Project SAO 2S42 "Lotos": two prototypes for state tests

The first prototype of the SAO "Lotos" on trials

Currently, tests and fine-tuning of the promising airborne self-propelled artillery gun 2S42 "Lotos" are being carried out. So far, one prototype machine is participating in these events, but a second prototype will join it in the foreseeable future. As reported, the presence of two self-propelled guns will allow you to fully test and work out all the new features of technology.

During the test

The first experimental "Lotus" was built a few years ago. In November 2020, he passed acceptance tests, and in August 2022, they announced the completion of preliminary tests. At that time, work was underway to eliminate the identified deficiencies and prepare for the next stage of inspections. In addition, in the 3rd quarter of the next 2023, they planned to start state tests.

October 25 RIA News revealed new details of ongoing work on Lotus and plans for the near future. Information of this kind was provided by an informed source in an unnamed structure.

According to the source, the first experimental CAO 2S42 is now in the third stage of work. Correction of the shortcomings revealed during the previous tests is carried out. These or other shortcomings are present in the design of the chassis, on-board electronic equipment and automatic loader. The nature of such problems and how to eliminate them are not given.

Experienced CAO at the forum "Army"

The source also said that the industry has already begun construction of the second prototype, which is necessary for the next stage of inspections. With the help of two prototypes, the customer will be able to conduct full-fledged state tests. First of all, it will be possible to check the interaction of self-propelled guns during joint combat work and the performance of tasks.

The source mentions that a second Lotus is being built for use in government trials. These activities, according to current plans, will begin at the end of 2023. Whether they will have time to assemble an experienced self-propelled gun by this time is not specified.

The deadlines for completing state tests and carrying out the following procedures and activities are not reported again. Nevertheless, already known and new information suggests that the Lotos SAO will be put into service no earlier than 2024. In the coming years, serial production of equipment for delivery to the army will begin.

New solutions

The promising SAO 2S42 Lotos is being created at TSNIITOCHMASH (part of the Kalashnikov concern) in the interests of the airborne troops. In the foreseeable future, such equipment will go into parts and begin to replace the existing self-propelled guns of the 2S9 Nona-S line. The new project uses and develops some of the ideas taken from Nona. This provides for the widespread introduction of new solutions and components that will provide an increase in performance and provide new opportunities.

So, in order to unify the equipment of the Airborne Forces, a promising CAO is being built on the basis of a modified chassis of the BMD-4M landing vehicle. Such a chassis is distinguished by an elongated body and an additional pair of road wheels; it also provides for the restructuring of internal volumes and equipment. The driving characteristics of the 2S42 remain at the level of the BMD-4M. The combat weight is 18 tons, thanks to which the self-propelled gun can swim and parachute.

The fighting compartment of the new development is mounted on the chassis. It is built around a 120-mm "universal" smooth-bore gun that performs the functions of a gun, howitzer and mortar. There is an automatic loader compatible with various types of ammunition. The rate of fire is up to 8 rds / min. The range of fire, depending on the ammunition, is 13 km. The main gun is complemented by a remote-controlled weapon station with a 7,62 mm machine gun.

It is known that a new fire control system has been created for the Lotus, which makes it possible to realize the potential of the 120-mm gun. It includes sights of various types, incl. commander's panoramic instrument, ballistic computer, weather sensors, crew workstations, etc. The JMA is also responsible for the use of the DBMS.

SAO 2S42 is being developed for the Airborne Forces and should work in the communications circuits of this type of troops. To do this, the machine receives communication equipment and other devices compatible with the Andromeda automated command and control system. Such equipment will allow the self-propelled gun and its crew to exchange data with other gunners and the unit commander, receive target designation, etc. Due to this, the effective combat work of both individual SAOs and entire units will be ensured.

In the next stage

To date, the only "Lotus" has passed several stages of testing, the purpose of which was to check the main systems and assemblies. So, the car showed the required driving characteristics and mobility on land and on water. In addition, the firing qualities of the new weapons complex were demonstrated. In general, the experimental CAO coped with the tests, although some shortcomings were identified.

