Military Review

Special operation lessons: UAV production lines in Russia are busier than ever

207
Special operation lessons: UAV production lines in Russia are busier than ever

The special military operation showed that there is a whole group of military-technical areas where our country had a serious, and sometimes critical, lag behind its opponents. One of these areas is unmanned aerial vehicles, both aviation and marine. You can say as much as you like that for the same UAVs we were “ahead of the rest of the planet”, you can engage in hat-taking as much as you like, but the fact remains: already at the first stage of the NMD, the needs of the Russian Armed Forces in the field of reconnaissance, and even more so strike drones, including drones - "kamikaze" were far from satisfied. And in terms of unmanned aviation Turkish “Bayraktars” of the Armed Forces of Ukraine literally reigned on the fronts of the NMD.


At the same time, you can sprinkle ashes on your head as much as you like, stating that the aviation unmanned industry in the country is completely crossed out from production realities, that drones “if there are, then they are entirely Iranian or Chinese”, that we only know how to re-stick stickers and outweigh tags, but the fact in the fact that since the beginning of the SVO, the volume of production of UAVs in Russia has increased manifold. The production lines are busy like never before.

During the 9 months of the special operation for a number of items, the production of drones by Russian companies not only surpassed the rates that were demonstrated before February 24 (and it was not surprising to surpass them), but exceeded the number of drones produced often over 4-5 years by the same companies. Today, the multifunctional reconnaissance Orlans-10 are literally put on the conveyor. Their production has grown exponentially. Percussion "Lancets", which in the spring were a real curiosity for the fronts of a special military operation, today "make a rustle" in the camp of the enemy. Since the beginning of October alone, thanks to the use of Lancets, Russian troops have destroyed over 600 enemy soldiers and up to a company of mercenaries, hit 14 American M777 howitzers, at least 9 field ammunition depots, 4 counter-battery combat stations, 6 air defense installations, including radars of anti-aircraft missile systems C -300, more than three dozen Soviet-style towed guns and howitzers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

Over four hundred uses of the Geran-2 UAV, which the enemy continues to call the Iranian Shaheds 136, have been recorded, but these are the problems of the enemy. He can call these drones whatever he likes, but, being produced in Russia, they have already managed to inflict enormous damage on the enemy’s infrastructure, both in the rear and in the frontline zone. The damage inflicted on the enemy by Geranium-2 alone since the beginning of their use is estimated at no less than $3 billion. And this is according to the estimates of the Ukrainian side. In reality, this figure, if guided by the scale of underestimation of losses by the Kyiv regime, is just right to be multiplied by at least 2.

Thus, lessons are learned. Slowly? The question is open. But the fact that we learn from mistakes is a fact. This means that the prospect of the development of the unmanned industry is far from being an ordinary phrase and not an empty phrase.
207 comments
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  1. aleksr2005
    aleksr2005 9 December 2022 16: 11
    +4
    How about this note:

    The West continues to disguise its weapons as nano-designed by Ukraine, so as not to raise the stakes in the confrontation with Russia. First, the cruiser Moscow was sunk, and they decided to salute the Poseidon missiles, which had not been used for several months since the start of the war, but here it was such luck. Then the liberation of Snake Island, where everyone was told about the accuracy of Ukrainian artillery, and later accurate strikes on command posts and warehouses. Next, attacks on airfields in Crimea began, and now a new stage in the miracle of Ukrainian technology, stealth drones capable of flying thousands of kilometers unnoticed by radars and air defense. Moreover, it is clear to everyone that only modern drones using satellite navigation could fly with such accuracy, but everyone claims old swifts .......

    Ukraine attacked Russian airfields with modified Tu-141 Strizh drones - Politico

    The publication reports this with reference to two Ukrainian sources familiar with the details of operations at bases in Engels and the Ryazan region.

    It is noted that the technologies with which the Soviet drones were modified are Ukrainian-made, and not supplied by the United States or other countries.

    These kinds of improvements demonstrate the ability of the Ukrainian defense industry to innovate, while the Russian Federation is forced to buy cheap Iranian drones to wage war.

    As one of the interlocutors told the publication, the surprise effect was the key factor, because the Russian Federation did not expect such actions from Ukraine.
    1. Orange Bigg
      Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 16: 15
      +10
      Well, of course, the Tu-141 Strizh is still those 40-year-old innovations. And in our country, as always, until the thunder breaks out, the peasant will not cross himself.
      1. Quote Lavrov
        Quote Lavrov 9 December 2022 16: 20
        +29
        It's too early to rush. So far, "acceleration" is noticeable in peppy articles, mostly. That's when it will be systemic, tangible and on the flow - then it will be seen whether something has changed dramatically or not
        1. skeptick2
          skeptick2 9 December 2022 17: 07
          +10
          Quote: Quote Lavrov
          So far, "acceleration" is noticeable in peppy articles

          Right. For some reason, these peppy articles do not add vigor. What does "production increased many times over" mean? What is this all about? Can't you give specific numbers? Is this a military secret? OK, give me a percentage. Then at least something will become clear. In general, such military secrets, apparently, are a secret only for Russians.
          And what does it mean "Today the multifunctional reconnaissance Orlans-10 are literally put on the conveyor"? Yes, they should have been put on stream at least a decade ago. Then we would not have entered the war in fact without the required number of UAVs. After all, it is a shame and disgrace - the second army in the world to beg for drones from Iran! And glue the label "Geranium" on them. Who are we deceiving?
          But the main thing is not even that. The main thing is that the CBO really forces us to draw practical conclusions. Moreover, on different sides. I don’t know how the production of UAVs will continue in Russia, although there is little hope for the best (today’s article by Skomorokhov on this topic does not inspire optimism). Moreover, in the conditions of the most severe sanctions and a shortage of components.
          But I have no doubt that the West also drew the right conclusions. I have no doubt that the production of drones (which was not there before) will now go (or is it already going?) By leaps and bounds. And a large part of these products will be in the possession of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Moreover, Ukraine itself does not even have to produce them, it will get everything anyway. And this is annoying, because the only question is time.
          So the lessons of the special operation - they are learned by both sides. And I'm afraid that soon we will have to worry not so much about our production of drones, but about protection from them.
          1. polar fox
            polar fox 10 December 2022 06: 09
            +4
            Quote from: skeptick2
            What does "production increased many times over" mean? What is this all about? Can't you give specific numbers?

            it's like sales of Rolls-Royces in the 90s ... increased by 1000% (for the previous year - 1 car, for the new one - 10 ... so it is here.
      2. DymOk_v_dYmke
        DymOk_v_dYmke 9 December 2022 16: 35
        -2
        Quote from Orange Bigg
        And in our country, as always, until the thunder breaks out, the peasant does not cross himself.

        An ordinary man is not enough.
        There must be a powerful man, and precisely muzhik.
      3. Bingo
        Bingo 9 December 2022 17: 25
        +10
        Quote from Orange Bigg
        Before that, everything seemed to suit everyone.

        Do not repeat stupid things after Skomorokhov. In Ukraine, there is the FIRST war in the world, where UAVs are massively used by army to army, and EVERYONE turned out to be unprepared for reality. In the WHOLE world, remember - a year ago all the screams about UAVs were about Bayraktars and swarms, and now they showed complete fucking uselessness - give Maviki and Gerani. Tell me, which army has Maviks in service? And Gerani, except for Iran and the Russian Federation?
        That's why they say - the war plan will show
        1. Orange Bigg
          Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 17: 50
          +5
          And Gerani, except for Iran and the Russian Federation?
          That's why they say - the war plan will show


          In truth, Iran created its Shaheeds as a kind of symbiosis of Israeli Harpy and Harop. And Harop is armed with the same Azerbaijan. But apparently our experience of the Second Karabakh War was not fully taken into account. Iran just needed more reliable, simple and, as a result, cheaper drones. So they created in Iran more simplified versions of Harop in the form of Shaheeds-136, for themselves, so to speak, for their technical capabilities and so as not to be expensive.

          give Maviki and Gerani.

          That's exactly what we are used to give and buy and sell, and the experience of the USSR where do-it-yourself is somehow not honored with us. Do you have Maviki and Geranium in your hands? Yes. So at least at the first stage, as China and Iran used to do, copy them and establish production and you will be happy.
          1. Bingo
            Bingo 9 December 2022 18: 55
            +3
            Quote from Orange Bigg
            and the experience of the USSR where do it yourself with us is somehow not honored

            Maviks are household appliances, JUST they didn’t exist in the USSR at all ... You think in the Garage they took a scene from the ceiling in a lump "6 tracks ... Stereophony ... It will leave in a moment." And in general, it was the USSR that screwed up with the UAV, having gone into a dead end branch of jet strategists who were not useful in principle, a dead end branch.
            And now with the UAV - well, an ordinary situation, forever - "the plan lives up to the first battle." Now we just found out what exactly is needed from the UAV. Now we have started the second stage - how to do it with us. It is the localization of production, since there are ready-made solutions - and it is precisely along the path of the USSR with, for example, AvtoVAZ, the plant is not Soviet, but localized
            1. Alemax
              Alemax 9 December 2022 22: 21
              +5
              And in general, it was the USSR that screwed up with the UAV, having gone into a dead end branch of jet strategists who were not useful in principle, a dead end branch.

