Military Review

E Series Experimental Fighters (Part-2) E-8 - Leading Time

72
In 2000, when wide aviation The public was shown the new MiG 1.44 MFI fighter (multipurpose front-line fighter), which was an experimental Russian prototype of the 5th generation fighter, many aviation experts noted that the layout of the car is somewhat reminiscent of the serial American F-16 fighter. At that time, only a few aviation specialists representing the older generation noted that this is not entirely true. The new Russian fighter really resembles the F-16, but at the same time, the American fighter repeats the external features of the experienced Mikoyan E-8 fighter, which was born almost 15 years earlier than the F-16. The experimental E-8 fighter was a plane back in the 60s, which was many years ahead of its time.

The experienced E-8 interceptor was developed as a deep modernization of the MiG-21PF serial fighter, but it had so many new design features that it was decided to assign the future MiG-1960 index at the initial design stage. It was originally planned that the new fighter will replace the production of the MiG-23P and will be a massive aircraft. The creation of the new machine was carried out in accordance with the decision of the commission of the military-industrial complex from 21 in May 30 on the development of the MiG-1960 interceptor fighter. This aircraft was a development of the MiG-23PF, equipped with a new C-21 armament system, developed on the basis of the Sapphire-23 radar, the Spektr infrared direction finder, and two K-1 long-range missiles. The new E-23 fighter was intended to destroy air targets in both the front and rear hemispheres at any time of the day in simple and complex weather conditions.
E Series Experimental Fighters (Part-2) E-8 - Leading Time
MiG 1.44 MFI

The main problem in upgrading the aircraft was that the diameter of the Sapphire radar antenna in its original version significantly exceeded the diameter of the CD-30T radar antenna, which is why it was impossible to place it in the nose-cone of the serial MiG-21 fighter. This fact led to a redesign not only of the forward fuselage, but of the entire fighter as a whole. From the base model, with the exception of the tail, the wing and the main landing gear (and then not in full), almost nothing has survived. Moreover, the increased take-off weight of the new aircraft required the installation of a more powerful engine than the R-11F-300 engine, the new aircraft needed a propulsion unit with at least XG more than its predecessor 800-1000. In this case, the new engine should have the dimensions of the previous one, in order to calmly take its place.

An interesting fact is that the new engine was created not by the “native” OKB-300 S. K. Tumansky, but by the design bureau at the serial plant headed by N. G. Metskhvarishvili. At the same time, the designers applied the method of small increments of the basic parameters of the aircraft engine basic model: they slightly increased the diameter of the compressor flow and rotational speed, increased the compression ratio, changed the profile of the blades, used new heat-resistant alloys for the manufacture of turbine blades. The new engine was designated P-21F-300 (its simplified name P-21-300 is also quite common). This engine had the same systems as the P-11F-300, including the de-icing system of the inlet part, oxygen feed for the starting igniters (it allowed to increase the height of the launch). However, its weight and dimensions have changed slightly.
Experimental fighter E-8

The new engine successfully passed the bench tests: all the characteristics required by the project were obtained already on the 3-th copy of the aircraft engine. The creators managed to increase its thrust at maximum operating mode from 3950 to 4700 kgf, and in the afterburner mode from 6175 to 7200 kgf. Due to this, with the take-off weight of the E-8 6800 kg fighter, its thrust-to-weight ratio could exceed one.

Among the main aerodynamic features of the experimental E-8, three of the most significant could be identified. The first is an unusual type of air intake. The second is the ventral ridge that folds during the release of the chassis, which was later used on the MiG-23 serial fighter. The third is the presence of the front horizontal tail (PGO or "destabilizers") with a span of 2,6 meters, while the PGO did not have a control mechanism. At subsonic flight speeds of the fighter, the front horizontal tail was in a free weather vane mode, and at supersonic flight speeds at M> 1,5, it was fixed parallel to the building horizontal of the fighter, which made it possible to shift the focus of the machine forward, compensating for its displacement back when the speed of sound passed. This solution made it possible to increase the lift coefficient by more than 2 times at speeds that corresponded to or exceeded M = 1,5, and 2 times - at speeds equal to M = 2,0. At a speed of Mach 2 at an altitude of 15 km, the maximum permissible overload should have increased from 2,5 to 5,1, which was evidence of an improvement in the maneuverability of the vehicle.