The new self-propelled gun will be used by the artillery of the Airborne Forces as part of fire platoons and batteries. For this reason, as part of the tests, it is necessary to work out the issues of joint operation of several combat vehicles. In addition, it is necessary to check the interaction of such units with the existing automated control system. It is obvious that it will simply not be possible to conduct such tests using only one experienced Lotus. It was in connection with this that TsNIITOCHMASH began the construction of the second prototype.

As reported, the first prototype is now being finalized based on the results of previous tests. The second machine should immediately be built according to an improved version of the project. Accordingly, next year two SAOs of the final form will go to state tests, and in this form they will show the full potential of the 2S42 project in its final version.

Predictable future

SAO "Lotos" has not yet passed all the stages of testing, but the course of further events is already clear. So, in about a year, a second prototype will appear, made according to an updated project. Together with the existing machine, he will go to the training ground, and over the next few months, the equipment will again work on the tracks and shooting ranges.

Previous events give cause for optimism and allow us to avoid negative forecasts. Apparently, already in 2024, two "Lotus" will confirm the design characteristics, and a new model of armored vehicles will receive recommendations for adoption and for the launch of mass production.

In this case, the first 2S42 products can be manufactured and transferred to the troops as early as the middle of this decade. It will take a few more years to produce the required amount of equipment and replace obsolete vehicles in parts of the Airborne Forces. How long this process will continue, and how many SAOs the armed forces will receive, has not yet been reported.

Having received the new Lotus guns, the airborne artillery will retain the existing fire capabilities, which are now provided by the Nona-S self-propelled guns. Such vehicles will be able to accompany airborne units and support them with direct fire or fire from closed positions using shells or mines. At the same time, a new weapon system based on a modern weapon and an SLA, coupled with an up-to-date automated control system, will improve the range and accuracy of fire.

The tracked platform "Lotus" shows high technical characteristics, and is also unified with the new generation of airborne armored vehicles. In addition, the self-propelled guns of the new construction will have a full resource and will be able to remain in service for the next few decades.

Reasons for optimism

Thus, work on a promising self-propelled gun for the Airborne Forces continues and solves new problems. Currently, the existing experimental Lotus is being finalized and the second prototype is being built at the same time. In about a year, two cars will enter the state tests, and over the next months the fate of the 2S42 project will be decided.

So far, it cannot be ruled out that due to certain events and factors, the Lotus program schedule will be adjusted, and specific events will occur later than expected. Nevertheless, the general course of the project is obvious and allows making optimistic forecasts.

Comments

[fiberboard]

And why didn’t they release Vienna? Same good car.

[Thrifty]

This, as always, will be the same with us as with Kurganets, Boomerang, Armata - long-term construction platforms imposed on the military solely for the "development" of billions, and in parts junk like BMP1 "deeply modernized" and the T62 tank. And, in the units there are no available "on trials" - eternal ones! And the guilty cannot be found, why is the army fighting on grandfather's equipment?

[cold wind]

Quote: fiberboard

And why didn’t they release Vienna? Same good car.

Because Vienna, like Lotus, just cut the dough on development.
If you need a self-propelled mortar, then they are installed in the back of a finished platform. Load manually or automatically - depends on the version.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

These are mortars with a short range and no direct fire capability.
A much more serious development is the Russian Phlox.

[cold wind]

Direct fire can fire 400-500 meters, which is not necessary for nothing.
The range of mortars that are in the photo is the same as those of Lotus, Veins, Phlox, etc. It all depends on the ammo.
While "serious developments" go to exhibitions, the necessary developments are at war.
So far, ours have to collective farm 2B11 in the back of the Urals.

Azerbaijani military fought on "frivolous" 120 mm CARDOM mortars

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Does the 2A80 have a direct shot range of 400-500 meters? Can this be taken seriously?

[cold wind]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

Does the 2A80 have a direct shot range of 400-500 meters? Can this be taken seriously?

What is surprising about this? Well, up to a kilometer if 3VBK14. Has the situation improved significantly?
A gun with a low muzzle velocity will not be able to direct fire a 120 mm mine / projectile further.
Therefore, these projects were cut. Instead of each, it was possible to purchase several armored trucks with a 120 mm mortar in the back. Made industrially, and not to engage in handicraft.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Is the 2A80-1 a low ballistics gun? Is it with a range of 12 km? At least average. These are mortars in your pictures as low ballistics guns for 4-6 kilometers.