              And what about strategic aviation? UAVs were also in the USSR. The issue is the filling used. Microelectronics was not very "micro" in the Union, and therefore this direction did not develop in terms of "portability". And, if it comes to that, it was not the USSR that clicked the UAV, but the current Russian Federation, which clicked the moment of development of ITS production of microchips and compact household appliances, the boom of which began in the late 80s and continued in subsequent decades.
            2. certero
              certero 10 December 2022 16: 45
              +5
              Quote from Bingo
              in general, it was the USSR that screwed up with the UAV, having gone into a dead end branch of jet strategists who were not useful in principle, a dead end branch.

              The USSR was just ahead of the rest on drones. If a big war had begun then, it was precisely such reconnaissance apparatuses that would have played a huge role.
              If the Soviet Union existed now, I guarantee that drones of all types and types in the Soviet army would be dofiga.
              Actually, all the cartoons that we see used in Ukraine are a Soviet legacy.
          2. Kurva18
            Kurva18 10 December 2022 23: 38
            0
            Copying is good for second and third world countries, but not for a country with nuclear weapons.
      4. Alemax
        Alemax 9 December 2022 22: 13
        +2
        Well, of course, the Tu-141 Strizh is still those 40-year-old innovations.


        Come on!
        How much is this? 60 years or 70?
    2. Quote Lavrov
      Quote Lavrov 9 December 2022 16: 17
      +7
      Quote: aleksr2005
      As one of the interlocutors told the publication, the key factor was surprise effect, because the Russian Federation did not expect such actions from Ukraine

      ...still would !!! It's 2-3 days of NWO ...
      1. Guran33 Sergey
        Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 16: 36
        -11
        The air defense of the air base, so that whoever writes intercepted these cruise missiles .. Move the next move further from the runway so that the planning debris does not reach the target. And a continuous air defense field in the western direction is not yet financed by our country
        1. Neo-9947
          Neo-9947 9 December 2022 16: 48
          +1
          Have you personally seen how the air defense of the air base was intercepted?
          What did they intercept if the wreckage fell exactly on the planes? Certainly not a ground-to-air missile. Not otherwise, a fighter from a Kalash tower gave a turn when he saw what a fool was flying at him.
          1. Guran33 Sergey
            Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 17: 04
            -11
            An employee of the TsIPiSO, you must know one hundred warhead "swift2" carries half a ton of explosives and rebar scraps, about one and a half times more powerful than TNT, and the damage to the fuel truck and aircraft (which suffered not from an explosion but from a fire) does not have explosive damage
            1. Neo-9947
              Neo-9947 9 December 2022 17: 21
              +5
              First, show me, an employee of the TsIPi SO, a fuel truck.
              And secondly, why did something crash where it flew?
              By the way, the video explosion is pretty decent.
              1. Guran33 Sergey
                Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 17: 36
                -6
                Not an explosion, but a fire, in another picture the cab of a fuel truck was visible with something crumpled to one side and burnt flaps and engine nozzles and not a single explosive fragmentation damage
                1. Neo-9947
                  Neo-9947 9 December 2022 17: 57
                  +5
                  So in that picture it’s not a fuel truck, but APA-80.
                  That's what I'm talking about. What then so zhahnulo half-screen.
                  1. Guran33 Sergey
                    Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 18: 15
                    -3
                    But it also has something to burn, from a 200 liter tank, especially if it is half empty, then it can give that flash to the equipment
            2. bayard
              bayard 11 December 2022 09: 20
              0
              Quote: Guran33 Sergey
              you must know one hundred warhead "swift2" carries half a ton of explosives and rebar scraps, about one and a half times more powerful than TNT

              What are fantasies? The "Swift" does not have a standard warhead, it is a reconnaissance UAV. And the warhead that he managed to compose was shoved into the place of reconnaissance equipment. The weight of warheads was called by them - 70 - 75 kg.
              And where did the fantasies with "rebar scraps" come from?
              About the UAV "downed over the airfield", most likely fantasies, and this "Swift" caused damage to the strategists and the airfield.
              THREE airfields!
              Hence the conclusion - our air defense does not provide control of low \ extremely low altitudes, the route for them ("Swifts") was obviously laid by the Americans - bypassing the visibility zones of on-duty air defense systems according to their own satellite and RTR facilities.
              The Armed Forces of Ukraine may have about a hundred such Swifts in warehouses, not counting the smaller Flights. Without an American navigation system, such UAVs had no chance of success. But now these chances are and will be.
              So I congratulate you on the next Overton window that has opened - a strike on the strategic nuclear forces of the RF Armed Forces. Will there be a blow \ ry to the centers that made the decisions?
              Not .
              Get lost in concern.
              1. Osipov9391
                Osipov9391 12 December 2022 03: 50
                -1
                And what about the radio altimeters on these very Swifts and Flights?
                For bending the terrain.
                Radio altimeters from cruise missiles for example.
                In the CIS, only one enterprise in Kamensk-Uralsky does such things, and these are highly specialized radio altimeters for KR and UAVs.

                But the devil is in the details. Ukraine can easily produce such products on its own in a full cycle - there is everything.
                Or use stockpiles, for example, taken from X-55 missiles when they were cut.

                As for satellite navigation, such gadgets are available to everyone who knows a lot about how to use them.
                Interface pick up and pairing with on-board equipment.

                The best such gadget in Russia today is this one http://i-progress.tech/products/navigatsiya/priemniki/pro-04-navigatsionniy-priemnik/
                Its modification was invented more than 10 years ago and was then made at the Vladimir
                "Avtopribore" under the name GeoS.
                But this one (goes for UAVs and KR) works immediately with 3 systems - Russian, European and American.
                1. bayard
                  bayard 12 December 2022 12: 16
                  0
                  Quote: Osipov9391
                  And what about the radio altimeters on these very Swifts and Flights?

                  Actually, in the performance characteristics of the "Strizh" it is indicated that it is capable of flying at an altitude of 300 m and descending and flying at 50 m, and this is WWI. So they definitely could not do without an altimeter.
                  Moreover, the Ukrainian anti-ship missile "Neptune" flies at an altitude of 50 m or less, so the Sumerians have altimeters.
                  Quote: Osipov9391
                  warehouse stocks, for example, taken from X-55 missiles when they were cut.

                  These are in unknown condition. But I'm sure that everything they lack will be provided by their curators and will help with pairing. So I don't see much of a problem with that.
                  Quote: Osipov9391
                  Ukraine can easily produce such products on its own in a full cycle - there is everything.

                  They can not only use the existing stocks of Soviet-made reconnaissance UAVs, but also organize the production of their own "Neptunes" with an increased range. Her warhead is 160 kg. , and this is more than that of the modified Swift.
                  Yes, and the United States has already approved the supply of longer-range ammunition to the Chimeras - with a warhead in the form of a planning bomb. And they were allowed to strike at the Russian Federation at their discretion.
                  The unfulfilled threats of the towers convinced the US that the Russian Federation would not dare.
                  1. Osipov9391
                    Osipov9391 12 December 2022 13: 55
                    -1
                    I meant to independently produce radio altimeters for UAVs and cruise missiles based on old Soviet or captured Russian ones from downed missiles.
                    CNC milling machine, printed circuit board production and soldering of all this can be organized in any basement if the profile factories are destroyed or de-energized.
                    Microcircuits (Kiev "Kvazar"), connectors (Poltava) and so on, they made themselves in a full cycle.
                    Disruptive connectors (for missiles and anti-ship missiles, mating launchers and missiles) is also their credo, almost the only enterprise in the CIS that produces them.
                    In general, there is everything.

                    And about the American radio altimeters, the Tomahawk and Harpoon have such a radio altimeter: https://mbtelectronics.com/apn-194
          2. ism_ek
            ism_ek 9 December 2022 17: 14
            +4
            Quote: Neo-9947
            Have you personally seen how the air defense of the air base was intercepted?

            There was a video from Ryazan https://t.me/rybar/41711
            Satellite images of Engels clearly show that the wreckage of the UAV fell
        2. Al manah
          Al manah 9 December 2022 16: 52
          +7
          Intercepted OVER the base? Stunned what efficiency, it takes pride ...
          1. topol717
            topol717 9 December 2022 17: 05
            +8
            Yes, and a no brainer, there was no interception, to inflict maximum damage, the HE shell exploded at a height of 10 meters from the ground. Ours and decided the type did not fall, so we shot down.
          2. Guran33 Sergey
            Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 17: 09
            -10
            Well, again, the sofa was shot down about 10-15 kilometers away, just the wreckage sometimes has aerodynamic quality and one so "successfully" fell on a fuel truck killing technicians
            1. Al manah
              Al manah 9 December 2022 18: 52
              +3
              The bureaucratic propaganda brethren might have appreciated the attempts of the applicant for the Order of Munchausen, but not me ...
              1. Guran33 Sergey
                Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 19: 20
                -4
                The wreckage of MH 17 scattered within a radius of 20 kilometers from the place where the rocket hit 90% in a cone of 8 km.
              2. runway-1
                runway-1 9 December 2022 20: 01
                +1
                This is not a contender, but a holder of the Order of Munchausen! lol
        3. alexoff
          alexoff 9 December 2022 20: 53
          -1
          The air defense of the air base intercepted, and in Saki a dozen aircraft were not either seriously damaged or destroyed. And in Berdyansk, air defense intercepted a "point-y" right above the fuel storage, after which one ship sank, and the second received considerable damage. And the Armed Forces of Ukraine bombarded Novaya Kakhovka with hurricanes and hemars, almost everything was intercepted, but a couple of missiles flew, although it is absolutely incomprehensible how hurricanes could get it.
    3. dmi.pris1
      dmi.pris1 9 December 2022 16: 48
      +3
      About Poseidon missiles in more detail, pzhsta ... And about UAVs? Look, the Taiwanese Chinese began to make a copy of Geranium or Shahid, as you like. These devices look like each other, like twins. However, the fact remains- only "a fried rooster pecked in one place" made the industry stir.
      1. Boa kaa
        Boa kaa 9 December 2022 19: 38
        +5
        Quote: dmi.pris
        the fact remains that only a "fried rooster pecking in one place" made the industry stir.