Another novelty of the E-8 fighter was that all the fuel tanks in the fuselage were no longer rubber (supplementary) tanks, as on all existing serial modifications of the MiG-21. New tanks were included in the design of the aircraft and later became widespread on all fighters of the OKB MiG without exception. A total of experimental fighter E-8 could take in their tanks - 5 fuselage compartment tanks, as well as 4 wing tanks - 3200 liters of fuel. In addition, the E-8 fighter system was created to blow the boundary layer from the flaps during landing.

Also on the fighter was installed the rescue system "SC", created in the Design Bureau A. I. Mikoyan. But, while on the first serial fighters of the MiG-21 in the process of ejection, the seat from the cockpit was carried out in such a way that the pilot defended the oncoming airflow with the cockpit lantern, then the E-8 didn’t protect the pilot (he folded to the side and dropped separately) . For this reason, the ejection was limited to speed in 800 km / h.

The main differences of the E-8 fighter from the MiG-21PF:

- New power plant based on the P-21F-300 with an all-mode double nozzle;
- new head and tail fuselage, aircraft fuel tanks (for the first time in OKB practice) were part of the fuselage design;
- the presence of a flat ventral air intake with an adjustable vertical wedge;
- tail and wing with a serial fighter MiG-21PF with modifications to the new fuselage and docking with it;
- visor type flashlight with opening to the side, mounted SK-3 seat, the pilot rescue system is implemented without cockpit protection;
- Front horizontal tail assembly (destabilizer) is installed, horizontal tail assembly is lowered to 150 mm;
- one brake flap below;
- rejectable ventral crest;
- on the pylon under the fuselage 1 PTB with 600 capacity could be installed.

By September 1961, the new E-8 fighter project was completely ready, but the creators of the C-23 complex failed to pass on time either missiles or radars for testing, so the E-8 decided to temporarily install the conventional CS-30TP weapons system, two serial K-13 rockets and Gem infrared reamer. Cannon armament on the experimental fighter was not provided. At the same time, the fighter began to be designated as MiG-21M. In total, two flight copies of the vehicle were assembled: in January X-NUMX of the year E-1962 / 8 was ready, and in May of the same year - E-1 / 8.

On both prototypes instead of the radar were mounted their weight-and-weight models and KZA. The first flight of the E-8 / 1 fighter took place on 17 on April 1962 of the year, the plane took off in the air G.K. Mosolov, test pilot of the OKB-155. In this and subsequent test flights, in addition to determining the characteristics of controllability and stability of the fighter, the removal of altitude and speed indicators, the CGM mechanism was worked out, the air intake control algorithms were refined, and other tasks were solved. In general, the new machine was encouraging creators. At the same time, all spoiled the unreliability of the new power plant. Almost every flight recorded overheating, surging, etc. At least 6 once the engine of the fighter spontaneously stopped.

11 September 1962 of the year during the 40 flight, the E-8 / 1 fighter crashed and crashed 60 km southeast of LII. The fighter engine collapsed at a height of 10 000 meters at a speed that corresponded to M = 1,7. Inspection of the wreckage of the crashed car showed that the cause of the disaster was the destruction of the 6-th stage of the compressor. A piece of this stage broke through the body of the aircraft engine and damaged the fuel tank and both hydraulic systems, which led to loss of control of the machine and fire. After that, a fragment hit the right aileron, destroying it and launching the plane into a spiral fall. Test pilot Mosolov was able to eject from an inverted fighter at an altitude of about 8 kilometers, damaging his leg and arm. At the time of landing, he was even more traumatized. The pilot was found only 2,5 hours after the accident and was hospitalized in serious condition. The doctors could hardly save the test pilot's life.

