The fate of the Burevestnik

138
The fate of the Burevestnik


"Flying Chernobyl"


We are talking about the product 9M730 "Petrel" according to the NATO classification SSC-X-9 Skyfall, which is being developed by the Novator Design Bureau (Yekaterinburg). When in 2018 the Russian president first announced the development in Russia of such weapons, Western experts unanimously argued that it was fiction, "Putin's cartoons."



But in two and a half years, the means of objective control of Western, mainly, of course, American intelligence services that monitor the testing of the latest Russian weapons, have made a revolution in consciousness in the West, a radical change in emotions from irony to anxiety, if not more - banal fear. Now they have to accept the Burevestnik as a reality. Skyfall has not yet entered service, but, apparently, this is a matter of the near future.

President Vladimir Putin and the Russian Ministry of Defense say that Russia already has a 9M730 Burevestnik missile, supposedly powered by a pulsed nuclear air-jet engine (PuYaVRD) similar to the classic PuVRD. But only a small-sized active zone is placed instead of the combustion chamber. Graphite, possibly more modern materials, is probably used as a moderator, and compacted atmospheric air is used as a coolant.

In fairness, the Americans were the first to try to create a strategic cruise missile with a nuclear power plant. Vought SLAM (Supersonic Low-Altitude Missile - low-altitude supersonic guided missile) - a project of an American strategic cruise missile with a nuclear ramjet engine, unlimited range. The Vought SLAM was a canard aerodynamically designed cruise missile.

Its design has been specially adapted for extreme flight conditions at design speeds up to M=3 at an altitude of no more than 300 meters. The rocket body, which had to withstand high thermal and aerodynamic loads, was supposed to be made of high-strength steel. The structure of the rocket was designed so strong that the designers jokingly referred to it as a "flying crowbar".

Although the prototype SLAM rocket was never built, the estimated flight speed at an altitude of 30 feet (000 m) was supposed to reach Mach 9, and the flight range at this altitude was supposed to be 100 km. At low altitudes (4,2 meters) and a speed of Mach 182 - a range of 000 km.

The main difference between the Russian Burevestnik and the American SLAM is the equipment of its PuYAVRD, and not a direct-flow nuclear VRD, the presence of an air valve in the PuVRD, the purpose of which is to prevent the reverse movement of the working fluid forward in the direction of the vehicle, which would negate jet thrust. In a ramjet, this valve is not needed, since the reverse movement of the working fluid in the engine tract is prevented by a “barrier” of pressure at the inlet to the combustion chamber, created during the compression of the working fluid at supersonic (more than Mach 3) speeds.

In a PWRJ, due to low subsonic speeds (Mach 0,9–1,0), the initial compression is too low, and the pressure increase in the combustion chamber, in a classic PWR, or in the core in a PWR, is achieved due to heating of the working fluid in a constant volume, limited by the walls of the chamber, the valve, and the inertia of the gas column in the long nozzle of the engine.

In an interview, French military expert Corentin Brustlin noted:

“A nuclear power plant removes restrictions on the amount of fuel, which allows the missile to use trajectories that are not tracked by the enemy and strike at weakly protected objects. Naturally, the presence of such a missile will make it possible to break through the enemy's anti-missile defense system.
In the increasingly complicated world military-political situation, this will become a very serious trump card.”

At first, the West was dominated by a rather skeptical attitude towards the prospects of the Russian missile. By the summer of 2020, it was replaced by wariness. For example, the US President's Special Representative for Arms Control Marshall Billingsley said that such a weapon should not exist at all, since it is a "flying Chernobyl".

Then, in September 2020, a statement was made by the head of British military intelligence, Lieutenant General Jim Hockenhull. He stressed that the Burevestnik missile is capable of staying in the air for an almost unlimited time. This allows you to inflict unexpected strikes on targets.

The 9M730 Burevestnik missile will be equipped only with the SBC, no “conventional” option is provided, for obvious reasons. Based on the results of work carried out in the USSR (Russia) in the 70–90s, jointly by teams of nuclear scientists RFNC-VNIIEF, KB-11 (Arzamas-16) in Sarov and RFNC-VNIITF, KB-1011 (Chelyabinsk-70) in Snezhinsk As regards the missile weapons systems of the Navy and the Strategic Missile Forces, including ammunition of small, medium and high power class, an essentially unprecedented qualitative growth was achieved in their main characteristics that determine combat effectiveness. Significantly, at times, the specific energy of nuclear warheads has increased. For small and medium-sized ammunition, it increased from 1 kt/kg to 5,25 kt/kg.

Modern Russian thermonuclear munitions, created already in the 2000–2010s. – 100 kg small class (150–250 kt) and 200 kg medium class (500 kt), 400 kg high class (2 Mt) power, designed to meet modern requirements for increased safety at all stages of the life cycle, reliability, security in abnormal conditions during operation and unauthorized actions. This is ensured by the first applied inertial adaptive detonation system in combination with the sensors and devices used in the automation.

At the same time, the level of anti-missile defense was increased. According to the calculations of the leading American specialist Hans M. Christensen, it will take the Americans at least 20 years, with appropriate funding, to reach the same level of power density of nuclear charges as the Russians. In principle, any of these new charges can be installed on a rocket.

A campaign has been organized in the Western press to discredit the latest Russian weapons; in the information war, all means are good, and not only in the Western, but also in ours. Moreover, not only “couch experts” and bloggers are involved, but also authoritative heavyweights.

Here is what Vladimir Zinovievich Dvorkin writes in his article “Russia's New Weapon: Benefit or Harm” (NVO No. 29, 2021):

“... in no real scenario, the Burevestnik cruise missile will not be able to make any contribution to the potential of Russia's nuclear deterrence, provided by the existing triad of strategic nuclear forces. At the same time, it should be taken into account that the probability of a successful flight of cruise missiles with a much shorter flight duration compared to the Burevestnik is noticeably lower compared to weapons in the strategic nuclear forces.

And he also writes:

"Poseidon" and "Petrel" complexes.
Their trials are at an early stage, and the terms of their possible adoption into service will most likely be outside the period of validity of the extended START-3 Treaty. But their inclusion in a hypothetically possible new treaty could be considered subject to the existence in the United States of similar systems or other new models that are subject to control and do not violate the overall balance of deterrence potentials.
To date, the possibility of achieving a solution to this problem seems extremely difficult, rather even impossible.”

That is, if the Americans do not have similar models of weapons or they are not able to create them in the foreseeable future, then we must abandon them. Otherwise, the Americans will refuse to renew START-3 or sign a new treaty.

Do we need such a treaty that will be beneficial only to the United States and limit our capabilities?

It is Poseidon and Burevestnik that are subjected to the greatest criticism in the Western press. The most effective of the recently created. The Poseidon cannot be intercepted or destroyed by modern means of destruction of the US Navy, the Burevestnik cannot be detected and intercepted after launch by modern radar and optoelectronic means of detection and target designation. Rocket 9M730 "Petrel", like a ghost, appears for a moment and disappears just as instantly. It can only be detected at the moment of launch, while the starting solid-propellant booster is working for this time, no more than 3 seconds from specialized DSP-4 satellites.

But, unlike ICBMs, they will immediately lose it. And they quite successfully detect and track ICBMs due to the long active phase in time from 180 to 300 seconds. Enough to build a mathematical model of the flight path. Not surprisingly, they were originally intended to detect ICBM launches.

In contrast to the “ordinary KR” of the Tomahawk or Caliber type, whose cruising flight takes place at an altitude of 6 meters, both at one and the other, only the final section of the route (about 000 km at the Tomahawk) passes at altitudes from 80 feet (100 meters) to 30 feet (200 meters) depending on the terrain in the target area. Such a flight profile, it is called - High-Low (high-low altitude), is a classic for all KR from anti-ship to strategic. For subsonic and transonic cruise missiles, the optimal cruising flight altitude (flight level) is 60–6 meters. At this altitude, the rocket travels the longest path with the least fuel consumption.

Examples of missiles flying at this echelon are the already mentioned "Tomahawk" and "Caliber" of all modifications, strategic air-based missile launchers X-101/102, X-555, AGM-86B ALCM, as well as transonic anti-ship P-500 (4M77) " Basalt, P-1000 (3M70) Vulkan, P-35 (4M44) Progress, etc. 2,5 meters. It is at this altitude that the anti-ship missiles P-3,0 (12M000) "Granit", P-14 (000M700) "Onyx" and strategic nuclear ASMP, ASMP-A (ASN3G) pass most of the way. For hypersonic missiles (with flight speeds from M-45 and above), the flight level of 800–3 meters is considered optimal.

The range or "radius" of the Tomahawk missiles, officially for the conventional version, is 1 English miles (000 km) (RGM / UGM-1E TLAM-E (Tomahawk Block IV) with a fuel reserve of 600 kg) - this value is "operational" range, which takes into account such factors as maneuvering around protected areas, deviations from the course to fly over a predetermined territory (correction areas) for updating information in inertial guidance systems, vertical maneuvering to avoid obstacles, fuel requirements, flying at higher than optimal speeds through protected areas and low-level flight.

The straight-line “aerodynamic” flight range of the Tomahawk (RGM/UGM-109A, with 650 kg of fuel) is about 4 km, provided that the entire flight takes place at the optimum altitude of 300 feet (20 meters) (fuel consumption for DTRD three times lower than at low and ultra-low altitudes) at cruising speed - 000 miles / hour (6 km / h).

Burevestnik conducts the entire flight route, regardless of its length, whether it be 10 km or 000 km, at altitudes from 20 to 000 meters at a cruising speed of about 25–100 km/h. Probably, the maximum speed, due to the specifics of the operation of the PuYaVRD, can reach up to 800–850 km/h. Engine thrust, most likely: about 1–100 kg. Which is quite enough for a subsonic missile launcher with a launch weight of 1–300 kg. Yes, the rocket does not need to fly at high altitude, it unmasks the CD.

The Burevestnik is devoid of the main drawback of all existing strategic missiles, both subsonic, supersonic, and even hypersonic. They are easily detected on the cruising sections of the flight. Long before reaching the goal. Burevestnik has an almost unlimited range reserve, which allows it to bypass air defense zones (A2 / AD) without any problems, enter the airspace of a potential enemy from any direction. In the US, for example, from the Mexican border. It should be noted that there is no continuous radar field over the USA. From the word "absolutely". As such, there is no air defense.

The fleet of fighter-interceptors is total of 240 F-22A, F-15C, F-16C aircraft. The comical events of the last week with the participation of Chinese balloons only confirm the absence of the country's air defense as such.

In the USSR, for example, at the end of the 1980s, there was a systemic air defense system with a continuous radar field over the entire territory, controlled by 800 radars of various types, 2 interceptor fighters and 500 missile launchers were available. It is worth noting that after the American authorities realized the threat in the late 10s and early 000s from a large number of Soviet ICBMs, it was decided to abandon powerful air defense, including a large number of air defense systems deployed on the territory of the country.

Airspace control is badly organized


According to former US Secretary of Defense Schlesinger, “If they cannot protect their cities from strategic missiles, then it is not worth even trying to create protection against a small number of bombers. aviation THE USSR". There is only a more or less continuous radar field of civil air traffic. Very specific, I must say. Airspace control is organized very badly, especially for unknown targets not identified by transponders. Small targets flying at ultra-low altitudes (less than 60 meters) are not seen by civilian airfield radars at all.

