Shoigu instructed the command of the Black Sea Fleet to equip the ships with additional firepower

290
Shoigu instructed the command of the Black Sea Fleet to equip the ships with additional firepower

Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu instructed the Black Sea command fleet take measures to install additional firepower on ships and vessels of the fleet to protect against unmanned boats that Ukraine attacks. This was reported by the press service of the military department.

Today, as part of a working trip, Shoigu visited the command post of the Black Sea Fleet, where he heard reports from the command and officers on the current situation and the implementation of combat missions in the area of ​​​​responsibility. The Minister instructed to equip the ships with additional firepower, including heavy machine guns, to repel attacks by unmanned boats of the Ukrainian Navy. In addition, Shoigu set the fleet command the task of conducting training to repel attacks drones, both during the day and at night.



Every day it is necessary to conduct training with personnel. Training to repel air attacks and attacks by unmanned boats. Carry out day and night so that all our crews are ready

- the minister added.

Earlier, Zelensky said that the fleet of unmanned boats created by Ukraine “destroyed” almost half of the Black Sea Fleet, driving the Black Sea Fleet warships under the protection of the port infrastructure. Kiev claims that it has already liberated the western regions of the Black Sea from Russian ships.

290 comments
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  1. +63
    17 March 2024 13: 46
    It’s like they didn’t understand this without him?.....maybe he still ordered funds to be allocated for their additional equipment?
    1. +14
      17 March 2024 13: 55
      Odessa must be taken!!! And not to retrofit..They are destroying our ships literally point-blank bastards
      FAB will be destroyed in the end. What are we holding out for?
      1. +27
        17 March 2024 14: 40
        This should have been done two years ago, and now the entire coastline near Kreaklova needs to be turned into dust... Ports first of all... Otherwise, as Julius Caesar said - My people will not understand me!!! request
        1. +5
          17 March 2024 15: 01
          He will understand, he will not understand, but he will choose again. It's a pity, though, that it's far from Caesar...
          1. -10
            17 March 2024 15: 14
            Oleg, there won’t be enough “Caesars” for all, we have what we have, but a “large-caliber machine gun... including”, including “shells” or without them? Maybe Kuzhugetovich was saying something about a laser, or we’ll make do with shotguns, which we bought to fight UAVs.
            Each sailor has a shotgun.))
            1. +9
              17 March 2024 15: 17
              So even shotguns are not allowed, and he doesn’t have enough brains to take them into service, let alone lasers and other death stars...
              1. -10
                17 March 2024 15: 20
                ... what, what... “overexposures”, for example, screw to the deck.)
                1. -1
                  17 March 2024 16: 06
                  Then introduce a program for searching and destroying drones into the Death Star.)
        2. -9
          17 March 2024 15: 17
          ...Leva, you’re cool, but Uncle Vova is not Caesar.)
        3. +22
          17 March 2024 16: 36
          And in my opinion, the admirals of the Black Sea Fleet should give Shoigu a list of what they need to protect their fleet, and not wait until the Ministry of Defense advises them something, because in fact this minister is a deeply civilian person, and apart from decommissioning fire hoses, he has no experience, but Well, he also knows where you can catch a large pike.
          1. +12
            17 March 2024 17: 57
            Quote from ugos
            it is the admirals of the Black Sea Fleet who should give Shoigu a list of what they need to protect their fleet, and not wait until the Ministry of Defense advises them something,

            In this regard, our dear Vasily Filippovich comes to mind.
            Who, if not he, could know what the Airborne Forces need, how they differ from everyone else and what equipment they need?
            That’s why I, for example, from movies, literature, service in the army and my father’s stories, know HOW MUCH his heart was for the Airborne Forces. That’s why we remember how much he did for the Airborne Forces, and that’s why he will live in memory as long as at least one paratrooper is alive.

            And if one of the local commanders thinks that there, in Moscow, they know better what they need, then, at best, such “commanders” should be driven out of their offices. In a bad case, send them to school as military officers or district military commissars. In the worst case, judge.
            Because the habit of starting to look for toilet paper immediately before use in civilian life is fraught with an uncomfortable situation, and in wartime it pays a lot of blood.
            1. +12
              17 March 2024 19: 32
              why the airborne forces? There is no need for it and history has shown this. Where the hell is the parachute landing, the beautiful aluminum BMDs, the beautiful parachute jumps, and the blue splashing? There’s no point in doing nonsense, we need to create heavy motorized rifle divisions. There's more firepower and armor. This is fucking not breaking bottles and bricks with your head. What is needed is not winged light infantry, but heavy infantry.
              1. +4
                17 March 2024 20: 52
                Quote: Vladimir_D
                There’s no point in doing nonsense, we need to create heavy motorized rifle divisions. There's more firepower and armor. This is fucking not breaking bottles and bricks with your head. What is needed is not winged light infantry, but heavy infantry.

                If you think that the Airborne Forces in war only crush bottles and bricks with their heads, then it turns out that my father lived his life in vain, I served in vain, and my son is now serving in vain. And they gave him two orders in vain, too. It would be better to save money for the heavy infantry. And someday I’ll take my grandson, not like a son, to Ryazan by the hand, but to the conservatory, to cut a violin.
                55 Heroes of Russia in the Airborne Forces in two years in Ukraine - also in vain?

                I think the men from your son’s company would hardly agree with you.
                Don’t tell our assault troops in Ukraine that they are not needed. They won't understand.

                For those who don't know.
                Landing is not only about jumping beautifully from a duralumin crowd and “showing off” on holidays in front of generals and waving civilian arms and legs. These are those who, as V.F. Margelov said
                in case of aggression, it will be thrown into the enemy’s mouth with the aim of tearing this mouth apart
                And they tore it more than once.
                1. +3
                  18 March 2024 05: 31
                  Well, they told you that in the current conditions, the Airborne Forces are not used airborne or amphibiously, but are used for infantry assault. Forced to be used.
                  1. +2
                    18 March 2024 11: 22
                    Quote: Kusja
                    Well, they told you that in the current conditions, the Airborne Forces are not used airborne or amphibiously, but are used for infantry assault. Forced to be used.

                    I won’t talk here about “three seconds an angel, three minutes an eagle, the rest of the time a draft horse,” I won’t remember here how many infantry battalions there were in the Soviet Specialized Assault Brigade in relation to the PDB.

                    I will only say that the Airborne Forces are not only “In the zone of special attention”, after which the competition in Ryazan increased 20 (!) times.
                    This is a different level and a different method of preparation, this is a willingness not only to fall out in a crowd with an IL-76 from 800 meters. This also includes landing from the “mother” Mi-8 from 5-6 meters, and also secretive raids in the rear areas, this is everything that can help deliver a sudden, unexpected strike in an unexpected place with the least forces and the greatest efficiency.
                    Jumping from the Ural while moving without breaking your legs is also a landing. And the infantry is not taught this, they don’t need it.

                    And “the noise of the engines behind the duralumin side” is simply the most beautiful, most advertised, but also the smallest part of the airborne forces’ training.
              2. +14
                17 March 2024 21: 49
                why the airborne forces? There is no need for it and history has shown this. Where the hell is the parachute landing, the beautiful aluminum BMDs, the beautiful parachute jumps, and the blue splashing?

                The problem is not at all in the Airborne Forces, in the motorized rifles or in the Navy, the problem is that those who manage it all are not able to use it all and do not even understand what they are needed for.
                And in fact, the Airborne Forces took Gostomel in a daring raid and made an unprecedented rush of the main forces from the border of Belarus to Kyiv. Another thing is that the chief betrayed all this with his Gesture of goodwill instead of mobilizing and filling the rear with troops.
                But you are right that we need heavy motorized rifle units on the Boomerang infantry fighting vehicle at least, but we also need airborne forces.
                If we had a well-built fleet, with competent admirals, then at the beginning of the Black Sea Fleet there would be a brigade of 6 frigates 22350 and three brigades of 6 anti-aircraft defense corvettes capable of carrying out air defense, plus modern minesweepers, plus at least one AWACS aircraft and Tu-204R operating in the interests of the fleet with a presence in the designated zone 24/7, accompanied by a squadron of Su-35 and Su-34 with UPAB, then in five days everything that could be fired by the Ukrainian Armed Forces at a depth of a hundred kilometers from the coast would have been destroyed and after In this case, Marines and airborne special forces would calmly land on the shore of the Odessa region in helicopters, and after that it would be possible to land an airborne division on an Il-76 without any problems from low altitudes without losses and within a few hours occupy and then hold a large bridgehead, onto which one can then transport parts of motorized rifle units by sea. This is what a competent operation involving the Airborne Forces should look like. And throwing airborne forces into battle as motorized riflemen is like hammering nails with a microscope.
                1. +3
                  17 March 2024 22: 29
                  And in fact, the Airborne Forces took Gostomel in a daring raid

                  In fact, it was not possible to ensure the landing of troops by landing from the military air vehicle, since capturing the runway has long been insufficient to ensure a safe landing; MANPADS and small-caliber artillery will not allow it, which is what happened in Gostomel. When we got there by ground, time was already lost; ambushes of the Armed Forces of Ukraine had already begun on the roads with attacks on transport convoys and the defense of Kyiv was organized. Which brings us back to the question of the possibility of landings deep enough behind enemy lines with light forces.
                  1. +7
                    18 March 2024 07: 42
                    In fact, it was not possible to ensure the landing of troops by landing from the military air vehicle, since capturing the runway has long been insufficient to ensure a safe landing; MANPADS and small-caliber artillery will not allow it, which is what happened in Gostomel.

                    But this is an example of the fact that the leadership of the Defense Ministry is not able to use the Airborne Forces, like everyone else.
                    What should have been done before the landing in Gostomel? Suppress enemy air defense, strike at the Presidential Palace and the General Staff, at headquarters, at the locations of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, at the television center, at communication centers and at bridges. And only after the destruction of the air defense and the actions of attack UAVs and then aviation, making sure that the air defense was really suppressed, could the capture of Gostomel begin and the main airborne forces landing on it by parachute. In this case, MANPADS or barreled air defense systems are of course not taken into account, since they do not pose a threat to aircraft flying above 5 thousand meters.
                    And starting an amphibious operation in a zone of unsuppressed air defense is killing the landing force and a crime, however, the entire preparation of the air defense, starting from false intelligence information, complete ignorance of reality and the lack of a plan provided by the troops if Zelensky does not immediately surrender, is all one big crime.
                    And the fact that two years later the SVO has not done what should have been done in the first days is also a crime.
                    1. +1
                      18 March 2024 08: 35
                      Suppress enemy air defense

                      Air defense based on MANPADS and MZA is almost impossible to suppress. Groups with MANPADS sit in the bushes or some basements and wait for the VTA to land. How to suppress them?
                      and landing on it by parachute the main forces of the Airborne Forces

                      What's the point of seizing the runway if the landing is by parachute? With this option, you will have to suppress air defense over a huge area, and if not everything is suppressed (for example, some kind of ambush, short-range mobile), then VTA aircraft are easy prey for even the simplest and most outdated air defense systems.
                      however, the entire preparation of the SVO, starting from false intelligence information, complete ignorance of reality and the lack of a plan provided by the troops if Zelensky does not immediately surrender, all this is one big crime.

                      If reality were taken into account, then there would be no point in starting SVO. Because we would have to start with mobilization, the element of surprise would be lost, and in Ukraine there would be the same mobilization and preparation for defense.
                      1. +3
                        18 March 2024 09: 19
                        Air defense based on MANPADS and MZA is almost impossible to suppress. Groups with MANPADS sit in the bushes or some basements and wait for the VTA to land. How to suppress them?

