Ukraine, "Pershing-3" and a disarming strike

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Ukraine, "Pershing-3" and a disarming strike

So, regular statements by Washington on the topic “we do not plan to destroy Russia” appear regularly. To a very large extent, this is an absentee discussion with Putin's statements about the "lethal" threat that will be created for Russia if American medium-range and short-range missiles are deployed in Ukraine.

The paradox is that inside Russia the president's theses were carefully ignored both by regular propagandists and by the whole horde of "experts" existing in symbiosis with them. What is more here: outright illiteracy or direct sabotage is a separate issue.



At the same time, the rare appearance of “rocket” theses in the media instantly drowns in the tantrums of jingoistic patriots.

Meanwhile, the issue was raised in the year before last. Putin, June 2021: “If Ukraine joins NATO, then the flight time of missiles from Kharkov or Dnepr to Moscow will be reduced to 7-10 minutes. If Russia deployed missiles on the southern border of Canada or the northern border of Mexico, how would the US react to this?

In the most detailed form, the problem was voiced on February 21 last year.

“Finally, after the United States broke the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty, the Pentagon is already openly developing a whole range of ground-based strike weapons, including ballistic missiles capable of reaching targets at a distance of up to 5,5 thousand kilometers. If such systems are deployed in Ukraine, they will be able to hit objects throughout the European territory of Russia, as well as beyond the Urals. The flight time to Moscow for Tomahawk cruise missiles will be less than 35 minutes, ballistic missiles from the Kharkov area - 7-8 minutes, and hypersonic strike weapons - 4-5 minutes. This is called, directly "knife to the throat." And they, no doubt, expect to realize these plans.

In other words, we are talking about the threat of a disarming and decapitating strike. The purpose of which is to destroy the main part of the enemy's nuclear potential before he has time to react.

Naturally, it is impossible to guarantee 100% effectiveness of a disarming strike. That is why the offensive component must be supplemented by a "defensive" missile defense system. The quotes here are not random.

The creation of a disarming strike capability and the development of a “finishing” missile defense system are tightly interconnected “elements”. So, until recently, quite a standard thesis of Western propaganda was the statement that missile defense was not capable of repelling a massive strike, and therefore was allegedly not directed against Russia.

Indeed, the creation of a missile defense system capable of intercepting a full salvo of strategic missiles is almost unrealistic. However, the picture changes dramatically if 80-90% of the enemy's missile potential is destroyed before launch.

Restrictions on missile defense were introduced precisely because in a situation of a preventive strike, a much more compact version than is necessary for a total interception can play a decisive role - and this was a powerful destabilizing factor.

Finally, it should be borne in mind that 100% interception of "remnants" is not an imperative goal in reality. nuclear efficiency weapons extremely far from fantastic mass representations; at the same time, the stories of the Western elite about the infinite value for them of the life of any subject are worth practically nothing.

Actually, the deployment of "preventive" systems automatically assumes that an impressive number of Americans and a huge number of Europeans have already been written off as acceptable losses. Simply because the West has no non-coercive options for maintaining dominance.

Pershing - Second Edition


Let's take a closer look at the current US efforts.

So, Washington announced its intention to withdraw from the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty (INF Treaty) in November 2017 - that is, less than a month after the successful testing of the prototype "long-range hypersonic weapon" (LRHW).
The "experimental phase" of the LRHW is considered to be the army's AHW program (tests in 2011 and 2014).

The declared range of the LRHW is over 1 ​​miles (725 km). Tests in 2 were carried out at a distance of more than 775 thousand nautical miles. The “carrier” of the missile is a modified M2017 semi-trailer of the Patriot air defense system with two containers.

The naval version of the program using the same C-HGB hypersonic unit is the CPS program. The new missiles are to be part of the arsenal of Virginia Block V multi-purpose submarines equipped with an additional VPM (Virginia Payload Module) payload module with 28 vertical launchers. Also, Zumwalt destroyers are considered as carriers.

At the same time, initially naval RSDs, work on which began at the beginning of the 3s, were considered as an option for arming strategic submarines, including those converted into cruise missile carriers (4-XNUMX RSDs in each Trident mine). It is very likely that such a "conversion" is possible for CPS as well.

In parallel, DARPA is developing a promising RSD Operational Fires (OpFires). The range is estimated at 1–600 km. At the same time, we are talking about a project that is very indicative in terms of basing flexibility and the possibility of overcoming missile defense, a project that deserves separate consideration.

repeats and story with the "landing" of cruise missiles on the model of the ground-based "Tomahawks" of the 80s ("Griffin"). On December 3, 2022, the US Army announced the receipt of the first experimental battery of the Mid-Range Capability (MRC) ground-based missile system, aka Typhon. We are talking about a mobile system using a quad navy vertical launcher Mk. 41 for all the same "Tomahawks" plus anti-aircraft missiles SM-6 (for ground targets).

Short-range missiles have traditionally been in the shadow of IRMs, but the changes planned here are also extremely remarkable. Let me remind you that in the American case, tactical missiles act as an alternative equipment for conventional MLRS. HIMARS carries one MIM-140 ATACMS missile, M270 - two.

At the same time, according to the plans of the Pentagon, the "outdated" ATACMS will be replaced by the Precision Strike Missile (PrSM). The base range of the missile is about 500 (499+) km, in the Inc 2 modification it is planned to bring it up to 700–750 km. For Inc 4, which is being developed in parallel, the wishes have been increased to 1 km - through the use of ramjet engines. For reference: the distance from Kharkov to Moscow is 000 km, from Sumy - 647.

Meanwhile, the number of M270 MLRS and HIMARS in service with the United States alone before deliveries to Ukraine was more than 600 units.

Further, as in the 80s, the United States intends to build an impressive "fleet" of stealth strategic bombers. Let me remind you that initially the main task of the B-2 was precisely the hunt for mobile ground-based ICBM systems (aka PGRK) and OTRK.

Finally, there is a program of "non-kinetic" impact on the missile potential of "victims" - including sabotage, electronic warfare, etc.

…and SDI 2.0


Now let's look at the anti-missile component.

Over the past decade and a half, the United States has made systematic efforts to develop missile defense. The result is obvious. In 2017 and 2019, the ICBM simulator was intercepted by the ground-based GMD system, and in 2020 by the naval missile defense component (SM-3 Block IIA).

Meanwhile, everything that we have observed so far is only the first stage of the project.

Let me remind you that when intercepting in the final section, the missile defense system is forced to interact with a “complex ballistic target” of “divided” warheads, decoys, jammers, etc. At the same time, it is enough to shoot down a single and perfectly “visible” target in the initial section. As a result, the functions of the ground-based missile defense system of the “final section” are auxiliary, this is the last echelon.

So, interception in the initial part of the trajectory is the main mode of a rationally constructed missile defense system. In most cases, this can only be done from space.

The most realistic and conservative option here is the reincarnation of the “Diamond Pebbles” of the SDI era. That is, the placement in space of already used kinetic interceptors. At the same time, their task will be much simpler than when intercepting warheads in the final section of the trajectory.

In the 80s, it was believed that 4 interceptors were enough in the variant of a preventive strike.
Since then, the number of targets has been drastically reduced - for example, the fleet of Soviet / Russian ICBMs has shrunk from 1 to 398 units (for 310).

One way or another, already in July 2018, the US military budget was published, providing for the creation of a missile defense space echelon - first a “sensor” one. In November of the same year, the State Department formally refused to sign the "Treaty to Prevent the Placement of Weapons in Outer Space" proposed by China and Russia. The draft UN resolution “Non-First Deployment of Weapons in Outer Space” was also blocked.

In January 2019, a National Missile Defense report was published stating the obvious. "The interception of offensive missiles in the launch phase will make it possible to more effectively respond to missile threats, to use a smaller number of interceptor missiles to intercept enemy missiles in the middle and final sections of their flight."

Explaining Washington's position, Acting US Secretary of Defense Patrick Shanahan stated in plain text that the United States intends to supplement space "sensors" with a shock component.

One way or another, the combination of missile defense and disarmament means is a bid for unlimited military dominance. It hardly needs to be specified that an enemy deprived of its own nuclear potential will be under the threat of large-scale US atomic strikes - at best, it will have a choice between capitulation and genocide.

Ukrainian bridgehead


What is the role of Ukraine in this context?

Theoretically, the entire European part of Russia and the Urals are achievable for LRHW already when deployed on the eastern flank of the current NATO (in Poland, Romania, etc.). However, let me remind you that the task of "disarming" missiles is not just to reach, but to reach the targets in less time than the reaction time of the enemy.

Now let's look at the location of the position areas of the Strategic Missile Forces. Let me remind you that in total they have 3 armies and 12 divisions.

27th Rocket Army, 5 divisions. Positional areas farthest to the east are Yoshkar-Ola and Svetly (Saratov region). Distance Warsaw - Saratov - 1 km, Warsaw - Yoshkar-Ola - 711 km. When hosting in Romania, the distances are even shorter.

In other words, the entire army is within the range of the late Pershing (1 km) with its ten-minute flying time. That being said, a longer-range/"energetic" LRHW at the same range will be significantly faster.

In other words, outside the context of deploying a powerful anti-missile defense, the 5th Army is practically dead.

Let's return to the geography of the Strategic Missile Forces. 31st Rocket Army. 3 divisions: in Pervomaisky (70 km north of Kirov), Yasnoye and Dombarovsky (extreme east of the Orenburg region), and Svobodny (10 km from Verkhnyaya Salda).

Pervomaisky is removed from possible starting positions in Poland and Romania at a distance of about 1 km. The difference with the Western group is not fundamental.
However, for the Ural positional the situation looks different.

Distance Warsaw - Upper Salda - 2 km, Iasi - Upper Salda - 555 km. Warsaw - Dombarovsky - 2 km, Iasi - Dombarovsky - 499 km.

The flight time of comparable LRHW missiles to a range of about 2 km is well known and is already about 500 minutes.

Equally well known is the time it takes to make a decision about retaliation. Naturally, according to American data, this is a terrible military secret in Russia.

Formally, it is 25 minutes long, but the meeting of the president with the committee of chiefs of staff takes 10 minutes, obviously, which is mainly political in nature. In this case, the scenario provides for the detection of launches from satellites, which generates a significant number of errors. Obviously, with launches near the borders, fixed by early warning radars, the uncertainty is much less.

In other words, the flight time to the Ural position areas is likely to be excessive disarming strike.

At the same time, the shift of positions to the Baltic states does not solve the problem in any way. In addition to a limited gain in distance, Baltiya is an extremely unsuccessful option.

Undoubtedly, too complacent attitude towards NATO's Eastern Baltic foothold is ill-founded and harmful. However, it is in the case of RSD that the compactness and specific geography of the Baltic states make it an extremely inconvenient position.

For example, placing missiles too close to the border makes it possible to shoot them down on the active part of the trajectory, that is, extremely effectively. Meanwhile, in the case of the Baltic states, the situation is aggravated by the presence of potential Russian positions in the rear (Kaliningrad and the Baltic Fleet), which ensures the interception "in pursuit", with a minimum approach speed - and the same probability of a miss.

At the same time, if we exclude extreme options with the placement of IRMs practically at the positions of a potential Russian missile defense system (for example, in the Daugavpils region), then the possibilities of attacking the South Urals position areas will not be better than in the case of the Romanian option (Riga - Dombarovsky - 2 km) . In the case of the northern Urals, a gain of 393-500 km is theoretically possible, but also at the cost of the extreme vulnerability of missiles in the active site. For example, 700 km can be obtained by placing RSD positions near ... Narva, 700 - near Tallinn or in a comparable region of Estonia.

In other words, the Baltic gain in a realistic scenario (central Latvia) is limited by approaching Verkhnyaya Salda by about 370 km - under the greenhouse conditions of missile defense operation.

In the case of Finland, the situation for NATO is more optimistic, but not ideal. In other words, with realistic options for the deployment of RSD, the positional area in the northern Urals is undoubtedly under threat - for example, the distance Verkhnyaya Salda - Yuvaskyla - 1 km in the absence of rear missile defense positions.

At the same time, the distance in relation to the South Ural position areas will be frankly excessive, about the same 2 km. Thus, all the "north-western" options for the deployment of RSDs leave out of reach a very impressive geographically and, perhaps, the most problematic region for a disarming strike.

However, the “shift” of the starting positions to Ukraine solves the problem. Distance Poltava - Dombarovsky - 1 km. The distance Poltava - Verkhnyaya Salda is 776 km, while it is clearly not the minimum possible.

An additional problem is the need to build anti-missile defenses for two very different directions when trying to protect the Northern Urals and European position areas.

... And the second edition of 1941


It would seem that there is an obvious solution to the problem - "just" to move 2/3 of the nuclear arsenal and decision-making centers as far as possible beyond the Urals. It is hardly worth specifying that “only” is already extremely expensive. However, in reality, things are much worse.
Let me remind you that ground-based RSDs are supplemented by missiles on submarines and an air component. At the same time, Siberia is, firstly, a narrow or very narrow strip with a more or less dense population and developed infrastructure, to the north of which there are no early warning systems - the easternmost of the northern stations in Vorkuta - and there is only focal air defense. At the same time, the Ukrainian Swifts recently once again proved how problematic it is to fight even with fairly primitive low-altitude targets.

Secondly, the huge northern maritime "facade". At the same time, the distance between Salekhard and Anadyr, even in a straight line, is 4 km - about 420 times more than the length of the notorious Faroe-Icelandic NATO anti-submarine line with all its branches in the Danish Strait, etc.

In other words, along with the creation of a defense of the required level, the price of the issue will be unbearable and, much worse, we may not just be “late in deployment”. We are going to be late. Putin's appeal to the situation of 1941 was not at all accidental.

At the same time, the president clearly does not share the opinion of "patriotic" gurus about the invulnerability of mobile ground systems and submarines. And even basic knowledge about the issue is enough to understand the reasons - however, this is a topic for a separate article. Some problems of submarine stability were also discussed at the VO.

In general, the situation would have been extremely difficult and dangerous without the Ukrainian factor. At the same time, the missile threat is by no means the only one emanating from the territory of Ukraine. It is “only” about the most immediate, deadly and obvious threat.
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  1. +13
    April 4 2023 03: 51
    Good morning! What I recently realized:

    so-called Ukrainians on the so-called. For the most part, Ukraine is not just hostile towards us.
    They really want the destruction of Russians and Russia
    The regime in Kyiv is cannibalistic.
    It is impossible to negotiate with these people.
    Only their destruction is possible.

    Wolfhound is right. Cannibal - no.
    1. +7
      April 4 2023 04: 09
      I largely agree! The author, in my opinion, did not take into account the fact that they have what they want even without missiles. Capitalism!
      1. +21
        April 4 2023 05: 15
        I am perplexed why there is a threat in the chain Ukraine - NATO - the flight time of missiles, and in the chain of the Baltic States / Finland - NATO - the flight time - for some reason such threats are not traced, which has already been officially announced. Why is a NATO missile from Ukraine more dangerous than a NATO missile from Finland and the Baltic states?
        1. +7
          April 4 2023 08: 27
          Quote: Mikhail Krivopalov
          Why is a NATO missile from Ukraine more dangerous than a NATO missile from Finland and the Baltic states?

          It will not be easy for the Finns to explain that they have to sacrifice themselves for the sake of "American poker". The Baltics are located in the semi-circle of our air defense systems, there is a chance for some kind of interception.
          But the territory of Ukraine is now just the perfect "testing ground" for any action, it won't get worse ...
          1. +2
            April 4 2023 11: 06
            Underwater carriers are near us. We cannot not calculate, not detect, not drive away (there is simply nothing). It is beneficial for the West to look at us fools, and they are not interested in half the world in dust. Se la vie sad
        2. +8
          April 4 2023 08: 56
          It's getting closer and closer from Tallinn and Helsinki... when will there be an article about these destinations?
        3. +3
          April 4 2023 09: 50
          Quote: Mikhail Krivopalov
          I am perplexed why there is a threat in the chain Ukraine - NATO - the flight time of missiles, and in the chain of the Baltic States / Finland - NATO - the flight time - for some reason such threats are not traced, which has already been officially announced.



          Actually, exactly about this - an impressive piece of the article.

          “However, it is in the case of IRMs that the compactness and specific geography of the Baltic states make it an extremely inconvenient position. For example, placing missiles too close to the border allows them to be shot down on the active part of the trajectory, that is, extremely effectively. Meanwhile, in the case of the Baltic states, the situation is aggravated by the presence of potential Russian positions in the rear (Kaliningrad and the Baltic Fleet), which ensures interception "in pursuit", with a minimum speed of rapprochement - and the same probability of a miss."

          Etc.
          1. +3
            April 4 2023 16: 02
            Quote: Alarmist79
            Meanwhile, in the case of the Baltics, the situation is aggravated by the presence of potential Russian positions in the rear (Kaliningrad and the Baltic Fleet), which ensures the interception "in pursuit", with a minimum speed of rapprochement - and the same probability of a miss."

            This is plain stupidity.

            From hypothetical positions, say, in the Gulf of Riga to the Kaliningrad region, the Republic of Belarus or the Russian Federation, 250-300 kilometers. There can be no talk of any knocking down "in pursuit". A medium-range missile, let's say based on the SM-3, will have the energy of the SM-3 - and shooting down the SM-3 "in pursuit" is not an idea.

            A piece of land 600x400 kilometers is not so small.
            1. -2
              April 4 2023 17: 25
              From hypothetical positions, say, in the Gulf of Riga to the Kaliningrad region, the Republic of Belarus or the Russian Federation, 250-300 kilometers. There can be no talk of any knocking down "in pursuit".


              1. And in what magical way do 250-300 km from Kalingrad prevent you from shooting down missiles in pursuit? After 200-300 km unsportsmanlike, or what do you mean?
              2. And what about the Republic of Belarus and the "continental" Russian Federation, and what do they have to do with the downing of a missile launched from near Riga in pursuit? Try to open the atlas.
              3. The Gulf of Riga - do you intend to place "Virginia" there (somewhere between the sprats) or immediately "LRHW" with scuba crews? No, I like the idea, but .... drug control, the dog is on the alert.


              .
              Quote: Negro
              A medium-range missile, let's say based on the SM-3, will have the energy of the SM-3 - and shooting down the SM-3 "in pursuit" is not an idea.

              1. That is what the rocket very slow compared to ICBMs, will it especially interfere with bringing it down in pursuit? Oh, this logic, Moscow pseudoscience.
              2. Actually, this is by no means about possible divisions based on the SM, but about a very specific missile.
              3. Maybe you are still better about oxen? And then the rockets are a Moskal shaitan-letalka, didas will not approve.
              1. +1
                April 4 2023 21: 56
                Quote: Alarmist79
                1. And in what magical way do 250-300 km from Kalingrad prevent you from shooting down missiles in pursuit? After 200-300 km unsportsmanlike, or what do you mean?

                Well, in almost all launch azimuths from Kaliningrad and RB - in pursuit (there the sphericity of the Earth will give even more)

                at MGM-31C
                1st stage: Thiokol TX-174 solid rocket; 115 kN (26000 lb) in 38,3 s
                2nd stage: Thiokol TX-175 solid rocket; 85 kN (19200 lb) for 39 s
                Final speed 8+M (3000-3200 m/s

                for 91H6E = about 14M (4800 m / s), it works for a maximum of 10 seconds.
                "achiles chasing the tortoise"
                S=a*t^2/2
                Sзур=480*10^2/2=24000м=24 км
                Spershing = 200m (000 km) +200*42^77/2= 2 +200000 = 124 km.
                It's all crooked, oblique, without ballistic, considering that the acceleration does not change.
                Not . Will not catch up
                Quote: Alarmist79
                2. And here the Republic of Belarus and the "continental" RF

                RB in pursuit, with the continental Russian Federation they can, if it is in the interception zone
                Quote: Alarmist79
                3. Gulf of Riga - you are there "Virginia"

                there you can eagle a berk, with its SM-6, which will take 91H6E for accelerating. 12,5 miles. And don't get excited
                or CRBD.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                1. That is, that the rocket is very slow compared to ICBMs,

                MGM-31C is a very nimble and compact RSD, and the installation is mobile
                Raytheon SM-6 Block IB in any case can only be OTP
                and on the basis of the SM-3 Block IIA / B- all the more, it can turn out to be an excellent RSD. This is how I would approach the matter.
                LHRW...
                Quote: Alarmist79
                or immediately "LRHW" with scuba crews?

                why be so perverted?
                LPD50

                ETH

                Banuchi, Sebastian I.; Hughes, Thomas M.; Rice, Cole;
                Tank and Thia N. (this is probably a woman) have already calculated everything a long time ago
                install, launch and remove LRHW launchers for it takes from 22 minutes (LCS) to 55 minutes (LPD and EPF).
                1. 0
                  April 4 2023 23: 44
                  =
                  at MGM-31C
                  =
                  What side is the late Pershing-2 with its 1770 km range to the real complex with a range of 2750+ km for forty years?

                  for 91H6E = about 14M (4800 m / s), it works for a maximum of 10 seconds.


                  91H6E - this is a radar / radar. Are you going to accelerate it to 4,8 km / s and powerfully hit the rocket with it? It happens, yes.

                  RB in pursuit

                  Look at your own map. A very economical way to go into the rear hemisphere, yeah.

                  from the continental Russian Federation can, if it is in the interception zone


                  Over the continental Russian Federation, for a minute, an active site will pass even in the case of Pershing-2 from the Riga region. Why waste numerically limited anti-missiles on firing at warheads in pursuit in such and such a context?

                  eagle burke is possible, with its SM-6, which will take 91H6E for accelerating. 12,5 miles. And don't get excited


                  That is you intend to shoot down overclocked radars SM-6? Is this a typical target?

