpants and do not go for new ones until you take them down. Well, so that everyone is equal - it is advisable to issue underpants of the same style without any "bourgeois excesses".
      1. Strategia
        Strategia 17 February 2013 19: 46
        +4
        Is the style of underpants in your life decisive for you? For me, this is how "the Native COUNTRY would live, / And there are no other worries"
  23. vovan234
    vovan234 17 February 2013 12: 34
    +3
    I liked the article, thanks to the author! For my part, I believe that every leader (leader of the people, president) also depends on his people, should be appropriate to the governing country, not succumbing to the influence of foreign media. I respect Putin, I do not respect the dollar and the world banking system, which makes everyone debtor, it is not even clear who all countries owe and where the devaluation of money came from, because 150 years ago it wasn’t damned !!!
    1. Karabin
      Karabin 17 February 2013 23: 11
      +1
      Quote: vovan234
      I respect Putin, I do not respect the dollar and the world banking system, which makes everyone debtor,

      Putin respects the dollar and the global banking system (otherwise he would not have kept the stash in euro-dollar bonds, would not tolerate the central bank as a private structure and did not put Siluyanov, the loyal follower of Kudrin policy as finance minister) and does not know about your existence.
      The dollar and the global banking system mean Putin, and just have you, and everyone else.
    2. loisop
      loisop 17 February 2013 23: 20
      +1
      Quote: vovan234
      because so 150 years ago her devil-damned was not !!!

      Yeah. that's exactly 100 years ago and it began. Woodrow Wilson Fed approved in 1913 as an emission center.
  24. Humer
    Humer 17 February 2013 12: 54
    +1
    Here is an article in which these topics have something in common. Only in relation to the present. http://delyagin.ru/articles/46487-pochemu-stalin-ernetsya-i-pochemu-sudit-kazhdo
    go-tom-chisle-stalina-nado-tolko-po-merkam-i-normam-ego-remeni.html
  25. stas
    stas 17 February 2013 13: 31
    +9
    History has already assessed the affairs of Stalin, both negative and positive.

    And if until now, liberals, gays, and diarrhea of ​​Russia of all stripes are fighting the long-dead Stalin, then Stalin costs a lot.
    It would be enough for a month to bring order to the Kremlin!
    1. zennon
      zennon 17 February 2013 16: 21
      0
      As well as tolerasts and human rights activists. lol
    2. Komodo
      Komodo 17 February 2013 20: 30
      0
      + + + + + + + + + + drinks How afraid they are)) therefore they live one day. Everything is quickly sold out and dumped. Tear money in a country lying in the knockdown, earn authority on a long-dead leader and have nothing to answer, there is no way to justify it. And it has not flown away from the descendants. Growing up, matured and wiser.
  26. treskoed
    treskoed 17 February 2013 13: 35
    +4
    The media daily reports the identification of thieves and bribe takers. And what about the people? It's time, and we must act more actively! 37th does not remind? As now, two decades in power - a damned caste! Maybe Stalin was right, uprooting weeds?
  27. darkman70
    darkman70 17 February 2013 13: 42
    -2
    It seems like I liked the article at first, but when I read it before comparing it with Peter the Great, I quit reading further. Because about Peter - bullshit.
    In general, recently there has been a clear order to denigrate the first Russian emperor ... Why would it? It is especially strange to read about the creator of the regular Russian army and navy on the site of a seemingly military-patriotic direction. This is just some kind of nonsense.
    It is important to understand that if not for Peter there would have been no Russia as a great power. There would be nothing, including a superpower created later by Stalin.
    And once again I am convinced how low the level of education and logical thinking in the former Union has fallen. It seems that history is not being taught at all now. Blame. for example, Petra’s economic decline after the 20-year-old Northern War is the same as blaming Stalin for the devastation after World War II.
    For those who are interested, I can recommend "Notes on Peter the Great" by A. Pushkin. All of Peter's affairs are scheduled there on the basis of archival data.
    1. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 23: 22
      +1
      Quote: darkman70
      It is important to understand that if not for Peter there would have been no Russia as a great power.

      for your information, the initiator of the war with Sweden was August II (the king of Poland), his desire to take Livonia from Sweden, for the help he promised to return to Russia, the lands of Ingermanladia and Karelia, formerly belonging to it, to Russia
      and Stalin defended himself, at first. For Stalin, the one that Grozny would have handed over to him

      Damn Emperor Peter
      He made souls like straw!
      For the pain of the current past
      It's time to arrange a review.
      ...
      Himself bridal sheared? Chapters sec!
      Damn, the king is a Christ murderer,
      for reveling in blood
      I have never been able to fill!

      And Russia left the face of the earth
      in secret log cabins,
      where no murderers
      they could not offend her.
      ...
      Damn Satan’s warrior
      The dead stone keeper,
      who from the absurdity of Streltsy
      shook in German pants.
      ...
      Damn the one who cursed Russia -
      this frosty Hellas!
      Cut my head as a reward
      that together with her, - I WILL NOT LAUGH!

      “The Curse to Peter” - B. Chichibabin (1923-1994) - Russian poet
      1. darkman70
        darkman70 18 February 2013 17: 21
        +1
        For Stalin, the one that Grozny would have handed over to him

        ))))) It's funny. How old are you at all? What is there that Terrible transferred to Stalin?)))
        Yes, there would be no Stalin at all. To do this, at least it was necessary to join Georgia, which would not be possible without a regular army and navy ... But why is there Georgia, with the Streltsy army, to keep its territory. In the devastating Narva battle for Russia, only the guard created by Peter showed himself on the good side.
        There would be no Leningrad - the cradle of the revolution, together with the Hermitage and the Admiralty, the Academy of Sciences, Dostoevsky, and Gogol, Tchaikovsky and Glinka. It was clear to Peter, that’s why he’s the Great, and you have good ideas about Russia and its history.
        1. alexandr00070
          alexandr00070 20 February 2013 00: 32
          0
          Quote: darkman70
          It’s ridiculous. How old are you at all? What did Grozny transmit to Stalin?

