Military Review

Fateful lessons of Budennovsk

92
В stories The new Russia has many tragic pages that still leave room for broad discussion and new assessments of government policy. One of these tragic milestones in the formation of a new Russian state is the Chechen war - the First Chechen war. Until now, no agency can say about the exact number of losses of the federal troops and civilians in the course of the bloody drama that broke out on the territory of the Chechen Republic.

At the same time, we must not forget that the Chechen campaign was not limited to the territory of Chechnya itself. Sometimes, peculiar resonant aftershocks of the Chechen tragedy were manifested in other Russian regions, attracting increased attention and forcing the Russian people to think about the sanity of the actions of the federal authorities and those people who in a number of foreign countries persistently called the motley mass of terrorists fighters for the freedom of the Chechen people.

One of the most horrific attacks of militants outside Chechnya during the first campaign can be called the tragedy that unfolded in the summer of 1995, in Budennovsk. More than 17 years have passed since then, but the feeling of shame for the actions of the then political leaders has not left to this day. That humiliation, which, in fact, all Russian people endured in June 1995, is difficult to forget, as well as difficult to give a sober assessment of this phenomenon.

Summer 1995 of the year. The war in the Chechen Republic against terrorism and extremism for the integrity of the Russian Federation entered a phase when Russian units managed to seize almost all key settlements of the Chechen territory, and the resistance of the militants at the same time began to resemble not active hostilities, but classical guerrilla warfare with attacks single groups. It seemed that the end of a bloody and highly controversial war was about to come, the militants would have to surrender weaponbut ...

This “but” was the actual failure of the Russian special services, as a result of which a terrorist group of up to two hundred militants (according to official data - 195) led by Shamil Basaev was deep in the rear of the Russian troops. Subsequently, Basayev himself said that a sortie to one of the Russian regions was discussed during his contacts with Aslan Maskhadov. Obviously, both Maskhadov and Basayev, and the then leader of Chechnya, Dzhokhar Dudayev, understood that it was pointless to continue an open war with the federal forces, and new ways of fighting should be sought. In particular, Dudayev, in one of his interviews with a sample of 1995, said that the war was shifting to another plane, and the Russian authorities and troops would still have to bitterly remember the decision to enter 1994 in December in Chechnya. Then these words of the odious leader of the Chechen separatists Moscow did not attach much importance, but, as it turned out after a few days, in vain ...

On the night of 14 June 1995, a convoy of trucks with militants disguised as Russian soldiers allegedly accompanying the bodies of the dead (“Cargo-200”) moved through the territory of the Republic of Dagestan to Stavropol. Unfortunately, there is no unequivocal information about why the convoy of vehicles in which armed extremists were completely teeth, for several hours unimpededly moved through the territory of the Russian regions, not encountering any barriers and without causing suspicion among servicemen at roadblocks .

On this point, one has to express either judgments or use words that Basayev himself uttered in his time. So, according to one of the judgments, the convoy was accompanied by a police car, in which there were several militants disguised as Russian law enforcement officers. Perhaps it was this fact that caused the convoy not to cause suspicion at the traffic police posts, especially since the militants had all the necessary documents in their hands about being in the Cargo-200 trucks. Where did these documents come from? - this is another question ...

According to Basayev, the convoy of vehicles moved to Budennovsk without hindrance, since in all posts they were banal Russian law enforcement officers. According to him, it was in Budennovsk that it happened that the money intended for bribes to servicemen and traffic police officers ran out. The leader of the militants said that in fact the target of the attack was not at all the Stavropol Cossack town of Budyonnovsk, but, no less than that, the capital of Russia. Basayev’s statements, which he managed to do to journalists during his raid, boiled down to the fact that the convoy with armed militants was moving in the direction of Mineralnye Vody airport, where the group was going to hijack a passenger plane and head to Moscow to strike at the center of Russia. In Budyonnovsk, they had to stop, allegedly for the reason that the local traffic cops demanded more money than the accomplices of Basayev could offer them.

However, indirectly Basayev's “version” of events by Basayev himself in one of his interviews at the time of being in the captured hospital of the city of Budennovsk is refuted. One of the journalists, referring to Basayev, is trying to find out from the leader of the terrorists how much ammunition remains at the disposal of the gangster group. Basayev replies that he has enough ammunition, and if they run out, he will buy them from Russian soldiers. If so, then it is unclear how the words “that there was not enough money to bribe the traffic police” with the words “if necessary, we will buy from the Russian military personnel. At least one of these statements is blatant bravado and lies.

According to the official data, the traffic police in Budennovsk stopped a suspicious convoy. When the very fighters who were in the accompanying convoy of KamAZ police Zhiguli came to the conversation and stated that the Gruza-200 was being transported, the policeman decided to check the information. At that moment, Basayev decided to act, and gave the order to destroy the policemen. After that, the convoy moved towards the building of the ROVD, where the battle began with the use of automatic weapons and grenade launchers. During the attack on the building of the police department of the city of Budennovsk, the terrorists killed people, as they say, indiscriminately: in addition to 13, civilians killed dead police officers in fatal injuries in the police building.

On the second floor, the police took up defensive positions, but the militants did not participate in the battle, which could lead to numerous casualties among members of gangs. As a result, the building was doused with gasoline and set on fire.

It is noteworthy that Basayev himself did not call the carnage in Budennovsk a terrorist act. According to him, it was one of the stages of the war with Russia for the independence of Chechnya. They say that federal troops allow themselves to be killed in the Chechen Republic, so why should he (Basayev) not strike back at Russia. Surprisingly, in 1995, such words of Basayev found numerous supporters far beyond the Chechen Republic. More and more apologists of the theory and practice of the struggle for independence were among European and American politicians who spoke out for the fact that the people of Ichkeria are fighting against an “aggressive and merciless enemy”. That is why the seizure of Budyonnovsk by many media outlets seemed to be "fair retribution" against Russia and the Russians.

After the shootings and arson in the ROVD building, the militants continued the total massacre on the streets of the city. The terrorists burst into buildings and killed people who came across their eyes in gunfire, while others, distraught with horror, were driven to one of the city squares - the square in front of the Budennovsk administration. The area was blocked by KamAZ trucks and a fuel truck that was threatened to be blown up in the event of an attack from the security forces.

While one group of militants intruding into the city was operating on the streets, in the administrative building, in banks, the House of Children's Art, another group seized the building of the Budyonnovskaya hospital. Hospital militants have chosen to take there their wounded. At that time, there were about 1100 people in the hospital, of whom about 650 were patients. In the hospital complex, the militants on foot drove away those who were taken hostage in the central square of the city. People who tried to resist the gang of Basayev were killed on the way to the city hospital. According to official figures, killed during the march, there were up to 100 people, but eyewitnesses say that there were a lot more killed.

A few hours later, the Basayev gang, taking hostage a total of about 1800 (according to other sources, twice as many) of the inhabitants of Budyonnovsk, took up defensive positions in the same ill-fated building of the city hospital. A few people, the leader of the terrorists, used as those who should have brought to the attention of the official authorities his demands. Basayev’s demands were as follows: an immediate cessation of hostilities on the territory of Chechnya, the withdrawal of Russian troops from the Chechen Republic, and a meeting of Russia's top leaders with Dzhokhar Dudayev at the UN mediating mission to endow Chechnya with the status of an independent state Russia. Later, Basayev added here the fourth demand for the payment of a huge contribution from Russia for the damage that the Russian army inflicted on Chechnya during the military campaign. At the same time, Basayev, who perfectly understood that his action without press coverage, could go unnoticed by the so-called world community, urgently requested that he be given the opportunity to hold a press conference. If journalists are not provided, Basayev promised to start a mass shooting of hostages.

While the Russian authorities were thinking about what to say to Basayev and his accomplices, the terrorists shot a few hostages in front of hundreds of people in a gesture of intimidation. Among them were Russian soldiers who were treated at the Budyonnovskaya hospital after participating in the Chechen campaign. Subsequently, the hospital staff stated that the nurses and doctors had to forge the personal data of patients in the cards so that the militants would not know about other employees of the Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of Internal Affairs who were in the wards of the hospital complex.

