General Director of Central Design Bureau "Rubin": The Russian Navy has expressed interest in the submersible patrol ship "Strazh"

Russian fleet showed interest in the project of the submersible patrol ship "Guardian" developed by the Central Design Bureau "Rubin". This was reported by the General Director of the Central Design Bureau Igor Vilnit.

The Russian Navy is interested in the project of a submersible (diving) patrol ship, the design of which was presented by the Central Design Bureau in 2021. But to what extent this interest extends, Vilnit did not explain; he simply stated the fact itself, without any details.

This is one of the very interesting units, it should certainly occupy its niche - of course, there is interest from the Navy

- leads TASS words of the chapter "Rubin".

The design of the ship "Guardian" was shown in April 2021. The development combines the capabilities of a surface ship and a submarine, which gives great advantages over classic patrol ships. The ship was initially developed for delivery abroad under the designation BOSS (Border and Offshore Submersible Sentry). In total, two versions were developed. The first was a ship resembling the Soviet submarines of Project 613, had a displacement of about 1000 tons, a length of up to 70 meters, a crew of up to 42 people, including an inspection group. The ship housed boats for inspection groups, as well as UAVThere was no armament.

The second version of the ship with a displacement of up to 1300 tons and a length of 72 meters received a new hull with different contours that reduce radar visibility and a new engine that allows it to reach speeds of up to 21 knots. The cruising range is declared to be up to 4 thousand miles at a speed of 10 knots. This ship has the following weapons: a small-caliber automatic cannon, two launchers for guided missiles, a XNUMX-mm cannon ... missiles and four 324 mm torpedo tubes.

Comments

[Alex777]

Fir-fir. There would be no way to develop something.
Well, who would be stopped for inspection by an unarmed person?
And what is the speed of 21 knots? Who to catch up with?
The submarine with VNEU would have been finished off. And he would be
both honor and respect. And it’s even awkward to read.

[I'm mine]

In my opinion, this miracle is the most suitable for patrolling the Black Sea, from naval drones

[Alex777]

Quote: I am mine

In my opinion, this miracle is the most suitable for patrolling the Black Sea, from naval drones

Seriously? Well, tell us how you see this defense.
How will drones detect? How to destroy?
These UAVs have a speed faster than a British destroyer.

[I'm mine]

. The second version of the ship with a displacement of up to 1300 tons and a length of 72 meters received a new hull with different contours that reduce radar visibility and a new engine that allows it to reach speeds of up to 21 knots. The cruising range is declared to be up to 4 thousand miles at a speed of 10 knots. This ship has the following armament: a small-caliber automatic cannon, two launchers for guided missiles and four torpedo tubes of 324 mm caliber.

Well, everything is written at the end of the article

[Alex777]

Quote: I am mine

Well, everything is written at the end of the article

There is nothing there about means of target detection.
This is a diving ship. Where are the locators on it?
Torpedoes against UAVs - this is strong. Alas, they won’t catch up.
The better armed 22160 barely fights off the UAV.
Moreover, they do not fight, but rather fight off attacks.

[Mitrich73]

Detection is possible in echo direction finding mode, which is more effective for targets such as surface drones. These drones have a small freeboard and are made of materials that do not reflect radio waves well. The sound from high-speed boat engines travels over considerable distances.

[umah]

I am skeptical about such miracle solutions. Like a mermaid - neither a fish nor a woman. Why does a patrolman need to dive? Maybe instead of a complicated ballast system, add additional detection and destruction equipment to the ship? We already have patrol mutants of Project 22160, who were supposed to be able to do everything, but they can do nothing. Maybe enough experiments?

[Shurik70]

Quote: Alex777

Well, who would be stopped for inspection by an unarmed person?

Why "unarmed"?
It not only has torpedoes, but also missiles and a machine gun.
Another thing is why would the patrol dive at all?
The patrol's task is to quickly reach a target spotted by an aerial drone.
The submarine's task is to quietly and unnoticed sneak into a given area, do its job and get out, if possible, also unnoticed.
These are different tasks.
Wartime patrol? So clean submarines will cope with this no worse.

[I'm mine]

Unfortunately, there is no information about detection. But the submarines somehow cope. And about the depth of immersion, although he doesn’t really need depth. Five meters is enough. There you can stupidly detect it with a periscope. I'm not talking about sonar. And the pressure at five meters is only five bar. The body is light. Cheap. A full-fledged mini-submarine. Better and more secure than any watchman. Will be able to enter rivers. I see only advantages. The downside is that it’s hard to escape when flooded.