                        That’s why it was necessary to land troops by parachute from altitudes above 5 thousand meters
                        What's the point of seizing the runway if the landing is by parachute?

                        If you land an airborne regiment by parachute, you can expand the bridgehead and occupy the landing area of ​​VTA aircraft, eliminating ambushes by MANPADS crews.
                        With this option, it will be necessary to suppress air defense over a huge area, and if not everything is suppressed (for example, some ambush, short-range mobile), then VTA aircraft are easy prey for even the simplest and most outdated air defense systems.

                        Again. Before landing, ALL air defense must be suppressed and air supremacy must be ensured, that is, our aviation, that is, Su-35 and Su-34 at altitudes exceeding 5 km, must freely operate over all proposed military air transport routes. Without this, landing troops on BTA planes is suicide.
                        If reality were taken into account, then there would be no point in starting SVO. Because we would have to start with mobilization, the element of surprise would be lost, and in Ukraine there would be the same mobilization and preparation for defense.

                        It was necessary to prepare the SVO at least a couple of years before the start, and for this it was necessary, firstly, to restore the personnel units and the work of the military registration and enlistment offices, and secondly, to conduct regular gatherings of reservists on the basis of these personnel units, preparing a mobilization reserve, and a month before the SVO, conduct the same gatherings calling on a hundred thousand people, driving them through the training grounds and, simultaneously with the announcement of the beginning of the Northern Military District, declaring mobilization, already having a hundred thousand troops ready to be sent to the training grounds and staffing another five hundred mobilized units ready for deployment.
                        In addition, since 2014, it was necessary to reform the army, taking into account the experience of the LMNR, which was completely ignored by our Ministry of Defense, and to increase rather than reduce the number of armed forces.
        4. +11
          17 March 2024 17: 17
          Quote: Lev_Russia
          Shoigu instructed the command of the Black Sea Fleet to retrofit the ships

          This should have been done two years ago, and now the entire coastline near Kreaklova needs to be turned into dust... Ports first of all... Otherwise, as Julius Caesar said - My people will not understand me!!! request

          This is what we have come to. There just isn't enough evil. am am am
          The former Minister of Emergency Situations explains to admirals how to ensure the protection of warships from BEC attacks. But the Haspata Atmirals themselves couldn’t think of this? Such admirals must be driven out of the fleet, you know with what rags.
          I remember Stepanov’s Port Arthur, when General Nikitin called the RIF admirals self-propelled guns, and proposed giving command of the fleet and ships to cap-2 and lieutenants. Now the situation is the same. There is nothing even worse than in Port Arthur. Our self-propelled admirals locked our fleet in the internal roadsteads of Sevastopol and Novorossiysk. am
          The admirals turned the Black Sea Fleet into a beach fleet and self-sank almost half the ships. am
          1. +6
            17 March 2024 21: 15
            Alas, you are absolutely right. The Secretary of Defense is already instructing admirals that they must conduct training.
          2. 0
            18 March 2024 15: 54
            Quote: Bearded
            The former Minister of Emergency Situations explains to admirals how to ensure the protection of warships from BEC attacks. But the Haspata Atmirals themselves couldn’t think of this? Such admirals must be driven out of the fleet, you know with what rags.

            The former Minister of Emergency Situations has enormous financial resources at his disposal. Admirals can only write letters in small handwriting with the humblest requests for the allocation of money for additional fire weapons for installation on warships... And the former Minister of Emergency Situations will then read out with aplomb a paper with instructions for admirals and generals... hi I see it like this.
      2. -18
        17 March 2024 16: 46
        Wow, how rude laughing A Russian patriot from (to) Ukraine took over... laughing
      3. -15
        17 March 2024 16: 48
        TsIPSO Odessa was given to Russia yesterday laughing
      4. 0
        17 March 2024 19: 49
        Pastukhov
        +6
        Today, 13: 55
        New
        Odessa must be taken!!! And not to retrofit..They are destroying our ships literally point-blank bastards
        FAB will be destroyed in the end. What are we holding out for?
        - that’s it, stop trampling on the left bank! - we need to start the offensive long ago!
        1. +1
          17 March 2024 21: 07
          That's it, stop trampling on the left bank! - we need to start the offensive a long time ago
          On a rake?
      5. +1
        18 March 2024 17: 54
        Layman, if they could have taken it already. And our ships, as practice has shown, are defenseless against attacks by Backs and wolf pack tactics...
    2. +62
      17 March 2024 13: 59
      Only two years of NWO passed and finally a brilliant solution finally arose in the head of the Minister of Defense, who joyfully accepted generally unarmed ships! But for some reason such an idea did not occur to the dying carpenters for two years! Or they were waiting for an order.
      I wonder if they will also wait for an order to install booms at all Russian Navy bases?
      1. +20
        17 March 2024 14: 42
        Shoigu is an intellectual. Others would have figured it out in the fourth year.
        1. +7
          17 March 2024 15: 20
          How can that be! He was ahead of Himself with the assignments!
      2. ANB
        +14
        17 March 2024 14: 49
        . I wonder if they will also wait for an order to install booms at all Russian Navy bases?

        It's not fair. You knew the answer. :)
        Naturally, they will wait.
        1. +33
          17 March 2024 15: 05
          A long time ago, in 2007, I read an interview with Admiral Vysotsky, the newly appointed commander-in-chief of the Navy. When asked by the journalist what the admiral sees as his main tasks in this post, he answered - to strictly comply with the requirements of the governing documents. I was shocked: I always believed that in such positions the main task was to develop these documents, conduct a constant review of previously adopted documents to ensure they comply with modern requirements, and if they do not comply, mercilessly cancel and correct them. But as the last 2 years have shown, in the Navy the senior command staff really structured their activities in the same way as Admiral Vysotsky. However, judging by the fact that our fleet has not had any special victories since Sinop, that is, for more than 170 years, these “traditions” had developed long before him in the once (under Ushakov) glorious Russian fleet.
          1. ANB
            +13
            17 March 2024 15: 11
            Well, rear admirals are still made by thinkers (I knew at least one such person), but they don’t rise further now. In the USSR (under Gorshkov) there was still initiative in the navy, then they began to spread rot on it.
            1. +4
              17 March 2024 19: 54
              ANB
              +8
              Today, 15: 11
              New
              Well, rear admirals are still made by thinkers (I knew at least one such person), but they don’t rise further now. In the USSR (under Gorshkov) there was still initiative in the navy, then they began to spread rot on it.
              - initiative in our time is punishable (I’m not kidding! I myself received a scolding from my superiors for this)!
          2. ANB
            +17
            17 March 2024 15: 16
            . to strictly comply with the requirements of governing documents.

            I came across Evmenov in Kamchatka.
            1. Even then he loved the “charter”, although he was a submariner
            2. It seems that, starting with Vysotsky, they selected people like themselves to replace them
            3. The booms in Krasheninnikov Bay were collected in a heap for God knows how many years and no one displayed them properly. Well, how could Evmenov know how to use them? :)
          3. +1
            17 March 2024 16: 57
            ...to strictly comply with the requirements of governing documents
            Unfortunately, in our country and in civilian industries, many heads of structural units adhere to the same principles, saying that “initiative is punishable”...
            1. +1
              17 March 2024 17: 18
              Quote: uralex
              ...to strictly comply with the requirements of governing documents
              Unfortunately, in our country and in civilian industries, many heads of structural units adhere to the same principles, saying that “initiative is punishable”...

              Now the generation of “menachers” is at the helm in everything, and that’s why such results, alas!
          4. 0
            17 March 2024 19: 06
            Tsushima hit the Russian Empire hard, I hope there won’t be a repeat. Maybe they'll come to their senses. Then, too, it is not known what they thought.
          5. +6
            17 March 2024 21: 27
            Many people are very far from Nikolai Gerasimovich Kuznetsov. For example, thanks to his actions, the USSR Navy was fully armed on June 22, 1941. Which, contrary to directives from the People's Commissariat of the Navy, took measures to bring the fleet to the highest levels of combat readiness and allowed to save the majority of ships and the lives of sailors in all fleets
            1. +2
              17 March 2024 22: 15
              Quote: oppozite28
              Many people are very far from Nikolai Gerasimovich Kuznetsov.

              About the rescue of the fleet on 22.06.41 this is just a story. The Germans did not plan massive attacks on the fleets at the beginning of the war at their base; they had no time for that. But the Baltic Fleet slept through the mining of its communications by the Germans and Finns. Or rather, he did not succumb to provocations and waited for orders; in those days, navy commanders could at least be understood as human beings. For unnecessary initiative you can go to the basement, but now....?
              1. 0
                18 March 2024 00: 19
                For unnecessary initiative you can go to the basement, but now....?
                And now just in the Northern Military District... recourse request
              2. 0
                18 March 2024 00: 33
                About the rescue of the fleet on 22.06.41 this is just a story. The Germans did not plan massive attacks on the fleets at the beginning of the war at their base; they had no time for that. But the Baltic Fleet slept through the mining of its communications by the Germans and Finns. Or rather, he did not succumb to provocations and waited for orders; in those days, navy commanders could at least be understood as human beings. For unnecessary initiative you can go to the basement, but now....?
                Nevertheless, the fleet retained its combat readiness, especially the Black Sea one.
              3. 0
                18 March 2024 08: 09
                About the rescue of the fleet on 22.06.41 this is just a story. The Germans did not plan massive attacks on the fleets at the beginning of the war at their base; they had no time for that. But the Baltic Fleet slept through the mining of its communications by the Germans and Finns.

                The stories of Doctor Goebbels, edited by the CIA and poured en masse into the heads of our fellow citizens since the time of the traitor Gorbachev, unfortunately, stupefied the majority of our fellow citizens, and for some this intoxication has not yet subsided.
                There were attacks on the Black Sea Fleet on June 22, and the Black Sea Fleet actually repelled them. Kuznetsov actually gave the order to bring all fleets into combat readiness and the order to begin repelling attacks before the General Staff, but the district headquarters also received such an order, another point is that the fleet was able to convey this order to the commander of each ship, but the districts could not even contact some armies and corps, enemy saboteurs have already broken communications.

                The first intelligence reports about the German attack on the USSR named the date May 15, 1941, and that the Baltic Fleet should have already started laying mines in the Baltic on May 15? Or do you think that the satellites were hanging there and the KBF monitored everything in real time, like in the movies? Why then, even now, did the Black Sea Fleet command not do anything even after civilian sailors reported a cluster of BECs at a distance of 100 km from Crimea? Did you also follow the order not to give in to provocations?

                In my opinion, even Admiral Oktyabrsky, who was able to organize the evacuation of Odessa and many landings, would have been a much better commander of the Navy than all those who have died out over the past 30 years. All the same, under Stalin, promotions were made based on business qualities and results and not on personal devotion and controllability, and the main thing was that the person being promoted was certainly dumber than the higher authorities, so that the authorities did not look real against the background of smart subordinates.
        2. +1
          17 March 2024 17: 11
          Why be surprised if the Fleet is, in fact, subordinate to the ground forces. The Anglo-Saxons have a separate Minister of the Navy, who deals with all issues and is part of the American KNSH. The same with aviation.
          1. 0
            17 March 2024 23: 15
            The KNS includes not the Minister of the Navy, but the Chief of Staff of the Navy.
      3. +5
        17 March 2024 14: 50
        Only two years of SVO passed and finally in

        One US General spoke well about such “parquet field marshals” using the example of Saddam
      4. +8
        17 March 2024 15: 27
        Not only did it not come, but the former commander of the Black Sea Fleet came up with the idea to directly prohibit the retrofitting of ships with additional firepower. But for some reason there is silence about this.
      5. +3
        17 March 2024 15: 34
        Read the story of how a man fed two generals, Saltykov Shchedrin. Nothing changed.
      6. kig
        +2
        17 March 2024 17: 52
        Quote: ramzay21
        Or were they waiting for an order?