Fateful lessons of BudennovskBasayev was given the opportunity to meet with journalists, and, taking advantage of a unique opportunity, the fighter voiced his demands to the whole world. It was after this that many representatives of foreign political elites began to say that Basayev was not a terrorist, but a freedom fighter, a rebel and a real Chechen hero. The information campaign machine against Russia started spinning at inconceivable speed, giving rise to the opinion that Basaev was right. The correctness of the act - is the capture of pregnant women and children? The correctness of the act - is killing civilians? The correctness of the act - it is the burning of houses with people who are there? Or, perhaps, the correctness of the act is the use of several dozen accomplished drug addicts for murders, attacks and arsons, the existence of which Basayev himself and eyewitnesses to the tragedy spoke of in the detachment? Monstrous hypocrisy! The top of information propaganda, which literally trampled the prestige of the Russian Federation, which was already undermined by the war in Chechnya.

It should be noted that at the time of the tragic events in Budennovsk, Russian President Boris Yeltsin was in the Canadian Halifax at the meeting of the Big Seven (then Seven) and tried to convince foreign colleagues of the need to provide Russia with another loan in the amount of $ 10,2 billion. Personnel of how Yeltsin mentions what is happening in the Stavropol region, scattered around the world. Yeltsin is trying to show on himself those black armbands that were on the gangsters who captured Budyonnovsk, and at the same time, the barely hidden smile on the face of US President Bill Clinton is clearly visible. This attempt by Yeltsin, parodied by Basayev, would later be mocked by the militants themselves ...

At the same time, in Budennovsk, after a series of failed negotiations with the militants, an operation was launched to storm the building of the city hospital, to participate in which attract, including the fighters of the famous group A (Alpha), who by that time had the experience of taking well-fortified buildings captured by the enemy. However, there has never been a situation with such a large number of hostages ...

At this time, the residents of Budennovsk hold a spontaneous rally, in which the federal authorities are accused of utter helplessness and the inability to protect their people, who have been in the grip of insane militants for many hours.

The order to start the assault is given by the then leadership of the security agencies with the direct participation of Prime Minister Chernomyrdin, despite the fact that the commanders of special units warned of the inevitable loss of a large number of hostages in the event of an operation. In particular, in Moscow, information was discussed that as a result of the assault half of all hostages in the hospital complex could die, moreover, there would be great casualties among the special forces themselves. However, these figures decided to close their eyes, and the order was given.


But even the beginning of the assault was not a surprise for the militants. Employees of the Alpha and Vega groups report that information leaks could occur. The fact is that already on the approaches to the hospital building, the special forces met fire from the positions of the militants. The gunfire from automatic weapons, which did not subside for about 10 minutes, was struck up by the groups of “Vega” and “Alpha” that were not part of the plans. During the shootout, the militants who installed machine guns in the window openings directly on the hostages' shoulders managed to damage two Mi-20 helicopters. In the windows of the clinic militants put up women who were waving white sheets. Basayev later said that women took this step themselves ...


The assault was continued. During the 4 hours of assault actions, the Special Forces fighters managed to gain a foothold in the main building and capture several buildings of the hospital complex at once. At the same time, according to some information, about 30 hostages and three soldiers of a special-purpose squad died. Then something happened that is difficult to explain in human language: Special Forces soldiers received an order to retreat. The reasons for such an order were a large number of victims among the hostages, as well as a remark from Basayev about the readiness for negotiations ... Special forces soldiers were perplexed ... Amazing! But didn’t the special division commanders warned about a large number of victims during the discussion of the storming of the hospital, and didn’t Basayev’s talk about negotiations - this is not another attempt to impose his will on the authorities? ..

During the second visit of journalists to the hospital building, Basayev allowed the correspondents to "walk" around the clinic, gripped by the horror of people and littered with the corpses of hostages, demonstrating the "inhumanity of the Russian army." During conversations with journalists, the hostages, apparently under pressure from the militants, stated that they were being treated very well, but the federal troops were killing their own, and the war must be terminated without fail by fulfilling all the demands of Basayev.

Basayev, through journalists, demands to get in touch with the top leadership of Russia, and declares that he is ready for negotiations. Moscow is perhaps making the most controversial decision in all this tragic history - to make a real connection with the militants.
Frames with the phrase "Hello! Shamil Basayev? Hello! This is Chernomyrdin! ”Went around the entire planet and showed the world a contradictory picture.

Someone called Chernomyrdin a real hero who saves people (forgetting, by the way, who promoted the beginning of the bloody assault and its incompetent completion). Others called Prime Minister Chernomyrdin a man who puts Russia in a bad light, starting a conversation with terrorists. From this point on, others began to consider Viktor Chernomyrdin to be the most genuine state Judah, who sold dozens of ruined lives for giving the militants the opportunity to freely return to Chechnya.

After the negotiations of Basayev and Chernomyrdin, the first one received guarantees that a corridor to the Vedeno district of the Chechen Republic would be open for him. In the eyes of bewildered people, several Ikarus and a refrigerator for the bodies of the killed militants drove to the Budennovsk hospital. Basayev himself was stationed in Ikarus, his accomplices and dozens of hostages whom the terrorists promised to release in Chechnya. The convoy, accompanied by traffic police cars, departed towards the administrative border with the war-torn republic. Ichkeria’s flags were waving from the windows, the joyful faces of the militants, who were depicting the Victoria sign with their fingers, were visible outside the windows ...

No assault on the column was undertaken ... The militants quietly returned to where they had invaded Stavropol a few days ago in order to become true heroes in the very Ichkeria, whose recognition of independence was mentioned in their “Budyonnovsk” demands. This outing of Basayev, together with his virtually triumphant return home, cost Russia too much. In the course of a multi-day terrorist attack, the losses of only those killed amounted to 130 people - according to one data, and over two hundred - according to others. This is many times more than the losses of militants ... However, human losses were far from the only ones in the course of this terrorist action. The initiative was lost in the entire Chechen campaign. After the Basayev sally, the war in Chechnya again turned into a sharp confrontation with federal troops, and Basayev himself, reveling in his victory, declared that he was now ready to reach Moscow, even Vladivostok. And, as everyone knows, unfortunately, the terrorist plans in relation to Moscow came true: the bombings of houses on Kashirskoye Highway, Guryanov Street, the seizure of the theatrical center on Dubrovka, terrorist attacks in the subway. And there were also Kizlyar and Volgodonsk, Beslan and Nazran, Vladikavkaz and Botlikh.

As a result, it can be said that the price of contacts between the federal authorities and the militants is simply overwhelming. These are thousands of lives that cannot be returned by any publications and rethinking of the tragedy in Budyonnovsk. The missed opportunity to prevent an attack on Budyonnovsk and to break the backbone of terrorism has become a necessity for Russia to make new and new victims ...

PS 2002 year. At the trial on the case of the seizure of Budennovsk, one of the defendants (Isa Dukayev), who was in 1995 in the Basayev gang, said that television had not broadcast that part of Chernomyrdin’s conversation with the ringleader of terrorists, in which the Russian Prime Minister proposed Basayev money in order to leave Budyonnovsk. According to Dukayev, Basayev refused and declared his readiness to withdraw “for free” if he was given guarantees. Warranties have been provided ...

Neither confirm nor deny the words Dukayev failed. But if everything he said is true, then it is difficult to imagine greater baseness on the part of a government official ...

I want to believe that the fateful lessons of Budennovsk have been learned in full, and the black page of Russian history is finally turned over.

