Military Review

The controversial Nazarbayev

226
The controversial NazarbayevAfter the recent performance of the permanent Kazakhstani leader with the message “Strategy Kazakhstan-2050”, many people interested in the processes in the post-Soviet space have some food for thought. And this time, Nursultan Nazarbayev decided to follow the path of announcing plans for the future, which was to arrange both his supporters and his opponents. At the same time, it would seem that his speech, designed to highlight the entire Strategy for the next 38 years, was prepared by people from different political camps. The result was somewhat contradictory; as controversial as can be judged, at least from Russia, which since 2010 has been together with Kazakhstan and Belarus in the EurAsEC Customs Union.


On the one hand, Nazarbayeva’s speech abounded in words about the need to develop an innovative economy, integration with the closest neighbors within the CIS and the Customs Union, and preserving the status of the Russian language in the republic. These statements can be considered a balm for the soul of the so-called Eurasians - supporters of the development of relations between the states of the former USSR and all those for whom the principles of a healthy economic and geopolitical partnership play an important role.

But in the speech of the same Nazarbayev, there were also alternative notes that were aimed at a completely different audience. Here Nursultan Abishevich designated the problems of development of Kazakhstan as a single state outside the conjuncture of blocs, unions and associations. The Kazakhstan leader used the thesis that Kazakhstan should go along its rails, developing both the economy and the language on internal principles. This same part of the Strategy included the idea that the Kazakh language should soon be translated into Latin, after which it allegedly would receive a more significant impetus to development than the one that exists at the moment. It should be noted that the statement about the translation of the Kazakh language into the Latin alphabet Nursultan Nazarbayev poured water on the mill of that part of Kazakhstan’s society, which is clearly set to promote the idea of ​​the unique position of Kazakhstan, to disintegration with Russia, in particular. What a sin to conceal, Nazarbayev’s speech about translating the language into Latin and the need to develop an innovative economy on the basis of Kazakhstan’s exclusive geopolitical role somehow does not fit well with the integration principles outlined in another part of the message.

After Kazakhstan political analysts compared individual episodes of the president’s speech, local publications filled with materials that Nazarbayev so blurred the true vision of the future of the country that neither his supporters nor his opponents had an unequivocal opinion on where to go. Kazakhstan, according to Nursultan Abishevich. If we assume that the priority is the Customs Union, how much does the unexpected statement about switching the Kazakh language into Latin, which is actually recognized by the President of Kazakhstan as the best basis for the development of Kazakh identity than the Cyrillic alphabet used by both Russia and Belarus, fit with the integration plans? If we assume that the words about the “breakthrough” alphabet and the sovereign economy are a provocation against their colleagues in the Customs Union, then how can the words about the need to develop partnership relations with neighbors fit in with it? Perhaps Nazarbayev, by the word "neighbors", means completely different states: well, China, for example ...

Oppositional Kazakhstani newspapers quickly picked up the presidential wave, giving away some nationalist notes, and stated that Nazarbayev, at the end of his reign, decided to finally wave the drab towards Russia, from which Kazakhstan "receives only problems." These problems for Kazakh oppositionists are seen in the fact that after the republic’s entry into the Customs Union, prices for all major goods in the country began to rise, and the republic’s economy was in a deplorable state. Like, before serious integration with Russia and Belarus, we had completely different indicators, and this “swampy” Moscow and a kind of Minsk decided to tie the rapidly developing Kazakh economy here and there. They say that Moscow is engaged in dumping policy in Kazakhstan and pushes its goods ...

However, the arguments that integration with Russia and Belarus is disastrous for Kazakhstan are not subject to any criticism. If we consider the change in the pricing policy in the republic from the position of inflationary levels, it turns out that the rise in prices that Kazakh opponents of Eurasian integration like to talk about today is absolutely not related to the country's entry into the Customs Union. And whether this price increase is total and systematic is also a question. The data on inflation parameters in Kazakhstan will help us to answer it.

Inflation in Kazakhstan in 2010 was 7,8%, in 2011, it decreased to 7,4%. At the same time, the inflation rate this year (2012) corresponds to a record low, even according to international experts, who are not very fond of using the “necessary” Astana numbers. So, according to the government of Kazakhstan, inflation in 2012 is 6,1%, and according to experts from the World Bank - about 6,2-6,3% (the difference is within the margin of error). In other words, after Kazakhstan joined the CU, the inflation rate in just two years decreased by 1,6-1,7%. At a time when crisis waves are rolling on the world economy with a new and new force, inflation indicators in Kazakhstan are very encouraging.

In order to compare with what, we give an example of inflation indicators in the republic for 2008 a year (before joining the CU). This figure was already 23,4%!

Words about the dumping policy towards Kazakhstan by the Russian Federation are also not clear. After all, if we consider that the Russian-Kazakh border has become open, and labor from Central Asia (from Kazakhstan, including) has almost freely flowed into the Russian Federation, then there is someone else who dumps ...

Based on this information, we can say that today there are enough forces in Kazakhstan that wish to unbalance the integration mechanisms that have emerged in the post-Soviet space. It is frankly not clear why President Nazarbayev is ready to go to the certain extent with these forces? Perhaps this is a kind of message to Moscow and Minsk with a call to strengthen the Asian direction of foreign policy, and not to look for dubious contacts on the side. If so, then Nazarbayev’s injection to Russia and Belarus, as CU partners (Russia, of course, first of all), Moscow should endure and evaluate correctly. And after such an assessment, decide on an open dialogue with Astana about where our three bird will rush in the near future. It’s another thing if Astana suddenly decided to like the West ... And this is a challenge for Moscow. But what is Kazakhstan going to call Russia (if it is going to)? - the question ... Have you really decided that it is time to start a carve following the example of some other territories of the former USSR? ..
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  1. 77bor1973
    77bor1973 29 December 2012 09: 17
    +5
    But why not immediately tear the alphabet into Arabic script - the old man suffers from insanity ...
    1. JonnyT
      JonnyT 29 December 2012 09: 52
      +6
      Maybe insanity, but in my opinion he acted like a real politician ...... he promised something that no one understood ... smile
      1. Denis
        Denis 29 December 2012 10: 32
        +2
        Attention! You do not have permission to view hidden text.
        -There was such a perversion before the Second World War in Tajikistan-laughter and tears. How swearing people who tried to read that nonsense
        1. Igor
          Igor 29 December 2012 11: 08
          10
          Quote: Denis
          translation of the Kazakh language into the Latin alphabet-There was such a perversion before the Second World War in Tajikistan-laughter and tears. As people swore trying to read that nonsense


          Until 2025, either the donkey will die or the khan will die)))
          1. Denis
            Denis 3 January 2013 06: 34
            +1
            Quote: Igorek
            donkey will die or the khan will die

            Better donkey, Hana komenty I like
    2. Igor
      Igor 29 December 2012 11: 05
      +3
      Quote: 77bor1973
      But why not immediately tear the alphabet into Arabic script - the old man suffers from insanity ...


      And what have you already learned Kazakh and now you have to relearn?)))
      1. AndreyAB
        AndreyAB 30 December 2012 13: 28
        0
        We’ll take a closer look at the comments, read and translate from Latin to Arabic like this, there will be something to do.
    3. Geser Khan
      Geser Khan 29 December 2012 11: 08
      -1
      but at least on a rune we will tell you from this what will happen?
    4. ujuice
      ujuice 30 December 2012 02: 02
      +5
      "Why not just scrape the alphabet into Arabic script"

      From the fact that on computers / tablets / smartphones the main layout is Latin. Kazakhstan, with its less than 15 million population, is uninteresting for producers of all of the above, therefore, localization under Kazakh alfafit does not appear in the first place.
      1. Dmitry23RUS
        Dmitry23RUS 30 December 2012 12: 00
        0
        You are discussing everything here, you think, puffing up, but answer me an ordinary mortal, where they will take the SOLID mother of his SIGN in the Latin alphabet ??? o_o

        what
        1. Beck
          Beck 30 December 2012 15: 32
          +9
          Quote: Dmitry23RUS
          You are discussing everything here, you think, puffing up, but answer me an ordinary mortal, where they will take the SOLID mother of his SIGN in the Latin alphabet ??? o_o


          Respected. In the Kazakh alphabet, that is, today's Cyrillic alphabet, b and b characters are not provided. They are simply not there. And all because of the peculiarities of Kazakh grammar. It all depends on finding the consonants in the word - in front, in the middle, at the end, as well as on which vowel the consonant faces. That's all consonants given and will be pronounced like solid or how soft..

          Examples. Hand - Qty. Here the sound of L is pronounced firmly, since the consonant L is before the vowel of O. Flower - pronounced as Ghul, and Gul is written. The sound L after the vowel Y is always pronounced softly. That's because of such a grammar in our alphabet and there are no signs denoting hard or soft pronunciation.
          1. Beck
            Beck 30 December 2012 16: 20
            +5
            Quote: Beck
            Examples.


            Something I signed up. There are signs in the alphabet, but they are not used. Just like the letter F. It is in the alphabet, but there is no such sound in the Kazakh language, as well as in Ukrainian.

            An example from a joke. They walk along the street Furmanova Ukrainian and Kazakh. Ukrainian is reading a tablet.
            - Street Hurmanova.
            Kazakh.
            “You are illiterate.” Which Khurmanova? Not Khurmanova, but Purmanova.
    5. bazilio
      bazilio 3 January 2013 17: 14
      +1
      Dear 77bor1973
      But do you care? or do you speak Kazakh?
      Anyway, within the framework of the CIS, the working language will be Russian, this is an objective state of affairs
    6. Dani
      Dani 3 June 2013 12: 48
      -1
      don’t get tired, guys Kazakhstan with Russia, we won’t give latin if there will be a boom, many in Kazakhstan UNDERSTAND THAT RUSSIA IS OUR SHIT, SOON A NAZIK IS AT SEP
    7. rope
      rope 19 October 2014 15: 52
      0
      how is your dad ?
  2. Apollo
    Apollo 29 December 2012 09: 44
    +9
    Good morning to colleagues!
    Thank you Alex for the review +.


    In my opinion, the President of the Republic of Kazakhstan (an island of political and economic stability in the post-Soviet space), Nursultan Abishevich, taking strategic course for rapprochement with Russia's main ally, at the same time it is conducting a multi-vector balanced policy with neighbors. A sample of a politician and statesman.
    1. GM.kz
      GM.kz 29 December 2012 10: 19
      15
      Recently, we celebrated Independence Day and said what a unique state we have and the fact that we do not need this alliance with Moscow, but at the same time everyone forgot that 90% of the foodstuffs for textile machinery and so on are imported mainly from Russia, so what the hell is INDEPENDENCE ?!!?!
      1. marshes
        marshes 29 December 2012 11: 56
        +4
        Quote: GM.kz
        at the same time, everyone forgot that 90% of the foodstuffs supply for machinery, textiles, etc., import mainly from Russia, so what the hell is INDEPENDENCE ?!

        This is called trade. In the north, everything from Russia to us in the southeast is local, as well as from China, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan and other countries.
      2. AndreyAB
        AndreyAB 30 December 2012 13: 32
        +3
        And this is not only yours, the Georgians are also independent, but they forget that all the energy is from Russia, Ukraine is using Russian gas regardless of Russia, and so on. It’s another shame, for some reason, they always blaspheme my country at the same time, well, God be their judge.
        1. Beck
          Beck 30 December 2012 16: 48
          +7
          Quote: AndreyAB
          It’s another shame, for some reason, they always blaspheme my country at the same time, well, God be their judge.


          Here is one of the Kazakhstanis who blasphemed Russia here ?. They repulsed the patriots, yes. But to blaspheme the thousand-year-old neighbor with whom we are building the EurAsEC, this is not. Read the comments.
      3. Piligrim
        Piligrim 2 January 2013 20: 31
        0
        Come on, come on!
        Why is it unique ???
        Well what wheel did you come up with that I heard!
        And that the French have gone the same from you!
        Something new your "scientists" dug out ???
      4. bazilio
        bazilio 3 January 2013 17: 12
        0
        Dear GM.kz
        Here you have the charms of the customs union.
        A customs union is beneficial only to those with a more powerful economy. No offense, but the Russian economy is stronger than the economy of Kazakhstan. In the framework of the CU, Kazakhstan has lost the opportunity to provide patronage to its national manufacturer. In such conditions, the local (Kazakh) producer, if it develops, is much slower than outside the vehicle. Of course, for the Kazakh export of vehicles for the good, but in the end, if less is exported than imported, then the national producer will suffer. I'm not saying that the CU is bad, you just had to initially calculate your strength whether Kazakhstan will take part in the CU or not
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 6 January 2013 19: 20
          +1
          Basilio, our enterprises have quite competitive factors - a more affordable bank loan, state support for certain activities, as well as a lower tax burden. Before comparing the efficiency of economies so rudely, look at at least Russian articles in which analysts and politicians (including Putin himself) are annoyed about the flow of Russian firms and capital to Kazakhstan. Business in KZ is much easier than in Russia.
      5. Dani
        Dani 3 June 2013 12: 50
        -1
        AND CHE GO BUILD CHE MUSIC
    2. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 30 December 2012 11: 44
      0
      Quote: Apollon
      Sample politician and statesman

      ruined or sold his industry, the country is torn apart by clan showdowns and what kind of model he is, considering that the "dad" is at the head of most structures, including illegal ones
      1. Piligrim
        Piligrim 2 January 2013 20: 34
        -1
        He from Germany seems so white and fluffy!
        And you live in this country about 30 years ...! All that you wrote Vladimir is the true truth. If there digging a little deeper ... there is such a de ... mo climb!
  3. Kadoman
    Kadoman 29 December 2012 09: 47
    -2
    Getting old. Insanity senile.
    1. GM.kz
      GM.kz 29 December 2012 10: 12
      11
      Nazarbayev Pts. smart leader but he is trying to sit on two chairs on the one hand integration with Russia and the other with Turkey. You should have seen how various Turkish ambassadors are courting him here called the father of the Turks, etc.
      1. Denis
        Denis 29 December 2012 10: 35
        +3
        Quote: GM.kz
        father of the Turks

        And where did you divide your Ataturk?
      2. Alexander
        Alexander 29 December 2012 12: 47
        0
        For me, so Nazarbayev is trying to create a new state with the capital in Alma-Ata on the basis of the CU and the alliance with Turkey and other countries.
        1. Sanches
          Sanches 29 December 2012 15: 22
          +5
          Alexander Today, 12: 47
          For me, so Nazarbayev is trying to create a new state with the capital in Alma-Ata on the basis of the CU and the alliance with Turkey and other countries.
          what does Almaty have to do with it
          1. El13
            El13 29 December 2012 18: 24
            +3
            Alma-Ata really has nothing to do with it.
            1. Alexander
              Alexander 29 December 2012 18: 46
              -2
              Those. in Astana (mixed up a bit).
      3. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 30 December 2012 11: 45
        +1
        Quote: GM.kz
        Nazarbayev Pts. smart leader but he is trying to sit on two chairs

        it's called differently
        1. Dmitry23RUS
          Dmitry23RUS 30 December 2012 12: 01
          +2
          In Russia there is a clever proverb, or rather wise. You’ll run after two hares ... then you know everything yourself =))
        2. Denis
          Denis 3 January 2013 06: 45
          +1
          Quote: Vasilenko Vladimir

          Quote: GM.kz
          Nazarbayev Pts. smart leader but he is trying to sit on two chairs
          it's called differently

          and then! said not a stupid guy Wasserman about two nipples, etc.
      4. AndreyAB
        AndreyAB 30 December 2012 13: 33
        0
        And who is called the mother of the Turks? Well, if father Nazarbayev.
      5. bazilio
        bazilio 3 January 2013 17: 27
        +3
        Strange, I was waiting for statements about "a snickering bai, that we need a Russian shepherd who will build all of Sr. Asia", etc. Note the main idea - the author purposefully condemns any "step to the left, step to the right" from the political and economic vector of the Russian Federation. Whether it is Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan and other republics, the main idea of ​​the author, each republic is obliged to obey the Russian Federation, if he did not obey, a traitor !!! and it is all the same that each republic is independent.
  4. kotdavin4i
    kotdavin4i 29 December 2012 09: 52
    22
    A peppy morning. Dear, it’s wrong to consider that with the transition to the Latin alphabet Kazakhstan will abandon Russia and the customs union. Having the Cyrillic alphabet, all the same, Russians from Russia do not understand the Kazakh language, and what difference does it make to them written in Cyrillic or Latin letters. If in the future there will be a rejection of the Russian language as a second state, then it is already worth drumming. And so Nazarbayev wants to calm the nationalists. both ours and yours as they say.
    1. Jipo
      Jipo 29 December 2012 21: 55
      +3
      I wrote about the same thing a week ago.
    2. AndreyAB
      AndreyAB 30 December 2012 13: 36
      +3
      Sorry, but you won’t reassure the nationalists, they will find any other reason and again they will start raising, it’s dangerous to make concessions to these little bells and whistles, then the trouble, the examples of concessions of the opposition around the world and haven’t come to nothing good.
  5. dmitreach
    dmitreach 29 December 2012 10: 01
    +2
    photo for the article pleased laughing
    all the same, in old age, in political life, one may not say so.
  6. GM.kz
    GM.kz 29 December 2012 10: 05
    19
    In Kazakhstan, only one state. Kazakh language and Russian language of communication! His status is not clear. 90% speak it and about 70% think it, but he is not state-owned. They force me to learn Kazakh, but there is practically no literature. Kazakhs themselves laugh at each other who speaks Kazakh more correctly.
    1. sq
      sq 29 December 2012 11: 59
      +4
      see situevina as in Belarus. Only we are not forced to learn Belarusian
    2. 11Goor11
      11Goor11 29 December 2012 16: 00
      +4
      They force me to learn Kazakh, but there is practically no literature.

      So we get a violent division, as in Ukraine
      There was one big powerful country, but it really doesn’t like to claim absolute hegemony, it is necessary to divide it politically, and now to strengthen this political (actually only on paper) division is already more powerful - to create linguistic, cultural barriers to unity. sad
    3. Lignitz
      Lignitz 30 December 2012 09: 56
      +2
      For the Kazakh language to become the state language, it takes time, this is a matter of the future. We need our own "Sinai Desert and our own Moses" in order to become ourselves in 40 years. One generation needs to pass, only then Kazakh will become the state language. Forcing events is stupid.
      1. El13
        El13 30 December 2012 13: 54
        -1
        Exactly, and at the exit get Mongolia with the spaceport ...
      2. Piligrim
        Piligrim 2 January 2013 20: 40
        -1
        Yes, lignitz! The generation that goes with you ... God forbid any state.
        You cannot graze sheep with him.
        and given that after Nazar is sheer uncertainty, one can expect any events (Kyrgyz, Ukrainian or just Wahhabiz)
        1. Turdaun
          Turdaun 4 January 2013 11: 22
          +2
          Dear Pilgrim, about the rams, you certainly bent. They are rams everywhere, for example, there are more than enough sheep in St. Petersburg, as in any other state. By the way, there are a lot of Wahhabis in Russia ...
          1. Denis
            Denis 4 January 2013 13: 03
            +1
            Quote: Turdahun
            and. They are rams everywhere, for example, there are more than enough sheep in St. Petersburg, as in any other state. By the way, there are a lot of Wahhabis in Russia ...
            Reply

            nothing passed
            those. choke
  7. borisst64
    borisst64 29 December 2012 10: 13
    +6
    Expressions do not converge:
    1. The booming economy of Kazakhstan.
    2. The labor force from Kazakhstan surged into the Russian Federation.
    1. GM.kz
      GM.kz 29 December 2012 11: 21
      16
      Do not speed. Kazakhs do not go to Russia to earn money, we are not Uzbeks, our robots are not small, and they pay more than in Russia. Average salary in the region of 900 cu. Kazakhs themselves do not want to work on this, Uzbeks work around us. I live in a border city and many of us go to Russia only to visit relatives or often for groceries!
      1. Piligrim
        Piligrim 2 January 2013 20: 43
        0
        You probably live in Almaty or Astana! 900 cu You still have not learned to count in your currency. And where is the 2030 program ??? Why is there no report on it if you have already completed it?
        You LM go to the regions, look what is happening there and how many zp! And unemployment ?!
        1. Turdaun
          Turdaun 4 January 2013 11: 40
          +1
          I agree with you Pilgrim, it happens differently in the regions, everything happens, I myself saw everything with my own eyes, myself from a small town. But, such a situation is quite commonplace for the entire post-Soviet space. This is true both in Ukraine, and in Georgia, and in Russia, I am sure too. This is our common problem, and this is a separate issue.
          As for the fact that "we rushed to work in Russia," this is complete nonsense. NOBODY came to Great Russia from Kazakhstan to earn money, we have the glory of the Almighty, they themselves have enough work. I ask you not to confuse us with other representatives of the countries of Central Asia.
          Regarding the fact that "we have not learned to count in our currency", we have learned, and for a very long time, just not many here at the forum will understand objectively if we express ourselves in tenge, so to speak, for the sake of INFORMATION.
          And where does the "Program 2030"? And to whom should we report to you? Personally in front of you? If so, then (entering the role): Mr. Pilgrimm, please listen to the report on the "Program 2030", we are implementing the program. We will complete the rest in the next 17 years. End of report.
          Unemployment, well, this is ridiculous at all, it’s a darling, and unfortunately it hasn’t disappeared anywhere in Russia, as many as 17% ... As I wrote earlier, this is our common problem.
        2. GELEZNII_KAPUT
          GELEZNII_KAPUT 5 January 2013 22: 03
          0
          I live in Altai Krai, Kazakhstan is our neighbor, I haven’t seen a single Kazakh for our earnings, but Uzbeks with Tajiks, there’s a lot of horror !!!
        3. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 6 January 2013 19: 25
          +1
          Pilgrim, you probably live in the 90s. The program "2030" is almost complete ahead of schedule... The "2050" program is already in operation, taking into account the new realities. I don’t know when you were in the Kazakh province, but I spend several times a month running around the regions on business. Of course, the standard of living in Almaty and Astana is significantly higher, but life in the regions is constantly improving. There is enough work, people have the opportunity to earn. There is practically no unemployment (something about 5%, which, in principle, is very normal). On the contrary, we have a shortage of workers.
          Z.Y. There are depressive small cities (more precisely, the so-called mono-cities) in which everything revolved around one city-forming (usually raw) enterprise. When the field runs dry, or its products are banal unclaimed, then in the city - sucks. But there is a program to solve problems with these issues - from mass relocation to other parts of the region, where on the contrary there is a shortage of hands, or the opening of new industries in the city with direct support from the state.
    2. plotnikov561956
      plotnikov561956 29 December 2012 12: 27
      +1
      Quote: borisst64
      Expressions do not converge:
      1. The booming economy of Kazakhstan.
      2. The labor force from Kazakhstan surged into the Russian Federation.


      This moment is quite interesting and mysterious ... I would like to hear more from the Kazakh comrades and what has developed rapidly there ...
      1. marshes
        marshes 29 December 2012 12: 36
        +5
        Quote: plotnikov561956
        I would like to hear more from Kazakh comrades and what has developed rapidly there

        Construction, automotive (assembly), the modernization of the electric power industry, oil and gas production, construction of the railway. and roads and much more.
        Astana will host EXPO-2017, so they are already negotiating with the Uzbeks to attract "workers", there are not enough of our own.
        1. marshes
          marshes 29 December 2012 12: 45
          +4
          Example.
          A plant for the production of photovoltaic modules has been launched in Astana. The launch of the production line of the subsidiary of Kazatomprom - Astana Solar LLP was carried out by President Nursultan Nazarbayev, Tengrinews.kz reports.

          "When we talk about industrialization, first of all, this is innovation, that is, new. What we did not have. We did not have this in Kazakhstan. You are employees of the very first facility that produces solar modules. The future is green." We have chosen this topic for EXPO-2017 and are already preparing for this. Roofs of houses will be made of these panels, everything that is necessary. I saw similar objects in South Korea, the USA. Of course, soon it will not replace oil, gas and so on, but in the future we must strive for this, "the Kazakh leader said while talking with the workers of the plant.

          The Astana Solar LLP enterprise is the final technological link of the major KazPV project - the practical implementation of agreements on industrial and innovative cooperation between Kazakhstan and France, which were signed during the President's official visit to France. Within its framework, a fully integrated industrial line for the production of renewable energy sources is being created in Kazakhstan. The new plant will produce solar cells based on 100% Kazakh silicon. The plant is equipped with the latest generation automated equipment. The design capacity of the photovoltaic plates planned for production will be 50 MW with an expansion in the future up to 100 MW.

          The President emphasized that those enterprises that will operate on such energy will become the most advanced.

          "If we master such panels, plus wind energy, then in the vastness of Kazakhstan we will be able to get a huge gain. We will not pull cables, install power lines. (...) This is a great thing, a revolution. Innovation is the future. Innovation is made by science, specialists of the new class - you are specialists of this class working on clean energy. There is no coal, smoke, gas, "the Head of State noted.

          According to the press service of Kazatomprom, output to production capacity will occur in the first quarter of 2013. The company will provide jobs for 175 Kazakhstani specialists. Some of them underwent specialized training abroad.

          The products of the subsidiary of the national atomic company will be oriented both to the domestic and foreign markets. Astana Solar LLP has already signed several contracts with the Kazakh-French company KATSO (uranium mining enterprise of AREVA and Kazatomprom) for supplies to the enterprises of the AREVA group in France.

          Note that NAC Kazatomprom JSC is the national operator of Kazakhstan for the export of uranium and its compounds, rare metals, nuclear fuel for nuclear power plants, special equipment, technologies and materials for dual use. The main activities of the company are: geological exploration, uranium mining and others.

          The President at the opening of the new plant was accompanied by Prime Minister Serik Akhmetov, Head of the Presidential Administration Karim Massimov, Deputy Chairman of Samruk-Kazyna NWF JSC Kuandyk Bishimbayev, Minister of Industry and New Technologies Asset Issekeshev, Astana Akim Imangali Tasmagambetov, Chairman of the Board of NAC Kazatomprom JSC Vladimir Shkolnik.