        Note that he did not order, but instructed. And he only instructed to take action.
    3. +35
      17 March 2024 14: 00
      Quote: Black
      It’s like they didn’t understand it without him?

      One of the commanders of the KChF once issued an order prohibiting the installation of equipment and instruments on ships that were not provided for by the project. Unfortunately, our top naval commanders sway for a very long time and ignore other people’s experience, and accumulate their own with difficulty and under pressure from above. The blitz solution lay on the surface. It is difficult to explain the reasons for ignoring it. Perhaps not healthy ambitions and fear of presenting an abnormal request to a senior commander. I would like the court’s decision in the case of the inaction of officials in a combat situation to tell about these reasons.
      1. +32
        17 March 2024 14: 07
        I don’t even know how to comment on this without swearing...
        1. +10
          17 March 2024 14: 13
          One of the commanders of the KChF at one time ordered to prohibit the installation of equipment and devices on ships
          I hope the investigators of the military prosecutor's office will ask him about the reasons for this decision
        2. +8
          17 March 2024 14: 23
          Quote: Aerodrome
          I don’t even know how to comment on this without swearing...

          Pee-wee-wee, Shoigu, bee-wee-wee...
          1. +4
            17 March 2024 16: 06
            Quote: Mordvin 3
            Pee-wee-wee, Shoigu, bee-wee-wee...

            Shoigu, where are the machine guns, ***?!
        3. +23
          17 March 2024 14: 31
          So why not comment...
          This is the whole Minister of Defense of the Land from birth, orders to put a machine gun on the ship. And where then are all the naval, God forgive me, analysts, strategists, tacticians, weapons engineers, etc. What are they doing that our fleet came to war without weapons.
          1. +4
            17 March 2024 17: 35
            Quote: BABAY22
            So why not comment...
            This is the whole Minister of Defense of the Land from birth, orders to put a machine gun on the ship. And where then are all the naval, God forgive me, analysts, strategists, tacticians, weapons engineers, etc. What are they doing that our fleet came to war without weapons.

            The main mistake you and others like you make is that you stubbornly expect from the current government steps similar to those that the leaders of the USSR would have taken in a similar situation. Understand that under socialism, spending on the army to maintain its combat capability was dictated primarily by the challenges that actually existed. Under capitalism, the approach is radically different - costs are minimized, because... these expenses do not bring profit
            1. +4
              17 March 2024 20: 03
              Bully
              0
              Today, 17: 35
              The main mistake you and others like you make is that you stubbornly expect from the current government steps similar to those that the leaders of the USSR would have taken in a similar situation
              - don’t idealize the leaders of the USSR, if not for them, the union would still be in good health!
        4. ANB
          +4
          17 March 2024 15: 01
          . I don’t even know how to comment on this without swearing...

          We need to pull ourselves together, take a deep breath and exhale. Count to 10. And then put a lot of stars in the comments. :)
        5. +2
          17 March 2024 15: 11
          What's incomprehensible about this? Here on the forum there are a dozen “experts”, with “marshal” shoulder straps, who clearly claim that large landing ships should be unarmed. They listened to them. You can't ask them for a machine gun.
          In their understanding, every BDK departure to sea should be accompanied by an escort of patrol ships in a circle, as if they were aircraft carriers.
          1. 0
            17 March 2024 18: 47
            There are only a few of them. Basically, people loudly trumpeted the need to take action and even offered ready-made interesting solutions.
            1. 0
              17 March 2024 19: 05
              There are not a few of them, and they are here with marshal's shoulder straps. There are a dozen or more of them, and they too must share their share of responsibility for the death of Caesar Kunnikov.
              1. 0
                17 March 2024 19: 18
                Oh, just don’t indulge in fantasy here.
                Everything was clearly explained to you, what’s what, and here you again begin to think and invent for yourself, WHAT YOU DIDN’T SAY AT ALL! Or you just didn’t understand anything.
                1. -4
                  17 March 2024 19: 33
                  But no, it’s your people who didn’t understand that they need to be held accountable for the “bazaar.” That's it. Since they defended the concept of unarmed ships with foam at the mouth, they must answer.
                  Otherwise, Shoigu is to blame everywhere, anyone but you.
                  1. +2
                    17 March 2024 19: 51
                    But no, it’s your people who didn’t understand that they need to be held accountable for the “bazaar.” That's it. Since they defended the concept of unarmed ships with foam at the mouth, they must answer.

                    Excuse me, are you an adequate person? Which ones are “ours”, which ones are “yours”? Are you playing to the public here, I don’t understand, you’re throwing arrows!?
                    Just show where, and when, and by whom it was said NOT to equip surface ships with additional weapons?
                    Otherwise, Shoigu is to blame everywhere, anyone but you.

                    And this is generally akin to the delirium of a sectarian... Shoigu and his cohorts take direct leadership and decisions on the construction of the RF Armed Forces, but they are white and fluffy, and ordinary people are to blame, in the Military District, who are not clear why they are guilty and you cannot justify their guilt either you can. fool
                    1. -2
                      17 March 2024 19: 55
                      Dear, BDKs were built in Poland during the USSR. What are the current construction decisions? All decisions must come from the commander of the Black Sea Fleet and the Navy as a whole, from the captain of the ship in particular.
                      Since you have undertaken to protect the adherents of defenseless ships, then be welcome to their company.
                      1. +2
                        17 March 2024 20: 04
                        What adherents of defenseless ships? What exactly does the construction of a large landing ship have to do with it? You really don't understand what they are saying to you! The construction of the RF Armed Forces means not only the construction of equipment and ships, but also their equipping/retrofitting with various materiel. They are engaged in development and planning in the construction and modernization of the RF Armed Forces... and here you are talking about the large landing craft. That is, in all this (which was not done) the civilians sitting at VO are to blame? The captain of the ship, where will he get the DBMs, or at least additional machine guns, tanks, ammunition for machine guns, and drones? Will she give birth at her own expense and at the expense of the ship’s crew?
                        Can you answer specific questions addressed to you? Where and when, by whom was it said that they do not need to be rearmed?
                      2. -3
                        17 March 2024 20: 07
                        The captain is not able to send a report with a request to equip the ship with machine tools and additional machine guns? Why even have a captain then?
                        And be so kind as to browse the forum yourself and find adherents of defenseless ships. I’m not going to satisfy your curiosity for you.
                      3. +3
                        17 March 2024 20: 22
                        The captain is not able to send a report with a request to equip the ship with machine tools and additional machine guns? Why even have a captain then?

                        Where is the evidence that the ship commanders were inactive?
                        And again, what is the fault of ordinary people sitting on VO?
                        And be so kind as to browse the forum yourself and find adherents of defenseless ships. I’m not going to satisfy your curiosity for you.

                        It’s clear, that is, you are going off topic and sending me FOR YOU to look for your own argumentation, that there are some kind of “adherents of defenseless ships”!? That is, you yourself cannot answer for your words, but you call on innocent people to answer for the failures of the Ministry of Defense in the construction of the RF Armed Forces and timely response to shortcomings and organization of normal interaction between services? Cool! good
                      4. -3
                        17 March 2024 20: 41
                        Proof of the inaction of ship captains is these lost ships themselves. Or are captains not responsible for their ships?
                        Sorry, your attempts to puzzle me are your problem, satisfy your curiosity yourself.
                        Maybe those who are opposed to equipping the ground forces with hunting shotguns for protection against drones are not to blame? Still so guilty.
                      5. 0
                        17 March 2024 20: 50
                        Proof of the inaction of ship captains is these lost ships themselves. Or are captains not responsible for their ships?

                        How is this? That is, it doesn’t occur to you that the appeals of ship commanders to their superiors could be stupidly ignored?
                        Sorry, your attempts to puzzle me are your problem, satisfy your curiosity yourself.

                        I’m not trying to puzzle you, I call on you to answer for your balaclava, I certainly shouldn’t do this for you!
                      6. -6
                        17 March 2024 20: 52
                        Where is the evidence that captains asked for help in retrofitting ships?
                        For babbling? Are you sure you will answer for the “bazaar”?
                      7. +1
                        17 March 2024 20: 56
                        Where is the evidence that captains asked for help in retrofitting ships?


                        I don’t have them (am I somehow registered in the structure of the Navy?)... does it follow that they didn’t apply and they are to blame? Even if they are to blame...then what blame lies with ordinary people?
                        Are you sure you will answer for the “bazaar”?

                        Ahhaah, and what kind of market should I be responsible for?
                      8. -8
                        17 March 2024 20: 58
                        Listen, I'm tired, you can see a demagogue from three miles away, especially when he tries to puzzle his interlocutor.
                        Beggars have no servants, be self-satisfied.
                      9. +4
                        17 March 2024 21: 06
                        tired, a demagogue can be seen from three miles away, especially when he is trying to puzzle his interlocutor.

                        You yourself are throwing it at the fan here and you’ve also labeled me as a demagogue, awesome. Of course, it’s easier than admitting you’re wrong about anything!
                        Okay, I won’t shake your nervous system anymore... all the best lol
                      10. -5
                        17 March 2024 21: 08
                        Sailor, should the captain and officers be held accountable for the sinking of ships, or do you disagree? It’s not Shoigu, but the captain and officers who should be held accountable.
                      11. +4
                        17 March 2024 21: 23
                        I agree, within the framework of my duties, of course, and if his guilt is proven, which you cannot say unequivocally. But why should the ship’s commander be responsible for the development and support of the Navy and the armed forces as a whole? After all, everything that is happening now is the fault of the fact that the fleet is not ready for this war; it is not the commander of the ship who should be involved in the development and provision of the fleet. After all, you have been told more than once that the problem here is not only in the installed or not installed additional weapons on ships. So Shoigu must also be responsible for the mess going on in his Ministry of Defense.
                        And according to you, should every ship commander be judged for a lost ship?
                        But how does this relate to the topic of my question?
                      12. -6
                        17 March 2024 21: 26
                        Sailor, the captain is responsible for the sinking of a ship, and for each such case there must be an investigation and trial. How else? Do you really think, sailor, that one should get away with something like this? Especially if drowning was shameful.
                        At least ask yourself your questions. I repeat, beggars do not have servants, be self-satisfied.
                      13. +3
                        17 March 2024 21: 38
                        Sailor, the captain is responsible for the sinking of a ship, and for each such case there must be an investigation and trial.

                        Moreover, how can you accuse someone without a trial and without knowing the case? Plus, at the same time, you can take a closer look at the command of the fleet and further up the stairs
                        Especially if drowning was shameful

                        Why is it shameful that the ships died as a result of the battle. It's a shame? So, this is how you assess the losses of our military personnel? Cool!
                        At least ask yourself your questions. I repeat, beggars do not have servants, be self-satisfied.

                        Well, it’s clear, in short, he’s a rude man, he can’t answer for his balabolism... and you’ll see a beggar in the mirror!
                      14. +3
                        17 March 2024 22: 25
                        You received the cons from me. (There are no ship captains in the Navy), it’s as if you didn’t read Artyom’s comments, who clarified in each one -Commander of the ship.And sorry
                        Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
                        There are not a few of them, and they are here with marshal's shoulder straps. There are a dozen or more of them, and they too must share their share of responsibility for the death of Caesar Kunnikov.