[cold wind]

Quote: Sergey Alexandrovich

Is it with a range of 12 km? At least average. These are mortars in your pictures as low ballistics guns for 4-6 kilometers.

12 km is achieved by active-reactive and / or guided munitions, weapons have nothing to do with it. Those in the photo also have them, the range is the same. With conventional mines, the range is up to 7 km cardoma, up to 8-9 km 2A80.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Past. Check out yesterday's comment from Bogalex below for a picture of the ammo loading at max charge.
Your foreign samples are underarmament compared to Phlox.

[cold wind]

Well, a person wrote and wrote, the next Internet stories no more.
A range of 13 km is provided by the 3VOF55 active-rocket projectile, there is a 3VOF54 variant of increased power but a range of up to 8 km. About 3VOF110 they officially write that it is of increased power, it is possible that there is an AR version of increased range.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

What does the person wrote mean? And the picture does not allow vision to see? There, as it were, a shot is depicted in all its glory, with a solid powder charge.

[Dimax-nemo]

This is, roughly speaking, a howitzer mortar. For such a system, the direct fire angle of 0 is not typical at all. For angles typical of a howitzer, it has sufficient range for its mass and acceptable accuracy. Now they have not invented a tool. Yes, and the chassis was not invented now, in fact it is still the BMD-3 at the core. Now they just put it together.

[Dimax-nemo]

Well, you tell this to GRAU and Margelov, who "invented" Nona in the 1970s. By the way, they also thought about a self-propelled mortar then, but abandoned it. Except for Tulip. But the French have to shove shells with ready-made ledges from the muzzle, as in the 19th century. - this perversion is real.
It's just that, as I understand it, the BMD-2 is no longer in production, as well as the swinging part for Nona. There is a BMD-4 in the series, hence all the dances with a tambourine. There is only one question. And what should we carry these 14-19 tons on? And if we have already "grown up" to 19 tons, why does the Airborne Forces have "armor" at all, different from motorized riflemen?

[TIR]

And why airborne and floating equipment at all? At least one operation was carried out using this trump card of this technique? In the name of the desire to fly and swim, they abandoned the armor and power of the main gun! If you already want to swim, then it is easier to have a special attachment for overcoming water bodies on your own. In 99,99% of cases, this technique does not fly or swim. Give me a single infantry fighting vehicle with good frontal armor, following the example of Swedish self-propelled guns. Reinforce such sloping armor with active armor blocks. Moreover, at such an angle it will work exactly

[Dimax-nemo]

Airborne - because Margelov wanted a combination of "pleasant with useful". The General Staff had its own plans for the use of just such airborne forces in Europe. Just that war, thank God, did not happen. Others happened. The BMD-1/2 could well be landed by a smaller helicopter than the Mi-26. If only we had it.
The buoyancy of the equipment was required, firstly, to capture a bridgehead on the other side, secondly, because there are not so many pontoon parks and other sapper stuff to transport everything along them. And now even more so. By the way the NWO is going now, I can’t say that even crossing the middle river is not a problem. Not to mention the Dnieper. In terms of security, the Swedish infantry fighting vehicle did not lie close to the MBT anyway. Those. from a grenade launcher-ATGM-BOPS is not protected in any way. Even if a high-explosive tank hits, it will fall apart.

[D16]

Why didn't they release Vienna?

Because the 120mm self-propelled gun is not relevant for the ground forces.

[strannik1985]

This is a replacement for the Sani mortar.

[insafufa]

Off topic, but my prayers have been heard. The centimeter returned to the troops.

The next day, artillery reconnaissance systems B75 "Penicillin", which covered the offensive of the allied forces, in the Ternov region (south of Svatov) discovered the positions of M777 howitzers made by the United States. They were hit by high-precision projectiles Krasnopol and Centimeter.

A centimeter is an excellent projectile for destroying enemy strongholds

[D16]

This is a replacement for the Sani mortar

Why change it? Mobility can be achieved in less expensive ways. Ukrov "Bars-8MMK" has a completely adequate apparatus.

[strannik1985]

Why change it?

"Vienna" has a readiness time for firing at an unplanned target of 1 minute.

Ukrov "Bars-8MMK" has a completely adequate apparatus.