                  MGM-31C is a very nimble and compact RSD


                  It is slow even for RSD. From where and the miserable range of less than 1/3 of the maximum for RSD.

                  and on the basis of SM-3 Block IIA / B- all the more, you can get an excellent RSD. That's how I would approach it


                  In general, it is possible to cut RSD based on anti-missiles only from great grief - simply because of the very different requirements for the platform.

                  Tank and Thia N. (this is probably a woman) have already calculated for a long time to install, launch and remove launchers LRHW for it takes from 22 minutes (LCS) to 55 minutes (LPD and EPF)


                  That is, instead of burying the installation in the Latvian bushes, you intend to put it on the deck of a rather big ship right in front of SUDDEN blow? What a drop dead cunning plan and how miserable my scuba divers were.
                  1. +1
                    April 5 2023 00: 49
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    What kind of sideways for forty years the late "Pershing-2"

                    You don't get too nervous. Chichas I will explain
                    1.
                    Quote: author
                    Ukraine, Pershing 3 and disarming strike

                    Neither you nor I know the characteristics of the P-3, well, because of my wretchedness, I took the P-2. Excuse me.
                    But make your bowler hat think if
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    forty years late "Pershing-2"
                    not to catch up (Achilles the tortoise) with modern missiles, then you invented the P-3 and even more so.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    91N6E is a radar / radar.

                    You shouldn't kick the pianist, he has a phone and crooked hands, well, clear yourself up.
                    take any 48N6E3 / 48N6-2 / 48N6DM, the speed is written. A smart person will understand, with complexes, a fart will explode.
                    Don't be so nervous
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    So you intend to shoot down the overclocked SM-6 radars?

                    you are repeating yourself (like this one, like him, ugh. Petrosyan, of course), I would modestly advise you to check if you are infected with monkey syndrome.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Actually, you can cut RSD based on anti-missiles only from great grief

                    Yes, no, not true, I think from the mind. And the narrow-minded, they quote more from the wiki
                    - production is established
                    - the skeleton is amazing.
                    - most of their ZhCI are idle.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    very different platform requirements.

                    Be kind, "an expert on air defense systems, missiles and in general" develop your idea (in an article or something)? Thank you very much.
                    I thought you were more into The Phantom Menace: Amphibious Problems, but I was wrong.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    That is, instead of burying the installation in the Latvian bushes, you intend to put it on the deck of a rather big ship right before a SUDDEN strike?

                    You are kind of weird...
                    - why is it "I" when Banuchi, Sebastian I. is written there in black in English; Hughes, Thomas M.; Rice, Cole; Tank and Thia N. ?
                    This publication is a work of the US Government as defined in Title 17, United
                    States Code, Section 101. Copyright protection is not available for this work in the United States/Monterey, CA; Naval Postgraduate School

                    ?
                    there about the "big troughs", "Riga puddles2" and contact and Frighten them with a "sudden blow"
                    Such a ... mmm immodest question, why did you pay attention to only the last two in the quote?
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    her on the deck of a big ship right before a SUDDEN IMPACT?

                    -How did you evaluate the ship as "rather big"? Did you use the ruler on the monitor? or so, by eye was the measurement?
                    I don’t understand, of course, with a deadly RTO, it looks like an aircraft carrier against a cruiser of the 1st rank. However....
                    - "sudden blow", this is for Solovyova and Skobeev, I have not read anything like that in the doctrine of the Russian Federation. Yes, and it won't. This is for the electorate. In reality: a lot of point moves. (this is the basis). Saddam Hussein will not let you lie (this is the superstructure).
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    What a drop dead cunning plan and how miserable my scuba divers were.

                    I'm afraid that your outdated FPGA could not even read what was written, judging by the seething comments ...
                    Happens. It's such an itch of graphomania ... Kirill Ryabov will not let you lie (I also have monkey syndrome, you see)
                    1. -2
                      April 5 2023 02: 34
                      Neither you nor I know the characteristics of the P-3, well, because of my wretchedness, I took the P-2. Excuse me
                      .
                      This. Did you read the article at all? There is just about the fresh American RSD LRHW / Dark Eagle. With a completely openly indicated range of 2775+ km.

                      But make your bowler hat think

                      Above what? Above the incoherent stream of consciousness?

                      do not catch up (Achilles tortoise) with modern missiles
                      ,
                      And here in general SAM? If we are talking about anti-missiles, then this is all the more absurd.
                      And yes, how is your conclusion “not catching up” made from the fact that the speed of the interceptor missile in your own "calculation" is one and a half times higher than the speed of the "Pershing"?

                      then, you invented P-3 and even more so
                      .
                      (triple facepalm) The Pentagon has already deployed the first division of these inventions.

                      take any 48N6E3 / 48N6-2 / 48N6DM, the speed is written.

                      Which side of the S-400 is generally relevant to the question? In your personal world, is this the most advanced means of intercepting RSD? But yes, the transition from shooting down by radar is already progress.

                      A smart person will understand, with complexes, a fart will explode.

                      The smart one realized a long time ago that you could not even master the article you are commenting on.

                      Yes, no, not true, I think from the mind. And the narrow-minded, they quote more from the wiki
                      - production is established - the backbone is amazing.
                      - most of their life cycles are idle
                      .
                      And the production of irons and frying pans is generally brilliant. AND?

                      Be kind, "an expert on air defense systems, missiles and in general" develop your idea (in an article or something)

                      Here's your first thought, as simple as three pennies. The mass of the interceptor on the CM-3 is only 70 kg. The head of the Pershing weighed a modest 399 kg.

                      You are kind of weird...
                      - why is it "I" when Banuchi, Sebastian I. is written there in black in English; Hughes, Thomas M.; Rice, Cole; Tank and Thia N.

                      Do they propose using deck installations for a mighty surprise strike from the Gulf of Riga? I do not believe.

                      here about the "big troughs", "Riga puddles and contact

                      For what? This launch scheme was dragged to the Gulf of Riga personally and specifically by you.

                      As a ship, how did you evaluate it "rather big"?

                      You have it written in English and white "LPD-50". You don't know that LPD is a landing transport dock?

                      Did you use the ruler on the monitor? or so, by eye was the measurement?

                      You don't know the dimensions of San Antonio and Co.? They couldn't read the article on the ungodly wiki, right?

                      "
                      sudden blow, "this is to Solovyova and Skobeev, I have not read anything like that in the doctrine of the Russian Federation.

                      And here the doctrine of the Russian Federation? Russia is not planning a sudden strike for obvious reasons.

                      and it won't be. This is for the electorate

                      Elitar for the whole "bowler"? Well, it is visible. Yes.
                      1. +1
                        April 5 2023 13: 27
                        And here in general SAM? If we are talking about anti-missiles

                        Зunitary уruled рair defense missile
                        Зunitary уruled рrocket missile defense - anti-missile
                        And yes, how did you conclude “it won’t catch up” from the fact that the speed of the interceptor missile in your own “calculation” is one and a half times higher than the speed of the Pershing?

                        And the speed of Achilles is conditional ten times higher than the speed of a tortoise. But... it won't catch up.
                        There was such a task in the middle classes of high school. Also from Ancient Greece. Hint - the movement does not start from one point.
                      2. -1
                        April 5 2023 14: 57
                        = Anti-aircraft guided missile air defense Anti-aircraft guided missile missile defense - anti-missile

                        Didn't you understand that the citizen was listing anti-aircraft missiles in the narrow sense, for the S-300?
                        And the speed of Achilles is conditional ten times higher than the speed of a tortoise. But... it won't catch up.

                        That is, you think that Achilles will not catch up with the tortoise, not in the ancient Greek paradox, but in real life? Whom you will not meet in these electric internets of ours.

                        Quote: Nefarious skeptic
                        Hint - the movement does not start from one point.

                        Tip #1 - No matter where you start from, a faster object will overtake a slower one if it maintains the speed advantage. Unexpected, right?
                        Hint #2. At school (in physics for the seventh grade), of course, they told exactly what is above, plus ... the actual content of the paradox.
                        So Achilles will not catch up with the tortoise, not because of "points," but because if space is homogeneous / infinitely divisible - that is, does not have a "minimum segment", it turns out paradoxical picture, nothing to do with real life. Therefore, the next couple of thousand years after Zeno of Elea dealt with the problem of that very minimum segment. Well, we got busy discreteness space-time.
                      3. 0
                        April 5 2023 15: 10
                        You see how interesting school can be. If you go there, of course.

                        Of course, I'm glad that Internet search helps you assert yourself in your "hot debate". But...
                        no matter where it starts from, a faster object will overtake a slower one if it maintains the speed advantage. Unexpected, right?

                        The truth is that in the middle classes they do not deal with the problems of "homogeneity and infinite divisibility of space." The aporia of Zeno is mentioned there in general and is transformed into a practical school task, where distance to the finish line and the tortoise crosses it faster, because its speed and distance allow it to do so despite the difference in speed. And the students just have to calculate whether the turtle will have time to do it according to the given conditional data. As well as a head start in the distance of the missile, it can allow the missile to reach the target before interception. Despite the high speed of the anti-missile.
                        Didn't you understand that the citizen is listing you anti-aircraft missiles in the narrow sense, for the S-400?

                        I did not understand where to understand this in this section of the conversation
                        You quote specific your opponent's words - "do not catch up (Achilles the tortoise) with modern missiles"
                        ,
                        You are responding to a quote - "What does it have to do with missiles? If we are talking about anti-missiles"


                        Do you see a list of S-400 missiles here? Me not.
                      4. -2
                        April 5 2023 15: 56
                        Of course, I'm glad that Internet search helps you assert yourself in your "hot debate"

                        In fact, any minimally educated person knows this. Some, you know, are interested in the physical meaning of textbook aporias.

                        Zeno's aporia is mentioned there in general and is transformed into a practical school problem, where the distance to the finish line is finite and the turtle crosses it faster, since its speed and head start in distance allows it to be done. despite the difference in speed. And the students just have to calculate whether the turtle will have time to do it according to the given conditional data.


                        Of course, it won’t be difficult for you to give a link to a textbook where they write such parascientific dregs?

                        As well as a head start in the distance of the missile, it can allow the missile to reach the target before interception. Despite the high speed of the anti-missile.

                        That is, you did not even understand that in the above example, the advantage in speed will gobble up the entire handicap in about 20 seconds? Physics, 7th grade.

                        = I did not understand where to understand this in this part of the conversation
                        You are quoting the specific words of your opponent - "do not catch up (Achilles the tortoise) with modern missiles"
                        ,
                        You are responding to a quote - "What does it have to do with missiles? If we are talking about anti-missiles"
                        Do you see a list of S-400 missiles here? =


                        So, in addition to the weird notions of movement, do you think it's okay not to track the progress of the discussion more than one post up?
                      5. +1
                        April 5 2023 16: 22
                        You got a strange design of the answer, not very clear, but I will answer as I understand it.
                        Of course, it won’t be difficult for you to give a link to a textbook where they write such parascientific dregs?

                        My high school is the 60s. No, of course I can search the Internet for the textbook that I had. But... First of all, why? Secondly, why do you limit the lessons solely to tasks from the textbook? Although, if memory serves, it was still in the book, and not written on the blackboard by the teacher.
                        "Parascientific nonsense"? Why? Because you couldn't understand what was written?
                        That is, you did not even understand that in the above example, the advantage in speed will gobble up the entire handicap in about 20 seconds? Physics, 7th grade.

                        It's not, I don't understand that the turtle may need, figuratively, 19 seconds to cross the finish line. I wonder why I singled out the words "where the distance to the finish line is finite", if the sense from this turned out to be a little less than nothing.
                        Forget about physics, we are talking about a simple school problem in a MATHEMATICS lesson, compiled on the basis of Zeno's aporia.
                        So, in addition to the weird notions of movement, do you think it's okay not to track the progress of the discussion more than one post up?

                        Is there something there that will change the meaning of those words of yours that I quoted in my first message? The answer is no.

                        PS Didn't notice your edit
                        Actually knows it any minimally educated person. Some, you know, are interested in the physical meaning of textbook aporias.

                        New absurdity, too, to explain? Or yourself?
                      6. -2
                        April 5 2023 16: 59
                        My high school is the 60s. No, of course I can search the Internet for the textbook that I had. But... First of all, why?


                        Then, that this is done in an elementary way, and also all because many people know how the textbooks of the 1960s usually look. There is a lot about industrial / technical applications and very little Zenon.
                        Here is a textbook on physics for 1966.
                        http://fremus.narod.ru/java/h01/fiz766.html

                        Forget about physics, we are talking about a simple school problem in a MATHEMATICS lesson, compiled on the basis of Zeno's aporia.


                        The math textbook is on the same resource. And what tells me that there is no problem there either. But you can easily prove otherwise.

                        "Parascientific nonsense"? Why? Because you couldn't understand what was written?

                        Do you really not understand why a wild misrepresentation of a very important aporia of Zeno is parascientific nonsense? The question of the discreteness or indivisibility of space is a little bit one of the key ones for physics, connected with many things.

                        It's not, I don't understand that the turtle may need, figuratively, 19 seconds to cross the finish line. =

                        1. We are not discussing turtles, but rockets with quite decent flight times. A medium-range missile is a thing with a range of 1000 to 5500 km.
                        2. If you want to talk about abstract physics, then I have a new surprise for you. The anti-missile will especially successfully catch up with the missile, if the speed thereof will be equal to zero after hitting the target.

                        Is there something there that will change the meaning of those words of yours that I quoted in my first message? The answer is no.

                        That is, the fact that specific missiles are listed there, and not abstract ones, does not change the meaning of the message at all? Hmmm.
                      7. 0
                        April 5 2023 17: 22
                        There is a lot about industrial / technical applications and very little Zenon.
                        http://fremus.narod.ru/java/h01/fiz766.html

                        You already scare me a little, if after "Forget about physics, we are talking about a simple school problem in a MATHEMATICS lesson, compiled on the basis of Zeno's aporia." provide such a link.
                        You do not understand why the wild misrepresentation of a very important aporia of Zeno is parascientific nonsense? The question of the discreteness or indivisibility of space is a little bit one of the key ones for physics, connected with many things.

                        You amplify my fear. Let me remind you
                        Forget about physics, we are talking about a simple school problem in a MATHEMATICS lesson, compiled on the basis of Zeno's aporia.
                        "The question of the discreteness and indivisibility of space" is strongly connected with the development of school skills in children in solving the simplest inequalities?
                        1. We are not discussing turtles, but rockets with quite decent flight times.

                        1) And my answer to the question is the answer to a specific question. And there you yourself decided to count the seconds of "eating the handicap by Achilles"
                        2) Well, we did not give the turtles a head start of two hundred kilometers.
                        If you want to talk about abstract physics, then I have a new surprise for you. An anti-missile will be especially successful in catching up with a missile if its speed is zero after hitting the target.

                        Well, there was no particular desire. But if you need an answer to the question, then yes - success is difficult to dispute wassat What did you want to say?
                        That is, the fact that specific missiles are listed there, and not abstract ones, does not change the meaning of the message at all? Hmmm.

                        Anything can be listed there. This will not change the fact that an anti-missile is also a missile defense system. Therefore, writing "What does it have to do with missiles at all? If we are talking about missiles ..." is ridiculous. The fact that I replaced the word "anti-missiles" in your text with "SAM" for clarity of absurdity, and not out of malice, I hope you can guess.
                      8. -2
                        April 5 2023 17: 46
                        You already scare me a little if after "Forget you about physics, we are talking about a simple school problem in a MATHEMATICS lesson, compiled on the basis of Zeno's aporia." provide such a link.

                        You, sorry, realized that "it was actually math" belatedly, in the process of editing the message, so to speak.
                        And yes, nothing prevents you from proving your fascinating story by walking on the same resource to a mathematics textbook.
                        And my answer to the question is the answer to a specific question.

                        To a specific question about missiles and anti-missiles? Then you are VERY wrong.

                        What did you want to say?

                        Of course, that in the case of abstract physics you are grossly wrong.

                        Anything can be listed there. This will not change the fact that an anti-missile is also a missile defense system. Therefore, writing "What does it have to do with missiles at all? If we are talking about missiles ..." is ridiculous.


                        That is, you do not know that not all missiles are specialized anti-missiles and are missiles in the narrow sense? Moreover, there is a very specific own abbreviation for anti-missiles - PR.
                        By the way, decide how you want to see the designation of non-specialized missiles in any thread that you deign to enter? Well, there, "SAM, which is not a specialized PR", or even longer?
                      9. 0
                        April 5 2023 18: 11
                        You, sorry, realized that "it was actually math" belatedly, in the process of editing the message, so to speak.

                        What are you talking about, comrade? The post in which I wrote this was not edited, I did not add this phrase after the fact. If you mean that you have already edited your message and added more words that mathematics is on the same resource, then the fear for you has not disappeared - why not remove the meaningless references to physics. And then also duplicate "a little bit one of the key ones for physics, connected with many things."
                        And yes, nothing prevents you from proving your fascinating story by walking on the same resource to a mathematics textbook.

                        How do you imagine that?
                        To a specific question about missiles and anti-missiles?

                        To the specific question that is quoted before the answer. If until now this feature has passed you by, then I will explain - in our correspondence a certain structure is observed - the words of the interlocutor are quoted and an answer is given under them.
                        Of course, that in the case of abstract physics you are grossly wrong.

                        Wrong asking you what you wanted to say in your own words? If you do not understand, you are now talking about the wrongness of your OWN statement.
                        That is, you do not know that not all missiles are specialized anti-missiles and are missiles in the narrow sense? Moreover, there is a very specific own abbreviation for anti-missiles - PR.

                        Have you decided to go down to primitive manipulation? Didn't expect it to happen so quickly. You gave hope.
                        Or is it just a difficulty understanding the relationship of subsets?
                        Not all SAMs are anti-missiles, but all anti-missiles are SAMs. Regardless of the "own abbreviation".
                      10. -2
                        April 5 2023 19: 03
                        If you mean that you have already edited your message and added more words about the fact that mathematics is on the same resource, then the fear for you has not disappeared - why not remove the meaningless references to physics =

                        What for? Pretty nice link. After passing through which you will be taken to a wonderful resource with math textbooks from the 1960s.

                        =. And then also duplicate "a little bit one of the key ones for physics, connected with many things." =

                        That is, from your point of view, the fact that parascientific nonsense that refutes the foundations of physics was voiced in mathematics is an indulgence, or what? I had no doubt.

                        How do you imagine that?

                        You do not know what to do with a link to a set of tutorials? Of course, look for the LEGENDARY task with Zenon there

                        To the specific question that is quoted before the answer.

                        I won’t even understand, because I see the desire to wrap up key issues here.

                        Have you decided to go down to primitive manipulation?

                        That is, you know about the existence of missiles in the narrow sense and specialized anti-missiles? Then what was the whole circus with horses above?
                        Or is it just a difficulty understanding the relationship of subsets? Not all SAMs are anti-missiles, but all anti-missiles are SAMs. Regardless of the "own abbreviation".

                        And how does this abbreviation even exist, if in your unusual world you need to indicate the names of all subsets in the case of any object?
                        Why do bastards from encyclopedias write PR, and not ZUR PR? They don't listen to you, sort it out there.

                        And yes.
                        1. So decide how you want to see the designation of a non-specialized missile in any thread that you deign to enter? Well, there, "SAM, which is not a specialized PR", or even longer?

                        2. Why did you personally subscribe to the Vile Skeptic, and not the deuterostome chordate vertebrate mammal of the order of primates, the family of anthropoids of the genus Homo Homo sapiens Vile Skeptic? Problems with sets? Don't you understand that any skeptic is a deuterostome, or are you unsure of it?
                      11. +1
                        April 6 2023 11: 06
                        That is, from your point of view, the fact that parascientific nonsense that refutes the foundations of physics was voiced in mathematics is an indulgence, or what?

                        What "parascientific nonsense" was voiced in mathematics? The one you came up with in your head? Do you read what they write to you?
                        You do not know what to do with a link to a set of tutorials? Of course, look for the LEGENDARY task with Zenon there

                        I don't know how this search is supposed to show that I didn't solve a math problem in a math class with a class.
                        And how does this abbreviation even exist, if in your unusual world you need to indicate the names of all subsets in the case of any object?
                        Why do bastards from encyclopedias write PR, and not ZUR PR? They don't listen to you, sort it out there.

                        Oh, more manipulations and attributions. Moreover, what you wrote to the fact that "Not all anti-aircraft guided missiles are anti-missiles, but all anti-aircraft missiles are anti-aircraft guided missiles"?
                        And why should the scoundrels from encyclopedias write like that? After all, this is stupid - "an anti-aircraft guided anti-missile missile." They are not you, entities do not produce.
                        Don't you understand that any skeptic is a deuterostome, or are you unsure of it?

                        laughing you now write it in the form of that verbal construction, which I commented on in the first message to you. "What do deuterostomes have to do with it, if we are talking about a skeptic." Which ... as you yourself just wrote - a deuterostome.
                      12. -2
                        April 7 2023 14: 00
                        What "parascientific nonsense" was voiced in mathematics? The one you came up with in your head? Do you read what they write to you?

                        That is, the absurd interpretation of Zeno's aporia has already been presented not by you, but by "I came up with"? What a wild dreamer you are.
                        Was it also written by evil enemies?
                        And the speed of Achilles is conditional ten times higher than the speed of a tortoise. But... it won't catch up. There was such a task in the middle classes of high school. Also from Ancient Greece. Hint - the movement does not start from one point.


