US press: The West has relied on the spring offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, hoping to defeat the Russian army

The West does not know how to stop the conflict in Ukraine without letting Russia win. According to The Wall Street Journal, the United States and allies have relied on the spring offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, but have no further plans.

Neither the US nor Europe knows how to end the conflict in Ukraine without allowing Russia to win. Now the collective West is betting on a spring offensive, in which the Armed Forces of Ukraine must certainly defeat the Russian army. This conclusion is drawn from the volume of military aid delivered to Kyiv recently.

The success of the Ukrainian army, the newspaper writes, should push Putin to negotiations on Kiev's terms, which means the return of all territories "conquered by Russia" since the beginning of the special operation, as well as the fulfillment of the "wants" of the United States and Europe. However, many military experts are perplexed as to why such a conclusion was made, why Moscow, after one defeat, if it still takes place, should start negotiations on the conditions of the West. On the contrary, they believe, it will only force Russia to get together and start a new campaign.

Therefore, now the West does not see options for ending the conflict, in which it remains a winner, since the Ukrainian army will not be able to defeat Russia on the battlefield, it simply does not have any advantage, and the West cannot provide it. The most probable is the scenario in which the war will turn into a protracted one and will be waged to the exhaustion of one of the parties. At the same time, many are not sure that Russia will be the first to surrender in this fight.

At the same time, the West could stop the war by ordering Zelensky to simply stop resisting and give Russia already conquered territories, but this will be seen as a weakness of "Western democracy" that China can take advantage of, waiting "in the shadow of the conflict" for the West's mistakes. Plans to retake Taiwan have not been abandoned in Beijing.

Comments

[Sith]

And before, they didn’t do it like that ... or now they invested expensively and think that everything will be more successful)

[boris ivanov]

"why Moscow after one defeat, if it still takes place"
What am I reading right now? Such an idea, even hypothetically, should not be considered! Or did someone decide to prepare the electorate, and to such an outcome?

[bayard]

Quote: boris ivanov

"why Moscow after one defeat, if it still takes place"
What am I reading right now? Such an idea, even hypothetically, should not be considered! Or did someone decide to prepare the electorate, and to such an outcome?

Actually, the guarantor has already said that we are talking about the survival of Russia, the possible death of Russia and even the death of the people of Russia ... The Armed Forces of Ukraine are preparing for the offensive, and in several directions at once. The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation do not prepare anything like this, just as they did not prepare anything in the winter. There are frontal assaults on highly protected lines of fortifications without proper fire support. Passivity. The initiative is again handed over to the enemy.

Quote: boris ivanov

someone decided to prepare the electorate, and to such an outcome?

Yes .
Or do you think that someone is striving for Victory?
I also wish .

[Slon1978]

