American heavy equipment of the Armed Forces of Ukraine is shown in impassable Ukrainian mud

Autumn in Ukraine, as in the southern regions of Russia, is mud and mud on the roads. In the current conditions of hostilities, troops have to operate in rural areas, where there are often simply no roads. Almost continuous rains wash away dirt roads in rural areas and in small towns.

So, difficult times have come for the Ukrainian army, especially considering that today a significant part of the Armed Forces of Ukraine units move on Western-made equipment. American cars get stuck in the mud, with difficulty overcoming natural obstacles.

At the same time, our troops have similar problems. Dirt is the same for everyone. True, Soviet-style equipment was designed taking into account possible hostilities on viscous, soggy soil.

Military correspondents publish photos of equipment of the Ukrainian army. They are wearing HMMWV vehicles and American-made M113 armored personnel carriers, which are currently used by units of the Ukrainian ground forces. It can be seen that the cars hardly make their way through the impassable mud of Ukrainian country roads.

In addition, an American M58 MICLIC demining system was also spotted in the area of ​​confrontation between Ukrainian and Russian troops. It is designed to make passages in minefields in an explosive way. In some ways, its principle of operation is reminiscent of the UR-77 Meteorite, a Soviet self-propelled demining machine. That is, with its help, during the clash, "moves" are made in the minefields of the enemy.

It is difficult to say how much such equipment Ukraine has already received from the United States and its allies in Europe. But there is no doubt that many HMMWVs and M113s have already died in the steppes of Ukraine, having been destroyed by Russian troops. Now, cars stuck in the mud will be added to them. Some of them have to be abandoned by the Ukrainian military in order not to waste precious time on their evacuation.

Comments

[dmi.pris1]

By the way, our technology is also difficult. They crawl on their belly.

[cold wind]

Quote: dmi.pris

By the way, our technology is also difficult. They crawl on their belly.

Right. Hundreds of our vehicles became trophies after getting stuck in the mud. Only MTLB has superior cross-country ability.

[Fisherman]

so hundreds? Do they give accurate information in TsIPSO?

[Shurik70]

Quote from cold wind

Hundreds of pieces of equipment of our steel from trophies after getting stuck in the mud

In order for "hundreds" of stuck equipment to become trophies, these hundreds should be stuck near the front shortly before the offensive.
And there have been no major offensive operations recently. Both sides.

[Negro]

M113 is the American motorcycle league. Yes, and the Hummer is very good in a tank track, it was created for it. Of course, if it is for Dagestan tuning with low-profile tires.

[Alexander Lebedev]

In general, you are right, at one time up to half of all LDNR equipment was former tasty, you abandoned a lot of your equipment.

[Uncle lee]

Mud champing oily and rusty,
Horses are tied up in stirrups,
But they drag me with a sleepy power,
That limp, swollen from sleep.

[Aaron Zawi]

Technology is a consumable. The United States and its allies are still competently playing the situation in which the war has turned into a positional one.

[Master 2030]

No "dirt" was needed to blow the latest T-90 with bells and whistles. And now the "guards" generally have an iron excuse. "Why did they abandon 10 tanks" - "So the rain has passed." And now the "dirt" is not far away. For some reason, Ukrainians do not complain. I liked the photo where the excavator digs out the tank. And who’s stopping the “guardsmen from taking shovels in their hands, digging them dry, calling an ARV with a winch and pulling the front rollers onto dry ground.

[SKVichyakow]

This technique is not intended for our climate zone at all.

[Fisherman]

not only are these carts-yanks not for the muddy black soil, but also after the fragmentation of the wheels, the dill abandon wheeled vehicles - stupidly there is no specialized rubber, it is not in the supply. And about the M113, Kedmi said very well: in the Israeli army, after the very first battle experiments, it was forbidden to introduce these boxes into the affected areas with artillery and small arms - it breaks through easily and burns out along with the crew and troops, they often do not have time to get out, so dill ride with open doors - to have time to fall out if that ...