                        =
                        I don't know how this search is supposed to show that I didn't solve a math problem in a math class with a class.=

                        That is, now the problem with Zenon was invented by an obscure Soviet marvanna? Because there is nothing like that in the textbook. What a wild dreamer you are.
                        = Why would the scoundrels from encyclopedias write like that? After all, this is stupid - "an anti-aircraft guided anti-missile missile." =

                        What do you mean why? You are here for the third day jumping on the topic that the PR is also an anti-aircraft missile, and calling it simply an anti-missile is haraam.
                        =They are not you, entities do not produce.=

                        That is, it was not you who demanded to call non-specialized missiles in a certain exact way wherever you deign to stick your eyes? And still can't decide which one? Did Marvanna hack you again? What a wild dreamer you are.
                      13. +1
                        April 10 2023 10: 38
                        That is, the absurd interpretation of Zeno's aporia has already been presented not by you, but by "I came up with"? What a wild dreamer you are.
                        Was it also written by evil enemies?

                        It was you who came up with some "parascientific nonsense." And if you read what they write to you and tried to comprehend what was written, then you yourself would understand it. By the way, directly voice "nonsense" until you decide. Instead, for some reason they quoted my words. Or maybe everything is simpler - such a smart boy does not understand how to transform the text of an aporia so that it can be used as just a mathematical problem in a mathematics lesson?
                        That is, now the problem with Zenon was invented by an obscure Soviet marvanna? Because there is nothing like that in the textbook. What a wild dreamer you are.

                        Yes or not, firstly, I immediately warned that I don’t remember exactly, and secondly, didactic materials are used in the educational process.
                        What do you mean why? You are here for the third day jumping on the topic that the PR is also an anti-aircraft missile, and calling it simply an anti-missile is haraam.

                        I? Don't be afraid.
                        That is, it was not you who demanded to call non-specialized missiles in a certain exact way wherever you deign to stick your eyes? And still can't decide which one? Did Marvanna hack you again? What a wild dreamer you are.

                        Of course not. You fantasize for the interlocutor, and then expose your own fantasies.
                        And, it is characteristic that, commenting on all parts of my message, you were embarrassed to comment on your own cleverness about the "deuterostomes". lol
                      14. 0
                        April 13 2023 13: 30
                        =It was you who came up with some "parascientific nonsense".=

                        That is, the delusional interpretation of the most important aporia is not parascientific nonsense? And charging cans is also a highly scientific occupation? Oh, it's "the best in the world." And why am I not surprised.
                        = And if you read what they write to you and tried to comprehend what was written, you would understand it yourself. By the way, directly voice "nonsense" until you decide. =

                        I told you ten times that an interpretation like “Achilles will not catch up with the tortoise simply because of the initial handicap” is absurd. and the first time - in the first answer, when he explained the meaning of the aporia.

                        =. Or maybe everything is simpler - such a smart boy does not understand how to transform the text of an aporia so that it can be used as just a mathematical problem in a mathematics lesson? =

                        Transform - in the sense, turn the meaning inside out? Again terrible, but obscure Marvanna?
                        = Yes or not, firstly, I immediately warned that I don’t remember exactly, and secondly, didactic materials are used in the educational process.=

                        In which no one in their right mind would distort the almost well-known meaning of Zeno.

                        =Me? Don't be afraid. =
                        =Of course not.=

                        Lying is not good. We look above.
                        1. Enumeration of classic missiles
                        2. Me: And what about missiles in general? If we are talking about anti-missiles, then everything
                        3. You are an anti-aircraft guided missile. Anti-aircraft guided missile PRO - anti-missile.

                        That is, you were extremely unhappy with the fact that I called the standard missiles just missiles and contrasted them with anti-missiles. Or did you decide to give out your “valuable” comment simply about “I can’t be silent”?

                        = You fantasize for the interlocutor, and then expose your own fantasies.=

                        Refuse your own words on the same page and blame everything on Marvanna ... what a violent dreamer you are.
                        = And, it is characteristic that, commenting on all parts of my message, you were embarrassed to comment on your own cleverness about the "deuterostomes".=

                        So you insist that I comment on your translation of the arrows?
                        But in general, your unique style cannot but please the eye. It’s a no brainer that you first heard about the physical meaning of the school aporia from me, but for a week now you have been tormenting the unrequited spirit of Marvanna.
                      15. 0
                        April 17 2023 14: 27
                        That is, the delusional interpretation of the most important aporia is not parascientific nonsense?

                        You invented the "delusional" interpretation and now, in exaltation, you refute it. Scene from Cervantes in reality.
                        I told you ten times that an interpretation like “Achilles will not catch up with the tortoise simply because of the initial handicap” is absurd. and the first time - in the first answer, when he explained the meaning of the aporia.

                        1) Considering that one of the main techniques in Greek philosophy is bringing to the point of absurdity, then your "indignation", in a way, gave rise to syneresis)))
                        2) Why absurd? If it is precisely because of the initial handicap that he does not catch up with her. The paradox is based on the assumption that the runner must first reach the point where the turtle started. In the absence of a handicap, the "unreachable" condition will not arise, the runner has already caught up with the turtle. Regardless of whether the space is discrete or not.
                        3) If you return from the tricks of the Eleatics to the sinful earth, then you were written in Russian in white about the "finiteness" of the route in the school problem. Dare to say that in this case the handicap is not something that affects the victory of one of the participants?
                        4) Finally, it became clear what construct you built and passed off as "my interpretation"
                        Transform - in the sense, turn the meaning inside out?

                        No. But you continue, instead of trying to understand the interlocutor, interpret his words in a way that suits you.
                        In which no one in their right mind would distort the almost well-known meaning of Zeno.

                        And the problem about cyclists who have left towards meets the meaning of Newton's first law. wassat Truly, the sleep of reason produces monsters.
                        That is, you were extremely unhappy with the fact that I called the standard missiles just missiles and contrasted them with anti-missiles. Or did you decide to give out your “valuable” comment simply about “I can’t be silent”?

                        It turns out that there is a certain "standard" SAM, there is "just a SAM" lol belay Oh well. And that was aplomb ...
                        So you insist that I comment on your translation of the arrows?

                        Well, do your best, what is there.
                        No brainer that you first heard about the physical meaning of the school aporia from me

                        Well it goes without saying.
                      16. 0
                        April 5 2023 16: 21
                        Approximately 200 seconds. Sorry, typo.
      2. +7
        April 4 2023 08: 22
        Quote: Alien From
        that even without missiles they have what they want. Capitalism!

        Dont Have. They want a Russia that is hostile to China. They don’t have such a Russia, and without this, the economic strangulation of the PRC is impossible even theoretically ...
    2. +9
      April 4 2023 04: 37
      Any nation, including the one you belong to, "wants" only to eat, drink and fuck. Everything else is brought into his consciousness by the shepherds of the human flock - the States.
      And in our time, also the power of global capital.

      Like Pushkin: "They must be cut or sheared." Yesterday they cut, today they cut.

      Russians 30 years ago were ordered to endure the destruction of their country, they endured it. Ukrainians were ordered to kill Russians from baby to old man-perform.

      There are elites called to steer, there are slave elites called to play second and third roles. And nothing more.
    3. +1
      April 4 2023 05: 56
      Today, the flight time of NATO missiles will be reduced by another ten minutes am Finland officially joins NATO and the deployment of strike systems is a matter of time. We need a real response in the involvement of Venezuela, Iran and Cuba.
      1. 0
        April 4 2023 08: 52
        Talkers and traders do not give real answers.
      2. 0
        April 4 2023 09: 55
        =Today, the flight time of NATO missiles will be reduced by another ten minutes Finland officially joins NATO=

        See article. In reality, the flight time to the southern Urals for the Finns is comparable to the Romanian one, they have a serious gain in the central Urals (Upper Salda). This does not mean that the threat from Finland can be ignored, but Ukraine is far away there.
        1. 0
          April 4 2023 22: 59
          In reality, the flight time to the southern Urals among the Finns

          The Finns will not be oriented towards the Urals in any way.
          It's just stupid.
          Their goals are LenVOKO, Murmansk, Kola and Arkhangelsk.
          Well, there are little things: Pella and the cascade of the Svirsk hydroelectric power station.
    4. +1
      April 4 2023 06: 52
      Quote: Ilya-spb
      They really want the destruction of Russians and Russia

      They don't want anything. Vaughn Zelensky, being an actor, happily filmed in Russia, and after becoming president, he was replaced. As if a fierce beast hates everything Russian! In reality, he simply plays the role prepared for him and follows the logic of events not invented by him.

      But the ardent nationalist Yushchenko, on the contrary, having come to power, began to deal with our president, to conduct trade business.
      1. +3
        April 4 2023 08: 18
        Quote: Stas157
        Vaughn Zelensky, being an actor, happily filmed in Russia, and after becoming president, he was replaced.
        And Dmitry Kiselev for Poroshenko, not so long ago, fried potatoes. hi
    5. -1
      April 9 2023 09: 24
      Good morning! What I recently realized:

      so-called Ukrainians on the so-called. For the most part, Ukraine is not just hostile towards us.
      They really want the destruction of Russians and Russia

      This became clear at the age of 14. It is enough to get acquainted with the texts of Turchinov and Yarosh. Religion Svidomism is a sect of extremists, why did the Kremlin recognize this government, that is the question?
  2. +12
    April 4 2023 04: 34
    The very defense concept of Russia is vulnerable in its essence of waiting for an enemy strike ... hence all the problems with this American scammer who, instead of attacking, should think about how to escape from a probable strike by our airborne forces.
    The author, as I see it, runs into the patriots ... I probably forgot how the patriots were indignant at the advancement of NATO borders from the GDR to the borders of the Pskov and Leningrad regions.
    B-52 is now freely simulating an attack on St. Petersburg ... but it should be the other way around ... our White Swans should be simulating an attack on Washington and Philadelphia.
    They screwed up Cuba ... they could have agreed with the Cubans to create a full-fledged base there with strike weapons under the ass of the United States ... now we are talking about flying time to Moscow ... these are the results of the Kremlin's foreign policy over 30 years of perestroika ... we are sitting in full pope with the war in Ukraine.
    But all this could not have happened if the leadership of Russia showed at least a little brain in interpreting the actions of the United States and NATO.
    Of course, I read the author’s article ... but I didn’t see anything new for myself ... all this was clear to me when the United States moved from the borders of united Germany to the new Drang Nah Osten.
    Now we are faced with the question of our existence in general ... the fate of Yugoslavia, Libya, Iraq is clearly before our eyes.
    1. +2
      April 4 2023 06: 27
      Absolutely true!
      Now we are faced with the question of our existence in general ... the fate of Yugoslavia, Libya, Iraq is clearly before our eyes.

      Everyone is afraid to answer our main Russian question:
      "Who is to blame and what shall we do?"
      I dare to answer:
      1. The current government is to blame, for many years trying to negotiate with our worst enemy and crushing the great past.
      2. Carry out a real mobilization, deliver a crushing blow from one or two (out of three to five deployed) Boreis on bridges, dams and other infrastructure facilities and ground forces equipped with tactical nuclear weapons, clear out pockets of resistance and all elements of the control of the enemy strike force - Ukraine .
      The real alternative is in the description of the author of the article, for which my personal thanks to Eugene.
      1. +1
        April 4 2023 20: 03
        . strike from one or two (out of three to five deployed) Boreys on bridges, dams and other infrastructure facilities and ground forces equipped with tactical nuclear weapons

        That is, nuclear ....., in Ukraine ..., from submarines. And then clean up... fool
        Maybe it's something else?
        1. -1
          April 4 2023 20: 35
          If you find something - I will bow at my feet!
          Only two conditions:
          1. The infrastructure must be demolished at once and cannot be restored as soon as possible before our attack.
          2. The US must understand that dreams of a limited nuclear war are not feasible. Russia's strategic nuclear forces exist, they operate, you cannot control them, so you can fly in in full AND NOT MANDATORY IN RESPONSIBILITY!
          If this is possible without "trump cards" ... But N.S. Khrushchev acted in this spirit - and it worked!
      2. -1
        April 9 2023 09: 27
        The current government is to blame, for many years trying to negotiate with our worst enemy

        Gold words.

    2. +1
      April 4 2023 06: 44
      Here, even without the author’s article, it is clear that we have a lot of problems with defense. Attacks on Engels and Ryazan showed this. Although, later against the ancient Swifts, it seemed to get better. Protected. And this must be done. Expensive? Yes, not more expensive than the life of the state, us.
  3. +1
    April 4 2023 04: 50
    In other words, along with the creation of a defense of the required level, the price of the issue will be unbearable and, much worse, we may not just be “late in deployment”. We are going to be late.
    If you do not make decisions and do nothing, then yes, we will be late. My personal opinion: air defense / missile defense systems should already be deployed both in the Far East and in the north. The fact that we have Moscow covered is good, but it seems that the rest of the country's territory does not really bother anyone. And in theory, the strike will be delivered both from the north, with the help of submarines and strategic bombers, and from the east. And it would be absolutely logical to meet missiles on the borders of the country.
    There is no need to say "we will be late", it is necessary to deploy a missile defense system, and it was necessary to start yesterday.
    1. +2
      April 4 2023 05: 10
      The state is an apparatus of violence in the hands of the ruling class. And only then there are options that this ruling class wants to develop in its citizens - human or bestial
      1. +1
        April 4 2023 06: 38
        Quote: Mikhail Krivopalov
        The state is an apparatus of violence in the hands of the ruling class.

        It all depends on one question. Who serves whom, the ruling class - the people or the people - the ruling class?
        1. +4
          April 4 2023 18: 06
          Quote: Stas157
          Who serves whom, the ruling class - the people or the people - the ruling class?


          And with what fright will the ruling class begin to worry about the people? Why does the ruling class need it? He is the ruling one. He is so good. He serves his own interests. And the people are beyond these interests.
    2. +1
      April 4 2023 10: 51
      Quote: Grandfather is an amateur
      There is no need to say "we will be late", it is necessary to deploy a missile defense system, and it was necessary to start yesterday.

      The problem is that exactly "yesterday". Even the USSR did not cope well with the operational deployment of everything necessary to protect against the Pershing-cruise missiles.
      In this case,
      1. Anti-missile defense is, on average, more expensive and more problematic than a missile "attack", which we have been victoriously talking about for the last twenty years. The point is that it works both ways.
      2. LRHW and Co. are capable of limited maneuver on the trajectory, which can be seen both directly in the design and in terms of accuracy. That is, this is a much more problematic target than the standard RSD.
      In general, we need missile defense, but we also need to gain time, plus the cheapest and most effective missile defense - tanks at potential IRM positions.
  4. +2
    April 4 2023 04: 51
    The concept of OVSU should be replaced by a Preemptive Strike.
  5. +10
    April 4 2023 05: 02
    All about, air defense and "preemptive strikes" are useless if our rulers, as well as those who give orders, "wake up and fall asleep looking to the west." All the reinforcement of the army, the vanguards and the Sarmatians are useless if the chiefs, clinging to comfort, do not dare to give the order at the right moment. There will be a sovereign policy - there will be a meaning in all "resistance", there will be no sovereign policy - all "resistance" will be reduced to empty slogans on TV (we say one thing, but do the opposite).
    1. 0
      April 4 2023 05: 40
      Sovereign from whom, from external forces, or from the interests of the people?
  6. +10
    April 4 2023 05: 07
    Russia is also vulnerable because a quarter of the population is concentrated in two large cities and their environs. To destroy a country, it is enough to bomb a relatively small area. And this process has gained speed over the past 30 years.

    To look at the map of modern Moscow is the same thing that we were shown in the lessons on life safety. The boundary of the affected area. With the most unpleasant in winter, the northeast wind. The Bible also says:
    Pray to God that THIS doesn't happen in the winter."

    I write about this for the sake of interest is not the first time. Why?
    The most interesting thing is the reaction of compatriots to such a post.
    A typical answer: "There are few Russians in Moscow, and therefore, it's not a pity" ... That's it ..... It's just the finish line.
    1. -2
      April 4 2023 06: 01
      Russia is also vulnerable because a quarter of the population is concentrated in two large cities and their environs. To destroy a country, it is enough to bomb a relatively small area. And this process has gained speed over the past 30 years.

      And I would say on the contrary, it is easier to provide two facilities with reliable missile defense and air defense than dozens across the country. Which is actually done.
      1. +3
        April 4 2023 08: 47
        Quote: Konnick

        And I would say on the contrary, it is easier to provide two facilities with reliable missile defense and air defense than dozens across the country. Which is actually done.

        We make everything easier. For example, to drive the whole country to Moscow....... You are simply unique!!!

        And in the rest of Russia, let them hammer, no one anyway ....
        I wonder why no one else in the world has thought of such a simply ingenious solution? Like fools, they develop all territories ....
        1. dSK
          +1
          April 4 2023 11: 10
          The standard question is "who benefits from this?"
          - construction companies with foreign capital...
          The advantage of Russia, in the form of a vast territory, is neutralized at the same time ....
        2. -3
          April 4 2023 13: 10
          Quote: ivan2022
          Like fools, they develop all territories ....

          What kind of territory? What kind of nonsense? Everywhere the same trend. People are moving to big cities.
        3. +2
          April 4 2023 18: 10
          Quote: ivan2022
          For example, to drive the whole country to Moscow....... You are simply unique!!!
          And in the rest of Russia, let them hammer, no one anyway ....
          I wonder why no one else in the world has thought of such a simply ingenious solution? Like fools, they develop all territories ....


          Nothing like this. Have you heard of agglomerations? For the peripheral periphery, which they consider not only our country, this is exactly the scenario that is envisaged. First, drive everyone into several agglomerations, and then sprinkle with dust.
      2. +2
        April 4 2023 20: 39
        it is easier to provide two facilities with reliable missile defense and air defense than dozens across the country.


        There is no "reliable" missile defense against a mass strike by strategic missiles.
        At the moment, the task of missile defense around Moscow is to provide the necessary margin of time (a couple of hours) to guarantee the security of the country's leadership. Holding the very first blow is all she can do.
    2. -2
      April 4 2023 17: 34
      Quote: ivan2022
      we were shown in the lessons on life safety

      Good caveat. OBZh was introduced in 1991. And this herring, larva, damn it, will tell me here - "how bad Russian narott is."

      Would have diminished negative
  7. +6
    April 4 2023 05: 55
    There is only one conclusion: a capitalist, a capitalist, neither a friend, nor a comrade, nor a brother.
    "Let one eighty-five pay," said Dodson.
    - Bolivar cannot carry two. "(c)
    1. 0
      April 4 2023 06: 02
      I'm sorry, Bob... But Bolivar can't take two... smile

      The Kremlin guys need to watch this movie more often ... to understand that as soon as they relax with their partners ... they will immediately be shot in the back.
    2. 0
      April 4 2023 06: 07
      There is only one conclusion: a capitalist, a capitalist, neither a friend, nor a comrade, nor a brother.

      if only everything was that easy...
      And we see that "Western capital" is united as never before in history...
      And we also see that the richest country in the world (capitalist), which could feed all the hungry Africa and pacify the Middle East, is adding fuel to the fire of wars and conflicts, while unfolding the flag of sodom over all the subjugated countries ...
      So you can’t get by with materialism alone, without metaphysics it’s a dead end ....
      1. +2
        April 4 2023 06: 39
        And we see that "Western capital" is united as never before in history...
        When you need to crush someone, capital unites or unites. This has happened more than once in world history. It was necessary to pinch Germany, unleashed WWI, in the 19th century, pacified Napoleon's ambitions. equal among the "senior". They took away all the "toys" from the "youngest" and set him on, the same "youngest" who does not climb into the common bedroom with the "older ones", but sleeps for himself, in the corridor on the "rug".
  8. +1
    April 4 2023 06: 27
    . a discussion with Putin's statements about the "lethal" threat that would be created for Russia in the event of the deployment of American medium-range and short-range missiles in Ukraine. The paradox is that inside Russia the President's theses were carefully ignored both regular propagandists and the whole horde of "experts"

    They don't fit into the propaganda cliché.
    We are rubbed that they say with our hypersound we are now the devil himself! Because for our dear hypersound, the distance has lost its meaning ...
    And here is how it turned.
    1. +2
      April 4 2023 11: 40
      Quote: Stas157
      They don't fit into the propaganda cliché.

      Yes, alarmists who repeat Putin's theses still magically end up as "agents of the State Department."

      Quote: Stas157
      distance has lost its meaning...