Materials used:
http://www.vestnikmostok.ru
http://newsruss.ru
http://www.kommersant.ru/doc/305693/print
Interview with Shamil Basayev, 1995 year
http://www.rusidea.org/?a=25061405
http://www.mk.ru
Author:
92 comments
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  1. mar.tira
    mar.tira 13 November 2012 09: 03
    +27
    How can one not recall Stalin with his solution to the Chechen question! At 24 hours .....! All under the comb, in freight cars and on Kolyma! That would once and forever knock out even thoughts of raids. And they seem now even proud of it!
    1. Alexander Romanov
      Alexander Romanov 13 November 2012 10: 47
      +14
      Quote: mar.tira
      How can one not recall Stalin with his solution to the Chechen question! At 24 o’clock ...

      Then we were ruled by other people who made decisions quickly and most importantly were not afraid to make them. Now in Kazan, columns with Al Qaeda flags are traveling and I have no confidence that this will not happen again. Our government, instead of sending everyone to Kolyma together with machines, tolerance. It is unfortunate that everyone understands what this may ultimately lead to.
      1. SenyaYa
        SenyaYa 13 November 2012 15: 05
        -12
        Would you live in '37, I would look at you, as Stalin sang laudatory romances)
        1. Rezun
          Rezun 13 November 2012 22: 53
          +1
          I would love to be there with you! And in eight years you can and vice versa. At the same time, I would see a young grandfather. But the main thing is to look at you ...
        2. mark021105
          mark021105 13 November 2012 23: 30
          +2
          SenyaYa,

          Why scare us? What has changed since then in this regard? As there were cops-chaos (NKVD-shniki), and now they are. Look, look at YouTube, how many mayhem are filmed in the video. ))) Especially about the traffic police ... So, as then, and now there are a bunch of freaks ...
      2. klimpopov
        klimpopov 13 November 2012 15: 56
        +6
        I didn’t even read further, something started, they traveled along the highway by bus, accompanied by the valiant traffic police, and no one could do anything to them (and this is not only in Budenovsk). And they were actually released from Budenovsk. It was calm in the Caucasus only from 43 to 57, my grandparents talked about how golden times at least here.
        1. mazdie
          mazdie 13 November 2012 20: 22
          +4
          They still drive around Moscow with Kalash in the back seat and nothing. Are we not paying too much for the "loyalty" of the Kadyrov clan?
          1. klimpopov
            klimpopov 14 November 2012 11: 52
            +2
            In these situations, one involuntarily thinks about Stalin’s policy in the North Caucasus, the only minus was he didn’t finish the job, didn’t consolidate the result, not only on the national question, that’s why it all fell apart so quickly ...
    2. Mikado
      Mikado 13 November 2012 11: 19
      +14
      "in 24 hours" - you are exaggerating or underestimating, the operation took 14 days, 18 soldiers of the Red Army were lost. Immediately I recall the rhyme from the times of the second Chechen "Putin is not Stalin, Rushailo (at that time the Minister of the Interior) is not Beria, so Ichkeria has been badly cleaned up"
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. sania1304
      sania1304 14 November 2012 14: 45
      0
      Yeah! What a ruler! Chechens to Kolyma, and buried his in the Solovetsky forests! In general, everything is correct. Such issues must be resolved sharply and radically!
  2. Sakhalininsk
    Sakhalininsk 13 November 2012 09: 16
    +20
    This episode clearly showed everyone that you can’t talk with bandits. Bandits must be killed; immediately on the spot, the conversation with the ghouls should be short and extremely cruel.
    1. Funker1981
      Funker1981 13 November 2012 12: 35
      +2
      Quote: Sakhalininets
      This episode clearly showed everyone that you can’t talk with bandits

      You can only about their unconditional surrender and lay down arms.
    2. Xtra1l
      Xtra1l 13 November 2012 13: 38
      +2
      They got rid of terrorism, got another problem (the impudent youngsters that they bring up) to them the state budget is the highest Russia get ready to spit on us
  3. Sarus
    Sarus 13 November 2012 09: 22
    +2
    In the 80s, no one would have done that .. It was possible in the beginning of 90 .. Especially if the government made concessions ...
    PS
    He was small at that time .. But it’s very scary how small children suffer for someone’s fanatical ideas ...
  4. JonnyT
    JonnyT 13 November 2012 09: 24
    +7
    We were then weak, or rather the tip of our West wanted to like everything, so they snotted. It was necessary to crush like cockroaches !!!! I hope our current leadership took into account the mistakes of the past and will not allow such fatal circumstances anymore !!!!
    1. Aventurinka
      Aventurinka 13 November 2012 10: 55
      +2
      Quote: JonnyT
      management took into account the mistakes of the past

      not taken into account ...
      1. strannik595
        strannik595 13 November 2012 13: 20
        +1
        on Dubrovka there were no negotiations with the authorities, only with singers from show business and an honored doctor
        1. Aventurinka
          Aventurinka 13 November 2012 16: 47
          +3
          strannik595, borisst64 this, of course, all yes .... Only this is all a consequence ... Clinical signs, so to speak ... But no one cures the disease itself ... They pump the "patient" with painkillers (on a ruble-dollar basis) ...
    2. borisst64
      borisst64 13 November 2012 13: 05
      +3
      Nevertheless, most of these "heroes" rot with bones in the ground. Including a ssykun with a submachine gun behind Basayev's back. I really hope for it.
  5. Enjoy
    Enjoy 13 November 2012 09: 48
    +5
    Phrase "Nothing is forgotten, nobody is forgotten." should relate not only to the exploits and heroes, but also to enemies and traitors.
    1. George
      George 13 November 2012 17: 31
      +1
      As Kenedy said, "Forgive your enemies, but do not forget their names." Although it is impossible to forgive such a thing. I watched a film in which Yeltsin showed complete helplessness. Here are these abreks and obsolete. They always respected only strength
  6. andrey9031
    andrey9031 13 November 2012 09: 49
    +13
    I took part in these events as part of the SOBR. There was no large column. Most of the militants were already in Budennovsk, next to which are Chechen villages and where militants rested and were treated. The weapons were stored in the basement of the infectious disease corps, which was reported to us by local doctors when we hoped for a shortage of ammunition from the militants. The entire population knew everything, but the FSB was supposedly not in the know
    1. Yarbay
      Yarbay 13 November 2012 12: 41
      +3
      Quote: andrey9031
      I took part in these events as part of the SOBR. There was no large column. Most of the militants were already in Budennovsk, next to which are Chechen villages and where militants rested and were treated. The weapons were stored in the basement of the infectious disease corps, which was reported to us by local doctors when we hoped for a shortage of ammunition from the militants. The entire population knew everything, but the FSB was supposedly not in the know

      I think this seems like the truth!
      1. dmb
        dmb 13 November 2012 16: 02
        +6
        This is nonsense. Trust Alibek. I was there too, and I know more of an ordinary SOBR fighter. However, I am not belittling his merits. But nonsense to collect an officer is unworthy. I have nothing to do with the FSB. This is me, so that there is no talk of protecting the honor of the uniform. But I would like to remind you of a group of villains who actively contributed to the transformation of murderers into "freedom fighters". Yes, yes, this is me about them, about our "conscience", about journalists. And not so much about foreign ones, but about “ours”. This is Mitkova, Sorokina and Masyuk and the like sang odes to the bandits and demanded humanism towards them. And now they are all in business, in power. Masyuk will even teach us in the Presidential Council how to live properly.
        1. George
          George 13 November 2012 17: 34
          0
          But aren't all officers in the SOBR? Well, in the sense of ordinary soldiers?
        2. Yarbay
          Yarbay 13 November 2012 18: 51
          +1
          Quote: dmb
          This is nonsense. Trust Alibek. I was there too, and I know more of an ordinary SOBR fighter. However, I am not belittling his merits. But nonsense to collect an officer is unworthy. I have nothing to do with the FSB. This is me, so that there is no talk of protecting the honor of the uniform. But I would like to remind you of a group of villains who actively contributed to the transformation of murderers into "freedom fighters". Yes, yes, this is me about them, about our "conscience", about journalists. And not so much about foreign ones, but about “ours”. This is Mitkova, Sorokina and Masyuk and the like sang odes to the bandits and demanded humanism towards them. And now they are all in business, in power. Masyuk will even teach us in the Presidential Council how to live properly.

