Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?

143
Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?

Information that Israel removes from storage more than 200 tanks Merkava Mk.2 and Mk.3, which "will be sold to two foreign countries, including one European country," is already worrying the minds in full.

The question is not who needs tanks today, everything is clear here that there are only two countries that need tanks. These are Ukraine and Russia. The question is who will eventually get the tanks, because to whom they will be sold initially is not a very interesting question, although from which side to look.



So let's start with the tanks.



These are cars of not very advanced age, but 40+. The age is actually not very large, today tanks that are almost twice as old take part in the SVO, so there is a question of safety.

The Israel Defense Forces at one time removed these tanks from service and carefully (or maybe not very much) kept them in their warehouses. Since a fire is burning in the world today, in which tanks are burning in the literal sense and in decent quantities, the increased demand for this type of military equipment in the world is quite obvious.

There will be a nuance here, about which a little lower, where questions of tank rotations around the world will be raised.

If there is a demand, then according to all the laws of the capitalist world, it simply must be satisfied, because profit is everything capitalist.

Today, the political situation around Israel is quite calm, half of the former opponents are almost friends with Jerusalem (indeed, an unequivocal success of Israeli diplomacy), the second is busy with cabals in Syria, Yemen and other no less hot places.

That is, everyone in the region is busy with business in a military sense, and therefore it is quite obvious that there is an opportunity to turn the money around well: sell old tanks and build new ones instead! Quite obvious and decent gesheft!

That is why the relevant commissions in Israel walked through the warehouses and carefully studied what was there. And even, they say, they tested selectively taken samples. The samples were tested normally, and as a result, it was concluded that the equipment is suitable for sale to anyone.

“Anyone” - two countries are declared, one seems to be in Europe, the second is somewhere else. The contracts seem to be on the verge of final signing, but naturally, in Israel they do not apply to the topic of who buys tanks.

As for the European component, two countries are targeted: Croatia and Cyprus. And here it is interesting.

Croatia


This is a very interesting position. On the one hand, the country has its own hotbed of tension at hand, and tanks in the armed forces look quite appropriate.

But here you really need to look at what kind of tanks they are. And these are our T-72s, which were turned into M84s of various modifications by the hands of specialists from the defense enterprise "Djuro Djakovic" from the city of Slavonski Brod.


And the M84 is quite a serious and, most importantly, a modern car. The engine and chassis are from the T-72, but the combat filling has been redesigned. Shooting is controlled using the Omega-84 system, made on the basis of the fire control system of the Slovenian company Fotona. The SKS-84 stabilized sighting device, wind, direction, tilt sensors, a digital ballistic computer and a laser rangefinder make it possible to fire on the move.

But in modern conditions, there are obvious problems with the T-72. It is almost impossible to buy spare parts, they are under sanctions, and cannibalism is such a thing ... So replacing old T-72s with old ones, but with a lower “mileage” of the Merkava, looks quite logical here.

Especially if the specialists from Dzhuro Dzhankovic can retrain from the T-72 to the Merkava, and why shouldn’t they be able to, then the option of selling the M84A4 to one of the countries that is in desperate need of tanks is a completely reasonable option. Moreover, the stocks of M84 in Croatia are about a hundred pieces.

Why not gesheft?

Cyprus


There, if anyone has forgotten, the island is generally divided into two parts, the smaller one, which the Turks captured, is not recognized by anyone except Turkey itself, and the Greeks live in the larger one. No less interesting, what is the National Guard of the Republic of Cyprus armed with in terms of tanks?


Bingo! There we have T-80U and T-80UK in the amount of more than 80 units! In general, the Republic of Cyprus used to cooperate very closely with the USSR in terms of weapons, somehow it didn’t work out with Russia, and France is gradually ousting us from all positions.

Considering that since 2004 Cyprus has been part of the European Union, and since 2008 the currency was changed to the euro, the plans of certain political parties in Cyprus to join NATO do not look so strange. From here, a completely normal move could be to get rid of Russian weapons in general, with the subsequent sale of them to those in need.

In general, the principle “who benefits?” observed.

So the Merkava Mk.2 tanks produced in the 80s of the last century and Mk.3, originally from the 90s, it is quite possible that they will find new operators. And for the first time in all history Israel, it will be the Europeans.

Of course, as is customary there, the Israeli Ministry of Defense does not specify the names of the countries where the tanks will go. We will find out about this pretty soon, we are talking about two or three months, which are needed mainly in order to agree on paper issues and prepare tanks.

The main thing in these transactions is that they agree to the sale to the United States, since, alas, the engines in the Merkavs are American and the approval of the US Department of Defense is required for the sale of tanks.

Why is it worth fighting?



Here, of course, the Israelis are silent, and the media give a very approximate amount of "several tens of millions of dollars." But "several tens" is both two and nine. In fact, the price on the world market for an old tank ranges from 200 to 400 thousand US dollars apiece. So yes, in this case, the amount of the transaction will fluctuate in the region of several tens of millions of dollars. Which, in turn, will allow the Israeli Ministry of Defense to use the proceeds to place an order for new Merkava Mk.4s, which have active protection systems against anti-tank missiles and network control and information exchange systems.

True, the Mk.4 is worth a level more expensive, but this is a new tank with all the consequences. 20-30 tanks at the expense of junk is decent. Considering that at all times the Israeli approach was quality, not quantity (unlike the enemies from the League), then everything is more than normal.

Can Merkavas get to Ukraine?



Doubtful. It is clear that the countries that will get the Merkavas and the United States will decide this, but the situation itself suggests that the T-72 / M84 and T-80 will look much better in the ranks of the Armed Forces of Ukraine than Israeli tanks.

Our "experts" have already rushed to bury the "Merkava" if they get to Ukraine. Well, there is a certain logic in this.

There is absolutely no desire to disassemble step by step how many horsepower per ton the Merkava has in comparison with the Leopard and Abrams, what is the specific load on the ground, for this there are enough experts on the sofas without me.

We have a political and economic review that does not affect the technical side, with the exception of one point: the Armed Forces of Ukraine do not have specialists in the maintenance and repair of Israeli tanks. The machines are quite unique, and therefore you need to learn how to handle them. And it will take a little more time than it takes to draw up contracts.

Therefore, the option of supplying and reselling Merkav to Ukraine does not look reasonable. This is a very worthy tank, among the best in the world, but the tank, as it were, is regional. Not fit to fight anywhere. In this regard, Croatia with its highlands looks much more preferable for exploitation than Ukraine with its black soil.

The Israelis are great, they created a simply magnificent tank, but they did not create it in order to trade around the world, but for their own use. Therefore, in some regions of the world, the Merkava will not feel as comfortable as the same T-72s or Abrams. Payment for a total advantage in its territory.

The actions of the Israeli military department are clear and understandable. Because of the events in Ukraine, a rearmament race has really begun in the world. Countries that had Soviet equipment began to actively dump it to Ukraine, in return concluding contracts for the supply of more modern equipment from the West. The fact that Israel decided to get involved in this process only means that it's nothing, just business.

Israel generally calmly trades in arms, the volumes are decent, the country regularly enters the top 10 world traders. In 2022, the volume of contracts concluded amounted to $12,5 billion, so the desire to take a bite out of the global pie is quite obvious.

And by the way, the Merkava is not the only thing you can profit from in the warehouses of the Israeli Ministry of Defense. There are hundreds of M113 armored personnel carriers, which are not of much interest to potential buyers due to the complete exposure to anti-tank fire. In their place, the Israeli brigades were supplied with newer models of armored personnel carriers, but the M113 may be of interest to the same representatives of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, who have recruited about 400 units around the world.

This, of course, will also require a separate permit from the Pentagon, but something tells us that there will be no problems with this. Although Israel could not sell its decommissioned F-16s to the same Croatia precisely because of the US ban.