                        [quote][/quote] I haven’t read the stupider comment.
          2. +3
            17 March 2024 20: 06
            Sergey Aleksandrovich
            +1
            Today, 15: 11
            New
            In their understanding, every BDK departure to sea should be accompanied by an escort of patrol ships in a circle, as if they were aircraft carriers.
            - in fact, large landing ships should be accompanied by escort ships - they’re not carrying firewood!
            1. -3
              17 March 2024 20: 15
              You've probably looked at the pictures on the Internet and TV. There are not enough security ships to accompany every BDK exit. Are you still looking for people to blame around, except for those directly guilty? And BDKs sometimes carry firewood, and in this case there will be no escort.
              The concept of unarmed landing craft is stupid and irresponsible. Why do we need a large and almost completely unarmed ship, incapable of independent navigation, which can be sunk by boats with motors?
              1. +1
                17 March 2024 22: 35
                Sergey Aleksandrovich
                - Large landing craft should not carry firewood - it’s not a core occupation, but if a landing operation is carried out, it will be a failure if the landing party is destroyed on the approach, and there’s no need to be smart about it!
        6. -1
          17 March 2024 16: 50
          So don't swear and comment laughing
      2. +11
        17 March 2024 15: 12
        According to TG "Rybar", one of the reasons for the recent loss of the corvette was the late start of the struggle for survivability, associated with bureaucratic (!) delays.
        However, the late-started struggle for survivability due to waiting for command orders essentially decided the outcome.

        if this is so, then there is simply nowhere to fall lower - if in the navy, in order to begin the fight for the survivability of the ship, a decision from the higher command is required, then the fleet no longer exists, and no reforms and transformations will resurrect the corpse, you can only create a new fleet from scratch, getting rid of all "traditions" of the previous one.
        1. +4
          17 March 2024 15: 34
          Quote: UAZ 452
          There is simply nowhere to fall lower - if in the navy a decision from higher command is required to begin the fight for the survivability of a ship,

          That’s why I say that there should be a court that would investigate the omissions of all those involved in incidents related to the sinking of the ship, and those responsible should receive real punishment. All those not touched by this decision of the commanders, the demonstrative punishment of large and small commanders for the loss of the ship should teach responsibility for the entrusted weapons and personnel. There is no other way. Then you need to remember the military-scientific conferences that were held after the Berlin offensive operation and repeat the experience in order to find the problem and its solutions. Based on the results, make decisions on the implementation of measures approved by the conference to improve combat training and the work of the fleet. There's nothing complicated. Just don’t drag things out over five years.
        2. 0
          17 March 2024 15: 44
          First, we need to send special officers and the prosecutor’s office there to clarify all the circumstances, and draw conclusions based on the results of the checks.
        3. +2
          17 March 2024 17: 17
          ...to begin the fight for the survivability of the ship, a decision from higher command is required

          Nonsense, and a bullshit at that. Either everything has changed so much in 30 years - it’s the other way around, or it’s a lie. To start the fight for survivability, you don’t even need an order from the ship’s commander.
          1. +4
            17 March 2024 18: 01
            Definitely nonsense. But this partly explains how it turns out that ships are sinking, and crew losses are either absent or relatively small (if they don’t lie to us about that either). If the damage was not absolutely fatal, and the ship, which could still be saved, was essentially abandoned, because no one signed up for the risk that always accompanies the struggle for survivability, then we have a sunken pennant, with minimal losses of personnel. Yes, people are more important than iron, but so soon the entire fleet will be at the bottom!
      3. 0
        17 March 2024 17: 45
        Quote: Hagen
        One of the commanders of the KChF once issued an order prohibiting the installation of equipment and instruments on ships that were not provided for by the project. Unfortunately, our senior naval commanders sway for a very long time and ignore other people’s experience, and accumulate their own with difficulty and under pressure from above.

        So where do you get the experience of walking on parquet floors and sitting in chairs?!
        After all, nothing whistles above and around your head, neither bullets, nor boots....
      4. -1
        17 March 2024 19: 29
        Ha...for a judicial decision, it is necessary that a competent person from the investigative authorities make a procedural decision, at least to initiate a criminal case, then the millstones themselves will roll along.

        What do you think: there are the same “decisive” subjects there, procedurally independent at all costs - or are they not much different from the criticized admirals? wink

        This is a system scribe.
        1. 0
          17 March 2024 20: 58
          Quote: hhurik
          it is necessary for the competent person of the investigative authorities to make a procedural decision, at least to initiate a criminal case,

          The Investigative Committee initiates an investigation into each case of death of military personnel in the Northern Military District. I am sure that investigations will definitely be initiated against Kotov and other ships. Another thing is that the case materials are not made public, and the involvement of the naval command (and in what capacity...) will certainly be carried out taking into account the opinion of the Ministry of Defense. In short, we won’t find out about this anytime soon. But I’m afraid that the people who gave “incomprehensible orders” will simply be sent into retirement.
          1. -1
            17 March 2024 21: 08
            Sorry, but you have a logical inconsistency: either during the investigation, an independent - at least structurally and legislatively - body establishes the truth in the case, in fact, for this purpose it was fabricated at one time and separated from the prosecutor's office into a separate department. Either no one establishes anything, they work for the basket, as unnecessary - because those under investigation “have an opinion” and it is more important than objective reality.
            Such a funny fart monocle.
            1. 0
              17 March 2024 21: 29
              Quote: hhurik
              because those under investigation “have an opinion” and it is more important than objective reality.

              There is no need to run ahead of the locomotive. No one has seen the case materials, and no one knows for sure who the phot commanders are in these cases. One can only assume that Krasnov, Bastrykin and Shoigu know each other and work together around the same incident and, perhaps, exert some influence on each other. Which one exactly is not easy to say. But there is certainly no “either or”; everything is more complicated there.
              1. -1
                17 March 2024 22: 06
                Why run somewhere, especially along railroad tracks? hi What about the criminal case regarding the alleged rebellion of a certain Prigozhin? Well, from the point of view of common sense, in light of the joint work of the officials you mentioned around this incident.
                1. +1
                  17 March 2024 22: 47
                  Quote: hhurik
                  What about the criminal case regarding the alleged rebellion of a certain Prigozhin?

                  Have you heard anything about the “secret investigation”? For this reason, we can assume anything here, but we are unlikely to ever see a real criminal case, and I think there is more than one volume of it. A very narrow circle of people can familiarize themselves with it, and everyone signs a non-disclosure obligation in accordance with Part 2 of Art. 161 Code of Criminal Procedure. Considering the identity and scope of activity of the victims, even the court hearing will most likely be “closed.”
    4. +6
      17 March 2024 14: 16
      What about the search for enemy naval drones and their defeat far from our bases? Why are there no helicopters on ships, why don’t helicopters patrol the waters together with ships at night? Where are the unmanned helicopter drones that have been massively promoted for more than one year in a row? Why did the Kremlin notice? what is the whole country seeing just now?
      1. +6
        17 March 2024 14: 51
        Where are the unmanned helicopters and drones.....Because they haven’t been brought to Wilderes yet
      2. 0
        17 March 2024 17: 12
        Where are the unmanned helicopters and drones that have been massively promoted for years in a row?

        It’s all there on pieces of paper; almost entire Death Stars were built there. In fact, all this became villas on Lake Como and houses in France)))
        1. -2
          17 March 2024 17: 52
          Quote: Oscar Mike
          Where are the unmanned helicopters and drones that have been massively promoted for years in a row?

          It’s all there on pieces of paper; almost entire Death Stars were built there. In fact, all this became villas on Lake Como and houses in France)))

          Well yes, it's possible. But in fact, on the front line, soldiers in the prime of life are dying, sailors in the navy are dying, and all because of empty, promoted statements like: “And here, for the first time in the world, we have no analogues...” (dachas, yachts - that’s YES!)
          PS What can we say if cargo planes and even long-range “detection” planes are shot down over our territories!
          PSS Just what does he discover if he is shot down? If he was shot down despite the promoted electronic warfare systems for aviation?!
      3. 0
        17 March 2024 19: 09
        The Ka27 could have played this role, but there are few of them left and they have been discontinued. The project based on the Ka52 is also not clear what’s wrong with it. There is no new helicopter for the fleet.
        1. 0
          17 March 2024 23: 37
          Quote: BAT-MENT
          The Ka27 could have played this role, but there are few of them left and they have been discontinued. The project based on the Ka52 is also not clear what’s wrong with it. There is no new helicopter for the fleet.

          ===
          drones on board are probably more relevant now, not helicopters
      4. 0
        17 March 2024 23: 52
        Why are there no helicopters on ships, why don’t helicopters patrol the waters together with ships at night?

        Helicopters are incapable of this; they won’t last long, just like the fuel for them on ships.
    5. +1
      17 March 2024 14: 57
      Looking at... the face of the new fleet commander (is that him sitting there?) - maybe they didn’t understand?
      But now, weak to God, the chief inspector-strategist-tactician of all Rus' arrived and gave valuable advice and orders
      So win
    6. +1
      17 March 2024 15: 52
      When was the last time we had anti-submarine, anti-submarine, and anti-drone defense exercises in the Navy? Searching for the destruction of nuclear submarines is a whole undertaking. Do we have ships for such operations, formations? What about naval aviation and anti-submarine helicopters? It’s scary to think what will happen if it’s not Ukraine that attacks, but Japan, for example. This will be the second Tsushima.
    7. +5
      17 March 2024 16: 08
      Quote: Black
      It’s like they didn’t understand it without him?

      What can I say... request ...Thank God that we have only one Black Sea Fleet at war.
    8. AAK
      +5
      17 March 2024 19: 13
      Well, yes, it took only two years to wise up, 7 sunk ships, approximately a slightly larger number of sunk boats and several damaged NK and submarines of the KChF, I’m surprised that the absolutely useless commander of this association is not in prison yet....
    9. -1
      18 March 2024 01: 33
      The black
      Yesterday, 13: 46
      It’s like they didn’t understand this without him?.....maybe he still ordered funds to be allocated for their additional equipment?
      I have to say, however: all proposals for retrofitting had to be made before the SVO, okay, time has passed, but in the process of 2 years you need to be prepared for the insidiousness of the nasty and constantly crapping Englishman, yak srii!
      There was little response for the destroyed flagship of the KChF RK "Moscow", BDK, DePL and a whole list of others,
      including the Crimean Bridge.
      It’s a shame why you can’t kill the mattress Reapers, Hawks, Poseidons, whose information carries leads and death to our RF Armed Forces in the Northern Military District and the civilian population, if the patriotic Houthis have the entire coalition, regardless of ranks!
    10. 0
      18 March 2024 02: 12
      Imagine, yes, they didn’t understand! This is all as old as time: first a roast rooster has to peck for someone to start moving.
    11. +1
      18 March 2024 09: 59
      ...everything is as usual - the boss arrived, and he alone knows everything.... I hope the new command already understands the necessary measures...
    12. 0
      19 March 2024 04: 54
      Of course not. No order. We are sitting. We wait. We keep ourselves busy with washing, painting, marching. You can line up. One-two. Lots of fun.
      They'll run now. Will do.
  2. +24
    17 March 2024 13: 46
    Wise and timely guidance from the Minister! Before, without Shoigu, what were the admirals thinking? No additional funds for you, no required number of teachings.
    It's good that such a wise man is in charge.
    1. +10
      17 March 2024 13: 50
      And it’s always like this with us. Until something very bad happens, nothing will be done. The refineries still stand without cover from drones. Now they will heroically build a defense
      1. +12
        17 March 2024 13: 52
        It’s a pity that the note didn’t say, but who gave Shoigu the idea to order all this! The Motherland must know its heroes!
        Yes, and give him a medal. Not Shoigu, but the tipster. Although, Shoigu can also deserve it.
        1. +1
          17 March 2024 14: 13
          Quote: Cat Alexandrovich
          It’s a pity that the note didn’t say, but who gave Shoigu the idea to order all this! The Motherland must know its heroes!
          Yes, and give him a medal. Not Shoigu, but the tipster.