[Negro]

Quote: Fisherman

. And about the M113, Kedmi said very well: in the Israeli army, after the very first battle experiments, it was forbidden to introduce these boxes into the affected areas with artillery and small arms - it breaks through easily and burns out along with the crew and troops

A broken clock shows the correct time twice a day, a stick shoots once a year, and Kedmi for once did not lie.
Jews don't really use M113 on the first line. They make heavy armored personnel carriers at the tank base, including the Merkava base for 70 tons.

But, frankly, few people have such armored personnel carriers. The Russian Federation, for example, does not have such.

[North Caucasus]

in the Israeli army, after the very first battle experiments, it was forbidden to introduce these boxes into the affected areas with artillery and small arms - it breaks through easily and burns out along with the crew and troops, they often do not have time to get out, so the dill ride with open doors - to have time to fall out if anything ...

Well, what can I say? Well done Israelis! The question is different. Do our designers of military vehicles take into account foreign experience? I don’t follow military equipment very much, but our people seem to be in no hurry to apply foreign experience. Correct me if there are experts.

[SKVichyakow]

Quote: North Caucasus

Well, what can I say? Well done Israelis! The question is different. Do our designers of military vehicles take into account foreign experience? I don’t follow military equipment very much, but our people seem to be in no hurry to apply foreign experience. Correct me if there are experts.

Why is their experience not taken into account, taken into account. Just don't rush. They made a heavy infantry fighting vehicle based on the Almaty, although I won’t specify a sample or a mock-up, and that’s it.

[Fisherman]

I agree that ours are well studying other people's experience, but the experience of the war with the Palestinians is not very useful to us .... it is precisely the lack of understanding with whom we will have to fight, at what intensity and at what theater of operations that does not allow us to produce the necessary weapons in advance. Therefore, they plan "from the defense" of their territory.

[North Caucasus]

The outskirts of Russia is not Palestine. This is NATO's shock fist. Military analysts did not see what was happening there and what was being prepared? Or do we not have military analysts? There are advisors, but there are no analysts! And what did the advisers in skirts advise us?

[Fisherman]

hardly anyone expected that all of NATO would trample its weapons to dill ... in fact, the Ukrainian army was defeated in two months ... then NATO harnessed itself and began to supply weapons and ammunition ...

[SKVichyakow]

Quote: Fisherman

hardly anyone expected that all of NATO would trample on their weapons to dill.

For such purposes, there are analysts. It's their job and the modulation of everything that happens on the computer.

[Fisherman]

everyone has a lot of analysts, only you can’t insert all the options into the strategy, otherwise it will crack and you don’t have to try to start anything.

[North Caucasus]

Here the question is probably not the severity of the car, but the maximum protection of the fighters. Disembarkation through the back door or on the sides? What is more efficient and safer? Are the seats suspended or bolted to the floor? Which scope and stock is better? Which radio is better? What is the best first aid kit? Well, and so on.

[Timofey Smagin]

Heh! I wonder how many meters a 70-ton Merkava will travel through Ukrainian mud ... After all, it was made for a rocky desert, actually. And no bridge can withstand it.

[lucul]

This technique is not intended for our climate zone at all.

The title photo is credited)))
According to the Germans themselves, they sent the tanker forward in front of the Tiger, and if a person fell into the ground, then the Tiger would not be able to pass there either. Only it seemed that they put the second person on their shoulders - the specific pressure of the Tiger on the ground was equal to the weight of 1.5 human specific pressure. 70 years have passed - but they did not draw conclusions, they still send a person forward))))

[Captain Pushkin]

In fact, this technique crawled through the mud back in Vietnam.
There is definitely no less rain and mud in Vietnam than in Ukraine.

[Murmur 55]

Well, yes, and ours are hovering right above the mud, the same difficulties and problems, and maybe a little more.

[KCA]

I didn’t serve in / on, but like in the North Caucasus, shishigs, Urals and armored vehicles fly along the road, where I saw dirt above the knee, and I also saw it across the field, and in the field I walked along the road, it’s normal, after a couple of steps the boots weigh three kilograms . Here's another thing - motorcycle leagues are also not ideal, on that road they sat on the belly and FSE, and the Ural 4310 and 4320 only scattered dirt around, and the BTR-80 too

[Fred Dozer]

I call them sitting ducks that need to be bred.