In general, the Merkava deal is quite calm, but the possibility of Israeli tanks hitting Ukraine is rather small. Most likely, instead of them, the Armed Forces of Ukraine will receive the same T-72 and T-80.
143 comments
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  1. +14
    18 June 2023 02: 56
    The Greeks in Cyprus will buy the Merkava, and from Cyprus the T-80U tanks will be handed over to the Khinzir. In the 2000s, all Cypriot tanks were modernized with the installation of the Plisa thermal imaging sight. In the spring, the Greeks agreed to send T-80U tanks to Ukraine, but only in exchange for German "Leopard-2" tanks, in order to maintain the volume of their arsenal against the backdrop of aggravated relations with Turkey. As a result, they found an alternative replacement in the form of "Merkav".
    1. -9
      18 June 2023 03: 50
      The Greeks looked at the leopards and said - well, maybe Merkavs are better? It’s not that it’s a superweapon, but it’s just that leopards seem to do nothing but absorb ATs, mines and shells
      1. +2
        18 June 2023 05: 05
        Quote from alexoff
        The Greeks looked at the leopards and said - well, maybe Merkavs are better?

        No, not better. But not everyone will get the "Leopards", so let's take what they give ... Although the "Merkava" is worse for their theater of operations.
        1. +18
          18 June 2023 06: 34
          Quote: svp67
          Quote from alexoff
          The Greeks looked at the leopards and said - well, maybe Merkavs are better?

          No, not better. But not everyone will get the "Leopards", so let's take what they give ... Although the "Merkava" is worse for their theater of operations.

          Mk-3 for Cyprus is definitely no worse than Leo-2.
          1. +1
            18 June 2023 07: 07
            Quote: Aron Zaavi
            Mk-3 for Cyprus is definitely no worse than Leo-2.

            Well let's see ...
            The Leopard2A6, which the Greeks were counting on, has an engine with a capacity of 1500 hp, which gives 23 hp per ton of weight.
            The Merkava Mk3 has a 1200-horsepower AVDS-1790-9AR V-12, which provides a specific power of 18,5 hp / t;
            Can you give an explanation about the gun? Believe "Merkava Mk3" and here it loses
            1. +11
              18 June 2023 07: 25
              Quote: svp67
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              Mk-3 for Cyprus is definitely no worse than Leo-2.

              Well let's see ...
              The Leopard2A6, which the Greeks were counting on, has an engine with a capacity of 1500 hp, which gives 23 hp per ton of weight.
              The Merkava Mk3 has a 1200-horsepower AVDS-1790-9AR V-12, which provides a specific power of 18,5 hp / t;
              Can you give an explanation about the gun? Believe "Merkava Mk3" and here it loses

              For the mountains of Cyprus, Mk spring suspension is better than torsion bars. The gun is 120/44 here and there.
              1. +2
                18 June 2023 08: 41
                The Leo-2A6 has a 120/55 gun (11 calibers longer).
              2. +3
                18 June 2023 09: 52
                Quote: Aron Zaavi
                For the mountains of Cyprus, Mk spring suspension is better than torsion bars.

                This is what needs clarification. Why are torsion bars worse than springs except for maintainability?

                And for the first time in the history of Israel, it will be Europeans.
                According to the original tanks, for the first time in the history of Israel, someone other than Israel is so.
                1. +2
                  18 June 2023 10: 09
                  Quote: Vladimir_2U
                  This is what needs clarification. Why are torsion bars worse than springs except for maintainability?

                  The Jews drove spring centurions and torsion bars Americans and Sovietoids. Verdict - spring suspension in the mountains is definitely better. More reliable, energy-intensive, long-stroke. Therefore, cents were used in the north, in the mountains.

                  In the early 90s, when geopolitical circumstances changed, the Jews considered the option of not messing with the Merkavs anymore, but accepting the Abrams as a gift. Tested and rejected. One of the voiced reasons is that the torsion bar suspension is not suitable.
                  1. 0
                    18 June 2023 16: 40
                    Quote: Negro
                    Verdict - spring suspension in the mountains is definitely better. More reliable, energy-intensive, long-stroke.

                    Nonsense, except maybe reliability.

                    Quote: Negro
                    Therefore, cents were used in the north, in the mountains.
                    MAGAH-3 (M48A3, upgraded in Israel to the level of M48A5), MAGAH-5 (M48A5) and MAGAH-6A (M60A1), were still used against Syria, so this is not an argument at all.

                    Quote: Negro
                    One of the voiced reasons is that the torsion bar suspension is not suitable.
                    Just so as not to offend the main sponsor with the words: "tank is shit."

                    Quote: Negro
                    Americans and Soviets
                    What a trembling attitude towards the owners ...
                    1. -1
                      18 June 2023 18: 45
                      Quote: Vladimir_2U
                      Nonsense, except maybe reliability.

                      You have your opinion, the Jews have theirs. That's why they decided to bother with Christie's suspension instead of torsion bars, apparently from nothing to do.
                      1. +1
                        19 June 2023 03: 52
                        Quote: Negro
                        That's why they decided to bother with Christie's suspension instead of torsion bars, apparently from nothing to do.

                        Which Christy? Is Brzezinski's mother-in-law Christy? Christie - candle suspension with the location of the springs inside the body. To the Merkavian suspension, the attitude is slightly greater than to the torsion bars.
                        Quote: Negro
                        You have your opinion, the Jews have theirs.
                        This is not an answer to this question:
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        Why are torsion bars worse than springs except for maintainability?



                        The Jews focused on maintainability after a mine explosion, that's all.
                        And even the good dynamic movement of the Merkava specifically is not the merit of the spring as such, but the size of the rink and the height of the hull.
                      2. -1
                        19 June 2023 05: 44
                        Quote: Vladimir_2U
                        This is not an answer to this question:

                        You mistakenly think that I am trying to convince you of something.

                        I am no more than conveying to you the position of the Jews on this matter. Whether the Jews are right or not, I don't care. I believe that torsion bars have not become the standard for tank suspension for nothing, but at the same time I believe that the Jews chose a different solution for a reason.
                      3. -1
                        19 June 2023 06: 44
                        It's strange that the plus sign does not reflect from me ...
              3. +1
                18 June 2023 10: 46
                Quote: Aron Zaavi
                For the mountains of Cyprus, Mk spring suspension is better than torsion bars
                This is an unproven assertion.
                Quote: Aron Zaavi
                Cannon both here and there 120/44

                No, the "Leo2A6" has a "new" gun not in 44, but in 55 calibers. 120 mm Rheinmetall L/55 gun. And there is a new BOPS DM53, especially for this gun. Look at the difference in its characteristics when shooting:
                - Barrel L 44: Energy - about 11,6 MJ, Initial speed - 1670 m / s,
                - Barrel L 55: Energy - about 12,7 MJ Initial speed - 1750 m / s
                1. -1
                  18 June 2023 16: 19
                  Quote: svp67
                  And there is a new BOPS DM53, especially for this gun

                  You apparently made a typo, DM55 was created for L63, DM53 BOPS for L44.
                  1. +1
                    18 June 2023 17: 41
                    The DM53 projectile (like all other 120 mm tank shells) can be fired from both L44 and L55. DM63 (2005) is not very different from DM53 (1999). By the way, DM73 is already on the way (although they left the penetrator there from DM63, they are conjuring, as I understand it, over a propellant charge).
                  2. +1
                    18 June 2023 20: 29
                    Quote: karabas-barabas
                    You apparently made a typo, DM55 was created for L63, DM53 BOPS for L44