          it is really funny to read the reasoning of a person far from the history of Russia, I understand that you have enough problems and you remember history from the textbook of Soviet times and the phrase "There would be no Leningrad - the cradle of the revolution," proof of that. By the way, in the same textbooks it was written that Ivan the Terrible, with the help of the rifle regiments, added the territory of Russia, but Peter - exterminated the archers as a caste, and changed the Russian army first into French, and then into German uniforms, although the Russian military uniform itself was weapons. The people called the new shelves "amusing"; And about the transfer, this is your phrase "Peter conveyed to Stalin, and you are not embarrassed by the fact that after Peter, Russia licked the wounds inflicted by Peter for a long time, but much has not been restored, because he has done such things that we still have responds -
          - destroyed the ancient Russian calendar, rejuvenating our civilization for many thousands of years;
          - destroyed the Russian chronicles - ordered to take them to St. Petersburg and burn. Then he called on the German "professors" to write a completely different Russian story;
          - destroyed the Russian script, which consisted of 151 characters, and introduced 43 characters of the Cyril and Methodius script (change of the Initial Letter);
          - banned the cultivation of amaranth and eat amaranth bread, which was the main food of the Russian people, thereby destroying the longevity, which then still remained in Russia;
          - transferred the peasants to the property of the nobles, which turned them into slaves (to whiten the image of Peter, this “event” falls on Ivan IV);
          - defeated the clergy (carriers of Russian culture) and destroyed Orthodoxy, bringing it closer to Catholicism, which inevitably gave rise to atheism;
          - defeated Russian self-government - "zemstvo" and replaced it with the bureaucratic apparatus of foreigners;
          But his main crime is the destruction of Russian education (image + sculpting), the essence of which was to create a person with three subtle bodies that he does not receive from birth, and if they are not formed, then consciousness will not have a connection with the consciousnesses of past lives (Image ) and this is very visible in your education
          1. darkman70
            darkman70 20 February 2013 02: 00
            +2
            I’m sorry, but what do you dislike about Soviet history textbooks?
            And now in order:
            - Ivan the Terrible lived a hundred years earlier than Peter. During this time, military affairs have changed quite a bit ... It's about the same if the Red Army entered the war with Hitler while in a state on 1841. That would have fought, right?
            - Terrible fellow. And under Peter the territory to Kamchatka was annexed to Russia.
            - The form. So now we will dress the Russian army in the form of archers. So what? )) That the enemies would be scared, right?)
            - Peter himself called the guard regiments.
            - Peter did not inflict any wounds. War inflicted wounds. If you think that war was not needed, then give Sweden back the territories received. Together with the fleet.
            - About the annals without comment .... Is there evidence or grandmother said?))
            - just like that and urged to write another story?)) Strongly.))) How is it known? Can you name any famous work of "German professors" on the history of Russia?
            - How did you destroy the Russian written language ????)) These are the times!)) But the men didn’t know .. And what language do I write now? In gibberish?)))))))))
            - About amaranth - it's strong.)) And he brought potatoes, lousy.)) I hope you do not eat it? Well, right. Eat amaranth. It is useful.)))
            - The enslavement of the peasants occurred long before Peter.
            - The bearer of Russian culture is the people, not the clergy.
            The decree of Peter I, published in 1702, proclaimed religious tolerance as one of the main state principles. “The opponents of the church must be treated with meekness and intelligence,” said Peter. “The Lord gave the kings authority over nations, but Christ alone has authority over the conscience of men.”

            - Zemstvos were introduced in Russia in the 1864 year. And here in general Peter.?
            - About education - it's generally a pearl. Alexander, are you raving? What bodies, man?))) How could he destroy the formation, which actually was not?
            Peter clearly recognized the need for education, and took a number of decisive measures to this end. On 14 of January 1700 in Moscow, a school of mathematical and navigational sciences was opened. In 1701 — 1721 artillery, engineering and medical schools were opened in Moscow, an engineering school and a maritime academy in St. Petersburg, and mountain schools at the Olonets and Ural factories. The first gymnasium in Russia was opened at 1705. The goals of mass education were to be served by digital schools created in the 1714 decree of the year in provincial cities, designed to “teach children of every rank to read and write, tsifir and geometry.” It was supposed to create two such schools in each province, where training was supposed to be free. Garrison schools were opened for soldiers' children; for the preparation of priests, starting from 1721, a network of theological schools was created. By the decrees of Peter, compulsory education of nobles and clergy was introduced, but a similar measure for the urban population met with fierce resistance and was canceled. Peter's attempt to create an all-elementary elementary school failed (the creation of a network of schools stopped after his death, most digital schools under his successors were redeveloped into estate schools to prepare the clergy), but nevertheless, the foundations for the spread of education in Russia were laid in his reign.
            Alexander, all this would be funny if it were not so sad. I would even say scary. Zero knowledge. Zero. Instead of knowledge, some nonsense is inserted. Horror.!!!
            1. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 20 February 2013 03: 35
              -1
              Quote: darkman70
              I’m sorry, but what do you dislike about Soviet history textbooks?

              This phrase crosses out all your attempts to cover the activities of Peter, abandon your textbook and turn to books (including electronic ones), since now a lot of information has become available. About "zemstvo" - the concept of zemstvo arose under Ivan the Terrible, when in 1565 he first divided the "state" and "zemstvo" lands. Those that contained the royal court and the oprichniks were classified as state ones, all the rest were zemstvo ones. Widespread zemstvo self-government was introduced after the abolition of serfdom - in 1864. Zemstvo in Russia finally began to denote the social civic principle in the organization of the life of the people. This was the expression of the democratization of power in the country. You not only read the titles in your textbook, but also the texts, read (http://www.bibliotekar.ru/istoria-rossii/202.htm) Kamchatka (The first information about the peninsula belongs to the middle of the 15th century.In September 1648, the expedition of Fedot Alekseev and Semyon Dezhnev was in the strait between Asia and America, which 80 years later will rediscover Bering. Travelers landed on the shore, where they met "a lot of good Chukchi." In January 1725, by order of Peter 1, the First Kamchatka Expedition was organized, which, in addition to Vitus Bering, gave history such names as Aleksey Chirikov and Martyn Shpanberg.) These are travelers, not conquerors. Regarding the form, the same nonsense, you flip through the textbook and see who was the main assistant of the Russian troops --- FROST ----- and the French and the Germans froze, and all because the uniform was figurative (stockings, wigs, cocked hats, etc. caftans and fur hats of the archers ------- the most detailed and accurate description of the uniform of the Moscow archers was the Swedish officer E. Palmkvist, who served the Russian tsar in 1674:
              Hat: Velvet, with a high cap and a fur band. The color of the hood depends on the shelf. The fur of ordinary archers is sheepskin, of officers (initial people) sable. On the front of the cap, officers have a gold emblem in the shape of a crown.
              Upper caftan: Eastern European type, fastens from right to left on spherical or flat round gilded buttons. Buttonholes of colored (on the shelf) cord with tassels at the ends. Officers often have a gold or silver cord. Collar resistant. There are small cuts on the sides on the floors, fastened with three buttons with the same buttonholes. The length of the caftan is slightly higher than the ankles.
              The same caftan for cold time was lined with sheepskin or fur and had a fur shawl collar, a fur trim on the bottom of the sleeves. Holes trimmed with fur were made in the upper part of both sleeves.
              The caftan is girdled with a fabric sash made of colored fabric (on the shelves), the officers sash with gold embroidery, fringe and tassels at the ends. Brown leather gloves with soft gaiters; officers' gloves have tight gaiters and are decorated with gold embroidery and fringe.) So, fight in the French uniform in frost in Russia.
              Speaking of the language, you can already see with the peasants and you didn’t know (who doubted it) that on January 29 (February 8), 1710, the Petrine reform of the Cyrillic alphabet was completed in Russia - Peter I approved a new civil alphabet and civil font. Well, to tell you about where the word “VERSIONAL THINKING” came from and that the letters in the old CAPITAL correspond to certain images, it’s useless, it’s clear that a person WITHOUT literate is historically, and by the way
              look for the decrees of Peter in the pre-revolutionary edition of the most curious edition of Miller's book on the history of Siberia
            2. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 20 February 2013 04: 02
              +1
              Quote: darkman70
              - Peter did not inflict any wounds. War inflicted wounds. If you think that war was not needed, then give Sweden back the territories received. Together with the fleet.