[Alex777]

Quote: I am mine

But the submarines somehow cope.

From a UAV? They can't cope.

[I'm mine]

Why would a submarine attack a UAV? Marine drones are disturbing our lives. And the bridge and the ships. The submarine's task is to be invisible and destroy naval targets. It is positioned as a submersible ship. Consider it a submarine and everything will grow together

[Nikolai Basalai]

It’s interesting how it’s written about pressure.

[I'm mine]

At sea level the pressure is normal - 1 atmospheric unit, 1 bar, 0,1 megapascal, 768 mm. rt. pillar Every meter of water exerts a pressure of 1 bar. There is a pressure of 3 bar in the water tap (and in the water heater tank, respectively). How deep do you think it is possible to immerse a water heater tank filled with air with normal pressure inside?

[Winnie76]

Quote: I am mine

Every meter of water exerts a pressure of 1 bar.

0,1 Bar

[I'm mine]

Yes, that's right. Wrong...............

[ln_ln]

"And the pressure at five meters is only five bar."
Thank God, only half a bar.
1 bar add 10 m water.
The stability of a complex-shaped shell under internal and external pressure is completely different.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Alex777

There is nothing there about means of target detection.

It’s all just speculation and a sketch on a restaurant napkin, but give you a full set of performance characteristics.

[Alex777]

Quote: Piramidon

Quote: Alex777

There is nothing there about means of target detection.

It’s all just speculation and a sketch on a restaurant napkin, but give you a full set of performance characteristics.

Have mercy! I have no use for this fantasy project.
Simple I'm mine claims it will be effective
against UAVs. Without performance characteristics. I doubted it.

[I'm mine]

Not a UAV. I immediately wrote about maritime drones. But that's not important. We're not having a referendum. It’s just that the truth is born in a dispute. Diametrically opposed points of view can be useful, not just destructive

[Zoldat_A]

Quote: Piramidon

Quote: Alex777

There is nothing there about means of target detection.

It’s all just speculation and a sketch on a restaurant napkin, but give you a full set of performance characteristics.

Considering the story with "Armata" and much more, it becomes somehow scary. Will I live to see her on TV on DB?

And, on the other hand, our smart heads in the design bureau have not yet lost the habit of their Soviet fathers to suddenly and completely surprise probable enemy. I would like to hope that with this boat there will be a surprise for the “sworn partners”.

[Captain Pushkin]

Quote: Zoldat_A

I would like to hope that with this boat there will be a surprise for the “sworn partners”.

The surprise will be great. Will such a device be of any use?

[Sergio Vo]

More likely from Japanese poachers. To suddenly take you by the ass.

[bayard]

Quote: Alex777

Fir-fir. There would be no way to develop something.

It really is such a shame. It would be better to load all the stocks with the construction of "Lada" and "Varshavyanka" in order to quickly rearm the submarine forces of the fleets. After all, the construction cycle of diesel-electric submarines is short (2,5 - 3 years), and the capacity allows it. Yes, we should have already created domestic LIABs for them, because we are already making them for electric vehicles of various classes. Yes, they would put light landing boats on stream, fortunately there are many places where landings are planned and what is needed.

Quote: Alex777

And it’s even awkward to read.

That's not the right word... It's just a shame.

[volodimer]

It looks like the Central Design Bureau just wants to knock out money for design.
They offered it to foreign customers, but when it didn’t work out, they decided to sell it to our Navy, as if that was the only thing we were missing. A patrol ship slowly creeping up on an intruder underwater?

[bayard]

Quote: volodimer

It looks like the Central Design Bureau just wants to knock out money for design.
They offered it to foreign customers, but when it didn’t work out, they decided to sell it to our Navy

In a normal state, even for trying to offer SUCH to its Navy, the head of the Central Design Bureau and his lobbyists would quickly fly off their posts and go to the Tribunal for sabotage. Especially in a country at WAR.
The popularizers of this disgrace and sabotage deserve the same fate! This is even more biting than the freaks pr. 22160 and 20386... this is generally beyond the bounds of a healthy mind.

[fiv]

21 knots for a patrol ship, I think, is quite small. And a complex design for underwater operation. Like a radio - the player is mediocre, and the radio is not very good. Only the advertising is good and the look is original. I wouldn't take it. There were already artillery submarines before the war. The topic was not developed.

[I'm mine]

He alone can cover a bridge, or the entrance to a bay, or carry out covert patrols off the coast of Odessa and Nikolaev. Looks somewhat like a zamvolt

[fiv]

You can sink a barge at the bridge with anchors. And there is no need to fuss about miracles.