                    No, the DM53 was created specifically for the 55 caliber gun, but with the possibility of using it on the 44th. I gave the characteristics
                    1. 0
                      18 June 2023 21: 03
                      To summarize the dates, the L55 began to be developed in 1991, and the Leo-2A6 was put into service in 2001. The DM53 projectile entered service in 1999, that is, it was created for the L55, but initially it entered the L44. And in 63, DM2005 was already immediately delivered to the second-hand L55. But in general, the argument does not make sense, since all these ammunition are for 120x570 NATO, they are interchangeable, you can shoot any shells from any gun, and even from the South Korean CN08 (also 55klb) French OFL120G1.
                2. +5
                  18 June 2023 18: 13
                  Quote: svp67
                  Quote: Aron Zaavi
                  For the mountains of Cyprus, Mk spring suspension is better than torsion bars
                  This is an unproven assertion.
                  Quote: Aron Zaavi
                  Cannon both here and there 120/44

                  No, the "Leo2A6" has a "new" gun not in 44, but in 55 calibers. 120 mm Rheinmetall L/55 gun. And there is a new BOPS DM53, especially for this gun. Look at the difference in its characteristics when shooting:
                  - Barrel L 44: Energy - about 11,6 MJ, Initial speed - 1670 m / s,
                  - Barrel L 55: Energy - about 12,7 MJ Initial speed - 1750 m / s

                  You are right. hi
                3. 0
                  18 June 2023 23: 36
                  Quote: svp67
                  See the difference in its characteristics

                  The MG251 has a larger range of ammunition + ATGMs.
              4. 0
                18 June 2023 22: 00
                If you talk nonsense, in particular about springs and torsion bars, especially on tanks, then it’s best to be as confident as possible !!!, quickly believe. Bravo Golden!
              5. 0
                19 June 2023 14: 58
                For the mountains of Cyprus, Mk spring suspension is better than torsion bars.

                It is unlikely that both will be of any use in the mountains until the tracks are laid for them there.
            2. +10
              18 June 2023 07: 44
              Quote: svp67

              Well let's see ...
              At Leopard2A6, which the Greeks were counting on

              Leo2A6 has one minus: it is not and will not be, for free, for sure. And in the coming years it will be impossible to buy it even for money.

              This minus outweighs any pluses.
            3. +3
              18 June 2023 08: 53
              The conditions of Cyprus are very similar to those of Israel - a small rocky country. So - this specific car can come in to them ..
            4. The comment was deleted.
        2. AAK
          +5
          18 June 2023 11: 11
          For Cyprus, the Merkava, especially the 3rd series, is quite the terrain - almost the same, of the most obvious advantages of the Merkav - maximum safety for the crews due to design features, the first is the forward location of the MTO and the presence of a large aft hatch-door for safely leaving a damaged tank. EMNIP on the Merkava, the percentage of 200/300 crew members in damaged / wrecked tanks was minimal.
          1. 0
            18 June 2023 12: 46
            Quote: AAK
            one of the most obvious advantages of the Merkav is maximum safety for crews due to design features, the first is the forward location of the MTO
            The engine is not an obstacle to crowbar, but how to balance the armored muzzle if the engine is in front is a big question. Which was solved by reducing the thickness of the forehead. For a tank, this is bad, for the Merkava, which performs the tasks of a mobile pillbox, it is acceptable.
            1. 0
              18 June 2023 16: 48
              Quote: bk0010
              The engine is not an obstacle for scrap, but how to balance the armored muzzle if the engine is in front is a big question.

              Obviously, a tower shifted back. This is a problem for a conventional tank ...
              1. 0
                19 June 2023 23: 46
                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                Quote: bk0010
                The engine is not an obstacle for scrap, but how to balance the armored muzzle if the engine is in front is a big question.

                Obviously, a tower shifted back. This is a problem for a conventional tank ...

                No-e-eee! The center of mass of the turret is located much higher than the center of mass of the frontal armor with the engine in front.
            2. +1
              18 June 2023 23: 47
              Quote: bk0010
              The engine is not an obstacle for scrap, but how to balance the armored muzzle if the engine is in front is a big question.

              Moving the tower closer to the tail.

              Quote: bk0010
              Which was solved by reducing the thickness of the forehead.

              Bredyatin. On the contrary, there is another armored partition between the MTO and the crew.
              About the tower, I generally keep quiet.
              1. -1
                19 June 2023 11: 25
                Bredyatin. On the contrary, there is another armored partition between the MTO and the crew.
                About the tower, I generally keep quiet.

                Wow! in Israel, engines are made of armored steel? a new word in the tank kama sutra?
                1. -1
                  19 June 2023 12: 15
                  Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
                  Wow! in Israel, engines are made of armored steel? a new word in the tank kama sutra?

                  Fire bulkhead. At Merkava, it is allegedly 80 mm thick. Even if it's less, it's still the same...
                  1. +1
                    19 June 2023 19: 44
                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    it is supposedly 80 mm thick.

                    86mm straight.
                  2. -1
                    20 June 2023 08: 51
                    Fire bulkhead. At Merkava, it is allegedly 80 mm thick.

                    from armored steel?
                  3. 0
                    22 June 2023 10: 14
                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    At Merkava, it is supposedly 80 mm thick

                    Strongly less. 10 mm on Merkava 3.
            3. +2
              19 June 2023 23: 51
              Quote: bk0010
              Scrap engine is not an obstacle,

              More precisely, the protection of the fighting compartment from scrap for both layouts is identical, but the protection of the engine with its front location is lower than with the rear. It's just that Tal did not have combined armor when developing the tank, and the only way to ensure crew protection was to place the engine in front.
          2. 0
            18 June 2023 23: 42
            Quote: AAK
            EMNIP on the Merkava, the percentage of 200/300 crew members in damaged / wrecked tanks was minimal.

            So it is, out of 50+ hits in 2006, 22 armor penetrations - 18 killed (4 on a half-ton land mine), about 30 wounded.
            Irretrievable losses of tanks - 5 pieces.
          3. 0
            20 June 2023 00: 16
            Quote: AAK
            EMNIP on the Merkava, the percentage of 200/300 crew members in damaged / wrecked tanks was minimal

            In relation to the crews of the M-60 and M-48 tanks. Not a very fair comparison.
    2. 0
      18 June 2023 07: 02
      In military regional conflicts where tanks are consumables, moreover, not covered from the air, quantity, not quality, is needed. On average, a tank on the front line during frontal attacks will last a week, well, the tank can be replaced, and trained crews in large numbers for motley equipment from around the world where will the APU be taken? I'm not talking about the fact that the Jews will calculate the situation and guess that their regional opponents in return will receive not the most, but quite modern weapons from Russia in the event of these deliveries.
      1. -1
        18 June 2023 14: 37
        Quote from Silver99
        In military regional conflicts where tanks are consumables, moreover, not covered from the air, quantity, not quality, is needed. On average, a tank on the front line during frontal attacks will last a week, well, the tank can be replaced, and trained crews in large numbers for motley equipment from around the world where will the APU be taken? I'm not talking about the fact that the Jews will calculate the situation and guess that their regional opponents in return will receive not the most, but quite modern weapons from Russia in the event of these deliveries.

        What will regional opponents get from Russia there?
        We supply T-55s to our troops. In his howl ... (SVO) ...
        Well, enough of these agitations about modern Russian weapons, which we will give to everyone
        We don't have anything.
        And we will not be able to give anything to anyone.