[Silver99]

"abrams" 70 tons weighs the very thing to cut through the mud Their history does not teach anything, the Germans also tried to conquer the dirt on narrow tracks, like these wedges. They don't even have lugs.

[cold wind]

Yes, yes, continue to carry this propaganda nonsense, haven't you had enough of it yet? So in any military registration and enlistment office, as a volunteer and to the front.
The Abrams will get stuck exactly where our Teshki are. Their pressure on the ground is approximately the same, the specific power of the Abrams
above. One compensates for the other. Weight by itself does not affect patency.

[begemot20091]

Quote from cold wind

The ground pressure is about the same.

What are you
T-80 specific power (diesel)=27,4
M1A2 Abrams =24
Т-80 Specific ground pressure, kg/cm²= 0,83–0,87
M1A2 Abrams 1,07
I do not guarantee for the ultimate truth, but we all suddenly became "military experts", designers, weapons developers ......

[Fisherman]

yeah .... about the Abrams, this cold breeze amused me notably :)))

[Il'nur]

this cold breeze amused me notably :)))

And what did you want, "every sandpiper praises his own swamp", and in this case, every ukropetik praises someone else's, Amer's, they don't have their own ... Either bayraktars, then javelins with heimers, and now they praise abros ...

[Molten]

"each sandpiper praises his swamp"

It seems that here a person just does not praise his own, but soberly assesses the situation, comparing the characteristics. he did not praise anything at all, neither his own nor the enemy's.
You yourself came up with something, sketching out about dill and bayraktars.
And who is the marsh sandpiper here after that))))

[Il'nur]

soberly assesses the situation

Where did you see a sober assessment?!
Here is a sober assessment

behemoth

T-80 specific power (diesel)=27,4
M1A2 Abrams =24
Т-80 Specific ground pressure, kg/cm²= 0,83–0,87
M1A2 Abrams 1,07

And what, you want to say that they didn’t pray for bayraktars to javelin, they didn’t compose songs

[Molten]

Here is a sober assessment

I myself am too lazy to google and compare, but in the post below the same Wind denied all this, citing completely different numbers.
So I still consider his words to be a "sober assessment". (Behemoth himself admitted even lower that he just poked at the clave, and does not pretend to the truth)
And also this Wind does not pray anywhere either for javelins, or for bayraktars, or for Abrams.
But you are just trying to elevate our T-shki in every possible way)))
So all the same - who is the swamp sandpiper here?))))

[Il'nur]

our T-shki are trying in every possible way to elevate

I did not exalt, but so far there is nothing to compare, the Abrams are not participating yet, they will, then you can compare ...
I wanted to point out that a comrade (taking him for a ukra) praised the abrams, as before the Ukrainians boasted of foreign weapons ...
And the performance characteristics below were not brought by a hippopotamus, but by some kind of wind, so he praises the abrams in every possible way, belittling the t-shki ...

[cold wind]

Quote: begemot20091

What are you
T-80 specific power (diesel)=27,4
M1A2 Abrams =24
Т-80 Specific ground pressure, kg/cm²= 0,83–0,87
M1A2 Abrams 1,07
I do not guarantee for the ultimate truth, but we all suddenly became "military experts", designers, weapons developers ......

It is a masterpiece. They wrote the characteristics of the T-80U, instead of the T-80 or the Ukrainian T-80UD (with 6TD-1, the gain is 21,7). They gave an example of one of the rarest tanks in our army. Can you compare with T-62, T-73A / B / B3 (mod 2011/2014), T-90A? They form the main fleet of our equipment. T-80U is an extremely rare bird. T-90M and T-72B3 (sample 2016) are still found, they are somehow close in mobility to M1A1 / M1A2 (there are 4000 of them in storage).
The fact that you can’t guarantee it became clear from the first lines, and the fact that you decided to do something “suddenly” is also visible.
So for reference.
Specific power, l. s./t: T-64A = 18; T-72B = 19; T-80 = 23,5; T-80U = 27,1; T-90A = 21,5; T-90M = 23,5; M1A2 SEP = 23,8; 2A6M = 24.