29 July 1962 for the first time flew into the air E-8 / 2, which was piloted by A. V. Fedotov. By September 4 on this fighter 13 test flights were carried out to remove the flight characteristics from the suspension of the K-13 missile models, to work out the power plant, to study the destabilization of the shaking. On the plane, a practical ceiling was reached in 19 650 meters, as well as a maximum speed of 2050 km / h at an altitude of 15 000 meters. However, after the loss of the first instance of the fighter, flights to the E-8 / 2 were discontinued. After some time, due to the lack of reliability of the propulsion system, as well as due to the fact that the mirror of the new Sapphire radar could be significantly reduced and the MiG-21 fighter jet was inserted into the cone, the project was closed. For a long time after that, the E-8 / 2 fighter stood idle at the OKB flight station in Zhukovsky, after which it was used to conduct ground testing of a number of elements of the future MiG-23 fighter.

The new fighter could have been brought to the required level of reliability, but at that point in time the design bureau was already in full swing working on the design of an entirely new fighter MiG-23, which was equipped with a variable sweep wing. At the same time, actually at the very beginning of the 1960-s, the new E-8 fighter could become a maneuverable air combat vehicle, similar to the modern F-16 and MiG-29 fighters.

Performance characteristics of the E-8:

Dimensions: wingspan - 7,15 m., Length - 16,9 m.
Wing area - 23,12 square. m
Aircraft normal take-off weight - 6 800 kg., Maximum take-off - 8200 kg.
Engine type - TRDF P-21F-300, 7 200 kgf.
Maximum speed - 2230 km / h. (M = 2,1).
Practical ceiling - 20 300 m.
Climbing time - 18 000 meters - 5,9 min.
Armament: suspension points - 2, UR air-to-air P-3С or P-23Т.
Crew - 1 man.

Information sources:
-http: //www.dogswar.ru/oryjeinaia-ekzotika/aviaciia/4573-istrebitel-perehvatc.html
- http://www.airwar.ru/enc/xplane/e8.html
- http://ru.wikipedia.org
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72 comments
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  1. Mikhado
    Mikhado 1 November 2012 09: 01
    +5
    Yes, it is a pity that the work on capricious and dead-end, but "fashionable" then "clamshells" buried this handsome man. How many forces, means and lives of the testers were ditched for a variable sweep, then to return to the trapezoid wing with an integral layout (MiG-29 and Su-27). But what can you do, it is now obvious, then it seemed like a breakthrough in aerodynamics ...
    Also, new research and discoveries have buried the reverse sweep, with which they were worn so much, and the entire layout "a la" F-16 is outdated, our PAK-FA is proof of that.
    And then they missed a serious and inexpensive chance to pump the tested car to new opportunities ....
    1. kPoJluK2008
      kPoJluK2008 3 November 2012 14: 11
      +1
      Variable sweep was necessary at that time. It’s just that nothing technically perfect was developed, but the static instability scheme was still 20 years old ...
      And in bomber aviation, it’s better they haven’t come up with anything yet ...
  2. Kazak_30
    Kazak_30 1 November 2012 10: 45
    +10
    I sit and watch in the evenings the cycle "Wings of Russia" there from the very beginning until today about aviation. And at the end of each episode, I think which country was asked * ali ... How many ideas, how many technical solutions. We made the first jet airliner ... How much has been created that is still flying, and now all our G. let's buy from the West. where are we going?
    I agree that before we did this, we bought, copied, finished and produced! But why not do it militarily in our auto industry, everything is fine with us, and our bonuses for kickbacks are ready to cheat everything ...
    Boiling up!
    1. cherkas.oe
      cherkas.oe 4 November 2012 18: 00
      +3
      Quote: Kazak_30
      Boiling up!

      Not just my brother was boiling, but I also want to go with these sabers to these bonzes and ruin everyone from head to ass, as they, because of their bitchy greed, still destroy a little that is still good.
  3. Splin
    Splin 1 November 2012 12: 10
    +2
    The Chinese have brought to mind the eight in the form of the FC-1 (JF-17). American women consider their plane to be at the F-16B level.