This is often used by owners of unregistered small aircraft. Of which in the United States, according to police estimates, there are tens of thousands. They clog and complicate the monitoring of US airspace to such an extent that, most likely, deliberately monitoring airspace at ultra-low altitudes is carried out formally, that is, in no way.

At the moment, the NORAD system is engaged in radar control of the air situation over the territory of the continental United States and Canada only for ballistic targets in the interests of missile defense. To control the airspace of aerodynamic targets, mobile radars are used, up to 12 air defense fighters and 2–3 AWACS aircraft are constantly in the air. That's the whole air defense of the US territory.

A standard NATO airborne early warning aircraft - AWACS E-3C / D / F / G will detect a Tomahawk or Caliber at a distance of 240 to 320 km, depending on the angle to the target and the altitude of its flight. But the "Petrel" at a distance of 40 to 100 km (depending on the real EPR of the rocket), if it is at the right time in the right place, and immediately loses it, Western experts estimate the EPR of the missile at the level of Kh-101 and AGM-129A from 0,01 (flank projection) to 0,001 m2 (frontal projection). The missile will only briefly strike on the radar screen and disappear, the operator has no choice but to take this splash for a flock of birds or a big wave. It's like looking for a needle in a haystack with a magnet, especially if you don't know where to look.

All these are theoretical estimates, in reality, in practice it is even worse. Suffice it to recall the episode that took place on March 11, 2022. The Ukrainian Tu-141 Strizh UAV, launched by the crew of the 321st separate UAV squadron (Raukhovka village, Berezovsky district, Odessa region), flew over 550 kilometers from Ukraine to Croatia and, after losing a control signal, crashed when it ran out of fuel.

A press release from the Office of the President of Croatia quotes President Zoran Milanovic as saying that

"the aircraft entered Croatian airspace after more than 40 minutes of flight over Hungary undetected."

The drone then flew for seven minutes in Croatian airspace and crashed in the urban area of ​​Jarun. The statement also said that the drone flew from the territory of Ukraine at a speed of more than 850 km / h at an altitude of 1 meters, crossed the airspace of Hungary and Croatia and crashed in the center of Zagreb.

According to the first investigative reports published in Croatia, the drone lost control signal and flew until it ran out of fuel. Meanwhile, Hungarian sources reported that it arrived in their airspace via Romania, again without being detected by air defense systems. The event is being treated as a serious incident and Croatia has launched an investigation to try to understand how an old Soviet-era drone was able to pass undetected through NATO airspace.

Croatian President Zoran Milanovic said it was clear that the drone came from Ukraine and entered Croatian airspace after flying over Hungarian territory. At this time, two AWACS E-3C aircraft patrolled in the airspace of Hungary, Romania and Croatia: American and British. Neither one nor the other saw a target with an RCS of more than 5 m2flying at an altitude of 1 meters without changing course and altitude (straight-line). There are questions. Is the AWACS E-300 capable of seeing small and low-altitude targets? And not only me. Here are some examples from social media. In general, it should be noted that there was a uniform panic in social networks then.

One of the Twitter clients under the nickname Vladimir Mrkša writes:

“How could this device fly over Romania, Hungary and Croatia without being intercepted? Hmm, you can’t say anything, “excellent”, however, NATO has air defense.”

He is echoed by a user with the nickname ASTA:

“Neither NATO AWACS nor AGS ground surveillance spotted this 15m drone during its 350 mile journey across multiple countries?! What would happen if it collapsed in the center of the city, killing dozens of people in the process?

9М730


The body of the 9M730 rocket is made using the Stealth technology, the cross section of the fuselage is an inverted trapezoid, the signal reflected from the rocket in the onboard projection goes under it, and does not return to the radar antennas, and this is at a flight altitude of 25-50 meters. "Zircon" due to the specifics of the laws of aerodynamic flight at hypersonic speeds is made of heat-resistant materials with a large number of fuselage elements and aerodynamic surfaces made of titanium and steel alloys, a design of straight lines and sharp corners.

In general, a solid, huge "corner reflector", according to the most conservative estimates, an RCS of about 15 m2, such an object, and even flying at an altitude of up to 30 km - the E-3C will detect at a distance of 500 to 600 km. The Zircon's only advantage is its speed, meaning it's easy to spot, but hard to shoot down.

The only reliable way to detect the Burevestnik rocket is by its radioactive trace that it will leave on its way - the isotopes of iodine 131, ruthenium 103, cesium 134 and cesium 137, but it has a drawback - the detection of the rocket trace will occur on the third or fourth day, when radioactive elements reach the upper atmosphere.

Given the 2-megaton SBC, Burevestnik is the only one of all the “Putin cartoons” that the US will only learn about using when one of the large metropolitan areas suddenly disappears along with the entire population. Only now it becomes clear such "close attention" to this particular missile from the Western media and our "fifth column" and a clearly organized campaign to discredit. 9M730 "Burevestnik" is an ideal "weapon of deterrence", the enemy will always be convinced, whatever his intentions towards Russia - the "response" is inevitable and inevitable.

During the test tests in the autumn-winter of 2017, a mobile range launcher was used, created using the artillery part of the 9P113 type launcher of the 9K52 Luna-M missile system with a launch container made on the basis of the container of the 4K44 Redut missile system.

Obviously, the rocket is in the dimensions of the Bazalt anti-ship missile - Vulkan, and directly asks for armament of the Marshal Ustinov and Varyag cruisers in the CM-248 launch containers. Preliminarily carry out the modernization of the cruisers, replacing the Osa-MA near-field air defense system with the Pantsir-M.

Most likely, the main method of basing missiles will be a ground-based mobile launcher.

Each of the newest Russian weapons created recently has its undeniable advantages, but there are also disadvantages, and you need to think hard before sacrificing some type of weapon to the new START.

It seems that while the fate of the Burevestnik was being decided, the START was being covered with a copper basin. It is good to.
138 comments
Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. +23
    18 February 2023 03: 49
    Lord, what are the "Petrels"? Yes. give the army an elementary connection, give at least some ammunition, 122 has long been at zero, 152 is with a gulkin nose. We already have D-1s at the front, and some have "Petrels" in their heads .....
    As for the fact that "one of the major US metropolitan areas will suddenly disappear along with the entire population," then our authorities do not dare to strike at the communications of Maidan Ukraine (Karl of Ukraine, not the West), his television is working, even strikes on the energy infrastructure are such that God forbid not to de-energize Ukraine, otherwise how will we drive resources to the coveted West.
    In general, of course, what we remembered about the Petrels is symptomatic. The worse things are in the real world, the more actively the West will demand surrender, payment of reparations and a tribunal over the authorities of the Russian Federation, the more often our propaganda inside will talk about how our Petrel flies across the expanses of Poseidon and all of us are so afraid that in fact we are already won.
    1. -2
      18 February 2023 04: 24
      the more actively the West will demand surrender, payment of reparations and a tribunal over the authorities of the Russian Federation

      From whom to demand?
      1. 0
        18 February 2023 05: 00
        Quote: malyvalv
        From whom to demand?

        So the authorities of the Russian Federation and demand. The minimum requirements of the West are only for entry into negotiations - the border for 1991. compensation for Ukraine's material losses and a war criminals tribunal.
        Well, then a wide field of opportunities opens up for such beloved multi-moves and cunning plans, the surrender of Crimea may not be allowed to be issued immediately, but after a transitional period, reparations through the already seized parts of the gold reserves, and to hand over all the "extremists" in the Hague in a wide range from Prigozhin to Strelkov.
        So you can try to extort a few more years in power and property.
        1. +12
          18 February 2023 05: 29
          Whose Crimea? Answer, dear, please.
          1. +1
            18 February 2023 06: 11
            Interestingly, the "Belisarius" himself believes in this ?? And it looks like a liberal training manual a year and a half ago
          2. +18
            18 February 2023 06: 24
            Quote: Mikhail Tynda
            Whose Crimea? Answer, dear, please.

            Russian.
            1. 0
              18 February 2023 12: 47
              Quote: Belisarius
              Quote: Mikhail Tynda
              Whose Crimea? Answer, dear, please.

              Russian.

              He is Russian and was in Ukraine. Russian or Ukrainian?
              1. +14
                18 February 2023 13: 18
                Quote: Carat
                He is Russian and was in Ukraine. Russian or Ukrainian?

                I see the level of discussion is rising)
                I can't stand the word "Russian" that has been widely introduced since the days of EBN as a quasi-replacement for the forbidden word Russian, but if you, like a real "dear Russian", use it, then Russian.
                1. +1
                  20 February 2023 18: 53
                  But it’s interesting, if we have the Russian Federation, then how to denote the belonging of any subject to it, if not with the word “Russian” ???
              2. +7
                18 February 2023 21: 28
                Soviet """"
            2. -4
              18 February 2023 13: 17
              Quote: Belisarius
              Quote: Mikhail Tynda
              Whose Crimea? Answer, dear, please.

              Russian.

              In general, Crimea is multinational. Three state languages. Ukrainian, Crimean Tatar. Russian .. More than one hundred and fifty peoples and nationalities live in Sevastopol-Crimea. And Crimea-Sevastopol is part of the Russian Federation.
              1. +14
                18 February 2023 13: 43
                Quote: 30 vis
                In general, Crimea is multinational.

                In fact, the word Russian has never been used in the narrow ethnic sense of the word. Neither in the Imperial nor in the Soviet period.
                Let me remind you that even in the empire our tsars were Russian (although by nationality they were generally Germans in the last 130 years).
            3. +4
              18 February 2023 13: 18
              Do not overshadow the weekend for the nerds, your pressing problems do not bother the leader of the tribe
          3. Aag
            +12
            18 February 2023 11: 10
            Quote: Mikhail Tynda
            Whose Crimea? Answer, dear, please.

            And Kherson? Nikolaev? Zaporozhye?
            1. +2
              18 February 2023 13: 16
              Quote: AAG
              Quote: Mikhail Tynda
              Whose Crimea? Answer, dear, please.

              And Kherson? Nikolaev? Zaporozhye?

              They forgot about Odessa and Kharkov, dear.
          4. +15
            18 February 2023 13: 45
            Quote: Mikhail Tynda
            Whose Crimea?

            It would be better to ask the Yeltsin company. And for one thing and about 15 former republics of the Soviet Union. Whose are they?wink
          5. -1
            19 February 2023 18: 23
            you look like Ukrainian titushki who pissed off the population with this issue, and people like you poked their fingers at them and said what kind of nits they are. I express to you my sincere disrespect and contempt.
          6. 0
            19 February 2023 20: 39
            Mr. Gordon, you forgot to log in
          7. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. The comment was deleted.
          2. The comment was deleted.
      2. -1
        9 May 2023 09: 35
        Agree. Why all these super-petrels, if there is no minimum in the army. Communication - the level of the Second World War, well, a little higher. The generals themselves use ammunition, apparently. Reports and reports - you can crap one's pants with happiness, in fact - it's a shame to say.
        The most important thing is that the leaders in the CIS and within society have no will to restore elementary order. Education and culture have been the scourge of the people for many decades. America is raising our children.
    2. +7
      18 February 2023 06: 32
      Quote: Belisarius
      Lord, what are the "Petrels"?

