T-64E became a tank of the XXI century

150
T-64E became a tank of the XXI century

Specialists of the State Enterprise "Kharkov Armored Repair Plant" proposed a deep modernization option tanks type T-64, T-72, T-80, which brings them to the line of modern machines. In particular, an option has been developed to significantly improve the performance characteristics of the T-64.

T-64 type tanks were called "home tanks" - these vehicles were never exported, even to the Warsaw Pact allies. For its time, it was, without exaggeration, a revolutionary tank: a combined reservation was used in its armor protection, which reliably protected it from most of the anti-tank weapons of that time, the fourth member of the tank crew, the loader, was replaced by a loading mechanism. The main armament of the T-64 is the 125 millimeter cannon-launcher, which, in addition to conventional projectiles, is capable of firing guided missiles. Auxiliary weapon represented by a twin PCT machine gun of caliber 7,62 mm and anti-aircraft machine-gun installation (ZPU) "Cliff" caliber 12,7 mm. A characteristic detail is that in the seventies, the T-64 TCDU received remote control, i.e. for firing from her tank commander there was no need to open the hatch and, leaning to the waist (often - under enemy fire), take up the handle of the machine gun control.


Naturally, for his nearly fifty years historyThe "sixty-four" order has lost its initial advantages: the armor is no longer reliably "held" by modern anti-tank ammunition, the small field of view of the LSD sight does not allow it to be used effectively to combat modern high-speed air targets, the engine power is clearly insufficient for the level of mobility requirements 21 century.

These, and other factors, were the reason for the initiative development in the deep modernization of the T-64. T-64E - so Kharkiv citizens "christened" the modernized tank, it is significantly different from its progenitor.

The first thing that catches your eye when looking at the T-64 is an unusual tower. Due to the use of the Knife, in its construction of the complex of dynamic protection, the tower slightly increased in size and “acquired” the panels inclined at an acute angle to the attacking ammunition. Similar protection blocks are mounted on the upper frontal part and the sides of the case, although it is not so noticeable there.


Another noticeable difference from the prototype is the formation of a new multi-channel fire complex based on an improved fire control system using thermal imaging, television, panoramic sighting and monitoring instruments, a modernized guided missile complex, a new ballistic calculating device with enhanced shooting conditions, the use of multifunctional combat modules installed in special mines of the turret.

On the machine exhibited on May 9, 2011, combat modules with the PKT machine gun and aviation double-barreled gun GSH-23L. In fact, the range of weapons that can be used as part of the modules is much wider. The design of the modules is easily removable, quick-changeable due to their unification according to the mounting parts of the installation, remote control drives, guidance, aiming. This technical solution appears to equip the machine with various weapon systems for a specific combat mission.

The use of an automatic tracking system, target identification in combination with an onboard information system, made it possible to significantly ease the crew’s combat work in reconnaissance and threat selection, minimized reaction time and defeat of priority targets. Moreover, the firing complex is able to recommend to any member of the crew (including the driver’s mechanics) of the tank an optimal firing channel, an outfit of ammunition for the speedy execution of firing tasks.

Thanks to this solution, the T-64E can serve as an infantry tank or a tank directly supporting infantry, thus embodying the concept of a prominent tank theorist Marshal Oleg Alexandrovich Losik. According to his theory, it is advisable to create two types of specialized tanks - artillery, armed with a large-caliber artillery system, and infantry, which, by arming with an automatic gun, can provide direct fire support to infantry units of a tactical platoon-company.


The special requirements of a modern tank are to the power supply system: the equipment is more and more complex, and therefore more and more energy-intensive equipment - this is the fire control system, KURV (guided missile complex), more and more sophisticated communications equipment, navigation equipment, optical-electronic complex suppression, installation of air conditioning, etc., necessitates having several sources on the machine. Capacities of tank batteries are not enough to maintain the functioning of all this equipment when the engine is not running (for example, in the parking lot, in ambush), and it is extremely inexpedient to “drive” the main engine, both from the point of view of developing its already limited lifespan and in order to save effective reserve fuel. The solution to this problem in the world "tank fashion" was the use of an auxiliary power unit (APU) - an autonomous engine with enough power to supply electricity to all onboard consumers. The T-64E didn’t stay away from this trend - the tank is equipped with a 10 kilowatt APU with a liquid diesel engine cooling system in the reserved bulk of the hull and a second air cooling unit with a 6 kilowatt cooling capacity in the turret niche. Thereby, guaranteed energy supply is provided in any possible situations.

Improving the survivability of the tank is achieved by using a high-speed system of fire-fighting equipment using optical sensors, their optimal placement in the branches of the machine.

Reduced visibility of the tank in the entire spectrum of electromagnetic, thermal and acoustic radiation is achieved by using special materials, shielding, creating surfaces of the structures of the necessary directions and shapes. Implemented a scheme of applying effective camouflage protective coating.

The implementation of the above design activities caused an increase in the weight of the machine to 42,5 tons, and, of course, the "native" engine of the sixty-four "5TDFA 700 hp power. no longer satisfied developers. The specialists of the state enterprise Kharkiv BTRZ, in collaboration with a number of scientific and design organizations, developed and manufactured their own forced version of 5TD - 5TDFE with 850 horsepower, resulting in the specific power of the T-64Е xNUMX hp / ton.

The calculations of the costs for implementing the T-64E project showed that, by the criterion of "combat effectiveness - cost", high rates were achieved. The tank itself is competitive in the external market and has the additional modernization potential. With the discontinuation of the BM Bulat theme, the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine may be offered as a budget option for the restoration and deep modernization of the T-64 fleet, at a lower price, and at TTH at the level and higher than 447АМ1.


Specialists of the state enterprise "Kharkiv BTRZ" not only modernized the T-64, which had far from exhausted its potential, but also pushed the horizon of the use of the modern tank, made a new step in its development. Time shows how successful and effective the concepts incorporated in the design of the machine are. Now with confidence we can say one thing - the tank is still alive, and the appearance of such machines is another confirmation of this.
Our news channels

Subscribe and stay up to date with the latest news and the most important events of the day.

150 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. StrateG
    +3
    7 January 2013 17: 51
    The tank looks certainly interesting ... but ... is it too late?
    1. +15
      7 January 2013 17: 56
      Quote: StrateG
      but ... is it too late?

      What happened?
      1. +14
        7 January 2013 21: 49
        Well, handsome, no matter how handsome they say, just not shoot at us
        1. +9
          7 January 2013 22: 42
          Quote: valokordin
          Well, handsome, no matter how handsome they say, just not shoot at us


          Whatever the misunderstanding in my photo, the Romanian T-55 tank upgraded to the TR-85M1 Bizonul, the most advanced Romanian aircraft, often frightens Ukraine.
          1. +6
            8 January 2013 05: 59
            It turned out very well with the Ukrainians. What about the price? It is necessary that modernization did make sense, otherwise it would be cheaper to buy T-90 ...
            1. +4
              10 November 2016 11: 23
              Dear comrades !!! Remember once and for all !!!! It is easier and cheaper to build a new simple, strong and cheap than to upgrade the old !!!! Since the labor costs for modernization are always higher than new construction !!!! You first need to disassemble the old, and disassembly also costs money (costs of materials, equipment, consumables, workers' wages + posting of materials), and again collect this money too. This is called cutting BABLA. Again, the question of the armor of the tank itself, the composition of the armor does not change and does not improve, an old box of t 64 is taken and protection is hung on it. Only Papuans or Arabs can take such a tank. For the European theater of war this is no longer relevant. It is easier to melt.
              1. +1
                10 November 2016 11: 26
                To develop the actual basic armor and, according to the old rational scheme (drawings), to assemble an already new 64ku. because the concept is not yet completely out of date. hang all the bells and whistles.
          2. 0
            2 February 2017 08: 39
            The T-55 tank and its clones have different rollers with a smaller number, so the photo shows the modernization of the T-64
        2. Yoshkin Kot
          +3
          8 January 2013 16: 35
          I doubt it very much. that there will be more than a dozen laughing
          1. 0
            6 November 2016 18: 47
            Strongly sure that will not be at all. And the idea is really gorgeous)
    2. +1
      7 January 2013 20: 50
      StrateG,
      Yes, but if the shell bounces under the turret, it will blow.
      1. +5
        7 January 2013 21: 34
        Can you imagine what kind of projectile is needed (caliber. Weight, etc.) to demolish a tower? Do not give an example of the Second World War, completely different conditions, etc.
        1. 0
          15 February 2017 09: 56
          152mm is enough to simply tear it off kinetic energy is just crazy if the 122m tower was torn off by a tiger
        2. 0
          18 March 2017 23: 25
          My dear mother, when the ballerina gets into the old woman’s zaman, she doesn’t have to demolish the tower. Direct fire from Acacia jumps out of pursuit from a blank
  2. +27
    7 January 2013 17: 56
    Our engineers need to carefully look at the technical solutions for the T-72 and T-80. Maybe something practical will come in handy during the modernization of our tanks. All the same, the Kharkov School of Tank Engineering is a high engineering level.
    1. MILITARY RF
      +16
      7 January 2013 18: 03
      I agree it is necessary to modernize them very well .... not to rot around these toys
    2. +3
      23 October 2016 13: 20
      And what does Kharkov have to do with the development of these tanks? T-72 was developed in Tagil, T-80 in Leningrad.
      T-72 "Ural" - the main battle tank of the USSR. The most massive second-generation main battle tank; Adopted by the USSR Armed Forces since 1973. The T-72 was designed and manufactured by Uralvagonzavod in Nizhny Tagil. The chief designer of the machine is V.N. Venediktov.
      The T-80 is the main battle tank produced in the USSR. The world's first serial tank with a single gas turbine power plant. In service with the USSR army since 1976. The first production samples, developed by SKB-2 on the basis of the T-64, were produced at the Kirov plant in Leningrad.
      1. 0
        18 March 2017 23: 27
        Kharkov is the T-64. Small rollers, dvigun counter
  3. +16
    7 January 2013 18: 03
    Well done Kharkovites, a good upgrade, there are still a lot of tanks like T-64 so there is something to upgrade.
  4. soldat1945
    +39
    7 January 2013 18: 04
    It is amazing how the military-industrial complex of Ukraine is fighting for survivability. Look at the general collapse of the economy, Kharkov citizens are constantly creating something new, a powerful school that the Soviet Union left!
    1. +2
      7 January 2013 18: 33
      I have nothing against the military-industrial complex of Ukraine, but why did they painfully create a new one that is striking in the imagination?
      1. +5
        7 January 2013 21: 40
        And they have nothing left. how to support yourself and survive on old technology, there are a lot of it. enough work for many years. And they won’t be given anything new to release, they need money for it, they aren’t in the state, all the other possible sponsors are direct competitors and they don’t need Ukrainian industry. in fact, like agriculture, and in order to promote a new tank on the world market, you really need to try and have real weight in the world. and this may be only a few countries (Ukraine is not a member of them, no offense, it is not sovereign). At the same time, Kharkiv tank school is definitely one of the strongest schools in the world!
        1. +2
          2 February 2017 08: 41
          "Kharkov Tank School is one of the strongest schools in the world" ... with clarification - WAS
    2. 0
      18 March 2017 23: 30
      Sandblasted scrap, a new pseudo-electronics .... There were a lot of them here with spare parts for agricultural machinery ....
  5. +2
    7 January 2013 18: 05
    Interesting remark:With the termination of the topic BM "Bulat", the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine can be offered as a budget option for the restoration and deep modernization of the T-64 fleet ))).
    In general, the topic of modernizing cars is not new. A good modernization of the machine is much cheaper than buying a new one. Although, undoubtedly, a qualitatively new one in all respects, such a machine will never become. For Ukraine, the topic has a place to be. For Russia, probably not. UVZ needs to come up with something for the T-72. Until completely out of date ...
    1. +3
      7 January 2013 20: 37
      Quote: urich
      A good car upgrade is much cheaper than buying a new one

