Military Review

And again about footcloths: the new minister is against

170
The main news of the last days, connected with the Russian armed forces, became the next plans of the Ministry of Defense in respect of uniforms. On January 14, Minister S. Shoigu announced that by the end of the current 2013, a piece of clothing called footcloth will go to history, and the army will move to more modern and perfect "clothes" for the soldiers' legs. At first glance, new messages regarding the form and related things have already become familiar and expected. But for a number of reasons, the dispute over the expediency and necessity of just footcloths over the past years is one of the main topics discussed at various levels. In the current “confrontation”, supporters of the footwomen and socks lovers have a sufficient number of arguments and therefore do not rush to recognize their point of view as erroneous.


And again about footcloths: the new minister is against


Within just a few hours after the Minister’s statements, a mass of comments of one kind or another appeared. Some officials, experts and representatives of the general public support the “decommissioning” of women’s footwear, the other part doubts that this can be done in the foreseeable future, and a third group who commented on such actions against such actions. In general, such opinions were expected. The fact is that over the past few years, attempts have been made to transfer the army to new shoes and related uniforms. However, for a number of reasons, changing boots and footwear for shoes and socks, firstly, did not reach the desired volumes, and secondly, did not bring the desired effect.

Thus, in the hands of supporters of the traditional approach to uniforms, involving the winding of footcloths, there was another argument against change. In addition, in practice, often there is an unpleasant situation caused by the "incompatibility" of socks and boots. Due to a number of characteristic features of the latest socks, even the so-called. tracking, can quickly break, which does not contribute to the convenience of wearing, especially in military conditions. As a result, the refusal of footcloths should lead to the removal of circulation and boots.

It is noteworthy that the boots and footcloths were excluded from the list of permanent elements of the uniform of military personnel several years ago. However, this exception in fact was only bureaucratic. For a variety of reasons, these elements of uniforms are preserved and are still used. At the same time, the activity of their use is constantly decreasing. The defense budgets of recent years provided for additional costs for the transition of the army to new shoes and socks. Thus, the recent statements by the Minister of Defense do not seem to promise a total ban on the old elements of uniforms, but they set a specific time frame, which should be taken into account when completing the long-term work of the supply services for the transition from footcloths to socks.

Perhaps the main problem in the situation with the abandonment of boots and footwear is the financial aspect of the case. Due to the size of the armed forces personnel, the purchase of a new form element, even with its low price, ultimately leaves the state in fairly large expenses. In particular, this is why the withdrawal of the footcloths began not today or yesterday. An additional problem of financial and supply character is the presence in the warehouses of the armed forces of just a huge amount of shoes already produced. At the start of the “shoe conversion”, the total number of boots in warehouses was estimated at 2,8-3 million pairs. After the cessation of purchases of new shoes, over the past five to six years, the soldiers did not manage to demolish even half of these stocks. So it turns out that after giving up a pair of footcloth-boots, a considerable amount of old army shoes will be useless to anyone, and the financial costs of previous years for its purchase will be in vain.

To overcome the financial difficulties of transition to new elements of uniforms offered in the easiest way. According to Minister Shoigu, additional funds will be allocated to complete the transition. Judging by the required volumes of deliveries, the period of complete abandonment of boots and footwear in practice can move significantly. However, the leadership of the Ministry of Defense seems determined to be determined and will do everything possible to get rid of the traditional but claiming footcloths as soon as possible.

Regardless of the actual timing of the full transition to socks and shoes, the debate about the feasibility of this decision will continue. Consider the arguments of both sides. Perhaps the most controversial evidence of the need for footcloths and boots are fabrications about traditions. Of course, the last two centuries, the Russian, Soviet, and again the Russian army used only such items of clothing, but economic reasons were the main reason for this. Two pieces of fabric cost much less than a pair of knitted items. At the same time, the vitality of this item of clothing is due to several positive qualities. For example, washing and drying footcloths is much easier than similar procedures for socks. In addition, there is the possibility of simultaneous washing a large number of footcloths without the subsequent need for any additional sorting apart from division into pairs.

Thanks to the uniform form of footcloths, all military personnel are suitable for use, regardless of their foot size. Also, simple pieces of fabric allow the fighter to wear larger shoes without any problems: with proper winding, all gaps are occupied by a footcloth. Finally, the manufacture of footcloths is an extremely simple process: an existing cut of suitable fabric is taken and cut into pieces of the same size. It does not require any sewing accessories: footcloth is traditionally done without seams and overlapping edges, which additionally protects the foot from possible injuries.

However, the traditional army footcloth is not without flaws. First of all, this is the complexity of “putting on”. Unlike a sock, footcloth is tied in a special way, and then suitable for use. This process takes a little more time than putting on socks, and at the same time requires special treatment. So, when the winding on the footcloth is not tight enough, folds can form, which can later lead to chafing and other unpleasant injuries. In addition, there is a method of quickly shoeing boots with footclothes, called "envelope". It takes much less time, but you have to pay for such a gain with convenience and consequences: because of a different arrangement of the fabric inside the boot, you don’t have much time to do so. Finally, in certain cases, there may be problems with wearing footwear and shoes, which also does not add to the soldier’s comfort and does not contribute to an increase in combat effectiveness.

It seems that several years ago, after weighing all the advantages and disadvantages of both “leg outfits” options, the Russian military came to the conclusion that there are great prospects for the shoe-toes option. Well, judging by the last words of the minister, this time the case will be brought to an end. In this case, it is worth considering the possible problems of completing the transition, as well as issues that will arise before the Ministry of Defense after the complete abandonment of footclothes and boots. Both before and after the completion of all these activities the quality of shoes and socks will be the main problem. The armed forces, being a large and numerous formation with demands for uniformity of form, should be ready to pay a considerable sum of re-training. Even with mass production, significantly reducing costs, the cost of a pair of decent shoes will not be lower than the price of a pair of boots. In addition, it is necessary to consider a financial policy regarding socks. Like any textile product, socks wear out, break and become unusable.

Thus, it is necessary to develop an approach to the replacement of these items of clothing. The most efficient and financially optimal approach is when the army purchases decent tracking socks with a corresponding service life. Depending on the material and manufacturer of a pair of such socks can cost from 70-80 rubles and above. This is much more expensive than the footcloths, but there will be no problems with the “compatibility” of socks and shoes. In addition, high-quality socks should not be some kind of accountable subject, which is supposed to be issued for a certain period without regard to wear, but, if I may say so, consumable so that the soldier does not need to constantly repair socks while waiting for the issuance of a new pair. Of course, with all the convenience of such an approach to security will be much more expensive than the existing one. But at the same time there will be an obvious benefit in the form of wearing comfort. Naturally, subject to the correct execution of all relevant instructions.

It is easy to see that the most convenient way to put socks into circulation will entail significant changes in the structure of supply services. It will be necessary to rebuild some mechanisms, as well as especially to monitor possible corruption schemes. Transferring socks to the category of an almost uncontrollable expendable material can attract the attention of various bad personalities like ensigns from anecdotes. Thus, the transition to new elements of uniforms will also require the involvement of supervisory structures, such as the military prosecutor's office. True, before the final transfer of socks to “consumables” for some time, these items of clothing will, for obvious reasons, be supplied in insufficient quantities, due to which the suppliers, some officers and ordinary soldiers may receive an additional “headache”.

The transition period, during which footcloths and boots will be replaced with socks and shoes, will definitely have a not very nice look. As always happens in such cases, the expected problems will fully manifest themselves, and also, most likely, new ones will appear. All these troubles, naturally, will not be ignored and will become another reason for renewing disputes about the prospects for this or that type of footwear and things to be crooked under it. Nevertheless, judging by the intentions of the Ministry of Defense, all these disputes will remain discussions or swearing without any real consequences. The military leadership of the country nevertheless decided to update the uniforms of the armed forces and is ready for various negative consequences of various kinds accompanying any major changes.

Based on the rather bold statements of the Minister of Defense S. Shoigu about the complete abandonment of the footcloths by the end of the current 2013 year, one can make an assumption that the military department has some kind of plan, according to which all transformations and transitions to the new elements will be completed uniforms. Probably, some similar plans were before, under the previous minister. However, judging by all the events around the soldiers' shoes and the uniform as a whole, the previous leadership of the Ministry of Defense simply did not have time to complete all the planned transformations. Now, it seems, the ministry’s leadership intends to complete all changes, as well as correct all existing errors and prevent the emergence of new ones. However, one should not forget that it is not so easy to transfer all the remaining parts from footcloths to socks, and this is not a quick thing. So in the very near future there will be new reasons for the renewal of old disputes.

On the materials of the sites:
http://ria.ru/
http://rg.ru/
http://rkka.ru/
http://twower.livejournal.com/
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  1. Kadet_KRAK
    Kadet_KRAK 16 January 2013 09: 07
    +15
    Wore in the Army and socks with boots and footcloths with boots, the conclusion is affirmative - the footcloth is better. But I agree with the author "Based on the rather bold statements of the Minister of Defense S. Shoigu about the complete rejection of footcloths by the end of the current 2013, it can be assumed that the military department has some kind of plan, according to which all transformations and work will be completed on the transition to new items of uniform. " This is obvious and I am sure that Shoigu will not break the wood, unlike his predecessor.
    1. Hon
      Hon 16 January 2013 09: 26
      +20
      Boots must first be purchased in good quality, and then they should end up from the footcloths, otherwise the soldiers would not have to wear boots with socks.
      1. beech
        beech 16 January 2013 12: 01
        +14
        I personally am against the abolition of footcloths. The father says this is the most universal thing in which you can complete the entire service without problems, and the next stop will remain) as for convenience: father says: again, there is no better footcloth — you got wet your foot — put on your footcloth on the back side, cheap — in warehouses it’s enough for a hundred years ahead, very durable, will fit under any leg, which can’t be said about socks
        1. Genry
          Genry 16 January 2013 12: 53
          -7
          Well, here's another "rumored" defender appeared.
          Know the weight of the footcloths? Just add this weight to your feet and run or walk a day.
          And then you’ll dream of a sock boot.
          Footcloth is an anachronism with an increased consumption of natural material, the price of which is growing every year.
          1. Hon
            Hon 16 January 2013 14: 14
            +9
            Quote: Genry
            Well, here's another "rumored" defender appeared.
            Know the weight of the footcloths? Just add this weight to your feet and run or walk a day.
            And then you’ll dream of a sock boot.
            Footcloth is an anachronism with an increased consumption of natural material, the price of which is growing every year.