      In the late forties of the XX century, the State Department issued a competitive task for a nuclear propulsion. Someone won and started work .. Gru found out about it .. Somewhere in 1952, some kind of "sharashka" began work in this direction. Then a cunning, illiterate Ukrainian conducted a sequestration of scientific works (the famous physicists-lyricists) and received information that this project was 50 years old, reduced funding by 70%, and handsome Kennedy closed this program altogether .. And now we have "a petrel, but they don't have a petrel .. D-1-so it’s good that the “effective managers” couldn’t fuse these weapons anywhere and they are now quite decently striking at the outskirts of the rebels. It’s a pity there are no mortars of the 152th century left with their monstrous caliber and indestructibility - in order to destroy it, you need to hit the muzzle of the barrel several times with XNUMX millimeter paper ..Or "crowbar" but this is from the realm of fantasy. And so a mine of half a ton weighing even once an hour ...
      1. -4
        18 February 2023 09: 34
        Kennedy closed this program altogether .. And

        Buddy, the states closed this program not because they are stupid, but because this program is a dead end and money wasted. 5 AUG will definitely be more effective. We don’t know how to make AUGs, so they overpower the unparalleled.
        And whether we have a petrel is not exactly known, it seems that there is, but they won’t show it, because it’s secret.

        It's a pity there are no mortars of the XNUMXth century

        But there are elephants, give an idea to the Moscow Region and let them buy war elephants in India.
        1. +1
          18 February 2023 09: 50
          Well, they don’t believe in such an idea, but it was so good - 500-600 mm caliber. 200-300 barrel thickness .. it’s not long to bungle a min at a distance of 2-3 km, a trench with a mortar, a couple of messages were brought along it on a motorcycle charging cart three mines - fired briskly, left for shelter, waited out the answer, picked up the mortar that had fallen from close explosions and shoot again
        2. +4
          18 February 2023 10: 05
          And where did I write about fools, perhaps about "effective managers" and then they are not fools, they are simply imprisoned for destruction - different civilizations, different possibilities ..
        3. +1
          19 February 2023 10: 54
          According to the Americans, about 15 prototype launches were carried out. The first 7 did not seem to work properly (?), the next ones seemed to take place. Why, like, - the test program is not known and what was worked out during launches. But since it flies, it means that the engine is quite working. It is possible that they are now bringing automatic control, protecting it on the device and everything related to ensuring the operation of the rocket at all stages of combat work.
          After all, in addition to launching, it must also be monitored and, possibly, retargeted if necessary. And this, with its operating ranges, is obviously provided by a satellite constellation.
      2. +5
        18 February 2023 15: 49
        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
        It’s a pity there are no more mortars of the 152th century with their monstrous caliber and indestructibility - in order to destroy it, you need to hit the muzzle of the barrel with XNUMX millimeter paper several times ..

        Do you dream about it?

        But this is "perfect" for "lazy warriors"! For the "rate of fire" was from 1 to 6 (on average 4 ...) shots per day! belay And also estimate how many diggers are needed to install the tools and in how many hours they will do their job! wink
      3. -2
        18 February 2023 18: 58
        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
        And now we "have a petrel, but they don't have a petrel"

        Such weapons increase the likelihood of a nuclear accident by an order of magnitude. That Poseidon is supposedly uninterceptable, that the Petrel. Our planes regularly fall over there, and then a nuclear reactor will fall on your head
        1. +4
          19 February 2023 15: 33
          So you live somewhere with adversaries, since a "petrel" falls on your head and a "Poseidon" arranges an accident ..
    3. +4
      18 February 2023 10: 01
      Quote: Belisarius

      Lord, what are the "Petrels"? Yes. give the army an elementary connection, give at least some ammunition, 122 has long been at zero, 152 is with a gulkin nose. We already have D-1s at the front, and some have "Petrels" in their heads .....

      Wow, that's how ... It turns out that "Petrel" is to blame for the fact that "122 has long been zero, 152 - with a gulkin's nose. I didn't know. Thanks Belisarius, I opened my eyes. Ask your wife, and she will confirm that she is able to cook You SIMULTANEOUSLY and the first, and the second, and the third for lunch. hi
      1. +2
        18 February 2023 12: 11
        Quote: Krasnoyarsk
        Wow, that's how ... It turns out that "Petrel" is to blame for the fact that "122 has long been at zero, 152 is with a gulkin's nose. I didn't know. Thank you Belisarius, I opened my eyes

        The fact of the matter is that with a drink on "unparalleled in the world" projects, as well as PR on them, they covered up the real state of the army and the absence of the most elementary in it.
        As a result, everyone involved with a lot of money, and in the army there is neither Petrel, nor communications, shells, etc.
        Returned to the Middle Ages military equipment for the mobilized is collected by families and communities.
      2. -3
        18 February 2023 12: 18
        Quote: Krasnoyarsk
        Wow, how ... It turns out "Petrel" is to blame

        Belisarius is an anti-statist. He needs to sow doubt and discontent. Cause? - At the front, the Hohlonatsiks have a complete mess: shells - take care! tanks - maybe as many as 14 units. they will give ... planes - the unattainable dream of a bubuin about oranges!
        But you need to somehow resist the NWO, well, at least on the Baltic front, throw verbal husks on the public - and let them wash themselves off, justify themselves, say that this is all wrong! The receiver is well known. And Goebbels' tactics: the more terrible the lie, the easier it will be believed!
        But in the essence of the article, Belisarius cannot blather anything, because. "there is nothing to cover!" The Yankees are in a deep hollow both in terms of hypersound and in terms of KR Str.D with POISON ...
        AHA.
        1. +12
          18 February 2023 14: 19
          Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
          Belisarius is an anti-statist.

          Again a deuce. I’m just a tough statesman, but I’m really against the authorities established in Russia since 1991 precisely because she is fatal for the Russian statehood and people. Not to notice this for 32 years can only be blind, well, or involved.
          Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
          But in essence, Belisarius cannot blather anything

          The essence of the article is a missile that is not in service "has no analogues in the world", with the same success I can write an article that I am the emperor of the galaxy and I have a laser blaster, and then demand a discussion of these theses "essentially"
          Before the SVO, such articles were amused, now, against the backdrop of all the problems in the real world and the real army, they cause rage.
          1. +2
            18 February 2023 19: 40
            Before the SVO, such articles were amused, now, against the backdrop of all the problems in the real world and the real army, they cause rage.

            Why? For sane people (that is, those who live in the real world and are aware of this) nonetheless ..... the features were, in general, obvious. Now this ... evidence has even begun to reach some (unfortunately) "patriots", "guardians" and the like. But, only up to some, and even they can’t pronounce some words out loud. As in that joke about Vovochka)) But rage ....
            Such a development of events is obvious and logical. Unfortunately. You can remember hand-compotion, you can remember the late Union .... At the appropriate stage of existence, of course. Everything is logical and predictable. Another thing is where it all will roll ... From here, yes, there is still space ....
            1. +4
              18 February 2023 22: 11
              Quote: frog
              But, only up to some, and even they can’t pronounce some words out loud. As in that joke about Vovochka)) But rage ....

              You're right, but I can't take it off
              Firstly, a lot of good and just a lot of people died thanks to such an amazing conduct of the war and such army building, they believed in Novorossia, or believed that they could change something, and now they are gone ...
              Secondly, any sacrifices are justified when there is hope for the best, but with the type of thinking, let's dream about how Burevestnik burns Washington, while the territory of Russia is being shelled like in a shooting range, which no one pays attention to anymore - no hopes are possible. There is no future.
              And since I want it to be, I cannot be detached from it.
              1. +3
                19 February 2023 17: 14
                I fully support you, and I will remind the rest of the story of the Khibiny, which was so admired by more than half of the commentators here. And where are these Khibiny now, no, everything turned out to be bullshit. So it will be with the Petrel. And if it really is, then why talk about it ahead of time? Why declassify new technology? Also about Poseidon, well, why did they talk? The main thing is that the equipment has not been adopted and whether it will be accepted is unknown, but here they are already dreaming of how it will sweep away American cities.
                1. +2
                  20 February 2023 01: 06
                  Quote: Fan-Fan
                  I fully support you

                  Thank you for the kind words. Here the worst thing is this type of thinking itself. People literally daydream and do not want to look at reality. Their house is on fire, and being in a burning house they dream of new curtains.
                  An elementary example is that in the real world, Maidan Ukraine shoots up the territory of Russia every day (not new, but indigenous). Of course, she is not afraid of any "Petrels" and other nonsense, in the real world, the leadership of the Russian Federation is afraid even to lay a finger on the officials of "respected Ukrainian partners." There was an article about this on VO yesterday (today there are no reports of new shelling, although today they killed a girl), and what do you think?
                  No one even commented on it, everyone pretends that it just doesn't exist. Just like they pretend that we have a connection, a form, etc. No witnesses of the Stormcloak sect showed up there. They are not interested at all.
                  But to dream about how hundreds of Petrels burn America and how she is afraid of the mighty Russian Federation here who immediately want the sea ....
                  Quote: Fan-Fan
                  and the rest I will remind the story of the Khibiny, which was so admired by more than half of the commentators here

                  There are many such examples ... The point is that people flying on Petrels and scaring Donald Cook with Khibiny have a memory like that of a gupy fish. They really no longer remember their own enthusiasm for the mighty electronic warfare. And if you remind them, they immediately become mortally offended, and then you become an enemy of the people.
                  The same applies to the Petrel, because they talked about it as an existing and real weapon 5 years ago. It's a long time, so what? What is the result?
                  I'm not saying that initially the story of Mr. Putin made sense to try to persuade the West to negotiate what he then said in plain text, and the second meaning was internal propaganda.
              2. +2
                21 February 2023 21: 01

                You're right, but I can't take it off

                So this is just understandable. But... It's useless to get angry at the rain. Even if you forgot your umbrella...
                And the current state of affairs - this is the same rain. We don’t like him, but what can we do .... I understand that the analogy is very weak, but what is it ...
                As for those who "dream how the Petrel burns Washington", then there were always enough of these cricetinae. and not only here. Alas.
        2. +2
          19 February 2023 01: 19
          Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
          In essence, the article