          You can even award an order based on the importance of the decision made (finally!). Truly, until the thunder strikes, the man will not cross himself. Well, it took a very long time to find a solution to the problem. I’ve always criticized armchair tipsters (even though I’m one myself), but in this case they reacted much earlier.
        2. +2
          17 March 2024 14: 30
          Apparently there are at least echoes of the explosion of comments on VO around
          notes on enemy BEC attacks, the situation around Kotov and
          ship project 22160 in general. It’s not in vain that we write, not in vain..
      2. +1
        17 March 2024 17: 06
        It’s early, not much time has passed. The solution must mature and remain in the folder for the necessary time. Only then can it be seen that they worked with the documents and made an informed decision.
    2. BAI
      +9
      17 March 2024 13: 59
      Before, without Shoigu, what were the admirals thinking?

      The former commander of the Black Sea Fleet (who was recently removed) FORBIDDEN the installation of additional fire weapons on ships. That's what we were thinking about
      1. +2
        17 March 2024 15: 18
        Probably due to the fact that with additional firing points, the ships did not look so beautiful at parades, and over the decades our admirals (and generals too) have become accustomed to thinking only in such categories - appearance, parades, parade reviews, and other tinsel. THESE will not be able to do otherwise, but they change them, if they change them, for exactly the same ones.
      2. -1
        17 March 2024 17: 19
        Now, according to the general directive of the Supreme Commander, the former commander must be promoted as if he had failed. His words: if he can’t cope, give him a promotion and appoint someone else (the same one, probably).
  3. +8
    17 March 2024 13: 47
    Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu instructed the command of the Black Sea Fleet to take measures to install additional firepower on ships and vessels of the fleet to protect against unmanned boats that Ukraine attacks. This was reported by the press service of the military department.
    Well, thank God! Less than three years have passed since the commission was born!
    1. +2
      17 March 2024 13: 57
      And this is not enough. It would be nice to equip them with Lancets with thermal imagers, and train the crew. Ships still don’t cost a penny, and it’s cheaper to spend a dozen lancets than one ship. And personally, I would also equip reconnaissance drones and constantly keep a couple of drones in the air to monitor the situation around the ship at a distance of at least 5 miles. And this is not a bit much, considering that the lives of sailors depend on it.
      1. +3
        17 March 2024 14: 14
        A dozen lancelets and a sawfish, they will take everything down, believe me! But admirals have been waiting for retirement and fishing for a long time.
      2. 0
        17 March 2024 15: 11
        This is certainly good - additional Lancets with thermal imagers, a pair of which will cut circles around the ship at a distance of 5 miles. But here several questions arise at once: where to store these drones with spare parts and related equipment on these ships, how many of them will ultimately be needed to control the situation around the ship, and who will control all this weaponry on the ship. It’s one thing to give out “valuable instructions,” but the grass won’t grow any further. It is quite another to practically carry out “valuable instructions” to benefit the business.
      3. +6
        17 March 2024 16: 15
        The lancet flies for an hour and a half at most. A Mavic with a thermal imager is much cheaper, it can see up to 5 kilometers, and its contrast is just right. Just look at how Krynok’s boats were sunk, it’s impossible not to see the inflatable rubber. And at such a range, FPV drones will work fine, they cost pennies, there are no obstacles on the water, you can launch them in stacks
      4. 0
        19 March 2024 04: 57
        But the Minister of Defense did not order this. There is no point in doing amateur activities here. All this is not provided for by the design and staff. Which means it's a mess.
    2. +2
      17 March 2024 14: 35
      What's the point of this order?! How many heavy machine guns does each boat need to protect itself? While the machine guns are being installed, the Ukrainians will send underwater unmanned vehicles.
      First of all, you need to learn to see the enemy, all these electronic warfare. hydroacoustics. And shoot not with slingshots, but with something significant.
  4. +7
    17 March 2024 13: 49
    Holy shit, not even 3 years have passed. It was for this proposal that I was constantly downvoted here and said that I didn’t understand anything and in general
    1. +15
      17 March 2024 14: 22
      Of course you don't understand. Add. fire weapons are supernumerary assets. It must be issued and registered on some basis, and again, a supernumerary allowance not provided for by the norms of the Labor Code must be allocated for it. Which needs to be written off somehow. Again, layout diagrams, calculations on corners...... in short, this is a most exciting, as they say now, quest! And a lot of people will be involved in it, and not always competent ones, they will simply be ordered. And they will report even before these machine guns reach the ships from the warehouses..... And I’ll tell you why this hasn’t happened yet. The use of non-standard equipment, and even more so weapons, is strictly prohibited in the Armed Forces. And for the financial department it’s absolutely brilliant that the databases are going in some way, as they say, the instructions are old but have not been canceled by anyone. And all the removed commanders obviously did not have the courage to further protect the ships without a command. And asking this very team to give again requires courage....
      1. +7
        17 March 2024 14: 41
        Quote from Voronezh
        the instructions are old but not canceled by anyone

        They say that one dismissal officer demanded a horse and harness, citing the Order of the 30s...
        Looks like they gave it away...
        1. -2
          17 March 2024 18: 41
          Quote: BABAY22
          They say that one dismissal officer demanded a horse and harness, citing the Order of the 30s...
          Looks like they gave it away...

          In some state of the United States there is still a law in force where a person released into the wild is entitled to a horse and a revolver. Well, I read about this in the 90s.
        2. +1
          19 March 2024 04: 58
          Well done! Right! So I read the documents.
  5. +1
    17 March 2024 13: 50
    Every day it is necessary to conduct training with personnel. Training to repel air attacks and attacks by unmanned boats. Carry out day and night so that all our crews are ready
    - the minister added.


    but we thought that they themselves could do it, and that they would only convey their decision to him...
    what if he didn’t give the order now? - that’s how sailors and ships died???
    as Papa Carla said there: “the country of fools”
    and the face in the foreground of the photograph is so spiritual....,
    1. +4
      17 March 2024 13: 55
      The face in the foreground finally received valuable guidance.
    2. +6
      17 March 2024 14: 39
      Quote: Dedok
      the face in the foreground of the photograph is so spiritual....

      The face is not disfigured by intellect.
      Incapable of thinking and acting independently. Only by order.
      1. 0
        19 March 2024 04: 59
        If they give the order to think, they will think. For now, no.
  6. +18
    17 March 2024 13: 54
    Thank you Shoigu for your concern.
    If not for his timely instructions, the Black Sea Fleet would have lost a bunch of ships from drones.
    Happy is the country that has such a defense minister.
  7. -2
    17 March 2024 13: 55
    I wonder what it will be. It seems to me that we need to put 3 AK-630s on each side with the ability to fire at the surface of the sea and night vision devices. But this is unrealistic on already built ships, so most likely there will be manually aimed machine guns.
    1. +3
      17 March 2024 15: 09
      Shoigu - the main discreditor - “entrusted” everything, he would have “called” and it will be like this: they will weld a couple of DShKs onto the ship and here you have “including heavy machine guns”
      1. 0
        17 March 2024 15: 15
        Quote: eskulap
        they’ll weld a couple of DShKs onto the ship and here you have “including heavy machine guns”

        Do you think that it is so easy to install something additional on an already built ship? Something serious can only be installed during construction, or during renovation and modernization.
        1. +1
          17 March 2024 15: 20
          So what am I talking about? That’s exactly what they will do - it’s easy and affordable, and the efficiency is excellent.
          1. 0
            17 March 2024 17: 55
            Quote: eskulap
            easy and affordable

            I would say not so - physically possible. Alas, cramming in something new is a very difficult task.
            1. -1
              17 March 2024 19: 23
              Somehow people added a double naval anti-aircraft gun to Motolyga, so it’s not such a problem to install something on ships, complete with thermal imagers and night vision devices.
              1. +2
                17 March 2024 19: 51
                Quote: Expert
                the ship's anti-aircraft gun on Motolyga was spandored

                You do not understand. The Hammer was originally created as a platform for various machines and, in principle, it is much simpler, but the possibility of global changes is not built into the ship, and its design is much more complex.
                Firstly, you need free space, which never exists. Secondly, it is necessary that in this place there should be sufficiently strong hull structures that will withstand both the weight and the recoil of the gun, or they need to be installed, and this is also a place. Third, everything needs to be connected to the ship's electrical and hydraulic systems. Fourthly, the fire control system needs to be improved so as not to direct everything manually. Fifthly, it is necessary to extend cable routes to combat posts.
                1. -1
                  17 March 2024 20: 14
                  That is, a small tower with its own heating, battery and Oka engine with a generator is not enough? Maybe there is no need to complicate the solution of the problem in extreme conditions? Are there really not a couple of places with sufficient strength at the edges of the deck, next to the bulkheads? At night, duty can be done for 2 hours. Release some of the crew from duties that are of little significance in the conditions of the air defense system, if possible.
                  The point is not to stare at the waves around the clock through a triplex with a night light? Did I understand correctly that most attacks were more or less detected a few tens of seconds before the approach of the attacking drones? That is, you just need to run up to the machines and work on the identified targets. Or not? And the main surveillance equipment should probably be located somewhere on the masts?
                  1. +1
                    17 March 2024 21: 13
                    Quote: Expert
                    Maybe there is no need to complicate the solution of the problem in extreme conditions?
                    Then we return to the machine gun, placed on a stand with manual guidance. Or even a 25 mm cannon, but again manually controlled.
                    Quote: Expert
                    Are there really not a couple of places with sufficient strength at the edges of the deck, next to the bulkheads?
                    There is no question about a hammer with its powerful hull, but a modern ship with sides made of tin is more difficult.
                    1. -1
                      17 March 2024 21: 32
                      Quote: Dart2027
                      Then we return to the machine gun, placed on a stand with manual guidance. Or even a 25 mm cannon, but again manually controlled.
                      But that's roughly what we're talking about. Only, not so oaky. You need at least an armored shield with a canvas roof, a seat and a 5 kW electric motor with two pedals for faster turning left and right.
                      1. +1
                        17 March 2024 22: 00
                        Quote: Expert
                        You need at least an armored shield with a canvas roof, a seat and a 5 kW electric motor with two pedals for faster turning left and right.

                        This is quite possible to implement.
                        Quote: Expert
                        But that's roughly what we're talking about.

                        Well, at first it was about a tower that was placed on a hammer, and this is a completely different matter.
                      2. 0
                        18 March 2024 00: 46
                        There are ship designers who know where on the ship, what can be screwed and welded (and whether it is possible at all), so the correct event is called modernization, and perhaps Shoigu’s pointers are not enough for this - there must be a type of specific order, otherwise everything will end up with the ship and the sailor mast with NVD
                      3. +1
                        18 March 2024 05: 51
                        Quote: eskulap
                        There are ship designers who know where on the ship, what can be screwed and welded (and whether it is possible at all), so the right event is called modernization

                        Of course, but serious changes can only be made in the process of a full modernization of the order.
        2. 0
          19 March 2024 05: 02
          It's easier to drown. But it's correct. If you don't have the brains to install it yourself, involve industry. They will calculate, they will calculate, they will do it. They will deliver it as a trick. But this is just a tender that needs to be held for a year! Otherwise - corruption. Consider for yourself: the boat sank, well, they’ll take it off. Then they will raise you. And they will go to jail for corruption.
          1. 0
            19 March 2024 19: 09
            Quote: MCmaximus
            If you don't have the brains to install it yourself, involve industry. They will calculate, they will calculate, they will do it. They will deliver it as a trick.