            Poor-poor soldiers barely move their legs because of the severity of the footcloths, what are the loads !!! laughing Footcloths are in any case cheaper than the simplest socks, and much slower wear out.
          2. merkel1961
            merkel1961 16 January 2013 14: 45
            +8
            But how did we in physicists in summer boots then hand over, cross, a horizontal bar, five times a coup lift, a complex on bars, etc. Put on shoes at that time, anyone would become a master of sports in running.
          3. biglow
            biglow 16 January 2013 17: 02
            +7
            Genry,
            I walked and ran in footcloths without having to take it off for days. Often I put on my footcloths with an accelerated method without winding. And there were no problems.
          4. bandabas
            bandabas 16 January 2013 18: 41
            +3
            Weight is normal. In kirsa he knocked down his leg only once, first and last. After that, he perfectly learned how to wind footcloths. Shoes ...- a thing beautiful, comfortable, but. It is normal shoes + normal socks + socks change at least daily. But in general, the question is to the Defense Ministry comrade, well, to the FoMans, respectively. Internal Service Charter: 341. The hardening of military personnel should be carried out systematically and continuously by the integrated use of water, solar and air factors in combination with physical training and sports.
            The main methods of hardening military personnel are:
            daily exercise in the open air;
            washing to the waist with cold water or taking a short cold shower;
            rinsing the throat with cold water, as well as washing your feet with cold water before hanging out;
            conducting ski training and occupations in winter, performing some work in lightweight clothing;
            conducting physical training classes and sporting events in lightweight clothing in the summer, sunbathing and swimming in open water during free time from classes and work and on rest days.
            Everything was always clear, except for gargling with cold water. Well. if Mr. Shoigu is guided by this charter, then to the ban on singing songs on the parade ground he must cancel and physical exercises in the open air will catch a cold.
          5. st.lt
            st.lt 18 January 2013 22: 15
            +2
            wore it wonderfully at the training ground for months, my legs did not fall off (I wore it under the boot). Until the "smart generals", the AP of Ukraine did not replace footcloths with socks (2 pairs of socks for a year)
        2. Pimply
          Pimply 16 January 2013 22: 02
          +3
          Have you ever worn good army socks?
      2. merkel1961
        merkel1961 16 January 2013 14: 38
        +7
        Correctly! I judge for myself: in my four years of study I have never rubbed my feet with a set of footcloths, I had to put my limpers on my socks before graduating at Gosy in an officer field, I immediately rubbed my heel. Socks, if only for sneakers!
        1. Pimply
          Pimply 16 January 2013 22: 03
          0
          I repeat the question asked to the comrade above - did they ever wear normal army socks?
          1. nerd.su
            nerd.su 17 January 2013 03: 38
            +2
            No. I want to try everything. Advise. I hope you can buy them? Or is it a military secret? :)
            1. dmitreach
              dmitreach 17 January 2013 15: 44
              0
              try buying socks for more than 10 rubles 10 pairs ...
              for example these.
              [img] http://www.splav.ru/viewbig.aspx?gid=20080221165544173518&num=1 [/ img]
            2. dmitreach
              dmitreach 17 January 2013 15: 49
              +2
              try buying socks for more than 10 rubles / 10 pairs ...
              for example these. RUB 85 far from the most ideal option. You just don't always need expensive socks. Even a special forces soldier does not 360 days a year, in the mountains at -10C, after 30 km it freezes. Sometimes it is worth buying something for both 700 rubles and 1000 rubles. (Thermosocks, but use it not "on the march", but as a heating for tired legs "in the camp") Experiment! Google to help you. And no need to talk about the fact that it is expensive .. To live according to any is more expensive.
              Somewhere in the comments, I read the thought about two types of serving people: lovers of freebies and contentment and those who prefer to buy themselves, high-quality, but for the money.
              forgive me moderators for not intentional advertising
              Composition:
              76% cotton
              16% PA
              7% spandex
              1% elastane
            3. Pimply
              Pimply 17 January 2013 23: 57
              0
              Google banned you? Look for the collapse of sales of army uniforms, say, the armies of the United States or Israel.
              1. nerd.su
                nerd.su 19 January 2013 03: 25
                +1
                You are discussing such a practical issue as socks / footcloths and boots / berets based on what Google tells you? :))
      3. Hauptmann emil
        Hauptmann emil 16 January 2013 17: 45
        +4
        Quote: Hon
        Boots must first be purchased in good quality, and then they should end up from the footcloths, otherwise the soldiers would not have to wear boots with socks.

        Absolutely agree. We can do it anyway.
        And also what to do with boots and other ammunition "riveted" in huge quantities? In 2008 he went to the military registration and enlistment office for a young replenishment. soldier's belts issued in 1978. Hats are also from the 90s, I generally keep quiet about duffel bags. Do not throw away all this "good". And keeping it in warehouses without updating is also not an option - it will fall apart from time to time. You just need to correctly replace it. For example, combat units - airborne forces, motorized rifles, etc. first of all, but "not very combat" (I do not want to offend anyone) will change their clothes later.
        In addition, you can sell to all kinds of companies - construction workers.

        And I have a positive attitude towards footcloths. Because they better protect the feet than the sock. If only they would have been issued not by 1 pair for a week, but by 2 pairs, then in general everything would be excellent. Himself upon dismissal scored a dozen winter and summer footcloths. Not even half was used up. Although I constantly reel them in fishing and in the country.
        1. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 35
          +2
          Soldier belts were issued in 1978. Hats are also 90s,
          Familiar rocketeer, ate meat of shaggy year. (I saw a stamp on the carcass, it was in the 90s, I ate almost 50s. maybe I joked like that)
          Here are just a nuance: at that time they stockpiled everything from the calculation of a global war such as the Second World War. That within a month to call up to 20 million people under arms ...
          1. adolph1
            adolph1 16 January 2013 23: 22
            +2
            About meat is true! In 2008, he unloaded the carcasses with a 1989 stamp. No one got into trouble.
      4. dmitreach
        dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 07
        +6
        Sudars, let's decide on the subject of the dispute. About the Army. What army does Russia need? An army with supplies from ideologically-savvy Wehrmacht spies? Which, to our soldiers, is given, for ideological reasons, shoes of the wrong size. And they buy so cheap and imperfect goods that they manage to sponsor their ideological war at the expense of stolen funds! Stop flogging nonsense! Otherwise, a bathing day in the army will be more profitable than showers built in the barracks. For once a week to wash, more economical in terms of consumption of official soap - 6 times! I'm not talking about the massive construction of showers ... Normal logic?

        So: if we are talking about an army of the USSR with a shitty supply, then I have to admit: for a boot (boot) crippling a soldier's leg (in view of his technological primitivism, rough skin and "iron" seams) - footcloths are a panacea and no alternative.

        If we are talking about an effective army, with a satisfactory supply (satisfactory, I emphasize), then the first thing you should refuse in the dispute is: from the mention of shoes that cripples the fighter. All these stories about the effectiveness of footcloths send us back to the century when they were not able to sew shoes according to the price / quality / mass criteria, in view of the perfection of technological lines! This is now possible.
        The footcloth is not suitable for modern footwear in which you can walk BOOSOF for a long time. And there are such shoes. Not expensive by the way. Not suitable, because it is sewn according to orthopedic templates, taking into account the fullness and width of the foot. To pull such shoes on a footcloth, you need to have a size margin. Not one athlete will wear shoes without "picking up on the foot". Do we need such an army (athletic, physically developed), or an army in modern analogues of "bast shoes" (a product made of tarpaulin), with lame soldiers?
        Expensive? Pretentious words about "feeding someone else's army" I will mention in passing.
        The future appearance of the Russian army implies not a large number of conscripts, in comparison with the scale of the USSR, which prepares up to 20 million under arms. people in the event of a global war. 300 thousand recruits (they are striving for this by 2020), against this background, is not such a lifting figure. Contractors who devote their lives to the service, even with "allowance", will still "vote" with their wallet! I'm not saying that this is correct, it’s just how life shows. Even in the army of rich countries, this is the case. This is normal.
        If a country cannot put shoes on a soldier, then it will "put on" (throw, steal) him during the war. As it was in the First Chechen. We need such an army, when a soldier takes off both the radio station and the shoes from the militant as a trophy? Or can Russia still afford to buy underpants / socks / soap / ammunition for a fighter?

        By the way, we have not yet discussed the blue testicles vs boxer shorts and the number of shooters, our three rounds, from a machine gun in the 90s.
    2. Ghenxnumx
      Ghenxnumx 16 January 2013 11: 01
      +9
      Quote: Kadet_KRAK
      He wore socks with boots and footcloths with boots in the Army, the conclusion is affirmative - footcloth is better.

      For tarpaulin, yuft boots - undoubtedly only a footcloth. Only now it is time to switch to modern boots with an internal seasonal stocking (at their cost price 2 times more expensive, which completely competes with the pickaxes), which practically excludes the wearing of footcloths.
      1. the polar
        the polar 16 January 2013 12: 47
        +14
        But you try on alarm that berets worn laced with socks or boots with footcloths are faster.
        In addition, for the Airborne Forces for military intelligence and units making large transitions and frequent marching, boots with footcloths will remain indispensable, as well as for service in the northern latitudes.
        Let the cops and riot police in boots shkandybayut they have nowhere to rush
        1. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 40
          -2
          lace up the berets, pulled on a sock, will take the same time, how to wind a footcloth and put your foot in a boot. that's just modern berets I sometimes wear on my bare foot and not tying. Poddolbaisky. for they are not a tarpaulin; they do not fall from their feet and do not rub. technologies...
          and if you put on slowly, you can get confused and "packing the folds of the leg", because there are seams, and this time ...
          for quick lacing, I made one lace "diagonal". that is, he darned with one lace, and the other just pulled up. it's fast enough.
          1. nerd.su
            nerd.su 17 January 2013 04: 11
            +1
            Quote: dmitreach
            that's just modern berets I sometimes wear on my bare foot and not tying.

            What is this miracle called? And by the way, how much does it cost?
            1. Hon
              Hon 17 January 2013 08: 31
              +1
              Quote: bot.su
              What is this miracle called? And by the way, how much does it cost?