          Hello dear Dmitry!
          I know who you are and about where you served and I believe you !!
          But in Andrei’s story I was attracted to what he wrote about the weapons depot in the basement of the hospital, I also heard about it at the time after the events !!
          By the way, as far as I remember, the armory was organized in advance at the school in Beslan!
          I'm not saying that the FSB knew!
          It just seems to me that the goal was precisely Budenovsk, and no other point, that is, I do not believe in fairy tales, that there was not enough money to Moscow!
          1. Ruslan67
            Ruslan67 13 November 2012 20: 41
            +4
            Hi Alibek! if we include elementary logic, it turns out that they definitely didn’t need Moscow - in the capital, with any mess, everything is different and the proximity of the authorities and power structures and resonance, and therefore the response, is simpler: until the authorities reach the headquarters and some interaction and management And as time goes on the media chokes, etc., and run to your mountains much closer and organize support on occasion, so the goal is precisely Budennovsk!
            1. Uncle
              Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 09
              +1
              Quote: Ruslan67
              if you enable elementary logic, it turns out that they definitely didn’t need Moscow
              What about the Nord-Ost?
              1. Alex 241
                Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 13
                +1
                And the explosions on Guryanovskaya and Kashirka, the first time I saw people sympathetically watching stray policemen, night patrolling the streets .............
              2. Ruslan67
                Ruslan67 14 November 2012 00: 44
                +3
                Actually, we are talking about a specific raid Then they did not need Moscow, but everything else was already being prepared precisely as terrorist attacks in the capital
  7. Fox
    Fox 13 November 2012 09: 52
    0
    I don’t remember the author of the book, but many episodes of the war were collected and analyzed there. Near the hospital there was a train with weapons and medicines, equipment, etc. attack aircraft at Basaev’s departure struck at obscure targets ... there was a planned betrayal.
  8. Lech e-mine
    Lech e-mine 13 November 2012 10: 29
    +12
    For me, this story and the tragedy and disgrace of Russia.
    A small handful of armed bastards dictated their terms to the whole STATE.
    The Kremlin leadership did not have the brains or the willpower to withstand the onslaught of the TERRORISTS.
    It is painful and insulting for the death of soldiers and officers as well as civilians killed in this massacre.
    I was particularly struck by how they met these scumbags in Ingushetia and Chechnya.
    I do not believe in the so-called friendship of peoples.
    1. Yarbay
      Yarbay 13 November 2012 11: 20
      -3
      Quote: Leha e-mine
      I was particularly struck by how they met these scumbags in Ingushetia and Chechnya.

      Then there were no wah-hobbits!
      Secondly, many lost their relatives, women, children as a result of the war!
      thirdly, for many it was the end of the war ..
      Quote: Leha e-mine
      I do not believe in the so-called friendship of peoples.

      Why??
      1. Lech e-mine
        Lech e-mine 13 November 2012 11: 33
        +5
        Maybe friendship between people is what I understand.
        Friendship of peoples MYTH invented by POPULISTS.
        Georgian soldiers, with a clear conscience, shot our peacekeepers — WHAT HERE CAN THE FRIENDSHIP OF PEOPLES BE.
        The fact that there were no VAKHABITS yet did not stop the scumbags from seizing hospitals with women and children.
        Many people in the Caucasus thought that BASAEV had won - THE WAY BACK, he pushed the peoples of the Caucasus into the abyss of war (naively believing that by force of arms and suppressing the will of people by fear, he would solve all his problems)
        History has shown - WHO MAKES A BET FOR WAR always loses in the end.
        1. Yarbay
          Yarbay 13 November 2012 12: 23
          -10
          Quote: Leha e-mine
          Maybe friendship between people is what I understand.

          If friendship is to seek benefits and want benefits only for oneself, it will not work out between people or between nations !!

          Quote: Leha e-mine
          Georgian soldiers, with a clear conscience, shot our peacekeepers — WHAT HERE CAN THE FRIENDSHIP OF PEOPLES BE.
          But was there FRIENDSHIP ?? Passing all kinds of weapons to the separatists, supporting them and giving them Russian partisans Dear Alexei, did you think there was friendship between you ?? And the Georgians did a lot of things, I agree!
          Quote: Leha e-mine
          The fact that there were no VAKHABITS yet did not stop the scumbags from seizing hospitals with women and children.

          So you also bombed their hospitals, at home with women and children !!
          Quote: Leha e-mine
          Many people in the Caucasus thought that BASAEV had won - THE WAY BACK, he pushed the peoples of the Caucasus into the abyss of war (naively believing that by force of arms and suppressing the will of people by fear, he would solve all his problems)

          Quote: Leha e-mine
          Many people in the Caucasus thought that BASAEV had won - THE WAY BACK, he pushed the peoples of the Caucasus into the abyss of war (naively believing that by force of arms and suppressing the will of people by fear, he would solve all his problems)
          I don’t think that many thought so!
          Many had a greater sense of satisfaction, victory or something!
          But starting the war, the Yeltsin clique probably thought so !!
          Quote: Leha e-mine
          History has shown - WHO MAKES A BET FOR WAR always loses in the end.
          So Russia made a bet on the war !! I believe that then Russia was not ready for war!
          In general, this is a controversial Question, dear, when there is no other way out and need to fight !!
          1. Lech e-mine
            Lech e-mine 13 November 2012 12: 42
            +10
            What kind of separatists?
            Ossetia and Abkhazia have never voluntarily been part of Georgia.
            And people received Russian passports in the hope that this would protect them from the Georgian artillery fire.
            Our pilots have never intentionally bombed HOSPITALS.

            If there is an anti-aircraft gun on the roof of the hospital, this is no longer a hospital but a military facility.
            The Yeltsin clique has done a lot of trouble. But do not blame everything on them.
            I REMEMBERLY REMEMBER that time - every day alarming reports of attacks on the RUSSIAN-POPULATION (KILLING, Looting, VIOLENCE - that’s what was in CHECHNYA (KILL THE RUSSIAN AND YOU ARE THIS CHEAT) here is their slogan for those years)

            And when I learned from refugees how Chechens CUT PERFECTLY HUNDREDS of hundreds of people just because they are Russians, excuse MY TOLERANCE FOR THESE SCATTERS ENDS)
            Tell dear Yarbay when your tribesmen are being killed, you too will defend yourself in all available ways.

            In no case do I want to blame the whole Chechen PEOPLE - just like in any nation there are scoundrels and scoundrels pushing people to commit crimes. And we all HAVE A LONGER TIME TO SHOULD THIS LIFE THAT ... ma (and Chechens and Russians)
            1. Yarbay
              Yarbay 13 November 2012 13: 04
              -11
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              Ossetia and Abkhazia have never voluntarily been part of Georgia.

              Dear Alexei, you honor the Russian historian Dubrovin about the territory of South Ossetia and how Ossetians appeared there at all !!
              Secondly, and that all the peoples of Russia entered voluntarily ??
              Why then do you not distribute Russian partisans to those nations in the CIS republics that were not part of those republics voluntarily ??
              Your arguments are not argued!
              Chechnya was part of Russia or Ingushetia voluntarily ??
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              And people received Russian passports in the hope that this would protect them from the Georgian artillery fire.

              Then there were no shelling !!
              And how did you protect yourself with passports from shelling ???))))))))) Passports were in the form of helmets?)))))
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              Our pilots have never intentionally bombed HOSPITALS.

              Alexey You are either not up to date or knowingly lying !!
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              If there is an anti-aircraft gun on the roof of the hospital, this is no longer a hospital but a military facility.
              I don’t agree! To protect the hospital, they may be forced to put an anti-aircraft gun there!
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              The Yeltsin clique has done a lot of trouble. But do not blame everything on them.