      A very controversial statement. If you upgrade according to "full minced meat", then the difference is insignificant, roughly speaking - from the 72nd 70s of production, the T-90-SM will only have the body and something on the little things, and high-quality dismantling is also not cheap and not fast.
  6. +32
    7 January 2013 18: 06
    modernization is good, but this tank is aimed at export, Ukrainian enterprises are not capable of mass production of such tanks, the goal is to upgrade part of the t-64 stock and sell, but many tanks were in terrible condition and it is hardly possible to upgrade them! Ukraine is trying to sell off the rest Soviet heritage, and then what. When everything collapses, what will be done. Nationalists shout about the Soviet occupation, Russian barbarians walked through the cossacks' huts and hetman's palaces, leaving behind universities and factories, factories and hospitals. Ukrainian oligarchs do not want to enter into alliances with Russia, because they will lose all power and all that they have plundered, and the people suffer. Very sorry for the Ukrainian brothers, one of the best forges of tank building dies. If such tanks went to the Ukrainian army there would be no price!
    1. veritas
      +3
      April 2 2015 00: 51
      When the Moscow kingdom came to the Getmanshchina there were 2 academies, 2 large publishing houses and several small ones, there was a school at each parish, and there were not even parish schools in the Moscow kingdom, and there was no talk of publishing books. As a result of walking through the cossacks' huts and the hetman’s palaces (only in Baturin, the hetman’s residence city, they killed more than 15000) and made the Left Bank (which they got after the Eternal Peace with the Commonwealth) empty for almost 100 years, killing most of the population , and the rest fled to the Poles. And factories are just the achievement of scientific and technological progress, and who knows how it would be now. It would not have been under the power of the former communists and Komsomol members who were accustomed to holding people for a herd of sheep. Russians are also sorry, the Kremlin clique destroys the people and the economy, sculpting obedient slaves who will protect its interests and help sell natural resources
      1. +9
        April 2 2015 01: 32
        And ancient Ukrainians dug up the sea.
        1. 0
          13 May 2017 15: 33
          and from the Caucasus, they poured
      2. +3
        22 October 2016 19: 55
        what are you smoking (or drinking) on ​​your Ruin?
        1. The comment was deleted.
      3. +4
        22 October 2016 22: 40
        There would be no Tsarist Russian power, and then there would be no Soviet power and Soviet power! At best, it would be part of Poland, Romania, Russia, but there would never be a territory called Ukraine!
      4. +10
        23 October 2016 06: 57
        The founding years of the academies, the names of the founders, and the names in the end ??? Which of them graduated from those who became famous throughout the world? Where can I see books printed in Ukrainian in those publishers, again in what years, book names, names of authors?
        Maybe it’s enough just to rub your tongue, first prepare the evidence. Only not fabricated, but real, not afraid of verification.
        And it turns out something like this:
        1. 0
          31 January 2017 09: 58
          the philosopher’s offspring, lying under the table, and by the way, in the winery he made such a thing,
        2. 0
          13 May 2017 16: 18
          Ostrog Academy -1576, Kiev-Mohyla Academy -1615. graduates - Mazepa, Samoilovich, Orlik (author of the first constitution in Europe), philosopher Skovorod, Mikhail Lomonosov, Pletentsky .. and now name what was similar in the Moscow principality ??? ... do not bother yourself - nothing happened. You, your printer Fedorov, survived from Moscow, and in Lvov (!!!) he published his first book, The Apostle, in 1574
          1. 0
            19 May 2017 19: 31
            Mikhail (and not Mikhailo) Lomonosov studied:
            - 3 years (1731-1734) at the Slavic-Greek-Latin Academy in Moscow.
            - for several months in 1734 he studied at the Kiev-Mohyla Academy, but, not finding there completely materials for physics and mathematicsHe "diligently reread the annals and creations of the Holy Fathers."
            - 1735-1736 - Petersburg, University of the Academy of Sciences.
            - then he studied for about 5 years in three places abroad.


            Your mention of this Kiev theological academy looks extremely ridiculous.
            1. 0
              20 May 2017 20: 56
              you, wise guy, compare the foundation years. during the functioning of the Academies, there was nothing like that at all in Maskva, even parish schools. the first appeared only in 1653. the one that you do not need to laugh. you would cry, maybe let
              1. +1
                4 June 2017 14: 15
                Kiev-Mohyla Academy: 1659 year of foundation.
                Slavic-Greek-Latin Academy: 1687 year of foundation.
                Well, the St. Petersburg Academy of Sciences - 1724, here already before the foundation of St. Petersburg in any way.

                A strange desire to separate the history of the formation of Little Russia from the general development of Russia. It somehow developed in parallel with the time of the conquest of Kiev by the Rurik dynasty in 882.
      5. 0
        3 November 2016 17: 34
        Well, what, Verun, did your overseas owners help you?
        I hope that you, as it should be for a generous patriot, have long signed up for ATO volunteers and died of a bullet from a Donetsk miner?
      6. 0
        7 November 2016 15: 19
        about how the sea was dug up also do not forget to mention.
      7. 0
        10 November 2016 10: 58
        What resources are discussed in more detail please. Have you really found oil in the toilets? Even digging out the Black Sea, they did not find a damn. And to be honest, in addition to land and scrap metal in Ukraine, not a damn thing. You say coal - yes, nobody needs it at hell at such a cost other than Ukrainian power plants. It is cheaper to buy coal in the Kuzbass where it is mined in an open way. Learn Economic Geography bully
        1. 0
          13 May 2017 16: 20
          in a similar vein, in Russia there is no other than oil and gas, the rest is every little thing
      8. 0
        27 November 2017 15: 38
        When the Moscow kingdom conquered part of the territory of Poland, the Russian peasants called cattle and Ukrainians in Poland were not said to be glad. Until 1918, the Ukrainian nationality did not exist, and the territory of Ukraine, as a country, appeared only in 1991.
  7. +1
    7 January 2013 18: 06
    Well done neighbors. In our 90s, everything died out. And here is an almost new car.
    1. +4
      7 January 2013 20: 31
      Quote: s.melioxin

      Well done neighbors. In our 90s, everything died out. And here is an almost new car.

      Well, a reference, how did UVZ stalled there? I agree about Kirovsky and Omsky, but about "everything at all" - alas, I cannot.
      Why isn't the T-90-SM "almost a new car"? Huh?
      1. bach2007
        +2
        23 January 2013 15: 33
        Uralvagonzavod

        At about the same time as the Kirovsky Zavods, the Nizhny Tagil Uralvagonzavod joined the “race” for the creation of main tanks. One of the main reasons for this was the identified deficiencies of the T-64 tank. It took time to fix the problems, and the new tank needed to be delivered as soon as possible and in large quantities. Opportunities of the industry allowed to start production at any of the plants of the industry However, Kharkov plant them. Malysheva could not provide all enterprises with the right amount of 5TD diesel engines. An alternative to the Kharkov engine could be the Chelyabinsk B-45 / 46. As a result, Kharkiv created a tank "Object-438", then renamed the "Object-439" - T-64 with a diesel engine B-45. It was assumed that it will be produced in Nizhny Tagil.

        MBT and their creators
        Object 172М-2М “Buffalo” (http://btvt.narod.ru)


        But the management of Uralvagonzavod insisted that they should not impose someone else’s development, but let them make their own. However, the Uralvagonzavod design bureau did not abandon the documentation provided on the “439 Object” and applied in its project a number of developments on the T-64А topic, concerning the armored hull and the turret. Not changed and the composition of weapons. In this case, the automatic loader was designed anew. It is worth noting that due to its design it was necessary to alter the shape of the tower. Another feature of borrowing developments was the non-interchangeability of some units. First of all, it concerns onboard transmissions. Nizhny Tagil engineers slightly changed the design of these units, which, however, excluded the possibility of producing identical boxes for both tanks.

        In 1973, the resulting “172M object” was adopted by the Soviet Army under the designation T-72. As a result of this decision, the troops turned out to be two types of main tanks, generally similar in characteristics but significantly different in terms of production. And the required modernization of the T-64A with the replacement of the engine did not work out - the T-72 was a kind of mixture of the know-how of the Kharkov and Nizhny Tagil design bureaus. However, the T-72 went to the troops.

        We often hear that T-72 was inferior in its characteristics to Kharkov T-64А. However, its combination of capabilities and cost allowed relatively quickly to equip a sufficient number of tank units and organize export deliveries. In addition, T-72 was produced abroad under license: in India, Iraq, Poland and Czechoslovakia. On the basis of the original T-72, two dozen modifications were made, several of which reached mass production. Finally, in foreign countries, primarily in the former Soviet republics, twenty more T-72 variants were created, differing from each other in equipment and armaments.
      2. +2
        23 October 2016 13: 38
        Omsk Transmash died? Yes, he doesn’t do tanks now. Releases TOS-1A, MTU-90M modernized bridge layer
        universal tank, PTS-4 floating conveyor, airborne transport ferry.
    2. Perch_xnumx
      +4
      8 January 2013 09: 13
      What new she is. T-64 frame, plus body kit. In a single copy, you can make even a super space tank with armor from nanotubes, with super electronics on board, make it easy in lower tagil. It’s just to launch a series will be very difficult and expensive.
  8. +3
    7 January 2013 18: 07
    And that is true. For sale on the foreign market is the most! The budget version of the tank for Africa, Mongolia, etc. will be affordable. In short, for low-income countries will do!
    1. 0
      7 January 2013 20: 28
      Quote: tronin.maxim
      And that is true. For sale on the foreign market is the most! The budget version of the tank for Africa, Mongolia, etc. will be affordable. In short, for low-income countries will do!

