Military Review

BMP-2M with the Berezhok module, or How did we get to such a life

236
BMP-2M with the Berezhok module, or How did we get to such a life

Sometimes with our MO it's better not to know the dates. There is such a machine as the BMP-2 - not the worst, quite at the level of contemporaries ... but not bad for the second half of the 70s, when it was created. But already in the 80s, when it was mass-produced, it was not the most modern, and now it is the 00st century in the yard, and to say that it is outdated is to say nothing. Usually, when a machine becomes obsolete, it is modernized, especially since - as often happened in the 400s, we created good samples due to export, in particular, a very cool Berezhok module. If anything, Algeria bought 2005 of them already in XNUMX. That is, they were not only created, but also launched into large-scale production, and even a simulator was created for them. But our Ministry of Defense raved about the Kurgans, just think, the troops were not only deuces, but even ones.


And the module was really good - here are excerpts from the test report:

“When attacking a stronghold with the reinforcement of an infantry fighting vehicle company, the use of weapons in movement against the enemy led to a decrease in the loss rate by more than two times, the costs (less ammunition consumption) for its implementation were reduced by almost 2 times.”

It is not surprising that Algeria, following the results of operation, equips even the BMP-1 with the Berezhok module (we are doing a dream of reason - the BMP-1AM, which, in terms of capabilities, is not even inferior to the non-modernized one, since they saved on sights!) And Tanks T-62. Algerians want to reduce losses by half, and in the Russian Federation women give birth to new ones.




Finally, in 2017, our Ministry of Defense gave birth and signed a contract for the modernization of 540 of the three thousand existing BMP-2s to the BMP-2M level with the installation of the Berezhok complex. When I thought about writing this article, the main question should have been why we still have non-modernized deuces at all, but as it turned out, the situation is much, much sadder. The first experimental batch of 16 vehicles was delivered in 2018 to the 74th Separate Guards Motorized Rifle Brigade of the Central Military District, where they were slowly (where to hurry!) tested until the end of 2019. So serial vehicles began to enter the troops only in 2020, 15 years after the creation of the module! And the delivery of all machines, according to this contract, should be completed only in 2025!


But on the Army forum, we demonstrate such drug addiction:

1. Why not just a more secure, but equipped with additional armor BMP-3 to put a cardboard habitable module instead of the beautiful Bakhchi, a sane person cannot understand.

2. In the case of a boomerang, the question of a cardboard module for a well-protected armored personnel carrier is supplemented by the fact that it is installed instead of an uninhabited one - so minus the volume for the fighting compartment.

But this is the expenditure of funds and resources of designers and technologists for the creation of cadavers.




By the way, the Berezhok module is not the only way to increase the combat capability of the BMP-2.

Security can be enhanced. For the BMP-2, the “Additional Protection Kit” 675-sb3KDZ was adopted. And although this particular kit was developed and presented back in 2015, only 101 of them were ordered with delivery dates of 64 - until 15.10.2020/37/15.10.2021 and XNUMX - until XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX. And not to the troops, but to warehouses! In the summer, they were taken out and, with the help of repair regiments, installed on infantry fighting vehicles, but there were no additional orders. Although, taking into account the fact that our army does not use the buoyancy of light armored vehicles (this is a separate sad история, which leads to losses, but our military does not know how to swim through water barriers), then increased security, as they say, “must-have”. The USSR in Afghanistan very quickly turned the BMP-1 / BMP-2 into the BMP-1D / BMP-2D equipped with additional armor.

Also, the means to reduce the visibility of armored vehicles from reconnaissance means increase the combat capabilities quite well. In particular, the set of means for reducing visibility from the Nakidka Research Institute of Steel, which began to equip the T-90M during the SVO, is quite well known. Only here is the nuance that this complex has been around for a very long time - it was exported to Armenia back in 2005. By the way, the same Finns who plan to have the BMP-2 in their arsenal will equip them with special camouflage kits until 2030, which will have to reduce the thermal visibility of the BMP. But we sincerely believe that only the T-90M is visible in the thermal imager, and the rest will be killed even without capes.


I won’t even write about dynamic protection, everything is not so simple with it, and artisanal modernizations in the troops are more likely to pose a danger to their crews. But if the DZ system for the BMP-21, created 3 years ago, has not been adopted for service and is supplied by the manufacturer every year as a novelty, then what can we say about the thin-skinned BMP-2?

Summing up - the stake on the front Kurgans and Boomerangs, each with a dozen, if not more, modules, led to ignoring the modernization of existing equipment. And the soldiers are forced to pay with their blood for "ceremonial" and "unparalleled" models of weapons, fighting on the equipment of the 70s.
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236 comments
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  1. 1razvgod
    1razvgod 8 January 2023 04: 44
    +92
    A lot of things are missing ... Noodles have been dripping from the ears for a year now. There would be first-aid kits to overcome at least not like the BMP
    1. cold wind
      cold wind 8 January 2023 08: 29
      +65
      All this was obvious before the start of the SVO. Pointless projects, parade equipment. Completely detached from the real need. Lack of new equipment in the troops. Under the guise of modernization and supposedly modern technology, they slip equipment outdated by the beginning of the 90s, and this is at best.
      1. Bad_gr
        Bad_gr 8 January 2023 12: 19
        +18
        Quote from cold wind
        Under the guise of modernization and supposedly modern technology .....
        If we talk about new combat modules for the BMP-2, then the Epoch BM was also offered for it (which is for both Kurganets and Boomerang)

        You can put the same "melon" on it

        And additional protection since Afghanistan is offered
        1. TIR
          TIR 8 January 2023 12: 38
          0
          In fact, these grilles do not even protect against RPG-7. Even in the USSR, tests were carried out. Here it is necessary, according to the type of Almaty, to make a single platform for MBT, self-propelled guns, infantry fighting vehicles, BREM. Moreover, the BMP has armor at the MBT level with a front-mounted MTO and a 57mm autocannon. And feed all these systems into a single information system. Moreover, the squad leader must see the whole picture of the battle with the UAV. Then he will even know at what point his fighter should come out of hiding and in which sector to open fire
          1. would
            would 8 January 2023 14: 17
            +16
            In fact, these grilles do not even protect against RPG-7. Even in the USSR, tests were carried out.


            Which were shown on the example of the BTR-80RE

            Protection against RPG grenades of the PG-9C type at any course angles of fire with a probability of at least 0,5.
            The probability of a break in armor when hit by RPG grenades is not more than 0,2.


            That's how they "do not protect."
            1. Bad_gr
              Bad_gr 8 January 2023 16: 59
              +16
              Quote: TIR
              In fact, these grilles do not even protect against RPG-7.
          2. AAK
            AAK 8 January 2023 16: 26
            +3
            I agree that modules with a 57mm cannon or 100mm + 30mm (with the addition of ATGMs) are really effective in combat, and they should (taking into account the maximum expediency for a certain model) be used for the complete modernization of "units" and "twos", as well as for being brought to mind "Kurgans" and "Boomerangs", for the armored personnel carrier 80-82 one must think that the 90th did not go into series, and the old armored personnel carriers, in my opinion, are more dangerous for their crews than for the enemy
            1. Von_Schmidt
              Von_Schmidt 10 January 2023 06: 25
              -1
              Effective shells are really effective in battle, and the caliber is not so important now.
          3. insafufa
            insafufa 9 January 2023 07: 51
            +8
            Better at least some kind of protection than without it at all, at least 40% of the shots the grate holds is also a chance for survival, which will not be superfluous.
            1. Romario_Argo
              Romario_Argo 9 January 2023 16: 10
              0
              these dances with tambourines around and around
              but the topic is different
              AFRF is simply numerically lacking infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers
              especially since they are already swinging from 1,15 to 2,4 million
          4. Alexey RA
            Alexey RA 9 January 2023 12: 00
            +6
            Quote: TIR
            In fact, these grilles do not even protect against RPG-7.

            In fact, correctly calculated and installed gratings protect against the most common PG-7V shot (proven by the experience of operating the Strykers). With shots of other types it is more difficult, but, on the other hand, there are simply fewer of them.
          5. savage3000
            savage3000 13 January 2023 23: 49
            0
            personally checked from RPG-7? they save everything. 50% chance of a grenade not triggering. and it works
        2. Codett
          Codett 8 January 2023 14: 36
          +10
          You know, I think that if there were enough such protective kits in the troops, the loss of personnel and crews of armored vehicles would definitely be less, but it would also be nice to take into account the experience of Israel with their armored personnel carriers, we also have the opportunity to convert a certain number of tanks into heavy armored personnel carriers or build them from scratch, but for some reason the management is in no hurry to do this, and I think that the mantra about buoyancy is an excuse not to spend money
          1. skeptic
            skeptic 8 January 2023 16: 30
            +14
            Quote: Codett
            we also have the opportunity to convert a certain number of tanks into heavy armored personnel carriers or build them from scratch, but for some reason the leadership is in no hurry to do this

            "On paper" a lot of what is being done. So is 1,5 million. sets of forms, from this sphere. The only pity is that there are no fewer "paper investigators" in the Ministry of Internal Affairs.
            1. Sebastian Aristarkhovich Pereira
              Sebastian Aristarkhovich Pereira 9 January 2023 13: 27
              +12
              But because "effective managers" stuck to everything! To torpedoes, to missiles, to infantry fighting vehicles and soldier's kitchen .... They don't care about the end result, the process of mastering the allocated budget is important to them. Literary critics with journalists cannot create real platforms for armored vehicles, just as they cannot sew backpacks and unloading .....
              But they can beat out money for the construction of departmental sanatoriums with their subsequent accelerated bankruptcy and successful privatization by the wife and kids!
              That's when they themselves will sit at the controls of the "Kurgans" dressed in tarpaulin boots and armed with their "promising" developments, then they will understand how to love the Motherland!
              1. kartantirambler.ru
                kartantirambler.ru 10 January 2023 13: 45
                +3
                Oh, and you don't have to! United Russia is in perfect order, and the budget is in surplus, and the gold reserves are at the level, and the NWF has not yet been written off.
          2. insafufa
            insafufa 9 January 2023 08: 03
            +4
            Quote: Codett
            but it would also be nice to take into account the experience of Israel with their armored personnel carriers, we also have the opportunity to convert a certain number of tanks into heavy armored personnel carriers or build them from scratch, but for some reason the leadership is in no hurry to do this, and I think that the mantra about buoyancy is an excuse not to to spend money

            At least for starters, make an infantry fighting vehicle at the level of the T-34 reservation at 28 - 32 tons, on which a normal DZ can be placed. Everything depends on logistics and the possibility of transportation and the availability of trawls, the trawl is carrying two infantry fighting vehicles - 1, BMP-2 or BMP-3 or one T-90, T-80 and T-72 tank. If you make the car heavier, then they can only be transported one at a time. This is what keeps the development of heavy infantry fighting vehicles. Another circumstance is that the Marines and the Airborne Forces, if their own equipment is being developed for the Airborne Forces, then the Marines are equipped with the same that the ground forces have. The Marines need air transportability, buoyancy, and the Airborne Forces have the same criteria. So for these branches of the military, it is possible to make the equipment unified; the ground forces should have their own more protected ones, and it is possible to purchase landing equipment for scouts, then we will have order and there will be no zoo unique and unparalleled like the Germans at the end of World War II. Everyone knows what the search for the Wunderwaffel Reich led to in 1945.
            1. goose
              goose 9 January 2023 09: 57
              +3
              Let's first do normal logistics in the army, remake autobathes and pontoon parks. For such a huge country, such structures should not be on paper.
            2. Materialist
              Materialist 9 January 2023 17: 48
              +3
              The production of military equipment, like any other industrial product, rests not on the trawls transporting them, but on the private capitalist method of appropriating the results of labor
              Apparently, as far as I can tell, in the Russian Federation it is now easier to get an order for existing (inevitably obsolete, for the most part, vehicles), in view of the bureaucratic procedures already carried out for adoption, and the state itself is not able to completely re-equip motorized infantry at least BMP 3, developed in the 80s, without even stuttering that all front-line combat vehicles should be unified and differ only in combat modules, representing extremely heavy and thick-armored vehicles (I will not be led by sophists and set specific weight limits for military equipment, since the ability to withstand the most modern weapons of this class of equipment and all possible promising ones is determined by weight only indirectly and it could well be on the order of hundreds of tons if protection and survivability measures required it), the Russian Federation is not able to provide the most primitive needs of the Armed Forces , not to mention promising ones, and about the unification of at least MBT, not even made in the USSR
            3. Old tanker
              Old tanker 10 January 2023 13: 03
              +1
              The trawl carries only one BMP-1/2. And it's not about weight, but about size.
            4. the same doctor
              the same doctor 12 January 2023 11: 52
              0
              The search for a child prodigy is a consequence, not a cause, of the collapse of Germany in 1945.
      2. alexmach
        alexmach 8 January 2023 16: 31
        0
        Pointless projects