        What's with the UAC? There were developments and proposals, but there were no orders from the Moscow Region! NVO forced to wake up fat cats from the Ministry of Defense, which are responsible for providing UAV troops. There were orders - the work began to boil! As always, it has happened before. Therefore, all claims are against our "clairvoyants", who were going to fight with grandfather's means and methods, who did not draw conclusions from the Armenian-Azeri war in a timely manner.
        Somehow, however.
        AHA.
        1. alexoff
          alexoff 9 December 2022 20: 59
          -1
          Did it really boil? I would like to look at satellite images of some airfield, where there would be at least five Orions. And they drew conclusions, back in 2008 they did, they gave 5 billion for the "stork" Vega, more than for Orion and Altius combined. They made it then in just a year, but it crashed and that’s it, it didn’t work out, we parted ways, and somehow others began to do it ...
    4. topol717
      topol717 9 December 2022 17: 07
      +5
      Quote: aleksr2005
      These kinds of improvements demonstrate the ability of the Ukrainian defense industry to innovate, while the Russian Federation is forced to buy cheap Iranian drones to wage war.

      Doesn't show anything at all.
      Remake 2 UAVs, and attach a fee from Ali to them for 2 bucks, any student of a specialized university will do such a thing for you in a place of laboratory work.
      1. alexoff
        alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 01
        +1
        But we won’t be able to do this - after all, we need to protect the technical project, test for at least a year, check the board at -50C, then redo it, then another year of testing, then the recommendation to adopt and that’s it, it doesn’t appear in purchases
        1. topol717
          topol717 9 December 2022 21: 49
          0
          10 pieces and ours can do it in the garage, but who will be responsible if Geranium flew to Poland? As you can see, this did not happen, which means that all PSI were carried out correctly. And when shooting at Ryazan it is impossible to miss. And if he flies to Poland, you can always blame Russia.
          1. alexoff
            alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 57
            -2
            So that the geranium does not fly away to Poland, I would suggest calling it a "bandera" and painting it in a yellow-black color, pasted a photo of Biden on one wing, and McCain on the other. It will quickly leave the media, they will be embarrassed to put it on public display simply
    5. NOMADE
      NOMADE 9 December 2022 17: 35
      -1
      To your regret, "Moscow" is not a "combat" loss, but most likely a coincidence, detonation, false start of an air defense system
      1. topol717
        topol717 9 December 2022 21: 52
        -4
        Quote: NOMADE
        To your regret, "Moscow" is not a "combat" loss

        They sank and thank God, the crew is alive, and no one needs a 50-year-old jalopy. In general, this fleet crap there to the fullest, and it would be better if it continued to stand in Sevastopol and go out to parades. Even the control of the grain deal cannot provide. His civilian ships are ATTACKING.
        1. NOMADE
          NOMADE 11 December 2022 09: 47
          +1
          About the crew, you shouldn't say that. Pity people, fathers, sons!
      2. Beaver
        Beaver 10 December 2022 14: 05
        -2
        Well, if we assume that they hit her with harpoons, but she never started the battle, then yes, a non-combat loss.
    6. ilya.muromczev2013
      ilya.muromczev2013 10 December 2022 00: 26
      +1
      Soviet reconnaissance drones Swifts were produced (including) IN KHARKOV, in Ukraine! It is not surprising that they remained there in some numbers, as did the people who worked in rocket science. There are no innovations (as well as "thousands of kilometers of range") there, they modernized it a little (not without the help of Western specialists), and that's it. The only question is how they can (and who will give them) to mass-produce them, because this is a rather difficult to manufacture, jet-powered UAV.
      As for the span, and the fact that our air defense did not notice them. IT IS NOT A FACT that they didn’t notice (they were shot down, after all) .. It’s not a fact that they were launched from the territory of Ukraine. There will be a "debriefing", there will be facts, and there will be conclusions - then you can talk about something. In general, it would be strange if the enemy, who is supplied by "the whole civilized world" - would not answer at all. But, if so, in a normal way to argue: the answer with one blow to a hundred of ours is more for the report of the authorities, for PR, but from a military point of view, this is about nothing ...
    7. flicker
      flicker 10 December 2022 11: 49
      0
      As one of the interlocutors told the publication, the surprise effect was the key factor, because the Russian Federation did not expect such actions from Ukraine.
      But these "surprises" open up new opportunities for us - and we have learned to use such "surprises" quite well.
      The terrorist attack on the Crimean bridge - the answer: the energy collapse of Ukraine. The bridge has almost been restored, and the energy system of Ukraine is breathing its last. And this is now the problem of the West.
      So who got hurt the most?

      I think that we have not yet answered for attempts to attack our airfields, but we will definitely answer - so the West must tense up and think carefully (after all, we can help the Palestinians ... with captured weapons).
    8. Submariner971
      Submariner971 10 December 2022 14: 54
      0
      Poseidon was apparently confused with Neptune ... It was Strizh with a modernized control system via the GPS navigation channel that was identified from the wreckage. If this were not so, a nuclear war would not have been started either, but the howl of the Foreign Ministry would have been carried all the way to the UN.
    9. Eroma
      Eroma 10 December 2022 20: 10
      0
      Quote: aleksr2005
      Moreover, it is clear to everyone that only modern drones using satellite navigation could fly with such accuracy, but everyone claims old swifts .......

      The Houthis just as effectively gouged an oil refinery in Saudi Arabia with some kind of junk. So navigation is not a problem, you can shove it into any UAV.
      With regards to the models, at the airfield, the wreckage must have considered that the device gasped.
      I am somehow more interested in the state of air defense of strategic aviation airfields! Sudden blow we will easily miss it turns out? belay
  2. Quote Lavrov
    Quote Lavrov 9 December 2022 16: 14
    +21
    I see no reason to be happy with such an article.
    On the contrary, I have 2 simple questions:
    1. And why weren't these lines loaded 24/7 for several years before the start of the operation?
    2. Did any of the perpetrators described in paragraph 1 suffer an effective punishment?
    1. CirclePit
      CirclePit 9 December 2022 16: 22
      +3
      1. For the current command, for the last time, the UAV operator was a typical "doing something with computers" employee, clicking on buttons and twirling a joystick. Only after the echnika had shown itself in practice, and even more than once, some conclusions flew over the hat and made.
      2. A rhetorical question in Russian realities, the answer to which is usually something ironic.
    2. Orange Bigg
      Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 16: 24
      +1
      And why are these lines not yet at the planning stage of the NWO before the start of the operation were loaded 24/7 for several years?


      Probably no one imagined that the SVO would take on such a scale and temporal scope. They hoped for something like ala Crimea 2014 or, at worst, the Donbass of the February 2015 model, and here it is how it turned out. In fact, the Third Patriotic War turned out (the first and second began respectively in 1812 and 1941). For many, Merkel's statement about why the West needed Minsk-2 was a revelation. It was naively believed that the West would honestly comply with the agreements, even to the detriment of its interests.
      1. Quote Lavrov
        Quote Lavrov 9 December 2022 16: 30
        +2
        That's why there is question # 2 - with the same essence, but only wider than about the perpetrators of the issue with the UAV ...
        And the answer to this question is the same - all the same, in + - the same places.
        This means that questions and problems are not analyzed, they are not solved systematically and deeply, but only holes are plugged in an emergency.
        1. Orange Bigg
          Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 16: 34
          -6
          Well, the leadership of the NWO has been changed. And now it’s probably not the time to change the system in a revolutionary way, it needs to be evolutionary. They don’t change horses at the crossing.
          1. alekseykabanets
            alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 16: 44
            +3
            Quote from Orange Bigg
            Crossing horses do not change

            What do they do with dead horses?
            1. Irokez
              Irokez 9 December 2022 17: 04
              +1
              A dead horse will not even crawl into the crossing.
            2. Boa kaa
              Boa kaa 9 December 2022 19: 45
              +2
              Quote: aleksejkabanets
              What do they do with dead horses?

              Hunted (!) Horses are shot.
              And the "dead" - the wolves in the ravines eat up! yes
          2. Kronos
            Kronos 9 December 2022 17: 24
            +6
            You mean changed? Shoigu, Gerasimov and other generals remained in place, as well as those who appointed them.
          3. mitrich
            mitrich 10 December 2022 13: 24
            +1
            How long do you propose not to bury a decaying and stinking corpse?
        2. topol717
          topol717 9 December 2022 21: 58
          0
          I know that 5 years ago with KnAZ them. Gagarin, many people were transferred to a new plant in the center of the country for the production of UAVs. But as usual, they were swinging there, and the government order was minimal, and now they work in 3 shifts.
      2. alekseykabanets
        alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 16: 38
        +6
        Quote from Orange Bigg
        It turned out in fact the Third Patriotic War (the first and second began, respectively, in 1812 and 1941).

        Come on, I'm sick of such high-flown phrases! Look at the "Third Patriotic War".))) In the Second World War, the Germans did not fill tanks with our oil and did not fire shells made of our metal.
        1. lego2
          lego2 9 December 2022 16: 58
          0
          if we take the 41st year, then even battalions were formed from captured Soviet tanks, the rear units were armed with the SVT rifle, and there are many such examples. But this is in 41-42 years, and then conclusions were drawn.
          1. alekseykabanets
            alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 17: 48
            +2
            Quote: lego2
            if we take the 41st year, then even battalions were formed from captured Soviet tanks, the rear units were armed with the SVT rifle, and there are many such examples. But this is in 41-42 years, and then conclusions were drawn.