      And shaw, do you already know the price? That's right for a penny, yes, any tribe can afford? They are there and 34-85 so far hurt, and only 54-55 - finally high-tech)))
      1. +4
        7 January 2013 20: 34
        Quote: Mikhado
        45-55 - finally high-tech)))

        Negroes are now picky. But I would like to see 64 pieces in service with the Ukrainian Armed Forces. In principle, the characteristics should be equal to or superior to any tanks of neighbors including the T-400A and MS (although there are difficult questions, what is better Relic or KNIFE 90 the question is almost insoluble except full-scale tests)
        1. +1
          23 October 2016 13: 51
          To compare the combat capabilities of the T-64E and T-90MS, which are not in the combat units, and there are only a couple of pieces of experimental and exhibition models, only a sofa analyst can.
  9. ximik
    0
    7 January 2013 18: 18
    Honestly, crap. UVZ has been creating normal tanks all his life. Well, they hung up defenses, so what ...? Yes, they don’t put hemorrhoids on her troops at all, you see. And hanged some hangers on the HLB? and they tested it in battle.
    So I read it again.
    I realized it’s easier to re-organize the t80. It will be cheaper and better.
    IMHO t-80 best tank
    1. 0
      7 January 2013 23: 52
      Yes, definitely the best, though not cheap. And as you know, good things are never cheap. Chassis and engine - super, he would have a new MSA and all T-90s as they say "nervously smoke"
      1. Beltar
        +1
        8 January 2013 03: 07
        Chassis T-64? Thanks neighing, it is only necessary for them in scrap metal.
      2. Perch_xnumx
        0
        8 January 2013 09: 14
        And in a series run poorly and compare at the training ground. Moreover, there is a T-90 SM, so it needs to be compared.
    2. s1н7т
      0
      8 January 2013 01: 41
      Quote: ximik
      IMHO t-80 best tank

      I also respect 80s, but how is it, in principle, different from 64s? Engine (more powerful, yes), chassis (here FIG knows, but more broadly, of course) - and that’s all. Moreover, more growth and weight. And do not forget that the 80 has grown out of 64. Conceptually, these are identical cars.
      1. Beltar
        -1
        8 January 2013 03: 08
        The T-80 is at least combat-efficient, unlike the T-64.
    3. veritas
      -1
      April 2 2015 00: 52
      The T90 itself was criticized by the Russian Ministry of Defense, calling it a coffin on wheels worse than T72 and more expensive than Western tanks.
      1. +3
        24 October 2016 16: 13
        Drink some water let go) On your outskirts lie the norm of behavior, but as the movie hero A. Schwarzenegger said: -What will your evidence be?
        At least bring a link to these words.
      2. 0
        31 January 2017 10: 10
        "T90 criticized ...."

        Yes, there is no criticism of the T-90 and it didn’t happen, the T-90 surpasses all the tanks of the world in terms of protection and operational load, and there is also an Invar KUV, but what about the 64th ???? two-stroke engine finished with a resource of 200 hours !!!!! KUV Cobra !!!!! After all, there are no prospects for the laser KUV Reflex, the plant then remained in Feodosia (Republic of Crimea), so it’s advisable to mold a gag on this resource with a saucepan. tea is not in an internet wash censor
  10. +2
    7 January 2013 18: 18
    similar to T-90MS
    1. +2
      7 January 2013 18: 31
      Yes, a lot like anyone
      1. bask
        +2
        7 January 2013 20: 59
        When showing the new armored vehicles ((layouts) on 01.08.12/2/130 ,, Motovikhinsky factories ,,, D. Rogozin. They showed a model called ,,, Black Eagle ,, - 152 Renamed to ,,, combat artillery machine. Caliber guns, I think will be XNUMX or XNUMX mm ...
    2. +1
      7 January 2013 18: 51
      all classic tanks are alike. Of course, the T-72-T90 family is significantly different from the T-64-BM Bulat-T-64E. In addition, it is more correct to compare not the modernization of the T-64, but the serial car Oplot-M and T-90MS (by the way, not yet sold commercially).
  11. +5
    7 January 2013 18: 25
    after all, Soviet designers are the most constructive in the world. forever lay
  12. +8
    7 January 2013 18: 42
    there is an opinion that an aircraft cannon and a machine gun in combat modules are still dummies demonstrating the concept of modernization, and not a working model. At least, if there was a valid one, there would have been a video of tests on the Internet for a long time, as with the Stronghold M ... The ability of 3 crew members to effectively control and use weapons is also questionable, because there are already 5 crew members on the same Terminator. but for the "infantry support tank" or "tank support", the T-64E is armed better, more powerful and more effective than the BMPT Terminator because it has a "normal" weapon, and not questionable grenade launchers and automatic cannons of the colleagues from Tagil. But when demonstrating T- 64 E, a heavy infantry fighting vehicle, based on the T-64, was also demonstrated. This is already much more interesting even for the Ukrainian army, because having BM Bulat and T-64E, for all their homogeneity, is still not very effective with the lack of money in the MO budget ... Well, you can take off your hat over Moosie's sagacity. If they listened to his opinion and implemented it (it was almost realized, but the Union collapsed), then there would not be such losses of tanks in Grozny and Chechnya in general.
    PySy And there is also intense competition among the designers of armored vehicles of Ukraine. The repairmen of Kharkov and Kiev offer their concepts of modernization, and "pry" the canonical designers from the Morozov Design Bureau. However, the former director of the KhBTRZ was appointed the director of the Malyshev Plant. To establish mass production of Oplotov M for Thailand, because the predecessor "messed up".

    here is the image of this BMP.
    1. 0
      7 January 2013 19: 29
      http://btvt.narod.ru/raznoe/bulat-leo2.htm вот еще статейка на эту тему. Уже писал выше по поводу статьи, но... Десяток новых танков по цене около 4 млн $ за шт равно 40 млн $. при цене модернизации 800 тыс $ это 50 машин. А уж что лучше рота новых или пять рот б/у это уже каждый сам для себя решает
    2. bask
      +1
      7 January 2013 20: 37
      Quote: Aeneas

      here is the image of this BMP.

      Here is an image of an infantry fighting vehicle based on the MT-S General Purpose Vehicle 1982 release. USSR. . Alteration of the Poles BMP BWP-200 ,,,, in 1999.
    3. Perch_xnumx
      +2
      8 January 2013 09: 26
      If he had listened to his opinion and implemented (already almost embodied, but the Union collapsed), then there would have been no such loss of tanks in Grozny and Chechnya in general.
      If blocks of curb dynamic protection were hung in the formidable, rather than box-models, there would definitely be much less loss.

      The T-64E is armed better, more powerful and more effective than the BMPT Terminator because it has a "normal" weapon, and not the grenade launchers and automatic cannons of the Tagil colleagues, questionable in their effectiveness.

      And you drive into the city among the ruins and littered streets and support the infantry. Enemies, too, know the time of reloading the gun, BMPT visibility is much better. While the tank will be looking for enemies, tossing the barrel, and whimpering, the BMPT will hit the windows and holes in full. BMPT does not cost anything to process under something like a Bushmaster at the top.
    4. 0
      7 November 2016 15: 30
      It is no longer necessary to establish mass production of "strongholds" for Thailand, the train has left in the direction of the Chinese.
  13. +7
    7 January 2013 18: 43
    Still, the inexhaustible potential of our classics of our time! wink
    Almost 25 years ago I served on the t-64b1.
    They are still experimenting with him!
    A truly revolutionary project for that time.
  14. Beltar
    -20
    7 January 2013 19: 07
    T-64 was trash barely born, trash and will die. Actually, the Russian Federation has already sent them to a landfill. T-72, here is the only regular tank.
    1. 0
      7 January 2013 19: 24
      A link about the T-64, so, for the sake of neighing http://gurkhan.blogspot.ru/2012/12/blog-post.html
    2. +1
      7 January 2013 19: 43
      Beltar,
      For your information, as far as I know, the t-64b differs from the 72-x only by replacing the MH with the AZ in it. STILL NOT REALLY REALLY RELIABLE!
      It is a pity there is no Sasha-Sparrow on the forum. He is more in the know. winked
      1. +5
        7 January 2013 19: 54
        Materiel would be nice to know. The differences are simply WAGON, you can’t confuse even outwardly.
        And about the article - I feel, there will be another 100 500th srach "kharkov-against-tagil".
        The author of the article is a troll, threw it on a fan and rejoices.
      2. s1н7т
        +1
        8 January 2013 01: 47
        MOH is less fire hazard, as far as I remember, therefore it was put on 80-ku.
      3. Beltar
        -2
        8 January 2013 03: 12
        For your information, these are TOTALLY different tanks, one of which is in service with dozens of countries and continues to develop, and the second from the Russian army went into scrap metal last year, and was never exported. Nobody would have bought it, because nobody needs a tank, which requires a constant presence of representatives of the plant in parts.
    3. +5
      7 January 2013 19: 53
      Quote: Beltar
      T-64 was ...

      Well, I was directly touched by reading this post!
      After all, they believe that the unclean is rampage before Christmas, and here. Alive smoking room. You can’t pass our Russian Christmas!
      Heresy carries and buzz catches!
      fellow
      1. Beltar
        -2
        8 January 2013 03: 13
        Another fan of Harkov?
        1. +1
          8 January 2013 19: 54
          Quote: Beltar
          Harkov fan?

