China takes over Central Asia

263
China takes over Central Asia

On May 18 and 19, an epoch-making event for many (including us) took place - the summit of the states of Central Asia, which are now called C5 - Kazakhstan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Turkmenistan and Uzbekistan.

But this summit was held not in the capital of one of the above countries, but in Xian, one of the capitals of ancient China, from where, by the way, the Great Chinese Silk Road went to Europe.



Symbolic? Oh yeah! Including because it was again about the great Chinese silk. way, but modern. And the summit was held in the C5 + 1 format, where “1” is China.

In general, I got the impression that Comrade Xi, having assessed the situation in the world well, stopped playing retail and went for a large wholesale. However, judge for yourself.

Documents were signed decently, but I will start with the most important, in my opinion. With the signing by China, Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan of the document about new steps in the construction of a railway to bypass Russia. It is clear that the key word here is “new”. It very well shows the essence of the moment, which means that the old steps have already been taken, we must move on.

This plan actually creates a shorter route to Europe for the Asian countries of the region. Only one nuance, completely unimportant for them, but important for us - the path lies bypassing Russian territory.


The route, frankly, is not without flaws, the main of which is Iran, but there is an option instead of the route through Iran to use ferry crossings to Azerbaijan, here is Turkey, here is Europe. In addition, it makes no difference to the countries of the Asia-Pacific region, through which countries to drive goods, the main thing is that it be cheap and safe.

As for “cheap” in terms of our Russian Railways, I can’t say, but in January 2023, 142 rubles were put up for the delivery of a minivan from Vladivostok to Moscow. Carriage deliveries can cost up to half a million rubles for a 000-ton car on the same route.

Security ... This is generally a moot point. Railway safety is a very delicate and complex matter.


However, once the documents are signed, it means that the participating countries are well aware of what they are getting into. And they are getting involved in the process of the final transition from the Russian sphere of influence to the Chinese one.

In principle, if there is an income for the country from this friendship, what difference does it make where to go to the parade, on May 9 in Moscow or on October 1 in Beijing? China, however, does not indulge itself in parades and holds it once every ten years. But nothing, as they say, would be the case, but there will be dancing.

And China, in the person of the leadership, not only talks about projects that guarantee profits for the economies of the participating countries, but affects much more significant areas, namely security. Security is not only about joint projects with China, we are talking about the security of the participating countries in general.

In fact, the Chinese leader Xi Jinping, openly offered the former Soviet republics that are members of the EAEU, the CSTO and other letter combinations, a real military bloc.

Military alliance of China, Kazakhstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan.


Xi Jinping said that China is ready to strengthen the defense capabilities of the participating countries, enhance their external and internal security, and ensure peace in the region. And for this, as a "goodwill step", Comrade Xi promised to give out 26 billion yuan from the master's shoulder. 3,6 billion dollars.

For what specific purposes, the Chinese leader did not say exactly, but even if this money is simply transferred to Chinese weapon, which will go to the armies of the countries participating in the new bloc, the amount is already quite decent. Chinese weapons are much cheaper than Russian ones.

Xi Jinping also said that China can take part in the development of the entire region. That is, to participate in the development and coordination of the development strategy, implement it, develop and build large infrastructure projects. Naturally, at the same time, Chinese companies will enter the region and start working, which in turn will give jobs to local residents.

You know, no matter how you look at it, it is an approach from such trump cards that Russia has practically nothing to cover with.

Undoubtedly, recently Russia has worked out its role in the CSTO very well and retained power to the President of Kazakhstan, Tokayev, who now demonstrates how he can be grateful for this. Purely in Kazakh. Next time, this work will apparently be done by Chinese special forces and it will be interesting to see the results. Although, it is quite possible that in the new world in Kazakhstan everyone will simply bathe in yuan and there will be no dissatisfied people at all.

Some analysts have already expressed the opinion that this is an application for the transition of the once Soviet, and then, with grief in half, and Russian Central Asia into the sphere of influence of China. Perhaps the opinion is somewhat pessimistic, but this is not even an application, but a statement of what has happened. So to speak, in fact.

Yes, so far no one disputes the membership of Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan in the CSTO, and joining the new bloc does not cancel participation in the Russian project. Or cancel?

In fact, all participation in the CSTO of any countries except Russia is a fiction. No, as for solving their problems at the expense of Russian soldiers, it's easy. Kazakhstan showed this in all its glory, and Armenia demonstrated it almost every year, trying to solve its problems with Azerbaijan in exactly the same way: to keep their own people at home, and others to die.

Therefore, I am sure that as the process of organizing a new C5 + 1 (PRC) military bloc moves forward, everyone who will not be able to get anything from participating in the future will leave the CSTO.

Roughly the same thing could happen to the dying EAEU. Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan will simply finish him off with their exit (the rest fled earlier or did not join at all).


And there will be two “blocks for three”, brawls from Russia, Belarus and Armenia. The last one is not accurate.

It is clear that the long work of Chinese analysts and forecasters has yielded certain results, and now China will try to use the situation in which Russia has been plunged to the maximum benefit for itself.

It's no secret that our Central Asian rulers, whatever you call them, presidents, bashis, sultans, or whatever else, they, just like their ancestors many hundreds of years ago, understand the language of power best of all. Who is strong is worthy. Friendship, cooperation, worship - the main thing here is strength and power.

China today has, albeit with reservations, but economic power and military strength, this is a fact. Significantly exceeding the capabilities of C5 countries. And the army fleet China has what it takes, at least in numbers on paper. Not like Kazakhstan, of course. But Russia... Let's not talk about sad things, but in short - Russia continues to surrender one position after another and there is no end in sight to this process.

Even after the start of the NMD, the Central Asian leaders were very wary of the idea of ​​a “march to the West”, and only after the collapse and abandonment of the Kharkiv region and Kherson they exhaled and began to unanimously support anti-Russian sanctions. The bear was not as dangerous as it seemed to everyone.

And here lies the very reason for the change of course. Russia can not be afraid, Russia was not as strong as it seems. A new partner, or whatever it comes out next, must be stronger.

Of course, this does not mean that all the Central Asian republics will turn away from Russia overnight like this. It is a sin not to use the opportunity to pump money from a neighboring country in such quantities as guest workers do. But there is a certain wariness, and this is already enough for the pragmatic Chinese comrades to poke everyone into the “successes” of the Russian army in the NMD and give out that “everything will not be the same under them.”

Russia is not invited either to build a railway or to participate in a military bloc.

And here everything is just amazing. The leadership of the PRC decided to create its own zone of trade and influence. Central Asia is a very profitable region, Chinese firms have been sitting there for a long time and densely. And then the expansion of everything plus the filling of this zone with what? That's right, yuan. Which is not a convertible currency, and there are many steps to be taken towards this Chinese currency. This is where it actually started.

Naturally, since “Any revolution is only worth something if it knows how to defend itself” (according to V. I. Lenin), then China must also protect its revolutionary campaign against the West from all possible and impossible surprises. And the region is still the same in every sense, Afghanistan and Iran are enough through the roof. But whoever takes risks wins. Moreover, China is demonstrating its readiness to become a regional peacemaker in Central Asia.

Can this defense alliance pose any threat to Russia?


In fact, no. The collapse of the CSTO for the sake of a new union, in principle, can be taken with relief, since the very idea of ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXbprotecting "younger brothers" at one's own expense is, as it were, utterly flawed in our time. Another question is that plugging holes in the work of the Russian diplomatic department with soldiers of the Russian army is not the best way out.

The collapse of the EAEU… What is dead cannot die anyway. Another question is that the countries of Central Asia will not completely abandon Russia either, a balance is simply needed here. In accordance with the English folk wisdom that you should not keep your eggs in one basket. That is. relations with Russia will remain, but they will simply go by the wayside, giving way to the more aggressive and wealthy in many respects, China.

“Comrade Xi, come, put things in order” - it is, of course, true, but if Comrade Xi starts to put things in order using Chinese methods ... In general, at least some kind of counterbalance is needed.

But nevertheless, Russia was not invited either to the military bloc or to the construction site. It is clear that if they were not invited to the summit, then there is no need to talk about the rest. They decided that they would manage on their own, and politically there were fewer problems.

Speaking of eggs in baskets. China professes this principle in exactly the same way. China has a lot of problems with the delivery of goods to other regions. And hitting Chinese trade is easier than ever, simply by creating tension at critical points in the maritime trade routes. For China, such a main point is the Strait of Malacca. And in a couple to him - Sunda. Any tension in the area - and that's it, the exit to the Indian Ocean is blocked automatically.

There are other points: the Bab el-Mandeb Strait, the Suez Canal, the Strait of Gibraltar. Risk zones, if you will, because the closure of even one of these places greatly complicates China's maritime trade.

Given the general instability of the world, China's aspirations are understandable. Here the best example is the Russian Crimea. The most reliable way is along the continent. Ferry crossings are blocked by storms, the bridge, as practice has shown, can be disabled by sabotage or a rocket. Therefore, China is looking not just for a new Silk Road, but for ways to implement a project that will diversify traditional routes.

Therefore, the Silk Road is not just one route. It can be multiple routes. Comfortable and not very, cheap or expensive, but the main thing in them is that they must be safe. What was in the diagram above is one of the options. But China will build more than one such corridor, no matter under what names. The important thing is that they will go to Europe, bypassing all zones of tension.

China has a huge production capacity, and once launched, the system must work. And it will work only when a clear sale is established. Today with sales to Europe, the tension caused by NWO. Therefore, it is quite natural that China will build alternative routes for the transfer of goods to Europe.

After all, Europe is the second largest consumer of Chinese goods after ASEAN. Over $500 billion per year (562 in 2022). There is something to strive for.

And therefore, the PRC will implement its projects in Central Asia, and implement it without Russia, which itself is today a point of tension for China both because of military operations and because of political and economic sanctions. China will definitely not quarrel with its main consumers of goods (EU - 562 billion dollars, USA - 581 billion dollars). And let the goods past Russia. Experts talk about the losses of JSC Russian Railways in the region of 120 billion rubles, judging by theoretical calculations about the capacity of the new railway at the level of 12-15 million tons.

Results


The results are not optimistic. Russia absolutely calmly surrenders Central Asia (conquered with considerable bloodshed and actually built by Russia) to China.

The EAEU is becoming a fiction, since the new C5+China economic bloc has more prospects than the EAEU, which in the current situation is not very interesting to the participants due to the sanctions against Russia.

The CSTO is becoming a fiction as China makes a very "tasty" proposal to organize a new military bloc.

In the future, if Russia is removed from the Silk Road, there will be economic losses.

Today, many "experts" unanimously started talking about the fact that “Moscow and Beijing in this region are not competitors, but partners, both countries are interested in the infrastructural development of the region, the creation of transport corridors and other economic projects in it, therefore many initiatives in Central Asia will be implemented by combining the efforts of Russia and China, for which the region also has geopolitical value.

This, for example, is Yana Leksyutina, a professor at St. Petersburg State University. But there were others who also claimed that "the Russian and the Chinese are brothers forever."

However, for some reason, China did not invite Russia to the military bloc or to the construction of the region. Perhaps they are so strong and confident that they can handle it themselves?
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  1. +59
    23 May 2023 03: 52
    the ingenious policy of Russia, what can I say, I didn’t think what I would see in my old age.
    1. +29
      23 May 2023 04: 59
      Russia continues to surrender one position after another, and there is no end in sight to this process.
      Sad but true ....
      1. +18
        23 May 2023 09: 14
        Quote from Uncle Lee
        Sad but true ....


        The saddest thing is that after the collapse of the USSR, Russia was unable to collect the former fragments of the union and integrate them into the sphere of its interests. All those organizations that we built did not lead to anything: the CIS, the EAEU and the CSTO in the military sphere. For (roughly) 30 years, real work and results were replaced by a beautiful picture in which we are the very best, we are building the EU 2.0, and by the end of 2008, 2014, 2022, no one supported us .... joint economic projects, it turned out not enough to keep our neighbors + steps were not taken to form a single political field / a single currency area / a single defensive union (which would really work) ... everywhere, rather, an imitation of unions.

        And the most interesting thing is that such a single union could really exist (albeit not in the form of the USSR), but as the EU. But we were in no hurry .... for the results, the work of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and other structures, the president did not particularly ask, as I understand it (after all, the main thing is the imitation of work than the result ... in our case it is so). Here is the result.

        Central Asia reoriented itself towards the PRC, even the same Belarus and that began to integrate more into the Chinese zone of influence (in various organizations) ... the former allies of the USSR, from Africa to Latin America, also changed their patron, and in the end we were left alone (if you look in fact).

        But there is a chance to reverse these processes .... provided that the United States begins a full-scale confrontation with China, brings down sanctions of our level and somewhat changes priorities from Russia to China (waiting for Trump :)), then countries oriented towards China may begin to hesitate and look for other neutral centers, and here we may have a chance (provided: the real development of the country, complete or almost complete import substitution, and the development of technology, in all spheres of life) .... if we have that chance ****** * Then that's it for sure.
        1. +10
          23 May 2023 14: 22
          Once upon a time, the ex-President of the United States, Bill Clinton, said: "Economy, fools!"
          Russia has remained like that, a srevoy appendage, a gas station with rockets ... What can she offer her beaten republics in Asia?
        2. +4
          24 May 2023 07: 43
          To the author, for the sake of completeness and perspectives, in addition to presenting the obvious position of Russia and its condition,
          it is necessary to name the reasons for this result and those responsible for this result in the aspect of public administration. Let's put it this way, not just to state the disease and make a diagnosis, but to identify and name its causes, for further successful treatment.
          1. +1
            26 May 2023 21: 10
            Quote from shurshun
            To the author, for the sake of completeness and perspectives, in addition to presenting the obvious position of Russia and its condition,
            it is necessary to name the reasons for this result and those responsible for this result in the aspect of public administration. Let's put it this way, not just to state the disease and make a diagnosis, but to identify and name its causes, for further successful treatment.

            I would answer you for Skomorokhov, I would say: who is to blame and what to do, but I’m afraid I won’t get off with a fine, and I don’t want to pay a fine either. And the underlying causes of what is happening are in the national character. Read what de Custine writes about Russia almost 200 years ago. And then read Kolesnikov's reports from Kommersant about Putin's communication with his subordinates, other presidents, the people, it's interesting!
            1. 0
              27 May 2023 13: 17
              Quote from Igor
              Quote from shurshun
              To the author, for the sake of completeness and perspectives, in addition to presenting the obvious position of Russia and its condition,
              it is necessary to name the reasons for this result and those responsible for this result in the aspect of public administration. Let's put it this way, not just to state the disease and make a diagnosis, but to identify and name its causes, for further successful treatment.

              I would answer you for Skomorokhov, I would say: who is to blame and what to do, but I’m afraid I won’t get off with a fine, and I don’t want to pay a fine either. And the underlying causes of what is happening are in the national character. Read what de Custine writes about Russia almost 200 years ago. And then read Kolesnikov's reports from Kommersant about Putin's communication with his subordinates, other presidents, the people, it's interesting!

              Thank you. You clearly enough answered who is to blame and what to do.
        3. +4
          24 May 2023 19: 02
          Quote: Aleksandr21
          The saddest thing is that after the collapse of the USSR, Russia was unable to collect the former fragments of the union and integrate them into the sphere of its interests.
          - I will modestly remind you what the USSR collected - a ball and the presence of an army on the territory of all of them.
          All...
          I live on the border with Kazakhstan. In 30 km from me in the Kazakh village under the USSR, hard workers received a salary of 30% more ...
          Just because they are not in the RSFSR ...
          The deficit lay there in stores quite accessible - in Moscow they beat each other's faces for Dumas or Agatha Christie or the Strugatskys, and there they lay in slides in bookstores. The same garbage was with food, clothes and other things ...
        4. 0
          26 May 2023 00: 35
          Trump was already waiting for this) The United States is ruled by institutions, not individuals. The arrival of Trump will not fundamentally change anything.
      2. -11
        23 May 2023 09: 36
        All power to the Soviets!

        Quote from Uncle Lee
        Sad but true ...

        Is not a fact. All answers depend on the CBO. Related video:

      3. -2
        23 May 2023 18: 27
        Quote from Uncle Lee
        Sad but true ....

        And if you look from a different angle)))
        That is, to participate in the development and coordination of the development strategy, implement it, develop and build large infrastructure projects.

        For half of the countries listed, the word "strategy" sounds strange to say the least))) For China, the strategy is for decades, and for the rest, from election to election, if there are no revolutions, now take a look at the geography of the route, there are no transport arteries, not at all , if we consider the long-term option and a forced alliance with Russia (Taiwan is a decision of five years, for Xi for sure). Sanctions will be introduced in any way, the sales market must be provided at a level no less than now. And if we remember that the Earth is round, then this route is more distant than through Russia, and it’s easier to negotiate with us)))
        1. +2
          23 May 2023 21: 43
          Some countries think about the consequences not only for themselves, but also for those who come after them. There are countries that think for today, let's say not countries, but rulers. It looks like a lion, or a hyena. He snatched off a piece and threw the rest away. Tomorrow, what tomorrow is, these animals do not understand.
    2. -2
      23 May 2023 05: 28
      Quote: Aerodrome
      the ingenious policy of Russia, what can I say, I didn’t think what I would see in my old age.

      There is nothing unnecessary in the world, when you leave something, there will be another interested person for what is left. China, as they say, has long been "trampling the clearing" in Central Asia, but Europe, Canada and the United States still have their own gesheft in the extraction of hydrocarbons, rare earths and other minerals in this region.

      Regarding the so-called. "schemes of the new Silk Road". How long can this fake be spread? It’s still clear for Ukr @ v, they have been jumping with this route for a week already !!! laughing

      German race car driver Rainer Zietlow intends to set a world record by driving 6 thousand km in 12,3 countries, including Uzbekistan, in 11 days. August 7, 2017.
      "The well-known German auto traveler and race car driver Rainer Zietlow intends to set a world record as part of the New Tiguan - Great Silk Road rally." A meeting with him took place on August 7 at the German Embassy in Tashkent.

      According to the press service of the embassy, ​​Rainer Zitlow plans to overcome 12,3 thousand km along the route of the Great Silk Road from Shanghai to Venice in the following 11 countries: China, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Iran, Turkey, Bulgaria, Serbia, Croatia, Slovenia and Italy. About 1000 km of the route will pass through Uzbekistan."