              And who to blame, who is to blame ?? didn’t Yeltsin’s entourage contribute to Dudaev’s coming to power ??
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              I REMEMBERLY REMEMBER that time - every day alarming reports of attacks on the RUSSIAN-POPULATION (KILLING, Looting, VIOLENCE - that’s what was in CHECHNYA (KILL THE RUSSIAN AND YOU ARE THIS CHEAT) here is their slogan for those years)

              I remember too !!
              You know, I talked a lot with the officers who entered the Bakuv together with the troops in 1990, they also told them to raise * spirit * that there are thousands of armed militants in Baku and they are killing hundreds of Russians!
              I remember how they were surprised afterwards when they found out that all that they had been told before departure was not !!
              Quote: Leha e-mine
              Tell dear Yarbay when your tribesmen are being killed, you too will defend yourself in all available ways.
              A respected massacre of my fellow tribesmen, they forced me to take up arms and become a military man!
              Understand correctly, I do not blame you, but I want you to think about others, what they felt, what they experienced!
              I do not condone the atrocities of the bandits !!
              But I think that it is impossible to put an equal sign between bandits and worthy people!
              And I remember at that time, according to the program, they showed one woman who told how she * miraculously * escaped from Baku, although I saw her leaving and holding a high post! A year later she returned and still works in the same post!
              You can minus me as much as you want, but I hope you will think about it!
              with respect!
              1. Lech e-mine
                Lech e-mine 13 November 2012 13: 22
                +9
                You yourself contradict dear Yarbay.
                AN Anti-aircraft guns on the roof of the hospital do not shoot fragrant flowers. Any airplane flying past can be shot down at the whim of the gunner (so it’s on their conscience)
                CHECHNYA HAS A CHANCE TO SEPARATE FROM RUSSIA AFTER THE HASAVYURT AGREEMENTS.
                How did the Chechens take advantage of this ????? Correctly, they went further and invaded DAGESTAN with their own orders - you see the WHOLE CAUCASUS wanted to see them in the Caliphate.
                The fact that ALCOHOLIC-YELTSIN handed over to DUDAEV weapons to several divisions is a crime for which he is already responsible to GOD.
                I’ll tell you about BAKU (you had a business trip in the Soviet Union) a beautiful city, friendly and nice people. And all this strife and feud went with Gorbachev (to succumb to him with English grants)
                Among the Chechens there are a lot of wise and respected PEOPLE, but for some reason Chechen youth prefers not to listen to them but to all the Saudi preachers there (with calls to cut off the head of the unfaithful, ALLAH said)
                Now, thank God, a bad world has come which is better than a good war. But in our cities, young guys from this republic still behave like in a PIG (I still hope that Kadyrov will be able to re-educate them, otherwise our people will do it)
                1. Yarbay
                  Yarbay 13 November 2012 13: 27
                  +1
                  Quote: Leha e-mine
                  AN Anti-aircraft guns on the roof of the hospital do not shoot fragrant flowers. Any airplane flying past can be shot down at the whim of the gunner (so it’s on their conscience)

                  I do not want you to think that I am on the side of the bandits, I would like you to carefully read me and, if possible, understand what I wanted and want to tell you!
                  Quote: Leha e-mine
                  CHECHNYA HAS A CHANCE TO SEPARATE FROM RUSSIA AFTER THE HASAVYURT AGREEMENTS.

                  I do not think so!
                  Gangster education cannot stand a chance!
                  1. Lech e-mine
                    Lech e-mine 13 November 2012 13: 43
                    +2
                    I perfectly understood you and in this case I agree with YOU.
                2. mar.tira
                  mar.tira 13 November 2012 13: 32
                  +2
                  Quote: Leha e-mine
                  Dear Yarbay.

                  Painfully, the speeches of this "respected" are similar to those of Maskhadov. He also justified this attack in the same way. He was not accidentally there among the defenders of "Independent Ichekria" But no, it’s hardly possible, the militants do not know how to express themselves so beautifully! But the fact that he greeted him is evident!
                3. Uncle
                  Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 15
                  +2
                  Quote: Leha e-mine
                  The fact that ALCOHOLIC-YELTSIN handed over to DUDAEV weapons to several divisions is a crime for which he is already responsible to GOD.

                  In general, he is responsible for the collapse of Russia, he will not get off with any construction of churches.
            2. Volozhanin
              Volozhanin 13 November 2012 13: 08
              +2
              telling the truth about Chechens means offending the whole nation. I don’t remember who, where and when said this phrase
        2. Uncle
          Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 13
          +2
          Quote: Leha e-mine
          History has shown - WHO MAKES A BET FOR WAR always loses in the end.

          Whoever comes to us with a sword will perish by the sword. St. Alexander Nevskiy.
          1. Alex 241
            Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 26
            0
            .......................
            1. Alex 241
              Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 33
              0
              Here is our sword.
              1. studentmati
                studentmati 13 November 2012 23: 40
                0
                Mark sharp and effective! But if I am not mistaken, the biggest losses in history were in Budenovsk. unfortunately.
                1. Alex 241
                  Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 47
                  0
                  Sasha, and during the seizure of the school in Beslan, at the Nikolo Arkhangelsk cemetery, a whole alley of these guys, it was impossible otherwise, in Budennovsk they worked on the move, but in Beslan you understand, there was no other way out.
                  1. Alex 241
                    Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 50
                    +3
                    as they say without comment ..........
                    1. Alex 241
                      Alex 241 14 November 2012 00: 06
                      +2
                      .......................
                      1. studentmati
                        studentmati 14 November 2012 00: 16
                        +1
                        Stand and win !!! I’m sure how heavy the losses would be! And our 1 year history will help in this !!!
                      2. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 14 November 2012 00: 19
                        +2
                        but in any other way ...............
                  2. studentmati
                    studentmati 13 November 2012 23: 51
                    +1
                    All this is very sad! I am sure that lessons have been learned and conclusions have been drawn! A typical example of Russian heroism !!! It is terrible that all this was happening and is happening not with an external enemy, but within the Russian state.
                    1. Alex 241
                      Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 57
                      0
                      Sasha mistakes some correct at the cost of the lives of others.
                      1. studentmati
                        studentmati 14 November 2012 00: 07
                        +1
                        "they correct some mistakes ...". So it was probably always ....? It's even more horrible when you have anything personal to do with it ...
                      2. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 14 November 2012 00: 09
                        0
                        It is necessary to break this vicious circle .............
                      3. studentmati
                        studentmati 14 November 2012 00: 21
                        +1
                        I think that breaking this vicious circle is possible when the former do not make mistakes, and if they do, they should not interfere with the actions of professionals trained to correct these fatal mistakes.
                      4. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 14 November 2012 00: 23
                        +1
                        Sasha agrees, when you need to work with a scalpel, do not wave a club.
                      5. His
                        His 16 November 2012 01: 40
                        0
                        I watched this movie to the end, from a series of Ati-Russian propaganda
                      6. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 16 November 2012 02: 11
                        0
                        It’s that they made a film at Discovery, according to Nord Ost, Politkovskaya, the reproachful truth-maker claimed that Alpha and Pennant, after the assault, looted ........ in their right mind it would occur to anyone ?????????? ????
    2. de_monSher
      de_monSher 13 November 2012 16: 02
      +1
      I do not believe in the so-called friendship of peoples.


      Where the loot begins ... the big loot, there ends not only "the so-called friendship of peoples", but even simple "humanity".

      Of course, you choose how to live and how you relate to "the so-called friendship of peoples", but, you see, the direct antonym of this phrase is "the so-called enmity of peoples" ... *)
    3. Uncle
      Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 11
      +2
      Quote: Leha e-mine
      I do not believe in the so-called friendship of peoples.