Let's take a closer look at what the past "victories" of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were like. Case 1 - The retreat from Kyiv was due to the obvious insufficient number of our group to storm the city. This was obvious to me at the beginning of March. I looked in bewilderment at a map of Kiev and its suburbs with a ruler and was perplexed - what is the calculation in our General Staff with the forces that we have there 30-40 thousand grouping, taking into account the size of the city with suburbs of 50 km and the numerical superiority of the enemy, hostile, unlike the cities of Donbass, the environment and the situation? Only later did I realize that the calculation was on the effect of Zelensky's panic, by analogy with Mishiko in Tbilisi, from the sight of troops resolutely moving towards the capital. But our partners brought the "client" to Poland on time, calmed him down, gave him medicines and instructions. I am glad that the General Staff has found in itself the will not to rest against its horns, but to withdraw its troops from Kyiv. Case 2 - Izyum and Kharkiv region. A sparse front, a thin line of defense, a general euphoria from the offensive and the liberation of territories, numerous trophies and the downcast appearance of the prisoners of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, who, as it seemed to us, were good for nothing, except for surrender. The defense is purely focal, only in large cities there are small garrisons from the units of the National Guard, in the suburbs there are only checkpoints, there are practically no strongholds. Here we were frankly taught a lesson for self-confidence and arrogance, taught to fight. As a result, rapid breakthroughs by mobile groups, panic in our ranks, attempts to put out the fire with reserves and form a new line of defense. Cities and settlements of the Armed Forces of Ukraine often bypassed without storming their garrisons, forcing them to leave their positions and abandon their property, fearing encirclement. It HAD to happen sooner or later with this approach. We were taught to defend ourselves, we were poked harey into shortcomings. Case 3 - Kherson. The whole group defended courageously and nothing really came out of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, except for heavy losses in the offensive with very, very dubious results. But the weakness was that all the logistics of the group were fun on the Antonovsky bridge and a couple of crossings, and in order to deliver them to the north of the Kherson region, they had to make a big detour. It was not possible to reliably protect logistics with the help of air defense, for the same reason, as now and in the future, air defense of Ukraine will not be able to defend against our missile attacks on infrastructure. The shield always loses to the sword. The retreat was a rational decision of the General Staff, no matter how insulting it looked.
Regarding the new offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, announced for the spring. I do not see the prerequisites for their success, except perhaps tactical - wedged in for several kilometers, no more than that, with heavy losses. Now the General Staff is tense, no one is relaxed and the army is waiting for the offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, the operational reserves supporting the front are available, the defense is built, the logistics are much more reliable, there is no underestimation of the enemy, rather it is even overestimated now. I think we are in for a tough rubilovo without significant results for the Armed Forces of Ukraine with their huge losses. However, CIPSO does not need significant results - they will disperse any village taken. They also have a "battle at Kruty", where UNA-UNSO smashed the Red Army convoy and now this is their greatest victory ...

[Aleksandr21]

Quote: Slon1978

Case 1 - Departure from Kyiv

Is it worth it to start like this? We spent so much effort / resources on a trip to Kyiv, as a result we returned back .... now we will not be able to repeat the same trip, because. the border of Belarus - Ukraine is seriously so fortified / mined, fortifications have already been created on the approaches to Kiev and it will not work to take such a city without serious losses ..... (and we don’t have such forces now ... we need to carry out a new mobilization, if suddenly The General Staff will decide to repeat the "success" with Kiev).

Quote: Slon1978

Case 2 - Izyum and Kharkiv region.

Until now, after the "regrouping" we can’t return everything, I won’t be surprised if the situation doesn’t change much there until the fall, we will take 100-200 meters a day, provided that we don’t run into serious defense .... because. The experience of Marinka/Avdiivka shows that the Armed Forces of Ukraine can hold the defense for months.

Quote: Slon1978

Case 3 - Kherson.

It was clearly a difficult decision .... well, we decided not to fight for Kherson, to surrender our city (the Russian regional center, after all), for the first time since the Second World War, and then? There is no opportunity to return it and in the short term it is not visible .... because. the bridge has been blown up, no one will allow us to make crossings there, taking into account the control of the enemy on the left bank), so it turns out that we need to take Dnepropetrovsk or Zaporozhye (and if the bridges blow up there, then that's it ...).

Quote: Slon1978

I think we are in for a tough rubilovo without significant results for the Armed Forces of Ukraine with their huge losses.

If ours do everything competently, then the counteroffensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine will finally stall .... but then what are our prospects? It is quite possible to liberate the Donbass before the end of this year, but it will take a huge amount of forces and resources, but then, most likely, everything will stall with us, as it was after Severodonetsk-Lysichansk ..... and we will have negotiations with partners and bidding.

Maybe I'm too pessimistic, of course, but as a result of the past year, optimism has somehow diminished, and so far there are no prerequisites for a quick defeat of the enemy, and access to the "operational space", but the situation is conducive to a repetition of a positional war.

[tovbot]

The stake will be on a higher organization of troops, high-quality intelligence and accurate artillery with drones. That is, the expectation that having highmarses, excaliburs and drones in large numbers and assortment, the Armed Forces of Ukraine will be able to cover the positions of our troops quickly and accurately, creating local breakthroughs and bringing chaos. It gives hope that all these bells and whistles cannot stop the same “musicians”, which means that ours may be learning to cope with this. And not only the Wagnerites, there are certain successes in other sectors as well.