      The scheme of his route, along the road of the ancient Great Silk Road, is here:
      https://www.gazeta.uz/ru/2017/08/07/rainer-zietlow/
    3. +13
      23 May 2023 05: 38
      I didn’t think that I would see this in old age

      Mde ... You are not alone, I would drink with you without clinking glasses. The mood, of course, is so-so.
      1. +16
        23 May 2023 15: 14
        Quote: Gnefredov
        I didn’t think that I would see this in old age

        Mde ... You are not alone, I would drink with you without clinking glasses. The mood, of course, is so-so.

        Fortunately for Russia, China takes its place and not Türkiye or Europe. What did you hope for, if since 1991 in Russia designers and engineers were kept in a black body and supported artists and journalists for their work to denigrate the communist past of the USSR. And yes, they continue to do so. If Russia and its leadership wants to change something, then it should look at the experience of more successful states. I would advise Putin and Mishustin to learn from the positive experience of the DPRK. There, talented young people are brought out from under the influence of lazy people and hooligans. All capable of advanced learning are sent to the best school in a large city or region, where they are provided with better conditions for work and where hooligans can not scoff at either excellent students or bully teachers. If such a student enters a university, then the state provides him tolerably well. Housing, food, access to literature and instruments, uniforms. In many group photos of Kim Jong-un, after successful tests, he is surrounded not by elderly generals and colonels, but by cheerful young people in military uniforms. Kim Jong-un, unlike Putin, prefers to interact directly with scientists and designers, and not through intermediaries in the form of unfortunate managers, who in Russia are often called effective managers for cutting the state budget. These are graduates of North Korean physics and technical institutes and Moscow Higher Technical School. There are much fewer universities there than in Russia, but there are no less Russian ones at the level of physics and technical institutes.
        1. +3
          23 May 2023 17: 25
          I would advise Putin and Mishustin
          LET'S ... ADVISE ...
        2. +15
          23 May 2023 18: 24
          What did you hope for if since 1991 in Russia designers and engineers were kept in a black body

          Well, thanks, I’m just the same designer and engineer, the institute where I worked was closed as unnecessary (MIEiA, Moscow, Aviatsionny Lane, if anything) and even having lost all hope for the future in my profile, I didn’t emigrate with my family in South Africa - which I was persistently offered in 1989 - so as not to work for the bourgeoisie in my field. So I did so in order not to make my country even worse than it had already done without me. And you know, it worked out, and as a bonus, I got a clear conscience (and not like some of my colleagues who had long given up on Boeing and made a career there) having worked to the limit of what was possible in the industry (until the mid-90s), but with the birth of my second child, it became not at all able and had to leave for "free bread". And about the DPRK ... he was there in 1987, right in his direct specialty (with all his secret and travel restrictions), he helped local specialists localize some of our products (organize production on the spot, as it is called in the old fashioned way). I believe that in many narrow sectors, the DPRK is now noticeably ahead of us. they always treated their "defense industry" with trepidation and did not finance it on a leftover basis, even in the most difficult years for the country. Perhaps now we will have something to learn from them. Well, okay, in the end, thirty years of movement "it is not clear where" also once had to end and our country will have to decide on plans for the future, if it wants to live. In this sense, CBO, although a bitter pill, is definitely beneficial for the patient's health.
          1. +11
            23 May 2023 19: 03
            Not only in defense. Excellent CNC metalworking machines. Medium price and quality segment. Better than Chinese in quality
            1. +2
              23 May 2023 19: 53
              Excellent CNC metalworking machines.

              Wow. Didn't know :) Thank you, interesting!
        3. +4
          23 May 2023 20: 25
          It's nice, of course, to be glad that your place is taken not by the Western world, but by the Eastern one, but what are they hoping for? The fact that he will not offend and threaten much?
          And in such a world, the role of Russia is incomprehensible to me: equality - I do not believe it. I hope ours do not agree to the role of "younger brother", such as Germany, otherwise laughter at its current position in relation to the United States on our part is, to put it mildly, hypocritical.

          PS
          I don’t blame you for anything - China is probably better than the USA (now for sure) and I think you are right that “it’s better”. It's a shame that we have come to such a comparison
          1. +4
            23 May 2023 21: 47
            The Chinese know. The United States, like ancient Rome, still bent. So China will pick up ready-made countries, and again for centuries. But there is a country which is not up to fat to be alive.
    4. -7
      23 May 2023 05: 59
      And what about politics? Purely commerce, how to deliver goods to China to the west? Through Russia does not roll, sanctions! So China is looking for workarounds! True, the "Silk Road" passes through Kurdistan according to the plan ... I think China will decide! Stable Asia, calmer than Russia!
      1. +13
        23 May 2023 06: 38
        Yana Leksyutina has already told us about this. As well as clouds of bloggers "on lure". To dump "politically neutral" billions into Central Asia for China, so that only Russia would be calmer. Yes, you should go to the Foreign Ministry as a press secretary!
      2. +19
        23 May 2023 07: 36
        Quote: Aristarkh Pasechnik
        And what about politics? Pure commerce...

        Yes, and the exchange of Russia's interests for personal cash is apparently purely commerce. And Putin's instruction to ban revision of the results of privatization is nothing more than business. And grain deals, gas supplies on the territory of the "enemy" during the period of hostilities, and here the politics. Here are the results!!! How is it, nothing personal? Rave. All this was already visible in 1993 and 2000. The end of the rope is near.
        1. +1
          24 May 2023 19: 09
          Quote from Mari33
          The end of the rope is near
          -if it is close, then Central Asia has disappeared for us forever.
          Simply due to the fact that in 1918 there was a mess and in 1992 there was a mess, and in both cases for about 7 years ...
          We will be very much not up to them
      3. +7
        23 May 2023 14: 08
        Damansky, is the conflict on the CER also a guarantee of peace? We are in 7th place among China's trading partners, 1st and 2nd - the USA and China. Let's keep quiet about military power. Or again, "a haberdasher and a cardinal - this is strength!"?
        1. +7
          23 May 2023 18: 04
          Quote: Pushkar
          on 1 and 2 - USA and China

          Sorry USA and EU.
      4. +8
        23 May 2023 15: 25
        Quote: Aristarkh Pasechnik
        Purely commerce, how to deliver goods to China to the west?

        The countries of Central Asia need help in the form of scientific and technical advice. They are ready to work with those who offer the best conditions. This is by no means Russia. Recently, Russia was offered to cooperate in the production of drones and their delivery to Russia. It was necessary to buy a glider and a motor group in Asia and equip it with Russian control systems and test in Ukraine the operation of 100kg and 250kg bombs on Ukrainian armored vehicles from the resulting drone .. Representatives of the General Staff did not even bothered to talk without a phone. Surely, during a telephone conversation, the United States listened to him and will now try to close the channel for the delivery of drones to Russia.
      5. +4
        23 May 2023 16: 21
        You may be surprised, but Iraqi Kurdistan is the most stable part of Iraq right now. Moreover, China is increasing investment in this region.
        https://riafan.ru/amp/23946555-prem_er_irakskogo_kurdistana_anonsiroval_ryad_masshtabnih_sovmestnih_proektov_s_kitaem
        Here is a link to a very recent article (moreover, on a resource that is usually extremely anti-Kurdish).
        Even Syrian Kurdistan has unofficial contacts with China. In particular, most of the recently opened hospitals are equipped with Chinese medical equipment.
        So the Chinese do with trade what others cannot do with a machine gun.
    5. +25
      23 May 2023 07: 15
      Russia was not invited either to the military bloc or to the construction site.

      The result of ingenious multi-steps and the successful work of the Foreign Ministry. And this is just the beginning.
      1. +12
        23 May 2023 08: 25
        Russia absolutely calmly surrenders Central Asia (conquered with considerable bloodshed and actually built by Russia) to China.


        —-Russia cannot surrender Central Asia, because you cannot surrender what you do not possess. Since 1991. The influence on this region remains - the earnings of guest workers, family ties, the remnants of linguistic and cultural ties, military influence, practical economic ties.

        —-“…stans” will continue to milk two queens, China's dominance will increase according to economic, military power. And geography.

        —-Russia has several obvious interests: Baikonur and the naval base at Issyk-Kul. Base in Tajikistan, base in Kant. The CSTO Treaty remains in force. Economic interests also play a role, albeit a minor one.

        —-The role and influence of Russia in the region has been continuously decreasing since 91. This is an inevitable process based on the development of national identity, and there is no point in wringing your hands in hysterics. The rest will be that which does not contradict the interests of Russia and each of the “…stans”. Which inevitably change over time, and in response to regional and geopolitical realities.
        1. +8
          23 May 2023 15: 37
          Quote: Mikhail Drabkin
          - Russia has several clear interests: Baikonur and the naval base at Issyk-Kul. Base in Tajikistan, base in Kant.

          Russia's interest in using the industrial and scientific and technical potential of Central Asia. There is a certain interest on the part of Kazakhs, Uzbeks, Tajiks. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the regulatory bodies of Russia stand as a barrier to such interaction. Let's imagine that Kazakhstan will offer Russia to supply its strike and reconnaissance drones. In this case, their equipment with a control system must be carried out on the territory of Russia. However, the customs of the Russian Federation will allow the import into Russia of no more than 1-2 sets of computers with encryption elements, long-range radio communications and an artificial vision system from China. It is easier to organize the production of drone control systems in Afghanistan from scratch than to obtain a permit for development work in Russia.
          1. -1
            23 May 2023 17: 05
            Tajik scientists? This region initially goes as a raw material base and then everything else. The USSR could not pull this region out of the Middle Ages ... do you think China can? Like in 100 years.
            1. 0
              24 May 2023 12: 45
              Quote: 6erJIblu
              Tajik scientists?

              The best woodworking and furniture factory in the CIS is located in Dushanbe, Tajikistan. It is he who wins tenders for equipping mosques in the countries of the Arabian Gulf with carved wooden details and dachas of Russian millionaires with pavilions and interiors painted with carvings in the Russian national style. Russia has lost the traditions of woodworking and is only able to produce boards and slats on foreign machines. An indicator of the scientific achievements of Tajikistan is the last Kyrgyz-Tajik war. Turkey was even afraid or did not have time to fit in with Kyrgyzstan, which is part of the zone of Turkish interests like Azerbaijan or East Turkestan, the Kyrgyz were so quickly defeated and pacified. This also speaks of a more competent use of drones by Tajikistan than they were used by the Russian General Staff.
        2. +3
          23 May 2023 22: 33
          The role and influence of Russia in the region has been continuously decreasing since 91. This is an inevitable process based on the development of national identity, and there is nothing to wring your hands in hysterics.
          - but then why doesn't the "development of national identity" interfere with China's increasing role in the region? Or has development gone in the wrong direction? Or is it over?
      2. +14
        23 May 2023 15: 28
        Quote: Monster_Fat
        The result of ingenious multi-steps and the successful work of the Foreign Ministry.

        The Russian Foreign Ministry was able to effectively and quickly impose sanctions only against the DPRK and strongly supports them. He was not able to organize the sale of petroleum products for rubles, despite the direct instructions of Putin.
      3. +14
        23 May 2023 18: 10
        I also agree that our grandmaster flew in big and the war is only a catalyst for this degradation. And even Potato, to which Vova twisted his arms, will merge if possible
        Thanks to the author, at least in hindsight raised the topic. For me, our journalists prefer not to raise two recent landmark news:
        -Asian cabal from where the Russian Federation was kicked out for the first time in decades became Chinese
        - and no less symbolically, Vladik was given for transshipment of Chinese goods without customs ... silence in the media ... this is the sunset of the Russian Far East
        The future is alarming ... will we still play these braces if the Breadwinner sits until the 36th year?
        1. 0
          24 May 2023 19: 13
          Quote from Sadam2
          less symbolically, Vladik was given for the transshipment of Chinese goods without customs ..
          - Can I have a link?
          1. 0
            24 May 2023 20: 04
            Of course you can
            https://tass.ru/ekonomika/17746719
            1. 0
              24 May 2023 22: 53
              Quote: Russian_Ninja
              Of course you can
              https://tass.ru/ekonomika/17746719
              - as far as I can tell (as a former customs officer with 13 years of experience) - if there is a delivery illegal to us in the Russian Federation instead of exporting to ourselves, then this, as it were, has always been a problem of the Far East. If export and replacement with fake documents on ships without unloading, then this, as it were, is not a special innovation
              If the transshipment is real, then this is money in our budget
              Where did you get this knowingly will it go through customs?
              And so in principle on the railway this thing is not new - import to Orenburg, export back to Kazakhstan and then again import to the Russian Federation in Ozinki
              1. 0
                28 May 2023 13: 00
                Illegality is a separate issue, as for me. It is clear that she will be fined and will not pass customs. But most likely it will hit your pocket - customs duties.
                Maybe this will be something good. But was it really in vain that Vladivostok was closed before that?
    6. +10
      23 May 2023 08: 20
      Quote: Aerodrome
      the ingenious policy of Russia, what can I say, I didn’t think what I would see in my old age.


      Russian politics has nothing to do with this. In our current system, we can only offer various projects for cutting any astronomical sums into any plausible idea. Perhaps in the future Russia will be able to create such projects that the USSR once created in developing countries, well, for this at least new great reformist leaders and progressive parties of the Bolshevik level will be needed. In the current system, we can offer the countries of Central Asia everything that we are creating at home - the eastern cosmodrome, the rearmament of the army and everything else from the current realities of Russia.
    7. +28
      23 May 2023 09: 43
      What do you want from the privatizers, they still seize the old Soviet factories by raiding and go bankrupt and sell them for metal, they export money abroad. Alas, the Russian Federation is a kind of corporation of thieves and bandits who are not able to create anything worthwhile. Norilsk Nickel and other enterprises are registered in the Virgin and Cayman Islands, this is a sign of a failed state. It looks like the Kremlin is also registered offshore.
      It’s scary to look at China as they have developed, huge cities with skyscrapers, solid cyberpunk.


      they have megaprojects, high-speed trains, they landed a lunar rover, the automotive industry, who would have thought in 90 that millions of cars would be made in China?



      China is an economic and technological monster, which is why people are drawn to it, and what can crooks offer? Asia is full of corrupt officials.
      By the way, I myself look after the car JAC J7
      1. +4
        23 May 2023 13: 52
        It’s scary to look at China as they have developed, huge cities with skyscrapers, solid cyberpunk.

        You should at least look for decency how people live in these skyscrapers / anthills before being so inspired.
        In addition, the Chinese work 996. From 9 am to 21 pm 6 days a week.
        Do you want to work like this too? Or is it better on the couch?

        they have megaprojects, high-speed trains, landed a lunar rover, the automotive industry,
        who would have thought in the 90s that China would make cars in the millions?


        Everything is imported there. Machine tools / software / .... For example, at the Huawei factory, all machines are completely imported. The Chinese do not have their own.
        If the West imposes 20 thousand sanctions, then the entire Chinese economy will turn into a pumpkin.

        China is an economic and technological monster,

        1 billion population. Somehow you forgot about it for some reason, and even on imported machines.
        1. +7
          23 May 2023 14: 20
          Would you at least

          don't lie so shamelessly
        2. +3
          23 May 2023 23: 17
          The Chinese are very carefully acquiring technologies (aero, military, auto and TD), it all started with electronics, in the early 90s, electronics made in China were considered crap, now find ones not made by them. Also with the rest, they first buy samples, then a license, and then, having mastered it, they make an analogue, first raw, then the same as the original. The Chinese system of governing the country is much better than the Western one is tuned to the global development of the country.
    8. +17
      23 May 2023 09: 59
      the ingenious policy of Russia, what can I say, I didn’t think what I would see in my old age.

      Politics, like diplomacy, is the art of the possible. There is no economic power - no political tricks and brilliant politicians will help.
    9. +11
      23 May 2023 16: 02
      It's not about politics, but about economics, they started their own without having anything for such a large-scale business. Putin took a chance and so far, by and large, is losing, well, the country is with him.
    10. 0
      26 May 2023 18: 31
      Aerodrome (aerodrome). 23 May 2023 03:52. NEW - "... the brilliant policy of Russia, what can I say, I didn’t think what I would see in my old age ..."

      China is respectful. Зand the debts will be PUNISHED and God forbid they will spoil! He puts his against the wall. and strangers ... It is hardly very tense .. bully
      And what's so surprising. in relation to the Russian Federation - HOW MUCH money was invested in lovers of "wood carving" of the late 80-90s of the USSR. how many of them "swept out of THEIR house and not desirable" were sheltered and given work. And what!? See the reports of the Ministry of Internal Affairs and the FSB of the Russian Federation !!! No. belay feel
      And enjoy reality

      Tajiks demand respect from Russia, Rahmon said right to Putin's face

      “We witnessed the collapse of the Soviet Union with you. As now, we were witnesses to the fact that there was no attention to small republics, small peoples. Traditions and customs were not taken into account. They did not support development. belay

      We are not 100 - 200 million. But we want to be respected. Where did we break something? Didn't say hello somewhere? We have always respected the interests of our main strategic partner.We want to be respected. Are we some kind of alien? We don't need a lot of money lol invest.Vladimir Vladimirovich, pI ask you not to have a policy towards the countries of Central Asia as towards the former Soviet Union", belayRahmon emphasized, adding that he asks Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin to respect Tajikistan.