      Moreover, "patriotic" masterpieces on this topic were very willingly published by openly pro-Western media. A deep bond between the city and the village ... sorry, "turbopatriots" with real manuals from the Washington regional committee.
      1. 0
        April 4 2023 13: 20
        Quote: Alarmist79
        repeating Putin's theses

        Thanks to Putin for theses and May decrees. Here you are talking about ignoring the theses. And there are things much worse. Our economy, which has been killed by industries in 30 years, is against the entire Western bloc. The Russia we lost and the high-tech West. And like a cherry on the cake, the last hope for nuclear weapons from the land of lost galoshes.
        1. +2
          April 4 2023 16: 35
          Our economy, which has been killed by industries in 30 years, is against the entire Western bloc. The Russia we lost and the high-tech West. And like a cherry on the cake, the last hope for nuclear weapons from the land of lost galoshes
          ..
          I remind you that the country of lost galoshes very bravely surrendered and fell apart against the backdrop of "pershing" + SDI / missile defense + lower oil prices and the war in Afghanistan. And no records in the field of production of combines that decompose environmentally on any roadside helped her. In large part, because the most progressive system brought grain imports from Canada / the USA as an alternative to the constant pre-Khrushchev hunger strikes. Plus, the galosh mill constantly begged for loans from the same USA.
  9. -1
    April 4 2023 06: 49
    Well, finally, someone sensibly sorted out the situation with the nuclear shield. And that always slipped either into populism or into unscientific fiction. The author is definitely a plus.
    By the way, it is not known why, but for the first time I see a completely unclassified idea - missile defense is most effective on the ascending part of the trajectory. Moreover, only there it is generally effective, supposedly "successful" intercepts from the American missile defense system ... Here we must talk about what exactly and how they were intercepted. The same naval SAM-3s were generally scandalous - they were tested on a "medium-range ICBM simulator", who asked a journalist "where did such a simulator come from, because they were all destroyed under the INF Treaty" - they were taken out of the press. Then it also turned out that the trajectory of the ICBM was known, and coupled with the fact that there seems to be 1 successful interception, it is known where and how the flying target is on about 6 unsuccessful ones, and in the successful one no decoys and interference were used, for which question another one flew to a journalist ... That such a missile defense system will not get a finger in the ass, not like in an ICBM.
    So, as there was a bet on a nuclear explosion in the air of an anti-missile, it remained so - with the aim not so much to destroy, but to confuse warheads, missile defense systems, your copper. Relax, envious of Moscow, if something unequivocally covers us, you just need to say thank you to US for the fact that for the guaranteed vitrification of Moscow with missile defense now you need to apply a lot of shit - there will be almost no left for YOU. But there is not so much missile defense, but the dispersal and security of objects that they must destroy ...
    1. +1
      April 4 2023 10: 29
      Quote from Bingo
      The author is definitely a plus.

      Thank you.
      Quote from Bingo
      Here it is necessary to talk about what and how they were intercepted. The same naval SAM-3s were generally scandalous - they were tested on a "medium-range ICBM simulator", who asked a journalist "where did such a simulator come from, because they were all destroyed under the INF Treaty" - they were taken out of the press. Then it also turned out that the trajectory of the ICBM was known, and coupled with the fact that there seems to be 1 successful interception, it is known where and how the flying target is on about 6 unsuccessful ones, and in the successful one no decoys and interference were used, for which question another one flew to a journalist ... That such a missile defense system will not get a finger in the ass, not like in an ICBM.

      1. No, it’s just that the Americans are taking consistent steps, which they themselves write about in sufficient detail. At the same time, the shooting of "naked" warheads is a stage long gone. Missile defense systems on current targets are still simplified, but by no means absent.
      2. Regarding the withdrawn journalist - more than a strange story, target missiles, including medium-range ones, exist in the USA on quite official rights, with open indices, an open description of the general design, etc.
      3. About a previously known trajectory - approximately from the same opera. It is inevitably known, because they shoot from range to range at a specific target. However, missile defense does little, intercepting the warhead itself without the missile defense PCB is the least problem. The key is to calculate warheads in a cloud of decoys.
      1. -2
        April 4 2023 12: 02
        Who argues, the situation is strange. And pro-target missiles are known. However, exactly what was in the INF Treaty about liquidation, a ban on the development and testing of this? That is, no target missile HAS THE RIGHT to be similar in characteristics to the INF,
        And then even steeper, for which the second journalist flew. English on white was declared. that interference and false targets were NOT used in the tests, after 5 minutes of chatter - "the test showed the high efficiency of the new target selection system for rejecting false targets", then the journalist's question - you did not use false targets, how did you test the system?
        Well, I’m unlikely to find this report now, I don’t even remember the year, but in a completely American press, not oppositional or little known ... It’s just not customary to pay special attention to jambs.
        And then - the SM-3 tests were successful - they knocked over a satellite flying along a known trajectory and this target from Minuteman-1 and two Pegasus blocks, which also did not maneuver and flew along a known trajectory with known parameters. Well, damn it, these are precisely no decoys, and precisely the kinetic defeat of a given and previously known point.
        What is PRO, what does PRO have to do with it? This is the defeat of a known point in space - in their own words - without any selection of targets.
        Maybe where there were false ones, only then they got to those unsuccessful ones ...
        1. +2
          April 4 2023 12: 27
          = However, exactly what was in the INF Treaty about liquidation, a ban on the development and testing of such things? That is, no target missile HAS THE RIGHT to be similar in characteristics to the INF missile, =
          In fact, more than it can, there are reservations in the INF Treaty.

          11. A ballistic missile, which is not a missile for use in a ground-based version, is not considered to be a BRNB if the test launch of such a missile is carried out at the launch position for testing from a stationary ground-based launcher, which is used solely for testing purposes and which is distinguishable from launchers BRNB. A cruise missile, which is not a missile for use in a ground-based variant, is not considered as an ALCM if the test launch of such a missile is carried out at the launch position for testing from a stationary ground-based launcher, which is used solely for testing purposes and which is distinguishable from the ALCS launchers.


          12. Each Party shall have the right to manufacture and use, for boosters that might otherwise be considered medium-range or shorter-range missiles, only existing types of booster stages for such boosters. Launches of such boosters are not considered to be flight tests of intermediate-range and shorter-range missiles, provided that:
          a) the stages used in such accelerator facilities differ from the stages used in missiles, which are referred to in article III of this Treaty as existing types of missiles of medium range or shorter range;
          (b) such boosters are only used for research and development purposes to test objects, not the boosters themselves;"

          That is, point "A" already allows you to assemble targets from stages that are not RSD, which the Americans used using the "shotguns" of the "Minuteman", etc.
        2. +1
          April 4 2023 12: 47
          And then even steeper, for which the second journalist flew. English on white was declared. that interference and false targets were NOT used in the tests, after 5 minutes of chatter - "the test showed the high efficiency of the new target selection system for rejecting false targets", then the journalist's question - you did not use false targets, how did you test the system?
          Well, I’m unlikely to find this report now, I don’t even remember the year, but in a completely American press, not oppositional or little known ... It’s just not customary to pay special attention to jambs.

          Something tells me that about the "deportation" of a journalist, etc. it was by no means in the report, but in some kind of "translation" of the Ramsay-Shurygin style. Because in this reality, staffers describe in detail what means of the PCB PRO they use, and yes, they have been there all of a sudden for a long time. Technically, they could not declare the absence of a PCB in relatively recent tests.

          And then - the SM-3 tests were successful - they knocked over a satellite flying along a known trajectory and this target from Minuteman-1 and two Pegasus blocks, which also did not maneuver and flew along a known trajectory with known parameters. Well, damn it, these are precisely no decoys, and precisely the kinetic defeat of a given and previously known point.


          In general, it will be necessary to re-find the relevant reports of the Missile Defense Agency ... and write an additional article. For in our country, as always: the General Staff spoke in full detail about the threat from missile defense, but the hordes of "patriotic" bloggers, as usual, know better.
          1. -4
            April 4 2023 14: 22
            Well, ninai-ninai, I definitely read about the test by the mattresses, it’s just that English somehow needs to be maintained at the level, so I’m having fun. They had it - both about the journalist and about the absence of decoys, so why did they buy it ...
            1. +1
              April 4 2023 14: 55
              Quote from Bingo
              Well, ninai-ninai, I definitely read about the test by the mattresses, it’s just that English somehow needs to be maintained at the level, so I’m having fun. They had it - both about the journalist and about the absence of decoys, so why did they buy it ...


              1. In general, the "brought out journalist", if he existed, acted quite in line with the official American propaganda.
              When questions began to the States from the side of the same Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs on the topic "Washington swore that the SM-3 is only against the Iranian and Co. missiles, but intercepts ICBMs," the Americans began to make excuses about this other / downed ICBM is not a full-fledged equivalent of Russian. And it was just the official / mainstream propaganda position.
              However, even within the framework of this demagogy, there was not a word about the complete absence of the PCB.
              2. Well, if such a scandal happened in reality - and every hat thrower would refer to it for decades with reference to specific source.

              In general, the saga of a journalist is similar to the work of "ultrapatriots" according to the scheme, "Western propaganda" + a damaged phone.
              So they were wrong, apparently. Memory is such a thing, confusion with sources is just an evergreen problem. I here chronically forget authors.
    2. 0
      April 4 2023 20: 55
      for guaranteed vitrification of Moscow with missile defense, now you need to apply a very fucking


      No, not to hell, it's not about quantity, but about time.
      The task of the Moscow missile defense system is simple - to repel only the very FIRST strike. So that the country's leadership is guaranteed to have time to go down to the shelters.

      The enemy's algorithm is simple.
      We launch 10 warheads + 100 decoys in the first wave across Moscow.
      To reliably repel such a first strike, absolutely ALL anti-missiles will have to be launched (68 anti-missiles are deployed around Moscow in 5 districts, 12-16 launchers each). The reload there is long, so we won’t have time to reload the launcher for sure, there’s even no calculation for this.
      In addition, air nuclear explosions around Moscow will ionize the atmosphere and completely blind our missile defense radars.

      And after that, the enemy calmly launches the second wave to Moscow.
      But the main goal of the missile defense system has been achieved: the leadership has already successfully hidden itself and cannot be reached.
  10. +1
    April 4 2023 08: 10
    In other words - where are the Soviet cruise missiles? And if the founders of the Yeltsin Center destroyed them, where are the modern developments?
  11. +1
    April 4 2023 09: 06
    There is only one conclusion. Or rather, two, but I will not consider the second.
    So, if it becomes clear that there are not enough forces for a retaliatory strike, then it is necessary to strike a preemptive one. Such a concept, of course, will greatly change everything, but I see no other way out. Our military industry has lagged behind NATO, and no matter how propagandists and gullible consumers of noodles puff up, the lag is only increasing.
    1. +1
      April 4 2023 13: 25
      Quote: acetophenon
      Our military industry has lagged behind NATO, and no matter how propagandists and gullible consumers of noodles puff up, the lag is only increasing.

      This is what is scary. That in fact they have not started yet, but we have already strained.
  12. +2
    April 4 2023 09: 45
    The author generally omitted the role of the Foreign Ministry, Lavrov, and the possibility of negotiations.

    But the reality is that until the age of 14, the Maidan, the Rostov billionaire inmate, Ukraine did not think about NATO, Pershings, etc. She couldn't have imagined this in her wildest dreams. Here the Foreign Ministry and Lavrov could prove themselves, but .... they are by no means famous for victories in diplomacy.

    But after the loss of territories, there was only one way out - intensify or disappear.
    And again, neither Lavrov nor the Foreign Ministry showed any talent. They did not achieve any real agreements and did not want to, apparently.

    And after February 24, they suddenly began to remember red lines, pershings, etc.
    Although they were not in Ukraine and are not. Again, neither Lavrov nor the Foreign Ministry showed anything, although when Ukraine lost part of its territory, it was both difficult and possible at the same time
    There are Chinese initiatives, Endogan, Macron, even Simonyan ....
    But neither Lavrov nor the Foreign Ministry hear anything real...

    If we remove the opportunity to negotiate at all, then the Baltic countries of NATO, Turkey, Finland, Japan are close at hand - what is the flying time there?
    1. +2
      April 4 2023 10: 49
      But the reality is that until the age of 14, the Maidan, the Rostov billionaire inmate, Ukraine did not think about NATO, Pershings, etc. She couldn't have imagined this in her worst nightmare.

      this is a delusion, the outskirts of the exercise with NATO have been conducting since the 90s!
      1. +4
        April 4 2023 16: 33
        Quote: Vladimir80
        the outskirts of the exercises with NATO have been conducting since the 90s!

        Russia also participated in such exercises until 2008. At the same time, Ukraine also participated in joint exercises with the Russian Federation - in particular, in 2001, a Tu-154 was shot down during such an event. Then it was called "rich vector".
        1. -2
          April 4 2023 17: 21
          in particular, in 2001, during such an event, a Tu-154 was shot down

          that 154 was shot down by the Okraenskie pvoshniks, period, no need to invent about Russia's involvement in this!
      2. +2
        April 4 2023 21: 01
        the outskirts of the exercises with NATO have been conducting since the 90s!


        Until 2013, Russia also conducted joint exercises with NATO. For example:
        https://www.nato.int/cps/ru/natohq/news_103663.htm
        On Friday (September 27), fighter jets from the air forces of Turkey, Poland and Russia, together with air traffic control (ATC) officers, successfully completed a five-day joint NATO-Russia anti-terrorist military exercise, Vigilant Sky 2013.
        The purpose of the exercise is to strengthen cooperation in the field of airspace security...
    2. +1
      April 4 2023 11: 18
      Quote: Max1995
      If we remove the opportunity to negotiate at all, then the Baltic countries of NATO, Turkey, Finland, Japan are close at hand - what is the flying time there?


      1. For the Baltics and Finland, there is an analysis right in the article.
      2. Nothing can be obtained from Japan with a normal flight time. Distance Sapporo-Irkutsk - 2900+ km, with a range of LRHW 2750+. That is, perhaps one the positional area will be at the limit of range, but time ...
      3. From Turkey, yes, it is potentially possible to threaten the South Ural position areas. In combination with Finland stands Ukraine. Only now the Turks are not rushing into battle yet, and the unreliability of this position against the backdrop of evergreen problems around Incirlik is clearly recognized in Washington.
      In general, the deployment of missile defense and the "strengthening" of the eastern positional areas is inevitable in any case, but while from this direction the ax does not hang overhead.
      1. +1
        April 4 2023 13: 28
        Quote: Alarmist79
        In general, the deployment of missile defense and the "strengthening" of the eastern positional areas is inevitable in any case, but so far the ax does not hang overhead from this direction.

        Wait, isn't that the same Turkey that recently approved Finland's entry into NATO? Although our turbopatriots on the payroll sang about what they never did.
        1. +2
          April 4 2023 14: 12
          Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
          Wait, isn't that the same Turkey that recently approved Finland's entry into NATO?

          It is one thing to substitute Fink for missiles and quite another to substitute them yourself in the face of growing escalation
          .
      2. +1
        April 4 2023 15: 24
        Quote: Alarmist79
        From Japan with a normal flight time, you can not get anything at all. Distance Sapporo-Irkutsk - 2900+ km, with a range of LRHW 2750+.

        What is the conclusion from this? It is necessary to talk more often on TV that Kazakhstan is not a real country and it should be liberated from the Nazis, partially or completely.

        Virginia in the Arctic Ocean + positions of the RMSD in Kazakhstan - and Russia no longer seems such a big country.
        1. +1
          April 4 2023 15: 46
          Quote: Negro
          Virginia in the Arctic Ocean + RMSD positions in Kazakhstan - and Russia no longer seems such a big country

          These are your girlish dreams, Ukro-Afor-American Yes
        2. 0
          April 4 2023 16: 23
          What is the conclusion from this? We need to talk more often on TV that Kazakhstan is not a real country

          Cheap juggling. This was said just in the context of the NATO-2008 summit, when Ukraine already broke into NATO with the support of the United States and the process was stopped only by the sabotage of the frightened French and Co.,
          and it would be necessary to free her from the Nazis, partially or partially

          and it would be necessary to free her from the Nazis, partially or completely.

          Yeah. Angelic patience and the highest tolerance for nationally preoccupied Russia has already been practiced. The result is in the form of a brave fascisation under the strict guidance of the Washington region on the scoreboard. We have what we have + your spreading cranberries. Next time it's better to use only cranberries.
          1. +1
            April 4 2023 16: 37
            Quote: Alarmist79
            Yeah. Angelic patience and the highest tolerance for nationally preoccupied Russia has already been practiced. The result in the form of a brave fascisation under the strict guidance of the Washington region on the scoreboard

            )))
            If there is a hint of Ukraine, then until 2014 the largest Russian military base abroad was located in this country. How it ended for Ukraine is well known.
            1. -3
              April 4 2023 17: 10
              Quote: Negro
              If there is a hint of Ukraine, then until 2014 the largest Russian military base abroad was located in this country

              Which Ukraine decided to insect. Did not work out request

              I wonder what would happen, for example, to Cuba, if she thought of doing the same with Guantanamo? Well, and a couple more examples - Japan is there, Türkiye ... purely for example Yes
              1. 0
                April 4 2023 17: 47
                I wonder what would happen, for example, to Cuba, if she thought of doing the same with Guantanamo

                There is a much more straightforward example. Panama/Noriega.
            2. +1
              April 4 2023 17: 37
              Quote: Negro
              If there is a hint of Ukraine, then until 2014 the largest Russian military base abroad was located in this country. How it ended for Ukraine is well known.

              That is, if we removed the base, the Americans would break into Ukraine weaker, and the Ukrainians would ride lower?
              1. Do you have fresh cranberries? And then we just removed the bases from Georgia before the attack of the brave Georgians in South Ossetia.
              2. The population that does not like Bandera and Shukhevych and sent Kyiv to the swamp in 2014, should they also be removed somewhere? Actually, this is called ethnic cleansing, but it is just expected from a Svidomo Afro-Ukrainian, yes.
              1. 0
                April 4 2023 19: 51
                Quote: Alarmist79
                That is, if we removed the base, the Americans would break into Ukraine weaker, and the Ukrainians would ride lower?

                If the Ukrainians had removed this base, then we would not have seen a series with polite people. Which of course does not preclude watching the rest of the series.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                And then we just removed the bases from Georgia before the attack of the brave Georgians in South Ossetia.

                Where did you manage to remove the bases from? From Tskhinval?
                Quote: Alarmist79
                The population that does not like Bandera and Shukhevych and sent Kyiv to the swamp in 2014 should also be removed somewhere?

                Anywhere, it's up to you.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                It's actually called ethnic cleansing.

                Well, let yourself be called. You seem to be discussing the flight time to Moscow here. There is something to worry about besides ethnic cleansing in foreign countries.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Panama/Noriega

                )))
                Comrade Noriega tried very hard, there was nothing like it in 2014. On the other hand, the Russian Federation is not the USA of the 90th year, you see.
                1. +1
                  April 4 2023 20: 27
                  If the Ukrainians had removed this base, then we would not have seen a series with polite people. Which of course does not preclude watching the rest of the series.


                  That is, according to the results of Ukrainian creatives of the Odessa type, viewing would begin immediately with an impolite series, right.

                  Quote: Negro
                  Where did you manage to remove the bases from? From Tskhinval?

                  From Batumi and Alkhalaki, ahead of schedule, by November 2007. Eee?
                  There was never a Russian military base in Tskhinvali.

                  Anywhere, it's up to you.

                  That is, the ethnic cleansing of Russians is right and fine, but of Americans or proto-Ukrainians is a terrible barbarity?
                  And with such a position, you manage to be offended by the fact that you are kicked?

                  Quote: Negro
                  Well, let yourself be called

                  Well, that's what they beat.


                  Quote: Negro
                  You seem to be discussing the flight time to Moscow here. There is something to worry about besides ethnic cleansing in foreign countries.


                  And what, the appeasement of the Nazis somehow reduces their appetites? First time I hear. Now I will hear that the approval of ethnic cleansing is not schiry Nazism, yeah. "Ashotakov".

                  Quote: Negro
                  Comrade Noriega tried very hard, there was nothing like it in 2014.

                  I mean, "Since the beginning of 1987, after the government of Panama refused to provide the US with the territory of the country to conduct activities against Nicaragua, relations between Panama and the US have deteriorated further." There really wasn't.
                  1. +1
                    April 5 2023 11: 55
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Ukrainian creatives of the Odessa type, viewing would immediately begin with an impolite series,

                    42 people died in the House of Trade Unions. For context, in Slovyansk in April-May 2014, at least twice as many died. In total, during "these 8 years" about 15 thousand people died in the Donbass, of which about a third were civilians.

                    Odessa was lucky then.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    From Batumi and Alkhalaki, ahead of schedule, by November 2007. Eee?

                    This is a little bit in other directions relative to Ossetia.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    There was never a Russian military base in Tskhinvali.

                    In 2009, the 4th appeared. For 2008, you are technically right, the SPKF was not considered a Russian military base.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    That is, the ethnic cleansing of Russians is right and fine

                    Well, at the expense of the results of the ethnic cleansing of Donbass, we will find out a little later who will live. I would prefer more moderate measures, but there are people who share your views.

                    As for the Americans and the "proto-Ukrainians", they will somehow sort it out themselves.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    in this position, do you manage to be offended by the fact that you are kicked?

                    I? You are confusing me with someone else.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Well, that's what they beat.

                    They beat, as V.V. rightly noted. Putin, the weak - because it is dangerous to beat the strong. Of course, it's a shame to have a neighbor in the 21st century who beats the weak, but there's nothing to be done about it.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    And what, the appeasement of the Nazis somehow reduces their appetites?

                    What are the appetites? I don't recall that the Nazis were so itching to clarify the flight time to Moscow. Moreover, I remember well how the Nazis demilitarized: Kuchma gave away nuclear weapons, Yushchenko sawed up Elbrus, Yanukovych gave cruise missiles on account of a debt for stolen gas.

                    Now, of course, they regret it. What are the Nazis without the Weapon of Retribution? Not Nazis, but one shame.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Now I will hear that the approval of ethnic cleansing is not a big Nazism, huh

                    Of course not. National Socialism is a rather specific social system. The main National Socialist of our time is, of course, Comrade Xi, a great friend of Russia and Russians. He has both socialism (in his own Chinese way, of course) and Han nationalism.

                    In Ukraine, whatever one may say, socialism is definitely not dancing. Though with purges, though without.