          Feng T-80U!
    4. Beltar
      -1
      8 January 2013 03: 10
      s more cons, more. The fact of the creation of the T-72, as a replacement for the Kharkov squalor, this will not cancel.
  15. +1
    7 January 2013 19: 08
    Another bubble of Ukrainian gunsmiths, like Oplot. Deep modernization involves the in-house production of many components and parts, including those that are not being modernized, but have an expired resource. In addition, it is necessary to provide a complete set of repair kits. Ukrainian factories have lost the technological ability to produce such parts or they were manufactured in Russia. But you can’t go far on Soviet reserves.
    Read the article http://warfiles.ru/show-20219-t-72-biznes-po-ukrainski.html very informative !!!
    1. +1
      7 January 2013 19: 28
      Nuu et old cartoon from the time of the Pakistani contract, sho "Ukraine will not be able". Everything is produced in Ukraine, even what Russia buys for example abroad (Belarusian-French sights and MSA). Of course, it makes no sense for the Kharkovites to revive the production of the T-64, because they stopped producing them even during the Soviet Union, and the production of the T-84-Oplot-OplotM was established. But for modernization and export there are more than half a ton of T-64 at storage bases. Of course in a different state, but the main body, MTO, chassis, are almost eternal winked
      1. +1
        7 January 2013 19: 56
        production of T-84-Oplot-OplotM launched

        read the link above wassat
        1. +1
          7 January 2013 20: 07
          I read, and sho? Well, even your country buys new BTR-4s, although under the Union in Ukraine, BTRs were not produced. Of course, an armored personnel carrier is a less complex and intelligent machine, but for example, a remotely controlled combat module is a high-tech product. The Thais want 200 M Strongholds, paid 60, and the rest will buy it too, because the army there dictates budget parameters and political stability. Ukrainian armored vehicles satisfy them, because they have been using the BTR-3 for a long time.
          1. Beltar
            +1
            8 January 2013 03: 17
            Che-go ??? Our army does not buy anything except the BTR-82.
      2. Beltar
        0
        8 January 2013 03: 16
        In Ukraine, nothing has been produced for a long time, and they themselves in Russia even buy DZ, which shove the remaining T-80 and T-72 into the hulls, and sell them. Nenka has long disappeared.
      3. evil hamster
        +1
        8 January 2013 14: 54
        I can break the template for you in some places, but "everything" is not produced in Ukraine, and sights and sows are made in Belarus and in Ukraine and in Russia, and that is typical for all TPV cameras from Thales.
  16. +8
    7 January 2013 19: 19
    Great tank!
    Urgently to Syria for a break-in.
    1. +2
      7 January 2013 19: 29
      Quote: Ivan Tarasov
      Great tank!
      Urgently to Syria for a break-in

      Yes, in Syria, the T-55 and T-72 do not feel bad.
      http://gurkhan.blogspot.com/2013/01/55.html
      http://gurkhan.blogspot.ru/2012/12/72_23.html
      1. ximik
        -1
        7 January 2013 19: 38
        as well as PZ 4 and T34 arr 44g, there is a desert, bad technology rots
    2. +3
      7 January 2013 19: 58
      of course in Syria and all sorts of ebipty T-64E there will not get. He, like the T-80, were tanks for the war with the main enemy, and was not sold (given) anywhere to our brothers in socialist reason. The T-72 was not in the SA Groups beyond the cordon, and was located in the internal districts of the Union, which led to its monopoly on distribution in the middle of the socialist camp. This tank (T-72) is reliable and easy to operate. Already generations of Arabs and Africans have been exploiting and studying it, and therefore it makes no sense to change "an awl for soap". Ukraine broke into the "non-Soviet" markets of Pakistan and Thailand. But these beetles want the more advanced T-80UD-84-Oplot. request
      1. stranik72
        +4
        7 January 2013 22: 22
        The T-72 was in the GSVG, I specifically name the place Parkhim, there was a tank regiment and we helicopter pilots were often taken to the "combat" brotherhood to "visit" them and their driving range was practically in the alignment of the strip, between BPRS and DPRS. The T-80 was also seen there, there was still a joke parallel to their route where they practiced driving to max V, a motor road passed and the Germans drove with them to ferries in their cars, but at the end the police were waiting for them from above, it was fun to watch, it was in 1988-1991
        1. +1
          8 January 2013 00: 01
          T-72 in the GSVG was a clear rarity! And driving on the 80 ke was great. The best tank, no options.
          1. s1н7т
            0
            8 January 2013 02: 08
            Quote: flanker7
            T-72 in the GSVG was a clear rarity! And driving on the 80 ke was great. The best tank, no options.

            For the GSVG, the 80th was the best, because it could quickly run along their roads, if necessary. However, for example, the operator is pohren, what engine is and what speed is the mech.water joy was to drive. And the power reserve - alas. Those. each theater has its own tank. The Union could afford it.
            1. Beltar
              -1
              8 January 2013 03: 19
              "Each theater has its own tank" is nonsense. Differences between machines should be minimal.
        2. s1н7т
          0
          8 January 2013 02: 01
          Quote: stranik72
          it was fun to watch, it was in 1988-1991

          Here, on the border of the Heidehof and Jüterbog provinces, they tried to chase 64. Especially hot tankers won! True, there the route gives a turn, and the tank route is straight))) And the whole park was on 64. The "armored" ones only complained that at + 5 they already needed heating.
      2. s1н7т
        0
        8 January 2013 01: 54
        The Northern Group of Forces was in 72. There they generally called him "Varshavyanka". ATS tank, in short. Didn't sell 64 and 80 just.
  17. 0
    7 January 2013 19: 31
    [media=http://http://yandex.ru/clck/redir/AiuY0DBWFJ4ePaEse6rgeAjgs2pI3DW99KUdgo
    wt9XvqxGyo_rnZJpNjfFDg3rin5THGkr5MpLqWqNFh0LGkycDyiDjsphqV-xjsufsVLB2U8u_x11-HTA
    FWaCOYGGiQo4FSspV2Gt89-XBcmS7etAwZdxrdMd33sfkGDcZYNFaHRSCc482TiJrMHfoWXdhS?data=
    UlNrNmk5WktYejR0eWJFYk1LdmtxbW9iajlOZE9UY2haM2otSU9tVGZnYmRQaTQ4WXJ6eEFhakhCSjdZ
    RDYtclFTbjk0cHBzZnpkRjIzaVdsX3JTRnBNeUNOUXlxQV8yUEZWRkE5ZFhRSFEtSEhvbGx0bFZYeGZH
    RlhHSnZQMkI&b64e=2&sign=2b6f8f9473a868acc99bd2fbf1482a53&keyno=8&l10n=ru&i=7]
  18. +1
    7 January 2013 19: 47
    Exactly. So far, Russia and its potential adversaries are creating a tank-antitank system. Khrkovites are trying to create an infantry support tank. There is something to speculate about.
    1. +2
      7 January 2013 20: 24
      What is this about? That the tank was originally created just for this? A modern tank is too expensive a toy to be highly specialized. Work on any ground targets + a little air defense. Another thing is that, due to the small crew, the tank is a single-channel facility, it works only on 1 target. They tried to create multichannel in the 30s and abandoned this business, the capabilities of the BMPT terminator are also a very controversial issue.
    2. Beltar
      -1
      8 January 2013 03: 20
      Any tank is also an infantry support tank. Stop writing nonsense.
  19. -1
    7 January 2013 20: 25
    Quote: StrateG
    The tank looks certainly interesting ... but ... is it too late?
    the same can be said about the T90MS
    1. beard999
      +5
      7 January 2013 20: 58
      Quote: MRomanovich
      the same can be said about the T90MS

      And what are the actual parallels between the T-64E and the T-90MS? Ukrainians modernized the tank created in the 60s. last century and which was adopted 44 years ago. Moreover, as quite rightly stated in the article, this tank "has never been exported." In other words, they are completely unfamiliar with this tank in the world. There is no experience in combat operation. And I didn’t hear the same about plans for the adoption of the T-64E by Ukrainian aircraft. The question is, where can this tank be claimed? APU is not needed, large exporters of military and military equipment (such as India, China, etc.) are the same, but worse for exporters (for Africa), such modernization is definitely too expensive. I will not say a bad word about modernization itself, but this product does not have any serial prospects.
      But with the T-90MS, things are still different. This is a further development of the T-72 / T-90, and this line of tanks is well known in the world, and in addition to Russia, they are in service in dozens of countries (even the T-90 has already been contracted for more than 1000 units), and they fought a lot ... that the chances of export deliveries of the T-90MS are significantly higher than that of the T-64E. For the T-90MS it is definitely not too late.
      1. +3
        7 January 2013 21: 08
        Quote: beard999
        What are the actual parallels between the T-64E and the T-90MS? Ukrainians modernized the tank created in the 60s. last century and which was adopted 44 years ago

        And you are upgrading a tank that was a simplified version of the T-64
        Quote: beard999
        in addition to Russia, they are in dozens of countries (even T-90 has already contracted more than 1000 units),

        these are old T-90s. No one has bought MS yet. In this case, the main buyer is India.
        Quote: beard999
        that the chances of export deliveries of the T-90MS are significantly higher than that of the T-64E.

        The chances are minimal - the only thing that can affect is that the Russian Federation sells weapons to some countries in the DEBT on its own loans.
        as well as deliveries are possible to countries to which the West will not sell anything at all. and we cannot sell what would not be a quarrel.
        Quote: beard999
        fought a lot

        T-90? Where did they fight?
        1. Diesel
          +3
          7 January 2013 23: 12
          Quote: Kars
          T-90? Where did they fight?


          t72 ("t90") fought a lot, but where did t64 fight? laughing

          Quote: Kars
          And you are upgrading a tank that was a simplified version of the T-64


          And IMHO, it turned out the most problem-free and optimal tank for Russia. And with modernization, it jumps much higher than T64, remaining with the advantages of T72
          1. -2
            7 January 2013 23: 16
            Quote: Diesel
            t72 ("t90") fought in many places,

            Do you equate T72 and T90? How unpretentious.

            Quote: Diesel
            but t64 where he fought

            In Transnistria.
            Quote: Diesel
            And IMHO, it turned out the most problem-free and optimal tank for Russia

            Navar for Uralvagonzavod lobbyists and three steps back for the USSR tank industry, which could get fundamentally new tanks in the 90s, and a step back for Russian tank construction that could modernize the T-80
            Quote: Diesel
            And when upgrading, it jumps much higher than t64

            That's the truth, the truth at least somehow jumped the T-64.

            Quote: Diesel
            with t72 advantages

            And what are these?
            1. Diesel
              +5
              7 January 2013 23: 33
              Quote: Kars
              Do you equate T72 and T90? How unpretentious.

              But truthfully. After all, T64E for example could call T94E
              Quote: Kars
              Navar for Uralvagonzavod lobbyists and three steps back for the USSR tank industry, which could get fundamentally new tanks in the 90s, and a step back for Russian tank construction that could modernize the T-80

              And "Bars", "Black Eagle" further questions to the government.
              Quote: Kars
              And what are these?