          And this "Belisarius" very deftly took away from the essence of the article, and all the comments around his splashes and tricks.
          By the way, about the essence - I saw the most interesting thing in the article even AT ALL not in the not yet accepted "Petrel", but about the weight characteristics and power of domestic nuclear warheads. Proceeding from this, it is obvious that the usual "Caliber" may well carry 400 kg of nuclear warheads with a capacity of ... those same 2 Mt. , missiles such as "Onyx" and "Zircon" nuclear warheads with a capacity of as much as 500 Kt. , and some ... X-35 what 200 ct. ... this is if to the maximum. And the times are now such that EVERYTHING needs to be done to the maximum.
          An analysis of the state of US air defense is very interesting ... they had it so-so in the last years of the Cold War, but now they have completely relaxed. However, they have a bet on fighter aircraft and AWACS.
          But for us, in the light of the current one, it would not hurt to dramatically increase the number and range of carriers of CD and GZUR. And mainly - sea-based. And if with the construction of frigates pr. 22350 and 22350M it entirely depends on the rhythm of the supply of power plants, then here is the possibility of continuing the construction of the Borey submarine in the Borey-K version with KR and GZUR in launch cups (5 GZUR or Caliber-M, or 7 CR "Caliber" in each glass) cannot be neglected in any way. Each "Borey-K" will be able to carry only in 16 launch cups 80 "Zircons" or "Caliber-M" (4000 - 4500 km.) Or 112 "Caliber". Plus up to 12 - 20 "Caliber" to launch through TA. Just calculate how much joy such a handsome man (Borey-K) can bring to the enemy's land / continent if each missile is equipped to the maximum. bully It will be just some kind of holiday - the Holiday of Heat and Light. fellow
          At the same time, such a Borey-K will cost (without missiles) no more (or even less, with serial construction) than ... a light frigate (!) Project 22350. Yes And so many fellow joy for such "ridiculous" money.
          And since such a luxury will cost ... little, then it is necessary and possible to build such SSGNs - A LOT. Therefore, they must be built at least 12 pieces. - 6 pcs. on the Northern Fleet and Pacific Fleet. So that at the same time there were from 2 to 4 such beauties at the database and launch distance across the USA. This greatly compensates us for the small number of ocean-class surface ships capable of being on duty in the North Atlantic and the North Pacific. And if Yaseni-M joins such duties (they can carry 2 - 2,5 times less, even though they themselves are 2+ times more expensive than Borea), then from each coast of the United States they will have 2 - 3 strike submarine nuclear cruisers capable of carrying out and glazing both of their coasts. Yes From a dagger distance and without using the strategic nuclear forces of the RF Armed Forces.
          And such a prospect is already much more interesting than the nuclear-powered Burevestnik. Although ... if it is based in the Far North or even on Novaya Zemlya, then ... why not. feel The main thing is the nuclear warhead for the entire spectrum of their carriers, because their weight dances from 100 kg. ... And even a special modification of the media is not required, only a special version of the software.
          Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
          The Yankees are in a deep hollow both in terms of hypersound and in terms of KR Str.D with POISON ...
          AHA.

          I don’t think that they somehow suffer especially from the fact that they don’t have this ... but from what we have ... it will definitely strain. And they should not be included in any START. Yes, and it's time to lower this agreement into the scrap. And build up your strategic nuclear forces for a guaranteed sufficient level. At least one and a half times. And do it (US) smile very simple too. Just add an additional number of soil complexes to the Strategic Missile Forces, fill all the remaining silos and ... DO NOT WRITE OFF those five Dolphins from the Sineva and Liner SLBMs, but simply withdraw them to separate bays as stationary launch systems with power supply from the coast. wink And this is neither more nor less than 80 additional intercontinental-range SLBMs (11 km) on alert.
          On PERMANENT (!) Combat duty. bully
          And we will consider this increase as compensation for the nuclear potentials of England and France.
          The Boreev-A bookmark program is coming to an end (no more than 12 are planned), so it's time to prepare bookmarks for SSGNs based on them. We will assume that they will replace the "Batons".
          hi
          And "Belisaria" and Co. it's better to just ignore it.
          1. -3
            19 February 2023 02: 22
            Hello colleague! drinks

            Quote: bayard
            But for us, in the light of the current one, it would not hurt to dramatically increase the number and range of carriers of CD and GZUR. And mainly - sea-based.

            About to increase - I agree. About sea basing is a difficult question.
            From conversations with high-ranking generals, I concluded for myself that the Burevestnik completely replaced the BZHRK.
            Its range allows you to place it anywhere in our large country. Beyond the Urals. Which makes their missile defense system useless. At the moment when they almost realized the concept of a disarming strike.
            Tracking the SSGN is not a problem. At least 10, at least 20.
            We can't build more.

            Quote: bayard
            And "Belisaria" and Co. it's better to just ignore it.

            The client's assertion that the Armed Forces of Ukraine had only 10 S-300 divisions at the beginning of the SVO, everything speaks of him. hi
            1. -1
              19 February 2023 05: 35
              The client's statement that the Armed Forces of Ukraine had only 10 S-300 divisions at the beginning of the SVO, everything speaks of him
              And here the main thing is not the reliability or accuracy of the information, but a banal attack on the fan.
            2. -1
              19 February 2023 05: 57
              Good day! drinks
              Well, since the generals are talking about the "Petrel" seriously, it means that it is still close to implementation. Warhead in 2 Mt. , this is very authoritative and reasoned, but it will be necessary to QUANTITY and ... the factor of time / delivery time - from start to finish. She will fly for a long time.
              Quote: Alex777
              About sea basing is a difficult question.

              Now, with any basing, a difficult question is - with such reconnaissance means, from satellites to undercover. But then I propose to use the SSGN data as a reinforcement and as part of the KUG of surface ships - as it was even under Gorshkov, when at least one SSGN accompanied the smallest KUG. Therefore, reconnaissance and control of the air and surface situation was carried out by surface ships, and the submarine / SSGN from under the water strengthened the anti-submarine defense of the formation and was ready to launch a salvo at enemy ships or coastal targets at the target designation of the surface forces.
              Now the times have changed, but the principle is still working - the SSGN strengthens the KUG with strike weapons and anti-submarine control, and the surface forces, in case of danger from the air, will provide air defense while the SSGN fires off its ammunition. Well, they shoot themselves. After all, they are required to be on duty at a distance of effective launch.
              For submarines, the biggest threat is submarine aircraft. And they are good with the enemy ... But when serving as part of the KUG, these aircraft will not be able to get closer. Especially in a war and threatened period.
              Quote: Alex777
              At least 10, at least 20.
              We can't build more.

              I think that 12 SSGNs for two fleets will be optimal (there will be a dozen more Ashes for them). And as for the expediency ... One such SSGN carries a strike arsenal higher than the atomic modernized "Admiral Nakhimov": against its 80 cells (in which you will have to cram 8 to 16 PLURs), the SSGN has, in addition to 80 "Zircons" or 112 "Caliber" can also be launched through TA from 12 to 20 KR ... though some of them will be PLUR or anti-ship missiles with a supersonic part ... But the composition of torpedo ammunition racks can be varied depending on the tasks. And such an arsenal carrier, larger than that of the Nakhimov, costs (without missiles) 4 (!) times less.
              With a larger arsenal.
              And if the KUG will include ... a pair of frigates pr. 22350.1 (32 cells each)? smile Or as many as three? bully
              So, if the composition of the KUG will be from three frigates 22350.1 + one SSGN, then at the PRICE as one modernized "Nakhimov" their strike potential will be:
              - (in Caliber) 112 + 12 (take the average) + 3 x 32 = 124 + 96 = 220 !!!
              - in "Zircons" (it will be somewhat more modest) 80 + 3 x 24 (we will reserve 8 cells for PLUR) = 80 + 72 = 152 "Zircon" + PLUR and anti-ship missiles.
              And this is all against 64 (MAXIMUM!) "Zircons" (or "Caliber") on the "Nakhimov" ... for the same money.
              Even a third-grader can calculate the level of economic effect. You can even include in the list of tasks in textbooks. bully
              Do you feel the effect and expediency?
              Moreover, the frigates are already being built, and by the time the last SSGN is built (the first half of the next decade), if we have so much time and we don’t exchange for a lot this summer, the SSGN will already have the same KUG that it will strengthen. .. By that time, aircraft carriers can also be built. If you do not steal, but do the deed and be responsible for what you have done.

              And now Russia only ... how is it in the cinema (?) ... "Back to the Future" - in the Superpowers.
              Otherwise, we won't survive.
              And they will have to return their territorial forms and completeness, and acquire new allies, and form and PROTECT their own sales markets.
              This means that the Fleet will be needed.
              Without it, there is no trade, no projection of one's own strength and intentions to protect allies. The blessed Cold War must return.
              But first you need to win on the battlefield.
              Exactly, on the battlefield.
              For we have been challenged, they seek to impose defeat on us, therefore WE must inflict defeat.
              But our Kremlin is so ... "mysterious" ... and ambiguous ... like Tsar Nikola-2 ... and such behavior is fraught. Nikola should have listened to the General Staff then, and not .... And now we have the General Staff ... just as mysterious ...
              And we need certainty and unambiguity.
              1. +3
                19 February 2023 16: 04
                Quote: bayard
                I think that 12 SSGNs for two fleets will be optimal (there will be a dozen more "Ash trees" for them)

                Even the States, with their budget, allowed themselves only 4 SSGNs based on Ohio. 154 CR is very expensive.
                And their destroyers, coming from the database, unload the BC so that another ship can use it ...

                Quote: bayard
                And such an arsenal carrier, larger than that of the Nakhimov, costs (without missiles) 4 (!) times less.
                With a larger arsenal.

                Comparing Nakhimov with SSGN is incorrect.
                The SSGN will definitely accompany him. Perhaps not alone.
                So the number of CR on the cruiser is not important.
                But his air defense / missile defense will have no analogues in our fleet.

                Quote: bayard
                But our Kremlin is so ... "mysterious"

                Looking forward to the 21st. Let's see how everything will be.
                1. -1
                  20 February 2023 19: 51
                  Quote: Alex777
                  Even the States, with their budget, allowed themselves only 4 SSGNs based on Ohio. 154 CR is very expensive.

                  For the United States, at those (!) prices, the cost of the Ohio under SLBMs was approximately $2 billion. , and taking into account their conversion into CD carriers (namely, they were converted, albeit during completion), all 2,5 billion dollars. in THAT prices ... About today's prices for such they have, it’s even scary to imagine.
                  Ours is different.
                  Our first "Boreas" cost 550 million dollars. , and the latter did - 450 million dollars. Therefore, even taking into account its modification in the SSGN, its price will in no way be higher than 550 million dollars. ... or even 500 million dollars.
                  Everything is very interesting in the cost of the CD for them and for us too. Their Tomahawk costs from 2 to 2,5 million dollars. , we have "Caliber" ... 400 - 450 thousand dollars. And taking into account the mass character of its current production, it may be cheaper than 400 thousand rubles.
                  That is, at the end of the 80s - the beginning of the 90s, their "Ohio" with the Kyrgyz Republic cost almost half the aircraft carrier "Nimitz" (5 billion dollars), and today it costs us less than the LIGHT frigate pr. 22350 . wink The cost of CD is also 5-6 times cheaper. And most importantly, we produce an order of magnitude more of these CDs than in the USA. And this is our advantage.
                  And the advantage, especially in war, must be used and realized to the maximum.
                  Quote: Alex777
                  And their destroyers, coming from the database, unload the BC so that another ship can use it ...

                  Well, they do not have enough budget for all ambitions. request Neither for timely repairs, nor for the renewal of the fleet of ships ... Hegemony, it is such an invoice.
                  Quote: Alex777
                  Comparing Nakhimov with SSGN is incorrect.
                  The SSGN will definitely accompany him. Perhaps not alone.
                  So the number of CR on the cruiser is not important.
                  But his air defense / missile defense will have no analogues in our fleet.

                  That's for sure . I actually made a comparison for clarity. We will not see such ships of the Nakhimov class for a long time in the Navy, but we can build SSGNs quite cheaply (in the truest sense of the word). And even as part of a KUG with a pair of LIGHT frigates 22350.1, these SSGNs will be able to MULTIPLY increase their strike power. And to save CR for our ships ... lol in the light of their current consumption and infinity in the NWO, and it is a sin to remember. stop This is definitely not our method.
                  Quote: Alex777
                  Looking forward to the 21st. Let's see how everything will be.

