Interview with Alexander Dugin, the leader of the International “Eurasian Movement”, Professor of Moscow State University named after M. Lomonosov, the Serbian journal “Geopolitics”.
- Dear Alexander Gelevich, please explain the background of the latest coups and wars in the Middle East, designated in the world media by the name “Arab Spring”. How do you assess the uprising in Syria and how, not only for this country, but also for the region and the whole world, do you consider important to preserve the state structures of President Bashar al-Assad?
- The Arab Spring has nothing to do with the interests of the Arab world itself. The Arab Spring is a manipulation of American strategists to change the balance of power in the Middle East. The goal of the Arab spring is to support what is called regional subimperialism in modern geopolitics, that is, allies of the United States who, nevertheless, come from other theoretical premises. Such sub-imperialist powers in the Middle East are Qatar, Saudi Arabia among Arab countries, and Turkey. These countries act as intermediaries for US-directed operations. During these operations, coups were carried out in Tunisia, in Egypt, where coalition groups came to power, targeting either the United States directly, these are the so-called Democrats, or Saudi Arabia and Qatar, i.e. on their geopolitical systems.
History with the group “Pussy Rayot”, the story of the attempt of the “Orange Revolution” is all the work of the “fifth column”, tseerushnyh agents of influence, liberals, as well as a very powerful Israeli lobby.
In Libya, when the situation became more complex, and the Libyan people did not want to be directly involved in this process, the West used military intervention measures when, in violation of all the treaties, in fact, representatives of NATO, the United States and European countries (in particular, France) , participated in the military conflict on the side of the Wahhabis and Islamic fundamentalists.
On the Internet you can find a remarkable photograph of Bernard-Henri Levy, adviser to former French President Nicolas Sarkozy, posing as a philosopher, an active Zionist, a supporter of Israel, along with Christopher Stevens, who will then be killed in Benghazi as the US ambassador. Sam Bajil (Nakula Basel), the producer of the scandalous film “The Innocence of Muslims”, is captured in this photo. We see the Zionists, CIA leaders and radical Islamophobes on one side. They are the source of the planning and implementation of the Arab spring, which has nothing to do with the interests of the Arabs themselves.
Arabs are simply manipulated in order to create a situation of controlled chaos. They are manipulated from outside, manipulated directly with the help of Western networks of influence, and with the help of their sub-imperialist allies in the Middle East. When in Bahrain, the Shiite majority tries to insist on their own on the wave of the Arab Spring, then all these forces rush against the overwhelming majority.
The case in the Arab Spring is not in a democracy, but in geopolitics: the West wants to create its own regimes that are loyal to themselves, the Saudis, the Catharites and the Wahhabis, as well as the Turks; create their own bridgeheads to attack Iran, the Shiite arc, which includes Iran, Iraq, which now largely passes under the direct control of Iran, as the American troops leave from there. Hence, the Shiite arc includes Iran, Iraq, Syria, Hezbollah in Lebanon, as well as Bahrain. All of these countries follow the anti-American line, do not play the American games, and oppose American imperialism in the Islamic world. Therefore, these forces are the object of hatred of the West, and all the Arab revolutions are directed against Iran, against Syria, against the Shiite arc, as well as against Russia, which in this case supports the anti-imperialist, anti-American policy in the Middle East.
Therefore, there is a fundamental geopolitical division: on the one hand, supporters of a multipolar world in the face of Russia, China and other big powers, and Shiite countries, Shiite societies in the Middle East, who oppose the American Zionist expansion. On the other hand, supporters of a unipolar world; these are the USA and their various sub-imperialist powers: Israel, on the one hand, Saudi Arabia and Qatar, Wahhabi and radical Salafi Islamic forces, on the other, and on the third side, Turkey.
In Turkey, Recep Erdogan, after his opponents were indiscriminately slandered and thrown into prison, re-returned to the atlantist position. Of course, if you make parallels, the story of Serbia is exactly the same: because Serbia is on the side of the multipolar world, it is an ally of Russia. The same forces that are now fighting against Iran, Syria, and engaged in destabilization of the Middle East, were thrown against Serbia. The same game, the same participants.
So, the last, as far as Syria is concerned, in the answer to this question, then Syria is the last bastion. If the regime of Bashar al-Assad falls under the blows of the Americans and their Salafi (Wahhabi) lackeys, there will be a way out open to Iran, which means a blow to Russia. This means war, war with Iran. Also, the Wahhabis, who were created by the same groups in Russia itself, are waiting for a denouement of the Syrian tragedy. As soon as the Assad regime falls, and if the Wahhabis seize Damascus, then Russia should prepare for an uprising. In Dagestan, these sentiments are already very strong with the very same goals: destabilization of the Russian state competing with America on a regional scale, and destabilization of the situation in Iran and Russia. Therefore, American, Saudi and Qatari agents act on the territory of the Russian Federation, and are preparing a strike to Moscow and Putin in the back.