              Just do not then say that all childhood diseases T64 eliminated. Running gear, jerk, goose and many small flaws from which the overall impression of the technique
              1. 0
                7 January 2013 23: 42
                Quote: Diesel
                But truthfully. After all, T64E for example could call T94E

                But they did not name it.
                Quote: Diesel
                And "Bars", "Black Eagle"

                What? And why should I ask your government?
                Quote: Diesel
                Just do not say that all childhood diseases T64 eliminated. Running gear, jerk, goose and many small flaws from which the overall impression of the technique

                Not 40 years and several modifications naturally did not eliminate anything.
                As well as the fact that the T-64 has been continuously operated in the Ukrainian Armed Forces for the past 20 years, including in Desna. The adoption of almost a hundred (for a country like Ukraine is a lot) BM Bulat. (Here, by the way they called, but it's beautiful)
                Quote: Diesel
                minor flaws from which the general impression of technology

                smiled from that, thanks.
                1. Diesel
                  +1
                  7 January 2013 23: 45
                  Quote: Kars
                  What? And why should I ask your government?

                  You said that the RF "Could"upgrade t80, she upgraded them
                  Bars and Eagle to you as an example.
                  1. 0
                    7 January 2013 23: 49
                    Quote: Diesel
                    You said that the Russian Federation "could" modernize the t80, it modernized them
                    Bars and Eagle to you as an example.


                    You are confusing something, there are dozens of OCDs and objects, we have somewhere .. Boxer. And Hammer dust. This does not mean anything.

                    RF COULD T-90 which is a T-72 brought up for the level of T-80U. That's just nepoyma why it was necessary to fence the garden when Uche was Birch.
                    Although probably this was said by higher prices for land and real estate in the second capital of the Russian Federation than in lower tagil.
                    1. Diesel
                      0
                      8 January 2013 00: 02
                      The barely unfolded production managed to produce about 500 tanks, most of which went to the central military districts of Russia. Cut off from the manufacturer and spare parts by the borders, the T-80UD was in danger of an early exhaustion of the resource of the aggregates which is not expected to be replaced, and the leadership of the Russian Ministry of Defense made a natural choice in favor of the tanks entirely produced and provided by the domestic forces.


                      And it’s time to stop this holivar. stop
                      1. +1
                        8 January 2013 00: 11
                        Quote: Diesel
                        Russian Ministry of Defense, made a natural choice in favor of tanks entirely produced and provided by domestic forces



                        It’s interesting, did Leningrad also remain abroad? What can I say is a fundamental mistake, but what can I do?

                        Quote: Diesel
                        Yes, and this holivar time to stop already

                        And how amusing? From this holivar of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation or MZU it is not cold not hot.

                        (((((((((((((((((((((sadness
                        Experienced tank "Object 292" of the design bureau of the Kirov Plant (Spetsmash OJSC) and VNIITransmash scientists. On the basis of the chassis of the T-80U tank, a new turret with a 152 mm cannon and a new MZ was installed. In 1990, a prototype tank was ready, with the exception of the MOH. In 1991, firing tests began at the Rzhev training range. As a result of the tests, positive conclusions were obtained.
                      2. Diesel
                        0
                        8 January 2013 00: 17
                        Quote: Kars
                        It’s interesting, did Leningrad also remain abroad? What can I say is a fundamental mistake, but what can I do?


                        Leningrad didn’t do the same, like 6TDF)))

                        About vol. 292, sorry, a good machine
                      3. +2
                        8 January 2013 00: 33
                        Quote: Diesel
                        Leningrad didn’t do the same, like 6TDF)))

                        Do you really think that you could not install another diesel engine on the T-80 in Leningrad?
                        I have a better opinion of Leningrad designers.
                      4. s1н7т
                        0
                        8 January 2013 02: 16
                        Quote: Diesel
                        Leningrad didn’t do the same, like 6TDF)))

                        You wanted to say - 6TD?
                    2. evil hamster
                      0
                      8 January 2013 14: 19
                      Kindly please? Well, about. 187 and the history of the birth of the T90 fundamentally do not remember? The funny thing is that the article is essentially about OCD, and a running layout for it, but Ukraine was able to, like Russia, isn’t.
                      1. 0
                        8 January 2013 14: 24
                        Quote: evil hamster
                        Kindly please?

                        What is it?
                        Quote: evil hamster
                        Well, about. 187 and the history of the birth of the T90 fundamentally do not remember?

                        And what to remember them? And 187?
                        Quote: evil hamster
                        The funny thing is that the article is essentially about OCD

                        Next then is an article about OCD T-90MS?
                        Quote: evil hamster
                        Type Ukraine was able and the Russian Federation is not.

                        Can you quote citations from the article?
                      2. evil hamster
                        +1
                        8 January 2013 17: 26
                        What is it?
                        Tagil-Kharkov srach vestimo
                        And what to remember them? And 187?
                        This is the topic for this topic:
                        RF COULD T-90 which is a T-72 brought up for the level of T-80U. That's just nepoyma why it was necessary to fence the garden when Uche was Birch.
                        I hope there is no need to explain why the series went about. 188, not 187? It was able to the question could not.
                        Next then is an article about OCD T-90MS?
                        Yes, this is quite fair, however, this also applies to Oplot M, so far, until the delivery of the first batch.
                        Can you quote citations from the article?
                        And what does the article have to do with it, I opposed you
                      3. +2
                        8 January 2013 22: 32
                        Quote: evil hamster

                        What exactly? Tagil-Kharkov srach vestimo

                        I'm wildly sorry hi But evil languages ​​claimed that there was no competition in the USSR laughing
                        It turns out it was? Maybe that's why we still live on this groundwork in many ways? Guys cool drink vodka bite salsa and ??? And let Russia and Ukraine grow stronger.
                      4. 0
                        8 January 2013 22: 37
                        Yes, I forgot to say I would not refuse hot potatoes; and ... Belarusians laughing
                      5. bach2007
                        +1
                        23 January 2013 15: 31
                        Hello everyone! competition was still what. read a book or review of the History of Soviet Tank Engineering. I can definitely say, without any bias - almost all Soviet tanks were copied from the 64, 72nd cheaper version of the 64 ki. Then at the top, each republic lobbied for its interests. By the way, when the Kharkov Design Bureau returned from evacuation from N. Tagil, the development drawings were not returned to Kharkov, and then, on the instructions of the party, a cheap (and simplified) 64-bit version appeared - T 72. But this is not about that. At the moment, Kharkov really made a very cool BTR-4, and the Oplot-M tank. And we don’t need to water us with mud. Take and compare from reliable sources of Old. Do you better or at least something normal - we will be happy for you. In the meantime, Ukraine has the best developments and upgrades in this topic!
                        and here is the link to the article
                        http://btvt.narod.ru/voprosi/voprosi.htm
                        http://topwar.ru/17153-obt-i-ih-sozdateli.html
        2. +4
          7 January 2013 23: 16
          Kars, as expected, will defend Kharkov. The points:
          1. More often than not, simplicity = reliability. Will we argue? A decrease in CD in A (M) S? But the driver can be pulled out and BC below. For a long time Tagil did not give more modern sighting devices - everything went to Kharkov and Leningrad, this is a question for politicians, not designers.
          2. Let's look at the buyers of the apt-up T-64. Why is Indian money bad? Worse than Pakistani?
          3. Well, yes, very much your tubercles pay attention to our opinion, if you find someone to sell, sell it.
          4. Twitching. The well-known fact of the appearance of the name "T-90", they wanted another index to 72, Yeltsin decided otherwise - for a "young" country - "like a new tank". And 72 fought - a fact, I hope?
          1. 0
            7 January 2013 23: 23
            Quote: Mikhado
            More modern sights Tagil for a long time just did not give

            Is this an argument?
            Quote: Mikhado
            Let’s look at the buyers of the apt-up T-64

            I deeply hope so.
            Quote: Mikhado
            Why is Indian money bad? Worse than Pakistani?

            Nothing, only Pakistan, unlike India, did not build a tank factory under the USSR. Therefore, India, in principle, has no choice but the T72 / 90.
            Quote: Mikhado
            . Well, yes, very much your hillocks pay attention to our opinion, if you find someone to sell, sell it.

            Unfortunately, they turn very strongly. A contract for the construction of a nuclear power plant in Iran immediately comes to our minds, ours could have received several billionth contracts, but M. Clinton rushed in and everyone refused.
            Quote: Mikhado
            And 72 have fought - a fact, I hope?

            If you still argue, the T-64 also fought, since the T-72 is a simplified T-64 for mobilization reserve and sale / gifts to various Papuans and friends in the social camp.
            1. Diesel
              +2
              7 January 2013 23: 49
              Quote: Kars
              T-72 is a simplified T-64

              Well, T72 and T64 - there are different names for different cars produced by different factories developed in different design bureaus, isn’t that so? laughing
              1. +2
                8 January 2013 00: 03
                Quote: Diesel
                developed in different design bureaus, isn't that so

                Say honestly, yes, but one gun and one ammunition bother me. The T-72M and T-72M1 (which really fought) weren’t over the T-64A, so the concept of the Soviet tank fought.
                1. Diesel
                  0
                  8 January 2013 00: 18
                  Quote: Kars
                  so the concept of the Soviet tank fought

                  I agree with this)
                2. s1н7т
                  +1
                  8 January 2013 02: 23
                  Quote: Kars
                  fought the concept of the Soviet tank.

                  Absolutely true!
                  64, 72, 80 - conceptually one tank.
                  It is gratifying that our designers then looked far ahead, but it saddens us that now they don’t see nichrome.
                  1. 0
                    8 January 2013 17: 07
                    Quote: c1n7
                    64, 72, 80 - conceptually one tank.

                    Why is there no T-34, T-55 on the list? And also ... their name is legion!
                    All conceptually one tank!
            2. +12
              8 January 2013 00: 01
              I would not want to stoop to sracha, in fact, I will not. You can never prove to a parent that his dearly beloved child is lame and moody.
              Stay with your two-stroke, unappreciated miracle, stay in sweet euphoria from its unearthly perfection.
              We, wretched northern barbarians, we will continue to ride on our worthless primitive simplified wagons, woe to us, woe crying
              1. Diesel
                +4
                8 January 2013 00: 04
                Quote: Mikhado
                We, wretched northern barbarians, we will continue to ride on our worthless primitive simplified wagons, woe to us, woe

                crying drinks Plus)
              2. s1н7т
                +1
                8 January 2013 02: 25
                Quote: Mikhado
                push-pull, unappreciated miracle,

                No, the idea is definitely good. It remains only to translate)
                1. 0
                  8 January 2013 22: 41
                  They embody 60 years - principal ailments are incurable.
              3. +1
                8 January 2013 02: 37
                Quote: Mikhado
                continue to ride our worthless primitive simplified wagons, woe to us, woe

                Do not worry so much, for the MS a lot has been done to fix the transmission and MTO.
                And while we will sell to the Chinese
                Quote: Mikhado
                his push-pull, unappreciated miracle


                But push-pull helps you restore constitutionality.
                1. 0
                  8 January 2013 22: 52
                  Kars,
                  Quote: Kars
                  But push-pull helps you restore constitutionality.