              21 years of worthless war (by the way in the previous form, with simple swords and spears and a Russian spirit, we beat both Swedes and Germans and Greeks, but we couldn’t do it in wigs)
              According to historian V. O. Klyuchevsky, “The Nishtadt world of 1721 put an end to the 21-year war, which Peter himself called his“ timely bloody and very dangerous school, ”where students usually sit for seven years, and he is tight comprehensible schoolboy, sat up for three whole courses ... "
              The history of Russia was invented during the reign of Peter 1, in the St. Petersburg Academy of Sciences, which he created, where the main part of the academic historians were Germans. In just a couple of decades, the Russian calendar was replaced and ancient books destroyed, i.e. all references to the real history of Russia, its traditions. Then they came up with a new font (more understandable to foreigners), opened the St. Petersburg Academy of Sciences, invited German "professors", who came up with a new history of Russia
              For 120 years, there were 33 academic historians at the historical department, of which only three were Russians, including MV Lomonosov. the rest are Germans who wrote the history of Russia, and some of them did not even know the Russian language! This fact is well known to professional historians, but is not advertised.
              Russian scientists, led by Lomonosov, fought for the right to have Russian history, they were opposed by the Germans, led by Miller, with the undisguised support of the Romanov court.

              Lomonosov in 1749 opposed the new version of Russian history created by Miller and Bayer. He criticized Miller’s dissertation on the origin of the name and people of Russia. Since that time, studies on historical issues have become a necessity for Lomonosov, for the sake of them he even abandons the duties of a professor of chemistry. In a correspondence with Shuvalov, he mentioned his works - “On the State of Russia during the Reign of Tsar Tsar Mikhail Fedorovich”, “Notes on the Monarch’s Works”, “Abridged Description of the Sovereign’s Affairs” (Peter the Great), “Description of Impostors and Streltsy Riots”.
              But all the works and numerous documents that Lomonosov intended to publish in the form of notes, manuscripts and preparatory materials were confiscated and disappeared without a trace. Several works were nevertheless published, but after 7 years! after the death of Lomonosov and edited by Miller. Computer analysis showed that this was a fake - there was little left of Lomonosov in them.
            3. alexandr00070
              alexandr00070 20 February 2013 04: 29
              0
              Quote: darkman70
              By the decrees of Peter, compulsory education of nobles and clergy was introduced,

              It would not be worth answering at all, but leaving the person in ignorance is somehow not humane. Those. according to your textbooks, it corresponds to the fact that before Peter the nobles and the clergy were illiterate and needed to be taught, or maybe he was breaking literate Russian people, After all, the main task of the reform was to change the language (Initial letter). Changing the language leads to a change in consciousness. Initial letter, in contrast to European languages, developed figurative thinking, and not straightforward. The brains of our ancestors did not work on the modern 3%, but much more, the first thing was information dense and fast. According to studies, if a child is taught the modern alphabet, then consciousness and world perception develops to “standard” 3% -5%, subconscious mind 95% -97%, synchronous work of the right and left hemispheres 5% -10%.
              If the child learns his native language in the pre-alphabet, then the Consciousness / Subconsciousness ratio is 34% -37%, the synchronism of the hemispheres reaches 50%. Genetic and patrimonial memory, immunity, hidden reserves and body abilities are restored. It turns out by modern standards a genital personality - the Russian potential is being revived. Such superiority in development also ensured success on the battlefield. The famous "Russian ingenuity" which the Europeans could not oppose. Rusichs thought faster and non-standard.
              A little history, enlighten
              1. In the 827th century, two Greek monks Cyril (869-815 g) and Methodius (885-6 g) began to change the Russian language (Initial Letter). For the spread of Christianity, they removed 49 letters not clear to them from the Initial Letter. They created a simplified alphabet (Cyrillic alphabet) and translated the Bible texts into the “new Russian language”. Thus appeared the Church Slavonic alphabet and Church Slavonic language. There were 43 characters in the Initial Letter, XNUMX remained in the Cyrillic alphabet. At the same time, the names of the remaining letters were changed, for example, the Gods turned into Beeches, Verbs into Verbs, Yes and Yes were combined into Yes, Life in Live, Zelo into Zelo, etc. Those. the principle of extracting images was distorted already in the first and second stages, it is impossible to read the true deep image. Over time, the Initial Letter was replaced by a simplified and false Cyrillic alphabet.

              2. Since 1708, Peter 1 took up the reform of the Russian language. He decided to create a “civilian font” so that Russian books and other printed publications look like Western European ones. Several capital letters (doublet) were deleted, superscript characters were excluded with them, the spelling of some capital letters was changed, European (Arabic) numbers were approved instead of letter designations of numbers (numerical values ​​of capital letters). They changed the Initial Letter and its graphics until the middle of the 38th century, until XNUMX letters were left in it.

              3. Since 1917, revolutionaries, terrorists A. Lunacharsky (1875 - 1933 g) and Lenin V.I. (1870 - 1924) changed the Initial Letter to the FACE alphabet, removing the images and reducing it to 33 letters. "Learn, study and study ..." (retrain). Both were hiding in Europe, in Russia were exiles, organizers of revolutions, Marxists, Bolsheviks.