              There are many firms, and the price of 3,5 thousand starts.
            2. dmitreach
              dmitreach 17 January 2013 15: 18
              +1
              nerd.su, Are you seriously asking or are you simply not interested in what the market for goods is?
              I am of the opinion that slippers by season and occupation should be different. That acquired in the summer subcautious (leon-iv so called them) "Tropic" mod.3351 olives. firm Buteks. (I think Belarus) I took it for hiking in the heat-heat. I ran in them in the park, instead of sneakers. They are somewhat similar to a cross between a sneaker and an ankle, only the sole is thicker and with a metal instep support. Weigh half a kilo! 1600 RUR (discount, since 1750) Last fall I was on an expedition for 4 weeks. I took them as sneakers, as a shift. As a result, he wore them, with rare exceptions, he wore rubber boots. Slept in them. In the heat, the leg does not shrink, as in leather ankle boots. In the camp I dragged on my bare feet. He could go all day without lacing and without socks. For laziness, for at times3,14-ki, for the socks were drying up. Che them in the camp to carry, if the weather permits? (autumn was still, although it was warm and dry, but still autumn) In the cold I used a warm woolen sock or thermal sock. (of course there were always spare ones with you)
              Among the shortcomings: cloth and nubuck are more difficult to clean (dried clay), in comparison with a cream and a brush.
              At +5, the earth sucks heat through the sole. (they’re still summer), but there is no reserve for the polyurethane insole, because they were selected in the size of the legs.
              Quickly get wet, but in combination with a thermal sock, quickly dry on the foot. (in the fall for 4 hours if the weather is dry). For the showers and swamps were boots.
              It is necessary to use silicone impregnation. (the infection costs money)
              Please note that these slippers are not designed for the cold season! However...
              For a month of active socks in the forests (and before that in the conditions of civilization), they did not lose their presentation. Neither shoes nor legs.
              In general, for 1600 it’s problematic to find something, but for 3000r you can pick up an interesting shoe model that will suit the commandos. And it’s not necessary to take the expensive Corcoran, although if you love the brand, then the excellent option.
              1. nerd.su
                nerd.su 17 January 2013 17: 31
                +1
                Seriously, I was interested in the phrase "I wear it on my bare leg and do not tie it." Well, if you carry it in the camp, then it's understandable. But I can wear tarpaulin boots in such conditions on bare feet. Although it depends on what to do :) And short tarpaulin boots, albeit with artificial fur, used instead of slippers in winter in the bulk farm.
                And I'm interested in many ways because I don't want to overpay for brands, and special shoes are needed all the time, not as a military special forces soldier, but as, in some way, a civilian "special forces")
                In the army, I wore boots with footcloths and was not at all upset. You can’t cover everything with your experience, therefore I am interested in those who use it.
                Here's an example tip
                thermal socks, but use it not "on the march", but as a heating for tired legs "in the camp"
                - option. I somehow did not think about it, because I am skeptical about things with the prefix "thermo" because of the discrepancy between price / quality during normal use. Thermosocks fail on the "march" smile at the same speed as ordinary ones, and any sweating and other bells and whistles there are not noticeable during long transitions. But in bivy conditions it’s worth a try, not in the 19th century we live.
                1. dmitreach
                  dmitreach 17 January 2013 19: 58
                  0
                  In every joke, like a gritsa ....
                  Somehow I will have a desire, on a dare, to run at least a three-ruble note in them, on a bare foot ... I strongly recommend that you investigate in detail the topic of "trekking shoes", because Western standards of army shoes tend to this phenomenon. The phenomenon when new shoes DO NOT cripple the fighter's leg. For us it is still - NEW. request
                  In non-laced boots you can only walk around freely (all of a sudden you step on the lace laughing !), when there is no need to rush anywhere or to correct the situation before the first opportunity. When, for example, you dust from the river to the camp, and go barefoot to the scrap, for a couple of kilometers on pebbles. In kirzach boots, this will not work. In them, the leg will dangle, which is the reason for the rubbing. Maybe in trampled kirzach-ankle boots, matched in size, and that is unlikely. They are also very conventionally sewn. I have never been able to pick up a product made of kersey (leatherette) on my leg. (I bought the first when I was 14 years old, I don't remember exactly, I barely found the size ...) I think it's about the "generalized patterns" by which the blanks are cut, for cheap shoes and the rigidity of the tarpaulin itself. Hence, "epic troublesome wear". Moreover, as far as I remember, they didn’t have a soft, fabric lining. All the same, the tarpaulin - originally consumer goodsreplacing expensive skin. On cheap material, they will not bother with the number of seams and parts, so that the configuration of the legs is repeated ...

                  In my youth, on fishing / hunting, I even used polyethylene with socks. Nonsense, of course, but then buying something was more problematic than today. What a blessing that the effect of a "thermos", in our time, can be achieved in a simpler and more reliable way ... It looked like a perversion: you put a bag (soft polyethylene) on your leg, under a woolen sock and also cotton on top to "pull together" and the wool was not rubbed in vain. (all "the other way around") Wet, not pleasant, but the temperature of the "humid environment" 36 and 6 while you stomp. And most importantly, the woolen and cotton sock is dry! If you don’t dive into puddles up to your waist ... It’s important that your shoes are also in size. Drying wool is extremely problematic in cold weather! At the halt, a mandatory inspection. Thin polyethylene does not last long and you need care for your feet. You wipe your feet dry, treat your foot with baby powder (from diaper rash, because the leg is "boiled", there may be chafing due to steamed skin and salts contained in sweat) and bask in a dry and warm wool sock. Just remember that it's terribly bad for the legs. Don't breathe. But you don't need to dry your woolen socks.
                  And what was my surprise when, quite recently, I deduced that the conquerors of the poles did so ... (only they don’t have bags there, but special socks that hold evaporation, similar to polyethylene) so that the inner layer in the boots would not be damp. They are not heated where.
                  This I mean that the situations are different and there are many ways. We need to experiment and forget about "modern bast shoes". Let the stock in the General Staff of the Ministry of Defense be demolished, or even better sold to the Tajik army, but they buy normal shoes. Not from a cheap tarpaulin, we don't need to put on a quarter of the country.
        2. Dikremnij
          Dikremnij 16 January 2013 21: 51
          +2
          Yeah, and you put on tarpaulin boots, put on a parachute and jump from 800 m. After all, the boots with lacing were designed primarily for the Airborne. I know that they will start throwing me right now: these are now no young landings, just a year of service, etc. My answer is: in the years 60-63, my grandfather served in the Air Force, in the PDS of one of the air regiments and told how, when jumping, they tied their boots to the belt using second-hand parachute lines.
          1. dmitreach
            dmitreach 16 January 2013 22: 01
            0
            yet I am generally against boots in the army. except rubber for fishing, or leather, for rock & roll music lovers bully
            wow, fig yourself 26 680 rub ...... Ankle boots Bogner .....

            1. dmitreach
              dmitreach 16 January 2013 22: 14
              0
              or such. I would buy.
            2. Hon
              Hon 16 January 2013 22: 30
              +1
              These are model shoes, beautifully but in the field they will quickly become worthless.
              1. dmitreach
                dmitreach 16 January 2013 22: 33
                0
                it's a joke like that. wink
          2. st.lt
            st.lt 18 January 2013 22: 29
            0
            Dikremnij,
            Quote: Dikremnij
            and you put on tarpaulin boots, put on a parachute and jump from 800 m.

            he made the first three jumps! the boots didn’t fly away (the footcloth helped), and yes, they tie them, and there are fabric ears in the kierzach
      2. borisst64
        borisst64 16 January 2013 12: 49
        +4
        No one disputes that soldiers ’feet should be cherished; it’s not in vain that they check heel toes during morning examinations. The footcloths have important advantages - compensation for the wrong size of shoes (a couple of sizes are large boots), the possibility of using improvised material (tablecloth, curtain, blanket, leg, etc.). In peacetime, this does not occur, but in combat .....
        And most importantly - it is NECESSARY TO BE ABLE TO WRINK THEM; in the army there will be socks — we will learn how to wind footcloths.
        1. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 24
          +1
          Why can they wind something? just don’t have to hit sapramat! This is a piece of rag.
          Pancake! I learned to wind footcloths as a child, from my grandfather and dacha, so that I could walk around mushrooms in my boots. Well, how much can this garbage be exalted to the rank of "where is his button" (x / f "Adventures of electronics")
          1. dmitreach
            dmitreach 17 January 2013 02: 44
            0
            the one who slapped a minus. You are proof material, on the topic: "the mechanics of deformation of a solid in a yuft boot", from what time did you defend it? was it really difficult?
        2. Dikremnij
          Dikremnij 16 January 2013 22: 05
          +1
          Or he can go from the rear and, as one great Old Man says, "fuck up" the rear and plant a couple of boiled rats, and then start the normal supply of the army.
          I want to give an example of one of the NATO countries, not the USA, Sweden: if a soldier needs a new uniform or needs a spare part, the soldier goes to the barracks, gets into the service jeep and goes to the warehouse. The warehouse is like a supermarket, idesh, taking what you need, passing through the warehouse entrance, they read the barcode from the thing and write the thing on you. And as for the uniform and shoes, or rather its replacement, try to tell the American soldier when replacing clothes that his uniform is still in good condition and he can still wear it for a long time or give out a used ear-shape, you know what will happen? No one will be fired, they will simply deduct from your salary an amount that is five times more than the cost of a set of forms.
          1. dmitreach
            dmitreach 16 January 2013 22: 13
            -1
            They sometimes buy what they like. Salary allows, the charter does not prohibit.
            1. Misantrop
              Misantrop 17 January 2013 00: 04
              +2
              Quote: dmitreach
              Salary allows

              In the next topic, I quoted that the January salary of the senior officer of the Ukrainian Interior Ministry, an engineer of the unit, amounted to as much as 1100 hryvnias (i.e. 4400 rubles), a contract soldier 900 hryvnia. At the price of normal socks (of those that are recommended for such shoes), for example, "Splav" in a Simferopol store is 150 hryvnia, his salary will be enough for 6 pairs. wassat
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 17 January 2013 02: 14
                +1
                Quote: Misantrop
                In a neighboring topic he cited, the January salary of the starter of the BB of Ukraine, an engineer of the unit, amounted to as much as 1100 hryvnias (i.e. 4400 rubles)