[Roma 1977]

I'll correct it, "The Massacre at Kruty" is where the convoy of the Red Army dispersed the "Ukrainian army" that was "defending" Kyiv. The clash was quite insignificant, more like a skirmish, but "timid Georgians fled." That is Ukrainians.

[kakvastam]

I would like to understand what the Kremlin hopes for...
The enemy is accumulating strength, preparing to attack, it is clear that the fight will be terrible.
Have you learned from the defeats?

[Sith]

Quote: kakvastam

I would like to understand what the Kremlin hopes for...
The enemy is accumulating strength, preparing to attack, it is clear that the fight will be terrible.
Have you learned from the defeats?

The press and fleas have been promising a terrible fight and a general battle since March last year
But it never took place and it’s not a fact that, in addition to regroupings of one of the parties,

Yes, they will look for a weak spot in the defense and our entrenchment ... but it’s generally not realistic to get a global advantage without prerequisites

[alexander 66]

And imagine that 404 captures Belgorod, the troops are there with a gulkin nose, not necessarily just purely all the way from the Russian corps. They put an ultimatum, people are held hostage, how will our general leadership solve the issue? An assault with huge casualties or the surrender of Kherson, Zaporozhye? Fantastic, but you can expect everything from them.

[Stepan S]

Imagine that 404 captures Belgorod

They cut off the supplies that captured the garrison and destroy

[alexander 66]

The hostages are civilians and there are many of them.

[DenD]

Unreal. This is not an apartment, not a house that can be vacated by "group A". This city. The losses will be colossal. Not one sane politician would do this, it's suicide.

[Void]

This is a reason for Russia to use nuclear weapons. As the saying goes, "just give us the wire."

If this happens, I would have brought down the Ukrainians from Kyiv.

[parabyd]

That's why it was interesting to decide that there are no troops there? Who told you such nonsense? Or did they themselves go and count them over their heads?

Let it be known to you that there are troops there, moreover, it is from there that they get into the LPR.

[former soldier]

And imagine that 404 captures Belgorod, the troops are there with a gulkin nose, not necessarily just purely all the way from the Russian corps. They put an ultimatum, people are held hostage, how will our general leadership solve the issue? An assault with huge casualties or the surrender of Kherson, Zaporozhye? Fantastic, but you can expect everything from them.

Russian Corps is what?
What you describe is an alleged agreement between the parties. Did the Ukrainian side often fulfill agreements? What will prevent it from putting forward more and more new conditions?

[MBRSS]

And imagine that 404 captures Belgorod ...

Even if they could, the Americans would not allow it. it is an excessive escalation of the conflict, with an unforeseen continuation. It is possible to deplete Russia on the territory of the VNA, which is successfully happening.
I think that for the same reason Ukraine will not receive long-range missiles and aircraft from the United States. And after the presidential elections, the States will generally score on Ukraine. Europe will disentangle.

[gsev]

Quote: alexandr 66

They put an ultimatum, people are held hostage, how will our general leadership solve the issue?

A massive thermonuclear strike throughout the Right-Bank Ukraine.

[Sergey3]

And imagine that 404 captures Belgorod, the troops are there with a gulkin nose, not necessarily just purely all the way from the Russian corps. They put an ultimatum, people are held hostage, how will our general leadership solve the issue? An assault with huge casualties or the surrender of Kherson, Zaporozhye? Fantastic, but you can expect everything from them.

I'm wondering, what are you smelling in the west like that? Now the units located in the SVO receive a monetary reward for this action, an order of magnitude higher than the average salary in Russia. It is not profitable for them to win, but it is beneficial that the war lasts as long as possible. Alas, gentlemen of the minus people, this is exactly so! When attacking a Russian city, "free" military units will go into battle, fighting not for money, but for an idea. They will have a motive above money.

[75 Sergey]

Give up the territories.... It never dawns on them that it's not about the territories, it's about them!