              The Russian language became IMPOSSIBLE, the rules of word formation disappeared. But this is not enough for Russophobes, they are going to reduce the alphabet to 31 letters for a long time and clog the Russian language with foreign words.
              The new goal of the Cold War is to translate Russia into an "English-speaking format."
  28. Goldmitro
    Goldmitro 17 February 2013 13: 59
    +8
    <<< Indicative in this respect is the phrase said by the former Minister of Education A. Fursenko that the vice (sic!) Of the Soviet school was that it sought to educate a creator (!!!!), while the task of the Eref school - educate a qualified consumer (!!!!). This, it turns out, is a national, or rather, a group idea, since the consumer and "consumerism" have no nationality, the main thing is a trough, and who will provide it, his own or someone else's, is the tenth thing, the main thing is where to stick the grunt. >> >
    It turns out that all this liberal-Western riffraff entrenched in power and in power, all these Profursenki together with their bosses in the State Department have already found a "national idea" for Russia and are implementing it! This "idea" is an unrestrained "Consumerism" and Russians - consumers ... no longer need to strive for the greatness of Russia, rush into space, discoveries in science, achievements in culture ... All this will now be done exclusively by the enlightened West, and the lot "..shki" hawala what he indulgently will dump into the WTO-shnoe trough. This is how the future of Russia is seen by Western gameokrats, "well-wishers" and their Russian adherents - henchmen of the liberals and are doing everything to make it happen and are furious that the overwhelming majority of Russians DO NOT WANT TO BE CONSUMED ... BODIES!
  29. kruplen
    kruplen 17 February 2013 14: 01
    +2
    Excellent article
    1. sleepy
      sleepy 18 February 2013 04: 51
      +2
      In the afternoon with fire one cannot find the multivolume of I. Stalin on book sales.
      If only the publishers would print and republish, but for now it’s on the Internet
      http://greatstalin.ru/
      “Since the death of Stalin, tens of billions of dollars have been spent on his discrediting, primarily in the USSR and Russia. Thousands of pseudo-historical films have been shot, mountains of lies have been piled up, thousands of “historians” are brainwashing people around the world, making Stalin a “horror story” for children. No wonder. The whole bastard of the world hates the man who, during the first 19 years of governing the country, increased its industrial production by almost 70 times and turned it from an African state into the second in the world, and by a number of parameters, the first country in the world. ”
  30. Urrry
    Urrry 17 February 2013 14: 16
    +7
    The author finally raises the topic of responsibility for the repression of the entire elite of that time, i.e. personal ... Khrushchev and the same elite were quite successfully able to confuse everyone's head - by dumping all responsibility on one person, and avoiding his own responsibility for what he had done ... the attitude of Stalin himself to the "flywheel of repression" is manifested, incl. in his article "The son is not responsible for his father" (which was stopped by the cannibalistic mechanism of bringing children to justice for their parents' crimes), which was unfolding on the ground by the "regional elite", as well as the trials of the leaders of the NKVD Yezhov and Yagoda, the judicial system - which even in the most "harsh repressive" years was not afraid to pass 10% of acquittals (for comparison - now this figure in Russia is 0,1%) ... So another question: did the repressions develop at Stalin's will - or just due to its inability to timely overwhelm the elite of the country, whose groups used "repressive methods" in their own struggle with each other. The latter is also supported by the fact that repressions are practically tied only to the last years of the 30s - although Stalin after that remained in power for another 20 years, and if he were the source of "repressions" - there would be no logic in their sudden end; but if he was internally against them - this is just explainable by the fact that in the end he broke in the elite an immoderate craving for the "blood of enemies", taking it under tighter control
  31. Strategia
    Strategia 17 February 2013 14: 30
    +5
    The current leadership of the country should not demonize the personality of Joseph Vissarionovich, but, on the basis of his achievements and personal qualities, educate the younger generation, form the ideals of patriotism among the people.
    1. pogis
      pogis 17 February 2013 14: 39
      +1
      You should take a history book from your children! Do not read it just before bedtime!
    2. zennon
      zennon 17 February 2013 16: 25
      +2
      And to hell? Oil and gas are being chased over a hill, loot is being cut. Why should the people be the authorities?
    3. sniper
      sniper 17 February 2013 17: 00
      +3
      Quote: Strategia
      The current leadership of the country

      I’m afraid that the current leadership is even more heterogeneous than under Stalin ... Moreover, they have such cash flows in their hands, and the infusions of the West are much stronger, so Putin’s task is not so simple. how they try to convince us ...
      1. Ascetic
        Ascetic 18 February 2013 01: 01
        +4
        Quote: sniper
        I’m afraid that the current leadership is even more heterogeneous than under Stalin ... Moreover, they have such cash flows in their hands, and the infusions of the West are much stronger, so Putin’s task is not so simple. how they try to convince us ...


        In short, today the situation resembles the mid-20s in the USSR. Then there was a kind of dual power in the country, Stalin had the administrative hardware resource, and the Trotskyist-internationalists had ideology and economics, also associated with American bankers.
        Today, on the one hand, we also have statists on the other hand, and on the other, liberals, compradors.
        1. sniper
          sniper 18 February 2013 01: 13
          +2
          Quote: Ascetic
          Today the situation is reminiscent of the mid-20s in the USSR.

          And even more than that, in my opinion it is even worse ....
  32. Avenger711
    Avenger711 17 February 2013 14: 35
    +2
    Immediately before the accession of Peter, Russia sold to Europe from one and a half to two thousand cannon trunks annually


    And can you find out how many armies in Europe had at least a couple of thousand trunks? In this case, the guns then served for a very long time, unless they were destroyed in battle. In the Battle of Poltava, Charles I had only 41 guns, although Sweden in those years produced half of the iron in Europe and perhaps was the strongest power in Europe.

    In general, do not write nonsense about the next "Russia, which has fed half the world."

    If we talk about the era of Peter, then, as usual, a small part of the nominees built a fleet, the rest simply argued that from the West you can bring wonders for yourself. At the same time, the victory over Sweden is very serious. The access to the Baltic was critical in itself, sitting in the depths of the continent it is impossible to even trade with anyone until you get a dry pass, every lousy count or baron will pay a fee on the way. Ivan the Terrible was still fighting for the Baltic, but in that direction everything ended with status quo ante bellum. Naturally, the boyars were also not against stealing, they executed someone, they put up with someone, like the same Menshikov. It is always difficult to find like-minded people, and you had to endure such characters, as later, under Stalin, Beria would pull out valuable personnel from the camps, even if they were anti-Soviet at least three times, even if the government scolded it, it would only work.
  33. homosum20
    homosum20 17 February 2013 15: 04
    -2
    Yes, they have already lured all this dregs. My mother was a Russian language teacher at school. And when they wrote an essay on Turgenev "fathers and children" (the new generation probably does not know about such a book - however, they did not lose much), one student wrote a very succinct in content and short in form: "It was a long time ago and there is no need to stir up the past." ...
    Winners are not judged. True, this does not apply to moral pygmies, who have not taken a more responsible decision in their entire lives than choosing between going to the toilet or settling in place ... (or going to a rally - or watching on TV). For them to judge the great is a way to exalt themselves.
    1. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 16: 04
      +1
      Well, if "not much has been lost" about Turgenev (by the way, he is a RUSSIAN writer, and in Russian surnames are written with a capital letter, unlike homosum20), then for you, apparently, it makes no difference which country to live in. Maybe change the flag?
      1. homosum20
        homosum20 19 February 2013 18: 21
        0
        Judge by your comment - you quote Turgenev by heart from any line and for any reason. If it didn’t come to you - with a capital letter I write the names of those people, countries that I respect. And I can’t consider any verbiage a great work, excuse me. Not a single new thought, not a single clearly expressed thought. And change the flag yourself, if it’s uncomfortable with me in one country, then you can do the same.
        And about a lot of lost, let's talk. You, for example, what was extracted from the work of Turgenev? What actions did his works draw on that you would not have committed without reading mu-mu?
        I'm afraid do not answer. But bullshit to drive into the wave - no patriotism, no knowledge of literature is required.
  34. pogis
    pogis 17 February 2013 15: 04
    +3
    It’s hard to find out the truth about Our history to the layman who does not have access to archives! Yes, this is not necessary. The main thing is to keep up with the times, that is, to publish textbooks in which there will be truth! I scored the story before Peter 1! HE CLEAR ALL But I think it’s important for the younger generation to bring the latest history of Russia (the USSR) from 1917 to 2013! At school, now they smoke 4 at a break! Teachers don’t even notice this! What can they teach! They have to teach their history at home for the last 10 years !
  35. figvamforever
    figvamforever 17 February 2013 15: 41
    -5
    Quote: Avenger711
    And where does Putin ??