                  We will see ...
                  I thought it wouldn’t happen to watch it live - again, due to the shelling, the Internet is broken in our country ... but they already did it.
                  hi
        3. +2
          19 February 2023 18: 42
          the real anti-statist is you. thanks to turbopatriots like you, this government will never change, it will never punish a single official or general, it will never work on mistakes in its own, it will never appoint specialists to leading positions. because she has a turbo electorate that will protect her. and she will continue to urinate in the face of the people, not noticing that under their leadership the boat is sinking.
      3. 0
        18 February 2023 13: 22
        Quote: Krasnoyarsk
        Quote: Belisarius

        Lord, what are the "Petrels"? Yes. give the army an elementary connection, give at least some ammunition, 122 has long been at zero, 152 is with a gulkin nose. We already have D-1s at the front, and some have "Petrels" in their heads .....

        Wow, that's how ... It turns out that "Petrel" is to blame for the fact that "122 has long been zero, 152 - with a gulkin's nose. I didn't know. Thanks Belisarius, I opened my eyes. Ask your wife, and she will confirm that she is able to cook You SIMULTANEOUSLY and the first, and the second, and the third for lunch. hi

        They are such good wives, mine will also make a salad for three courses and a Napoleon cake at the same time. If it’s a holiday or a birthday, then it’s better not to go into the kitchen. laughing
        1. +1
          19 February 2023 19: 14
          [quote = Ulan.1812] [quote = Krasnoyarsk] [quote = Belisarius]
          _----------------
          .... Ask your spouse, and she will confirm that she is able to cook you SIMULTANEOUSLY and the first, second, and third for lunch. hi[/ Quote]
          They are such good wives, mine will also make a salad for three courses and a Napoleon cake at the same time. If it’s a holiday or a birthday, then it’s better not to go into the kitchen. laughing[/ Quote]
          Minusator, do you have a bad wife? I sympathize and do not need to envy those who are lucky with their wife. laughing
    4. +5
      18 February 2023 14: 40
      The funny thing is that making such a CD on an existing base is not a problem.
      We take the Kh-101(2) with its 5000+ km range, hang the PTB and calmly increase the range to 10+ km. With an accelerator, you can launch from a ground launcher.
      True, this does not make much sense, like the Petrel. However, it is not as harmful to us as this projector.
      In the USSR, by the way, there was a similar project. True, there were fewer enemies in power than now and they understood that ICBMs are many times more effective than all these projects.
      1. +6
        19 February 2023 06: 18
        Quote from cold wind
        In the USSR, by the way, there was a similar project. True, there were fewer enemies in power than now and they understood that ICBMs are many times more effective than all these projects.

        "Storm" was developed when the USSR did not yet have ICBMs. And it was not clear when they would appear and how they would show themselves.
        And the USA had a similar project.
        But the ICBMs turned out to be faster, cheaper, easier to prepare for launch, more reliable and ... more accurate.
        Therefore, with the advent of the R-7, the Storm project was closed.
        And with the "Petrel" ... a really ambiguous project.
        Like Poseidon.
        But damn, both are terrible. Really scary.
        And the enemy should be really scared.
        And both of them are not included in the list of START restrictions.
        That is, we can build and adopt them ... but the Americans simply cannot.
    5. +2
      19 February 2023 07: 37
      Well done Author!
      I subscribe to your every word.
      YES! "Petrel" must be done (the day before yesterday).
      But, in our SVO (Strange military operation) the government collects loot from the population with SMS messages. It is correct: Aligarhs cannot be offended.
      Russian Finance Minister Anton Siluanov stunned....
      Of particular interest is the enigmatic phrase of the minister:
      “I know that there is never a lot of money, and, of course, there are always more offers to spend than there are resources, but we have a lot of money ...”.
      Wow, where is our money????
    6. The comment was deleted.
    7. 0
      April 3 2023 09: 40
      Well, let's throw out the entire nuclear arsenal and rivet radio stations
    8. 0
      April 15 2023 11: 01
      What does "already D1" mean?! D-1 is still quite a normal weapon, and eats old ammunition like crazy
    9. -1
      April 26 2023 14: 54
      Since CIPSO does not like it, then we are doing everything right.
  2. +7
    18 February 2023 04: 26
    Something thought that the PuVRD, due to its cheapness, is perfect for a bait target, in order to deplete the enemy’s air defense, as well as intimidate and divert the attention of the infantry. Because it roars terribly! (as a child I heard at the performance of aircraft modellers).
    1. -6
      18 February 2023 06: 45
      What was called the "Petrel" "is successfully lying around in debris at the bottom of the Nenox Bay, while threatening its testers. Nobody even saw the Poseidon in reality and its" supercharacteristics "are not confirmed - everything is within the framework of speculation. In addition, as one wrote here a smart person a couple of years ago, the fascination with "wunderwaffles" went to the detriment of classical weapons, to the detriment of equipping and modernizing conventional weapons and equipping the army. And he turned out to be right. Now I look again they began to talk about "wunderwaffles" like - here he is an ace up his sleeve! Only something tells me that in fact there is no "ace" ....
      1. +4
        18 February 2023 12: 26
        Quote: Monster_Fat
        Only something tells me that in fact there is no "ace" ....

        And if it turns out that he IS!? What then do you order the Yankees to do? Again recalculate the combat potentials of the parties and the probability of defeat ??? And what should the public answer to "uncomfortable" questions? And ahead are elections, access to the budget, the opportunity to make super profits on fat military orders ...
        Say what you like, but they really need such an ACE ... Otherwise, you can get to disarmament ...
        AHA.
        1. -4
          18 February 2023 13: 25
          Quote: BoA KAA
          Quote: Monster_Fat
          Only something tells me that in fact there is no "ace" ....

          And if it turns out that he IS!? What then do you order the Yankees to do? Again recalculate the combat potentials of the parties and the probability of defeat ??? And what should the public answer to "uncomfortable" questions? And ahead are elections, access to the budget, the opportunity to make super profits on fat military orders ...
          Say what you like, but they really need such an ACE ... Otherwise, you can get to disarmament ...
          AHA.

          Well, "Belgorod" did not go out to sea in vain.
          Look like "partners" Alarmed.
          1. -1
            19 February 2023 11: 19
            Quote: Ulan.1812
            Quote: BoA KAA
            Quote: Monster_Fat
            Only something tells me that in fact there is no "ace" ....

            And if it turns out that he IS!? What then do you order the Yankees to do? Again recalculate the combat potentials of the parties and the probability of defeat ??? And what should the public answer to "uncomfortable" questions? And ahead are elections, access to the budget, the opportunity to make super profits on fat military orders ...
            Say what you like, but they really need such an ACE ... Otherwise, you can get to disarmament ...
            AHA.

            Well, "Belgorod" did not go out to sea in vain.
            Look like "partners" Alarmed.

            I didn’t understand something, the invasion of the cissoshniks or someone’s conspiracy.
        2. -1
          7 December 2023 11: 18
          Well, you can talk any kind of crap to the public, no one is answerable to them for anything, and at most they themselves can bleat something.
      2. +6
        18 February 2023 13: 01
        But I, for example, remember the comments almost word for word with the tocsin rattled-WE DO NOT HAVE CALIBERS and cannot be .. WE DO NOT HAVE HYPERSOUND and cannot be and again the old old 14 years old manual for her.
      3. 0
        April 26 2023 14: 55
        The main thing is to believe in it and victory is not far off.
  3. +6
    18 February 2023 05: 47
    “Neither NATO AWACS nor AGS ground surveillance spotted this 15m drone during its 350 mile journey across multiple countries?! What would happen if it collapsed in the center of the city, killing dozens of people in the process?

    Nothing would have happened.
    The Croats would have wiped themselves out, as the Poles had wiped themselves out, in which the Ukrainian rocket killed two people.
  4. +1
    18 February 2023 06: 31
    The fate of the Burevestnik...

    You can organize the publication of articles:
    The fate of "Armata"
    The fate of the "Coalition-SV"
    The fate of PAK DA
    The fate of the Su-57
    The fate of the destroyer project 23560 - "Leader"
    The fate of "Peresvet"
    The fate of Russia is a continuation of the fate of the USSR ...
    Sorry! stop We will be led in the wilderness for 40 years, like Moses? Why in the desert? Yes, because there is no that binding idea, there are no spiritual bonds... Emptiness!
    There can be no common interests among the population of the country with its gorged leadership of millionaire officials ... This theory does not fit in with the concept of social equality ...
    1. The comment was deleted.
      1. +9
        18 February 2023 12: 55
        The avant-garde cannot be beaten. It was also a cartoon of 2018, but it is already in service.
      2. +2
        19 February 2023 05: 39
        The fate of "Armata"
        The fate of the "Coalition-SV"
        The fate of PAK DA
        The fate of the Su-57
        The fate of the destroyer project 23560 - "Leader"
        The fate of "Peresvet"
        The fate of Russia is a continuation of the fate of the USSR.
        I would send you a bag of acorns for diligence, but unfortunately everything is over, sorry (
    2. -1
      18 February 2023 08: 54
      We will be led through the desert for 40 years

      He watched the Vremya program, read Kommersant,
      He was horrified and said sadly:
      “You need to be led through the desert for another fifty years,
      Until everyone who voted dies.”


      recourse sad
      1. Aag
        0
        18 February 2023 11: 16
        Quote: paul3390
        We will be led through the desert for 40 years

        He watched the Vremya program, read Kommersant,
        He was horrified and said sadly:
        “You need to be led through the desert for another fifty years,
        Until everyone who voted dies.”


        recourse sad

        Timur Shaovich - strength! hi
        1. Aag
          +1
          18 February 2023 15: 12
          Quote: AAG
          Quote: paul3390
          We will be led through the desert for 40 years

          He watched the Vremya program, read Kommersant,
          He was horrified and said sadly:
          “You need to be led through the desert for another fifty years,
          Until everyone who voted dies.”


          recourse sad

          Timur Shaovich - strength! hi

          I beg your pardon, - Timur Sultanovich Shaov .... feel
        2. 0
          18 February 2023 19: 47
          Timur Shaovich - strength!

          Well, it's hard to argue with that...
          And what about the sovereign? Really
          Is he in captivity of beautiful dreams?
          Can't really see
          That all the swings were on fire?
          What the hell did the clear moon take away?
          "Quo vadis, Caesar?" - that's the question.

          The nobles crowd around him,
          Not that they love, but they are afraid.
          Everyone hurried to beat him with a brow,
          Until they got their foreheads stuffed.

          He stared into the bright distance,
          He stretched out his right hand like a wing,
          And heavy thoughts sadden
          His high forehead.

          Overseas brother scheming
          And also rattling armor.

          It's dark in Mikhailovsky Castle
          But the words are heard again:
          “With me, everything will be like with my grandmother ...”
    3. +13
      18 February 2023 12: 34
      Quote: ROSS 42
      There can be no common interests among the population of the country with its gorged leadership of millionaire officials ... This theory does not fit in with the concept of social equality ...