"Vena" can work as a mortar, can fire direct fire, including "Granya" with laser guidance, more precisely (rifled), but more expensive. In terms of price / quality, systems based on CARDOM / SPEAR are better.

[D16]

"Vena" can work as a mortar, can shoot direct fire, including "Granya" with laser guidance

If I understand correctly, instead of Vienna, they muddied 2S40 "Phlox" on a wheeled chassis.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

True, it is preferable to put more long-range howitzers on a tracked chassis. They decided to make a mortar on tracks only for paratroopers.

[Dimax-nemo]

This is not a mortar on tracks. According to the firing range and the power of the ammunition art. part of Nona is comparable to 122-mm howitzers mod. 1909/30 and 1910/30 Mortar - this is already "for a snack", the second or third and compote.
Mortars on M113 tracks are a dime a dozen.

[Dimax-nemo]

Phlox will not be able to accompany the infantry in the BMP, which must keep up with the tanks. It could be considered as a battalion firearms on wheeled infantry fighting vehicles / armored personnel carriers / MRAP .... Why did Lotus need to be instead of Vienna - an interesting question.

[D16]

There is (should be) BMP-3 for infantry support, and Phlox for working from closed positions.

[Dimax-nemo]

For any "ordinary" mortar, a significant part of the mass of the mine does not form fragments. The shank will lie somewhere nearby. This is less effective compared to a rifled barrel projectile. A feathered mine, by and large, makes sense either for a very steep trajectory, or if it is not possible to carry-carry a howitzer of a comparable caliber. That is why the French got confused with a rifled mortar back in the 60s. So we are by no means "pioneers" here. Another thing is that we have much more experience in the use and design of artillery than the French had in the 60s. Therefore, we made a "normal" breech-loading gun with recoil devices, much more logical and suitable for self-propelled installation.

The Airborne Forces received such a self-propelled gun a long time ago, but they changed their "cart" - BMD-1 to BMD-4. The army men have been groaning with Nona on the armored personnel carrier for a long time and continue to compost the brain ..... Neither the BMP-3 nor the BTR-80/82 are considered by them as promising "platforms". Well, or not considered 8-)

[fiberboard]

Why is it not relevant? Why then ,, Carnation ,, is fighting successfully and ,, Nona ,,? Showed on TV today. Why are we moving away from 122 and 120mm? Can't the power of 152 be superfluous? I'll tell you more - I think that we should return to 76mm. ZiS -3 could give up to 20 shots per minute with quick fire (I read). So, if you make self-propelled guns like the SU-76 during the Second World War with such a rate of fire and better cross-country ability (based on the same motorcycle league, for example), then it will be great. A battery of six guns will give infantry and light armor 120 shells per minute, after which it will change position. And if you also work on shells. There, ,, Cornflower ,, put in the body.

[D16]

Why are we moving away from 122 and 120mm?

122 most likely will definitely not be anymore, and 120 mm 2S40 "Phlox" for mines and shells with ready-made rifling are dragged around exhibitions. True, I have little idea how this thing will shoot from wheels without outriggers.

[D16]

Self-propelled guns of the SU-76 type during WWII

https://topwar.ru/160468-chem-horosh-samohodnyj-minomet-2s41-drok.html
The power of ammunition is higher, and it is more convenient to pick out infantry from the trenches.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

Most likely, the case in cluster munitions. Because of this, the 152mm caliber is preferred.

[Bad_gr]

Quote: fiberboard

Why are we moving away from 122 and 120mm?

120mm is the caliber of mines and projectiles for guns with low ballistics, there are many new developments for it, and therefore the rumors about its departure are most likely not true.
122mm for artillery, of course, will be replaced by 152mm, since 152mm is more effective in solving the same tasks, and keeping two calibers here is not justified.
But among tank guns, in calibers, stability (or stagnation, it's how you look)

[Yarik]

I don’t understand why such machines should be developed until the whole concept of using the Airborne Forces as a branch of service has been revised? This is the technique of the last war. The SVO showed that it is necessary to change approaches in the development of the Airborne Forces and other maneuverable combat arms. Weakly armed cardboard on the battlefield solves absolutely nothing.

[Dimax-nemo]

Well, you tell the APU with their pickups. In comparison with which the Soviet armored personnel carriers, infantry fighting vehicles and infantry fighting vehicles are by no means cardboard.