[Alex777]

When it was really necessary, Ochakov was sunk. Then they raised it.

[fiv]

How would an underwater patrol guarding a bridge differ from a sunken barge? Would you shoot from an underwater machine gun?

[I'm mine]

What does he need torpedoes for? Isn’t it his destiny to surface and fire a gun? It is even easier to detect a motorboat in the water with an echolocator than radar or optics.

[Normaine]

He will find the motorboat quickly. in a surface position. visually. Google the distance of the horizon relative to the height of the observer. We subtract 10-20 percent for waves.
acoustically. Well, he will detect the sound of an engine from several kilometers away. how to determine that it is a drone and not a pleasure boat for example?
Well, that's the main problem. speed. If you believe the technical specifications that drones are surfing the Internet 2 times faster. catching up to intercept and destroy at close range will not work, and shooting at a small target at a distance is a waste of ammo.

[I'm mine]

From sea drones too?

[T.A.V.]

Wunderwaffle again. Are normal ships no longer listed?

[dump22]

What exactly is the advantage of a submersible patrol ship?
What compensates for the increased complexity and cost of such a design?

I just can't find any advantage.

[I'm mine]

The fact is that it is difficult to detect and difficult to destroy. Imagine him patrolling off the coast of Odessa or Nikolaev. Yes, and sea drones will not detect it and will not be able to attack it

[Dekabrist]

Imagine him patrolling off the coast of Odessa or Nikolaev.

Well, Odessa is okay. But Nikolaev is on the bank of a river. It's called the Southern Bug.

[I'm mine]

I think this won’t be a problem for him
It’s unlikely that they expect such meanness

[Dekabrist]

It’s unlikely that they expect such meanness

Of course they don't wait. Who in their right mind would expect a submarine to be driven into a river 2,5 meters deep? So surprise is guaranteed.

[Normaine]

with a surface height of 10 meters) quietly and inconspicuously

[dump22]

The fact is that it is difficult to detect and difficult to destroy.

Any submarine will have much better stealth.
There will always be a periscope with a snorkel sticking out above the water.
And it will always make noise with its diesel engine.
And to use weapons or launch a UAV, he will still have to surface.

[Rumata]

Quote from: dump22

I just can't find any advantage.

Cruising range is stated to be up to 4 thousand miles at a speed of 10 knots

[dump22]

So what?
And the “traditional” patrol ship of Project 22160 is up to 6 thousand miles at a speed of 16 knots.

[KVU-NSVD]

That's exactly what we were missing. Dive patrol. How fresh this is.

[Aviator_]

Rave. Very similar to the wunderwaffle of the late Khrushchev era, I think I read it from Shirokorad. The project ended with the removal of Nikita the Wonderworker. A universal device is one that does everything, but does everything poorly. I wonder if he will fly?

[I'm mine]

He only needs to dive five meters to make the enemy’s task much more difficult. It can be destroyed either by a torpedo or bombs. At sea, ships no longer have such capabilities.

[alexoff]

By the time this semi-submersible ship with low meaning is built, they will probably be able to rivet flying drones in normal numbers, which with machine guns and anti-tank guns will shoot all Ukrainian boats a hundred kilometers from our ships

[Dekabrist]

I wonder if he will fly?

Will. Ushakov’s 1934 project will be finished and it will fly.

[Dekabrist]

Very similar to the prodigy of the late Khrushchev era

Small submersible rocket ship of Project 1231.

[cat Rusich]

Quote: Aviator_

Rave. Very similar to the wunderwaffle of the late Khrushchev era, I think I read it from Shirokorad. The project ended with the removal of Nikita the Wonderworker.

Project 1231 "Dolphin" 1959-64.
Performance characteristics at the level of the 60s

Quote: Aviator_

A universal device is one that does everything, but does everything poorly. I wonder if he will fly?

LPL Ushakova 1934-38 The project did not go beyond the drawings due to poor underwater performance.
My opinion...
In the event that the conversation is about patrol boat with airborne inspection group on board - something needs to be improved PSKR pr 133 "Antares"

Built 12 boats (plant in Feodosia) 1975-93, in Russia the last Antares was decommissioned in 2009...

[I'm mine]

His trick is that he walks underwater. Otherwise, what is its uniqueness? There are already enough different boats

[Dart]

Antares-Vesch! A project that complies with the technical specifications. And the underframe smells like a saw cut..
project development -

[Aviator_]

Project 1231 "Dolphin" 1959-64

Thank you for the specification, the timing of the development of the project is precisely the period of convulsions of Khrushchev Kukuruzny after the defeat of the aviation and navy, together with the creation of economic councils and the extension of the next five-year plan to a seven-year plan.