            Unfortunately, this cannot be done quickly. Development of technical documentation, sending the ship to the plant, performing work.
            Quote: Dart2027
            Something serious can only be installed during construction, or during renovation and modernization.


            Quote: MCmaximus
            But this is just a tender that needs to be held for a year! Otherwise - corruption.

            It is truth too. The fight against corruption is a double-edged sword. On the one hand, it seems logical, but on the other hand, some “Horns and Hooves” will declare that they will do everything quickly and cheaply, but in the end they will do nothing.
            1. 0
              20 March 2024 15: 40
              Yes, ushhhh.... If, of course, you draw the technical specifications, start a tender, conclude an agreement, start development and drawings, then all the same for manufacturing.... But business.... Reinforcements of the bulwarks or pillars and reinforcement of the deck , standard kingpin (or whatever it is called?). Place it on the site, etc., etc. Managers know how to formulate all this very cleverly. .. Then we will be ready for goal 2025.
              But in a normal way, a crew at the factory would work out this kind of crap in a day and five bucks on top. To each.
              1. 0
                20 March 2024 19: 15
                Quote: MCmaximus
                But business.... Bulwark reinforcements or pillars and deck reinforcements, a standard kingpin (or whatever it is called?)

                “or whatever his name is” sounds especially clever.
                Quote: MCmaximus
                But in a normal way, a crew at a factory would work out such crap in a day
                and when you try to use it, everything will fall apart in a couple of seconds.
    2. 0
      17 March 2024 15: 24
      The AK-630 is large and heavy and cannot be installed on every ship. We need installations like the USPU-24 helicopter with a YakB-12,7 machine gun. But even with such an installation, not everything is simple; the installation is difficult to load and maintain. If installed in casemates, at least on rails so that they can be pulled out and pushed in.
      1. -1
        17 March 2024 15: 30
        Good declination and rotation angles.
      2. 0
        17 March 2024 16: 50
        The YakB-12,7 is a capricious machine gun; it is better to install the aviation double-barreled GSh-23. It is quite light and compact.
        1. -3
          17 March 2024 19: 14
          Oh really? Why didn’t they install DShK or NSV then? Stop talking nonsense. The multi-barreled machine gun is precisely designed for long-term fire and is superior in this to the conventional small arms variants that are shoved into the DBM.
          But the gun is too large and is unlikely to be suitable in large quantities on a ship. How is it better than the Broadsword complex?
          1. -1
            17 March 2024 21: 44
            Theory is one thing, practice is another matter entirely. Initially, the Mi-24A was equipped with the A-12,7, then the Mi-24V was equipped with the YakB-12,7, but the practice of using the YakB-12,7 in Afghanistan showed its unreliability.
            Military use showed the design flaws of the machine gun. Among which, mainly, are capriciousness from contamination and overheating of the machine gun. Problems with the movement of the cartridge belt. Also, after 250 shots, the machine gun “spitted” and jammed. As a result, the practical consumption of ammunition was up to 500 rounds per flight.

            As a result, the YakB-12,7 was abandoned and at first they installed a fixed 30-mm GSh-2-30K on the Mi-24P, and then on the Mi-24VM and Mi-35 they switched to the GSh-23L in the turret.
            1. 0
              17 March 2024 21: 47
              So what, dear? A DShK or NSV will bend much earlier than a multi-barreled machine gun, and not in theory, but in practice.
          2. -1
            17 March 2024 21: 57
            And the gun is too big
            Weight YakB-12,7 45 kg
            Modified YakBU-12,7 60 kg
            GSh-23 - 51 kg
            The rate of fire for the GSh-23 is 3000-4000 rounds per minute for the YakB-12,7 4000-5000
            1. 0
              19 March 2024 05: 07
              The GS is small and light. Only without the appropriate sight it is of no use. With its rate of fire, there won't be enough ammunition.
      3. 0
        17 March 2024 17: 57
        Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
        The AK-630 is large and heavy, and cannot be installed on every ship.

        It will fit on corvettes. It’s hard to say about RTOs, but I think that 4 of them can be squeezed in.
  8. +5
    17 March 2024 13: 58
    Every day it is necessary to conduct training with personnel. Training to repel air attacks and attacks by unmanned boats. Carry out day and night so that all our crews are ready
    in the moment this is all correct, here and now there is no other way out, but in the long term this is a path to nowhere, a person cannot defeat a robot, we need appropriate countermeasures, unmanned, fully automated, with AI elements
    1. 0
      17 March 2024 14: 04
      So far the situation is similar to 1877-1878. But, however, after the war, means of protection were found. The search process is currently underway. How p.s. In the Red Sea, backs are still dealt with using a 40-on-one system. Otherwise, I doubt that the same Burke will get out of four.
      1. +1
        17 March 2024 14: 08
        It seems to me that Burke, that our ships will not be able to oppose anything at all to underwater drones, and they are already on the way, in the roadstead we can only set up anti-torpedo nets
        1. +3
          17 March 2024 14: 13
          The issue is detection. And so RBU will cope with it efficiently. But... the question is the number of attacking objects. When the system is overloaded, defeat is inevitable. But sticking ships with everything possible from all angles is not feasible.
          1. +2
            17 March 2024 14: 15
            That’s the point, there’s a problem with detecting surface surface ships, and if they’re not even visible visually, their engines are water-jet, you can’t hear them, then screw it, just hide
            1. +4
              17 March 2024 16: 21
              Everything is normal there with detection, modern thermal imagers allow you to see a log in the river and individual waves. It’s just that if the fleet doesn’t have a single Mavik with a heater, not to mention all sorts of Orions and especially reconnaissance aircraft, and there are no hydroacoustics at all, then it turns out that saving ships is only a matter for the crew of these ships. Here even the backs all saw ordinary ships, reported where they needed to go and that’s it, nothing happened, the helicopter didn’t fly to sink them. Admirals are not on ships, they cannot drown, and they will not go to trial
              1. +1
                17 March 2024 16: 54
                Can you imagine the continuous monitoring of the entire space around the ship during the entire dark time of the day at 360 degrees, this is how many people with thermal imagers are needed on the ship, they also need to be changed very often because continuously looking into a thermal imager is very bad for vision, I have already encountered soldiers with their own blindness per eye for this reason, it should be an automated XNUMX-degree inspection system
                1. 0
                  17 March 2024 17: 17
                  I think 2-3 people can handle it, on a ship they can be put in a separate cabin and surrounded by large monitors, and not, as usual, looking at a small image from a mobile phone. And if they order a neural network for control by normal, sane pogromists, then it will be a fairy tale. But this requires breaking through the bureaucratic blockade, which is practically impossible. I think we have just zero drones in the Black Sea Fleet, everything is behind flags, the times when a torus could be piled on a ship are gone, now the fleet has returned to 2021 without war, but with parades
        2. 0
          17 March 2024 14: 52
          Quote: _Ugene_
          It seems to me that Burke, that our ships will not be able to oppose anything at all to underwater drones, and they are already on the way, in the roadstead it is only possible anti-torpedo nets arrange

          3 BECs - one undermines the networks, the other two enter the breach and tear the ship
          1. +1
            17 March 2024 20: 46
            You still have to get into the hole in the net to slip through. The first explosion will make some noise around. Presumably, the ship can cope with the rest on its own?
        3. +3
          17 March 2024 15: 20
          So far, it seems that the surface ones are controlled through Starlinks and the like. There will be some problems with underwater ones.
          1. 0
            17 March 2024 15: 55
            yes, they should be completely autonomous, the bourgeoisie is in full swing
      2. +1
        18 March 2024 00: 05
        Burke will just turn out. For these purposes, he has a Bushmaster with automatic target tracking or an even more advanced Phalanx. Or both. And standard Brownings on the sides.
        1. 0
          18 March 2024 19: 54
          Vidkilya there are those machine guns? The Burks are not the Fletchers, to whom everything was crammed.
          1. +1
            19 March 2024 00: 03
            This is a standard weapon.
            4 12,7 mm M2HB machine guns
          2. +1
            19 March 2024 00: 20
            By the way, out of curiosity I looked at Fletcher. There was a lot of everything, but there were no regular machine guns; there were 20 mm Oerlikons. At that time, everyone was interested in anti-aircraft weapons, and machine guns were already ineffective against aircraft.
            On Arly Berki, of course, they are installed not as anti-aircraft, but as anti-sabotage.
  9. +4
    17 March 2024 14: 00
    Hasn't any ship been sunk yet? How timely. Look, at this rate, in a couple of years we’ll start something we haven’t started yet.
  10. +17
    17 March 2024 14: 01
    Oh really !!! Half of the Black Sea Fleet was lost and only just came to its senses. Shoigu is somehow an unhappy figure. We need a new minister with a military background and tactical thinking. While Shoigu in the Russian Defense Ministry there will be no breakthroughs or significant victories. Only thanks to the heroism of our guys there is still hope for victory, but not thanks to the “wise Shoiga.” He doesn’t even have the charisma of a commander, so warm g...o.
    1. +11
      17 March 2024 14: 24
      Quote: Chernorechye
      not in any way thanks to the “wise Shoiga”.

      From the commander and above, personal loyalty is more valued. And only fools can be the most loyal; no one else needs them.
    2. +3
      17 March 2024 15: 24
      We need a new minister with a military background and tactical thinking.

      Didn’t our admirals, including those who were removed, have military education? And how did it help?
      1. +5
        17 March 2024 16: 34
        . Didn’t our admirals, including those who were removed, have military education? And how did it help?


        Having an education does not imply the ability to use it.
        Take, for example, an axe. Someone has bungled Kizhi, someone is chopping wood, someone is cutting off heads. And in the case under discussion, the ax handle has rotted long ago, the piece of iron has been eaten away by rust, in short, the results of the reforms are before our eyes.
        1. 0
          17 March 2024 18: 44
          Quote: Podvodnik
          Take, for example, an axe. Someone has bungled Kizhi, someone is chopping wood, someone is cutting off heads. And in the case under discussion, the ax handle has rotted long ago, the piece of iron has been eaten away by rust, in short, the results of the reforms are before our eyes.

          A porridge made from an ax with foulbrood will do just fine.
    3. +3
      17 March 2024 16: 01
      On August 15, the decision to surrender Japan was published. That evening, Admiral Onishi invited several officers to his residence. They talked until midnight, then the meeting participants dispersed.

      Sometime before morning, Admiral Onishi's aide was informed that his superior had committed hara-kiri. Rushing to the admiral's residence, the aide discovered Onis's body in a second-floor office, where he had disemboweled himself with a Japanese sword in the traditional manner. The abdominal cavity was carefully cut, but the admiral's subsequent attempt to cut his own throat was not so successful. When the assistant arrived, the admiral was still conscious and said:

      - Don't try to help me.

      Thus, refusing both medical help and the last blow in order to free himself from his death throes, he agonized until six o'clock in the evening. His desire to prolong his suffering was apparently an act of atonement. Left alone on the evening of the previous day after the departure of the staff officers, Admiral Onishi wrote a note with the following content:
      “I would like to express my deep gratitude to the brave kamikazes. They fought selflessly and died with faith in our final victory. With my death, I would like to atone for my failure to achieve victory and apologize to the grieving families of the fallen pilots.

      I wish the Japanese youth to strengthen their spirit by the example of my death. Recklessness only helps the enemy. You must strictly follow the spirit of the emperor's decision. Be proud to be Japanese.