      Fair enough... But why in Sweden and Norway can combine the interests of the poor and the rich, but we in Russia - no? And the thing is that they have a NATIONAL (!) bourgeoisie and are not engaged in cannibalism of their compatriots. And we have ? She is at least "kart-speaking", but in fact - international! And they do not feel sorry for the natives. Worms do not care about the devoured organism! The main thing for them is to fill their belly ... And even to shake off the loot offshore ...
      BUT.
      1. +3
        18 February 2023 13: 30
        Quote: BoA KAA
        Quote: ROSS 42
        There can be no common interests among the population of the country with its gorged leadership of millionaire officials ... This theory does not fit in with the concept of social equality ...

        Fair enough... But why in Sweden and Norway can combine the interests of the poor and the rich, but we in Russia - no? And the thing is that they have a NATIONAL (!) bourgeoisie and are not engaged in cannibalism of their compatriots. And we have ? She is at least "kart-speaking", but in fact - international! And they do not feel sorry for the natives. Worms do not care about the devoured organism! The main thing for them is to fill their belly ... And even to shake off the loot offshore ...
        BUT.

        Well, when the murderer and thief Khodorkovsky said that for them Russia is just a "territory for hunting."
        That is for robbery.
      2. 0
        April 26 2023 14: 57
        I don't know anyone who is enthusiastic about Sweden. Nothing special can be there. Then they had low spending on the army. Now they will get worse.
  5. -8
    18 February 2023 06: 44
    In my opinion, the biggest problem of the rocket will be its disposal. Imagine, the crisis has reached its highest point, the Burevestniki are sent into the air, and then suddenly, as in 1962, there is a lights out.
    1. KCA
      +6
      18 February 2023 07: 19
      If you don’t have any ideas on how to use a miniature nuclear reactor, this does not mean that no one is developing ways to use it, not only as a CR engine
    2. +5
      18 February 2023 07: 41
      Quote: Just_Kvasha
      Imagine, the crisis has reached its highest point, the Burevestniki are sent into the air, and then suddenly, as in 1962, there is a lights out.

      Fuck rapu! Let it fly! Enough for our time! Yes
      1. -4
        18 February 2023 08: 14
        He-he-s. -------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------
    3. -3
      18 February 2023 12: 39
      Quote: Just_Kvasha
      the biggest problem of the rocket will be its disposal.

      No problem!!! UTILIZATION - only in a natural way: straight to the designated PURPOSE !!! And let the States rack their brains: how to collect the remains of their cities! am
    4. 0
      18 February 2023 16: 54
      Drown in the Pacific Ocean - that's all ........
    5. +3
      19 February 2023 06: 34
      Quote: Just_Kvasha
      Imagine, the crisis has reached its highest point, the Burevestniki are sent into the air, and then suddenly, as in 1962, there is a lights out.

      There will be no rebound - this is a second strike weapon.
      And even if it goes along with the first, then the ICBMs will fly earlier. And they definitely can't be returned.
    6. 0
      April 26 2023 14: 58
      Rejection is not provided. The doctor said to the morgue - that means to the morgue.
  6. -3
    18 February 2023 07: 13
    Russia should more often develop and implement means that would inspire "banal fear" in the collective West. For each of their sanctions and provocations, something new from military technologies based on domestic components. And right away in the series, and so as not to be a trifle, but essential. Let them wake up in a cold sweat from terrible dreams !!! Only fear can restrain the nonsense that comes into the heads of Russophobes.
    1. -5
      18 February 2023 12: 53
      brand new military technology based on domestic components.
      thanks, laughed
      1. 0
        18 February 2023 13: 51
        Laughing for no reason is a sign of fooling around.
        1. -1
          18 February 2023 19: 49
          Laughing for no reason is a sign of fooling around.


          He-he-s. -------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------


          Not without it...
  7. -1
    18 February 2023 07: 39
    There are legends in the West that a Russian nuclear-powered missile leaves a trail of plutonium powder behind it :)
    true or false, but the payload of such a device can only be nuclear, which seriously limits its use: the first to use such a weapon on American or Russian soil will become the ultimate suicide.
    1. +5
      18 February 2023 09: 28
      Quote from: zorglub bulgroz
      There are legends in the West that a Russian nuclear-powered missile leaves a trail of plutonium powder behind it.

      And when it flies, it yells - "Hiroshima, Hiroshima, Biden kaput!"
    2. 0
      April 26 2023 14: 59
      On the contrary, whoever applies first, he will survive.
  8. +6
    18 February 2023 08: 13
    Burevestnik" cannot be detected and intercepted after launch by modern radar and optoelectronic means of detection and target designation. Rocket 9M730 "Petrel", like a ghost, appears for a moment and disappears just as instantly. It can only be detected at the moment of launch, while the starting solid fuel booster is working for this time, no more than 3 seconds from specialized DSP-4 satellites.

    But, unlike ICBMs, they will immediately lose it.


    The only reliable way to detect the Burevestnik rocket is by its radioactive trace that it will leave on its way - the isotopes of iodine 131, ruthenium 103, cesium 134 and cesium 137, but it has a drawback - the detection of the rocket trace will occur on the third or fourth day, when radioactive elements reach the upper atmosphere

    And what about the "thermal trace" of the afftop? Which is detected, for example, from satellites ...!
    And what about detection using a space (satellite) radar from above? With the help of a "holographic" lidar? By air turbulence using lidar?
    1. 0
      18 February 2023 09: 05
      The problem is not to see the launch / flight of the CD, but to bring it down. And secondly, the imperceptible launch of strategic weapons is more bad than good. Stealth provokes the enemy to a preemptive strike.
      1. -1
        19 February 2023 18: 13
        That's when this Petrel will be put into service, when three or four hundred of them will be released, when starting positions, reserve positions and false positions will be created for them, then you can rejoice. Now don't say gop until you jump over.
    2. +9
      18 February 2023 11: 38
      And what do you want? "The author is not a reader, the author is a writer." If you already undertook to cite SLAM as an example without even bothering to read what it isrequest.
      In those distant times, many were blown away by the seemingly endless possibilities that had opened up. Here and space and the atom, peaceful and military, underground cities of a million people as a result of all these miracles. Hence the SLAM, which was just a cruise missile and was not at all. In the modern classification, it is rather a drone, an unmanned nuclear bomber. SeYA horror was supposed to carry several nuclear bombs and use them on targets on its trajectory according to a given program. But her mission did not end there. Continuing the flight, SLAM continued to inflict damage on the enemy, destroying objects and incapacitating the enemy’s manpower and civilian population with a sonic boom due to its supersonic speed at low altitude, as well as for centuries infecting the area along the flight with the products of its Direct-flow YAVRD. The return to their territory was not planned by itselflaughing.
      Either the authors of the project eventually got out of drug intoxication (you wouldn’t think of such a thing because of the “blue sadness”), or the humanism won among the Americans (at that time the battle for world peace, although it was on the rise, was still fresh in the memory of the events WWII), or the goals became achievable with the help of conventional weapons (and it was also said that no one wanted to test IT on their territory even in the desert, unlike some), but thank God the Horseman of the Apocalypse project was closed. hi
    3. 0
      18 February 2023 13: 16
      Quote: Nikolaevich I
      And what about the "thermal trace" of the afftop? Which is detected, for example, from satellites ...!

      Nikolaevich, hi
      Everything is correct. The heat engine can't. "traceless". But there are ways to reduce it, by mixing the flow of cold outside air and the exhaust trail ... You can "cover yourself" with clouds, walking at an altitude of 60-300m, etc. but it cannot be eliminated completely.
      Quote: Nikolaevich I
      And what about detection using a space (satellite) radar from above? With the help of a "holographic" lidar? By air turbulence using lidar?

      In theory, it is also possible ... but it is difficult. 9M730 will be used in "response" to the attack. And this means that the atmosphere will already be "outraged" by the presence of nuclear explosions and will be seriously "mixed". Therefore, it is not a fact that the measures taken by the Yankees will be effective. Then - the detachment of forces to intercept such an "air raider" will be colossal. After all, it is not known where he "emerges". Only object defense remains. And here - all the "charms" of reflection of NL EOS from different heights and directions!
      But for me, it's better than not. With the next START, there will be something to bargain about and something worth changing for a thread ...
      AHA.
      1. -3
        19 February 2023 16: 48
        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
        You can "cover yourself" with clouds, walking at an altitude of 60-300m, etc.

        Neither clouds, nor smoke, nor fog, nor rain, nor "disturbed atmosphere" (whatever that means) interfere with modern satellites with AFAR.
        1. +1
          19 February 2023 21: 42
          Seriously? Just hung up a satellite with AFAR and can you safely track all low-flying targets in contrast to the ground, the city? And really, why do we need Awaks, all sorts of AWACS then! Throw an idea to the military, otherwise they are stupid, they rush about with their A50-100-Tu214, it’s just business, stick the AFAR to the satellite and you’re done!
          1. -1
            23 February 2023 19: 50
            Well, like if we don’t know this, it doesn’t happen, right? So only a couple of countries have such satellites, because the technology is complex. With a resolution of 5 cm only in the United States. For example, pictures from them were provided as evidence at the trial of the downed Boeing in 2014. And the Russian military is still wearing a lot of things, having no modern alternatives. Like, in order for such satellites to appear in the Russian Federation, you just need to throw an idea, but to implement it once in a while? And what does AWACS have to do with it in general?
  9. +6
    18 February 2023 09: 21
    "Poseidon" cannot be intercepted or destroyed by modern means of destruction of the US Navy, "Petrel" cannot be detected and intercepted after launch by modern radar and optoelectronic means of detection and target designation.
    This is an overly optimistic statement.
  10. +2
    18 February 2023 09: 21
    Quote: Sergey Valov
    The problem is not to see the launch / flight of the CD, but to bring it down. And secondly, the imperceptible launch of strategic weapons is more bad than good. Stealth provokes the enemy to a preemptive strike.

    Yes, this is a problem ... To bring down what is not ... In my opinion, no one has succeeded so far ... In real life.
    Although ... cartoons have everything. Some draw a rocket, others draw how it is shot down. Parity)))
  11. +3
    18 February 2023 09: 24
    Funny article. We will defeat the pier with unparalleled products. It has long been discussed that in nuclear jet engines, the disadvantages overlap the pros. What does radioactive exhaust cost, and they are also prohibitively expensive, simpler and more reliable than conventional ICBMs.
    Poseidon is also stupid, it is doubtful that the autopilot will be able to "circle around the finger" the trained crews of Western submarines. One underwater explosion will not create a movement of masses of water for a tsunami.
    1. -3
      18 February 2023 13: 01
      And what kind of exhaust, how many curies are there? Yes, scatter along a route tens of kilometers long at a height of tens of kilometers. You can't even measure with scientific instruments.
      1. +4
        18 February 2023 15: 39
        Quote: stankow
        And what kind of exhaust, how many curies are there?