[Normaine]

about flying - already happened) the famous ekranoplan

[Valery_3]

Serious cutting of babosiks is biting, keep it up

[Codett]

I don’t think that this project is suitable for patrolling, one of the main things is speed, even if they install a gun, then increasing the underwater speed of movement is problematic, and what kind of surface seaworthiness will it be? In general, all this is very similar to a waste of resources.

[I'm mine]

It will be slightly more expensive than a patrol ship, but will be better protected from any type of attack. He does not need to withstand pressure of 700 atmospheres. Just be below the level. That's all

[Repellent]

Quote: I am mine

pressure of 700 atmospheres

Are you talking about the Mariana Trench, perhaps? No one in their right mind seems to be diving at 7 km these days.

[I'm mine]

Yes, I was ten times wrong
I've already been told. People in their right minds don’t dive, but ours seemed to dive at 700 meters

[Normaine]

You know that for 0th buoyancy you need to greatly reduce the surface buoyancy? or make a huge ballast system (which is not particularly smart). which means a hole that a classic ship can survive can be fatal for this creation.

[Codett]

The fact is that it is positioned as a patrol ship, and how will it intercept violators? 21 knots are not that slow; fishing trawlers usually develop from 11 to 16 knots (I’m talking about Soviet ones, I don’t know about modern ones). Project 22460 patrol ships sail at maximum it seems like 28 knots, and the Border Patrol Boats of Project 12200 are 47 knots, there is also the question of what speed will be economical for this miracle, in general I have a lot of questions about this project, I don’t think that the main thing here is that it is well protected, the main thing is that it fulfills the main task .

[Boa kaa]

During the war, the entire border service becomes subordinate to the Navy. PSKRs became patrol boats... Well, what kind of "patron ship" is made from a semi-submersible without weapons at a speed of 21 knots!?
In pursuit of a futuristic form, one must not forget about the content: neither air defense nor anti-aircraft defense can organize such a miracle even for itself, not to mention covering the forces of the fleet or transports.
Rave! And they have someone else, damn it, “interested” in this! (Perverts...LGBT people from shipbuilding, no less! )

[Aviator_]

(Perverts...LGBT people from shipbuilding, no less!

[I'm mine]

Who can currently threaten him in the Black Sea and with what? Finding it is already a problem. It can attack a drone or a boat from an underwater position, and not a single dill will guess who sent it to the bottom. They'll blame it on some storm

[BMP-2]

Invisible patrol? Well I do not know. I always believed that the main functions of a patrol are to control the perimeter and prevent its breakthrough by the very fact of its presence. But being in an ambush is no longer a function of a patrol, but of a secret.

[SovAr238A]

Well, these submersible ships are nonsense.
Nonsense.
And the fact that the general director signed up for this nonsense means that he is already out of his mind, senile.
These are immediately sprayed.

[solar]

And the fact that the general director signed up for this nonsense means that he is already out of his mind, senile.

I wouldn't rush to draw such a conclusion. Perhaps it's all simpler - he just knows how to make money on this "megaproject"

[Chief Officer Lom]

This submersible ship is very similar to a World War II submarine, with a missile launcher instead of a hangar for the Japanese I-400 aircraft carriers or a main battery tower for the French Surcouf.

[pop]

This ship must be sent down the Dnieper to the Kyiv Sea, enter the lock and blow up the doors. There won't be a catastrophe, but we will drain all the reservoirs. Zelie will have big problems.

[Normaine]

interesting - how to lower it like that? on the surface?

[Vashek]

Does he sometimes not fly for an hour?

[I'm mine]

Once for sure he can

[Ross xnumx]

Yes...Flying tanks were also in demand at one time...
What about the ekranoplan? There the speed is 400-450 km/h (not every UAV can catch up). You can add some air defense module and select weapons according to the topic...
I don `t want? Or are the brains aimed purely at cutting? To create ideas without implementation? To invent concepts...The most important thing:

The Russian Navy is interested in the project of a submersible (diving) patrol ship, the design of which was presented by the Central Design Bureau in 2021. But to what extent does this interest extend? Vilnit did not explain

and did not name the names of the interested parties.

[Knell wardenheart]

The idea is a failure and completely untimely. Looks like a potentially gorgeous cut.

[Vitaly Koisin]

In the original they even ingenuously write that this supposedly can also “be used for training of our own anti-submarine forces and training of crews of classic submarines” :)

https://ckb-rubin.ru/mediacentr/novosti_i_sobytija/novost/news/detail/News/strazh_20_novyi_oblik_bolshe_vozmozhnostei/

[al3x]

I've seen the wonders of technology, but for something like this...