- The crisis of the West (EU and America) is evident, as the production and the real economy are transferred to the East. What will be the response of the West to the process of recession of its own power? Will global planners resort to some kind of long-term strategy or some radical solution, say, to provoke a conflict on a planetary scale?
- I am absolutely convinced that the crisis of the West is present, but the West has not just moved the center of economic industrial growth to the “third world” and to Asia or Latin America. The West continues to control with the help of the financial system all the processes that occur in the world. Therefore, the West depends only on the success of a unipolar globalization. If the United States and the West as a whole retain control over setting the rules of the game in the economy (not production itself, not industrial power itself, but rules, especially in the financial sphere), that is, financial capitalism, a global financial oligarchic model, then where the production will be located, it is the West that will control all the processes in the economy. Since it is the West that prints the reserve world currency, all economies are pegged to the dollar, so virtually the whole world works for the United States and sponsors the United States.
Thus, a crisis is a crisis of financial capitalism as a whole, and it is not solved by a technical change of problems in one direction or another. This is a crisis of civilization, it is a crisis of materialistic atheistic culture, it is a crisis of the way of the West to liberalism and individualism, and so-called freedom, which in fact led to new forms of totalitarianism, perversion and dictatorship. Therefore, in fact, we are experiencing a fundamental crisis; this crisis is not a technical failure, this crisis, in fact, is the result of the path of the West over the past three hundred years, when the West has moved away from Christianity, from its religion, and finally embarked on the path of technical modernization. Therefore, now we are approaching the most terrible, most conclusive chord of this path. Accordingly, the economic crisis and the problems that the USA and Europe are experiencing in management are not just technical failures, they are a collapse. And although many there pretend that everything is normal, that nothing is happening, they understand this. Therefore, there can be no soft way out of this situation.
I am absolutely convinced that the United States is leading the cause of the Third World War - a real, full-fledged, world war. Therefore, by bringing radical Islamic regimes to power, the United States itself creates an excuse for the subsequent invasion of these countries. And this is well understood by many Muslims and Arabs, who see how they are manipulated, how scarecrows are created from them, the enemies of humanity in the flesh, after which they will be destroyed, explaining the need to prevent the "misanthropic ideology", which the Americans themselves now support. They will justify the future genocide of Muslim peoples, and those that have nothing to do with what is happening. In general, the final fight begins.
The task of the United States, of course, is to globally destabilize political systems, to deprive states of sovereignty — the events of the Arab Spring are aimed at this; all sovereign states must be dismantled and go under the control of either provocative extremist forces, which simply by their existence provide an opportunity at any moment of the invasion. For example, the Taliban regime in Afghanistan, which the Americans themselves also brought to power through their Pakistani sub-imperialist allies. And this goal corresponds to the destabilization of other countries, especially China.
Therefore, there is a struggle between US globalism and those who, on the contrary, are now trying to preserve sovereignty and their general positions, that is, supporters of a multipolar world. There are two camps: supporters of a unipolar, Western world, Western hegemony, imperialism, financial capitalism, who wants to save themselves at any price, including the cost of the Third World War and the de facto destruction of a significant part of humanity. This is the most likely scenario; It seems to me that we will not be able to pass it, although it is necessary to do everything possible so that supporters of the multipolar world make a harmonious outcome of this fundamental, absolute, unprecedented final crisis. For this we need to rally, for this we need to think, to work, but everything is permeated by Western networks of influence - in Russia, in the Islamic world, in Europe, also in Iran there is a “fifth column”; there is, of course, in Serbia - servants of Westerners and Atlanticists. This aggravates the possibility of our maneuvers.
Humanity is doomedly moving into the abyss, where it is being dragged by representatives of the world elite - this is no longer just the United States as a separate country - these are representatives of financial global capital, world financial oligarchy, which in essence is a world government ignoring any laws of democracy.
We see this, for example, in Greece. Greece has simply introduced an absolutely direct external administration, which has absolutely no relation to democracy, which disposes of this country at its discretion, ostensibly to save it from the crisis that the representatives of this financial oligarchy themselves created in Greece. And so will be everywhere, that is, there is a de-sovereignty.