          Astana Solar LLP was established in 2011 to implement a joint Kazakh-French project to develop solar energy technologies in Kazakhstan and create an integrated industrial line for the production of photovoltaic panels
          1. AndreyAB
            AndreyAB 30 December 2012 13: 40
            -2
            And what only Kazakhs work? Have everyone else left?
            1. Marek Rozny
              Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 17: 34
              +1
              Andrei, you seem to have some kind of Jesuit logic ... There are Russians at the Kazakhstani factory, which means that "everything is done with Russian hands, everything depends on the Russians." There are no Russians at the factory - it means that the Russians were expelled ... Can't you just imagine that there is no politics here? There are Russian workers, there are Kazakh workers. In the north and east there are more Russian workers, in the west, in the center and south there are more Kazakh workers.
        2. GM.kz
          GM.kz 29 December 2012 13: 14
          +8
          Build quality auto stop. I can say a little better on my personal experience, even compared to Russian, oil and gas were not important to foreigners for 40-50 years, and what is happening on the railroads is generally terrifying. We are developing cool !!! The reason in my opinion is corruption and clan business.
          1. marshes
            marshes 29 December 2012 13: 31
            +2
            Quote: GM.kz

            Build quality auto stop. I wish the best road I can say from personal experience not important even compared to Russian

            Example please. I can give an example that Skoda drives to Ust-Kamenogorsk already from Tolyatti, cheaper and better ... The problem is different that I can get paid Rexton only after four months, turn.
            Quote: GM.kz
            Russian oil and gas sold to foreigners for 40-50 years

            What is the problem, if each project has a share of Kazakhstan and we do not risk investment risks, all the problems are foreigners.
            Quote: GM.kz
            about what's going on on the railroads in horror

            Fly airplanes. I don’t like railway transport myself.

            Quote: GM.kz
            . We are developing cool !!! The reason in my opinion is corruption and clan business.

            You can look to the north. Serdyukov for example, or to whom the other day was awarded the rank of Colonel-General of Justice.
        3. QWERTY
          QWERTY 29 December 2012 15: 00
          -1
          This is how many railway roads were built in Kazakhstan? in fact, they die there ... As they built in the 70s, so no one does anything
          1. marshes
            marshes 29 December 2012 15: 10
            +4
            Road Western China-Western Europe.
            http://www.europe-china.kz/links
            1. marshes
              marshes 29 December 2012 15: 16
              +1
              - Rail transport is an artery, the development of the economy cannot continue without transportation, so we paid great attention to infrastructure. Over the years of independence, 1100 km of railways have been built in Kazakhstan, which has no analogues in the CIS. We have built a diesel locomotive, now an electric locomotive plant, ”continued Nursultan Nazarbayev. - I am glad that we are launching one of the most technologically advanced factories with high labor productivity. The plant is very modern and built on the territory of the free economic zone in Astana. “I am glad to see“ Bolashakites ”—engineers who have studied abroad and now use their experience,” the president said, referring to representatives of the labor collective of the new enterprise.
              1. marshes
                marshes 29 December 2012 15: 52
                +2
                Now the energy.
                EMAlliance OJSC, which is part of the largest Russian power engineering concern Power Machines, and the general contractor Emet-Trade LLP (Pavlodar) signed an agreement for the supply of heat exchange equipment as part of the modernization of unit No. 2 of Ekibastuz GRES-1 - the largest thermal power plant , a part of the united energy system of Kazakhstan. The design capacity of the power facility is 4000 MW.

                The equipment supplied under this project will be manufactured in accordance with the technical documentation developed by the engineering center of JSC EMAlliance (Taganrog). Production will be concentrated at the main production site of the company - the Taganrog boiler-building plant "Krasny Kotelshchik". The term of the contract is February 2014. Product weight - 530 tons.

                The commissioning of equipment manufactured by EMAlliance will make it possible to increase the efficiency of the turbine unit and eliminate the cost of repairing equipment that has exhausted its standard resource.

                Under the contract, EMAlliance will design and supply three PV-1800-37 (high-pressure heaters) and a set of fast-acting protective devices for the PV-1800-37 group, as well as a DP-2000/150 high pressure deaerator. The design and working technical documentation of the DP-2000/150 deaerator will be developed by EMAlliance jointly with NPO CKTI (St. Petersburg).
                The energy market of Kazakhstan is strategic for the companies of the Power Machines concern. The equipment produced by the power engineering company is well known and successfully operates at the largest thermal power plants of the republic. Among them are Ekibastuz GRES-1 and GRES-2, Karagandinskaya GRES, GRES JSC "Eurasian Energy Corporation", Ust-Kamenogorsk, Balkhash and Zhezkazgan CHPPs.

                Earlier, OJSC Power Machines, in accordance with a contract signed in April 2011, supplied two drive turbines with a capacity of 1 MW each produced by OJSC Kaluga Turbine Works for the second power unit of the Ekibastuz GRES-11. For the same power unit, a 500 MW turbine generator is currently being manufactured, the shipment of which is scheduled for the second quarter of 2013. In addition to deliveries of new equipment, Power Machines repaired and delivered seven low-pressure rotors (LPR) to Ekibastuz GRES-2006 in the period from 2012 to 1, and also manufactured a new high-pressure rotor for steam turbines with a capacity of 500 MW, which are part of power units station.
          2. Beck
            Beck 29 December 2012 18: 55
            +2
            Quote: ytsuken
            This is how many railway roads were built in Kazakhstan? in fact, they die there ... As they built in the 70s, so no one does anything


            Without railways, no way. In 90, yes, everything, like everyone else, and the railroads crumbled. Now everything is working out. Watching the roads. They built a branch Shary - Ustkamenogorsk. This would be if you go from any direction to Ust-Kamenogorsk, do not make a detour through Semipalatinsk and the Russian railway junction Rubtsovsk. And in the West of Kazakhstan, they built something.

            And do not walk, not knowing, la-la to give out.
            1. marshes
              marshes 29 December 2012 18: 59
              +2
              But fresh.
              On December 29, 2012, the first industrial-scale solar power plant in Kazakhstan was commissioned in the Kordai region. According to the press service of the akim of Zhambyl region, built exclusively at the expense of private investment, the solar power station is connected to common electric networks and can provide electricity to the country's unified energy system.

              KazEkoWatt LLP was the investor of the construction project of the Otar solar power plant with a capacity of 504 kW.

              The cost of construction of the first stage of SPP "Otar" was about 200 million tenge. The price for electricity will be 23,4 tenge with VAT per 1 kW / h, while in Europe the cost of solar electricity exceeds $ 0,4 per 1 kW / h.

              Over the past three years, several projects for the construction of renewable energy sources (RES) are being implemented in the Zhambyl region.

              As a result of the activities of the company "Zhambyl Hydroenergo" specially created under the akimat of the region, from 2010 to 2012, Kazakhstani, Russian and European investors were attracted to the region with the intention of building renewable energy facilities.

              The total capacity of the facilities reached 188 MW.

              The planned investments may amount to $ 375 million, Kazinform reports.
    3. Fox
      Fox 29 December 2012 18: 53
      +1
      many friends from the north-east of Kazakhstan-niodin is not going to go somewhere ... but some have left for Kazakhstan for permanent residence ... they are not sad.
      1. xan
        xan 29 December 2012 18: 57
        0
        write nonsense, do not know the situation, do propaganda
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 17: 38
          +3
          yeah, he’s on special financing of Nazarbayev :))) Fox is paid money to engage in Kazakh propaganda. Khan, if you need money, then write a letter that, they say, agree, PR KZ - they will pay regularly.
          Address: Republic of Kazakhstan, Astana, Akorda. Nursultan Nazarbayev personally. Be sure to two photos three by four, as well as a biography and a characteristic from the precinct. Noticed how many thousands of Russians on the Internet tell their positive reviews about Kazakhstan, having been there? These are all our special agents. The fox was recently handed the captain of the Kazakh state security. Secretly, of course ... Fox himself does not know about it.
          1. Turdaun
            Turdaun 4 January 2013 11: 53
            +1
            good lol
            The fox does not know, but he guesses))))
  8. Rezun
    Rezun 29 December 2012 10: 15
    13
    Quote: Kadoman
    Getting old. Insanity senile.


    I apologize, you probably at one time led the region?
    Before making loud statements, gain authority (like Nazarbayev's). And "crowing" is not difficult.
    1. GM.kz
      GM.kz 29 December 2012 13: 15
      +6
      Support!
      1. bazilio
        bazilio 3 January 2013 17: 32
        +2
        Dear neighbors (geographical)!
        Earlier, when Uzbekistan and Karimov were watered on this site, I tried to pay attention to such concepts as political correctness, respect, argumentation. But many do not want to think soberly and fairly. Now they have reached you (Kazakhstan). Now do you (Uzbekistan) understand us?
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 6 January 2013 19: 40
          +2
          There is a significant difference. Uzbekistan is criticized for its complete disregard for multilateral cooperation in the framework of integration processes in the ex-USSR. And here just the author of the article, by and large, got to the bottom of the Kazakh alphabet. These are very different things.
          I myself once worked in the foreign policy department (Committee on CIS Affairs of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Republic of Kazakhstan). It is almost impossible to work with Uzbeks (officials). They are completely dependent and focused on "uncompromising" work (in fact, they do not cooperate). With Russians and Kyrgyz, for example, we always found a common language, somewhere they were inferior, somewhere they insisted - in a word, we cooperated for the sake of our countries. And the Uzbek state bodies are a swamp. Any idea drowns in them. Really asses sit out. I have a normal attitude towards Uzbeks, but the authorities of your country (or rather, Karimov himself) are an enemy of their neighbors and their people. Because of his personal stupid empty grievances and ambitions, the whole region is stalled.
          If Uzbekistan interacted with its neighbors, then all of Central Asia, and not just Kazakhstan, would have jumped out of the quagmire long ago.
  9. fenix57
    fenix57 29 December 2012 10: 36
    +2
    Well, yes, "Left-smart; to the right, beautiful; should I be torn?" - so here.
  10. Geser Khan
    Geser Khan 29 December 2012 10: 47
    -2
    nonsense, what difference do you have in what alphabet we will write? Russian will not be translated into Latin in Kazakhstan. Russians calm down !!!
  11. Yeraz
    Yeraz 29 December 2012 11: 08
    +3
    It doesn't matter how cold it is to be Kazakh in the Latin or Russian Cyrillic, the Kazakh language is all the same. The Latin is chosen because the leaders of the Turkic states agreed for a long time that everyone will switch to Latin to make it easier to integrate. Turkey has long been to Latignitsa, Azerbaijan is almost 20 years old, Uzbekistan also seems to have gradually moved (I would like to know the exact data from the Uzbeks), here Kmzakhstan is moving, but it seems to have been promised by 2025.
    1. sashka
      sashka 29 December 2012 12: 43
      +1
      In Uzbekistan, it was done a long time ago .. At first it is not clear .. Then EVERYTHING IS EQUAL .. True, upon arrival in Russia, problems arise. You don't know what language to read .. It's easy to get used to it .. Even the word "PHARMACY" until you turn it over and think it over ..
  12. romb
    romb 29 December 2012 11: 30
    -2
    Dear author!
    Honestly, I read this article almost with a laugh.
    Why succumb to the same theme with different sauce?
    Do you have a creative crisis, new ideas left? Maybe you are hurt by the fact that you, as a person fluent in the Kazakh language, will now be forced to write in Latin? laughing
    I assure you, nothing threatens your ability to know and understand languages. You can continue to boldly write in Kazakh as it will be convenient for you, i.e. in cyrillic wink
    1. sashka
      sashka 29 December 2012 12: 24
      0
      Quote: romb
      Honestly, I read this article almost with a laugh.

      In 2002 .. My Sister arrived in Tashkent to buy KEROGAZ. Does anyone remember what it is? And I bought it. IN THE PLASMA HOUSE .. There is no electricity and gas ..
      1. romb
        romb 29 December 2012 12: 30
        -1
        I apologize, but I personally can’t help you with anything. Alas, I have nothing to do with gas facilities and electricity distribution companies.
    2. Volodin
      29 December 2012 12: 37
      +6
      I vas Novym godom! wink
      1. romb
        romb 29 December 2012 12: 41
        +4
        Birge bolsyn! hi
        1. Turdaun
          Turdaun 4 January 2013 11: 56
          +2
          Let's try immediately on the topic:
          Birge bolsin!
      2. marshes
        marshes 30 December 2012 13: 35
        +2
        smile drinks
        Happy New Year!
    3. bazilio
      bazilio 3 January 2013 17: 36
      +1
      Rhombus - the author has such an idea, the former union republics are not allowed to go across the Old Man ..
  13. sashka
    sashka 29 December 2012 11: 58
    +1
    I was born and lived there for some time. In Pakhta-Aral. My sister came to Tashkent to buy KEROGAZ. 2002 ... SOMEONE REMEMBER. ??? WHAT IS IT ?? But I bought the infection ... Why was I surprised to the point of extreme ... Well, the life-time one has to spin ... There are no options here ..
  14. sashka
    sashka 29 December 2012 12: 13
    0
    There is a queue of "Kazakh" schools for my sister .. They don't want the children to grow up fools .. Unfortunately
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 11: 50
      +3
      The vast majority of Kazakhstani winners of international olympiads are schoolchildren from schools with the Kazakh language of instruction. Just a fact.
  15. Beck
    Beck 29 December 2012 12: 24
    +6
    The title of the article is intriguing.

    Interest immediately arises. What is Nazarbayev contradictory? In understanding the geopolitical situation in the world? In the views on economic development paths? On the tendency to build the EurAsEC?

    You start reading and - "My heart skipped a beat and my heel sank. And my soul is completely lost."

    It turns out, well, that there are no more global problems in the world and political statements categorically unacceptable for Russia, like Kazakhstan’s supposed transition to the Latin alphabet. Well. the sky is crumbling right and the waves flood the whole earth

    And the main thing is not explained in the article in what way it will be worse for Kazakhstan, for Russia, for Swaziland, for polar bears in the Arctic. Only in the article one can see a certain infringement of the author’s feelings in his understanding of alphabets towards Great Russian.

    Well, that’s what I care about before Belarus writes. In Cyrillic, Latin, Mayan or in the special alphabet of the father of Lukashenko? Which alphabet will the Belorussians consider acceptable, they will write on that. And on health.
    1. Misantrop
      Misantrop 29 December 2012 12: 37
      +4
      Quote: Beck
      how it will be worse for Kazakhstan, for Russia

      Do not understand? Well, on health, you will understand later. When in Ukraine medicine was transferred from Latin (commonly used in the world) to mov, they also believed that there were only solid pluses from this. And how did this turn out in real life ... So clarification will come to you, later winked
      1. Beck
        Beck 29 December 2012 13: 25
        0
        Quote: Misantrop
        When in Ukraine medicine was transferred from Latin (commonly used in the world) to mov, they also believed that there were only solid pluses from this. And how did this turn out in real life ..


        Dear, you are confusing two different things. Application of the new alphabet and the Substitution of international (Latin) terms and concepts with the root words of any language. In Kazakhstan, no one is going to invent any Kazakh names in Latin terms. The Latin revolution will remain a revolution. The Russian Sputnik (cosm.) Remains the Sputnik. Myocardial infarction will remain a heart attack.

        And the fact that Ukraine translated medical Latin into MOV was because it stepped on the rake that the USSR had put in its time. After the Second World War, they also decided, in a fit of false patriotism, to replace Latin names with truly Russian words.

        Hematoma - Hemorrhage in the soft tissues as a result of rupture of the blood vessels present in this place. On the cut, the soft tissue itself is saturated with blood, clots of coagulated blood accumulate in the sinuses of the soft tissues.

        So Hematoma replaced by Russian The cattle.

        I even saw a similar textbook. But in time, the USSR Ministry of Health came to its senses. After all, then Soviet doctors would have ceased to understand other doctors. You in Ukraine stepped on this rake twice. Initially part of the USSR, now independently.

        For clarity, a joke.

        They sit at night around the campfire Chingachkuk, Chapaev and Petka. In the dark, in the bushes, a rustle is heard. Chingachnuk quickly, silently dives into the bushes. The sound of a beat is heard. Chingachkuk leaves the bushes, silently sits down. He has a bruise under one eye. Petka asks what was there. Chingachkuk waves a reassuring hand. After some time, a rustle is heard again. Chapaev grabs a gun and rushes into the bushes. Two beep sounds are heard and then two shots. Chapaev leaves the bushes. He has two bruises under both eyes.

        Chingachkuk.
        - Only a pale-faced brother can step on a rake twice in a row.
        1. Misantrop
          Misantrop 29 December 2012 13: 40
          0
          Quote: Beck
          Dear, you are confusing two different things. Application of the new alphabet and the Substitution of international (Latin) terms and concepts with the root words of any language.
          I am not confused. These two things are very intertwined. Replacing the alphabet will almost inevitably lead to a bunch of other replacements. Do not resist, the process of "reforming" is enough to start once, and then it begins to live its own life. And there is just a gigantic amount of rake spread out there (and not just a rake, but with a short handle that is hit not in the forehead, but somewhat lower winked ) Because there will be a huge number of misunderstandings, discrepancies, etc. Especially in abbreviations, abbreviations and special terms. There are only a few letters from the Latin alphabet in the mov, and the mess from their introduction was simply not measured
        2. Rezun
          Rezun 30 December 2012 06: 20
          +1
          I see a specialist in hematomas.
          With uv. Rezun bully
        3. baltika-18
          baltika-18 21 February 2013 20: 03
          0
          Quote: Beck
          For clarity, a joke.

          They sit at night around the campfire Chingachkuk, Chapaev and Petka.

          Minus for the joke.
      2. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 11: 55
        +3
        Misanthrope, what for measure Kazakhstan with the Ukrainian ruler? We have a completely different algorithm for solving problems. And therefore, all the final results of our work in any field are completely different than in Ukraine: be it the economy, foreign policy, cultural social policy, political reform, military administration, etc.
        1. bazilio
          bazilio 3 January 2013 17: 44
          0
          Misanthrope - according to your logic, you should not speak for the Kazakhs. The Chinese are bastards like that. Theirs is not just Latin, they have some kind of scribbles, you can't read anything there. So just now I ran into Chinese writing, so there "a huge number of misunderstandings, discrepancies, etc. Especially in abbreviations, abbreviations and special terms"Let's first retrain the Chinese to Cyrillic so that we don't step on a rake with a short handle. This is your logic.
          By the way, in Uzbekistan they switched to the Latin script in the 90s, so what? Do you have any misunderstandings?
  16. sashka
    sashka 29 December 2012 12: 34
    +2
    At the "end" of the collapse of the USSR .. In Kazakhstan, no more than 30% of Kazakhs lived .. The rest of the "Russian-speaking" .. One can only imagine .. Koreans, Tajiks, Uzbeks. Russians ... there won't even be enough room here ...
    1. Beck
      Beck 29 December 2012 14: 06
      +5
      According to the 1970 census. Rounded numbers.

      Kazakhs 40%. Russian 40%. The remaining 20%. Of the total population of 16,5 million.

      Subsequently, the number of Kazakhs increased due to higher birth rates.

      In the 90 years, most of the Russians and Germans moved to their historical homelands (and the Germans do not say that they were expelled). As a percentage of Germans left more. There were 957 thousand left 180 thousand.

      According to the 2009 census. Kazakhs 63,1%. Russian 23,7%. The remaining 13,2%.

      Given the territory of Kazakhstan, its economic potential of 16,5 million inhabitants is small. And only because of this, Kazakhstan could not encourage the eviction of anyone. On the contrary, the government only persuaded to stay.

      Domestic nationalism in the early 90s, which hit all the CIS countries, does not count. He arose and quickly came to naught.
  17. old rocket man
    old rocket man 29 December 2012 12: 51
    +2
    Quote: marshes
    negotiate with the Uzbeks to attract "workers", there are not enough of their own

    Yes, you have enough of your own, they just don’t want to work, and these hands are sharpened wrong.
    I didn’t want to say anything offensive, just the Kazakhs and Uzbeks have a very different mentality, if I may say so, different attitudes
    1. marshes
      marshes 29 December 2012 13: 01
      +2
      Quote: Old Rocketman
      Yes, you have enough of your own, they just don’t want to work

      Something it reminds me of. smile
    2. romb
      romb 29 December 2012 13: 35
      +2
      About:
      they just don’t want to work, and these hands are not sharpened.


      LG recognizes its products manufactured in Kazakhstan - the highest standard of quality. Not a single LG company in the CIS can even be compared with the Kazakhstan company in this aspect.
      1. Petrospek
        Petrospek 29 December 2012 14: 46
        +1
        LG has internal production standards that have nothing to do with either the country of production of its goods or the nationality of the workers.

        PS and how do you know that only purebred Kazakhs work at this plant?
        1. marshes
          marshes 29 December 2012 14: 57
          +3
          LG factory in Almaty.
          1. marshes
            marshes 29 December 2012 15: 05
            +1
            And these are PRESS workers with an excursion at the factory. smile
        2. romb
          romb 29 December 2012 15: 12
          +5
          Dear, in Kazakhstan there is no such color differentiation of pants as in Russia. We are more interested in the question: whose citizens work in production, and not what nationality they are there.
          There are citizens of Kazakhstan!
          1. raf
            raf 29 December 2012 23: 45
            0
            He smiled: "in Kazakhstan there is no such color differentiation of pants as in Russia." (Kin dza dza damn it!) laughing
          2. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 02: 09
            +1
            I recalled how a Russian journalist interviewed the Kazakh commander of the brigade of airborne forces:
            - Tell me, how many Slavic officers are in your division?
            - No idea. It never occurred to me to count my officers by nationality.
    3. sashka
      sashka 29 December 2012 13: 46
      +1
      Quote: Old Rocketman
      Yes, you have enough of your own, they just don’t want to work, and these hands are sharpened wrong.

      If the PRODUCTION did not work with Russian .. This was a topic for discussion in the "smoking room" ..
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 12: 05
        +6
        Thousand nine hundred and ninety some year. Bought a new cottage. Digging in the beds. A neighbor is standing, talking to my father through a symbolic fence about all kinds of summer cottages. Suddenly, she fell silent for a moment and issued:
        - Well, it is necessary after all! Kazakhs seem to be ... but they work with their hands ... I would never have thought ...
        The father immediately reacted to this offensive "praise":
        - Well, then! It seems to be Russian, but sober ...
        Z.Y. Then we talked normally. Without national prejudice :)
  18. Ascetic
    Ascetic 29 December 2012 13: 16
    +9
    The problem is not to write in Cyrillic or Latin letters, the problem is much deeper. Glpvnoe for any language MOTIVATION of the person to study it.
    This is primarily a socio-political and economic problem. It is necessary to raise the question in a different way, but what does the same Russian, Korean, or a person of any other nationality have learned the Kazakh language? What does this give him in terms of work, career, education in Kazakhstan itself, the same Russian-speaking people, it doesn’t matter whether they are Russian, Kazakhs or anyone else (people who THINK in Russian) Let's not deceive ourselves: nobody will learn the language just like that., even in Cyrillic, even in Latin, using advanced techniques or from under the stick. But if Russian parents say that Vasya became the akim of such a district or region, then their children will learn the language in the hope of making a career and serving the country. For me, what difference does it make in what language will the minister or official speak?
    so that they solve the problems of the Kazakhs. If they speak the Kazakh language, solving the problems of the Kazakhs, great. But if not, it doesn’t matter. The main thing is that the problems of Kazakhstanis be resolved. And this is already in the field of personnel policy. Was there a rigidly set language theme in the Baltic states and how much did it help them despite membership in NATO and the EEC? Apparently not if, for example, from the same Riga, Latvians aspire to work in England and the motivation for the same English is higher than for their native one. And the problem of translating the language into ONE AFAVIT is not unusual. Once you select the Latin alphabet, it means that you think that this will simplify the study of the language and its popularity again. What kind of language is this in which the hell breaks from alphabets?

    For example, the Kazakhs of Kazakhstan, Mongolia, the CIS countries (except Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan) and the Baltic countries use the Cyrillic alphabet, the Kazakhs of Turkey and Europe and America use the Latin alphabet, and the Kazakhs of China, Afghanistan, Iran and the Arab countries use Arabic graphics, the so-called "tөte jazz", developed by Ahmet Baitursynuli. The problem is that they can communicate among themselves in their native language, but when it comes to correspondence, difficulties arise.

    Amandyk Amirkhamzin - Head of the Translation Department of the Ministry of Industry and Trade; Chief Expert, Administrative Department

    Imagine if we had three alphabets - Old Slavonic, Greek and New Russian?
    1. Misantrop
      Misantrop 29 December 2012 13: 47
      +1
      Quote: Ascetic
      Once you select the Latin alphabet, it means they thought that this would simplify the study of the language and its popularity again.