[lucul]

It is a masterpiece

Ahahaahah))))
This is definitely a masterpiece
At first he began to lie about the specific pressure on the ground (they say that it is the same for Western tanks as for ours), and when they dipped their nose into the facts, they immediately jumped off to the specific power, because it doesn’t work.
Ahahaahah))))

[Molten]

At first he began to lie about the specific pressure on the ground (they say that it is the same for Western tanks as for ours), and when they dipped their nose into the facts, they immediately jumped off for specific power

And why did you start lying and jumping around, waiting for him to dunk you with his nose?
The man directly wrote - "Ground pressure they have about the same power density the Abrams are higher. One compensates for the other."

[lucul]

The man directly wrote - "The pressure on the ground is approximately the same for them, the specific power of the Abrams is higher. One compensates for the other."

Where is the same? Or are you comparing the difference with parsecs and light years? ))))
A difference in specific ground pressure of 20% is a lot for off-road.

[Molten]

When it came to "sameness", you wrote that he jumps from pressure to power.

When I started talking to you about your lies, citing a quote where he originally wrote about both power and pressure, you jumped back to "sameness".
Be consistent in your answers.

[begemot20091]

Yes, I said that "not the ultimate truth" = just poked into Claudia and Google threw it away. And to argue with you ... I know a little shells and bombs = and even those where ..... In general, I know a little. And about what I heard and read on the fence - I will not write. I listen to smart people.

[VyacheSeymour]

Quote from Silver99

They don't even have lugs.

Well, it’s clear for tractors that they are, and specific ...- but for armored vehicles, lugs ...- this is something new! Or did you mean a self-pulling log?

[Bayun]

what is the point in a narrow "goose"? It's the same as a "parquet SUV": the pressure on the ground is higher, and it takes off one-two-stop.

[Vladimir80]

The article is our next imaginary "victory", what will we hope for next step ??? If there really is such impassable mud - where are the strikes against enemy equipment that is stuck in the mud ???

[North Caucasus]

Or maybe the weather is non-flying in the mud? Zero visibility. How to search for a target? By instruments? What does our military-industrial complex offer for such cases? After all, they seemed to be preparing for the war, exhibitions were held. And where is now all this modern splendor of military equipment that has no analogues in the world? Well, submarines and hypersound are probably not applicable here, and you can keep silent about them. What about the other?

[Dedok]

What is the article about? - about the thaw on the TVD?
and what new things have been brought to us in it?

[lucul]

What is the article about? - about the thaw on the TVD?
and what new things have been brought to us in it?

Failed in letters? )))
An article about the fact that Western armored vehicles do not drive on our off-road in spring and autumn.)))

[Dedok]

Quote: lucul

An article about the fact that Western armored vehicles do not drive on our off-road in spring and autumn.))

and a wrangler and a prado and a padzherka in the village - they show such tricks, they really try with might and main with a cornfield, but not with that comfort

[lucul]

and a Wrangler and a Prado and a Padzherka in the village - such frills show

Uh-huh, that is, when you see how Western SUVs knead the dirt better than the Zhiguli, do you conclude that Western armored vehicles have the same advantage over ours in cross-country ability? )))) Yes ?

[Negro]

Quote: lucul

An article about the fact that Western armored vehicles do not drive on our off-road in spring and autumn.)))

Meanwhile, roughly all heavy tracked construction vehicles are Caterpillars or Komatsu.

[begemot20091]

Let me whistle. KRAZ and TATRA saved us in the north, and the rest stood like a stake in the cold. Instead of antifreeze, solarium "boiled". On the return line "moonshine still". Another light bulb in the fuel tank in the cold, like snot.

[Okolotochny]

Magiruses have not shown themselves badly yet.

[Dedok]

Quote: Negro

Meanwhile, roughly all heavy tracked construction vehicles are Caterpillars or Komatsu.

there was also International and Fiat-Allis

[Toucan]

I will tell you a little secret, our equipment also does not like waterlogged soil. A lot depends on the qualifications of the driver. However, the SU-90 was kept on the border with China until the beginning of the 100s. The patency of these self-propelled guns due to the different design of the caterpillar in swampy terrain was higher than that of the T-55.

[rocket757]

Now, cars stuck in the mud will be added to them. Some of them have to be abandoned by the Ukrainian military in order not to waste precious time on their evacuation.