            What are you carrying? And here is the trophy equipment? Did the USSR trade with Germany and its allies during the Second World War?
            1. Guran33 Sergey
              Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 18: 25
              +1
              I didn’t trade .. and in the comment it was not about trade, so we got - what kind of question is such an answer. And if about trade .. How excited are the propagandists on state TV that Europe is switching to American gas and Middle Eastern oil, as if each of them has a production well .. And with a "naphtha" pipe of incomprehensibility. In the same Hungary, you can get gas through Poland supply (though horseradish radish is not sweeter)
        2. cold wind
          cold wind 9 December 2022 16: 59
          +2
          Quote: aleksejkabanets

          Come on, I'm sick of such high-flown phrases!

          These are attempts to give meaning to conventional colonial warfare. The authorities of Ukraine decided to lie under other masters, we tried not to let them do it. Unsuccessfully, we went according to the scenario of the Crimean War. History is cyclical.
        3. Guran33 Sergey
          Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 17: 19
          -3
          And they refueled and T-34s with crosses fought against us, anti-aircraft guns in large numbers captured in the household of General Pavlov were drilled to German caliber and successfully or not fired at allied aircraft in the Ruhr direction, everything was to the greatest regret
          1. alekseykabanets
            alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 17: 53
            +3
            Quote: Guran33 Sergey
            And refueled

            What were they running? Oil sold by Stalin? Do not compose, the USSR did not trade with Nazi Germany and its allies.
            Quote: Guran33 Sergey
            ... and T-34s with crosses fought against us, anti-aircraft guns in large numbers captured in the household of General Pavlov ...
            And here is the trophy equipment?
            1. Dart2027
              Dart2027 9 December 2022 19: 06
              +4
              Quote: aleksejkabanets
              the USSR did not trade with Nazi Germany and its allies.
              Until the beginning of a direct military clash, he traded.
              1. alekseykabanets
                alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 19: 35
                0
                Quote: Dart2027
                Until the beginning of a direct military clash, he traded.

                Here is what up to the start of a direct military clash.
                1. Dart2027
                  Dart2027 9 December 2022 19: 46
                  +1
                  Quote: aleksejkabanets
                  before the start of a direct military confrontation

                  Are we already at war with the USA?
                  1. alexoff
                    alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 06
                    -2
                    Well, they are definitely with us, but we only whine
                    1. Dart2027
                      Dart2027 9 December 2022 21: 17
                      0
                      Quote from alexoff
                      Well, they are definitely with us.

                      That is, they directly and officially participate in the database?
                      1. alexoff
                        alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 54
                        -2
                        In general, yes, they quite openly provide military assistance, provide reconnaissance and target designation for strikes. Or is it not participation?
                      2. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 9 December 2022 22: 24
                        -2
                        Quote from alexoff
                        Or is it not participation?

                        Officially, we are not at war. As well as with Ukraine. There are political games going on here, which are difficult to judge from the outside.
                      3. alexoff
                        alexoff 9 December 2022 22: 43
                        -1
                        Well, the Americans have not officially fought with anyone since 1945, just like us, but this did not stop anyone from actually fighting
                      4. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 10 December 2022 06: 33
                        0
                        That's what I'm talking about. The USSR did not fight the USA, although the military of these countries fired at each other in dozens of countries.
                      5. Alt 22
                        Alt 22 10 December 2022 09: 55
                        +1
                        Do you need to directly officially declare war? And the fact that they supply Ukraine with weapons, ammunition, intelligence, and that Ukraine is actually their proxy, does not bother you?
                        A simple example - Excalibur shells are made of Russian titanium. The Russian Federation delivered a large batch of palladium to the United States - which is needed for the production of high-precision shells for "himars".
                        And there are plenty of such examples!
                        That is, the Russian Federation - supports those who supply its direct military opponents with weapons, ammunition, equipment!
                        And I don’t even know which of them is the greater enemy of Russia, the countries of the West, or people like you and those who feed the enemies !!!
                      6. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 10 December 2022 11: 23
                        +1
                        Quote: Alt22
                        Do you need to directly officially declare war?

                        The USSR actively traded with NATO countries during the Cold War, despite the fact that it was an enemy. A direct war is the end of the whole world.
                      7. alexoff
                        alexoff 10 December 2022 15: 03
                        -1
                        Titanium was not supplied to the USA for weapons. And during the Cold War, American weapons did not fire on Soviet settlements on a regular basis.
                      8. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 11 December 2022 06: 57
                        0
                        Quote from alexoff
                        did not supply titanium to the USA for weapons
                        Actually supplied. Officially, the United States seemed to be deceiving the USSR with the help of front companies in other countries, but the KGB did not work with mugs, so the version of deception seems doubtful. Yes, and the European industry, which riveted weapons for the war with the USSR, worked thanks to the GTS built in the USSR.
                      9. alexoff
                        alexoff 11 December 2022 15: 44
                        -1
                        Well, the USSR also received something in the left ways. But that the USSR decided not to finish off its enemies in the 70s, but to extend a pipe of help to them, it was a fatal step in the collapse of the country's economy and its drain
                      10. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 11 December 2022 16: 00
                        0
                        Quote from alexoff
                        Pu USSR also received something in the left ways
                        Was getting. And something and not the left. This is a policy in which 2 + 2 can be equal to both 5 and 3, and at the same time. So it was then and so it is now.
                      11. alexoff
                        alexoff 11 December 2022 16: 07
                        -1
                        Then it ended badly, for some reason the children of the general secretaries live in the USA, so their parents played politics
                      12. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 11 December 2022 16: 15
                        0
                        Quote from alexoff
                        Then it ended badly
                        It ended badly, because the idea of ​​building communism is impossible in principle. People are a biological species and always build a certain model of society. Even if the USSR won the Cold War, it would still be destroyed.
                      13. alexoff
                        alexoff 11 December 2022 16: 41
                        0
                        The USSR somehow did not strive to build communism, did not build its own economic bloc normally, did not build allies, in Brezhnev's time it chose for itself the place of a raw materials appendage. Well, winning in the Cold War is free technology, free Western specialists, access to markets, etc., but it's too difficult to build a planet after victory, and degrading is so easy and pleasant ...
                      14. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 11 December 2022 19: 21
                        0
                        Quote from alexoff
                        and degrading is so relaxed and pleasant
                        Alas, that's all it is.
                      15. mitrich
                        mitrich 10 December 2022 13: 27
                        0
                        Are you just waiting for a communique? Intelligence data, ammunition, modern weapons and Amer's military experts are not enough for you?
                      16. Dart2027
                        Dart2027 10 December 2022 14: 27
                        0
                        Quote: mitrich
                        Are you just waiting for a communique?

                        Quote: Dart2027
                        That's what I'm talking about. The USSR did not fight the USA, although the military of these countries fired at each other in dozens of countries.
            2. runway-1
              runway-1 9 December 2022 20: 06
              0
              Greetings! hi
              Trophy equipment, of course, has nothing to do with it, but it’s not about it, it’s just about these commentators: “There is an elderberry in the garden, but an uncle in Kyiv!” ... winked
              1. alekseykabanets
                alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 20: 36
                -2
                Hello! hi
                Quote: WFP-1
                Greetings! hi
                Trophy equipment, of course, has nothing to do with it, but it’s not about it, it’s just about these commentators: “There is an elderberry in the garden, but an uncle in Kyiv!” ... winked

                Yes, in general, I didn’t write very correctly there, maybe they didn’t understand.
          2. Alf
            Alf 9 December 2022 18: 27
            0
            Quote: Guran33 Sergey
            anti-aircraft guns in large numbers captured in the household of General Pavlov were drilled to German caliber

            What are they and what caliber?
            1. Guran33 Sergey
              Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 18: 33
              -7
              Seventy-heels under 8,8 cm. And blah blah blah to lengthen the comment
              1. Alf
                Alf 9 December 2022 18: 42
                +2
                Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                Seventy-heels under 8,8 cm. And blah blah blah to lengthen the comment

                And where did the 75-mm caliber come from in the Red Army in general, and in anti-aircraft artillery in particular? Give the model of the gun? It was in the Red Army that the German-designed 3K gun with a caliber of 76 mm was bored out, but only up to 85 mm, the strength of the barrel did not allow further.
                I'm waiting for the gun model.
                1. Guran33 Sergey
                  Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 18: 49
                  -4
                  Read the book "The Adventures of Werner Holt", where he served as a recruit in the calculation of such a weapon and it was in the Ruhr. barrels and anti-aircraft guns were not redrilled during the war
                  1. Alf
                    Alf 9 December 2022 18: 55
                    +2
                    Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                    Read the book "The Adventures of Werner Holt", where he served as a recruit in the calculation of such a gun and it was in the Ruhr.

                    So say you don't know. You should at least look at Shirokorad's "God of War of the Third Reich". Excellent reference book. On German artillery, perhaps the only fundamental study.
                    1. Guran33 Sergey
                      Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 19: 05
                      -5
                      I am not a historian and not a fan of retro weapons, I am a reader. In the magazine "Communist for 85-86 years, in an article on ammunition and art, there was also talk about these anti-aircraft guns and the number of about 400 pieces, the author is a war veteran lieutenant for 46 years. We still for now, something is covered in the darkness of silence, for example, in a country that produced only galoshes during the war, flammable trains with automatic charging lines stood behind the fronts and the number of these factories determined the number of fronts (probably read in mamoirs how gunners hated stupid commanders for handing over cartridge cases by count?
                      1. Alf
                        Alf 9 December 2022 19: 29
                        +3
                        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                        I am not a historian and not a fan of retro weapons, I am a reader.