      Renault car is written in Cyrillic very simply. And in Latin? With a decrease in the number of letters in the alphabet, the number of letter combinations grows in a non-linear progression. For the same amount of transmitted information. Is this called "simplification" now? What, then, should we call "complication"? Is it not easier to add a few letters (or letter combinations) to an already used alphabet? Purely from the engineering side, without any policy
      1. Ascetic
        Ascetic 29 December 2012 14: 01
        +5
        Misantrop,

        The policy is seen in the fact that they translate the alphabet into the Latin alphabet close to the Kazakhs of Turkey, Europe and America instead of the Cyrillic alphabet familiar to the Kazakhs of the CIS and post-Soviet countries. That is, this is seen as an orientation towards integration with the West and not with Russia. In my opinion, Nazarbayev made concessions in this regard to certain circles, supporters of the course towards the West, however, in terms of creating a single integration space with Russia, there are no cardinal "waste". Let's say Kazakhstan joins the UNIFIED air defense system within the CSTO from the last steps, so to speak.
        Well, with the Latin alphabet, a mess and confusion will begin, the same Nazarbayev will say, well, you see, the western mov in the territory of Kazakhstan does not take root, it will be necessary to switch to the Cyrillic alphabet again.
        1. Rezun
          Rezun 30 December 2012 06: 38
          +1
          To the point. We would have had more Stroganovs, and the question would "fall" by itself.
      2. Sanches
        Sanches 29 December 2012 15: 35
        +3
        Misantrop Today, 13: 47
        Renault car is written in Cyrillic very simply. And in Latin? With a decrease in the number of letters in the alphabet, the number of letter combinations grows in a non-linear progression. For the same amount of transmitted information. Is this called "simplification" now? What, then, should we call "complication"? Is it not easier to add a few letters (or letter combinations) to an already used alphabet? Purely from the engineering side, without any policy
        You drag in French hemorrhoids. Reno will be written in Kazakh. Peugeot - Pejo. Citroen - Sitroen. Kazakhstan - Kazakstan. New Year - Jana jyl. Get behind the alphabet of an alien Turkic language
        1. Misantrop
          Misantrop 29 December 2012 15: 54
          0
          Quote: Sanches
          Get behind the alphabet of an alien Turkic language

          Yes, a flag in your hands and a drum on your neck. At least cancel the alphabet. wassat
          Here are just a gigantic number of elderly people who simultaneously became unemployed due to banal illiteracy (due to the documentation of new requirements, and in old age how hard it is to relearn) to thank you and your supporters. I just watched how this happened in Ukraine. Rake - over there on the happy road wink

          And to the inhabitant of Crimea in hell knows which generation the Turkic languages ​​are really alien. You might think that the Tatars are a rare occurrence. laughing

          Kazakhstan - Kazakstan.
          So in Kazakhstan, Kazakhs or Cossacks are the main nation? This is so offhand wink
          1. marshes
            marshes 29 December 2012 16: 02
            +4
            Quote: Misantrop
            Here are just a huge number of elderly people who simultaneously became unemployed due to banal illiteracy

            Until 2025, many more and more than one generation will go to another world, by the way the current generation is texting SMS using Latin letters. Yes, and you have a nickname in LATIN.
            1. Misantrop
              Misantrop 29 December 2012 16: 18
              0
              Quote: marshes
              the current generation is texting SMS using the Latin alphabet
              SMS is not a DOCUMENT that I have been unsuccessfully trying to explain not the first post. In any state there is a DOCUMENT TURNOVER executed according to strict rules. And the replacement of these rules is almost unreal hemorrhoids. You have yet to make sure of this ...
              Quote: marshes
              Yes, and you have a nickname in LATIN.
              My nickname is a glitch of a provider who refused to register me on this forum with a new nickname. So I had to take the old one, from the time when this was a standard phenomenon.

              By the way, about SMS. If a difficult one will bring you to Ukraine and buy a SIM card from a local operator, make sure how "fun" it is. ALL SMS from the provider, advertising, promotions and discounts come ... ONLY in mov and Latin letters. It is almost impossible to disassemble this abracadabra, since there are not only Latin, but also surzhik (instead of normal Ukrainian). The vast majority of acquaintances erase this nonsense, without even reading. And if there is interest, they then climb onto a site with the ability to translate
              1. Sanches
                Sanches 29 December 2012 16: 31
                +5
                Misantrop, read such home-style Cyrillic letters as ә, ғ, қ, ң, ө, ү, ұ, һ, i. At the same time, look how Kazakhstan is spelled in Kazakh so that there are no questions. If you even have Ukrainian in Latin causes a headache, think about whether to meddle in a foreign language with your charter.
                1. Misantrop
                  Misantrop 29 December 2012 16: 39
                  -1
                  Quote: Sanches
                  If you even have Ukrainian in Latin causes a headache ...

                  You seem to have the same problem even with Russian:
                  Quote: Misantrop
                  not only Latin are paired, but also surzhik (instead of normal Ukrainian)

                  Specially emphasized for ease of reading

                  And what, in Latin these letters
                  Quote: Sanches
                  ә, ғ, қ, ң, ө, ү, ұ, һ, i
                  except for the last two have unequivocal an analogue?
                  1. Sanches
                    Sanches 30 December 2012 13: 19
                    +6
                    Misantrop, although I am Ukrainian, I am Kazakhstani, and I am not familiar with surzhik. But I’m familiar with the problems of the Kazakh language, and how difficult it is to shove it onto the keyboard. If you are interested, now it’s like this:

                    A a Ә ә B b C c D y Ғ ғ D e F E Y Ж ж З з и й К к Қ қ L l M m N n Ң о O o Ө ө P r R r S s T t У ү ү Ұ ұ f f x x Һ һ c c
                    H W H W H H W N Y I I Y

                    It has 42 (!) Letters. All punctuation marks and numbers are occupied by its letters, and the letter можно can be typed only by switching to the Russian layout. Trilingual layout - here no punto switcher will help. There is an option to make the Kazakh alphabet 30-letter in Latin, while retaining almost all the specific letters:

                    A a Ӓӓ B b C c D d E e F f G G Ğ ğ H h I i J j K k L l M m N n O o Ö ö P p Q q R r S s T t U u Ü ü V v W w X x Y y Z z

                    ... And "Y", "b", "b" equate to the apostrophe - '. You can also equate "" with "K", because its sound in cities has long since smoothed out, but this is not necessary, since there is a "Q".
                    And stop crying in our vest about some specific problems of Ukraine, about some surzhik there, they do not concern us
                    1. Misantrop
                      Misantrop 30 December 2012 22: 22
                      +1
                      Quote: Sanches
                      I am not familiar with surzhik.

                      We are not acquainted? Lost a lot. A wild mixture of Polish, Hungarian and German, posing as real Ukrainian.
                      Quote: Sanches
                      they do not concern us
                      It seems that you are not even concerned with the fact that the English alphabet has 26 letters, not 30. In 36 letters, you could not insert your 42 letters, but in 26 it will work out. Flag in hand. It is your choice and your problems. And the 3-language layout on my keyboard is nothing too problematic.
                      Well, about "crying", I can only send you to a popular address, your sympathy is like an umbrella to me. If your experiment succeeds, then in a few years see for yourself
                    2. Misantrop
                      Misantrop 31 December 2012 14: 14
                      -1
                      Quote: Sanches
                      His letters are occupied by all punctuation marks and numbers,

                      Didn't it occur to you to use the right numeric keypad under the letters? But it is not only on the keyboards of hospitals, but even on most laptops there. Or is it too easy? wink
                      1. Misantrop
                        Misantrop 31 December 2012 15: 46
                        -1
                        Judging by the silent minuses in response to any technical proposal to solve the problem of the alphabet, everything that was voiced here is not a reason, but no more than an excuse. The reason is deeper, but ... the eastern mentality does not allow it to be voiced winked
                      2. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 16: 03
                        +6
                        the reasons for the transition - both technical and cultural - have already been painted a hundred times, and not only under your posts.
                        you just want to believe that this is a political issue in defiance of Moscow, that the Kazakhs supposedly betrayed someone by this. these are your personal problems. You can consider us Russophobes, Slavic haters, admirers of the West or Turkey. your right. you have your own installation and you will hold on to it.
                        With new rocky!
                      3. Misantrop
                        Misantrop 31 December 2012 16: 31
                        -1
                        Quote: Marek Rozny
                        you just want to count

                        I don’t want to count anyone. There is no meaning or desire. In my posts, I wrote that the proposed solution, firstly, is not the only and uncontested one. And, secondly, it entails VERY many organizational and other problems that may not be visible in euphoria from the simplicity and elegance of such a solution. Simple solutions always have very complex consequences. Moreover, this is not purely theoretical and unfounded, but on the basis of what it really turned into in Ukraine, Georgia and the Baltic states. Here it is all gone.

                        Happy New Year!
                      4. Sanches
                        Sanches 31 December 2012 17: 28
                        +3
                        Misantrop, the peculiarity of the Kazakh mentality is that if there is a problem, they solve it, and do not cry, do not sprinkle bile in the direction of the alleged perpetrators, and do not repeat: "I warned you." This is the main difference from the mentality of most Slavs. You clearly missed my posts from Yesterday, 14:29 and Yesterday, 21:52, you only see what you want to see. You don't even see that in Ukrainian and Russian, 33 letters are the same (not 36, Misantrop, not 36 at all). Yes, we are typing numbers on the number pad, but this is inconvenient. Most of the letters in the Kazakh language are brought from Russian and are alien to the Kazakh language, they are practically not used. The letters Ё, Ц, Ч, Щ, Ъ, Ь, Э are used only in words borrowed from Russian or through Russian, which are written in accordance with the rules of Russian spelling, hard and soft signs are not needed at all due to the peculiarities of grammar. The letter E is always pronounced as the letter E. This is not going into details, but the details there are such that they often contradict the grammar and spelling of the Kazakh language. So why do we need unnecessary and inconvenient, just to please trolls and hurray-patriots from foreign countries? We have explained the reasons for you, but it is clearly useless to explain to hostile foreigners
                        Happy New Year
        2. marshes
          marshes 29 December 2012 16: 42
          +2
          Quote: Misantrop
          If it brings hard to Ukraine

          I have relatives in Kharkov, Chernomorsk, and friends in Kiev, Khmelnitsky, and Odessa. smile
          1. Misantrop
            Misantrop 29 December 2012 16: 46
            -2
            Quote: marshes
            I have relatives in Kharkov, Chernomorsk, and friends in Kiev, Khmelnitsky, and Odessa.

            So take an interest in them in case of SMS from their operators wink
            1. marshes
              marshes 29 December 2012 16: 52
              +2
              Quote: Misantrop
              So take an interest in them in case of SMS from their operators

              Believe me, do not believe them absolutely nevermind which font we will use after 2025. And we communicate on Skype.
              1. Misantrop
                Misantrop 29 December 2012 17: 01
                -1
                Quote: marshes
                they nevermind what font we will use after 2025

                Naturally, this is not their problem. Actually, I don’t care either. I just wanted to warn what stones are lying on this seemingly so flat path.

                And in Skype, by the way, there is the possibility of choosing a font and keyboard layout. This is if you communicate not by voice, but by means of text messages. Telephone operators (at least ours) do not provide such an opportunity
                1. marshes
                  marshes 29 December 2012 17: 08
                  +4
                  Quote: Misantrop
                  Naturally, this is not their problem. Actually, I don’t care either. I just wanted to warn what stones are lying on this seemingly so flat path.

                  Thank you for worrying about the development of the Kazakh language!
                  Quote: Misantrop
                  And in Skype, by the way, there is the possibility of choosing a font and keyboard layout. This is if you communicate not by voice, but by means of text messages. Telephone operators (at least ours) do not provide such an opportunity

                  I mainly use video with voice and 3G networks, although in the city they switch to 4.
              2. Rezun
                Rezun 30 December 2012 06: 43
                +2
                Oh, our lad - a free ride ...
        3. biglow
          biglow 29 December 2012 18: 34
          +2
          Misantrop,
          for sure, delirium written in Latin in Ukrainian and often in Galician surzhik is usually immediately deleted. even without going into the meaning of what is written
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 17: 42
      +3
      Quote: Misantrop
      So in Kazakhstan, Kazakhs or Cossacks are the main nation?

      There is no word "Kazakh" in the Kazakh language. The self-name of the Kazakhs is "Kazakh". And the country is called "Kazakhstan".
  • Siberian
    Siberian 30 December 2012 18: 29
    +2
    Latin is written RENO! Renault is in French
  • vladsolo56
    vladsolo56 29 December 2012 14: 08
    +1
    He just wants both ours and yours. everyone knows what it's called, but how it ends, most likely no one knows
  • zambo
    zambo 29 December 2012 14: 31
    +9
    Nazarbayev is old, wise and orientally cunning ... He doesn’t put his eggs in one basket, if only he would appoint the right successors.
    1. Ascetic
      Ascetic 29 December 2012 14: 46
      +9
      Quote: zamboy
      Nazarbayev is old, wise and orientally cunning ... He doesn’t put his eggs in one basket, if only he would appoint the right successors.


      As a German proverb says -in grossen surnames nicht beak clack clack
  • Zhenya
    Zhenya 29 December 2012 14: 43
    +5
    Lord, gentlemen, let them translate into Latin, well, what will happen to Russia from this? Then they themselves will want to return this, the matter is theirs, they are a different state, which is what we are up to their lines with regard to military moments, then yes, Russia has to do this, since Kazakhstan is a strategic partner. I think the Kazakhs are one of the most appropriate former republics, there is nothing to teach them :)
  • VadimSt
    VadimSt 29 December 2012 16: 00
    +4
    I read, thought and remembered the saying - "Every sandpiper praises his own swamp."
    I see nothing in the fact that an independent country wants to get along peacefully with all its neighbors, while having a strategic partner.
    Why should someone decide for others? How do you imagine joint decisions of neighbors - at the household level, when some decisions benefit one, deprive something of the second and give nothing to the third? How will these neighbors relate to agreements and to each other?
    Another question is how the state’s internal and foreign policy is reflected in the rights and freedoms of other nations.
    Patriotism and nationalism have the same roots, but the goals and methods of their implementation are different. I don’t want to remember about Bandera's henchmen in Ukraine - I’m already tired of discussing this. But aren't the beginnings of nationalism and separatism flourishing in Russia itself? Isn't the special position of individual nations enshrined in the Constitutions of the individual formations of Russia? Didn't individual representatives of local authorities allow themselves statements that run counter to the Russian Constitution? Is it in Russia "with a smile on his face" that every "non-Russian" is met?
    Until the very basis of nationalism is uprooted by civilized measures, there can be no talk of any rapprochement between peoples. All integration processes affect exclusively the political and economic goals of states - people are not "provided for" in this program.
  • homosum20
    homosum20 29 December 2012 16: 59
    +1
    To draw conclusions about the direction of the country from a politician’s speech is like guessing at the thick of coffee. Politics is such a thing, brown, like coffee grounds.
  • valokordin
    valokordin 29 December 2012 17: 19
    +1
    Quote: VadimSt
    Patriotism and nationalism have the same roots, but the goals and methods of their implementation are different. I don’t want to remember about Bandera's henchmen in Ukraine - I’m already tired of discussing this. But aren't the beginnings of nationalism and separatism flourishing in Russia itself? Isn't the special position of individual nations enshrined in the Constitutions of the individual formations of Russia? Didn't individual representatives of local authorities allow themselves statements that run counter to the Russian Constitution? Is it in Russia "with a smile on his face" that every "non-Russian" is met?
    Until the very basis of nationalism is uprooted by civilized measures, there can be no talk of any rapprochement between peoples. All integration processes affect exclusively the political and economic goals of states - people are not "provided for" in this program.
    At one time, the problem of nationalism in the Soviet Union was solved, why the ruling elite in the republics and in the Russian Federation cannot take advantage of this experience, she doesn’t need one answer, divide and rule, and profit is the main thing, and there it’s like a god will give. Yes, and antagonism in the sphere of who serves God more correctly.
    1. nurker
      nurker 30 December 2012 09: 39
      +1
      I must say, a good objective description of the CIS situation
  • FunkschNNX
    FunkschNNX 29 December 2012 18: 25
    0
    I recognize the old man: he spoke a lot but did not say anything :-) This is the policy of Kazakhstan - "multi-vector", like a weather vane - where it blows and unfolds.
  • xan
    xan 29 December 2012 19: 33
    -5
    Kazakhstan is a strange country, I would say, as it were, a country.
    sort of economy, kind of education, kind of militia, and what kind of democracy. plus politics. and the country's leadership is preoccupied with creating the appearance of economic and social development. all visible prosperity of Kazakhstan - increased many times, even tens of times, compared with the period of the USSR, the exploitation of mineral resources.
    who could have left the Russians, there were those who had nowhere to go.
    1. Beck
      Beck 29 December 2012 20: 00
      +6
      Quote: xan
      Kazakhstan is a strange country, I would say, as it were, a country.


      And why so? Out of the blue confrontation escalate. And why would like a country EurAsEC to build?

      People left for their historic homeland, which is bad. Of course they would have left more, but not because of the fact that it is bad here, but because in Russia everything needs to be rebuilt. And it is in no way beneficial for Kazakhstan that people leave.

      You still drag here that the Russian expelled. Someone there, drunk, bravado, betrayed that he had been kicked out and away. Generally think about Khan.

      In 90, not only Russians left for their historical homeland. 80% of Germans left. Chechens, Ingush, Greeks left. And no one said they were kicked out. Only Russian cheers patriots throat. Thousands of Kazakhs have moved to Kazakhstan, to their historical Motherland, and continue to move from Mongolia and China. But we are not yelling in the direction of Mongolia and China, that they are expelling our compatriots.

      Well, and the speech of politicians, it is the speech of politicians. They have a story without embellishment, so this is not a story.
      1. Ascetic
        Ascetic 29 December 2012 23: 27
        +4
        Quote: Beck
        In 90, not only Russians left for their historical homeland. 80% of Germans left. Chechens, Ingush, Greeks left. And no one said they were kicked out


        The anecdote of that time remembered, bearded as an elder

        Nazarbayev convened the meeting and said: Golden-headed Jews left for Israel, golden-armed Russians - for Russia. What are we going to do, golden-toothed?

        And this one about the Kazakh language

        Two ordinary Kazakhs hang out in Moscow, got into a Taxi. They turn to face each other and say, "Myna is a taxi driver, a terrible eken." The taxi driver turns around with a serious face and says "You don't like my face?" - do you know Kazakh?

        More about taxi and Kazakh

        The new Kazakh got lost in New York. He stops a taxi and says: "To me in" Samal "Taxi driver:" There is no such area here! "New Kazakh hands out $ 1000:" To me in "Samal" Taxi driver: "There is no such area here!" The new Kazakh holds out a press of one hundred dollar bills: "To me in" Samal "Taxi driver:" Are you from Lenin or from Furmanov? "

        Petka arrives from Kazakhstan. Vasily Ivanovich asks: - Well, what about Petka, did you learn the Kazakh language there? - Yes. - And what is "one" in Kazakh? - Bir. - And "five"? - Bir, bir, bir, bir, bir. - And what will be the "thousand"? - Well, it's a long song.
        1. Focker
          Focker 29 December 2012 23: 34
          +4
          Probably been to Almaty?) Or just someone told?
        2. Beck
          Beck 30 December 2012 09: 57
          +8
          Quote: Ascetic
          The anecdote of that time remembered, bearded as an elder


          Not expected. From Russia, hear jokes about the Kazakhs. In general, during the USSR, there were almost no jokes about Kazakhs. And then like an avalanche. And this is good. The people who do not laugh at themselves are dying. I will add.

          Two aul guys walked in the summer in Almaty. Heat. We decided to go to the bar for a beer. We went in, sat down at a table. And then one another says.
          - Hey sen blesenba kalai orsha aituga kerek (hey you know how to say it correctly in Russian) - Dvа beer or dvе beer?
          The second scornfully says that he knows. Calls to the waiter.
          - We have three beers and one is not necessary.


          90 years, the wave of bilingualism. A man is walking through the bazaar. He sees a goose on the counter, for sale. Two strings are tied to the legs of the goose, and there is a sign on the chest - "Goose, bilingual." The person turns to the seller.
          - What kind of garbage is this?
          Seller.
          - No bullshit. You pull the left rope, the goose will speak Kazakh. For the right you pull, in Russian will be a fool.
          A person is in a state of confusion and distrust, grabs two strings at once and yanks. Goose staggering says.
          - Hey klatasyn, yo .. your mother. (Hey, drop it .....).

          90 years. In Almaty, Furmanova Street was renamed Kabanbai Batyr Street. An urban Kazakh is walking along this street with his son, about 9 years old. The son reads a sign with the name of the street and asks his father
          - Dad, who is Kabanbai batyr?
          Father silently goes on. The son at the second house reads the tablet.
          - Dad, what is Kabanbay Batyr?
          Father.
          - Leave me alone.
          The son at the third house reads the tablet. He stops, stamps his foot.
          - Dad, what is Kabanbay Batyr like?
          Father stops.
          “You got me.” Furmanov it. Furmanov.
          1. GM.kz
            GM.kz 30 December 2012 16: 46
            +4
            Beck,
            The Russian Uzbek and Kazakh fall on a desert island. Well, you need to do something so as not to die. The Russian sowed the field with bread, the Uzbek began to build a house, and the Kazakh disappeared somewhere. As time passed, the Russian harvested, the Uzbek built a house, and then a Kazakh appeared and says - I’m your local policeman, Mynbaev, present your documents, registration !!! This joke was told by Nazarbayev on TV.
            1. Beck
              Beck 30 December 2012 17: 30
              +6
              Quote: GM.kz
              This joke was told by Nazarbayev on TV.


              There is such a thing in our mentality. What can you do. Then I will continue.

              Serik cuts along the highway in a "Mersa". A traffic cop jumps out, stops for speeding.
              Serik.
              - What are you doing? I know your head of the department of internal affairs.
              Traffic cop.
              - Well, you and a bouncer. Well, I would say you know the head of the traffic police, otherwise the department.
              Serik and traffic cop still bicker then argue for $ 1000 that Serik knows the head of the department. They get into the car and go to the city. Drive up to the Ministry of Internal Affairs. Get out of the car. Towards, from the stairs, surrounded by close ones, the general descends. Serik to the general. They greet each other, the general amiably pats Serik on the shoulder, leaves. Policeman and Serik travel out of town. Policeman counts the money passes Serik. Serik.
              - Yes it is that. Nazarbayev knows me.
              The traffic cop does not believe. Again arguing for $ 1000. Serik is calling somewhere on his cell phone. After 15 minutes, a helicopter sits nearby, Nazarbayev leaves it. Serik to him. Shaking hands. Having talked Nazarbayev flies away. Serika can not be stopped.
              - Yes, the Pope himself knows me.
              In the heat of the moment, Serik, at his own expense, takes the traffic cop to Rome. There are many people in the square. Dad is speaking from the balcony. Serik tells the policeman that they will not let you in the balcony, you stand here, and I will go up to the pope to the pope. After a while, Serik appears on the balcony, approaches Pope. Policeman loses consciousness. He comes to himself because Serik brings him to life.
              - Why did you lose consciousness? What happened?
              Traffic cop.
              - Wow! I lost consciousness when people next to me began to say - And, what kind of demon is this next to our Serik.
              1. Beck
                Beck 30 December 2012 18: 27
                +5
                If they add another joke, I’ll tell you about Russian and Kazakh.

                At the northern customs of Kazakhstan there are two New. New Russian and New Kazakh. New Russian at 600 Merce. New Kazakh on a simple Merce. The Russian has a massive golden chain on his chest. They get out of cars. New Russian, arched fingers.
                - Hey Kazakh, what are they calling you New?
                Kazakh.
                - So in Almaty they call.
                Russian.
                - Do you have 600 Merce?
                Kazakh.
                - No.
                Russian.
                - And you have a two-story villa.
                Kazakh, confused.
                - No.
                New Russian waves his hand dismissively.
                - What to talk to you.
                Departs. Kazakh takes out his cell phone and calls to Almaty Tokal (younger wife, older wife lives in another house). Says tokal.
                - Listen to us here for people do not consider.
                Tokal.
                - What happened? Like this? Explain ...
                Kazakh.
                - I'll come explain. And before my arrival you do the following: There the helicopter is in the backyard, you sell it and buy 600 Mers. Take down the third floor of the house so that two floors remain. In the kennel, a dog sits on a golden chain. You take this chain off the dog. I will come I will carry this chain.
          2. Ascetic
            Ascetic 30 December 2012 17: 58
            +4
            Quote: Beck
            Not expected. From Russia, hear jokes about the Kazakhs.


            Baikonur, Sary-Shagan, Balkhash, Semipalatinsk and Alma-Ata of course. I had to happen. Now a close friend who worked there for about 20 years goes to his son in Almaty to visit. The son lives there, is engaged in business. When he returns, we arrange days of Kazakh cuisine with Russian vodka hi
            1. Marek Rozny
              Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 18: 17
              +5
              10 minutes ago, a friend from Russia called Yura. Just two weeks ago, he and I in a Akmola steppe gobbled up vodka under the Kazakh horse-flesh :) Say what you like, if you drink alcohol, then Russian vodka is the perfect drink for beshbarmak and boiled meat. Neither wine, nor beer, nor cognac. Namely cold vodka. In a good company with intimate conversation :)
              Russian (Ukrainian) with Kazakh (Tatar) will always find the language, we muzzle each other because we rarely, usually only we can poke around in the net, and in real life we ​​automatically hammer in all the little things and communicate with each other with pleasure.
              But the Siberians and the Urals generally generally mentality, as if neighbors from the same landing, which you understand perfectly) :)))))))
              1. Ascetic
                Ascetic 30 December 2012 19: 02
                +3
                Quote: Marek Rozny
                Russian vodka is an ideal drink for beshbarmak and boiled meat.


                That's right..
        3. Beck
          Beck 30 December 2012 17: 59
          +2
          Quote: Ascetic
          The anecdote of that time remembered, bearded as an elder


          Yes, how do you know Kazakh? Enlighten, do not be lazy.
          1. Ascetic
            Ascetic 30 December 2012 19: 04
            +3
            Quote: Beck
            Yes, how do you know Kazakh? Enlighten, do not be lazy

            Yes, what do I know there ... a couple of typical phrases and that is forgotten without a linguistic environment, there is a Friend of Kazakhs ... their name is Serikhan .. we communicate .. He illuminates almost all the problems of Kazakhstan.
            1. Beck
              Beck 30 December 2012 19: 41
              0
              Quote: Ascetic
              Yes, what do I know there ... a couple of typical phrases and that is forgotten without a linguistic environment, there is a Friend of Kazakhs ... their name is Serikhan .. we communicate .. He illuminates almost all the problems of Kazakhstan.


              So here it is. So you eat Kazakh beshbarmak with Serikhan and drink Russian vodka. Kazi vodka, card, shuzyk snack. You drive around Kazakhstan. You’re poisoning jokes about Kazakhs. So at least a hint he gave that we are not persecuting anyone. And under Beshbarmak, I enjoy drinking vodka with my Russian brother.

              Anyway. Beshbarmak ate, sitting cross-legged - Countryman means you will. All and how much is needed, only good.
              1. Ascetic
                Ascetic 30 December 2012 20: 56
                +2
                Quote: Beck
                So at least a hint he gave that we are not persecuting anyone.


                There are a lot of stereotypes. Russian Van from a village which beyond the outskirts did not see anything in life since you need to study, learn the world, travel money, but you cannot make stone chambers by working righteous. Here he is watching a zombie man where they tell him that you live so poorly and poorly because the different Kazakh pasties there sit on the neck of Russia they hate Russians, etc. The same poor arat from the ail who was not further than the nearest pasture some mullah from the Saudi madrassa about Russia and the Russians - they are the colonialists who want to destroy the Kazakhs and enslave them again and because of them such a life is difficult and poor. In the Union we had more opportunities For mutual communication, we studied, worked, served, and there was nothing for us to share. Now the youth closes only on their national little world, not knowing anything about the neighbors, and as a result of such propaganda, they feel nothing but hostility towards each other. The generation that grew up under the USSR will leave and finally become enemies for the benefit of uncles from across the ocean.
                1. Beck
                  Beck 30 December 2012 21: 07
                  +2
                  Quote: Ascetic
                  There are a lot of stereotypes.