[strannik1985]

If disposable infantry suits you, then yes.

[Dimax-nemo]

And the RPG-7, you know, it doesn't matter if it holds a 12,7 board there or not. And even Mukha doesn't care. And even 2A42 - all the same. Neither Bradley nor Warrior keep her on board. Now, for 300 thousand mobilized, where are we going to get armor? Kurgans? Boomerangs? Well, if the BTR-70 and "penny" still start up from the storage bases.

[strannik1985]

And the RPG-7, you know, still holds a 12,7 board there or not.

Combat distances and spread. For fighters in a pickup truck, small arms and fragments from mines / shells / missiles are a threat. The firing distances of the PG-7S are 300 meters, if you don’t click with your beak and have a normal connection, they won’t pose a big threat, but you can’t track every woman with a machine gun.
Now there are many options for increasing the level of situational awareness, from secure communications to civilian drones, thermal imagers and laser detection devices for optical reconnaissance, i.e. the level of awareness of a linear BMP-2 can be very well raised without gratings and NKDZ.

[Realist58]

Pickups of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, this is the merit of our most talented chief commanders. If the organization of the front line corresponded to the charters and military science, then the Banderomobiles would not have had a single chance. Even a 12,5 mm machine gun would have stopped their raid. So, you should not be equal to this wunderwaffle. It is worth drawing conclusions.

[Dimax-nemo]

Let's suppose that 7,62 would be enough there. But the style of rides on the type of jeeps was not invented by the Armed Forces of Ukraine and not even by the gardeners. At first it was done on Defenders, SAS
Everything is very simple. As much as the infantry needs, the navel will untie to armor it like a tank. Moreover, tanks from the cumulative to the side are actually very bad. There was a BMP-2D, from any 7,62 mm at reasonable distances it protected even on board. Nothing better in terms of protection than the BMP-3, we simply won’t be able to mass-produce. No longer on anything and nowhere. At least, if not at the expense of tanks.

[Realist58]

Well, this is what separation was invented for. MBT, BMPT, TBMP break into the defense and attack the flanks, and BMP, BTR, LT, LPT enter the operational space and nightmare the rear, developing an offensive in an area with no long-term defense. Aze so to speak. The bad thing is that we have an infantry fighting vehicle with a normal 45+ mm cannon, with modern ammunition, reconnaissance equipment, etc., etc., etc.

[Dimax-nemo]

Already passed. Heavy tanks and medium. All OBT is over. And who has an infantry fighting vehicle with a 45+ gun? You want armor, and a powerful machine gun, and troops. How does all this fit into one bottle of acceptable weight and price?

[Realist58]

You're right. But there is one BUT. Mobility in modern warfare is even more important than before. Especially aeromobility. The fact that you can forget about cinematic landings from BT behind enemy lines does not negate the need for such an operational landing in the rear of our troops on the breakthrough directions. Accordingly, the equipment for such a task should be appropriate, but as much as possible unified with motorized rifles.

[spirit]

As I understand it, the guys are sitting tight on the budget for the production of "aluminum" and will do their best to slow down the process of reformatting the Airborne Forces and moving towards air mobility rather than landing.

[Realist58]

Landing is a way to quickly deliver units to the direction of a breakthrough, at least. If our army had not been led by logs, and the thieves had not sold the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation with giblets, then the landing of units during the Kharkov offensive would have completely saved the front.

[Vladimir80]

Unfortunately, everything is as usual in our country. Until it comes to adoption, it will finally become obsolete (most likely already "obsolete").

[shark507]

Waste of money and time. What the hell is BMD? Wake up! There will be no parachute drops! It's good to cut aluminum cans already! Put this gun on some GAZ-66 - the survivability will be the same as that of the BMD.

[Realist58]

Has a grenade from a UAF drone fallen on you yet? It's a pity.

[igorra]

Why is the third sample not immediately made on wheels? These drive for 2-3 years, then they decide to make wheeled ones, another 5 years will pass, as a result, for another 8-10 years, the Airborne Forces will not receive a new self-propelled gun.