                To go nuts ... In Kazakhstan, the salary of just a lieutenant - starts at $ 760, captain - starting at $ 950. Private contractor starts with almost 400 dollars.
              2. dmitreach
                dmitreach 17 January 2013 02: 32
                +1
                In Russia, more recently, monetary allowances have been raised. Often in a rafting I see a warrior. Moreover, they are packaged in small wholesale, for impressive amounts ...
                This action looks like this: you come to the checkout (with some laces), and there is a mountain of tactical pouches for a Nny bag, you will make some money ... and you think: no !, oh well! Do not you say! Well, maybe this healthy "buyer" loves airsoft, with such an official muzzle-face? Or he chooses tactical bras for "hunting" ... (Well, he doesn't like the hunting line of things, in alloy)
                What do you, slovenians, wish you (financial well-being)!
                1. Alex 241
                  Alex 241 17 January 2013 02: 36
                  +1
                  http://www.kamo-uniforma.ru/
                  1. dmitreach
                    dmitreach 17 January 2013 02: 49
                    +1
                    curious website, thank you.
                    1. Alex 241
                      Alex 241 17 January 2013 02: 53
                      +1
                      Yes, not at all. Not cheap of course, but of high quality, I've been packing for two years there.
                      1. dmitreach
                        dmitreach 17 January 2013 02: 59
                        +1
                        Oh you, the world is so small! .... I got in to see the contacts, and they are stationed near the metro station Illich Ilyich .... I know them, I've been ...
                      2. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 17 January 2013 03: 01
                        +1
                        This is the most normal store, do not even shove in others.
                      3. dmitreach
                        dmitreach 17 January 2013 03: 06
                        +1
                        adherent of the alloy ... 10% card. request I’ll go the other day, I will change constant love.
                      4. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 17 January 2013 03: 08
                        0
                        Dim in a personal discount card, 15% for Ilyich, plus 20 shares.
                      5. dmitreach
                        dmitreach 17 January 2013 03: 14
                        0
                        Thank you, comrade! drinks
                  2. Ruslan67
                    Ruslan67 17 January 2013 03: 14
                    +3
                    Quote: Alex 241

                    Alex 241

                    Hi Sasha fellow Listen god with them with footcloths cancel well and x with him And now how now without a belt with a badge belay This is a soldier’s personal weapon soldier What is disarming the army again? am
                  3. Alex 241
                    Alex 241 17 January 2013 03: 18
                    +1
                    Ruslan hello buddy without a badge of melancholy!
                  4. Ruslan67
                    Ruslan67 17 January 2013 03: 22
                    +3
                    Quote: Alex 241
                    plaque-free longing!

                    And how to educate young people without taking their hands out of their pockets request
                  5. Alex 241
                    Alex 241 17 January 2013 03: 26
                    +2
                    Do as I do, not as I said!
  2. st.lt
    st.lt 18 January 2013 22: 34
    0
    I envy in black on the salary of the Ukrainian company (1200 UAH-150 $) so you will not walk
  • Hon
    Hon 16 January 2013 23: 10
    0
    As far as I know (I may be mistaken) in the United States only one set of forms is issued, then they transfer money to a special account and the soldier acquires the necessary uniforms as needed, it is impossible to spend money from this account for other purposes. As for the Swedish experience, I would have taken everything straight to the market from this warehouse, and most of the soldiers and officers would have done the same laughing
  • nerd.su
    nerd.su 17 January 2013 04: 17
    0
    Sweden is not a member of NATO. Although it works closely.
    Quote: Dikremnij
    if a soldier needs a new uniform or needs a spare part, the soldier goes to the barracks, gets into the service jeep and goes to the warehouse.

    socialism, however ...
  • Mikhado
    Mikhado 16 January 2013 09: 18
    +7
    Well, I smell holivar again there will be 200 posts wink
    The topic is clearly painful and controversial. And although the army, by definition, should be monotonous, here, with all the anecdotes, you can’t chop off your shoulder.
    It seems to me that it is necessary to objectively leave both boots and footcloths for a much longer period than the minister ordered. The most wonderful sock will fold into folds in the very-rassam nano-boot - this is obvious to all people who are more or less familiar with the issue. And if you do something really effective, the cost will be sky-high ...

    Well, it started laughing
    1. Hon
      Hon 16 January 2013 09: 30
      +2
      Buy ankle boots "bates" or "crispi" and try to rub your leg in them, this is not possible, run at least 20 km at least 30.
      1. Demon_Ex
        Demon_Ex 16 January 2013 11: 44
        +9
        Have you tried 30 km in "maraders" on the sand or in the rain when foam comes from the bootlegs? Ankle boots are good in dry climates, but not in the desert or steppe, and even more so in the usual Russian one. Apparently not seen when a sock on his leg rotting after a week of fighting.
        1. Hon
          Hon 16 January 2013 12: 44
          +3
          Quote: Demon_Ex
          Have you tried 30 km in "maraders" on the sand or in the rain when foam comes from the bootlegs? Ankle boots are good in dry climates, but not in the desert or steppe, and even more so in the usual Russian one. Apparently not seen when a sock on his leg rotting after a week of fighting.

          It seems that only the Russian army makes march throws. In the desert, boots are not suitable at all, in Afghanistan they were replaced with berets, and then with sneakers.
          1. Demon_Ex
            Demon_Ex 16 January 2013 12: 54
            +7
            For the last 10 years I have been in berets, there were corcorans and miltecs, tactics of several other companies. But not one did not take root, at +40 the vaunted membrane on sand or stone turns into slimy horseradish after 3 hours of march. After going into the ford of a river or stream, the water stupidly remains in the berets and during walking it leaves the shafts in the form of foam, the sock rolls into a tourniquet. Legs in both cases are just pi .... ec. And the Russian troops, there is such a thing as the rate of supply. They will give the fighter 2 pairs of socks for a month, and ordinary Chinese cotton socks, which in principle do not have elastic.
            1. Massik
              Massik 16 January 2013 14: 11
              -4
              respected it is necessary to wear interchangeable shoes; universal shoes do not exist yet))) they didn’t try to use shoe covers when they crossed the river ???) for the worst, the stockings from the OZK help someone like that, but these extra 1-2 kilos are not so difficult for me in the mountains to pull for dry feet I’d better lay out a can of canned food than I will walk with wet feet and go nuts when they start shooting me *******.
            2. st.lt
              st.lt 18 January 2013 22: 37
              0
              Quote: Demon_Ex
              They will give the fighter 2 pairs of socks for a month

              in the Ukrainian army 2 pairs per year
      2. beech
        beech 16 January 2013 12: 03
        +4
        for us there are no problems with the purchase, but for mo !!! You know, they’ll buy the cheapest, they’ll take surrender for themselves, and the fighters will eat their brains all year long!
        1. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 44
          -1

          beech,You know, they’ll buy the cheapest, they’ll take surrender to themselves,
          so the problem is in the prosecutor's office, not in the footcloths .... kakbe
          1. Misantrop
            Misantrop 17 January 2013 00: 09
            +1
            Quote: dmitreach
            so the problem is in the prosecutor's office, not in the footcloths .... kakbe

            I remember that the main reason for appointing Serdyukov's whores to the top military posts was precisely the reason for the fight against theft of the military. But these investigators were appointed to control them. Remember the result? wassat
      3. Egoza
        Egoza 16 January 2013 13: 15
        +2
        Quote: Hon
        Buy ankle boots "bates" or "crispi" and try to rub your leg in them,

        And in terms of the entire army, this is, excuse me, how much money will it be? Or do you think Serdyukov will pay out of his own pocket for "redemption"?
        1. Hon
          Hon 16 January 2013 14: 26
          +1
          Quote: Egoza
          And in terms of the entire army, this is, excuse me, how much money will it be? Or do you think Serdyukov will pay out of his own pocket for "redemption"?

          Saving is certainly good, only the savings are obtained on the soldiers, you can still replace the meat in the stew with soybeans, so the savings will turn out. Remember the saying "if you don't want to feed your army, you will feed someone else's"? So this also applies to uniforms.
          How much money was spent on Sochi, the World Cup, the Summit, etc.? Maybe it would be better to put them on shoes for soldiers? And by the way, it's a good idea to dispossess Taburetkin and his Amazons. laughing
        2. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 47
          0
          Is Russia again counting tens of millions of citizens mobilized, in case of war, counting money?
    2. nikoli25
      nikoli25 16 January 2013 09: 39
      +5
      I agree with you, you need to leave the footcloths or at least to teach the people how to wind them, because in the event of a global conflict (for example, like the Second World War), there may not be enough socks for everyone, and the footcloths can be made from almost any fabric and even old clothes. I myself work at the factory, I barely have enough socks for a week, I do not have enough, I use home-made footcloths.
      1. Cosmonaut
        Cosmonaut 16 January 2013 10: 17
        -8
        And checkers instead of machine guns ...
        And instead of tanks, horses.
        1. Homo
          Homo 16 January 2013 11: 05
          +2
          Cosmonaut, you can not jerk. There is a good saying - if you want peace, prepare for war! One should always strive for the best, but not forget about the possible worst.
          1. Cosmonaut
            Cosmonaut 17 January 2013 00: 23
            +2
            I don’t jerk, just footcloths are not the most pressing problem of the RF Armed Forces.
            1. s1н7т
              s1н7т 17 January 2013 11: 03
              0
              Quote: Cosmonaut
              footcloths are not the most pressing problem of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation.