      In our suburbs in the 90s, Russians tortured and killed Russians no less than the Nazis did. Nationality is not the issue, or rather, not only in it.
  9. Cadets
    Cadets 13 November 2012 11: 09
    +7
    The main trouble is betrayal, thanks to which the thugs were able to carry out the so-called. "operation". It would be nice to recall the experience of the Israeli special services after the Munich Olympics, when, to the last bastard, militants who raised their hand against athletes were destroyed all over the world, regardless of any international reaction, to the last! And here in the Caucasus (after serving short terms, and more often amnestied by the Kadyrov regime) Basayev's thugs who participated in the massacre of women and children in Budenovsk, who consider themselves almost national heroes, are still alive and well. Terrorism must be burned out with a hot iron!
  10. Forest
    Forest 13 November 2012 11: 44
    +3
    After these events, an interesting article (about these events) was in the magazine "I have the honor". I remember 2 episodes. The first story of the old man how he went to the market with his 5-year-old granddaughter and at that moment these creatures appeared there, in front of the grandfather's eyes they shot the granddaughter and released the grandfather with the meaning: "Torment until the end of your life." And the second story is that the morgue did not hold all the killed and they were piled in the city bath. Although I remember on TV announced about 20 dead.
  11. hohryakov066
    hohryakov066 13 November 2012 13: 11
    +7
    Here is someone with big generalMarshall stars seem to be trying to justify the actions of Basayev and the company? Yarbay I am amazed! Killing children cannot be justified by anything! I remember these events very well and I remember very well how I had to catch my fighters and almost at the train station to catch and return home - who were eager for vacation, and who were so easy to get to the Caucasus! The country's leadership proved to be genuine bastards, but where are you going? There can be no excuses! None!
    1. Uncle
      Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 18
      +2
      Quote: hohryakov066
      The leadership of the country proved to be real bastards

      That's right.
  12. Yarbay
    Yarbay 13 November 2012 13: 18
    -2
    Quote: hohryakov066
    Is there someone with big General Marshal stars who seems to be trying to justify the actions of Basayev and the company? Yarbay I am amazed! Killing children cannot be justified by anything! I remember these events very well and I remember very well how I had to catch my fighters and almost at the train station to catch and return home - who were eager for vacation, and who were so easy to get to the Caucasus! The country's leadership proved to be genuine bastards, but where are you going? There can be no excuses! None!

    You are inattentive or reading or just do not know me!
    I just do not justify under any circumstances and did not justify the killing of women, or old people, or children !!
    Moreover, I condemn this, no matter who it is and what it does not justify !!
    Some here justify this with the fact that there was a war!
    1. mar.tira
      mar.tira 13 November 2012 13: 37
      0
      Well! So I'm not the only one who saw your attempts! Read on your praises!
    2. hohryakov066
      hohryakov066 13 November 2012 14: 52
      0
      Perhaps I did not understand correctly. In this case - sorry /, but dear Alibek - it seemed not to me alone - more carefully with expressions.
  13. Light source
    Light source 13 November 2012 13: 20
    +1
    the feeling of shame for the actions of the then political leaders does not leave to this day.

    Shame on politicians? Never!
    The humiliation that, in fact, the entire Russian people experienced in June 1995

    Actually anger.
  14. Xtra1l
    Xtra1l 13 November 2012 13: 46
    +1
    The video was completely watched by Chechens such pi ******
    1. Uncle
      Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 32
      +1
      And the last photo where Chernomyrdin speaks with Basayev under cameras! There are children hostage, and he glitters under flashes, PR, s-ka.
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 13 November 2012 23: 38
        0
        .............................. But I don’t think that it was a PR, at a difficult moment he assumed full responsibility, this also needs to be understood. with all due respect .......
  15. sergant89
    sergant89 13 November 2012 15: 45
    +13
    I’ll say what I saw in 1993-94, at that time (I lived in Dagestan) thousands of refugees, almost all Russians (100% Slavs), at best sold apartments and houses for a penny, I won’t speak at worst (about 30 thousand corpses found), when traveling by train past Chechnya, the conductors asked to close, the doors were wrapped with a rope, one hell they stopped and robbed, killed, raped and all this was not read, but it was seen personally while the authorities were silent about all this, I don’t want to say what was war time (had to participate), even now there are friends , colleagues who lived there at one time, I suggest they return there, now there is a restored European city, they return the worn-out housing and all that, they all turn their fingers at the temple and say I’m better here in Russia than in the mansions, and I don’t have the nationality (Russian) to live there, but our authorities can only speak obscenities, because she can forgive tens of billions half the world, and simply lose all those who lost everything because of her actions. SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUKI.
    1. Aventurinka
      Aventurinka 13 November 2012 16: 17
      +4
      Yeltsin’s crime is not in the fact that he sent troops into 1994, but that he did not do so in 1991.
      1. vardex
        vardex 13 November 2012 16: 36
        +2
        In general, shame on Russia and the then government, some kind of bandits imagined themselves-raids are arranged as during the OV the Germans SS men scared 150 people all over the country-GREAT RUSSIA-ashamed .......
      2. survivor
        survivor 13 November 2012 23: 24
        +1
        IN Grozny, they said, "YELTSYN INTRODUCED THE TROOPS INTO CHECHNIA NOT TO REMOVE RUSSIANS FROM CHECHNIA. TO ALL AND POSITION"
    2. vardex
      vardex 13 November 2012 16: 43
      +2
      And at the moment, RUSSIA pays Chechnya so that this bastard sat quietly in her new buildings and didn’t suffer from garbage-funny Russian people are crying out for peace in their country-
      1. vadimN
        vadimN 13 November 2012 17: 07
        +5
        This is called - to pay tribute. How many centuries ago the nomads were paid after the bloody raids on Russian lands, we still pay ....
        .. and the more we pay, the more they will despise and hate us. There is such a buzzword - mentality. so, they have it different. They understand only power and only rudeness. If they are polite, it is perceived as a weakness .... And there is no hesitation to breed Euro-liberal ravings about tolerance, friendship of peoples, etc. .... Only force can create the authority of Russia, both in relation to Caucasians and in relation to other countries. ..
    3. ikrut
      ikrut 14 November 2012 13: 36
      +2
      In those years, NONE of the trains passed through Chechnya so that they would not plunder it. Terrible violence and humiliation of the peaceful Russian population. This is not forgotten and remains at the genetic level. And all this MANDATORY recall. It is a pity that the responsibility for the past will not be for those who committed crimes. Well, that’s how the world works. In ancient times, wise ancestors simply destroyed the offenders at the root. Remember the Khazar Khaganate. And with us, too, did not stand on ceremony especially. Living in constant peace and harmony with others (and even with your own) is a huge work and a huge merit of the national elite. But you cannot forgive and let out either. Otherwise, the people will simply degenerate. In this world, the strongest people survive and with a better memory. Navsha history shows that we are not the very last on this planet. Therefore, you need to remember everything and save strength. Purely IMHO.
  16. George
    George 13 November 2012 17: 38
    +2
    As there they had, don’t buy from Sasha and Masha, everything will be ours.
  17. Comrade1945
    Comrade1945 13 November 2012 20: 15
    +2
    Geeks are bloody. I don’t even want to say anything.
    1. Rezun
      Rezun 13 November 2012 23: 08
      0
      And let's sayanyone with a gun, and not with shoulder straps, must be destroyed - for "one-two"!
  18. wolverine7778
    wolverine7778 13 November 2012 21: 10
    0
    Basayev’s end report began with one phone call when the 9.11 attacks occurred. in New Orc, Putin was the first to express condolences to Bush Jr. thereby received a large carte blanche for all actions in Chechnya)
  19. Uncle
    Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 04
    0
    Previously, the city bearing the name of the hero of the revolution was called the Holy Cross. I think that if the historic name were returned to the city, the Lord would not have allowed such a terrible tragedy. It’s kind of like an analogy with the name of the ship, as they call it, it will float.
  20. survivor
    survivor 13 November 2012 23: 15
    +7
    on the day when Basayev entered Budenovsk, I was selling the newspaper Groznensky Rabochiy on the Central Market. in Grozny. the newspaper was not old, yesterday's. it contained an article that Basayev's group left on horseback in the direction of Georgia. I am selling a newspaper, and nearby from the underground they are selling Dudayev's "Serdallo". and in it in huge letters on the whole page that Basayev, in order to end the war, made a campaign against Moscow, but did not get to Moscow and settled in Budenovsk ...
    how on the streets of the wounded city they perceived HERE SO news given? I think there is no need to explain.
    about hospitals ... lived next to 2 city hospital. I remember the terrible rumors about what was going on there. I remember how Russians were killed in Grozny. I myself helped the families of classmates to leave. And many Chechens and Ingush helped! I remember how the troops entered. how many peaceful people were simply killed. himself, a bespectacled student, stayed in the city in order to preserve the impoverished "wealth" that my family had left. during the war he was wounded and concussed. was shot three times. I also remember how it all began. how the troops left and left the warehouses with weapons. how people robbed these warehouses. I remember how for three years they did not give out either salaries or pensions, actually stimulating crime and lawlessness! I also remember trains with oil that went to Chechnya every single day (Grozny factories refined it and traded it free of charge.)
    it’s easy to say that Chechens and Ingush are bandits. They don’t know how to work, only to rob and kill! however, as it is forgotten the fact that for 93 years, Ingushetia, which is part of P, F, had 90% of unemployment. that after the near oil ran out in Malgobek, there was no work. my relatives went to build nightmares in the Stavropol Territory, Kalmykia, Krasnodar Territory. I myself hired for cleaning in the Stavropol Territory.
    it’s very easy to resent about it and without it, but I want to ask you, and did anyone try to understand why it all happened? where did Dudaev, Basaev, Udugov and others come from?
    The Chechen events still require a long, non-personal, analysis! and while the people understand that the INTERNAL ENEMY HAS BEEN SPECIALLY GROWN, IN ORDER TO SCARING THE PEOPLE THEM, DISTURB ATTENTION FROM THAT B.L. Ya.D.STVA, WHAT HAPPENED IN THE COUNTRY!
    when they were Jews, then there were Chechens. I'm not talking about the fact that the Chechens are not directly guilty, I am talking about the fact that among the Chechens there were guilty ones, among other things, like among the Russians, the Ingush and others. the people cannot be a criminal !!! just like in Russia In the 90s, the Chechens were guilty of everything, in the west they also frightened the Russians !!! you need to look for the root of all troubles, but unfortunately, one "root" did not wait for the people's court. pomer. but there are other roots and their crimes, in many ways overshadow all the evil that the militants have done !!!
    ps
    By the way, what do you think, what will they call the Russian army in the case of aggression in Russia?
    1. Uncle
      Uncle 13 November 2012 23: 29
      +1
      Magomed, your opinion is valuable, since you are an eyewitness to the events and, most importantly, a Chechen. Probably, one should have expected criticism of the Russian military, but you are not criticizing. This is good, because otherwise the conversation would have gone in circles, everyone would have scolded everyone. I remember your article - the course of survival in the besieged territory, I read it with great interest, that is, as a Chechen, you turned out to be a victim, just a "survivor". Why didn't you take up arms, dabbled with drugs and went to fight against the infidels? What is the moral character of those who went to fight? Not all of them are illiterate shepherds, the same Basayev is a Komsomol leader. What motivated those Chechens who killed children? Were they proud of their "exploits"?
    2. Yarbay
      Yarbay 14 November 2012 08: 59
      0
      Quote: survivor
      The Chechen events still require a long, non-personal, analysis! and while the people understand that the INTERNAL ENEMY HAS BEEN SPECIALLY GROWN, IN ORDER TO SCARING THE PEOPLE THEM, DISTURB ATTENTION FROM THAT B.L. Ya.D.STVA, WHAT HAPPENED IN THE COUNTRY!