[Dmitry Ivanov_8]

What are 7-8 years old? Already now they will begin to cut loot on "LOTOS-Super-Duper M" and endlessly cut loot on "analogue" technologies. And there the "Lotus-Super-Duper M2" will arrive in time ...
Everything can be done most simply with one ballistics computer and a couple of sensors. When you just poke a tablet with a stylus at a point on the map where you need to shoot, and the computer, taking into account the coordinates, height difference, wind, air temperature and charge, gives you the azimuth and elevation of the gun. And with this data, you can manually twist the handwheels for the gunner. But the most ancient cannon with this becomes super-marked. The price of the issue is a couple of salaries of a deputy of the State Duma.

[rumpeljschtizhen]

Fully agree. While there is no concept of a new application for the airborne forces, it’s not worth it to launch into production something that is not useful here, I’m sure that this is a dead end branch

[storm]

For the rearmament from NONA to Lotus of the 5-6 airborne regiments present in the Airborne Forces, 5-6 divisions or 90-108 units will be required. SAO LOTUS.
They should also be given all the battalion sets of BMD-4M and BTR-D "Rakushka" (15-18 sets).
It is also required to speed up the production and delivery of 5-6 battalions of PTITSELOV air defense systems (90-108 units) to paratrooper regiments.
Instead of SAO Sprut-SD, self-propelled anti-tank systems "Kornet" on the BMD-4M platform will be much more useful for paratroopers.

Air assault regiments fighting in Ukraine as ordinary infantry need heavy self-propelled guns Msta-SM2, T-90M tanks, MLRS Tornado-G and BMP-3M with DZ and KAZ.

[Tank destroyerSU-100]

The question is that the Volgograd Tractor Plant, the manufacturer of BMD, has been demolished. For prototypes on the knee, in the backyard of a factory in Kurgan or Chelyabinsk, the chassis can still be made. But for mass production, nooks and crannies are not suitable. Again, just an exhibition sample that has no prospects for a series?

[D16]

demolished Volgograd Tractor Plant

If you believe the wiki, only part of the plant that produced civilian products was demolished.
The military part of the plant continues the production of armored vehicles in the interests of the Airborne Forces of the Russian Federation at the southern site: BMD-4, BTR-D, Sprut-SDM (s)

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

You forgot about the liquidated tool and steel production, closed subcontractors at the Shipyard.

[D16]

You forgot

It's hard to forget what you didn't know. I think they'll break it down somehow. And with the tool, and with the foundry, and with subcontractors.

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

I do not believe in a happy ending. The financial group that seized the Tractor Plant at one time, it seems, set as its goal its complete destruction, and the observed picture is very close to this.
The most interesting thing is that they were also close to the destruction of the Kurgan plant.

[Realist58]

You don't believe right. Even now, the ruling regime is destroying one of the largest defense industry enterprises - the Motovilikha Plants. And this is at the moment when our people and the army without BT are washing themselves with blood in the Ukrainian war.

[Sedoy]

These or other shortcomings are present in the design of the chassis, on-board electronic equipment and automatic loader. The nature of such problems and how to eliminate them are not given.

those. there are no shortcomings only a machine gun ...
and that's because the old PKT probably ...
“Vena” was thwarted for years - they abandoned it, took up the “Lotus” and then screwed up for two five-year plans ...

[Bad_gr]

.... in order to unify the equipment of the Airborne Forces, a promising CAO is being built on the basis of a modified chassis of the BMD-4M landing vehicle.

It seems that they took the chassis already ready, from Sprut-SDM1 (SAO 2S25M). Find differences :

[Dimax-nemo]

So all the fuss with the "new" Octopus is due to the fact that the original "object 934" for the Octopus for the Airborne Forces is a "foreign body". Therefore, the same box with the same turret was put, roughly speaking, on a "cart" with giblets from the BMD-4, so that the airborne troops did not go crazy.
In addition to the Airborne Forces, the Octopus is only needed by the Marine Corps, but, as usual, they will not be asked. The army men, of course, ignored the "under-tank", but it seems that a bold cross is still drawn on the anti-tank artillery. In perspective.
After that, it would seem logical to put the howitzer-mortar on a new cart, but there is one "but". With comparable capabilities, Nona is almost twice as light.