                  But this is an outright clumsy. While we are DIFFERENT states, there is no need to joke on such topics, this is OUR Russian tragedy. Ducks turned up - Yolkin and sent them, there could be any.
                  And the lot of two-strokes is cheap scooters, on tanks this is a dead end that you entered 60 years ago, and now the "master's ambition" does not allow you to recognize the truth.
                  Come on, Kars, give out the bricks, stand up for the "Ridny Square 5 (6) -TDF, prove our backwardness and simplicity.
                  1. 0
                    8 January 2013 23: 15
                    Quote: Mikhado
                    While we are DIFFERENT states, do not joke on such topics, this is our Russian tragedy

                    Where's the joke? The tank of the Kontimirovsky court division. Defends the EBN which gave the name T-90
                    Quote: Mikhado
                    Come on, Kars, give out bricks, stand up for "Ridny Square 5 (6) -TDF, prove our backwardness and simplicity

                    Why do I need to prove something? Do you know a lot of complaints from the Pakistani contract? Or have you heard about such a tank Al-Khalid? Can you tell me why the Chinese continue to buy this push-pull muck
                    Quote: Mikhado
                    and now the "master's ambition" does not allow to recognize the truth.

                    So I see a campaign of elementary envy. Probably from greed and from trying to prove that you have all the best.
            3. 0
              8 January 2013 23: 17
              Quote: Mikhado
              Well, yes, they really pay your attention to our opinion, find someone to sell - sell
        3. Beltar
          +4
          8 January 2013 03: 21
          The T-72 is not a simplified version, it's just a battle-worthy tank, unlike.
        4. evil hamster
          0
          8 January 2013 14: 46
          And you are upgrading a tank that was a simplified version of the T-64

          Well, why can someone upgrade the 80-ku and call it beautiful names, but to us nizya?
          these are old T-90s. No one has bought MS yet. In this case, the main buyer is India.
          And what, this cancels the fact that the T90 was sold for export by a series of at least 1200 cars (these are only those that are already)
          The chances are minimal - the only thing that can affect is that the Russian Federation sells weapons to some countries in the DEBT on its own loans.
          as well as deliveries are possible to countries to which the West will not sell anything at all. and we cannot sell what would not be a quarrel.
          Ha three times. Well, of course, the modernization of a car sold in a volume of 1200 and whose ancestor was sold in general in the amount of over9000 has minimal chances. Etozh obviously smile But the modernization of the T64b, which was not seen in the eyes of the Union, it has more chances, of course :)))
          1. 0
            8 January 2013 15: 02
            Quote: evil hamster
            Well, why can someone upgrade the 80-ku and call it beautiful names, but to us nizya?

            Because this is a step back, and then call it the first Russian production tank)))))))
            Quote: evil hamster
            And what, this cancels the fact that the T90 was sold for export by a series of at least 1200 cars (these are only those that are already)

            I explained elsewhere.
            Quote: evil hamster
            Ha three times

            at least four, how has India already ordered there after an exhibition in its territory?
            Quote: evil hamster
            here she has more chances then of course :)))

            There is also a characteristic like the price, MS 4 million. Damask steel -600 thousand (plus an old tank from storage), this will be under two million.
            Quote: evil hamster
            sold altogether over 9000, has minimal chances

            There are also enough charred them around the world, and you don’t even take them into service, at least for pro forma.
            1. evil hamster
              +1
              8 January 2013 18: 23
              Because this is a step back, and then call it the first Russian production tank)))))))
              You categorically forget to put IMHO, but in vain because this is it. The T90 of 93 is identical, the T80 of U. Scolding is equivalent, one is generally one, one is faster and gluttonous, the other is slower but more economical and decently cheaper. so there are no steps back. And please do not need double standards: it appears t80UD with a welded tower, we suddenly t84 stronghold and this type is normal, but about. 188 - T90 nizya, out of concept
              at least four, how has India already ordered there after an exhibition in its territory?
              You have problems with the logic. What was India required to order? Maybe Oplot bought all the countries where it was shown?
              There is also a characteristic like the price, MS 4 million. Damask steel -600 thousand (plus an old tank from storage), this will be under two million.
              I’m lost, but where does Bulat come from, where was it mentioned here? With all of my rather modest modernization of the T64B, for some reason you are comparing it with a new tank and making far reaching conclusions! What is it for? You better compare with the stronghold M, the one is also more expensive.
              There are also enough charred them around the world, and you don’t even take them into service, at least for pro forma.
              You can’t meet the burnt T64 in connection with the lack of a patient in conflicts, although there are not a bit of corpses in Transnistria. I can reveal a terrible secret, but nobody was going to take the T90MS into service, this is a purely export-oriented product. Not Tagil, of course, would gladly sell it to MO, only nothing would work out in the form of a modernization kit.
              1. 0
                8 January 2013 19: 05
                Quote: evil hamster
                You categorically forget to put IMHO

                And not going to.
                Quote: evil hamster
                T90 93 years identical, T80 U

                Well, what am I talking about?
                Quote: Kars
                Because it's a step back

                T-80U --1985
                T90 SMOG could become identity by 1993, is this a step forward?
                Quote: evil hamster
                the other is slower but more economical and decently cheaper. so there are no steps back

                It was back and even for a whole decade. Especially when there was already a sample with a diesel engine in the series.
                Quote: evil hamster
                You have problems with the logic. What was India required to order?
                I just asked how are you?

                Quote: evil hamster
                I’m lost, but where does Bulat come from, where was it mentioned here? With all of my rather modest modernization of the T64B, for some reason you are comparing it with a new tank and making far reaching conclusions! What is it for? You better compare with the stronghold M, the one is also more expensive

                Quote: Kars
                There is also a characteristic like price, MS 4 million. Damask steel -600 thousand (plus an old tank from storage), this will be under two million

                Find here the estimated price of the T-64E
                Quote: evil hamster
                You better compare with the stronghold M, the one is also more expensive

                What for?
                Quote: evil hamster
                But the modernization of the T64b, which was not seen in the eyes of the Union, it has more chances, of course :)))

                You spoke specifically about upgrades 64, and they answered you.
                Quote: evil hamster
                Oh yes you will not meet the burnt T64 in connection with the lack of a patient in conflicts

                Quote: evil hamster
                I can reveal a terrible secret, but nobody was going to take the T90MS into service, this is a purely export-oriented product

                No, you won’t open it and it’s not a secret, but a big mistake that will complicate the export of MS very much
                1. 0
                  8 January 2013 19: 14
                  Quote: evil hamster
                  it appears t80UD with a welded tower, we suddenly T84 Oplot and this type is normal, but about. 188 - T90 nizya, out of concept


                  In general, the T-90 you have done before our T-84.

                  And I am not opposed in principle, but could have been more modest than the T-74, T-76. We didn’t call the T-95 even though we had every right to take calendar dates.
                  1. evil hamster
                    0
                    8 January 2013 22: 13
                    Quote: Kars
                    And I am not opposed in principle, but could have been more modest than the T-74, T-76. We didn’t call the T-95 even though we had every right to take calendar dates.
                    That is, it’s all a claim :) they say it’s not a pretty hat, they’ve had fun smile
                    1. 0
                      8 January 2013 22: 18
                      Quote: evil hamster
                      That is all this claim

                      I don’t have any claims, these are your problems.
                      the pursuit is unclear why the promising projects were ruined while building for the RF Armed Forces less than half a hundred ersatz T-80U
                  2. 0
                    17 March 2017 21: 01
                    According to Vrungel, as you call a yacht, so it will sail!
                2. evil hamster
                  +1
                  8 January 2013 22: 11
                  Quote: Kars
                  And not going to.
                  Do you know everything? Sinless at times?
                  Quote: Kars
                  T-80U --1985
                  T90 SMOG could become identity by 1993, is this a step forward?
                  Well, as soon as free sou appeared so immediately and caught up. But in 85 it was somehow not enough.
                  Quote: Kars
                  It was back and even for a whole decade. Especially when there was already a sample with a diesel engine in the series.
                  If you forgot that in 91 the states of the Russian Federation and Ukraine were organized, and so in the first they made the T80 with a gas turbine, and in the second with a diesel, and not vice versa.
                  Quote: Kars
                  Find here the estimated price of the T-64E
                  And why do you actually conclude about the price of T64E for Bulat? In damask steel there is no TVP, no panorama, no additional weapons. Or that neither the TVP nor the panorama on the T64E will be either?
                  Quote: Kars
                  What for?
                  And why not, actually, why are you comparing prices for T90MS and T64E, even though they are machines of different price and consumer categories. So why go far then, compare with the native product.
                  Quote: Kars
                  You spoke specifically about upgrades 64, and they answered you.
                  No, no, no, I started this motley:
                  Quote: Kars
                  The chances are minimal - the only thing that can affect is that the Russian Federation sells weapons to some countries in the DEBT on its own loans.
                  as well as deliveries are possible to countries to which the West will not sell anything at all. and we cannot sell what would not be a quarrel.
                  Your opponent had quite sane arguments, but you don’t have any say at all: there is no chance, that’s because I want it so much, and if this is not so, then loans and outcast countries.
                  Quote: Kars
                  No, you won’t open it and it’s not a secret, but a big mistake that will complicate the export of MS very much
                  In returning to the first point, and most importantly, it’s reasoned how, I said a mistake and there’s nothing to discuss here
                  1. 0
                    8 January 2013 22: 25
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    Do you know everything? Sinless at times?

                    strange conclusion.
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    Well, as soon as free sou appeared so immediately and caught up. But in 85 it was somehow not enough

                    You can see the mat part to learn and teach.
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    If you forgot that in the year 91 the states of the Russian Federation and Ukraine were organized, and so in the first they made the T80 with a gas turbine, and in the second with a diesel, and not vice versa

                    Do you deny the possibility of the Leningrad or Omsk tank builders putting a diesel engine on the T-80U without the help of Kharkov?
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    T64E according to Bulat? In damask steel there is no TVP, no panorama, no additional weapons

                    therefore E and more expensive.
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    Why are you comparing the prices of T90MS and T64E for some reason, although these are machines of different price and consumer categories.