[Revolver]

Russia has not yet come to war. What is, it is precisely the NWO, carried out by limited forces and means. If the Kuev Nazis have about the same success in the spring offensive as those Nazis near Kursk, then most likely it will remain in the NVO format, and the stake on negotiations on Kuev’s terms will be beaten. And if not, then "Get up, the country is huge", "Everything for the front, everything for the Victory", and the stake on negotiations on Kuev's terms will still be beaten. But at what cost?

[Aken]

Do you seriously believe that Shoigan will admit that he screwed up and call on the people to save his reputation and position?

[Revolver]

Quote from Aken

Do you seriously believe that Shoigan will admit that he screwed up and call on the people to save his reputation and position?

___

Quote: I.V. Stalin

We have no irreplaceable.

[tsvetahaki]

We have no irreplaceable.

"U on" - this is who?
Stalin did not. But Abramovich and others like him are irreplaceable and beyond jurisdiction ...

[former soldier]

Do you seriously believe that Shoigan will admit that he screwed up and call on the people to save his reputation and position?

And here he is. Actors have the ability to change.

[sopot]

But the war has already come to Russia, regardless of whether Russia has come to it or is still itching!

[kakvastam]

"Get up, huge country", "Everything for the front, everything for the Victory"

And who will say it? For the authorities, this is like death, the population does not care, but we have no people.
Well, there may be people, but there are very few of them, judging by the level of support for the front.

[former soldier]

And who will say it? For the authorities, this is like death, the population does not care, but we have no people.
Well, there may be people, but there are very few of them, judging by the level of support for the front.

Look at the history of Russia in the 20th century and the answer to your question will appear - when who did what and when.

[MBRSS]

Russia has not yet come to war.

NATO is also in no hurry. They look like they are at a fight of gladiators, tossing weapons to one of them so that the fight is approximately equal.

[FoBoss_VM]

Unfortunately, Russia came to war. And she appeared in full force, there was nowhere to wait for help, all of us were already there. Russia did not use only nuclear weapons (and I hope it never will) and did not use massive bombing of Tu22m3m in full bomb load. The rest is already in action ... So leave these fairy tales that Russia did not start for Skabeeva and the nightingale. It is known for certain that over a hundred tanks have already been delivered in excess of those declared, this is not counting the little things in the form of infantry fighting vehicles, armored personnel carriers, mrap and other animals. And I pray to God that our people do not oversleep the direction and time of the strike. Losses will be colossal... And it is still not clear why they do not hit the Ukrainians at the location? Why are they being kept? Agreements again?

[solar]

did not use massive bombing tu22m3m in full bomb load

With unsuppressed enemy air defense, this will only lead to the death of aviation

[FoBoss_VM]

Oh, stop repeating these mantras already. One idiot spoke out and everyone repeats after him like a prayer. There are special measures to open up and suppress enemy air defense, there are forces and means for this. Tu22m3m ammunition is laid from 7-8 km, MANPADS do not go there. Plus, the bombers have their own rabbi, plus the su35 escort. The operation is difficult, but it is possible and necessary to prepare and perform it. And carry out without loss. It would be Putin's will. The military is not allowed to fight at full strength. It is forbidden to destroy certain objects, they are forbidden to hit the clusters with their hands. Dirty War

[falx]

The talk that Russia/Kremlin/Putin, in case of defeat in the upcoming battle, will negotiate on the terms of the West, is striking in its naivety and even stupidity. are they serious about it?

[kakvastam]

"No alternative Minsk", "goodwill gestures" and "difficult decisions" show that their calculations may well come true.

[1 z1]

I wonder if only Western partners led Putin by the nose? It seems to me that, in addition to the hypocritical environment, the beginning of the NWO could bless the leadership of China

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: 1z1

the beginning of the NWO could bless the leadership of China

Why do they need it?

[MBRSS]

Mordvin 3 We are driving raw materials to China cheaper than we were driving to Europe. But I do not think that China specifically wants to rot Russia.