        5*10^(-9)- 1*10^(-7) кюри/литр
        Where liter = liter of air passed through the core
        Quote: stankow
        Yes, scatter along a route thousands of kilometers long at a height of ten kilometers

        according to the author, it flies at an altitude of 25-30 meters.
        they will not look for her on the trail, which will not go anywhere later and will show the starting point

        Air defense will graze this pepelats by IR signature
        1,5 MW of thermal power cannot be hidden anywhere.
        700 kW will be radiated (efficiency specification under 40-49%) with T under 700K
        and 700 kW will fly out with a jet with T pd \u1000d XNUMXK
        1. 0
          2 December 2023 22: 39
          Let them follow the heat signature, but the radioactive one cannot be seen remotely. Only if you fly after, try the laboratory. Science, not war in real time.
  12. +4
    18 February 2023 09: 43
    Considering that the once-promoted Burevesnik then completely disappeared from the PR field, and appeared only now, without any evidence of existence, then ....

    thing is strange. Maybe just a distraction..
  13. +2
    18 February 2023 10: 02
    Modern Russian thermonuclear munitions, created already in the 2000–2010s. – 100 kg small class (150–250 kt) and 200 kg medium class (500 kt), 400 kg high class (2 Mt) power, designed to meet modern requirements for increased safety at all stages of the life cycle,


    Many questions, but is there a "boy". The moratorium has been in effect for 30 years. It may be worth testing these warheads, otherwise it may turn out that they are cartoons or even more interesting, there is a Petrel but there is no load. I won't be surprised with our generals.
  14. +3
    18 February 2023 10: 48
    Quote: Belisarius
    what we remembered about the Petrels is symptomatic. The worse things get in the real world... the more often inside our propaganda will tell about how our Petrel flies

    Did I understand you correctly?
    Are you now talking about the fact that the article is custom-made?
  15. +2
    18 February 2023 13: 31
    There are a lot of questions here.
    1) Will we have funds for the manufacture of non-homeopathic quantities of "B"? This is still not a firecracker with gunpowder, inside there will be a sufficiently high-quality reactor (=$$$) and materials that can not die from such operating modes for at least 16 km. That is a long time. Problem 000 follows from this.

    2) Similar products combining a reactor and a ramjet cannot empirically be reliable at a high percentage.
    High speeds, low flight altitude, long-term flight in completely different conditions of humidity, temperature, composition and impurities in the air, in the actual conditions of air cooling of the entire circuit, cannot be a reliable solution. The conditions of internal heat transfer will change unpredictably * flight time. That is, the chances that the structure will successfully fly will decrease with the distance and the specifics of the route.
    Unlike air-launched missiles or ballistic missiles, where the engine runs for a limited time, the "B" system will work for the entire flight period, this is its main weakness.

    3) Thermal trace. It will be huge)) Although "Wiki" claims that "B" will be subsonic, it is worth imagining how much heat during 16-20 hours of flight (subsonic is <1 km / h at measured ranges of 000-12 thousand km) will pass through its bowels, gradually warming up the body, among other things. It does not matter what materials are chosen - either the rocket will be thoroughly heated up by the time it takes off, or there will be a sufficiently detectable exhaust.
    And here we come to possible detection options - the flight of such a large product can be detected by a variety of heat-detecting means, including space systems that record ballistic missile launches. And if, for example, now this may present some kind of problem, in the foreseeable future this is the most effective direction in the search for such objects, given their speed and specificity. Nobody canceled heat transfer, and heat exchange with the environment of such a scale cannot be hidden.

    4) The inevitable progress in the means of combating the CD. Now we are working on targets in Ukraine, often with CRs, and it is logical that after this conflict, the percentage of R&D aimed at combating missile defense against CRs of various types will increase. So the overall effectiveness of the CR as a type of weapon can fall unpredictably. The main means of survival of such missiles is a combination of stealth and inconvenience to shoot down. With progress in the field of UAVs and radar detection, with a decrease in the cost of "smart weapons" of anti-missiles, these advantages of the CD will be leveled.
    Modern developments on the so-called "atmospheric satellites" in general can in the future significantly increase 24/7 border control of UAVs, sharply increasing the situational awareness of a potential enemy.

    I summarize - as a bogey, the product is undoubtedly intriguing. As an effective weapon, it already causes skepticism.
  16. +1
    18 February 2023 13: 47
    Quote: malyvalv
    the more actively the West will demand surrender, payment of reparations and a tribunal over the authorities of the Russian Federation

    From whom to demand?

    overseas dreamers...
  17. 0
    18 February 2023 14: 06
    It is Poseidon and Burevestnik that are subjected to the greatest criticism in the Western press. The most effective of the recently created.


    And, you, are you suggesting that a billion people living in Europe and the USA oppose 140 million Russians with Kalashnikov assault rifles?
    History already justifies us, and does not wake up further condemnations that an enemy that was 10 times larger, both in numbers and in economy, was destroyed ...
    The enemy needs to be beaten now, and not to argue what is not and what is needed ... The enemy should not be given the opportunity to prepare, accumulate resources, mobilize and restructure.
    You need to hit now, and very hard ...
    Do not forget we are opposed by a billion, financially and technically superior to us ...
    History is on our side!
  18. +2
    18 February 2023 14: 27
    Quote: author
    and the inertia of the gas column in the long nozzle of the engine.

    recourse
    Inertia is the physical phenomenon of maintaining speed. body constant if no other bodies act on it or their action is compensated.
    The column is not a body, but other bodies act on it
    Quote: author
    The main difference between the Russian Burevestnik and the American SLAM is the equipment of its PuYAVRD, and not the direct-flow nuclear VFD, the presence of an air valve in the PuVRD,

    and Strategic Forecasting, Inc. ("Strategic Foresight") - known as Stratfor, believes that there

    About the electric motor that turns the turbine, this is the stupidity of the journalist, of course: a nuclear turbojet engine


    Quote: author
    Obviously, a rocket in the dimensions of the Basalt - Vulcan anti-ship missile, and directly asks for armament of cruisers "Marshal Ustinov" and "Varangian" in launch canisters SM-248. Preliminarily carry out the modernization of the cruisers, replacing the Osa-MA near-field air defense system with the Pantsir-M.

    Most likely, the main way of basing missiles will be - ground mobile PU.

    belay
    thought flow dualism
    SM-248 has never been a container. This is a launcher. Ammunition is not transported in it.
    "Volkan" P-1000 is loaded into the launcher SM-49

    that at 248, that at 49 I doubt that it is possible to charge a product with a nuclear energy source and store it for a long time and reliably
  19. VB
    -6
    18 February 2023 15: 25
    Call a spade a spade - a traitor and traitors in Moscow will never use anything and there is no need to talk about it.
    1. -3
      18 February 2023 18: 36
      The propulsion system can be created not only on the basis of heating the working fluid (air) in a constant volume, limited by the walls of the chamber, plus a valve, there may be a breakthrough in research with a thermionic reactor that generates a current that turns the electric motor and propeller, or "beta-voltaic element "based on a semiconductor diode, on the surface of which a layer of a radioactive isotope is deposited. also produces current.
  20. -1
    18 February 2023 18: 52
    "Zircon" due to the specifics of the laws of aerodynamic flight at hypersonic speeds is made of heat-resistant materials with a large number of fuselage elements and aerodynamic surfaces made of titanium and steel alloys, a design of straight lines and sharp corners.

    In general, a solid, huge “corner reflector”, according to the most conservative estimates, an RCS of about 15 m2, such an object, and even flying at an altitude of up to 30 km, will be detected by the E-3C at a distance of 500 to 600 km. The Zircon's only advantage is its speed, meaning it's easy to spot, but hard to shoot down.

    I read in articles that hypersonic missiles fly in a plasma cloud, which greatly reduces the EPR.
    1. 0
      18 February 2023 19: 10
      Quote: Lt. air force reserve
      yat in a plasma cloud, which greatly reduces the RCS.

      meteors and fireballs will not agree with this. Comets - confirm
  21. +3
    18 February 2023 22: 02
    In my opinion, Burevestnik and others like them will be relevant in the near future, look at the goal-setting of the West. Ukraine is only a detonator, a big drum is approaching, the West has bitten the bit and, breaking everything in its path, longs for the physical destruction of Russia. Therefore, the entire Soyuzmultfilm should take up combat duty as soon as possible, and these are not years but months. They hope that they would not change their minds. Another question is whether Ferrum in Faberge will be enough to reset Western civilization with cartoons, otherwise they will reset us.
  22. +3
    18 February 2023 22: 43
    The Belgorod submarine will not go far from the base and it is not a fact that the Poseidons will be able to be released on targets. At the entrance to the Kola Bay, there are several striped attack submarines on duty + personal satellites or a satellite with round-the-clock surveillance will be allocated for such a boat. So the boat will not cause big problems. Her exit to the sea will be under control. There are also a lot of questions about the Petrel, especially after the announced 70% of new weapons! When even the form of the required quantity was not found.
    1. +2
      19 February 2023 13: 05
      In a threatening period, Belgorod should already be at sea. Otherwise, yes, that's right, they just won't let you out.
      1. -4
        19 February 2023 18: 28
        Well, how many Poseidons does Belgorod carry? One? Well, what are we talking about? Everything, forgot, there is nothing to talk about.
        1. -1
          21 February 2023 00: 25
          One boat = 2 Poseidon. He's not really a kid...
        2. 0
          April 7 2023 21: 43
          It's good that you understand everything.
    2. 0
      April 7 2023 21: 57
      It's great that you understand everything!
      I also remember how everyone laughed at Putin when he talked about decision-making centers. With the latter, everything is entertaining and fun, there is a center, but without those who make decisions, it is useless. And so Putin waited for more decision-making people to gather in such a center and hit him with the "Dagger". Also an interesting point. I counted in the American transporter more than fifty boxes wrapped in a mattress with stars, and this has not yet been loaded, and this is not all in the frame. Easily, there will be a hundred, star-striped American scum ... But they missed the launch of attack submarines into the sea, pooped, slammed ... Are you sure of this? That all the American shit floating underwater near the borders of Russia is not under the gun?
      Russia has, in service, three types of hypersonic missiles, Avangard, Dagger, Zircon, and soon they promise Hermes ... In the United States there is not a single type of missile in service, NOT ONE. US science cannot provide the army with effective means of warfare? I did not confuse anything? No, I didn't. Probably, the United States has prepared surprises for the Russian Navy.
      Probably, Russia has prepared surprises for the United States.
  23. +1
    19 February 2023 00: 01
    Everything is great, a cool toy, but I can’t understand the range, is this the most defining property of the product? I myself am a retiree, so I understand something ((. I would really like to look into the eyes of the developer of the route map, if there are any? Inertial, astrocorrection, GLONAS, digital terrain, etc. How will the product circle around the North Pole, how to fly over the Pacific Ocean, then dodge over Mexico. Maybe the time of approach and accuracy are more important. We manage to shoot at 2000-300 km with carriers with an estimated range of an average of 400 km, and the bridges are all intact.
  24. 0
    19 February 2023 03: 34
    Both Burevestnik and Poseidon projects are of interest only from the point of view of experience in the development and use of compact nuclear reactors. By themselves, these projects in the original design as doomsday weapons are useless and harmful. I will not repeat in detail the shortcomings of these miracle weapons. Dear colleagues have already commented on this in detail. In short, I will say that the main drawback of these projects is a very long cycle and development budget with an unclear perspective. Plus, a very long and slow production cycle for at least some sufficient amount of these media. Instead of these wunder toys, several classic nuclear weapons carriers could be made, which would undoubtedly strengthen our strategic nuclear forces. And so, we have unclear prospects for the spent funds, time and resources. In the original plan, these types of weapons are not applicable due to their slowness. It takes tens of hours for a petrel to hit the enemy, and in the case of Poseidon, several days. By this time, the main hostilities with the use of strategic nuclear forces have already basically come to an end. Who will control these miracle rockets and torpedoes? Who will they hit? Will they hit what is already hit? These developments have no deterrent effect and military expediency.
    1. +1
      19 February 2023 09: 05
      The Petrel as Poseidon was announced at the same time, which suggests that both of them could be created on the basis of the same power plant, with some differences
      1. +1
        19 February 2023 18: 33
        About the Petrel as Poseidon was announced at one time,
        and it was the time before the presidential elections. In fact, these statements of his were intended for internal use - as election promises.
    2. 0
      April 4 2023 23: 44
      Quote from Alorg
      Both Burevestnik and Poseidon projects are of interest only from the point of view of experience in the development and use of compact nuclear reactors. By themselves, these projects in the original design as doomsday weapons are useless and harmful. I will not repeat in detail the shortcomings of these miracle weapons. Dear colleagues have already commented on this in detail. In short, I will say that the main drawback of these projects is a very long cycle and development budget with an unclear perspective. Plus, a very long and slow production cycle for at least some sufficient amount of these media. Instead of these wunder toys, several classic nuclear weapons carriers could be made, which would undoubtedly strengthen our strategic nuclear forces. And so, we have unclear prospects for the spent funds, time and resources. In the original plan, these types of weapons are not applicable due to their slowness. It takes tens of hours for a petrel to hit the enemy, and in the case of Poseidon, several days. By this time, the main hostilities with the use of strategic nuclear forces have already basically come to an end. Who will control these miracle rockets and torpedoes? Who will they hit? Will they hit what is already hit? These developments have no deterrent effect and military expediency.