                        Dear Sergey ! You are on the site of "riveters" who can confirm their words with facts and figures. If you want to succeed here, become an explorer and connoisseur. And you will succeed.
                        Well, magazines like Communist (although the people really need good propaganda) are not comme il faut in the form of evidence in VO.
                      2. Guran33 Sergey
                        Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 19: 36
                        -2
                        This magazine is not digitized, so I can't please you with a link. and at home for 35 years he went somewhere
                      3. mitrich
                        mitrich 10 December 2022 13: 31
                        0
                        What kind of analytics can be expected from the reader and admirer of the Communist magazine? It feels like you are writing in Murzilka. There's at least half, military experts.
                      4. stankow
                        stankow 10 December 2022 13: 43
                        +1
                        Well, to hate the commander because of the surrender of shells!?!
                      5. Guran33 Sergey
                        Guran33 Sergey 11 December 2022 05: 00
                        0
                        Read the memoirs of artillerymen in the ZhZL series
                      6. stankow
                        stankow 11 December 2022 16: 44
                        +1
                        Was reading. "Hatred" is so, it is said with exaggeration. Collecting shells is no more difficult than shooting them. In a combat situation, you can lose some. And if you need to quickly leave, then in general you can leave it in position. There is a "trophy team" that will take care of it.
                  2. Alf
                    Alf 9 December 2022 19: 32
                    +2
                    How to tie
                    Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                    85mm is our caliber
                    и
                    Seventy-five
                    For me personally, this is a great mystery.
                    Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                    our caliber, not the thinness of the barrel

                    This phrase is beyond my understanding...
                    Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                    anti-aircraft guns were not redrilled during the war

                    And BEFORE the war? Our native 85 mm 52K came out of the German development of the 76 mm 3K gun.
                    1. Guran33 Sergey
                      Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 19: 55
                      -1
                      I don’t know how many buttons were on the German tunic .. The book was artistic and there was nothing about performance characteristics
                      1. Alf
                        Alf 9 December 2022 20: 01
                        0
                        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                        I do not know how many buttons were on the German tunic.

                        That's about it.
                        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                        .Art book

                        Nowhere do they lie like in love, hunting and war. Fiction books should be divided by 10 according to truthfulness.
                      2. Guran33 Sergey
                        Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 20: 20
                        0
                        I looked at what I wrote and I apologize! Inattention is my name .. Anti-aircraft guns were bored under the caliber "akht-akht" 8,8 cm, which is 76 mm, which is 85 mm
                      3. Alf
                        Alf 9 December 2022 20: 55
                        0
                        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
                        I looked at what I wrote and I apologize! Inattention is my name ..

                        Come on... It's okay, I'm not a know-it-all either.
    3. spirit
      spirit 9 December 2022 16: 25
      +14
      So there was only one plan A "flowers and tanks" that successfully failed. Plan B where it was necessary to fight Shoigu and the general headquarters saw only in nightmares, since they understood best of all that they only know how to fight in reports and TV. Therefore, there was nothing prepared. "wooden" Adventurers of pure water who do not know how to calculate risks lead our army, unfortunately.
      1. Quote Lavrov
        Quote Lavrov 9 December 2022 16: 34
        +1
        I'm not at all sure that this is the case. It is obvious that "flowers and tanks" were primarily the plan of politicians (that is why the 60+ km column did not storm Kyiv, because only the military could understand the outcome). I absolutely do not want to relieve the military of responsibility - elementarily for behaving like that Patrushev, and not getting up and leaving, or how Rokossovsky proved to Stalin three times the reality of the plan for the operation on the Kursk Bulge, even when CAM sent him from the meeting to "think." ..I mean, the military has its own points of responsibility, but it is precisely the concept of the operation itself, I am sure, that is the result of the work of politicians in the first place.
        Yes, and the same ROSTEKH - well, it’s obvious that it’s not the military that controls the holding itself and manages it. Moreover, they can hardly even influence him.
        1. Zug
          Zug 9 December 2022 16: 54
          +3
          In my opinion, not the Kursk Bulge, but Bagration and Stalin did not recall anyone anywhere. This is a myth. The idea of ​​\uXNUMXb\uXNUMXbthe operation belongs to the General Staff
        2. Botanologist
          Botanologist 9 December 2022 17: 02
          +4
          Quote: Quote Lavrov
          I am sure that the idea of ​​the operation itself is the result of the work of politicians in the first place.

          Two for your logic. Try to come up with an operation to export, for example, thousands of cubic meters of forest from some Zaozerny district of the Irkutsk region, and in 10 seconds you will understand that you need ideas about roads, river seedlings, the presence or absence of transport, and much more. And for this you need to ask specialists. And in the case of SVO, no matter who plans what, there is (more precisely, there should be) the General Staff who clearly knows what is possible and what is not. And here the MO nodded and convulsively thought how to get out. Here they turned around. There are no brave ones.
          Quote: Quote Lavrov
          Yes, and the same ROSTEKH - well, it’s obvious that it’s not the military that controls the holding itself and manages it. Moreover, they can hardly even influence him.

          They can very well. They have billions for programs. If you like it, we work, if you don't like it go ahead, compete with China in the civil sector.
        3. alexoff
          alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 15
          0
          A few years ago, Kalashnikov proposed to the Ministry of Defense to build a plant for drones, the Ministry of Defense did not react in any way.
      2. alekseykabanets
        alekseykabanets 9 December 2022 16: 40
        +2
        Quote: spirit
        "Wooden" Adventurers of pure water who do not know how to calculate the risks lead our army, unfortunately.

        If only the army, half the trouble would be!
      3. alexoff
        alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 11
        -1
        I suspect that for our leadership, "flowers" were no less a nightmare. Sanctions would have been instantly imposed on Ukraine, like on Venezuela, and the inhabitants of a heavily subsidized region, where there were only 7 million in permanent work in 2021 and another 5 in a non-permanent one, would have waved the tricolor and would have waited for them to build a subway for Troeschina and hang them on lanterns of all oligarchs with deputies.
      4. mitrich
        mitrich 10 December 2022 13: 38
        -1
        You can't blame our military establishment like that. Their successes in tank biathlon, short lines and parade boxes are undeniable.
        Now, if the NATO ss.yk.uns dared to take part in Alabino, our generals would, hoo-hoo-hoo, roll them with multi-colored tanks to zero.
    4. rotkiv04
      rotkiv04 9 December 2022 16: 31
      0
      Quote: Quote Lavrov
      I see no reason to be happy with such an article.
      On the contrary, I have 2 simple questions:
      1. And why weren't these lines loaded 24/7 for several years before the start of the operation?
      2. Did any of the perpetrators described in paragraph 1 suffer an effective punishment?

      probably because someone decided that on the outskirts it would end like in Kazakhstan, a week or two and you could go back to winter apartments again, but everything turned out according to the classics - shock, rejection of the situation, apathy ... now the last stage has probably already come - acceptance decisions
    5. Guran33 Sergey
      Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 16: 43
      +3
      It didn’t happen, and here again (the unforgettable Chernomyrdin overslept the Maidan). Everything according to the classics, the generals are preparing for the last war .. and in general, the drones clearly showed themselves in the Azer NVO by demolishing the Armenian police (militias) of Karabakh. the head of the civilian minister did not notice the opinion of analysts about a sufficient number of cars, limiting themselves to small batches for the report
      1. Alf
        Alf 9 December 2022 18: 29
        +2
        Quote: Guran33 Sergey
        generals led by a civilian minister did not notice the opinion of analysts

        Then the question is to the generalship, on the x ... fig are you needed like that?
      2. Russian soldier
        Russian soldier 10 December 2022 16: 40
        -1
        Mister connoisseur, but what does Chernomyrdin have to do with it???? Was he the President???? Do not show your amateurism. Start with Mr. Yanukovych. He would turn to us for help, show willpower and that's it. And it turns out the former bandit got scared. And the ophthalmologist B. Assad was not afraid, he retained full control over the army and special services, and when he needed help, he first asked Iran for help. And when Iran could not stop the terrorists, it asked for help from us. And that's it. At the legitimate request of the LEGAL President of the SAR, Russia provided assistance on LEGAL grounds to B. Assad.
        1. Guran33 Sergey
          Guran33 Sergey 11 December 2022 04: 40
          +1
          The former prime minister, the ambassador on the outskirts, it was under him that the Nazi-Bandera group was formed in Kiev. And the Yanuca, at his suggestion, went to the presidency. And yes, since the Kherson referendum, our army has become an aggressor ..our native aggressor for the Nazis-Westerners.
    6. Sibiriya
      Sibiriya 9 December 2022 17: 10
      +9
      Enemy retaliatory actions were not planned. And the enemy is serious. As for the UAV, the lack of tactical drones capable of delivering strikes to the desired depth with serious ammunition, not suppressed air defense, the absence of corrected aerial bombs of the required caliber. Well, you won’t fly with old factories and hephaestus over unsuppressed air defense ((. And on the second point

      To the right of Shoigu is the recent chief of all logistics of the RF Armed Forces, General of the Army Bulgakov. Also Hero of the Russian Federation. The photo was taken at a recent after the awarding of the real heroes of the NWO.
      I recently watched an interview with Strelkov. Much makes you think.
      1. Volga073
        Volga073 10 December 2022 07: 03
        +3
        Someone is fighting, and someone is fattening. Three gourmets at the table who don't even have NVP.
    7. Barberry25
      Barberry25 9 December 2022 17: 18
      -3
      a simple question .. and if you are so smart, then why are you so poor? But seriously, it has already been agreed 333 times that the primary plan of the NWO did not provide for a long military operation at all .. or do you leave the house every day in a helmet?
      1. Kronos
        Kronos 9 December 2022 17: 27
        0
        Any sane military actions are not provided for now.
        1. Barberry25
          Barberry25 9 December 2022 18: 50
          -1
          thank you, I laughed .... of course I know the answer, but I’m not going to check whether comrade major reads me .. you can firmly believe that tomorrow the Kremlin will storm the Kremlin ... the main thing is beautiful and epic write here, they will give you plus
      2. nickname7
        nickname7 10 December 2022 09: 20
        +3
        the primary plan of the NWO did not provide for a long military operation at all ..