[Oleg Apushkin]

A strange object, a hybrid of pure water. The fleet knows better.

[Graz]

in my opinion it's some kind of nonsense

[AlexanderBrv]

The idea of ​​Japanese aircraft-carrying submarines of the I-400 type (carriers of the Aichi E16A1 Seiran attack floatplanes, which never took part in real combat operations) is back on the agenda. In modern conditions, it is not difficult to implement this project. The question is in the effectiveness of ships of this kind, the correspondence between costs and returns in real affairs (without an aviation component, in the form of UAVs, in the weapons complex here it is clearly impossible to do, and loitering munitions would also be useful).

[Vladimir_2U]

There is a fully developed EP with a displacement of 380 tons with a reasonable cost, seaworthy, very lifting for its tonnage, no, some kind of project in the spirit of white submarines needs to be made...

[sub307]

Oh...I wouldn’t want to serve on such a “vessel”. It is reassuring that most likely this miracle of engineering will remain in the project.

[Igor K]

Looks like a Zumvelt, reminiscent of an open budget cut.

[Gomunkul]

General Director of Central Design Bureau "Rubin": The Russian Navy has expressed interest in the submersible patrol ship "Strazh"

I read the article and for some reason I remembered the lyrics to a children’s cartoon:

Samovaro - steam locomotive - aircraft
Poems by Yu. Moritz
Music by S. Nikitin
Samovaro - steam locomotive - aircraft,
He flies, whistles, puffs and gives tea,
He flies across the sky and whistles,
And he boils tea for Dusya and Vasya,
Samovaro - steam locomotive - aircraft!
He flies across the sky and whistles,
And he boils tea for Dusya and Vasya,
He flies, whistles, puffs and gives tea,
Samovaro - steam locomotive - aircraft!
He boils tea for Dusya and Vasya,
He flies to himself, whistles and is not sad.
He will pour tea for everyone who flies past
Samovaro - steam locomotive - aircraft!
There are many taps and wheels
Samovaro - wind plane - steam locomotive,
Steam locomotive – wind plane – samovar
Flapping its wings, releasing warm steam,
Warms the audience, dances and sings
Samovaro - steam locomotive - aircraft!
November 1981, XNUMX

[lynnot]

No way, S.K. Dzhevetsky’s “water-armored destroyer” was rethought and the trendy design was changed?

As in the old joke: Whatever they don’t do at Rubin, it still turns out to be a submarine...

[acetophenone]

I don’t even know how to comment on such work. As I understand it, these guys will do anything to avoid doing what needs to be done.

[Wayfarer_2]

Well, an unarmed barge needs another cover ship. Therefore, such a barge can be exported. If there is some donkey to buy it. And another one, which has a speed of 21 knots, will also go for export. Why does the Russian Navy need such a turtle with a pre-war (WWII) speed? This is not a patrol ship. Because a patrol ship should have a speed of at least 40 knots. And a cruising one - 32-35. And this "miracle of progress" will not even catch up with a Japanese or Korean fishing schooner.

[lynnot]

Apparently, according to the plan, this miracle should be in an underwater position, such as periscope depth, and when an intruder appears, who does not have any means of observation and detection, it should suddenly emerge right in front of him.

[spectr]

If it works, it will only be for sabotage. But then we need to make a hybrid of these two projects.

[cast iron]

Again they came up with some fabulous useless bullshit.

[BorzRio]

Purely logically - a patrol ship. The task is to patrol some coastal zone. Why does it need to dive?! And torpedoes? Who is it going to patrol from with a maximum speed of 21 knots?! Submerge for what? Sit in ambush, surface and drive someone away with its appearance?! For diving, most of the useful space on board is occupied by specialized equipment and ballast tanks. Useless for patrolling. Degenerates, in a word. It would be better to think about how to make a combat unit well protected from missiles and surface underwater drones from our fleet, and not just expensive surface launchers for Kalibrs. They should develop modern missile defense systems for ships. There are no words.

[huggi]

Everything is fine, the Navy just wants to make money by selling such prodigies to South American smugglers.

[AlexWar]

We need to try it, look at the pros and cons of this weapon. Even a couple of pieces would be normal. Moreover, the APU can only be seen from above; they no longer see under water.

[notingem]

Complete nonsense. It’s better to fence off the whole sea and install cameras

[notingem]

Japanese poachers; OH THE RAPIST HAS HAPPENED