[1 z1]

So all the interested parties probably did not expect such a development of the NWO. And for China, in any case, while Russia is under sanctions, buns are pouring in.

[alexoff]

I remember after the dump from Kherson they asked for negotiations to fix the losses, and it was not Zelya with Bidon. But the partners did not want to take a little shame, they want a lot of shame. Let's see if they bargain or not.

[Pavel_Sh]

Well, Putin came to Minsk-1/2. They came to Turkey in the first month of the NWO. Then they came to the grain deal. Will come to Minsk-3 if necessary. You are speaking from a citizen's point of view. And it follows - from the point of view of the oligarchs. Their goal is to return economic conditions to their previous levels as quickly as possible. The West sings very sweetly - we wish you defeat, but on acceptable terms. I see no reason why the oligarchs (and in fact this is the government) will not meet such conditions.

[Egor Adashev]

Quote: boris ivanov

"why Moscow after one defeat, if it still takes place"
What am I reading right now? Such an idea, even hypothetically, should not be considered! Or did someone decide to prepare the electorate, and to such an outcome?

So they have forgotten how to think ahead, for them a two-year-old is already unimaginable wisdom ...

[Fangaro]

The news has no author.

VO just generates texts to increase the number of views? There are authors in History, there are authors in Armament. And there is no news. Maybe this is not news? And there are less and less authors in the Main. Maybe the main thing is not the main thing, but the stuffing of the rating? Before selling VO to some Twitter for the maximum amount.

[Filibuster]

The most probable is the scenario in which the war will turn into a protracted one and will be waged to the exhaustion of one of the parties. At the same time, many are not sure that Russia will be the first to surrender in this struggle.

It is absolutely obvious for every Russian person what is considered a defeat of Russia in this war for Ukraine - the preservation of the Nazi regime in Kiev, the Bandera ideology, the preservation of Nazi Ukraine's access to the Black Sea coast - Odessa, Nikolaev and Kherson as US Navy bases, a temporary freeze of the war on the current LBS, which will give the Kiev regime time to rearm the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

[Ezekiel 25-17]

Russia would rather use nuclear weapons than agree to an analogue of the Brest Peace.

[Private SA]

And like the Wehrmacht with a dozen self-propelled guns "Artsturm" (Stug III) and a dozen trucks
with panzeregers, the city of Oryol took it, it seems that there was also the headquarters of the military district.
Eremenko passed through the headquarters of the front, crushing them with caterpillars, not understanding what it was.
Later the infantry divisions home-marched.

Quote: Stepan S

They cut off the supplies that captured the garrison and destroy

Oh well . Remember the siege of Koenigsberg, Poznan. Fighting in Mariupol ...
And God forbid, Buchu ...

[Ratibor_A]

The goal of the NWO has been set and it will be achieved .... Only Europeans who are ready to turn their backs on them can not understand this, so long as they are not touched and live in comfort ...

[isv000]

What's up with that?! Do they really believe in the possibility of defeating Russia?! We’ll cook potatoes on a fire, we’ll also find something to hit, do they remember something about the partisans at all ?!

[Mordvin 3]

I see no reason why the West should defeat us. It’s better for them to tighten this NWO, as in Afghanistan, for 10 years. Only there our contingent was about a hundred thousand, and in Ukraine - half a million somewhere. And the losses over these 10 years will not be 15 thousand, but more. Moreover, the loss of men in the prime of life. And then maybe a new Gorbachev will come and start making friends with the West. Well, I wasn’t an optimist before, and now even more so, don’t understand what’s in your head.

[MBRSS]

I see no reason why the West should defeat us. It’s better for them to tighten this NWO ...... Moreover, the loss of men in their prime ...

Absolutely right!!! I think the West won't even mind if we chop off half of Ukraine. The main thing is that we get this territory in ruins (like Bakhmut or Popasnaya), with a poor and embittered population. Then we will be guaranteed to be weak for another 50 years, which plays into their hands.

And then maybe a new Gorbachev will come and start making friends with the West.