We deal with the occupation practically on a global scale, the occupation of sovereign states by the world government and its means of influence. I think it's time to declare war on the world government. This is the only way to postpone or even avoid the Third World War: either we strike at the Americans and their networks that lead to this cause, or we will kill each other.
- In Serbia over the past decade, with great pleasure watching the process of state and economic recovery of Russia. On the other hand, it should be noted that the national circles in Serbia are following with concern the protests of the "opposition" in Russia, as well as the process of undermining the authority and values of the Russian state and civilization by the media. The concern comes from the fact that we in Serbia have a wealth of experience in implementing all kinds of Western methods of orange revolutions. How do you rate the real media harassment of the Church, President Putin?
- Yes, you are absolutely right: this is a very dangerous tendency. These people do not represent our population, but it is very, very active, fueled by the West, the United States, the CIA, the US State Department, and the European subimperialist structures, fueled by a minority. It consists mainly of people either ethnically non-Russian, and there are a lot of such people in multinational Russia, or completely oriented towards the West, and they constitute a “fifth column” that seeks to strike at the most basic power angles of Russian statehood. This is Orthodoxy, this is our historical identity, this is a sovereign state, a statehood that holds a complex society in unity and ensures the territorial integrity of Russia. This is President Putin himself, who is pursuing a policy independent of US influence.
The story of the Pussy Riot group, the story of the attempt of the Orange Revolution - all this was the work of the “fifth column”, tseerushnyh agents of influence, liberals, as well as a very powerful Israeli lobby, which differently related to the Russian statehood. There were attempts to bring the Israelis closer to Russia, just like with Turkey in recent years, but Israel’s final alignment with the United States occurred. "Echo of Moscow" is a frank ideological headquarters for the overthrow of the Russian statehood. It is striking that in the midst of Prime Minister Medvedev there are a lot of people of a liberal, pro-Western, pro-American orientation, belonging to the same American-Israeli lobby inside Russia. This is extremely dangerous because they hold in their hands the key, most sensitive centers for managing social processes.
Despite the fact that Putin pursues a policy of strengthening the sovereignty of Russia, representatives of these pro-Western, ultra-liberal circles mobilize the population, create an atmosphere of psychological harassment of people who advocate Orthodoxy, patriotic values, Russia's originality, ostracize them, and lead things to revolution. "
Now this revolution is choked: Putin won the fight for the street, for the social strata. Nevertheless, this is a very dangerous situation, because our society is literally riddled with the “fifth column”. And you, the Serbs, know how much a traitor can do when people shed their blood, society stands a mountain and a wall for their interests, a group of traitors who succumbed to the exhortations of the West, or were simply bought, are capable of delivering a sneaky stab in the back. All this is possible now in Russia, so despite the fact that the trends after Putin’s return are very good. For example, the Izborsky Club was created, which unites conservative-patriotic intellectuals, politicians, public figures and left and right orientation, regardless of ideology, who have now rallied in order to save the country in the face of external and internal aggression. Internal aggression from the "fifth column", because of which there is still a very great danger.
- So, on one side there is a large part of the Russian elite, pro-Western and Atlantic-oriented, influential in society and the media, and on the other hand - the patriotic bloc, which consists mainly of President Putin and the majority of the people ... Can you explain that difficult environment and the situation in which there is President Putin? How should mutual understanding and interaction between the Russian national and economic elite and President Putin, and between them and the Russian people, be promoted?
- I think that Putin is lonely, he relies on society as a whole, but the pro-Western, pro-American elite, the “fifth column” is blocking Putin’s access to the broad masses of the people. There is practically no Russian national elite, because for the last twenty years almost the entire elite has been polled, except perhaps for some security officials and some individuals, practically under the influence of Western liberal circles. We have an absolutely liberal government, we have liberal media, we have a liberal education, and there is practically external management in them, and it still exists. If we speak with a certain degree of approximation, the entire Russian elite is pro-Western, and it is all opposed to Putin, or at least not interested in ensuring that its reliance on the people becomes stable and serious.
Russia is a nuclear country, and if it takes Serbia under its protection, the situation will be solved completely differently; there will be not only western checkpoints, there will be Russian, Serbian ones.