                  Well, Ascetic, why so pessimistic. The worst will come. I hope for EurAsEC. This is historically. How else? And we have nowhere to go from the neighborhood.
                  1. Ascetic
                    Ascetic 30 December 2012 21: 37
                    +2
                    Beck,

                    The main thing is that then it does not turn into the next division of money between our powers that be. In this case, people are thought of last of all. Here we need strong and wise leaders who are able to keep them in check so that they do not interfere with the unification of their small-town clashes. Well, trust is easy to lose and it is very difficult to restore, but it would be possible if there was political will and desire.
                    1. Beck
                      Beck 31 December 2012 13: 53
                      +1
                      Ascetic.

                      Well, they’ll cut something, as without it. These are our officials, the roots are common. But for the sake of the EurAsEC it is possible to endure.
      2. xan
        xan 30 December 2012 02: 10
        -1
        Yes, no one claims that they expel the Russians,
        it’s just in just a couple of years, and it was under Nazarbayev, not only Russian, but generally Russian-speaking, that it suddenly became uncomfortable to live, they felt like second-class people.
        Russia sets itself geopolitical tasks and tries to solve them, while Kazakhstan has a solid creation of visibility, and in everything - in politics, economics, education, science, etc., and it does not smell like democracy. Yes, and the maximum task seems to be the same - on a trailer from Russia to drop in where allowed. Russia is trying to use its natural annuity for modernization, and Kazakhstan is stupidly devouring it. The lack of a glimpse of the future by the Kazakh elite is striking
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 12: 13
          +2
          verbiage. solid. in every sentence.
          1. xan
            xan 30 December 2012 14: 19
            -4
            what hurt Kazakh?
            I wrote softly, but you’re already sausage
            calm down you're not to blame
            1. Marek Rozny
              Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 14: 42
              +7
              here on the website dofiga of our Russian Kazakhstanis. Do any of them consider themselves a disadvantaged and enslaved second-class man? even if I didn’t know anything about Kazakhstan, then on the basis that none of the Kazakhstani Russians speaks of oppression, but rather emphasizes the normal national climate in the country, I would not write nonsense about their well-being.
              in addition, I see complete ignorance of the economic realities of Kazakhstan, in which industrial policy is implemented (almost an analogue of the Stalin five-year plans). On average, two large industrial facilities are commissioned on average for every three days. From the production of feed and building materials to the production of electric locomotives, automobiles, and light aircraft. The export of finished goods to other countries, even to all-producing China, is slowly growing.
              You do not know anything, do not write. Sometimes it's better to chew ...
              1. xan
                xan 30 December 2012 15: 35
                0
                I don’t argue about the national climate
                but about industrial policy, give links, I'll see.
                but no matter how I come - only duken yes taxi drivers, and on the shelves all China and Russia.
                1. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 15: 59
                  +3
                  please - http://www.kt.kz/?lang=rus&cat=1133168166 This is just a link to the Industry section of a non-state news agency for November and December of this year.
                  And here are the latest figures on industrialization, if you are too lazy to google:
                  For 3 years of implementation of the program of industrial and innovative development of the country's GDP grew by 20%. The export of manufactured products in 2011 for the first time in the history of independent Kazakhstan exceeded $ 22 billion, which is 85% more than in 2009. (It is a question of finished products, not raw materials such as oil and gas).
                  Over 3 years of industrialization put into operation 537 new objects. The volume of their production amounted to 1,4 trillion. tenge. At the same time, the government allocated 2,1 trillion for the opening of these enterprises. tenge.
                  The course for accelerated development has given rise to more than double the volume of innovative products - up to 236 billion tenge.
                  Until 2014, the Industrialization Map has yet to be built. 170 large enterprises.
                  The presidential program of industrialization involves not only the implementation of innovative projects, but also the creation of conditions for doing business, the emergence of new opportunities for Kazakhstanis for self-realization. So, during the implementation of the industrial program, three laws were adopted, amendments were made to existing legislative acts. Earned national plans to attract investment, energy efficiency. All this allowed to systematize and increase support measures. Today there are about a hundred. Along with this, administrative barriers were reduced by 30%, additional incentives were introduced for investors and innovators.

                  In general, more than 400 innovative industries, over 1 non-oil product exporting enterprises, 500 enterprises under the Business Roadmap program received state support, and 2,5 enterprises participate in the implementation of the Performance 44 modernization program.
                  1. xan
                    xan 30 December 2012 21: 51
                    +1
                    did you yourself follow the link? I managed to open only some creamery and a new locomotive plant in Astana for as many as 50 people. All other information is paid and only through registration. weird somehow. well, another assembly of some Korean SUVs as much as one thousand cars a year.

                    Quote: Marek Rozny
                    In general, more than 400 innovative industries, over 1 non-oil product exporting enterprises, 500 enterprises under the Business Roadmap program received state support, and 2,5 enterprises participate in the implementation of the Performance 44 modernization program.


                    400 innovative productions, is that you can give a link?
                    1500 enterprises exporting non-primary products - can you give a link? What do these enterprises produce? So let's see what Kazakhstan managed to create in 21 years of independence., In addition to the developed structure of dukens and the class of taxi drivers. What Kazakhstan graduated before independence, I know that under socialism I graduated from school and managed to enter the competition in one of the leading St. Petersburg universities

                    but do not write about the Dzungars anymore, these are your local showdowns, they are not interesting to Russians. The Russians then dealt with those who won, and managed with skillful administration and some border Cossack hundreds.
                    1. Marek Rozny
                      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 22: 44
                      +1
                      1) if some news is closed there, then type its title in Google - you will find it on other sites. I brought this link so that it would be convenient for you to go over the headings. decided that it would be clearer. if you want details, google on the topic "industrial program of Kazakhstan", "industrial modernization of Kazakhstan", "a plant opened in Kazakhstan", etc. You will find hundreds of pages on this topic.
                      2) Automotive industry: "For 10 months of this year, 14 cars were produced in the Republic of Kazakhstan. While last year, in the same period, 996 cars left the conveyors of Kazakhstan car factories. So, from January to October 6055, almost 2012 times more cars than in the same period in 2,5 ".

                      Regarding innovation - then you need to google. Links to collect on the topic - not one hour of work. For example, here is http://internet.bibo.kz/292707-v-kazakhstane-planirujut-otkryt-proizvodstvo.html
                      - Creation of the production of LED lamps on the basis of Kazakhstan's know-how. Etc. You will find 399 more links in the mentioned Google.
                      And in that first link - just go through the titles and then google them separately. Everything is there and everything will be found, you yourself would have a desire. And if you have no desire to perceive information, but there is only a strong desire to see "ruins, shops and taxi drivers", then no arguments will convince.
                      And in principle, your skepticism is understandable. If he lived in the socialist KZ, then, of course, he saw that practically no civilian products were produced in the KZ. And what was - something instantly outdated after the Soviet market opened up to the world, as, for example, the mentioned three-programmers "Medeo".
                      And what about the Dzungars - it's your relatives who remember them, demanding gratitude for "saving" them :)))))))))))))) Look at the correspondence, there was some absolutely "hot guy" telling how he taught the Kazakhs to piss and saved them from the Dzungars :))))))))
  • knn54
    knn54 29 December 2012 20: 05
    +4
    Shevarnadze was also a clever politician ...
    And what will happen when you have to pay with China
    The peculiarity of Kazakhstan is in its "zhuz" structure of society. Moreover, representatives of the younger zhuz do not have any political power. There are few representatives of the middle zhuz in the ruling elite.
    In addition, the population of the western (oil-rich) regions of Kazakhstan live in poverty. The "sworn" friends will not fail to take advantage of this. The first bell has already rang. By the way, most of the terrorists, citizens of Kazakhstan, are from these regions.
    1. marshes
      marshes 29 December 2012 20: 59
      +2
      Quote: knn54
      And what will happen when you have to pay with China

      What does China have to do with it? It is not in the first place in terms of investments.
      On November 20, 2012, the Fitch Ratings rating agency increased the long-term issuer default rating (IDR) in foreign currency from BBB to BBB + and the long-term local currency IDR from BBB + to A-. Forecast changed from “Positive” to “Stable”. The Agency also upgraded the Country Ceiling from BBB + to A- and short-term foreign currency IDRs from F3 to F2.
      According to Fitch Ratings, the rating upgrade reflects the ongoing strengthening of the country's external balance, low level of government debt and good development prospects, as well as consistent government measures to improve the banking system.

      Quote: knn54
      The peculiarity of Kazakhstan is in its "zhuz" structure of society. Moreover, representatives of the younger zhuz do not have any political power. There are few representatives of the middle zhuz in the ruling elite.

      Well, well, you know a lot. Do you know Aslan Musin? At one time he could be said to be the second person in the state.

      Quote: knn54
      In addition, the population of western (oil-rich) regions of Kazakhstan live in poverty.

      Well, in poverty, mainly immigrants, for that region is leading in Kazakhstan in terms of average wages.
      And what about the region located next to the terrorists? And why is it written in Russian literary language when seizing forbidden literature? And on Saidk’s CDs?
      1. knn54
        knn54 29 December 2012 22: 05
        0
        1. For Kazakhstan, at first.
        2. At one time .. and now ... Yes, and the capital just can not stand.
        3.Do you want in English? You do not have a high opinion of terrorists and their sponsors. Average salary is a vague term, but convenient for those in power. “The cow drowned in a puddle, and on average she was knee-deep there”; I agree that so far terrorism in Kazakhstan has no organized roots.
        1. marshes
          marshes 29 December 2012 22: 16
          +4
          Quote: knn54

          1. For Kazakhstan, at first.

          Rating of Kazakhstan's partner countries by investment volume for January-December 2011

          The duet of the leading countries in terms of investment in the Kazakhstani economy in 2011 was made by the Netherlands and the Russian Federation with almost the same indicators. Unlike other countries that occupy high positions in this rating, investments from Russia go not only in the extractive, but also in the manufacturing sector. A certain positive impact on this process is provided by integration processes within the framework of the Customs Union and the Common Economic Space.

          Great Britain closes the top three with significantly lower results. Investments from this country account mainly for oil production.

          It is noteworthy that China took only 5th place in terms of investment in the economy of Kazakhstan. This disagrees with the widespread opinion about China's expansion into the Kazakhstani economy.
          Quote: knn54
          2. At one time .. and now ... Yes, and the capital just can not stand.

          The capital was moved for many reasons: Ecology, Seismicity, proximity to the borders of China and Kyrgyzstan, overpopulation of Almaty, old infrastructure.
          Quote: knn54
          .Average salary is a vague term, but convenient for
          those in power. “The cow drowned in a puddle, and on average she was knee-deep there”; I agree that so far terrorism in Kazakhstan has no organized roots.

          In that region, the people and power are almost all relatives.
  • sadqwsaff
    sadqwsaff 29 December 2012 20: 15
    0
    Have you heard what our authorities are doing again ??? Now everything became known, all the information about each resident of Ukraine, Russia and the CIS countries.
    I just found this base on the Internet smll.co/aVq1c3,
    and most importantly, they did something like searching for lost relatives, but here is all the information about each of us:
    Correspondence with friends, addresses, phone numbers, place of work, and the worst thing is even my exposure of photos
    (I really don't know from where ...). In general, I was very scared - but there is such a function as "hide data"
    Of course I took advantage and I advise everyone not to hesitate, you never know
  • nurker
    nurker 29 December 2012 21: 37
    +1
    Hello, dear.

    I wanted to share my vision of political processes.
    The author of the article expressed his extreme disrespect for the leader of the Republic of Kazakhstan, you even think: "I would not like to use a swearing word at an opportunity to describe the statements of N.A. Nazarbayev." My general vision in the ideas of N.A. Nazarbayev lies in the fact that he, as a "veteran" of the USSR, does not want to repeat the mistakes of the former leaders. And the main and most significant mistake of the USSR and even the Russian Empire was the construction of only one powerful educational, construction, industrial, agricultural core in the western part of the USSR (in particular, Russia, Ukraine, Belarus).
    And Kazakhstan and Central Asia as a whole was considered mainly as a powerful raw materials appendage. And in connection with the export of raw materials, railroads were built: Tselinograd, Tashkent, Nukus, Ashgabat mainly, well, other cities.
    The leaders of the USSR were not interested in the prosperity of Central Asia as a powerful universal core, it was given what was allowed to be done, and if you make a mistake again, it would be almost impossible to raise Central Asia.
    1. Denis
      Denis 29 December 2012 22: 08
      +2
      Quote: nurker
      Soviet leaders were not interested in the prosperity of Central Asia

      What an old song, dating back to the "struggle for independence. If this is a summing up of a" scientific basis "for nationalism, which is not found only in newspapers, etc., then further dialogue is inappropriate. And if you really are interested in this issue, then take an interest in the numbers and it will immediately become clear, who was the "donor" and who was the subsidized region
      It is strange that still has not flashed about the intrigues of Moscow, which has maliciously located the spaceport and the nuclear test site, only to plague the population
      1. marshes
        marshes 29 December 2012 22: 23
        +1
        Quote: Denis
        It is strange that still has not flashed about the intrigues of Moscow, which has maliciously located the spaceport and the nuclear test site, only to plague the population

        Nothing strange. Kazakhstanis are restrained people, and who will remember what the people say ...
        1. Denis
          Denis 30 December 2012 10: 01
          -1
          Quote: marshes
          Nothing strange

          And it’s true, much has already happened, now repeats itself ...
          Sly, just in dazibao there was no corresponding section
          Let me explain: dazibao (Chinese) - the slogans of capital letters. The name is not exact, but so in his youth called. quote pad Mao-Red Book and many other things, but in a figurative sense. You understand that there were quotes of Mao for all occasions that every Chinese should know and carry. It is clear that she had a small format. In the USSR, often with that word they called collections of instructions, safety rules, etc., etc. Once, my commander called (oh horror!) the Charter of the Armed Forces of the USSR, who happened to serve in the SA, of course, remembers this wonderful and extremely entertaining book. I didn’t hear and no one bothered the special officer. But enough lyrical digressions, we’ll talk about the case.
          I noticed that the comments of many Kazakh interlocutors are distinguished by the infallibility of spelling and punctuation (reminded the school lessons of the Russian language-hyphen, paragraph, red line ...) and as they used to say in the old days “are ideologically consistent. It would seem commendable, but, but, but ...
          Nowadays, including on the Internet, people strive for simplifications and abbreviations, often deviating from the rules and from mistakes (grammatical and stylistic) no one is immune. The same comments remind in their correctness the editorials of the newspaper "Pravda" of Soviet times. In addition, they are written alien and imposed Cyrillic.

          Uncover the secret of the quote pad
          1. marshes
            marshes 30 December 2012 14: 26
            +2
            Quote: Denis
            Uncover the secret of the quote pad

            The press, not only Kazakhstan but also Russian, but knowledge of the Russian language, I think in Kazakhstan is higher than in other CIS countries and many more graduated from this military university in Russia.
            PS My father regrets that I did not become a political officer (VOSPR), then the "brain" was scary. laughing NVVPOU is a good school.
      2. nurker
        nurker 30 December 2012 09: 16
        +3
        This is not a song. It is a fact. Do you want to say that the USSR was a very kind country? Yes, I agree, a lot has developed, but you can’t call this country a paradise, as small nations did not even have a good official history, they all tried to reduce it to the Soviet people. I say the facts, there was a mistake. as in any country.
      3. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 12: 35
        +2
        Denis, the Kazakh SSR was a donor, not a recipient. Formally, in some documents, it seems that the Kazakh SSR allegedly did not give much to the budget of the USSR, but this leapfrog is due to the fact that most of the largest enterprises in Kazakhstan, in view of their strategic importance, were attached directly to all-Union ministrieslocated in Moscow, and their financial result was attributed to Moscow. In the same way, now all sorts of oil-producing regions of Russia are formally considered subsidized regions, although all of Russia is supported by their oil. The head office is located in Moscow (and since Soviet times), and therefore it is believed that this is the Moscow region "earned", and not all sorts of Siberia.
        In general, Kazakhstan gave much more than it received - oil, gas, metals, other ores, bread, meat, uranium, and so on. But most of the investments from Moscow to the Kazakh SSR from the USSR state budget were more for the creation of objects of all-Union significance, and not for meeting the needs of the Kazakh SSR. Well, or to create infrastructure for their own settlers. There was no task to relocate Kazakhs to cities. As well as in general cities "built for Kazakhs". Cities were built to support the livelihoods of immigrants from the European part of the USSR around some field. Spending on the needs of the Kazakhs was more for show. Particularly to invest in the development of national culture, etc. - no one in Moscow was going to. Only literature in the spirit of glorifying the role of the Russian people and the ideas of Bolshevism was generously funded, as, incidentally, in other republics. At the same time, the almost total absence of schools and institutes with the Kazakh language of instruction, the absence of normal textbooks, the absence until the last moment of the school subject "History of Kazakhstan" (and the textbook itself was as thick as a notebook, in which half of the material is the role of Russia and the CPSU, since the author Bekmakhanov had already been sentenced to 25 years in camps for "nationalism" when he tried to tell a story for the first time "not right"), as well as the absence of the subject "Kazakh language" for non-Kazakh schoolchildren of the Kazakh SSR.
        Of all Kazakh oral art, only Abai, who was an ardent supporter of the Kazakhs' acquaintance with Russian culture, was propagandized. The remaining representatives of the Kazakh literature were simply ignored, causing a false belief that no one except Abay existed. Only in the 90s did other names appear.
        Denis, tell us more about how "generous" Moscow was towards Kazakhstan? We will not talk about the construction of test sites (military, nuclear, space, bacteriological) and other joys in the name of the prosperity of the local Kazakh population. What was the money of Moscow invested in Kazakhstan spent on?
        ZY And then we will smoothly move on to the topic "How many useful nishtyaks were taken from the Kazakh SSR for the benefit of the Soviet Union."
        Did you want to showcase numbers? Get started. How gritsa "drive me into debt" :))))
        1. Denis
          Denis 30 December 2012 13: 25
          +2
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          We will not talk about the construction of landfills (military, nuclear, space, bacteriological) and other joys for the prosperity of the local Kazakh population.

          To paraphrase, I will say “When the politician speaks, the mind is silent.” There is no need to remember about decency
          About the same long-suffering cosmodrome even from the school course of physics it is known that the closer the cosmodrome is to the equator, the greater the mass of a rocket from it can be launched
          But with what the polar bears of Novaya Zemlya got to Moscow, who, just like the Kazakhs were damaged by nuclear tests, hardly anyone will answer
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          and not to meet the needs of the Kazakh SSR

          One of the manifestations of faraway nationalism. Is there a lot of honor to do the whole country for someone? In the USSR, it was done FOR THE WHOLE COUNTRY, but not as for Moscow or Zhmerinka
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          There was no task to relocate Kazakhs to cities. As well as in general cities "built for Kazakhs"

          This is from the same song, the cities were built for everyone. Was the problem necessary to relocate? Because of the climatic conditions, did they live a nomadic way of life, did it have to be changed? In Yakutia, such an experience is remembered very negatively when children were taken to study in boarding schools. The parents themselves they wondered what algebra could help in grazing deer or hunting walruses, which a child of 10 did not study. Was it right?
          Quote: Marek Rozny
          Do you want to demonstrate the numbers?

          This is the least, I remember the saying about lies and statistics.
          If desired, you can find any and satisfying any look
          So what about debts is an ungrateful business. The Utyos machine gun was produced in the USSR, the plant (of course, maliciously!) Was located in Kazakhstan. When it collapsed, was it taken out or were copies produced somewhere? No, just developed "Kord"
          1. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 13: 59
            +6
            1) Why your phrase about "decency"? Did I personally or Kazakhs as a whole behave dishonestly somewhere? Explain.
            You don’t like that Kazakhs do not deal with hysteria regarding polygons that are craped for millennia in advance? I don’t like that the Kazakhs didn’t drive Russia out of Baikonur, but persuade Russia to take up Baikonur (I’ll remind you that investing in Baikonur and just launching missiles from it are two big differences. Kazakhs are talking about Baikonur’s development, and Russia prefers to squeeze everything out of the cosmodrome, what else is possible until complete physical deterioration, without the injection of any funds)? What were the Kazakhs ungrateful to you personally or the Russian people?
            How many Russians here juggle concepts. When it is necessary they say "We have built Baikonur for you to the Kazakhs", and when it is necessary they jump to the neutral "about the equator". So for whom was Baikonur built and so on? For the Kazakhs or for the USSR? If for the whole USSR, then why should Kazakhs be grateful to the Russians? Where is the logic? If they were building for the Kazakhs, then why ask the "gift" back and again demand the Kazakhs to be "grateful"? Russia has an indistinct power that cannot clearly explain something to the citizens themselves. That is why the Russians on the forum rustle from one extreme to another, and any position expressed in such an “extreme” way is poorly argued and logically not strong. And the latent understanding of this irritates the speaker himself. Please note that Russian members of the forum have already begun to insult Kazakhs in "ingratitude" or openly "appendages", "narrow-minded nationalists", etc. At the same time, search through the entire forum of the site - you will not find anywhere that a Kazakh insulted someone on a national basis. ... Not once - not a Russian, not an Asian, not a European, not even a Chinese, whom the Kazakhs consider a potential enemy.
            Regarding the Utes machine gun and other things, I did not understand at all. What is it for? Or did Kazakhs of the Kazakh SSR need these products? We didn’t need mayonnaise and TV in the yurt, if only the machine gun stood? Why should Kazakhs be grateful to the Russians for all these plants? Their products only consumed Kazakhstan resources, and none of these products remained inside KZ market, and KazSSR did not receive any profit from these enterprises... And here every second Russian forum member demands repentance and gratitude for this industry ... But why did the Kazakhs need it? In Kazakhstan, even mayonnaise was not produced or a ballpoint pen. Only raw materials were mined and weapons were riveted. From our resources. If we assume that this is all for a common country - then ok, no problem, the Kazakhs don't mind. And if it turns out to be a gift from "Russian enlighteners to unreasonable Kazakh shepherds", then any Kazakh will instantly send an "enlightener" who taught him to shit and piss in three letters. What do you want? Play football with one goal? You will play it out that the "ungrateful" Kazakhs will bill the "Russian people" for the Kazakh resources spent. So decide - either it was all consumed and built by the USSR or the Russian people. And then the members of the forum are staggering here with your similar views like a boat in the sea.
            1. Denis
              Denis 30 December 2012 14: 07
              0
              Quote: Marek Rozny
              Why is your phrase about "decency"?

              Not too decent to ascribe other people's expressions
            2. GM.kz
              GM.kz 30 December 2012 18: 42
              +5
              I have been living Russian in Kazakhstan since birth and I am very grateful to the Kazakhs for everything that they did in the muddy 90s and are doing it now for Russian speakers. And I want to say, mentally, Kazakhs are closer to us than Russians in Russia. I do not know kaz. Language to my shame, but I will do everything so that my children know it, it is important for their independence. And if I leave here, it’s only because of the bad environment. The situation in our region.
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 19: 00
                +3
                Our Russians have long been the fourth zhuz, together with the subgenus "ukraine", "nemis", "korean", "pole" :)))) With all the ensuing rights and responsibilities :))))) And language is a profitable business. The Kazakhs did not learn Russian in one day either;) The main thing here is that there are no hysterical comrades on the one hand and narrow-minded hurries on the other. Then everything will be as it should.
                And when most of our Russians begin to speak Kazakh, then the Kazakhs can be erected a monument to the Russian language, which really gave a lot to our country. But now it’s too early for such a monument - many people don’t understand that they are Russian, that they are Kazakh. That's when linguistic parity develops, then it will be possible to put a memorable symbol of the Russian Language from the Kazakhs - not as a gravestone, but as a sign of respect and hope for its further achievements.
              2. Beck
                Beck 30 December 2012 20: 26
                +3
                Quote: GM.kz
                And I want to say, mentally, Kazakhs are closer to us than Russians in Russia.


                I did not want to speak on this subject due to the correctness. But if my Russian Kazakh countryman said, I will support. The mentality of Russian Kazakhstanis, of course, is not all, but especially those who have lived in Kazakhstan for many years and those who were born in Kazakhstan are different from the mentality of Russians. I have heard this many times. Russian Kazakhstanis come from Russia and say - the Russians there, not our Russians.

                I can explain, with my opinion, this as follows. Even with the Stolypiska reform, the most energetic, grasping, risky Russian men moved to the steppes of Kazakhstan. The weak-willed, fearful men (it’s to go to an unknown distance, it’s not known why) remained on their Russian land shortage. Then the dispossessed kulaks were exiled to Kazakhstan, also the strongest business executives. Then Tselin, New buildings, although on appeal, but also the most energetic. This is what formed the Russian man - the Kazakhstani. And of course, close communication with the Kazakhs, in which biases towards another nation disappeared.

                Two examples. In the 90s, due to everyday circumstances, a doctor from Russia came to Almaty. We worked with him. He wondered at the Russian ambulance drivers. I couldn't figure out why. It turns out he was surprised that Russian people worked as ambulance drivers in order to have two days off after a day of duty. This weekend they were engaged in some apiary, some rabbit farming, some other. This doctor said that there is no such thing in Russia.
                This example is from conversations. Our Russians, in 90, went to Russia, to some village. Five people. Lived in. They got wildlife. Three years later, built up new houses. And they became for the locals ... Fists, they nearly burnt their houses. This is from the story of the Russians themselves.

                So that everything is more or less good. Well, and those of our Russians who left, at the call of their souls, to their historical homeland, they also wish them all the best.
                1. GM.kz
                  GM.kz 30 December 2012 20: 56
                  +2
                  Where was born there and accounted so said my child born in Uralsk, my father born in Guryev, and I say so to my son born in Atyrau! They do not choose their homeland; they live and die in it.
            3. Denis
              Denis 30 December 2012 20: 40
              0
              Quote: Marek Rozny
              Regarding the Utes machine gun and other things, I did not understand at all. What is it for?