. And how much fuel is needed to move through the mud, it’s finally a horror!

[APASUS]

I wonder how the French Caesars are now dragging themselves through the mud?

[Negro]

Quote: APASUS

how are the French Caesars now dragging themselves through the mud?

As well as Krazy with the Urals. But in general, art on a wheelbase works on the roads, and not from the fields.

[Uprun]

Techniques are different techniques ...., there was a case at the training ground, tactics lessons ..... Snow to the waist ...., T-64s stuck, T-72s were still crawling ..., oil painting - 3 tanks from a hill across the field, as if on asphalt, they passed by ...., as it turned out, the T-80s were secret at that time ...., they passed, only there was a whistle behind .....

[cold wind]

A very simple explanation of what you saw with your own eyes. Specific power, l. s./t: T-64A = 18; T-72B = 19; T-80 = 23,5.
But this parameter is for Western tanks.

[lucul]

A very simple explanation of what you saw with your own eyes.

For cross-country ability, a more important parameter is the specific pressure on the ground, and not the specific power.
And with the specific pressure on the ground, all Western equipment is very bad.))))

[Negro]

Quote: lucul

And with the specific pressure on the ground, all Western equipment is very bad.))))

Kilogram per centimeter +/- 20%. And not in the western, but in any, except for a specialized swamp.

[Dimax-nemo]

And who said that there were T-64A?
Well, who is to blame for us, that they also abandoned the turbine ..... now there is no use for the longer range of diesel tanks. And from "suitcases" - we rape everything B-2.

[D16]

Power density,

Are you looking forward to hydroplaning? . Specific power characterizes the ability of equipment to quickly accelerate, and not patency. For better cross-country ability, high ground clearance and low specific pressure are needed. Dope tanks and so enough. Although 64s, due to the low torque of "suitcases", require higher qualifications from mechanical drivers, Maybe that's why they sat down earlier.

[ZIF122]

Well, then, while they got stuck in the mud, they had to be covered with artillery and aircraft until they had no maneuver!

[North Caucasus]

So then it was necessary to cover them in bulk when they went to the front! There were no funds for wholesale destruction, but there were heaps of funds for a single defeat? Some strange mathematics in this war. Derailing a train or bombing a bridge is expensive. And to wet at the front by the piece, that's it!

[Mint Gingerbread]

I look at static images and see how they are driving and screaming "we're stuck! we're stuck." No, I'm not a telepath.
Many people can not get stuck in such shit

[Magellan]

The article is about nothing, it is clear that it works both ways. Marshal Mud vs. Everyone

[spectr]

Interestingly, Russia uses temporary road complexes there, which it once boasted of or is again prohibited?

[Fangaro]

The more often our news shows how Americans, Poles, Ukrainians, along with their equipment, get stuck and become helpless, the less faith our media has.
From the cries that "we are the strongest in the world," the nephew of the horns will not be added.

[Sergeant_Soviet_Army]

There is only one mud for everyone, only American equipment, more and more on the asphalt of Europe, but on the sand of the Middle East I rode, but I never had a chance to ride on our mud. Everything happens sometime for the first time. And last...

[Russian Patriot]

Articles like this are both funny and sad. Reminiscent of Alekseev's children's fairy tales about the war.
The technique of the enemy is bad, it gets stuck in the mud, breaks ...
And ours, on the contrary, is the best. How magical.
Only the reality is completely different. Not so fabulous.

[Dimax-nemo]

I remember a review of H1 Hummers in Autopilot magazine in the shaggy years. They were driven at our tank range and the cross-country ability was rated as excellent. M113 - tracked. But all sorts of MRAPs - yes, these are hard.

[alexey alexeyev_2]

It was not about the bobbin - ........ I was sitting in the cab. That's why we don't build good roads because there are Urals and Kamaz trucks. I saw the Urals in the tundra. This is a song. And Btr -80 in general with four bridges and all leading ....

[Augustine]

What young and healthy guys in the photo. It is a pity that Russia did not return Ukraine to the all-Russian field in a timely manner. So would these guys work or serve in the interests of our country

[certero]

What this article is about, I have no idea.
The title suggests an analysis of the shortcomings of American technology, or at least a comparison with ours.