      You are a national treasure. With all the restless spirit of a kamikaze, fight for the well-being of Japan and for world peace."
      1. +1
        17 March 2024 20: 57
        Quote: BAT-MENT
        and for world peace."
        But this was probably added after the war?
    4. 0
      19 March 2024 05: 09
      We had these. There was no point.
  11. +2
    17 March 2024 14: 04
    The “leaders” came to their senses - this should have been done earlier, before the SVO.
  12. 0
    17 March 2024 14: 06
    The Minister instructed to equip the ships with additional firepower, including heavy machine guns, to repel attacks by unmanned boats of the Ukrainian Navy.

    Did someone tell him that he needed to pull the ring?
    “Ilya Muromets and Nightingale the Robber”©

    There was also talk about the ship's "Geraniums"... Isn't it more reliable if the operator is big-headed and handy?
  13. +1
    17 March 2024 14: 08
    Maybe the designers and shipbuilders should have taken care of this, coupled with military acceptance.
    Now the minister orders to retrofit the ships themselves and with what they have?!
    1. +3
      17 March 2024 21: 14
      In order for designers and shipbuilders to do anything, they must first be given the appropriate technical specifications and allocate funds for development.
  14. +7
    17 March 2024 14: 09
    Well really! It has reached the third year of hostilities!!! I just want to say: “You are not brakes, you are slow gases.” And in another three years it will be realized that it is necessary to constantly illuminate the entire Black Sea with the help of UAVs. And as soon as something comes out of Odessa, use emergency means to send everything to the bottom.
  15. +4
    17 March 2024 14: 12
    wassat Not even 2 years have passed, but I was wondering what they were waiting for, it turns out there was no order soldier
    1. +7
      17 March 2024 14: 19
      Correction, this has been going on for three years now. And this parade marshal just came to his senses.
      1. +3
        17 March 2024 15: 25
        And the ceremonial admirals have not yet come to their senses.
  16. +8
    17 March 2024 14: 16
    “The Minister instructed to equip the ships with additional firepower, including heavy machine guns, to repel attacks by unmanned boats of the Ukrainian Navy,” - the NWO was in its third year.
    1. +4
      17 March 2024 14: 52
      We are waiting for this strategic genius to come to Belgorod and also give valuable instructions there
  17. -3
    17 March 2024 14: 17
    that until the minister pokes his face and scratches what kind of people, these drones have been interfering with life for a year and a half
    1. +4
      17 March 2024 14: 51
      Yeah, the minister is good
      These are the ones he appoints as bad ones
      And he's good
    2. +2
      17 March 2024 15: 21
      I'm wildly sorry, but maybe the minister himself is needed, like a kitten who doesn't yet know why there's a tray in the house?
  18. +7
    17 March 2024 14: 19
    You will ask the right question: why didn’t someone do or suggest this before? The answer is simple: the high command lives by the principle of initiative e.... initiator. So they sit on their butts straight and watch the fleet slowly sink to the bottom.
  19. +1
    17 March 2024 14: 20
    Was it really impossible to do all this back in 22? What did Evmenov and the previous 2 Black Sea Fleet commanders do?
    1. +3
      17 March 2024 14: 31
      Until 22, the entire country was annually shown a parade army that had no analogues in the world, some of which existed exclusively on paper.
  20. +2
    17 March 2024 14: 20
    Yeah, our Minister of Defense is just some kind of strategist, has probably seen the light?
  21. +4
    17 March 2024 14: 31
    This is not Shoigu’s competence. The Black Sea Fleet command should have done this as soon as information appeared about the production of BEC in territory 404. This is window dressing for journalists.
    As a matter of fact, after Gorshkov we did not have a defense minister. Shoigu is something. What are they doing to the country? Prigogine, even though he is a criminal, is right 1000 times over.
    1. +7
      17 March 2024 15: 26
      Quote: Aleks88
      This is not Shoigu’s competence.


      This is Shoigu's incompetence.
  22. +17
    17 March 2024 14: 32
    On the fourth day, the Vigilant Falcon noticed that the barn was missing one wall wink
  23. +2
    17 March 2024 14: 40
    I can’t even imagine what I would have been like if the bright head of the blogger’s father-in-law had not been visited by these sensible thoughts in the third year of the Secondary Educational Institution and he would not have given out “valuable” instructions. In general, it’s worth admitting that all those people who write to him on a piece of paper are unsuitable for their profession.
  24. +4
    17 March 2024 14: 42
    Previously, sonobuoys were installed to detect moving ships. It was possible to detect the enemy in advance.
    1. +1
      17 March 2024 15: 36
      This is another problem, a detection problem. The buoys did not work for long, even in passive mode, and they also had to be assembled later. Sonobuoys should replace unmanned boats with equipment.
  25. +1
    17 March 2024 14: 45
    Yes, the deer has woken up after a long Northern, half-year hibernation.
  26. +3
    17 March 2024 14: 46
    Couldn’t this have been done immediately after the news about the creation of Magura was announced?
    Or is our leadership so stupid and stupid that they care about them like a giraffe?
    Or should we lose half of the Black Sea Fleet?
    What would the brain say turn on?
  27. 0
    17 March 2024 14: 50
    What kind of hazing has he put on himself?!
    1. 0
      17 March 2024 15: 22
      Perhaps a field uniform is an option for a general
  28. +2
    17 March 2024 14: 53
    The GShG-7,62 machine gun also looks good. despite the small caliber.
    https://youtu.be/C_Dl4UC-wY8?si=-dBkxP53AZmwJmon
    It is advisable to have a machine for shooting while sitting, like the one they made for the pickup truck in the video.
    1. -1
      17 March 2024 22: 09
      The GShG-7,62 machine gun also looks good. despite the small caliber.
      https://youtu.be/C_Dl4UC-wY8?si=-dBkxP53AZmwJmon
      It is advisable to have a machine for shooting while sitting, like the one they made for the pickup truck in the video.

      Carefully! The video is edited “ingeniously” - at the beginning of the video, the sound of a Gatling gun burst is heard at all possible volume, and then the announcer’s barely audible voice
  29. +2
    17 March 2024 14: 55
    This is the new fleet commander in the photo in the foreground
    The face says it all
    Negative selection at its finest
    They will recruit devotees - but they ask how smart they are?
    1. -1
      17 March 2024 22: 24
      Quote: Ivan№One
      This is the new fleet commander in the photo in the foreground
      The face says it all
      Negative selection at its finest
      They will recruit devotees - but they ask how smart they are?

      So they took so many years, in vain or something. The result is expected!
  30. 0
    17 March 2024 15: 03
    Thoughtfully, very thoughtfully... first they thought carefully (for a couple of years), and then issued an order...
  31. +1
    17 March 2024 15: 04
    It even dawned on the essentially civilian Minister of Defense that there should be more machine guns on ships, just wondering what the Black Sea Fleet command has been doing since the beginning of the Northern Military District?!

    Or is it now impossible for us to install an extra machine gun on a ship without instructions from the Minister of Defense? Should the mesh protection for the tank also be approved by the Minister of Defense now, or can we install it ourselves for now?
    1. +4
      17 March 2024 15: 34
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Or is it now impossible for us to install an extra machine gun on a ship without instructions from the Minister of Defense?

      So, have we already abolished liability for illegal possession of firearms? Who will give the ship's commander a machine gun that was not provided for in the project? Even if someone gives it away, he is not a fool to take it. You can sit down for this unconditionally.
      1. 0
        17 March 2024 20: 00
        But to sit down for eleven years, for not ensuring the combat effectiveness of the ship does not shine? Are you scared by responsibility for machine guns? It's absolutely stunning what it's come to.
        1. +1
          17 March 2024 20: 24
          Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich
          But to sit down for eleven years, for not ensuring the combat effectiveness of the ship does not shine?

          What kind of responsibility could there be for this? Well, in the worst case scenario, they will be appointed head of some academy.
  32. -2
    17 March 2024 15: 05
    The solution lies on the surface, you just need to come up with a protective field that the ship can generate for its protection. It's elementary.
    1. +1
      17 March 2024 16: 26
      The keys to the frequencies of electronic warfare systems are sooner or later selected and after that the effectiveness of its operation is reduced to nothing. There are no fools fighting with us, and they are aware of the principles of operation of our electronic warfare systems much more than almost everyone present here.
  33. +1
    17 March 2024 15: 11
    That is, only now the order was given to lift a finger?!!
    In the Middle Ages, the Bosporus was blocked off with a chain, in the 19th century a torpedo boom was invented, and in the 21st century it took two years and a whole series of sunken ships to begin the difficult process of thinking about the eternal Russian question - “what to do”?
  34. -3
    17 March 2024 15: 18
    I came to my senses, hello, we've arrived! This will not give anything, we need to radically solve the problem! Take Odessa, make the Black Sea a no-fly zone!
  35. +6
    17 March 2024 15: 25
    Our MO, with its reaction speed, gives the impression of a boxer who entered the ring, took a stance, stood motionless for fifteen minutes while he was beaten from all sides, and after the gong struck, he began to wave his fists in the empty ring, pretending to fight with an opponent who had long gone into locker room
  36. +2
    17 March 2024 15: 32
    the decision is late. but better late than never... there are shipborne MZA, but they were removed to the storage bases, and from the storage bases they were stuck on motorcycle boots. And all these stealth, which on a good wave will blink on the radar like a mozyanka... and the requirement of no protruding parts and equipment. And the fact that any boat with a CPV is already a serious threat, especially small-caliber rapid-fire 23, 25,30, 40mm, has nothing to oppose to anyone? There are essentially no anti-drone weapons!!!
  37. +1
    17 March 2024 15: 34
    The question is not even at the admiral level. It’s good that it’s not the president who decides, that would be completely sad.
  38. +2
    17 March 2024 15: 38
    They still woke up the rescuer. Shall we defend ourselves?
  39. +4
    17 March 2024 15: 39
    The United States had all its ships against kamikazes; the entire deck of the ships was lined with machine guns and anti-aircraft guns. We just got it.
  40. -1
    17 March 2024 15: 48
    Well, yes, if private and not state companies serve the Moscow Region, then this order is like wind in the field.
  41. -3
    17 March 2024 15: 56
    Admiral Nakhimov sank the Turkish fleet in Sinop, and the Tsar Father lost the war!
    1. -2
      17 March 2024 16: 02
      It is not for you to judge Our history!
  42. +1
    17 March 2024 16: 01
    There are no words, we have seen the light! What is the price of this solution? How long have we been harnessing!!!((((
  43. 0
    17 March 2024 16: 09
    Is it right that such instructions for modernization are published? Also at a press conference with big stars.
  44. +2
    17 March 2024 16: 11
    Quote: Sergey39
    There are no words, we have seen the light! What is the price of this solution? How long have we been harnessing!!!((((


    We don't harness. Nobody will give us such a right.
  45. +2
    17 March 2024 16: 16
    Well, if the minister himself... No one would have known this without him.
  46. +4
    17 March 2024 16: 25
    The Minister instructed

    This is the first time I have heard of this form of issuing orders in the army.
    1. +1
      18 March 2024 01: 13
      It’s only cooler to “summon”
  47. +2
    17 March 2024 16: 42
    And the Black Sea Fleet command still didn’t realize that urgent measures had to be taken a year ago.
  48. +1
    17 March 2024 16: 45
    Wow! I'm shocked! Not even two years have passed! Our tired pants with stripes came up with something better and decided! Well, then things will go well! But they didn’t say what price they had to pay, how many of our ships have already been sunk?
  49. +4
    17 March 2024 16: 53
    The Minister instructed to equip ships with additional firepower

    Good morning Shoigu laughing
    How right Prigogine was after all when he spoke about these wooden stripes.
    Until they drown the entire Black Sea fleet and destroy all the non-production factories, they will never come to their senses.
  50. +2
    17 March 2024 17: 05
    Clear.
    The Russian fleet is unnecessary.
  51. 0
    17 March 2024 17: 07
    Quote: Lev_Russia
    Shoigu instructed the command of the Black Sea Fleet to retrofit the ships