        Well, meaningless. Here is the same Kurganets had to solve the issue of security. So far, they haven't been able to bring it to fruition.
      3. Amper
        Amper 9 January 2023 22: 27
        +7
        And what to expect from the deciders, of which one does not understand anything and is always on the sidelines, and the other is a biathlon master firefighter, and similar what
        1. Old tanker
          Old tanker 10 January 2023 13: 07
          +1
          Shoigu is not a firefighter, but a builder. So he builds temples and Patriot parks, and not armored vehicles.
    2. Nesvoy
      Nesvoy 8 January 2023 10: 51
      +78
      As you read the comments, it becomes so "funny". But it’s okay that all those who have been talking on this site all these years, and not only on this one, that in our army far from everything is as rosy as the urapatriotic articles described, they were automatically branded traitors, agents of the State Department and trolls and sent to the ban! ? How is that?
      1. Soulcube EKB
        Soulcube EKB 8 January 2023 12: 25
        +58
        100% it was! As soon as you start talking about shortcomings, shortages, shortages, window dressing, etc., Kremlinbots immediately run in and start stigmatizing, insulting, distorting, distorting, and so on and so forth. And so everywhere, on any resource, in any field ... Well, here .. CBO is like an x-ray, lit up the jambs. Hurray-bots have diminished, but they have not completely disappeared.
        1. nepunamemuk
          nepunamemuk 8 January 2023 13: 28
          -20
          maybe it's not the Kremlin - and cheers - bots, but tsipsoshniks and ukro - bots wassat
          1. Nesvoy
            Nesvoy 8 January 2023 13: 33
            +15
            From your words, it turns out that 90% of the VO audience are Kremlinbots and tsipso? Well things...
        2. Evgeny
          Evgeny 8 January 2023 16: 53
          -22
          Liberal people usually like to call people Kremlinbots, you also write about quilted jackets and rahku.
          Everything is always bad with liberals, so that it would be good and how to do it, they don’t offer!
          1. TheWatcher
            TheWatcher 8 January 2023 17: 45
            -17
            Quite right! Here, in fact, the entire VO is all one tsipsota, who is very actively trying to disguise himself as real patriots, who supposedly know everything about the problems of the army and tell only the truth. But for some reason, this “truth” for them is how bad everything really is for us - everything is gone, the plaster is removed, the client leaves and stuff like that.
            I have long been disappointed in the local contingent, completely amateurs who go out of their way to pose as know-it-alls and show that they are like in the topic of what is happening, as if they work in the Ministry of Defense or somewhere in a defense enterprise.
            1. Nesvoy
              Nesvoy 8 January 2023 18: 32
              +20
              As it did not sound wild, but the bulk of amateurs are urapatriots. It is they who do not really understand anything and most of all yell "has no analogues." And all those who are technically savvy and went to the dispute were branded and removed from the site.
            2. AlexSam
              AlexSam 8 January 2023 20: 31
              -2
              Quote from The Watcher
              Quite right! Here, in fact, the entire VO is all one tsipsota, who is very actively trying to disguise himself as real patriots, who supposedly know everything about the problems of the army and tell only the truth. But for some reason, this “truth” for them is how bad everything really is for us - everything is gone, the plaster is removed, the client leaves and stuff like that.
              I have long been disappointed in the local contingent, completely amateurs who go out of their way to pose as know-it-alls and show that they are like in the topic of what is happening, as if they work in the Ministry of Defense or somewhere in a defense enterprise.

              I respect. At least someone openly said the truth about the people inhabiting VO.
          2. Mikhail Krivopalov
            Mikhail Krivopalov 9 January 2023 05: 26
            +5
            Hooray-patriots and liberals are two sides of the same coin, for some everything is always bad, for others everything is always good.
            1. Alexey RA
              Alexey RA 9 January 2023 12: 03
              +4
              Quote: Mikhail Krivopalov
              Hooray-patriots and liberals are two sides of the same coin, for some everything is always bad, for others everything is always good.

              Opposites converge. ©
              It is not for nothing that leftists and liberals are now standing shoulder to shoulder.
        3. Kotobor Lys
          Kotobor Lys 8 January 2023 19: 54
          +15
          You might think now they don’t send to the ban, it’s worth saying something not quite patriotic)) for example, that Ukrainians are not fools or at least a little doubt about the imminent victory
        4. Terator
          Terator 9 January 2023 20: 02
          +1
          Well .. I was banned just for captioning the photo review .. I even wrote to the administrator ... But the administrator is the main one)))
      2. Overlock
        Overlock 8 January 2023 12: 59
        +10
        Quote from Nesvoy
        automatically branded traitors, agents of the State Department and trolls and sent to the ban!? How is that?

        They have such a job
        1. Mikhail Krivopalov
          Mikhail Krivopalov 9 January 2023 05: 29
          +5
          Yes, not everyone has a job, it’s just that their brains are already so sharpened that if something doesn’t fit into the picture of the world that exists in the head, it immediately causes rejection and a tirade is automatically issued about “CIA manuals, Khokhlobots, piled up.” To discuss, you need to think, analyze, and then the picture of the world can be shaken. And so I hung labels on all opponents, and calmed down.
      3. User_neydobniu
        User_neydobniu 9 January 2023 05: 27
        +5
        By the way, notice these cheers, well, let there be bots, so I have better words for them, but they won’t let them through, for some reason not at the front with Ukraine, but crap further on the forum, justifying the current situation in the army and squealing about numb analogs units.
        In general, for good, these gentlemen should have been standing at the wall for a long time
      4. insafufa
        insafufa 9 January 2023 08: 13
        +5
        Quote from Nesvoy
        How is that?
        Yes, simply and not forcibly, 22 years ago they began to withdraw the BMP-1 from the ranks of the troops, how they were removed, it was generally a thriller, they reduced the divisions to brigades and the problem was solved for you and the money is intact and your pockets are full. And so everywhere they almost reduced the 122mm artillery also by reducing the artillery brigades and transferring the acacia to the level of the regiment of motorized rifle units. And the same with the Hurricanes they did not begin to replace them with Tornadoes, it was expensive, they were simply reduced, now we have more Iskanders than tornadoes in service. This is now so backfired on us and it was impossible to imagine a year ago.
    3. 2112vda
      2112vda 8 January 2023 13: 42
      +29
      Here you are right! There are no longer bearing factories, factories for the production of fuel equipment are barely eking out the existence, TsNITA has rested in Bose. Pogrom on motor factories and much more is gone. But we have representatives on the Forbes lists of the wealthiest "comrades". The reason is simple, as Stanislav Govorukhin accurately put it, in Russia, in the late 90s, there was a "great criminal revolution." Russia is ruled by an oligarchic-kleptocratic clan through its officially elected representatives. So, what kind of "Berezhki" and other "Brooks" are there. Who needs it.
      1. Aviator_
        Aviator_ 8 January 2023 15: 08
        +5
        The reason is simple, as Stanislav Govorukhin accurately put it, in Russia, in the late 90s, there was a "great criminal revolution."
        At first Govorukhin in the late 80s suffered about "Russia that we lost" - this is about tsarist Russia. They paid a lot of money for that back then. Stanislav is still the expert.
        1. Bad_gr
          Bad_gr 8 January 2023 18: 15
          +1
          Quote: 2112vda
          There are no more bearing factories,


          Domestic (20)

          https://www.podshipnik.ru/manufacturers/
          1. UAZ 452
            UAZ 452 8 January 2023 19: 48
            +21
            I understand everything, but wasn’t it too early for you to register the Lutsk, Kharkov, Gnivan and Vinnitsa plants in the domestic ones? Minsky - where it didn’t go, all the same allies.
            1. Bad_gr
              Bad_gr 8 January 2023 20: 33
              +1
              Quote: Bad_gr
              https://www.podshipnik.ru/manufacturers/
              Quote: UAZ 452
              I understand everything, but wasn’t it too early for you to register the Lutsk, Kharkov, Gnivan and Vinnitsa plants in the domestic ones? Minsky - where it didn’t go, all the same allies.
              I apologize for misleading you. I typed in the search "Russia, manufacturers of bearings", I checked the data for some icons - they are working, with fresh dates.
              There is a film on YouTube about the production of bearings in Russia, equipment in production from ancient to the most modern. Production, quite to itself, works.
          2. nils
            nils 8 January 2023 20: 20
            +9
            In 2018, the Samara Bearing Plant was declared bankrupt.
            In October 2022, the SPZ building, together with a land plot of 23085 sq.m. and equipment, was sold for 141 million rubles. individual entrepreneur Lyudmila Vasilyeva. As an individual entrepreneur Vasilyeva is registered in the Chechen Republic, the main activity is renting out your own real estate. Approximately at the same price per square meter, other SDR buildings were sold.
            1. Bad_gr
              Bad_gr 8 January 2023 21: 19
              0
              Quote: Bad_gr
              There is a film on YouTube about the production of bearings in Russia, equipment in production from ancient to the most modern. Production, quite to itself, works.

              "Terminators will produce bearings at the EPK plant" (2019) https://youtu.be/Dzuk88UXn1Y

              "Vologda plant of special bearings will fulfill serial orders" (2019) https://youtu.be/gLAI10REHMg

              "Middle Volga Bearing Plant for 16 years has become a leader in the production of huge bearings" (2022) https://youtu.be/2shEiCTJznw

              "Saratov bearings. Corporate film" (2022) https://youtu.be/kMn8-4giP0s

              "Finally, our bearings! Russia is building the first plant" (2021) https://youtu.be/pnKxyQtKCvU
              1. UAZ 452
                UAZ 452 8 January 2023 22: 09
                +4
                "Finally, our bearings! Russia is building the first plant" (2021)

                I’m not ready to waste time watching content that doesn’t interest me too much, but this name, to put it mildly, somewhat contradicts the assertion that in the Russian Federation there is a real, streaming production of full-cycle bearings. Otherwise, what kind of first plant are we talking about, and this plant is still under construction in 2021?
                1. Bad_gr
                  Bad_gr 8 January 2023 22: 40
                  0
                  Quote: UAZ 452
                  Otherwise, what kind of first plant are we talking about, and this plant is still under construction in 2021?

                  This statement does not contradict the fact that there are also old working plants (moreover, modernized)
              2. Sertorgraius
                Sertorgraius 9 January 2023 00: 47
                +6
                I happened to work for the EPK you are talking about. Renovation has passed, only lines oriented to the citizen and export. For example, in the Samara branch, manual assembly was carried out for the defense industry, even somehow they managed to ship a frank marriage to Kamov. Non-magnetic bearings for dryers were individually assembled by hand from the stage and roughing. At the same time, every second shop manager was looking for an opportunity to quietly merge those Soviet-style documentation to the Chinese
          3. Figvam
            Figvam 8 January 2023 22: 59
            +7
            Lutsk and Kharkov, especially domestic))
          4. insafufa
            insafufa 9 January 2023 08: 23
            +4
            left over from the USSR. An abandoned factory in Sterlitamak that produced self-propelled guns "Msta-S"!
            December 5 2019
            100K read
            Today we will talk about the abandoned and almost destroyed Sterlitamak Machine-Building Plant. A huge factory producing self-propelled artillery mounts.

            The enterprise began to build in 1983 by order of the Ministry of Defense of the Soviet Union, but the construction was delayed. The first howitzer left the assembly line only five years later - quite a long time for the USSR.

            By the end of the eighties, under the "skillful" leadership of Gorbachev, the Soviet Union had already begun to bend, and the pace of commissioning of new production facilities left much to be desired.

            Instead of a conclusion: by now, the plant has been almost completely destroyed, the last self-propelled guns lowered from the machine that stood on the pedestal for many years were evacuated to Victory Park, and the production of self-propelled guns 2S19 is now going on at the facilities of the UralTransMash plant.