        It is very sad for the leaders if they did not take into account that NATO is set up for a long military operation, where is the intelligence and where are the analysts? But most likely the analytics was correct, but the tired grandfathers in the Kremlin were weak in spirit and incompetent.
    8. Alf
      Alf 9 December 2022 18: 24
      +3
      Quote: Quote Lavrov
      Did any of the perpetrators described in paragraph 1 suffer an effective punishment?

      Dear colleague, even during the scandal about the missing 1,5 sets of uniforms, it was said in Russian from above - Why stir up this topic, it just happened ...
      Why do you think it will be different now?
    9. Akhr82
      Akhr82 9 December 2022 20: 38
      0
      It’s been great for a few years, but it would be nice to deploy it at least to the beginning.
    10. ilya.muromczev2013
      ilya.muromczev2013 10 December 2022 00: 37
      +1
      You have two not simple, but two childish questions :) If you think in your opinion, then in the Great Patriotic War both Stalin, and the General Staff, and all high-ranking officers would have to be shot (I’m generally silent about Kutuzov) ... For the simple reason, that they allowed the enemy to Moscow.
      Stop whining, eh?...
    11. potap6509
      potap6509 10 December 2022 12: 26
      +2
      hi I read, either in a cart, or here, how true I don’t know, one strong stellar general, the second after the Minister of Defense, said before the start of his own, we don’t really need UAVs, we will defeat everyone like that. About punishment, who will punish him, he is almost a monument.
  3. TIR
    TIR 9 December 2022 16: 20
    +5
    And you need to have 500-1000 UAVs constantly in the air from ordinary quadrocopters to Orlanov-30. In total, 4-5 thousand UAVs are needed in service. That's not counting drums. Those 1 thousand are definitely needed
    1. Orange Bigg
      Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 16: 42
      +4
      Then you need to have industry and development competencies at the level of China
      or at least Iran. And so you have to learn on the go. It is necessary to develop the production of optics components, ammunition, the same engines for UAVs from APD-45 to APD-500. they invented something, but nothing came out. Although there are some progress here too. The walking one will master the road.
      In Novosibirsk, a flying laboratory based on the Yak-52 aircraft performed runs and take-offs as part of the planned stage of testing the APD-A aircraft piston engine demonstrator, the press service of the P.I. Baranova (CIAM). The APD-A demonstrator engine is a modification of the APD-500 aircraft piston engine (power 500 hp) developed at CIAM, which was created on the basis of the automobile engine of the Cortege family of EMP FSUE NAMI.

      https://aviation21.ru/yak-52-s-perspektivnym-porshnevym-dvigatelem-apd-a-sovershil-probezhki-i-podlyoty/
      1. Barberry25
        Barberry25 9 December 2022 17: 22
        +2
        in the current conditions, it would be nice to deploy at least the production of APD-45, and not piece by piece, but in quantities of several thousand a year .. Since a completely domestic kamikaze drone is needed very, very much .. well, or either scale up the production of the turbofan engine-50 .. although I honestly don’t believe that it will be cheaper than an aviation APD
        1. Orange Bigg
          Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 17: 28
          +1
          in the current conditions, it would be nice to deploy at least the production of APD-45


          Well, there are already prototypes. We need interest and a team from above. And it is desirable to have television for Geranium-2, like the same Lancet-3, Izdeliye-305, X-29TD. There would be a desire.
          1. Barberry25
            Barberry25 9 December 2022 18: 51
            -1
            Well, I think that there is interest. We will learn the truth about the actions again from the trip of some deputy ..
      2. Alt 22
        Alt 22 10 December 2022 10: 04
        0
        As long as supporters of the slogans "it is better to buy abroad than to produce at home" are in power, there will be no sense.
      3. TIR
        TIR 10 December 2022 12: 03
        +1
        I apologize, of course, but first, our rear and supply men need to stop fucking property. Those who deal with government contracts should stop tearing money into their own pockets. And with rollbacks to solve the problem. Believe me, within half a year, the armies will offer 10-20 types of engines and not purchases from China, but their own or foreign counterparts. And with optics, you can decide if you do not build villas and yachts, but think about the country. If I'm wrong, then how do entire warehouses with entire complexes of Warriors and sights appear in Avito ???
        1. mitrich
          mitrich 10 December 2022 13: 57
          +1
          Well, you are fantastic, my friend. So that the current government would stop, as you write, piz..t and buy villas, yachts in the coveted west?
          Yes, this is the dream and the meaning of life of their thieves kompradorskih entities. They sleep and see how to make peace on any terms and again be there, in their true homeland.
    2. Guran33 Sergey
      Guran33 Sergey 9 December 2022 16: 46
      +4
      Here, in the year 18, for such a comment I received 54 minus zero pluses (I didn’t remember the vindictive but ninus record), though I had the figure 10,000. There are no prophets in my country .. And about a moped-like UAV body with a battery was at an arms exhibition in 16 did not go into series (did not buy the Moscow Region) due to copying the American apparatus decommissioned in the zero years and insufficient flight range
    3. ilya.muromczev2013
      ilya.muromczev2013 10 December 2022 00: 41
      0
      Why be trifle! Well, then, "you always need to have in the air" not some miserable 500-1000 UAVs, but 5 - 000 !!! A million is even better ... True, there will be no money left for other weapons, but you will calm down :) ...
      1. TIR
        TIR 10 December 2022 18: 55
        0
        I'm talking about SVO now. At the moment, 200-500 UAVs can really hang in the air at the same time. But 90% of them are regular Mavics. And do not try to respond with sarcasm to real needs. This is more like a lack of analytical thinking, but simply called stupidity. I did not take these numbers with my finger. It is for the tasks of the SVO that at least 500 UAVs are needed in constant operation. These are both conventional battery-powered quadrocopters with an operation time of 30-60 minutes, and UAVs with guidance of guided missiles and with the ability to work for hours and to control hundreds of kilometers deep into enemy territory. Then only it is possible to destroy equipment and manpower on the march. And put an end to the air defense of the enemy. Remember, the lack of technical intelligence and target designation always leads to huge losses. I hope people in the General Staff do not sit with such thoughts. Otherwise, we will prolong this war.
        P.S. So to speak about the cost of the UAV. Much cheaper to build a fleet of UAVs than to build one Borealis
  4. Iris
    Iris 9 December 2022 16: 21
    +6
    The fact that after 9 months they realized it is very pleasing. During this time, they hatch a human larva and even give birth. In another 40 years, the larva will become a general and we will learn the fate of RUK and ROK, the successful creation of which we were told at the military academy in 1982.
  5. Suslin
    Suslin 9 December 2022 16: 21
    -3
    In my opinion, the production of UAVs needs to be decentralized, i.e. transfer a number of parts and components to commercial structures, and leave the final assembly, adjustment, testing to the developers. This will significantly increase the yield of finished products. And of course to improve the feedback between the operators (army) and developers (manufacturers).
    1. DymOk_v_dYmke
      DymOk_v_dYmke 9 December 2022 16: 45
      +2
      It is necessary to decentralize, parallelize and organize production in the depths of the country for a different reason: production at one site in the European part can be closed.
      Arrival in Engels should teach you a lot and quickly.
      1. Suslin
        Suslin 9 December 2022 17: 22
        +4
        On the other side (from the NATO side), reconnaissance UAVs hang at the borders of the Khokhlobanderites for days, I generally keep quiet about satellites. And where are our AWACS aircraft? And do the VKS have them at all? Hence all the failures with Angles and other airfields. Something like this.
        1. DymOk_v_dYmke
          DymOk_v_dYmke 9 December 2022 17: 48
          0
          The failure with Engels reminded me of the story of Matthias Rust.
          Time passes, little changes.
          1. Suslin
            Suslin 9 December 2022 18: 32
            +2
            Well, with Rust there was a fear of making a decision without the approval of the Politburo. Now the times are not the same, but the rule that the generals are always ready for the last war, it does not seem to change.
        2. Akhr82
          Akhr82 9 December 2022 20: 41
          +2
          In the summer I rested on the sea - A-50s flew without exaggeration for days.
        3. alexoff
          alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 21
          -2
          Are AWACS aircraft really vital near their borders? Can conventional ground-based radars be placed around the perimeter at commanding heights so that they look further away?
    2. Alf
      Alf 9 December 2022 18: 33
      +1
      Quote: Suslin
      transfer a number of parts and components to commercial structures,

      Such a decision is not
      Quote: Suslin
      significantly increase the yield of finished products
      , but the cost will increase. How our "businessmen" are able to find an excuse for overpricing, we all know well.
      1. Suslin
        Suslin 9 December 2022 20: 57
        +3
        Of course, this factor is present, but no one bothers to set a price ceiling for certain components. And those who wish, I am sure, will definitely be found. And of course, the desired volumes do not need to be increased to millions.
        1. Alf
          Alf 9 December 2022 21: 04
          0
          Quote: Suslin
          but no one bothers to set a price ceiling for certain components.