                    The consumer category is the same, but E is cheaper. MS has not one important advantage in terms of performance characteristics.
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    Your opponent had quite sane arguments, but you don’t have any say at all: there is no chance, that’s because I want it so much, and if this is not so, then loans and outcast countries.

                    These are your problems if you do not see the arguments, for now, as a regular customer, India doesn’t buy something. And I can assume from possible operators India and Venezuela (if the chavez is still alive and on loan)
                    Quote: evil hamster
                    Vo in returning to the first paragraph

                    which one?

                    Quote: evil hamster
                    the main argument is how I missed the slip and there’s nothing to discuss here

                    Did you understand what you wrote?
                  2. 0
                    17 March 2017 21: 05
                    Khomyakov-in tanks!
              2. 0
                23 October 2016 14: 46
                T-64 is full in the Donbass.
        5. +1
          8 January 2013 17: 15
          Quote: Kars
          And you are upgrading a tank that was a simplified version of the T-64

          A deeply modernized version, so to speak, economically optimized, as far as possible to say about the production of military equipment.
          T-64 is the pearl of Soviet tank building, is it really not familiar?
      2. Beltar
        0
        8 January 2013 03: 20
        Operational experience is. In Russia, won already sold at the price of scrap metal.
  20. I. Brovkin
    0
    7 January 2013 21: 00
    It is a pity that in Russia 64k this year will go to mass remelting massively. Nevertheless, if we didn’t have so many 72k and 80k modernization of 64ok would be justified.
    T-72 was not in the SA Groups behind the cordon

    Why did you decide that you weren’t! It was not only in the ZGVG, but in the other groups of troops they were.
    1. +1
      7 January 2013 21: 06
      Quote: I. Brovkin
      if we didn’t have so many 72ik and 80ok, upgrading 64ok would be justified.

      Well, 64 matches are more likely to be deduced from the resource, but why there is no project for deep modernization of 80 matches is a question.
      And I think the answer to it is oh-so-many do not like it.
      bully
      1. ximik
        +2
        7 January 2013 21: 54
        because the Omsk did 80ku, and 72 \ 90 UVZ. Uvz lobbyists are cooler.
        1. +3
          7 January 2013 23: 51
          Quote: ximik

          because the Omsk did 80ku, and 72 \ 90 UVZ. Uvz lobbyists are cooler.


          The people, well, already, really. 80 is good, no doubt, but you need to count money, the jerk is several times more expensive, and its advantages are not so certain as to overpay. At the same time, 80s are already equipped with a good default, they will do their job, maybe they will get electronic nishtyaks over time.
          And about lobbying ... In the 60s and 70s it was Kharkiv who had a "hairy hand" in Moscow and pushed its miracle with all its might. The warriors howled and kicked out, but for a long time they were forced to cohabit with the capricious Kharkov "columbine". The material on this topic is the sea.
          1. +3
            8 January 2013 00: 00
            Quote: Mikhado
            . 80 is good, no doubt, but you need to count money, the jerk is several times more expensive


            Does this not tell you anything?
            T-80UD (1987) - a 6TD diesel engine with a capacity of 1000hp was installed, dynamic protection in built-in version.

            Quote: Mikhado
            to cohabitation with the capricious Kharkov "columbine". The material on this topic is the sea

            the opposite is no less.
            1. +1
              8 January 2013 01: 59
              Go eat fat, maybe it will pass ...
              1. +2
                8 January 2013 02: 39
                Quote: dima1970
                Go eat fat, maybe it will pass ...

                Is it from personal experience? The digestive tract has little effect on me and my thoughts (hunger does not count)
          2. 0
            8 January 2013 16: 55
            Quote: Mikhado
            The warriors howled and kicked back

            From what, only clarify, otherwise it turns out howled and kicked back from a missile-cannon tank? So in the GBV they were driven as a counterweight to Abrams.
            And the turbine, that turbine, was made economically by the UD.
            Quote: Mikhado
            jerk several times more expensive

            And military equipment, by definition, is expensive, its economic efficiency is considered in a completely different way.
            Quote: Mikhado
            Kharkov had a "hairy hand" in Moscow and was pushing its miracle with all its might.

            Which car instead?
      2. Beltar
        -3
        8 January 2013 03: 39
        Fuel consumption and the general high cost of the tank. The fact of bankruptcy of the Omsk Panzer is probably not decisive here.
        Generally GTD fftopku. Now there are equal diesel engines.
        1. 0
          8 January 2013 20: 39
          Quote: Beltar
          The fact of bankruptcy of the Omsk Panzer is probably not decisive here.

          I will reveal a terrible secret! The best!
          Transmash did not go bankrupt like a tank; it was simply bankrupt. And the conversion production has already gone bankrupt!

          A 80-ku mister Beltar they are still waiting for tenders, but now they only offer her native Oplot.
    2. Beltar
      -2
      8 January 2013 03: 37
      No pity.
  21. slava.iwasenko
    +2
    7 January 2013 21: 20
    Great car !!! soldier
  22. escobar
    +1
    7 January 2013 22: 58
    The headline is certainly pompous, but the fact that the Kharkov school is alive and capable of serious steps is very pleasing. If all these matters were with cooperation with fraternal Russia .. eh.
    1. +4
      7 January 2013 23: 31
      Well, if I were Ukrainian, I would also be glad that my country is "mogot" for something, but "yak klyaty resident of Muskva"))), of course, I root for "friends", the UVZ school is closer to me. The roots of the confrontation between Kharkov and Tagil go back to "the totalitarian past," and the mutual non-pollution now has a national motive. And then, in Soviet times, the situation with three MBTs was called a "tank tragedy", this is an impermissible luxury even for the empire. Now it is a national affair of every state, a judge is not even a battlefield (nedaybog), but the world market. It is not our fault that your hillocks have loved the most powerful Ukrainian industry, and, no offense, you simply have NOTHING to produce tanks even of your design and maintain their maintenance.
      And I do not see yet any prerequisites for cooperation, your tank builders themselves are clearly positioning themselves as COMPETITION to the Russians, right down to black PR. Alas, this is the bitter truth.
      1. s1н7т
        -2
        8 January 2013 02: 31
        Quote: Mikhado
        mutual non-pollution now has a national motive

        What, sick? s and Russians are one nation! "Tagil RulIt" - it was only for the elections, calm down! And the tank school was always one - Soviet!
        1. 0
          8 January 2013 22: 38
          Healthy. The very "s" that the filter did not allow you to write, do not really break into "one nation", especially their mounds. Tagil rules because he is really alive, unlike. There were at least three Soviet tank schools, the Urals survived like MacLeod.
          1. 0
            8 January 2013 22: 46
            Quote: Mikhado
            Tagil rules because

            that privatization is waiting for him soon))))))) and we need to invest more (your) money there. And then an effective manager will come.
      2. 0
        17 March 2017 21: 12
        Well, even archieffective projects are ruined by elementary bribes, selling instead of a new-resuscitated-repainted used one with God knows what -... stuffing
  23. +6
    7 January 2013 23: 11
    Modernization options !!!
  24. Kochetkov.serzh
    +2
    8 January 2013 00: 04
    window dressing alone! no sense
  25. +4
    8 January 2013 00: 11
    64 is probably good, but why are Ukrainians selling pancake STABLE ONLY upgraded 72 ?? !! this is apparently a paradox. And if they run out of supplies 72 what will they sell ?? winked Is it time for the earth? In the sense, tank schools should be combined again, it will be much more fun, and B2 common and actually tanks ALWAYS were common, THERE ARE NO PRINCIPLE differences, even if you can now move a dvigun from 64 to 72 without any problems, and 64 have a weapon system from compatible 72- 80-90, let's get back to us .. laughing
    1. Beltar
      +2
      8 January 2013 03: 40
      Because no one needs the T-64.
    2. +2
      22 October 2016 23: 04
      Well, such an unification on Y, the Russian Federation went through the stage of the drunk Yeltsin and the war on its territory, and Ukraine is just beginning its Golgotha ​​and judging by the chosen ideology of such a president and CITIZEN as there will be no GDP.
  26. +6
    8 January 2013 00: 24
    old srach which is better, a 60s tank made in Kharkov or a 60s tank from Tagil. imho need to move on ...
  27. stranik72
    +7
    8 January 2013 00: 47
    Well done, the Slavs don’t understand tanks, but I'm glad for you that you don’t give up and train your design brains, let it work out for you. drinks
  28. evil
    +1
    8 January 2013 01: 46
    Well done, there are no brothers, there’s no current where to sell, Russia has car factories for maintenance and so on ... are we competing for Africa?