              This is an example. And somewhere to think globally, and somewhere, as if not to understand dishonesty
              Quote: Marek Rozny
              I personally, or Kazakhs in general, have dishonorably gone somewhere
              and this too, what does it have to do with it?
        2. knn54
          knn54 30 December 2012 14: 12
          +2
          In 1992, he was traveling on a train with an economist from the former union ministry. According to him, there were 6 donor republics in the Union. The Balts were in the "zeros" of Georgia and the republics of Central Asia (of course, without Kazakhstan). were subsidized.
    2. Smoke
      Smoke 30 December 2012 02: 39
      -9
      hear the appendage, since the beginning of the 20th century, an immeasurable number of Russian money and Russian lives was invested in your country, I’m not a fan of counting whoever processed the Kazakhs Russians more or vice versa, the Kazakhs deservedly fought against all then common enemies, and the Russians did not spare no life’s means for you personally to receive a normal education, because your great-grandfather, unlike mine, I’m sure I was still illiterate (although yes it will turn out now that you are SUDDENLY there genghiside or timurid which thread and your great-grandfather was raised in a strictly classical Muslim style) Turksib, virgin lands, gigantic irrigation canals, oil and gas production and REFINING (you saw that REFINING was being built in the colonies), heavy and light industry, schools, universities, institutes (Herase colonialism, Russia would so much who stoned the thread), nothing there were restrictions, and on the contrary, there were quotas for incomes of Kazakhs for you, only so that you do not degenerate, because you were a minority in the Kazakh SSR. It should be a shame! Russian you piss against the wind weaned and you ..... oh you!

      zs I will also add for thought: when the Dzungars cut you under the roots, they asked for something themselves under the protection of Russia, and until a network of fortresses was built along the Irtysh, you were strengthened so that in your epic there is a cycle of "years of great disaster" or something like that .... how many of you are you were there Kazakhs left? Once or twice, and missed .... You generally as a nation, thanks to the Russian, still exist. And after all this, they are still unhappy with something
      1. Rezun
        Rezun 30 December 2012 06: 54
        +5
        Dear, YOU ARE THERE nothing did not invest !!!

        Komsomol card of the deceased Red Army soldier Kazakh Nurmakhanov under number 20405684 with the entry on the pages "I will die but not a step back." 3rd Belorussian Front.
      2. nurker
        nurker 30 December 2012 09: 25
        +6
        Just the same my grandfathers were educated and I am not a Chingizid at all, and I ask you to change your tone to a simpler one, without any reproaches and like "Listen, you."

        for example: In Kazakhstan there are only 3 oil refineries, according to Soviet standards, they are able to provide only half of energy consumption (fuel), and the remaining half is purchased from Russia and China.

        Russian you piss against the wind weaned and you ..... oh you!

        You have chauvinism of a very serious stage, get treated.

        zs I will also add for thought: when the Dzungars cut you under the roots, they asked for something themselves under the protection of Russia, and until a network of fortresses was built along the Irtysh, you were strengthened so that in your epic there is a cycle of "years of great disaster" or something like that .... how many of you are you were there Kazakhs left? Once or twice, and missed .... You generally as a nation, thanks to the Russian, still exist. And after all this, they are still unhappy with something

        Dzhungarov Kazakhs themselves won, dear. Treat your chauvinism. We do not say that thanks to Genghis Khan, you Russians have preserved your Christian faith. So no arrivals, dear
      3. Beck
        Beck 30 December 2012 11: 09
        +6
        Quote: Smoke
        hear the appendage, since the beginning of the 20th century, an immeasurable number of Russian money and Russian lives was invested in your country,


        I can understand you will answer. Yes, I got access to world culture through the Russian language. What is bad and is there a reason to blame. We all borrowed something from someone. 250 years for history, not time. I will speak in your manner. Who, under Peter 1, introduced bastard and bearded Russia to world culture? Only Germans and Dutch from Kukuy (you know about Kukuy), and also Germans, Dutch, Europeans invited by Peter from Europe. Here they can show you too.

        From the 20th century they invested in Kazakhstan. What? What was invested in Kazakhstan remains. It was a pranome development of the USSR economy. The Chelyabinsk Metallurgical Combine needed ore and only for this they developed the Sokolovo-Sarbaiskoye iron ore deposit.
        Nuclear industry centers needed uranium. Therefore, uranium ores were developed at Mangyshlak. The entire electrical industry of the USSR needed copper. Therefore, they developed Dzhezkazgan. Ukraine, Russia needed phosphorus, which is why Kentau was developed. Russia and other republics needed bread, which is why they plowed the virgin lands. If all of this the USSR did not need, then nothing was developed in Kazakhstan. And in order to more effectively develop all this, we had to train local personnel. Nobody canceled the merit of the Great Russian people. But no one will accept the Great Russian chauvinist in Kazakhstan.

        Do you see Smoke taught to piss? You teach your wife something. You are with this komentom on your head and did not care. And do not mind, shri yet. For yourself and for all the chauvinists like you. You may suffocate from stench.
      4. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 13: 35
        +5
        Hey Smoke! Of course, thank you for teaching us how to urinate correctly, otherwise you understand, they suffered for centuries, did not know how to put a trickle. Thank heavens, Smoke came and showed how to do it. Thousands of years of obscurantism are over, a ray of the Sun appeared in the Kazakh sky, flashing on the "correctly gurgling" stream of urine ... The gratitude of the Kazakh people is immeasurable. If someday the Kazakhs erect a monument to you, for what you also taught us how to poop, then I will immediately write to you in a personal about this joyful event. I can already imagine the monument itself - a gray-haired aksakal on the courts, crap on the steppe soil, and at the same time shakes with both hands the hand of the Great Smoke, who remained forever in the Kazakh epics as the One-Who-Taught-Shit.
        Now let's move away from the lyrics:
        Quote: Smoke
        Turksib, virgin lands, giant irrigation canals, oil and gas production and REFINING (you saw that REFINING was built in the colonies), heavy and light industry, schools, universities, institutes

        Let's start in order:
        1) Turksib - the idea of ​​building a railway to connect Turkestan and Siberia arose in 1886. The line was supposed to strengthen Russia's military presence in the border region with China, and also greatly simplify the export of cotton from Turkestan to Siberia and the delivery of cheap Semirechye and Siberian grain to Turkestan.
        Quite a colonial undertaking - a road for the transfer of troops and the export of cotton, which was necessary for Russia as air.
        2) Virgin land - was created in order to feed the European part of the USSR. Personally, Kazakhs have never needed so much grain. It would be wiser, instead of virgin lands, to further develop distant pasture cattle breeding for the Kazakhs. As a result, millions of hectares of Kazakh steppes were ruined, since Moscow "agrarians" did not want to listen to objections from Kazakhstan, which warned that the wind would simply tear out and carry away the plowed fertile layer in the steppe. And even Stalin knew what "wind erosion" was, he also thought about plowing the Kazakh steppes, but in the distant future, when the Steppe would be covered with specially planted trees on all sides.
        3) How irrigation canals were built - a tragicomedy with a firing end. Central Asian irrigation canals were built long before the Russian parish. But in tsarist times, Russian officials invented practice, to seek funding for irrigation canals (primarily to increase Russia's cotton production), and then this money was stolen more than completely. For existing canals, existing or nonexistent channels were issued. The first decades of the Soviet regime did not change anything - leaders sent from Russia did the same in the 20s and 30s. Without exception.
        4) oil and gas production and processing - typically colonial occupations. By the way, what kind of processing did we have? that a small drop of crude oil was converted into gasoline and fuel oil? is it a sign of concern for the Kazakhs? Well, in order for you to present the refining of kazneft more clearly, I inform you:
        Three refineries were built in Kazakhstan. The first is the Atyrau Refinery in 1943, which was built for the needs of the army. And the second and third refineries were built just recently - in 1978 and 1984. If you think that the construction of an oil refinery is a vivid proof of concern for the Kazakhs, then you should recognize that this concern began only ten years (or even less) before the collapse of the USSR.
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 13: 36
          +4
          5) Heavy and light industry. In Kazakhstan, industry almost consisted of the raw materials industry. There were, of course, individual large factories of light industry, but they did not represent any weight even for the residents of the republic. The industry of Kazakhstan is raw materials (hydrocarbons, metal, uranium, etc.), wheat, meat + production of the military-industrial complex. If you call it in your own words, then the economy of the Kazakh SSR looks like a colonial appendage. Although, however, you yourself wrote this word, referring to another Kazakh interlocutor.
          6) Schools and universities. Do you even know that until recently, even in the capital of the Kazakh SSR in the one and a half millionth Alma-Ata, there was only ONE Kazakh school? I generally keep quiet about universities, universities have become an instrument of Russification. Kaz faculties were only for some specialties. In general, education was given only in Russian. The question is - either the Soviet government could not bring up a generation of Kazakh-speaking teachers until 1991, or simply did not want to? But the young Kazakhstani authorities after 1991 ensured that Kazakhs could receive higher education in their native language. Apparently, the Soviet government did not really strive for this and "hammered" on the Kazakh problems. Colonialism or "care for Kazakhs"?
          At the same time, I recall that the Kazakh SSR was a donor republic to the USSR state budget. That is, Kazakhstan at times gave more to Moscow than it did. And most of what the Kazakh SSR received was in no way connected with the needs of the Kazakhs. It went on to create infrastructure of all-Union significance - training grounds, mining and metal complex, military bases, etc.
          ZY The Dzungars were defeated in battle by the Kazakhs themselves (and the Manchus), not the Russians. The Russian army did not wage any war with the Dzungars, but it was selling weapons (this was calmly described in the TSB), and moreover, the Dzungars became Russian subjects and Russia pledged to protect them "FROM THE KAZAKHS". And where are these Dzungars? How did Russia protect them? How many Russian soldiers fell in the battles for the happiness of the Kazakh people in battles with the Dzungarian (or other) invaders? How much weapons and food did Russia send to the Kazakhs during the war? How did Russia SPECIFICALLY protect the Kazakhs from the Dzungars? And the Dzungars from the Kazakhs? Have you built fortresses on Kazakh soil? It scared the Dzungars who bought weapons from the Russians ??? Or maybe the Russians built giant fortresses in which Kazakh refugees could hide? No, there was usually not enough room for a couple of dozen soldiers. Maybe Russian soldiers intervened in the Kazakh-Dzhungar battles as peacekeepers? This has never happened. What is it all about? Tell us how the Russian army saved the Kazakhs from the Dzungars. Specifically. Not slogans.
          1. xan
            xan 30 December 2012 15: 30
            0
            you don’t have any education now, neither in Russian nor in Kazakh,
            there is no economy and industry, only the exploitation of natural annuity increased by several times compared with the time of the USSR. Here, it’s cunning to wisely explain to people who do not see the situation in Kazakhstan your progressive development. Your gas and oil production has grown almost 30 times, hence all your successes. You yourself can no longer service and operate the railway and air traffic, but under the Kazakh SSR you could. If this goes on, you will soon begin to hire foreign companies to manage your industries, such as the economy and industry. Maybe there is success in agriculture? the number of livestock increased, began to collect more bread? There is simply no education, higher or secondary, there is the appearance of education, when you know or don’t know, it’s important to simply pay for the assessment.
            Modern Kazakhstan has a very gloomy impression on the background of recent years of the Kazakh SSR. Some shops and taxi drivers. You do not have Kazakh goods in stores, all China and Russia.
            Once again for the gifted. The main occupation of the power of Kazakhstan is the appearance of social, political and economic development, and not development itself. But the real development, and everyone in the elite understands this, is connected with the development of Russia, hence the activity of the Kazakhs in supranational structures. All the wisdom of Nazarbayev is a direct bet on Putin’s Russia, without shy, and multi-vector for visibility.
            1. Beck
              Beck 30 December 2012 16: 40
              +4
              Quote: xan
              Modern Kazakhstan has a very gloomy impression on the background of recent years of the Kazakh SSR. Some shops and taxi drivers. You do not have Kazakh goods in stores, all China and Russia.


              Khan. Everything is developing both in Russia and Kazakhstan in completely different patterns than under socialism. What can I say, and with 90 years, neither Kazakhstan nor Russia can be compared. We walked a long segment of the path and went forward.

              China. So Russia depends on him. To cause an economic crisis in Kazakhstan and Russia, China does not need weapons. Closes all its customs at the borders and krants. The crisis in Kazakhstan will come in two weeks, in Russia in a month.
            2. Marek Rozny
              Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 17: 27
              +4
              1) Regarding industrial development, gave a brief answer above. I do not want to repeat myself;
              2) Hydrocarbon production has increased, but income from them does not come directly to the budget, but to the National Fund for the sterilization of excess money supply. Roughly speaking, this is a piggy bank for the future. No money is spent on social services from there (a sharp increase in salaries to state employees is pointless, since it will be immediately consumed by inflation and foreign goods; the increase in salaries should be carried out reasonably, taking into account general economic industrial development), the money goes from there only to major infrastructure tasks. So the overall development of the state does not depend heavily on the money received for the sale of oil and gas. Our task is to strengthen the non-raw materials industry, which has been developing well in recent years - from the production of toilet paper to diesel locomotives (by the way, Russia ordered thirty diesel locomotives of Kazakhstan production for 2013, in addition, Tajikistan and Kyrgyzstan applied for Kazakh diesel locomotives). This year, Ukraine and Mongolia placed orders for Kazakhstani EU-145 helicopters. Next year, Kazakhstan-made buses and trucks will go on sale in the Russian market.
              3) The railway is operated by the national company "Kazakhstan Temir Zholy" (owner - the Republic of Kazakhstan). The air carrier - Air Astana: 51% of the shares are owned by the state, 49% - by the British company BAE Systems. From this fact, you decided that the Kazakhs are allegedly unable to service railways and air? If so, I will explain that BAE Systems invested in the airline by purchasing shares. This is normal business practice. You will blame the British for selling the Rolls-Royz to the Germans, and scold the Germans for selling Siemens' telecommunications division to the Chinese. And the main thing is that the department of policy in the field of railway and air transport is conducted by the Ministry of Transport and Communications of the Republic of Kazakhstan, and not by private business structures, especially foreign ones.
              4) Regarding agriculture. There are serious problems with meat, but the problem is already being solved. New meat farms are being built throughout the country, the best breeds of sheep and cows are purchased in Europe, Australia, and the USA. The state finances agricultural enterprises on this topic. There is a specific task, there is money, a program is being implemented, which should yield results in a few years. The result of the "Soviet" cows is bad, they are economically inferior to European cows. The remaining "Soviet" cows in a few years will all go the knife mercilessly. There is no time to deal with their genetics. But breeding work continues on the "Kazakh" fat tail sheep and on our horses. Here we are with a mustache. By the way, even about meat, the Kazakhs have a simple task - to fill Russia with their meat. Now it sounds ridiculous, but there is a goal, we are solving the problem. This year, the production of meat and milk increased by 10%, reaching the figure of 150 thousand tons of meat, 312 thousand tons of milk. We now plan to increase the export of meat to Russia to 60 thousand tons.
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 17: 28
                +4
                Regarding grain: Last year, 27 million tons of grain were harvested. So much was harvested for the last time in 1986, but then the sown area was one and a half times more. Thanks to new technologies, we have learned how to grow large crops in a smaller area at a lower cost. This year, the crop was 13 million tons due to the drought that hit all grain countries, but back in January 2012 the Ministry of Agriculture officially announced that we would grow less grain, the task was to grow no more than 16 million tons, because taking into account all elevators, there is simply nowhere to store an oversupply of grain. Kazakhs themselves eat only 9 million tons of grain per year. Those. only those who do not understand this topic closely can cry about the dead grain farm. Kazakhs grab grain for the eyes, elevators are built every year and are instantly clogged with the remnants of crops. Oversupply. Previously, the whole Soviet Union ate our grain. Now Ukraine and Russia are trying to grow enough wheat themselves. Now we export to Turkestan, China, Italy, Iran and other countries. By the way, Russia also usually buys for its non-grain regions.
                5) Regarding education. There is a good indicator - international Olympiads. Kazakh schoolchildren are rated higher than most of the countries of Europe and Asia in the top ten, causing extreme discontent among all the British, whom we categorically want to see in the image of their own "borat". Sorry, but Kazakh schoolchildren beat the Germans and the British outright on the international scene. Although they, too, like you, would like to believe that we have only a "semblance of education." By the way, I already wrote a voluminous message on this topic on the forum.
                1. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 17: 29
                  +3
                  6) Goods ... Oooh, how much of this sound. We have goods from all over the world - it's a fact. The country is open. Our own consumer goods are still not enough, but they are slowly appearing. Especially when you consider that there were practically none of them at all in Soviet times. We did not produce TVs, pencils, or the notorious mayonnaise. What goods could a Kazakhstani buy in a store before 1991: a bottle of Almaty / Chimkent beer, a loaf of bread, a pack of butter, a piece of cloth on a dress of the AHBK plant, a three-programmer "Medeo". Roughly speaking, this is all that was "Made in KazakSSR". Now I can completely furnish a table with Kazakh products, and buy a Kazakh TV, and even a car. Even if in some places the production is screwdriver, but this is how the South Koreans, the Chinese and others started. Next comes localization, creating your own design bureaus, etc. Whether you like it or not, this is one of the industrial phases. Once upon a time, the USSR did not know how to produce razor blades, until the firm "Gillette" taught Stalin's engineers. Kazakhs are learning capitalism. And they do it well, if they do not go to other countries for a piece of bread, but on the contrary attract millions of guest workers to themselves.
                  It would be foolish and inefficient to compete to produce all types of consumer goods. We have selected the main tasks for which we have good chances to occupy our niche in the region, in the world. The efforts of the state are aimed at them. We are 16 million people. Less than a third are able to work. The rest is children and old people. Do you expect to see the production of everything in the world here?) We are not China here, there are no human resources for this. And it's stupid to blame the Kazakhs for this. But we found a weak spot in China and supply there, for example, batteries for their cars. A deal for 1 million batteries was signed this year. In general, as I already wrote, the export of finished goods in 2011 amounted to more than $ 22 billion. This is not oil and gas, but consumer goods. If we had "some shops and taxi drivers", we would have long ago roamed your city at construction sites and sweeping the streets. But no, even local Russians (of whom there are still millions) are not going to leave the KZ, even though every neighboring "well-wisher" here writes about the terrible "oppression" and "half-starved life" in KZ ... You have no cognitive dissonance in your head , why does no one want to leave Kazakhstan, but thousands of Russians go there to work?
                  Han, we have work through the roof. Send your resume, we will find a job in the specialty, if that. I promise not to even remember this conversation about the "collapsed KZ".
                  1. Beck
                    Beck 30 December 2012 17: 53
                    +4
                    Quote: Marek Rozny
                    Regarding grain:


                    I’ll add my own, for my horizons. Wheat yield in Kazakhstan, on average, 10-13 centners per 1 ha. In Ukraine, there were 30-40 centners. But here is a feature of strong and durum wheat varieties, from which they make bread and pasta. The higher the yield per 1 ha of strong and hard varieties, the less gluten in the grain, which means it is unsuitable for bread. Therefore, a crop of 30-40 centners is feed grain. For strong and hard rocks, the most optimal, for gluten saturation, is precisely 10-13 centners per hectare.
                  2. Denis
                    Denis 30 December 2012 20: 26
                    +4
                    Quote: Marek Rozny
                    chimkent beer

                    it was not tastier in the USSR
                    Germans made bottling lines in Chimkent and Yaroslavl
                2. Denis
                  Denis 30 December 2012 20: 29
                  +1
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  the "borate" invented by them

                  and the movie is funny!
            3. amph1cyon
              amph1cyon 30 December 2012 21: 30
              +6
              Quote: xan
              You yourself can no longer service and operate the railway and air service

              Honestly, it killed. Kazakhstan Temir Zholy. Does this not tell you anything? A new high-speed train was launched in Kazakhstan, between the country's capital Astana and the city of Aktobe.

              The composition is called "Aktobe" and for the first time will connect the west of the country with the capital.

              The travel time between the two cities was reduced by more than 11 hours, now 1411 km of the route takes 16-17 hours.

              The train, consisting of 19 wagons, was built at the Tulpar-Talgo plant in Astana.

              The locomotive plant was opened by Alstom, Transmashholding and Kazakhstan Railways (KTZ) in November 2012.

              Production, which is also located in Astana, in January 2013. KTZ will begin to fulfill the order, which the company placed in 2010, for the manufacture of 200 freight and 95 passenger locomotives.

              So here we are not serviced and operated by the railway.


              About Aeroflot, I can say Air Astana, Scat Air Lines, Otrar Air Lines. Air Astana has signed the largest contract in the history of civil aviation in Kazakhstan with Boeing for the supply of four Boeing 767-300ER aircraft and three Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner. The cost of the contract is about 1 billion US dollars.

              The delivery of long-range Boeing 767 aircraft will take place in 2013 and 2014, the delivery of Boeing 787 airliners is scheduled for 2017 and 2019.

              I myself often use rail and air.
              I will say this. I was pleasantly surprised when I flew from Taraz to Astana not on Fokker, but on Airbus 320, but back to YAK 40. And I flew not 3 hours, but only a half. And you say maintenance and exploitation.
              1. xan
                xan 30 December 2012 23: 49
                -5
                what are you sculpting me here, can you confirm the production of equipment in Kazakhstan with links?
                Quote: amph1cyon
                The locomotive plant was opened by Alstom, Transmashholding and Kazakhstan Railways (KTZ) in November 2012.
                Production, which is also located in Astana, in January 2013. KTZ will begin to fulfill the order, which the company placed in 2010, for the manufacture of 200 freight and 95 passenger locomotives.
                So here we are not serviced and operated by the railway.


                I followed the link that Marek Rozny gave about this electric locomotive factory. The staff is only 50 people, the first 10 locomotives will be assembled in France, production in Astana will begin in 2016. Agree very strong difference in information. I suspect that everything else is exactly the same.

                Quote: Marek Rozny
                In general, as I already wrote, the export of finished goods in 2011 amounted to more than $ 22 billion. This is not oil and gas, but consumer goods. If we had "some shops and taxi drivers", we would have long ago roamed your city at construction sites and sweeping the streets. But no, even local Russians (of whom there are still millions) are not going to leave the KZ, even though every neighboring "well-wisher" here writes about the terrible "oppression" and "half-starved life" in KZ ... You have no cognitive dissonance in your head , why does no one want to leave Kazakhstan, but thousands of Russians go there to work?


                you can confirm with links everything that you wrote here, especially about thousands of Russians going to work, or verbiage

                and I want to know everything, what non-oil products you supplied as much as $ 22 billion in 2011

                Quote: Marek Rozny
                To compete in producing all types of consumer goods would be stupid and inefficient. We have selected the main tasks for which we have good chances to occupy our niche in the region, in the world. The efforts of the state are aimed at them.


                can you specifically find out what such niches are targeted by the state’s efforts, only specifically, or will our Kazakh brothers again include propaganda?

                about places at the olympiads do not tryndit, you do not have secondary and higher education, just do not. and therefore there is no future
                1. romb
                  romb 31 December 2012 00: 03
                  +4
                  Don't like electric locomotives?
                  Then please - Kazakhstan diesel locomotives!

                  http://www.aolkz.kz/about/
                  1. xan
                    xan 31 December 2012 01: 04
                    0
                    Well, my Kazakhstan friend
                    I went to your link.

                    The design capacity of the plant is 100 freight trunk locomotives per year. It is planned to launch all the plant’s capacities by 2014. Then the staff of the plant will consist of more than one thousand people.
                    I add - the maximum localization of production is 50%, mainly welding of the body and wheeled carts. Everything else "General Electric"
                    this is how i understood your breakthrough technologies

                    and now you follow my link http://www.tmholding.ru/about_us/enterprises/ Only one plant of "Transmashholding" Novocherkassk electric locomotive building with 100% localization has a staff of 11 thousand people, and in total "Transmashholding" is about 45 thousand. Geography of supplies from Germany (marine diesel engines) and Bulgaria (electric locomotives) to China (turbochargers).
                  2. xan
                    xan 31 December 2012 01: 09
                    -6
                    Well, my Kazakhstan friend
                    I went to your link.

                    The design capacity of the plant is 100 freight trunk locomotives per year. It is planned to launch all the plant’s capacities by 2014. Then the staff of the plant will consist of more than one thousand people.
                    I add - the maximum localization of production is 50%, mainly welding of the body and wheeled carts. Everything else "General Electric"
                    this is how i understood your breakthrough technologies

                    and now you follow my link http://www.tmholding.ru/about_us/enterprises/ Only one plant of "Transmashholding" Novocherkassk electric locomotive building with 100% localization has a staff of 11 thousand people, and in total "Transmashholding" is about 45 thousand. Geography of supplies from Germany (marine diesel engines) and Bulgaria (electric locomotives) to China (turbochargers).