        NVO has been on the same positions for a year and a half, all sorts of offensives and counter-attacks.
        Victory is not expected at all for the next 3-4 years.
        At all
        And they still talk with bravura slogans and editorials.
        Truly, turbopatriots divorced from reality.
        Like 5 years ago they were turbinated, so now ...
        1. +2
          18 June 2023 16: 37
          O. Leafed, leafed and found. All this multi-letter work was written for one stuffing. And he, without hesitation, is placed in the "first lines" of this opus. And then it remained to wait for the "comrades" to raise the flag. They raised it. If someone does not understand what I mean, then about our tanks, which are twice as old as 40-year-old chariots. Everything else is water.
          1. +2
            18 June 2023 22: 36
            Seriously, I think it makes no sense to compare single wooder waffles. Loads over 60 tons. With a full set of electronics and other things and everything. And a serial car for the war. Where there are thousands of them. And they are fighting all over the world. I'm definitely not talking about the fact that T55 and T62 are in large quantities. Better than a couple hundred modern cars. Equipment breaks down and gets damaged. Yes, and the means of destruction, there are new ones. 20 or 30 tanks of any kind. They won't change anything fundamentally. Wooderwafers have been and will be. Leclerc, Abrams of the latest modification. Armata. But the modified T72, aka T90m. Really fighting. And he solves problems.
  2. 0
    18 June 2023 02: 57
    I can't believe this content, why would Israel give tanks to Ukraine? The Jews may control the entire West, but as a nation they are very vulnerable. No sane person would risk getting involved in a war that would endanger himself.
    1. -4
      18 June 2023 04: 08
      Quote from: wanna
      No sane person

      And there they ended. And quite clearly.
      On the subject: if they hit, they will burn for sure. If they don't get in, they won't. Are they fireproof? Yes, that's nigga
      1. +7
        18 June 2023 04: 32
        And quite clearly.

        A mysterious NGO unexpectedly donated several useful items to Hamas.
        1. -19
          18 June 2023 05: 28
          Well, after Hamas hacked the Israeli air defense node connected to the network ... I say - they ran out)))
          1. +13
            18 June 2023 06: 36
            Quote from Bingo
            Well, after Hamas hacked the Israeli air defense node connected to the network ... I say - they ran out)))

            You, as always, believe the nonsense that you want to believe, even if it is outright nonsense. But these are trifles. The main thing is to take care of your health. hi
            1. -2
              18 June 2023 07: 12
              And don't forget about your health. It is the main thing in life, the rest will follow.
            2. -11
              18 June 2023 08: 09
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              The main thing is to take care of your health.

              Oh, yes, after your storytellers in VO, how to live Koshchei the Immortal - laughter, they say, he prolongs life ... I'm here after a whole day one higher mind in VO told that only in wild Scythia they press the buttons with felt boots, and the whole civilized world has been launching missiles through VKontakte for a long time ... And then his successor wandered around and told about secret-encrypted social networks only for Israeli air defense officers ... I was cut off for a hundred years in two days, no less.
              By the way, why did the air defense not work, since no one broke it? Ahhh, didn't you turn it off yourself? Even when the Leaky Colander spat out the annual budget of Israel in 10 days into the sky?
              Although, well, nafig, do not specify. I'll laugh for another hundred years
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. +5
                18 June 2023 09: 10
                Quote from Bingo
                By the way, why did the air defense not work, since no one broke it?

                Who said it didn't work? laughing
                Quote from Bingo
                Leaky Colander

                Of the 100 rockets in 2014 in Tel Aviv, all were shot down, I then lived there. Of an unknown number of drones, 2 passed through Krasnodar request I live here and this happened recently
                Quote from Bingo
                spit out Israel's annual budget in 10 days into the sky?

                lol centenary, why be modest))
                Don’t worry about their budget, there are 3 times more grandmas on the snout of the population than ours laughing
                1. 0
                  18 June 2023 09: 49
                  Well, in principle, I even heard these drones, I live on Garazhnaya, 200m to the MTS building in a straight line, this attack is the stupidest and it didn’t cause much damage, and I’m more than sure that these airplanes were launched from the territory of Russia, and an example of an attempt to strike at the Slavic tank farm , shows that important objects are covered, only God can give a 100% guarantee of protection.
                  1. +2
                    18 June 2023 10: 56
                    Quote: Pivot
                    Well, in principle, I even heard these drones, I live on Garazhnaya, 200m to the MTS building in a straight line, this attack is the stupidest and it didn’t cause much damage, and I’m more than sure that these airplanes were launched from the territory of Russia, and an example of an attempt to strike at the Slavic tank farm , shows that important objects are covered, only God can give a 100% guarantee of protection.

                    70 meters from the windows of my dentist's apartment, there was a bang. Who knows where they were let in from, from Kherson and Zaporozhye to us is much less than 1000 km.
                    100% guarantee - only from God, I agree, and the blows were made for the sake of creating panic, as part of the psychological preparation for the counter-grunt. laughing
                    1. +4
                      18 June 2023 23: 56
                      Quote: Krasnodar
                      It's just that Ragullo doesn't understand how much we don't care about all this.

                      Especially after Israel. Yes
                      1. +3
                        19 June 2023 02: 19
                        Quote: And Us Rat
                        Especially after Israel.

                        Exactly ))
              3. +2
                18 June 2023 23: 54
                Quote from Bingo
                Oh, yes, after your storytellers on VO, how can Koshchei the Immortal live

                Until the doctors find a needle in the egg. lol
              4. 0
                19 June 2023 11: 49
                Oh, yes, after your storytellers in VO, how to live Koshchei the Immortal - laughter, they say, he prolongs life ... I'm here after a whole day one higher mind in VO told that only in wild Scythia they press the buttons with felt boots, and the whole civilized world has been launching missiles through VKontakte for a long time ... And then his successor wandered around and told about secret-encrypted social networks only for Israeli air defense officers ... I was cut off for a hundred years in two days, no less.
                By the way, why did the air defense not work, since no one broke it? Ahhh, didn't you turn it off yourself? Even when the Leaky Colander spat out the annual budget of Israel in 10 days into the sky?
                Although, well, nafig, do not specify. I'll laugh for another hundred years

                Here you are laughing, but they are still abydna! they are "God's chosen"! the meaning of everything should be as one says! laughing laughing laughing
            3. 0
              18 June 2023 19: 45
              I beg you Aron. The Jews will never admit and will not recognize until the facts are poked in their face. And then they will say that it was intended that way.
          2. 0
            20 June 2023 11: 39
            Quote from Bingo
            Well, after Hamas hacked the Israeli air defense node connected to the network ... I say - they ran out)))

            For this, they need to pull a separate cable from the air defense unit to Gaza. The Israeli army Internet is PHYSICALLY not connected to the global Internet. It's just your internal Internet linking military units.
        2. +1
          18 June 2023 23: 51
          Quote from: wanna
          A mysterious NGO unexpectedly donated several useful items to Hamas.

    2. +15
      18 June 2023 06: 02
      What makes you think that the Jews will sell something, and even more so just like that, skaklam? The Greeks for inexpensively get quite an argument for themselves in graters with the Turks, and their T-80s, for which now there is no factory service, no spare parts (and what to do, sanctions!) Will be sold to the "tank coalition" for more than they could really count on free market. And the fact that this "tank coalition" will hand them over to 404 is not a claim against the Greeks, much less against the Jews.
    3. +1
      18 June 2023 10: 32
      Quote from: wanna
      I can't believe this content, why would Israel give tanks to Ukraine? The Jews may control the entire West, but as a nation they are very vulnerable. No sane person would risk getting involved in a war that would endanger himself.