    Well, to see the truth and nothing to do with. Not at work, in general, he. But does Russia need such a non-chapel president?
    1. Avenger711
      Avenger711 17 February 2013 19: 53
      +2
      The dynamics of Putin's rule are positive. It may be enough to accuse him of destroying something that in the 2000th no longer existed.
      1. sleepy
        sleepy 18 February 2013 05: 00
        +1
        Quote: Avenger711
        "The dynamics of Putin's rule are positive.
        Maybe it will be enough to accuse him of destroying something that did not exist in 2000. "
        .

        No one is going to blame for what was not in 2000.
        For example, there were no vaccinations against cancer. And the destruction of the people with vaccinations was not in 2000.

        "There is a sterilization of women and girls with the help of" vaccinations against cervical cancer "
        http://vk.com/antiprivivki#/topic-19732513_25671494
        "Ugra, along with Moscow and the Moscow region, has become a pilot site for testing a vaccine
        "Against cervical cancer."
        Under this project, 15 thousand girls aged 9 to 17 will be vaccinated with the new Gardasil vaccine developed by the American company Merck. This vaccine is now being actively introduced into the national vaccination calendars of many countries. The cost of vaccinating one person is 15000 rubles, which will be paid from budgetary funds.
        The vaccine manufacturers and the Ministry of Health and Social Development officials who promote it, in numerous advertising materials, prove that this vaccine can significantly reduce the number of cases of cervical cancer. "

        http://rutube.ru/video/44921f1b895c04e95fc4b37167d89f50/

        From the Internet.
        “Statistics show that with the advent of vaccines, mortality among patients has increased.
        Side effects associated with modern vaccines include Sudden Infant Death Syndrome
        (“Death in the cradle”), the rapid increase in the number of autistic people and many other equally dangerous and painful diseases.
        However, vaccinators, led by WHO, pretend that their pharmaceutical business is saving humanity ...

        Already proven by independent laboratories that all vaccines kill immunity (especially three-phase).
        For example, a uterine cancer vaccine sterilizes girls, and annotations indicate
        that supposedly this aspect has not been studied. And these are the vaccines that advertise on CT.
        In Ukraine, people staged protests against vaccination requirements when they learned that the shipment of vaccines supplied to them led to numerous deaths in Germany.

        Vaccine proponents: only one question - what is the composition of any vaccine you know.

        The truth about vaccinations. http://vk.com/antiprivivki
        Doctors against vaccinations
        "... and there one of the topics sounds like this:" Are there physicians among us (as well as former ones)? How did you come to refuse vaccination? "
        The answers are as follows:

        Hello! I am a neurologist, now on maternity leave with my youngest daughter.
        After vaccination of their children (older than 8 years, younger than 1 year. 10 months.) Refused after the institute cycle of immunology.
        In informal classes, we were told statistics on vaccination, "forbidden" articles.
        Then I discovered that even a disability group was allocated in the local social protection fund
        (Complications after vaccination). I am very glad that I found like-minded people here! Thanks you!
        1. sleepy
          sleepy 18 February 2013 05: 59
          0
          One science fiction book described a planet on which children were no longer born due to genetic experiments.
          Representatives of the planet turned to all Galactic authorities, but no one could help.
          The inhabitants of the planet lived a long time, but no one could abolish mortality.
          Without children, the planet was doomed and others began to record it in their sphere.

          http://privivke.net/
          About vaccinations.

          "If we do really good work on new VACCINES, health care, reproductive services, we can reduce the population" - Bill Gates.
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKKAbDfH6xM

          A wave of childhood deaths from vaccinations.
          http://privivke.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=436:130213-&cat

          id=49:2012-01-18-11-31-12&Itemid=75

          Vaccination through genocide.
          http://privivke.net/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=433:070213-&cat
          id=49:2012-01-18-11-31-12&Itemid=75

          1. sleepy
            sleepy 18 February 2013 06: 03
            0
            "If we do a really good job on new VACCINES, health care, reproductive services,
            then we can reduce the population "- Bill Gates.

  36. wax
    wax 17 February 2013 15: 50
    +2
    The article is thoughtful. Respect to the author.
  37. Ascetic
    Ascetic 17 February 2013 16: 08
    +4
    Quote: Wax
    Author Respect.


    Andrei Ilyich Fursov (May 16, 1951, Schelkovo, Moscow Region, RSFSR, USSR) - Russian historian, sociologist, publicist, organizer of science.

    Born in the city of Shchelkovo in the family of a serviceman. In 1973 he graduated from the History Department of the Institute of Asian and African Countries at Moscow State University. M.V. Lomonosov. In 1986 he defended his thesis on "A critical analysis of non-Marxist historiography of the 1970s and 80s on the problems of the peasantry in Asia."
    In 1997-2006 supervised the work of the Institute of Russian History of the Russian State Humanitarian University (RGGU), organized by him, headed the Russian Historical Journal, led the seminar club Universum. In 2002-2006 was co-director of the Center for Global Studies and Comparative Studies of the Institute of Philology and History of the Russian State Humanitarian University.
    A. I. Fursov - director of the Center for Russian Studies at the Institute for Fundamental and Applied Research at Moscow University for the Humanities (since May 2007), head of the Department of Asia and Africa, INION RAS (since 1990), editor-in-chief of the journal Orientalism and Africanism (foreign literature) ) ”, Head of the Center for Methodology and Information of the Institute for Dynamic Conservatism (since 2009).
    Member of the Russian Intellectual Club, expert council of the Political Journal.
    According to the results of the Internet voting of the scientific community in 2000-2004 and 2005. entered the lists of “100 leading social and humanitarian thinkers of Russia” (2005 and 2006, respectively).
    In 2009, he was elected a full member (academician) of the International Academy of Sciences (Austria).
    Since 2009 - Member of the Expert Council of the international analytical journal "Geopolitics".
    In 2010, he was elected a member of the Union of Writers of Russia.