      Rahmon was offended that not so long ago he asked Russian ministers to attend a forum in the republic, but only deputies came instead. Which in turn offended the Tajiks No. . If earlier only Tokayev allowed barbs in the direction of Putin, now it has come to the point that the Tajiks have already imagined themselves as a superpower am , and not a country that lives on subsidies all its life crying . At first, they were fed by the Soviet government from the subsidy fund, giving them money from the budget of the RSFSR only because they were national minorities, as if as reparations for the era of colonialism, and now from Russian and transfers of migrants from Russia. Not to mention the ethnic cleansing of Russians in the 90s in Tajikistan, maybe we need to respect them for this? Or for migration crime? fool negative

      Real friendship cannot be bought with money. You can buy only a surrogate of friendship. For money, they will "befriend you", "smile", "support the company, etc. But as soon as you stop giving money, or when friendship with you can bring sanctions to the country. You will be betrayed and sold and they will already speak completely different keys. Especially if everyone sees that despite all the spokes in the wheels that Kazakhstan puts under the Russian Federation, the Russian Federation continues to mumble and this despite the fact that all the countries of the EAEU depend on Russia. crying

      The best tool for influencing Tajikistan, Uzbekistan and Kyrgyzstan will be tightening in obtaining citizenship, the visa regime for migrants, up to the threat of closing the borders. good This should work: the governments of the Central Asian republics themselves would like to get rid of the mass of the hungry population, unable to find work in their homeland. Twenty-year-old excited guys may well arrange another coup, but the southern rulers don’t want to am . Wouldn't it be easier to dump the surplus of radical youth somewhere abroad, especially when migrants threaten Russia from within? bully

      In addition, the economies of the countries of Central Asia are unusually dependent on the earnings of migrants. The Russian Federation has a powerful lever in its hands: by intensifying the fight against migration, Russia is able to bring down the economies of several republics at once. In the East, this is understood, but, having become accustomed to the puppet national policy, they do not believe that such a powerful weapon can be used. bully

      For some reason, the Russian Federation equates its pseudo-allies with itself, respects their personal opinion and does not try to pressure or convince anyone. If we take the same Americans, we will see that they always treat their allies from a position from above, bend their line and criticize those who do not agree with them, acting on the principle: "who is not with us is against us." good bully
      The way the CSTO countries treat Russia really hurts the feelings of most citizens of the Russian Federation, it is time to show who is the boss in the house and not be mattresses, otherwise the "partners" will start to wipe their feet about the Russian Federation wassat . We need to be realistic, given past experience, it is unlikely that anything will change in this direction in the near future. good hi
      https://vk.com/wall-195940807_457575
  2. +22
    23 May 2023 04: 14
    Every society has its own idea of ​​wisdom. As General Lebed said: "Stupidity is not the absence of intelligence. It is such a mind." And History judges what kind of mind is better and what kind.

    Our task has always been very heroic and boiled down to the "survival of the people". Country of Heroes! Now we are heroically surviving in the richest country in the world so far among the wonders of technology of the 21st century ....... And it is not known whether we will be able to defeat ourselves in this deadly struggle with our mind, which is the chamber.
  3. 0
    23 May 2023 04: 20
    The daily growth of the population of Uzbekistan is 2000 newborns, 700000 per year. How to feed, provide jobs and decent housing for so many people? There is no escape without Russia! Huge labor market! China has nowhere to give its workers.
    1. +15
      23 May 2023 08: 29
      Quote: andrewkor
      The daily growth of the population of Uzbekistan is 2000 newborns, 700000 per year. How to feed, provide jobs and decent housing for so many people? There is no escape without Russia! Huge labor market! China has nowhere to give its workers.

      In China, the population has already begun to decline, and the salary is 2 times higher than in Russia. Eats all the immigrants and does not notice
      1. +11
        23 May 2023 09: 15
        At the same time, as I think, without the creation of any diasporas and everything "good" associated with this and with one hundred percent assimilation.
      2. +19
        23 May 2023 09: 50
        You have the wrong idea about getting a job in China. Do you think it's like in Russia? I personally had the opportunity to work in China for almost two years in 2012-2013. What I personally went through: you fly to Singapore. There you pass a medical examination and receive a temporary visa to China. Upon arrival in China, you first go through an interview in the employment department, and the most important thing here is that there are no Chinese applicants for this profession and position. This is how they protect their labor market. Then an interview with the police, then you go through a medical examination again and get a medical passport that allows you to find a job. Then just apply for a work visa. Wait two weeks. If everything is fine, then they put a work visa in the passport and you can work. That's it. And that was then. And now, after covid and the introduction of the social rating system, I don’t even know what kind of system there is for the employment of foreigners ....
        1. +13
          23 May 2023 10: 15
          And it is right.""""""""
        2. 0
          24 May 2023 13: 51
          You might think that the Russians dream of waving a broom instead of gasters.
      3. 0
        24 May 2023 12: 56
        Quote: BlackMokona
        In China, the population has already begun to decline, and the salary is 2 times higher than in Russia.

        In China, unemployment is at the level of 15-20% and it tends to rise despite the population decline that began this year. In the PRC, the birth rate among the intelligentsia is declining more rapidly, and this is an alarming trend for the Chinese.
    2. +23
      23 May 2023 09: 11
      that's right, they will work and establish their own rules, including criminal ones, not accepting our culture, but imposing their own ... and they will develop large projects and military blocs with China ... great, yes? it just smells like our success diplomacy and, in general, the course of the country's development ... I put development in quotation marks
    3. +14
      23 May 2023 09: 26
      China has an inverted pyramid, they really need young and able-bodied people. And the whole of Uzbekistan on the scale of China is a trifle. Just for reference, Xi'an has a population of about a third of Uzbekistan, and the entire province is 6 million more than in Uzbekistan.
    4. 0
      26 May 2023 18: 40
      andrewkor (Korchuganov Andrey). 23 May 2023 04:20. NEW - "...The daily increase in the population of Uzbekistan is 2000 newborns, 700000 per year.How to feed, provide jobs and decent housing for so many people? There is no escape without Russia! Huge labor market..."

      And where does Russia and its indigenous peoples. crying As the liberals say - "these are their problems ... And not OURS We have our own families. children and grandchildren. why do we NOT grateful freeloadersNo. ,,,We need to solve our own problems. and not CREATE them YOURSELF ... " good
      Topic work. who under a fixed-term contract and with knowledge of experience under strict control and under the total responsibility of the employer and the country of residence that applied for them. In full responsibility - financial. criminal. moral. good
  4. +9
    23 May 2023 04: 49
    M-yes. ((((I'm reading. It's a shame for the State.
    1. +20
      23 May 2023 06: 42
      Sorry, of course. With all due respect to the greatness and history of Russia, but ask yourself the question "how many of us?". There is a lot of land, a lot of wealth, but people? And then it will be clear why and how all the Thatchers and other Western politicians treated Russia.
      The population is not only mouths and hands, it is also unsurpassed "living supercomputers". Which are like generators of thoughts, ideas, etc. produce scientific, cultural and engineering discoveries and developments. And here is simple arithmetic - the more supercomputers, the more and better the processing goes, which in one way or another affects everything - the economy, the power of the army, science.
      Skill, of course, is also important, otherwise these are empty "supercomputers". But it's liveable. With education in China now everything is very good. Just look up how many universities they have now.
      1. +15
        23 May 2023 07: 00
        The population is not only mouths and hands, it is also unsurpassed "living supercomputers

        You're right. Education and health care must lie at the foundation of the country. There will be this, there will be a future. There can be no future without knowledge and health.
        1. +8
          23 May 2023 18: 43
          In 22, the outflow of scientists from the Russian Federation reached a historical maximum of 70 thousand. They run away faster than institutes graduate ... but we have Uzbek scientists))
      2. +15
        23 May 2023 08: 50
        Quote: Azim77
        With all due respect to the greatness and history of Russia, but ask yourself the question "how many of us?". There is a lot of land, a lot of wealth, but people?


        Canada is a huge northern country. The population is 38 million. According to many indicators of the standard of living, it is the number one country in the world. One of the largest levels of development. For some reason, everything is done in a human way, unlike us. There are no oligarchs who rob the country, there are no state embezzlers who, under patriotic rhetoric, plunder their country and transport their families to live in Europe. There is no in Canada a wise tsar-father beloved by all the people, who alone decides everything for the whole people and who plows around the clock like a galley slave for the sake of the greatness of the country and the well-being of its citizens. There are also no habitual intellectual muzzles of irremovable deputies in parliament, which have been discussing one bill for years.

        How they live in Canada without all this - I still have no idea.
        1. +4
          23 May 2023 09: 54
          There is no father-king in Canada because Canada is ruled by King Charles III, who is also the current British monarch. Canada is a very expensive and backward country, 70% of which (the Canadian north) is practically uninhabited. Bribery and corruption thrive in Canada (take an interest in the history of the mayors of Montreal, Applebaum and others). Only a Ukrainian preparing for emigration can write about the high standard of living in Canada. Canada is full of expats who live the lives of second-class people. And yes, the faces of the Canadian deputies will seem unusual at first. Indeed, everything is human, with one amendment - not for everyone. Just like everywhere else, right?
          1. +18
            23 May 2023 10: 12
            Quote: Olddetractor
            There is no father-king in Canada because Canada is ruled by King Charles III, who is also the current British monarch. Canada is a very expensive and backward country, 70% of which (the Canadian north) is practically uninhabited. Bribery and corruption thrive in Canada (take an interest in the history of the mayors of Montreal, Applebaum and others). Only a Ukrainian preparing for emigration can write about the high standard of living in Canada. Canada is full of expats who live the lives of second-class people. And yes, the faces of the Canadian deputies will seem unusual at first. Indeed, everything is human, with one amendment - not for everyone. Just like everywhere else, right?


            What you wrote here (it’s even hard to call writing) is the fruit of a sick imagination. I have lived in Canada for 7 years and I responsibly declare that everything you wrote here has nothing to do with Canada. I start with nonsense that supposedly Canada is ruled by King Charles III (by the way, does he even rule England himself or not?) And I end with the same nonsense, emigrants are like second-class people there.

            And yes, there is corruption. But if you read what Canadian corruption is and compare it with the corruption of even some petty official in Uryupinsk, you just roll with laughter. Recently, some mayor of Canada was convicted for corruption. It turns out that he used bonus cards of accumulative points from the bank card of a civil servant for himself. This is something like the Pyaterochka card, where some pennies or discount bonuses are dropped onto the card for the purchase of products.
            1. -1
              23 May 2023 10: 45
              I didn't know that I was talking to an immigrant. Didn't mean to offend.
              A commemorative epitaph to Emir Seyid Alim Khan:
              “An emir without a homeland is pathetic and insignificant.
              A beggar who died in his homeland is truly an emir.”
              1. 0
                23 May 2023 13: 57
                Pavel Durov nervously smokes in the corner) Together with the same Brin, for example
            2. +3
              23 May 2023 14: 11
              I lived in Canada for 7 years

              Are you in Canada now? If not, why did you leave?
              And why does Canada have only 38 million people?
              If everything was supposedly super there, then there should be at least 300 million people.
              1. 0
                23 May 2023 22: 40
                If everything was supposedly super there, then there should be at least 300 million people.
                - and there are three hundred of them, even without the Mexicans - enough for the self-sufficient economy of that continent. Because you can't separate Canada from the US.
              2. 0
                24 May 2023 09: 23
                In Canada, by definition, 300 million cannot live, even based on natural and climatic conditions. The effective area of ​​Canada, where the bulk of the country's population lives, is a small part of the total area of ​​the state. No one there is going to settle a large number of people in most of the country.
            3. +1
              24 May 2023 19: 32
              Quote from iran
              And yes, there is corruption. But if you read what Canadian corruption is and compare it with the corruption of even some petty official in Uryupinsk, you just roll with laughter. Recently, some mayor of Canada was convicted for corruption. It turns out that he used bonus cards of accumulative points from the bank card of a civil servant for himself. This is something like the Pyaterochka card, where some pennies or discount bonuses are dropped onto the card for the purchase of products.

              typed in Google "corruption in Canada" and fell down

              "Low enforcement of anti-corruption laws is evident, as seen in the recent case against SNC-Lavalin; a Canadian construction company that allegedly paid $48 million in bribes to Libyan officials and led to the resignation of several members of Prime Minister Justin Trudeau's cabinet."
              and more
              "The Charbonneau Commission was set up in 2011 to investigate corruption in Quebec. The investigation uncovered long-standing and widespread corruption, including "pricing schemes among construction companies bidding with municipal governments", "illegal donations to major political parties in the province from some of the largest engineering firms" and links between the Federation of Labor of Quebec, the Federation of Labor of Quebec (FTQ), the province's largest trade union federation, and organized crime."
              and more
              "In 2015, employees of information technology firm EBR, IBM Canada and Revenu Québec were arrested for fraud, collusion and breach of trust in connection with contracts for computer equipment and services with the provincial government."
              and more
              "The RCMP's own study identified 330 cases of internal corruption between 1995 and 2005. "Inadequate provision of police information was the most common type of corrupt behavior, followed by fraud, abuse of police status, theft and interference with the judicial process"
              and more
              "Canada's previous Liberal government lost its power largely due to the Sponsorgate Scandal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sponsorship_scandal), where advertising agencies close to the Liberal Party were awarded government advertising contracts without competition. , or with a “prepared” competition, and part of the money was then unfastened back to the treasury of the liberal party for election expenses.
              In the province of Quebec, corruption scandals are simply on the agenda; they are mostly related to construction. The industry is controlled by the Italo-Quebec mafia and the cut of budget money here is simply phenomenal (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/scandalpalooza-canadian-edition/article12691571/ ). To console my Russian colleagues, nothing new was invented in the sense of theft in Sochi. During the construction of the Olympic Stadium in Montreal, the mafia drove empty cement trucks through the construction site and repeatedly received payment for the "delivered" cement + salary to dead souls.
              and more
              "Canada dominates World Bank's blacklist of corrupt companies
              Canadian companies dominate global corruption list
              The Huffington Post Canada
              September 18, 2013 12:05 pm ET
              From more than 600 companieswho are currently banned from doing business with the World Bank due to corruption, 117 are Canadian, the most in any single country
              https://www.huffpost.com/archive/ca/entry/world-banks-corrupt-companies-blacklist-dominated-by-canada_n_3948280

              well, no corruption in Canada, no ....
          2. -1
            24 May 2023 13: 03
            Quote: Olddetractor
            Canada is full of expats who live the lives of second-class people.

            My friend moved to Canada. In Russia, he traded in the heat and cold on the counter under a polyethylene canopy for about 10 years. In Canada, after 6 years, he became the owner of a large car dealership selling cars and repairing them. It's hard to call it a second-class life. By the way, I bought myself a wife from Afghanistan in Canada.
            1. +1
              24 May 2023 19: 39
              Quote: gsev
              By the way bought a wife from Afghanistan in Canada.
              -some suddenly for first class people...
              In principle, I know how he became the owner of a car dealership - he just cut the throat of the previous owner ....
              This is the only REAL human option buying wife from Afghanistan
        2. +4
          23 May 2023 10: 05
          How they live in Canada without all this - I still have no idea.

          I explain how. Canada is one of the few countries (Switzerland, Belgium, Norway, and partly Sweden, other countries of "democracies" also have the same system, but it is very limited for various reasons and therefore does not work as efficiently) that managed to organize the influence of voters on those whom they elected through a "vote of confidence" (or "no confidence") system. A year after the election, the elected person reports to the voters what he fulfilled from his promises, or why he did not. Voters have their registration number on a site similar to our "Gosuslugi" express their confidence or not confidence in this deputy. If a certain number of "do not trust" is typed, then the deputy or any elected person will be re-elected ahead of schedule. That's how it works.
          But this is in terms of control over the elect. But the appointed officials in Canada, this is still that song, some will give odds to Russian officials in terms of corruption and lawlessness. In addition, there are very strong bureaucratic costs. In general, Canada is a state with a greatly overestimated quality of life by foreigners. The so-called "native Canadians" live there well, who are not subject to dismissal and have worked out a corporate pension. For those who came and live less than 25 years, it is not very sweet.
          1. 0
            24 May 2023 09: 10
            This system is justified when evaluating the activities of city mayors, but not deputies. As far as I know, this system is advisory, not mandatory. How can, for example, a representative of a party that is in the minority in parliament or municipality fulfill its promises? As far as I understand, in Western countries a deputy is primarily a legislator. And, by the way, in most Western countries it is always emphasized that even a member of parliament elected from a single-mandate district is a representative of the entire nation, and not just his district. And when making decisions, he is not bound by the will of the voters. The only restriction is that they will not vote for the party or deputy next time. If there are bicameral parliaments, then the deputies of the upper chamber defend regional interests there. Although, for example, American senators, although they are elected by the population of the states in the amount of two people, regardless of the size of the population, deal with issues of national importance, and not what we usually call regional politics.
        3. +6
          23 May 2023 14: 06
          Canada is a huge northern country. The population is 38 million. According to many indicators of the standard of living, it is the number one country in the world.

          In Canada, a lot of people die from bad medicine.
          But Canada has found a solution. Euthanasia.

          One of the largest levels of development.

          Name how many technological leaps and breakthroughs Canada has made?
          I don't remember what.
          And why do so many Canadians leave for the US? Hmm...amazing.

          How they live in Canada without all this - I still have no idea.

          It would be interesting if 20 sanctions were imposed on Canada.
          See how they would live there.
          And finally, what if Canada had 140 million people?
          Would the economy have pulled so many people?
          No. And that's why 38 million live there, not 140.
        4. 0
          24 May 2023 09: 27
          That's just the majority of deputies in the Canadian parliament and provincial parliaments, as, by the way, and American congressmen and senators, sit for several terms. There are also dynasties of politicians. And, by the way, a lengthy, sometimes over several convocations, discussions of some bills and reform plans is just such a not-so-good tradition that came to us from the West. The British Parliament is especially famous for this. There, for several years, they can discuss the question of not even how to carry out this or that reform, but the question of its very expediency. Which does not change the fact that sometimes in the USA, Canada, Britain and other countries, some laws that are necessary for the executive branch or large corporations, or when it is urgent to raise the rating of the ruling parties before the elections, on the contrary, are adopted in record time. Everything is dictated by political necessity.
        5. 0
          25 May 2023 18: 05
          In fairness, the Trudeau family could be mentioned in the topic of "irremovability".
      3. +5
        23 May 2023 09: 37
        Quote: Azim77
        Sorry, of course. With all due respect to the greatness and history of Russia, but ask yourself the question "how many of us?".


        To measure success by population .... debatable.

        In the same RSFSR (Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic) there were only 147 million people (in 1989 ... and even less at the time of the formation of the union), and yet we were able to unite other countries and create the USSR (293 million people), although many times more people lived in the West.

        There are also successful examples of small countries with small populations... that have achieved high standards in terms of living standards, education, economy, and so on. (of course, almost all of them are connected with the West, but nevertheless ... you can again return to the example of the RSFSR). So the question is not in the population (although this is very important, especially in our time), but in the management system and those personnel who are at the helm.
        1. +2
          23 May 2023 14: 16
          There are also successful examples of small countries with small populations... that have achieved high standards in terms of living standards, education, economy, and so on. (of course, almost all of them are connected with the West, but nevertheless ... you can again return to the example of the RSFSR).