          Three times Ha ! (Do not be offended.) Last year, the import of palm oil into the Russian Federation was legally banned, after the ban, imports INCREASED. This is me to the fact that it is customary to sneeze at the adopted laws in Putin's Russia, to put it mildly. Besides, who will install the ceiling? Military? So our "producers" will tell them very simply - Or take it at OUR prices and fight as you like.
          1. Woodman
            Woodman 9 December 2022 23: 19
            +2
            Quote: Alf
            Last year, the import of palm oil into the Russian Federation was legally banned.

            Could you quote this law? Or at least provide a link to it?
            Quote: Alf
            It's me that

            there was no such ban.
          2. Suslin
            Suslin 10 December 2022 13: 04
            +2
            Are you by any chance delusional? It's just very similar.
  6. BIABIA
    BIABIA 9 December 2022 16: 25
    +2
    Quote: Quote Lavrov
    And why are these lines not yet at the planning stage of the NWO before the start of the operation were loaded 24/7 for several years?


    But because they thought that in one fell swoop they beat everyone! But no one met something with flowers ...
  7. Neo-9947
    Neo-9947 9 December 2022 16: 30
    +4
    It's wonderful what huge damage our drones inflict on the enemy!
    Well ?
    Where is the victory?
    The impression is that the one who planned the SVO in Ukraine stupidly did not take into account the scale of the special operation being carried out. This is not the Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict where a dozen tanks are destroyed live from UAVs and victory is in your pocket. And not Syria, where one airfield is tightly closed by our air defense.
    Here the front is thousands of kilometers away and they are fighting in fronts, not BTG.
  8. Arkady007
    Arkady007 9 December 2022 16: 32
    +10
    Hard to believe.
    If they promised at the beginning of the year to produce 10-12 Il-76 aircraft for the VTA in a year, but they issued three with flaws, I don’t think that there is a sharp breakthrough in other directions.
    Wages at aircraft factories for literate workers are lower than for the same workers at car factories.
    It remains only to sing the praises of outsourcing implementers Medvedev and Serdyukov.
    1. Romario_Argo
      Romario_Argo 9 December 2022 16: 48
      -1
      actually already took off 5-th Il-76MD-90A assembled in 2022, 2 were assembled that year
      https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/149295/
      for salaries at Aviastar, an average of 58 rubles.
      https://ulpressa.ru/2022/07/29/средняя-зарплата-почти-59-тысяч-рублей/
      in Moscow it is less - the minimum wage is 25 rubles. and the salary is an average of 000 rubles.
      1. Alf
        Alf 9 December 2022 18: 35
        +7
        Quote: Romario_Argo
        about salaries at Aviastar on average 58 rubles.

        Of course, I would like to believe it, but we all know well what the term "average" means.
        1. Romario_Argo
          Romario_Argo 9 December 2022 19: 02
          -4
          on average means - surcharges for secrecy
          at sensitive enterprises, shifts are not as long as at conventional enterprises
          + now defense plants work in 3 and 4 shifts
          so there is the possibility of a side job, which does not contradict the Labor Code of the Russian Federation
          1. Alf
            Alf 9 December 2022 19: 36
            +4
            Quote: Romario_Argo
            on average means - surcharges for secrecy
            at sensitive enterprises, shifts are not as long as at conventional enterprises
            + now defense plants work in 3 and 4 shifts
            so there is the possibility of a side job, which does not contradict the Labor Code of the Russian Federation

            The point is not the number of shifts, but the fact that in order to derive the "average salary" formula, we add up the salary of the turner and the general director, and it turns out that everyone eats cabbage rolls.
            Quote: Romario_Argo
            now defense plants work in 3 and 4 shifts
            so there is a chance to work

            If the plant works in THREE shifts, then there is no question of part-time work, there are only 24 hours in a day. And no one will put you on two shifts in a row, a man is not iron. About FOUR shifts is generally funny.
            1. Romario_Argo
              Romario_Argo 12 December 2022 10: 34
              0
              6-hour shifts at sensitive enterprises
              1. Alf
                Alf 12 December 2022 19: 34
                0
                Quote: Romario_Argo
                6-hour shifts at sensitive enterprises

                Can anything be cited as evidence?
      2. Arkady007
        Arkady007 9 December 2022 18: 43
        +5
        1. Took off - this does not mean that it was put into operation.
        2. They promised to transfer twice as much, and not take off.
        3. And yes, "the term" on average "we all know well."
      3. alexoff
        alexoff 9 December 2022 21: 25
        -1
        Yeah, compare this average salary building heavy transport workers with the salary of a welder at a construction site in the Moscow region or a Yandex food courier in Moscow ...
  9. Ruslan Sledkov
    Ruslan Sledkov 9 December 2022 16: 52
    +2
    Drones are certainly good. But explain to me why in the first months of the NMD, the Defense Ministry announced 16 ukrov losses per month, and now Shoigu announced 8500. Does it mean that drones do not help? Maybe you need to attract more people and weapons to the NWO? You can't win with one little finger.
    1. Orange Bigg
      Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 17: 07
      -4
      And if the SVO lasts more than one year, then it might be better to save resources and not throw everyone at once on the SVO, you see, and their turn will come over time when playing for a long time? , but the change is gradual, not so that everyone who has gained experience in the NWO goes on vacation, but gradually, so that only by smelling gunpowder and fledging, having learned what newcomers would change already experienced fighters. While some will rest, others will gradually learn skills at the forefront in order to pass on the acquired skills to beginners over time.
  10. Joker62
    Joker62 9 December 2022 17: 05
    -4
    Quote: Quote Lavrov
    Quote: aleksr2005
    As one of the interlocutors told the publication, the key factor was surprise effect, because the Russian Federation did not expect such actions from Ukraine

    ...still would !!! It's 2-3 days of NWO ...

    Aren't you tired of pouring bile all over the place???
  11. Ruslan Sledkov
    Ruslan Sledkov 9 December 2022 17: 10
    +3
    It is necessary to destroy ukrov not in hundreds per day, but in thousands. It's already overdue. Otherwise, in six months we will get something like a Ukrainian offensive in the Kharkov region. Save up and go
    1. Orange Bigg
      Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 17: 32
      +5
      And who gives Ukraine all the time to freely accumulate human and technical resources without taking preventive measures?
      1. Alf
        Alf 9 December 2022 18: 37
        +3
        Quote from Orange Bigg
        And who gives Ukraine all the time to freely accumulate human and technical resources without taking preventive measures?

        This topic is not recommended...
        1. Orange Bigg
          Orange Bigg 9 December 2022 18: 47
          0
          And what else is not recommended? It is recommended, apparently, only to express endless concerns that go somewhere into the void.
          1. Alf
            Alf 9 December 2022 18: 57
            +3
            Quote from Orange Bigg
            And what else is not recommended? It is recommended, apparently, only to express endless concerns that go somewhere into the void.

            Well .. you can still listen to the victorious reports of Konashenkov and K * ...
  12. rocket757
    rocket757 9 December 2022 17: 29
    +2
    Thus, lessons are learned.
    . Unfortunately, there were ... more errors than you can, now, quickly fix them all.
    1. Alf
      Alf 9 December 2022 18: 38
      +2
      Quote: rocket757
      now, on a quick fix them all.

      As a result, an error can be quickly corrected, but what about correcting the cause of this error?
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 9 December 2022 18: 53
        +3
        Error... for a quick DO NOT fix. Especially in a hurry, it's easy to make new / repeat the old ones, from another groan or something like that.
        As for the causes of errors ... unfortunately, we have SYSTEM errors, generated by the control system that we have now.
        Question... can we change something in the current system???
        From the bottom, there is no, yet, such a significant force that can / is ready to fix the SYSTEM or make it work as it should.
        Wait for correction from above ... I, personally, did not climb the Willow tree and do not advise others.
        Question... what to do???
        For now, correct the mistakes as it will turn out and try not to make the next ones, and then ....
        You can recall the classics ... a "man with a gun" will return from the front and he will have many questions ... to the top, first of all.
        1. Alf
          Alf 9 December 2022 19: 39
          +3
          Quote: rocket757
          we have systemic errors, generated by the control system that we have now.

          What is it about...
          Quote: rocket757
          a "man with a gun" will return from the front and he will have many questions ... to the top, first of all.

          And that is why he will be disarmed at the front. I saw in the 90s how a CIVIL train from Chechnya arrived at the Kazansky railway station ... The platform was fenced off, everyone was shmonied without exception.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 9 December 2022 19: 55
            +2
            Not the seventeenth year, no one will walk the streets with a "three-ruler" ... "a man with a gun" is a conditional definition, although it can be assumed that it will be a man, as from another world.
            It is not worth guessing exactly how it will be ... it will be different, not like now.
            1. Alf
              Alf 9 December 2022 19: 59
              +1
              Quote: rocket757
              It is not worth guessing exactly how it will be ... it will be different, not like now.

              You are right, but I would like it to be faster, before the process has become irreversible.
              1. rocket757
                rocket757 9 December 2022 20: 05
                +2
                In order for the "other person" to start acting and receive support, which is very important, in society, among the people, it must "ripen", as they say.
                The question is...our society, our people have matured??
                Judging by the latest "by-elections", where the ruling party received, again, everything it needs, the society has NOT MATURED, to a direct and categorical rejection of these, and does not see others that it wants to replace.
                It's Complicated!!!
        2. Boa kaa
          Boa kaa 9 December 2022 20: 16
          -1
          Quote: rocket757
          try not to make the next, and then ....