    1. Windbreak
      Windbreak 1 November 2012 12: 51
      0
      Maybe Chengdu J-10, but not FC-1 (JF-17)?
      1. Splin
        Splin 1 November 2012 13: 35
        +3
        J-10 is an enlarged Israeli aircraft Lawi, which they developed on the basis of the Mirage did not take into service and sold all the documentation to the Chinese.

        And the Chinese bought the future FC-1 in the early 90s from Mikoyan. The G80 project was not closed. He went until the early 29s, along with the MiG-XNUMX. Then the preference was given to the second.
        1. Insurgent
          Insurgent 2 November 2012 15: 43
          0
          On the basis of the mirage was developed kfir and not lavi
          1. Splin
            Splin 2 November 2012 16: 04
            +1
            Kfir C.2 (Kefir) was a pure clone of the Mirage created by Israel, based on documents hanging in France. Lavi is his further development is more advanced, although I may be wrong. But it was not created completely from scratch, but the old foundation was used. Although, the most important Chinas were not sold. Without a normal Flight Control System (American-made), their J-10 does not fly very well.
            1. Insurgent
              Insurgent 2 November 2012 17: 09
              -1
              Well, why did you decide you have data, or maybe the designer shared with you
              1. Splin
                Splin 2 November 2012 17: 25
                +1
                About Papa Mirage? I read it a long time, therefore I say - I can be wrong. In the 90s, we did not have the Internet.
  4. gregor6549
    gregor6549 1 November 2012 13: 30
    +3
    Now it’s clear why Eurofighter is licked. New, this is well forgotten old.
    1. Splin
      Splin 1 November 2012 13: 49
      +3
      Eurofighter is made according to the "canard" aerodynamic design, in which there are no tail horizontal rudders, and the E8 has a normal aerodynamic design (the "cocked hat" version).
      1. gregor6549
        gregor6549 1 November 2012 17: 50
        +1
        The duck scheme was used in Eurofighter only because such a scheme underlies most of the aircraft of the French company Dassault, including the last Rafale, and has been worked out to the smallest detail for many years. All other European companies participating in the development and production of Eurofighter cannot boast of such successful designs suitable for a fighter. By the way, the E8 had a not quite "normal" scheme / It was a combination of a duck with a normal cocked hat, which was also well worked out by a MIG, but the E8 air intake was really new for that time. By the way, the MIG also has another plane, the MIG25, which was gladly licked not by Europeans, but by the Americans, creating their own F15.
        1. Splin
          Splin 1 November 2012 18: 10
          +1
          A bit wrong. The French used the tailless scheme on all their aircraft. There the height ailerons acted as rudders. A very successful layout with a stable aerodynamic effect. The "duck" scheme has always been practiced by the Swedes. "Rafale" and "Eurofighter" are built according to this scheme to improve maneuver. They can literally somersault in the air. In general, without a computer, they are not as stable as the "Black Hawk Down" of the Americans. Have you seen a single video or photo of a Chinese J-10 performing aerobatics? They have a problem with the course computer. As for the 25th, if the Americans made such air intakes, then only visually. Belenko hijacked the plane in September 76, and the F-15 entered service in March six months earlier. And in the 75th he took 8! world records.
          1. gregor6549
            gregor6549 2 November 2012 11: 35
            +1
            What you said does not contradict what I wrote. Moreover, in my post there was not a word about the Chinese aircraft.
            Concerning Ф15 at the end of 60х i.e. long before Belenko, in a number of foreign publications, Americans openly recognized that the design of the M15 airframe was based on the MIG25 airframe design.
            MIG25, stolen Belenko was a shock for the Americans in a completely different way. They did not expect such a frail avionics to stand on such an outwardly powerful aircraft. True, they appreciated that the MIG25 airframe used steel sheets joined by welding rather than traditional riveting, which made it possible to weld cracks and other damage to the MIG25 airframe in the field. And the last one. The hijacking of an airplane cost the USSR a very solid bag, because had to urgently change all ground and airborne equipment state system. recognition of air objects used in the USSR.
            1. Insurgent
              Insurgent 2 November 2012 19: 39
              0
              not quite so the Americans did not lick the scheme in an instant
              1. gregor6549
                gregor6549 4 November 2012 17: 56
                0
                Watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcO2HczBKoE&feature=g-vrec
                Maybe he will convince you more than me.
            2. Alex 241
              Alex 241 2 November 2012 20: 33
              +1
              George, no matter how much I read materials on hijacking, but no one has an unequivocal attitude towards him. There are too many dark spots. And they were planning to change the recognition system even without hijacking the aircraft.
          2. FID
            FID 2 November 2012 20: 30
            +2
            Quote: Splin
            There ailerons of elevation served as rudders