          High standards are due to the fact that these countries are completely dependent, both technologically and in other ways.

          So it's not a matter of population.

          It is in numbers.
          If there is a goal to build your own country that will not depend on others.
      4. +11
        23 May 2023 15: 46
        There is a lot of land, a lot of wealth, but people?
        It was necessary to try so hard that with the demographics in Russia, kranty, even cash injections do not help. They don’t want to live and breed in Russia. “Here are the conditions, here is the environment” (c)
        1. +3
          24 May 2023 12: 52
          Dk in order for injections to help, they need to be poured where necessary (into their own people, and not into the pockets and foreign banks)
    2. +11
      23 May 2023 09: 16
      Yes, there is no Power now, so, cap. 3rd world country.
  5. +24
    23 May 2023 05: 09
    Over the past 20 years, I have often heard from acquaintances: "if not Putin, then who?" They calmed down. Against the background of this article, territorial concessions over these 20 years, and the situation as a whole.
    1. +18
      23 May 2023 06: 13
      "if not Putin, then who?"
      Who? Who will continue such a "great deed"? Started in Belovezhskaya Pushcha? Who else besides him? laughing They didn’t shoot right away, so it’s better to suffer. So we have been suffering for 32 years. smile
      1. +19
        23 May 2023 07: 10
        Any presumptuous smart guy who overestimates himself and underestimates others will sooner or later be put in his place by an even bigger smart guy.
        Juliana Wilson
      2. +8
        23 May 2023 07: 17
        Like who"? Cat! fellow
        (The text of your comment is too short)...
    2. -1
      24 May 2023 13: 13
      Quote: Foundling
      Over the past 20 years, I have often heard from acquaintances: "if not Putin, then who?" They calmed down.

      Putin, as a politician and leader, has shown himself quite advantageously in the last 2 years. Compare even the first year and a half of the NWO and the first year and a half of the Great Patriotic War under the leadership of I.V. Stalin. The comparison will not be in favor of Stalin. The Germans, according to the diaries of Goebbels, by December 1941 lost only 200 people killed. The losses of the Armed Forces of Ukraine are secret, but they most likely lost more dead by April 000 than the Germans in 2023 months of World War II. Forecasters by June 27 predicted the collapse of the Russian economy and a complete halt of road transport in Russia due to Western sanctions. The predictions did not come true. So far, everything is working out for Putin. Mishustin will apparently be able to successfully replace him and will already interfere in industry, the economy and key international negotiations.
  6. +10
    23 May 2023 05: 14
    There are a lot of fictions, in 32 years. Neither economically nor politically. I would not be surprised if the Union State with Belarus becomes a fiction. According to the NWO, the thought arose, what if this was all started by the West in order to block China's path to the West? Crazy idea, of course. But in the light of this summit ...
    1. +18
      23 May 2023 05: 39
      Quote: parusnik
      Something a lot of fiction, for 32 years.

      What other fiction? Right now, Lavrov will call us all, and our Masha will lose her lezginka at a grain deal.
      1. +4
        23 May 2023 06: 05
        Right now, Lavrov will call us all
        Logically. Is everything going according to plan? And there "..everything will be done in the best possible way. They won't have time to look back, as the checker will jump into the kings!" (C). laughing Multi-way zhezh.
    2. +9
      23 May 2023 09: 04
      about NWO, the thought arose, but what if this was all started by the West in order to block China's paths to the West? Crazy idea. But in the light of this summit ...

      But what if, on the contrary, the NWO was started not by the States, but by China? More precisely how. The Ukrainian conflict itself is definitely produced by the West in order to create a permanent point of tension on the Russian border - that's for sure. And I believe the Kremlin has always understood this, but in view of the general orientation of our economic model and the elite to the West, they could not do anything about it, and, to be honest, they didn’t really want to, preferring to silently agree to a conditional freeze of this conflict. And here the question arises: why, after 8 years of uncontested Minsk agreements, the leadership of the Russian Federation nevertheless set a course for direct confrontation? After all, many understood (remember Naryshkin's reaction at the Security Council) that holding an NVO means deliberately falling into a pre-prepared trap. And yet, not only did we not evade this fate, but rushed to Golgotha, created personally for us, with a zeal worthy of the best imitation. The question is: why do we need it? In the leadership of the country that polls are sitting without exception, some clinical idiots? Don't think. Just do not think that I have a high opinion of the cognitive abilities of our political elite - there are more than enough mediocre leaders, but we must admit another thing - there are no outright suicides there either. But then why, please explain to me, to take this largely adventurous and voluntaristic step?

      So I reasoned until I saw how Chinese diplomacy sits the leaders of the Middle Eastern states at the negotiating table. And here the picture, as they say, has developed.

      What is the main problem of the new silk road? A large number of participants, which is quite difficult to bring to a common denominator and consensus on existing interstate contradictions. Plus, the internal instability of individual state entities. However, all this is somehow solved if China is ready to take on possible risks. And China, as we see also from Roman's article, is ready to take this step. Moreover, China is ready not only to fill everything with money, but also to ensure the direct military security of its investments. However, the Chinese would not be Chinese if they put all their eggs in one basket, leaving their economic well-being at the mercy of such rather unstable and independent partners as the leadership of Iran or Turkey. Thus, the idea of ​​creating an alternative route of the Silk Road project was born, which is necessary to increase the successful functioning of the main branch, as well as to reduce potential pressure on China from the countries participating in this project, which would lose their monopoly position due to the presence of an alternative.

      By the will of fate, only Russia can provide such a backup route.

      In fact, there are a lot of advantages from the transit of a significant part of Chinese goods through the territory of the Russian Federation. Let's start with the fact that paving the way through the territory of the Russian Federation, there is no need to build a complex system of relationships between differently directed subjects of the world political community. Everything is quite simple here. Compare for yourself what is better: to build relations with more than a dozen states, constantly settling their internal squabbles, or to negotiate with just one fairly stable and negotiable player. The choice is obvious. The second undoubted bonus: the high security of this highway, which does not need to be provided by the PLA units and which will be difficult to cut through direct military intervention. Plus, the already existing sufficiently developed transport logistics, which does not need to be created anew (although with the capabilities of the Chinese industry, this is not the biggest problem).

      For the Russian Federation, this project also brings many bonuses: firstly, it allows you to reorient economic flows, reducing dependence on the West, and secondly, in such situations, Russia becomes something like an official looking after Europe on behalf of China. It would seem, everywhere you look solid pluses. But with all these positive aspects, there is one serious minus - thanks to the buffer zone created by the US from the territories of Ukraine and Poland, the Russian Federation has practically no direct access to the European market, which is key for Chinese industry. Apparently, the SVO should have solved this problem, and the Russian leadership apparently received permission for it from its Chinese partners during the Winter Olympic Games in Beijing.

      And here the Chinese made a very big mistake. They believed in the coolness of Mr. President of Russia and the armed forces of the Russian Federation. And it's hard to blame them. After all, just a month before, the Russian army, in the course of a brilliant military operation, successfully approved a Chinese temnik as the leader of Kazakhstan. I believe the Chinese leadership sincerely believed that the Ukrainian elite was waiting for the same thing. That is why China was almost the only state that did not evacuate its embassy from Kyiv at the beginning of the NWO. However, the Chinese greatly overestimated the mental abilities of the senior command staff and the cleanliness of the political elite of the Russian Federation, and also underestimated the ability of Ukrainians to resist and the willingness of the West to support this conflict. As a result, instead of forming a backup sustainable route for the movement of Chinese goods to Europe, China received an intense military conflict on the periphery of this very Europe, which led to a significant reduction in the purchasing power of the citizens of the Schengen zone and to general economic instability, which greatly aggravated the situation of the already unsuccessful really recover from the covid restrictions of the world economic system. That is why China had to urgently build bridges between the leaders of Iran, Syria, Turkey and the AOE.

      In fact, with the Chinese model of the new great silk road, approximately the same thing happened as with the Russian gas export system: after the destruction of the northern streams and the introduction of an embargo on the supply of gas liquefaction equipment, Russia has no choice but to continue to drive gas through the territory of Ukraine, which again became a monopoly in this matter. So China now depends entirely on the benevolence and good neighborly relations between the countries through which it is planned to pass its main trade highway. All this will require from him simply an incredible amount of resources and significant costs, which it is unlikely that he will be able to cover at the expense of the end consumer, because the same Europeans, other things being equal, will simply prefer Chinese handicrafts to their own or American ones. As a result, all the costs will inevitably fall on the shoulders of China itself, which not only does not contribute to attracting additional investment, but also significantly reduces the likelihood that China will be the first to decide on a conflict, because in the event of a naval blockade, which randomly coincides with the chain of color revolutions in Central Asia, which does not allow stopping them all at once, China runs the risk of being left without markets altogether. This means that whether Beijing wants it or not, it is the United States that retains the right to deliver a preventive strike against its main economic opponent in the short term, and not vice versa.
      1. -2
        23 May 2023 09: 44
        The conspiracy is solid. The point is different. The United States is now grabbing Europe in order to have the strength to finish off China
      2. +6
        23 May 2023 11: 48
        Well, at least someone else thought about China.
        China is one of the reasons for NWO!!!
        Amer and China nailed the geyrop with the hands of the Russian Federation.
        Just looking - who benefits from the problems that arose as a result of SVO
        RF - not profitable
        EU - not profitable
        The United States is profitable, since competitors of US goods are being killed and the industry has also begun moving to the United States, oil and gas can be sold at elevated prices in the EU.
        China - there are pluses and minuses ... but competitors in Europe are definitely dying, the Russian market is redirected to China with purchases, while its own industrial development in the Russian Federation is difficult because of the sanctions, and therefore again China starts either supplying goods or equipment. Oil and gas have become cheaper, you can still get an additional discount from the Russian Federation, because where is the Russian Federation going to go !!!! And you can sell your goods in the Russian Federation and at a higher price - where will the Russian Federation go!??!?
        Russia can be said to be on the hook for China !!!
        If China is closed at the same time, then what will the Russian Federation do???? Yes, it will be creepy!!!
        If we have 40% of our trade turnover with China, we will have a disaster.

        So not only the USA are the beneficiaries of the NWO !!!! Here and CHINA warms hands to the fullest!!!!
        Like amers during World War 1, this is how China operates, quietly peacefully selling everything to everyone and entering those markets where it was not there before.
        Nothing personal - current business.

        "Are you guys still shooting????
        1. +1
          23 May 2023 11: 55
          we will have a disaster

          in general, you are right, but there will be no catastrophe ... a catastrophe is when heating is "cut down" at -30, or there is no water supply in a million city for years, or a rocket "flies" into a residential building ... and so - let's go back to the middle of the 20th century , maybe we will learn to live "independently", "with our own mind"!
      3. +8
        23 May 2023 15: 57
        But what if, on the contrary, the NWO was started not by the States, but by China?
        And what? Quite. If you remember, such a cartoon took place, they say, "comrade" Xi, asked the GDP not to start the operation until the Olympics in China are over and ....., the Olympics ended on 20.02.2022/24.02.2022/XNUMX, the NWO began on XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX. "Coincidence? Not I think." (c)
      4. +5
        23 May 2023 17: 04
        Quote: Dante
        And here the question arises: why, after 8 years of uncontested Minsk agreements, the leadership of the Russian Federation nevertheless set a course for direct confrontation?


        Because it was impossible to delay further .... the situation worsened worse than ever, and it began to get out of control, and carried serious risks for the security of the Russian Federation (cleansing of Donbass, and the capture of Crimea), and then (after the loss of Crimea) they could very bad processes start....

        Mistakes were made elsewhere..... Our "wise men" overestimated their capabilities. In addition, the control system turned out to be inefficient. tied to the decisions of one person (V.V. Putin) and he is very slow in making key decisions (in 2014 the story with Donbass and Ukraine could have ended, but they outwitted themselves), + there is a problem of nepotism and clan interests .... when the highest positions are occupied not by effective specialists, but by friends / associates who are not very good in their place. and no one canceled the clans .... maybe due to the development of a consensus between all the elites, and such a slow action is taking place ....

        + and the most important problem ... the system does not recognize errors). As Prigogine said there, in Russia there are 2 realities, one is a TV picture, the other is real, this is it.

        + The West turned out to be very good, in terms of the speed of decision-making and the effectiveness of the management system ...

        + They figured out and outplayed our leadership in many situations. And in our country, unfortunately, it’s not the intellectuals who make decisions, but the athletes .... although there are really smart people in the government (the same Mishustin), and there are real patriots (for example, Prigogine), etc.

        And as for the PRC, this story with the NWO did not give up to them at all. because there were problems with the EU, disagreements began in trade / in the political field, + a united Europe is not very good for the PRC, it is harder to negotiate with it, especially under the control of the Anglo-Saxons .... and so they single-handedly processed the countries of the West, and here such a nuisance .

        Pro-American Ukraine did not give up to them either. Before the NMD, China was the largest trading partner of Ukraine, invested in its economy, etc. (and could well, over time, intercept influence from the United States).

        Of course, from this conflict, they got on well (a weakened Russia is a good prize), but in general they are used to acting differently .... they have a different way of thinking, here are intrigues, behind-the-scenes struggle, recapture of influence, etc. this is their theme. They are quite successful even without all this history (SVO), they are implementing their policy ... and so they had to make adjustments, and implement some processes faster.
    3. +7
      23 May 2023 09: 12
      The new Russia for 32 years has not offered anything for the states in the post-Soviet space

      After all, those who stood at the origins of the new Russia suggested - "take sovereignty as much as you want" and "We don't need to produce anything, we'll sell oil and buy everything"
    4. 0
      24 May 2023 13: 21
      Quote: parusnik
      The CIS is a fiction, the EAEU is a fiction, the CSTO is a fiction, BRICS, in the near future, it will also become a fiction.

      Let's compare the relationship of the independent states that left the USSR with Russia and the former colonies of France and Great Britain with their mother country. Russia managed to find some vector of interaction. The fact that the interaction is bad is not connected with diplomacy, but more with the collapse of science and industry in the USSR through the fault of Nabiullina, Chubais, Gaidar, Chernomyrdin, Yeltsin, Gorbachev.
      1. 0
        26 May 2023 00: 51
        Terrible Gaidar, prime minister in 91-92, ruined everything! And the Monstrous Gorbachev, who had no influence after 91! )))
  7. +1
    23 May 2023 05: 37
    It hurts and hurts, of course. So much effort, so many people put in their time. But let's be optimistic. "Whatever is done is for the better," - so our ancestors used to say. China will scoop up these republics for itself, but it will also ensure order there. Everything is better that non-Americans will sit there. And China will bring discipline. You won't spoil him. Maybe migrants from the Russian Federation will be drawn home, which will also force Russian "businessmen" to chase personnel and raise salaries. Will live!
    1. +13
      23 May 2023 05: 58
      China will scoop up these republics for itself, but it will also ensure order there. Everything is better that non-Americans will sit there.
      Very optimistic! smile What else will we give to China that the Americans do not get? laughing
      1. man
        +8
        23 May 2023 09: 57
        Very optimistic! smile What else can we give to China?
        Our incapable "elite", stupid and unprofessional, for nothing but theft and chatter. Whether the Chinese will be able to re-educate her or our "elite" will bring down China, that's the question. If I were the Chinese, I would not dare to accept it.
    2. +11
      23 May 2023 08: 24
      "Whatever is done is for the better," - so our ancestors used to say. China will rake these republics under itself
      You are like Russia, a generous soul! laughing
    3. +5
      23 May 2023 08: 31
      In order for our businessmen to start chasing after cadres, it is necessary a little, quite a little and a little, this ideology is called.
      Rejecting the Soviet ideology and not inventing a new one, they removed how it is now fashionable to tryndet the vector (the word is smart and beautiful) the vector of development and the running on the rake remains.
      You, madam, should read the history of China and whatever is from their philosophy (there is a fusion of Buddhism, Confucianism, Taoism, Christianity and paganism) is mixed and mixed everything.
      Only order there from one thing there is no concept of democracy at all, this sophistication or twist of minds does not fit in the world awareness that the Hans are that of all the peoples and nationalities of China. There is a clear concept of hu-barbarians and they are completely alien to them. By the way, some people blame the oppression of the Uyghurs by the Chinese, and here again there is no knowledge of the history of China, the bloody fall of the Tang dynasty and the wholesale robberies and murders of the Hans, and even the Sanbi people of the Uyghurs of the Uyghur Khaganate.
      In a word, you won’t spoil the region antiresno.
    4. +12
      23 May 2023 10: 01
      Quote: Egoza
      But let's be optimistic. "Whatever is done is for the better," - so our ancestors used to say.

      You seem to be a teacher by trade. It's people like you who teach our children patience and false optimism. Such "teachers" throw ballots in elections and promote the flawed policy of EdRa. "Everything that is done is all for the better" ... Yeah ... For example, this:
      The vice-president of the Russian Academy of Sciences announced the loss of 50 researchers by the country in five years.
      https://www.interfax.ru/russia/902007
      For the better, the loss of tens of thousands of researchers, in the conditions of the already significant lag of the Russian Federation in science ..?
      Quote: Egoza
      China will rake these republics under itself, but it will also ensure order there ... ... And China will impose discipline. You won't spoil him.

      And this eternal "someone will come / something will happen - it will be better for us in Russia." Either we hope for Trump, then for Erdogan, then for China, then for the winter, then for the Yellowstone volcano ... Political infantilism is twisted to the maximum. Aw, oh yeah. It is strange that you have not called for prayer and fasting yet.
      Quote: Egoza
      Maybe migrants from the Russian Federation will be pulled home

      Or maybe China will squeeze the Central Asians so much that they will pour into Russia in an even larger stream. An example of the Uyghurs in plain sight. In principle, there are more and more Central Asians every year. Despite the fact that China "has not started anything yet."
      Quote: Egoza
      Will live!

      As Victor Stepanovich said "optimistically": "We will live badly, but not for long."
      1. +1
        23 May 2023 14: 24
        The vice-president of the Russian Academy of Sciences announced the loss of 50 researchers by the country in five years.