      It's all nonsense. The Jews are vitally dependent on the states, they will order, and they will hand over their last pants to Ukraine and do not care that after that the Palestinians will have Cornets instead of stones and sticks.
      The Jews swear that they do not interfere in the conflict, but in fact they have been supplying ammunition to Ukraine from the very beginning. And let them say that these are American arsenals and they have nothing to do with it, but in fact the Jews from their territory supply ammunition to Ukraine on their own., And this is a fact.
      Regarding the Merkav. They will be in Ukraine and this is also a fact, just as over time there will be f-16s and others.
      Will the Merkavas play any significant role - NO. It's like giving Ukraine some kind of cruiser, no matter how you use it, but the cost of it will always be higher than the result, and they will sink it anyway. And the point is not even that the Merkava needs an entire infrastructure, ranging from special tractors and maintenance, to the fact that not a single bridge, panton, wagon, or anything at all, was calculated for its weight. This is a suitcase without a handle. Will he be in trouble? Maybe. Essential? Very doubtful. This is not an imba, and it burns just like the rest.
      1. +1
        18 June 2023 16: 37
        Quote: Ramzaj99
        Will the Merkavas play any significant role - NO.

        Quote: Ramzaj99
        And the point is not even that the Merkava needs an entire infrastructure, ranging from special tractors and maintenance, to the fact that not a single bridge, panton, wagon, or anything at all was calculated for its weight. This is a suitcase without a handle.

        Again, stories about bridges, special infrastructure and the like, as they used to talk about Leo2, Challengers 2. Heavy, not heavy, these tanks are a secondary matter, but their SLA, which sees much further than any of the most modern T-90Ms, especially at night, guns and ammunition, serious protection rather increases the combat capability of the Armed Forces brigades than reduces it.
        1. 0
          19 June 2023 11: 52
          believe. faith is above physics, chemistry and common sense
      2. +2
        19 June 2023 00: 06
        Quote: Ramzaj99
        Jews are vitally dependent on the states

        What (precisely vital)? By points and from expression examples.


        Quote: Ramzaj99
        Palestinians instead of stones and sticks, Cornets will be

        These ones?


        Quote: Ramzaj99
        but in fact the Jews from their territory supply ammunition to Ukraine on their own

        Blah blah blah.
        Date of? Board number? Quantity? Nomenclature? Where are the trophies? Where are the shards?

        Quote: Ramzaj99
        They will be in Ukraine and this is also a fact

        Prophet Syndrome? sad
      3. 0
        20 June 2023 15: 41
        Quote: Ramzaj99
        Palestinians instead of stones and sticks, Cornets will be

        A long time ago, either Iran or Russia gave them both bassoons and cornets, so Israel has no obligations to Russia in this regard.
    4. +2
      18 June 2023 10: 58
      Please explain.
      We have a classic market - there is demand (tanks), there is supply (merkava tanks). What is the problem? Countries have sold weapons before ....
      1. +1
        18 June 2023 22: 44
        What's the problem?
        What is the problem you say? And the problem here is that the Nazis, including the Ukrainian Bandera, carried out genocide against the Jewish nation. Now to put tanks on Ukraine, which is cultivating fascism and Banderaism, is equivalent to going to the grave of my grandfather, who fought against fascism, and defile it in a perverted form. Personally, I did not expect the Jews to fall so low.
        1. +2
          19 June 2023 08: 28
          Personally, I did not expect the Jews to fall so low.
          You can also look at this from the other side. Or maybe today's Jews are perverts-masochists. Help the Nazis who kill them. Here is the wangyu, when the dill picks up the greens, they will still remember that he is a Jew. And he and all the other Jews to the heap.
          1. -1
            20 June 2023 15: 45
            Quote from A2AD
            Help the fascists who kill them

            At one time, the USSR actively helped to kill the Israelis by supplying the latest weapons at that time to its enemies. So that you are not saints in the murder of Jews.
      2. +1
        19 June 2023 01: 50
        Quote: Sergey Zhikharev
        Please explain.
        We have a classic market - there is demand (tanks), there is supply (merkava tanks). What is the problem? Countries have sold weapons before ....

  3. -4
    18 June 2023 03: 38
    Ours are now training on "leopolds")), got combat experience just in case.
    If we practice on Merkavs, this experience will be very useful, and not only to us.
    The Israelis already have a tribesman, the shame of their nation, they will send Merkavs to Ukraine, there will be a disgrace to their mind. The experience of working on the merkava, no doubt, is used by those who dream of correcting the local geography.
  4. +2
    18 June 2023 03: 53
    Starting with the T-80, Cyprus will continue with the BMP and Torami.
    1. GGV
      +5
      18 June 2023 07: 00
      T-80s and infantry fighting vehicles can be replaced, but what will they replace the Torah with?
      1. +2
        18 June 2023 12: 48
        Quote: GGV
        T-80s and infantry fighting vehicles can be replaced, but what will they replace the Torah with?
        Bibles.
  5. +1
    18 June 2023 04: 16
    And why is "Merka" better than "Leopadly"? There are no fireproof tanks yet))
    1. +1
      19 June 2023 01: 54
      Quote from Shtaier
      And why is "Merka" better than "Leopadly"?

      Available for sale without pre-order.

      Quote from Shtaier
      There are no fireproof tanks yet))

      And will not be.
      1. -2
        19 June 2023 11: 54
        Available for sale without pre-order.

        blah blah blah. storage areas, equipment, BC noclature, security, geo-coordinates
  6. +6
    18 June 2023 04: 57
    Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?
    If they are there in the war, then they will ALWAYS be
    1. +1
      18 June 2023 18: 15
      Quote: svp67
      Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?
      If they are there in the war, then they will ALWAYS be

      100%. Well, if they were burning in Lebanon ...
  7. The comment was deleted.
    1. +6
      18 June 2023 06: 12
      Quote: ROSS 42
      It is more relevant to consider the questions why in Israel forty-year-old tanks are considered a kind of panacea, and in Russia the T-90 (“Breakthrough”)

      Here is a strange approach ... The Merkava that is now in service is MUCH younger, otherwise you will have to admit that the T-90 is another modification of the T-72 and it will be older
      1. +3
        18 June 2023 16: 50
        Quote: svp67
        otherwise, you will have to admit that the T-90 is another modification of the T-72 and it will be older

        Isn't the T-90 a modification of the T-72? This is not a development from scratch, but the same basic bath, running gear, B2 engine, but with a modified VLD and a new turret, body kit, gun. Between Leo2A4 and Leo2A6 there is already more difference than between T-72B and T-90A, since the bathtub is made of other, more durable steels with additional. fillers, mine protection. And starting with Leo2A7 and even more so A8, the case has nothing to do with the original Leo2. But KMV and Rheinmetal did not think of calling him Leo3 and Leo4.
        1. +1
          19 June 2023 23: 41
          Quote: karabas-barabas
          Isn't the T-90 a modification of the T-72?

          So it was originally called T-72BU. But EBN decided that the tank would be called the T-90. And the tank became known as the T-90.
  8. 0
    18 June 2023 06: 26
    Can Merkavas get to Ukraine? Doubtful.
    Well, why is it doubtful? In our time, of course, you need to doubt, but you also have to expect that doubts will turn out to be in vain. It is indeed possible that someone will buy Israeli tanks and hand over the rest of the Soviet ones to Kiev, but who will give a 10% guarantee that at one fine moment Merkavas will suddenly appear in Ukraine? And then the question
    Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?
    will be purely rhetorical. They will be like the others.
  9. +8
    18 June 2023 06: 49
    Hm, yes.

    It seems that R. Skomorokhov tried to distance himself from the genre "little, late, useless" (other authors are responsible for him) and to be a realist, so to speak. But then decided not to exacerbate.

    And there are three news, one worse than the other.

    1. New achievement of geopolitics. So Israel, albeit not directly, but joined the coalition through a circular supply scheme. Before that, Finland, Sweden, Switzerland, Japan and Korea had tied up with neutrality "in the European war" - I don’t remember such a dog wedding in the entire known history of diplomacy. In fact, of the countries with a serious military industry, only India and the PRC are not covered.

    Not yet covered.