            Self-propelled guns "Msta-S" in front of the administrative workshop of the Sterlitamak MashZavod
            No conclusions about effectiveness. It’s better to tell yourself what you think about this in the comments - on the one hand, production continued elsewhere, on the other hand, more howitzers were produced here in four years than in all subsequent years ...
          5. Stone
            Stone 9 January 2023 15: 50
            +3
            It is not a fact that these firms themselves produce something, they can simply buy it in China and pack it in their boxes.
            In general, we were very lucky that they didn’t divorce us as Greeks, although they tried very hard, if someone didn’t know they were flooded with cheap loans and loans to cover loans, etc., in return they blew all their production, and now the EU is almost islands demand for debt.
          6. Nikolay293
            Nikolay293 14 January 2023 23: 02
            +1
            At the Vologda plant, the plant produces a small amount of bearings for the military, and the main amount is the cheapest Chinese, they just put the factory stamp.
      2. Terator
        Terator 9 January 2023 20: 05
        +6
        Once, not so long ago, a new director arrived at one plant, gathered people, both small and great, and said that now Deripaska owns the plant. My task is to earn money FOR HIM. So let's get to work. Something like this)))
    4. zloybond
      zloybond 9 January 2023 12: 27
      +11
      The general, checking how the soldiers are being fed, asks one of them:
      - Is there enough food?
      - That's right, even remains.
      Where does what remains go?
      - We eat up and even not enough!
  2. 28st region
    28st region 8 January 2023 04: 45
    +14
    It becomes sad and insulting when you realize what state our economy is in if any
    "Additional protection kit" 675-sb3KDZ. And although this particular kit was developed and presented back in 2015, only 101 of them were ordered with delivery dates of 64 - until 15.10.2020/37/15.10.2021 and XNUMX - until XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX. And not to the troops, but to warehouses!

    It can be said in single copies produced. And if it’s high-tech like the Su-57, they generally have a couple of pieces a year and manual assembly. UzhOs.
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 8 January 2023 07: 10
      +25
      I think - the reasons are banal. Knowing our noneshnye realities. They produce something from which you can steal more .. And on what you can save money .. Don't care about the rest. Including the lives of fighters.
      1. nils
        nils 8 January 2023 09: 32
        +37
        Quote: paul3390
        I think the reasons are banal. Knowing our current realities. Produce what you can steal more from.

        And if deeper and wider, or wider look? What if this is a deliberate policy? Ministry of Emergency Situations after Shoigu in a deep ass. Engineering equipment (read the civil defense troops) were destroyed, only a few copies remained, for television display. The next Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, the results are on the face! Fighting old equipment from storage. Flow on trailers on the roads. Minimal upgrades. Let's forget about the new one, there is no economic potential. Is over! Foreign spare parts will not help! Parades and biathlons are shiny beads for an ignorant electorate (natives). The mobilization system is broken to the ground. Or maybe there are grandiose successes somewhere in other areas, for example, in education, health care? Everything there is clearly according to the patterns of the "OST" plan, prepared in fascist Germany for implementation in the occupied territories in relation to the indigenous population. It is better to keep silent about Culture altogether. Outdid the OST multiple times. There was only one national idea left: more money, not getting into "Paradise" ahead of time and outliving Putin. As for stealing, it's nothing more than an adjective for everything else.
        1. Servisinzhener
          Servisinzhener 8 January 2023 11: 04
          -3
          Ministry of Emergency Situations after Shoigu ... And tell me, what was the state of this ministry before him?
          1. Russian jacket
            Russian jacket 8 January 2023 13: 34
            +29
            There was no such ministry before him. When it was created, both the paramilitary and professional fire departments were destroyed. But colonels and lieutenant colonels divorced one for each fire truck. Therefore, object fire departments began to appear. Manufacturer owned. We have two brand new cars, which are ahead of the entire Ministry of Emergency Situations of our city in terms of equipment, which are begged for by the same colonels for show. They prefer not to show their cars.
            1. Eule
              Eule 8 January 2023 17: 19
              +7
              Quote: Russian quilted jacket
              fire brigades began to appear

              In my neighborhood, object IFs are collapsed:
              The chemical plant of the Chemical Plant had at least two ACs, plus every third worker knew where to run in case of a fire alarm and what to put out in what calculation.
              FC Technotkanki, one AD
              FC factory number ... (something), one AC, but a lot of people, on command to put out the running.
              The "watermelon foundry" (popular name) PCh was ruined, how many cars there were - I don't know.
              1. Russian jacket
                Russian jacket 9 January 2023 13: 09
                +2
                And there is. But we did not have an object, there was an agreement with a paramilitary one. Now there is. Question for the owners. hi
          2. Iris
            Iris 8 January 2023 16: 37
            +12
            Before the Ministry of Emergency Situations, there was the Civil Defense. The commander was an army general. The system of shelters, the training of drivers, pilots, and much more. Everything is destroyed.
            1. goblin xnumx
              goblin xnumx 11 January 2023 00: 10
              +2
              there were a lot of things before the Ministry of Emergency Situations, but everything was and everything had owners - firefighters in the Ministry of Internal Affairs, civil defense - in the army. and then he went to Moscow ... though evil tongues say that he just misled the sign on the door ... he ended up in the Moscow region ... but he could ... and now it's the army's turn
        2. alexoff
          alexoff 8 January 2023 16: 55
          +5
          What do you mean there is no economic potential? Since 2010, at least a trillion has been allocated annually for the purchase of new weapons, what exactly did they buy? Kurgan-Armaty-Su-57s were not included there, they were not bought, but no one knows what they bought in this case. Except one minister
        3. Terator
          Terator 9 January 2023 20: 08
          +3
          Under Shoigu, the Ministry of Emergency Situations fed well!)) There was a notable time
      2. Eroma
        Eroma 8 January 2023 12: 20
        -4
        Your remark is fully justified, when creating a new one it is easier to write off money than when mass-producing used parts.
        But I think it is quite likely and stupid savings fool , for the sake of high-quality re-equipment:
        But our Ministry of Defense raved about the Kurgans, just think, the troops were not only deuces, but even ones

        As they say, the best is the enemy of the good! No.
        For 8 years of preparation for war (and we were preparing), relying on promising models is stupidity! And such nonsense has surfaced as it hurts a lot belay
        1. UAZ 452
          UAZ 452 8 January 2023 19: 53
          +2
          For 8 years of preparation for war (and we were preparing), relying on promising models is stupidity! And such nonsense has surfaced as it hurts a lot

          If everything certain people did turned out to be stupid, then the only reasonable explanation is that these people are simply stupid.
          1. Mikhail Krivopalov
            Mikhail Krivopalov 9 January 2023 05: 35
            +3
            Big positions are rarely occupied by stupid people, they just worked for other interests.
    2. cold wind
      cold wind 8 January 2023 08: 13
      +22
      And what about the economy? We have money like a fool's shag. We froze $ 300 billion, the country did not even wince.
      1. Overlock
        Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 03
        +5
        Quote from cold wind
        We have money like a fool's shag.

        Sure? Bloomberg: Gazprom ordered to transfer 1.2 trillion rubles to the budget, other large companies were ordered to transfer 50% of their profits to the budget. The budget deficit is 2.9 trillion rubles. Where's the money, Zin?
        1. victor50
          victor50 8 January 2023 14: 26
          +10
          Quote: Overlock
          Quote from cold wind
          We have money like a fool's shag.

          Sure? Bloomberg: Gazprom ordered to transfer 1.2 trillion rubles to the budget, other large companies were ordered to transfer 50% of their profits to the budget. The budget deficit is 2.9 trillion rubles. Where's the money, Zin?

          And the leaders of Gazprom, the oligarchs were not ordered to transfer money? Maybe they are right there? Money.
        2. ZeeD
          ZeeD 8 January 2023 21: 52
          -1
          I wish Bloombergs would hear about our budget ... They will write something like that there ...
          1. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 13 January 2023 19: 30
            0
            Quote: ZeeD
            I wish Bloombergs would hear about our budget ... They will write something like that there ...

            I don’t like Bloomberg, read the draft budget for 2023. It is designed for an oil price of 70 cu. It is in short supply.
      2. UAZ 452
        UAZ 452 8 January 2023 19: 54
        -1
        This money since 2014 is not really money, because in the last 8 years it was impossible to buy anything you want with it (sanctions, however).
        1. Mikhail Krivopalov
          Mikhail Krivopalov 9 January 2023 05: 37
          +3
          And before that, all the years they shouted about attracting investors, and from the TV screens they boasted of every billion invested in the Russian Federation, but at the same time they did not invest hundreds of their billions in the country, but kept the money in the NATO nightstand
    3. Stone
      Stone 9 January 2023 15: 54
      +3
      The trouble is that officials, incl. and officials from the Moscow Region do not need cheap and efficient, they need the main thing expensive, because only with "expensive" can they be paid good kickbacks.
  3. Andrey Moskvin
    Andrey Moskvin 8 January 2023 05: 16
    +1
    we are doing a dream of reason - BMP-1AM
    It has long been known that the sleep of reason produces monsters.
    1. cast iron
      cast iron 8 January 2023 08: 25
      +13
      Most likely, the shoulder strap of the BMP1 turret is easier to remake under the BTR-82A remote module than under the "berezhok". Another thing is that such upgrades should have been made by 2010. And it would be much better not to modernize antiques, but to produce BMP-3.
  4. cast iron
    cast iron 8 January 2023 05: 24
    +39
    Cool. But with the Aurus they were worn like crazy. Money was pumped into the design and production of Russian Rolls-Reuss for local "masters". But there is not enough money for the army. Only for the parade and drapery of the Mausoleum.
    1. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 06: 24
      +26
      Quote: cast iron
      But with the Aurus they were worn like crazy.

      You do not understand, this is the prestige of the country, so Russia is immediately respected! (sarcasm, bitter sarcasm)
    2. Soulcube EKB
      Soulcube EKB 8 January 2023 12: 32
      +14
      He is "Russian" only in desires and fantasies, in fact, the basis of the filling is foreign, as in all so-called. "novelties" of the domestic auto industry.
    3. Iris
      Iris 8 January 2023 16: 40
      +10
      Stop rocking the boat! You don't know what the decision makers know! And you don't have to know! Because where it should be, there used to be a sentry. But the guard was removed long ago.
  5. Parvis rasulov
    Parvis rasulov 8 January 2023 05: 44
    +11
    “When attacking a stronghold with the reinforcement of an infantry fighting vehicle company, the use of weapons in movement against the enemy led to a decrease in the loss rate by more than two times, the costs (less ammunition consumption) for its implementation were reduced by almost 2 times.” this is an excerpt from the report on the operation of the BMP 3 and these lines are either in the test report of the BMP 2 Berezhok, then the BMPT Terminator, then the BTR 82 ☺️
    1. Alexga
      Alexga 8 January 2023 13: 06
      -1
      Absolutely right! Here is an example: "The effectiveness of the Berezhok module
      The effectiveness of MK "Berezhok" can be appreciated from the following example - when attacking a stronghold with reinforcement of an infantry fighting vehicle company, the use of weapons in movement against the enemy led to a decrease in the loss rate by more than two times, the costs (less ammunition consumption) for its implementation were reduced by almost 2 times." https://army-today.ru/tehnika/berezhok
  6. tatarin1972
    tatarin1972 8 January 2023 06: 01
    +32
    What to judge, everything is as it was and will be. No, of course there is an option, to make a crew from the Minister of Defense, the Chief of the General Staff, the Chief of the GABTU, put them in the BMP-2 and on the opornik somewhere near Donetsk. If they survive, a lot will change.
    1. victor50
      victor50 8 January 2023 14: 29
      +9
      Quote: tatarin1972
      If they survive, a lot will change.

      If they don't survive, too. Either smart ones will appear, or those who remain will be forced to think. For the question will constantly torment: "Who's next?"
    2. UAZ 452
      UAZ 452 8 January 2023 19: 58
      +13
      It is impossible to put the Minister of Defense as a crew commander - he did not serve in the army. Without a military education, we can only be the Commander-in-Chief and the Minister of Defense.
      1. Yaroslav Tekkel
        Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 20: 37
        0
        Now only Britain has a commander-in-chief with a military education.
  7. The comment was deleted.
    1. Reklastik
      Reklastik 8 January 2023 08: 40
      +7
      If the management does not set goals, then why would the performers be responsible for the mess? In due time, it will be announced to calm the society and foreigners what was actually planned. And it turns out that there were goals, and that's what they are. It will logically follow that within the framework of achieving the goals set there was no mess, there was directed work to achieve them. And that's it. It will look good, smart. But in general, the goals were indeed announced: denazification, a non-bloc or military-politically neutral status of the Ukrainian state towards Russia, and the protection of the Russian-speaking population. The only question is the uncertainty of the timing and methods of achievement. It is clear what our country needs. It is not clear how the political leadership is going to achieve this, because this implies a complete replacement of the leadership of Ukraine with leaders loyal to us and ideas for the Ukrainian population. But none of our leaders directly says this. This is what drives everyone crazy.
      1. Santa Fe
        Santa Fe 8 January 2023 09: 09
        +12
        the goals were indeed voiced: denazification, non-bloc or neutral in the military-political

        You have listed the goals of the NWO; it all ended back in March. those goals are not achievable.