            I beg your pardon, but there is no such thing as "height aileron". Ailerons, on occasion, can play the role of elevators (while deflecting up or down), and so - ailerons perform the function of roll control.
            1. Splin
              Splin 2 November 2012 20: 33
              0
              I know - described. It turned out 2in1th. But all the same, they understood what it was about.
            2. Alex 241
              Alex 241 2 November 2012 20: 37
              0
              Seryozha, maybe spleen wanted to write elevons?
              1. FID
                FID 2 November 2012 20: 46
                +1
                Well yes, elevons. I'm just correcting. Not everyone knows the terms, they need to be corrected. On Mirages, elevons, on Eurofighters - PGO (front horizontal plumage). Always decrypt, for non-aviation. And then, sometimes, specialists will begin to swear in obscure words - take out the saints!
                1. Alex 241
                  Alex 241 2 November 2012 20: 49
                  0
                  Like Seryozha, I somehow read the branch where the submariners communicate bully that’s where the syllable, the terminology of course, is even easier for us wink
                  1. FID
                    FID 2 November 2012 20: 55
                    +1
                    Well yes. CNTs, interceptors, elevons, ailerons, cabling ... much more can be invented!
                    1. Alex 241
                      Alex 241 2 November 2012 20: 57
                      +1
                      So we’ll be simpler Seryozha, a pen on the sebe and the gloom bully
          3. Splin
            Splin 2 November 2012 20: 48
            +2
            Quote: Splin
            There ailerons of elevation served as rudders.

            I wanted to write like this "There ailerons play the role of elevators"

            As Alex correctly noted, these are elevons.
            1. FID
              FID 2 November 2012 20: 57
              +2
              Yes, you do not worry, it happens to everyone. Only specialists understand the intricacies (with difficulty, though)!
              1. Alex 241
                Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 04
                +1
                It all depends on the completeness of the poured glass drinks
                1. v53993
                  v53993 2 November 2012 21: 44
                  +1
                  And also from the volume of the glass. I apologize if I interfere.
              2. igor67
                igor67 2 November 2012 21: 05
                +1
                FID,
                Sergey, I have a question, maybe you know: in the late 80s we built a workshop for repairing the engine of product E, we brought in equipment, but the union broke up, what kind of engine is it and for which car?
                1. FID
                  FID 2 November 2012 21: 11
                  +4
                  Quote: igor67
                  in the late 80s, we built a workshop for repairing the engine of product E

                  All prototypes, tested in Zhukovsky and TsAGI, had the "E" index. Therefore .... you also need to know the number: E101 or something else.
                  1. igor67
                    igor67 2 November 2012 21: 15
                    +1
                    FID,
                    We didn’t have time to find out, the union had fallen earlier, we only had to take the workshop to operation, the only thing I remember was that the engine lodgement was much larger than the NK12 lodgement
        2. igor.borov775
          igor.borov775 2 November 2012 11: 58
          +1
          Hello everyone. Everything was set in its place. I had to refuse all the same, no breakthrough ideas could be seen. We would have jostled around or around 21 and its configuration, we would have been in an even worse situation, Remember after the collapse of the country the first duty almost all single-engine aircraft were removed, I sent another SU-24 bloodsucker there, it cost too much, How many pilots died in it in peacetime, Yes, if it doesn’t change memory, it sent a lot of testers, And 25 is really a new quality, MIG-29 MIG-31 MIG-35, There is still groundwork, And SU-27 really chose all the continuations no The following are completely different, He is a masterpiece of scientific thought, Everything put its places in time,
          1. Splin
            Splin 2 November 2012 12: 35
            +2
            Quote: igor.borov775
            Remember, after the collapse of the country, almost all single-engine aircraft were removed as the first duty,