This elite is Russophobic, this elite hates Russian history, and it is ready to sell the country entirely and in parts. Therefore, she had already begun to do this under Yeltsin in the 90s, and now she continues. Putin is lonely, and he cannot fully rely on the people. Maybe it will turn out after a while, but he is isolated by the elite. So often in Russian history, when the king or leader was surrounded by traitors, scum, influence networks, agents, the “fifth column” and spies. But he cannot break through to Russia yet. Society thereby imposes the iniquity that the elites do — corruption, theft, cynicism, theft — all imposes on Putin. Thus, the elites discredit Putin by their behavior, on the one hand, and on the other hand, they do not give him the opportunity to reach out to the broad masses of the people and rely on them. They block everything. Therefore, the situation is very tragic.
- Alexander Gelevich, we would like to take this opportunity to praise one of your strategic providence - Eurasianism. We see that your ideas about Eurasia, advanced by you two decades ago, are now being translated into reality. We have in mind the idea of creating the Eurasian Union, about which Russian President Vladimir Putin also spoke. Do you think that Serbia should also become a member of the Eurasian Union, given the fact that Serbia relative to Russia is geographically in the west?
- I, first of all, thank you for this remark, since the Serbs were the first to get acquainted with Eurasian ideas in Europe, they were the first to translate my books, or at least among the first. I have always loved the Serbian people very much and always believed that Serbia and Russia are two states, two cultures united by a common destiny. In this regard, it is no secret to the Serbs where the ideas of Eurasianism came to Putin - this is really my job, my like-minded Eurasians. Now these are not just words, this is the reality of the creation of the Eurasian Union: the Customs Union is working!
I think that Serbia, of course, should join the Eurasian Union, should become a member of the Customs Union, enter the CSTO, and only so Serbia will be able to defend its sovereignty, independence, rapidly and actively develop. This will not contradict the orientation towards Europe. First of all, you can freely leave Russia now, you can trade freely, and Russia’s economic relations with Europe are much more than with different countries that are members of Europe, for example, from Eastern Europe. Therefore, those who fear that joining the Eurasian Union will distance the Serbs from Europe should know that this is a lie, this is propaganda of our enemies. This will bring the Serbs closer to Europe, only with dignity it will allow preserving sovereignty. And in fact, Russia does not recognize Kosovo - this is also very important. Russia believes that Kosovo is Serbia. And if Russia has a nuclear weaponthen this confession is not empty words.
- Historical experience tells us to be careful. Is there a danger that the Russian people within the framework of a new supranational community, like the Eurasian Union, will again lose their spiritual and national identity, as was the case in the times of the USSR? Igor Panarin suggests that Orthodoxy become the central idea of the Eurasian Union.
- I think that there are such concerns, but if Russia does not unite the Eurasian Union, then it alone will not stand up to pressure from the West - that’s the thing. If we do not strengthen our positions in the post-Soviet space, cannot integrate it economically and military-strategically, then Russia has no chance of sustaining its own confrontation with the West. We just crash, so we have no choice. This is risky, and I believe that concern for strengthening the identity of the Russian people is a priority task, including Orthodox identity as a basic and axial one. But if we try to offer Orthodoxy to all countries belonging to the Eurasian Union, we will come across very powerful resistance, for there are Islamic countries: Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan. We can not neglect them. Therefore, I think that it is necessary to act in parallel, creating a Eurasian Union at the level of economic and strategic, and work inside Russia and with the Russian population to strengthen Orthodox identity, but not to declare it openly, and not to talk about it as the official and main idea. It will simply create problems that we will never solve.
- We know that you have a deep respect for Islam. An ordinary person belonging, conditionally speaking, to a European or, in a broader sense, world civilization, it is difficult to understand and accept the actions of radical Islamists who are blowing up either themselves or innocent students of some school, or occasional passengers of the subway or train ... Is this a genuine Islam or one of its currents, Salafist, well-groomed by Western intelligence agencies, from Afghanistan to the present? We ask you this question, as there is a surprising coincidence of the goals of Al-Qaida and the United States in many countries.
- This is a completely correct remark. Brzezinski personally coached Al-Qaida militants in Afghanistan, Bin Laden was a CIA agent (this is known), and Salafism, a radical terrorist Islam, is simply the “fifth column” of the CIA, the West. The West discredits Islamic values, works against the interests of Muslims, represents Muslims as anti-human, cruel animals, and it is Salafism and Wahhabism that represents such a radical, in fact caricature, idea of Islam.