          It's clear: mistakes are contraindicated for everyone... But this is in normal times, and during the war, and even on the eve of ELECTIONS 2024 - they are deadly!
          Therefore, our government will end all this pandemonium with the taming of Svidomo at all costs by the beginning of 2024. And believe me, the closer to the election date, the tougher the struggle will be. Then no one will persuade anyone else. Heads will fly like soccer balls in collar training.
          IMHO.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 9 December 2022 20: 29
            +2
            Cavalry swoop to change something, fundamentally .... there is something to think about, although .... it is doubtful. Only a system no less powerful than the previous one can fight against the SYSTEM.
          2. Alf
            Alf 9 December 2022 20: 59
            +1
            Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
            our government, by all means, will end by the beginning of 2024.

            Judging by the incessant calls for negotiations, the end will not be at all obvious. What, what, but the propaganda machine in modern Russia is so well-oiled that it will convince everyone of the need for negotiations, or, more precisely, surrender.
            1. mitrich
              mitrich 10 December 2022 14: 12
              +2
              So everything goes to surrender. Our bosses hoped to take Sumeria, flowers, champagne, people's love with a cavalry swoop. No one expected to receive implants for expensive teeth. Now they do not know what to do, because there was no plan B. And they are ready to surrender everything and everything, if only they would get their buns back. The ghouls don't give a damn about the second oil, about you and me.
              1. Russian soldier
                Russian soldier 10 December 2022 16: 23
                -1
                Are you sure you didn't assume that? Are you sure? You also write that the President should read telegram channels! He has nothing to do nonsense from the networks to watch. Probably the reports of the GRU General Staff and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation and the Foreign Intelligence Service are much more informational than amateurish opinions on the network
            2. Russian soldier
              Russian soldier 10 December 2022 16: 21
              -1
              Mister connoisseur, do you know Putin's plan? Is he supposed to tell everything to people like you online? Did you know what will be SVO? It was possible to guess. And what about the date of its beginning, the composition of forces and means, the plans of the commanders of the groups? Part tasks? No. So what are you whining about the negotiations?
  13. Sasha Koblov
    Sasha Koblov 9 December 2022 18: 31
    +2
    THE QUESTION, how then were the exercises used to be carried out?
    Where did the intelligence come from?
    Something here smacks of eyewash in the style of the 80s.
    Conclusion - it's time to drive the generals who are over 75 years old.
    1. Russian soldier
      Russian soldier 10 December 2022 16: 33
      -1
      And tell me how many generals are active who are over 75 years old ???
      If you served in the army, you would know that exercises are exercises, and a real battle is different. Infantry, for example, can only be taught to fight in war. Because "Mr. Connoisseur" in peacetime, at all events of operational and combat training, the main thing is SAFETY REQUIREMENTS. And if during the stage of the exercise people die, then they can stop. So far, the publication smells like a well-organized persecution of the country's military and especially the generals. It seems that we are for the Motherland, but you will see, and this is a betrayal of pure water. And why doesn’t the author tell how many Bayraktars were shot down? And where are they now????????? Where are the "Banners" ?????? The author and you answer where? Have you ever participated in strategic exercises ??? Or army? Or in BTU with live fire? The enemy is NOT SHOOTING at us !!!!!
  14. oleg_627
    oleg_627 9 December 2022 19: 23
    +4
    it feels like we have a lot of traitors. Airfields were bombed in the Crimea and they could at least learn something. You can see everything from the satellites. Everyone knew this and someone left it like that on purpose. So that the drone hits the tanker right next to the crowd of planes. And we have such planes in a piece copy and their losses are very attractive. Like ships
    1. Alexey Lantukh
      Alexey Lantukh 10 December 2022 15: 54
      +1
      The MO broadcasts that all the UAVs were shot down, but it looks like he is lying. They aimed at the tanker and hit.
    2. Russian soldier
      Russian soldier 10 December 2022 16: 35
      -2
      I agree: 75% of military correspondents and 80% of sites are traitors and PANICKERS. And mislead people
  15. sub307
    sub307 9 December 2022 19: 31
    +3
    Quote from: skeptick2
    And I'm afraid that soon we will have to worry not so much about our production of drones, but about protection from them.

    Judging by the free "run" of the APU "Strizh" right up to Engels, this "soon" was the day before yesterday. winked
  16. Fangaro
    Fangaro 9 December 2022 20: 29
    -2
    Special operation lessons: UAV production lines in Russia are busier than ever

    Thus, lessons are learned. Slowly? The question is open. But the fact that we learn from mistakes is a fact. This means that the prospect of the development of the unmanned industry is far from being an ordinary phrase and not an empty phrase.

    And the losses incurred due to mistakes, and the prospect of new losses, while the unmanned industry develops, is far from a common phrase and not an empty phrase.


    Author!!!
    There are problems in our country.
    In other countries, even in the USA. There is no need to create news in which everything is very good with us and tomorrow will be even better.
    The news about how xyz withstood the hmr attack in combat conditions and destroyed it with return fire - this is News.
  17. Fuat
    Fuat 9 December 2022 21: 20
    0
    Clever learn from the mistakes of others, and on their own. That's what the teachers used to say at school.
  18. savage3000
    savage3000 9 December 2022 21: 54
    +1
    it is very easy to talk about learning from mistakes, when human lives are hidden behind a simple word mistake.

    you need to start with communication. protative, portable and transportable gambling must be produced in tens of thousands.
  19. aleksr2005
    aleksr2005 10 December 2022 01: 07
    0
    Quote from: topol717
    Quote: NOMADE
    To your regret, "Moscow" is not a "combat" loss

    They sank and thank God, the crew is alive, and no one needs a 50-year-old jalopy. In general, this fleet crap there to the fullest, and it would be better if it continued to stand in Sevastopol and go out to parades. Even the control of the grain deal cannot provide. His civilian ships are ATTACKING.

    In fact, several dozen sailors died on the Moscow cruiser.
  20. anite
    anite 10 December 2022 02: 48
    -1
    Judging by the video, the Lancet disables the equipment, but does not destroy it. Too small ammo.
    I watched several videos of how they were sent to tanks. Quite an illogical decision to ditch the drone. Perhaps the operator did not find anything else and there is no way back?
  21. Horn
    Horn 10 December 2022 09: 02
    +1
    But the fact that we learn from mistakes is a fact.

    It has long been said: "Fools learn from their mistakes. Smart - from strangers."
  22. Vashek
    Vashek 10 December 2022 10: 19
    -1
    Making a UAV is not a trick. More terrible is how they did not develop a reconnaissance and strike complex based on satellite information, although they talked about it for 30 years.
  23. stankow
    stankow 10 December 2022 13: 31
    0
    Skoromokhov to say - "Russia has no drones at all." And then suddenly the whole production lines. Yes, even loading?!
  24. Woo dee
    Woo dee 10 December 2022 15: 21
    0
  25. Alexey Lantukh
    Alexey Lantukh 10 December 2022 15: 50
    0
    And what? Before the special operation, did we have production lines for drones? I thought they were made on the knee, by the piece.
  26. Russian soldier
    Russian soldier 10 December 2022 16: 17
    -1
    Dear author! You are a little misleading. You write the effect, not the cause. "Bayraktars" .. don't tell me, our air defense systems demolished them under 100 units, and you write that they reigned? It's a lie. Isolated cases of the use of "Bayraktars" did not affect in any way, and even more so now they do not affect the performance of tasks. The topic of UAVs was raised by military commanders who need to post something on the network every day. Here they are with them. Yes, the vids are good to watch. But how can a grenade with an UAV bring strategic success ??? Funny. Complete dilettantism. UAVs were not mass-produced because there was no need. Do you know such a method as working on a target after analyzing radio intercepts? Of course not. Listen to bloggers and military correspondents, we have NOTHING. And we are complete ignoramuses and fools. As soon as in 9 months they did not catch up with us to Moscow. Do you really know how the cruiser "Moskva" sank? I doubt. With the light hand of bloggers, of course, anti-ship missiles of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Or Western means. But what is real: the English cruiser Sheffield was damaged on the Moskva cruiser. Sunk in 1982. Deftly yes. What to yell excitedly. What part of our population has the peculiarity to criticize their own and extol the Western. Wow, we're all bad. It is necessary to serve in the real army and then write complete heresy about air defense
  27. garik77
    garik77 10 December 2022 23: 06
    0
    UAV production lines in Russia are busier than ever

    And yet they are still missing...
  28. Dima Dima_2
    Dima Dima_2 11 December 2022 00: 24
    0
    Swift is a cool device, flew to Zagreb, flew to Engels. Oh no, they wrote it off...
  29. Viktor Grishchenko
    Viktor Grishchenko 11 December 2022 14: 00
    0
    Why be surprised, well, this is Russia, these are not mistakes, but the failures of the bureaucratic system and the results of reforms
  30. Petrol cutter
    Petrol cutter 12 December 2022 20: 45
    0
    The Russian Federation, in my provincial opinion, should also think about creating / updating a pontoon park.
    If she plans to win the war.
    Bridges will be bombed one way or another. And we will return to this issue again.
    Bo other options to establish a stable transfer of all and everything, I personally do not observe. request
  31. flyer
    flyer 13 December 2022 09: 48
    +1
    After the aggravation of the Karabakh conflict, our strategists had to start thinking with their heads.