        The goals of the ensuing war are still unknown.
        1. Yustas201
          Yustas201 8 January 2023 09: 13
          +18
          Yes, it’s just that the General Staff has no goals, parquet shamblers and their relatives dug in there, so so much blood of our boys is shed ...
          1. UAZ 452
            UAZ 452 8 January 2023 20: 02
            +6
            Since the 90s, the main condition for the military to serve in Moscow was the availability of housing here. The military talents of personnel officers were the last thing they were interested in. These owners of a Moscow residence permit have grown to the level of generals by now, they are planning the NWO (if at all someone else is planning something there).
        2. stankow
          stankow 8 January 2023 15: 11
          +1
          Santa Fe Didn't end in March. It continues and won't stop.
        3. Reklastik
          Reklastik 8 January 2023 17: 36
          +2
          The Allies denazified Nazi Germany: the Germans didn’t need a war for more than 50 years, they lived well, so why did they have to fight? Denazification is feasible; the same can be done with respect to Ukraine. If the leadership of our country had enough brains, the task is being solved, but by no means only by military means. And the goals of the NWO have not been achieved, neither in March, nor in October, nor now. What kind of achievement of goals can we talk about if Donbass was shelled, and continues to be shelled, and even flies through the territory of the border regions of Russia? The goals have not been achieved, and yet they have been known since the beginning of the NWO. Or was there no war before March?
          1. Pilat2009
            Pilat2009 13 January 2023 19: 50
            0
            Quote: Reklastik
            The Allies denazified Nazi Germany: the Germans didn’t need a war for more than 50 years, they lived well, so why did they have to fight? Denazification is feasible; the same can be done with respect to Ukraine. If the leadership of our country had enough brains, the task is being solved, but by no means only by military means. And the goals of the NWO have not been achieved, neither in March, nor in October, nor now. What kind of achievement of goals can we talk about if Donbass was shelled, and continues to be shelled, and even flies through the territory of the border regions of Russia? The goals have not been achieved, and yet they have been known since the beginning of the NWO. Or was there no war before March?

            You forgot how Germany lived for 50 years. The United States poured a huge amount of money into its economy in exchange for complete military and political dependence. And the population of Germany treated the United States normally and the standard of living there was decent compared to socialist countries
        4. Kotobor Lys
          Kotobor Lys 8 January 2023 20: 23
          -1
          Well, how do you get out of this situation? Yes, it suddenly became clear that there would be no easy walk. And the declared goals are unattainable. But what to do with it now? Ukraine will not negotiate or will roll out unacceptable conditions. It remains only to continue in the hope that the enemy will get tired of this bodyaga earlier
      2. stankow
        stankow 8 January 2023 15: 10
        -3
        The goals were set very well. Don't pretend you don't understand them!
    2. Vladimir_2U
      Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 09: 50
      +12
      Quote: Santa Fe
      The war with Ukraine itself - how to beat your mother or relative with your feet
      What, right mother? Or maybe a bastard nephew who beat his sister?
      You are pitiful...
      1. Santa Fe
        Santa Fe 8 January 2023 10: 46
        +1
        https://topwar.ru/171754-v-ldnr-stali-zabyvat-s-kem-vojuem-i-kto-ubivaet-nashih-detej.html

        A couple of years ago, this article was published right here:

        More interesting here is the fact itself: the number of residents of the LDNR, who consider it the norm to travel to Ukraine to work or rest, is gradually growing. Yes, mostly these are those who spent 2014-2015 with relatives in Ukraine or the Russian Federation and simply did not see the war and cannot imagine it. And yet - the trend is not only alarming

        ...

        In this situation, I really want to believe that Lugansk and Donetsk will change their minds and begin to take feasible steps aimed at acting out the situation. Otherwise, after just a few years, the majority of the population will simply not understand that it is booming over the horizon.

        An alarming trend, the conflict ends. The authors tried their best to convince the inhabitants, but they need to wage war. And do not go on vacation to Ukraine
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 10: 53
          +2
          Quote: Santa Fe
          A couple of years ago, this article was published right here:

          And she was called like this:
          In LDN they forget who they are fighting and who is killing their children

          And people like you and other Galkins with Pugachevs did not notice this at all.
          1. Santa Fe
            Santa Fe 8 January 2023 11: 19
            +1
            it was called like this:
            In the LDNR they forget who they are fighting with and who is killing their children

            What kind of person able to forget?

            Absurd title. It was an attempt to somehow explain the situation that breaks the pattern for many. Those living in the DPR/LPR see no reason to fight, they go to Ukraine for vacation, here are the ungrateful
            1. Vladimir_2U
              Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 11: 29
              -1
              Quote: Santa Fe
              Those living in the DPR/LPR see no reason to fight, they go to Ukraine for vacation, here are the ungrateful

              What all? Repairmen of gas and electricity networks, killed by the Armed Forces of Ukraine, civilians of the LDNR killed during DAILY shelling since 2014, are they too?
              1. Santa Fe
                Santa Fe 8 January 2023 11: 53
                +7
                You will not be able to interpret the situation, which has become so obvious that even here I had to publish an article from this

                https://topwar.ru/171754-v-ldnr-stali-zabyvat-s-kem-vojuem-i-kto-ubivaet-nashih-detej.html

                In pursuit - figures that it is undesirable to mention, otherwise the entire SVO is called into question
                2021 servicemen of the People's Militia of the LPR and one civilian of the republic became victims of the aggression of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in 20, the representative office of the LPR in the Joint Center for Control and Coordination of the Ceasefire Regime (JCCC) reported.

                That's the whole price of your slogans
                1. Vladimir_2U
                  Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 13: 24
                  -1
                  Quote: Santa Fe
                  That's the whole price of your slogans

                  What is the price of your lamentations about the beaten mother-Ukraine is clear from the fact that you forgot something about the DPR.
                  According to the press service of the office of the Commissioner for Human Rights of the Donetsk People's Republic, in 2021, 70 military personnel and 7 civilians died in the DPR, 97 military personnel and 32 civilians were injured

                  And the price of your "position" is not added by the fact that you calmly do not consider the killed and wounded fighters of the LDNR to be victims of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. For 21 years. Despite the Minsk Treaty.
                  So that you understand your price in hryvnias, whether in cents, I will explain that such shelling of the Armed Forces of Ukraine is tantamount to shelling by the Japanese of border guards and villages in the Kuriles - with a hundred killed a year, and that there is no peace treaty.
                  Oh yes, surprisingly your lamentations coincide with the fresh pitiful dill message about the innocently killed Ukrainian soldiers.
                  1. Overlock
                    Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 29
                    +4
                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    What is the price of your lamentations about the beaten mother-Ukraine is clear from the fact that you forgot something about the DPR.

                    Nothing should be forgotten, but there is no trace of repeating other people's sins. Have you helped the LDNR a lot since February 24? Did you complete the maximum-minimum program? They didn’t even go to the borders of the region, and don’t go out, there are such doubts. But as the Armed Forces of Ukraine are saturated with Western technology, what will you do? Western technologies against nepotism and corruption, 50% of world GDP against 1% - who will win?
                    1. Vladimir_2U
                      Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 14: 15
                      -3
                      Quote: Overlock
                      Have you helped the LDNR a lot since February 24? Did you complete the maximum-minimum program? They didn’t even go to the borders of the region, and don’t go out, there are such doubts.

                      And how can you get out here if such evil spirits have dug in in the country, either stupid, or pulling everything into your pocket, or licking the tail of the stubborn creatures, not a few of them, but fortunately not many. How is it in your country?
                      Quote: Overlock
                      But as the Armed Forces of Ukraine are saturated with Western technology, what will you do?
                      Straight saturation? It's unpleasant, but what to do, by the way, it will be funny if you burn to hell and with a squeal in the M2a1 "Bradley", because the M2A2 will not be delivered, "there are such doubts."
                2. Orkraider
                  Orkraider 8 January 2023 13: 29
                  -2
                  And you're lying. And you don’t know the true attitude of the Republics towards Bandera. Either you know, but you work out a hryvnia or a dollar.
                  Most likely the second, if you look at your texts.

      2. Blackgrifon
        Blackgrifon 8 January 2023 12: 17
        -3
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        What, right mother? Or maybe a bastard nephew who beat his sister?
        You are pitiful...

        And you do not prove anything to a tsipsoshnik or a traitor. They also have "pity", and people like you or me are "fanatics". Like them, the main thing is the defeat of the country and do not care about the consequences and their idol is Gorbachev. They are working out the manual from the times of Afghanistan.
        1. Santa Fe
          Santa Fe 8 January 2023 13: 07
          +3
          and people like you or me are "fanatics".

          Don't flatter yourself

          Another word is used for you and your slogans
          1. Overlock
            Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 29
            -4
            Quote: Santa Fe
            Another word is used for you and your slogans

            No matter how they remember February 1917
            1. Blackgrifon
              Blackgrifon 8 January 2023 13: 46
              -2
              Quote: Overlock
              No matter how they remember February 1917

              If you were a little smarter, you would know exactly what happened and why in 17, and therefore would be silent. Yes, and, a huge request, do not drag Lenin here - he called for a world revolution, and not for the defeat of his own country.
              1. Overlock
                Overlock 8 January 2023 14: 17
                +3
                Quote: Blackgrifon
                do not drag Lenin here - he called for a world revolution, and not for the defeat of his own country.

                It can be seen that they skipped classes on the history of the KPS and did not work with primary sources:
                1.B. I. Lenin.
                About the defeat of his government in the imperialist war. IN AND. Lenin. Full composition of writings. Ed. 5., v. 26, M., 1969, p. 286-291
                2. Manifesto of the Central Committee of the RSDLP "War and Russian Social Democracy", 1914.
                1. Blackgrifon
                  Blackgrifon 11 January 2023 21: 49
                  0
                  Quote: Overlock
                  It can be seen that they skipped classes on the history of the KPS and did not work with primary sources

                  Apparently you didn’t read and understand these texts, but clinging to one quote, drown for the defeat of Russia.
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. Blackgrifon
            Blackgrifon 11 January 2023 21: 47
            0
            Quote: Santa Fe
            and people like you or me are "fanatics".

            Don't flatter yourself

            Another word is used for you and your slogans

            What are you?! :) I already wrote what word is used for people like you, but it was deleted for violation, so you can guess for yourself.
        2. Overlock
          Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 19
          -1
          Quote: Blackgrifon
          And you don’t prove anything to a tsipsoshnik or a traitor.

          So you believe Moskalkova and Morozova
          1. Blackgrifon
            Blackgrifon 8 January 2023 13: 43
            -5
            Quote: Overlock
            So you believe Moskalkova and Morozova

            I believe in real facts, not in cissy bedding and traitors.
            1. Overlock
              Overlock 8 January 2023 14: 21
              +3
              Quote: Blackgrifon
              I believe in real facts, not in cissy bedding and traitors.

              Would you like to say that Tatyana Nikolaevna Moskalkova, Deputy of the State Duma of the Federal Assembly of the Russian Federation of the XNUMXth and XNUMXth convocations, Doctor of Law, Doctor of Philosophy, Professor, Honored Lawyer of the Russian Federation, Major General of Police and Commissioner for Human Rights in the Russian Federation -
              Quote: Blackgrifon
              ... cisco litter and a traitor
              ? Cool! Can you tell her this or weakly?
              1. The comment was deleted.
              2. Blackgrifon
                Blackgrifon 11 January 2023 21: 47
                0
                I specifically wrote to you, so do not evade the answer.
      3. Overlock
        Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 11
        +2
        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        Or maybe a bastard nephew who beat his sister?