              The most reasonable comment! +100!
        2. Nagaibak
          Nagaibak 16 January 2013 13: 03
          +5
          Cosmonaut "And horses instead of tanks."
          As for the horses, you shouldn’t joke ... one cannot exclude, for example, the return of cavalry units. For movement: Not such as before numerous, but like raid cavalry divisions. In the villages, they are already plowing on horseback so that why exclude the return of their army?
          At border guards, by the way horses are used with might and main.
        3. Egoza
          Egoza 16 January 2013 13: 19
          +3
          The Nazis also thought that, thanks to their technology, they would end the USSR over the summer. However, our roads were not taken into account. Roads will be our "ally" against technology for a long time! But the horsemen were great help out. Do not offend the horses! wink
          1. Cosmonaut
            Cosmonaut 17 January 2013 00: 18
            +1
            I don’t offend anyone, it’s just not a reform, but some kind of crap.
            Well, why bother with footcloths? Is this an incredibly important problem?
            I don’t get it.
      2. Nagaibak
        Nagaibak 16 January 2013 12: 55
        +3
        nikoli25 "I agree with you, footcloths need to be left or at least taught to wind them up, because in the event of a global conflict (for example, like the Second World War)"
        If a major war with mass armies ... then most likely the footcloths will return. Soldiers without orders will wear them. At least in our Russian army.
        1. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 48
          +2
          Nagaybak, and also return the semaphore and morse code. for after a nuclear war most of the electronics will be covered.
          1. Dikremnij
            Dikremnij 16 January 2013 22: 14
            +1
            And no one has yet canceled the morse code, and, as far as I know, light signals too.
            1. dmitreach
              dmitreach 16 January 2013 22: 25
              0
              and semaphore alphabet?
      3. Egoza
        Egoza 16 January 2013 13: 17
        +1
        Well yes! And mother will definitely throw up socks in the army. And not one pair. Can you imagine the benefits to the manufacturer? And already the question is not worth the quality. It is clear which will be released. am
    3. Massik
      Massik 16 January 2013 10: 52
      +3
      Well, I don’t know about- "this is obvious to all people who are in the slightest degree familiar with the question." I can say for the special forces who are not greedy wears good socks, who loves freebies wears footcloths. That and that should be changed at least once every three days if you walk far, I just feel you just did not wear good socks along with good shoes hi
      1. Nagaibak
        Nagaibak 16 January 2013 13: 13
        +2
        Marssik "This and that needs to be changed at least once every three days if you walk far, I feel you just didn't wear good socks along with good shoes"
        I looked at the discovery seem, reporting on a foreign legion. So after the march of throws, they treated their worn legs with medicines. And as I understand it, this is the norm, they are used to it. Even the sergeants had their legs knocked down. The quality of socks and boots to discuss in this unit probably makes no sense. This is me as an info ...
        1. Massik
          Massik 16 January 2013 14: 20
          +1
          Well, fools, hunting, legs to ruin, well, they made the march, they arrived at the point, it is necessary to fight and ,,,,,, ??? all ****** can’t we run to legs ??? where are they then with their legs aaa knocked down? Well, is it difficult to take socks with you 3 pairs ??? I don’t know what they have there for the march, it’s unlikely to be longer than 15 km, then anyway there is time to change socks, and not to ruin your legs thinking that for 80 years you will be just as healthy and strong)))) and the objectivity of the discovery channel is a separate issue) )))
          1. Nagaibak
            Nagaibak 16 January 2013 16: 14
            -1
            Marssik "running longer than 15 km, then there is still time to change socks."
            It seems like a 12 km march was. But it is not exactly.
            About the objectivity of "Discovery" - the very concept of objectivity is not applicable to this channel.
            1. Massik
              Massik 16 January 2013 20: 29
              0
              at our place, the guys let them fly 12 km along the intersection, including crawling through puddles of mud along the neck, crossing rivers, swamps, marshes, etc., and nitsche normal legs, nobody knocks his own legs because after the march there’s still a lot of things to do, but everyone runs ordinary berets and socks)
        2. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 51
          0
          Nagayba do not replace concepts. They process their legs for medical reasons, and not because they do not use footcloths. Have you ever sung a leg in footcloths? And in the jungle?
          1. Nagaibak
            Nagaibak 17 January 2013 06: 12
            +1
            dmitreach "do not substitute concepts."
            The march was in France. Crouched legs and sores showed. They made faces as it hurt. You won’t play like that. What I saw him and I say. And why did you sing in the jungle? In the boots drove you there? Read carefully in stories about the French, I did not express my point of view. I expressed my opinion about the return of footcloths when mass armies returned to the battlefield. It’s just that some people go into extreme discussions saying that there is nothing better than shoes, so I gave an example to a foreign legion.
            1. s1н7т
              s1н7т 17 January 2013 11: 08
              +1
              Quote: Nagaibak
              And why did you sing in the jungle? In the boots drove you there?

              They drove my comrade. In boots and footcloths. He remembered a lot of things from that war, but he doesn’t remember problems with footcloths / boots laughing
    4. Demon_Ex
      Demon_Ex 16 January 2013 11: 46
      +1
      Of course it started, half of the troops in boots marching, with a valiantly declared refusal of these 6 years ago.
      1. Z.A.M.
        Z.A.M. 16 January 2013 13: 14
        +3
        Demon_Ex
        Quote: Demon_Ex
        half of the troops in boots marching

        HERE! This is the most important thing, why it is impossible and foolish to give an order to forget the "concept of footcloths" by the end of the year. Well, they saluted, well, let's go to perform. How???
        Or whatever "TAMA", on the" top "that"HERE", on the website, they think that all our troops are elite, in nano-ankle boots and nano-socks, super-heroes? special forces of the ground forces consist of the Engineering Troops, Communications Troops, EW Troops, Railway, Automobile Troops, etc.
        Yesterday, for example, was the day of the pipeline troops. They would be asked about berets laughing
        On the advantages and disadvantages already said everything (above and earlier).
        But WHY (?!) immediately refuse, by order? Go gradually, since such stocks of boots and footcloths.
        Only now I'm not sure what will be better in the future. Enterprises that churned out boots and footcloths poke up, and then we will listen to the bleating: "And we wanted to be like LUCCCE" ...
        1. dmitreach
          dmitreach 16 January 2013 19: 53
          0
          Z.A.M., But it’s not about putting a bonfire out of an existing one. What about tomorrow? (And after 2020)
          Kalashnikov to you as an example.
      2. Ascetic
        Ascetic 16 January 2013 22: 22
        +4
        Quote: Demon_Ex
        Of course it started, half of the troops in boots marching, with a valiantly declared refusal of these 6 years ago.


        Now is transition period when both boots and "ankle boots" are used, both footcloths and socks are used. I am of the opinion
        Mikhado, in this matter, that sharply cutting the shoulder in such an important issue should not be, in the modern army there is simply no modern, high-quality comfortable and functional shoes of mass, say, tailoring, as there used to be boots. Generally before peck at such news like Shoigu said that by the end of the year the whole army will go in super tibia should be treated critically, that's when there will be the end of the year then we'll see. In the meantime, the rules of material allowances are in force in accordance with Decree of the Government of the Russian Federation of June 22, 2006 N 390 "On clothing provision in federal executive bodies, in which military service is provided for by federal law, in peacetime"
        И nobody is going to cancel them.

        Here are the acting standard number 5 of the supply of personal property with clothing for elders, sergeants and soldiers who are on military service

        Boots or low shoes
        1 couple
        life time
        -
        High boots or boots
        1 couple
        1 year

        Winter ankle boots on fur
        1 couple
        life time

        Cotton socks
        2 couple
        1 year
        -
        Winter socks or winter footcloths
        4 couple
        1 year

        Socks are summer or footcloths summer
        6 pairs
        1 year

        Barracks slippers
        1 couple
        life time
        -
        Sport shoes
        1 couple
        life time

        Completely here
        1. Was mammoth
          Was mammoth 16 January 2013 23: 58
          0
          Quote: Ascetic
          Cotton socks
          2 couple
          1 year
          -
          Winter socks or winter footcloths
          4 couple
          1 year

          Socks are summer or footcloths summer
          6 pairs
          1 year

          I wear more on a citizen.
        2. Pimply
          Pimply 17 January 2013 01: 33
          -1
          Belvili's the same - quite high-quality shoes
  • shurup
    shurup 16 January 2013 09: 19
    -1
    In circles close to the Moscow Region, it became known about the intentions of transferring the Kantemirovskaya or Taman divisions to bast shoes and onuchi made of new high-tech materials. To the positive aspects of this decision, experts attribute the possibility of self-supply of personnel with shoes with significant budget savings. In the Navy, an analogous transition to Chuni, possibly Swiss-made, is expected.
    In addition, the question of the use in the troops, following the example of winter fishing enthusiasts, from ice, women's tights and sanitary napkins under the insoles, is being discussed.
  • PSih2097
    PSih2097 16 January 2013 09: 21
    +3
    The transition period during which footcloths and boots will be replaced with socks and boots will certainly not be very attractive.

    To begin with, let them make high-quality boots, and not like now, that fall apart after a year of constant wear (not for nothing that the same specialists buy western boots, and you don’t have to go far for an example - http://k-a-r-d-e-n.livejournal.com/ ) Although I think they will not come up with a replacement for footcloths in the next 20 to 30 years, if at all they can do it.
    1. Hon
      Hon 16 January 2013 09: 33
      0
      There is a Faraday company that makes shoes at the highest level.
      1. LaGlobal
        LaGlobal 16 January 2013 10: 32
        0
        Our company? - if not, there can’t be any talk!
        1. Hon
          Hon 16 January 2013 11: 01
          0
          Quote: LaGlobal
          Our company? - if not, there can’t be any talk!

          Our. These products are usually shown to reporters.
      2. Massik
        Massik 16 January 2013 11: 03
        +3
        yes they make ankle boots for conscripts, they gave me a "Faraday", they were still tall, although they were dead after 4 months, the skin on the heel was frayed and the heel was worn out, but at least they were comfortable, but right now the conscripts are giving it 3,14 like skis and they look the same. I could not even find a photo of this ********. On the sole, too, Faradey is written am
        1. Hon
          Hon 16 January 2013 11: 25
          +1
          This model costs 800 rubles, and the average price of their products is 5 thousand

          Here is an example of one of the Faraday models
        2. beech
          beech 16 January 2013 12: 05
          0
          3,14 zdets- beautifully jumped))) +
  • nalexx
    nalexx 16 January 2013 09: 23
    +2
    Kadet_KRAK,
    Quote: Kadet_KRAK
    In the Army, he also wore socks with boots and footcloths with boots, an affirmative conclusion - the footcloth is better.

    It was such a thing. Socks in berets - parade, footcloths in boots - everyday. By the way in the footcloths it was warmer. He served in the Urals
  • erased
    erased 16 January 2013 09: 31
    -2
    A trifle, of course, but important and indicative. In berets it is better to walk with socks. As for the boots - how to look. But the boots are in the past. AND??
    Let's see what comes out of the new minister ...
    1. Homo
      Homo 16 January 2013 11: 07
      +3
      erased, and so far have we gone from this past? If at all gone.
    2. Ghenxnumx
      Ghenxnumx 16 January 2013 11: 07
      +2
      Quote: erased
      In berets it is better to walk with socks.