                    But you can call KVNs Nazis, it's funny.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    I mean, "Since the beginning of 1987, after the government of Panama refused to provide the US with the territory of the country to conduct activities against Nicaragua, relations between Panama and the US have deteriorated further." Really wasn't

                    There, the comrade was asking for all the two Reagan terms, and asked for it only under Bush. Including statements about the war with the United States in the "parliament". Well, war is war, get it - sign it.
                    1. 0
                      April 5 2023 15: 32
                      42 people died in the House of Trade Unions. For context, in Slovyansk in April-May 2014, at least twice as many died. In total, during "these 8 years" about 15 thousand people died in the Donbass, of which about a third were civilians.

                      That is, the fact that the authors of the house of trade unions also staged a massacre in the Donbass justifies the geeks who staged the house of trade unions? In the sense, “could they have killed 50 times more”? Well, for animal Nazism and "Hottentot" morality, they beat you.

                      Odessa was lucky then.

                      That is, we need to drive a herd of banderni together with you into some kind of shed and burn it for the sake of good air and order in the native Zhmerinka - and then Zhmerinka will also be lucky?
                      Do not persuade, we are talking about "hang by the neck" basically.

                      This is a little bit in other directions relative to Ossetia

                      AND? The fascist proto-ukrams had nowhere to establish a new ordnung except Sevastopol, or what? How is it in proto-Ukrainian - "searching"?

                      In 2009, the 4th appeared.

                      Was it before and after the attempt to clean up Ossetia from the wrong Ossetians? Ah, after….

                      Well, at the expense of the results of the ethnic cleansing of Donbass, we will find out a little later who will live. I would prefer more moderate measures.

                      Like Odessa?

                      but there are people who share your views.

                      Regarding the admissibility and desirability of ethnic cleansing of the Donbass from the haters of Hauptmann Shukhevych and Bandera, you deigned to burst out. where does this translation of the arrows come from? What, is there a prospect of being given away from somewhere for half a bag of potatoes?

                      I? You are confusing me with someone else.

                      Come on, resentment for Ridna Zhmerinka in your case is obvious.

                      They beat, as V.V. rightly noted. Putin, the weak - because it is dangerous to beat the strong. Of course, it’s very disappointing to have a neighbor in the 21st century who beats the weak, but there’s nothing to be done
                      .
                      The whimpering about the “weak ones being beaten” right after the cries about the correctness of Odessa is a masterpiece, yes. “If a svitla warrior burns, it’s good, if a svitla warrior is nailed, that’s bad.” Well, that's why the "Hottentot" morality is in quotation marks - the unfortunate Hottentots did not say anything like that. Unlike some Neolithic savages in the neighborhood of Russia.
                      And yes, in order not to pay for this, it’s not enough to even be a hegemon - “bloody Assyria” for some reason was unlucky, not to mention petty bastards like the Third Reich.

                      What are the appetites? I don't recall that the Nazis were so itching to clarify the flight time to Moscow.

                      Is it true? And what did Yuscher forget in NATO and what did the whole vyshyvanochno-ziuyuskaya party of Ukrainushka dream about in the 90s and later? You have forgotten that we are Russians, and memory, like that of guppies, is a purely Ukrainian feature of cerebral activity.
                      , Yanukovych gave cruise missiles on account of a debt for stolen gas.

                      Yanukovych suddenly a Nazi? What a farmer's trick, I would say.

                      Of course not. National Socialism is a rather specific social system.

                      And what about the system, if we are talking specifically about ideology?

                      There, the comrade was asking for all the two Reagan terms, and asked for it only under Bush.


                      Yes, I remember the criminal refusal to provide support for the Contras.
                      Including statements about the war with the United States in the "parliament".

                      Did Noriega notice the preparations for the attack, which happened 4 days later?
                      But generally agreed. If you refuse to provide support for saboteurs somewhere in Romania/Poland, we must deal with you ... democratically.
                      1. +1
                        April 6 2023 16: 55
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        That is, the fact that the authors of the house of trade unions also staged a massacre in the Donbass justifies the geeks who staged the house of trade unions?

                        Of course it doesn't justify. But in the Donbass, these geeks were able to kill much more people even last time, not to mention that.

                        By the way, why is it necessary to "cut", what kind of barbarism? We are not in Rwanda. The Soviet government provided artillery for everyone.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        That is, we need to drive a herd of banderni together with you into some kind of shed and burn it for the sake of good air and order in Ridny Zhmerinka

                        When you get to Zhmerinka, we'll discuss your ideas.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        The fascist proto-ukrams had nowhere to install a new ordnung except Sevastopol

                        And why is Sevastopol worse or better than all other cities?
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Regarding the admissibility and desirability of ethnic cleansing of the Donbass from the haters of Hauptmann Shukhevych and Bandera, you deigned to burst out.

                        I am not a supporter of such brutal methods. Quite a few people who dislike Bandera and Shukhevych from Donetsk and Luhansk have had a horizontal life, so to speak. The example of Odessa (as well as Kharkov, Dnipro and other Russian-speaking cities) shows that this was not necessary at all.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        I would prefer more moderate measures.

                        Like Odessa?

                        In Odessa, there was a mess on the Ukrainian side and the Russian headquarters. This is what caused the tragedy. Where the authorities dealt with each other faster, there was a small fight (Kharkov) or even a couple of rallies (Dnipro).

                        Therefore, by the way, for Donbass, my questions are not to the Russian world - the Russian world was like this yesterday and will be like that tomorrow - but to Akhmetov.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Whining about the “weak being beaten” right after the cries about the correctness of Odessa is a masterpiece, yes

                        What does the "whining" and Odessa have to do with it? 8 years of talking about the war with the Russian Federation and getting troops in the suburbs of the capital on the second day is a shame. Nazi grandfathers did not fight like that.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        And what did Yuscher forget in NATO and what did the whole vyshyvanochno-ziuyuskaya party of Ukrainushka dream about in the 90s and later?

                        Have you suddenly started to believe Ukrainian politicians? NATO is not waiting for Ukraine even now (despite your calculations on flight time), and even more so under Yushchenko. There, even without Ukraine, they recruited an excess of squabblers, rogues and freeloaders.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Yanukovych suddenly a Nazi?

                        What is the Reich, such are the Nazis.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        talking about ideology

                        Any ideology is good for cutting people.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Did Noriega notice the preparations for the attack, which happened 4 days later?

                        He tried for ten years, not 4 days. An angelic patience man was Reagan's grandfather.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        we must deal with you ... democratically.

                        To act democratically is like Panama, a week and 24 dead on their part? The deed has not grown, dear friend. So we have what we have.
      3. -1
        April 4 2023 20: 05
        To comment 11:18 Alarmist 79.
        Add Kazakhstan to your layout and the puzzle will fit.
    3. +4
      April 4 2023 11: 28
      Quote: Max1995
      Here the Foreign Ministry and Lavrov could prove themselves, but .... they are by no means famous for victories in diplomacy.

      This motive sounds very loud and constantly) What do you and your like-minded people want from Lavrov and the Foreign Ministry ?! The Ministry of Foreign Affairs is by no means an independent force! You seem to be constantly shaking the uniforms of poor cashiers in stores, demanding that they lower their prices) Cashiers cannot do this.
      The Ministry of Foreign Affairs, in principle, cannot achieve what its country has not achieved. It's not his job at all. As a campaign lawyer, he can't get a big contract. The maximum that the employees of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Lavrov in particular can do is to correct some wording. And then their implementation will actually depend not on the wording, but on how strong the Power he represents is.
      If we manage to win a serious military victory in Ukraine, ideally defeat their armies altogether and occupy all the desired territories, then Lavrov will be able to conclude cool treaties. If he tried to extort something like that in 2014, he would simply run into: Fuck you ... And that's it. And we would have to wipe ourselves out if, in response to the message, our army would not have entered into action.
      Leave the sellers alone.)
      Gromyko achieved a lot for the USSR. For the simple reason that he could say such things, for example. When someone at the UN uttered a peep, saying that Turkey would close the Straits for the USSR, Gromyko calmly declared that then there would be neither Turkey nor the Straits, there would be a wide channel with free passage. And everyone described themselves, because the USSR could and was ready to do this - to bang nuclear weapons by arranging that same channel. That is, it was not Gromyko's mastery of the tongue-lashing. It was the power and combat readiness of the USSR. Well, at least it's clearer?)
      1. 0
        April 4 2023 19: 41
        Quote: Mikhail3
        Gromyko achieved a lot for the USSR. For the simple reason that he could say such things, for example. When someone at the UN uttered a peep, saying that Turkey would close the Straits for the USSR, Gromyko calmly declared that then there would be neither Turkey nor the Straits, there would be a wide channel with free passage.

        ))
        You very opportunely remind that Gromyko was the Soviet Dmitry Medvedev. And lately, many have had the illusion that the current Foreign Ministry is noticeably weaker than the Soviet one.

        No, it's okay.
    4. 0
      April 9 2023 10: 08
      Here the Foreign Ministry and Lavrov could prove themselves, but.

      And who do you think Lavrov is Zeus? How can a diplomat change geopolitics?

      And again, neither Lavrov nor the Foreign Ministry showed any talent. They did not achieve any real agreements and did not want to, apparently.


      Unlike the negotiators of diplomats, the US, the State Department, the CIA and Soros did business - deployed a network of NGOs, trained militants, sponsored and promoted Bandera to power. Lavrov alone is not able to resist this, this can only be done by the state with its combined power. That is, claims for inaction should be presented to the authorities of the Russian Federation in general, and not to Lavrov. Let me remind you after the burning in Odessa, after the actual declaration of war by the Saloreich, the Kremlin recognized the Kyiv junta as the legitimate authority. How can Lavrov replace the Ministry of Defense and the government of the Russian Federation and the commander in chief?
      Again, neither Lavrov nor the Foreign Ministry showed in any way

      Maybe it was necessary to write in sportsloto?
  13. 0
    April 4 2023 09: 50
    Everything new is well forgotten old
    air defense towers - only higher and in a new look with MRLS, S-350/400/500/550 air defense systems, Pantsir air defense missile systems
  14. +1
    April 4 2023 11: 38
    The pathos of the article is clear. Why do we need Ukraine? Protect yourself from anti-missiles and US missiles. Let's say yes, we desperately need it. But! Our military-political leadership has come to the conclusion that the further liberation of Ukraine is impossible. The most combat-ready troops take Artemovsk for half a year, they still haven't taken it. Under Ugledar we received a heavy slap in the face. We would like to keep what we have. As a result, a new concept of the foreign policy of the Russian Federation appears. The West is not our enemy, but Europe is simply a friend. And we hope that Europe, which invited Vladimir Vladimirovich to The Hague, will come to its senses and we will establish good neighborly relations. The liberation of Ukraine from the Nazis, and at the same time NATO missiles, is not provided for in the KVP. We will negotiate, and God knows how far we will agree. Therefore, now it is necessary to write articles on the topic "green grapes", i.e. Ukraine is not so dangerous for us, you explained so convincingly that missiles in the Baltic States and Finland are impossible. Write another article that convincingly proves that missiles are impossible in Ukraine. And what, maybe it’s true, the West, having reconciled with Russia, will not threaten it with missiles in Ukraine.
    The West hated Russia so much that they built a bunch of car factories in it, the last factory built Mercedes. Several dozen Western brands produced a million cars out of a million and a half produced in Russia. In addition, Avtovaz (more than 300 vehicles a year) was 75% owned and operated by Western firms. Gearboxes, engines and other components from Europe and America were widely used in the truck industry. In March-April 2022, after the departure of Western firms, production fell by 98%, and work somehow resumed only by the end of the year. Now we have an absolutely sovereign auto industry, which really has to rush around the world in search of components that are not produced in Russia.
    In this world, you can't depend on anyone. A person living in the state goes to work, pays taxes, pays for an apartment, pays for goods in a store. A sovereign and independent bum who lives in a thermal chamber, and eats and dresses in a landfill. If the cops did not get it, full sovereignty and independence.
    1. -1
      April 4 2023 12: 12
      Quote from Igor
      The liberation of Ukraine from the Nazis, and at the same time NATO missiles, is not provided for in the KVP.

      In general, in the recently announced requirements of the Foreign Ministry, the demand for demilitarization and non-bloc status has not gone away. Simply because the requirement of demilitarization is just the key, the rest ... is optional.

      Quote from Igor
      Well, you so convincingly explained that missiles in the Baltic States and Finland are impossible.

      Thank you, but about the impossibility, I did not write anything at all. And especially I did not write this in relation to Finland, where it is quite likely. The point is that deploying missiles even in Finland will provide limited opportunities simply because of heartless geography

      Quote from Igor
      Write another article that convincingly proves that missiles are impossible in Ukraine.

      Even if you credit me with the villainous work for the AP, it is completely incomprehensible why this should be done. With the rocket theme, domestic propaganda has an epic fail, I suspect that it is quite conscious. Ovsyannikova's case lives on and wins. This article is guaranteed to drown in cries about the State Department on "patriotic" resources like "Global Adventure".

      Quote from Igor
      The West hated Russia so much that they built a bunch of car factories in it, the last factory built Mercedes.


      You might think that in another version, Chinese factories would not have stood here. See also the textbook quote about 300% profit.
      At the same time, if you want to know what animal hatred is, even go to a non-political Western forum. There, from the voice of the mainstream media and outside the context of the SVO, they will explain to you that, for example, the massacre of Russians is justified, not to mention apartheid, because bloody Russian colonialism. The cannibalistic fantasies and practices of Ukrainians are not invented by them, they are just an echo of Western propaganda.
      1. +1
        April 4 2023 13: 48
        Quote: Alarmist79
        The cannibalistic fantasies and practices of Ukrainians are not invented by them, they are just an echo of Western propaganda.

        Damn Western propaganda. If it were not for her, Ukrainians would immediately become white and fluffy. Or maybe you don’t need to attract by the ears what is not attracted? And they will hit metaphysics explaining quite materialistically explainable things to themselves? All this is perfectly explained within the framework of Marxism and has long been chewed. The economic system, its laws make people act as they do. Therefore, we have a flow of migrants, both in the US and in the EU. Therefore, we all have problems with demographics. Therefore, now in Ukraine, Russians and Ukrainians are killing each other. And tomorrow the Americans and the Chinese will probably kill each other.
        1. +1
          April 4 2023 15: 25
          Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
          Damn Western propaganda. If it were not for her, Ukrainians would immediately become white and fluffy.



          They just tell you that theses like "bastard Russia without toilets" and the legality of the massacre are straight pulled from the Western mainstream.

          All this is perfectly explained within the framework of Marxism.

          Could immediately refer to the all-conquering teaching of voodooism. Predictive value is about the same.

          The economic system, its laws make people act as they do.

          That is, all nations under capitalism are obliged to hate each other, but under socialism will the air become more balanced? Is it okay that the roots of fierce neo-Nazi Russophobia and mutual "love" in the Caucasus and Central Asia are precisely Soviet?
      2. +1
        April 4 2023 15: 24
        Alarmist79 Replying to your comment. Quote from the concept of foreign policy of the Russian Federation:
        "Russia's foreign policy is peaceful, open, predictable, consistent, pragmatic, based on respect for the universally recognized principles and norms of international law and the desire for equal international cooperation in order to solve common problems and promote common interests. Russia's attitude towards other states and interstate associations is determined constructive, neutral or unfriendly nature of their policy towards the Russian Federation."
        "Russia does not consider itself an enemy of the West, does not isolate itself from it, does not have hostile intentions towards it, and expects that in the future the states belonging to the Western community will realize the futility of their confrontational policy and hegemonic ambitions, will take into account the complex realities of a multipolar world and return to pragmatic interaction with Russia, guided by the principles of sovereign equality and respect for each other's interests. On this basis, the Russian Federation is ready for dialogue and cooperation."
        I was tortured on the phone to copy KVP. Read for yourself. In my opinion, there are no specific ultimatum requirements. The maximum requirement is to take into account the interests of Russia in general, its territorial integrity. There are many calls for respect for international law and the interests of sovereign countries. The demands for demilitarization and non-bloc status recently voiced by the Foreign Ministry (deputy minister for the CIS) have disappeared somewhere. In general, the topic of Ukraine, to put it mildly, is not pedaled. You can demand anything, for example: NATO borders for 1997, how to achieve this? But thank God we don't need it anymore.
        Your statements that the deployment of missiles in the Baltic States and Finland is unlikely for a number of reasons, I presented in an exaggerated form, as impossible, I apologize. Didn't think you'd get into an argument.
        Again, I apologize for the ironic passage about missiles in Ukraine.
        About profit. We were a country where you could make a profit on the production of cars. An engine-building plant was also built in Kaluga. And despite 300% of the profits, foreign companies left Russia, having suffered huge losses, here you have 300% of the profit!
        I know about animal hatred. Europe, I am sure, will still be ashamed of the unprecedented surge of Russophobia, comparable only to anti-Semitism in Germany in the 30s.
        BUT! I remember July 1, 2018, the night after the victory over Spain. Not only we rejoiced, foreigners also rejoiced for us, and not only Latin Americans. I was stopped by a group of European-dressed and European-looking people, who asked me to take a picture with them, and I was dressed quite normally, without any signs of a fan, and yet they captured me as a keepsake. That was the attitude. In Europe and after the Crimea, the attitude towards Russians was quite loyal. The Greeks are very friendly. In Paris, the porter admitted that he respects Putin very much. ABOUT! Putin!
        A few years have passed and animal hatred. Who is to blame and what to do?
        1. -1
          April 4 2023 16: 13
          BUT! I remember July 1, 2018, the night after the victory over Spain. Not only we rejoiced, foreigners also rejoiced for us, and not only Latin Americans. I was stopped by a group of European-dressed and European-looking people, who asked me to take a picture with them, and I was dressed quite normally, without any signs of a fan, and yet they captured me as a keepsake. That was the attitude

          Do you really think that the average inhabitants / consumers of propaganda about terrible Russia went to the World Cup? This is clearly not true.

          = In Europe and after the Crimea, the attitude towards Russians was quite loyal. =

          If you consider it “normal” that in a cafe they didn’t rush at you with a fork at the ready, but were polite on duty, then I have bad news for you. Likewise, they were polite to any future victims of the day the demolition began.

          = In Paris, the porter admitted that he respects Putin very much. ABOUT! Putin!=
          The problem is that such "porters" in the local population are an insignificant minority, while extras ...

          \uXNUMXd In Greece, very friendly \uXNUMXd
          The example of Greece is just indicative of the fact that they are a rare exception in old Europe. The Italians are still partially sane, but everything is already much more sad there.

          =Who is to blame=

          If the population moves out en masse to open Nazism with "orcs", etc. after a couple of clumsy fakes, there is only one explanation: thousand-year-old deposits of garbage in the head about Russian barbarians and their “racial” superiority.
          The evil people are to blame, who did not arrange for the “denazification” of the European inhabitants according to the “Americans in West Germany” scenario, through carpet bombing and the free private initiative of simple GIs. There are no other options to return this fauna to human form.
          1. 0
            April 5 2023 09: 54
            If a person does not want to see reality, he will not see it. Russophobia in Europe is a state policy. If you sympathize with the Russians, then you sympathize with Russia, which means you sympathize with the NWO, which she is carrying out, and this is just a crime. And for this threatens not ostracism, but criminal prosecution. And Russophobia became state policy not after a couple of fakes, but after the start of the NWO, which the West perceived as unprovoked aggression against a sovereign state, firstly, and as a declaration of war on the West after the failure of negotiations with it, secondly. In Europe, they did not hate Russians because there were no reasons to hate them. Rousseau tourist - a source of income. There are 69 slots in the Italian Visa Application Center. Do you want an annual Schengen visa for you? Let's! Once or twice and you have a one-year visa to Europe. So in Europe everyone dreamed of poking a Russian with a fork, they only held back, and now they stopped holding back? Have you been to Europe? I was not in tourist groups there, but I walked freely and had to communicate, albeit minimally. The attitude is mostly indifferent, rarely benevolent. Hate Russians? Lots of honor! Who are we to hate us!? Ordinary Russo tourists.
            1. +1
              April 5 2023 11: 10
              Quote from Igor
              If a person does not want to see reality, he will not see it.

              Yes, faith in good European common people - it is like that.

              Russophobia in Europe is a state policy.

              That is, say, behind the author of every Russophobic pearl on "everyday" forums is the European Commissioner with a gun?

              And for this threatens not ostracism, but criminal prosecution.

              Unless in Germany and Eastern European limitrophes.

              And Russophobia became state policy not after a couple of fakes,

              And what about the "state policy" if we are talking about the cuckoo of a simple European citizen who flew away to the area of ​​an Austrian artist with a mustache?

              which the West accepted

              That is, the West is not aware of its own plans for missile defense and the deployment of RSD, which even the latest tabloids wrote about?

              In Europe, they did not hate Russians because there were no reasons to hate them. Rousseau tourist - a source of income. There are 69 slots in the Italian Visa Application Center. Do you want an annual Schengen visa for you? Let's! Once or twice and you have a one-year visa to Europe.

              official criterion. For example, the Yugoslavs / Serbs actively rode to the West while the USSR was still alive. Did this somehow prevent the Serbs from carrying out ethnic cleansing to the joyful squealing of the Europeans?
              And yes, to pass off the attitude of Italians as typical of Europeans is generally a masterpiece.

              So in Europe everyone dreamed of poking a Russian with a fork, they only held back, and now they stopped holding back?

              Do you seriously think that the current attitude appeared at the click of a finger? Once again, slowly - eating frankly garbage propaganda is possible only with the corresponding twist of the brain. And the Europeans turned out of great and pure love for the same all kinds of Mujahideen and Co. in a completely unrestrained way twenty years before the NWO.

              Have you been to Europe?
              .
              Has anyone else been there?