        Where can they get a job?
        What factories to build?
        Well, you build a plant, make products, and then where to sell these products?
        Here's an example
        Because of the sanctions.
        The volume of optical fiber production in the Russian Federation decreased by 60%.
        Previously sold to a large number of countries, now only 2 countries.
        First, it is necessary to raise the birth rate of the indigenous population, then an internal market will be formed. And if there is no market, then there is nowhere to sell products.
        1. +2
          23 May 2023 14: 38
          Well, I don’t really believe that there is no one to sell products to: are other countries really so poor that they can’t buy fiber optics.
          Yes, and how to raise the birth rate, if then these new people have nowhere to work
          1. +1
            23 May 2023 20: 22
            Well, I don’t really believe that there is no one to sell products to:

            There is, where. Well, you must admit, the domestic market is a support.
        2. +5
          23 May 2023 19: 16
          Quote from stelltok
          What factories to build?

          Why did you immediately remember the factories? The main field of activity of researchers is research institutes and universities. Of course, scientists are also present at enterprises, but compared to the scientific and teaching orientation, there are much fewer of them.
          Quote from stelltok
          Because of the sanctions.

          For "because of the sanctions" say "thank you" to the "great geopoliticians" and other multi-movers. And in general - "sanctions are in our favor," as propagandists and politicians of all stripes and colors claim (or claimed).
          Quote from stelltok
          First, it is necessary to raise the birth rate of the indigenous population, then an internal market will be formed.

          Even the Chinese do not provide for themselves the domestic market. In addition to the internal market, there is also an external market. But to reach it, you need brains and business acumen, which the Ilita did not notice.
        3. 0
          24 May 2023 13: 28
          Quote from stelltok
          Where can they get a job?
          What factories to build?

          I recently got into a society of people inscribed in the state system of science and higher education. I was struck by some kind of fear prevailing among them even to speak on harmless topics. Their children either moved to the West and live there enjoying adventures, or simply study in Russia without making any attempts to create their own production and business and vegetate in positions in a system close to universities in positions near MVTU for 30 rubles a month.
      2. +1
        23 May 2023 15: 55
        The example of the Uighurs, unfortunately, is the memory of the terrible page of the Han nation.
        Just read the materials about the fall of the Tang Dynasty and questions about the Uighurs will disappear.
        1. +1
          24 May 2023 13: 41
          Quote: saigon
          The example of the Uighurs, unfortunately, is the memory of the terrible page of the Han nation.

          It's just that the Chinese have studied the experience of the collapse of the USSR. They succeeded in stifling separatism in the bud in Manchuria, Inner Mongolia, Tibet and East Turkestan. Moreover, the Chinese attached exceptional importance to the fight against separatism, and even somewhere in the 1960s they agreed to cooperate with Israel in the fight against Islamic nationalism and extremism. In Turkey, for example, Russian citizens are prohibited from issuing a residence permit for about a year. But if you have Uyghur roots, then a residence permit will be issued and even the prices for rent will be reduced to the level of low-income Turkish citizens. Moreover, civil servants, having learned that you are a Uyghur, will advise you to consider yourself a purebred Turk and treat you as a born Turk (if you behave like a Turkish patriot in response).
          1. 0
            25 May 2023 15: 05
            It is useless to study the experience of the USSR. It had its own specifics. and the USSR was destroyed not by separatists, but by traitors.
  8. +5
    23 May 2023 05: 37
    China, if it invests money, it must be with some kind of filler. China at the very beginning of the political game does not make a big bet. The main thing for this country is trade. I don’t think that this is detrimental to our country. True, it’s a little disappointing for the missed opportunities. We still have a large state in our subcortex. Although, the further, the more disappointing the forecasts will be.
    1. +5
      23 May 2023 06: 01
      We still have a large state in our subcortex.
      And whatever is in the subcortex, we will cut the borders, to the borders of the Vladimir-Suzdal principality, and the rest, everything is for sale. Yes, and figs with him with a large state. laughing laughing Sarcasm, if that.
    2. +15
      23 May 2023 06: 11
      True, a little sad for the missed opportunities.

      In truth, not much at all. You can’t drag people with imperial thinking endlessly across the floor and keep them without victories. For victories, the next "liards" of individual personalities are not accepted (I don’t understand at all why so much money in one hand, if you still go to the next world without them, so isn’t it better to leave a good memory of yourself, something for the country, people, not for yourself but for everyone). Somehow, everything incredibly dull floats somewhere into the distance, without an idea, while losing its form, enthusiasm and meaning itself. What the fuck is going on :(
      1. +6
        23 May 2023 06: 25
        Quote: Gnefredov
        if you still go to the next world without them, isn’t it better to leave a good memory of yourself, do something for the country, people, not for yourself, but for everyone). Somehow, everything is incredibly dull floating somewhere far away, without an idea, while losing its shape, enthusiasm and meaning itself.

        That's what IDEOLOGY is for! And when "neither fish nor meat" - so who will go for the Russian Federation?
        1. +12
          23 May 2023 06: 36
          That's what IDEOLOGY is for!
          Let there be an ideology for you, wait a minute. They don’t put up a monument to Ilyin in vain. SAM, he reads it .. They will slowly tighten the nuts for the people, and they will give such an ideology, the former honey, it will seem.
        2. +7
          23 May 2023 08: 01
          Quote: Egoza
          That's what IDEOLOGY is for!

          There is an ideology in our country! it is a cult of consumption. In this cult, just like in any religion, with the help of advertising, a person feels shame for not having the advertised goods. laughing who does not go to the Maldives .....
          Quote: Egoza
          And when "neither fish nor meat" - so who will go for the Russian Federation?

          to follow us, we need to know where to go. The history of Mankind, in the existing order of things, is finite. How to make people think at least a couple of generations ahead???
        3. +3
          23 May 2023 08: 35
          That's what IDEOLOGY is for!
          So it is, it is called, Everything is for sale, get rich! Why doesn’t she suit you? Very cute, with a subtext: Work blacks! The sun is still high!
    3. +14
      23 May 2023 07: 36
      ... The main thing for this country is trade. I do not think that this is detrimental to our country ...

      Dear Nikolay Malyugin.
      I do not agree with this statement of yours.
      The first - according to the thesis: "The main thing for this country is trade." For any country, trade with other countries is an important component for economic development. Trade is penetration into the territory of another country: expansion of the sales market for their goods, hence the development of domestic industry, an increase in jobs in production, etc. Remember how, with the help of trade, after the collapse of the USSR, industry was destroyed on the territory of Russia, namely: aviation, machine-tool building, electronics, etc.
      The second - according to the thesis: "I do not think that this is detrimental to our country."
      You are wrong. It's detrimental. Even as detrimental to Russia. With further trade expansion of China, the market for our country in the territories of Asian countries will be limited. And if China invests its resources in the development of the industry of these countries, then this sales market will be completely lost for Russia.
      1. +1
        23 May 2023 08: 55
        What is the market for what we have in SA? Wheat and... And that's all...
        P.S. About s.a. this is a very instructive story for the witnesses of the USSR and adherents of the WTO.
      2. +2
        23 May 2023 10: 02
        Quote: AA17
        And if China invests its resources in the development of the industry of these countries,

        I doubt it .... Kazakhstan is minerals, their extraction will be developed, but otherwise these countries are a brake on China. That's why Xi threw money to bait to attract the top.
  9. The comment was deleted.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  10. -1
    23 May 2023 06: 48
    1. The presence of China on the Silk Road took place up to the Caspian Sea. And the reverse influence of the Turks on China also took place. Up to the loss of China's own independence. There was a long history of both trade and mutual genocide.
    2. Having despised friendship with Russia, the Central Asian bais climbed up to be friends with China. A very slippery policy. They will try to throw the Chinese.
    3. Russia today has no power to control Central Asia.
    The question is do we need it. If we can organize the cultivation of cotton in our country, we do not need the countries of the saxaul belt at all. Although, we can throw a pipe to sell water. Let's take the yuan.

    It seems that Central Asia, in its eastern cunning, has come back to the status of second-class native territories, doomed to be dependent on the powers that be. Only Russia offered them equality. Now their role as vassals of China. Good luck.
    1. +12
      23 May 2023 07: 02
      A country that is not ready to defend its furthest garrison will also surrender its capital. Atyrau is Russian Guryev, Alma-ata is Verny, Ashgabat is Poltoratsk, the market in the city center is still called "Russian".
      1. -7
        23 May 2023 08: 58
        Tell the great Soviet rulers about the distant garrisons, who cut the territories of the new "republics", but rather forget
        1. +13
          23 May 2023 09: 35
          The great Soviet rulers held these territories for 70 years, and began to spread under the "democrats and marketers." In the 90s, Nazarbayev called Gaidar in shock: "Why are you cutting us off with ore and coal?" Answer: "We will sell oil, we will buy the rest, and you are sailing!" Here they sailed away.
          1. -5
            23 May 2023 09: 43
            kept for 70 years because the borders were closed, and now everything is open - the borders are open (including there are no information barriers!), And everyone goes to a "richer rajah", "the market has decided" ... and no fairy tales about a common history and brotherhood of peoples you can’t lure them back (and don’t!)
            1. +11
              23 May 2023 10: 01
              The economy was common - they gave you an example of this. There was a huge aircraft factory in Tashkent, there were a lot of Russians. And the ideology was common and the administrative apparatus.
              1. -8
                23 May 2023 11: 02
                we would need to have "full" Russians in Russia, and Tashkent, sorry, is not interested at all ...
                ps ideology has not stood the test of time, like any house "built on sand"
                1. +6
                  23 May 2023 11: 58
                  This ideology did not survive or a few bribed bosses? Painfully, the director of the CIA boasted of his victory over the "red dragon" in order to rant here about "a house built on sand."
                  1. -8
                    23 May 2023 12: 15
                    As part of the discussion, I will offer two answers:
                    1. alternative reality, we are in the summer of 1991 and in February 2014 at the same time, we are voting - who is for a return to 1991, presses a button and returns to 91 - do you think how many of the population of post-Soviet (!) Countries would vote for a return to the past and attempt number 2 to find "your true future"?
                    2. you can watch cinema of the late 70s - early 80s (but not adaptations of classics, or historical films) - "Courier", "Afonya", "Vacation in September", "Autumn Marathon" - it seems to me that these films are evidence of the impasse of that "ideology" ".
                    1. +4
                      23 May 2023 12: 45
                      you can watch cinema of the late 70s - early 80s (but not adaptations of classics, or historical films) - "Courier", "Afonya", "Vacation in September", "Autumn Marathon" - it seems to me that these films are evidence of the impasse of that "ideology".

                      wassat
                      1) The impasse of the "other ideology" shows even more films.
                      2) None of the films you mentioned show any "dead end of ideology"
                      1. man
                        +4
                        23 May 2023 13: 00
                        The impasse of the "other ideology" shows even more films.
                        It can be said that almost all
                      2. -3
                        23 May 2023 13: 22
                        Dead end of "another ideology"

                        Well, at least write what you are talking about ...
                        "the ideology of consumption" it is simply characteristic of any person ("ON THE WOMB, LOVELY FOR EVERYONE AND THE EVIL LORD"), it doesn’t matter under the Soviet regime he lives or under capitalism - it’s just that under the Soviet regime shoes (from Romania) worth half the average salary could not be changed once a year, and now Chinese consumer goods are possible.
                      3. -1
                        23 May 2023 13: 47
                        "consumption ideology" it is simply characteristic of any person

                        And what do you call the "ideology of consumption", since you have it in all people?
                      4. -3
                        23 May 2023 13: 01
                        Dead End of 'Other Ideology' Shows Even More Films

                        what ideology are you talking about?
                      5. +2
                        23 May 2023 13: 18
                        what ideology are you talking about?

                        Do you want to say that you did not understand that it was about capitalism, after you yourself used the phrase "that ideology" in relation to communism? Yes, to the "argument" that capitalism is not an ideology, you will hear the answer that communism is also not an ideology. But both formations have an ideology, and the other.
                      6. 0
                        23 May 2023 13: 25
                        do not be offended, but this is a primitive reasoning - do you think the ideology is either communism or capitalism? these are just forms of economic organization in society ... and your favorite dialectical materialism is present here and there ... it's just that the capitalists were able to "defeat" the communists due to the imperfection of the person himself
                      7. +3
                        23 May 2023 13: 44
                        and your favorite dialectical materialism is present here and there

                        Philosophy is not identical to ideology, an incomprehensible comparison.
                        do not be offended, but this is a primitive reasoning - do you think the ideology is either communism or capitalism?

                        Well, we're talking about the real world, and not about speculating. In any case, everything rests on the economic organization. Do you have any other options for organizing society in mind in the 20th century?
                    2. +1
                      23 May 2023 17: 42
                      In your fantasies, you are somehow alone. You are still watching the films Afonya and the Autumn Marathon, although they were filmed under the "ideology". What is filmed without "ideology" is impossible to watch. And these films are not about ideology at all, but about restless inhabitants. Do you think that the American layman firmly believes in the "self-evident truths" described by Jefferson? A slave owner, by the way.
                2. +5
                  23 May 2023 16: 05
                  like any house "built on sand"
                  And now, what is the "house" built of? Of granite? And the ideology, reinforced concrete? More precisely, like ancient Roman concrete, which only grows stronger from time to time. Yes? laughing
                  1. -1
                    23 May 2023 16: 17
                    And now from what "house"

                    now we are each in our own hut wink
    2. -2
      23 May 2023 08: 03
      Quote from Kuziming
      If we can organize the cultivation of cotton in our country

      why cotton? back in the late Soviet era, we learned how to synthesize viscose (synthetic cellulose), things from which are much better than things made from cotton.
      1. The comment was deleted.
    3. +8
      23 May 2023 08: 38
      The question is do we need it
      Familiar songs, since the end of the 80s, the Union has not been needed, we feed everyone, we don’t have enough ourselves. There is no Union, have you eaten too much?
  11. -4
    23 May 2023 07: 03
    it would be nice if China "takes" all the SA for itself. together with migrants
    1. +13
      23 May 2023 07: 37
      There is nothing easier than to stop the flow of migrants to Russia, but the "respected people" from the RSPP need them to keep salaries at the level of 20 thousand. But the RSPP does not refuse us.
  12. -1
    23 May 2023 07: 13
    Author.... . Let's start with the fact that that "map" is a cycle route for one athlete, and has nothing to do with the forum.
    Secondly, China is not planning any military blocs. This is a fact to be accepted.
    Thirdly, Passing goods through so many countries is absolutely not profitable. The composition will have to be stopped at each border and each of the countries to pay.

    Well, the last. All these "Silk Roads" bypassing Russia have existed for a couple of decades. But they were never popular. And they will not use it, it is absolutely not profitable. If there will be cargo going there, it will be only because there are not enough ways in Russia. ALL.
  13. +16
    23 May 2023 07: 19
    Yes, China is simply brazenly buying loyalty to itself. Putin and his friends are all worried that their people will live richly. Afraid to spend extra money. We treat children throughout the country, we supply our army. With such money as that of "friends" it is not necessary to build palaces, yachts, but to buy the loyalty of all these Asias with Ukraine together. They have already stolen a hundred generations ahead, so it's time to think about the country, the people. No, it's not enough! Soon all this Asia will move to Moscow and Russia, and China will clean up the territory. For some reason, this Asia does not run to China to earn money, and China is in no hurry to create jobs for them. And Putin, "good soul", and citizenship, and work, and Russians in the NWO, in a meat grinder.
    Therefore, we are not up to these projects. Finish the SVO and restore the LDNR, which they themselves gouged. I won't say anything about Ukraine. Putin has a thin gut, attach it all, and who will allow him!!!
  14. Eug
    +5
    23 May 2023 07: 27
    This is where the essence of the Chinese "partner" comes into play. The question is, what is Central Asia for Russia today? It is clear that Kyrgyzstan is a storehouse of minerals, it is possible to build several interesting energy facilities - perhaps on mutually beneficial (although I doubt, rather for nothing) conditions, and then what? The loss of transit is painful, but not critical .. paradoxical as it may seem, but the United States can help Russia - if China is drawn into the Taiwanese "operation" and especially if it drags on. The Straits of Malacca and Sunda overlap elementarily ...
    1. +5
      23 May 2023 14: 45
      Eh, if only this thought about “intervention from outside” and “getting your own benefit from this intervention” would ever go away. Still, in some matters you need to act on your own.
      Yes, and it’s strange to hear statements “why Russia needs Central Asia”, and then scold Tokayev for cooperation with the United States
  15. +9
    23 May 2023 07: 35
    It is strange that only now they are combed. In general, I think that they are doing the right thing. Our worthless impotents cannot show their character, seriously give dill in the NWO and, in general, engage in industry, science and the economy, but only strongly condemn and show gestures of goodwill. It’s better to let China increase its influence there, because the Americans, the Turks with their Turkic world are now actively approaching Central Asia, and even Macron has frequented those regions (and where else can he go if Wagner shamefully kicked him out of Africa?). And this is extremely unprofitable for us, and even more so for China, because who else needs a potential hot spot at hand. So it's better to let them. Well, our impotent people deserve it. Let Pugachev continue to kiss his hands and twitch at Ilyin's labors in languid evenings, maybe they twitch.
  16. +18
    23 May 2023 07: 54
    Here we must blame ourselves and ask ourselves the question: what can we offer them?. Yes, nothing but cheap energy and the market for their products.

    What can China offer? It offers colossal state-of-the-art infrastructure projects, hydro-irrigation projects, huge logistics hubs, linking nodes of economic opportunity, and much more. Look at YouTube what China is creating in developing countries, jaws just drop. Something similar, maybe not on such a scale, was created in the developing countries of the USSR.