      Bertsa berets berets - those that gave us in the ZSibVO - wiped socks for a day regardless of the thickness of the sock. I mean these:
      1. Hon
        Hon 16 January 2013 17: 35
        0
        Last year, I got similar ones, only higher.
      2. Dikremnij
        Dikremnij 16 January 2013 22: 33
        +1
        If my eyesight does not wrap me around, then these ankle boots only have a leather toe and heel, and even then they are made of leather from "Budenny's horse magnifying glass", and everything else is a banal tarpaulin?
        If so, then I believe your words, we were also given similar g * explicitly, only the sole 2 times thicker that it was not a leg to lift, not a toe to stretch. And after a month, two or three soles began to come off, and for everyone: take off your OZK stockings, and a leg in a boot without a sole comes out from there. laughing
        Then he bought ankle boots in a store, ankle boots of Ukrainian production, inexpensive, lightweight soles, soft leather. Result: several parachute jumps, marching throws, extinguishing a fire with his feet, berets for the third year and still alive, though the lining on the inside of the shafts was torn.
        As for the rubbing of the legs, I rubbed my legs heavily in the old ugly berets, after buying new ones, I didn’t rub my legs even once, although during jogging and march-throws I wore 2 socks and washed my socks every day.
    3. the polar
      the polar 16 January 2013 12: 52
      +3
      This is not a trifle!
      A fighter without legs is a ballast for the unit and a notorious loss of battle
  • Psyjoker
    Psyjoker 16 January 2013 09: 40
    +2
    First you need to give out shoes of the correct size, or at least a footcloth, at least a sock, and + 2 / -2 sizes in any case, heads ... leg pain laughing
  • stalker
    stalker 16 January 2013 09: 54
    +4
    He served an emergency 97-99g. I got the first boots in the army two sizes larger, there were no others, and of course the footcloths, with proper winding, in general, it was normal, but the first time when I still couldn’t do this, they strayed into the corner of the boot and at minus 30 on the street it wasn’t ice) over time, I bought myself berets at my own expense and began to wear socks, and yet they are more comfortable in them than in a canvas, in general I am for berets and socks.
    1. Homo
      Homo 16 January 2013 11: 10
      +6
      stalkerif someone has not learned something, then this is not a reason to cancel. Many cannot master the gearbox, but there are no calls for an all-round transition to the automatic transmission.
    2. collapse
      collapse 16 January 2013 11: 33
      +1
      A similar situation, the footcloths, when used correctly, are very convenient - but only under the boot, I tried socks with boots so that my legs would work out normally during the day of duty. The only way out for socks is berets, but again they must be fitted to the leg correctly, otherwise the same song. Somewhere I heard (or read) that the Americans, when issuing shoes, take several measurements with an almost individual fit, but I can’t say the truth or not.
    3. klimpopov
      klimpopov 16 January 2013 12: 17
      +1
      He wore shoes with a flannel footcloth and socks, for three years the socks (reinforced) worn out the insole and the zhostosti ribs of the heel began to shamelessly put pressure on the heel, the footcloth more successfully hid the whole thing, but there was no talk of any 5 kilometers. At the same time, it was these shoes that really passed 2 - 2,5 of the year without complaints, even to LIGHTNING, they never let down (with laces the pipe, only braided). So the shoes are definitely! Not any boots, but I would leave a footcloth, because socks can’t stand it and carrying two pairs with me is certainly good, but our industry doesn’t have such a lot of socks, if ordinary shoes bought do not go for long, then knowing our MO (which is cheaper) - you yourself understand.
      Here, in the military office 1200 - 1300 rubles, categorically do not take metal zippers, only plastic. Really unkillable. And be sure to see that everything inside is leather, because it happens from some kind of rag but costs 100 rubles cheaper. And also for the shoelaces there should be not hooks but holes, hooks at the poins came off, I only wore holes.
      Maybe someone will come in handy .... Although the photo is somehow bourgeois, I didn’t have a layback on my tongue, but they look one-on-one. In short, you’ll go to Voentorg, you will see something similar, look inside the main thing, you won’t be mistaken if this is it.

      That's something like only the hat on this one was not on top, and there was a tongue for drying.
    4. Was mammoth
      Was mammoth 16 January 2013 23: 49
      +1
      Quote: stalker
      The first boots in the army received two sizes larger

      At the training camp, in the 80s, they gave me a pair of boots - one "U", the other "W" (it was not my size). wink The footcloths were good — there were no problems with the legs. And when he was serving urgently — we had one Ossetian. So he went through all the quarantine in slippers until his boots were sewn to order. He had a leg that Gulliver had. belay Sometimes I still use footcloths and I taught them to use my own. By the way, boots should always be taken a size larger, under two pairs of footcloths in winter.
      But seriously, I see that in the modern army, in order to have normal shoes, you have to buy yourself. And where is the state? And here the question is not about footcloths or socks, but the fact that often "good intentions are the road to hell".
  • Massik
    Massik 16 January 2013 10: 44
    +2
    ******* as I remember, I was already shaking for four months with these footcloths my legs were in the meat))) the ankle boots should be normal, and sports shoes should be running, for example, I took MFN boots and I have been walking for the third year already even though henna, neither the mountain serpentine, nor the swamps of Smolensk, nothing could spoil them) the authorized ankle boots "Parity" give out nothing, but they are only for ensigns and higher on the term it was difficult to get it))) , he still walks in them even though he served in 87, we all can do everything we just do not want to study ... and we feel sorry for the money for the darling army ...
    1. Cheloveck
      Cheloveck 16 January 2013 13: 11
      +6
      Quote: Marssik
      ******* as I recall, already shaking for four months tormented with these footcloths were legs in meat)))
      Hmm, for four months not to learn how to wind footcloths .... laughing laughing laughing
      Quote: Marssik
      and running sports shoes should be
      Especially in the swamp. Huh?

      In fact, each vegetable has its own place and time.
      But with us "either-or", there will be no comprehensive solution.
      1. Massik
        Massik 16 January 2013 14: 27
        0
        so that you don’t have to torment you, a man with bad legs should refrain from physical activity of running, etc. put the legs on honey, let’s say that they heal, I didn’t get such grace unfortunately footcloths I could wind for the second week only it helped too when the shoes were just your size.
        Is it convenient to go to fp in berets ???
        1. Cheloveck
          Cheloveck 16 January 2013 15: 12
          +2
          If he washed his feet, he didn’t know how to wind.
          Definitely!
          Especially if the boots are just your size.
          1. Setrac
            Setrac 16 January 2013 16: 15
            +3
            As shown once how to wind the footcloths, and for two years no problems, even if, on alarm, the footcloths are folded with an envelope.
            1. Cheloveck
              Cheloveck 16 January 2013 16: 17
              0
              Here I am about the same.
            2. biglow
              biglow 16 January 2013 17: 13
              +1
              Setrac,
              similarly, all the service went in footcloths dressed in an accelerated method, and everything is fine, although the boots were often a couple of sizes larger
      2. Hon
        Hon 16 January 2013 14: 32
        0
        Quote: Cheloveck
        Especially in the swamp. Huh?

        Is it better in the swamp boots? So the swamp will take them off, and in the berets the lacing is tight.
        1. Cheloveck
          Cheloveck 16 January 2013 15: 19
          +1
          In boots, swamp is better.
          And she won’t take it off if she can walk skillfully.
          But when you get out of the swamp, you will immediately check out that even wrung out footcloths in boots are more comfortable than fresh socks in berets.
          1. dmitreach
            dmitreach 16 January 2013 22: 32
            0
            if hedgehogs drown in swamps, it’s better to be brokers. only run hard in them.
  • AK-47
    AK-47 16 January 2013 11: 08
    +2
    No doubt, socks.
    Shoes - high quality and at the time.
    Socks - summer, winter, socks no more than a month.
    And the footcloths are a pity; the shoe was stinging.
  • redcod
    redcod 16 January 2013 11: 12
    +3
    In the winter we were given wool footcloths to our regiment. In winter, their legs didn’t freeze even in kirsach.
  • Bort radist
    Bort radist 16 January 2013 11: 15
    +7
    He served urgent in boots. In the taiga about 25 years walked in the swamps, there was already a choice. Urgent is no secret for socks punished. Hunters and fishermen go 50 to 50. Some are footcloths, some are socks and the so-called chuni, liners made of rolled fabric. We turn to tourists, climbers there, as far as I know, socks. In my opinion, it’s realistic to switch to socks, but these socks are not from a stall. This should be a special item and a special order for the army.
    1. cth; fyn
      cth; fyn 16 January 2013 14: 03
      0
      Good idea good
  • bubla5
    bubla5 16 January 2013 11: 18
    +4
    Before canceling something, one must introduce or introduce normal shoes into the troops, but for each type, for example, a certain one, depending on the task posed or solved, and only then cancel the footcloths.
  • Clueless
    Clueless 16 January 2013 11: 24
    +9
    Quote: Hon
    Buy ankle boots "bates" or "crispi" and try to rub your leg in them, this is not possible, run at least 20 km at least 30.


    yeah, and give out to conscripts

    a day later, the whole company without shoes, such as they stole it from us, and all shoes were sold behind the fence;)

    I went through this, though it was not shoes that gave us excellent pea jackets, a couple of days later the soldiers didn’t have pea jackets, many simply stole them from their own people and sold to the side

    and with expensive shoes - this will happen everywhere, because they will buy it with pleasure

    soldiers serve for a year, let them walk in boots and footcloths, or berets with footcloths, they will survive - we served for 2 or 3 years, and not what is alive;)

    contractors and so wear socks

    again plundered a bunch of dough, it is better to buy equipment for this money
    1. cth; fyn
      cth; fyn 16 January 2013 14: 01
      +1
      I agree on the part. can serve a year in footcloths, but all the same, in the case of kipish, even conscripts should be dressed in normal clothes.
  • LION
    LION 16 January 2013 11: 25
    +2
    As if in nano socks, the legs would not stink. You walk in footcloths for a week and there are no smells for you. Fungus and mazoli are friends of the soldier. Not every part has a nightly shower. At a construction site in winter, spring and autumn I walk in boots. The conditions here are difficult. I never thought about high-top boots. But the main material for socks. There will be synthetics, there will be a byak.
    1. Srgsoap
      Srgsoap 16 January 2013 11: 59
      +4
      Do not tell me good modern materials that remove moisture, etc. much better skin and longer lasting, I wear Corcoran marauder myself and no problems. First you need good shoes for both summer and winter. And we will save and drink as always.
      1. leon-iv
        leon-iv 16 January 2013 12: 20
        +6
        by the way about corcoran
        We have one here decided to get out bought the hermits. And they have a teflon sole. Now he has great boots for skiing.
        1. cth; fyn
          cth; fyn 16 January 2013 13: 59
          0
          ice boots laughing
        2. Karlsonn
          Karlsonn 16 January 2013 19: 17
          +1
          Quote: leon-iv
          by the way about corcoran
          We have one here decided to get out bought the hermits.


          let this try:

          BELLEVILLE BOOTS 390DES




          Quote: leon-iv
          Now he has great boots for skiing.