              I was not in tourist groups there, but walked freely and had to communicate, albeit minimally
              .
              That is, having "minimally communicated" with the receptionist and Co., you have become a great expert on the state of mind of Europeans?
              Actually, a horde of expats is running around the country, and the Internet is generally a big village. I am now thinking where to find suitable photographs of the Luna / Frog launcher for the German, for example. But Rousseau tourist, who talked with the porter, seriously thinks that he has joined.

              The attitude is mostly indifferent, rarely benevolent. Hate Russians? Lots of honor!

              That is, it is really a criterion for you that they didn’t throw an ax at you on the streets. And on June 21, 1941, in Germany, someone rushed at the Russians with an ax? Unfortunate slandered Hans and Fritz, yeah.
            2. 0
              April 9 2023 08: 10
              Nazism in Europe was revived not in connection with Russia's blow to Nazism.
        2. 0
          April 4 2023 17: 10
          Quote from the concept of foreign policy of the Russian Federation:

          We are talking about the conditions announced by the Deputy Foreign Minister no later than March 29th. And here the concept is a very interesting question.
          https://eadaily.com/ru/news/2023/03/29/rossiya-ozvuchila-10-usloviy-dlya-ustanovleniya-ustoychivogo-mira-na-ukraine-i-v-evrope
          1. +1
            April 5 2023 08: 57
            Conditions announced by the Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs, for internal use, for turbo-patriots upset by the current state of affairs. Therefore, they were voiced by the Deputy Minister for the CIS. Those. no one, and a day later a large-scale document appears - the concept of Russia's foreign policy, for the West, with proposals to make peace. Guys, let's live together, this is the essence of this concept. We wanted to solve the problems by force, but there was little strength, so the situation is not suitable for ultimatums. They are for internal use. And the West will ignore both our ultimatums and our offers of friendship.
            1. 0
              April 5 2023 10: 36
              The conditions announced by the Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs, for internal use, for turbo-patriots upset by the current state of affairs ... and a large-scale document appears a day later - the concept of Russia's foreign policy, for the West, with proposals to make peace.

              1. That is specific do you refute the statements with conspiracy and references to a generalized demagoguery document, where the default style will be "for all the good against the bad" and "we are for world peace"?
              2. That is, it was necessary to write in the concept "we will tear the West to shreds" - well, so that supplies to Ukraine would be larger and longer, and Western propaganda seized it with all its claws? Brilliant.
    2. 0
      April 4 2023 13: 35
      Quote from Igor
      The West hated Russia so much

      Where is love and hate? It's just business. Take off your rose-colored glasses. This is how capitalism works, today they smile favorably at you, and tomorrow they hit you on the head and take away the last thing. You don't seem to understand what's going on. And the robbery of Russia is being prepared. Colossal and hitherto unseen. And that is why the EU imposes sanctions so unanimously and suffers losses. Because they believe that tomorrow it will beat them back a hundredfold.
      1. +1
        April 5 2023 11: 30
        I answered you yesterday, but I pressed the wrong thing and the answer flew away, but I was too lazy to repeat then, I apologize.
        About the hatred of the West is ironic. He hated it so much that he built a bunch of car factories.
        Prepare to plunder Russia? What do we have to steal? What can the Western economy get in Russia? Industry and workers? But the Western economy has left Russia and apparently will not return. Minerals? It is almost only energy carriers. Do you think they need someone? The United States is the largest or one of the largest countries in terms of oil, gas and coal production. In Canada, UK oil. Gas in Holland and Norway. Australia has gas and coal. In Poland and Germany coal. Romania has oil. These are only Western countries. And in the world in general there is a sea of ​​energy carriers. They will live without ours and will not notice. We sold gas to Europe many times lower than market prices. The money from the sale went to the oligarchs and placed in Western banks. Now that was a robbery!
        Are we being robbed? Scared ....
        1. 0
          April 9 2023 08: 17
          How the official state hatred of the US is now linked to the construction of factories in the past. The sources of both are different persons with opposite goals and not linked to each other in a system.
    3. +2
      April 4 2023 21: 54
      Quote from Igor
      Now we have an absolutely sovereign auto industry,

      Are these Chinese Havals with Muscovites - a sovereign auto industry? They changed the steel awl to an iron nail.
      1. 0
        April 5 2023 10: 46
        Quote: mordvin xnumx
        Quote from Igor
        Now we have an absolutely sovereign auto industry,

        Are these Chinese Havals with Muscovites - a sovereign auto industry? They changed the steel awl to an iron nail.

        That was the irony.
  15. +2
    April 4 2023 11: 48
    Russia throughout history has been forced to respond to threats from outside, and often the reaction is late, or disproportionate to the threat. History shows that no treaties with the Anglo-Saxons can be trusted! Therefore, it is necessary to place thermonuclear missiles in space in geostationary orbits over the territory of the United States, and along the places of geological faults on both sides of the states at great depths to install several deep-sea vehicles with multi-megaton charges. This is solvable. And there, let the enemies bark as much as they want - but they will know that no preemptive strike will save them!
  16. +3
    April 4 2023 12: 45
    I believe that all these drone flights deep into Russia are, first of all, probing the real situation regarding a preventive strike against us. These flights are primarily of interest to amers for the reaction of our air defense.
    1. +2
      April 4 2023 13: 15
      Quote: DmSol
      I believe that all these drone flights deep into Russia are, first of all, probing the real situation regarding a preventive strike against us. These flights are primarily of interest to amers for the reaction of our air defense.

      Yes exactly.
    2. 0
      April 4 2023 13: 38
      Quote: DmSol
      I believe that all these drone flights deep into Russia are, first of all, probing the real situation for a preventive strike against us.

      And this too. And an attempt to intimidate the population, to force them to fight the authorities. Do not think that every action has only one goal. This is the dumbest stupidity.
  17. +2
    April 4 2023 14: 28
    For example, placing missiles too close to the border makes it possible to shoot them down on the active part of the trajectory, that is, extremely effectively. Meanwhile, in the case of the Baltic states, the situation is aggravated by the presence of potential Russian positions in the rear (Kaliningrad and the Baltic Fleet), which ensures the interception "in pursuit", with a minimum approach speed - and the same probability of a miss.
    The author writes nonsense. There are no positions in the rear of the Balts. The Kaliningrad region is cut off from the Russian Federation, but it’s better to keep quiet about the DCBF, he can’t make any interceptions at the moment. With all this, the airfield network that the Balts inherited from the USSR is not mentioned, some are even capable of receiving strategic bombers. From Narva to St. Petersburg according to road signs 125 km! M142 HIMARS will easily demolish half of the city with only conventional ammunition, and if it is nuclear ... then it’s not worth talking about. The North-West direction is the most dangerous, and neither air defense nor missile defense is tightly covered. In the USSR, that direction was tightly covered by radar stations located along the entire coast of the Baltic Sea. There was also powerful air defense and missile defense, for example, a former Soviet military facility, a component of a missile attack warning system (SPRN). It was located approximately 4 km north of the Latvian town of Skrunda. Now all this is gone. The North-West is open from all directions. From the Baltic States is much closer to Moscow than, for example, from the Poltava region.
    1. 0
      April 4 2023 15: 15
      The author writes nonsense. There are no positions in the rear of the Baltic states.


      Did you not notice that this is written right in the passage you quoted?
      potential Russian positions


      Kaliningrad region, cut off from the Russian Federation,

      AND? In your opinion, is the disarming attack of IRMs a protracted process, during which echelons of anti-missiles need to be brought to Kalingrad?
      Or is something preventing you from sticking anything BEFORE the attack?
      The same with KBF. There are no insurmountable obstacles to deploying missile defense carriers in the Baltic, the main task of which is to survive a few minutes before launch.
      1. +1
        April 4 2023 19: 18
        Quote: Alarmist79
        Did you not notice that this is written right in the passage you quoted?
        potential Russian positions

        No need to build illusions, the Kaliningrad region, with a gulkin nose, you will not notice how after leaving Gusev you will be in Baltiysk. None there potential positions there’s not much to deploy. There, even during the Union of Forces, it was unmeasured, now it’s probably smaller, but still in abundance, freedom of maneuver even for the OTRK is not enough, to say the least. The DCBF is much weaker than the KChF, and there is only one base for the entire Baltic Sea - Baltiysk and the meager fleet there, if something happens, it will be covered from all directions. The Baltic itself has a well-developed road network since the times of the USSR, many of which go to the Russian Federation. ", you can increase the OTRK as much as you want, there is freedom of maneuver.
        Quote: Alarmist79
        There are no insurmountable obstacles to deploy missile defense carriers in the Baltic, the main task of which is to live a few minutes before launch

        The most insurmountable obstacle is the current government and the system that it has created, it does not even have a sense of self-preservation, and in order to create, build something, it cannot from the word at all. Only destroy. This is how missile units were placed in the Union
        Completely blocked the North-West direction. Now, driving through the Pskov region, it’s just, bitterly looking at the remains of the former power.
        Everything was broken, and something new will never be able to build. Therefore, the fate of the inhabitants of the city of Petra, and the North-West in the event of a conflict, will be unenviable.
        1. -3
          April 4 2023 19: 51
          No need to build illusions, the Kaliningrad region, with a gulkin nose, you will not notice how after leaving Gusev you will be in Baltiysk. There are not many potential positions to deploy
          .

          On an area comparable to Israel (15 sq. km versus 20,7), is there nowhere to deploy anti-missiles? Oh wow, poor Jews.

          The DCBF is much weaker than the KChF, and there is only one base for the entire Baltic Sea - Baltiysk and a meager fleet there, if something happens, it will be covered from all directions

          1. Actually, there are two bases, and this ... I understand that it will be extremely unusual, but you can’t keep part of the fleet NOT IN THE BASE?
          2. Once again, slowly. The task of potential anti-missile men is not to dictate an inflexible will, etc., but to live N-minutes before the missiles are fired.

          Quote: Unknown
          The most insurmountable obstacle is the current government and the system that she created, she does not even have a sense of self-preservation


          There is no need to attribute the cockroaches of the USSR to the evil capitalists.

          This is how missile units were placed in the Union

          1. That is, the Soviet economy to the point of impossibility to maintain these beauties and the USSR itself, too, Putin ruined? And even before the State Emergency Committee, the "renewed Union" looked like a purely confederation, and at the same time a bunch of broad Soviet leaders refused to sign even this.
          2. We guess in five minutes who will squeal about the bloody anti-people regime, if we raise military spending to the Soviet level. Really specialists in collaborationism from Gorby to Brest?
          1. 0
            April 5 2023 05: 44
            Quote: Alarmist79
            On an area comparable to Israel (15 sq. km versus 20,7), is there nowhere to deploy anti-missiles? Oh wow, poor Jews.

            There is no need to compare Israel with the Kaliningrad region, which is completely surrounded,not friendly countries, this is not the Arab League.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            1. Actually, there are two bases, and this ... I understand that it will be extremely unusual, but you can’t keep part of the fleet NOT IN THE BASE?

            Have you looked at the map?
            Where is the Gulf of Finland with Kronstadt, and where is Baltiysk. The port indicated on the map is Ust-Luga, only thirty kilometers from the coast of Estonia in a straight line, any modern howitzer will cover it.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            2. Once again, slowly. The task of potential anti-missile men is not to dictate an inflexible will, etc., but to live N-minutes before the missiles are fired.

            More times slowly , but will they let you live until the shooting then? Or they will immediately cover it without letting you utter a word, since the distance is scanty, you won’t have time to wake up.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            There is no need to attribute the cockroaches of the USSR to the evil capitalists.

            The USSR had the sad experience of the beginning of the Second World War, and the generals, along with the general secretaries, remember 1941 very welland didn't want a repeat. Therefore, they were worried about the DEFENSE of the country. Today they worship mammon, and they don't give a damn about the country.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            1. That is, the Soviet economy to the point of impossibility to maintain these beauties and the USSR itself, too, Putin ruined? And even before the State Emergency Committee, the "renewed Union" looked like a purely confederation, and at the same time a bunch of broad Soviet leaders refused to sign even this.
            2. We guess in five minutes who will squeal about the bloody anti-people regime, if we raise military spending to the Soviet level. Are specialists in collaborationism from Gorby to

            Let's say, he had a hand in the collapse, he was tied with Sobchak then. The USSR could contain these beauties, and much more that the current generation could not even dream of. But what can the authorities and the Russian Defense Ministry do now? Even arrange the release their promising UAVs , they themselves cannot, let alone launch the latest weapons into the series. That's what they do well, spend allocated funds. The real question is, where?
            1. -2
              April 5 2023 10: 14
              There is no need to compare Israel with the Kaliningrad region, which is completely surrounded by non-friendly countries, this is not a league of Arab states.

              And in what magical way does the environment prevent the deployment of anti-missiles in an area of ​​XNUMX/XNUMX of Israel, which will be fired in the first minutes of the conflict?

              The port indicated on the map is Ust-Luga, just thirty kilometers from the coast of Estonia in a straight line, any modern howitzer will cover it.

              That is, Estonia will shoot at transports carrying anti-missiles in peacetime? Or do you intend to deliver anti-missiles to Kalingrad in echelons AFTER all the RSMs are fired from the Baltic states? And what's the point of, uh... ritual?

              Once again slowly, but will they let you live until the shooting? Or they’ll cover it right away, without letting you utter a word, since the distance is scanty, you won’t have time to wake up
              .
              Once again, spell it out. It's about surviving for a few minutes. And no, the "death star" has not yet been invented.

              The USSR had the sad experience of the beginning of the Second World War, and the generals, together with the general secretaries, remembered 1941 very well, and did not want a repetition. Therefore, they were worried about the DEFENSE of the country. Today they worship mammon, and they don't give a damn about the country.

              That is, the "disinterested" Soviet elite sold the country in the 80s for two kopecks, but this is not out of concern for mammon? And the current one is butting heads with the West much more actively than the late USSR and across purely material desires, out of concern?
              Stop mirroring through and through the corrupt Soviet elite to the current reality.

              Let's say, he had a hand in the collapse, he was tied with Sobchak then.

              Putin worked in the GDR until the 90th year. It was he who brought the mighty Soviet economy from there to coupons for everything and queues for kilometers, right?

              =USSR, could contain these beauties, and much more that the current generation did not even dream of.

              Is it due to a much larger share of military spending in GDP + the size of the country? At the same time, cut your consumption to the level of the 80s (real, with queues and rotten potatoes in stores), howling in the swamps and fighting against the anti-national regime will be applied in full growth.

              =
              But what can the authorities and the Russian Defense Ministry do now? They themselves cannot even arrange the release of their promising UAVs =


              OMG. If we are talking about UAVs, then the USSR first overslept the direction of screw drones, and then gave birth to completely fierce scrap metal aka "Bee". At the same time, Israeli UAVs flew for a long time and stubbornly under the nose of "professional" military advisers until the air defense pogrom in the Bekaa. Then, as usual, the crooked-armed Arabs (tm) were to blame for everything.

              That's what they do well, spend the allocated funds. The real question is, where?

              That is, it was not in the USSR that they riveted a horde of cardboard armored personnel carriers / infantry fighting vehicles, outdated twenty years ago, invented 1001 “cheap and effective” means of combating aircraft carriers, which in total cost more than an aircraft carrier fleet with no efficiency, built hordes of submarines without rear infrastructure - why at sea were they present radically less than in the USA, and gave birth to three main tanks in service? And these are just "global" examples.
              In terms of unbridled lobbying and spending money, the devil knows where exactly the Soviet military-industrial complex is unrealistic to surpass.
              1. 0
                April 6 2023 05: 12
                Quote: Alarmist79
                And in what magical way does the environment prevent the deployment of anti-missiles in an area of ​​XNUMX/XNUMX of Israel, which will be fired in the first minutes of the conflict?

                The anti-missiles deployed in Israel could not intercept all the old Scuds launched by Iraq during Desert Storm with a conventional charge, but what if it was nuclear? What would then happen to tiny Israel?
                Quote: Alarmist79
                That is, Estonia will shoot at transports carrying anti-missiles in peacetime? Or do you intend to deliver anti-missiles to Kalingrad in echelons AFTER all the RSMs are fired from the Baltic states? And what's the point of, uh... ritual?

                The Estonian government has instructed the ministries to develop their position on the issue of introducing a coastal "contiguous zone" within a month. The creation of such a zone, according to Tallinn, will allow Estonia to "apply its laws and detain violators in a wider maritime territory."
                ...
                The problem is that if Estonia really takes this initiative to its logical conclusion, it could provoke a most dangerous crisis between Russia and the Western community. Since the introduction of the “contiguous zone” regime will give the Estonians the opportunity to block Russian warships and civilian ships from leaving Kronstadt and the ports of the Leningrad region through the Gulf of Finland to the Baltic Sea.
                These are still flowers, berries will be ahead.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                That is, the "disinterested" Soviet elite sold the country in the 80s for two kopecks, but this is not out of concern for mammon?

                More details about two kopecks? I wonder why carry nonsense, if in the 80s they were not even listed in the project?
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Putin worked in the GDR until the 90th year. It was he who brought the mighty Soviet economy from there to coupons for everything and queues for kilometers, right?

                There is no need to retell fairy tales, about coupons and other nonsense. When they appeared, and why, at the end of the 80s, I remember very well. So tell the tales about the Soviet era, tell the liberals, they will believe. About the president. The USSR was destroyed in 91. Upon returning from a business trip to the GDR to Leningrad in January 1990, remaining career officer of the KGB, Putin took the post of assistant to the rector of Leningrad State University for international affairs. In May 1990, shortly after the election of A. Sobchak as chairman of the Leningrad City Council (May 23), he became an adviser to the chairman of the Leningrad City Council.
                Putin's influence on Sobchak significantly exceeded the formal[3] (which Putin himself does not deny[2]). Dmitry Lenkov, who was the coordinator of the Democratic Russia faction in the Leningrad City Council, recalls that Putin’s relationship with the deputies “was quite positive”: for example, it was Putin who initiated negotiations between the Democratic Russia faction and Sobchak during a period of aggravation of relations between deputies and the Chairman of the Council at the beginning of 1991. And the role of Sobchak and "Democratic Russia" in the collapse of the USSR well known Yes, they did not particularly hide their participation. Yes .... what surnames, Gaidar, Popov, Burbulis, even Chubais, they were all there.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                OMG. If we are talking about UAVs, then the USSR first overslept the direction of screw drones, and then gave birth to completely fierce scrap metal aka "Bee". At the same time, Israeli UAVs flew for a long time and stubbornly under the nose of "professional" military advisers until the air defense pogrom in the Bekaa. Then, as usual, the crooked-armed Arabs (tm) were to blame for everything.

                "Bee" is a good UAV is still in service. And the Arabs are definitely crooked.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                That is, it was not in the USSR that they riveted a horde of cardboard armored personnel carriers / infantry fighting vehicles, outdated twenty years ago

                That's what they would do now, without Soviet infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers? Thanks to the USSR that there is still something left, otherwise it’s just a pipe. Yes, and they are hiding behind the Soviet "nuclear shield", although no one knows what condition it is in, well, they hope. Such a shield, the current Russia, cannot be made never when.
                1. -3
                  April 6 2023 09: 46
                  Anti-missiles stationed in Israel could not intercept all the old Scuds launched by Iraq during Desert Storm.

                  1. (facepalm) Why do we need to intercept everything? The task of the IRBMs starting from the Baltics is to knock out the main part of the nuclear arsenal within reach. Will it greatly help the States if what falls on them is reduced even by tens of percent?
                  2. The "Patriots" during the "Storm" had a glitch widely known in narrow circles - the software "floated" during long-term duty.
                  =, with a conventional charge, but what if it was nuclear? What would happen to tiny Israel then?

                  From single strikes, even with Israel, there would be nothing lethal, by the way.
                  The Estonian government instructed the ministries to develop their position within a month on the issue of introducing a coastal “contiguous zone

                  Launching a Russia-NATO war (and shelling ships is war) BEFORE the nuclear arsenal is neutralized is a case of extremely alternative talent.
                  At the same time, I repeat, especially for non-readers of articles that comment: it is too far from the Baltic states to the South Ural positional areas, the flight time is long.
                  More details about two kopecks?

                  That is, the collapse of the USSR, the surrender of everything and everything in Eastern Europe, the Bering Sea, then everywhere, the sabotage of the military during the State Emergency Committee - are these all Martians, and not the "honest" Soviet elite? At the same time, there is evidence of a mass purchase by the Americans of the brave Soviet military in August 1991.
                  = That's interesting, why carry nonsense, if in the 80s they were not even in the project?

                  Boy, I'm actually 79th. That is, he grew up against the backdrop of Soviet coupons, epic problems with soap, Soviet shops with a subtle smell of rotten vegetables, and "Arab boots" for half a salary as a sign of prosperity. And you don’t even have to try to lie to my face, out of the Soviet habit.
                  = Fairy tales, no need to retell, about coupons and other nonsense =

                  The son of some petty commander, or what? Special distributor and that's it?
                  \u80d. When they appeared, and why, at the end of the XNUMXs, I remember very well. \uXNUMXd

                  Talons, young man, did not appear at all in the late 80s, they were introduced relatively locally already in the late 70s. And why is really well known. The advanced system did not assimilate what even the agrarian appendages in Latin America assimilated, and depended on the import of food and cheap consumer goods. Plus, since the 60s, he has been printing unsecured candy wrappers. Where did the problems come from even during the “oil shock” of the 70s.
                  Well, then oil prices fell, and Gorby, instead of quietly building normal capitalism, like the Chinese, decided to “improve” socialism according to the recipes of the founders. Why there are even more candy wrappers, and the same "super-technological" laundry soap - even less. And voila.