    This is the answer to the question: why the former fraternal countries are fleeing from Russia in two directions - either China or the EU.
    Build Singapore instead of Russia, and then not only Ukraine will return, but half of Europe will want to enter into an alliance with Russia. But so far, in 23 years, they have built such that even the citizens of the country, at the first opportunity, flee to live in other countries.
    1. -4
      23 May 2023 08: 49
      With all due respect to your position - Singapore is a 100% puppet state (we are 98% so far), creating Singapore is the same as returning to 2007 and telling the West "whatever you want, take everything"
      1. +5
        23 May 2023 10: 22
        Quote: Vladimir80
        With all due respect to your position - Singapore is a 100% puppet state (we are 98% so far), creating Singapore is the same as returning to 2007 and telling the West "whatever you want, take everything"


        So Russia is exactly the same puppet state. The people of Russia in this country owns absolutely nothing. VSM is owned by the elite and the oligarchs, who have a home in Europe and America. Even Russia's revenues from energy exports are not managed in Russia.
        1. -1
          23 May 2023 10: 45
          Once again I will explain my opinion (as I see it) - these 2% of independence include a ban on sodom propaganda and some restrictions in juvenile justice ... otherwise we are the same puppets - we have a cult of comfort, imaginary success and material well-being ( "consumerism", "golden calf") ... one of the pluses of Russia should be noted (again for myself) - the ability to do something directly or indirectly for the "neighbor", one's country and remain a person.
        2. +8
          23 May 2023 15: 34
          Do not confuse warm with soft, you turn on the logic) Russia is not a puppet state. A puppet state is a state with low sovereignty, which pursues a policy such as the owner needs. To be more precise, they provide other people's interests to the detriment of their own. Russia, even in the harsh 90s, was not such - 3-4 points out of 10 the country had sovereignty. Yes, everyone drank to please the Americans, but even then
          they had graters with them. Color revolutions are not carried out against puppets and hot spots like Chechnya are not arranged around, as was the case in the 90s, because why in a puppet state overthrow your own puppet regime?)))))
          You are probably confusing the actual puppet state (low sovereignty) with the desire of the elites to live beautifully and not really strain their brains. These are completely different concepts. Our puppet state would be if Navalny came, or other people who suit the United States. Then it would be a puppet, and most likely the Americans would slowly push the country onto the path of a battering ram against China. And so - we just have quite sovereign elites, they promote and protect their interests. It's just that these interests do not really coincide with the interests of the people. Again, to clarify: personal
          The interests of these people are higher than the national interests. But this, sorry, is a completely different story, and has a little less than nothing to do with sovereignty as a whole. Any political scientist with a higher education will explain this to you on the fingers.
          1. +1
            23 May 2023 16: 22
            thanks for the extended opinion!
            if I may ask, as a political scientist with a higher education: what is your opinion, why did it start, what served as a "trigger" (or was the start date known in advance)?
            1. +2
              23 May 2023 17: 23
              I will send you 1 thousand US dollars by transfer if you show me the place where I wrote that a political scientist with a higher education is me =))) I am not a political scientist with a higher education, but I try to listen to those if possible) And in our century high-tech opportunities for this are somewhat greater than even 20 years ago.
          2. -1
            23 May 2023 21: 58
            Quote from termos
            Do not confuse warm with soft, you turn on the logic) Russia is not a puppet state. A puppet state is a state with low sovereignty, which pursues a policy such as the owner needs. To be more precise, they provide other people's interests to the detriment of their own. Russia, even in the harsh 90s, was not such - 3-4 points out of 10 the country had sovereignty. Yes, everyone drank to please the Americans, but even then
            they had graters with them. Color revolutions are not carried out against puppets and hot spots like Chechnya are not arranged around, as was the case in the 90s, because why in a puppet state overthrow your own puppet regime?)))))
            You are probably confusing the actual puppet state (low sovereignty) with the desire of the elites to live beautifully and not really strain their brains. These are completely different concepts. Our puppet state would be if Navalny came, or other people who suit the United States. Then it would be a puppet, and most likely the Americans would slowly push the country onto the path of a battering ram against China. And so - we just have quite sovereign elites, they promote and protect their interests. It's just that these interests do not really coincide with the interests of the people. Again, to clarify: personal
            The interests of these people are higher than the national interests. But this, sorry, is a completely different story, and has a little less than nothing to do with sovereignty as a whole. Any political scientist with a higher education will explain this to you on the fingers.

            So after all, at first there was a color revolution, it was in the sovereign USSR, and only then sovereignty was lost. Chronology of events. And Chechnya. it's just a rip off of the most banded part of the country. The influence of the Freemasons on the creation of the situation with Chechnya is minimal. If at all it was inspired by them initially. It's just that banditry was rolling in a wave throughout the country, as a result of creating a breeding ground for it - the initial accumulation of capital. And yet our so-called elite is being held by the throat with a stranglehold. For "their interests" they can butt heads only on the length of the measured chain. From that, everything is so indistinct, in the alleged confrontation with the West. Having destroyed the real system of confrontation, they automatically found themselves in the global system. And there is only one owner. Their sovereignty is formal, like that of all countries on the planet. Because globalism. Finances and the imposed model of the economy dictate how to equip life, and the Internet does not make it possible to blur the problem. Sooner or later it will explode. And without any bulk, by itself. In the XNUMXth century, it was simpler, drove troublemakers to hard labor, destroyed the printing house, with a left-wing newspaper and plundered the treasury.
      2. The comment was deleted.
      3. 0
        23 May 2023 10: 53
        What is two percent? Dutch merchant flag over the towers? So Singapore, too, seems to have its own fluttering where necessary.
  17. +5
    23 May 2023 08: 05
    As it is bypassing Russia, it is Russia that is going to build the railway in Iran, as it is not correct to write around Russia.
  18. +4
    23 May 2023 08: 09
    every day it gets sadder and sadder... no, I'm not an all-rounder, but doubts about the strength of our state are increasingly penetrating the minds of the citizens of our country. every day our neighbors are moving further and further away from us. Well, let them go, it will be easier for us! Why waste money and effort on those who do not want to be with us? us, or to carry gas to all the towns and villages, you see, the people will reach for the land. And if we have prosperity, the neighbors will crawl on their knees. Is it really not clear up there?
    1. +4
      23 May 2023 08: 37
      you look people will reach for the earth.

      Land can be given away for free, because of something, and we have a lot of this good - more than anyone in terms of per capita - let them just give birth to children and live for the good of their own country. You can do so many things, the whole world would gasp, here you have a national idea.

      UPD. My 1000th comment. Anniversary one :)
      1. +1
        23 May 2023 09: 01
        We just don’t need the land anymore, we still need to prepare the entire infrastructure
    2. +4
      23 May 2023 08: 41
      And if we have prosperity, the neighbors themselves will crawl
      Our wealth, in American banks, and did a lot for this wealth? Is it really ahead of the rest?
      1. +9
        23 May 2023 08: 47
        Our wealth, in American banks

        So this is not our wealth, but theirs. Whose banks will be? Zaozernykh. Well, it means their prosperity, but the fact that, like "ours", they put this money in their banks, well, it's not like ours anymore laughing
        PS Remember how this bastard (but smart bastard) Brzezinski said: “Russia can have as many nuclear briefcases and nuclear buttons as you want, but since 500 billion dollars of the Russian elite are in our banks, you still figure it out: is it your elite or is it already ours? And you're right, you bastard.
  19. +5
    23 May 2023 08: 44
    We lost the Central Asian republics during the collapse of the USSR. Dot. Crying is useless.
    Given the speed with which they returned to the feudal state, trying to bring them back is like running against the escalator. It is possible, but it requires a lot of effort and resources.
    The regions are frankly subsidized, the population is wild, illiterate (judging by guest workers). I won’t give a well-known plate on income / expenses in the USSR, everyone saw it. If China wants to play progressives, which I highly doubt, let them try. Flag in hand.
    If the number of illiterate and uncultured people from Central Asia decreases on the territory of the Russian Federation, I will only be glad.
    1. +3
      23 May 2023 09: 05
      You have very approximate ideas. Type at least a photo of Ashgabat in the search engine. Until recently, gas for the population there was free. Plus about 700 liters of gasoline per family per year. Mortgage 1%. And all this at the expense of gas and cotton. 95% of the territory of Turkmenistan is desert. Huge natural reserves in Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan, where the Americans actively invested. Russia, which does not know where it is sailing, will not have a fair wind.
      1. +3
        23 May 2023 09: 20
        Type at least in the search engine a photo of Ashgabat

        As an option, type in a search engine a photo of Moscow and salaries on hehe.ru. So in Moscow time for 100t.r. per month, a significant number simply "sit out the pants." This is me to the fact that not all of Turkmenistan lives in Ashgabat. The Russian Federation mines like Saudi Arabia, and the population is 4 times larger, plus the climate is such that a significant amount of the cost of heating the "atmosphere" goes up. It's just that behind the mantra "about the richest country" they forgot about the population and the climate in which we live.
        1. +5
          23 May 2023 09: 38
          Oh, that's it - the climate! And the fact that 2/3 of Russian oil and gas revenues end up in the West does not play any role here. There are no oligarchs in Turkmenistan, around whom the whole country dances, and all income goes to the state treasury. And besides oil, there are many other resources in Russia that go exclusively to football clubs in Monaco, yachts with a displacement greater than the Russian Navy, and villas in proxy enemy countries.
          1. 0
            23 May 2023 09: 54
            in turkmenistan "king" (bai), and we all need "democracy", look at the forum - 1000 people and everyone has their own opinion! you ask the population - who is ready to live in poverty but with the "king", or don't understand how - but to be able to present YOUR opinion around?
          2. +2
            23 May 2023 10: 46
            Quote: Boris Sergeev
            2/3 of Russian oil and gas revenues settle in the West

            Interesting figure, where did you get it from? wink

            Quote: Boris Sergeev
            There are no oligarchs in Turkmenistan, around whom the whole country dances, and all income goes to the state treasury

            And who is the owner of the "state treasury" there, do you remember? wink

            Quote: Boris Sergeev
            And besides oil, Russia has many other resources.

            Wait, nab would deal with the oil ... so far you are slurred. Yes

            Quote: Vladimir80
            The Russian Federation mines like Saudi Arabia, and the population is 4 times more

            Not at 4, but at 6:


            Of these, 38+% are non-indigenous, "goods" do not apply to them. Check it out for yourself, what if I'm wrong? wink laughing
            1. +1
              23 May 2023 11: 52
              what if I was wrong?

              Just manipulated, as usual.
              1. +3
                23 May 2023 12: 16
                Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                Just, as usual, manipulated

                Try to refute what

                - in Saudi "oil benefits" are distributed only for indigenous people
                - the indigenous population in Saudi - a little more 60%
                - the number of indigenous people of Saudi Arabia correlates with the population of the Russian Federation approximately as 1:6

                If it works out, you can go further. Unlimited Yes
                1. +1
                  23 May 2023 12: 38
                  Try to refute what

                  Oh really?
                  To refute what is specifically proposed, since it is not something that contains manipulation.
                  Do not judge by yourself, not everyone is so primitive.
                  1. 0
                    23 May 2023 13: 09
                    Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                    Refute what is offered on purpose, as it is not what contains manipulation.

                    Significantly... but extremely incoherent. Is that exactly what you wanted to say? wink

                    Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                    Do not judge by yourself, not everyone is so primitive

                    Good luck. You are our non-primitive. laughing
                    1. -2
                      23 May 2023 13: 24
                      Significantly... but extremely incoherent. Is that exactly what you wanted to say?

                      Just clearly, coherently and exactly what I wanted to say.
                      1. -1
                        23 May 2023 14: 28
                        Quote: A vile skeptic
                        Significantly... but extremely incoherent. Is that exactly what you wanted to say?

                        Just clearly, coherently and exactly what I wanted to say.

                        Um. Let's do the analysis:

                        You were asked to refute 3 simple statements:

                        Quote: Repellent
                        - in Saudi "oil benefits" apply only to the indigenous population
                        - the indigenous population in Saudi - just over 60%
                        - the number of indigenous people of Saudi Arabia correlates with the population of the Russian Federation approximately as 1:6

                        You did not want to refute them, literally:

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        To refute what is specifically proposed, since it is not something that contains manipulation

                        That is, what you are asked to refute - "does not contain manipulation." At the same time, a little higher, you declare the same statements ... manipulation:

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        Just, as usual, manipulated

                        Cool logic, not even female. request
                      2. 0
                        23 May 2023 14: 46
                        That is, what you are asked to refute - "does not contain manipulation." At the same time, a little higher, you declare the same statements ... manipulation:

                        Above, "the same statements" exist within the context, then - outside of it.
                        Therefore, the "parsing" did not work out for you. And it won't work. Don't torture yourself.
                      3. 0
                        23 May 2023 14: 55
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        Above "the same statements" exist within the context, then - outside of it

                        What context? What exactly do you think makes the same statement a manipulation in the first case, and "not a manipulation" in the second? wink
                      4. 0
                        23 May 2023 15: 34
                        What exactly do you think makes the same statement a manipulation in the first case, and "not a manipulation" in the second?

                        The presence or absence of context. This has already been written above.
                        What context?

                        The one that is in any connected text. In this case, the connected text is a chain of messages between "Boris Sergeev", "Vladimir80", "Repellent".
                      5. 0
                        23 May 2023 15: 55
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        What context?

                        The one that is in any connected text. In this case, the connected text is a chain of messages between "Boris Sergeev", "Vladimir80", "Repellent"

                        It's hard to argue with that. good

                        And yet you did not answer the question: what exactly did you see, namely you, our non-primitive, in this "chain of messages", that you declared mine in it, the chain, the message - manipulation?

                        Already curious. Yes laughing
                      6. 0
                        23 May 2023 16: 24
                        Already curious.

                        Do you list everything?
                        Or will it be enough that you left out the uncomfortable message about other income items, except for those that are received from oil revenues? Or the fact that they narrowed the distribution of national wealth to the receipt of "unconditional income" by a certain category of people living in the state?
                      7. +1
                        23 May 2023 17: 12
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        did you bracket out the uncomfortable message about other sources of income, except for those that are received from oil revenues?

                        I continued the thought of comparing the Russian Federation with Saudi, which I began Vladimir80:

                        Quote: Vladimir80
                        The Russian Federation mines like Saudi Arabia, and the population is 4 times larger, plus the climate is such that a significant amount of the cost of heating the "atmosphere" goes up. It's just that behind the mantra "about the richest country" they forgot about the population and the climate in which we live

                        What is in Saudi, what (to a lesser extent) in the Russian Federation, the basis of budget revenues is oil (or oil and gas, as in the Russian Federation). Therefore, talking about "other income" seemed redundant to me. Objections, additions?

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        you ... have narrowed the distribution of national wealth to the receipt of "unconditional income" by a certain category of people living in the state?

                        Stop juggling with your tongue. It was about the distribution of income, and the number of inhabitants, to which this income is supposed to be distributed. So, in Saudi only citizens (indigenous people) have benefits from these incomes. Expats do not have such benefits. As I said, exactly to justify the ratio of the population of Saudi and the Russian Federation:

                        Quote: Repellent
                        Not at 4, but at 6

                        Objections, additions?

                        Where is the manipulation, dear? wink
                      8. +1
                        23 May 2023 18: 10
                        I continued the idea of ​​comparing the Russian Federation with Saudi, which was started by Vladimir80

                        Who showed this undertaking as a reply to Boris Sergeev, to whom you replied in the same message as Vladmimru80. They answered by throwing out an inconvenient message about other income items, except for those received from oil revenues, out of brackets
                        What is in Saudi, what (to a lesser extent) in the Russian Federation, the basis of budget revenues is oil (or oil and gas, as in the Russian Federation). Therefore, talking about "other income" seemed redundant to me. Objections, additions?

                        1) And what is the "basis" of the budget? How much is this in percentage? 75% like the SA for oil, or 40% like the Russian Federation for oil. Are you saying that it seemed to you that the basis of something could be something that takes up less than half of the structure? Well, this is the level, of course.
                        2) And why is it necessary to consider budget income, and not national wealth (or at least national income)? Because it is more convenient to pull an owl on a globe in a specific manipulation?
                        Budget revenue will only show the budgetary policy of the state, which will correlate with how much the state receives less funds that could be used for the development of the country.
                        Stop juggling with your tongue. It was about the distribution of income, and the number of inhabitants, to which this income is supposed to be distributed. So, in Saudi only citizens (indigenous people) have benefits from these incomes. Expats do not have such benefits. As I said, exactly to justify the ratio of the population of Saudi and the Russian Federation:

                        Again decided to consider out of context? Oh well. "These incomes" go not only to cover the benefits of citizens. Or will you tell me that 75% of the budget goes to benefits? wassat
                        Yes, among the "non-indigenous" there are not only poor Pakistanis who cannot utter a word. Lamborghini "to use", for example, for engineers from Russia at the time of work, is not a wonderful miracle.
                        Where is the manipulation, dear?

                        Already written in previous post. You can continue to ignore.
                      9. +1
                        23 May 2023 18: 52
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        They answered by throwing out an uncomfortable message about other income items

                        You are repeating, I have already answered this question.

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        And what is the "basis" of the budget?

                        The basis of the budget is something without which you can ... forget about the budget. Both Saudi and the Russian Federation are similar in this regard - the basis of the budget is oil (and gas in the Russian Federation). This, my friend, is the alphabet ...

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        And why is it necessary to consider budget income, and not national wealth (or at least national income)? Because it is more convenient to pull an owl on a globe in a specific manipulation?

                        No. This is because the benefits that the inhabitants receive (in the same Saudi, here, caught my tongue) are a derivative of the state budget. The national income and - "-- wealth - nervously smoke on the sidelines. This, you see, is not real money, you can’t organize for it ... but at least free medicine ... you can’t organize anything for them at all.

                        And you, my friend, are diligently trying to blur the topic ... avotbuy Yes

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        Lamborghini "to use", for example, for engineers from Russia at the time of work, is not a wonderful miracle

                        About nothing. These are purely corporate jokes. It has nothing to do with government policy. And to "national wealth" - too.

                        Training flight, repeat. Yes
                      10. -1
                        24 May 2023 10: 33
                        You are repeating, I have already answered this question.

                        The answer is what is related to the question. In case you didn't know or forgot.
                        The basis of the budget is something without which you can ... forget about the budget. Both Saudi and the Russian Federation are similar in this regard - the basis of the budget is oil (and gas in the Russian Federation).

                        And therefore, can the difference in the balance of the budget of 25% equate to 60%? Why did you choose to ignore it? But the difference is 4 or 6 - no. As such approach is called, I sounded in the very first message.
                        The national income and - "-- wealth - nervously smoke on the sidelines. This, you see, is not real money, you can’t organize for it ... but at least free medicine ... you can’t organize anything for them at all.

                        lol
                        National income - not real money? Is it true? And I thought it was a sinful thing that this is the source from which the state fills the budget through taxes and fees. And the extent to which the national income is transformed into budgetary funds depends on the policy of the state. Do not agree?
                        National wealth cannot be excluded from consideration. If only because over the centuries of existence, Russia has accumulated much more than the SA, which until the 1950s was a godforsaken area.
                        About nothing. These are purely corporate jokes. It has nothing to do with government policy. And to "national wealth" - too.