In principle, Putin will suit them, too. He has not yet abandoned the idea of ​​restoring former friendly relations with the West. Tries to honor all contracts. Worse (for them) if the Communists come to power. Therefore, Putin is a very acceptable option.

[Maks1995]

A set of template statements.
although there are a lot of articles nearby that write exactly the opposite.

[lopvlad]

The West has relied on the spring offensive of the Armed Forces of Ukraine

the only thing the West relies on is the peacefulness and compassion of Russia even towards the enemy, namely, that Russia will never, under any circumstances, use its neither new nor old weapons of mass destruction against it.
They believe that they are in a kind of abstract impenetrable bunker, and therefore they can do anything, and until Russia demonstrates to them that their bunker is a cardboard escalation will only increase.

[Romeo]

what is the benefit performance of cipso here? more and more of them. Is it possible for the admins to cover them up?

[MBRSS]

what is the benefit performance of cipso here?

My version: members of the forum were bitten badly and they massively began to turn into werewolves: during the day they write one thing, and closer to midnight they reveal, so to speak, their second look.
Another version: shhhh...! admins are werewolves...
(Joke, if anything)

[Fangaro]

I wanted to ask why they downvoted.
And all the same minuses noted?
What is this? Bots? Ukrainians? VO itself?
Where did all the minuses come from?
And hawks, and peacekeepers, and random passers-by.

[B44]

I'm shocked too, what's going on here? It looks like a massive use of bots or a pre-planned attack by trolls.

[former soldier]

I'm shocked too, what's going on here? It looks like a massive use of bots or a pre-planned attack by trolls.

Don't care about bots. Write what you think is necessary, without looking at +/-.

[Nord11]

But it seems to me that the best outcome for the United States would be to support the conflict to the last, and then foist a devastated, plundered Ukraine with an embittered population of Russia. We definitely won’t pull such a “victory” ..

[MBRSS]

Nord11 +100500. Oil painting "Lunar landscape on the Dnieper" is being written right now and will be solemnly presented to us! And it's kind of awkward to refuse.

[Private SA]

Quote from Fangaro

Where did all the minuses come from?

Are you that interested? I personally wanted to poop from a high
tree and on "Like" and on "Minus". Chat is not small children, so that from the roof
nine-story buildings due to a bad review on the network on the asphalt rush ...
They served the army in Soviet times, and there the opinions expressed
in bad terms it was quite enough ... Every three minutes.

[Alexey G]

The success of the Ukrainian army, the newspaper writes, should push Putin to negotiations on Kiev's terms, which means the return of all territories "conquered by Russia" since the beginning of the special operation, as well as the fulfillment of the "wants" of the United States and Europe.

Yes! And also, Russia can simply bang tactical nuclear weapons at western Ukraine and there will be no more deliveries and everyone will screw up and understand that the Russians are not joking and it's time to shut up and talk nicely.

[Al manah]

And Russia can just bang tactical nuclear weapons on western Ukraine

Maybe, but it doesn’t bang, which means it can’t.

[Muromczev-2015]

It's funny to read the local forum - some cypsoshniks gathered :)....

[tolmachiev51]

They stubbornly push the skakuas into the "meat grinder", knowing full well that there will be no victory because, as our supreme leader said, "..... we have not started yet !!!"

[Knell wardenheart]

In the USA, they prefer the type of planning in which the result is not conditionally "bad" and "good" - but "good", "acceptable" or "excellent" from their point of view. In other words, their plans lure the target of the focus into conditions in which she (the target) is forced to choose not from "good" and "bad" options, but from bad and very bad ones. If they can lure the target deep enough into these snares, of course.
For example, when they lured the USSR to Afghanistan in this way, they would not be embarrassed by our final "victory" in this conflict - because they have been observing and analyzing our dumbest habits of distributing money and nishtyakans to all the orphans and the poor for quite a long time, like that, that by these habits we are gradually placing our economy in more and more embarrassing situations. In the conditions of a conditional "victory" we would have got a poor and backward country, into which we would have to "pump", and which would have occupied us to about the same degree. Among other things, the USSR would receive another flabby socialist ally in a region that is mostly non-socialist and extremely specific.
A sort of "Trojan horse" in general.