There is real Islam; it is a great, ancient civilization, which today is most vividly represented by Shiite, Sufi circles, traditional Islam, and which is very spiritual. It is ambiguous - everything is there; there are the most diverse types of societies, the most diverse values. Wahhabis are trying to create a caricature of reformed Islam: primitive Islam, Islam devoid of the spiritual, cultural, historical dimension. And in this respect, it is not Islam, it is just a continuation of American imperialism. We cannot assume, for example, that certain sects that hide behind the name of Christ, such as the Moon sect, or Aum Shinrike, which can use the name of Christ, that they are Christians. Likewise, the Wahhabi thugs are not Muslims at all, they simply have very little to do with Islam, as well as sectarians towards Christianity. Therefore, I treat the Islamic tradition with the deepest respect and esteem. Especially close to me is Iranian philosophy, a Sufi tradition.
- In Russia, the murders of the mufti and Islamic leaders in Tatarstan and Dagestan that took place last year are alarming. Who did this and how do you look at this difficult question?
- This is an absolutely obvious thing. Just as the Chechen conflict was settled after a part of those Chechens who fought against Russia realized that the Wahhabis were leading them to the slaughter, to destruction, that they were simply manipulating, and that they were destroying the Islamic tradition itself, the mufti, the Sufi leader Akhmad Kadyrov went over to the side of Russia - it was a crucial moment. In Dagestan, two muftis were killed recently; one of them, Said Chirkei, was not just a representative of traditional Islam, but was the highest spiritual authority, a Sufi authority, who pursued an absolutely sound, correct, deep spiritual policy, very meaningful. And those who are planning to repeat the Caucasian War in Dagestan removed him, and they already knowingly understand the significance of traditional Islam, Sufi Islam, remove those leaders who can go, and would definitely follow the line of Akhmad Kadyrov, i.e. Russia, and the victory of the traditional Eurasian power over the enemy.
- Why Russia will not protect them?
- Russia is paralyzed in its activities by the fact that our elite is completely under the control of the liberals. Even about Putin a completely false notion is being formed.
- Alexander Gelevich, how do you assess the current situation in Serbia, as well as the kind of political, diplomatic and economic pressure that has been constantly being taken from the West over the past twenty years? What does Serbia need to do about Kosovo, in the face of a serious violation of its economic and political sovereignty?
“I am convinced that, firstly, the Nikolic government is already a positive shift, though not the best, but it is a good move. I met Nikolic, I have a very good impression of him; then there were different events, I carefully do not watch, to be honest. In any case, he is a patriot, he is a Serb, and not an agent of influence, who constantly appear in our country; I think Nikolic wants Serbia good. Whether he can or not do this - I do not know, this is better for you. I think that the only salvation for Serbia is integration into the Eurasian Union and the solution of the Kosovo problem based on Russian nuclear weapons.
- The new government and new president Tomislav Nikolic are more willing to cooperate with Russia, but the economic policy has not made a continuity gap, foreign investors are supported, and many believe that too many concessions to the West are being made on the issue of Kosovo and Metohija ...
“I think that, maybe, it’s still a matter of realism, because I personally, upon returning from Serbia, seeing what situation there could have been under the previous mandate, conveyed this question to the country's leadership. But I noticed this: on the part of Russia, Serbia did not arouse much enthusiasm, at least at that time. We should not forget that Russia has major restrictions, and perhaps partly a policy of rapprochement with the West, or the continuation of economic relations with the West - this is dictated by necessity, pragmatic necessity, because Moscow is not ready to fully assume the situation in Serbia now. To this she goes, to this we are getting closer and closer, and at a certain point ... Therefore, I would not draw any radical conclusions regarding Nikolic.
He is a Serbian patriot; maybe not all he can, does not know everything. The only problem is in Moscow itself, as well as with integration with Kazakhstan, which President Nazarbayev of Kazakhstan has long insisted on, and relations with Belarus, with our closest brothers. In this regard, Serbia needs, I think, to maneuver now, to come closer to Russia, but to understand that our situation is not so good either. Now it is getting better, and Nikolic is a beautiful figure, optimally suited, he is taking steps towards Russia in the framework of the possible.
As for Kosovo and Metohija, here it is necessary to press from below simply, to demand, there are different (I also watched on the Internet) network social movements that stand firmly on Serbian interests, you just have to press. In the end, it is a question of social mobilization. If the entire Serbian society is unanimous, then no ruler at all, under the fear of immediate withdrawal, will be able to pursue a treacherous policy of national interests.
In general, only Russia and rapprochement with Russia will resolve this issue. Russia does not recognize any independence for Kosovo and Metohija, nothing, just no Albanian American structures - it doesn’t care Russian. Russia is a nuclear country, and if it takes Serbia under its protection, the situation will be solved completely differently; there will be not only western checkpoints, there will be Russian, Serbian ones. We will work on what to do, gradually, only we need more activity from below.