            The layout scheme with one engine was removed in vain. There should be light and heavy fighters in the army. MIG-29 is by no means easy. The Union understood this and gave the assignment at C54-56
        3. Splin
          Splin 2 November 2012 12: 19
          +2
          What you said does not contradict what I wrote.

          Here is the Swedish "duck" here is the French "tailless".


          There is nothing to do with the GXNUMX. "Eurofighter" was generally developed by Italians, British and Germans.
          It has the usual triangular wing. And the fact that the nose wheels were set to increase maneuverability, so this idea was not new. Well, we are not pioneers in these areas! And it’s even for the best. We create already perfect samples than foreign ones experienced.
  5. admiral993
    admiral993 1 November 2012 15: 36
    0
    oh gbljhfcs! Such a plane, as usual, ghjt, fkb !!
  6. strelok107
    strelok107 1 November 2012 19: 14
    -1
    Chinese J-20 speak from our IFI copied
  7. maxiv1979
    maxiv1979 1 November 2012 19: 33
    +2
    Quote: Splin
    A bit wrong. The French used the tailless scheme on all their aircraft. There the height ailerons acted as rudders. A very successful layout with a stable aerodynamic effect. The "duck" scheme has always been practiced by the Swedes. "Rafale" and "Eurofighter" are built according to this scheme to improve maneuver. They can literally somersault in the air. In general, without a computer, they are not as stable as the "Black Hawk Down" of the Americans. Have you seen a single video or photo of a Chinese J-10 performing aerobatics? They have a problem with the course computer. As for the 25th, if the Americans made such air intakes, then only visually. Belenko hijacked the plane in September 76, and the F-15 entered service in March six months earlier. And in the 75th he took 8! world records.



    competently, there is nothing to add
  8. maxiv1979
    maxiv1979 2 November 2012 06: 32
    0
    Unfortunately, the school is lost, it takes 15 years to recover
  9. Chicot 1
    Chicot 1 2 November 2012 20: 15
    +4
    And I traditionally noted in the topic of air art in the subject ... smile

    MiG-23E-8. How could it be if ...
    1. Alex 241
      Alex 241 2 November 2012 20: 25
      +3
      Weekdays of agricultural aviation
    2. Chicot 1
      Chicot 1 2 November 2012 21: 10
      +2
      And another version of the art with the MiG-23E-8 ...
      As can be clearly seen, he practically repeats the photo of the fighter one to one (with possibly minimal changes). However, this is a normal and common practice of artists painting equipment (and not only aviation) to take photographs as the basis for their work ...
    3. cherkas.oe
      cherkas.oe 4 November 2012 18: 36
      +1
      thank you dearChicot 1,
      Quote: Chicot 1

      MiG-23E-8. How could it be if ...
  10. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 20: 23
    +3
    Basil, according to tradition, I answer good :