          Here is this model on amers in Afghanistan:
          1. Pimply
            Pimply 16 January 2013 22: 30
            -1
            The Israelis are also buying it now.
            1. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 17 January 2013 01: 39
              +2
              Pimply



              this company from World War I bots for the US Army, for example, bots that Belleville did for the army in World War II

              1. Pimply
                Pimply 18 January 2013 00: 15
                -1
                In Israel, they use the black version and the red, in accordance with army traditions.
          2. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 17 January 2013 02: 23
            +1
            By the way, are sand-colored berets allowed in the Russian and Ukrainian army? We are simply allowed to wear such. True, usually senior officers flaunt them.
            1. Karlsonn
              Karlsonn 17 January 2013 12: 51
              +1
              Marek Rozny

              Quote: Marek Rozny
              are sand-colored berets allowed in the Russian and Ukrainian army?


              in Ukraine - no, but we don’t have such a place; although those who served in Iraq could be extradited.
              in Russia - I don’t know.
              Although both Russian and Ukrainian specialty shoes are mostly bought by myself, and on the pictures you can’t see a bot



              SOBR Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Russian Federation in the Kurgan region.
      2. Karlsonn
        Karlsonn 16 January 2013 19: 11
        +3
        Srgsoap

        I wear HAIX AIRPOWER P6-HIGH, all day in the mountains, in the Crimea in the summer - my foot is dry, my toe had no smell; in Kiev before -15 (they started to pour salt - the toad strangled) - the same thing.



        Quote: SrgSoap
        First you need good shoes for both summer and winter. And we will save and drink as always.


        Yes sir!
        1. Srgsoap
          Srgsoap 16 January 2013 22: 20
          +2
          I have the same corcoran, and even the summer version is up to -10 the norm. Yes, my mine has some kind of impregnation, the dirt does not sit at all. The current color is sage green.
          1. Karlsonn
            Karlsonn 17 January 2013 01: 53
            +2
            Srgsoap

            I want to try these



            550 ST - Marine Corps boots with steel toe cap for hot weather.




            The anatomical construction of the VANGUARD® outsole is the VIBRAM® Sierra polyurethane midsole and rubber outsole.
            Top - olive cowhide (suede) / CORDURA® nylon.
            Lining - sweat-proof COOL-MAX®.
            Polyurethane removable insole
            Shaft Height - 8 inches (Army Standard)
            Eyelets for moisture
            Lanyard quick tightening system

            the insole really needs to be changed intelligently, something like this





            anatomical insole TR-1 with anti-bacterial pad Agion.
            what
            1. Srgsoap
              Srgsoap 17 January 2013 14: 39
              0
              Cool support the choice. good By the summer, I’m also thinking of buying a couple more of a different color, probably I’ll also choose these.
            2. Pimply
              Pimply 18 January 2013 00: 16
              -1
              Great feature
    2. Sirozha
      Sirozha 16 January 2013 13: 13
      0
      Take good modern shoes and good modern sweat socks and you will forget about the boots!
  • vedmed690
    vedmed690 16 January 2013 12: 17
    +2
    during the service he wore footcloths with boots and socks with ankle boots, footcloths were given out, and they were enough for the season, the provided socks were enough for two or three days. and then "chpok" and buy-buy. At the exits, they even wore footcloths in ankle boots
  • SIT
    SIT 16 January 2013 12: 21
    +15
    When it was hard on the other end of the earth, I had to run around in their jungle boots and socks during the rainy season. I thought my legs would rot along with the leather bottom of the boots. As a result, I nadybal trophy, whether Chinese or Vietnamese-type sneakers with a high top made of tarpaulin. He took 2 soft mosquito nets and wound them like footcloths, but so that they protrude through the top of the ankle boots. As a result, moisture went up. When it really started to squish, he took and rewound such "footcloths" on the contrary - top to bottom, and dry up at the bottom. At least some illusion of dry feet appeared. I learned how to do my colleagues. They liked it. That's just the word footcloths, they all learned a week and French-speaking and English-speaking. Darkness whisper ... faq with them you take smile
    1. valerei
      valerei 16 January 2013 12: 45
      +1
      SIT, yeah. Russian soldier shaves with an awl!
    2. Demon_Ex
      Demon_Ex 16 January 2013 14: 01
      +1
      These sneakers are called colonial, the French wore such in Indochina. A creditable thing. Only instead of socks go special canvas bags to them, the prototype of our footcloths.
    3. kulpin
      kulpin 16 January 2013 21: 25
      0
      In the turbulent youth there was a period when I happened to work in forest inventory, in the field from May to October. Resume from personal experience. In the swamp it is best to walk in sneakers. Of course, the leg is in the water, but it will still be drawn into the boot and only toss an extra couple of kg. And the water leaked out of the sneaker and after 10 minutes, if it went to a dry area, the leg dries by self-heating. Kerzachi is also a thing, but where more is supposed to be dry. Again, I did not cover the seams very much, so that the water, if it gets, quickly squeezed out. About calluses. Yes, for the first two or three weeks I went on live meat, but then I got used to it and even once there were no scuffs. It even happened that the kirzachi was dragging his bare feet all day (the heat was terrible, but in that quarter the snakes were full, you can’t wear sneakers) and nothing. A month later, the sole has grown so much that the argument went on broken glass.
  • Tartary
    Tartary 16 January 2013 13: 01
    +1
    They say that foot wraps are evil ??????????????

    "Half a liter? To smithereens? - Yes, I will ... (C)

    Personally, he wore footcloths ... And today, if there is a long, difficult path, even in winter or summer, I will choose a footcloth ...
    Because there is no better "theme" (!)
    Socks are not very socks ... (put the reader, correctly accent) ...
    Cartilage - flat heel ...
    Cartilage - rubbed a leg in the blood ...
    In the right, properly wound footcloth, this almost impossible.
  • Sirozha
    Sirozha 16 January 2013 13: 11
    0
    Normal shoes + good socks and no footcloths are needed! Everything is decided only by normal provision! Naturally, if they give out shitty tarpaulin berets with the same shitty socks, then there is only plus for footcloths and boots.
    Someone here talked about the alarm and speed of shoes - this is solved by shoes with a quick lacing system + socks - and by the time, too, only you will know that your sock in the boot will crookedly, unlike the footcloth in the boot!
    The whole world makes great use of shoes with socks, and we are still waving our bast shoes! ..
    1. Z.A.M.
      Z.A.M. 16 January 2013 14: 18
      +1
      Sirozha
      What are you doing: take it, take it, plus
      Quote: Sirozha
      with quick lacing system

      It - ARMY, a lot of people. It's not about a single set. Or show you what kind of "rummaging" you are
      They themselves suggested
      Quote: Sirozha
      Naturally, if they give out shitty tarpaulin berets with the same shitty socks, then there is only plus for footcloths and boots.
      Well it will be SO. Is it all that you propose will fall from heaven before the end of the year?
      Yes, and read my comment above. There about the kind of troops. Does everyone need socks and berets?

      Incidentally, Egozajudging by the flag, your fellow countryman
      Quote: Egoza
      And even better, as in the current Ukrainian army - almost everywhere parents buy uniforms, shoes, and "accessories". Our state has no money for uniforms ... Again, what is bought by parents, the soldier will not fuse the fence. And there is nothing to steal in MO! Double benefit !!!!

      request
      All ukrаhi to the Indians drinks He served, not for long, in Vinniki, near Lviv 91-92.
    2. Pimply
      Pimply 16 January 2013 22: 30
      -1
      Absolutely.
  • Egoza
    Egoza 16 January 2013 13: 27
    +4
    And even better, as in the current Ukrainian army - almost everywhere parents buy uniforms, shoes, and "accessories". Our state has no money for uniforms ... Again, what is bought by parents, the soldier will not fuse the fence. And there is nothing to steal in MO! Double benefit !!!! am
    1. cth; fyn
      cth; fyn 16 January 2013 16: 08
      0
      give money on the form? or do the procedure for providing clothing akin to going to the store (clothing store)?
      I sympathize with this situation of the Ukrainian Army, yet it is a pillar of the country and its sovereignty.
    2. Dikremnij
      Dikremnij 16 January 2013 22: 42
      0
      EXACTLY!!!
      ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ good
  • washi
    washi 16 January 2013 13: 56
    +1
    Footcloths and boots are not required.
    1. Convenience, practicality, price
    2. If a fighter cannot independently take care of his health, that is, pick up shoes and wrap the CORNER, then he is DULL and he does not belong in the sun
  • cth; fyn
    cth; fyn 16 January 2013 13: 57
    +4
    I think you can’t send a footcloth to retirement. Imagine:
    There is a war, the soldiers fought for four weeks in positions, spare socks ran out, socks ended on corpses (all worn out), and then the soldiers remember what the commodity elder taught them at survival lessons and wind up footcloths.
    Leaving them as a plan "B", all can save someone's life (well, this question is akin to the expediency of a bayonet-knife).
    In short: go to socks, but still teach winding footcloths.
  • grizzlir
    grizzlir 16 January 2013 14: 02
    +4
    I don’t understand the essence of the dispute. If a soldier puts on boots, then definitely with footcloths. If shoes and low shoes, then only with socks. Boots with socks or berets with footcloths, it’s like skiing on ice, or skiing, which who likes more.
    From personal experience I’ll tell you that I traveled in Chechen plasticine in miner’s rubber boots. In the tank I changed into civilian boots, half-sneakers. Everything is possible for the officer. The soldiers walked in their boots, under their boots. when the leg to the knee went into the mud. Well, in the summer I preferred berets.
  • Volkhov
    Volkhov 16 January 2013 14: 42
    +5
    Boots / boots are a matter of taste, but the absence of boots leads to wooden legs or a suit. Frosted once in boots, then only felt boots with galoshes (in the mountains) - with the right fit, the best option for skis.
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 16 January 2013 15: 47
      +1
      Did the boots have been canceled?
      1. cth; fyn
        cth; fyn 16 January 2013 16: 05
        0
        2010 were still ...
  • fight
    fight 16 January 2013 15: 23
    +3
    I'm for footcloths! will give out new footcloths-lepota-foot warm and comfortable. Wear a week to the next bath. the foreman will give out the washed ones (they became seated from washing and holes can be), you twist and turn in and hand in two weeks in the same footcloths. The main thing to hang out to dry in the evening. And in the rain and in the snow and the heat, wonderful. Ankle boots and socks are not very practical. Especially in the far exits. the fungus appears almost immediately. need to be changed almost every day. leg dangles like G in the hole))) grandfathers did not just come up with footcloths. And the manufacture of material for footcloths will also support our light industry
    1. grizzlir
      grizzlir 16 January 2013 15: 55
      +3
      Quote: luta
      grandfathers did not just come up with footcloths