                        To national wealth - the most immediate, this conditional Lamborghini, a grain (non-financial asset), which, together with other grains, constitute national wealth.
                        But this car drives on roads that are maintained at the expense of the budget and refueled with gasoline, the cost of which is subsidized from the budget, and the protection of the compound where it will stand is also paid from the budget. And it does not depend on who is driving it, indigenous or not. If an expat does not receive direct income, this does not mean that he costs zero for the budget. Any private trader working with a budget will transfer his expenses for qualified expats to the budget. And insurance, and the same Lamborghini. wink
                      11. 0
                        24 May 2023 23: 05
                        Let's go back a little:

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        did it seem to you that the basis of something could be something that occupies less than half of the structure? Well, it's a level

                        Your skeleton, in terms of mass and volume, is much less than half of your body. That does not prevent him from being the basis of this body. If this skeleton is taken out of you, you will turn into an amoeba. Yes

                        Similarly, the basis of the budget for the Russian Federation is oil and gas revenues. For Saudi - oil. Everything is simple.

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        National income - not real money? Is it true? And I thought it was a sinful thing that this is the source from where the state fills the budget through taxes and fees

                        Once again, the budget is the money that can be spent. For example, for free (for residents) medicine. National income (and national wealth) are numbers on paper that cannot be spent. I already wrote about this, I repeat just in case, suddenly you will understand.

                        So where are the promised "manipulations" anyway? Kind? wink
                      12. -2
                        25 May 2023 09: 59
                        Your skeleton, in terms of mass and volume, is much less than half of your body. That does not prevent him from being the basis of this body. If this skeleton is taken out of you, you will turn into an amoeba.

                        What you wrote is called a false analogy. No manipulation at all, right?
                        Once again, the budget is the money that can be spent. For example, for free (for residents) medicine. National income (and national wealth) are numbers on paper that cannot be spent. I already wrote about this, I repeat just in case, suddenly you will understand.

                        From adding the phrases "once again" to the text, stupidity will not cease to be such. National income (and national wealth, for that matter) are not numbers on paper that cannot be spent. A simple question - where does the state get money for the budget?
                        So where are the promised "manipulations" anyway? Kind?

                        Written three more posts ago. Is it my problem that you decide not to notice them?
                      13. +1
                        25 May 2023 11: 07
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        What you wrote is called a false analogy

                        What you wrote needs proof. We are waiting, sir.

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        National income (and national wealth, for that matter) are not numbers on paper that cannot be spent

                        Why? Can they be spent? Can these numbers be seen anywhere else but on paper?

                        What do you think "national income" is? Explain on your fingers, I'm ... dull laughing

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        Written three more posts ago. Is it my problem that you decide not to notice them?

                        The bullshit is written there. You accused me of manipulation, but you are not able to explain what exactly this manipulation consists of. Conclusion - you, my friend, balabol. Least. request
                      14. -2
                        25 May 2023 11: 33
                        What you wrote needs proof. We are waiting, sir.

                        1) My evidence will not change the fact that you used a false analogy.
                        2) Do I have to prove that 25% of the balance of budgetary funds is occupied in the budget structure not as much as 60% and therefore cannot be excluded from consideration? That is, the fact that 25 is not equal to 60 requires proof? wassat You are definitely original.
                        Why? Can they be spent? Can these numbers be seen anywhere else but on paper?

                        What do you think "national income" is? Explain on your fingers, I ... dull laughing

                        You forgot to answer my question - where does the government get the money from? And one more - then, to what extent the national income is transformed into budgetary funds depends on the policy of the state?
                        The bullshit is written there. You accused me of manipulation, but you are not able to explain what exactly this manipulation consists of.

                        Lie. It was written - ... you thrown out of brackets uncomfortable message about other items of income, except for those that are received from the proceeds of oil? Or what narrowed the distribution of national wealth to the receipt of "unconditional income" by a certain category of people living in the state?
                        What is this if not an explanation of the essence of the logical errors you introduced into the reasoning, which is manipulation?
                      15. -1
                        25 May 2023 11: 59
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        1) My evidence will not change the fact that you used a false analogy.
                        2) To prove to me that ... You are definitely an original

                        Well, sometimes you demand proof of obvious things. wink

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        You forgot to answer my question - where does the state get money for the budget?

                        What does this question have to do with the discussion? And to the fact that the state budget is the source of state spending?

                        Your mention in this context of nat. income and national property - a typical manipulation, a subspecies of "blurring the subject of discussion." There is nothing new under the sun... request

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        What is this if not an explanation the essence of the logical errors you introduced into the reasoning, which is manipulation?

                        It is a your manipulationbased on a free interpretation of the issue under discussion. You have already turned yourself on so much that you don’t remember how the matter began ... I sympathize.

                        Get together, pout, bristle and answer clearly - what is the national income, since it is so dear to you.


                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        National income (and national wealth, for that matter) are not numbers on paper that cannot be spent

                        Mdya what
                      16. 0
                        25 May 2023 13: 49
                        Well, sometimes you demand proof of obvious things.

                        For example?
                        What does this question have to do with the discussion?

                        Immediate.
                        Your mention in this context of nat. income and national property - a typical manipulation, a subspecies of "blurring the subject of discussion." There is nothing new under the sun...

                        This is said by the one who, instead of answering a simple question, interrupts him with other questions in the second message. lol
                        What is directly connected with it cannot be a blurring of the subject of discussion. After all, when it turns out that the national income is preferable when comparing countries in determining the reserve of funds that the state can have to direct to the social sphere, rather than just the budget, then it will become clear that the manipulation is just your selection of the particular from the general.
                        You have already turned yourself on so much that you don’t remember how the matter began ... I sympathize.

                        Thinking for the interlocutor.
                        This is your manipulation, based on a free interpretation of the issue under discussion.

                        How nice, you didn't find anything smarter than remembering "the best defense is an attack" lol
                        what is national income

                        the total value of the primary income of residents of the country.
                        Mdya

                        I just copied what you wrote, adding the particle "not"
                      17. -1
                        25 May 2023 14: 07
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        For example?

                        For example, the fact that the recent "crack" in the Belgorod region has no meaning, except as propaganda. Yes

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        manipulation is just your selection of the particular from the general

                        Chatter. I compared the number of citizens of the SA and the Russian Federation. Ratio 1:6. Yes

                        You take for comparison anything - comparable amount of money for citizens of the Russian Federation, you still do not count. And the source of money for government spending is still the state budget. laughing

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        you have not found anything smarter than remembering about "the best defense is an attack"

                        I'm just tired of your way of constantly distorting. It's indecent, after all, people are around. belay

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        the total value of the primary income of residents of the country

                        (c) Vika. But this is not real money that can be spent. Refute. Yes
                      18. 0
                        25 May 2023 15: 04
                        For example, the fact that the recent "crack" in the Belgorod region has no meaning, except as propaganda.

                        Past the checkout. This is an ambiguous judgment, unlike 25, it is not equal to 60. And the fact that it is ambiguous is confirmed by the fact that you could not substantiate it, as well as refute another version.
                        Chatter. I compared the number of citizens of the SA and the Russian Federation. Ratio 1:6.

                        Oh, again, they forgot about the context in which this comparison appeared. Although previously written
                        Quote: Repellent
                        what exactly did you see ... in this "message chain" that announced my in her, chains, message - manipulation

                        Thereby confirming that you understand that it is not only about one specific paragraph with the attitude of the population of countries.
                        the source of money for government spending is still the state budget.

                        AND? This somehow contradicts the fact that how much money will be in the budget depends on national income and state policy in the field of taxes and fees?
                        I'm just tired of your way of constantly distorting. It's indecent, after all, people are around.

                        Have you come out of puberty?
                        (c) Vika.

                        A hint that I took the definition from Wikipedia? Ah, well, what is it, again past the cash register. It's just not your day.
                        There are claims to the definition, do not agree with it?
                        But this is not real money that can be spent. Refute.

                        1) What a message in a row, but it won’t reach you that I’m not the one with whom you can manipulate. I am not supposed to refute, but you must prove that this is not real money that can be spent. The burden of proof is on the claimant.
                        2) You are trying in vain to replace my thesis that national income is a reserve of funds for the state, from where it draws budgetary funds through a system of taxes and fees, with the thesis that the state does not directly have access to national income. That is why the answers to questions where does the government get the money from? и then, to what extent the national income is transformed into budgetary funds depends on the policy of the state? I can't get it from you.
                      19. 0
                        25 May 2023 16: 15
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        Oh, again, they forgot about the context in which this comparison appeared. Although previously written

                        Not tired yet? Excuse me, I'm patient and persistent:

                        - I compare Saudi and Russia, by the amount of oil produced per capita. Root.
                        - while the ratio possible benefits for indigenous people Saudis are 6 times more than for the population of the Russian Federation.

                        So clearer? wink

                        At the same time, all your tricks with "the state budget is not the state budget", "three sources and three components of the state budget" are out of business.

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        answers to questions from where the state receives money in the budget? and the extent to which the national income is transformed into budgetary funds depends on the policy of the state? I can't get it from you

                        That's right, you won't. Since to the original discussion - you have a question no no relationship.

                        That's something like ... request lol
                      20. +2
                        25 May 2023 16: 56
                        Not tired yet? Excuse me, I'm patient and persistent:

                        This dignity is only in the event that he is also not stupid. A ram or a donkey is also patient and persistent.
                        - I compare Saudi and the Russian Federation, in terms of the amount of oil produced per capita.

                        And why do you compare the SA and the Russian Federation, only on the basis of the amount of oil produced per capita? Such a comparison will not show how much the state can allocate per capita.
                        - at the same time, the ratio of possible benefits for the indigenous population of Saudi is 6 times greater than for the population of the Russian Federation

                        No. The national income per capita in the SA is 46 thousand dollars, in the Russian Federation it is 32 thousand dollars. Therefore, the ratio of POSSIBLE goods is 1,4, not 6.
                        At the same time, all your tricks with "the state budget is not the state budget", "three sources and three components of the state budget" are out of business.

                        Why not in business? Just because you don't like it? Argument lol
                        That's right, you won't. Since the question has nothing to do with the original discussion.

                        Have the most direct.
                        The national income of the SA is 1 billion dollars, of which the budget receives 661 billion dollars, or 257% of the national income.
                        The national income of the Russian Federation is 4 billion dollars, of which the budget receives 680 billion dollars, or 343% of the national income.
                        You definitely dare to say that the funds in the amount of another budget in the Russian Federation have nowhere to spend?
                      21. -2
                        25 May 2023 17: 15
                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        The national income of the SA is 1 billion dollars, of which the budget receives 661 billion dollars, or 257% of the national income.
                        The national income of the Russian Federation is 4 billion dollars, of which the budget receives 680 billion dollars, or 343% of the national income.

                        Interesting numbers. Specify the source, please. Yes
                      22. 0
                        25 May 2023 17: 30
                        Specify the source, please.

                        National income figures from datacommons.org
                        According to the budget of the Russian Federation from pravo.gov.ru
                        According to the CA budget from the exchange portal take-profit.org
            2. -1
              23 May 2023 11: 59
              Insects or pigs are indistinct, in front of which beads are not tossed.

              https://tsargrad-tv.turbopages.org/turbo/tsargrad.tv/s/articles/proval-v-2023-godu-akademik-glazev-o-sekretnom-dokumente-i-dvojnoj-igre-cb_622737
              1. +1
                23 May 2023 12: 12
                Quote: Boris Sergeev
                Insects or pigs are indistinct, in front of which beads are not tossed.

                Well, why are you talking about yourself like that? Everything is simpler - you just decided to hype. Again.

                Quote: Boris Sergeev
                https://tsargrad-tv.turbopages.org/turbo/tsargrad.tv/s/articles/proval-v-2023-godu-akademik-glazev-o-sekretnom-dokumente-i-dvojnoj-igre-cb_622737

                If it's about

                Quote: Boris Sergeev
                2/3 of Russian oil and gas revenues settle in the West

                then you are confused again... Carefullyeuh, meticulousee ... wink
            3. +2
              24 May 2023 11: 17
              Divide 146 million by 38 million. Just a difference of about four times.
              1. -2
                24 May 2023 11: 22
                Divide 146 million by 38 million. Just a difference of about four times.

                He excludes the stateless from 38 million. This will make 6.
    2. +4
      23 May 2023 10: 52
      Quote: Winnie76
      the population is wild, illiterate (judging by guest workers)

      Do you think the most cultured and educated of these countries are coming to us as guest workers? no, my friend, the very ones - as you said .. the rest either do not come to us or they are "badly fed" at home .. I have never heard that an Uzbek from Tashkent came to the construction site, more and more from distant auls ..
  20. BAI
    +12
    23 May 2023 08: 55
    1. China has invested in Central Asia the most. And he does not want to risk assets. They must be protected.
    2. After Stalin's death, China is an opponent of the USSR, and it's good if it's just neutral towards Russia. Therefore, he will not take care of the interests of Russia.
    3. Obviously, we should expect sanctions on goods transported through Russia. Therefore, China urgently needs a way around Russia.
  21. +3
    23 May 2023 09: 04
    Already built a railway through Kazakhstan. And how do trains run? A high-speed train from Ust-Kamenogorsk (I don’t know if the Kazakhs renamed it or not) goes at a speed of 40 km / h. And the new internal lines are already being overhauled. I'm not saying that Russian Railways is a sample, but better than Kazakh Railways
  22. -2
    23 May 2023 09: 04
    In one of the anonymous telegram channels I saw a similar assessment of the summit of China and the states of Central Asia. The meaning of such a message: we urgently make peace with the West, stop the NWO in Ukraine and join the anti-Chinese coalition. The question involuntarily arises: cui prodest? As they said in the old days: on whose mill is the author of the article pouring water?
    1. +2
      23 May 2023 11: 04
      Termination of SVO? If it were possible, they would have stopped and reconciled. The West does not want.
      And the author's mill is the interests of the people of the Russian Federation.
  23. +7
    23 May 2023 09: 10
    This plan actually creates a shorter route to Europe for the Asian countries of the region. There is only one nuance, completely unimportant for them, but important for us - the path lies around Russian territory.
    If we consider the material presented in the article only from one side, then for Russia it seems to look sad, but there is a nuance - the path to Europe passes through 11 countries. Russia is now building its own trade route from China to Europe and this is the well-known Northern Sea Route and it passes through 1 country. There is also a third route from China to Europe and it lies through the Suez Canal, and many have already forgotten about the Somali pirates, who caused a lot of trouble for merchant ships. And now let's sum up, which route is safer and cheaper to transport goods to a merchant from China to Europe, I think it's obvious. But in China they are not fools, and they don’t want to sit down on one route, and therefore they are working out alternatives, here, as they say: “The owner is a gentleman.”, China has extra money, let it invest in Central Asia, these are new jobs, everything is better, how will the British and Americans propagate all sorts of religious extremist movements and cultivate drugs. hi
    1. +9
      23 May 2023 10: 30
      Quote: Gomunkul
      If we consider the material presented in the article only from one side, then for Russia it seems to look sad, but there is a nuance - the path to Europe passes through 11 countries.

      The path outlined in the article is not a transport corridor, but a rally path.
      Famous German auto traveler and race car driver Rainer Zietlow intends to set a world record as part of the New Tiguan - Great Silk Road rally. The meeting with him took place on August 7 at the German Embassy in Tashkent.

      To hell with them, with 11 countries - although there are such nice and friendly neighbors there as Kyrgyzstan with Uzbekistan and Iran with Turkey (and even with a gasket in the form of Kurdistan). But did anyone even look at the physical geography along the route? smile
      1. +5
        23 May 2023 10: 34
        But did anyone even look at the physical geography along the route?
        In the article, the route is laid exactly on the political map, where the entire surface is flat, the message of the article is that Russia is losing Central Asia. smile
        Another nuance is the width of the railway track for all countries participating in this route is different.
    2. +2
      23 May 2023 11: 12
      Quote: Gomunkul
      which route is safer and cheaper to transport goods to a merchant from China to Europe, I think it’s obvious

      naturally obvious .. and this is clearly not the NSR .. if you can still talk about security, although as you rightly said, they forgot (destroyed) about the pirates, then about the benefits of the NSR in front of Suez .. you are probably just unfamiliar with the basics of modern sea freight and logistics .. Do you know how many intermediate ports along the route through Suez? (only super-large 14) how many months of the year is it navigable? (12) In addition, to Hong Kong from Rotterdam, only 10% closer via the NSR, after all ... The NSR is beneficial only for direct flights North China-Northern Europe, which, I think, even 10% of Chinese traffic through Suez do not will be typed..
      1. +3
        23 May 2023 11: 55
        Do you know how many intermediate ports along the route through Suez? (only super-large 14) how many months of the year is it navigable?
        The more routes there are, the better, the fact that there are many ports along the Suez trade route is only because this route has been operating for a very long time, and all the relevant infrastructure has been adjusted to it.
        As they say, it's a matter of time, there will be a safe and profitable route, there will be consumers on it. The task of the government is to make it convenient for everyone.
  24. +5
    23 May 2023 09: 16
    because in Grossen surname with a beak niht clack-clack.
  25. +3
    23 May 2023 09: 53
    So long ago, all the predictors said that after the third world war, which is now underway, the yellow race will rule the world. And no matter how anyone giggles or gloats over it, it's just exactly how it goes! And no one believed in a war game, pot-bellied experts were clever that nothing would happen, and they laughed about China, but it goes exactly as predicted!
  26. -2
    23 May 2023 10: 24
    Let him take the central one, we will be left with the middle one ...
  27. 0
    23 May 2023 10: 46
    What else to expect from them? We've been made too toxic. According to this, as they say in the camp, nothing personal ...
  28. -3
    23 May 2023 11: 24
    Russia keeps afloat as long as Putin remains president, as soon as he retires, a war of oligarchic clans will begin, as a result of which the most powerful regions can separate from Russia. Already, those who long for the second wave of privatization are actively swarming around the Kremlin, and if it happens, new 90s are coming, with the same troubles and rampant impoverishment, rampant crime and the collapse of the economy. Even in the Kremlin there is no unity and a single patriotic impulse, everyone wants to snatch a fatter piece and China sees all this. Why does he need a region with major problems and corruption in power? If the NWO is decided in favor of Russia and on its terms, then something may change, but for now we ourselves will have to get out.
  29. +4
    23 May 2023 12: 46
    The map of the New Silk Road to Bypass Russia - turned out to be a picture of the rally route on a Volkswagen Tiguan assembled in Kaluga in 2017.

    https://shina.guide/press/11423/
  30. +1
    23 May 2023 12: 55
    Pressing the Central Asian bais is easier than ever. Carry out large-scale deportations of "labor" migrants to their homeland, block transfers of funds, conduct a large-scale check on the legality of obtaining citizenship for immigrants from Central Asia, deprive citizenship of those who do not at least slightly correspond to deportation without the right to re-enter.
    Change the entry procedure when only the presence of an invitation from a specific employer will be the basis for entry.
    And when millions of "highly qualified" "specialists" flock to their sunny homelands, and money transfers dry up, the minds of the Central Asian bais will immediately brighten up.
    1. 0
      24 May 2023 14: 01
      Quote: Tank DestroyerSU-100
      Pressing the Central Asian bais is easier than ever. Carry out large-scale deportations of "labor" migrants to their homeland,

      My acquaintances, who have Kyrgyz roots, found through Uzbekistan the opportunity to travel to work in other countries. Last year they went to South Korea (for a working day at 8 o'clock they were able to bring an average of 100 dollars to Moscow by South Korean mail), this year they are going to Morocco. Cheap labor power will not be superfluous both in Europe and in the Arab monarchies. People from Central Asia go to Russia because of the preserved cultural ties, which are becoming weaker. A good Uzbek welder can often more easily earn the same money at home, and not in the Moscow region.
  31. 0
    23 May 2023 12: 57
    Quote from Dekimen
    Russia keeps afloat as long as Putin remains president, as soon as he retires, a war of oligarchic clans will begin, as a result of which the most powerful regions can separate from Russia. Already, those who long for the second wave of privatization are actively swarming around the Kremlin, and if it happens, new 90s are coming, with the same troubles and rampant impoverishment, rampant crime and the collapse of the economy. Even in the Kremlin there is no unity and a single patriotic impulse, everyone wants to snatch a fatter piece and China sees all this. Why does he need a region with major problems and corruption in power? If the NWO is decided in favor of Russia and on its terms, then something may change, but for now we ourselves will have to get out.