        If you believe Moskalkova, and you must believe her, then in fact since 2015 no one has died in hostilities, the number of deaths has decreased every year, and in 2021 it was the lowest figure for all the years of the conflict - 110 dead (as in the territories of Donbass, controlled by the LDNR, and controlled by Ukraine), and the majority of deaths were associated with careless handling of ammunition.
        Daria Morozova, Donetsk Commissioner for Human Rights: over the past eight years, the largest losses among the civilian population in the DPR and LPR occurred in 2014 (the year the conflict began) and 2015 (when hostilities were still going on): 2084 and 955 people, respectively . In 2022, the DPR alone lost 4176 military personnel, while in the previous years of the conflict, 6500 military personnel were killed in both independent republics. 
        Office of the UN High Commissioner: in the territory controlled by the government of Ukraine 7395 victims (3511 killed and 3884 injured), in the territory controlled by Russia (LDNR) 2035 victims (467 killed and 1568 injured).
        Can you compare properly?
        1. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 13: 51
          -5
          Quote: Overlock
          Can you compare properly?

          Why throw beads before ukrosvinka?
          But it is adequately possible: Almost all the losses of civilians are associated with the actions of the blooded military, no matter in what territories.
          All those killed by the ukrovermacht under the age of 22 on the territory of the LDNR, and rub the nonsense about "careless handling of ammunition" with the electorate of their owners and US-ania. But we don’t need it, not after scattering “Petals” in the settlements of the LDNR.
          1. Askold65
            Askold65 8 January 2023 15: 27
            -5
            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            Why throw beads before ukrosvinka?

            Alas, unfortunately it is necessary. Here on the website of such workers of the CIPSO as dogs not cut ..... And I can only add again and again - this is, albeit indirectly, or maybe directly, the fault of the Russian leadership, which has not yet blown " Caliber" hardware - linear rooms of Ukrainian mobile and Internet providers. So that, finally, these dill propagandos on Russian resources would die out. And such expensive systems in half a day, like burned-out transformers, cannot be changed.
            And also, at the same time, their entire system of bank payments and transfers would collapse. Why don't they do it, I DON'T KNOW?! am
            1. Postcode
              Postcode 9 January 2023 12: 47
              0
              In short, it is because the payment system and the banking system in general of Ukraine are strongly integrated into the international / European system. Today Ukraine is one of the largest transporters of Russian gas and oil to Europe. One way or another, due to this, we get a large influx of CURRENCY, which, during the period of hostilities, well, we really ... really need.
        2. Askold65
          Askold65 8 January 2023 15: 11
          +1
          Quote: Overlock
          ..... moreover, most of the deaths were associated with careless handling of ammunition.

          You also forgot to write from your training manual about death from "self-attacks".
    3. Servisinzhener
      Servisinzhener 8 January 2023 11: 00
      0
      But wasn’t it on this resource in the comments that they fought in paduche proving that there were entirely ordinary Soviet people. And the fascists are a small request from the guest of fanatics that does not affect anything.
      1. Servisinzhener
        Servisinzhener 8 January 2023 11: 38
        -1
        AutoCorrect gets in the way. I wanted to say: a small handful of fanatics.
      2. Overlock
        Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 12
        -4
        Quote: Servisinzhener
        And the fascists are a small request from the guest of fanatics that does not affect anything.

        Do you want to say that all the Armed Forces of Ukraine and civilians of Ukraine are a handful?
    4. Blackgrifon
      Blackgrifon 8 January 2023 12: 14
      +1
      Quote: Santa Fe
      Stopping the war and withdrawing troops once could cost someone the throne.

      Everything is gone and we offer to surrender. Wonderful.
      Quote: Santa Fe
      The very war with Ukraine - how to beat your mother

      Well, yes, but calls to kill Russians and 8 years of real murders are just that.

      Although what am I crucifying? The traitor does not understand.
      1. Alexander Rublev
        Alexander Rublev 8 January 2023 12: 29
        +4
        The losses of the civilian population in the NMD are several times higher than all the losses of the eight years of the war in the Donbass
      2. The comment was deleted.
        1. The comment was deleted.
          1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 14: 04
          +4
          Quote: Overlock
          No one has been allowed to turn on the brain yet

          Are you talking about yours? And turn it on, just turn off the brehlomet first.
          In your video, the words of the paid balabol "calls for the killing of Ukrainians" are pronounced before the words "there should be no mercy for them", but to whom is it? To whom? That's all, all of a sudden, the creatures from "Azov", the creatures that burned dozens of people in Odessa, the creatures that for years beat the residential areas of Donetsk and not only, namely, the leader spoke about them, became ALL Ukrainians. This balabolchik from the video is just as deceitful as you are, like the rest of the mourners paid by the ukroevrovs about Ukraine-mother.
        3. would
          would 8 January 2023 14: 18
          -2
          And what to do with calls to kill peaceful Ukrainians?


          Do not watch TsIPSOsh YouTube channels and do not carry them on topwar
          1. Yaroslav Tekkel
            Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 20: 44
            +1
            Do not watch the People's Governor Gubarev either?
      3. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 8 January 2023 13: 29
        +1
        Quote: Blackgrifon
        8 years of real murders - it's just that.

        A hundred killed in 21 years, well, the little things, why remember ...
    5. Overlock
      Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 04
      0
      Quote: Santa Fe
      Voenkor Kotz just noticed this, less than 11 months later.

      Got it. Ivashov sample of December 2021 forgot to see
    6. futurohunter
      futurohunter 8 January 2023 14: 07
      -4
      Santa Fe
      I wanted to say here about the name of the military commander Kots, but I'm afraid to get banned ...
      From the point of view of logic - well ... blue flags, tablets, stucco moldings of "heroes", and other artifacts of "Svidomo" were put by the Ukrainian authorities. It is much more important what they say, and even more important - what the locals do...
    7. alexoff
      alexoff 8 January 2023 17: 09
      0
      And what date did Kotz write this post? Otherwise, the date was cut so neatly so that it was impossible to check, in recent days he has nothing of the sort.
      1. Santa Fe
        Santa Fe 8 January 2023 21: 27
        -3
        And what date did Kotz write this post?

        His interview on December 31
        https://www.kp.ru/daily/27490/4700578/

        And then they cut the date so neatly so that it was impossible to check

        No one was going to deceive you, suspicious you
    8. Guran33 Sergey
      Guran33 Sergey 8 January 2023 19: 15
      0
      The journalist is rooting for his own .. And the signs, posters, this is an echo of the USSR ..
  8. storm
    storm 8 January 2023 06: 19
    +22
    It was necessary to mobilize not ordinary men from factories, factories and individual entrepreneurs, but 300 thousand United Russia officials from the warm "lordly" offices.
    And the burden on the budget would also be significantly reduced for the ruling party, which for 20 years at the helm is an excellent way to "try on" the real state of the army, to which they also brought their decisions.
    1. paul3390
      paul3390 8 January 2023 07: 08
      +20
      Exactly. Here in the Second World War - members of the ruling Communist Party were the first and voluntarily went to the front. Considering this their sacred duty .. And the party - lost almost 4 million. Which, in my opinion, was the reason for the subsequent sad fate of the Union ..

      Can noneshnye fat-ass bureaucrats repeat their feat? The question is purely rhetorical - we all know the answer very well.
      1. cast iron
        cast iron 8 January 2023 08: 19
        +6
        You somehow naively compare communists with capitalist officials :)
      2. Per se.
        Per se. 8 January 2023 11: 39
        +3
        Communists went to the front for a great idea, for the common people. The current "fat-assed bureaucrats" for their millions and billions stolen from the common people, they send this very simple people to the front, and all sorts of Abramovichs continue to make money, with human grief and suffering.
    2. Servisinzhener
      Servisinzhener 8 January 2023 11: 08
      -1
      How many of these 300 thousand officials are men of a suitable age, and not aunts from the administrations of cities and towns?
  9. Sir Galant
    Sir Galant 8 January 2023 06: 55
    -1
    thoughts are correct. and the article is written chaotically and unreadable ....
  10. Nikolaevich I
    Nikolaevich I 8 January 2023 08: 00
    +2
    This is Russia, Valera! "One cannot understand Russia with the mind" ... and how to understand if everything is done without a mind! fool
    "You can't measure with a common arshine" ... you can measure it here when bureaucrats have different "arshins" ... everyone has their own! request
  11. steelmaker
    steelmaker 8 January 2023 08: 27
    +8
    "a contract for the modernization of 540 of the three thousand existing BMP-2s to the level of the BMP-2M with the installation of the Berezhok complex."
    Thanks to the USSR and the communists for "riveting" so many "galoshes". What would they fight now? Putin built only yachts, palaces and high fences in 20 years.
  12. cast iron
    cast iron 8 January 2023 08: 30
    +25
    It was always amused how ours laughed at the "stupid" Americans. They say their weapons and equipment are awkward and not ideal. However, they have this weapon and this equipment and in sufficient quantities. As well as modern communications, drones, interaction between military branches in the operational mode. Down to platoon and squad level. Satellites monitor everything. Global drones spot everyone. Advances are flying... Even now, the starlink was organized for our "partners" quickly. Indeed, well, "very stupid Americans." Where are they before us :)
  13. Oleg Ogorod
    Oleg Ogorod 8 January 2023 09: 02
    +20
    The problem is complex throughout the military-industrial complex.
    Part of the military-industrial complex is private, part is conditionally state-owned, but controlled by specific people in corporations. Who have long turned into oligarchs. Well, or like Rogozin.
    On the ground, the directorate has long turned into mini-oligarchs. Nepotism flourishes in enterprises, where imprisoned friends and relatives often do nothing, while others are forced to work for them. The states are inflated by this, the costs are high. Another nuance is that basically the enterprises are old, on the basis of the old Soviet ones, with a Soviet scale in terms of area. Previously, it cost nothing, you could easily put up with losses in communications, but now you have to pay for it and not a little. This is how military-industrial complex enterprises go bankrupt.
    Military acceptance at enterprises is a separate issue, but nepotism flourishes there even more. And the level of knowledge of the new lieutenants has long fallen to the level of the plinth.
    After the 90s, the design school can be said to have left. Now they are sitting on the Soviet backlog, slightly modernizing it. Therefore, everything is as it is now. And change quickly here in any case will not work. Despite SVO. I remember Bender's speech at a dinner party, when he raised money to help hungry children, and Kisa importantly puffed up his mustache and puffed out his cheeks. Something like this is happening now in the military-industrial complex.
  14. Evgeny Kotov
    Evgeny Kotov 8 January 2023 09: 07
    +8
    I agree with the previous speaker, they put watering cans in our ears a long time ago, and everything is fine with us, they intimidated everyone with this dagger, we have such a rocket and we will tear everyone to the fascist cross.
  15. BorzRio
    BorzRio 8 January 2023 09: 07
    +9
    In recent years, it has become clear that Russia's problem lies in the vertical of power that the president has built. As a result, around him in all positions responsible for the security forces - the Ministry of Defense, the Ministry of Internal Affairs, the FSB, special services, and so on, sit untouchable, but people devoted to him. And they did what they wanted. With the Army, with defense orders. They hung noodles on his ears, hiding the reality. About the combat super capabilities of the army and its training, about equipping with modern and new equipment, about the situation in Ukraine before the start of the NMD, and so on.
    1. private person
      private person 8 January 2023 09: 27
      +11
      They hung noodles on his ears, hiding the reality

      Noodles are hung only for those who do not mind. And doesn't the president himself hang pasta on the ears of us Russians? And this is from year to year.
    2. Overlock
      Overlock 8 January 2023 13: 20
      +3
      Quote: BorzRio
      In recent years, it has become clear that Russia's problem lies in the vertical of power that the president has built.