  38. polly
    polly 17 February 2013 16: 31
    +8
    Judging by how liberals are afraid of any mention of Stalin
    (remember the recently released notebooks for schoolchildren with a ceremonial portrait of a generalissimo on the cover, and their barking about it!), they perfectly understand the futility of their pathetic attempts to mix Stalin with mud. Worthless shakalya flock!
  39. Snoop
    Snoop 17 February 2013 16: 43
    +2
    As for the TASS statement of June 14, 1941, it was also addressed to Japan, it was part of a tripartite pact. According to which the participants provided military assistance in case of attack on any of the parties to the agreement by a third party. After the war began, Stalin sent a note to Japan which he asked to resolve the border conflict with Germany. All this was done in order to avoid a war on two fronts, so that the Japanese did not have formal grounds to begin hostilities in the Far East.
  40. figvamforever
    figvamforever 17 February 2013 16: 57
    -11
    Quote: Strategia
    The current leadership of the country should not demonize the personality of Joseph Vissarionovich, but, on the basis of his achievements and personal qualities, educate the younger generation, form the ideals of patriotism among the people.


    This is in the sense that it is learning to rob? Stalin was a professional criminal. The komunyak had a lot of such "heroes".

    The peak of the predatory activity of the Stalin's gang was an attack on the ship "Emperor Nikolai the First."

    1908 year. Just before the departure of the mail steamer, people in police uniform appear on the pier. They board on the pretext of finding dangerous criminals. And then there is a cry: “Drop your weapon, this is a raid!” Security is quickly driven into the cabin.

    Stalin with his gang of criminals seize the safe. The best bear cub of the city of Ahmed opens the safe, from where they pull out a million two hundred thousand rubles (!).

    Stalin, along with Ahmed transplanted on a fast boat. Security breaks out the cabin door and jumps out onto the deck. But the boat was already out of sight ...
    1. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 17: 20
      +11
      And then notes appeared in the newspapers that Dzhugashvili was buying up the most expensive real estate in London? Or could a bank loan for revolutionary activity be taken?
      1. vovan1949
        vovan1949 17 February 2013 18: 51
        0
        Strategia: "Stalin was a professional criminal. The komunyak had a lot of such" heroes "."

        It has long been said: - "There is no mind - consider a cripple."
        1. Strategia
          Strategia 17 February 2013 19: 09
          0
          Something did not understand why you ascribe other people's words to me.
    2. Egoza
      Egoza 17 February 2013 19: 03
      +3
      "figwamforever"! Why didn't you put a link, where did you get this lie? am
      It has long been proven that I.V. Stalin himself did not go on any raids! Planned - maybe! And for the raids there were militant groups! And the money went to the newspaper and by the way partially distributed to the families of the striking workers.
    3. Avenger711
      Avenger711 17 February 2013 19: 56
      +1
      He was not professional, but ideological, that is, to steal from the power with which you are struggling, as it is possible and fairly. In youth, many romantics, but smart necessarily become conservatives.
    4. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 22: 26
      0
      Quote: figvamforever
      Stalin was a professional criminal. The komunyak had plenty of such "heroes".

      it is now revolutions and financed over the hillocks, but then the same Stalin robbed more than one safe for a good cause, they probably forgot "Expropriation of the expropriators"
    5. Havoc
      Havoc 18 February 2013 02: 00
      +3
      Quote: figvamforever
      Security is quickly driven into the cabin.

      Wow, what terrible criminals, they didn't even kill anyone, Koba had a very "terrible" gang.
  41. zavesa01
    zavesa01 17 February 2013 17: 10
    +5
    Quote: Cynic
    Bloody gebni misinformation! Until Peter I, Russia did not have its own cannons and had no experience of cannon fighting! Reliability of information? Everyone knows that! There in the cinema they showed how merchants brought the first guns to the tsar to the show!


    But did you know that it was Russia that armed all of Europe with advanced weapons? Every year, Russian monasteries and foundries sold hundreds of guns, thousands of muskets, cold steel.
    Source - here's a quote from the "Encyclopedia of weapons":
    “It is interesting that in the XVI-XVII centuries manufacturers of artillery guns were not only Pushkarsky sovereigns, but also monasteries. For example, a fairly large production of cannons was carried out in the Solovki monastery and in the Kirillov-Belozersky monastery.
    They owned guns and very successfully used them Don and Zaporozhye Cossacks. The first mention of the use of guns Zaporozhye Cossacks refers to the year 1516.
    In the XIX-XX centuries in Russia and abroad the opinion was formed that the pre-Peter artillery was technically backward. But here are the facts: in the 1646 year, the Tula-Kamensk factories supplied Holland with more 600 guns, and in the 1647 year 360 guns of the 4,6 caliber and 8 pounds. In 1675, the Tula-Kamensk factories shipped 116 cast iron cannons, 43892 cores, 2934 grenades, 2356 musket trunks, 2700 swords and 9687 iron poods. ”
    Here you have a wild backward Russia, about which they say at school.
    England and France learned to cast iron only in the 1600th century. We ask those who doubt doubts at the Artillery Museum in St. Petersburg. One of the cast-iron cannons, cast in XNUMX, is impudently lying there on a stand for all to see.
    1. Cynic
      Cynic 17 February 2013 17: 36
      +5
      Quote: zavesa01
      One of the cast-iron cannons, cast in 1600, is impudently lying there on a stand for all to see.

      This only confirms that the bloody gebnya not only falsified documents, but also had a time machine developed by scientists from a license plate in its casemates!
      Certainly an advanced Western scientific thought, get this gun to her. will find a secret stigma and inscription on this gun!
      wink
      1. alexandr00070
        alexandr00070 17 February 2013 22: 34
        0
        Quote: Cynic
        will find a secret stigma and inscription on this gun!
    2. Mikhail3
      Mikhail3 17 February 2013 19: 04
      +2
      Are you sho? Over there, above, they explain "reasonably" - we bought all the ore in Sweden! And Peter cut off the bells from the belfries of the monastery ... but did not liquidate the industrial enterprises of the military-industrial complex, to please European and English competitors ...
      I hope that we will be read by a certain number of young people who have not yet lost, even under the cruel pressure of "modern European teaching methods", critical thinking. Convince people of something. those who are confident that Europe is light and Russia is darkness (while conscientiously wrapping up Russian bacon) are sad and useless ...
    3. Avenger711
      Avenger711 17 February 2013 20: 10
      0
      Can I proof? And then the chances are 99.9% that the Netherlands had 600 guns in the 17th century, which did not spawn at the same time. Which is characteristic, but Charles XII easily hung the lyuley of the Russian army near Narva. But instead of ordering a couple of hundred guns at his factories, which at such a pace of production would have been given to him in a month with the refusal of export supplies during the war, Peter suddenly began to remove the bells.