    Yeah, and in general, before 2000, Russia did not exist at all, Peter the Great, Catherine the Second, Lenin, Stalin were fictions, there were none, because Russia did not exist.
  32. +3
    23 May 2023 13: 16
    Well, who will put on a brandy that is both lame and thieving and resembles the horse of Ilyusha of Muromets with a characteristic Semitic accent
  33. The comment was deleted.
  34. -2
    23 May 2023 13: 57
    The next everything was gone from Roman, here is a more or less suitable analytics on the topic:

    https://aftershock.news/?q=node/1248002
    1. -2
      23 May 2023 14: 53
      aftershock slipped into propaganda, at least I was banned there six months ago for "uncomfortable questions" by local gurus
      1. +2
        23 May 2023 16: 19
        Most likely for rudeness and the transition to personality
        1. 0
          23 May 2023 16: 46
          Most likely for rudeness and the transition to personality

          nope, just naively appealed to "orthodox bots" (when the same "convenient opinion" is repeated for the rating, the main thing is that the naive reader should upvote)
  35. -1
    23 May 2023 14: 02
    First, we would have looked at how the State Department would have squirmed if their ancestors had guessed at one time to give the Indians national autonomous republics with the right to exit instead of reservations. Secondly, China will not be able to subjugate Central Asia just because the Asians are generally incapable of unions and alliances. Otherwise, they would have united long ago and beat all the oppressors. And thirdly, Central Asian bays do not need Chinese yuan for nothing, even if the yuan becomes the most convertible currency in the world. They only need glass beads and green papers.
    1. -2
      24 May 2023 14: 06
      Quote: Katya_Ivanova
      And thirdly, Central Asian bays do not need Chinese yuan for nothing, even if the yuan becomes the most convertible currency in the world.

      Central Asian politicians and intellectuals have created viable states in their 30s. In the future, they can become a strong competitor to China. The territory and resources make it possible to increase the population of millions to 300. In alliance with Turkey, Pakistan and Iran, these countries can eventually move on to expansion into East Turkestan.
  36. +5
    23 May 2023 14: 04
    Quote: Level 2 Advisor
    naturally obvious .. and this is clearly not the NSR .. if you can still talk about security, although as you rightly said, they forgot (destroyed) about the pirates, then about the benefits of the NSR in front of Suez .. you are probably just unfamiliar with the basics of modern sea freight and logistics .. Do you know how many intermediate ports along the route through Suez? (only super-large 14) how many months of the year is it navigable? (12) In addition, to Hong Kong from Rotterdam, only 10% closer via the NSR, after all ... The NSR is beneficial only for direct flights North China-Northern Europe, which, I think, even 10% of Chinese traffic through Suez do not will be typed..


    All this is true, but there is one thing but ... the route through Suez is simply catastrophically overloaded.
    I remember a recent story when a tanker caused a blockage in the canal, because of which even stock prices for oil went up.
    And I suspect that in such a situation, the Egyptians, if they have not raised the fee for passage through the canal, will raise it in the near future. Well, the laws of business, if demand goes up...
    Alternative ways, diversification - a very necessary thing. In addition, the period of navigation along the NSR will increase due to the notorious "global warming". It is no coincidence that the interest of various powers in the Arctic is growing every year.
  37. -3
    23 May 2023 15: 19
    In Soviet times, China has already helped the United States to bring down the USSR. Now, probably, there is one plus - that the native parasites will fall off from Russia. After all, our rulers still support these parasites, including non-refundable loans. It is necessary to carry out active work to remove the remnants of the Russian-speaking population from these non-states and to sharply limit the admission of migrant workers to Russia. And, God forbid, to conclude any military alliance with China. And evade any military aid to China. Enough to stand on ceremony with dill - it is vital to finish off the dill, and include the territories in Russia as regions. Then deal with the Kazakhs - to return all the Russian lands back. Next in line are the Poles and the Balts.
  38. +1
    23 May 2023 16: 28
    No need to worry so much about Central Asia. Maybe it's better to worry about Siberia, the Far East and Baikal? In the light of our recent achievements, it is not at all clear why China has not yet chopped off this. Most likely uses creeping expansion. And very successfully.
    1. +2
      23 May 2023 18: 23
      Quote: Old Horseradish
      No need to worry so much about Central Asia. Maybe it's better to worry about Siberia, the Far East and Baikal? In the light of our recent achievements, it is not at all clear why China has not yet chopped off this. Most likely uses creeping expansion. And very successfully.

      First, because the Chinese do not like the cold. They don’t live much in their own north of China, especially since they won’t live in Siberia, even if they are invited. Secondly, even if the Chinese suddenly want to chop off something from us, the Americans will never allow it. They also want to control Siberia.
  39. +2
    23 May 2023 16: 53
    Decent article. And the truth is written. Everything is at a glance, we are surrendering everything that was ours and our sphere of influence. It is sad..
  40. +1
    23 May 2023 17: 01
    We won't be able to keep it without China. Everything will go to the British and the Turks. So thank him.
  41. +3
    23 May 2023 17: 28
    In fact, the Chinese leader Xi Jinping, openly offered the former Soviet republics that are members of the EAEU, the CSTO and other letter combinations, a real military bloc.

    Military alliance of China, Kazakhstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgyzstan and Uzbekistan.


    The fact that Central Asia goes under China was clear a few years ago, the only benefit from this union for Russia is to agree with China on the return to Russia of the northern regions of Kazakhstan cut off from Russia during the formation of the Kazakh SSR
  42. +3
    23 May 2023 17: 52
    I watch videos from the Chinese channel (I subscribed because of the best military correspondent 2022 Maslak). I have long understood that they attract Central Asia. Their propaganda works. The main thing is pouring money and money into our neighbors. RF doesn't work that way.
    In the short term, this is better for us than the influence of Turkey or the West. In the long run, this is a minus.
    A few years ago I was driving with an elderly Uzbek woman in a car. We talked, she came to us in Siberia, to see relatives. According to her, all smart and promising young people left for China, the salary and prospects are good. Only those who have strong family ties or "losers" come to us, to Russia.
  43. -1
    23 May 2023 20: 37
    It will be hard for China, they practically didn’t participate in any conflicts, they imposed a few sanctions, and look what happened, they didn’t yell at the whole world - this is a fact ... it was a heavy blow for China ... Even now nothing will happen to Taiwan , they won’t do anything ... They have heard enough of Chinese warnings ... and there will be a lot of weapons there! And they won't play war, that's 100%. And if something happens to Comrade Xi, then the division of China will begin ... and this is the curtain.
    1. -1
      24 May 2023 14: 12
      Quote from: Neluyd
      It will be difficult for China, they practically did not participate in any conflicts

      China in the 20th century was at war with almost all of its neighbors. in 1950-1953, hundreds of thousands of Chinese soldiers fought against the Americans in Korea. Generals from the PRC in that war also led the battles in Vietnam in 1979 and then demonstrated knowledge of modern tactics. Damansky in 1969, the Chinese were able to capture and hold under massive shelling. In 2014-2015, Chinese special forces successfully fought in Myanmar. Then the PRC managed to defend the rights of the Chinese minority in this country. And then the pro-American government was overthrown in Myanmar. By the way, then Russia supplied about 20 drones to correct the work of the Burmese artillery on the Chinese and not Strelkov to defend Slavyansk.
  44. +2
    23 May 2023 21: 33
    In Russia, the president is too cautious and unhurried, without a specific instruction from which not a single serious issue is resolved. Here is Medvedev, a member of the Security Council, a former president, but he plays the role of Zhirinovsky, who at most led the second or third party faction in terms of the number of seats in the Duma. That is, in fact, it does not solve anything, but only voices someone's "secret" thoughts.
    1. +2
      24 May 2023 00: 08
      does not solve anything, but only voices someone's thoughts

      if so, otherwise this is 100% populism - formidable phrases that will appeal to the nearby potential electorate
  45. +3
    23 May 2023 21: 41
    30 years, and especially the last 20 - down the drain. As a result of the actions of the "brilliant" Russian "giants of thought".
  46. +3
    23 May 2023 22: 10
    For our country, the situation in international relations in the spheres of politics and economics is "organically" developing not along the path that was declared or was desired. This is a natural consequence of internal system problems ...
  47. +2
    24 May 2023 06: 46
    In the "one belt" initially there were several routes and the one described in the article was immediately past the Russian Federation. Why didn't it bother you 5 years ago?
  48. 0
    24 May 2023 09: 04
    It is possible that ours themselves abandoned the block with China, and also broke the insane price for railway transportation through the territory of the Russian Federation.
    1. -1
      24 May 2023 14: 28
      Quote from Beaver.
      It is possible that ours themselves abandoned the block with China,

      And so it was. Chinese firms were ready in 2014 to invest fabulous funds in Russia. Only one of the firms allocated exactly 1 billion yuan for these purposes. But Russia ignored its products. The Russian mining complex began to buy Chinese frequency converters only at the end of 2023, when Schneider completely sold out the stocks of frequency converters brought to Russia in anticipation of the aggravation of the conflict in Ukraine. Prior to this, the leadership categorically forbade the use of Chinese technology.
  49. -1
    24 May 2023 11: 09
    If everything is presented in a minor key, it will look minor. No, I do not argue, for national pride these are not very pleasant facts by ear (if you do not understand them carefully) ... BUT!
    This is from which side the results are not optimistic (according to the author)? Let's take a look:

    The EAEU is becoming a fiction, since the new C5+China economic bloc has more prospects than the EAEU, which in the current situation is not very interesting to the participants due to the sanctions against Russia.

    The EAEU was dead. Russia alone bore all the burden of expenses and alone turned the gears of this completely incapable mechanism.

    The CSTO is becoming a fiction as China makes a very "tasty" proposal to organize a new military bloc.

    Yes, and thank God! It was a one-way road anyway! Russia, within the framework of this alliance, solved the problems of everyone with its Armed Forces - and none of the other CSTO members came and will not come to help Russia by military force. Belarus provides good paramilitaristic assistance - but so it does not go anywhere, but remains with us.
    It will no longer be necessary to worry about the fact that the conditional Tokayev is threatened by a lantern on the main square. There he is dear!
    Moreover, if China settles there with a military bloc, then Russia's underbelly will be protected from the Anglo-Saxons, who are our open and fierce enemies, unlike China. Yes, China does only what is beneficial to it - but this is not at all the fact that the Anglo-Saxons are doing everything just to destroy Russia! Yes, Russia's influence in the south will be somewhat lost ... but some dependence on China is orders of magnitude better than the undisguised life danger from the Anglo-Saxons !!!

    However, for some reason, China did not invite Russia to the military bloc or to the construction of the region. Perhaps they are so strong and confident that they can handle it themselves?


    Please note that Kazakhstan is also NOT in the list of participants in the new Silk Road. But Kazakhstan for China is the MOST important and tasty morsel in all of Central Asia. But he was also not invited to the construction site. Oops...
    Do you know why? Because the path is built in the way that is as short and cheap as possible! The author categorically stated: "about new steps in the construction of a railway to bypass Russia ..." But what kind of detour nafig ??? A detour is always a detour and extra kilometers. Yes, just look at the map: a detour is, just, through Russia. It would be through us that a non-figuring hook would turn out!
    Now, if the Chinese wanted to build a road to Northern Europe, they would do it through us. Because it would be shorter and cheaper already through Russia. And neither Uzbeks nor Tajiks would be called. But they are not going to build roads to the north yet.

    In general, do not look for a conspiracy where there is none! Everyone builds in the way that is more profitable and shorter for him. China with Tajiks and other Turkmens are building a continental Silk Road without Russia and Kazakhstan. The Turkmens are building gas pipelines with Kazakhstan and China - without the Kyrgyz and Tajiks. Russia and China are building gas pipelines without Kazakhstan and others .... and the Ice Silk Road (as the Chinese call the NSR) Russia is building one more thing: without Uzbeks, and without Tajiks, and without China. But the author doesn't think that this is a conspiracy against Comrade Xi, does he? laughing
    1. -1
      24 May 2023 14: 32
      Quote: Peter_Koldunov
      But Kazakhstan for China is the MOST important and tasty morsel in all of Central Asia.

      Kazakhstan does not have an overabundance of population. The Kazakhs have some interest in their diaspora in East Turkestan and strongly sympathize with the Uighurs. At one time, Ospan-batyr was the most stubborn opponent of the establishment of communist power in Northwestern China. China is also waiting for Kazakhstan to transfer the Trans-Ili region to it.
      1. 0
        24 May 2023 22: 38
        Ospan Batyr was the most stubborn opponent of the establishment of communist power in Northwest China.

        Ospan-Batyr fell for promises and tried to build an independent state on the territory of Xinjiang. Mao didn't like it. And he agreed to merge the East Turkestan Republic.
  50. +3
    24 May 2023 11: 19
    The people are discussing the German traveler's cycle route with such enthusiasm.)
  51. -1
    24 May 2023 14: 06
    Let them build. If Russia survives the war poorly, the Silk Road bypass will no longer be a problem. And if the empire is suddenly revived, then the same Kyrgyzstan can be taken over and cunning China will wash itself away. How it is now washing with Taiwan.
  52. The comment was deleted.
    1. -1
      25 May 2023 06: 34
      Quote: Katya_Ivanova
      It is a sin to laugh at sick people. China can't even take Taiwan for itself. What does Central Asia look like to him?
  53. 0
    24 May 2023 19: 12
    If anything comrade. Xi has “got it”, then building parallel routes for the supply of resources and goods, outside the control of the United States, while the tools for “expropriating” standard sea routes are being built up. The Chinese fleet is not so much about Taiwan as it is about the future. Otherwise... why take on the role of a “camel”? They have two textbook examples - the USSR and the USA. An intelligent “person” usually has his own path - following the example of his “ancestors”, taking into account their mistakes and advantages.
  54. -1
    24 May 2023 21: 15
    What were we waiting for...

    In the early 70s, the immortal comrade. Kissinger offered China dollars (investments) and access to Western markets (technology) in exchange for anti-USSR. We know what happened to the USSR, which invested billions of money, technology and resources in China...

    After 50 years... China was offered the opportunity to eat up Central Asia, into which, again, the Soviet Russian Federation and post-Soviet Russia invested, built, trained, etc., etc.

    An indicator of such an agreement will be the reaction of the United States and the West.
    If there is no real answer, then it is very alarming

    So soon Siberia and the Far East will offer China to eat for being anti-Russian
  55. The comment was deleted.
  56. -3
    24 May 2023 22: 52
    There were so many analysts that now we and China will bring down Western hegemony and begin to divide the world (mind you, we have two-thirds). But in fact, the Chinese began by squeezing out our already ephemeral sphere of influence. This is very reminiscent of the confrontation between the USA and Britain after WWII. The decrepit empire could have resisted the young strong predator for a long time, but, being drawn into an unsuccessful war, it found itself in his complete power. Now China has a very tight grip on us by the... well, by the neck. In a couple of months, without much effort, he can simply collapse everything on us. And, realizing this, the Chinese will demand (and receive) more and more concessions.
    1. -1
      24 May 2023 23: 11
      Quote: Yaroslav Tekkel
      Now China has a very tight grip on us by the... well, by the neck. In a couple of months, without much effort, he can simply collapse everything for us. And, realizing this, the Chinese will demand (and receive) more and more concessions.

      And what? Just then Western hegemony will collapse, because they will no longer be able to compete with China, which receives everything from us for almost nothing. Isn't that what we want?
  57. -1
    24 May 2023 23: 10
    Quote: gsev
    Kazakhstan does not have an overabundance of population

    has grown by a third over the past 20 years...
    but this is of course nonsense compared to its neighbors, in which. DOUBLE
    That is why there are crowds of migrant workers, and in Kazakhia there is only unrest and unrest

    Malthusian theories are true...
  58. -1
    25 May 2023 07: 10
    Prices in Russian Railways. This is robbery. Well, on the other hand, why should a monopolist think about anyone? Moreover, the office is already Nikonor. Maybachs and mansions need to be maintained. Somehow I had to see the car park of Russian Railways executives.
  59. The comment was deleted.
  60. 0
    25 May 2023 19: 04
    Shall we take it all back? Shall we invest a lot more money in Central Asia, even though we don’t have enough ourselves? Let them try to live near China, let them understand what it is... But at the moment we are not capable of investing in other economies, due to various objective reasons

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