      And who did all this?
      1. frog
        frog 8 January 2023 15: 20
        +6
        How is who?? It's been said so many times
        Agents of the State Department, liberda, cissists .....
        Optionally, you can enter reptilians or these, from Nibiru .....
        And yet it has been proven that it is they who do not clean the streets, crap in the entrances and regularly raise prices. And yes, retirement age is also them ....
        In general, the power is literally indestructible. And only one, all alone, fights with them .... Sometimes getting off the galleys ... There were tales about the emperor-gladiator .... Somehow it all ended sadly ...
  16. erased
    erased 8 January 2023 09: 18
    +15
    The text clearly shows the author's surprise and even bewilderment at these facts. And why is the author surprised by the mess and disorder? Is it possible to expect otherwise from the Ministry of Defense and the authorities?
    If at the height of the fighting, a ceasefire is suddenly declared out of some fright, if the military operations themselves are conducted without a clearly defined strategy, if the goals of the Spetsoperushka are not clearly and in detail indicated, then what can we expect?
    No, everything is going according to plan. Someone else's plan. Hostile people of the Russian Federation. This must be understood, realized and accepted as a given. And do not scratch your turnip, marveling at strange and illogical moves.
    All moves are already recorded. Follow them and don't arise.
    1. Per se.
      Per se. 8 January 2023 11: 24
      +9
      Indeed, there is nothing to be surprised at, it was not in vain that it was said that the army is a mirror of society, in our case, a mirror of the ruling bourgeois power. Bigotry, Jesuitism, speculation on Soviet achievements, this is all a "cunning plan", taking into account and amending after a more straightforward collapse from Gorbachev and Yeltsin. We must pay tribute to the Anglo-Saxon "reptilians", they prepared worthy bad boys for their bourgeoisie.

      Now about this Strange Military Operation, due to which Russia incurs huge costs and loses people, the Soviet safety margins are being devastated. Tons of shells and cartridges are being used up at the front, wear and tear and loss of equipment. What have our capitalists created during the years of their rule? Succeeded only in the sale of everything that can be sold and created for sale. If not for the sanctions, they would continue to sell Russia. Optimized science and medicine, destroyed many defense enterprises.

      What's next? How many thousands of new shells can we make a year, how many high-precision missiles? We will be left with empty arsenals in front of NATO, having lost a lot of our men ... Ukraine could have been taken with minimal losses in 2014, Donbass and the entire south-east of Ukraine definitely, but they chewed the snot, gave Nazism in Ukraine 8 years to strengthen in order to get bogged down in 2022 in this "SVO". No, with the bourgeoisie, in their capitalism, we cannot defeat this very world capitalism, whose enemy is not our dependent traitors, but the residual Soviet potential, which is being destroyed in this very NWO.
  17. Navigator Basov
    Navigator Basov 8 January 2023 10: 44
    +2
    And, ChSKh, no one answered and will not answer for all this. MO is like Buridan's donkey and wants to starve to death.
  18. Georgy Sviridov_2
    Georgy Sviridov_2 8 January 2023 11: 42
    +4
    The article is both true and not.
    Of course, when they make cadavers for BMP - 3, it's scary, because it still has the best combat module in the world (for BMP), given that it has been worked out and goes to both BMP-3 and BMD-4, a large order for which the landing force nevertheless knocked out for itself, it is strange that this module does not go to Kurnants and boomerangs ... But on the BMP-3 they put the era module with a low-ballistics gun-57 mm ... But this is practically what the BMP abandoned, when they created the bmp-2 ...
    I also agree that why the hell do we have BMP-1s in combat units. Having excellent bmp-3m bagins, this junk should not exist.
    It is clear that they can remain in warehouses in case of mobilization, I can even understand their presence in training and rear units. That is, they can be used by the protection of airfields, the protection of air defense units, engineering units, the protection of military medical institutions and taxes of non-units. Even the border guards are somewhere conditionally on the border with conditionally friendly China and Korea, I will understand everything. It's bad, but it's a pity to throw it away.
    Although most of it should have been given to the guys in the Donbas back in 2014, where the guys have nothing, these cars would help, especially if they are modernized. Or sell or even donate to the same Syrian army. And the old technology would not disappear and people would be really grateful.
    In combat units, and even more so in units of constant readiness, there should be at least modernized deuces. And in the mind, mostly improved triplets. With modern sights, screens. (no one bothers to take them off if you need to swim, because the importance of capturing a bridgehead for building ferries is not discussed, and it is much better to swim across on an infantry fighting vehicle than on a rubber boat and be left without technical cover).
    But there is also strange talk - about the cape ... It is clear that in war conditions they are made for priority purposes, that is, expensive modern tanks. To urgently establish production in order to cover all the equipment is either unrealistic or it will cost forces and resources that can be spent on something else. There is always a question of priority. If capes were sewn for the BMP-1, but not for the T-90, here I would yell that boobies.
    About remote sensing for infantry fighting vehicles ... The question is difficult.
    Screens, grilles are needed, no doubt about it. But DZ is not a fact, it all depends on how to use the car ...
    If you want the equipment to go in the same ranks with the infantry during the assault, then no, by the way, there are no dz on French leclercs. Because zhz will simply kill the same infantry.
    Well, yes, for thin-walled BMP-1/2, most likely there is no point in dz, it even worked properly, it most likely will not save the equipment, the armor is too thin ...
    On the BMP-3, if it is used at a distance from the infantry, like a light tank or generally a self-propelled canopy, then dz makes sense. Most likely, it will not save you from modern means, but a fly or the same spg-18 spear, dz can really save you from light grenade launchers with old shots like RPG-9, and there is a lot of such good used there. They throw RKG-3 from copters ... And also dz, standing on top, can save, by the way, this is important when working from closed positions ... Artillery of the near edge, such as the same Non, would also cover dz, primarily from copters raids.
  19. Kazbek :-)
    Kazbek :-) 8 January 2023 11: 51
    +3
    BMP is great! But who would explain why we are throwing ourselves off for a more efficient army? On socks underwear and all that!?!?
  20. SaLaR
    SaLaR 8 January 2023 12: 02
    +11
    Quote from Nesvoy
    As you read the comments, it becomes so "funny". But it’s okay that all those who have been talking on this site all these years, and not only on this one, that in our army far from everything is as rosy as the urapatriotic articles described, they were automatically branded traitors, agents of the State Department and trolls and sent to the ban! ? How is that?

    And now they continue, only already junk. yes, they threaten with articles .. Because no one needs the truth .. Neither those who plundered everything, nor those who have been stupid for these years uracal...
  21. alexey_444
    alexey_444 8 January 2023 12: 15
    +1
    The desires are understandable, only rich European countries with military budgets comparable to ours have modern infantry fighting vehicles, I’m not talking about tanks at all, some miserable hundreds or even less. Yes, they protect better, but in their 152 mm on the BMP-1 drum or marder, only if we spent all the money on this couple of hundred, then what would we fight now, they would have ended long ago. the desire to make our analogues of puma is understandable, it doesn’t work out very well, it’s understandable where you can find a designer for 30 thousand rubles, when you can earn 60 thousand with a food backpack without straining. And peacetime was still discouraging, what difference does it make on what to ride during the exercises.
    1. Yaroslav Tekkel
      Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 20: 56
      +1
      And the rich European countries were going to fight in one snout with the largest country in Europe? Or do they intend to wage major wars together, when their tens and hundreds add up to thousands?
  22. anonsvirus7
    anonsvirus7 8 January 2023 13: 29
    0
    There are few truly honest people.
    So there are no leaders!
  23. Pavel57
    Pavel57 8 January 2023 13: 31
    0
    I wonder how the Algerians installed Berezhok on the BMP1?
  24. Dmitry Zip
    Dmitry Zip 8 January 2023 13: 40
    -5
    Now that our country has begun to mass-produce new T-90M, BMP-3. The concept of upgrading old samples is not cost-effective. It is better to gradually abandon the BMP-1 and BMP-2 and sell them, and for extreme necessity, leave the already modernized samples on the warehouses. Since modernization takes not only money, but also time, until the troops put them in, they will already become obsolete. Better go and build a BMP-3. It's my opinion.
  25. AdAstra
    AdAstra 8 January 2023 13: 53
    +2
    So it turns out that "and the king is naked" ...
  26. gromovanton
    gromovanton 8 January 2023 14: 00
    +1
    A good example of the modernization of the BMP is the American Bradley.
    About our infantry fighting vehicles and modernization / replacement. In fact, a modern BMP is almost a light tank - projectile-resistant in the frontal projection (25-60 mm caliber shells) + dynamic protection at the MBT level.
    Active protection is questionable.
    Modern BMPs are wildly expensive both for 1 piece and taking into account the 1: 1 replacement of the existing BMP fleet. Roughly 1 unit This is 3-5 million dollars per piece. Need at least 4000 pcs. \u5d 4000 * 20000 \u20d 1400 million \u10d 2 billion dollars \uXNUMXd XNUMX billion rubles. Even if stretched over XNUMX years, this is $ XNUMX billion for infantry fighting vehicles alone.
    On the other hand, we spend a lot on a useless fleet ...
    Yes, the modernization of the BMP could be made smarter. Hypothesis except stupidity corny saved.
  27. Codett
    Codett 8 January 2023 14: 19
    +2
    Unfortunately, it’s just like that in our country, it’s a complete window dressing, and the equipment in the troops is Soviet, there is little Russian, and parasitizing on the achievements of Soviet engineering, the current oligarchic government is not going to spend money on protected equipment, since it’s cheaper to mobilize new soldiers than to produce equipment, so our guys go on armor, the concept of floating equipment did not justify itself in Afghanistan, but for leaders it does not matter
    1. Yaroslav Tekkel
      Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 21: 05
      0
      And where to swim in Afghanistan? Another thing is that she does not swim anywhere at all.
  28. MaKeNa
    MaKeNa 8 January 2023 14: 37
    +10
    The whole policy of Shoigu and GDP in the army is the most beautiful "Military Acceptance" and Army Games. They were ready to play with toys! In general, the "Potemkin village" !!!
    1. Ulan.1812
      Ulan.1812 8 January 2023 20: 45
      +3
      Quote: MaKeNa
      The whole policy of Shoigu and GDP in the army is the most beautiful "Military Acceptance" and Army Games. They were ready to play with toys! In general, the "Potemkin village" !!!