    Topical bully .............
    1. Chicot 1
      Chicot 1 2 November 2012 20: 57
      +2
      Alexander good
      And yet, I, too, shy away on such a topic ... wink laughingYYY
  11. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 05
    +1
    And here we are, Vasily. wink
    1. Chicot 1
      Chicot 1 2 November 2012 21: 18
      +2
      Flying cows is certainly harsh! .. But it is much more convenient to bomb caterpillar locomotives ... wink
      1. v53993
        v53993 2 November 2012 21: 41
        +2
        It’s more convenient to bomb from everything that reaches the bombing object.
  12. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 24
    +3
    Harvesting Party Care wink
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 21: 39
      +1
      It’s a pity the board, this pack of his comrades is not worth it.
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 44
        +2
        Volodya, don’t worry, nobody was hurt. Ours is at the helm. Extra confirmation, born to crawl, leave the runway. I’ll throw you the Khotilov pictures right now.
        1. Alex 241
          Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 47
          +1
          ...........................................................................
          1. v53993
            v53993 2 November 2012 23: 24
            +1
            Thank you, I’m familiar. This is from the MIG-25th on the pedestal, from the town.
            1. Alex 241
              Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 30
              +1
              Volodya, yes it would be for what.
    2. Chicot 1
      Chicot 1 2 November 2012 21: 49
      +2
      A still from the movie "The Baron of Arms" (if I'm not mistaken) with Nikolos Cage in the title role ... smile
      Well, as a respected v53993, it’s more convenient to bomb from everything from which it will fly ... Please ... wink
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 54
        +2
        Here you have a bomber crew.
        1. Chicot 1
          Chicot 1 2 November 2012 22: 00
          +1
          Great crew !!! Immediately obvious, in good shape ... more precisely, with good ones! ...
          And these are the interceptors that fly towards him ...
          1. Alex 241
            Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 02
            +1
            But there are more bombers.
            1. Chicot 1
              Chicot 1 2 November 2012 22: 17
              +2
              But the interceptors have a better sponsor ... bully
              1. Alex 241
                Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 19
                +2
                And drinks us crew.
                1. Chicot 1
                  Chicot 1 2 November 2012 22: 32
                  +2
                  drinks
                  Yes, of course you have crews oh-hoo, but we have techies no-shit! .. laughing
                  1. Alex 241
                    Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 34
                    +2
                    Well wow, we have flint techies.
                    1. v53993
                      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 39
                      +2
                      The plane is not ours, and the techie is indecently clean.
                      1. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 42
                        +4
                        Vova is better than our techies. On the knee they’ll take apart anything and collect. Many thanks to them, and bow to the ground.
                      2. v53993
                        v53993 2 November 2012 23: 07
                        +2
                        He himself is practically a techie, a signalman. They lived as a family and always got along.
                      3. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 12
                        +1
                        An excellent regiment, I still remember. soldier
                      4. studentmati
                        studentmati 2 November 2012 23: 15
                        +2
                        This is really 1000% true! And the beauty is that our techies will never go home without completing their job! Real men !!!
                      5. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 16
                        +2
                        And the main Russian estimate, they’ll always come up with something. Kulibins.
                      6. studentmati
                        studentmati 2 November 2012 23: 23
                        +2
                        Again San for you 1. There is no doubt that they will come up with it. And usually not even for "liter", but simply "for respect." It's worth it all! Agree !?
                      7. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 29
                        +2
                        For thanks they will be killed, but they will make Sanya, but it is necessary to set the scale for the sake of respect.
                      8. studentmati
                        studentmati 2 November 2012 23: 33
                        +2
                        Of course, you need to set, simply because they are one link in the chain. The MOSCOW is still still held by the Russian army!
                      9. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 42
                        +2
                        And she always held on. soldier
                      10. studentmati
                        studentmati 2 November 2012 23: 46
                        0
                        Of course!!! And glory to our parents that raised us MUSIC !!! Sanya, while we are alive and on our feet, the Motherland can count on us in a full clip!
                      11. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 50
                        +1
                        But in another way, there is no other HOMELAND.
                    2. Chicot 1
                      Chicot 1 2 November 2012 23: 05
                      +2
                      Nice wash ... But we have a fierce materiel ... angry laughing
                      1. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 10
                        +1
                        Against ours weakly. soldier
                      2. Chicot 1
                        Chicot 1 2 November 2012 23: 29
                        +1
                        Terrible ... But our materiel will flood at least someone! Even with a trench tool ... bully
                      3. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 39
                        +2
                        And best of all, beautifully and in Russian.