      Poseidon is a weapon of a global simultaneous strike against enemy ship groups, coastal infrastructure and submarine missile carriers. They can start from any carrier to follow the target or lie down near the target in order to explode at the same time on a centralized command. Petrels are also preemptive strike weapons that can launch unnoticed by enemy air defense, approach targets at low altitude from an unexpected side almost simultaneously and hit them almost simultaneously. As much as we don’t like it, there are historical patterns in the development of human civilization - if weapons created, then it must certainly be applied and the winner will be the one who applies it first with the least damage to himself.
  25. +1
    19 February 2023 13: 00
    The main argument that the striped ones have is that they can deploy IRBMs along the western perimeter of our borders with a flight time to Moscow of less than 10 minutes. About St. Petersburg, Smolensk, Novgorod, Sevastopol, I generally keep quiet. Everything is very simple. In the north - Norway, in the north-west of the Balts and, it is possible, the rapidly degrading mind of the Finns. Poland in the west, Romania in the southwest, and in the south - on ships in the Northeast Mediterranean. All of the listed countries will agree to accept these missiles, because. they hate us to bits. We do not have such a symmetrical answer. From the word at all. As a way out, we can propose the transfer of some metropolitan functions inland. Ekaterinburg could be an ideal candidate. You won’t fly there very quickly, and you don’t need to transfer everything, but only part of the strategic military infrastructure. First of all, management. But this solution is also expensive and not fast. Obviously, the striped ones will say the following: what you were making up here, poseidons, petrels, and so on - turn off. Otherwise, along the entire western perimeter on your borders - our missile divisions. When the striped ones reach hypersound, and they reach out, the situation will become critical. At all. Thus, we do not have a wide choice. But curtailing the Burevestnik in exchange for the non-deployment of the INF is still more likely not an option. After a while, something else will happen, and they will still deploy with the IRM, and we will be without ingenious developments. So Yekaterinburg. Under these conditions, the most protected person in the country should no longer be the president or the minister of defense, but the elected one who, at the onset of the X hour, will have time to press the necessary response buttons of unacceptable damage in the middle of the country. And the striped must understand this for sure. Then maybe they won't. And we need to increase the power of nuclear weapons. First of all, thermonuclear. If 100 kt arrives in London, then 1/5 of the city, maximum, will be destroyed. And if 10 mgt, then alles.
    Goodbye Forever!
    1. 0
      19 February 2023 15: 59
      It's simple.

      Everything was just about 40 years ago. Now flying time plays a negative role. The decision to deliver a counterstrike in this case will no longer be made by a person. That is why CUBA is not suitable for us now either. Behind the puddle, they also know this very well and are not particularly in a hurry with these missiles, the price is too expensive in the event of a failure, and they won’t have time to carry their asses away.
      Already at that time, completely new missile defense systems were being developed. These are the Trust and Northern Lights projects. If earlier the elements of these systems were very bulky and energy-intensive, today it is possible to make them mobile. Well, now for the answer. If there are 40 pieces on each side of the mattress of uninhabited vehicles with the same medium-range missiles, the flight time will be about the same. Those ships. services, of course, will visit the "inhabitants of the sea coarse", but this will definitely not add a buzz to the mattress toppers. Well, here's what you can sum up - there would be traction in victory.
      1. +1
        21 February 2023 00: 30
        Well, I won’t downvote you, but I’ll say this: remember 4 am on 22.06.41/XNUMX/XNUMX. Whoever strikes first suddenly has the advantage.
  26. -2
    19 February 2023 14: 35
    https://www.gazeta.ru/army/2022/12/26/15999361.shtml, у янков слабая ПВО, только вот мячи залетают в наши ворота...
  27. The comment was deleted.
  28. +1
    19 February 2023 19: 16
    Despite the indignation of the majority from the "fascination" with such "wunderwaffles", it should be noted that there would not have been even half of modern weapons without such projects.
  29. -2
    19 February 2023 20: 20
    My opinion about the unlimited flight time of the Petrel is not worth talking about. Yes, it can be much larger than a conventional cruise missile. The first reason is that the electronics and mechanisms that control different rocket systems, like any other devices, can fail for no reason, such as a cell phone;). The second reason is the possible burnout of the heat-resistant partition between the reactor and the heating chamber of the air flow itself and providing the jet propulsion of the rocket. Practice shows that at critical temperatures any heat-resistant materials behave unstably.
    PS Any water heating boiler burns out sooner or later ..
  30. +2
    19 February 2023 21: 38
    I didn’t understand ... and where does the NATO classification come from ???
    I absolutely don’t give a fuck about STE NATO, and what it calls our weapons is even more fucked up to me.
    And when some journalists begin to call our weapons not ours, they want to throw a bucket of slop at such cretinoids.
  31. 0
    19 February 2023 21: 48
    All the advantages of a low-flying flight are blocked by the presence of people on the ground, who will stupidly see the Petrel with their eyes, and they will also post a video on the Internet, as we observe the Caliber flights in a cart. And if it is known where the KR flew, then it will not be difficult for a supersonic interceptor to intercept it. This is to talk "from the side of Mexico", half of Mexico will be showered by the States with photos and videos with this Petrel.
    1. 0
      20 February 2023 11: 46
      There will be no mass launches .... and they will fly over the Ocean and fly around air defense areas. 404 populated country and around and above a bunch of Avaks and ground-based radars and satellites.
  32. 0
    20 February 2023 11: 44
    Western experts unanimously claimed that this was fiction, "Putin's cartoons."

    Several times they analyzed the difficulty of creating such a taxiway ... with two circuits - heavy with one - strong radioactive contamination in the exhaust. And most importantly, unlike Poseidon, - a one-time use .... and when the attack is canceled - pollution of the fall area. And this at a huge cost. And despite the fact that all the same plus or minus can be solved using traditional CR with nuclear warheads and they can also be used with conventional warheads.
    And for nuclear submarines, what is the launch of a BR, what is such a CD ... from any patrol area.
    1. +1
      20 February 2023 12: 50
      The author writes about the alleged use of a PuYAVRD (pulsating nuclear air-jet engine) in the Burevestnik, for reference, even a conventional non-nuclear pulsating engine has a low specific impulse (the ratio of engine thrust to fuel and air mass consumption) and, as a result, the lowest efficiency (they still have very strong noise), and this despite the fact that the air is heated by burning fuel in it, and when the air is heated from cooling the reactor due to the thermal conductivity of its hot walls, this will further reduce the specific impulse and the power plant will turn out to be very difficult and dangerous to work. It is much easier and more efficient to use a steam turbine and turn the pusher screw with it, and you will need a steam condenser that will take up half the internal volume of the aircraft, but the specific impulse and efficiency as a whole will increase by an order of magnitude and you can get by with a small reactor
      1. 0
        20 February 2023 22: 07
        If we develop the topic of nuclear power plants, then it is more realistic with the Propeller
  33. 0
    April 4 2023 23: 28
    For some reason, our angry patriots are sure that the goal of the NMD is the defeat of Ukraine, although it is the Avatar of NATO, which will die within a few months after the power outage. The goal of the NWO is to defeat NATO, not to turn Ukraine into ruins. That is why no one is in a hurry to mobilize and intensify hostilities in the process of NMD. As far as I understand, real super efforts are being made in the field of strategic weapons. And we learn that everything is ready for a fatal blow from the harsh ultimatum rhetoric of the Russian leadership. How else to explain the ostentatious calmness of GDP? I can imagine how he wants to punch them all in the face. And you yourself put each mentally in his place. From what can a person who has been severely insulted be indicatively calm? Only in two cases - either he catches a convenient moment to kill the offender or he is an ordinary idiot. GDP somehow looks a little like an idiot. So, I hope we will soon understand how the Burevestnik is planned to be used and maybe even see how it works, unless of course the offender realizes his mistake and does not kneel in time. However, do not take these little man's fantasies seriously.
    1. 0
      11 February 2024 11: 31
      In general, everything is known about the purpose of the SVO and a lot is said and written. It's strange that you passed by this!
  34. 0
    April 7 2023 21: 40
    Why Chernobyl and not "Flying Fokushima"?
    According to superfood, by definition, the best American technology in the world, spent rods were stored in a pool ABOVE the reactor. And when the reactor exploded, and the 200-ton reactor lid flew 200 meters, scattering the spent rods from the pool above the reactor for kilometers around, the Japanese squealed in horror, made themselves long-forgotten hara-kiri, and stopped ALL AMERICAN-MADE REACTORS , on its territory, that is, EVERYTHING. But this is in Japan, this is American shit .... you can’t talk about it, it’s DIFFERENT ... We must remember the Russian reactor, which Gorbachev’s associates deliberately drove into an accident, after which NOT ONE SUCH REACTOR was stopped, not only in the USSR , but also in the world, because the composition of technical imperfections was not found. And in Japan, ALL reactors were stopped, because they, just like Fokushima, pose a threat to life. And in Europe, exactly the same, 500 power units, approximately, are waiting in the wings, but ... It's different there, there is no profit, there is pure American democracy. It's purely Marx's Capital.
  35. 0
    11 February 2024 11: 28
    At the beginning of October 2023, the President of the Russian Federation, speaking at the plenary session of the XNUMXth meeting of the Valdai International Discussion Club, said that the latest test of the Burevestnik, a global-range cruise missile with a nuclear installation and a nuclear propulsion system, was successful. The missile has not yet entered service, but most likely this is a matter of the near future.