      Potemkin villages were just a reality. Potemkin founded and built the cities of Odessa, Nikolaev, Kherson, Yekaterinoslav.
      Wow "Potemkin villages".
  29. dfk-80
    dfk-80 8 January 2023 14: 41
    +10
    The author's story is a consequence, not a cause.
    This is where the system needs to change. Even on GDP with capitalism, but the selection system in the Moscow Region, the system for monitoring this selection and cash flows.
    If our authorities are pissing for themselves and civilians, then for the military to return (apply) the VMN and the article undermining the country's defense capability with a range from 15 to VMN is just long overdue:
    There is no communication in the troops - everyone from the minister to the company commander knew and did not report: minus the rank and record in the file for a start. Organizers and responsible 25 in peacetime, VMN with confiscation in wartime and equated to it. Shaking up the fate of all relatives up to the 7th generation.
    No UAVs - everyone from a company commander to a minister ...
    A non-statutory officer because of which more than one fighter was taken down / dropped out in the regiment: everyone from a company commander to a Comanche ..., to the organizer - even if this conscript is a fan of the AUE or jamaat: VMN. Check relatives for rottenness, an attempt to smear and solder complicity + non-information.
    This is where the homeland / army begins. And then there won't be any problems with the bank and the rac proposals.
  30. certero
    certero 8 January 2023 14: 55
    +11
    The fighting simply opened the veil over a closed corporation, where you could cut money without external control.
    Once upon a time, I considered the thirty-seventh year in the Soviet Union a terrible absolutely unprovoked period. And now I understand that if such methods of solution existed now, then the descendants would also ask what happened and why so many generals were shot.
    1. Yaroslav Tekkel
      Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 21: 11
      +2
      The trouble is that in 1937 many of those who should not have been shot (say, the same Rokossovsky walked along the edge, but managed to sit, but how many did not pass?) And, conversely, many who should have been shot or, at least, fired in disgrace, rose in the ranks.
  31. stankow
    stankow 8 January 2023 14: 58
    0
    The military can't swim?! laughing laughing
    ................
  32. Ulan.1812
    Ulan.1812 8 January 2023 15: 12
    +5
    The result of the activities of the Russian government.
    Window dressing and irresponsibility, and personal interests above the state.
    So why be surprised by what is happening.
    The army is a cast from the state.
    There is no order in the state, that's where the legs grow from.
  33. ashigara
    ashigara 8 January 2023 15: 20
    -3
    The author is indignant at the lack of modern infantry fighting vehicles in the army, says that the BMP-2 is outdated, and then, literally in the next paragraph, laughs that the Moscow Region dreamed of the Kurgans instead of modernizing the BMP-1/2. Where is the logic of the author. The desire to have new BMPs instead of wasting money on useless upgrades is absolutely correct. Pumped up the performance. People with kind eyes and bright faces, like Yura Borisov and Denis Manturov, completely destroyed all the new projects that appeared under the "bad" Serdyukov. Armata, Boomerang, Kurganets, a new destroyer - the list goes on and on. And where, excuse me, did the Poseidons and Petrels go? There is absolute silence on these topics throughout the year. And yet, just in time for the fateful meeting of our dear President in Geneva with the damned American President, structures began to grow by leaps and bounds in Moscow and on the net that began to promote "the reduction of strategic weapons and especially nuclear weapons." It's time, as we see, for reduction, yeah.
    In general, I will tell you, you are not looking there. BMP is, of course, good, but here is such a moment. In the eight years of fighting Nazism and denazification after Crimea, how many radical Ukrainian nationalists who called for war against Russia were destroyed by our special services? How many were detained? The answer is zero. NO ONE. And how many during the same time, detained or suddenly sent to another world those who called for the fight against the liberals in Russia, those who demanded patriotism? Those who demanded the strengthening of the army and the state? They have no number. And here's the thing, I think. I don't know, I'm just guessing. Our dear, beloved President, our hope and support, began his career as President with cooperation with the United States in the "fight against international terrorism." And throughout his career, all these twenty years, our President and his entire nomenclature have been saying that it is necessary not to conflict with the United States, but to cooperate mutually beneficially. The most important thing in international relations is mutually beneficial cooperation! And now it seems to me that after Geneva, our President and his nomenklatura finally began to cooperate with the United States again for mutual benefit. It’s just that twenty years ago they cooperated mutually beneficially with the United States in the fight against international terrorism, and now, a little less mutually beneficial, but forgive me, as they say, who studied what, they cooperate in the fight against Russia as a strong independent state with a powerful army and people .
  34. Wolf
    Wolf 8 January 2023 16: 01
    -1
    WE LOOK AT AN IMPORTANT POST AND EXACTLY ON THE POINT !!!
    To get answers to the question: how did we get to such a life? Must have started in 1953. and answer how Stalin died and who actually was Khrushchov and TROTSKYST !!! The truth about Stalin's death has not yet been revealed, how and who were the Trotskyists and for whom did they work? wink
    Historically, the role of the MASONS has not yet been touched and does not touch, how and for whom do they work? As before the onset of Napoleon in Russia, the French language reigned between the "elite" and what was the role of the Masons in this.
    So NOBODY touched Stalin until he started to carry out the GOLDEN RUBLE project !!! Few people know about the Stalinist project GOLD RUBLE !!! This was just before his mysterious death (read murder)
    The murders of other leaders who wanted to start the GOLD STANDARD of the CURRENCY also coincide in the country, as zpr. The assassination of Gaddafi, etc.
    Until the historical truth about Stalin is revealed in Russia, Russia cannot be a FREE COUNTRY.
    Zpr. today Rusia themselves are a big producer of grain!!! but there is also a fatal dependence on the IMPORT OF SEEDS FOR GRAIN, if someone thinks that this is by chance, he is a very naive person. IN RUSSIA THERE WAS ALWAYS THE POSSIBILITY AND ABILITY TO START AND SEME AND GRAIN AND IN CLUSTER WHAT WOULD DICTATE THE WORLD PRICE OF GRAIN, but how could this not have happened?
    In the 90s, what happened in Russia or the USSR, but simply THE CONSEQUENCES OF STALIN'S DISAPPEARANCE AND THE TROTSKISTS' COMING TO POWER. "Reform" Gaidar, Chubais and the rest of the KABALISTS were aimed at destroying both Russia and the rest of the state by the collapse of the USSR. Even the former IS PLACED AND A COMPLETE CIVIL WAR AND GAOS ON THE WHOLE TERRITORY OF THE USSR.
    To POWER IN ALL THE REPUBLIC OF THE USSR came PARASITES OLIGARCHS CRIMINALS who built a system where they can rob with impunity AND THE PEOPLE AND THE STATE, from there the Abramovichs and Rosenbergs, etc. And from there, NO ONE TOUCHES THE THREAD OF POROSHEN, THE THREAD OF YATSENOK, THE THREAD OF TURCHINOV, THE THREAD OF ABRAMOVICH, THE THREAD OF ROSENBERG THE THREAD OF ZELENSKY!!!
    Let me give you an example of the Chinese when a CIA officer in 1999. marked the Chinese embassy in Belgrade as a target and bombed the building, then "it is not known" who smashed the head of this servant in the USA with a hammer, or freshly what happened to Nancy Pelosi's husband after visiting Taiwan? , also unknown people beat him in the USA in front of his house.
    Here somewhere lies the answer to the question: How did we come to this life? and why there is no Armate, Kurganets, Boomerang, apotechki, helmets, bulletproof vests, etc. , and that ochim can easily happen choo there will be not a GRAIN IF RUSSIA BEGINS TO WIN! Today, grain is bought from producers in Russia at the lowest prices, and exported to different Rozenbergs at very competitive prices, and the difference in price in the place that would be invested in the production of seeds goes to finance the yacht, billions of Abramovich, the US military-industrial complex, France, Israel, etc.
    The factory for Kurganets was sent into bankruptcy with the intention and no one gives an answer how could this happen? And even worse, Efimov IS SENT IN PRISON IN ST. PETERSBURG AND EVERYONE IS SILENT WHO DID IT AND WHAT THE INTENTIONS OF THESE TRAITORS !!!
    Russia CAN IMPORT EVERYTHING THAT IS NECESSARY FOR THE PRODUCTION OF MILITARY EQUIPMENT AND INDUSTRY THROUGH CHINA OR INDIA, etc. , and why the first question for the top does not do this, the authorities will do the same. an engine for Armate or ROAFAR for SU 57 or product 30, or a wide-body passenger aircraft with China, or for which the MS 210 is still not in the series, etc.
    There are a lot of problems, but now they are OUT OF THE EYES well and we will expose the people and they are on the surface, but everything is in order IF THEY ARE SOLVED QUICKLY!
    1. Wolf
      Wolf 8 January 2023 19: 57
      +2
      Modern plant for the production of cartridges Turkey !!!
      https://www.atesci.com/


      https://youtu.be/S9Ay0ABdLyU
      And that there was no money to create and there was no need for such a new plant, at least for hunters in a country of 150 million people and still attached to the country? And it is possible for 6-9 MONTHS!!! and the Chinese have similar equipment and THERE ARE NO SANCTIONS TO RUSSIA. , but Vanka is cheaper for Gref and cabalists, do they give birth to a woman?
    2. Yaroslav Tekkel
      Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 21: 14
      -1
      Your Caps Lock is stuck. I need to clean my keyboard.
  35. billybones
    billybones 8 January 2023 16: 40
    +5
    Four or five years ago, the Kurgan Machine-Building Plant, which produces infantry fighting vehicles, was on the verge of bankruptcy. Well, what new structurally BMPs can the plant develop and produce in this state? The question is rhetorical.
    Let's imagine that the plant would be closed, like many defense industry enterprises that would be useful now.

    https://oblast45.ru/publication/18672

    https://ura.news/news/1052616466

    https://inosmi.ru/20180420/242041264.html
  36. Alebedev
    Alebedev 8 January 2023 16: 45
    +3
    Shoigu and Putin, unfortunately, do not read the comments ...
  37. Glagol1
    Glagol1 8 January 2023 16: 48
    +8
    Another reason to remember the amusing troops and the fraud. Lies and fake stars of heroes for carpet generals = 70% of the equipment in the troops is modern. And our soldiers and officers are dying en masse on the BMP-1, T-62, etc.
  38. Radikal
    Radikal 8 January 2023 17: 29
    +2
    Quote: nils
    Quote: paul3390
    I think the reasons are banal. Knowing our current realities. Produce what you can steal more from.

    And if deeper and wider, or wider look? What if this is a deliberate policy? Ministry of Emergency Situations after Shoigu in a deep ass. Engineering equipment (read the civil defense troops) were destroyed, only a few copies remained, for television display. The next Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, the results are on the face! Fighting old equipment from storage. Flow on trailers on the roads. Minimal upgrades. Let's forget about the new one, there is no economic potential. Is over! Foreign spare parts will not help! Parades and biathlons are shiny beads for an ignorant electorate (natives). The mobilization system is broken to the ground. Or maybe there are grandiose successes somewhere in other areas, for example, in education, health care? Everything there is clearly according to the patterns of the "OST" plan, prepared in fascist Germany for implementation in the occupied territories in relation to the indigenous population. It is better to keep silent about Culture altogether. Outdid the OST multiple times. There was only one national idea left: more money, not getting into "Paradise" ahead of time and outliving Putin. As for stealing, it's nothing more than an adjective for everything else.

    Respect! good I totally agree. sad
  39. AlexWar
    AlexWar 8 January 2023 17: 56
    +3
    Our Defense Ministry did not order Boomerangs, nor did it upgrade the BMP-2.
    Even after Syria, the arms depots were empty. Putin gave the order to spend all his stocks of missiles, but the replenishment apparently did not go so fast.
    If we take Mr. Gerasimov, then he would not rest against the fact that our army needs something. He always silently came and looked and left. You watch all the videos when Gerasimov came.
    Boomerangs were ready for a long time, they just had to start releasing. You understand that the Kurgan plant is poor, they naturally did not finalize the models of equipment.
    Why should our factories be engaged in modifications and not special design bureaus, purely work according to the needs of the state, engage in constant development of technology. In the USSR, every 10 years, new tanks and infantry fighting vehicles were produced,
    Today I watched NATO infantry vehicles and today I looked at the rubbish that is in our army and came to the conclusion that we cannot defeat them.
    Military equipment, which is also modernized, should always be new models in the army. There were no boomerangs in the army; the Ministry of Defense did not like their height.
    No one drives dangerously inside our BMPs because. From Chechnya and Afghanistan, everyone rides on armor. Here you show that at least in the battle with us someone rode inside these infantry fighting vehicles. It's dangerous to burn alive there.
    Why is there no attack? Because everything is mined and no one wants to get into these infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers
    The same applies to the BTR-82, that there is no protection inside from a large caliber
  40. Vladimir Shchennikov
    Vladimir Shchennikov 8 January 2023 19: 14
    +1
    Looking at the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, in the form of fat cats and cats (with wide stripes on wide trousers and skirts), I am very glad that I have no sons and grandchildren ....
    1. Herman 4223
      Herman 4223 9 January 2023 11: 32
      -2
      Maybe if you had a son, he would become a general.
  41. Mikhail Kazakov
    Mikhail Kazakov 8 January 2023 19: 27
    -10
    the author of the article. 1. Alarmist (unless, of course, he’s a traitor or a migrant from TSYPSO. 2. I don’t understand anything from the word n ​​... I don’t understand the configuration of units of the RF Armed Forces, especially during hostilities.
    So with a sense of plainly on the example of the BMP - 1-2-3.
    And with the numbers, what the author - generally not in the tooth with his foot.
    BMP-3 in our Armed Forces of the Russian Federation (according to open data) 640 units at the time of the start of the special operation in 2022 (I won’t be talking about losses, the Ministry of Defense classified the data until the end of the war, and guessing - let the yokperds star as they like - their problems), then BMP - 2 - 3400 pieces (1500 in storage), BMP-1 - not in the troops, about 7000 (most likely 1-2 thousand less than the mk was delivered to Syria to the Donbas, etc.) - in storage.
    All infantry fighting vehicles (both two and three) are distributed, they are attached to parts of all our districts - western, southern, central, eastern. When our military personnel "went to war" - then naturally those units that "went" - went with standard weapons. Further, what we have is losses at the front (something irrevocably, something for repairs, etc.). Mobilization has begun, units are formed from reservists, they need cars. From where the armored personnel carriers go to replace - naturally FROM THE RESERVE. And as we can see - we have BMP3 in reserve - no, they go either BMP2 or BMP1. Even if there are BTR-3s in other units that do not participate in the war - NATURALLY they stay there, they are not "taken away" from them (!). Therefore, to say that the BMP3 "has ended" in our Armed Forces of the Russian Federation is bullshit.
    Further, why there are so many BMP1s in the Donbas, especially in the LNR DNR. Firstly, they are mostly trophy ones. Secondly, our Defense Ministry, with the "free" support of the countries we want to help militarily, first of all always "give away" the oldest weapons. So it was with Syria, when a n-th number of BMP-1s were transferred to them, so it was with Donbass, until it was part of the Russian Federation. There are many factors why this is so, but the main ones - 1 - they gave it away and gave it away, it practically does not affect the combat capability of the country, 2 - it’s easier for the native population to master everything, everything new usually needs to be learned / completed / retrained.
    Further, according to "ah, we all pissed off in the troops, one goes." The author, disrespected by me, just for fun - show me at least one country that has one new one in the warehouse of the old decommissioned "military iron". Well, there is Germany, storage, the USA. Let's see what's going on in the USA. Maybe there are thousands of NEW Bradleys of the latest modifications, or a bunch of the most modern mraps. And let's see what's there - in sishiei, again from open data. We look and see - baa armored coffin M113, the beginning of production in 1960 (!!!!) of the year. In the USA, 24 thousand of them were produced, then they were written off and tried to "shove" them under whatever contracts they could (whom they didn’t sell the current), but for sure they still are available. And why do we know this - because after the new year, the United States announced a NEW supply of weapons to benders, including 113 pieces of M100. Curtain.
    And now, in the manner of an author (and why are we boars, he can) - about the THAT side about the Ukrainian military-industrial complex.
    Have driven!
    Sometimes with our Ukrainian military-industrial complex - it's better not to know the date! For a year now we have been at war with the damned Muscovites - and things are getting worse and worse. Where are our Cossacks - all pros, where drag the modernized T62 - pros, where ours delivered from the former Soviet countries BMP1 - pros, where our Patrol-shame - pros. Proo, in general, all the weapons, now there is hope - the current is for the NATO countries and for that shit in 1960 that they are sending us.
    I'll finish on the sim.
    1. cast iron
      cast iron 8 January 2023 20: 11
      +10
      Did you invite the author to see what the United States has with BMPs? Why did they remember the M113. Let's better just see how many MODERN infantry fighting vehicles they have now? In suddenly it turns out that THOUSANDS of pieces. Those. in Russia, the army is equipped with antiques of the 60s and 500-600 BMP-3s, and for stupid Americans, ALL BMPs are BREDLEY. Well, i.e. obviously more modern than the BMP 2, which is the main one in the Russian army. Moreover, modern Bradley modifications are BETTER in terms of combat capabilities than the BMP-3. CICS, surveillance systems, communications and armor protection of the latest American Bradley modifications are BETTER than those of the BMP-3. And their number is MORE than the BMP-3. Checkmate. Conclusion. Our army rides on ANTIQUES of the 60-70s of the 20th century. This is a concrete fact. You can't dispute it with anything.
    2. cold wind
      cold wind 9 January 2023 00: 02
      +2
      Uh, what does the M113 armored personnel carrier have to do with it? He has better armor than all of our armored personnel carriers and BMP-1/2, armament does not play a role because he is an armored vehicle. But why they are supplied so little is really a mystery. Such equipment is needed there, our people love it very much as a trophy, especially modifications with enhanced armor.
      1. Negro
        Negro 9 January 2023 10: 07
        +3
        Quote from cold wind
        But why they supply so few of them is really a mystery.