      You said much better, which I also wanted to emphasize !!
  21. survivor
    survivor 13 November 2012 23: 52
    +4
    Well, first of all, I'm not a Chechen, but an Ingush. secondly, I had to see different fighters. and those whom I call the Dudaev Army (many of them really fought for the idea and were sharply against the lawlessness that others did), and those who came down from the mountains and fought in the militia, and those who got involved in this war exclusively for the sake of money, and of course those who did not care about Dudaev at all, fought for the fact that they had lost relatives.
    why didn't I take up arms? hmm, hmm ... a very interesting question. Probably because before the war he was in the student underground and put up leaflets and helped the Russian people to travel? Or maybe because instead of shooting at people, I took up the unrewarding job of getting these very people out of the conflict zone? or maybe because he was wounded in the Ingush Ossetian and after being wounded, did not fully recover? I have no answer to this question. Thirdly, many militants not only did not welcome the killing of women and children, but also put such "heroes" against the wall. ( I cannot speak for the second Chechen, I have not seen it myself, I speak for the first!)
    any nation has a known number of fiends! unfortunately, education in no way affects this. You yourself called Basayev educated, but I saw a highlander-militiaman who recaptured a Russian woman from his "brothers in arms" and defended her, though at the cost of his life. he tried to reason with them with words. said that a devout Muslim should not do that, then he simply mutilated three and released the woman, but received a bullet in the back from one of them ... what criteria should I measure?
    1. Uncle
      Uncle 14 November 2012 00: 14
      0
      Quote: survivor
      Well, first of all, I'm not a Chechen, but an Ingush.

      Sorry, I didn’t.
      Quote: survivor
      helped Russian people travel?

      I did not even imagine what it was.
      Quote: survivor
      many militants not only did not welcome the killing of women and children

      It also seems to me that there is nothing to be proud of.
      Quote: survivor
      who beat off a Russian woman from his "brothers" in arms and protected her, though at the cost of his life.

      This is a feat worthy of the kingdom of heaven. I don’t know where Muslims go after death; a Christian would be forgiven of all sins for this.
      Quote: survivor
      What criteria should I measure?

      The criteria for the salvation of the soul, in any case, in a conversation with a Christian.
    2. Lech e-mine
      Lech e-mine 14 November 2012 05: 50
      +1
      Yes, the case you described ME convinces me once again that there are HONEST AND JUST PEOPLE in this people too. There would be more of them.
      Unfortunately, it is easy to introduce various ideas of NATIONALISM and FANATISM into the heads of LEG-CERTAIN PEOPLE ..
      Now, under the cover of sermons in the Caucasus, yes and throughout Russia (
      (including my hometown) EMISSARS -SAUDITS work.
      For us, they now pose a DIRECT THREAT (I can feel it right in my gut)
      they are stealthily preparing militants - killers, brainwashing young guys and filling them with POISON OF Wahhabism. At any time, these READY KILLERS can go out to kill on the STREETS of OUR CITIES.
      TAKE BETTER PREACHERS FROM SAUDI ARABIA AND QATAR.
    3. Yarbay
      Yarbay 14 November 2012 09: 06
      0
      Quote: survivor
      I saw a highlander-militia fighter who beat off a Russian woman from his "brothers" in arms and protected her, though at the cost of his life. he tried to reason with them with words. said that a devout Muslim should not do this, then he simply mutilated three and let the woman go, but got a bullet in the back from one of them ... what criteria should I measure