      Cast iron in Europe is known for a very long time. England really did not melt much, because there was little wood and it went to the fleet, but after the introduction of coking the process began, and coal in England is of very good quality, as far as I know.
    4. Alexander 1958
      Alexander 1958 17 February 2013 20: 17
      0
      Quote: zavesa01
      England and France learned to cast iron only in the XNUMXth century

      Ek, you are enough! And where did they get guns for the strongest fleet, anchors, bells for churches, etc. Well, I don’t argue, and in Russia the foundry was set up well, but that the English-French would learn how to cast iron only in the 19th century .. belay
      Alexander 1958
    5. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 21: 58
      0
      Quote: zavesa01
      Until Peter I, Russia did not have its own cannons and had no experience of cannon fighting!


      I’ll add ......... but in another chronicle (“Sophia temporary”) there is a message that during the defense of Moscow from the Tatars in 1382 the Russians used firearms “mattresses (“ mattress ”the spoiled Tatar word“ mattress ”means a gun ), commencing in them ... and others with great guns. ” In 1400, Moscow began to manufacture gunpowder.

      By the beginning of the 1393th century, artillery pieces were in service not only in the Moscow principality, but also in other Russian principalities. So, the presence of guns in Lord Veliky Novgorod was mentioned in the annals under 1408, and in the Principality of Tver under XNUMX.

      In 1408, the Tatar khan Edigey moved with a large army to Moscow. Prince of Moscow Vasily Dmitrievich decided to sit in a siege. As Karamzin wrote stories: "Vasily the prince hoped for the fortress of the walls of Moscow, for the action of his guns ... November 30, in the evening, the Tatars appeared, but in the distance, fearing the action of city guns."
      Thus, in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries there were dozens, if not hundreds, of artillery pieces, structurally close to the guns of the late XNUMXth century, threaded with vertical and horizontal wedge gates.
    6. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 22: 32
      +1
      Quote: zavesa01
      Russia didn’t have its own guns and had no experience of cannon fighting


      I’ll add .................... But in another chronicle (“Sophia temporary”) there is a message that during the defense of Moscow from the Tatars in 1382 the Russians used firearms “mattresses ( "Mattress" the spoiled Tatar word "mattress" means a gun), commencing in them ... and others with great cannons. " In 1400, Moscow began to manufacture gunpowder.

      By the beginning of the 1393th century, artillery pieces were in service not only in the Moscow principality, but also in other Russian principalities. So, the presence of guns in Lord Veliky Novgorod was mentioned in the annals under 1408, and in the Principality of Tver under XNUMX.

      In 1408, the Tatar khan Edigey moved with a large army to Moscow. Prince of Moscow Vasily Dmitrievich decided to sit in a siege. As Karamzin wrote stories: "Vasily the prince hoped for the fortress of the walls of Moscow, for the action of his guns ... November 30, in the evening, the Tatars appeared, but in the distance, fearing the action of city guns."

      The development of artillery guns in Russia followed basically the same paths as in the west. The most significant difference was the lack of a bombardment in Russia (in any case, historians do not have information about them).
      Noteworthy is the large number of long-barreled instruments of squeakers. The word peep comes from the Latin pistula trumpet. Any long-barreled guns, from heavy guns to large siege guns, were called bugs.
      Thus, in the XVIXVII centuries there were dozens, if not hundreds of samples of artillery pieces, structurally close to the guns of the end of the XIX century, rifled with vertical and horizontal wedge gates.
  42. Vadim-ragalevich
    Vadim-ragalevich 17 February 2013 17: 19
    +1
    The article is very timely. I read it with great pleasure. I would very much like to hear the author on the RTR in the program "Jew" (he called himself so in one of the last programs) Solovyov.
    1. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 17: 26
      0
      If you call yourself, then you need to write without quotes)))
      1. Cpa
        Cpa 17 February 2013 18: 52
        0
        He also wrote a book about himself, where he confessed to a Jewish boy adopted by Russian parents. Typically, in a book written in an artistic way, Soloviev presents himself as an apostle of a new messiah. There is also the author’s irony about the Russian faith in the Jewish god, with strong anti-Semitic sentiments.
  43. figvamforever
    figvamforever 17 February 2013 17: 27
    -7
    Quote: Strategia
    Or could a bank loan for revolutionary activity be taken?


    The tsar had to hang them all to one, as he hung his brother Ulyanov. The good king was, here the Jews and Georgians made a revolution. And he was shot for kindness. Commies are bloodsuckers.
    1. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 17: 53
      +1
      But the king abdicated from the throne not before the Jews and Georgians ...
    2. Urrry
      Urrry 17 February 2013 18: 58
      +2
      The tsar was overthrown by his own "liberal" elite with bourgeois goals and under the slogans of "political freedom of the individual" (that is, the same, in fact, that destroyed the USSR) ... the Bolsheviks came much later than the tsar's abdication from the throne. The Provisional Government consisted of masons, and it would hardly have begun to build an "independent world power" in Russia, and if the Bolsheviks had not come to power at that moment, it would have been the same 90s: the redistribution of property and the robbery of raw materials with an almost complete loss of independence and sovereignty ...
  44. zavesa01
    zavesa01 17 February 2013 18: 10
    +2
    At the expense of the Petrovsky fleet, not everything is so smooth either. Peter destroyed the Pomor ships, and began to build Dutch ones. However, Dutch ships in the northern seas, due to the peculiarities of the hull bypass, had a limited navigation time. De Tolle built his "Fram" on the principle of POMOR ships "lodias". The peculiarity of the lodge is that, being trapped by ice, its hull did not crack, and the ice itself pushed it to its surface. Here's another example of backward Russians. By the way, I don’t remember exactly whose correspondence, if I’m not mistaken then Plato, there is a mention of the SKIF prince, who taught many useful things and explained many things, in particular, what is the ANCHOR for.

    If we take the cavalry, what was the European cavalry armed with and what was the Russian? And now if there are no fans of edged weapons then rummage through the Internet. I assure you if you are interested, discover VERY MUCH new when comparing dates, places, and the names of steel.