        There, of course, they started very slowly, but slowly swaying. There were 400 cars, out of the bottom 200 from the Americans, they give another 100 in a new package. It seems that the Italians promise to connect, so maybe after Ramstein they will give them more. Plus, it is necessary to establish service already - this is apparently also for the Italians.
      2. Herman 4223
        Herman 4223 9 January 2023 11: 12
        +1
        M113 is better armored? Are you sure? As a car weighing 10 tons and larger in size, it can be better armored than a BMP-1 weighing 13 tons and more compact.
        1. cold wind
          cold wind 9 January 2023 13: 22
          +3
          Absolutely sure. Naturally, I'm talking about those M113 and BMP-1/2 that are at the front.
          1. Herman 4223
            Herman 4223 10 January 2023 14: 39
            0
            Your video says nothing at all. How was the shelling carried out, from what distance, at what angle, or maybe it was not shelling, but fragments from a shell?
            There is no need to invent anything. The classic M113 without additional armor can withstand a 12.7 mm machine gun in frontal armor but from a distance of more than 200 meters. In the sides, the protection is twice as thin. In the video, by the way, there is a car where there are holes for bolts for additional protection, but there is no protection itself, for Russian fools it will do.
    3. Negro
      Negro 9 January 2023 10: 10
      +7
      Quote: Mikhail Kazakov
      Sometimes with our Ukrainian military-industrial complex - it's better not to know the date! For a year now we have been at war with the damned Muscovites - and things are getting worse and worse. Where are our Cossacks - all pros, where drag the modernized T62 - pros, where ours delivered from the former Soviet countries BMP1 - pros, where our Patrol-shame - pros. Proo, in general, all the weapons, now there is hope - the current is for the NATO countries and for that shit in 1960 that they are sending us.

      What is it, dear friend? Did the Nazis and drug addicts not prepare to attack Russia?

      What do you think the Supreme Commander-in-Chief is fooling the people?
    4. Herman 4223
      Herman 4223 9 January 2023 11: 30
      -5
      Everything is clearly marked. You can also add that it is difficult to find footage where our military people drive the BTR-80/70, for example. Basically, the BTR-82A flashes everywhere. Hundreds of BMP-3s purchased. So rearmament went on as usual. To scold the army for the fact that it is developing and testing equipment is generally nonsense. But what to do, such are the authors on military review.
      1. cast iron
        cast iron 12 January 2023 04: 52
        0
        The BTR82 is no different from the BTR80 in terms of convenience and protection. They do not have a thermal imager, as far as I know. In general, a very strange modernization is the installation of an autocannon on a cardboard armored personnel carrier. They are now used in cities in battles, although they are not intended for this. But they are used, because they have an autocannon.
  42. vh48905
    vh48905 8 January 2023 19: 36
    +4
    BMP-1AM "Basurmanin", in terms of the combat module, drank the dough with special cynicism.
    1. Yaroslav Tekkel
      Yaroslav Tekkel 12 January 2023 21: 22
      +2
      Also the name is awesome. Just the thing for the friendship of peoples in a multinational state. It was necessary to make a whole line: BMP "Basurmanin", tank "Zhidovin", self-propelled gun "Chukhonets", armored car "Frya Zamorskaya".
  43. EFIM LYUBIN
    EFIM LYUBIN 8 January 2023 21: 08
    +2
    How is it nothing? And a successful cut of the military budget, and hung with orders and medals (it is not known what "combat" merits) parade-parquet mediocre generals! This is power! And especially parade models of weapons (Wunderwaffe) under the slogan - "there are no analogues in the world"! Lord, when will honest people be in power in Russia? Or is the power vertical built on the basis of corruption?
  44. Sergei N 58912062
    Sergei N 58912062 8 January 2023 21: 25
    +4
    I won’t even write about dynamic protection, everything is not so simple with it, and artisanal modernizations in the troops are more likely to pose a danger to their crews. But if the DZ system for the BMP-21, created 3 years ago, has not been adopted for service and is supplied by the manufacturer every year as a novelty, then what can we say about the thin-skinned BMP-2?

    Back in the early 2000s, we developed a remote sensing system for our light armored vehicles.

    The Research Institute of Steel has developed a mounted modernization complex for the BMP-2.

    The Arabs bought our BMP-3 from our own DZ.

    We have a lot of things and at the same time we don’t have them for our army. And all because we have, as always

    1. Sergey Venediktov
      Sergey Venediktov 9 January 2023 21: 38
      +4
      It is better to distribute money to the oligarchs than to spend money on upgrading the passive protection of floating infantry fighting vehicles. First you need to decide why a tin can is needed to transport drugs to the front line, which does not provide any protection to the infantry on the battlefield. Then it's better to bring suicide bombers in trucks that have a metal box with a machine gun or on shahid-mobiles with machine guns and light armor. For the price of a BMP-3, you can buy 30 UAZ-patriots.
      1. cast iron
        cast iron 12 January 2023 04: 47
        +1
        By the way, a great idea for our MO. Kurganets is not needed, BMP3s and BMP2 upgrades are not needed. You need to buy a lot of UAZ Hunters, weld on them boxes with machine guns and benches for personnel. Each UAZ will fit 6-7 guards paratroopers. And that's how you go into battle.
  45. vindigo
    vindigo 8 January 2023 23: 18
    +2
    I watched the performance characteristics of our armor-piercing shells for a 30 mm gun. 3UBR6 and 3UBR8. Sadness and sadness compared to shells for 25 mm Bushmaster Bradley. I also read about 3UBR11, but they write that they are not in the army. All hope is in the confrontation with Bradley for ATGMs with tandem warheads.
    1. Sergey Venediktov
      Sergey Venediktov 9 January 2023 22: 29
      -2
      So ATGMs, if you don’t steal, but do it cheaply and you can simply plan 20-30 times more than all the tanks and infantry fighting vehicles in NATO. As long as they don’t have KAZ, we have a chance: we put all the infantry on UAZ Patriots with a reservation for the driver’s seat (300kg) and an armored machine gunner’s seat (300kg) for a total of 600 kg at a price of 200 rubles per kg.
  46. Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 8 January 2023 23: 22
    0
    In general, not upgrading the BMP 2 is a crime. A set of additional armor was still in the USSR, cornets were serial, brains and installations were put on the Tiger (which are also not visible on the chronicle). There are not so many pieces of 2ek, during the “skating around exhibitions” it was possible to modernize everything. In general, my personal opinion is that this wonderful module needs a new 35-45 mm autocannon and you can destroy everything and put it on the BMP3 too (adjusted for the thickness of the tower.
    1. Devil13
      Devil13 9 January 2023 01: 47
      -2
      And why is an infantry fighting vehicle needed in the 21st century, which pierces 12,7mm in a circle, 14 and 23, and even more so 30mm, are already sewn right through?

      Old tanks, as was done in Israel, could long ago be converted into infantry fighting vehicles with a good level of protection.
      But figurines to you
      1. Zaurbek
        Zaurbek 9 January 2023 09: 31
        0
        They exist and there are many of them, do you plan to produce 20-5 thousand cars every 10 years? Here comes the (large-scale) war, make the BMP-3M thousand 5. The Americans have the M113 in storage, Bradley has been modernized from 113, Bradley herself has been modernized for the 4th time. And only in the last 10 years there has been a competition for a new BMP.
        1. cast iron
          cast iron 9 January 2023 19: 05
          +4
          Imagine that in a normal army everyone does this. They produce thousands of pieces of equipment, use them for 20-30 years, and simultaneously modernize them. And then they are quickly replaced with more modern models, which are multiple times superior to outdated equipment in terms of efficiency. The bradley of the first issues has practically nothing to do with the bradley of the latest modernization. The armor is completely different, the CICS is completely different, the surveillance systems are the most modern, the communications are the most modern. The engine is different. Even the layout of the cabin for the landing was changed. Do we have something similar for the BMP-2? Not? Well, here's the same thing. Moreover, in the United States, tests of equipment to replace Bradley are in full swing. And don't tell tales about the M113. They were withdrawn from the army units long ago. Moreover, Bradley was never a development of the M113. Designed from scratch BMP.
          Everything is so simple with you: "here the war has come - make BMP-3M 5 thousand pieces." Who will make them? You? At what power? You know that Kurganmashzavod will not master such a production plan even when working in 3 shifts around the clock. Do we still have factories that are capable of producing 500 BMP3M units annually? Not? And where are they? And I'll tell you where. Bankrupt and demolished for the construction of shopping centers, warehouses and high-rise buildings. That is the whole result of bourgeois capitalist power over the last 31 years of government.
  47. Bratkov Oleg
    Bratkov Oleg 8 January 2023 23: 37
    +2
    But we have the best tank biathlon in the world!
    Useless? But it's beautiful!
  48. Devil13
    Devil13 9 January 2023 01: 44
    +2
    And they didn’t buy these combat modules, mask kits, and didn’t repair cars, and didn’t buy new ones, sawing grandmas, the same n * d * r * sy)
    So you shouldn't be surprised.
  49. Stepych
    Stepych 9 January 2023 10: 26
    -5
    The author did not see how dz works?
    You can even hang it on a jeep, the car will survive an RPG hit
  50. heber
    heber 9 January 2023 10: 34
    +4
    The main task of our generals at all levels was to line their pockets, because 90% of them got into their positions either through pull or for "skidding". I think the beginning of our SVO proved this to almost everyone.
    1. Sergei 777
      Sergei 777 9 January 2023 21: 06
      0
      These are the problems of any peacetime army. If you write down the names of all our army commanders in 1941 on a line and follow their path to 1945, you will see that 70% did not move up.