      Grandfathers also invented bast shoes laughing , frills and stuff, stuff ...
      Quote: luta
      Ankle boots and socks are not much practical. Especially in the far exits

      Given the supply situation in the modern Russian army, it’s hard to disagree with you. The officer can afford to take several pairs of interchangeable socks with him to the military exit. As a rule, the ryadovoy does not have such an opportunity.
      In general, given the climatic conditions of Russia, boots, berets, boots, depending on the weather and the tasks performed, were supposed to be in the conscript soldiers. Dreams Dreams.
    2. cth; fyn
      cth; fyn 16 January 2013 16: 02
      -1
      don’t get hung up so much, yes there is a fungus, but this is due to the fact that the feet don’t wash in the evening, and there will be fungus in the footcloths too. At first (when the mother called the Motherland), my legs in socks were normal in berets, but when they said that they don’t wear socks and threw us mouths, they gave us footcloths, after when the foreman scored us, I tried to walk in socks, but the boots spread and rubbed, walked a day and returned to the footcloths, now I wear berets that I have since school, from grade 10 (my veterans) in socks, no fungus or other problems (good boots, leather from Piggy laughing cops soldier )
  • Cheloveck
    Cheloveck 16 January 2013 15: 56
    +2
    In general, to be honest, this is not what Shoigu does.
    He needed to rake the Augean stables after the stool, but he took up footcloths.
  • Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 16 January 2013 16: 06
    +2
    I don’t know how they will do it in the Russian army, but in the KZ it is allowed to give footcloths to the soldier instead of socks (if the soldier wishes and if he is in stock). Well, of course, depending on the type of activity and environmental conditions, appropriate shoes are issued. Bertsa is for everyone, plus some have the usual boots, both insulated and rubber, and chemically resistant, and summer sneakers, and winter sneakers, and climbing boots, felt boots, etc.
    There is no universal shoe. Therefore, talk about the benefits of a shoe can only be conducted for certain conditions of service.
  • wild cat
    wild cat 16 January 2013 16: 22
    +3
    I am very surprised how much is devoted to this topic on the Internet. Footcloths are socks, which is better which is worse. Let me tell you about myself, I have 25 years of experience in the Airborne Forces. For 4 years a cadet wore only footcloths with both berets and boots, socks never. Officer socks, but good, did not spare money, but in the taxiway there were always footcloths, always !. for war only in footcloths, the Soldier serves 1 year ONE and runs nothing in footcloths, and contract soldiers and officers themselves figure out what to wear, according to the situation.
  • zmey
    zmey 16 January 2013 16: 48
    +2
    for the army only footcloths! For specialists and contractors for choosing boots
    + footcloths or berets + socks.
    Footcloths are simple, convenient, cheap, in any conditions you can exchange them for any other rag, wash in any puddle, dry (even on yourself), rewind 10 seconds - 1 minute with a smoke break for 3 minutes!
    My socks are erased, what is in the berets and what is in boots for 1 day (holes under the fingers and on the heel) do I need to take 7 pairs with me for a week or put patches every night ?!
  • Irek
    Irek 16 January 2013 17: 03
    +4
    force boots - you don’t get cold in summer, you don’t sweat in winter ...
    I wore boots with footcloths and wear .... it’s much easier to dry footcloths and boots by the fire (in the field)
  • georg737577
    georg737577 16 January 2013 17: 22
    -2
    If we ignore the economic aspect of the problem - of course, boots (at least 4 types, depending on the weather and territorial features), and saving on this is a crime. Socks are absolutely not acceptable with boots. In most armies of the world, the problem has long been solved - there the soldier receives both sneakers and slippers and different socks. And the nostalgia for "kirzach" - will pass ...
  • Sedoy
    Sedoy 16 January 2013 17: 38
    +1
    > the main problem in the situation with the abandonment of boots and footcloths is the financial aspect of the case

    here .... as expected, everyone should not worry about the soldier, how he will be and in what - grandmothers are important to them ...
  • ildar335
    ildar335 16 January 2013 19: 47
    +1
    I don’t know how everyone, but after the term, serving on a contract, I even wore berets with footcloths. Socks can withstand MAXIMUM 3-4 days (taking into account the fact that I bought socks myself, not authorized), but at the field exits, DAY. plus the footcloths are much warmer!
    I'm against!!!
  • Algor73
    Algor73 16 January 2013 20: 45
    -1
    If the quality of the socks will be the same as the footcloths, then for the socks.
  • SuperVodka777
    SuperVodka777 16 January 2013 21: 57
    0
    Let them make socks from the same material as the footcloths soldier
  • Aleksandr34
    Aleksandr34 16 January 2013 22: 28
    -1
    21st Century Outside. Good Nostalgic. Bertsa and socks are unique. The country is not poor. Sooner or later, all the same, everyone will be provided with this form of shoes. Moreover, the decision has already been made.
  • Iraclius
    Iraclius 16 January 2013 22: 45
    +4
    I went to school in footcloths and tarpaulin / yuft boots for 2 years. Then ankle boots of various models (both those that were given out and those that I bought myself). I will say this - both in winter and in the heat it was much more comfortable to walk in boots. Those boots that gave out ("crocodiles" on a rubber track, lined with nails - that is still a thunderstorm of the NATO bloc laughing ) "ate" a couple of issued socks, or golf (she-she! I'm not lying - some specimens reached my knee! belay From cotton fabric and without elastic, yoba!) Per week. I always woolen foot-wraps on the cross, fortunately, the head of the course looked at such a graft loyally. A year later, the socks were over, no one forced us to buy them in a chip and the footcloths returned to our lives again! fellow
    In order not to seem like a retrograde, I will say that the good new is better than the good old, but the bad new is worse than the usual old. If we can’t afford high-quality shoes and good socks in sufficient quantities, then let our boots and footcloths remain - our sons will later thank us!
  • Takashi
    Takashi 17 January 2013 07: 07
    -1
    You know asked the peasants at work - Did they serve in the army? 15 out of 12 people served in the Soviet Army. And she knows when they changed clothes - she purely instinctively looked what people wore under work boots and boots = it turned out to be SOCKS !!!! Nobody put on footcloths - although there was an opportunity. When going fishing - under socks also put on SOCKS.
    --------------------------
    maybe you just need to solve the supply problem - and stop saving on people ???
    --------------------------
    Cowards, by the way, are also torn ... you did not try to replace them with rags ?? More economical and more practical.
  • Stalinets
    Stalinets 17 January 2013 08: 27
    +1
    If a shoig had served in the ARMY for at least a couple of years, he would have known that there was nothing better than footcloths.
  • general.bnw
    general.bnw 17 January 2013 08: 42
    0
    Lord! And yet again: boots / not necessarily tarpaulin, but leather, high-quality! /, Boots, footcloths, socks, sneakers, sneakers, etc. - DIFFERENT types of shoes and articles of clothing, NOT competitors! Everything has its place and time! Beautiful high-quality boots for parades are much more aesthetic than * drunk * pants, dangling on the go! By the way, our / and foreign / beautiful ladies for some reason do not go, especially in the off-season and in winter, from boots to boots - to know that boots are more appropriate, despite the great capriciousness of their wearers, both in aesthetic and practical terms! Well, now about the boots in the Army: and how to wear them without footcloths!?.
  • s1н7т
    s1н7т 17 January 2013 11: 52
    +2
    For everyday wear in the PPD, there were enough boots. By the way, raising the alarm - he is also in the PDP, here the speed of dressing is useful laughing
    At the exits (mountainous and wooded area) they wore "ankle boots" with 2 socks - cotton and thick wool. By the way, during my service in the SA, I met 3 types of "marching" boots - "crocodiles" (2 years of socks - guaranteed, but heavy!), "Attack" (p.p., sucks, light, but they don't folds, sole - none) and the latter were - super! Genuine leather, the ankle is held, but the leg is not interfered with, and the hooks and holes are light, the sole is solid, without a heel.
    In the mountains they took the mountain, rejected.
    On jumps - sports "jumping".
    In the gym they wore sneakers (their own, although they were state-owned in the warehouse, but ...).
    I mean, ideally it should be like this - the shoes should meet the conditions for the task. Only for the RF Armed Forces this is still a fantasy, just like a normal army for the current RF. So the slogan "Down with footcloths!" - it's just a PR stuff.
  • vladek64
    vladek64 17 January 2013 14: 24
    +2
    To deal with the financial difficulties of the transition to new elements of clothing is proposed in the simplest way.


    Very traditional! First, we create difficulties out of the blue, and then we heroically fight them.

    According to Minister Shoigu, additional funds will be allocated to complete the transition.


    And here is the answer why! We are cutting the budget! And who is this powerful manufacturer of "trekking socks" for which 2,8 million boots are ready to go to the landfill? Well this is how it was necessary to "interest" the ministry !!!