                        ................................................................
                      4. Alex 241
                        Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 39
                        +1
                        .................................................. ..............................
                        ..
                      5. Chicot 1
                        Chicot 1 4 November 2012 16: 52
                        +2
                        Beautiful and in Russian, it’s good ... smile ... (1100)
            2. v53993
              v53993 2 November 2012 22: 20
              +1
              It looks like a wedge tired, at the end of the day.
              1. Alex 241
                Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 21
                +1
                A big plane will fly in, eat all the little ones, and then die wink
        2. v53993
          v53993 2 November 2012 22: 18
          +1
          Wash it is a brothel. Or am I not understanding something?
          1. v53993
            v53993 2 November 2012 23: 09
            +1
            Rather, I do not understand, I'm sorry.
            1. Alex 241
              Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 11
              0
              Yes Volodya is okay. Just kidding.
  13. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 21: 50
    +2
    ............................................................................

    maybe I saw. I don’t know.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 09
      +2
      Sasha, it was all in front of my eyes. Around one in the morning, rain, haze, high approach to the strip. After the end just rained down. After touching the spark, flame. Well done Vasiliev (RP), gave the command for bailouts. Knysh, regiment commander, you said what a fool you are doing. But he essentially saved the pilots. As soon as they left, without even reaching the highest point of ejection, the plane exploded. Everything still stands before my eyes.
      And I was completing the construction of the KDP already working in LLC "INZHTRASSTROY"
    2. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 32
      0
      I haven’t seen it, but there’s not enough of the real in Khotilovo. The radio is cut off. And there were still miracles, with the landing of two sides in Andreapol. They were not expected there, they turned on only 5 minutes before landing. I served before Khotilovo for 5 years.
  14. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 11
    +2
    Volodya, I was at your seniority in Gromovo, I fell the 31st, almost a similar situation.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 14
      0
      You wrote to me about this. It just happened before our eyes. There were more commissions than people. Well, you understand.
      1. Alex 241
        Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 16
        +1
        I know this is imprinted in life and memory forever.
        1. v53993
          v53993 2 November 2012 22: 22
          +1
          So that we no longer see this. But pilots do not fall into such situations.
  15. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 23
    +1
    Pah pah pah Volod. We will live happily ever after.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 36
      +1
      I haven’t seen the video, but there’s not much from real in Khotilovo. The radio is cut off. And there were still miracles, with the landing of two sides in Andreapol. They were not expected there, they turned on only 5 minutes before landing. I served before Khotilovo for 5 years.
  16. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 40
    +1
    Volodya it is understandable, the full version of the radio is hard to get, but at least we find out what happened, and not from the news.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 45
      +1
      Everyone rushed to the plane first. Darkly began to look for pilots. And the plane burns, and the gun shoots. They all lay down and shots counted. And he shot towards Borisovsky, but no one was hurt.
  17. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 47
    +1
    Fuck, Vova, I didn’t know such details. And even the fairing of the gun opened?
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 22: 52
      +1
      I don’t know what opened, because I’m a signalman, but I shot for about ten minutes. Next to me lay the deputy. by IAS. He said when to get up.
  18. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 22: 58
    +1
    Vova most likely Bk was torn, the gun there unloaded at a time.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 23: 03
      +1
      Maybe, although he flew without rockets. And as far as I know, only the gun is not being cut. The deputy on IAS told me about this when, 200 meters from the plane, they laid their nose into the ground.
  19. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 05
    +1
    Yes Volod, cannon ammunition on an airplane. Plus a squib in the pylons,
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 23: 11
      +1
      Probably it was. Well, at least the pilots landed on the ground, and not on the concrete. Only the navigator had a slight fracture of something in the area of ​​his leg. Then he continued to fly.
  20. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 14
    +1
    That’s for sure, Ato would have given a nail on concrete, had God not brought.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 23: 17
      +1
      That’s for sure, one armchair on a concrete block. Lucky guys.
  21. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 18
    +1
    God loves aviation.
    1. v53993
      v53993 2 November 2012 23: 20
      +1
      I agree. And we love her. God give them all soft landings!
  22. Alex 241
    Alex 241 2 November 2012 23: 22
    +1
    Aviation-Mother dear.
  23. VLADIMIR700
    VLADIMIR700 8 November 2012 18: 49
    0
    Informative article fellow