[Dimax-nemo]

I can't understand one thing. And what is such a fundamentally new Airborne Forces getting with this Lotus compared to the Leg? For a couple of km. longer firing range? At the cost of a doubling of the combat mass? Maybe she's not bad in her own way. For a motorized rifle battalion of tank units as a replacement for mortars.

[D16]

And what is such a fundamentally new Airborne Forces getting with this Lotus compared to the Leg?

According to the author, a long smooth barrel with a developed muzzle brake. I wonder how they plan to use shells with ready-made rifling from Nona.

[Bogalex]

I wonder how they plan to use shells with ready-made rifling from "Nona"

What confuses you?

[D16]

what bothers you?

Finished rifling on shell shells

[Bogalex]

And what's in them? The Lotos, apparently, has about the same gun as the Vienna and Khosta. There are no problems with the use of shells with ready-made rifling.

[D16]

There are no problems with the use of shells with ready-made rifling.

There will be :
fighting compartment of the new development. It is built around a 120 mm "universal" smoothbore guns that act as guns, howitzers and mortars. (c) from the article.

[Bogalex]

Dear Ilya, the fact that the author of the article thoughtlessly called the Lotus gun smooth-bore does not make it so. Alas, Comrade Ryabov has long been "out of circulation" and I personally have less and less faith in what he writes. Especially in matters requiring technical literacy.
Putting a smooth-bore gun on the Lotos is, firstly, completely pointless, and secondly, there is no need.
The declared range of 13 km is excellently provided by a 2A80-type gun mounted on the Khost. And it was precisely this that was installed on the Lotus - in this regard, the developers did not introduce any innovations.

[Dimax-nemo]

I understand everything, but why should the "public" be so frightened?

[Bogalex]

So that you have no doubts at all, here is a freeze-frame from the video “The Russian Army. Self-propelled gun for the Airborne Forces "Lotos", which you yourself can easily find on the Internet.
This frame demonstrates nothing more than loading a 3VOF110 round with a 3OF68 high-explosive fragmentation projectile (black means inert) and a long-range charge into the fighting compartment. This is just the one that flies those same 13 km and yes, it is with ready-made rifling

[D16]

So that you don't have any doubts

Thanks, no more doubts. Why the hell do people replicate this fake about a smooth barrel if it was in the Army. Has no one looked?
Wikipedia should be corrected.

[Bogalex]

Moreover, I will tell you that even in this video it is signed that the gun is smooth-bore.
Unsuitability, she ... such ...
... contagious, or what?

[Dimax-nemo]

Yes, at first I didn’t pay attention at all that in the article this gun was called a smoothbore

[Dimax-nemo]

Stabilization of projectiles after firing from a barrel that has no rifling. Despite the fact that the shells do not have plumage, like mines or shells for smoothbore guns.

[Realist58]

This is, first of all, the preservation of the scientific and design base of the country. So let them work, otherwise soon there will be no high-tech specialists in the country except for Uzbek janitors.

[garri-lin]

Lotus is good. It is not clear why, on the basis of a single fighting compartment, they do not immediately make a whole line. On BMD 4 there is. Add on the basis of BMP 3 and an adequate wheeled platform.
The car promises to be pretty good. Ordinary motorized rifles will definitely not refuse this. In exchange for mortars.

[shark507]

Quote: Dimax-Nemo

Well, you tell the APU with their pickups. Compared with which Soviet armored personnel carriers, infantry fighting vehicles and infantry fighting vehicles are by no means cardboard

That's just the BMD is the same non-tenant on the battlefield as the "cart" of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. And the price difference is orders of magnitude.

[Sanguinius]

The same non-tenant as the infantry with its infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers, therefore the question is ... why exactly does the Airborne Forces need to be reformatted, and not the infantry !? Maybe it is necessary to "pump up" the infantry so that the landing force and the marines do not plug holes behind them everywhere and everywhere?

[Zaurbek]

Why does everything need to be sharpened for landing and BMD? Make a module and massively distribute it throughout the army ... in the best possible scenario, how many pieces are needed in the Airborne Forces? Do motorized riflemen have some kind of excess of self-propelled mortars? No. There are not even “simple” self-propelled ones with a sunroof and an FCS. And in the Airborne Forces you have an Octopus and a mortar .... In piece quantity

[Sergey Aleksandrovich]

In development, and already in production, wheeled self-propelled guns "Phlox". It is more profitable to replicate it, there is a large portable ammunition load and a relatively cheap universal chassis.