                    Well, is there any other information on no less breakthrough Kazakhstan technologies?
                    1. romb
                      romb 31 December 2012 11: 14
                      +4
                      Question on the question:
                      If Transmashholding was doing so great, then why does it need GE and Alstrom's technologies? They are needed so much that the owners were actually forced to cede control of the enterprise to the French. At the same time, several reasons are indicated: banal inefficiency of management, obsolescence of the material and technical base, degradation of scientific thought.
                      Today, Transmashholding uses various levers of influence in order to prevent Lokomotiv from entering the domestic Russian market. understands very well that it will not be able to compete on equal terms with the technologies of General Electric and Siemens.
                      Eh ... but once it was a powerful enterprise of this type in the world.
                      1. xan
                        xan 3 January 2013 01: 32
                        -1
                        infa from where, the clown
                        tryndet we are all much more
                2. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 01: 01
                  +6
                  You are a very tiring conversationalist.
                  1) Regarding the production of electric locomotives. Firstly, there are several factories already. You looked at the link to ANOTHER plant, which was launched the other day. As for the number of employees: 50 employees today, and by 2016 there will be 650. Read more carefully. The first PRE-serial electric locomotives will be manufactured in France, and these 50 people will be trained there at the French factory. That is, they will do them together with the French, fill their hand. In Kazakhstan itself, 395 electric locomotives will be manufactured AT THE FIRST STAGE, immediately after the manufacture of the first 10 pre-production in France, i.e. in 2013. In 2016, production will peak according to plan, and not the start of work. Do not misinterpret. http://eng.eps.kz/news_press/news/185-ktzh-alstom-i-transmashholding-otkryli-nov

                  yy-elektrovozostroitelnyy-zavod-v-kazahstane.html
                  Another General Electric locomotive plant ALREADY produced more than 150 locomotives in Astana, some of which were exported to the CIS. http://www.aolkz.kz/about/
                  There is also a new plant in Astana for the production of Talgo cars (high-speed trains) with a capacity of 150 cars per year. It is already working and Kazakhstanis are already riding in its cars.
                  You just do not want to believe point blank that Kazakhstan has not only not bent, but is also developing better than before 1991. That's all. For some reason you are terribly upset and annoyed. Therefore you are furious.
                  2) I already wrote to you that, for example, China purchased 1 million Kazakhstan batteries for cars this year, CIS neighbors bought and purchased locomotives, Russia bought half a billion dollars worth of goods from Kazakhstan machine builders this year for only 9 months ( and in general over a year more than $ 700 million should be obtained, http://www.kursiv.kz/industriya/industriya-weekly/1195235936-rossiya-i-kazaxstan

                  -menyayutsya-mashinami.html), Mongols and Ukrainians have drawn up documents for the purchase of Kazakhstani EC-145 helicopters, Ukrainians are buying transformers, Europeans are buying clothes, Belarusians are buying cars, etc. etc. In total - two thousand and a half items. Go hang yourself out of grief. Kazakhs are developing their industry. You are a totally ex-Kazakhstani who left in some 1996 and now you are going crazy, because you promised everyone that "you will die without us, you will crawl on your knees" :))))))) And now you dream of being suddenly asked, and where is the Radiant Man under the nickname "Khan", without whom we once became orphaned? Let him come and teach us how to live ... :))))))))) Here is your crystal dream? Smash it against the toilet and start life anew.
                  1. Marek Rozny
                    Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 01: 02
                    +5
                    Regarding Russians in the KZ: Here is an interview with the director of the representative office of the Chamber of Commerce and Industry of Russia in Kazakhstan - http://m.megapolis.kz/art/Viktor_ZhIGULIN_Vladelets_ubitochnogo_v_Rossii_predpri
                    yatiya_otkriv_proizvodstvo__v_Kazahstane_poluchaet_rentabelnoe Read about how ordinary Russians go to work in Kazakhstan, and about how Russian business begins to flow into our country, where it is more convenient and profitable to work. Moreover, he only called the official number of Russian migrant workers - 9000, and I personally two years ago employed illegally (there was a sin) several groups from Omsk to Astana catering establishments. And seven years ago, he personally traveled to Moscow to drag several IT companies in Almaty, they took all in droves, including accountants. Moreover, he acted on the instructions of the ministry in which he worked. And even in the sauna you can stumble upon girls from Barnaul who want to stay in KZ for permanent residence :)))) Prostitutes here get $ 100 per hour, and in Barnaul they are fantastic prices for prostitutes :)))) We don’t have Moscow, but Astana is more attractive to ordinary Russians from the regions - closer, calmer, more profitable than going to Moscow or St. Petersburg. Only 7 years ago there were more than 11 thousand illegal migrant workers from Russia who were forced to legalize. Now the numbers are unknown to me, but judging by the real communication with them, there are much more of them.
                    And there is a huge mass of Russians who do not fall under the concept of migrant workers - persons with a residence permit. There are already hundreds of thousands of them. Basically, the former Kazakhstanis, who at one time sniffed from the KZ, and now have returned. And they are not going back to Russia, although they retain their growing citizenship. And there are many such returnees from Russia. In every Russian family there are such examples. Formally, they are not moved to Kazakhstan, but in fact they live and work only in the KZ.
                    And about the Olympics - I already answered. If you really want to know, then hold on, read - http://rus.azattyq.org/content/article/1359548.html
                    1. xan
                      xan 31 December 2012 02: 56
                      -7
                      9000 Russian guest workers - some kind of nonsense
                      from IT dragged IT specialists to Almaty, in Almaty more salary? Himself not funny? This is an indicator of the deficit of IT professionals in you. prostitutes move to permanent residence in Astana - this is an indicator.

                      Quote: Marek Rozny
                      And there is a huge mass of Russians who do not fall under the concept of migrant workers - persons with a residence permit. There are already hundreds of thousands of them. Basically, the former Kazakhstanis, who at one time sniffed from the KZ, and now have returned. And they are not going back to Russia, although they retain their growing citizenship. And there are many such returnees from Russia. In every Russian family there are such examples.

                      false lie, Goebels' lie
                      I understand you, what is called the phenomenon of a propagandist to the people.
                      he left 21 years ago, today everyone has left his mother, half his father, left from Kaluga to Krasnoyarsk, no one has returned and will not return.
                      let's end on this
                      you paid
                      1. nurker
                        nurker 31 December 2012 03: 15
                        +3
                        In your argument, I don’t understand what you both argue about, both of you have gone far and are not inferior. Compare macro to micro. Yes, the economy of Kazakhstan with a small population - micro, in comparison with the Russian Federation, is not a secret, even the volumes of GDP show well. But where should Russia be offended, with its potential to become a financial slave to the United States than even small Kazakhstan.
                        You are comparing the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan as a high school graduate with a quadruple junior high school student. And Marek tells you, as it were, that this RK skimmer got the top five today.
                        With such a comparison, you would have approached a 7-year-old boy and asked: "Let's compare who is longer?"
                      2. Marek Rozny
                        Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 10: 03
                        +3
                        Yes, he does not argue, he does not even give any facts. He is simply trying to deny development in Kazakhstan. Don't you see that he is just a "former" Kazakhstani, one of those who once left with a hiss "die without us, mambets." What are you worried about him. He has an incurable hatred and arrogance towards Kazakhs. And now there is also a seething resentment that it turns out that the Kazakhs have not died.
                    2. nurker
                      nurker 31 December 2012 03: 31
                      0
                      Quote: xan
                      xan (1) Today, 02:56 ↑ ↓

                      9000 Russian guest workers - some kind of nonsense


                      It was such a joke in your direction, you did not understand.
                      I'm embarrassed to ask, how is your nickname correctly read? If this is a khan, then the second question is: "why and for what reason did you take the name khan, after all, this is a Turkic-Mongolian phenomenon. Why not a tsar, a prince, primordially Russian. Sorry for the questions, but Nosovsky-Fomenko got so fed up that you even start to find fault to names "

                      Regards, Nurker
                    3. xan
                      xan 31 December 2012 04: 02
                      -1
                      about nickname
                      when registering, I wanted to write a completely different word, but the keyboard on the computer was buggy, I decided to leave what I typed

                      Quote: nurker
                      You are comparing the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan as a high school graduate with a quadruple junior high school student. And Marek tells you, as it were, that this RK skimmer got the top five today.


                      no, wrong association.
                      I know how Kazakhstan was under socialism and what Russia was like,
                      what Kazakhstan has become now, and what Russia is now. in my opinion Kazakhstan is now completely hypocritical state in all its manifestations. To clarify, I share the concept of "Kazakh people" and "Kazakh power".
                      The Republic of Kazakhstan was a fourth-grader junior high school student under socialism, and now the Republic of Kazakhstan was a junior high major without first grade, with oil and gas payments paid until the end of his studies. And Marek is trying to convince me that a kid with such an education has the prospect of no oil and gas.
                    4. nurker
                      nurker 31 December 2012 04: 16
                      +2
                      You have a fairly objective opinion in your area, I will not argue. the sins of the ruling elite are in any state. In any case, I wish you to be more tolerant of the opinions of others, if someone is mistaken, then beautifully correct his opinion.

                      As an oilman, I can offer one more thing, we have such a son of the rich sitting in the company, and an intelligent and capable assistant, performer. But not everywhere. this also had to be noticed.

                      But in general, you are a plus.
                3. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 09: 58
                  +3
                  Well, here we are. The interview with the director of the Russian Chamber of Commerce and Industry in Kazakhstan, in which he says that Russians and business are going to Kazakhstan, the "khan" called nonsense. Apparently, this CCI-shnik also paid for. All around are paid propagandists. Russian businessmen, commentators on the internet, I am absolutely silent about the Kazakhs)))) Only the "khan" was the only one who remained unpaid and knew the truth)))))))) Scream)))))) All lies, propaganda everywhere)))) ) And how I turned out to be right that you just left the skin, who hates any phrase that KZ is not dead, and even began to develop better after such ballast as you dumped from here. What, han, is guano playing in the body? It's a shame that some Kazakhs managed to raise their country without you? Do you remember my advice about your crystal dream? Run to the toilet, hit her faster, and really start life anew without hate. And then you will drown in your own nausea.
                  Mlyayaya, with what arrogance and anger you left KZ I still remember. How much shit you poured out on the internet in order to play off Russia and Kazakhstan, and now you gnaw your elbows, having learned that life in Kazakhstan did not stop without you. You even have the same handwriting when you start writing about Kazakhstan :)))))))))))) From the first paragraph you can see the "former" Kazakhstani, who was allegedly oppressed, humiliated, kicked out. It seems that you are still living under the pressure of humiliation, and therefore you have anger towards the whole world. Not only Kazakhs. It is a pity for Russia, which received so much "foam" from Kazakhstan.
                  Remember how they once joked at KVN?
                  Putin: And they say Zhirinovsky from Kazakhstan comes from?
                  Nazarbayev: Vladimir Vladimirovich, I apologized again that time ...


                  I wish you brains and kindness this new year :))))
                4. xan
                  xan 1 January 2013 20: 42
                  0
                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  And how I turned out to be right that you were just leaving the skin, who hates any phrase that KZ did not die, and even began to develop better after such a ballast as you dumped from here.


                  Stop smudging the snot on the screen, About the fact that Kazakhstan began to develop better, you have not proved to me and will never prove it, because it is not. All your posts about delivered 22 billion dollars of non-oil products and about breakthrough industries, on which the efforts of the Kazakh government have focused, have remained without evidence. Instead, you began to switch to personality.
                  catch the link http://www.ved.gov.ru/exportcountries/kz/about_kz/ved_kz/
                  open your eyes and look at the export and import of Kazakhstan in dollars
                  All your development, this is the export of almost $ 120 billion per year of raw materials from high-tech products, only 560 million to the CIS and 220 million to non-CIS countries. You import almost 6 billion from the CIS and 10 billion from non-CIS countries. Where is the development ?, where is 22 billion of non-mineral exports?

                  Quote: Marek Rozny
                  Mlyayaya, with what arrogance and anger you left KZ I still remember. How much shit you poured out on the internet in order to play off Russia and Kazakhstan, and now you gnaw your elbows, having learned that life in Kazakhstan did not stop without you. You even have the same handwriting when you start writing about Kazakhstan :)))))))))))) From the first paragraph you can see the "former" Kazakhstani, who was allegedly oppressed, humiliated, expelled.

                  You didn’t read this from me, leave this kind of lyrics for other sites. You are a pistapol. In your posts, the construct disappeared altogether. From this, I conclude that your myth about the accelerated development of Kazakhstan has disappeared, and my truth remains about the country of oil workers, gas workers, dukens and taxi drivers.
                5. xan
                  xan 1 January 2013 21: 49
                  +2
                  Yes, still.
                  Kazakhstan, in terms of per capita, exports 5 times more oil and gas than Russia. And even with such a monstrous proportion, you were able to make a living standard in Astana and Almaty more or less acceptable.
                  Such a development of Russia fuck is not necessary.
                  and let Kazakhstan continue.
                6. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 6 January 2013 20: 54
                  0
                  1) I already gave you links and quotes. Everything is in the internet. Just google it. You are simply dodging, because you are stuck in your head on the phrase "Kazakhs cannot do without me, my dear." Sorry, but got along. The detachment did not notice the loss of a soldier. Hundreds of thousands of people from neighboring countries came instead of you to WORK. So the Kazakhs will not rush at your feet with tears "Come back! We are starving to death without you."
                  The total volume of exports is somewhere around $ 200 billion. Of these, 10% are finished products, the rest is raw materials. Yes, you can be ironic if you don't know what kind of economy the USSR left us in 1991 - in Soviet times, the Kazakh SSR was almost exclusively a "raw material cow" and do not pretend that you did not know this. It is now that we have begun to produce something that is interesting to buy for an ordinary person, and 20 years ago there was nothing from consumer goods. The first task was - Import substitution, now the task on many positions has been completed, now in recent years we have been developing the topic export-oriented products... And there are successes. I'm already tired of talking to you about engineering products and other articles of Kazakh export. You just don't want to admit it. Even if you bring you up to the wall, you will still shout "Mambets! Without me you will never be able to develop!" :)))))))) And what have not seen such "refugees" like you personally? In one of Wiedergeburt every Sunday I saw drinking parties leaving for Vaterland, where people did not hesitate to say that the Kazakhs "would die out like dinosaurs without us." The Germans who stayed live great lives, and those who left, smearing snot about their "professional irreplaceability" - get sozial or are interrupted by black work. And from ethnic Russians in KZ in the 90s and early 2000s, all Kazakhstanis, both Russians and Kazakhs, constantly heard that "we will leave, and Kazakhs will be able to graze only sheep." Che to play the fool, if even mass Russian-language newspapers from issue to issue wrote this cliché in different interpretations. Or did you not read the newspapers in KZ? Have you forgotten how the Russian-language Kazakh newspapers relished the theme of the "departure of Russian-speaking"? You, by any chance, did not write such articles in newspapers yourself?
                  2) Regarding your Kazakhstan export link. Read carefully what is written there shares of non-primary goods sold ONLY to CIS countries:
                  - Machines, equipment, vehicles, devices and apparatuses - 4,4%
                  - food products - 9,4%
                  - chemical products - 6,6%
                  - textile products - 0,6%
                  - shoes - 0,3%
                  - building materials - 0,3%
                  - pulp and paper products - 0,3%
                  etc. Then, with a calculator, calculate the export of non-primary goods to the FAR ABROAD. You really are like in the saying "I look at the book, I see a fig" ... Only by article "Machinery, equipment, vehicles, instruments and apparatus" Kazakhs sold abroad for a little less than a billion dollars (more than 750 million dollars)! Moreover, it was noted that sales to the CIS countries grew by 223,7%! What are you fooling about? Every year Kazakhstan began to increase the export of non-primary goods. And even if this is only 10% of total exports, this is already an indicator of the growth of the non-resource economy for us. Until recently, we sold nothing at all except oil and metals. Or can you name the consumer goods that we sent to Russia or Uzbekistan until 1991? There was no such thing. And now there is. For two tens of billion dollars. Burst now, impenetrable "khan".
                7. Marek Rozny
                  Marek Rozny 6 January 2013 20: 55
                  +1
                  3) As for the proportions of oil exports per capita - I do not know what your balance is in Russia, but there is one more factor in Kazakhstan. Population density. The costs of gasification / installation of telephones / Internet access / construction of social infrastructure are gigantic and, most often, absolutely stranded. Do you remember the size of the country? And the population size? Do you remember the fact that Kazakhstanis live "spread out" throughout the entire territory? Arabs from microscopic countries did not even dream of our expenses on road construction. If you don’t fumble about the state economy, then what are you trying to polemize? You just live in 1996. You stayed there. And all your messages are correct only for that period. Wake up, "Khan", it's 2013. Stop being angry that no one is crying over your hasty departure from Kazakhstan. Stop calling your acquaintances fools who do not want to leave our country point-blank. There is work here, there is income, it is calm on the streets, no one infringes anyone on the national basis, people are generally optimistic about their future (which is not in Russia, unfortunately) - what is the reason for a Karaganda resident Ivanov or a Kustanay resident Freidenberg to leave the country? If in the 90s they believed that it was possible to live here, now even more so. Considering that all our Russians have already visited Russia "with intelligence" more than once and saw with their own eyes how the situation was there. And you are just offended that all your "forecasts" about the death of Kazakhstan have remained nonsense. So you are trying to pass off wishful thinking. By the way, did you watch the Olympics? How do you like the performance of our athletes? I saw how strong Kazakhstan is, even as a mere sports power, and noticed how many among Kazakhstani sportsmen - Russians, Caucasians, Dungans and others? In Russia, everyone was angry when the Caucasians won gold, and in Kazakhstan for the victories of "our Kazakhs" - the Russians Vinokurov, Podobedova, Rypakova and Volnova, the Greek Ilyin, the Dungans of Chinshanlo and Maneza, the Caucasians Gadzhiev and Manyurova, the Ukrainian Dychko, (I'm not talking about Kazakh athletes - Tanatorov, Sapiev, Niyazymbetov) - really cried with pride. The state has money even to finance sports well, to engage in space and Antarctic projects, so do not whine - Kazakhstan is alive and well. Which he wishes for you too. I say again, you need a job in Kazakhstan - write in a personal, we will pick something up;)
    3. xan
      xan 31 December 2012 03: 33
      -6
      about electric locomotives do not tryndi, it seems you yourself do not read your links.
      at your plant in Astana, a maximum of 650 people will work, and for General Electric, one thousand. and this is at 50% localization, i.e. body welding, places for equipment and wheelsets. In Russia, 45 work at Transmash with 100% localization. Yes, give examples of the accomplished purchase of locomotives by Russia from Kazakhstan, we are all very good at trying.
      Quote: Marek Rozny
      I already wrote to you that, for example, China bought 1 million Kazakhstan batteries for cars this year, CIS neighbors bought and buy locomotives, Russia bought half a billion dollars worth of goods from Kazakhstan machine builders this year in just 9 months (and In total, more than $ 700 million should be obtained in a year, http://www.kursiv.kz/industriya/industriya-weekly/1195235936-rossiya-i-kazaxstan

      -menyayutsya-mashinami.html), Mongols and Ukrainians have drawn up documents for the purchase of Kazakhstani EC-145 helicopters, Ukrainians are buying transformers, Europeans are buying clothes, Belarusians are buying cars, etc. etc. In total - two thousand and a half items.


      You promised me a link to 22 billion, but here are some snot. you give data on Russian supplies to Kazakhstan?



      Quote: Marek Rozny
      Go hang yourself out of grief. Kazakhs are developing their industry. You are a totally ex-Kazakhstani who left in some 1996 and now you are going crazy, because you promised everyone that "you will die without us, you will crawl on your knees" :))))))) And now you dream of being suddenly asked, and where is the Radiant Man under the nickname "Khan", without whom we once became orphaned? Let him come and teach us how to live ... :))))))))) Here is your crystal dream? Smash it against the toilet and start life anew.

      Well, your real face of the propagandist has begun to get out? calm down and be blown away, you don’t get nifig, wrestler, dream about yourself
      I solved my matproblems in the late 90s and I live much better than my not only Kazakh, but also German friends. but I can’t travel to Kazakhstan anymore, for health it’s unbearable what the current government has done with my city and its inhabitants. not a single enterprise for the production of anything, even food, only duken, taxi drivers, grain and subsistence farming. all my school friends who have not left are tormented by material problems and the realization that they cannot provide a better life for their children. my Kazakhstan friends are avoiding me. very sorry that they did not go to St. Petersburg with me, that there was not enough energy and brains. they have no complaints against the Kazakh authorities, they do not expect anything from it, this is not their power. but this is lyrics.
      I remind you once again, you wrote about the industries on which the Kazakh government decided to focus efforts, give examples of these industries, give links
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 10: 13
        +6
        Hey, you! You were kicked out of Kazakhstan, and now you were deported from Google? :))))))))))))) Look further yourself - "clusters in Kazakhstan", "competitiveness of Kazakhstan" - there you will find about the industry. And you didn't fucking accidentally ask for links to hundreds of businesses? I gave you some examples, then pick it yourself. Why the hell should I do monkey labor if you're just flooding with hatred? Go puk the toilet after a hangover. Then wash your face, mark the New Year, and after the holidays google it and read it, if you really want.
        I'm already tired of writing to you, giving you links and so on. News, interviews, quotes. And you will not calm down in any way. Go read it yourself, you chewed me completely, "refugee".
        1. romb
          romb 31 December 2012 11: 49
          +1
          Do not feed the troll!
        2. xan
          xan 1 January 2013 21: 14
          -1
          I especially liked the link to LED lamps, the plant of which the Kazakhs are going to open as much in 2014
        3. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 6 January 2013 21: 07
          +1
          we have it for many years to come. Russia only recently switched to a budget for several years, and in the KZ in the 90s they were following a program designed for 35 years. and now the general development strategy is planned until 2050.
          and in this year, 2013, there were plans for a huge amount in the industry. Kazakhstan is already used to the fact that some day a plant is opening.
          by the way, since you are probably interested in the military topic, take a look on the internet, what is going on in the defense industry in Kazakhstan. a bunch of factories have also been / are being launched - from Kevlar and radio headsets to small ships and armored vehicles. "Kazakhstan Engineering", "Gidropribor", "Zenith" and other firms in this topic look. Until recently, they were all "dead", but now they produce products worth billions of tenge.
    4. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 12: 03
      +3
      ohhh, what passage I happen to have missed!
      Quote: xan
      my Kazakhstan friends are avoiding me.

      Wahahaha))))))))))))))))))) I perfectly understand your friends laughing
  • sergskak
    sergskak 29 December 2012 22: 05
    +2
    Cho, cool picture! Tsar, just Tsar! Like ours.
  • Was mammoth
    Was mammoth 29 December 2012 22: 54
    +1
    An article about N. Nazarbayev would sooner or later appear on the military-political website in Russia. Kazakhstan is our closest neighbor with a centuries-old joint history that began long before Batu Khan. And where Kazakhstan-Russia is developing should be not indifferent. To whom is he friend, and to whom is the enemy? Can one trust such an ally? Is there a “Kazakh caliphate" or a multinational state? Kazakhstan for Kazakhs or for Kazakhstanis? There while still a quarter of the population lives-Russians.
    Quote: Beck
    According to the 2009 census. Kazakhs 63,1%. Russian 23,7%. The remaining 13,2%.
    Beck.
    And given the so-called "Russian-speaking", I think up to half will be.
    In words, everything is rosy: “... Nazarbayev’s speech abounded with words about the need to develop an innovative economy, integration with the closest neighbors within the CIS and the Customs Union, about maintaining the status of the Russian language in the republic.
    On the other hand, steps to move away from Russia. One little step.
    Quote: Geser Khan
    ... what difference do you have in what alphabet we will write? Russian will not be translated into Latin in Kazakhstan. Russians calm down !!!

    Indeed, what is the matter of Russian - in what alphabet will Kazakh write? By the way, do all Kazakhs approve the transition to Latin? The answer is simple. Have you heard Pan-Turkism? It will be a distance from Russia (but Turkey will be closer). And this is not the only step in this direction. Nazarbayev is building the Kazakh Caliphate? Does Russian culture interfere? And we are in Latin. And the Russians are assimilation or go home to their historical homeland.
    It was written on this site:
    "- someday it will come true. I bring up children in this spirit. It is a pity, of course, that not with my sons and not even during the life of my sons. But it will come true. It is the Kazakh Caliphate, not the Turkish-Kazakh, not the Uzbek-Kazakh, none, only the Kazakh. And these neighbors in the furnace, or rather, to our slavery under the influence. "
    So think about it.

    Quote: nurker
    Soviet leaders were not interested in the prosperity of Central Asia as a powerful universal core

    Hmm. Those. before the collapse of the USSR in Kazakhstan, there were only one nomads? There was no industry, there was no Virgin?
    Quote: Beck
    You still drag here that the Russian expelled. A migrant there, drunk, bravado betrayed that he was kicked out and away

    As many as three million drunkards have left !!! My wife is from Kazakhstan. she still had relatives there. So, that "drunk" will not work. Do you not know what the Kazakh press writes.

    PS I did not want to offend the Kazakhs, but I see as I wrote.
    1. nurker
      nurker 30 December 2012 09: 27
      +2
      Dear, in my opinion you did not understand what I wrote and cut down with a hot hand
    2. Beck
      Beck 30 December 2012 10: 22
      +6
      Quote: There was a mammoth
      As many as three million drunkards have left !!! My wife is from Kazakhstan. she still had relatives there. So, that "drunk" will not work. Do you not know what the Kazakh press writes.


      Do not distort. This distortion leads to misunderstanding. You perfectly understand what I had in mind. If your wife has been kicked out of your wife, why shouldn’t her relatives be kicked out? Some kind of problem.

      And in those breakup years, everything was at the household level. Yes, and now, with abuse, neighbors, whom else, do not they speak in the heat. Go to your Taganrog. Drive to Burundi. Not going So go to x ... y.

      They are still shouting in the swara. Sgin. Yes, what would you have died. I’ll kill you. I'll kill you. If desired, all these words can be attributed as an exceptional orientation against the Russians. Rave.

      The official press does not write anything bad, but calls on everyone to remain citizens of Kazakhstan. Well, there are nationalist leaflets. So nationalism is a disease, in one way or another, characteristic of the inadequate personalities of any people. Somewhere more manifests, somewhere less. Your skinheads have multiplied, so that I should perceive this as the official policy of Russia. This is nonsense. Just like your rubbish about exile.
      1. Was mammoth
        Was mammoth 30 December 2012 21: 53
        +1
        Dear Beck and Nurker.
        I would be glad if you would dispel my doubts.
        I will allow myself a few excerpts.
        “Azimbay GALI.
        Three tasks of the Kazakhosphere. There are tasks that should become priorities. This is the introduction of the state language, the Kazakhization of Kazakhstan, socialization. Kazakhization involves the recruitment of elites and ethnosocial mobilization to transform multinational Kazakhstan into post-ethnic.
        ... What will it give individually. The solution to the first problem will preserve the integrity of the Kazakh culture, otherwise the side branch, the so-called Russian-speaking Kazakh culture, will develop. A similar Kazakh subculture in Kazakhstan itself will only weaken and split resources, mix priorities. If the subculture will develop somewhere in Uzbekistan, Russia, China, then this is quite acceptable. The solution of the second problem will make the decolonization process irreversible. Urbanization will give Kazakhs political and social stability. The ideal state is the completion of the transformation into a bourgeois, urban and individualistic ethnic group.
        ... What is good for Kazakhstan and Kazakhs? Integration, assimilation and acculturation on the basis of Kazakh values ​​and observance of national values ​​and sacredness - the national state, state language and national spirit (Islam, material and spiritual culture).
        ... At the same time, workflow is in full swing into the state language, a list of specialties with mandatory knowledge of the Kazakh language is being prepared. So, the process of replacing Russians has been stable and ongoing from 1968 to the present day.
        ... Decolonization is a stage that must be passed. Then Kazakhization of non-Kazakhs will follow.
        ... We see that the future of the Kazakhs lies in the Kazakhization of the entire population as a result of ethnosocial mobilization and in the transformation of the multinational into post-ethnic Kazakhstan. ”

        Does this remind you of Nazarbayev’s actions? Reminds me. The Baltic states.
        Agree, building a national state and building a nationalist are two big differences. According to your press, in so far multinational Kazakhstan, 99% of Kazakh leaders are. Mentioning the "Kazakh Caliphate" I did not mean religion. Kazakhs used to relate to religion quite loyally. It’s enough to remember that Kazakh women never wore veils. I meant nationalism. He is now fueling religious strife. The desire to write as convenient as your right. That's just the reasons confuse in the light of quotes. Is it all the same you all immediately approved the transition to the Latin alphabet? It somehow reminds me of the decision-making of our "United Russia". Compare with the consistent destruction of the historical memory of the Slavs. Where is now Tselinograd, Shevchenko, Semipalatinsk, Alma-Ata .... How many street names are left in Russian? How do they teach history in schools? What good have the “colonizers” left behind, whose descendants still live in Kazakhstan? Like links of one chain.
        We are united by a lot. What will happen tomorrow? Much depends on the Kazakhs.
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 23: 43
          +2
          Quote: Was Mammoth
          Does this remind you of Nazarbayev’s actions? Reminds me. The Baltic states.