                  Upon his return from a business trip to the GDR in Leningrad in January 1990, while remaining a career KGB officer, Putin took the post of assistant to the rector of Leningrad State University for international affairs. In May 1990, shortly after the election of A. Sobchak as chairman of the Leningrad City Council (May 23), he became an adviser to the chairman of the Leningrad City Council. Putin's influence on Sobchak significantly exceeded the formal[3] (which Putin himself does not deny[2])

                  AND? Did Sobchak destroy the Soviet economy? Or the illiteracy of products of the best education in the world like Gorby and congenital handicap (it didn’t work without mass executions)? Recall the statistics of Soviet marriage - since you watched the Soviet light industry because of the wide facade of the special distributor?
                  "Bee" is a good UAV is still in service.

                  It was garbage with wings, without a stabilized chamber, with a short flight time (Soyuz ALSO couldn’t get into high-quality ICE), etc.
                  “The head of intelligence of the Airborne Forces, Colonel Valery Yakhnovets, under whose leadership Stroy-PD was used in Georgia: – Together with the complex, six vehicles with specialists arrived in the group, but they also prepared the device for launch for more than three hours. As a result, the first drone crashed to the ground, barely taking off, and the second, already launched at the Georgian base in Senaki, did not allow us to see our convoy of ten armored personnel carriers: in a bad image, we could hardly find only five vehicles. At the same time, Georgian UAVs (Israeli Hermes 450 - author's note) flew at heights inaccessible to our air defense systems, and the "Bee" was so low that it seemed that it could be hit from a slingshot, and "growled" at the same time like an armored personnel carrier. So the effectiveness of the complex is zero and the Airborne Forces do not need it.
                  The Soviet industry was true to its ideal of a "bucket of nuts" in the main part of the military-industrial complex, all of a sudden.
                  Arabs are definitely crooked.

                  According to the stories of drop dead qualified advisers and manufacturers of Soviet military junk? Undoubtedly.
                  That's what they would do now, without Soviet infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers?

                  That is, you manage to be proud of the fact that the most progressive system generally riveted some kind of junk? Is this already a great achievement for socialism? Well, that's what we're talking about.
                  = Yes, and they are hiding behind the Soviet "nuclear shield", although no one knows what condition it is in, well, they hope. Such a shield, the current Russia, can never be made. =

                  The best Soviet education in the world, yeah. In reality, even Pakistan has nuclear weapons as such, and for more or less industrialized countries like Sweden, it was not a problem to acquire them already in the 60s. As for missiles, 2/3 of the Strategic Missile Forces are post-Soviet, almost half are STRONGLY post-Soviet (“Yars”)
                  1. -1
                    April 6 2023 19: 48
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Why do we need to capture everything? The task of the IRBMs starting from the Baltics is to knock out the main part of the nuclear arsenal within reach. Will it greatly help the States if what falls on them is reduced even by tens of percent?
                    2. The "Patriots" during the "Storm" had a glitch widely known in narrow circles - the software "floated" during long-term duty.

                    I wonder who we are? Israel, or the Kaliningrad region? Were you in a tight circle?
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    From single strikes, even with Israel, there would be nothing lethal, by the way

                    It depends on what and what charge if with a powerful hello to the promised land.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    At the same time, I repeat, especially for non-readers of articles that comment: it is too far from the Baltic states to the South Ural positional areas, the flight time is long.

                    You want to sit out behind the Urals. It is commendable. But what about the North-West of the Russian Federation? Truly "They do not cry in Ryazan about the Pskov crop failure",
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    At the same time, there is evidence of a mass purchase by the Americans of the brave Soviet military in August 1991.

                    It's interesting to see evidence of mass buying of the military. If this is not one grandmother from liberal circles said.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Boy, I'm actually 79th. That is, he grew up against the backdrop of Soviet coupons, epic problems with soap, Soviet shops with a subtle smell of rotten vegetables, and "Arab boots" for half a salary as a sign of prosperity. And you don’t even have to try to lie to my face, out of the Soviet habit.

                    What are you talking about? Since the 79th year? .. Yes, then you can safely judge the Soviet times. Where can I, from the age of 64, judge those distant times.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    Talons, young man, did not appear at all in the late 80s, they were introduced relatively locally already in the late 70s. And why is really well known. P

                    They were born at 79, and already knew that there were coupons?. The makings of a child prodigy. When, with sponges, they were still looking for my mother’s tit, I went to study at a vocational school, in the city of Kingisepp, the Leningrad Region, which was then rapidly being built, near which the Phosphorite plant was being built. They studied, they did internships, and they dined there, and they didn’t see the coupons at point-blank range, which they saw from behind their mother’s breasts. Although, at the plant, coupons were given for milk there, who worked in hazardous industries.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    AND? Did Sobchak destroy the Soviet economy? Or the illiteracy of products of the best education in the world like Gorby and congenital handicap (it didn’t work without mass executions)? Recall the statistics of Soviet marriage - since you watched the Soviet light industry because of the wide facade of the special distributor?

                    When they took the first steps under the table, I was called up to the SA, after serving in production, and I don’t need to talk about the statistics of marriages here, you don’t know what. What could they know about special distributors when my mother leads the kindergarten by the hand, which was also part of the special distribution system. Well, when they began to study the primer, they could not understand from childhood what Sobchak called for in 89. Having slandered the SA, after the events in Tbilisi, he began to hang noodles on his ears that if the Russian Federation leaves the USSR, then everyone will live in chocolate. Well, some of them believed. Like the same Sobchak and his associates, he called for capitalism, they say the market will arrange everything. How did he arrange it .. His art can be listed further, but there is no desire.
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    That is, you manage to be proud of the fact that the most progressive system generally riveted some kind of junk? Is this already a great achievement for socialism? Well, here's what

                    Well, yes, the so-called junk is still serving. And what can the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation boast of today?
                    Quote: Alarmist79
                    As for missiles, 2/3 of the Strategic Missile Forces are post-Soviet, almost half are STRONGLY post-Soviet (“Yars”)

                    Yars is a modification of the Topol-M missile system, work on the creation of which began in the mid-1980s. That's it, mister anti-Soviet.
                    1. -1
                      April 7 2023 16: 39
                      = I wonder who it is to us? Israel, or the Kaliningrad region? Were you in a tight circle?

                      That is, you still have not understood that we are talking about a strike on Russia, and the Kalingrad region is not a separate state?
                      = Depending on what and what charge if with a powerful hello to the promised land.=

                      Of course, I understand that PTU is a force, but the most powerful warhead that has ever been stuck on a rocket will not even break windows in all of Israel.


                      \uXNUMXd You want to sit out beyond the Urals. It is commendable. But what about the North-West of the Russian Federation? Truly, “They don’t cry in Ryazan about the Pskov crop failure”, =

                      You don't understand what it's all about, do you? We are talking about a disarming strike, which is a priority strategy. But in your reality, NATO's priority strategy is to attack Russia, which has not been knocked out of its nuclear arsenal? Or do you, as a full-fledged proletarian of mental labor, generally do not bother yourself with such mental activity?

                      = It's interesting to see evidence of mass buying of the military. If this, not one grandmother from liberal circles said. =
                      That is, the Soviet military lowered the USSR into the sewers absolutely free of charge? And after that, the anti-Soviet - me?
                      And in general
                      https://topwar.ru/41723-gorbachev-soratniki-i-podelnikikak-prodavali-sssr.html

                      = What are you talking about? Since the 79th year? .. Yes, then you can safely judge the Soviet times. Where can I, from the age of 64, judge those distant times. =
                      Well, your ability to judge anything in the appendix to the USSR is perfectly visible below.


                      =Born at 79, and already knew that there are coupons?. The makings of a child prodigy.=

                      Young man, don't you know that you can not only write on forums, but also read? Soviet documents, for example.

                      \uXNUMXd When, even with sponges, they were looking for mommy's tit, I went to study at a vocational school, \uXNUMXd

                      Have you even finished?

                      \uXNUMXd to the city of Kingisepp, which was then rapidly being built, Leningrad Region \uXNUMXd

                      Leningrad region with its priority supply, yeah. Well, who would have doubted. Eating the rest of the USSR and then broadcasting on behalf of the entire USSR - this is called beautiful Yiddishism hutspa, yes.

                      =. They studied, did internships, and dined there, and did not see the coupons at point-blank range, which they saw from behind their mother's breasts. Although, at the plant, coupons were given for milk there, who worked in hazardous production. =

                      Only for milk? Oh is it. At the same time, see above about the super-privileged region.


                      = When they took the first steps under the table, I was called to the SA, after serving in production, and I don’t need about the statistics of marriages =

                      What other "marriages"? You didn’t even understand that we are talking about the results of your vigorous activity in production? And no, not about half-time smoke breaks, but specifically about marriage on a cruel scale.

                      = here to say what you do not know. What could you know about special distributors when your mother leads the kindergarten by the hand, which was also part of the special distribution system. =

                      I am the nephew of a rather high-ranking aircraft designer from Antonov Design Bureau, actually. And you demonstrate too much awareness of the special distribution for the supposedly "simple hard worker"


                      = Well, when they began to study the primer, they could not understand from childhood what Sobchak called for in 89. Having slandered SA, after the events in Tbilisi, =

                      Mirror? You seem to have spent the entire restructuring in an unconscious state.
                      That is, it was Sobchak who flirted with the Georgian Nazis for decades, and after a terrible exposure by Sobchak, he leaked the Georgian government and stopped the criminal case against the Zviadists, who also staged pogroms with victims in Abkhazia at that time?

                      = Well, part believed. As the same Sobchak with his associates, called for capitalism =

                      That is, it was necessary to continue building real socialism, so that before the traditional Soviet famine and disintegration into separate regions?

                      = they say the market will arrange everything. How did it arrange. =

                      That is, it annoys you that Russia did not fall apart from the first sneeze, like the Soviets? It's wrong, right? “Turn the imperialist war into a civil one” and make the Ukronats happy according to the Soviet habit did not work out?

                      =Well, yes, the so-called junk is still serving now=.

                      So you manage to be proud not only of the fact that the USSR spent a huge amount of resources on thrash, but also of the fact that Soviet thrash is creating problems right now?


                      = And what can the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation boast of today? =
                      Well, for example, by the fact that in the new technology they still tried to isolate the tankers from the ammunition load and provide a convenient landing for the landing force. The USSR was not up to this, “women are still giving birth”



                      = "Yars" - is a modification of the Topol-M missile system, work on the creation of which began in the mid-1980s. That's it, mister anti-Soviet. =
                      That is, the Americans won the war for the USSR? Because the T-34, for example, is, in fact, another iteration of BTshek / Christie, aircraft engines of understandable origin, etc. That's not an adviser, it's just Novodvorskaya at the minimum wage.
                      1. -1
                        April 8 2023 06: 05
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        That is, you still have not understood that we are talking about a strike on Russia, and the Kalingrad region is not a separate state?

                        A separate enclave, completely cut off, but the geography is at odds.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Of course, I understand that PTU is a force, but the most powerful warhead that has ever been stuck on a rocket will not even break windows in all of Israel.

                        As I understand it, living in Israel knows better, I will not argue. Under the shadow of Uncle Sam, for the time being calmly.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Leningrad region with its priority supply, yeah. Well, who would have doubted. Eat the rest of the USSR and then broadcast on behalf of the entire USSR - this is called beautiful Yiddishism hutspa, yes

                        Only for the entire Union, no need to speak from Israel. There is not the right contingent to say something positive about the USSR.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        I am the nephew of a rather high-ranking aircraft designer from Antonov Design Bureau, actually. And you demonstrate too much awareness of the special distribution for the supposedly "simple hard worker"

                        Blue bone, Jewish origin. I enjoyed all the benefits of my uncle's position, and then you definitely need to ob ...... Soviet power. A purely Jewish trait, all former citizens of the Union. Special shops served the disabled, veterans of the Second World War, persons equated to them, disabled since childhood, and injured at work, etc. All of the above did not threaten my uncle's nephew.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        That is, it was Sobchak who flirted with the Georgian Nazis for decades, and after a terrible exposure by Sobchak, he leaked the Georgian government and stopped the criminal case against the Zviadists, who also staged pogroms with victims in Abkhazia at that time?
                        You are speaking. you don’t know about what you don’t know, about those events due to infancy No need to carry nonsense here.
                        Quote: Alarmist79
                        Well, for example, by the fact that in the new technology they still tried to isolate the tankers from the ammunition load and provide a convenient landing for the landing force. The USSR was not up to this, “women are still giving birth”

                        You yourself need to jump out, from the landing site, then grind with your tongue. In general, it makes no sense for a Jew offended by Soviet power to prove something. Useless.
                      2. -1
                        April 8 2023 14: 13
                        A separate enclave, completely cut off, but the geography is at odds.

                        AND? In the event of a disarming strike on Russia, will he maintain proud neutrality?
                        As I understand it, those who live in Israel know better

                        That is, you are saying that only Jews can master the materials in terms of the radii of destruction, and the Russians are too stupid for this? Burn, Moses Yakovlevich, oh-vey.
                        Only for the entire Union, no need to speak from Israel.

                        The presence in the USSR of different categories of supply and the privileged status of the Leningrad Region can be seen even from Argentina.
                        blue bone

                        Blue... what?
                        , of Jewish origin.

                        And only Jews can design airplanes? And the Russians - only a locksmith? You have already lost the coast in Haifa. And yes, in reality, the uncle's name was Vladimir Viktorovich Shishkov, and he died in a plane crash in Iran, helping the locals create their own BTA.
                        = I enjoyed all the benefits of my uncle's position =

                        The grace of the special distributor did not extend to nephews in a very different city, all of a sudden.
                        , = and then you definitely need to about ...... Soviet power =

                        Of course it is necessary, because the same mess in Soviet aviation chronically had a purely chthonic scope.
                        = Special shops served the disabled, veterans of the Second World War, persons equated to them, disabled since childhood, and injured at work, etc.. =

                        But my grandfather is just a veteran ... So save the noodles on your ears about the great Soviet charity for someone else.
                        = You are speaking. you don’t know about what you don’t know, about those events due to infancy. No need to carry nonsense here. =


                        That is, Gamsakhurdia was imprisoned, and not released on all four sides "due to a change in circumstances"? Etc. Did you really carry out the entire restructuring in the astral plane, or was it just a minor citizen of the Independent, a staggering regime?

                        “You yourself need to jump out, from the landing site, then grind with your tongue”

                        And to open the scheme and listen to those who jumped out - this is also not for Russian Vaneks, right Moses Yakovlevich?
                        By the way, how do you combine love for Comrade. Lenin and Co. with anti-Semitism and the search for Masons under the bed?

                        ". In general, it makes no sense for a Jew offended by Soviet power to prove something. Useless".

                        There is no need to extend your personal experience to all Jews.
  18. +2
    April 4 2023 16: 30
    I think that the states have the guts to fight us now. Let's remember how they twitched with the DPRK. But Russia can not be compared with Korea. The United States will only then decide on a preemptive strike - when they have a huge, fundamental superiority in offensive means, and only when they are absolutely sure that they will not receive anything in return .. In the meantime, they will climb out of their skin, trying to topple Russia from the inside, like the Soviet Union .. And count on the rotten top of our government ... And they are not working on this in vain - remember the negotiations with the Nazis ... And now the Simonians are throwing in the consolidation of the conquered territories for frozen foreign exchange funds in Western banks ... And he is voicing this person, for sure, desires money bags that affect power ...
    1. +3
      April 4 2023 20: 40
      Nobody needs a real war, you need to understand that these gestures with the expansion of NATO, pro, Ukraine, etc. are, first of all, politics, the West does not want to kill us, it wants to dictate its political and economic will to us, taking advantage of the benefits of these decisions.
      One of the points for achieving this is already the provision of military superiority by nullifying nuclear parity.
    2. 0
      April 5 2023 16: 39
      Let's remember how they twitched with the DPRK.

      I mean - they sent a couple of aircraft carriers and demonstrated something there?

      But Russia can not be compared with Korea.

      That's it. Unlike the elusive Joe Jong-un, the defeat of which will not personally bring the United States anything but additional militarization of opponents. The Russian nuclear arsenal is one of the global factors separating the States from unrestricted dominance.

      = when they have a huge, fundamental superiority in offensive means =

      Where is the connection here? They do not need "superiority" in some abstract offensive means, they need a sufficient number of quite specific ones to take out the main part of the strategic nuclear forces.

      when they are absolutely sure that they will not receive anything in return.

      And what is the basis of this belief in the Christmas kindness of the Clintons, McCains, etc.? Do you seriously think that the American elite cares about the death of a million or two non-elites? Given that global hegemony is at stake?
  19. 0
    April 4 2023 20: 47
    Today (4.4.23) Finland officially joined NATO and the length of the Russian border with NATO has increased exactly 2 times. Who needs this Kharkiv after that?
  20. +1
    April 4 2023 20: 53
    At 87, when Rust arrived, the USSR air defense was much more powerful. And what?
  21. 0
    April 4 2023 21: 49
    The paradox is that inside Russia the president's theses were carefully ignored both by regular propagandists and by the whole horde of "experts" existing in symbiosis with them. What is more here: outright illiteracy or direct sabotage is a separate issue.

    And the author is definitely Pozhidaev?
    The text is such that, as it were, Podzhigaev.
    The horde of experts ignored everything, the in-house propagandists ignored everything... But was there a White Knight?
  22. 0
    April 4 2023 22: 03
    Military experts! Since you are so enthusiastically discussing a nuclear war, you can understand that to grub Russia with sanctions, Ukrainian Janissaries on "Abrams" and stubborn invaders of the fascist idea as assault squads will not work, the fun of the Russian army is coming, the guys will frolic for glory.
    And even the most moronic and demented "shadow" rulers "" of the world will not want to die in a radioactive environment. In vain are they, perhaps, procuring spare parts for themselves in the former Ukrainian SSR? You want to live and live well. One thing is bad for them - the Russian common people, like the proletariat of the times of October, have nothing to lose, except for their chains, of course. So - everything is not so gloomy up close!
    1. 0
      April 5 2023 22: 47
      Putin seems to have put it this way about the war with the United States: We will go to HEAVEN, they will go to HELL. I can't vouch for the accuracy of the words, but the meaning is this. As for Western Europe, a 1 megaton warhead should be stocked for each capital + a couple of spares elsewhere. Warheads must be named. A photo of this warhead in the form of a large panel should be displayed in front of their embassies.
  23. -1
    April 5 2023 00: 08
    You can justify the current events as much as you like by saying that peppers could appear in Ukraine, but it seems to me that after Finland joined NATO, this also absolutely does not matter.
    But most importantly, to believe in the desire of the United States to deliver a disarming strike on Russia and burn itself in an atomic flame if they are still afraid of even doing something with Mr. Kim, who either has one bomb or not ...
    I do not believe.
  24. 0
    April 5 2023 21: 16
    For starters, you can move the capital to the Urals, or beyond it (for example, Krasnoyarsk, or Irkutsk).
    So the missiles go further, and maybe the region develops.
    In general, I think that the capital can be moved once every 10-15 years (but there will be crap with missile defense and others if it happens so often, but you can move it once).
  25. 0
    April 7 2023 18: 17
    = I wonder who it is to us? Israel, or the Kaliningrad region? Were you in a tight circle?

    That is, in a few days of speeches under the article, you did not understand that we were talking about a strike on Russia?

    It depends on what and what charge if with a powerful hello to the promised land. =

    Moreover, such a confident statement, which is typical ... in the complete absence of knowledge on the issue. In reality, the most powerful warhead that has ever been stuck on a rocket will not even break windows in all of Israel.

    \uXNUMXd You want to sit out beyond the Urals. It is commendable. But what about the North-West of the Russian Federation? Truly, “They don’t cry in Ryazan about the Pskov crop failure”, =

    You don't understand what it's all about, do you? We are talking about a disarming strike, which is a priority strategy. But in your reality, NATO's priority strategy is to attack Russia, which has not been knocked out of its nuclear arsenal? Or do you, as a full-fledged proletarian of mental labor, generally do not bother yourself with such mental activity?

    = It's interesting to see evidence of mass buying of the military. If this, not one grandmother from liberal circles said. =

    That is, the Soviet military lowered the USSR into the sewers absolutely free of charge? And after that, the anti-Soviet - me?
    And in general
    https://topwar.ru/41723-gorbachev-soratniki-i-podelnikikak-prodavali-sssr.html

    = What are you talking about? Since the 79th year? .. Yes, then you can safely judge the Soviet times. Where can I, from the age of 64, judge those distant times. =

    Well, your ability to judge anything in the appendix to the USSR is perfectly visible below.
    =Born at 79, and already knew that there are coupons?. The makings of a child prodigy.=

    Young man, don't you know that you can not only write on forums, but also read? Soviet documents, for example.
    \uXNUMXd When, even with sponges, they were looking for mommy's tit, I went to study at a vocational school, \uXNUMXd

    A nuclear physicist, I presume?