[Two diplomas]

And is it necessary? Something grandiose landings with the release of equipment are not observed. Maybe something high-precision and very long-range is better, then the landing will not be needed.

[Dmitry Rigov]

To begin with, to come up with tasks for the Airborne Forces itself, if they are used as ordinary infantry, while also "borrowing" heavy guns from it, then why do they need this new CAO?

[shark507]

Quote: Sanguinius

The same non-tenant as the infantry with their infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers

The BMP is still "stronger" than the BMD.

[shark507]

Quote: Sanguinius

why exactly the airborne forces need to be reformatted, and not the infantry !? Maybe it is necessary to "pump up" the infantry so that the landing force and the marines do not plug holes behind them everywhere and everywhere?

And who spoke out against the "pumping" of the infantry? And then the Airborne Forces will no longer be needed.

[Realist58]

Airborne, this is mobility. Mobility in modern warfare is needed even more than before.

[Nikolaevich I]

The fighting compartment of the new development is mounted on the chassis. It is built around a 120-mm "universal" smooth-bore gun that performs the functions of a gun, howitzer and mortar. There is an automatic loader compatible with various types of ammunition.
And with what fright did the "non-like" gun become smooth-bore? There is reason to believe that the "single" 2A80 gun or its modification (for example, 2A80-1 ...) was screwed into the Lotos. There is no particular point in depriving the 2A80 of rifling! Otherwise, complete "continuity" with the previous samples of "nona" and its ammunition is lost! Not everything is clear with the automatic loader either ... if you believe what I read, then there is more like a "semi-automatic" ...! They promised to "introduce" into the ammunition and "guided active-reactive planning" artillery projectile with a range of up to 20-25 km ... but it seems that this projectile was postponed for "after" (!), which means, according to Russian custom, this projectile may not appear "finally"!

[Bogalex]

You are absolutely right. Apparently, nothing new was introduced in the part of the gun in the Lotus. But ... "Come on, guys, Ryabov" (if not for the surname, then ©)

[Tank destroyerSU-100]

Quote: D16

demolished Volgograd Tractor Plant

If you believe the wiki, only part of the plant that produced civilian products was demolished.
The military part of the plant continues the production of armored vehicles in the interests of the Airborne Forces of the Russian Federation at the southern site: BMD-4, BTR-D, Sprut-SDM (s)

Recently, photographs appeared on the Internet - on one STZ after the Battle of Stalingrad, on the second - what happened to the VTZ. The picture is identical. Look for photos on the Internet, but not in the garbage wiki, everything will become clear right away. And besides, if the machining workshop, foundry, blacksmith shop is demolished, then what the hell can you make.

[Dimax-nemo]

And in Rostec now "competence centers" are doing all this Those. the foundry will be in one town, the blacksmith shop in another, machining in the third. And in Volgograd, for example, only the assembly will be left. Or a very, very "small" enterprise, as they left the MiG in Lukhovitsy.

[shark507]

Quote: Realist58

Airborne, this is mobility. Mobility in modern warfare is needed even more than before

Is mobility needed only by the Airborne Forces? The rest - hell?

[squid]

hosspadi, why the hell do you need it?! Is it really not clear that no one will jump anywhere with any parachutes? What the hell are all those cardboard boxes?
make elite infantry out of the airborne forces by issuing normal tanks and normal heavy infantry fighting vehicles based on these tanks. and throw all the projections of cardboard crafts into the trash along with parachutes

[Olegsv]

The whole trouble is that motorized riflemen are made from the Airborne Forces, although they should be completely different

[handwriting]

The timing of the implementation of the program is amazing, it seems that the Russian bear has not yet woken up and the troika is still being harnessed. As an example, we can cite the work of small private firms that develop and produce a large number of various off-road equipment, and original solutions.

[locks]

I never understood why to spend resources on the development of airborne equipment when no one in their right mind would use it. Air defense has long defeated the airborne forces.

[sgrabik]

We now urgently need long-range artillery with guided munitions, this is the Coalition SV self-propelled guns, so all forces and means should be directed to accelerate its mass production, and a range of 13 km is somehow not serious even for a 120 mm caliber.