So now, as far as I understand, the United States does not see a "bad" option in which we conditionally "win".
They are probably very skeptical about our ability to capitalize on the busy without critical internal imbalances. And the array of sanctions adopted on the sly will, of course, further contribute to this.
This is one of the levels of the plan.
Another level is to involve us in some kind of reciprocal activity, in which it will seem to us that we will "respond asymmetrically to the West." Such activity will bring us less benefit than some abstract "harm" that, in our view, we will cause it to the West.
Here I am talking first of all about this newfangled shirt with a "multipolar world". All these lala-trolls about some alternative, like any construction in general, must eat a lot of resources, and they will eat them, of course. Or it will be a simulation (and image damage as its long-term result). Since this is an extremely large, long and hemorrhoidal project, for a state that has been chewing gum for 20+ years with such a trifle as the "Union State of Russia and Belarus", any movers in this direction will be downright a tasty morsel for plutocrats, because we will shoot at it has a lot of resources, makes a lot of mistakes and, most importantly, the task is endless and not in our wallet at the same time.

Here they will only need to stock up on popcorn and occasionally throw firewood of one kind or another, so that the situation becomes even more fun for us, pushing us either to economic collapse, or to turning into a hellish bogey for the "countries of the free world", or to an increase in tension in the elites and society.

The counter to this would be the most understandable and voiced plan that adequately takes into account both our resources and their potential focus. This has not yet been publicly announced. Alas.

[Slon1978]

Our people, including all sorts of experts and analysts, including you, no matter how cynical it sounds, it is not worth voicing these plans. You will still be dissatisfied and will only get new food for criticism of both the plan itself and the bumps that will inevitably appear on the way to its implementation. The enemy will also be unjustifiably informed. Therefore, it is not necessary to voice plans loudly (Rogozin knows how to do this remarkably in our country), but to quietly implement them, giving out information to the population as they go through the stages - and nothing more. Whoever has brains in his head, he will see the plan himself.

[Al manah]

but it is not worth voicing these plans.

There is nothing to voice, no one plans anything, because brains are needed for this, and by the way the strange operation is being carried out, it is clear that they were not there.

[former soldier]

In the USA, they prefer the type of planning in which the result is not conditionally "bad" and "good" - but "good", "acceptable" or "excellent" from their point of view. In other words, their plans lure the focus target into such conditions.

With such "smart" planning, they fled Afghanistan so shamefully.

[Knell wardenheart]

All US constructs work relatively well against civilized states, and the better the society and infrastructure of these states are, the better. Because their planning analyzes the habits of the elites, pain points, economic injections and outpourings, and so on. Americans know how to count money and generally understand the psychology of the consumer quite well, and through these two things they got the hang of influencing.
In terms of military strength, they also act in APPROXIMATELY the same way - "carrying out" civil architecture, key nodes, and so on. All that matters, in a nutshell.
This works the better, I repeat, the more developed the state, its infrastructure and its civil society.
Neither in Afghanistan, nor in any Somalia, this "so" will not work. Because there is a different attitude to things, to life, to values, and so on and so forth. Conventionally, instead of the general headquarters with some pathos shoulder straps and respectable uncles, there will be a house made of adobe bricks, and bearded men will gather there, blow something and solve a whole heap of problems for some garrison, and then these problems will spread through their volosts embody what is called. There you can easily hang a shkolotron or femka with TNT and send it "on a mission" without blinking an eye. And behind it there will be a queue of people who want to. There, you can instill in the little man the "values ​​of the free world" as much as you like, but she will know that the real values ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXbare a set fraulein, a roof made of fresh straw and a good harvest of opium poppy. And there can also be such a magical thing as an economy approaching natural - when, conditionally, most of what is consumed in it is made inside the country, and some high-value nishtyaks are imported literally from all sides in microscopic batches according to well-functioning and damn flexible schemes. There will be no (or almost) any Akhedzhakovs or Sakharovs who will drip on the brains of power or shake the air in the ears of the followers - simply because these same followers will deeply spit on everything that is above the lowest cultural or intellectual level.