    2. Israel - surprise - "in Soviet times" accumulated mountains of weapons. Looking ahead, there are not only tanks, but also armored personnel carriers, artillery, etc. With such an additional warehouse, vacuuming the whole world for Soviet remnants and your own junk like M113 or M109 will be even easier. Even though it wasn't that hard before.

    3. Actually tanks. It is rightly noted that the Merkav brigade in Cyprus means the T-80 brigade in Ukraine. Good T-80s, with upgrades. However, for some reason, Croatia is listed as the second country - instead of the much more obvious Greece. And Greece is the largest tankless power in Europe. Its subsoil contains almost a third of the remaining world reserves of Leo1 (and all A5) (can be replaced by Merkava 2) and the largest reserves of Leo2A4 in Europe now (can be replaced by Merkava 3). It is also important that the tank shells of large Greek tank forces can be replaced by Israeli ones, and the old ones can be sent to where they are now needed.

    If the sodomites have fooled the Greeks (as if the Greeks are so against this case), then this is a serious increase in the coalition's capabilities.
    1. +1
      18 June 2023 14: 43
      Quote: Negro
      Hm, yes.

      It seems that R. Skomorokhov tried to distance himself from the genre "little, late, useless" (other authors are responsible for him) and to be a realist, so to speak. But then decided not to exacerbate.

      And there are three news, one worse than the other.

      1. New achievement of geopolitics. So Israel, albeit not directly, but joined the coalition through a circular supply scheme. Before that, Finland, Sweden, Switzerland, Japan and Korea had tied up with neutrality "in the European war" - I don’t remember such a dog wedding in the entire known history of diplomacy. In fact, of the countries with a serious military industry, only India and the PRC are not covered.

      Not yet covered.

      2. Israel - surprise - "in Soviet times" accumulated mountains of weapons. Looking ahead, there are not only tanks, but also armored personnel carriers, artillery, etc. With such an additional warehouse, vacuuming the whole world for Soviet remnants and your own junk like M113 or M109 will be even easier. Even though it wasn't that hard before.

      3. Actually tanks. It is rightly noted that the Merkav brigade in Cyprus means the T-80 brigade in Ukraine. Good T-80s, with upgrades. However, for some reason, Croatia is listed as the second country - instead of the much more obvious Greece. And Greece is the largest tankless power in Europe. Its subsoil contains almost a third of the remaining world reserves of Leo1 (and all A5) (can be replaced by Merkava 2) and the largest reserves of Leo2A4 in Europe now (can be replaced by Merkava 3). It is also important that the tank shells of large Greek tank forces can be replaced by Israeli ones, and the old ones can be sent to where they are now needed.

      If the sodomites have fooled the Greeks (as if the Greeks are so against this case), then this is a serious increase in the coalition's capabilities.

      The Greeks are the biggest donors to Ukraine, if you count per capita or the ratio of aid to the level of the country's budget.
      Anti-Russian sentiment in Greece is one of the strongest in the world.
      So if even one declares about the Orthodox brotherhood, then let him go to Greece now.
      1. -2
        18 June 2023 18: 14
        Quote: SovAr238A
        So if even one declares about the Orthodox brotherhood, then let him go to Greece now.

        Russophobia Russophobia, but weapons have so far been given very little. But Greece really has one of the largest arsenals of equipment from the time of the XV. They have their own HB with a neighboring NATO member.
  10. -2
    18 June 2023 07: 08
    There are two countries ...... There is such a country as the Czech Republic and there is such a country as Poland. Both countries are unprincipled executors of the will of "you-know-whom". Through both countries, weapons trash is now being pumped and not only from all over the world. Yes, even on the territory of these countries, new ones have been created and old tank repair facilities are being used. Yes, and you yourself know where to take it closer and everything is fine.
    1. -10
      18 June 2023 07: 41
      For the first time I hear about Polish and Czech tanks in Ukraine
      1. +4
        18 June 2023 09: 25
        Quote: Rinat Khametov
        For the first time I hear about Polish and Czech tanks in Ukraine

        Solid and Czech analogue has long been there
  11. -15
    18 June 2023 07: 40
    The Jews are scaring .... For in exchange for a tank for Ukraine, nuclear weapons can go to Iran ....
  12. The comment was deleted.
    1. +8
      18 June 2023 08: 02
      Quote: Vadim S
      At 2.30 the article was posted, by 8 in the morning ...

      Quote: Anecdote
      A hangover man hears on the radio:
      - In Moscow - 15 hours, ..., in Khabarovsk - 22, in Vladivostok - 23, in Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky - midnight.
      Man: - Oh, barda-ak!

      The ball is round. And there are different people, almost everywhere. wink laughing
    2. +2
      18 June 2023 08: 15
      Quote: Vadim S
      you people have nothing to do at night??

      Have you heard of time zones?
      1. 0
        19 June 2023 13: 16

        Have you heard of time zones?
        So this is a typical Muscovite. For them, everything beyond the Moscow Ring Road does not exist.
  13. -7
    18 June 2023 08: 42
    Merkavas do not look good on the territory of the Square, due to the fact that the Armed Forces of Ukraine paint on them, in addition to the Star of David, a Nazi swastika. With regards to the T-72 and T-80: if our leadership has the will, they will make sure that these tanks do not reach the Nenka.
  14. +1
    18 June 2023 09: 31
    Merkava needs rocky ground. plus service. Jewish support. An old tank that has not been mastered, there is no rembaz, is scrap metal.
    1. +2
      18 June 2023 12: 31
      There is loess soil there, which is why a caterpillar with an open hinge, like the English one, was chosen. Loess is like a lubricant for her. By the way, in winter, when it rains, the picture there is no worse than on black soil
    2. -1
      19 June 2023 02: 07
      Quote: Victor Sergeev
      Merkava needs rocky ground.

  15. -2
    18 June 2023 10: 27
    All power to the Soviets!

    Quote: R. Skomorokhov
    Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?

    Necessarily will! Russia is great, but there is nowhere to retreat - behind Moscow!

    ps
    I didn’t find information on VO about an interesting event that happened in Petrograd, which I can’t get past:

    "On June 17, in the park of the 300th anniversary of St. Petersburg in the waters of the Gulf of Finland, flags were raised to a height of 179,5 meters: Russian Empire, the Soviet Union and the flag of the Russian Federation".



    For lovers of the tricolor, it became state only under Yeltsin, as a symbol of Russia's colonial dependence on the West.
    More about flags: https://disk.yandex.ru/i/x4MIa9VhuUmQKw
    1. -1
      19 June 2023 02: 10
      Quote: Boris55
      For tricolor lovers

      The flag of the Republic of Ingushetia is also a tricolor, only in other colors.
  16. +1
    18 June 2023 11: 29
    Today, the political situation around Israel is quite calm, half of the former opponents are almost friends with Jerusalem (indeed, an unequivocal success of Israeli diplomacy) ...
    More like MOSSADA. bully
  17. 0
    18 June 2023 11: 33
    The actions of the Israeli military department are clear and understandable. Because of the events in Ukraine, a rearmament race has really begun in the world...
    This is only part of the question, the basis is completely different .... sad
  18. 0
    18 June 2023 12: 09
    The Dutch media write that they will be sold to Poland, and that they will directly transfer it to Ukraine. Thus, Israel maintains neutrality
    https://www.geenstijl.nl/5171079/je-gaat-bijna-raden/
    1. 0
      19 June 2023 02: 15
      Quote: dimasik-nl
      The Dutch media write

      They also write on the fence.
      1. -1
        19 June 2023 11: 57
        They also write on the fence.

        they also beat on the passport. classic
  19. 0
    18 June 2023 12: 12
    No, they won’t burn, since they are generally not adapted for combat operations in the middle lane, and especially in Ukraine! Their mass exceeds 70 tons even without a body kit and in Israel they are forbidden to travel on roads, only delivery on trailers to the battlefield and to areas where there is strong rocky ground.
    1. 0
      19 June 2023 02: 49
      Quote: Berg Berg
      they are generally not adapted for combat operations in the middle lane

      Not tired of replicating this bike?
      The Merkava has wider tracks than Leo or Abrams, and the ground clearance is higher. You have not seen the north of Israel in winter.