    \uXNUMXd to the city of Kingisepp, which was then rapidly being built, Leningrad Region \uXNUMXd

    Leningrad region with its priority supply, yeah. Well, who would have doubted. Eating the rest of the USSR and then broadcasting on behalf of the entire USSR - this is called beautiful Yiddishism hutspa, yes.
    =
    . They studied, did internships, and dined there, and did not see the coupons at point-blank range, which they saw from behind their mother's breasts. Although, at the plant, coupons were given for milk there, who worked in hazardous production. =

    Only for milk? Oh is it. At the same time, see above about the super-privileged region.
    = When they took the first steps under the table, I was called to the SA, after serving in production, and I don’t need about marriage statistics
    =
    What other "marriages"? You didn’t even understand that we are talking about the results of your hectic life at work? And no, not about smoking breaks at half the working day, but specifically about marriage on a cruel scale.
    = here to say what you do not know. What could you know about special distributors when your mother leads the kindergarten by the hand, which was also part of the special distribution system. =

    I am the nephew of a rather high-ranking aircraft designer from Antonov Design Bureau, actually. And you demonstrate too much awareness of the special distribution for the supposedly "simple hard worker."
    = Well, when they began to study the primer, they could not understand from childhood what Sobchak called for in 89. Having slandered SA, after the events in Tbilisi, =

    Mirror? It looks like you spent the entire restructuring in an unconscious state.
    That is, it was Sobchak who flirted with the Georgian Nazis for decades, and after a terrible exposure by Sobchak, he leaked the Georgian government and stopped the criminal case against the Zviadists, who also staged pogroms with victims in Abkhazia at that time?
    =
    Well, some of them believed. As the same Sobchak with his associates, called for capitalism =

    That is, it was necessary to continue building real socialism, so that before the traditional Soviet famine and disintegration into separate regions?
    = they say the market will arrange everything. How did it arrange. =

    That is, it annoys you that Russia did not fall apart from the first sneeze, like the Soviets? It's wrong, right? “Turn the imperialist war into a civil one” and make the Ukronats happy according to the Soviet habit did not work out?
    =Well, yes, the so-called junk is still serving now=.

    So you manage to be proud not only of the fact that the USSR spent a huge amount of resources on thrash, but also of the fact that Soviet thrash is creating problems right now?
    = And what can boast of the military-industrial complex of the Russian Federation today?
    =
    Well, for example, by the fact that in the new technology they still tried to isolate the tankers from the ammunition load and provide a convenient landing for the landing force. The USSR was not up to this, "women are still giving birth."
    = "Yars" - is a modification of the Topol-M missile system, work on the creation of which began in the mid-1980s. That's it, mister anti-Soviet. =

    That is, the Americans won the war for the USSR? Because the T-34, for example, is, in fact, another iteration of BTshek / Christie, aircraft engines of understandable origin, etc. That's what is not an "adviser", it's just Novodvorskaya at the minimum wage.
  26. 0
    April 8 2023 18: 35
    Quote: Alarmist79
    And in what magical way do 250-300 km from Kalingrad prevent you from shooting down missiles in pursuit?


    Their speeds are slightly higher than those of the Stinger.
    1. 0
      April 8 2023 21: 00
      Quote: Comrade Kim
      Their speeds are slightly higher than those of the Stinger.

      So you couldn't do the XNUMXth grade math problem about chasing trucks/trains?
      Let's take the speed of the rocket after the end of acceleration at 4,5 km/s, which is apparently close to the real speed of the LRHW. Let's assume that the anti-missile speed is 6 km / s - something simple, like the American GBI without additional stages and taking into account its own "kinetic interceptor" engine.
      The distance between positions is 335 km (Riga-Kalingrad). When will the anti-missile catch up with the RSD?
      Will you open a textbook for grade 6 or do you have a ready-made answer?
      1. +1
        April 9 2023 00: 07
        Quote: Alarmist79
        Let's assume that the anti-missile speed is 6 km / s - something simple, like the American GBI without additional stages and taking into account its own "kinetic interceptor" engine.

        Never mind wishes. Will it not crack?
        Such things are many times more expensive than any RSD, for a minute. How many of them do you plan to deliver to Kaliningrad? Not to mention how many of these do you have?
        Quote: Alarmist79
        The distance between positions is 335 km (Riga-Kalingrad). When will the anti-missile catch up with the RSD?

        It will probably never catch up. Because launch information + decision making + launch procedures are minutes at best. The GBI in Alaska has these minutes, your imaginary Nudols in the Kaliningrad region do not.
        By the way, on Nudoli in the Kaliningrad region, the enemy will not regret a 155mm divisional salvo, try to bring it down.
        1. 0
          April 9 2023 12: 47
          Never mind wishes. Will it not crack? Such things are many times more expensive than any RSD, for a minute.

          (facepalm) That is, the speed of 1,5 km / s more automatically makes the PR many times more expensive? It's not even clear how to comment. Because simply by replacing the warhead with a much lighter interceptor, the speed of exactly the same RSD will grow much more capitally.
          =Probably will never catch up. Because launch information + decision making + launch procedures are minutes at best. =

          That is, you did not master the task for the sixth grade, because even a head start of 2-3 minutes will not ensure a shortfall in any way.
          However, in reality it will not. If the air defense / missile defense system meditated on the target for several minutes, it would have been scrapped long ago. In general, we look at the reaction time of air defense systems, there 15 seconds is a lot.
          \u155d By the way, on Nudoli in the Kaliningrad region, the enemy will not regret a XNUMXmm divisional salvo, try to bring it down. \uXNUMXd

          1. Does religion forbid the use of mine launchers, which will only scratch six inches? However, it doesn't matter because...
          2. The Kaliningrad region is 90 kilometers from north to south, so perhaps the "Panzer-howitzer" is actively reactive. And now another surprise. Projectiles suddenly (c) also have a flight time. For example, in a D-30, a projectile flies at 15 km for a little less than a minute.
          In reality, even the standard mobile "Nudol" will have time to shoot back and run away.
          1. -1
            April 9 2023 14: 20
            Quote: Alarmist79
            The Kaliningrad region is 90 kilometers from north to south, so unless the "Panzer-howitzer" is actively reactive

            Any 155/52 system. By the way, now the Americans are switching to 155/58, such will block the Kaliningrad region from north to south and from south to north.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            In reality, even the standard mobile "Nudol" will have time to shoot back and run away

            Your problem is that you keep forgetting who is attacking whom. Because it is impossible to repulse a preventive strike with any cunning plans.

            Naturally, if the enemy chooses the time of the strike, he will find a minute to bring up howitzers. Moreover, howitzers, unlike missile defense systems in combat mode, can hang out at the border always, at any moment.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            to use mine launchers, which will only scratch six inches, religion forbids?

            This religion forbids you to dig silos near Yakutsk, but digging the same silos in Kaliningrad is normal.

            Will you also put radars in silos?
            Quote: Alarmist79
            In general, we look at the reaction time of air defense systems, there 15 seconds is a lot.

            Here is your usual problem. For such terms, the systems should already work in automatic mode. That is, a no-fly zone should be established over NATO countries even before the launch of missiles.
            That is, there is no question of any strategic preventive disarming strike.

            OK, let's say your complex will work 15 seconds after the rocket leaves the radio horizon (at a distance of 300 km, this is an altitude of about 10 km). That is, at the moment of launching your "anti-missile" the RSD will already drop the first stage.

            While your "anti-missile" is flying 300 km (actually twice as fast), the RSD will work out the second stage, reset the engine and the warhead will start to go back beyond the radio horizon.

            And from the Gulf of Riga to Moscow, only 900 km.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            That is, the speed of 1,5 km / s more automatically makes the PR many times more expensive?

            Certainly. You yourself said "GBI", I did not pull your tongue. That is, you are trying to shoot down a conditional Iskander with a conditional semi-Topol - GBI weighs 11 tons, this is actually a small orbital launch vehicle.
            Quote: Alarmist79
            Because simply by replacing the warhead with a much lighter interceptor, the speed of exactly the same RSD will grow much more capitally.

            Virtually no growth. This is 2% of the weight of the rocket itself.
            1. 0
              April 9 2023 15: 53
              =Any 155/52 system.=

              Seriously? The same Thunder has a range of 40 km. At the same time, you were not going to put the self-propelled guns right on the border, where after the first shot they were transfused?
              = By the way, now the Americans are switching to 155/58,=

              Yes, let them go, see the flying time above.
              = Your problem is that you keep forgetting who is attacking whom. Because it is impossible to repulse a preventive strike with any cunning plans. =

              (triple facepalm) I haven't heard more absurdity in a long time. In THIS reality, if the reaction time of the enemy is less than you need for your attempts, then you will have to forget about an effective preemptive strike.
              = Naturally, if the enemy chooses the time of the strike, he will find a minute to pull up howitzers. Moreover, howitzers, unlike missile defense systems in combat mode, can hang out at the border always, at any moment. =

              Once again, slowly and spelling. The projectile in reality is a rather slow thing, you will have a flight time of about three minutes.

              = It is your religion that forbids you to dig silos near Yakutsk, but digging the same silos in Kaliningrad is normal. =

              That is, you ALSO could not assimilate the article? Because it boldly emphasizes what is the problem of positional areas in Siberia. And no, this is not the cost of the mine.
              Will you put radars in silos too? =

              What for?
              = In general, we look at the reaction time of air defense systems, there 15 seconds is a lot. Here is your usual problem. For such terms, the systems should already work in automatic mode. =

              In which automatic, my dear? We see the mass start of the RSD, we press the button. If you personally take minutes to click, then these are your personal Estonian problems. But it is possible to automate, a small question.
              = That is, a no-fly zone should be established over NATO countries even before the launch of missiles.=

              Lol what? You have civilian liners and military litaks with speed/acceleration, altitude, etc. RSD fly? In reality, they are distinguished by the dumbest algorithm in a few lines of code.
              \u15d OK, let's say your complex will work 300 seconds after the rocket leaves the radio horizon (at a distance of 10 km, this is an altitude of about 300 km). That is, at the moment of launching your "anti-missile" the RSD will already drop the first stage. While your "anti-missile" flies XNUMX km, (in fact, twice as fast) the RSD will work out the second stage, reset the engine

              Maybe you'd better about the oxen? Even for a short-lived type "Pershing-2" the duration of the steps is 55 and 40 seconds.
              = and the warhead will start to go back beyond the radio horizon.=

              For what radio horizon, my dear? The horizon (not radio, it is somewhat larger) of the target at 200 km, for example - 1741 km. Naturally, the missile will be seen throughout the flight from any point west of the Volga.
              = And from the Gulf of Riga to Moscow, only 900 km. Quote from Alarmist79 =

              Iii?
              = That is, the speed of 1,5 km / s more automatically makes the PR many times more expensive? Certainly. You yourself said "GBI", I did not pull your tongue. That is, you are trying to bring down the conditional Iskander =

              What "Iskander", sick? LRHW is almost twice as heavy. 7.4 tons.
              = conditional semi-Topol - GBI weighs 11 tons, it is actually a small orbital launch vehicle. =

              What a vigorous uncomplicatedness. In fact, a small orbital rocket, all of a sudden (s), has a speed close to orbital, and not 6 km / s. NJAP 8+ km/s. Without additional steps - who was it written for? There are actually several options under the GBI brand, you are our non-rocketeer.
              = Because simply by replacing the warhead with a much lighter interceptor, the speed of exactly the same RSD will increase much more capitally. Virtually no growth. This is 2% of the weight of the rocket itself. =

              (fourfold facepalm) But the main part of the rest of the weight is fuel, which is spent on rocket acceleration. If you absolutely do not understand that missile speed / range is highly dependent on the payloadthen you won't be able to help. Give examples, or do you yourself realize that you argued?
              1. 0
                April 10 2023 00: 35
                And yes, in reality, RSD will not have this handicap at all
                \u15d OK, let's say your complex will work 300 seconds after the rocket leaves the radio horizon (at a distance of 10 km, this is an altitude of about XNUMX km).

                Because no religion actually forces to detect launches of RSD only by ground-based radars.
                And at the same distance of 300+ km, a rocket launch / torch will be detected exactly at the moment of launch by an AWACS aircraft spinning directly above Kalingrad or simply a high-altitude drone with a more powerful thermal imager.
            2. 0
              April 9 2023 16: 25
              = conditional half poplar - GBI weighs 11 tons,

              Sorry, I missed this uh... masterpiece.
              Topol-M weighs 47 tons, just Topol 45. Well, nothing, Latynina is still much cooler, yes.
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. 0
                April 10 2023 23: 12
                Quote: Alarmist79
                just Poplar 45.

                Minuteman 30, GBI is roughly half a minuteman. Okay, third. Soviet missiles are always 1,5-2 times heavier than American ones.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Kalingrad by AWACS or just a high-altitude drone with a more powerful thermal imager.

                How will you look for a transatmospheric interceptor for a warhead?
                Quote: Alarmist79
                If you absolutely do not understand that the speed / range of a rocket is highly dependent on the payload,

                Replacing a warhead with an interceptor in your example means +2% (actually less) fuel. Remake Iskander
                in GBI is not possible.

                (I’ll be boring. Orbital speed can be obtained on a rocket weighing 2,6 tons. But it won’t suit you. And they don’t make it in Russia).
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Actually, a small orbital rocket, suddenly (c), also has a speed close to orbital

                GBI and brings the interceptor to orbital speed.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                LRHW is almost twice as heavy. 7.4 tons.

                Yes, overweight with her stupid glider. Plus, it's conventional. In the case under discussion, it is redundant.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Iii?

                Iii promising highmars is enough.
                in the Inc 2 modification, it is planned to bring it up to 700-750 km. For Inc 4, which is being developed in parallel, wishes have been increased to 1 km

                Quote: Alarmist79
                For what radio horizon, my dear? Horizon (not radio, it is somewhat larger) of the target at 200 km

                If this is a hypersonic glider, then the height is in the region of 100 km or lower. The radio horizon is in the region of 1300 km. For everything about everything about 5 minutes. At the same time, some of the targets are closer than these 1300 km, and much closer.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Even for a short-lived Pershing-2, the duration of the steps is 55 and 40 seconds

                Just Pershing in this sense is unusual. Solid propellant rocket motors usually work for 30 seconds. In the case of Pershing, extra speed has always been a big problem.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                In reality, they are distinguished by the dumbest algorithm in a few lines of code.

                If "in reality" you consider it acceptable to operate such systems in "without an operator" mode with open civilian traffic, then 155mm will arrive much faster than you would like.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                We see the mass start of the RSD, we press the button.

                If you introduce a person there, then this is 15 minutes ideally and roughly a day in reality. While you are figuring out which bunker your person is in, while in the bunker they are figuring out which of the doubles is on duty, etc.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                What for?

                Should the interceptor search for a warhead in near space?
                Quote: Alarmist79
                than the problem of positional areas in Siberia

                The fact that there are no missile defense / air defense systems. And they are nowhere to be found, except for your imaginary Kaliningrad.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                The projectile in reality is a rather slow thing, you will have a flight time of about three minutes.

                Yeah. And what prevents you from starting shelling three minutes before launch? By the way, where will the orbital power radar run in these three minutes?
                Quote: Alarmist79
                In THIS reality, if the reaction time of the enemy is less than you need for your attempts, then you will have to forget about an effective preemptive strike.

                In this reality, the reaction time exceeds the flight time of the RSD theoretically by several times, but practically by an order of magnitude. What caused nervousness just at the time of these Pershings of yours: a retaliatory and even retaliatory strike became too unprofitable a strategy, which destroyed the whole concept of mutually assured destruction. Although it would seem that these are the problems of the loser (USSR), the risks also grew for the winner.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                Yes, let them pass.

                Yes, in principle, no one is against it.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                The same Thunder has a range of 40 km

                This means that the same Thunder was not tested with Excalibur. The ballistic solution there is standard for any system.
                Quote: Alarmist79
                where are they tranked after the first shot?

                How is it that we have already seen transglyukirovat for a year. In any case, the task of destroying your multi-billion dollar prodigy with the risk of losing a self-propelled gun division is incomparable.
                1. -1
                  April 11 2023 11: 51
                  Minuteman 30, GBI is roughly half a minuteman. Okay, third. Soviet missiles are always 1,5-2 times heavier than American ones. =

                  That is, in reality, a quarter of the Topol is comparable to the mass of the LRHW, which was to be expected. At the same time, GBI based on the launch vehicle is a frank ersatz.
                  How will you look for a transatmospheric interceptor for a warhead? =

                  1. What kind of warhead, my dear? You have a hefty carcass of a rocket with a torch flying for the first couple of minutes. What is the beauty of shooting in the active area.
                  2. Even an AWACS aircraft, even the drones mentioned above, can give target designation to the carcass. This is the beauty of shooting down missiles stuck by especially gifted people in a “giant territory” like the Baltics.
                  3. This is not to mention the fact that instant detection makes it possible to immediately begin pre-launch procedures.
                  =, Replacing a warhead with an interceptor in your example means +2% (actually less) fuel.=

                  That is, you not only mastered the Tsiolkovsky formula, you couldn’t even get into elementary logic? Once again, slowly and spelling. The mass of fuel in the end does not slow down, but ACCELERATES the rocket. What a surprise, right?
                  Payload, SUDDENLY - pure "retarder".
                  therefore for a rocket, there is a rigid relationship between speed and the ratio of fuel mass to final mass. I’m translating, otherwise it won’t reach again - the final mass / payload is an independent “divider”.
                  As a result, the range of the same Trident with 8 W88 is 7838 km, and with three - 11, practically one and a half times more. Although the weight of five BBs is about 2 tons, less than 4% of the mass of the rocket.
                  = It is impossible to convert Iskander to GBI.=

                  What’s this all about?
                  = (I'll be boring. Orbital speed can be obtained on a rocket weighing 2,6 tons. But it won't suit you. And they don't make it in Russia) =

                  AND? The point is that a three-stage launch vehicle with a "giant" load in the form of an interceptor will have an orbital speed, and by no means 6 km / s.
                  Yes, overweight with her stupid glider. Plus, it's conventional. In the case under discussion, it is redundant. =

                  Mozhyd, is it better for you to master the Tsiolkovsky formula first, and then teach the Pentagon how to live? "Wacky Glider" provides maneuverability and accuracy.
                  =Eee promising highmars is enough. in the Inc 2 modification, it is planned to bring it up to 700-750 km. For Inc 4, which is being developed in parallel, wishes have been increased to 1 km =

                  AND? And what about specialized anti-missiles and shooting down RSD from Raliningrad in pursuit?
                  =If this is a hypersonic glider, then the altitude is in the region of 100 km or lower. Radio horizon in the region of 1300 km. =

                  There is no full-fledged "ballistic glider" there, BB LRHV is frankly about maneuvering in the final section, nothing more.
                  = Just Pershing is unusual in this sense. Solid propellant rocket motors usually work for 30 seconds. =

                  Is it true? And then the duration of the Pioneer stage, for example, is 63 seconds.
                  = If "in reality" you consider it acceptable to operate such systems in the "without operator" mode with open civilian traffic, then 155mm will arrive much faster than you would like.=

                  Oh how scary. Of course, the States are eager to kill themselves in a nuclear war over purely theoretical risks for priceless Polish / Baltic carcasses.
                  = If you introduce a person there, then this is 15 minutes ideally and roughly a day in reality. While you are figuring out which bunker your person is in, while in the bunker they are figuring out which of the doubles is on duty, etc. =

                  Dear, are you overheating from excessive CPU load? If you isolate at least some sense in your stream of consciousness, then you think that Putin should personally give the order to shoot anti-missiles?
                  = Should the interceptor search for a warhead in near space? =

                  1. Is a warhead visible in near space only from Kaliningrad?
                  2. This is not to mention the fact that the same AWACS flyer will give the initial target designation, and with your 155 mm Kaliningrad radars will live long enough to continue.
                  = That there are no missile defense / air defense systems. And they are nowhere to be found, except for your imaginary Kaliningrad.=

                  There is no air defense anywhere except the imaginary Kaliningrad? Hmmm.
                  Yeah. And what prevents you from starting shelling three minutes before launch? =

                  That this is an "official" disarming strike warning. As a result, the decision-making cycle will begin before the impact and, due to the absence of any uncertainty at all, will be shorter. By the way, uncertainty like “whether our early warning system has glitched” miraculously removes the shelling as such. At least three minutes before, at least after. As a result, you can put pressure on the Big Red Button. What a pity it is that with your ideas you are still not in the Pentagon.
                  =By the way, where will the orbital power radar run in these three minutes?=

                  Where does he need to run?
                  = In this reality, the reaction time exceeds the flight time of the RSD theoretically by several times, but practically by an order of magnitude. =

                  That is, they will look for Putin in the bunker and “try to distinguish from a double” for 100+ minutes? Crazy greasy mri here I see.
                  = The same Thunder has a range of 40 km. This means that the same Thunder was not tested with Excalibur. =

                  Seriously? Here is a 52-caliber Caesar with Excalibur, early 2022.
                  "During testing, a 155mm Excalibur projectile fired from a howitzer hit two targets at a distance of more than 46 km, "which is [its own] record for the range of fire from this gun system," the manufacturer states.
                  46 km. Already. An artilleryman from you is the same as a rocket man, yeah.
                  = How is it that we have already seen transgluking in a year.=

                  What did you see? The impossibility of destroying a bunch of guns that have been standing almost at a distance of direct visibility from the border for years?
                  = In any case, the task of destroying your multi-billion dollar prodigy with the risk of losing a division of self-propelled guns is incomparable.=

                  If they could still destroy something effectively and on time, they would not have a price, yes. But in reality, an idiotic circus with self-propelled guns will simply reduce the time it takes to decide on a retaliatory strike.
  27. 0
    April 9 2023 09: 17
    regular statements from Washington appear on the topic “we do not plan to destroy Russia”

    As one leader said - "promise them anything, we'll cut them later"
  28. 0
    April 9 2023 22: 04
    Yes ... it's hard to be a politician and make or try to make balanced, unemotional decisions, especially under such conditions.
    I so want to bang my fist on the table and say, so don't get you to anyone ... and press the button first ...

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