Like the USSR at one time, the Americans simply did not catch up with the real depth of this rabbit hole until they climbed into it. Their society appreciates comfort, predictability, freedom and opportunity - and the society of Afghanistan, strictly speaking, does not care about all this, except, perhaps, the first. But even here their view of things categorically diverges from the American one.

Any elegance or multi-level cunning of any plans there stupidly breaks into the actual indifferent-religious feudal autarky of being. Genghis Khan would solve this problem, but the US has a thin gut.

[MBRSS]

Here they will only need to stock up on popcorn and occasionally throw firewood of one kind or another, so that the situation becomes even more fun for us ...

which is successfully carried out by the enemy :(

[Kuziming]

Quote: B44

I'm shocked too, what's going on here? It looks like a massive use of bots or a pre-planned attack by trolls.

It is also there.
But the main reason is that the patriotic audience does not have a unified view of the situation.
It can be said that the division into jingoists and skeptics remains. They undermine each other.
There is also a division into religious communists and realists, they also minus each other.
And one more division - into supporters of an extensive approach, mass mobilization, and technocrats, supporters of the intensification of production and the development of technologies, the conduct of hostilities with modern types of weapons, a small number.

[Alexander Raikov]

All this is due to the practical discrediting of the Russian armed forces over the past year by the NVO. Previously, everyone believed that the Russian Armed Forces were still the strongest army capable of solving any tasks, even individual mistakes in Syria did not affect. Today they have already begun to apply the concept of "defeat" to the RF Armed Forces.

[azmt]

Quote: bayard

Yes .
Or do you think that someone is striving for Victory?
I also wish .

It's strange, you have like positive messages are replaced by almost complete hopelessness.

[zenion]

To defeat the Russians, you need an army like Genghis Khaim, or three such armies as Hitler had.

[_simply]

Put alarmists against the wall! Wow, good gentlemen, in due time... Yes, okay. I won't say anything.

[Bayun]

The Armed Forces of Ukraine could not take Donetsk for 8 years. The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation for a year could not secure Donetsk from shelling, they could not take Kyiv and Kharkov. Maybe it's worth recognizing that Ukraine, with the loss of territories, like Poland and Finland after 1917, honestly "swept aside" Moscow, becoming independent?

Ukraine - also honestly admit that Russian people and lands (before Nikolaev and Odessa) "saw in a coffin in white slippers" Uniatism, independence and Ukraine itself.

Better to curse each other until we get tired than with bombs, missiles and DRGs.

[Alexander Raikov]

What you call Ukraine, in fact, has not been the former Ukrainian SSR for a long time, but it is "Anti-Russia", "Banderoland" or something else, but this, a tumor formation, will constantly metastasize and infect the body of Russia ...

[EugeneG]

If without journalistic snot, then ... the Euro-democratic stick has two ends, two parties. Kind of a Tory Whig.
At one end of which, for half a year now, the West has been cynically programming Ukrainians for a spring meat grinder. That there is a typical liberal idea to mow down the male population of Ukraine for the sake of a bright future for the Anglo-Saxons.
The Second European Party of Love for Ukraine advocates for as long as possible to test the latest types of weapons and techniques in the "square".
Both European parties are remarkably wise and will somehow agree among themselves at the expense of such laboratory "coming out" rodents. Mice or rabbits - one ***. Games with covidla from this opera. Classics of the genre.

[zenion]

It can easily be broken. The main thing here is to take a picture in time when they return. While it’s still cold here, it’s better not to wear underwear under your pants, you may not have time to take them off. Even when returning, it can rub the legs and the entire back of the body. There may not be enough water for everything and so on.

[BorzRio]

How in general have we lived to such a point that serious people in the West, in the USA, believe that Ukraine, even with the support of the West, can defeat Russia?! After all, they have intelligence that is ten times more knowledgeable and technically stronger than ours. So they know something, since they believe in it?