      Quote: Berg Berg
      Their mass exceeds 70 tons even without body kit

      Bredyatin. Mk-2 weighs 62 tons, and Mk-3 63.5 tons in FULL configuration. Even the Mk-4 does not reach 70, it weighs 67 tons with KAZ (almost a ton).

      Quote: Berg Berg
      in Israel they are forbidden to travel on the roads

      Because their tracks do not provide for the installation of rubber blotches. This is free asphalt in Russia.


      Quote: Berg Berg
      delivery on trailers to the battlefield

      Do you have common sense at all? Why not immediately into battle on trailers? fool
      You are talking nonsense.
      1. -1
        19 June 2023 11: 58
        Because their tracks do not provide for the installation of rubber blotches. This is free asphalt in Russia.

        you do not worry about our asphalt.
  20. 0
    18 June 2023 12: 52
    And why did someone decide that nature in Cyprus and Israel is the same?
    He worked in Cyprus for 16 years, but he did not find any steppes or deserts there.
    The mountains.
    Though not high, but mountains. Even the airports in Paphos and Larnaca have been built on the seashore, on the beaches.
    But in Limassol they were not honored.
    Somehow I can’t imagine the Merkava in the climbing version.
    As far as I know, Croatia has about the same plein air.
    1. 0
      18 June 2023 18: 11
      Israeli terrain, also very mountainous, not the Alps of course, but Jerusalem 800 meters above sea level, the Great Sea 400 meters below level, Haifa 500 meters above the level, Safed 900 meters, Golan Plateau 1000 meters, Mount Hermon 2060 meters, well, there is still more the Judean mountains, the mountainous Negev, but with the steppes and plains in Israel it’s a big strain, although they exist, as well as the swampy Hula, and the Israel Valley that turns into almost a swamp in winter. Israel has a very diverse landscape, and many of its parts really look like Cyprus
    2. -3
      18 June 2023 18: 49
      Quote: Seamaster
      Somehow I can’t imagine the Merkava in the climbing version

      And the T-80, therefore, can you imagine?
      1. +2
        18 June 2023 23: 19
        After Chechnya and Afghanistan - yes.
        And all the photos of "merkav" at the front - only in the desert, out of the blue.
        1. -1
          19 June 2023 19: 51
          Quote: Seamaster
          And all the photos of "merkav" at the front - only in the desert, out of the blue.

          Looking bad.

    3. -1
      19 June 2023 02: 53
      Quote: Seamaster
      He worked in Cyprus for 16 years, but he did not find any steppes or deserts there.

      I had to go to Israel and look north of Tel Aviv and in the vicinity of Jerusalem. wassat
  21. 0
    18 June 2023 12: 57
    Merkava will be bought by Azerbaijan. The terrain is suitable, there is independence, and it would also be very good to intercept. All the same, this is not ungrateful Ukraine.
  22. -1
    18 June 2023 14: 18
    Ukraine may well exchange the Merkavas in exchange for the Uman synagogue ...
  23. -2
    18 June 2023 16: 31
    In our country, they say, Poplars and Topolyams-M are being exchanged for Yarsy, and there the resource is unfinished from 10+ years. We also need to look for buyers! Why are we worse? smile
    1. KCA
      0
      18 June 2023 18: 09
      PGRK Topol is not just a fucking fool, is it also a complex of control, security and protection vehicles, where can they be quietly delivered? Yes, and Russia still adheres to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons and Missile Weapons
      1. +2
        18 June 2023 19: 31
        Some states of the NPT did not sign, but, nevertheless, have nuclear weapons and means of delivery to sensitive areas of Russia, more than likely, have an agreement with the United States for coordinated use. Do you propose to ignore this on the basis of an agreement repeatedly violated by potential partners? belay
        1. 0
          19 June 2023 03: 13
          Quote: engineer74
          Some states of the NPT did not sign, but, nevertheless, have nuclear weapons

          You have a causal relationship. They have it precisely because they did not sign it, and not in spite of it.
          The NPT just forbids signers to have nuclear weapons, well, except for a gang of "special" planetary gopniks. It's essentially a cartel. But fortunately, the collective farm is a voluntary business.

          Quote: engineer74
          have an agreement with the United States on the coordinated use

          Do you seriously think Israelis are idiots? laughing
          If you grapple with the Yankees, Israel will "sit in a tree" with the PRC and eat popcorn. There is no way to get into a dog mating of SUCH bad scales, for such idiocy there are tribalts. laughing
          1. KCA
            0
            19 June 2023 09: 02
            There is no ban on countries that have not signed the NPT to develop their own nuclear weapons, missiles; They are the same development and production in India
            1. -1
              19 June 2023 20: 00
              Quote: KCA
              There is no ban on countries that have not signed the NPT to develop their own nuclear weapons

              So. Yes

              Quote: KCA
              missiles

              Missile technology is not mentioned in principle in the NPT.
              The NPT stipulates exclusively nuclear warheads.

              Quote: KCA
              but if the country itself develops, then you can

              Even nuclear weapons are possible, but only to another country outside the treaty.
              If, for example, Israel sells a neutron bomb to India, no one can de jure present anything about this.

              And even if Pakistan sells a nuclear weapon to Mongolia, for example, only Mongolia can be presented for the purchase, but not to Pakistan for the sale. Because Mongolia is in the NPT, but Pakistan is not.

              Quote: KCA
              Brahmos example

              Bad example. Bramos is an RCC and is generally not regulated by any agreements.

              Quote: KCA
              at least one presentation was?

              No reason. And India is NOT a party to the NPT.
          2. -1
            19 June 2023 12: 03
            The NPT just forbids signers to have nuclear weapons, well, except for a gang of "special" planetary gopniks. It's essentially a cartel.

            eco you are talking about the US and your newest mole, so to speak!
            Do you seriously think Israelis are idiots? laughing
            If you grapple with the Yankees, Israel will "sit in a tree" with the PRC and eat popcorn. There is no way to get into a dog mating of SUCH bad scales, for such idiocy there are tribalts.

            Well, yes, well, yes ... supplying equipment with weapons to the fascist regime - is this called popcorn haw in Israel?
            Well, not everyone in Israel adheres to your precious opinion. you need to prove your loyalty. You are still class 2. and here - runaway
  24. 0
    18 June 2023 18: 52
    Quote from: wanna
    And quite clearly.

    A mysterious NGO unexpectedly donated several useful items to Hamas.

    The Celestial Empire does not need to engage in terrorism, it is too vulnerable.
  25. The comment was deleted.
  26. +1
    18 June 2023 21: 04
    Will Merkavas burn in the steppes of Ukraine?

    Will!!!
  27. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. -1
          19 June 2023 20: 31
          Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
          well, so you comment on the supply of weapons

          What? request

          Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
          and equipment

          Equipment is not a weapon. No one has ever killed anyone with an air raid siren.

          Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
          about maintaining the Kyiv junta, which during WWII poisoned your fellow tribesmen

          The Kyiv junta is not even 10 years old. She physically could not do anything to the Jews during WWII. And now he can't.
          It's your bogey, not ours.

          Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
          splatter the righteous with uncomfortable questions

          So you ask them to start. laughing
          Real questions, not nonsense.
          What can be the answer to nonsense? What would you say if I asked you "why and how long have you been a serial child rapist"? Is the analogy clear?
          Israel is not responsible for your personal fantasies.

          Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
          at the same time I recommend to slander

          For what? For your neurosis? As long as you're not rude, I don't see a problem.

          Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
          but what do you think - zelitler extolling Bandera and others who destroyed the Jews is doing the right thing, is this different?

          Yes, I don’t care like that, there are millions of anti-Semites, racists, Nazis, maniacs, fanatics and psychopaths in the world. As long as they don't try to harm Israel and the Jews, they don't really interest me. Zelya is a banal opportunist politician, like 99% of politicians in the world. We have a different mentality, we do not condemn threats, we try to eliminate them, but these should be real threats, not agitprop narrative. And we also do not have imperial ambitions to punish someone on the other hemisphere for dissent.
          1. -1
            20 June 2023 09: 14
            you try to look the least, but you come out extremely bad.
            What?

            it is strange that you did not use the "guineal" method - to ask moronic questions like - where, when, batch number, security by last name.
            grenade launchers and rifles. ammunition.
            Equipment is not a weapon. No one has ever killed anyone with an air raid siren.

            no need to engage in boltology, you are not the smartest here. SIBZ is also equipment that saves the lives of the Nazis. this is different, right?
            The Kyiv junta is not even 10 years old. She physically could not do anything to the Jews during WWII. And now he can't.
            It's your bogey, not ours.

            Yes Yes. and Bandera did not destroy the Jews, and not Bandera and Shukhevych were not the national heroes of the Ukrainian Reich, and Zelitler was not a Nazi, he was still a Jew. old tales from the State Department.
            So you ask them to start. laughing
            Real questions, not nonsense.
            What can be the answer to nonsense? What would you say if I asked you "why and how long have you been a serial child rapist"? Is the analogy clear?
            Israel is not responsible for your personal fantasies.

            I asked. but you were talking nonsense, chatting up uncomfortable questions, just like your fascist bibik, who, distracting his own citizens from protests to remake the judicial system for himself, is killing Palestinians. and you are so familiar with the types of delirium? from which side - from the side of the bathrobe or pajamas? or just because you think you're some kind of know-it-all? I assure you, sir, you are mistaken. the only question is that under the influence of SMP or due to chromosomal damage.
            and do not equate yourself with Israel, there I know a lot of people to whom your position is a quote: "bullshit."
            For what? For your neurosis? As long as you're not rude, I don't see a problem.

            Wow! and you - a doctor - are throwing diagnoses? Or is it just your usual rudeness masquerading as sarcasm? your excessive aggressiveness tells me, as a specialist, that you have problems in your personal life. I would work with you, but you just chicken out. as usual.
            We have a different mentality

            No. our mentality is the same. but your excess and excessive aggressiveness does not allow you to realize this. that's why you hide behind aggression and "love" for Israel, like behind a smokescreen. the difference is that it is extremely difficult for you to settle down in a new role. I feel sorry for you as a person. your psyche is under threat, how would you convey it - that is the question.
      2. +1
        19 June 2023 10: 08
        You have Semites there exterminating Semites and still nothing, no one is embarrassed about it. And Goebbels would envy your Old Testament. hi
        1. -1
          19 June 2023 20: 38
          Quote from AdAstra
          You have Semites there exterminating Semites and still nothing, no one is embarrassed about it.

          And you have Slavs of Slavs. AND? Are you any different?

          Quote from AdAstra
          And Goebbels would envy your Old Testament.

          You haven't seen the rock paintings of 150 years ago. wassat
          1. +1
            20 June 2023 07: 41
            AND? And not x- ... no need to push anti-Semitism.
  28. ASM
    +2
    18 June 2023 23: 16
    They won't even make it to the front. Merkava on the outskirts can be used as a maximum as a semi-self-propelled gun. And then pray if they manage to pull her to the rear.
    1. -1
      19 June 2023 21: 38
      Also, they say, in terms of dimensions, it will not drive onto the bridge, nor will it stand on the railway platform. And our "Chariot" does not know how to swim ... A strange preference for the Armed Forces of Ukraine.
  29. -2
    19 June 2023 09: 14
    Well done Israelis, they created just a great tank

    kaeshna! this is the best tank in all of Israel! laughing
    Israel forgot how the boxes burned in Egypt and Syria. recall.
    and if the boxes are dragged to 404, then it will become clear that Israel is supporting the fascist Kuev regime with all its might and helping the Zelitler. then you will have to re-sing about your eternal sorrowful song about the pseudo-holocaust
    1. 0
      19 June 2023 20: 44
      Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
      I forgot how the boxes burned in Egypt and Syria

      Merkava did not fight in Egypt and Syria.

      Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
      recall

      No, don't remind me.

      Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
      and if the boxes are dragged to 404

      Who and why?

      Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
      Israel supports the fascist Kueva regime with all its might

      And you are Satan and cannibalism. (hand face)
      Israel does not care about your war, there are more important concerns. Even the media does not remember you. The world does not revolve around you.

      Quote from: QuestionsNeudobny
      about the pseudo-holocaust

      Don't get an ulcer.
      1. -2
        20 June 2023 09: 19
        Merkava did not fight in Egypt and Syria.

        learn the history of your birthmark
        No, don't remind me.

        do not worry so much, it will not affect you personally, but - we remind you.
        The world does not revolve around you.

        Come on?! so Israel is not the navel of the earth! even a completely different hole on the other side.
        Don't get an ulcer.

        do not worry. Russia and fascism will cure, and exclusivity, and God's chosen people.
        do not pick up Nazism with a complication due to exclusivity. and then later there will be no one to squeal about, allegedly, the "holocaust".
        I still recommend you see a psychologist. you need an adjustment. I hope you, as a Shabakovite, still have discounts or are assigned a full-time psychologist
  30. 0
    19 June 2023 14: 05
    It is possible that smart heads decided that for the tactics of small assault groups currently used by the Armed Forces of Ukraine, the Merkava is well suited, given the possibility of transporting several fighters in a hull. But this is theoretical.
  31. The comment was deleted.
    1. -1
      20 June 2023 00: 41
      I don't even want to argue with your wording.
    2. +1
      20 June 2023 23: 05
      Quote: kayak
      already worries the minds in full

      Where does the mind of these idiots come from? ...

      With CIPSO, probably. Or the former Russian "fighters against corruption", they are now repainted as "ultrapatriots".
      1. -1
        21 June 2023 09: 16
        With CIPSO, probably. Or the former Russian "fighters against corruption", they are now repainted as "ultrapatriots".

        It's not just cissos here. here are the Shabakovites, and the Mossadites, and the Gurovites and other white-tape trash. and also "patriots --> patriots from a shining house on a shining hillock" - "conscience" of the so-called. liberalism and other
        1. -2
          21 June 2023 22: 26
          Are only real, Zatupinsky am welcome here? OK, zopeyasl wassat
  32. 0
    22 June 2023 12: 00
    I do not understand the reasoning about the Ukrainians "having a lot of foreign weapons".
    The USSR delivered to the Arabs for the wars with Israel not hundreds, but thousands of units of both tanks and aircraft.
  33. 0
    22 June 2023 12: 56
    The Jews will sell the merkava to the Cypriots and bang like a cherry, they say only the circumcised can fully control the tank laughing
  34. 0
    16 August 2023 12: 17
    Quote: svp67
    Believe "Merkava Mk3" and here it loses


    Now the Zionists will come running, they will start screaming about the Holocaust and the Black Hundreds.
    Take care of your psyche, the site is parked in Israel.

    Criticizing the kosher merkava, ultrasound with galil is not allowed here.
  35. 0
    10 October 2023 00: 16
    As we see, there will be no Merkav in Ukraine until the end of the conflict with Hamas.
    .
    Moral: Mutinies and wars behind enemy lines are necessary. Stop being a purist. The West supplies weapons to the Ukrainians! We, too, must renew our participation in this game.