          If they decided to cite the words of the political scientist Azimbay Gali as an example, then we could remember his words from the mentioned interview: “The Kazakhs will put their priorities, national, spiritual, at the forefront. What is done tough in the Baltic States, rude in the Caucasus, should be done gently in Kazakhstan, with the complementarity characteristic of Kazakhs".
          Azimbay Gali is a supporter of the creation of a "large Kazakh nation" into which all ethnic groups of Kazakhstan will be incorporated. In principle, here in Kazakhstan they have been joking for a long time about the "fourth zhuz", meaning ethnic Slavs, Germans, Koreans as an integral part of a single people. There is no mention of any forced assimilation of non-Kazakhs! What is Kazakhization in the Kazakh sense? This is when Vanya Ivanov knows the Kazakh language and knows the Kazakh way of life and culture. At the same time, Vanya Ivanov must know his roots! We are not going to go anywhere from borscht and songs in Russian, and a penny worth to that Russian Kazakhstani who will spit in the direction of his native culture. Because he is a traitor. Today he betrayed his culture, tomorrow - ours. Such "Kazakhs" are worse than outright chauvinists. And the same Azimbai Gali mentioned in the same interview says the same thing: "At the same time, it is not assumed that you should forget your native language, but you are obliged to know the state language. A change of faith, confession is not assumed, but political loyalty to the state and its priorities is assumed.".
          Don't take phrases out of context. Yes, the fact is - Kazakh culture should be the core culture of Kazakhstan. But no one says that in Kazakhstan there should only be a purely Kazakh culture! Kazakhs want all Kazakhs to know and respect the attributes of a common country. This is "Kazakhization". At the same time, the Kazakhs themselves will not allow our Slavs, Koreans, Germans, Vainakhs, Turks, Kurds, Jews to renounce their cultural characteristics - this is already the wealth of our country. Be it Russian pancakes, German cabbage, Ukrainian songs, Korean salads. Kazakhs are proud to know the culture of their non-Kazakh compatriots. And we want our compatriots, whom we are proud and respectful, to also know the Kazakh culture. This is the concept of the "big Kazakh nation". What did you see disturbing here? Or is there no "big Russian nation" in Russia, which includes Yakuts, Bashkirs, and Mordovians?
          The fact that most non-Kazakhs do not speak the state language worries Kazakhs. It should not be allowed that the non-Kazakh part of the country began to boil in its own world separately from other Kazakhstanis. You correctly noted that in the civil service, most of the employees are Kazakhs. The problem is that because of the language problem, Russians do not go there. Today the situation is still bearable, but after 10 years, if the Russian Kazakhstanis do not master the language, then they will find themselves in the backyards of Kazakhstani society. This worries the Kazakhs. Therefore, they say that the state should concern itself with the problem of the full integration of the non-Kazakh part of the population into the life of the country. If the Kazakhs did not want Vanya Ivanov to become a full-fledged part of society, then these questions would not be raised by political scientists. Russian Kazakhstanis must be full citizens. And they understand this themselves. There should not be any infringement in Kazakhstan on a national basis - this is the credo of our society. This is the core of our steppe worldview in general. This is what we have, regardless of whether we have oil or not. We are a multicultural nation. This is our wealth. And our task is to teach non-Kazakhs the Kazakh language so that they can not only be managed, but also manage, as it should be to the master of the country.
          1. Marek Rozny
            Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 23: 43
            +4
            Z.Y. Regarding the names:
            1) Tselinograd before Khrushchev was called Akmola, Akmola.
            2) The city of Shevchenko received its historical name - Aktau (that was the name of the city until 1964). But the memory of Shevchenko is preserved in the name of another Kazakh city - Fort Shevchenko.
            3) Semipalatinsk was renamed to rebrand the region, which everyone associated exclusively with the Semipalatinsk nuclear test site. And the locals, including Russians, still called the city in everyday life briefly - Semsk, Semey.
            4) Alma-Ata - a name that appeared in the Soviet years, the city itself since medieval times has always been called Almaty. The word Alma-Ata - from the point of view of the Kazakh language - is absurd, this word is a stupid mistake.
            In addition, the names of streets that were named after communist realities were renamed - Kommunisticheskaya, Sovetskaya, Lenin, Marx, Engels, etc. At the same time, there is Zenkov street, Baum grove (people who made a huge contribution to Almaty before the revolution) and so on. ... Let me also remind you that the East Kazakhstan city of Leninogorsk was, for example, renamed by the Kazakhs into Ridder in honor of the Russian German, thanks to whom this city appeared. And the city of Dzhambul was renamed into the historically correct Taraz. In Astana, for example, Abay Street was renamed into Kubrin Street (a pre-revolutionary local merchant, whose houses are still the decoration of the city). The name of Abai was given to another street - the former Lenin. Streets in honor of Potanin, Katchenko, Scriabin, Zataevich, Brusilovsky, Kravtsov, Gumilyov appeared in the new Astana. Why do we need foreign names for Kazakhstan? All the more so when there are many Russians of their own who really contributed to the development of the republic, but remained immortal? Kazakhs name streets in their honor. And they are not called "colonizers".
          2. Was mammoth
            Was mammoth 31 December 2012 12: 52
            +1
            Quote: Marek Rozny
            What is being done tough in the Baltic states, in the Caucasus is rude, in Kazakhstan should be done softly, with the complementarity peculiar to Kazakhs. "

            This is alarming. In the Baltic, Russians are already second-class people; in the Transcaucasus, there are practically none left.
            Quote: Marek Rozny
            The fact that most non-Kazakhs do not speak the state language worries Kazakhs.

            The bilingualism of Kazakhs is a big plus, and I myself honestly envy if someone knows more than one native language. When I was young, 30 years ago, I understood a little Turkmen, Kazakh, Latvian. True, I could speak at the level of Elochka, a human-eater. Now, as they say - "English with a dictionary." For 20 years, you have not created a normal system of teaching the Kazakh language, in addition, due to the reluctance of the bulk of Kazakhs to change the traditional way of life, gaps appeared in the language. (Among the Russians who encountered Kazakhs in the countryside, there were many who knew Kazakh. My relative had a grandfather , blessed memory of him, Kazakhs always called him to celebrations, where they trusted to butcher his head). This is how the distinction between urban and rural emerged. the first had to use the Russian language, which always absorbed new things. In my opinion, only linguists can tell where certain words come from in Russian. This is the main reason why Kazakh language teaching is so slow. And if you go to any Kazakh site, you get the impression that the Kazakhs themselves have not yet figured it out. It’s not for me to tell you about clannishness.
            For 20 years, it would be possible to create a sane system of language training and incentives for its use. The main reason is the uncertainty of the future and led to the loss by Kazakhstan of several million of its citizens.
            Quote: nurker
            I did not understand this phrase, either a threat, or ridicule, or gloating.

            In no case, neither the first, nor the second, nor the third. I always say that Russians have a lot to learn from other peoples, which our ancestors did. I just hope that the Russian state will build relations with other states depending on the real position of the "Russian-speaking" in them. Not yet.
            The topic of the native language is important for everyone. God grant that the right path is chosen. It must be sought together.
            Tomorrow is the New Year. I wish you all health, success, happiness.
            1. Marek Rozny
              Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 15: 04
              +1
              Quote: There was a mammoth
              This is alarming. In the Baltic, Russians are already second-class people; in the Transcaucasus, there are practically none left.

              How was it done in Russia? Tartars, Chuvashes, Mordovians and northern peoples were culturally introduced to the "Russian big nation" gently or harshly?
              Let's not deny that Russian politics has been assimilating since the tsarist times, and sometimes very harshly (forcibly baptizing Tatars and Chuvashs, eliminating Finnish place names, teaching exclusively in Russian, etc.).
              Kazakhs are not going to do any tough actions. We have in our blood a respect for other nationalities and religions. Until recently, Bosko was chopped off by our fellow tribesman for insulting a foreigner on this basis, I think you are familiar with the strict historical laws of the steppes. And although now there is neither Iasi, nor Zhety Zharga, nor other steppe laws, this is firmly entrenched in the Kazakh mentality. Therefore, the Kazakhs are sincerely violently outraged when someone tries to humiliate us on the basis of nationality or on our faith. And we don’t want our Russians were subjected to any kind of oppression. We have given 35 years to finally move inside the country to the state language. This is the time during which new generations of Russian Kazakhstanis will grow up who will know the language from the kindergarten. At the same time, I repeat once again, the Russian language will remain in school education, along with Kazakh and English. But the public life of Kazakhstan will definitely go into the Kazakh-speaking sphere. Russian culture occupies and will occupy a worthy place in the pan-Kazakhstan culture. I myself worked for several years (for free) in a German cultural center, engaged in the development of German culture among German youth. Paradoxically, I knew their culture and language than most of our Schneiders and Kellers did.
              The fact that supposedly there is no Kazakh normal training program is a fallacy of the older generation, who really formally studied the Kazakh language in the 90s. Then it was not up to the tongue, just to survive. Now the state is opening free courses, in organizations they pay extra to Russians who know the Kazakh language. In the civil service, Kazakh-speaking Russian makes a career faster than Kazakh. On TV, the news is conducted by Kazakh-speaking Russians and Germans. There are a bunch of books, paid courses, and courses of a wide variety of forms - from gaming to academic. There are even Kazakh language textbooks written by Russian Kazakhstanis (for example, Romanenko’s textbook)! The whole country recently looked with enthusiasm at our Olympic champion Marina Volnova, who easily spoke with journalists in the Kazakh language.
              The German writer Gerold Belger is nicknamed "the conscience of the Kazakh nation" - I personally do not know a single Kazakh who would have mastered such a masterly Kazakh speech as this aksakal!
              From the current generation of Russians there is no demand and never will be. Demand will be from the new generation, which now goes to kindergarten and school. And since childhood, they absorb three languages. Do not think that your relatives are dumber than Kazakhs, they will easily learn the Kazakh language. And they will do more to make them proud of both the Kazakhs in Kazakhstan and the Russians in Russia.
              I recently cited an example on the site that the Russian Cossacks of the Urals, Orenburg region, Siberia, and Semirechye all knew the Kazakh language before the revolution. And this is without any textbooks. Russian Kazakhstanis will learn the language and will shame shala-Kazakhs like me more than once with their impeccable knowledge of the state language. Knowing Russian (Ukrainian, German, Korean, Chechen) clever women, I have no doubt about this.
              1. Marek Rozny
                Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 15: 10
                +2
                Quote: There was a mammoth
                Tomorrow is the New Year. I wish you all health, success, happiness.

                And let me also congratulate you on the upcoming! We all have big plans in our personal plan, and we all want our countries to be a single, strong state again. Let everything come true at the right time and that we always treat each other from the hands of one at the same table :)
        2. nurker
          nurker 31 December 2012 01: 27
          +3
          In principle, I agree with the expressed opinion of my fellow countryman.
          I’ll add one clarification from myself. The settlement of Almaty has existed since ancient times, there, at the foot of the mountains, apples of a special variety grew - an aport, and probably the settlement was named after the apples among the Turks, kaz. Alma is an apple, but the Turks of those times formed Alma + you (and) and Almaty - they already receive the adjective - apple. When the detachment of Peremyshleysky came to the settlement, then, accordingly, the Vernaya fortress was built near the edge of the borders with China, this name began to unite that area. During the years of the revolution, the name Alma-Ata was returned, probably the name was made by a person who did not know the Turkic. And now the city got its historical name back.
        3. nurker
          nurker 31 December 2012 02: 03
          +2
          Quote: There was a mammoth
          We are united by a lot. What will happen tomorrow? Much depends on the Kazakhs.

          I did not understand this phrase, either a threat, or ridicule, or gloating.
          About religions: as Boris N. Yeltsin said. : "I understand, for democracy." After the collapse of the USSR, most of the leaders of the CIS took a course towards democracy, including the Kazakhstani leadership. Of course, the standards of democracy - the United States - took part in creating the laws. Democracy gives freedom of speech to everything that was previously forbidden, and it was forbidden to speak to religious people and any magicians. Therefore, oceans of Divine information poured into both the Russian Federation and the Republic of Kazakhstan. By the way, atheism is also a religion - it is a religion for non-believers in God, it is also cleverly done. And so, the Kazakhs were looking for their recent roots in Islam, joined different sects, the Slavs were also doing this: Witnesses, New Christianity, or something else like that. There are also representatives of cultural sects: rappers, rockers, emo, goths, gays, lesbians, etc. So I am against the creation of a caliphate, socialism as in the USSR, democratization, or anything that violates the normal integrity of the family, person and world outlook on life. I am against the rapprochement of Kazakhstan with Turkey, in Turkey imperial ambitions are manifested with the creation of a second Ottoman Empire on the basis of the unification of all Turks. I believe that the state should educate a good citizen, not a good slave.
          1. Denis
            Denis 31 December 2012 04: 21
            +1
            Quote: nurker
            The standards of democracy, of course, participated in the creation of laws.

            Are you serious about the standard?
            Quote: nurker
            There are also representatives of cultural sects: rappers, rockers, emo, goths, gays, lesbians

            and about the last few, how cultural?
            1. nurker
              nurker 31 December 2012 04: 29
              0
              Quote: Denis
              Are you serious about the standard?


              About the standard, I, as it were, in quotation marks))) I just did not write quotation marks, my mistake.

              Quote: Denis
              and about the last few, how cultural?

              how cultural I meant that they carry their culture with them, for a normal person they are cultured. Well, here, too, it was necessary to write in quotation marks.
              Thank you for your comment.
              1. Denis
                Denis 31 December 2012 04: 36
                +3
                Quote: nurker
                acultural

                Then I propose a replacement for the anuscultural!
                I apologize for the thought crime (according to J. Orwell), I read it without quotes and thought badly
                1. nurker
                  nurker 31 December 2012 05: 05
                  0
                  Thank you, I will know in the future. then you are also my like-minded person. It's good. You just sometimes wonder why these rappers, who are whining and lowering each other, are the same rockers, these gays, with their rights, and lesbians, these whiners, goths and emos, etc. to religions.
                  After all, you can arrange a moral civilization on planet Earth.
    3. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 14: 21
      +3
      What are the signs of the "Kazakh Caliphate" ??? Do you think that Nazarbayev is building a religious state? Maybe our Constitution is built on Sharia law? You, do not hesitate, fantasize further ... If someone on the site from members of the forum wrote their opinion on the Caliphate, it is silly to pass it off as the state policy of Kazakhstan. Moreover, in this passage, the member of the forum admits that this will not happen either during his lifetime or during the life of his children. And let me pull out the thoughts of skinheads and other semi-literate Russians and base the Russian foreign policy strategy on this. Can you imagine what you can write? "The Kremlin is building a fascist state! Hitler is an icon of all Russian people!" etc. So what? Vasya Pupkin, in the heat of an Internet dispute, wrote something like that, so I thought that this was the official position of the Kremlin leadership. What's the nafig difference? Are you acting according to this logic?
      Quote: There was a mammoth
      Does Russian culture interfere? And we are in Latin. And the Russians are assimilation or go home to their historical homeland.

      Eeee, I'm generally at a dead end ... How to connect "Russian culture" and "Kazakh Latin"? Are the Kazakhs going to remake the Russian language, Russian music, Russian literature and so on? WHY IS THE KAZAKH ALPHABET AND RUSSIAN CULTURE HERE? You also say that due to the fact that Kazakhs will now start writing in Latin, they will infringe on the rights of Russian-speaking Kazakhstanis :))))))))))))))))))))))) as Kazakhs write. They still don't understand anything in Kazakh texts. What if they suddenly feel slighted or, more precisely, as you put it, "assimilated"? These "assimilated" would at least learn to pronounce the sentence in Kazakh. Oh, these cruel Kazakhs-oppressors - so assimilated the Ivanovs that even in Kazakh they forbid the enslaved Russians to speak ... It is impossible to imagine more terrible assimilation!
      And what is the connection between
      Quote: There was a mammoth
      The answer is simple. Have you heard Pan-Turkism? It will be a distance from Russia (but Turkey will be closer).
      and a phrase that supposedly is evidence of pan-Turkism:
      Quote: There was a mammoth
      It is the Kazakh caliphate, not Turkish-Kazakh, not Uzbek-Kazakh, no, only Kazakh.

      Point blank I do not see the logic and the connection between these parts of the post.
  • Skinny
    Skinny 30 December 2012 01: 07
    -5
    The reconstruction of the Empire will be very difficult, strong resistance, the backwardness of the CIS economies, their kings will be against (it would be better to be 1 in the village than 2 in Rome) How many problems, responsibilities. I am sure that Russia has only 1 way - Europe.
    First you need to solve the problems of enormous corruption, alcoholism and drug addiction, internal security. Making a more sustainable and competitive economy. We are entering the EU. So here, to all evil! Collaborate on equal terms! Russia is part of European civilization! And in the global world we are on the way. I know that this site will not approve of this, but by ..
    1. xan
      xan 30 December 2012 02: 21
      +1
      Skinny,
      if you want to join the EU, join separately from Russia, now it is possible
      I do not want any alliances with them; for me they are complete hypocrites.
      I quote for you
      As soon as you come across a person who claims that Russia needs "to Europe", you should know that this is NOT RUSSIAN. I don't know which one. But not a Russian person. He does not have in his soul the feeling of a great global nation. A great people with a great history and a great future.
  • Smoke
    Smoke 30 December 2012 02: 22
    -5
    hmm))) Kazakh in Latin, this is kaneshno five !!!))) Let's Nazarbai burn further cho)) Then the old stsukan himself will die soon - all his life he wrote in Cyrillic, received education in Russian, and now that's how it is. ..... stsuka, how did all these elites in the republics begin to boil ... after all, simply I’m more than confident that Kazakh poher can write on what
  • GOLUBENKO
    GOLUBENKO 30 December 2012 06: 50
    0
    The article is good, put a plus, the questions are posed correctly.
    I think that it is not worth paying much attention to what the aksakal says.
    The most interesting in Kazakhstan will begin after his departure.
    Namely, the war of the elites with the active participation of pro-Islamic terrorist forces and special services of the USA and China, possibly Russia.
    For the USA vryatli will miss the chance to put on the post of president of Kazakhstan its own person like Saakashvili or Yushchenko. What is going on with these states, I think everyone sees and knows.
  • Magadan
    Magadan 30 December 2012 07: 50
    +6
    Was in Kazakhstan in 2010m. The most pleasant impression. For example, we, who flew to Moscow from Magadan, were kept in the baggage waiting room in Sheremetyevo for 1.5 hours. It was hot, I wanted to drink, there was only coffee in the machine. I put the bill in 100 rubles, the machine-gobbled it up, but didn’t give the coffee. In the end, the airport workers started sharing their own bottled water.
    Then he flew to Astana. Customs passed in 15 minutes. The police are polite everywhere and help. A car broke down at one of ours, so Kazakh police did not leave him on the highway, they contacted someone on the radio, they were told that there would be a bus and a friend would be taken away. It is a pity that they refused a fish and caviar as a present.
    Everywhere the service is at the highest level. Along the slopes there are normal flush toilets with showers. I did not notice any difference in service between the USA and Kazakhstan, only in the USA there is no "local flavor"
    He was driving back to Russia on a car tire. Customs on the Kazakh side passed in 20 minutes. Kazakhs simply randomly checked their luggage.
    On the Russian side, it has begun. They pulled everyone out of the bus at night with their luggage. They were held in line for a long time, some Kazakhs pointed out to the customs officers that they had children. In response to them, ours, as usual, were rude.
    We crossed the border. Civilization is over. Wooden toilets, skewed fences, complete ruin. We still laughed, "Well, you need toilets in the Kazakh steppe, but here there is a forest - there is a toilet under every bush."
    I am ashamed. For some reason, they were able to bring out the external gloss after the collapse of the USSR. And here along the way this gloss of bureaucrats exclusively in their London dachas is suggested.
    1. nurker
      nurker 30 December 2012 09: 31
      +2
      I can also give an example of a more or less better human relationship: one neighbor talked about a trip to relatives in Russia and Latvia.

      It was not only to her that Muscovites reacted coldly to her, so in Latvia young people have never lost their place in public transport.

      Rather, it is an everyday example.
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 14: 30
      +3
      Magadan, thanks for your message. I am very glad that I liked it in Kazakhstan. I hope you will be in our republic more than once.
      On the internet I often met Russians' comments about Kazakhstan, usually everyone likes it. And horror stories about the oppression of Russians and medieval beast are usually told by those who have never been to KZ, but only from the words of a "refugee". Well, or a rather large part of the offended former Kazakhstanis who after 1991 were left out of business, especially the former nomenklatura, of whom the KZ was above the roof. And those who are still under the impression of the pre-election chants of all sorts of clowns in the mid-90s, when they came to power with the slogans "We will defend the humiliated Russian people in Kazakhstan and Latvia!" Although it’s time for them to wake up already.
  • Sanches
    Sanches 30 December 2012 14: 29
    +5
    Just compare the texts in the modern 42-letter alphabet, which even the search engine cannot always read correctly, and the new 30-letter alphabet:

    Khalyқtardyң arғy tagіn anyқtau үshіn ғalymdar әr tүrlі classification ларasaydy. Қазақстанда халықтарды тілдік ұқсатықтарына Baylanists classificationlau қabyldanғan. Ethnologist onday ұқsastyқtyң olardyң shyғu tegіnің ortsқtyғyn kөrsetetіnіn aytady. Sondyқtan tіldіk classification (linguisticқ) ethnicalқ that bolyp tablady.
    Classification 3 Satydan Trada. Alғashқy (temengі) satsys - zheke halyқtar. Ekinshi (Ortasha) Satyns til Boyinsha Zhayn Tuystas Khalytar Toradydy. Үшінші (жоғарғы) саты-әулет - тілдері Boyynsha tuystas halyқtar tobyn bіrіktіredі.

    Xalyqtardyn arğy tegin anyqtaw ushin ğalymdar ӓr turli klassifikaci'alar jasa'dy. Qazaqstanda xalyqtardy tildik üqsastyqtaryna ba'lanysty klassifikaci'alaw qabyldanğan. Etnologtar onda 'üqsastyqtyn olardyn shyğw teginin ortaqtyğyn körsetetinin a'tady. Sondyqtan tildik klassifikaci'a (lingvistikalyq) etnikalyq ta bolyp tabylady.
    Bül klassifikaci'a 3 satydan türady. Alğashqy (temengi) satysy - jeke xalyqtar. Ekinshi (ortasha) satyny til bo'ynsha jaqyn twystas xalyqtar toby qüra'dy. Ushinshi (joğarğy) saty-ӓulet - tilderi bo'ynsha twystas xalyqtar tobyn biriktiredi.

    The new record is even shorter. And most importantly - more convenient. Kazakhs of Russia and Ukraine will not understand Kazakhs so that so, we will get rid of unnecessary problems
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 15: 15
      +4
      Sanchez, IMHO, your answer on the Cyrillic-Latin alphabet is the best :)))) The message is the simplest and most intelligible.
      My respect ;)
      1. Sanches
        Sanches 30 December 2012 21: 52
        +4
        Thank you drinks Mutual respect

        By the way, this is how the Kazakh alphabet mysteriously looks in some forums:

        And so in ANSI encoding:
        Huh? ? B b c c d d? ? Y e Y Ё ё ж ж з и и Й к к к к к? ? L l M m N n? ? Oh oh ? P r R s S T t U y? ? ? ? F f x x? ? Ц Ц Ч Ч Ш Ш Щ Щ Ь Ы s I i

        For many reasons, I would like to see the Kazakh layout:
        [~ `] [! 1] [@ 2] [# 3] [$ 4] [% 5] [^ 6] [? 7] (& 7) [* 8] [(9] [) 0] [_-] [+ =] Backspase
        TAB QWERTYUIOP Ä ({[) Ğ (}]) ENTER
        CAPS ASDFGHJKL [:;] ["'] [/ \] (| \) ENTER
        SHIFT ZXCVBNM Ö (<,) Ü (>.) [,.] (? /) SHIFT
        In parentheses are the symbols for the same buttons in English. layout. Punctuation marks and numbers are freed up on the keyboard, while specific sounds are recorded in one letter.
        Compliance is as follows:
        A a - A a
        Ә ә - Ä ä
        B b - B b
        B in - V v
        G g - G g
        Ғ ғ - Ğ ğ
        D d - D d
        E e - E e
        Ё ё - 'O' o
        F - J
        Z z - Z z
        And and - I i
        Th y - '
        K k - K k
        Қ қ - Q q
        L l - L l
        M m - M m
        N n - N n
        Ң ң - N n
        O o - o o
        Ө ө - Ö ö
        P p - P p
        P p - R r
        C s - S s
        T t - T t
        Y y - W w
        Ү ү - U u
        Ұ ұ - Ü ü
        F f - f f
        X x - X x
        Һ һ - H h
        C c - C s
        H h - Ch
        W w - Sh
        Щ u - Sch
        B b - '
        Y s - Y y
        I i - I i
        B b - '
        E e - E e
        Yu yu - 'u' u
        I am - 'A' a

        But the most rational option was proposed by Nursultan Abishevich himself, unfortunately I can’t find him, only this example:
        aurugha karsy egu nauқany - aurugha qarsi egu nauqani.
        It is readable in any encoding and fully complies with the rules of the Kazakh language, while even the quite common letters Ä, Ğ, Ö and Ü from the previous version are not always digestible on the network and are distorted in ANSI encoding. Why some of our Russian friends have long-awaited reform of the Kazakh alphabet is outrageous - more than incomprehensible.
  • nurker
    nurker 30 December 2012 14: 39
    +6
    Based on the conclusions of the Russian forum users, I personally can acknowledge the gratefulness of the Great and Mighty Russian language. He really is Great: almost 200-250 million in the world speaks it. Thanks to this, this macro language has absorbed all the available world dictionaries. In Russian, you will find everyday life of the Türkic and Slavic, the academic nature of Latin and Greek, the military terminology of German, the art and colorfulness of Italian, French, and the superstitiousness of Chinese.
    In truth, the Mighty language, or as Olzhas Suleimenov said: "I thank the Russian language for keeping the language of my people - Turkic and even Kazakh"
    The great Abai said: "Ozge tildin barin beat, oz tilindi kadirle" translation: "Know all languages, but respect your native language"
    And for me, a person who speaks fluent Kazakh and Russian, this is generally a huge plus ("like on your Internet")
  • nurker
    nurker 30 December 2012 15: 03
    0
    Quote: Sanches
    The new record is even shorter. And most importantly - more convenient. Kazakhs of Russia and Ukraine will not understand Kazakhs so that so, we will get rid of unnecessary problems


    Sorry, you wrote that Ukrainian. It turns out you speak fluent Kazakh, Russian, Ukrainian?
  • antiaircrafter
    antiaircrafter 30 December 2012 17: 39
    +5
    I don’t care what letters the Kazakhs write to each other. I’ve never seen a Kazakh.
    1. Beck
      Beck 30 December 2012 18: 31
      +5
      Quote: antiaircrafter
      I don’t care what letters the Kazakhs write to each other. I’ve never seen a Kazakh.