    This should have been done two years ago, and now the entire coastline near Kreaklova needs to be turned into dust... Ports first of all... Otherwise, as Julius Caesar said - My people will not understand me!!! request

    Well..will you have time to get into the trench or..
  52. +5
    17 March 2024 17: 29
    For me, it should be a shame. In 22, the backing washed up on the coast of Crimea, it was clear that they would be used and, probably, how. And nothing for two years. It may be a bad analogy, but if a company’s revenue had been falling for two years, the company would most likely go bankrupt. And most likely they would have removed the commercial one, and maybe the director as well. Install machine guns, maybe ZSU, and equip them with drones for reconnaissance. You don't need a lot of money for this. Why didn't they do it? And the main thing is when they do it. The pace does not inspire optimism
    1. +1
      17 March 2024 19: 45
      So they have already chosen.. why do anything.
  53. +1
    17 March 2024 17: 31
    The Black Sea Fleet command itself, naturally, did not think of this wink
    1. +1
      17 March 2024 19: 13
      Moreover, I didn’t think of it, but the former commander of the Black Sea Fleet forbade doing this
      1. 0
        18 March 2024 16: 07
        For this he should be put on trial, at least for sabotage.
    2. 0
      17 March 2024 19: 40
      And the rest of the command is 7 inches in the forehead. Mediocrity
  54. +2
    17 March 2024 18: 16
    The Ka 27 helicopter would do an excellent job of searching for and destroying Drones. Why aren't 27-hour patrols organized? Meanwhile, the Ka52 was taken out of production. You can adapt the Ka27 for this purpose. Why isn't this being done? Meanwhile, the KaXNUMX helicopter enjoys well-deserved recognition in other countries of the world. However, we discontinued it and there is no replacement. In general, there is a problem with naval aviation. The Tsushima tragedy crippled the Russian Empire. I hope they come to their senses and start acting in the right direction.
    1. 0
      17 March 2024 22: 23
      The boat's main enemy is a helicopter/low-speed attack aircraft. This was established in practice by the coalition during the Gulf War in 1991. When helicopters destroyed almost all Iraqi boats while they were draping from oil platforms. This was 30 years ago, apparently the current “Otmiral” in those days slept through lectures or swept the parade ground.
      If there are so few Ka27s in the valiant fleet, then mobilized and repaired An2s with a container with night optics attached would be enough. In addition, their flight hour is much cheaper.
      1. 0
        18 March 2024 00: 21
        When helicopters destroyed almost all Iraqi boats while they were escaping from oil platforms.

        Destroyed. Only these were not the same boats as they are now. Helicopters cannot remain in the air for long periods of time.
    2. 0
      19 March 2024 05: 15
      In order to send a helicopter, you need to know exactly about the release of the kamikaze. A helicopter does not have an infinite resource; it’s easy to fly.
      And these tubs aren’t worth anything. You can see them with your eyes. The radar sees the wave. Sit and shoot. You just can’t stand still.
  55. 0
    17 March 2024 19: 12
    But what about installing barriers on the sides of ships?
    A type of mesh that protects tanks from above.
  56. 0
    17 March 2024 19: 12
    The wooden generals were not able to take the initiative two years ago
  57. -4
    17 March 2024 19: 37
    how many initiative people are on the site... it’s just terrible... generalists... they say that a narrow specialist knows EVERYTHING about nothing, and a generalist (who are the majority here) NOTHING... but about everything. But why tell me please, the high command (in during the war) they must speak to the whole world about their actions.
    1. +1
      17 March 2024 22: 31
      Quote: oldzek
      but why, please tell me, the high command (during war) must speak to the whole world about their actions

      Yes, no one asks him about his future actions. Everyone can see everything based on the results of actions already taken.
      (starting with the sunken flagship of the Black Sea Fleet). This is what makes everyone wonder what will happen tomorrow after what happened earlier.
      1. +1
        17 March 2024 22: 40
        always and everywhere (and in Russia especially) the generals are preparing for the war that WAS. and not for the one that will be. New means of attack have appeared. And ours (though not only ours) was not ready to repel them.
        1. +1
          17 March 2024 22: 45
          Quote: oldzek
          always and everywhere (and in Russia especially) the generals are preparing for the war that WAS. and not for the one that will be. New means of attack have appeared. And ours (though not only ours) was not ready to repel them.

          You are, of course, right, but I would also like to add the factor of negative selection in the army of the senior command staff (the ones in favor were not the best and those with their own opinions, but those who were flexible and loyal), which was shown by the course and course of the Northern Military District.
          1. 0
            17 March 2024 22: 53
            but I completely agree with this! BUT this system was not born yesterday, not under the GDP, not under the EBN, and not even under the USSR, and (unfortunately) only war can destroy it. Our entire history testifies to this.
  58. -1
    17 March 2024 19: 39
    The word “retrofit” killed me.
    I won't write anything else. Will block
  59. 0
    17 March 2024 19: 46
    Shoigu instructed the command of the Black Sea Fleet to equip the ships with additional firepower
    - but he did not order the ships to be equipped with electronic detection and countermeasures! The main thing is to report and then the grass won’t grow!
  60. 0
    17 March 2024 19: 58
    Until thunder strikes (and more than once) Shoigu will not order. What a brake.
    1. 0
      17 March 2024 22: 43
      and who is the main brake there?
  61. 0
    17 March 2024 20: 53
    better late than never....here I watched a video of our people shooting at Ukrainian unmanned boats. and it seemed to me that automation and cybernetwork should work on military ships, but all the shooting was from a Kalashnikov light machine gun... If only they had fired back with slingshots... (I probably shouldn’t have suggested that). There is no mechanization when traveling on our kayaks, no target detection, no collective defense, no self-defense of any kind... and the reb is also a slingshot... Our lack of mechanization in detecting targets and modern means of destruction...
  62. 0
    17 March 2024 22: 02
    Well, let's install machine guns. And we will collect for teplaki again with the whole world. The approach needs to be changed completely. The Black Sea has already become Ukrainian
  63. 0
    17 March 2024 22: 17
    Quote: Hagen
    Perhaps not healthy ambitions and fear of presenting an abnormal request to a senior commander.

    the courage of a soldier to go into battle, the courage of a commander to ask unpleasant questions and convey unsightly information to the command.
  64. -2
    17 March 2024 23: 17
    It’s time to launch airships over ships and see from binoculars that nothing is floating, since they can’t see. Well, or at least we need drones to watch the sea from
    Where are the heavy drones anyway? Just like the Americans have them and they launch them all the time, and we need good ones with optics to detect enemy drones
  65. -1
    17 March 2024 23: 17
    Additional firepower. This is an increase in staff. Was Serdyukov wasting his time in vain? belay
  66. +1
    18 March 2024 08: 40
    Two years have passed!! Two! Dear Mom, how wooden are they all?
    1. 0
      18 March 2024 08: 44
      Quote: chingachguc
      Dear Mom, how wooden are they all?

      I would say that they are OAK, but oak is a valuable type of wood. And the value of these plywood ones is very doubtful.
  67. 0
    18 March 2024 08: 43
    Less than two years have passed! wassat
    The text of your comment is too short and in the opinion of the site administration does not carry useful information.
  68. 0
    18 March 2024 11: 43
    How unexpected! Work proactively
  69. +1
    18 March 2024 12: 14
    oh, yes, not even three years have passed since things moved forward. Maybe he’ll drop by the airfield at the same time and, after 2 years of war, finally order the construction of concrete shelters for airplanes?
  70. -1
    18 March 2024 13: 01
    Not even 3 years have passed! Is there still anything left to equip? And with what? He probably sincerely believes that a couple of DShKs on board will be enough...
  71. 0
    18 March 2024 13: 31
    Those who point out that admirals should be the first to protect ships are right, but it is impossible to fundamentally solve this outrage without the liberation of Odessa and Nikolaev.
  72. +1
    18 March 2024 16: 05
    What were they thinking about before that the fleet commanders themselves couldn’t think of?
  73. +1
    18 March 2024 19: 43
    Today, as part of a working trip, Shoigu visited the command post of the Black Sea Fleet, where he heard reports from the command and officers on the current situation and the implementation of combat missions in the area of ​​​​responsibility. The minister instructed to equip the ships with additional firepower, including heavy machine guns, to repel attacks by unmanned boats of the Ukrainian Navy. In addition, Shoigu set the fleet command the task of conducting training to repel drone attacks, both during the day and at night.

    I cannot comment on this news. Because they will ban you again. NOT A SINGLE CENSORED WORD. Even prepositions, conjunctions and particles are obscene. stop
    1. 0
      20 March 2024 18: 36
      Even prepositions, conjunctions and particles are obscene.

      Yes, this is part of a series of pieces of advice for managers of all ranks and titles: “Economic growth is good, economic decline is bad.” Moreover, this is for printing, but in reality there may be completely different words.
  74. 0
    18 March 2024 22: 46
    Or maybe there is no need for warships to stand in the roadstead? Or maybe it’s cheaper to go to a base fenced with booms? Maybe it’s cheaper to remember about PDSS? Or maybe it’s cheaper and more reliable to shoot down everything that’s hovering over the Black Sea? It feels like the fleet is ceremonial, just like the Baltic...
  75. 0
    19 March 2024 00: 56
    Quote: ramzay21
    The first intelligence reports about the German attack on the USSR named the date May 15, 1941, and that the Baltic Fleet should have already started laying mines in the Baltic on May 15? Or do you think that the satellites were hanging there and the KBF monitored everything in real time, like in the movies? Why then, even now, did the Black Sea Fleet command not do anything even after civilian sailors reported a cluster of BECs at a distance of 100 km from Crimea? Did you also follow the order not to give in to provocations?

    There is such a thing as patrolling one’s communications, including by aviation. The nights in the Baltic in June are bright. There was a massive mine war less than 25 years ago...
    However, aviation is not about the current fleet, it adds force to the parade, and the plane flew by. There is no spirituality or greatness from him, a demonic piece of iron. again, pilots don’t like to wear polished boots, and the uniform doesn’t EVEN have shoulder straps.
  76. 0
    19 March 2024 08: 46
    They must be smashed from morning to morning, they must be closed off from access to the Black Sea, and for this, at a minimum, they must take everything - from Kherson to Izmail ❗❗❗
  77. 0
    19 March 2024 11: 57
    And what did the admirals not DoSuk think about this before? Or did these unmanned boats just appear yesterday?
  78. 0
    19 March 2024 12: 30
    Ah, that's how it works!! Without an order from the Minister of Defense, the armory will not even be able to open! Let Shoigu in the Aerospace Forces also give instructions to aircraft to build hangars/sheds. And protect the Crimean bridge with booms. , the entire Black Sea Fleet headquarters seems to be just extras.
  79. 0
    19 March 2024 13: 48
    It’s not a long time ago and it didn’t arise today???
    I’m wondering, when the Ukrainians launch Drones in a storm over 5 points, when the Ka 27 Helicopter doesn’t fly, what will happen? machine guns, which are not only useless in a storm, but even in pitching?
    I'm wondering if the Ukrainians are will hang Ultralight small-caliber torpedoes /see specifications!!!/ on Drones, what will happen? machine guns?
  80. 0
    21 March 2024 15: 04
    What should have been done the day before yesterday will be done the day after tomorrow. Think about it! Our military leadership is in hibernation. And the sailors, and especially the materiel, disappear with supersonic sound. The West World Cup is now out of reach for the Black Sea Fleet. There, the biggest enemy of our country has created a transport paradise for himself.