    Simply, if you immediately say interesting things, they usually do not believe them.
  45. riding
    riding 17 February 2013 18: 17
    +4
    To the question of repression. If now part of our elite steeped in corruption, corrupt and stunned by the stolen goods, is forcibly sent to the Far East to raise the economy of this most important region, then later they will tell the truth about the bloody repressions of the totalitarian regime.
  46. figvamforever
    figvamforever 17 February 2013 18: 26
    -3
    Quote: Strategia
    But the king abdicated not before the Jews and Georgians

    Forgot how commies-revolutionaries leaked war to the Germans? They forgot how the Bolsheviks put forward the slogan of defeating "their" government. However, it was difficult to expect anything other than betrayal by the then revolutionaries (Jews and Georgians). They will plunge into chaos.
    1. Larus
      Larus 17 February 2013 18: 43
      +1
      They did not forget the multimillion victims of the First World War to please the Western countries, which then rushed to rob their former ally, and kill citizens. For starters, you should read that the thread did not interfere, except for stamping about the traitorous commies and so all the beloved nobles who removed fluff from their peasant neighbors who swam in the shokload. Look at modern reality from the hinterland and know that there will be exactly the same continuation, looking at this "concern" for ordinary people.
    2. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 18: 59
      +1
      Remember the date of the abdication of the king from the throne and the date of the October Revolution. Remember who accepted the abdication of the king, in whose environment he was.
    3. Avenger711
      Avenger711 17 February 2013 20: 18
      0
      The tsarist government merged the war, as for the tantrums about getting out of the war and that it was necessary to go to a victorious end, then to correct the brains, get acquainted with the lack of everything in the Russian army, from guns to grub.
    4. loisop
      loisop 17 February 2013 23: 33
      0
      And bring liquid links?
  47. Larus
    Larus 17 February 2013 18: 35
    +4
    Correctly the article says that the thieves and caste of Soviet-party nomenklatura who scambled over into shit-democrats, who previously divided everything that was created by the whole country and people, thus robbing it and building nothing new continues to parasitize on what is still holding on. They pump out everything that is possible from the old Soviet one, do not update anything, do not improve anything and build nothing of what we need. And now they also close the hospital in villages and towns, because. You see, it’s not profitable for them, let the people die.
    All the same, the story moves in a spiral and such people were already sitting abroad and thinking what was wrong, it was who managed to carry his feet away from popular anger.
  48. zavesa01
    zavesa01 17 February 2013 18: 42
    +6
    “Many of the affairs of our party and people will be perverted and spat on, above all, abroad, and in our country too. Zionism, striving for world domination, will cruelly avenge us for our successes and achievements. He still sees Russia as a barbaric country, as raw appendage. And my name will also be slandered, slandered. Many atrocities will be attributed to me.
    World Zionism will by all means strive to destroy our Union so that Russia can never rise again. The strength of the USSR lies in the friendship of peoples. The edge of the struggle will be aimed primarily at breaking this friendship, at breaking off the outskirts of Russia. Here, I must admit, we have not done everything yet. There is still a big field of work.
    Nationalism will raise its head with particular force. He will crush internationalism and patriotism for a while, only for a while. National groups within nations and conflicts will arise. Many pygmy leaders will appear, traitors within their nations.
    In general, in the future development will go more complex and even frantic ways, the turns will be extremely steep. The point is that the East will be particularly upset. There will be sharp contradictions with the West.
    And yet, no matter how the events develop, time will pass, and the eyes of new generations will be turned to the deeds and victories of our socialist Fatherland. Year after year, new generations will come. They will once again raise the banner of their fathers and grandfathers and give us their due. They will build their future on our past. "

    I. Stalin. From the recording of the conversation with A.M. Kollontai, November 1939
    1. SASCHAmIXEEW
      SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 15: 28
      0
      What a visionary !! The mind is incomprehensible !! All who blaspheme him are really pygmies !!! Plague on their house !!!
  49. figvamforever
    figvamforever 17 February 2013 19: 07
    -8
    Quote: Larus
    For starters, you should read that the thread didn’t interfere other than stamping about commies traitors
    1. Strategia
      Strategia 17 February 2013 19: 19
      +2
      You probably are not capable of more than copying someone else's. I didn’t read any of your author’s thoughts.
    2. alexandr00070
      alexandr00070 17 February 2013 22: 48
      +2
      Quote: figvamforever
      For starters, you should read that another thread didn’t bother


      We are dealing only with the image of Stalin, projected onto a real person, a social construct that is created here and now, by us and our contemporaries. We cannot but comprehend the world, including the events of the past, on the basis of the existing structures and procedures for understanding man, society, and the world. And these structures are not generated by a separate human consciousness, but by society as a whole. Any understanding is an interpretation of facts, any history is only an interpretation and, if you like, a myth. After all, the criteria themselves are changing for what to consider as a fact, what sense to invest in this concept, how to select these facts and, finally, which of the billion events to direct attention to, and which not, etc. If our society is ready to talk and argue about Stalin, then this figure acts as a marker and symbol of existing social trends and expectations. Who is Stalin now? Stalin is not the past, it is the present and the expected future. Stalin is actualization, a visible manifestation of the mythological structures of the Russian, the painful reaction of the Russian unconscious to the deadly virus of liberalism. Stalin is a longing for a strong state, associated with the difficulties and hardships of life in a great empire.
      Stalin is a myth about truth, without which the “state will not stand,” this is the eternal Russian dream of a time when they will live in justice, in an atmosphere filled with faith and hope, clothed in the image of memory, this is the myth of the fearsome Tsar-father, the myth of retribution and punishment, In the Stalinist myth find their place and traditionally characteristic of Russian society, ideas about power, the state, the figure of the king, ruler, the relationship of the sovereign and the people, sovereign and elite, by the way, and the traditional disputes for Russia on all these issues too react ulizirovannye and cling to the image of the leader as a significant symbol for all. Why was he destined to play this role? To answer this question is to unravel the mystery of a great personality, of what made it great, which is hardly possible. The eternal and the modern converge in the image of Stalin together.
      The myth is what should interest us, in the myth of Stalin two lines intersect more clearly than ever, one is the idea of ​​a “people's king,” a formidable and just one, the king-patron, punishing the presumptuous elites. The second is the elites' fear of punishment, justice, the prospect of losing everything that “has been acquired by overwork”. The advocates of Stalin only about the first component of the myth, about Stalin, which the people are waiting for, about the type of leader who so corresponds to the national archetypes that he cannot but materialize, and forget about the second. Elite, or to be honest, the rabble, which takes the place of real elites in Russia, is also waiting for Stalin. And for them he is more alive than all the living, he embodies the fear of punishment and the awareness of his own wrongness, the fear and premonition of retribution that will come from the people despised and longing for the "Kremlin highlander" people. How else to explain more 20-years going "de-Stalinization"? With the dead do not fight, especially for so long. De-Stalinize, then wait, De-Stalinize, it means they have a presentiment. They, too, without realizing, bring the materialization of the archetype closer, see the revived ghosts of the past in the future, tensely awaiting retribution.
      1. SASCHAmIXEEW
        SASCHAmIXEEW 19 February 2013 15: 33
        0
        Oh come retribution !! They will distribute each earring! Little does not seem!
  50. sdf23wesdgg
    sdf23wesdgg 17 February 2013 19: 32
    -1
    Imagine, it turns out that our authorities have complete information about each of us. And now she has appeared on the Internet http://trunc.it/m8pnt Very surprised and scared,
    my correspondence, addresses, phone numbers, even found my nude photo, I can’t even imagine from where. The good news is that the data can be deleted from the site, of course, I used it and I advise everyone not to hesitate