    Like, I wanted to say, let's live back in one country ...
  29. s1н7т
    0
    8 January 2013 02: 36
    Well done let them train! The time will come, again we will create one tank for all!
  30. boris.radevitch
    0
    8 January 2013 03: 38
    Better than the T-90 tank in the world have not yet been conceived! tongue
  31. -1
    8 January 2013 03: 46
    Infantry tank .. Export potential .. Tank of the ХХХХХУ century ... Adin pieces. The Kharkovites have no where to work, go home, for us.
    To whom? Georgia, Iraq, Pakistan?
    Markets are divided ..
    P.S. Sorry for the bile, BEER does not sell from 22.00
    How to live?
    1. 0
      8 January 2013 04: 38
      Such comments are furious! And who are you ???? In truth, you don’t know, do not revive the strife !! Ukraine and Russia 2 are strange who can at least do something from the CIS countries and the former Warsaw Pact! There was one tank school, at the moment the body is divided, something we have something for you, and not yes, Kharkovites are equated to TT, in terms of Export, you have a similar set !!! Well, right, take the territory of Ukraine and Russia, and the amount of weapons on the territory, the figures are the same in the coefficient!
      1. 0
        8 January 2013 13: 40
        and if per person, not territory?
      2. 0
        8 January 2013 16: 46
        What really annoys is the lack of basic literacy.
        And where is my discord? With a wife's ear - problematic, will stop feeding bully
        The demon is inhabited
      3. 0
        17 March 2017 21: 20
        What else but sweets? The Utes machine gun is Kazakhstan-Uralsk.
  32. +1
    8 January 2013 04: 13
    GOOD LUCK !!!
  33. boris.radevitch
    +4
    8 January 2013 05: 56
    We’ll do such tanks soon with Ukrainians. The world is gasping!
  34. +1
    8 January 2013 12: 00
    good T-64E tank or bad, it is not known, in any case, it will have childhood diseases. The T-90 has a huge advantage over him and its name is a large series and continued improvement in the series + the actual running-in in many local conflicts of its predecessor (T-72) and the actual operation in many climatic zones. The same Indians drive them in the tail and mane and it is naive to think that India is only a tropical climate, it is mountains and cold. The continued procurement of the T-90 speaks volumes and the most important thing is the real military operation, the designers see what happened and improve. T-64E can be an excellent tank (or is), but its true characteristics are not clear, but you can declare anything
    1. 0
      17 March 2017 21: 24
      There is nowhere to fight, except within oneself, with the same ones that are not modern. No, three or four newfangled people will eat up the entire military budget. And what should law-bearers eat? Again for caches?
  35. +2
    8 January 2013 17: 15
    s1н7тThe T-80 is the best not only because it runs fast, it has the most advanced control system and chassis of the entire three MBT. The power reserve, yes, is small, but with that road network (GSVG) and the saturation of the gas station, this is not the biggest problem. And the general reliability of the engine, confident start, moment, low noise level, and all this many times outweighs its "gluttony", at least in war conditions. So I am for T80, this is the best we have. While there is ..
    1. evil hamster
      0
      8 January 2013 19: 17
      The best that we have in the army today is the T90A. However, there would be no problems for the T80 to come to the same level if Omsk had not gone bankrupt. Rather, if the Union had not broken up. But this is another story with a bunch of unrealized projects. By the 90th year, all plants had something to show
    2. 0
      22 October 2016 22: 55
      T-80 is the best tank for use in the polar latitudes!
    3. 0
      17 March 2017 20: 34
      And where are you? What are the gluttonous gas turbines going to find? Are you going to pump crude oil from the well? Aviation kerosene crumbs at an unburned aerodrome. Civilians burned out before gas stations are absent. Chechen factories should be brought with you? Your suggestions - how to feed the engines?
  36. +2
    8 January 2013 19: 49
    Quote: evil hamster
    However, there would be no problems for the T80 to come to the same level if Omsk had not gone bankrupt. Rather, if the Union had not broken up.

    I think many will agree that the collapse of the Union was not the main cause of bankruptcy, although it was a prerequisite, however, as with many other things. but the fate of the T80 was decided all the same deliberately in favor of the relatively weak T72, with all the ensuing consequences - bankruptcy, the appearance of T90, etc.
    1. 0
      8 January 2013 20: 46
      Quote: MRomanovich
      T80 decided all the same intentionally in favor

      In favor of the T-90!
      No need to distort the already distorted enough history of our tank building.
      1. 0
        9 January 2013 01: 46
        as the 72nd do not call - T90 or otherwise, it still remains the 72nd in fact.
        1. 0
          21 October 2016 05: 39
          Only the caterpillar base remained for your information.
    2. 0
      17 March 2017 21: 28
      Argument with documentary, technical and accounting calculations. Then you will be understood
  37. toguns
    +2
    8 January 2013 19: 52
    "T-64E became a tank of the XXI century"
    thank you laugh wassat, knowing the problems in the military industrial complex of independent Ukraine, however, as in their MO, I wouldn’t throw such loud phrases.
    1. 0
      17 March 2017 20: 37
      He really didn’t really become a tank of the 20th century. The famous engine-counter. They were wallowing in parks in the 80s
  38. 0
    21 October 2016 05: 35
    It looks good, but one trouble, no one wants to buy knowing the quality of the product.
  39. 0
    22 October 2016 13: 10
    Quote: barbiturate
    good T-64E tank or bad, it’s unknown
  40. +2
    22 October 2016 22: 50
    On the T-34, you can also install: dynamic protection, a new engine, new electronics, a new tower, etc., but this will not make it a modern tank. The civil war in Ukraine proved that it is useless to use obsolete tanks, in view of the development of anti-tank weapons. The shape of the tower is ideal for hitting a turret sheet and, accordingly, it guarantees the crew that has been almost completely scraped and cremated!
    1. 0
      17 March 2017 20: 41
      In 80, he shot a blank at Ruca from Acacia at it, put it in pursuit. The tower took off. Zaman!
  41. The comment was deleted.
  42. 0
    23 October 2016 15: 45
    The analog of T72 does not reach T90.
  43. +3
    23 October 2016 20: 10
    I had the opportunity to command the unit armed with the T-64. There was no worse tank in my practice. Even compared to the T-62, not to mention the T-72 and T80. I don’t know the T-90. And looking at the T-64E, I see that all its negative qualities have not changed. These are frail and narrow rollers, which if a caterpillar flies off crashes into the ground so that it is impossible to tow the tank. Very complex tracks, if the caterpillar is interrupted, changing them is very difficult. The 5TDF engine only starts in the summer and then for this the tank has 24 volt batteries. It is difficult to start it in winter, and since the side boxes are hydraulic, it is impossible even to get a tug. The outlines of the tower are even worse than steel, the opposite angle between the hull and the tower, on the contrary, will catch shells, and the dynamic defense for the sub-caliber drum, it does not have a cumulative stream. If the tower jammed, the driver didn’t open his hatch, and it was impossible to climb into the tower from the control compartment. In general, this is not a tank, but a guano.
    1. 0
      17 March 2017 20: 52
      What else! I rolled it over 1000 km to be sent for training from conservation ... It didn’t burn, but the tower jumped off the stopper and the entire crew was alone, the specialty is the commander of the Akatsiya SG. Without shells, it’s empty! 64 how I got out with a rope over the barrel turned the tower. They pushed the stopper into place. Then everything is normal
      1. 0
        17 March 2017 21: 05
        Quote: ty60
        It didn’t burn, but the tower jumped off the stopper ...

        - Why did the tower jump off? laughing

        Quote: ty60
        For half a day, they thought with the T-64 mechanical drive how I got out with a cable for the barrel, turned the tower. They pushed the stopper into place. Then everything was normal

        - Explain if not breaking. I know T-64 well if ...

        Quote: ty60
        Not burning, but ...

        - I was both burning and drowning ... there was a lot of everything. But you can always get out of the tower without any problems ... stop, damn it request

        PS: if you write "from the place of the mehan", then:

        - there was a button, an emergency turn of the tower, like ... I really don’t remember her name, but I definitely have it. At the mechanic, yes. This time.
        - You can leave through the landing hatch, if only. These are two.
        - and you can also teleport wassat

        In short, in vain you there "consulted" with mehan, IMHO
  44. 0
    24 October 2016 13: 20
    And who is financing this project?
  45. The comment was deleted.
  46. +1
    25 October 2016 08: 54
    Particularly pleased with the combat module based on GSH 23.
    Immediately obvious, the tank was designed by real experts.
    Nothing that everything that is hung on the tank from the outside is a priori a consumable?
    And if there Kord which costs reasonable money, and reasonably weighs, at the same time,
    which allows it to be changed by the crew, then the dismantling of the spoiled module with GS 23 will require an ARV and cost a lot of money. Nothing that a shell does not enter her nomenclature, is used only in aviation, and requires a complete change in logistics? Nothing that maintenance and operating conditions of the aircraft gun
    a little different?
    That it just stupidly stuck after the first three kilometers on a primer in the summer?
    But should a flying gunsmith clean and repair it?
    And finally, the location of the gun allows him to shoot.
    But shooting and shooting are two different things. I doubt that firing in bursts will not lead to a buildup of the tank,
    and as a result of zero efficiency. This is just offhand ...
    Here are all the fools around. Both Russians and Americans, Germans, French ... British ...
    They’ve been doing tanks for a hundred years now, it’s worse, better there ... In different ways ... But they didn’t guess how to attach an aircraft gun to the tower.
    Some big-screeners are ahead of the rest ....
    1. 0
      17 March 2017 20: 56
      See Middle East - JIHAD TANK !!!!!
  47. +1
    10 November 2016 11: 39
    Um ... article from 07.01.2013/XNUMX/XNUMX, however ... okay. What immediately catches your eye:
    - DZ Knife - only the lazy one hasn't scolded her yet. This Knife remarkably "cuts" its infantry and sometimes cripples the vehicle on which it is installed. He's the one who protects her so zealously, yeah ...
    - forced 5TDF is five. He is not forced and capricious, as ... in general, extremely fastidious. Forced in the crazy hands of the ukrotankists will burn like a candle. And even the presence of a "high-speed system of fire-fighting equipment using optical sensors" will never save
    - About lazy cartridges of charges also did not write about vertically located in the Ministry of Health (around the commander with the gunner). And that certainly hasn’t changed.
    - and so - to nuchet ... a wonderful machine turned out laughing
  48. 0
    18 November 2016 05: 12
    What a hohlyadsky stuffing?
  49. 0
    17 March 2017 20: 21
    he is a dead man of the 21st century

"Right Sector" (banned in Russia), "Ukrainian Insurgent Army" (UPA) (banned in Russia), ISIS (banned in Russia), "Jabhat Fatah al-Sham" formerly "Jabhat al-Nusra" (banned in Russia) , Taliban (banned in Russia), Al-Qaeda (banned in Russia), Anti-Corruption Foundation (banned in Russia), Navalny Headquarters (banned in Russia), Facebook (banned in Russia), Instagram (banned in Russia), Meta (banned in Russia), Misanthropic Division (banned in Russia), Azov (banned in Russia), Muslim Brotherhood (banned in Russia), Aum Shinrikyo (banned in Russia), AUE (banned in Russia), UNA-UNSO (banned in Russia), Mejlis of the Crimean Tatar people (banned in Russia), Legion “Freedom of Russia” (armed formation, recognized as terrorist in the Russian Federation and banned), Kirill Budanov (included to the Rosfinmonitoring list of terrorists and extremists)

“Non-profit organizations, unregistered public associations or individuals performing the functions of a foreign agent,” as well as media outlets performing the functions of a foreign agent: “Medusa”; "Voice of America"; "Realities"; "Present time"; "Radio Freedom"; Ponomarev Lev; Ponomarev Ilya; Savitskaya; Markelov; Kamalyagin; Apakhonchich; Makarevich; Dud; Gordon; Zhdanov; Medvedev; Fedorov; Mikhail Kasyanov; "Owl"; "Alliance of Doctors"; "RKK" "Levada Center"; "Memorial"; "Voice"; "Person and law"; "Rain"; "Mediazone"; "Deutsche Welle"; QMS "Caucasian Knot"; "Insider"; "New Newspaper"