      Congratulations. The most objective koment.
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 01: 27
      +3
      Anti-aircraft, how did you not see the Kazakhs? The author of the article writes about the surging wave of Kazakh migrant workers :))))))))))) Like, they opened the border for them, now they rushed uncontrollably to work in Russia :))))))))))) And then, you know, inflation with us, the latinization of the alphabet and other horrors of the Bai state :))))
      But seriously, the author either confuses the Kazakhs with the Uzbeks / Tajiks, or gives out the wishful thinking. In addition, the free movement of citizens of the CU within three countries does not mean that border control has disappeared at the border. There can be no uncontrolled migration. Anyone who crosses the border is checked by the border guards. Well, in general, Kazakhs go to Russia only if absolutely necessary, and then only to visit friends and relatives or on a business trip. Only an ethnic Slav who is going to move to Russia for permanent residence can go to work in Russia. Kazakhs in Russia have nothing to do. This is not a very friendly country in everyday communication, and it does not make any sense to work there for the Kazakh, when the level of salaries is at least not lower than in Russia and taxes are lower.
      If the Americans are convinced that in Russia, bears walk on the streets, then the Kazakhs usually believe that in Russia only skinheads roam the streets.
      I personally saw them in Moscow many times, but I had no conflicts with them. I have a typical Kazakh muzzle - a brazen cheekbone-Horde, and not intimidated like a Tajik or an Uzbek guest worker. Or I was lucky that they were well fed in those days, and therefore did not touch me :))))) But unpleasant prickly glances from under the brows I caught from ordinary people much more often than from shaven-headed goldfinches (they just turn away, "do not notice in emphasis "). And this is no longer gut, unfortunately. In the Urals and Siberia, such sidelong glances are rare.
      1. antiaircrafter
        antiaircrafter 31 December 2012 12: 31
        0
        Quote: Marek Rozny
        how did you not see the Kazakhs?

        Not a single Kazakh / Kyrgyz / Uzbek in his right mind reaches my village. The bears will eat lol
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 12: 37
          +1
          Alexander, it’s good that they warned)))) But if the Russians live there, then I think they will save them from the bear, and put the treat on the table for the guest, as it should be in Russian;) And if you are in Astana, I will show our village with pleasure: ) And I will treat Kazakh dishes from the heart)
          1. antiaircrafter
            antiaircrafter 1 January 2013 15: 20
            +2
            Quote: Marek Rozny
            and they will save them from the bear, and put the food on the table for the guest,

            Save, save. And in the bathhouse we’ll put and sleep we’ll put not on an empty stomach !!!
        2. Beck
          Beck 31 December 2012 14: 51
          +2
          Quote: antiaircrafter
          Not a single Kazakh / Kyrgyz / Uzbek in his right mind reaches my village. The bears will eat


          Please, do not overlook Russian hospitality. Transplant bears on the chain. And we will somehow come to visit you.

          We will drink, we will walk
          And death will come, we will die.
          And death will come, it will not find us at home
          We are holding a bottle, we will dance in a tavern.
          1. antiaircrafter
            antiaircrafter 1 January 2013 15: 19
            +1
            Quote: Beck
            Transplant bears on the chain.

            What's on the chain? They are sleeping in their dens myrono while.
  • Marek Rozny
    Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 18: 03
    +2
    On the whole, the article is stupid. Fictions, search for "secret meaning" and distortion. I especially liked the hint that the CU allegedly saved Kazakhstan from inflation :))))) Facepalm is such a facepalm ... I can also write an article where I will say that the CU has influenced the low grain harvest this year, as well as the premature the potency of a pensioner neighbor ...
    By the way, if someone did not notice, the article was originally called, judging by the address http://topwar.ru/22614-protivorechivyy-nazarbaev-ili-kto-sachkuet-v-upryazhke-ts
    .html, "The contradictory Nazarbayev or Who sits in the vehicle sled". That is, the meaning of the article is to accuse Kazakhstan of allegedly doing nothing. Like, again, these Kazakhs sat on our necks, again they will ask for handouts from the Russian people ... Mlyayaya, author, you beloved breadwinner, come to Kazakhstan, I will feed you myself. And then, damn it, I found a net ...
  • nurker
    nurker 30 December 2012 19: 30
    +1
    2 weeks ago I saw one Tatar about 55 years old at Saparzhay. He back in Soviet times worked as a trucker between Belarus, Ukraine, Russia and Kazakhstan, so he told me that he was going to Kazakhstan to buy vodka and local products, the best vodka in Kazakhstan.
    In Almaty, even foreigners, without fail, and even they have become a tradition to buy cognac "Kazakhstan", a direct brand, even for the British, not like neighbors.
  • Shade
    Shade 30 December 2012 19: 42
    -7
    ........... Kazakhstan is a poor country, officially the average salary is 21000 rubles, in fact 5000-6000, the fat majors that move about 900 Baku and relatives of ministers and politicians do not count, they live at the expense of ordinary citizens, and the situation is very deplorable in the country, even on construction sites, basically no more than 20000 rubles, and there are no construction sites, forecasts and results on GDP are crap, and it reflects the situation in the pockets of officials, the only place where you can earn something else is Alma-Ata but it’s not rubber and the crisis and it cripples

    although Nazarbayev is a very competent politician, he is truly respected, but corruption does its job and this affects the conditions and standard of living much lower than in neighboring countries (Russia, Belorussia, Ukraine)
    1. Vasilenko Vladimir
      Vasilenko Vladimir 30 December 2012 19: 43
      -4
      oh what will happen now !!!!!
    2. marshes
      marshes 30 December 2012 20: 04
      +1
      Quote: Shade
      fat majors that move about 900


      Especially those.
    3. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 21: 03
      +4
      1) Shade, find on the internet any site of a recruiting agency and see the proposed salaries.
      If you want to know the salaries of public sector employees, you can look at the current job advertisements on the website of the Agency for Civil Service Affairs. I once showed the salaries of doctors to Vladimir Vasilenko after he also wrote about "poor doctors with a salary of $ 200".
      2) As for construction projects - just the whole country is in construction sites. Both in both capitals and in the regions. We have another problem - poor-quality construction, especially social housing. This is yes - the smut in power and society. And the volume of construction is decent. Even post-crisis.
      "over the years of independence, 82,8 million sq. m. (including 11 months of 2012) of housing were commissioned in the republic, including more than 40,5 million sq. m. - by individual developers, 801,3 thousand apartments were built. In 2011 6,5 million square meters of housing were put into operation, which is 1991% more than in 6,5 ".
      And these are figures only for the construction of apartments. It should also be noted that many other objects are being built in KZ. I don’t understand where you saw the absence of construction projects in Kazakhstan. The pace has slowed down, about 5 years ago, in general, construction-mania was, now it is calmer, but social construction has increased. Type in the search engine "construction in Kazakhstan" - you will find a bunch of materials on this topic. And thousands of job advertisements for builders of all stripes.
      Well, yes, there is corruption. In all areas. But about the standard of living, I absolutely disagree. The other day, with a friend from Kiev, we discussed the topic of labor migration from Ukraine to Kazakhstan. Now from there a lot of people go to the KZ to work. In Belarus, salaries are also significantly lower. But there is at least order in the country, so people do not flee from there. But the Russian neighboring regions constantly and willingly go to work in the KZ. In most specialties - our real salaries are higher than theirs. For some specialties, they have higher salaries than ours. Personally, my acquaintances Russians in Astana work both as bartenders in eateries and as large consultants in large organizations. Tomorrow I celebrate the New Year with one of them (in a small company). And with him there are still a dozen Muscovites who are well settled here and really want to remain by hook or by crook. Here a good specialist will always find a good salary, the demand is large, there are few competitors. The streets are clean and safe, in society - no hint of conflict. Living is quite comfortable (especially, of course, in large cities). In small cities, it’s harder to work. What specifics do we have? Many cities were built around the field. The field has dried up or its products have become unnecessary in such volumes - and the city begins to die. Such towns and cities are a problem, and from there people leave for other regions of the country where there is work. But to imagine that the whole KZ is sitting on poor salaries, or even without work at all, is stupid. A few years ago, the Ministry of Economy generally stated that we had 1,5 million shortage of workers - builders, doctors, police, teachers, managers of various levels. And this despite the fact that we have more migrant workers per capita than in Russia.
      And if you compare the salaries of the military, until recently, our lieutenant after school received as a Russian major. Only recently have your salaries raised more or less. In general, salaries in the KZ are inferior to the Moscow-St. Petersburg figures, but higher than in the rest of Russia. Moreover, goods - from bread to cars are cheaper (but a communal apartment is more expensive).
      And here are the articles about the Ukrainian "labor wave" in Kazakhstan:
      1) http://portmone.name/portmone/2011/nomer-ot-01.03.11/za-dlinnym-rublem-v-kazahst
      an.html
      2) http://news.nur.kz/213879.html
      You can find more on the internet if you want to search.
  • Ermek
    Ermek 30 December 2012 20: 57
    +4
    Good evening everyone
    As recently as a couple of days ago, poor-poor Kazakhs were humiliated by giving us the alphabet. After such words, anyone will wave his hand and say - well, them, let's move at least to the mbwongo-mbwongo writing, if only different obscurantists would not blather. But having cooled down they decided to return to the Latin alphabet, see the scan of the newspaper "Socialist Kazakhstan", so again they did not please the obscurantists. So what should we burst like that monkey? Or is it a sign of love for us?
    movie "Office Romance"
    - None of the employees would you allow yourself to throw a bouquet in your face. Are you not indifferent to me?
    - One more word, and I will launch a decanter in you!
    “If you make a decanter, then you really are me ... this-that ...”

    Indeed, almost all of Central Asia switched to the Latin alphabet, Azerbaijan switched - and nothing. And then ... I was already at a loss.
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 21: 21
      +4
      Flag of the Kazakh SSR until 1940.
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 21: 32
        0
        German propaganda leaflet in the Kazakh language :) I mean, they say, Kazaktar, drop weapons and Bolshevik power, go to German captivity :) I did not see the Cyrillic leaflet in Kazakh. I also have scans of leaflets in Tatar and Uzbek - also Latin. And there is still on Arabica.

        German flyer. Above - in German, in the middle - in Kazakh Latin, below - in Russian.
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 30 December 2012 21: 34
          +1
          German leaflet in Kazakh Latin
  • tommy1984
    tommy1984 30 December 2012 21: 50
    +1
    He performed normally. Trying to balance. I think it’s doing it right.
    1. nurker
      nurker 31 December 2012 03: 21
      +1
      beautiful answer, plus.
  • Setrac
    Setrac 30 December 2012 22: 37
    +4
    U-bye-bye, they were afraid of Pan-Turkism, it’s enough to consider Turkey as an enemy, it’s not Kazakhs who should be blamed (it’s their business to call themselves Kazakhs, Kazakhs, or like Cossacks in the old days), we must strive to Turkey be an ally of Russia, to draw them into the CU. Moreover, Turkey will not be accepted into the EU and will not be accepted, but they will promise.
    1. antiaircrafter
      antiaircrafter 31 December 2012 12: 38
      +3
      Quote: Setrac
      pull them into the vehicle.

      Toka let out of NATO first.
      1. Marek Rozny
        Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 12: 59
        +2
        I, too, am not opposed to pulling the Turks to our side, but they really need to get out of NATO for this. I agree. In general, the Turks really disappointed in Europe. They will never be part of the EU. The latest Turkish articles on this subject are written quite frankly. But pragmatic Turks are increasingly looking at Russia and the CIS countries with which economic relations are growing. Indeed, it is possible to play on their pan-Turkism (although what kind of Turks they are - they are actually purely Greek-Byzantine Greeks, but this can also be used wisely). Yes, Russia waged several wars with Turkey, but it was not the Turks who wanted it, but Russia itself expanded and wanted to subjugate those zones that were traditionally in the Turkish zone of influence. Yes, and the British skillfully pushed the Ottomans with the Russians, this is not a secret.
        I like that the Turks in the political sense are distinguished by their firmness and integrity. They never threw anyone. And while never humiliated in front of others. They have historically been in good relations with Germany, but have always clearly stated their position regarding the war with Russia / USSR. Moreover, they really unselfishly helped Turkic Soviet prisoners of war. Like every nation, they have their minuses and pluses, but as a state, the Turks deserve respect. If the Kazakhs will process them in terms of Pan-Turkism, and the Russians - crushing on their ties from the Byzantine times and the current economy, then there is a good chance of getting Turkey into its orbit.
        I am sure that if NATO starts a war against the CSTO, the Turks will not fight against us. They do not succumb to the verbiage of the Americans, and besides, the Turks are brought up on the fact that Kazakhs, Tatars, Yakuts, Kyrgyz are brothers. Their heads will explode even from the assumption that at least theoretically it is possible to fight against relatives. This is similar to the Kazakh belief: "Kazakhs do not fight Kazakhs." We must use this. For the benefit of the CU, the CSTO, the Eurasian Union. Although I understand that in Russia the Turks have never been considered "friends" due to national-cultural, political and propaganda reasons. But society must be changed. Our ancestors also did not immediately start drinking vodka together. They fought in blood from time immemorial, and then got used to each other - they sat in the same trenches and shared one piece of bread.
  • arseke
    arseke 31 December 2012 03: 54
    +6
    I just can’t understand where so much bile from our brothers comes from. What offended you the Kazakh people? Why does our development cause you such a butchert?

    In my humble opinion, the author of the article is not objective and many facts and conjectures are sucked from the finger.
    There is no need to look for a trace of pan-Turkism here. It is simply our leader, 01 gives direction for the country, for its development. And I believe that he is right as always.

    I may be young to make such high-profile statements, but I think living in KZ is good. The standard of living here is good and there are all conditions for self-realization and development of people. Now, if you take me as an example, I’m 19 years old, we have 5 people in my family (mother, three sisters and me). Mother is a pensioner, father is no longer with us. But at the same time, we live normally, 2 apartments, each member of the family has his own PC, phones and more. I know 4 languages, study at an excellent university and lead an active and completely normal life. At the same time, in my life I did not pay a dime for my education. I work and earn very decent money for a student + scholarship, somewhere around $ 100. What is not a normal life? In the country, normal social. the situation, life goes on, and even I can observe serious positive changes in the life of Kazakhstan people, although young.
  • Smoke
    Smoke 31 December 2012 04: 32
    -5
    Well, they accused me of chauvinism and dragged Chinggis Khan, although what relation does he have to the Kazakhs? ... Your political elite should have thought about chauvinism in 90-99, when the constitution was adopted, when the Russians were driven out. Why the Russians, in fact, quietly glanded into the KZ in the second grade, and the Russians who live there (still live) understand this. Why second grade? Because it is NEVER Kazakh who can become president. And why? Yes, because you see it is necessary to know the language perfectly, and how to define this "perfection" nobody knows exactly. Although the Russian people, I believe, have earned the full right to initially be a full-fledged people in their country, and the Russian language has every right to be the state language in the country that the Russians actually built. After all, Kazakhs at the time of 1992 were a minority ... And children who were born in the late 80s and early 90s only enter full-fledged labor activity .... You nip the Russians there))) Really naive ... but every cunning ...
    1. nurker
      nurker 31 December 2012 04: 55
      +2
      Dear, are you really confusing Kazakhstan with another country? or still I live in another country. I’ll go and check my passport and clarify.
      I do not want to protect the interests of the political elite of the Republic of Kazakhstan, but as far as I observed, there was no pasture or oppression of the Russians. I remember once that the evil president said that people who knew the Kazakh language of any nationality would be given priority jobs if only you knew the Kazakh of the most ordinary Kazakh, and unfortunately, the Kazakhs in the Republic of Kazakhstan do not know Kazakh well, sometimes worse than Russians. This is the stimulation of other peoples and Kazakhs to study, if you look deeper, then this oppression is not only Russian, but the Kazakhs themselves, for their sins. And the Russians interpret this in their own way. Do Russians have a broken jaw if they learn Kazakh better than Kazakhs? If that were the case, then they would really prove that they are the best people in the world, I would call myself Russian. And in general, where is the standard or device that determines that a particular language is better? The fact that the Russians do not want to learn Kazakh is their fault. But there are those Russians who know Kazakh and literature and speak on Kazakh television, are Good morning in Kazakh. And in general, we even have advertising first in Russian and then in Kazakh, news too.
      1. Smoke
        Smoke 2 January 2013 21: 25
        0
        nurker tell me by what parameters the quality of the Kazakh language proficiency will be assessed? Can you imagine it yourself? And yes, I do not understand and will not accept the status of the Russian language as a "language of interethnic communication" - this is just a deception and nothing more, IMHO. Why shouldn't the Russian language be given a state status, especially since the Russians living in Kazakhstan have fully deserved this by long and hard work.
    2. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 10: 47
      +1
      bang! The great urination teacher is back! Che, the bubble is full, will you again entertain the Kazakhs, showing new ways of defecation? Can you write in a trickle on the snow: "I will never talk nonsense about the Dzungars again"? So ... Just wondering.
      1. Vasilenko Vladimir
        Vasilenko Vladimir 31 December 2012 12: 17
        0
        maybe you will moderate rudeness ?!
        and then somehow any example that calls into question your ideas immediately for some reason becomes stupid not right or some other
        1. Marek Rozny
          Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 12: 24
          +4
          Rudeness? This smok himself boasts that he taught the Kazakhs to piss correctly. Maybe you recommend him to monitor the language? What a hello - such an answer.
  • Zhenya
    Zhenya 31 December 2012 08: 37
    +3
    Guys, why are you surprised ?? (I'm talking about Kazakhs)
    Now in Russia, the prohibitive number of very aggressive people to socialist republics and not Kazakhstan is to blame, here the rulers of our state are to blame for the bulk, who let crowds of Kyrgyz, Tajiks, Uzbeks, Azerbaijanis, etc. into the country and it is not surprising that here falls under the hot hand of the Kazakhs. Just here are the realities (
    And so, according to the statements, I can only say one thing, I am Russian and Orthodox, that is, I no longer accept people who have Islam, because no offense to the cries of Alah Akbar, they cut the heads of our guys (Russian guys) in Chechmund, it’s clear that this is all was specially made, but the sediment will not go anywhere, anyway! And Kazakhstan, if I’m not mistaken, is the Muslims, so what kind of brothers are they, as some say here? Forgive the guys, but for me, the brothers are Slavs, Serbs, Ukrainians, Belarusians, even Poles, although they have had problems with them for the last 20 years, these are real brothers. You are not dependent, do not pay attention to the fools from Russia who teach you, you can’t be taught anything already, you are a different people, a different country and a different religion, we hardly have anything in common.
    With respect, Eugene.
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 10: 38
      +4
      Eugene, we also have crowds of Kyrgyz, Uzbeks and others. But! They behave within. Neither the society nor the law enforcement agencies have any particular complaints. Why do you think so?
      Second, what does religion have to do with it? Both of my grandfathers were shot at by the Germans during the war, even on their belt buckle it was written: "Gott mit uns". Should I hate Christians now? Western Christians killed Russians dozens (if not hundreds) times more than Muslims. And you only hate Muslims. Don't you think you've been misdirected?
      And what about the Tatars, Bashkirs and other Muslims of Russia? Will we separate them or "re-educate" them?
    2. arseke
      arseke 31 December 2012 12: 14
      +2
      Hmmm, dear, do not forget that Kazakhstan is a secular state. Yes, the majority of the population professes Islam, these are Sunnis. There are a lot of different religions in the country and I have never seen anyone oppressed because of his beliefs. Our Orthodox churches stand next to mosques and castels. I have a bunch of friends and even relatives of Christians and nothing, everything in the world but consent.
    3. nurker
      nurker 31 December 2012 13: 28
      +1
      Quote: Marrying
      Forgive the guys, but for me, the brothers are Slavs, Serbs, Ukrainians, Belarusians, even Poles, although they have had problems with them for the last 20 years, these are real brothers. You are not dependent, do not pay attention to the fools from Russia who teach you, you can’t be taught anything already, you are a different people, a different country and a different religion, we hardly have anything in common.


      And you call all the brothers Slavs killers brothers brothers? Remember the invasion of the Poles and the attempt to Catholicize. You divide people on a religious basis, but there is one fact that the Kazakhs were tolerant of all religions, for speaking, all religions come from one religion - Faith in one God, and God manifests itself in everything - Tengriism. But there is no sense in praising these religions, for their time they were competently used by craftsmen, let’s not talk about it. You Russians would first have found your faith, otherwise there are already such citizens of the Russian Federation, some complain that Vladimir Solnyshko the grebe forced all Russians to accept Christianity, others complain that the Communists forced them to abandon their faith in God, and made a godless religion. Get out of medieval worldview.
    4. Beck
      Beck 1 January 2013 15: 02
      +2
      Quote: Marrying
      Guys, why are you surprised ?? (I'm talking about Kazakhs)


      I would like for you, Zhenya, for reference, to give some clarification of mine. In Central Asia, it is the Kazakhs who are least Islamized. And this is all from the past, the nomadic image of life. Always in a nomad, in the steppe. If in half a year, or even a year, a nomad got into his city, in the south, where settled Kazakhs lived, then this year, he once a year saw a mosque. And once I heard the prayer of the mullah. After all, you won’t take a mosque with you. And the mullah will not roam the steppe for a year, not by status. Hence, religiosity has always been many times less than, for example, among Uzbeks.
  • Gecko
    Gecko 31 December 2012 10: 58
    0
    The history books of Azerbaijan, Georgia, KAZAKHSTAN, Kyrgyzstan, Moldova, and Uzbekistan evaluate the status of their territories within the Russian Empire as "colonial" and, accordingly, qualify Russians as "colonialists."

    So, in the Kazakh history textbook it is written: "The struggle of the Kazakh people against Russian colonialism lasted a long time, covering the second half of the 90th century until the XNUMXs of the XNUMXth century. The following is a dozen examples of the struggle of the Kazakh people for independence - uprisings, unrest, national liberation movements, performances, etc.

    Details: http://www.regnum.ru/news/polit/1610250.html#ixzz2GbtsnNJb
    1. Marek Rozny
      Marek Rozny 31 December 2012 11: 08
      +2
      Gecko, you will not believe, but in Soviet times the tsarist advance to Turkestan was also called "colonial" and "conquering". A sample of a typical paragraph in Soviet times:
      "Andijan Uprising 1898 was a consequence of the colonialist policies of tsarism in Wed. Asia, which caused in the 80-90s. a wave of spontaneous popular performances in the Ferghana region. The discontent of the masses was used by the feudal nobility and the Muslim clergy of the former Kokand Khanate (See Kokand Uprising 1873-1876). At the head of A. century. Madali-ishan stood, who settled in the village of Ming-Tyube (near Andijan). In fomenting the religious fanaticism of the masses, he drew to his side part of the working population. Madali Ishan established a connection with the Turkish Sultan. Leaders A. century. they planned to raise an uprising in Andijan, Osh, Margelan under the slogan of ghazavat (a holy war against the "infidels"), capture Namangan, restore the Kokand khanate, spread the uprising throughout Asia, introduce the old, feudal orders. On May 17, participants in the uprising gathered in Ming-Tyube and its environs and marched to Andijan.
      The rebels, the bulk of whom were farmers and cattle breeders, day laborers, mardikers, armed mainly with melee weapons, numbered up to 2 thousand people. On May 18, at dawn, they suddenly attacked the barracks of two companies of the 20th Turkestan line personnel battalion, located on the outskirts of Andijan. The soldiers, having suffered minor losses, scattered the disorganized crowd with fire. The movement was quickly and violently suppressed. 383 people were convicted by the tsarist authorities, 18 of them (including Madali-ishan) were hanged, the rest were sent to hard labor and settlement. A. in. was defeated not only due to poor preparation, but also due to the fact that, despite the anti-colonial sentiments of the bulk of its participants, the leadership of the uprising was in the hands of the feudal lords and clergy, who sought to restore their privileges with the help of the popular movement. Nevertheless, A. in. objectively contributed to the further growth of the national liberation struggle of the peoples of Turkestan. "

      Lit .: History of the Uzbek SSR, vol. 2, Tashkent, 1968. H.T. Tursunov.
  • marshes
    marshes 31 December 2012 12: 20
    +4

    Happy New Year! smile