      Salam alaikum Magomed!
      Glad to see you again!
      And here you have given an example that shows that not everything is clear and different people had different ideas and different human qualities !!
      After all, that militia was absolutely right in saying that killing a defenseless person and generally killing is unacceptable for a true Muslim !!
  22. survivor
    survivor 14 November 2012 00: 37
    +5
    the fact that you, dear Uncle, did not know that youingush, there is not any fault of yours, so there’s nothing to forgive).
    Much of what was THERE carefully concealed HERE. for if you admit many, seemingly small, or not meaningful facts, then somehow the whole, harmonious picture of the enemy collapses.
    Yes, there were people among ALL nationalities on whom the apartments were specially rewritten so that they could sell them at a great price. usually, at first the family was exported to Russia (Krasnodar Territory. the capital, etc.), the apartment was sold and the money transported to the former owner. there were those who cheated, threw. there were those who profited, gave a smaller part of the money, but there were decent people .... they are in any nationality in large numbers)
    believe me, after death, the route of all faiths is the same))) because God is one, no matter how they call him.
    take my word for it, in that situation I least of all thought about saving the soul ... here to save the bytushka))).
    By the way, if you carefully read my article, then you will probably find the answer in it, why I did not take up arms)
    1. Uncle
      Uncle 14 November 2012 00: 47
      0
      We will return to this topic, and now I’ll go to bed, at the Mother See almost one in the morning.
  23. survivor
    survivor 14 November 2012 01: 06
    +1
    always at your service). Good night.
  24. survivor
    survivor 14 November 2012 09: 44
    +3
    Leha e-mine,
    not everything is so simple. as long as there is stability and strong power, all national, nationalist, Nazi
    That is, ideas simply do not work among the people. As soon as the authorities are shaken, stability disappears and literally right away, all this creeps out. a person just tries to explain to himself - "why did it become bad?", and he was immediately answered - "Chechens have come in large numbers ... Russians have come in large numbers ... m.s.k.a.l. and come in large numbers .. . "familiar intonation? in the 90s, people reached such a handle that the revolution could begin at any moment. I remember, I worked at a construction site as a helper, the ruble collapsed. So we really wanted to go to the rally !!! The salary is still the same, and the prices are not the same ...
    it was then that the internal enemy was needed .... Dudaev was not put on the throne by the people ... they gave him and promoted to the people.
    wa alaikum assalom. Alibek. common truth, any religion teaches peacefulness, but a person, a diabolical creature, rewrites any religion, interprets for himself, for his own, sometimes petty, needs.
  25. vladimirZ
    vladimirZ 14 November 2012 12: 43
    0
    Flirting the highest authorities with nationalists from among the small peoples of Russia inevitably leads to blood, including civilians, women, and children.
    A striking example of Dudaev and his pack that Yeltsin gave rise to is still not a proper lesson for those in power.
  26. Yarbay
    Yarbay 14 November 2012 13: 17
    +2
    Quote: survivor
    in the 90s, people reached such a handle that the revolution could start at any moment. I remember working at a construction site as an auxiliary worker. The ruble collapsed. So we really wanted to go to a rally !!!
    then the internal enemy was needed.

    In principle, and now in reserve hold such strength and mood among the people!
    Take the case of Mirzaev, after him at least three more athletes killed people for various reasons and two of them were sentenced to a year of imprisonment and one conditionally, but no one talks about it! A man who shot children in kindergartens with a sniper rifle or buses are not interested in anything, but the shots from wedding processions immediately become the number one news!
    Please note that I do not in any way condone the crime or boorish behavior of some Caucasians, and even condemn it, but I think that passion and discontent are specially warmed up!
    Quote: survivor
    Dudaev didn’t put the people on the throne ... they gave him and promoted to the people.

    Totally agree!

    Quote: survivor
    but man, a fiendish creature

    Man of God creation!
    I read the expression of Ali Ibn Abu Talib!
    He said, the Almighty gave the animals (nafs) a desire, but did not give reason!
    The Almighty gave the angels reason, but did not give the desire, and the man gave both the desire and the mind, if the person has the desire to overpower the mind, then he will be lower than the animal in the eyes of the Almighty, but if, thanks to the mind, the person can overpower his desires (nafs) then in the eyes The Most High will be above the angels !!
    1. Light source
      Light source 16 November 2012 20: 53
      0
      Quote: Yarbay
      immediately become the number one news

      The owners of television have their own kind of news, and it does not regularly coincide with the opinion of the people.
  27. George
    George 14 November 2012 14: 13
    0
    I watched the doc / f in which Dudayev negotiated with Pasha. Dudayev said that I personally do not want war, but I am a hostage of the interests of the people I represent. In my opinion, all the first persons of any state are subject to the influence of their "close boyars." does not justify any of them. Later, Maskhadov faced the same problem and as a result, the appanage princelings, who had already seized power and permissiveness, began to rule. Could this be one of the factors that influenced their early defeat? I would like to read the opinion of Ochevid
  28. survivor
    survivor 14 November 2012 14: 48
    +2
    any ruler is made by his retinue! it is the retinue who determines who to sit or not to sit on the throne. Of course, while the retinue would like to receive all sorts of dividends from the person it has placed on this throne. Nothing prevents this retinue from overthrowing any tsar, king, president. Remember the time of troubles in Russia, or the accession of Ekatirina. There is a moment when individual clans cannot choose a common contender for the throne. strife begins in which the state itself perishes and the civilian population suffers. examples? I have them! the same seven-boyar or split of Kievan Rus. At the same time, neighboring states are specifically conducting propaganda against reunification. Well, it's not profitable to have one strong neighbor, it's better to have three or five weak ones. The weak can be influenced. the weak can be bought. with the weak, you can smile in the face, behind the back (and not only) carry out scams. tailor the country, use cheap labor, use the resources of this little neighbor. if he refuses to fulfill the requirements of the "sponsors", then he can simply be fired .... Grishka Otrepiev was fired.
    so, you are absolutely right. "divide and conquer" did not go anywhere.
  29. Yarbay
    Yarbay 14 November 2012 15: 00
    +1
    Quote: survivor

    any ruler does retinue! it is the retinue that determines who to sit down silt and not to sit on the throne. Of course, while the retinue would like to have all kinds of dividends from the person who planted it on this throne. nothing prevents this retinue from overthrowing any king

    I disagree!
    It all depends on the personality of the ruler !!
    If he is strong-willed and smart enough, he will make himself a retinue who will tear for him!
    1. survivor
      survivor 14 November 2012 15: 17
      +1
      where to get strong-willed? and which clan will elect the one who will become their executioner?
      1. Yarbay
        Yarbay 14 November 2012 15: 36
        +1
        Quote: survivor
        where to get strong-willed? and which clan will elect the one who will become their executioner?

        That's why I say that it all depends on the person !!
        I will give you an example, does Kadyrov depend on his environment or the environment from it ??
        Aliyev depended on the environment or the environment from him ??
        Sometimes a clan has nowhere to go, except to do whatever the leader requires!
        The question is loyalty - if you’re a devotee, you’ll live well, no, better kill yourself!
  30. George
    George 14 November 2012 17: 50
    0
    And Kadyrov is dependent, I believe that there are no independent in principle. After all, at the basis of the nomination of any politician is a group of people who pursue their own interests, but this coincides with someone's opinion, these behind-the-scenes businessmen do not care. "and what? All the curses did not go to them
    1. Yarbay
      Yarbay 14 November 2012 19: 10
      +2
      Quote: GEORGE
      And Kadyrov is addicted, I believe that there are no independent

      You read inattentively, we are talking about different things !!
      The issue is not independence, but in relations with loved ones, subordinates!
      Quote: GEORGE
      at the heart of the nomination of any politician is a group of people
      In some cases, this is a subordinate group, and in others a leader !!
      It all depends on the personality of the leader and his capabilities !!
  31. George
    George 14 November 2012 21: 58
    +1
    in short, you are talking about authority. And I'm not talking about relationships, but about subsequent responsibility. They curse the rulers, not those who surround them. Here is our Vova, on the one hand, there is authority and a desire to fix something (my opinion), but the staff the surroundings are old. How was Kadyrov able to pacify his fellow tribesmen? Yes, he just told the villagers either the kayuk or give up. It’s just convenient for Russia. And in this context, I think it means that he said it, he did it.
  32. click80
    click80 15 November 2012 13: 18
    0
    the fourth demand for the payment of a huge indemnity by Russia for the damage that the Russian army inflicted on Chechnya during the military campaign.
    Unfortunately, we are still paying this to Chechnya, they just call it differently.
    And to judge the black man for treason, and to confiscate all his property and the property of his wife, children, brothers and so on.